PRECIOUS PLASTICS

CHARACTERISTICS OF THE MOTORS FOR THE MACHINES

V2016.07.27

UPDATE (2016.10.17)
After several attempts we concluded that a monophasic motor isn’t
powerful enough for the shredder. (It is good enough for the extruder
though). So the parameters specified here (our motor is single phase
230V, 1.1KW = 1.5HP, 70 Nm) ARE NOT ENOUGH! For the shredder
get a Triphasic motor with more than 2 or 3 HP.
The monophase motor does shred, but it clogs often which requires a
circuit to switch directions and to unstuck it very often, like every 2-3
bottles.

UPDATE (2016.07.27)
@robksawyer from the precious Plastics Forum has created a
Precious Plastic Wiki​ that is more suited for the community than this
Google Docs.
The information of this document is now hosted on the ​Definitive
Guide on Motor in the wiki​ - go and improve upon that!

OLDER INFO - Kept just for reference

This document aims at helping those that want to build the ​Precious Plastics machines
understand a bit more about the motors they need. The spec sheets are very scant and when
you first find yourself looking at the motors in a scrapyard or online you really don’t know how to
judge all the numbers in the plaque of the motor. Often they use different units which, unless
you know how they relate to each other, you can’t be sure if you are making the right choice.
This document is here to give you a​ reference cheat-sheet on the properties of a motors​ you
want to look for.

This is a condensed version of many informations that can be found in several posts in the
Precious Plastic Forums that deal with Motors:
● (Almost) Definitive guide on Motors (WIP)​ ​(<< let’s keep the discussion in this post and the clean
summary in this doc)
● Motors
 ● Shredder Motor
● Realistic Cost Shredder
● All posts that name “motor”

1 - MOTOR for the SHREDDER

The​ Precious plastic Shredder​ requires a ​“​slow but powerful​”​ motor, these are approximate
properties that we’ve calculated or found in the spec sheet
Notes :
● We are aiming at using a monophase motor​ so that you can plug it into any normal
220-230 V socket, but you must be aware that ​Dave uses a triphase motor​ in his video,
which requires more Voltage, allows more power,​ and ​implies​ that you can plug it
into only ​industrial sockets​, not the ones you commonly find in households. This
cheatsheet is for a monophase motor! Read the ​note on this difference​.
● We have NOT built our machine with a monophasic motor yet (as of 2016.05.13), so all
this is theoretical, until we actually can make it
● Even more important than the motor is the gearbox that reduces the speed and defines
the Torque (​read the note about it​)
● all these units are ​rough approximations​ used only to give you an understanding
range, you can safely get something slightly above or below these numbers.
● Use the calculators and converters further down to check or change these parameters

READ THE UPDATE AT THE TOP: ​(our motor is single phase 230V, 1.1KW =
1.5HP, 70 Nm) AND IT’S NOT ENOUGH for the shredder ​(it is enough for
the extruder). For the shredder look for a triphasic motor (≈380V, 2-3 HP or
more)

property Desired Other related Notes

Unit and value units

RPM = Revolutions Per ± 70 RPM ≈1.16 Hz As suggested by Dave Hakkens

Minute

Power ≈ 1.5 Kw ≈ 2 HP - Some say that to grind you need a minimum of 5 or 6

But probably ​from Horse Power Hp, but that implies that you need a triphase motor of
735 W up (or CV) at least 400 V.
Even 500 W it’s - ​MAYBE For the extruder​ you can probably use a
fine (read Torque less powerful motor (ie ½ Hp= 372W = 0.372Kw)
notes)

Torque ≈270 Nm ≈27.53 Kgm This is the max Torque you can expect from a 2Kw
(theoretical max) Or and 70 rpm motor, as calculated by the formula:
≈ 2389.7 lb-in Torque (Nm) = Power (Watts) / (RPM * 0.105)
 If the speed of the motor is right (±70 Rpm), then
the more Torque (or power) it has, the better.

Torque ≈100 Nm ≈ 10.12 Kgm @andyn​ on the Precious Plastics forum ​suggested that
(hypothetically ≈ 20-60 Nm Or he: ”estimate the shredder only needs 50-100Nm to
sufficient) might be enough ≈ 885 lb-in chew through most things”​. Took some measurements
and ​said​ that “To shred bottle tops takes a maximum
(60 Nm =) 20Nm, to shred the thickest plastic I could find (front
≈ 6.1 Kgm panel of a domestic appliance) took 60Nm”
Or Which, by applying the previous Torque formula, it
≈ 531 lb-in implies that ≈ ½ Kw (or ≈500 W) Motor is more than
enough:
​a 735W Motor can be enough:
Power (Watts) = Torque (Nm) * RPM * 0.105
W = 100 Nm * 70 Rpm * 0.105 = 735 Watts
W = 60 Nm * 70 rpm * 0.105 = 441 W

Volts 220-230 V Warning: as stated before we are aiming to find a

monophasic motor​ to use in all households - if you
find higher V they will be triphasic and be pluggable
only in industrial compounds with the special plugs (but
read the ​note about monophasic or thriphasic​)

Amperes ≈ 6.81 A (but don’t Don’t use the amps on a motor to pick one out.
look for this Instead, use the motor power, speed, and torque.
number, you won’t The amperes listed on a motor nameplate (Full Load
find it, always less) Amps, or FLA) tell you what the maximum current the
motor will use in a fully loaded condition. Use this
number to design your electrical system, circuit
breakers and fuses, etc.

Gearbox ≈ 1:20 ratio = (input rpm) / (output rpm)

Reducer Ratio (i) (if input is 1400 example
rpm to convert to (input 1400 rpm) / (output 70 rpm) = 20/1
70 rpm)

Gearbox 1 or 1.2 is enough Read the note on gearboxes

Service Factor (s)

Gearbox I (1 in Roman Read the note on gearboxes

Service Class Numerals)

CALCULATORS & CONVERTERS

● RPM to Hertz
○ 60 Rpm = 1 Hz
● Kw to Hp (or CV)
○ 1 Hp = 0.7457 Kw
○ 2 hp ≈ 1.5 Kw
 ○ 2.7 hp ≈ 2 Kw
○ HP to CV​ is roughly 1:1
● Torque Units Converter​ (metric <-> imperial)
○ 10 Nm ≈ 1 Kgm ≈ 88.5074 lb-in
○ Torque Nm to Hp convertion
(((rpm x Nm)/(9.5488 x 745.7))*1000)/1000
● Torque (Nm) = Power (Watts) / (RMP * 0.105)
● Ampere Calculator
○ Ampere = Watt/Volt
○ 1 A = 1W / 1V
● Gear Reduction Calculators
○ Reduction Ratio = (input rpm / output rpm)
20:1 = (input 1400 rpm) / (output 70 rpm)
○ Online Gear Generator​ (super cool)
○ How to Buy the Right Gear Motor for the Right Job​ (awesome explanation)
○ Pulley Calculator
○ Gearbox Calculators
● Calculating the capacitor for single phase motor
○ Instructions & theory

COMMON QUESTIONS / DOUBTS

What are the most important parameters to look for?

@Andyn​: “... ​most important is the torque, then the speed, less than 70rpm​ is probably fine, it
will just go slower, too fast and material will get thrown out of the shredder.
The torque x the speed ( x 0.105) tells you the power of the motor you need to look for”

Triphase or Monophase Motors?

Monophase motors can run on 220 V plugs (the ones you use every day), and by consequence
use a 2 pole plug (in some places will be 3)
while Triphase motors usually require or can stand more Voltage, which means that they can be
more powerful, but it also implies that you must plug them only in industrial complexes that have
the ​special industrial multiphase plugs
 ● How do you recognize them?
● Look at the plugs: if there is a big plug like the one above it’s a triphase
● Look at the Voltages: if it has a voltage above 230 it is probably triphase
● Look at the cables: (if the cable is cut and there is no plug) If there are 3 wires,
it’s single-phase. If there are 4 wires, it’s 3-phase.

Can We convert a Triphase to a Monophase motor?

Yes. but there is some wiring to do and it’s better if you have some expert help you do it.
Consider that the power will be decreate roughly -30% over the one that appears on the motor
label
You will also need one or two capacitors (a starter and a running capacitor) that should be at the
right amount of µF (micro Farad) to your motor. If you are planning to use the motor for very
short periods of times you can also only add the starting capacitor (C2 in the diagram) and avoid
having to install the running capacitor (C1 in the diagram)
Read this article ​http://www.electricneutron.com/electric-motor/single-phase-capacitor-sizing/

This is more or less how you will have to wire them (​source​)
explanations to the wiring diagram
c​1​ operating capacitor, c​2​ starting capacitor
Frequently it is necessary to connect three-phase not ors to single-phase mains. In this connection, the following
disadvantages must be taken into account. The rated output (see rating plate) will be reduced to 80 % to 65 %.
The rated torque will be reduced to 30 ​%.
The output or power can be calculated according to the following equation:

C = capacity of the capacitor in μF

P = power in kW
U = voltage in V
f = frequency in Hertz
The following approximate values can be assumed when connecting to single-phase alternating current of 220 V:
Power (kW) Capacity of the Capacitor

0.10 7

1.00 50

2.00 100
 I

● Some Useful and clear pages (in Spanish)

○ Como conectar un motor trifásico a 400V a 230 monofásico y no morir en el
intento​ (very clear diagrams and capacitor calculator)
○ Calcular el capacitor de un motor monofasico
You tube videos:
● How to do it: ​run a 3 phase motor on single phase supply (part 1)
● How to do it: ​run a 3 phase motor on single phase supply (part 2)

Can’t we use a Washing Machine’s motor to do the job?

The idea is great, cheap motors everywhere, but the problems are that:
● Washing machines are too fast and don’t come with a reducer on board
● You can’t reduce the speed by reducing the current (ie with a dimmer or PWM)
especially because at low speeds (the 70rpm you are trying to get) it doesn’t quite work
○ Video​ - This guy built a circuit which you can see and copy but he says that at
low rpm the engine hiccups (the whole video is very informative)
● Washing Machines use ​VFD Inverters (A Variable-Frequency drive)​ to control the speed,
can´t we use those?
○ The same guy from the previous video on how to reuse washing machines
explains ​why it’s not possible to reuse the control boards in washing machines
■ They are too complex
■ There is too much variability between each model
○ You can certainly buy a VFD if you find a cheap one, unfortunately, the ones I’ve
found cost as much as a new motor with the reducer

Can we build our own gear Reducer?

Buying only the gearbox is a better solution (​read about how to choose one​). Having said that,
producing it might be a possibility, after all if you have to lasercut the parts of the shredder, you
could lasercut the parts for the gearbox (even though real gearboxes have complex elicoidal
shapes that can’t be lasercut).
The only problem is that there isn’t a design file yet, and you would have to customize the sizes
and proportions of the gears to the output of your own motor (the gears would be different if
your motor outputs 1400 rpm or 1500 rpm).
Any mechanical engineer want to tackle this?​ Some tools here to get you started:
● Online Gear generator​ - supercool
○ Example: ​these parameters convert a 1400 rpm to 70 rpm
○ The current code has a limitation to 360 rpm max, but if you open the console
(View > Developer > Javascript Console in Chrome) and paste this function:
function getRPMfix() { return fixInput( Number( $("#RPM").val() ), setRPM, RPM, -1400,
1400 ); }
It will allow you to input 1400 RPM
● There is also a simpler version you can build with pulleys that someone posted in the
precious plastics forums
○ Check ​this video
○ check this ​Pulley Calculator
● Video on the ​inside of a Gearbox
● Another ​video on a complex planetary gear box
● Understanding Motor and Gearbox Design instructable
● There is proof that you can build something very compact - look at this ​amazing plastic
gear puzzle - reduction ratio 1:11 million
● Rare image of how a gearbox looks inside

How Do (Motoreducer) GearBoxes Work and how to choose one?

Gearboxes are the most important part in the whole process, even more so than motors.
Their properties determine the output speed (rpm) and, more importantly, the final Torque (Nm)
depends (almost? exclusively?) on the characteristics of the gearbox and independently of the
motor you couple it with.
● Service Factor (s):​ The most important characteristic of a gearbox is the ​“service
factor”​, a multiplier number (like 0.8, 1.2, 1.9 or other decimal number) that the
manufacturer provides and describes in the datasheet that indicates the “​permissible
horsepower loading which may be carried under the conditions specified​”. The easy
explanation is that it gives an indication of how much you can actually use it (hours per
day) before it wears or heats: lower numbers ​(≈1 - 1.2) are good if you’ll use it
sporadically​, like 1h per day or less, which is very likely the case for the
PreciousPlastics machines. Higher Service Factors are for heavy duty, if you want to
shred continuously. Anyways ​never go below a service factor below 0.8 and a safe
bet is a minimum of 1;
● Service Class​: The lower end ​Class service 1​ (in Roman numerals I) is more than
enough.
More detailed articles:
● How to Size and Select a Gearbox: A Motion Engineer’s Guide
● Select speed reducers to perform reliably
● How To select a SpeedReducer​ (pdf)

Where can I find the motors / what are they usually used for?
The motors that are “slow and powerful” are normally used in machines that have a heavy duty,
that need to crush or pull heavy stuff, or that have regulators to reduce their speed and have a
greater control. This is a partial list of the kinds of machines you might look for in a scrapyard:
● Some Industrial machines (but beware they are very likely triphase and look for the
gearing reducing box that must be attached to the motor… very few actually have the
reducing box)
● Meat / bone crushers
● Olives or oil mills
● winch and hoist motors (used to pull up stuff from cars or industrial compounds) (probably
not because winches usually have high rpm because they use pulleys - Some might have
the right output RPM, but check twice)
● Other shredders
● Some types of gates (doors that slide not those that open sideways like a door)
● elevators
Winch and hoist
How to read the Nameplates
Here after find a couple of screenshots captured from the ​Bonfiglioli Motor Catalogue​ that will
help you understand better some of the codes in the nameplate. Please Bear in mind that
different manufacturers, or older motors, might have different types of lables and also with other
units (if you are looking at them in the US)
MANUFACTURERS
Many Motor manufacturers are either Italian or German (at least in Europe). Here are a few of
the main brands and some references to their products. You might not need this if you are
looking at motors in the scrapyard or online, but you might still find useful to understand the
different types of motors (coaxial vs orthogonal axis) and other characteristics:
● Bonfiglioli
○ Helical bevel gearmotors
○ Mechanical variable speed motors
● Ghirri
○ Very useful ​multilanguage summary of properties
● Nord Drivesystems
● Rossi Gearmotors

CREDITS
Thanks to all those who contributed to this document and to the precious plastic project
Here are just a few:
Dave Hakkens - Dustin Weir - Beltran Berrocal - ​enviro​, ​paulfreed​, ​andyn​,
… come put your name here