Howard Griswold Conference CallThursday, April 7, 2011 Partial Howard Griswold Conference calls: 218-844-3388 pin 966771# (6 mutes

& un-mutes), Thursdays at 8 p.m., Eastern Time. 6 Mutes and un-mutes

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Note: there is a hydrate water call Mondays, same time and number and pin #. Howards home number: 302-875-2653 (between 9:30, a.m, and 7:00, p.m.)
Mickeys debt collection call is 8:00 p.m., Eastern Time, Wednesday night. The number is 712 432 8773 and the pin number is 947975#.

Mickey Paolettas cell number is 717-979-3061 Check out: www.escapeharrassment.com www.escape-tickets-IRS-court.org All correspondence to: Gemini Investment Research Group, POB 398, Delmar, Del. 19940 (do not address mail to Howard Griswold since Howard has not taken up residence in that mailbox and since hes on good terms with his wife he isnt likely to in the foreseeable future.) "All" Howard's and GEMINI RESEARCH's information through the years, has been gathered, combined and collated into 3 "Home-Study Courses" and "Information packages" listed at www.peoples-rights.com "Mail Order" DONATIONS and/or Toll-Free 1-877-544-4718 (24 Hours F.A.Q. line) Dave DiReamer can be reached at: notaxman@dmv.com Peoples-rights has a new book available from The Informer: Just Who Really Owns the United States, the International Monetary Fund, Federal Reserve, World Bank, Your House, Your Car, Everythingthe Myth and the Reality. Hell take $45 for the book to help with ads, but $40 would be ok which includes shipping ($35 barebones minimum) www.peoples-rights.com c/o 1624 Savannah Road, Lewes, Delaware 19958 ********************

Christian Walters (trusts) is on Mondays, Tuesdays and Saturdays at nine o'clock, Eastern Time. The number is 1-712-432-0075 and the pin is 149939# (9 pm EST). Wednesdays number is 1-724-444-7444 and the pin is 41875# (8 pm, Eastern) or

tune in on Wednesday at Talkshoe.com at http://www.talkshoe.com/talkshoe/web/talkCast.jsp?masterId=41875&cmd=tc

Often you can find a transcript or a partial one for the weeks call at the following website: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/peoplelookingforthetruth Howard approves or disapproves all postings to this yahoo group. Send potential posting to Howard.

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********************* Extra legal help is available from the firm, Ketchum, Dewey, Cheatham and Howe. When you arent talking please mute your phone!! Especially, dont walk away from your phone while its unmated. If you were near the phone in that situation youd hear the callers screaming at you to mute!!! It would be best if you mute your phone when you first come on, then un-mute it when you want to talk and then re-mute it. You can use the *6 button on your phone or use the phones mute button Speaker phones and cell phones are not desirable as they can chop up the call badly occasionally. If you are recording the call and leave the phone unintended, please mute!!!!!

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Get a phone with a privacy or mute button. This is much more convenient than star-6 and more rapid to use. It can also be used as a cough button since it can be used rapidly. Try it, youll like it. ********************************************************************* Mickeys new call-in number: 1-712-432-8787, pin: 170555# 8 p.m, EST Check out Citizens Reform Center. ****************************************

A recording of each Howard Griswold Thursday conference call is available from Dezert Owl upon request for any sized donation. Go to the following link: www.TheRealPublicRadio.Net/Archives.html .
For donations to desert, send them to Free America Radio Network, 121 Seaparc Circle, Suite B, Kingsland, Georgia 31548. Phone number: 912-882-2142. Cell: 304-629-7169. For reference: Jersey City v. Hague, 115 Atlantic Reporter 2nd, page 8 (A 2nd ) ***************************************************** Start ***************************************************** {00:10:13.331} [Howard] Im going to tell you about something thats going on. Dave e-mailed me something the other day about another case. This time it was in Alabama. The court in Alabama ruled that the mortgage foreclosure action by a bank against an individual in their home was not proper and had to be dismissed simply because they had not properly securitized the papers on the loan and kept a record of the securitization. Now, heres what theyre doing. There are two pieces of paper that people sign when they go get a mortgage in case youre unaware of this, if you never got one. Ill explain it to you. There is a mortgage application and then there is a thing called a promissory note and the so-called borrower which really isnt a borrower has to sign each one of these notes. Now, heres what the bank does. The bank writes the figurelets just pick an arbitrary figure, say youre borrowing $100,000 to go buy a house. Maybe you put $20,000 down or something. Maybe you got one of those government loans where you didnt have to put anything down, but whatever. The paperwork shows $100,000. They write $100,000 on the promissory note with your signature on it and they deposit it and it creates $100,000 in a bank account. This is what they go to the settlement table with and they pay the seller $100,000 with a check out of that account which closes out that account. In the meanwhile they have a different account and they deposit the mortgage application and they write $100,000 on it. Now the bank just made $100,000. You got your house. The bank turns around and gives you a payment book because you got to make X number of dollar payments every month. This is what they call amortization. They amortize it by

establishing the payment schedule and the date and time that its due which is in accordance with whats spelled out in that mortgage note that you signed. So now you start paying. If you pay the whole thing off in twenty years, twenty-five years, thirty years, whatever the mortgage was made for with the interest that theyre charging you it usually comes out to about three times the amount. Now, they made $100,000 on the first deposit of the mortgage note. They make $300,000 on you paying it off. Thats $400,000 profit. Now, if you dont pay it off they have an insurance policy on it. They insure it against loss. So if you default what they do is they put it up for auction against loss. They usually buy it back themselves which, by the way, is a breach of the trust because theyre holding the property in trust for you and they have no right under the laws of trustsas a matter of fact, theres an interesting court case on this called Brun v. Hanson that you could look up and read that the trustee cannot bid on or buy the property that theyre holding in trust when they auction it off or sell it. They cannot become involved in the price of it because its their job to get the best possible price. And if they buy it theyre probably cheating on the best possible price so thats a breach of the trust. But what they do is they put it up for auction. Most times they send their own people in there to bid to run the price up. Eventually, everybody goes away. The bank buys it back then the bank turns around and sells it to some real estate outfit thats associated with the bank who sells it on the market for a good price and shares part of what they make off of it with the bankthey split it half and half. The bank makes money again. In the meanwhile the bank turns the default over to the insurance and they get paid the interest that wasnt paid plus the principal that supposedly wasnt paid on the mortgage agreement and they get their $400,000. So they end up getting probably another $100,000 on the default and the sale of it plus the three times the amount plus the original $100,000 they made. These people are pretty good thieves arent they? This sounds like a great racket. I wonder how we could start something like that and make some money. If the people are dumb enough suckers to fall for this and allow these kinds of things to happen then I would say the American people are easily taken advantage of. We ought to put together a new group, throw this old group out we should start taking advantage of them, huh? What do you think? [Henry] Theyll put us in jail.

[Howard] No, therell be nobody to put us in jail if we took over. Theres nobody there to put them in jail because theyre in control. All we got to do is run them out of the country and take over and run the same kind of a scam. The only problem is I wont allow this because thats not my way of doing things. I wouldnt do this. I wouldnt become involved in doing this in any way, shape or form and what I want to do is put a stop to it but its starting to unwind for them. The Alabama court came down with the same ruling that the Long Island, New York court came down with a couple of months ago, maybe its two months ago or so. They came down with.the same thing that the Alabama court said based on what the Massachusetts Supreme Court said and they came down with that ruling because of what the court in Kansas said which is the first one that brought all this stuff about the fact that they are not doing this properly that they are not proving the chain of title to the ownership of the documents and that they are amortizing and securitizing these things incorrectly. Now, let me tell you what thats going to result in. There is a lawyer lady down in Florida who was on Sixty Minutes program Sunday night talking about this

and exposing what a scam it was. Theres an awful lot of people in the country that listened to Sixty Minutes so a lot of people that may be in foreclosure are suddenly learning that theres something than can be done about the foreclosure which means theres going to be a whole lot more people getting involved in bringing these kinds of arguments to the courts and the courts are going to rule in the same way because the law says they have to securitize this together and keep track of where its sold. They cant separate the two documents and let them go in different directions and not keep track of where they went that, first of all, they cant separate them. Second of all, they cant not keep track of where they went. And thats what theyre doing, theyre separating them and theyre not keeping track of where theyre sold to because theyre sold over and over and over again and theres no chain of title that can be proven. No matter whos got it, it doesnt matter, theres no chain of title that proves that whos got it has a right to right to it. So this is going to cause major problems for major banks like Bank of America, City Bank, Chase Manhattan, the big banksmajor, major problems because now with these things being stopped like this theyre not going to be able to pay the bond people. They sold these things to bond people who put up a guarantee to pay x number of dollars in exchange for the mortgage which means This is what theyre talking about, collateralized mortgages. They sell them to these bond people. The bond people buysay you got $100,000 mortgagethey buy it for $80,000 and theyre guaranteed to collect $100,000 of part of the money that the banks get. Well, when the bond people are not getting their money where the banks have guaranteed to pay it because the banks are not getting the money from you and not able to foreclose on it and not able to turn in the insurance claims on it because of the improper securitization now the bond people are going to move against the banks. When they do, thats going to take the bond market and the banks down. There is going to be a major drop in the entire economic structure in this country and the entire stock market because the stock market and the bond market are one and the same. The securitization is all done through the bonds and the stock market. Youre going to see one hell of a mess develop from this. Its probably going to take about six months. Its not going to happen tomorrow because none of this legal stuff goes very fast. It might take about six months. Well, six months from now is next fall and if you remember what happened in 2008 it was in the fall when everything started falling apart and the stock market dropped from 14,500 to 6,400. Well, right now, the market is at 12,400 and youre going to see it drop, probably this fall, from wherever it ends up at in the fall down to around 4,000. Its going to be one tremendous drop. And if you think we just experience one big slowdown and a massive unemployment problem here in 2008, 9 and 10 wait until you see what happens in 2012. Dont die, hang on, because if you die youre going to miss the greatest show on earth. Barnum and Bailey Circus used to advertise that they were the greatest show on earth. This circus is going to be a thousand times better than Barnum and Bailey Circus was. You only have to understand a little bit about the simple mathematics of something like this to realize what I just explained to you and I understand the simple mathematics of it well enough to see whats coming about. These mortgages foreclosures are up in the millions. I dont mean millions of dollarsmillions of mortgages that are being foreclosed onsomething like 3 million I think I heard them say. You realize the monetary impact of 3 million foreclosures? If we just took an average of todays prices of $150,000. There are still homes that are $100,000. A lot of them are $200,000 today. Some of them are even higher than that. Take that average and multiply it by 3 million and think

about the amount of money that is not going to be there thats supposed to be there. That is a tremendous impact on the economic structure. I think Barack Obama would be damned smart not to run again. {running to the border would be ok}. {Henry} Well, he cooked his goose with that Obama care {or was that Obama snare?} {Actually as of April 10, I see that the Republicans caved in on Obama care and a bunch of other things.} [Howard] I think youre right.

{02:17:01.953} [Howard] I have a letter here from a Republican state senator in Illinois named Roger Keats. You can find this if you want to copy it and look it over more closely or send it to some of your friends from NealBoortz.com. Roger Keats is moving out of Illinois. He says, good bye and good luck. As we leave for good I want to say good bye to my friends and wish all of you well because like Ive told you before there are good people and there are evil people all over the place and they come from all walks of life. And he knows that theres good people in Illinois so he wants to wish them well. And he says that he is a lifetime son of the heartland and hes very proud of it. After sixty years I leave Illinois with a heavy heart but enough is enough. The leaders of Illinois refuse to see that we cannot continue going on in the direction we are going and accept people who have opinions to stay here I remember when Illinois had twenty-five congressmen. In 2012 we will have 18 congressmen. Compared to the rest of the country we have lost one-quarter of our population. Dont blame the weather because most people love the four seasons. Illinois just sold still more bonds and our credit rating is so bad that we pay higher interest than the rates on junk bonds. Illinois is ranked 50th in fiscal policy among the states, 47th in job creation among the rest of the states, 1st in unfunded pension liabilities, 2nd largest in budget deficit, 1st in failing schools, 1st in bonded indebtedness, highest sales tax in the nation. Most judges have been indicted Five out of our last elected nine governors have been indicted. That is more than the other 49 states all added together. Added to that 32 Chicago aldermen, which is the city council for Chicago, they call them aldermen, and over a thousand state and municipal employees have been indicted. The corruption tax is the real cost of doing business and we are the butt of jokes for standup comics. We live in the most corrupt big city, the most corrupt big county and the most corrupt state in America. I am sick and tired of subsidizing crooks {When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice: but when the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn. Proverbs 29:2} A day rarely passes without an article in the news about corruption and incompetence. Chicago even got caught reading the test to hire police and fire people. Our Cook Country corporate property tax system is intentionally corrupt. The Democratic state chairman who is also speaker of the Illinois House and the most senior alderman in Chicago each make well over a million dollars a year putting the fix on their clients tax assessments. We are moving to Texas, he said, where there is no income tax while Illinois just raised their income tax 67% higher. Texas sales tax is one-half of our sales tax which is the highest in the nation. Southern states are supportive of job producers, tax payers and folks who offer opportunities to other residents. Illinois shakes them down for every penny that they can

extort from them. In the hill country of Texas near Austin and San Antoniowait until he moves there and finds out what he is walking into. That is not a great area but he thinks it is right now. He says, we bought a gracious home on almost two acres with a swimming pool and its new and it will cost around 40% of what weour house in Illinois for and the property taxes are one-third of what they are in Cook County in Illinois. The property tax system in Illinois is a disaster. The homes there sell, like ours, he said, sold for nearly 50% more than the property taxes are. Can you imagine that? The house sold for just about 50% more than what the property tax every year is. He goes on to say, our assessed home value was 50% higher than the sale price. The system is unfair and incompetent. Now, this is a retired Republican state senator in the Illinois legislature. Hes leaving. Illinois is too corrupt for him. Texas is no where near as corruptIll grant him that. Delaware, for instance, where I live is nowhere near as corrupt. Go across the line which is not very far away from me, go across the line which is not very far away from me, three miles down the road and into Maryland, and its a lot more corrupt. They extort more from their people in Maryland than they extort from their people here in Delaware. But it is amazing to me how incompetent, untrained and unknowledgeable these people are. Texas extorts a small amount of money for the property tax from their people. Delaware extorts a smaller amount of property tax from their people than Maryland does, for instance, right next door to us. They are still extorting from the people and shaking us down. Why are we so knowledgeless? Why are we so incompetent as a society to not understand what the laws and the rules of the society were supposed to be, especially people like this gentleman? I refer to him as a gentleman because I dont the man and I dont know that he is not a gentlemen so I will show that much respect for him but he is an incompetent idiot that was in politics and didnt know what he was doing in politics, allowed the corruption to continue to get worse around him and now hes moving to another place to avoid that corruption and walking into a lesser corruptionso what? My question is, why dont people learn what the real law is and do something to enforce it? This banking scam thats been going on for years in this country is starting to be exposed. The government scams that have been going on in this country have not yet been even begun to be exposed. Theres complaints, theres mouthy people speaking out and poignant minor little things out but nobody has yet gotten to the real points of the purpose and intents of these governments which Ive spoken about for months now is a trust situation where the government is the trust, the government employees are the trustees and the American people are the beneficiaries. Information that Ive given so far and tonight I didnt get into it because this news today and the stuff thats going on in the news is so important that we talk about that I didnt get into that and I had a little discussion about the news and things ahead of time and then I let Dave go over a bunch of the more recent e-mail news and Im just going to continue on with the news and how corrupt things are. Im not going to get into the specifics right out of the law book this week as I usually do. Next week maybe well pick up on that again but its important that we talk about this. The stupidity of people, especially the ones in higher positions, is absolutely unbelievable. To do nothing about it and to not push our politicians is beyond belief but there are ways something can be done about this. I dont know how many of you will feel competent as Im able to get this information about the trusts and the duties of a trustee out and really feel like you could go into court but everything that Congress is doing right now is a breach of the public trust without passing the budget. That would be an interesting suit for somebody

who just happened to get on that bandwagon. Ninety percent of the stuff that comes out of these courts are actually exposing the breach of the public trust. If one of you has a particular subject matter that you happen to like the most like abortion or property tax or driving regulations or what have you but a fellow up in Pennsylvania that is 78 years of age and he has a pacemaker implanted in his chesthes not in good health at allwas harassed by some police officers back on April 30th of 2010 which is getting on now pretty close to a year ago. This case has not yet come to court. The charges against him were not even filed by the police until the 26th of June. They pulled him out of the car, beat him up, knocked him around a bitfinally one of the police must have been decent enough to call for the paramedics. The paramedics finally showed up. The police gave the paramedics a hard time. The paramedics finally told the police to go to hell, were taking this man to the hospital so they got him to the hospital. When he got to the hospital the police were hanging around and the doctor told them to get the hell out of there or he would do something about them so finally they left. It seems there really is some power somewhere in some people once in a while and it comes out of them. Anyway, the police left. They didnt write these complaints up against him until almost two months later from April 30th to June 26th is nearly two months time. Remember, the month of May is in between there. And somehow or another this stuff has been delayed and put off in the courts and something is coming up on, think its the 14th of this month which is only about six or seven days in front of us. And what he did was he got together with a few of us and the criminal code of Pennsylvania and we all went down to the criminal code and read the specific details of the criminal code. It is against the law under the SectionIll give you a number, 154 or something like thatof the Pennsylvania Code to do a certain type of a conduct. It is against of the law to do a certain type of a conduct under Section 922 of the Pennsylvania Code. It is against the lawwell, we came up with 12 different laws, criminal violations that their conduct fit. And what weve donenow, I want you to think about this. You can go to any local court building. Go down in the basement. There is a library. In the libraries they have the entire state code. It doesnt matter if you live in Pennsylvania. If you live in California, if you live in Michigan, if you live in Florida, the courts have a library in the basement. It is for the benefit of the local lawyers who use the courts in case they dont have enough of a library. It is open to you providing that you have a case going on so if you have a case going on you are entitled to use that court library. They will restrict you if you dont have a case going on. But if you have one going on you can go down into the library. In the library they always have the state code books from 1 to 50 or 1 to 92 or whatever number of stupid little books they have in the state code. And one of the books is called the criminal code and if you will sit down and do what this fellow did with the help of a couple of other people. He went over item by item criminal statute by criminal statute, he read it carefully, he thought about the details of what they had done to him and he applied those details and he wrote up that their conduct of doing this, that and the other did then and there violate Section 514 of Title 18 of the Pennsylvania Code and he wrote up a criminal complaint and he sent it to the attorney generals office which weve done before to no avail that they dont go after their own. It has been useless pretty much of the time in the past. The only benefit that its ever had to us was that when we did this the police officers didnt show up in the court to testify and the case got dismissed so one individual got out of the problems by doing these things. But that didnt change anything. That didnt get these cops arrested for what they do wrong like

beating up a 78 year old man with a pacemaker who told them he had a pacemaker. He told them he was having chest pains that they were upsetting him. That didnt matter, they proceeded to do what they consider their job to be and harassed the hell out of the poor man. Well, this time we sent this criminal complaint to the attorney general with an attached letter. The attached letter said that if you do not prosecute these people we will file a civil suit against you for breach of the public trust and breach of your fiduciary duty to protect us as beneficiaries of the government trust. I got a feeling that these police officers are going to get prosecutednow, probably to the most minimal extent. They will pick the lowest penalty crime thats in there, plea bargain it down to that lowest penalty one and probably give them probation but they will convicted and be on probation and that will cause them to lose their job as police officers and they damned well ought to because thats not how you treat the American people. That is definitely breach of their fiduciary and trust duty even as police officers. They deserve to lose their jobs. And I almost hope that because of this lawsuit and because of the situation that theyre in that their wives get mad and leave them. Thatll probably hurt worse than anything else in some cases. In some cases they might be happy the wife left but we never know which way something like that will go. We are learning ways to go about these things and put them in a very awkward position. You people out there need to put out an effort to look these things up. You can find this kind of stuff in your own local courts in the basement in the library. It will take you a little bit of time. It will take you a little bit of using your brain and thinking to read the criminal statutes. They are not all against you. As a matter of fact, most of the criminal statutes are actually against government people for wrongdoings of government people. Theres only a few that are against you and I and government definitely has a duty to protect you and I from one another. They have a duty to protect us from robbery, rape, murder, assault and battery. Every other foolish damned thing thats in the criminal code is really applying to government. Anything related to the five things I just mentioned, robbery, rape, murder, assault and battery, they are really common law crimes. They have a duty to prosecute me if I do one of those criminal acts to you. Thats a duty they have to protect you from me. The rest of that criminal statute is mostly against them for their activity including some things like robbery and murder because theyre been known to kill people and theyre been known to rob people. Most of their statutes are used to rob the private sector when the private sector is not the ones that these internal statutes of government are supposed to apply to. So any time they apply these code statutes for taxes, fines and fees it is a violation of the public trust and their fiduciary duty because those codes do not apply to the private peoplethey only apply to government. There is a court case that backs that up. I forget the whole name of it but its something to the effect of Chicago Railroad Company v. Yakima County School District in Colorado. Its a Colorado Supreme Court case. It stated emphatically that the codes, statutes, rules and regulations of government apply to the juristic society. If you go to a law dictionary and look up juristic society it says it means government. So what it said was, those codes, rules, statutes and regulations apply only to government. They dont apply to the private sector. They are applying this stuff to us like property tax, like traffic tickets, like income taxes improperly because they dont apply to the private sector. They only apply to the privileged people within government who are privileged to work with or have a license to do a particular activity from government. Anything outside of that application is a breach of their fiduciary

duty and weve been letting them get away with this for years. Im getting, as the politician up there in Illinois said, sick and tired of supporting the criminal element, the crooks. [Dave] The state code is in the regular libraries, not limited to only law libraries.

[Howard] In Delaware it is. Now, I wouldnt tell people that it is in every state in this countryit may well be. Most of the local little town and city libraries will have a copy of the state code and thats all you need. If the courthouse wont let you in the basement library then go to the regular libraries and see if they dont have ita lot of them do. Here in Delaware every local little library in every small town that we have here in Delaware has a copy of the state code. You can find all this stuff if youll just put out a little effort to do it. The big effort is not finding it and where it is but reading it and applying it. That does take a little bit of strain on the brain stem and if youre afraid to strain your brain stem then you probably should be done away with anyway. I think our Creator ought to just come down here and sweep all those people kind of people away and dispose of everything. I hope that insulted a few people. I enjoy insulting people. They need it. Sometimes it is the only thing that will get them moving. So I hope I insulted a few people and it gets you moving. You might not realize it but if you will apply your brain you will lift the conscious level to a higher level. Dont sit there and do nothing. Dont sit there and beg and worry and pray to God. God, please take care of this. Jesus, come and help me because Im going to tell you something. God and Jesus dont come and help you for your own personal things. God gave you an ability to do these things and if you dont use it youre not going to get any help. Ill tell you how you get help from God. I get it all the time. You people need help. You have problems. You are all upset and worried and concerned and I dont even have an answer, sometimes, to your problems. I don know what the hell to do for you. Ive never run into this situation before but I will just sort of look up and say, God, this guy named Jimmy, the one that will take all youll give him, he needs some help and I dont know what to do for him. And, by golly, God will lead me to an answer to help Jimmy. leave me anything to help myselfnever didbecause He gave me an ability to help myself. When I need help for other people I get help. It will come to me. The answer will be given. Now, whether youll listen or not, thats your problem. You dont have to listen, you dont have to pay any attention to what I tell you. You can do it the way you think you ought to do it. You may screw it all up but thats your problem, you didnt listen. But the answer will be given when youre trying to help somebody else. But when you want it for yourself dont bother, youre wasting your time. You can pray all you want for help for yourselfyoure not going to get it. God gave you the ability to do things. You have talent. Remember the little blurp in one of the verses in the Bible about God gave three different people each two talentsone of the verses in the Bibleand one of them multiplied those talents by invested them and improving them and increasing them. And one of them stuck them in a closet and stored them away and didnt do anything with them. And the other one wasted them and spent them all. The basic concept of the word, talent, at that time is that it was like money. Each was given two coins of money that were called talents. The fact is its the talent of your brain, the ability that you have, and if you invest it and increase it and improve it you will be very successful and if you put it in the closet and dont use it you will just be where you are. And if you waste it you will be below where you were. That is the allegory of that story and most people put it in the closet. Some

people waste it and very few people invest it and improve it. This is a time in our history in the course of life when we better start investing what we have. You better start using those talents because if you dont youre going to be on the short end of the stick when the cleanup comes and the cleanup is not far in front of us. I can imagine with the failure of the economic system the downturn to a point of very, very low economics or a total collapse which might be on the horizon. And this is not just going to happen in this country because we have a world-connected economy and as goes one country so goes the other countries. So a total collapse of any one country will domino effect into a collapse of another and another and another and it could be very fast. It could be a matter of months and a total collapse of all economic structures and all governments are in power and in force because of their money structures. And if their money structure collapses there is no power and no force. Governments will collapse right behind it. And without government and its provisions of so many goodies to the people all over this world and the money being available for you to enjoy all the nice things that we are accustomed to with money like electrical supply and school for your little brats that you dont want to baby sit and take care of yourself and hospitalization because youre too stupid to learn how to take care of your body properly and you trust a moron doctor and all these other goodies that were accustomed to when they disappear I can imagine many, many suicides coming and attempted suicides by stupid people who will throw themselves out of the basement window. Anyway, so much for my ranting tonight, go ahead, sir, what was your statement? [Carlos] Yes, hi, this is Carlos in California. I knew a person who committed suicide because he lost his business due to property taxes and every six months they go through a lot of headache and I guess because due to property taxes they do this How else can they fight back or how can we help them fight back and can you give us any ideas? [Dave] You want me to answer that, Howard?

[Howard] Well, no. No, let me answer it because some of what we had in the property tax home study class that we had, we have gone beyond that. We are far above it today. There is a home study course that you can purchase from www.peoples-rights.com thatll get you on the right track but there is more to it today. With what weve learned in the recent months and yearsfirst of all, the Fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution which was made applicable to the states through the 14th Amendment forbids the governments whether they be state or federal from taking private property for public use without just compensation. Making you register your private home or your private little building that you do a little private business in or something like that, that isnt really commercial is a taking of private property without just compensation. But that was a complicated sort of a case to put together. Weve found a number of cases that have been brought by lawyers or people who had enough money to pay lawyers to bring it. Weve read them. It was very involved. The government always fights it. Youre going to have a long row to hoe if you approach it from that direction. We looked and looked and looked to find a more effective approach. And finally, we have stumbled over this realization that government is a public trust, that government officials of any type at any level whether it be federal or state or county or city or town officials are in a trustee position. It is their duty

as trustees to protect our property. And as a matter of fact, there is a court case that is quite old but it is still the precedent setting ruling on the meaning and definition of the word, property. That case is Fulton Light, Power and Heat Company v. New York. It is at 200 NY reports, page 400, a 1911 case. I told you its a rather old case but its the precedent case that is still referred to in modern textbooks as the meaning of property and that case said that property is something that is guaranteed and protected by government. Now, thats a summary of that case. That case is about sixty pages long, a big long discussion, a lot of reading of some very technical legal wording in it which can be confusing to the average person who hasnt been to law school. But the summary of it is that government has a duty to guarantee us the right to have private property and guarantee the protection of that private property from all sources of invasion of it. That is the public duty of these trustees and they are breaching that duty. The simplest way to bring a case against them is for breach of their public trust and fiduciary duty to protect our private property and not to take it without just compensation. Now, we can jump over the hurdles of the just compensation arguments and go right to the trust argument. So, yes, there is a way. Private property is not taxable. As a matter of fact, that was my point about the stupidity of this Illinois politician who is moving to Texas because the property tax is only one-third of what it is in Illinois. Well, damn, hes stupid. Hes probably educated person. Education does not make you intelligentit just maintains stupidity. They cannot tax private property but theyre getting away with doing it. And theyre getting away with doing it because of the stupidity of people. They cant read the label that says, do not use Preparation H orally. He ate the whole tube and hes still got the hemorrhoids but now he cant even swallow a jelly bean. Stupid, stupid, stupid, we have been put in that position. We have been restrained from knowledge through education. It is starting to come back to us thanks to quit a number of people around this country who are willing to research and study and learn and share the informationIm just one of those people. Im not the key. I might be the loudest speaker. I might talk the most. And, by the way, I heard, the other day, that there are several other people starting to chant this concept of suing them for breach of the public trust. That is great. I hope they will bother to look up the laws and study them and use them properly and not just run their stupid mouths but I dont care if somebody gives me credit because I found it first or somebody takes it and runs with it and does better than I do with it. I want this word to get out. I want you people to understand that there is a waynow, youre probably never going to find a lawyer unless you find one thats financially hurting then he might take your case. Other than that I dont think youre going to find a lawyer that is going to help you go against the system and sue them for breaching their public trust because if you prove one case its going to open the doors just like this banking thing has opened the doors that all banking loans are a fraud. Not one of them is honest and thats going to shut the banks down. Well, this breach of the public trust is going to shut these governments down and stop them from what theyve been doing to people from stealing our property and extorting our money from us under the false pretense that their rules and regulations apply to our private automobiles and our private use of the roadways and our private labor and our private land and the use of our private land and thats going to take away zoning regulations, building permit regulations. All the crap that they make so much money on is going to stop if we push this. But if we dont, shame on you people, you deserve what you get.

[Dave] [Howard]

Howard, I have an additional answer. Go ahead.

[Dave] Being as the reason they control your land is because you were tricked into recording the deed or registering the deed, why not get the security agreement indemnity bond financing statement as drawn up for people by the Howard Griswold Research Group and terminate the registration then they cannot continue to enforce their behavior code on the private property land and they cannot then tax you every year for enjoying the benefit of them regulating your land for you. Then your land is not within the corporate bounds. Just like that lady up in New London, Connecticut, Mrs. Kelo and all her neighbors, the Supreme Court did not point out to them that the reason the court had jurisdiction was because their evidence of ownership, their private property deed was recorded into the county up in Connecticuts public land records all their private property deeds were recorded. If they had had Howard Griswolds security agreement recorded at the Connecticut State Secretary of States office at the UCC Department it would have terminated the registration of the deed and then the Supreme Court would not have had jurisdiction to give their land away to Pfizer Chemical and the town to raise the tax base so the town could make money on stealing private property and give it away to Pfizer Chemical. They raised the wrong issue. They never raised the fact that the way the court presumed it had jurisdiction was because their private property deed was in the public property records. So if everyone would just terminate their registration or recordation by having a security agreement recorded at the State Secretary of State office, UCC Department, then they could serve on the county tax assessment office an affidavit of commercial notice based upon the recorded security agreement indemnity bond financing statement and that terminates the registration and then they cannot send you a tax bill any longer and they cannot presume to enforce their behavior code title numbers and code section numbers because they can only do that on property thats within their corporate bounds if it continues to be recorded in their public property records. You destroy the presumption by having that security agreement and by serving that affidavit of commercial notice. It terminates the registration and terminates their presumption that you have abandoned all claim of interest in your private property land and that therefore the interest fell to the state under the lawyers doctrine of escheat because you failed to claim your interest. You not only failed to claim it, you gave what remained of it away by recording it without the just compensation as Howard pointed out. Thats the perfect way to terminate that fraud is to withdraw and come out of their record keeping system because you made a mistake. And under mistake is one of the fundamental underlying principles of law in the state commercial code section 1-103 along with bankruptcy and other validating and invalidating circumstance. Once you raise that theres a mistake that is indication that they cannot proceed because they cannot proceed on a falsified record once you raise that theres a mistake the entire game stops. Nobody passes go, nobody gets $200. They cannot proceed on a falsified record and if theres a mistake that means the record is in error and in mistake and they have to stop the case or stop the action or theft or whatever they were trying to do with that ladys property. They have been trying to do it with us every year with these assessments and enforcing their behavior code, title number and section numbers on private peoples property. Just terminate all that, withdraw.

[Howard] And that case is a perfect example of what I just said, that a lawyer will never do this job for you. The lawyer that they hired argued that the government couldnt use eminent domain to foreclose on their property. There are dozens and dozens of cases that say the government can use eminent domain to foreclose on somebodys property for particular government purposes. So he has a losing battle to start with. Hes an idiot lawyer with a idiot law degree. He didnt even bring up the just compensation argument at all in the arguments that he brought out of the Fifth Amendment. Thats one thing and the other thing is he didnt bring up the fact that its governments duty to protect your right to that property, that its a breach of fiduciary duty of the government officials who attempted to take the peoples private property for their own benefit and enrichment. The only way this is going to be brought is by us, the people, not by lawyers. Lawyers are the problem, theyre not the answer. [Dave] Because the registration in the first place was the taking of private property and they never gave you the full disclosure that by recording your private property deed for you and having the temerity to charge you money to do it to you, for you, and charge you money for it [Howard] And its amazing, too, how our Creator works methodically. When we developed that security agreement back in 1999 and in late November we started circulating that information it bothered me terrible that even though we thoroughly understood from all the research we did on how to do that security agreement do it properly in accordance with all the rules and restrictions of legislative enactments I didnt know how in the hell to enforce it and that worried me. And do you that it took me ten more years. It was 2009 before I finally got an answer from our Creator as to how to go about enforcing it. And as that answer started to unfold in 2009 here we are in 2011 and were still studying it, were still learning details about it. I will tell you for sure that our Creator has a time schedule for all things to be revealed. As the Bible tells you, it will happen and there is a time and that time is coming very close because the enforcement of that secured interest is through the doctrine of trusts and they had no right to interfere with your private property in any way, shape or form and they have a duty to return it to you. Thats part of the law of trusts. I think its something that I read a couple of weeks ago out of the duties of a trustee that upon the termination of the trust or upon the grantors decision to take the property back that the trustee must return whatever trust property that the trustee is holding back either to the creator of the trust or if the creator was to pass on then the beneficiaries which is us, the American people, of this corporate governmental trust that was created by the Constitution they have to return to us, the beneficiaries, any property that theyre holding for us at any time that we demand it. Well, through the security agreement and other documents that weve developedone of those documents is called an Affidavit of Commercial Notice which was a notice in commerce to terminate the commercial registration of that property and return the property to us and theyve refused to do it. Now, weve tried doing that for about eight years and weve just gone up against a stone wall. And the biggest thing we were told by government morons was that were not going to take it out of the records and return the property to you without a court order and I kept looking and looking and how can we go into court and get a court order? What do we need to do?

What do we need to show the court because if we dont go in there with the right stuff, if we go in there half cocked theyre just going to dismiss our case. Were wasting our time unless we do this right. And I kept looking up saying, come on, God, Im getting tired of thiswe need helpcome on, damn it. A lot of Christians would say, you dont cuss at God. Oh yes you do. He hears you. He doesnt care what you said. Believe me, he doesnt care what you said. He will give you the answer when its His time. And finally, he gave us the answer and maybe because I hollered so much and I begged so much for the answer for the benefit of other people and finally hes given it to us. It is in this knowledge and understanding of the public trust and of constructive trusts. That is how you get it back. Now, weve got an interesting case going on, right now, where we sort of had to get a little rough with a lawyer to get him to do a constructive trust. I want to see what happens with that. He didnt want to and Im not sure hes done it right. I dont know what hes done and I wont know until he finally puts the papers into court and then we can go down to the courthouse and get a copy of the papers and see what he did. Im sure hell never give us a copy willingly but you can get them from the court record. [caller] [Howard] Mr. Griswold. Yes.

[caller] Before you do the security agreement do you convey your property back from your trust into your name if you have conveyed it before to a trust to some relative, you convey it back [Howard] No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, you dont have to do that. No. It doesnt matter what name its in. Was it you that bought and paid for it? If youre the one that bought and paid for it even if you put it in a trust of your own, one of your own little private trusts, what you can do is create a secured interest on the trust and whats in it. And Im going to tell you something. A trust is not a safe thing to have unless you have a security interest securing whats in the trust, then it becomes safe. Theres a lot of people out here promoting the idea of putting everything in trusts. Do this with trusts and do that with trusts and theyre charging tremendous amounts of money. Some of them are getting $2500, $3000, $5,000 to create trusts for you. Stay away from those clowns. Theyre way overcharging you. You dont need something like that. [caller] What if I had conveyed the property to my son, do I need to convey it back to my name or I can do it on my sons name? [Howard] You can show that you have an interest in it because you son owes you something back for the property. [caller] Ok, great, thank you.

[Howard] Or what you can do is you can create a secured interest for your son in the property. And he should probably if hes above eighteen years of age and out in the commercial world he should have his own secured interest too and he should get on these

calls and learn something about this. Dave brings it up and talks more about it than I do but Dave is explaining it and getting the details of why you should have one and what its all about more so than I get into it because I keep getting into this advanced study and everything were learning about trusts and Dave keeps backing up on that and repeating it and its a good thing he does because you dont want to forget that. You cant prove you have an interest in the property to go in there and put an argument against them for breaching the trust unless you can prove you have an interest it. So you need the secured interest filed properly in order to prove you have an interest before you can even bring a breach of the trust claim against the property. All this stuff goes hand in glovethey fit together and if you dont have one and dont understand one you cant do the other and youll never understand the other part of it. So need to put a little effort, put your mind to work, think, do a little studying of the stuff we put out, go to the places we tell you to go to and the cases we tell you to go to and read them and build a comprehension in your mind of how this stuff works because the burden in upon you to protect yourself. This government is not protecting you. Its supposed to but it doesnt. Its not to be trusted and yet its a trustisnt that interesting? It is a trust and but its not to be trusted. [Dave] And you start by getting that 48-page information package thats listed at the mail order page at www.peoples-rights.com. Just print out the mail order page and get that 48-page data package with questionnaire blanks for the security agreement/indemnity bond/financing statement. Its only $10 and that covers the photocopy costs and postage for the entire 48-page information that gives you the explanation of how it works and why it works and the documents that back it up that Howard has provided. [Howard] And by the way, that information on how it works is lawyers writings on how it works and why it works and what its for. Its not Daves or my personal opinion because we dont do those kinds of things. If we cant find something in a law text book or in a statutory book or in a court case book we dont put it out. [Dave] . . . [Dave] about. [Howard] Its copies of law review articles written by professors.

Before you end the call, Howard, Ive got one more legal thing to talk Ok.

[Dave] I got some information yesterday on another conference call. Somebody made a suggestion that I think is excellent. You know how for years weve been trying to get the original MSO, manufacturers statement of origin back from the Department of Motor Vehicles or Department of Transportation after the dealership stole it from you when you bought your new car. They failed to provide it. They gave it away and weve never been able to get it back from them. Well, in our researchcorrect me if Im wrong

weve always found that the bill of sale and the cash paid receipt are proof of ownership right? [Howard] Thats correct. As a matter of fact there is a Tennessee Supreme Court case that says that very emphatically. [Dave] Well, lets use that to our advantage. Instead of worrying about collecting or getting back the original manufacturers statement of origin just sell the car from whatever name you now have it in to your next door neighbor or your friend down the street for $10 and then buy it back from him for the same $10 or you might even give him a $5 profit. Give him $15, he sells the car back to you and youve got a bill of sale with a paid cash paid receipt and that is your evidence of ownership if one of those revenue collectors in a hat pulls you over and presumes he has some jurisdictional claim on behalf of the corporation that he works for, State of Pennsylvania or State of Whatever, you say, well, they might have used to have an interest but they never paid me for my interest and since that time that cars been sold and I bought it back from the guy and heres my bill of sale and proof of paid receipt cash paid and that trumps your claim of interest or your claim of right of interest by your corporation, Department of Transportation or Department of Motor Vehicles or Department of licensing and inspection or State of Whatever, Department of Highways, whatever name they call it youve got the Bill of Sale and a cash paid receipt and that trumps whatever they got. Never mind whether its void or valid. They never paid you for it anyway so its a void claim of interest. Their interest in that document that theyve been holding is bogus and your cash paid Bill of Sale trumps any document they may presume to think they have. [Howard] [Dezert] [Howard] That proves that its private property. They will ignore these things. Wouldnt you want to use gold or silver in the exchange? No. Gold or silver is not money. It cant be used for money.

[Dave] Love and other good and valuable considerationyou do not have to itemize what that love and other valuable consideration was. [Howard] [Dezert] Thats right. Got you.

[Howard] Ten dollars and other good and valuable considerationthats all that has to be said. But they will ignore this because the stupid law that the cop has been taught says you have to have a registration. You have to have a license tag. You have to have a drivers license and if you dont were going to arrest you and if you give us any trouble well break the window, drag you out of the car, throw you on the ground, beat you up and then arrest you which is what they did to that 78 year old man that I was talking about earlier but he had done all this paperwork and done exactly what youre talking about with his car and yet they did this to him. These cops need to be prosecuted and if they arent the attorney

generals going to get sued for not prosecuting them. This is what we have to do to accomplish something. We are dealing with programmed little idiots with an education. Some of them have a very high college education but they are programmed little idiots. We have 435 of them in Congress in Washington, D.C. that are programmed little idiots and I just read something to you about a programmed little idiot in Illinois who is moving to Texas because hes angry with how Illinois is doing it wrong but hes going down to Texas and participate in the same wrong at a lower cost. What did he accomplish? He hasnt stopped the problem, has he? [Dave] Hes what big Al would call an imbecilic drone.

[Howard] Ok, I call them programmed idiots. Same idea, I agree with big Al. We are dealing with educated idiots of all kinds or as my little fat neighbor around the corner used to say mo-rons. Some of them are educated mo-ronsquite an interesting little chubby character used to live around the corner from me here. Mo-ronsI dont even know if he could even pronounced moron properlyhe called them mo-rons. But that fits, idiots, morons, imbecilic dronesyeahthats what were dealing with. These people actually believe that theyre doing the right thing. Even police officers believe theyre doing the right thing. Lawyers with what theyre taught in law school actually believe that theyre doing the right thing. These little stupid people that go to work for government and get a job doing some function in government are taught the function and they actually believe that theyre doing the right thing. The only thing thats going to correct or change this is for the American people, the beneficiaries of the public trust to do something to these individuals for breach of the public trust. And what you just explained can only be resolved by filing a complaint to impose the constructive trust and enforce it to protect my private property that I just bought for $10 as you just explained. Finally I think we found the answer to how this is done. Its just going to take an effort on the American peoples part to learn these things and do them. If you have no respect for yourself and your private property, guess what, you deserve what you get. And you know what, with a prayer to our Creator will eventually come out on top and we will get by doing this. There may be people dropping by the wayside because of finances not being enough to keep things going but somebody will keep going. Somehow things will continue to progress in the direction theyre going in because this is a time for things to be revealed and righteousness to be brought forth. Itll take time. Its not going to happen in the click of a finger in case youre anxious. Its going to take time and its going to take effort. History has shown in the past many, many different times in the history of the world that these problems like this have developed in different nations of the world, mostly the Babylonian nations. This country happens to be the seventh and final Babylonian nation. It will be destroyed from within. It will self-destruct. But it will take the effort of the people to expose the wrongs and the evil and bring it to a halt. We have to do it. It is up to us. If we dont do anything then, like I said before, you deserve what youre getting.