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cab_7_0009to0013

cab_7_0009to0013

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Published by: Bren-R on Sep 14, 2010
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CONFIDENTIAL
NOTE
FOR
THE
HUTTON
INQUIRY
RECORD
OF
MEETINGS
INVOLVING
THE
PRIME
MINISTER
ON
7
AND
8
JULY
2003
The
following
is
a
record
ofa
series
of
running
meetings
on
Monday
7andTuesday
8
July
.
Most
ofthe
meetings
were
devoted
to
other
subjects
but
this
note
attempts
to
piece
together
thepartsofthe
discussion
relating
to
Mr
Gilligan'sstory
and
the
appearance
of
an
individual
who
had
come
forward
and
might
be
his
source
.
This
compilation
is
therefore
based
on
the
recollection
of
those
at
these
meetings
.
Monday
,
7
July
-
0900-1000
Present
for
atleast
part
of
the
meeting
:
Foreign
Secretary,
David
Omand,
Kevin
Tebbit,
John
Scarlett,
David
Manning,
NigelSheinwald,
Alastair
Campbell,
Sally
Morgan,
Tom
Kelly,
Godric
Smithand
Jonathan
Powell
.
The
main
purpose
of
the
meeting
was
to
discuss
the
Government's
reaction
to
the
FAC
report
.
There
followed
a
briefdiscussion
of
whether
theindividual,
Dr
Kelly,
who
had
come
forward
was
indeed
Mr
Gilligan's
source
.
Kevin
Tebbit
saidthe
individual
was
an
expertbutnot
in
the
intelligence
communityand
was
not
centrally
involved
in
the
preparation
of
the
dossier
.
Dr
Kelly
had
denied
that
he
had
mentioned
Alastair
Campbell
to
Mr
Gilligan
.
Jack
Straw
remembered
him
sitting
next
to
him
at
an
earlier
FAC
hearing
.
There
wassome
questioning
of
"
whether
we
should
already
have
given
his
name
to
the
Chairman
of
the
FAC
.
Were
we
withholding
information?
But
it
was
agreed
that
we
needed
to
know
more
before
deciding
what
we
shoulddo
next
.
The
Prime
Minister
asked
what
we
knew
of
Dr
Kelly's
views
on
weapons
of
mass
destruction
inIraq
.
What
would
hesay
if
heappeared
before
the
ISC
or
the
FAC?
Kevin
Tebbit
said
that,
while
he
supported
the
war
and
was
certain
that
Saddam
Hussein
hadweapons
of
mass
destruction
and
that
they
had
been
concealed
from
theinspectors,
hemight
say
some
uncomfortable
things
about
specific
items
on
which
he
had
views
.
He
undertook
to
find
out
more
about
his
publicly
expressed
views
.
He
said
we
would
have
to
face
up
to
the
factthat
his
identity
was
likely
to
become
public
at
some
pointsoon,
given
the
number
ofpeoplehe
had
talked
to
.
MOD
was
preparing
contingency
press
lines
just
in
case
.
Kevin
Tebbit
reported
that
Dr
Kelly
had
come
forward
of
his
own
volition
and
as
far
as
MOD
was
concerned
there
was
no
question
of
any
offence
having
beencommittedunder
the
OSA
.
The
Foreign
Secretary
reminded
the
meeting
of
the
og
e)
lq
locC~
 
CONFIDENTIAL
-2-
employment
rights
Dr
Kelly
had
.
The
Prime
Minister
made
it
clear,
as
he
had
overthe
weekend,
that
the
MOD
should
continue
to
handle
the
casefollowing
whatever
internal
processes
were
normal
.
Kevin
Tebbit
and
David
Omand
should
be
in
the
lead
at
all
times
and
nothingshould
be
done
with
which
they
were
not
absolutely
content
.
There
was
agreement
that
Dr
Kelly's
account
needed
to
be
subject
to
more
forensic
examination
and
that
the
MOD
should
re-interview
him
.
The
meeting
concluded
with
Kevin
Tebbit
agreeing
to
call
Dr
Kelly
back
froma
co)
:fcrence
in
Lincolnshire
to
allow
him
to
be
re-interviewed
.
Tuesday
8
July0815-
0845
As
part
of
the
meeting
to
prepare
forthe
PMs
appearance
beforethe
Liaison
Committee
involving
Alastair
Campbell,
Clare
Sumner,John
Scarlett,
David
Manning,
Tom
Kelly,
Godric
Smith,
Sally
Morgan,
Catherine
Rimmer
and
Matthew
Rycroft,
there
was
discussion
of
what
the
PM
should
say
if
asked
directly
whether
a
source
had
come
forward
.
The
PM
was
anxious
not
to
be
misleading,
if
a
statement
was
to
be
issued
later
in
the
day
but
he
did
not
think
it
would
be
appropriate
to
reveal
that
an
individual
had
come
forward
at
that
stage
.
Godric
Smith
checked
with
Kevin
Tebbit's
office
what
they
thought
the
PM
should
say
and
it
was
agreed
that
the
PM
should
say,
if
asked,
that
we
were
taking
the
issueseriously
and
looking
at
it
in
the
normal
way
.
(Inthe
end
the
question
was
not
put
to
the
PM
at
the
Liaison
Committee)
.
Tuesdav
8
_Ju
ly
-1130-1200
Present
:
David
Omand,
David
Manning,
John
Scarlett,
Alastair
Campbell,
Tom
Kelly,
Jonathan
Powell
(Kevin
Tebbit
in
Portsmouth)
.
David
Omand
reported
back
that
he
had
heard
from
MOD
hat
Dr
Kelly's
re-
interview
had
confirmed
the
earlier
story
from
his
first
interview
.
There
were
inconsistencies
remaining,
but
it
looked
asif
Dr
Kelly
was
the
main
explanation
for
Mr
Gilligan's
story,
and
that
Mr
Gilligan
appeared
to
have
heavily
embellished
the
conversation
for
the
controversial
parts
of
his
story
.
In
discussion
of
what
should
be
done
with
this
information
the
following
points
were
made
:
a
.
Government
witnesses
before
the
ISCwould
be
indifficulty
if,
as
was
very
likely,
they
were
asked
whether
they
knew
the
identity
of
the
source
.
David
Omand
said
he
felt
he
would
have
to
reply,
if
asked,
that
we
did
have
someone
 
CONFIDENTIAL
-3-
who
had
come
forward
.
We
couldnot
attempt
to
cover
up
the
fact
.
And
he
was
anxious
that
we
could
be
accused
of
acover-up
if
the
FAC
learned
much
later
that
we
had
had
this
information
now
given
that
they
had
only
just
published
a
report
covering
this
very
subject
.
We
would
be
open
to
criticismfor
not
revealing
the
existence
of
a
possible
explanation
for
how
the
Gilligan
story
had
been
sourced
.
b
.
it
was
relevant
that
the
individual
had
come
forward
voluntarily
and
that
there
wasno
expectation
on
his
part
of
continued
anonymity
.
That
had
been
discussed
by
MOD
with
him
.
He
knew
he
might
have
to
give
evidence
.
c
.
Dr
Kelly's
case
was
beinghandled
by
MOD
according
totheir
personnel
procedures
.
Whateverwas
decided
would
be
put
by
MOD
o
Dr
Kelly
forhis
agreement
.
d
.
The
field
of
WMD
experts
was
a
small
one
and
Dr
Kelly
had
indeed
been
asked
by
one
of
his
associates
in
RUSI
whether
he
was
the
source,
which
had
prompted
him
to
come
forward
.
So
we
must
assume
that
the
media
would
soon
speculate
.
MOD
had
prepared
draft
press
noticesagainst
the
likelihood
that
Dr
Kelly's
name
might
surface
which
had
been
received
the
previous
night
(and
on
which
Godric,
Alastair
and
Jonathan
hadproposed
amendments)
.
The
meeting
concluded
that
it
was
now
firmly
enough
established
that
an
individual
had
come
forward
to
admit
to
meeting
Mr
Gilligan,
in
circumstances
matching
much
of
whathad
been
said,
butwith
a
materially
different
accountof
what
had
been
said
to
the
journalist
.
That
was
highly
relevant
to
the
evidence
now
being
taken
by
the
ISC
on
the
dossier,
as
well
asto
the
public
debate
following
publication
of
the
FAC
report
.
It
was
difficult
to
see
how
thatfact
couldnot
be
communicated
given
its
manifest
relevance
to
the
proceedings
.
The
PM
stressed
once
again
that
the
next
steps
should
be
decided
by
the
MoD
.
David
Omand
suggested
that
instead
of
a
press
release,
he
write
to
the
Chair
of
the
ISC
to
tell
her
that
a
MOD
official
had
come
forward
and
that
we
were
prepared
to
allow
them
to
interview
the
individual
if
they
thought
fit
.
We
could
provide
theactual
name
of
the
possible
source
in
confidence
.
TheISC
tookevidence
in
private,
so
confidentiality
could
be
maintained
whilst
the
committee
examined
thecase
.
That
would
be
the
best
way
for
Dr
Kelly
to
put
the
record
straight,
initially
with
the
ISC
and
in
due
course
with
thepublic,
whilst
avoiding
misleading
thepublic
now
should
the
BBC
respond
with
information
that
made
clear
that
it
had
been
another
source
on
whomMr
Gilligan
was
relying,
although
his
name
was
bound
to
surface
eventually
.
If
we
wrote
to
the
FAC,
instead
of
the
ISC,
that
couldbetaken
as
an
invitation
for
them
to
summon
Dr
Kelly
as
they
had
done
Mr
Gilligan
.
We
could
copy
the
letter
to
the
FAC
chairmanand
at
the
same
time
make

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