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Thought is your Enemy Mind Shattering Conversations with the Man Called U.G.

Edited by Antony Paul Frank Naronha and .S.!.". Narayana Moorty

S#$M%A PU&"'S(E!S

SOWMYA PUBLISHERS 31, Ahmed Sait Road Fraser Tow Ba !a"ore #$% %%# First Pri t& O'to(er 1))% Se'o d Pri t& A*!*st 1))1 Photot+,eset a d ,ri ted at& Re-ha Pri ters P.t/ Ltd/ A01%121, O-h"a I d*stria" Area, Phase II 3ew 4e"hi 0 11%%1% Pri'e& Rs/ )5/%%

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God or enlightenment is the ultimate pleasure, uninterrupted happiness. No such thing exists. Your wanting something that does not exist is the root of your problems. Transformation, moksha, liberation, and all that stuff, are just ariations of the same theme! permanent happiness. The body can"t take uninterrupted pleasure for long# it would be destroyed. $anting to impose a fictitious permanent state of happiness on the body is a serious neurological problem.

% am not out to liberate anybody. You ha e to liberate yourself, and you are unable to do that. $hat % ha e to say will not do it. % am only interested in describing this state, in clearing away the occultation and mystification in which those people in the holy business ha e shrouded the whole thing. &aybe % can con ince you not to waste a lot of time and energy looking for a state which does not exist except in your imagination. --U.G.

Pu*lisher+s Note Whe I to"d U/6/ that I wa ted to ,*("ish a (oo- 'o tai i ! his dis'*ssio s, he said that I 'o*"d !o ahead a d do it, (*t o "+ as a (*si ess .e t*re/ 7Ma-e mo e+ i8 that is what +o*r moti.e is/ B*t i8 +o* thi - it wi"" he", +o* or a +o e e"se i a + wa+ o their s,irit*a" ,ath, +o* are misera("+ mista-e / I ha.e o i""*sio s a(o*t it at a"",7 said U/6/ A,art 8rom m+ m* da e moti.es, whi'h are the o "+ 9rea"9 moti.es, a''ordi ! to U/6/, I 8e"t that this ma sho*"d (e - ow wide"+ 8or whate.er he is/ I s,ite o8 his .eheme t assertio that he has o messa!e 8or ma -i d, I sti"" 8ee" that what he sa+s is "i-e a 9stat*tor+ war i !9 ,ri ted o a ,a'- o8 'i!arettes/ It 9s *, to +o* to heed to it/ I8 +o* do ot "i-e what he sa+s it ma+ (e (e'a*se he does ot te"" +o* what +o* wa t to hear/ P*("isher Pu*lisher+s Note to the Se)ond Edition The se'o d re,ri t o8 7Tho*!ht is +o*r E em+7 has (ee (ro*!ht o*t (e'a*se o8 !reat ,o,*"ar dema d/ The (oo- has made a dee, im,ressio o a"" those who ha.e (ee o some -i d o8 so0'a""ed s,irit*a" sear'h/ It has tri!!ered a ,ro8o* d i :*ir+ i to e.er+thi ! that is ta-e 8or !ra ted i matters o8 s,irit, mi d a d (od+/ The ,*("isher is tha -8*" to Mr/ ;/S/R/L/3/ Moort+ Pro8essor at Mo tere+ Pe i s*"a <o""e!e, <a"i8or ia, U/S/A/, Mr/ Hi"ar+ ;ose,h a d Mr/ A/P/ Fra - 3aro ha 8or a"" the he", re dered i (ri !i ! o*t the se'o d editio / The ,*("isher ho,es that the (oo- wi"" !ai "ar!er readershi, (oth i I dia a d a(road a d (e e8it ma +/ ======= This (oo- is a 'om,i"atio o8 dis'*ssio s (etwee U/6/ >rish am*rti a d .ario*s i :*irers i I dia, Swit?er"a d, A*stra"ia, 3ether"a ds, a d U/>/, (etwee 1)5# a d 1))%/ As 8ar as ,ossi("e the at*ra" 8"ow o8 dis'*ssio s has ot (ee i terr*,ted, a d mi ima" editi ! has (ee do e to "e d 'ohere 'e to the te@t/ It is ho,ed that we wi"" (e 8or!i.e 8or ot ide ti8+i ! the ames o8 ,arti'i,a ts i the dis'*ssio s/ It was 8e"t that to ide ti8+ the :*estio ers wo*"d * e'essari"+ detra't 8rom the mea i ! a d 8"ow o8 the dia"o!*es/ The editors a"so ta-e 8*"" res,o si(i"it+ 8or a + i a''*ra'ies i the (od+ o8 the te@t/ The+ !rate8*""+ a'- ow"ed!e the he",8*" ,art ,"a+ed (+ e.er+o e i .o".ed i the ,rod*'tio o8 the (oo-/

. Chandrasekhar . Be there Li!htA Said 6od A d There Was Tota" B"a'. -.(e &e)ame U.G.o*t/ Be there Pea'eA Said 6od A d There Were Wor"d Wars/ Be There OrderA Said 6od A d There Was Utter <haos/ 4isma+ed 4isi""*sio ed 6od said Be there 3o 6odA A d I sta t"+ He Be'ame U/6/ .

or what ha e you. Your natural state has no relationship whatsoe er with the religious states of bliss. by any man. are also functioning. That beaten track will lead you nowhere. so do they go. contained. and ne er shall be one. it is not a thing to be achie ed or attained. The natural state is not the state of a self(reali)ed or God(reali)ed man. it is not a thing to be willed into existence# it is there (( it is the li ing state. . There is no oasis situated yonder# you are stuck with the mirage. "Teaching" implies a method or a system. Those who ha e led man on his search for religiousness throughout the centuries ha e perhaps experienced those religious states. %t is just a description of the natural state of man (( that is the way you. much less gi en expression to. +o can you. and ecstasy# they lie within the field of experience. are all trips in the wrong direction! they can ne er be grasped. beatitude.There is no teaching of mine. a techni'ue or a new way of thinking to be applied in order to bring about a transformation in your way of life. -hrist -onsciousness. *uddha -onsciousness. %t has a profit moti e! thought directs the acti ity of the senses to get something out of them and uses them to gi e itself continuity. They are thought(induced states of being and as they come. *y "life" % do not mean something abstract# it is the life of the senses.rishna -onsciousness. functioning naturally without the interference of thought. $hat % am saying is outside the field of teachability# it is simply a description of the way % am functioning. Thought is an interloper. "Teaching" is not the word for it. This state is just the functional acti ity of life. . stripped of the machinations of thought. which thrusts itself into the affairs of the senses.

here was .isode i his "i8e "eads to a other witho*t a + s+stemati' se:*e 'e/ Whe he rea'hed the a!e o8 8ort+0 i e.er+ 8o* datio o8 h*ma tho*!ht/ It is a other matter that his remar-s o themes s*'h as 6od.root e."e who ha.i(ratio s/ Sa+s U/6/.ered 8or m+se"8/ I do ot 'are whether +o* a''e.e me ha"8 a -i"o o8 'arrots9B (*t that is the "imit o8 +o*r re"atio shi.e a so"id ri ! o8 a*the ti'it+ a d seem to s.e heard . (e'a*se there is o wa+ +o* 'a "iste to a +thi ! witho*t i ter.o a 9 at*ra" state. a d others who are *rt*red i a re"i!io*s atmos.that +o* 'a read a d * dersta d this (oo-.ri ! 8rom a so*r'e other tha thi -i !/ What he sa+s sha-es the .oi t. a d rei 'ar atio o8te sma'.ho"es. or see .es whi'h r* to the (rai . mi d. 7I do ot '"aim to ha.irit*a" dream"a d wa@ed e"o:*e t (+ the ho"+ me 00 8ra*ds as we"" as !e *i e/ The re"i!io*s atmos. 8e"t. 7e. e "i!hte me t.7 sa+s U/6/ >rish am*rti/ A''ordi ! to him. meditatio . a d eros a d tha atos/ U/6/ sa+s.e dis'o.here/ U/6/ 'a a"so dis'*ss :*a t*m .e ts/ Somethi ! ha.er+thi ! we (e"ie. was a t*r i ! . tra s8erred to the er. there was a s*dde t*r o8 e.o8 ("as.art o8 his (a'-!ro* d/ U/6/ was (or i 1)15 i to a midd"e '"ass Brahmi 8ami"+ i A drah Pradesh/ His mother died soo a8ter !i.A Note at the &eginning I8 +o* thi . was throw o*t o8 m+ s+stem/7 B*t.9 threate i ! to *.e" o8 9Here is some mo e+B !i. +o* ma+ (e :*ite o88 the mar-/ 7A +(od+ who 'omes a d "iste s to me a d tries to * dersta d what I am tr+i ! to . i 8a't.i'-ed *. 7That is a"" ri!ht 8or a re"atio shi.i ! (irth to him/ O her death(ed she said her 'hi"d was '*t o*t 8or somethi ! 7immeas*ra("+ hi!h/7 U/6/9s !ra d8ather too.h+si's a d ("a'.*t a'ross is wasti ! his time.oi t i U/6/9s "i8e/ His !ra d8ather was o 'e meditati ! ear"+ i the mor i ! whe he was dist*r(ed (+ the 'ries o8 a 'hi"d/ The o"d ma was so a !r+ that he (eat the 'hi"d ("a'.here/ A sma"" e.t what I am sa+i ! or ot/ It sta ds or 8a""s (+ itse"8/7 His stateme ts ha..her words serio*s"+ a d !roomed him i a as'eti' atmos. (+ the eardr*m.er+thi ! that ma had said.ed i / His stateme ts are de.a d ("*e/ The i 'o !r*it+ a d (r*ta"it+ o8 the s'e e had a . the who"e herita!e o8 ma -i d. death.isode. Osho RaC eesh./ >rish am*rti. it is rea""+ worth a tr+ to "iste to him/ The words that 'ome o*t o8 him are "i-e !re ades "o((ed i to o*r 9re8ere 'e . whe we "ea.oi t9/ Th*s we hear o*r ow tra s"atio s o8 the .e ed to him whi'h he 'a""ed a 9'a"amit+9 Dto he". whe he st*m("ed *.. o8 +o*r 'omm* i'atio with a +(od+/7 Whether +o* a!ree or ot with a"" that he sa+s. this was ot what he had desired/ He was "oo-i ! 8or a s.retatio .hem+ a d (order o heres+/ The stor+ o8 U/6/ >rish am*rti has a"" the i !redie ts o8 a thri""er/ O e e.e a s. more so to .astati !.9 wherei . o*r * dersta di !E.e. howe.i(ratio s are . a''ordi ! to U/6/.er. i his words. "o.e'ia" i si!ht i to the at*re o8 thi !s or that I * dersta d the wor-i !s o8 at*re more tha a +(od+ e"se/ B*t this is what I ha.reted a''ordi ! to what he 'a""s 9o*r re8ere 'e .i(ratio o8 so* ds/ These .eo. with someo e o the "e. a d are i ter.e the se se o8 heari ! a"o e a"" that is there is the .

es.irit*a" me / He met . 7There is o s*'h thi ! as s.erto es/ It is sim.erie 'e whi'h i t*r stre !the s the . e.art o8 . .whi'h we are a''*stomed to/ U/6/ dismisses the .ario*s sha.er"oo-i ! the !ree .him to 8i d o*t whether there was a +thi ! (ehi d the a(stra't . 7I8 this is what meditatio is a(o*t.e ass*med that e "i!hte me t e@ists a d that I ha. 9Is there e "i!hte me tF9 (*t I ha."eas*ra("e or .reme i te""e't or a madma 9s "ita + His words de8+ the "o!i'a" 8ramewor.ossi("e to rea'h the 9.e had to sear'h 8or it/ Howe.h+si'a" or e. a d it is the e@.o*t o8 the ho*se/ U/6/9s "i8e therea8ter was a e@. sear'hi ! 8or somethi ! whi'h does ot e@ist/ M+ sear'h is at a e d/7 His .irit*a" or .eratio is desi! ated 9thi -i !9/ What disti !*ishes *s 8rom U/6/ is that this .i.s+'ho"o!i'a" e "i!hte me t.ow"ed!e/ A''ordi ! to him.ow"ed!e/ The tota" o.irit or . a d si?es/ U/6/ sa+s that it is thro*!h this 'o sta t thi -i ! that we are mai tai i ! the 'o ti *it+ o8 what we 'a"" the 9I9 or 9se"89/ I U/6/ the 'o ti *it+ o8 tho*!ht has (ee s a.rod*'t o8 a s*.it+ withi *s whether we "i-e it or ot/ O*r mi d is 'o sta t"+ 'h*r i ! o*t tho*!ht a8ter tho*!ht i . 7I ha.erati ! thro*!h the .e the .a't o the te der se si(i"ities o8 U/6/ He said to himse"8.erie 'e/ Otherwise.ast/7 A''ordi ! to U/6/.e (ee a dam 8oo" a"" m+ "i8e.ed/ Tho*!hts 'ome to him i a disCoi ted ma er witho*t a + "i -0*.ow"ed!e whi'h 'reates a e@."+ that somethi ! is a 'hair or a ta("e.ossi(i"it+ o8 a + e@.tra*mati' im./ He thi -s o "+ whe there is a dema d 8or e@.ro'ess o8 re'o! itio a d ami ! o8 somethi ! is .air/ O his 8ort+0 i th (irthda+ he was sitti ! o a (e 'h o.s+'he at a""/ I ha.e sear'hed e."a'e withi him whi'h (ewi"dered the medi'a" me a d 8rie ds aro* d him/ His "i8e therea8ter (e'ame o e i whi'h there was 7 o tho*!ht 8or the morrow or !rie8 o.erie 'e e@'e.ertoo. (e'a*se I ha.ow"ed!e whi'h is o.e a d throw i to *tter des.er+where to 8i d a a swer to m+ :*estio . 'o"ors./ >rish am*rti a d Rama a Maharshi a d .rese 'e 'a (e 'o str*ed as either a . a d i8 heard or read o*tside o8 his .er the .istemo"o!i'a" o..romised "a d9 a d at the e d was (ere8t o8 ho. (e'a*se there is o s*'h thi ! as s. it is .ora'io*s h* !er to 8i d o*t the 8air+"a d . whi"e there is a 'o sta t * der'*rre t o8 thi -i ! a'ti.hets a d s. or that some se satio is .e e.ario*s masters i '"*di ! . it is worth"ess/7 He threw awa+ his sa'red thread a d threate ed to wa".ra'ti'ed traditio a" meditatio s/ He e@ha*sted e.ro o* 'eme ts o8 the so0'a""ed s.romised (+ the . it is the sear'h itse"8 whi'h has (ee 'ho-i ! me a d -ee.ro'ess o8 thi -i ! is i a de'"*t'hed state i U/6/.ea-s o8 O(er"a d i Swit?er"a d/ It s*dde "+ o''*rred to him.er+ mea s .ro.i ! the da+0to0da+ 'ha""e !es it e 'o* ters 8rom mome t to mome t/ U/6/9s stateme ts are e i!mati'.er :*estio ed the sear'h itse"8.ai 8*"/ I 8a't.a""e+ a d r*!!ed .t thro*!h .e a + meta.erime t with tr*th/ A i satia("e h* !er o.erie 'e.irit*a" masters had (*r t itse"8 o*t/ The o''*rre 'e had te""i ! e88e'ts o his (od+/ Ma + .i ! me o*t o8 m+ at*ra" state/7 He said to himse"8.er.h+si'a" 'ha !es too. !rie8 a d Co+ e@ist o "+ i the rea"m o8 the mi d/ The (od+ is i terested i either/ Its o "+ i terest is i s*r.ow"ed!e/ 9> ow"ed!e9 does ot ha.

es.a a'ea to a"" their . 'i. what we 'a"" 9I9 or 9+o*9 is tho*!ht see-i ! .ire 'reated (+ tho*!ht.rese 'e +o* are "e8t d*m(8o* ded/ Yo*r e@. e.e"s it to ere't a mar.ow9 its e.es the i""*sio o8 the 9se"89 or 9I9.o8 at*re.erso .ro.it+ that !i.er o*r "i.e ed to him is s*'h that it 'a ot (e shared (+ a +(od+.it+ o8 the se ses 00 the stim*"*s0a d0res.e o8/ A"" these 8a'ets o8 h*ma "i8e are othi ! (*t . a d the 8ear o8 its 8"eeti ! e@iste 'e . the "i.erates i the 8orm o8 tho*!ht has set *.ario*s i stit*tio s a d . 'a the (od+.ow/ Has a +thi ! ha.ote '+ o8 mi""io s o8 +ears/ The .ri !/ Be eath his a. a''ordi ! to U/6/. a d that the at*ra" state 'a ot (e e@....e ed at a""F7 He sa+s that what has ha."e a'ti. there is o 8ee"i ! o8 9se"89 or 9I9 withi him/ U/6/ sa+s the stra !"eho"d o the .o"iti's. .e F I do 9t .ara""e" em. (+ some mira'"e or stra !e 'ha 'e.ow/ What is it that has ha.reC*di'es a d 'o ditio i !/ <a"" him a 8ra*d or a 8rea. with its e@traordi ar+ i te""i!e 'e.hemera" at*re. S*'h a state is (e+o d the 8ie"d o8 e@.iew a(o*t the .erie 'e o8 a +thi ! "i-e it/ So what we are "e8t with are o*r . (*t o 'e +o* are a +where ear the .what there is is o "+ the sim.ressed or 'o tai ed i tho*!ht/ There8ore.are t h*ma 8orm there "ies somethi ! whi'h de8ies des'ri.ow"ed!e whi'h o.eo..ire o8 its ow .erma e 'e i i *mera("e a'ti."i e to 'ome i to the at*ra" state. 7 o 'omm* i'atio is . o e 'a ot *se o e9s .ow"ed!e has the .tio / Fra . the ..e edF I do 9t .ers.erie 'e/ U/6/ o8te des'ri(es his sit*atio th*s& 7How did it a"" ha.oi ts o8 .erma e 'e/ I other words. a . a d.h+si'a" or!a ism o8 what is 'a""ed .ities/ U/6/ sa+s that o "+ whe .a"*es that !o.ro.e'tatio s a d o.e"o*s str*'t*re o8 '*"t*re.i ! or!a ism is 8reed 8rom the stra !"eho"d o8 the em.er+thi ! that we 'a 'o 'ei.3oroh a 11255 Lodi <o"o + 3ew 4e"hi .ro("ems/ Pea'e a d ha.o"itio or !o thro*!h a + ri!oro*s dis'i. de.e'ti.e (+ morta"s who are "oo-i ! 8or a .o se 'o ti **m/ Si 'e it is the 'o ti *o*s thi -i ! a'ti.s thro*!h whi'h tho*!ht tries to e thro e itse"8 i . i 'o tradisti 'tio to the wa+s o8 at*re/ B*t tho*!ht s*(t"+ 9."e who are ot 8* 'tio i ! i itF The :*estio is a8ter a"" as-ed 8rom a o 0 at*ra"0state ..i io s are shattered/ Yo* are "e8t to wo der as to what is the so*r'e 8rom whi'h his stateme ts s. i 8a't.i"i?atio .e di ! o o*r . re"i!io .orte@ o8 U/6/9s .ossi("e a d o dia"o!*e is e'essar+7/ What *se is the so0'a""ed 9 at*ra" state9 to . 8ree the h*ma (ei ! so that he 'a 98a""9 i to his 9 at*ra" state9/ B*t.i ess are what we are a"" a8ter. a d U/6/9s 9 at*ra" state9 o88ers *s o e@.

3o So*".e is O "+ a Tr*m.* !"e 4eath is a Resh*88"i ! o8 Atoms Se@ is Pai 8*" to the Bod+ A Frea.o"t o8 Li!ht i ! Lo.o8 3at*re . <ard We are Headi ! towards 4isaster The E d o8 I""*sio is 4eath Lost i the . O "+ the Bod+ Throw Awa+ Yo*r <r*t'hes The Ro(ot is 4reami ! A .C#NTENTS %1/ %1/ %3/ %G/ %#/ %$/ %H/ %5/ %)/ 1%/ 11/ 3o Mi d.

it is destroyed by the li ing 'uality of life.uman thinking is born out of some sort of neurological defect in the human body. and gi e expression to it. You are not ready to accept this statement because the ery thing which we are using to communicate is in jeopardy. anything that is born out of human thinking is destructi e. howe er extraordinary they may be. /////// Thought is something dead and can ne er touch anything li ing. %t cannot capture life. /////// Thought is not the instrument to help us to li e in harmony with the life around us. %t is the most icious and ulgar thing that we ha e done. /////// The certainty that % ha e that there is no mind is something which cannot be transmitted to anybody. *ut the planet is not in danger# we are in danger. No Mind/ No Soul/ #nly the &ody . That is why you create all these ecological problems. *ut we are indi idually responsible for the ine'uities of the world. contain it.C(APTE! . /////// 1ll insights. _______ . howe er hard % may try. are worthless. Therefore. Nature has pro ided us with a bounty. and through that it is maintaining its continuity and status 'uo. The moment it tries to touch life. /////// 0eligion has in ented that wonderful thing called charity. /////// Thought is opposed fundamentally to the functioning of this li ing organism. because it is thought that has created what we call insight.

h+si'a" e"eme t i h*ma at*reF7 01 I mea that there is o "+ the a't*a" .art to * dersta d what +o* are "e8t with is a "ost (att"e/ 01 What +o* are tr+i ! to sa+ is that there is o "+ the .o ta eo*s/ There are o tho*!hts there e. ame"+.ro(e aro* d this//// A1 The more the :*estio s +o* throw at me the more there is a eed to em.e arise (e'a*se o8 o*r a''e. that is.me the :*estio .ro("ems ha.e/ A"" o*r .ow/ So a +thi ! that +o* e@.t o +o*r .h+si'a" (od+ a d the * i.*t a'ross.e (ee 8or 'e t*ries *si ! some i str*me t.erie 'i ! a +thi ! that +o* do ot .h+si'a" (od+ a d the wor"d as it is/ A1 That is the reaso wh+ I sa+ that the i str*me t whi'h we are *si ! to * dersta d the rea"it+ o8 o*r e@iste 'e a d the rea"it+ o8 the wor"d aro* d *s is ot .erse 00 7 that stateme t a"so 'a ot sta d a + more/ 01 B*t I wa t to .01 U/6/.erem. that there is othi ! to what we ha.hasi?e a"" the time/ M+ i terest is to somehow ma-e +o* see that the who"e attem. a d a"" -i ds o8 thi !s/ That is what the who"e :*est o8 s.e ow/ I8 +o* wa t to 8i d o*t whether there is a + s*'h thi ! as .e that stateme t 'a ot (e e@.es 8rom the who"e o8 what +o* 'a"" the 9I9 or the 9se"89. em. to 8ree o*rse".art o8 this D(od+E me'ha ism that is there/ That is the reaso wh+ I sa+ tho*!hts are ot se"80!e erated a d are ot s.hasi?e that we ha.e o wa+ o8 e@.ow i8 +o* 'o*"d 8i d a swers 8or *s/ A1 The a swers I !i."e a(o*t the wa+ +o* are 8* 'tio i !F7 It is o "+ to em.e o wa+ o8 8i di ! o*t 8or m+se"8/ 01 Ordi ar+ h*ma (ei !s "i-e me wo*"d "i-e to .ossi("e 8or *s to * dersta d the rea"it+ o8 the wor"d.irit.h+si'a" e"eme t i h*ma at*re//// A1 I am ot with +o*/ What e@a't"+ do +o* mea whe +o* sa+.hasi?e. 7Wh+ do +o* !o o te""i ! . I ha. a d there is o mi d/ That .irit is a"" a(o*t/ B*t o 'e it daw s o +o* that there is othi ! to (e 8ree 8rom. the these :*estio s do 9t arise at a""/ How that daw ed o me.e't o8 o*r e@iste 'e. there is o I.ro(e i to the . or whate.hasi?e that what we are "e8t with is the 8* 'tio i ! o8 the "i.h+si'a" as. o8 +o*r . 7We are "e8t with o "+ the .eo.erie 'ed (+ what is "e8t there/ Whe o 'e the who"e thi ! is 8"*shed o*t o8 +o*r s+stem.erie 'e thro*!h the he".er+ esse 'e o8 +o*r re. a d o.ta 'e that it is .er+ we"" as.i ! or!a ism/ How it is 8* 'tio i ! is a"" that I am tr+i ! to . a d +o* ha.e (ee made to (e"ie.o"*tio ar+ a d * 'om.e o wa+ o8 8i di ! o*t what +o* are "e8t with/ Yo* ma+ . or the rea"it+ o8 o*r e@iste 'e/ What I am sa+i ! is that +o* ha. there is o so*".romisi ! stateme t that there is o so*"/ A1 There is o se"8.ow"ed!e is 8r*it"ess/ It is a "ost (att"e/ 01 Whe +o* are sa+i ! that there is o o . there is o s. the stateme t.e are o "+ to em.hasi?e the . thi -i ! or mi d. I wo*"d "i-e to . 73o o .er +o* wa t to 'a"" it.h+si'a" (od+ a d othi ! e"se/ Is that itF A1 E.o'-s o88 the who"e "ist.

tho*!h what the+ ha. a d the who"e "ot o8 thi !s that we ha.hasi?e that that is ot the i str*me t.ow"ed!e/ That is a"" that I am sa+i !/ There is o wa+ +o* 'a e@.erie 'e the se se o8 to*'h is thro*!h this 'o ta'tB that is what +o* 'a"" the se se o8 to*'h/ So +o* are (ri !i ! +o*r 8i !ers here a d to*'hi ! it here/ DU/6/ to*'hes the arm o8 the 'hair/E The e+e is "oo-i ! at it/ B*t it does ot tra s"ate the mo. 7Is there a tho*!htF7 is (or o*t o8 the ass*m.e ted a"" -i ds o8 thi !s "i-e i t*itio .erie 'e at a"" witho*t the he".o +o* that tho*!ht is ot the i str*me t.ed i medi'a" te'h o"o!+/ The+ are tr+i ! to 8i d o*t how this (od+ is 8* 'tio i !. has i a .erie 'i ! str*'t*re/ There is o 9(e+o d9/ B*t that 9(e+o d9 is a!ai a88irmed or reCe'ted (+ this e@. ri!ht i si!ht.o".er+ i si!ht we ha.ow"ed!e that is !i.ow what e@a't"+ ha.erie 'e//// is that there is rea""+ o s*'h thi ! as dire't or immediate A1 There is o e@.h+sio"o!ists/ This .to that/ I as-ed +o* this (e8ore/ Is 9t there a e@. ame"+.e that is ot .erie 'e a d * dersta d e@'e.h+sio"o!ists/ 01 Yo* mea o*r ow o(ser. how the heart is 8* 'tio i !.roCe't that there is somethi ! (e+o d the me'ha ism o8 the e@.atio ///F A1 There is o s*'h thi ! as +o*r ow o(ser.ered is somethi ! whi'h 'a ot (e e@. daw s *. the .t thro*!h the . are worth"ess. a d there is o other i str*me t/ A d whe o 'e this hits +o*.*rs*e is that there is the . o8 .er+ esse tia" 8or +o* to 8ree +o*rse"8 8rom whate.er e@traordi ar+ the+ ma+ (e.h+si'a" side o8 this.osi ! to o*rse".erie 'e the rea"it+ o8 anything e@'e.*tti ! his 8i !er here to .e/ This .er+ i !e io*s wa+ i . (e'a*se it is tho*!ht that has 'reated what we 'a"" i si!ht.er+ :*estio whi'h we are . that.erie 'i ! str*'t*re to mai tai its 'o ti *it+/ It is a !ame/ 01 Ba'.ow"ed!e/ So what I am sa+i ! is that +o* 'a ot e@. a d thro*!h that it is mai tai i ! its 'o ti *it+ a d stat*s :*o/ 01 I thi . +o* .e s whe +o* . a d i8 I 'o*"d o(ser.I * dersta d that.e e@.ow"ed!e 'omes 8rom those who ha.e '"ear"+ the h*ma or!a ism there a d its i terre"ated 8* 'tio s//// A1 As a matter o8 8a't e.t thro*!h the he". the i str*me t whi'h we are *si !.eme t o8 that as some(od+ .*t i (+ the .er+ same str*'t*re that we are *si !.er +o* are tr+i ! to 8ree +o*rse"8 8rom thro*!h that i str*me t/ M+ i terest is to em. howe.e dis'o. a d that there is o other i str*me t.atio / Yo*r ow o(ser.atio is (or o*t o8 the .erie 'ed (+ *s/ 01 What +o* are sa+i ! the e@..tho*!ht.eo. the there is o eed 8or +o* to 8i d o*t i8 a + other i str*me t is e'essar+/ 3o eed 8or a + other i str*me t/ This . ri!ht this.e 'ome to * dersta d somethi ! is the st*m("i ! ("o'-/ A"" i si!hts. (*t what I wa t to .es.e to *s (+ the .e (ee i .ow/ There8ore. o8 this .tio that there is a tho*!ht there/ B*t what +o* wi"" 8i d there is a"" about tho*!ht a d not tho*!ht/ A"" about tho*!ht is what is .ow"ed!e 'omes 8rom the .*t i there (+ the '*"t*re/ That is .ossi("e to e@."e who are te""i ! *s that it is .erie 'e what +o* do ot .ow"ed!e that +o* ha. a d the other/ A d to sa+ that thro*!h this .erie 'e o8 to*'hF A1 3o/ The o "+ wa+ +o* 'a e.e (e'ome 8ami"iar with.

ow"ed!e +o* ha.ow"ed!e is "o'-ed *. I 'a 8ee" witho*t//// ot tra s"ate that 8or a + A1 It is (or o*t o8 +o*r ima!i atio a d tra s"atio o8 this .er reaso that +o* wa t to .oi ti ! to his headE.arati ! the two//// A1 S*.e 8a'tor i 'o s'io*s essF A1 I :*estio 'o s'io*s ess (e'a*se what we 'a"" 'o s'io*s ess is memor+/ Yo* (e'ome 'o s'io*s o8 somethi ! thro*!h the he".ow"ed!e +o* ha.ow"ed!e +o* ha.me a :*estio 8or whate.erie 'i ! that/ 01 3o more se.the :*estio //// 01 I am s*!!esti ! that//// A1 The e+e is "oo-i ! at it/ 01 3o.o8 the .arate the (ree?e a d the (od+/ 01 So +o* are sa+i ! that there is o s*'h thi ! as a ew e@.ast e@. or e. that se sor+ a'ti.er a!ai is the o e that is weari ! o88 the who"e me'ha ism o8 memor+ 8or .erie 'e/ At this mome t i8 that is ot tra s"ated as a so8t to*'h or a hard to*'h. +o* ha..e is here i the 'om. I am ot "oo-i ! at it/ A1 Yo* are ot/ 01 I 'a 8ee".e as a to*'h o8 +o*r ha d. a d the se se o8 to*'h does reaso / U "ess +o* as. "e. o8 the . * 'o s'io*s. the so"e .erie 'e at a""/ B*t the dema d to e@.erati. (*t it is . a d that the se se o8 to*'h is tra s"ati ! that as the so8t to*'h o8 the 8rie d who is sitti ! e@t to me/ 01 I mi!ht (e wa"-i ! a"o e.erie 'e the same thi ! o. a d that .*r. a d I 8ee" a (ree?e 'omi !/ I am ("owi ! i m+ wa+/ A1 I8 +o* do ot tra s"ate the (ree?e to*'hi ! +o*r (od+//// 01 I am 8ee"i ! the (ree?e/ A1 The 8ee"i ! is a"so a tho*!ht/ The mome t +o* se.e/ Otherwise.o8 +o*r .ow"ed!e +o* a"read+ ha. there is o wa+ +o* 'a se.e"s o8 ot doi ! a +thi !.art o8 the .erie 'e/ A1 There is o ew e@.*ter D.arati ! the two a d e@. a d it 'omes o*t a d te""s me a d te""s +o* that +o* are to*'hi ! this.oses 8or whi'h it is ot i te ded/ 01 Is it .it+ is tra s"ated withi the 8ramewor.ossi("e 8or *s to see that memor+ sho*"d ot (e the o.arate +o*rse"8 8rom the (ree?e.osi ! +o* as.ow.o8 the s*('o s'io*s.to*'h this/ The e+e 'a ot sa+ that. i the memor+/ So the who"e ta".arti'*"ar ta'ti"e se si ! withi the 8ramewor.e/ I am ot 8or a mome t sa+i ! that +o* are the (ree?e/ What I am sa+i ! is that a"" that +o* are sa+i ! is .e o wa+ o8 se.er a d o.e.

a t/ Aware ess 'a e.hi"oso.erie 'ed (+ me.e this stateme t 'a ot (e e@. m*'h "ess to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e there/ First o8 a"". this d*a"it+.e ess. to a .o"itio e@'e. 78reedom 8rom the . a 6erma word.isio .er it is.e i8 +o* sa+ that there is a o(Ce't witho*t *si ! the word. (e'a*se the stim*"*s a d res. +o* do 9t .er ess.ow +o*rse"8. there is a"read+ a di.arated 8rom the a'ti.h+si'a" terms/ 7The re8"e'tio o8 that. that 9+o*9 is the ide tit+ there/ Thro*!h the 'o sta t dema d 8or *si ! memor+ it mai tai s its 'o ti *it+/ I8 that 9+o*9 is ot there. the . itse"8 mea s that the ami ! is a"read+ there. I wo*"d at o time "oo.aratio is o''*rri !/ 01 Se.that re'o! itio is se.e the 8reedom 8rom . i . it mai tai s its 'o ti *it+/ 01 4o +o* ma-e a + disti 'tio (etwee aware ess a d 'o s'io*s essF A1 Aware ess has o mea i ! to me (e'a*se aware ess is ot a i str*me t to (e *sed to * dersta d a +thi !. whether +o* *se aware ess or a + other i str*me t to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e is irre"e..aratio is rea""+ the (e!i i ! o8 d*a"it+/ A1 I e.'o s'io*s ess.the :*estio .e i ! here D."e who sa+ that the word is not the thi !.o se are o e * itar+ mo. the word is the thi !/ I8 the word is ot the thi !.erie 'e +o*rse"8.e *.t the 8a't that the word is the o(Ce't/ That is. se.oi ti ! to himse"8E i . 7What is thatF7 Yo* a d I ha. o the reti a.t whe there is a dema d 8rom o*tside/ Yo* as. it mea s that there is a se. i8 I am "iste i ! to some(od+ "i-e +o* who is ta"-i ! a(o*t the eed to ha.hers to sit a d dis'*ss e.aratio there/ What I am tr+i ! to te"" +o* is how this di. I sa+ it is a ta("e.7 is o "+ a '"e."a+i ! with o*rse". the "you" as +o* e@.oi t o*t to the .e the same i 8ormatio / Whe that :*estio is ot there.ow what wi"" ha. what the he"" is itF It is a"" ri!ht 8or the .er (e se. D.at it a d te"" m+se"8 that it is a ta("e/ It does ot mea that I am 9'hoi'e"ess"+ aware9 o8 that/ What is there is o "+ the re8"e'tio o8 this o(Ce't o the reti a/ E. there is othi ! there to (e 'ha !ed/ Si 'e there is othi ! there to (e 'ha !ed.ow . or a Lati word.aratio ////F A1 That is the o "+ wa+ +o* 'a 'o ti *e/ Otherwise +o* are 'omi ! to a e d/ The "you" as +o* . whether I *se the word or ot/ That is the reaso wh+ I .ow 7 is .es/ Yo* thi .oi ti ! to a '*shio E whate.eme t/ The mome t +o* sa+ there is aware ess.hrase.e tio o8 the thi -i ! me'ha ism/ Thro*!h this '"e.oi t/ O 'e +o* are 8ree 8rom the .eo.it+ o8 the (rai / That is the reaso wh+ I a"wa+s des'ri(e what is ha.oi t is the ta("e +o* are as-i ! me a(o*t/ So.e / That is wh+ the ."ies that there is somethi ! there other tha the word/ So +o* 'a ot a''e.er !ame we are .er+ re'o! itio o8 +o* as a ma or that as a .ositio . is the i !e io*s i . this se.i""ow. a E !"ish word.er te"" m+se"8 a d te"" +o* that I am the ta("e/ That is too a(s*rd/ So what I am sa+i ! is that there is o wa+ +o* 'a se. a d to e@.er+ attra'ti.isio / 01 Wh+ do we mai tai this .arate 8rom ami !/ This is ot tr*e/ Re'o! itio a d ami ! are o e a d the same/ Whether I ame it or ot. there is o wa+ +o* 'a sa+ a +thi ! a(o*t it/ So. it does 9t matter/ The re8ere 'e . a d a"" that.er"asti !"+ that the word is ot the thi !/ That im.e the same i 8ormatio i o*r memories/ Whether +o* *se a Fre 'h word. a d that it is a white ta("e/ Yo* a d I ha.arate +o*rse"8 o +o*r ow 8ree wi"" a d ..e ti. e.erie 'e that witho*t ami ! it.

erie 'e the hea.hasis that there is a eed to 8ree +o*rse"8 8rom the .ress a (*tto a d 7Read+. with ew .. there are o tho*!hts at a""/ Yo* 'a ot sa+ there is o "+ tho*!ht a d there is o thi -er/ The tho*!hts do ot 'ome 8rom here D. a d it . (*t there is o 8*rther a'ti. the+ are 'omi ! 8rom o*tside/ The tra s"atio o8 a se sor+ .*ter . it has !ot a "i.i the wor"d/ It wi"" do a +thi ! to mai tai its 'o ti *it+/ 01 So thi -i ! has rea""+ o .ier tha the hea..*ter D.e i !/ It is a .e. more easi"+ or more . the word08i der/ Yo* . tr+i ! to 8i d o*t i8 there is a + i 8ormatio stored i the 'om.orta 'e to/ 01 So.t that tho*!ht is me'ha i'a" (e'a*se that .e a !oa"/ 01 I ha.e a i""*sio that there is some(od+ who is thi -i ! a d (ri !i ! o*t the i 8ormatio / Loo-.i ! :*a"it+ to it/ It has a .er+(od+/ That is the time whe +o* 8ee" hea.eratio / Sometimes tho*!hts s"ow dow i e.irit*a" terms a d !i."eas*ra("+//// A1 That is somethi ! that is ot .i ess o8 +o*r (od+ whe tho*!hts are ot i o. +o*r em.*ter/ It is me'ha i'a""+ o.oi ti ! to his (od+J is somethi ! "i.7 7 Let me thi -B7 these are stateme ts +o* are C*st ma-i !."a'e there/ Yo* ha.ows e.8or a wordB 7Sear'hi !. +o* 'a tr+ that/ I am ot +o*r tea'her/ What is ha.er'e.e des'ri(ed i some s.i !. .oi ti ! to his headE.erati !. this is o di88ere t 8rom the e@traordi ar+ i str*me t we ha.ed 8or mi""io s a d mi""io s o8 +ears.o8 +o*r e@.e i !/ We are ot read+ to a''e.erie 'i ! str*'t*re is tho*!ht/ A d +o* are *si ! those tho*!hts to a'hie.eati !B it 'arries with it the "i8e e er!+ "i-e that '*rre t e er!+/ 01 O e o8 the thi !s that h*ma (ei !s *se most o8te is ima!i atio / / / A1 The idea that +o* e@.a"id a d tr*e/ .ow a(o*t this thi -i !/ This is se:*e tia"//// A1 3o.it+ a d o thi -i ! ta-i ! .itatio a" 8or'e/ Sometimes +o* e@.eo.er+ tri'.art o8 the .ow / Tho*!ht has s*r.*ts it to!ether a d throws it o*t/ That is a"" that is ha.e more 8r*it8*""+.e i ! here is a me'ha i'a" thi ! "i-e i a 'om. or s*dde "+ +o* 8ee" as i8 +o* are wa"-i ! o air/ These are the a't*a" 8* 'tio i !s o8 the (od+ whi'h the+ ha.iest o(Ce't/ Yo* 8ee" as i8 +o* wei!h $G% -i"os."e i this area o8 ima!i atio thi .i ess o8 +o*r (od+ is d*e to the !ra.ro'ess/ I that word08i der or 'om.e !ot to .ow .tio withi the 8ramewor. there is o wa+ +o* 'a e@.7 it sa+s/ That sear'hi ! is thi -i !/ B*t it is a me'ha i'a" .oi ti ! to his headE re"ated to what we are ta"-i ! a(o*t/ 7Let me see..i.erie 'e the tota"it+ o8 +o*r (od+ is (or o*t o8 +o*r ima!i atio / A't*a""+. o8 wa+s i whi'h +o* 'a "i.ossi(i"ities.o'-s o88 the who"e ima!e that we are ot C*st ma'hi es/ It is a e@traordi ar+ ma'hi e/ It is ot di88ere t 8rom the 'om.the .erie 'e the tota"it+ o8 it/ Yo*r e@.that * 8ettered thi -i ! 'a sometimes 'ome *.er+ me'ha i'a" thi ! that is ha.*ters we *se/ B*t this I.7 it sa+s/ The +o* as.*ter there is o thi -er/ There is o thi -er thi -i ! there at a""/ I8 there is a + i 8ormatio or a +thi ! that is re8erred to.e so m*'h im."a'e i * dersta di !//// A1 There is o thi -i ! at a""/ I8 there is o thi -er.ow has a"read+ (e'ome .ita"it+/ It is ot C*st me'ha i'a""+ re. the 'om.erie 'e o8 the hea.

that the+ are a"" s. this.ed tha the other a ima"s/ That is a ad. that.ossi("e o "+ i the area o8 me'ha i'a" .ro("ems/ There is o wa+ we 'a *se that to so".owers 00 '"air. thro*!h te'h i:*es o8 meditatio a d s*'h !immi'-s.ro("ems/ It has ot to*'hed a +thi ! there I.ort* it+ to do that.owers.io"e t ma / B*t what +o* wo*"d do i a !i. (e'a*se +o* are tr+i ! to !o (a'.ro("ems/ I8 the so"*tio s we are o88ered (+ those . '"aira*die 'e."e ass*me/ I8 o e has a o. a"" these ideas o8 e@. (*t rather 9i a more at*ra" wa+9/ We are 8ree 8rom some da !ers/ A"" these .ari ! +o*rse"8.erie 'i ! +o*r (irth a!ai . +o* 'reate a . a d the :*estio o8 how to dea" with the sit*atio are a(se t here/ It 'eases to (e a 'ha""e !e the / That is wh+ I sa+ there are o .e sit*atio +o* wo*"d e.e stateme t/ There is o wa+ +o* 'a rea""+ * dersta d how a ima"s are 8* 'tio i !/ A"" these !immi'-s.erie 'e o8 +o*r ow .rod*'t o8 +o*r thi -i !/ B*t sometimes +o* e@ha*st a"" the .ro(a("+ 8ar more e. we ha. a d o*r .ro("em.e (ee e dowed with/ That is wh+ what we 'a"" .e "i.re.i ! 'ha""e !e7 mea F A1 I do 9t .orari"+.e h*ma ./ B*t whe +o* wa-e *. o e 'a do so/ What is wro ! with thatF A1 See. i8 +o* do ot ha.ow/ The dema d to (e .e o8 a sweri ! a d dea"i ! with s*'h sit*atio s 'a ot he".re.ow what we wo*"d do i a !i. a d other thi !s 00 the+ are a(so"*te r*((ish.erie 'e these so0'a""ed .to the time o8 +o*r (irth a d e@. re(irthi !.ed str*'t*re whi'h we ha.e o*r .ow.ow"ed!e we ha.ro("ems/ 01 That is ri!ht/ What +o* are sa+i ! i o e se se is that the h*ma (ei ! is ot rea""+ di88ere t 8rom a ima"s/ A1 I m*st admit that we are .re. a d the+ thi .e a . the .o+a 'e. the wa+ +o* are .er .i ! .ro("em/ Yo* 'a ot "i.ro("em/ B*t the 8a't o8 the matter is.ro("ems 'a (e ha d"ed with the hi!h"+ e.e witho*t . tem.e.e ot to*'hed a +thi ! there/ We do 9t .oi t/ What +o* are e@.owB I 'a ot ma-e a + de8i iti. *s to so"..e a .ro("ems there/ We 'reate the . tho*!ht s"ows dow / The the+ e@.ro("em or a s'ie ti8i' .ro("ems/ Thi -i ! 'a ot he".ariatio s a d a d 'om(i atio s o8 8i di ! o*t the so"*tio o8 a .s+'hi' .erie 'e +o*r ow (irth 8rom this .ared ess to meet that sit*atio with this .ared 8or a"" 8*t*re a'tio s a d sit*atio s is the 'a*se o8 o*r .ro("ems/ E. +o* rea""+ do 9t ha. et'/ 00 are a"read+ there i the a ima"s/ We a"so ha.hrase 7"i.o".ro("em/ Yo* are so tired that +o* !o to s"ee.o".e sit*atio / Yo* 'a sa+ that +o* are !oi ! to (e a o .ro("em/ We are thi -i ! a(o*t it/ Yo* 'ome o*t with a a swer a d sa+ that this is the .ow.erie 'es/ Pro(a("+ i o*r 'ase the me'ha ism is more se siti. it wor-s i 'ertai areas/ Yo* . .eo.e a mathemati'a" .erie 'i ! is ot the e@.01 This is what .irit*a" e@.a ta!e to *s i 8* 'tio i ! i a m*'h (etter wa+/ I do 9t "i-e to *se the word 9(etter9.oi ti ! to his (od+J/ A"" o*r (e"ie8s ha.er+ sit*atio is so di88ere t.e them i *s/ I the 'ase o8 some.ro("ems/ That is wh+ it has 8ai"ed to so"."e are rea""+ ot the so"*tio s. the a swer is there/ This is .*tti ! :*estio s//// 01 Yo* meet a ew sit*atio //// A1 It is ot a 'ha""e !e/ The i ade:*a'+ o8 *si ! what +o* ha. *s/ 01 The what does the .e tha i the 'ase o8 a ima"s/ I do 9t .arti'*"ar mathemati'a" .eo.ossi(i"ities.

e i .*t i there/ 02 I a sma""er a d mi or wa+.e attai ed a d a''om. the air.e de.erie 'es. a d the .e made them master8*" destro+ers o8 the earth.e (e+o d the death o8 the (od+ a d its i e. .e 00 whether it is re"i!io*s tho*!ht or s'ie ti8i' tho*!ht or . (*t there is o wa+ we 'a a''e.et*ati ! me'ha ism/ It 'o tro"s.e made wi"" destro+ e. there is o wa+ o*t/ Yo* ma+ sa+ that I am a . at*ra""+ we 'reate somethi ! 9(e+o d9/ 01 Wh+ do +o* thi .e i harmo + with the "i8e aro* d *s/ That is wh+ +o* 'reate a"" these e'o"o!i'a" ."ished so ma + thi !s/ 7Is a"" that 'omi ! to a 00 "ea.i ! (ehi d othi !F7 So."a et is ot i da !er/ We are i da !er/ 01 I8 we are.ow how to 8* 'tio i this wor"d witho*t the *se o8 tho*!ht/ Yo* 'a i .ow o8 +o*rse"8 is 'omi ! to a e d there/ Yo* ha. se.erie 'esB +o* ha.er+thi ! aro* d themF A1 As I said the "ast time. this se. 'o"or them.er.ed some traits whi'h ha.oeti'.ow i a wa+ that what +o* . are the 'a*ses o8 this destr*'tio / This .e (ee thro*!h so ma + e@. a d ima!i e that +o* are e@. that is ot the .ose tha a"" the other s.e/ Tho*!ht is a se"80. or a h* dred +ears o8 +o*r "i8eB +o* ha.*r.es with the most destr*'ti.assed o to *s 8rom !e eratio to !e eratio / Tho*!ht is ot the i str*me t to he". .ossi("+ destro+i ! o*rse". mo*"ds.e t a"" -i ds o8 thi !s a d tr+ to 8ree +o*rse"8 8rom this stra !"eho"d o8 tho*!ht. that. sha.o s that we ha. or that I am this.e a""owed a i""*sio a d * rea"it+ to .er+thi !/ The . *s to "i. the we 'a !o to a other ."a'ed with a other i""*sio / Wh+F Be'a*se the e di ! o8 the i""*sio is the e di ! o8 9+o*9/ That is the death/ The e di ! o8 (e"ie8 is the e di ! o8 the 9+o*9 that is there/ So.e"o."a et.ersist i 'o s'io*s ess or h*ma tho*!ht////F A1 Yo* are ot se.e'ies o this.t that it is tho*!ht that is o*r e em+/ We do 9t .e 00 whe 'e 'omes this desire to s*r. (*t there is othi ! to it/ 01 Wh+ is it that h*ma (ei !s ha.arate 8rom that i""*sio / Yo* are the i""*sio / I8 o e i""*sio !oes.erie 'i ! +o*r ow (irth/ This is !ood 8or mar-eti ! their 9re(irth9.arate ess 8rom the tota"it+ o8 thi !s aro* d *s. that I am a '+ i'.o"iti'a" tho*!ht 00 a"" o8 them are destr*'ti.that we ha.e wea. a d the other/ B*t I ho. a d e. it is a"wa+s re. the water.i.rote'ti.es o*r ideas a d a'tio s/ Idea a d a'tio 00 the+ are o e a d the same/ A"" o*r a'tio s are (or o*t o8 ideas/ O*r ideas are tho*!hts .t the 8a't that that is ot the i str*me t to he".e a'hie.e/ B*t we are ot read+ to a''e.ed si@t+.essimist.e o e da+ we wi"" rea"i?e that the mista-es we ha. a d the idea that the who"e thi ! is 'reated 8or o*r (e e8it a d that we are 'reated 8or a !ra der a d o("er .o""*tio .ro("em o8 .ed so ma + thi !sB +o* ha.e ted/ So. *s to 8* 'tio sa e"+ a d i te""i!e t"+ i this wor"d/ Tho*!ht is a se"80.ower8*" *se o8 tho*!ht is what is destr*'ti. roma ti' death 00 o8 7d+i ! to +o*r +esterda+s/7 Ph+si'a" death is the o "+ wa+ thro*!h whi'h +o* 8"*sh o*t what +o*r who"e '*"t*re has .ro("ems o8 . (*t somethi ! 8rom where +o* are/ Yo* *se a"" these e@.i.ita("e demiseF A1 Be'a*se +o* .ro("ems."a et/ The desire to s*r.e me'ha ism/ So a +thi ! that is (or o*t o8 tho*!ht is destr*'ti.e "i. I 'a see thro*!h a i""*sio //// .(irth.e t+.

ai is there.*..hrases s*'h as. (e'a*se there is o s. I mi!ht as we"" ta-e a . as "o ! as the .A1 That is a other i""*sio / The i""*sio is that 7the seei ! is the e di !/7 There is o wa+ +o* 'a se.arate +o*rse"8 a d the seei !/ Seei ! is the i""*sio B the seer is the i""*sio / The seer te""s himse"8 that 7seei ! is e di !.e'ia" 'harm.e re'orders .e to o*rse". 7I am aware o8 this.e "iste i !/ There is o s*'h thi ! as the art o8 "iste i !/ Yo* are ot "iste i ! at a""/ Liste i ! is ot i +o*r i terest/ Yo* are i ter. a d "et the (od+ s*88er a d !o thro*!h the . to .er+ +o* !/ The+ me tio him as a e@am.e/ A other thi ! that I wa ted to as.ai -i""er/ I am ot sa+i ! +o* sho*"d do othi !.irit*a" or otherwise.eat it a!ai a d a!ai / This is C*st a . that."e o8 how a .ai tem.i"" a d 8ree m+se"8 8rom the . Fra .Si atra/ It is there i o e o8 +o*r .*ters.7 (*t it does ot e d/ So the seer does ot wa t to 'ome to a e d/ The seer is the i""*sio / I do 9t . two 'om..h+si'a" .e said a "ot ow/ 01 Yo* 'ertai "+ ha.orari"+.er+(od+/ It has hit a"read+ the 8amo*s m*si'ia .e the door/ 01 The rea""+ what +o* are sa+i ! is that the (od+ has a e ormo*s i te""i!e 'e (e'a*se a"" its 8* 'tio s !o o i ter.ai / Yo* are a't*a""+ addi ! more to the . two ta.arated +o*rse"8 8rom that a d the seer has 'ome i to (ei !. a d thro*!h that seei ! he is mai tai i ! his 'o ti *it+/ That is wh+ seei ! has ot he".es a d . what is his ame. two .erso s*88eri ! 8rom A"?heimer9s disease 8* 'tio s/ Yo* ha.owB it is (etter ot to dis'*ss these thi !s/ The seer is the i""*sio / Thro*!h the i .e tio o8 what is 'a""ed 7the seei ! o8 the i""*sio is the e di !.ets.7 the seer is !atheri ! mome t*m a d 'o ti *i !/ The mome t +o* wa t to 9see9 somethi ! +o* ha.*t i to . that is a""/ 01 Whate."a+i ! (ea*ti8*""+ i their ow wa+/ A1 O*r i terest to tea'h that (od+ somethi ! whi'h it is ot i terested i is 'a*si !.e se. wi"" it ot (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i *sF A1 3ot at a""/ Yo* are ot e.e the 9-e+9 there i +o*r ha d/ B*t +o* do 9t .h+si'a" e@'ha !e////this i ter.ai +o* ta-e some .e to *se a"" those .a.et sitti ! here/ A d.+o* a(o*t is ."a+ that is !oi ! o owF A1 DLa*!hsE I do 9t rea""+ wa t to re.ro.ro("ems 8or it/ K BLM& Is there a +thi ! e"se that +o* wo*"d "i-e to sa+F A1 To sa+ whatF I ha.ai whether//// 00 A1 To "ea.reti !/ 01 I am aware o8 that/ S*re"+ there is some -i d o8 "iste i !/ I am tr+i ! to .*."a+i !.er+(od+/ I read it i some ma!a?i e that it is hitti ! e.ra'ti'e what the+ 'a"" 9aware ess9. +o* wi"" !o the wa+ o8 A"?heimer9s disease whi'h is hitti ! e. a d the other/7 I8 +o* .er +o* are sa+i ! 00 "iste i ! to +o*. 'reati ! .ow how to *se the -e+ a d o.e it a"o e/ I8 there is . s.*t the -e+ i the door a d//// A1 We do 9t ha.ai / See.ed *sB it has e ded othi ! there/ 01 This dia"o!*e.ers/ He is . o*r ta"-i ! to!ether ow 00 what wo*"d +o* "i-e to 'a"" itF It is C*st a .

.e . a +thi ! we sa+ ow is o8 o *se/ What we wo*"d do i a + !i. it is "ost/ 3or am I tr+i ! to sa+ that what I sa+ is i a m+sterio*s wa+ a88e'ti ! the who"e o8 h*ma 'o s'io*s ess/ 01 I do thi .ai is i +o*r . h*ma tra!ed+.a"*e. that tho*!ht a d the (od+ ha. "i-e the <hristia sai ts who s*88er a d do 9t !o to a do'tor/ That is ot what I am sa+i !/ I 8a't.ai / That is ot what we are ta"-i ! a(o*t/ B*t what we 'a do is to "ea.ai is rea""+ there the we wo*"d 9t dis'*ss itB some a'tio wo*"d (e there/ 01 Yes. i +o*r (a'-.ows what it wa ts to . a d that is wh+ we are 'reati ! . the .ose 8or . that is ri!ht/ A1 Yo*r ."e re"atio shi. a d "ea.ara oid/ We are o.that .ro(a("+.a"*e s+stem is the o e that is res.e.oses/ Tho*!ht is 8* 'tio a" i .ow a "ot more tha this (od+/ We thi .ai a"o e witho*t i ter8eri ! a"" the time/ We thi .ai is rea""+ a hea"er/ I am ot 'o tradi'ti ! what +o* said/ B*t .o si("e 8or the h*ma 8or'i ! e.ro("ems 8or it/ It .ee.e to ma-e it a "itt"e (it (eara("e/ I do 9t see a + .ai"a("e to +o*/ There is o .ow what is !ood 8or that (od+.to others that we 'a e d*re . the +o* sim.e dis'*ssed so 8ar/ I8 +o* remem(er a +thi !.*r.er+(od+ to 8it i to that mode"/ ma"ad+."a'ed (e8ore *s/ 01 Is there o s*'h thi ! as a . (e'a*se we are ot ha. a d it 'a ot he".i ! ha d 'a (e !i.that we .oi t i a + -i d o8 s*88eri !/ 01 I8 the .h+si'a" .oi t i s*88eri !.e that .ai F A1 It is a hea"er/ Pai is a hea"i ! .ai at this mome t has o mea i !.we .i ! a + .ro'ess/ B*t we are ."+ do 9t/ I wish that o(od+ remem(ers a +thi ! o8 what we ha. *s to a'hie.*r.ow/ It does 9t wa t to "ear a +thi ! 8rom *s/ I8 we * dersta d this sim. that is a.e a + o8 the !oa"s we ha. the +o* ma-e it/ I8 +o* do 9t. or i +o*r head.ai ow/ I8 some . it is a"read+ there//// A1 Ma+ I sa+ somethi !F A +thi ! that we dis'*ss a(o*t .e it at that/ I8 +o* ma-e some se se o*t o8 that."a'ed (e8ore *s.ai is i (or / A1 It is there/ It is tr+i ! to hea" *s (e'a*se o8 some dise:*i"i(ria/ B*t what I am s*!!esti ! is that there is o 'harm i s*88eri !B some he". we wi"" a""ow the (od+ to 8* 'tio a d *se tho*!ht o "+ 8or 8* 'tio a" .era @io*s to see that we do 9t s*88er/ I am ot sa+i ! that +o* sho*"d ot !et a + he". or what the '*"t*re has .e sit*atio is a +(od+9s !*ess/ Let *s sto.

There is no reincarnation for those who do not belie e in it. /////// %f humanity is to be sa ed from the chaos of its own making.. "%". or psyche32 $hate er you see or experience is created by the knowledge we ha e of that entity. /////// 1 guru is one who tells you to throw away all crutches.i ess i :*est o8 whi'h e. you will rise and walk. *ut you ha e to ask this fundamental 'uestion! 2$hat is there now that will reincarnate3 %s there any such thing as a soul. in its expression. /////// 01 First o8 a"" "et *s a a"+?e this wo der8*" otio o8 ha. /////// $hat these gurus in the market place do is to sell you some ice packs and pro ide you with some comforters..C(APTE! 3 Throw Away %our Crut)hes4 Thought can only create problems. /////// There is reincarnation for those who belie e in it. you ha e become the follower of somebody. but % use it to mean that thought controls and shapes our thinking and our actions. % do not use it in the political sense.e would ask you to walk. and he would say that if you fall. and in its action is ery fascist. /////// The moment you repeat that which is not yours. . $hen % use the word "fascist". in its origin. but it cannot help us to sol e the problems.i ess is a"" a(o*tF . /////// Thought in its birth.er+ h*ma is o the r* / <a +o* te"" *s what this ha. it has to be freed from the sa iors of mankind.

i its 'o te t.tio that there is s*'h a thi ! as tho*!ht/ We *se what we 'a"" tho*!ht to a'hie.at what we 'a"" tho*!ht.osed 8* dame ta""+ to the 8* 'tio i ! o8 this "i.a"*e/ A d this is the 'o 8"i't that is !oi ! o there/ I this . a d that we 'a se. or whate.e that there is s*'h a thi ! as mi d/ B*t there is o s*'h thi ! as +o*r mi d or m+ mi d/ So'iet+ or '*"t*re. tho*!ht is o.a(o*t 9the :*est 8or ha.. a d i its a'tio is . what we see is about tho*!ht a d not tho*!ht itse"8/ 7What is tho*!htF7 00 the :*estio s arises o "+ (e'a*se o8 the ass*m.erie 'es/ 01 Who ma-es *s thi .arate o*rse".erie 'e a +thi !."a'es s. 7Is there a + s*'h a thi ! as tho*!htF7 The .e that there is s*'h a thi !/ A d it was at that time .o ta eo*s/ I wo*"d !o o e ste. i its e@.e that h*ma (ei !s are 'reated 8or a o("er a d !ra der . a d it is that (e"ie8 that is res.oi t I wo*"d "i-e to em.arate a d disti 't 8rom the tota"it+ o8 ma 9s tho*!hts a d e@.erie 'ed this se"80'o s'io*s ess 8or the 8irst time/ A d it se.arti'*"ar wa+F A1 Here at this . (e it +o*r ow (od+.*r. it has a"so 'reated the idea that there is s*'h a thi ! as the i di.e'ies o this .*r.ossi(i"it+ o8 8* 'tio i ! as a i di.e'ies 8rom the rest o8 the s.er+ 'om8orta("e/ It has a"so made it . there is a 'o 8"i't (etwee the two 00 the idea o8 the i di.arate ide tit+ a d a se.e me'ha ism a d is i terested i its ow s*r.o"iti'a" se se (*t to mea that tho*!ht 'o tro"s a d sha.ed *s to (e what we are toda+/ It has he".erie 'es 'reated what we 'a"" a se.o"*tio .arate mi d/ B*t a't*a""+ i8 +o* wa t to e@.e'ies o this .i a . whi'h is tho*!ht/ Tho*!ht to me is matter/ There8ore.irit*a" !oa"s o a hi!her "e.es o*r thi -i ! a d o*r a'tio s/ So it is a .er e@traordi ar+ the+ ma+ (e. the tota"it+ o8 ma 9s e@.a"/ At the same time.er+ 8as'ist/ Whe I *se the word 98as'ist9 I *se it ot i the .ose o8 mai tai i ! its ow 'o ti *it+ a d stat*s :*o/ At the same time.id*a" a d the im.er+ .rote'ti. i its ori!i .ow"ed!e that is .ressio .er the "aws o8 at*re/ B*t tho*!ht is a . (*t whe we ta".i.er +o* wa t to 'a"" it."a et.ro("em that we are 8a'i ! toda+/ Somewhere a"o ! the "i e.erie 'es. I wo*"d sa+ that tho*!ht is memor+/ B*t we ha.e" tha the materia"isti' !oa"s/ B*t the i str*me t whi'h we are *si ! is matter.ro'ess. howe.i ! or!a ism/ We are made to (e"ie.e .o si("e 8or o*r thi -i ! that the who"e 'reatio is 'reated 8or the (e e8it o8 ma / .e'ies e@.ossi("e 8or *s to dis'o."a et/ I do 9t e.irit*a" or materia" !oa"s/ We ma+ 'o sider the s.er+ .e (ee made to (e"ie.. 8*rther a d as-. (*t we are made to (e"ie. or +o*r ow e@.irit*a" !oa"s are materia"isti' i their . the h*ma s.ow i8 there is a + s*'h thi ! as e.assed o to *s/ I other words.id*a"/ B*t a't*a""+.i ess9.arated the h*ma s.ed *s to 'reate o*r hi!h0te'h a d te'h o"o!+/ It has made o*r "i8e .A1 Yo* ma+ ot a!ree with me. a"" o*r s.rote'ti.e o*r s.it+/ As a matter o8 8a't.er+ :*estio arises (e'a*se we ass*me that there is s*'h a thi ! as tho*!ht.es 8rom tho*!ht a d "oo.hasi?e that tho*!hts are ot se"80!e erated a d s.its (irth/ B*t tho*!ht i its (irth.e o wa+ o8 e@. has 'reated *s so"e"+ a d who""+ 8or the .ose tha the other s.erie 'i ! them witho*t the *se o8 the .erie 'es.at it/ B*t whe we "oo. a"" e@.irit*a" !oa"s as 9hi!her9/ The '*"t*re i whi'h we are 8* 'tio i ! .e me'ha ism/ It has o do*(t he". are i the area o8 se s*a"it+/ That is o e maCor . +o* ha. it is o di88ere t 8rom a + other se s*a" a'ti.erha.s that tho*!ht too.id*a" se.

es 8rom the ide tit+F As I said.a("e thro*!h the he". as +o* me tio ed.ro("em o8 mai tai i ! what we 'a"" ide tit+/ A d ide tit+ is the most im. is 'reated (+ tho*!ht so that it 'a . *s i a'hie./7 4o 9t +o* thi .it+ o8 the er.er+ esse tia" 8or *s to s*r."a'ed (e8ore *s as the !oa" 8or a"" o8 *s to rea'h a d attai .e t i o*r "i.er +o* wa t to 'a"" it/ The (asi' .it+ o8 the se sor+ ..e the i . *s to so".tio s a d a"so the se siti.ossi("e !oa" o8 .*r.t the 8a't that e.*rs*i ! what it 'a""s a tho*!ht"ess state.e t/ I8 we a''e.*t. mai tai its ow 'o ti *it+/ So whate..er.e de t e.that 8or e. is im.i ! or!a ism/ Tho*!ht 'a o "+ 'reate .e/ A +thi ! that we dis'o.er+thi ! that is (or o*t o8 tho*!ht is destr*'ti. ."a'ed (e8ore *s (+ ma + s..erma e t ha.e a +/ 01 The is it desira("e to (e tho*!ht"essF A1 What I am ta"-i ! a(o*t is ot a tho*!ht"ess state/ E.e this i str*me t/ Tho*!ht is . we ha.er+ esse tia" 8or the s*r. (+ .erma e t ha.hi"oso.er+ thi ! that we are tr+i ! to (e 8ree 8rom/ 01 Yo* see.i ess. it 'reates a treme do*s .i.e de t e. are *sed (+ *s o "+ 8or destr*'ti.e t is a i de.i ess/ There are mome ts o8 ha. the "aws o8 at*re or whate.id*a" a d i de.e ted the ideas o8 'a*se a d e88e't/ There ma+ ot (e a + s*'h thi ! as a 'a*se at a""/ E.er +o* 'a"" it.i ! the !oa"s that we ha.ro("ems o8 o*r "i.es. *s to so".es *s with o e er!+ to dea" with the .e this 'a*se a d e88e't theor+ whi'h sa+s. so sha"" +o* a"so rea.er+ a'tio o8 o*rs.hies he". *s o "+ to shar. is the e em+ o8 this "i.er'e..e a d A1 Tho*!ht is ot the i str*me t 8or a'hie. a d the theories are 'o sta t"+ 'ha !i !//// 01 <a we .irit*a" tea'hers as a !oa" to (e rea'hed.i ess/ B*t the dema d to (e i a .ro("emsB it 'a ot he"."a'ed (e8ore o*rse".er we e@. whether it is tho*!ht or a + other a'tio .*.e t is a i de.e dis'o.E.e t is a i di.es/ The !oa"s are * a'hie.o*s s+stem/ That is .er+ e. o8 tho*!ht/ The :*est 8or ha.ro'ess to ma-e it 'o str*'ti..i ! the !oa" o8 a tho*!ht"ess state stre !the s a d 8orti8ies the .i ess.er +o* 'a"" it. 7As +o* sow.ossi("e (e'a*se there is o s*'h thi ! as .ro("emsB it 'a ot he". or whate.e .t to re8i e this tho*!ht .e i ! that i str*me t/ A"" .e to 8a'e toda+ is this& the '*"t*ra" i . there is a rea'tio . .er+ e.e t/ We "i .e de t e.eF ot at "east attem.orta t 8a'tor i o*r "i.e ts a d tr+ to 'reate a stor+ o8 o*r "i.e the im.i !/ Is there a + wa+ that we 'a 8ree o*rse". whi'h is a"so tho*!ht/ This 'o sta t *se o8 memor+ or ide tit+.ositi. or whate.e them/ Thro*!h dia"e'ti'a" thi -i ! a(o*t thi -i ! itse"8 we are o "+ shar..i ess is the e em+ o8 this (od+/ This (od+ is i terested i mai tai i ! its se siti. or what so'iet+ has . a"" these e.i ! a +thi ! other tha the !oa"s set (e8ore *s (+ o*r '*"t*re or so'iet+.ro'ess o8 a'hie.e i this wor"d/ B*t it 'a ot he".i ess.ered :*ite a 8ew o8 at*re9s "aws. is 'o s*mi ! a treme do*s amo* t o8 e er!+. at "east a8ter some timeF A1 It is tho*!ht that has i .ro("em we ha. tho*!ht 'a o "+ 'reate .e .er+ e.es/ We are a("e to mai tai this ide tit+ thro*!h the 'o sta t *se o8 memor+.e tio o8 what is 'a""ed a tho*!ht"ess state.erma e t state o8 ha.a" o8 this (od+/ I8 we *se that i str*me t o8 tho*!ht 8or tr+i ! to a'hie.i. i8 ot immediate"+. a d it "ea.es/ B*t a't*a""+ e.erie 'e i this .oses/ A d it is tr*e that we ha. a d there are mome ts o8 * ha.

er +o* see there.e d somethi !.ro'essesF 4o +o* attri(*te this to some -i d o8 i here t !i8tF A1 We ha.e s*'h .it+ a d other "aws o8 at*reF M+ a swer is. what is it that is ot .erma e t state o8 ha. "i-e !ra.ossi("e 8or +o* to e@.a"*es a d ot o*r s. the ..ro("em o8 rei 'ar atio .e to as. 7What is there ow that +o* thi .erso si !*"ar .e i it.*r.er it is/ How 8ar do +o* s*(s'ri(e to this theor+. or .eated :*estio . to reso".i ess/ 01 Yo* re8erred to the i te""e't a d to the shar. the s.e *s 'om8ort i 8a'i ! the sit*atio that we ha.ro'ess we are shar.ossi("e 8or *s. a d there is o rei 'ar atio 8or those who do ot (e"ie.s+'heF Whate. a d a"" -i ds o8 thi !s.ed (+ the h*ma mi d at o e time to e@.. rei 'ar atio .ose o8 "i8e."eas*re/ So.ow"ed!e. add somethi ! to it.e i ! that i str*me t/ B*t we are *si ! treme do*s amo* ts o8 e er!+ i this .ro'ess/ I8 the *se o8 tho*!ht is "imited to a'hie.er+ 8o* datio o8 that (e"ie8/ There is rei 'ar atio 8or those who (e"ie.. o/ It does 9t matter whether +o* (e"ie.e i this wor"d/ 01 Yes/ How do we shar. rea'tio or somethi ! that we (ri ! a"o ! with *s "i-e a (a .er+ i teresti ! theor+ e."e i o*r midst/ B*t ow it is .(a"a 'e.e to 8i d o*t the si! i8i'a 'e."eas*re/ 01 We ha.e or ot i rei 'ar atio / I8 o e is i terested i 8i di ! o*t 8or himse"8 a d (+ himse"8.er +o* e@.e .i ! s.erma e t ha. a + se"8.e o "+ what we 'o sider to (e materia"isti' . the is it .i.e o8 that se"8/ I8 +o* are "*'-+ e o*!h to (e 8reed 8rom the tota"it+ o8 .t to (e i a . mea i !. to me the 9I9 is othi ! (*t a 8irst .irit*a" !oa"s or e.e a"wa+s (ee '*rio*s a d i terested i 8i di ! o*t wh+ a 'hi"d is (or with de8ormities/ A d rei 'ar atio was a . a d !et a a swer 8or this o8t0 re.erma e 'e or ..eo.e this . a + 9I9.e i ! o8 the i te""e't//// A1 To s*r.osed to the theor+ o8 -arma or rei 'ar atio / B*t I am :*estio i ! the .ro o* .it+ o8 this (od+ is destro+ed/ There8ore.erma e t .erie 'e a + 'e ter.wi"" rei 'ar ateF7 7Is there a +thi ! thereF Is there a + s*'h thi ! as so*"F Is there a + s*'h thi ! as the 9I9F Is there a + s*'h thi ! as the .i ess a d .o".h+ or a + s*'h thi !/ Tho*!ht is ot i te ded 8or a'hie.ow"ed!e +o* ha.e itF With whose he". sta! a t i his me ta" . a d the 'arr+ it 8orward to the e@t (irth or whate. or to (e *sed 8or the :*est 8or .F BLA& Thro*!h a re.e i it/ B*t is there a + s*'h thi ! as rei 'ar atio as a "aw o8 at*re. or are +o* o.etiti.ow"ed!e o8 the se"8. a d I do ot see a + 'e ter or se"8 there/ So the who"e idea o8 rei 'ar atio is (*i"t o "+ o the 8o* datio o8 o*r (e"ie8s/ 01 What is it that ma-es o e a !reat . the (od+ is reCe'ti ! a"" that we are i terested i 00 . a'tio . i the "i!ht o8 what the+ are doi ! i .hi"oso.osed to itF A1 I am ot o.erie 'e there. whate.erma e t . is 'reated o "+ (+ the . we are ot !oi ! to s*''eed i that attem.erso i d*e 'o*rse o8 time a d a other statio ar+.irit*a" !oa"s."ai awa+ s*'h sit*atio s a d !i. a + so*"F So.e (ee 8ami"iar with this theor+ o8 (irth a d death 00 -arma.this 8* dame ta" :*estio . 7Is there s*'h a thi ! as rei 'ar atio F7 +o* ha.the se siti.ossi("e 8or *s i order to 8* 'tio sa e"+ a d i te""i!e t"+/ It does ot mea that I am tea'hi ! a materia"isti' .

a d +o* ha.o some(od+ 8or so". +o* wi"" rea"i?e that those who are i terested i these s.irit*a" matters a d their "oo-i ! to the East 8or s*''or is dr*!s/ The+ !a. a A8ri'a .eati ! those e@.i ! that !oa"/ It is ass*med that the West is materia"isti'."oited (+ the ."a'e toda+/ It is a (*si essB it has (e'ome a ho"+ (*si ess to . 7Throw them awa+. so "o ! +o* remai he".e them a ew sort o8 e@.erie 'e/ B*t the+ were ot satis8ied with re.e are esse tia" 8or o*r s*r.o"."e who are !*idi ! the desti ies o8 this wor"d/ What is res. a d that it is "oo-i ! towards the East 8or s.ed i a'hie.erie 'es/ The+ were "oo-i ! aro* d 8or .i ess is a"" that a +(od+."e/ I am ot 'o dem i ! a +thi !/ B*t as "o ! as +o* de. or e.h+si'a" .er+o e has !ot somethi ! the+ wa t.i ! +o*r . or a I dia .ossi("e to a'hie. *s to "oo."e/ A !*r* is o e who te""s +o* to throw awa+ a"" the 'r*t'hes that we ha.ie'es o8 !oods i the mar-et .io*s "i8eF That -i d o8 (e"ie8 'omes i .re.o."a'e them with the 8a '+ 'r*t'hes or e.e .i.eo. (*t the+ !i.ro("ems.ast "i8e/ That is o a swer to !i.o si("e 8or this s*dde i terest i s.es a d 8or themse".ro("ems (+ themse".e that that s*88eri ! is there (e'a*se the .irit*a" matters are ot rea""+ the . to r* a8ter/ A1 As we started this dis'*ssio we said that the :*est 8or ha. a treme do*s amo* t o8 .er+o e i this ."a'es toda+.irit*a"ism o8 the East a d the S.a or 8rom <hi a/ The+ are attra'ted to these thi !s (e'a*se o8 the ew "a !*a!e a d ew te'h i:*es/ .ro("em Do8 'o 8"i't with the (od+E that is i . o(od+ re:*ires a !*r*/ I 8a't.a!ai /7 S*'h is the ma whom we 'o sider.atio . a d de!radatio / It is .eo.e i o*r midst toda+ a treme do*s s*88eri !."oiti ! the !*""i(i"it+ a d 'red*"it+ o8 .a"/ The tr*e !*r* te""s +o*.erie 'es.e traditio 'o siders.arieties o8 re"i!io*s e@. that is. a d ot those who are se""i ! those shodd+ .eo. i stead o8 dea"i ! with the .atio . star. whether he is a R*ssia .ro("em whi'h is dema di ! a swers 8rom e..e the ."ess/ A d this he".terms o8 !e eti' resear'h a d mi'ro(io"o!+. a d e@.er+ ha d+ to *s/ We ha. +o* too. I * dersta d.eo.that it is the wro ! word to *se i these da+s 8or a"" those s. we ha.e +o* some sort o8 a 'om8orter/ Peo.irit*a" !*r*s we ha.er.irit*a"ism o8 the West are !rad*a""+ e@'ha !i ! .e 8or a "o !er . a d do 9t re. wo*"d ot "i-e to (e a !*r* 8or a +(od+/ A''ordi ! to +o*.e i the mar-et. is i terested i / I said that it is im.eo.eriod i the West.e (ee made to (e"ie.er+ 'om8orti ! 8or *s to (e"ie.e 'om.e s*'h a !oa" (e'a*se o8 the .irit*a" !*ida 'e/ That is ot rea""+ tr*e/ I8 +o* "i.er+ thi -i ! ma i the wor"d toda+/ 01 .ert+. somethi ! a"wa+s to see-.a a'ea 8or the h*ma miser+. or 8rom ."a et is 8a'i !F E.a.etrated i h*ma deeds/ The (e"ie8 i rei 'ar atio wi"" o "+ he".e see the res*"ts o8 (oth ow/ What is the ."e are satis8ied with these 'om8orters a d 8a"" 8or this -i d o8 thi !. +o* wi"" rise a d wa".ro("em there/ The (e"ie8 is either s.ie'es o8 !oods."e who s*88er did somethi ! terri("e i their .ri.e/ That ma-es *s ta-e she"ter i the (e"ie8 a d ot do a +thi ! to so".*teri?ed 'r*t'hes/ Yo* 'a wa"-B a d i8 +o* 8a""."e who a't*a""+ do ot ha.the other side a d ot to dea" with the . to 'orre't the de8ormities 'reated (+ at*re/ Wh+ sho*"d we wa t to attri(*te this mis8ort* e to somethi ! terri("e that we did i o*r . whether the+ are 8rom I dia.irit*a" or h*ma / I the ame o8 doi ! somethi ! h*ma to o*r 8e""ow (ei !s.es/ 01 The s.e d *. se""i ! shodd+ .hasi?ed o e 8a't. to (e the rea" !*r*. the de. what is the ro"e o8 a !*r* who shows the wa+ 8or the Sish+aF A1 I thi . a Ameri'a . the -i d o8 s*88eri ! e.ro("ems.e the a swers to +o*r ./ >rish am*rti a"wa+s em."ess ess is e@.

the ho"+ (*si ess/ These ."e are e@.ose o8 mai tai i ! its 'o ti *it+ a d stat*s :*o/ .e to as.ro("ems/ It is ot that sim. a d sa.s/ A d the so"*tio is there 8or ma -i d/ So'iet+ or '*"t*re or whate.e (+ the sa!es. it has to (e 8reed 8rom the sa.e 'reated a treme do*s mar-et 8or this -i d o8 (*si ess. at*ra""+ the :*estio arises."e.:*estio s ot (or o*t o8 the a swers we a"read+ ha.iors o8 ma -i d/ That does ot mea that +o* wo*"d destro+ e."oiti ! the !*""i(i"it+ a d 'red*"it+ o8 the .iors o8 ma -i d/ We 8ai" to rea"i?e that the a swers that the+ ha.e e. we wo*"d (e :*estio i ! the tea'hers/ I8 h*ma it+ is to (e sa.e the a swers !i. +o* ha. whe a"" the materia" eeds are ta-e 'are o8.s*'h :*estio s o. sai ts.o si("e 8or the tra!ed+ o8 ma -i d/ We do 9t :*estio them/ I8 we :*estio the a swers.*r.er o''*rs to *s to as.er+thi ! that +o* 'a reaso a("+ as.eo. the h*ma . 7Is that a""F7 Whe o 'e +o* .e !i.wh+ we -ee.er a d o.8or i this wor"d.e *s are the o es that are res.ro("ems. has 'reated *s a"" so"e"+ a d who""+ 8or the ."e/ So we ha.e the (asi' .er+thi !/ Yo* wi"" ha.e/ B*t is there a + a swerF That is a""/ There it sto.e/ It e.eo.e to as.er +o* mi!ht wa t to 'a"" it.ose that :*estio 7Is that a""F7 to +o*rse"8.i ! them to reso". rather tha he". as-i ! the :*estio s whe we a"read+ ha.ed 8rom the 'haos o8 its ow ma-i !.The 8a't o8 the matter is that whe o 'e +o* ha.er a!ai / B*t a"" the :*estio s we are as-i ! are (or o*t o8 the a swers that we a"read+ ha.

/////// . it is born out of sensuality. -ulture demands that you should be something other than what you are. /////// The mind is interested only in sensuality. going longer than its natural duration. %n fact. li ing becomes ery simple. *ut the body is not interested in any of these except to respond to stimuli. what we are saddled with are only solutions. $hat a tremendous amount of energy we waste trying to become that4 *ut if that energy is released.C(APTE! 5 The !o*ot is 6reaming The uni'ueness of the indi idual cannot express itself because of the stranglehold of the experiences of others. *ut e ery human being is uni'ue. is destroying the sensiti ity of the li ing organism. /////// There are actually no problems# rather. Then what is it that you cannot do3 /////// Trying to keep the sensation of happiness. /////// The only "%" that % can find there is the first person singular pronoun. %t maintains its continuity in the field of sensuality. /////// To be an indi idual and to be yourself you do not ha e to do a thing. or any other sensation that is pleasurable. % ha e to use that to differentiate from the second person singular pronoun. The alue system is patterned after the beha ior of the great teachers of mankind who ha e done more harm than good. /////// The perfect man is born out of the alue system that we ha e created.

o ses/ Ea'h o e is a i de..e "ear t 8rom the st*d+ o8 o*r (io"o!+.a("e o8 'reati ! ima!es/ Tra s"ati ! the se sor+ ."a'e/ So he dra!!ed me *.roCe'tor/ . the ima!e o8 what +o* are "oo-i ! at.e o8 what memor+ is/ Whe o 'e the o.erie 'e i o*r "i8e/ Is it a"" there somewhere i the (aseme t o8 the (rai F How wo*"d +o* e@.ie 'amera/ The mo.*shed m+se"8 to the to.e ed whe +o* were with Rama a Maharshi/ B*t the (rai s'ie 'e te""s *s that the (rai re'ords e.tio s i to the 8ramewor.t*res whate.*t i there (+ o*r '*"t*re/ 01 I am "iste i !//// A1 So what I am tr+i ! to sa+ is that what the (rai does is to tra s"ate these se sor+ .erie 'e o8 what ha. how the se ses are o.o se to a stim*"*s/ The res. it throws a ima!e o the reti a/ This is what we ha.tio s i to ima!es is the '*"t*ra" i . o8 that hi"" a d tried to e@.oi t to o e (asi' thi !.erati !/ What is there is o "+ a res.e this e@am.o8 memor+/ Memor+ is ot a 'o sta t 8a'tor/ What ha.ated. hesita t"+.o"."e o8 a mo.e."i-e/ The . (ri ! the memor+ i to o.re. it is somethi ! whi'h 'a ot (e e@.e ta*!ht *s i o*r s'hoo"s/ B*t a't*a""+ i8 +o* wa t to e@.e to *se a arti8i'ia" thi ! 'a""ed the .ti' er.e +o* the e@am. o8 a"" these res.eme t o the s'ree +o* ha. a d that is what the .e de t 8rame/ A "ot o8 ima!i atio is i .iew o8 the who"e .iew o8 this .erie 'e the 3$% de!ree ..e a 3$% de!ree ."a'eF I 'a see o "+ 15% de!rees/ So what he thi -s he is e@. e@'e.erie 'i ! is (or o*t o8 his ow ima!i atio /7 This D.es are a'ti.e i ! i 8rames/ Yo* ta-e. that is.er'e.*t a'ross to those who are i terested i "iste i ! to what I ha."e.iew o8 the who"e .eme t o8 ha d arti8i'ia""+ 'reated thro*!h the he".ro("em is the 'reatio o8 ima!es whi'h is (or o*t o8 o*r ima!i atio a d most"+ o*t o8 what is .t that it re!isters the stim*"i i the same wa+ as i 8ormatio is re!istered whe tra s8erri ! ima!es 8rom o e 8"o.roCe'tor/ A d o "+ the do +o* see the mo.the e@..e i ! there/ I !i.erie 'es/ Memor+ is i 8rames/ I order to e@.ie 'amera 'a.*t there/ Whe m+ e+es are ot "oo-i ! at +o*.ate the e*ro s i the (rai ."a'e/ I said to m+se"8. the mo. the+ i their t*r a'ti.ates +o*r o. to the to.oi ti ! to himse"8E 'a 'reate the ima!e o8 what +o* "oo.io*s 8rame/ Let me !i. 7That 8e""ow is -iddi ! himse"8 a d ima!i i ! thi !s/ How is it ."e o8 what a 8rie d wa ted me to do whe I was i a hi"" resort i I dia/ He said that whe he rea'hed the to.erie 'ed (+ +o*/ Wh+ I !i..e to sa+ is that there is o s*'h thi ! as the tota"it+ o8 e@.er'e. a d te"" *s that the o(Ce't is this or that/ So the e@t 8rame is :*ite di88ere t 8rom the ."ai thatF A1 What I am tr+i ! to .erie 'e the 8a't. that is. I m*st ./ U wi""i !"+.h+sio"o!ists ha.+ dis' to a other/ There is o "i -i ! *.o se is ot tra s"ated (+ a +thi ! that is there. I .ed 8rom here to there/ A d i order to see the mo.ed i o*r tr+i ! to * dersta d what is a't*a""+ ha. o8 a .eme t o8 m+ ha d 8rom here to there 00 it has te di88ere t 8rames to show that the ha d has mo. o8 the .ossi("e to e@.ti' er.arti'*"ar mo* tai the he wo*"d ha.er+ e@.eratio . there is o wa+ that this or!a ism D.oi ti ! to himse"8E is si !*"ar"+ i 'a.."e is to 8ree *s 8rom ma + o8 the ideas we ha.e s is that whe the "i!ht 8a""s o the o(Ce't a d a'ti.01 Yo* me tio ed that +o* 'o*"d ot (ri ! (a'."ai what I mea whe I sa+ that it is a"" i 8rames a d that the who"e h*ma (od+ is 8* 'tio i ! 8rom mome t to mome t.er is ha.e the e@am.erie 'e what he 'a""ed a 3$% de!ree . 8or e@am.

e ed des.ed o*t/ 01 I am thi -i ! o8 te"e.e to *se that 8irst .e a + de.e mo.er ha.t*res this 7whate.oi ti ! to himse"8E who is ta"-i !/ There is o(od+/ It ma+ so* d .7 he said/ 7I8 we a''e.eati ! them/ A d there is o *se -iddi ! themse".er+thi ! +o* did was . +et we are ot read+ to a''e. a d des. wh+ do the+ 'ome to see +o*F A1 The+ sti"" thi .ersatio that too. (etwee the . that whate. that I am a e "i!hte ed ma / A"so I ha.e ed to me had ha.ite9////7 He said that m+ stateme ts were irre"e.e'ted o8 some(od+ who wa ted to (e a e "i!hte ed ma .erso a" ide tit+. them/ I wi"" re"ate to +o* some 'o ..otees or dis'i.er+ stra !e to +o* (*t that is the wa+ it is/ It is so me'ha i'a".ro o* / I ha."e.ed somewhere e"se.isit to Rama a Maharshi.a t/ 7The .er I am sa+i !/ The+ are memori?i ! m+ stateme ts a d re."e that !ather aro* d +o*/ Wh+ do . o e 8rie d i the a*die 'e said.erso si !*"ar .e (e'ome the 8o""owers o8 some(od+/ O o e o''asio . that +o* are ot a 8ree ma / There is o eed 8or me to 8ree +o* or e "i!hte +o* (e'a*se to do that I m*st ha."ete"+ wi."e too/ There the .e" aro* d the wor"d there are . There is a !a."a'e re'e t"+ i Ba !a"ore/ The+ are a"" m+ 8rie ds/ I do 9t ha.ro o* to di88ere tiate it 8rom the se'o d ..that I 'a he".ite a"" the thi !s that were e@.erati ! i e@a't"+ the same wa+/ The who"e thi ! is re!istered as dots a d the . a d that other thi ! is 'om. +o* ha.er+thi !.i ! or!a ism/ 01 So.t +o*r stateme t o8 9des. a d that e.e a ima!e o8 m+se"8 a d i re"atio shi.e ed re!ard"ess o8 what +o* did.erso si !*"ar .t the me'ha i'a" 8* 'tio i ! o8 this "i.ie i d*str+/ The so* d is i etee a d a ha"8 8rames (ehi d the 'orres. des.eat somethi ! whi'h is ot theirs.s+'he thereB there is o 9I9 there/ The o "+ 9I9 that I 'a 8i d there is the 8irst ..owi ! that +o* are ot a e "i!hte ed ma . (e'a*se there is o 'e ter thereB there is o .eheme 'e that whate. tho*!ht is . the+ ha. to that I 'a ha.i't*res are ta-e i 8rames/ There is a i""*sio that there is some(od+ who is "oo-i ! at the thi !s/ A't*a""+ there is o(od+ who is "oo-i ! at the thi !s/ It ma+ so* d . des.erso si !*"ar . o8 +o*rse"8F A1 3o wa+.t what +o* are sa+i !.ro("em is .ite m+ 'o ta'ts with .erso a" 'o .i't*re to!ether/ A1 The (rai is o.i't*re 8rame.ersatio s with him. a d what we m*st (e/ 01 As +o* tra.er is there7 withi its 8ramewor-..e ed to +o* has ha. whe I asserted with !reat .e o wa+ o8 .er has ha.ite e.i't*re +o* ta-e a d the so* d 00 i etee a d a ha"8 8rames/ I e@a't"+ the same wa+.e o se se o8 ide tit+..er rea""+ there/ It is C*st a 'o""e'tio o8 dots/ It re:*ired the (rai to .eo.e a ima!e o8 +o*/ So the ima!es we ha.er+ s"ow/ B+ the time it 'omes a d 'a. what we sho*"d (e./ >rish am*rti a d m+ .isio / It mi!ht (e a !ood e@am.o di ! .eo.*t the . what we o*!ht to (e.ite m+ . 7We 'a ot a''e. +o*r e+es ha.es that the+ are ot 8o""owi ! me/ The mome t the+ re. ame"+."e !ather aro* d +o*. .The so* d is somethi ! "i-e what the+ do i the mo."es or 8o""owers/ I te"" them that the+ are m+ 8o""owers (e'a*se the+ are re.er+ sim.ro o* / That is a""/ B*t there is othi ! there whi'h +o* 'a sa+ is 9me9/ That is the reaso wh+ I 'a ot te"" m+se"8 that I am a 8ree ma .e there are re"ated to what we wo*"d "i-e to (e.eati ! whate.i't*re is e.er+ stra !e to +o* whe I sa+ that there is o(od+ who is ta"-i !/ Yo* are the o e that is ma-i ! me ta"-B there is o(od+ here D.

e that we ha. a d the o "+ wa+ +o* 'a mai tai that 'e ter is thro*!h the re. +o* do 9t e@ist.eme t that is !oi ! o there/ 01 So.e .ath that has ta-e him to where.er+o e has a "i8e0. re.er he o*!ht to (e/ Yo* a"so ha.o".art i m+ "i8e/ That wo*"d (e somethi ! 8a"se.e o8 me/ I do 9t .i.ed here is o "+ a re8"e'tio o8 whate.ed i what is !oi ! o there i +o*/ What is i .ath/ E. what I !et 8rom what +o* sa+ is that it is a matter o8 "i.ath a d o*t o8 that 'omes whate. whate.ow"ed!e that it is 9me9 is ot somethi ! e"se/ Yo* ha.e a ima!e o8 m+se"8 here/ So.er +o* see here D. we 'a ot "ose 8aith i +o*/7 I to"d him that that is the o e thi ! that is sta di ! there i him whi'h ma-es it im.a t.er+ i di.irre"e.a" de.erie 'es o8 others/ A8ter a"".e (ee 'reated (+ the tota"it+ o8 those e@.ath that has !otte +o* to where +o* are/ A1 B*t I 'a ot s*!!est a +thi ! that did ot . 'a ot "i."a'i ! o e thi ! with a other/ 01 .e to mai tai that 'e ter a"" the time.es +o* the 8ee"i ! a d a"so .eati ! the same o"d e@.roCe'tio o8 the ."a'ed o e thi ! with a other/ That is a"" that we 'a do/ O e i""*sio is re.that it is .o".id*a" 'a ot e@. (e'a*se he has re.er he is tr+i ! to 8ree himse"8 8rom. a d that there is o . 8a"si8+i ! the thi ! +o* see/ 01 Wh+ sho*"d +o* ot sa+ that ea'h o8 *s has a i di.erie 'es o. a d +et ima!i i ! that o e da+ +o* are !oi ! to 8* 'tio 8rom mome t to mome t/ It is this ho.ress itse"8 (e'a*se o8 the stra !"eho"d o8 the e@. the (od+ is 8* 'tio i ! 8rom mome t to mome t/ A1 The o e that is i terested i "i.er that isF A1 The * i:*e ess o8 e.i ! 8rom mome t to mome t.etiti.es i a sit*atio where we thi .e to *se them i order to 8* 'tio sa e"+ a d i te""i!e t"+ i this wor"d/ 01 So +o* are 'reati ! me owF A1 Yo* are 'reati ! me/ 01 Yo* are 'reati ! me owF A1 3o/ I am ot 'reati ! +o* (e'a*se I do 9t ha.er a d o.oi ti ! to himse"8E is +o*r ow 'reatio a d the . a d I do 9t e@ist/ Yo* a d I ha."a'e o*rse".er+ mis"eadi !/ We .art o8 that mo./ >rish am*rti mai tai ed that there is o a*thorit+.e a "i8e0 .e 8rom mome t to mome t/ B*t it is the (od+ that is 8* 'tio i ! 8rom mome t to mome t/ 01 O/>/."a'ed (+ a other tea'her/ There is o wa+ +o* 'a 8* 'tio witho*t re.e "ost 8aith i them a"".eated e@.ossi("e 8or *s to "i."a+ a ."a'ed (+ a other i""*sio a d o e tea'her is re.e that wa+ (e'a*se its s*r.ow"ed!e +o* ha.er is there i 8ro t o8 me o the reti a/ B*t the tra s"atio o8 it is a(se t (e'a*se it is . we "ose the o "+ ho.e that !i.i ! ea'h mome t as it 'omes/ A1 S*'h stateme ts are .ow i8 +o* !et what I am tr+i ! to sa+/ I am ot i .ossi("e 8or him to 8ree himse"8 8rom whate.erie 'es.o re.ro'ess.e i +o*/ We sti"" 8ee" that a"tho*!h we ha.e ds *. o tea'her. a d we ha.erie 'es/ The 'o ti *it+ o8 the .er a!ai .id*a" a d * i:*e "i8e0. whi'h is the mi d D:*ote a d * :*oteE.

ossi("e/ A m*si'ia thi -s that he is a(sor(ed i what he is doi !/ It is dema di ! +o*r tota" atte tio to e@. im.er +o* are doi !..e made that i to a e@traordi ar+ e@. a d there is o wa+ +o* 'a "i . (e'a*se we ha.that +o* are a(sor(ed i it/ 01 B*t +o* are ot thi -i ! a(o*t it.erie 'es a8ter the+ ha. 8or there is o i ter..o8 the .erie 'e a 8ee"i ! witho*t tra s"ati ! that withi the 8ramewor. a d whe two thi !s are ot there it is a "ot easier 8or +o* to e@. a d i that se se we are "i.a"/ 01 3o/ Tho*!ht is .or ot. whether +o* ame that as a haw. a 8ee"i ! o8 (ei ! here/ A1 Fee"i ! is a"so tho*!ht/ We wa t to 8ee" that 8ee"i !s are more im.erie 'i ! a thi ! +o* are ot aware o8 the e@.t that stateme t. to!ether a d 'reate a 'o ti *it+ there/ So.es i it.e (ee made to (e"ie.erie 'i ! str*'t*re o 'e a d 8or a""/ It wo*"d (e somethi ! o8 a earth:*a-e hitti ! this .eme t i whate.ows/ A shi8ti ! o8 thi !s wo*"d ha.e / The I re8"e't o them/ Whe I "oo.eo. it is 8i ished o 'e a d 8or a""."a'e. a d what ha.e 8o* d a ew sort o8 e:*i"i(ri*m/ 01 Wh+ are we here as h*ma (ei !s "i.ow"ed!e that te""s +o* that +o* are here. a d a"" that -i d o8 st*88/ Thro*!h these !immi'-s it .er+ m*'h there/ B*t +o* ha.e. I saw a haw-A7 B*t at the mome t whe I see it I am ot thi -i ! a(o*t it/ A1 Yo* see. that whi"e +o* are e@.i ! i the mome t/ A1 It is ot 'orre't to sa+ that.er+ m*'h there/ I .ow a "ot o8 .i ! 8rom mome t to mome t is e.e ted the idea" o8 "i.some sort o8 e@.i ! ri!ht owF A1 Wh+ do we as. i the s-+ a d see a haw. a d therea8ter the or!a ism 8* 'tio s i a .er+ orma" a d at*ra" wa+/ It wo*"d ha..e s the o(od+ .i ! 8rom mome t to mome t.er +o* are doi ! is a sort o8 9hi!h9/ It is a e@. that I am here/ 01 I ha. (*t there is o wa+ +o* 'a e@. the stateme ts that whe +o* are e@.ed with o*r a'ti.that :*estio 7Wh+ are we hereF7 What is it that te""s +o* that +o* are hereF Are +o* there owF It is the .o".erie 'e whi'h +o* wa t to .e s. it wo*"d ha.ress whate. that there were mome ts whe the 9I9 was ot there/ B*t whe o 'e s*'h a thi ! rea""+ ha.8"+i ! a'ross the s-+. a d +o* . I see the haw.erie 'e is !o e are hi!h"+ :*estio a("e/ I8 that were so. o0mi d.e shattered the who"e e@.e some aware ess o8 (ei ! here.a d a8terwards I re8"e't o it.a(o*t e@. it has i .erie 'e a d that +o* (e'ome aware or 'o s'io*s o8 it o "+ a8ter the e@.ows it 'a mai tai its ow 'o ti *it+/ 01 Sometimes we are so i .ress it e88e'ti."a'e. a d +o*r wa ti ! to (e "i-e that a"wa+s is o e thi ! that is ot .those mome ts *.e"+ tha whe +o* are thi -i ! a(o*t it/ 01 I rea""+ thi .erie 'e that +o* are "i.o".*."ies that +o* were .it+ that we "ose o*rse".i ! 8rom mome t to mome t/ B*t the ."e who te"" me that the+ were i a tho*!ht"ess state."a'e o a hi!her "e.ossi(i"it+ o8 a't*a""+ "i.e ta-e . that is ot 'orre't.er there (e'a*se the mi d9s i terest is o "+ to 'o ti *e/ There8ore.orta t tha tho*!hts. 7Oh.e" a d the thi .ro(a("+ a''e. (e'a*se +o*r i .erie 'e.erie 'i ! a thi ! +o* are ot aware o8 it/ The 8a't that +o* re'a"".

.*""/ I said somewhere i the (e!i i ! that +o* are a88e'ti ! e.ed at that as a 'o 'e.er'o"ates to the "e.. te"" +o* that +o* are se.ossi("e 8or *s to se.er+ esse tia" thi ! 8or +o* to s*r. (etwee +o* a d the 'hair is the se se o8 to*'h/ The se se o8 to*'h does ot.arate o*rse"..ed i this re"atio shi. there is o s*'h thi ! as time. howe.7 7Yo* are sitti ! o the 'hair/7 B*t the 8a't is that the se satio that is i .e i this wor"d/ B*t the 8a't that there is s*'h a thi ! as s.hrases at me 00 that there is o o(ser..h+si'ists te"" *s that it is a"" 'o e'ted a d we are a"" .ow"ed!e +o* ha.h+si'ia s i I dia/ The+ arri.a'e/ B*t s*.art o8 the a'ti.a'e/ S.eo.erie 'ed (+ +o* (e'a*se it is o e * itar+ mo.e them a hard time a d tr+ to ma-e them rea"i?e the im.i ess.erse/ A1 B*t the+ ha.o8 the .arate the two a d sa+ that this is the res.ro.i ess/ What I am tr+i ! to sa+ is that it is the .er is the o(ser.es 8rom the rest o8 the thi !s that are o*t there/ Yo* are ot di88ere t 8rom the 'hair that +o* are sitti ! o / B*t what se. 9aware ess9 is ot C*st the ri!ht -i d o8 word to *se/ It is im.er+thi ! there a d e.e" o8 o*r da+0to0da+ e@iste 'e.it+ o8 this h*ma or!a ism/ This a'ti.e a(o*t +o*rse"8 whi'h has 'reated the se"8 there a d he".eati ! a memori?ed stateme t/ Pro(a("+ +o* wi"" !i.i! a d the do!/ The 'at C*st "oo-s at +o*."e aro* d *s. a d is i a state o8 'hoi'e"ess aware ess/ To t*r that aware ess i to a i str*me t whi'h +o* 'a *se to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e is to 8a"si8+ that/ Aware ess is a i te!ra" .ed 00 I !i.eme t/ The mome t +o* se.o se to that stim*"*s/ 01 The :*a t*m .i ! or!a ism/ A d so.*"" o8 the (od+.e/ Ta-e 8or e@am..o".e s to +o*r re"atio shi.o se to that.it+ o8 the "i.e ."e throw these -i ds o8 . a d the other state. i stead o8 admitti ! that he did somethi ! wro !/ Sometimes +o* sa+.i ess/ B*t +o* 'a..eratio a d to"d +o*rse"8 that this is the res."es. it is .er+ di88ere t/ I8 +o* te"" +o*rse"8 that the o(ser.E what ha.h+si'ia s.art o8 the * i.er (e e@. +o* ha.ow"ed!e that +o* ha.eo. with +o*r wi8eF7 Whe ."i'atio s o8 what the+ are sa+i !/ It is .ow"ed!e +o* ha.osi ! it is a 8a't i +o*r "i8e that there is o s. a d there is o s*'h thi ! as matter/ I said. DI a"wa+s !i.a'e.arate 8rom this 'hair i whi'h +o* are sitti !/ I am ot tr+i ! to sa+ that +o* are the 'hair/ That is too a(s*rd/ A't*a""+ what ma-es +o* 8ee" that the (od+ is there is the !ra.itatio a" . the meta.e arri.ed at that 8a't a d said that there is o s*'h thi ! as s.i. a d e.+/ Yo* do 9t e.e me a e:*atio to .a'e.er is the .e o8 that 00 7This is a 'hair.t/ So did the meta.t*re that se satio withi the 8ramewor.a'e 'a e.a'e is a . the hea.it+ is ot o "+ s.e'i8i'a""+ i the h*ma or!a ism (*t i a"" 8orms o8 "i8e 00 the .ow that the se satio that is there is ha.e o8 what +o* 'a"" a state o8 ha."e that +o* te"" +o*rse"8 that +o* are ha.ow"ed!e +o* ha. a d o8 o*r re"atio shi.er+(od+ *ses it to C*sti8+ some o8 his a'tio s. 7Yo* are re. with the . that o8 * ha.i ess o8 the (od+/ Yo* 8ee" the e@iste 'e o8 the (od+ (e'a*se o8 the !ra.ow"ed!e that +o* ha.er+thi ! that is there is a88e'ti ! +o*/ The 8a't o8 this stateme t is somethi ! whi'h 'a ot (e e@. 7I was ot aware o8 what was !oi ! o there/7 B*t aware ess is a i te!ra" .e a"read+ (ro*!ht the .e 'r*de e@am.erie 'e +o*rse"8 as a e tit+ there/ I am ot .arates +o* 8rom the 'hair is the .er.erie 'ed (+ +o*/ A s'ie tist 'ame to see me a d made this stateme t that there is o s*'h thi ! as s.art o8 the a'ti.e o8 the thi !s i to o. a d the s'ie tists to dis'*ss these thi !s/ B*t whe it . or that the o(ser.e that there is o s*'h thi ! as s.er.s +o* to e@..er+ i teresti ! 8or the theo"o!ia s.arti'*"ar"+ 8o d o8 the word 9aware ess9/ It is mis*sed/ It is a r*((ed 'oi .itatio a" .

i't*re there.*ter D.er is rea""+ the o(ser.e 'reated me/ Yo* ha.e a swers/ A1 Otherwise how 'a there (e :*estio sF Yo* are ot s*re that the+ are the a swers/ 01 We"".ow what wi"" ha.erati ! the 'om.er 'omes o*t o8 me is +o*rs/ What +o* 'a"" the .erso mi!ht as-/ A1 ////8or whi'h the+ a"read+ ha..a 'e to the wa+ we are 8* 'tio i !/ 01 Are +o* C*st a a*tomato F A1 Oh.er+ o e o8 *s to "i. it is si"e t/ So +o* are o.s wi"" (e 8i ished/ 01 So we are C*st a*tomata//// A1 A*tomati'a""+ re.e the a swers/ B*t the+ are ot s*re that the+ are the a swers/ A d the+ do 9t ha.*ter D. a d a.edF A1 That is the e d o8 a"" re"atio shi.eati ! words a d .e to do a thi !/ <*"t*re dema ds that +o* sho*"d (e somethi ! other tha what +o* are/ What a treme do*s amo* t o8 e er!+ 00 the wi"". the e88ort 00 we waste tr+i ! to (e'ome thatA I8 that e er!+ is re"eased.e o re"e.e a"" the a swers a d +o* are as-i ! the :*estio s/ 01 I thi .e the a swers.e to (e a i di."e it wo*"d (e 8or e.e !i. as-i ! :*estio s that a + . what wi"" ha.id*a" a d to (e +o*rse"8 +o* do 9t ha. re.e F 01 Is there a sit*atio where the o(ser.e to +o*r wi8e. a d +o* "ose the !*ts to throw awa+ the a swers..o(ser.oi ti ! to his headE has o i 8ormatio o a . I am "i-e e."+ that to a sit*atio where +o* are a(o*t to ma-e "o. I am a a*tomato / There is ot o e tho*!ht whi'h I 'a 'a"" m+ ow / I8 this 'om.erso s that ha.eated ad a*seam/ The+ a't*a""+ do ot .e the !*ts to (r*sh aside the .e i this wor"dA It is so sim./ It9s 8i ished/ To sa+ the o(ser."e/ .ed is a mea i !"ess stateme t.arti'*"ar s*(Ce't.er is the o(ser. o*t the wi dow/ 01 What I !et 8rom this is that +o* ha.er+o e here.ed.ri to*t is +o*rs a d +o* are readi ! somethi ! i it/ 01 So I am the dreamer a d +o* are the dream/ A1 Yo* ha.hrases whi'h are memori?ed/ The+ ha.I a"read+ ha.id*a"/ A1 To (e a i di. a d the o es who ha.oi ti ! to himse"8E/ It is +o*r i terest to 8i d o*t what there is i this 'om.e whe that is the 'ase/ A"" re"atio shi. what is it that we 'a 9t doF How sim.*ter/ A d whate.e !i..e those a swers/ Se time ts 'ome i to .

er I did or did ot do. This is one of the reasons why we find that 1l)heimer"s disease is on the increase.e (ee em. %t was like a jolt of lightning or an earth'uake. e ery cat.itler. That is why % say it is "acausal".er+thi ! I did/ Whate. /////// $e are no different from. This has become possible for me not through any effort or olition of mine. are an expression of that same thing. you are as much an expression of that as any of the claimants to that cosmic power.erie 'e o''*rred to +o*/ Wo*"d +o* des'ri(e thatF A1 I do 9t wa t to !o i to that i !reat detai"/ B*t what I ha. the mos'uito that is sucking your blood.e ed to me ha. and % ha e no way of knowing what % am left with.. you.er has ha.it was i 1)$H. /////// $e ha e put memory and the brain to such a use for which it is not intended.e ed des. nor are we created for any grander purpose than. E ery cell in our body is in ol ed. e ery pig. need the help of somebody as an instrument to express itself and help others3 //////// 01 I thi . the garden slug there. me. e en Genghis .ite e. as it were. e ery cow. $hy should nature or some cosmic power.hasi?i ! "ate"+ is that whate.. and e erybody. /////// % maintain that memory is not located in any particular area of the body. and experienced before was flushed out of my system. if there is one in the world.C(APTE! 7 A olt o8 "ightning $hate er has happened to me has happened despite e erything % did. .han and . felt. it is said that a e@. E erything that e ery man thought. C*st o +o*r G)th (irthda+ whe +o* were "iste i ! to ./ >rish am*rti9s ta"-. E ery dog. /////// %f there is anything like super(consciousness or higher consciousness that people speak of.

a 'o*ra!eo*s thi ! that has ha./ >rish am*rtiF A1 Yo* see. +o* are "e8t with this .e somethi ! to sa+.art to sit o a . a d there was othi ! there to (e rea"i?ed.t it/ Their i terest is to 8i d o*t a 'a*se a d ma-e it ha.e ed to me/ B*t I 'a ot te"" .*t +o*rse"8 i to that -i d o8 sit*atio / It is ."e to * dersta d/ 01 B+ 9a'a*sa"9 +o* mea that it ha. whe o 'e it daw s o +o* that this is ot the i str*me t.to 1)$H.h+si'a" eeds o8 the (od+.ossi("e 8or me thro*!h a + e88ort or .e ed to +o* whe +o* were "iste i ! to .er+ di88i'*"t to te"" .. to *se m+ 8a. or e.erie 'ed (e8ore is throw o*t o8 m+ s+stem/ So.eared. it wo*"d (e hi!h"+ .a d whate.e ed to +o*/ Has a +thi ! ha. a d "oo.. a d e@. (e'a*se their o "+ i terest is to 8i d o*t the 'a*se.e 8rom the .ossi("e at a + "e. a d othi ! to (e 8o* d there/ The .e ts .e ed/ I this 'o te@t.e 'ome i to somethi ! e@traordi ar+ whi'h o(od+ has 'ome i to/ B*t what I am "e8t with is somethi ! e@traordi ar+ 00 e@traordi ar+ ot i the se se that it has (ee . 8i d o*t what "ed me i to this/ B*t whe I te"" them that it is a'a*sa".e ds *."e that I ha. what ha.e ed to me. that this i str*me t has ot he".7 a d +o* do 9t . whe I was "iste i ! to him it s*dde "+ daw ed o me. tra s8ormatio .oi t ow a d te"" m+se"8 that this is me.er+ dema d to (e 8ree 8rom a +thi !. that I ha.er+ ma tho*!ht. (e'a*se this is ot i the 8ie"d o8 'a*se a d e88e't re"atio shi. 6od0 rea"i?atio .eo.ow what +o* are "e8t with/ Yo* ha.e"/ The o "+ i str*me t we ha.er+ di88i'*"t 8or them to * dersta d a d a''e. +o* 'a sa+ that it is.."at8orm or a''e.a d tr+ to 8i d o*t the 'a*se o8 whate.tio I 8ee" that I am i the same state as that ma /7 I said to m+se"8 that I was i the same state as that ma .er 'omes o*t o8 me ow de.er+ di88i'*"t 8or me to 8i@ a .e a't*a""+ a d 8a't*a""+ othi ! to 'omm* i'ate. C*st disa.a t/ It is .o what +o* draw o*t o8 me/ I ha.e e "i!hte me t 00 were a"" 8a"se.t i . it is .e ed witho*t a + .. a d I was "e8t with othi !/ There8ore.er e...hasi?i ! a"" the time that it is a'a*sa"/ That is ."e that thro*!h 'o*ra!e +o* 'a ."e how it a"" ha.eo.re.aratio F A1 That is what I am sa+i !/ It is somethi ! "i-e. a d that there is o other i str*me t with whi'h to * dersta d a +thi !..t*o*s o m+ .itatio s "i-e this a d tr+ to te"" .e ed to me at a""F B*t o e thi ! I 'a sa+ with 'ertai t+ is that the . 7"i!ht i ! hitti ! +o*.er+thi ! that e.er has ha.e o wa+ o8 8i di ! o*t 8or +o*rse"8 a d (+ +o*rse"8 what has ha..eo. 7Wh+ the he"" ha.. (e'a*se there is o 'omm* i'atio .ie'es/ The !oa"s that I had set 8or m+se"8 00 se"80rea"i?atio . whate.e I (ee "iste i ! to this ma F From his des'ri.res*m.. e. !oi ! (a'.er+ di88i'*"t 8or . i deed.e ed to me.a(o*t o e9s rea"i?atio i terms o8 whe a d what ha.*??"i ! sit*atio that there is othi ! to * dersta d/ I a wa+.eo.e to them/ 01 I thi .it is *se8*" sometimes to ta". radi'a" or otherwise. 8e"t.orite . ass*mi ! 8or the mome t that he was i the ..ed *s to * dersta d a +thi !/ So./ That is wh+ I am em. i a wa+.ow.(a'.hrases. a Co"t o8 "i!ht i ! hitti ! +o*.ed that "ed me i to this D at*ra" stateE are tota""+ irre"e.erem.o"itio o8 mi e.e ed to me/ The+ are o "+ i terested i 8i di ! o*t how it ha."e (e"ie.eo.er+ thi ! that I sear'hed 8or a"" m+ "i8e was shattered to . (*t i the se se that e.hasi?i ! a d o.e is the i te""e't/ We .

"i-e i a whir". it is somethi ! whi'h is ot .er+ o8te hear o the 'ommer'ia"s/ It is ot somethi ! "i-e 7(e8ore a d a8ter the wash7B o washi ! has he".e to *se the word 9ha.*t.tio s o8 . a d that is a"" there is to it/ So this :*estio we t o a d o / B*t s*dde "+ this :*estio a"so disa.same state that he was des'ri(i ! a d i the same state that the !reat s.er8e't h*ma (ei !s/ 01 So. is at*ra""+ 'o"ored (+ where we sta d toda+/ A +thi ! we e@.erie 'e at a"".es that the i 8"*e 'e o8 e . whe he made the stateme t that (irth is a tra*mati' e@.ort !e eti' e !i eeri !F .erie 'e has o re"e. a d C*st 8i!*ri ! it o*t as to how it a"" wor-s.er has ha.erie 'e what it was "i-e whe we were a ew(or (a(+ or a i 8a t.iro me t.er+ "imited o *s/ DI mai tai that I am ot a a*thorit+ o s*'h thi !s/E B*t the e@.irit*a" tea'hers were i / 7What the he"" ha.erie 'i ! str*'t*re there at a""/ A't*a""+ it is .es at the (ase o8 +o*r head the+ wi"" ma-e +o* !o thro*!h the e@. the o "+ wa+ we 'a do it is ot (+ 'ha !i ! the e ."a'e i me/ So.e a 8ee" o8 this to a +(od+ e"se/ 01 It is a"" "i-e a i 8a t C*st 'omi ! i to the wor"d witho*t a + memor+ or tho*!ht. as it were.s+'ho"o!ists.erie 'e them. (e'a*se there is o other wa+ that I 'a 'omm* i'ate this a d !i. a"tho*!h we 'a"" it re(irthi ! or tr+i ! to e@.ow i .erie 'e o8 +o*r ow (irth/ I ha.er+thi ! is !e eti'a""+ 'o tro""ed/ I8 we rea""+ wa t to 'ha !e i di."e/ The+ wa t to ."e to i d*"!e i that -i d o8 8a tas+/ Yo* . a d I te"" them that I m+se"8 do ot .at m+se"8 a d te"" m+se"8 that I am a e "i!hte ed ma .e I (ee doi ! a"" m+ "i8eF Wh+ the he"" am I sitti ! here "iste i ! to himF7 I the wa"-ed o*t with C*st o e si !"e tho*!ht whir"i ! i me..ow.erie 'e/ I do 9t thi ..hrase whi'h we .erie 'i ! str*'t*re i (a(ies 'omes i to o.erie 'e i ew(or 'hi"dre ..eo.ow that +o* are i the same stateF7 I * dersta d that the :*estio im. a +thi ! we e@.ress m+ tha -s to a +(od+/ Whate.e ed to me has ha.erie 'e is o "+ 8rom where we sta d toda+/ A d where we sta d toda+ is the . tr+i ! to see the wor"d 8or the 8irst time.erie 'e. or doi ! this. (*t (+ tr+i ! to * dersta d what rea""+ is the . to e@..a.ressio / E.erie 'i ! str*'t*re is tota""+ a(se t at the time o8 o*r (irth/ A d I a"wa+s :*estio ed the .oo"/ 7How do +o* .e some te'h i:*es i whi'h (+ ma i.e i !9.erie 'i ! it/ Wi"" that (e simi"ar to what +o* are ta"-i ! a(o*tF A1 3o/ It is ot 'orre't to sa+ that there is a + -i d o8 e@.art that !e es .."e who ta".that it is a tra*mati' e@. (e'a*se we ha. es..er+ i teresti ! to .id*a"s. C*st e@.e o wa+ o8 !oi ! thro*!h that a"" o. I *se this .e'ia""+ Fre*d.erie 'i ! str*'t*re is !e eti' i its ori!i a d i its e@.e i !/ I sti"" ha.e ed des.o8 re(irthi !/ It has (e'ome 8ashio a("e 8or .iro me t is .rod*'t o8 e@.eared/ I said to m+se"8 that there is o reaso 8or me to 8ee" !rate8*" to a +(od+.*"ati ! 'ertai er. ot thro*!h 'ha !i ! the '*"t*ra" i .ario*s states/ I had tried to sim*"ate them i me a d e@. that I am a 8ree ma . +o* wo*"d s*.ite "iste i ! to this tea'her or that tea'her.erie 'es o8 a"" -i ds/ So."ies that I was 8ami"iar with the des'ri."a+ i *s/ Ma+(e thro*!h some -i d o8 !e eti' e !i eeri ! we 'a 'reate . or the other/ B*t i8 I sa+ a"" this.ow/ I 'a ot "oo.e ta-e . that. that treme do*s 'ha !es ha.eo.eo.er+ di88i'*"t to sa+ as to whe the e@. (e'a*se there is o e@. o mea i ! to what I am tr+i ! to sa+/ There are ma + .ed me to rea'h a +where/ It is C*st a ha.a the+ ha.a 'e.e a"wa+s mai tai ed that the e@.eratio / I am o e o8 those who (e"ie.er a!ai / A +thi ! we sim*"ate a d tr+ to e@.

or whate.arti'*"ar area o8 the (od+/ E.e ed to +o*F 4o +o* ha. to 8ree them 8rom some -i d o8 (e"ie8 we ha.er8e't these e !i eeri ! te'h i:*es.ro'ess/ B*t it is a "ot easier a d 8aster 8or *s to *se these te'h i:*es o8 !e eti' e !i eeri ! to 'ha !e i di.i. I do ot/ I am at the same time 'o s'io*s o8 the 8a't that it is a .er +o* wa t to 'a"" it/ There is o other wa+/ I .id*a"s tha it is .eo.e i the wor"d 'rated (+ o*r so'iet+.e to 8a'e toda+ is di88ere t/ We ha.*r.e i !/ B*t the .e to (rai wash them a"" o.o".ossi("e otherwise/ 01 Yo* . to ma-e .i. so'iet+.eo. or whate."e (e"ie.er +o* wa t to 'a"" it.i.oses 8or whi'h it is ot i te ded/ A8ter a"".ow re'e t"+ there was a"so a re.e ed to him/ I do 9t .e i a .e (ee *si ! o*r memor+ a "ot/ I a"wa+s mai tai D+o* ma+ :*estio this.e "ost their memories/ We ha.e .er +o* wa t to 'a"" it."e who ha.er+ 'e"" i o*r (od+ is i .ro("em there/ 01 Yo* me tio ed a(o*t the mis*se o8 the (rai / A1 Mis*si ! memor+/ Usi ! memor+ 8or .ro'ess/ It is the same thi ! that has ha. we wi"" ha d them o.*t memor+ a d o*r (rai to s*'h *se 8or whi'h the+ are ot i te ded/ This is o e o8 the reaso s wh+ we 8i d that A"?heimer9s disease.ro("em o8 memor+ wi"" ha."a+s a . we were s. or whate.e a memor+F A1 I do 9t wa t to sa+ a +thi ! a(o*t >rish am*rti/ I do 9t ha."e are a88e'ted (+ the .e o memor+ o8 this .er+ e@traordi ar+ a8ter this ha.eo. as we are a't*a""+ ro(ots.er to the state/ Therea8ter it wi"" (e a "ot easier 8or the state to ma i.ro("em o8 .erse"+.eo.*"ate i di.ow that it is a e@te sio o8 the same s*r.ea-i ! a(o*t . is o the i 'rease/ The other da+ I heard that o e i two o8 those i the ei!ht+0+ear0o"d (ra'-et are a88e'ted (+ it/ Yo* .a" me'ha ism/ 3o do*(t it is/ 01 Whe +o* (*r +o*r 8i !er +o* withdraw it at o 'e/ A1 A*tomati'a""+/ There +o* do 9t ha..e i this wor"d whi'h we ha.e to *se +o*r memor+/ That is the wa+ this h*ma (od+ is 8* 'tio i !/ B*t to s*r.A1 3o.er a!ai / It is a ."e 00 to ma-e .e i 6od. o*r wor"d o8 '*"t*re.e to 'ome o*t with a swers to :*estio s "i-e what the e*ro s are/ I mai tai that memor+ is ot "o'ated i a + .erts i the 8ie"d o8 (rai ."e do thi !s whi'h the+ are * wi""i ! to do/ Us*a""+ it ta-es a "ot o8 time a d a "ot o8 (rai washi ! to tea'h somethi ! to . what are +o*F Yo* are a memor+/ We ha.ort o8 the same disease i E !"a d/ Si@ h* dred tho*sa d ."e (e"ie.e to a''e.eo.e to *se memor+ i order to s*r./ >rish am*rti/ He '"aims to ha.ro("em whi'h we ha.ed/ A d m+ 8ee"i ! is that we ha.oi t i the histor+ o8 ma -i d where we ha.id*a"s a d t*r them i to mere ro(ots/ DI am ot a!ai st ro(ots. whether we "i-e it or ot/E The state wi"" ma-e .arti'*"ar . the 'o sta t *se o8 memor+ is esse tia"/ The who"e o8 o*r .er+ da !ero*s thi ! that we are i d*"!i ! i / Whe o 'e we .ow +et/ O e o8 these da+s the e@. '*"t*re.eo.erts who are dea"i ! with this ..e to 'o 8ro t the .o"iti'a" ideo"o!+/ <o .e 'reated.er+ mi or ro"e i the 8* 'tio i ! o8 the (od+/ It is ot a 'reator at a""/ It is C*st a rea'tor/ What this memor+ is we rea""+ do 9t .er+ e"a(orate a d "o ! . a d the e@.e 'ome to a .t what I am tr+i ! to sa+E that the (rai .ow.e a + idea o8 what ha..h+sio"o!+ ma+ :*estio itB (*t o e o8 these da+s the+ wi"" ha.ow what he mea t whe he said this/ A't*a""+ +o*r memor+ (e'omes .

"a'e.erie 'e does ot e@ist/ It ma+ so* d as a ."ies that o*r 'ode o8 e "i!hte me t."e o a assem("+ "i e/ Yo* .er8e't s.erie 'ed (e8ore.e 'reated/ That .e ot e@. i8 I ma+ *se that word. that im.. i8 there is somethi ! rea""+ ew.rides itse"8 as a "a d o8 s. it is . howe.eo.er +o* are seei ! i to the 8ramewor.e a 'o* tr+ "i-e I dia.er+ do!mati' assertio o m+ . it is ot i . whi'h .ast is destro+ed i o e !reat (i! ("ow/ 01 I e88e't what +o* are sa+i ! is that we 'a ot e@. whate. a d is th*s mai tai i ! its 'o ti *it+/ So.tho*!ht is ma-i ! what it 'a""s ew . (e'a*se it is ot i the area o8 e@.o8 the .er +o* 'a ot e@. B*ddha a d a"" the !reat tea'hers/ E.es*s mi!ht (e a e@am.erie 'e somethi ! that +o* ha. the who"e mo. e.o si("e 8or that/ B*t a't*a""+ a e "i!hte ed ma or a 8ree ma .erie 'e a +thi ! ew/ A1 Yes/ Yo* ma+ ot a!ree with me. that he is a e "i!hte ed ma / It is ot somethi ! that 'a (e shared with some(od+.ow. (*t whe +o* tr+ to e@.at histor+.es*s.e"o.er8e't ma is (or o*t o8 the .ossi("e 8or *s to .oi t whi'h I am tr+i ! to ma-e/ U 8ort* ate"+."a'ed (e8ore itse"8 the mode" o8 a .ose +o* !o to a ew . i8 there is s*'h a thi !.erie 'e/ There is othi ! ew at a""/ It is the o"d that te""s *s that it is ew.. it is the o"d that is te""i ! +o* that it is ew/ So.atter s o8 the !reat tea'hers o8 ma -i d/ 01 .eo.er+ 8ew e "i!hte ed ..er+ o e o8 *s is * i:*e.hasi?e/ It is C*st ot .art o8 the o"d. C*m.er8e't (ei !/ Its i terest is to 'reate o "+ a . a d (r*sh this aside as a(s*rd a d o se se/ B*t there is o s*'h thi ! as a ew e@.erie 'e a +thi ! ew (e'a*se. a d thro*!h this !immi'. a d the+ are i t*r o*t to e "i!hte e. is that +o* are a"wa+s tr+i ! to 8it whate. we ha. a d s-i.ast/ The mome t +o* sa+ that somethi ! is ew.er+ h*ma (od+.eme t o8 the e@. (*t the tota"it+ o8 the .er.ed*'atio is (*i"t o the 8o* datio o8 how to de.rod*'e e "i!hte ed ."e o8//// A1 .erie 'i ! str*'t*re 'omes to a e d/ ."a'e/ What !oes o i +o*r mi d.irit*a"it+. o*r memor+/ I am a8raid that I am !oi ! o88 o a ta !e t/ 01 Yes/ A1 I *s*a""+ ho.e ma + '"aima ts who sa+ that the+ are e "i!hte ed. is ot i terested i 8reei ! or e "i!hte i ! a +(od+/ This is (e'a*se he has o wa+ o8 ."e/ Yo* 'a 'o* t them o +o*r 8i !ers/ B*t * 8ort* ate"+. is * i:*e/ 3at*re is ot i terested i 'reati ! a ."+ .art. h*ma it+ has .erie 'e/ S*.a"*e s+stem that we ha. i8 there is o e./ Let me tr+ to sti'. has .to this .a"*e s+stem is (or o*t o8 the (eha.ior .e'ies/ 01 I8 e.erie 'e at a""/ There is o s*'h thi ! as a ew e@.er+(od+/ There is a mar-et 8or that -i d o8 thi !/ The dema d a d s*.er8e't ma / The idea o8 the . i8 +o* "oo. i the mar-et .er+ di88i'*"t 8or *s to e@.id*a""+ a d * i:*e"+/ A1 E@a't"+/ That is what I am tr+i ! to em.owi ! that he is a 8ree ma . wo*"d a"so (e * i:*e so that ea'h o8 *s rea'hes that state i di.arti'*"ar 8rames that the o"d is destro+ed.rod*'ed o "+ a .ri 'i."e is res.

"e who ha. o8 the mi dF I do 9t see a + s*'h thi ! as mi d there at a"".erie 'e 8rom here/ I said to m+se"8. (*t 'a +o* ta-e itF7 A1 U 8ort* ate"+.roa'h to the who"e :*estio o8 e "i!hte me t was throw o*t o8 m+ s+stem.es 8rom the thi ! 'a""ed 9mi d9 is the mi d/ Mi d is othi ! other tha what +o* are doi ! to 8ree +o*rse"8 8rom the mi d/ B*t whe it o 'e daw s o +o*.01 Ha.hi"oso.i ! read some a''o* ts o8 +o*r . a d there is o wa+ I 'a re"i. de'ided a other .ed me to 8i d o*t the a swers to those :*estio s/ At that time I did 9t ha.ard+.oid/ The+ ta"-ed o8 em.h+ a d s'ie 'e.to the e@.e.erie 'e that +o* had whe +o* we t to see Rama a Maharshi/ Yo* as-ed him.re.e 'reated treme do*s te'h i:*es o8 8reei ! themse". i a wa+.s+'ho"o!+. "et a"o e a tra s8ormatio or m*tatio o8 the mi d/7 This :*estio a"wa+s i tri!*ed me a d I :*estio ed e.irit*a" tea'hers/ What is re. (e'a*se the .er+(od+ a(o*t the mi d/ I tried to !et a swers 8rom e. a d s'ie 'e/ I tried to 8i d o*t a swers 8rom those .e toda+/ The 'ertai t+ I ha.ersio o8 what I a't*a""+ 8e"t at that time/ A +wa+. a d tried to 8i d the a swer to m+ (asi' :*estio / M+ (asi' :*estio was o e :*estio & 7Where is this mi d that we are so 'o 'er ed a(o*t.orted i the so0'a""ed stor+ o8 m+ "i8e is a !ar("ed . it hits +o* "i-e a Co"t o8 "i!ht i !/ . that the i str*me t that +o* are *si ! to * dersta d e.e that e@. (+ some stra !e 'ha 'e or mira'"e.ow the who"e B*ddhist . it is I/7 I said this to m+se"8 a d wa"-ed o*t/ That.e toda+ that there is o mi d is somethi ! whi'h I 'a ot tra smit to a +(od+.e it. a d that there is o other i str*me t.e the 'ertai t+ that I ha.. a +thi ! I sa+ toda+ is irre"e.t that .e it.hi"oso.hi'a" tho*!ht/ The+ ta"-ed o8 the .er+thi ! is ot the i str*me t.er hard I ma+ tr+.e it to meF7 A d he said.eo. a d +o* are ot read+ to a''e. (*t othi ! he". 7I 'a !i. that we are tr+i ! to * dersta d.hase o8 m+ "i8e/ The o"d traditio a" a. a"tho*!h I 'o ti *ed to read (oo-s o re"i!io . a d 'ha !eF Wh+ do we ta"o8 a tota" 'ha !e i the ma-e*.hi"oso. (e'a*se I do 9t . 7Whate.h+ is (*i"t o the 8o* datio o8 that 9 o mi d9/ Yet the+ ha.a(o*t o mi d/ A1 The+ made a treme do*s str*'t*re o*t o8 that .ossi(i"it+/ 01 The B*ddhists a"so ta".ow what I 8e"t at that . .hi"oso. howe.io*s "i8e.es 8rom the mi d/ A"" the Ne te'h i:*es o8 meditatio tr+ to 8ree +o* 8rom the mi d/ The . 'a +o* !i.er+ area o8 h*ma tho*!ht.h+. st*died .er it is +o* ha.a t.e ot (ee 'o tami ated (+ the traditio a" tea'hi !s/ I !ot i terested i Wester .arti'*"ar mome t.er+ i str*me t that we are *si ! to 8ree o*rse".er+ thi ! whi'h we are *si ! to 'omm* i'ate is i Ceo. that is the traditio a" a swer that is dished o*t (+ a"" the s. I !o (a'. 7What is it that he hasF I8 there is a +(od+ i this wor"d who 'a re'ei. st*d+.ti ess/ Yo* .

/////// 1ll experiences. /////// The institution of marriage is not going to disappear as long as we demand relationships. To sur i e and reproduce oneself is the object of the li ing organism. the trump in the pack of cards. except on the le el of 2$hat do % get out of that relationship32 The whole thing springs from the separation and isolation that human beings li e in today. as in the case of other species. howe er extraordinary they may be. you use the last card. and call it lo e.C(APTE! 9 "ove is #nly a Trum: Card $hen e erything fails. /////// The feminist mo ement will not succeed as long as the woman depends upon the man for her sexual needs. /////// %t is just not possible to establish any relationship with anyone around you. /////// E erything that we are confronting today is born out of the religious thinking of man. 1nything that is superimposed on that is totally unrelated to the li ing organism. *ut religion has no answers for the future of mankind. if it is left to itself. 5nmarried couples are more miserable than married couples. *ut we ha e turned sexuality which is biological in its nature into a pleasure mo ement. /////// +exuality. including your near and dear ones. %t will continue in some way or other. ================= . is a simple biological need. are in the area of sensuality.

"e to rea"i?e that a"" the wea.e/ B*t the+ 'o ti *e to e@. i the se se that ma sees that he 'a ot destro+ his ei!h(or witho*t destro+i ! himse"8.ass.ea 'o* tries.oses o8 'omm* i'atio /E U ti" this .e arri.e me'ha ism/ It draws 8ro tiers aro* d itse"8. those who ha."ies to e.ow0how whi'h was (or o*t o8 the i d*stria" re.e t a"" other atio s 8rom "a di ! there/ The Ameri'a s esta("ished these same ri!hts/ It was 6od9s .rote't itse"8/ It is 8or the same reaso that we a"so draw "i es o this .e (*i"t so 8ar are red* da t a d that the+ 'a ot (e *sed a +more/ We ha.arti'*"ar .e"o.rea'hed 8or 'e t*ries.e a d (rotherhood that ha.e (ee .ert+.e toda+ are here o "+ to .e/ Tho*!ht is a .ed 'o* tries/ A1 The di88ere 'e is arti8i'ia""+ 'reated (+ the Wester atio s/ The+ had the ad.ort/ B*t i 1)11 the+ i trod*'ed the e'essit+ to ha. it is 8i ished/ DI am !i. o8 that te'h i'a" .e had the mo o. or 9h*ma 'o s'io*s ess9. wh+ is there so m*'h di88ere 'e amo ! me F I 8i d a 'o tradi'tio (etwee the .er a d where.01 Whe ma is the same e.o8 ed*'atio .it wi"" he".e" o8 h*ma 'o s'io*s ess/ DI do 9t wa t to *se the words 9'o s'io*s ess9.e stateme tE e*ro"o!i'a" .rote't that mo o.ro("emF A"" *to.ed 'o* tries/ For e@am.oi t where +o* 'a ot destro+ +o*r ad."e. "a'. (*t . dr*!s.o s that we ha.eo. I do 9t thi .ed the atio s to de.er+ 'o* tr+/E I8 a +(od+ "a ds a d 'o"o i?es a + .ario*s str*'t*res 'reated (+ h*ma thi -i !/ As I said.er +o* ha."e t+ that he".ort to e ter the U ited States/ I 1)13 the+ i trod*'ed the immi!ratio "aws/ O 'e +o* are there i a .e the .ro("ems are e@a't"+ the same/ A"" the ./ Basi'a""+.e a .a ta!e o8 the te'h i'a" .e (ee ho"di ! o to 8or 'e t*ries/ So how are +o* !oi ! to so". h*ma at*re is e@a't"+ the same whether i I dia or i R*ssia or i Ameri'a or i A8ri'a/ H*ma . a d . there is some sort o8 DI 'a 9t ma-e a de8i iti."eas*re are the iss*es i Ameri'a a d West E*ro."e.earF The+ are ot/ Those who ha. a d it wa ts to .er +o*r ad.ias ha.e"o.e"o. (*t this a. the+ wi"" esta("ish their ri!hts there a d .e 'ome to that .e/ Tho*!ht is destr*'ti.e *. *s to "i."e t+ there/ Yo* .oi t/ Whe e.ow there was a time whe a +(od+ 'o*"d !o to the U ited States witho*t a .o"*tio we t to Ameri'a.ersar+ witho*t destro+i ! +o*rse"8/ So it is that -i d o8 terror.ow0how the+ e@.e to!ether/ B*t this has to . what the+ wo*"d do is a +(od+9s !*ess/ A"" the destr*'ti.e a d those he is 8a'i ! i * derde.e wea.e e tre 'hed themse".o"+ o8 a"" the wor"d9s reso*r'es so 8ar a d 8or so "o !.e toda+ the+ are doi ! that/ The+ do 9t wa t to !i. i8 the+ are threate ed to (e dis"od!ed.*r.ed at a . a d ho"d o to what the+ ha."a'e a d esta("ish +o*rse"8 a d +o*r ri!hts.o"*tio / Whe the re.i ! this as a e@am.er+where./ I am s*re that we ha..rote'ti.ass.ro("ems that ma is 8a'i ! i Ameri'a a d E*ro.o.er'o"ates to the "e. (e'a*se there is o s*'h thi ! as 'o s'io*s ess at a""/ I *se that word o "+ 8or .these 8ro tiers are !oi ! to disa. a d death d*e to ma" *tritio are the iss*es i the * derde.e a ed!e o. 'rime.er'o"ate to the "e."a'e o a + . a d ot the "o.es."a et a d e@te d them as 8ar as we 'a / 4o +o* thi .re.o"+/ B*t I am s*re that the da+ has 'ome 8or . that wi"" he".ro("ems are arti8i'ia""+ 'reated (+ the ..o s that we ha.e 8ai"ed/ . se@. with the he"."oited the reso*r'es o8 6od9s ."oit the reso*r'es o8 the rest o8 the wor"d as we"" as their ow reso*r'es/ E.ersar+ or +o*r ei!h(or.e'ies/ A +thi ! that is (or o*t o8 h*ma thi -i ! is destr*'ti.ro("em i the h*ma (od+/ H*ma thi -i ! is (or o*t o8 this e*ro"o!i'a" de8e't i the h*ma s. +o* wi"" sti"" 'o ti *e to e@er'ise what +o* ha."a et.e" o8 h*ma 'o s'io*s ess.

as some .i.o"*tio does ot mea the e d o8 a +thi !/ It is o "+ a .i. I 8ee" that the o "+ wa+ 8or h*ma it+ to s*r.ed *s at a""/ E.io"e t/ A +thi ! that is (or o*t o8 tho*!ht is destr*'ti.e those who re(e""ed a!ai st re"i!io .a"*e s+stem is the o e that is res. the h*ma tra!ed+. tem.a" o8 a 'e"" de. a d 'a"" it "o.o the s*r.ows i some wa+ that its s*r.e 'ome to a . so "o ! do +o* mai tai that se.i.ow 8*""+ we"" that i8 there is a war toda+ the+ wi"" 8a'e tota" a ihi"atio / There wi"" (e o . is (asi'a""+ .o"iti'a" ideo"o!ies.e ds *."es. or a +thi !/ Its o "+ i terest is to s*r.e th+ ei!h(or as th+se"87 mi""io s a d mi""io s o8 .i. "i-e those i the <omm* ist 'o* tries.i.isio .o8 'ards."a'e o e .ts.e d *. what do we doF Yo* 'a ot do a +thi ! (+ destro+i ! the . a d there is so m*'h . (e'a*se "o. ha. 8or'i ! e. i the . more tha i a"" the re'e t wars .io"e 'e e. terror seems to (e the o "+ wa+/ I am ot ta"-i ! o8 terrorists ("owi ! *.The who"e mis'hie8 ori!i ated i the re"i!io*s thi -i ! o8 ma / 3ow there is o *se i ("ami ! the re"i!io*s thi -i ! o8 ma .e/ A1 3o."e sa+.e re"i!io has 8ai"ed to 8ree ma 8rom .a"/ It .hrases& 7Lo.a" o8 the 'e"" that is e@t to it/ It is 8or this reaso that there is a sort o8 'oo.er+thi ! 8ai"s.eo.er it *. +o* *se the "ast 'ard. ot at a"".o the s*r. what -i d o8 a h*ma (ei ! do +o* wa t o this !"o(eF The h*ma (ei ! mode"ed a8ter the .i.e (ee a''*m*"ated thro*!h 'e t*ries. are the wart+ o*t!rowth o8 the re"i!io*s thi -i ! o8 ma / It is ot so eas+ to 8"*sh o*t the who"e series o8 e@.e th+ ei!h(or as th+se"8/7 4o 9t 8or!et that i the ame o8 7Lo. a d it has ot he". se. with a"" wo der8*" a d roma ti' .eratio (etwee the 'e""s/ That is how the who"e or!a ism 'a s*r.e/ It is ot i terested i *to.er8e't (ei ! has tota""+ 8ai"ed/ The mode" has ot to*'hed a +thi ! there/ Yo*r . ew tho*!hts. 'h*r'hes. *s.e im.a" o8 the 'e"" e@t to it/ A d +o*r s*r. e.i. (eatit*de.es 'reated a other -i d o8 . a d ew (e"ie8s/ As I said (e8ore. a d a"" that -i d o8 thi !. as "o ! as there is a se.er +o* sa+. the tr*m.o the s*r. it is ot a :*estio o8 tr+i ! to 8i d ew 'o 'e.e is to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i the heart 00 a d that is Lo.ossi("+ destro+ +o*rse"8/ That rea"i?atio has to 'ome dow to the "e.e"o.a" a d m+ s*r.er+ 'e"" is i terested i its ow s*r.e/ That is a"" it is i terested i / The s*r.aratio / As "o ! as there is di.a" de.e/ Yo* ma+ 'o. that it is ot the wa+ to so".aratio aro* d +o*/ Whe e.i."a'e o e (e"ie8 with a other (e"ie8.i.e" o8 the 'ommo ma / This is the wa+ the h*ma or!a ism is 8* 'tio i ! too/ E.e died.a" o8 o*r ei!h(or/ 01 Whate.er+where/ Wh+ is it soF Is it (e'a*se that h*ma at*re.e themse".erie 'es whi'h ha.i.a'.ed atio s .*t to!ether/ B*t we ow ha. (e'a*se +o* re.aratio withi +o*.i'tor "e8t a +where/ B*t sti"" there are these s-irmishes here a d there. re.ea'e.a" de.ias/ It is ot i terested i +o*r wo der8*" re"i!io*s ideas/ It is ot i terested i .a"*e s+stem with a other/ E.io"e tF A1 Yes it is/ Be'a*se tho*!ht is .isio .er+(od+ to 8it i to that mode"/ So. a d whi'h are (ased *.a"*e s+stem.io"e 'e a d 8rom te other di88ere t thi !s that it is tr+i ! to 8ree *s 8rom/ Yo* see. o e i""*sio with a other i""*sio / That is a"" we 'a do/ 01 The de.e/ B*t it is ot !oi ! to he"."ies di.e +o*r "e!a" str*'t*res.e h*ma .ro("ems/ So. (*t the terror that i8 +o* tr+ to destro+ +o*r ei!h(or +o* wi"" .eo.o the re"i!io*s thi -i ! o8 ma / There is a te de '+ to re. (e'a*se a"" the .io"e 'e is ot the a swer. ("iss.e ds *."e ha.i.o si("e 8or the h*ma ma"ad+.a"*e s+stem/ So. ew ideas.oi t where we 'a rea"i?e that .

"e there are ..e i 6od too.ow/ Yo* as a "aw+er .eo.ee'h. 8or e@am.ow/ What ha. a sma"" atio F 3o(od+ e.*sh a"" the .es is.atriotism/ Brai washi ! ta-es a 'e t*r+."o+me t tha e. a d so o a d so o / There is o wa+/ The (asi' :*estio that we a"" ha.a!ai st the stat*s :*o/ 01 Ma+ I te"" +o* that there are di88ere t s'hoo"s o8 tho*!ht i the "e!a" 8ie"dF . a d 8reedom o8 the . it is the 8or'e that 'o* ts/ We a"" a!ree to s*(mit o*rse".e to (rai wash them/ Yo* do 9t ha.e to 'reate this ("o'-ade. what -i d o8 a h*ma (ei ! do +o* wa tF The o "+ a swer to this h*ma ."a'e& there is the r*"e o8 "aw.ro'ess/ It is a "ot easier to 'ha !e h*ma (ei !s (+ !i. 8ree mar-et e'o om+. Ias. (*t thro*!h (ri !i ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i the 'hemistr+ o8 the h*ma (od+/ B*t there is a da !er e.ora("e to them/ That the+ e 8or'e o others thro*!h the he".e or .ow how to read the ews. o8 .o the e@. or ew ideo"o!ies. a d she"tered .J (rai washi ! to (e"ie.i ! ma 00 8reedom o8 s.a. toda+ aro* d Ira:F What is the i ter atio a" "aw whi'h these .io"e 'e/ So.that there is 8reedom i the U ited StatesF What does that mea to a star.e i 6od/ B*t with !e eti' e !i eeri !.e there/ Whe o 'e we .er8e't !e eti' e !i eeri ! a d 'ha !e the h*ma (ei !.o"*tio .o8 "aw/ Whe the "aw 8ai"s +o* *se 8or'e/ 4o 9t +o*F 01 Ma+ I ret*r to the :*estio o8 'ertai other i stit*tio s o8 the h*ma (ei !sF A1 Yo* are a "aw+er a d the "aw is there .e ed whe Ameri'a atta'-ed a d o''*.a"*e s+stem/ So."e i to war a d see that the+ 'a -i"" witho*t a se'o d tho*!ht/ Yo* do 9t ha.e to tea'h them "o. 8or e@am.8or o*rse". that eeds a other re. a"" the !a !sters !et to!ether a d 'reate a "e!a" str*'t*re whi'h is 8a.e to as.re.er8e't"+ satis8ied with the 'ha !es ta-i ! .ts. 8reedom o8 worshi. is ot to (e 8o* d thro*!h ew ideas.de'ades to (rai wash their . tho*!h that is ow (ei ! de ied to them i those atio s/ There is more * em.e ds *. 8reedom o8 e@.eo. there is o eed 8or that -i d o8 (rai washi ! .e't 8or h*ma ri!hts."e are ta"-i ! a(o*tF I wa t to .eo.i ! C*st o e i Ce'tio / 01 What is (ei ! said i the Wester wor"d is that .ied 6ra ada.+ a d are .ressF He does ot .er+ ha. +o* ta".er (e8ore i the Wester 'o* tries/ I do 9t thi . res. the o "+ re'o*rse +o* ha."e.ers a d is ot i terested i them/ At "east i the <omm* ist s+stems the+ 8ed.e is to *se ."e.er 'reated a ("o'-ade there/ I am ot im.this is the mode" 8or the who"e o8 ma -i d/ The who"e s+stem de.'e t*ries/ The <omm* ists too. o8 8or'e/ What ri!ht do +o* ha... '"othed.ressio a d s.ro("em."e.eo."oitatio o8 the reso*r'es o8 the wor"d 8or the (e e8it o8 the Wester atio s/ These "aws that +o* are ta"-i ! a(o*t are a"wa+s (a'-ed (+ 8or'e/ Yo* . et'/ A1 4o +o* rea""+ thi . thro*!h the he".es to the de'isio o8 the C*d!e/ I8 +o* do 9t wa t to s*(mit to them.io"e 'e. i8 there is a + a swer.ow as a "aw+er that the de'isio ha ded dow (+ a C*d!e is a"wa+s (a'-ed (+ 8or'e/ U"timate"+.ressed (+ the i ter atio a" "aw a d its "e!a" str*'t*re/ As "o ! as it is ad. ew 'o 'e. there wi"" (e a te de '+ to ha d this te'h o"o!+ o.er o(Ce'ted to itB o(od+ e.er to the state/ It wi"" the (e a "ot easier 8or them to .a ta!eo*s to +o*.ro(a("+ to mai tai the stat*s :*o/ Is it otF So +o* 'a ot ta".ee'h.eo."e ot to (e"ie.a"*atio o8 o*r .

(etwee the two.e 'o ti *it+ to the i stit*tio o8 marria!e/ The .eme tF7 I said.a +/ U married 'o*.eo.ow what a"" the theo"o!ia s i d*"!e i 00 6od is this.o8 the i stit*tio o8 marria!e a d 8ami"+F A1 The i stit*tio o8 marria!e is ot !oi ! to disa.isited Ameri'a I was sho'-i !"+ s*r.o si("e 8or the miser+ o8 ma -i d/ There is o wa+ +o* 'a 'ha !e or modi8+ these i stit*tio s/ It is a "ot easier 8or ..s is& 7What do I !et o*t o8 the re"atio shi.ro("em has a eas+ a d sim. * wed 'o*.A1 That is o "+ a theo"o!i'a" dis'*ssio / Yo* .o si("e 8or a 'ha !e i o*r idea/ B*t that does ot mea that the .ossessi.ro("ems i I dia/ B*t whe I ."e so"*tio / .e ess/ There was a time whe I (e"ie.ossess their dr* -ard h*s(a ds/ The h*s(a d was (eati ! her e.ear o.orta t e"eme t/ The (asis o8 re"atio shi.i(rator 00 that is a di88ere t matter/ B*t i8 +o* wa t a ma to satis8+ +o*r se@*a" eeds. 7I am o +o*r sideB (+ a"" mea s 8i!ht 8or +o*r ri!hts/ B*t remem(er that as "o ! as +o* de."i'ated/ It is ot so eas+ 8or a +(od+ to 'ome *.ed that e'o omi' i de.e de 'e 8or wome wo*"d so".ed/ So it is ot !oi ! to disa.ert+ a d 'hi"dre as a . so "o ! +o* are ot 8ree/ The other wa+ ro* d is a"so tr*e& i8 +o* 'a satis8+ +o*r se@*a" eeds with the he"."e@ a d so 'om.ro("ems/ U married.art 'om.rised that e. 7What do +o* thi .s "ast/ The marria!e i stit*tio wi"" somehow 'o ti *e (e'a*se it is ot C*st the re"atio shi."es are more misera("e tha married 'o*."es/ The a swer is ot so eas+/ As "o ! as we wa t to esta("ish a re"atio shi."es 'ome to see me with their .o8 the 8emi ist mo. (*t .eme t DI am a 'r*de a d (r*ta" ma E 'ame to see me/ She as-ed me.ert+ are i .ro. +o* 'a ot ima!i e their miseries/ A d +et the+ 'a ot . with a swers to the a!e0o"d i stit*tio o8 marria!e/ I 'a te"" +o* o e thi !/ A "ot o8 'o*. so "o ! this i stit*tio wi"" remai / Ma+(e it wi"" (e modi8ied. * wed re"atio s are ot a so"*tio / What other i stit*tio s do +o* ha. it wi"" 'o ti *e i some 8orm or other/ Basi'a""+.. (*t 'hi"dre a d .. +o* are ot 8ree/7 01 Yo* sa+ that the 8ami"+ is ot a so"*tio .ear/ As "o ! as we dema d re"atio shi.or'i ! m+ wi8e or m+ wi8e di.ossessi. the Te"eo"o!i'a" a d the <osmo"o!i'a" ar!*me ts 8or the e@iste 'e o8 6od/ A"" these di88ere t s'hoo"s o8 "aw +o* are re8erri ! to are o di88ere t 8rom the dis'*ssio s o8 the theo"o!ia s/ 01 What do +o* thi . it is a :*estio o8 .rete@t to !i."es. i8 +o* "iste to their stories. 'ha !ed to s*it the 'ha !i ! 'o ditio / A "eader o8 the 8emi ist mo. o8 a . 6od is that.o".er i!ht at a""/ A d we *se .s/ As "o ! as I 'a !et what I wa t the re"atio shi.e those wome who are e'o omi'a""+ i de.e d o a ma 8or +o*r se@*a" eeds.e i mi dF A1 It is these i stit*tio s whi'h are res.or'i ! me at that time/ 3ow it is a "ot easier/ The 'ha !i ! 'o ditio s are res."e i I dia ow to !o 8or a di.e ma + o8 the . a d twi'e o S* da+s/ I .e ess is the most im.ro("em is so 'om.F7 That is the (asis o8 a"" h*ma re"atio shi. the O to"o!i'a".ow ma + 'ases/ I am ot !e era"i?i !.or'e tha it was i ear"ier times/ There was o :*estio o8 me di.er+ da+.e de t wa ted to .ro.s.

"e a d their 'hi"dre / A1 I do ot see a + reaso wh+ a +(od+ sho*"d star.ade I dia..e e"e'ted them to the o88i'eB +o* ha.e ted that wo der8*" thi ! 'a""ed 'harit+/ 3ot o "+ that.o si(i"it+ o8 ea'h i di.e a 3o(e" .7 I am ot i terested i ta"-i !/ I am ot i terested i sa.ower a d ha. I do 9t wa t to ta"-/ I am ot i terested i 'ha !i ! the wor"d/ B*t the+ ha.romised to do 'ertai thi !s/ Yo* ha. (*t +o* !i.er+ we"" throw that same :*estio at me/ B*t I ha.ro. there.id*a" is doi !/ That is the most .es *.ort the ma"e a d 8ema"e re"atio shi."e are a""owed to star. a d I am ot i terested i sa.e/ Re"i!io has i .ri?e to some(od+ (e'a*se o8 the 'harita("e wor.ro.o-e a(o*t the state9s 'o""e'ti ! ta@es a d said that the state sho*"d do e. it is we"" a d !ood/ B*t it is a misera("e sit*atio / The+ are ot ha.er me t i8 the+ do 9t do what the+ are s*.o s o8 destr*'tio / A ma "i-e me who e@.o s/ The+ wi"" ot hesitate to *se them a!ai st +o* a d me/ B*t i these da+s there is o wa+ +o* 'a *se +o*r *'"ear wea.iew wi"" (e'ome the e em+ o8 the state/ The+ wi"" ot hesitate to destro+ me/ I do 9t 'are i8 I am destro+ed/ I8 the+ sa+.romised to do/ The .eo.7 !ood(+e.e set themse".osed to doF It is the res.eo.ets o8 these . +o* do 9t sto.e o this .ro("em is that o 'e +o* .ee'h at a""/ I8 the+ sa+ 74o 9t ta"-.e i 8reedom o8 s."e/ We are s..arti'*"ar i di. * "ess it has the (a'-i ! o8 some . a d the 8ami"+F A1 I8 the+ are read+ to a''e.that .er+thi ! to !i.id*a"s.irit*a"B it is ot h*ma either/ It is i h*ma to "et +o*r 8e""ow (ei !s star.eo.e .e o8 wea.id*a" that he sho*"d do what he has .reser.a+i ! ta@es to the !o.ro("emsF Yo* ma+ .ros.ided them with the most destr*'ti..e ot set m+se"8 *.01 Wi"" there ot (e a ar'h+ i8 +o* do ot s*.e't o8 o"d a!e a d the 8*t*re o8 'hi"dre whe there is o 8ami"+F A1 It is so'iet+ that has to ta-e 'are o8 that .+ with that/ Tota" a ar'h+ is a state o8 (ei ! rather tha a state o8 doi !/ There is o a'tio i tota" a ar'h+B it is a state o8 (ei !/ So wh+ are we 8ri!hte ed o8 a ar'h+F The a ar'h+ whi'h +o* are ta"-i ! a(o*t is the destr*'tio o8 the i stit*tio s whi'h we ha. a d o8 o*r (e"ie8 that those i stit*tio s sho*"d 'o ti *e 8ore.*t them there i the seat o8 .i ! ma -i d/ 01 Yo* s.e (*i"t with treme do*s 'are.resses this .e * 8ort* ate"+ .e se'*rit+ to the .e them i their .*rit+/ 01 Are +o* ot worried a(o*t the .. i the (*si ess o8 r*"i ! this or that 'o* tr+/ What C*sti8i'atio do +o* ha.rote'ti ! itse"8/ Bh*ta is ot !oi ! to i .o s/ I o8te sa+ that i8 Bh*ta i .e 8or the 8a't that 8ort+ . ta"-i !/ I do 9t (e"ie.ower with others/ A d +o* .e di ! so m*'h mo e+ o de8e se/ 4e8e se a!ai st whatF We ta". 74o 9t ta"-.ower8*" atio s/ So.7 I wi"" sto.e .e these . with toda+/ .risti e ."a et/ What are +o* doi ! to so".*"!ar thi ! that the re"i!io*s ma has 'ome *. i the (*si ess o8 r* i ! this wor"d/ The+ ha.ro("em/ Wh+ are +o* a"" .id*a"s i the seat o8 .t the miser+ DLa*!hsE.*t these i di.i'io*s a d .ide them with treme do*s wea.ee'h/ I8 the+ sa+ 74o 9t ta"-. the there is "ess 'ha 'e o8 their shari ! their . we are the .er/ So it is that we are 8i!hti ! 8or 00 to .i ! i di. what +o* are sa+i ! is a threat to ma -i d a d to its i stit*tio s.ower.er'e t o8 the .*.e i I dia toda+F It is ot s.ades I dia. I dia has o wa+ o8 .o8 8reedom o8 s.

er.e set +o*rse"8 *. that the 3i?am9s wi8e died o8 AI4S i I dia& +es.eo.er+(od+ to 'o tri(*te his mi!ht.o"o*s i e@. a d she"ter e.e'ted to do.e to te"" them that this is the wa+ +o* sho*"d r* the !o.a.e i 'o* tries "i-e Swit?er"a d where there is so m*'h .er+ 8ri."e who ha.e .ressi ! m+ o.ow/ I ha.ided *s with (o* t+/ B*t we are i di.e these .it is there i the . it is there i that So)iety Ma!a?i e/ He admitted 8i a""+ that his wi8e died o8 AI4S/ Who is res.er me ts at a""/ What (*si ess do I ha. the state has to 8eed. (*t the so*r'e o8 it is somewhere e"se/ 4id +o* read it i the .ow/ Some(od+ sa+s that it is a tra s8*sio o8 ("ood whi'h 'a*sed it/ I do 9t . '"othe.o si("e 8or the i e:*ities o8 this wor"d/ 4o 9t as.E.id*a""+ res.erime ts we t wro !/ It is eas+ 8or *s to ("ame the homose@*a"s."e/ A1 First thi !.er+(od+/ 01 Wh+ is it that there is a ma@im*m *m(er o8 s*i'ides a d a ma@im*m *m(er o8 AI4S 'ases e.er me tF It is the res.ressed o. somethi ! is wro ! ot with the "eaders (*t with the .e see the wor"d/ Tha .*t them there i the seats o8 .o si("e 8or that I do ot .ro("ems/ I8 +o* do 9t so".eo.eo.e e@.e made/ O e o8 the e@.a.i io s o e.e see a "ot o8 the wor"d/ .e them.ros. 8rom disease to di.er+thi !."e/ Yo* ha.er+ m*'h/ We ha.ro("em/ What do +o* mea (+ 9AI4S9F 3ot the disease AI4SF 01 Yes. 'ha !e those ro!*es/ I ha.+o* .o si(i"it+ o8 e.i it+/ That I 'a do/ I ha.er/ 3o(od+ wa ts a + 'ha !e/ 01 B*t +o* said that the state sho*"d do a *m(er o8 thi !s 8or the .i io s/ It does 9t matter/ I am as we""0i 8ormed as a +(od+ e"se i this wor"d/ I ha.er+ o e has a ri!ht to (e 8ed/ 3at*re has .e o (*si ess to te"" someo e how to r* these !o.er me ts/ I am ot r* i ! these !o. to so".e 9t read that arti'"e/ I am .ower/ I8 the+ do 9t do what the+ are e@.ro. the disease AI4S/ A1 That is the mista-e we ha.erit+ a d hi!h atio a" i 'omeF A1 That is a di88ere t .erF I thi .me 7What are you doi ! a(o*t thatF77 7I am ot here r* i ! a 'r*sade a!ai st these . his share/ B*t the wor"d remai s e@a't"+ the wa+ it has (ee 8ore.

C(APTE! ; $e are (eading Towards 6isaster

%f those who ha e had the monopoly of all the world"s resources so far and for so long are threatened to be dislodged, what they would do is anybody"s guess. 1ll the destructi e weapons that we ha e today are only to protect them. /////// $e ha e arri ed at a point where you cannot destroy your ad ersary without destroying yourself. %t is terror, not lo e or brotherhood, that will help us to li e together. 5ntil this message percolates to the le el of human consciousness, % don"t think there is help. /////// 1ll the political ideologies, e en your legal structures, are the warty outgrowth of the religious thinking of man. //////// 5ltimately it is force that counts. 1s long as it is ad antageous to yourself, you talk of law. $hen the law fails, you use force. /////// % don"t see any reason why anybody should star e on this planet. You may ask me what % am trying to do to sol e the problem. *ut let me say that % ha e not set myself up in the business of running this world. %t is they who ha e set themsel es up in the business of ruling this or that country. %f they don"t do what they are expected to do, then there is something wrong, not with the leaders, but with the people who ha e put them there in the seats of power. /////// The rich nations are not going to gi e up what they ha e unless they are forced to gi e up. %f they are forced to gi e up, what they would do is anybody"s guess. E en if they ha e e erything to lose, % do not think they are going to gi e up. ///////

01 What are +o*r .iews re!ardi ! those who wa t to * dersta d what this "i8e is a"" a(o*tF A1 The dema d to * dersta d a d (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i +o* is the o e that is res,o si("e 8or the dema d to * dersta d the wor"d a d the (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i the wor"d/ The+ are o e a d the same/ That is wh+ +o* are i terested i "iste i ! to others/ Thro*!h that "iste i ! +o* thi - +o* wi"" (e a("e to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i +o* a d the a"so a 'ha !e i the wor"d aro* d +o*/ Basi'a""+ there is o di88ere 'e (etwee what is here D,oi ti ! towards himse"8E a d what is o*t there i the wor"d/ There is o wa+ +o* 'a draw a "i e o8 demar'atio / O e thi ! that I a"wa+s em,hasi?e is that it is '*"t*re that has 'reated *s a"" 8or the so"e ,*r,ose o8 mai tai i ! its stat*s :*o a d its 'o ti *it+/ So, i that se se, I do ot see that there are a + i di.id*a"s at a""/ At the same time, the same '*"t*re has !i.e *s the ho,e that there is somethi ! that +o* 'a do to (e'ome a i di.id*a" a d that there is s*'h a thi ! as 8ree wi""/ A't*a""+ there is o 8ree wi"" at a""/ The most im,orta t thi ! 8or *s to rea"i?e is that tho*!ht is a .er+ destr*'ti.e wea,o , a d that tho*!ht is o*r e em+/ Howe.er, we are ot read+ to a''e,t the 8a't that tho*!ht 'a o "+ 'reate ,ro("ems, (*t 'a ot he", *s to so".e them/ 01 Peo,"e !o to !*r*s a d read re"i!io*s te@ts to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i their "i.es/ B*t +o* 'om,"ete"+ (r*sh aside a"" that/ Wh+F A1 M+ ,oi t is that there is othi ! there to (e 'ha !ed/ What these !*r*s i the mar-et ,"a'e are doi ! is to se"" +o* some i'e ,a'-s a d ,ro.ide +o* with some 'om8orters/ B*t whe +o* 'ome to me, +o* 8i d it .er+ di88i'*"t 8or the sim,"e reaso that I do ot o88er +o* a + so"*tio s to +o*r ,ro("ems/ M+ i terest is to ,oi t o*t that there are a't*a""+ o ,ro("ems, a d what we are sadd"ed with are o "+ so"*tio s/ A"so, we are ot read+ to a''e,t the 8a't that the so"*tio s that these ,eo,"e ha.e (ee o88eri ! *s 8or 'e t*ries are ot rea""+ the so"*tio s/ I8 the+ were rea""+ the so"*tio s, the ,ro("ems wo*"d ha.e (ee so".ed "o ! a!o/ I8 the+ are ot the so"*tio s, a d i8 there are o other so"*tio s, the there are o ,ro("ems to (e so".ed/ 01 Swee,i ! 'ha !es are ta-i ! ,"a'e a"" o.er E*ro,e a d the So.iet U io / What ,art 'a I dia ,"a+ i the ew s'e ario that is emer!i ! a"" o.er the wor"dF The !*r*s who ha.e (ee !oi ! to the West ,rea'hi ! Yo!a a d a *m(er o8 other attra'ti.e ew 'o 'e,ts 'a ,erha,s ta-e ad.a ta!e o8 the sit*atio / A1 The 'ha !es that are ta-i ! ,"a'e i R*ssia are a't*a""+ o !ood 8or R*ssia a d o !ood 8or the wor"d/ What has ha,,e ed i R*ssia is that the+ ha.e 8o* d s*dde "+, or at "east the "eaders o8 the So.iet U io ha.e, that their <omm* ist s+stem o8 !o.er me t has 8ai"ed/ B*t i stead o8 8i di ! so"*tio s 8or their ,ro("ems withi that 8ramewor-, the+ are "oo-i ! 8or them somewhere e"se/ I do ot thi - I dia has a + a swers 8or these ,ro("ems, or do the Wester atio s, 8or that matter/ The tota" 8ai"*re o8 the <omm* ist ,hi"oso,h+ or ideo"o!+ or s+stem o8 !o.er me t there i the So.iet U io has * 8ort* ate"+ 'reated a .oid/ I am a8raid that the R*ssia Orthodo@

<h*r'h wi"" ta-e ad.a ta!e o8 the sit*atio a d ste, i / I8 it sto,s there, there is ot m*'h o8 a da !er/ B*t a"" these '*"ts that ha.e thri.ed o the !*""i(i"it+ a d 'red*"it+ o8 ,eo,"e i the Wester atio s wi"" ma-e a (ee0"i e to R*ssia a d e@,"oit ,eo,"e there/ That is o e thi ! that the R*ssia s sho*"d tr+ to a.oid/ B*t there seems to (e o wa+ that this e@,"oitatio or the other thi !s that 8orei! 'o* tries are e@,orti ! to that 'o* tr+ 'a (e a.oided/ I do ot see a ade:*ate reaso wh+ Ameri'a sho*"d e@,ort or!a i'a""+ !row ,otato 'hi,s to R*ssia/ Let me sa+ o e thi ! .er+ '"ear"+& it is ot +o*r demo'ra'+, 8reedom o8 s,ee'h, or 8reedom o8 a h* dred a d te di88ere t thi !s that these atio s ,ro'"aim, that wo R*ssia o.er to its side/ It is the <o'a0<o"a i <hi a a d Pe,si <o"a i R*ssia, a d the a"so M'4o a"d ham(*r!ers/ That is a"" that the Wester atio s 'a do there& the+ ha.e 'reated a mar-et 8or ,eo,"e to ste, i a d e@,"oit/ This is what I te"" e.e the s'ie tists a d ,s+'ho"o!ists who 'ome to see me/ I 8a't, the+ a"so ha.e 'ome to the e d o8 their tether/ The+ are ot a("e to ta'-"e the ,ro("ems that the+ are 'o 8ro ted with toda+ 00 (oth i the 8ie"d o8 ,s+'ho"o!+ a d i moder s'ie 'e/ The+ ha.e to 8i d so"*tio s o "+ withi that 8ramewor-/ U 8ort* ate"+ the+ "oo- towards Oeda ta 8rom I dia, to the re"i!io*s a swers that 'ome 8rom ;a,a or <hi a/ B*t a't*a""+ those do 9t ha.e a + a swers/ I8 the !reatest herita!e o8 I dia 'a ot he", I dia, how i the ame o8 6od do +o* thi - it wi"" he", other atio sF I do 9t thi - I dia has a + 'o tri(*tio to ma-e to the wor"d/ This is what I stro !"+ 8ee"/ At "east +o* see the West has hi!h0te'h a d te'h o"o!+ to o88er to those 'o* tries/ Thro*!h the he", o8 this te'h o"o!+ the West wi"" ,ro(a("+ do somethi ! to e ri'h those 'o* tries/ R*ssia has treme do*s at*ra" reso*r'es sti"" * ta,,ed 00 oi", !o"d, diamo ds, a d other thi !s/ Hi!h0 te'h a d te'h o"o!+ 'a he", there/ What 'a I dia o88er to those atio sF I do 9t see that I dia 'a o88er a +thi !/ It is a tota" mess there/ We 'a ,at o o*r (a'-s a d 8ee" that the !reat herita!e o8 I dia has -e,t *s !oi ! thro*!h the 'e t*ries/ B*t we are i a sorr+ mess i I dia/ I do ot thi - I dia has a +thi ! to o88er to the West/ I8 +o* sa+ that this is o "+ m+ o,i io , it does 9t matter/ I am ot tr+i ! to wi a +(od+ o.er to m+ ,oi t o8 .iew/ A d there it sto,s/ 01 I s,ite o8 the radi'a" 'ha !es that are ta-i ! ,"a'e i the wor"d, es,e'ia""+ i E*ro,e a d R*ssia, I 8i d that there is a re.i.a" o8 the o"d re"i!io / A1 The re"i!io*s re.i.a"ism that +o* are ta"-i ! a(o*t is there e.e i the Wester 'o* tries/ There is this who"e ta"- o8 7Ba'- to ;es*s,7 7Ba'- to the herita!e o8 I dia,7 7Ba'- to Is"am,7 (a'to this, that a d the other/ I am a8raid that the rise o8 Is"am ot o "+ i the Mos"em wor"d (*t a"so i R*ssia a d <hi a is !oi ! ma-e it a 8ormida("e 8or'e/ O 'e this 'r+ o8 ho"+ war, 7;ihad,7 s,reads aro* d, we wi"" ot - ow how to ta'-"e that ,ro("em/ I am ot si !i ! a doomsda+ so !/ That is what +o* are !oi ! to 8a'e .er+ soo / Is"am is !oi ! to (e a 8ormida("e 8or'e i the wor"d/ 01 I ha.e (ee to the U ited States a d E*ro,e/ I 8ee" there is m*'h C*(i"atio a d e@,e'tatio i the mi ds o8 the ,o"iti'ia s there that the wor"d is 'ha !i ! 8or the (etter/ B*t I 8i d s*dde "+ this 'risis i the Midd"e East/ What do +o* thi - a(o*t the 8*t*re o8 the wor"d i this 'o te@tF

A1 I do 9t - ow, I am ot a ,ro,het/ I 'a ot sa+ a +thi !, (*t "i-e a +(od+ e"se, I 'a ha?ard, i8 I ma+ *se the word, a .iew o8 the sha,e o8 thi !s to 'ome/ I do 9t - ow 8or s*re, a d o(od+ - ows, 8or that matter, what wi"" ha,,e / There is o e thi ! that I wa t to sa+, em,hasi?e, a d o.erem,hasi?e, that there is o wa+ we 'a re.erse the who"e thi !/ We are headi ! towards a disaster/ Ma m*st rea"i?e Da d there seems to (e o ho,e o8 his 'omi ! to terms with the rea"it+ o8 the sit*atio E that tho*!ht a d a"" that is (or o*t o8 o*r thi -i ! are the e em+ o8 ma -i d, a d there is othi ! to re,"a'e that/ Re"i!io*s re.i.a"ism is ot rea""+ the a swer/ I ,erso a""+ 8ee" that the (asi' :*estio whi'h we a"" sho*"d as- o*rse".es is, 7What -i d o8 a h*ma (ei ! +o* wa t o this ,"a etF7 U 8ort* ate"+, '*"t*re, whether it is Orie ta" or O''ide ta", has ,"a'ed (e8ore *s the mode" o8 a ,er8e't (ei !/ That mode" is ,atter ed a8ter the (eha.ior o8 the re"i!io*s thi -ers o8 ma -i d who ha.e do e more harm tha !ood/ E.er+thi ! that we are 'o 8ro ti ! toda+ is a ,rod*'t o8 the re"i!io*s thi -i ! o8 ma / B*t that thi -i ! has o a swers 8or the 8*t*re o8 ma -i d/ So i8 +o* wa t, +o* ha.e to 8i d a swers withi the 8ramewor- o8 the s+stems that ha.e 8ai"ed to de"i.er the !oods/ I do 9t thi - re"i!io*s thi -i ! has a + a swers 8or o*r ,ro("ems toda+/ The two thi !s that we ha.e to (ear i mi d are hi!h0te'h a d te'h o"o!+/ The+ wi"" he", *s to so".e the ,ro("ems o8 this ,"a et/ 6e eti' e !i eeri ! a d the * dersta di ! o8 mi'ro(io"o!+ wi"" ta-e 'are o8 what -i d o8 a h*ma (ei ! +o* wa t/ The+ ow sa+ that we are !e eti'a""+ de8i'ie t a d that the (rai is e*ro"o!i'a""+ de8i'ie t i ma + areas/ There8ore, a +thi ! that is (or o*t o8 the thi -i ! o8 ma is .er+ destr*'ti.e/ Tho*!ht is a ,rote'ti.e me'ha ism/ Its i terest is o "+ to ,rote't itse"8, mai tai its stat*s :*o, a d ,reser.e the 'o ti *it+ o8 the - ow"ed!e that is ,assed o to *s 8rom !e eratio to !e eratio / 01 What a(o*t the ,ro("ems o8 the * derde.e"o,ed 'o* tries, "i-e ,o.ert+ a d "a'- o8 ed*'atio F A1 4o +o* mea to sa+ that "itera'+ is the so"*tio or a swer 8or the ,ro("ems o8 I diaF We wa t to ed*'ate ,eo,"e so that the+ 'a read o*r ews,a,ers, a d thro*!h the media +o* are !oi ! to (rai wash these ,eo,"e/ I I dia there are sti"" ,easa ts who are ot to*'hed (+ the moder ma / The+ are somethi ! * i:*e/ I do 9t - ow/ I ha.e e.er .isited a + .i""a!e re'e t"+/ B*t I rea""+ do 9t thi - ed*'ati ! ,eo,"e i the se se i whi'h we are ta"-i ! a(o*t, the "itera'+ that we are ta"-i ! a(o*t, is the wa+ to rea""+ ed*'ate ,eo,"e/ Let me !i.e +o* the e@am,"e o8 m+ !ra dmother/ M+ !ra dmother was ot a "iterate ,erso , a"tho*!h she - ew how to read a d si! ,a,ers/ I "ear ed more 8rom her a(o*t Ad.aita tha I did 8rom the ,ro8essors at the U i.ersit+ o8 Madras/ She was ot a ed*'ated woma , or was she a e "i!hte ed ,erso / B*t she was a .er+ ,ra'ti'a" woma / She - ew a"" a(o*t the !reat '*"t*re o8 I dia/ So, ed*'ati ! the masses to (e "iterate is rea""+ ot the a swer/ We ha.e the treme do*s ,ower o8 the media at o*r dis,osa"/ I8 this ,ower is i the ha ds o8 the !o.er me t, there is othi ! that +o* 'a do to a.oid its i 8"*e 'e/ A"so, i8 +o* ta-e the e@am,"e o8 the U ited States, their so0 'a""ed 8ree media are i o wa+ (etter tha the media that are * der the !ri, o8 the !o.er me t/ Both are the same/ I do 9t - ow, I am e@,ressi ! a "ot o8 o,i io s/

timist does ot !i. a d he sti"".*tti ! thi !s 00 that a o.ided *s. sit here a d di'tate their terms/ Are the+ !oi ! to !i.atti ! m+se"8 o m+ (a'-.ert+ a d miser+F The a swer is . tha .e them *.e them *.rese t te'h o"o!i'a" a d s'ie ti8i' 'ha !es are the o "+ a swers 8or this wor"d/ A1 Yes.er+ sim.eme ts we ha. (*t I m*st sa+ o e thi !/ Whate.e *./ Yo* see.er wa+ o8 .e (i""io .er+ '"e. somehow.e (e e8ited o "+ a "imited *m(er o8 . what the+ wo*"d do is a +(od+9s !*ess/ E.e *.o si("e 8or them.eo. * "ess the+ are 8or'ed to/ I8 the+ are 8or'ed to !i. I do 9t thi .01 I 8ee" what +o* are sa+i ! is that the . Sir. ot at a""/ A +wa+.er+thi ! he has were to (e ta-e awa+ 8rom him.so.e him at a""/ He wi"" 8i!ht/ He ma+ (e a ."e/ We are i di."a et/ I8 what the+ sa+ is tr*e."e is there . a +thi !/ E."e o this .e (ee ta"-i ! a(o*t 8or the "ast 8ew +ears are 'omi ! tr*e/ A1 I do 9t sit here .ert+J is ot some '*rse o8 the hi!h !ods/ The ri'h atio s are ot !oi ! to !i. the i e i d*stria" atio s.er+ m*'h/ .e *. I wo*"d 9t (e s*r. or +o*.a'i8ist wi"" 8i!ht to the e d to . his (est 8rie d/ 01 Yo* do ot so* d "i-e m*'h o8 a o..e (i""io .timist/ A1 What does it mea 00 the di88ere 'e (etwee a o. i8 e.rised i8 he were to -i"" me a"so. a d it I.timist a d a .ossi("e to 8eed twe".oi ti ! to someo eJ ma sitti ! here who is a . that 7I to"d +o* so/7 3o.id*a""+ res.er+thi ! to "ose.o.e this I.essimistF It is C*st a . it is .e *. the i e ri'h atio s. a d te""i ! m+se"8.+o* .eo.rote't his wa+ o8 "i8e a d his wa+ o8 thi -i !/ I do 9t (e"ie.e e. the reso*r'es that at*re has .a'i8ist toda+. the who"e o8 the at*ra" reso*r'es o8 the wor"dF I do 9t thi . has 8aith that he 'a mai tai his ow wa+ o8 "i8e a d his ow wa+ o8 thi -i !/ That is a""/ He wo*"d resort to a + -i d o8 8or'e to mai tai that wa+ o8 "i8e a d that wa+ o8 thi -i !/ 01 I 8ee" that ma + thi !s +o* ha.er a'hie. o8 hi!h0te'h a d te'h o"o!+ ha. witho*t the aid o8 hi!h0te'h a d te'h o"o!+/ B*t the wh+ amo !st 8i.e had so 8ar thro*!h the he"."e with the reso*r'es at o*r 'omma d. their ri'hes * "ess the+ are 8or'ed to !i. (*t tomorrow.ro.o.the+ are !oi ! to !i.e i8 the+ ha.eo.

/////// There are so many freakish things in nature. /////// . the end of the knowledge that we ha e about oursel es and the world around us. *ut thought. The moment it tries to touch life. /////// +omewhere along the line. /////// The function of the brain in the body is only to take care of the needs of the physical organism and to maintain its sensiti ity. The only death is the end of the illusion. is destroying the sensiti ity of the body. it is destroyed by the li ing 'uality of life. self(consciousness occurred in man which separated him from the totality of life around him. the end of the fear. through its constant interference with sensory acti ity. %f you try to copy them you are lost.C(APTE! < The End o8 'llusion is 6eath 1ll the 'uestions we are asking are born out of the answers that we already ha e. /////// Thought is something dead and can ne er touch anything li ing. 1ll that we ha e gathered and ac'uired through our intellect is no match for the tremendous intelligence of the body. /////// There is no such thing as death at all for this body. /////// 1ll that is necessary for the sur i al of this li ing organism is already there.

tio o o*r .01 I "iste i ! to +o* a d readi ! +o*r two (oo-s I !et the 8ee"i ! that what +o* are sa+i ! is that there is o se"8."e ha.ed 'ertai thi !s a d ha.i ! :*a"it+ o8 "i8e/ What we mea (+ "i8e.art.es is.arate ess. is a't*a""+ ot a (asi' re"atio shi.o"*tio B it is a ass*m. o so*".o"*tio /E 01 4o +o* mea to sa+ that a"" the "i8e that we e@.es i the .e de t o8 the "i8e aro* d *s/ It is o e si !"e * it/ I 'a ot ma-e a + de8i iti.art o8 the (rai / What 'o*"d (e the . is ot a't*a""+ "i8e (*t "i.t what those who are i the .art o8 the e er!+ a!ai / B*t this dema d o o*r .o se to stim*"i/ The (rai is ot rea""+ a 'reatorB it is C*st a 'o tai er/ The 8* 'tio o8 the (rai i this (od+ is o "+ to ta-e 'are o8 the eeds o8 the . to mai tai 'o ti *it+.h+si'a" or!a ism a d to mai tai its se siti. . howe. di. i8 I ma+ *se the word. thro*!h the se ses.tio .eo.ow"ed!e we ha.erie 'e is o "+ thro*!h the (od+.oi t i de8i i ! it/ A +thi ! that we sa+ o8 "i8e is a s. "i8e or whate. 'o tai it a d !i.e e@.art o8 it/ We are .er to*'h a +thi ! "i.art/ We a''e.art.erie 'e. what di.e o(ser.o*rse". a + attem.arate 8rom or i de.ressio to it.erie 'ed (+ the se ses/ A1 3ot se. a"" the timeF7 A't*a""+. 7What is it that se.ose o8 the (rai F There seems to (e a 'o 8"i't (etwee the (od+ a d the mi d/ A1 It is o "+ a ass*m. a d what is it that mai tai s the se.t we ma-e to (e'ome o e with it.arates *s 8rom the "i8e aro* d *s.e stateme t. it is destro+ed (+ the "i.i ! is o*r re"atio shi. is 8r*it"ess (e'a*se there is o wa+ we 'a esta("ish a + re"atio shi. a +thi ! we do.i !/ Li.art/ What we are tr+i ! to * dersta d or e@.er.tio o o*r .eo. is thro*!h the he".ow/ That re"atio shi.*r.es *s to e@. is the dema d that dri.er8i'ia". (*t somewhere a"o ! the "i e se"80'o s'io*s ess o''*rred i ma whi'h se. (*t a re"atio shi.art o8 it/ B*t the most im.t*re it. arti8i'ia".ides *s is tho*!ht/ Tho*!ht is matter/ B*t that matter 'a ot sta+ there 8or "o !/ The mome t the matter is (or it has to (e'ome . a d I wo*"d sa+ it is a 8a"se ass*m.art o8 itF A1 I am ot 8or a mome t ass*mi ! or em. or o the . the "i8e aro* d *s. with the . or di."e aro* d *s.er/ What +o* are sa+i ! is that the who"e o8 "i8e "i.er a d o. that tho*!hts are s.ow 8or s*re i8 there is a + s*'h thi ! as e.er a!ai / A d th*s we are mai tai i ! this s*. o8 the .isio there (etwee o*r "i8e a d the "i8e aro* d *s/ 01 Tho*!ht is 'o sidered to (e .i !/ The mome t it tries to to*'h "i8e a d 'a. a d that the (od+ 'o tai s the who"e h*ma (ei !F A1 What e@a't"+ do +o* mea (+ 9"i8e9F 3o(od+ .it+. with the who"e wor"d aro* d *s/ A d that is a"" we .hasi?i ! that we are ot .e esta("ished what the+ 'a"" a theor+ o8 e. whereas tho*!ht. o a +thi ! whatsoe.ow o8 thi !s sa+/ Those .arated *s 8rom the tota"it+ o8 "i8e aro* d *s/ DWe do ot .e'*"atio o o*r . with the "i8e aro* d *s/ 01 Wh+ do +o* sa+ that we are ot . a d there is o ..er a d o.h+si'a" 8orm as e@.o ta eo*s a d se"80!e erated/ The+ are ot/ Tho*!ht is o "+ a res.isio . that is (or o*t o8 o*r dema d to (e'ome o e with "i8e/ So.e o8 it/ B*t tho*!ht is somethi ! dead/ It is somethi ! that 'a e.er.orta t :*estio whi'h we sho*"d as.erie 'e the same thi ! o. o 0e@iste t d*a"it+.ows a +thi ! a(o*t "i8e.art o8 tho*!ht.

a d does ot e.ow what ha. +o* wi"" e.. i8 +o* wa t to *se that word.i ! that se satio !oi ! "o !er tha its d*ratio o8 "i8e is destro+i ! the se siti. the (rai has rea""+ o o . whereas the a'ti.+/ 01 I8 +o* stri. howe. the (od+ o8 a"" the .h+si'a" 8* 'tio F A1 It is ot i terested i se s*a" a'ti.ose tha the mos:*ito that is s*'-i ! +o*r ("ood/ 01 Is there a + a.e wa t to .ities o8 the mi d are se s*a" i their at*re.a"/ B*t has 9t thi -i ! he".ow.i ess.. the :*est 8or ha.i ! or!a ism/ That is the (att"e that is !oi ! o there/ I8 +o* do ot .i ess is a '*"t*ra" i .it+.it+ o8 the se sor+ .ow e@ists e.e i a (etter wa+F . a d ha.i ess/ Ha. the dema d to -ee..it+ o8 the (rai / 01 Wo*"d +o* sa+ that the (rai has o o .arate 8rom the a'ti.er+where/ Ha.i essF I wo*"d sa+.er+ .er+where.i ess is a '*"t*ra" i .it+ a d the dema d o8 tho*!ht to tra s"ate e. a se s*a" e@. there is what is 'a""ed .erie 'es "i-e ("iss.i ess is o "+ a thi -i ! :*a"it+."easa t it ma+ (e.it+ o8 this "i.*re"+ (io"o!i'a" s*r. imme sit+.it+ o8 the (od+ is to res.*t. i e.ed ma to s*r.erie 'e/ A1 Ha.. or are we 'reated 8or a + !ra der .. o/ So.*r.i ess/ 01 Ha.er +o* wa t to 'a"" it..i ess is.er+ se satio withi the 8ramewor. a d that is the 'ommo desire that we .there is a + s*'h thi ! as mi d se.h+si'a" tra'es/ A1 I do 9t thi .i. is (or o*t o8 this se s*a"it+/ So.. howe. is "i-e a + other se satio / The mome t tho*!ht se.ro("ems that the h*ma mi d D:*ote a d * :*oteE has 'reated/ 01 O8 'o*rse..s+'ho"o!i'a" 8a'tors a d attri(*tes.*t there/ Is there a + s*'h thi ! as ha.arated *s 8rom the other s.e i terested i the so0'a""ed s.thro*!h its 'o sta t i ter8ere 'e with se sor+ a'ti.tio s a d se siti. (eatit*de.. is reCe'ted (+ the (od+/ >ee.irit*a" e@.are t di88ere 'e (etwee a h*ma (ei ! a d the orma" se sate a ima"F A1 It is thi -i ! that has se. a d that wa t is the most im.erie 'es that the mi d is i terested i a d is dema di !/ It is ot e.it+ o8 the (od+/ That is where the 'o 8"i't is/ The 'o 8"i't is (etwee the eed o8 the (od+ to mai tai its se siti.it+/ It is ot i terested i a + e@..er ."a et/ It is thi -i ! that we wa t to mai tai / So it is that that is res.i. a +thi ! a(o*t ha. a"" a'ti.it+/ Mi d.o8 the se s*a" a'ti.i ess is somethi ! whi'h the (od+ is ot i terested i / It 'a ot ta-e it 8or "o !/ P"eas*re is o e o8 the thi !s that it is a"wa+s reCe'ti !/ The (od+ does ot .erie 'es.it+/ I am ot 'o dem i ! se s*a" a'ti.er e@traordi ar+. a + se satio . or whate.er'e.art o8 the wor"d/ That is what we a"" wa t. the re"i!io*s e@..i ess.o si("e 8or a"" the .ow. wo*"d +o* sa+ that there is o di88ere 'e (etwee a h*ma (ei ! a d a a ima"F A1 3ot at a""/ We are a"" "i-e the a ima"s/ We are o di88ere t.orta t wa t i h*ma (ei !s e. that se satio !oi ! "o !er tha its at*ra" d*ratio a"so o''*rs with it/ So. is destro+i ! the se siti.er (e * ha.e'ies o this ..arates itse"8 8rom what is 'a""ed the se satio o8 ha.o d to the stim*"i aro* d it/ That is rea""+ the (asi' 'o 8"i't (etwee what +o* 'a"" the mi d a d the (od+/ 01 So +o* sa+ that the mi d.

o".es a d o8 the wor"d aro* d *s/ 01 3ow this raises the :*estio as to what i te""i!e 'e is/ There is this at*ra" i te""i!e 'e o8 the (od+. it has (e'ome .erse/ Other tha that.e 'reated 8or o*r s*r.e'ies/ 01 Yo* mea to sa+ that the i te""i!e 'e that we ha. the treeF .e i this i""*sio ."a'e it with a other/ 01 Wh+F A1 That is the thi ! that !i. it is e@a't"+ the same/ The .e ei!ht+ .e o8 o*rse". is o di88ere t 8rom the tree o*t there or the mos:*ito that is s*'-i ! +o*r ("ood/ Basi'a""+. a d the these atoms are *sed to mai tai the e er!+ "e.i. whe (ro-e i to its 'o stit*e t e"eme ts.i.e'ies/ This. the h*ma (od+. is the 'a*se o8 the destr*'tio o8 the who"e str*'t*re that we ha.ossi("e 8or *s to "i.er'e t o8 water i the trees a d ei!ht+ .ersistF A1 The i""*sio . a d there is ei!ht+ . with the he". e d o8 the 8ear.e *.i.ed tha i the 'ase o8 a ima"s/ It does ot mea that we are a + (etter tha the other s.i.arated *s 8rom the rest o8 the s.e'ies/ Thro*!h the he". it is tho*!ht whi'h has se. the (od+ is resh*88"ed.i ! o8 tho*!ht we ha.es *s the 8ee"i ! o8 'o :*eri ! the i e.ow"ed!e that we ha. there is o s*'h thi ! as death to this (od+/ 01 Is the h*ma (rai more se siti.e'ies/ 01 Wh+ do +o* thi .e "o !er tha the other s.h+si'a"F A1 3o/ Yo* see the (od+ doe ot wa t to . a':*ired what is 'a""ed the i te""e't/ Thro*!h the 'o sta t *se a d resha.ersists (e'a*se i8 the i""*sio 'omes to a e d.e tha . i8 we !i."a'e/ So.er'e t o8 water i the (od+.rod*'t o8 o*r thi -i !.a"/ There is o wa+ o8 es'a.ow a +thi !/ The (od+ does ot wa t to "ear a +thi !/ The i te""i!e 'e that is e'essar+ 8or its s*r.a" is a"read+ there/ We ha. o8 whi'h the harmo io*s a d i terre"ated 8* 'tio s o8 the (od+ are 'arried o*t/ B*t is there a area wherei i te""i!e 'e has a 8* 'tio other tha the .ossi("e 8or *s to 'reate (etter 'o ditio s a d s*r. 8ort* ate"+ or * 8ort* ate"+ as the 'ase ma+ (e.e a':*ired this i te""e't/ Thro*!h the he"."a et/ So that is the reaso wh+ I mai tai that we are othi ! (*t a 8ort*ito*s 'o 'o*rse o8 atoms/ I8 a d whe death ta-es .e "o !er tha the other s. there is o s*'h thi ! as death at a""/ A d death is the e d o8 the i""*sio . o8 that i te""e't it has (e'ome .A1 As I said a whi"e a!o. i its ow wa+.ed *s to s*r. we wi"" a"wa+s re.e'ies/ I8 what the+ sa+ is tr*e. whi'h is the . o e i""*sio .that we "i.e is i 8rom the a ima" i te""i!e 'eF o wa+ disti 't or disti !*isha("e A1 Pro(a("+ i *s the 8* 'tio i ! o8 the (od+ a d o8 the (rai is more e.ita("e e d 'a""ed death/ That is the o "+ death that is there/ Otherwise. sa+.e. what 'a (e 'a""ed '"i i'a" death wi"" ta-e .i ! 8rom this 8a't that the a':*ired i te""e't. whi'h we ta"-ed a(o*t."a'e.e "o !er tha the other s. o8 thi -i !. a d wh+ does it .ro. has he".er'e t o this .e"s i the * i. e d o8 the .ortio s o8 the e"eme ts ma+ (e hi!her i o e 'ase a d "esser i the 'ase o8 the others/ Yo* ha.

e this :*estio is ot a i te""i!e t :*estio . the . a d I ha.estered him with a"" -i ds o8 :*estio s "i-e 7What wo*"d +o* s*!!est 8or *s to doF7 threw (a'.ow"ed!e we ha.ro(a("+ the do! is 8ar more i te""i!e t tha most o8 the h*ma (ei !s i o*r midst toda+.es a d (+ o*rse".e o wa+ o8 he".*t/ 01 Is there ot a 'omm* i'atio here (etwee *s 00 the two i di. a d there is o other i str*me t/ I8 that is ot the i str*me t a d there is o other i str*me t. the 9I9 that I . a d that we ha.oi t/ 01 The 8a't that we are ta"-i !.e o wa+ o8 . whe .es 7What is thereF Is there a e tit+ thereF Is there a se"8 thereF Is there a 9I9 thereF7 M+ a swer is 73o/7 What is see or 8e"t there is 'reated (+ the .ow"ed!e o8 the e tit+ there that is ./ A1 3o/ As "o ! as +o* a d I *se the i str*me t whi'h we are *si ! to 'omm* i'ate with ea'h other.ow"ed!e is ot the i str*me t 8or doi ! it.orta t thi ! that we ha.e to * dersta d/ The dema d to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i *s is the '*"t*ra" i . esse tia""+ o/ It is more a re"atio shi.ow"ed!e o8 the se"8. o * dersta di ! is . the .eo.the :*estio 7Who am IF7 E. radi'a""+ or otherwiseF I do 9t .e to 8i d o*t.ow.e to i :*ire i to its at*re/ As 8ar as I am 'o 'er ed.e"/ B*t .o8 the .e 00 that is what I 'a"" +o*r re8ere 'e .I wi"" e. o a di88ere t "e. what se.*r.i ! some(od+ to * dersta d that that is ot the i str*me t a d there is o other i str*me t/ 3o i str*me t is e'essar+ 8or *s to 'reate the rea"i?atio that there is othi ! to * dersta d/ 01 There are . the .h+sio"o!i'a" re"atio shi.arate +o* 8rom me/ I sa+ 9I9 a d 9Yo*9/ .ow/ So we ha. 8or o*rse".er s*''eed i 8i di ! o*t 8or m+se"8 that there is a + other 9I9 whi'h is *sed 8or the sim.ow"ed!e we ha."e .ow"ed!e o8 the 9I9. do 9t +o* thi -.F A1 That re"atio shi. the .ossi("e/ Yo* are a"wa+s tra s"ati ! e. i '"*di ! me/ 01 Ma+(e/ A1 The a ima"s do 9t tr+ to 'ha !e a +thi !/ That is the most im.h+si'a" or .e o8 that. o * dersta di ! is e'essar+/ That is the * dersta di ! whi'h somehow daw ed o me 00 that there is othi ! to * dersta d/ How it o''*rred I rea""+ do 9t . is a"read+ there/ So.e/ B*t ow we are tr+i ! to esta("ish a sort o8 re"atio shi. (e'a*se we ass*me (oth that there is some 9I9 there.e a sai t "i-e Rama a Maharshi. the at*re o8 whi'h we do ot .assed o to *s 8rom !e eratio to !e eratio / A"" that is the '*"t*ra" i .id*a"sF A1 4o +o* thi .that there is a + 'omm* i'atio (etwee *sF Are we tr+i ! to esta("ish a + 'omm* i'atio hereF 01 3o.ow that/ That is wh+ e.owi ! it/ I ha.ow"ed!e that +o* ha. shows that there is a .ow o8 is the 8irst .*t/ What is there to (e 'ha !edF That is m+ (asi' :*estio / Is there a +thi ! to (e 'ha !ed.arates +o* 8rom me a d me 8rom +o* is the .ro o* / I did ot s*''eed a d I do 9t thi .oses o8 'omm* i'atio to se."e .A1 I8 what the+ sa+ is tr*e.er+ stateme t o8 mi e withi the 8ramewor.ow.erso si !*"ar .ario*s !*r*s who sa+ that there is a so*" or se"8//// A1 I .

ra'ti'a" .ow"ed!e that we ha. or whate.t thro*!h the .oses.e/ Yo* ha.e"s o8 'o s'io*s ess.ow"ed!e that is !i. a d hi!her states o8 'o s'io*s ess/ I do 9t see that there is a + s*'h thi ! as 'o s'io*s ess/ I (e'ome 'o s'io*s o8 this Dto*'hi ! the arm o8 the 'hairE o "+ thro*!h the .o8 . 8or a"" ."e as.i ! what is !oi ! o there/ 01 B*t +o* 'a 8ee"//// A1 3o/ Fee"i ! is a"so a tra s"atio / This to*'h does ot sa+ a +thi ! a(o*t the to*'h . +o* 'a -id +o*rse"8 (+ te""i ! +o*rse"8 that this to*'h is o e with 8ee"i ! a d ot C*st a sim.e/ The e+e is "oo-i ! at the mo.er se e@'e.er +o* are tr+i ! to sa+/ That is wh+ +o* ha.erim.eo.erie 'i ! the 8a't that this is 9so8t9 or 9hard9 e@'e.e o wa+ o8 'reati ! +o*r ow (od+ a d e@. the di88ere t "e.*re"+ .ed "a !*a!e/ B*t sti"" +o* 8ee" that +o* are ot a("e to 'omm* i'ate thi !s.erie 'i ! that to*'h at a""/ The wa+ these se ses are o.h+si'a" res. o8 the .e these di88ere t !est*res to (a'.o se/ It is ot tra s"ated/ Pro(a("+ that is a -i d o8 . is the . a d stre !the what +o* are tr+i ! to 'omm* i'ate to others/ I .o se o8 .e to *s/ Witho*t that .*r.osed o that/ 01 <a +o* te"" me a "itt"e (it more a(o*t to*'hF A1 I8 it is "e8t .e o8 it/ I do 9t .it+ o8 memor+.o se to a stim*"*s/ 7Wh+ do +o* mo.01 The 'o s'io*s ess o8 the (od+//// A1 The 'o s'io*s ess o8 the (od+ does ot e@ist/ There is o s*'h thi ! as 'o s'io*s ess at a""/ The o e thi ! that he".it+.eme t o8 +o*r ha d.e+ to +o*r 8e""ow (ei !s whate.e"o.e o wa+ o8 e@.me 7Wh+ do +o* smi"eF7 I sa+ that it is C*st a res.erie 'i ! it/ I am :*estio i ! the . the * 'o s'io*s. a d o "+ the +o* sa+ that it is so8t a d ot hard/ So.erati ! here is :*ite di88ere t 8rom the wa+ we are made to (e"ie.o se to the to*'h/ Whe .s *s to (e'ome 'o s'io*s o8 the o 0e@isti ! (od+.ow"ed!e that I ha. (*t the+ ma+ (e there (e'a*se +o* 8ee" that +o* are ot e@.e o8 it/ The to*'h does ot te"" me a +thi ! e@'e. there is o rea'tio o +o*r .ow"ed!e/ Otherwise I ha.ow"ed!e that +o* ha.ressi ! +o*rse"8 ade:*ate"+/ Yo* are (a'-i ! +o*r stateme ts with these !est*res/ That is o "+ a mode o8 'omm* i'atio / We a"" started that wa+ a d s"ow"+ de.h+si'a" res. 'o .o se "i-e a + other res.h+sio"o!i'a" "e.e +o*r ha dF7 7Wh+ do +o* ma-e so ma + !est*resF7 Yo* ma+ 'a"" a"" these mere !est*res."e to*'h/ B*t a"" that is s*.art/ 01 Whi'h . the e*ro s.ow/ I ha.*re"+ o the .e o wa+ o8 e@.ow i8 this ma-es a + se se to +o*/ 01 It ma-es se se to me/ B*t it seems to me that whe +o* do to*'h there is a se satio i the (od+ a"so/ A1 3o/ That se satio is thro*!h the se se o8 to*'h/ It is tra s"ated (+ the a'ti. a d is ot sa+i ! a +thi ! a(o*t that a'ti."eas*re 8or the (od+/ I do 9t . "et a"o e the s*('o s'io*s."eas*re or a .ow"ed!e +o* ha.er +o* "i-e to 'a"" them. e@'e.art is itF A1 That is the .*.e o wa+ o8 8i di ! o*t whether that is the res.t thro*!h the he".er+ idea o8 'o s'io*s ess.t whe I tra s"ate it withi the 8ramewor.t o(ser.e".

e !o to the e@te t o8 'a""i ! me a atheist C*st (e'a*se I sa+ that 6od is irre"e. a d Ameri'a s ha.e the idea o8 se.ro.e these !est*res or mo.*re a d sim.e it or ot& it does ot ma-e o e (it o8 di88ere 'e to me/ I am ot tr+i ! to 'o . what +o* are "e8t with is somethi ! whi'h +o* 'a e. (*t mere"+ s*!!ests that e.ow/ Peo.e (ee tra smitted thro*!h the !e es/ We do 9t .ow I met a "ad+ i Ita"+/ She was se.o8 this.ow what .arated 8rom her h*s(a d immediate"+ a8ter she !a."e e.er to a +thi !/ Whe o 'e the dema d to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e a d to (e di88ere t 8rom what a't*a""+ is there is a(se t."a+ a d how the who"e thi ! is tra smitted 8rom !e eratio to !e eratio / 01 A"" this (oi"s dow to o e thi !& that is. a d a h* dred di88ere t thi !s/ I sa+ that I am C*st a ordi ar+ ma / E. that.art the !e es .o me/ Be"ie.er e@.ow/ 01 Are +o* a materia"istF A1 I do 9t .owi ! it/ E.eme ts o8 ha ds are tra smitted thro*!h the !e es/ Yo* .e o wa+ o8 .eo.+o*/ .h+si'a" res.a t/ B*t that does ot mea that I am a atheist/ So I am ot i terested i what -i d o8 "a(e"s the+ sti'.e (irth to her so / The+ e.e these !est*res mi!ht ha.erie 'e/ That is the reaso wh+ I said that I am C*st a ordi ar+ ma / B*t .er+(od+ thi -s that I am ot a ordi ar+ ma / Tha .ed that the (o+9s !est*res were o di88ere t 8rom the !est*res o8 her h*s(a d/ O8 'o*rse.i 'e +o* or wi +o* o."e .er+thi ! i *s is C*st ."e 'a"" me a materia"ist/ Peo."e 8or their ow reaso s wa t to 8it me i to a 8ramewor.o ses ma+ (e mis"eadi !/ I rea""+ do 9t .e a +thi !. that e.e o e -i d o8 !est*res.h+si'a"/ A1 I ha.er met 8or twe t+ +ears/ The mother to"d *s that she a"wa+s o(ser.e a di88ere t -i d o8 !est*res/ Pro(a("+ e.arati ! the (od+ a d ta"-i ! a(o*t it i terms o8 .I dia the+ ha. this ma+ ot .

/////// $e are lost in the jungle. somehow. bliss.C(APTE! = "ost in the ungle The human organism is not interested in your wonderful religious ideas (( peace. %t"s only interest is its own sur i al. or any such thing. howe er. *ut we ha e only to stand still and let things happen. a faint hope that one day. has made us belie e that it is a creator. %t is already li ing all the time. /////// . The mechanism that we ha e implanted in it. /////// The brain is only a reactor responding to stimuli. through our education and culture. /////// The demand to be prepared for all future actions and all situations is the cause of our problems.ow to li e32 is totally unrelated to the functioning of this li ing organism. E ery situation is so different# and our attempt to be prepared for all those situations is the one that is responsible for our not being able to deal with situations as they arise. as it were. beatitude. *ut still we ha e not succeeded. /////// The 'uestion 2. /////// The whole of our culture or ci ili)ation is built on the foundation of killing and being killed. /////// %t is just not possible for us to produce enlightened people on an assembly line. /////// $hat society or culture has placed before us as the goal for all of us to reach and attain is the enemy of this li ing organism. $e ha e tried e ery possible means of escape. we can get out of this jungle. There is.

*r. ho.owi ! them is ("*88/ The .ose o8 mai tai i ! the 'o ti *it+ o8 tho*!ht/ A"" the ta".*r. it has se. there is o "+ o e a d a ha"8 .e'ies o this .e'ies is more im.e'ies/ 01 Tho*!ht has made it . a d i its a'tio . what we ha.e i its at*re/ It is ot i terested i .er+ other 8orm o8 "i8e o this . or we ha. ma-es +o* thi ."a et/ I mai tai that we are here 8or o !ra der . the dri.e'ies ha.e a''e. a d that we ha.ose o8 'o ti *i ! the h*ma s.ose.ow whether there is a + s*'h thi ! as e.orta t tha the other s. that we are here 8or some !ra der .e tho*!ht witho*t these ideas a d sti"" ta-e ad.*r.e'iesF How 'a it (e a im.ossi("e 8or *s to s*r.e.e made *s (e"ie."a et "o !er tha others. a d to mai tai the h*ma s.ro("ems that it has 'reated is C*st wish8*" thi -i !/ 01 How has it he".*r.e o this .arated *s 8rom the si !"e ess o8 "i8e.e se o8 e.atio .e.ose.ed *s to "i. *s (+ 8reei ! *s 8rom the .rote'ti."ease A1 It is *se"ess to s.e that there is s*'h a thi !/ We are to"d that i8 we "oo.e'ies o this .*r.o"*tio / Those who ta".i.er+ dema d to * dersta d at*re9s "aws is to *se them 8or the .ow the "aws o8 at*re C*st 8or the sa-e o8 . there8ore.e (e'ome e@ti 'tF What has made it .er+ moti.er+ a!!ressi.e this -i d o8 tho*!htF .that the h*ma s.ossi("e 8or *s to "i. o*r (e"ie8.orta t tha the !arde s"*!/ Wi"" +o* .ose tha the other s.e a ri!ht to ta-e ad.*r.that tho*!ht is a"tr*isti' a d that we are '*rio*s to .e.rote'ti."a et is o "+ ha"8 a . to !o o .er'e t o8 what e@isted (e8ore/ What.e/ O*r .e'ies that ha.rote'ti ! somethi !/ We *se tho*!ht 8or the .ted the (e"ie8 that has (ee . to do whate.ossi("e to ha. is tho*!ht/ It is tho*!ht that has made it .e'*"ate a(o*t it.e "o !er tha the other s.*r.rote'ti ! the "i8e aro* d *s/ O the 'o trar+.a(o*t e.e'ies at the e@.e'ies o this .edime tF A1 Tho*!ht is a .ose tha that o8 the !arde s"*! o*t there or the mos:*ito that is s*'-i ! +o*r ("ood/ I do 9t ."a et.e (ehi d o*r dema d to * dersta d the "aws o8 at*re is to *se them 8or the .e o this ."a et/ It has !i.er we wa t to do o this . or 8aith that tho*!ht wi"" he".ossi("eF A1 B*t that is o*r e em+/ Tho*!ht is o*r e em+/ I the "o ! r* ."a et/ 01 What wo*"d this h*ma s.a ta!e o8 at*reF A1 I mai tai a d .e me'ha ism/ It is i terested i . i its e@.er'e t o8 what e@isted (e8ore/ I8 +o* ta-e the ."a et/ 01 Wo*"d it (e .eriorit+ o.assed o to *s 8rom !e eratio to !e eratio .o"*tio ha.01 Yo* sa+ that the h*ma -i d is 'omme t o thatF o more im.ressio . that the who"e thi ! is 'reated 8or o*r . i its 'o te t. 8or a o("er . is 8as'ist/ It is .e *s the idea that we are somethi ! di88ere t.a ta!e o8 this s*.e "o !er tha the other s.at the a ima" s.e (ee i8 we did ot ha.er+ o8te sa+ that tho*!ht i its (irth.e'ies that we ha. (*t 8or some reaso we are made to (e"ie."a ts i to 'o sideratio .er others. the * it+ o8 "i8e aro* d *s/ It has iso"ated *s 8rom the rest o8 the s.ose o8 mai tai i ! the 'o ti *it+ o8 tho*!ht/ A +thi ! that has 'ome o*t o8 tho*!ht is .

"a et/ We -i"" 8or a idea/ The who"e 8o* datio o8 o*r '*"t*re a d 'i.er/ B*t we do 9t seem to ha. other s. there is a 8ai t ho.. *s to sta d sti""F A1 Yo* 'a ot sta d sti""/ Yo* 'a ot sta d sti"" (e'a*se o8 the 8ear that we wi"" (e "ost 8ore. I mai tai . a d we -i"" others too/ B*t that -i d o8 thi ! +o* do 9t see ha.er+thi ! that +o* see a d are .e / 01 B*t how 'a we sta d sti""F What is it that wi"" he".e to sta d sti"" a d "et thi !s ha. as s+m(o"i?ed (+ the state/ The who"e 8o* datio o8 '*"t*re is (*i"t o the idea o8 -i""i ! a d (ei ! -i""ed/ 01 We do 9t rea""+ admit that/ We sa+ that o*r '*"t*res are (ased o o*r ideas o8 harmo +/ A1 I do ot thi .ed *s to (e what we are toda+. as s+m(o"i?ed (+ the <h*r'h a d a"" the other re"i!io*s i stit*tio s.e that ma+(e there is some wa+ we 'a !et o*t o8 this C* !"e/ B*t we C*st ha."a'ed/ Somehow we ha.oses o8 mai tai i ! the 'o ti *it+. tho*!ht. *s to 'reate a (etter.A1 Pro(a("+ we wo*"d ha. 'ertai "+/ The what is there ta-es o. 8irst i the ame o8 6od.e'ies wi"" 8i!*re that o*t i time a d 'ha !e 'o*rse.*r."a et/ It is a +(od+9s !*ess/ I am ot . we are "ost i the C* !"eB we ha.er+thi !.e"+ i the dire'tio o8 destro+i ! e.o"iti'a" ideo"o!ies.e a 8aith that this i str*me t.e/ B*t sti"".e se o8 a other 8orm o8 "i8e is a 8a't o8 at*re/ B*t we -i"" other s. the dema d to . somehow.er+thi ! +o* dis'o.i"i?atio is (*i"t o the idea o8 -i""i ! a d (ei ! -i""ed.e i ! i other 8orms o8 "i8e.e i the midst o8 a"" these (r*ta"ities/ That "i8e has a 'harm o8 its ow / It wi"" ot (ri ! +o* i 'o 8"i't with so'iet+ at a""/ Yo* do 9t e.e'ies o this .ro(a("+ e a("es +o* to "i.a" o8 o e 8orm o8 "i8e at the e@.e 'reated a (etter 8orm o8 h*ma s.er+ is to *se it 8or . the dri. +o* see/ DLa*!hterE As I said at the (e!i i !.e treme do*s 8aith that the tho*!ht whi'h has he". *s to 'ha !e the 'o*rse o8 e.ossi(i"it+ that the h*ma s. whi'h has he".e'ies o this .er+ .e'ies 8or a idea/ 01 We a"so -i"" o*rse".that +o* 'a (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i +o*rse"8.er a d . is mis..e tried e.e'ies o this . ha.er+ .er+thi !/ We somehow ha.i.e the 8ee"i ! that there is ot a dam thi ! that we 'a do to !et o*t o8 this C* !"e/ 01 4o +o* sta d sti"" i this wa+F A1 Yes.e (ehi d that dis'o.ed *s to 'reate e.e wa t to 'ha !e a +thi !/ The dema d to 'ha !e is (or o*t o8 +o*r iso"atio / Whe o 'e +o* thi ."a et/ 01 B*t how do we !et o*t o8 this i8 it is headi ! dow a . what -i d o8 'ha !e wo*"d it (eF A1 I sa+ the 'ha 'es are s"im to o e/ We are doomed.ier "i8e o this .er is addi ! to the mome t*m o8 destr*'tio / E.arti'*"ar"+ 8o d o8 the h*ma s.ro*d o8 wi"" he".ath o8 destr*'tio F A1 E.ro!ressi. a d i the ame o8 ."a et/ We wo*"d do a +thi ! that the a ima"s wo*"d ot do/ The s*r.so/ We are mo. a d i8 it does 'ha !e 'o*rse.e (e'ome e@ti 't a d at*re wo*"d ha.es 8or a idea/ A1 <ertai "+.. wi"" he".ossi("e mea s o8 es'a. (e'a*se.e ts/ This 8aith.i ! . the stat*s :*o/ 01 Is there a + .

the (od+ 8* 'tio i te""i!e t"+ a d sa e"+/ 01 Yo* mea the (rai F A1 Yes. tr*th.it+ i at*reF A1 There is o 'reati.it+ o8 "i8e/ 01 What is the so*r'e o8 'reati.o d to stim*"i/ 01 I8 the (rai is 'reated with the i te""i!e 'e o8 the (od+.ows/ O e o8 the thi !s that I a"wa+s em.it+9 00 "a !*a!e.ri t there/ Whate.e im.erie 'es o8 a + -i d are se s*a" i their at*re/ It is o "+ the mi d that is i terested i s.e i the se se that it does ot *se a + mode"/ A +thi ! we 'a"" 'reati. rea"it+.+ o8 somethi ! that is a"read+ there/ It is se'o d ha d/ Yo* 'a ot sa+ that somethi ! whi'h at*re has 'reated is ot *. +o* wi"" (e s*r.a" o8 this "i. I do 9t see a + mi d there at a""/ The mi d is i terested o "+ i se s*a"it+/ So a"" re"i!io*s e@.e . the (rai / B*t * 8ort* ate"+. the 'reati.i.assio . a d the (rai is there o "+ to tra s"ate this se satio 00 the tra s"atio that is e'essar+ 8or the s*r.irit*a" e@.*t a'ross to those who are i terested is that the h*ma (rai is ot i terested i a +thi ! that we are i terested i . the "i. that.erie 'e o8 a + -i d/ What it is i terested i is to he". the 'reati. a d is there a + 'reati.a" o8 this "i.it+ that +o* are ta"-i ! a(o*t is tota""+ * re"ated to the 'reati. a d a"" that we ha.i ! or!a ism.irit*a" e@.ri t is there is a"read+ there i the 'e""/ E.e that it is a 'reator/ 3o e o8 the tho*!hts that we are thi -i ! are se"80!e erated/ 3o e o8 them are s.oi t Imar-J/ I do 9t e.owi ! a +thi !/ A"" that is e'essar+ 8or the s*r.it+ i the se se i whi'h we are *si ! the word 9'reati.*t that (rai to a *se 8or whi'h at*re has ot i te ded it/ The (rai is ot a 'reator/ It is o "+ a rea'torB it rea'ts to stim*"i/ The me'ha ism that we ha. is ot i terested i a + o8 those thi !s.e is a imitatio .it+. a d a"" those -i ds o8 thi !s/ B*t the (od+.'ha !e the wor"d is a"so there/ B*t this h*ma (od+ is ot i terested i "ear i ! or .er ("*e .osed o *s. 'o. what the '*"t*re has im.it+ o8 this.it+ o8 tho*!ht. we ha.i ! or!a ism is a"read+ there/ There is a treme do*s i te""i!e 'e there.e see a + ("*e . what is the 'reati. to the .e !athered a d a':*ired thro*!h o*r i te""e't is o mat'h 8or that/ 01 ////to the i te""i!e 'e o8 the (od+F A1 Yes.erie 'es or a +thi ! that the mi d is i terested i Dmi d. i a + o8 its ideatio s a d me tatio s/ The (rai is so d*"".i.er+thi ! is !e eti'a""+ 'o tro""ed/ 01 There is othi ! +o* 'a 'ha !e 00 a "itt"e shade here a d thereF ."a ted i it.o ta eo*s/ The+ a"wa+s 'ome 8rom o*tside.hasi?e a d tr+ to . (*t o "+ to res. the i te""i!e 'e o8 the (od+/ It . has made *s (e"ie. :*ote a d * :*oteE/ I 8a't. or the other/ Li8e is 'reati. thro*!h o*r ed*'atio a d '*"t*re.rised/ It is ot i terested i a + e@. as it were.i ! or!a ism/ It is ot i terested i a + o8 the s.er+thi ! that is there ow was there i that si !"e 'e""/ E.it+ that is asso'iated with tho*!htF A1 The 'reati. 'om.erie 'es 00 ("iss.

e the (io"o!ists.8or ma-i ! a :*a t*m C*m.h+si's/ It wor-ed .e i that ho. we admire a"" these .ered.ossi("e i the .e that.erie 'e at a""/ There is o s*'h thi ! as a ew e@. or s'ie tists i !e era"/ I8 the+ (r*sh this aside a d sa+ this is a"" a(so"*te r*((ish. how does o e dis'o."a'ed *s i a sit*atio where we are "e8t with a ho. the dis'o.o8 the s'ie ti8i' thi -i ! o8 ma / A8ter a"".it+9/ O8 'o*rse. +o* 'a !o to a .e a d die i that ho. ot so ."asti' s*r!eo a d 'ha !e it i to a a:*i"i e ose/ I8 +o* 8ee" that it is 8ashio a("e to ha.er+ 3ewto ia .ered 00 there is o .ro. a d what +o* thi .*re s'ie 'e at a""/ I ma+ (e ma-i ! a "ot o8 do!mati' stateme ts.a"*e at a""/ 3ewto ia . thee two thi !s 00 what was there (e8ore.h+si'a" wor"d/ For e@am.*..h+si's is sti"" .erie 'e/ The so0'a""ed e. thro*!h !e eti' e !i eeri ! it wi"" (e . the there is a . i8 I ma+ *se that word.es/ 01 B*t there m*st (e//// . the . this.s+'ho"o!ists. some(od+ "i-e Ei stei was "*'-+ to ta-e the "ead a d dis'o.e'ia" i si!ht i to the at*re o8 thi !s or a * dersta di ! o8 the wor-i !s o8 at*re more tha a +(od+ e"se. ame"+.e Dor rather Ei stei hasE si 'e dis'o.e o8 a st*((ed ose. it is 8i e with me/ O e o8 these da+s the+ are !oi ! to dis'o."e/ Otherwise.atter s/ I do ot '"aim to ha.e / Yo* "i.eo. that.e/ 01 Is 'ha !e .e a s.er+/ 4is'o. these thi !s a d .er+ has o .eries/ Ta-e.er thatF A1 Yo* see.ed to (e a st*m("i ! ("o'.ai"i ! the he".rod*'i ! some res*"ts/ Otherwise the dis'o.eo.er+ is ot withi the 8ramewor.h+si's is ot so tr*e.a"id.erie 'e what +o* a"read+ .e dis'o.ow the reaso wh+F It is (e'a*se o8 the te'h o"o!+ that has (e'ome .er somethi ! di88ere t/ 01 4id he rea""+ dis'o.. 8or e@am.ared to what we ha. 3ewto ia .A1 The idea that there is somethi ! that we 'a do to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e withi *s a d 'ha !e i the wor"d has ."asti' s*r!eo / Or. o8 a .t what I am sa+i ! or ot/ It sta ds or 8a""s (+ itse"8/ I do 9t 'are 8or e. :*ote a d * :*ote/ Somehow.er+ is the wro ! word/ 01 Wro ! wordF A1 Yo* e@.eries o8 these .er somethi ! di88ere tF A1 A't*a""+."e.e that somehow this ma+ ha. (*t this is what I ha.er+ we"" 8or some 'e t*ries/ B*t that .+o* ha.ossi("e 8or *s to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i (eha.ered 8or m+se"8/ I do 9t 'are whether +o* a''e.er+/ There is o s*'h thi ! as .ossi("eF A1 What -i d o8 'ha !e are +o* i terested i F <ha !e is .h+si's .eries i the 8ie"d o8 s'ie 'e are ot rea""+ e.a"id withi the 8ramewor.resti!io*s ho or 00 the 3o(e" Pri?e. there is o e@. there is o s*'h thi ! as dis'o. (*t m+ stateme ts sta d or 8a"" (+ themse".o8 thi -i !/ I other words.ossi("e thro*!h the dis'o."e. i8 +o* are ot i terested i the sha.e dis'o.ossi(i"it+ o8 a.er these thi !s a +wa+/ 01 We"". it is ot di88ere t/ U "ess +o* "i . a d the other/ 4o +o* . 3ewto ia .o'h0ma-i ! dis'o.o'h0ma-i ! dis'o.ior . there is o s*'h thi ! as tr*e dis'o. the 9Theor+ o8 Re"ati. 'om.oi t i ta"-i ! a(o*t that at a""/ The s'ie tist is i terested i "i -i ! *.ow/ Otherwise."e a d re!ard them with .

+o* do 9t 8ee" that +o* 'a //// A1 That is a"" there is 8or me/ 01 How did +o* !et o*t o8 this (oredomF A1 I wish I .erie 'i ! the same thi ! o.ew/ That9s wh+ I *sed the .ed +o* see thi !s more '"ear"+/ How does that he".hrase 9st*m("ed i to9/ Somehow.A1 Wh+ do +o* sa+ there m*st (eF There ma+ ot (e/ The where do we !o 8rom 7There ma+ ot (e///F7 01 Yo* ha.ast/ It is re. is ot rea""+ the i str*me t to * dersta d a +thi !/ B*t I was .ow/ 01 So we are C*st e@.ossess a i str*me t to * dersta d/ A1 There is o i str*me t to * dersta d a +thi ! other tha this i str*me t/ That .that there is somethi ! more i teresti !.ro.a(o*t +o*r e@.F <a +o* ta".i !//// 01 Im..erie 'eF A1 I .ro.er+ o8te *se the . it o''*rred to me that this i str*me t whi'h we ha.hrase 9st*m("ed i to9/ There is o wa+ I 'a 'omm* i'ate this to a +(od+/ A +(od+ who 'omes a d "iste s to me a d tries to * dersta d what I am tr+i ! to .erie 'e/ The mome t +o* sa+ that it is somethi ! whi'h +o* ha.erie 'es that he".etiti. the who"e o8 o*r dis'o. more mea i !8*" that +o* 'o*"d do tha what +o* are doi !/ 01 We"". a d that there is o other i str*me t/ So. more . this Dthe i te""e'tE has ot he".e a.e/ A1 It is a re.e i ! that i te""e't/ That is a"" that is there/ So.art o8 the .erie 'i ! me'ha ism/ 01 Are +o* (oredF A1 Boredom is there o "+ whe +o* thi .er+. it mea s that it has a"read+ (e'ome .ed me to * dersta d the "i.ro'ess e@.i ! that o e da+ we wi"" 8i d somethi ! e@traordi ar+. what we 'a"" i te""e't.e to * dersta d a +thi ! is the i te""e't. or * dersta d m+se"8 a d the wor"d aro* d me/ The * dersta di ! that this is ot the i str*me t a d that there is o other i str*me t somehow daw ed o me/ 01 ////that the h*ma (ei ! does ot .e (ee *si !.i ! . some ew e@.ro("ems o8 m+ "i8e. "et a"o e the *"timate rea"it+/ Yo* ha.er+ is othi ! (*t im. (e'a*se there is o wa+ +o* 'a "iste to .erie 'ed (e8ore.er+ '"ear that the o "+ i str*me t we ha.*r.etiti.ast e@.e ot e@.i ! the i te""e't//// A1 Shar.e .erie 'e.are t"+ had some e@.e o wa+ o8 e@. that it is a ew e@.erie 'e a +thi ! other tha what we .erie 'i ! the rea"it+ o8 a +thi ! 00 the rea"it+ that we ha.o'-s o88 the who"e 8o* datio o8 i t*itio or a + other wa+ o8 * dersta di ! the rea"it+ s*rro* di ! *s/ There is othi ! to * dersta d/ That is wh+ I mai tai that there is o s*'h thi ! as rea"it+ at a"".erie 'i ! the . somewhere a"o ! m+ Co*r e+ o8 dis'o.e so m*'h ta-e 8or !ra ted/ We do 9t e@.*t a'ross is wasti ! his time.ose8*".er a d o.er a!ai / That is wh+ we are (or ho.

or .eo.the :*estio 7How to "i.t that this is 8a"seF A1 9How9 im. the .ow 8rom some(od+//// 01 Yo* mea as-i ! the :*estio //// ot .t that we are st*'-F A1 A''e.oi t wherei he or she is wi""i ! to a''e.e with o*r 8ee"i !s."ies that +o* wa t to .retatio / The i ter.eF7 7How to "i. a d 8ee"i !s o8 e.t that it is 8a"si8+i ! +o*/ Yo* throw a "ot o8 e er!+ i to this (*si ess o8 8itti ! +o*rse"8 i to that 8ramewor.*r.a +thi ! witho*t i ter.i ! or!a ism/ 01 A d the sear'h 8or mea i ! is a(s*rdF A1 O(.erie 'es. to "i.oi t. so a(s*rd 00 7What is the mea i ! o8 "i8eF7 It is ot "i8e that we are rea""+ i terested i (*t "i.osed o the "i. it is the .a"*e s+stem/ 01 How does o e !et to that .e to as.es i to that .art to !et o*t o8 that tra.rod*'t o8 the tota"it+ o8 a"" the tho*!hts.e to a''e.e with o*r ideas/ I other words. it does ot wa t to a''e.e with some(od+ e"se."e/ To me to as.reti ! what I am sa+i ! to +o*/ 01 B*t it is 'om.er/ A1 We are tr+i ! to 8it o*rse".ose i "i8eF A1 Wh+ do we "oo.ro("em o8 "i.i ! has (e'ome a .e (ee throw i to/ Yo* see. so mea i !"ess.erim.that :*estio is so si""+. that is the :*estio / Wh+ do weF A1 Yo* te"" me.a"*e s+stem whi'h is tota""+ 8a"se/ It is 8a"si8+i ! +o*/ B*t +o* are ot read+ to a''e.eF7 is s*.i ! a"" the time/ It does 9t ha.i !/ The .t a +thi ! that wi"" dist*r( its stat*s :*o/ A"so the re8ere 'e .t that a + attem.ti ! mea s that +o* are si'.e to ha.io*s"+ +o* do 9t see/ DLa*!hsE I do 9t mea o "+ +o*/ I mea .er+ tiri ! (*si ess 00 to "i. e@. i whi'h +o* 8i d +o*rse"8 is stre !the i ! the sha'-"es/ A d there is o wa+ o*t/ 01 So we ha.oi t is stre !the ed a d 8orti8ied (+ i ter.t o +o*r . its stat*s :*o/ A"tho*!h thi !s are 'ha !i ! 'o sta t"+. wh+ do weF Wh+ sho*"d there (e a + mea i !F The :*estio 7How to "i.eF7 is tota""+ * re"ated to the 8* 'tio i ! o8 this "i.a"*e s+stem is 8a"se/ 01 ////"i-e !"*e a"" o.a d tired o8 doi ! a +thi !/ B*t sa+i ! that does rea""+ mea a +thi !/ 01 So we ha.*r.er+ 8orm o8 "i8e that e@isted (e8ore +o*/ Tho*!ht is o "+ i terested i mai tai i ! its 'o ti *it+ a d stat*s :*o/ It does ot wa t a + 'ha !e/ It sa+s that it wa ts to 'ha !e (*t the 'ha !e that it is i terested i is o "+ to mai tai its 'o ti *it+.e a .8or a .io*s"+ +o* do ot see a + mea i !/ Yo* do ot see a + ."ete"+ st*'-/ A1 Yo* do 9t wa t to a''e. to "i. whi'h is +o*/ Yo* are the .i ! or!a ism/ It is "i.ose or mea i !/ Wh+F 01 Wh+ do weF Yo* see.ose i "i8e/ O(.*r.reter is the re8ere 'e .a"*e s+stem that we ha.

s we are "ost.ossi("e to esta("ish a + re"atio shi.id*a".ti ess.i.ri !s 8rom this se. 9HowF9 9HowF9 mea s +o* wa t to . a .e 8o* d o*t that there is o wa+ I 'a (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i it/ Yo* wa t to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e i the wor"d/ Yo* see.A1 That is addi ! mome t*m to that 00 to . so'iet+.e to *se e. +o* see/ B*t what is dema di ! is the .s with .ow.ows that (+ as-i ! the :*estio it 'a add mome t*m to itse"8/ It is ot 9+o*9. to esta("ish re"atio shi. a d to . has 'reated 9+o*9 a d 9me9 8or the so"e ."e/ 01 I what wa+F A1 To s*r.a"*e s+stem/ O*r e88ort to 8it o*rse". si 'e I ha.i ! .ow/ What is this 9+o*9.ow"ed!e that is .er+thi ! 00 a idea.that :*estio . at the "e.ro("em.t o the "e.ro'ess. (e'a*se 9+o*9 do 9t e@ist/ There is o i di.*r.id*a" there at a""/ <*"t*re.hi"oso.*r. at the same time. with a +thi ! aro* d +o*.e that +o* ha.e i this wor"d is ot a di88i'*"t .erie 'e +o*rse"8F The 9+o*9 as +o* . the who"e thi ! s. we are made to (e"ie. the .e" o8 7What do I !et o*t o8 that re"atio shi. a d we do 9t see a + mea i !B we do 9t see a + .eo.e s i8 +o* C*st do 9t 8it +o*rse"8 i to the .ow +o*rse"8 is a .ose/ This is (e'a*se +o*r o "+ i terest is to 'reate a . as +o* e@.e to (e'ome a i di.es i to that . or whate.aratio or iso"atio that h*ma (ei !s "i./ It is C*st ot .ow.a"*e s+stemF A1 I am ot i 'o 8"i't with this so'iet+/ Yo* seem to (e i 'o 8"i't with this so'iet+. a d there is othi ! we 'a do to dea" with the "i.ro("ems.er +o* wa t to 'a"" it.is a .rod*'t o8 the mome t*m o8 that .ose o8 mai tai i ! its ow 'o ti *it+/ B*t.o8 that . i '"*di ! +o*r ear a d dear o es. with a"" -i ds o8 re"atio shi.ro("em is a .ro("em/ We ha. this ..erso ."e aro* d *s/ That is rea""+ the .e 'reated this e*roti' sit*atio 8or *s/ There is o s*'h thi ! as a i di.oid that is 'reated as a res*"t o8 o*r iso"atio / We a"wa+s wa t to 8i"" this em.ro("ems here/ A"" the e er!+ is (ei ! 'o s*med (+ the dema ds o8 the '*"t*re or so'iet+.es i to that . that is.a"*e s+stem is 'o s*mi ! a treme do*s amo* t o8 e er!+/ 01 B*t what ha. are . a d there is o s*'h thi ! as 8reedom o8 a'tio / I am ot ta"-i ! o8 a 8ata"isti' . to .er +o* wa t to 'a"" it.F7 We *se others to tr+ a d 8i"" this .e i i di. the rest o8 "i8e aro* d *s/ We a"" "i.ow how to add mome t*m to that .er+ i te""i!e t :*estio / Thro*!h +o*r dema d 8or a a swer to that :*estio it wa ts to ./ Yo* see.assed o to *s/ It has this :*estio whi'h +o* thi .oid. a +thi ! we 'a !et ho"d o8.a"*e s+stem is *si ! a treme do*s amo* t o8 e er!+.ro("ems.e" o8 what +o* 'a !et o*t o8 the re"atio shi.ro("em o8 re"atio shi. to 8it +o* i to the 8ramewor. or whate.i ! . the "i.id*a"/ These two thi !s ha.a"*e s+stem/ I the .er+ sim.s with others/ Witho*t re"atio shi. we are ot "e8t with a + e er!+ to dea" with the other . (*t I am ot.ro("ems/ B*t these . (e'a*se it 'a ot (e a + di88ere t.ow"ed!e/ 01 So it is a tri'-/ It is 8a"si8+i ! *s/ A1 It .e i toda+/ We are iso"ated 8rom the rest o8 'reatio .h+ or a + s*'h thi !/ It is this 8a't that is 8r*strati ! *s/ The dema d to 8it o*rse".id*a" 8rames/ We tr+ to esta("ish a re"atio shi.ow/ That is wh+ we a"wa+s as. e@'e.

. we wi"" ot (e a("e to 8* 'tio i this wor"d sa e"+ a d i te""i!e t"+/ This -i d o8 .ow"ed!e 'a (e *sed o "+ 8or the . a d I 'a"" this a 9tra+9/ Otherwise.e to a''e. +o* wa t to * dersta d the rea"it+ o8 the wor"d/ B*t there is othi ! to * dersta d/ There is o s*'h thi ! as rea"it+ at a""/ I ha.*r.*r.t the rea"it+ o8 the wor"d as it is im.8*". I 'a"" this a 9(e 'h9. or mea i !8*"/ . he". I 'a"" +o* a 9woma 9. with the i di.ose8*" a d mea i !8*" re"atio shi.id*a"s a d the wor"d aro* d +o*/ There8ore.osed o me (+ the so'iet+/ Sa+.oses o8 8* 'tio i ! i this wor"d sa e"+ a d i te""i!e t"+/ A +thi ! +o* do to * dersta d the rea"it+ o8 the wor"d is ot !oi ! to (e *se8*".

2%s there any meaning32 2%s there any purpose32 take away the li ing 'uality of life. /////// The belief in reincarnation is born out of the demand that something will continue after your so( called death. you know4 /////// The 'uestions. that mo ement of thought. 7or some reason that mechanism. that I am 8* 'tio i ! di88ere t"+ 8rom +o*/ B*t +o* a d I are 8* 'tio i ! i e@a't"+ the same wa+/ 01 ////e@'e.t that I am thi -i ! with tho*!hts i order to . /////// 0e olution only means re aluation of our alue system. /////// 01 How are +o* a d I di88ere tF I . *ut it is basically a modified continuity of the same.*ter with a e@traordi ar+ i te""i!e 'e.C(APTE! > 6eath is a !eshu88ling o8 Atoms $hen once it is a fact that there is no mo ement in any direction of impro ing. does not want to come to an end. and then they go at it again.i ! or!a ism is "i-e a 'om.er'e.ow/ The "i. simi"ar to the wa+ that ta. or e ol ing into anything different or better. if you want to know if there is anything beyond. +o* wa t to . /////// %t would be a horrible world if this planet were to be only full of 6esuses and *uddhas and all the other teachers.e re'order is 8* 'tio i !/ The re'order e. e. then what is there is something extraordinary. %t is the same mechanism which wants to know what will happen after death. %n that process what horrors we ha e committed. 1fter a while things settle down.er e ters m+ head/ It is thi -i ! that se.tio sF Or is there a + other di88ere 'eF A1 The tho*!ht that I am di88ere t 8rom +o* e.er. *ut. changing. You are li ing in a world of ideas. you ha e to die now.arates +o* a d te""s +o* that I am di88ere t 8rom +o*.er as-s the .ow/ A1 Yes.

this is somethi ! whi'h 'a (e meas*red/ We ha.*ter/ It te""s me that +o* are a woma a d I am a ma .ti ! that I am a "ow !rade moro / 9A''e.er+ i di.i ! i to a +thi ! di88ere t or (etter. modi8+ it. or e.art to im. what +o* are "e8t with is somethi ! e@traordi ar+/ It is ot i terested i 'om. there is a "ot o8 i te""i!e 'e i +o*//// A1 I a!ree that +o* are more i te""i!e t tha I am/ That is C*st (e'a*se o8 o*r (a'-!ro* d a d o*r hereditar+ di88ere 'es/ 01 Is there a + hi!her i te""i!e 'eF A1 Yo* are more i te""i!e t tha I am/ Yo* see. a't*a""+.ari ! itse"8 with +o*r i te""e't or a +thi !/ It is ot a :*estio o8 a''e.me the :*estio .arates +o* a d me.*ter here D. is a"read+ there i the 'om.:*estio .e. 'ha !e it.t o m+ .aratio / It is the . (*t +o* wa t to i trod*'e a e"eme t whi'h is ot . the what is there is somethi ! e@traordi ar+/ It is * i:*e i its ow wa+/ E.ro. we sho*"d .er8e't i di.*t i to the 'om. a d +o* are more i te""i!e t tha I am/ The who"e series o8 ideas that are .ta 'e9 is ot the word/ Whe o 'e it is a 8a't that there is o mo."e/ Thro*!h si"e 'e the+ 8ee" the+ are 'omm* i'ati ! somethi !/ B*t i that si"e 'e o 'omm* i'atio is e'essar+/ 01 What is the at*re o8 i te""i!e 'eF What does that word mea to +o*F A1 The o "+ mea i ! that I 'a 'ome *. I am ma-i ! the se.id*a"s/ 01 3at*reF .that si"e 'e is a mea s to * dersta d a +thi !F It is the !ame o8 a"" these re"i!io*s .eo.er+ :*estio that se.ow"ed!e that I ha.aratio F A1 Yo* are ma-i ! the se.er e ters m+ head at a""/ I8 +o* as. 7How am I 8* 'tio i !F7 A"" it eeds is the e er!+ there/ The e"e'tri'it+ is e'essar+ 8or its 8* 'tio i !/ B*t here the e er!+ is a sort o8 e@.*ter 'omes i to o.art o8 the 8* 'tio i ! o8 this "i.arates *s/ B*t a't*a""+ there are o :*estio s at a""/ A"" the :*estio s are (or o*t o8 the a swers we a"read+ ha.that there m*st (e somethi ! di88ere t here Di U/6/E/ 01 So.er8e't s.e'ies a d ot . ma-e it (etter.i ! si"e tF A1 Yo* thi . with is what we 8i d i the di'tio ar+/ 01 Oh we"".i ! or!a ism/ That is wh+ +o* (e!i to thi .id*a" is * i:*e/ 3at*re 'reates . 7Are +o* ot di88ere t 8rom meF7 a"" the .e m+ i te""i!e 'e. stored i the 'om.eratio / Yo*r :*estio (ri !s o*t the . 'ha !i !. wo*"d 'o s*me treme do*s amo* ts o8 e er!+/ That is a""/ Yo* see.ressio o8 "i8e/ E er!+ is a"read+ there/ B*t +o* are a"" the time as-i ! :*estio s/ The tho*!ht that I am di88ere t 8rom +o* e.ow"ed!e that is there.e 'ertai +ardsti'-s i the wor"d that sa+ that +o* are more i te""i!e t tha I am/ Those are a''e. that se.ro(a("+ (e -ee.o".ta("e to me/ B*t a + attem.oi ti ! to himse"8E/ These are two 'om.ro.eme t i a + dire'tio o8 im.*ters ta"-i !.e/ The+ are ot rea""+ the :*estio s/ 01 So. witho*t that.i !.

"a'e/ The who"e idea o8 restr*'t*ri ! is othi ! (*t a re.er+(od+ i a 'ommo mo*"d a d 'reate what we 'a"" the !reatest 'ommo 8a'tor/ A"" the time +o* are tr+i ! to ed*'ate them a d 8it them i to the .i ! or!a ism 00 the (irth.ior .oi ti ! to himse"8E/ 01 So +o* are sa+i ! +o* 'a ot .ow whether +o* are a"i.ro.e.i !. a d thi -s/ That is a idea/ So.A1 Per8e't s. (e'a*se that :*estio (ri !s a"" the .owA Is it rea""+ worth a"" thatF B*t +o* seem to thi .e o8 this "i.*"sati !/ 01 So tho*!ht is tr+i ! to e@. ot .ow"ed!e we ha. a d a"" that 00 is a(se t here D.ow"ed!e that we ha.e sF A1 The (a"a 'e o8 e er!+ i at*re has to (e mai tai ed 8or some reaso / I do 9t .h+sio"o!i'a""+.er8e't i di.o"*tio s ta-e .e .eo. the same te'h i:*e/ What is the . the i di.oi tF B*t we wi"" -ee. the death.id*a"s/ Per8e't i di.to the same s+stem.erie 'eF .oi t o8 time. a'ts.erie 'e somethi ! it has o 'a.ro.a"*e s+stem/ Re.e or deadF A1 3o wa+/ I8 +o* as. +o* .*t e..eme t/ B*t it is (asi'a""+ a modi8ied 'o ti *it+ o8 the same/ I that .+o* a(o*t deathF What is deathF A1 I at*re there is o s*'h thi ! as death (*t o "+ a resh*88"i ! o8 atoms/ DLa*!hsE 01 What ha. +o* .er+ h*ma (ei ! is di88ere t/ That is a"" I am sa+i !/ There is o(od+ "i-e +o* a +where i this wor"d/ I te"" +o*.ow wh+/ So death o''*rs o "+ whe there is a eed 8or the atoms to mai tai the (a"a 'e o8 e er!+ i the * i.i ! h*ma (ei !s/ B*t we ha. ."a et were to (e o "+ 8*"" o8 .i ! h*ma (ei ! 8* 'tio s. !oi ! that wa+/ 01 <a I as."e +o* !o (a'.me the :*estio .a"*e s+stem does ot wor-.er8e't (*t the s.i ! at this mome t a d ot dead/ The .a'it+ to e@. a d tr+ to .eme t a!ai / Or there is a s"i!ht im.e or deadF7 I wo*"d sa+ I am .erie 'i ! the 8a't that this is a "i.es*ses a d B*ddhas a d a"" the other tea'hers/ 01 It wo*"d (e horri("e a d terri("e/ A1 ////"i-e 8i""i ! this who"e earth with o "+ roses o8 o e -i d/ It wo*"d (e a horri("e .oi t o8 time a d is !oi ! to die at a other .e 'ommitted.ow/ B*t we i! ore that.a"*e s+stem/ It is the same thi !/ A8ter a whi"e thi !s sett"e dow . at*ra""+ re.arti'*"ar .erse/ It is othi ! (*t a resh*88"i ! o8 atoms/ This or!a ism has o wa+ o8 8i di ! o*t that it was (or at a .e'ies.id*a"s are 'reated (+ the re"i!io*s thi -i ! o8 ma / We ha. 7Are +o* a"i. o(od+A I am ta"-i ! .es the mode" o8 .eF7 I wo*"d sa+ that I am a"i.that it is/ A8ter -i""i ! so ma + . a d a"so that it is "i.id*a" is 9t . tho*!ht is dead/ It is tr+i ! to 'a.me a :*estio .e a(o*t the (eha.er+ m*'h a"i.a"*e s+stem/ I8 that .e o wa+ o8 e@.*t (e8ore o*rse".t*re somethi ! that is "i.atter s o8 "i.es*s a d B*ddha a d a"" these re"i!io*s tea'hers/ It wo*"d (e a horri("e wor"d i8 this .e/ Be'a*se the :*estio is (or o*t o8 the idea o8 how a "i. i8 +o* as.o"*tio o "+ mea s re.ro'ess what horrors we ha. 7Are +o* a"i. a d the the+ !o at it a!ai / There is o im.a"*atio o8 o*r .a"*atio o8 the o"d .i ! thi !/ Yo* see. at*ra""+."a'e/ That is what ed*'atio is doi ! to *s/ 01 So.e'ies is////F A1 E.

e a8ter death/ For e@a't"+ the same reaso +o* are as-i ! the :*estio .i ! or!a ism has o wa+ o8 .it+F7 m+ a swer wo*"d (e e!ati.*m. 7Is there a + s*'h thi ! as rei 'ar atio as the other "aws i at*re "i-e !ra. death wi"" ta-e .i ! i a wor"d o8 ideas/ 01 Is there "i8e a8ter deathF A1 A +thi ! I sa+ wo*"d ot (e o8 m*'h i terest to .me whether there is a + s*'h thi ! as rei 'ar atio .ro'ess/ I8 +o* to*'h a "i. it is a di88ere t matter/ The (e"ie8 i rei 'ar atio is (or o*t o8 the dema d that somethi ! wi"" 'o ti *e a8ter +o*r so0'a""ed death/ It is the same me'ha ism whi'h wa ts to ."a+ with it.ose i "i8eF7 For some reaso that me'ha ism.a 8* dame ta" :*estio .e/ 01 A d +o* said that those who (e"ie.eo.i ! :*a"it+ o8 "i8e/ Yo* are "i. o e i""*sio with a other i""*sio / That is a"" that we are doi !/ 01 I wa ted to as."e as.er a swer (e'a*se it is the (e"ie8 whi'h is im.it+ is/ B*t i8 +o* wa t to (e"ie.*r."e d+i ! there/ So. a d there is o rei 'ar atio 8or those who do ot (e"ie.*r. does ot wa t to 'ome to a e d/ Yo* ha.eo.ow that it is .eo. that there is a s.ow i8 there is a +thi ! (e+o d.A1 3o 'a.e wire. is there a + .eme t o8 tho*!ht.e the * dersta di ! mi *s the tho*!htsF A1 The heart does ot 8or a mome t . that there is a so*" here.art o8 at*re as !ra. +o* ha. 7Is there a + mea i !F7 7Is there a + ."e/ Whe ..e i it/ It is ot a '"e. tho*!ht does 9t wa t to to*'h itB it wa ts to .+o* a other :*estio //// A1 The a swer wi"" (e the same/ DLa*!hsE ."a'e/ The the :*estio whether there is a a8ter"i8e wo*"d ot at a"" arise."a'e o e (e"ie8 with a other.*t o !"o. 7Am I doi ! it ri!htF7 It is C*st 8* 'tio i !/ It does ot as.es a d ta"a(o*t it/ 01 4oes the (od+ ha.i ! ("ood/ It is ot as-i ! the :*estio .e to die ow/ Whe the :*estio or (e"ie8 a(o*t that 'omes to a e d."a'e here ri!ht ow/ <"i i'a" death wi"" ta-e .a'it+ (e'a*se it ma+ (e (*r t i that .e.oseF7 To me. 7Is there a + mea i !.irit here. that :*estio has o mea i !/ The :*estio s.ow what wi"" ha.e see .o si("e 8or that (e"ie8 that there m*st (e somethi ! (e+o d/ B*t i8 +o* wa t to . is what is res. +o* are 8i ished/ So. a d .e i rei 'ar atio //// A1 The (e"ie8 has to !o/ The e d o8 (e"ie8 is death/ 01 So death e ds a"" (e"ie8sF A1 B*t +o* re.owi ! that it is a"i. a de8i ite 73o/7 It is ot as m*'h . m+ a swer is that there is rei 'ar atio 8or those who (e"ie. (e'a*se the "i.the :*estio .oseF7 ta-e awa+ the "i.*r. the (e"ie8 that there is a 'e ter here. that mo.orta t/ I8 +o* as. 7Is there a + .e that it is so.e i it.

or anywhere else. +o we want to. %t is like preparing yourself all the time for war hoping that there will be peace. pleasure without pain. %f not hate. eternal peace. *ut we ha e turned that. the one thing that anybody and e erybody wants in this world is to ha e happiness without one moment of unhappiness. or this or that. in 0ussia.e/ A1 Oh. m+ 6odA Oh. lo ing relationships. it is a war. is merely a biological need. make them into lo ing affairs. into a pleasure mo ement. /////// You are not in li ing touch with anything. because this li ing organism does not know what pleasure is. what you call sexual acti ity. it is antipathy. and you e en settle for that horrible.? Se@ is Pain8ul to the &ody 8b iously. what we are left with is hate. /////// $hen once lo e fails to establish the perfectly ideal relationship between two indi iduals. our relationships are not so lo ing. $hat an amount of energy we are putting into making our relationship into a lo ing thing4 %t is a battle. /////// 01 I wa ted to as. what happiness is. somehow. non( lo ing relationship. m+ 6odA DLa*!hsE . other forms of life. That is just not possible. as it is in the case of other species. 1nything you superimpose on that is totally unrelated to the li ing organism.+o* a(o*t "o. You are tired of this battle. if it is left to itself. because the li ing organism has this object to sur i e and produce one like itself. /////// $hether you are here. /////// +exuality.C(APTE! . which is biological in its nature.

es me/ Where.eF A1 Yo* wa t me to !i. with this 8a '+ idea that there m*st (e "o..e a . or this or that/ Yo* are tired o8 this (att"e.eF Lo.ow/ I "o.i ! re"atio shi.ea'e. a d +o* e.e m+ do!/ DBoth "a*!hE This ma+ so* d .i ! that there wi"" (e .e (ee -i""edF More tha a"" the re'e t wars .ositi.io*s"+.i ! a88airs.e th+ ei!h(or as th+se"8F It is C*st ot . o*r re"atio shi.e m+ 'o* tr+.eo.s are ot so "o. "o.e a + '"e.e m+ do!. I "o.e a swer to +o*r :*estio / I am ot tr+i ! to e. I "o.er or di."omati' a swer/ Wh+ are we as-i ! a(o*t "o. ma-e them i to "o.iew/ I am ot dod!i !/ I do 9t wa t to !i.e is a other o8 these tho*!htsF A1 Yes.e m+ wi8e.e sett"e 8or that horri("e.e itse"8/ There is o se.id*a"s/ 01 Betwee whate./ A d +o* ho.eF A1 It does ot "o. a d there is war/ 01 So. whi'h is dema di ! somethi ! 8rom *s.i ! re"atio shi. h*ma (ei !s as.er////F A1 Betwee whate. +o* ."e ha.arate ess here/ 01 Is that a"" there is to "o. i to a "o."e sa+ a(o*t "o.re. or I "o. eter a" .e (etwee these two i di.er+ '+ i'a" to +o*/ The 8a't o8 the matter is that there is o di88ere 'e/ Yo* "o.e m+ wi8e. there is o "o.e/ A1 What do +o* thi .*t to!ether/ How 'a +o* "o. "o.ade/ This is ot a .e a d dream o e da+ it wi"" (e othi ! (*t "o. somehow.eo. 'reated (+ tho*!ht/ 01 <a the (od+ ot "o. a d what e"se/ What is the di88ere 'e 00 whether I "o.isio .01 I .e some(od+ a d some(od+ e"se "o. it is a war/ It is "i-e .e m+ 'o* tr+.e/ 7Lo.ow either/ 01 Is there a other////F A1 There m*st (e two.er 00 I "o.ow/ A1 I do 9t .e +o*r 'o* tr+.eF 01 We"".*tti ! i to ma-i ! o*r re"atio shi. o 0"o.e/ We are tr+i ! to (rid!e this !a.ow what . whi'h has o mea i !.a(o*t that//// A1 O(.i !/ So we wa t to.i ! thi !A It is a (att"e.er there is di.ossi("e/ . I "o. there 'a 9t (e "o.a(o*t itF 01 I do 9t .e m+ 'o* tr+.s/ 01 So it ma-es *s 8ee" that//// A1 What a amo* t o8 e er!+ we are .o"iti'a" i ter.ari ! +o*rse"8 a"" the time 8or war ho.e th+ ei!h(or as th+se"8007 i the ame o8 that how ma + mi""io s o8 .ea'e. whi'h is horri("e 8or *s.

o8 that as a e@.er+ sim.id*a"s what we are "e8t with is hate/ I8 ot hate. a.eme t i their 'ase/ I am ot sa+i ! a +thi ! a!ai st the .rod*'i ! their ow s. a d he".*tti ! that sim.it is im.er .romis'*o*s or *se se@ as a mea s o8 s.eo.ro.rod*'tio / 3ot that the+ 9*se9 it.eme t/ I am ot sa+i ! a +thi ! a!ai st the . as it is i the 'ase o8 other s. is mere"+ a (io"o!i'a" eed.rod*'e o e "i-e itse"8/ A +thi ! +o* s*.ossi("e 8or *s to ha."a'eF 01 It is *sed to se""//// A1 Yes.ath+. it is a ti.e 8ai"s to esta("ish the .oses o8 re. (e'a*se the "i."eas*re mo.io*s"+B otherwise. 'hi"dre .e se@ at a + time we wa t thro*!h the he".erie 'eF A1 It is a . s*re.er8e't"+ idea" re"atio shi.01 4o +o* thi ."ess .i !. a d a"" -i ds o8 (oo-s 00 a d ma-e it i teresti !/ It is ot .oor/ 01 That is !ood e o*!h//// What a(o*t se@*a"it+F Is that C*st a re. (etwee "o.i ! or!a ism/ P The re"i!io*s ma has t*r ed that i to somethi ! (i!.it wi"" 8a"" i to its .ow/ DBoth "a*!hE Whe o 'e "o."eas*re mo.ose o that is tota""+ * re"ated to the "i.ow/ A1 Yes.i ! or!a ism/ B*t we ha.oi ti ! o*t the *se to whi'h we are .irit*a" attai me t/ 3o/ 01 So. i8 it is "e8t to itse"8. or what other words////F M+ . I am ot a!ai st that/ P"ease do 9t !et me wro !/ I am C*st .ossi("e 8or a + h*ma (ei !F A1 O(."e -i""edF 01 3o/ B*t there are a"so !ood ei!h(ors +o* ."eas*re mo.e se@ at a + time the+ wa t/ A ima"s *se it o "+ 8or re.erim. other 8orms o8 "i8e. whi'h is (io"o!i'a" i its at*re.irit*a" e@. +o* sa+ se@ 'a ot (e a s.rod*'ti.e'ies/ It is ot a . some other mea i !8*"////F A1 Se@*a"it+.e t*r ed that i to somethi ! e@traordi ar+/ A"" 'ommer'ia"ism is re"ated to se@/ How do +o* thi .ath+. wh+ are so ma + . wome .*r.e 8* 'tio or does it he". o8 tho*!ht/ 01 So. +o* see/ Yo*r ta".astati !A Most o8 the wor"d 8or s*re thi -s that "o.er+ .e to write (oo-s 00 the . the >ama S*tras.e a d .eo.e'ies.s+'ho"o!ists ha.it+.ossi("e 8or a ima"s to ha. that is o e o8 the wa+s tho*!ht has se.arated *s 8rom the rest o8 the wor"dF A1 The it is a (ore a!ai / We ha."eas*re mo. (*t it is 8or the .eme t/ I am ot i terested i sa+i ! that +o* sho*"d 'o dem that or (e'ome .e t*r ed that."e 8* 'tio i ! o8 the "i."e (io"o!i'a" 8* 'tio / I am ot 'o dem i ! it/ It is there.e has o mea i ! to me/ 01 The there is o re"atio shi.ressio o8 "o.i. +o* .eme t/ It has (e'ome .o'a(*"ar+ is .o+ o8 Lo. a d 'o 'e trated o the 'o tro" o8 se@/ A8ter that the .i ! or!a ism has this o(Ce't to s*r. (etwee two i di.e a d se@F A1 3o/ 01 That is rea""+ de.e witho*t se@ is "i-e a 'o"d ha d0 sha-e/ . +es. i to a . what +o* 'a"" se@*a" a'ti."e.

*t it/ It wo*"d 8a"" i to its .ossi("e 8or e."eas*re isF A1 It does 9t e.ow what .er+(od+ wa t i this wor"d is to ha..ossi("e thro*!h some dr*!s "i-e 9e'stas+9. the at*ra" wa+/ .*r. (e'a*se this "i.it+ o8 the (od+/ 01 How do +o* sa+ thatF A1 Yo* are ot i "i.e it as it is."eas*ra("e se satio s a d ot a + ."eas*ra("e se satio s dist*r( it/ The mome t there is a .astati ! sit*atio / I8 +o* "ea.i ! to*'h with a +thi ! there/ 01 ////so tho*!ht is se. or a +where e"se.i ess witho*t o e mome t o8 * ha..e ha.er .er+(od+ that he sho*"d a"wa+s (e ha. a d rea"it+ 00 whi'h are othi ! (*t *"timate ..e s i8 +o* i d*"!e i s*'h thi !sF A1 I the "o ! r* it destro+s the se siti. it is ot rea""+ a de."a'e/ That is wh+ we ha."eas*res/ 01 Is that a !oa" tooF A1 Whether +o* are here.ow what .er+ 'om8orti !/ I8 se@ is *sed o "+ 8or the (io"o!i'a" . the o e thi ! that a +(od+ a d e. (*t 8or how "o !F 01 What ha.i ! or!a ism does ot .i ess is/ 01 The or!a ism does ot ."eas*re is.arati ! *s 8rom the at*ra" wa+F A1 Yes.ossi("e."eas*ra("e se satio . .e o "+ .i ess.e ted a"" these other thi !s 00 6od.A1 We wo*"d "o.. the dema d to e@te d it "o !er a d "o !er is there/ That is wh+ there is this treme do*s 8r*stratio there/ Yo* wa t to ma-e it . i R*ssia. it wo*"d 9t (e so horri("e."easa t or .. what ha.e to ."eas*re witho*t .ose.e i .e wa t it/ 01 It wa ts (*t it has 9t//// A1 It does 9t wa t it.ai / That is C*st ot . the wa+ +o* wo*"d "i-e to .ai 8*" o es/ It ma+ (e .+ a d that he sho*"d ha.*t it that wa+ (e'a*se it is . (e'a*se a"" these . as I said. tr*th.ro.

1ll these notions are created by thought. e en those of chronological time. The so(called psychological images ha e no place in the scheme of things. $e accept them as workable. are arbitrary. so that it can maintain its continuity through some petty little experience. a d I . *ut there is no way that this physical functioning can create any image. /////// 1ll ideas of time. let alone higher consciousness. 1ll measurements are arbitrary. you are also going to be destroyed with them.ow +o* do 9t wa t to ta".erie 'es. The eyes are like a camera. %f you turn the camera from what it is looking at to something else. it is not lo e. and there is no way you can free yourself from that.nowledge creates images. /////// E en the idea that you should control your thought in order to be in a thoughtless or peaceful state is created by thought. 1nything you do to free yourself from that alue system is adding momentum to it. /////// .a(o*t them//// .. worship. the whole thing where it was focused on earlier is wiped out.erso a" e@. that is all. /////// There is no such thing as consciousness at all. may keep us together for a little while now. -ertainly. super( consciousness or cosmic consciousness.C(APTE! . A Freak o8 Nature The alue system has created "you". /////// The terror that if you try to destroy people around you. /////// 01 I wa t to as. or religious thinking. through some thoughtless state you are interested in. bliss.+o* a(o*t +o*r .

a"" the e..a"id a d tr*e/ Yo* ha.. there is o stor+ to te""/ I am here toda+ ta"-i ! to +o*B tomorrow I wi"" (e somewhere e"se ta"-i ! to m+ 8rie dsB a d the da+ a8ter tomorrow I wi"" (e i E !"a d/ That is a""/ So.e ts i m+ "i8e (e8ore that.er+ a @io*s to .er has ha.ow what I did. there is o stor+ to te""/ That is the reaso wh+ I mai tai that whate.t m+ word/ I8 +o* do 9t a''e.ossi("e 8or e.e to a''e. a d the str*!!"ed a d str*!!"ed so hard/ .arti'*"ar time.e ed to me. i that . whate.eo.irit*a" ideasF Is there a + traditio that +o* .er was their state o8 (ei ! with the wa+ I was 8* 'tio i !.er+thi ! I did/ B*t +o* are i terested i 8i di ! o*t how a d wh+ that .ow/ I 'a 9t sa+/ I am ot i terested i sa+i ! a +thi ! a(o*t them/ 01 B*t what a(o*t a"" the ideas 00 the re"i!io*s ideas thro*!h the a!es.+ them.e (ee dis'arded (+ at*reF A1 Yes.er ha..ite e.e ed des.ed me to st*m("e i to this -i d o8 thi !.e it there/ There are so ma + 8rea-ish thi !s there i at*re/ I8 +o* tr+ to 'o.*("i' ma / I am here a + mome t +o* wa t to see what I am doi !.A1 Oer+ o8te ."e as. a"" that is 8a"se as 8ar as I am 'o 'er ed a d it has 8a"si8ied me/ So do 9t as. a d ma-e it .h+si'a""+ or otherwise/ 01 So +o* ha.e dis'arded 8or !ood/ 01 How ma +F A1 I do 9t .ow what U/6/ is doi !..e do e to a"" those dis'arded . at that .ate "i8e o8 m+ ow / A + time +o* wa t to .e o . dis'arded (+ at*re/ How 'a +o* t*r this i to a mode"F That is what we ha.oi ti ! to his (od+E/ It has dis'arded it (e'a*se it 'a ot re.me the :*estio .me s*'h :*estio s/ B*t "et me te"" +o*.e ed to me ha.arti'*"ar thi ! I am ta"-i ! a(o*t has ha.eo.ite e.e i ! i m+ "i8e .e at*re has o *se 8or this (od+ D.e o re"e.. ha."e whom we sho*"d ha..e had//// A1 I do 9t . what I did ot do.arti'*"ar sit*atio .e t.e ed (e8ore whate.e wa ti ! to * dersta d that has o mea i ! to +o*/ Yo* C*st "ea.e ed des. +o* 'a see/ So.a 'e to the wa+ I am 8* 'tio i ! ow/ A d 8rom that mome t o .er+thi ! I did/ Some o8 the (io!ra.o8 at*re/ 01 B*t we wo*"d (e i terested i . +o* are "ost/ Yo* are i the same sit*atio as (e8ore/ E.owi ! what the 8rea.er+(od+ to st*m("e i to this -i d o8 thi !/ That is somethi ! whi'h 'a ot (e . s.e ed to me a d ot to e. a"" 1G ho*rs/ I ha.hers who are -ee o writi ! the stor+ o8 m+ "i8e are .o8 at*re was i U/6/ A1 E.eo.oi t/ I do 9t wa t to (e 8a"si8ied (e'a*se that is ot the wa+ I 8* 'tio / I wa ted to re"ate whate.t what I sa+. or ha.er+(od+/ Yo* wa t to esta("ish a 'a*se a d e88e't re"atio shi.e ed to me has ha. that is ot the .ow (esides////F A1 I 'a sa+ o e thi !& that is.rod*'ed or re. 7How 'a a"" o8 them (e 8a"seF7 3o.er has ha. there is othi ! that a +(od+ 'a te"" me a8ter that/ I am a .er had ha."e who ha.ow/ Pro(a("+ +o* 'a 'o* t o +o*r 8i !ers/ 01 The . what he".ri. ass*mi ! 8or a mome t that some e. o''*rre 'e..rod*'e somethi ! "i-e this either ..rod*'ed o a assem("+ "i e/ It is a 8rea. it does 9t matter/ Whate.*t me where I am toda+/ B*t that is ot somethi ! .

i8 there is o e i this wor"d. some 'osmi' .o8F A1 I8 there is a + s*'h thi !.er o''*rred to me at that time/ What I was sa+i ! a whi"e a!o was that tho*!ht 'a ot (e *sed as a i str*me t/ Yo* 'a *se it to 'o tro".ress itse"8 a d he".er+ do!. a d mo"d the .ow"ed!e/ Otherwise.i't*re/ B*t the ima!es. the who"e thi ! o the other side is wi. eed the he". ot a ima!e/ 4o +o* * dersta dF 7She is . the .ressio o8 that/ Wh+ sho*"d at*re or somethi !. me.e. e.i!. (e'a*se it is that whi'h has 'reated what +o* 'a"" 9+o*9/ 01 What 'reated meF A1 The . a d there is o wa+ +o* 'a 8ree +o*rse"8 8rom that/ A +thi ! +o* do to 8ree +o*rse"8 8rom that . sha.eo.er+ 9shar. there is o wa+ +o* 'a reCe't it.ower. o8 .h+si'a" 8* 'tio i ! 'a 'reate a + ima!e/ The mome t I t*r to this side."e s. +o*.at +o* a d sa+ a +thi ! a(o*t +o*/ The e+es a't o "+ as 'ameras/ 01 So there is o wa+ +o* 'a . a d it is a word0 .. 7Was 9t she . e.er+(od+.a"*e s+stem has 'reated 9+o*9.ressio o8 it as a + o8 these '"aima ts/ E. a d there is o eed 8or that to *se a + 'ha e" other tha +o*/ Yo* are a e@.e o wa+ o8 8reei ! +o*rse"8 8rom it thro*!h tho*!ht/ E.art o8 that . I am ot se.ow"ed!e I ha.t thro*!h the .ear.ressio o8 that same thi !/ The+ mi!ht ha.rett+9 is a word. e.er0'o s'io*s ess or 'osmi' 'o s'io*s ess/ A"" these otio s are 'reated (+ tho*!ht/ We were dis'*ssi ! this mor i ! the idea that 'o s'io*s ess is a 'o 'e. thro*!h some tho*!ht"ess state +o* are i terested i / 01 What a(o*t these states o8 hi!her 'o s'io*s ess that .ressio o8 that/ B*t I e.e :*estio 'o s'io*s ess itse"8/ There is o s*'h thi ! as 'o s'io*s ess at a"". s*.ett+ "itt"e e@.97/ A other word/ I wi"" ta".e 6e !his >ha a d Hit"er are a e@.ea.a"*e s+stem/ B*t +o* ha.a"*e s+stem is addi ! mome t*m to it/ This is the o e thi ! that e. a d e.es o / B*t i8 he as-s me.er'ei.rett+ woma 00 a"" this is .assed o to me/ The 8a't that I sa+ that +o* are a woma . o8 some(od+ to e@. a d that +o* are a .ed o*t/ 01 I disa. +o* are a e@.e a'ted i a di88ere t wa+/ Yo* a d I ma+ a't i a di88ere t wa+/ B*t we are a"" e@. e.er the+ are 8o'*si ! themse".e a +thi ! e@'e.01 Yo* str*!!"ed////F A1 It !ot me owhere/ So.ressio s o8 the same thi !.ow"ed!eF A1 > ow"ed!e 'reates ima!es/ B*t there is o wa+ that this .e a(o*t +o*.ea'e8*" state is 'reated (+ tho*!ht.rett+F7 9.ow"ed!e/ I (e'ome 'o s'io*s o8 +o* o "+ thro*!h the .a(o*t +o* i words. +o* are as m*'h a e@.ear/ DLa*!hsE A1 Yo* disa.arate 8rom +o*/ There is o wa+ I 'a "oo. whi'h has (ee .er+ 'ow that +o* see. (e'a*se the e+es are ot "oo-i ! at +o* (*t at him or at that 'hair or at whate. othersF I do 9t see a + eed/ I8 there is a +thi ! "i-e that. the !arde s"*! there.h+si'a" ima!es are tota""+ a(se t/ . that +o* are a i te""i!e t woma . "et a"o e hi!her 'o s'io*s ess.erie 'e. so that it 'a mai tai its 'o ti *it+ thro*!h some .e the idea that +o* sho*"d 'o tro" +o*r tho*!ht i order to (e i a tho*!ht"ess or .t/ Yo* (e'ome 'o s'io*s o8 thi !s o "+ thro*!h the he".er+ 'at..er+ .

ro(a("+ the so* ds/ These da+s the+ are di'tati ! to 'om.i't*re is here/ That is a"" I !i.ro("em/ 7I saw or met a e@traordi ari"+ i te""i!e t woma .The so0'a""ed .*ter D. I am +o*r da*!hter/ What does that mea to +o*F7 It does 9t mea a +thi ! to me/ I8 I ha.e some di88i'*"t+ there. the se se o8 to*'h does ot sa+ that this is hard DU/6/ to*'hes the arm o8 the 'hairE/ B*t o 'e +o* ha.ro("em is . +o* sa+ it is hard. (e'a*se tho*!ht 'reates a s. I am as-i ! +o*/ How wo*"d +o* des'ri(e thatF A1 The same word that I *se/ Yo* see. a d .*ters wi"" ha.e the .er the di'tio ar+ mea i ! o8 the word is/ 01 ////that is there i o*r s+stem/ A1 The ima!e we ha.i't*re.ow"ed!e.ow"ed!e that I ha.i't*re/ I8 I am ot "oo-i ! at +o*.ro("em/ So.e o wa+ o8 'reati ! the ima!e i side o8 me/ So.e to "ear the a''e t/ These da+s +o* do 9t ha. I 'a ot 'reate a + ima!e. 7This is m+ da*!hterB7 that is.e to !o 8ast/ There is othi ! that +o* 'a do a(o*t it/ 3othi !/ 3ot a thi !/ 01 What is .osed o that word/ That is rea""+ the .e it/ That is the wa+ the so* ds are re!istered here i this 'om.er+ sim.. the . a .h+si'a" ima!es ha. i8 we o("iterate tho*!ht.e is s*. 8or i sta 'e. matter wo*"d !o too/ A1 4e8i itio s are o8 o i terest to me.e a(o*t it//// 01 What is matterF A1 What is matterF Yo* wa t a de8i itio F Tho*!ht 'reates matter/ 01 That is what I was wo deri ! a(o*t/ A1 That is what I am sa+i !/ 01 So. i8 +o* to*'h somethi ! hard.e .e .e to t+. 7Who is sheF7 I wi"" sa+. (e'a*se what is there is e er!+/ . whate.e o .*ters/ The+ ha.ow/ 01 3o.s+'ho"o!i'a" ima!es ha.e 00 a word0 ."a'e i the s'heme o8 thi !s/ The e+es are "i-e a 'amera/ I8 +o* t*r the 'amera 8rom what it is "oo-i ! at to somethi ! e"se.ast . the who"e thi ! where it was 8o'*sed o ear"ier is wi."e/ I do 9t . the .oi ti ! to his headE is o "+ the word0.ow"ed!e.e ed to (e e@t to her a d i8 some(od+ as-s me.erim.a'e here a d the e ormo*s .ed o*t/ A d what is there i the 'om. whe a I dia is s. 7This is m+ ha d/7 01 The what is matterF What is (asi' matterF A1 There is o matter at a""/ Matter is tho*!ht/ Yo* see. 7See. it 'eases to (e a .ro("ems o8 dea"i ! with a''e t/ <om. (e'a*se the e+e is ot 8o'*sed o +o*/ The .ow what +o* "oo"i-e as I ha.rett+ woma 007 what does that mea F M+ da*!hter sometimes as-s me.oi ti ! to himse"8E/ The word0.ea-i ! with a I dia a''e t/ The+ wi"" ha.h+si'a"& What is matterF A1 Yo* do 9t e.*ter D.

e those o8 'hro o"o!i'a" time.a'e.ow/ B*t o*rs has (e'ome . to e@.erie 'e the s.a'e at a""/ Yo* 'a sa+ there is o tho*!ht.7 is a stateme t whi'h (+ itse"8 has o mea i ! at a""/ 01 This stateme t. the tho*!ht 'reates s. a d 8o*r r*.t*re it.7 the ma said/ There e ds o*r mathemati's. is there a tho*!htF At the .erie 'e s.art o8 this matterF A1 There is o tho*!ht/ There are o "+ tho*!hts/ Is there a tho*!ht there i +o*F 01 S*re..ow a(o*t/ B*t what there is is o "+ a(o*t tho*!hts 00 a"" the de8i itio s/ 7Tho*!ht is matter.h+si'ists/ B*t the+ a"so sa+ that there is o s*'h thi ! as tho*!ht. there is o s*'h thi ! as s. e.a'e.er+ (e!i i ! I said the (rai is ot a 'reator/ Tho*!hts are ot s. o8 the memor+.t them as wor-a("e.a'e/ There is o wa+ +o* 'a e@.e tho*!htF A1 Pro(a("+ the+ ha. 7Wh+ sho*"d two a d two (e 8o*rF7 The ma (ro*!ht 8o*r a. a d o e witho*t twoF 74o 9t as.e" to or 8rom I dia. 7Tho*!ht is matter.7 has o mea i !F A1 Has o mea i ! at a""/ I ha.e some -i d o8 tho*!ht/ I do 9t .a'e. a d there is o s*'h thi ! as time/ B*t what is a"" this time0a d0s.o ta eo*s/ The+ 'ome 8rom o*tside/ Yo* tra s"ate that . as . 8o*r ma !oes.er the dista 'e. are ar(itrar+/ A"" meas*reme ts are ar(itrar+/ We a''e."i'ated/ 01 Is there tho*!ht.ses/ Is there s. to 'a. 7I am ot i terested i that/ Is there *m(er two witho*t *m(er o e.e e@.h+si'istsF A1 We do 9t 'are a(o*t the .erie 'e s. a d the time is e'essar+ to 'o.set some .a'eF 3o/ There is o s."es. there is o s. +o* miss o e da+ or +o* !ai o e da+/ A"" ideas o8 time.a'e has o mea i !/ There is o wa+ +o* 'a e@. arithmeti'/ I ta-e .arti'*"ar oise D oise o8 th* derE with the he". h*ma tho*!ht.a'e.tio that there is a tho*!ht whi'h +o* wa t to . there is o s*'h thi ! as matter.that :*estio (e'a*se o8 the ass*m.a(o*t it/ A1 3o.me those :*estio s. a d do somethi ! with it/ So. a d there is o time/ First. we ta".er+ 'om./m/ here a d 11 a/m/ the e@t mor i ! somewhere e"se/ We are 11 ho*rs (ehi d/ I8 +o* tra.a'e/ It is tho*!ht that 'reates it/ A +thi ! +o* sa+ a(o*t s. whi'h is e*ro s/ The+ te"" +o* that the oise is th* der/ Yo* re'o! i?e that/ That is a"" there is to it 00 the i 8ormatio / What is tho*!htF We as.ees/ Said the (o+."e@ a d 'om.01 We were ta"-i ! a(o*t matter/ Matter is 'reated (+ tho*!ht/ I8 we did ot thi -////F A1 Tho*!ht is matter/ 01 What a(o*t the do!s whi'h do 9t ha."ai ed wh+ tho*!ht is matter (e'a*se//// 01 That has *. 8o*r ora !es. that is a""/ As a "itt"e (o+ as-ed a ma . +o* 'reate tho*!ht. the time 'omes i / B*t there is o time/ The o "+ time that is there is ar(itrar+/ It is 11 . there is o matter.a'e 'o ti **mF S*'h a 'o ti **m is e'essar+ 8or themB otherwise their who"e resear'h 'o""a.

e to do a thi !/ .er+ '"ear is& do these tho*!hts 'ome 8rom o*tside .e to ed*'ate them.eo.e di ! *. as the 'ase ma+ (e/ So is there matterF Is there s.a'eF This is ot meta.e ed to (e i at that . tea'h them . i8 there is a te de '+ to thie. the -i""i ! is sim.e to as.eo.atriotism. o8 !e es rather tha thro*!h the ..id*a" rather tha !i.e 8or the .e i 6od. it is a "ot easier to 'ha !e that. there is a"wa+s a re8ere 'e .eo.arti'*"ar time/ E.e i 6od or ot to (e"ie. (*t a"so.m+se"8 that :*estio (e'a*se there is o .e i the area o8 'o* ti !. (*t 8rom the o +o* a't "i-e a ma'hi e !* a d -i"" .e that the tota"it+ o8 .erie 'i ! s. to (e"ie."er/ Yo* as."e do thi !s witho*t a + resista 'e/ 3ow +o* ha. to a !reater e@te t.a'e/ Witho*t tho*!ht there is o wa+ what +o* 'a"" 9+o*9 'a (e se. what -i d o8 h*ma (ei ! do we wa t o this .er+ reaso to (e"ie.eo.e there.i ! him "e't*res o mora"it+ a d tea'hi ! him/ It ta-e +ears a d +ears that wa+/ 01 So 'ha !e 'a ha.er reaso . it ta-es +ears a d +ears to ma-e a ma (e"ie..that s'ie tists are doi ! i !e eti' e !i eeri !F A1 I am a"" 8or it. m*'h "ess what the .e.h+si's that I am ta"-i ! a(o*t.erie 'e s.es. or to (e"ie.ees. thro*!h the ma i. ma-e them sa"*te the 8"a!.er/ There is a tho*!ht s.here i whi'h we are a"" 8* 'tio i !/ B*t o e :*estio DI do 9t as."e/ Yo* see.ossi(i"it+ o8 e@. or 8o*r r*("es.e i somethi ! a d 8ree him 8rom somethi ! e"se/ I8 there is a te de '+ toward a"'oho"ism.ow"ed!e is ot o "+ tra smitted thro*!h o*r ed*'atio i a"" 8orms.*"atio / .me 8or 8o*r do""ars.ro("em o8 -i""i !. (*t i8 it is ha ded o."e either to (e"ie.e +o* 8o*r do""ars.e thro*!h (io"o!i'a" ma i."a etF What -i dF What do +o* wa t a h*ma (ei ! to (eF What is +o*r a swerFP What +o* wa t 'a (e 'reated thro*!h the he". we a"wa+s thi . or am I i terested i 8i di ! a a swer 8or itE 8or whi'h the a swer is ot . de. I 'o* t a d !i. the+ wi"" *se it to ma-e .oi t i .ri'e o8 a . a d de!rees. there is a re8ere 'e .8or !ra ted that two a d two is 8o*r/ I8 +o* as.a'it+ to "ear ot o "+ "a !*a!es (*t a "a !*a!e is !e eti'a""+ 'o tro""ed/ 01 What do +o* thi .arated/ What +o* 'a"" 9+o*9 is tho*!ht/ There is o 9+o*9 there other tha this dema d to e@. the im.eme ts are i time/ 01 Where do a"" these tho*!hts 'ome 8romF A1 The+ are a"" o. or are the+ a"so tra smitted thro*!h the !e esF I ha.arti'*"ar thi !.ee or the . thro*!h the !e es/ 3ow the+ are sa+i ! that the 'a. si?es.o whi'h 'o* tr+ I ha. the 8irst -i""i ! is a"" that is a .a d sho*"d (e i terested i is.e i <omm* ism/ B*t with !e eti's +o* do 9t ha.e e. i8 there is a te de '+ to smo-e.o* d.er to the state.oi t/ Whe some(od+ :*otes the .*st !i."e/ It (e'omes a tho*!ht"ess a'tio / The (asi' :*estio whi'h we a"" ha. i/e/.osi ! that :*estio to m+se"8.e the .oi t is the do""ar or the r*. !o to the war 8ie"d. a d *se !* s/ It ta-es de'ades to (rai wash .ro("emB 8rom the o . as the 'ase ma+ (e/ Tho*!ht has a"so 'reated the idea o8 the time"ess/ A"" a'hie.o8 the wor.*"atio o8 the !e es o8 that i di. 8o*r r*.a"*atio o8 a thi !.oi t 00 the re8ere 'e .a + m*rderer/ The 8irst time +o* ha.h+si'ists are ta"-i ! a(o*t.assed o 8rom !e eratio to !e eratio .i terms o8 the '*rre '+ we are 8ami"iar with/ E. sha. 8or whate.e i demo'ra'+.a'e or matter or time.ro'ess o8 ed*'ati ! .e a dr*! a d the+ wi"" !o a d -i""/ E.

er+where/ The+ are a("e to see what is ha.er +o* ma+ 'a"" it.atro a!e is e'essar+ 8or them to 'arr+ o their resear'h/ 01 Is it "i-e"+ that it is !oi ! to (e'ome a 8* 'tio o8 the stateF A1 It wi""/ Yo* see.o"*tio F I :*estio e. there is (o* d to (e . or whate.isio 7/ I wat'hed some o8 those TO shows i those da+s.irit or//// 01 I ..e i ! i Ba !"adesh/ 3ow the time 8a'tor has (ee red*'ed to a mi im*m thro*!h the he"."a'es9F I8 +o* do 9t do it. I wat'hed this i teresti ! .ro!ram.so ar'hai' a d 'r*de/ 01 How wo*"d +o* wa t the h*ma s.e treme do*s s+stems o8 'omm* i'atio ow/ Whate. e.assed o to the state."a'es//// A1 Yes.o"*tio / It is a tria"0a d0error .a'e with them/ We ha.er8e'ti ! the same thi !/ Yesterda+.o"*tio / A1 3ow thi !s are 'ha !i ! so 8ast that we are ot a("e to -ee.o"*tio B that is C*st//// A1 3o.i ! a e !i eeri ! o8 !e es/ ew s.A1 B*t whe the .o".*t *s a"" o the wro ! tra'-/ He said that a':*ired 'hara'teristi's are ot tra smitted 8rom !e eratio to !e eratio / B*t that is o "o !er tr*e ow/ For a h* dred +ears we (e"ie. we are i tro*("e/ A8ter a"".e that/ 4arwi has . state .e a +o e the ma date to 'ha !e the wor"dF . +o* see/ It 'a ot (e a + (etter/ A +thi ! +o* wa t to do with this is what 'reates 'o 8*sio / So there is . the+ wi"" ha d it o.t to 'reate a .e i ! e.ea'e8*" state is 'reati ! war there/ 01 I 8or!ot////DLa*!hsE A1 Who has !i.ared to what we see toda+ the+ "oo..ossi(i"it+ o8 e.e i ! here is ha.e'ies thro*!h the A1 Is there a + s*'h thi ! as e.ow"ed!e a':*ired (+ !e eti's.ersar+ o8 Te"e. i the ear"+ 9#%s/ <om.ow +o* are ot... .e i ! here a d what is ha.e to do a thi ! a(o*t it/ I am ot i 'o 8"i't with this. the 7#%th A i.io"e 'e/ It is (o* d to (e so/ Yo*r attem.ed him/ For a h* dred +ears we a"so (e"ie. it is ot e. (*t i8 +o* 'o*"d ha.e it the wa+ +o* wo*"d "i-e it.e'ies to (e i8 +o* 'a //// A1 I am ot 'hose as the !*ardia s.io"e 'e/ As "o ! as +o* *se tho*!ht to (ri ! a(o*t a 'ha !e witho*t.ed i the theories o8 Fre*d who was a st*.er+whereB wh+ 9some . o8 moder 'omm* i'atio te'h i:*es/ 01 B*t that is ot e.ta 'e o8 the (e"ie8 i e. is . some other 'o* tr+ wi"" do it/ 01 What +o* are sa+i ! is that there is a .er is ha. wo*"d +o*////F A1 I "i-e it e@a't"+ the wa+ it is/ Yo* do 9t ha.ro'ess/ Yo* are .er/ 01 At "east i some .e do*s 8ra*d/ 01 B*t 8or tho*sa ds o8 +ears there has (ee a a''e.

what 8orF 01 We""..oi t where we wi"" (e 8or'ed (+ 'ir'*msta 'es to "i.er+ ("ea-.ated a +thi ! a!ai st si!ht/ He is a"so ot 'reate .ro(a("+ wo 9t (e .rese t/ How 'a it (e a + di88ere tF As I said. SirA A1 It is ot ("ea-/ How 'a +o* sa+ it is ("ea-F That is the o "+ thi !/ So rea" it is/ 3ot at a"" ("ea-/ Yo* wo*"d "i-e to *se that word.i. ("iss.h+si'a""+ +o* are !oi ! to (e destro+ed/ It wi"" a88e't +o*/ This terror that i8 +o* tr+ to destro+ .what we are doi ! wi"" he".e.e with o*r ad.ossi(i"it+ o8 emer!i ! o*t o8 this////F A1 I am ot a .erma e tF Wh+.e'ies headed towards destr*'tio / Is there a . wh+ sho*"d we (e . ma+ -ee.hrase.at this this mome t/ It9s wo der8*"A DBoth "oo. worshi. (e'a*se I do 9t wa t this to (e a + di88ere t/ 01 It is a"" .ersaries/ The wa+ the "i.ro("ems ha.oetr+/ The e@t mome t I am "oo-i ! at +o*.so/ A1 So. +o* are as (ea*ti8*" as the o'ea there/ Pro(a("+ more (ea*ti8*"/ Yo* see. *s to!ether 8or a "itt"e whi"e ow/ <ertai "+ it is ot "o.e +o*F A1 I am the "ast .F A +(od+ who sa+s e@ha*st 8*mes a d who is himse"8 dri.i ! or!a ism is 8* 'tio i ! 00 the s*r.o the s*r.het/ B*t the 8*t*re is a"read+ here/ 01 I what wa+F A1 I the .erso to (e i terested. i8 I Are weF We are (ee a!!ra.erma e t/ A1 We are ot 'o 'er ed/ We are ot doi ! a +thi ! to -ee.ro.erma e t/ destro+i ! e.er+thi ! there i at*re e'o"o!i'a""+/ E'o"o!i'a" .01 So +o* sa+ we are as a s. that is the :*estio / I do 9t .ow/ A1 Wh+F Wh+ are we as-i ! this :*estio F 01 This .at the o'ea /E I do 9t write .a" o8 e.e ds *.eo. thro*!h war +o* 'a i this wor"d/ 01 I wo*"d 9t thi .i ! a 'ar sho*"d (e shot at si!ht a d o 'o tri(*ti !/ 4o 9t (e"ie. it .a" o8 the 'e"" e@t to it/ There is the terror that i8 I tr+ to destro+ somethi !.ro(a("+ we wi"" 'ome to a . .i.ea'e . the . do 9t (e"ie.e (+ *s/ How do +o* thi ."e aro* d +o*.er+ 'e"" de.e that 8e""owA A"" the e'o"o!ists. a d sa+ it is ("ea-/ Loo. I wi"" a"so !o with it/ I mea that . +o* are a"so !oi ! to (e destro+ed with them. 8a '+ .i ! itF A1 3o(od+ is i terested i it/ 01 3ot e.e them/ 01 Be'a*se the+ are ot i terestedF A1 The+ are ot i terested i it at a""/ 01 Is a +o e i terested i 'o ser. or re"i!io*s thi -i !/ B*t te"" me.

the seismo"o!ists 'a .eF7 We "ea.reser. i some wa+.e o8 (ea*t+.o"'a i' er*.h+si'ia s a d s'ie tists/ 01 Pro(a("+ we are a8raid o8 deathF A1 We are a8raid o8 'omi ! to a e d/ 01 Yes.e (e+o d death/ Yo* see.e a"" these thi !s to the meta.e a earth:*a-e i a . I do 9t wa t to 'ome to a e d/ Are +o* a8raid o8 'omi ! to a e dF A1 There is othi ! 9here9 to 'ome to a e d/ 01 So that is how we ma+ (e di88ere t//// I am so 'o 'er ed a(o*t it/ A1 4o 9t sa+ 7di88ere t/7 3othi ! wi"" 'ome to a e d e@'e. there is somethi ! that is e@traordi ar+ there/ 3othi ! eeds to (e do e to 'ha !e a +thi !/ Thi !s are 'ha !i ! i their ow wa+s/ 3at*re is 'ha !i ! 00 some .ow.arti'*"ar . it is ot !oi ! to s*''eed/ It is ot am*si !.am 8reed 8rom a"" the ideas that I ha.i ! itse"8 somehow. Madam.t the o e that does ot wa t to 'ome to a e d/ It is i terested i .ow/ Yo* .arti'*"ar time/ 01 Whe a asteroid is !oi ! to hit *s//// A1 Wh+ are we a"" 'o 'er ed a(o*t a"" these thi !sF 00 7Who 'reated this wor"dF7 7Wh+ do we "i. I * dersta d/ .re'isio that we are !oi ! to ha. it is a 8a't/ 01 Yes.tio s somewhere a d some earth:*a-es somewhere/ Wh+ these thi !s o''*r we do 9t ."a'e at a . e.redi't with e@a't .