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What would you do in your market if you had the clout?

If you had your way, what would you do in your market? What I would do in mine: 1. Bring back Eyewitness News to channel 7. That Seven on Your Side stuff is getting somewhat old, at least to me. 2. Get a dedicated ABC station for this market (Greenville-Spartanburg) so that we no longer have to be tethered to 13-WLOS in Asheville, which has an unhealthy (albeit understandable) focus on WNC news. Dallas-Fort Worth market: Rebuild the news staffs at all the affiliates. (they've all had deep staff cuts in the past 5 years) Put more news resources in the suburbs. (there's way too much focus on Dallas) Put a 24/7 local news channel of some kind on someone's subchannel. (could be a rebroadcast of newscasts with traffic and weather updates 24/7 in some way along with live news events, maybe some simple talk shows and other exclusive programming) Put more national subchannels on the air and promote the idea of cutting cable. (this market has so many stations we could put nearly all of them on the air) Put one of the local newscasts in a sidewalk studio in Sundance Square in Downtown Fort Worth. (so many more people there than WFAA has with Victory Park in Dallas) 1. Get rid of these long blocks of paid programming. It seems they are becoming more and more numerous. The dustiest rerun of almost anything would be an improvement. 2. Cut the local newscasts to an hour or two in the morning, and half an hour at 6 and 11. Not enough legitimate news happens in my town to fill up an hour or more every day. I would in particular scrap the all-morning news blocks that run on weekends. 3. Expand local sports coverage on the newscasts back to the length and prominence it had in the 1980's. 4. Use my best judgment to run locally-produced or syndicated programming in place of network shows that are proving to be absolute stinkbombs and/or offensive in some manor. 5. Get rid of the mind-destroying bilge like Jerry Springer and all of his imitators. Again, the dustiest kinescopes from the DuMont Network would be an improvement. 6. Quit beating us over the head with sanctimonious promotional campaigns that imply that you are somehow better than your viewers. (the long-running KDKA-TV "For Kids Sake" campaign comes to mind as a particularly egregious example). 7. Restore some political balance to the programming on the PBS affiliate. Give us a sense that the half of us who are not liberals are getting some value out of our tax money that is going to subsidize you. Actually put a 24-hour 7-day weather subchannel on KGW's allegedly 24-hour 7-day weather subchannel. Wouldn't that be a novel concept?

Put more national subchannels on the air and promote the idea of dropping pay-cable. This market has so many empty channels we could put nearly all of them on the air. (Just taking the liberty, tested.) Rebroadcast the local public/community access channels over the air, especially for those without reliable (or any) QAM access or in areas out of range of the cable company (LOTS of those outside VanCamas.) What good are community access channels if the community can't access them? First, I'd put tighter restrictions on duopolies and LMAs. Here in the Chico-Redding, CA market, the CBS affiliate (KHSL-TV) operates the NBC affiliate (KNVN) under an LMA. Both stations share news departments (even simulcasting newscasts at 5 am, 11 pm and on weekends). The result is the worst, most bland newscasts I've ever seen. Competitor KRCR (ABC affiliate) isn't much better. I moved down here five years ago from Spokane, so maybe I'm not getting the whole picture, but it seems like the stations here "gave up" at some point, probably when the NBC and CBS stations entered into their LMA. Maybe if the stations here were all under unique ownership and management (the Fox and MNTV affiliates are also a duopoly), there would be more competition, yielding better product. I would also try and reincorporate local programming back into the mix. I believe locally-produced shows are a very important aspect of television history that, across the country, has been lost to "progress" in the past 30-40 years. Finally, I'd give stations a deadline to upgrade completely to high-definition (news broadcasts and syndicated shows). 1. Get rid of these long blocks of paid programming. It seems they are becoming more and more numerous. The dustiest rerun of almost anything would be an improvement. Commercial television stations exist to make money. Period. Infomercials generate revenue. Ancient reruns don't. Quote 2. Cut the local newscasts to an hour or two in the morning, and half an hour at 6 and 11. Not enough legitimate news happens in my town to fill up an hour or more every day. I would in particular scrap the all-morning news blocks that run on weekends. Scrap the weekend shows, and you'll get more infomercials outside of the E/I requirements. Sorry, but the days of Bugs Bunny cartoons on TV is over. Quote 3. Expand local sports coverage on the newscasts back to the length and prominence it had in the 1980's. Not a chance. Teams want rights fees from everyone - that means cable-only. Local sports PxP other than the network-controlled NFL is just about dead in most markets, with only a few games in each market at most (wait until Tribune comes out of bankruptcy and WGN is sold - No Cubs for you!). Quote 4. Use my best judgment to run locally-produced or syndicated programming in place of network shows that are proving to be absolute stinkbombs and/or offensive in some manor. The networks will become a moot point in the next few years, especially in the smaller markets (You think Fox really cares about losing Twin Falls, or being on a subchannel in Terre Haute or an

LPTV in Lima?). Syndicated programming is expensive. I think station groups will go with programming produced in-house and shown group-wide if Scripps is successful with its new programming. They'll have to, otherwise TV stations will start going the way of AM radio. Quote 5. Get rid of the mind-destroying bilge like Jerry Springer and all of his imitators. Again, the dustiest kinescopes from the DuMont Network would be an improvement. As long as people live in trailer parks, there will be plenty of viewers for Springer and his ilk. Grin Quote 6. Quit beating us over the head with sanctimonious promotional campaigns that imply that you are somehow better than your viewers. (the long-running KDKA-TV "For Kids Sake" campaign comes to mind as a particularly egregious example). They want you to think that they care, I guess. Maybe these things look good to the FCC and parents' councils. Quote 7. Restore some political balance to the programming on the PBS affiliate. Give us a sense that the half of us who are not liberals are getting some value out of our tax money that is going to subsidize you. Most PBS stations are either owned by colleges/universities or state governments. Either way, they're your tax dollars at work. And you didn't like William F. Buckley, John McLaughlin, or Louis Rukeyser? No liberals in that bunch. The myth that PBS is hard-core liberal/Democrat is just that much of which is due to Bill Moyers' former ties to LBJ 45 years ago. ATLANTA: WUPA 69 dumps the CW and goes independent WATL 36 dumps MNT and goes indepedent low powers WTBS 26 and WANN 32 somehow go full power (or switch with 69 and 36) In Jackson, TN: On WBBJ I'd drop 7.2, which is usually nothiing but a repeat of 7.1 (ABC) with occasional secondary audio, but usually there's no real difference. Then I'd adjust the bitrate to make Me-TV a full time subchannel instead of just filler for the CBS subchannel on 7.3. On WJKT (Fox) I'd replace Cool TV with Antenna TV on 16.2. ON WLJT (PBS) I'd bring back The Red Green Show and also add Monty Python, Fawlty Towers, and Mr. Bean. Finally I'd dump ALL infomercials and trash talk. Even dead air would be better than that. Charleston: I like Charleston's TV market. All 3 TV stations are pretty good at what they do, and act like they're much larger than the 98th market. I wish though, they had a few things. Hopefully Charleston grows a few pegs in the next few years so we don't have as many inexperienced reporters. Charleston needs a weekend morning newscast. After 11:30 on Friday night, there's no news until 6pm on Saturday night.

Raleigh-Durham-Fayetteville 1. (In the analog days) Move the channel 28/Durham allocation to Chapel Hill as NCE and return the channel 4 allocation to Durham as commercial to allow for a competitive NBC or Fox affiliate on VHF. 2. More standalone stations and less duopolies or news sharing agreements. 3. Separate Raleigh-Durham from Fayetteville with either separate affiliates or via digital subchannels. I realize this would negatively affect our market ranking, but Fayetteville doesn't have many cultural ties to Raleigh and Durham besides sharing TV stations. In a market that size (194,600 TV households, over a very large geographical area), I'm not sure you can expect too much. I have friends who live near Redding, so I spend a couple weeks a year up there, and have for close to 30 years. If it's any consolation to you, the news programming there is much better and more professional than it used to be a couple decades ago when it was laughably camera pointed at some young just-out-of college anchor who was hoping to step up to the "big time." I remember when KRCR had an 'interns-on-the-air' feeling to it, and the Chico CBS affiliate didn't exist...or wasn't available to Redding residents, many miles away, in any case. In Milwaukee; 1. WTMJ/NBC needs to get back to being a good news operation run by a newspaper owner. Going tabloid and repetitive with six hours of news a day, along with an image which suggests the conservative hosts on their radio side get some newscast and reporter casting input has ruined their image completely. Also, get some syndicated programming people actually watch rather than watch solely for mocking value. And just stop with the charade and merge your Green Bay NBC station in as a gloried full-power translator already. We know you really just want to cut out that terrible news operation with how much you go to Milwaukee for sports and weather, so just stop stringing your employees there along and put them out of their misery so they can move on with their careers. 2. WISN/ABC is doing fine, but get the HD upgrade finished already. We had to stand 3:3 SD weather warnings for years during Lost and Grey's, I don't want to see image quality on field video that makes my local public access station look awesome. 3. WDJT/CBS is doing everything right with programming and news, but they need to issue a challenge to the big stations in town. Double down on good talent when their contracts are over, and keep covering good stories rather than the 'who cares' car accident stories everyone else runs. 4. Better luck for the Sinclair duopoly (WCGV/WVTV) once they eventually get their new studios and HD syndication capability. It's one of the better duopolies in the chain but Weigel is overwhelming them in the market just by how many subchannel networks they have, and their schedules are stuck with crap corporate foists upon them. 5. MPTV/PBS, we really don't need two audio channels devoted to jazz and classical music, or a poor quality version of Local Accuweather. Just give us 1080i video on your stations, please. WITI in 720p should not have better video quality than your version of 720p. 6. Finally, when Armando Montelongo and other 'hotel ballroom hustler' infomercial kings come to town...just turn down their infomercials. Please. You keep talking about how these people are ripoffs in your newscasts and then you carry their garbage anyways, which monopolizes every late night slot in the market? That's what you'd find if you looked up "double standard" in the dictionary. Thanks for all the responses! You all have made some good points. This WSPA promo from the 80s illustrates very well why I would bring Eyewitness News back. For Greenville, SC: For WHNS 21, I would regain Wendy Williams. Other stations add shows that are unseen in this market like Til Death, Ugly Betty, Punk'd, Cash Cab, etc. Get WSPA 7 to do

weekday morning newscasts starting at 4:30am just like WYFF 4 and WLOS 13. Plus get WLOS 13 to clear ABC's Litton's Weekend Adventure programming block on Saturday mornings. Plus add a Antenna TV and Bounce TV subchannel on one of the stations. Get SCETV/PBS out of Columbia, SC to bring back Nightly Business Report, Are You Being Served?, and Keeping Up Appearances. We need a real indie station besides WGGS 16 after WNEG 32 became non-commercial WUGA last year despite having inadequate signal and pay-TV coverage in it's market. And GSP should stop being more Paid-Programming Happy and air uncleared syndie shows as well. And air less 4x3 local commercials and more 16x9 HD commercials. Plus just for laughs, WYFF 4 needs to bring back the Arrow 4 logo (used during it's WFBC years to WYFF from red/blue from 1974-86 to gold from 1986-91)! Seen in this video from late 1990 on channel 4. That's what I call a classic logo you dig! For Augusta, GA: They need MyNetworkTV and CW stations to be on a HD primary channel instead of SD digital subchannels. For Columbia, SC: They need to clear Jeremy Kyle Show in Columbia! For Charleston, SC: Get WCBD 2 to do HD news. Get WTAT 24 to have their own news division just like WHNS in Greenville, SC. Plus get WCIV 4 to do news at noon, five and five-thirty. Get their CW station on primary HD channel instead of SD digital subchannel. I agree with the poster said about Charleston SC doing weekend morning news. Plus get WTAT 24/WMMP 36 to have HD syndicated shows in true HD. That would hurt Raleigh-Durham as you pointed. While cultural may not be strong, I think it does have valid economic ties even if not commutership. I've been to Fayetteville and it's a lot cheaper and not so incovenient to fly through RDU than FAY to reach there. RDU also had 16,000 avg. daily seats on departures to domestic airports while FAY had less than 1,000. No doubt Research Triangle Parks helps alot of that, but it could be the main carriers (including low cost carriers) prefer serving RDU at FAY's expense (given the paltry service there) and making RDU a gateway to a greater area than just the MSA. I think it is a greater association than Philadelphia and Allentown. ABE is economically and culturally just as tied to New York as it is to Philadelphia now, and independent on its own merit as well - with people not commuting to either region. There is state commonality between ABE and Philadelphia, and the broadcast stations being able to reach there, but IMO it's weak. Those are your examples of Conservatives on PBS? Two are dead and the third one is pretty much retired. Let them offer a slot to Mark Steyn or Walter Williams or somebody and then get back to me on that. They also have an annoying tendency to wrap the liberal perspective on issues like Global Warming throughout every piece of programming that they have. This is the reason I do not contribute to PBS or NPR stations. They make is abundantly clear to me that my point of view is not welcome there. Which is fine if they are owned and funded by a university or a non-profit corporation. I just don't like my tax money going to that. If Limbaugh one day moves to NPR I'm sure you'd understand within the first five seconds. Although you did give me a pretty good punch line. "How do you spot the Conservative on PBS? He's the guy who's dead!" Grin

I wouldn't blame the radio channels for that. They compress pretty well & don't really occupy much bandwidth to begin with. The weather & other video channels, on the other hand, are indeed using a fair bit of space. Another thought on my earlier post: I'd also drop all courtroom shows and most reality shows. Those are your examples of Conservatives on PBS? Two are dead and the third one is pretty much retired. ...producing and hosting two weekly half-hour shows (The McLaughlin Group and McLaughlin One On One) hardly qualifies as anything near "retirement"... Lake of the Ozarks it's own CW/PBS and so on. KSHB Action Weather Plus it's own Channel and make it KSHB Action News and also in HD. Metro Weather,Sports HD and 2,KMCI HD/Live Well Network,Ion Life/Qubo on Comcast Bounce TV on the Cable Systems here in KC area because not yet only on Digital Antenna. Daily Buzz more live Newscast on KMCI. A National Channel out of Orlando. Why stop with a local market, I will take a shot at the big 4 networks and a lot of the cable networks. When a network "buys" a weekly sitcom, assuming it lasts more than 3 or four weeks, please buy at least 26 episodes! I understand the economics of summer reruns but twice is enough. If someone can't watch the show when it is aired, there is always Hulu. In Phoenix... Break up the Gannett news monopoly...either sell off the paper to local interests or sell KPNX to another media company. Combine Belo and Scripps local operations...put ABC back on 3TV, move the CW to 15, put antenna-tv on 61? And move Fox 10 out of the termite terrace on Adams, maybe out to Westgate near the stadium. In Phoenix... Break up the Gannett news monopoly BS generator... Fixed. Grin Quote ...either sell off the paper to local interests or sell KPNX to another media company. The Repugnant probably can't be saved in the long-term; it's the worst big-city paper in the country. I haven't bought it in almost 5 years. I used to use it to line the cat-box until the cats complained. Grin NBC might have been interested in Channel 12 years ago, but I can't see them buying another station now (they already own KTAZ/39 here). The only way I can see Comcast still wanting it is if they shut the OTA NBC network down and would want to move Telemundo there. Quote Combine Belo and Scripps local operations...put ABC back on 3TV, move the CW to 15, put antenna-tv on 61? What difference does it make where ABC is? Both stations are UHF now, so reception isn't an

issue anymore. Besides, are Belo and Scripps interested in merging? Didn't think so. What I think would be a good idea is for KAET to return to RF 29, KSAZ to 31, and Belo sell KASW's transmitter to Gannett and then put KPNX on 49. KASW's programming could then be moved to 3.3. Get off of VHF completely! Greensboro/Winston-Salem/High Point: Although my biggest wish is for WGHP to become an ABC affiliate again (and I think Fox has been too much of a cash cow for the station for that to happen), my changes are directed at WFMY: 1. Dump the 7-8 AM hour of "The Good Morning Show," run "CBS This Morning" from 7-9, then start a 9 AM newscast to compete with WGHP's. 2. Move "Let's Make A Deal" to 10 AM. 3. WBTW Florence, SC has a three-hour block of "The Talk" at 2, Anderson at 3, and Ellen at 4. Let WFMY do something like that in the afternoon. I also wouldn't mind seeing CBS make an offer for either WBTV Charlotte or WRAL Raleigh. A few months back the rumor mill was stirring with suggestions that CBS was going to buy WAGA and it would once again be Atlanta's CBS station, but that obviously isn't going to happen. Why can't CBS just make WUPA the CBS affiliate for Atlanta? CBS has held it so long that it's as if it's always as an option. CBS could start it off without a newscast and run it like the Detroit CBS station WWJ, but then start one up by paying talent from other stations to move there. In Philly, KYW got Larry Mendte (from WCAU) and Alicia Layne who was hot from Miami and paired the two together. The two didn't last because of a scandal, but the point is neither were KYW vets. It'd probably be cheaper to just build a newsteam rather than buy a station that has one, but not sure. Also, here in Philly, Univision built up a newscast on WUVP, which was once a HSN station. The benefit for such a large market is CBS would keep the retrans and advertising profits. Meredith would get screwed in the process, but it's business. That brings another point. With the auto industry rebounding in Detroit, Detroit still relatively healthy and stable and the VHF UHF thing being a less relevant issue in digital, could CBS put investment in their Detroit station and launch a newscasts there? It seems like newscasts on these major stations are still a profitable business, and with CBS #1 in primetime, it'd seem to make sense to make a go for it. Put Me-TV and Antenna TV in the Knoxville Tn market. In the designated market area of Mobile, Alabama-Pensacola, Florida... I would have WFGX-TV broadcast all programming from ThisTV on their main channel and sell the rights to some of their syndicated programs (including "The Jerry Springer Show", "The Maury Povich Show", and "The Jeremy Kyle Show") to other stations.

I would cancel all plans for WALA-TV and WEAR-TV to produce 4:00 PM newscasts Monday through Friday and have them broadcast syndicated programs at those times instead (WALA-TV would broadcast "Jeopardy!" at 4:00 PM and "Wheel of Fortune" at 4:30 PM. WEAR-TV would broadcast "Inside Edition" at 4:00 PM and "The Insider" at 4:30 PM. I would purchase the local rights to "Dark Shadows" and "Mama's Family" for WKRG-TV ("Mama's Family" was very popular locally after having been broadcast by WKRG-TV and WALA-TV at 10:30 PM for years after production of the program ended). "Dark Shadows" would be broadcast at 9:00 AM and 9:30 AM Monday through Friday instead of paid programs and "Mama's Family" would be broadcast at 6:30 PM Monday through Friday and broadcast at 10:35 PM on Sunday. I would establish rules (at any station) requiring all newscast presenters and reporters not to express their personal feelings about news, weather, or sports during local newscasts. I would have WEAR-TV broadcast "Nightline" at 10:30 PM instead of 11:00 PM and "Jimmy Kimmel Live" at 11:00 PM instead of 11:30 PM Monday through Friday. These programs would no longer be delayed by "Prep Football Final" every Friday during the high school football season, because "Prep Football Final" would be rescheduled for 6:30 PM on Saturday (WEAR-TV usually produces local news programming between 6:00 PM and 7:00 PM on Saturday). I would have WALA-TV end 5:00 PM and 9:00 PM newscasts by 5:30 PM and 9:30 PM respectively Monday through Friday. I would create new local programs for the station to broadcast at 5:30 PM and 9:30 PM Monday through Friday. I would make programming from Antenna TV and the Funimation Channel available on digital subchannels through WALA-TV, WPMI-TV, or WJTC-TV. I would have Comcast Cablevision of Mobile provide programming from the Retro Television Network (RTV) by retransmitting the programming broadcast on one of WKFK-TV's digital subchannels. In Jackson, TN: On WBBJ I'd drop 7.2, which is usually nothiing but a repeat of 7.1 (ABC) with occasional secondary audio, but usually there's no real difference. Then I'd adjust the bitrate to make Me-TV a full time subchannel instead of just filler for the CBS subchannel on 7.3. Fire some of the four or five weatherpeople(there's one who only does the Saturday morning news) they have and use that money to get some good reporters. Quote On WJKT (Fox) I'd replace Cool TV with Antenna TV on 16.2. Start a WJKT newscast and drop the WLMT/WPTY news. Quote ON WLJT (PBS) I'd bring back The Red Green Show and also add Monty Python, Fawlty Towers, and Mr. Bean. Air more shows about West Tennessee history. KMBC- Exstrella TV,Own Weather Channel and Moretv back KCWE- Tuffy TV,AMGTV,Midday and 4PM Newscast and 9pm to an hour KCTV5- TNN,The Country Network,Weathernation TV,PBJ,Weekend and 4pm Co-Anchors KSMOTV Saturday's 9PM, Weekday Morning Newscast back,Pursuit,9pm Co-Anchor,The Cool TV,Povich at 4pm if coming back

FOX4KC- My Family Net,Outside,4pm Newscast,Accuweather KSHB- RTV,Untamed Sports TV,Ethnic Channel,Weekend Mornings Co-Anchor KMCI- Shopping Channel,Youtoo,other Digital Sub Channels,more local programming and also Game Shows like Family Fued Orlando Stations do nothing but add local Sports and more Newscast/Digital Sub Channels. For Springfield and Columbia/Jefferson City,MO more Newscast and Digital Sub Channels. I would like to see all the Nexstar duopolies here in West Texas (Lubbock, Amarillo, Abilene, Wichita Falls, San Angelo) split up. That way we'd have more options for local news. I live in Lubbock and the newscasts on KLBK and KAMC are pretty much the same other than different anchor talent. Raleigh-Durham (RDU) is an international airport, while Fayetteville (FAY) is a regional one. It's not unique to Fayetteville for air travelers to opt out of their local airports' limited offerings in favor of RDU. Cities such as Danville, Burlington, or Greenville--all three of which are in adjacent TV markets--could be included as well. Despite the difference in airports (and being joined in a hyphenated TV market, the two areas are separate and distinct: Two separate radio markets Different economic engines (education/medicine/research-Research Triangle Park) vs. military/industrial/agriculture-Fort Bragg/Pope Army Air Field) Over an hour away from each other via interstate (and that's not a direct connection--you have to take I-40 East to I-95 South) Fairly self-contained as far as retail and entertainment Different weather patterns and conditions Fayetteville is culturally and economically more tied to Lumberton (in the Myrtle Beach-Florence market) than RDU. Really the only time you see Raleigh, Durham, and Fayetteville together is on top of the hour IDs and on the local newscasts when they stretch to cover the two different areas, be it the two useless token Fayetteville Traffic Cams in the morning, an extra long list of election returns/school closings, or interrupting a Spring Lake (near Fayetteville) viewer's favorite show about a thunderstorn in Oxford (near Raleigh). Often, even TV promotions where, say, Wheel of Fortune is "coming to your town" will require two separate events for Raleigh and Fayetteville. One of Fayetteville's two TV stations, WFPX, channel 62, literally doesn't even register in the RaleighDurham part of the market (not even a faint picture in analog days and with digital it actually shares UHF channel 36 with Roanoke Rapids public TV station WUNP-TV in the far northeastern corner of the market). Again, market rank (now #24) and lots of money are at stake, and both take precedence over viewer convenience or the separate areas argument, so Fayetteville always has and always will be joined to Raleigh-Durham as far as local TV is concerned. For New Orleans, LA: WWL 4 should dropped their local morning newscasts at 7-9am and clear CBS This Morning. WVUE should go back to ABC, WGNO should be FOX. For Salt Lake City, UT: I would get KSL 5 to force to relinquish the NBC affiliation and give the Peacock affiliaton to KXTV 4 and clear the entire NBC line-up (despite NBC has more tolerence on local pre-emptions) including SNL, and ABC goes to KCSG 44 and KSL would be an indie!

For Jacksonville, FL I would like to see WJXT 4 be affiliated with MyNetworkTV instead being on subchannel of it's FOX station in the market. For Boston, MA (just like my friend Shane Spencer said): WCVB 5 should switch from ABC to NBC and bought by NBC Universal (and trade NBC Connecticut to Hearst TV), WHDH 7 switch from NBC to ABC and bought by Disney, and regain Wheel and Jeopardy!, and I would say Live! With Kelly. WSBK 38 should be CW instead of MyNetworkTV, and WLVI 56 should be bought by FOX and become My56. San Francisco, CA: I would like to see KTVU 2 bought by FOX making all four network O&Os in Bay Area! Dallas, TX: I would like to see WFAA 8 being bought by ABC, so they could have all four network O&Os. I disagree about KSL. You really thInk everything on that network is worth clearing? They spared their viewers crap like "The Playboy Club" That station seems to have more smarts than the network, and that's why they're number 1 (or 2) in Salt Lake City. And SNL isn't worthwhile either. In Austin: I would switch Fox and CBS back to their original channels, so KTBC Fox 7 would be CBS 7, and KEYE 42 would go back to Fox 42. In San Antonio: Fox would buy WOAI 4 and become an O&O, and become Fox 4 San Antonio. KABB would become NBC 29 Action News. In Dallas: I would trade ownership of KTVT and KDFW. Therefore KTVT would become Fox 11 and KDFW would once again be CBS 4. In addition to the changes I suggested previously for the designated market area of Mobile, Alabama-Pensacola, Florida, I would switch network affiliations for WALA-TV (FOX) and WPMI-TV (NBC). Since WALA-TV was affiliated with NBC from 1953 to 1995 and they lost that affiliation as a result of a change in ownership in which the FOX Television Stations group and Savoy Pictures Entertainment were involved (their venture was called Savoy-Fox, or SF Broadcasting), I believe it is best to restore their affiliation with NBC. Even though they may have fewer hours for syndicated programming, the limits may help them gain more viewers and listeners and better programming. We tend to get into the technicalities of digital (WXIA is Ch. 10, WGCL is Ch. 19, WAGA is Ch. 27, WSB is Ch. 39, etc.), but the general public still thinks of them as 11, 46, 5, and 2, respectively. As I recall, when CBS moved from 2 to 62 in Detroit, before the digital conversion, WTOL/11 Toledo became, in effect, the CBS affiliate for Detroit, if you go by the numbers of people watching. Atlanta viewers would probably say, WUPA, oh, that's Channel 69, and CBS has another WWJ on its hands. Besides, some of you are saying Chs. 4 and 11 in DFW ought to switch so that KDFW/4 is once again CBS, and that 10 and 15 in Mobile ought to switch so that WALA/10 is once again NBC. So what's wrong with WAGA going back to CBS, except that Fox will never sell the station?

I would like to see WFAA become an ABC o&o, being the largest Big Four station that is not one currently. But, just as I don't think Cox would sell its flagship, WSB, to ABC, neither do I think Belo would sell its flagship. The two stations I'd most like to see as ABC o&os are WFTV Orlando (just because of the Disney connection there) and WJLA Washington, since NBC and Fox have o&os in Washington and CBS has one in Baltimore (scratch WMAR--Scripps-Howard already owns it and I don't know why ABC would want to own it; even being on Ch. 2 it's rarely been a factor in the Baltimore market, except for Orioles games). Somebody pointed out that WVUE will not go back to ABC; the station owner also owns the Saints, and as long as Fox has the NFC contract, WVUE is going to stay put to carry the team. Finally, KSL is a special case; it is owned by the Mormon church, which considers programs such as "Saturday Night Live" and "The Playboy Club" inappropriate. When it was a CBS affiliate it frequently pre-empted made-for-TV movies it considered offensive to its primary audience. Bill Paley never said a discouraging word; he once said that KSL was one of CBS's weakest affiliates but it had a reason and was thus willing to make allowances for its tendency to pre-empt. Besides, "SNL" is on--what?--Ch. 13, so you can still see it. First, I'd quintuple TheRob's salary. You're welcome. Twin Cities: TPT (PBS) has two stations and only 4 streams -- PBS, "Life", "Minnesota Channel" and Weather. Add PBS WOrld and a traffic channel with 88.5FM audio (This used to be done OTA on Channel 45) WCCO (CBS O & O) The husband and wife primary anchor team is getting tough to watch. Break 'em up. KSTP/KSTC (ABC/Ind.) Blow up the news department. Throw reruns of "McHale's Navy" during the news time. Start over in 2013. KMSP (Fox O & O) Do something with your sub-channels. Antenna TV perhaps? KARE (NBC) Hire a primary news anchor. Add (yes, ADD) a Sunday morning local news presence. WUCW (CW) No opinion. WTFC (MyNet, Fox O & O) See KMSP. KPXM (Ion) Move to the Shoreview Telefarm with the other full power stations. Your wish is their command: KPXM recently received a CP to do just that. I think in the past, VHF meant a lot more. A VHF station would pay less for electric bills and get greater exposure of the channel, as people 50 miles out could receive the channel. I remember it was a lot easier to receive the Philly VHF stations in Central NJ, than it was to receive the Philly UHF channels, and the few that did reach Central NJ like WPHL and WTXF had to pay alot more for power to reach the same viewing area as the big three VHF stations: KYW, WCAU, WPVI. The VHF Channel would have a low cable channel position. Channel would be grouped with other VHF channels on the dial, likely other successful VHF channels, and newspaper listings were relevant. It also was carried SV in areas out of market, while the UHF station likely didn't. From an advertising perspective, that meant a station like WGAL could claim to Central PA advertisers that WGAL reached more homes including Berks County, while the UHF Harrisburg stations didn't.

A channel like WCAU in Philly for example operates on UHF now, but brands itself as NBC 10. If one is 20 miles from the Philly and lives in an apartment and uses an indoor antenna (even amplified), the signal on WCAU breaks up, but WPHL doesn't. It varies so much from place to place and the advantage is less clear. So, one is stuck having to get Comcast which might have a deal like I get $20/mo. that includes cable nets, which isn't bad. The networks have the leverage to secure preferred cable channel positions, like NBC did with KNTV in SF market on Ch.3 (not sure if it still is on Ch.3 on cable there). It's also easy to brand without a number like "NBC Bay Area" Here's what I'd like to see changed with the Chicago market: WLS-TV (ABC) - Make WLS-TV & all other ABC O&O remove the dual HD from their stations. I don't know about other ABC O&O, but the few times I watch Livewell Network, the HD on that channel is horrible. As for Livewell Network, get better programming. Also, eliminate the Livewell Network simulcast on 7.3 & add a different diginet. WTTW (PBS) - make WTTW Prime a widescreen channel. There's no excuse why they can't make this channel widescreen since the bulk of their newer programming is filmed in widescreen. I don't like windowboxed programming. For the main channel in HD, add more desireable programming in primetime. I find it sad that WTTW Prime is programmed better than the main WTTW channel. While this doesn't have to do with WTTW, but the people who program V-Me, but I'd like to see all the programming that was originally recorded in English to be available with English audio. For programs originally done in Spanish, or other languages, have English dubs. WYCC (PBS) Eliminate the SD. It isn't necessary. Since this station has an NCE license calling for so many hours of instructional programming, they could have the subchannel programmed to handle the instructional programming in the morning & early afternoon hours, & childrens programming all other hours. Since adding more children's programming in the morning hours, they moved the instructional programming in the overnight hours on Monday - Thursday. I can't say it's 100% entertainment, but for someone going to college, these programs can help them out. WCIU (ind) Eliminate U Too. I don't see the channel being needed. They already have plenty of syndicated programming. The bulk of the programming on U Too is time-shifted. Instead, I'd move Bounce from WWME-LD 23.2 to WCIU 26.2. End the Fox duopoly on WFLD & WPWR-TV. Ever since Fox bought WPWR-TV in 2002, the station's programming has overall gone downhill. It's simply a dumping ground for programming that Fox doesn't want to air on WFLD. WCPX (Ion) Make Ion Media actually allow their stations to be programmed locally instead of being on the bird 24/7. I'd also have the infomercials cut back (not eliminated), as they rely too heavily on infomercials to fund their stations. I would also make Ion Media sell most of their stations, & instead allow stations to be affiliated with them. The extra money they would have by having fewer O&O stations could be used to acquire better programming. Since they're acquiring some programming from Canada, their network would stand out from everyone else by showing programs not seen anywhere else. I'm not sure what changes I'd like to see with Qubo. For Ion Life, I'd like to see more than 1 or 2 seasons of shows that are still on the air in Canada. This diginet has potential, but with Ion Media refusing to allow anyone to affiliate with Ion Life, it actually hurts them, since they're spending a lot of money on their stations, even with a skeleton crew. WYIN (PBS) I'd have the dual HD eliminated on this station as well (WLS-TV being the other station running dual HD). If PBS World is a free service as I hear it is, then WYIN could add that to a subchannel to eliminate 1 simulcast. I don't know how long it'll take the Indiana Channel to completely get off the ground. If that diginet only intends to air about 6 hours of programming a week (I believe that's correct), then it doesn't make sense to even have the Indiana Channel, & simply incorporate the programming within the Indiana PBS schedules. So far, WYIN hasn't dedicated a subchannel for the Indiana Channel. Besides, not all Indiana PBS stations have

completely converted to HD, or even SD Widescreen. WYIN Gary & WNIT South Bend broadcast in HD, but locally produced programming isn't in HD, or even SD Widescreen. I don't know about the other PBS stations in Indiana. WJYS (Ind) I would like to see this station sold to Weigel Broadcasting, & move MeTV & MeToo to this station. Then on the WCIU side, remove MeTV & MeToo simulcasts from WCIU 26.3 & 26.4, & have more bandwidth for HD programming. Weigel could then sell off WWME-LD & WMEU-CD, as it would be needed (unless they would have other plans for these LPTV stations). WJYS (Ind) I would like to see this station sold to Weigel Broadcasting, & move MeTV & MeToo to this station. Where would the people with bad credit who want to buy cars go? Oh won't someone please think of the people with bad credit who need cars!!!! I actually agree with Dave, let Weigel have either WJYS or WPWR Going back to my hometown of Rockford, Illinois...first thing I would is take some of the counties in the other surrounding DMAs (such as Rock County, Wisconsin from Madison, DeKalb County, Illinois from Chicago as example), and of course, it would like the Rockford DMA slightly bigger (currently #134). Secondly, I would add at least a few more stations to the area; presently, there are four full-power stations (each affiliated with the Big Four), and a couple low-powered stations (one's religious, the other is a repeater of Weigel's Chicago stations). My idea would be standalone CW and MyNet fullpower stations (currently, they're each on subchannels of the NBC and ABC stations respectively), and they can have subchannels of their own (MeTV, Antenna, This, TheCoolTV, the re-born TNN, etc.). More importantly, I would have two PBS stations in the market; one could originate from Northern Illinois University (one of NIU's radio stations is licensed to Rockford), the other could be a station from Wisconsin Public TV (the city of license would be Janesville or Beloit). Phoenix: Seriously take a look at better branding for the local news stations. Three out of five have station group graphics and music at this point. Throw back to the days when each station actually felt, uh, distinct: I *love* 10's Spirit of Arizona era, same for 12 at that time. KNAZ: Return local news to Flagstaff, this time in an insert format in KPNX's newscasts. (This is what SHOULD have been done in 2008. One anchor, one reporter, not much needed. Larger stories can be sent to Phoenix to air on big 12.) KTVK: Bring back NewsChannel 3 and a traditional newscast format. Solo anchoring is not working. Fields Moseley needs to be an at-desk anchor for the newscasts. 3 could be a better racehorse if it were cared for properly. 3, however, would be throwing out its circle 3 tradition (same logo modified several times since 1982; circle 3s going back to the late 70s), in favor of a nice, earthy package (preferably John Christopher Burns or the people that did KWGN). Had Belo still operated KMSB Tucson, I would have suggested tighter integration between the two or a statewide newscast, but that's not happening now. (Tucson would probably involve a separation of Raycom's SSA there.) KPHO: Doing fine, though a little too tabloid in style right now. KSAZ: Complete rebrand based on the Spirit of Arizona package from the 90s; return to the Channel 10 News title and modernized sunset 10. Get a better weekend weather person; Kristy Siefkin (late of San Francisco) is not good at all. (Hey, we're lucky; a weekend newscast with two

main anchors is unheard of these days!) Start thinking about retiring Dave Munsey and getting a chief met with a seal. KPNX: Returns to the Arizona's News Station era, this time redone in HD. Cancel EVB Live. Get a proper chief meteorologist. KNXV: There's no good era of this station to throw back to. Phoenix has the luxury of five fullstrength news operations. 15 has been growing, but I think there are other ways it could grow. My idea is "15 Action News" with a completely de-corporatized look that still riffs off Scripps' other "Action News" properties and a renewed emphasis on franchise and in-depth reporting to position itself as a rival to 5. General: Produce some decent high school sports coverage. Two stations are trying now, and their efforts are good but limited, especially at 3. I've had an idea for an hour-long football-season show brewing in my head for some time now (with East Valley and West Valley in separate blocks, better statewide coverage, etc.), and it can be done, but it'd be a bold effort. General: Ever considered a 30 minute newscast each week for certain "focus areas" of the sprawling Phoenix market? Flagstaff, White Mountains, Navajo Nation, Pinal County, Yavapai County would make good areas to do that. Sounds best on 3, though any station could attempt. DENVER KWGN 2 (CW) Dump the news (Not only is it redundant in the AM since sister station KDVR 31 also has a morning newscast but I don't know of ANYONE who watches the 7:00 PM newscast). Also drop the CW network (They'd get higher ratings as an Indie than they currently do as a CW affiliate as KCDO 3 quickly discovered when it dropped RTV to go Indie) KCDO 3 (Independent) Drop the religion & infomercials KCNC 4 (CBS) Invest in Diginets (All the CBS O&Os should do this as CBS has already previously announced) KMGH 7 (ABC) Pick up the LiveWell Network once Scripps Howard moves Azteca America affiliate KZCO 27 to its own DTV tower KUSA 9 (NBC) None KTFD 14 (TeleFutura) Avoid the temptation to affiliate with MundoFOX KTVD 20 (MyNetwork TV) None KDVR 31 (FOX) None KETD 53 (Estrella) Bring back English programming (Even as a subchannel in the 250 channel region on cable) KPXC 59 (ION) Drop the religion & infomercials I say no changes for KTVD 20 because (For all intents & purposes) it IS an Independent (Gannett just call it as such) JMO..... Cheers & 73 Grin

For Salt Lake City, UT: I would get KSL 5 to force to relinquish the NBC affiliation and give the Peacock affiliaton to KXTV 4 and clear the entire NBC line-up (despite NBC has more tolerence on local pre-emptions) including SNL, and ABC goes to KCSG 44 and KSL would be an indie! I would have to disagree here. Because of ABC's long standing history of appealing to moderately Conservative viewers, I think KSL 5 would make an excellent ABC affiliate IMO But mind you, that's just MY opinion, not that of the Mormon Church Grin Quote For Jacksonville, FL I would like to see WJXT 4 be affiliated with MyNetworkTV instead being on subchannel of it's FOX station in the market. Actually ABC would be a better fit for this station as well (Especially since it's on crappy Gannett owned WJXX 25, which is a duopoly of NBC affiliate WTLV 12) Quote For Boston, MA (just like my friend Shane Spencer said): WCVB 5 should switch from ABC to NBC and bought by NBC Universal I have a one word response to this - WHY Shocked What's to be gained by COMCAST & Hearst Argyle doing that? Quote WHDH 7 switch from NBC to ABC and bought by Disney Again, the one word question - WHY Shocked Both WCVB 5 & WHDH 7 are well established with their respective networks & have strong relationships with them. Why should either one of them rock the boat? You're starting to look like Julius May with these ASININE & RIDICULOUS suggestions..... Quote WSBK 38 should be CW instead of MyNetworkTV, and WLVI 56 should be bought by FOX and become My56. First, neither network is worthy of a swap. Secondly, CBS does own at least one other MyNetwork (West Palm Beach, FL comes to mind). So YET AGAIN I ask the (Now redundant) one word question - WHY?? What's to be gained by CBS & Sunbeam doing this? Quote San Francisco, CA: I would like to see KTVU 2 bought by FOX making all four network O&Os in Bay Area! Dallas, TX: I would like to see WFAA 8 being bought by ABC, so they could have all four network O&Os. What is it with you & network O&Os? Lemme test you - Did you know that in Washington DC, NBC & FOX own the stations there yet ABC & CBS do not? Under your so-called "Logic", are you suggesting that ABC buy WJLA from Albritton (Sp?) & CBS buy WUSA from Gannett just so that all four networks own the stations there too? Seems kinda silly if you ask me..... Cheers & 73 Grin That's all well and good if you understand the logistics behind digital, and obviously you do. But I still think the average viewer still identifies stations with their analog channels, which means that in

Atlanta WSB is still Ch. 2, WAGA is still Ch. 5, WXIA is still 11 Alive, etc., because that's how they see them identified. WGCL might have a better signal on digital 19, but even I don't think of WGCL Ch. 19; the closest 19 to me is the analog channel of WLTX Columbia, SC. So I still think the average viewer is going to think of WUPA as that channel at the top of the dial that doesn't put out a decent signal. There's just one problem is WUPA did get CBS: Detroit viewers can still see CBS on Ch. 11 in Toledo, Ch. 5 in Flint, or Ch. 6 in Lansing. None of the CBS stations surrounding Atlanta (WSPA/7 Spartanburg, WDEF/12 Chattanooga, WRBL/3 Columbus, GA, WRDW/12 Augusta, WMAZ/13 Macon, or WIAT/42 Birmingham) gets into the Atlanta metro area. So there's no WTOL to take up the slack if WUPA were to become another WWJ. On other notes: I think ABC has tried to get WJXT Jacksonville and been turned down. I still rank it as one of the all-time blunders when Ch. 4 dropped CBS; ironically, back when ABC was number one in the '70s Florida Trend magazine had an article about three markets that were bucking the trend and where CBS was still number one: Miami (WTVJ), Tampa (WTVT), and Jacksonville (WJXT). None of them is a CBS affiliate today: WTVJ is an NBC o&o (I guess it still is), WTVT a Fox o&o, and WJXT an independent. Of the three, WJXT could have stayed put; I've heard the real reason was that negotiations broke down over compensation, but I also heard that the g.m. didn't like CBS sports programming running over into her local news time. Oddly, CBS has not been a factor in Orlando for as long as I can remember; that always seems to have been an ABC town, and ever since I was a kid I've always thought of WFTV first when I thought of Orlando television. As for WFAA, it is true that Dallas is the largest market without a Big Four o&o, and WFAA reminds me a lot of an ABC o&o; their newscasts always reminded me of the ABC o&os even though they branded themselves "News 8" rather than "Eyewitness News" or whatever. If WFAA were to become an ABC o&o, it should have happened during its years of dominance from the mid-'70s until their front four of Tracy Rowlett, Iola Johnson, Troy Dungan, and Verne Lundquist were gone (I think the then-existing ownership limits might have been a barrier). I still don't think Belo would sell its flagship any more than I think Cox would sell its flagship, WSB. That might also be true with Allbritton and WJLA; I've just often heard speculation that if ABC ever does buy another station it would probably be the one. Finally, what is the big deal about KSL not clearing "Saturday Night Live" or certain one-shots that might potentially offend the Mormons? Sounds to me as if Ch. 5 is still considering community standards. We had an incident several years ago when our CBS affiliate, WFMY, refused to show the Victoria's Secret special; management considered it blatantly sexist. Nobody screamed for CBS to take WFMY's affiliation away. Nor do I recall any mass call for ABC to change affiliates in heavily-Catholic markets in the Central time zone that ran "Soap" at 9:30 instead of 8:30 (San Antonio comes immediately to mind and KSAT is still the ABC affiliate there) or to drop all those stations that didn't carry "NYPD Blue" when it was new. Give KSL a break; management obviously knows what it's doing. How I would do my markets: Austin KTBC 7- Return to CBS as CBS 7/Newscenter 7. KLRU - Leave as is. KVUE - Rebrand as KVUE ABC Austin. Brand the newscasts as ABC Austin News. KBVO - Leave as is. KXAN - Rebrand the station as NBC 36, NBC 36 News.

KEYE - Return to Fox, as Fox 42. KNVA - Leave as is. San Antonio KCWX - Leave as is. WOAI - Switch affiliations, as it should have been if the station wasn't traded by ChrisCraft in 2001, and it would become a Fox affiliate. Rebrand as Fox 4 San Antonio. KENS - Rebrand as CBS 5 Eyewitness News KLRN - Leave as is. KSAT - Rebrand as KSAT ABC 12, rebrand news as simply 12 News, just like WISN ABC 12/12 News in Milwaukee. KMYS - Leave as is. KABB - Would have traded affiliations with WOAI, and become the new NBC affiliate, rebrand as NBC San Antonio/29 Action News. Smiley Like here in Charleston. Since Channel 5 has always had CBS, with the highest rated news by far (sometimes two or three times the other stations), CBS has always been the strongest network. While 2 and 4 both have their followings here, Channel 5 gets huge ratings in the rural areas who have grown up watching them. Almost all of their shows are at least #2 in the market (even the Evening News when Couric was on it). Years ago (late 80s), them and WBTV were approached for a switch to NBC. The stations are so loyal to CBS they wouldn't budge. Savannah is like that too with WTOC. WSAV has turned into a decent #2, probably being the leader in Savannah itself, but 11 and CBS owns all the rural areas of the market, because they have been the same for so long. Their anchors have been around for decades, they are always out in the community (they cover live pretty much every parade within 50 miles), and they have always had the same news music. Jacksonville has changed since they switched. 4 was the #1 by a huge margin for probably 30-40 years. 4 is still #1 in news, but NBC is much stronger because of WTLV. ABC has almost always been an afterthought there, too. They went from 17 to 25, which simulcast with WBSG in Brunswick, had separate newscasts, lasted about 2 1/2 years, then 25 merged with WTLV. GMA only got a 4 share this sweeps month on 25. Speaking of WBTV, if I had the clout, I would like to see them owned by either Capitol Broadcasting or CBS. Raycom can have WMYT and can put all their sports programming on there. WBTV just isn't what it once was which started with Lincoln Financial. Otherwise, honestly the Charlotte market is really not that bad. Defunct TV stations in your city Does your city have defunct TV stations?

Duluth has eleven. The very first preceded all other TV stations in about 1953. It operated on UHF - requiring a special converter then - and went by the call letters "WFTV". It picked up programming from a couple networks. With KDAL and modern-day KBJR signing on in 1954, it soon went kaput. The first eight were part of a "UHF cable TV" service common in the 1980's and 1990's in rural Minnesota. In Duluth, it went by the name of "BEAM TV". My family subscribed to it for a while when I was 7 and 8. I still remember the channel line-up: 15 - Sci-Fi Channel 27 - CNN 30 - TBS 32 - USA Network 34 - Discovery Channel 38 - Family Channel 56 - Showtime 60 - Nickelodeon They were going to add channels on 62, 64, 66, and 68, but never did as far as I know. They shut down operations in 1996 as Primestar, Dish, and DirecTV / USSB gained popularity. Duluth got a FOX affiliate on September 1, 1999 (KQDS 21). The enthusiasm for local TV spread to a group of local investors who started up KDUL-LP, channel 12. After several delays, it launched in the Fall of 2000, with transmitter tests in August 2000 (their puny VHF signal launched during a tropo opening, in which it was often interfered with by WJFW, Rhinelander, WI, 160 miles away). It carried A1 or AIN, as well as UPN programming and the local sports-themed public access show "The Average Guys". They received carriage on Bresnan (local) cable channel 16, which was the only way most people saw them. This probably created a inconvenient sim-sub situation with KMSP-9, which was the state's superstation at the time and then affiliated with UPN. Their transmitter had a fire in August 2001, kicking them off the air for good. K58CM, a long standing affiliate of TBN, signed off in 2010. In Seattle, there used to be KPEC 56 in Tacoma in the 1960s, which was operated by the Clover Park School District. It signed off in the '70s, and then bought KTVW 13, which several years later would morph into, you guessed it, Q13 Fox. -crainbebo We've had a couple of LPTVs come and go here in Rochester. W38AW (later WAWW-LP) and WROH-LP 47 are both gone now. I think WAWW was running America One when it was last on the air, and WROH-LP was shopping. The only defunct full-power TV here is only sort of defunct: channel 10 in Rochester signed on in 1953 as a share-time between WHEC-TV (affiliated with WHEC 1460) and WVET-TV (affiliated with WVET 1280). In 1962, the owners of WVET-TV bought WROC-TV 5 (soon moved to channel Cool and WROC-FM 97.9. WVET 1280 moved in with the WROC stations and became WROC 1280. The WVET-TV half of the channel 10 license was sold to WHEC-TV, which went full time on 10. The WVET staff moved over to WROC, so the only thing that really went "defunct" was the WVET-TV callsign. There's more defunct-ness in our neighboring markets: in Buffalo, WBES channel 59 came and went in the first flush of UHF in 1953. WBUF-TV 17 also signed on in 1953 and lasted for six years before the channel ended up being donated to educational TV as WNED in 1959.

In Syracuse, there was a channel 43 (WONH) that was built in the early 1970s but apparently never made it past a test pattern before folding. (The channel was later reused in the 1990s by what's now WNYS.) Elmira's first TV station, WTVE channel 24, signed on in 1953 and died in 1956 when a storm took down its tower. WKBS 48 in Philly in the 1980's went defunct. KQEC 32 in San Francisco the 1980's went defunct and was off the air for sometime before KMTP 32. KEMO-TV 20 in SFO went defunct in the 1980's and was off the air for 1 month before James Gabbert took over TV-20 for KTZO and KOFY. Chicago W9XZV/KS2XBS Ch. 2 was Zenith's pay-TV experimental channel. It operated off and on between 1939 and 1953, when it was bounced to make way for WBBM-TV's move from Channel 4. It also held the callsign WTZR, but that was never used on-air as the station never received its commercial license. KS2XBS briefly returned on Channel 38 in the '60s. WXXW Ch. 20 was WTTW's second channel, operating between 1965 and 1974. Its license survives today as WYCC, and its CP goes back to the never-built WIND-TV from 1953. W36AO was a Juke Box Network station that had broadcast on Channel 36 in Palatine in the late '80s and early '90s. I think it became a TBN affiliate later, and I don't know when it left the air. WCAE Ch. 50 St. John IN (1967-84) was Indiana's first public broadcasting station. Its license was never turned in to the FCC and it was used to test WPWR's transmitter in late '86, right before it moved from 60 to 50, but I don't know if WPWR or WYIN/56 is its "official" successor. WLXT Ch. 60 Aurora was a short-lived independent circa 1970. WBBS-TV Ch. 60 shared time with WPWR-TV between 1982 and 1985. It was a Spanishlanguage station. Phoenix KOY-TV Ch. 10 shared time with KOOL-TV in 1953 and '54, alternating days until KOOL bought them out. Juke Box Network also had an affiliate in Phoenix on Channel 61 around 1990. I don't know if it moved or left the air, but by the time I moved back here in 1994, it was gone. Yuma KIVA Ch. 11 aired between 1953 and 1970. It is no relation to the current KYMA. In Raleigh-Durham, the market's first TV station, WNAO-TV/Raleigh, was a UHF on channel 28 that signed on on 1953. Three VHF stations followed in 1954 (WTVD/Durham), 1955 (WUNC/Chapel Hill), and 1956 (WRAL/Raleigh), WTVD and WRAL specifically spelling doom for WNAO, which fell silent in 1957. In the southern part of the market, Fayetteville had WFLB-TV on UHF channel 18 from 1955-1958. We've had quite a few LPTV stations come and go, such as W34AX in Henderson, WUBX-CA 13 in Durham (Former W13BW), and WBXU-CA 13 in Raleigh (W13CI).

I have always looked at WPWR-TV being the successor to WCAE (channel wise), only after the allocation was changed from non-commercial to commercial. WYIN's license on 56 goes back to WGMI (originally a commercial license), which was an unbuilt CP that Newsweb Corp. held. So WYIN signed on 56 for the first time in 1987. As for WCAE, I don't remember the station ever being on the air in 1984. I remember it being off the air in 1983, & nothing ever broadcasting on 50 until late 1986, when Newsweb was running test patterns on the station with the WCAE call letters. As for WCAE being Indiana's first non-commercial station, I'm surprised that it was in fact Indiana's first non-commercial station. Their original network was NET, then became PBS in October 1970. WFWA Fort Wayne, IN was the last non-commercial station to sign on in Indiana. WYIN claims (on their website) they descended from WCAE. Which would jibe with FCC policy on conservation of non-commercial reservations. WFWA was *not* the last non-comm to sign on in Indiana; that title would go to WDTI-69 (WTBU at the time?) Indianapolis, which came on six years later. Yes, WDTI holds a non-commercial license. Oh, Milwaukee? -- only one truly defunct station. WCAE-TV channel 25 operated in the mid-1950s, as a CBS affiliate. They left the air when CBS bought WOKY-TV 19. (CBS also traded WOKYTV's inferior equipment to WCAE-TV in return for WCAE's gear, with the thought that WCAE would continue to operate. With a second VHF station -- WTVW channel 12 -- already in operation, and a pretty good chance for a third VHF, WITI channel 6 -- WCAE decided not to continue.) There was a permit for channel 31 but it never operated. Nashville's channel 17 has had at least one false start. Other than LPTVs I can't think of any other truly defunct stations in Middle Tennessee. WKBF 61 in Cleveland, a Kaiser-owned independent, went dark in 1975. The frequency was later occupied by another indie, WCLQ, which later became WQHS (home shopping network), and is now a Univision O&O. Mobile, Alabama used to have a station with the call letters WKAB-TV; it was the first TV station in the area to begin broadcasting. Here is a link to a series of articles about the history of WKAB-TV in Mobile. When I looked back on that one, I didn't realize that now WDTI used to be WBTU, a former PBS station. Now as for WCAE/WGMI mess I found wasn't easy. Newsweb Corp. was already holding the unbuilt CP for WGMI Gary. They also acquired the WCAE license from the Lake Central School System. Since channel 50 was able to be moved to Chicago for broadcasting purposees (not changing the COL), they applied with the FCC to swap the allocations to make 50 commercial, & 56 non-commercial. The original 56 license that was commercial, but changed to non-commercial, was transferred to what is now the Northwest Indiana Broadcasting Company. The original WCAE license (originally non-commercial, but now commercial), is currently held by Fox Corp. The fact of the manner is that the license WYIN holds did not evolve from the WCAE license. They however did evolve from WCAE in the sense that they're providing a TV station to NW Indiana with programming aimed at NW Indiana. Had the Northwest Indiana Broadcasting Company acted sooner, they would have been broadcasting on 50, & WPWR-TV would have likely stayed on 60. 56 most likely would never made it to the air, & the channel allocation probably would have been deleted. 54 & 33 were also non-commercial allocations for the Chicago market (54 for Kankakee & 33 for Dekalb), but those never went on the air, & have since been deleted. I'm surprised 62 managed to stay on the air in the analog days, with their limited signal. Pittsburgh has had WENS-TV 16, which went dark in 1957 after it's transmitter was damaged in a

storm. Two new VHF competitors were about to sign on, and it was deemed not economically feasible to rebuild. The license was later transferred and the station returned some years later as public broadcaster WQEX. Channel 53 has gone kaput twice. Once in the 1950's after a brief existence as WJKF. And then in the early 70's as WPGH (it was on for a few years, off for three, and back on again). Also several LPTV's on 29, 35, 63. The obvious example in Hartford/New Haven would be the old WHCT-TV channel 18 of Hartford. They were the market's first CBS affiliate as WGTH-TV. They were then an independent station. Even Dr. Gene Scott's people owned it for a few years. Then came the controversial sale to Astroline Communications in the mid-1980s. They tried to compete with then-independent WTXXTV channel 20 of Waterbury and pre-FOX WTIC-TV channel 61 of Hartford. Outside of some Hartford Whalers NHL games, I can't remember anything else worth watching. They were forced off the air in April of 1991 by the FCC. They were nearly entirely running as a home shopping channel by then. It came back on around 1997 and looked like they would become the market's PAX affiliate. Today, the station is WUVN-TV, a Univision affiliate owned by Entravision. In Greenville, SC market: WAIM 40 (CBS/ABC later Indiependent) around 1979. Came back as indie WAXA 40 in the mid 1980s, after losing the FOX affiliation to WHNS 21 in 1988 following Frank Outlaw's death, suffererd Chapter 11 and went dark on August 31, 1989. If WAXA was still on the air in 1990-onwards, it would pick up Match Game (1990 ABC revival), and other ABC shows prempted from WLOS 13 (if it wasn't simalcast), and syndicated shows we never got to see in GSP like Hogan Family,Perfect Strangers, etc. Today it's WMYA My40. Also last year WNEG 32 (despite having an inadequate signal/pay-TV coverage in it's home market) which was then a commercial indie became non-commercial WUGA. As a result, GSP viewers didn't get to see Punk'd, The Hills, Storm Stories, The Daily Buzz, and the rest of Steve Harvey's first year on Family Feud until WMYA My40 regain Family Feud this season. WLKT-TV channel 62 in Lexington Ky. It came and went before anyone really knew it was there. Also on channel 62 in Lexington several years later was WBLU LP. It is gone now. ...Channel 25 was WCAN-TV, matching their co-owned radio station WCAN/1250... ...and, up Highway 41 from Milwaukee: Fond du Lac: KFIZ-TV/34, independent/CBS secondary, 16 December 1968 to 19 November 1972 Neenah: WNAM-TV/42, ABC, 10 December 1953 to 2 January 1955 (license morphed into WFRV/5 Green Bay) Oshkosh: WOSH-TV/48, NBC, 27 June 1953 to 22 March 1954 (assets used to build WMBV/11 Marinette) There have been a few in Southeast Michigan... - WDCP-TV in University Center - originally WUCM and later WDCQ, was a PBS station on Channel 19. The station had a full-power repeater on Channel 35 in Bad Axe (WDCQ, originally WUCX and later WDCP - confused yet?). When the DTV transition took place, it was decided to use one digital transmitter instead of two analog transmitters, so the Bad Axe station was kept while WDCP was shut down entirely. Interestingly, the remaining WDCQ now uses 19.1 for its PSIP, instead of 35.1. - WPAG-TV in Ann Arbor, an early UHF station, broadcast on Channel 20 from 1953 to 1957

- WJMY-TV in Allen Park (a suburb of Detroit) took over Channel 20, got a CP, and broadcast a test card one night in 1968. It never came back on the air. The Channel 20 allocation later went to independent WXON-TV, now MyNetworkTV affiliate WMYD. - WFHD-LP in Ann Arbor was a repeater of Detroit's WDWO-CA (TCT) on Channel 27, now silent. - W67AJ in Ann Arbor was a repeater of CBS affiliate WLAJ-TV in Lansing. The translator was owned by Eastern Michigan U, and has been off the air since 2007. - WXON-LP in Flint - no relation to WXON/WMYD in Detroit - broadcast starting in 1999 on Channel 54. Its license was cancelled by the FCC in January of this year, although I don't know when it actually signed off. The station's Wikipedia article says it was an independent station. - WTAC-TV in Flint signed on in 1953 on Channel 16, and went off the air after less than a year. It was affiliated with ABC and DuMont. On the Canadian side of the border in Western Ontario, the only station that has actually ceased broadcasting was digital-only CKXT-DT-2 in London, a short-lived rebroadcast station for the nowdefunct CKXT-TV in Toronto. Also in Arizona: Full power: KPOL broadcast on channel 40 in Tucson from 1985 before going dark in 1989. The license lay dormant until it was purchased out of bankruptcy and launched as KHRR in 1992. KTFL was a FamilyNet affiliate in Flagstaff, broadcasting on channel 4 from 2000 through 2006, when the license was canceled and call sign deleted. Low power: There have been about 160 low power licenses canceled throughout the State of Arizona, mostly from small community-owned translator associations who no longer wished to maintain a translator system once DBS became widely available. In the Phoenix area: KUSK/KAZT owned four stations that served as translators for the full power Prescott station: K17BU Mesa broadcast from Usery Mtn. in Mesa. Became K57HX when it was displaced by KPHO's digital operations. When it came time to clear the 700 MHz band, the owners of K57HX chose to shutter the station instead. K49DF Phoenix covered the west valley from the White Tanks Mtns. Was displaced when channel 49 was assigned to KASW for digital operations. Became K18GH, but interference from KTVW 33 crippled the station and it shut down. K55EH Phoenix covered the central and north valley from Shaw Butte. Once the primary translator for KUSK, once KHSK 27 became KAZT-CD, the channel 55 signal was redundant. The station went dark and twelve months later, the FCC canceled the license. K43CO Casa Grande broadcast to central Pinal County, including Casa Grande, Eloy, Coolidge and Florence, from 1989 until 2010, when the FCC canceled the license, presumably at the licensee's request. I remember seeing TV listings for both of Tucson's UHF independents in the late-'80s, and I thought KPOL was more aggressively programmed than KDTU-18 (an independent owned by the Diocese of Tucson, now MNT station KTTU) and also had stereo sound (which KDTU/KTTU didn't). By 1989, KDTU and KPOL were in bad financial shape, but a company by the name of Clear Channel came to KDTU's rescue and that sale sealed the fate for KPOL. Tucson did not have room for three English-language independent stations (this included Fox affiliate KMSB-TV 11). Fast forward to 2012, and both KMSB and KTTU are now operated by CBS affiliate KOLD-TV, a sign of how weak Tucson still is as a TV market. An example of a typical KPOL nightly sign-off can be seen here. If you go back to the 1970's, Phoenix's KPAZ-TV 21 can also be considered a once-"defunct"

station. They were on the air from 1967 until 1977 as first a bilingual independent, then a Christianleaning independent. The transmitter was repossessed in 1977 and the station stayed dark for several months until Trinity Broadcasting Network stepped in and assumed the license and put the station back on the air. I believe KeithE4 mentioned Channel 61 (K61CA) as an example of a station that was short lived. It was on the air from early 1983 until October of 1984 as a locally-programmed music video station, years before The Box came to town on now-defunct K58DV (which became KPHZ-LP, then KDTPLP--what remains of the station is piggybacked on a subchannel of KDPH-LD as "58.1" with Jewelry Television shopping). Forgot to add one, KCWT-27 Wenatchee, WA, 1984-1993. Had been an independent, then turned into a satellite of KCPQ-13 in Seattle [FOX], before turning into Channel America, and finally a TBN affiliate until 1993, when it's transmitter malfunctioned and KCWT went to TV Heaven. -crainbebo In Ventura, CA, part of the Los Angeles market, there was KKOG-TV channel 16 (the call letters stood for Kalifornia's Koast of Gold). This station existed for a whopping nine months, from December 1968 to September 1969. There is no channel 16 in the Los Angeles market now. The frequencies occupied by UHF channel 16 have long since been reallocated from TV in Ventura to mobile radio in L.A. Then from May 5, 1974, to December 23, 1975, there was KVST-TV channel 68 (the call letters stood for K Viewer Sponsored Television, since the station was owned by the Viewer Sponsored Television Foundation. Various technical problems led to this station's demise after a mere 19 months. In May 1987, the Black Television Workshop returned channel 68 to the air as KEEF-TV. By August 8 of that year, KEEF-TV was gone, due to the FCC's Mass Media Bureau shutting the station down for using antennas and antenna height other than those which were authorized by the Commission. Obviously, the removal of channels above 51 from TV use as part of the 2009 digital transition, channel 68 is gone forever. The only defunct low-power station in the Los Angeles market that I can think of is Almavisin translator K55KD, which had to file for an STA to move to channel 57 due to interference complaints lodged by Qualcomm, which had purchased exclusive rights to broadcast on the frequencies occupied by UHF channel 55. The station is still on the air today, as WXFT-DT. After WSNS picked up the SIN affiliation, WBBS gave its weekday hours to WPWR, and kept its weekend hours for Spanish movies. After WPWR moved to channel 50, channel 60 was sold to HSN, and became WEHS in 1986, then Telefutura and WXFT in 2002. CBS is Lansing was, and still is, WLNS, and W67AJ repeated that station. We had that wireless "UHF" cable service here in Fresno, it was called Choice TV, it went dark also, as far as stations going dark and not coming back there was one in the 50s on channel 27 that carried the Dumont network, other than that KFRE CBS 12 switching to Channel 30 and KAIL 53 (MNT) switching to channel 7 recently all original stations still exist. ...KCOK-TV/27 Fresno apparently was announced as a DuMont affiliate in an ad in the Fresno Bee, but never actually took to the air ...

Here in Boston, we had WTAO-56, the market's first UHF station, which went on the air September 28, 1953 (carrying a handful of DuMont or ABC programs but never a "full time" affiliate of either network). WTAO went off the air two-and-a-half years later, on March 30, 1956. The station failed because not many sets in the area could get UHF at a time when most set owners had access to three (or some, even four) VHF stations: WBZ-4 and WNAC-7 from Boston plus WMUR-9 Manchester (beginning in 1954) and/or WJAR-10 Providence. WTAO's owners Harvey Radio Labs kept the license, and briefly put the station back on the air in 1962 as an FCC-sponsored test as WXHR-TV, using programming from the Boston Catholic TV Center (according to a Boston Globe article of the period). In 1966, the Channel 56 license along with two radio stations owned by Harvey was sold to a joint venture of Kaiser Broadcasting and the Globe, which put the station back on the air that December as WKBG (it is now WLVI). Further West, in Worcester, there was Channel 14, originally WWOR, later WJZB. As WWOR in the 1950's, it broadcast a few ABC and DuMont shows, and a handful of local programs. After several years off the air, the station reappeared as WJZB, under the same ownership of WWLP-22 in Springfield. While simulcasting "Western Massachusetts Highlights" (a talk show) and the NBC news (then co-anchored by Chet Huntley and David Brinkley) from WWLP, the rest of the time, WJZB was an independent carrying "bargain basement" syndicated programming. Although there were rumors that WWLP was going to try to move WJZB into the Boston market, the station left the air in 1969 after fire destroyed their facilities atop historic Mount Amnesbumskit in Paxton. And north, in New Hampshire, there were two stations that are now defunct: The first was WXPO-50, which launched in the Fall of 1969 as an rather ambitious independent. But the station lost money and went off the air nine months later. Later, there was WNHT-21 in Concord, which was at first an independent, but was later a CBS affiliate. But even that wasn't enough to save it, and it went off the air around 1990. Out in Northwest Massachusetts, there was WRLP-32 in Greenfield. Long a satellite of sister station WWLP, WRLP eventually (late 1970's) became an independent for Western Massachusetts (with a signal that greatly overlapped WWLP's). WRLP carried games of the Boston sports teams (Red Sox and Bruins from WSBK-38; Celtics and Patriots' pre-season games from WBZ), primetime movies, but did also carry NBC's nightly news (by this time, anchored by John Chancellor). WBBS's share of Channel 60 was purchased by WPWR in early 1986 (I'd thought it was late '85), ending the split-schedule arrangement. WPWR moved to Channel 50, and Channel 60 became WEHS in January of '87. For the last year or two, that was it. From the June 8-14, 1968 TV Guide, Eastern New England Edition: Mon - Fri: 6 PM (14) Highlights - Tom Colton (from WWLP) 6:30 (4) (10) (14) {COLOR} News - Chet Huntley, David Brinkley (with note "Ch. 14 does not colorcast") 7 PM (14) News, Weather, Sports (from WWLP)

I can recall two oddities - colorcast or not, the color signal was fed to the transmitter - and produced a weird phase-shifted pattern of several color images over the monochrome background. Also, they must have used a cheap timer or manual remote control - the signal would actually disappear somewhere between 7:30 and 7:45 PM - showing the beginning of whatever NBC show was on WWLP at the time. I remember it stayed on all evening at least once. No, It Was KVVG Tulare, It was before my time , but my grandmother told me when I was like 9, saying that she saw the Dumont Network on 27, and KBAK 29 Bakersfield that Carried Dumont and ABC in the mid 50s. The site KVVG 27 was broadcast at, Eshom Point(Sequoia National Forest), was home for the short lived KICU 43, which went dark in the early 60s and didn't return until 1989 as KSDI. WARNING: LONG Reply. It would have been nice to have had a GSP station showing programs like Hogan Family, Perfect Strangers, Head of the Class, Saved By the Bell (which aired on WYCW 62 for a year when it was brought back to E/I syndication), A Different World (which later aired on WFBC C40, then WHNS Fox Carolina, and finally on WYCW -Your Carolinas' CW 62), children's programs like The Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog (which would, in fact, later air on WFBC C40 when the show was brought back to syndie - in 1993-95 I watched this over the air on Charlotte's WJZY 46 before school, and it later wound up on USA Network), Superhuman Samurai Syber Squad with Matthew Lawrence (which aired on WJZY and on WGN Channel 9 on cable), and game shows like Talk About, Jackpot with Geoff Edwards (syndicated version from 1989-90 after USA Network version went off the air), The 3rd Degree with Bert Convy, John Davidson's $100,000 Pyramid (which I saw on WCNC-36 NBC in Charlotte at noon its first season), The Quiz Kids Challenge, Studs, and Infatuation with Bob Eubanks (the latter two early 90's dating shows). WAXA may have wound up clearing these shows, but I have read old Herald-Journal TV listings from its time on the air. There were programs that I see even game show-heavy WAXA didn't clear such as Wink Martindale's High Rollers, the second and final season of syndicated Sale of the Century with Jim Perry (the first season aired for a few months at 7:30 p.m. on WSPA before Dawson's syndie Family Feud came back to the schedule at 7:30 for its final few months), Split Second with Monty Hall (Canadian 80's version), Bill Cullen's Joker's Wild, Bill Rafferty's Card Sharks (syndicated version concurrent with CBS Daytime Card Sharks with Bob Eubanks), Every Second Counts with Bill Rafferty, Couch Potatoes with Marc Summers, most of Dick Clark's $100,000 Pyramid (which they wound up picking up in the middle of its last season around January 1988 and aired at 6 or 6:30 p.m. weeknights), Yahtzee with Peter Marshall (they had the syndicated Canadian Lingo from the same producers), and the final season of John Davidson's Hollywood Squares (which aired on WSPA-TV at 7:30 p.m. from 1986-88 before being replaced with Ray Combs syndicated Family Feud). They also did not clear the following games from CBS: Body Language from January 1985-January 1986 (which aired at 9:30 a.m. to be replaced with Jim Lange's $100k Name that Tune and later Jim Caldwell's Tic Tac Dough which moved there from WLOS-TV at 7 p.m. when Wink still hosted), Press Your Luck from January-September 1985 (replaced with Caldwell Tic Tac Dough and later either Perfect Match with Bob Goen or Love Connection), Bob Eubanks' Card Sharks from September-March 1988 (replaced with Peter Tomarken's syndicated Wipeout which I thought was a CBS daytime game as a kid), and Chuck Henry's Now You See It (Love Connection aired in this spot; Card Sharks had come back to WSPA for its final month on CBS). I also want to think that WSPA didn't clear the last few months of Family Feud Challenge (CBS Daytime, 1992-93), which could have wound up on WAXA in later years but they never cleared any CBS games previously. And WAXA never cleared any of ABC's daytime sitcom reruns/game shows in the late 80's that WLOS never carried (Perfect Strangers, Mr. Belvedere, Who's the Boss, Growing Pains, Angie, maybe All-Star Blitz/Double Talk/Family Feud/Hot Streak with Bruce Forsyth) It was a GREAT move to pick up Super Password since WYFF didn't clear it and it was a successful, quality game (and NBC's most successful game show in the noon timeslot, lasting 4 1/2 years). They also picked up Double Dare (syndicated version with Marc Summers) from WHNS when it became Super Sloppy Double Dare after Finder's Keepers syndicated version (also on WAXA) went off the

air and moved to Nickelodeon in reruns. I do not understand how Double Dare jumped stations in the middle of a season; I thought WHNS would have had the rights for the entire 1988-89 season (WHNS also aired rival show Fun House with JD Roth for its entire syndicated run and it's Fox Kids season as well as spin-off College Mad House with Greg Kinnear). WAXA might have cleared the syndicated sitcoms (along with second cycles of shows such as Gimme a Break, Silver Spoons, Punky Brewster, Family Ties, Facts of Life, etc and reruns of syndie shows such as New Leave it to Beaver, Out of this World, Small Wonder, and Munsters Today), but from reading their schedule, they were not a very sitcom-heavy station. From what I remember they had: Soap, The Ted Knight Show, Canada's Hangin' In, I Dream of Jeannie, Gidget with Sally Field, Flying Nun, weekend syndies such as Throb, T and T, New Gidget, and Starting From Scratch plus FOX's program lineup from 1986-88. The owner was actually Anthony Kupris, not Frank Outlaw, and he was heavily invested in expanding the station before his death, so we might have seen a wholly upgraded WAXA, the station might have also kept or gained back its Fox affiliation and became "Fox 40". However, the station might have still stayed low-budget or might even have went dark later than it did (or Kupris would have died later in the 90s or so), and the station might have still ended up under Sinclair/WLOS). I think potentially a converted WGGS-16 (becoming a general entertainment station and phasing out religious shows) or an earlier WASV 62 might have also picked at least the sitcoms up (Hogan Family and Perfect Strangers syndication contracts ran out right before WASV signed on in 1997, and WASV brought Step By Step, Hangin' with Mr. Cooper, and Martin along with older classic sitcoms that previously were not seen/had not been seen in years in the GSP market (and they later aired the second cycles of Full House and Family Matters), so the shows could have wound up there for at least a short while). I am actually surprised WHNS didn't clear at least Perfect Strangers since they aired their spinoff Family Matters and also sister show Full House, as well as most of Miller-Milkis-Boyett's shows with Garry Marshall - Happy Days/Laverne & Shirley/Mork & Mindy/Bosom Buddies (but not Angie, which was in local syndication), but Hogan Family I can see station executives going: do we want viewer confusion when one episode airs with Valerie Harper and another with Sandy Duncan? (which was also a sister show to Full House and Family Matters). Hogan Family might have been offered to stations at a bargain (and WAXA had a very low-budget schedule). I guess WHNS didn't get Step By Step because WSPA secured the rights to air on the New 62 WASV. WSPA could have signed on WASV in a Local Marketing Agreement as early as 1993 or 1994. WFBC C40 was on the air from 1995-97 but never picked up the sitcoms, and the only sitcoms they showed until 1997 were shows previously shown on WLOS - Growing Pains, Who's the Boss, Night Court, and Murphy Brown, and they did have Beverly Hillbillies and Brady Bunch reruns). So I think either a later WAXA, an earlier WASV, or a general entertainment WGGS would have showed these programs (WACH Fox 57 in Columbia, SC - formerly WGGS' sister station WCCT - had the Columbia rights to The Hogan Family as well as Martindale's High Rollers and Davidson's Hollywood Squares its last two seasons) or maybe - possibly a FOX-less WHNS 21 with more room on their schedule. Also, WNEG cleared Chappelle's Show but not Reno 911 or the second cycle of South Park (which it might have already been WUGA then). It would have been nice to have Reno while it was syndicated). I personally think WMYA-My40 should now be called WTSH or WTRS-Trash 40 (or WTTF-"Trash TV 40") due to their daytime schedule with Maury/Jerry Springer/Steve Wilkos and other talk shows (and the unbelievably superior MyNetworkTV could go to the also superior WYCW station if The crappy CW goes off the air and MyNet doesn't and the station could get the WASV call letters back and be called My 62 WASV like the old days of The New 62/Super 62/UPN 62). The only good things on 40's lineup are Family Feud, some sitcom repeats overnights, MyNetworkTV's primetime reruns, and the occasional Wheel of Fortune and Jeopardy (which I think should be moved to WSPA/WYCW since my great aunt lives in Duncan, SC and cannot pick up WLOS with no cable/satellite). The 7:00 news could be moved to 4 or 4:30, Jeopardy could air at 4 or 4:30, and Wheel could air at 7 before Scene on 7...or Scene could move to WYCW after their 10 p.m. news and be simply called "Your Scene" or something close and Wheel and Jeopardy could air together from 7-8 with news ar 4/4:30 or a full hour (and dump Judge Judy or Dr. Phil, or only air them on

WYCW). Or WYCW could air the two game shows...but they have too great of a comedy lineup to mess with that. Move Who Wants to Be a Millionaire to a daytime/afternoon slot from overnights, and maybe even get Family Feud from WMYA and Andy Griffith from WYFF and air the B&W episodes weekdays instead of the color ones (air the color ones overnights/weekends/in a lesswatched time slot). I remember them being a semi-satellite of KAYU-28 out of Spokane (also FOX) for awhile -- this would be before the LPTV FOX affiliates launched in Yakima and the Tri-Cities. In the Tri-Cities, you first had KBWU 66 [which IIRC was a satellite of KAYU], and Yakima first had a translator of KAYU, K68EB on TV-68. KBWU later morphed into KFFX 11 which is full-power, and K68EB turned into KCYU-LP, still on 68, but it later moved to 41 where it is today. -crainbebo ...there was WNHT-21 in Concord, which was at first an independent, but was later a CBS affiliate. But even that wasn't enough to save it, and it went off the air around 1990... IIRC, it signed off at midnight, right in the middle of CBS' main late-night offering at the time, the now-defunct "Pat Sajak Show." Not a way to go out in a blaze of glory. Embarrassed What doomed 21 was becoming a CBS affiliate as since NH cable also carried WNEV and WGME at the time they could not get any traction. 20 years earlier both WMUR and WXPO were mentioned as possible CBS affiliates to make ONE viewer happy -one William Paley who could not get CBS at his summer home north of Laconia and for a few years CBS paid AT&T long lines a small fortune for a microwave hop to the home. What would be interesting, is to discuss how many stations got as far as securing a construction permit, taking an option on a studio and transmitter location, and maybe even getting as far as firing up a test pattern, before throwing in the towel and stopping short of ever getting even a day of scheduled programming on the air. In Buffalo, NY, the abortive Channel 59 and Channel 17, which did get on the air for a few months or a few years in the 1950s, were already mentioned. Just to the east in Rochester, Channel 15, WCBF (allied with longtime top 40 powerhouse WBBF) was a live construction permit for years although it never got a signal on the air--and a Channel 27 station, which was going to be another joint venture of WHEC and WVET while serving as the city's ABC affiliate, was on the books in the late 1950s (although without a callsign being assigned) before Channel 13 was assigned to the city as a third VHF in 1959 and got on the air to stay three years later. In Syracuse, a third VHF was granted a CP on Channel 10 just before the 1948 freeze as WAGE-TV (companion to then-WAGEAM 620) and had an option on a Sentinel Heights tower site, but never got built--WAGE-AM later changed hands and became Meredith-owned WHEN-TV's sister station WHEN (AM). Syracuse waited until 1962 for its third VHF on channel 9. There are a surprising number of buildings out there that were built as TV studio facilities by radio broadcasters in the 1940s and 1950s who were absolutely certain they'd be getting TV licenses. At least a few of them never got those TV licenses, or got CPs they never built. We had one in Rochester that you might not know about, Bob...the studio building at 191 East Avenue was constructed around 1951 by WRNY radio, complete with upstairs studios for WRNY 680 and WRNY-FM 97.9 and a big TV studio and control room in the basement for a future WRNYTV. After WRNY failed to prevail in the four-way battle for channel 10 (they were granted a channel 27 permit that was never built), they didn't need that big building, so they sold it around 1955 to WHEC

and it became the home of WHEC 1460 and WHEC-TV 10 for the next quarter-century. (It was demolished in 1979 and the land where it sat is now the parking lot of the current WHEC studio building next door.) A good example being the aforementioned WKJF-TV 53 in Pittsburgh. A WKJF-FM radio station did take to the air and still remains (as KDKA-FM, The Fan 93.7). Before moving into the CBS cluster this station was in a HUGE studio building at the base of it's tower in the Mt. Washington section of Pittsburgh. Built to accommodate Channel 53 studios, no doubt. Now largely empty except for the 93.7 transmitter, it is perched dangerously close to the edge of the cliff. In addition to the already mentioned WKBF/61 here (yes, definitely a different license than what is today's WQHS/61, a Univision O&O, with a long gap between WKBF and WCLQ)... There's, of course, WICA/15 Ashtabula, in the far northeast corner of the market. Wikipedia: UHF Morgue (reprint of a 1995 Ashtabula Star-Beacon article): On the air briefly in the 1950s and again briefly in the 1960s. Attached to 970/97.1, today's WFUN and WREO-FM... Channel 36 in Atlanta had a couple of false starts; the first being around 1954 (as WQXI-TV, which became Channel 11's call letters from 1968-73) and whose biggest program was a Saturday-night country-music show. Then there was the first WATL, owned by U.S. Communications, from 196971. 36 returned as WATL in 1976 and has remained on the air, today being a duopoly with WXIA. Channel 38 in St. Petersburg was the Bay Area's first station, WSUN (1953) but suffered some of the same problems as WNAO: in 1955 two VHFs, WFLA (NBC) and WTVT (then-CBS) came on and 38 ended up with ABC. In 1965 ABC got a VHF, WLCY/10 (now WTSP, the CBS affiliate). 38 tried to make a go as an independent but, starting in 1969, was hopelessly outclassed and outrated by Hubbard's WTOG/44. WSUN gave it up in 1971 but has since returned as WTTA. In Orlando, Channel 35, WSWB, had a very brief run in the mid-'70s. It has returned as Fox affiliate WOFL. Greensboro/Winston-Salem/High Point had WTOB/26 (ABC) at roughly the same time WNAO was on in Raleigh (1953-57). Southern Broadcasting didn't leave the market, however, being the original owners of WGHP. Around 1967 the market got an independent, WUBC/48, which folded around 1971, IIRC; it returned in 1981 as WGGT and today is MyNetwork affiliate WMYV after a stint as UPN affiliate WUPN. As for Ch. 26 it's part of UNC-TV, WUNL Winston-Salem. In Atlantic City, NJ, there was WFPG-TV on Channel 46. Primary NBC affiliation with secondaries with CBS, ABC, and Dumont. Lasted two years. Maybe an old topic...stations that still "sign-off"...

Checking the network late night television schedule, NBC is probably the only network that doesn't have overnight holes, ABC and CBS have about an hour of free time give to the affiliates, and everybody else can do whatever they want after their local news, except for maybe ION and the "XX.2" networks. With that being said, as of now, are there any U.S. television stations that sign off at night and sign back on the next morning? WOAY Oak Hill/Beckley, WV on Ch. 50 [ABC] signs off nightly. Weeknights it's at 1:06am after Jimmy Kimmel Live. KAPP 35 Yakima, WA [ABC] also signs off nightly, ditto WOAY weeknights, and at 12AM on Saturday night/Sunday morning. KGWC 14 Casper, WY [CBS] signs off at 2AM weeknights after America's Court with Judge Ross, and 1am weekends. KLWY 27 Cheyenne, WY [Fox] signs off at 2AM Mon-Sat and 4AM Sun/Mon Morning. KVRR 15 Fargo, ND [Fox] signs off 12:35AM 7 days a week. WDAZ 8 Grand Forks, ND [ABC] signs off between 2:30 and 4AM anywhere from 15 min to 2+ hrs. -crainbebo KLBK-CBS and KAMC-ABC in Lubbock sign off early on Saturday and Sunday mornings (~2:00 AM t0 5:00) but they show a loop of their weather graphics during this time with no audio. I thought that from a maintenance point of view it was cheaper to leave the transmitter on than to sign off, turn-off the transmitter, and then turn it back on. Also with many stations starting a 4:30 - 5:30 newscast in the morning, the stations cannot be off for all that long. KQDS (Fox) and WDSE (PBS) in Duluth, MN both sign off every night - KQDS at 12:05 AM (12:35 AM on weekends) and WDSE usually between 1 and 2 AM, although during the school year they will usually stay on later one or more nights a week to feed educational programming from Wisconsin Public Television. Unlike a lot of other stations that still sign off, these two go the full distance by completely powering down their transmitters. I believe the CBS, ABC, and Fox stations in the Bismarck-Minot-Williston-Dickinson, ND market still all sign off every night, or most every night. With the advent of digital broadcasting, though, they don't completely leave the air. Instead they play some sort of looped programming or display a station logo or black screen or something along those lines. WDAZ (ABC) in Grand Forks, ND is a semi-satellite of WDAY (ABC) in Fargo, ND and both typically run the exact same schedule. So that means that whenever WDAZ is off the air, WDAY is too. These days when they go off air they simulcast their weather subchannel. Also the CW subchannel on both of their signals stays on the air 24/7. Due to budget cutbacks, I know some PBS networks have had to go back to signing off the air every night. Iowa Public Broadcasting and Nebraska's NET are two that come to mind, at least with regard to the OTA signals. NET provides some cable systems with a dedicated 24/7 stream. Georgia Public Broadcasting USED to sign off. They would play Ray Charles' "Georgia" transposed with beautiful video scenes from around the state. I remember that back in 1998 after a MONTY PYTHON rerun. Plus WNEG 32 (now noncommercial WUGA) used to play that song for their sign off too until they went 24/7 in 2008 after disaffiliating with CBS.

Here's some stations that still sign off: KSL 5 (aka the NBC affiliate owned by Mormons that said no on SNL) I've heard they sign off at 3:30am Mountain Time on Sunday Mornings. KIRO 7 (which used to own by KSL's owners, also a CBS station in Seattle) signs off once a week. WTKR 3 (the CBS affiliate in Virginia Beach, VA) sign off once a week I've heard. WIS 10 (NBC station in Columbia, SC) signs off once a year on Christmas Eve/Morning after the Christmas at the Vatican thing. Pretty uncommon for TV stations to sign off once a year. OK I'll chime in..... WPLG 10 (ABC, Miami) sometimes shuts off late Friday nights at 1:35am or so (good for me the DXer), but it never seems to be a set or symmetrical schedule; I depend on Zap2it to tell me. I say they shut off about every 6 Friday nights. cd ...KLCS/v58 Los Angeles, the backup PBS station here, signs off the air most (all?) nights from 1:00 AM to 5:00 AM... KSL-TV "signs off" the main channel for an hour or two on Saturday and Sunday mornings. The transmitter usually stays on, carrying "Live Well" network and local "KSL WEATHER", though. It's mostly a tradition, but gives us a few minutes to do any studio maintenance (automation, program-chain, etc) that might be awkward to do otherwise, and the transmitter can be powered down on occasion, if needed. I wish all the locals would have a regular shut-down time available, maybe just once a month. It's often a pain to schedule any tests on the common transmitter site, and it would be nice if Cable and satellite had a time slot where they could make changes without worrying about loss of programming. In Milwaukee, there no longer are any stations that sign off. The last hold-out to this practice was Christian broadcaster WVCY-TV (Channel 30). Not long after the digital transition, station ownership went with a 24-7 schedule. Through the mid-90s, WVCY used to braodcast from noon to 11 p.m. and gradually began adding hours to their broadcast schedule. Prior to going 24-7, their broadcast day started at 9 a.m. (8 a.m. weekends) and ended at midnight. As of a year or so ago, when I traveled through the area, WMFD-TV in Mansfield, Ohio used to sign off after midnight. They have since improved and added to their lineup and studios, so not sure if that is still the case. WRAZ (FOX) in Raleigh signs off every Sunday night/Monday Morning at 2:30am and signs back on at 5am. I thought that from a maintenance point of view it was cheaper to leave the transmitter on than to sign off, turn-off the transmitter, and then turn it back on. WBAY in Green Bay used to sign off in full on weekends...until January 2010, when the transmitter went out completely because the on-off cycles it and Wisconsin Public Television (which shares it's tower) did were doing the damage. Now WBAY's .1 airs their .2 weather feed during what used to be off-the-air time on the main channel (the .2 and .3 just program as normal), and WPNE has a still image of WPT's coverage map, which WPT adopted across the entire network. So it seems in the digital age it seems a little more risky to take off the digital transmitter than in the analog age. WFRV goes "off the air" for a half hour on Sunday mornings, but now it's just their weather

computer in loop. Markets without a fullpower PBS Station I know Montana and Wyoming are one of the last states, that didn't have a full power PBS station until 2000's. So far I know these markets that don't have full power PBS stations, and have to rely on nearby cities on LPTV. #122 Santa Barbara, SLO, and Santa Maria, Northern part of the DMA market uses KQED 9 San Francisco, and Southern part of the DMA uses KOCE 50 Hunington Beach/Los Angeles. #126 Bakersfield - Uses KVPT from Fresno. #166 Yuma, El Centro CA. Western DMA uses KPBS from San Diego, and Eastern part of DMA uses KAET 8 from Phoenix. #145 Palm Springs - Uses KVCR from San Bernardino, and KOCE from Hunington Beach/LA. Any others? Rockford, IL has no PBS station of their own. Cable instead pipes in WHA from Madison Wisconsin & WTTW from Chicago. Depending on where someone is located in the Rockford market, it's possible to get one or both stations OTA. Fortunately, both stations are on the UHF in the digital era. Lafayette Indiana is a 1 TV station market (WLFI, a CBS affiliate), & they rely on cable & satellite for their programming. On cable, they get WFYI Indianapolis & WTTW Chicago, along with the subchannels. I don't remember if they also get WTIU Bloomington & WIPB Muncie on cable. OTA, depending on where someone is located, it's possible to get WFYI from Indianapolis or WILL-TV from Champaign, IL OTA. While Terre Haute, IN has 2 PBS stations licensed to their market, both signals only cover the southern part of the market, & both don't even Terre Haute. WTIU Bloomington covers more of the Terre Haute market than WVUT Vincennces, IN & WUSI Olney, IL do. There's stray coverage over Terre Haute. So I believe cable carries WUSI & WVUT, but not sure about WTIU, since it's licensed to the Indianapolis market. No local PBS currently in Tyler/Longview. Most in the market are able to watch KERA/13 from DFW on cable or dish. In the last couple of years, KERA's owner tried to apply for a translator for Tyler. They asked for Ch. 25, but the local 3Angels station was able to move to Ch. 25 from a previous channel, effectively denying KERA's owner their request. There's been no news as to a re-application for another try at a translator channel for KERA in Tyler. it's only about 50 miles from San Bernardino to Palm Springs, KVCR is rebroadcast on two lower-power signals in Palm Springs (KJHP-LP/18 and K09XW/9) and some regular KVCR-only program production actually originates from Palm Springs (Gloria Greer's interview programs, for example), I wouldn't say this actually qualifies as an example.... Dave: I know the Time-Warner system in Terre Haute carries WTIU for its primary PBS. They also make WFYI Indianapolis and WEIU Olney available on premium tiers. WVUT is not on the system at all. How about Monterey Ca, They have to borrow KQED and KQEH from San Francisco. Isn't Watsonville (KQEH) firmly within the Monterey market? Rockford, IL has no PBS station of their own. Cable instead pipes in WHA from Madison Wisconsin & WTTW from Chicago. Depending on where someone is located in the Rockford

market, it's possible to get one or both stations OTA. Fortunately, both stations are on the UHF in the digital era. Lafayette Indiana is a 1 TV station market (WLFI, a CBS affiliate), & they rely on cable & satellite for their programming. On cable, they get WFYI Indianapolis & WTTW Chicago, along with the subchannels. I don't remember if they also get WTIU Bloomington & WIPB Muncie on cable. OTA, depending on where someone is located, it's possible to get WFYI from Indianapolis or WILL-TV from Champaign, IL OTA. Lafayette had a non-comm channel allocation in the analog era (originally 47, then 24 when Indiana and Illinois allocations were moved around in the mid '60s), but for some reason Purdue University never put a station on the air. I don't know if that allocation was kept after the digital transition. Quote While Terre Haute, IN has 2 PBS stations licensed to their market, both signals only cover the southern part of the market, & both don't even Terre Haute. WTIU Bloomington covers more of the Terre Haute market than WVUT Vincennces, IN & WUSI Olney, IL do. There's stray coverage over Terre Haute. So I believe cable carries WUSI & WVUT, but not sure about WTIU, since it's licensed to the Indianapolis market. Indiana State University had a CP for WISU-TV going back to the early '60s, first on 36, then 26 after the above-mentioned allocation swaps, but AFAIK it never went on the air. I don't know if Terre Haute still has a non-comm allocation. Waco, TX has no PBS station anymore [KWBU was shut down in 2010 due to lack of funding]. KAMU in College Station and KERA Dallas/KUHT Houston are the distant PBS stations that are probably pulled in that area. -crainbebo Waco still has KNCT, licensed to nearby Belton (near Temple). Maps show that it still has a strong signal in the city and the 60 dBu line is a little north of the city. All unused allocations were deleted with the digital transition. It looks as if the WISU-TV permit expired before transition, so that allocation is gone as well. IIRC, the CP for WISU-TV expired sometime in the early '70s. I lived about 50 miles from TH at the time, and I don't remember it ever going on the air even for testing. Perhaps Utica, NY? They'd likely rely on WCNY-TV channel 24 from Syracuse. Also, I don't think Elmira, NY has their own PBS outlet, likely relying on WSKG-TV channel 46 from Binghamton. WSKG had a high-power Elmira translator, W30AA, which they sold off in the early 2000s after realizing that nearly the entire market was on cable. W30AA had a brief second act as WTTX-LP, an independent (and I think very briefly UPN?) run by NBC affiliate WETM 18...and then went away with the DTV transition when the programming moved to WETM's 18.2. But in the meantime, WSKG had had a long-pending application for a full-power channel 30 signal in nearby Corning that was unexpected granted - and so they built it as what I think was the first DTV-only signal in the state. It's now WSKA, a full simulcast of WSKG. As for Utica, it had a high-power WCNY translator, W59AU. That translator lasted past the DTV conversion, and went digital last year as W22DO-D. More markets without their own PBS outlet: Lima, OH (gets fringe service from WBGU Bowling

Green) and Zanesville, OH (served by WOUC-TV Cambridge, which is not technically in the market). No local PBS currently in Tyler/Longview. Most in the market are able to watch KERA/13 from DFW on cable or dish. In the last couple of years, KERA's owner tried to apply for a translator for Tyler. They asked for Ch. 25, but the local 3Angels station was able to move to Ch. 25 from a previous channel, effectively denying KERA's owner their request. There's been no news as to a re-application for another try at a translator channel for KERA in Tyler. Along the same token, Wichita falls also has no full-power PBS outlet -- Wichita Falls has a KERA repeater, while Lawton has an OETA repeater. Waco, TX has no PBS station anymore [KWBU was shut down in 2010 due to lack of funding]. KAMU in College Station and KERA Dallas/KUHT Houston are the distant PBS stations that are probably pulled in that area. The market has one other "local" PBS station -- KNCT from Belton, which serves Temple and Killeen. Cable systems replaced KWBU with KNCT after KWBU ceased operations. WTTX was UPN from Sep. 2004-it's closure in 2006. Then WSKG launched WSKA on 30, AND The CW went to the WB 100+ affiliate WBE, so it went off. -crainbebo The Abilene and San Angelo television markets do not have a PBS affiliate. Suddenlink cable in Abilene and San Angelo pipes in KERA from Dallas. Most of the smaller cable systems in these two markets either pipe in KERA or KRMA from Denver. Can we also say that some states that have statewide PBS networks contain markets that don't technically have their own PBS station, as they receive a PBS station from a neighboring market via a full-power repeater? Laredo doesn't have a PBS affiliate. They don't have an ABC affiliate either. Also in North Texas, no full power PBS in Wichita Falls/Lawton (KERA has or used to have a translator there) or in Sherman/Ada (although Oklahoma's state network is available via translator in much of the market). "Good Morning, America (Or Eight Cities In America We Own Stations In)" ABC is developing new "Alarm Clock" smartphone apps customized for eight cities in which there are ABC O&O's. The first app was launched in Houston (KTRK/13) this week. Wait does your phone already provide an alarm clock? Thinking: WABC (New York), WPVI (Philadelphia), WLS (Chicago), KABC (Los Angeles), WXYZ (Detroit), KTRK (Houston), KGO (San Francisco)...who am I missing? WXYZ-TV is owned by Scripps. ABC had to sell it when Cap Cities bought the company in '86. The other ABC O&Os are KFRE/30 Fresno & WTVD/11 Durham NC. Both had been Cap Cities stations. Funny you mentioned WXYZ, I wonder what have Disney/ABC would have done back in the 1990s

to secure that station back in its ownership fold when Scripps was toying with allowing all its stations to switch to CBS. Unless they reverted, the Fresno station has been called KFSN-TV since 1971. I know for fact Disney/ABC is glad its still has its hands on WTVD (ABC11) in this rapidly growing Southern market (unlike NBC-Universal whom was stupid enough to unload WNCN to Media General in 2006). I wouldn't be surprised if the Raleigh-Durham-Fayetteville market wind up in the top 20 largest markets within the next 10 years considering they have jettisoned from the top 30s to top 25 in the last 10 years. KTRK had the absolute dumbest on-air explainer when the app launched earlier this week. Their "Consumer Reporter" Jeff Ehling fronted it at their (over-hyped, yet underwhelming) touchscreen "Smartboard." Apparently, with the app, you can set the alarm to the "Breaking News" stinger the station uses. KTRK had the absolute dumbest on-air explainer when the app launched earlier this week. Their "Consumer Reporter" Jeff Ehling fronted it at their (over-hyped, yet underwhelming) touchscreen "Smartboard." Apparently, with the app, you can set the alarm to the "Breaking News" stinger the station uses. It probably was a nice asset, but NBCUniversal wanted cash - I think to reduce debt. The merger itself brought a number of cable assets, and broadcast assets weren't valued as much relatively. NBCUniversal even tried to sell the Miami NBC at one point (crazy given that they co-own the Telemundo affiliate). NBCUniversal and Disney in general are less interested in owning broadcast affiliates and more into cable networks. NBC sold WNCN with 3 other stations to Media General so it was bundled in the deal- not like they chose sold it alone. Somewhat like those DVD packs at Wal-Mart and Best Buy: Buy 3 movies for $15, and there is atleast one flop in that package. Raleigh was bundled with Columbus (small growth projections), Providence(market overshadowed by Boston), and Birmingham. In the top 3 markets and some more (up to top 10), it's a necessity to own the stations but after that, it's marginal. Disney hasn't bought a station when it could have. For both, it's a better return on investment starting a cable network, bundle it with another cable net, and let it grow over time (and gets national exposure as well). Fox and CBS take a different approach however,primarily due to their history. Fox itself doesn't deal with as many affiliate groups - it's mainly Sinclair, bankrupt Tribune owning a few, Cox, a cable company, owning a few. From that point, Fox has gone solo and has had to keep exposure of Fox mostly on its own. The big thing now of course are sites like YouTube and Facebook, which are self-created, rather than affiliates. If Disney or NBCUniversal could get some venture that is successful like them, they'd prefer that over affiliate ownership. I can't understand why ABC has never looked for stations in the South and Southwest (WTVD and KTRK excepted). We've said at other times that WFTV Orlando would be a logical choice for an o&o, since Disney World is located there, less likely WSB Atlanta and WFAA Dallas/Ft. Worth, flagship stations of Cox and Belo, respectively. But how about WSOC Charlotte, WPLG Miami, WKRN Nashville, or KSAT San Antonio? And how about something better in New Orleans, even it

means buying WWL or WDSU? On the subject, NBC sold two Southern o&os to Media General; besides WNCN it unloaded WVTM Birmingham, which I hear has gone south big time since the sale (perennial doormat WIAT, Birmingham's CBS affiliate, has come on really strong). I also wouldn't mind seeing CBS make an offer for either WBTV Charlotte or WRAL Raleigh. A few months back the rumor mill was stirring with suggestions that CBS was going to buy WAGA and it would once again be Atlanta's CBS station, but that obviously isn't going to happen. I think ABC/Disney and NBCUniversal have a more astute reading of the nature and direction that broadcast television is going to take within the next decade. While there is value in owing stations in large markets, eventually the networks will likely be gone and will transition into national cable networks. So owning a broadcast affiliate in New York or Los Angeles will continue to bring you revenue down the line, even once these stations are strong independents that still offer local news and syndicated fare, because there are enough eyeballs to sustain these stations and make money. Owning stations in small markets becomes less important, though, to the long term cash flow equation. Its tantamount to the large newspaper groups selling off newspapers in smaller cities within the past 15 years. Fox and CBS seem to fine with amassing large television groups. Fox originally did it out of necessity, as the New World deal propelled them into actual relevancy. They might have died on the vine as a network, otherwise. CBS is still very much an old school media company, in that they still own clusters of radio stations in various markets, along with outdoor advertising, book publishing, etc. Of course, they have had the forethought to essentially place all of the old school mediums into one corporation (CBS), while effectively spinning off the cable networks and other properties ripe for growth into a second company (Viacom) that won't be dragged down by any decline in reveneues at CBS. Fox is still very much stuck in the old thinking that a media conglomerate needs to own everything from radio to broadcast stations to a movie studio and so on, but we all saw what happened to the granddaddy of all media conglomerates (AOL Time Warner). I agree but I don't think the broadcast networks will become cable networks atleast so easily. It'd be too many hoops to jump through. Also local news (say WRC's local news) fits very well with NBC News and successful programs like 'Today' and those national shows would suffer going cable only. The coupling is too strong. However, I suspect scripted dramas and comedies may disappear from broadcast network at some point earlier. Like NBC going with Celebrity Apprentice Season #45, ABC with Dancing With The Stars Season #45, and reality TV, sensational type news programming (like Nancy Grace) across both of those networks lineups over scripted programming. Some people will make a lot of money like Trump, Nancy Grace, etc., but most actors, writers, etc. will not find work through television. I'd be curious to know the the source of this rumor as I very much doubt FOX/Newscorp would sell a competitive O&O in a top 10 market. All four of the networks have shed smaller-market assets in the last 5-10 years, the latest deal involved ABC O&Os in Toledo and Flint. That left Fresno & Raleigh/Durham as the two smallest markets in the ABC fold. As stated before, probably growth opportunities with Raleigh/Durham and I believe I read they kept Fresno because the station serves as their test bed for things that are later rolled out across the O&Os. I doubt Disney/ABC will buy new TV stations. I looked at Disneys 10-K Sec records and they tend to put emphasis on their theme parks, and cable divisions, Studio divisions rather than spending

money on Local TV. I remember back in 2006 and 2007 they sold radio stations with an ABC Radio affiliation to Citadel Broadcasting (Now Cumulus inc). The Flint and Toledo ABC O&Os were apparently originally purchased as backup for Detroit at one point, but were no longer needed. It's somewhat interesting that Flint is it's own TV market, as it's considered part of the combined statistical area with Detroit now. In Raleigh, ABC could sell the affiliate to Hearst which owns the NBC affiliate in Greensboro. There might be some synergistic benefit for Hearst owning stations that are driving distance apart (e.g. WBAL WGAL), however it's obviously not a great as owning the two in the same market. In some cases, ABC should have bought out the station. St. Louis is a market that ABC should have bought out the ABC affiliate-from Sinclair, even if it was to just flip it and sell it off to a better station group. It's known to be a weak ABC affiliate for a mid-size market. Well I'm surprised that Disney Never got WJLA 7 in Washington DC in 2006-2007 when they sold the ABC radio stations to Citadel. Apparently, not the case with this new "alarm clock" - in fact, according to the rollout schedule, I think Fresno will be one of the last markets that gets their own. There were rumors more than a decade ago that ABC had made overtures to Albritton about buying WJLA, but Albritton wanted them to buy all their broadcast assets (which ABC didn't want). How many digital TV channels (including subchannels) does your area receive? Duluth has 12. Only a few, but a lot better than the 4-6 we had during the analog days. 3.1 KDLH (CBS) 3.2 Northland CW (CW) 6.1 KBJR (NBC) 6.2 My 9 (MNTV) 8.1 WDSE 8.2 WDSE Second Chance 8.3 Create 8.4 MN Channel 10.1 WDIO (ABC) 10.2 Me TV 21.1 KQDS (FOX) 27.1 KCWV (My Family TV) How many does your area have? What's the location that can receive the most channels OTA with a regular (small rooftop yagi) antenna? I pick up 12 stations here in central Pa with a winegaurd 8800 outdoor antenna w/ preamp: 3.1 WPSU (PBS) 3.2 Create 3.3 World 6.1 WJAC (NBC) 6.2 MeTV 10.1 WTAJ (CBS) 23.1 WATM (ABC) 23.2 WWCP (FOX) 23.3 THIS TV

29.1 WHVL (MYNET) 29.2 America One 47.1 Cornerstone No CW in this market There's lots in the Chicago market, but I'm only gonna focus on what I can pick up with my outdoor antennas & pre-amp in Gary, IN. Antennas are Antennacraft CS600 for VHF & Winegard HD9032 & HD-1080 for UHF (HD-1080 for just 1 station), & pre-amp is RCA TVPRAMP1R pre-amp with separate VHF & UHF ports. 2.1 WBBM-TV (CBS) (RF 12) 5.1 WMAQ-TV (NBC) (RF 29) 5.2 Nonstop 7.1 WLS-TV (ABC) (RF 7 & RF 44, but get better reception from RF 7) 7.2 Livewell Network in HD 7.3 Livewell Network in SD 9.1 WGN-TV (CW) (RF 19) 9.2 Antenna TV 11.1 11.2 11.3 11.4 13.1 13.2 13.3 13.4 WTTW (PBS) (RF 47) (main channel programming in HD) WTTW Prime (PBS) (PBS without children's programming, & locally programmed) Create V-Me WOCK-CD (Mega TV) (RF 4) WOCH-CA (KBS or Arirang, not sure) LATV America One

18.1 WHNW-LD (World Harvest TV from LeSea) (RF 18) (viewable mainly in northern Lake County Indiana) 20.1 WYCC (PBS) (RF 21) 20.2 WYCC in SD 20.3 Mhz Worldview 23.1 WWME-LD (MeTV) 23.2 Bounce 23.3 MeTV simulcast, until new programming becomes available 25.1 25.2 25.3 25.4 26.1 26.2 26.3 26.4 26.5 W25DW-D (HSN) (RF 25) Telos TV Sonlife Infomercials WCIU (Independent) (RF 27) U Too (time shifted programming & shows not found on 26.1) WWME-LD simulcast (MeTV) WMEU-CD simulcast (MeToo) (local MeTV) This TV

32.1 WFLD (Fox) (RF 31)

38.1 WCPX (Ion) (RF 43) 38.2 Qubo 38.3 Ion Life 44.1 WSNS (Telemundo) (RF 45) 44.2 Exitos TV 44.3 SOI TV 48.1 WMEU-CD (MeToo) (RF 32) (local MeTV) 50.1 WPWR-TV (My Network TV) (RF 51) 56.1 56.2 56.3 56.4 WYIN (PBS) (RF 17) (need Winegard HD-1080 for this station, & station is in HD) WYIN simulcast, & in HD Lakeshore Kids (locally programmed children's programming, & in widescreen SD) WYIN simulcast in widescreen SD

57.1 WDCI-LD (Daystar) (RF 30) 60.1 WXFT (Telefutura in HD) (RF 50) 60.2 WXFT in SD 62.1 WJYS (Independent) (RF 36) (brokered station) 62.2 WEDE-CA simulcast (Independent) (all religious programming) 62.4 WJYS (separate channel for brokered programming) 66.1 WGBO-DT (Univision) San Diego is not so hot on the digital subchannel front... 6.2* Canal 5 (Televisa) 8.2 ME-TV (KFMB-TV/CBS) 10.2 Cool TV 10.15 TV Azteca 15.2 VMe 69.2 Antenna TV 69.3 This TV 39.2 NBC California Non-Stop 50.1 (Low power) TVC (Spanish) 50.2 Milenio 50.3 Mexicanal 50.4 Vmas If you have a big antenna, you can pick up the following from LA * if atmospheric conditions are favorable 4.2 NBC California Non-Stop LA 5.2* Antenna TV (KTLA)

5.3* This TV 11.2 KTTV (Standard Def) 13.2 Bounce (KCOP) 28.2-4* KCET 40.1* TBN 40.2* The Church Channel 40.3* Enlace 40.4* JCTV 50.1* 50.2* 50.3* 50.4* 63.1* 62.2* 63.3* 63.4* PBS SoCal PBS SoCal Daystar PBS OC KBEH Trs3 (MTV3) Spanish language brokered religious programming KBEH Trs3 (MTV3) Simulcast Spanish language brokered religious programming

(Cox Cable in San Diego fudges having to pay MTV Networks to carry Trs3 by carrying KBEH-TV, which, incidentally, does not show Trs3's late night block, but shows "The Liquidation Channel." The Houston area has an amazing number of digital offerings: KPRC 2.1 NBC/.2 This/.3 blank (formerly LATV) KUHT 8.1 PBS/.2 Create & time-shifted .1 programming/.3 V-Me/.4 taping for the blind KUVM-LD 10.1 blank KHOU 11.1 CBS/.2 Bounce KTRK 13.1 ABC/.2 Live Well HD/.3 Live Well SD KETH 14.1 TBN/.2 Chuch Channel/.3 JCTV/.4 EnlaceUSA/.5 Smile of a Child KVVV 15.1 blank KTXH 20.1 MyNetworkTV KVQT 21.1 Triunfo/.2 Familia TV/.3 Keys TV/.4 TuVsion/.5 Infomercials/.6 Urban Houston Network/.7-.9 blank KLTJ 22.1 Daystar KRIV 26.1 Fox KUVM-CD 34.1 blank/.2 RTV/.3-.6 blank KZHO 38.1 Vision Celestial/.2 Vida Vision/.3 music/.4 NJC-TV/.5 unk/.6-.8 blank KIAH 39.1 CW/.2 AntennaTV KHLM 43.1 Multimedios TV/.2 mbc/.3 TV de Houston/.4 Bendicion TV/.5 unk/.6 Altavision/.7 Melinio TV/.8 Urban TV KXLN 45.1 Univision/.2 simulcast of KFTH (SD) KBPX 46.1 Wikipedia says The Country Network. I can't get it to tune-in to verify this. KTMD 47.1 Telemundo/.2 Exitos/.3 Canal SOI KPXB 49.1 Ion/.2 Qubo/.3 Ion Life KYAZ 51.1 Azteca America/.2 VietFace TV/.3 Saigon TV/.4 New Tang Dynasty/.5 Global TV/.6 Immigrante TV/.7 LATV KTBU 55.1 MegaTV/.2 VanTV/.3 NacionTV/.4 MiCasa/.5 ITV (asian)/.6 CCTV News KUBE 57.1 Ind./.2 La Mera/.3 BYN/.4 Me-TV KZJL 61.1 Estrella/.2 Immigrante KFTH 67.1 Telefutura/.2 simulcast of KXLN (SD)

What is it about the spanish-language broadcasters that makes them much more likely to multi-plex their signal out the wazoo? Salt lake City has 11 low-power and 29 full-power Digital TV channels. Also, one or two outside the SLC area, that are hard to pick up in SL County (Daystar, etc). In SW Fla approx 35 mi SW of the Fort Myers transmitters, I get 6 stations NBC 20, CBS11,ABC26 FOX36 CW36 and a religious channel 49. Not even a sniff of PBS on 30 but I don't watch PBS very much. With subs a total of 11 channels. Antenna "system" is a 20 y.o (or more) indoor RCA with a UHF loop/dish. Sits on top of an empty waste basket near the top of the ceiling in a N facing window. Super lo tech but effective, 100% reliable day/night. Not bad for a 50 cent yard sale find. Had a more expensive amplified indoor antenna that only got 2 stations CW 46 and the pray per view on 49. In my opinion, consider a passive vs amplified antenna 1st for indoor reception. Every night I get the Tampa-St. Pete stuff from 60 mi N. The most reliable ones are ABC 28, PBS on 16, MY on 38, and Univision on 62. With subs that 10 more. The Tampa stuff generally comes in from 7-10 or 11PM and then disappears. The only one I really watch in that direction is My TV. Since I don't watch much stuff during the day, my setup works. Pretty slim pickings here in Rochester NY (but then, we only had five full-power analogs back in the day, too): WROC (RF 45): 8.1 CBS/8.2 Bounce WHEC (RF 10): 10.1 NBC/10.2 MeTV/10.3 weather WHAM (RF 13): 13.1 ABC/13.2 CW WXXI (RF 16): 21.1 PBS/21.2 World/21.3 Create WUHF (RF 28): 31.1 Fox/31.2 TheCoolTV W42CO-D (RF 42): 42.1 TCT religion, 42.2/3/4 more religion Many parts of town can also see the Buffalo-market ion outlet, WPXJ (RF 23) Batavia, which runs the usual four ion streams on 51.1/2/3/4 from a site somewhat closer to Rochester than Buffalo. (Where's MyNetworkTV? It's on an analog LPTV, WBGT 40, which has supposedly flash-cut to digital but not on a signal I can see here without cable. No Antenna, no This, no RTV, none of the Spanish-language networks....)Hartford/New Haven (CT)... WFSB Hartford: 3-1 (CBS), 3-2 (CBS 3 Springfield, MA), 3-3 (Eyewitness News NOW), 3-4 (WFSB Fairfield County) WTNH New Haven: 8-1 (ABC), 8-2 (Bounce TV) WUVN Hartford: 18-1 (UNI), 18-2 (LATV), 18-3 (Telefutura) WCCT Waterbury: 20-1 (CW), 20-2 (ThisTV) WEDH Hartford: 24-1 (PBS), 24-2 (CPTV 4U), 24-3 (CPTV Sports) WHPX New London: 26-1 (ION), 26-2 (Huh) WVIT New Britain: 30-1 (NBC), 30-2 (Weather Plus) WEDN Norwich: see WEDH Hartford WCTX New Haven: 59-1 (MY), 59-2 (TheCool TV) WTIC Hartford: 61-1 (FOX), 61-2 (Antenna TV) WEDY New Haven: see WEDH Hartford PROVIDENCE 6.1 WLNE-ABC PROV 6.2 Live Well Network 10.1 WJAR-NBC

10.2 METV 12.1 WPRI-CBS 12.2 COOL TV 28.1 WLWC CW 28.2 LATV 36.1 WSBE PBS 36.2 LEARN 64.1 WNAC FOX 64.2 MY RI TV- My Network TV and time shifting of shows from WNAC and WPRI with some other things tossed in. 69.1 WPXQ 69.2 QUBO 69.3 not sure but not carried on cable system PROVIDENCE 69.1 WPXQ 69.2 QUBO 69.3 not sure but not carried on cable system 69.3, based on other Ion stations would be Ion Life, a lifestyle channel similar to Livewell Network. All Ion O&O stations have Ion TV on XX.1, Qubo on XX.2, & Ion Life on XX.3. I forgot to mention that Ion Media has few affiliates for Ion TV, but they don't currently let anyone affiliate with Ion Life, & I believe they've only allowed 1 or 2 affiliates for Qubo. Otherwise, Ion Media wants all control over the networks & the stations they're on. Phoenix - 63 viewable subchannels (66 overall) + 3 M/H feeds KTVK 3.x (rf24) - .1 Independent / .2 ThisTV KPHO 5.x (17) - .1 CBS / .2 Wx KAZT-CD 7.x (36) - .1 Independent / .2 MeTV / .3 RTV KAET 8.x - .1 PBS / .2 Eight Life / .3 World / .4 KBAQ (FM audio)1 KSAZ 10.x - .1 Fox2 KPNX 12.x - .1 NBC / .2 Wx2 KNXV 15.x - .1 ABC / .2 Live Well KPAZ 21.x (20) - .1 TBN / .2 Church Channel / .3 JCTV / .4 Enlace3 / .5 Smile of a Child KTVP-LD 22.x - .1 Good News TV / .2 Mexicanal3 / .3 SonLife / .4 Mas TV3 / .5 & .6 test pattern KTVW 33.x - .1 Univision3 / .2 KFPH-CD (SD)3 KFPH-CD 35.x - .1 Telefutura3 K38IZ-D 38.x - .1 IZ Peliculas3 / .2 Tuff TV / .3 IZ Videos / .4 TCN KTAZ 39.x - .1 Telemundo3 / .2 Exitos TV3 / .3 Canal SOI3 KEJR-LD 40.x - .1 Tr3s3 / .2 Infomercials KPDF-CD 41.x - .1 Azteca America3 / .2 For Lease slide / .3 LATV3 / .4 OnTV4U (infomercials) KVPA-LD 42.x - .1 Estrella TV3 KPHE-LD 44.x (16) - .1 Telemax & Multimedios TV3 / .2 Mas TV34 / .3 Good News TV4 / .4 My Family TV KUTP 45.x (26) - .1 My Network TV / .2 KSAZ (SD) KDPH-LD 48.x (46) - .1 Daystar / .2 JTV5 KFPB-LD 50.x - .1 CornerStore TV (infomercials) / .2 ESNE TV3/ .3 Video Zona TV3 / .4 Restauracion TV3 / .5 Video Zona TV3 / .6 Video Vision TV3 / .12 ESNE Radio3 6

KPPX 51.x - .1 ION / .2 qubo / .3 ION Life KASW 61.x (49) - .1 CW 7 1 - Two other subchannels appear, which are artifacts of the UpdateTV and TVGOS services offered by KAET. 2 - Also includes M/H feed of the station - does not appear as a subchannel 3 - Spanish-language broadcast 4 - Through 5/31 only 5 - IDs on PSIP as channel 58.1. 6 - Additional subchannel appears, which has no packet data 7 - Also includes M/H feed of sister station KTVK - does not appear as a subchannel KCTV5-None KSMOTV-Bounce TV but only Digital Antenna so far KMBC-ME TV KCWE-This TV KSHB- Action Weather Plus KMCI- Live Well Network Digital Antenna and TWCKC so far FOX4KC- Antenna TV KXPE- Ion Life and Qubo not on Comcast yet but others. KCPT all but Worldview KTWU only SD Channels but HD and Digital Sub Channels maybe Surewestkc Metro Sports only TWCKC has all it's Channels and Comcast just it's SD Channel Metro Weather only TWCKC at monet so for like Yes Network or NESN. Evansville, IN. The Nexstar duopoly doesn't believe in subchannels, and ComCorp's WEVV has two major networks. Means we don't get many of the diginets. I count only 10 fully viable program streams: WTVW 7.1: Independent (airs some ME programs) WNIN 9.1: PBS WNIN 9.2: "WNIN Local" - rebroadcasts of public meetings, local documentaries WNIN 9.3: Simulcast of NPR/Classical WNIN-FM WFIE 14.1: NBC WFIE 14.2: Weather plus reruns of some syndicated shows WFIE 14.3: This WEHT 25.1: ABC WEVV 44.1: CBS WEVV 44.2: FOX/MyNet Viewers in other portions of the market may be able to receive 31.1-31.4 from Kentucky Educational Television, WVJS-LD 17.1 (America 1), and WTSN-LD 36.1 (Me). We also have WAZE-19.1 (CW), but they were never viewable at my location and there is some speculation they are dark. let's in suburban Pittsburgh... KDKA (CBS) 2.1 WTAE (ABC) 4.1 THIS-TV 4.2

WTOV (NBC) 9.1 Me TV 9.2 (*broadcasting on former analog channel VHF 9. Licensed to Steubenville, Ohio, but transmitter was actually moved about 10 miles inside Pennsylvania when they went digital) WPXI (NBC) 11.1 Me TV 11.2 WQED (PBS) 13.1 PBS Create 13.2 Neighborhood Channel 13.3* (*Rick Sebak history specials and other locally produced programming) Cooking shows/Music specials 13.4 WINP (ION) 16.1 Qubo 16.2 ION Life 16.3 WPCW (CW) 19.1 WPMY (MyTV) 22.1 TheCool TV 22.2 WPCB (Christian) 40.1 WPCB (standard def) 40.2 Some other Christian program service 40.3 WPGH (Fox) 53.1 The Country Network 53.2 WBGN (Ind.) 59.1 RTV 59.2 Infomercials 59.3 Live Well Network (formerly Universal Sports) 59.4 Daystar (Christian Programming) 65.1 CBS, which owns KDKA and WPCW, does not believe in digital sub-channels apparently. They didn't, for a long time, but they're coming around. They've just recently launched a local news channel on WCBS 2.2 in New York, and will be following suit soon in Los Angeles and Chicago. Raleigh/Durham, NC...33 total WUNC-TV, Chapel Hill (RF 25) 4.1- UNC-TV (PBS) 4.2- UNC-KD Kids 4.3- UNC-EX Explorer Channel WRAL-TV, Raleigh (RF 48) 5.1- WRAL (CBS) 5.2- This TV WTVD, Durham (RF 11) 11.1- WTVD (ABC)

11.2- LiveWell 11.3- LiveWell (formerly Eyewitness News Now) WNCN, Goldsboro (RF 17) 17.1- WNCN (NBC) 17.2- Antenna TV WLFL, Raleigh (RF 27) 22.1- WLFL (CW) 22.2- Country Music videos WRDC, Durham (RF 28) 28.1- WRDC (MNT) 28.2- The Cool TV (music videos) WRAY, Wilson (RF 42) 30.1- WRAY (Total Christian Television) 30.2- TCT (different from 30.1) 30.3- TCT Family 30.4- TCT Spanish WUNP, Roanoke Rapids (RF 36) 36.1- UNC-TV (PBS) 36.2- UNC-KD Kids 36.3- UNC-EX Explorer Channel WUVC, Fayetteville (RF 38) 40.1- WUVC (Univision) WTNC-LP, Durham (RF 40) 40.2- WTNC-LP (Telefutura) WRPX, Rocky Mount (RF 15) 47.1- WRPX (Ion) 47.2- Ion Life 47.3- Qubo 47.4- unsure WRAZ, Raleigh (RF 49) 50.1- WRAZ (Fox) 50.2- Me-TV (replaced RTV) WFPX, Fayetteville (RF 36) 62.1- WRPX (Ion) 62.2- Ion Life 62.3- Qubo 62.4- unsure Atlanta has at least 55 and most are junk. I rank the ones I like best. 1. WSB 2.2 Me-TV 2. WATL 36.3 Antenna TV 3. WANN 32.7 PBJ

4. WATC 57.2 (religious independent with some regular shows) 5. WTBS 26.3 Weather Nation 6. WGTV 8.3 PBS Knowledge 7. WXIA 11.2 Accu Weather (honorable mentions: 26.8 Tuff TV, 32.1 Free TV guide, 32.2 RTV, 32.3 THIS-TV, 32.4 Moxie (old movies), 32.5 Oldie Goldie (old TV), 32.6 My Family TV, 36.2 Bounce) Here's what I can pick up with my Silicon Scientific outdoor OTA antenna and GE Outdoor Digital antenna (outside my apartment) in Aliquippa, PA (Beaver County): (Yes, folks, I got the greenlight from the landlord/super because I plan to cut the cable within June.) KDKA 2.1 (CBS) WTAE 4.1 (ABC); 4.2 (This TV) WTOV 9.1 (NBC); 9.2 (MeTV) WPXI 11.1 (NBC); 11.2 (MeTV) WQED 13.1 (PBS); 13.2 (Create); 13.3 (The Neighborhood); 13.4 (Showcase) WINP 16.1 (ION); 16.2 (qubo); 16.3 (ION Life) WPCW 19.1 (CW) WPMY 22.1 (MY); 22.2 (The COOL TV) WKBN 27.1 (CBS); 27.2 (FOX Youngstown (WYFX)) WPCB 40.1 (Cornerstone TV) 40.2 (Bible Discovery) 40.3 (?); 40.4 (?) WNEO 45.1 (PBS); 45.2 (WNEO Fusion); 45.3 (MHz WorldView); 45.4 (V-me (Spanish)) WPGH 53.1 (FOX); 53.2 (The Country Network) And on occasion, WFMJ 21.1 (NBC); 21.2 (WBCB-CW) and WYTV 33.1 (ABC); 33.2 (MY YTV); 33.3 (weather radar). And I am still trying to figure out how to tune in WBGN-LD 66, Beaver. And if you have a good antenna pointing south toward South Mountain, you also get the following from Tucson. KUAT 6.x .1 PBS, .2 vMe (spanish), .3 Ready TV KTTU 18.x .1 My Network TV, .2 Estrella TV (spanish) CBS, which owns KDKA and WPCW, does not believe in digital sub-channels apparently. They didn't, for a long time, but they're coming around. They've just recently launched a local news channel on WCBS 2.2 in New York, and will be following suit soon in Los Angeles and Chicago. Would be nice to see them bring Antenna TV to town. Won't happen. Whatever they use their subchannel for will be produced in-house. They're not going to benefit a direct competitor, Tribune (which owns Antenna and uses its own stations to compete

against CBS in markets such as NYC, LA and Chicago.) Twin Cities -- 40 (well, actually fewer without the redundancy). 2.1 2.2 2.3 2.4 KTCA -- PBS The Minnesota Channel (local productions; state house/senate coverage) TPT Life -- PBS TPT Weather (NOAA Radio with NWS Radar, maps, etc.)

4.1 WCCO -- CBS (CBS O/O) 5.1 KSTP -- ABC 5.3 Me-Tv 5.4 This Tv 5.45 KSTC-- Ind. (actually RF 45, with the other 5's RF 35) 9.1 KMSP -- Fox 9.2 KMSP -- Fox (actually RF 29.2; duplication for those who struggle with the Hi-V RF 9) 11.1 KARE -- NBC 11.2 WeatherNation 16.1 K16HY-D local Info 16.2 ETWN 16.3 SMB -- locally produced religious programming, with a little secular programming 16.4 /16.5 Simulcast of 16.2 23.1 WUCW -- CW 23.2 The Cool TV 23.3 Country Network 25.1 K25IA-D TBN 25.2 Church Channel 25.3 JCTV 25.4 Smile of a Child 25.5 Enlace 29.1 WFTC (MyNet) 29.2 WFTC (actually RF 9.2) 33.1 K33LN 3ABN 33.2 Proclaim 33.3 D2D 33.4 3ABN Latino 33.5 3ABN Radio (audio) 33.6 3ABN Radio Latino (audio) 33.7 Radio 74 (audio) 41.1 KPXM (ion) 41.2 Qubo 41.3 Ion Life 43.1 K43HB-D (HSN) 45.5 KSTP2 (Eyewitness News Rewind)

62.1 Daystar 48.1 and 50.1 are on and off the air. Univision still has analog Channel 13/ We get 19 stations in the Lubbock, Texas area: 5.1 KTTZ - PBS 5.2 KTTZ - Create 11.1 KCBD - NBC 11.2 This TV Lubbock 13.1 KLBK - CBS 14.1 KMYL - My Network TV 14.2 Jewelry TV 16.1 KPTB - Religious Channel 22.1 KLCW - CW 22.2 KMYL - My Network TV 22.3 KXTQ - Telemundo 28.1 KAMC - ABC 28.2 Bounce TV 32.1 KJTV "FOX 34 NewsNOW" (HD) 34.1 KJTV - FOX 34.2 KJTV "FOX 34 NewsNOW" (SD) 46.1 KXTQ - Telemundo 48.1 Me-TV Lubbock 51.1 KBZO - Univision We have too many duplicates of the same channels. Chicago, near north side. Forty-Four Digital, 3 Analog, 1 of which is an 88.7 FrankenFM. There about 4 or 5 duplicate signals in the above. I'm using a 6 foot hunk of cheap coax to which I have clipped together two sections of alligatior clip test leads, which attaches to an elaborate lead gridwork of a nearby window. I have a phase-tuneable attic antenna, but it's VHF-only proportioned, so that's unused these days. Works pretty good, but ignition pulse noise from vehicles going down the street often knock out decode or provide humorous distorted phantasms out of normal faces and scenes. Not all vehicles, just the ones with noisy ignitions, this may be 10-20 % as I also note listening to an AM radio in my own car. I hear certain nearby vehicles spewing control data noise or ignition noise. They sound very different from each other. Location: 3 miles NNE Portland, OR (98683) Channel count: Physical: 15 Virtual: 32 (and nothing on) Ch PS Call Sf City Sub Programming 08 08 KGW TV Portland 01 NBC affiliates 02 "KGW 24-7 Weather" (ha!) 03 Estrellas TV

10 10 KOPB TV Portland 01 Main programming/PBS 02 Secondary stream 03 KOPB-FM/KMHD-FM simulcasts 12 12 KPTV TV Portland 01 FOX affiliates

22 22 KPXG TV Salem 01 Pax Net/PAX/I/Ion (previously Home Shopping Club) 02 NBC Qubo Channel 03 ION Life 26 26 K26GJD Salem 30 49 KPDX TV Portland 01 Independent/religious 01 Semi-ind. ("PDX-TV")/Their Network TV

33 32 KRCW TV Beaver Town 01 CW affiliates (Beaverton) 02 Antenna 03 Test card (was Universal Sport) 36 36 KEVE LD Vancouver 40 06 KOIN TV Portland 01 3 Angels (relay of KBLN) 01 CBS affiliates

42 42 KPXG LD Camas 01 Pax Net/PAX/I/Ion (previously Home Shopping Club) 02 NBC Qubo Channel 03 ION Life 43 02 KATU TV Portland 01 ABC affiliates 02 THIS TV (until 2012 June 24) 45 24 KNMT TV Salem 01 The Bible-thumper Network (TBN) 02 Church Channel 03 J.C.T.V. 04 TBN Enlace USA 05 Smile of a Child 46 46 KGWZ LD Portland 47 47 KUNP LD Portland 01 Weather map ("appendage channel" of KGW) 01 Univision affiliates ("appendage channel" of KATU)

49 17 KWVT LP Salem (relay) 02 America One 27 02 Retro TV (hi, Tripinva!) 37 02 Azteca Americas Aaaaaaand here's the scan I did in North Dakota a few weeks back. By comparison, the Silicon Dust scan ( ; check out all the free-to-air QAM channels available there, too! Jeeze!) is VERY woefully incomplete: Location: 23 miles SSW Fargo, ND (58052/Cass County [unincorporated]) Channel count: Physical: 14 Virtual: 35 (and nothing on) Ch PS Call Sf City Sub Programming 8 8 WDAZ Grand Forks 01 ABC (widescreen) 02 CW (regular-screen)

03 WDAY-MW simulcast 9 9 KMSP Minneapolis 01 FOX affiliates 02 WFTC relay (Their Network TV) 11 11 KARE Minneapolis 01 NBC affiliates 02 "Weather Nation" 13 13 KFME Fargo 01 Prairie Public/PBS 02 PBS World Channel 03 Minnesota Channel 04 Lifelong Learning

15 2 KGFE Grand Forks 01 Prairie Public/PBS 02 PBS World Channel 03 Minnesota Channel 04 Lifelong Learning 16 16 KCGE Crookston/Grand Forks 01 Prairie Public/PBS 02 PBS World Channel 03 Minnesota Channel 04 Lifelong Learning 19 15 KVRR Fargo 21 6 WDAY Fargo 01 FOX affiliates 01 ABC (widescreen) 02 CW (regular-screen) 03 WDAY-MW simulcast

22 23 WUCW Minneapolis, Minn. 01 CW affiliates 02 The Cool TV 03 Country Network 27 27 KCPM Fargo 34 34 K34HO Willmar, Minn. 38 4 KXJB Fargo 01 independent/Rupert's Network TV 01 The Weather Channel/UHF-TV Cable Inc. 01 CBS Affiliates (widescreen)

40 41 KPXM Minneapolis 01 Pax Net/PAX/I/Ion 02 NBC Qubo Channel 03 Ion Life 44 11 KVLY Fargo 01 NBC affiliates (widescreen) 02 THIS (regular-screen)

And if you have a good antenna pointing south toward South Mountain, you also get the following from Tucson. KUAT 6.x .1 PBS, .2 vMe (spanish), .3 Ready TV KTTU 18.x .1 My Network TV, .2 Estrella TV (spanish) South Mtn is actually west of me, so I don't want to point there. Grin You're correct about the Tucson stations - depending on where you are in the Phoenix area, you can pick up one or more from Tucson occasionally. I get KUAT at least once a night and sometimes KTTU, but in Scottsdale, near the airpark, a good antenna would net you KVOA, KUAT,

KMSB, KOLD, KTTU and KUVE - in other words, all the UHF stations broadcasting from Mt. Bigelow. For the record, here is what Tucson offers: (29 subchannels) KVOA 4.x (23) - .1 NBC K04QP-D 4.x - .1 KVOA 4.1 KUAT 6.x (30) - .1 PBS / .2 V-Me / .3 Ready TV KGUN 9.x - .1 ABC / .2 Mexicanal / .3 Live Well K16EO-D 9.x (16) - .1 KGUN 9.1 / .2 KGUN 9.2 / .3 KGUN 9.3 KMSB 11.x (25) - .1 Fox / .2 ThisTV KOLD-TV 13.x (32) - .1 CBS / .2 MeTV KOLD-TV 13.x - .1 KOLD 13.1 / .2 KOLD 13.2 KTTU 18.x (19) - .1 My Network TV / .2 Estrella TV K21CX 21.x - .1 JTV KUAS 27.x (28) - .1 KUAT 6.1 / .2 KUAT Kids / .3 World KFTU-CD 34.x (18) - .1 KFTU-DT 3.1 (Telefutura) / .2 KUVE-DT 46.2 KHRR 40.x - .1 Telemundo / .2 Exitos TV / .3 Canal SOI KUVE-DT 46.x - .1 Univision / .2 KFTU-CD Why all of the duplication? Most transmitters are on Mt. Bigelow, which sits lower than Mt. Lemmon and Pusch Ridge, so signals don't reach NW metro area communities like Oro Valley, Marana, Casas Adobes and Cortaro, so the LP stations broadcast from either Tower Peak or Tumamoc Hill to provide infill to the unreached areas. Defunct diginets What are some defunct "subchannels" you know of? One is THE TUBE. This was probably one of the earliest "subchannel" networks, launching in 2004. It played music videos, if I remember correctly, older music videos. Despite accumulating a dedicated fan base, especially among free-to-air satellite viewers (it was transmitted in the clear on the same satellite as Equity's holdings), it stopped airing in 2007. .2 Network - Never launched as promised, it's thunder stolen from the widely successful launch of THIS. Bohemia Visual Music - Never gained traction Don't know if this was broadcasted via satellite at all, or if there was a genuine effort to make it a national network -- it was seen only in Portland OR, Phoenix and Los Angeles, with LA being its only full-powered affiliate (on a sub of KDOC). It was also short-lived on KJKZ-LP in Fresno, but yeah KDOC was it's only full-powered candle. NBC Weather Plus (2004-2008) I don't know if this counts, but when I first got an HDTV the local PBS affiliate simulcast the local analog station in the .1 channel in SD. The .2 channel was PBS HD which was 100 percent HD with no local content. They eventually dropped the HD channel and started simulcasting the .1 channel on .2 most of the local content at the time was still in SD. And because the main channel .1 time shifted their PBS programming there was lots of shows previously seen in full HD on .2 were now seen in crappy standard definition. The simulcast of .1 and .2 still continues but most programming is now in HD. I see no point in continuing the SD feed. It should be shut down and bandwith returned to HD channel.

Variety Television. Mostly "Live Well" style junk, although the weekends had some older movies and PD episodes of 1950's-60's TV (including 1950's B&W era Dragnet). Carried by many Clear Channel (later Newport TV) O&O stations (including KASN Pine Bluff/Little Rock, and WLMT Memphis). I also remember NBC Weather Plus and The Tube but neither were carried in the Little Rock market--both those stations were seen though during TV DX sessions. The original Equity-owned Retro Television Network (RTN). There was a reports of something called "Lick TV" but that was never a network although the concept was turned into Tuff TV, another Equity-turned-Luken subchannel network. PBS YOU used to air on the same channel as PBS Create. Duluth used to have PBS HD, too. In fact, the transmitter would go from four channels (8.1 WDSE, 8.2 WDSE +1h, 8.3 PBS Kids, 8.4 PBS You) to just two at about 6 PM every evening, the +1h feed of WDSE being replaced by PBS HD, which aired in full 1920 x 1080 glory and looked absolutely stunning. Now the four subchannels stay on all of WDSE's broadcast day, and the HD programming WDSE airs is hard to tell from the SD. Sinclair's WBFF used to have "Good TV" which aired classic tv shows. wikipedia lists it's existance from 2006-2008. I'm not sure if other Sinclair stations ran this or if it was local to Baltimore. As far as classic tv on digital subchannel, it predated Me-TV and Antenna TV, or atleast those channels national reach. I'm sure you have all noticed the trend towards shorter names for TV networks. What is the root of this? What are some examples you'd like to list? And is it correlated with a dumbing-down of programming / catering to the lowest common denominator? TV CHANNEL NAMES BECOMING SHORTER Some examples: MuchMusic USA -> MuchMusic -> Fuse (dumbed down IMO) The Nashville Network -> TNN -> Spike The History Channel -> History (dumbed down, became a reality TV channel) History International -> H2 The Learning Channel -> TLC (exec said a while back that it does not stand for anything anymore, dumbed down) Paxnet -> Pax -> i Outdoor Life Network / OLN -> VS ZDTV -> TechTV -> G4 (extremely dumbed down) you forgot Game Show Network - > GSN More: Home Box Office --> HBO Court TV --> truTV Lifetime Movie Network -> LMN

-crainbebo CNN Headline News -> HLN (went from primarily news to primarily entertainment) OWN NICK ME TV CSN (Comcast Sport Net) FSN (Fox Sport Net) TLC Here are some more: American Movie Classics->AMC Arts & Entertainment Network->A&E Discovery Health->OWN Outdoor Life Network / OLN -> VS Versus is now NBC Sports Network. A more recent one is NBCUniversal rebranding their mystery/crime-themed cable channel Sleuth as Cloo. And of course there's The Sci-Fi Channel becoming SCI FI and then Syfy. Music Television > MTV Video Hits 1 > VH1 Turner Broadcasting System > TBS Turner Network Television > TNT New England Sports Network > NESN Madison Square Garden Network > MSG Microsoft NBC > MSNBC Consumer News & Business Channel > CNBC BBC2, BBC3, BBC4 BBC America ESPN2, ESPNCL, ESPNU Broadcast TV channel names sometimes get longer. Channel 11 in the SF Bay Area has dropped all references to their channel position, and insists on being called "NBC Bay Area." Nick at Nite's TV Land = TV Land Noggin = NickJr. Gospel Music Channel = GMC The Sci-Fi Channel= Sci-Fi = Syfy Country Music Television= CMT The Disney Channel= Disney Channel Black Entertainment Television= BET BET On Jazz= BETJ= Centric

CourtTV= TruTV Prevue Guide= Prevue Channel= Prevue= TV Guide Channel= TV Guide Network CBN Cable= CBN Family Chanel= The Family Channel= FOX Family= ABC Family Video Hits One= VH1 The shortest name I can think of...... E! Entertainment Television Discovery, formerly The Discovery Channel has added..... Velocity. I caught some shows on that this weekend. If channels are dropping the "The" from their name, will TLC soon become LC? No, TLC is Tender Loving Care. I thought TLC was The Learning Channel. How many analogue channels did New York and LA have? Much more. New York: WCBS-2, WNBC-4, WNYW-5, WABC-7, WWOR-9, WPIX-11, WNET-13, WNYE-25, WPXN-31, WXTV-41, WNJU-47, and WFUT-68 were just the full-powers transmitting from New York city itself. Include low-powers and you have to add a 17, 26, 32, 35, 39, 42, and 60 at the very least. From surrounding areas, you might have received WLIW-21 and WNJN-50/WNJB-58. I'll let someone else handle LA, but it actually managed to have more stations than New York. - Trip L.A. had more to be allotted by the FCC. There were channels 2, 4, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13, 22, 28*, 34, 40, 46, 52, 58* and 68* allotted to either LA or surrounding communities. There was 16 in nearby Ventura which lasted less than 1 year in the late 1960s IIRC. There were also the fringe-area channels 18, 24, 30, 50*, and 63*. I am sure I am missing a couple. [* = non-commercial or PBS] Channel 56 in Anaheim, and I think there was a station on Channel 62 somewhere in the area. Riverside? KDOC 56 Anaheim....of the corner I go. And 62 Riverside..... cd Of course WWOR-TV was/is licensed to Secaucus, NJ. Then there was WLNY-TV (IND) channel 55 of Riverhead, NY, which was available on cable in New York City, if I'm not mistaken. Channel

68 of Newark, NJ had a full-powered satellite on channel 67 licensed to Smithtown, NY. In the "good old days", I used to get a very snowy channel 55 and 67 with my indoor antenna in New Britain, CT. Granted, the signals were quite weak, but they both came in enough to where I knew it was them. Los Angeles' channel 18 (KSCI) was originally licensed to San Bernardino, which can be considered fringe, as its 60+ miles from Los Angeles city proper. About a decade ago, the station shifted their city of license to Long Beach. KSCI's studio and offices are located in West Los Angeles (next door to KTTV/KCOP), and transmits from Mount Wilson along with most of the other Los Angeles-area stations. How about Chicago? 2, 5, 7, 9, 11, 20, 26, 32, 38, 44, 50, 56, and 62 (13 stations, not counting low power) Minneapolis: 2, 4, 5, 9, 11, 17, 23, 29, 41, and 45 (10 stations, not counting low power) The Los Angeles and New York markets are a bit hard to count because they have numerous "fringe" stations which only serve part of the market. Houston Metro had 17 full power analog stations listed below (along with a number of low power stations) 2 (NBC) 8 (PBS) 11 (CBS) 13 (ABC) 14 (TBN) 20 (My, formerly UPN) 22 (Daystar) 26 (Fox) 39 (CW, before WB) 45 (Univision) 47 (Telemundo, previous at 48) 49 (Ion, previously Pax) (the station comes from northern suburbs, did operate a low power station near the areas' main transmitter site southwest of the city to better serve the sourthwest suburbs) 51 (at first all news, then indpendent, now TV Azteca) 55 (originally independent, now Mega TV) 57 (was Value Vision, then independent Spanish, now independent English "the Kube" 61 (now Estrella TV (spanish) was La Raza TV 67 (originally was independent, then Home Shopping, now Telefutura for quite a while). You forgot 60 (allocated to Aurora) and 66 (allocated to Joliet). That makes 15 channels. How about Chicago? 2, 5, 7, 9, 11, 20, 26, 32, 38, 44, 50, 56, and 62 (13 stations, not counting low power) You forgot 60 (allocated to Aurora) and 66 (allocated to Joliet). That makes 15 channels. Yes, my bad. Especially considering that I sometimes received those stations (even on rabbit ears) during tropo openings here in Duluth, MN. Here are the networks they were affiliated with, c. 2000:

2 - CBS 5 - NBC 7 - ABC 9 - WB / Independent (superstation that aired on cable systems across the US) 11 - PBS 20 - PBS 26 - Independent 32 - FOX 38 - PAX 44 - Spanish Ind. 50 - UPN 56 - PBS? 60 - Home Shopping Network, right? 62 - PBS? or Independent? 66 - Univision (Note that PBS is more of a programming distributor than a network, so it is possible for there to be multiple PBS stations in a single market with completely different schedules) In the analog days, both of those stations weren't received clearly OTA in their COL's either (56 licensed to Gary, IN & 62 to Hammond, IN). Despite pointing my main antenna toward Cedar Lake for 56, or toward Tinley Park for 62, I could never get a good picture. Out of the list of stations licensed to the Chicago market, 56 (now RF 17) is the only station that isn't transmitting out of Chicago, due to financial reasons, & not because of WTTW & WYCC trying to block the move. WYIN 56 did get the ok to relocate to Chicago by the FCC, but the lease costs At the Sears Tower & other Chicago skyscrapers prevented the move, & the station withdrew their application. Even transmitting from their site near Cedar Lake, IN, people in Chicago could possibly pick up the station, though not really around downtown Chicago, & definitely not with rabbit ears either, except those closest to their tower. When I lived in Hammond, IN I had no trouble getting 56 or 62. 62 was really good. In fact I lived in the south part of Chicago in the 70s and got WCAE Channel 50 very well via rabbit ears. That was when WCAE, channel 50 was PBS and channel 56 was the commercial allocation. That was later swapped. Stations that Show the Time and Temp Bug on All Newscasts What are some stations in your local market that show the time and temp on all newscasts (not just the morning news)? In my market (Los Angeles) most stations that have local news do this. The English-language ones are the KCBS 2 (CBS O&O)/KCAL 9 (co-owned indie) and KTTV 11 (Fox O&O)/KCOP 13 (coowned MyNetworkTV affiliate) duopolies (the latter being the most recent to jump on this bandwagon); as well as KNBC 4 (NBC O&O), KTLA 5 (CW), and KABC 7 (ABC O&O). The only Spanish-language station that does this is KMEX 34 (Univisin O&O). KVEA 52 (Telemundo O&O) only shows it on its morning newscast; while KWHY 22 (indie-soon-to-be-MundoFox), KAZA 54 (Azteca Amrica), and KRCA 62 (Estrella TV) don't show one on any of their newscasts. Discuss! ...when I was in Phoenix five years ago, KTVK/3 and KASW/61 displayed the time-and-temp bugs on all programs, not just the news broadcasts... @Ultimajock: WNYW/5 also used to have a time/temp ticker underneath their logo on the screen all the time; they've done away with the ticker a few years ago... If I'm not mistaken, I think most, if not all, Fox O&O's followed this practice...

In NYC: WCBS, WNBC, WABC, and I think WPIX. WALA-TV in Mobile, Alabama used to display the current time and current temperature only during morning newscasts until Saturday, April 21st, when they produced their first local newscast in high definition (WALA-TV used to display the current time and temperature for all newscasts years ago). When they produced their second high-definition newscast on the following Sunday, no temperature was displayed beside the clock. They would begin displaying temperatures beside the clock again during the following week. As for other local TV stations with news operations, (WKRG-TV, WPMI-TV, and WEAR-TV), they usually display the current time and current temperature during all of their newscasts. I always thought the interesting part about showing the temperature on a Los Angeles newscast are all the microclimates, especially in the summer, when it can be 68 in Malibu in the afternoon, 78 downtown, 88 in the Valleys and 98 in the desert communities that are also within the MSA. I know they show the downtown/Hollywood temperature, which serves as a temperature that is fairly accurate if you're within the LA Basin, but anyone in the Valleys, Inland Empire, high desert, etc gets basically excluded. Yes, that's true of basically anywhere. I live in the nearby NYC suburbs (about 10 miles out of town) and the temperature at my house in the morning is usually about 5 or 6 degrees colder than the midtown Manhattan temperature that is displayed on the bug. Keep driving west or northwest and the temperature can be as much as 20 degrees colder than NYC. Other times, especially during the day, NYC will have a sea breeze kick in and the distant suburbs actually become warmer. Microclimates are everywhere. All the major Dallas-Fort Worth stations (KDFW/4, KXAS/5, WFAA/8, KTVT/11) show times and temps during every newscast. KPRC-Local 2 in Houston shows the Time & Temperature all the time outside their newscastsMainly on Dr. Oz, Ellen, & E.T.; And during their newscasts, They don't show the Time & Temperature bug below the station's logo. So do all the newscasts in Philadelphia. All stations here in Kansas City show time and temp during all newscasts. We use the temperature here at the station, which is often warmer than the official airport temperature. Yes, that's true of basically anywhere. I live in the nearby NYC suburbs (about 10 miles out of town) and the temperature at my house in the morning is usually about 5 or 6 degrees colder than the midtown Manhattan temperature that is displayed on the bug. Keep driving west or northwest and the temperature can be as much as 20 degrees colder than NYC. Other times, especially during the day, NYC will have a sea breeze kick in and the distant suburbs actually become warmer. Microclimates are everywhere. Pardon me for this message, but since the errors in bold are very common in regards to temperatures (especially in broadcasting), I must post this message: since temperatures are measurements of hotness or coldness in an environment or body, it is better to say high or low temperatures rather than warm or cold temperatures. Whether the air is warmer or cooler depends on the person. I stand corrected. We use the temperature as indicated by a thermometer at the television station. This temperature is often five degrees (Fahrenheit) above the official temperature measurement at

Kansas City International Airport. But in the opinion of the women in my newsroom, who use space heaters daily, the air is never warm enough. KLFY Lafayette,LA has an animated weather bug that shows temps and weather conditions for cities around Louisiana. Here is a video showing what I mean..... In Raleigh/Durham, I know WRAL-TV has a time/temp bug that I'm pretty sure they use on the shows they produce for sister Fox affiliate WRAZ, and I believe WTVD uses time/temp as well. Don't know about WNCN or WUVC. Charleston, all stations use time and temperature in the morning. Channels 2 and 5 use it during all newscasts, and the other two stations use it too. The only time you don't see a time and temperature is when Channel 24 (Fox) does a newscast after a Fox sporting event. It is usually taped at 10pm, even though it might not air till midnight or later. KPIX has the Time bug on their logo. but its based on how the other CBS O&O's does them. However sister station KCNC 4 here in Denver shows the temp as well. Beyond that, I think the only two news departments that do it all the time are the duopolies (KWGN 2/KDVR 31 & KUSA 9/KTVD 20). KMGH 7 only does it during the morning newscast Cheers Grin KGW, on their secondary service known as "KGW 24-7 Weather" on xx-02, which actually shows very litle weather-related programming during the day, instead opting to run a tape loop of the most recent local "news" broadcast much of the time. (Decended from NBC Weather Plus+, which xx-02 originally carried.) They take it a step further and add a highly annoying and distracting headline ticker across the bottom of the screen. None of this is present on their regular broadcasts over xx01. In a similar vein: Does your local newscast remove their corner bug when they go to the weather segment? WTIC-TV (FOX) channel 61 of Hartford seems to do so in their 10 PM news. WFSB-TV (CBS) channel 3 of Hartford seems to remove everything at that time, including their "3" bug and the "#WFSB" written above the "3" logo. Time and temp bug is standard here with the local Chicago stations. And as a longtime business traveler I can tell you that it's also pretty much standard on morning commercial TV just about everywhere in the U.S. Same goes for Canada and the UK. And much appreciated by me when I have appointments to get to! Another feature that I much appreciate in the morning are real-time freeway traffic maps. For years, going back to the early 80s, the only place where I ever saw these was on KSTP-TV in the Twin Cities. They got briefly inserted into local news and weather cutaways as well as for a couple of seconds in local commercial breaks. Fortunately, today, these have become much more common....but not as universal as the time and temp bugs. Live local momentary weather radar shots are also good. Here in Boston, WBZ, WHDH (and sister station WLVI) and WFXT show the time and temperature on all their newscasts. I think WCVB only does on their morning newscast. Atlanta: Channel 2 Action News

FOX 5 News 11 Alive (the worst with the rundown, bug and scrolling headlines on the bottom) CBS Atlanta ...they all have bugs for every newscast. However, Channel 2 and CBS Atlanta only showtemps for the evening and late night newscats. Another question on this: When did this start? Anyone know who started it, and when? And when did it become commonplace? My guess is it started sometime in the 90's, but didn't become commonplace well into the 21st century. But I don't know for sure. Why 11:35 and not 11:30? In 1991, The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson moved its start time back five minutes to 11:35 pm. Nightline eventually followed suit, as did Late Show with David Letterman upon its August, 1993 debut. Why, exactly, was this move made? What do the networks and the affiliates have to gain by having irregular start times late at night? Does it have to do with advertising revenue for the local stations' late local news, as I've heard hypothesized, or is there some weird "Turner Time" ratings theory in play here? Could ABC, CBS or NBC gain more ratings traction if they moved their show back to 11:30 and had a head-start on the competition (Nightline could return to a full thirty-minute broadcast), or would viewers miss the extra five minutes of local news? Today, by the way, the start times are even more bizarre: The Tonight Show with Jay Leno starts at around 11:34 pm, and Craig Ferguson and Jimmy Fallon's shows have 12:37 am start times. Simple answer: 5 more mins of ads for the late local news. Yes - it was to give the late local news a few extra minutes, and allow them to make some extra $$ $. It was no big loss for the networks, and viewers got used to it pretty quickly. So it's solely for the benefit of the affiliates, then. Was Johnny upset by this move (since NBC was first), or did he not have much to say about it since he was on his way out? Before ABC and CBS pushed back the start of late-night programming by 5 minutes, a lot of their affiliates who weren't clearing the network at 11:30/10:30C had been starting their syndicated shows at :35 after for a number of years. KARE in Minneapolis, which was one of the very few NBC affiliates that was ever allowed to show Carson on a delay, started its syndicated show at 10:40 Central and started Carson at 11:10. At least that's how it was in the late '80s. Traditionally the 10 PM local news is the cash cow on affiliates in the Central and Mountain time zones; as far back as the '70s ABC and CBS affiliates were adding an extra five minutes (and one more commercial break) to the news; the practice spread by sometime in the '80s to ABC and CBS affiliates on the two coasts. NBC had held firm until its affiliates demanded in effect, why can't we have the extra five minutes if they can? So NBC gave in, as did ABC and CBS, and it probably cut down the number of delays of "Nightline" and Letterman. I believe KTVU (Fox in San Francisco) often goes over 5 or 10 minutes when there is a lot of news -

making their very popular 10 O'Clock News about 65 or 70 minutes long on some occasions. Of course, they're following it with their own Seinfeld reruns. But it must push back the rest of the night's programming, as well. In the 70's and 80's, far fewer people had cable/satellite televison and Al Gore had not yet invented the internet. Therefore, they got their news from local stations and the networks. Therefore, the stations were expanding their newscasts beyond the traditional 15 minutes as people wanted more timely news. The local stations pushed for longer late newscasts; the networks seriously considered expanding the evening news to an hour. Nightline was, in fact, expanded to an hour for several years. In 1991, the practice was institutionalized by delaying the Tonight Show by 5 minutes to 11:35pm. And the rest is history with longer and longer and longer local newscasts... Also, the TRT of Letterman is not 1:00:00 but 1:02:30. Leno starts 30 seconds earlier than Dave, at 11:34:30. As recently as 2000, channel 4 here in Nashville used to let their newscast run long, and joined Leno late! That seems incredibly stupid on the station's part as a significant number of Leno viewers stay just long enough for his monologue. Cutting in late by more than a minute or two would mean missing part of that monologue. Before the networks officially went to 11:35/10:35 start times, I think that (almost) all of the major commercial stations in Minneapolis/St. Paul were using 10:35--including not just the Big Three affiliates (WCCO, KARE, and KSTP). Bill Carter's excellent aforementioned book The Late Shift gives the explanation for the later start times - it was initially due to news updates during the Gulf War in 1991. After that, like a previous poster stated, the affiliates realized they could slip in more commercials in those five minutes. Although the practice of expanded late local news seems to have taken off in the '70s in the Central and Mountain time zones, and the '80s in the Eastern and Pacific time zones, WCCO was carrying 45 minutes back when Merv Griffin was on CBS (1969-72) and had special dispensation from CBS to delay him 15 minutes. It would have been in that era that WAPI (WVTM) Birmingham became a fulltime NBC affiliate and got permission to delay Carson to 11:30 (CT). That, however, was not because of an expanded local newscast; the station wanted the 10-11 hour for syndicated shows and ran its local news at 11 instead of 10. I do remember, when I lived in Dallas in the late '70s, that WFAA's 10 PM news didn't always end at 10:30; I have seen it go as long as 10 extra minutes, especially if there was some breaking story (usually weather-related). But that would not have affected ABC's programming; the station aired a movie before running ABC's lineup of crime shows and old movies-of-the-week on delay. By the '80s they, too, had gone to 35 minutes and delayed "Nightline" to 11:05. I noticed even on the 11pm Weekend News KGO-TV would still go up to 11:35 and then by 11:35 syndicated programming or infomercials will take over from there. I know as of 2011-2012 KGO even made the 11pm weekend newscast go up to 1 hour but the second half is more on features

and sports. KIRO 7 here in Seattle, I'm not sure if they still do it, but a few months ago I remember the Sunday night newscast went from 11-12AM. Never stopped at 11:35. -crainbebo Back in the day (late-70's), KIRO's Sunday night newscast was only 15 minutes followed by the CBS Sunday Night News. Fox stations tie-in with FNC A lot of Fox stations distance themselves from FNC but do any Fox stations actually try to tie themselves into FNC? Have never noticed this with my local affiliate (and they are owned by Sinclair, which itself is pretty conservative). Possibly because their local newscast is co-produced with the NBC affiliate. Depends on what you consider a tie-in, but a lot of Fox stations air Cavuto's nightly biz reports. Think there might be one or 2 more FNC offerings for local affiliates, too. Do they still do the World in a Minute segment? KTVU is the largest Fox station (Cox Owned) that I can think of that does not shape their Newscasts like Fox News. I know for national Breaking News KTVU will go to CNN over Fox News for reports from them. For some stories KTVU will use Fox News for national features. KTVU is also the largest Fox station that is not an O&O -- which means that they have a little more freedom than the other major market Fox stations that are owned by News Corp. Before it lost its Fox affiliation last fall, KSFX-TV (now independent KOZL-TV) in Springfield, Mo. called itself "KSFX-The Ozarks' Fox News Channel." That's a conservative market, many Fox O&Os are in large liberal markets How's that working out for them now? Roger Ailes oversees the Fox station group, so you know the Fox O&O stations pattern their news on FNC. Only time I see FNC tie-ins on KCPQ 13 is when the Fox stations broadcast the State of the Union [mostly with Shepherd Smith hosting the coverage]. -crainbebo WHBQ in Memphis has local news the same as the CBS, NBC and ABC stations do. AFAIK, WHBQ doesn't lie to the viewers and distort facts like Fox News does. Fox affiliates that don't have "Fox" in their channel branding Most Fox affiliates across the country brand themselves as "Fox [Channel Number]." As far as I can tell, it's been this way since at least the early '90s (I'm sure this is a mandate from the network itself). There are a handful of stations, though, that get away with having their own unique branding

with the word "Fox" nowhere to be found. Off the top of my head, there's: KHON (Honolulu) WSVN (Miami) KTVU (San Franscisco) Are there any others? Fox Kansas KSAS TV Wichita KS I think WDRB in Louisville just refers to itself as WDRB. This is correct, and it is a fairly recent development. WDRB rebranded itself last summer while Nexstar and FOX were renegotiating their contract. It was rumored that Nexstar threatened to remove WDRB's Fox affiliation, but they publicly denied that. That is strange, since Nexstar doesn't own a station in Louisville. I was thinking more along the lines after WDRB owner Block Communications dropped FOX on its Boise station that it caused some friction between the network and the station. I remember back in the early 90's in Cleveland, WOIO/19 - which used to be FOX before it became CBS - was known as "FOX nineteen" or "FOX 19." It became a huge identity for the station. So much that when it switched networks with WJW/8, it couldn't really match the success of the FOX years. WJW is now as strong as ever as "FOX 8," whereas WOIO has struggled as "CBS 19," though things are starting to look up a little. In Fargo and the Red River Valley region, KVRR and its satellites go simply as "Fox", with its local news "Fox News". KTVU used to brand themselves as "Fox 2" for a time in the early 2000's, while KCPQ (Seattle) is still "Q-13". Correction on KTVU San Francisco (Oakland, actually). They still use "Fox 2" during network hours, and for all trailers for Fox shows no matter the time of day. Their promos for their syndicated afternoon and evening shows (Seinfeld, etc.) use the Fox voice-over guy, and I believe they also say "Fox 2." But KTVU is very proud of their news department, which has been a high-class operation for decades, well before their affiliation with Fox. So during the news hours, it is always "KTVU Channel 2" without any mention of "Fox," Did they do this before FNC? Many news departments of Fox affiliates and even some O&Os distance themselves from the Fox News Channel That's too far back for me to remember. I can tell you that they never called it "Fox 2 News" or anything of that sort. Being in the liberal Bay Area, KTVU has nothing to gain and everything to lose by asociating themselves with FNC, which most Bay Area citizens consider biased toward the rightwing. KTVU does run reports from Fox News correspondents on their news programs. But of course, that includes none of the right-wing punditry or commentary, just straight reporting. In the case of KTVU they don't have to ID themselves as Fox 2 because of the fact that Cox owns KTVU and KICU. If Fox waw-nted to, they could require Cox and KTVU to identify the station as "Fox 2" as part of

their affiliation agreement. I know other networks have required this of affiliates in the past. I know KTTV in 1987-1993 did ID themselves at 10pm as Fox News. Then around 1994 after the Northridge quake KTTV started to ID their news operations at Fox 11 News. There are lots of stations with the original 3 networks who don't call themselves "NBC 4." That could be regional bias to me. But as I travel around Indiana, I find that there are very few stations that brand themselves with their network. Indianapolis: "WISH-TV" (WISH-TV, CBS, Cool; "RTV 6" (WRTV, ABC, 6); "WTHR, Channel 13" (WTHR, NBC, 13) Terre Haute: "NBC 2" (WTWO, NBC, 2); "News 10" (WTHI-TV, CBS, 10); "WAVW" (WAVW, ABC, 38) Fort Wayne: "WANE 15" (WANE-TV, CBS, 15); "21 Alive" (WPTA, ABC, 21); "NBC 33" (WISE-TV, NBC, 33) Evansville: "WEHT Local" (WEHT, ABC, 25); "CBS 44 WEVV"; "14 WFIE" (WFIE, NBC, 14) In my area, the big 3 stations from both cities (Austin/San Antonio) all use their call letters instead of their network ids. Austin: KVUE (ABC 24) KXAN (NBC 36) K-EYE (CBS 42) San Antonio 4 WOAI (NBC 4) KENS 5 (CBS 5) KSAT 12 (ABC 12) The reason why you guys won't see much amongst stations these days pushing for network branding is because local branding is key these days. On the case of WFAA-TV in Dallas-Fort Worth, they may not label themselves as "ABC 8" but they do make it a huge effort to include the ABC logo in everything they do with the exception of their news product. They even use ABC network themed graphics. I know Seattle uses Q13 instead of FOX 13. Actually, KCPQ goes by "Q13 FOX" and even their news branding is "Q13 FOX News" nowadays. In my hometown of Spokane, WA, most stations use their call letters as their on-air branding, and not their network affiliations. The only exceptions are KAYU ("Fox 28") and KSKN ("The CW 22"). KHQ used to call themselves "Q6," but they've shied away from that branding in the past decade or so. KHQ and KXLY use their network logos as part of their own logos (NBC and ABC, respectively). KREM had the CBS eye as part of their old logo from the mid-'90s up until about five years ago. I currently live in the Chico/Redding market, where most stations use their network affiliation as their branding: KHSL is "CBS 12," KNVN is "NBC 24," KCVU is "Fox 20" (formerly "Fox 30"), and KRVU is "MyTV Northern California." The only holdout is ABC-affiliated KRCR ("KRCR NewsChannel 7").

STATIONS SEEN ON THEIR CORRECT CABLE CHANNEL (EXAMPLE: CHANNEL 5 ON CHANNEL 5) Are there any cable areas where one or more channel is on the correct channel? It seems in many areas (for some unknown reason) they are always off by at least one number (channel 8 is seen on cable channel 9). What is their logic in putting channel 8 on cable channel 9? Don't include Dish or DirecTV. When I had boring cable before going satellite in 2004 I had Northland. 4 is WYFF 7 is WSPA 10 is WIS (out of Columbia, SC) 13 is WLOS While WFBC/WBSC (now WMYA 40) is on 6 and WASV (now WYCW 62) is on 8 and WGGS 16 is on 11 and last WHNS 21 on channel 12. Non-commercial station we had only is WNEH 38 (SCETV/PBS) on channel 2. The logic of putting local VHFs on a different channel during analog days was that homes close to the tower would pick up the over-the-air signal along with the signal from the cable system and they'd interfere with each other (usually with a ghost image). Usually something with very little viewership would be on the actual over-the-air spots on the cable system...maybe even the community access channel. That being Dayton, Ohio WHIO has stayed on their actual 7 on most systems. WDTN was moved from 2 to 9 in the greater Dayton area, remaining on 2 further out. CBS 3 in Philly. ABC 6 NBC 10... You get the point. Comcast in the Boston area has the historical VHF channels on their channel #s: 2 - WGBH 4 - WBZ 5 - WCVB 7 - WHDH The UHF stations were dispersed around the lower part of the dial between channels 10-22. Major Cities in the West Coast Cable matches OTA analog Channels. San Francisco - Comcast KTVU 2, KRON 4, KPIX 5, KGO 7, KQED 9 execpt KNTV 11 is on cable 3 Sacramento - Comcast KCRA 3, KVIE 6, KXTV 10, KOVR 13 Los Angeles - Time Warner KCBS 2, KNBC 4, KTLA 5, KABC 7, KCAL 9, KTTV 11, KCOP 13 Portland - Comcast KATU 2, KOIN 6, KGW 8, KOPB 10, KPTV 12 Seattle - Comcast KOMO 4, KING 5, KIRO 7, KCTS 9, KSTW 11, KCPQ 13 San Diego - COX XETV 6, KFMB 8, KGTV 10, XEWT 12 the cable system I grew up had all the VHF's on their proper channel (now Charter Cable)

3-WBTV (CBS) Charlotte, NC 5-WCYB (NBC) Bristol, VA 8-WGHP (ABC) High Point, NC (this was before New World, now WKPT, Kingsport, TN is on that channel) 9-WSOC (ABC) Charlotte, NC 11-WJHL (CBS) Johnson City, TN 12-WXII (NBC) Winston-Salem, NC (now QVC replaced by WCNC on channel 6) Interestingly found that 3,5,9, and 11 are still at the same spot in the lineup with WHKY on Channel 14 (which was their analog channel). (Continuing e-dawg's post...) Vancouver - Comca$t; KATU (2), KOIN (6), KGW (8), KOPB (10), KPTV (12) KATU was flipped to channel 4 at the start of the AT&T era for unknown reasons, but was flipped back to 2 about a year into the Comca$t era. I seem to remember Paragon (in Portland) also doing that for a little while in the 90s, probably until enough people complained. Almost all my channels on Charter in Wisconsin share their same channel numbers, mainly because the Lake Michigan cities mostly have their affiliates on VHF. The only ones that aren't are all higher UHF stations which wouldn't be logical to 'neighborhood' channels, so... Charter mid-Wisconsin WBAY - 2/2 (ABC GB) WMVT - 3/36 (PBS MKE; 16 on Time Warner systems) WTMJ - 4/4 (NBC MKE) WFRV - 5/5 (CBS GB) WITI - 6/6 (FOX MKE) WPXE - 7/55 (ION MKE; joined in 1999. On 15 for Time Warner customers) WDJT - 9/58 (CBS MKE; joined in 1995 after the big CBS/Fox switch, so it had to be squashed somewhere. Usually it's universally on 5 throughout the Milwaukee metro.) WMVS - 10/10 (PBS MKE) WLUK - 11/11 (FOX GB) WISN - 12/12 (ABC MKE) WPNE - 13/38 (PBS GB; moved from 38 after a 2000 channel re-mapping after our system ditched the A/B switch system) WVCY - 15/30 (REL MKE; wedged in last year after they asserted must-carry after Charter and forerunners never offered any channel space to them) WGBA - 16/26 (NBC GB; moved from 26 after the 2000 re-map) WVTV - 18/18 (CW MKE) WBME - 19/49 (METV MKE; joined in 2008; universally Channel 19 throughout the market, and one of only a few full-power ME-TV stations) WMLW - 21/41 (IND MKE; joined in 2001, bumping WGN America to 17 and TV Guide to Channel 89) WCGV - 24/24 (MYN MKE) Univision's on cable channel 69, national cable feed WYTU - 965/63 (TMD MKE; late addition to Charter, digital-only) The logic of putting local VHFs on a different channel during analog days was that homes close to the tower would pick up the over-the-air signal along with the signal from the cable system and they'd interfere with each other (usually with a ghost image). Usually something with very little viewership would be on the actual over-the-air spots on the cable system...maybe even the community access channel.

COMCAST where I live (Bristol, Connecticut), which was United Artists Cable back in the day had WFSB Channel 3 on Channel 2 because of this. Channel 3 was Prevue Guide. Later Channel 3 became what TCI Cable called "Color Check" which was just color bars meant for you to make sure the colors on your TV were set correctly. Then NESN - New England Sports Network went from being a Pay Channel to a basic cable channel and they occupied Channel 3. After complaints they swapped Sneak Prevue the Prevue Guide's Pay-Per-View Preview channel and NESN with NESN ending up on Channel 10. Later still they eventually left Channel 3 as an empty channel, which was what it was like when I moved into my apartment and became a Comcast subscriber in April 2009. A few months after the analog shut-down they moved WFSB to Channel 3. Channel 2 was removed all together (though if you disconnect the digital box there's color bars on Channel 2. (Don't know if its the same as the color bars on Channel 102 with the box). Channel 69 also became a problem in 1997 when they revived WHCT (now WUVN) Channel 18 from the dead. Same issue. Ghosting. COX in Meriden when they rebuilt the system after they bought it from Dimensions (sic) put WFSB Channel 3 on Channel 2 and WTNH Channel 8 on Channel 7. The 3 towns they serve are closer to New Haven (where Channel 8 is based out of), so the ghosting was worse. Channel 3 was COX-3 later renamed COX Sports Television (mostly infomercials) and Channel 8 was WSAH Channel 43 out of Bridgeport which was the flagship station of The Shop-At-Home Network. After the analog shut down they too moved WFSB from 2 to 3 and put COX Sports Television on 2. WTNH however remained on Channel 7. Now there's nothing on Channel 2. The moved COX Sports TV to Channel 128. And Channel 8 is now HSN. WSAH (Now a mix of ME-TV and Infomercials) moving to Digital only Channel 75. Comcast, Bellevue, WA 4-KOMO 4 (ABC) 5-KING 5 (NBC) 7-KIRO 7 (CBS) 9-KCTS (PBS) 11-KSTW (CW) 13-KCPQ (Fox) are all on correct channels. Other locals (like ION, KBTC, etc) are on different channels. -crainbebo WCYB Bristol channel 5 WJHL Johnson City channel 11 WATE Knoxville channel 6 WVLT Knoxville channel 8 WBIR Knoxville channel 10 on the majority of systems that I have dealt with. WOWK Huntington WV channel 13 again on the majority of systems. WCHS Charleston WV channel 8 WSAZ Huntington WV channel 3 In Knoxville on Comcast, WATE 6 is on 13, WVLT 8 is on 5, and WBIR 10 is on 9.(of course all of these channels are virtual now) Comcast in San Francisco does this correctly - 2 is on 2, 4 on 4, 5 on 5, etc. Even the Hi Def channels follow this rule, so HD 2 is 702, HD5 is 705, etc. The UHF channels remain on the same cable channels they have had for decades. The only exception is NBC "Bay Area," broadcast channel 11, which is on Cable 3. But as I understand it, that was at the request of NBC.

If NBC had their way it would've actually been on 11, but before they bought the station, Granite Broadcasting tried to brand it as "NBC 3" upon the NBC relaunch and had it moved to 3 nearuniversal. However, KCRA in Sacramento is on the real Channel 3 and both them and NBC complained about confusion, so when NBC took over, they killed the "NBC 3" branding immediately and bumped it to "NBC 11", then "NBC Bay Area". But they're stuck with the 3 cable slot, which they can't move now (and wouldn't because they control the main Bay Area cable systems in Comcast now). Of course in San Diego NBC embraces the false cable channel branding with "NBC 7/39" for obvious reasons. The interference mentioned earlier was due to something called ingress. Like MarcB said, that is the biggest reason why WFSB-TV (CBS) channel 3 of Hartford was always on cable channel 2 in the old analog days. WTNH-TV (ABC) channel 8 of New Haven was always on analog cable channel 8 here in southern Hartford County. Their Hamden transmitter site was far enough away from our system's head end, so it was never a problem. WUVN-TV (UNI) channel 18 of Hartford was on analog cable channel 18 when they came back on the air in the late 1990s (they were forced off the air in the spring of 1991). Of course, with digital broadcasting , that really isn't a problem now. At this point for the few customers in New Britain and Hartford still using an analog lineup, the so-called "matches" are 3 on 3, 8 on 8 and 18 on 18. That will change shortly, once Comcast sheds the old analog line-up for good in April. Hopefully, it'll make WCTX-TV (MY) channel 59 of New Haven rethink about calling their station MY-TV 9, since it was on analog cable channel 9 in much of the market. @MRSCHIMPF: That's why I hate the branding of MY-TV 9 here in Connecticut. Go an hour and change down I-95 from New Haven and what do you have? Yes...WWOR-TV (MY) channel 9 of Secaucus, NJ/New York City. I assume this is normal all across the US but I'll post anyway. Down here in the Mobile/Pensacola DMA, AT&T UVerse has the local channels on their real PSIP channel numbers... for the most part. WEAR ABC 3 = 3 / HD=1003 WDPM Daystar 4 = Not Carried WKRG CBS 5 = 5 / HD=1005 WALA Fox 10 = 10 / HD=1010 WFNA CW 55 = 12 / HD=1012 WPMI NBC 15 = 15 / HD=1015 WMPV TBN 21 = 21 WSRE PBS 23 = 23 / HD=1023 WHBR CTN 33 = 33 WFGX MY 35 = 35 / HD=1035 WPAN Ind 53 = 40 WEIQ PBS 42 = 42 / HD=1042 WJTC Ind 44 = 44 WFBD BLAB 48 = Not Carried WAWD Tourist Info 58 = Not Carried Daystar affiliate WDPM is not carried for some reason, I guess the OTA station may be a simulcast of the cable Daystar station already on UVerse? WDPM's digital allotment is 23 and is supposed to be using PSIP 31 but they have been using PSIP 4 since they signed on... when they aren't off the air. I see where WFNA wanted to be on a low number, channel 12, as they are co-owned with WALA Fox 10. WFNA does use 55 as their OTA PSIP channel #.

Independent WPAN channel 53 has never broadcast a PSIP number OTA and has dropped all channel number branding. Their digital allotment channel is 40 and they wound up on UVerse channel 40. WJTC channel 44 has no HD coverage on UVerse... Which sucks because they carry SEC network sports in HD among other HD programs. Being Co-Owned with NBC 15 I would think they should have the pull to get an HD channel on UVerse, their engineer tells me otherwise, "no network = no HD channel." No LPTV stations are carried and no sub-channels are carried on UVerse here either, and we have a bunch of those. Bangor Maine's (which now serves most of Eastern and Downeast Maine) cable lineup has always been this way, NBC 2 is on 3, CBS 5 on 6, ABC 7 on 8 and PBS 12 on 13 with public access on 2 5 7 & 12, although the UHF Pax/ion affiliate eventually took over the Channel 12 position. In Rochester, NY the traditional VHFs have always been carried on Time Warner Cable on their traditional OTA channel #... WROC (CBS) on Channel 8 WHEC (NBC) on Channel 10 WHAM (ABC) on Channel 13 WHEC and WHAM are still physically transmitting OTA on their traditional channels as well, in the digital era, although WROC has moved (at least for now) up to physical channel 45 OTA. The other full power channels in town were moved down to lower channels; WXXI (virtual 21, physical 16) is on cable 11, WUHF (virtual 31, physical 28) is on cable 7. Pittsburgh has channels positioned in quite a few places on Comcast. In Westmoreland County, KDKA-2 (CBS-owned) is on Channel 2, WTAE-4 (Hearst, ABC) on Channel 3, WINP-16 (ION-owned) on Channel 4, WPGH-53 (Sinclair, FOX) on Channel 7, WQED13 (WQED, PBS) on Channel 9, WPMY-22 (Sinclair, MyTV) on Channel 10 (this is a common placing for My-TV Pittsburgh on quite a few systems), WPCB-40 (Cornerstone, religious) on Channel 11, WPXI-11 (Cox, NBC) on Channel 12 and WPCW-19 (CBS-owned, CW) on Channel 15. In Monroeville, on a former Adelphia system, WINP-16 uses Channel 16, but WPCW is on 2, KDKA 3, WTAE 5, WPGH 6, WPCB 9, WPMY 10, WPXI 12 and WQED 14. In Pittsburgh proper, it's WINP 4, WPCB 5, KDKA 6, WPGH 7, WTAE 8, WQED 9, WPMY 10, WPXI 12 and WPCW 15. Of course, one also has to consider the digital lineup where there is some confusion of another sort. WPCW uses RF channel 11, WPXI's old analog position. WBGN, a regional independent not carried by Comcast, uses RF 16, WINP/WQEX's former analog slot, but is seen on digital channel 59 in Allegheny County. WQED-13 has its old analog 13 position for digital broadcasting. On FiOS, the lineup is KDKA-2 on 2, WPCW-19 on 3, WTAE-4 on 4, WPCB-40 on 5, WPGH-53 on 7, Pittsburgh Cable News Channel (WPXI's round-the-clock news outlet) on 9 (Comcast usually puts it around Channel 35), WPMY-22 on 10, WPXI-11 on 11, WQED-13 on 13 and WBGN on 22. In Knoxville on Comcast, WATE 6 is on 13, WVLT 8 is on 5, and WBIR 10 is on 9.(of course all of these channels are virtual now)

I do not deal with Comcast in Knoxville that much. I do know that in the outlying areas and up in Kentucky the Knoxville stations 6 8 and 10 are usually on their correct cable channel. WTNZ is usually on 12 or 13 and WMAK for those that carry it is usually on 7. @MRSCHIMPF: That's why I hate the branding of MY-TV 9 here in Connecticut. Go an hour and change down I-95 from New Haven and what do you have? Yes...WWOR-TV (MY) channel 9 of Secaucus, NJ/New York City. If I remember that's because when LIN grabbed the station, they also forced the local cable systems to take WCTX in exchange for WTNH-8 during RT consent negotiations, and then forced Syndex to boot WWOR out of the market and put them on cable 9, right? Or was that just coincidental that they were on 9 beforehand? Daystar affiliate WDPM is not carried for some reason, I guess the OTA station may be a simulcast of the cable Daystar station already on UVerse? WDPM's digital allotment is 23 and is supposed to be using PSIP 31 but they have been using PSIP 4 since they signed on... when they aren't off the air. I would assume they're just waiting out the string on their cable-only contract for the digital religious tier, then will throw up the must-carry flag to get WDPM on local systems later. @MRSCHIMPF: I don't know if there was anything involving WWOR-TV. Here in New Britain, CT, WCTX-TV was added to our lineup quite a long time time after WWOR's EMI Service was ended. I'm not sure if WWOR (or WPIX) is still on any cable systems in Connecticut outside of Fairfield County (which is part of the New York City DMA). In Jackson, TN Charter has the following cable channels that match the channels they were on before the digital conversion: From Memphis: WREG CBS 3 WMC NBC 5 WKNO PBS 10 WHBQ Fox 13 From Jackson: WBBJ ABC 7 WLJT PBS 11 WBBJ was on cable channel 8 until the digital conversion when it changed to channel 7. Dish Network for northwest Tennesse is as follows ... Locals WPSD NBC 6 & 6672 (Paducah, KY) WBBJ ABC 7 & 6670 (Jackson, TN) WLJT PBS 11 & 6674 (Martin, Jackson, Lexington, TN) KFVS CBS 12 & 6671 (Cape Girardeau, MO) WJKT FOX 16 & 6673 (Jackson, TN) Superstations KTLA CW 233 (Los Angeles) WPIX CW 234 (New York) KWGN CW 235 (Denver) WBZ My Network 236 (Boston) WWOR My Network 238 (New Jersey)

WGN America 239 (Chicago) ***Not a superstation, part of a different package*** The locals stations match, but the superstations don't. Smiley On Dish and DirecTV the stations always match.....that's why we're not counting them. I don't travel a lot, but it seems to be more in the South (for some reason or not) that cable doesn't give stations the correct channel number. @ JAZZ_KAT: I think you meant WSBK-TV (MY) channel 38 of Boston. WBZ-TV is CBS channel 4. However, they are sister stations at least. Smiley You are right. My mistake. Smiley I do travel a lot, and I don't think the phenomenon is limited to the south. As others have pointed out upthread, the only real reason VHF stations were ever shifted from their RF channels in the first place was to avoid the "ingress" problems that stemmed from having powerful over-the-air transmitters close to residential areas, where the OTA signal could get into poorly-shielded cable systems and TVs and cause interference to the cable signal on the same channel. There are certainly southern cities with transmitter locations that could cause ingress issues (Atlanta and Birmingham come to mind here) and others where the transmitters are far enough out of town to be less of an issue (Orlando, for instance). But I can think of plenty of cities in other parts of the country where ingress could be a problem as well - Rochester and Syracuse, for instance, or Boston's western suburbs, or Omaha. Out west, towers tend to be on mountaintops and ingress is usually less of an issue, but there are prominent exceptions even out there (Seattle and San Francisco come to mind.) Here in Rochester, the suburban People's Cable system put 8, 10 and 13 on 8, 10 and 13 and battled ingress issues right up until the end of analog TV (and even now, I get some ingress issues from digital signals on 10 and 13 against analog cable 10 and 13.) The American Cable system in the city started out using modified Hamlin "slide-rule" converter boxes that did a crude form of remapping: when your pointer on the box was on "channel 8," it was really tuned to RF channel 7. So there was no "channel 2" on the system, and 8, 10 and 13 were really on RF 7, 9 and 12. The advent of cable-ready TV sets pretty much ended that scheme, and the system was eventually realigned to put 8, 10 and 13 on 8, 10 and 13. I remember Syracuse's Newchannels system putting 3, 5 and 9 on 4, 6 and 7. Those got moved eventually, if memory serves. In Boston, the systems near the TV towers in Newton and Needham didn't make much use of the low VHF channels at all; 2, 4, 5 and 7 ended up on 22, 24, 25 and 27 for many years. The move to digital cable has largely eliminated ingress and channel-mapping issues. Here on my Time Warner system in Rochester, less than a mile from the Pinnacle Hill tower site, I can still punch up "8" or "10" or "13" on my digital cable box to watch the SD versions of "channel 8." But the QAM digital signal it's actually tuning in is on a completely different frequency (somewhere up on "cable channel 90" in the 700 MHz range), and even at that it wouldn't conflict with the RF channel 45 UHF digital signal that "channel 8" now uses. (One more note here: in Canada, cable systems have long been REQUIRED to remap local VHF signals off their RF channels to avoid ingress. So Toronto's CTV affiliate, CFTO, for instance, has never been "channel 9" on cable there; it's been on cable 8 for decades.)

@MRSCHIMPF: I don't know if there was anything involving WWOR-TV. Here in New Britain, CT, WCTX-TV was added to our lineup quite a long time time after WWOR's EMI Service was ended. I'm not sure if WWOR (or WPIX) is still on any cable systems in Connecticut outside of Fairfield County (which is part of the New York City DMA). Probably because it's New Haven County both WPIX and WWOR (along with WNBC and WABC) are on COMCAST Waterbury/Wolcott. WPIX is on 11, WWOR is on 23, WNBC is on 5, and WABC is on 19. And on COX Meriden (again New Haven County) WPIX is on Channel 22. (used to be on 23). Time Warner Cable in Burlington, NC carries WUNC/4 (PBS) on 4 WGHP/8 (Fox) on 8 WTVD/11 (ABC) on 11 WXII/12 (NBC) on 12 OTOH, WFMY/2 (CBS) is on Ch. 9, WXLV/45 (ABC for the Triad; TVD is for the Triangle) is on 10; WCWG/20 (CW) is on 3, and I'm not even sure where WMYV/48 (MyNet) and WGPX/16 (Ion) are. If I'm correct Athens, GA still has WSB (ABC) on Ch. 2 WAGA (Fox) on Ch. 5 WGTV (PBS) on Ch. 8 WXIA (NBC) on Ch. 11 Charter in St. Louis city has most STL-area stations on the "correct" channel: KTVI-2 (FOX) on 2; KMOV-4 (CBS) on 4; KSDK-5 (NBC) on 5; KETC-9 (PBS) on 9; KPLR-11 (CW) on 11; WPXS-13 (Daystar) on 13; KNLC-24 (Ind.) on 24. The only two that differ are KDNL-30 (ABC) on 12 and WRBU-46 (MY) on 7. Comcast in Boston has the lower channels on the correct channel: WGBH-2 (PBS) on 2, WBZ-4 (CBS) on 4, WCVB-5 (ABC) on 5, WHDH-7 (NBC) on 7, WENH-11 (PBS) on 11. All the higher channels are as follows: WFXT-25 (Fox) on 13, WUNI-27 (UNI) on 17, WSBK-38 (My) on 14,

WGBX-44 (PBS) on 16, WWDP-46 (ShopNBC) on 10, WYDN-48 (DayStar) on 23, WBIN-50 (Ind.) on 18, WLVI-56 (CW) on 12, WNEU-60 (TEL) on 19 (in some areas), WMFP-62 (MeTV) on 20, WUTF-66 (TF) on 21, and WBPX-68 (ion) on 15. Though I will point out that in the late 80s/early 90s in my town, most of the channels were on the correct channel, but I remember WGBH-2 being on channel 3, and WLVI-56 being on 26 (our cable system only had 52 channels at the time). But then in 1996, we switched to fiber-optic, and became a part of the cable system in my neighboring town, which is rather close to the towers, and the lineup looked like this: 27 - WGBH-2 (PBS) 28 - WBZ-4 (CBS) 29 - WCVB-5 (ABC) 30 - WHDH-7 (NBC) 31 - WENH-11 (PBS) 32 - WFXT-25 (Fox) 33 - WUNI-27 (UNI) 34 - WSBK-38 (formerly UPN) 35 - WGBX-44 (PBS) 36 - WMFP-62 (formerly Shop-at-home) 37 - WLVI-56 (formerly WB) 38 - WHSH-66 (now WUTF, formerly HSN) 39 - WABU-68 (now WBPX, formerly Ind.) and 70 - WNDS-50 (now WBIN, Ind.) About a year later, Comcast changed the lineup for most of Massachusetts, and the low channels moved to the positions they are today, but on my system, the cable-ready channel lineup differed from the lineup if you had the box. The main differences in the cable-ready lineup was: 22 - WGBH 23 - WBZ 24 - WCVB and 58 - WHDH (moved to 25 in 2003 or so) Also note, that for the cable ready lineup, channels 2 and 4 were not used at all, 5 was WYDN, and 7, was actually WSBE-36 (PBS) out of Providence, RI, exclusively available in Natick. It had always been a part of the cable system in Natick, and I think there was some contract with the town. It had never been part of the Newton/Needham system. It was on channel 22 if you had the box. For Comcast systems in Lake County Indiana, the 5 stations that were on their former VHF channels were placed on the same channel for cable, & still that way today with their virtual channels: 2 WBBM-TV (CBS) 5 WMAQ-TV (NBC) 7 WLS-TV (ABC)

9 WGN-TV (CW) 11 WTTW (PBS) Now with digital, if we go by the RF channel, WYIN (PBS), which used to be on 56 analog has always been on 17 for cable systems, & their RF channel 17 (digital) is also their cable channel placement today. Now if only they could officially use 17 for channel branding than 56 (though they mostly brand thamselves as Lakeshore Public Television). Here are some additional cities in the west coast. Spokane - Comast KREM 2, KXLY 4, KHQ 6, KSPS 7 Medford - Charter -KOBI 5, KSYS 8, KTVL 10, KDRV 12 Boise -Cable One KIAD 4, KIVI 6, KTVB 7, KNIN 9, KTRV 12, except KBOI is on Channel 8 (OTA 2) Redding - Charter KRCR 7, KIXE 9, KHSL 12 Santa Barbara Cox- KEYT 3, KSBY 6, and KCOY 12 Las Vegas - Cox KSNV 3, KVVU 5, KLAS 8, KTVX 10, KTNV 13 Reno - Charter - KTVN 2, KRNV 4, KNPB 5, KOLO 8 Phoenix - Cox KTVK 3, KPHO 5, KAET 8, KSAZ 10, KPNX 12 A bit of a stretch...but where I live (Amherst, NS), local cableco EastLink carries WCVB 5 on cable 5 (WGBH 2 is on cable 4, WBZ 4 on 32, and WHDH on 11 (local OTA CBAFT 11 airs on cable 12)). Comcast in Savannah, Ga. continues to use the pre-digital slots for two of its three V affils: WSAV 3 (NBC) ... 2 WTOC 11 (CBS) ... 6 WJCL 22 (ABC) is on 4, and WTGS 28 (Fox) is 10. WVAN 9 (PBS) has its transmitter some 30 miles inland (Pembroke), so it's always been 9 on Comcast. --Russell Here in Denver, all the English locals except for KTVD 20 & KDVR 31 are on their home channels on cable (All of them are on their home channels on satellite however) KTVD 20 is on Comcast Cable 5 while KDVR 31 is on Comcast Cable 13 The Latin locals however are THE COMPLETE OPPOSITE of this however. Here, only TeleFutura affiliate KTFD 14 is on Channel 14 on cable & satellite as well as virtual OTA while LeSea's KETD 53 (Estrella) is still stuck on Comcast Cable 53 but the others are listed as follows..... KCEC 50 (Univision) Comcast Cable 10 KDEN 25 (Telemundo) Comcast Cable 11 KZCO 27 (Azteca America) Comcast Cable 15 Pretty weird..... Cheers Grin Pat Phoenix is a straight shot, with the major six stations on their correct places. Other oddities...

*KAZT-7 Prescott is on cable 13. Cable 7 is Cox-7 access. (Though, prior to about five years ago, it was TBS. TBS was 7, KUTP-45 was 16, and Cox 9 was...9. Those all moved. KUTP is now 9). *KPPX-17 is 51. KASW-61 is 6 (though they have branded as 6 for a number of years). *KTVW-33 is 19. KTAZ-39 is 20 (that was its Daystar positioning too). KPAZ-21 (TBN) is...21. I believe Tucson is mostly the same way with major stations on their dial least on the Cox system. (Some parts of Tucson are Comcast, their only presence in the state.) For these numerous markets where every major station is on its OTA (virtual) channel... It would be interesting to know... Were they carried on their own channels in the *analog* era? For stations below channel 14, usually the point of *not* carrying them on their own channels was to avoid ingress interference, where the air signal interferes with the cable signal. (it's my understanding that in Canada, it's *illegal* to carry a must-carry station on its own channel, for this reason) With digital TV, stations below channel 14 are usually no longer broadcasting OTA on the same channel they used in analog. So usually, there's no longer any technical problem with carrying a station on its own channel. IOW, the situation changed drastically in June 2009 & I would expect far more stations to be carried on their own channels. At least in my travels, I haven't seen much evidence that 2009 and the end of OTA analog resulted in very many cable lineup changes. I would submit that the bigger motivation for cable lineup changes in recent years has been regulatory, not technical - specifically, the provision in the must-carry rules that went into effect sometime in the late 1990s/early 2000s (can't quite put a finger on it at the moment) that must-carry stations have to be carried on their OTA channel position or lower. That provision appears to me to have been responsible for some of the moves (Syracuse, suburban Boston) from off-channel to onchannel positions. And of course by 2009, most larger cable systems were looking toward an all-digital future, with a significant majority of their customers (the valuable ones, anyway) watching on digital boxes that were probably already remapping SD QAM channels in place of the legacy analog lineup. (I know that my S-A box for Time Warner doesn't tune analog at all - if I punch in "10" for my local NBC affiliate, it's tuning a QAM stream at 93.xx instead of the analog 10 signal on the cable.) Charlotte, NC had only a few VHF stations in the analog era. On Time Warner where I live, WBTV channel 3 (CBS) is on 3 and WSOC-TV channel 9 (ABC) is on 9. Ironically, the NBC station was known as NBC 6 for many years, and shortly before their over-theair channel changed from 36 with the switch to digital, they started calling themselves News Channel 36. With the digital transition I had to learn a whole new set of channel numbers. My TV 12 made it easy by not mentioning their over-the-air number as they once did as WB 55. NBC's Today Show local on-screen tickers

Every morning on NBC's Today Show on the ticker slide (with the current time and local tempature and Today's webaddress or KLG & Hoda's one in the 4th hour) they ran local news tickers on bottom on the screen on the white background. Some used the NBC logo on it (like NBC O&O's like WNBC-4 or KNBC-4 for example, or non O&O like WCBD-2 in Charleston, SC) and with all capitol letters, but in the Greenville, SC market it shows headlines (with first letter in Capitol letter and the rest in lowercase) and places a WYFF-4 logo in the place of the NBC logo on the ticker screen, another I saw was WYFF's sister station WLWT-5 in Cincinnati, Ohio doing the same thing, but using capitol letters for news tickers. Some markets don't do local news tickers, like WAGT-26 in Augusta, GA or WMBF-32 in Myrtle Beach, SC for example. Haven't seen the ones on WIS-10 in Columbia, SC or WCNC-36 out of Charlotte, NC. Does your local NBC station carry local news tickers during the Today Show in either capitol or lowercased letters, and NBC or local NBC affiliate logo? Or none at all? KNTV the NBC O&O has tickers on the Today Show. WGBA Green Bay and WTMJ Milwaukee don't do it; but judging from their 'My First Huge HD Graphics Set' from Journal and the use of "Locals Only" (the most uninspired news music package in the history of the medium), they think the text is too tiny for us to read Roll Eyes. After about 20 minutes though they quickly get repetitive and aren't updated after 7:01; it's always the same six non-stories from the crime and entertainment blotters, weather and sports scores scrolling down, so I'd rather have without the ticker. I haven't seen WDIV/Detroit in awhile but I recall them using capital letters, their station logo, and a mention of their website Our main NBC affiliate, WHDH Boston does the tickers with their circle 7 logo instead of the NBC logo. They use all capital letters, and also show temperatures with colored graphics. High temperatures with a red background and low temperatures with a blue background. I think they show sports scores as well. The other NBC affiliate we can get here, WJAR Providence, doesn't do tickers at all. WSFA (Montgomery, AL) uses the ticker; WPMI (Mobile, AL/Pensacola, FL) does not. KTUU (Anchorage) also uses a ticker; KTVF (Fairbanks) doesn't. I've seen the ones from WNBC 4 in NYC recently. They just use regular NBC logo. On KNBC 4 in Los Angeles they used the NBC 4 logo (like WYFF used their own logo on the scrolls). Neat! WESH 2 in Orlando doesn't do this. WVIT-TV (NBC) channel 30 of New Britain/Hartford, an NBC O&O, uses the ticker, as far as I know. Not sure if the "NBC Connecticut" logo is used on it, however. KPRC in Houston does not use the bottom ticker during Today.... which is another proof about that affiliate that i've been mentioning for years. Roll Eyes The NBC station here in Lubbock, KCBD-TV, does not run a ticket during the Today Show. WTWC in Tallahassee (which hasn't had a news department in over 12 years) doesn't run a news ticker during Today. KUSA in Denver uses a ticker, but they use their own by squeezing the picture up the screen.

Out of market channels on satellite Who else agrees with me that there's got to be some kind of rule change with out of market channels on satellite TV (Direct and Dish). It is so frustrating. Angry I am literally a stone's throw from the border of TV markets but because I'm just over the border, I can only get the local TV channels from my market even though I badly want a channel from the other market just down the road. The local cable company offers that channel so I'm tempted to switch, but I hate the process of switching and I've got a good package deal with the satellite company. And I can't get that channel on an antenna either. I've tried but I'm behind a mountain. So why is it that cable companies are allowed to carry out of market channels but satellite companies are only allowed to cover the local channels in that particular market? I agree with you 100%. In a more perfect world, you'd at least be offered the markets that you could receive with a rooftop antenna. Unfortunately, like most every other entertainment medium, television is a big business that has become fiercely territorial. Spots and programs are bought and sold on the assumption that a station from Market A has the SOLE distribution rights within it's "territory" (now known as 'the market'). Reception of signals from Market B (which may actually be closer to your house as the crow flies) only serves to dilute that value and stations in Market A don't like that. While they can't do anything about OTA reception, they can do something about second party distribution....and they do it as often as they can. Which is to make sure that you are watching their signal and ONLY their signal if you want their network and live within their counties. This is why the cable system in my area, which is equidistant from Chicago and Milwaukee, blew out every Milwaukee channel (except for 1 PBS station) back in 1997. Because, as of 1996 (thank you Cable Reform Act), the Chicago locals could make that happen. So, unless you have an antenna (and many of us can't because of HOA rules, etc.), Milwaukee stations are now as foreign here as stations from Baton Rouge. Now yes, this area is much more oriented toward Chicago than Milwaukee. There's absolutely no argument from me there. Historically, both sets of channels had been available. The many fans of those evil Packers who live around here were guaranteed weekly coverage of their team while the rest of us could watch the Bears. So, why must it be an either/or situation? $$$$$, that's why. Historically, cities and/or suburbs were tied to one central city, though. The scenario actually gets more complicated now that some people live in exurban areas and bedroom communities that could be tied to one than one large city. For example, my mom lives in Temecula, California- an exurb that is part of the Los Angeles TV market due to its location in Riverside County. They also receive KUSA, a San Diego market station, on Fios though. Arguably, Temecula is more part of the San Diego market- as people commute just across the city limit to San Diego County for work opportunities, and the city is somewhat tied to Camp Pendleton in Northern San Diego County. However, there are also plenty of people who work in Riverside, San Bernardino County, and even Orange and Los Angeles counties- so its a part of both worlds. I'm guessing its annoying to turn on the TV in the morning in Temecula and get news and weather from LA, when you're making a morning commute towards San Diego. Isn't the market carriage based on some kind of required agreements between the sat/cable company and the stations? We used to have Dish, and one time, for a hour or so, on channel 9, we were getting some channel from like Denver, and we're in NC. That was the only channel like that, I imagine it was some switch gone bad or something. So I also imagine that the sat/cable companies COULD do a lot of things

that they don't do, because they are trying to make the most people the happiest they can be, and maximize their profits and minimize their effort, and the agreements they have to make with the local stations is what makes the difference.... @ JUSTPASSINGTHROUGH: I think you meant KUSI-TV (IND) channel 51 of San Diego? Strange how KUSA-TV (NBC) channel 9 of Denver got mentioned in the next post! Smiley Anyways, is there some rule about a cable company having to provide an out-of-market PBS affiliate? Comcast of New Britain, CT carries WGBY-TV (PBS) channel 57 of Springfield, MA on analog cable channel 12 and in digital elsewhere, but in SD only. Naturally, we get the HD feed of WEDH-TV (PBS) channel 24 of Hartford, along with their subchannels of CPTV 4U (WEDH-TV 242) and Create (WEDH-TV 24-3). PBS is probably treated differently because they tend to be more viewer supported than advertiser supported. I live in the NYC area and the only PBS stations I get are in-market. So there is certainly no guarantee that every cable system is going to carry an out of market PBS station. I think there is a policy that states that cable systems should offer at least two PBS stations, if possible -- which is why in some cities that have only one local PBS, you see another PBS from an adjacent market. Case in point is Jacksonville, where Comcast viewers in that city get WUFT Gainesville, in addition to their local PBS station, WJCT. Also, in Tallahassee, Comcast viewers get local WFSU and Albany GPB outlet WABW. In Southington, CT you get WCBS, WNBC, and WNYW out of NYC on DirecTV in addition to the local Hartford/New Haven Channels. They're not on 2, 4, and 5 however. They're in the 380 range. DirecTV has all the NY affiliates in the 380 channels nationwide, and all the LA affiliates in the 390 range nationwide. I can see the NY channels on the guide here in Los Angeles, but I can only watch the LA affiliates on either their 390s channel allocation or where they're mapped to appear on channels 2,4,5 etc. That's like in Porter & LaPorte Counties of Indiana, that they're between the Chicago & South Bend markets. Cable systems carry the South Bend stations in LaPorte County because they're usually allowed to carry channels that can be picked up OTA, but also because of significantly viewed status. In Porter County Indiana, cable can only carry WNDU (NBC) & WSBT (CBS) because of significantly viewed status. However, if you have an outdoor antenna you can get both Chicago & South Bend. People in those 2 counties usually have a VHF/UHF combo antenna pointed at Chicago, & a UHF only antenna pointed at South Bend. Since Weigel Broadcasting accepted RF 27 for WCWW-LD South Bend, they made that station 15kw non-directional, while weakening the signal of WCIU Chicago, & people are likely getting interference on RF 27, due to both WCIU & WCWW-LD being on that channel. As for satellite, those 2 counties of Indiana can only get Chicago stations, but LaPorte County residents consider themselves closer to South Bend, but Neilsen has LaPorte County lumped into the Chicago market, & Indianapolis also has them lumped into the Chicago market. LaPorte County also tried to get on Eastern time, but was denied, because Indianapolis considers them part of Chicago, & Not South Bendm though South Bend is much closer to LaPorte County (like Michigan City & LaPorte). When it comes to PBS, you're typically only allowed to get your own market PBS stations on cable & satellite. If in between markets, cable will most likely offer a neighboring PBS station, like WNIT South Bend being offered to LaPorte County Indiana residents, along with Chicago area PBS stations WTTW & WYCC Chicago, & WYIN Gary, IN. Satellite, they only offer the main channel of the PBS stations in your market. Markets without their own PBS station, cable will pipe in a PBS station from a neighboring market. Rockford, IL is one market that has yet to get their own PBS station, & relies on WHA Madison Wisconsin & WTTW Chicago on cable, while satellite to my

knowledge only offers PBS East & West. My sister lives in Lafayette Indiana, & her market only has 1 TV station. Cable TV is allowed to carry the Indianapolis stations, along with WLFI Lafayette (the only TV station, which is also CBS), & have permission to carry WTTW Chicago, & the subchanels in the digital tier (including WTTW Prime, Create, & V-Me). On satellite, she would automatically be eligible for New York & Los Angeles stations on DirecTV (except for WCBS & KCBS, due to being in WLFI's Grade A coverage area), but not sure about Dish Network. We live in Tennessee and have Dish Network, we get our local stations, including the Superstation package that include WPIX in New York, KTLA in Los Angeles, KWGN in Denver and couple others. I have no problem with it. Those channels in the 380's are only available to customers that live in areas where Directv does not carry local channels. Since you live in the LA area that's why you can see them in the 380's. I live in the NYC area and can see the NY channels in the 380's. Unfortunatley they don't let you subscribe to NY/LA unless local channels are not available. Believe me, I asked. Isn't there a 50 mile radius "must-carry" rule? Absolutely not. This is why there are now people in parts of Massachusetts (within the Boston mkt) who live 20 miles from Providence and yet cannot get most Providence channels on cable. Worse yet, folks in NE Rhode Island (about 30 miles from Boston and 25 from the big Route 128 tower) get absolutely NO Boston signals on cable. No, it's all about which market you're in and whether an adjacent market station can argue that your county qualifies for "significantly viewed" status as far as their station is concerned. Unfortunately, when counties were divvied up 100-200 years ago, the pioneers weren't able to take RF readings from the nearest big cities - so some parts of counties can get the royal shaft as far as this goes. After all, OTA reception on one side of a county may be entirely different than OTA reception on the opposite side. When it comes to PBS, you're typically only allowed to get your own market PBS stations on cable & satellite. That's not true. The rules for PBS signals are a little more flexible than they are for commercial stations. In a single market, you can have up to 3, but adjacent market PBS signals may certainly be carried. And there's no syndex/non-dup crap to deal with. For that reason, many cable systems' only out of market offerings are PBS stations. From where I live in Lake County, IL, WMVS Milwaukee (PBS) is offered on our system - both in SD and in HD. Nothing else from Milwaukee is available on cable. As far as satellite or U-verse are concerned, the Chicagoland area is a big island with singular viewing characteristics that is separated from anywhere else by hundreds of miles. So neither offers WMVS, though Northern Indiana's PBS (WYIN) is offered on both. We don't get WYIN where I live, though it replaces WMVS once you get into the Cook County Comcast systems. The way that TV and radio markets are carved out, they tend to ignore the fact that you'll get different OTA stations from adjacent markets in Waukegan than you will in Joliet or Merrillville, IN. Most large markets have this issue and - believe it or not - cable seems to address the problem better than U-verse/Fios or satellite do. The way that TV and radio markets are carved out, they tend to ignore the fact that you'll get different OTA stations from adjacent markets in Waukegan than you will in Joliet or Merrillville, IN. Most large markets have this issue and - believe it or not - cable seems to address the problem better than U-verse/Fios or satellite do. In Fios' case -- Verizon's Fios system offers ABC affiliate WWSB from Sarasota to all subscribers within Verizon's service area, which includes the greater Tampa Bay area. However, subscribers in

Haines City and Davenport, in Polk County (part of the Tampa Bay market), will be missing Orlando channels, which are available over-the-air in that region, as well as on Bright House and Comcast. Even living in Los Angeles, I still see the NY channels on the 380s, listed as ABC-E, CBS-E, etc.- I just can't view them. The west coast affiliates appear in the 390s and are listed as CBS-W, ABCW, etc but they are viewable to me since they're my local market stations. I have had DirecTV for several years and asked to have New York and Los Angeles stations included (although I dropped Fox Los Angeles), since I could already get my local stations over-the-air (this was in analog days). When the switch to digital came, I sprang for my local channels but was allowed to keep NYC and LA (and, in fact, I keep them mainly because our CBS affiliates have a tendency to pre-empt CBS's college basketball coverage for ACC games, and I'm a Kentucky fan who's more likely to see them on WCBS or KCBS; I also watch several things on WABC). As for the local channels, technically we should not be getting any but those in the Raleigh/Durham DMA but we also get WFMY (CBS 2) Greensboro and WGHP (Fox Cool High Point, NC, I think in part due to popular demand (Charter Communications carries them as well) since WFMY was the first station in this area (1949) and WGHP has always had a following, even when it was an ABC affiliate. However, DirecTV does not provide WXII (NBC 12) or WXLV (ABC 45) from Winston-Salem, some 60 miles away, nor does it provide PBS, the CW, MyNetwork, or ION from the Triad; all of those come from Raleigh/Durham. In other words, we have 2 CBS affiliates (WFMY and WRAL), 2 Fox affiliates (WGHP and WRAZ), and only one of all the others among the local channels. I think this thread should also apply to Telco services such as Verizon FiOS. Because in a lot of areas, you can get out-of-market channels on cable but not FiOS. The biggest example is here in Massachusetts. In several areas close to the RI border, cable companies Comcast and Charter carry the Providence NBC affiliate, WJAR. Though I think that's only because Charter has been the primary cable provider in the Worcester area for YEARS and years and years. And I can almost guarantee that if they redid their system, they would remove it from their lineup. On the other hand, ABC affiliate WMUR in Manchester, NH is available in the ENTIRE Boston DMA on DirecTV, Dish, and even Verizon FiOS. I have to say that I think that servies like FiOS & AT&T U-Verse are more like satellite than they are like cable in that regard. Actually with DirecTV in Lafayette, IN, you get WLFI plus all the offered Indianapolis stations including Indy's CBS affiliate, WISH-TV. In addition, WTIU in Bloomington is offered as a secondary PBS, plus Lafayette residents have access to the PBS National Feed, which is remapped to channel 65. We didn't get PBS Net until WIPB in Muncie was dropped by DirecTV earlier this year. The Jackson, TN area is odd because of being between Memphis and Nashville, although Memphis is actually closer. There are two cable systems, Charter, and E+ from the Jackson Energy Authority. Both have WREG (CBS), WMC (NBC), WKNO (PBS), and WHBQ (Fox) from Memphis, and WBBJ (ABC), WLJT (PBS), and WJKT (Fox) from Jackson. E+ carries WSMV (NBC) and WTVF (CBS) from Nashville, but Charter doesn't. If I had the choice I would definitely rather have E+, but where I live Charter is the only choice. Undecided Satellite really gets strange. Both DirecTV and Dish have WBBJ, WLJT, and WJKT, but neither of them have any stations from Memphis. DirecTV has WSMV, WTVF, and WNAB (CW) from Nashville, but Dish is the strangest of all. They get CBS from KFVS in Cape Girardeau, MO and NBC from WPSD in Paducah, KY, although this may change soon with NBC coming to an LP

station in Jackson in the near future. This makes absolutely no sense since Jackson is further away from them than either Memphis or Nashville. Meanwhile neighboring counties get the Memphis packages and can't get the Jackson channels. Huh I live north of Jackson area. We had all three, cable, Direct, and Dish. Cable, back when we have a few years ago, had the Jackson and Memphis markets. Then we move to Direct, which I think at the time only had the Memphis market. Now, we have Dish, we used to just get the Memphis market, then they added the Jackson stations and finally WPSD and KFVS. Lots of good choices then. Then, a couple of years ago, they (Dish) drop the Memphis market, which makes sense because they mainly covered Memphis and only went as far Jackson in coverage. So, we now get WBBJ, (Awful station, don't get the locals started Smiley ) WJKT, (Another like station like WBBJ, stays on sometimes, then sometimes it's off on sat and rabbit ears) and WLJT is a good station. WPSD and KFVS do cover northwest Tennessee and seem to cover us pretty good. JMO. : ) The LP station when it gets up and running sounds good, but I hope we get to keep WPSD as well. Like I said in an ealier post, we don't get a local CW or My Network. So, through Dish we have the Superstation package. KTLA, WPIX, KWGN, WSBK, WWOR. Awesome deal for seven dollars. WPSD and KFVS would make sense if Dish's Jackson package was in more counties in NW TN, but considering it's mainly in Madison county and maybe 2 or 3 other surrounding counties Memphis or Nashville would make more sense. I live in Crockett County, which gets the Memphis package for both DirecTV and Dish, even though it's next to Madison County. I'm still waiting to see what happens with the NBC LP station in Jackson. It will probably be OK for getting NBC as long as they don't go pre-emption crazy, but somehow I get the feeling that they could end up being all cheap programming and infomercials when they're local. I haven't seen any ads anywhere that they're coming, like they've at least been delayed. There's nothing stopping Fios to offer the same locals as the cable system. However, Fios is choosing to have less local lineups (that is, lineups varying from county to county), and is choosing consistency/ simplicity. However, there are a few exceptions that they have accommodated. Fios in Mercer Co. NJ does carry both Philly & NY stations. Fios in Howard Co. MD does carry the big 4 DC stations with the Baltimore stations. This is partially because people in Princeton tend to identify with NY and want their NYC channels, and Howard County residents think they are in DC's metro when they are closer to Baltimore, but want their DC channels. Fios would otherwise have a hard time selling their services (from subscribers of Comcast) without the bigger market stations. In Central DE, the Salisbury stations have must-carry rights (Salisbury is closer to Dover, than Philly) and Fios is more or less required to carry them. So, central DE Fios does get Philly and Salisbury on Fios. Fios has the means and follows the same regulations as cable in terms of locals. One consequence of this is that more local channels are being carried marketwide within Verizon's service area, rather than just their locality. In Verizon's service area in Florida, which stretches from Pasco County south to southern Sarasota County and as far east as Lake Wales in Polk County, Fios offers WWSB (ABC) from Sarasota (in addition to WFTS), WXAX-LP (Azteca America) from Tampa, and WZRA-CA (multicultural) from Oldsmar, in northeastern Pinellas County. On traditional Bright House and Comcast cable, WWSB is seen only in Manatee and Sarasota Counties, WXAX in Hillsborough only, and WZRA on Bright House in northern Pinellas only. I'm much closer to one My Network affiliate than another, and I believe it's true that other My Network station has a signal that won't reach my area even with a typical antenna. I can watch the

closer station with an antenna and used to all the time before I started having problems. But I watch the other station on cable for movies more than I watch any other station's local programming. Until recently, probably more than all local stations combined. The signal wasn't ideal in the days of analog but I did like their movies. On cable, we used to get the Big Three and maybe Fox from both markets. Now it's just CBS. All the others are Charlotte. In the next county, it's just the Fox station that's out-of-market. You didn't mentioned that if they lived in a market where they don't carry local-into-local service like DirecTV for example. They have to apply for a waiver to their local affiliates for NY/LA feeds (in SD) and NY HD feeds of 4 networks in Eastern/Central or LA HD feeds in Mountain/Pacific zones. You can blame the NAB for this. I think the National Association of Broadcasters should be banned from lobbying in Congress. Markets without Litton's Weekend Adventure on ABC Here in the Greenville/Spartanburg/Anderson/Asheville market, we don't recieve the ABC Litton's Weekend Adventure programming block on Saturday Mornings (which includes Jack Hanna's Wild Countdown,Ocean Mysteries with Jeff Corwin,Born to Explore, and Everyday Health, Food for Thought with Clair Thomas, and Culture Click). Instead we get those off network syndicated shows like Dog Tales, Sports Stars of Tomorrow, On The Spot, and DragonFlyTV which these preceeds crummy informercials at 9am. I know the GSP market is Informercial-Happy. Is there any other markets that don't clear Litton's Weekend Adventure on ABC? WAWV in Terre Haute, Indiana, which switched back to ABC from Fox last year, doesn't clear "Weekend Adventure", either. Wikipedia also says that KDNL in St. Louis also doesn't carry the block. WEAR-TV, the ABC affiliate in Pensacola, Florida, broadcasts only two programs from the block (which is really a syndicated block): "Jack Hanna's Wild Countdown" and "Ocean Mysteries with Jeff Corwin". They broadcast "Jack Hanna's Animal Adventures", "Aqua Kids", "DragonFlyTV", "Career Day", and "Teen Kids News" along with the two programs mentioned previously as part of their Saturday morning programming. It must be a decision made by Sinclair management, since they own WEAR, KDNL and WLOS. I noticed WKEF/Dayton also avoids the Litton Weekend Adventure altogether, so if anything, chances are that WSYX/Columbus, WXLV/Winston-Salem, WICD/Champaign & WICS/Springfield, and WCHS/Charleston are either passing on or airing parts of the block. Out here in Honolulu, KITV airs the block on Sundays due to live sports coverage from the mainland on Saturdays. It's probably more with Sinclair that they have a huge E/I deal to air Cookie Jar E/I programming and other syndicated providers on their stations (where it mainly airs to nobody except non-cable homes against the network morning shows on weekdays), so they also have to package in their network affiliates on it because of a glut. In this case, no objection to pre-emptions at all by them; most of the Litton programs are in the tradition of that syndicator, barely tolerable. Culture Click seems like an eighth-rate educational clone of The Soup, and the rest are just educational content without fun chasers to lighten the gruel (besides Corwin's and Hanna's shows, which are just their usual good shows but with HD production values). That, and ABC has seemed to lose all sense of how to program non-college football Saturdays, period; their one hour infomercial for Budweiser on Saturday afternoons is

unwatchable and makes me yearn for the days of time-buy motorcross and skateboarding. It's bad enough when stations pre-empt regular programming for grownups, but to me pre-empting kid's shows for infomercials, even if they replace them with something else at another time, is an all time low. ABC should be putting a stop to this. One thing that this does prove is that if e/i rules weren't in place there would be a lot more stations that would doing the same thing. I'm not an e/i fan by any means, but if it didn't exist most stations would go to having news and/or sports at best or trash talk and infomercials at the worst on Saturday mornings. I don't understand why Sinclair's ABC affiliates (including WLOS 13) chosed to pass on Litton's Weekend Adventure block on ABC Saturday Mornings in favor of Cookie Jar Programming. That's the first time that WLOS 13 pre-empted an ABC network programming on a permanent basis in 12 years. The last inncodent that WLOS pre-empted an ABC program on a permanent basis I recall was/is the popular women's talk show The View (with Barbara Walters of course). Instead, they choosed to air Jerry Springer instead at 11am in place of The View from 1997 until it was cleared in 2000. If I was an owner and had a license to operate an Independent station in my market (Greenville/Spartanburg, SC), I would call the station WSHK-TV 37. I would call affiliate relations at the ABC Television Network and have their permission to grant the rights for us to broadcast Litton's Weekend Adventure in place of WLOS 13 so viewers in the GSP market get to see it. Just like the good ole days when Independent stations picked up network programming from the major networks (in which the affiliates didn't clear in their market). Three examples. 1.)In Philly, future ABC O&O WPVI 6 chosed to pass on The Edge of Night (when it moved from CBS to ABC in late 1975). As a result, there were protest letters and calls at the station. So, now-defunct Indie WKBS 48 broadcasted EON instead on three week delay. Also, WLOS didn't clear the ABC run of EON either. 2.)CBS affiliate (first stunt as CBS before becoming now-defunct UPN) KIRO-TV 7 once owned by the conservative Mormons (same owners of then-CBS, now NBC KSL 5 in Salt Lake City, Utah) refused to air The Bold and The Beautiful because of campy nature of the serial. Lots of fans protested at KIRO and the late William J. Bell (creater of B&B) sent a letter to the station. It was seen instead on an Indie station which is now MNT affiliate. After KIRO reverted back to CBS in 1997 (after chaning ownerships years earlier), they now carry B&B. 3.)In my home market, Indie WAXA 40 (now WMYA MY40) carried certain NBC programs that WYFF didn't clear including Super Password hosted by the late Bert Convy. At first WAXA broadcasted SP in place of Channel 4 at Noon because WYFF was broadcasting their NewsCenter4 newscasts at Noon followed by now-defunct Search For Tomorrow in which ended in late 1986 on NBC. Later, WAXA broadcasted SP on one-day delay basis at 11:30am every morning at the time of it's run. Looks like Litton's gonna have some competition in 2012. Bellum Entertainment plans to air a syndicated EI block with shows including 'Animal Atlas', 'On The Spot', and a new show featuring chef Rocco DiSpirito. Here's my question: Will any ABC stations that pre-empted Litton's Weekend Adventure air any shows out of this block? Local CBS Stations Airing Paid Programming Instead Of CBS Primetime Noticed tonight the local CBS station for my market is airing paid programming at the 8pm hour when "A Gifted Man" is surpose to be on. The 9pm and 10pm hour isn't touched. Surprised to see this, isn't a show I watch but I could see this happen with a NBC affilate not a CBS affilate. Which market are you in?

Myrtle Beach, SC WBTW News 13 KPHO-TV Phoenix has done this also--recently pre-empted a Big Bang rerun on a Saturday with infomercial crap. WCSC 5 in Charleston, a heritage station, is preempting a new 48 Hours tomorrow night to air two infomercials for the Southeastern Spine Institute. You know people are losing money when a new show like that is preempted. WCSC 5 in Charleston, a heritage station, is preempting a new 48 Hours tomorrow night. KHOU11 in Houston is doing the same thing, but it'll show two news specials: "What's Right", with Saturday morning news anchor Sherry Williams; And "Len@Work", with 6pm news anchor Len Cannon. Both are year-end best-of specials. I've said before that the networks and the FCC need to put a stop to stations pre-empting prime time shows for infomercials and start penalizing stations that do it. Pre-emptions for news bulletins and possibly charity specials are one thing. But infomercials shouldn't be tolerated, no matter how bad the ratings are for the shows they replace. I believe that the FCC should set rules that infomercials can only be set ar regularly scheduled times for nothing but infomercials, and that they can't pre-empt network programming, at least during prime time. I wonder how the FCCwould DEFINE "infomercial"? And if they did, wouldn't some of the offerings on PBS stations during beg-a-thons qualify? I think there's a place on the FCC website that says it NEVER interferes with programming. This is often used as an escape clause when a classical station for example changes format. That's between the network and the station, and it's been going on as long as there have been networks - TV or radio. The FCC has nothing to say about it. This is as it should be. If anyone is to penalize an affiliate for not running its programming, it's CBS. If an affiliate doesn't want to run a network show, doesn't the network have the right to offer it to another station in the market? OK perhaps the FCC should stay out of it. But I do still think the networks should penalize stations for pre-empting prime time shows for infomercials. Occasional local specials might be OK. But infomercials shouldn't be tolerated. And I agree that a lot of what goes on with PBS begathons qualifies as infomercials as well. They do... Several stations (I can think of WSVN/Miami as NBC as a prime example 25 years ago and IIRC, WJXT/Jacksonville as CBS more recently) have lost their affiliation because they didn't clear enough network programming...replacing it mostly with local news or infomercials. Mind you, both of these stations do very, very, very well even though they are no longer part of the "Big Three". Other stations in smaller markets, like WTOC-TV/Savannah simply dominate the local ratings so much (and has for over 30 years) CBS tolerates them playing loose with the schedule... They can't really do that, because it would involve the FCC in the details of station programming -something that would surely violate the First Amendment. What the FCC could do (and once did do) is to completely prohibit infomercials on broadcast stations by putting in place a maximum limit for the amount of advertising that can run in an hour.

Such rules were more or less in place until the early eighties, which is why infomercials typically didn't show up on broadcast stations until the eighties. As I recall, the rule wasn't an absolute limit but was instead a requirement that stations airing more than 18 minutes/hour of advertising had to justify the high advertising load in their renewal application at the FCC. Stations didn't generally want that sort of visibility at the FCC and generally stayed under the 18 minute limit. For childrens shows, the limits were (and still are) even stricter, which is why we don't see infomercials aimed at kids. Now, theres two questions here: the first is what the FCC can do, and the second is what they should do. Unlike some folks here, Im not adverse to government intervention if it will advance some sort of broader public interest. And part of me would indeed like to see the FCC reimpose advertising limits and effectively ban infomercials. The problem with this is that its the weaker stations that would get hurt the CBS affiliate that runs an occasional infomercial in prime time to meet quarterly revenue goals is probably not going to go dark in the absence of that revenue, but a small independent station might. What I would like to see if for the government to grant a limited antitrust exemption to allow cable and broadcast TV groups to get together and develop standards regarding advertising limits, nonprogram material, and infomercials. This would be similar to the old NAB code that set advertising limits that generally did serve as guidelines and restrain commercial clutter in a way that was beneficial to viewers, stations, and advertisers. But Im not holding my breath for this to happen, either. For childrens shows, the limits were (and still are) even stricter, which is why we don't see infomercials aimed at kids. And for that reason, this is why the networks got out of Saturday morning, leaving programming of E/I friendly shows to third parties or, in Fox's case, sell its time to an infomercial broker and give up entirely. And even for the E/I blocks, at least one, Litton Media for its "Weekend Adventure" on ABC, refuse to sell traditional commercial time at all, opting to show only PI and pharmaceutical ads instead, none slanted towards kids and, in some cases, not necessarily to parents. As to WSVN (a.k.a. WCKT prior to being WSVN), I've been posting here before how they were preempt-happy as I was growing up---however..... Wasn't WSVN's loss-of-NBC due strictly to WTVJ being purchased by NBC (prompting CBS to look for a station to buy, and purchasing WCIX 6), and no more than that? I do recall late 1988 WTVJ, still running CBS, but just being purchased by NBC, running NBC's "Santa Barbara" while yet running CBS shows (until the contract ran out Dec 31, 1988). After all, NBC was quite aware of WCKT/WSVN's hijinks for many years....apparently they decided to put up with it until what we called the "Big Switch" on 1/1/89. WCKT/WSVN was pulling that stuff since the 60s, maybe earlier.... I know that NBC was ready to yank co-owned WHDH Boston due to the Jay-Leno-at-10 deal..... Scripps stations were mentioned earlier. WMC in Memphis when it was owned by Scripps was notorious for pre-emptions all day long, but especially in the daytime from the 70's to the early 90's. I had always thought that NBC should have pulled their affiliation at that time. Their pre-emption antics ended in the 90's when the station changed owners and the station manager who had been bad about pre-emptions left. When MY TV 9 pre-empts its prime-time programming from MY Network TV for the St. Jude's Hospital Infomercial or New York Yankees Baseball they always air prime-time programming at 10:35PM following the conclusion of The 10PM News. It's the local programming that doesn't get

aired, which would be TMZ at 10:35 and Excused at 11:05. (Though in my opinion not much is missed by Excused being pre-empted). KPIX5 a CBS O&O does prempt CBS Primetime and the CBS Evening News sometimes to air NFL Network Coverage of the Oakland Raiders on Thursday Night Football. and in some cases go to Disney Owned ESPN to air Monday Night Football when the 49ers are playing that night. However some of the CBS programming that is pre-empted from KPIX goes to San Francisco's other CBS O&O KBCW 44 the CW. Look when KPIX5 was owned by Group W they even pre-empt CBS Primetime for Warriors basketball. I only know of another CBS O&O that does pre-empt CBS Shows and that is KCBS 2 but thats just to air a car chase from sky9 AKA chopper 2 KPIX a CBS O&O would sometimes pre-empt CBS Primetime for Sutter-Health PR Video's. I think that Lance Russell was more involved with wrestling by the time he moved to WMC. The station manager during that time was Ron Klayman, and he got much of the blame for WMC's preemptions. He continually ignored complaints about pre-emptions from viewers and the local newspapers as well, and got worse over time as if to spite them. He left in 1993 when WMC was sold, which is also about the same time the pre-emptions ended. Like I said earlier, NBC should have pulled WMC's affiliation over their stunts. I very rarely see it done in Milwaukee or Green Bay anymore, where it used to be a regular occurrence up until 2007, when it seemed the Billy Graham Crusade specials faded out from the CBS affiliates that took them entirely. Currently though it only seems to be done on Saturday nights on WTMJ/NBC Milwaukee when an infomercial block or bad 90's TV movie filled with corn syrup schmaltz plots airs, where the only thing lost is an expendable repeat of a procedural nobody cares about (the last time a network program at least a few cared about was pre-empted was Face the Ace by them, and in that case it was a mercy pre-emption since it hit XFL levels in the Nielsens). They used to be heavy on infomercials on Saturday and would even pre-empt the Notre Dame postgame in 2009 and 2010 to cut right to a scheduled one, but they got so many complaints they had to stop (that, or the economic meltdown passed for them, because they used to air so many Hydroxytone ads I thought that rube eye cream was their only sponsor at times). Their sister station in WGBA also had the same heavy pre-emptions in the last couple of years, including daytime syndicated programming, but they seem to be done now. Green Bay's WBAY/ABC did it on Tuesday nights until last year with the first hour of ABC primetime with a local football show, but they've canceled it to air the DWTS "Recap for Dummies". Again though, at least until V aired in that slot and forced WBAY to take the show live, the football show did much more for WBAY than the awful sitcoms ABC plugged in that slot. And in Milwaukee, WITI/Fox has only pre-empted one Fox show in their history, Osbournes Reloaded (which aired in late, late night). Again, mercy pre-emption; these stations do it for reasons that seemed right for the market and so they aren't sponsored by the "huge rolls in a warehouse" carpet outlets and law firms that populate their late night schedules. Also, these days with the many modes you can catch programming outside of a network mandated timeslot (Hulu, Netflix, network site/player, YouTube, certain other questionable means), I have much more latitude for a network pre-emption than I had five years ago. I still remember the one night I had to wait for a Gilmore Girls ep to air until 10pm because of a last-second Marquette conference tourney game being scheduled; every day I'm thankful that the multiple ESPN's and Big Ten Network were created so that this doesn't happen much on broadcast TV any longer. Station's seem to due to their network pre-emptions during non-sweeps periods and they often try to schedule them during a reruns, but a lot of times network changes the schedule and schedules a

new episode when the pre-emption is scheduled. You never see pre-emptions during sweeps periods Michael's Moore's TV Nation on NBC was pre-empted in Phoenix by infomercials for a local hospital chain. I don't know if they knew about Michael Moore or the station was gonna pre-empt it anyway for infomercial since it was a low rated summer replacement show. KSHB runs infomercials at 6:30PM Saturday and right after SNL and the Sunday Night News (often delayed due to low running football games). Last winter, they pre-empted some reruns during NBC primetime for a Big 12 Basketball game that are normally seen on sister station KMCI (this game was even involving K-State, Mizzou, or KU) and last spring an hour long Gary Lezak severe weather special but that's about it. Last year, KSDK pre-empted a new episode of Community for a local grocery chain infomercial That doesn't have anything to do with pre emptions. But to do with the NFL broadcast rules. If the local team has a home game on cable then it will be also be broadcast by an OTA station, but only if the game isn't subject to a blackout. It's a nice theory that those restrictions on children's advertising are the reason why the networks got out of the Saturday morning business -- but the only problem is that it's wrong. Those restrictions were in place from the beginning of the nineties, but the chilrdren's TV business on broadcast TV remained pretty healthy for a good ten years after those restrictions were legislated in place. During those ten years, Fox drastically expanded it's children's programming schedule, and both the WB and UPN entered the business. If this particular bit of government regulation had been strangling the business, none of that would have happened. What did happen was that competition from Fox and the WB on Saturday mornings made cartoons less profitable for ABC, CBS, and NBC -- who instead chose to expand established news franchises to the weekend. And, ultimately, competition from Nick, Cartoon Network, and the Disney Channel made the business less appealing to Fox, the WB, and UPN. On top of that, a difficulty in filling local advertising slots during network children's shows made affiliates less than enthusiastic over carrying large blocks of difficult to sell kids programs. So declining ratings combined with pressure from affiliates is what encouraged the networks to get out of this business. The chilrdren's TV advertising limits appear to be (at most) a minor consideration. People - it's called the "reply" button - use it. Danke. Anyhoo - CBS O&O's were notorious for pre-empting shows like "Entertainment Tonight" in the prime access hour in the late 90's. Also KPIX would also air Sutter Hospital PR video instead of CBS Primetime on a Saturday night where theres too many 48 hours episodes that night. Getting network TV to Hawaii (and other places outside the main 48) Forgive me if this has come up before-I don't think it has in the couple of years I've been a member. I've been reading recently about the extreme lengths UK engineers went to to get TV to the Channel Islands and the Shetland Islands. Both are about 100 miles from the UK mainland, and right on the edge for either off air reception and rebroadcast or microwave links. But they did it with very selective and very hi-gain aerials and it worked- most of the time! The link to the channel islands was used until 2002 when they finally went fibre optic.

Which got me thinking- how did Hawaii go on? Much, much further. What about Guam? Obviously much, much, much further than the channel islands! From 1978 to 1980, I was stationed in Alaska. Any live programming, mainly sports, but maybe other important news events, came off satellite, but I am sure it cost a bundle in those days. Network programming went thusly for Anchorage: Ch 2 (NBC) - 3 week delay Ch 7 (PBS) - became same-day during my tour, and was not sure how it was accomplished; not sure how much delay prior to that, maybe 1 week Ch 11 (CBS) - 2 week delay Ch 13 (ABC) - 1 week delay Evening network news, Today Show & similar programs were same day but delayed for the time slot. In the mid 80s, I'd say, satellites were more common, and now all programming is same-day delay. We have a member here on r-i in Fairbanks, Alaska, who maybe can explain further; I would say that their delays were even longer, and they had less TV stations when I was stationed in Alaska--one had to pick from 2 networks (before that, TWO stations shared programming from ABC, IIRC). I believe the regular network programming was mailed to Honolulu first (after the run in the "48 states"), then sent to Alaska & then maybe Guam---or, maybe duplicated for both Guam & Alaska; I am not sure. Do we have an r-i member in Hawaii? He/she would explain better than I. For many years, maybe until the early 90s, Guam had only 1 commercial TV station, KUAM-TV, which cherry-picked from all networks. Confused yet? I am. cd The same was true in many rural areas for a while when there was only one TV station in town, they got to cherry pick from all the networks. That is what drove the popularity of cable. Not TBS and WGN (early providers via satellite), but the ablility to pull in out of market stations that would allow you to get signals from all the major networks. The first cable system was not in a big city but out on the fringes of Philadelphia in a valley so they could watch the Philadelphia stations. Sure. A similar thing happened in Ireland where they only had 1 channel until the late 70s, and only 2 until the late 90s. Cable networks grew up which used huge aerials on hilltops to bring in stations from the UK. But not even the biggest aerial would work in Alaska, Hawaii or Guam!!!!!!!! Until satellite feeds came along, national programs were recorded (originally on film, later on videotape) and shipped to Alaska, Hawaii, and Guam. "Time-value" programs (newscasts etc.) might be shipped by air; less-critical shows (dramas, comedy, etc.) might be sent by ship, resulting in pretty significant delays. Early U.S. TV stations produced a LOT more programming locally. (and aired a lot more films) Of course, they didn't operate 24/7 either. (so there wasn't nearly as much programming required) Actually, that happened with many mainland stations as well in the early days of TV. Often, a new TV station would be completed before the coaxial or microwave network feed reached their city. In

some cases they'd rebroadcast another station off-air, but in others that wasn't possible. The same shipping of recordings thing was the only option. I know of a hybrid system that existed in North Dakota. A station in the center of the state put up a receiving point as far west of Fargo (in the southeast) as they could get reliable off-air reception. They then used microwave hops to bring that signal to their facility in Bismarck. Chris: I'm pretty sure PBS was the first network to go to satellite distribution. At present, I think Guam gets everything (with the possible exception of sports) on a day-behind (for example, "60 Minutes" airs there on Monday night since it's 10 AM Monday when the broadcast airs on the U.S. East Coast at 7 PM Sunday). I know Hawaii uses the Central time version of primetime, but sports events go live; it's not unusual for a college football game airing at noon (ET) to be seen at 7 AM in Hawaii. Bermuda, one hour ahead of New York, simply goes along with the U.S. network feeds. Scott, Diane, and Brian air at 7:30 PM (Atlantic time), while primetime is 9 PM-midnight. (Local news airs at 7 PM and midnight.) Bermuda is an interesting situation. They are not even part of the US, so I wonder how they get to affiliate with the major networks (FOX still needs a station there). If it's okay w/ Bermuda, why not the Bahamas, Jamaica, Antigua, etc.? cd Well Bermuda only has a population of 65,000 people, which is rather small to make a 3 channel TV service viable unless you mostly relay someone elses programming. Although it is a British colony it is much nearer the US than the UK, so I'm not that surprised TV has developed along US network lines. According to Wiki, TV came to the island in 1958, and it's 600 miles offshore so I'm guessing they showed only pre recorded shows for a good while after opening. Besides, the UK is four hours ahead of Bermuda, which would make for some awkward airtimes for British programs. No more so than US East-coast generated programs airing in Hawaii According to the Wikipedia before Bermuda had its own TV stations they could receive TV from the American Kindley Air Force Base, so maybe they had some kind of arrangement for network programs with that I spent my junior year of high school in Honolulu....1964-65 TV season. The network stations (2 NBC, 4 ABC, 9 CBS) generally carried the prime time lineups on a oneweek delay. Schedule was the same as Central time (shows aired an hour earlier local time than their usual Eastern and Pacific time slots) There were two exceptions that I recall. KGMB-TV, the CBS affilliate on Channel 9, carried a tape of the evening's CBS news anchored by Walter Cronkite just before signoff. Meaning it generally came on at around 12:30 or 1am.

The other exception was NFL and college football tapes which aired a day after the games were played. College games on Sundays....NFL (basically 49ers) Monday late afternoons. I believe World series games were also broadcast one day after being played. I think Johnny Carson might have also been a one-day delay, but I'm not sure. One quirk that went on in those days was that practically nothing came on at its scheduled/announced time. Programs typically came on anywhere from five to fifteen minutes later than scheduled. This varied on a day by day and channel by channel basis. "Bonanza at 8pm Sunday night on channel 2? Well....maybe 8:05, maybe 8:10 or whenever we get around to it". Of course if Channel 9 was further behind with the CBS schedule than channel 2 was with NBC, hanging around for the end of Ed Sullivan's program meant you could miss the first few minutes of Bonanza! Of course, the next Sunday, things might be just the opposite! Nobody seemed to mind...or care. The stations or the viewers. Nowadays I believe stations record then play back the satellite feeds. (KGMB couldn't do CBS HD primetime shows until they got the proper equipment to record and play back in HD.) I believe the Phoenix stations (there's no satellite feed for their awkward situation) do the same thing. Yes I hadn't realised that there was a US military presence in Bermuda from 1940 until fairly recently. That, coupled with the fact that the local currency is pegged 1:1 with the US dollar would further explain why they would look west rather than east for their TV. Plus the US network feeds are there and ready and waiting to be used. Any feeds from the UK would need to be set up, paid for, possibly time delayed. And since 2 of the main British channels don't take commercials, there would be little possiblity for recouping the cost with adverts. Though they could've imposed a license fee to fund the non-commercial channels. But as mentioned, because of logistical purposes, they opted to get their TV from the states instead. As for Hawaii, at one point during the 70's, I remember watching the network evening newscasts first thing in the morning and the morning newscasts later on in the day. My understanding is that they were flying taped newscasts on the last evening flight out of LA. Then, at some point, CBS had a special Hawaii edition of the CBS Evening News via satellite (updated similar to the West Coast version with Terry Drinkwater in LA). I think there may have also been an audience appeal factor. My personal observation is that British TV sometimes has flashes of brilliance (news coverage is superb), but much of what's on is pretty boring. My daughter has lived in London for ten years and bought a slingbox just so she doesn't have to be captive to the local British fare. I recall reading at some point Johnny Carson aired same day - as soon as taping was done in Burbank (6pm-ish?), a copy headed to LAX to get to Honolulu on the next plane out - thus if the plane were delayed a few minutes, it might not air until 10:40... I'm pretty sure films and tapes were "bicycled" around Hawaii, Guam and Alaska (just like syndicated programs were shipped around the US before tape and digital storage were as common as they are now). Jim LOCAL CABLE/DIRECTV/DISH CHANNEL CARRIAGE .

I know this is probably not the best fit topicwise for this section: If one were to have a startup LPTV station which they would hope to have carried citywide in a market and available on local cable systems and locally on Directv/Dish, FIOS, AT&T, 1) Who would one talk to at these companies about carriage, 2) What kind of incentive would have to be given for these media outlets to carry a LPTV station on startup? It would be very rare. Dish Network carries LPTV station WNBD-LD which is an NBC affiliate for Greenville/Greenwood Mississippi. WNBD-LD is also the sister station of WABG (ABC, FOX via 62 subchannel) which is in a Bottom 25 market. I have NO LPTV stations on my DirecTV. I don't even have a full slate of full-power local stations. (WINP, the local ION affiliate, was dropped back when their programming was all Home Shopping). And of the other locals, only PBS and the Big 3 are in high def. None of their digital side channels are carried. My brother has Dish Network and they likewise do not carry LPTV's. The major LPTV here, WBGN, was dropped by Comcast cable a couple of years ago (they had apparently been paying to lease a channel from Comcast but did not keep up on the payments). This allegedly came close to putting them out of business. They are carried on Verizon FIOS. Good luck with your efforts to start an LPTV station! Question would be better asked in a local forum because the answer varies. My city is served by two smaller cable companies, and both have a local manager who would be the contact point. If your area is served by Time Warner, Comcast, or another of the giants, your mileage will probably vary. Actually when the NBC affiliate tried their hand at Latino programming and ultimately failed, they had carriage of the LPTV station on the local cable TV companies...... Once the Latino programming ended the systems dropped the channel. My understanding is that, in most cases, if a TV station can be received with a reasonable signal at the cable company's headend antenna, it has to be included on the 'basic/lifeline' channel lineup. Satellite coverage seems to be limited to network outlets for the most part. Any others want to comment. Low power stations are execepted from must-carry; and I do not believe that there's any requirement to carry multiple subchannels either. That's one reason why I wouldn't consider Direct TV or Dish here in the Chicago area: MeToo (available OTA via a LP and subchannel signal) is not offered on either one. But our Comcast system offers most subchannels in this market. For now, the FCC does not require OTA digital subchannels for Must-Carry. As a result, satellite refuses to offer them. Satellite doesn't like offering some low power stations either. I remember DirecTV didn't even want to carry what was then WWME-CA (before they even added their digital companion channel) to their service, & refused to add MeToo, U Too, & This TV to their Chicago service package. Because of this, WTTW hasn't been able to get WTTW Prime on satellite either. I hear that DirecTV & Dish Network will only consider carrying local subchannels, if one of the top 4 networks (ABC, NBC, CBS, & Fox) are on a subchannel (usually a case in small markets with few TV stations). As for cable, they too aren't required to carry low power TV stations, or carry subchanels from any TV stations. Most cable systems are however adding the subchannels, but they're putting them in the digital tier. The LPTV stations might either be in the basic package, or strictly in the digital tier

(check your local cable company if your LPTV station is available, & which part of the service). Comcast is the only service in my immediate area, because AT&T Uverse is not available in all neighborhoods of Gary, IN. Uverse in my area does not have the local subchannels, but not sure if they have the LPTV stations. Full-Power Stations That've Always Been With the Same Network (O&O or Affiliate) Similar to gregg75's thread about independent stations that have always been indies, what are some stations that have been with the same network (be they O&Os or affiliates) from the day they signed on? Again, not counting LPTV's, Class A's, Translators, or Godcasters. Here in L.A., the only one that comes to mind is ABC O&O KABC channel 7 (although it originally signed on as KECA, which stood for K Earle C. Anthony, a Los Angeles broadcasting pioneer). Sort of a subset of this thread from a few years back: Of course, there are plenty of "never-changed" stations that didn't fit under that thread. Most of the ABC stations in my neck of the woods have been with the network from day one - WKBW Buffalo (1958), WOKR/WHAM-TV Rochester (1962), WBJA/WMGC/WIVT Binghamton - even as other stations in their markets have shifted. WBEN-TV/WIVB Buffalo has been with CBS since 1948, and WNBF-TV/WBNG Binghamton since 1949. WVIT-TV (NBC) channel 30 of New Britain/Hartford has always been a primary NBC affiliate, since their 1953 sign on. They are presently and NBC O&O. It's not as uncommon as one might think, especially in smaller cities: Phoenix/Mesa AZ KTYL/KVAR/KTAR/KPNX 12 - signed on as NBC in 1953. KTVW 33 - SIN/Univision 1979 Tucson AZ KVOA 4 - NBC 1953 KDWI/KGUN 9 - ABC 1956 KOPO/KOLD 13 - CBS 1953 Yuma AZ/El Centro CA KVYE 7 - Univision 1996 KAJB 54 - Telefutura 2000 Flagstaff AZ KOAI/KNAZ 2 - NBC 1970 Scranton/Wilkes-Barre PA WARM/WNEP 16 - ABC 1954 (Originally 2 affiliates of ABC: WARM 16 Scranton merged with WILK 34 Wilkes-Barre in 1956 to form WNEP. WILK had been an ABC affiliate since signing on in 1953.) WGBI/WDAU/WYOU 22 - CBS 1953

WBRE - NBC 1953 Bismarck ND KFYR 5 - NBC 1953 KBMB/KXMB 12 - CBS 1955 KBMY 17 - ABC 1985 KNDX 26 - Fox 1999 Dickinson ND KDIX/KNDX/KXMA 2 - CBS 1956 KQCD 7 - NBC 1980 Minot ND KMOT 10 - NBC 1958 KCJB/KXMC 13 - CBS 1953 KMCY 14 - ABC 1985 KXND 24 - Fox 1999 Williston ND KUMV 8 - NBC 1957 KXMD 11 - CBS 1969 Fargo/Valley City ND KXJB 4 - CBS 1954 Jamestown ND KJRR 7 - Fox 1988 Glendive MT KXGN 5 - CBS 1957 In North Carolina, the following stations have maintained their primary affiliations with the same network since sign-on: WFMY, Greensboro (CBS-1949) WBTV, Charlotte (CBS-1949) WXII, Winston-Salem (NBC-1953)- originally WSJS WNCT, Greenville (CBS-1953) WECT, Wilmington (NBC-1954)-originally WMFD WLOS, Asheville (ABC-1954)-second-longest tenured primary ABC affiliate south of Washington, DC WITN, Washington (NBC-1955) WCTI, New Bern (ABC-1963)-originally WNBE WWAY, Wilmington (ABC-1964) WFXI, Morehead City (FOX-1989) Let me add a few... WBAP/KXAS 5 Fort Worth/Dallas (NBC since 1948)

KBTV/WFAA 8 Dallas/Fort Worth (ABC since 1949) KNBH/KRCA/KNBC 4 Los Angeles (NBC since 1949) KSD(K) 5 St. Louis (NBC since 1947; the first NBC affiliate west of the Mississippi) KWK/KMOX/KMOV 4 St. Louis (CBS since 1954) WCCO 4 Minneapolis/St. Paul (CBS since 1949) WDSU 6 New Orleans (NBC since 1948) WLBW/WPST/WPLG 10 Miami/Fort Lauderdale (ABC since 1957) I'll leave some for others to add... Wausau/Rhinelander WI WSAU/WSAW 7 - CBS (1954) WAOW 9 - ABC (1965) WAEO/WJFW 12 - NBC (1966) WYOW 34 - ABC (1995) WFXS 55 - Fox (1998) Milwaukee WI WTMJ 4 - NBC (1947) Chicago IL WNBQ/WMAQ 5 - NBC (1949) WENR/WBKB/WLS 7 - ABC (1948) South Bend IN WNDU 46/16 - NBC (1955) WSBT 34/22 - CBS (1952) Terre Haute IN WTWO 2 - NBC (1965) WTHI 10 - CBS (1954) Cedar Rapids/Waterloo IA WMT/KGAN 2 - CBS (1953) KWWL 7 - NBC (1953) KCRI/KCRG 9 - ABC (1953) Little Rock/Pine Bluff (historic channel numbers used) KTHV 11 (CBS) 1955 present KARK 4 (NBC) 1954 present Actually, KTHV was the third CBS affiliate for Little Rock/Pine Bluff. The first was the defunct KRTV (ch 17) in 1953-54, KATV (ch 7) then in Pine Bluff signed on as a CBS affiliate but did not do live network programming until it aquired KRTV's assets (and shut down the UHF station). ABC has always been with KATV in the LR market but it was a secondary affiliation to CBS until KTHV went on the air in 1955. Fort Myers/Naples market: WINK - CBS WBBH - NBC WEVU/WZVN - ABC WFTX* - FOX *Originally independent at launch; became FOX affiliate approx. one year later.

WGAL Channel 8, Lancaster PA has been an NBC affiliate since its March 1949 sign-on. Like many early stations, WGAL ran programming from all four of the networks of the day, NBC and CBS programming cherry-picked and aired live, and ABC and Dumont programming on film. WGAL continued airing programs from all the networks until the fall of 1962, when it became an exclusively NBC affiliate. They chose NBC over CBS because of their investment in color equipment, and at the time NBC was the only network broadcasting anything in color. Even when they were airing all three nets, they were airing the Today and Tonight shows and NBC news, but they aired a lot of CBS prime time shows and prevented the other CBS affiliate (a UHF station) from getting them. All the Houston stations have been with their respective networks since day one. Let me add a few... WBAP/KXAS 5 Fort Worth/Dallas (NBC since 1948) KBTV/WFAA 8 Dallas/Fort Worth (ABC since 1949) Actually, WFAA/KBTV was originally a Dumont Affiliate. It was Dumont until 1951. Then it switched to ABC/NBC Timeshare, before finally settling on ABC in 1957. KXAS/WBAP was originally ABC, with shared NBC, just like WFAA-AM and WBAP-AM were shared, this lasted until 1957. So ABC and NBC Switched Hourly from 5 to 8 and vise-versa, just like their AM sisters, for quite some time. (1951-1957) In Maine: Bangor's WVII has been on since 1965 with ABC (was WEMT until 1976) The Big 3 affiliates in Portland have never changed: WGME (CBS, 1954) WCSH (1953), WMTW (ABC, 1954) and WAGM in Presque Isle has always been a primary CBS affiliate (although they've cherry picked from everybody since they're the only station in the market) since their 1956 sign on. WTAP-TV, Parkersburg, WV had been an NBC affiliate ever since its 1953 sign-on, even though it was with all three networks(NBC, CBS, and ABC) in its early days. In Memphis WMC 5 has been with NBC since its beginning in 1948, although they also carried shows from CBS, ABC, and Dumont in its early years. WREG has been with CBS since its beginning in 1956. WNBK/KYW/WKYC Cleveland-NBC since 1948 despite several changes of ownership.. The NBC affiliates in the Kentucky edition of TV Guide: WAVE, WLWT, and WLEX (even though WLEX carried ABC and CBS shows in the '50s and '60s, and WAVE carried some ABC shows before the arrival of WLKY, NBC has always been their primary network); likewise WFIE Evansville, IN. Roanoke/Lynchburg is the only market in Virginia which hasn't played musical affiliations; WSLS (1952) started as an NBC primary; WSET (1953) is ABC's oldest affiliate south of Washington (WLOS is second); WDBJ (1955) has been with CBS from the beginning. Greenville/Spartanburg/Asheville has also been stable: WFBC/WYFF (NBC since 1953), WSPA (CBS since 1956), WLOS (ABC primary, then

ABC solely, since 1954). Columbia, SC, likewise: WIS (NBC since 1953), WNOK/WLTX (CBS since 1953), WOLO (ABC since 1961). Charleston: WCSC (CBS since 1953). Florence: WBTW (CBS primary since 1954, although a few NBC shows in the '50s and several ABC ones as late as the late '70s). WPDE has been ABC since sign-on in 1981; WMBF, NBC since sign-on in 2008. Bristol/Kingsport/Johnson City: WCYB (NBC), WJHL (CBS), WKPT (ABC), although WCYB and WJHL both carried some ABC shows until WKPT signed on in 1969. Nashville: WSM/WSMV (NBC since 1950), WLAC/WTVF (CBS since 1954). WSIX/WNGE/WKRN started with CBS in 1953 but switched to ABC because of WLAC's association with CBS dating back to radio days. Washington, DC: WRC (NBC o&o from its beginnings in the '40s); WTOP/ WDVM/WUSA (CBS since 1949). WMAL/WJLA carried mainly CBS in '48 and switched to ABC in '49. WTTG is tricky; for most of its life it was independent (Metromedia), but if you consider DuMont and Fox to be a straight-line connection, it might count, technically. Charleston/Huntington: WSAZ (NBC since 1949) Orlando: WDBO/WCPX/WKMG (CBS primary, then CBS solely, since 1953); WESH picked up NBC in either '56 or '57, I'm not sure which; WLOF/WFTV (ABC since 1958). In Tampa, WFLA has been with NBC since 1955. What about WSYR-TV 9 (Syracuse).... they have been with ABC since they went on the air as WNYS in 1962? In fact I think all of the big 4 affiliates in Syracuse (WSTM, WTVH, WSYR-TV and WSYT) have not switched affiliations. Scott what about WMUR-Manchester, NH? They have only been with ABC but I am not sure they were an ABC affiliate when the signed on or if that came later. I didn't repeat WNYS/WIXT/WSYR-TV in this thread, because it was mentioned in the original thread I linked to - as you note, Syracuse is one of the markets from that thread, in which nobody's ever flipped affiliations. Still in Central New York, WKTV has always been a primary NBC since 1949 (but did cherry pick in the old days) & WUTR has been ABC since sign on in 1970. WFXV has been FOX since day one (of FOX). According to the history on WSET's website, the station, then WLVA-TV, was a CBS affiliate from its 1953 sign-on until 1954 when it switched to ABC. This predates CBS affiliate WDBJ's sign-on by a year, though, so not an affiliation swap. Roanoke also had a separate ABC affiliate on UHF, WRFT-TV 27, from 1966-1974--the second of three attempts to operate a successful station on UHF 27 in the market, only the third of which proved ultimately successful (today's Fox affiliate WFXR). A couple of smaller Texas markets: Abilene - KRBC has been an NBC affiliate since its sign-on in 1954. KTXS has been an ABC affiliate since it signed on shortly after (they were split affiliation with ABC and CBS until 1979, when...) And KTAB has been with CBS since its sign on in 1979.

In Wichita Falls/Lawton, all three network affiliates (KAUZ/6 - CBS, KFDX/3 - NBC, KSWO/7 - ABC) have been with their affiliates since they signed on. For South Bend, IN, WSBT has always been a CBS station, though they were NBC & ABC secondary affiliates for about 3 years after they signed on in 1952. They were also one of a few CBS stations that was color in the 1950's. WNDU has always been NBC since their sign on in 1955. Those are the only 2 that have stayed with the same network since their sign on. In Montgomery, Alabama, Channel 12 (WSFA) has been with NBC from the beginning of that local channel. Similar to Nashville, where WSIX (now WKRN) was a CBS affiliate in 1953-54; WLAC (now WTVF), as I pointed out, signed on in 1954 and took the CBS affiliation, CBS having a long relationship with WLAC radio. I think, though, that WSET's website points out that it is the oldest ABC affiliate south of Washington; coincidentally, the two oldest ABC affiliates south of Washington are both on virtual channel 13; likewise, it's something of a coincidence that the two oldest CBS affiliates south of Washington are in North Carolina: WBTV Charlotte and WFMY Greensboro, both since 1949 (Atlanta would lay claim to both except for the fact that there were two network swaps there: WXIA would be the oldest ABC affiliate south of Washington if it were still with the Alphabet network, having signed on in 1951; WAGA was the oldest CBS affiliate south of Washington (March 1949 sign-on; WBTV's wasn't until July) until the change to Fox in 1994). One I didn't see in this thread (or the other linked thread from last year... though I may have missed it): WCAX (ex-WVMT) Burlington, VT, which as far as I know has been a CBS primary since day one in 1954. They did have a brief secondary Fox affiliation in the mid '90s IIRC. I should point out that in TV Guides that I have seen from the 70s, WECT had some CBS programming, particularly afternoon soaps, and WWAY was listed as an affiliate of NBC as well. This was a little unusual in that this was a market that didn't get a CBS affiliate until 1984 (it's now Fox and there is no full-power CBS). But I guess it's no different from the affiliates in other markets that stayed mainly with one network even though someone had to provide the other network or networks. Even though it started as CBS in 1953, WSET-TV easily still claims oldest ABC affiliate south of Washington, as they switched the very next year. After the dust settled from the DTV Big Switch, WSET and Asheville's WLOS are both again on RF 13, though I don't think they did so on 6/12/09. With the Wilmington market having only two commercial TV stations from 1964-84 (and, until 1972, two stations, period), they probably had secondary affiliation agreements with CBS. This was common practice in markets such as Wilmington, Florence, and Raleigh-Durham before they had a sufficient number of stations sign-on to accomodate the then-three national networks. The NBC-WWAY listing is interesting though, as WECT was (and is) the primary NBC affiliate. Youngstown, OH has all of its full-power stations with their original network: WFMJ/21 (NBC) WKBN/27 (CBS) WYTV/33 (ABC) WFMJ dates back to 1953 (started its first year on Channel 73). WKBN goes back to 1953 as well (first station in the market), and WYTV also dates back to 1953 (the first few years as WKST/45 New Castle PA). All three started with their current networks.

Speaking of 45, it later was reallocated to Alliance OH, and is now the Youngstown market's PBS affiliate (WNEO, simulcaster of WEAO/49 Akron "Western Reserve PBS"). And it started with PBS, too. WYFX-LD/19 is not full-power, of course, but has been a Fox affiliate since starting as analog WYFX-LP/62. Portland, Oregon as well: KOIN 6 (CBS), since 1953 KGW 8 (NBC), since 1956 San Francisco: KPIX 5 (CBS), since 1949 KGO 7 (ABC), since 1949 Seattle: KOMO 4 (ABC), since 1959, was with NBC (1953-59) KING 5 (NBC), also since 1959, was with ABC/NBC, I think (1948-53) KIRO 7(CBS), since 1958, except 1995-97, when they were with UPN Sacramento: KCRA 3 (NBC), since 1955 Las Vegas, NV KSNV 3 (NBC), since 1955 KLAS 8 (CBS), since 1953 KTNV 13 (ABC), since 1959 Phoenix: KPNX 12 (NBC), since 1953 That's all I can think of. Time-change weekend I'm guessing that the local TV stations will fill the extra hour with infomercials, but if you find anything interesting airing during that extra hour, please post it here. (I'm further guessing that the spring time changes are fairly easy, in that they just drop an hour of filler programming.) No extra hour here in Phoenix. Grin When Arizona network affiliates stop using the West Coast feed and go with the Mountain feed. Grin Or Hawaii...or Puerto Rico...or Saskatchewan! As for Arizona, the Navajo Indian Reservation of Arizona DOES observe Daylight Time. I think daylight time should be year round and nationwide, or not have it at all. Russia is experimenting with year round Daylight Savings Time this year. But personally, I'd rather just have nationwide Standard Time all year long. I (and a lot of you) lived through DST in the winter of 1974; I was a freshman at the University of

Georgia at the time and was going to my first class (9 AM) in the dark. I'd take year-round standard time (which we had in North Carolina until 1967, and you couldn't tell that much difference in sunrise or sunset) over year-round daylight time any day. You and I must be about the same age, as I was also a college freshman when winter DST was tried in 1974. I had classes every day at 8am, and it was quite bizarre walking to them in complete darkness. That is why we haven't seen year-round DST yet, as in many parts of the country the sun wouldn't rise until after 9am. Complaints about late sunrises is what forced the idea to be scrapped after only one winter. I can easily see why Arizona stays on standard time: when it gets to 115+ degrees in the daytime, you want that sun to go down ASAP. Does anyone besides NBC have a mountain time feed? I know for years NBC was the only one, and for a couple of years WTHR in Indianapolis took it during the summer so they could stay on an 8-11pm prime time year round (eventually all of the stations installed delay equipment or did manual delay like we did at WLFI-TV in Indianapolis...until Indiana finally went on DST). How does cable work in AZ...bounce back and forth between separate feeds or just watch for shows an hour earlier or later than before? No extra hour here in Phoenix. Grin In effect, there is, at least on Sunday mornings on Fox 10. In September and October, KSAZ-TV goes straight from Fox News Sunday to Fox NFL Sunday. Now, there's an hour of infomercials in between. Roll Eyes Nope. The daytime and evening schedules are the same year-round, generally the same clock time as Central. If the network has a Mountain feed, it can be used during standard time. The only left coast feed on OTA during DST are updates to the morning yak shows (Today, et al) and the evening newscasts. Time Change will doesn't mean anything for Local Stations because they don't lose or add any programming so if you get News on at 10pm it will still be on at 10pm but not if the station changes it. I thought year round DST was the best thing ever. It was "technically" proven that less energy was used when it was still dark in the mornings vs afternoon, based on typical lighting habits. But the only places it made a big difference (for good or bad, as perceived by each person's preferences), was near time zone divisions and places where time zones are way too wide. This provides the residents the choice of an "unacceptably" dark morning or evening, as perceived. I was fine with going to school while it was still dark and leave as much daylight as possible for after school. But it did worry too many parents. Seems it started gettting light while I was on the bus to school in 74...which would mean that 30 miles east, the kids got to school in the eastern time zone and it must have been dark for most of the first hour of school. For a real mind-twist put this into your search engine: "What time is it in Indiana?" There's an exhaustive, mind boggling description of Indiana time. Arizona would have just as good a story, I bet.

GMC/The Today Show/son are Taped because would be starting at 8am on East Coast/QVC Morning Show and so on are on at the right time east Coast time but Central Time TSV 11PM the day before. i am in indiana and would rather not have DST but understand that as long as it is used in all the states it is in it is needed for economic reasons. there was a study comparing energy use in indiana comparing pre-DST and post -DST usage.indiana is the only state it can be done studying current energy using was found that more energy was used in indiana since DST was makes me wonder if there is more energy used in other states as well. if no states had DST all 52 states would know what time it was year round in other states including arizona. just a thought consitering we may as a nation be using more energy with DST instead of saving energy. During the year round DST experiment in 1974 it was indeed dark until 9am. My school system started the day a half hour later. Not wanting to reset all the bells we had our own time zone. We went to school at 9am EDT but 8:30am "school time" Huh Have no idea what you are talking about. Explain please. As for (the original two hours of) Today, it's only live on the east coast, 7-9 AM ET. It's then played back in order an hour later for CT, two hours later for MT, and three hours later for PT. Additionally, the top of the 7 AM hour is often updated for the left coast feed. The reason why many people hate DST is because the time zones are wrong. If you look at the original maps, Detroit is in Central Time, and so is Indiana. Detroit automakers wanted to be in sync with New York City, so they petitioned to move into Eastern Time. Indiana did a similar thing. This means both Indiana and Michigan are an hour ahead of where they should be. So places like Detroit are in reality on DST year round. When you add DST to Indiana and Michigan and other places that are "incorrect" they move two hours ahead of sun time I read a book on the history of DST and it was interesting how even Chicago wanted to move into Eastern Time. If you look at historical maps, you can see the time zone boundaries slowly creeping west I see it as New England, VT, NH, Maine, Mass, RI, and Connecticut not wanting to be an hour ahead of NYC. If the divisions fell more within allowable (smaller) variations in longitude, there wouldn't be such disparities in sun time. I'd like to see an adjustment of zones to more natural divisions, instead of the current politically orchestrated zones.

This would run the division of eastern/central at the Mississippi River and NYC would complain about daylight savings "putting too much light in the morning hours".

New England would have to make a huge mental adjustment. Politically I think there are too many people on the east coast to reuqire them to suddenly accept the ridiculous overbreadth of the Eastern time zone as somehow "wrong", no matter how distorted it has become. In the Eastern Time Zone, only the area from Columbus, OH west to the IN/IL border is "wrong" (that is, west of where 82/30 W runs, and where Central time should begin). Unless you possibly count a tiny area where ME juts east, all of New England is west of 67/30 W and does lie in the Eastern zone. I remember going to school in the dark in 1974. I like having more sunlight in the afternoon in October, though, but it sure comes at a cost in the morning. Now I'll end up driving home when it's dark a lot. I could make adjustments, but I tend to forget. But libraries open at a set time, and Mike Huckabee airs at a set time. I read somewhere recently that the lawmakers in Maine wanted to relocate to Atlantic Time, just so they could be in tune with the Maritimes; however, there was a catch -- they won't observe DST if they switch time zones, resulting in being more in tune with Puerto Rico, which is also in Atlantic Standard Time year-round. Summarily, the idea was discarded. It certainly does...that tilt is the reason we have less winter sunlight here in Rochester than they do in Miami (and hence why DST matters much more up here than it does down there)...and why there will soon be no daylight at all up in the Arctic for a few months. Time zone boundaries are even screwier in Canada. The Maritime provinces are on Atlantic time, yet the Gaspe peninsula of Quebec, which extends east of most of the Maritimes, is on Eastern time. And then theres Newfoundland, which is a half-hour ahead of Atlantic time. And the Canadian TV networks have a separate feed for each of the time zones except for Newfoundland. At one time wasn't the US considering double daylight time, which would push the clock ahead a second hour in the Summer? TO me that would be even worse. One thing that seems ridiculous to me is how the time zone lines will split some states, including Tennessee where I live. It looks like it would make more sense to follow state lines as much as possible. I wonder how Maine's border with New Brunswick would be if it were just another state line? (It's presently the Eastern/Atlantic time line.) I just wish Obama would ask congress to revert back to the original DST from 1st Sun Apr-Last Sun Oct like it was from 1987-2006 because this new extension really screws up my sleeping habits as I'm fooling myself into believing it's 11:00 PM when it's only 10 PM, I really think the Energy Act of 2005 provision to extend DST sucks bad and I am hoping that we revert back to the 1987-2006 version. Thanks a lot Bush for causing this DST Extension. One thing that seems ridiculous to me is how the time zone lines will split some states, including Tennessee where I live. It looks like it would make more sense to follow state lines as much as possible. I might agree with you, except that we are an east-west oriented state. Most states that are

oriented north-south (with the exception of Indiana, of course) are all within one time zone. (At one time Morgan County here in Tennessee was split over central/eastern time. At some point they decided to go all on eastern time.) At least here in Tennessee, our time zone boundaries fall along grand division lines, with east Tennessee on eastern time, and middle and west Tennessee on central time. The reason why many people hate DST is because the time zones are wrong. If you look at the original maps, Detroit is in Central Time, and so is Indiana. Detroit automakers wanted to be in sync with New York City, so they petitioned to move into Eastern Time. Indiana did a similar thing. This means both Indiana and Michigan are an hour ahead of where they should be. So places like Detroit are in reality on DST year round. When you add DST to Indiana and Michigan and other places that are "incorrect" they move two hours ahead of sun time I did not know that about Detroit, but it seems to me that most north-south interstate corridors (the ones having odd numbers) are entirely within one time zone. For instance, interstate 75, which passes through Detroit, is entirely on eastern time. I-65, which passes through Nashville, is an exception, in that it is partially on central time, and partly on eastern time. I just wish Obama would ask congress to revert back to the original DST from 1st Sun Apr-Last Sun Oct like it was from 1987-2006... Or would you go for the last Sunday in March to the last Sunday in October? At least then the U.S. and Canada would be in synch with Europe. International airlines would love not having these "stray weeks" at the beginning and end of DST. BTW, there were several other "original DST" dates going back in years--for example, up to the mid-1950s the common dates were last Sunday in April to the last Sunday in September. Maybe DST really needs to be late March-late September, as that six month period closely matches the spring and summer seasons. Of course, we'll get that right after we get MI, IN, western OH, etc., moved to Central time! Cheesy i think as a nation we should drop daylight saving time.let it be the same time year round for all of the states without having to change the clocks . daylight saving time is supposidly for energy savings.but indiana has started to use more energy after restarting DST .so the question is would other states use less energy if there was no DST in the united states? how old were the last nationwide studies on energy usage involving DST use?wouldn`t they be outdated? I'd rather keep Halloween on daylight time. Actually, I would rather stay on daylight time all year. That is exactly the argument that got DST pushed into November. The original just pushed the date back in March, then the argument came that Halloween would be better off in DST, so they added a week to the other end as well I seem to recall a compromise which took Halloween week out of DST the last time they revised time changes, then this most recent change (2007) finally put Halloween on DST. Still wonder about that second week of March thing for the spring time change. Texas/New Mexico/LS/Mobile,Alabama,Florida,Arizona,Southern California,Mexico,Hawaii and so on Southern Time meaning Midnight starts the day. East Coast One Hour behind. Central area's Minnesota to Ohio 2 hours behind MO/ARK/OK/KS/Iowa/Nebraska 3 hours behind Colorado/Wyoming/North and South Dakota/Nevada 4 hours behind and rest of California/Oregon/Washington 5 hours Behind. States like Florida that don't get Snow don't lose an hour.

I still think Indiana should be on central time in its entirety, meaning Central Standard Time now and then Central Daylight Time from March to November, just like Chicago. My only question about that would be for somebody crossing from Indiana north into Michigan, since southern and even southwest lower Michigan are on eastern time. Another argument? The local sunrise and sunset time for Indianapolis. Compared to my home city of New Britain, CT (outside of Hartford), their rise and set times for November 9th are 7:22 AM and 5:35 PM , compared to 6:32 AM and 4:37 PM here. Another issue is their longitude west of Greenwich. Both Indianapolis and Nashville are at or slightly past 86 degrees west longitude. Nashville is in the Central Time Zone. Why isn't Indianapolis? Huh This actually happened for one year - I think it was 1974. Due to the energy crisis (long lines of cars at gas stations, etc.), President Nixon retained DST for the entire winter as an energy saving measure. The rationale was that people would use less heating oil in their homes if sunset was an hour later. The problem was, by the time the days were shortest (December, January), sunrise didn't happen until after 8:00 AM. And that was where I lived in the San Francisco Bay Area. Sunrise had to have been even later in more northern cities like New York, Chicago, Boston, Seattle, etc. I was a new college student at the time, and definitely NOT a morning person, so it was difficult to get myself out of bed and to early classes. That may have been why Indiana did not observe DST for the longest time, save for a county or two near Louisville. It's my understanding that Alabama (also along the same longitudinal line) wants to go to eastern time, but I have not heard much about that lately. If Indiana were all on central time, that would put nearly all of I-65 in central time, except for the areas of Kentucky near Louisville. I was about fourth or fifth grade about that time, and while I remember year-round DST, I don't remember much else about it. With me, time changes get harder on me as I get older. I would like to be on eastern time all year, but not observe DST. Of course, that would put January sunrise at about 8:00 a.m. here as well. I was 5 that winter, so I had to have been in kindergarten in '74. I was living in Massachusetts right outside of Boston at the time and I remember nothing about not changing the clocks back to EST. I do know that that extra week of daylight savings now makes it look like nighttime at 7am here in PA just West of Philly. I DO remember long gas lines and gas stations running out of gas in my hometown. That may have been why Indiana did not observe DST for the longest time, save for a county or two near Louisville. Oh, you mean those five "illegal counties" next to Cincinnati and Louisville going on EDT. Shame on them. Grin So how come the Feds never dinged them for doing the "DST nasty"? ABC Stations wth a 6:30pm Newscast KMIZ Starting tomorrow with Hoenes and Tate hosting it. KMBC does a 6pm repeat on METV. You Mean Local newscast? I know KGO-tv has a 6:30 Newscast but its part of the 1 hour newscast of ABC7 News at 6pm.

That's not two separate newscasts; it's just KGO timing the broadcast so that they can come out of a break and have the anchors re-introduce themselves and recap the top story. Stations with hourlong newscasts have done that for years, it just took someone at KGO to think it would be 'cool' to make it look like they had two different, but consecutive, newscasts. I know that the 6:30 part is really ABC7 News at 6pm but they go to the national headlines at 6:30 and Assignment 7 segments at 6:30. Likewise, WSB, which carries local news until 7 and is the only ABC affiliate in the Eastern time zone not to carry "World News" ar 6:30. KTRK Houston and (I believe) KSTP Minneapolis-St. Paul do local news from 6-7 (CT); any other station that might be doing a 6:30 local news is probably in the Pacific time zone. WSB/Atlanta has local news from 4:00pm-7:00pm. A solid 3hours of the same stories being repeated every 30 mintues. Matt Hammill is the host for WQAD HDNews8 at 6:30pm (Moline, IL) KATU, KOMO & KTNV (Las Vegas) & has newscasts from 6:00-7:00 pm everyday. Some Sunday nights WSOC-TV has one. Usually they have ABC News. WHAS-11 in Louisville air their Sunday night local news at 6:30, and World News at 6pm. Not sure why, but might have been for the sports pre-emptions back when ABC carried more sports programming. So does KCTV5 with CBS at 6;pm and Local at 6:30pm Sunday's. Also KMCI/Live Well Network repeat 11am Newscast at Noon to 1pm. I'm not sure I understand the relevance of this question. It really depends on the timezone. In the Pacific timezone, there is lots of local news at 6:30pm (either an individual newscast or a continuation of the 6pm newscast). In the Mountain and Central timezones, it is rare because 6:30pm is the half-hour right before primetime (usually reserved for Wheel of Forture, ET, TMZ, etc.). In the Eastern timezone, the national news is often on at 6:30pm. Here in Nashville, two out of the big three have news (still) on at 6:30. But the third one does indeed have Wheel on at half-past six! Grin All three now begin their afternoon/evening newscasts at 4:00 p.m. now that Oprah is gone. In Phoenix, only one station (KPHO) out of five stations with news departments has a 6:30pm newscast. Only two stations (KNXV for 30 minutes and KPNX has a fluffy news program) start news at 4pm. Before Freedom management shut it down and moved it to Kalamazoo the ABC Affiliate in Lansing used to have a 6:30pm newscast called ABC3NEWS LIVE AT 6:30 2011-12 Network Pre-emptions Up until now, WHBF-TV had never aired CBS' 'Up To The Minute'. It just started airing the late night program recently...What other regular network pre-emptions are there? Any kind, not just late night. What about daytime? Primetime? Saturday morning? And do other stations pick up the programs? WHBF is owned by Citadel Communications, which is notorious for having its stations leave the air

every night. In light of this, does any Citadel ABC affiliate begun showing "World News Now" overnights (besides WLNE in Providence, which was grandfathered in)? WFSB Channel 3 the Merideth owned CBS station in Hartford doesn't carry The Saturday Early Show. If you have rabbit ears however you can see The Saturday Early show on Channel 3.2 in Hartford, which is a simulcast of WSHM-LD from Springfield "CBS TV 3". Originally on 67 now on 21. During non-sweeps periods, affiliates with often pre-empt a random show that's scheduled to be a rerun with an infomercial or an old movie as make goods for local advertisers. Last December, KSDK in St. Louis pre-empted a new episode of Community with a local grocery store infomercial. Markets without the last hour of Today show Baltimoreons don't receive the Kathie Lee & Hoda hour of Today show. Kelly (not Live) at 10am. Instead they get Regis &

Are there other markets in the country that don't receive Kathie Lee & Hoda? And, are there other eastern markets that receive Regis & Kelly on time delay? Whdh 7 nbc has a time delay of the last hour of Today, I think. What time is the last hour normaly shown, 10am or 11am? Whdh has it at 11am. KPNX does the same thing to air Regis and Kelly, but I'm not sure of all the details. I think they delay hour 3 and don't air hour 4. KPNX Mesa airs hours one and two in pattern 7-9 AM, hour three at 9, then Reege 10-11, and finally Today's hour four at 11 AM. This is most likely one of those lifestyle shows which features nothing but paid segments that have become popular with large ownership groups over the past ten years. Every major affiliate in Phoenix (except for the FOX O&O) has one ("Better," "Arizona Midday," "Sonoran Living," "Your Life A to Z"). The markets without the 4th hour of Today can all be called the same thing....the Lucky Ones. In Austin, Regis airs at 9 on KXAN, then the 3rd and 4th hours of Today air from 10 to noon. Sister station KUSA 9 does the same thing except they air a show called Colorado & Co. @ 10:00 AM, which is a local version of NBC's Today but minus the news (Why they leave the news out is beyond me) I wish WMAQ-TV in Chicago wouldn't air the last 2 hours of Today. Since it's an NBC O&O, won't happen. 2 hours of Today was fine. Expanding it to 3 hours was pushing it, & adding a 4th hour is overkill. They air all 4 hours consecutively. WNDU in South Bend & WISE-TV in Fort Wayne, IN air the first 2 hours of Today, then show Live with Regis & Kelly at 9am ET. At 10am, they resume showing the last 2 hours of Today on an hour delay. Milwaukee's WTMJ-TV also delays the last 2 hours of Today. From 7-9am, they have the first 2 hours of Today. From 9 - 10am, they have local morning show, The Morning Blend. Then from 10am - Noon, it's the last 2 hours of Today. I can not find one within 200 miles of Chicago that doesn't show the last hour of Today (or even the last 2 hours). We all know that NBC O&O will show all 4 hours, while affiliates might not show all 4 hours, or delay part of Today. KNTV would pre-empt the Today show but only if Breaking news is going on in San Jose. Just like KNTV would Pre-empt NBC Primetime for Comcast coverage of Giants games.

Uh, 3 of the 4 Media General-owned former NBC O&Os air all 4 hours of the Today in sequence. WJAR-TV Providence is the only exception to the rule. I don't watch Today, but it serves it purpose for those whom are at home at the time or homebodies. So just because you don't like or watch it, then don't knock it. Hell, we could say that about anything on TV nowadays considering how mundane most of it has become... Maybe with the new partial Comcast ownership and all the activity at ABC, there will be some changes to the daytime at NBC. It's somewhat weak. NBC tried "Later Today" and it failed, so this expansion idea was to expand Today, as a way to keep the hour with a new show having some of the strengths of being associated with Today. But by the 4th hour, it's very different show than from the first, and I wonder if it tarnishes the brand. Maybe it should just be retitled as KLG and Hoda as that's what is essentially - although are both of them ever on vacation at the same time?, and Today has different hosts at that hour? In Philly, there is a local show 10! that used to air at 10, but had to be pushed back to 11 when Today expanded. It now goes up then against The View which is tougher slot than what it was at 10. It also doesn't permit clearance of 'Access Hollywood Live' which was renewed. I haven't seen this show. I wonder why Chicago and Philly can have AM morning shows, but the network execs are unwilling to do so for New York, and would rather just fill it with network or syndicated, even if its really bad programming. I'd think with NY being 2-3x the size of Philly, there would be more news, more stories for local programming and shows, but the network O&Os want less local programming there. Another undesirable hour is the reruns of Real Housewives on NBC stations. Is that slated to continue in the Fall? Strangely, NY isn't really considered a market with a 'local' or 'community' feel to it like the other 2. It's more a 'metropolis' than a city with an identity like Chicago and Philly thus the lack of intent by anyone to push anything of such there. In lot of ways, LA is the same way thus the lack of locality on its O&O stations as well. Here in Nashville, WSMV-channel 4 aired the first three hours of Today from 7:00 a.m. to 10:00 a.m., with the fourth hour from 11:00 to noon. Better Nashville aired from 10:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. That changed when Oprah retired. Now they air all four hours straight through from 7:00 to 11:00 a.m., with Better from 11:00 a.m. to noon. Better's "extra" airing at 1:00 p.m. is now dedicated to Oprah reruns. 1:00 p.m. used to be the main airtime of Better, with 700 Club at 10:00 a.m., until the latter moved to another channel. Uh, 3 of the 4 Media General-owned former NBC O&Os air all 4 hours of the Today in sequence. WJAR-TV Providence is the only exception to the rule. And then, there's Media General-owned NBC station [never was an O&O] WFLA in Tampa-St Pete, which bumps the Kathie Lee & Hoda hour of Today to 12 noon in favor of the infomercial-loaded Daytime at 10 am, followed by a double-run of yet another "judge" show, America's Court with Judge Ross in the 11 am hour. KUSA's sister station WXIA has "Atlanta & Co." at 11 AM (11 Alive does carry all four hours of the "Today" show) and it is one of those shows with paid segments. The Meredith-owned CBS affiliate in Atlanta, WGCL, carries "Better" at 12:30 PM (they're moving it to 12 Noon this fall), runs "Y&R" at 3, and "Let's Make A Deal" at 10 AM. I'm surprised people haven't mentioned WHDH. It currently airs Regis & Kelly at 9 am, and delays the last 2 hours of the Today Show. Come August 22, Regis & Kelly will be moving from WHDH to WCVB, the ABC affiliate in Boston, and WHDH will be doing a 9 am newscast, which I have never

heard of before. Why can't they just stop delaying the last 2 hours of the Today show. I heard someone mention WTMJ in Milwaukee, and so far, these are the only 2 NBC affiliates I know that delay the Today show for something besides Regis & Kelly. For WHDH, that will be bizarre having an hour newscast sandwiched between 2 hours of Today on each end. I wonder if NBC is fine -With affiliate airing something else at 9-10am, but must make up the 2 hours on delay, or -With the last hour not being aired. but not both, with the third hour being on delay, and the 4th hour not being aired. Otherwise, that would be the sensible thing for WHDH and WBAL and other affiliates that wanted to keep Regis. As far as 9am newscasts, I think a few CBS affiliates tried it, but they may have given up on them. Some of the Fox O&Os have 9am newscasts, but it works well as an extension from the 7-9 morning show or newscast. You forgot Greenville, SC market WYFF 4. The third hour of Today is delayed at 10am after Regis and Kelly. The fourth hour is bumped for Racheal Ray. KNTV 11 has the luxury of doing this due to the time zone difference that forces them to delay NBC primetime to 8:00 PM PACIFIC (Which is 10:00 PM Central & 11:00 PM Eastern) whereas WMAQ does not It's not likely KNTV delays NBC prime itself, rather it takes the left coast sat feed which airs prime 8-11 PM PT. I've looked at TV logs of almost every market over the last 2 months, and all of the NBC affiliates carry ALL 4 hours of the Today Show at some point during the day. In short, none is missing an hour or two, just delayed. I've forgot, Sacramento NBC affiliate KCRA-TV 3 don't clear Kathie Lee Gifford and Hoda Kotb's Today Show fourth hour. Yes, they show "Regis and Kelly" at 9am and delay the third hour at 10am just like sister station WYFF-TV 4 in Greenville/Spartanburg, SC, WYFF pre-empts KLG and Hoda for Rachael Ray. Other sister station that don't carry the 4th hour is KSBW-TV 8 in Monterey, California. Unfortunately, KCRA (Sacrametno), KSBW (Monterey), WBAL (Baltimore), and WYFF (Greenville/Spartanburg) are owned by Hearst Television. I had three chances to watch KLG and Hoda. My first chance was in June 22, 2010 during my vacation in Charleston, SC ("Today" was seen in its entirety including the 4th hour on WCBD-TV 2 in Mt. Pleasent, SC which was an ABC affiliate until 1996) and they had a "Summer Lovin'" sing-along. My second chance to see the 4th hour was this past Thursday when I picked up Augusta, Georgia's NBC station WAGT-TV 26 OTA. Nick Lachey was filling in for KLG. And my third chance was the day after when musician Ben Folds fills in KLG. The Today Show's 4th hour is more entertaining and fun. And in HD. I wonder if Regis' departure next month will create any changes in the airing of the "Today" show. I don't believe Kelly will be as entertaining as Reege is and affiliates will drop "Live". I was looking at the TV Listings for WYFF, KCRA and WBAL. They have an hour of Today airing overnight from 2:05am-3:05am. Is this the fourth hour of Today? It must just be preempted.

KSL-5 in Salt Lake is missing out on "The Playboy Club". Yep, it's the best show on TV by far, And I smell a hit. I was wondering what are they're showing on KSL at the same time the rest of America is showing "The Playboy Club". You guessed it, They're showing back to back reruns of The NBC sitcom, "30 Rock". There's nothing dirty about "The Playboy Club". No you are wrong, I am in the market, and they are airing a local program called, "We Are Utah". Local issues, local news, local whatever...(fluff, mostly, but I digress) The Playboy show can be seen on another channel in SLC. KSL is owned by the Mormon Church. I believe they have every right to edit network programming. I also believe NBC values their association with KSL, and will allow this lee-way. Again, the fact that this show can be seen in SLC on another channel makes this a moot point. For years I have wondered why NBC chooses to keep KSL-TV as an affiliate since they usually don't air network programming not up to par with The Mormon Church. It's a fair question. But KSL provides NBC with some decent ratings, (although somewhat sliding in the past year or so). Not sure how to answer your question beyond that. KSL remains a strong affiliate, with local news ratings that are competitive, though sliding in the past year. I think that KSL will need to improve on the local news ratings, and continue to the do well daytime to convince NBC/Comcast that they are a strong affiliate. I have every belief they will, as this organization is backed by strong ownership and they don't lose often. If KSL plans to continue to pull some NBC shows, like "The Playboy Club", & "SNL", They might end up becoming a Strong Independent, like KTVK in Phoenix, WJXT in Jacksonville, Fla, and even KRON-TV in San Francisco. NBC might end up looking for another station in SLC, since KSL in owned by The Mormons. KRON a strong independent? Don't make me laugh -- KRON has grown much weaker after dropping NBC and instead settling for MyNet. It also doesn't help matters that Young Broadcasting is tanking as a result of paying millions for KRON There are few "VHF" stations in Utah any more...just a couple of low-power Digitals and Daystar. Everybody else, and their translators are on UHF. Most towns/counties have translator access to the major channels, ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, PBS, BYU, and KJZZ. There is also an SDTV version of CW on the ABC mux. Playboy Club is on the KUTV/CBS mux, on channel 2-2, which primarily is a MyNet affiliate with local programming and local sports, and is also a full-power station (KMYU) in St, George. KSL pre-empted CBS programs not considered to be in line with Mormon beliefs; it was also not one of CBS's strongest affiliates. But Bill Paley understood the station's position. Perhaps NBC does as well. And if the overnights are any indication ("The Playboy Club" finished last in its timeslot with a 5.0 rating--note, the timeslot winner was "Hawaii Five-O" Smiley) KSL may soon be back carrying the network show at 9 PM (MT) on Mondays. I knew there's something fishy. I think NBC might move "The Playboy Club" over to USA; My

prognosis it would have done better on cable than OTA Television. "SouthLAnd" did much better on TNT, just after it started off shaky on NBC. "The Playboy Club" may be heading on over to FX, whose sister company, FOX Television Studios co-produces it with Alta Loma Productions, Which happens to be a subsibidary of Playboy. Maybe its a good thing KSL did miss out. "The Playboy Club" came in last in the 10PM/9PM slot. An indication that we could see this one being put in the category of new shows that are in trouble along with "Free Agents." The season premiere ratings will probably make this thread irrelevant. And KSL will have to figure out what to do with "We Are Utah". Or perhaps they already realized this was just fill. Remember when the Billy Graham Crusade used to semi-regularly pre-empt primetime fare? Maybe KSL can look at a regular series for the duration of "Playboy's" run. ...doubt that idea will get traction at Bonneville and LDS HQs. Back when Paul Crouch bought KUSW, the shortwave radio station outside Salt Lake City, and turned it into KTBN Worldwide with the audio feed of Trinity Broadcasting Network's satellite signal, there were some heated columns in the LDS-owned Deseret News and Salt Lake Tribune. TBN had a habit of allowing its televangelists to call the LDS a "cult" on the air, and old Billy Graham tapes were among the items on the schedule at the time... Stations offering the Most Subchannels At one time IIRC WCIU-26 Chicago had six subchannels (Me-TV, Me-Too, etc.)--or at least "room" for six subs. Closer to home WWTO-35 (TBN LaSalle, IL/Chicago but has better Peoria-area coverage than Chicago) has the most subchannels in downstate Illinois (main TBN plus their other subs such as Church Channel, TBN Enlace, etc.). Within the last month or so in another thread on this board I recall reading that one of the ethnic stations in LA had a whopping TEN subchannels (KXLA digital 51, virtual 44 Rancho Palos Verdes/LA). What other stations offer between 6-10 subchannels, if not more than 10, and if so what is the programming like on the main channel and their many subs? Atlanta has 2 low power sister stations (WANN 32, WTBS 26) which have great signals for LP as each covers about 75% or more of the metro population. They have about 10 sub channels and 8 radio signals. You'll find pretty much the same channels on both but on different channels. One or two are found only on WTBS. THIS TV is their only major channel. TUFF TV and UNTAMED SPORTS are also there along with 3 Spanish subs, a French news channel, another local movie channel and a local OLDIE GOLDIE channel. A sales channel is on one sub also. A few years ago when OPB were in the process of moving all its subchannels about, there was a point when they had 7 subchannels due to a fluke in their PSIP track: 10-01 through 10-05 (the then-standard TV mux plus an "experimental" KOPB-FM simulcast) then 10-07 and 10-08. 10-07 and -08's payloads were really 10-01 and -02, respectively. (But I don't think there's ever been anyone in this area actually carrying 6+ subchannel *streams* proper.) The most KC has is 2 so far with KCPT 2 and maybe MKSMOTV with 2 and others just have one.

Metro Weather Has none. Metro Sports has Metro Sports 2. KTWU also gets MZ Worldview. CFNEWS13 has a Couple so does some stations in Orlando,FL,Springfield,MO or better yet closer to MO/AK boarder and Whichtia,KS Metro Sports might be added to AT@T U-Verse and Yes Network,Sun Sports are available on AT@T Verse,S. Dish and so on. If you're referring to the availablity comment I have made, for all practicalities, AT&T and Dish Network (and their equivalents) are the same as cable. Tim mentioned KXLA here in Los Angeles...their sister stations KJLA and KVMD (owned by the same family, but under separate licensees) also each offer at least eight or nine subchannels, including a couple simulcast from the other's set of digital subs. Like KXLA, the KJLA and KVMD sets of channels are all foreign language: Spanish, Chinese, Korean, Japanese, and Vietnamese, just an example. KSCI, another mutli-ethnic station, has nine digital subchannels as well. As far as primary English-language stations, each of the local PBS stations offer about three diginets; KOCE has the OC Channel (jointly-programmed between the station and Chapman University), Daystar, and PBS World, KCET has a kids/family channel, V-me, and MHz Worldview, and KLCS has a locally-programmed PBS Kids channel, Create, and a channel offering instructional programming. Besides that and the usual suspects (MeTV, Antenna, This, Nonstop, and Live Well), there isn't much more variety among English-language offerings locally. I can't think of anyone outside of California with all that many HD subchannels. Pittsburgh market has four stations with four subs apiece: WTAE-4.1 main ABC service from Elizabeth Township tower (RF 51). WTAE-4.2 ThisTV Pittsburgh from Elizabeth Township. WTAE-4.3 main ABC service from Oakland translator (RF 22). WTAE-4.4 This TV Pittsburgh from Oakland. WQED-13.1 main PBS service. WQED-13.2 Create. Also delayed-play PBS dinnertime news shows. WQED-13.3 Neighborhood. WQED-13.4 (NEW) Showcase, will come on this fall, basically with stuff from national, local pledge drives. WINP-16.1 ShopNBC. WINP-16.2 ION WINP-16.3 Qubo WINP-16.4 IONLife WBGN-59.1 main infomercial/late afternoon-nighttime programming. WBGN-59.2 HSN. WBGN-59.3 Retro. WBGN-59.4 Universal Sports. KDKA (CBS) has one channel, WPXI two (NBC; MeTV), WPCW (CW) one, WPMY two (MyTV; Cool TV), WPCB three (main religious channel; Bible Discovery Network; main channel in HD) and WPGH two (Fox; The Country Network). We have TBN O&O WDLI/17 here, with the usual complement of five total channels. PBS affiliate WVIZ/25 has:

25.1 Main WVIZ/PBS/HD feed 25.2 Ohio Channel (state public affairs, co-operated by WVIZ) 25.3 PBS World 25.4 PBS Create 25.9 Cleveland Sight Center Network (radio reading for the blind, audio only, can be picked up on most tuners) Given Pittsburgh's likely loss of Radio Information Service in the near future from the WESA-90.5 sub-lineup, I wonder if a TV version of RIS might be possible. I like that choice on WVIZ. I'd also love to see Pennsylvania Cable Network (our equivalent of Ohio Channel) as a subchannel in this market (not likely as long as it is a cable-and-cable-only service). This is a whole other topic, but when are stations going to start offering the main channels as subchannels of related stations? I know of one case with two network affiliates where the owners are the same and the tower is the same, and there are two subchannels total. It would be so easy to make both subchannels and the one main channel subchannels of the first. In many cases across the country, it's like that. In several cases, you have in-market sister stations often simulcasting the other's main signal on a secondary subchannel. As an example, in Central Illinois, CBS affiliate WCIA simulcasts its main signal (I believe in standard-def form) on the second subchannel of its sister station WCFN (a MyTV station), and vice-versa. WCFN was originally a repeater of WCIA for the southern half of Champaign-Decatur-Springfield market for many years until WCFN became a stand-alone station. As is the case with some other Fox-owned stations, KCOP carries the standard-def signal of KTTV on its second subchannel; KCOP 13.2 is actually mapped to KTTV 11.2. Also, going back to my KJLA/KXLA/KVMD post, KVMD's main signal is also simulcast on KXLA 44.10, while KXLA's main signal is on KVMD 31.2. KAXT, a low power (56 kW) station serving the Santa Clara/San Jose, CA market, might be the sub-channel winner. Their virtual channel is 1 although they broadcast on 42. 1.1 Electronic program guide 1.2 My Family TV 1.3 Diya TV 1.4 South Asian TV 1.5 Vietnamese TV 1.6 NetV 1.7 EMTV 1.8 FAN (Filipino) 1.9 TVHS (Taiwan) 1.10 Tiempos Finales 1.11 Jewelry Television 1.12 Peanut TV (real estate) The rest are radio on TV 1.13 Brioso Classical music 1.14 QH Radio 1.15 Classic Country 1.16 Classic Hindi/Bollywood 1.17 Bhajans - Spiritual 1.18 Desi Jams (modern Hindi music) 1.19 Tagalog 1.20 Punjabi Radio USA Shows you what is possible on just 6 MHz of spectrum. Warren Trumbly, whom I've met, is one of

the owners. They use Harmonic equipment for all of their encoding and multiplexing. Fox stations with 11PM (10PM central) news WDAF actually 2 hrs from 9PM-11PM M-F Central and Mountain? KSAZ-TV 10 Phoenix. 5-6 PM and 9-10 PM with one anchor team. 6-6:30 PM and 10-10:30 PM with a separate anchor. KDFW Dallas has 5, 6, 9 and 10 PM news in the evening. WBRC, WAGA, WSVN, WOFL, WTTG WTIC-TV. 10PM-11PM is one newscast. 11PM-11:35PM (though the guide says 1130) is a seperate newscast. Sunday-Friday. WFTX Fox 4. WTVT in Tampa... KMSP Minneapolis/St. Paul (but not on Saturdays) Here in Milwaukee, WITI-TV has a 10 p.m. (central) newscast -- a practice that took place long before Channel 6 joined the FOX family in 1994. (WITI, formerly a CBS affiliate, was one of the stations that underwent an affiliate switcheroo in the New World Communications deal.) 23 WXXA in Albany, they've run an 11 PM newscast for over a year now (along with 10 and 10:30 PM)... they also run a morning newscast from 6 to 8 AM and a half-hour at 5 PM, still no midday newscast however Smiley When we used to get WHBQ in Memphis they had a ten o'clock newscast, I believe they still do. FOX 25 has news on from 10-11:30. Call letters, please. I think he's referring to WFXT Boston...they advertise news at 10 & 11pm. Fox 17 here in Nashville has a solid hour and a half of news from 9:00 to 10:30 p.m. every evening. How about KCOP in LA My13 its run by Fox. They have an 11pm newscast produced by the KTTV news team does that count? WVUE-TV in New Orleans recently added a 10pm (half-hour) cast. All told, they are now doing 8 and a half hours of news a day Monday through Friday. 5a to 9a

Noon (hour) 4pm (hour) 5pm (hour) 9pm (hour) 10pm (half-hour) Is that a lot of local news for a Fox affiliate? WDAF Along with sister station KDVR here in Denver And doesn't WDAF go till 11:00 PM ?? KHON/Honolulu has a 10PM newscast. The 9PM hour is occupied by "Big Bang Theory" and Two and a Half Men." To Jazz Kat, WHBQ did relaunched their 10PM newscast in August 2010. Some Fox stations only have a half hour of news at 10PM(9PM Central) WAGA/FOX 5 ATLANTA Weekdays 4:30am-10am 12:00pm-1:00pm 5:00pm-7:00pm 10:00pm-11:30pm 1:00am-2:00am(10:00pm Repeat) 4:00am-4:30am(11:00pm repeat) Weekends 6:00am-8:00am 6:00pm-7:00pm 10:00pm-11:00pm It should be noted here that they've done this for their entire Fox affiliation. KTBC Austin did a similar thing for about five years after switching until they at last started up a 9pm newscast in 2000. Well, I would appreciate when they begin streaming all of their newscasts once again like their sister stations seem to do. Everyone isn't going to be at home on the weekend to sit in front of the TV to catch the news, and would appreciate if they stream it so while on the go and be about your day.