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Guest interview:

Gwen Bailey

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ADMIN NOTE: Hi everyone, tonight we have author of 9 books including one of THE most
bestselling puppy care guides of our time 'The Perfect Puppy', founder and director of Puppy
School & behaviour specialist -Gwen Bailey!
Hi Gwen - and thank you so much for joining us. To kick things off can you tell us why you left
your position as head of behaviour in the rescue after 12 years to open Puppy School?

Kim Carnell Welcome Gwen and thank you for giving up your time

Serena Marangoni Welcome!

Christine Holmes Spriggs Bennett Hi Gwen Bailey! thanks for joining us!

Tamara A Howard Welcome and thank you for time with us today.

Joseph Patrick John Kelly Thank you for your time Gwen. Who has been your mentors at the start
of your career
Gwen Bailey Thank you for inviting me! I think anyone who works in rescue for more than a few years
gets a little tired of seeing dogs come in with the same problems over and over. I wanted to do something more
preventative, and, when I realised how good puppy classes were at doing this, I wanted to spread the word and
hence Puppy School was born!

Jason Currie Welcome Gwen thankyou for sharing your time with us

Tamara A Howard And now...what would you say the number one problem was??

Gwen Bailey Definitely John Rogerson played a big part in helping me think the way a dog does, and
then John Fisher of course. It was good to be around at the very start but also very scary as a lot of things we did
had to be trial and error, or, as we should be saying, trial and success….

Denise O'Moore Gwen was that also the reason you start writing? And did you think your puppy care
book would have such an impact?

Joseph Patrick John Kelly Thank you for your answer. John Rogerson has helped me greatly

Gwen Bailey Biggest problem in this world is fear - in humans and dogs. If only we could all stop being so
fearful! The sad thing is we know how to raise sociable well adjusted puppies, but getting breeders to do it is so
difficult, especially when money is involved.

Jason Currie Gwen i think some pup classes are poorly run, do you have advice on how to avoid classes
becoming riots !!

Gwen Bailey I started writing because, after a number of years working in rescue, I could see why
owners were getting it wrong and I had an overwhelming desire to help people get it right. So I started with puppy
classes on a sunday morning and I realised people didn't want to sit and listen, but instead wanted to 'do' so I
started writing handouts on different subjects for them to take away. That grew over the years and The Perfect
Puppy was born.

And, no, I never thought people would come up to me and say 'I used your book to raise my dog and he is
perfect' - I used to hold my breath in case they said something else but they never did - phew! But I pretty much
knew what I wrote was correct - not wishing to be big-headed - but I'd lived those problems for so long that it
seemed obvious to me how owners could get it right instead

Denise O'Moore lol I think most of here have either read it or used it at some point Gwen.

George Quinlan Hello Gwen Bailey, I am collecting your books for many of my clients to help them
understand our goal.
Serena Marangoni Gwen, your dog is a beauceron, right? Can you tell me something about your
experience with the breed? I had a female beauceron who was a "handful" but we loved her to bits - unfortunately
she died very prematurely at only 6 mo. and now we're going to get another puppy soon - I remember skimming
dog books at the library, seeing the picture of your dog and buying the book right on the spot (it's one of the few
positive training books available in Italy in libraries and not just through specialised sellers)

Mike Hurley What is the hardest thing to get owners to do and follow through on with regard to puppy

Christi Chapman Gwen, The rescue I founded has been working with a hoarding situation,
unfortunately LE will not get involved and put a stop to her behavior, but we took 10 puppies a year ago from this
environment. I am a trainer and behaviorist myself and would like your opinion on some observations from this
situation. I am giving you the full history here because I think it is pertinent.

The ten pups were from 2 litters, one group were 3-4 weeks old and the other litter were 6-7 weeks. We kept
them together in their litters, but kept the litters apart. They were malnourished, and terribly dehydrated. They all
scored between 1 and 2.5 on the body conditions. Some had hair missing in patches because of either extreme
cold, one had a part of the tail missing, and they had open wounds from bites, possible exposure to the extreme
cold, and likely from an unclean environment.

From the day they came to us, all had abundant food, and water. They initially fought over the food bowls AND
the water (the younger litter didn't know how to drink at all- we had to use a dropper to get them started) until we
taught them that there was an individual food bowl for each of them.

As they matured, many retained that resource guarding behavior. We consistently worked, using only positive
methods, to eliminate this behavior. When they were adopted into homes, we disclosed this and asked that the
new owners continued to follow the training and if they were having trouble that they would hire a trainer in their
area to assist them. They are improving, slowly, but wondered if you had thoughts on this situation?

Denise O'Moore ADMIN NOTE: Hi guys don't forget questions can only be answered as quickly as our
guest can type

Gwen Bailey so sorry, I got locked out of FB for a moment, but I'm back now

Jason Currie fb gremlins at it again

Denise O'Moore Gwen that's normally my job to lock people out during interview lol - I think Serena 's
question is the next to be answered. And George is collecting your books for his clients in the US.
Gwen Bailey Ah, a Beauceron question. My favourite subject! My boy is 10 years now, and I really
wouldn't recommend the breed unless you have lots of experience and lots of sensitivity to cope with their
sensitivities. but I love their close bonding and their protection, but next time its a labrador or something easier -
perhaps a poodle!
The hardest thing to get owners to do is to separate two pups and play/train/educate them independently. Most
owners who get siblings enjoy the lack of effort until they reach adolescence and need our help. By that time,
pups area dog-focussed and less successful as pets. It's really hard to get them on the right track earlier.

Denise O'Moore I have noticed a number of Beaucerons being used as Service dogs in US - not one I
would have thought suitable! Stunning breed though.

. Gwen Bailey Yes, they do look very impressive and so I can see why they like to have them in difficult
situations - I had a situation where I was in our field one day and didn't notice two telephone pole men walking
towards us until Spider was at full pelt running towards them tail and hackles in the air. One man actually tried
climbing on the other he was so scared! But my early working trials training came in very useful when I shouted
'sit' and much to everyones relief he sat!

Chantal Karyta Hi Gwen - What do you find the best method is to motivate owners in puppy classes?

Jason Currie Gwen changing the subject a little but you have a background in zoology so I was
wondering what other animals you have worked with ?

Gwen Bailey Christi - that's a difficult one, isn't it. I think when dogs have had to fight for food and water,
there is an intensity to their behaviour that makes it very difficult to work with them. And of course when it
happens at such an early age, it is so much more ingrained. so I think you have done very well to get them to a
stage where some are improving slowly. Thank goodness for you as if they had had the usual punishment so
often attempted in these cases, they certainly would have gone downhill quickly.

Now, shall I refresh my page and risk getting locked out again? Advice please Denise O'Moore

Grainne Finucane Hi Gwen, I have a 17 week old Labradoodle that is being trained at home as an
ASD assistance dog. I'm having huge trouble with him jumping up and mouthing me when he gets excited. He is
crate trained but nothing seems to work and my hands are covered in teeth scratches

Denise O'Moore Gwen - try refresh

Mike Hurley You can hit F5 to do it with one key stroke also.
Christi Chapman Gwen, I wondered perhaps if that behavior could be evolved? They had also never
been treated with any anger or punishment, or aggression from any human. Most of the dogs there do not have
those behaviors either, if they do and are in rehab they were never exposed to the pups in any way. Most of the
pups were in foster homes that were very nurturing too. So it led me to consider that possibility. I was happy to
see that we COULD turn it around, with consistent positive methods.

Gwen Bailey Ah, still here, hurray. Grainne - labradoodles have such a lot of energy and a very lively
jump! I would try to focus all of that onto play with toys. I'm not sure how you train your assistance dogs, but if it is
with toys, be sure that there is a 'training time' and a different 'letting off steam' time so that your puppy can learn
when to be sensible and when to let loose. But the very first thing, of course, is to teach them to enjoy playing
with toys, so something large and fluffy so that fills up the mouth rather than your hand. if you are still getting
bitten, use a collar and line so that the puppy can only reach the toy and not you. Good luck

Serena Marangoni Thanks for the answer. Denise, as a matter of fact I chose the breed to have a
sturdy companion for Search & Rescue, I was choosing between beauceron and malinois but I fell in love with
the beaucerons I met when looking for a breeder and I was hooked by their personality. My main problem has
been my dog's lack of "calm moments" - she had a constant urge to work, and had zero frustration tolerance...
As Gwen said, it's certainly not a dog for everyone

Sarah Mumtotwobeautifulgirls Gwen hi x please can you help, to a few this maybe easy to answer.
Of and my partner have a young pup whom we have had from 5 weeks of age dvd to his mum getting an
infection and told to keep her away from her pups so all the pup hot picked up so he has missed out a lot, the
problem mostly is his biting we have yelp to show he has hurt we have said a stern no and ignored him we have
give him time out in his create he also has loads of toys and bones meant for chewing we have tried distracting
him with his toys , none of these work and having 2 young kids at 2 and 27 wks is scary as he is getting bigger so
are his bites and wanting to put more of what he bites in his mouth, please can you help any tips and advise Will
be so gratefully appreciated xx

Grainne Finucane Thanks Gwen, he is teething at the moment too so will work more on teething toys
with him during play time

Denise O'Moore Fantastic Serena! You must post pictures - I can say YES I would go for that breed for
search and rescue also. When I mentioned service dogs I should have said seeing eye and disability assistance.

Gwen Bailey Christi - I think food/water guarding behaviour is quite instinctive as you see it in very young
puppies. But it does develop quite rapidly if there is a shortage of resources and other creatures are trying to take
yours. so puppies in the litter will quickly teach each other and it doesn't have had to come from a human. They
learn it from each other and then transfer it to humans. Yes, keep going, you can always make improvement and
teach trust, even if you never achieve a completely safe dog.
Christi Chapman I am glad to see we are of the same opinion here- I have taken some criticism!
Thank you!

Chantal Karyta Hi Gwen - What do you find the best method is to motivate owners in puppy classes?

Gwen Bailey That's a pity - don't let them grind you down!

Jason Currie Gwen are there a breeds that commonly stand out as being harder or easier to manage in
puppy classes ?

Mike Hurley I have an 8 month puppy, Bernese Shepard mix.. very non-food motivated. Any
distractions at all, and no interest in treats. Perhaps in your book but if you have any recommendations, I'd
appreciate it. I am trying to take him to Intermediate training for the 2nd time at the moment.

Guy Williams Hi Gwen. What age would you recommend a pup goes to its new home? Have you
seen a link between pups that go too early and later issues interacting with other dogs?

Gwen Bailey Ooooh, that's a difficult one. I think there is no 'best method' but different methods work for
different people. The sad thing is we can't take all the puppies home and train them ourselves so we have to
work with everyone. And everyone has different motivations for what they do (and sometimes no motivation at
all!) so its a matter of finding what works for them. Short of giving them cash or chocolate (and I'm not above
giving prizes if that's what it takes), you just have to find out if they like praise for them, for their dog, winning
competitions, social time, it just depends what they want. But whatever it is, you better have the tools to teach
them to teach their puppy easily as most people want a well trained pup and they want it NOW!

George Quinlan what size classes do you offer?

Gwen Bailey I'm not sure there is an easy breed as it depends on the puppy to an extent, and also no
what mix of pups you happen to have. So bull breeds can be difficult because of the way they play and their
strength of bite, but if you have labradors and boxers to mix them with, for example, you are okay. Its always
good to see gun dogs on the list though and hounds as they are usually so easy going and mix with most others -
but not always …..
Will your Bernese puppy play instead? Some dogs, especially those that are not neutered, are less interested in
food, but will play instead. But you will need to build it up to a level where the toy becomes THE most interesting
thing in the world and that takes time. Or perhaps you are too generous with treats, or not using ones that are
exciting enough or your dog is too full when you try to use them? If I could see you and your dog in action, its
usually pretty easy to spot what is going on - really difficult via this medium.
Mike Hurley So maybe if I video taped a session, you could take a look at it? Thanks I know, not an
easy quick answer when you can't see what's going on.

Gwen Bailey You are welcome. This is such a rewarding group. I know how it must feel to be your dogs

Serena Marangoni Oh, must make another question after reading you comment about
breeds, Gwen. Do you think puppies have a bias of playing with pups of their same kind? sport dogs with sport
dogs, bullies with bullies, sheephers with shepherds... Can they can tell the different breeds? My golden retriever
puppy used to react to white-yellowish big fluffy dogs that resembled her more openly than to other dogs

Tinha Johansson Thank you so much Gwen


Gwen Bailey Yes, I think they do prefer to play certain games, so collies like to chase, bull breeds like to
wrestle, for example, and they all have their own sensitivities and preferences and so are sometimes upset by
others who don't play the same games. So that may account for your goodie's preference for big fluffy yellowish
dogs! But also life in the litter is strongly remembered and the preference may have come from there, especially if
she was late leaving the litter and so had more exposure.
Which is always why its so important that they are exposed to breeds other than their own so they get used to
black coats, squashed faces, lots of fur/no fur etc

Mike Hurley This is what he looks like, he's a rescue puppy.

Gwen Bailey Yes, Mike, if you videoed your bernese mix in action with you trying different things in
different situations, I'd be happy to take a look. Also show me how the puppy plays with toys. sometimes you can
see things really quickly that way (sometimes not!).
Have I missed any questions

Denise O'Moore I'm scrolling now for you Gwen.

Christine Holmes Spriggs Bennett I think you may have missed this one (I was interested in the answer
as well!) "What age would you recommend a pup goes to its new home? Have you seen a link between pups that
go too early and later issues interacting with other dogs?"

George Quinlan yes ,,,,,,,,, How many pups do you recommend in your classes

Tamara A Howard Do you find a tipping point when socializing a puppy? Example: one more
meeting/interaction is too many?

Christi Chapman I wanted to thank you for this awesome host and the conversation!

Denise O'Moore Lol Gwen you will be sorry you asked that!

Gwen Bailey Puppies should go to new homes when they would benefit more from
socialisation/education in the new home. so this depends on how good the socialisation is at the breeders - e.g. if
its a puppy farm, better to get it out of there sooner rather than later. If the breeder is really good, they can stay
and benefit from being in a litter. If there are large pups, development will be a little slower so they are better
staying a bit longer. On average, I would recommend 8 weeks as that is usually best for most litters, but it does
vary a little depending on the above.
George - nice to see an old friend on here - I know, less of the old! An ideal class for me is 6. Enough to have
variety and socialisation and interaction, but not too many to keep control. It can go up to 8 and you can still keep
control but it only needs one or two riotous families to spoil the atmosphere. Any more and I need assistance,
then you could go up to 12 if you have the space.

Denise O'Moore ADMIN NOTE: Hi all, I want to give a very special thank you to Gwen Bailey for this chat
and thank you to all of you for contributing. Gwen will finishing up with the questions in a few minutes so I'm just
going to take the opportunity to post the links mentioned earlier - Again Thanks Gwen

Dog Problems Solved — Behaviour Problems, Puppy Issues, Rescue Dogs, Dog Training, Dog Breeds
My name is Gwen Bailey and I've been helping owners with problem dogs for over 25 years. With the right
techniques, there is hope for even the worst of cases. Good luck with finding a solution that works for both you
and your dog.

George Quinlan come visit in Maine sometime and do a puppy workshop/ Enjoyed today, thanks for
coming on.
Gwen Bailey The tipping point for puppy socialisation - well, I think the more meetings the better but that
should be limited by making sure every meeting is happy and joyful (otherwise it is not socialisation) and allowing
enough time for the puppy to sleep and rest. So that means you cannot do too much or go too fast but must keep
to limits imposed by the puppy.

Jason Currie Gwen its been super having you with us, thankyou you so much

Denise O'Moore Some of Gwens books:

Gwen Bailey Can I just mention my new webiste?

Its a work in progress but you may find some answers there perhaps

Dog Problems Solved — Behaviour Problems, Puppy Issues, Rescue Dogs, Dog Training, Dog Breeds
My name is Gwen Bailey and I've been helping owners with problem dogs for over 25 years. With the right
techniques, there is hope for even the worst of cases. Good luck with finding a solution that works for both you
and your dog.

Denise O'Moore

Puppy training classes, Puppy School is a network of UK schools for training young puppies.