SKYLAB

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Houston,

Skylab III Change Johnson Space Center September 13, 1973 5:01 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

PARTICIPANTS: _Nell E. Hutchinson, Dr. Royce Hawkins, Guy Jackson, PAO Flight Deputy Director Director

of

Medical

Operations

PC-88

SL III TIME: 9/13/73 f

PC-88A/1 17:01 CDT

PAO Okay. We're ready to start the change of shift briefing and we have Nell Hutchinson, off-going Flight Director and Dr. Royce Hawkins, Deputy Director of Medical Operations. First we'll have a statement by Neil and then a statement by Dr. Hawkins, and then take your questions and answers. HUTCHINSON Okay. This was my first day back on after about three weeks on the swinging graveyards. It's nice to be back working regular hours again, more or less. Got three of four little ditties we probably ought to talk about. One, as you know, we have been running battery capacity tests on the ATM batteries here over the last, well, it's been going on a couple of weeks now. The last one we ran was yesterday, well, really yesterday afternoon and at the conclusion of that test we were running it on CBRM 5. We had a problem with CBRM 5 and it - we're not sure exactly where the problem is, but we have a phenomenon in the battery. It either looks llke a broken diode - a broken down diode, which allows electrical current to flow the wrong direction or a short across the charger. In any case, we no longer have automatic charge capability over CBRM 5, Now, that's really not the right way to put it. CBRM 5, we are not using it any longer. We have taken it off the line for a couple of reasons. One is that we have to baby sit it to use it, probably the primary reason. Another is that the battery, when it does charge is charging at considerably higher charge current than is normally done and we'd as soon not cycle the battery through that kind of a charging current on a regular basis unless we have too. As far as the battery capacity tests themselves go they're still tending to indicate that the ATM batteries are degrading in a little faster fashion than we would have hoped they would. A general number that you can put in your mind to remember is about an amp hour a month per battery. And I guess - and you all know these batteries started out at 20 and there's been a lot of discussion recently about the fact that we may have lifted off with - somewhere in the area of 15 or so. And they're showing up around Ii at the moment, which is sort of consistant. And those are all round numbers. Anyway, I suspect we have - we won't be doing any more battery testing for awhile here. We may do a couple more to get another data point prior to mission end based on what happened to CBRM 5, and by the way we have no reason to suspect that the testing we were doing on CBRM 5 is connected, directly connected with the problem we had with it. Although you always tend to wonder when you're cyclin s equipment on and off and something goes wrong with it, whether your cycling

SL III TIME: 9/13/73 r-

PC-88A/2 17:01 CDT

had anything to do with it. Anyway that's about where we stand on the batteries, We've ceased testing. We won't be doing any for awhile here. And what that all adds up to_ is by the time we get to the end of Skylab IV, we're going to have to be very frugal in our EREP passes, because if you add the numbers up, that turns out that we're down in the six or seven amp hour range on the ATM batteries 5y the time we get toward the end of Skylab IV. And with that kind of capability we won't be doing the kind of EREPs we're doing now, back-to-back hundred degree pass type operation. However, it's not I really think it's too early yet to be absolutely certain that they're continue to degrade, in fact, I know it's too early to come to that conclusion and secondly even if they are it will certainly cause us to have to pay more attention to the way we plan EREP passes, but I don't think it's going to compromise EREPs significantly in Skylab IV. We certainly are going to continue to watch it, however. I guess Dr. Hawkins is going to tell you about the e_tension, so I won't mention that. I might let him talk about this some too, but I'ii say - I'll at least tell you how we're going to do it. The circadian shift to conclude the mission has been finalized. We're going to do it in two steps. The first one starts on mission day 51, and basically mission day 51 END OF TAPE

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SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88B/1 17:01 CDT

HUTCHINSON We're going to do it in two steps. The first one starts on mission day 51. And, basically, mission day 51 will be a 14-hour crew work day. We'll go to bed two hours early and get up two hours early on day 52. Then we'll stay on that for one day. And then on day 53, we will shorten that day - work day by two hours and get up two hours early. And at the end of day 54, what that basically does, we've swapped everybody's schedule with the ground and the flight crew back four hours. And that will be the schedule that we will continue with all the way to splash. That's the same wake-up schedule on retrofire day. Now, yon recall, on Skylab-ll, we went the other direction. We did a couple of 2-hour shifts as we approached retrofire. And then on the last day, we slept, we went to bed early, got up early and picked up 5 hours right there at the very end, or six hours, I don't remember. Six hours. Anyway, the whole shift was about i0 hours in the opposite direction on Skylab-ll. So this looks like it's going to work out a lot cleaner and everybody'll They'll get eight hours sleep the night before retrofiring. Things will probably work out better. Let's see, in systems today, we found - we were running a TV of the blood draw and urine specific gravity this morning, TV-4. It didn't come out. In fact it didn't get to the ground at all. It got to the ground but it was all garbled and unusable. In the process of troubleshooting that, we have discovered that we have lost one of the two power cables we had power signal cables, we have on board for the television and that EREP down-link. Now, in retrospect, it looks like this may have been - You recall that about two weeks ago we were having trouble with that thing called the EDDU, which is a little box that puts the data from the tape recorder in EREP down to the FM data system. It looks like maybe this cable may have been the culprit all way back then and this is the first time we've seen this particular cable used on the television camera. Anyway we've still got another one up there, so that isn't any problem, let's see, since there's been a flight director here, we lost another airlock module tape recorder last night And we have replaced it and the new one is working satisfactory. The one we lost had a lot of hours on it, I don't remember, but it was over a thousand, if I recall. And we have three more spares onboard. And, of course, as you know, in Skylab-IV, two of the ones that are broken now onboard, we know the failure mode, it's the belt drive and we're flying up some new belts, so we hope that we can recondition a couple of them on Skylab-IV and still have three more spares on board, so that's not really a problem. The Two more little systems ditties the Y-3 gyro on the
f-

SL-III Time: 9/13/73 rack some

PC-88B/2 17:01 CDT

still kind

seems of EMI. seem with

to

be being bothered a We're still continuing

little to

bit by look at it all llke

that, an antenna

and there associated

to be several things sending commands to

that cause the vehicle,

switch causes the gyro to start oscillating just a very small amount and then damp out. That problem has been with us for a couple of days and we're still looking at it. That is an old - one of the old gyros. It's the old Y-I. It does this is one last ran five data a not have something thing. the fail new that On SO55, heater in it, of course. But we haven't seen before. And you may or may not remember.

We

test to see if we were getting and we're Just now getting around and we aren't finished yet, but

corona in detector to analyzing the the initial indications 5,

look llke we probably are getting some arcing in detector and that is causing it to trip off. So, it's cutting out validly. Flight Plan for tomorrow, two EREPs, 29 and 30. Major medical on CDR. And a full day of ATM operations. Heavy Flight Plan tomorrow, about 7 hours ATM. And that's all I have. health. health F_ HAWKINS We've and well Okay. The crew continues in good had no medical problems concerning their being. There has been no medication, no that. Their morale is really outstanding.

requirements

for

And they continue to work and perform in, I think, a very satisfactory manner. The run on the Commander, yesterday, as you probably already know, was terminated after three minutes in the maximum negative stress level. This was the third time that this has occurred for the Commander. The END previous OF TAPE times were on day 5

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88C/I 17:01 CDT

HAWKINS - for the Commander. The previous times was on day 6 and day 20. Following each of those previous runs he has been run again - subsequent runs at minus 50-millimeter negative pressure, the maximum, without any illeffects whatsoever. He is scheduled again tomorrow and will again be run at minus 50. The run on the 92 run on the Science Pilot yesterday was completed, the full protocol. The run today, I really haven't gotten any answers back on HUTCHINSON I don't think we have any reason to believe it was terminated. HAWKINS I don't - haven't any indication of it. HUTCHINSON None whatsoever. I'm sure it was run to full protocol. HAWKINS Yes. The M171, the ergometer workload study, this has - we've had - I think one run on each of the three crewmen since last week's report and they continue to be working very well within their preflight envelope level both from the heart rate and blood pressure standpoint. I guess I should mention on the 92 studies all three crewmen are still running slightly increased heart rates in the inflight as compared to their preflight baseline levels. These are not increasing at all, but they're - they're still ranging in the upper range as they have been. The M093, that's the veetorcardiogram, which is used to not only monitor the subject during 92 and 171 runs, but in itself being a separate study shows no clinical abnormalities. Everything looks good there. And the - from the nutritional mineral balance study everything - here looks very stable. The weights on the crew have been stable for the majority of this mission, except for the Science Pilot who has shown a slightly gradual weight loss over the mission, having reached what I think is a plateau level now at about 129 with some fluctuations lle within half a pound to a pound around that. We do have a absolute limit, redline, if you will, on what weight loss we will accept for him before we do something and that was 128-1/2. Now if he fell below that for 3 consecutive days well then we would increase his caloric intake. He has been below that for two days and then yesterday - the report we got this morning, he was back up into the 129 plus area again. So I feel that he is stable as far as weight goes. The review of all the medical data over the past week was presented to Headquarters this morning and in turn to Dr. Fletcher who did make the decision to go ahead with the balance of the mission as planned. I think you have that statement available to you. Okay? PAO We're ready for questions then. Bruce Hicks.

_

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88C/2 17:01 CDT

weight

QUERY at launch? Yes

Yes,

First,

Royce,

what

was

Garriott's over here have.

HAWKINS with me either. 136.8. bottom there? it. END QUERY redllne? HAWKINS It's OF TAPE

Oh, boy. I didn't bring I did, too. On Garriott Why do you it arbitrary pick or 128-i/2 what's

those I do

Is

as the

an absolute magic number

it's

-

Well, there's nothing you subtract that out

really magic about and that's - -

F

¸ .

SL _-_

III

PC-88D/1 17:01 CDT

TIME: 9/13/73

about

QUERY HAWKINS it.

It's

-

- magic number there? Well, there's nothing really magic you subtract that out and that's a sizeable small guy and you to set and if we say okay, go below this this,

amount of weight loss for a is about the limits we ought

then we ought to start really looking at it seriously. And up to this point, I really haven't been concerned about it. QUERY Neil, why would you have any reason to believe that the CBRMs won't continue to degrade? What gives you that kind of a clue? HUTCHINSON Well, we don't - I don't haven't have any clue whether they will or won't. The data that we've gathered so far, of course, and we haven't been gathering it all that long. We've got some pretty good data points on the curve, on the discharges here, just from the last three weeks, you know, we've got a big gap of knowledge here as to ow they got to where they got, except for the data we have now that maybe they were down quite a bit before we lifted off, you know, because of the cycles before lift off. I have no reason to believe that they won't continue on the present curves. I have no data to lead me that, but the data that I do have that says where they're going the time we get to the end of Skylah IV is pretty Bruce, and that, coupled with the fact that most folks, in fact, all of the folks I've talked to, to he skimpy, of the don't by

_-_

understand why they're doing what they're doing completely yet leads me to not be very positive about where we're going to be when we get down to the end. Also keep in mind that we're extrapolating our conclusions based on - to all 18 - based on testing three or four, a couple of good ones, and a couple of "had ones", not really bad, but the ones that saw the heat cycles of Skylab I. So I got no data to say that, really. QUERY Okay. So now we've got two CBRMs off line and those that aren't, we feel are degraded, and if we get to the 5 or 6 amp hours toward the end of SL IV, won't this have some sort of effect on Kohoutek viewing? HUTCHINSON It is going to have some - if it continues at the rate we're seeing now, it is liable to. I really haven't considered it in terms of Kohoutek, but of course it is an out of solar inertial attitude some of the time, a lot fact, think that on as is EREP, and probably - I'm trying to think whether of that is done - some of that is done at night, in I know some of it is done at night, so I wouldn't that - I really don't know, Bruce, I wouldn't think it EREP. would But have that's as much an off effect the on cuff that answer. as it might have I'd really

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SL III TIME: 9/13/73

PC-88D/2 17:01 CDT

have to look at that. It's bound to have to be taken into consideration, I mean, we don't have as much power as we'd like to have. But some of the Kohoutek stuff, and I don't how the viewing programs llne up, but since it is an inertial target off to the side, some of it's done at night, some of it's done" in the daytime. Whereas EREF is all done in the daytime. Except for things like JOP 13 or llke EREP CALs. QUERY What's the EREP passes tomorrow? Where they going to be? HUTCHINSON I haven't got the exact - that data with me. They're going to be - They're both over the U.S. Oh, yeah, I got a Flight Plan, but it doesn't give you the exact - Let's see track - One of them is - this will help you out. Nave you got VTS charts. One of the_ is - It's track i and track 2 on the VTS. Those are both U.S. passes. I don't know exactly where they're going or where are the total number of targets or anything, in fact, I didn't bring that data, but I'ii remember to bring it. We had an outstanding day today. That second pass we had today, we got 28 sites with it, and we got i0 or ii with the first one. So we had an exceptional day with EREP today. The weather was considerably better on the second pass than it was on the first. Farther west. are _-_ QUERY With CBRM 5 off line, how much power percentages are we down from I00 percent all together now? HUTCHINSON Well, of course, with two off, you're you've lost a little less than i0 percent of your capability out of the ATM_ and you got to add on to the fact that add on the battery degradation - gee, I haven't got a number in my head. If you added on the degradation in terms in END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88E/1 17:01 CDT

HUTCHINSON

- -

that

had

on

the

battery

degradation

and gee, I haven't got a number in my head. He added on the degradation in terms of absolute - you mean where we ought to be right now or where - or where we thought we were going to be. Of course, we knew the batteries were going to degrade some and if we started out with 20 amp hour batteries we're probably down I guess 25 percent from where we ought to be in degradation at this time overall ATM power capability. And due to degradation and probably another - well, less than 10 percent. It's probably around a third. It'd be a good round number. Boy, that's off the top of my head_ but a third, and that's with the ATM production capability. QUERY What's the so - so-called abandon ship redline on power. HUTCHINSON Oh, way+ way, way down from that. We would have to be down in a posture where - and we have looked at that, in fact, we've got all the data all laid out for that particular situation relative to the loss of the ATM and the loss of the airlock. Of course, the alrlock situation, we're running with this single coolant loop. If anything were to happen to that coolant loop now and when we get a chance to reservice the other one on Skylab IV, we're in a situation where we have to turn off all the alrlock power. The drop dead power levels, as far as to stay in orbit operations, bare minimum are right around 3000 watts, roughly_ something like that. And you know we're sustaining everyday orbit operations right now in the area of 5500 to 6000 watts. So we're not even half way and of course we're not overtaxing the power system in any way shape or form with the current orbital levels. I mean, that's a fullup spaceship. With all the experiments going and everything else, it depends on the Beta angle, how much heat you're getting in and so on end so forth. But itls around 5500 to 6000D roughly, average power load per orbit. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, can you go into the Commanderls experience of having to terminate the experiment? What happened and what were his heart rates and everythin_ when they terminated? HAWKINS Okay. It was 3 mlntues into the 50 minus minus 50 level when he had the feellng, as he expressed it, of just not feeling quite right. Now at that point in the elf-to-ground transmissions the observer said that he really saw nothing that would indicate that, you know, that he was in any type of trouble of any kind. In other words, the usual type of presyneopal symptoms were really not evident. Such as change of skin color of the face, the sweating, that type of thing. But he did - and he had not noticed any change -

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88E/2 17:01 CDT

HAWKINS when we got he had climbed then Just in

in

his

blood

pressure

or

pulse. was 100 the

Now a drop and -

the data back and analyzed it, there from a 68 resting heart rate up to the - over the last 5 seconds before

Commander - the subject actually hit the switch to dump the can, he - over that last 5 seconds there very gradually his pulse rate came down to a 70 at the time the pressure was released. So he did have some drop in heart rate and slightly - a slight - a slight drop in systolic pressure too. along seen There with before, was a that. Abby, slight (garble) That's a similar but not - this he hit the of the pulse type response was I think a switch tell in and dumped pressure that we've little blt it sort little of

less, perhaps earlier. QUERY phenomena OF TAPE

because

the END

of

his

What does this heart weakening

you about space - -

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88F/1 17:01 CDT

QUERY What does this tell you about the phenomena of his heart weakening in space? HAWKINS Well, it's the same type of thing that we saw in Skylab-ll crewmen. You recall, we had, with Dr. Kerwin, especially, the - We saw a similar type of picture to what we've really seen with Commander Bean here, I think And Joe had three times in the 28-day mission, really. And this is only Al's third, time, over the course of 40 some days, 56 days. So, it's a change, certainly in the cardiovascular system, which we have seen and previous crews have experienced. I don't think that you'd term weakening of the heart as really correct. It isn't the weakening of the heart. There's a different type of a change within the dynamics of the - within the internal sensors that control the heart rate and cardiac output and that type of thing. That is, I think, is at work here. And Just what this, again, means to us, in our postrecovery phase, we have yet to wait and see what a real significance that is. We saw, as you know, a delay, different type of response of these three crewmen in Skylab-ll postflight, and a much more prolonged period of return to preflight baseline levels. I'm sure we'll see a similar picture here. QUERY What about the loss of - in the circumference of their calfs - that measured? HAWKINS Well, I really don't have any, you know any new theories on it, other than this does reflect a loss of muscle mass, and having again the initial decrease that we saw is a reflection of the redistribution of the body fluids from the lower extremedies into other parts of the body and to the upper extremidities, in the trunk and deeper vains and deeper vessels. Now following that in the weight, usual water loss and that type of thing, then you have to look at any further deduction as a loss of actually body fats and fat tissue, if any, there, in the underlying skin surface or around the calf and then the muscle. And I think, very definitely, yes, it's muscle mass loss that we have seen. QUERY How much have they lost, you know, by date, now? HAWKINS Okay. Abbey. The - All three of them are Just really alike this time, which is not the case with Skylah-II. I think Paul really showed the greatest loss in Skylab-ll. But all three of these people are Just about alike and it's about a 7 to 8 percent loss over what they've measured preflight. Now that's something like about an inch in circumferance that they've lost. And this has been very, very gradual in a definite downward trend over the entire flight. I don't know that - for certain, it looks llke we this

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SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88F/2 17:01 CDT

may have kind of bottomed out over the last has been a definite gradual downward trendon measurement. QUERY body negative consecutive, HAWKINS QUERY HAWKINS END OF TAPE Dr., the device for AI, were they not? Curtailed Yes. No - curtailed curtailed Or were runs? runs runs they?

week. this,

But tht,rt, in this

on the lower were not

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88G/I 17:01 CDT

The

QUERY curtailed HAWKINS

runs

- - lower body negative were not consecutive, or Curtailed runs?

device for were they?

AI.

QUERY Yes. HAWKINS No. Not consecutive. QUERY Spread out over the mission - HAWKINS No. The first was the 6th day and the second was the 20th mission day, and the third one was then the 46th day. QUERY If this curtailed response is so erratic, you really cannot establish a trend, can you not? HAWKINS No. No, no. QUERY Could it he an individual reaction? HAWKINS It - Yes. And it can be yet some other, you know, some other factors that have, you know, have an influence on his particular physiology in performance that particular day, too. You have to take all these things into consideration. And this, of course, takes a little hit of time to try to go back and really determine exactly what he was doing and how much sleep he had and what relation it was to meal time and all of this. And this run did happen to have - happen to be done within an hour after his last meal, which may have some influence upon the results we see too. Of course, we normally like to have a good two hours after a meal. PAO Let's take Jim Maloney's. QUERY What can you say about the comparison of this crew with the first crew at this point? HAWKINS Well, Jim. I think that right at this point, I think this crew looks very - very much llke the Skylab-II crew did at the end of their 28-day mission. And I guess you would interpret that to say that actually they have done a little better. And they've gone much longer with no further change, degradation of their performance as compared with the Skylab-II crew. QUERY What does this tell you then, about when a crew's reached a point, where they can Just go on and on? HAWKINS Don't have that answer yet. And I don't think we will until we have certainly gotten this crew back and then we've flown another 56-day and have another three data points to look at, to tell us. I think it's Just to early, Jim, to be able to predict that. PAO Bruce. QUERY inference that expected to be flight. I took from today's statement the this crew's in better shape than they were at this point in time, based on the first

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88G/2 17:01 GMT

HAWKINS Well, based on the first flight, yeah. QUERY Right. And you expected them to do a lot more exercise than the first crew did, based on that. What else makes them in that much better shape? If you did expect exercise, you would have expected them to be in better shape than the first crew so what else is involved? HAWKINS Well, Bruce. We - I guess, I kind of kicked this thing off before the end of Skylab-II, with in looking at the amount of exercise that each individual was doing. Pete was doing the most, by far and certainly looked the best from all measurements that we had. And I think, rightfully so, that exercise is a very important key element in this maintaining physical condition. And, therefore, we did recommend that they have more time for exercise. I think very definitely the exercise that they are doing, and they're really working at it is paying off in that - This perhaps more than any other factor, certainly in more than any single factor, I think, is influencing the results that we're seeing. QUERY Well, then it might turn out to be exercise is more - even more important than you thought? HAWKINS Maybe so. And - PAO I have four questions that were phoned in. I'd llke to ask them now. First is for the flight director. Will the crew bring the fish - END OF TAPE

-

f

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88H/I 17:01 CDT

PAO I have four questions that were phoned in. Like to ask them now. The first one is for Flight Director. Will the crew bring the fish home if the fish are still alive at the end of the mission? HUTCHINSON I don't believe so, but I'ii have to check - I can't answer that for sure. I'll have to check. We are of course, bringing one of the spiders home, or both of them. I'm not sure one or both of them. But I'm not sure about the fish. But we ought get them an answer straightforward answer on that. PAO Okay. The next three questions are for Dr. Hawkins and you've answered part of them, but there may be something you would want to add. How much cardiovascular decondltioning has been seen in this crew, please detail
your answer.

well

HAWKINS as I can.

Well,

I think

I've

covered

it about

as

PAO Okay. How much better condition the crewmembers in now than anticipated? HAWKINS We've touched on that one I think in trying to answer Bruce's question there. PAO How much aftereffects do you expect when they return to one g? HAWKINS Well, I think I mentioned that one too. In that I expect to see something very similar to what we saw in the Skylab II crew. But how much different, don't know. I really don't at this point. PAO Paul has another question. QUERY Have you come across anything would lead you to recommend or at least investigate possibility of changing some - something with the or activities of the last crew? I really

at

all that the conditioning

HAWKINS In flight, you're talking about now? QUERY Premlssion or in the flight itself. HAWKINS No. Based on what we know and what we've seen right to date, I don't know of any change that we would make in the preflight period. I don't know yet what changes might be recommended for any inflight. It'sreally kind of hard until you really get them back to see, you know, what the overall total picture is, because it's - it begins way in the days preflight and it ends sometime several days after recovery. Till you've been able to really assess what the inflight data even means to you. In that I think you have to have before you start trying to make too many changes and alterations to your basic experimental protocol. And at this point in time, I don't see the need for anything much different than what we are doing. It's possible that

SL-III Time: 9/13/73

PC-88H/2 17:01 CDT

HAWKINS you may very well find that you want to increase the exercise even more. Quite possibly we would want to perform different types of exercise if the problem with the lower extremeties is really the problem that we think it is. And in weightlessness this is where the most change seems to take place and occur, in the lower extremeties. Fluid movement out of the extremeties, loss of muscle mass, and so forth. So perhaps we need to think and look at different types of exercise where you're really putting good stress upon those leg muscles - the thick - the big heavy mUSCles. QUERY If I recall from the first on the lower body negative test_ Just started declining and each test was a little bit more the previous one. It set a definite trend as mission, gradually curtailed I recall. Kerwin_ than Where-

as this result on Bean has been an erratic thing - your run exactly. The result of that, I don't quite understand how you can compare - compare the crews and say theylre - Heants about where Kerwin was, in effect. If the characteristics and testing results are different. I was abort END HAWKINS saying is_ the mission TAPE There's differences. we had three occurrences with Joe; we had three The only where we with AI. thing is, had to

OF

f

SL III TIME: 9/13/73

PC-88I/I 17:01 CDT

HAWKINS

-

occurrances

where

we

had

to

abort

the

mission with Joe. We had three with AI. You're right. There always did seem to be with Joe, a slight rise in heart rates leading up to the point where it would then precipitantly drop. Now, whereas, we haven't really seen quite that type of pattern or trend with AI. You understand, l'm saying the same thing you did, really, you know, you were saying drop and it was really, they build up and then drop. Okay. PAO Any more questions? Okay. Thank you gentlemen. END OF TAPE

f

SKYLAB NEWS CENTER Houston, Texas

Skylab III - Change Johnson Space Center September 14, 1973 7:49 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

PARTICIPANTS: Nell
F

B.

Hutchinson, PAO

Flight

Director

Amos

Crisp,

f

PC-89

SL-III Time: 9/14/73

PC-89A/I 18:49 CDT

PAO For today's change-of-shift press briefing, we have Flight Director Nell Hutchinson. HUTCHINSON Okay. I haven't got a heek of a lot today. The reasons I'm late, we had a tough time trying to get tomorrow's Flight Plan put together. It was not a matter of_having a crew time to do anything or anything like that. It was a matter that we had scheduled extra long EREP pass. And by at the momemtum's state expensive for our blood, instead of one big one, to-back EREPs tomorrow. the time we got around to looking we decided it was a little too so we backed off and we're running, two fairly straight forward backSo that kind of took us a lot of

_-

today to try and get that Flight Plan straightened around. About the o_ly - We had a couple of little systems anomalies today, both of them in experiments. We had a problem in the EREP gear during the EREP pass we ran today, which, by the way was a very good pass. We got about 20 sites. The weather waslnot spectacular, but it was fairly good in the right places. So we had a good EREP pass today. We had a funny with the S193 instrument, that's the radiometer, scatterometer, altimeter and we are a long ways from understanding what it is that may or may not he wrong with it. I guess for the moment, I'd llke to say that there's We aren't realty sure that there's anything wrong with it. However, we did run a short test on it after the EREP pass on it today; And we had the little down-llnk, the EDDU. which is the little down-link device that we can get down one instrument's worth of data or one channel's worth of data from the EREP down to the ground hooked up. And it happened_to he hooked up to 193 and the EDDU data didn't look good either. It looks llke - a preliminary look at it llke we had_a radiometer receivers malfuntion light during the pass. And without getting into a lot of detail, we could have _ problem with the logic box that sequences the operations in the 193. We may have just had a little logic hangup. And it'll be all right tomorrow. If we get some similar performance out of it tomorrow, I suspect we'll be dolng some kind of troubleshooting. The altimeter worked grea£. We didn't have any problems with the altimeter part of the_SO93. It was in the radiometer part. And then after we - The radiometer is the receiver only, that receives microwave signals from the earth, passive receiver. The scatterometer, when we ran our little test, we also showed up a similar funny when we ran the test after the pass and we're looking at some things from the logic that might possibly cause those two things to be related. However, it's too early tO say whether anything's really wrong with the

f

[

SL-III Time: 9/14/73

89A/2 18:49

CDT

instrument. We didn't have We found another cable that cable between the TV monitor

any systems anomallles today. wasn't - isn't working properly. and the TV camera that monitor's

A

that little thing they use to look at the television pictures. It hasn't anything to do with what gets on the downllnk or what comes down on the television, it's what the crew can see and we've got an innerface cable there, and apparently it's got an intermittent opener, intermittent short in that causes the monitor on occasion not to receive a good picture from the television camera. Experienced some problems with those cables before, so I don't think that's anything exciting. Flight Plan for tomorrow, two EREP passes, both of them over the United States. One of them cuts up over the Rio Grande Valley and up across Ohio and into New York. Pennsylvania, New York, and out over the southeastern part of Canada. And the other one is track 16, which is also the U.S., farther west, comes up over California and on into Nevada across the Great Plains and out across Lake Superior and North Atlantic. Both of them look llke fairly good passes. That'll be passes 31 and 32 on EREP, if we take them tomorrow. And I suspect we'll take them both. And that's about all I have. I might say something about I think I mentioned it yesterday and it's been fer - END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/14/73

PC-89B/1 18:49 CDT

HUTCHINSON say something about it's been firmed up on the shift on the first half of it the crew will go Monday morning 2 day 53, they will words, we've got Sunday and Tuesday

And - I and crew

that's about all I have. I might think I mentioned it yesterday and finalized now. This circadian shift will occur on mission day the

on mission day 51, that's Sunday. Sunday to bed 2 hours early and they will get up hours early. Then on Tuesday - next week, again go to bed 2 hours early - in other two short work days of only 14 hours on and on Wednesday they will get up 2 hours by Wednesday morning they'll be getting time here and going to bed at 7 o'clock at night pardon me, 6 o'clock local And we will remain on that cirdadlan

early and, therefore, up at 2 a.m. local at night. 6 o'clock time, Houston time.

rhythm till mission termination, which is getting unbelievably close; a week from next Tuesday. And that's about all. The rest of the mission's beginning to - we actually have got Flight Plans run out all the way to the end and it's pretty much press on with EREP. We expect to get, I'm not sure how many passes. We'll probably end up close to 40, which of course anticipated. I I'ii give you a going to end up is way, way more than we had originally suspect before I'm through with this shift good summary of about where we think we're as far as all the experiments go. We've which is pointing the ATM out in the night sky instead one of those is scheduled And other than that it's about up, and on day 57. getting the CSM of course we've And that's

got a couple of these JOP 13's instruments at a X-ray source of at the Sun. And the first on day 53, which is next week. pretty much back up and got the EVA about all. PAO 6 when QUERY they second got A up, EREP medical, getting left.

start thinking the CSM packed And Are the EVA's any

there

questions? it this morning at second EVA - second it to right cost in you a minute was 200 foot-pounds

As I understood the reason the I'll get going it's

EVA

cancelled was if I remember HUTCHINSON

because of -

Pound-seconds. - pound-seconds, getting to the cutting into or point your whatever where the experiment it is, shortage collection? that

of of

QUERY TACS. Are you TACS is actually

HUTCHINSON 200 pound-seconds during our flight preceding and then this on the end

No, not at all. Let me tell you how came from. It turned out, we basically, planning cycle over the last 24 ho_rs we the had second an EREP EREP two EREP was a passes maneuver of pass

morning,

f_

SL-III Time: 9/14/73

PC-89B/2 18:49 CDT

HUTCHINSON that basically kept the vehicle - kept the EREP instruments up and kept the vehicle oriented so that we would scan the limb of the Earth. It's called an Earth limb scan. And frankly, the ground teams over the three shifts that of course, it takes three shifts to get one of these days planned - we made a mistake in the calculations. We actually forgot one of the teams, in fact, my team forgot the Earth limb scan and we got the maneuvers computed without the Earth limb scan in there but the pads had it in and that 200 pound-seconds was nothing more than an estimate based right off of somebody's head. It was not based on the computer runs we normally do. And how much it would cost us to get that Earth to get the scan in when we had it there right at the end of the flight planning cycle - when we hadn't preplanned for it properly. To answer your question specifically about whether the TACS is cutting into EREP, the answer to that is unequivocally no, not at all. 200 pound-seconds we would never spend 200 pound-seconds for an EREP pass because you don't have to if you're very clever about where the way you manage the momentum going in there and you keep vents away from it, like keep the M092 lower body negative pressure runs away from the EREP passes so that you get a you're able to get rid of the excess momentum between them and so on and so forth. And as you know, we've pretty much been running EREP free, even when we run these - by free, I mean it doesn't cost any TACB at all. And - END OF TAPE

F-

,_

SL III TIME: 9/14/73

PC-89C/I 18:49 CDT

f-

HUTCHINSON EREP free. Even when we run these by free, I mean it doesn't cost any TACS at _111, and, you know, by tomorrow I think that the prognosis is something like five or six minimum impluse firing switches, like 25 pound-seconds, something like that, which I consider to be fairly, that's an expensive EREP pass, since we've been running them at zero. Two hundred pound-seconds is not only expensive, it's over exorbitant, and we wouldn't spend that to get one, mainly because we just don't have to. So that's how that all came about. We basically made a mistake and in trying t$ correct it late in the game we couldn't get around it, so, you know, we're _oing to run the Earth limb scan again. QUERY I noticed he was Just showing the minnows on the TV there. Did he mention in the telecast how many minnows are in there now. HUTCHINSON Yes. Fifteen. He said they had - He said about 15, I think. QUERY Have some spiders any more (garble) recently? We haven't heard anymore about that. HUTCHINSON Well, let's see. I donlt know as he's mentioned them. We've had some activity with them, I think, in the last 3 or 4days. I wasn't on, but we actually, deliberately destroyed the webs a couple of times in attempting to get some pictures of web building, mainly because, I think they had - they have some history that's on the spider that's on the ground and the time of day that it builds webs and it's directly is doing it very close to when the lights come back on in the morning. So, and I'm not sure whether they're successful, if they were successful at that or not, hut the spiders are alive and well, you know. Of course, Anita is still in the web spinning business, and Arahella is off in the little jar. QUERY Today we noticed that the crew was especially quiet or exceptionally quiet today. Is there any reason for that. They just weren't talkative at all. HUTCHINSON No, I don't think so. I think we Just had pretty much a day as usual with - awfully busy. These Flight Plans are, you know, we've been Just packing them, just as full as we can get them, every minute. And I think it was the fact of the matter was that they were busy. I didn't notice anythingwhen you come - now that I come to think of it, there wasn't a beck of a lot of conversation today. That probably indicates, in fact it does indicate a smooth running Flight Plan. When there's not a lot of conversation, and I don't think it's indicative of anything.

a_L

SL III TIME: 9/14/73

PC-89C/2 18:49 CDT

Tomorrow they may talk our head off, you know, there may be a little tendency, you know, we're in the homestretch, and the excitment peaks may be over a little bit. We're really just pouring out the science llke it's going out of style here, coming down the homestretch. Most of this - boy, this last 5 or 6 days are the real bonus days for the science folks. This is where they are getting all their extra gravy. QUERY We asked yesterday and I Just wondered if you happened to come up with a possible answer. Are they going to bring the fish back. HUTCHINSON They're not. QUERY They're not going to bring the fish back. They going to dump them down the trash alrlock or what? little back? HUTCHINSON QUERY through a test of procedures. They is that correct? the HUTCHINSON air? Yes. They're going to, I understand run the reentry procedures, maneuvering are going to do it in the simulator Sunday, Oh, you mean here on the ground or in HUTCHINSON small for QUERY I would assume so. I think they're a being edible. The spiders however, will he brought

QUERY I Just wanted to review the procedures of preparation for reentry that they're going to do. I understand there's going to be two sims on the ground, and they're going to cold fire them up.there. Have you done any more on that and could you just kind of review the schedule. HUTCHINSON Yeah, I'm trying to see exactly where it is and zeally on a _ it should be on about - hut I really don't see it here. It's about - I can give you a general run of the mill - END OF TAPE

r-

SL-III Time: 9/14/73

PC-89D/I 18:49 CDT

HUTCHINSON should be, oh, in about, but I really don't see i_ here. It's about I can give you the general run of the mill way that's - that that takes place. Basically, the crew will be going through a Ah, here it is. Well we really d5 two things. It's on day 55, which is - I don't know what d_y that is, but it's coming up here - 55? Right. It's on Thursday. And, the crew will be doing a couple of things. For one thing, they go up into the CSM and spend a couple ofihours smoking everything over very carefully and I'm not_sure what all those E minus five-day checks include but, basically, it's an over all systems check of the CSM. We'll look 9t just about everything up there. We'll power up the G&N,.so on and so forth. And also, on that same day, there'_ a procedure review scheduled, which basically is going through the timeline making sure we haven't touched the switch _xercise. And I haven't been deeply involved in this. Phil Shaffer, of course, is the CSH Flight Director who runs th_s whole entry thing, as far as the CSM goes. On Skylab-ll, we had - we did exactly the same thing before entry. And_we. wnet through the timeline of the whole entry sequence an_ all of the procedures, and the crew on Skylab-ll, and the ground actually went through what we call an entry simulation._ And we are going to do that again and basically that's sortlof to tune us up as well as to tune them up. And the cre@ on Skylah-ll, if I recall, felt like they didn't get a lot out of the entry sim part of it. However, we are goin_ to run it again, to make sure the ground has got all the_ sites, all the data going up to the CSM at the right time. i And so on so forth, so that it's - it's sort of a tune up for both of us. But I think the ground probably gets more out of the reentry slm exercise than the crew does. And the crew, of course, will get a lot out of the fact that t_ey have some quiet time alotted to set down and go over the!procedures very thoroughly and look at all the CSM stuff t_at has to be done. Because, after all you, know, we've[been up there two months and people haven't thought a l@t about the CSM. Although, it's probably gotten more than i£s share of attention with all the problems we have with the RCS.We had some procedures work done over the months - over the no - over the two months. But that's basically what it is. And I can give you - If you really want, tomorrow, I'ii bring you a rundown of the whole time line basically, what they're doing. QUERY Also, well, you're not a doctor, but Dr. Hawkins said yesterday Bean called it quits on the lower body thing, two minutes before the end of his protocol and today we heard while we were over here that he completed it.

negative

SL-III Time: 9/14/73

PC-89D/2 18:49 CDT

He went the whole correct, from start HUTCHINSON tion at 50-millimeters. expected. PAO END OF TAPE

completed the whole protocol, to finish? Yes. And that includes the That's - frankly that's Okay. Thank yon.

is

that

full durawhat I

f-

J--

SKYLAB

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Houston,

Skylab IIIChange Johnson Space Center September 15, 1973 4:30 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

PARTICIPANTS: Nell David Hutchinson, Garrett, Plight PAO Director

f_

PC-90

SL-III Time: 9115/73

PC90A/I 16:30 CDT

PAO Ready to get started with our change-ofshlft-brleflng this afternoon. We have with us off-golng Flight Director Neil Hutchinson. Neil. HUTCHINSON Okay, today we had another - Just a plain ole pretty busy day of operations. Two ER_P passes, we ran two EREPs today, got about 40 sites in the two of them. We did run some work on one of the EREP instruments that we had trouble with yesterday again today we ran it fairly as a S193, the radlometer/scatterometer, altimeter we ran programmed the instrument through the EREP passes pretty much as we would have if nothing had been wrong with it however, we did put some special steps in there for the crew to get some observations on the antenna motion and also get some observations on the readouts as some of the - some of the data channels coming off the instruments. We also radioed the data channel off 193 to the ground through the EDDU data device. And make a long story short, the current prognosis on S193 is that we apparently have some kind of logic problem in the instrument that's causing the antenna to malfunction in its scan patterns. And _ if what currently looks llke the problem turns out to be the problem - turns out in fact to be a real problem which it looks llke it it's likely to, we may have loss the radio_eter/scatterometer portion of S193. The altimeter protion of the device does not call for any antenna motion. The antenna Just goes to nadir 00 looks straight down at the ground. The altimeter part which descends Just llke a radar for - and all types of purposes or radio it down and bounces it back is - works fine. Of course that doesn't require any particular position of the antenna. Now the thing that has this kind of buffaloed on the antenna today during part of - during several of the operating modes this antenna basically - it's very simple. The thing really has two basic modes to it. One mode is where it's scanning the ground in track longitudinally as the vehicle goes along like this the antenna it looks - first in nadir and then it pitches up 45 degrees out - looking out in front of the vehicle and then it scans back down to zero then back to 45. This is called in track, contiguous now the other mode is where - a cross track contiguous @hieh is effectively the same thing but the scan pattern is side to side. Like this. We got about I0 degrees off to the side as the vehicle is moving along it Just scans a path of the ground. The antenna motions observed today which are - were highly regular at a first glance anyway, and keep in mind this data is all based on Al's comment we don't have any telemetry data on the glmbal positions or anything. The antenna in the intrack mode is pitching forward 45 degrees scanning back to zero and then instead of pitching forward it's pitching

SL-III Time:

PC90A/2 16:30

CDT

9115173
backward 45 course, runs te the side the side as co So degrees and back to zero_ like that which is, of the data. On that cross track it's rolling out and it has a small pitch motion when it gets out it should and then it rolls back - it scans back of rolling up out on lot and of looking also the left it one side. at voice rolls And back right again. I'm sure we're going we got off have to go the back

to

0 and instead it's hanging doing a today

to he systems

the readouts tapes we'll

ever those pretty carefully and see if we decifer what it is that's broken but the logic box that sequences the antenna looks llke it's not doing its job right. Today we ran the only other thing out of - really out of ordinary on the flight plan that we had on the flight plan today was we ran a cooling test on Jack all suited up this mernln E for a couple of hours while he was working at the ATM panel to check out the coollng technique that we're going to use en him during the EVA, and we have about the same responses out of him that we had when we ran it on the ground it was certainly not super but it was adequate. So - END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/15/73

PC-90B/I 16:30 CUT

_'_

HUTCHINSON - - about the same responce out of him that we had when we ran it on the groupd. It was certainly not super, but it was adequate. So I think that subject's probably closed and that's the way we're going to be running the EVA as far as the crew cooling goes. That's the two outside guys on the 02 flow and th_ inside guy with his fan hooked up to his suit, recirc_lating cabin air through the suit. Interesting note, if you didn't copy it today, this morning in fact, at abput 15:00 zulu, 14:49 to be exact. Owen and Jack passed Pete's record for total hours in manned space flight, thus becoming the number two guys on the llst behind the other guy that's up there. Of course, A1 will end up with more hours than anybody I imagine for the, who knows how long. The Flight Plan for tomorrow. Tomorrow's the crew-dayoff by the way. The Flight plan for tomorrow is as - are have been all the crew day offs pretty normal. There's some amount of slop in it, however, we are running about 5 hours or so of manned ATM time. Two EREP passes, EREP 33 and 34 and numerous other smaller items. No medical runs tomorrow. And that's all I have. QUERY In other words, then, we've lost the rad scat the last two days on 193, is that right? HUTCHINSON Yes. Now, you know when I say we've lost it, we've lost this mode of it. I'm not intimately familiar with all the modes of the instrument. I have I suspect that there is a constant tad mode - And I'm not sure of this Bruce, where the antenna isn't required to be gimbaled in a pattern. Although, I'm not sure, I think almost all of the antenna - all of the motions require some gimbaling and a pitch direction to compensate for movement motion - you know, forward motion compensation across the ground. To answer you question specifical_y, about the last two days, we haven't lost it, but the_data appears of certainly dubious value since the antenna - we - is not performing the way it's suppose to. QUERY Is that part of the da_a only - How much is intergrated with the rest of it when they start looking at the Earth Resources and is it pmetty much as I would think, Just on the geologic takes more? Or is it pretty well in all of it, do you know? HUTCHINSON Well, I suspect - I suspect it's certainly will affect the - Since the basic principal instrument is surface structural and subsurface structure, you've got to assume that it would hurt the geologic folks more or the people who are interested in those kind of aspects more than it would hurt people who are interested

SL-III Time: _ 9/15/73 in other forth. the

PC-90B/2 16:30 CDT

things It has one most.

llke clouds and vegetation to reduce the total worth somewhat, because they another. But And I - Keep Okay.

of

and so on and so the science of a package which affects is still

instruments

are

compliment them the working. PAO END OF

I suspect it probably in mind the altimeter you.

Thank

TAPE

SKYLAB NEWS CENTER Houston, Texas

Skylab III Change Johnson Space Center September 16, 1973 5:10 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

PARTICIPANTS: f_ Nell Amos Hutchinson, Crisp, PAO Flight Director

PC-91

SL-III Time: 9/16/73

PC-91A/I 17:09 CDT

burn

QUERY and all

And that. Well, Yes.

I

understand first The there -

that was one it

they a

did

the

2

impulse

HUTCHINSON Skylab-IV crew. QUERY (garble). they SPEAKER are doing a

Skylab-IV going

sim. on crew now, but

one

that's a

They are doing Skylab-lll slm.

with

backup

PAO shift briefing who will give

Okay, we're ready for today's and we have with us Flight Director us an account of today's events.

change of Nell Hutchinson

HUTCHINSON Okay. We had - kind of an uneventful day today. Today was the crew's day off, however like all the other days off we worked pretty much right on through the day. With two EREP passes today, we picked up about 30 plus sites, 32 sites something llke that so it was a good day again for EREP. We still have a - pretty serious malfuctlon with the S193 gear. I explained yesterday that we had observed some anomaly with the antenna andthe antenna drive mechanism. We did some checking today, running the S193 only in altimeter mode with the antenna - the altimeter mode doesn't modwlate the antenna at all, it Just stays parked in nadir looking right straight down at the ground. And after we attempted a couple of lock on_s with the altimeter, we decided to send the CDR to look out the window to see where the antenna was and it appears that the S193 antenna - as opposed to being at 00 nadir where it was suppose to be and where the telemetry said it was when we shut it down yesterday, is at about zero erosstraek and itts about 45 degrees angled to get a good idea back all the way model here. there It's up towards the CSM and probabiy of the 193 antennas, the little to the back towards the airlock have 45 a gander degrees up if you want one in the on that through which only, we've the got

and you can canted about

at it when we're towards the CSM

is the wrong place for it when it's in altimeter MODE so it looks llke we may - probably highly likely that some kind of a logic failure in the box that sequences

operations of the antenna. And we have suspended 193 operations indefinitely. The only sis other systems data we had today is that we've had some kind of a problem with one of the TV monitors in the ATM console, monitor i, &t's not unusable but we have shut it down until we can understand some more about what it is that's line, like it has that's completely the middle of the it. We had one going on some kind undefined day today other with it. It appears to have of a sync generator problem. as to - that just turned up and we haven't done anything if you could call it an horizontal And - about with anomaly.

anomaly,

SL-III Time: 9/16/73

PC-91A/2 17:09 CDT

Anita, the secondary spider died, or was dead this morning. And she's been a - retired back to her container. And I guess will remain there until we decide whether to bring her back or not. Of course, we had plans to bring them both back and I'm not sure how that's going to - all fold together now that - I do now that - we're not going to put Arabella back into action. As we had intended, - in an attempt to preclude her from befalling the same fate, whatever that might be. tomorrows flight plan is full up. We had a little problem - I - - you recall a couple of days ago, I talked about - we were going to use the ATM instruments to look at a - x-ray source - - one of the joint observing programs called JOP 13, it flight plan to run JOP 13, however, as we went flight planning cycle, we were unable to - get control system cost in terms of tax propellant where we felt comfortable with it END OF TAPE was in tomorrows through our the attitude down to the place

SL-III Time: 9/16/73 "_

PCglB/I 17:09 CDT

r

(HUTCHINSON CONT'D) - - we were unable to get the attitude control system cost in terms of tax propellant down to the place where we felt comfortable with it so we have scrubbed JOP 13 out of tomorrowVs flight plan. An_ it remains to be seen if we're going to be able to work it in between now and the end of the mission, At the very leas_ I suspect will have only i J0P 13 as opposed to two. We were going to go after an X-ray source on the first one and a ultraviolet on the second one. The X-ray source is of considerable more interest at the moment so - and that's the one we cancelled so I suspect if we are able to work one in again it's dependent upon working it around other on-going operations, namely, EREP and the biomedical operations, such that _t doesn't cause us to get in trouble with the attitude control system. Now when I say in trouble I mean in terms of spending a lot of tax propellant. The particular set of geometry that's available to us right now to get the instruments pointed at the source and to get stars for the star tracker which are required to obtain a pointing accuracy. And also the beta angle that is how much - in simple terms how much the canister has rolled out of plain, all add up to have us to - to cause us to do some pretty healthy maneuvering a couple of maneuvers are up in the 30-40 degrees range in one axis, and then 50 in another and so on and so forth to get out to this attitude. We're going to try to get it in the flight plan before the mission is over, we'll probably know in the next day or so whether that's going to be possible. We have two EREP's tomorrow. One of them over Japan, track EREP 36, VTS track 49. EREP 36 by the way will be the 34th EREP pass of Skylab III. You recall we've cancelled a couple of them so the numbers don't represent the total number of passes we have to keep the number bookkeeping straight so the crew and both the crew and us don't get confused. Anyway, EREP 36 is VTS track 49 is over Japan and we'll be doing some land views, and a population study water quality and so on and so forth, over on that side of the world. The other EREP pass is a real good ones up the eastern seaboard, and out across Chesapeake Bay all the way across the Atlantic and up across Europe. And we finally got a nice break in the weather it looks llke, we're - we got a ground track that goes right between two fronts right up the east coast and that opens up a big area in the middle of the country up along North Carolina way up in that general vicinity and up across Chesapeake Bay that we've had a heck of a time getting because of these fronts that have been continually plaguing us going through there; EREP day. And QUERY so tomorrow looks that's about all Questions? like a particularly I have. productive

F

SL-III Time: 9/16/73

PC91B/2 17:09 CDT

PAO

John?

QUERY Back on that second ode tomorrow - QUERY VTS track Howard? HUTCHINSON Well, I gave them to you backwards. The VTS track on U. S. pass which is early in the morning at about 14:00 is track 43, and the Japan pass is _rack 49 and it's lata at night Just before bedtime at about 23:00 Znlu. You'll also recall that tomorrow is our first day on the flop around crew will be up tomorrow morning 2 hours early. END OF TAPE

f

f

SL-III Time: 9/16/73

PCglC/I 17:09

CDT

(HUTCHINSON around. it is

Crew

CONT'D) will to

be

up

Tomorrow tomorrow

is our morning

first day 2 hours

on the early. rhythm

flop change,

QUERY that going HUTCHINSON QUERY 4

On that - with that circadian affect y'all's shift? Yes, sir. So, in other words, you will early than Yes sir. So of we won't shift. you he are havi_g now to or

he

coming

off time of

by

Wednesday HUTCHINSON QUERX to get a

hours

approximately till this

wait

day

change

HUTCHINSON We_l, I hadn't thought of that but I guess not. That's right. The execute - we are flopping right over with the crew. As a matter of fact, I have to be in tomorrow morning at five, so we take over at six and I'll he finished up tomorrow around two, so this particular activity ought to take place probably around three tomorrow as opposed to around five. That's correct. QUERY this S193 antenna up on the SL IV? HUTCHINGSON we're have that f going to my doubts, boy I'd Is there any problem, around Well, figure and I that's out tell I tell way that EVA o_ you the crew by taking I think can fix something first really say that thing

Howard,

is what's wrong with it. I you why - well, I shouldn't in fact l'm not going to say

because we fixed a heck of a lot of stuff. There is a fairly complicated logic box between the antenna and this progralmer if you will - - the device that causes the antenna to move in various patterns and it's this interface box we really don't think there's anything wrong with the antenna itself I mean it's not hung up it's not that it isn't drive - it won't drive or anything, it's the - it appears that the driving signals it's getting are all fouled up so that makes you think that it would he a particular difficult problem to take care of that. I'm almost sure that that box is outside I but - - you better not write that down I'm not really sure of that but I think it's outside. There's already some talk about trying to get - powering the antenna up and trying to - put it into a contiguous modes one of these swinging modes and trying to catch it so it's - at least part at - close to nadir so we can use the altimeter. I _ean if it was down close to nadir we could use the altimeter and the fact that we couldn't get anything out of the _itlmeter today

is in - is the results of the fact of course is canted up so where in looking off at the side instead of We got a lot of reading out of the of the currents the motor currents are on the gimbals that position

that t_e_ antennas ZLU it was - you know looking straight down. antenna today, in terms and so on and so forth antenna that didn't

that

the

f

SL-III Time: 9/16/73

PC91C/2 17:09,

CDT

look very healthy. For example, both the torque motor currents were saturated on the - and that's the current that goes from the airlock power system into the antenna to drive it that would lead you to believe that we're getting a con - some kind of continuous drive signal down there althoush the antenna was not on a hard stop so it may be we may no_ even be able to position it to a position we like and I think it p_obably remains to be seen and I'm really not sure whether wQ'll do anymore with it on Skylah III. We are not going to do anythin E with it tomorrow unless the two teams comes up tonight with something clever they'd llke to do. We are not scheduling the operation of it tomorrow. QUERY Did A1 finish his around the world on a the bicycle? HUTCHINSON I don't know. I can't answer that. But you can sure get him the answer to that. It's certainly I don't know what time he planned - exactly when he planned on doing it. I didn't - don't have today's flight plan with but probably whereever he had a lon E session of PTwith some open time I suspect he hadn't done it when I left. Hadn't finished it. QUERY the simulator procedure? HUTCHINSON _f Is tomorrow Pete Conrad to fly that know still twin the planning thruster fellow to be in re-entry that can

me

I don't

but

answer that is in the Control Center we can get him on the telephone, Phil Shaffer is over there. I don't - I haven't heard any changes in that plan so I would assume so. But you ought to confirm that, Phil's the right next - he's at the console right next to the PA0 console. PA0 Okay. Thank you very much. END OF TAPE

f

SKYLAB NEWS CENTER Houston, Texas

Skylab III - Change Johnson Space Center September 17, 1973 3:15 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

Participants: Neil Amos Hutchinson, Crisp, PAO Flight Director

PC-92

f

SL-III Time: 9/17/73

PC92A/I 15:15 CDT

• PAO Okay, we're ready for the Monday, September 17th, evening change-of-shift-briefinB and we have with us Flight Director Nell Hutchinson who will give us a brief account of today's activities. HUTCHINSON Okay, pretty much business as usual today. we had - we have 2 EREP passes today. Today was the day that we had that JOP 13 that was cancelled so we basically had a busy ATM day and a couple of MI31 runs and AMI31 run and 2 EREPs, one of which is done and one of which is to come the one that we finished we ran up across the states up the eastern seaboard and it was a good run, had about 16 sites. The one tonight is the Japanese pass and we're still looking at some kind of shakey weather over there, however, I suspect it'll come off they haven't decided yet they'll be deciding here in the next hour or so. Today on EEEP we ran across the states, we ran another test on the 193 altimeter and it was fairly simple straight forward thin E we have a transponder on the ground at Wallops Island, Virginia, NASA station there at Wallops Island not one of the ones we use for the Manned Space Flight Operations. And we were flying right over it and the test we ran we turned the 193 altimeter on with the antenna of course sitting out half cocked the way it is and we were able to receive the micro-wave signal at Wallops and lock up on it and turn it around and send it back up to the vehicle and we did get a lock on the vehicle for about 8 seconds. That basically proved to us that RF part of the instrument is working properly. And undoubtedly sooner or later is going to lead to some kind of EVA activity to try and get the antenna back in the proper position to be able to use the altimeter now. We fairly - pretty much decided that that's not going to be a Skylab III activity mainly because well there's two reasons. One is that we don't have any EREP passes between this EVA coming up and the next EVA which comes up right after we get there on Skylab I_. And number two it's going to take awhile to gin up the procedures and we haven't got them ready yet. If and when we do decide to g o out there and try and realign the antenna manually by a man realigning it. However, it is good news that the RF part of the system seems to be worklnE all right and of course we again ran our data down-link on EREP and we'll be analyzing that data to see if there were any other anomolous things on the 193 opeTation today. Obviously we didn't take any data with the instrument we were Just running this test. And there won't be any data take anymore, in fact I suspect it won't be fired up again. I talked a second about JOP 13, which is the - the use of the ATM instruments to look at interstellar X-ray sources. And we tentatively have got that back into our Plight Plan cycle

f

SL-III Time: 9/17/73 for

PC92A/2 15:15

CDT

day-55,

which

is

a

couple

or

3

days

from

now,

and

we

are

again attempting to Flight Plan it and see how much cost it's going to cost us andlfwe can get ourselves a posture where we feel comfortable with the amount propellant in the performance Of the APCS, I'm sure going to be doing that JOP 13. This is the Skylab chance to get this co-ax i to get. So this opportunity particular target it's not let's see, we had a couple today wasn't having one END of OF X-ray source that they'd is it. It's not that available on Skylab IV. of troubleshooting things

TACS into of we're lll's last like Yesterday we did really we were console -

one one troubleshooting and one thing that troubleshooting - yesterday I told you that trouble with one of the monitors on the ATM the TAPE two that they have to look aE the Sun -

f

SL-III Time: 9/17/73

PC-92B/I 15:15 CDT

HUTCHINSON - - we did today. One troubleshooting and one thing that really wasn't troubleshooting. Yesterday I told you that we were having trouble with one of the monitors on the ATM console, one of the two that they have to look at the Sun - that the crew looks at the Sun for analysis and pointing and so on and so fort_. The monitor is now working correctly. We didn't do anything to it except turn it back on again. It turns out we're beginning to feel that problem we've experienced with it is directly connected with some kind of thermal situation in the electronics. We had the monitor turned off for an extended period of time for power considerations for a back-to-back EREP, and - day before yesterday. And when we turned it back on was when we experienced a graying in the lines in it and - or the lines in it. We're fairly certain that there's nothing wrong with the TV monitor, and indeed, we have some kind of a thermal situation there. Because it's on now and it's working properly. So that little gem is closed. One thing I - I did do - I told you a couple of days ago that we'd talk a little bit about entry. As far as the Flight Plan goes, the Flight Plan's pretty much holding up just about the way - just about the way we'd - we had it laid out a long time ago. Basically, on day 55, the same day as that JOP 13, in fact, which is 3 days from now, we'll be running some entry checks. Well, first let me back up. In case you didn't know it, yesterday, with the backup fliBht crew, we ran a full-blown entry simulation with the Skylab-lll checklist, and the thruster situation as it exists, and the single impulse maneuver, with all the ground tracking and so on and so forth that we plan - that we will have for the entry. And it went very smoothly. There weren't any changes in procedures that came out of it or anything, so we feeling very comfortable about that whole part of the sequence. We ran that with the backup crew, Vance Brand, and the control center, in parallel with the orbital operations yesterday. The next thing we've got coming up on entry is on day 55, as I mentioned. It's a thing called the minus 5-day checks, and it very simply is an exercise to go up in the CSM and power everything up we can power up. The G&N, the SCS, the optics, we'll align the platform. Of course, it hasn't been on for a long time. And make sure that we don't have any problems with any of the CSM systems we have to use for entry. Also, there's some time on that day, several hours, in fact, about 3, I guess, 2 I guess. I see here, now. Shortly after the entry minus-5 day checks, to review the procedures and at that time the crew will have some quiet time to update their deactivation

SL-III Time: 9/17/73

PC-92B/2 15:15 CDT

checklist, which we just finished the modifications for today. To make sure that we - there's going to be a few minor modifications to the entry checklist coming ups get all their documentation in line, and ask any questions. And we'll ask them any questions we have and they'll ask us any they have. And then the EVA is still all set for day 57, 2 days later. Day 58, we've got a medium Flight Plan day. You recall that we don't operate the ATM after EVA. The ATM is closed out for unattended, unmanned operations. Post EVAfilm is taken up and stowed in the CSM and the ground will be running the ATM the last 3 days of the mission, Just like we run it unmanned. Same thing we did in Skylab 2. I don't have the layout of the EVA timeline, hut I do know that there are no, currently, no extracurricular activities plannedfor the EVA. It's pretty much straight-laced, just going to go out and change the ATM film. We may take a picture of the S193 antenna. That's about it. I believe we bring back in S149. I'm not sure. I think so. Anyway, maybe tomorrow I'ii have a clearer layout of the EVA timeline. Post EVA, like I said, we'll close out the ATM panel, we'll also deactivate the EREP, and get all the EREP stuff transferred to the CSM, film and tape. Day 58, END OF TAPE

f

SL-III Time: 9/17/73

PC-92C/I 15:15 CDT

HUTCHINSON the ATM panel. We'll so deactivate the EREP and get all of the EREP stuff transferred to the CSM, film and tape. Day 58 - is the gathering of all the rest of the stuff, we have to bring home, except the refrigerated items. Blood, urine, bio samples and they are transferred into the CSM during - deactivation. Now we start deactivation on day 59 and we do it all day long, it's a 14-hour day of closing the cluster down and tomorrow I'ii give you a little run down on what gets shut off when. We have an 8 hour sleep period and then Tuesday we get up, day 60 and finish the deactivation. there's about 4-1/2 hours of work on in the workshop that last day, get into the CSM, the CDR get's into the CSM early in the morning on that last day and stays in there. The rest of the cluster is really closed out by the pilot and the SPT. Just like we did in Skylab-ll. And I did get some rough times on that final day. I give them to you in ZULU and you can subtract 5 hours or however you'd like them. Would you like them local Houston time? Make any difference, I've got them both. Okay, 9 o'clock in the morning, we will be closed out in the workshop. That's the nonimal time schedule for closeout, three o'clock in the afternoon is undocking, these times are rough now and we will have some really good ones here in the next day or two. - Retrofire and this is again approximate - is around 5 o'clock and I may be off 15 minutes on these times, I'm just giving you an nice even hour so you can get a fill for the time line, splash about an hour later, 6 o'clock Houston time. You'll notice that there's a fairly big time span, in fact 6 hours there between hatch closure and undocking. The reason for that is of course when you do a single impulse deorbit, you save yourself about 3 hours between maneuvers. You also recall that we're not doing a flyaround this time. So you save yourself another hour, so that's how come there's such a long time between finishing up in the workshop and undocking. So the day - the final day doesn't turn out to be quite as hectic in fact it's got a 4 hour slop in it, as opposed to that day on Skylab-ll, or any day when you'd be closing out with a - two impluse deorbit. And that's kind of how it stacks up. And - tomorrow, I'ii try and give you some better times and a good feel for the EVA set up. PAO QUERY take your

4-1/2

to

team

Ready for questions. Questions. Go ahead. Have you decided as yet where your going to dinner? the as

HUTCHINSON Well, (Laugh) I refuse to answer on grounds it might incriminate me. (laugh) No, - I haven't, a matter of fact. PAO Tom.

$L-III Time: 9/17/73

PC-92C/2 15:15 CDT

QUERY The splashdown had been scheduled, last schedule I saw was 5:20 Houston. HUTCHINSON Houston, time? QUERY Yes. Why has that been HUTCHINSON That may he - that may be closer to the right time, Tom. I think I - that was a - that 23:00 ZULU or 6 p.m. was - did I not add right? Yeah, I added wrong, I believe. Let me see if I got these times right, I got them down ZULU and I think I may have goofed up. No, that's right. 18:00 local. I'll get you a good time tomorrow, I - I - I was just trying to give you a gross feel for the time line and you may be right. It may be closer to 5:30 than it is to 6 o'clock. the QUERY - that they'll to be HUTCHINSON fact the last on the CDR END OF TAPE do What their will be the last scientic actual data that they data take, is that going gathering and is a medical in run

thing

The last - the last data that's done appropriately

SL-III Time: 9/17/73 (QUERY in run

PC92D/I 15:15

CDT

CONT'D) HUTCHINSON

- The

is that last -

going to be the last data

a

- gathering come

and

fact on

the last thing the CDR on day

that's done 58. Two days

appropriately, before we

is a medical home.

Day-59 is completely deactivation is deactivation and entry. Day-58 there's two rune, one on the PLT, a full set of blood and specific PAO Howard? you QUERY mentioned HUTCHINSON Just What was that briefly there? SCOX-I.

and day-60 is of course is a full medical day and one on the CDR, plus gravities on urine. JOP 13 x-ray source that

and

QUERY HUTCHINSON I'm not sure

Do you know how to spell It's literally S-c-o-X-i whet other - Itm sure it has I don't know And how did have you heard? No. What - what's them today or Yes. What Well, what they're what that

that? and that's some other do today,

-

designator, Howard, QUERY in the simulator, HUTCHINSON they QUERY were calling HUTCHINSON QUERY HUTCHINSON _

it is. Conrad run

the something

was

it llke

plenum that?

bags

are those? large gunny-sack

slze

storage containers, cloth storage containers that are used for non-biologlcal trash, by that I mean, anything that doesn't thatdoesn't generate bugs llke busted tape recorders, etc. They're called plenum bags because the area that they end up in is the plenum which is that area down underneath the floor in the bottom of the workshop. You get - you get through this little hatch in the CDR's sleep compartment take the floor up and go down in there. And there's a large expanse the dome of the tank - of the waste tank up there and a large area know exactly it's referred fairly comes

then the sides of the vehicle come up and there's in there - a man can stand up in there, I don't how - but it's a good size and it's another been to sometimes as the crotch area of the vehicle.

-

And we have a plan - have had a plan and have been storing these bags down there since Skylab II activation. We started right with Conrad's. He got about 2-1/2 or 3 bags worth of launch restraints out of the vehicle, bolts_ and nuts and packing, and so on and so forth they were put in those bags and they were put down there. The end of Skylab II when Skylab II closed out they put two more down there, that's 5 and we found out today, we haven't been keeping particular track but the Bean crew has put 3 more down there in the process of the 2 months. And I suspect that they've got 2 or 3 more that will be going down there as a part of deacti_atlon. But it's

SL-III Time: 9/17/73

PC92D/2 15:15 CDT

basically non biologically active trash. QUERY Were - were yon there - did you cut off circulations or someting; you got too much in there, is that what they were talking about? HUTCHINSON Well, yeah, actually we had a plan lald out where we would have 8 of these bags down there, 7 of them actually, and we really had been thinking about anchoring anymore than 7 up underneath the - on the floor and the rings around the dome locker underneath the rings - underneath the water tanks there you know there's a grating underneath the water tank and on second look it looks like there we can probably put quite a few more down in the plenum if we're clever about where we put them and not disrupt the air flow. You know the air flow for the whole bottom half of the cluster comes down those ducts and comes into that plenum just like a chamber and then it - the only outlets out of that area down there are the defusers in the floor of the experiment compartment that's the basic air circulation route you pump it into the plenum from theby the way that's where the word plenum comes from, it's a plenum chamber which is an air collection chamber, if you will. The air comes from the - down the three big ducts into that area and then it comes up through the floor and circulates back up to the inside of the cluster. QUERY referred to. in the command HUTCHINSON This 4 hours What are they going module? Jim, I really of slop time to be doing, don't know, that you Just sitting I I have get out a right

feeling, if the days goes very up to hatch closure and we may right when I said we did. END OF TAPE

smooth we'll probably not close the tunnel

SL-III Time: • 9/17/73

PC-92E/I 15:15 CDT

HUTCHINSON

-

-

we

get

right

up

to

hatch

closure

and we may not close the tunnel out right When I said we did - would. You know, we may keep the hatch open for - there for another hour or two. To answer your question, if the timeline goes as designed, except thatthere's about - there's a 6-hour Delta in there. There's about 2 hours worth of work to get themselves finally squaTed away and all set for undocking, and to answer your question, they would be sitting in the command module for about 4 hours with not a lot to do. QUERY Well, being a a non-early riser, I

guess what I'm getting at is - why in the world is in there, so they have to get up at some ridiculous like 2:00 a.m. ? Six is terrible, but - whole fully that

it planned hour

HUTCHINSON Yes, well, of course, the whole the deactivation sequence is laidout very, very, careand fairly tightly to get them - get everything done has to be done, with - there are small pads put in activities in that last day. Like closing system and stuff, so we don't have any glitches to get - meet the undoeking time, because a dual - two-impulse deorblt, when you run when you get to undocking time, you've got you're going to not be able to land where So the timeline was originally designed of pad in there. Now, when we cancel cancel the two-lmpulse operation, and up as a single impulse and cancel the have moved downstream the time that Now, in order to we would have had to and, you know, the go it that

to particular out the water in being able when you run any deorblt, to undock or

you wanted to land. with a small amount the deorbit - the set the - the thing fly-around, we then

we want to - that we have to undock. - to accommodate that whole sequence, change around the a lot of checklists way we sequence ahead and get makes the day kind during did. there back And are of

through things, so we Just decided to them up on time, keep the pad in there, - if I had my druthers, I'd llke to see there everytime And you'll in case recall, we in get in Skylab

a pad in deactivation.

a Jam II we

You at down

remember their the very end we there to screw me feel a in the fact

refrigeration were thinking around with

system andright about sending them some circuit breakers. frankly. would have You wanted

it makes correct

lot more that -

comfortable, that if we

to go through a pretty have jacked it around But, or got them up not to do that.

healthy procedures update we could and got the - got them up later. about on time. However, we chose

.E

SL-III Time: 9/17/73

PC-92E/2 15:15 CDT

QUERY AI got a little bit vocaltoday about the private family communications and - in fact he called it kind of unworthy of the space program or something llke that. What is the problem there? Why can't you get the good communications on the family? HUTCHINSON for that, the ground changes that involve Well, I guess we'll have to take a folks. Communications configuration a lot of coordination are hard to rap do.

And changing a basic communications mode from an S-band system to a VHF system, and back to an S-band system is not the easiest thing in the world to do. And every - about everytime we'd pull off threeor four - you know we've been doing these things regular, you know. A couple three a week, for each guy, and we Just get to pulling them off smooth, and we run into a bad night like we had last night. We had two separate failures on the ground at two separate sites. One was a procedural error, one was an equipmentfailure. The equipment failure was an air-conditioner and a VHF trailor went out and the transmitter kicked any voice up, and we have had some figuration in the vehicle. All it off minor takes and we couldn't problems with is one switch get conout

of about six or seven out of configuration, and one side of the voice, either up or down, isn't working. So, what we did today, and what I think we'll probably do for Skylab IV, in fact, I hope we do it, is we've taken and put a couple of extra steps in there when we have VHF comm and we're doing it this afternoon. We reset up those calls we blew last night for tonight. We're going to reconfigure the CSM one rev early, and we'll run a live VHF check from the control center to the the END spaceship - OF TAPE and back at the site that we're going to have

_

SL-III Time: 9/17/73

PC-92F/I 15:15 CDT

HUTCHINSON the spaceship private call maybe, we'll we'llhave to

-

VHF

check

from

the

control

center

to

and back - at the site that we're going to have the from, the rev before, on live VHF frequency. And do it better. I guarantee we'll do it better, do it better.

QUERY Isn't anything you can do about it tomorrow. QUERY Oh, well, do you have to do it that way? Why can't you just do llke the medical comm and set aside some S-band time for each guy. And run it right through the flight plan. HUTCHINSON Well, the problem with that that is, that's a very pos - distinct possibly. And that that particular possibily was considered. But the problem with that is that interfers with a normal ongoing operations and in order to maintain - by interfer, I mean that means the ground can't we can't carry on business as usual with the crew. And in order to minimize the interference to the ongoing operation and, really to accommodate a number of these calls, you know I could see we've been doing a couple of three a week per guy, we Just felt that was too much of a price to pay for - that kind of service to interfer - let it interfere with the - the regular operation. And that is the one thing that - the duel comm VHF S-band does. You know we carry on a regular "dlddy" with the other two crewmen while the private comm is going on. And with the private med, that isn't so. The control center is off the loop. that deal right. QUERY they're asking HUTCHINSON for us. - It (laugh) PAO But Well, does it make the controllers for so many - private phone calls? Oh, no. It's not. It's really no makes us sad that we don't - didn't like I said, we'll Further, questions. try harder. Thank you very unhappy big do it much.

f

/

SKYLAB

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Houston,

Skylab III Change Johnson Space Center September 19, 1973 1:23 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

Participants: Milt Windier, Flight Director John Stanley, EREP Project Engineer Charles Williams, Mgr. for EREP Engineering Bob Eisenberg, G.E. Chief Engineer, EREP Bill O'Donnell, PAO

& Technical

Integration

PC-93 f

SL-III Time: 9/19/73 PAO

PC-93A/I 13:23 CDT

Okay,

we're

ready

for

the

change

of

shift

briefing here. And we have from - beginning on my right here: Charles Williams, Manager of Engineering and Integration in EREP; Milt Windler, the off-golng Flight Director; and John Stanley, EREP Project Engineer. Milt. WINDLER Okay, we had a fairly uneventful day. My highlight was the fact that I was able to see one of those spiders who apparently is called Ado or something llke that. They all control it came. seem center, I've to start with A. But they was that sent yesterday? been away from the control have one I don't center. in the know when Well, I

was

there Monday and it wasn't there. But anyway, I'm going to go home and see if it's like all of those spiders that are hanging around my house, to see if I've got any bonlfied space spider there. But the - the crew did - what's become standard scientific day, I guess. A medical run and the first of two EREP passes. The EREP pass was over the European Countries. Starting weather was not very the French area. It over - over Isreal. type activities today, happen in the system which one of these about. Correct. SPEAKERS WINDLER WILLIAMS of problem couple of in France and ending in Israel. And the good in - the western part of this, in improved gradually and it was pretty good And then there, of course assorted ATM type but there wasn't any anything unusual areas with the exception of the S193, two gentlemen or both are golng to talk right. John, Chuck. Chuck (laugh) John has been looking into the about it and I think there is - relative to us trying to underthat we to talk tomorrow have up there. about that and - and what

-

kind is a

That's John, Okay. and talking possibilities

stand the exact nature You - I wonder John if test a little bit that we

of the problem you might want we plan to do

might expect from it. STANLEY Well, in looking at the data that we've gotten to date, it appears that the antenna control is what we've lost. We have a problem in the reference voltages and in the antenna control itself. There is a plus to minus 10 volt potentlometer that controls the - the antenna itself in roll and gimbal in - in this area here. Okay, we've lost some reference voltages in there. We don't know whether, if we've had an electronics failure, that generates these reference voltages or whether we have some contamination with in the potentiometers there at the glmbel themselves. The test tomorrow, well let me show you first. Now you can see there area. is What extensive we suspect amount at the of Mylar, moment, aluminized is is the Mylar most in this probable

f

SL-III Time: _ 9/19/73

MC-93A/2 13:23 CDT

cause of the problem, is that a piece of this aluminized Mylar got down in one of the potentlometers and is shorting out the potentlometer. So that we've lost our minus i0 volt reference. All of the symptoms we've experienced indicates that is certainly a possibility. The test that we have scheduled tomorrow is one in which we'll operate the antenna in a cross track noncontiguous MODE. Such that It'll Jar or shake the antenna in hopes it'll move this contamination. Either remove it from the systems, so it operates properly or moves it - to some other location so we can verify that that's where it is. And if it - if we can verify that's where it is and it does not come out of the systems_ come out of the potentlometer area_ what we would do in the future - during future time was - is to determine maybe how we can clean it with an EVA procedure. Or - or run another pass to try and shake it out again. I don't know if that That's about all I can - about all I can think of. PAO QUERY could be it to short END OF TAPE Okay, we're ready for questions. You said you believe now, possibly some Mylar or something contaminating that out. Suppose it's something more serious, Paul. perhaps and causing that -

f

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC93B/I 13:23 CDT

QUERY You said that you believe now, possibly, perhaps could be some Mylar or something contaminating that and causing it to short out. Suppose it's something more serious - is it possibly that you suggest EVA can clean out the Mylar. Could they possibly replace any of the broken hardware that could cause this? EVA wise? WILLIAMS Well, a more serious problem would be a loss of the electronics down in the - the body of the instrument. And if we lost the electronics down there_ there would be no repair. We would then - there would be no repair to restore full use of the antenna. What we would then do is to possibly perform an EVA and position the antenna in a local Nadir or a stabilized condition, such that we could go ahead and use the altimeter mode on the antenna. See, it's very erratic now in it's operation. In fact, A1 Bean reported at one time that it was banging the forward and aft stops. It's just not controlable without that reference voltage. So we could possibly, by EVA, go in and place a pin - it's actually a long slot pin - in the instrument and lock it then so that we could use it in local Nadir. That - that would mean basically that we would get the kind of data that we'd expected to get in flight. However, we'd have to manipulate it quite a bit more in order to understand where local vertical really was. QUERY You would get the data you expected; the radiometer and scatterometer - WILLIAMS No, I said from the altlmeter. QUERY All right, from the altimeter. All right so you would lose the radiometer and scatterometer. Right? WILLIAMS No, not necessarily. You would be able to get the - the radiometer portion of the data. In fact, it would be reasonably good radiometer. As far as the scat is concerned, it would be a catch-as-catch can because of the range gate situation as far as zero is concerned. QUERY (garble) the capability (garble). WILLIAMS You'd lose the capability of taking data at any other position except nadir. Data at nadir would still be perfectly valid. So the scatterometer and radiometer which had mapping modes by way of the - by virtue of the various scans, would now only take data at nadir, but they're still fully operational. PAO Paul. QUERY Okay, obviously the - you designed in the movement of the antenna for some particular reason. If you can't move it you're going to lose something. Now, what are

f

SL-III Time: 9/19/73 iyou

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losing? WILLIAMS I'm sorry, I didn't catch it. WINDLER Well, what theytre asking is what we lose because now we're locked in a local nadir position and we've losted the ability to scan out to the 12 degrees on either side of nadir and the fore and aft 48 degrees. WILLIAMS Well, one of the major portions of the experiment was the ability to layer, if you please, like stacking a group of pancakes, patterns from fi_e different major angles, starting out at 48 this data correlated with respect that part of the experiment. degrees, to each and seeing how other. We'll lose

WINDLER Yeah, let us not mislead you. When we have to lock up this antenna in local nadir position, we are losing a significant amount of the capability of the instrument. Now, wetre - we're losing the ability to do the scan off track. QUERY Okay, you're not going to be able to scan to the left and right in effect if you're going to lock it in, so what type of data are you losing? Are you going to lose that that would - which, if you could have gotten it, would have told you what? In other words, are you losing your heating sensing data or something ,ha,would help you in your geology studies or your hydrology or land use or what precisely? WINDLER We'll lose considerable data that we'd like to have, relative to understanding the ocean, wave heights, understanding that would be from the scatterometer, we would lose these forward looking angles and side looking angles where we would get the - the brightness, temperature, and understand the state of - the state of the sea. QUERY (garble) SPEAKER Well, I -END OF TAPE

_-

SL-III Time: 9/19/73 Well, thing that

PC93C/I 13:23 CDT

I - Earnie you want to add - would you like to add someto that. WILLIAMS The - the greatest part of the information was to be obtained from the instrument was a relative

magnitude of these parameters that you're measuring with respect to the antenna angle and with respect to the Cstate conditions we're looking at. So, obviously when you loose the ability to move the antenna either in pitch or roll, you lose the ability to distinguish the difference in these measurements at those angles. The the information on the altimeter as far as altitude is concerned which is highly prized by the scientificcommunity for mapping the geoid will still be perfectly valid as will the portlonof the altimeter experiment thatdetermines what the return pulse from the earth looks like which in turn is a function of the condition of the sea, in the radlometer/scattermeter the biggest loss is the ability to differentiate the information versus angle versus the C-state that you're looking at. So your zero degree dataas I said is still valid hut then you have no data of the other angles to see the effect on. PAO Tom, you have a question? QUERY I - I had something on the film. PAO Anybody else, good. QUERY I take it from what you said that only oceanographic information will be affected by this? I want get an answer if that's right or wrong then I want a followup. WILLIAMS No, sir, that is wrong. It's not just oceanographic information that would be affected. QUERY Well, how about giving me a llst of what else will be affected? the WILLIAMS Can you list those for us? SPEAKER The instrument is capable of making it's specific measurements over ocean or over land. The orginal prodiment intent was to get the oc - the data over the ocean areas, there is use in the data over land and you lose the same basic abilities you then can't get the relative magnitudes over land because you can't scan either. WINDLER Yeah, I think he wants to know use this instrument quite a bit in looking down on the clouds for the in the frontal systems, and thesevere weather; those types of things, don't you. And also isn't it important in the studies of the snow, and ice. WILLIAMS We're - we are transparent to most most weather conditions except for severely water ladden clouds and in the area you mentioned as far as sea or land ice coverage, you'll lose that whether it was over land or sea, - WINDLER But - but that's the thing he's interested
f"

_

to

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC3C/2 13:23

CDT

in getting the answer to I think he's talking about applications that is used for llke - llke the - SPEAKER Moisture content things of that We would lose - -

the nature.

SPEAKER Any information thatls obtained in the earth portions as opposed to the ocean portions would be affected by the lack of scan capability to the - SPEAKER No, I think well QUERY Well, you do - you do the same information you lose in the ocean do you lose in all other earth resources areas? SPEAKER SPEAKER SPEAKER you Mr. it's SPEAKER know there's Williams can Yes sir, yes. Yes. In other words Only this experiment one experiment that has still describe there's no the failure impact the

SPEAKER It's a combined 3 part experiment but got I number. SPEAKER Well, if you will, the S193 is identified as i experiment although it has 3 experiments inherent in the i antenna, in the one designed. And what we're losing is the ability to scan off of nadir, the ability to look out at plus or minus 12 degrees, or plus or minus 48 degrees, depending on the mode that it's in. The same thing with looking down track, we lose that capability. QUERY Well, can you put a number on the percentage loss of data that can be expected if from now S193 can't be used except in nadir? SPEAKER Well, let me try and put a number on what let's say what we've done so far. SPEAKER You've already obtained SPEAKER We've already obtained 80 percent, approximately 80 percent of the radi - radiometer and scattermeter objectives that were set out at the beginning of the Skylab program. We've also obtained 50 to 60 percent of the altimeter objectives, what we have not obtained is some very rough oceans with the altimeter. And those can be run in the local nadir that's sort Tell END QUERY me what OF TAPE with the of where you antenna we are. what all pointing are you dlrectly going to down. loose, So, then?

Well, could -

F

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

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WINDLER QUERY then? Tell me you apparently do you - what's of loss? SPEAKER Probably we'll that we'd llke

- -

there's

sort

of

where

we

are.

What are you - what are you going to loose what you could - you know all during SL-IV, were planning to use these instruments, so what - what are we going to - give me the percentage Well, use roughly to have as we'll give 20 percent far as the you a ball park number. of - of the objectives scatterometer is concerned.

_

WINDLER Let me point out one other thing too about the - we talked about the EVA and what might be done there. Of course, there's a lot of work that has to be done in - in looking at failure MODEs and procedures andthlngs like that before we know EVA pads even. Before you know how effective you could operate on - or do something with the instrument and that - that's a ways off before we - in fact I'd probably venture to say there probably hadn't been any serious consideration given to thatuntil they try this - motion test. To see if it perhaps is - something to dowith Mylar that might be simple to dislodge or something llke that. SPEAKER That's great. QUERY A - I'm sorry to keep hugging y'allabout this hut I think all the newsmen have set out here for literally hours and listen to the - the experts praise the wonders of EREP and I - I wouldcertainly hope we could getequally detailed answers to thewhen we have an EREP failure. At now my - my question is - this thing detects - one of these devices detects heat over land or - land andoceans, are you going to loose the ability to - locate geothermal hot spots or - to detect - thermal pollution in water, - both of which where highly praisedby previous briefers. Are you going to - how far off the the ground track are you going to be able to gather information? In other words, if you miss a target by - Just few miles is that target not going to be able to get anything on it with this instrument? Things llke this. WINDLER He wants to know the antenna pattern (garble) MS (garble) SPEAKER Yeah, what the current (garble) what the antenna beam width is. SPEAKER Roughly 6 miles in diameter QUERY 6 miles, okay. SPEAKER At the nadir position the - the spaclal resolution of the antenna pattern is roughly 6 nautical miles circle. Obviously at the off track - at the off nadir positions you cover more area. The - the loss of data is in the relative magnitudes temperature scattering of those as it's coefficient measurements, called or the of the the radiometric brightness reflection coefficient the that your looking at at

-

surface

F

_-

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC-93D/2 13:23 CDT

various angles. Now those those parameters are highly dependent on the sea state or the state of the ground you're looking at. It's roughness, in the sea, the wind speed the currents, things on that order. The - the radiometer, I don't think was every intended for looking for thermal pollution or things like that in the in the (garble) areas or the river outlets. It's - It's measurement of radiometlc brightness temperature of the target it's looking at is a function of the (garble) of the target, roughness of the target and the things in that area. So for a sea state monitor, as your seas get rougher and rougher and you generate foam and whitecaps your apparent radiometric temperature goes up. You'll still be able to sense that at nadir, when you won't be able to sense it at the larger off nadir angles, which would be more incident in rougher seas, have more incidents inrougher seas. So the - the thermal pollution obJecives of EREP are going to accomplished by a lot of the photographic and the infrared spectrometry experiments, not by the S193. QUERY When this - scatterometer is scanning, as designed, what kind of pass do you have? As far as miles are concerned, if it's only 6 at nadir what is it at normal? SPEAKER The - I'm not sure of the exact number there. There's a photograph available, that gives the - the maximum swaths of these - that this instrument can accomplish. I believe it's in the - in the MODE that swings it the most across left and right of track, it's close to i00 miles wide, the total coverage. With each cell, with in that swath, being as wide as the antenna beam would be when projected at that angle on the ground but the total from one side of the arc to the other side of the arc coverage would be almost a i00 miles. WINDLER That's probably pretty fair, I think - that's the answer your really looking for is that, your talking about instead, your going to get the instruments working okay, it's just one of the main factures is the antennas is the painting a window that's 6 miles wide instead of a i00. QUERY Yeah. is END QUERY concerned OF TAPE Well then Milt as far as flight planning

_

f

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC 93E/I 13:23 CDT

WINDLER QUERY planning is concerned, to take pictures on the EVA?

...

instead

of

a

hundred. far as flight are yon going Is that on

Yeah, well in - Milt, as if yon - first of all, this EVA of that antenna?

WINDLER Well, right now we don't have plans to do that, but that's not to say that it couldn't be done if it's if it's useful. And as I say, if anybody has looked at EVA pass to it, I'm not aware of it. And it may have been done, but it's not in the very easily accessible place as far as the normal activity is concerned. But that's not to say - I Just don't know whether we could get down there or not, but we'll be talking about that in the next day. QUERY Okay, if the test tomorrow doesn't help this thing at all, in other words it's still banging around out there, would you conclude the mission with the assumption that it's - that it's gone? WINDLER Well, we've only got two more EVA I mean EREP's scheduled for Skylab-III, anyway. That's the one that's going on this after at 3, counting the one that's happening this afternoon. So it's not going to have a big effect gives on the EREP us a couple operation of months for here Skylab-III. to decide And what to this do obviously between now

_-

and - that may be able to be done during EVA or even electronically they'll freeze the antenna, I don't know. The guys that work on the equipment always come up with a trick or two that makes things that appear to be lost able to take data. So I'm sure he'll think of something if he has to. He Just doesn't want to think real hard until after he does his test tomorrow. QUERY test tomorrow is not The test tomorrow will will not not mean mean that the If the failure

successful,

in not where we suppose it to be. It will mean that we Just - if it is there, we were not successful in clearing it. SPEAKER Do you want to follow up on that? SPEAKER Yeah, I was Just going to say that that's based on the assumption that it's contamination in the first place. SPEAKER Yes, it is. SPEAKER Yes. WINDLER perspective. it that way already than we This out of I think that is one instrument, - out of several more out Let's don't get this out if you want to consider in the EREP area. We've to this and I. point We are of

gotten a great deal had expected to get

information of Skylab-II

f

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC 93E/2 13:23 CDT

down to the point now, in fact, I'd hate to put a percentage number on it. We sometimes mislead people in both - both directions on numbers. But we have passed the point at which we get most of the - of the Earth Resources data, Just because of the fact that the prime interest is in the growing season in the summer time. We had planned on Skylab-IV to be looking at - at some conditions that are unique to the - to the late fall and winter. One has been mentioned: severe storms which are prevalent in the Atlantic and North Atlantic and things llke that. Of course, ice and snow cover, we're interested in trying to find out about, hut let's remember that we do have the other EREP instruments going for us, so we've got, you know, it in perspective that this is not going to destroy by any means the value of the Earth Resources experiments. They've already gotten a large amount of data to - to go on and build light pieces of equipment that are better in the future, plus that we have these other ones to work with us - work with on Sky lah-l_. I think we had another question about a different subject I guess. QUERY On the - the EVA Saturday, can you do you have a firm timelins; and what else is going to be done besides a film changeout? Can you detail the other - other tasks? WINDLER We - I don't have what you probably would consider a firm time llne. I'ii be able to give that to you tomorrow night, I would expect. The task that we're going to be doing will be dusting off another particle off of the - the S052 instrument. As you recall we did that in Skylab-ll. We'll be bringing in a - a sample I guess you'd call it, off the $230 instrument. We have a sail sample that's fastened to one of the struts; we'll be bringing that in. And then the - that S149 that's got the panel stuck on it, we'll close that up and bring that inside. The S149. I helleve_ and then, of course, the film you already mentioned. And I think that pretty well concludes it. The only other thing that's unique about this EVA - we will be using gas cooling, and maybe that's been mentioned to you, I'm not sure. I - END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC93F/I 13:23 CDT

WINDLER - - a - we will be using gas cooling and maybe that's been mentioned to you, I'm not sure, I've been gone but anyway the primary method of cooling in the past has been the water cool garments with some gas cooling from the oxygen system hut we do not plan to use that on this EVA, the liquid cool garment. We'll he using the gas flow and so that will be different and for that reason we will spend a little more time installin E the instrumentation on the crew members and we will be working out the times that which we have to run the instrumentation checkout prior to putting on the suit. It will be more similar to perhaps the way the Apollo lunear EVAs were, in the sense that they'll be suiting up and getting a verification of the instrumentation prior to actually donning the suit itself. QUERY How about giving us a kind of walk through on that cold fire test tomorrow and the time on it. SPEAKER Oh, I SPEAKER The time (garble) SPEAKER I'm sorry I can't do that. I didn't brin E the summary Flight Plan it may be over here now, it is blocked out as part of the checks, but I don't know the time on that. QUERY Bobby Riggs SPEAKER QUERY it's in? in Just - (Chuckle). Could you tell us what part of the day for those of us that are interested

WINDLER Well, it's flict with Bobby and Billie Jean, the crew is the crew's Bedtime

I don't think it will conbecause of course you know now is about 6 o'clock in

the evening and that - when is that - that match is 8 o'clock or something - when is that. QUERY Well, they're going to start at noon. SPEAKER Oh, they are? QUERY No, no, not Bobby and Billy but - SPEAKER Oh, (chuckle). QUERY The celebrity match. WINDLER Oh, okay, I didn't realize it was going to start that soon. (Laughter), I read an article about several you know - one of the papers that competed against Bobby, seem to have no trouble in beating them. But anyway, they weren't tennis reporters, (chuckle) I - I don't know exactly when that time is. One of them is fairly early in the morning, especially in the Houston morning. QUERY How bout Just telling us how the test will be conducted. Who'll do what and or do you know that? WINDLER No I don't. Phil Shaffer has been working on those haven't been can find out procedures with the entry time line and I really following them to tell you the truth. And we though, he's over in the Control Center now.

f

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC93F/2 13:23 CDT

And - what if you can tell kind of specific information the - -

us

a little you want

bit we'll

more try

about what to get it before

QUERY Well, would it be kind of Just a switch touching WINDLER Yeah, it - you know last, I'm sorry go ahead with your question. QUERY Well, that's Just it what - switch touching is SPEAKER It's not going to be as elaborate as it was last time because we did try to go through a slmmulatlon last time and found out that actually the time spent on the entry simulation as such turned out to be not very beneficial with respect to the hours that were spent. The crew wound up waiting long periods of time and this is going to be an abbreviated type operation and primarily it's going to be a review of all the many pages of checklist information that we've sent up to them. A sort of, if you want to call it something a question and answer period, they've - they had to make oh, untold numbers, in fact they were telling me that they thought that they sent a - set a record last night in sending up teleprinter messages, they figure they sent 50 feet up and a lot of it, the vast majority of it had to do with the entry checklist changes. So that's the things in fact I was looking here there's 2 or 3 hours set up here. Now from ii to 14:00 are the entry minus 5 day checks. And that's in so that's to 9 o'clock. (Whistle), (chuckle), that's from 6 o'clock in the morning to about 9 or i0, that's a little after, 14:00 so it looks llke it'll be over in plenty of time for the celebrity matches tomorrow. Did you want to know exactly what the crew's going to be doing, itts really Just a real limited procedures check if you want to call it that. NothlnE like it was on Skylab II. QUERY Milt, could you explain to us what they're going to do in this cold firing as far as testing the - those thruster? SPEAKER Well, you said cold firing, and I'ii have to confess that I'm not really sure that they're going to cold fire the Jets. And if somebody said they are l'm sure that's the case. But primarily they're going to check the GNS system and Just verify that the systems are okay, on the command module but there's a big debate over how far you can go with all that and you can take one side that says well you need to be realistic as possible but then that put stress on the equipment and when you get through 5 days from now you still don't know whether it's you know - function again or not. So we generally that have adopted the philosophy real long lead times of like doln E a check on the if there's a problem things with

SL-III Time: f 9/19/73

PC93F/3 13:23 CDT

- with the computer or something like that we'd like to know about that early in the game. But the hardware that's generally speaking is relatively simple we don't - we don't try to stress it anymore than we can especially since you know the RCS system is giving us trouble early in the mission anyway and we - nobody wants to put their high pressures on any sooner than they have to. END OF TAPE

f_

r

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC-93G/I 13:23 CDT

anyway sooner they work,

WINDLER and than QUERY

we they

- given us trouble early in the mission no body wants to put high pressures on any have too. Milt, this is a real iffy question. If and QUADs A & C don't

-

get in this CSM on next Tuesday - what happens then? and WINDLER Well QUERY the exact been weeks, Cape status that but is

about

We haven't heard anything in of the rescue vehicle and -

a I

long know

time in it.

there has in several And

- that hasn't been planned on and we haven't heard much - much about the old saying, "that no

what the WINDLER

doing. You know

news it

is good news." And I guess that's the case here. To start off with Zhe vehicle was brought up to a state of readiness and was stop short of installing some of the propellants, so I don't know how many days it would take from where we are to get it ready to go. Precisely, but the - potential hardware failures or systems failures have been reviewed, oh some weeks ago now, whenever we - we first had the - the problems with the RCS system. We checked out to our satisfaction the procedures for the next - two failures in fact, the complete loss of the Quads that you mentioned and - determine that through the simulator here, at the centerj the command module simulator that adequate control measures were available to allow us to even - not only to enter under the condition that we have now but even if we had these subsequent failures. So of course going thing. this all went into the decision not to with the rescue vehicle preparation and And the Skylab-III backup crew, who - not to that sort are also keep of the

Skylab-IV backup crew did in a simulation a couple of three days ago, perhaps it was Sunday, I'm not sure exactly what day it was now, did go through the reentry procedures that will be followed for the reentry and found out in Phil's words that it was a piece of cake. It there was just - there was no trouble at all in accommodating or the entry under the conditions have wound up with - with a couple and time for the entry day, since in the premlssion or preundocklng changed bought pretty JOP about and the us about good QUERY shape entry is a single 3 extra hours. for getting Can you and It the Well, time it So the reentry under the that we have. In fact, we of hours with extra pad the crew wake up in the timeline has not been impluse we we entry think why, that's we're in for and

ready for run through it's occurs

the the

entry. procedures be and etc? - 8 o'clock I

13, tomorrow WINDLER 10:30.

going to between getting

really

starts

exciting,

guess

F

SL-III Time: 9/19/73 as and we -

PC-93G/2 13:23 CDT

as

we

go

around it

the consist

-

the of a

back

side

or to a

the a

dark predeter-

side

essentially

maneuver

mined attitude using the star the instrument that we know of which probably research on it that's world,

and yon verify your - your attitude errors by tracker. And we're actually going to point at what is one of the strongest x-ray sources in the solar system. A body called SCOE X-I means more to y'all if y'all have done a little than it does to me. But it is an object of interest say, I want to the - to the physic to say solar physics there. and then pick we up we but

of a great deal I guess you want

not - obviously not the we hold that long enough back to - to a solar at the next daylight drift off of not very much the during of

exact relationship to take the data attitude and And of course

But anyway we come the Sun would 2 or and 3 degrees we'd

inertial cycle.

the attitude the course of

somewhat perhaps the maneuver back Sun business it sensors. at the

pick this up easily we're back in - in daylight cycle. that useful mention END OF QUERY this would

with the the solar

acquisitions inertial

And next

In the contribute mission 210

alr-to-ground, some operational for being foot seconds

was data

mentioned that will they also it is -

be

in the last it's costing TAPE

Kohoutec and or whatever

if

SL-III Time: 9_!9/73

PC93H/I 13:23 CDT

QUERY for 210

... will

be

useful

in

the

last

mission

Is to

viewing Kohoutek. And they also mentioned it's costing foot seconds, or whatever it is, QUERY Pound seconds. QUERY ... pound seconds to get in that attitude. the quantity of TACS going to be a factor in the ability view Kohoutek?

WINDLER I'm sure it will be. Of course, as you recognize - I don't know where to start with all your questions. Let's go with your TACS first; these unusual, if you want to call them that, maneuvers do - do tend to cost TACS as you well know, and fortunately though, the comet occurs late in the mission, it's the - mission Skylab-lV is being extended, so presumably we will be there at a maximum margin of TACS. So we'd have our greatest capability. You're probably aware of the fact that the TACS budget is predicated on a command control moment gyro failure. And of course, every day that we have that we don't have a failure and still maintain our three CMG operation, builds up our - our reserve you might call it. So we anticipate having certainly adequate TACS to support that part of the operation, no problem there. Now, the the value of the JOP 13 maneuver - It's very similar to the fac - to the maneuvers that are required to point at the comet, in the sense that we have essentially, really Just one basic mode of operation concleved for the Skylab, and that was to always be solar inertial and have the spacecraft always pointed directly at the Sun; the solar panels et cetera. Now, subsequent to the initial design, of course, we got the Earth Resources equipment was - was concieved and the concept for a - a maneuver that pointed the spacecraft at the Earth was needed, and the equipment was - was built to do it or modified, you might say, to do it. Now, from where we were then, you couldn't always make it as precise as you'd like or do everything that you'd llke to have done if you'd started out from scratch. And the same thing is true when you consider having to - to point the whole Skylab off to some completely off nominal, you might say, neither - neither in this mode of pointing directly at the Earth, or pointing at the Sun. It does pose you some problems in attitude and control and it does require this extra TACS usage. It also introduces some attitude errors. Now the solar equipment, or solar instruments I should say, are - are designed with fairly small fields of view in order to really pick out the details on the Sun, and this works to an advantage when you're looking at small events on the Sun, but it works to a dlsadvantaEe when you're trying to - to hold them on a body llke the comet.

,f

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PCgSH/2 1S:23 CDT

So we have done a test in the past to see what the what the errprs were and I'd like to point out to the people that built the equipment that it was the actual equipment as it's constructed and as it performed is far - far superior to the to the specs that were put on it. It's it's performing very well. But even as such, it's - does pose some problems in trying to get these small - these instruments with the small fields of view on - on an object llke the comet. And so we're interested in seeing how good it does attract the x-ray source on the JOP 13. That's a long answer to your questions. Probably overdid it; I'm sorry. QUERY Milt, I understand that you have a lot of confidence in A and C quads, but my question was; when or if they don't do their thing when they're supposed to, and the crew is sitting there and waiting to come home, and they don't - they can't - they can't come home in that CSM, if that happens, you know, what happens then? WINDLER Well, you said two things that don't really fit together. First of all, if A and C quads don't work the procedures are already onboard to perform the entry; and we would go ahead and do that. Now, I guess if you're going to suppose that we have some additional failures that keep us up there, then we would stay until the rescue vehicle was - the preparations were completed on it and we launch it. And I'm sorry, I Just don't know the - the number of days thatit takes. From where we are now, of course, it's less than it was when we started working on the vehicle because it's it's, you might call it maximum state of readiness. QUERY Okay, the thing that I'm not familiar with are what are those - the other procedures that are onboard if we have those - END OF TAPE

f

SL-III Time: 9/19/73

PC931/I 13:23 CDT

(SPEAKER CONT'D) I'm not familar with what are those - the other procedures that are onboard - if we have those the (garble). WINDLER Okay, well using of course the onboard command module computer and the two remaining quads and the command module RCS system, we can control the attitud_ and also, of course, the service propulsion system which has a control capability of its own. Itts rather - I wouldn't want to say that it's gross but with the - with the gimbaling capability that it has, you - you can control it as it burns. But we can, using a combination of all these we can do adequate thrust spectercontrol andof course conclude the entry. PAO END OF TAPE Any more questions? Thank you very much.

f

SKYLAB

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Houston,

Skylab III - JOP-13 Johnson Space Center September 20, 1973 12:00 p.m. CDT

Briefing

Participants: Dr. AI Kreiger, Amos Crisp, PAO Principal Scientist S054

PC-94

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PAO Okay_ wetre ready for a press conference, and we have with us Dr. A1 Krleger, who is Principal Scientist for SO54. And I would like to point out that the name is spelled K-r-l-e-g-e-r, which I think the i and the e were transposed on the television screen. We'll start off then with a statement from Dr. Krleger. loops Just what for are KRIEGER There's been a lot of talk on the that yon might have caught lately about JOP 13, and I thought I'd try to explain exactly what JOP 13 is and we're trying to do. First of all, JOP is our acronym Joint Observing Program, and Joint Observing Programs

the way that ATM observations are scheduled. Each Joing Observing Program is a major ATH scientific objective which has various parts to it. It denotes a series of ATM operations and JOP 13 is entitled observations of celestial objects. Now JOP 13 is divided into 2 parts, one of which is observations of X-ray objects, and ultraviolet objects. this morning, for the me other part is The observation was last night. observations that we ran I was up of extreme last - or until 4 and That's Basicthe

it

just got up about an hour ago, but for some of you it might be today. Anyway, was SCO-X 1 which is an X-ray source. why Itm here because my instrument is the grazing incidence X-ray telescope, the SO54 grazing incidence X-ray telescope. ally, SCO-Xl is the brightest X-ray source in the sky. It

was

first discovered in 1961, but it remains, to this time, very enigmatic. The nature of SCO-Xl is really very hard to define. There are lots of models which explain some of the other X-ray sources that exist, but we really don't have a good model at this time for SCO-Xl. In other words, I can tell you a lot of things it's not, but I can't tell you what it one of the major problems in X-ray astronomy has finding the precise location of the X-ray source is. Now, always been so that you

can look at it with optical and radio telescopes and get somemore information about it so that you can find out what the X-ray source is. Now, the X-ray telescopes are, of course, very good for that kind of thing, but in the past from rockets we just haven't had the time above the atmosphere to be able to take a photograph of an X-ray source with an X-ray telescope. the first brightest counterpart, had And the So, source source, or JOP 13 on ATM was that we decided namely SCO-Xl. proposed optical designed to do that. Now, to look at was, of course, SCO-XI does have an optical counterpart, and so we of where to point. aside from taking object. What we'll the

a pretty fair what we'll be first photograph

idea of what we would doing here is two things of a celestial X-ray

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be doing is we'll be measuring its flux in the 3 to 60 angstrom. What we have done actually, since we did it last night - is to measure its flux in the 3 to 60 angstrom wave band and to refine the location. The - the X-ray previously the X-ray location is only good to, oh, maybe about a minute of arc and now we'll be able to get that down to Just about i0 seconds of arc, maybe even a little better than that. Because of the fact that there's there is an identified optical cou _erpart we don't really expect a big surprise, although I must admit it would be really exciting if there were a sur _ise and it weren't identical as what everyone has thought it was. That's about it. start PAO over here with Okay, Art. let's open it for questions. We'll

QUERY So, what would you look like? And when you say there are mean that you expect it to be precisely counter END OF TAPE

expect the no surprises what your

image to does that optical

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(QUERY CONT'D) so what would you expect the image to look llke and when you say there's no surprises does that mean that you expect it to be precisely what your optical counterpart is? SPEAKER No, well or - let me put it this way let me answer that in two parts first. And the second part - the first part will tell what surprise we're sort of hoping for. If the - if Skylab didn't drift or jitter at all then what we would expect would be a little dot on the film. Now by measuring the location of that dot with respect to the fiducial marks on the - on the film, we could locate precisely where in attitude the sky control the soource system of was. Now, the vehicle fortunately is not perfect the all

gyros have noise and try their So instead the cour _ that point sort of a SCOX-I is line will llne, see. _-

a little bit of drift in them just due to electronic mechanical torques and various things. The engineers best to get rid of those but nature is there. - the spacecraft will drift of the source during - during the course of the JOP 13 pointing and so will not be Just a little dot, rather it would be long - sort of straggerly line. Now, if in fact - has some pulsations in it for example, then that not be a sire - a solid llne it would be a dotted we fact the kind that it of thing will be we a could

for example. That would As it is because of the

line we can get some idea of the flux at so - in because of the fact that it is a line we can get of the flux _ a function of time. But the main

other reason some idea thing we're that the

trying to do on this one is to measure the flux in the three to sixty angstrom wave lengthband. Some of the other sources we'll be doing on SL IV our major objective will be to locate source precisely. As I say we pretty well know where SCOX-I is, that's why we decided to do that one first. QUERY The little dot on the film is caused by x-rays. Right? SPEAKER Yea. QUERY do you know x-ray source SPEAKER that or is And what that No, you you a you said a proposed is have optical what a you object is fair the idea see optically don't. You

pretty

I think almost everyone would be willing to bet a six-pack on that. The point is the following: that - a couple of years, an experiment was done with a device called the modulation collimator which gives you several possible positions for asources, lines of positions for a sources on the sky. One of those lines of position the most likely had two stars in it. Various optical people then looked at SCOX-I, looked at these two stars along with the (garble) while the (garble) satellite was looking at SCOX-I in x-rays,

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SL-III Time: 9/20/73 and they variation ness of in fact

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noticed that from one of in SCOX-1 coincides with the star and so that pretty that star _ and star should

these stars the time variations of the brightwell tells you that be in quotation marks

because it's not an ordlnary star by any means, what it is I can't tell, but I can tell you it's not an ordinary star. The brightness of that blue pointllke object varied along with the x-ray source so it's pretty well defined but the x-ray source is associated with that star. What we'd llke to see is fact off a that it's exactly in the same place or whether to one side, something like that. QUERY This optical object quote star; single body it's not big galaxy or some sort? SPEAKER No, it's not it's not - it's it's in it was a ordinary it is not surrounds it a _ '

in it,

external galaxy they knew that it was just an

our galaxy. Before that - before strong x-ray enmitter, they thought old 13 magnitude star of which if

you look up at the sky with a telescope you can see such object with the naked eye. If you look up at the sky with a telescope you see oh, maybe a million similar beast in the sky, but then they discovered that unlike the other - END OF TAPE

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KKEIGEK

-

of

the

naked

eye.

If

you

look

up

at

:_

the sky with a telescope you'll see) oh maybe a million similar beast in the sky. But then they discovered that unlike the other - 999,000 and so on, this one is the strongest x-ray emitter around. But the brightest x-ray emitter at the earth. QUERY Could give us the feel for how far we had to rotate the spacecraft to get there and did we have any trouble finding that star? KREIGER No) the maneuver went amazingly smoothly. The - ground people before hand in there calculations and analysis of the maneuver did a superb job and Owen was able to follow the pads with relative ease and we got right over to the object with very little difficulty at all, in fact, the prediction as to the TACs usage, the CMG momentum and so on was right on - closer on than they had expected it would be. The - the maneuver was 66 degrees in the Y axis and 25 degr _s in the X axis. In other words the vehicle was pointing towards the sun and we rolled it - I guess to the side and then up. QUERY What is it that makes SCO X the so unusual? Is it just the intensity of the x-rays? Are there other objects that - I Just don't understand why they - why there wouldn't be other objects exhibiting a similar pattern. KREIGER Well, there are at the present time, there about 2 hundred million x-rays sources. That number changes from day to day. (laugh) The - and most of them fall into one of five or six categories but SCO Xl does not. Just for your information the five or six categories are: distant galaxies, quazars, super Nova remmants close splneries, one member of which is the - a compact star like either a neutron star or a black hole. Let's see what else, pulsars (laugh) SCO-Xl is none of those things and it's also the brightest. That's - in fact the thing that made - the thing that's really the first thing that anyone thinks about it. What makes it none of those things is the fact that if you look at all of these other objects you find particular characteristics. For example, extrenal galaxies, you find first they are very high galactic latitudes, second, when you look in that direction you find that external galaxy which is a very strong radio emitter, you find that the optical galaxy has particular characteristics which indicate it's undergoing an explosion of some kind. Most of those are very radioactive galax - radio-active not radioactive (laugh) Very active radioemltters. Many of them are (garble) very obvious (Laugh) in neutron Pulsars or well characteristic, the (garble) SCO are members of it's pulsars they go beep Xl doesn't. binery pairs, have beep Black and a beep holes or beep and beep.

stars

compact

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bineries which are one member which neutron star or binery pairs and so they rotate which gives them a fast fast plus satlon rate then they have on top of that occulted when in to produce characteristics about It's but it's which is due to the they pass behind the the x-rays. In other of the sou _e, you

maybe a black hole that you see the frequency osolation, a slower sinusoidal

or there rate

-

rotation and they get star whose mass is falling words from - usually from can tell a heck of a lot of those It categories. It fluxuates Itts analyze. although

the

it. But SCO-Xl doesntt not associated with the it doesn't have the brightest, theoretician or 3 models a regular it's one a

fit any supernova.

plusation period. of the hardest to of mine SCO-XI

You know_ with - 2 (laugh) MS PAO Are I

friends day for

have you know come up and none of them work.

(laughter) Let's go going

to

Howard. any TV there come out of his unique, this today?

QUERY is some KREIGER guess not. QUERY been OF TAPE

Did ya - did to come down? I see Jack

back

shaking is so - -

head, has

(Laugh) any Since speculation SCO-Xl is so that perhaps

there END

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QUERY Well, since SCO-XI is so unique, has there been any speculation that perhaps that the source is not natural but some sort of artifact? KRIEGER No, there hasn't, other than the fact that every once and a - you know, everyone always jokes about little green men, you know, when pulsars first came out, that was suggested. The point is that the - we don't know exactly how much power SCO-XI emits because we don't know exa _ly how far away it is. And, you know, you can measure something's brightness at Earth, but then you have to take it back to the source by the inverse square law in order to figure out how much power itvs emitting. So, without knowing how far away it is we don't know exactly how much power to emit. But we know that as close as it possibly could be, the power density emitted must be very, very, very, high. And if it is an artifactive intelligent life, they're not very intelligent because they would be fried immediately. The power density is just too high for it to be anything but a natural object. QUERY In that case you're saying that there ought to be other SCO-XI's around but nobody's found them or - SPEAKER Well, there probably are. As I said, there are 200 X-ray sources at least, or more than 200 now, I'm not sure the exact number of sources in the present (garble) catalog, they keep revising it. But not all of these have been studied. Many - most of the ones that have been studied fall into these 5 or 6 general broad categories of sources, but not all have been studied. There are some that are as enigmatic as SCO-XI. This is a class of object that at the moment we just don't understand. QUERY Will you, from the Skylab pictures, be able to determine the distance this object is? Do you hope to do that? Does the object go through any kind of an analogous thing to the red shift or something like that? KRIEGER No, it doesn't because it's within our galaxy. So, you don't have it's not receding at a tremendous velocity that would give you a red shift. What you do see though, and this measurement has - will be - it's something we can get out of our data but it's already been done, so it's not really true to say that we'll be the first to do it. You can measure the wavelength at which the X-rays are cut off. You see, soft X-rays have a hard time getting through the gas of the galaxy because they're absorbed by the intervening matter. And so what

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do is you measure the wavelength at which the X-rays are cut off, and that tells you how many hydrogen atoms there are between you and the source. Now, that gives - now you know pretty well the density of hydrogen in the galaxy from the radio results, so - with the density of gas in the galaxy from the radio results, and so you are able to determine how far it is to the source except that you don't know how much of the hydrogen between you and the source, along the line of sight, is at the source. So_ you can get a lower limit, which is it can't be closer than thus and such because there's no way you can cram _at many hydrogen atoms in, and you get an upper limit which says that it can't be farther than thus and such because if it were there would be more hydr _en in the way than there is along that particular llne of sight. And those kind of numbers - in parsecs I believe they're order of magnitude 200 to i000 parsecs, which is about to 3000 light years. That indicates itts fairly close to us in the galaxy. It's a near neighbor. QUERY Will you - but will you be able to tell and refine that further with the Skylab pictures at all, or are you stuck with that? KRIEGER I think we're stuck with that because that's just the result of our uncertainty about what the composition of the source is. We have a few other things we - we might try later on that will give us some more information. But, I - I'm afraid that's about as well as we probably won't be able to do too much better than that number. QUERY This emits X-rays and presumably visible radiation? KRIEGER Yes. QUERY Is it also a radio source or - KRIEGER Yes, it's a weak radio source. Relative to it's strength in visible light and radio it - well, it seems to be - it's very unusual in that it's one of the few END objects OF TAPE that emits much more in X-ray, much more power - -

600

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(SPEAKER CONT'D) - visible light and radio well it - it's - it seems to be - it's very unusual in that it's one of the few objects that emits much more in x-ray, much more power in x-rays than it does in either visible light or radio. Most - again - most x-ray sources - although called x-ray sources are really most powerf _ in either radio or visible light depending on the type of object, very strange piece. PAO Dr. Krieger, we had one question that was call _ in. What are the instruments being used in the JOP? KREEGER Yeah, well, the S054 and SO56, x-ray telescope experiments were both used and the S055, XUV let me see what does he call it, spectroheliometer, polyo crometsr, spectroheliomster, I think that's the latest name, for his instrument. The S055, XUV, telescope at any rate was used. The point being the - they - that was an entirely speculative observation which could be extremely exciting if it succeeds, and we hope to see some XUV radiation from SCOX-I. That has never been seen before because of lack of opportunity and if they succeed that would be very nice. The SO56, of course was also attempting to achieve an ex a photograph of a x - a celestial of x-ray sources, same scientific objective pretty much as ours. And the S052, white light coro _graph was used as an aspect camera. See we know where we're pointed from the solar observations, we know where we're pointed with respect to S052 and we can't see ordinary stars of course in our instrument but they can at night, so they look at the ordinary stars we look at the x-ray source and we combine the two photographs and we know where the x-ray source is with respect to the ordinary stars. PAO Any further, okay. QUERY Is this the first JOP i0 - JOP 13 maneuver that's been performed and do the one you have planned in the future help relate together to give you a total picture of anything? SPEAKER Yes, that's the that's the - the major point this is the first time we've tried JOP 13 and we wanted to fit in on SL III, so we could see how successfulit would be and so far it seems to have been - well without having seen the data yet have some reservation, but other than that it seems to have been a real success and we will plan to try it some more on SL IV, the idea is that since SCOX-I, as I mentioned before is already identified with an optical counterpart we can use this to check the accu mcy with which we can locate things and now we can go off and look at some of these sources which are totally

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unlocated. counterparts they are. you END PAO very OF

For which there are no optical yet_ Just because nobody know No further Krieger. questions.

or radio exactly where Okay. Thank

much

Dr.

TAPE

f

SKYLAB

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Houston,

Skylab III Change Johnson Space Center September 20, 1973 1:22 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

Participants: Milton Windler, Amos Crisp, PAO Flight Director

PC-95

j-

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PAO shift-brieflng a recap of Windler. WINDLER the for day

Okay,

we're

ready

for

the

change-ofto give Milton day today, us

Thursday, so far we Well, we

September have Flight had an

20th. And Director

interesting

started off I guess with a little JOP 13, and that worked out very well, we learned quite a bit from it, just from a procedures point of view. And in addition to the fact that the spacecraft pointed at the right place in the sky and we were able to get a lot of good data. Of course, that'll be reviewed on the films, and wetll pick that up later. But we were quite pleased with it. It came out on the predicted consumables cost with respect to TACS and worked out very well. We did the checkout limited though it was, of the command module updated the crews procedures prior to that time, I guess youVd say and spent some time with the crew briefing them in the entry situation and I imagine if you all haven't heard that why you'd probably be interested in getting a copy of that transcript, gut I think they answered most of the questions that y'all have been asking and I got the impression though that while they answered all the questions that the crew had for this given day, the crew did ask for some additional information to be sent up to them on the teleprinter and in that iterative process why we'll I'm sure be talking with them at length for the next several days. We did the test of the S193 antenna, and got data back to the ground. We were at first concerned that somehow we hadn't gotten the data on the down-link but it turned out to be there. It was Just less than the ground station had expe EREP Just had experienced in the previous on before passes because the whole and in this case it was system had been a small part of turned it.

-

I don't yet know too much about the results of that until we analyze that down-llnk data and analyze what Jack was saying. Re gave us an excellent running commentary on that. But it does not appear that whatever was there, you know there was a one theory that said that maybe there was a piece of Mylar and it would shake out or move away and it would start working normally. have to review the a - very promising And data for that but that didn't happen and so it certainly doesn't particular antenna. they'll still look llke And as we said

yesterday, the instrument itself was working okay, it's only the pointing mechanism on the antenna. If we could disable that in some way or fix it so it would point in the correct direction, the instrument actually takes data all right. We got out the EVA pads and have in fact uplinked some of those in the processing of uplinking the rest. As you know, tomorrow there's about 3 hours for the crew to go over the standard EVA prep period. Then in the morning, Saturday morning at 8:35

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Zulu, for a period of about 2-1/2 hours they'll be getting their suits ready and doing the actual work that's required at the very last day there, prior to opening the hatch. The hatch open time is schedu _d now for 11:15 Zulu, and we are planning on a 2-1/2 hour EVA. I believe we've already said this you probably already know that but EVI will be the Science Pilot - will be Owen, and EV2 will be AI, and EV3 back in the MDA will be Jack. The time line is about like this: It's about 20 minutes to transfer the equipment out of the airlock, this is after the hatch opening, after the depressuriation. It'll be 20 mimutes to transfer the equipment out of the airlock to the FAS station to get it set up where they can start using it. 35 minutes then for the operations at the first camera station and then 50 minutes for operations out at the sun end, and this includes moving the S141 - S149 -closing it, taking it off the sun end and putting it in a temporary stowage place down by the FAS area. And brushing off the S052, getting that little particle off that white light eoronograph, includes 15 minutes for getting in the DO24, about i0 minutes for bringing in the $230 and the END OF TAPE

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white

WINDLER light

getting coronagraph.

that Includes

little particle off 15 minutes for bringing around in one the that

of

that

getting in the D024 about $230 and the sail material struts, in the and in then the around airlock

I0 minutes for that's wrapped 20 minutes for and ingressing.

the of the equipment add

restowing And all

up to 2 hours and _ minutes. And that's not too, of course, far off what is - what is the standard film changing type EVA. And then the rest of the day is essentially just getting squared away after the EVA and also going through some some more checklist updates. And we're trying to work a 509 run in, but I don't know if we'll be able to do that tomorrow look too promisin_ we are. PAO QUERY significance of give us WINDLER QUERY WINDLER concerned in AM - primary and they, of or not at the Okay, the of having gas little picture Yes, Yes. On I mean moment. on EVA And day or not. that's about Doesn't where

questions. EVA - could you cooling and, you of that. Why? of a - kind run through know, just of - Why? the kind

a

kind

Okay, well, we're - we're, of course, that the - the - it goes back to the primary coolant loop - or the coolant loops rather, course, had this extra path in them that was us some extra cooling we first activated got some contamination the valve that that capacity during the that on Skylab-II out of that little controls the flow.

intending to give EVA's. Well, when well, _ probably bypass loop into

And that causes the - the valve it's modulating low and causing be cooler than we like. We did, EVA we've always used the - the course, so we're we've lost the primary on the secondary loop; to put the the liquid valve Since

is stuck in both systems the - the temperatures to as you know, on our last water loop on the - of coolant this is loop the now altogether, coldest of the we're

two. Wetre hesitant umbilical system with afraid into a we'll problem

crew on cooled

the regular suit garments because

drive this there.

further closed and we've already lost

we'll get the one

system, why we don't want to do that particularly late in the game. We have what we think is an adequate method of cooling the crew, and we plan to cool them basically using the oxygen flow. The coolness of the oxygen in a mode that is actually higher flow rate than the - the normal. Of course, we have plenty consumables, wetre not concerned about that

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aspect of it. any problem. us that if

And we don't think People that have run they have a

that this

there's in the in

going chamber

to too

be tell cold.

anything,

problem

getting

And - and we expect to be 4 hours now. The medical all of it very carefully. particularly all the way consider up to 4

able to go for a period people - they will be But, we - we've agreed GO at if it's 3

of around looking at that we'll and go I've

a finite GO/NO hours if it's

hours required.

already mentioned that we think now it's only going to be about 2-1/2. The person with the greatest problem is the is the command - I mean the EEV3, who happens to be the PLT now because he doesntt have his helmet and gloves on and gas, of course, is designed to flow around a closed circuit. Plus, it dumps out in the cabin and would raise the pressure too high. might So, say, we in have which an auxiliary we take one suit inlet I guess, and cooling of the really we blow system onboard for him, blowers you and but as you many several -

hook it up to his that's incidental

to the exhaust, air flow - it tried this ago, however system for

circulates it within his suit. And he's know, oh, 3 or 4 days ago - 5 or 6 days it was now, and has been on this cooling

hours, about 2 I believe, maybe several to - implies too much, but anyway he's reported that it's - it's marginal but but he - but it's adequate. So, he is also in a position of where he can take cool liquids and things like that so he if necessary, even he could get out of the suit. We wouldn't want him to do that unless he really had to, but he could. And the and in case of a depressurlzatlon - if he really had to he could use that, although we wouldn't he could actually go on crank up the coolant loop want to do that. And good for doing that, could blow the air as the other two thing about this EVA you might say we and we don't anticipate - that aspect of it.

in fact, the but he could gas on through crew members.

configuration is not very if he depressurized, he his suit system the same So that's - the unusual aspect. And fortunately EVA - a standard EVA any problems with that be a long answer.

the

is the cooling we have a simple that we'll have I told you it'd END OF TAPE

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WINDLER - EVA and we don't inticipate that we'll have any problems with that that aspect of it. I told you it'd to be a long answer. QUERY To change the subject slightly, I wonder if you'll tell us how you feel about the command and service modu _ now after - after today's - today's checkout? It's been dormant for quite a while and so forth. Now you must have had some thoughts while the checkout went on and so forth. WINDLER Yeah, I think, we probably implied there is more to this checkout than there really is, at least from your point of view. The major systems that we're concerned with we didn't turn on. That is the - you know the - the gas systems, the propulsion systems that actually have the high pressure fluids in them. The primary thing that we've done here is turn the computer system on and - check all of the sof tw_re, check the commands that are issued and - and run over - up-llnks and erasable memory and things llke that. WeVve also turned on the - the secondary control system and - and verified that it'll control the gimbals and that the - the B MAGs and that sort of thing. The SCS that's system I was talking about of course works okay. We're of not really as you will fall-back simulated with the So we put he the RCS system aware, if you'll to the proof test yet. get the transcript, But the the

course,

procedures D had been ground crew

are well understood, in the trainer, had - in the simulation

we think. Have been been simulated, even - on a Sunday.

feel pretty good about the entry procedures. QUERY As we say, that's sort of not nuts and bolts answer and what I was looking for was a subjective - humanistic feeling you might have for (garble) WINDLER something then. I Well, guess I I'll try to don't have

kind the or I

of

he more dramatic any feeling, llke

might have if I was in an airplane you know and broke out of the clouds into the into the sunlight or som_hing like that, because we just really didn't have that kind of a day. I think that the system is fine and what was done was not that big a stress. I'm anxious to see the end of the mission, I guess. I feel like that we've done a lot of science and it's time to fall back forward to - to the behind us. But - today and examine all that so, I'm looking to the entry phase and getting that didn't - wasn't any real - real big at me least mostly of trying module flight directors,

milestone as far as proving the equipment out, it wasn't to me. It was a wild day. Reminded to activate the lunar modu _. Running a command and a Skylab and a couple of CAP COMMs and two and all of that.

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QUERY You said the oxygen used in the cooling that will be used in the cooling is dumped in the cabin? In the WINDLER Well it - it - only for the one man. It it actually is dumped at the suit, so wherever the man is, that's where it goes. Since he's in the - the one in the airlock, the in this case, the PLT, his will actually be building up pressure in the - inside of the - it would be if we were doing that. But we - you do understand though, he's not on the oxygen system, like the other two guys are. QUERY Will the - using the oxygen for the other two guys, have any implication for - oxygen supplies on the next Skylab flight? WINDLER No, we have real - real adequate margins there. Several ors of magnet I mean - I shouldn't say that, several times the time the amount that we need. They told me the numbers some days ago, and it was so big I even forgot. It may have been like 1800 pounds or 1200 pounds extra and we're going to use about 36 pounds. So there is that kind of a differential. QUERY Could you go into a little more detail about tunnel vision effect, that - two members of the first - first crew apparently sustained. We - I didn't know about this, from before. WINDLER Well, I didn't either. (laugh) To tell you the truth, until a couple of days ago. When they, they reported. I think it was primarily Kerwin, reported that he had some slight graying out during the first SPS burn. And I guess you - you're aware probably that when your - you do have a look of blood to your - your eyes that - they narrow from the edges, it's the effect that youVre talking about. And while didn't really hear the crew say that was the sensation but I think that that's probably the END OF TAPE the -

I

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(WINDLER CONT'D) talking about and while I didn't really hear the crew say that that was the sensation but I think that that's probably an accurate guess as to what it was. I know the - I guess it was Bean that said something about that so, he probably assumed that that was the case but it's not - doesn't affect everybody and it's not repetitive apparently, at least as you heard, probably on the loop it didn't have anything to do with - it didn't affect him on the second SPS burn. So I really - we don't think that the - inflatin_ the pressure suit or that counter - whatever it's called garment, is a guarentee that it will prevent that and we don't even know that they'll have it anyway, it's a relative minor type thing as you're well aware I guess the system flies automatically through this period anyway. You wouldn't need to be able to monitor. QUERY Well - for - from what you might have heard the doctor say or anything is there any indication that this effect would be more or - you would get more reduction in vision the longer you stayed in space or anything llke that? WINDLER I don't think so. Let me tell you as a layman and the medical guys will probably shoot me for this but you recall Kerwin was perhaps in the - in the - physically anyway, or at least peddling the bicycle and all of that he was - his workload was reduced the most of any of the other two guys and or of the three of them. And these because of what he had said and the comments that he had made and the other two crewmen made we increased the PT for this and the workloads, and the exercises that they're getting now are really equal to their pre-flight type responses and all of them with the exception of one run by A1 Bean they've all been able to go the full protocol on the MO92 and his was probably due to eating to close to the time he was in it, similar to you might get a cramp you know if you ran around after you ate or too close to it or went swimming. So I really think that that they already were on to the secret which is lots of exercise and keeping your body in condition and they seemed to - they feel real good - everytime you turn around they're pumping the bicycle, using the exercisers and they even told us today that they didn't want us to turn the - short change the PT, on the EVA day because the EVA wasn't that strenuou_s and they still needed to do the PT, you know Conrad did that the day he did the - even the hard EVA, he Jumped on the bicycle and peddled it. I would have thought that they would have been pretty tired but apparently not. So that's a round about answer to your question but as a layman I think that probably the condition of the crew is physically or you know muscularally is very good.

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QUERY You said that the 193 was things don't look very promising there, are you thinking now an EVA something on an EVA by the SL IV crew is not going to solve the problem or is that the next step? WINDLER I think it would probably take something like that and that - in my mind it would be a little bit difficult to do because itts down in a place where's there's not a good EVA path you'll need to get into - we already have several other things we want to work on I'm sure in my mind anyway reservicing the RCS I mean the cooling system would be more significant than working on the 193, so it just looks llke it would have been a lot simpler if there would have been apiece of Mylar and had been falling out and everything had worked okay. (Chuckle), I think since it's apparently in the electronics, either shorting out in some fashion or some amplifer that's gone bad. It probably implies that it's got to be a fairly extensive amount of time spent on doing something to it. PAO Let's see I have two questions from Kennedy Space Cen=er. What did you learn from the antenna test this morning, we answered that, what is to be done next, you just finished that. What shape is the CSM in based on this morning's checkout? I think you answered that too. Are there any further questions here? Okay, thank you very much.

SKYLAB NEWS CENTER Houston_ Texas

Skylab III Corollary Johnson Space Center September 21, 1973 11:04 a.m. CDT

Briefing

Participants: Jack Waite, Manager, Corollary Experiments, MSFC Bob Adams, Material Processing Program Manager, MSFC Harry Gatos, Principal Investigator M562, MIT Art Boese, Technical Manager M518, MSFC Amos Crisp, PAO

f

PC-96

P"

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-_

PAO Okay, we're ready to begin press briefing this morning on corollary experience - experiments manufacturing in space. We have with us on my right, Mr. Jack Walte, Manager of Corollary Experiments at Marshall Spaceflight Center in Huntsville. Next, on my right, is Mr. Bob Adams, Material Processing Program Manager from Marshall. Next we have Dr. Harry Gatos, MIT, Principal Investigator for M562. And farthest down on my right is Mr. Art Boese from Marshall, Technical Manager for M518. And we'd llke to begin with a brief statement from Mr. Waite and perhaps from Mr. Adams and Mr. Boese_ and then a longer statement from Dr. Gatos, and save the questions and answers for the end. Mr. Jack Waite. WAITE We've had a very good mission on Skylab-lll. We've completed all of the planned objectives on the corollary experiments, and in many cases we have exceeded the originally planned objectives by as much as i00 percent. So it's been a very successful mission from a corollary experiment standpoint. We've done, in addition to the ATM, the Biomed and EREP, we have satisfactorily completed some 42 corollary experiments. This is - we as I had mentioned in the last press conference, the space manufacturing experiments, the M518 series, space processing experiments, were scheduled for SL-IV. But we able to shift those and we will complete the las there are ii of the space processing experiments. We will complete the last space processing experiment in the morning. So it's been a very good mission. And in the question and answer period I'ii be glad to answer any questions you'd have on any of the corollary. But without any further discussion I'd like to turn it over to Bob Adams. ADAMS Thank you, Jack. Gentlemen, Jack asked that I be prepared to give you somewhat of an overview on the Skylab activities that's related to the area of material science, which we call materials processing. We still have quite a bit of the earlier terminology manufacturing in space that's applied to this - this area, and it's something that we're having considerable difficulty getting away from. The effort that we do have on - that we have underway is of a research nature, as l'm sure most of you know. And the term manufacturing in space really does not directly apply. Perhaps at some future date it certainly can lead some of the information that we get back from Skylab - could lead to that type of effort. As most of you are aware, we have two experiment systems onboard Skylab that are dedicated to research in this field. First, the M512 materials

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CDT

processing facility, it has five individual experiments. And then the M518 multipurpose furnace with eleven different experiments. We have performed three of the M512 experiments during the first mission, and two of these involved welding and brasing techniques. And we performed them basically to obtain data that was necessary on the repair and assembly techniques in space. Our analysis of these return samples are still in progress, but we do have some qulcklook reports in that indicate a few facts that I think you would be interested in. First of all, the electron beam welding and the exothermlc brasing techniques can both be utilized successfully in space. And this is using basically the same procedures that we consider applicable on Earth. This is data that's very important to us for later assembly of large structures and repair of existing structures. The welding and braslng specimens _hat have been returned are - are very markedly less porous than comparable samples on Earth; and again I think this is something that we would have expected. The tantalum weld specimen that is part of the welding experiment, apparently again without dissecting and complete analysis - apparently does have some micro structure differences in the bead. But - END OF TAPE

_

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ADAMS differences

in

the

- beat.

apparently That is

does have differences

some microwave from the light

structure

welding procedures on Earth. But at this point, we haven't drawn any specific conclusions from this. It is a point of further analyisis. The third M512 experiment, which has already been performed is a basic metallurgical research experiment involving the formation of the metallic spheres. The specimens that we are looking at, it can be generally concluded that they are definitely more spherical than their one g counter parts. And as I have already referenced, less porous. That is all that I can say about the _512 experiments at this time. I realized that you gentlemen are very anxious to get the results of our analysis. It will be another 30 to 60 days before we do get the final reports from our investigative team. _e have forwarded these samples to some 21 different investigators representinR a wide spectrum of the academic world and industrial world in the country. And they are working to a very tight schedule for a final report like in the next 30 or 60 days to us. The multipurpose furnace experiments are based on solidification, crystal growth, and other phase change processes. As Jack pointed out, we have completed all Ii on this mission, something that we are very pleased with. I'ii say that from all appearances the furnace facility has operated perfectly. We are highly pleased. The complex control unit has performed flawlessly and we have data that we have been tracking through telemetry that indicates that we have obtained hopefully, all of each principle investigator's basic thermal desires. Of course we have not returned these specimens yet. They will come down and we will get them in the hands of the investigators a little later on in the first part of October. The apparent success of the 518 system has led us to prepare for additional work utilizing this facility on the next mission. We are sendin_ up, we've made preparations to send up the an additional set of samples that we have prepared that we put together as some sort of a contingency preparation. We feel that now that possibly we will have time and that it is so important that we would like to send these samples up and run some of them perhaps and really duplication effort perhaps some of them through additional scientific points as Dr. Gatos points out. He is very interested of course, and all of the Pls will be very interested in looking at what we return from this first mission. And we may be changing the requirements for the second run right up to the time that it is actually performed based on perhaps some surprises out of the first analysis. These experiments were all designed, really all ii of them, each having differences and likenesses. They are all designed to

about

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PC-96B/2 ii:04 CDT

the various of zero-g materials.

perimeters processing And I have

of materials processes. on the properties of asked Dr. Gatos really

And the the speto address be

what I consider to be the most brought to your attention. And some of the experiment selections

important point that should this beinK the reasons for and why we are endeavoring

to apply the unique properties of space to materials processing, and some of the potential benefits that he and we all expect to obtain. So I'd like to go ahead and ask Harry to work from his points. GATOS Thank you, Bob. I believe that materials processin_ in space provides the greatest opportunity any generation benefit materials as they I would material of these that the are not directly END OF has had in the past or any country has today to mankind. Let me first state my beliefs regarding and the dominant roll they play in our society, have in all past societies or civilizations. In particular, llke to discuss briefly the acute problems confronting science and engineering today. In underlying some problems, I hope it will become abundantly clear challenges and opportunities that outer space presents merely intellectual technological exercises, but bear on today's mountfng societal needs.

TAPE

F

¸

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GATOS - merely intellectual technological exercises but bear directly on todays mounting societal needs. Finally I'ii discuss the experiment that the astronauts performed a few days ago, which my colleague professor Waite and I and our associates designed at the electronic materials group at HIT. We refer to the prehistoric periods in terms of the materials that were used. For example, the stone, the bronz and the iron ages. But the history of any period or any civilization, can be written in terms of materials processing and the uses of material. The theoretical concepts of the Greeks and the Egyptians remained concepts for centuries. And so did Leonardo de Vinci's ingenious engineering systems, the flying machine, the submarine and many others. Because material technology was simply not there. The basic roll of material was not realized and appreciated then and I'm afraid the same situation prevails today. In our era, the scientific and engineering spectaculars have overwarned us and captured our imagination in terms of physic, engineering or medical science. In all such instances we had essentially, lost sight of the fact that these spectaculars could only be staged on the right materials. Materials engineering almost invariably remained and still remains in the background, struggling with colossal technical problems, without substantial support and stripped from glamour. We are all fascinated by the jet engine, the computer satellite communication, the openheart surgery. But we seldom fully appreciate the fact that it is the painstaking development of high temperature materials, high strength materials, electronic materials, plastics and others that makes these advances possible. I consider this situation alarming. Particularly so, because the development of these materials has not been based by in large on a scientific basis but on (garble) or on trial and error. The inherent difficulties of material development on the scientific basis has been compounded by the lack of appropriate research support. The natural consequences have been and still are, over design, waste, and frequent failures. As we stare at the crisis upon us now, pollution, energy, natural resources, housing, medical services, transportation, communication and others. All of which are essentially materials problems, I believe, we are approaching the end of the road, with empiricism as the substantial ingredient in materialsprocessing. Outer space environment, as we will see in a few moments, has the potential of moving many of the major technical barriers in pursuing the development of and basic understanding of materials processing. The support of the government and the nation are needed now more than ever before. We have not began to exhaust

SL-III Time:

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9/21/73
the potiental materials that we know they have. And I'm referring to nearly all solid materials, metals, ceramics, plastics, electronic materials, medical materials, and others. We need to go forward with molecular engineering. Let me explain briefly, what I mean. The properties of materials are directly related to the exact position of the atoms in their three-dlmensional areas, the exact position of foreign atoms in the frame work of the host material and the interactions among atoms on the micro and macro scale. It will be through the understanding and the control of these relationships that we will utilize the full potiental of the existing materials and will design and develop new materials to perform known functions better or new functions in a reliable and responsible fashion. But a number of interferring gravity affects make the study and detailed understanding of the solidification processes extremely difficult if not impossible. And it is only through such understanding that we can possibly achieve complete control of these processes. I hope you know can begin to see why outer space provides simply unique advantages, if not the only way to overcome our difficulties. There is no gravity in outer space, therefore, there is no thermal convection in the liquids to desturb the uniform formation of the solids. Components with different densities do not separate out like they do on Earth, while the solids are formed. Furthermore, containers are not necessary to confine the liquids from which the solids are to be prepared. Con Containers in very END OF TAPE

--

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GATOS solids are to desirable and

be prepared. uncontrollable

confined the liquids from Containers invariably contamination of the

which cause melts.

the un-

_ost importantly, all pertinent solidification parameters can be adjusted, varied at will, and studied in the absence of gravity. The results of such studies should have a major impact on the design and control of solidification processes on Earth. Understanding solidification processes and achieving crystalline perfection and chemical uniformity will without doubt, usher in a new era in materials processing, leading to materials that can be used at past theoretical performance, rather than hundreds or thousands of times below that. In my opinion, such an achievement would overshadow any other achievement contemplated in outer space. I shall demonstrate the problem of uniformity for the case of electronic materials, and specifically for semiconductors on which, to a large extent, as you know, our modern technology is based. The electronic materials - in electronic materials one deals with phenomena on a microscale on atomic scale. If I may have the first slide. Here is an illustration of silicone chips, now being processed, individual on each devices one of which or a complete there is system, over which a hundred can really

perform a substantial function like running a small calculator. Now in a lighter vein, you see in the next slide - perhaps one of the press people are right at this, that we are getting smaller and smaller. Now let me show you in the next slide, a silicone wafer, about this one here, which 3/4 inch in diameter, is a few and this millimeters tiny square thick that and yon see

here, represents one of those little chips that you saw before. Now one of those chips has, as I said before, a complete circuit which in this particular case is incorporated to form a system you can barely see it. We'll focus now on this particular chip here, which is one of these, and you'll see what it looks if one might - we magnify it. Next slide please. This is that chip that you know. This has a complete circuit incorporated on it. The lights please. Now in a wafer like the one I showed you before, we can put on three quarter of a million devices to form the lens for the television camera, which could perform without visible light, since it is sensitive to the infrared. Although this has been demonstrated, it is not yet commercially available because the uniformity of the active ingredients in this partlcular wafer is such that doesn't allow the quality of this particular lens to become a commercial reality. I'll now show yon a crosssection of a semiconductor crystal which has been grown on Earth, then sectioned, etched and magnified, in this particular case a few hundred times. Next slide please. These lines that you see here, this white or

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dark lines, and the other lines in between, represent changes in the concentration of the active ingredients in the semiconductor. Therefore, demonstrate the nonuniformity of the semiconductor that I referred to before. If we magnify this now a few more hundred times you'll see in the next slide that even finer structure of nonuniformity appears between the ones that we're looking before. The in both in this and the previous instance we are dealing with a crystal grown under what we consider a satisfactory or above average, above normal conditions. When he growth conditions on Earth become a little bit out of control, then this nonuniformlty is far more accentuated, as you'll see in the next slide, whereby more types of nonuniformity or inhomo_enities are present of the active - END OF TAPE

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GATOS

Next

slide

-

whereby

more

types

of

nonuniformlty

or inhomogeneitles are present of the active ingredients again. And in the next slide you see another type of inhomogeneity where by simple vibrations while the material was being prepared caused this nonuniform distribution of the active ingredients. The lights please. These problems of atomic engineering are typical not just of the electronic materials, but of nearly all solid materials. They will not be solved by trial and error processes. They require realignment of our thinking with regard to materials processing and its implications. They require bold steps in new directions. Unique and imaginative approaches. They require - bold steps - they require - outer space offers a new dimension in approaching the solution of these problems. Let's hope that the country exploits that dimension in the decades ahead for the benefit for all mankind. Let me now discuss very briefly colleague and associates performed in the Skylab. a semiconductor, indium the particular experiment that and I have designed which was We have grown several crystals and temonide in this particular my recently of case.

And we have enclosed these crystals in capsules. You see the actual capsules in the next slide. This is the crystal enclosed in capsule in quartz capsules, which in turn are enclosed in a stainless steel container and put into the furnace that Mr. Adams referred to. Now this crystal grown on the /-_ Earth have been examined, very carefully analyzed, studied, and all their earthly properties are known - chemical, structural, and electrical. In space part of this crystal is molten and then regrown. And in the next slide you see schematically what the situation is. There is a crystal inside, before it went in space. Now what the astronauts have done, they melt it up to here. This was - they melt it up to here. So when the crystals return back, they'll contain part of the crystal grown on Earth and part of it grown in space. We'll dissect them, as the artist has done here, and hopefully we'll be able to distinguish the difference of the nonuniformities that were grown - that were present on the crystal grown on Earth, and whatever it has happen in the crystal grown in space. Lights please. The - we will compare then, exhaustively, the effect that zero-gravity had on the growth of these crystals. We will study extensively the way they grew in space, the way the active ingredients were distributed there and how the electrical properties in all their details have changed. We do have from Skylab the performance data on this and the other solidification experiments. Equipment and procedures worked just as designed. In a few weeks we will have a first direct look at assessing factually

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the potential of outer space in improving the properties of materials and designing new ones. We are taking the first step. Many more need to follow. The scientific and engineering community need to be mobilised, and it can with the support of the government and the encouragement of the nation. So that basic knowledge on materials and technology attainable only in space can be transferred directly or indirectly to Earth through this program, I should say through this heroic program of NASA. I hope I have conveyed to you some of the reasons that make me view with alarm the present status of material science and engineering. It is this types of reasons that should make us all look toward outer space as a powerful new dimension for mastering molecular engineering. Let me conclude with what I have said at an earlier occasion. I believe that the ultimate compositions END OF TAPE impact of controlling of materials is beyond the chemical that - and structural

_

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GATOS of controlling the materials is beyond of

I believe

that

the

ultimate

impact of type

chemical and structural composition the most far out science fiction

imagination. ADAMS Thank you. Thank you very much, Harry. Gentlemen I think you can well understand that when Harry concludes his remarks on materials processing it leaves very little for anyone else to say. I would like to - to reference one additional point that ties right in with his closing comment. We - we do look forward to flying this type of experimentation, this - this door opener, if you will, as often as possible. And we - we have already made arrangements to fly in the Apollo/Soyuz mission, a like system of this nature. We have selected, at this time, 6 experiments some entirely different than - than those being flown on Skylab and some somewhat comparable. We - we look forward to seeing what we get out of Skylab so that we can determine perhaps the directions that we should go in our future flight opportunities. I'm quite concerned that with the potential - the obvious potential -our next flight opportunity after the next Skylah mission is, of course, the ASTP flight in mid 75. We will have the shuttle following then, and I think I can assure you that there will be this type of bolton processing and resolidlfication certainly at every - every flight of the shuttle if at all possible. I have asked Mr. Art Eoese, Technical Manager on the furnace system, to Join us today to answer any specific questions that you might have. I apologize for not being able to bring down specific hardware for you to look at. We did have to come down from Marshall this morning. We do have a couple of - of placards that has some pictures on it that might further simplify and better explain some of the points of how the system operates. And I'd llke to just essentially open it to questions at this point unless you, Jack or Amos has anything further to say. SPEAKER No. PAO Thank you very much, Bob. And now if there are any questions - QUERY Is - Dr. Gatos is indium antimide a common semiconductor crystal now used, or is it Get some idea of what this crystal is used for right now. GATOS The indium antlnlmide is not nearly as widely used as silicon, as you know. It is used in a limited way. The choice of the indium antinlmide was because it is - it has a low melting point; it's easier to study; and in the first experiment which was primarily exploratory, it was the best

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to

use

rather

the

most

important

semiconductor. obtained for indium or show the way how

However, antinimide

may I can

add that the information readily be extrapolated

to design experiments for more useful silicon. This is our ultimate goal, QUERY The semiconductor they get pretty of useful or line. Is that GATOS good if workable correct? The

semiconductors of course. manufacturers,

llke I think

you get a i0 or 15 percent yield semiconductors from the assembly Is it that low, or is it - the yield varies depending whom

you ask. The yield is low. But let me say something which I've said in the presence of semiconductor manufacturers; that I personally am shocked to see a multlbillion dollar industry based on crystals which are grown without knowing what's going on. Does that answer your question? QUERY Well, I was going to ask in addition, do you think they could - I guess it's costly to ge t such a low yield of usable semiconductors. If you went into zero-G, you think you could get what - 90, 80 percent? What - Is this the kind of idea you're pushing for? GATOS Well, the zero-G will do one thing, it'll give them raw material to work with which is infinitely better, hopefully, than they have now. Now, what they do with that, it will be up to them. END OF TAPE

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now.

GATOS Now what

they

infinitely better do with that, it'll

hopefully be up to of

than them.

they have Certainly,

the yield is bound use is bound to go that - the make of which work, are on maybe, PAO

to go up. The efficiency up. The - the capabilities them is bound to - to be And of

the devices they of the devices better. Or devices be put to

paper now should work. incorporated in division Mr. Wilford.

they can crystals.

QUERY Could we get some - some welding experience in space. I think all you is that it seems to work pretty much llke it Could you describe bow the experiments went? particular problems of welding in zero gravity? ADAMS I am somewhat limited in

discussion on mentioned does on Earth. If there are any my capability

to answer your question but I can - I can give you a description of what we did and the - the type of comments that have come back to me from our investigators to date. We had three different material, 3 plates that we put in front of an electron beam, welding apparatus, if you will and then we rotated these plates. The weld beads turned out to be essentially, what we did expect. The welding technique, the puddle control if you will, which is a very common terminology in welders language as to the problems involved with techniques for all kinds of welding. The - the - the actual techniques that we use on _ Earth, we have essentially And that 's basically all course metallurgical actual dissecting been concluded at and all, proved we can out say. in space There by this experiment. there are of answered that has Just well in the not under

research, questions to be radiography and so forth as a matter of fact is

way. We had to dissect these samples and send them to many many different people that are specialists in one particular field. The welding and brazing went every bit as well as we could possibility hope for. The brazing as Jack has touched on it in the past, actually exceeded brazing on Earth in llke techniques. We took aluminum and stainless steel and we cut grooves. We didn't actually try to - to braze two tubes together. We cut tubes in one case of a varying width if you will, the cut on the side, and we put a brazing compound We encapsulated it in that particular area and then we heated it we heated this brassing compound with an exothermlc materal, an exothermlc compound. And the material, as it became molten, it stayed right in the braze. Which of course tells us that the surface tension was the primary force present and is an essential point if we're going to be able to - to braze to put together tubular type structures in space. The braze compound it flowed very evenly, very uniformly. The - the weld beads were extremely uniformed. As I touched briefly on - in my earlier

F

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PC-96G/2 1104 CDT

comments the weld a somewhat marked the and alignment if resolidified.

of tantalum, the weld bead in tantalum does difference in the actual micro structure of you will of the metal as it's been melted This is not so marked in the other two

show

specimens. We don't know what conclusions to draw from this at this particular point. I would llke to - to essentially say that basically we did accomplish our goals in these two areas but as to - to advances or metallurgical knowledge that - we're Just limited in what we can say at this point. QUERY Now in something llke, puddle control, or something llke that, had you expected there to be a different phenomena in - in zero gravity. Had you expected things to sort of spread out and so you couldn't get a good - good weld? ADAMS We could be the situation. depending again on who and END OF TAPE were very concerned There were several you talked to as to that that certainly change of thought what would occur

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WAITE

-

-

and

so

you

couldn't

get

a

good

weld.

ADAMS We could be the situation. depending again on who And basically what we

were very concerned There were several you talked to as to did prove that any essentially operations. we simply

that that certainly chains of thought what would occur. fears that had been

expressed in this area were do exactly the same type of this experiment was performed judgment.

groundless. We can And we simply, before could not make that but to

QUERY I'm not sure who to ask the question, there is one experiment, M557 on immiscible alloys having do with segregation of metals. Was that carried out this time or the previous time? matter again WAITE It was carried of fact the first of our ii it is one that has just been

out as one of the, as a experiments on M518. And carried out and we look

forward of course to its return. But other - all we can say now is that the thermal design of all ii of the experiments, it included, went as expected. And we do feel that we have given the PI his basic goals. to QUERY alloy? WAITE BOESE session QUERY that Do you remember what metals he was trying

Art, can you address that one? May I give you an answer at the here? cannot you Is it be made possible on Earth? that in zero g

end

of make

f

this alloys

you

can

ADAMS answer and give the Gatos address

I think I can my views, but that particular

certainly anticipate I much prefer to hear point.

the about

GATOS Well, the answer is definitely yes, in terms of uniformity. If you have a multiphase system and you are trying to solidify on Earth, gravity simply wont t let you do that in a uniform way because the heavier particles precipitate first after solidification proceeds. In fact this problem what I of mean uniformity whether by multiphase or it is multiphase solution. I think you it understand is one

os the mos_ serious problems that materials engineering faces today. It may have to do with the fact of ordinary steel that we have. It may be hundreds to a thousand times weaker than the theory tells us it should be. QUERY future things, or will make GATOS this particular is that Any time there some has never I'm aspect sure of during the Skylab or alloythat you would been done before? my colleagues they are are some llke of to the make in I'm

interested yes. But

processing,

f

SL-III Time: 9/21/73 sure

PC-96H/2 11:04 CDT

also

what

they

will

wish

to

try

first

is

to

see

an

alloy as made here now - as first for instance, for high strength when the dispersion is done in a perfectly uniform way how stronger this alloy will be or how high a temperature it can withstand. When we talk about efficiency in jet engines for example, if we could go up 300 degrees in running the jet engines the efficiency will go up by a large percentage which means pollution will come down by a great deal. So we are looking both for improving what we have in some instances we'll need only a little bit, or making new things which we can make now for container problems or what have you. And we could go on and on as to the type of improvements. Like in energy conversion, we have ii percent now with silicon the way we have it. Well, theoretically we could go to 25 percent. And there is in principle no reason why we can't do that. Then once we go to 25 percent, and then using the Sun as the main source of all energy_ it will be economically competitive with what we use now. So we are getting close to realities. give ADAMS you the answer If to that your satisifes earlier you on question. that, Of I can the three

cartridges them was mixture. was lead END OF

that we performed, different. And the And the second was indium and tin.

that we heated on 557, each of first was lead zinc animony gold and germanium, and the third

TAPE

pf

SL-III Time: 9121173

PC96I/I 11:04

CDT

ADAMS were What QUERY going to are some ADAMS

And you have some of these On

the

third

was

lead,

indium

and

tin.

mentioned earlier that - that you other experiments for the 3rd mission. that youtre talking about? the 3rd mission all that we could the And could have additional

do, see, we were originally scheduled to perform entire M518 experiment system on the last mission. the - had we had any indicators that we possibly pulled it up, we could have moved out to prepare samples entirely this opportunity. different, And to if take you will. advantage

We did not have of of the opportunity

as it has recently come to us. The only thing available to us right now is the so-called backup samples that we had already prepared and had on standby that are basically identical. Now, let me clarify that point. They are not identical in every case with the so-called primary samples that we have already run, the ii samples. In the preparation of - of any crystalline structure obviously there are differences and - that will - that will occur Just in the actual preparation. And the principle investigators in each case went by out of their - the numerious items that they prepared and they tried to pick out the best the best sample for their prime system. But in each case there were - well, there were several PIs that referenced the fact that there were some slight differences and they would certainly welcome the opportunity to be able to run both the prime and secondary samples that they had prepared. And at the time we had to tell them that we could not foresee that opportunity. We to on had very That which do have say that Skylab-II; QUERY that opportunity we will duplicate that is simply I think over in in this Yes, that we counting now, so it would be improper the effort that we have done not the case. some comments that Dr. Gatos are a big break.

when we were appropriate GATOS is, we the fact weren't we in

the office this morning too. I think the - this is can on. get We the have backup two

furnance choices faster

here. And investigation conditions

are given this principle of both choices to modify the second experiment.

investigation the thermal That is, cool

or hold longer, or solidify that's in greater portion and variables of this type that we didnt t have before. But I think the most important thing here might be that if indeed some of the effects that we are - we are expecting are present in the experiment in the material that come

SL-III Time: 9/21/73

PC961/2 11:04 CDT

back the first time around then repeating it and making sure that what we saw once we can repeat again, that will be far more important than trying to do something different. A mere fact which will - which one sees confirming it for the second time, I think, is an extremely desirable process. PAO Are there any further questions. Okay, thank you very much. That closes the press conference. END OF TAPE

SKYLAB --

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Houston,

Skylab III - ATM Briefing Johnson Space Center September 21, 1973 1:06 p.m.

Participants: Milton Windler, Flight James E. Milligan, PI Jack Riley, PAO Director for SO56

PC-98
f

SL-III Time: 9/21/73

PC-98A/I 13:06 CDT

PAO Milligan, a summary discuss just has deal with the you

Okay, principle want to the

lets

go

on

to

ATM

with

James Do you

E. have to

investigator for S056. give us to start OUt with? down during of

MILLIGAN Just

I was asked to come general ATM operations

here today, SL-III and

to give you a broad breast picture gone, things of this sort., We really about the science right now because data that we really don't And I roughly a_ a know where

the can't we're we

way the operation go into a great so enundated other

stand,

than we are swamped. of minutes describing far as we're concerned

just thought I'd how the mission grou p of scientist

spend a couple has gone as down on the

ground and then Just open it up for some questions, if anybody has any particular questions. First I think we might like to mention that the instrument performance on this mission has really been almost all us trouble occasionally. been fixed quite good and of them minor. was the problem we've had very The main problem wlth the doors a very we that few problems, had that caused welve had have had couple as far no at than all. anybody

Which in case of during the EVAs during we the fixed first them EVA

couple of experiments, this mission. We've probably mission. fix a But

a couple since more doors on as the serious

and we'll of the next

experiments operational I think

have gone, difficulties are holding

there really have been during this mission up that much better

Experiments anticipated END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/21/73

PC-98-B/I 13:06 CDT

MILLIGAN

There

have

really

been

no

serious

oper-

ational difficulties during I think are holding up much they would based on previous And things are really going of ATM gotten time and the amount a lot more observing

this mission better than experience quite well. of manned time in

at all. Experiments anybody anticipated that we'd had in space. In terms of amount time we've than I think most

observing this mission

of us thought we were going to get during the whole Skylab program. The astronauts have operated the ATM console and the actual operation of the Sun is on the order of 300 hours right now. And we've got something llke 250 odd hours or something llke that in the unmanned portion of Skylab-3 on some of the experiments. The operation has gone extremely well. Somebody asked the question earlier of Milt about you know, have the astronauts made mistakes and things of this sort. Of course the answer is yes, they are human. But I think it is remarkable how few mistakes they have made. It really is, it's just incredible. In almost every case where they have mae a mistake it has been due to the fact that we have changed our minds on the ground since they have been in orbit on how the experiment should be operated. And the number of changes that have gone out from the people on the ground to orbit is just incredible. It's just pages in the Control and pages it seems llke every day if you Center. And the guys have really reacted are mar-

velously to it. Not only that, but they have suggested changes in the experiment operation and things of this sort that have really helped the scientific mission pay off. And so the few mistakes that they have made or the ones that, you know, they have talked back down to the ground about have really been very, very minor. And they have usually been caused by fact that we've sent them up so many different instructions on a given instrument that they are confused as to which one is valid right the people now. on the And quite often I think ground forgot about the it's last usually set of been because instrucmode all

tions that they gave them. of operation. In addition also had, I think unbelievable had designed launch. We

And so we got them into the wrong to marvelous crew operation we've cooperation from the Sun. We originally, early on the active And quite We were and it had everyto a Sun moderately whole range

our experiments for 1968, 1969 designed our experiments to work

Sun, and we went into Sunspot minimum to fly them. frankly a lot of us were quite disturbed about this. quite worried. But the Sun played its usual tricks has been very nice thing from one of that active was day as active during to the as us. During this mission quietest Suns I have ever it ever is at least We've during had the maximum. we've seen a

Sunspot

,F

--

SL-III Time: 9/21/73

PC-98B/2 13:06 CDT

of solar phenomenon presented to us during this mission. And we have gotten better observations in every category than we ever hoped to get on every one of these phenomena. It's just incredible the amount of information we're getting back. We've got detailed information on the quiet solar atmosphere, and its structure that we've never seen before on a coordinated endeavor. We've had simultaneous ground people working on ground in coordination with the observations made upstairs, so we've had timedependent observations of the sort that never been able to achieve before. In addition to that we the we have

have observed the development of storms with so called active regions on the Sun. We've watched a number of them as they grew and died as they transciented from one side of the Sun to the other as it rotated around. We picked up several of them on more than one rotation. We've observed_ oh golly, I bet if we start cataloging it up, it will be over a hundred flares. Now of those hundred flares we've only got 5 or 6 that we've really talked about where we've had truly coordinated events. We've got on the order of one hundred flares or something like this where we've got partial data on, which is more detailed data than, you know, anybody has ever seen before. We've had coronal trancients, things going out of the corona. We've had prominences lifting off. You name it, we've seen it, and they have gotten good data on it, and they have gotten it quite often in remarkable fashion. They have responded - the crew has really responded beautifully. It really shows the advantage of having a really well trained man right up against the equipment that he is observing with where he's got (garble) with the information back and he can really move out with it. In terms of film usage and things of this sort, everybody is about run out of film on both camera loads that we have had up there. There are just thousands, and thousands, and thousands of photographs. Each one of these photographs contains a lot more information than let's say the Mars pictures do for example, individual Mars pictures do. And we've got a real problem trying to figure out which data we're going to select out and use, because there is so much data that we've really got a data management problem. We'll get our film back, I guess Wednesday night or early Thursday morning something of that sort. It will probably take depending on which grounp you're talking about, it will take anywhere from a couple of weeks to maybe a couple of months to get Just the original developing of film done. It will take us another couple of months to get any prints because things are END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/21/73

PC98C/I 13:06

CDT

MILLIGAN couple of months are just so much be able to look in any detail time we start with another I think we've

. ..

done,

and

it'll prints. And I we've

take

us

another

to - to get any data to handle. at this data that

Those things doubt if we'll really gotten on SL-III the up but SL-III;

until getting crew. had a

after SL-IV is over_ because by this data back, we'll be back And, I don't know how to put it marvelous scientific success on

I think it's Just been fantastic. And I think in part it's been due to the dlslclpllne that's been the flight control people here on the ground, and corporation up the doors experimenting; that part they've given the in this mission. they've done a Pls. They've They've done lot of things in Apollo they've

a large shown by the

really opened a lot of on the ground and the early learned to work

they never allowed to of the Skylab program

happen because

with us and we've learned to work with them. And they've really bent over backwards to do everything they could for us to allow us to do real time things; to allow us to talk to the crew for example, which is, you know_ quite a breakthrough. And allowing interchange to go on between the ground people and the crew, and it's really been great. And so I think in general we can say this I'm just very, very pleased. Have any questions or anything? PAO John. QUERY When you do get the data are some of the could you just give us a of what the scientists think they'll be most what they really want to get their hands on? some of the flares, but any other thing that will have of those. a priority and might be the most back, what few examples excited about, Obviously you think exciting out

MILLIGAN Well, scientists are no different than anybody else in that way. We'll take them - I obviously we'll work on the most spectacular events because you get but selenctific show and it gets though that when quiet Sun data. the most publicity Well, not that way. only news It makes

mean first

publicity the best I would it's the structure imagine

people the most interested. you really come down to it, It's the study of the overall

of the Sun and things going to get the most there's only so much situation. The solar from the a tornado havoc it on wrecks

llke this that - that are really attention over the long run. Because you can do with a very complicated flare on the Sun is not too dissimilar on You can the solar you can see attmosphere all

the ground. on the

SL-III Time: 9/21/73 and what

PC98C/2 13:06

CDT

it

does

to

it

and

things

of

this

sort,

and

you

can describe the event. But to try to figure out why it happened and how it happened, well that's a difficult job. And let's face it, it's - when you really want to spend the time to get out detail theoretical work, you'll end up working on those problems that you think you can solve. And those problems _hat we'll probably be able to solve are those problems that deal with just the general structure of the atmosphere and how it interacts on a long term basis. So, I think that's where the biggest payoff is going to be. We're going to have information on the - on the structure and the long term dynamics of the outer solar atmosphere that we've never had before. And it's a - it's a beautiful time to go in and really try to do some model building as to how the outer atmosphere of the Sun works. And I think that's where - in over the next 4 or 5 years that's where the major efforts are going to be because we do have the theoretical equipment available, the knowledge available to handle problems like that. PAO Jerry. QUERY Did you get any feel for the intensity and and energys of the particles thrown out during the flares? Were they very unusually large or what kind of radiation might have - MILLIGAN of particles, few 1O's of to particles ranging kilometers in the Well_ from or cosmic flare produces a whole particles that move Just hundreds of kilometers a gray range. And it a spectrum a second on

depends

the type of event how - how hard the spectrum gets. That is, how energetic some of the particles are, and how many of them there are depends upon the particular event. The Sun is a pretty good producer of - of these very high energy particles. And there are just an awful lot of them. They vary back and forth; every event is different. Maybe I didn't understand the question right. QUERY Let me I guess there were satellites up during this time, solar observatories and so forth. After a flare don't you get a - a cloud of protons of particles hitting the Earth? MILLIGAN Oh, yeah. We get numbers of different types. For instance, on the Xl flare that we had, we got within an half an hour we got, from some of the satellites, in this particular case it was the Vela satellites, but we got information energy few days coming protons. later, back to us that we had some energies. which fairly high And then a That is why you'll cosmic ray type get an aurora

-

SL-III Time: 9/21/73

PC98C/3 1306 CDT

gives you the other end of the soft stuff. It's blown out at the Earth. We've got an awful like this that - that we're study. The information is now, but there's there's area END that OF we're really going

spectrum, the very, very a very slow speed that hits lot of coincident events

going to have to go back and quite incomplete on them right all kinds of data in this to have to go back and dig out.

TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/21/73

PC98D/I 13:06

CDT

MILLIGAN on of go in to

-

-

the

information

is an going

quite -

incomplete

them right now, but there's - there's data in this area that we're really back and dig out. QUERY Then the biologists how much radiation the crew received.

all kinds to have to

are obviously interested Have you been able

get any calculations on - MILLIGAN Well, I think we've got some ideas, for instance, on that one flare that had the - was the proton event that we verified. The radiation that the guys received that day was extremely small. And this is precisely what you would expect, because we're inside of a magnetic bottle in the Skylab program. The Earth's magnetic field tends to shield the astronauts in the orbit they're in; provides a very good shield. So, - the - as I remember, and this is Just sort of off the head, off the top of the head, it was something llke 1 percent increase in the average orbital dosage rate. You know, down in the noise level, really. QUERY Nothing happened during these flares that you rwould have had MILLIGAN know, translunar them - biologist No. If they'd trajectory of or have some medical people been in a - in a sort, there might -

have been some worry and they might know, cuddle up inside the command they've got such a great amount of from the Earth's field that this factor

have had to go in, yon module or something. But shielding essentially this provided the safety

to them. QUERY Jim, from what you know now, or what you think you'll know in the next few months, just from the Skylab data; do you think that you're going to be able to say anymore about using solar energy on Earth practical wise. Or is that still pretty far off further - further away than something you can learn from Skylab? MILLIGAN I guess I have to get honest on that answer, on the answer on that one. Really the experiments that are associated with Skylab are basically research experiments and are not directed in that area. The work that has to go on in practlcal applications, that is utilization and solar power, and things of this sort, is basically an engineering Job. And it's an instrumentation problem, and it's a problem that's being worked on by practical people. And we already have the information on what the Sun's energy is doing here on the Earth. It's a matter of taking that energy and utilizing it to - that

source

S

-

SL-III Time: 9/21/73 and

PC98D/2 13:06

CDT

utilizing

it. isnt t in things

And

the

work

that

wetve

done

on

-

on

ATM really of practical

that direction. is that because

The only area in terms of the fact that we've ground based transient on llke

had this very, people and the

very integrated observations we

program between made onboard of

events Spectacular types of this sort. We should many problems of solar relationships. That is,

storms on the Sun and things have a lot better handle on of short term solar-terrestial the effect of flares and

things

this on the ionosphere, aurora producing events, and things of this sort than we've ever had before. We've got an awful lot of data utillz_ng the Sun as a light source on the absorption characteristics and things of this sort in the upper atmosphere of the Earth made with this particular doing for that he's background. crew. It's - it's an experiment that we've been Owen Garriott actually. A series of observations been very deeply interested in because of his We've got an awful lot of data in that area over a long range in time, but over differeny Earth to an extend that we really haven't because of the resolution of the instruments. lot of data for that of this sort that's we've got coming out figure Just out some another by just - that of this to really mission

that not only places on the gotten before So there's a wasn't planned

that we're going get out into the we have to accept. QUERY MILLIGAN transient implies. over a very short very rapidly and

to have to literature. What It's

way burden

- to that

do you mean a - really

coronal what

transient? the word

It's a - it's an event that takes place time period where materials is moving the - it interacts with the basic structure the magnetic fields a burst of particles the Sun or way it that and it causes causes a

of the solar corona - And reconflgnres and things of this sort. And usually or a burst of gas is thrown away from travels through a transient in it to reconflgure QUERY subflare or MILLIGAN the atmosphere the atmoshpere itself. Is miniflare? No. Sometimes are this in and what

such a disturbs they

sometimes cause

call coronal

flares

transients, and sometimes think for the most part in the solar atmosphere. END OF TAPE

they dontt. The flare is, rather low lying phenomona It occurs down - -

I

f

SL-III PC-98E/1 Time 13:06 CDT 9/21/73 MILLIGAN - and sometimes they don't. A flare is, I think for the most part a rather low lying phenomenon in the solar atmosphere. It occurs down, at least most of the event probably originates down in the tens of thousands of kilometer area above the surface of this, so called surface of the Sun. These transients that we're talking about take place over several radii sometimes in the way outer atmosphere of the Sun. And so they interact with a very large volume of the whole solar atmosphere. Sometimes a flare on the Sun triggers this kind of event. It's the starting pulse that causes the coronal transient, sometimes it isn't. Sometimes, something else happens. We really don't know all the mechanisms right now. It's one of the things we hope to gether in this program. QUERY Then what is a prominence. MILLIGAN A prominence is really just a cloud of gas, a cooler or cloud of gas that is sitting in the solar atmosphere. It's a region of higher density and tends to be a little bit cooler than the surrounding area. And so it gives the same sort of a general appearance on the Sun as a cloud from above gives on the Earth. And they are interesting to study because of the fact that they occur and because of the fact that we can observe them very easily with the instrumentation. QUERY Do they seem to have any relationship to either a transient or a flare as a result of? MILLIGAN They are usually - well, they are usually associated with what we call active regions on the Sun. They are clouds of gas that are confined together somehow with the magnetic field in the outer solar atmosphere. And usually when you have transient events on the Sun they ususally have they are usually associated with one of these active regions. And so when you have a flare or you have a transient event, these prominences or filiments we call them some times do get involved in the process that goes on. QUERY How much of a warning system do you have that a flare is about to errupt, or something is building up? In other words so you can tell the crew to get to their station. MILLIGAN Well, not very much. We really don't know precursors that well. That is one of the things we wanted to find on this mission, one of the things that we've all been looking for. Are there precursors that we can monitor that can tell us when things like flares occur, transient events? Now we've been trying to look in different regions of the spectrum to see if there is one region that tends to boll a little bit beforehand that gives us a clue as to when something might be happening. We have not done a very good job from the ground predicting these things. The solar weather people that

$L-III Time: 9/21/73

PC-98E/2 13:06 CDT

have been supporting us have done a magnificient Job, but they are in the same sort of situation as the weather man is down on the ground. They can give you probabilities and they can give you guesses as to which regions are apt to have the storms, and you know their freuqency of occurrence and things of this sort. But quite often we guess the wrong places. It turns out that the astronauts have in general, reacted before we discovered the events occurring on the ground. They have better information upstairs than we do on the ground. For example one of the TV displays, there is some indications now that this crew has picked up that seem to beget a bright spot on this TV display that NRL has on board, the so called XUV monitor. It monitors the Sun in the 200 angstrom region. There seems to be an indication that at least on some of the events that a bright spot occurs in an active region before a flare off. At least the crew has reported this back down. had some conversations with them about it. And this goes We've seems

to have happened before anythings happens on any of the other wavelength regions. At least this is what the crew has reported. And so it has allowed them to go early to some of these transient events long before we knew that they were going to occur. And so we are picking up things llke that, but we're in a real learning process. QUERY Have they been able to watch the spot form, a classic Sun spot form and follow its history? MILLIGAN Yes, we've got data on this sort of thing, probably better than we've ever had before, at least with the type of instrumentation we got on board. We have seen Sun spots form, they have observed them form. They have gone ahead and taken data on these things during the early part of the formation. We've got quite a few Sun spots throughout the mission where we have seen them grow, go through maturity and die out. We've got an awful lot of data of this sort, of the type that we've never seen before. And just a quick look data here indicates that the things are a lot more complicated and a lot more interesting than we had suspected they would be. END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/21/73

PC-98F/I 13:06 CDT

MILLIGAN

-

the

type

that

wetve

never

seen

before.

And just the qulcklook data here indicates are alot more complicated and a lot more we had suspected they would be. The data spectacular than we thought it would be_ about that or QUERY the - do -

that the things interesting than is a lot more

The - one of the big mysteries I guess Sun is what these spots are and how they form is think now that you're going to have a handle on this We're Some Yeah, getting a new theories I think lot more about will data. it or? be a lot from to of the ground

MILLIGAN QUERY MILLIGAN new with theories magnetic the sort

there

on it. We have instrumentation magnetic feilds and we've got

got simultaneous data that is instrumentation in data these regions in wavelength

measure of this

and things regions we

haven't seen before. We have I think photographed some very very early time periods of some spot formation that we_ve never been able to do before. Pick things up earlier than we can from normal ground instrumentation. And fin - we have found already indications of corelations between what the guys are observing in their magnetic analyzers on the ground and what were - what we're seeing up in orbit. The answer is that yes, we're going to have a lot more ideas than we had before. PAO OF TAPE Lot more ideas. Probably a 0 kay, thank you very lot more much. arguments.

END

SKYLAB Houston,

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Skylab III - Change Johnson Space Center September 22, 1973 12:06 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

Participants: Milt Jack Windier Riley, - Flight PAO Director

PC

99A

SL-III Time: 9/22/73

PC-99A/I 12:06 CDT

PAO ready or do EVA,

The

light

is

on

so

that

means

we're

to get started. Do you want to do a summary Hilt, you want to go right to questions. WINDLER Well, today we did a just another nominal so I'm ready for questions. PAO Wait for the microphone. QUERY I didn't quite understand all of the on you the know, ATM I fact, now, again didn't or getting everyit too good

discussion about powering thing squared away there. WINDLER Yes, myself when it we still don't was know

understand

going on. In about. Right

that's one of

something the TV monitors

on board the spacecraft a, I think, and I forgot I think we had a problem

is not operatin E correctly. We had to ask the ATM operator, but previously with it. But when Jack turned it on the S052 was okay, the calllhratlon, and after turn it off and leave it off. low and So he behold dusted another that off, course, He to see was too.

on to see if the dusting operation which it was, and then they did that time, it was the intend to And while particle the calibration apparently jumped was on

going on the disk.

Then some time later when they went he wasn't going to be sat - I don't wasn't going to be satisfied until if that particle was really gone. do that and he couldn't get one of a lot of confusion about where the

up there -Owen of blame him, either. he looked at himself

And so he went up there to the monitors on. And there switches were since we

were - we kind of Jumped into the middle of the procedure. But in any event, in the testing that went on after that time, gone enough, we've done enough troubleshooting to establish the fact that the camera on the spacecraft is okay; the one that takes the pictures is all right. And the downllnk is all right to the ground, but the monitor that actually displays it to the crew is what has malfunctioned. And apparently, there is something wrong in the power supply to the monitor. And I'm not real sure, but what this isn't an intermittent type, problem and we have to look some more at what happened to us before. closed on that. But right now, one of those does not come on. PAO John. go back and So the story two monitors

welve

isn't

QUERY What are they supposed to be doing tomorrow? WINDLER They have a medical run on each one of the crew members and they do stowage, transfers, and a limited amount of deactivation, and one science experiment I guess you'd call it, $019. QUERY What has been the impact, if any, of collecting more data in some areas than was anticipating, which means they will be bringing back more, I assume they will be bringing

,f

SL-III Time: 9/22/73

PC-99A/2 12:06 CDT

back more stuff than had recently been anticipated. How do you all work that problem, if it is a problem? WINDLER I don't think it's any practical problem. If you mean how does it effect what was originally scheduled for the next mission - or bringing the data back? QUERY No, I mean Juast the physical (garble) storage. Windler oh, the stowage. Well, they have been very particular about maintaining control of the stowage. And so there is no problem with that other than the command module went up stuffed, and it's going to come back stuffed. But some things have not been approved over the past 60 days, particularly, you know, over the past 40 days, say, because there was not room to bring them back. So we have, @e are, as always, limited by the command module's capability to return equipment. QUERY Well, if I could follow it up a minute. That sort of brings the question then as far as you remember Bean was talking about really, you can give the crew more work to do and this that and the other. That would seem to place really an upper limit on the amount give any crew to do based on what you can command module. of work you can glt back into the

_-

WINDLER It probably does. I think what we need is a vehicle llke a truck that we can run up there and back and can be reused and all of that. And maybe we'll call it a shuttle. But you are right. We've always known that to be a limitation on the equipment. And yes, there is only a certain amount that the crew can do. I'm sure the ATM people would have liked to have had lots more film on this last mission to use. END OF TAPE

,f

SL-III Time: . 9/22/73

PC99B/I 12:06 CDT

WINDLER the crew can do. liked to have had

... is only a certain amount that I'm sure that the ATM people would have lots more film on this last mission to -

.-

to use, but they used what they had. And it'll take them a long time to analyze the data. There's advantages in spreading out data, as you know, and there's disadvantages too. But anyway, they've, I think, utilized what they had resources they had very well. But we are limited by the capacity of the command module to come back. And likewise, we'll be limited, in some respects, by what can be taken up on IV because that's limited in what is already on the spacecraft, you know, that can be used that's allocated to Skylab-lV. QUERY What's happening or has already happened to the spiders and the fish? WINDLER Well, one spider's dead; one spider's alive; I think the two big fish that were taken up are dead; the minnows, as far as I know, are still alive. And I don't think we ever got to ask Owen how many - the minnows the baby - the one's that were hatched. We're going to bring them all back, so we'll get to count them. QUERY They're bringing Anita back, too; the dead spider? WINDLER Yes, that's my - Yes. That's in a little bitty vile. QUERY They're bringing the dead fish, too? WINDLER Well, I think they're all in a plastic container, and you can't hardly bring back some without the others. (Laughter) QUERY You ought to wrap them in the New York Times. PAO Any other questions? WINDLER The - that's the end, huh? You probably copied all the answers to the EVA questions. We tried to ask them all we could think of while it was fresh on their mind. more And I think, than adequate as for you the recognized, that two men that were the cooling outside. was certainly And I

would say, Just barely adequate for the one that did stay in, as we pretty well predicted. QUERY That does kind of remind me of one other question. Now the next crew will resurface the the primary coolant loop. Is this an operation that will take place during an EVA? And if it is, I'm kind of wondering how long - in other words, you would have to use this same cooling method, say, for the first EVA, or whenever you schedule it. And it would have to be - How long does that take and that sort of thing? WINDLER Yes, right now, the - the primary intent

f

SL-III Time: 9/22/73

PC99B/2 12:06

CDT

is to use the gas method again. And we're thinking it'll probably take considerably longer than a 2-1/2 hours it took today, or 2 hours and 41 minutes, which is one reason why we're interested in what the crew had to say. And I think what they said is it'd be no problem. In fact, AI said he thought he could go 8 hours. Now on the other hand, too, recognize the fact that people are still evaluating the way of reservicing it, and it is subject to modification. But right now, we do plan to do it through an EVA and we'd have to use the gas cooling method until we got that done. QUERY How long (Garble)? WYNDLER I've heard numbers of - of, I think, it's 4 or 5 hours, so it wouldn't surprise me any if it wasn't. Now, obviously, the crew - the Skylab-IV crew will be able to train to that procedure, which the III crew did not have the advantage of; and that'll make it considerably easier. So that's,you know, off in the future, and it's going to get tweaked out between now and then. PAO END OF TAPE Okay, thank you.

SKYLAB Houston,

HEWS

CENTER Texas

Skylab III - Change Johnson Space Center September 23, 1973 12:28 p.m. CDT

of

Shift

Briefing

Participants: Neil Jack Hutchinson, Riley, PAO Flight Director

PC-100

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-IOOA/I 12:28 CDT

PAO change of shift you want to give HUTCHINSON

with us

Okay, we're ready to get started Flight Director Nell Hutchinson. a rundown. Okay, today was our day to finish

with the Nell off the

medical work for Skylab-3 and get the CSM stowed. Both of which were proceeding fairly normally. I guess l'd kind of like, in this stowage business, to - if you were going on a six weeks vacation, you were going in a Volkswagon and had to pack up your whole family and you had to do it by remote control, all things considered, we seem to be doing okay though. Awful lot of questions on stowage back and forth, nothing insurmountable, just getting all the little things in all the right nooks and crannies. As far as the Flight Plan goes today, it was just being executed pretty much per normal. I really haven't got much to say about that. We're in the process right now, of the last medical run of the Skylab-3 mission. And as you know, EREP has been closed out and ATH has been closed out; and tonight, we close and the next day, our deactivation. activation and entry on the next and the next day in the afternoon. is the medical, and tomorrow And then, of course, deday. Tomorrow is deactivation the morning today that and entry, had nothing out

deactivation in We had a problem

to do with the Flight Plan in the ATM C&D coolant loop. The ATM C&D coolant loop is a water loop, waters the heat transport mechanism - the fluid in the loop. It has a heat exchanger with the airlock module primary loop and that's how we end up getting rid of the heat overboard. This loop also is a loop that runs through some of the EREP gear, llke the tape recorder. I think it's kind of early, yet, to say what it is what kind of problem we've had, basically, the symptomology was the crew begin, and I believe, I just came back on after a couple of days off, but to my knowledge, the first time they reported it was first thing this morning. The last day or so, on occasion, they had heard a strange gurgling sound down in the airlock module, obviously, exterior to the spacecraft, and they described, , this morning, very carefully where what's it was, mounted and on we immediately the outside of started to the airlock look in around for that area.

And there are a couple of things there. One of the things are the coolant reservoirs for the - the eight coolant reservoirs, which are Jugs about this big around, and there are eight of them in series, four sets of two, side by side. And all the plumbing for them and their location for the airlock module primary coolant loop is in that location described by the crew. Also, there, in the same general vicinity, are the three coolant pumps for the ATM C&D coolant loop. Now when

F

SL-III Time: 9/23/73
/-

PC-100A/2 12:28 CDT

HUTCHINSON (CONT) they first reported it, and there was some talk about the frequency of occurrence being roughly an hour - certainly not every rev, but on an hour to hour and a half basis, it sort of sounded like it was probably associated with thermal cycling, which we have seen in the primary coolant loop even though it is shut down and we believe most of the fluid has leaked out of it. It varies maybe 4 or 5 psi a rev. It will go from 4 to 8 and back to 4 again, cyclically as you go through that night time and back into the day. That was our first assumption at what might be causing it. Then it finally happened this morning about 9 o'clock or i0 o'clock Houston time where the gurgling sound occurred and we were also over a site. And low and behold we saw some strange performance in the ATM C&D coolant loop. And the strange performance was a dropoff in that we have some flow transducers in there that tell us how much fluid is flowing past them. And we saw some dropoffs - like the loop normally flows under a single pump

END

OF

TAPE

f-

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCIOOB/I 12:28 CDT

HUTCHINSON - - so much fluid is flowing past them. And We saw some dropoffs - like the loop normally flows under a single pump flow conditions, we can only run one pump in this loop. But it flows about 230 pounds an hour, and it was dropping off to like 200 pounds an hour coincident with the gurgling sound. I describe is as a gurgling sound, I really don't have any way of knowing that that's really what it sounded like. It was alternately described as a mechanical grating to somebody with an air hose under water letting it bubble. So Itm not sure how you'd characterize it, Anyway, it turns out that - and then we really begin to get on it because it it appeared that we might have something wrong with the ATM C&D coolant loop. And indeed, not - the frequency began to speed up. And it happened again about 20 or 30 minutes later; again over a ground site, and again it was accompanied by a dropoff in the coolant flow. And by this time we'd decided that it was possible we could have a problem in the pump package which I told you is located in the same general vicinity the crew seemed to be hearing this noise coming from. So since we have the ATM C&D powered down, that coolant loop is not required. It's being - it normally would have been turned off late tomorrow as a standard part of deactivationlate tomorrow or early Tuesday morning, I'm not sure which. I can look that up if, that's important. We decided to go ahead and turn it off now to preclude possible - anything further happening to the -to the loop in case we had a bearing problem in the pump. Now these pumps have the bearings are cooled by the flow of liquid in the loop. In other words, the liquid actually gets passes over the bearing surfaces on the pump. So, the concern here was that if we had a bearing going out in the pump, which we really have no firsthand knowledge that that's the failure mode, if there is a fa - if the failure is in the pump mechanism, of possibly getting some contaminants into the loop, which we don't want, of course. The plan now is to leave the loop off until we can get a chance to change out - the loop has a filter in it that's changeable. And I'm not sure if we ever got this completely straight, but if my memory serves me correctly, we have changed the filter one time, and it was at the beginning of Skylab-ll. And it was changed - we launched with a clean filter in there; we ran the loop; we cycled all three pumps during activation of Skylab-ll, and by the way, these pumps can only be cycled from the air, by the crew, for the express

SL-III Time: 9/23/73 purpose the the

PCIOOB/2 12:28 CDT

of

cleaning

the

loop

out

so

to

speak

so

that

all

plumbing in filter out;

it had been flushed. put a new filter in -

And there,

then and

we changed we've been of course, period between

on - in that configuration for turning the loop down Skylab--ll morning -

ever since. as during we

Except, unmanned

and Skylab-lll as tomorrow afternoon.

were going The filter

to do tomorrow situation is so minute

that we flew we do have a

up another spare filter spare filter onboard.

on Skylab-lll, It's about a 15

Job to change it out. It's going to be changed out I hope this afternoon. The decision hasn't been made yet, but I'm fairly certain we'll change it ont. And we will undoubtedly turn the loop back on with the second pump. There are three pumps in this loop. I'II say again that we've been except on the number for a short i pump period since the beginning of of time when we turned the the program, other

two pumps on to flush them out at the Go on to the second pump, pump 2, and we've got a good operating loop. Now, so we have a lot of redundancy, and I

beginning of Just to make the - we've think we want

Skylab-II. sure got it to

make sure that we've got a good loop before we leave here on Skylab-III. The implications of not having the loop at all are not overwhelming. Cools the EREP tape recorder and that certainly would - it also cools the EREP C&D - cools the EREP C&D. The C&D constraints, I believe, and I'm not totally up on this since it just happened, but I believe the C&D on restraints the ATM C&D than that on both the EREP control display panel are crew touch-temperature cold the panel and constraints in the panels. electronics to keep keep the

rather The one cold the tape END

trying to keep the electronics we are concerned with keeping And and, some in of -

is the EREP tape recorder. crew touch-temperature down recorder cold would require OF TAPE

both cases, course, to -

F-

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCI00C/I 12:28 CDT

HUTCHINSON touch temperature cold would require the only equipment

down some that

-

And

in

both

cases, to that duZy

to

keep

the

crew recorder Now the

and, of course, duty cycle on would require

keep the tape equipment. cycle on in

ATM C and D are those big television monitors. They're the ones, johies, that really generate the heat. And as you know, we lost one of those the other day. So we only have one of those. And I heard some figures before I left the Control Center of a duty cycle to keep the touch temperatures within 105 degrees, which is the maximum we'd like to get a panel that the crew's got their hands on. The maximum we'd like to get it to is something on the order of 15 minutes of daylight cycle. So you know, you'd be you would have to modulate the use of it and not have it on for not more than 15 minutes a rev, which is not overly restrictive and certainly would'nt be as good as continuous - having a continuous television picture there, but certainly wouldn't impair the ATM science tremendously. On the EREP side of the duty cycle on a the tape house, I recorder, don't but have that any has figures for an obvious

implication in length of passes and et cetera, and maybe some different operating procedures, turning the recorder on and off during passes or something llke that. And I don't have any - any duty cycle data on the EREP tape recorder. So that's where we stand on the coolant loop. And I have a feeling, when I left, the guys were getting read - I'm sure we're going to do something about it this afternoon because we'd llke to get it all out of the way before we get into the activities canned, that's right for tomorrow and we don't out of through the it. of and llke the next to have day. anything Since in days You we had another they're fairly that Flight Plan so we recall, can flow we had during problem

ordinary the last two It's kind of ironic. day later, we got but into

a - of course, deactivation with near John

it was a Skylab-2,

- it was coolant

the refrigeration the implications PAO Wolf. is the

system. Although this that one did. I guess Okay. Go to questions.

one has nowhere that's all. Jack. Any questions? it is the pump. Is that the I'm the I would but

QUERY But if it situation?

You're not quite sure that pump, you've Rot two backups.

HUTCHINSON eot sure we'll ever pump off. I'm sure Unless we got down

That's how it stacks up. And, John, prove one way - It's llke, we turned we're not going to turn it back on. to where there was nothing left to do and a loop, or not. Now Has not been to was analyse bearing

-

turn it back on. We have two more pumps if we may never know if it was the pump some talk about bringing a filter back. _. yet. Of course, would be trapped or whatever.

and I doubt there is decided what material

the obvious intent, there, in the filter to see if it

SL-III Time: 9/23/73
f-

MCI00C/2 12:28 CDT

PAO QUERY objective seriously system? HUTCHINSON affected I think got to failures remember to get

Tom Nell, - the scientific affected, even If that's

Bell. you're work if you saying that the on the SL-4 would still had trouble in that to say know, anyway. context, that. you I scientific not be with this seriously But you more a triply

you put it reasonable a you fix,

that they're yourself in

need two mean,lt's

redundance system. So before you get yourself in sequence whatsoever, and all you got to do is turn the filter out, turn the other pump on, and you're in business. And recall that if it indeed is what it on may be a bearing failure in there has got-heard a number the pump, the pump like 2,000 hours

any con- change right back we think that's on it.

You know, which would carry us way on past the Skylab-4 type of time frame. So, you know, you can draw your own conclusions. I don't think, if you had two more failures, which is unlikely, since the pumps are operated serially, have to turn another one on, and have it break. Of course, you don't operate them unmanned now. And then turn another one on and have it go to pot on you before you'd be in a posture where you'd even have to duty cycle any. And then can turn the equipment on and off to get the maximum amount of use out of it without thermally, we're kind of Thermally, you never know spond. You might be able not an equipment might be able to cycle, just PAO QUERY 2, the turn constrain, run a TV it off at Tom. What seems Oh, overheating it. And you know, - thatts always a funny ballgame. quite how things are going to to run those TV monitors since it's monitor night, the crew for the and you holding homing not doing up in on touch whole do constrain. daylight to

you'd

you

reit's You ATM. 17 How

anything number well. So

Number the

crew

stowing to be we're

today, pretty it.

about

flight teams? HUTCHINSON

flight

teams are holding up great. And I think stowing is everything except the refrigerated stuff. The time we finish today, therell be nothing left to put in the CSM except the refrigerated stuff which is the medical sam - the urine, the blood, the bioside, bioside samples stuff that's biologically of the refrigerator. So ! - Specifically, I mean, _ike the rest of the EVA M228, all the film, the handheld camera END OF TAPE and ear samples and so on. All this active that's been in the chillers that's an awful broad statement. we're putting in all that stuff stuff. Like S149, went in, it. All You - know, the S019 film, all

all of stuff.

i f

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-IOO-D/1 12:28 CDT

HUTCHINSON

(CONT)

all

of

it,

you

know

the

S019

film,

all the handheld camera stuff, all the EREP film, the EREP tapes, all that went in today or will be in before the day is out. So the CSM is fairly well loaded up except, of course the ATM film was already onboard, was put on the CSM after the EVA. So that pretty much leaves the biomedical samples the refrigerated biomedical samples. QUERY What about the spiders? HUTCHINSON I believe both - let's see, the fish go the are fish go onboard. list, QUERY in the IMSS I haven't I container looked in so I guess detail at that, you the that know, spiders

-

stowage the

suspect they are. Who's idea was

to

put -

spider on HUTCHINSON

the

display board over I don't know, it

in the MOCR? just kind of

evolved

a lot of people. I guess I had a hand in it. But a lot of people. QUERY Could you give us a little capsule on how it hap pened? How it started? HUTCHINSON Well, the spiders, I guess, kind of achieved a little notoriety and one of the flight control teams kind of championed the spider as the symbol of success on Skylab-IIl I guess So that's - you know, we cooked up a display on the board that we float up over on. I don't know, it Just call the spider the Silver it that. you QUERY give us the HUTCHINSON name there when kind of fell Team mascot my particular out, I guess if you'd llke team is you could to call would

Incidentally of your Oh, yes.

as a matter spider and spell The spider - -

of record it please?

is to

QUERY HUTCHINSON one from the have down here

He has a llve The spider is one of the test from Hunststville.

spider over there. No, we - the llve spider spiders that we happened And it is one of the

ground control spiders in a the control center. The one may have heard the - I don_ t talk? PAO But our transcript name and I know HUTCHINSON and if you're A-r-a-c-h-n-e, weaving spend

cage and it's over there in you are referring to - you know, is this press conference

I think yesterday it was referred to. people, I don't believe, understood the they didn't spell it right. Okay. The spider's name is Arachne with the Green mythology, lady who tried her into weaving to she out was - that's do Minerva she could where the

familiar she was her

and Minerva the rest of

turned life

a spider so webs. That's

f

SL-III PC-IO0-D/2 Time: 12:28 CDT 9/23/73 HUTCHINSON (CONT) spider got her name. I guess I could attribute that to my wife, if youtd really llke to know. PAO I'm glad we're coming home. (Laughter) QUERY Where do you have Arachne in the Control Room? Do you have her in a cage? HUTCHINSON She was - yes, well, John, she's in a flight - we have a flight - a backup flight cage with the plexlglass sides. And it's just a vented module about this wide, you've probably seen one. About that wide and about that tall. And she's sitting there on the Flight Director console. QUERY How has she been - how well has she been doing? HUTCHINSON Well, today - she's been in Huntsville and I guess she's been doing very well. Today was the first day i had seen her here in the control center. She came in about 4 or 5 days ago. And she didn't have a very splffy looking web today. But I don't know how Closely we've been adhering to the you know they spin at night so you cover up the apparatus with a black cloth. I donlt know how long it's been since they covered her up, and she's respun her web. So I don't know how old the web was, it was there today but I understand she's been spinning well. QUERY What do you feed her? HUTCHINSON I believe they feed her meat but we have, you know, it's a once a week or so process and I don't believe she's been fed since we brought her down here. I can't answer that for sure though. QUERY Why did they bring her from Huntsville? HUTCHINSON I wanted to see a spider. And so since we had the one up on the board we decided since we had the ground control spiders here and had a spare cage here in Houston, we'd just bring one down. General interest. Really very small, after you see all the television pictures, you lose your perspective of size as far END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCI00E/I 12:28 CDT

HUTCHINSON

-

-

really

very

small.

After

yeu

see

all the television pictures you lose your perspective. Besides, the spider is - you knew, this body is the size of your little fingernail. It's a really fairly small spider when it comes right down te it, censidering it was blown up to incredible proportions on the television screen with closeups. PAO END OF TAPE Thank you.

SKYLAB

NEWS

CENTER Texas

_

Houston,

Skylab III - Earth Resources Johnson Space Center September 23, 1973 2:08 pm, CDT

Experiment

Package

Briefing

Participants: M. Leroy Jensen - University of Utah Geological Findings from Skylab II William G. Hart - U.S. Dept. of Agriculture Norman MacLeod - American University - Afllcan V.R. Wilmarth - Overview of EREP PAO - Jack Riley

Drought

F

\"

PC-102

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-102A/I 14:08

PAO briefing.

We're ready Participants are Dick

to start Wilmarth

with from

the Earth Resources the Johnson Department G. Hart, in Weslaco, in Washington to discuss to our

Space Center, Dr. M. L. Jensen, University of Utah, of Geological and Geophysical Sciences Mr. William U.S. Department of Agriculture, Research Division, Texas, and Dr. Norman McLeod of American University DC. I'ii turn it over to Dick Wilmarth. our WILMARTH activities Okay, this afternoon, relative to SL-3, primarily;

we're going look ahead

planned activities in SL-4, and of, I think, most importance to the press, is to have three of our investigators tell you about some of the activities that they have conducted and some of the results with the SL-2 data, as well as some of the SL-3 TV. So to begin with, we've been processing the SL-2 data, distribution to the Pls is underway. Can we have the first slide? As a recap, I think it's good to look back and see what our program is, for a moment. We've got to - this is our slide indicating what we have in the way of investigations - investl gator teams. There's 150 of them, and if you add all of the co-investigators, relative to their own investigation teams, there's something on the order of an additional 300 investigators. So if you look at the total program, EREP wise, the principle investigator activities cover something on the order of about 500 scientist and engineers and technicians, directed to understanding in the analysis of our EREP data. May we have the next one, please? The SL-2 data, distribution is underway, as I stated. For your information, all of the optical data has been distributed. This is the slx-camera format that we that has been distributed to the Pls from the 190A of the multispectral on the right, camera.. You can right hand corner. see up The there, color the color IR in the which is

come

doesn't come through too well over here on the left the other - other four are black and white. Color top, just plain black and white on the bottom. So PIs receive this information and from here, there ways of going. They can go to color composits of the various the black and whites to enhance direct importance to their own of the task sites the PIs have, this format in response to their the next one? This is our 190B that goes to the PIs. This is in black and white. area. It's It the is O'Neal, Nebraska

corner, IR on the that the are several

enlargement,, they can request color IRs and the colors, or any of the features that are investigations. So for each we have distributed to them direct requests. Can I have standard format 5-1nch film the color. We also have it and here, it's again, all they it's can of go

of

$0243, from

the

to color slicing - density slicing, color composltlng, Bpon their own investigations. So now that fundamentally covers our multispectral and our Earth terrain camera

depending data.

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCI02A/2 14:08 CDT

As you well know, we've got four sensors that are involved in the electronic data analysis. Now in order to determine the area that the PI is going to work with the computer-compatlble tapes, relative to his own capability and facilities, we have distributed to all the PIs wanting the multispectral 192 data, and can I have the next one to show the press what kind of screening film is distributed. This is the format, and as you can see_ with enlargements or enhancements of the color, the individual areas of which the PI can select and then provide us, essentially, on a GMT or a time hack basis, information that he will require in the way of channels or in the way of special processing for the 192, also, for the 193 and the 194 and the 191. So this is what we've distributed to the Pls. We have received requests from the Pls on the 192 screening film, are in the process of preparing the necessary channels for their investigations, and within a couple - within, I think the schedule now calls for in October and November, distribution of the remaining computer compatible tapes for END OF TAPE

_-

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCIO2B/I 14:08 CDT

SPEAKER - called for, in October and November, distribution of their remaining computer compatable tapes for the microwave analysis, and for the multispectral scatter data studies. Now, in addition to that, there is several things that the Pls can do. And we have done some of the the processing here just as an example of what can be done, taking the - the 192 computer - the magnetic tape that is brought back with the crew. Can I have the next one, please? And here we've taken the black and white - I think it's channel 7 - and have converted it from a magnetic tape to a film image. Now, this is a rather sophisocated process and is a matter of looking at it from what is a utility of the 192 data rather than as a over all tool for each of the investigators to work in. If I could have the next one, please. Of the same area this shows the color composites of I think it was channels 3, 7 and ii, and it shows you the variations and certainly the vegetation which shows up as red, and the blue is, of course, the water in the river valleys. But it shows you the kinds of - of flexibility that can be built into any analysis of the 192 mag tape that is brought back from Skylab-ll. And certainly on Skylab-lll and IV we'll have considerable more data to work with over different areas. Okay, can I have the next one, please? All right, so that covers essentially where we are with our 190 - or our SL-II data distribution plan and some of the things that we have accomplished with them. SL-III was a - indeed a - a very fruitful and excellent mission. We started out with the idea that we were going to run 26 Z-LV passes. We far exceeded that, we've got 39 Z-LV passes and rather throughout the world. In addition to that, as you may know, from the solar inertial mode we can obtain very useful data, certainly with the 190B or the Earth terrain camera, and this is what we've acomplished during the SL-III. We've taken essentially 3 sor - 3 solar inertial passes over Paraguay to obtain the height resolution 19DB data for use in developing a cartographic experiment. In other words, if it's possible, with stereo coverage, to produce a map of an area using the 192 stereo coverage as the photogrametric data base for developing the control points. This is a rather interesting experiment to be conducted in areas that are relatively inaccessible such as the parts of Paraguay or - or Gran Chaco of Argentina. In the Sargasso Sea, the (garble) Oceanographic Institute along with the people term interest in the
f

up at Louis distribution

Research, have of the Sargasso

had a weed

long

i

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCI02B/2 14:08 CDT

which is growing at a - I think the figures that they quoted to me are some 4 million tons of the Sargasso weed in the Sargasso Sea which is off, about 150 miles east of the Coast of Florida. They are looking at it from the standpointz Is the seaweed a resource? And we obtained some information for them and they will be doing the analysis of that. To be discussed later on, we obtained a - by Dr. McCleod - we obtained a sea - a solar inertial pass over the Central Africa drought area. And this should give us an additional data point. We did obtain some additional - some Z-LV data over the western part of the drought area, over Mall, specifically. And that together with the solar inertial data gives us a, another data point for looking at some of the desiccation processes that are going on there today. So in essence then we've got something on the order of - of 45 excellent data points, data passes, over some rather interesting parts of the World. Can we move on to the next one, please? Statistically, this is always of interest, I think, to people to understand that this is really a very major data collection facility that we have up there. And to give you a feel - END OF TAPE

SL-III /Time: 9/23/73

PC-I02C/I 14:08

SPEAKER • to people to data collection understand facility

this that that

is -

always

of

interests, very And

I

think,

this is really a we have up there.

major to give be

you a feel for it, we got something on the order of i0,000 estimated that we have not yet completed the final detail review of how much data we did actually take, which would usable for the PIs. I've estimated out of about 10,000

frames for the 190B, approximately 2,000 for the 190 and the DAC 191 film is used primarily for a data point to determine the location of the ground station or the ground target, say, for the 191 infrared spectrometer. We should use up a considerable amount of data for that on - and also, for additional uses of the DAC camera. For all of the 192, 191, 193 and 194_ which is all recorded on mag tape, a rather startling amount of 90,000 feet of magnetic tape. So those are rather interesting statistics, and shows you that we do have a rather enormous amount of data collected and to be returned by the crew. Can we move on, please? Okay. It's hard to put the world on an easy map to show you where we have collected data. Can we have the other one, please? I wonder if we can't put that one over here, and we can collectively look at it from a total stand point, if you could, please. Let me reorient myself here for a moment. Here are the locations of the - and copies of this can he made available at the end of this press conference, if you so desire. It shows you the distribution of all the ground tracks that we took data on on SL-III. Let me point out - that this ground track here and this ground track here are essentially Z-LV data takes over the hurricane or tropical storm, I think it did get essentially to a hurricane, Christine. We attempted some others, but they didn't cooperate very well with us, and they moved off the ground track. But I think the important thing to show you here is that we have covered, essentially, all of the United States. We have taken data in all of the 48 states. We've had some very interesting and very good luck with the weather in taking the data take across Japan. Early in the SL-III, over in that far slide, there, we took data beginning Thailand, across the Java, east of Malaysia_ and down across Australia. That mark across there is not one of our paths, incidentally; that's horizontal. We also acquired very good data over parts of Europe. of Africa we made, certainly, of the world, including the on up into Germany, and as well as down on over scending passes. So, I obtained data for, but I And as you can see, on the far side several passes up over that part Mall area, on up over into Spain,

in

on up into Sicily, end the toe of Italy, into the Italy and France on the dedidn't count all the states that we know that we've got data in all of the

f_

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PC-I02C/2 14:08 CDT

SPEAKER (CONT) U.S. states; and probably, I didn't count them, but there is probably 35 countries that we obtained data for. For - In response to the investigator requirements. Now, to give you a feel for this, the repeated coverages, Just to back up for a moment, the repeated coverages were, in part, conducted in order to fill in the areas where we had not optimum wearer. So you can see some repeated passes across the United States and on most of the passes there, one down through here. And the reason for that is because weather did have a very important affect on our data collection, but, so far as, I can see now, the repeated coverage did provide us the necessary data collection that we needed to satisfy the PI requirements on the SL-III. Now on SL-II. a lot of those passes look very similar because we did complete the descending tracks on the SL-II END OF TAPE

f_

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PCI02D/I 14:08 CDT

SPEAKER very similar because tracks on the SL-II.

-

too.

A

lot

of

those

passes

look doing some of

we did complete the descending And on the SL-IV, we'll be collection, and - but for different seasonal please? Some highlights because I want to have As -

the same type of data provide the Pls a data Okay, can we move on, want to dwell on this talk more than information on of the hurricane

in order to data points. - I don't the investigators get some stages the

I do today. the developing Christine.

I told you, we did and the date - decay We obtained data over

r

African drought areas, and is the last pass, and I will speak to that, we obtained data over the active volcano Etna in in Italy. And believe it or not, the weatherman was good to us, and we did get data over Houston. It took us all through SL-II and III, but we did get data over Houston. I'm happy to report that today. A very interesting, severe storm developed in Olkahoma, in one of our passes. And one of the major investigations of Dave Pitts here at JSC, is to determine what is the - the nature of the temperatures and moisture distribution prior to a severe storm. In Olkahoma, this did occur about 4 hours prior to a very severe hail and tornado storm. In Olkahoma we obtained the necessary clear data - EREP da_a for his investigation, which is very difficult to - - to obtain, relative to a severe storm. The Gulf of Mexico sports fishery experiment, and there's been several press releases on that, so I won't stop. And in Arizona, around Phoenix, which is known as ARETS or Arizona regional ecological test site, we had a clear day. We had a helicopter in the area; we had a P-3 flying at 5,000 and I0,000 feet; we had the C130 at, essentially, the - about 20,000 feet; we had, also the spacecraft overflight along with the U2 at about 60,000. We got a compliment of data over a very clear area, over an area that's for remote sensing. of data for use in been intensively studied, So we have a complimentary determining the atmospheric specifically, sequence effects

in utility of the various instruments for remote sensing in that area as can be applied to anyother areas that we can can look at. We did two Earth limb experiments looking at the distribution of the constituents with - with the 190A and the 192 from the atmosphere on up to the top of the - the atmosphere, essentially, about 80 kilometers. We did that twice at the end of a Z-LV data pass. Visual observation experiments, we conducted numerous types of nandheld and visual observation experiments by the crew

f_

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCI02D/2 1408 CDT

in order to help us better de,elope the techniques and the onboard data packs for the SL-IV crew to aid in obtaining information of direct use to the EREP investigators as well as to - to areas or to agencies such as in the drought area for - of Mall, supplimenting some of the Z-LV and solar inertial data that we can collect on EREP. Can we move on? What are we going to do in SL-IV? The blocks show the general areas or periods where we have good coverage. Now, when I say good coverage, I mean we have the appropriate lighting conditions of, essentially, 20 to 20 Sun angle. Elevations, they overfly major parts of the continents or - or whatever the ground coverage may require. So, you see, we've got two periods to overfly the US early in SL-IV, and then late in SL-IV. South America, early in December, and again, the latter part of December_ early in January. Now, this is assuming we're going to have a launch on - as now projected, on the llth of November. Europe is very similar to the United States, only a little bit further north. Africa, late in November, and again early in January. And then the Australia and Malaysia country, early in the December on over to about the 15th of December. The points there at New Zealand and Japan are END OF TAPE

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WILMARTH

-

-

country

already

into

December

on

over -

to about the 15th of December. The points there, New Zealand New Zealand and Japan are to obtain some interesting predawn data for geothermal studies using the 192 as well as the 190A and B data. So again we've got something very similar to what we've run through SL-3 and a good data take going as far to do the as I wish same to thing discuss on in SL-3, a good data take early the latter part of SL-3, and So I think afternoon, that's Next in we're

on SL-4. that this

about we

have Bill Hart, who's going to that he is - he has completed, the insect investigations down of Texas and Mexico. Bill.

talk on some of the preliminary as they along the Rio Grande

activities may be, on and parts

HART Thank you, Dick. Potentially the most damaging situation that can occur with an insect pest is the introduction of a new species to an area. This is particularly true, because the insect usually arrives without any of its natural enemies with it, As a result the populations can explode very rapidly, inflict severe damage on an area, and remain destructive for a prolonged period. For this reason, efforts to prevent new introductions or to eradicate those from gaining a foothold can be readily justified. Since I work on a border area on citrus insects_ we're very cognizant of the potential hazards of new pest introductions. Because of this, we have explored new approaches that would lend support to methods that would aid in exclusion of new pests. In order to effectively explore these approaches, it's necessary to have a thorough knowledge of vegetative areas on both sides of the border; or in the case of coastal areas, the distribution of vegetation approaching the coast or at ports of entry, which are particular hazards in the establishment of new pests. Ground surveys to gather ecological data required to complete this picture are extremely time consuming, costly, and in most cases, not very efficient, because many of the areas are inaccessible. For this reason, we propose to investigate the use of photography from Skylab to develop information along the critical border areas between northeast Mexico and the lower Rio Grande avoid introduction and also theirs Valley of Texas. We did this in order of our more serious pests into Mexico, into our area. We had added incentives to in

this area because the citrus black fly had become very abundant in northeast Mexico, and a series of infestations had occurred on citrus trees on the United States side. Despite a vigorous _ffort by the Animal and Plant Health Inspection services of the United States Department of Agriculture, and the excellent cooperation of the Mexican officials, infestations continued to occur the fact 29 months that in after recent the year_ original we've had find. the This, coupled Mediterranean with

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-102E/2 14:08 CDT

fruit fly invade our area, and repeated Mexican fruit fly, gave added impetus information about avenues of entry of

season finds of the to o_r efforts to find these pests, in areas

of stress due to the continuity of vegetated areas. The preliminary information obtained from Skylab has greatly whetted our interests, since it clearly shows the areas of continuous vegetation leading up to the border from both sides and the points of stress that would require increased vigilance in attempts to exclude new pests from being introduced. The Skylab data of interest to us was collected on three types of film. High definition black and white, normal color and false-color infrared. All of these films contributed to the information we were seeking. First has excellent definition, above - END OF TAPE slide but please. it leaves The black a lot of and white questions film

Skylab-lll PC-102F/I Time: 14:08 CDT 9/23/73 HART - black and white film has excellent

_

definition but it leaves a lot of questions about vegetated areas. We are able to use it in order to exploit different geometric patterns and information of this type and to gather reference points. But there are so many things that can be confused with vegetation in order for it to be really effective for determining these areas of critical interest. Next slide please. The normal color gives us a lot more information in the way of cropping but it does fall down because there are still many things that can be confused with crop areas. Many of the geographic features of the area are very apparent and some of these are useful when we put them in combination with the other types of film. Next please. With the color infrared photography, the vegetated areas become readily apparent. As you can see on this slide they show up as red in false color film and they can be - we can pick out the areas that are cropped and the brush areas and other information which is of critical interest in determining the types of crops that might be serve as avenues of entry for these various pests. Next slide please. In the upper portion of the lower Rio Grande Valley, which would be the western end up toward Sugar Lake in Mexico, you can see from this photo that we can get a lot of information about the geographic setup, things like how the drainage patterns go and information about soil types and - but again, vegetation, although there is some indication of where the vegetation is and in this case it would be green - have a greenish hue - it isn't sufficient to enable us to say definitely these are the areas of interest to us. Next slide please. This same portion of the lower Rio Grande Valley clearly shows the areas of interest. This is, again, Sugar Lake in Mexico, and along this portion of the Rio Grande River you can see the cropped areas and the vegetated areas. Opposite this area is the Mission, Texas citrus area, these long plots here are citrus plots. And since the prevailing winds are from the south here, there is a tremendous hazard, when populations of a pest build up on this side, of the winds carrying the pests into the citrus area in places like Mission. You can also see various other cropped areas on the U.S. side. As you move down the Rio Grande River and this is roughly in the McAllen to Weslaco area, there is little cropping on the Mexican side. These areas would have little hazard in here of a pest coming in. So your vigilance and surveillance of methods would be less here and they would be up in areas such as that up above. You can see below these areas into Mexico, there is very little in the way of cropland. One of the problems that we have is this heavy vehicular traffic coming up, that - where pests can be brought in and

f

"-_

Skylab-III PCI02F/2 Time: 14:08 CDT 9/23/73 HART (CONT) get established on this side and then

move over. As you move down the river, again you pick up cropped areas on the Mexican side, the river running roughly along in this area here. And you can see cropped areas here and cropped areas up above. Next slide please. Now this is down toward the coast and unfortunately, we had a lot of cloud cover as this point, but there is still a lot of information of interest to us. Along the coastal area you can, again, mostly physical features that are apparent in the normal color film. But you can pick out in this area, because of the geometric patterns and the greenish color, some of the cropped areas. Next slide please. This is the same area END OF TAPE

-

f

F_

Skylab-lll PC-102G/I Time: 14:08 CDT 4 9/23/73 HART (CONT) again you can of the river coastal areas. turns this out area many have Next slide see that the extends down This would please. This is the same area cropped area on the Mexican into Mexico conslderably along be an area of hazard, and as into area. the U.S. We're

and side the it in

of the pests that have come come in in the Brownsville

currently fighting a citrus black fly problem in the Brownsville area at the present time. And from our standpoint up above we have heavy cropping up above the river, , here, on the U.S. side. And there are problems that we can help to prevent from getting into Mexico. We're concerned at the present time about the imported fire ant moving down the Gulf coast, and the possibility that this may go into the area into Mexico. So it's a situation that is mutually beneficial to have information llke this. We have a very cordial relationship with the Mexican officials and work very closely with them on these problems. I believe that's my last slide. In evaluating how important it is to exclude these new pests and how much effort should he put into keeping them from becoming established I'd cite the case of the bollweevil. This severely destructive cotton pest moved into the lower Rio Grande Valley from the south in 1894. It now causes about 2 hundred million dollars worth of damage anually on cotton in the U.S. And about another 75 million is spent for insecticides. That's one third of the total amount spent on insecticides in the United States annually. It's all for a single pest that was introduced. It therefore, seems apparent that a good knowledge of ecological factors associated with these pest problems such as those demonstrated by the Skylab-II data,offer considerable promise in the continuing effort to exclude these destructive pests. PAO Thank you, Bill. PAO The next will be Dr. Leroy Jenson, University of Utah. He will give you a discussion of the - what he has learned area. from Roy. the study of some of the imagery in the Nevada

f

JENSON Ladies and gentlemen,is the mike working? I think the room is small enough even if it isn't. I speak professionally as a geologist and academically as a professor of geology and geophysics at the University of Utah. The area in which I'm interested in is Utah and Nevada as an exploration geologist with the hope of finding mineral deposits or oll depolslts for which we face evidence in the past. University of Utah ment of geology and geophysics has been active and Lunar landing. And if I can 5egln with my indications of have no surin the departin the Apollo first slide

f_

4

Skylab-lll PC-102G/2 Time: 14:08 CDT 9/23/73 JENSON (CONT) interested in as the one who surface is of not the active Earth. in this but You recall

more

that maybe when Apollo 58 is sent to the Moon, they may be spending their time cleaning up the mess. As a geologist, however, I was more interested in what I could see on the surface of the Earth and the following few slides I can indicate the area in which we are interested. The next slide please. The basin arranged provJnce is an area that extends through northern Nevada, into eastern Utah western Utah and finally into Mexico and Sanora. The area of my test site includes the area in the rectangle , the basin arranged province. Prior to Skylab, no imagery was obtained above north 35 degrees latitude. So this area was not covered even though Apollo and Gemini ships have done much in this area here, which is continuingp of course, through Skylab and this was mentioned by Mr. Wilmerth, Dr. Wilmerth. It also includes the province of the Colorado plateau, uranium province, Vinta mountains and portions of the Green River basln,in Wyoming. We speak of this area in the basin arranged province as elephant country because that's where elephant ore deposits exist. Deposits that are mined by open pit techniques and which gross in the order of billions of dollars, tens of thousands of
f

END

OF

TAPE

r

SL-III -. Time: 9/23/73

PCI02H/I 14:08 CDT

JENSON that the are order mined by open of billions

-

when

are

deposits

exists.

Deposits in of

pit techinq_es of dollars.

and which gross Tens of thousands

Bingham, for example, has grossed over l0 billion dollars or i0,000 million dollars• These are elephant deposits, they're not small veln-type deposits, which may be very rich. The tonnage mined in these big deposits is in the order of hundreds of tons per day, even though the average grade of material is maybe a few dollars; 5 or 6 dollars. We'd hope that as we see in the next slide please, that the area is covered with a vast amount of alluvium. This is a geological map of the area. So what we're interested in is essentially this region extend into The stippled represents deposits. the mineral years ago, been hidden. our what what f through Mex here, even into Arizona though these caterpillars and into Senora, Mexico. area that you see here, covers evidence of mineral material is recent in age; tens of millions of on the surface has the mineral basis of

area, the uncolored alluvial material that That is, this alluival

deposits may have formed and the evidence for them In fact, this is really believe, crisis crisis

nation, I an energy a mineral

in the next few years. We know is now and by next year we'll know is. It is our hope, therefore, as

geologists to be able to see - if we could wait a few tens of millions of years, maybe a thousand feet of this over burden through this area would be removed. We can't wait that long, so we'll have to develop techniques that will allow us to see through it. My detecting may be emanations of mercury given off from certain hydrocarbons given fields underlie the area. an oblique picture are the salt flats Lake. here. ore deposits, or emanations off from where petroleum The next slide shows, I SL-II. this is This the of believe, these Salt see

that is taken by of Western Utah;

is Great of

The railroad crosses at this It has an earthen dam as it's

discontinuity - instead

that you a trellis

network, with only two channels through fresh water off the Wassateh Range here of the people of Utah live, rather than snow falls and where water is available,

it. Most of the where 85 percent out here where flows into this

southern portion of the Great Salt Lake. And the water flows into here where evaporation goes on. And this one _his portion of the lake has an esormous amount of Salt J n it, 27 percent, while this one is down around 22 percent. ?his slight to exist in portions of variation it and the lake the in the soll reflectivity is due to the allows that different we receive types bacteria from the of species two

different

f

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCI02H/2 14:08 CDT

of bacteria. which is a reflectivity.

Fresh water is occurrin E here in Utah Lake, fresh water lake, you see, has a quite different This is the San Rafael swell over in the Colorado

plateau. We're dealing here with large vast areas of fairly flat lylug rocks. This is Lake Meade in Nevada. And all of this is Nevada over here. We see portions of Nevada, Utah, Colorado, and even Arizona where Lake Meade extends. The next slide, please. Shows the salt flats from a very low level. can actually see the curvature of the Earth here by the telephone poles disappearing over the horizon because it's so flat. No ore deposits of metallic mineral deposits other than salt exists here because this is recent material that covers the evidence of that - of these ore deposits. The next slide then, if we continue on, shows some false color composites of Earth imagery. These should be red but we play around with them and make it look as it actually does to man. This is green, and the Wassatch range is through this region here. The southern portion of the Great Salt Lake• This is Utah Lake, and if you look carefully you can see a swirl of bacteria and in it, or of algae in it. Notice that we have much more vegetation over here where snowfall is greater than we do over here in the desert portions. Something llke 7 to 8 inches of rainfall falls here while 40 - 40 to 45 inches of snowfall falls here. So, as I say, 85 percent of the people of Utah llve right along the edge of this range. The next sllde shows us the swirl, I think a little hit more clearly than it did in the last one. Now you can see the light areas here represent bacteria that have been swirled into circles by the wlnd. Even though Poole is located here, with about 80,000 people, they were not aware of this algael swirl here. In September the 12th of last year it was detected first on space imagery. We expect it to occur again, however, in the fall of this year. - in fact, about now. It doesn't exist in the winter because itts frozen over. In fact, the next slide shows this area in the early winter, about November, as we see in the next slide, please. Where I'm sorry, it'll be in the one after this. But this - END OF TAPE You

_

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SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-1021/1 14:08 CDT

Jensen We're is an - I'm sorry, area of an

-

-

as be

we

see

in one

the

next

slide_

please. this Basin.

it'll anacllnal

in the structure

after in the

thls_ Green

but River

It's known as the rock - Rock Springs Uplift. This Flaming Gourge Reservoir here, Vlnta mountains, down cloud cover through here. This is one of the major for the inter-mountain west. Mountain Fuel Company

is also here and gas resources provides

Salt Lake City with natural gas predominantly from this field, plus other fields. They borrowed this image, blew it up to this - when it comes to us , it's on a scale of i to 1 million, but blew it up four times, which we've also done, and notice that they were structures through this region training in this direction here. And many of these, in fact 20 of them were picked by them. Even though they had mapped this area in detail on the ground, they were able to pick up at least 20 more major faults, trending through the region in this direction. The importance of this, issince this is an anaclinal structure or dome structure, these are younger beds here, than the older ones this out here. direction here been But even or dipping though down these beds are in this direction, anaclined This is a dipping up in faults coming which application

up

through had not

were formed faults detected before,

structures, practical

of this imagery from space to the development of a greater amount of petroleum and natural gas from this structure. The next slide shows another potential of this. And the Vinta Basin which is a major producer of gas and oil. This is the Vinta Basin off through here. The VintaMountains through here and Utah Lake once again. And you can see even though this is mostly covered with snow, that the area around Utah Lake because of a thermal effect has prevented the snow from falling there and it melts rapidly. The same is true in the VintaBasin here which receives less precipitation while the high amount of snow that we have here in the Vinta Mountains provide water for irrigation during the summer months. This is a river through here. And if you look at it very carefully, I don't know if you can see this or not, you can see some trends, even though covered by snow. These are major fault trends through here. And also _ the drainage of this stream is also controlled by major fault. Since the beds are dipping down towards this area that has no snowD once again we have a fall closure on

that

oil producing horizons, and oll should be searched for along the northern edge of these fault zones which forms a block, which prevents the petroleum from rising stratigraphically to higher elevations and ,possibly ,even reach the surface. The next slide ,please. I'm primarily interested in ore deposits and as a result, I have stressed that aspect of it. This is a Gemini photograph, taken at lower elevations in our ERTS or EREP Skylab imagery. But it shows the town of Tucson here,and

SL-III Time: 9/23/73 the The Pima

PC-I021/2 14:08 CDT

Sierra white _llning

Mountains areas that Company,

around here, you see are andAmerlcan

with major Smelting

a pediment dumps from and

over here. Anaconda, Company They

Refining

deposits, which all of which were covered were found by what I still like to call techniques, mineralization the Anaconda as I which that at -Twin of all is on the surface, depths as much as Buttes deposit. this of ima Utah _ry and

by alluvium• remote sensing sulfide below here slide shows above 35 since that

detecting 600 feet The next

on where

-

say, none includes

was available Nevada. And

degrees, time

of course, we are receiving that imagery and applying these techniques to an area that has never been studied by space imagery before ERTS and ,now,before Skylab. This is an aeromagnetic map, showing a mineral range through here of the Basin Art Range province. This represents - this is the Ruth Open Pit Copper Deposits owned by Tenneco Copper Corporation, which has as you see, a magnetic positive area over it. This is the Ward Mountain area, which recently has received extensive activity and mineral deposits have been found at depths of less than 1500 feet there. Even in that case, it would be mined by underground techniques. Another positive area was indicated on the map here, this map of US Geological Survey, which is an area of what I would call post-ore blankets or volcanic rocks that cover any evidence of mineralization in that area. The area was not shown as an interest of great activity because everyone assumed that it was covered by thousands of feet of volcanic rocks. And even if there were ore deposits below it, it the - that's assumin_ here, similar the volcanics. for many years. of California, END OF TAPE to would that be the difficult positive to mine magnetic them. anomaly If

this and We looked

similar on our used - -

to this, I'd been work

was caused interest Standard

by in this Oil

area

In west

fact, I of here

to

for

Company

F

n _

Skylab-lll PC-102J/I Time: 14:08 CDT 9/23/73 JENSON (CONT) looked on our - I've Similar to this been interested was caused by the volcanics. in this area for many

We

years, in fact, I use to work for Standard Oil Company of California west of here and drove past this every day for one once or twice a day during one summer, live also worked for Kinnicod (?) but mostly in the area through here. The area was of interest to me for many years, so I looked on our Skylah imagery, I think the next slide shows that, and even though it doesn't appear too plainly here, these are clouds in the area. The smelter for the Ruth (?) pit is here and you see the tailings through here. But this area that you see here is that volcanic mass, this of course, shows up much better when you look at it with a binocular microscope. But if you look carefully, you can see certain light areas within that. There's one through here, here, here, here. These llghtsareas are not the normal color of andesite unless it's weathered. So we did some ground truth on it and I visited the area here and as I show in the next sllde, we mapped it and showed geologlcally that the area surrounded by alluvium, this area here, these slides are all - this is north. This is alluvall material, the brown represents the volcanlcs and they extend all the way out through here as indicated by the pencil marks. But the blue represents limestone rocks, dolomite rocks, and as you see they extend - stick up through this material in extensive areas. Obviously therefore, the volcanios are very thin. The magnetic anomaly that surrounds this area is not due to the volcanic rocks here but is due to something underneath the surface. What we would hope to be and most likely is a granitoid rock from which these mineralizing fluids are derived and these porphyry copper elephant deposits. So we have a thin layer of volcanics here, alteration in the limbstone that sticks up through it, indicating the voleanics are thin and also that something from below has given rise to mineralization in the limestone rocks. With the hope that with other techniques and possibly final!y with drilling we may find another large mineral deposit here. We have other techniques for collecting ground truth that are not as costly as drilling. The next slide shows one of these techniques which is the mercury sniffer - I'm sorry the slides are all inverted 90 degrees but this is the surface of the ground. This is the hemisphere dome with a fan in the top of it here operated off the battery, which is controlled by this switch. Silver screen is placed in the top of this; this is buried in the ground to about through here, and we draw soll gas out of the ground through this sil_er screen. Since mercury occurs as a material of high vapor pressure, and it's always associated with ore deposits and it's constantly ble bleeding off from these deposits, we can determine where we have

/

Skylab-III PC-102J/2 Time: 14:08 CDT 9/23/73 JENSON (CONT) anomalous high mercury content. The amalgum that is formed here on this silver screen, which is a combination of silver and mercury, is taken back to the laboratory and analyzed on atomic adsorption instruments to determine the amount of mercury, that we collected. We've done this over the area, the results are not available yet. But if we have certain local spots of mercury anomalies, we've indicated areas which may overlle buried mineral deposits of that. The next slide is an example of what we would hope to flnd_ I regret once again that - the slides were given to him correctly, but he's converted them 90 degrees. If you Can turn your head sideways, this is a Bingham porphyry copper deposit open pit mine which has grossed 10 billlon dollars. Wouldn't it he magnlficant if we could find one more of these by space imagery which would provide a - finally, an amount equal to three times the national the federal budget for NASA each year. Or if the University of Utah acquired it, it would provide quite an endowment for us. I enjoyed speaking to you very much. Thank you. PAO Okay. The last speaker this afternoon is Dr. Norman McCleod, from American University and he has just returned from - he is part of the investigative team that we have for EREP and looking at the descerflcatlon (?) areas and drought areas over in Mall and adjacent areas. He Just returned and, although I will be first to admit that we do not have any SL-II data_ We do have a TV film cllp that was collected by the SL-III crew. And he is going to talk to us this afternoon about he and his investlgator_team can look at relative to the use of that data and, as you can see, some of the results that we've already got from - preliminary results that we have already got from the EREP SL-I_ data analysis - and relate that to the types of investigations that are going over there. You can, I think_ readily see that the SL-II as well as the SL-III data - END OF TAPE

SL-III Time:

PC-102K/1 14:08 CDT

9/23/73
data that that SPEAKER preliminary results from the EREP SL-2 analysis, and relate that to the types of investigations are going on over there, You can, I think, readily see the SL-2 as well as the SL-3 data do have a practical

application in the study of such things as surface land features, and dynaml¢ processes (garble). SPEAKER Before he speaks, I have an ERTS photograph here that shows that same area. SPEAKER It has to be removed because our next speaker will be referring to something underneath it. But I'ii leave it up here, and if you want to look at it, this is the volcanic area. The light areas represent where the limestone is sticking through. This is an ERTS photograph, which I haven't had time to blowup an EREP, Skylab photograph, which shows it, actually, in a little better detail. This won't come off. SPEAKER I'd like to locate the - is it my comm? I'd llke-to locate the area of the experiment or the investigation. And, say, that this has been going on for about a of 2 or 3 years in the Republic of Mall, which was the first of the African countries to request some information from the remote sensing program of NASA. And this is the .... Republlc of Mall, the Sahara Desert here, in west Africa. and the Sahalion zone. It is located both The Sahara Desert period

in being,

generally, in the central part of Africa, but the Sahallon zone being a border region between the desert and the woodland areas of the rain forest in the south along the coast, extends all the way across the African continent, Just about this latitude here. Now, when we began to talk with these people in the Republic of Mall, their problems were the problem, primarily, of desertificatlon. That is, the expansion of the desert, the increasing aridity of their agricultural areas in the south. The problem affecting both nomadic peoples, who were moving cattle north and south with the rainy and dry seasons, and the sedentary or cultivation - people who are doing cultivation cropping in the more humid regions along in here. Now the - Not only is the pattern - not only is the location of the Sahalion zone common across the continent, more or less so; also, the pattern of nomadic movement north and south with the season, so-called transients, is also something one finds all the way across the continent, with the sedentary people down below. And over the period of many years, hundreds of years, this zone of Eood pasture, the northern part of the Sahale has been moving southward. This is not just a matter of drought, as defined meteorologically, it's also a matter of a cultural use of that particular area, which is resulting regions. We are that there's more in a downward movement of calling that desertification; sand in the area, and also the pasture it does mean means that there's

f-_

SL-III Time: 9/23/73 more

PC-102K/2 14:08 CDT

there's or people

a for

lesser plant of Mall

amount growth. told us

of

water

available

for

plant

production that the

Now that's was number

the problem i. Their

agricultural resource base has been shrinking. And with this drought, it has been shrinking rapidly. Problem number 2 was to understand the hydrology of the area. And this is the Niger River, which flows from Sierra Leone in Guinea, through Mall, down through Niger and then through Nigeria. It's a major water resource. It's one of several rivers that flow through the Sahallon zone, the Senegal being one, and the Niger River. The rivers (garble) associated with the Lake Chad Basin is also a bounty river flowing out of that region, and then of course, the Nile. These rivers flow through basins that are more or less of the same latitude across the continent, again. well understood. There's a call it. It's about 40,000 END OF TAPE The hydrology very interesting square kilometers here is marsh, - not very let's

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCI02L/I 14:08 CDT

MCLEOD

-

-

is

not

very

well

understood.

There's

a very interesting marsh, let's kilometers in the south central Inland Delta. Because when it's or less llke a tipped Delta.

call it, about 40,000 square portion of Mall, called the full of water, it's shaped hydrology, as I say, of

more that

The

particular area is not very well known. There's some problems that are being addressed that I'll talk about specifically in a moment, showing you a picture of this area. Further, the the - there are some problems in rationalizing or - the sedentary agricultural patterns in the Sahaleon zone in general, and in Mall in particular. Problems dealing with soil erosion, problems dealing with the - the nomadic people coming into the - in the sedentary areas and moving back out again a aeasonal basis, these are - also, the problem of which cast crops and what - where should they be grown, under what conditions should they be grown, how do they fit into production of, for instance, cotton or peanuts or rice on a commercial basis? How does this fit into traditional agricultural? Where does this get done? In addition, there are problems of explorations for mineral resources. And this is the area - because the Malian principle investigator, Mr. Konate, Manader Konate, who is the director of the Geological and Mining Services in Mall, is a geologist and is, therefore, concentrating most of his research effort in that area. However, the agricultural hydrologic - hydrologic and ecological problems are also being addressed in that country. Now, Mall had these problems. We --I was at Goddard Spaceflight Center at the time we first started working with these people. And it became clear to them and to us that there was some possibility for gathering very much needed resource information through the use of satellites like ERTSllke manned satellites llke Skylab. The - In developing their program, we have to realize that this group of countries in here - These 6 Sahaleon countries that have recently declared their - themselves to be a - in a drought - catastrophic drought are, also, among the countries that have the - 25 countries that have the lowest incomes in the world. Referring to Mall to Upper Volta to (garble) in particular, Mauritania. The uses face imagery then means that these countries can - leap over the enormous amount of work that's been done, for instance, in the United States on geological exploration, on agricultural developments, and the sails classifications and so forth. This represents an opportunity to them, inventory. one for must what's at them least, to start on gathering Now with the drought_ that to solve. That is to say it concerning in the their drought information for resource problem is a very essential that they must understand, agricultural resource and what opportunities base; there amo

have information happening to

SL-III Time: f 9/23/73 are for

PCI02L/2 14:08 CDTT

the

development.

Now

let

me

look

at

the

first

slide,

if

I may; the only overhead slide. This is a part of the Inland Delta - going up here. Could you rotate it the other way? There we go. Oh, all right. And clockwise 90 degrees once more_ please. There we are. This is a - an ERTS composit. We have a - an EREP pass over this area. The information will be sent but that information is not yet been processed so that will be sent when it's available to Mall which gets of a fall deal Niger Now, this information directly. This is a color composit - an ERTS image taken this pass summer. The raincomes in the the summertime but it takes a good of time for the - for the res_iting flood in the River to penetrate through this photograph indicates that dunes When recede, that the and those this several inland Delta of the kinds with. the sand area. of These dunes

problems are sand are water. begins to areas as the flood And there of END that OF

Malians are dealing dark areas between through grown in

the flood comes miler will be

and then it those interdunal As flood. out

well as in the major regions comes through fishermen are are some 50,000 tons of fish Delta each year. The hydrologic

in the south. following that that are taken problem -

TAPE

F

_

SL- III PC- I0221/I Time: 14:08 CDT 9/23/73 ?ICLI:AD - fisherman are following that flood, and there's some S0,000 tons of fish that are taken out of that delta each year. The hydrologic problem is indicated in here, if I can contrast that - these darl: areas are water I;y the way - and if I can contrast this one with this one over here, Milch has a lot of red in it, I can talk about the problel;. The problem is that the vegetation in some areas of tile inland delta is disappearing for some reason. In those areas of permanent water, and as a result the flood is movinF through the delta more rapidly. It's not understood quite why this is happening, but if the flood moves through rapidly, it means that there's going to he a higher peak in the flood moving on downstream, past Timbukt, by the way, (;ow and in !!all and in 'runis_a, aml with that high pea_ there's going to be a shorter pulse, so that people wt,o are dependin_ on the Ei;'er ",iver floods for irrigating their rice are going to be,:in to 1,e disappointed because the water will l:e there in a fiend state, too hi_q_ a flood and then last not a long enougtl tir'e. The - one other part of this that I'd like to shin.: is this area in here, the red indicating vegetation we're out in a desert area here, nor'adic people use this vegetation in the rainy seasnn, and this is in August during tile rainy season, and will graze their cattle out i_ these areas here. Now it's not known really in "Iali where the good grazing is, and this is sort of a map of where the good grazing is at this particular time of year. The ::omads know by experience, but in a droupht situation nobody really knows, and so this kind of information is extremely helpf,1. Both in terms of immediate application as well as future plannings. And I'll speak more about future plannin_ in a minute. The - now from a geologic point of view, this picture has some very interesting information for geolo,:ists as _.:ell. There's in here there are three different dune orientations that one can see with analysis, these are fossil dunes by the way, they're not active at the present time. One can see some parallel orientations in here, that li]:e so and that's part of a regional fracture system and has four rather definite orientations, people don't know exactly why those are formed, and there are some questions also as to u'hether or not - this is a rather interesting pattern here. It _irics the pattern of the delta itseIf on the - right in this region here. Tile vegetation forming a pattern that some geologists are going to take a look at that and say the delta • s r:ovinr east or has moved to the west. And there is some speculation that dipping is going on in the general area and that the water is moving to the east - something to speculate about. ?low the problems that 'Iali faces are problems that other countries in the Sahelion zone face. These are regionaI problems, and they need to be addressed regionally, and the kind o c information

F.

SL-III
_Time: 9/23/73

PC- I02H/2 14:08 CDT

coming from Skylab, coming from ERTS, is a synoptic view, one that can be - for information to be derived on a regional basis. This is a mosaic of several IiRTS frames that we've put together. And we have another mosaic that's in black and white that's extending from '!auritania, now to Chad, it's still not complete, but this color one is useful to get a reg_;onal aspect of the not only the geology, but the vegetation distribution and the hydrologic phenomena here. This can be used not only for a resource inventory, but also for planting purposes. And you may think that this is a river as a for instance, this is in Niver. In fact it's part of a very old drainage system, in which no surface run oft or water flow occurs. One can see however, that there are excellent soils in this area by adequate interpretation of this imagery, and also through field studies one can infer that there is considerable amount of water running into thoae channels in the entire - so that we have an association of water and good soils, which are not being utilized at the present tir_e. That brings ne to another phase of this discussion, and that is planting FND OF TAP]:

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-102N/I 14:08 CDT

McLEOD - - which are not being utilized at the present time. Now that brings me to another phase of this discussion, and that is planning. In terms of the drought situation right now. The major problem is the immediate problem of course, is it's not raining enough in the Sahelion zone. down in But that's any case, not has the been only problem, moving down the desert for a very is long moving period

of time. Somehow that process has to be stopped. Is there any hope for stopping it? Well, in Niger we are finding some help, there's some imagery here that indicates in some of the ranching areas, control grazing and controlled access to - to grazing sites, has in fact turned some of the desert areas around. I mentioned the - the opportunity to utilize some of the water in these old channels, which are generally associated with pretty good soils for irrigation cropping. I also mentioned earlier the problem of soll erosion in - in areas cropped in a traditional fashion. In my visit recently, it seemed to me that - that I didn't find one field, not one field of millet that was fully stocked with plants, and the reason a lack of rainfall; the reason was that the farmers their soil as they've used it for many years. It's kind but of where shifting cultivation, the - the land is in an 20 years, and erosion problem used now as slash and normally burn once was not just are using a shifting cultivation, or 1 years, are -

kind of or twice

or 2 yearss and there's

that cycle's down a result and the

to i0 soils

wearing out, just quite literally. And the problem do a job of soll selection for the - in conjunction extension effort to a work with the - these farmers. is a - a very serious situation that the - that the

is to find with an Now, this Sahellon

zone is facing, in terms of - of what's going to be happening this coming year. The crop in some areas is pretty good, and in some areas it's it's quite marginal and this week the rainfall this week, this very week, is going to tell whether or not there's a successful crop. The rainfall in some areas is still below average. In other areas good rainfall and probably it will have planning, however, for recovery or re the desert must proceed immediately and they - they've a good crop. rehabilitation the countries had The of are a

proceeding immediately as you know, there - they had a meeting of the six countries in the past couple of weeks. We hope that we can supply information concerning the resources to those to those people, on a fast turnaround kind of basis. We have to know what it is they need and I'd llke at this time to - to ask that the TV tape or I'm just beginning Instrument on the be played. to realize on the Skylab, We are Just that there's the Skylab beginning a heck that's of in to realize a good orbit

/--

SL-III Time: 9/23/73 f

PC-102N/2 14:08 CDT

at the present time. Could I have the TV tape please? Now this - this is CDR The drought area, you might be able to see on your ground that - that - McLEOD It's in color. CDR ground below, on your TV, that the ground below us is not nice and green like it should be, but brown, reddish, sandy color. This drought has been in effect for, or has been with these people, over nearly six million people, for 4 or 5 years, and it's affected them greatly. Relief supplies are sent there frequently, but it's hard to supply six - food for six million people from a very long time. McLEOD _ou're looking at - at the area of Nigeria, and Niger, and that's the consuance of the Niger River and the Bani River, I'd like you to compare the - the patterns that you're seeing on that screen with - if you come up close later on and what you're seeing on here on EKTS. This is a a he is now coming up CDR - - over the Ivory coast. McLEOD Right. That information there is useful to people like myself. I could interpret that in terms of of CDR - - over the Niger region which - McLEOD - agricultural land patterns, idrologic patterns and the - in time, one ca_ use that information to determine how the crops are coming along

END

OF

TAPE

f

r

SL-III Time: 9123173

PCI02-O/I 14:08 CDT

_

_ICLEOD In time one can use that information to determine how the crops are coming along; how the harvest is coming along; what the harvest area - what the cultivated area might be for the next year as this is done seasonally. In addition it's possible to use this same kind of information to locate areas in which development might occur. Development that is related to the rehabilitation of the deserts; stopping the desert processes from forming. There is some concern that we might be developing the Niger River at the expense of stopping the desert. These things can be assessed and analyzed with this kind of imagery. Nhy don't we have the voice back up again, please? This is one of the sandiest areas in the desert, by the way. Look at him zooming in on this. Ne are really getting some information that we have not gotten before. Now, - now there's a technical problem in the in the TV. Hountains, sand hills, sand (garble), hydrologic patterns. Bean is going to talk now about what he's done. B_ tlere's the continent of Africa. This has been our orbital path. The Sahel is an area that's about 500 miles in width extending south from the Sahara. Iiere's the Sahara, from the Atlantic to the Red Sea. This area right here is under an extreme drought condition now, caused by lack of rain for the last 4 or 5 years, or a minimum of rain for the last 4 or 5 years. This is the sixth nation area, and in that area million, several billion people live. Now, from Skylab we're not going to be able to make it rain. But we think from Skylab we can look down with suitable sensors - photographs we've actually did just a few moments ago look down with these sensors and find areas that are now so affected by the drought that might not be obvious to a man on the ground. We also think we'll be able to determine areas which have high probability of water table not too distant below them. In other words, find spots that are good for possible digging of wells, possible planting of crops where other plots of parts near the spots nearby aren't so possible. We think this will be possible on a worldwide basis, with equipment such as we're using in Skylab and with equipment such as we're using in our unmanned satellite ERTS. MCLEOD I hope those are prophetic words. That we will be able to get information quickly back and be able to work with - directly with the astronaut as a an expert observer as he's going over this - this particular drought area. And that remains to be seen how that works out but - Right.

F

SL-III Time:

PC102-0/2 14:08 CDT

9125173
PAO Okay, do we have any questions? Abbie. QUERY (inaudible) SPEAKER Yeah, the - I've seen that tape now, twice or three times. There's an area covered in Nigeria which shows land patterns that are very similar to this. That's an important thing to know, that those land use patterns are similar. It went up into the area of the (garble), the (garble). Also along the Erie mountains. Now, the - when it zoomed it was zooming at a - at a point that I'm very END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-102P/I 14:08 CDT

Also was

SPEAKER along zooming

the at

- - area of Errer Mountains. a point that I'm point it's

the Now very

ERTS Itlnery the - when anxious to assessing it's so

in Niger. it zoomed, see. And the sandy

it

particularly distribution, there's which here. area

from the although

of view of very sandy,

vegetation that

one tree that's on every map. It may be on this map, is i to 5 million. It's called the - well it's right They do have a dot where the tree is. This is the that it passed over right along in here. Now off from the

central Sahara there appear to be and we're seeing these in the imagery, I can show you one of these right here. And there's another, and part of a third, there's the bottom of a fourth over here, channels of years ago, patterns when than some wrong it is at in I water time. coming out that were early - late tertiary they formed from when the present time. But them, would and unfortunately llke very much formed probably drainage the Sahara was those to areas he zoomed have seen millions much more have at the area humid

still right this

from the satellite. We were and his comment on the view view from space is very well is communication with people

able - I've flown around in here, from space, that is the visual taken. Particularly if there on the ground who are research

scientists, and if there's also communication with people who are doing planning. So that he is, in fact, making observations that are in real life are necessary for the planning process. The action programs, there really need to go forth now, in other words, not just planning, but putting things in that are going to help in the recovery of the desert. Now in this area, as I say, land patterns in this area here, and right up in here I would be very much interested in reviewing that tape even further to see if I can see of these channels, which I think are probably there. I see them coming into the Lake Chad area in here. We can any can

see that there are some indications that they continue well up into the Ere Mountains, and that's important information. QUERY Will that TV tape reveal those channels and see if they have water in them where you could, say, grow crops, or drill wells, from the Skylab tapes. McLEOD From this very tape? As I said I'm afraid zoomed at the inappropriate time. QUERY McLEOD run QUERY you have. McLEOD Well, From No, There from future from was any tapes? this Just mission that Yes. or single is that tape. is of the only

he

There a

is an EREP pass that goes over critical area as well. We'll from that EREP pass.

here, and this get quite a lot

as I mentioned, information

2_

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PCI02P/2 14:08 CDT

WILMARTH Any other questions? QUERY I wasn't clear on say, drought llke we think of llke we or whether the desert, the Sahara, is very long-term 30 years, or the McLEOD drought basis, whether that Just this maybe moving is a 7-year I think there the dustbowls

Jerry. this drought. Or let's had here in the 1930's moving southward on some for drought are has the next 20 or type of thing.

Well, produced

analogs, that some similar

characteristics. One, the land management practiced in the dustbowl areas in the United States, certainly assisted in the production of dust in that area, and those land usepractlces have been changed. There have been that's part of our agricultural revolution that's occurred in the - so quietly in the United States. That methods have been worked out so that the land is much more protected, when there is a period of low rainfall, such has occurred since, without the formation of a dustbowl. I think there - that kind of thing is analogous, where the vegetation was destroyed and the soll was also lost much of its fertility - I'm going to say fertility that's a good way of saying it. The drought can be defined meterolosically , there has been 5 or 6 years of low rainfall throughout the Sahellon zone, or - END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-102Q/I 14:08 CDT

McLEOD - - meterologically. There has been 5 or 6 years of low rainfall in the - throughout the Sahelion zone, or either low rainfall or badly distributed rainfall, both things are important. However, the nomads will tell you that they have been moving south - by the way, they have a oral history, that goes back about 80 generations in some cases. So, that when they're telling you something that - that has been going on for a few hundred years they - they're really telling you their history and - and it's generally quite accurate, so in general they will tell you that they have been moving south for - for many many generations. And they've been moving south because the desert is right behind them. So both things are happening. PAO Abby. ABBY For Dr. Hart, have you tentatively identified any areas where you think insects do pass back and forth across the border and what - what particular insects are you guarding against going both ways? HEART Well, in particular in the citrus SPEAKER (Garble) excuse me. HART - the citrus black fly is - is one that we know came into the Brownsville area across from the cropped area in Mexico, and it's also - there have also been a few cases out. of it up further But other pests in the valley that that are of concern they've sprayed womld be the and knocked

Mediterranean fruit fly, which is in Central America, and poses a great threat, it's a very destructive pest, probably the most destructive fruit pest, worldwide. And it is moving in Central America and we feel that the data that we're getting from - that I showed, may be helpful in setting up trapping areas, so that we can follow this when it comes in. Hopefully, we can cut the thing off short of Mexico, because if it gets into Mexico, it'll be extremely difficult to keep it out of the United States. But in reverse, we have the imported fire ant moving down the coast, and this would be another problem that we may send into Mexico, that we're hoping we can prevent. PAO Abby. ABBY And you do feel from the information that you got on this mission, that you can identify those areas the sort of trapping before it got across? ar_, so that you could get the insect

HEART Yes, definitely, we could - this would help with - with surveillance techniques, such as trapping or ground surveys. There'd be little need to be concerned about the areas that are uncropped, in between, because your chances of an insect moving up those - in those areas would be quite sllm.

SL-III Time: 9/2S/73

PC-102Q/2 1408 CDT

ABBY Do you have any idea how long that would terms of miles, say along the border? HART The uncropped areas ABBY No, the cropped areas, the potential passing zone (garble). HEART Well, we're talking in terms of probably I would say, 120 miles in that - along the river in that area. And, I would say probably i/4th of it is uncropped. The rest would be cropped areas on - on at least on the Mexican side. It would be more continuous on the U.S. side. ABBY How is the information from Skylab going to help you? In other words, if you know where the cropped areas are already in Mexico. HART This is • problem_ you don't know. You have a hazy idea, but in many of these areas - we hope to define this further. But we hope to be able to - to go into thls in more detail and identify - and identify citrus crops, for instance. This would be much more useful data if we could do be in that, we'll many into and we're quite confident that we will be ultimitely be able to do that, with the Skylab data. ABBY And, can you estimate, roughly, say how dollars worth of damage would do if these two pests got the United States?

HEART Mediterranean fruit fly - it would be difficult to calculate all the damage it could do, because it - through a seasonal cycle it moves a considerable distance, and if it became established - for instance, in the Rio Grande valley it could affect it could affect peach crops all through the southern portion of the United States. It could move in - you run into quarantine problems with it I would expect that we'd -

END

OF

TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-102R/I 1408 CDT

HART

-

-

it

could

move

in

and

you

run

into

quarantine problems with it. I would expect that we'd lose at least half of the citrus crop in Texas from the Mediterranean fruit fly. Plus a lot of your fruit has reduced quality. PAO Jerry. QUERY Dr. Jensen, on this area you discovered with the volcanic thing the dolomite sticking through it, I guess it's been fairly recent hasn't it? JENSEN Yes, in fact, it's so recent, I donVt even have copies of the imagery to show you. I have a little 70 millimeter positive transparency in color that would show it with me, hut we've done this mapping and located it within the last month. QUERY does, how JENSEN release this. it about As that information becomes public, or if mineral leasing and - I expect another 49 gold rush, when you Seriously, it is public domain. It's open for it by mining claims isn't that simple, about i0 by i0. llke $50 a claim Also you have to do hold these claims.

any citizen of the United States to stake which measures 1500 feet by 600 feet. It however, it's an area of i00 square miles, That's 3,200 claims and it costs something to stake them, and a long time to do it. $i00 worth of assessment work per year to So our next, in fact fly it aeromagnetically, feet over the surface probably at rather

this coming week, we're going much lower elevation, about 1,000 than the 11,500 feet above sea

level that it was flown on the map that I showed you. So it's really premature for anyone to go ahead and start staking it, because we don't know, it's still very raw prospect. We don't know what portions of it should be staked, and whether it should be extensive, or whether it should be staked at all. We will have our mercury soil-gas analyses probably this coming week, at least some of them. That may indicate also those zones that are above the mineralized areas. QUERY of When you say we, is that the University Utah (garble? JENSEN That's right - I mean myself and coln_estigators with me at the University of Utah. All the people in geology who are employed on my contract. QUERY These are JENSEN These are professors of geology QUERY - a federal contract not a 3ENSEN - at the University of Utah, no it's federal. It's a federal contract. I'm a principal investigator on both ERTS and Skylah. So the funds that we're spending are derived from the contract, except for the - if we ever staked it I"m sure that NASA would not pay for that. (laughter)

&.

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-102R/2 14:08 CDT

QUERY Well, you know, prospecting traditionally been a private thing - a private venture. JENSEN Not necessarily. I'm a professor and I prospect every spare moment I have - n my own or as a consultant for other concerns. What you're asking is whether the University of Utah would be seriously interested in this and the answer is yes. QUERY Well, I was thinking if the prospecting and mineral deposits are discovered with federal funds, are there any legal problems of Kennicot and some of those moving in, taking information and moving right in to claim it? JENSEN You're asking very excellent questions, which we've asked and tried to answer ourselves here, and my contract states that if I release this information or give this information to NASA - which I have - it'll be released has through the Department of Commerce weekly information news letters, it'll also, I presume, be released to the public through you. I think neither NASA, nor the University of Utah, nor myself would jump the property before this information has been released to the general public. I think it's very likely that this, when I first found this out several weeks ago, I telephoned NASA and dictated over the telephone, essentially, an abstract of the informatlon we had, and told them I absolve myself of any leakage from now on. It's up to you to release the information. PAO Incidentally, this information has been placed in public domain, so his - Dr. Jensen's com*,ents are appropriate. It is in the public domain and has been released and what the report that he prepared at that time has been released also. So it's in the public domain. It's not a secret. QUERY I wasn't implying that - I just wondered if there were some unusual legal problems involved in the mineral leasing and so forth in that area. JENSEN My analysis of this is the US Geological - END OF TAPE

/f

SL-III Tlme: 9123173

PC-IO2S/1 14:08 CDT

in

SPEAKER mineral leasing

and

some so

unusual forth in

legal that

problems area.

have

been

involved

JENSEN My analysis of this is U.S. geological survey of course, has thousands of geologlst who are doing work of this sort. If they ever find anything of interest, they release it in various U.S.G.S. offices at given times through out the country. So no one has an unfair advantage except that person who can afford a helicopter, that is flying in the general area and then he radios and tells them as soon as he release reads the release, where it is. I think HASA's concern is to prove or to show how practical or economically potential practicality the information is, with the imagery we receive. So if we can find something of this sort, think NASA is primarily interested in who gets it. out in the wash, finally,that it was NASA's imagery to the discovery of these mineral diposits. QUERY Can you give us a better idea of location of this area. It's JENSEN near the QUERY Ruth This is information that porphyry copper deposit, Near what town? has near would I don't It'll come that led the

to be indicated. Ely, Nevada.

JENSEN I say it's near, Just say it's in eastern Nevada. And I can be I should be much more explicit than that. However, I am concerned about people who might go out and stake and it'll be a waste of money because it's not to that stage yet. A hundred square miles, it'd cost $32,000 easily for anyone to stake it, plus all the effort that goes into it; the cost of people, post, filing the records, and so forth. that QUERY could have that Of course reoourse there to do are some that. mining companies

this,

JENSEN Copper Corporation, porphyry cooperate, it may be that they've and look for holes, PAO

That's what I say, I worked for Kennico and this is within sight of their Ruth. It may be that they've looked at drilled it. I can't cover 100 square but I didn't see any evldence of it. Abby.

it; miles

JENSEN Incidentally - I might say incidentally, that this iantt the only one we've found. Another one we have in eastern Nevada, and I haventt even mentioned that and it looks even better. ABBY PAO when basin JENSEN geologist range die, province, Would you llke No, no he would There's the good where to mention not. it? that the

an old saying in geology, ones go to heaven which everything is exposed

is

f

SL-III Time: 9123173

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nothing is covered except in these valleys. So there are a lot of geologists out there. It's happened to me. I was born and raised in the west, but went to the school in the east, and taught in the east for many years before I went back home. I love to ski. That 40 inches of rainfalls all snow and Alda is right in the middle of it, but Z'm tremendously exclted about the application of of both ERTS and Skylab's lmagery to the basin range province, that is in western Utah and Nevada. i fully expect this to be a terrifically successful economically, and I'll settle for the prestige, rather than staking it myself. Prestige is a geologist being successful in finding these deposits. You know we have a gross national product of over a thousand billion dollars, which stems from about 23 billion dollars worth of raw resources, half of that is petroleum. By next year, when we're running out of these materials, and being kicked out of Chile, and other countries, we're going to have to find these mineral resources within our own boundaries. And three-fourths of the basin range provinces covered by alluvial or post-ore volcanics. This volcanics that I indicated to you on the imagery is one of them. If we can find major mineral deposits in this area of the basin range, three-fourths of which is covered by - blanketed by post ore sediments or volcanics, it's going to improve our standard of living by developing the mineral resources, within our own boundaries. I'm talking about mineral economics and it's a very important subject. JENSEN Yes. QUERY discovered this JENSEN a thousands of Skylab so far, except for the SPEAKER JENSEN SPEAKER JENSEN Can you go over again how in a sense you've possible area for - When you reallze that we've received over ERTS photographs, and probably more than I00 none of which are bigger than 70 millimeters, S190B, however S190B did not cover this pass. Pardon me, you're right. Itts on It wasn't on at the time. - but it so we - we found it|s not - one of new

f

hundreds of 70 milllmetar photographs. I don't Chink I've spent 25 years as a geologist in thebasln range province, and I don*t think if I'd done that, I'd probably have noticed this, but I was unaware of numerous areas in Nevada working for many concerns and even for myself, various companies I doubt if I would have noticed this. So I think that there's a little bit, there's no technique in geology but the geologist who knows how knows which ones that is apanacea to use all these for explorations various techniques,

END
f

OF

TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/23/73

PC-102T/I 14:08 CDT

JENSEN there's no technique

-

so in

I

think

that that

there's is a

a panacea

little for

bit

-

geology

explora-

tion. But the geologist who knows how to use all his various techniques, knows which ones to use, and which ones not to use, I think, will he more successful in applying this one technique to exploration. So if I hadn't had some information had some interest in why that anomaly existed there, and you can see it - itVs a mountain, of volcanlcs, you'd say, well certainly it's due to the magnetic it's due to the volcanics, which often give very positive magnetic anomalies. But I decided I'm looking at the photographs, and we spend literally hours per day with a binocular microscope going blind examining each one of these. And this one showed these little light spots in it, which are shown on an ERTS photograph, but I hadn't noticed on ERTS in this area here. The volcanics are that And area those there, and you can see these light are all limestone sticking through. spots So through it has it. to by

-

be very thin, therefore, the magnetic anomaly is not the volcanlcs, but something underneath. Maybe it's meteorite. It isn't, but there are other causes of many other deposits. QUERY by of causes of The And that was done and the area south that time. And haven't looked they took gravity anomalies magnetic than Just an was economic initially

caused a anomalies, mineral found

anomaly

aerial survey JENSEN the area Ruth

in 1963, primarily of it, which was it's been a in the northern stations on

because

extremely me, as The map

active at to why people shows where

paradox to portion. the ground. Geologists good

They went right passed one of these limestone areas. here appreciate this becau _ geophysicists aren't very geologists. (Laughter). PAO Okay, thank you. JENSEN Thank you. END OF TAPE

SKYLAB NEWS CENTER Houston, Texas

Skylab III - Recovery Johnson Space Center September 24, 1973 10:08 AM, CDT

and

Medical

Procedures

Briefing

Participants: Dr. Dr. Bob W. Royce Hawkins, Deputy Director for Donald E. Stullken, Flight Operations Gordon, PAO Medical Operations and Recovery Branch

PC-103
f

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PAO Okay, Ladies and Gentlemen, we'll start with our briefing with Dr. Don Stullken, Chief of Recovery Branch and Dr. Royce Hawkins, Deputy Director of Life Sciences. We'll start wlth Dr. Stullken. STULLKEN Okay, if I can have the first view draft please. This is Just a reiteration of a lot of information that's been coming of_ the ship from the press pool out there. But I thought you might be interested in the training that the - that the primary recovery forces has been getting and also some of the - experience that the forces we have had. We feel pretty confidient. We've been doing enough of this activity out there in the Pacific now, where it's almost impossible to get a ship and a squadron that hasn't had some previous experience and it really pays off. I talked to Mel Richmond, the team leader aboard the ship and he's real happy with the preparedness, the readiness of all of the units out there and everybody, squared away. Okay, next one. As you may have heard, within the last 3 or 4 days here we were able to adjust the entry proFram. We will roll left instead of roll right. And we'll land to the left of the ground track or to the east of the ground track as you see. And that get's us within about 200 nautical miles of San Diego. We were about 375 from San Diego. The advantage of this is that the ship will get back into port in time to do the R plus i day physical examination with the ship tied up at the dock. And that menlmizes the impact on the instrumentation and the crew itself for that matter of any ship motion or ship vibration while they are at sea. The recovery forces are Just the same as they were on the last mission. All right post-splash events, you can read that as well as I can. QUERY (garble) PAO Yes, we'll make copies of it, yeah. STULLKEN As you see, the ship arrives in San Diego on the 26th at ii:00 Houston time, that's 09:00 San Diego time. The crew will have had an extremely long day tomorrow, on the 25th. And it's my understanding that they wlll be permitted to sleep just as long as they want to on the morning of the 26th. And when they do get up, they should by that time, be in port and they can start their R plus I day physical exam. Now the crew will stay aboard the ship all day of the 26th, they'll have their R plus 2 day physical examination aboard the ship on the 27th and depart San Diego at 15:00 Houston time which is 13:00 San Diego time and get back here to Ellington at about 6 o'clock in the evening, 6 p.m. on the 27th, Thursday. Okay, next slide. That's Just some of the same information and more of the same information broken down into the various catagorles of return timeline. PAO film is the film that is shot of the recovery, as it's no film from the spacecraft at all. Just - Just film that was shot during the recovery secquence. The experiments include all the experimental

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-103A/2 10:08 CDT

materials as well as some of the spacecraft equipment, things llke that - that are being brought back. And as you see that will get back here to JSC on the 27th on the 26th at about 9:30 in the evening. Fli_ht crew, we hay e all ready discussed. The command module will be off loaded as soon as we get into San Diepo. The RCS system will be safed and purged and then ittll then be moved back to Downey as is usual. Skylab mobile laboratory as soon as they complete their R plus 2 day physical exam, they'll start breaking the lab down, off load from the ship, put it on a C-5, and then it'll be ready for the R plus 3 day physical back here at John - back here at Johnson. Okay. That's it. PAO Okay, Dr. Hawkins. Do you want to leave it open for questions? STULLKEN Yes. what END HAWKINS I need OF TAPE is - what Well. I don't know whether I need to say - I can really -

f

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HAWKINS - Yes, I don't know whether I can really - what I need to say, is the plan is - the spacecraft, Just like it was on Skylab-2, will be brought aboard the recovery ship. The crew will he evaluated by the Flight Surgeon prior to leaving the command module. This will entail blood pressure and pulse check to determine their stability. The -the counter measure garments which they will be wearing, will be inflated and they will be immediately taken from the command module to the mobile laboratories where the initial examination will begin. And it is our plan that we will do a full-up protocol, of course, depending the condition of the crew. Any specific questions, we'll try to clear up on. PAO Okay. Art. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, I wonder if you would give us sort of your ascessment right now of the crew's medical status and also maybe some of your thoughts as to what they are going to face during re-entry here and kind of cast that in the light of men who've been away from gravity now for 59 days, and maybe discuss a little bit about the medical mystery area that we're kind of into here. HAUKINS Well, that's a - that's a pretty big question, Art. Well, actually I think the crew has been in a very stable condition from a medical standpoint now for some time. I think in looking back, it kind of looks llke if you want to hang a date as to where things really looked stable, was about day 39. And I think most of the changes that we saw, definitely occurred in the early phase of the flight and with minimal changes occurring subsequent to that time, up to about day 39 and from that point on, I have not really seen anythin_ to indicate that they were anything other than Just a stable condition with the - based on the M092 and the 171 studies that are - their weights, nutritional intake and so forth. They've been in good spirits all the time from the - after they Inltiafter they got over that initial motion sickness phase of the first 5 or i0 days. So, I really think that the crew is in - is in good condition. There's no question that but what they have lost some of the of the muscle mass, similar to what we saw with the Skylab-2 crew. This is the - what I'm referring to now is the calf circumference measurements of which you've been aware of. These, again, have been stable. They have continued to lose again, almost llke from again, from day 39_ period where that has been fairly stable and no impressionable change. There's no question in my mind, at least but what we're going to see a very unsteady crew once they get up on their feet. I think that the counter measure garment will be of upon

f

f-

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PC103B/2 i0:08 CDT

tremendous benefit to them in assisting them in this initial readjustment and readaptation to the to the one g environment. And they're going to - they're going to have to take it slow and - and it's possible that we may not be able to do a complete medical protocol. If we do the full-up protocal, the as is planned, it'll take something llke about 7 hours, which after an awful long day already, and you add another 7 hours to it, it is going to be a - END OF TAPE

.F

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

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_"

HAWKINS as is planned, it'll that something like about 7 hours, which after an awful long day all ready, then you add another 7 hours to it, t is going to be it's goin? to be hard. And so you've got a lot of things working a_ainst you. You've got a long day. You've got fatigue. You've got the problem of re-entry and re-adjust to l-g conditions. And so it's - plus the - the no doubt the - the cardiovascular deconditioning, a factor which is present, which in - which we have seen in every flight. All of these things are going to be there. And we're going to see the effect of that. But I don't really believe that we're going to see anything that's going to be a lot different from what we saw with Skylab-ll. And I think definitely, we're going to see a prolong period of rea!dapting and - a time period similar to Skylab-ll's or maybe slightly even longer before they really get back into what we call their pre-flight envelop. PAO Mark Cramer. Go ahead. QUERY D _ Hawkins, will Garriott exam the other two astronauts and/or himself in anyway prior to the spacecraft bein_ taken aboard the space - the primary recovery ship? HAWKINS No. We - Dr. - Dr. Buchanan and Dr. Burchard who will - who are out on the ship. One or the other of them will go into the command module and examine first the man in the center couch and bring him out, and then examine the other two then in that order. QUERY Could you estimate how long such an examination might take? HAWKINS Oh, I think probably for the whole three maybe about 15 minutes. It's the matter of Just putting the blood pressure cuff on and checking their pulse and pressure and determining what that initial evaluation is. or QUERY swimmers STULLKEN there is 4. 5 in the Dr. Stullken, are water immediately Want us to braker there normally 3, after splashdown? it real we'll, 4,

PAO Tom Hilton, (garble) QUERY Dr. Hawkin, do you expect the crew, as they expect, to be able to walk out or climb out by themselves? HAWKINS Yes, I think they will with the assistance and all of the counter measure garments. I feel like they will be able to to assist themselves in this manner. PAO Okay, Tom. PAO It's not related, okay. Mr. Chris here. QUERY Doctor, who is going to make the decission of whether the astronauts want to walk or whether they want to get on these chairs on that forklift truck and so forth? I understand official policies to have them ride to the laboratory.

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-I03C/2 10:08 CDT

HAWKINS That's right, that is the policy. QUERY But, they apparently, Bean said the other day, for example, that they want to walk. HAWKINS Well, (laugh) Kind of academic. The primary purpose of that forklift is so that they won't have to climb stairs. See the command module on the dolly is the hatch of it is about 5-1/2 feet above deck level. And they'll come out onto a platform that's moved up to the command module. Then instead of having to climb down the stairs to get back down to deck level, they'll come over onto this forklift platform, which is contiguous with the stationary platform, llke riding down an elevator. Now, when they get to the bottom - when they get to deck level, whether they drive the forklift 50 feet, and they they step off and walk into the lab or whether they step off and walk 50 feet into the lab, that's going - decision is going to be made out there at the time. QUERY How about the chairs? HAUKINS Well, the chairs are on the forklift. And if I was in their position, I'd sit down. I mean, why stand if you can sit. QUERY I guess, that's what HAWKINS Skylab-ll. SPEAKER HAWKINS PAO QUERY up, Dr. Hawkins. As them not to stand on medically examined. END OF TAPE Obviously they'd be the first to they indicated in their - (laugh) We've got lots of firsts do on so,

Skylab-ll? Skylab-lll, whatever it is. Up front here, Re_ey. I wonder if you could help me clear this I understand it, medically, you prefer there feet at all before they are They want to

f_

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-IO3D/I 10:08 CDT

QUERY I wonder if you could Just help me Just clear this up, Dr. Hawkins. As I understand it, medically you'd prefer them not to stand on their feet at all before they are medically examined. They want to walk across the deck and if they insist on walking across the deck, you're not going to stop them. Is that it? HAWKINS No, I don't - if they feel that they definitely want to walk across there, then I, and I felt as the Flight Surgeon out there that they can do it. I certainly wouldn't prohibit them from doin_ it. I think this will depend on what the medical judgement is based upon what they see. QUERY But if they do walk across the deck, you do lose some medical data. Is that right? HAWKINS Well, it's hard to say how much, how much you lose. All of these things enter into the, you know, into the end results that you get. The fatigue factor, motion sickness, all of this adds up and interferes. What we would certainly like from a medical stand point, and strickly a scientific stand point is to have them Just bodily hand carried and placed upon the examining table where you don't, you know, you don't introduce anything new into your study. But it's, we're in an operational situation where you can't always do exactly like you want to do. QUERY But if this is medically important, why you insist on it? HAWKINS Well, I can't say that it is really that important because I can't tell you Just how much effect that's going to have them. I can't identify that. QUERY You mentioned that after day-39 there has been almost no change in the astronauts. How much change, I mean could you give some general feeling for how much change you noticed up until day-39? And why, do you have any theory on why it was 39 days? HA_TKINS No, I don't know why the 39 days at all. The - and up until that time there were, there were changes erratic responses in their heart rate and blood pressures that was seen from one examination to the next. And all of don't these really started off much higher than what you would norm_lly expect. Here a_aln I think it was associated with the early motion sickness that the crew suffered that gave the very high pulse rates under examination. And these things gradually began to settle back. Now they have always been higher than their preflight base llne, but both in the resting rates as well as in the heart rates under stress. This has been characteristic throughout the mission, that these rates have remained higher than their preflight base llne measurements.

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-103D/2 10:08 CDT

Now what is a more The rates

we have seen consistent are almost

then in this response each on a straight It's been and erratic tests the 92, that the

latter part of the mission time that you do the test. llne if you connect one almost response you lower are body been Just a which we've referring negative straight, seen to are

data point to the next. without that fluxuation earlier. QUERY ergometer HAWKINS sure, yeah. the These And

pres-

QUERY Does that mean prior to the 39th day for example the astronauts experienced some lessening of the red blood cells reproductlvity, and the marrow for example, but after that there was no longer any change or there was an increase, or what? know HAWKINS that until I I get can't some talk blood about samples that s back because as to I won't what we're

seeing there, really. We've had have been, I think, very nominal, any really ehan_e. But that is have on the blood at this point. END OF TAPE

hemoglobin takes and without any, the only inflight

run which without data we

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-103E/I 10:08 CDT,

HAWKINS

Really

any

change.

But

that's

the

only

in-fllght data we have on the blood at this point. QUERY Well, Dr. Hawkins, from you're point of view now, is this the plateau that - would you interpret this as the platteau that everyone has been looking for? HA_KINS Well, I guess it's a little bit early to say, you know for certain, what that really means if that is a platteau because you don't have all the picture and you definitely want to see what your in-flight blood and urine samples tell you. You've got to have all the chemistries and the intricate studies, hormonal studies and all this to put the total picture together because there - it's possible that these thinzs may be still changing. QUERY Okay. And the other thing that I wanted to ask you was goinM back to what you said earlier about the crew's long day. Isn't there some way to work out re-entry day so that you don't end up with this extra time being heaped on the crew either by lengthening or shortening the mission or doinE somethin_ to get around it? IIAWKINS Well, probably Dr. Stullken can really answer that a little better than I can. It's my understanding that you have from awake up to splash, you have a built in time factor there which is something like 12 or 14 hours that there is Just no way around it, that's that. And so you start from there than. Don, you can explain it a little better I'm sure. STULLKEN I'm sure you remember we increased the length of this mission from 56 to 59 days. In order to put the target point as close as possible to the west Coast, further in order to minimize the amount of time aboard ship so that we could get this R plus one day physical conducted, you know, tied up along side of the pier without the impact of whatever motion sickness or vibration on instruments might have, you know, on the R plus 1 day data. But by doing that, you see, we traded off the intregrity you might say of the R plus I data for a little more - a little longer time line in terms of the crew's last day. And there's - we're kind of strapped, you know, by orbital geometry here. These ground tracks repeat every 5th day and there's only one out of 5 days that get's that close to San Diego and that may be a day when you impact the crew's time line. PAO (garble) right here. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, did you say a while a_o that there had been no appreciable change in body mass since day 39? HAWKINS Somewhere in that day 39 - 40 somewhere along in there, it looks to me llke when you graft these

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PCIO3E/2 10:08 CDT

points out that they just platteaued out and I haven't seen any apprlciable chan_e since then. PAO Jim Olson, in the back. QUERY Dr. Stullken, I'm curious to know how that hurricane is going to affect the general weather conditions in the splash area and also, the increase in the height potential sea sickness? more of particularly, the waves is how going the - perhaps to affect I I brought don't a new

STULLKEN I thought a chart. And that's the only get it back over there by ii

you'd never ask because one in exlstance and if o'clock, they got to make

one. What you see on that is the footprint which is max lift, men lift, and target point for the end of mission. And right now the hurricane is located right here and at recovery time it is predicted to be up at this point. And you see the hurricane dicting, dicting is still well outside the footprint. realize now this is all 48-hour type max winds at the max llft point of 30 They're prediction knots and preprethat's

pretty close to being marginal. Well, that is marginal. However, the weather, if the predictions are correct, if those predictions are correct, and the weather we expect at the end of mission target point which is this X up here. I'll see if I can read it upside down, we'll have scattered clouds at 1800 feet, occasslonally broken, visibility of i0 miles END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-103F/I 10:08 CDT

SPEAKEZ - - expect at the end of mission target point which is this X up here, I'ii see if I can read it upside down, we'll have scattered clouds at 1800 feet, occassionally broken, visibility of 10 miles, sea state - combined sea state which is the max combination of the ground swell plus speed ideal the wind waves on from 360 degrees recovery conditions the top of it, of 5 feet, and a wind of about 15 knots which is Just about as as we can expect to get. Now, that's

the prediction. And there's no question that as the sea state increases, the waves get higher, the Job becomes tougher. And I can't give you a cutoff point because if you have a ground swell, that's 12 feet waves, hardly any impact at all because the interval between croft and creast is so long that it doesn't bother you. On the other hand if you have a real short wave chop, as little as 8 or i0 feet, it can cause problems. And it's a very complicated inner reacting situation of direction, of swell, direction of wave, and direction of wind, that has to to be resolved the Command by the [iodule skipper to get of the ship it underneath in making that B&A on of the approach crane to based or are that to -

pick it up on the deck. And it's strictly an on my experience, quote end quote, analysis not to do it. That's the best I can give you. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, 2 questions. could you give us some feeling for the muscle you have extrapolate like that

scene, whether what loss

One, mass

experienced - you have seen and is there any way from say the loss in the thighs or something to what loss there might he in the heart muscle. question might because might of is not not

The second being - you Now is that astronauts HA_KINS the amount

- you mentioned something about not be able to do the full medical protocol. of the time factor or is that because the that full protocol? of the question loss, is about 6 to

muscle

be able to undergo Well, the first part loss - muscle mass

8 percent. Now this is in the calf leg, and no, I don't although we have seen a reduced size in the cardiac silhouette by X-rays in the post-flight period and we will again be doing cardiac X-rays to determine exactly what the size of the heart is and if There is aga _, any type of reduction in size as we have seen previously or not. That I can't relate back to the loss of muscle mass in the extremities. And I don't think that you see these same type of muscle loss over the entire body either, this seems to be limited to the lower extremities. Where in the weightless condition suddenly the muscles that normally exercise to against gravity to support the body are no longer active. They don't have a role to play really. And so it's in the legs that you really see,

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I think the more significant change, and less so in the upper extremities and other parts of the body that are normally performing and working and doing tasks and all which they normally do anyway, QUERY Protocol. HAUKINS Now, on the protocol, yes, we plan to do a ful I up protocol. And that takes something like a good 6 to 7 hours of time if we go through all that is planned. The reason why we would not do that, is because of the crew's condition. If they are Just not up to it, this could be because of sea sickness that would interfere with it. It could be because - END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-103G/I 10:08 CDT

HAWKINS - is the cause of the crew's condition. If they are just not up to it,,this could he because of sea sickness that would interfere with it. It could be because of the deconditioning, cardiovascular deconditioning that would not permit them to go ahead and go through the entire medical protocol. Fatigue could also be a factor here. So it really is dependent on just how well the crew, the crewmen are, and how they are able to perform. And we'll go as far with them as we feel is medically indicated. QUERY Following that up a bit, will you allow the astronauts or encourage them for that matter to take any sleeping pills to help them sleep when weiRhtless again, or would that spoil the medical tests? HAWKINS You mean prior to their return? QUERY Immediately, immediately. For their first night's sleep which will presumable be pretty difficult on the ground? HAWKINS Well, it is the experience that we've had really they have had no problem sleeping. Now you remember the Skylah 2 crew, boy when they got to bed they were out like a lipht and they slept for 12 hours. And they sure didn't need anythin_ to put them to sleep or keep them there. And I don't think that we would here. Now if there was a reason why a guy couldn't sleep, yes, then we would probably give them some seconol or something to assist him, to get him to sleep because he definitely needs the rest. But I don't anticipate that that is going to be a problem. QUERY C _ you give us any actual wieght losses or gains during the flight? Do you have those figures? HAWKINS Yes, I do. Do you have the original weights? Okay. Let me see if I can find them here. Okay, let's see, here is the latest I have. I'ii give you the Commander's first, which preflight weight was 155, I'm sorry, 151. Okay, and on day-58 his weight that's today, isn't it? Okay, day-58 anyway is 143.9. The Science Pilot preflight was 136.3, and at day-58 he was 128. That's the lowest that I recall his weight being. He has hit 128.2, 3, 4, down into that range a time or two, but he has bounced around between 128 and 130. So this is really about an average of 129. Round it off to that and you will get about what his actual weight loss is. For the Pilot, Jack's weight was 194.8 and day-58 he was 187.7. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, out, do you have anything on the calves? De you have anythin F on perimeters easily grasped by the while you have those figures loss of muscle mass in the the heart rate, any other news media and the public?

_"

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PC-103G/2 10:08 CDT

HA_qKINS Well, as I said on the muscle mass, it's about 68 percent loss. Which really in circumference is about an inch, is just about what they have lost. And this is Just about the same for all three of them_ where in Skylab 2 we saw quite a difference with Pete having lost the most, as I remember, about 16 percent. Now heart rates, well I don't have any good figures. END OF TAPE

F.

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-103H/I 10:08 CDT

HAWKINS - - about 16 per cent. Now, heart rates, I don't have - Well, I don't have any good, you know, really good figures here to give you on that. The only thing there is the resting rates have - a new - in association with the examinations, 92 and 171 have consistently run a little higher by - by ten maybe 15 beats over the baseline pre-fllght baseline levels. Heart rates about I0 or 15 beats higher, resting heart. QUERY Is that considerable? HAWKINS Well. QUERY What's the normal heart rate, 60 or 70? HAWKINS Oh, well it varies for individuals. Like Jack's in the base pre-flight ran somewhere in the low 50's, you know, or the upper 40's. Where QUERY That'll be an enormous increase, wouldn't it? HAWKINS Well, he's up to what something like about 60 or 65 at a baseline in flight resting level. That's not really - that's not really significant. QUERY That's on the order of perhaps as much as 25 percent. HAWKINS Well, yeah, probably. QUERY I would - I'm not a doctor - I can say that's frightening. HAWKINS No. QUERY Heat rates vary HAWKINS Heart rates wary for a lot of reasons, really. And just the anticipation of doing an examination, you can increase your heart rate, you know. So, that's why it becomes a little bit, you know, a little bit dangerous to try to - try to - attach to much significance to the heart rate except under specific circumstances. QUERY Okay, Dr. Stullken, one last question, is it possible for the spacecraft to be on board the ship in less than was it 35 minutes, is that the plan time? Or is that the minimum, is that the optimum time? STULLKEN Oh_ it's possible. One thing that we impress on the people out there is that a few minutes, one way or the other, up to 50 percent of that amount of time is really pretty insignificant. And we would prefer that they - that they do a more deliberate job and a good job rather than to - you know make a horse race out of it. As a matter of fact, this is one of the - one of the things when we start with new ships and new helo squardrons and new swimming teams and what not. Everybody wants to beat the other guy's record. And this we discourage, this whole task is a little bit like riding a blcycle. You got to keep it moving at a good slow deliberate speed, but your control of it is best if you don't go to fast.

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-103H/2 10:08 CDT

QUERY simulations?

What

What have they kind of - -

been

doing

in

these

STULLKEN I haven't even asked. The very fact that I would ask, would lend emphasis to it, and therefore, and since it's not important, I don't ask that question. PAO (Garble) QUERY How much exercise have the three men been doing p_r day? HAWKINS Oh, boy. I believe they've - they've been doing an awful lot really. Let's see, I don't know whether I got the - yeah, maybe I Okay, they've been • hey've been ranging anywhere from - from about - well, let's see, 5000 to 8000 watt minutes. And Jack has been - QUERY 5000 - what does that mean? HAWKINS (laugh) Well that's the (laugh) that's the way - that's the way you measure the - the amount of of - of - of energy that they're working at - against on the - on the bicycle ergometer. QUERY How many hours (garble) (laugh) MS (garble) (laugh) QUERY Is it enough energy to rnn a 5000 watt light bulb or someting (laugh). HAWKINS Well, lets see, how would I break that? MS (Laughter) QUERY (garb le) HAWKINS Yeah, (garble) you could. QUERY How many hours, in the terms of hours? HAWKINS In the terms of hours - I don't have I don't have you mean for the total mission? QUERY No, no. Per day, are they exercising hour and half a day or HAWKINS Something, approaching an hour, which is what they had programed. QUERY Is Jack Lousma exercising twice as as the other two? HAWKINS he is consistently period, than the END OF TAPE Candy, an

much

He's - he's not quite twice as much but adveraging more work load per exercise other crewmen are.

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-I03I/1 10:08 CDT

SPEAKER

But

he

is

consistantly

averaging

more

work

load per exercise period than the other crewmen are, like he bezan to relate it into watt minutes of energy. He's working like up to 8 or 9000 where the other two are working somewhere around 4 to 5000. That's the amount of enerzy - watts energy per minute work load. QUERY Why is twice as much as the other Jack two? Lousma exercising almost

SPEAKER to, you know, two, Abbey, QUERY physical condition the other two? able other

Nell, he's a much bigger man. And he's just work at a much higher load than the I believe that's the answer to it. Do you notice any difference in his because he's exercising so much more than

SPEAKER No, I don't think you can really say I can see any difference in their physical condition. I think that a - looks to me - they are all in good physical condition for their particular statue and they are all stable. In other words, they've reached a fairly stable condition, in that maybe this is the right exercise, you know, for that particular guy. This is, of course, one of the thinks we're going to looking for and trying to hopefully we'll have an answer to that when we get them hack to what all this exercise really does mean. We saw in Pete Conrad where we worked the most which - whether it really influenced his condition on R-zero or not is hard to say yet. We only have Just one a little their mission man more one data point. insight into that, Maybe this as to how crew well will that give us maintains

physical staminl, their physical condition through the and protects them in the immediate post flight period. PAO Nich, Crls. QUERY Dr. Stullklns, could you please run through

once more the - some of the figures you gave us on the hurricane As I understand it, it is now marginal and in 48 hours, you expect it to calm down enough to Would you run through it again, please? And how many give us some nautical miles of distance of the hurricane from the - STULLKENS I can estimate them because I don't have a at the present time, the last reading the hurricane was about a pencil length and half an inch away from the target point a pencil length plus half an inch and that's 3, 6, 9 - that's over i000 miles from the target point. Nautical miles, yes, multiply by i.i if you want statute. Now the last time it was located t which was 24th at 09:00 Zulu, it was - well, that's when it was i000 miles. Now, they are predicting at the time of landing that it will be 3, 360, 420, 480 nautical miles, almost due southwest along the ground track I mean southeast

-

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PCI031/2 10:08 CDT

alon_ the ground track from the target point. And out from the center, a distance of 240, between 240 and 250 miles, is as close as I can tell it, out from the center 250 miles, the max winds will be 30 knots. Which is still 3, 4, 420, 485, 490 miles from the target point and that is the max lift point of the spacecraft. See, the spacecraft could reach that point if he flew max lift all the way in which we have no intention of doing. It's Just part of our maneuver - END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9124173

PCI03J/I 10:08 CDT

STULKEN spacecraft could reach that point if he flew max lift all the way in, which we have no intention of doing. It's Just part of our maneuver footprint that we coule reach. But at the present time there is no intention of moving the target point. If the thing progressed in that direction - the same direction at a little bit higher rate of speed or intensified somewhat - well, quite a bit higher rate of speed and intensified quite a bit, then We would consider movinE the target point back along the groundtrack Just to stay further away from it. But at the present time, we've got - like I said earlier, almost a perfect weather forecast for splashdown on Tuesday. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, on the weight loss. These guys I understand have been eating quite well, in fact more than their scheduled ration. There's no reason for them to be degydrated, so what is it they're losing? And also - it strikes me as interesting to hear that Lousma's a big guy, Bean is a medium guy, and Garriott is a little guy, and yet they all three lose about the same amount - 7 or 8 pounds. Whet are they losing? HAWKINS Well, I think the initial loss was fluids. Which is associated with the early adaptive phase of the mission. Following this - and remember, they were ill, a lot of motion sickness there the first few days, and they were off their diet and they were off their fluid intake, and so all of this contributed to this initial loss. Now then, followin_ this, then any weight loss is going to be fat, and following that, then, itts goln B to be muscle if there's any continuation of loss. And so what we've seen is some of all three involved in this total weight loss picture. Now, they reached a fairly - well their initial loss, I don't recall the exact number of pounds, but it was somethin_ less than this total. And then there was Just a gradual trend, downward - which is what we saw with Skylab 2 crew, all three of them - that seemed to continue throughout their entire mission. There's always a gradual trend downward. This crew has showed a similar trend for something llke the same period of time or slightly longer, but as I say, from somethin_ llke last - well since day 35 or 36, somewhere along in there, I can't really see where there's been any real signficant change in their weight. It's been _airly stable. So 1 feel like they had reached a level and they've maintained this with adequate nutritional intake. QUERY Isn't it strange that Lousma and Garriott lose the same? You'd think a bit guy would have more to lose, and would lose more. HAWKINS Well, there net any of that went into this

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC103J/2 10:08 CDT

mission obese_ anything llke fat tissue there for them to readjustment, body fluids and I think this would be something to all three crewmen, and then I can't explain yet.

that. lose.

There's been So whatever

-

very little whatever

loss of fluids that's required, that would be fairly comparable any muscle mass is something

STULKEN I'll make a comment, Royse. One of the main reasons we're flying Skylab is to get the answers to the questions you're asking, if we knew those answers, we wouldn't have to be doing this kind of research work, and until all the data gets back, you can't come up with good firm answers to it. If we had those good firm answers, we',re wastin_ our time up there, you know, doing a lot of the things we're already doing. Just to get answers llke that. PAO Lets have one more question with Mr. UAWKINS Until we to look at the return to what And you get a chance to look body chemistry and all, it's this meansmeans. And is this apparently the - END OF TAPE get them back and we have a chance they measured pre-fllght and all. at all the other changes in the difficult to say why or what coincidental that they each lose

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PCI03K/I 10:08 CDT

HAWKINS

-

-

and

all.

It's

difficult

to

say, -

you know, why, what this means. And is this coincidental that they each lose apparently the same amount or is it not. It's QUERY Dr. Hawkins, are you happy with this circadian rhythm shift that the crew has gone on to. I notice they seem to be sleeping less each night than was common during the other part of the mission. HA_KINS Yeah, it's definitely it has seem to to affect the We have given use of sleeping they really to it. But And what PAO if amount of them some pills. sleep or assistance And but, that taking the quality with this they have you know, the full of the through I think that time sleep. the that do

- they're it - hut they

making it has

adjustment to really

it.

really adquately adjusted yet, I Let's have one more here with Dr. Hawkins, can you compare of this crew with the SL-2 shape, somewhat better, twice Well, that's hard to that's

don't know. (garble). in some way crew? Are as good hard to

QUERY the general condition they in much better shape or what? HAWKINS

say really. They look to be they look to be in good shape and the Skylab-2 crew looked to be in good shape. In lots of ways, this crew seems to be in better shape. And it's it's just yet really difficult until we get them back and really see what the - what the recovery picture looks llke. It's hard to say what this really means. PAO Tommy, a real quick one. QUERY The crew asked for more time on this mission and in their press conference last week said they could go on quote, "Indefinitely.? Do you think they could have from a medical stand point? HAUKINS Well, from what I've seen and they in the latter part I would - I've seen could not continue QUEKY HA_TKINS condition I was QUERY understood medical. here and the That of this nothing on. Why? As I As reason is, I mission, at this yeah. point I think they could. which says they

stated

earlier, Now if

there's there -

been excuse them it

a

stable as

prevailing.

understood, for them (garble)

they're for bringing mission when

me, back, was

for

suppose

to be ended. HAWKINS Well, That's not the only reason. a medical interest in not heen our policy is that we only throughout extend a

that's not the only reason. No. Certainly, we want to - we have extending it because of what has the mission manned by space doubling flight program, the exposure

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

MCIO3K/2 10:08 CDT

time at which we previously had. And until we understand what that means to us, what impact that has on the total picture, what that means, then we dontt llke to commit ourselves. to you know, into an unknown area. But there are other consierations in the decision to not extend the mission. PAO Okay, gentlemen. Thank you very much. I want to remind everybody at 1 o'clock this afternoon, we'll have Glynn Lunney, manager of the Skylab CSM. He'll be here to discuss the command module this afternoon at 1 p.m. END OF TAPE

SKYLAB Houston,

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Skylab III - CSH Systems Johnson Space Center September 24, 1973 I:00 p.m.

Briefing

Participants: Glynn Lunney, CS_f Jack Riley, PAO _Ianager

PC-104

f

SL-III PCI04A/I Time: 15:00 CDT 9/24/73 PAO Okay. We're ready. Glynn Lunney, the Apollo Spacecraft Program Manager, here at the Johnson Space Center, who will tell you about the command and service module in which the crew will come home tomorrow. Glynn. LUNNEY I would llke to start with a brief review of what status of the ship is since it took off from the Cape, some 58 days ago now, and let you know what we have learned and what we have done about it - that is, some of the problems we've had. I'd llke you to understand our posture for tomorrow and then I would like to try to answer any questions that you might have concerning the ship. We have had two problems during the course of the flight, which relate to the ability of the ship to perform all the functions that it has to do for the safe entry and splashdown tomorrow in the Pacific. The two problems that we have had are as follow. The first, on the first problem we had was on rendezvous day, we had a leak through one of the thrusters. This was in quad Bravo, which looking forward from the Pilot's seat, is at 3 o'clock on this side of the spacecraft approximately. The forward firing thruster on that particular quad, was stuck open a certain amount such that the oxidizer was coming forward, the quad was isolated that is, the propellants were shut off to the quad and the rendezvous continued. The second problem that we had, was an oxidizer leak in Quad Delta. Again, looking forward, Quad Delta is 180 degrees or at the 9 o'clock position on the spacecraft. And we had a oxidizer leak in that quad. Let me discuss both of these problems a little bit more for you to help you understand them and then take you into where we are in the spacecraft today. On the first one, we have concluded that the problem that we had was due to some contamination on the seat. As you know, there are two valves one for oxidizer and one for fuel, which admit the propellants to the engine where they are ignited hypergolically to provide the control function. The measurement of the leak rate which we have, indicates we have a valve which is open about 25 percent of it's full throw. We talk in fairly small numbers when we talk about the opening of a valve. Full open in 20 thousandths of an inch. So we have an opening which is equivalent to about 5 thousandths of an inch opening. The or 25 percent of the full open condition of the engine. We have concluded that we have had some kind of a contaminent which was probably a 5 not much bigger than a contaminent resting on fully close. then we have a thousandth particle, which is really couple sheets of paper together, a the seat, such that the valve cannot are open to the engine, on the oxidizer side

-

And then when propellants case where the oxidizer

If

SL-III Time: 9/24/73 would

PCIO4A/2 15:00 CDT

leak

out

on

through

this

leak

path

through

the

engine.

The engine happened. shut off

- the quad By that, I to that quad

itself, has been isolated mean that the propellants so that there has been no

since that have been further of our knowledge, order and keeping

oxidizer flow we still have of 5 thousandths

through it. However, to the best to assume that a particle on the is still sitting on the valve

the valve from closing all the way. Therefore, we assume that if we have to reenable a quad or apply propellants to use it, that we would continue to sustain the leak. The leak in that quad is, as I recall, 0.075 pounds per second. The other problem that we - let me say one more thing about that. And in summary on - on the quad B, quad Bravo, we have what we can refer to somewhat as a control leak, in that the direction of the leak is known. It's obviously coming out of the chamber, obvious from the fact that the crew reported a chamber llke size or chamber - END OF TAPE

/f

Time: . 9/24/73

SL-III PC-104B/I 13:00 CDT

LUNNEY coming out the chamber obvious from the fact that the crew reported a chamber like size, or chamber shape size snow cone coming up past the window, and also from the motions that we saw in the spacecraft at that time indicating that something was moving the spacecraft in that direction. The quad would be entirely usable with this condition recognizing that there would be a continuing oxidizer leak through the chamber. We would have to assume today that that would still occur. But we could use it recognizing that as we used it we would in effect have a leak in our gas tank so that we could not run as far as we could normally run on a full tank of gas. Quad Delta occurred, the leaking quad Delta, occurred again oxidizedly occurred on the sixth mission day early in August. The characteristics o_ this leak are different than those that I described through the thruster on thweopposite quad. We appear to have a leak internal to the structure that the four engines are housed in. We refer to that structure as a dog house in that it is about that shape and size, and the four engines of course are mounted in it. We have clncluded that had a fitting that was lose in one of the engines in that package, and that the flow of the oxidizer was actually firm inside the dog house, some probably getting out around the quad itself, or around the dog house itself outside. But most of it coming back in through the service module up over one of the SPS tanks, and on out the back end of the spacecraft. We can trace the flow of this frozen oxidizer by the temperatures that we saw, responding to that both in the dog house, and then inside the quad, and then around the SPS, and around the helium tank as the oxidizer found it's way to the vacuum outside. We've done a fair amount of testing. I ught to say that relative to the oxidizer, it comes out in a frozen state. There is no concern for combustion. We've run tests of the oxidizer in these conditions on all of the materials that we have in that area, and there is no sensitivity to the oxidizer. Also, the potential for ignition outside of an engine by having an oxidizer leak and then a subsequent fuel leak, which we have no indication of is very unlikely in that it takes about 6/10 of a psi to sustain combustion of these propellants, and we don't see any way that we could actually sustain that kind of a pressure since it would fairly quickly go to a very low pressure even if we had a fuel and oxidizer leak. The conclusion is then that, again, we have a condition where we have a leak of the oxidizer, this time internal to the quad. We know what the leak was, the leak rate was at the time that it occurred. Again we feel llke the quad would be usable

f

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-IO4B/2 13:00 CDT

in an emergency, but for both the quad Bravo and quad Delta, we would choose not to use them normally for the mission unless we had some further problem. We have adequate propellants to meet the red line requirements for attitude control and back up the orbit system with the quads that we have had no problems with, that is quads Alfa and Charlle, and the propellant load that we have in the propellant storage module. If we had to use a backup technique, we would also enable propellants that is flow propellants to quad Bravo in order to fire the aft flrinB thruster that is the one that pushes forward, pushes the spacecraft forward in order to counteract a very small torque which would exist on the spacecraft pushing it in the direction of quad Bravo. Our research on the problem that we had indicates that there was a point in the assembly of the particular quad that we have on 117, this very particular quad where there was some amount of rework done on the quad which gives us some credence to believe that the one or more of the flttin_s were not completely tightened, and that indeed, this was the cause of the problem that we had inflight. We have since checked all of the fittings in the service module on the other spacecraft, We checked them to prove that they were past, finger tight, which we think it would have to be about that loose to get a leak. We checked to see that they were all finger tight, and we have actually gone in and retorqued all of the fittings in the service module. Ue have also retorqued all of the fittings that are available to us in the command module, although there are a few fittings which we cannot - END OF TAPE

_-

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-104C/I 13:00 CDT

LUNNEY we have actually gone in and retorqued all of the fittings in the service module. We have also retorqued all of the fittings that are available to us in the command module, although there are a few fittings which we can not get at in the - in the 118 ship. That is the ship that is on the pad today. By that process again, we feel that - gained assurance that the - that the general condition of the torque on the fittings and the fleet of ships that we have on the ground is adequate and we would not have had a leak with any of those either. Given that, we are now making our plans for the entry tomorrow. There has been a modification to denormal the orbit plan. As you know normally, we - we - we perform the deorbit sequence in two burns, that is, one burn taking us down to a lower altitude, and then, a rev later, finishing off with the burn which causes the entry of the spacecraft. In this case, we would llke to, Just as a matter of prudence, minimize the time that we are flying the spacecraft, in the sense that not in the sense that we have any concern about the QUADs that we have - hut Just as a matter of prudence and not putting any more time on it than we have to. QUADs Alpha and Charlie have been wetted of course the whole time with propellants and we have no sign of leaks there or in the propellant storage module. So the plannin_ for tomorrow has a single SPS deorbit burn I have the time here in the flight plan, which is probably available to everybody, about an 18-second burn. We have plenty of margin of propellants in the service propulsion system. As a matter of fact, we would re-enter after the burn with about 2100 pounds of propellant left in the tanks. We did have a instrumentation problem last night on the service propulsion system that you may have heard about. An oxidizer reading - let me say it this way - pressure reading in the oxidizer feed system, shifted from the about 160 psi that it was reading throughout most of the flight, down to 135 psi. However, the other pressure measurement which we had in the tanks stayed exactly where it had been throughout the mission. And the temperatures that we have in the service module also gave no indication of any change. The conclusion is that, indeed, we did have a - shift in the transducer, and we have seen this kind of shift on transducers on the ground in the past thus giving us the confidence that indeed the SPS is still exactly where we want it to be, that is tight and ready to be used. The - We have made some backup plans tomorrow for use of the thrusters as a backup deorbit _echnique. We have tried a varity of modes of deorbit using the two good QUADs that we have, Alpha and Charlie, in the propellant storage models - module. We have also simulated backup deorbit with the two QUADs which have a leak in the propellant storage module, that is, Bravo and Delta in the propellant storage module. And almost - in all of these cases we have a positive margin above the red line - in order to perform a backup deorbit if we had to. The deorbit is planned

f

SL-III Time: 9124173

PCI04C/2 13:00 CDT

to land at 5:36 - I'M sure you have heard most of these times tomorrow, central daylight time, off San Diego. I haven't I didn't listen to the conference that was just held, but I understand you hear from Don Stullken on the posture of the recovery forces and the hurricane that is out there so I won't talk anymore about that. I would like to conclude by saying that, although we have had the two problems in flight on the RCS system we have concluded that they are really isolated and completely independent problems. We have had a long experience of very successful operation of the RCS systems. We have not had any leaks in flight prior to this point. So we approach the - the entry tomorrow with full confidence that the system is entirely capable of doing it's normal job and that we can go to a number of tiers of degration and still have an adequite performance of the control system, both as a control system and as a deorbit technque, in case we have a further problem with the SPS. With that perhaps I would go to questions and END OF TAPE

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PCI04D/I 13:00 CDT

problem and -

LUNNEY with QUERY

the

SPS.

technique With that, Glynn_ too. 5:36 that's

in case perhaps, First one

we had a I would you just

further to questions brought

up,

you said, LUNNEY QUERY been LUNNEY QUERY LUNNEY -

did

you

say Yes.

splash? 16 minutes off of everything

Well, Okay. We've Okay. Unless,

we've

been

getting

5:20. came we've up got. at As the

last of

QUERY SPEAKER this morning, it

unless

something one

5:20's the was 5:20.

latest

LUNNEY Okay. My Flight Plan is 5:36. QUERY One other. From your last statement, you've given full confidence in everything else. Then, are you Just ruling out any possibility that another problem could crop never had cidence? a up although hitch with we have before? had You two in just a system that we've Is it Just coinhad -

_

LUNNEY I have concluded that the problem that we in two systems - that is, the two problems that welve had are really independent problems, we've given the same circumstances that is, a contamlnent or a loose fitting. We could're had either problem on separate flights in the past. We see no connection being about with to those happen two problems in the other in terms quads. of spreading As a matter or of and PSM.

fact, the other quads we have not experleneee Again, by having what

have been wetted with propellant any leak in those quads on the we consider to be a known leak

condition, we feel that if necessary, we would use those quads and in effect be - be similar your car with a known leak in the gas tank. wouldn't be able to go as far by having full of the fuel in the tank. That is, you would QUERY I'd like to get - pardon I'd like to get a little bit of a run down. understand what RCS for deorbit LUNNEY QUERY two are just good quads leaking? LUNNEY using the or would It quads. the situation Yes. Could you we you have do to that burn with the is. If you have

go back and to driving You Just availabllty lose some. me, I've got Make sure I to use the

only two

the that by gets

quads

two

have a problem It can be done,

with control however, it

SL-III Time: 9/24/73 to run

PCIO4D/2 13:00 CDT

a

fair

amount

of

fuel.

By

that,

I

mean

there

is

a

control Charlle it does control

mode for the pilot to operate just with Alfa and and the PSM propellants and do the job. However, amount to some extra fuel because it's not an optimum mode. In view of that, then we would propose if we

had to do that, to turn the propellants back on to Quad Bravo, which would result in the small leak of oxidizer through the forward firing thruster. But our intention would be to fire the thruster that fires backwards in order to provide a - a control moment because the spacecraft tends to yaw, Just firing Alfa and Charlle. So, we would fire this thruster this way to keep it pointed in the direction that we wanted to fire it in. QUERY LUNNEY QUERY LUNNEY you QUERY have to LUNNEY QUERY use only LUNNEY and fire the Okay. Yes. A, B, Yes. So and then C. prior to the the spacecraft. going to SPS burn, you'd you'd use three.

All right. Now, RCS to position Yes. Now, how for this. Yes. are you

you're

going

to

A

and

C

A

use

QUERY C and not LUNNEY it. One of

have them

Could you tell us how you can use a control problem? Yes. There are actually two modes is with, what is called the dock in by the three use of axes_ the And two quads, it can do

only to digital actually this

auto pilot, control the

which would, spacecraft

because of the quads and the moments are lined up such that the appropriate jets can be called to provide thrust. Let me say what I mean by that more clearly. A and C being on top and bottom, you can fire them this way and get pitch. And you can fire them this way and that way, get roll. And then the dock digital auto pilot has a mode where you control in the workshop, it doesn't fire them in couples, as we called them on Apollo. But rather, fires two of them together so that you Just if - if get essentially, you were mostly Just flying translation. the Apollo ship alone, The reason for this,

is to take advantage moment arm you have of them this way.

when you dock from the center So the dock dap

to the workshop of the long of gravity and you fire two mode can fire two of them this The center a kind of it's problem gravity of a gravity big enough to

way, which gives you this kind of yaw control. is that, you don't have very much moment from of the spacecraft and you have - so you have a very low, the very two short distance would from fire. the center where thrusters However,

f

r

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PCI04D/3 13:00 CDT

and it's positive enough so that you do get motion of the spacecraft in the yaw direction. The pilot can also use his translation controler. The T-handle on the left-hand side of the spacecraft available to the commander. As you know, is used to translate the spacecraft and in that sense it fires two thrusters in one direction. He can control the yaw of the END OF TAPE

.-

SL-III Time: 9/24/73

PC-104E/I 13:00 CDT

LUNNEY two thrusters would positive enough so in yaw direction.

- - in the center of gravity to where the fire. However, it is big enough and it's that you do get motion of the spacecraft The Pilot can also use his translation left-hand you know it fires side of the spacecraft is used to translate two thrusters in one

control@r, the T-handle on the available to the Commander, as the spacecraft. In that sense

direction. He can control the yaw of the spacecraft by pushing the stick which ever way he wants to go. And by firing two thrusters he gets a yaw moment on the spacecraft, thus again being able to control all three axes. The limitation is that it is not as crisp a control as you would like, and that it takes more propellant to be used to do the Job than you normally have. QUERY automatic and And manual? this is going to be a combination

LUNNEY It can he done either way. Okay. QUERY How do you propose to do it tomorrow? LUNNEY We're going to use the dock dap and there will also be times when the Pilot will use the T handle. QUERY If you have a 60 minute slippage in the splashdown time, does it mean that everything moves 60 minutes? LUNNEY You had better not count on my number. You had better count on Jack Riley's number on the splash time. I'ii be there starting at 2:00. QUERY these thrusters? or Just A and C? which LUNNEY tend to push How long before you nndock will And which ones will you test, all We the will fire spacecraft the Aand forward C aft before you test of them,

fine thrusters, we undock.

We will also fire all of the command module RCS Jets before we undock. I can call the time out for you, it's in the Flight Plan. It's at GMT about 15, no I take that back, about 13:50 tomorrow. So about 8:50 in the morning. Okay. And later on we'll fire - I told you wrong. It's slightly after undocklng we'll fire all of the command module RCS thrusters, Just immediately after undocking. And then we would return to the service module thrusters. QUERY obviously not advantages of This one deorbit the way you wanted to this? burn to come down, that's do it. What are the dis-

LUNNEY Originally we planned to do the two step deorbit. Really, in order to take advantage of as much time as we could possibly have to plan for any contingencies, the first burn was intended to see how you were doing on the SPS propellant in case there was a possibility of any leaks that

I-

SL-III Time 9/24/73 we

PC-IO4E/2 1300 CDT

couldn't

detect,

although

we

don't

have

any

evidence

at

all,

that that is planning the is, you could if you had a and you would that I mean, burn land

the case. It also gave deorbit, or the backup do it in one stage on problem with prepare to when you're you had

us a better posture deorbit sequences. the first revolution

for That and

then

the SPS, you would know the problem do the second burn accordingly. By using a big SPS engine for the second can fire to fire it the say RCS here if thrusters you to want land to

to bring you down here. Now if you

at the same place, you ought to start earlier, because they are lower excelleration type of system and it takes longer to get the burn off. So the protection for backup deorbit sequence in the case of a further failure, that is an SPS failure, was improved and you could assure landing in the same area. What we will do tomorrow is target the single burn, SPS burn, for the primary area off San Diego. And if we had a problem with that we would come down two revs later in a place off Johnson Island. Okay. So in summary, Tom, the advantage really was to completely understand the propulsion systems so that if you had a problem which you had no insight into before the fact, you could land at the same point. QUERY Have you ever done a single burn deorbit? LUNNEY Yes, we did in Apollo 7. And we must have in Apollo 9, also. Since that time we've been going out further. QUERY Glen, I have a, what ifj question, but I'm sure that it is one that you all have answered and have a mission rule for. When you do this 15 millisecond burn of the Alfa and Charlie RCS, and they don't fire_ what if, what then? LUNNEY Well, first off we're going the specific control mode. And if we don't get in that mode, I'm sure we're going to go through the modes. However, if we end up with a problem or Charlie I think we'd have to talk about it END OF TAPE to try to fire them to fire the rest of with Alfa in

/

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LUNNE¥ - we are going to try to fire in the specific control mode. And if we don't get them to fire in that mode, I'm sure we're going to go through the rest of the modes. However, if we end up wlth a problem asaln with Alpha or Charlle, [ think we'd have to talk about it to find out exactly postulating the game, what one we're the problem was. or two failures. takln_ the attitude I don't konw whether you And that at this stape of that if we have a subto have to regroup want to do. Okay? is a plan for -

sequent problem with the QUADs, we're going and look at it and decide precisely what we QUERY I know there is - there if one more QUAD goes, you can make it home LUNNEY Yes.

QUERY - - on Just the single. But if you find that problem before you undock, what youtre saying, is you're going to regroup then, becuase that could indicate even a fourth failure could be coming. LUNNEY I don't think you'll ever I don't think we would be so much concerned about another failure coming as we would be to understand exactly what the problem was and what we ought to do about it, and how much remaining control capability that we had. Okay? I am reluctant to answer it in the generalj I think our attitude is that if we have a subsequent problem, we would pretty carefully like to take that problem and weight it against the condition that we have in the rest of the spacecraft before we decide what to do. _qe really want to go slow on that. QUERY Is that firing the one you said it was at 13:50 LUNNEY PAO END OF TAPE Yes, Any as other I recall, questions? tomorrow Okay, morning. thank you.

SKYLAB

NEWS

CENTER Texas

Houston,

Skylab III - Post Recovery Johnson Space Center September 25, 1973 7;06 p.m. CDT

Press

Conference

Participants: William C. Schneider, Skylab Program Director Leland F. Belew, Skylab Program Manager, MSFC Kenneth S. Kleinknecht, Skylab Program Manager, JSC Glynn S. Lunney, Apollo Spacecraft Program Manager, JSC Philip C. Shaffer, Flight Director Donald K. Slayton, Director of Flight Crew Operations, JSC, Dr. W. Royce Hawkins, Deputy Director for Medical Operations, JSC Maj. Gen. Kenneth R. Chapman, DOD Manager for Manned Space Flight Operations John P. Donnelly, Assistant Administrator for Public Affairs

PC-106

S

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PAO Good evening, Ladies and Gentlemen. We're about to begin our Skylab Splashdown Press Conference. We'll plan to open with some introductory remarks by Dr. Fletcher, NASA administrator, which will be followed by a brief statement by Bill Schneider, Skylab Program Director. Now before that however, I'd like to announce that Dr. Hawkins will talk to the ship immediately after this press conference and we will have a medical status report available in the news room. There will be another medical status report following the comprehensive medical exams at approximately 1 a.m. Dr. Fletcher. FLETCHER are tremendously second manned excellent job the ground who very important Thank you, John. Heedless to say, pleased by this sucessful completion Skylab mission and we are very proud of done by the crew have contribute, mission. I don_ we of the the

and by all of the people on made contribution to this t think it's an over statement

f

to say that Skylab-III is one of the most significant scientific ventures of all times. And certainly, it's a fitting capstone to NASA's first 15 years. In the 15 years since it's founding, on October I, 1958. NASA has successfully placed 250 payloads in orbit. And of these, the mission that we've completed today, will very likely prove to be the most fruitful of all of these 250. As you know, on Skylab-IIl, we accomplished much more than any of us had hoped when we had started the mission. The crew completed half again as many Earth resources passes and solar observations as they had planned before launch. And as you know they got a slow start for the first 2 or 3 days. So it's much more than we had ever expected after the first 2 or 3 days. We also received more than expected in almost every area, collecting medical data, testing the maneuvering units, astrominy experiments_ I heard that we had probably taken 74,000 pictures on the alone, most of them on this last mission. We also made in the metal processing and crystal growth experiments that were not scheduled until the next Skylab mission. It's most appropriate that on NASA's 15th birthday, the just ATM progress

Skylab is in the mist of it's flight phase. Because Skylab marks the transistion of our space program, the U.S. space program from the period dominated almost entirely by exploration to one dominated by exploitation of the space around us as a global resource. To me that is Skylab's most important achievement. We have demistrated that no longer can space be considered a very unique place and be used for the benefit a vast emptiness. Space a new important resource of people everywhere on is a that Earth. place, can It

f

SL-III Time 9/26/73 provides towards the from from

PC-106A/2 19:06 CDT

with a the sun

vantage or the

point stars,

from but

which we also look

can look outward inward toward to collect the data what we

Earth to gather information that is impossible any place on the ground. As you know most of Skylab is brought back with the crew but from

can tell at the moment, the just now returned will take And mission control talking one person estimated that 5 module at the present time, know at this point, can live and work time. And we have is to have the human observe, to respond

film, the tape and the samples, years to analyze and to absorb. to some of the scientific monitors, years of data is in the command Just being taken out. We do of

without analyzing the data that people effectively in space for long periods seen again, how great an advantage it mind on the to unexpected scene to make developments

judgements to and to effect in Skylab. we can in many Skylab.

corrective measures. All of these were demonstrated As we at NASA look ahead to the next 15 years, I feel expect to see more advanced space laboratories, based ways on what we have learned and we are learning from Just yesterday, it seems like weeks yesterday, that I signed an agreement Council for the development in Europe their name for what we used to call has offically European name. END OF TAPE changed Space it's Lab reference as you know

ago, but it was Just with the European Space of Space Lab. That is a Sortie lab and NASA to Space Lab, is a laboratory the which -

SL-III Time: F _ 9/25/73

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SPEAKER and NASA has officially changed its reference to Spacelab, the European name. Spacelab as you know is a laboratory which will be carried into Earth orbit by 12 the space scientists Shuttle and will be capable of for one single mission. When workshop May 14th, from our the Kennedy expectations Space were housing up we launched Center on very high to

the Skylab morning of

the indeed.

These expectations and we're only two

have already been thirds of the way

achieved through.

and exceeded, Skylab has

given us the confidence and the knowlege we need to plan the best ! and most productive uses of this important new resource at our command. Now before I leave, I would like to read a message which the President has sent by Twix to the crew on the New Orleans. To Astronauts Bean, Lousma and Garriott At the completion of mankind's longest journey beyond the boundaries of human knowlege, I congratulate you on behalf of all of the American people. The record of your Skylab mission combines the traditions of those great explorers of history who have faced the uncharted reaches of the physical unknown with the traditions of those men of science who have unlocked the doors the to secrets man's of the universe, future progress. By and have thus your scientific opened endeavor

and your physical endurance you have converted a space vehicle into a repository of more scientific knowlege than mankind can immediately comsume. In doing so you have provided the basis for a quantum jump in human knowlege. As we salute you in your moment of personal triumph, and of our national pride, we are mindful of the men and women whose contributions made your own accomplishments possible. Your collegues in the National Aeronautics and Space Administration, in the Armed Services, and the Civilian Scientific Community, and the men and women of America's vast technological and industrial establishment. Your accomplishments reflect the power and the potential of the American democracy at its best. Out of the efforts of many individual accomplishments is made possible. And from the deeds of the individual all benefit. We welcome you back to Earth and back home to the United States America. Signed, Richard M. Nixon. Thank SPEAKER Thank you, Dr. Fletcher. with a statement from Dr. Schneider, I'd like our tor, participants. Lee Belew, Mr. Skylab William Program Schneider Manager, of you very much. Before we begin to introduce Program DirecKen Kleinknecht

, Skylab Marshall,

Skylab Program Manager, JSC Phillip Shaffer, Representating the Flight Directors, Donald K. Slayton, Director of Flight Crew Operations, Dr. W. Royce Hawkins, Deputy Director for Medical Operations, JSC, and Major General Kenneth Chapman,

SL-III Time: 9/25/73 DLD you

PC-106B/2 19:06 CDT

Manager

for

Manned a few I ably

Space

FLight

Operations. much to before

Bill,

would

care to say SCHNEIDER Fletcher has so

words? can hardly said. Our

add very objectives

what Dr. we lifted

off were to reestablish the workshop in orbit, and to conduct medical scientific and techniloglcal experiments. Obviously we met those objectives. In detail we met the detailed objectives by well over 150 percent. We even conducted twelve experiments that had not been previously planned on the mission, some of which hadn't even been conceived of when the mission lifted off. As you can see from the if they are in good health and we do in the very near future. Skylab III was as best described by superlatives the launch crew, all of the scientists, TV, the crew looks as hope to get a better report as far as I'm concerned right from the launch, the engineers, the I would wonderful are in from for

flight controllers, and of course the fllght crew, and be very remiss if I didn't mention the magnificent Job that was done by the Department of Defense on that very recovery effort. Turning to Skylab IV, the preparations at the Cape. any necessity Skylab IV with END OF TAPE We just moments for rescue and a planned - ago we're released the on a normal vehicle flow now

work

SL-III Time f 9/25/73

PCI06C/I 19:06 CDT

SCHNEIDER any necessity Skylab-4 with and that will before we left already begun our it's for rescue a planned

moments

ago

released a normal of around

the

vehicle

from for ii

and we're on lift-off date

flow now November

be a 56-day mission and before we left the the Control Center, the Skylab-4 mission had in the unmanned portion - we had already begun

__

synoptic ATM observations. So, all I can say is that been a great 59 days and take questions. PAO Thank you very much, Phil. Before we begin with the questions and answers, I'd like to remind you that there are copies of Dr. Fletcher's statement and the President's statement available to you in the Newsroom. Would you please wait for the mikes and identify yourself. QUERY Parker Hill, the Houston Chronicle. Mr. Schneider, what are the possibilities of slipping the Skylab-4 launch date to November 21 and for lengthening the mission to 70 days and to accompany that question, what if some circumstance would convince you that you wanted to launch the Skylab-4 crew to get to the workshop as fast as possible. How quickly could you respond in that event? SCHNEIDER Well, taking your questions in turn, we have our planning mission of 56 days duration beginning on November ii, which would bring splashdown around January 6th. We do expect to examine the medical data from Skylab-3 as well as our mission planning data and our hard - in orbit hardware, sometime late in October to see if that is the proper mission. At that time D we have several alternatives to stick with our normal mission to slip the launch a few days so that we can better see the post parahellon Kohoutec or as you state, extend the mission. Right now, the planned mission is 56 days duration on lift-off at November llth, but we will be reviewing that in the next few months. As far as how fast can we lift off if we had to - if we did it today, we could be there now as of tomorrow thing on the order PAO in 9 days, and that of about Jack. we wouldn't 9 days would 20. - we will probably be recycling go to some-

QUERY John Wolfe, New York Times. Dr. Hawkins, have you had any word from the carrier as to their condition and what kind of report do you expect to get after this presss conference? What kind - how much of a report would you have then? And just how do they look to you? HAWKINS Okay. No, we have not had any verbal report from the - from the doctor out on the ship as yet. We do have a target time of with the ship and gain some time, it's going to be very 7:30 this evening to quick-look information. limited information, rendezvous At that but I think

SL-III Time: 9/25/73 it will

PCI06C/2 19:06 CDT

give

us

a

little

better

inside

into

actually

what

their condition is. From what I saw on with the - the way the crew was able to they showed the unsteadiness of gate of expected. I think that the - the counter serve good their purpose at this point. QUERY very Deke, well I'd and llke that to

TV, was very pleased perform. The - I think which we definitely measure garment did the crew you looks from not very a

ask

medical viewpoint but from a crew viewpoint. I mean you've seen all these crews go in space right from the beginning, and it seemed to me that even though all of the crews, I feel have done an outstanding job, but this crew in particular has put in far more hours and seemed really, you know, super energetic and they certainly have accomplished a hell of a lot more than they had started out to do. Now, that's from my viewpoint. I would like to have you evaluate them as to how they operated in relation to other crews and what you think the reasons are for it. Whether their exercise, mental attitude training or what? SPEAKER Well, I don't know that I could add much to what you've said. I think you've summarized it pretty well. Well, obviously, one of the reasons of course, is they've been up there alot longer and they did do an awful lot of things. But I think the prime reason, in my opinion that took them a little while to get started, we normally flight plan and put in about 40 to 50 percent pad in our flight planning on the ground because we always assume it's going to take longer in space. And I think these are the first guys that have stayed up there long enough to really geK proficient in space. And all of the sudden, we ended up with - END OF TAPE

F

F

SL-III Time: 9/25/73 F

PC-106D/I 19:06 CDT

HAWKINS assume it's going

to

on the ground, because we always take longer in space. And I think these

are the first guys that have stayed up there long enough to really get pro _cient in space. And all of a sudden we ended up with time to spare. And they were eager, willing to fill it up with whatever made sense to the Flight Control team; and fortunately, they were able to give them enough constructive things to do. So I don't think there is anything secular about this crew other than the fact that they were, obviously, highly motivated and feeling good and enjoying it, which, I think, has been true with most crews. But they were there long enough to adapt very well. PAO Nick. QUERY Nick Chris, LA Times. Dr. Hawkins, did it appear to you that Jack Lousma, perhaps, was more unsteady on his feet in that short time than the other two, and if so, could that be possible, could that because he was the most healed in the early days of - of the mission when they had motion sickness? looked did. also, HAWKINS the most Did I understand unstable. you say you thought he

_

QUERY I said, did it appear to you that he It did to me and some others, and I wonder if it did, to you? HAWKINS Actually, I really had the - had the impression, as he walked on the command module over to the seat, that he looked really the most stable of the three. QUERY On the second time he walked, he seemed to be more unsteady then HAWKINS When he got up from the chair, yeah, he did stumble there aga _st the rail momentarily. But it's hard to say, really, whither that was the roll of the ship or really whether it was part of the unsteady gate. PAO AI. did all did QUERY AI Flago with New York News. Dr. Hawkins, any of the crew take any seasick medicine or did they wear their pressure garments inflated? HAWKINS Affirmative on both questions. They take the anti-motion sickness medication 2 hours then they did

prior to splashdown, all three of them. And have the counterm _sure garments inflated. QUERY How much medication? HAWKINS PAO One dose Tom. of the

scopolamine/Dexedrine.

QUERY Here is a question for Kenney Kleinknecht. How much gear is the next crew going to have to take up? Are they going to have to take an awful lot of food? Because this crew seemed to have eaten their way through half of that

locker.

F

_

SL-III Time: 9/25/73

PC-106D/2 lg:06 CDT

KLEINKNECHT I think we'll have a full payload the next time arou _. Our limit launch weight is about 13,500 pounds. Ue have stowage identified now that brings it up to just very elcse to 13,500. Some resupply, normal and planned resupply, we had _me replacement hardware for some of the things that we've had some difficulty with. We do have on board, as a part of that stowage, about 75 pounds of food. That food is SkTlab food. And one of the reasons for putting it on is as you know, we had a single freezer loop operating now. If we should loose the freezer between now and the time the SL-4 crew is launched, we'd have to replace that food and that's about 20 percent of the remaining food. It Just turns out that if the freezer dosn't fail, that 75 pounds of food is also enough. Should we be able to make the additional decision to extend the mission, it'll provide nurishment and the medical protical for the experiment for about 70 days. QUERY To take onto that question, what kind of hardware are you bringing up? Is it going to be hardware to observe Kohoutek? KLEINKNECHT Well_ we had some new experiments. We have modification to the T025 experiment. A new $201 experiment, provided some filters for the - or providing some filters and additional film for S063. _e will also use some of the AT[ sensors for Kohoutek observations. PAO Second row. QUERY Don Fink, Aviation l_eek. I have a question for Phil Shaffer. Phil can you tell us how the CS_ performed under the emergency proc_dures with only the two thruster quads functioning? S}{AFFER Yes, 5 days ago, you know, we powered it up and took a good look at it, which was a normal procedure. We did this same thin_ on SL-II, powered it up several dayg before we were to use it for re-entry. And there was just *_o problems with it. Everything in it worked just fine. There were no supprises. Today, we powered it up again - END OF TAPE

F

F-

SL-III Time: 9/25/73

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_-

KLEINKNECHT - several days before we use it for reentry. And there were just no problems with it. Everything in it worked just fine. There were just no surprises. Today we powered it up again, essentially a nominal time line with the exception of the guidance and navigation system, which was powered up yesterday. And everything went just exactly like it was supposed to. There were just no problems with the CSM today. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, when the crew was on the deck and when they came out to the chairs, which took quite a while, do you know or does anybody know their condition then? Were they disorientated during that time? HAWKINS Well, the time I believe, wasn't much longer than we predicted, about 15 minutes maybe longer. And the purpose of that was for the FLight Surgeon onboard, Dr. Buchanan, to go in and do some blood pressure and pulse measurements on the crew in the recumbant and in the sitting position, and then standing. No, we do not have any reports at this time of any vestibular disturbances of any kind. SPEAKER (garble) well before the launch of Skylab III that he was going to stay in the spacecraft still and relatively quiet for about i0 or 15 or 20 minutes, that he and the crew would after they got set back on the deck. QUERY John Pollock, ABC radio. One of the crewmen and I could identifiy his voice because of the noise there while they were on the water reported that his, or mentioned rather, that his pressure garmet had deflated it was inflated before they left orbit and was it had been inflated, but was deflated by the time they hit the water. Has that crewman been identified yet? SPEAKER No, he has not been identified, and I honestly did not hear that comment myself. However, this can happen and they do have to reinflate that. They have hand bulb just like on a pressure cuff to pump it up. They have a guage there to show them exactly what pressure to maintain. QUERY A couple of questions both for Deke. I thought the sea conditions for the recovery were rougher than I have seen before. Could you tell me your view of that? And were they in fact sea sick despite the medication? SLAYTON Well sir, I would agree observation. I haven't seen the sea that rough, I was trying to remember during recovery as a matter of fact, and I think Apollo 12 was about as close to it as I have seen. And I don't think that there was any indication that they had sea sickness. I don't think we' ii know for sure until the doctors talk to them here in the near future. But it certainly appeared not to me.

f

SL-III Time 9/25/73

PC-IO6E/2 19:06 CDT

QUERY I wonder if you not one of whom seen man through of great SLAYTON

have has

And looking any thoughts flown before Skylab we have

forward to the next flight, about sending up a crew, when all of the crews we've have no contained concern at about least that. one The

Apollo and experience. No,

hardware is well proven, and the crew is well trained, and as you are well aware of we flew a number of missions starting the manned programs with crews that haven't flown. I guess I don't see this that all being all that different. We have very good crew for Skylab. all, take QUERY to the best the Scop/Dex HAWKINS Dr. Hawkins, I have of my recollection the on the way back. That's right, Mary. garment Some time Uh-h nh. But mean. To them from my knowlege, they through did entry. inflate I them don't or that they after he afterward. did wear several questions. first Skylab crew Yeah. got down Joe on Kerwin the water.

a

First of dldin' t

inflated his QUERY HAWKINS QUERY inflated I HAWKINS and know pulse chart. they any

pressure

these

through

reentry,

did wear different in

inflated that.

QUERY readings HAWKINS QUERY think that contributed OF TAPE

And you don't the spacecraft

have any blood pressure for any indications of

you had END

Not And - I know greatly

yet, we're waiting to get from what you see now, how you said before you thought to their physical condition

that. much would exercise -

SL-III Time: f 9/25/73

PCIO6F/I 19:06 CDT

I

know

QUERY you to

said their

before physical

now, how much would you thought exercise condition, in orbit taking _ - has

you think contributed anyway.

that How

greatly much the

do you counter

think measure

maybe exercise, garments won

the scop/Dex, wearing influence their but I

apparent good condition coming out of the spacecraft? HAWKINS _ell, I think the - the no question, what the exer _se in flight has, has been beneficial. don't think that we understand yet_ at all how beneficial that is or just exactly of the results of the We have yet to arrive medication, which they what that means with the experiments and the studies at that that conclusion. did take, did afford them

in light that we've done. I think the a lot of

protection and I have the feeling right now that they probably came thro _h those rough seas without any seasickness. The garment, I feel no doubt, has performed just as it was intended to do and that they again_ have benefited from that. Here again, the results of the stand-up tests and lower body negative pressure test and the labs will give us some indication of how affective that garment was. PAn Nick. QUERY NASA, that you the astronauts way to the SML SPEAKER prior to the mission, and on open commu instructions. it or questions any specific. PAn Did you or any other officials at know of, hay e any private conversations with concerning whether they should walk all the or ride those chairs? This, this was discussed with the crew was

f_

mission and it was further confirmed during the as I recall_ I think that most all of that was _cations oi pads about the form of No doubt, there have been some comments about answered Here. in the private comm. I donlt recall

QUERY Tom _ell, the NPI. For Phil Shaffer, how is the lab itself doing now and do you have a_y concerns at all for this 6 weeks of unmanned operations? SHAFFER No, thetels - therets nQthlng new that you haven't heard already in terms of the status of the lab. The - we had two, what you would call anomallles today in the process of final deactivation. We apparently had a leak in the minus Z scientific airlock. But before we could get a handle on that, we found out that it's avery bad plan to run the secondary coolant loop water boiler. The steam pressure out of that water boiler, which is used for nooling, demonstrated that it was a bit much for the control systemp the way we had do a it set bunch up, for the nominal of manipulation of control system. that system in You know_ preparation we for

SL-III Time: 9/25/73

PCI06F/2 19:06 CDT

undocking, chan_ing constance and et cetera._ And the, the combination of the water boiler in those constance_ gave us some problems - we used a bit more TACS prop_llant than we intended. And in the process of persuing that, we put a hose with another plug, if you will, on the scientific airlock and the leak went away although we never got enough data on it to know if it was leaking or not. But those are the only two real anomalies we had today. And I would class those, both as minor. When we left the Control Center, the vehicle looked very good to us. It looked just like it's looked for last week or so. PAO Art.

the

F_

QUERY l_r. Schneider, possibly Kenny, what's as of now, what's going to happen to the Skylab workshop in January at the conclusion of the program? Is it to be deorbited or left in space to naturally decay? SCHNEIDER We will turn off all the systems and we will leave it in orbit for natural decay. There is some possibility that sometime later ASTP or shuttle or somebody else might want to go back and look at it. QUERY How long then would it take it to naturally decay? SCHNEIDER The number's around i0 years or something like that 7 years, 8 years so - Depends upon the probabilities that you put on it. PAO Okay. I guess we can conclude it by saying it was a pretty good mission but nobody's perfect. You were 17 seconds earlier than predicted dumped splashdown. Thank you. END OF TAPE

P

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