SL IV Time: 2/8/74

S/R-1 12:43











post Skylab Control. CMG n_mber i test was performed about an hour ago on the control $oment gyro number i aboard the space station. And the indicators were that the wheel speed did not come up. The currents applied to the field windings on the gyro indicate that the wheel is still stationary. They've shut the heaters off on CNG number 1 now. CMG number 2 continuing in a stressed mode. Commander Cart, aboard the New Orleans, has finished his prellminary physical and he just had family communication at 17:34 or 1:34 central time, with his family. Pilot Pogue and Science Pilot Ed Gibson are getting very close to the end of their initial physical. Blood samples being drawn now, and they should be coming up family call within the half hour. Wet11 let you know after that happens. 1:45 central daylight time, this is Skylab Control. END OF TAPE

SL IV Time: 2/8/74

S/R-2 01:28





PAO minutes


This is daylight

Skylab time.

Control. All three

One hour initial

and medical

examinations for the crewmembers of Skylab IV have been completed. And Commander Jerry Cart indicated that they all feel pretty darn good. He said they only had a feeling of headiness and vertigo initially when they stepped out of the command module. Science Pilot Ed Gibson echoed Cart's remarks. He said, "I feel pretty good, and overall we all feel pretty good." And Bill Pogue chimed in by saying the same thing. We should have a medical report for you sometime soon. That'll come from the medical officers here in Houston. END OF TAPE 1:27 central daylight time, this is Skylab Control.

SL-IV TIME: 2/8/74

S/R-3/1 02:44











daylight time, this is Skylab Control. We've just received word that there will be a medical review this evening around i0 p.m. with Dr. Royce Hawkins, Medical Director for the Skylab Program. Repeating that, there will be a medical review briefing this evening in the briefin E room in Building with Dr. Royce Hawkins around I0 p.m. An exact time will be announced later and we'll be hack with that when we get it. 2:44 central daylight time, this is Skylab Control. END OF TAPE 1,

SL-IV TIME: 2/8/74

S/R-4/1 02:59





PAO about


minutes Video That's

Three o' clock away from a coming about from the 30 minutes

central replay U.S.S. away


daylight time. the video Orleans, now and medical 10 p.m., he back cameras

of recovery. aboard ship.

New from be a about we'll

repeatinB an earlier review with Dr. Royce we don't have a firm

announcememt, Hawkins this time on that

they'll evening yet but

with you. And that'll be in the Buildin that's tonight around i0 with Dr. Royce minutes away from a replay of recovery central END OF dayliEht TAPE time, this is Skylab

E 1 brlefln_ room, Hawkins. Thirty video now. 3:01 Control.



SL IV Skylab IV Post Johnson Space Center February 8, 1974 12:00 p.m. CDT



Participants: Dr. James C. Fletcher, NASA Administrator William C. Schneider, Skylab Program Director Kenneth S. Kleinknecht, Skylab Program Manager, JSC Leland F. Belew, Skylab Program Manager, MSFC Phil Shaffer, Flight Director Alan B. Shepard, Rear Adm., Chief,Astronaut Office, JSC Dr. W. Royce Hawkins, Deputy Director for Medical Operations, Col. Alan R. Vette, Director, DOD Manned Space Flight Support William J. O'Donnell, Public Affairs Officer

JSC Office



PCI29A/I 12:00 CDT,



FLETCHER the - President Well I I would like to read something Nixon to the astronauts before I begin.


This was just TWXed to the ship. "On behalf of the American people, I'salute the third crew of Skylab astronauts on your safe return to Earth and on your successful completion of man's longest space journey. Your mission has brought to an end one of the most scientifically productive endeavors in the history of human exploration. Skylab now joins the ranks of the Santa Maria, The H.M.S. Bagle, the Spirit of Saint Lucas - Louis and the Eagle. Each of these great vehicles has carried us beyond the comtemporary limits of human knowledge into a new comprehension of our own possibilities and a new definition of our own destiny. We welcome you home and we salute you and all your predecessors who have launched us on this _reat adventure." Signed Richard Nixon. This is a most historic day and I don't need to tell you it has _reat meaning for all of us. Naturally, those of us that have been directly involved are terribly dissappointed that because of no network coverage at splashdown, the world could not share this experience with us. Everything that we have done in the Skylab Program has been necessary for future progress in space. And the Skylab experience has confirmed that we are really on the right track in proceeding to develop the Space Shuttle and its spacelab manned module for use in the 1980's and 1990's. Skylab in all its aspects has demonstrated that this nation is capable of conducting broader and more useful benefical activities in space that directly relate to our own planet Earth. It has served us well as a true orbiting research facility. And namely our astronauts to carry out a wide spectrum of scientific engineering and biomedical studies. To appreciate the broad capabilities of Skylab, we should take note of President Nixon's landmark speech on this space exploration which he made on March 7, 1970. In that speech, the President stated that three purposes should guide our space program exploration, scientific knowledge, practical application. Surprising as it may seem, Skylab and the Skylab men have accomplished simultaneously all of these purposes. It was also said that we must see our space elfort, not only as an adventure of today but also as an investment in tomorrow. And that space activities will be a part of our lives for the rest of time. Skylab has shown the way. In a very real sense Skylab can be considered a turning point, for while it was basically a experimental space station, it nevertheless possessed many qualities and ingredients that will characterize operational missions for the future. It has moved the space program from the realm of the spectacular into a new phase that can be characterized possible as almost businesslike if not yet quite

SL-IV TIME: 2/8/74

PCI29A/2 12:00 CDT,



routine• Now even the splashdown portion of it was not exactly a routine today. The investment in Skylab has contributed to an orderly transition from the Apollo era, the 60's to the space rather the shuttle spacelah era of the 1980's and as continued U.S. leadership in man's space flight. We have clearly - clearly demonstrated that man can perform valuable services in Earth orbit as observers, scientist, engineers and repairmen. Skylab has given us a wealth of new information about the dynamic processes of the Sun and how this effects all of us here on Earth. It's provided new evidence of the value of Earth observations from space, helped us defined the feasibility of making new products in zero gravity, and has stimulated interest of international cooperation in space. I must say 271 days is a long time, but that's how long it's been from the first launch of the Skylab orbital workshop• And to all of us it's a significant step in the long term duration - long term flight in space. All of these returns from our Skylab investments are impressive and I should point out, the returns are not all in. We will be hearing much more about what has been found in the months ahead• Indeed, we will for a long - long END OF TAPE all be living with Skylab achievments


SL-IV Time: 2/8/74

PCI29B/I 12:00 CDT




FLETCHER been found


- we will be hearing much more about the months ahead. Indeed, we will all

what be

living with Skylab achievements for a long, long time. Thank you very much. PAO Okay, ladies and gentlemen, we have with us today the Skylab team. Beginning from my right, William C. Schneider, Director of the Skylab program. Next to him is Kenneth S. Kleinknecht, Skylab Program Manager here at JSC, Dr. Royce Hawkins, Deputy Director for Medical Operations, JSC, Mr. Le!and Belew, Skylab Program Manager at the Marshall Space Flight Center, Admiral Alan Shepard, Chief to the Astronaut Officer here at JSC, Flight Director Phil Shaffer, and on the far end, Colonel Alan Vette, DOD Manager for Manned Spaceflight Operations. Bill, you want to open with a statement? SCHNEIDER Well, as you know, Skylab IV just had a most successful completion of their mission after 84 days and 1 hour and 16 minutes, and Dr. Lowe told me we were 8 seconds late in our splashdown. But that marked the completion of what I consider the historical phase of Skylab after 271 days of useful work in orbit. And now we begin the science phase of Skylab. And for the next year next few years, I should say, there'll be just as an intense effort - probably not as visible to you folks_ but probably very meaningful examination of all the data that we've brought back. And as we've said, that's the pay-off of Skylab, that was the reason for Skylab, and it has been successfully completed - our portion has been completed. The Science phase has just begun. Let me take off a few things that happened during Skylab IV in the area of accomplishments. We had planned 30 EREP passes, and we achieved 39. In addition to that, we had about - we also had planned 2 solar inertial passes, and we completed - we completed four. In the ATM, we had planned 350 hours of of solar observation, we actually completed 338. The Comet Kohoutek had 13 obs - separate observations by the ATM and iii observations by the other instruments. We did all the major medicals; and incidentally, we spent more hours on major medicals in Skylab than we had on any previous mission. The corollary, we batted a hundred percent, we had 28 planned and we accomplished 28; same with the student experiments; and the same with ETOs. We actually achieved exactly what we had planned. In the ATM world, I understand the ATM scientists are particularly pleased because during this mission, we were able to catch a flare right from it's initial phase right on through. All previous flares, we caught sometime during their build-up or fall-down. This one we got the thing from birth through death. Turning then to the entire proBram, which, of

SL-IV Time: 2/8/74

PCI29B/2 12:00 CDT



course, this also marks - Let me let me tick off a little bit of statistics, and as I said, statistics are meaningful only in this historical phase• As far as duration is concerned, if you go back to what we had said we were going to do back before the May 14, we'd planned on 241 - 240 days in orbit. We actually accomplished 271. Of the m - that time we'd we'd thought we'd be planned for 140 days, we actually did 172• In the science world - and incidentally, in - we did something of END OF TAPE

• °

SL-IV Time: 2/8/74

PC129C/I 12:00


172. unusual

SCHNEIDER - planned for 140 days, In the science world, and incidentally in our mission planning, something

we actually did we did something that is unusual for

us. We were not ultra conservative. We thought we were bein_ quite bold. We thought we were scheduling our premission flight plans more fully than we expected to be able to accomplish. The ATM world, we planned on 565 hours and we got 755 hours. The medical world, we had planned 701 hours and we got 822. EREP. we thought we would be lucky if we got 60 passes. We got 90 Z-local vertical passes plus ii solar inertial passes, almost 60 percent more than we had in our fondest dreams. Technical experiments, we had planned 264 hours, we got 294. Materials investigations, we had i0 of them planned. We actually did 32 separate investigations. Astro physics, we had 168 planned we actually did 412. Even in the student investigations we had thought we'd get 44 of those operations, we actually got 56. If you look at the percentages they range anywheres from 320 percent of what we had planned to well over i00 percent in the worst ones. So I can say we certainly were able to - through the hard work of a great number of people - achieve what more than we really had expected. I received a great number of questions in the last week asking me what I though the greatest achievement of And Skylab it's was. been a Skylab has been a something different multidiscipline facility. to each individual. Each

discipline, meaning in greatest -

each scientist has looked upon Skylab as having a different area. As far as Itm concerned Skylab's greatest achievement was to prove beyond a doubt

that there is no limit in our space research that just like anything else that America sets out to do, the limit is only our resolve not our ability to do work, not the ability of men to work and not our technical knowledge. PAO Okay, we'll take questions. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, what do you think of the crew when your first quick information that you have, and are you now willing appear to be in, to HAWKINS I wish that we could spacecraft did sound admission much don't of with with the condition that they say anything about a one to two year mission? Well, I'm elated with what Itve heard. all seen this exit this from the they own as I than if you crew

on this certainly monumental occasion. But great. Their voices were strong and by their they did feel good. You I think heard about commentary that they with how the they that I appeared Skylab looked. did. to I or But they were sound to be

the know

shakey, worse off

what we saw can remember


crew when they would imagine

returned, that this

SL-IV Time: 2/8/74

PC129C/2 12:00 CDT

looks very - very similar. I'm delighted with the inital re medical reports that we have from - from the command module. And I still reserve the right to answer the last question until we've had a chance to look at some of the cellular levels on the samples that we bring back. QUERY Is this the first time that they have recovered the apex cone, if they did; and what use would you make of it? SCHNEIDER I don't recall whether we recovered we did _et at least one apex cover in Apollo. We have no plans to make any use of it. We didn't need it; it's - was available and they recovered it. But we have no reason to believe there is anything wrong with it, obviously people will look at it. QUERY Could you tell us some of the things that you have done on this flight that will be useful on the Space Shuttle. Some of the experiments that were planned to _ive you information, and were there any END OF TAPE


. °

SL IV Time: 2/8/74

PC-129D/I 12:00 CDT

QUERY Could you tell us some of the things that you have done on this flight that will be useful on the space shuttle? Some of the experiments that were planned to give you information, and were there any thay you planned that would aid you on the ASTP? SCHNEIDER Well we had a _reat deal of activity go into what we would call habitability, and that will provide a great storehouse of knowledge of how to best build a machine for the future, both shuttle and any space station that might come on beyond. And from a ASTP standpoint, why, we both use the command - the same command and service module. I do believe they will probably use some innovation of our flight planning practices, and we do have a materials processing experiment. Lee, you might add to that you can. We have a materials processing experiment that follows on with the one we had. I must confess if I'm a little vague about ASTP, it's because I haven't been looking at what they've been doing for the past year. BELEW Well, there is an experiment on ASTP that follows the Skylab materials experiment. Actually there's two. And we do feel that that will especially one of them will be a step toward proving some technology that's needed. It's - before we go all out for something on say shuttle. To elaborate a little bit on your overall question; what we really did gain in an overall system sense out of Skylab, that will to apply to say, the shuttle, is the systems that we functioned, the attitude control systems, power systems, and the life support systems, and the coolant systems, especially for experiments. They do span the spectrum that I feel proves without a doubt the operability of it over a long duration, that will be a direct feed in to shuttle, and shuttle payloads. It's eliminated I think a great deal of concern that one might have had we not had the Skylabtype mission. QUERY How about a rundown on the post or the unmanned testing of Skylab. The CMG I, and so forth. BELEW Well, on the post Skylab testing, the tests that have been conducted that give us some results to date are those that were run at the very end of the manned mission. That's on some battery tests. On our battery systems, we have two major systems. One on the ATM and one on the airlock. And those tests showed a very favorable trend in the batteries that are in the airlock. The battert's life looks extremely good. Better than we'd hoped for. And the ATM, they looked as we had expected. We handled those two systems somewhat differently as far as what they received before we sent them up. For instance, the batteries in the airlock were new. The ones in the ATM, we had used through

SL IV Time: 2/8/74

MC-129D/2 12:00 CDT

a great deal of our test program. And that two - having two types results there gives us a great deal of information on this type of system. The other enBineering tests are just under way. The one that we have a bit of information on is the spinup of our CMG number I. It began looking like it might be following the right curve as far as the current that one would have. We have the footprint of the first startup and we plot it, we were tracing the results of this one. It looked pretty good for an hour, but it now looks like it's kind of not acting just right, so I wouldn't predict too much on that one. The other engineering tests are just underway. PA0 Mary. QUERY I have a question for Admiral Shepard. Since you were the man that started this whole thing off, and you had a, I believe the time was something in the order of 15 minutes in space, could you Five your thoughts on did you think this day would come that you would have an 85-day mission? And what you think the astronauts per se, not technology, I don't mean that, but the men themselves have accomplished during this span of time? END OF TAPE

SL-IV TIME: 2/8/74

PCI29E/I 12:00 CDT,



QUERY nauts per se, not the technology, I don't mean that, but the men themselves have accomplished during this span of time. SHEPARD Well I think, certainly Mary that you partially answered your first question in that back in '59 and '60 when there was a great deal of cynicism about men in space, that we found it difficult to believe that we would have made the strides that we've made in this short period of time. I think that we've accomplished certainly much more than even the most optimistic of us would have predicted at that particular time. And I think that certainly along those lines, we have reached a sense of maturity which is heartening to us in some degree that we have been able to do this. In the short space of time that we've been able to demonstrate already, some of the spin-off and fall out that has started to effect the social structure of the country. But at the same time, it's disturbing that since we have reached this sense of maturity that its becomes so blase that we didn't even cover the last landing of this fantastic Skylab program live on television. With respect to these accomplishments, I think that certainly the majority of them have been accomplished by the fact that man has been the factor in the loop. Not only the crews in the spacecraft but also the crews on the ground have been able to bring their exercising judgment - exercise their judgment in engineering to bear on the problems that have occurred. I don't think that we would have been able to make the progress that we had that we now have the imaginative and the flexible element of man with us all the way through during this time period. QUERY How much of a problem - how much of a worry was this propellant leak this morning? And since something similiar occurred on the second mission, does this give you any thoughts about this system in general that you're thinking about make any changes? SHAFFER The first part was a leak in the command module RCS system which is a system that provides attitude control during reentry sequence. That system is completely redundant, so the first concern is the loss of redundancy and the sensitivity to a subsequent failure in the other system. The second level of concern is that fact that those propellants are toxic. And we had some special procedures that we wanted to relay to the crew to protect them from the toxicity as much as we could. One of the thinBs that was new this time that we didn't have for the two previous missions was ARIA spacecraft - the ARIA airplane off Japan that covered the deorbit maneuver. And that vehicle came in very handy because it allowed us information to the crew prior to entry. I don't to relay think we that.


SL-IV TIME: 2/8/74

MCI29E/2 12:00 CDT,



know yet, what the actual leak was. Whether it was the helium which is used to pressurize or whether it was actually one of the propellants. But that system is contained in the vehicle that we have recovered. So it will be able to find have out specifically what the failure was. Alan do you something you want to say. SHEPARD That was what I was going to say, Phil, exactly. SHAFFER Okay. QUERY For anyone who would like to take a crack at it, I would like to know what's left for man in space? Decoupling budgetary and political things from it but just some on - on pure basis, what is there - what is there left now for man to do in space? SCHNEIDER I'll take a crack at that. That's what I meant when I said it's only national shown that no man or machine limitation resolve. We on whatever have we want

to do in space. I believe our Royce is a little more conservative than I. But I think eliminating budget problems, I think we have shown in Skylab that man can work in space. He does useful work in space, and there is useful work to be done up there. And we've shown that there's no man restriction on shuttle or space station or anything that we want to do beyond that. QUERY I know there's no money in the fiscal '75 budget for another series of Skylab missions, but is this being considered at all since you have most of the hardware you need? SCHNEIDER No sir. QUERY Think it will be opened for consideration now that this series was completed so successfully END OF TAPE

SL IV Time: 2/8/74

PC-129F/I 12:00 CDT

QUERY - -- being considered at all since you most of the hardware you need? SCHNEIDER No, sir. QUERY Think it will be open for consideration now that this series was completed so successful. SCHNEIDER No, sir, I do not. The equipments that we have been using in Skylab will gradually be phasing into the ASTP and Shuttle Programs and once that begins to happen, why, we will have essentially no capability to reactivate. We are holding to things until June. That's - because that's when they begin being needed for the Shuttle, and after that, there will be no equipment available. QUERY Even though the men now have left Skylab, and even though the tests have been complete, the mission in a sense is still going on. I think people would be interested in knowing the future of the workshop, roughly how long it will be expected to stay up. How long it will function, and how valuable its function will be? have SCHNEIDER We have, as you heard earlier, a series of engineering tests that are planned for the next 22 hours, I believe, or something on that order, which are designed to bring back to us as much engineering data as we can out of Skylab as it remains. At the end of that, we will put it in to what we call a gravity gradient mode, and we will turn off the lights and turn off the switches and turn off the CMGs and let Skylab drift. It's anticipated that it will remain in orbit about i0 or ii years. QUERY Related to that, I heard several references the last couple of days about a possible revisit to Skylab with a time capsule being left in it - that sort of thing. What do you have in mind? SCHNEIDER Well, we've just left it such that if, in the event the Shuttle comes along and we go up there and we can redock and revisit if ASTP has an alternate mission, why it too can go up and dock and revisit. We do not think that there is a high probbability that if you tried to turn the systems on, they would turn on, but we think you can very easily, very probably be able to dock and reenter. And that's why we left the package, the materials they have to bring back to see what long term exposure in space is. Currently I'd have to say there are no active plans that I know of by anybody to visit Skylab. QUERY Mr. Schneider, since many of us feel that we have ended an era in certainly dynamic exploration, where we've had progress in manned space flight year after year, and now we only have the ASTP, which is a brief mission and Shuttle. How soon do you think that we will be able to get underway with an equally dynamic manned exploration program, in which we have things above and beyond what we've done and equally dynamic with the past, say, 13 or 14 years?

SL IV Time: 2/8/74

MC-129F/2 12:00 CDT

SCHNEIDER Mary, you'll forgive me if I don't know the dates on the Shuttle_ because I really don't. But I'll say I don't look upon this as the end of an era, but as the beginning of an era. I think we've shown in Skylab that what we've been saying on Shuttle is true. We are _oing to make space into another diminsion that man is goin_ to use profitably. He's going to live and work up there. And with Shuttle, we're _oing to make that easier than it was on Skylab. QUERY Has there been a ballpark figure on the numbers of Earth photographs you have. SCHNEIDER I've seen those numbers. Many, many. If you'll excuse me just a minute. Is this it? Let me ATM, it says we have 182,842 frames. I hope they're all good, too. EREP, it says we have 40,286 in 190A, and 190B has 5,860, and we've got a great deal more film than that that's coming down, so that's just a beginning. Now, also, interestingly enough, we have 238,600 feet of tape, which, off of the EREP. So there's a great deal data that will be coming down. That's what I mean when I say this is the beginning of the scientific phase. It will take the scientists a great deal
of ---




SL-IV Time: 2/8/74

PCI29G/I 12:00


SCHNEIDER when will data past










I say this is the beginning take the scientist a great and to bring out of it all QUERY mission? SCHNEIDER Those I'm were sorry,

of the scientific phase. It deal of time to look at that all that it's worth. total yes. Skylab. Not just this

QUERY Dr. Hawkins, now that the mission's over and keeping in mind that there were a few very evident problems at the beginning and lack of training on certain medical things, and all that kind of thing. To what now would you attibute the dramatic changes in both the mood of the astronauts and the efficiency of the astronauts, and the seemingly greater compared to other HAWKINS difficulty in adjusting crews. Well, Mary, I don't to I weightlessness know as we've


really saw any greater difficulty adjusting. When at the levels of performance in all - and compare have looked very very similar to what we have seen past. There through. It learn how to is a is move learning curve that they is a new environment and and coordinate themselves

you look those they in the

- they must go they've got to in this new

environment. Even though they have had extensive training on the medical equipment that they used in flight - preflight. There is still a new learning curve that they have got to follow. I think you see individual difference, eertainly_ but that's - that's to be expected. But I think this crew has - did have some experiments and some tasks and all which they were - were asked to start immediately off on, in the early phases of the mission which the previous crew did not begin to encounter until way beyond halfway of the mission, when they had already gone through that initial just sheer learning curve of adjusting in weightlessness. So, I I think the performance is very outstanding in the way that they have wrapped up this program and the data that they have areas have given us not only medical area of endeavor here, I think Just SPEAKER Don't forget none been there before_ this is the been anywhere before the bar. (Laughter) We were talking but all of the scientific speak for itself really. of these three guys first time for all three. listen the ATM to PI's the this sea

They haven't stories at SPEAKER

except to

morning, and they had a very very glowing report for the conduct of the ATM experiments by this crew. In fact they said some of there very best data on on was gained by this crew. So - so that sort of witnesses that they really did

SL-IV Time: 2/8/74 did

PCI29G/2 12:00 CDT

perform quite well. QUERY For Alan Shepard and Dr. Hawkins, do you see any objections to sending another rookie - entirely rookie crew up in space? HAWKINS Well, I'm sure Admiral Shepard doesn't and I certainly don't as long as they've had the benefit of pre-flight training which they must have or any crew must have. SHEPPARD Yeah, I think that's correct. That bears out the the fact that our training program is essentially correct for these three fellows. The comment I made earlier had =o do with the fact they were not only there for the first time., but there had been, as Royce said, some last minute changes in procedures particularly in the medical experiments, which they really hadn't had a chance to become too familiar. So I don't see any problems at all. And certainly that is one of the plans as you look forward to shuttle is to put rookies up there. Particularly in the area of the payload specialist as we call them. This will be the first time for them, so we've got a very good data point on how to handle it. SPEAKER I might add that certainly this crew did everything that they were called on to do, and they did it well. No one can question the - the way in which they did anything. QUERY Do you think it's safe now that the mission completed that man could stay up in a long mission for a year or two using the same physical training that was used on Skylab? HAWKINS I think it will go a long way to keeping him there, sure. We're going to have to look at what we've learned here in these three missions. And certainly in the duration that we've just flown does give us a lot of hope and promise for what man can really do, how long he can stay there. I'm optimistic about it. I didn't mean to sound pes - END OF TAPE

SL-IV TIME: 2/8/74

PCI29H/I 12:00 CDT,




HAWKINS what man


- - does give us a lot really do and how well he

of hope and promise can stay there.

I'm optimistic about it. I didn't mean to sound pessimistic earlier in response to the first question. There are - there are a lot of things that have to be learned, which we do not know at this particular point. But what we have seen in performance does lead us to believe that certainly we can - we can work around any limitations that man has in order to be able to keep in there in help him do a job. QUERY To follow up possible on what AI was saying, that's sounds to me as though somebody has been thinking about maybe getting new astronauts from somewhere down the road closer to the shuttle. And I just wonder if you could share some of that thinking with us as to when you might be in position to bring some new ones on board and whether they will be women involved and the requirments for these new people and so forth. SHEPARD My name is if we're going to talk about ladies in space my name is Deke Slayton. We have as you know all kinds of plans for shuttle, the crewls in Shuttle training programs. But just generally speaking, the plans right now for staffing the missions appear to be that we will use the current astronauts that we have here at the space center, in the areas of piloting requirements, in the initial medical and the initial scientific areas certainly the experiments. But

beyond that after a year or so of conducting these experiments, the thought currently is that we will be brinBing in people who are familiar with a specific experiment, and will be conducting it, but not necessarily have any previous training at all in space flight. That's the general plan and certainly if you want to say that an experiment includes writing a poem in space, maybe you'd take a poet up there. I see no reason why you wouldn't expand it to that degree. QUERY What you're saying is that after a year or so, what you're looking at is taking Just ordinary people along. SHEPARD We've been putting in ordinary people in space for 12 years now - 13 years. You won't believe it but we have. QUERY I'd like to know about what information from Skylab is goinB to have a bearing on the future training of the astronauts for these shuttle programs? SHEPARD That's a big question, I think certainly we will - we will use almost all of the training, the types of trainin_ equipment - the procedures that we've used very successful, which has, same types of training in in the past. We)re found them of course, - to maybe break

SL-IV TIME: 2/8/74

PC129/2 12:00




it down a little further, which means you'll have some people training to be pilots and some training to be the scientist that and specialists that go along with it. But I really haven't seen generally speaking anything in our previous training programs that - which we will not use in training people further right from the general familiarization training right all the way down to the specific experiment type training. We've had a lot of experience to count on. QUERY For those of us who followed this thing every day for 84 days and especially in the last few weeks, whatever happened to CMG number 2? Is it still alive? I know it's still alive and if it were to collaspe now after during this period, how long - what would be the orbital lifetime of the - ? S SCHNEIDER Well, CMG number 2, as we left the control center a moment ago, locked like it was in what we call stable i, that's where we started. We - we souBht a new plateau you know, during these last 6 or 8 weeks. And found another stable point and it's been vacillating between the two. Of course, if you lost this CMG, you would really lose the ability to keep it pointed to the solar attitude that's necessary over these next 20 so - 20 odd hours to do some of the data gathering we're doing. Sort of academic as to what happens thereafter because you will call on that system not to where, it'll be shut off. KLEINKNECHT Whether that's operating or not doesn't effect the lifetime of the vehicle that's up there. END OF TAPE

SL IV Time: 2/8/74

PC-1291/I 12:00 CDT

KLEINKNECHT - - Whether that's operating or not doesn't effect the lifetime of the vehicle that's up there. QUERY Dr. Hawkins, did you get any actual measurements in talking with the ship on what the blood pressure and pulse readings of the various men were? And if not, they obviously didn't, then if not, how soon could we expect to get that? HAWKINS Mary. We didn't, as I was shaking my head. No, the only figures we did get was reported by the crew, one of the crewmen earlier from the spacecraft of the heart rates in a supine position, which were 70, 80, and 80, which are certainly very, very nominal readings. I would estimate that possibly, maybe 2 hours before we'll really have the initial quick-look report that'll ?ive us any solid figures to work with. it'll be very late this afternoon, early part of the evening before we get the final R plus zero data. PAO More questions• Thank you very much. END OF TAPE


Skylab News Center Houston, Texas

Skylab Review Johnson Space Center February 21, 1974 i:00 p.m. CDT

Participants: Dr. Robert A. Parker, Scientist Astronaut W. Royce Hawkins, Deputy Director for Medical Operations Verl R. Wilmarth, Program Scientist for Earth Resources, JSC Dr. J.A. Eddy, High Altitude Observatory, Boulder, Colorado William C. Snoddy, Skylab Kohoutek Project Scientist Robert L. Bond, Co-PI Skylab Habitability Experiment Bob Gordon, PAO


SL IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31A/I 13:03


PAO post-Skylab ments. The held More here than

Ladies IV summary. fifth Annual at the Johnson 200 reports on

and First Lunar Space lunar

gentlemen, I have Science a

we'll couple Conference

begin of


announcewill be through will 22. be

Center on scientific

March 18 research

presented by investigators from the United States and several foreign countries. Some 500 scientists are expected to participate in the conference, which will be held right next door. No, excuse me, at the Gilruth Recreation Center and in Building i. Further information on this activity can be obtained through this office. Second announcement, courtesy of our secretary, Judy more coffee today, Affairs post-Skylab Hotel, Suite 153. of Skylab, Dr. Robert little PARKER review so here Parker. thing. Boin; she encourages you to buy some and you are all invited to the public event this evening in the Nassau Bay So we have 171 days, 13 hours and 14 minutes to tell So we Okay. Okay. us will Let So from about turn me you Skylab it over have know IV, to Mission Scientist Dr. Parker. all got we're we're Sort this trying of a to in some cases,

they what what Skylab.

tryln_ to talk about general cases an

do this afternoon. are the results

Generally, all of from data, of

"tie everythin_ some first looks of the

together at SL-IV productivity

Skylab," including or at least in some SL-IV. For some, and


many experiments, I should say, the data for SL-IV is Just now, or e_en not now available to the Pls. For some experiments, for _nstance, S183, the French ultraviolet astronomy experiment will not even be developed until next Tuesday, so that in some cases, you know, in fact, most cases, we cantt show you, "Hey, this is what we did and these are our conclusions from SL-IV." In fact, we're a long ways from that. In fact, I think I mIKht Just emphasize again, because I think quite frequently the publ_c as a whole, at least, and you people that speak to them probahly does not have too good a realization that the really solid basic results, or the results that really count from the Skylab data will not be available in some cases for years, And that's not to say that the most exciting firstlook tblngs won't be available during this coming year, but there will be, indeed, very heavy and decent solid science being done on Skylab data, hopefully 5 years from now, still, so that there's an awful lot of stuff yet to be gained which we can't even begin to think I might Just again, attention to the about sort to at right of as least now. On a shorter time scale, an announcement, call your some of my feelings. I myself, about the remiss else's of coming

being sort of up here later on, talking generally corollary experiments, and somewhat - feel somewhat quite frequently to come up and talk about somebody experiment. What you really want to do is instead

SL IV Time: 2/21/74

PC-131A/2 13:03 CDT

to hear me talk about 85 corollary experiments in 14 minutes, what you really want to do is sit down and talk to the individual PIs who know more about the experiments than I do, partly because they've got the data, and I don't. And whose real lives have been involved in them as well. And there are a number of symposia being scheduled just for the press's benefit, but for the group and - but these ought to be newsworthy for you me start which is It on or out by saying basically the there's furnace one and by NASA, not of PIs benefit, people and let

on materials technology, the metallurgical samples.

will be held EREP results August, and

at Marshall sometime in April. There's one which will be held here in Houston in July then a similar medical one which will be held

here in Houston again in July and August. A general symposia is currently scheduled for the American Astronautical Society meeting in Los Angeles in August. It will be kind of again, probably a somewhat simpler level "gee whiz" type of a thing with a whole bunch of the PIs from many areas. That's in Los Angeles in August. And there are some plans afoot to have some sort of a Kohoutek symposium in Goddard in October, in Washington. Those are the ones we know about so far. In reviewing the accomplishments of the mission I can say as those who I recognize as having been here on and off for a good deal of the last year, at least coverin_ Skylab, I'm sure some of you are probably a little bit tired of hearing NASA



people say that the mission has been very successful. _owever, it has been very successful, and I really feel, you know, there's no other word to describe it. In fact, I can say this for a number of reasons, one, we've accomplished far more than we expected to a year ago, for instance, a year ago SL-IV was a 56-day mission. It had only one load of film for each of the ATM experiments, instead of essentially two, which we got eventually. EREP was expecting 26 passes, instead of something 40, on both SL-III and SL-IV. ATM was expecting somethlnK like hours on SL-III and IV. We had no idea of doing anythin_ with Kohoutek, because a year ago - well, a year and a month ago we didn't even know Kohoutek existed. Many of the corollary experiments, such as S019, a year ago was expecting to expose two magazines of film_ one on SL-II and one on SL-III. Instead they exposed various portions of five magazines over all three missions. And this, remember, was when we assumed a year ago, that we_ in fact, were going to have a perfect working vehicle after launch. In fact, it may be one one likes to think about this on the late night summary shifts, which we worked so many on - durin_ Skylab, that maybe, in fact, we wouldn't have accomplished quite as much as we did, had we had a perfectly successful launch. It may well be that gettin_ our

like 200



SL IV Time: 2/21/74 feet

PC-131A/3 13:03 CDT






day very would





to a

scramble little allowed

and make do and less conservative

make some than we

hard have

decisions made us been, and perhaps

us to accomplish more in the long run for the mission. In that line, I'd like to read one thing here, which is a letter that Jack Sevier and myself as program scientists wrote to Bill Schneider as program director towards the close of the SL-IV mission discussing the efforts of not Just the experimenters, but of many of the other people who worked down here for instance, Huntsville, in and the MOCR and at the various the backrooms contractor and sites, out at and what

their impact was on the science mission. It goes as follows: "Without detracting from the dedicated and excellent performance of the many individual members of the experiment teams, we feel it is also particularly important to recognize the slmillar high level of the operational systems. Time dedication and performance on teams supporting the vehicle and again during the mission the part of and ground as different the malthe members of

functions occurred maintain not only science capability and easier course conservatively to let the experiments

they exerted themselves mightily to the viability of the vehicle, but also of the mission. Although a leFitimate of action would have been to stick premission fend for plans and themselves, constraints systems and constraints

were repeatedly reevaluated and work-around procedures in o_der to increase the capab_llty to support experiment activities. For example because of electrical shortages thermal problems, a sizeable program of power management Instituted in ordc_r to permit the continuation cf Z-LV maneuvers for EREP. When command module launch weight a problem because tended and launch of requirements - and stowage for repair requirements and for

developed and was became

for an exan extended

SL-IV mission, virtually all the reductions in weight were made in the area of operational equipment and through reexamination of launch redlines. Similiar efforts were also made following the loss of CMG number 1 to permit maneuvering in this nonnominal mode for EREP and comet observations. As you well know, there are many other examples where such efforts have also contributed very substantially to experiment operations. Presuming to speak for the various members of the experiment teams, we are happy to acknowledge the major contributions by the various operational teams to the science accomplishments of Skylab." And I guess I can say that wlth a gread deal of serious sincerity, because there were many times when I frankly felt almost embarrassed at how little was being asked for the scientists to give up in terms of what was being taken off, for instance, of the command module before the SL-IV launch. An awful lot of things that people have assumed for

SL IV PC-131A/4 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 many years were necessary were taken off instead of takin_ off other experiment consumables, like extra canisters of film for ATM and EREP and so forth. The mission was also, I think, and here I'm talkin_ about the whole Skylab mission, or the Skylab program, maybe is the better work for it. It was also successful because each mission built so well on the preceding missions. Because we were able to develope and demonstrate a flexible, smoothly-working system to accomplish and plan our objectives in a timely manner. The I hope, and we certainly tried, and I - as I say here, I think we




_I _b_ ¸

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PC-131B/I 13:03 CDT

word so

PARKER for it, well on

was also preceeding

- the Skyla5 program successful because missions a our flexible objectives because

maybe is each mission we were

the better built able to


develope and to accomplish

demonstrate and plan

smoothly in a

workin_ system timely manner.

I hope, and we certainly tried and as I say here I think we succeeded. I think we found a system and were able to develope at least a system where we could remain in Flight Plan and work in extremely flexible atmosphere, respond to real time requirements and changes, And I think this is something that I myself am as proud of as say the total number of frames exposed or something llke that for any one of the experiments. Now one of the things I was gQinz to do this afternoon is talk particularly about some of the results, in particular are the corollaries. However, as I said before virtually none of the data has gotten to the Pls in any form to be analyzed yet. We have a couple of "gee whiz" thln_s of the comet which we"ll show you, but quite frankly, maybe I shouldn't say this, but quite frankly we just don't have any SL-4 data right now that's been given any sort of interpretation. This is particularly true of the corollaries because very little of the data is brought down in real time as opposed to say the medics when they get the crew back in almost real time and they get all their telemetry data back in real time. They say $019 with the comet was developed yesterday; S183 for instance, is beinF developed on Tuesday; S093, the ozone experiment heinz developed over the weekend. So some of the data is still totally locked up on film. Other data is just barely become available to the Pls. Itrs also somewhat ironic that because in many During of the small staffs of most of the cases only two or three people are SL-IV very little time was available corollary experiments workinz on the data. for the small staffs

to work on the reduction of SL-II and SL-III data. Again if I were to discuss (squeal) that much from most of these Pls because again they have been spending all of their efforts workln_ operationally and gettinz more data durin_ SL-IV. So for those reasons_ I really don't wan; to say too much about mean counts and results. I don't llke to talk about how many they what frames somebody got or how many got and so forth. That is one we've accomplished, but I donlt feet of magnetic tape way of keepin_ track of myself find that too

_nteresting. here with days where I think I to reruns, data for

And I know that there was a press conference the corollary people before Skylab IV a couple of they did discuss some of those sort of results. can Just say this, Skylab IV was devoted prlmarily and production runs, most of the corollaries and the acqulsltlo_ that had been done of more already

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74 on

PC-131B/2 13:03 CDT










mission got essentially all the data or more than they anticipated say a year ago. Primary exceptions here are the solar scientific airlock experiments who lost in a great hurry when we had to use the solar scientific airlock to deploy the canopy during rescue out of to look scattering remember back in Skylah II. In some data from EVA at fact them for those particualarly three by experiments we did takinK experiments was wantin contamination K

and makin_ those (squeel) these zodieal light Gegenschein

S073, which particle

around the spacecraft. That experiment, back to August, malfunctioned, could not through the antisolar airlock which would

if you can he withdrawn have essentially

tied up the airloek for all other experiments, experiment was jettisoned early during SL-III. two basic experiment areas which we did not do did not do literally as well as we had expected

and so that Those are the quite as - or a year ago.

If some of you have questions on individual experiments, I'm quite willing to answer those, and hopefully I can get you some reasonable and honest comments on those. But as I say, I don't of film many END want to compared _ sit to up here and a pre-mission tell you that S019 got 136 total or some other EREP frames got so

thousand OF TAPE

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31-C/I 13:03 GMT











many go I'd the a that thought

thousand feet of magnetic tape. And at that and if you have - if some of be willing to answer them, otherwise next one which must be the medics. PAO question, Okay, Jim. of Okay. the CSM What that Dr. Hawkins.

I think I'd let it you have questions we can press on to Unless you have

QUERY were taken out to be necessary?

were some of you said were some stowage writeup

the things previously

PARKER Okay. There were things were stored in soft - in soft stowage. There must be some sort of

lockers. instead on that Jim, each

You know, of hard someplace there command

(garble) word about that. SPEAKER Yes. Before each mission, was a list available of the things removed from module that were necessary.

PARKER Okay. One in particular - one in particular, was water from the survival kit. Used to be in there, I think, for 5 days, this was reduced to 3 days, or else it used to be in there for 3 days, was reduced to 2 days. The total size of the survival kit was markedly reduced in order to save weight. QUERY That's it? PARKER No, there was a whole bunch of other ones. There was some - there was 150 pounds more or less taken out. But I - quite frankly, don't have those. this crew PAO area, status, we'll and Well, if we have go on to Dr. Royce medical experiments. no further questions Hawkins, discuss the Dr. Hawkins. on

HAWKINS Okay. I guess the way this was set up here, for - by Bob, as to how we were going to approach this this afternoon. Sounded like we're going to give you all the answers to what we've seen in Skylab and let me assure you right now, that isn't so. We've -, we've had - we've had three successful flights and we've had six different individuals up there and our results from each of the missions, has been somewhat different. This is unlike a lot of engineering type of of studies and all, where they can predict the outcome of a specific performance or failure. Man is a different type of system all together. He doesn't always respond. He doesn't usually respond just exactly like you - you were going to predict and that's the interesting thing understanding and learning what - what these that the real limitations of man may be and, means in order to cope with those limitations ahead and do a job. We feel like the results about it_is the differences are, therefore, provide in order to go we have seen



SL-IV MCI31-C/2 Time: 13:03 GMT 2/21/74 with the three missions thus far, certainly with the last one, point positively toward man's future roles and participation in space. The longest duration of the mission, showed a crew retuH1i[g - I think probably in the best shape of any of the three crews. Their - certainly their immediate postflight performance was better than what we really anticipated or expected to see. In the in the 171, the the crew of Skylab IV were, of course, not subjected to the full work protocol on the bicycle ergometer. Even at this level, they were capable of performing quite satisfactorily although at much higher physiological cost, both in heart rates and blood pressures than what we'd seen preflight. This is again, what we would expect. At R plus l, they were still not able to do a full protocol. This is slightly different from what the from what the Skylab II and Ill crews showed. But by R plus 4, all of the crews of Skylab IV, were back within their preflight envelopes. Now to compare that with Skylab II, that crew was not back until R plus 16. R plus 3 looked very much like R plus 4 by R plus 5 they were - they were considered well back within their preflight envelope. Now in the 92, M092 experiments, the - END OF TAPE

i! :i m£

SL-IV Time: 3/21/74 HAWKINS that are well back within their the was PCI31-D/I 13:03 CST

preflight envelope. Now, in the 92 - MO92 experiments, the Skylab IV crew showed again, not - not - responses not unlike the previous crew's. We had one crewman that not able to complete the abort the run at minus at minus 50 level. The the full 1 minute and protocol. He and 12 seconds the science had into

to the were



able to complete that protocol on R plus zero. Up R plus 2, which was all still out on the ship, they were still showing rather slgnlflcant blood pressure elevations, heart rates and all with the performance the protocol satisfactorily. at R plus 5, flight levels. which is the

through they of of

although they were able to complete those runs And then by R plus 4 back here, and again the crew of Skylah IV were back within the preNow, this was again borne out at R plus ii, last data point that we had on the on the I think in the cardiowould say, is very that is - is most

Skylab IV crew. So, their performance, vascular area, has been one of, that I remarkable. It's - it's certainly one encouraging, and - the significance why we have seen each mission we was certainly Skylab III, of time that I

don't yet fully understand all of the of the differences that we have seen, or these particular differences. Although with did do certain things differently, and exercise

one of the differences that we did put aboard and again on Skylab IV, increasing the amount the crews had for personal exercise on each of you

subsequent mission there. The - the calf circumfrance measure ments, which is another interesting flndln K which I know all have - have tried to track and follow along with us. We have always seen, in every mission, a rather significant drop in the circumference of the calf of all of the crews. And this

would vary, the rate of change then, from that initial first 2 or 3 days, would vary depending upon - on the individual. But as far as Skylab IV showed, this was a continuing rate changeout beyond day 40, with rather slgnif - a - type of plateaulng after that, very insignificant rate change if any at all. Now then, at recovery we saw what looked llke exactly the same type of last infllght measurements, and we expected that this was going to follow along the path which we saw for the two previous missions, where this would be slowly returning to what the preflight girth measurement of the calf was, something out about llke 21 days before this occured in Skylab II and III. Well, by R plus 5 they had recovered about a third of the loss that was seen in flight, and then by R ii, R plus ii, I consider the measurements that we obtained at that time to be exactly like they were preflight. So, here's a fairly significant

SL-IV PCI31-D/2 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 ChanBe in the positive aim. Now, to give you some comparisons of times of recovery, or return to baselines for Skylab II and III, and IV. In II the - the II crewmen, that were longest of any of the crew - crewmen flown so far, did not begin to show comparable prefliBht levels of measurement until after R plus 21: that was the commander and the science pilot. Now, the one individual that was - stood out very much different was, of course, the pilot on Skylab - END OF TAPE



SL-IV PCI31-E/I Time: 13:03 GMT 2121/74 HAWKINS - - one individual that was stood out very, very much different was, of course, the pilot on Skylab II, who was back to preflight levels at R plus 2. Skylab III, all three crewmen were considered hack by R plus 9. Then again, as I said earlier on by R plus 4, the Skylah IV crew were back. Okay. Now in the 131, the that's the vestibular studies the - the results here have - have been very - very similar, really, to what we've seen in the previous crews. The last measurement that we had with the Skylah IV crew was in R plus 5, where the motion sensitivity test was performed and at that time, the crews were able to perform their - their usual 150 head movements at the maximum rotation of 30 rpm, but with mild symptoms. Now the next time we'll be - we will evaluate this particular teat and function will he at R plus 17, which will be like next Monday. The oculogyral illusion in special localization tests were as - were performed at R-If and these were considered to be back within preflight levels. The Skylab II crew, were - were considered back with all of the motion sensitivity and the OGI and the special localizations by R plus 21. Perhaps even a little bit of question at that particular time, as I remember, but we were not able to again check them until R-60 which by that time, was a very positively reverted back to at normal preflight state. Now, the same thing appeared with Skylab III crew, and I think that what we're going to see here is probably a similar situation with Skylab IV. Now the big differences here are the levels of rotation, the stress the - which the crews of II, III, and IV were subjected to. As I said, Skylab IV crew have been rotated at the 30 rpm, which is what the - they had obtained preflight and sustained all the way through in flight. The Skylah II crew were at 12 rpm. For two of the crewmen, 15 rpm for one, and 20 for the other preflight, and they were not able to go above these levels in the postflight period, although in flight, they did. While Skylab III, were - all three of them were about had obtained a level of about 20 rpm with 150 head movements preflight and were able to continue on that level of,performance in the postflight period. So, that is a difference there and yet, I don't fully know why _ why the difference. Now an interesting point is in the calcium mobilization from the bones, we had not seen any significant losses until Skylah III and at that time, we saw about a 7 percent loss in the heel bone of the science pilot. Now, in Skylab IV, the R plus 1 data - and that's all I have available as yet, showed a loss in - in all of the crewmen, with _bout a 7 percent loss in the p_lot_ and about 0.7 - 0.5 percent then doesn't look much unlike what us in period Skylab III of flight pilot, in the Owen's 4-1/2 in the science commander. This, again Owen Garriot showed longer significant

although this is at a - a certainly and exposure to zero gravity. The

SL-IV PCI31-E/2 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 thing here I think is, of course, that all three crewmen here have shown some some loss. Although, again let me reassure you that the losses that have been seen to date, are not - are not of any level that would be clinically significant where you would expect any type of trouble such as bone fractures or anything of that nature. But it is - it is an interesting finding which as yet must await the full analysis and interpretation by our principal investigators. Now, let me touch on the other points which have been of significant interest to us and that is the hemotology. Again, our loss in plasma volume has been about the usual 15 percent loss in Skylab IV. And the red cell mass, again doesn't look really too much unlike the - the previous crew's except perhaps a little bit lower percentage loss in the Skylab IV. Now in Skylab II, we - we had - we showed about at R-0, about a 14 percent loss in the red cell mass. In Skylab III, we had again about a 14 15 percent loss is the average and then in Skylab IV, I would say the - the average loss here was somethin_ like about 7 percent. So it may - roughly, it's about half. Now I don't know what the - let's see. I guess we did get another blood - blood samples that are isotope studies done in R plus 5, I believe it was. And I don't have the results of that yet. That'll be coming probably by the end of the week. But in the the hemoglobins, this was initially found to be elevated in the R-0 recovery phase, partly due to dehydration and concentration of the - of the blood, the pla - and red cells. It - the figures at that time did not look too much unlike what the inflight values had been running. Although, remember we did see an awful lot of fluctuation in the in the readings that that were obtained in flight. And I might add that did not always correspond with what the - the readings obtained postflight from the inflight samples returned to us show. Now at R plus I, then we did find with rehydration, a drop in the hemoglobin levels by about 2 to 2-1/2 grams across the board for the crewmen. Now this to dat e now, has - has remained just about at a gram, gram and a half loss. They have increased slightly. The other important thing that we track very closely in this immediate postflight period has been the reticular side counts which is a indication of the blood-forming organs of the body to produce new red blood cells and where in Skylab II, we did not see any activity in this area until out to beyond R plus 18. And somewhere in between R plus 18 and R plus 42, which was the time that we were able to obtain blood samples again from that particular crew. And it was somewhere in that time period, they did begin to develop what would be called a normal hemopoetic activity in response. The Skylab III crew were different. They were definitely showing increased red cell counts , red cell formations there by R plus 5. And R

SL-IV PCI31-E/3 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 plus - Skylab IV, we were seeing _p_,,1_ =4_4-e counts in R plus zero. So you can see, we do have a lot of differences here to look at and it's going to take tlme for us to really compare all of the data that we have. We still have a lot of the laboratory that is still END OF TAPE data, of course, from the bein_ processed and - infllght samples

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PCI31-F/I 13:03 CDT

data data, bein K there

HAWKINS that we


- - for We still

us to have

really a lot

compare all of of the laboratory


of course, processed, as yet.

from the infllght samples and I cannot really speak But it's goin K to take some

that is still of any of the results time for us to

completely analyze this and put it together, and to really understand what all of these changes really mean because they do have to interlock and interrelate to one another. PA0 Okay, we'll have questions and answers. If questions, Paul (garble). QUERY please wait Dr. for Hawkins, the mike. way back Paul, in right May before here. the

Conrad crew launched, you said that one purpose of the medical tests was to find kind of a magic formula that would enable man to stay in space virtually forever. Do you think at this point in time that you got a handle on it, or you still searching? HAWKINS No, I don't think we've got a handle on it yet by any means. And we won't really, definitely been able to put all the pieces really understand what the - what the big PAO Bill Crommie. QUERY ulations on are you the fact or what? sayin that why K each it they Have of you got the crews be a there any actual came out until we've together and picture is. reasons better? of exercise to plateau or specI mean and off, -

could were

combination long enough

HAWKINS Well, you can speculate on a lot of the a lot of these thin_s really. And no, I don't know the answer to that. I think exercise has definitely played a significant role. That and time have been the really the hi@ - the bi_ Deltas if you, you know, as you look from one mission to the other. Of course, the other difference, of course, are the individuals. And although I think that the - the individual performance _s really not goln_ to give you that sole answer. There are other thin_s which you've got to figure into it. And the nutrition, the schedule of activity, the time allocated for rest, exerclsin_, all of these thinks definitely play a significant role in - in, I think, where you PAO in preparing could expect men or maintaining them them to go indefinitely. Author Helt. in a state

QUERY out thus far, a reasonably Raquel Welch,

Well doctor, based on what you have found how would you personally feel about certifying healthy, but nonspace trained person, say like for a 14 or 30 day space shuttle flight? And

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PCI31-F/2 13:03 CDT

for this type of person what sort of preflight medical checks, if any, would you want to run? HAWKINS Well, (laughter) I'ii start off and say I'ii volunteer to take all of that responsibility and perform all the examinations necessary. (Laughter) The - yeah, I feel llke that we've, you know, we've flown healthy individuals. Of course, we - we certainly know more about the individuals that we've flown than we do right now about the average people as being candidates Out of what we've off the street for passengers - what we have which you're referring in the in the future. learned and what we will to

learn in Skylab, we will have to develop criteria and standards of selections of people who will be flown. I I I have no doubts, but what the standards can he somewhat lower than what we have, you know, have selected our astronaut core by and have have flown in the flights to date. These - these individuals have been in the - in really the best of health. They've had the advantage of most of medical attention that anybody in, I think in the world, has ever recieved, They've had the benefit of all the medical knowledge that we can muster to support them_ and for a specific purpose that we were going into the unknown and we had to, you know, we had to have them ready to cope with any type of problem, emergency, or whatever. I think that the _ the physical status of those crews have held up to that requirement. But, I think in the process we've learned too, that okay, we, you know, we can fly people with a little less physical state, a little less exercise regime program that they would _ave to maintainp and certainly the different sexes. But the standards will have to be established, and I don_t have those today, of what wetre going to measure those passengers by. But there definitely will have to be some restrictions placed on people. You can't just open it up as an airline yet to everybody because I feel very sure that the type of changes we've seen, certainly in cardiovascular areas are going to dictate that there's a lot of cardiac and cardiovascular problems just won't be able to go. QUERY Let me, if you'll speculate alon_ with me just a little bit further here, based on your knowledge of the, say out of a given number of people like i0 or 100 average individuals there would be a certain number you would expect with some cardiovascular problems, and so forth. But - but, just can you give us a ballpoint figure of - of say, projected i0 or 15 years from now. Out of a I00 average people, how many would you think would be medically okay for 14 or 30 day type of space flight as a passenger?

SL-IV PCI31-F/3 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 HAWKINS Whew, oh, boy. (Laughter) I don't know, I don't know what that figure would be right off hand. Really, I'd even hesitate to make a guess. I think you've got a One thing, I think you've got to again look at a specific population that you're going to be flying. You're not going to really be talking about flying every man off the street like an airline. You're going to be flying people with specific backgrounds, scientific or whatever, to perform a specific function up there. And the damands, I think, are going to be different for each different group. You're going to have the hard-core pilots who are going to fly the thing up there and back and they're going to have to meet some pretty rigid standards because they got to be - they got to be in a state where they can perform and take care of any type of emergencies that exist whether you're passengers or not. It's very comparable to what you'd see in an airline situation. But out of a hundred people off of the street that you're talkin_ about, I'd say maybe i0 percent would maybe be, you know, readily acceptable. PAO Bruce Hicks. QUERY Yeah, Royce, I got a couple. First of all, what were the results on the - the testing on the heart size? HAWKINS Okay, the - you're talking about the echo cardiography. I don't have - I really don't have any results yet on the X-rays, which you know the conventional cardio ratio. These have not been measured as yet and analyzed completely. The - the echo showed absolutely nothing, no change in the - in two of the subjects, the commander and the SPT. The pilot was the only one who showed any type of change, and this looked on the first of the examination to be a volume - a chamber volume change rather than any muscle mass or body wall thickness - muscle wall thickness. QUERY Well, do you expect those results will change with the X-ray results, or will they - do you think they'll backup the echo cardiogram? That's more sensitive, isn't it? SPEAKER Well, the echo cardiography is designed to measure - END OF TAPE

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PC-13iG/1 13.:03 CDT

muscle with will it?









QUERY Well, do you expect those results to change the X-ray results or will they - Do you think they back up the echo cardiogram? It's more sensitive, isn't Well, thickness. the echo cardiography The cardio-thoracic is designed ratio is a to

HAWKINS measure the


diameter of the heart, the overall size of the heart, which we have consistently seen to be reduced in size. And the question before was whether that was a muscle loss, cardiac muscle loss or whether it was a volume change. And so far the initial results with the echo cardiography looks like it's probably volume change. QUERY And this is the first time we've done the echo cardiography, so the other times when we've seen the heart shrlnka_e or the reduction in size or whatever, it isn't muscle mass loss as such then? HAWKINS now tends to loss. say that Well, that so far what I is the truth. have It available right is not muscle

QUERY And a moment ago you made a comment that the exercise regimen may not he as much on, say, the average guy off the street and so forth on a Shuttle flight. Well, the results - just a to gross look at the results of how long it takes to come back to the envelope after flight, you take a mission that is three times as long as the first one the guys are back five times faster, hut they have done all this much more exercise and each flight got more. How can you cut back to the exercise level of Pete Conrad's crew and say they are going to he, you know, he able to handle it? HAWKINS Well, I'm really thinking about the the realistic time duration of your Shuttle flights. You're talking about 6-day, 8-day flights. And you go back and look at Gemini and Apollo crew's return to those, they bounce back within about this time period that we have seen here without any real exercise program on board - nothin_ of the nature we'_e had with Skylab. They didn't have a bicycle ergometer up there or a modified makeshift treadmill up there or any that. It was just a hungee cord, the Exergene or whatever. And so I think with the shorter duration flights, the amount that of

of exercise is really not going to be so meaningful, not that it isn't it wouldn't be helpful, let me put it that way. And what I would propose that we have in Shuttle is the capability for exercising and maintaining the physical status of all the people.

SL-IV PCTI31G/2 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 QUERY Well then in relationship to a I- or 2-year flight is an hour and a half of exercise per day going to cut it or are you going to have to increase that? HAWKINS Oh, I think there is a limit to how, you know, how many hours a day that you need to exercise to maintain your physical status. And what that magic number is, Bruce, I'm not real sure at this point, but it certainly looks like from Skylab IV that an hour to an hour and a half a day seems adequate. And I wouldn't expect it to go beyond that really. If they utilize that time efficiently, that should stress the cardiovascular system and the musculature system adequately enough to keep you in a pretty good state of health. QUERY Can you put a number on the heart shrinkage as a percentage of the total heart or something? HAWKINS Let's see, I don't have a figure, let me see what - I was trying to think back to Skylab II and III, what we - This was not, I mean, this is not a big significant loss. I think the percentage that I recall right offhand, I may be wrong on this, was somewhere between 1-1/2 and 3 percent, depending on the individual. That's diameter or volume, area. QUERY In other words, when the heart is fully expanded it would be 3 percent less than on Earth. HAWKINS Yeah. QUERY I wanted to ask you about the gain in height. they all three gain exactly the same amount of height and lose it at the same time at R zero? HAWKINS It was about the same. It was about, well it was about an inch and a half to 2 inches is the range it that they showed inflight. And then yes, this is, you know almost immediately reverted back to their normal preflight levels, certainly over the first 2 days. The same thin_ with the anthropometric measurements that we saw inflight. If you recall, we did see a reduction in the limb size circumference both - more so in the legs, but also in the upper extremities as well as the trunk. And you can associate this partially with a lengthenin_ of the spinal column in the increased height, and of course, e stretching or redistribution of the body tissue. And then of course under the one g conditions you get recompression of the spaces between the vertebrae and then they settle right back to what has long been their normal height. And you also get the other tissues more or less kind of returning to what the normal waistline was and so forth. QUERY Did any of them lose any of the compensation in their back muscles like A1 Bean did? HAWKINS They are all complaining, even today, of some muscular soreness. This involved the neck, the abdominal Did all

+ P

++ -i+++ +i+|_

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PC-131G/3 13.:03 CDT

muscles, the still have a

lower little

back, and residual

the calves, of this. little of improving, associated you it's you know to what


primarily. think all

They three


them are still experiencing a time. So it's been gradually And a little muscular stiffness QUERY HAWKINS To what I Well,

this even to th_s but it's still there. with it also. that? a different immediate accustomed use of this had just in they

would think


the muscles, and muscle return to one g conditions

groups, over

themselves to using them in zero g. And it's not too much unlike you getting out and working hard in the yard on a Saturday and using muscles you haven't used, they are goln_ to be sore for a few days. QUERY In effect, the use of the muscles are normal in gravity was not bein K done up there and they atrophied and they are being used now and they're sore as a result of this. HAWKINS Well, they are used in a different way. Now I don_t know how much atrophy, you know, it looks like from what we_ve measured with this crew that we really haven't seen any appreciable amount of atrophy, completely say that there was not some. in the lower extremities we did see some II and III. I think we've seen less of of the aboard heavy specific type to specifically of exercise give them program a chance although I think of that it with you can't certainly with Skylab IV because

devices that we put to work those big

antigravity muscle groups. QUERY There was a - the crew reported they had a rash while they were in the flight, a skin rash sort of thin K . Now that youtve had a chance to look at it does this tell you that there is need for a change in personal hygiene or clothing changes or anythin_ like that for a lon_ term flight, or was this wen related to zero g environment? HAWKINS Well, it's not I don't think it's related to the zero g, but I do think itts related to of course the environment, the gaseous environment that they are in. The temperature, definitely humidity and have influenced amount of oxygen and all very the condition of the skin. They

have all _ all crews have experienced some drying effect in fl_ght. And this is strictly just a result of the gaseous humidity environment. And this was not, I don't think, specifically the cause of t_e rash. I think that's perhaps more of an irritant type of thinK. The rashes that were seen were not of an infectious nature_ so they are really just from irritation, from the clothing, or that type of thing. These - END OF TAPE

SL IV Time: 2/21/74

PC-131H/I 13:03 CDT

HAWKINS of an infectuous from clothing or course, is always










nature, so they're really that type of thing. These extremely important, and

Just from irritation - Hygiene, of the better hygiene

capability you have for your crews, the healthier the skin is goin_ to be. But I feel that we really did not see any really significant chanEes here in the crews from either of the postfllght that would say that you Just really have any big problem. There were - they did use the showers, and I think it's important that they have that capability to shower down, and keep keep themselves in a comfortable healthy state. PAO Arthur. QUERY missions, not but was there prised you? a little bit HAWKINS Doctor, was there necessarily of a - of anything that - medically anything anything speakln_ out of these of serious nature, that sur-

That strikes your memory as somethin_ that was unexpected? (Cough) Excuse me. Well, I guess - I of the crews during - durinK the on their bicycle ergometer and all was that what I had expected. I would anyway, would have before seen we ever greater flew changes Skylab II, in the

guess the performance exercise performance a little bit different have that thouKht, we would initially of - we

physiology of the - of the men undergoin_ this particular type of function as - as a reflection of the - of a chan_ing in the cardiovascular system. What we really saw was the crews - and this was characteristic of all of them - the crews more or less looking exactly llke they did preflight. And then the big change, of course, was in the immediate postflight period. The other interesting thing, and I don't llke to classify it as really suyou know, as surprisin_ to that level, but the performance to the in - to the er Their we_d then not bicycle er - I mean, the lower body performance here of how you could term degradation in the cardlovascular on the very show this at next all. time around they Their performance negative pressure. you could see what response, and would of - they would would be, again,

very acceptable. This was a little of a of a - certainly a change, a change, but not necessarily reflecting of degradation. It's got to be thus specific things associated with the vlronment, lack of sleep, some things into it, but the 92 did prove to he Their performance inflight under the they were going to look llke in the think this was rather significant. other big change was that we saw,

surprisln_ and indicative fluctuatln_ type of a - a cumulative type related to some some run at that time. Enthus have to figure a very good predictor. 92 predictin_ what postfllght period. I And then, of course the and didn't really expect

SL IV PC-131H/2 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 was the in the vestibular area, of how these crews could

perform at levels which exceeded the - their preflight baseline levels without any symptomatology whatsoever in zero g. QUERY I realize the radiation environment in Earth orbit's different than it was in - since lunar - or trip to Mars studies or anything, but did you see anything in your that would indicate a need for more protection radiation or

less protection or anything like this? Any change in what you previously knew? HAWKINS No. Not from the standpoint of levels of radiation that we saw. The levels - and I don't have these actual figures here with me, but the levels that the crews saw in Skylab were always below what we predicted. Now, that's total cumulative dosage over the period of time. It's always below what was predicted, and it's certainly below any designed critical levels. I think that there now we're going to have to take another look at this, I think that there are some possibilities that when you go through certain latitudes or certainly through the South Atlantic anomaly, that you may be picking up higher rates of radiation at that particular time, and we probably need to take a further look at this as we begin to understand more about what we've learned from - certainly from Skylab IV in - in the light flashes, studies and all this that we've been able to do in passin_ through those - that anomaly and also the northern and southern latitudes. But, here again, the total dosage and all has well been below any established critical levels of exposure, and therefore the crew should certainly not experience any problems whatsoever. PAO Bill (garble) QUERY Yeah. You didn't indicate any surprise at the fact that the red blood cell mass was only half in this crew as compared to the others - WILMARTH Well - QUERY You have any theories as to why that is? HAWKINS I here again, the maximum loss I believe in III didn't appear until the second sampling either, so we may be seeing a further loss in that. I'm - I really you know, I really don't know what to make of it yet. PAO Okay. If we have no more questions of Dr. Hawkins, thank you sir, we'll move on to the next part of the program. Bob? GORDON Okay. The next one will be Wilmarth, who will talk about some of the EREP results. WILMARTH I didn't mean to run everybody off, but I want to do two things this afternoon. And that's primarily to talk about what we have overall accomplished relative to EREP, Earth resources, and then another aspect of Earth resources and that has to do with the visual observation project that we


)l !l_

SL IV PC-131H/3 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 initiated for SL IV, and to give you a brief review of what the crew observed; some of the things that they'll be talking about tomorrow and showing you some rather striking photographs of some of the the phenomena that they observed and that they have photographed. Now, I want to back up a little bit on EREP, because I think we lose track of what we originally planned to do with EREP and try and give you a feeling of what we have accomplished relative to the total objectives that we first started out. I see that there's some people in this audiance have already seen these slides, but I do want to go back and recapture some of the things that we talked about at the very beginning of EREP. So we can start out with the first slide, please? EREP was conceived with a specific point in view, and that is to determine how useful the spectral and spacial sensors we have on board could be in Earth resources. Secondly, we flew a series of microwave experiments and we needed to find out how good they would be. How useful they would be in any END OF TAPE

SL-IV PCi31-1/I Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 WILMARTH - - and that is to determine how useful

the spectral and spaclal ensensors we have on board, could be in Earth resources. Secondly, we flew a series of microwave experiments and we needed to find out how good they would be how useful they would be in the Earth resources program. Thirdly, what's the effect of the atmosphere. We had onboard sensors capable of detecting the atmospheric constituents varying and the effects of that kind of data on the overall processing and analysis of data from the - from the other sensors is a very important aspect as I'm sure you people recognize. We move on to the next one, please. The total EREP program was devised around essentially nine various program elements and you can read these as quickly as I can. They represent the broad disciplines beginning with geology, hydrology, cartography and land use, and things llke that. But remember that these are the major areas that we are planning to use the sensors to determine how useful they would be in the - both from a scientific and a land use or an application type program. We have the next one, please. Contrary to some of the Skylab programs, scientific studies, we have on board, a major segment of the scientific communities both in U.S. and in 19 foreign countries. We have 140 designated Pls. They are strongly supported by a series of probably an additional 250 to 300 scientists that are dlrectlysupportlng their activities. Now, to emphasize to say a_ain, all of the data have not been distributed to the Pls and I_ii talk of that a little bit later; none of the data from SL_IV. So we're in the same boat as many other investigators, Can we go on to the next one, please? To give you a feeling with the distribution of the foreign Pls here is the llst that you've seen before. There are 19 of them. Again, our neighbors to the south, have considerable interest £n Earth resources. Can we have the next one, please. Can I have tkls one also? Now with that as a background, let's turn briefly to what we accomplished in SL-IV. The ground tracks that you see here, very similar to what we did on SL-III, the SL_II ones are primarily - the ones on the far left with the descending passes over the U.S. and down through South America, III looks very similar to this with the exception that we have a rather lonK arc. You will see that beginning here, extending all the way around to the - to give us a complete 360 degrees cycle using the radar altimeter. But in general, we kave 40 Z_LV passes. We had 5 solar inertials, primary to look at some of the data from a solar inertial standpoint and the funny looking llne that you see down over the U.S. and South America; was one of the first EREP passes. That was done l_n solar inertial mode and some of the results from that are beginning processed and _ some of the data are now they are rather interesting beginning from a to be oblique standpoint.

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74 We -

PC131-I/2 13:03 CDT







III and are






up over Iran and have considerable

that part of cloud cover,

the world the data

although we did of considerable

use to the Pls. Again, we shot down over Australia once, twice, off over into Europe but this is a very had time of the year simply from the standpoint there's a Sun angle that's not very convenient to take data over there. So in general, what we've taken, is essentially an additional 40 EREP passes, operation of the sensors, and from the standpoint of total sensor operation, they were all operational. We did do a little mechanical have crosstrack are, Can then fixing of mode instead direct Let's to what the of 193 antenna so in-track mode. to many what we accomplished that gut we'd the only data

of course, of we go on again? I'll move on

interest look at we have

of the investigators. did for SL-IV and on the total

mission. valuable The 190A comment Area areas Test of

Regardless of the statistics, they still are avery and a very valid way of judging how good we did. multlspectral camera, some 18,000 frames, and I will here that finally, we did get data over our Houston Site and investigation of as you well know, that's here being conducted division. 190B. I have one of by the We the major science and

applications, good number of the new spectacular. IR data is

Earth observation frames from the

got again, a looked at some it is the new you will interesting From an

emulsion The really

of the 190B color IR and people, resolution that we are gettin_ from very good. The I think tomorrow, Alabama involved in that will be very Earth resources.

see a shot of to most people

Birmingham, who are

operational standpoint_ as I noted, we did do a repair job on the 193 antenna. During the - about the middle of January, as a matter of fact it was January 15th, we changed out the 192 multispectral scanner detector. And this was done for a specific purpose. We carried up with us on SL-IV, a higher resolution detector, specifically in a thermal channel 13. There was a program requirement to obtain information on "geothermal data" as could be in order the capability of let's see, surface looking at temperature terrain, done and variations variations from I'll in new band as much to determine

surface temperature under various conand a nighttime an example of what final of 3 analysis, of PIs and Dr. the

ditions, both from a data take. This was that _ those 140 PIs, we Enastrosa we dfd not Chad area.

a daytime show you

kind of data. In the - in the did complete with the exception

(?), studying obtain any As far as

the upwellin_ areas off the coast of Peru, data for him or Dr. Geisner (?) over the EREP data, we did not obtain any inforwe did not acquire order to do his So those are all

mation from him. And then for Dr. Stoyburr, the data he needed in pre_dawn conditions in thermal volcanic studies down in Guatemala.



21i!_ _

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31-I/3 13:03 CDT

140 PIs, we do have data for the PIs to do their final analysis and complete their approved investigations which I think is a rather a very definite credit to the three-man crews. As I stated and I showed you an example, after 360 deRree altimeter pass, data was acquired. Again, one of the storms in the January 4 to January ii time frame, off the north Atlantic, was one of the successfully a storm in order conditions, hour and wave largest storms in a decade. We did acquire series of optical and miercwave data over to determine the variations of sea state, conditions were 40 to were 50 upwards feet, in of 70 order that wind

the wind heights

miles per to determine

the utility. I go back again to the objective of how useful our microwave data from space in studying the variations in sea state and several other environmental conditions. Again, you probably have looked at the snow and ice maps of the U.S. We did get a considerable amount of data for snow mapping and sea and lake ice studies over the U.S. I pointed out some of the geothermal data, so let's go on to the next slide. Now, the X-5 detector is a higher resolution capability in the thermal channel. What we did was to take a series of data takes, using the X-5 detector and you can see the areas that we have acquired data. Commenting for a moment, we did a pre-dawn pass over here, followed by a series of passes in the daylight. We did down over this part of the world. These were ground truth using both the heloeopter for ground truth as well as ground stations in order to determine the actual temperature variations. We did do a series series of - I thought I could shout loud enough. We did do a - a very interesting ground track down through here with ships taking data actually the chemical and the temperature data. Word came at the same time that we were overflying with the X-5 detector. In general then, we satisfied a program requirement in order to determine how useful such a detector would be from satell_tes END OF TAPE in order to look at variation -

SL-IV PCI31-J/I TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 WILMARTH - - program requirement in order to determine how useful such a detector would be from satellites in order to look at variations in temperatures both from a geothermal energy source, in other words, detection of potential hot springs or volcanic areas for use in studying and possible development for geothermal energy. Again, the one over - off the coast of Florida was done primarily to look at the loop current sea surface temperature variations. The other areas were, of course, of interest from the standpoint of what are the - what is the detectable temperature variations over different varieties of terrains. Could we go on to the next one, please? This is an example of an image created from the 192 X5 thermal detector. It's down off the coast of - of New Orleans is actually Marsh Island. Marsh Island is in here. Here is the Mississippi River comin_ down. As you notice, the difference in temperature is rather obvious. The land is brighter, warmer than the water and you can see the variations here. Now, this is one of the first downlink data that was during the mission, and it's obviously not as well processed. Considerable data can be further obtained from it, but it does give you a rather interesting idea of how useful this kind of thermal detection capability is. Look at look at the variations between the darker blue water out in here and some of the pollution or some of the areas in here which probably represents long shore currents in this area. So, this is Just a typical example of the kinds of imagery that you can get from an X5 detector with a - with looking at variations in surface temperatures. The cities little cities stand out very interestingly as bright spots. You can see here the areas where - This spot, incidentally, over here is not real. There are some flaws data dropouts Can we go on to the next one, please? All right let's look at EREP totally. Statistics again - some 22,000 feet of magnetic tape, some 34,800 frames of 190A, and some 5600 frames of 190B. In addition, you all know there's a series of DAC film which are used primarily with the 191 to determine location of the data collection. Let's look at what we did from the standpoint of the - of the objectives. We set out to find out how useful the microwave data are in Earth resources. We d_d obtain excellent data over hurricane Ava, over hurricane Christine. As I remarked the extratroplcal cyclone, the largest in the decade over the north Atlantic, was sent some successive passes, and we do have a tremendous amount of data which will aid us in understanding how useful this sensor is for the determination of possibly looking to the future of other types of sensors and other types of satellites. The

SL-IV PC131-J/2 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 altimeter data was acquired over several deep ocean trought, including the Java trench, the Puerto Riean trench, the Mariannes trench, and again the trip around the world, as we jokingly spoke of the 360 degree altimeter run, does provide us a rather new complete cycle of data on one pass for looking at the geoidal characteristics of the Earth. Turnin_ to some of the more - more, let's say, difficult but rather interesting and certainly of prime importance to the understanding of the - and the analysis of the other sensor data, we did acquire much of the - much of the 192 data over a series of groundtracks with the ground with the ground truth information in order to understand the variations in total reflectance from the Earth with using the aircraft as well as the 192 sensor onboard on EREP. This is, of course, of interest in the atmospheric modeling and of direct interest, of course, as I stated to the data analysis program. As part of this in SL-II, Wabash River, within an hour we obtained, on a clear day, the 190 - I say all of the EREP sensors were operational, the ERTS overflew within an hour, we had aircraft at 10:20 and 40,000 feet, operating of concurrently, or near concurrently, a very similar and a very complimentary set of sensors. Similarly in SL-IV, we did the same thing over White Sands. Again this is known as multistate sampling technique, but it does provide us a way if evaluating utility of the sensors based on what we would call ground truth or near surface aircraft and making comparison with some of the unmanned ERTS type data. We have the next one, please? Within the sensus cities program being conducted by the U,S. Geological Survey, we acquired a mass amount of data over 15 of the 18 sensus cities. Specfically in the Phoenix area and also on the Washington D.C. area. Their comments to us is that the EREP 190A, and 190B data are comparable to some of the high altitude RB57 aircraft data. So, we know that we have certainly approached a standpoint that how useful are these sensor_ in Earth resources, they're proving to be certainl) beneficial. The modeling that we have done intrying to look at the use of the oblique as well as the vertical 190B data in trying to map inaccessible or vary your mode areas of the world, has this modeling has progressed to the point where we know that we can do a very useful topographic map from the EREP data without any - without a major ground control program. The area of un - area under study was done the Gran Chaco of Paraguay, part of the of the major area which has not been mapped. We have certainly demonstrated that the EREP data can provide us that kind of modeling and that kind of

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PCI31-J/3 13':03 CDT

data for a lot of program. amount of

topographic mapping. Pazazy interest has

Finally, been the

and visual

perhaps of observation a tremendous were not -

The crew has observed and has unique information over areas

acquired that we

that we had not photographed on previous manned missions and over areas of the ocean which very little information on sea temperatures, currents, island wakes, and things like that had been acquired over the past years of study, both from a ocean as well as from a aircraft program. Can we go to the next ones now? Letts look at what we tried to do with the can the crew he photo documentation in getting data of the a very of the the as a of visual observation scientific observer, program. both How from a good

standpoint, from an observer direct interest in scientific

standpoint studies

Earth. This was a prime objective. extensive data package with maps kinds of phenomena to be observed

We had onboard, and illustrations and the kinds of to

features as well look at what they next one, please. this is imcomplete,

as the procedures to observe it. Now, accomplished, let's take a look at the Up through mission day 81 and we know but here is a series of numbers that

give you the variety of features, dlcipllnes that they observed. They represent essentially 85 different categories of features or phenomena, something on the order of 800 to 850 observations and well over 1200, maybe 1500 photographs. In part some of this is color IR, both Nikon as well as Hasselblad. But in all of these the crew served and photo documented exactly what they were looking at, therefore the data are of direct interest and we have already proven that it is of direct interest and they'll talk to you some more Let's here about this tomorrow go on. All right it illustrates the on some to kind kinds of of these specific examples. of wrap up here are the areas data based on the color observed a rather blooms off in this

chart that tremendous

you can see over there. They amount of upwelllng Plankton

part of New Zealand, the a Alpine'fault has been photographed and it's a tremendous example of data collection. Here again, they looked at the currents here, you see the pinks are primarily the desert sand dune areas. Geology is indicated, here is the Afar triangle with the African rift shown through here. Deserts here_ looking over here, the Humboldt current and and the very interesting Falkland current which they'll talk to you tomorrow as well as the Yucca,an current END OF TAPE

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31±K/I 13,:03 CDT







Afar in

trlangle with the African rift zone through here. Deserts here. Looking over here, the Humboldt current, the fault the very interesting Falkland Current which they'll talk with you tomorrow, as well as the Yucatan current. Again, the ice islands and the general areas in here. This gives a general collected that what going going comment forth, feeling data. of the areas So in summary has to that the crew I think that indicated has be accomplished. observed and we can say that far surpassed We know it's


EREF as Bob already we thought was going to to

be several years down the pike as to when get some results. As an example or let for a moment the results are now beginn_n_ a matter of fact, we are having (garble)

we're let me to be at AGU

put on


April 8th a summary of - with about i0 of the PI's to give a preliminary summary of what they have learned. We are also having here, as Bob indicated a science conference in July with all the PI's commlng in to give us a status of where they are, what they are doing, how far they have progressed in their data analysis. Of course, this is a very massive effort. It's not a very easy Job to look at somethin_ on the order of 34,000 frames of data, although each PI doesn't get this, this is recognized. Nevertheless, you look at a - one photograph co_erlng something on the order of 3606 square miles obtained from the 190B and the variety of information can be obtained. You readily understand, as a matter of fact, George Mall of Hurricane Center in Miami stated rather emphatically that he had spent two weeks observing and analyzing one photograph obtained on a massive job ahead underway from SL-II of all the data has on the 190B in SL-III. So we do have of us. The data distribution is well and SL-III probably 75 to 80 percent been distributed to the PI's. We have the 192 which is a problems in processing And distribution of

one major area of concern and thatts multispectral scanner. We had - had the data and we are delayed ±n that. the data probably of the May time men is a summary been a great PAO SPEAKER

is going to beg_n something in the order frame. So that over all ladies and gentleof what we have acccmplished, I think it's Thank you Well Dick Dick. if data Orson. reduction

mission. analysis

takes so long what does this do as far as working on a second generation EREP that could be put on future spacecraft either manned or unmanned? WILMARTH All right, I think the answer to that is that is that we intend to get, as I indicated in July, a very quick status of where we are and what wetve accomplished.

SL-IV PCI31-K/2 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 And from that I'm sure that we will be able to - to give a a rather firm understanding of what kind of - of sensors; let's say what our EREP sensers have dene. That was one of the major objectives of what we tried to get done here. In other words, how useful is the 13 channel scanner? How useful is the 190 B with a 30 meter resolution capability, or the co2er IR, which may or may not be a - a total total picture. But we certainly will have at that time the utility of the microwave data. Those those PI's have really gone to work and we will have that data available certainly. So we will have a considerable amount. Now with the 192, of course that presents a different problem. Okay. PAO Bill. QUERY Dr. Wilmarth, could you tell us in what way that - did Skylab prove that you need men to operate these instruments or could you take the same instruments and use them on - on ERTS. And do you have any if it does prove that you need men up there can you give us specific of how or why? WILMARTH We - the fact that man was there, they were already flying Skylab, and of course, we came on at a - at a very late date to get our EREP sensors on board. So the concept of Skylab was already established. During SL-IV the the crew did observe and did use their options to turn on and turn off and plan some of the the data taking for to optimize the collection of data with the - with the sensors. Now in direct responce to your question, there is no doubt but what some of the sensors can be operated remotely. The - whether the man is needed or not, of course, is depending upon whether there is a need to change out film or something of this sort. No_ some of the results of the altimeter data analysis are being used by federal agencies to determine the utility or the shape, size specifications of the sensors on board a - a GOC microwave satellite. QUERY So in other words, Skylab IV then didn't definitely prove that you need men up there to make Earth resources observations. WILMARTH We did - from an EREP standpoint, the sensors probably can he designed - developed so that there is not a need for a man. But I think that one of the - the things that we did prove is that that utility of the sensors and operational capability of the sensors with the capability of chan_nR as we did on on the SL-IV the 192 detector did optimize the - the utility of that sensor and that data. And again I go to the visual observations where they did obtain some rather interesting and heretofore new data on various of the ocean phenomena.

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31-K/3 13:03





QUERY Will the data from those snow and ice studies be available to - to the PI's in time to provide them _ith information they can check out on agriculture and flood control. I presume that has to be this year. WILMARTH Yes, we are planning right now the distribution of the SL-IV data by May. Certainly all of the optical data will be distributed by May. Processing of the 192 is going to be delayed as I said we won't start that probably until May itself. But all of the other data will be processed and distributed. PAO Howard. QUERY WILMARTH QUERY What is the problem We've got a (garble) Was it all the way with the S192? of the noise problem. throuzh all three

flights? WILMARTH It's worse in the early 192 and it gets better in the 193, and we haven't looked at the 194. Although the data that we did get on the EDDU or the downlink data that you've already seem here indicated that the data are really very good. So, it's a - it's a kind of kind the of hand - hand PI requirements. PAO cultured It's Paul. a processing of the rather complicated data to gadget. meet

QUERY Did you recover all the data that you lost through the - because of the absence of filters during several passes early in Skylab IV? WILMARTH We are - at the present time we have processed the color for the 190-A of the first ten - eleven passes that we took, and that's good. We have not - we have not proces processed any of the other channels or any other camer8 stations until we see a little more experimentation on it. But we are - we don't see any reasons - any problem in trying to process it. We know that the color is very good. PAO Louis. for QUERY the insturments, in But concerning you lost four the design passes on and SL-II procedures because

one step alignment. in SI-IV

calibration had been omitted And you lost a few passes or because the filters were omitted.

or or align partially lost them Are you satisfied that guess else you can send

that you can design machines and procedures up on ERTS that will he alright? WILMARTH Yeah, I guess we are I that. I mean it's - it's Just like anythin_ got the wouldn't asking? time have and the money that kind of you could s problem, probably Louie,

we can do if you've it so you what you'le

design is that

SL-IV PCI31-K/4 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 QUERY me refine Yes, l_ttle but now let's, if you don't bit. Art Hill was talking mind, about




quick look or you telling about a qu_ck look so that you could get your second generation equipment recommended for a - an upcoming ERTS flight. Do you think that - WILMARTH Do you mean for the ERTS-B_ is that what your talking. QUERY Yes sir. Are you satisfied that you can make recommendations for that? WILMARTH I would say that from the July conference that that probably is relatively very late in trying to get any inputs into the ERTS-B. If that's the question you're asking I didn't understand that one. No I thought you were talking about shuttle and beyond, right. But as far as ERTS-B that's set in concrete as far as 1 kncw. END OF TAPE

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31L/I 13:03 CDT

WILMARTH Relatively very late in trying to get any inputs into the ERTS-B. If that's the question you're asking, Art, I didn't understand that one. No, I thought you were talkin_ about Shuttle and beycnd, right. But as far as ERTS-B, that's set in concrete as far as I knew. PAO Jim Malloy. QUERY What phenGmenon were they trying to detect or shoot when tbey were taking pictures of Russian launching sites? WILMARTH Well, I Just don't know the answer to that one myself. No, I really don't. I knew they took some handheld over Russia, but QUER_ Who requested that they shoot them? WILMARTH Is that ERTS is that ERTS satsl-. lite? We did take the Gobi Desert sand dune study photography on SL-IV, but on - not on any that I kncw of EREP we dldn't do any EREP data, and I'm sure they didn't do any handbeld over the Russian launch sites. If they took any, that was probably done by the ERTS unmanned satellite out of Goddard. At least, I don't know the answer to that. PAO Okay. then? WILMARTH Dom't ask me, I don't - you're the expert, (Laughter) PAO Okay, Dick, thank ycu very much. Next we have Dr. Jack Eddy of the High Altitude Observatory who'll discuss the ATM and solar science. Jim was reading Jack Anderson. EDDY I'm here representing the six experiments on the ATM from five organi2ations and I guess, I'ii list them for you quickly, since I'm not a part of any of them_ and I want to make sure they're properly credited. It's the ultraviolet spectroheliograph of Harvard College Observatory, the X-ray telescope of the American Science and Engineering Company, the X-ray telescope of NASA, Marshall Space Flight Center, the white light coronagraph of High Altitude Observatory, the extreme untraviolet spectroheliograph and ultraviolet spectrograph of the Naval Research Labaratory. QUERY Can we have your name? EDDY Yeab, it's Jack Eddy, I'm from the High Altitude Observatory. I've been called in as sort of a neutral arbitor to give you a summary of the solar results from SL-IV. Speaking on behalf, I think more of the solar physics community than the principal investigators, so I hope I'Ii have your answers. I want to give you a few highlights of SL-IV then a very quick summary of the entire mission anticipating your questions, which I understand comes which is, "what do we know now that we didn't know last May about the Sun?" And finally, I want to have time for questions. As was explained to you earlier today, the

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31L/2 IB:03 CDT

experimental film is a long way from being ready. The - all of the experimenters I have talked to just within the last few heurs can report that the film is partly processed. All but one have begun processing; none has completed processing. So I - they haven't seem for the most part their data, let alone being ready to give me any pictures to show you, so I don_t have ary mew pictures for you as you were told. That always makes me thing of the - being put in the position of Snow White in that movie where she sang "Someday My Prince Will Come", but they're not here today. I can say that they are all immensely satisfied with the results of SL-IV as they are with the whole mission, with the performance of the astronauts and with the performance of the instruments. And I woulG remird you that these telescopes that are on the ATM are as complex as any that man has ever turned on the sky, and I think that's true from tbe ground or from orbit. So it _s really quite amazing. And in this case, SL-IV is unique in that the mission was finished with all systems operating and going strong, There were no disabling failures in SL-IV. There is a partial one _n SO54 that was cured, and I_ii mention that one in a minute, but the mission was fin£shed with everything going strong. This included the five extra eamerssp which were taken up for this missio_, which made possible an extra 25,000 pictures. And again to give you an idea Qf how this thing was pushed to the very bitter end_ I got the report from Bob MeQueen on experiment SO52 last Friday, that in the films that they got back, their roll - their one magazine of film is 650 feet, or about 8000 frames, on the supply spoo_ that wss broepht back with one foot of unused film. So_ it was really squeezed out unt_l the last. I think thetis what the sports testers call extra effort, and I think _t's really something. The picture count, l_m not supposed to tell you, I guess, the total numLer, but it ccmes out to. be about 600 a day over the 9 months ef the mission. And that is something when you also realize that each of these Fictures _s the stale of the &rt. It's as good as any thet has been taken_ and I think that's really somethin_. The highlights of SL-IV as I see them are these: one, the observation of tbe trapsit of Mercury on the 10th of November. thmt was just be£ore the manned phase of this last mission. When the planet moves across the disk of the Sum, it appemrs, of course, as a very t_ny dot there. It's diametel is only l0 arc seconds, which comes out to be, in our earlier press release, 1/400,000 the size ef the Sun. As it mcves across it appears as sort of a dot. When it goes across_ here is a picture, that's all I've got to do is hold it up where you call see Mercury here, here, here, here, here,

SL-IV Time: 2/21A74 here, little

PCI31L/3 13:03 CDT

here, dot

and here

here. across

If I turn the disk

it rightslde of the Sun. the of

up, Here

it's that we see it line has

actually moving out, of magnesium -X. So

backlighted by the observation

corona in this that phenomenon

to be a highlight. It help astronomy in two ways, one is by hacklighting the planet illuminating it from the rear, it gives you a chance to probe the planetts atmosphere. Doctor Reeves told me this noon about the progress of that analysis. He does see the gradient of an atmosphere on Mercury in the ultraviolet_ and that's kind of an exciting thing that we can see that distance small object*s atmosphere. He can also analyze and he_s it helps resolution it then by looking at the spectrum not ready to give us that result. astronomy is in solar physics. limit of the instruments that College limit of spectroheliograph. the Harvard College in more detail, The second way It extends the observe it. In this As you recall, limit is about

_ase the Harvard the resolution five - END OF TAPE

SL-IV TIME: 2121/74

PcI3i-M/I 13:03 CDT


EDDY physics.


- - Second extends the

way it helps astromony is resolution limit of the


instruments that observe it; in spectroheliograph. As you recall that Harvard College instrument corresponds to roughly a featured surface of By watchinK the Sun, a very fixed small

this case Harvard College the resolution limit of is about 5 arc seconds which 2000 miles across on the

by the optics of the telescopes. object this one move across in into giving you a finer it covers and uncovers. see features down to about 1 arc second on the that, to say on represent the disk sort of detail watching this go draw on that

time, you can actually trick optics picture of the Sun by watching what And in this way, they were able to 1/5 that size or 400 miles across,

surface of the Sun. To give you an idea of a room this wide, if you would let the room of the diameter of the disc of the Sun, the that Dr. Reeves and the Harvard group see by by corresponds to a dot as small as I could

board. About a tenth of an inch, in 20 feet so you're really lookln R at fine detail. And sure enough, when he looked in fine detail in the ultraviolet, there was a structure of it that size on the Sun. That's Just been the history of our study of the Sun. The finer you look it, the more fine detail is there, The Mer - transit of Mercury occurrs about 16 times per century. The last one that occured was in 1970, the one before that was in 1960. They don_t always come out every 6 years llke that so we were Skylab very lucky was up, and that more one than of them occurred during the that we were very fortunate


time that

there were clever enough technicians and support to point the telescope just right during the unmanned phase, to capture this thing, as it goes along. Other astromoners by the way use transits of Mercury to look at fine detail. That technique had been done before, but never in the ultraviolet. Certainly a transit of mercury had never been observed before in the ultraviolet. The second feature, an annual eclipse of the Sun was observed on Christmas Eve, the 24th of December, while the instrument was in the man mode. The it's not an complete ecllspe as seen from the ground. Still a ring of the i Sun appears if you were right on the band of Tataoudi (?) tower i which happened to stretch across the South America. It was observed by Skylab on 6 orbits. The Skylab vehicle forces an eclipse of the Sun by moving around so fast_ so you actually change the geometry faster than nature gives you this eclipse. So on the film records of this phenomenon you see the moon on the downllnk records; the film hasn't been looked at yet. Moving through the corona, well down into

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74 down

PCI31-M/2 13:03












So this phenomenon was observed. That's two eclipses that Skylab observed in 9 months which is this one and the other being on June 30th on the unmanned mode. That's more than we normally get in a year. Once again we were fortunate; we can't take credit for their production at all. Just to make an interesting contrast to you in that, on June 30th, the unmanned Skylab observed an eclipse. On December 24th, the manned Skylab observed an eclipse in the Sun with three men up there operating it. For each of those, hundreds in the case of Africa; thousands of scientists, went off to Africa to see the same things in the atmosphere that the Skylab astronauts were looking at, the chromosphere and the corona. And fairly expensive expedition if you will, by ships, by airplanes, by every way. The people on the ground got a chance to see them for a couple of minutes. In the case of the South American eclipse is an annualar eclispe; they couldn't see the corona. In Africa, a very long eclipse, they got 7 minutes of viewing time. The Skylab was up there watching it every pass. And all the time in between those two esclipses. I think it says something about cost effectiveness here, we ought to think about. Maybe IVll get a chance to talk about it later. The third highlight of the thing was the observation of the famous infamous Comet Kohoutek, about which we'll here more in the next report. I want to say why the observations of that comet by the white light coronagraph many comets and he watches into the Sun. But at some is, whether it is bright as advertised, you lose it in that man has thought about as it gets,close - it's most are unique. Man has observed them as close as he can as they come point, no matter how bright a comet advertised or not as bright as the glare of the Sun. And one way many times of watching the comet interestin_ part of this orbit is


by the use of a coronagraph and indeed this has been tried in the past. The weather has stopped us; the atmospheric scattering has stopped us. This is one time, when it didn't stop us according to the downlink pictures anyway. And I think, again, the test development of the H-AD film shows that it's going to be as good as expected. I will make a prediction that the when that picture becomes available to you, and I'm just awfully sorry that it's not available to anybody today, but I'll predict and not having seen it, that it _s goin_ to restore a little bit of the lost glory to Comet Kohoutek. I think it's going to be exciting part of the pull solar Sun. to see that Sun. As it as comet as experiences it moves this the 16 and in to it's horrendous hottest million it watched closest gravitational of of go the the out.

of the Sun radiation. And Skylab

it passes through It was there within it go there

blast miles it


SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PCI31M/3 13:03


That's twice as be a first too, a middle class A fourth mission

close as Mercury. the first time man comet come that close

I think thatVs got has ever watched a to the Sun and

to comet out



again. on this

highlight, and Just in general, is that the ATM instruments observed a number of


spectacular solar features which Itm not going to you now other than to mention the very large llmb that was I think, that has not mean that our that

list for prominence

seen on December 18 and 19. Estimates at the time, still stand: that it probably was as large as any been seen in the last quarter century. That may it's the largest since then. It probably tells observations of the llmb of the Sun haven't been for 25 years. Secondly, the complete observation


of at least one flare sequence from start to end, you know, all wavelengths, and a very dynamic limb event on January 13 and 14. The real importance of these isn't that it or was the that we largest even prominence that we saw by to a or so solar number that much it of was a it in bright time. flare I

think the real importance complete coverage of it

physics is of (garble)

that we have instruments

trained on it, operating simultaneously, programmed as cleverly as we can to do it. It's really an organized onslaught on these rare occurences. I would ask you too to think about the comparison between Skylab and say, the International Geophysical Year. If you remember about 16 years ago in 1957 when one of the aims of that was to get complete coverage of dynamic phenomena on the Sun. And for this purpose chains of station were set up around the Earth with hydrogen-alpha telescopes and any other instruments they could to try to be (garble) to catch events like this. Indeed, they caught some but they were limited in how much of it they could see. They could only see Just one layer of the chromoshpere. You may also remember that back in the International Geophysical Year there was a thrust to try to find out whether flares had any ultraviolet or important? We know only 16 years ago, X-ray emission. An@ if now that it is terrible we didn't know if it was to see in rockets the the and warning they were_ important there at Caribbean all sorts net to was but all. with of give us it And

in that case we sent the Navy ships and rockets, baloon-borne eloborate things. Once again


a warning of when they would occur. When to be starting, the rocket were sent off was there X-ray or ultraviolet emission. thwarted by the communication When they tried to report so the ships couldnlt here

the flare was reported to try to find out Some of that was a flare. was disturbed out that there

problem come up in it, out the ionoshpere it. But they did find

SL-IV PCI31M/4 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74













we are looking at them in grave detail over the entire ultraviolet and X-ray spectrum and that is a tremendous advance. An overview of Skylab as a whole, quickly and the reason I put that on the board was just to remind you of where we start in the solar cycle and that's the very roughly drawn count END OF TAPE


__! j_ i _

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31N/I 13:03 CDT

EDDY spectrum, of Skylab

and as a

that whole


to the just a quickly

entire untravlolet tremendous advance. 9 and the reason I we are in of Sun spot of time, the one remember

and X-ray An overview put that on the solar cycle, number as the last maximum before that the that, maximum

the board was to remind thatVs the very roughly astronomers define it. is in 1947, 1969, the one before you know all that.

you of where drawn count As a function that, You may

1958, not

there in 1958 at the time of the GY was - was the highest every observed, about 200. And that with the Skylab mission coming, most of us were pretty pessimistic about what sort of activity we were going to see. The extrapolated number there, you see, goes down to a Sun spot count of like 20 or 30 durln R this period of time; that's a monthly average number, but it could be zero on many days. And I think that's what people sort of feared would happe_ during this mission. I'm next going to show you a plot, it1"s the second viewgraph_ the one thatts not colored or not bound, which is a magnification of the solar cycle during the Skylab mission. This is a - yeah, - this is on this decllnln_ phase, but look how good the Sun was to us. Here's the same scale that's over on the board there. Here


100, the height of the last Sun spot maximum, here's 130, and 50, and down here's zero. Launch of SL-II was back here way over to the left. The first mission I1ve colored in in green to show what happened to Sun spot number during those 28 days. You see we went through a minimum and a maximum during this checkout period. The second, SL-III misslon_ occurred here and data were we be so taken lucky. in manned This was operation over this range. when - time came when the How Sun could

spot number went up to just about to 130 at a time when we expected the Sun spot cycle to be tailing off towards zero. Again, this happens as fluctuations most of the time throughout the solar cycle. But for this, the jump up that high and give us the picture of a really active Sun has just got to be something we should really be thankful for. The next part of the mission, and if we can slide that over Just a little bit, I think there's a little more information here. This is the SL-IV time period. As you notice, the overall envelope is coming down, so during this last mission, the solar activity was a great deal and we see here this phenomenon that was reported to you in which people like Nell Scheeley and all who are - and Joe who are in on this Sun mission had two operation faces. It knew was very well, presenting and that was that the to us a very hot and

active face and then a very quiet face. Here's a period of six days when the Sun spot count was zero_ another period of six days when - four days when it was zero, and inbetween, a very active other hemisphere of the Sun. So, if we had been able to program the Sun to produce some activity for us during Skylab,

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31N/2 13:03 CDT

I don't think I the way it came was considerably all know that. know now that we

would have programmed it much different than out. But we do see that overall the activity lower during this last mission; I think you And that ts all for that slide. What do we didn't know about the Sun before? About the

structure of the solar atmosphere, we now have a record in all wavelengths of the temperature and density of the solar atmosphere. I should say, at all heights. WavelenEths are directly related to heights in the atmosphere. By making observations of the Sun not only when it's active, but when it's quiet, we can build up this data and, therefore, a model of the quiet and active Sun. Those results are the ones that you're going to have to wait quite a long time think, a complete set of data to About flares, we have a complete and a wavelength picture of these mentioned that in our status now for. But we do have now, I go into that - that model. picture now - a time picture dynamic events, and I just as compared to what it was_

say, I0 years ago. About the corona, we had looked at the corona in X-rays before, but never with this kind of detail, and never - never day after day. We know for sure now that it's complete folly to talk about the corona as being a million degrees, or a certain density, or a certain anything. It seems to be so changin K and fluctuating. In the X-ray region, it seems pretty clear now that we can classify as our next step of approximation, the corona as being: corona holes where there doesn't seem to be any corona; active regions where the corona is very hot, and the residue of active regions. It's very startlin_ new knowledge of the corona that we didn't know all before and couldn't have know before, is in the shape the that Sun, and at and

chan_es in the solar corona as it's seen in white light, is, distribution of electrons in the outer corona of the through the coronagraph. And there, too, you have to stop think about the effort that mankind has gone to over the to of to see it. you the corona to You've heard again that we try to build these numbers have roughly up just before, one a few but let a

years to try observations me give them year. during like well over that year, works


The average length of time that we can see the corona an ec - total eclispe, is about 2 minutes. That means, 2 minutes a year that anyone of us has, if he's lucky and funded enough to see them. By combinin_ peoples observations the length of _ the Earth over which an eclispe is seen, observation period can be extended to maybe an hour per And that out okay. Is if So, everybody that's a works hundred together and everything hours per century. That that when SL-II splashed had on board more pictures had up to that point. And

says that if everythin_ goes right, down on the very first mission, they of the corona than mankind had ever

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74 that since terms that thin_

PCI31N/3 13:03 CDT











many - literally thousands of years before Christ. In of records of it, we'd never had that kind of record, and is kind of a gee-whiz number, too. The really important is not that wetve got so many thousand pictures of the we_ve and And got them in a time sequence over intelligently thought out way, so that is the other thin_ about the We for days didntt didn't know have before any Skylab, idea how a that we corona -

corona_ but that regularly planned watch it change.

that the Sun, we certainly is how much it chanKes. chanKed tryin_ Naval tkere carried really i especially to find that out Obseryatory a few and found out to was

and that the corona

the outer corona. And man's been many years. I was just at the ago looking through some old stuff experiment was corona chan_ed. station one in for China, that and between Well,

that in 1886, an elaborate try to find out whether the by settin_ of that whether whether The out. up year - by they one ecllspe in Russia,

And this particular trying these guess Chinese to two

done eclispe

find out stations

comparin_ the pictures could detect any chanKe. was clear, series of

what happened? was clouded

Russian ecllspe That started a

the thln_s

and this experiment never have been able looked for transient these have seem them transients

has been tried many, many times, but we to detect any change. People have also features in the corona, and although at by You're slide, radio techniques, we could never well familiar with the coronal if I can have that now, reminds That - a better of dreamed of, of, we kind of

been hinted optically. - the small those, - that never

you of one of focus_ I hope but certainly

this sort seen.

one is from SL-III. of thing was sort If it was dreamed

had the hope that if there really were those thln_s there, maybe we_d see one. And Dr. McQueen tells me that they've seen literally scores of them durin_ this mission. You're lookln_ at probably one of the best ones taken in August,


they're numbered llke that, and you've been given those pictures before. Thatts a complete surprlse. I think if I were to say finally, what is the most important sln_le accomplishment of the Skylab ATM solar experiment package, it's this, that's it'S shown the power of this way of looking at the Sun - END OF TAPE

s -Iv P¢-131-0/i
TIME: 2/21/74 EDDY I think if I were to say, finally, what is the most important single accomplishment of the Skylab ATM solar experiment package it's this: That it's shown the power of this way of looking at the Sun; this coordinated attack method. Of all astronomical objects, you must concur that the one is the most important to man is the Sun. Even though it's easy to see out the window, when you really stop and think about it, it's almost audacious to think that we could be able to really look at it in great detail and understand it in detail, by techniques that the previous group up here called remote sensing. Looking at something thatts 100 million miles away and to really think that we could conquer it in the way that we think that we're getting to now. I think of it, the comparison of Skylab and say, the single experiment approach or the single experimenter this great problem, I think a good David and Goliath_ We're attacking we've gone from squad, where we at once and this this have has approach in terms of simile is sort of like a big thing. And in to literally all trained It's been a firing upon it done, by attacking Skylab, 13:03 CDT

slingshot stage elaborate things really paid off.

the the

way, over the feelings was the best way to do doubters are convinced

of many of us about whether that it and whether it would work. But among the scientist; it's not only

the principal investigators in solar physics who are rejoicing, itts the entire solar physics community because they're all folded into it. And last_ once more let me say, the role of the astronaut, I just dontt think thereVs any doubt about that in made it another anybody's mind that that go, Each experiment was by astronaut intervention. was the thing that really salvaged at one time or By pinning the door that

had locked shut, by removing foreign material that had fallen on the coronagraph occulting disc, by reaching in, as they did durinK this mission, with a screwdriver at hand to turn the filter wheel that was Jammed in the wrong position. Each of these experimenters told me that he felt genuinely that the thing that snatched victory from defeat was having the astronaut there. And thatts not saying anything about the way they directed the experiment, conferred with the ground, help decide what to look at. I wish you could see a movie that I saw just a few days ago, which was a quick run-through of the hydrogen alpha pictures of the Sun on, I believe it was the second mission. So here you see a very accelerated picture of activity on the Sun. Over Just a few minutes, you see the Sun zip by and change rapidly as this was made into a movie. Astronomers have done this before, too. But the thing that impressed you here, the crosshairs of the pointed

SL-IV PC131-0/2 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/2k/74 cluster were on there. And as the Sun came around and anything active came around, zip, there went the crosshairs right to it. And if somethin_ else didn't show up here and up they would go. And there was a record that just was terrible impressive about how they were taking every target of opportunity. They, I mean the people that were here controllin_ on the ground and the astronauts up there. But nothin_ was missed. I can't imagine anything more efficent than that operation in astronomy. You start to see somethin_ and as an astronomer, you'd picked it out. That looks a little interestin_ and the next thing you knew the crosshair was on and by golly, they got it. I think that was the story of the mission. PAO Dr. Eddy, thank you. If you have a question, please wait for the mike. Bill, microphone. QUERY Have you had any better idea or feeling as to what causes flares and how the corona receded from below to such a high level? EDDY You're really on to the right questions and I don't think that I can say we've now answered either of those questions. We have the data to answer them now, in time and in spectral coverage, Those are certainly two important questions to be asked from these data. QUERY And you feel you can't answer them right now? EDDY I think the data is there to answer them, yes. PAO In the back. QUERY Probably miss it on my own tape_ Going beyond those equations which I know will be a few years, Dr. Eddy, can you tell us who will be usin_ that data? And what he will be using to figure out with it? Such as magenetic storms or electr - radioactive - radio storms, l_m sorry. EDDY Yeah. First part of the question: Who will be using that data? There are five experiment groups but each of them has allied experiments literally around the world. I don't know what the total number is; hundreds of cooperating institutions. To give you an the way they'll look at it in terms of Earth look very hard at the data now for things in that we're now getting an idea are the areas out and effect the Sun. In particular these holes where we think the solar wind flows out and can be then extrapolated on to the Earth. identifyin_ these in a very clear way now in like in the AS and E data. We also see them coronagraph data and in the ultraviolet data. example of effects, we'll the corona, that extend on are now coronal much faster We'll be the X-ray pictures in the white light And these will

!i ii_i

SL-IV PC131-O/3 TIME: 13:03 CDRT 2/21/74 be on linked with interplanatary observations and the Earth to try to establish a correlation. with observations Does this

really coincide with something that happened on Earth, giving a given lag-time. That sort of approach. That will be used terrestrial effect applications. I think one thing here that the Skylab has done too is let us look at the outer atmosphere of the magnetic field that seems to control the emissions that leave the Sun and reach the Earth. And in the X-ray pictures of the corona and the white light pictures, we see this magnetic field map for the first time. PAO Well, if you have no more questions, Dr. Eddy thank you very much. We'll move on now to Mr. William Snoddyp Marshall spaceflight center was the Skylab Kohoutek project scientist. Before we move on we have a change in plans for tonight. A change in room numbers, so pick them up here. SNODDY Let's get the important things first. SNODDY I'm afraid that as far as showing you results, we do indeed suffer from the snow white syndrome that we mentioned awhile ago. We depend on, for our Kohoutek results, on ATM and on the corrollary instruments and as you just learned, the ATM data is not really available yet. And the corollary is, that Dr. Parker referred to, that data is only now becomin_ available. I have some information about how it's looking, say I would say directly from the darkroom and I'ii mention that as we go along. Dick Wilmarth mentioned that ERFP was a little bit late getting on Skylab. Well, I think Kohoutek is really a new comer considering the fact that it wasn't discovered until, I think it was ii months ago. And the fact that a comet of this size and it still is a very nice comet so far as comets are concerned, did come alon_ at this time is indeed a very delightful prospect. This is the first time that a comet has ever been discovered so far away from the Sun. That is 9 months away in time. First time it's ever happened and it may never happen again. Had it not been discovered just at the time that it was discovered due to orbital considerations and so forth, it would not have been discovered until possiblt last October or very likely, last October. So we were very, very fortunate to have this opportunity and I think it's a real testimony to the flexibility of the Skylab type operation that we were able to take as full advantage as we think we have taken of this opportunity, The comets are a little bit llke the Sun in that they are dynamic objects. And in order to understand them you need to have synoptic data take over a period of time, preferably with as broad a range of instrument as possible.

SL-IV PC131-O/4 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 Because they tend to show up unannounced from directions - from completely random directions that it's almost impossible to have any kind of logically planned program. That again is why this particular comet has been an opportunity. END OF TAPE

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31-P/I 13:03 CDT

SNODDY almost impossible to program, That aRain such an opportunity. a dynamic is, where the comet. materials And so you






have any kind of logically planned is why this particular comet has been We - and you need to get the data over you want to understand what a comet where it's going, the whole life of in towards the Sun the different made much boil off at different of what material is rates. there at

range because it came from, As it comes that need and what made

which it is to see how from this it is that of. What

what time, determine comet is mentioned October. to as a several

you can work backwards and try to the comet is the nucleus of the is the model of the comet? Bob Parker a Kohoutek meeting in is a - a the one he referred was previously scheduled be in October. I'm sure

that we planned to have That particular meeting IAU meeting on comets that years ago to -and it will

there will be a lot of Kohoutek papers at the meeting. But it's become apparent that there are so many observations by so many different groups that there is a real need for a symposium just on Kohoutek. And this is bein_ looked into and it may be that we will have such a symposium perhaps as early as April - as May of this year. And at that time then we'll we really really begin accomplished. to see what It's like a what Jigsaw sort of puzzle, things each

observation with each instrument is one piece of the puzzle. At at the May meeting, if we have it then, all these pictures of puzzle will be brought out and then the fun will begin of tryln_ to fit them together and see what kind of model or what kind of picture we come up with. I want to - I dontt have - have anything in the way of Skylab results yet. I do have somethin_ we'll come to in a minute. Let me do a brief, shall we say, summary discussion of what we think we've accomplished using just a few viewgraphs here. Can I have the first one please? This is a viewgraph that I_ve used down at the Cape prior to the launch that showed the kind of operation we wanted to carry out. I agree with Dr. Parker the number of frames sometimes don't mean a lot. But in the case of looking at something number So this like of is a comet where you want to watch it evolve, do mean something. the observational our wildest opportunities dream, the sort

of thln_s we thought we might come close to carring out. We had a minimum program that we wanted to carry out that was less than probably half this extensive. You see the various instruments on the left there, the corollary instruments and ATM instruments. And then the times when we would llke to is have call observed if our - called at all possible. our intensified This is program. the And thing the this next

SL-IV PCI31-P/2 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 viewgraph shows you how we did compared to that. The red dots are the actual observations that were made, And just without trying to count anything you can see that we came real close to almost reaching our dream program. Better numbers are shown on the next viewgraph, summary numbers which list the different instruments. The ATM is grouped together down here. And these are the observational opportunities. And this is the minimum for the mission requirment document based on what we felt like would make sense in terms of the scientific program. This is the intensified extended intensified program where we tried to cover the entire range of Skylab IV mission, And with intensified observations, this is the kind of thing - our dream program shall we say, and this is what we actually what we accomplished. And in almost every case we came - certainly exceed the minimum in almost every case and came close to the intensified. I think when we consider what was envolved in carting out these observations, the fact that the spacecraft had to be maneuvered in a manner that they had really had not given much consideration to before - The the timing was very tricky because the comet always set just before the Sun or rose just before the Sun. So you had to be careful of the Sun in the case of the corollary instruments. You had pointing problems to worry with; you didn't have much you didn't always have a bright star handy to use as a reference back when the comet was extremely dim at the early and late part of the missions. And just procedures in general and all of these sort of things I think is just rather miraculous that we are able to carry out that much of our planned program. Let me say a little bit about the brightness of the comet, if I could have the next viewgraph. This just shows you sort of thing that we were working with here in trying to understand. What we have here is brightness of the comet in stellar magnitudes along this scale here. And to give you some idea of what this mean I've plotted the brightest stars are along here. Jupiter resently was about this brightness. Venus was up here, the full Moon was up there. The dimmest star, which was on here but got left off, is down here around sixth maKnitude, about right in here. Then we have time along here just in time nearest perihelion. And these are theoretical curves that have taken into consideration the distance from the Earth to comet because the nearer you are to the comet the brighter it would appear, And the distance from the comet to the Sun, because as the comet comes near the Sun the brighter the comet appears, So these curves have taken that into

I !jl:

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31-P/3 13:03 CDT

consideration usually used

and there in trying

are two to fit a

basic comet.

parameters One is

that are this index


here which has to do with the rate at which up as it approaches the Sun, and you see a Different comets seems to follow different quite shifted ness, understood up and a constant

it brighten family of curves. curves, it's not can be brightthis case family data. This

why. And then this whole family down based on a kind of an intrinsic that's added to the formula. In of up 5. and So you have down to fit were using One of the that you observations to this the

the constant has the value of curves and you shift it

is ground based observations that we understand what Kohoutek was doing. that we might point out is the scatter ground based observations. And these filtered is people by the called Smithsonian in their for they Astrophysical observations this felt

to try to first things get in these were That who They in and

Observatory. Smithsonlan

is a clearing turned fed us

house what

sort of information. to be the most reliable

best observations based on their past experience. So you can see the kind of scatter you get. And you can see at this - even in early December it's awfully difficult based on what you have here to say for sure what the thing is going to do. So it is it still appeared though that it would fall - we shifted the curves up and down so that most of them fell with in this range of - of values. And it still appeared htat following the - in the perihelion and the first part of January where the vls - the ground based observation would be the best - you can see it's nearer the Earth_ so this side of the curve is higher than this side - that we should be up in here comparable to the brighter stars and perhaps even brighter if you - you know dreamed a little bit and thought you were on one of those upper curves there perhaps. So even as late as the toward the middle of December it looked llke that we would still have a very nice visual object in the January sky. That's what the Smithsonian was predicting and we saw no reason to quarrel with them. Following perihelion is the - the thing has it has dropped off and more rapidly than even the lowest of these curves. This is not understood really why. There has been quite a bit of speculation on it. Perhaps as we gather more and more information on this, this will become more apparent to us, a reason for this will be understood. But it is very quite in - in the past I think more typically if they change at all they tend to get brighter rather than dimmer after they pass through perihelion. Although that is not always the rule, certainly. So this is there is Just a lot that we dontt understand about comets, I guess, is one thing this thing proves. And nevertheless, the

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31-P/4 13:03 CDT

the fact that it was not and as we had all hoped attractive comet to say

as bright as the that it would be, the least. And I

public had expected it's still a very think the next made in New and the Univer14, this little a half a degree

viewgraph which is a ground based observation Mexico by a - an observatory run by Goddard sity of New Mexico. This was made on January circle here is the size of the Moon, thatls

just to give you an idea of scale. You see the two tails here. The - I hope you can see it. The straight one here is the gas tail we talk about made up of ionized particles that are blown back by the solar wind, the low energy protons from the Sun. And then this fuzzier one here that's kind of curved to the left or up I should say is the dust tail, which is made up of small particles on the average of less than 1 micron in size. And they are blown back primarily by the sunlight itself, the solar photons. So this comet is an interesting comet. It does have these features. It's been studied by a tremendous number of techniques and astronomically speaking it's an exciting object. One of this type - END OF TAPE

"-i HE: ii_:

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31Q/I 13:03 CDT


SNODDY does have


- so this comment features; it's been

is an interesting comment. studied by a tremendous it's an according to However, the

number of techniques and astronomically speaking, excitin£ object. One of this type does show up Smithsonian about every 2 to 5 years, perhaps.

trick is that they generally don't show up in time for you to do anything about them. Comet Bennett, for example, which was the last big comet of this type which came in 1970, I believe it was the last one, was only discovered, I believe, 2 to 3 months, I forget the exact time, prior to perihelion. So, that's more normally the case, you don't have any warning. Suddenly, they're there and therets Just no time to gear up any kind of good well-rounded program, You need that synergism that you get from a number of instruments all doing their thing. And with this one, we think we_ve got it. So it'll be extremely interesting to see how - what we learned from all these different results. Let me go on now to the next viewgraph. This is one of the - this is the viewgraph of the photograph of the TV screen of the downlink of the sketches that the astronauts did. This one in particular was done the day after perihelion. From that we've reconstructed - we had to get airbrush drawing. And if we could have the next viewgraft, which is a first attempt to try to reconstruct the comet as they saw it on these particular days. They were the only ones making able to make these observations as it was so near the Sun. This is about call it, passed second side, 10 days a very before graceful it got object. to the This Sun when was one it was day after as they it


nearest the Sun, this was as it appeared EVA. You see, this tail has swung around as it went pass the Sun, and leaving this on colors

during their to the other spike which theory you are in the

is probably there all the time dependin_ use to explain it. And then there are original drawing and the red and either the kind

hich that

that don't show up too well here, the orange so forth which are thought to have to do with of material or with the thermal effects or

things of this sort. In the comet then, this is 2 days after, 4 days after, 7 days after, and then back out here. And normally, on the ground, you would only see this observation and maybe that one. Actually, you'd be lucky to get that near the Sun with observations. You would miss all this entirely. So, for the first time - this is the first time this sort of thing has ever been seen that near the Sun. Welre quite excited just over these visual observations. Maury Dubin, who's head of the Commentary Office of NASA headquarters has said that this probably constitutes one of the best scientific papers to come out of this Kohoutek/Skylab program, Just these visual observations in themselves. I might mention one other thinz, too, that's kind of interesting is the spike remained there

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31Q/2 13:03 CDT

if you'd allow me to briefly try to explain this thing. Some of the an_les aren't quite right on this. We now know more than we did at the time that we put this thin_ together. One thing, when we reversed it to try to get it pointed right in respect to the Sun, we reversed it one time too many, and the obtuse angle - this angle here - this tail here should be more up. In other words, if you could just swap these two angles, you'd have a more accurate situation of what they really observed. But in effect, what happened is, this is the heavier material that was in the orbital plane that was following the comet. And prior to perihelion, the tail of the comet was also following the comet as it came towards the Sun. So the tail of the comet, more or less the dust tail, made up of much lighter - smaller particles tended to mask this spike of heavier material. This material here is probably less than one micron in size on the average. This material here is probably greater than i0 microns in size. But they are both materials are here, you just can't tell the heavier from the lighter because they overlap each other. After it went past the Sun, the solar pressure of the light blew the lighter particles so that the tail now, the long graceful tail, is ahead of the nucleus of the comet; whereas, these heavier particles are still trailing it, and so they now stay revealed, so to speak. This has now been confirmed. At the time these sketches first came down, we misinterpreted this. We here - some of the people here working on this data, thinking that this was more of an injection of material or else it was a - a - the old tail looping way around, and this was the tail way out somewhere and not heavier particles close in. We now have confirmation that what I just told you is probably the correct story because there has been infrared observations that were made on the ground which indicated this region to be hotter than this region, even though this is nearer the Sun, the Sun is down here. This region is hotter than that. And that's explained by the fact that these less the one micron size particles, and that's where the particle size comes from, is you explain this being hotter by assuming that the particles are very small, less the one micron. Therefore, they are not efficient radiators at the 8 or I0 micron wavelenKth they would like to radiate the energy they're absorbing by the Sun. Not being efficient radiators, they tend to get hotter, whereas these particles - this is more near the (garble) temperature, therefore, you'd tend to think that these particles must be at least the size of the radiation they're trying to radiate, therefore, they must be i0 microns or greater. That would - also explains why these have been blown that way and and these are remaining back here. But you need this combination of, for example, the ground based infrared versus the visual to really

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31Q/3 13:03 CDT













think that's Just one real quick example of that. The - oh, yeah, one other interestinK thing, too, is that this spike here would naturally become dimmer as it moved further away. Even though, as it got further away from the Sun, ground based observatories with the long time exposures similar to the one you saw just a little bit And in fact, observations increasingly has started surprise to is into in the previous slide, were still of spike. And in fact, it's still I learned yesterday with Smithsonlan able to pick up being seen. that recent

have shown that the spike, instead of becomin_ dimmer as it moves further away from the Sun, becoming brighter again. And that came as a real them. I don't know if that means that more material from Just the what nucleus and it means. to is But is that only a falling was an the an now, says, day before interby the as far magnlthis

is coming loose this region, or

unexpected yesterday

phenomena that or so. So, this even still now. plenty they more

they learned continues It's about bright. - they get times dimmer gives a run over

about remain

esting object way, which is as they're tudes_ a very and day. I'll

9th magnitude Smlthsonian excited than summary - some

concerned, thousand or

over Kohoutek

15th is

The last viewgraft just quickly try to

of the of them

highlights are sem-i

redundant, if you'll pardon that. term coverage of the evolutionary first observation of any sort was the last one on February the 3rd. of the scora pi the star Pi-Scorpio

But we do have - the long development all the way, our made on November the 23rd, We observed the occultation by the comet. And I'Ii

verbalize most of these for the benefit of the people that aren't here to read it. By SO19, that data was taken. We hope, here, that some of the material in the comet will show up in absorption, that doesn't normally show up in emission. In other words, it will absorb the light of the star and we can tell what the material star looks different we can tell a little is by the fact that the light from the when seen through the comet and, therefore, bit more abo_t what the comet is made of we hope, with quite interesting. that sort. We referred to that

by using this technique. We got our imagery, T025 on December 25 and 29th; that should be to compare that with the astronaut views and got the ATM synoptic coverage and Jack Eddy

a while ago I wontt need to say any more about that except that I think you could tell that they were quite excited about it and I think that _s typical of most of the PIs that got data on the comet. We got imagery with the $201 of the hydrogen cloud development, and that has been done. This data is available; stand the be glvin_ it's just the just will be results becoming available, and I underastronauts some of showing that of this, but tomorrow. it looks They'll good.

SL-IV Time: 2/21174

PCI31Q/4 13:0B CDT

We have the photometric development. Just used the little Nikon camera where they took a couple of shots, one or two shots a day of the comet, --isible eye, Just to get this - instead of a big scatter of data, we hope we have a nice smooth - not smooch, necessarily, but a nice curve where we can see how the brighthess does vary and and really nail down, at least for one comet, exactly what it did do in terms of brightness. How much of those jlg_les we see are real and how much are just due to ground base error of one sort or another. Then we have the OH cloud that we think END OF TAPE

SL-IV PCI31R/I TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 SNODDY - - on this. How much of those Jiggles we see are real and how much are Just due to ground-base error of one sort or another. Then we have the OH cloud that we think we got with these instruments here. I see I want to mention back up here on S019, I talked to the PI about ii o'clock this morning, literally Just out of the darkroom and they were very delighted. They say they have beautiful data with S019 on the comet, lots of spectral ]ines. And of course they haven't had a chance to do anything with it yet because we're literally Just developing films so that's real good. The other data that's being developed right now this - today, tomorrow over the weekend, we'll know a lot more next week than we do now. Do you think we got spectrograph observations over an extended period? We know we've got the S019 information. We got some Lyman Alpha data from S055. On S082 A and B, I understand from them they have processed their data and it looks like maybe the results from that is going to be marginal at best. There may not be much information there. But we do have the spectral information from S019 anyway. And again S082B, we apparently may not have information here. This is probably premature to say for sure until we get a better look at the data. The astronaut observations and your periheloun, I've already talked about. They were the first to detect that antitail and kind of alert people to the fact that it was there. We may have got data w_en the comet passed through the orbital plain or when the Earth passed through the comet's orbital plain. We got the S052 information. Again, these timelapse observations, that should be quite nice. We may have gotten some extra imagery This would be pretty much a long shot. We -that would depend probably on there being an X-ray event on the Sun which would then excite the comet's nucleus and it in turn would floresce in the X-ray region. We don't know whether this occurred while we were looking at the comet wlth these instruments or not because the Comet was on the backside of the Sun and the X-ray event would have to be on the back side of the Sun, and we have no way of knowing whether there was one at the time we were taking these exposures or not. The data is not yet available for us. Then last and probably most important of all is Just the fact that we have recorded similar summary observations with the sounding rockets and the spacecraft, ground base observatories. We -copernicus for example only the OAO 3, I believe it is. We were only able to observe Kohoutek when it is at least 60 degrees away from the Sun. And the first time it has been 60 degrees away from the Sun, I believe is on February 28, I'm sorry, January the 28. So it could not start it's observations until then. But it's observing

SL-IV PCI31R/2 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 in some of the same spectral regions that ATM has been observing. Of course that overlapped real nice and we have the ATM data up until that point and then we pick up with Copernicus and it's continuing to observe right now. And will do so up until the middle of March or so at which time I believe the comet again comes back in towards the Sun at least along the line towards the Sun. So they're going to have to quit observing at that time. So we optimistically we have a lot of good information and we're just real anxious to see if indeed we do or not. I think that about covers it. PAO Okay, Bill, we have questions? QUERY Yeah, Bill you said that the Kohoutek was a very attractive comet at the least and were you ever able to see it with the naked eye? SNODDY Me, personally? I've stood next to guys here in Houston who said they saw it but I'm nearsighted and I have trouble seeing a lot of stars actually even but QUERY Did you see it through binoculars or anything else? SNODDY Oh yes, a number of time. When I was in Huntsville once for about January the 10th or so, I took my wife out and it was just very easy to observe. She found it with no difficulty, once I told here where to look, you know, she could tell it had a tail and which way it was pointing and that sort of thing. But yon had to kind of know what yon were looking for. It was a fuzzy kind of thing. And if you look for something like you saw that picture then that's not what you would see, you know, with the naked eye. And there were quite a few of people who did see it with the naked eye. In fact some guy claimed he saw it with his naked eye just a few days ago, still. And apparently this fellow PAO (Garble) SNODDY Beg your pardon. And this is relayed to me Smithsonian when I was talking with him. They said that this guy has a record of being able to see tremendously well. But - and - But there were quite a few people who did see with a naked eye, especially some of the guys here who the astronauts and so on that flew up. Karl Henize saw it a number of times when we went above the clouds in his plane jet and made seketches of it and things of this sort. PA0 Howard, and then Bill. QUERY Dr. Eddy said the picture is near perihelium should be spectacular, what are we likely to see in those pictures? you'd SNODDY see something You'll see - you like that series should - I would expect that I had in the sketches



SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PC 131R/3 13:03 CDT

there much

where behind

it it it it.

would start and then as around to You might That's the comets.

out probably it got near

with the the Sun. the

tall The

pretty tall tall so of place of

would move to effect and the interested

the other see the one reason Because

side as interaction the they

Sun begins between the

corona. in

solar are

people are good probes take events

the Sun's environments. in the tail. And these various remember I think types. It the range they yeah

And maybe

we may see relatable See this they had data out

turbulances to coronal spike develop. the data but to that point.

you may over which they had

I don't You develop. missed

should see the tall move around and I would think you should. Any other there particularly. QUERY Not really. SNODDY Okay. QUERY new about the SNODDY results yet because say from that the the radio comets

this spike actually points that I have

Bill, is there anythin_ structure and composition I guess the - from the we don't have that much up

as yet of the not from yet to

that you comets? Skylab see but guess than


observations, are made

it's now confirmed, I of more exotic materials

had originally been thought by a lot of people. they are indeed probaly formed way out in the our solar system if not captured by the solar And/are very likely examples of the primordial

This implies extreme region system even. material that


the solar system was originally made of because of this having been formed that far out. And therefore, that kind of gives weight to the idea that they formed that far out and they are out there and this comet may have been formed at the time the solar system was and this is the first time this orbit has been perturbed such that it came in near the Sun. That may be one of the reasons to as much as we thought. We thought have something to do with the fact that that that it didn't that must it seems brighten up surely to be such

a new comet in the sense of it first approaching the Sun. Perhaps there is a frozen layer of' hydrogen gas on these new comets that contain dust for example. And an older comet llke gas; new Haley's comet it would have comet perhaps away one with wouldn't already there is have this frozen layer of hydrogen been evaporated away. But in a as it comes in and starts to

evaporate where this associated comet. at that

at great distances llke out near Jupiter was discovered. You then have the dust this left as a kind of a halo around the not so much solar pressure to blow it just sort of han_s around this and halo away accummulates

There's distance

SL-IV PCI31R/4 TIME: 13.:03 CDT 2/21/74 and so when the Sun hits it, it reflects off of this dust and makes it appear a lot larger than you normally expect the comet to appear at that _reat distance. This is the kind of various people have talked about this sort of mechanism perhaps explaining it. There was also a recent study that was done I understand, I don't believe it's been published yet, but there seems to be a relationship about how active the Sun is and how bright a comet becomes as it comes in toward the Sun. And the Sun was very quiet so perhaps we had a very new comet approach and a relatively quiet Sun and that sort of thing has been talked about. PAO Abby. QUERY What new information or understanding do you have of comets from the sketches of the way it behaved right around perihelium? SNODDY Well, I think - there's always been theories about the way these tails should behave depending on the size of the particle and things of this sort. And there have bottles made up of - if the material that's coming off has such a range of partical sizes then you would get a tail of this END OF TAPE

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31S/I 13103 CDT

SNODDY - about the way these tails should behave depending on the size of the particles and things of this sort, and there have been bottles made up of if the - if the material that coming off has such a range of particle sizes then you'd get a tail of this behavior and it would interact with the Sun in such a fashion, and as long as comets are way away from the Sun, then all material tends to behave sort of the same way. It's only when you're really near that you begin to get this differentiation in particle sizes and things of that sort. And so I think the crew's observations will really allow the theoreticians to refine their models in terms of this tail behavior - development and behavior in terms of the particle sizes and in terms of the rate at which these particles are produced. This - the same kind of information that SO52 is expected to give us also. And so I think this confirms well, I think it's it's that in that it allows us the first time that observations have been made this near the Sun, where it's really easy to begin to sort out these different kinds of of thinking about the size particles and the distributions of them and the way they would behave. QUERY What is the model then of the way they behave? SNODDY Well. it's it - it depends on the rate at which they're produced and the size of them_ for example. Even here, there was some feeling that the spike was caused by very small particles that were - if you imagine the tail dragging behind the comet and then being reformed and making a great big - as you come around the Sun, the tail - the new part of the tail the part that's Just coming off of the nucleus begins to be pushed ahead and you kind of get a U-shaped tail. First it's straight, then it develops a kind of a kink in it, then gradually this kink pulls the whole tail around. And at first, we thought there was some speculation that the spike was made up of the materials at the end of this tail, the very fine material that had not been pulled around yet to the other side of the comet. The old tail, so to speak as opposed to being something else other than that. And so, I think we now with this information about this dynamics and the angles and so forth, we're able to say no, the spike in the infrared observations, the spike is definitely made up of heavier material that is in close to the comet, a material greater than i0 microns in size with - and perhaps it's this kind of material then this kind of material does in - may be proof that this sort of material does come off of comets, and this may explain the development of meteroid streams. You know, there are these streams of meteroid in space and occasionally, the Earth tray passes through one, and you get a meteroid shower.

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PC131S/2 13i03 CDT's been speculated of comets. And maybe we indeed this does seem to

that these streams are the remnants now have direct evidence that be the case. There does seem to be

these heavier particles that are breaking away from comets as they come in near the Sun, and are developing these streams. So, the fact that there are particles this size, I think, is now being proved, whereas, you might some other theories might have it that there aren't any particles this size, they're all very. very small dust things that are - would be blown away in in the - in the tail and eventually blown out of the solar system entirely. OUERY So this is the first direct evidence that particles of this size exist from - come off of comets? SHODDY I - so far as I know, it is, yeah, I think so. PAO Bill Promey? QUERY You said that comets - you concluded that comets are made up of more exotic materials than you expected. What exotic materials? Does that throw out the dirty snowball theory? SHODDY No, that - they are also - it's the frozen gases and so on, and dust, which is the basis of the dirty snowball_ but it was always thought that the frozen gases or not always thought, but it was basically thought that they were made up of primarily water, simple molecules. And now they - the with radio techniques, they've discovered the hydrogen cyanide and so on which is a more complicated molecule. And so - the dirty snowball is much more complex than some people had thought that it probably would he, they didn't expect that you would find these kinds of complex molecules in comets. PAO Okay. Okay, Bill, thank you very much. We have next Bob Bond who will discuss the habitability studies aboard Skylab based on intrepertation of the crew. Ve have a clarlfaction to make on Jim Maloney's question here. I'll ask Brian to pass them out to you. Was it (garble) Denis? Yeah. Before we start, I'd better read this because I'm sure there's a lot of people on line based on Jim Maloney's question (garble) here. Images of the Soviet launch site located at 60 degrees 15 minutes East, 46 de_rees North and called the (Garlbe) have been made usin_ data returned from the Earth resources technology satellite. Both summer and winter images have been released by the NASA Public Affairs Office at Goddard Space Flight Center. One such photo image was reproduced in a recent issue of Aviation Week and Space Technology. The image was produced from data acquired on October 5, 1972. ERTS 1 data is automatically acquired over virtually the entire globe. Only areas near the poles are not viewed by the electronic sensors on the satellite. All photographs from ERTS


SL-IV Time: 2/21/74 data EROS,

PC131S/3 13:03 CDT

are made available Earth Resources

to the Observation

_eneral public System data

through center

the in Siou

Falls, South Dakota. No photography to the best of our knowledge was taken of the Bachinor site by Skylab equipment or crews. No such request or program requirement was issued and no data is expected from either the EREP instruments or from held - handheld cameras on Skylab. So we'll proceed with Bob Bond on habitability studies, Bob. BOND Okay, let me speak to two of the Skylab experiments and M516 crew today, M487 activities habitability malntlnance and crew study. quarters My boss study being the

principal investigator for the former and myself for the later. And rather than harass you with any of the details of why or how particularly the experiments were _enerated and the protocols were developed and the data was gathered, suffice it to say that neither of these two things were experiments in the classical sense of the term, but they were rather something more akin to an operational evaluation. The purpose of which was to gather as much quantitative information as possible and to reduce as much subjective opinion into quantitative engineering terms as possible so that that information could then be used in the design of future vehicles and programs. Methods that we used were basically unobtrusive. We listened a lot and we took as many pictures as we could of the guys doing things in their general order of business. That is we did not stage demostrations particular in there Just for the sake of catching the guy doing a thln_. But preferred really to see the crewmen _enera] work day scheduled llvin_ and workin_ inside

the spacecraft feeling that that would _ive us a much better data point on how a particular item was accomplished. In terms of data we have available film, television solicited voice comments, unsolicited voice comments, ad hoc remarks. Environmental data represents most of the quantitative numerical data that we have in han@ . There was a small kit that we have on board with environmental instruments in it that could he used to - to Bather number type of data. And then we simply talked to the _uys an awful lot when they get back. Go over the film and the pictures with them, _o over the remarks that they made. And help ourselves by getting the responses from them to assess the adequecy of the design of the man machine interface on board the spacecraft. And that particular interface regardlesss of whether it has to do with the creature comfort and experiment and operational element on board the spacecraft is the interface that we're interested in. Now for the convenience of scorekeeplng_ we had divided elements if the you two will experiments and there up are into subcategorles a number of those or so why

SL-IV PC131-S/4 Time: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 don't I for the sake of convenience here today just march down through those elements and give you a sentence or two about what we think the major findings are in each one of them where we think we have a finding. I'll begin with 487 and I'll yell when I make the transition from 487 to 516. In 487, the first element we dealt with we call architecture. END OF TAPE



SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31-T/I 13:03 CDT

BOND finding. I'ii be_in transition from 487 dealt with we called










with 487 and I'ii yell when I make the to 516. In 487 the first element we architecture which had to do with the

_eneral layout of the spacecraft, the manner in which it was put together, the compartmentalizationp dividing the thins up into various compartment for doing business and the basic interior design. There were two basically very different kinds of spacecraft. The workshop was set up in a one _ kind of orientation with a very definite floor a very definite ceilin_ a very definite gravity orientation. The multiple dockins pravity around adapter was orientation the peripkery a cylindrical can without any particular associated with it with things laid out of the cylinder of gettin_ as much in

as you could around the periphery and leaving a path through the middle for the _uyS to traverse. It turned out that maybe it was just a function of the fact that so much time had been spent in the one-g trainer learnin_ how to do business. But never theless, the crewmen tended to orient themselves the same way in the spacecraft even though they were not gravity hindered, as they did in the one-g trainer, and they tended to translate about particularly on the lower deck of the workshop where there was a distinct ceilln_ and floor that could be used for what we call pressure walking where you put your hands on the ceiling and your feet on the floor and bounce between the two as you go along. You can use either the top or the bottom to get your fin_er or toes hooked into to locomote alon_. And they tended to remain in an erect posture, even as they went about the spacecraft. Wetd anticipated there would be a _oldfish in a bowl type of locomotion where you would no head first from point to point. That did not turn out bein_ the predominate mode of locomotion. Nevertheless, on a lot of instances we discovered that it was not dificult for the crewmen to take advantage of zero g nor should it be difficult for us in designin_ other vehicles to take that same advantage of zero g. For instance even though the table in the wardroom was, oriented in a one-g kind of a way and you essentially oriented yourself with respect to the table as you would on the ground, it was not difficult for a _uy to be at that particular station eatinp and have some _uy from upstairs, there was a hole in the floor between the wardroom and the upper deck that was a hatch way there that was removed and left open, to poke his head down with th_ fellow would accustom seemed numerous to through essentially downstairs a 180 yourself to doin_ no particular of that type upside degrees on the difficulty. throughout down and communicate out from what you ground, and that Because of the missions, it

provide instances

SL-IVPCI31-T/2 Time: 13:03 2/21/74


appears to us that it's perfectly feasible to take advantage of the zero-g situation in designing things, but there is no particular reason to try to orient for zero g if one-g is more convenient. That has a lot of implications for the shuttle because the thin_ has to be used in a one-g mode as well as a zero_g mode. It's got to be flown and serviced as an airplane on the ground and used as a spacecraft in orbit. We hope that that will help a lot in designin_ that. Some other interesting things associated with architecture, it appears to be no particular problem to hang a guy up against the wall and have him sleep there. His bed is oriented 90 degrees differently from what he is accustomed to having it, but that seems to he no particular problem, The crew slept very well, the only instance we had of people movinF out of their bedrooms and going other places in the spacecraft were not associated with any kind of phycological disorientation because of sleeping vertically but were associated with the thermal conditions that occurred in the bedroom as the relationship of the spacecraft and the Sun chan_ed from time to time and it got hot in there and they moved out to a cooler place until it cooled off. The - the one interesting point as a final point on architecture the place where you seem to have the most difficulty with running into things and impinging yourself on the structure of the vehicle upon the structure of the vehicle is where you make a transition in the path that youtre traveling, or where you have an openin_ and have to go from one compartment to another, where you chan_e directions essentially and have to go around the corner through an opening or whatever. The body tends to seek a sort of a neutral position in zero g with the legs bent somewhat and as you go through hatches you tend a lot of time to dine up your knees and your toes on the sills. And if there is a place that we ought to put some padding and protection in future vehicles, it's any place where you go through a door or change your direction of travel from one direction to another as you go across a threshold of some sort. Environment was another basic topic that we attempted to investigate. The environment within Skylab turned out to be very pleasant. The temperature, once the initial difficulties were solved with respect to _ too much heat inside and the solar shields were deployed, because very pleasant. It was an odor free enviroment. It was quite quiet if you will, presented no difficulty in terms of noise creation keeping the guys awake at night or anything of that nature. It was relatively dry which created some small problems on in terms of the same kind of difficulty you would experience on the ground in a dry climate, nosebleeds, not violent nosebleeds but a tendency toward

SL-IV Time: 2/21/74

PCI31-T/3 13:03


that direction, hangnails developing scaliness of the skin. A few of those kind of things which you may or not hear about from some of the medics. We attempted

may to do

no evaluation of it. We Just noted it as an artifact and wetll let them do the evaluating. The illumination on board as an emviromental factor was some what marginal. Could have been a good deal brighter places to do business. And there was no particularly noticeable airflow, even though there was an airflow, it was not noticable to the crewmen in terms of creatinp coolness, if you will, llke standing in a cold breeze. It was there and it did move things about inside the spacecraft very nicely, as a matter a nice thing that is and of it. But is was not a that they really noticed was when completely then they is another of fact, I'll mention later what how we hope maybe to take advantage problem for them. The only time that there was any airflow at all wet back taking a out into that shower and were the airstream Mobility there not and


they got themselves dry when they got did notice a major item. bit We

of coolness. discovered

and restraint was tremendous

mobility. There seemed to be no difficulty in _oing from anyplace to any other place getting themselves from point to point or gettinR any other item of equipment from point to point. In terms of what it takes to restrain a fellow to have him do business at any particular workstation, there were numberous items onboard, of restraint, all of which were given a reasonable fair trial, some of which turned out not bein_ very useful at all. For instance the chair that we had at the ATM panel turned out not bein_ a very useful kind of device because it limited the scope of activitiy of the crewmen at that panel. It doesn't take much imagination to, as you sit there, would be if you were think about how much more mobile you restrained only at your feet, could lean

in any direction you wanted, to rather than beinR restrained as you sit in the chair and can only cover whatever you can reach from that sitting position. Let me show you the major item of restraint in Skylab. Let's have that first one now. I_ll show you here the triangle shoe as it interfaces with the grid. device, you close. The I know you've heard a great deal may have never seen one of these shoe is rather bulky and rather about this particular animals up large and rather

heavy in a one-g enviorment. None of those items particularly 5other you in zerorg. It goes through the grid and if you rotate it slightly, it will lock as it is shown on the screen here in t_e locked position. That gives you all the restraint that you you need very to do rigidly business so that at a you particular can exert worksite forces in it mounts any direction.

SL-IV PCI31T/4 TIMEz 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 It holds you there vary nicely, with it was that it took awhile t_e only problem we to accustom yourself discovered to exactly

how you make the interface between the shoe and the grid. You'll notice that the triangle on the shoe is almost as big as the hole that you have to stuff it into. And you have to look in order to see where you are. It was not a thing that could be very easily engaged without looking at what _ou were doing_ On the other handj once there, you were retained very nicely, you did not have to twist your foot and lock it in place, once you put it therep you could leave it ratEer loosely attached and extract it very easily and very readily. There were other devices onboard that we did try towards the end of the last mission and toward the beginning of the first mission that replaced the triangle on the bottom of the shoe, little things that looked some llke an inverted ice-cream cone - mushroom type jobs that is probably a better description, an upside-down mushroom, that would hook underneath the grid was much smaller and would go through the triangle in the grid more readily but would also disengage more readily. Those were not found to be nearly so desirable by the crewmen as the triangle was because the triangle, after a time you got accustomed to it, you were much more readily able to engage it and it gave you the kind of END OF TAPE

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PCI31U/I 13:03



BOND not

found to be

- also nearly

disengage so desirable

more by

readily. the crewman

Those as

the triangle was because the triangle - after a time you _ot accustomed to it you were much more readily able to en_age it and it _ave yon the kind of restraint you would llke to have, the kind that you can engage and not have to think about. You and Let don't have to exert any you can forget all about me show you that device This panel is an during additional it and in work, forces to stay there go about your business. if we can see that second it shows notice A1 that Bean he He

slide now. at the ATM

infllght photograph, his mission. You'll

is restrained has tremendous any point on

only at mobility that ATM

the feet, he is not using the chair. and tremendous scope, he can reach panel. He can reach to the left of

it, he can reach to the right of it. There was nothing that he needed to do business at that panel or in that immediate area that he could not get to with simply the foot restraint engaged and he could engage both feet or one foot as he desired and had tremendous scope and much more so than the limited trainer mobility allowed by doing that the crewmen to

have on the ground_ which was what they had become accustomed to it, the one g situation which is sitting in a chair and front of this same panel. Once in orbit, they found that they could get at things quite easily, that they could not on the ground and it was a plesant surprise to them. It also begins to change our thoughts and ideas about where the design eyepoints should be for designing panels in work stations. We can take advantage of this particular thing to essentially spread out the crewmen's range of mobility and range of cooperation. And we'll have to ogitate awhile on what that might mean to us in terms of how to design the next item, but a bit. Another it increases point that our scope can he made and by our capability looking at this quite

particular picture is in terms of mobility and restraint. Anything on board the spacecraft is vulnerable and eligible to be used as a restraint device, even though it may not have been so designed or intended for that particular kind of use, and the point that we will have to make very strongly with designers of hardware with future spacecraft particularly designers of experiments is that whatever their device is it may be used. used You'll in ways notice that here they that had A1 not intended is holding for himself it to in be

the position that he has chosen there not only by being restrained by his feet, but he's chosen to pull his body back to a particular posture by pulling up on the tray there that is designed to hold down all the paper work that tells him what to do at that panel. There are numberous instances

SL-IV PCI31U/2 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74

in looking at the film and the TV of the guys operating on board Skylab that show them using whatever happens to be available in their path to push off of, initiate motion, stop motion, restrain themselves temporarily, or whatever. And that's a point that must be made very stongly in future designs. This is the first time we had a vehicle large enough for the fellows to move around in and really display this kind of capability. Another major point, moving into maybe the creature comfort area had to do with food and water. For the first time here, we have an open food tray, very similiar to what you might pick up in a cafeteria. And dispersed around the tray is the old system the Apollo system where you have to stick the water gun in, squirt the water in, reconstitute t_e food and eat it with your fingers, _et it all mixed up together and then suck it out through the hole. Therels no question about the fact that that is a far less desirable kind of a system and to simply take the open tray with the utensils and eat it. And the food adhered very nicely to the utensils and there was not much spattering, if you will, about leaving it off the utensils. The major spattering had to do with opening the cans and of any of you have opened these pop top cans know that that "last millimeter or two is the one that gets you. I'm not sure that there is anythin_ we can do about that except catch the drop as it goes by. But that turned out not being a significant problem. It was not difficult to clean up whatever drops or spatters of food were bantered about by doing that. And the system itself turned out being quite nice, quite easy to use. And if we can see the next one now. We see here the first crew, picture taken in the trainer not in flight but the inflight pictures do not look significantly different from this one. If I hadn't told you you probably wouldn't have known the difference. And it presented a very nice kind of a way to do business, the trays had timing devices on them, so that you set up your meal. It's kind of like putting the roaster in the oven and going to do something and when you come back afterwhile, it's all done. You set up the cans in the tray for the next meal, turned on the timer) went away and did your thing and then when you came back and it was time to eat next time and your food was all warm and all you had to do was take the lid off and eat. An_ it presented a nice social situation for everybody to gather around the table to eat and talk about what had happened since the last time. In the world of hygiene, great improvements made here also, if we could see the next one please. There we see once again in the trainer, Paul Weitz is standing in the waste management compartment. By his left hand is the fecal/urine collector system. Down by

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

131U/3 13:03


his left collection

knee are drawers.

the A

three drawers little closer

that back

were to

the urine me is the


washer system. All of these things worked very vast improvement over wet and dry wipe kinds of business. The fecal collector was a tremendous defecatin K in a glove. The guys had no problem in using this system. It functioned very nicely

nicely, were a things to do improvement over whatsoever for them.

It's a great improvement and it ought to be accepted as the baseline way of doing business from now on with whatever improvements we can crank into that system. When, lefts see, yeah when A1 Bean's crew left the spacecraft, they left a calling card for the next crew that was coming up and as you see Paul standing here_ you can't really appreciate the manner in which you would have to use this system until you can see somebody using it, so if we can see the next one, we'll find a way that Jerry Cart's crew found the head as they arrived. The previous guys had stuffed a set of clothes with used and things and mounted the guide in the use position can see him here. That's a little bit different than accustomed to seeing people. 90 degrees different at up linen as you we're least. at the

But that presented no particular least, the one thing that was

problem. complained

Geometrically about most was

fact that we failed to realize that maybe folks woul d like to _o there and read the newspaper llke they do on the ground and the light was overhead. When you get into that position you can't see, you'll block the light out. Okay, we can pull that one down now. And bring the lights back if you want to. Let's hold that last one for a while. Another major area of investigation had to do with housekeeping and we define housekeeping as all of those things you needed to do to keep your ship liveable. The one thing that we discovered is that you must allow time in the time line to do all of those things that on a daily are a basis, number there of are chores other that things must that be accomplished are associated

with changing filters and cleaningscreens housework that can be done periodically upon the time line. The time must be basis to get these chores accomplished. things that happened was for the first

and doing Just general but it does impinge allowed on the daily One of the very nice time we had a nice

forced air system that had fans in the loop that moved things around and kept the air circulating and flowing about inside the spacecraft and there were return vents there Just llke you have in the air conditioning and heating system in your own home. There were filter there that had to be changed or cleaned periodically. The point at which the air was sucked up out of the cabin and transferred back into the system for recycling and redistribution became a collection point for e_erythlng

SL-IV PCI31U/4 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 that got loose in the spacecraft. We would - that was a very nice kind of a thing because you didn't have to particularly worry about anything that you lost control of. If it was some small sort of a thing and you were concerned with about the fact that it might get into your eye or your ear or up your nose as you slept in the evening, it didn't. There was not a reported case in all of the manned hours of Skylab of any of that kind of thing happening. Nothing ever floated into a human orifice inadvertently. These thin_s all migrated to the screens. It was nice to know that because if you lost control of something and you wanted it back, you could go to that screen in a day or so and it would be there. We would like to take advanage of that in future designs by knowing that that happens and knowing that we can go there designing maybe a more easily cleaned system and maybe taking either further advantage of it by - there is enough retention force on those screens and we did do a little bit of experimenting in the last mission by havin_ the guys go to the screen and use it as a place to do business. When you have a great deal of loose paper and you want to update your checklist and write on it and pasting your pages and it would do things like that. When you turn all of those loose things loose zero g they're going to go somewhere, particularly if there's an airflow system that END OF TAPE

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PCI31V/I 13:03



BOND and



_ to

- to do business when update your c_u_cklist

you and

have write

loose on it

and past new pages in it and do things like that, When you turn all of those loose thin_s loose in zero-E, they're going to go somewhere, particularly if there is an airflow system that moves them around. If you can go to a place llke this and not have to stick them or bunse_s_ we can it a nice place to down with tape or lay them out on a do business_ And stick them under sprln_s flat surface, it makes it retains it. There's

enough inward, ne_atlve pressure there if you will to retain them. They tood advantage of tkls and we maybe would llke to try to take advantage of that by concurrently deslgnin_ into the system a worksatlon alon_ with these return air screen so that you can go there and do work, If we can see that last one now. Once the This is sort of a representlve picture some collection of debris. agaln_ an inflight first mission showin_ made on Conrad's of the thin_s that flight on collected

on the screen representive various bits

at the top of the dome, And you can see a group of items, a bolt and nut, a syrln_e, and pieces of paper and debris and dust, a ba_ went Lousma loose place there said from the very he discovered that hun_ smallest one

that was opened. Everythin_ to the very largest. Jack night around in his sleep all the time

he kicked from the

his Jacket he had it

he wore up in his

bedroom and he knew exactly where to go. He hustled up to the screen and there it was. So from the largest to thesmallest item collected on the screen and this photograph bares evidence to the fact that yeah, there is the stuff and it did go there. You can take that one down now_ I have to show you. The final And thatts two or three the last picture items associated

with M487 were in some ways minor, but nevertheless Interestln_ and will have application down stream. For instance, garments is another major item. We discovered in the world of garments that two piece garment is indeed a very good kind of a garment to use and to have on board. It gives you various options of what kind of clothing you will wear. It allows you to adjust to thermal conditions by putting on or takin E off pieces of clothing. The nicest thin E it does,as opposed to the one piece flight coverall is that it allows you to very easy access for personal hyglene chores. You don't have to undress completely in order to Eo to the John. Pockets become much more useful in zero g than they are on the Eround. We lay things on desk_ we put thinss on table, we put them everywhere the ground and they stay there, You cantt do that in a zero g envlorment and the pocket becomes one of the most utile tools probably be available put into to the you. deslgn A good deal of of the Earment thought system on

will for


SL-IV PCI31V/2 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 progarams in order to take full advantage of this and to be sure that all the right kinds of pockets, restraints, et cetera are there to hold the right things and retain them in the right kind of way, allow access without emptying the whole thing. That's another problem, the jack-in-the-box effect in zero g. If you have a large container and you have a single orifice through which you insert and extract items once you open them up and get a hand in there and stir them up and try to extract one without getting the rest of them out you ordinarily discover that you have removed more than you intended to inadvertently, a lot of times, That must be thought about seriously. The garments tended to stay very clean, They got dirty from the inside out, rather than from the outside in, no perspiration predominantly being the thing that soiled the clothing, the undergarments and socks mainly. There was nothing on board to soil from the outside in. The spacecraft had been put into orbit in a clean room kind of a configuration and it pretty much stayed that way. The one thing that the first crew complained most about was the fact that they would have like to have had more underwear and socks so that they could have chan_ed those on a more frequent kind of basis than they did. That was accomodated in the later missions by launching more in the command modules. Communications, IVA communications, person to person inside the spacecraft was another major item. And there was only one thin_ to say about that, it was rather difficult in the low pressure enviornment_ sound did not propogate well, particular sound of voice. And beyond i0 to 15 feet, it was difficult to communicate by a voice without using the intercomm system on board. That problem will probably go away in the shuttle Because it will be a 15 pound cabin and we'll talk just like you and I are talkin_ now. Off duty activity equipment was the final major item investiKated by 487 and of all of the items that were available in the kit on board the one thing that seemed to be used predominantly was the tape recorder for the playing of the cassette music. The other major-offduty item was the window out of which the crews enjoyed immensely looking at the ground. And we have concluded that there ought to be plenty of those availabe for use in future vehicles. In 516, a lot of the areas overlapped with the 487 thin_, there were a few unique items associated with that. Manual dexterity was one of the areas of investigation. What we have concluded is that at least for 85 days, the crewmen dexterity did not de_rade at all. Their ability to manual manipulative chores seemed to be just as keen and sharp at the end of the mission as it was at the beginning of the mission. And the only thin_ that is a problem in that area is when you have a multiple number

_I i_._ _

SL-IV PCI31V/3 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 of small items than trying to the next item, to manage. manage a which was It single mass gives you much more of a problem large item. That gets us into handling and transfer or

cargo moving from place to place. We had anticipated that there might be some difflculty in moving some of the large packases about• It turned out there was no difficulty at all. The crewmen moved all of the large items on board very readily from place to place. What did give them trouble was trying to control or logistically manage multiple small items. They get away from you very easily_ They are hard to corral and get all into one place and when you open whatever the lld is forces they tend imparted to get to them, out of they_ll there. Wlth go somewhere. very very That's small

a problem that we must work on quite a bit, Another major area, in 516 was locomotion which is the same as mass handling and transfer without the mass. It's you going somewhere without taking something with you, somewhat analegous to the mobility and restraint in 487. And once again the major finding there done presents backward, most of his is no that locomotion is problem whatsoever. down, from all Very turn point very easily and readily You can go forwards (garble) Pete There seemed to place needed did be in

upside trips at

flips enroute to point. from were

no difficulty the spacecraft,

in locomotlng small forces

to place within to initiate

locomotion_ and very small forces to stop it at the other end. The final item is maintenance, maintainability. And the major finding here I think is that man is capable of maintaining his spacecraft and all of the hardware in it if glve the proper tools to do business with and given the proper access to whatever it is that has gone wrong. The vehicle itself was maintained in an outstanding manner. As a matter of fact, the program was salvaged through maintenance during the first mission, unscheduled unplanned maintenence as it was. But, nevertheless, the entire program was salavaged by that. A number of the experiments were salvaged onboard by being able to get inside of them, detect what the bug was, and cure the the that that problem. And what we would shuttle program is we take we put the tools on board, we provide a workslte. A recommend to management regarding advantage of this capability that we provide the access work station where the chores capability covers, for Bob,

can 5e done. And take advantage of the guy's doing these things. And I think that probably the major points of the two experiments, PAO Okay, any questions, Bill.


SL-IV PCI31V/4 TIME: 13:03 CDT 2/21/74 QUERY Yeah, on the rec there they included a lot of balls of different sizes and consistency and at least the first crew used them, did the crew take any advantage of those, did they use them at all? BOND Very little, it was a sort of a gee whiz item to pull out and play with, a little bit. We do have some film of the first crew using them. We have no reports of anybody else using them for anything. P 0 ake Carolyn here. QUERY How about the playlnK cards? BOND Playing cards were never used. As it turned out there were restraints on board that were provided for the playing cards which would hold a sinKle hand, a deck diffent kinds of hands for different kinds of games and one use that we found for that was in holding down the checklist for the updates. QUERY In view of what you found out about maintenance and are you going to recommend on that shuttle that there be ways of going EVA in order to make repairs and doinK maintenance? BOND We certainly will. PAO Howard. QUERY On this last fllght_ Bill Pogue did a lot of complaining about the waste management system, about food, about a lot of things that nobody else seemed to complain about throughout the mission. Is that just his individual taste or desires or what, do you have any explanation for that? BOND Well, we approached the think I guess by saying that we had nine crewmen and in order to get the consensus we tried to add up all the comments and divide by 9, if we end up with 3 siKma data point we may treat it that way. There was an awful lot subjective individual opinion associated with the manner in which we were forced to do business. Most of our data came back bein_ suggestive and the difficulty we're having now is convertinK the subjective data into objective data. A lot of what we did was to ask questions and ask for evaluations onboard given an opportunity to express an opinion about how it could have been done better or what was wrong with it. Most of the guys took advantage of the opportunity. PAO Abby. QUERY There was some talk that the sleeping arranKement, they were too close to each other, so when anybody turned over_ the other person heard them and the same with the voice management system, just for the noise, are you planninK to do anything about that?

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PCI31V/5 13:03











conceived today, there is no place in that vehicle to go to get away from other people so we will probably attempt to lightproof and soundproof the sleeping arrangements as much as possible with privacy curtains or some sort of sound and light Skylab buffer crewmen PAO QUERY that in the washln_ and facilities. you the between that people. that be Art. Another We done. thing strongly recommend it by all





waste management that face washing facilities Is this goln_ to be to have The this

somehow from done on

you separate the hand your hygiene the next shuttle or are situation of it's on size

still goin_ shuttle? BOND

crowded Just

bathroom because


will probably will probably do business. management opposed size. to

be more crowded be more severe We'll be reduced compartment the one in

than Skylab was. in terms of volume to something like a commercial may be three

The constraints available to a waste airliner. four times As that

the size of Skylab which

PAO Abby. QUERY How, in the architecture in, say, planning a future space station, would you separate the sleepln_ compartment much more from the bathroom Just from this noise point of view, would you separate, have individual sleeping compartments? Is the noise that bad? BOND Given enough room to do that kind of business, yes, I think we would try to get those kinds of thln_s as far apart as possible. The problem with Skylab it was a common wall between the bedroom and the bathroom the equipment made noise when it was operated. ways of reducln K the noise in the equipment, be able to separate physical the two facilities other. There however from was and

may be you may each

PAO Abby. BOND Did they play darts? The last two crews? BOND I thought you'd never ask. They played with the darts. Just out of sheer curiosity the aerodynamlclsts amon_ them were intrigued by why did the darts tumble and not go right. They made larger fins and taped them on, cut the fins out of the carboard on the checklist and attached them to the darts and the vehicle QUERY BOND QUERY BOND sure enough that you when you got enouzh surface to are flying it flew pretty well. Who did that SL-IV? Three_ Three. Yeah. control

SL-IV TIME: 2/21/74

PCI31V/6 13:03



PAO million

For miles with

those Skylab

of and

you the

who rest

have of

traveled us, we thank in the briefing morning will

you. Tomorrow in the large be ASTP next

is the crew auditorium. spring, thank

conference The next you very

at 9 premission much.












SL IV - Postfli_ht Crew Johnson Space Center February 22, 1974 9:15 CDT



Participants: Lieutenant Colonel Jerry Carr, Dr. Ed Gibson, Science Pilot Colonel Bill Pogue, Pilot Jack Riley, PAO Commander


SL-IV PCI32-A/I Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 PAO Good morning. The Skylab IV crew is here today to tell you something about their mission, show you some pictures. I think most of you know these _entlemen but for the record, we'll reintroduce them. At least two of them look a little bit differently than they did when they returned to Earth. From your left, the mission Commander, Lieutenant Colonel Jerry Carr; next to him, Science Pilot, Dr. Ed Gibson: and on the end, the Pilot, Colonel Bill Pogue. Colonel Carr. CARR Thank you. I think first off, I'll just bring up the _reat reentry crisis. As you all know, we had a ring problem with propellants and the helium _ases that pressurize the tank and heaped on top of that, we ended up with a configuration problem. Essentially what happened is, we - we pulled four circuit breakers just prior to separation and just after we had tested out all of our engines. And the four breakers we pulled were near the right four breakers we should've pulled and in the fury of getting all our marbles gathered up and everything straight for the loss of the secondary ring, the plumbing - redudant plumbing system that had failed, in our haste in preparing for that, we essentially just pulled the wron_ four breakers. And so when we separated, we had that long moment of silence as I twittled the hand controller and nothin_ happened. And our hearts fell and our eyeballs popped, but we immediately moved to our next line of defense, you might say, which was in accordance with the training that we've gotten and we moved on to our direct system which is essentially a second set of wirin_ that _oes to the - to the engines and used those and from then, all from then on, all worry was _one. It was just more of puzzlement as to how in the world that had happened because we had just got finished testing those engines out. And I had a very stron_ hunch at the time that it was a procedural problem and we couldn't find it. And so rather than make any big thin_ of it on the _round, I wanted to find out the facts first. I asked the fellows here at JSC to try to see if they could ferret out the reason why we had the problem. And sure enough as I had suspected, it was a procedural problem and but at no time did we feel that we were in any great sweat. I will admit there was an instant of stark realization that we were - something was amiss. But thanks to good reliability design, we had plenty of redundancy and we had new trenches to fall back to and it was just no problem at all. When we got to the actual reentry attitude, I was able to give it back to the computer and it did a magnificent job of flying us right to the target point. So, so much for the reentry. I'll be glad to field any questions later on on this thing that you might want to ask. But I think that pretty well covers it. Bill, why don't you give them a little overview on the medical situation.

SL-IV Time: 2/22/74

PCI32-A/2 09:15 CDT


POGUE flight

Of to maintain

course, physical

we worked condition.

pretty We

hard during thought at

the time condition. we - when optimistic

during the However, they and

flight there

that we were in good physical is always a doubt. On the ship things started looking to look optimistic. protocol this is concerned. very We

started the tests, they have continued

just completed another long medical at least as far as that blood test

morning And although

our the hemoglobin level is down in all three of us, it's still above what could be the normal average range in - in individuals. We feel well. We're running again and aside from very, very minor things which we've very dutifully reported, just maybe a sore calf here, and maybe knee joints a little bit sensitive there, a little bit of lower back sensitivity, we're in _reat shape and it - mainly, itls just a manner of having thing which feel this sort of consciously make yourself aware of anyin order to be able to report anything to the medics, is of course, the desirable position to be in. We great and I don't way know how we look. Anyway, we're dethe medical test Ed, why don't you results have fill them in come out. a little

lighted with the CARR bit on the ATM.

GIBSON Okay. went fairly nominal except pleased with. First, was END OF TAPE

The mission itself in terms of ATM for two events which we were very a very


__L-IVPCI32_B./i TIME: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 CARR





- - fill


in a little



the ATM.

GIBSON Okay, the mission itself in terms of ATM went fairly nominal except for two events which we were very pleased with. First was a very bright coronal transient. I was satisfied with this for two reasons; first is it exemplified the type of coordination which we've developed between the ground team and the people in flight. One of the observatories on board - one of the observatories on the ground picked up a prominence which was lifting off the limb. That's a fairly high-density material right above the limb of the Sun, and reported it in to the people here at Mission Control which sent it up to us, and with in a matter of minutes then we were able to get the ATM instruments on it. It showed up on board, looking at the corona of the Sun which is the region right around the Sun, the atmosphere of the Sun, showed up as a very bright spearhead of material moving away from the Sun out - I wouldn't say it was heading directly toward the region of the Earth, but it could in some instances. What I'm trying to imply is that there was an awful lot of material thrown off the Sun in one instance which all went into the solar wind which eventually arrives here at Earth. So, from that standpoint the scientific interest plus the coordination that was - really worked well. I was very happy with that event. Second one is the flare which we did get. We did get a couple of flares, and so did other missions, but I think from the previous missions we were able to determine what is the optimum way to use the instruments which we had on board in order to get the rise of a flare. The reason we're after that, of course, is that all the action takes place in the early minute or two of a flare and then from there on it's just a decay of what's taken place. It's essentially an explosion, if you will, on the Sun. A lot of energy is released, and the whole aim here is to determine what happens in those initial few minutes so you can understand how the explosion takes place and be able to better predict it and maybe even, to some degree, use that same technique in applications down here. We were able to look an active region which we could tell by its pulse rate; its pulse rate was up, if you will, the energy which was being emitted from it was coming out very sporadically in rather large quantities, that it was about to flare. And we just stood on it and waited until we had an indication on one of our displays that it was just at the very early stages of going off and luckily we were on the right spot at the right time and got everything going. So, I think we probably got the early rise of a flare and that we were very interested in

SL-IV TIME: 2/22/74

PCI32B/2 09:15


seeing how the results is which we continued the ATM using a lot of developed in we were able

came ou't. on was the onboard

The third aspect nominal operations which has

of the of been



the previous to advance a

two missions little bit.

and which we hope There's a lot of

interesting data going to tell us CARR

which when all put together, I think, is a lot about our own energy source. Okay, and now it's show-and-tell time.

We would like to show you some of our home movies; some of our pictures that we took. We're going to start off with some - I believe some Kohoutek work and then an ATM pizture. And then, not because it's of any greater importance than the others, but it's pictures we got back first, and that's a lot of the visual observations and Earth resources photography that we took. We - we've picked some pretty good examples here, we believe, of the various areas in which we were interested. And we'll each one and try to give of them. So you a if we little can go bit of a blurb ahead and dim along with the lights

get started. CARR These pictures up here are really sketches, and these are essentially renditions done on the ground based on the television pictures they took of the sketches that that Ed made with Bill and I leaning over his shoulder nagging at him when we thought or the wrong line, so Ed, why about that? the GIBSON comet as we saw Okay, the it before he'd don't put you the wrong colo_ in talk a little bit on the left perihelion. just shows There

first one it got to

was not really too much in the way of a dynamic phase to it then. We saw just the coma, the bright region around the nucleus and the tail leading off. We had to use binocalars in order to see any detail at all. We like everybody - END OF TAPE

SL-IV Time: 2/22/74

PC-132C/I 09:15 CDT

GIBSON - - nucleus and the tail leading off. We had to use binoculars in order to see any detail at all. We, like everybody else, were a little disappointed in the brightness of the comet, but once it got down to perihelion and we were able to see it, which is the second frame there, the center frame at the top,then it became very interesting to us_ And the time we first saw this was out EVA. It was rather bright. I know you folks down here didn't get a good chance to view it that way_ but we were out EVA and I had a visor down and looked up at sunset and there it was. And what was so remarkable about it was the spike which came out from the front of it. There are several explanations of this spike, one perhaps which is the best is the dust which had not moved around behind the comet as it swung around the Sun, and it's in the plane of the orbital motion of the comet, so it all appears really like a spike whereas if you were looking at the top it would look more like a fan. But it was very bright to us, it was yellow in appearance, which is not shown there. CARR Yeah, we felt that there was a whole lot more orange in that than what you see in these pictures, in particular those close to perihelion, considerably more orange. GIBSON And it appeared relatively more bright to us for about 2 to 3 days after perihelion. Then as the tail swun_ around so that we were lookin_ more perpendicular to the axis of the tail, essentially its lon_ length became exposed to us, the tail tended to lengthen out and we saw it out to around 7 or 8 de_rees or so at one time. And the spike out in front tended to diminish in intensity and finally disappear as far as what we could see of it. As we went on there we were able to view it quite well up to about a week, week and a half. I think the last sketch I made was up around 9 days after, that's not included here. And we saw the tail become more bluish in appearance, which is characteristic of a gas tail rather than a dust tail. When you look at photographs which were taken with long time exposures, they show both tails existin_ and starting to separate a little bit as you got out maybe 5, 6, to 7 degrees or so away from the nucleus. We never saw that separation. It became very faint as we got out that far, but we were able to distinguish the gas tail itself and its bluish appearance, It all happened ralatively quick, that is in a period of a week or so, and to us it was very beautiful and very dynamic. And I'm sorry that the people down here did not get the same view. CARR I must say that I think the most thrilling think was the day you and I were out EVA, Ed, and you said, "Man, look at that, there it is." And that comet was just

SL-IV Time: 2/22/74

PC-132C/2 09:15 CDT

_orgeous up there was so black and

in the

the sky right near the comet was so brilliant,

Sun. and

And the sk¥ it was just that view eyes it or from well, in that

really a gorgeous sight. It's one of the mission that I think I_ii never forget. GIBSON You know, in order to we had to get dark adapted, that is to some way keep the at it right after wondering where I workstation right little ball tryinE CARR your their crew, eyes PAO GIBSON CARR _ives you at it. I fact, science spike time. I light out for 4 sunset. So the or 5 next

sights really our


minutes before you looked time around Jerry was

was and he found me huddled over in the behind the airlock shroud rolled up in to keep my eyes away from the light. Yes. You begin to have worries and doubts when you find (Laughter) I think we had Okay, Okay, them better huddled keeping just up in on the moving corner

about with

you know, closed.


let's go ahead. this view here

essentially look

a good look don't think

at we was

the other aspects, the other ways to should spend any time on this. In presented that like bottom to go yesterday, one into will those wasn't explain details it, the some in

believe this conference? front if



Yes, you'd

CARR Okay, next: slide. This slide is a very early, early picture we took with the handheld camera. This was the experiment $233, which was the Nikon camera with very sensitive film. And this is Kohoutek in late November when the only way we could we had to make use of fields in order But there, you tail beginning GIBSON data which was data from The only which is END OF even see it essentially was our with binoculars. knowle_e of the And star of a

to get even pointed in the right direction. can see, is Kohoutek with just a little bit to form. Next slide. We do not have any of the photographic brought back from ATM available data which S055. to us yet. see we have is the Harvard the type of experiment, you



SL IV PC-132D/I Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 GIBSON We do not have any of the photographic data, whlch was brought back from the ATM available to us yet. The only data we have is the type of data which you see here, which is from the Harvard experiment, SO55. It was all sent down on telemetry, and therefore it has been able to be processed and put out. What this illustrates is typical of some of the things which we saw on the very limb of the Sun. Right here, we're looking at a line of neon VII in the red - which is shown red here, and this is a loop right above the limb. We've got a mechanical failure here. Let's push the button. Here we go. This and - let's go on to the next slide, I think it will show it better. This shows the higher temperature regions. This is from silicon XII. which is a line - essentially what it means is a silicon atom which has had ii electrons removed, so it is very highly ionized. And it shows the very hot regions of that same area. Next slide, please. Now_ we have a composite of the two, which shows the loop as well as the hot regions - again the red region are the relatively cool areas, or yellow is exceptionally bright. What was important about this is not just how it looks still here, but apparently over a couple of orbits here, this was able to exchange energy between the surface and the loop itself. Material was ejected in a flare at the base, it went up into the loop, came back down along the magnetic field lines, which everything tends to follow on the Sun, back into the feet of the loop, right down there at the surface and caused more flaring, and this energy exchange took place several times. One thing that we hope to determine from ATM is quite a bit about the magnetic fields, and how they in turn put energy into flares very rapidly. This is one thing we don't understand. It's going to be useful for understanding the dynamics on the Sun. How to predict flares, and we may learn a little about energy processes that may be useful to us down here. SPEAKER Okay. CARR Okay. Now this slide shows the Falkland Current. And some time ago, we got briefings from some of the people in the area of oceanography, and they were askin_ us to do what we could to see what could be seen from space, and what could be determined about ocean currents. And talking to a few of the fellows who had flown, I had very grave doubts that we would be able to see much of anything in the way of ocean currents. However, the Falkland Current is one of the most spectacular currents in the world, as far as we can see. The plankton that blooms up, that comes up from the bottom of the sea is a very brilliant green in the Falkland Current. It's a very fluorescent-type green. It seems to come from

SL IV Time: 2/22/74 alon_

PC-132D/2 09:15 CDT











Antarctica_ and around

and it swoops up alon_ the Straights of Magellan the Falkland Islands, and it just runs headlong Current

into the Brazil Current, which is the South Equatorial coming down from the north along the Argentine,Brazilian coast, River, and just off the mouth of the Rio these two currents come together, de la and a

Plata magnificent

eddy pattern is set up. And when you've got all the plankton that you can see here, all the smears you see are real brillian fluorescent green plankton, and it's carried along in the current, and it's just like a - as an aviator would see it sea marker, dye marker in the sea. And it very, very plainly showed us the confluence of these two currents, and we could see exactly how those two currents met, and how they eddied. We passed over the area so many times we could get a day-to-day synoptic view of how the current was changing. Now, the value of this particular picture is is this is one of the times that we saw what is commonly called the red tide, and that's this area right in here. And the red tide is made up of a one-cell organism that is very toxic to shellfish and fish and it's even believed that some of the airborne vapors that come from these red tides have affected people on land, when they've been blown into inhabited areas. The plankton itself, the nice green plankton can see one of the you see, values of is what the observations the fish feed on, so you from space is that is there's got to

you can find plankton, and be fish, a lot of fish. END OF TAPE



i ii r

SL-IV PCI32-E/I Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 CARR the use of observations from space is you can you can find plankton and where the plankton is, there's _ot to be fish, a lot of fish. And the Russians and the Argentinians have done a _reat deal of fish harvesting down here in the Falkland Current. One particular point that this - this picture shows out is the fact that the red tide is almost completely surrounded by the green, life-giving plankton bloom. We've got a lot of pictures of this and they're going to be all released over a period of time. I think that the - this really thrills the oceanographers and to us, it was very interesting. Next picture. Now we took this picture again at - with the purpose of looking at plankton blooms. You can see that light-colored stain there. That's in the water. That's not clouds. There's some light stain right up in here. And we were Just busy giving people all sorts of synoptic data on the plankton blooms and then people began to look at these pictures recently and they said, "Hey, look at this. You've got these cloud streets these little streaks of clouds all going along here which indicate that the wind is blowing" - well, there goes the flashlight. The wind is blowing in this direction. From down here, up into this direction. But they said all of a sudden, you - you know you're forming these nice cloud streets over the water and everything looks good. And then all of a sudden, you get one of these great big empty cells - empty space here with all the cumulus built up on the other side of it. And the oceanographers say, "You know, we think we're Just beginning to discover that there are some things called 'cold-water eddies' in the ocean where cold water is rising from below." It's very, very cold and we think what we've got here is the wind blowing over the normal temperature of water which is a little bit warmer than the air. And so your - by convection, you're buildin_ clouds up. But then all of a sudden, that air goes over this cold eddy right here and nothing happens. You get no clouds, And then when it gets to the other side of the eddy, it runs into that, that warm water again and we set up convection and you build up the big cumulus clouds. So we're beginning to believe that these are what are known as cold water eddies and these eddies are beginning to answer a lot of questions that people are trying to figure out as to just exactly what is the mechanism of energy exchange between the ocean and the atmosphere. Next slide. GIBSON You'll have to work a little hard but I think in the center of the picture to the left, you'll see an island and you'll also see a wave coming off of that, This is a bow wave and it's very much analogous to what you would have in a speedboat. Here's bein_ the island. Here's a

SL-IC Time: 2/22/74

PCI32-E/2 09:15 CDT

series of waves which move off. As you move a boat through the water, you would get a series of bow waves moving off. Now we're moving the island through the water, if you will, or the current past the island and we get a very analogous situation. These waves in the water, were not always apparent close to islands but here where we did have a strong current, it was. This is the island south of New Zealand, the Antipodes Island and we're able to - knowing the speed of propigation of the wave here and the angle which you make back here, you're able to also figure out the speed of the ocean current. This has not been done yet, but it is - should be done quite easily. Also cominB straiBht back from the island - that is _oing from left to right, there is another darker line which you see which is the island wake itself. Not wave, but just the wake of the island. The fact that it's darker) implies to oceanographers that it's a colder region of the ocean, cooler water coming up from below and has led some people to speculate that with this fairly substantial temperature difference, you could Benerate thermal-electric power. People are lookin_ into this - how feasible it is, I couldn't be sure right now. But it sure would make an island like this which depends upon most if its energy for from petroleum imports, it would make it quite self-sufficient. Next slide. Now we're looking at something analogous to a wave that we saw before only now it's formed in the clouds. Here we have the air with the clouds, moving over an island down there in the lower right and a series of waves coming off of it, analogous to the bow waves which we saw in water, here we see the same effects in the clouds. What's remarkable here is the extent of these waves. This picture carries across about 200 miles and I'm sure if we looked a little that. bit harder, we might be That's an exceptionally able large to see a little bit beyond wave pattern and I would people would have also this long distance Also, interesting

have never suspected. that the wave pattern and affect the weather there waves we've back. imposed now, I people time the

I don't think many would propigate for this far downstream.

is if you look up close to the island, you see not only the which are coming off in the same - the bow waves which seen before, but there are some which run almost straight They're very narrow, short wavelength and they're superupon the other waves. This is unexpected don't have a good explanation for that. who have thought a little more about it we did see waves coming we saw Carmen Vortices off islands which is a and right Maybe some do. Most of this of in


when clouds

like series

just circular patterns, spiraling patterns left or counterclockwise and clockwise. see a pattern which was so extensive and

which alternate Very rarely did we so beautiful as this

SL-IV PCI32-E/3 Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 but this was a Food one and it's Foing to be studied a little bit. Next slide, please. POGUE This - this is southern Australia here and we have the city is generally in this Tasmania down to the of Melbourne located right up here. North direction here. 90-mile beach over here, south. The - well there will be a pair

of pictures here and what I would like to call your attention to is the value of the human operator in Fathering data from space. This picture has merit in its own right but the the pair of pictures shows rather _raphically the data that is that can be gathered by a rather spontaneous and on-the-spot action by the human crewmember. If we could see the next slide, please. Yes. Okay. Now you'll notice - if you can recall, the previous slide and this slide, you'll notice again we have the city of Melbourne located just above Prince Charles Bay here I think. I'm having trouble with my pointer. But the - the point here to make is that this picture here gives us the color of the circular bay down in the lower left. The previous slide _ave us a sunFlint pattern. Now the sun,lint pattern will give us a lot of data regarding current flow and water action, silt deposition and the like. The change, of course, from one slide to the next, _ives us comparative data. This slide here is better for total color, tone and shading. The ne - the previous slide with the sunglint on the water, gives us much better an idea of surface texture in water flow patterns. Again, just pointing out the value of an on-the-spot observation and a quick reaction by a human operator. CARR Bill, if you can get that pointer going, would you point out the cultivated area there because I'm going to be POGUE Okay. It's - CARR Referring to that later. POGUE It's up in the upper left, just above the antenna. This is part of our rangeland and agricultural area in southern Australia and CARR And the lower right area there is all cultivated. POGUE The lower riBht area down here, just to the left of 90-mile beach that runs perpendicular, up and down along the left. So we have ranch land and agricultural area in this photograph. And it's not working too well. CARR Do we have any hope for another pointer? POGUE Next slide. CARR Do we have a redundant pointer? CARR Okay. This is - Sakurazima volcano in southern Honshu right here and this was I think the first active volcano we saw. And having been stationed in Japan,


SL-IV Time: 2/22/74

PCI32-E/4 09:15 CDT

_uess I became the resident expert on Japan was always watching for something familiar. over the area and there was old Sakurazima a storm is the one fact day. that And the real you can study it the

in our crew and I Whenever we went just smoking up

value of pictures like this the smoke plume and you can and how it understanding diffuses and spreads. of how that smoke

study how the And the study

wind carries of this and

plume moves around, is very valuable in our studies, our interpretations of how manmade pollutants are - are wind carried. Would you please show the next slide but keep this one ready to flip to if necessary? Now this was taken the next ,Jay and you can see that the smoke plume is gone considerably more. The distance here is about 220 miles from the volcano out here to about as far as you can see the smoke plume. Notice that the smoke plume is still going sort of southeasterly but you notice the southern side of the plume is a very, very sharp line of demarcation and then it's sort of whispy or feathery off to the north, indicating to me that there must be some sort of a wind shear or something there where you've got lower level than upper level winds the upper level winds, north and I think the END OF TAPE winds going in a different direction and when this smoke finally gets into it begins to be swept on up toward the people - -

SL-IV PCI32-F/I TIME: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 CARR - - where you've got lower level winds going in a different direction than upper level winds, and when the smoke finally gets into the upper level winds it begins to be swept on up towards the north. And I think the people in environmental studies are very interested in - in the winds and how smoke is carried. And this smoke here, though it's mostly steam, it does carry a lot of nitrogen and sulphur and carbon dioxide it it. And this I guess, is probably the first picture that was ever taken that shows the complete smoke plume from a volcano. Back to the next slide quickly and then move to the next one after that. You can see there's been considerable - considerably more diffusion in one day's period of time and it's about essentially the same amount of smoke. Okay. GIBSON We're lookin_ here at the South Island, New Zealand. For any of you that are familiar with it, there's a town of Christ Church underneath the clouds over here on the right, and Cape Foulwind up here on the upper left. Manual backup pull through. The prominent feature here that interested us and we were trying to - to gather data on for a long time is the linear feature which runs north-south. This is a fault line, a wrench fault, if you will. What has happened here is the land on the left has moved up relative to the land on the right. This fault line is part of the Circum-Pacific tectonic fault line, or series of faults which runs all around the Pacific. It gives us information on sea floor spreadin_ and continental drift. We were so interested in this because it was able to demonstrate to us as well as other people how obvious some of these faults are from space. Granted you can hoof around and find much of this on the ground but you really can't find the full extent of it and find so many obvious manifestations. For example, the vegetation on the left is much different than it is on the right. It comes about primarily because of the slope of the land is different. You can - let's just take a look at, say this one little stream bed here. It's very narrow here on the right hand side of the fault where the water's running very rapidly; it's a very steep incline. And then down here where the floor is a very gradual slope, it tends to spread out_ and thatts true all the way alon_ here. You can see the direction of the fault movement by seein_ the direction of the channel which has moved this way and then finally up and to the left as you go across the fault. We looked for faults all along in New Zealand. We were very happy to get days like this. There were not too many of them, hut we did get quite a few which were open in New Zealand

SL-IV TIME: 2/22/74 low

PCI32-F/2 09:15 CDT













gotten some fairly substantial space. We did quite a bit of will, especially over southern and so forth. This is a twin very which with.

mapping of the area from searching for faults, if you California, the San Andrea, of San Andrea, if you will,

much like it. And we have a whole host of pictures we brought back which the geologists will be working Next slide, please. POGUE This is a feature that we discovered in

Wisconsin as a circular feature which I'm tracing now with the light here, which was unknown prior to the flight. This is the Mississippi River here. The city of LaCross is located right in here_ Eau Claire, Wisconsin up here, and this is the western tip of Lake Superior. This is approximately 60 miles in diameter. It is interlaced with rivers that run more or less east-west. And I looked this up in an atlas last night and the circular feature does not show up, but you can piece it together by using pieces of rivers and a major road artery that goes around here. So the thing actually does exist. We noticed this because of the snow which provided a relief detection capability. In other words, it just showed up when it had snow on it apparently. This area has three possible port I say, sources of origin. It could be volcanic_ it out because the rocks cantt be volcanic, are not volcanic. so It I threw that could be structural

due to collapse or folding or something like that, and it could be an impact crater. And they were goin_ to - the geologists now are looking into movin_ into this area to try to determine exactly what. It looks like now, probably structural is tile best guess on this. The point here is that this was an unknown structure prior to our flight. It is not just a fictitious thing, it actually exists there, and with it will be looked at. I would like for you to keep this in mind and, in other words, it's not just a point of curiosity, although itts certainly curious in its own right, but it does have a relationship to other features which we saw in orbit. Next slide, please. This circular feature here in the lower right is a - the Manicouagan impact feature in Canada. If down to the south here is Quebec City. The St. Lawrence River runs along in this direction here. And we're we're looking a little 50 miles fairly north bit smaller in diameter, - far north in Canada again. This is than the feature in Wisconsin, about and 45 miles in diameter. It does atlas, although the complete This is known to be of impact way that the rocks have been broken

show up fairly well on an circle cannot be detected. origin and because of the

SL-IV PCI32-F/3 TIME: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 up and mangled and were able to see a you will always be slide, please. CARR so forth. Again the point is that we new feature, and of course, we feel that discovering new things in space. Next Okay, this - this slide is one of many,

many slides that we took, many, many pictures we took showing sand dunes. People are becoming aware of the fact now that sand dunes are not always straight or slightly crescent-shaped and rippley looking things like you see out around Yuma, Arizona and the Sonoran Desert, and out in the Sahara. We're beginning to find that as you look around the world, and as the different wind patterns and geographic features affect sand movement, we find different kinds of sand dunes. And these sand dunes in this particular field are rather star shaped. Every one of these little sand dunes in here, when you look at them very closely in a real good photograph, are star shaped, somewhat like a - somewhat like a five_pointed star. Another very peculiar feature here is that all of these little stars are on chains. If you can follow the direction of the arrow here, I think you can begin to detect rather linear patterns, so you have chains of stars, And this again is very peculiar. We're gathering data and the people from the geological survey who are studying sand dunes are trying to come up with some sort of a rationale as to why sand dunes seem to form in all these strange ways. Another thing that we don_t show very well in this photograph, but we have some excellent photos of it, are the edges of some of these dune fields. One would think that a dune field would come to an end when it hits a river, or when it runs into, say a ridge of mountains or something like that. But you would not expect a dune field to come to an abrupt hault on flat land where there's no geographic nudge, you might say, to cause it to change. And that seems to be the case right here. As best we could see from space, this area where these all these chains just abruptly come to an end is very flat. There doesn't seem to be any logical geographical reason - geological or geographical reason why that string of star dunes should come to an abrupt halt. We saw sand dunes in the Algerian Desert, in the Gobi Desert, the Sahara Desert, the deserts the Kalahari Desert down in southwestern Africa. There are sand dunes in the United States and Mexico, South America. And they're just not the same; they're all different. And the folks from the geological survey are - have alert had alerted us before we left that we should look for all the different types we could find and whereever possibly document them photographically so that they could compare them and try to come

SL-IV 132-F/4 TIME: 09:15 2/22/74


up with some - some answers to these questions. Next slide please. Okay, San Francisco. POGUE Okay, I guess this is mine. Okay, when it's good, it's real good, and when it's bad, it's still good. This is not a particularly good picture for discriminating objects, but it does show the San Andreas fault very graphically. I don't want to dwell on this other than to say that every picture that we get does have value. You have even some snow cover information over here on the right. One of things that we would like to avoid is gettin_ low contrast, like everythin_ here is in shades of blue. But whatever we get we can use. Next slide. END OF TAPE

p .

SL-IV PCI32-G/I Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 CARR - photographically so that they could compare them and try to come up with some some answers to these questions. Next slide, please. Okay. San Francisco. POGUE Okay. When it's good, it's real Rood and when it's bad, it's still good. This is not a particularly good picture for discriminating objects but it does show the San Andreas Fault very graphically. I don't want to dwell on this other than to say that every picture that we get does have value. You have even some snow cover information over here on the right. One of the things that we would like to avoid is gettinR low contrast. Like everythin_ here is in shades of blue. But whatever we get, we can use. Next slide. SPEAKER Okay, Ed. GIBSON This is a slide which is representative of the type of data which we got in the northern part of the Unite_ States, of course, in the the good season for snow cover_ and that's what welre primarily interested in here although we'll show quite a few other things. We're looking at Lake Erie here_ Lake Ontario, the old hometown of Buffalo, New York right there, Niagara Falls, Toronto over here. You can see the sharp, relatively sharp cutoff of snow as you move away from the lakes here. Seems though there's just a belt of snow running from from the lower left to the upper right, from this band right over to here and this is one of the few times that this whole region was wide relatively wide open. We did see on the lakes, a large number of these buildups of clouds as you move across the lakes. For example, here's a good illustration of this. The wind would be blowing from the lower left, pick up a little moisture over the relatively warm_ moist waters of the lake, start to condense it out and then finally when you got over land which was relatively cool, it would really cause it to condense and dump a lot of snow out on the region as it goes across. And that's why the southern and the eastern side of the lakes usually end up with quite a bit of snow. As I shoveled my driveway back there three times in one day, I use to wonder this. Now we also did study the Lake Ontario, especially for ice. Unfortunately, the cloud cover was there most of the time but we did get - manage to get a few pieces of data which I think will show synoptically ho w the ice forms and what its dynamics are. Right now, we've got it fairly early in the mission where there was no ice. Next slide, please. Here's another area which we studied quite a bit for ice. We're lookin_ at the northernmost penninsula of Newfoundland, right here, and the Strait of Bell Isle coming along here, and Quebec. This is of course, a coastline as we move along here and we're looking at the ice which is off to the right here. It's quite interesting

SL-IV Time: 2/22/74

PCI32-G/2 09:15 CDT

to the people who want the flow of ice, as to

to study just how

ice dynamics, this process

formation and takes place.

We got many repetitive passes over this area. This was just about at our highest latitude that we got. We were able to see things quite clearly up to 55 degrees latitude here and be able to see not quite so clearly beyond that. CARR Bill, I think one time you saw the mountains up at Bathan Bay. POGUE Bathan Bay. Way up there north of Hudson Bay, yes. The - there was a good low Sun angle, just at dusk, but you can see a country mile up there and there's no doubt about it. About 1600, I guess in any direction which from lunar distance, it doesn't sound like a whole lot, but still gives you a good view. Of course, the nice thing about it, you'll say, "Why study the ice?" and boy golly, we got a guy come in here and talk to us one mornin_ and we came away ice enthusiasts and converts. It turns out that if you melted all the sea ice here, you'd sink Florida. So that's why this is important. (Laughter) GIBSON This whole area we studied quite a bit right down here is the Gulf of St. Lawrence which there was an awful lot of ice formed on and changed quite dramatically throughout the mission. For the people that are interested in ice, this is brash ice and pancake ice, plumes of it reaching out, mostly wind driven. Next slide please. POGUE Oh - let's see. Trying to get my bearings. I was wonderin_ if this is upside down or not. We're looking at the Rampart Range of the Rockies here. It's right (garb]e) my button. This is the Rampart Range. We have Pikes Peak, Colorado Springs, the United States Air Force Academy, Denver, Colorado, and we have to the north up in here - I can't - this is Greeley. I think this is Cheyenne but I wouldn't stake my reputation on it. Now. This orients you. We have the Platte River, goes back up to the north, that's the South Platte actually. Okay. So we have the Rocky Mountain area here, the value of this photograph is for studies of snow cover which has very important implications as far as our watershed is concerned. In fact, we have the Continental Divide in here and the Continental Divide is roughly right alon_ in here. But this picture is important for two reasons. It shows us the potential for using these photographs for snow cover studies and to be able to analyze our watershed potential. It also shows us some of our shortcomings. For instance, there're a couple of things here that impair our ability I know trees to calcuate snow cover. this area fairly well in in here. And this to some One here is that there's and there're a degrades so lot muchof




SL-IV PCI32-G/3 Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 So let's - we want to study that. Another thing is that you'll see that some of these very deep valleys in here also shadow the snow and make it difficult to use op certain optical techniques for determining snow cover. So we have great potential here. We also see some problem areas and we will be studyin_ those. I would like for you to recall this photograph because later on, we're going to look at an area around Flagstaff, Arizona. I hope we get to that one and I'll show you how we can get around that difficulty. CARR I think another important point in this particular picture too, another value of it is that you can study metropolitan growth. We can see Denver as big as life and you can see how Denver's growing and pictures like this taken over two or three years of - will very, very graphically show you how Denver's growing. POGUE I don't think realize what potential we had for for determining these metropolitan CARR Next slide. that demographers using snow cover areas. This is really photographs excellent.

GIBSON As Jerry mentioned before, one of the things that we can do from orbit is to look at smoke plumes and determine a little bit about how these smoke plumes carry and what you're likely to expect in the way of condensation and dropout from plume from pollution. Here we're lookin_ at some oil well fires off the coast of Louisianna. This is one goin_ off of Marsh Island here and this is on the southern side of Vermilion Bay. This is the Atchafalaya River coming down here into the Atchafalaya Bay. We're able to also see some of the sedimentation and how it's carried, how it's moved out into the Gulf. The smoke plumes themselves, this one is about i00 miles long as shown here and I believe there was some succeeding photographs showing how this thing progressed further out into the Gulf, So it does go for quite a few hundreds of miles. As we looked at it with other wavelengths, I'm sure we'd find the effects far downstream. The wind was quite strong here. You can see by the narrowness of the - both the narrowness and the straightness of the plume itself. We did get quite a few of these, both from - from fires like this, from brush fires over in Africa, we saw quite a few and from pollution sources within our own country. Next slide please. CARR Okay. This is - this is a pretty good indication of a good picture showing agricultural area. This was taken in Australia and what we have here is a dry lake. We have surrounding this dry lake, a lot of very well cultivated areas and you have these areas here which are either burned or we have ground that really isn't suitable for cultivation. One of the thinRs you can do from space, I'm convinced of this is

SL-IV PCI32-G/4 Time; 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 that you can do an excellent job even just visually or with handheld cameras, you can do an excellent job of assessin_ the crops that are being grown down there. If you'll remember early - earlier in the slide presentation, I asked you to remember down around Melbourne, some of those that cultivated area down there. And you see it's a great deal like this one. You can see the very, very stron_ rectilinear pattern. That's cultivation. Ran_eland is also extremely easy to see. You can very definitely and very easily see man's effect on the Earth. When a man puts up a fence, he makes a change down there and just in the way the animals graze. And the way the animals graze, is going to affect the land. We very definitely saw changes in color. When we first got up there in November and December, we looked at the wheat producinE areas of the southern hemisphere which are essentially northwest or southwestern and southeastern Australia and Argentina, south of Buenos Aires, and down around Gulfo de San Juan down - down or San Jorge down below that. But the fact was that in December and in November, the fields were essentially brown which I guess meant that they were - it was early in the season. They were plowed or a laying fallow and had not yet started their growth. By late January, and early February, there was a very definite chan_e in color of all these fields that we could see, especially the wheat fields since they were larger. You could see the different shades of green. You could see the rather chartreuse green of new growth and you could see the very deep rich green of the more mature crops. And photographic coverage of that sort of thin_ in infrared as well as color photography is certainly of great value to man in bein_ able to assess world-wide what the what the wheat crop situation is for a given time. In northern Australia, they were having one heck of a drought and we flew over and took many pictures of the northern Australian drought area and through central Africa, we took many pictures of the drought area there. While we were up there, the northern Australia drought area had a very huge rainfall END OF TAPE

SL IV PC-132H/I Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74

CARR But we feel, since they were larger, you could see the different shades of green. You could see the rather chartreuse green of new _rowth, and you could see the very deep rich green of the more mature crops. And photographic coverage of that sort of thing in infrared as well as color photography is certainly of great value to man in being able to access worldwide what the, say the wheat crop situation is for a given time. In northern Australia they were having one heck of a drought, and we flew over and took many pictures of the northern Australia drought area, and through central Africa, we took many pictures of the drought area there. While we were up there, the northern Australia drought area had a very huge rainfall in a short period of _me, and they had terrible flooding problems. And I think most of you might remember the story that came out about the flooding and everything around the Gulf of Carpenteria. And we _ot some good pictures of that. And it just goes to show you what a - what a disaster a drought can be, because once you have a drought and the foliage dies off, if you _et hit by a bi_ rain, the erosion just wipes you out, ruins your topsoil. And we've got very, very good pictures of all of this from space, which I'm sure that people who are studying these areas are going to find of great value. POGUE Yeah, you engorged rivers 500 miles inland in northeastern Australia. CARR And they're just hauling the silt down and dumping it in the water. You see all that good topsoil just being carried out to sea. Next slide. POGUE Okay. This is mine. POGUE This now, is false color IR_ or color IR, infrared, using the Earth terrain camera. This is the city of Birmingham, Alabama, and it's the this road here is the main road down to Montgomery, which lies on down here, so that north is generally on the left side of the photograph. We've look at faulted, folded, and bent, broken Southern Appalachain Mountains. That's what all of these features are here. The main purpose of this is to show you that we can, by using - and also, you'll notice the false blue color of the bodies of water here. The main purpose here is that by using carefully selected photographic techniques, we can enhance the things we want to look at; we can subdue the things that confuse us, and we can extract the maximum data. Next slide please. we on PAO need to CARR itself. kind of We're beginning to run short excelerate here if we can. up on time_ so


I think this picture pretty much stands here is where it all started. And we a picture where it all started let me point out quickly some anytime interesting

never failed to we got over it.

take But

SL IV Time: 2/22/74

PC-132H/2 09:15 CDT

things about this. how red it is around of all that vegetation vegetation, and it in this area where

This here

is also an on Merritt That's nice more

infrared Island. all rich red. populated,

picture. That's healthy

Notice because



shows up a it becomes

As you _et down you begin to

see the gray areas in between population. There's Cocoa Beach. Right there is Patrick Air Force Base. Another thing that is of value to the meteorological people is the fact that the cloud shadows here are extremely well defined. And it gives them an opportunity from this sort of distance. CARR This is to study cloud Next slide. another photo shapes taken by and the will, a bay forms Earth or here. Bay. River this

terrain camera, and it shows the the amount of sedimentation which

dynamics, if you is carried into

We're looking at the town of Mobile right Here we have two rivers coming together, and the Alabama River come together, move

here, Mobile the Tombigbee down through

river channel, and through many outlets come into the bay here, and eventually on out into the Gulf. The sedimentation motion, I think is well defined here, and we've gotten - we made a fairly concentrated effort to study mouths of rivers and sedimentation flow. And I think we'll have some useful data for the folks who are worried about how the land is redistributed POGIE Arizona here. Peak, the town in this way. Next slide. All right. This is This is meteor craters. of Flagstaff, Arizona and an area This is U.S. 66 the

of northern Humphrey's is comin F

right along in here. I re - referred earlier to the photograph of Denver and told you that the primary value of that photograph was in accessing snow cover. We're looking in an area very close to the Salt Verde Watershed, which is very important in Arizona for obvious reasons. They have to manage their water very carefully. I mentioned the problem we had in avoiding the problems caused by shadows and vegetation and by the use of color infrared. We can partially obviate that problem and get rid - the vegetation will show up as a red in this area, but by using effects total that down other Agua the various techniques, of certain other features we can cancel and come up out with the detrimental a sort of a

picture of the watershed of an area. is the way we handled this one sort of CARR Okay. This is the last

And that's sort of problem. Next slide. slide. This is at is is the and anit

in Baja, California, and what you're looking chance we got to look at a fault, and this Blanca Fault. And you can see it right


goes all the way from the Gulf of California, which here, all the way up and you can just kind of trace a linear pattern all the way to where it drops into

is down sort of the sea.

SL IV PC-132H/3 Time: 09:15 2/22/74 This, by the way, is another little sidelight, look at that little eddy in the clouds right there. Very interesting to the people studying meteorology. The geologists, I hope, will be able to get a lot of information from this. One item of interest is this transform, or cross-fault right here, and what we're looking for is the other end of it. You know, you've got fault line here, which is a sheer line between two hunks of ground, essentially that has slid, and the _uess is that maybe this area right here has something to do with that, but we have a crossfault here, and we're busy looking for the other side of it. And you can see a few stream beds in here that are displaced by a very large amount• And as Bill and Ed both mentioned, the San Andreas Fault has gotten a lot of coverage from us. I think it's going to give us a lot better understanding of the fault zones and the earthquake situation in California. Baja California, and western Mexico were very, very extensively covered photographically, as well as down around the Chile and Peru coast, the Autocoma Fault was extremely well lighted for us at all times. We certainly got a lot of good photography of that area. And that should just about tie it up. SPEAKER Okay. The crew is still on a busy debriefing schedule and we've got somewhat less than 20 minutes for questions, so we'll take those now. Bill Crommey. QUERY During the latter part of the flight you all three described experiencing changes in attitude towards human value. I believe it was sort of more humanistic orientation. Could you describe - each one of you describe those feeling for us? CARR I think we pretty well covered those in flight, as to how we felt that we had changed. I'll try to keep mine brief, and just say that I think that the trials and tribulations and the things that we looked at; the things that we were exposed to up there have kind of heightened my awarenes of the world around me, made me a whole lot more interested in spreading my horizons and getting away from just one narrow pursuit of either occupation or interest. I now have a much wider interest in many things in the world. GIBSON I would say that I had a little different viewpoint, but it's primarily the - boils down to the same thing in the end product, and that is world unity. I saw how small the world really is, and how little difference there really is between one piece of land and another. All the divisions are manmade, and I certainly would like to see everybody get that type of perspective, and I'm sure we'd move towards world unity a little bit faster.

SL IV Time: 2/22/74

PC-132H/4 09:15 CDT

POGUE tainly developed and the potential contributions to a



call share





greater sense of value of the that lies within each individual himself and to society. I don't other than the to and greater processes - I think and have in to fact that again, - with a greater

individual for making know exactly one becomes sensitivity at are

how to explain it, more or less tuned to your own the world. really I think thought I would do

and the way that you look that attitude and feelings

everything that we

dealing with problems. Although have technical capability, and

I certainly - I enjoy doing teehnica] work. I think that there is a proper balance that can be achieved. I don't think that you can swing the pendulum too far in either direction. If you do this, all you do is destroy your own balance and outlook. I hope to some degree that I have more or less restored the balance and outlook I have on life. END OF TAPE

SL-IV PC-1321/I Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 POGUE I hope to some degree that I have, more less, restored the balance and the outlook I have on life. QUERY Yesterday Senator Frank Moss of Utah said that a dot on an ERTS satellite picture of Mount Ararat in eastern Turkey might turn out to be Noah's ark. The Bible said that that is where Noah's ark is supposed to have landed. In your mission, in any of your photographs, did you see or photography anything like that? Do you expect that anything like that might show up in any of your photographs? POGUE Well I think that most certainly you're going to find all sorts of new revelations and new things up there. I have no reason to doubt the people's thoughts there on the Mount Ararat thing. We saw nothing like that on Mount Ararat_ but_ the capability is up there. You can look down on Earth and you can see the big picture. You can see things in completely different relationships one to the other. And so I have no reason to believe that you can't really discover a lot of new things. And we feel we have discovered a lot of things about the Earth by just being off from a distance and being able to see the whole area, or QUERY your mates the most? This is for Bill Pogue. were up there for 84 days. What Remember, this is for television Bill_ you and did you miss now.

POGUE Well, I think we're all family men and we missed our families the most. I missed being - I think the most enjoyable part of the day is being with the family in the evening. And this is what I missed the most. QUERY I guess for Jerry, you did have the - man's longest mission and all. And would you have been willing to have stayed an additional 3 months, I mean provided all the you had all the food and water and so forth you needed? And what is going to be needed in the psychological comforts for a year or 2-year mission? CARR Well, the first part of your question, yes, I think if there were something productive to do up there and we had all the other things taken care of we would have been willing to stay. But it had to be worth it to stay up there, not just staying up to see how lon_ we could stay. There had to be something productive to be done. Psychologically I think man has got to be able to- there have got to be things to divert your mind. You can't run in the channel too long up there, youtve got to be able to relax, put your feet up, think about things you've got to be able to completely divert your mind from what's going on there into some other area. We of course, the most interesting thing for us, the way for us to divert our minds was looking out the window. That was really great. We enjoyed that more than anything


SL-IV Time: 2/22/74

PC-1321/2 09:15 CDT

else. But we we also tried

also tried to to do a little

do as much reading bit of writing.

as But

we could, I think for



year-lonE_ or several-year-lonE missions we're going to have to develop systems where a guy can divert himself, that is thinEs like movies and television and lots of good literature, good music. You've got to be able to get your mind off the work, and as we say in the flying game, close the hangar doors and go off and do something completely different. QUERY For either of you, were there times where you just got on each others nerves, and was there tension between you and what caused it if there was? GIBSON Well, I think we answered that in flight and other times also. Of course everybody has got their own idiosynchrocies, but these, whatever frictions that might be caused by those were relatively small compared the realization that all three of us were in this thin_ And we started cooperatinE I think when we were assigned the flight and that spirit's remained and I've been very with it. CARR I think that we are a very fortunate to together. to happy crew

in that our personalities_ our character is all rather complimentary. We all seem to there was somebody to pick up where the other guys weren't too interested. Like, I think Bill is a creative kind of guy, pretty philosophical kind of guy. Ed is the kind of guy who likes to look ahead and know what's coming and plan and get ready, and I'm kind of an execute man. Bill can dream up some neat ideas, and Ed will plan ahead, and i'll see that it gets done. And the three of us just kind of - we all mixed up well together, complimented each other's ability. QUERY Executioner. CARR I think we were very fortunate were put together in this way because it worked to And we had no difficult times up there at all. QUERY How about when you returned to

that we our advantage. Earth, was

there anything that had transpired here that you recall that you had not been aware of, of course, while you were on the space station? Anything surprising happen on Earth that struck you when you got back? CARR I think the folks on the ground did a very good the world. job of keeping us aware of what was going Our little morning newscast that we got on in from the

Euys was very good and we appreciated it. I personally was most impressed by my family when I got back. I thought they had carried just beautifully while I was gone. And that is the one thine that nobody told me about, about how beautiful my family was. They got alon_ beautifully without me. My

SL-IV PC-1321/3 Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 wife kept things together, and the kids got sort of a kindred spirit and they all just worked together and bore up under the fact that the old man was gone. And thatts the thing that really impressed GIBSON CARR me. Kind of Yeah, scares you a little bit.

QUERY This is a question I am relaying for Mary Bubb at the Cape. It's for all three of you_ and I'd llke an opinion from all three of you. Was there anything in space such as weightlessness, isolation from Earth or physiological changes which caused you difficulties during the first 6 weeks of the mission including what appeared to be excessive fatigue, mild depression, and slowness in doing tasks? GIBSON Well I think in the first 6 weeks or I'd say about the first 20 to 30 days, we were all working pretty hard and behind in the power curve as we call it in the flying game. We started working hard, and the harder you work the more tired you get and the less efficient you get and therefore the harder you've got to work. And I think this is something we learned as we went into the flight how to keep the time line in the right perspective. And after that first 20 or 30 days, we learned how to carry it out and we are very happy with the results from there on. But it was a very valuable lesson to us and I think to everybody else, CAKR I think maybe that the adversity, we consider to be adversity we had the first 20 to 30 days of tke mission where we were really running hard and running behind, and working hard to try to get caught up. I think that's the thing more than anything that triggered the feelings that Bill and the three of us talked about about human value and human sensitivities. If you start playing the machine game, playing the numbers game, you lose your humanism, and your human sensitivities. And this is somethinK that I think was very graphically brought home to us. And we finally realized that if you will just sit down and talk to people about what is not working right and what is working right, and get a little dialogue going that things really smooth out. And just as soon as we had our conference on day 28, and the ground told us where their hanKups were and we told the ground where our hangups were, thinks smoothed out and we really got to hustling. And I think this really is a pretty good demonstration of the value of humanism, POGUE Analogy there that seems to me to be valuable is that it doesn't take much overrun in scheduling to destroy the total operation. It's like a family that makes $i0,000 a year and trying to spend ii. I mean or 5 dollars more than what


SL-IV PC-1321/4 Time: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 you make. It's just the difference between contentment and misery. There is not there is a very very fine distinction there and when you go just beyond that point, then the whole system goes unstable. And I think that it looked very reasonable to some have people_ but it was just a little beyond what we really could done well and properly. QUERY The three of you set a new endurance record for man in space and sent back an awful lot of scientific data_ but you really didn't get the headlines that previous space missions have been accorded. And I wonder how much that bothers you that your work really didn't get the recognition that the work of previous astronauts did? GIBSON I think that there is a natural inclination on the part of everybody to want to see what they are doing recognized by the people around them. But at the same time we have to realize what is the state of the space program now, and we moved into what you call more operational phase, the phase where we are busy accomplishing thinks which are no lon_er new and different but which we just go into in more detail as we have tried to illustrate to you this morning. Importance and newsworthy are not necessarily the same thinE. We realize it, it's a fact of life. But on the other hand it tells us the maturity of the space program. QUERY (Garble) GIBSON Yes. QUERY For the future of the space program though from the standpoint of - END OF TAPE


SL-IV PCI32-J/I TIME: 09:15 CDT 2/22/74 QUERY Yes. For the future of the space program though, from the standpoint of _etting new funds and everything, isn't it necessary to really keep up the interest in the program as far as the public _oes; as far as the people who spend the money in Washington? GIBSON That it - that is certainly is. I think it's up to us to try to tell the which is of importance and which public what we are doing is of usefulness to them.

That's what we've been trying to do and we will do for quite a few months to come. We're disappointed, of course, if we don't get the immediate recognition which goes with the spectaculars, so our work becomes a little bit harder. But nonetheless we intend to carry it out. sort CARR of thing I think as a marine is kind of like the old I think maybe this the marine - the

beachhead thing, you know, when you make your landing, your amphibious landing, and you roll in and all the action's on the front lines and nobody pays much attention to what's going on back at the beachhead after the front lines move inland and they're busy consolidating. And as far as I can see I think that what we are in now in space, particularly in Skylab, we were in a consolidation phase. That is we're beginning to find out what we can do. We've proved that we can get up there and get back safely. And the question now is what can we do while we're up there? And I think that in Skylab we've definitely shown a _reat deal of potential there. We've, I think, without a doubt established the need for man in space; not just robots and satellites. QUERY Could each of you give us an illustration of the effects on your day-to-day life that - just some mundane things of your readaptation to the one _. Well, CARR let me hit the Well, at first the readaptation to one zero-g part first, really. The first g

2 or 3 weeks in zero-g, you know, you're always thinkin_ about getting from here to there and how am I going to anchor myself when I get there, and that all has to be thought about. But after you've been there for awhile and you've worked out a scheme of your own for how you handle yourself, you begin to forget about that and you begin to get on with the work at hand. And I do remember very distinctly on the ship that I was right back in the same boat in one g and that was how am I going to get from here to there without ricocheting off the the first week very from here to there, walls, and the very same thing. You spend concerned with how you're going to get and what you're going to do when you get



SL-IV TIME: 2/22/74 there. helps worry

PCI32-J/2 09:15 CDT

And then after a few weeks good old Mother Nature you accommodate to your environment. And now I don't about any of that anymore, I'm more concerned with there. of rear It's back all and very quit natural, worrying Jt just about

what I do when I get and if you just kind

all the details of things, you know. a man's environment it takes time to got to learn new things, new skills, or something like that. PAO END OF TAPE Okay, thank you

_,_enever you change accommodate, and you reestablish old skills very much.




Sign up to vote on this title
UsefulNot useful