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K: What would you like

to talk about?
S: Pride.
K: Pride.
Are you proud?
S: At times.
K: Sometimes. Why?
What are you proud about?
S: Achieving something.
K: Achieving.
What have you achieved?
Or you are admiring
people who have achieved
or do you want to achieve?
Is that what you want to talk about -
pride, achievement, success, money
position, power.
Is that what you all want?
Probably you all do.
Don't fool yourself,
don't deceive yourself
you all want to have
those things.
S: No, sir, we all want it
because in this world
we can't live
without those things.
K: In these times, the boy says,
we can't live without those things.
How do you know?
S: Anywhere you see a poor man
K: You come out here!
S: Anywhere you see a poor
man, or anything, sir
they'll argue if you don't give
them anything, or if you try
to make them a nice man,
they won't give you any respect.
K: So what do you want to be?
S: Anything which we can
achieve enough respect
for living a happy life,
but not too much respect.
K: You are quite right -
not too much respect
but a fairly comfortable life,
and a happy life. Is that it?
S: Yes.
K: Is that what you want?
S: Yes.
K: Then go after it.
S: Sir, but it is not so easy
unless you try and achieve it.
K: Any other questions?
S: What is the difference between
meditation and concentration?
S: What is the difference between
meditation and concentration?
K: I understood.
K: Do you really want to talk
about that, or is it a game
or just fun to
talk about something
I may be interested in,
is that it?
Do you really want to know what
is meditation and concentration?
All right, sir.
If you really want
to talk about that
will you pay attention
to what I am going to say?
S: Yes, sir.
K: Don't say, 'Yes,
sir', and fidget.
Do you really want
to talk about it?
If you do it is a very,
very serious subject.
What do you think
is concentration?
S: Something which you really
want to think about, sir.
Think about deeply, go into it
deeply, think about it deeply.
K: Think about it deeply.
S: Think about it deeply.
K: Think about it deeply
- what do you mean by that?
S: Something which we
want to keep our minds on.
K: Come over here!
Something you want to
keep you mind on.
Have you tried it?
You want to look at those
flowers, or your book
or what your educator
is saying.
Have you ever looked at it very
carefully, at those flowers
what the teacher is
telling you, listen to him
and concentrate on a book,
have you?
S: Sometimes.
K: Sometimes.
When does that happen?
When you like it - right?
S: Yes.
K: Now, when you like something you
put your attention, your thought
your energy in observing it.
And that is generally
called concentration.
That is, you concentrate on the
book you are reading - right?
or on something that you
are looking very carefully
at those flowers -
or what your friend, or your
teacher is telling you. Right?
S: Yes.
K: Have you ever watched
very carefully
concentrated on
something for a long time?
Not for a second or two
but for a long time
Have you done it?
S: I don't know, sir.
K: Yes, try it now.
Try now to listen very carefully
to what somebody is saying to you
or look at those
flowers for a long time
not allow any other
thought to come in.
That's what concentration
means, focusing
giving all your
attention to something
that you are listening
to or reading a book
or watching something, a
lizard going across the wall.
Will you do it,
are you doing it now?
S: Yes.
K: You are? Good!
Now, when that takes place
what happens?
S: We understand it.
K: Not only you understand
but what is happening?
I'll explain to you presently,
you think it out for yourself.
Where do you come from?
S: Bangalore.
K: Bangalore, good.
I have got two boys
- now two girls?
Now, he wants to know what is the
difference between concentration
and meditation.
You don't know the word 'meditation',
do you, what it means? No.
Nor do you know the meaning
of the word 'concentration'?
S: Now I think I know.
K: Now you know
because I have pointed
it out to you.
So concentration means 'focusing your
thought, your energy on something'.
S: Sir(inaudible)
K: Come over here!
Move a bit so that we give
her more room.
She is a big girl. Right?
She is a big girl.
S: But isn't it difficult to
concentrate on something
without any thought
in your mind?
K: That's it. Is it not difficult
- listen to it carefully
is it not difficult to
concentrate on something
without thoughts coming in?
S: I think it is.
K: It is difficult, isn't it?
So, then what do you do?
S: We try and keep the
other thoughts away.
K: Away. Then who keeps the -
I won't make it complicated for you.
So, you concentrate on a book
and other thoughts come in.
S: Yes.
K: Then what do you do?
S: You try to keep them away.
K: Yes, you try to push
other thoughts away.
Now what goes on
in that process?
I am concentrating on
this, thoughts come in
then I try to push
them away
and then thoughts come in.
So I keep this, don't I?
S: Yes.
K: Are you listening
to what I am saying?
If you are not interested
don't bother.
S: I am thinking of an answer
which you could give correctly.
K: I can't understand you.
S: I am thinking of an answer which
you could give correctly for it.
K: Look, sir, I was telling you,
when you concentrate on something
other thoughts come in.
Then you try to push
those thoughts away
and then you try
to concentrate.
So there is this going
on all the time. Right?
S: Why do those thoughts
come in?
K: Wait, wait, I am
coming to that presently.
First see what is happening.
You want to concentrate
on something
then thoughts come in and
then you push them out
and again thoughts come in
and again you push them out.
So, you really are not
concentrating, are you?
Because thoughts come
in and disturb you.
Now, he asked,
why do thoughts come in.
S: Yes.
K: You tell me why thoughts
come in. I will tell you.
S: I think it is because we
think about those things.
Because when we are doing
something something else happens
and you think about it.
K: Yes, that is, you
are thinking about this
you are also thinking
about something else.
Is that it?
S: Yes.
K: Why does this happen?
S: Sir, if you are thinking that
while you are concentrating
K: Come and sit here!
Sorry, three boys and a girl.
S: Sir, as you try
to concentrate
you keep thinking that I should
not allow thoughts to come in
and so they come in.
K: Yes, why do they come in?
S: Because you keep
thinking about them.
K: But you are also
thinking about this.
S: Because we are
suppressing them.
K: That's right.
You have got it.
You have understood what
you have said?
Not quite.
You are trying to concentrate on
this, other thoughts come in
then you try to suppress thoughts,
only the other thoughts except this.
Right? So what is
happening when you suppress?
I suppress
I am uncomfortable
I have eaten bad food,
and I feel
and I try
to suppress my pain.
Why do you do that, why do you have
suppressions, why do you suppress?
S: Because we think
it will be nicer
if you suppress
they won't come again
so you suppress it.
K: That's right.
So, he says, when you suppress
them they come back again.
So it is futile to suppress.
It would be wrong to
suppress, futile to suppress.
Then what will you do?
S: If you are really thinking about
something very seriously, sir
there are no other thoughts.
K: But other thoughts
come in, old boy.
S: But when you are really thinking
without any other things
why should they come in?
K: Now wouldn't you try to
understand why thoughts are always
moving back and forth?
Wouldn't you ask that question?
S: Sir
Because we suppress thoughts
come in and we can't control them
and we lose
our concentration.
So what should we do because,
sir, is it possible that
if we just leave it the other
thoughts will go by themselves?
K: I haven't quite
grasped it, have you?
S: If you don't do anything
with the other thoughts
if you don't pay attention
to them, will they go away?
Is that what you are saying?
K: Would you come up here?
Come up here, sit up
here, don't be nervous.
This is a very complex
subject, isn't it?
Most people, grown-up people, young
people, are told from childhood
are you listening,
listen carefully
from childhood you are
told to concentrate. Right?
You want to look out of the
window and the teacher says
'Concentrate on your book'.
But you are really interested in
watching that lizard on that wall.
And the teacher says, 'Don't
look, pay attention to the book'.
So from childhood you are
interested in watching the lizard
but the teacher says,
'Do this'.
S: Yes.
K: Now, if I were your
teacher I would say
'Let's both of us look at that
lizard' - you understand?
Not try to force you
to look at the book.
You have understood
what I am saying?
S: Yes, sir.
K: That is, you are watching that
lizard - there is no lizard here!
And your interest is in
that lizard, not in the book.
So I, as a teacher, would tell you,
'Let both of us watch that lizard
very very carefully, see
how it sticks to the wall
how many claws it has
see the head,
see the eyes'.
S: Yes, sir.
K: I would help you to watch
much more that than the book.
S: Sir, but I've got a question.
K: What?
S: If the teacher, or
in a class
children get distracted
at different times
like I might get
distracted at a certain time
and another person might
get distracted at another time.
And if the teacher tends to
all our distractions, sir
how will she cover the portion?
K: I am going to show you.
You are all so very
clever here, aren't you?
K: Where do you come from?
S: Madras.
S: My parents live in Zambia.
K: First of all,
I have no distractions.
Don't call it distractions.
What is important is
that you watch
pay attention,
listen, that's important.
But there are no distractions.
Don't use the word
'distraction'. Right?
Now, wait a minute, I help
you to watch that lizard
or I help you to watch that boy
sitting over there being restless
fiddling with his fingers.
What I am helping you - not
helping - what I am showing you
is when you pay
attention to something
whether it
is right or wrong
then you can pay
attention to the book.
You have got it?
S: Yes, sir.
K: Are you sure?
S: Yes, sir.
K: That is, when you pay
attention to that lizard
you have learnt
the art of attention.
And I am going to help
all the boys
or twenty or fifteen boys
with me to pay attention.
And when there is attention
there is no distraction.
S: Then why don't
teachers do that, sir?
Suppose we get
distracted in the class.
K: There is no distraction,
don't call it distraction.
S: Suppose we want
to watch something
then why don't the teachers
help us to watch that thing?
K: Ask them.
I am telling you
- come over here
Two girls. Right.
Come up here,
that's better!
All right?
S: Yes, sir.
K: You are not shy?
S: No, sir.
K: That's better.
You are asking why don't your
teachers tell you all this.
S: Yes, sir.
K: Why don't they tell you?
S: Sir, I think they want
to finish their particular
whatever they
wanted to teach us.
K: That's right.
They want to get it over.
They are bored, you are bored.
And they want to quickly
finish what they have to say
and get on to the next
subject, or the next class.
So they are bored
with teaching.
Now find out from them
why they are bored
why they want
to finish quickly
why don't they help
you to pay attention?
You understand?
If you pay attention
to that lizard
then you have learnt
the art of attention.
Have you got it?
Then you can pay attention to the
book, then there is no distraction.
S: But
K: Wait, wait, wait, old boy.
I haven't finished.
If I were your teacher I would
point out to you very carefully
what attention is.
Attention is to pay complete energy,
attention, to what you are watching.
And if you learn that you can learn
how to pay attention to your book.
S: Yes, sir.
S: You might be interested
in the lizard only
and you might
not like studying
you won't be
interested in your studies.
K: Somebody might
not like to study.
Then don't study.
S: Sir, then you can keep
K: Find out, sir, find out.
Learn. Find out why you
don't want to read books.
Now, you listen to me.
We have talked about concentration,
that is, you are thinking
paying attention to something,
then other thoughts come in
and you push
those thoughts out.
And so there is always this conflict
- wanting to pay attention to that
thoughts come in, and so there is
constant chattering of the brain
chattering, chattering,
chattering. Right? Got it?
Now, meditation,
the word 'meditation'
you know what that word is,
you have heard about it?
S: Yes, sir.
K: Meditation in English
means also 'to measure'.
Right? 'To measure'.
As in Sanskrit, if you ask
S: Radhikaji.
K: Radhikaji.
By Jove, thank you
for helping me
If you ask Radhikaji,
she will tell you
'ma' is also 'to
measure' in Sanskrit.
So meditation also
means 'to measure'.
Now, without measurement there is
no technological advancement at all.
Agree? See that?
Do you see all this,
what I am saying?
S: I didn't understand
that word which you said.
K: You don't understand
the word I am using?
S: Yes.
K: I am using 'to measure'.
You have a tape measure, haven't you?
S: Yes.
K: Meditation means
also 'measurement'.
S: I think he doesn't understand the
word 'technology', technological.
K: Ah, you don't understand
the word 'technology'?
Technique - to do something, say for
instance you want to build a car
and you must know all the
parts, put them together
they are all
working together.
I have dismantled a car,
put it all to pieces
and then put it all
together hoping it will work.
But it did work.
Learning about all the machinery, how
it works, what are its components
what are its measurements
its metallic strength
and so on, all that
learning about that is
called technology, some of it.
Now, meditation,
concentration, for me
are two entirely
different things.
S: Sir, quite often you concentrate
without even trying to concentrate.
Like you will be doing something,
you don't need to concentrate
you will be concentrating.
K: You can do something
if you love something you
don't have to concentrate.
Have you understood that?
S: Yes, sir.
K: If you love something
there is no concentration.
Do you love something?
S: Quite a few things.
K: You love quite a few things.
What are they?
S: Sir, I like reading books.
K: Flying kites?
S: Yes, sir.
K: Climbing mountains, climbing
trees, chasing monkeys.
What do you really love?
S: Collecting stamps.
K: No, just a minute.
This is too complex a
subject for little boys.
Meditation means to
be free of measurement.
This is too difficult
for you all.
S: Sir, concentration is something
which you force and do something
and meditation might be
where you don't force anything.
K: That's right. Meditation can only
take place when there is no effort
when there is
no contradiction.
You know contradiction? Saying one
thing, doing another thing. Right?
S: Sir, suppose you like reading, then
you are really concentrating on it
isn't that meditation, where you
don't know you are concentrating?
K: No, no. You are then trying to
understand what the book is saying.
S: You don't know
you are concentrating.
Like he said you don't know
you are concentrating
but you are concentrating.
K: That is when you
like something
when you like to read a
good detective story
you enjoy it, don't you?
This is too difficult for you.
Don't bother about
meditation and concentration.
It is much too difficult.
S: Yes.
K: A little bit.
Now, I would like to talk
about something else.
May I?
S: Yes, sir.
K: I have asked you what you
would like to talk about
and then after asking
you all these questions
I would like to talk to you
about something else. May I?
S: Yes, sir.
K: All of you?
S: Yes, sir.
K: 'Yes, sir'.
Human beings, like you,
have capacity
have some kind
of hidden talent.
Talent - you understand? - that
is to paint, to play the violin
to play the flute, or to be
a very good human being.
Human beings have
hidden talents.
And your society,
your parents
everybody says,
'Become a business man
or become a doctor,
or become an engineer
or become Indian Administrative
person, the Service'. Right?
So your brain, you understand,
what is inside the skull
is conditioned by your parents,
or by the society in which you live.
You understand?
S: Yes, sir.
K: So, your own talent is
destroyed by this pressure.
You might be a great painter.
Or a great singer
or a marvellous botanist,
horticulturist. Right?
But your parents, your society,
say, 'No, that is not good enough
you must become
really a businessman
or a good doctor, or IAS'.
So you destroy
your own talent.
And what is important is
to have your own talent
then you are happy with it.
You understand
what I am saying?
S: Sir
K: Listen to what I am saying.
I am talking now.
And you are listening to me.
That is one thing
- human beings
have essentially,
hidden, a certain talent.
Not always to become a businessman,
or a captain in the army, or a flyer.
So you have to discover your own
talent, and stick to that talent
whether you become
poor, rich, successful.
S: Sir, but it you want
to be a businessman
and by the side of it you can
also sing, or paint, or whatever.
K: Clever boys - you have really
trained these boys beautifully!
They say you can become a
businessman, or a General
or an army captain,
and also paint.
Do you follow how
his brain is working?
You are quite right, sir.
Then you will do neither
thing properly, fully, happily.
S: Why, sir?
K: Because you are
torn between the two.
S: No.
K: I know this, I know this.
You understand?
S: Yes,sir.
K: Wait a minute, I am
talking for a while.
So, it is very difficult also
to discover your own talent.
And it might not
lead you to success.
It doesn't matter then.
You understand?
Then you don't mind
not having much money
because you have got
something in yourself.
S: Yes, sir.
K: So find out, all of you,
find out
your own talent,
something of your own
not imposed by education,
by your parents, by society
but find out something
that you have for yourself.
S: But if our parents
force us to do something.
K: I know your parents force
you to become an engineer
force you to become
something or other.
But while you are young play the
game and say, 'Yes, I accept that'
and find out for yourself.
S: But supposing
something happens to you.
K: I know, just listen
to what I am saying.
Because I have got
something more to say.
S: Yes.
K: You don't mind?
S: No, sir.
K: And also you are going
to enter into a world
when you leave this
marvellous valley
with all the rocks,
and the shadows
and the trees, and the flowers,
and the really peaceful campus
you are going to face a
world that is terrible. Right?
There is violence,
shooting, bribing.
The world is becoming
more and more dangerous.
And the world is
becoming corrupt
all over the world,
not only in India
where it is quite blatant.
You know what the word
'blatant' means? Quite open.
They say, 'Give me something
before I will do something else'.
There is corruption.
All over the world, not
only here in this country
but in America,
in France
in England
- political corruption
social corruption,
black market and so on.
There is tremendous
corruption all over the world.
We say that corruption is bribing,
passing money under the table
paying cash without
giving an account.
All that is called corruption.
But that is only a symptom.
Do you know
what 'symptom' means?
S: Yes, sir, signs.
K: Do you know
what 'symptom' is?
Symptom is I have eaten
something, very heavy food
and I have got tummy ache.
The tummy ache is the symptom.
But the cause is my
eating the wrong food.
Got it?
S: Yes, sir.
K: So, I want to go into
the cause of corruption.
We say corruption -
I hope you are all listening
because you are all
going to face the world
when you leave Rishi Valley.
S: Sir, supposing if you don't
take the money he is giving, sir
he might do something worse.
If you take the money
K: If I give you money under
the table you become corrupt.
S: Yes, sir.
K: And then you also become corrupt
because you are accepting money.
S: Yes, sir.
But if I don't take the
money he might do something.
K: I know, I know. If you
don't take it he will hurt you.
Just listen, understand, what
is the cause of corruption.
You understand?
Corruption isn't merely
passing money
under the table,
bribing, black market
but the cause is
something entirely different.
I am going to go into
that if you are interested.
Corruption begins
with self-interest.
Do you understand this?
S: Yes, sir.
K: If I am interested in
myself, in what I want
what I must be,
if I am greedy
envious, harsh, brutal,
cruel, there is corruption.
You understand?
Corruption begins in your heart, in
your mind, not just giving money
that also is corruption
but the real cause of
corruption is inside you.
Unless you find that
out and change that
you will be
a corrupt human being.
Do you understand
what I am saying?
Corruption is
when you are angry
when you are jealous,
when you hate people
when you are lazy,
when you say
'This is right, and I feel
this is right' and stick to it.
You understand
what I am saying?
S: Sir, it looks like everything
comes under selfishness.
K: Everything comes under
selfishness. You are quite right.
Corruption begins there.
You understand, old boy?
S: Yes, sir.
K: So don't be corrupt.
It doesn't matter
if you die for it.
S: Sir
K: Wait, listen to me.
You understand?
We are all so frightened.
You say, 'How will I live? What
will I do if I am not corrupt
when all the people
around me are corrupt?'
You understand what
I mean by corruption
not just the outward sign but the
deep inward sense of corruption
that human beings live with -
selfish, thinking about themselves
wanting their success, envious
- you understand?
So, corruption is inside, in
your heart, in your brain.
So if you understand
that very carefully
and you are really
serious, not cynical
most of those grown-up
boys who are going to leave
have become cynical, they see
what the world is, they say
'Well, I have got to accept it'.
That is a form of cynicism.
But if you understand very carefully
from now that corruption is
not merely passing money
under the table, bribing
bribing whether
it is two rupees
or ten million dollars,
it is still bribing.
And being violent is part of what is
called corruption, terror, all that.
That is what is
happening in the world.
You are a human being growing
up, don't be like them.
Don't become angry, don't be
envious, don't always seek success.
S: Sir, how can we stop all that?
How can we stop being envious?
K: If you want to be envious be
envious and see what happens.
You understand?
But if you don't want to be
envious, don't be envious.
Don't say, how do I stop it?
If you see something dangerous, like
a cobra, nobody tells you - you run.
So, corruption inside
is most dangerous.
So don't be corrupt.
Begin there first,
not out there.
You understand?
S: Yes, sir.
K: Will you do it?
Don't promise.
Don't ever promise unless you are
absolutely going to carry it out.
But if you see how
important it is in life
because you are
all growing up
growing into
this terrible world.
It's insane world.
You understand?
There is no sanity in the political
world, in the religious world.
In the economic world
there is no sanity.
So, please, I am just pointing out
to you, whether you are grown up
or leaving this
marvellous valley
or staying here for
another two, four years
don't be corrupt,
don't seek vanity, pride
don't say, 'I am
superior to somebody else'.
You know, you learn a great
deal when there is humility.
You know the word 'humility'?
You learn a great deal
if you are really humble.
But if you are merely
seeking success
money, money, money,
power, position
status - you understand? - then
you are beginning with corruption.
You might be poor,
be poor, who cares.
That's why it is
important for you
for all of you, to
find your own talent
and stick to it even
though it doesn't
bring you success,
fame, and all that
which is all nonsense anyhow
because we are all going to die.
You understand, old boy?
While you live, live, not with
all the rubbish that is going on.
S: Sir, why don't people
realise this?
K: Because they don't
think, they don't feel
they are thinking about
themselves all the time, their job
their administration,
their work.
You understand? They are not
interested in this. But if you are
S: How do you
stop being selfish?
K: How do you stop being
selfish? Don't be selfish.
Just listen.
Don't ever ask anybody, 'How?'
You understand?
Then they will tell you
how, then you are lost.
That is the biggest corruption.
S: You mean we must
find out for ourselves.
K: Find out, enquire, use
your brain, doubt, question.
Don't merely accept.
I am your teacher, suppose
I am your teacher.
I want to see that you
have a very good brain.
To have a good brain means
not to have conflict
in yourself or
with somebody else.
I know all this is too much.
S: I wanted to ask you, sir -
supposing you are not mistaken
and someone does
something to you?
K: If someone does
something harm to you
what will you do?
Hit him back?
S: It depends on the
depth of what he has done.
K: Yes, you have said it.
By Jove, you are quite
If he hurts you deeply
what will you do?
Have you asked what it
means to be hurt?
Go on. Think with me.
Think with me!
S: Sir, is it corruption
again to be hurt?
K: Just listen.
Suppose I hurt you very deeply;
suppose - I don't want to hurt you
suppose I want to
hurt you very deeply.
Now, you say, 'I am hurt'.
Now, what do you mean by that?
Use your brain.
Don't repeat.
S: Physically?
K: Yes, not only physically
but inside,
he hurts you.
He calls you a fool.
S: Sir, I think
K: Just listen carefully.
All of you listen carefully.
He calls you a fool,
and you get hurt.
Right? Have you found
out what gets hurt?
Careful, careful!
S: If you think you aren't a fool
and then someone comes along
K: Look, somebody calls you a fool
and somebody calls you a great man
they are both the same,
aren't they?
Do you understand
what I am saying?
Somebody calls me a fool, an idiot,
and I get hurt - suppose.
What gets hurt?
Careful, think it out, don't
reply quickly, think it out.
K: Think it out.
No, I won't listen.
I said think it out,
carefully think it out.
I am asking you, I call you an idiot
- I am not saying that
and you get hurt.
What do you mean,
you getting hurt?
What is you?
S: Your ego.
K: Think it out,
old girl, think it out.
S: It is me, my ego.
K: What are you?
S: I am one
K: Come over here,
old boy.
Sit in here.
Come on, don't waste time.
I know you, so go on.
S: Sir, what is hurt is me,
what I have build of myself.
K: That's it. What you have built
of yourself, which means what?
S: Sir, what has been achieved, what
I have achieved, what I have done.
K: What you have done,
what you have achieved.
Why are you all so
accustomed to achievement?
You all talk about achievement.
Like your father, your mother, your
grandmothers, they have achieved.
Right? They have become
successful, you mean.
S: No, sir, what they
have done to themselves.
K: Yes.
Say, for instance, I have been
all over some of the world. Right?
I have talked to various
thousands of people
I have been to the United Nations,
all kinds of things I have done.
Right? Which means I have built
an image, a picture about myself.
Picture about myself.
You come along and say, 'You are an
idiot' - and I get hurt - suppose.
What gets hurt?
S: My feelings.
K: My feelings, my image.
S: The image of yourself.
K: Yes, that's right.
The image of myself because I
have travelled, I am a great man
I have written books,
I have seen Mrs Gandhi.
You follow?
I have built an image about
myself; that image gets hurt.
Now, the next step,
listen carefully.
Can I live without image,
any image?
S: Can you, sir?
K: Can I? Yes.
I wouldn't otherwise
talk about it.
That is dishonesty to
talk about something
that you yourself are not living.
S: Sir, but you want to go
K: Wait, wait, listen to
what I am saying, old boy.
So, have you an image
at this age?
Of course, all of you
have images.
And those images get hurt.
And all through life
you will get hurt
as long as you
have those images.
S: Should you forget them, sir?
K: Leave them, don't have them.
Somebody - many people
have flattered me
and many people
have insulted me.
I have no image, I can't
get hurt, it doesn't matter.
You understand?
S: Yes, sir.
K: Be like that.
That is where corruption begins.
S: Sir, but how do you
get rid of your images?
K: How do you
get rid of images?
If you see they are dangerous you
will get rid of them immediately.
S: Sir, if you get rid of
images, what is left of you?
K: Nothing!
S: Then what are you?
K: Wait!
Listen to what I said.
Be nothing
and then you live.
You will understand later.
S: Sir, those might have images of
you but we shouldn't have images.
K: Yes. Let the others have
images, don't you have them.
S: Sir, sometimes
we don't have images
K: Not 'sometimes'.
Are you talking seriously,
or theoretically?
S: No, suppose a person can
K: Why do you suppose?
S: If a person doesn't have an image
isn't he likely to feel insecure?
K: Be insecure!
Know you are insecure.
Then find out
what is security.
But if you are always
seeking security
you don't know
whether you are insecure.
But first find out for yourself if
you are insecure, what it means
physically, inwardly,
and so on.
S: Whether you have an image
or not you are insecure.
K: Whether you have an image
or not, you are insecure.
I am asking you, have you
found out if you are insecure
or are you just talking?
S: Sir, I feel insecure
about some things.
K: Wait. Find out what it means,
what it means to be insecure.
Either you are insecure physically
- right? - or economically
or insecure in public
opinion - right?
or insecure
in money matters
or insecure in your
relationships. Find out.
S: And then what, sir?
K: When you learn where there is
insecurity then you are secure.
Get that, old boy.
S: Sir, do you have an image?
K: Listen to what I said.
You get it?
When you find out for yourself
what is insecure,
where you are insecure
with your family, with your
father, with your mother
with your wife or
husband, with god
You understand?
Find out, learn about it.
The moment you know and have learnt
a great deal about insecurity
then you are out of
it, then you are secure.
S: Sir, if you learn a great
deal about insecurity
you don't know
the full insecurity.
K: Oh, yes, you will.
Sir, if you begin rightly
- do you understand?
then what is right
is at the beginning.
This is too difficult.
S: Sir, are you saying, live with
insecurity to find out what it is?
K: You are insecure, not
live with insecurity.
You just now said,
'I am insecure'.
Live with it, find out.
Use your brain to find out.
Don't become mechanical.
S: Sir, to get rid of insecurity we
have to get rid of fear first, no?
K: Fear. Right?
Now, I am going to show you, you
have to learn, not from me, learn.
What is fear?
S: Fear is the thing
which we think about.
S: Something you
don't know about.
K: Wait, sir. You don't listen
to somebody else first
you are always ready
with your own questions.
He said - do you know
what he said?
You don't because
you didn't listen
because your own question was
more important; that is selfishness.
He said, 'Fear, how is one
to be free of fear?' Right?
You meant that, didn't you?
So, first listen to that question.
He said, 'What is fear, how
is one to be free of it?'
Now, do you know
you are afraid?
S: Yes, sir.
K: Yes, sir! Why?
S: I think it is because I think of
something which makes me feel afraid.
K: Now, just a minute you have
said something tremendous.
I don't know if you
are aware of it.
You have said
something very true.
S: Then if we don't
think of something
K: That's it.
You have learnt the first
thing, that thinking brings fear.
Right? Right?
S: Yes, sir.
K: So, you have to find out what is
thinking, not how to stop fear.
You understand?
You just now said
very carefully
that thinking brings
fear, which is true.
I might die tomorrow
and I am frightened.
I might lose my job,
I am frightened. Right?
So thinking brings fear.
Then what is thinking?
Now go step by step to find out.
What is thinking?
S: Sir, is it that to get rid of
fear we have to get rid of thinking?
K: No. I said never get rid of
anything because it will come back.
S: So you see that
fear is dangerous
K: Yes.
No, first listen carefully.
I said to you, fear, he
said, fear exists, comes
when you think
about something. Right?
Fear - I might die, fear - I might
lose my job, fear of my father
fear of my teachers.
So as long as you are thinking about
the future - right? - there is fear.
Right? Now you have to
find out what is thinking.
S: It might be selfishness.
K: Yes, wait, wait.
I am asking you something,
first listen, old boy.
I am not trying to stop you.
What is thinking?
Use your brain.
S: What the brain does?
K: No, use your brain to
find out what is thinking.
S: Imagination, sir.
K: Imagination, go on.
S: Sir, what you have seen you
record and you think about it.
K: That is good,
you are beginning.
You are recording, aren't you?
That is - Oh, lord!
I'll show you.
Our brain, what is inside
the skull, is recording.
You are recording mathematics.
You are recording geography,
history, you are recording.
A tape is recording.
This is recording, down there.
You understand?
I am talking, electrically it
is connected to that machine
and that is recording
on the tape.
Our brain acts
exactly like that.
It is recording.
Mathematics, history,
geography, your father
it has recorded your father.
Now, wait a minute.
What do you mean by recording?
Think it out, use your brain.
S: It recalls something
back again.
K: What do you mean recording?
S: Absorbs.
K: Isn't it necessary to record?
S: Yes.
K: Why?
S: Sir, to link the
past with the future.
K: No, isn't it
necessary to record?
I hope the older boys are
paying attention to all this
because it is their life.
So, recording is necessary when you
write a letter, when you drive a car.
Right? When you have to pass
an exam - unfortunately
when you record that you have a
father in some place, and a mother.
All that is recording,
that is necessary.
Now, there is also
another recording.
I get hurt - you get it?
S: Yes, sir.
K: There are two kinds of recording
- the recording of driving a car
writing a letter, becoming
IAS, becoming an engineer.
Listen carefully, old boy,
you are following?
And there is also another
recording - me first, I am selfish
I want this,
I want success.
So, these two are
recording all the time.
Which is recording is memory,
isn't it?
Memory of your father,
memory of your mathematics.
Right? So recording means
memory, which is repeating.
Do you see this?
When you learn mathematics you
are recording, you are repeating
memorising like that tape.
So, you become mechanical.
Like that tape is mechanical,
it repeats, repeats, repeats
I am a Brahmin,
I am a Brahmin
I am a Hindu,
I am a Hindu
I am against Communist,
Communist. Right?
And so on. Our brains then become
conditioned, limited, small.
So thinking is part of memory.
You can't have memory if you
haven't met your father
if you haven't seen
your father, your mother.
So, you have seen the
father and your mother
and that is stored in the brain as
memory, and also that is knowledge
and knowledge is based on
experience - of course.
S: I am memorising.
K: You are memory.
You understand?
You are memory, the whole
of your being is memory.
Memory that you are atman
memory you have got a soul,
memory there is light inside you
memory that there is god.
It is all still memory.
You listen carefully, find out if it
is true what the speaker is saying
or it is a lie.
You understand?
Find out.
You are memory, without
memory you are nothing.
Memory of your name,
memory of your family
memory of mathematics,
memory of going up that hill
memory of your friend.
So you are memory.
Memory is something
dead, gone.
S: Then how are we alive?
K: Because the organ, you have
food, you have air, water.
S: Then how can we
K: Find out, sir,
that is the great point.
You understand?
Find out what is truth.
Memory is not truth.
S: Sir, what do
you mean by truth?
K: You can't describe it.
What is the flower?
What is that flower?
Look at it.
You never ask when you are looking
at that flower, what is it
how did it come,
the beauty of it.
Please learn something.
Beauty is truth.
You understand?
Beauty is truth.
The beauty of a good life
- good life, not successful life
Now, sirs, it is ten to eleven,
will you sit quietly for a minute?
Sit quietly.
All right, sirs,
thank you.