Mfr Nara- t3t4- Dos- Kattouf Theodore H- 4-21-04- 00654

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8ECR£'flNfEvent:TheodoreH.KattoufTypeofEvent:InterviewDate:April21,2004SpecialAccessIssues:

SECRETHJF

Additionalnote:ThisinterviewwasrecordedPreparedby:AlexisAlbionTeamNumber:Three(CounterterrorismPolicy)Location:KStreetParticipants-Commission:AlexisAlbion,ScottAllan,SerenaWille,PhilipZelikow[portion]ThisMFRprovidesasummaryofthemostimportantpointscoveredintheinterview.Background(U)KattoufservedasU.S.AmbassadortotheUnitedArabEmirates(UAE)fromNovember1998untilAugust2001.HethenservedasU.S.AmbassadortoSyriauntilhisretirementinAugust2003.Hehasspent31yearsintheU.S.ForeignService,includingSaudiArabia,YemenandIraq.HeiscurrentlypresidentandCEOofAmideast,anon-profitNGO,specializingineducationandtrainingintheMiddleEast.(U)TheUAEisunique:itisafairlyloosefederationof7statelets,witharulingfamilyineachstatethatguardsitsprerogativesjealously.ThepresidentofthefederationisShaykhZayed-anoctogenarian,whohasbeenpresidentsincethefoundingoftheUAEand,accordingtoKattouf,isveryrespected.Hisemirate,AbuDhabi,isextremelywealthy,whereasotheremiratesgenerallyarenot.KattoufsaidthattheforceandstrengthofZayed'spersonality,thefactthatheisaverybenevolentandwisemandespitealackofformaleducation,andthatheknowshowtodeployresourcesstrategicallyinordertobindthefederationtogether,hasledtoasituationinwhichAbuDhabiiscertainlythefirstamongequals.

It

is,however,aconsensus-drivensociety.TheUAEisalsoatraditionalandtribalsociety,inwhichtheemiratisareaminorityintheirowncountry-therearebiggergroupsofPakistanisandIndians,forinstance.UAEForeignRelations(U)Asasmallandwealthy,andpotentiallyvulnerablestate,theUAEhaslookedforallies.AccordingtoKattouf,amongtheGulfStates,theUAEforsometimewasnotasclosetotheUnitedStatesasothers,suchasSaudiArabiaandKuwait.Forexample,mostoftheUAE'sarmspurchaseshavecomefromFrance,andShaykhZayedhadneverpaidanofficialvisitofanysorttoWashington-hehadneveraskedtocometotheWhiteHouse.WhilefriendlyandmaintainingagoodrelationshipwiththeU.S.,theUAEdidnothavetheclosenessonapersonalbasisthatsomeothersintheGulfhad.BesidesbeingamemberoftheGulfCooperationCounciltheUAEhadgenerallygood

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relationswithotherArabnations,andwithPakistan(towhomtheyhadgivenaid),EuropeanStateandsoon.TheTaliban(U)KattoufrecalledthesubjectoftheTalibancomingupfairlyoftenwhenhewasambassadorintheUAE,andthatitcameupoccasionallywithseniorofficials.ButtheStateDepartmenthaddecidedthattheUAEwasnotpreparedatthatpointtobreakrelationswiththeTaliban,andthattojustcarponthatissuewouldundermineotherthingsthattheU.S.wastryingtodo.AsKattoufexplained,evensmallcountriesguardtheirsovereigntyjealouslyanddonotliketobetoldbyoutsidershowtoconducttheir•foreig;nrelations.l(U)WhenKattoufarrivedintheUAE(inlate1998),therehadbeena"bitofaflap"betweentheoutgoingambassadorandUAEgovernment(hehadmadesomepublicremarksaboutreformandsoon,thatraisedsomequestions,thengavetheinterviewtoanewspaperandthatsetoffafirestorm).OneofthethingshesuggestedtotheUAEgovernmentbeforeheleft,however,wasthattheycuttheirrelationswiththeTalibanandAfghanistan.ThereweresomestrainswhenKattoufarrived,therefore,butnotsevere.(U)Thereisarealpassionamongemiratis,especiallywithintheroyalfamily,tohuntwithfalcons(almostanationalsport),especiallyusingfalconstohuntthehubara,whichfollowsamigratorypathfromSiberiadownthroughSouthAsia.ManyhubaracomethroughAfghanistan.Formanyyears,UAEshaykhsandothershuntedthehubarainAfghanistan,regardlessofwhowasinpower.TherewasarepresentativeinDubaiwhorepresentedTalibanofficials.wasnosecretthatMohammedBinRashid,CrownPrinceofDubaiandUAEDefenseMinisterwasgoingtoAfghanistanforhunting(asdidothers).(U)AccordingtoKattouf,theUAEhadnoideologicalpredilectiontowardtheTaliban-s-"farfromit.".Zayedwaspious,butaverytolerantmanwhofolloweda"liveandletlive"philosophy.ButZayedalsolikedtohelpIslamiccountriesinneed.(C)Thatbeingsaid,KattoufdidnotbelievetherewascollusionbetweentheUAE

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(C)TherewereoccasionalvisitstotheUAEbypeoplelikeClarkeorSheehan.TherehadbeensignificantprogresswiththeUAEoncounterterrorismissues.,

•U.S.-UAERelationsClarke'sVisittotheUAE,Early1999

(S)InlateJanuary/earlyFebruary1999.ClarkecametotheUAEwithadelegation,

whichincluded

State'sMikeSheeha~

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