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The Dulce Interview: Retired USAF Colonel Confirms Secret Military Installation at Dulce

By Anthony Sanchez 7-22-10

Note: The following is an excerpt of the author's upcoming book-FW Background Information This interview was held at a private residence in Placer County, CA. on January 6th, 2010 conducted by researcher Anthony F. Sanchez, with a retired USAF Colonel to recall the events surrounding a classified 1979 incident which took place at Dulce, NM. This includes details involving (Colonel X) who was assigned to Dulce as part of a special Medical Detachment where he learned the history and circumstances surrounding the 1940 Dulce Discovery event; a harrowing event, as claimed by the Colonel, filled with many intriguing details, which have never been revealed to the public before. Preface Because of the enigmatic nature surrounding the UFO phenomenon and how it typically negatively affects those who come forth with disclosure, my source, (Colonel X), has requested anonymity.

the name of the subject was never given to the examiner. ensuring prevention of leaks from discovery of the story‟s premise. after leaving the Air Force I went back to school and earned two post graduate degrees in Psychology. and each of these events happened exactly as I have written them based on the personal testimony provided by (Colonel X). All the accounts mentioned in this interview are real. All three are grown now and doing quite well on their own. what are you doing today. and I guess that‟s why we are here to talk. (PST) Colonel‟s Private Residence Sierra Nevada Region. at about that time everything about my career was quite normal.S. nor was his name asked during the exam.: So you live a pretty normal life.S.X. There are no fictional characters. Again. CA A. Today I teach graduate students at a college right here in Northern California. Anyhow.S. But all questions were accordant to the Colonel‟s understanding in that they reflected his direct involvement at Dulce. Interview January 6th 2010. I specifically chose an examiner who knew nothing of the case as to prevent him from later remembering or identifying my source who requests total anonymity. Placer County. are you still involved with the Military? C. as such. or until such time that I am given permission to do so. this allowed us to retain anonymity of (Colonel X). academic credentials and current work as a professor in Northern California have been vetted and deemed completely legitimate. And more than anyone else. I personally structured all the questions (outside the innocuous). Also.. and how it affects all of us. He passed two independent examinations. On January 8th.M. also from Northern California. The forensic Polygraph Examiner can 'possibly' reveal the identity of (Colonel X). I have obtained the information from (Colonel X) with assurance that his name would not be divulged under any set of circumstances. proceeding quite well. A. 2010 (Colonel X) submitted to two tests by a certified forensic polygraph examiner. Air Force I can remember how arduously hard I worked towards a promotion to Lieutenant Colonel. .X. During the latter half of my military career while I was still a Major with the U. I‟m still happily married and have three children. was it always this way? C. he was never made aware of the significance of Dulce or the reason for the exam. the only known speaking 'first-hand witness' to events at Dulce. ensuring that we conceal the secretive nature of the „story‟ away from the polygraph examiner.: No it wasn‟t.Therefore. His military record.: Colonel.: No. for this interview held with the Colonel.. His selection (the examiner) was made after meeting specific criteria. I firmly believe that his testimony will be the catalyst to the exposure of what really is happening beneath the Mesa at Dulce NM. 9:00 A. and I am very thankful they live close by. except for revealing that he is a retired law enforcement officer and now a private investigator. I am still surprised as I am grateful. Therefore I will not divulge the name of the examiner used. That‟s all I wanted .

It was pretty severe. Two men died. This was nothing new for me. everything I knew would change for many years to come. drowning out the aircraft's own engine noise. CA. NM. . “Where in the world was Dulce?” For one. any normalcy in my life ended at about that time. my specialty detachment typically operated at various levels of classification. I had never heard of the place.. one man we evaluated had been subjected to something so severe during the incident that eventually he had to be discharged. It began after I received orders to report to Edwards AFB.. either. and they happened more often than you would think. assigned to a Medical Detachment specializing in an area of Psychiatric and Behavioral Studies for both the USAF (and occasionally the Central Intelligence Agency). Secondly. However. causing them painful headaches. Mainly what we would do was conduct an initial. I remember thinking to myself. all aspects. so our regular operating protocol was to always treat each new job with a standard compartmentalized approach. as this was a top secret assignment. however. what my detachment was for . that's medical lingo for a first interview with the patient. The orders informed me that I was to adhere to strict protocol under our classified guidelines. medically for mental instability.I was stationed out of McClellan Air Force Base near Sacramento. This is what I did. but it‟s accurate. And whatever it was they saw out there. I had been assigned on many top secret projects before. In any event. That was all I knew about the assignment. coming closer with each pass. In some cases we'd facilitate triage if necessary and then conduct exit interviews before submitting our final report. we never were sure as to what the entire nature of the Irwin incident was. A USAF C-130E Hercules with six men aboard had nearly collided several times with an object of unknown origin traveling at a super high rate of speed estimated at 1500-2000 miles per hour. the year before the Dulce assignment I had been on one particular job having to do with a recovery mission from a crash site located near Fort Irwin down south. almost playing with them. from there I would fly on a special assignment to conduct interviews at a secret installation in Dulce. I was certain that none of the people I had served with knew of Dulce. The survivors said the unidentified object appeared to be tracking them. ultimately crashing. and in fact. Our team reported to these types of incidents. One man reported that a deafening high-pitch sound penetrated the plane's walls. By the final pass from the object. and then we'd investigate and document the investigation. It had never been mentioned before and was never on any list of installations that I had reported to. and to the best of my knowledge. typically my work involved trips to locations on joint Air Force-CIA special projects. My role was to assist with physical and psychiatric evaluations of any surviving personnel. the C-130E immediately began to stall. was definitely traumatic enough to make them succumb to an arbitrary psychological condition causing both paranoia and terror. I know that might sound surprising.

D.: Well … before joining and starting OTS at Lackland. Only by landing directly near the front gate on a obscure landing pad could you see the entrance. and with a great level of relevance. because it's what prepared me for Dulce.. A. Usually when on assignment we operated in a team of four to six people per detachment. as you know already. was simply out of the question until after my military career was over.S. What I immediately can recall was that upon first reaching the entrance to the Dulce Installation was that it appeared to be eerily similar in design to that of Cheyenne Mountain Air Force Station (NORAD) where I had been stationed twice before. A. in addition to other areas of my work. I had already earned my Bachelor of Science in Psychology.: Do you mean.S. but it‟s important that I mention this event. A. and in the other scenario. So. through both psychological and behavioral assessment.: Was it normal for your detachment to work at places like Cheyenne? .. in Psychiatry and decided that teaching Psychology would be a much more relaxing and rewarding career path for me after the military.D.. This assignment was something that caught me completely off guard. but this time it was to be just three of us. I was too busy. usually falling under some umbrella of secrecy. And it is.S. These events are classified. Plus.D. Anyhow. in Psychiatry. How we operated was simple.I know you want to talk about Dulce. A Type-X event or incident involves a death or accident caused by unknown phenomena.X. during my time with the Air Force I was selected for assignment with a classified medical detachment. Later a fourth would be added. You can be certain of it. If you were flying above this place at any distance greater than a few hundred feet.: Exactly . Only by coordinates could you find it. One scenario would be to conduct psychological assessments of personnel after „Type-X events‟.X. except the entrance was half the size. and the travel involved quelled any ideas for additional higher education. we would be called to evaluate potential candidates prior to consideration for any „special assignment‟ that involved a unique set of circumstances. at that time an M. I hate to do this … but before going into detail about Dulce can you briefly describe your work at Cheyenne Mountain? C. I chose to forgo an M. Basic Officer Training had been tough enough. but I noticed that the two most qualified people in my area of expertise were pooled together for this assignment. relevant to your work? C. we specialized in performing a battery of psychological and behavioral evaluations of military personnel (from any branch) in two manners of protocol. I don‟t know who recommended me. you would never know it was there. the very reason why my unit was created. Something I don‟t think I was prepared for . but not in our field of expertise. even if the Air Force felt that I was. It was very clever how they used the desert landcover to conceal the entrance.. possibly. But wouldn‟t you know it. Back then I had often pondered about one day earning an M. me being one of them.: Colonel. but once I was fully entrenched.

the most common in these environments. especially within a deeply embedded or subterranean environment.S.: Taphephobic? C. anyone found to be suffering from any acute psychological condition as a result of the environment. researcher Anthony F. This was to help identify and combat the affects of working in various levels of prolonged confinement.. but to the military … if these people were selected at the „top‟ of their grade and „qualified‟ with a specific specialization meeting certain requirements … well then. was simply re-assigned. someone generally at a director of operations level. central operations at Cheyenne are housed at approximately 600 meters within the mountain and there are various levels of ranging depths to other key operating areas below the mountain‟s base. in charge. and then submit a final report to the commanding officer. [End of excerpt. Such an important task was usually reserved for assignment to a Lieutenant Colonel. or by medicating. No.: Oh yes. Anyhow. It was quite common to encounter new people who had reservations over working these assignments. See Also: . perform psychological analyses of all the personnel involved. not at all.S. these situations would require too much physician interaction and the potential for bad effects from medicating. they had to be evaluated. A.. A. but I had never had been asked to conduct a full investigation. you maybe had 3-5 people with simple diagnoses such as low-level claustrophobic anxiety. Sanchez. With about 1500 personnel operating the base at any one time.C.S. are you saying that many people at NORAD are medicated? C. and in rare cases (convinced) to perform their job.X.: „Taphephobic‟ is the fear of being buried alive.: Oh no . This could be done either through psychiatric sessions. But if we ever suspected that someone possessed a high-level or an acute claustrophobic or taphephobic anxiety … there was no way in „hell‟ they would be permitted to operate there. :How was Dulce different? C. As you probably know.. A. The work was the same every where I went on these assignments … except for at the Dulce installation.X. which would not be conducive to facilitating a successful work environment.: Very interesting. or both.X.] * Special Thanks To Anthony Sanchez Read the entire interview in the upcoming book "UFO Highway" by author. for anyone. at Cheyenne there was regular evaluation required for any potential long-term personnel slated for work at the installation.X. My assignment was always the same: you conduct an investigation. At the time I was just a Major..: At first it was because of circumstance.

↑ Grab this Headline Animator I'm sorry. urging me to read the rest of the story in a book.. I have a hard time taking them seriously. The idea of a book also clouds the message. New Mexico Dulce.. Dulce. No one has every been prosecuted for reveling secrets about UFOs. It did a good job hooking me with a story. June Crain worked at Write field. By Anthony Sanchez. There is one new anonymous UFO whistle blower every week and the idea that they will get in trouble is a fallacy. She came out publicly and nothing happened. When money is a motivating factor in issues such as this. New Mexico posted by Frank Warren at 12:01 AM 12 Comments: Wargame Junkie said. 6:17 AM mfritz said. The interview is cut so short. So for me thank you I . the abruptly ends. this just seems like a gimmick to sell more copies instead of getting the "truth" to the public..First UFO Underground Base Conference at Dulce.. there isn't enough to make me want to spend any money on the book. It sounds like the interview goes no where so why would I bother? 7:03 AM cappufo said... New Mexico: Bio-Warfare and Project Blue Beam SHARE YOUR UFO EXPERIENCE HELP SUPPORT THIS SITE ABOUT DONATIONS Labels: Article. I have a hard time taking alot of stories like this seriously and this article doesn't help. These interview are useless. To me.

We all have to survive and doing what it takes or what we love to do ie writing. Just because someone is ultimately selling something. Hiding the truth about UFOs or possibly ETs by attacking those people who come forward with no real proof would be the height stupidity . no one who works for or with CIA wants the fact known. 7:27 AM roscoe said... I have no problem with someone selling books. it's silly to make such a big deal over keeping Colonel X's identity a secret when the information provided in the interview all but gives his identity away.. Military officers are always subject to recall and prosecution for unauthorized disclosures.wouldn't waste my money.. First.and good luck. . I hear this argument over and over again and it doesn't hold water.. The mythical Colonel X could be readily identified (if he existed) from the data provided. and unfortunately. Such use of fashion accessories suggests that the author is too overly concerned with projecting a "cool" image to be taken what. 1:09 PM Michael said.. officers involved in Top Secret operations carry their knowledge to the grave (unless info is unclassified--that this apparently is not).. Fantasy. (I was a USAF Major. including a picture of the author wearing a suit with sunglasses on his forehead creates a flashy image inappropriate for a reporter seeking to establish his credibility. I don't have a problem with a book either but let him do it in public so his testimony can investigated by other in our community. . Joe Capp UFO Media Matters 8:01 PM Chris said. Incredible. but very much in need of a rewrite. too. it just doesn't make their product or book invalid. Joe Capp UFO Media Matters Non-Commercial Blog 7:11 AM Writer said.Michael K.. Although I appreciate the author making this information available to the public. there are several problems which work together to create a negative perception of both the author and his article.) Incidentally. 1:27 PM Joseph Capp said. Second.. that probably is reason enough to discredit this piece. The information presented is insufficient to generate the desired level of interest. So all this cloak and dagger stuff is not part of real UFO history.. The last thing the government does when it is UFO is bother. How many ex-Air Force colonels are psychology professors in the Nor Cal area? My guess is not too many! In any event..Can't wait for the book to come out. But for me it is time to stop making money on UFO interviews. Finally. may prove counter-productive to the goal of selling books. it's an intriguing article. I am sure there are those in the UFO community that will bye this book. You go Anthony.. Let's get real. When was the last time anyone who came out from the military who had personal testimony of UFOs been tried or arrested. in cutting the interview so short the author and/or publisher of this website give readers little incentive to secure for themselves a copy of the book in question. First of all. and media follow-up would be makes sense. or "making money" off interviews. IF this person really cares and is not doing if for the money let him come forward like June did who's is a real hero to the truth.

evaluate. scroll all the way down left hand column to get the address)." his identity is being protected by Sanchez. Regarding the truncated version of the interview: let me make it clear that "I asked researcher Anthony Sanchez" to publish said interview. and again-the majority don't want their respective names used. he did not approach me! He had the (truncated) interview on his web-site "briefly.. 1:18 AM Greetings All. Thank you for taking time to make comment. As a "courtesy to him" for allowing me to publish the piece. I asked and received his permission to publish said piece. bad Idea on the marketing attempt.. the witness "isn't anonymous. as I do all for all of our contributors who have penned recent tomes. along with Sanchez' investigation into Dulce falls under that purview. and disseminate all information concerning UFOs and related phenomenon. Good Day Joe. or if one is about to come out. (Please e-mail me. I felt at the end of reading I wasted my time. I thought the interview with "Colonel X" interesting.These clownish gimmicks for book sales are just another reason why so few people take the community seriously. for example: Frank Warren said. Cheers. irregardless of the fact that it wasn't complete. I put up the blurb about his upcoming book. Re "getting into trouble": the laws that were established in the early '50's (to the best of my knowledge) are still in place today (in some form or fashion). . Here at The UFO Chronicles our mission statement is to "collect. Additionally..." As the publisher/editor of TUC. Frank Editor/Publisher . You wrote: These interview are useless. 11:36 PM The Mulacs said. Thank you for taking time to make comment. I'm afraid I have to respectfully disagree: I have been interviewing witnesses since the early '70's and "the majority" preferred not to have their names used--out of those the bulk certainly wasn't "useless.." the a fore published (truncated) interview. collate. There is one new anonymous UFO whistle blower every week and the idea that they will get in trouble is a fallacy. like there was not enough to tell me anything here that actually made me want to read the book.The UFO Chronicles 9:41 AM Frank Warren said. I receive UFO reports of some sort frequently.. I should have stayed on the coast to coast site where this came up on." and I was able to read it.

SECURITY 208. Any person who violates the provisions of these acts may be liable to prosecution thereunder. Intel. Military and Civilian. or trial by court martial in the case of military personnel. Chapter 37. may result in dismissal or prosecution under law. or the Canadian Official Secrets {|} Act of 1939.S. including key civilian executives and military personnel regardless of grade or position. There were very many in the USAF who had experiences. Communications Act of 1934. The purpose is to emphasize the necessity for the handling of such information within official channels only.The UFO Chronicles 11:05 AM bdune said. Military commands and activities in making local distribution Of MERINT reports and in subsequent communications regarding the contents of any MERINT report shall handle such communications in accordance with current security regulations. Netscape Communications. educated and does well for himself--the notion of his motives being solely for profit just doesn't apply. b. In addition to being a Software Consultant for the State of California through his own company. Any person who makes an unauthorized transmission or disclosure of such a report may be liable to prosecution under Title 18 of the US Code 793. Acer. in the case of civilians. he is intelligent. as amended. in Computer Information Systems from Western Governors University of Salt Lake City. Frank Editor/Publisher . My uncle who was a bird Colonel (fouht in WW2-Pilot 30 bombing missions over occupied Europe-. Moreover. You wrote: IF this person really cares and is not doing if for the money let him come forward like June did who's is a real hero to the truth. Additionally. UFO books as a rule--don't make money. I am sure there are those in the UFO community that will bye this book. Transmission of CIRVIS reports are subject to the U. and the Canadian Radio Act of 1938. as amended. This should not be construed as requiring classification of CIRVIS {|} messages. Korea and Vietnam)told .. Disciplinary Action. But for me it is time to stop making money on UFO interviews. as amended. In short.. The witness in question (to the best of my knowledge) hasn't been paid. Anthony has been employed for 16 years as a Software Engineer working for 3Com. These reports contain information affecting the national defense of the United States and Canada.UNITED STATES COMMUNICATIONS INSTRUCTIONS FOR REPORTING VITAL INTELLIGENCE SIGHTINGS (CIRVIS/MERINT) SECTION III . UT in 2008. most authors are fortunate to break even. b. Cheers. Violations of or failure to observe the provisions of security regulations be treated under disciplinary procedures authorized by law and prescribed in applicable regulations.. and won't be in the future. The unauthorized disclosure of classified information by any individual. Matrix Innovative Systems Inc. Anthony has BSc. and Hewlett Packard performing high level software development supporting scientific engineering and business intelligence projects.

. sightings etc were valid it was the single most important development in the history of the human race..He told me there was always someone "around" who had had an experience and would talk to friends. not even as a civilian.dropping young men off the same age as his sons and a month or whatever later picking them up in a bag. He did tell me also that "he had heard" of USAF personnel being hospitalized as well as "retired" and then hospitalized..he would never go into specific detail.. Additionally.nor would he talk about his combat experiences except to tell me Vietnam was the worse for him. after experiencing a contact. All this to say that what the author describes does not sound too far fetched to me. He also resented that the military was not allowed to win that war. he had indirect ties with Blue Book (between Korea and Vietnam)and first heard about unidentified phenomena as early as 1944. radar operator or controller who had had UFO experiences. I am only conveying what I was told.. He told me he knew several .Some who were combat veterans. 10:20 AM that almost everyone in the USAF knew a pilot. crewman... He knew UFOs were real but he also knew if that word appeared on your USAF record your career path stopped. even superiors about it but would never "go on record". He said that if one percent of reports.