Professional Documents
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TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
TRANSCRIPT IN CONFIDENCE
5 O/N 138069
PARRAMATTA REGISTRY
10
DUNKLEY FM
15
20
<SURNAME>
and
PARRAMATTA
30
10.58 AM, THURSDAY, 26 NOVEMBER 2009
Copyright in Transcript is owned by the Commonwealth of Australia. Apart from any use permitted under the
Copyright Act 1968 you are not permitted to reproduce, adapt, re-transmit or distribute the Transcript material
in any form or by any means without seeking prior written approval from the Family Court of Australia.
HIS HONOUR: No, you can just come in and have a seat, or you can not participate
at all. It’s a matter for yourself.
10MR <SURNAME>: I’ll do so if you agree that all my inalienable rights are intact,
sir.
15MR <SURNAME>: You don’t agree that I have my inalienable rights intact, sir?
HIS HONOUR: No, I don’t. It’s a matter for you as to whether you want to
participate or not, so if you do want to participate, come and have a seat at the bar
table.
20
MR <SURNAME>: I will do so, sir, if you agree that I have all my inalienable
rights intact.
HIS HONOUR: Call Mrs <SURNAME>. It’s all recorded, sir. You don’t need to.
You can get copies of the transcript. It’s all on record. Mrs <SURNAME>, is she
coming in?
35
MR <SURNAME>: I haven’t seen her, David.
HIS HONOUR: Good, thank you. Ms Bevan, are you appearing for the respondent
today?
10MR <SURNAME>: No, sir. I will have a seat when you agree I have all my
inalienable rights intact.
HIS HONOUR: Ms Bevan, do you rely on the amended response filed 21 April
2008?
15
MS BEVAN: Your Honour, I have a minute of order to hand up - - -
20MS BEVAN: - - - which varies that. I’m not sure whether you received my case
outline?
25MS BEVAN: There is one additional order on this minute of order in relation to an
account in Jersey.
HIS HONOUR: All right. Thank you. Can I have that? Now, the Jersey account,
where do I find about that?
30
MS BEVAN: Sorry?
MS BEVAN: Yes.
MS BEVAN: November.
5
HIS HONOUR: November, and a financial statement which was sworn on 20
November.
15HIS HONOUR: Now, Mr <SURNAME>, there was filed for you an application for
final orders on 3 December 2007 and there was also filed on that day an affidavit that
you swore on 13 June 2008 and a financial statement that you swore on 28
November 2007, and there don’t appear to be any updating documents since then.
Are you relying on any other documents?
20
MR <SURNAME>: I am not relying on any other documents to do with the
Australian Federal Magistrates Court.
HIS HONOUR: It’s a matter for you as to whether you keep standing. So those
35documents aren’t relied on by you. If that’s the case, then you won’t have any
documentation before the court.
HIS HONOUR: Well, it’s a matter that you either give me the documents now or
the case would proceed on an undefended basis.
45MR <SURNAME>: You have no right to proceed with the case on an undefended
basis, David. I have submitted my claim of right to the Queen, the Prime Minister,
the Attorney-General and the Governor-General, and they have consented by
HIS HONOUR: Yes. Well, sir, you are an intelligent man and you know that that’s
5a nonsense.
MR <SURNAME>: Well, if that is a nonsense, David, you are going to have to sign
an affidavit under full penalty of perjury, full commercial liability, to say that it is a
nonsense. Are you willing to sign such an affidavit?
10
HIS HONOUR: No. I have just said that it is a nonsense. Now - - -
MR <SURNAME>: Well, what you say doesn’t matter. What matters is what you
are prepared to put on affidavit, David.
15
HIS HONOUR: All right. So there is no documents on which you seek to rely?
MR <SURNAME>: I have documents on which I seek to rely, but you have not
agreed to the contract that I can enter the court room with my inalienable rights
20intact.
HIS HONOUR: Sir, you either hand me the documents now or the matter proceeds
on an undefended basis.
25MR <SURNAME>: Well, if you proceed with the matter on an undefended basis,
David, I will charge you one million ounces of gold for enforcing an adjudication
process on me that I have not consented to as a sovereign.
35HIS HONOUR: All right. Thank you. Then the matter proceeds undefended.
MR <SURNAME>: Well, you will be charged one million ounces of gold for doing
this, David. Do you agree to that charge?
MR <SURNAME>: Thank you for agreeing to the bill, David. Your audience here
may wish to know why is it that a man cannot enter the court room with his
inalienable rights intact?
45
HIS HONOUR: The audience here observes that you are already within the court
room, sir. All right. Then, Ms Bevan, you better address me in respect of how we
MS BEVAN: In relation to the Black & Kellner and Weir & Weir principles, my
10case is that the husband, by failing to disclose his assets, has left the court in a
situation where, as those cases say, you should not be unduly cautious in making an
adverse – finding in favour of the innocent party.
HIS HONOUR: Well, they can’t be because, I mean, this is the venue for the
hearing, isn’t it?
25MS BEVAN: It is, and this is the appropriate jurisdiction, in my submission, your
Honour. Your Honour, there is also emails from the husband in which he makes
reference to having removed certain amounts of money, such as 7000 and 10,000
Euro out of the jurisdiction, that being the jurisdiction of Ireland.
30HIS HONOUR: All right. Well, you had better tender that material.
MS BEVAN: Thank you, your Honour. I have on the front of it a list of those
documents. I estimate that it will take approximately an hour to read. However, I
can indicate that in relation to the husband’s emails, although it is certainly outside of
35the usual practice, those emails are quite lengthy and I have put highlights around the
relevant sections. I don’t ask you to read the whole of the emails, but simply those
highlighted sections.
HIS HONOUR: So the material that is produced in the ringback folder, you are
40seeking to tender that. Is that - - -
HIS HONOUR: All right. On that basis don’t you consent to the tender of the
documents?
10
MR <SURNAME>: I don’t consent to the tender of the documents on the basis that
I have not been given the opportunity to enter the court with all my inalienable rights
intact.
15HIS HONOUR: That’s not a legal basis for the tender not to proceed, sir.
MR <SURNAME>: That’s the lawful basis for the tender not to proceed, David.
HIS HONOUR: And on the basis that there is no objection that is sustainable at
law, I mark as exhibit A the material in a ringback folder.
25
MS BEVAN: Would you prefer to have my submissions or after you have read - - -
HIS HONOUR: All right. We will adjourn while I go off and read.
40
ADJOURNED [10.20 am]
HIS HONOUR: All right. Do you want to do that now, thank you.
10MR <SURNAME>: I would love to do that now, David, as long as you will agree
that I can enter between these two gates with all my inalienable rights intact. In
particular, my property rights.
HIS HONOUR: Yes, all right. So if you are going to produce, produce them now
15please.
MR <SURNAME>: When you said, “Yes, all right,” do you mean that I may enter
with my property rights and my inalienable rights intact please, David?
HIS HONOUR: No. Are you going to produce some documents in answer to the
25notice to produce?
HIS HONOUR: All right. I take it that means that you are not producing.
35
MR <SURNAME>: And I note for the audience that David has refused to answer
the question, is his oath in the court room today?
10MS BEVAN: It’s only the upper part of that email I ask you to read, your Honour.
HIS HONOUR: Thank you. Then I mark as exhibit B the email from Sarah Bevan
dated 25 November 2009 to SBA Mail.
25
EXHIBIT #B EMAIL FROM SARAH BEVAN TO SBA MAIL DATED
25/11/2009
30HIS HONOUR: Mr <SURNAME>, there is a letter from the Royal Bank of Canada
to Mrs J. <SURNAME> dated 20 March 2008 that is sought to be tendered. Do you
want to be heard about that?
HIS HONOUR: Then there being no objection, I mark as exhibit C the letter from
40the Royal Bank of Canada dated 20 March 2008 to Mrs J <SURNAME>.
HIS HONOUR: And then there is some emails to a xxxxxxxxx. Who is that
person?
10
MS BEVAN: There was only one to Bruce and that’s the accountant, your Honour.
HIS HONOUR: And there was some emails directed to a Bill xxxxxx, x-x-x-x.
25HIS HONOUR: Son. Fair enough, I gathered as much. All right. Yes, all right,
then your submissions.
MS BEVAN: Thank you, your Honour. The orders my client seeks effects, when
one takes into account the add backs included, and in that regard, your Honour, I
30should have an amended case outline which I should have handed up earlier. There
are only some minor amendments on it which I have underlined - - -
HIS HONOUR: That’s the money that was transferred when the - - -
MS BEVAN: And the net is underlined on the two last pages, your Honour.
HIS HONOUR: Still have to plead it as a contribution that comes in on his side of
the - - -
20MS BEVAN: You do, your Honour, and I will address you on contributions in that
respect when I get to it, but given that the husband has not put any evidence with
regard to the amount of the loan or the interest on the loan or the terms of repayment,
and also given the nature of his emails as contained in the tendered exhibit A, my
submission is that this is not a loan and should not be treated as a loan of the parties.
25In fact, it’s just simply a contribution issue that I will come back to.
MS BEVAN: Your Honour, in relation to the Black & Kellner considerations, you
30have before you emails from the husband where he refers to removing 7000 Euro out
of the jurisdiction. He also refers to paying that amount to a colleague in Germany,
as he says. You also have the email, exhibit B, which refers to him removing 10,000
Euro, he says to apply it for the sake of the family. My client’s evidence says
different and in fact my client’s evidence is the only sworn evidence you have before
35you, your Honour.
In addition, your Honour, there was also what I would submit was a very significant
asset, that being the company, Instant Business Intelligence. My client’s evidence is
clear that that business traded well, afforded them a very decent income.
40
HIS HONOUR: I don’t have any figures about it, do I? Don’t have any.
45HIS HONOUR: And there is no profit and loss statements, there is no taxation
returns.
MS BEVAN: But in any event, there is no means by which that this court can say,
“I consider it had, or at some stage, a value of X.” That - - -
10HIS HONOUR: I mean it could have – it could simply just be a trading company
that they conducted a business out of. It had no other intrinsic value of its own.
MS BEVAN: It could, your Honour, but it also could have been a significant asset
itself. Tied in with the company is a reference, the husband makes in various emails,
to the software.
20
HIS HONOUR: Yes.
MS BEVAN: That he has software and, on one of his emails, refers to, “No court
can force me to sell my software.”
25
HIS HONOUR: Sure.
Your Honour, in respect of the add backs, it is my submission that where you have in
40effect concessions by the husband that those amounts have been removed for his own
purpose, have not been expended, on my client’s evidence, for the sake of the family,
but presumably have been used for his own personal purposes or simply, as he says,
paid to someone else, that being a colleague in Germany, then the appropriate course
is to treat those as add backs rather than as some sort of wastage consideration under
45Kabaly. Your Honour, in relation to – actually I will come back to the Kabaly issue
later, your Honour. In relation to those add backs, there is then the consideration of
whether they are to be treated as an asset rather than – under section 75(2)(o).
MS BEVAN: Sorry?
MS BEVAN: Yes. However, that is mitigated by the fact, your Honour, that my
client received child support from the children’s father and they were only resident
with the parties for a limited part of the marriage. The other factor, your Honour, is
20the gift from his brother. He said it’s a loan, but as my submissions – as submissions
made earlier, it’s appropriate to be treated as a gift. My client’s evidence is that it’s
an amount of $15,000 that was advanced very early in the relationship. On the basis
of it being a relatively limited amount and the amount of time and the nature of the
contributions that have flowed since that time, my submission is it would really have
25little, if any, weight pursuant to Pierce & Pierce type considerations, your Honour.
On the contrary, your Honour, my client has made significant post separation
contributions and I should add, when I am jumping to post separation, apart from
those two factors that I have just mentioned, I would say that the contributions during
30the marriage would generally be considered 50/50. The husband was the bread
winner, my client was the carer of the children and the domestic duties. She did that
and that is how the parties organised their lives. It’s a clear case where, apart from
these other factors, it would otherwise be a 50/50 case, your Honour.
MS BEVAN: Since separation, my client has continued to care for the children and
has continued to make all payments for the care of the children. She has given
evidence that in caring for the children she must pay private school fees and she is
40now also supporting Josephine, the older child, who is now at university.
MS BEVAN: Sorry?
45
HIS HONOUR: She is over 18.
MS BEVAN: I will come back to her in relation to section 75(2) though, your
10Honour. In addition, the contributions that my client has made post separation, in my
submission, have been made more onerous by the conduct of the husband. The
husband has embarked on a course of conduct which was designed – I withdraw that.
The husband has embarked on a course of conduct which has had a significantly
negative effect on my client. She says in her affidavit that she has received an
15extraordinary amount of emails from the husband and on that point, your Honour, I
must correct one point in my client’s affidavit. She says she has received what
numbers in the thousands. Since swearing the affidavit, she has taken the arduous
task of actually counting those that she still has, not knowing if any were deleted
when the husband accessed her account, and she has counted 550.
20
That doesn’t include the emails sent by the husband to various friends and colleagues
and family members. Whatever the number, whether it’s 550 or in the thousands, it
is an extraordinary number of emails all taking a very particular approach and all –
the combined effect must have an effect on my client. Your Honour, you don’t have
25it in evidence, but my client instructs me today that she has been in counselling for
18 months – she has now concluded that counselling – in order to deal with the
treatment she has had at the hands of the husband. Your Honour, as you will be
aware, Kennon & Kennon gives authority to where – in circumstances where there
has been domestic violence, but not only domestic violence, also other conduct
30which is not limited by description, the factors such as those should warrant a
consideration of weighting the contributions in favour of the – essentially the victim,
your Honour.
If ever a case fell into the category of conduct which is designed to, or which has led
35to making the innocent party have a more onerous job in doing their day to day life,
this is the case. Your Honour, the number of those emails, the nature of those
emails, the widespread nature of those emails, can only have an effect on my client.
Admittedly you don’t have expert evidence before you, but, in my submission, it is a
very clear cut case that by simple common sense the effect of those must have had on
40my client. Your Honour, in relation to the section 75(2) factors, my submission is
that there would be a very weighty adjustment in my client’s favour. If we started
from a proposition of a 55/45 contribution, my submission would be that it would be
appropriate to adjust, perhaps even up to 40 per cent in my client’s favour.
Your Honour, in addition my client has the care of the younger child of the marriage;
she is under 16. As her evidence says, she is required to pay private school fees for
15him and also maintain him in the usual way. In addition, subsection (d) refers to the
commitment to support others, as does subsection (e). She has given evidence that
she is paying Josephine’s university fees. As someone on a student permit, she has
limited work rights and therefore limited ability to support herself. In addition, your
Honour, subsection (k) refers to the effect of marriage on the earning capacity of a
20party. My client gives evidence that throughout the marriage, from very shortly after
the younger child’s birth, by agreement she was the one looking after the children.
She was the one who stayed home and devoted herself to the care of the children in
the house and effectively enabled the husband to go out and earn the amounts of
25money that he did, which then puts him in good stead to earn similar amounts of
money now.
30MS BEVAN: What he earned. In my client’s affidavit, your Honour, there is some
evidence.
35MS BEVAN: There is a bit of limited evidence, but you have it before you in
paragraphs 55 and 56. It’s within her knowledge to make those statements and
therefore, as the only evidence you have in this matter, my submission is that it’s
strong evidence that you are able to rely on, your Honour. She says that the
company paid the husband between six and 8000 Euro a month and that the company
40earned 220-odd thousand dollars in consulting fees and an additional amount in
software sales. Coming back to the effect of the marriage on my client’s earning
capacity, the absence for her from the workforce for such a length of time can only
have a negative effect on her earning capacity.
MS BEVAN: Your Honour, the husband has engaged in conduct that I would
submit falls within the Kabaly principles in relation to two items: that being the
company. If your Honour accepts or is willing to make a finding that it may well
15have had a value, then the husband’s actions since separation have led it to now be
dissolved and for it to have no value, one would assume, at all. In addition, your
Honour has evidence about the actions the husband took in relation to the controlled
moneys account. The sale proceeds from the sale of the Pennant Hills property were
pursuant to orders of 16 June 2008 to be placed into controlled moneys account.
20
HIS HONOUR: Well, the best that they can get for that would be something like
about 2 or 3 per cent, isn’t it?
MS BEVAN: In a cash management account – it now has gone up, but previously
25which relates to most of the period – would be about 3 per cent. By my calculations,
being that it’s approximately six months, it would be around about four and a half
thousand dollars. Your Honour, there is very clear evidence from the husband’s
emails in respect of the controlled moneys, I can say that there was an attempt by my
client to have the registrar sign the required documents pursuant to section 106A.
30There was a difficulty in that regard as a result of the notation made by Judicial
Registrar Johnston that the agreement that Watts McCray would ....., the husband’s
former lawyers, was a notation only. That was therefore unsuccessful, your Honour.
HIS HONOUR: That probably puts it to an end. If it’s a notation only – I mean I
will have to look at that.
40
MS BEVAN: It’s unfortunate that in what happened, it was only a notation.
45MS BEVAN: There was certainly no issue at the time and it wasn’t – that particular
part wasn’t drafted as consent orders. It was added by Judicial Registrar Johnston.
Your Honour, returning lastly to justice and equity in respect of the property issues,
That the husband has presented with that attitude should leave the court no concerns
10as to failing the husband in terms of providing him justice and equity. Your Honour,
there are two additional orders sought that have only lately been sought in respect of
parenting. Your Honour, that is sole parental responsibility and an issue about the
passport. While sole parental responsibility should cover a passport, it is certainly
my experience in the past with other clients that the passport office doesn’t
15necessarily accept a sole parental responsibility order.
MS BEVAN: He does, your Honour. Your Honour, there has been no section 60I
certificate. My submission is that this is a matter where mediation is – that the
25requirement for mediation should be waived because of the simple impracticality of
it. Your Honour, the husband – the only evidence I am relying on to support the sole
parental responsibility is the husband’s own emails where he refers to the children as
his former children and also makes a comment of “the leeches called wife and
children.” The husband himself has disowned the children. I can say to your Honour
30that those two emails that I provided are not the only emails in that regard; there are
numerous emails. I didn’t see any point in tendering all of those relevant emails,
your Honour. Your Honour, those are my submissions. I do have an application in
respect of costs though.
35HIS HONOUR: Well, I am going to reserve so you will have to come back in
respect of that. Mr <SURNAME>, are there any submissions that you want to
make?
HIS HONOUR: No, no. What happens here, Mr <SURNAME>, is that all
45proceedings in this court are recorded.
MR <SURNAME>: Okay. So for on the record, David, are you operating under
your oath today?
MR <SURNAME>: For and on the record, David, are you operating under your
5oath today?
HIS HONOUR: I take it that therefore you have no submissions that you wish to
make.
10MR <SURNAME>: So let the record show that a sovereign, Peter xxxxxxxxxxxx
<SURNAME>, has asked David twice, is he operating under his oath today, and
David has refused to answer is he operating under oath, and it’s my contention that
he is operating as a private employee and therefore has no jurisdiction over my
common law property rights.
15
HIS HONOUR: There being no submissions, then I reserve my decision. I will
deliver written judgment on a date to be advised.
30
MATTER ADJOURNED at 11.28 am INDEFINITELY