This action might not be possible to undo. Are you sure you want to continue?
(3) Went ahead and... Home Search for people, places and things
Matt Zukowski Find Friends Home
Jason Polk DC Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children
6 hours ago ·
Went ahead and deleted that last thread. I think we discussed adequately the topic which was the point of the thread. The conversation degenerated from their to more childish ridicule by some of your followers. Seeing as how public perception is an important factor in running a small business, I find it counterproductive to associate with such rude folks as the couple of people who took over that thread.
Like · Comment 2 people like this. Jay Kanta So many of us actual scientists have been anxiously awaiting that new diagnostic tool that allows everyone to diagnose "subluxations". A new type of body energy would be an incredible find. What exact measurement tools were used to document them? 59 minutes ago · Like Jason Polk DC it is a straw man. i have never said chiropractic was a substitute OR that vaccines are a lie. i never said any of that. 59 minutes ago · Like Allison Hagood I know, Jay! I am so excited about the Nobel Prize that the research team which identified and verified the existence of subluxations will receive. :) 58 minutes ago · Like Jason Polk DC allison, you are just going to have to develop some patience. im not home right now and i dont have all that stuff in front of me on my iphone. i WILL get it to you. 58 minutes ago · Like Jason Polk DC here is a great one to chew on in the meantime: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20889389 i have tons more when i get home. The Chiropractic Hospital-based Interventions Resear... [Spine J. 2010] PubMed - NCBI www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov PubMed comprises more than 22 million citations for biomedical literature from MEDLINE, life science journals, and online books. Citations may include links to fulltext content from PubMed Central and publisher web sites. 56 minutes ago · Like Matt Zukowski And WTF, you're the one who posted the pic with the kid asserting a boosted immune system. So sorry, you're a liar, you promote Chiropractic as an alternative to vaccination. 56 minutes ago · Like Jay Kanta Wow, actual evidence is going to be right here. I'm giddy. I can't wait to add it to my lengthy file containing all of the credible citations I use in my work. Hurry, Jason Polk DC, we've just never found a real chiroquacktor that would give us this previously hidden evidence. 55 minutes ago · Like Allison Hagood He gave one! Unfortunately, not double-blinded - the outcome assessors were blind, but the Chat (15) participants in the different study groups were not. And it was about low back pain, one of the FEW areas where chiropractic might actually have some scientific validity. So, unfortunately, while Jason may believe that this is the Smoking Gun, as it were, it still suffers from a serious design flaw. The people receiving the care were aware of the care they were receiving. You'll notice that the summary says this is the first such study. So, I wonder where Jason is going to get the other "hundreds" of his cites? 51 minutes ago · Like · 1 Allison Hagood Also, yea, Jason? We saw your picture of the baby bragging about his awesome immune system because he'd been adjusted since birth (since birth?!?! What. The. Fuck.). So, either you DO promote chiropractic as being just as good as, or better than, vaccinations, or you are willing to post a picture that promotes that idea. Which is it? 50 minutes ago · Unlike · 2 Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children Oh man, see what happens when I take a nap? I think I'm going back to bed. 49 minutes ago · Like · 1 Jason Polk DC is the first reported randomized controlled trial comparing full CPG-based treatment" "This maybe if you knew what you were doing you wouldnt be incapable of understanding this statement. it is the first study that uses CPG and compares to PCP. 48 minutes ago · Like Joy Joy Jason, are you and Allison going to make out already or WHAT?! 46 minutes ago · Like · 1
University Place Refuse and... "Like" our page for contests, giveaways, and up-to-the-minute service updates! Like · 608 people like this. Action Legends Looking forward to The Fast And The Furious 6! LIKE!
Like · 310,140 people like this. BBC America and Canada Shop Like BBC America Shop and win exclusive giveaways!
Like · 36,231 people like this. Public Arrest Records Arrest records can be viewed online. 1) Enter a name & state 2) Subscribe to view results
Taga Bike is in the USA! Taga, the amazing bikestroller, is now available in the USA and Canada! check it out
11,668 people like Taga. War With Millions Build a pirate empire and compete with millions for world domination. Play free now!
Tony Clinton played Battle Pirates. Tinder Box Buffalo Take advantage of select sales every week! Buy 4 get 1 free! Deals run FriThurs. Like · 703 people like this. Brooklake Church Visit Brooklake Church where everyone's welcome, nobody's perfect, & anything's possible. Use Now Amber French Photography Capturing life's extraordinary moments.
Like · 389 people like this. Pierce Transit Provides public transportation for people with disabilties, commuters, seniors & students Like · Mikel Kirk likes this.
Facebook © 2012
(3) Went ahead and...
Jay Kanta Just from the abstract alone: 1) UC is not a direct placebo controlled trial. Failure #1. 2) The number of subjects (N) is too small for an age range of 15-59. Statistical failure. 3) " randomized controlled clinical trial" <- No, it isn't. I have to suspect that the authors used a formulaic template or just copied and pasted a real trial and used word replacement like many F students. Did you think this study was credible? 45 minutes ago · Unlike · 3 Jay Kanta I now have to determine if that useless study is actually worth the time it would take to identify all of the other flaws, if it were so easy to do it in just the abstract alone. I really was hoping to use that time to read about all the incredible potential of "subluxations". 42 minutes ago · Like · 1 Jason Polk DC do you think it is easy to get published in Spine? 42 minutes ago · Like Allison Hagood Irrelevant. While even poorly-designed studies can and do get published, and actually have value in guiding further research (since further research will fix the problems in original research), that doesn't mean they prove what you want them to prove. Jay, I know - I wanted to read about the (finally) scientific identification of subluxation. So sad. 40 minutes ago · Edited · Like · 1 Jason Polk DC you know, perhaps you should go ahead and throw out all the research published in all the journals, if you dont trust that they have any standards required for publishing research in their journals. im not sure why journals like the NEMJ, BMJ, JAMA, SPine, etc. would let chiropractors in with faulty literature if they hold everyone else to high standards? 40 minutes ago · Like Jay Kanta Hmmm, name dropping. How sad. 40 minutes ago · Like Jason Polk DC well, i never got in dbcrt studies for vaccines when i asked. i got some studies. and im slowly digesting the info you sent, so maybe im not there yet. but id love to just throw all of the non-dbrct research out if thats how you do it. 39 minutes ago · Like Jay Kanta Spine only has an impact rating of 2.04. Not exactly rockin' the science world. And, as Allison explained, low-back pain is the one area where chiroquacktic actually has shown the potential for efficacy. That doesn't mean it is the right treatment, just that it happens to reduce pain over a short period of time. 38 minutes ago · Like · 1 Allison Hagood Jason, what you linked to would more properly be called a pilot study. Pilot studies use a small number of subjects, often have methodological flaws, and are seen as a first step to a better, larger, more valid study. When small sample sizes are used, weird things happen. Also, future studies are designed around the pilot studies in order to address issues of methodology. Since this was the first such study, surely another, larger, more methodologically sound study was done? Where the researchers actually were able to somehow blind the participants as well as the outcome assessors? Also, what Jay said. :) 37 minutes ago · Like · English (US) · Privacy · Terms · Cookies · More
Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children Jason: I'm no expert, but it's my understanding that part of the process is that when studies are published, the community will often pick it apart to determine the validity. Publication is not the beginning or the end, but another step in the process. If there is a reaction and rebuttal to the study, it's certainly relevant. 37 minutes ago · Unlike · 5 Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children I WIN! Now I'm going to find a drink. I'm sure I'll come back to find this thread deleted and a new one about 100 comments in to replace it. Godspeed. 34 minutes ago · Like · 2 Jay Kanta Jason Polk DC: I'll admit that I'm not too "up" on the "academic" qualities of a chiropractic program. @ Could you tell me exactly what courses you took that taught you about determining validity and reliability? What about the statistics courses? Did you ever do any critical examinations of publications or learn the philosophy of science? 34 minutes ago · Like Allison Hagood It's not up to us to "understand it." It's up to you and your ilk to PROVE IT. This study is a flawed step in that process. 33 minutes ago · Edited · Like Jason Polk DC Allison, you are a community college teacher. i dont need you to talk down to me. i understand what a pilot study is. pilot studies are also often labeled as such upon their publication. your definition of a pilot study is a little off. but this is not a pilot study. 32 minutes ago · Like Jay Kanta "Don't short-change me". Given my entire disrespect for the quack-practices of a "medical practice" that makes massive claims far beyond plausibility or defined mechanisms, I don't think I can short-change you. 32 minutes ago · Like Jason Polk DC im not doing medicine dude. if all you want are drugs, youre talking to the wrong guy. 31 minutes ago · Like Jay Kanta Given the small N, it most certainly is a pilot study. Oh, wait, even though chiropractics claim they are capable of medical intervention, it isn't "medicine". Hmmmm. Are you sure you're a chiropractor, or are you just pulling our legs? 29 minutes ago · Like Allison Hagood Based on the sample size and the methodological flaws in it, I'd say it's AT BEST a pilot study. My students sometimes accuse me of talking down to them when I'm explaining something that they don't
understand. Comes with the territory.
(3) Went ahead and...
Your stated belief that medicine is nothing but drugs is typical of your quackery and your misguided brethren. 29 minutes ago · Unlike · 2 Matt Zukowski Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children Indeed, and this was a VERY LIMITED pilot study, small sample size across a wide age range, and wasn't double blind as indicated, unless they gassed the patients which isn't a bad idea actually. It's only cited 17 times, which is the important bit, as many peer reviewers are of the opinion that community criticism is the way to go even for a crap study. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1529943010011149 And I don't think anyone here every suggested that chiropractic isn't great for lower back pain. The question of the day is chiropractic care, from birth, being an alternative for vaccinations, as promoted by Mr. Polk DC. 29 minutes ago · Like · 1 Allison Hagood ACtually, I'M still waiting for that Nobel Prize-winning study that identifies, for the first time, subluxations. 28 minutes ago · Like · 1 Allison Hagood No worries, EC, I'm archiving the whole thing. 27 minutes ago · Like · 1 Jason Polk DC medicine has two tools: drugs and surgery. things that are not drugs and surgery, are competition and they call competition quackery. speaking of conspiracies, the AMA was convicted an unlawful conspiracy in restraint of trade "to contain and eliminate the chiropractic profession." (Wilk v. American Medical Ass'n, 671 F. Supp. 1465, N.D. Ill. 1987). this campaign went on for decades in an effort to convince the public that chiropractic was, as you say, quackery. it was a marketing campaign for christ's sake. it is why you people are so blind right now. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilk_v._American_Medical_Association Wilk v. American Medical Association - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia en.wikipedia.org Wilk v. American Medical Association, 895 F.2d 352 (7th Cir. 1990), was a federa... See More 26 minutes ago · Like Jason Polk DC you guys arent the folks who publish research and probably cant even define pilot study without google. 25 minutes ago · Like Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children Before I do go, I might note that anytime someone makes the accusation in these threads that someone is putting words in their mouth, I go back through to find that they have carefully avoided using their own words at all. So, Jason, can you please detail for us your views on vaccination and how chiropractic care does or does not fit into the need for vaccines? 24 minutes ago · Unlike · 2 Jason Polk DC If you follow this link, you realize that pilot studies in reputable journals are identified as such: http://www.nature.com/nnano/journal/v7/n7/full/nnano.2012.74.html 24 minutes ago · Like Matt Zukowski Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_trial Here's the lowdown on clinical trials. Sample size of 80 is Phase 1, or a pilot study, unless we're talking an exponentially rare condition, which lower back pain is not. It's pretty much good enough to establish safety to go up the chain. 24 minutes ago · Like · 2 Jay Kanta Ah, there we go, he's starting to get frustrated and show his true colors. You're young, Jason, your inexperience and lack of knowledge is absolutely clear. You stand a very good chance of making a complete ass of yourself and all of this is being captured, constantly. If you had an ounce of professionalism you would run and hide from this to protect what little credibility you might have with other chiropractors. 22 minutes ago · Like · 1 Jay Kanta For not being able to find the research on "subluxations" you sure can post other links. 22 minutes ago · Like · 1 Allison Hagood "Medicine has two tools, drugs and surgery" You're so full of shit I'm surprised you don't squeak when you walk. My doctor discusses diet, exercise, lifestyle changes, meditation, yoga, and all kinds of other things when I see her for my yearly checkup. You so obviously have never spoken to an actual doctor. 20 minutes ago · Unlike · 2 Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children (This, btw, is another example of how the anti-vax nut and the 9/11 nuts are so similar. They are really good at "asking questions" and "demanding proof", but never can seem to articulate exactly what their alternative reality is.) 20 minutes ago · Like · 2 Matt Zukowski you follow this link, you realize that pilot studies in reputable journals are identified" "If
(3) Went ahead and...
So you concede "The Spine Journal" wasn't a reputable journal? Not surprising. Elsevier got spanked many times for pushing bogus journals and pay to publish garbage. 18 minutes ago · Edited · Like · 3 Jennifer Rodrigues WAIT!! I gotta go to 7-11 and get my slurpee and popcorn, this shits getting good. 20 minutes ago · Like · 3 Jason Polk DC my view on vaccines and chiropractic is this: they are completely 100% unrelated. im not even licensed to give specific recommendations in practice about vaccines. i always tell my patients to do their own research on the cost and benefit of each vaccine and the scheduling of that vaccine and to be sure to consult at least one medical doctor before making their decisions. i do point out that if they are concerned about the safety (and they often are already if they think to ask me) that whether or not to vaccinate is not an all or nothing decsion. there are always different or delayed schedules to consider. and there is always the option to forego some while getting others (many people dont see a need for Hep B for infants when Hep B is transmitted through risky or promisuous sex and IV drug use). It's not my job as a chiropractor to decide these thangs for my patient. 19 minutes ago · Like Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children http://www.reactiongifs.com/wpcontent/uploads/2011/11/mj_popcorn.gif 19 minutes ago · Like · 2 Allison Hagood No worries, Jay. Like I said, I'm saving the whole thread. It'll all be available for his clients to search if they want information :) 18 minutes ago · Like · 1 Embarrassed Cousins of Proud Parents of Unvaccinated Children Is it your job as a chiropractor to tell them their immune system will be stronger through chiropractic care? 17 minutes ago · Unlike · 2 Jason Polk DC it's been studied and confirmed that it can have that effect. 15 minutes ago · Like Allison Hagood Oh, Jason, you know that we can see your practice's page, right? Including the little infant boy trying to sex up a girl on the phone by bragging about how strong his immune system is because of adjustments? And why, somehow, do I think you're lying about what you tell patients? Also, Hep B is not JUST transmitted through sex and drug use. Another lie. Or disease knowledge fail. Whichever. 15 minutes ago · Unlike · 3 Allison Hagood Do link to those studies. Thanks in advance! 13 minutes ago · Unlike · 2 Jason Polk DC when the mom doesnt have hep b, those are the primary risk factors 12 minutes ago · Like Matt Zukowski Jason Polk DC "it's been studied and confirmed that it can have that effect." @ Citation needed, a real one, you know a refereed academic journal, not something called "The Spine Journal" from Elsevier. 11 minutes ago · Edited · Like · 2 Allison Hagood Primary risk factors doesn't mean ONLY risk factors. 10 minutes ago · Like · 1 Jason Polk DC i love it. i work with MD's all the time. they would laugh you out of the room for that last comment matt. 8 minutes ago · Like Jay Kanta "Jason Polk DC it's been studied and confirmed that it can have that effect." Liar. 8 minutes ago · Like Allison Hagood No links then? 7 minutes ago · Like Adam Keener Dr. of Chiropractic? That's like Dr. of Creation Studies. How do you get a degree in something that has no backing? I trust the Rug Dr. more than you guys. At least it has studies showing it works. 6 minutes ago · Edited · Like Matt Zukowski "Medicine has two tools, drugs and surgery" Then how do you explain physiatry? Orthos wouldn't suggest physical therapy? What Chiropractor doesn't at least have one physiatrist to refer to when treatment continues beyond let's say ~7 weeks or so? What doctor wouldn't refer someone to at least a nutritionist? This sounds like a cheap scare tactic. 6 minutes ago · Like Matt Zukowski " i work with MD's all the time. " You just said you didn't, as MDs only use drugs and surgery. I guess you lied. "they would laugh you out of the room for that last comment matt." Doubtful, considering I just talked with my ortho about "the Spine Journal". An appeal to ridicule is a logical fallacy. Bad chiropractor, no donut :P
Unable to post comment. Try Again Write a comment...
(3) Went ahead and...
This action might not be possible to undo. Are you sure you want to continue?
We've moved you to where you read on your other device.
Get the full title to continue reading from where you left off, or restart the preview.