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THE RESTORER'S CORNER

By J. R. Nielander, Jr.
It's again that time when we start planning for
the annual safari to aviators' paradise. The 26th An-
nual EAA Convention and Fly-In will be held at Witt-
man Field, Oshkosh, Wisconsin, from Saturday, July
29 through Saturday, August 5,1978.
Your Antique/Classic Division has again organized
a full week of activities for antique and classic air-
craft and their owners. These include the judging of
the exhibit aircraft and the awarding of trophies in
many different classifications. Additionally, well-known
aviation pioneers and outstanding restorers will be
recognized at the daytime Interview Circle and the
evening Pavilion Program. On Thursday evening the
Division will present a History of Flight Pageant as
the evening air show program. The Forums Commit-
tee has a full schedule of type club and general in-
terest forums planned. These generally include in-
formation on maintenance problems, parts availability
and substitution, modifications, specific restoration
techniques, flight characteristics, and aircraft avail-
ability. Additionally, there will be forums on tech-
niques and procedures applicable to all aircraft. These
forums are scheduled for a 1 '14 hour period and are
held in a large meeting tent located next to the An-
tique/Classic Division Convention Headquarters barn.
The tent is complete with blackboards, rostrum, pub-
lic address system, projection equipment, and 250
seats.
Again this year we are inviting all type clubs to
make the EAA Convention one of their annual fly-in
actiVities. Due to the limited parking space available
in the Display Aircraft Parking Area, we do not plan
to park the aircraft by type. However, we do have
the aircraft type signs available, so if any type clubs
want to have their own row(s), we shall be happy to
supply the signs, but it will be necessary for them to
make arrangements directly with the Antique/Classic
Division Parking Chairman, Arthur R. Morgan, 3744
North 51st Boulevard, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53216,
before July fifteenth and to police their own rows with
their own members starting on Wednesday, July 26,
and continuing through the entire convention period.
While we are talking about the Display Aircraft
Parking Area we would like to point out that the EAA
Convention is somewhat different from the average
fly-in which we usually attend . EDUCATION is the
basic theme of the EAA Convention, and your Antique/
Classic Division tries to encou rage this theme in both
its forums and its Display Aircraft Parking Areas. We
would appreciate your cooperation in using the Dis-
play Aircraft Parking Area exclusively for parking those
aircraft of which you can be justifiably proud of your
work or efforts spent in its restoration, reconstruc-
tion, or continued "Tender Loving Care" mainte-
nance. In this area we want to display that which we
consider excellence in our field and that from which
others can learn by close inspection, by example, and
by conversing with the owners and restorers . In this
area he who is planning to restore an antique or
classic aircraft can see what he can expect to achieve
and can thereby be fired with enthusiasm. In this area
photographers can snap the finest collection of the
restorers ' art. In this area he who comes to admire
historic beauty on wings can savour the excellence
of workmanship.
In the centerfold of this issue you will find a bal-
lot for the annual election of Division officers and
directors. In addition to the candidates nominated
by the nominating committee, there are spaces for
write-in candidates of your choice. Please exercise
your right to vote, and show your officers and direc-
tors that you support them, or write in the names of
those whom you would prefer to see on the Division
management team. Only with your active response
can we determine what is necessary to give you the
organization which you want.
Don' t forget about our membership contest. Take
all of the membership applicat ions out of your back
issues, print your name and Division membership
number on the back of them, and distribute them
to your friends and acquaintances who share your
interest in vintage aircraft. Make sure that you win
a pair of antique goggles for sponsoring five new
members and a leather flying helmet for sponsor-
ing ten new members. Don't forget, the big prize is
a five year free membership to the member who spon-
sors the most new members by the end of 1978. Let's
see how many helmets and goggles you can win. There
is no limit .
JOINT  DIVISIONS  MEETING 
AT  EAA  HEADQUARTERS 
The Officers and Directors of the Antique Classic
Division, the Warbirds and the International Aero-
batic Club met on April 29th for the first annual Joint
Divisions Meeting. Chaired by Paul and Tom Pober-
ezny, the agenda focused on the state of the divisions
and more effective methods of working together in
solving problems that are common to all three divi-
sions. "Each division is interested in expanding its
membership," said President Paul in citing an example
of how the three groups are unified, " and it will help
us all if we exchange ideas for increasing our member-
ship lists." The reaction produced a wealth of ideas
and suggestions all of which contributed to a highly
successful day.
Major discussions also developed on the subjects
of EAA services to the divisions, developments in
the FAA (Charlie Schuck was there to explain FAA
attitudes and action), participation at Oshkosh and
in the museum.
The day's events proved what Paul Poberezny has
long sensed : that although the EAA tJas several divi-
sions , it is not divided. The special interest groups
within the organization of EAA are tightly bonded by
their mutual interest in flying and their desire to
preserve their own way of doing it .
Representing your interests at the meeting were
J. R. Nielander, Jack Winthrop, Brad Thomas, Claude
Gray, Art Morgan , John Turgyan, Kelly Viets, Dale
Gustafson , and Bill Ehlen .
HELP  NEEDED  AT  OSHKOSH 
Kate Morgan and Donna Bartlett have requested
assistance for the Antique/ Classic Headquarters Staff
at Oshkosh . Staff members are involved in the vital
function of providing information , taking member-
ships, selling magazines, etc. If you can help two hours
any a.m. or p.m. write Kate at 3744 North 51st Boule-
vard , Milwaukee, WI 53216, or Donna at Box 5156,
Lakeland FL 33803.
(Photo by Chris Sorensen)
1941 Waco UPF-7 of Liz Winthrop.
Editorial
Staff
Publisher
Paul H. Poberezny
Editor
David Gustafson
Associate Editors: H. Glenn Buffington, Robert G. Elliott, AI Kelch,
Edward D. Williams, Byron (Fred) Fredericksen
Readers are encouraged to submit stories and photographs. Associate Editorships are assigned
to those writers who submit five or more articles,which are published in THE VINTAGE AIR-
PLANE during the current year. Associates receive a bound volume of THE VINTAGE AIR-
PLANE and a free one-year membership in the Division for their efforts. POLICY-Opinions
expressed in articles are solely those of the authors, Responsibility for accuracy in reporting
rests entirelywith the contributor.
ANTIQUE/CLASSIC
DIVISION
OFFICERS
PRESIDENT
J, R. NIELANDER.JR.
P.O. BOX 2464
FT. LAUDERDALE. FL33303
VICE·PRESIDENT
JACKWINTHROP
RT. 1. BOX 111
ALLEN.TX 75002
SECRETARY
W. BRADTHOMAS. JR.
301 DODSON MILLROAD
PILOT MOUNTAIN. NC 27041
TREASORER
E. E. "BUCK" HILBERT.
8102 LEECH RD.
UNION.1L,60180
William I. Ehlen
Route 8Box 506
Tampa, Florida 33618
Claude L. Gray, Ir.
9635 Sylvia Avenue
Northridge, California91324
Dale A. Gustafson
7724 Shady Hill Drive
Indianapolis, Indi ana 46274
Richard Wagner
P.O. Box 181
lyons, Wisconsin 53148
Ronald Fritz
1989Wilson, NW
Grand Rapids, Michigan 49504
John R. Turgyan
1530 Kuser Road
Trenton, NewJersey 08619
Directors
AI Kelch
7018 W. Bonniwell Road
Mequon, Wisconsin 53092
Morton W. Lester
Box 3747
  Virginia24112
Arthur R. Morgan
3744 N, 51st Boulevard
Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53216
M. C. "Kelly" Viets
RR 1BQX 151
Stilwell, Kansas 66085
Advisors
Stan Gomoll
1042 90th Lane, NE
Minneapolis, Minnesota55434
Robert E. Kessel
445 Oakridge Drive
Rochester, NewYork 14617
Robert A. White
Box 704
Zellwood, Florida 32798
THE VINTAGE AIRPLANE is owned exclusively by EAA Antique/Classic Division, Inc., and is published
monthly at Hales Corners, Wisconsin 53130. Second class Postage paid at Hales Corners Post OHice,
Hales Corners, Wisconsin 53130, and additional mailing oHices. Membership rates for EAA Antique/
Classic Division, Inc., are $14.00 per 12 month period of which $10.00 is for the publication of THE
VINTAGE AIRPLANE.Membershipis open toall who are interested in aviation.
The VINTAGEAIRPLANE 
OFFICIAL MAGAZINE
EAA ANTIQUE/CLASSIC
DIVISION INC.
ofTHE EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT ASSOCIATION
P.O. Box229, Hales Corners, WI 53130
CopyrightO1978 EAA Antique/Classic Division. Inc.. All Rights Reserved.
JUNE 1978  VOLUME 6 NUMBER 6
TABLE OF CONTENTS
(Cover Photo by  Chris Soresen: George S. Mennen's 1940 Spartan Executive.)
The Restorer's CornerbyJ. R. Nielander,Jr. ........................... 2
A Stinson by Byron (Fred) Fredericksen ................................ 4
World War I Era Replica Plans by Leonard Opdycke.....................10
NoticeofAnnual Business Meetingand Election of
Officers and Directors ............................................. 12
VintageAlbum .......................................................14
A HarborFor Classics by David Gustafson..............................16
Restoration Tips by Fred Chew ........................................20
The Baby Cessna .....................................................24
CalendarofEvents ...................................................25
Letters .............................................................. 26
EAA ANTIQUE/CLASSIC DIVISION MEMBERSHIP
o NON-EAA MEMBER - $20.00. Includes one year membership in the EAA Antique/
Classic Division, 12 monthly issues of THE VINTAGE AIRPLANE; one year mem-
bership in the Experimental Aircraft Association and separate membership cards.
SPORT AVIATION magazine notincluded.
o EAA MEMBER - $14.00. Includes one year membership in the EAA.Antique/Classic
Division, 12 monthly issues ofTHE VINTAGE AIRPLANE AND MEMBERSHIP CARD.
(Applicant must becurrentEMmemberand mustgive EAA membership number.)
Page 4  Page 16 Page 24
3
A  STINSON 
By Byron (Fred) Frederi cksen
3240 W. Beezewood Lane
Neenah, Wisconsin 54956
(Photos by the Author unless otherwise noted)
Left , Mr. J. D . Berr y, ri ght, th e author and Stinson
'N NC 15 165 on an i sl and across th e river fr o m
Nenana Alaska, May 16, 1972. (Aircraft was l anded in
50ft snow with the gear up 90 mil es west of here in
1947.)
"What do you think about this?" my friend asked
as he reached across the the table and handed me a
color Polaroid photo. My mind was still with some
home movie films of airplanes we had just viewed
when he spoke and I really only half heard what he
had sai d. The autumn Alaska air was' cool even in
the cabin as I shuffled my feet to a more comfort-
able position, gulped some freshly brewed coffee and
gazed at this photo. As I began to realize what I was
looking at, I answered, " I didn' t think any of these
existed anymore. " My host then said, " Well this one
does; it is mine and I wanted you to know about it as I
may di spose of it . . . maybe ... there is still some work
to do. "
I got a magnifying glass from my briefcase and
studied the photo in detail. The photo was of good
quality but was taken very late in the day. It showed
a forest in the arctic twilight with some snow cover
and parked in the shadows beneath some huge trees
was an airplane. A big airplane. It had three engines
on it complete with cowling and propellers. The
wheels and tires were removed but the gear was
down and the airplane was mounted in this position
on a very large log frame skid . The fuselage top
and windshield was covered with a canvas. The tail
group was visible as were the wing struts. It was,
of course, a low wing Stinson tri-motor airliner all
complete except that the outboard sections of the
4
wings were removed. I had a hundred questions to
ask, but thought better of it. I poured some more
coffee and listened to a tale about which one should
write a book, then make a movie. As my friend re-
vealed his story of where this airplane was when he
found it, why it got there, how he moved it to its
present location, and what sti ll remained to be done
to get it out of the wilderness, I realized a once in
a lifetime adventure was unfolding here.
Some readers will by now know my friend with
the photo was Mr. J. D. Berry for he briefly wrote
of and had a photo of this subject Stinson in an
Antique Airplane Association magazine some years
ago. This was 1970 when he informed me of this air-
plane and told me his story. Ever since then I have
been hoping he would write a complete story about
his ten year ordeal to recover this rare bird . He
has not chosen to do so as of this date, nor will
I write of the COMPLETE story here. I would however
like to share the portion of this adventure in which
I was personally involved along with some rare photos
I took for those interested in Stinson history.
I have always had a special interest in the Stinson
airplane. Twenty years ago I bought my first Stinson.
It was a 108-1 model Voyager. I owned three other
108 series after that and some of the most pleasurable
hours I have ever spent flying was in the left front
seat of a Stinson Gull Wing I onee owned. The publica-
tion entitled THE STINSONS by John W. Underwood
is an excellent reference for the Stinson buff. It
contains good photos and history of all three models
of tri-motors built by the Stinson Company. In another
of Mr. Underwood's books titled THE VINTAGE AND
VETERAN AIRCRAFT GUIDE there appears on page 42
a model 'A' tri-motor with a caption which states
N15165 is the last surviving model A. N15165 is the air-
plane' in the photos on these pages. There is also a
fine discription of the model 'A' Stinson ATC #556 in
Mr. Joseph P. Juptners book titled U. S. CIVIL AIR-
CRAFT VOL. 6. I have not read where anyone has
stated the exact number of these models produced.
It seems however some 35 were manufactured of
which the prototype was first flown in mid 1934 with
the bulk of production in 1935 and 36. Production had
ceased by 1937 and by this time the A's were operat-
ing in many foreign countries as well as in the U.S.,
namely by American Airlines, Central Airlines, Delta
and others. I can just barely remember seeing these
airplanes when I was a kid and I have always thought
the 'A' was a very handsome airplane. The model
A specifications and performance data were very
impressive for it s time and they were well built.
Arrival a t th e village of Nena na. ( Note huge tug
boat s r equired to move these barges and their
cargo.)
(My associates and I are rebuilding a 1931 high wing
Stinson tri-motor at present which is the same type
construction as the ' A' with 4130 ClM welded steel
tubing fuselage as well as wing spars welded up
with same material into a truss.) Ribs are square
aluminum tubing. The only wood used is for fairings
here and there. But then these fine aircraft like so
many others of the past gave way to the more modern
method of construction such as used on the Boeing
247 and Douglas DC-2 and 3 series with all the rivits
and shiny aluminum.
I will be brief here with the events involving the
recovery of N15165 and its subsequent rebuild as I do
not wish to steal the present owner 's thunder or
former owner' s should either ever decide in the future
to do a complete story of this interesting adventure.
Going back to 1970 at J. D .'s home where he first
showed the photo, we speculated on what the airplane
might be worth. I have always felt any antique was
worth what some one might pay for it. However thi s
airplane might well be the last of its kind . Then two
things happen , one you can begin to justify the time
and dollars spent to recover it and second one can
dictate the selling price. If it is the only one and the
prospective buyer gives you a hard time on your
price simply ask him to check around on the pri ce
of these models for sale and if he cannot make a
better deal come back and see me! J. D. indicated
what he mi ght wish to take for it , however we did
not make any deal at that point in time. Later when
I was back home in Wisconsin , I was given a pri ce
which included the airplane being brought out to
civilizat ion where one could drive a vehicle to it. At
the time I was shown a photo of the airplane whi ch
was about halfway on its ·almost one hundred mile
trip from its original l ocation sight to the nearest
road. J. D. had all hi s equipment in the bush at the
Stinson site. This included a D-8 Caterpillar equipped
with a dozer blade, a huge sled on skids which con-
tained many fifty gallon drums of fuel and oil, two
five ton co me alongs, snowmobile, many parts
and hand tools and the two airpl ane wings. Along with
Unloading a t Union Oil Co. Dock. (A magnifying glass
will make visible 75765 on the rudder. )
6
Th e la st pull 10 Colde n Vall e y Electric In c. s ub
station enclosure.
these he had built a six foot by twelve foot
cabin for shelter mounted on skids for pulling. This
home away from home is called a "Wanigan". He
would go ahead with the Cat and clear a few hundred
yards of timber along the route he chose through
the bush and over the ridges, come back and hook up
his "train": airplane, sled and Wanigan, and then
unhook again and clear another path and so on.
The only catch to this process was that this had to
be done in the winter months only as the unfrozen
tundra would not hold up the Cat in the summer
months. And what with the break downs, problems
with starting and operating a diesel engine in fifty
degree below zero weather, uncertain ice thicknesses
to cross over rivers , coupled with very few hours of
daylight that time of year in Alaska one wonders if
any price is worth that. A man all alone in this type
of operation could get himself killed. In fact the Cat
did go through the ice once. He got it free all by him-
self. Another time be broke a foot in a mishap and
laid in the Wanigan in that condition for ten days
before a refueling plane he had ordered found him.
Talk about a dedicated antiquer! Once again, would
this story not make an interesting movie? And all
it would require was a one man cast.
I accepted J. D.'s asking price and had in fact
made a deal with a third party here in the "Lower
48" to acquire it. I might add that was the first and
last time I will ever be the in between man on a
deal like this, it cost me a very good friend and one
cannot put a dollar value on that. One cannot
state he lost money he never had, however I was
offered thirty thousand dollars more for the airplane
than I got for it while it was still in Alaska, but
then that's water over the dam. I really was not in
this for money. J. D. and I only wanted to see this
' A' find a good home and people that would rebuild
her and fly it again. And I understand it is being
rebuilt at this time in a very professional manner.
Anyway, due to an almost inhuman effort the man,
!Dick Stouffer photo)
The Stinson obviously required a little more than a wash
and paint job.
7
the cat , airpl ane, sled , and Wani gan aft er two wint ers
of work arriv ed on an i sl and across the river fr o m
Nenana, Al as ka about si xty mil es be low Fairbank , .
Thi s was May, 1972. And the ice was breaking up in
the swift spring cur rent. I can imagin e J. D. standing
ther e on th e bank thinkin g if I w   ~ ju st a wee k
earli er I coul d cross to the road into town . He wal ked
across th e i ce l eavin g everything o n the i sl and and
advi sed me of the situation. Meanwhil e, something
was taking pl ace abo ut that time in that the milit ary
at Ft. Wainwri ght had received some fl ying cranes,
(car go heli copt ers). These animal s coul d do in a few
minut es wh at takes us mo nths in ter ms of moving th e
tri-mot o r. Aft er mon t hs of ca ll s, pro mi ses, l ett ers etc.
we fin all y gave up o n the U. S. Army. (The president
of EAA even tri ed to hel p but to no avail. ) I fin all y
fl ew up to J. D.'s pl ace and we wor ked o ut a method
to get th e airpl ane across the ri ver.
There was a Barge Line Co mpany whi ch wint ered
in Nenana and was by now readying their tugs and
barges fo r the summer season of hauling fu el and
equipment to their custo mers vi a the river hi ghways
in Al as ka. There equipment is much the same as the
tu gs and barges we see operating on the M iss iss ippi .
Tbeir base was a sho rt di stance down str ea m f rom
the Stinson site on the i sland. J. D. spoke to them
and a pri ce was agreed o n to pu sh a ba rge to th e
i sland , ti e unto the shore and give us a day to buil d
a ramp to the barge and load our cargo. J. D. and I
hir ed a local fell ow with a boa t t o take us ar o und
to th e bac k of th e i sl and and we t hen spent five
days cutting b ru sh and dragging everythin g to th e
water 's edge, whil e waiting for o ur 'ship ' . The tug
and barge ca me in si ght on th e fi f th day but th e
curr ent was 50 st rong t he tug lost steerage and the
ba rge wound aro und the tug and fl oat ed down stream.
Th e crew went af te r it and th e nex t day made it
all th e way . Th ey pu shed int o shore as c l ose as
poss ibl e and tossed heavy cabl es as ho re whi ch we
clamped aro und tree stumps we had cut. Th e crew
pull ed the barge with th e power win ches . Th ey l eft
with th e tu g aft er the Capt ain remin ded us he d i d
not want th e deck of th e barge to rn up by the cat.
We were t o pl ank th e tr ac ks. I f orgot how many
million s o f doll ars he sa id th e ba rge co st. "And
don't smoke on it because the , even foot deep hol d
i s full of fu el fumes."
We got ri ght to wo rk . J. D. pushed ton s of dirt
and tr ees int o the ri ve r between the sho re and the
barge. Hal f of it washed away but fin all y enough logs
and trees were cri ss-crossed and thi s base began to
hold th e mud and dirt and soon w e had a ramp
(whi ch continued t o w as h away). We immedi atel y
began to pull everything on board . In a coupl e o f
hour s we were all loaded ju st as our ramp vani shed.
What a good feeling we had. Thi s was 1972. M r. Berr y
start ed thi s proj ect a hund red mil es away, back i n
'1961 ! The tug capt ain sent a small boat for us as
we were no t to sl eep on t he barge.
The nex t day the tu g brought o ur precious ca rgo
down str ea m to th e r iver dock of th e Uni o n O il
Company. M r . Coghill own er of thi s Co mpany was
kin d eno ugh to let us compl et ely tear up hi s ya rd
w ith th e ca t in th e unl oa ding pr ocess. J. D.
str aight ened th e ya rd o ut lat er with th e dozer blade.
We pull ed everythin g t o a dirt side street out of
everyon e's way and wondered where we could store
the airplane.
We d i scove red an aba ndoned el ec t r i c company
power sub stati o n at the edge of town. It had a cyclo ne
fence aro und it with a gate and lock. We found the
owner to be Golden Vall ey Electri c Association Inc.
whose offi ce was in Fai r banks . We went there, saw
Mr. Boyd Robert s, as ked and were given permi ssion
to use th e Nenana St ation for a month , signed a hol d
harmless agreement and returned to Nenana. Then we
reali zed we had to cross two set s of railroad tr acks
with th e cat and the airpl ane. You ju st don ' t run a
crawler pulling an eight thousand pound load on rou gh
log ,kids across anoth er man's railroad tracks. Af-
ter much negotiating with the local railroad depot
personnel we got the okay to cross the tracks if we
first built a bridge of pl anks to run on . This we did
and pull ed the tri-motor up to the power station gate
onl y to fi nd the gate was too small to all ow the ai r-
pl ane to pass thro ugh. We got some shovels, dug down
all around o ne gate pos t until we hit the huge chunk
of con cret e th e post was ce mented int o . Th is we
lift ed out with the dozer blade. We then pull ed t he
airpl ane inside the fence, repl ant ed th e cement and
pos t , closed t he gate and locked i t. I then sought an
old gentl emen that li ved across the street and gave
him some doll ars in ret urn fo r hi s shOOing away any
peopl e he may obse rve climbing the fence with an
int erest in o ld airpl anes .
Th e nex t day was spent l oad in g <.1 11 o f J. 0.',
equipment on a ra ilroad fl at- car fo r shi pment to Fair-
banks. We later drove to Fairbanks in J. D.'s truck
and took a mu ch needed res t. We vi sit ed o th er
spot s where I observed a compl ete Norseman an d a
Gull Win g Stinson rotting out side in the element s and
suffering hard knocks fr om snow plows. J. D. also took
me to the museum at the Uni versit y o f Al as ka where
I could have spent a coupl e days. Aft er that we took
the airlin e down to Ancho rage and vi sit ed Mr . Reddin ,
the curat o r of the Air Tr ansportation Museum who
gave us a swell tour of thi s institution.
8
'
(Dick S!ouffer pho!o)
itting tab A into slot B is no easy task in a rebuild of
his size.
(Dick 5rouffer ph 0/0)
The monumental task is nearing compl etion and may
be flying when you read thi s.
This musellm and its contents has since burned to
the ground.
I then said goodbye to J. D. and spent the next six
and a half hours inhaling Vodka martinis on a non
stop jet to Chicago.
The tri-motor was picked up by semi truck along
with a new set of wings Mr. Berry had aquired that
went with the deal. The airplane is being rebuilt in
Crvsta: L a k ~   Wisconsin and should flv this summer.
Perhrt ps some day J. D. and I may watch it fly at
sC;'lIe antique meet.
F-or the record:
Stinson NC15165 was manufactured under ATC #556,
model A, serial No. 9125. Engines were Lycoming (3)
model R-680-5, 260 hp each; engines serials were Rt.
#2-1292, Lt . #2-1400, ten. #2-1290. Number of crew
and passengers, 9 PCLM.
Delivered to original owner February 28, 1936
American Airlines, Inc. 4848 West 63 Street, Chicago,
Illinois.
Ship damaged at Washington , D. C. on June 8,
1936, when a drunk drove a car into the tail while
th e ship was parked near a hanger at the Washington
ai rport.
On November 2, 1939 the total time on thi s aircraft
was given as 2234;03 hours.
Sold to Lavery Airways, William L. Lavery, Fair-
banks Alaska, April 27, 1940.
Sold to Raymond I. Peterson, DBA Ray Peterson
Flying Service, Anchorage, Alaska, September 14,
1942.
Sold to Ray Peterson Flying Service, Raymond I.
Peterson , Marie Antoinette Peterson, Glen I. Dillard,
Anchorage Alaska, April 26, 1944.
Crashed, November 1947. No details given.
On February 19, 1948 so ld to Northern Con-
solidated Airlines, Inc. Box #1439, Anchorage, Alaska.
Remarks:
Delivered to American Airlines, M arch 2, 1936.
NC Licenses i ss ued to expire 3-1-37, 3-1-38, 3-15-39,
and 11-15-40. On 11-14-40 license NC-15165 approved
for one year . Aircraft disapproved for license on
10-30-42 due to bad original fabric. Ship approved
for license on 5-15-43 for one year.
The next chapter is for Mr. J. D. Berry to write,
should he wish to do so.
For five years now I have sought and acquired what
I believe is a complete listing of every serial number
of the Stinson 'A' models produced. I followed one
rumor and found some "bones" of an A model. I
believe there are two more in existence, in what
condition I do not know; however, I am going to find
out. Who knows?
9
WORLD WAR I ERA
REPLICA PLANS
Compiled  by 
Leonard  Opdycke 
15  Crescent  Rd. 
Poughkeepsie,  NY  12601
Reprinted  WWI  Aeroplanes 
FOR YOUR INFORMATION:
(Abbreviations used below: H = Hawker-Siddel eyAvi-
ation Ltd., Richmond Road, Kingston-upon-Thames
KT2 5QS, UK (Attn: j. Crampton, Deputy Sales Mgr.,
L50 per set ofdrawings for anyone aircraft)
W  = Wright-Patterson AFB, OH 45433 (Att n : Verna
M. Frazier, Freedom of Informati on Manager, Admini-
st rati on Office, Headquart ers Aeronautical Systems
Div.) (AFSC)
Antoinette:
*4 sheets of the German Albatross-built version,
drawn by Gabriel-Sales Desk, National Museum
of Science and Technology, 1867 St. Laurent
Boulevard, Ottawa, Ontario, K1A OM8, Canada.
Bellanca 1912:  -
*Complete set ofdrawings$40.00- MikeMurphy,
4923 West 99, Oak Lawn, Illinois60453.
Berchman B-2 Scout(1918):
*W (Can #482)
BleriotXI:
*Complete set of drawings, instructions, $15.00 -
Mel Miller,2030 Geary, Albany, Oregon 97321
*Complete set in BUILDING AN AEROPLANE by
C. B. Hayward , 1912, reprint ed by King's, Box
17646, Nashville, Tennessee 37217 ($3.50)
Bristol F2B:
*A few miscellaneous drawings, not enough to
build from, many structural photos; parts and
rigging manuals; operating manual - LEO, WWI
AEROPLANES
Bristol ScoutA:
'Axerox copyofthe 500 - ser iesofdrawings from
Frank Barnwell's own notebook (not for sale,
maybe recopy) - LEO, WWI AEROPLANES
Bristol Scout D:
* Many 8 x 10" sheets, copies from original Bristol
factory drawings, enough to build from (not for
sal e, maybe recopy) - LEO, WWI AEROPLANES
CurtissJN4 series:
* jN4(Can) : 35mm microfilm roll - Ken Hyde, RD
1, Warrenton, VA 22186
* jN4D: Ken Hyde (above)
from Canadian Aeroplane Company, Ltd. Can
#66 - W, Air Force Museum, Wright Patterson
AFB, Dayton, OH (not same as W, above).
20 sheets 17 x 22, g/a and structure, from factory
drawings - Charles F. Schultz, 910 Broadfields
Drive, Louisville, KY 40207.
23 draWings, incomplete but good coverage -
Gordon E. Codding, 4572 W. 147 Street, Lawn-
dale, California.
Reprinted operating manual , $3 .00 - Aviation
Publi cat ions, 2036 Ludington Avenue, Milwaukee,
Wisconsin.
* jH4: From Curtiss-Wright Aeroplane and Motor
Corp., Can #495 - W
Curtiss 0-1 XO-1, 0-2:
*W(Can #301)
Curtiss Pusher:
*34 x 48" plate showing co nst ruction of 1910
Curtiss A-frame, $10.00 Herbert L. Kelley, 56424
Handley Road , Yucca Valley, CA92284.
*Set of drawings developed from original Curtiss
prints, $25.00. Charles F. Schu ltz (above)
*Complete set fOf construction - Mel Miller
(above)
*Complete set in BUILDING AN AEROPLANE,
King's (above) - but note #46:8 for Charles
Willard's cautionary noteon using these plans!
Chanute Hang Glider:
* jack Lambie, 115B Merrimac Drive, Anaheim,
California 92807.
DeHaviliand4:
*Dayton-Wright Aeroplane Corp., (DH4, DH4B) -
W (Can #195)
* Miscellaneous drawings from AF Museum (above)
*FisherBody(DH4) - W (Can #191)
DeHaviliand 9/9A:
* Few drawings including float models - Colin A.
Owers, Box 241, Quirindi , NSW, 2343, Australia.
FokkerDVII:
* BLUE MAX DVII drawings - Harold Best-Dever-
eux, 11 Stonehills House, Welwyn Garden City,
Herts, U.K.
*11 plates 34 x 48" for 1601180 Mercedes versions,
$110.00 Herbert L. Kelley (above)
* AF Museum (above)
*11 plates 34 x 54", $121.00, with raw materials
and parts to be available later- Stolp Starduster
Corporat ion, 4301 Twining, Riverside, Calif.
FokkerDVIII:
* Full set from Platz original sketches for Warner
powered reproductions. E. D. Swearingen, 40
Monee Road, Park Forest , Illinoi s.
*AF Museum (above)
*Dan-San Abbott (in process of entry for Roland
DVI , below)
Fokker Drl:
*Brochure $2.00 and full set of working drawings
for Warner reproductions. Walt er W. Redfern,
Route1, Athol, Idaho 83801.
*10 sheets donetowardsacompl eteset ,each $4.00
plus spar and rib sets, fiber-glass cowls - Ron
Sands, RD 1, Mertztown, PA 19539.
Fokker EI:
*1 plate 22 x 30", 1" to 1', for full scal e detail
f lying model , $10.00. Herbert L. Kelley (above).
FokkerEIII:
*25 9x 7 photos ofstr ucture ofKensington Science
Museum EIII, $25.00 plus $1.00 postage - Ed
Brannon, 1405 Marcella NE, Albuquerque, NM
87112.
FokkerVI:
*8 plates 17 x 22", 1110 scale, structure developed
from photosand historical data (of #44), $25.00-
Herbert L. Kelley (above).
*1 plate 34 x 54", 1110 scale for 26" span model ,
$10.00- Herbert L. Kelley (above).
Macchi-HanriotHD1:
*Drawings $120.00 - Chris j . Warrilow, 141 Chair-
borough Road, Hi gh Wycombe, Bucks., U.K.
Nieuport17:
*Rozendaal drawings - Fred Kom Losy, 725 Robin
Way, North Palm Beach, Florida33408.
*Air Force Museum (above)
*3 sheets $2.25 - National Museum of Science
and Technology (above).
Nieuport24:
'Walt Redford (above).
Nieuport27:
*Fred Kom Losy (above).
*Gordon E. Codding (above).
Nieuport28C1:
*Air Force Museum (above).
Pfalz Dill:
* Darnell Sitton, 1925 N. Vermont Avenue #7,
Los Angeles, CA 90027.
Pfalz DXII:
'Set of 30 fine 5 x 7 photos of the EAA Museum's
DXI I under reconstruction, $20.00 (air craft on
permanent loan from National Air and Space
Museum) Ben Owen, EAA Museum, Box 229,
Hales Corners,WI53130 ($15.00 forEAA members)
10
RAF Se5A:
*32  photos  as  above,  $20.00  ($15.00  to  EAA  mem-
bers)  - Ben  Owen,  EAA  Air Museum  (above) 
*Drawings  for  85%  scale  all-wood  reproduction 
- Replica  Plans,  953  Kirkmond  Crescent,  Rich-
mond,  B.C.,  CANADA 
*Air  Force  Museum  (above) 
*Gordon  E.  Codding (above) 
*Complete  set  from  which  RAF  Museum  ship  was 
rebuilt  - Public  Records  Office,  Chancery  Lane, 
London,  UK (See  Note,  below,  also) 
Roland DVla/b:
*5  sheets 34 x 44,  fully detailed, $50.00  plus  postage 
$3.50  (these  fine  drawings  reviewed  this  issue 
p.2) - Dan-San  Abbott, 25886  Gettysburg Avenue, 
Hayward,  CA  94545. 
Pomilio:
*W,  Can  #66 
Sopwith: Bl, Baby, Bulldog, Buffalo, Camel, Condor,
Cuckoo, Dolphin, Dove, Dragon, Gnu, Gun Bus,
Hippo, Pup, Rainbow, Ram, Rhino, Salamander,
Snail, Snapper, Snipe, 1'12 Strutter, Swallow, Tabloid,
Triplane:
*H 
Sopwith Camel:
*Air  Force  Museum  (above) 
*Gordon  E.  Codding  (above) 
*Clayton  &  Shuttleworth  drawings of F1,  Some 2F1: 
200  drawings  for $144.  Chris  J.  Warrilow  (above) 
Sopwith Pup:
*GordonE.  Codding  (above) 
*Air  Force  Museum  (above) 
*72  drawings  18  x  24",  $162 .00  - Smithsonian 
Institution, Washington  DC 
Sopwith Triplane (110 Clerget):
*Clayton  &  Shuttleworth  drawings,  about  100  for 
$72.00.  Chris  Warrilow (above) 
*S.  Wieser, Dir.  Plantetarium, Clagary Parks  Depart-
ment,  Box  2100,  Calgary,  Alberta,  Canada 
Sopwith Miscellaneous Types (SS, SSD2, SPGN, 150
hp Smith, D3, S, STS, STD, D2, DS, frS, 225 Sunbeam,
frS 220 hp Seaplane, 2FR2, 50 Gnome Biplane):
* H 
Sopwith-Kauper Gun Gear:
*H 
Spad 7:
*Air Museum  (above) 
*Gordon  E.  Codding  (above) 
*Jack  Hickey, 1659 Willis,  S.  St.  Paul,  Minn. 55705-
20  sheets  for $75.00 
Spad 13:
*Gordon  E. Codding (above) 
Sperry Messenger:
*W (Can  #289) 
Standard 11:
*Air  Force  Museum  (above) 
Thomas-Morse S4C:
*Air  Force  Museum  (above) 
*Gordon  E.  Codding  (above) 
Wright Gliders:
*4  plates:  1899  Kite  17  x  22";  1900-01-02  Gliders 
@1/10 scale  34  x  48",  total  $35.00  - Herbert  L.
Kelley  (above) 
Wright Flyer 1903:
*Master  drawings  made  for  construction  of  Kitty 
Hawk Memorial  reproduction, 21  sheets  for  $22.00 
(make  check  payable  to  Cooper-Trent)  - Louis  S. 
Casey,  Cu rator  Aircraft  &  Aeronautics,  National 
Air  &  Space  Museum,  Washington,  DC  20560) 
Notes:
*Complete  drawings  for  display  or  building  the 
Spandau  LMGO-8-15  mig, 3  x  6Vz'  - Ray  Hollings, 
338054  Street,  San  Diego,  CA 92105. 
*RAE  TECH  MEMO  4:  This  catalog  is  subtitled 
The EAA Aviation Museum is now the proud owner
"Catalogue  of  Original  Tracings  of  Aircraft  and 
Engines  Designed  and  Built by the  RAE  1911-1918", 
assembled  by Wing Commander NHF Unwin, from 
Public  Records  Office,  Chancery  L  ne,  London, 
UK.  Drawings  are  listed  by  aircraft  type,  subject 
of  drawing  and  drawing  number;  any  can  be 
bought  separately.  The  SE5A  set  is  complete  (of 
RAF  SE5A,  above).  Types  for  which  at  least  some 
drawings  are  available : 
Bristol  Scout 
Bristol  F2B 
Cierva  Autogyro 
DH1-6,9-10 
Hamble  Baby 
Handley-Page  0/400,
V-1500 
Short 225,  320 
Sopwith  1%,  Pup,  Triplane, 
Camel,  Snipe,  Dolphin 
RAF  BE1-5,  7-10,12 
RAF  CE1 
RAF  FE1-9,  12 
RAF  NE1 
RAF  HAM  I,  " 
RAF  Hydro-Aeroplane 
#17 
RAF  HRE  2 
RAF  RE1,  3,  5-9 
RAF  BS1 
RAF  SE1,  2,  4,  4a,  5,  5a 
RAF  TE1 
EAA's Aviation Museum has built a  replica of its own:
the Ryan NX-211 Spirit of SI. Louis; it's also sponsored
construction of  this replica Wright Flyer at the Black-
hawk Technical Institute in janesville, Wisconsin.
of this replica Fokker DR-I Triplane which was built and -
donated by Robert H. Fergus of  Columbus, Ohio.
The white paint scheme on  this replica was used by
Lt. Hans Wei ss who flew with von Richtoffen.
11 
planes,  fighters  up  through  transport
w.  Brad  Thomas,  Jr.
Notice of Annual Business Meeting
C-54's.
Pilot  Mountain,  North  Carolina 
Today  he  holds  a  commercial  license
and
Manufacturer 
with  single  and  multi-engine  land,  and 
Born  in  High  Point,  North  Carolina,
Election of Officers and Directors instrument  ratings,  and  remains  actively 
Brad  was  educated  at  McCallie  School, 
flying with  his  Gyrocopter and  VW pow-
Notice  is  hereby  given  that  an  annual  business 
Chattanooga,  Tennessee;  MIT,  Cam-
ered  Scamp,  both built by him, a Moon-
meeting  of  the  members  of  the  EAA  Antique/Classic  bridge,  Massachusetts;  and  High  Point 
ey  for  travel,  and  a  D-17R  Staggerwing. 
Division  will  be  held  on  Saturday,  August  5,  1978,  at 
College.  His  flying  career  began  at  the 
He is  currently Secretary of the Antique/ 
age  of 16  when  he  soloed  and  obtained 10:30  A.M.  (Central  Daylight  Time)  at  the  26th  An-
Classic  Division  of  EAA,  Oshkosh  Con-
nual  Convention  of the  Experimental  Aircraft  Associa-
his  private  license  in  1938.  The  advent 
vention  Classic  Awards  Chairman  and 
tion,  Inc.,  Wittman  Field,  Oshkosh,  Wisconsin. 
of  World  War  II  encouraged  his  enlist-
Chief  Judge,  Secretary  and  Treasurer 
Notice  is  hereby  further  given  that  the  annual 
ment  i n  the  Army  Air  Corps  as  a  pilot . 
of  EAA  Chapter  8,  Greensboro,  N.C., 
election  of  officers  and  directors  of  the  EAA  Antique/ 
He  graduated  from  British  Flying  Train-
Vice-President  of  EAA  Antique  Chap-
Classic  Division  will  be  conducted  by  ballot  dis-
ing School No.5, Clewiston, Florida with 
ter  3  and  a  member  of  their  executive 
tributed  to  the  members  along  with  this  June  issue  of 
both Air Corps and RAF wings, was trans-
committee.  Br-ad  and  his  wife,  Ferne, 
The Vintage Airplane. Said  ballot  must  be  returned 
ferred  to the 7th  Ferry Group, Air Trans-
have  five  children,  of  which  one  is  an 
properly  marked  to  the  Ballot  Tally  Committee,  EAA 
port  Command,  Great  Falls,  Montana 
active  oilot. 
Antique/Classic  Division,  Box  229,  Hales  Corners, 
where he ferried  most types of Air Corps 
Wisconsin  53130,  and  received  no  later  than  August 
3,  1978. 
Ronald  Fritz,  Chairman 
Nominating Committee 
W.  Brad  Thomas,  Jr.,  Secretary  the  acquisition  of  his  private  pilot  li-
EAA  Antique/Classic  Division  cense,  he  immediately  bought  and  re-
stored  his  first  airplane,  a  1946  Cessna 
AI  Kelch 
140,  N72323,  which  had  been  used  as 
Mequon, Wisconsin 
a  trainer  at  South  Dayton  Airport.  In 
Manufacturer
1953  he rebuilt and restored 1946 Cessna 
AI -started  hi s  own  company  in  1950, 
140,  N73018,  and  flew  it  during  the  re-
mainder  of  1953  and  1954.  During  this 
"The  Kelch  Corp." ,  which  is  now a con-
same  period, J.  R.  bought an  extensively 
glomerate of 5 small  manufacturing com-
damaged 1949 Cessna 170A, N9730A, and 
panies  in  the  industrial  plastic  field. 
completely  rebuilt  and  restored  it  in-
AI ' s  interest  in  airplanes  goes  back 
cluding  splicing  the  parts  of  two  fuse-
to  his  childhood  in  the  1920s  when  he 
would  sit  on  his  father's  lap  and  fly  in
iages  together to  make  one. 
With  the  completion  of  the  Cessna 
his  uncle's  Jenny  whenever  the  Jenny 
170A  in  early  1955,  he  flew  to  Florida 
came  to  town  barnstorming. 
where  he  was  hired  as  an  A&P  by  the 
He  is  a  lifetime  member  of  EAA  and 
local  Cessna  distributor,  Sunny  South 
AAA.  He  was  president  of  the  Wiscon-
Aircraft  Service.  Later  that  same  year 
sin  Chapter  of  AAA  for  two  terms,  and 
he  joined  Pan  American  World  Ai rways 
a  director  of  Antique/Classic  Division 
as  a  co-pilot  flying  Convair  240' s.  Since 
of EAA  for  two  terms.  He  served  as  edi-
then  he  has  flown  Douglas  DC-4,  6,  7C, 
tor of The Vintage Airplane magazine from 
January  1976  until  February 1978. 
8,  Boeing  707  and  720  aircraft .  Besides 
J. R.  Nielander,  Jr.
He  currently  owns  and  flies  a  1939 
his  ATR  and  mechanic  tickets  he  also 
Fort  Lauderdale,  FL  Piper  J3  Cub  which  he  completely  re-
Pan  Am  Pilot  J.  R.  was  elected  vice-president of the 
holds  a  flight  navigator license. 
stored  in  1968,  and a 1939  Franklin  Sport 
By  the  time  he  learned  to  fly  at  Lake- Antique/Classic  Division  at  its  organiza-
biplane  which  he  restored  in  1969.  A 
wood  Airpark,  Mount  Healthy,  Ohio,  tional  meeting  on  November  6,  1971. 
1931  Travel  Air  12Q  will  be  flying  this 
summer,  and  two  American  Eaglets  and 
in  1951,  J.  R.  had  already  completed  He  held  that  office  until  he  was  elected 
five  years  of  university  study,  as  well  president  by  the  Board  of  Directors  at 
an  E2  Cub  are  his  current  restoration 
as  one  year  of  graduate  school.  With  their  meeting on  February 5,  1976. 
projects. 
12
Morton W. Lester
Martinsville, Virginia
Builder-Developer and Real Estate
Investor
Morton is President of The Lester Cor-
poration and Vice-President of Motor
Imports, Inc. He is Executive Vice-Presi-
dent of the Virginia Aeronautical His-
torical Society, and a board member of
several other civic, governmental, busi-
ness and humanitarian organizations.
Morton was soloed by his father at the
age of 10 in a Piper Cub. He currently
owns several prototype antiques such
as the Ryan SCW, Davis, Low Wing
Aeronca, and Johnson Rocket. His cur-
rent ship is a civilian Howard DGA-15P.
He also owns a rare Travel Air 6000B
which is currently undergoing restora-
tion under the careful expertise of his
cousin, Pete Covington. Morton is a
Trustee of the EAA Air Museum Founda-
tion, and a past chairman of the Classic
Judging Team of Oshkosh. He is past
president and current member ' of the
executive committee of EAA Chapter
395 (N.C., S.c., & Va. Antique Airplane
Foundation). Morton and his wife Mar-
garet have three children.
M. C. "Kelly" Viets
Stilwell, Kansas
Consulting Engineer, Self-Employed
Kelly entered the consulting engineer
field in 1938 and spent World War II
designing airports and base facilities '
for the U. S. government. He started
his own firm, Viets Consulting Engi-
neers, in 1954. He is a registered pro-
fessional engineer and holds member-
ship in numerous professional societies.
Kelly spent a lot of his younger days
around Kansas City Municipal and Fair-
fax airports, seeing Benny Howard's
"Ike" make its first flights, the Travel
Air Mystery Ship on the way to Cleve-
land, all the early airliners, etc. He start-
ed flight instruction in 1938 in a 55 hp
Porterfield and finally got his ticket on
the G.I. Bill in 1946. Kelly and his wife,
Edna, own an Ercoupe and the two of
them started and manage the Interna-
tional Ercoupe Association. Their month-
ly newsletter goes out to over 550 Er-
coupe enthusiasts around the world.
Kelly also owns and is restoring the 14-
12 Bellanca that was used as the proto-
type for the 14-13 series. He is a Director
of EAA's Antique-Classic Division. Kelly
and Edna have 3 children.
Art Morgan
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Oster Service Division
Art Morgan began flying in 1961 and
received his private license in 1962. In
1965 he went on to get his commercial
rating.
He has been a member of EAA since
1962, and was parking airplanes at Rock-
ford, Illinois.
Art was one of the first to start build-
ing a KR-1, and although he did not
complete his project, he was instrumen-
tal in the completion of two of the little
birds.
In 1974 he and his wife Kate purchased
a 1939 Luscombe 8-C, which he promptly
rebuilt. After two years of flying the Lus-
combe, Art and several friends organ-
ized the American Luscombe Club.
Art has served the EAA as a museum
volunteer for several years; as Classic
parking chairman at Oshkosh and also
as Antique-Classic parking chairman.
FOR  THE  COMPLETE 
AVIATION  LIBRARY 
THE 
FLYING  AND  GLIDER  MANUAL 
FOR:  1929 
1930 
1931 
1932 
1933 
1929-1933  MISCELLANY 
$2.50 Each Post Paid
ORDER  FIVE 
AND  GET THE 
SIXTH  ONE 
FREE 
Total Cost For All Six
$12.50 
Order From :
EAA  AIR  MUSEUM  FOUNDATION 
BOX  469 
HALES  CORNERS,  WI  53130 
13
I.  Pioneer  Northwest  pilot  Eclith  Fol tz  lVel .' ,1 neltive  of 
Dallas;  maiden  name  - \1agali,.  She  learned  to 
{I),  in  Portlaml,  Oregon  Fel)(uar)'  of  l,)l8. 
l.  IJdrn,tormecl  a  long-wing  Edglerock  (OX-5) ; 
·kCfuirec/  Licen.se  #5nOO and  lVas  th e  fifth  U.S. 
wOlllan to  ohtain  the  Transport  r,lIing. 
..J. Barnstorming the  Northwest  - Pilot  Greenwood in  a Ryan  "Brougham" 
and  Edith  in the  OX-5  Eaglerock. 
4.  Edith  placed  second  in  the  light-plane  division  of the  first  Na-
tional  Women's  Air  Derby,  1929, Santa  Monica  to  Cleveland, 
flying  an  Alexander  Eaglerock  Bullet  (Kinner  engine).  Charter 
member  of the  99s. 
5.  May  1930 - Edith  christening  "The  Romer",  new  five-passenger 
airplane  manufactured  by  the  National  Aircraft  Corp.,  Beaver-
ton,  Oregon. 
Vintag 
The  Fl ying life 
Compile
(Special thanks to Paulin
sharing Edith Sterns' scr
for c
-
1I.  Edith  Stearns  instructed  Naval 
and  Kingsville,  TX  after  WWII. 
with  Pauline  Glasson.  Decease 
Album 
mes of Edith Foltz Stearns
Buff i ngton 
;;on  of Corpus  Chr i sti,  Texas  for 
(  wi t h  us  - also  to  I.  B.  Decker 
the  photos) 
,ts  in  i ns trument  flying  at  Corpus  Christi 
eel  the  '52 and  '53 Powder  Puff  Derbies 
956;  ending  a  brillidnt  flying  career. 
Edith  served  as the  first  Northwest  Section  Governor  of the  99s  - and 
she  also  w as  Oregon  Governor  of the  National  Aeronautics  Ass'n.  in 
the  earl y  ']Os.  She  fl ew  a Kinner  Bird  in  the  '3 7 and  '32  derbies,  both 
from  Santa  Monica  to  Cleveland.  (4th  in  '3 7  and  2nd  in  '32,  in  the 
women's  division.) 
7.  Edith  and  her  son,  Richard  Foltz,  age  6  in  793 7  at  Portland, 
Oregon.  . 
8.  7932  at  Cleveland  National  Air  Races  (L  to R)  Viola  Gentry, 
Gl adys  O'Donnell,  Florence  Klingensmith,  Frank  Phillips,  Edith 
Folt z  Stearns  and  Frances  Marsalis,  taken  with  Phillips'  " Wool-
aroc"  Trophy.  Edith  fl ew  the  Bird  to  2nd  place  in  the  Amelia 
Earhart  Trophy  Race  (pylons)  1932;  Klingesmith  was  first  in  a
Monocoupe. 
9.  Sk i rts    Edith  Foltz  St ea rns  model s  one  or 
her  trade-marked  "  FoIZLIp "  flying  lOgs  which 
easil y  converted  to  st reet  wear  - 7  932. 
I O.  Edith  managed  a  new  feeder  airl ine  a t  Port-
land  dnd  t aught  primary  CPT  at  Salem  prior  to
WWII  - se rved  in  Engl and  as  a Firs t  Officer 
in  the  Air Tran sport  Auxili ary;  here  in  uniform. 
(Fred Chew photo)
Bill's Cessna 140 slips through a quick l eft turn in a test
of-rhe new splas h rails.
A Harbor for Classics
By David Gustafson, Editor
Some folks would argue that Bali Hi is a mythical
Island out in the South Pacific where the best in life
is an everyday affair. There are a few people,how-
ever, who would be inclined to suggest that the proto-
type model for Bali Hi can be found on the South-
east corner of Stafford Pond in Westport , Mas-
sachusetts . That's where Bill Walsh lives. What makes
it special? Well, he's got several acres of land in
the secluded inlet of a clear lake. He doesn' t have
palm trees though his Norwegian pines give the same
effect on a warm and breezy summer night. To
improve the natural scene, Bill put in a dock, laid
down some railroad track for a movable ramp that
can be winched right into the hangar he erected 200
16
feet from the water . Naturally, there has to be some-
thing to place in the hangar, so Bill's lined the walls
with tools and bending brakes. The space that's left
is reserved for his Cessna 140 Floatplane and the
Aeronca Sedan he's rebuilding so he can be a two-
floatplane family!
The Cessna 140 was built in 1948 and sent directly
from Wichita to Sea Wings of Connecticut for con-
version to floats . It was then sold with floats and
wheels . With the stock Continental 85 horsepower
engine, the plane was marginal as a hot day aquatic
performer. Getting off the surf with two husky adults
when it' s over 75 degrees out is a groaning process.
Some of the problem relates to the high speed air-
foil that works nicely in cruise, but does little to
generate the kind of take-off lift you get in some-
thing like a Cub or Champ. Even as a ground plane,
the Cessna requires a long take-off roll.
Once airborne, however, the 140 levels off to a
respectable 90 mph with a corkscrew that measures a
wide 76" x 38". Bill 's hoping to swap the C-85
someday for an 0-200 so he can take up some of his
fat friends in the mint julip season.
As far as skidding around the pond, Bill report s
there's very little difference between the 140 and com-
parably sized float planes. Of course, the take-off run's
longer, but once airborne (40-45 mph), it climbs
well and flies with much greater stability than a
land model. The floats give it "a big plane feeling,"
says Bill.
Stalls with a floating 140 are similar to the land
configuration and intentional spins are strictly
verbotten.
When Bill bought the plane in 1963, it was on the
floats but he couldn't get it off the water. The
floats leaked. Experimentation revealed that the keel
opened up on a take-off run, so they were replaced.
Later he added spray rails which eliminated the center
wake and brought the plane up onto the step quicker.
In the wintertime, the floats are replaced with
skis and Bill goes out to race the ice boats. Between
;he floats and the skis, the wheels haven't been on
the 140 for several years now. When he wants to
bounce around a paved runway, he heads off to Fall
River Airport, haul s out a 170-B (of which he owns
1115th), and renews his acquaintance with toe brakes
and squealing rubber.
Like a growing number of people in EAA, Bill
divides his time between flying one project and tinker-
ing with another. He's lucky enough to have an Aeronca
15 AC Sedan as that other project. He picked it up a
couple years ago at a price that would take the wind
out of some people. Ask anyone who knows Bill or
his close friend, Fred Chew, and they'll tell you that
those two guys deserve a special suit that says
"SUPER-SCROUNGERS" across the chest. They have
uncanny talents at picking up materials for nothing or
next to it. More than once in recent history they've
plucked chicken feathers out of an old Continental or
Lycoming that was retrieved from the dark corner of
a barn for around $100. (Actually, Bill's just finished
a two-year term as President of EAA Chapter 51 in
Middletown, Rhode Island, and Fred's still the Chapter
Designee - they have both done an excellent job.)
When the opportunity arose, they dickered and
diddled and sang the song of a snake charmer until
they could come home with a smile and that particular
Sedan.
Naturally, the plane needed a little work . The
previous owner had argued with a pine tree. The
tree not only won, but took the left wing as a prize.
The Aeronca was apparently so shocked by the action
that it pulled back and stood up on the right wing
as if to say "I beg your pardon." When things got
back to level , the right tip was mashed.
How many times do you suppose guys like Bill
and Fred have set out to unbend a wing, but wound
(Fred Chew photo)
Off and flying, the 140 is a marginal performer on hot days
with a full load.
(Fred Chew photo)
This Cessna 140 has been a regular feature in Bill's back- yard for 15 years.
up rebuilding the entire machine? You can add their
names to the list .
One thing Bill quickly points out, is that he and
Fred are not engaged in a full-scale, down-to-the-
last-screw restoration project. Nope. When it flies
again , i t will still be clearly recognizable as an
Aeronca Sedan , but there are some (approved)
changes in store. Most obvious is the addition of
brackets for float struts. A presto-change-o routine
with a few bolts will convert the plane from land to
sea or vice versa.
Conveniently, it so happened that the greatest
crash damage occurred on the left side. Fred happily
ripped out the bent tubes, bent a few new ones,
and followed the STC cookbook for installing a left
side door that opens upwards to the wing. It' s an
approved mod for a seaplane configuration.
(Davi d Gustafson photo)
Progress in t he rebuil ding effort i s evi -
dent in thi s shot of the Sedan: the l eft
wing att achment has been repaired, the
fusel age has been bl asted and primed,
the new l eft door frame is complete, and
a new headliner's being installed.
(Fred Chew photo)
after abrupt remov-
18
Each of the large metal wings originally contained
20 gallon rubber gas bladders (say that three times!)
and both leaked after the crash. Replacement cost
was $700 apiece, so the wing panels were torn off
and Fred bent up a couple of metal tanks that are
larger than the originals. Between the tanks and the
twisted metal from the crash, Fred figures he's dis-
mantled at least 80 per cent of the wings and replaced
50 per cent of the total materials. Included are a
number of ribs shaped by hand on wooden formers
which were also hand etched from the pieces bound
for the junk heap. That translates into a lot of
aluminum: the wing span is 37'6" with a chord in
excess of 5 feet which produces 200 square feet of
wing area. In the end, Fred will be able to reproduce
any curved part of the Sedan's wing and, yes, he plans
to come up with quotes for others needing help
(write Fred Chew, 158 Meridian Street, Fall River ,
Massach usetts 02720).
With the Clark Y airfoil and a Continental 145
horsepower engine the Sedan leaps off the ground
almost as fast as a two-place Cub. When you turn
it into a "Seadan" by adding a couple EDO 2000's,
it breaks surf suction with a simple hop, skip and a
slurping leap. The only drawback is that with the
2,000's you can't hop unless there are only two people
on board. With four people and full tanks the floats
become submarines. As a result the two resourceful
metal benders, who plan to build their own floats,
are giving serious thought to making something big-
ger.
(David Gustafson photo)
Detail of the float attachment fitting.
Bill's Aeronca was built in 1948 and like most
classics it's a l r e a d ~   changed hands a few times. Dr.
Paul Nussbaum was the first to drop mud on the
carpets in ' 49. John Ru sh moved it from Missouri
to Ohio ten years later . After another decade, a pair
of partners in Pennsylvania flew it for awhile and then
left it with anot her partnership in New York. Gerry
Broskin and Harris Gordon revamped the panel and
went IFR. Soon after that, it became the answer to
a dream for Ron and Diane Rissone in Randolph,
Massachusetts. But then there was this pine tree ...
That brings the odyssey of N1365H to Bill Walsh'
hangar and private seaplane base.
The next time Bill's Sedan sees another runway
it'll obviously be sporting rebuilt wings and new float
brackets; in addition, there' ll be a new windshield,
all new woodwork , new ceconite, new headliner, new
used back seats (from a Tri-Pacer , yet!), a new panel
(still IFR), and discussion has already started about a
total engine overhaul.
There's one other new item in the works for the
Sedan. When it's checked out on its wheels again
there' ll be a streamlined gas tank nestled in the gear
bay. You see, Bill and Fred have promised themselves
this extended tour of South America, once they finish . .
Then the Sedan will bob in the harbor beside the
Cessna and Bill can wrestle with the question , " which
one do I fly today?"
(David Gustafson photo)
Fred Chew holds up the new tip
he's built for the right wing.
(David Gustafson photo)
Bill Walsh displys the seaplane door that's being installed
on the left side of the Sedan.
19
Restoration Tips:
a photo  essay  provided by 
Fred  Chew 
158  Meridian  St 
Fall  River,  Mass.  02720 
(Note:  Fred's  kept  an  excellent  photo  record  of  the 
process  of  rebuilding  the  wings  for  Bill  Walsh's 
Aeronca  Sedan.  It  gi ves  a good  idea  of  how  to do  it
and how much  work's  invol ved.) 
No.2  - Teardown  reveals  the  damage.  No.4  - Line  up  new  to old. 
No.  1 - Last  step  before  rebuilding. 
20
Aeronca  Sedan  spar  repair  7976 (Right  wing).  No.5  - Extrusion  repair. 
No.8 - Removing old section. No. 10 - Repair of extrusion spar.
No.6 - Horizontal-line up.
No.7 - New piece made ready for hole fl are. No.9 - Ready for spar extrusion repair . No. 17 - New piece in place for riveting.
21 
No. 12 - Nose rib in place. No. 15 - Form to fit inside of old damaged spar tip rib. NO.  78  - Hand form mg.
No. 73 - C1eco nose rib to spar. No. 16  - .032  alclad ready to be clamped in form. No. 79  - Flanging spar tip.
No. 74  - Ready to repair rear spar.
No. 77  - Form ready for hand bending jig for lightening holes. No. 20  - More of same.
22 
No. 27 - Trim off excess flange . No. 24 - Test fit to spar. No. 27 - .032 alclad 2024 TJ.
No. 22 - Trim square to form. No. 25 - Fly cutting lightening holes. No. 28 - Spar tip ready for installation.
No. 23 - Remove from form. No. 26 - Flanging. No. 29 - Cleco' s test line up.
23
The  Babv  Cessna 
It  was  born  in  Wichita,  Kansas  at  the  Cessna  fac--
tory  in  1929.  Because  of  the  stock  market  slump, 
the  Airplane  manufacturing  business  fell  off  dras-
tically.  To  try  and  keep  the  plant  in  operation,  Eldon 
Cessna  decided  to  design  and  build  a  light  airplane 
that  could  be  sold  at  a  low  price.  As  a  result  the 
EC-1  was  developed.  It  was  powered  with  a  25  hp 
Cleone engine. 
At  the  time  I  was  enrolled  at  the  Braley  School 
of  Flying,  which  was  located  directly  across  the  road 
to  the  east  of  the  Cessna  field.  I  spent  much  of  my 
spare  time  at  the  field  watching  the  men  work  on 
and  fly  the  Baby  Cessna.  It  was  a  fascinating  little 
airplane. 
Early  last  year  I  was  looking  for  a  suitable  air-
plane  to  model  for  a  C02  Powered  model  airplane 
contest.  I  remembered  the  Baby  Cessna  and  thought 
it would  be just what  I wanted. 
In  doing  research  for  drawings  and  photos,  I  found 
that  photos  of  both  the  EC-1  and  the  EC-2  were 
available,  but  no  drawings.  I  had  a  photo  of  the 
EC-1  that  I  had  taken  with  my  Brownie  box  camera. 
The  EC-2  looked  cleaner  with  its  design  refinements 
and  the Aeronca  E-107  engine. 
I  met  Eldon  Cessna  at -an  OX5  get-to-gether  at  the 
Santa  Paula  Airport  and  we  discussed  the  EC-2  at 
length.  He  informed  me  that  plans  had  never  been 
published.  The  EC-2  (c/n  253,  N405W)  was  the  last 
Baby  Cessna  built. 
From  the  photos  and  from  memory  of  being 
around  the  Baby  Cessna,  these plans  for a model  were 
drawn.  Imagine  what  a  delightful  ' fun'  airplane  it 
would  be  for  a  homebuilt  replica  project  today. 
These  specifications  appeared  in  the  1930  issue  of 
Air  Age'  magazine. 
Baby  Cessna  EC-2  (c/n253 ,  N405W) 
30  hp  Aeronca  E-707A 
• 
"1 
Baby  Cessna  EC-7  (c/n  257,  N403W)  25  hp  Cleone 
1930 
By  Cedric  Calloway 
EAA  #752 
74624  Willow Street 
Hesperia,  CA  92345 
:", '",  ~   .   ~
THE  "BABY"  CESSNA 
Span  . ...................... ...... .....  34  ft.  11  in. 
Wing  area  ........... .... ................ 163  sq.  ft. 
Length  overall ........................... 20  ft.  4  in. 
Height overall  ... .... •.... .... ......... .. .  5  ft.  6  in. 
Weights 
Empty .... ................ .. .. ......... .  470  Ibs. 
Gross  .................................. 925  Ibs. 
Gasoline  capacity  ............................ 8  gal. 
Oil  capacity ................................ 3/4  gal. 
Power  (Aeronca  E-107A)  ..................... 30  hp. 
PERFORMANCE 
High  speed  ........ ... ................. ....  86  mph 
Cruising  speed  ............................ 70  mph 
Stalling speed  ............................. 38  mph 
Climb  first  minute . ...... ... ................. 740  ft. 
Ceiling  (service)  .... ...... . ............... 15,000 ft. 
Cruising  range  ............ .... ........... 200  miles 
24 
CLASSIFIED ADS
ADVERTISING  ClOSING  DATE:  10th  OF  THE  SECOND 
MONTH  PRIOR  TO  PUBLICATION  DATE.  (THAT  IS:  MARCH 
10th  IS  ClOSING  DATE  FOR  MAY  ISSUE.)  CLASSIFIED  AD· 
VERTISING  RATE :  Regular  type:  per  word  35c.  Bold  face 
type: per  word  40c.  ALL  CAPS:  per  word  45c.  (Minimum 
charge  $5 .00.)  (Rate  covers  one  insertion  one  issue.)  PAY· 
MENT  WITH  ORDER. 
REPLICA  1912  CURTISS  PUSHER  - Excellent  craftsmanship, 
fabric,  C·65,  90  SMOH.  A  real  crowd  pleaser - $4800  or  best 
offer.  8051498·5101.
TAYLORCRAFT  BD·12D  - Razorback,  butyrate.  New  Slick 
ignition.  Genave  100  Comm  portable  installed.  Spare  prop 
and  compass.  Sound  65  hp  Cont.  Fresh  annual.  $5000  Firm.' 
Crawford,  7500  Balboa,  Van Nuys,  CA  91406. 
ENGINES 
65  Continental  - Approx.  1000  hrs.  Logs.  Complete  except 
for one  mag.  414/387·4895.
Two  Continental  aircraft  engines  for  sale.  Crated  and  ready 
for  shipment.  Continental  A·75-8.  OSMO  - Total  Time  1386 
hrs.  Crankshaft  - standard  size  - pistons  0.15  over .  Com-
plete  less  carbo  Complete  logs .  Price  - $1850.00.  Continen-
tal  A-65-8.  OSMO  - Total  Time  218  hrs.  Pistons  and  crank-
shaft  - standard  size.  Complete  less  harness.  Complet e 
logs.  Price  - $2250.00.  Jon  J.  Thompson,  telephone  804/ 
285-2929. 9  A.M.  - 5  P.M.  Monday' through  Friday. 
PROPELLERS 
Custom  built  props  for  Con tinental ,  Lycoming,  GPUs,  etc. 
Fast  delivery.  Chad  Wille,  5957  Sevi ll e  St.,  Lake  Grove,  OR 
97034. 
ARROW  SPORT  reduction  gear  and  oil  pan  for  Ford  V-8 flat-
head  engine,  new.  Mark  Dees,  358  S.  Beverly  Dr.,  Beverly 
Hill s,  CA  90212.  213/552-0192. 
WANTED:  Any  information  concerning  the  Lincoln  Spor t 
Biplane  produced  in  Lincoln ,  Nebraska  in  the  1920' s  (par-
tial  plans  shown  in  the  1930  Flying  and  Gli der  Manual ).  Mr. 
Harry  R.  Owen,  Box  304,  Isanti ,  MN  55040. 
Calendar  of Events 
JUNE  9-11  - SPRINGFIELD,  OHIO  - 2nd  Annual  Spring  EAA  Mid-
Eastern  Regional  Fly-In  (MERFI ).  Air  Show,  awards,  on  airport 
camping,  static  displays,  etc.  Please  check  NOTAMS.  Contact 
Myrna  Lewi s,  241  Bassett  Drive,  Springfield ,  Ohio  44506.  5131
323-2424. 
JUNE  16-18  - ANDERSON,  INDIANA - Second  Annual  Cessna  120-
140  Assn.  Fly- In  and  meeting,  Quad  City  Municipal  Airport,  Mo-
line,  Ill inois.  For  information  contact  Frank  Hancock,  Sec.fTreas. , 
3941  West  Cross  St.,  Anderson,  IN 46011.317/643-1593.
JUNE  17·18  - FREDERICKSBURG,  VIRGINIA  - Antique  Aircraft  Fly-
In ,  Shannon  Airport .  Air  Show  attract ions:  Bob  Hoover,  Bob  Rus-
sell  and  Duane  Cole. 
JUNE  21·26  - TULLAHOMA,  TENNESSEE  - Annual  Staggerwingl 
Travel  Air  International  Convention.  Forums,  formation  fl yi ng 
and  fun.  Contad  John  Parish,  cl o Lannom  Mfg.  Co. ,  Tullahoma, 
Tennessee 38388.  615/455-0691.
JUNE  23·25  - HAMILTON,  OHIO  - Annual  National  Waco  Reunion 
Fly-In.  Contact  Ray  Brandly,  2650  W.  Alex-Bell  Rd. ,  Dayton,  OH 
45459. 513/435-9725.
JULY  1-2  - GAINESVILLE,  GEORGIA  - 11th  Annual  Cracker  Fly-In 
at  Lee-Gilmer  Airport .  Awards  will  be  presented  in  all  categories. 
Our banquet will  be  at  the  Gainesville  Ho liday  Inn  Saturday  ni ght , 
July  2.  Len  Povey  has  accepted  an  invitation  t o  be  guest  speaker. 
Accommodations  - Gainesvi lle  Holiday  Inn  and  other  local  motels. 
Information:  Jim  Ealy,  3535  Childers  Road,  Roswell , Georgia 30075. 
404/993-4568.
JULY  1-9  - BLAKESBURG,  IOWA  - Wright  Brothers  75th  Anniver-
sary  Fly-In  at  th e  Antique  Airfield.  Incl udes  World  War  II  PT  and 
Liaison  Plane  Fly-In,  Jul y  1-3,  Fairchild  Club  Fly-In  and  Unique  Air-
plane  Fly-In  July  8-9. 
JULY  9  - EASTON ,  PENNSYLVANIA  - 2nd  Annual  Aeronca  Fly-
In ,  Easton  Airport.  10  AM  to  2:30  PM ,  open  to  all  types  of 
Aeroncas.  Rain  date,  July  16.  Contact  Jim  Polles ,  2151759-3713
nights  and  weekends. 
JULY  14-16  - MINDEN,  NEBRASKA  - Second  Annual  National  Stin-
son  Club  Fly-In.  Pioneer  Field  near  Harold  Warp' s  Pioneer  Vil-
lage.  BBQ  Friday  night  for  early  arrival s.  Sat urday  night  banquet 
and  awards.  Schedu led  events.  Fly-In  Chairman  Bob  Near,  2702 
Butterfoot  Lane,  Hastings,  Nebraska  68901.  402/463-9309.
JULY  15·16  - LOCKPORT,  ILLINOI S  - Chapter  15  and  86  of  the 
Chi cago  area  EAA  are  now  formulating  plans  for  their  18th 
Annual  Fly-In  and  Air  Show  to  be  held  at  Lewis  University.  In-
formation:  Janice  P.  Fish,  P.O.  411,  Lemont,  Illinoi s 60439. 
JULY  15-16  - LONG  ISLAND,  NEW  YORK  - Antique  Airplane  Club 
of  Great er  New  York  16th  Annual  Fly- In,  Brookhaven  Airport , 
Brookhaven,  Long  Island,  New York. 
JULY  16  - DUNKIRK,  NEW  YORK  - Annual  Fly-In  Breakfast 
sponsored  by  EAA  Chapter  46  and  Dunkirk  Rotary.  Free  break-
fast  to  homebui lders,  antique  and  warbi rd  pilot s.  Trophies  in 
all  EAA  classes.  Spot  landing  contest  on  arrival.  Contact  Charles 
Gall agher,  19  Shelby  Drive,  Buffalo,  New  York  14225. 
JULY  21-23  - COFFEYVI LLE,  KANSAS  - Funk  Fl y- In .  Funk  owners, 
pilots  and  friends  invited.  Fly-bys ,  factory  and  museum  tours, 
banquet.  Contact  G.  Dale  Beach,  1621  Dreher  Street,  Sacramento, 
California  95814  o r  Joe  C. Funk ,  2409  Edgevale  Drive,  Coffey-
ville,  Kansas  67337. 
JULY  29  - AUGUST  5  - OSHKOSH,  WISCONSIN  - 26th  Annual 
EAA  FlY-in.  Plan  now - it's  the  greatest  show on  eart h. 
AUGUST  6-12  - LAKELAND,  FLORI DA  - International  Cessna  170 
Associat ion  Convention,  Lakeland ,  Florida. 
AUGUST  7- 12  - FOND  DU  LAC,  WISCONSIN  - 13t h  Annual  EAN 
lAC  Internati ona l  Aerobati c  Championships.  For  further  informa-
tion  contact  Sam  Maxwell,  2116  Erie,  Nort h  Kansas  City,  MO 
64116. 
EAA ANTIQUE/CLASSIC
DIVISION
MEMBERSHIP DRIVE
~   ~ a i r ofAntique Goggles 
by persuading 5 people to 
JOin.
er A  Leather  Flying  Helmet 
when you get 10 people to 
sign  up. 
- then startoverand win again
~  A  free  five  year  member-
ship in the Antique/ Classic 
Division if you sponsor the 
most  new  members  in 
1978.
To  Qualify: Write  your  name  and  member-
ship number on  the back of the member-
ship blanks  we' ve  been  providing  in  THE
VIN TAGE AIRPLANE. Headq uarters  will 
keep  score. 
25
1..  
Dear  Sir: 
I am  trying to get information on an  aircraft that was 
built during the  '20s,  called  the  "Golden  Eagle  Chief". 
It was a parasol wing powered by a radial engine, type un-
known.  Only  about  seven  were  built.  If  any  of  your 
Antique classic division  members know anything about 
this  aircraft,  I  would  like to  get in  touch  with  them. 
I  would  like  to  take  this  opportunity  to  express 
what  an  outstanding  organization  I  think  the  EAA 
is.  I've  only  been  a  member  for  three  years  and  only 
regret  the  years  before  I  joined.  SPORT AVIATION
is  one  of  the  best  publications  that  I  have  ever  read. 
I  have  been  to  Oshkosh  twice  and  to  quite  a  few 
local  fly-ins,  including  Sun  'N  Fun,  and  have  never 
seen  anything  more  organized  or  better  run.  I  am 
looking  forward  to  Oshkosh  '78  and  to  continued 
membership  in  a  fine  organization. 
Sincerely, 
james  E.  Spradley  (EAA  108947) 
P.O.  Box  146 
Rutledge,  Alabama  36071 
Dear  Mr.  Nielander: 
Your  editorial  in  the  February  issue  of  The  Vin-
tage  Airplane  is  the  best  expression  of  the  question 
of  who  is  really  qualified  to  maintain  antique  and 
classic  aircraft  (this  applies  equally  well  to  some  cur-
rent  aircraft  such  as  the  Bellanca  Viking,  etc.). 
I  submit  the  following  recommendation  as  a  way 
to  offset  some  of  the  difficulties  expressed  in  your 
excellent  editorial;  to wit: 
The  FAA  should  grant  an  A  and  E (or  P)  mechanic's 
license  to  an  individual  who  meets  the  following 
qualifications: 
(1)  Passes  three written examinations  now required 
for the  rating; 
(2)  Passes  the  practical  examination  currently  re-
quired; 
(3)  Can  show  that  he  has  actually  done  the  major 
portion  of  the  work  in  the  restoration  of  an 
antique  or classic  airplane. 
You  will  note  that  the  difference  between  these 
requirements  and  the  current  FAR  part  65  require-
ments  is  the  modification  of  sec.  65.77  which  relates 
to  on-the-job  or schooling  experience. 
From  my  own  experience  in  restoring  three  air-
planes  (Luscombe,  Stinson  Reliant,  Beechcraft  B17L) 
I  know that the  amount of honest-to-God airplane and 
engine  work  in  the  usual  restoration  project  is  in  ex-
cess  of  the  stuff  that  the  students  in  the  " approved" 
mechanic schools get. Moreover, during the 30 months 
"practical"  experience  referred  to  in  FAR  65.77,  a  lot 
of  that  time  is  spent  just  removing  cowlings,  clean-
ing sparkplugs, changing tires, sweeping floors,  pump-
ing  gas,  and  plowing  snow.  I  guess  what  I'm  trying 
to  do  is  build  a  case  which  shows  that  the  antique/ 
classic  restorer  or  homebuilder  knows  just  as  much 
about  airplanes  in  general  as  does  the  individual  who 
qualifies  under  the  current  provisions  of  FAR  sec. 
65.77. 
Very  truly yours, 
Thomas  R.  Rench 
1601  Circlewood  Drive 
Racine,  Wisconsin  53402 
Dear  AI: 
Perhaps  I  can  shed  a  little  light  on  the  center-
fold  of the  February  issue  of The  Vintage Airplane. 
The  two  planes  pictured  in  the  center  of  the  page 
are:  Top  picture,  Wright  Martin  (Loening)  M-8.  Bot-
tom  picture  is  an  Ansaldo  SVA-5  or SVA-9. 
The  Loening  was  manufactured  by the Wright Mar-
tin  Corp.  and  was  built  in  1921-1922.  The  factory 
deSignation  was  M-8. 
The  Army  Air  Service  designation  was  PW-2,  PW-
2A  and  PW-2B.  Two  of  the  PW-2  model  were  built 
in  1921.  Gross  weight  was  2788  Ibs.,  span  39'  8", 
length  24'  2".  Ten  of  the  PW-2A  model  were  ordered 
by  the  Air  Service  but  the  order  was  cancelled  after 
four  were  built  in  1922.  Gross  weight  was  2799  Ibs. , 
span  39'  9" ,  length  26'  1". 
The  PW2B  was  evaluated  in  1922  but  was  never 
built.  Gross  weight  was  to  be  2976  Ibs.,  span  34'  1", 
length  23'  4". 
PW-2  and  PW-2A  were  powered  by  the  Wright 
Martin  "H" of  320  hp  which  was  a  Hisso  built  under 
license.  The  PW2-B  was  to  be  powered  by  a  350  hp 
Packard  engine. 
The  Ansaldo  can  be  either  an  SVA-5  or  SVA-9  as 
the  front  view  doesn't  show  whether  it  is  a  two 
place  or  single  place.  The  SVA-5  was  single  place 
while  the  SVA-9  was  two  place.  Both  were  powered 
by  the  Breda  SPA-6A  engine  which  was  6  cylinders 
and  rated  at 200  hp at 1600  rpm. 
I  understand  that  there  is  an  SVA-5  in  a  museum 
in  Connecticut  but I  am  not sure of this . 
Hope  this  information  will  be  of some  use  to  you. 
Best  regards, 
H.  M.  Harkcom 
Harkcom  Aircraft  Service 
Rt.  1 
Inola,  Oklahoma 
Dear AI : 
In  the  February  issue  j .  R.  Nielander  wrote  an  in-
teresting  editorial  concerning  the  possibilities  in  the 
area  of  personal  certification  of  antique  aircraft  by 
the  owner restorer. 
Without  blowing  my  own  horn  too  loud,  I  have 
worked  with  antiquers  and  others  for  the  last  28 
years  doing  what  j.  R.  talks  about,  signing  off  work 
for  non-rated  owners.  A  lot of these  people  are  really 
sharp  and  most  do  above  average  work,  and  should 
be allowed  to cut  it on  their own, somehow. 
I  think  the  key  to  this  thing  is  for  the  FAA  to  set 
up  a  program  whereby  the  interested  antiquer  could 
satisfy  them  that  he  is  qualified  to  restore  and  main-
tain  his  antique.  This  may  not  be  as  far  away  from 
FAA  thinking  as  one  might  imagine  as  there  has  been 
talk  around  for  some  time  at  lower  levels  that  the 
A&E  ratings  cover  too  much  area  for  the  average 
mechanic.  In  other  words,  the  thinking  in  some  areas 
of the  FAA  is  that  specialized  ratings  might  be  needed 
to  have  better  qualified  people  in  the  field  where 
needed.  If  this  thinking  is  still  being  kicked  around 
in  the  FAA  then  the  people  in  the  antique field  would 
fit  into the thinking already  floating  around. 
A  specialized  rating  for  antiquers  that  covered 
about  what  was  in  old  manual  18  would  not  be  diffi-
cult  to  qualify  for.  I  would  favor  two  ratings  along 
the  lines  of  the  A&P.  If  an  antiquer  did  not  want  to 
get  into  the  mechanics  of  engines,  he  could  go  after 
an  airframe  rating  only.  If  he  wanted  to  be  able  to 
annual  his  antique  then  of  course  he  would  have  to 
hold  both  tickets .  To  satisfy  the  FAR's  and  the  in-
surance  companies  I  think  the  antique  rating  ap-
proach  has  good  merit. 
I  have  talked  to  several  antiquers  not  rated ,  and 
they  all  said  that  they  would  be  happy  to  work  to-
ward  a  limited  type  rating  that  would  allow  them 
unrestricted  labor  on  their  own  aircraft.  They  all 
feel  that  they  should  have  this  opportunity,  and  I 
concur.  I  have  not  always  been  happy  to  sign  off 
work  as  an  IA  due  to  the  fact  that  there  is  no  such 
thing  as  direct  supervision  even  if  you  are  in  the 
same  room  all  the  time.  Also  I  have  seen  the  FAA 
just  as  uneasy,  mostly  because  they  as  a  whole  are 
far  from  qualified  to judge  most antiques. 
Well ,  hope  this  fills  a  small  gap  in  the  overall 
picture.  If  I  can  be  of further  help  in  any  way,  please 
let  me  know. 
Sincerely, 
Bob  Younkin 
55  Appleby  Road 
Razorback  Airport 
Fayetteville,  Arkansas  72701 
26
Are  you  restoring  a Classic? 
:/)(U1.'t
dJ.4  ~ ~
\
I / ~  
Jj
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