Jeff Katz / Twitalyzer ROI of Social Media Transcript

Stev en Grov es Hello everyone, this is Steve Groves with the SocialMarketingConversations.com and stevengroves.com with Guy Powell of Marketing-Calculators.com and today we're getting together for another podcast and the ROI of social media series appearing at SocialMarketingConversations.com and StevenGroves.com. Hey, Guy, how are you today? Guy Fantastic, Stephen and it's great to bring the series and we've got a great Powe call coming up here with Jeff Katz with Twitalyzer. Some very interesting ll tools that if you are not familiar with, it's a great thing to understand and learn about. SG Yeah, I'm really looking forward to it. The Twitalyzer tool is something that Guy showed me the other day, and it's really exciting to have him on the phone. Well, let's introduce him in here. Today we have with us Jeff Katz with Twitalyzer. Jeff has over seventeen years combining business and technology insight and the various product development, strategic consulting and data analysis roles. Jeff's been an independent consultant since 2006 when he worked very closely with his clients to ensure their online business initiatives became a reality via comprehensive digital strategies. Prior to joining Twitalyzer, Jeff was a product manager at Web Trends in Portland, Oregon. Welcome to the call, Jeff. Jeff Katz SWG JK Thank you guys. Thank you for having me. Well, we're real excited about it and before we get started can you talk just a little bit about what Twitalyzer is and what's your role there? Sure! Well, Twitalyzer is an analytical and reporting platform built for short messaging media, which, you know Twitter today is a de facto player in the space. We've been pretty much around for a year or so now and this weekend we had an upgrade in our primary platform about a month or so ago and my role is really kind of product strategy and business development with myself and Eric Peterson, who founded Twitalyzer. Okay, and where do you see Twitalyzer going? What's the market for Twitalyzer? How do you see people using it most effectively?

SWG JK

Well, with the new release of 2.0, we see more and more organizations shifting away from people who, like a lot of other analytic tools over the past year were more focused on their individual scores and how they're doing on Twitter, is now what we're seeing is we're seeing companies outside of Fortune 500 companies who really small non-profits and small Mom and Pop ROI of Social Media Series Page 1 of 8 Posted April 23, 2010
Steven Groves / SocialMarketingConversations.com Guy Powell / DemandROMI.com Recorded January 19, 2010

Jeff Katz / Twitalyzer ROI of Social Media Transcript
shops on Twitter, to understand their impact on Twitter and to better improves it. So if they want to see how they brand or how their organization is structured and whose communicating with them and how to effectively respond and whether it be a customer service or actually a sales opportunity or everything in between. We really see it going from an individual usage to companies really trying to understand the metric and benchmark around thos to improve their Twitter as a channel. GP JK What do you see as the key successes that you've had with some of the companies that are using it? Well I think what we're seeing now is the market is maturing, I'm sure you two are aware of is companies nowadays they spent the last year or two on Twitter even on Facebook and other platforms getting their word out and trying to build up mine share and certain numbers as far as followers and sometimes they Tweet. Now what they're trying to do, and we see this with some of our customers that we're talking to, is how do we measure that? Our board wants to know, someone into web analytics, how many pay-per or clickers they're getting, they now want to see how I'm engaging my client. Am I increasing certain minor scores? Am I able to look at certain segments of Twitter population and react to those and engage with them? I think that's what we're seeing almost across the board with our install base right now. It's very exciting for us because we do come from a digital management space with web analytics and we're seeing what we saw five, six years ago when analytics started to take place in social media measurement. GP Yeah and it's certainly looks that way and you know, if I look at your dashboard and got four or five things across the top in terms of impact and engagement and generosity, velocity and clout. And do you see there are specific types of companies? Or vertical companies that will benefit from this more than others? You think it's more of a general platform across the board? It's definitely more of the latter. We have spent a lot of time and talking to various companies when we were in BETA over the winter before the New Year's. We had some very significant companies test and we tweeted about them. We had Starbucks and Microsoft and IBM and Intel and some small businesses that were friends that we knew personally that we could engage with. We went across the board, what we're trying to be is and this latest release ROI of Social Media Series
Steven Groves / SocialMarketingConversations.com Guy Powell / DemandROMI.com

JK

Page 2 of 8

Posted April 23, 2010
Recorded January 19, 2010

Jeff Katz / Twitalyzer ROI of Social Media Transcript
of our product is we essentially want to be the de facto analytical tool out there, almost kin to Google Analytical Web Trend. There is certainly some prodder social monitoring tools out there that speak to a larger enterprise trying to monitor the whole social media platforms. But we're focused specifically on Twitter. You know when other social media platforms come up or along or become more of a significant player, but certainly what we're seeing is very much across the board. SG Yeah, so I'm sitting here looking at the dashboard as well and really enjoying the level of data and information that seems to be coming from the tool and the stuff that you're providing. How did you come up with this algorithm that you have? What was the genesis of all this? JK To answer your question, the genesis was little over a year ago, it was actually my business partner Eric Peterson who was, myself and a few other people, who were several months before that goaded him to get onto Twitter. He runs a global web analytics consulting firm and we were telling him, you know you really need to get the word out. You have this website, this blog, he does lots of speaking engagements across the world and he wasn't on Twitter. He finally caved in as you would say and did it and after a little while he was trying to figure out whether there's a worthwhile kind of business in a tweet in a business or even for personal reasons. He looked at some of the productive tools that were out there at the time just a little over a year ago and he looked at them and they gave him all of these squares that to him didn't reflect how he uses Twitter. I mean, he would always say and continue to say, to me you know, “He's just not a good Twitter-er, I mean to me he's just always out there.” and the scores he would get, these very high scores that weren't reflective of how he was using the tools. So like the good data geek that he is he stayed up for about a month or so, you know, the hours of 8 to 2 am and building and implementing what he called the “Twitter Influence Calculator” where he had myself and a bunch of other people in the web measurement space kind of take a bang at it and get feedback and what came out of that, what was born out of that, was Twitalyzer. It was still kind of side project for a couple more months and then what happened, I think last March at a tech show. . . I think it was AdTech down in San Francisco, there was an off-cuff remark by Guy Kawasaki who said, “If you're serious about measuring Twitter, you should use Twitalyzer” and it actually crashed the servers and literally, we have the spikes for it and that ROI of Social Media Series
Steven Groves / SocialMarketingConversations.com Guy Powell / DemandROMI.com

Page 3 of 8

Posted April 23, 2010
Recorded January 19, 2010

Jeff Katz / Twitalyzer ROI of Social Media Transcript
was kind of the “A-Ha!” moment you know, there's something more to this than just a side project. It was then that Eric asked me to join him to help him with some real product management background and really productize the product and take it forward realizing that Twitter is here to stay, it's viable platform for companies and individuals. They're using it all over the world and it needs to be measured so that's kind of the history of how Twitalyzer came to be. GP How do you see how people are using it. . . well, I guess I mean by that individuals as opposed to companies using it? You see much difference there? And how are they using it from their Twitter influence, I guess. Well, how we see individuals using it is certainly different than how a company would use it. What we're seeing from the individuals is they're more focused on their user profiles than benchmarking reports. They just really want someone to get a glance at a trending view, how they're doing over a certain amount of time or within the last days look. They're not necessarily taking any action on it but they are using it for the individual consultants say and it's just a practice and they just want to see it they have anymore. . . you know, whose tagging us, the tagging feature, whose talking about us potentially. What we see with organizations, whether it's a large company or a small non-profit here in Portland, is that they're starting to use more of this dashboard authenticating features. You know, setting goals for certain metrics but they want to measure themselves against goals that they set for their organization. To be able to understand whose talking about them negatively or positively from a sentiment analysis point of view. So the organizations are really starting to use it as you would expect an organization to look at data, very much from a benchmarking perspective and continue to improve their views on Twitter and optimize whether it's content or how they engage on Twitter itself. GP Right and actually that goal-setting feature I really liked it. It was kind of interesting to be able to say, 'Okay, here are the goals that we think we want to shoot for' and then you can actually develop an action plan, monitor against what you're doing, then update the goals or how you're getting there. It provides that instantaneous feedback you have as a business or even an individual wants to drive a certain level of activity on there. Looking at it though at this space, kind of a 50,000 foot level, and looking at tools in general and looking at measuring tools and I don't know exactly how you categorize this, but where do you see things like this going in the future? Do you see them hooking into and connecting with other tools and social ROI of Social Media Series
Steven Groves / SocialMarketingConversations.com Guy Powell / DemandROMI.com

JK

Page 4 of 8

Posted April 23, 2010
Recorded January 19, 2010

Jeff Katz / Twitalyzer ROI of Social Media Transcript
media? So where do you see the future for this? JK Yeah, to the first part, obviously for Twitalyzer and probably for other tools as well, I think we're really at the starting line as far as what the platform can do. Obviously we're very much tied to Twitter's API right now and where I see Twitalyzer going is we actually built our own series of API's and we are talking to various other tool sets out there to integrate our data into theirs. That’s where we kind of see our next natural phase, not the functionality, the product itself but we have companies that want to integrate either completely white-labeled and people don't even know its Twitalyzer data, or a ‘powered by’ or a combination of both. So, potentially dealing with some of those social media platforms. We do have one right now with Google Analytics and we hope to extend that to the other analytic vendors since the state that both Eric and I come from and too us it’s a natural fit, where in keeping with social media and site analytics collide and so yeah, that's where we see ourselves going in the. . . at least in the next 6 to 12 months. Functionality aside. GP JK GP Right, right. Well, functionality is kind of a never ending battle with things like that. Exactly. The old feature creep comes in but certainly the API is an interesting way to help incorporate this high value into their operations. The other thing that's kind of fascinating with these tools and I kind of don't know what you see happening over the next. . . you know I was going to say a year but that's a millennium in the Twitter space, but how do you see things like sentiment and semantic analysis, is that going to be coming into the equation anytime, you think? You know that's a great question. We built a sentiment analysis tool and we intentionally left it as a manual process that we would store certain positive and negative words into a library and then individuals can copy and then extend it. You know we, Eric and I go back and forth about it, how to automate this completely or a variation and there's still a lot of debate happening even this week with a lot of Radian6’s and a lot of SM2's of the world. There's a lot of buzz going back and forth between those type of tools and what's proper, automated or manual? Because manual as it says is time consuming and you have resources dealing with it and it's automated analysis is preferable from a resource constraint but it's flawed in many ways especially when you get to the different languages. You know and that's right and we played with Radian6 and SM2's and it's really interesting to see the tonality and sentimentality, but unfortunately they've been very inaccurate when you use them automatedly and so it Page 5 of 8 Posted April 23, 2010
Recorded January 19, 2010

JK

GP

ROI of Social Media Series
Steven Groves / SocialMarketingConversations.com Guy Powell / DemandROMI.com

Jeff Katz / Twitalyzer ROI of Social Media Transcript
seems like if you really want to get somewhere you have to have a manual process in there. JK Exactly. And you know we talked about this and it's obviously not revolutionary but it's an idea potentially. You know crowd sourcing now, especially when you get to multiple languages. You know Mebo.com did a great job of crowd-sourcing when they went to multilingual a couple of years ago. Great model for that. I don't know how well it exstends. . . the only issue with that is. You know even in English you obviously have variations in English but then you have vertical words that are different. Even in American words that are different. It's something that's a new feature for us, where we're really monitoring right now and see how people are using it. And we're getting a lot. . . it's probably the one year after year that we get a lot of feedback from users offering ideas and suggestions. I'd say more than the compliments on the new product, we get a lot of questions or ideas on functionality. So I think we're going to probably put a lot more resources into that. How it shakes out, our next release. Couldn't even tell you right now. GP Yeah and you know that area of sentiment is a real area of concern and we do acknowledge it and certainly we've used both Radian6 and Alterian on the SM2 product. They admitted that it's really more of an art than a science to get the sentiment and tone out of it. Then the very best you're going to get at this point is really a trend by not trying to deal with the entire data just pieces of it. Yeah, that's a good point because one of the things when you talk about the process and argument, it's very much just as much an art as it is a science and again what I spoke about earlier with the social media monitoring is where web analytics was a few years ago. It's very similar because even Eric and Abinash, from Google where you talk about web analytics, it's not just the technology it's the people and how you use it. So, what we're seeing is people looking for these trends or taking words and tweet in the context of what the discussion is so. . . we don't expect this to be an automated process and organizations will take the data out of Twitalyzer and really look for the nuggets and a person will be in charge of that to look for trends and potentially read. Depending on what type of organization and how they use Twitter it may be for marketing purposes or the typical customer support services. To your point around whatever our biggest obstacle is. It's the ever-changing market right now, especially with Twitter and their API's and we're expecting good things when they open up the fire hose. The API's will certainly allow us to do a lot more than we can do right now and then everybody. . . it will ROI of Social Media Series
Steven Groves / SocialMarketingConversations.com Guy Powell / DemandROMI.com

JK

Page 6 of 8

Posted April 23, 2010
Recorded January 19, 2010

Jeff Katz / Twitalyzer ROI of Social Media Transcript
be apps on top of Twitter. Pretty much the same, copy and paste. That's really our biggest concern right now is having a stable data set that we can ping all the time. There's very few down times, there's no missing data that’s returned and that's what we. . . you know our current obstacle is people don't trust our data even if it's us reflecting when we get back from the API's and they're not going to use our system or anybody else's. They're just going to. . . they could just possibly throw up their hands. SG No, they really would and that's a great point. You know, we're all dealing with this question from a perspective of really wanting to uncover the answers and, we are most about looking for people who have approached different pieces of it so that as we move forward with the book, “The ROI Social Media Book” we're able to bring many different perspectives to it so that the readers can really get a sense of: A.) How complex this question is and B.) get a sense of at least a framework of dealing with the question. I don't think there's going to be one solid answer to it. I totally agree. We're beginning to wrap up and again, Jeff, I want to thank you so much for the time you've given us today. Guy, as we wrap up here, did you have anything you wanted to ask Jeff? GP No, I guess just, thank you very much Jeff and you know it's fascinating and I think you're term for the Twitter API and in the opening up and the fire hose of data, it's just got to be absolutely immense and you know it's going to be where Twitter has all of its servers is going to be this enormous fire hose of electronics cable coming in and others like you and can get some data out of this so they can do some real-time things out of this. What's going on with Twitter. It'll be a fascinating time, that's for sure. It certainly will be. We're giddy with anticipation. Absolutely. Jeff, if anybody wanted to know more about Twitalyzer or wanted to work with you guys on an API connection or whatever, how would they get hold of you? Sure. So, the site is Twitalyzer.com. Email address is jeff@twitalyzer.com or I on Twitter as @Katzpdx Okay, anything you want to share with our listeners before we wrap up here? No, I just want to thank you too for inviting me to this caucus and I'm looking forward to seeing and hearing this one when the book comes out soon. Absolutely and we're certainly excited to have you share that information with your followers, your friends on social media and all the rest. Page 7 of 8 Posted April 23, 2010
Recorded January 19, 2010

JK SG

JK SG

JK SG JK GP

ROI of Social Media Series
Steven Groves / SocialMarketingConversations.com Guy Powell / DemandROMI.com

Jeff Katz / Twitalyzer ROI of Social Media Transcript
We're really grateful for the time you've taken with us today. JK Thank you very much.

About the Podcast and Credit For Where Credit is Due – This transcript was developed from a live interview on January 19, 2010 between Jeff Katz, Guy Powell and Steven Groves on FreeConferenceCall.com. The podcast interview was downloaded and processes in Audacity, which is available from SourceForge.com, and with ‘4toFloor.wav’ music loop from member ‘Rooks’ and posted at SoundSnap.com. The initial transcript was provided courtesy of Social Marketing Conversations, and the introduction voice is Ms. Cynthia Propst.

ROI of Social Media Series
Steven Groves / SocialMarketingConversations.com Guy Powell / DemandROMI.com

Page 8 of 8

Posted April 23, 2010
Recorded January 19, 2010

Sign up to vote on this title
UsefulNot useful