Mill between Aristotle & Bentham Author(s): Martha C. Nussbaum Reviewed work(s): Source: Daedalus, Vol. 133, No.
2, On Happiness (Spring, 2004), pp. 60-68 Published by: The MIT Press on behalf of American Academy of Arts & Sciences Stable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/20027914 . Accessed: 29/09/2012 22:39
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His radical abhorrence of suffering to bring all ambition to a state of well-being beings for a time. for a time.
Thus Henry Prichard. ? 2004 by the American & Sciences
6o D dalus
answer influence like a question whose was so obvious that it could not be asked
in earnest. so powerful was the obscuring a ques power of Bentham's insights that tion that Wordsworth took to be alto indeed. loving. the fact that some issues of justice cannot be well handled mere summing of the interests through of all. including "TheFragility of Goodness: Luck and Ethics inGreek Tragedy and Philoso phy" (1986). Indeed. and theLaw" (2004). When Ar with pleasure istotle asked what happiness is.Martha
C. His concern with interests
the Happy Warrior" Man does not strive after happiness does that. and "Hiding from Humanity: Disgust. and satisfaction obscured. lines answering the spent eighty-five is soon what happiness really question under Bentham's looked to philosophers
C. by in his thinking Bentham's conception that he simply assumed about happiness who talked about that any philosopher must have been identifying it happiness or satisfaction. Law School.
might conceptions philosophical even while conceal. Nussbaum is the author of numerous books. and Divinity School. is appointed in thePhi losophyDepartment.only
aggregating of each and every person ob scured. and which.
guished Service Professor of Law and Ethics at theUniversity of Chicago.Friedrich Nietzsche. A Fellow of theAmerican Academy since 1988. such as activity. Jeremy aspects of human portant Jtowerful good. By shin some im genuinely ing a strong light on life. things also be fullness of commitment might involved. Nussbaum. Nussbaum
Mill between Aristotle &Bentham
is the happy Warrior? Who is he That every man in arms should wish to be? -William Wordsworth. albeit a foe of was so influenced Utilitarianism. "Character of
Bentham's Utilitarianism ers. "Upheavals of Thought: The Intelligence of Emotions" (2001). he gether askable. they reveal. Prichard
. and satisfaction the fact that well-being and his admirable sentient
not be all there
is to the human
or even all there is to happiness. Shame. "Women and Human Develop ment" (2000). .
happiness to be a kind of living that is ac
to this tradition.
in the Ethics of Aristotle. equal of home and family. even though it sometimes may involve pain and loss. rep and longer tradition of derived from thinking about happiness ancient Greek thought about eudaimonia resented an older and its parts.'" As Austin saw. kind. similarly. Urmson New 31. poem. was on a concep Wordsworth relying tion like this when he asked what the character and demeanor of the happy Warrior would be in each of the many areas of life." Philosophical and G.
According most fully is general Ethics.. consists
piness have been means to the production of happiness. miserable train. whether he knew it or not. and tivities that put contentment so forth. an lover bition. Unaware tradition Wordsworth's of the richer English that concerning happiness
hap in. J.
o?Agathon in J. Austin memorably wrote in a devastating critique of Prich worth who ard on Aristotle. Wordsworth remarkably 3 Here Aristotle that Aristotle. John Stuart Mill knew both the Ben thamite and the Aristotelian/Wordswor thian conceptions of happiness and was torn between them. Warnock J. for the community. meant. "I do not think Words : 'This is the warrior
: is contentment obvious happiness Instead of asking what satisfaction. Aristotle. then. Thus characteristically the arete of a pruning see knife. the important thing about
is that he has traits the happy Warrior that make him capable of performing all in an exemplary of life's many activities way.
asking the question been asking. coura geous. that goal rath who pursued Englishmen for a noble er than richer goals involving suffering ac end. lacking nothing it richer or better. hap a state of and con piness to be pleasure and expressed his scorn for tentment. in Aristotle's
am worldly a lover of reason. the unimpeded of the performance activities that constitute happiness. in the Ethics of Papers. L. Despite his many
2 I thus render the Greek Arete even need be trans usually in be ethical. L. and inherited via the usual of eudaimonia as translation English 'happiness. indeed.3 to honor or attached sively concerned not exces
ly agreed tive. im ed.
27 39. and 1-
Prichard. His life is happy be cause it is full and rich. As J. whatever it good at doing what makes does. he believed. activities able activities in accordance
i Henry A. My including plicit York: Oxford account his University of Prichard account follows
the one major from departure to Words seemed apparently worth Aristotle required by British morality. that thing sort of thing can Plato speak of that that
lated deed a trait
as Virtue. he must really asking about the instrumental
he sim poem embodied. continued striving.
intellectual. but usually accompanies happiness. (Oxford Press. a trait of a person. a good friend.' it need not
ethical. He ismoderate.
premises. Plea is not identical with sure. re In other of honesty.' Indeed. since
he could not really have been he appears to have its answer was so or
and political and activities excellences.argued.1 understood Nietzsche. inclusive of all that has intrinsic val that ue. Aristotle would make to argue for a more spe then proceeded cific conception of happiness that iden tified itwith a specific plurality of valu for example. honest.
and Eudaimonia "Agathon in Austin. and complete.2 involved in love and friendship. does not make much to is close spects.. to be what took English 'happiness' ply Bentham said itwas. not is. famously Austin. he is 'Doomed to go in company with Pain / And fear and bloodshed. loving. at risk.
"The Meaning " and
Philosophy 10 (1935) :
of anything. Austin's. 1979). It is arete. and that he acts in accordance with those traits.
.' But Wordsworth's
feels pleased. O.
subsequent questions discussed such philosophers with great subtlety. of being active. is that. a or a way or many things ? Is it feeling. the The unkind way of characterizing be to say that Mill was and had no coherent deeply confused result would The kinder of happiness. what is in question
to pro the same thing in other words.more is richer than both of its sources capable of doing justice to all the ele as ments that thoughtful people have sociated with that elusive idea. Bentham or
Be?." In amanner that turn. The result is the basis. thus he never described nor flict between them. as he puts it. at lymapped that of happiness for a conception least. Bentham's general was a lover of the Greeks and a lover of criticisms he credited the poet whom Wordsworth. argued for the of the pieces he appropriat importance tions ed from each one. Mill seems with curing his depression. never to have fully realized the extent of the tension between the two concep the con .
of dis disregard that have mattered greatly to : ismeant that property in any it tends to produce bene
good. the long Western flouting tradition that had debated philosophical whether could be identified happiness . the two amore
the happiness of the party :or. according it appears to have to augment or which is to maximize
dalus Spring 2004
. He in itself is pleasure. Aristotle. mote or to oppose that happiness." Such ways for in of talking raise several questions. and the ly thing good only thing bad in itself is pain. thing. conception I believe. and giving pleasure and the absence of pain and of depres never sufficient sion a role that Aristotle out. and goes An equally long philosophical tradi tion before Bentham had debated how we should understand the nature of as a type pleasure. if such very self? Is it count as plea different experiences sures? Could there be any one feeling or toMahler's sensation that both listening Tenth and eating a steak have in com mon? and awhole line of Plato.
of Bentham. on from there.a in which tradition the with pleasure answer negative greatly predominated. From the assertion that these two "masters" have a very influence on human powerful to he passes without conduct. or. We speak of pleasure we also say of experience. pain. Meanwhile. but things are like. "My greatest pleasures listening toMahler and eating steak. he never stopped as a defender himself of representing he line. or unhappiness the party whose interest is considered.
pleasure. is "that principle which of every action approves or disapproves of conduct to the tendency whatsoever. tham simply declares are all the same and happiness good. (all this in the present case comes to the same thing) or (what comes again to the same thing) to prevent the happening to of mischief. The principle minimize pain. more accurate thing to say and. a stance : Is pleasure single unitary thing. or less coherent idea of how to integrate richness of life and com them giving a place they do not plexity of activity have in Bentham. he defines utility in shows his characteristic tinctions philosophers By utility
fit. answer the positive being endorsed by Ben few apart from the Epicureans Ignoring that pleasure.Martha Nussbaum on happiness
C. activity it a sensation at all. argument claim that the proper goal the normative and pleasure of utility. perhaps. or happi
object.hamhaSawayofmaki?gMeseem asserts that the on simpler than it is. despite Mill's lack of unfortunate clarity about how he combined he really did have conceptions. whereby
Even in the context of nonhuman this is a very reduced picture of animals. pealing aspects of his thought is its great tham's program of sentient for the suffering of animals. at the very of thought that the painless kill argued sometimes be permit
problem in the Utilitarian
have labored greatly. plays no Activity. So. what is valuable in life. just add a new dimension defined as that Right action is ultimately which produces the greatest pleasure for the greatest number. that count as
is that of evil pleasures.
sees that the LJnlike Bentham.4 But comparable cannot be said to have devel Bentham account like a convincing oped anything or of of pleasure and pain. or internal. Ben in extending tham sees no problem the class to the entire world comparison sentient animals.simply ignores them. the Utilitarian system in a complicate way that Bentham would approved. social utility. personal which dition there economists human it leaves out more about inter on tra actions
at the same
introducing itself reducible attractive
not have an ethical value to pleasure or
about Ben is its focus on the urgent needs beings for relief from Indeed. certainty or remoteness. The special goal of right action is to maximize plea as a sensation. A person who gets pleasure by being hooked up to an experience machine the famous of the late Robert Nozick is example as well off as the person who gets just that produce pleasure by loving and eating and listen ing.).
. pleasure is a sin other minds. he adds. from inflicting pleasure
as so often they do. in causal properties (tenden to produce more pleasure. As Mill writes. Mill says. Their capacity for agency is of interest only in the sense that itmakes them capable of choosing utility. Where are concerned. beings or less everything.
time. is the ty." sensation containing gle homogeneous no qualitative differences. should a that makes pleasure society better? Most economists who follow Bentham have tried to draw some lines here. That is sure. Another economists of
Aristotle Bentham &
that has troubled problem in the Benthamite tradition If people harm get on others. Aristotle nature of happiness is very difficult to down. people and animals are of sensations of plea large containers sure or satisfaction. compassion which he takes to be unproblematically to human suffering. suffered thus he that death. through the imagi
nation. in order to rule out the most sadistic and In so doing. Moreover. finally. result of "the empiricism of one who has had little experience" either external. that is not
pain. Per cy concern with pain haps Bentham's deep can somewhat con which plausibly be as a unitary sensation varying sidered is the only in intensity and duration source of his that various plea feeling sures do not differ in quali meaningfully But this conclusion. one of the most ap suffering. "Bentham failed in deriving light from For him. duration. that he denied however. his view cries out for adequate philosophical develop
ment. of happiness. uncertainty.
from large our scope of consideration one person to many we people. propinquity and. Because of his attachment to a dogmatic simplicity. simply of quantity. In book i of the Nicomachean pin
4 It should animals and be noted. in effect. understood the only good thing there is in the world. etc. The only vari : it can ations in pleasure are quantitative or vary in intensity. For Bentham : is no such problem when we en
an animal ing of ted. role in Bentham's system. Nor is Bentham worried a comparisons. they malicious pleasures.
on. since we all agree that is equivalent happiness to "living well and Itmust doing well. that is. In any case.) Itmust be active. etc. activity. very different conceptions one in book 7 and one in book 10. moderation. since we to define happiness as some a few can enjoy. pleasures Another for Mill. account holds that pleasure that neces along with. friends. complete." Later some further he advances arguments the identification. human being. First of all. in all of this does pleasure Where fig ure? Early in the work. ties fit together to make up a whole life is an element in the value of that life. "like the sarily supervenes bloom on the cheek of youth" . Aristotle himself offers two pleasure of pleasure.
Ethics. ily appetites. he sets about that task. and probably bet ments").one gets it by doing the relevant activity in a cer or complete tain. whatever of a human life turn out to be. some way of coping with our bod etc. that living for saying pleasure only would be "to choose the life of dumb grazing animals. Itmust be self which he means that there sufficient. by his account. and relationships fellow citizens. (He immediate makes clear that self-sufficiency does ly :the sort of self not imply solitariness he is after is one that includes sufficiency that has intrinsic with family." flourishing human being. pleasure is just not the right thing to focus on in a account of the good life for a normative are bad. are worth pursuing. inclusive of all value. it against is by no means easy to say exactly what is. The first identifies pleasure with unimpeded that activity (not so odd ifwe remember and "enjoy speak of "my pleasures" The second. He seems to think that there is relatively little controversy about the fact that courage. trying to identi fy the excellent way of acting in each of these areas. He argues on sever that there is general agreement : It al formal characteristics of happiness must be most final. Aristotle human life in which we characteristical ly act and make choices. Happiness. then the greatest Scholars argue a lot
the precise meaning of this pas sage. is that some valuable activities
. Aristotle does not re as a gard pleasure single thing that varies in intensity and duration . Some pleasures evil people take pleasure in their evil be mative havior. happiness involves all of these in some suitable and the way all the activi combination. the controversy 64 D dalus Spring 2004
Furthermore. And itmust thing only be relatively that stable. not something can be removed chance misfor by any don't want
and a revealing one problem. Aristotle dis misses the claim that pleasure is identi cal with happiness. justice. if there lence." we cannot in it. it con only tains qualitative differences related to the activities to which it attaches." be generally available.
to the more precise definition of pertains these excellences because presumably in each of these spheres we all have to some choice or another: we have make to devise some way of facing the risk of death. is a nor by contrast. He must the excellent activities mean. apparently unimpeded thing way. concludes are more and most about than one. by is nothing that can be added to it that would increase its value. to anyone who makes the right sort of effort. either one excellence.Martha Nussbaum on happiness
C. itself In the remainder of the Nicomachean considers the areas of Ethics. : since it is constitutive notion as "the human of what we understand life for a include evil
or "a good life. that comes we
this apparently uncontroversial of his argument by part that there is a further deep suggesting : ismade up of ac agreement happiness that is in accordance with excel tivity or. is some ter. but let me simply assert.
. says Aristotle.
for the greatest the greatest happiness number. that he has not left sensation he ut
terly out of account: he asks "which is the most of existence of two modes uni grateful to the feelings. particularly er" and "lower" pleasures. and is aware of that .. for him.. We cannot avoid recognizing qualitative between differences. much to be said. according are people whose there circumstances. It is absurd to say at the pros Indeed. children. judge between Mill refers them? "high then. he counts music. Meanwhile. prisoned one has the unfortunate "luck of Priam" whose friends. that "To give a standard set up
his judge makes choices. however. First of all." be "dislodged as is organized Utilitarianism IVliU's an extended defense of Bentham's pro gram against the most common objec tions Mill that had been raised against it.and to what extent this is
left an open question. or. with out open defection from the Benthamite a number of crucial he introduces camp. and way of life were suddenly snatched away from him here too one can by defeat and capture from happiness. that it could be. deprive by depriving He names the im them of happiness.
Mill between & Aristotle Bentham
of intensity. and judge who tives. says Ar istotle. which pleasures in one form all human beings possess or other. is happy. This health shows as Elsewhere major pleasures. This just goes to show. conflicts nothing which than momen otherwise
more [Bentham's] theory. an object tarily." apart from the question that are evident to any competent judge." So a is a part of what happi : it acts as a gate people choice of a life de the preventing D dalus Spring 2004 65
." This istence" ismost like Aristotle. sense of dignity ness is for many keeper." Clearly the . virtue. Nonethe to feel at the prospect he is acting in accordance with ex less. is so essential a and which of those in whom part of the happiness with it is strong. he admits clear view of the moral by. Aristo is the courageous warrior tle's example a source forWordsworth's po (perhaps who faces death in battle for the em) sake of a noble end. Mill makes
of desire to them. that pleasure does not always ac that constitute the activities company happiness. for a this judge as planning imagines as which should be complete whole life.. to Aristotle. them of activity. in particular.. In a later text. the more he thinks he has to lose and the more pain he is likely that this warrior is pleased of death. awhole of all the major and inclusive
sources of value. to
Like Plato in book 9 of the Republic. both the idea that pleasure and the idea is identical with happiness in producing that right action consists defends
nor pleasures pains : there are differences
homog "in kind. things get still more The reason an experi complicated. enced judge will not choose the lower is "a sense of dignity. ward. can that they closely linked to activities not be pursued apart from them. what requires things it includes in the ideas of pain and pleasure . talk suggests that Mill." Shortly after it plain that. the pect of death. modifications.its reli calculus of the Benthamite ty ance on quantity as the only source of in pleasures has been thrown variation an idea of compe out.
the choice to a competent both alterna has experienced shows Mill famous passage as very like activi thinking of pleasures so as experiences ties. Along the way.are not accompanied by pleasure. with Aristotle. replaced here by tent judgment as to what "manner of ex "worth having.and so he cellence. How. If and tortured as examples. better his life is.
likeWordsworth's warrior. with a decided predominance of the active over the passive. and that is a good way.
expe clearly be rejected Mill continues. toward pained virtue is subtly different from that of a and Wordsworth. But Mill the happiness of does not tell us enough about this man.Martha Nussbaum on happiness
tells us. who supposes that this sense of anyone some dignity will cause people to forfeit two of their happiness "confoun[ds] rience machine would very different content." that this man must sacrifice concludes mote to pro his own happiness if he wishes others. and activity. by this judge. Mill Summarizing writes that the happiness which the an cient philosophers "meant was not a life of rapture . to be but one part of happiness. in judging him 66 D dalus Spring 2004 shows us that his attitude
to display prodigious of many mastery and to share his fa intellectual skills. Nor did he receive elsewhere any successful or stable care for the emotional parts of his personality. and the all-important Even though pleasure sense itself is
can still live in his own happy because he chosen way. in one crucial passage. we be Aristotelian may recall. he Meanwhile. ther's shame at powerful emotions. seems its potential significant beyond A life full of ethi for inhibiting activity. the happy Warrior who endures pain for a noble cause. to those excellences for happiness if pleasure or if too much present. cal and intellectual and ac excellences tivity according does not suffice is insufficiently pain is present. This life ing long period was the result of an that em upbringing to the exclu excellent phasized activity a sion of emotional includ satisfactions. as he Why didMill think this ?
in and heterogeneous. as he much other was brought records. in an existence made up of few and transitory pains. of happiness. Moreover. complex standing a close relation to it is here said activity. Aristotle Imagining virtuous man in the present "imperfect state of the world's he arrangements. And an on yet pleasure persists emphasis throughout Mill's work. ing feelings of contentment. The pained warrior sets the bar of fortune
his discussion. judges that Priam is "dislodged from happiness" by his many and great But if this man ismore like misfortunes. from an early draft of the Autobiography the passage prior to publica (he deleted tion at the urging of his wife Harriet)
experienced In a passage
. For the presence of a great deal of pain Mill. then Mill. Mill. up by his father to be able of courageous
Well. pleasure." At this point Mill appears to have jettisoned of the equivalence :for with pleasure happiness happiness some is now "made up of" pleasures. clude virtue of dignity. Mill's mother was evi awoman of no marked dently al interests or accomplishments soon became very exhausted so many children. he had experienced such a life in amo not. he cannot ut terly leave it aside. many and varied pleasures. tle and Wordsworth.
sensation. has thus rejected one of Bentham's equivalences. and comfort. ment but dur risk-taking. and its "parts" in pains. Aristotle thinks that for a person from tune dislodges happiness it impedes activity so severely when only that a person cannot execute his chosen is plan of life at all. Mill's position :for Aristotle. of depression.
V Ve might put this point by saying that
Mill Aristotle higher than does. so that his life is deprived of activity. If his sacrifice is very great. and as famously evidence demonstrates." Mill more and ideas.but moments of such. she by bearing
this as a lack of warmth.
to be is at variance unhappy. Her son intellectu .
Ifwe now examine the original Mar as interpreters montel of the passage. 1999). either before or after this episode.Mill
speaks of his mother : able harshness
his father. Marmontel his consolation of his family is accom with plished through the aid of a difficult con as he deliv trol over his own emotions. seem keen on caring for oth particularly ers. relates his reading. a really warm hearted mother. But my mother. No doubt placing
is that Mill
is identifying him so and expressing
Mill between Aristotle &
this interpretation is not altogether mis for hostility toward his father is guided. we see that it strongly confirms it clear that makes reading. he says. The oppression of the thought that all
feeling was no was dead within me. he tells us that he tried to lift his depression by being actively concerned with the well-being of others. and loneliness. came to the passage which death. because she was kind to them. would in the first place have made my father a totally different being. Mill encountered a crisis of ac He remained depression. but of relief at comfort.5 So Mill is clearly in receiving
5 Jean Fran?ois Marmontel. streams of tears are suddenly released in his mother :tears no and younger siblings longer of bitter mourning. M?moires 63: : (Paris mes "'Ma m?re. and you will find someone who will be everything to you. Instead. felt and made them feel that he would be everything to them would supply the place of all that they had lost. and the sudden in
spiration by which he. and Iwas moved to tears. loved.. I longer or a stone. if palpable a great deal of love counterbalanced by and admiration. only knew how to pass her life in drudging for them. Whatever she could do for them she did. From
my burthen grew lighter. your feelings of pain. He imagines someone saying to him. then amere boy. The
That rarity in England. nized and fulfilled. but to make herself obeyed. looked up to.and many and indelible are the ef fects of this bringing
my moral growth. He tried to relieve his melancholy through dedica tion to the general social welfare. the desire to care for his family by dis the father he feared. hopeless a stock
IViiU's ly been
episode has typical in terms of an alleged
dalus Spring 2004 67
.. I thus grew up in the absence of love and in the presence of fear . The problem with this is that Mill does not account. Your needs.
fortunately did not possess. a emotion in the narrative. tive and carried out his plans. The crucial in turning point was a very mysterious cident that has been much discussed:
Iwas Memoirs. however. and they liked her." speech But at his words of comfort. you will have the care that you need. but that this effort did no good. Your distress will be seen love. with the very best of intentions. do not bother to Autobiography usually this do. It seems to me much more likely that Mill above all identifies with the orphaned family who were now to receive the care going they needed. and Marmontel's accidentally. and in the second would have made his children grow up loving and being loved. but he was aware of a deep inner void. Indeed. ers his "without a single tear. the fo cus of his search is on care for finding and in particular for the emo himself.
up in the stunting of
In his early twenties. but the blackness did not abate. : Iwas was not gone. tions and subjective feelings that his fa ther had treated as shameful. will be recog deadness. the distressed
of the family. A vivid con ception of the scene and its feelings came
over me. or even required qualities which she un
sumption self with Marmontel. Mercure de France.
he felt. and. soeurs. lacking all understand simplified
ing of poetry (asMill insists) and of love
(as we might add).vous je p?re l'?tre . painfully that tained the kind of self-knowledge his great teacher lacked. des afflictions la plus grande . je veux fr?res. But perhaps itwas
nous mes leur dis-je. which Mill often stresses. It places too much weight . to find a comfort that assuages the emotional In part. as the Autobiography makes clear.ne nous y lais vous sons abattre. an extremely tional person who is very skilled at cir de John's intellectual cumnavigating care for the person who would fenses him as his mother. of happiness is conception on too cold. invites. Here. empiricist with aman who at experience. we may
childlike nature of Bentham's approach to life. To relate plexities and Aristotle to the com the Autobiography of Mill's relation to Bentham
the very childlike character of Bentham. the man who loved the pleasures of in small creatures. ma m?re. . et vous ruisseaux am?res.' de mais de leurs
pressant cher enfant!
je t'ai bien
. care when he becomes and value the previously for. oped to the who look for a tidy resolution Mill's Utilitarianism tensions it introduces into the many it has proved Utilitarian system. too. One might feel like "a stock or a stone. 'mon connu ! fils! '" n'?tes de ces mots. But over the ages because it con compelling tains a subtle awareness of human com that few philosophical works can plexity rival. in Harriet Taylor he shortly discovers emo as her letters show. elements of did not value the emotional over in the right way. ?prouvons. Aristotelian the suppose. sort of conjecture that makes sense. tous ? les devoirs des moins s'?cria coeur. Martha Nussbaum on happiness
not of the self position son. vous en retrouvez un en ser . hidden aspects of himself. en me mon orphelins. Mill stands out . did not. is not a fully devel It frustrates philosophers work. as in his surprising writings on women. he the personality them. larmes yeux. nourish. In part. who allowed the mice his study to sit on his lap. proves :for Bentham understood how valuable are for chil pain and pleasure powerful and for the child in us. rible loneliness and deadness. perdez point un .not on the re 'correct' activity enough and childlike parts of the person ceptive act correctly and yet ality. Mes enfants. and who turned into philosophy. For Mill.C. contre que bien 'Ah!' son plus larmes." Here the then. but of the weeping composed mother and children as they are relieved sorrow.an adult an among the children. Bentham dren. the sort that Mill moreover. j'en embrasse virai . je le suis. Mill's wish for care is fulfilled able to accept. that made him able to see something did not Aristotle see :the need that we all have to be held the need to escape a ter and comforted. that self-knowledge
But it is the is conjectural.