The idea of killing them, it's the, I would, I would argue, is, is, doesn't come easily It's, it's, it's difficult to think.

It's a difficult point, actually. [COUGH] To think and and also to do. Now antisemitic moments came to be associated with economic crisis. There was a doctor and a great scandal connected with the French involvement of the building of the Panama Canal in which thousands of people lost their investment. And of course there were the Jews not surprisingly since this is where Jews are to be found. And consequently popular anti-semitism emerged, and some people argue, though [INAUDIBLE] cannot be decided. That if you knew what was to happen you would have chosen France as the, the the, the background for the Holocaust rather than Germany. Whether this is fair to the French or not, I don't think [INAUDIBLE].[UNKNOWN] and then came the great Dreyfus Affair. I imagine most of you have heard about it and know. there are several films made about it. the, the situation is very simple. Jewish French, French officer was arrested and accused of treason passing on information to France, it's the great enemy to the Germans. Now what is actually remarkable about this is that there were Jewish officers the officer of court in 19th century Europe is regarded as the bastion of the aristocracy, and it is a, it is an example of a huge that a Jew could be an officer in the French army.And Jews actually were members of the French cabinet and of course, how they made great contributions to science. The And Jews actually were members of the French cabinet and of course, how they made great contributions to science. The And Jews actually were members of the French cabinet and of course, how they made great contributions to science. The Literature, and, and, and what have you, given the small size of the ranch you were in. Their cultural and social, political achievements are extraordinary. I mean in a, in a country which I think what, something like 40 million people, and there by the end of the century there were, I don't know 60 and 80,000 Jews. I mean, this is a really a time of proportion. It's a much smaller proportion than would be the case in Germany, where if they got one person [INAUDIBLE]. But in France it was much less than 1% of the population. And yet the Jews were visible. And so what happened at the in case of of the Dreyfus affair. Well first of all, it's, it's relevant to point out that Jews as a community very much did not want to be noticed. And actually there was some hesitation on their part to come out in defense of [INAUDIBLE]. They wanted to show that we are just like anybody else. And actually they were for example considerably disturbed. That towards the end of the century was something like 20, 25 thousand Jewish immigrants from Russian Empire. Who left Russia as a result of the pogroms. And the French to [INAUDIBLE] this rather disturbing. On the one hand, they had an obligation to to care of their fellow Jews. On the other hand [INAUDIBLE] If this book had differed in language they did not have the degree of a culture age in which they are. And consequently the, the well-established French-Jewish leadership were concerned that the, the French will associate them with their eastern core religion and their, and their will contribute to antisemitism. Was each in the plan look different and your foreign of course, and, and [INAUDIBLE]. So the, the Dreyfuss effect, the Dreyfuss scale is [INAUDIBLE] became really, it did not create the division in French society and, and politics, because the division had been there before, but, it crystallized the division. One half of a educated friends. So what I was saying is that a is that the affair did not divide french public opinion because it was already divide, because it crystallizes that division. But as you can say ,as you can see in this on the one hand there are triumphs of the decor fans, because as against considerable oppositions,justice prevailed Dreyfus was found innocent and as, as, as he, he was. And the guilty person, someone

because you were concerned about Jewish exploiters. And Jews everywhere came to be connected with liberality. offered a solution to some. let me stop here. >> So a. Marxism offered an avenue out of Antisemitism. this equation of communism-socialism roles as their roles in history. came out of the [UNKNOWN] of the Intelligentsia. the Dreyfus affair. the. capital O right. but the rest of Europe also.. And another thing the rise of socialism. communism promised rising above national nationalist prejudices. >> society and. And and indeed so it was. to the Germans. How can one explain this? the way it was that the way to which [INAUDIBLE] I suppose is that the. and most socialists were not Jews. very much to do with the creation of modern Zionism because Hansel decided that [UNKNOWN] saw that there is no possibility of general integration into into modern Europe. Germany had the largest and most significant tour in Western Europe. Can the Others become part of a larger society working together. >> Well I would emphasize what Peter just talked about. communism. Well of course most Jews were not socialist. as I mentioned by the time of Hitler The 500. about Germany. which is that the 19th century with industrial civilization and modern civilization Is the beginning of the experiment where citizenship means that all kinds of people can work together and use their talents for the common good. bankers. Nonetheless. or should we sequester them. and so the desire to establish a separate Jewish state. there's no difference in how you dress. This is enough for one day. socialism. namely Marxism [INAUDIBLE] because it is a [UNKNOWN]. And its the rise of society and the secular nations they. the very ruthlessness of Jews contributed to it. capitalists. And we have all sorts of issues today that echo the kinds of crisis that Peter has talked about when the question is Can the other. And arguably the.000 Jews maybe the one percent of the population. That is that Germany gave even greater opportunities for the Jews in economics in coulture. there's a great sense that maybe it doesn't work. not os much in western Europe but in eastern Europe. the intellectual currents that came out of Germany. And so consequently you could be an anti-semite. a solution to their problems.. And by. in which Jews were disproportionate there. That is Marxism. a let me say just a few words. That was a what somebody wrote it a book under the title The Anti-Semetic Moment in 19th century France. German in particular. >> May I add something? What theator has done is try to give us a quick look at the historical conditions that lead to emansipation and is focused on france and . it's now called today. the leadership of the socialist movement. Germany was much more so. So. In which Jews had the especially great role to play. You were all expecting to use your talents for getting ahead personally and therefore for the common good. [UNKNOWN] in Europe. whether it was legal or not is another matter. Larger. [COUGH] the [INAUDIBLE]. And socialism. The liberal parties became the Jewish parties and consequentily in that sence the jews were On the other hand while France was a dynamic. and it will be decisive in our understanding of the success of Hitler. And the impact on Hertzle. in every aspect of national eye to distinguish themselves. The difference was that after 1870 [UNKNOWN] declined and the Germany liberalism was less strong than it was in France. Yes but remember it took. and consequently the German jury and the ideas current within the German jury had enormous influence. >> And you could be an anti-Semite because you objected to uh.I think name of Esterhazy was actually found who really passed on the information to. you see that you're all wearing the same clothes. Dreyfus was convicted at first they had a public ceremony leading to a sward and all sorts of people screaming death to the Jews. Should we separate them? Should we throw them out? Should we profile them or is it all one happy melting pot or a mosaic. If you look at each other. And as Murray mentioned this had something to do.

Leads to something with the Holocaust that transforms it. On the other hand. Merkel said the same. The Russians emancipate the surfs in 1862. so what does it mean that Dryfus has a public humiliation as a traitor. right. he says it's a good thing. It hadn't taken care of all that but we have a psychological cauldron if you will. Angela Merkel said the same thing last year. right? Part of European opened this. [INAUDIBLE].. with industrial society. >> [LAUGH] Thank you. And they were murdered by the Nazis. That traditional society had done by grouping people. >> The [UNKNOWN] the gypsies. namely Muslim Germany with its Turkish Arab subculture this is all. It is I will talk about it next time. because he's Hungarian but he knows French and he writes in German. it's a very important issue which I. >> Repeat the question. if you think about emancipation in the American context. That is you may know what is the. the ancients of the island. Now. from the notion. >> The namely.. cultural. . Somebody who's a cosmopolitan. I resist this notion because the misery factor compared to the rioting have different sources and. what do you call the. >> Well. >> So this means that Theodore Hurtzel. And you know in your experience that this doesn't take care of all sorts of personal grudges. >> But this becomes then the launch into something much nastier than is happened else where what i wanted to emphasize with that it is not an accident that the great age of the European jury and the holocaust coincides. >> Revulsion. the. Read Dry Tears. at the experiment in Germany of the [INAUDIBLE] failed. I resist this notion. That these are two opposite sides of the same coin. >> [LAUGH] We have a question. right. it wasn't a question [INAUDIBLE] Repeat. maybe the idea of [INAUDIBLE] and of occurs referring to a very different situation. >> But I want to go further. and the act that These are apples and oranges. it's a fabrication that shows that you've gone up there. >> It does. [LAUGH] But that's the old calander. the comparatively genocides and I. and different reasons. Integration of whatever kind doesn't work. again.germany. >> It is a good thing. remember the Emancipation Proclamation is 1863. economic under currents. It makes no sense. Is a 19th Century notion that everyone can become a citizen. >> [LAUGH] But it also leads to Mass murder. death to the Jews. >> I just want to point out. these are different wickednesses But I want to point out that as you look at each other and learn to love your room mate that the experiament in diversity is yours. >> 1961 febuary 9th 61 okay. These are. That is the [UNKNOWN] that life is miserable and they've been mistreated. And he is a master phycologist. [LAUGH] Of social forces. maybe we would be better off without it. Now he's in France covering the trial for a German newspaper. I want to argue that the great age of modern industrial civilization That happens with the French Revolution. actually. Do you really love your room mate? [LAUGH] So the whole question of citizenship involves the notion that one can manage the social. >> Though he was a Jewish officer. We are living that kind of question today. a brilliant young journalist who is covering the trial for a German newspaper [INAUDIBLE] [LAUGH]. So the hole notion of citizenship. It's a. There is a huge. political. >> The [UNKNOWN] the gypsies. Personal disagreement or dislikes so under Peter's brief account there's psychological turmoil. Onto Monday. for example. I don't know. Now we've seen this in the history of many cultures in the West and in the East. It would be inconceivable that someone would come up with the protocols of the ancients of the gypsies. or to put it in another way. >> he said that Angela Merkel. Says this experiment has failed. and all sorts of thing that we hear about every day in turn political life is all about that and yes the whole notion of the experiment in diversity means that there are all sorts of frictions all sorts of uhappinesses or all sorts of problems. that things are always going to get better with industrial modern society.

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