#Meded Twitter Chat 30 June 2011 UK/EU

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript
01/07/2011 21:20
#meded
Healthcare Hashtag Twitter Transcript
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amcunningham
@glittrgirl you going to join us for #meded chat?

Thu Jun 30 12:58:39 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@amcunningham I'm here watching. #meded ;)

Thu Jun 30 12:59:25 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@drsuparnadas thank you for taking the time! this story is one of the worst http://bit.ly/kSCA42 #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:00:19 PDT 2011
amcunningham
Hello everyone! Welcome to everyone joining in and looking in on tonight's #meded chat. Please say who you are and where you are:)
Thu Jun 30 13:01:12 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@D_Rodders this is what tonight's #meded chat is about -portfolios and competency http://bit.ly/lVTGsJ
Thu Jun 30 13:02:09 PDT 2011
topknife1
#meded @topknife1 Scott surgical reg northern ireland

Thu Jun 30 13:02:17 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
DJ, Anaesthetics Reg, Wales. #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:03:05 PDT 2011
nlafferty
Hi #meded - Natalie here in Dundee, elearning lead and dare I say it looking at possible e-portfolio tools for our undergraduates
Thu Jun 30 13:03:22 PDT 2011
amcunningham
RT @silv24: #meded Hi, I am Natalie a foundation year one doctor from Warwickshire
Thu Jun 30 13:03:43 PDT 2011
MykelO
#meded Pharmacist Lancashire.

Thu Jun 30 13:05:10 PDT 2011
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amcunningham
If you haven't seen it yet here is the much-commented blog post on porrtfolios and competency - thanks++ http://bit.ly/j2gzhC #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:05:10 PDT 2011
DrShock
head of residency training and medical education for psychiatry #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:05:13 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@DrShock Hello - good to have you on tonight's #meded chat

Thu Jun 30 13:05:35 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
RS, Fourth year med student, SW London #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:05:53 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
Previously consultant anasthetist and medical educator. Now run my own outfit for business education in healthcare #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:05:54 PDT 2011
thefourthcraw
@amcunningham #meded Mike, Paeds SpR, East Midlands

Thu Jun 30 13:06:04 PDT 2011
NHS_GP
PB, GP in the midlands. #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:06:43 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
#meded Suzanne Hardy, non clinical senior advisor for the HEA subject centre for med, dent and vet UG education in the UK
Thu Jun 30 13:06:45 PDT 2011
amcunningham
And since that post has 41 comments here are a few quick thoughts from me on some of the main themes http://bit.ly/lVTGsJ #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:06:48 PDT 2011
MykelO
Michael a pharmacist looking in and watching to your comments. Blackpool, Lancashire. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:07:21 PDT 2011
DrShock
competence education only usefull to my opinion during clerkship and than still somewhat premature #meded just my 50 cents ;-)
Thu Jun 30 13:07:54 PDT 2011
vmcombs
RT @ElinSilveous: Study Finds Error Rates Similar for Electronic, Handwritten Rx http://t.co/ivFuYCm #MedErrors #HCQ #HIT #MedEd
Thu Jun 30 13:07:58 PDT 2011
amcunningham
I know that many of you have commented on the post already- I'd like to kick of by asking were you surprised at depth of feeling? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:08:24 PDT 2011
catherineleng
Catherine, 3rd yr medic, London #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:09:07 PDT 2011
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topknife1
#meded no surprise. Would have commented if had time. Main issue is competence vs excellence
Thu Jun 30 13:09:53 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
No, it only takes a quick look at the DNUK Forums to see how hated the current system is by end users. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:10:07 PDT 2011
bw58
RT @amcunningham: Hello everyone! Welcome to everyone joining in and looking in on tonight's #meded chat. Please say who you are and where you are:)
Thu Jun 30 13:10:26 PDT 2011
DrShock
@topknife1 main issue feedback versus competence #meded?

Thu Jun 30 13:10:55 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
helped design and implement ePorfolio at our medical school #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:11:13 PDT 2011
topknife1
#meded box ticking exercises for most part that do not discriminate good from bad.
Thu Jun 30 13:11:49 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
Appearance on the blog is that the introducers of portfolios genuinely believe it to be a good thing; this is not felt by end users #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:12:21 PDT 2011
amcunningham
I wasn't suprised either ... hoping this discussion can generate some light along with the heat:) #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:12:32 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
Portfolios are about reflection and developing life long learning skills IMHO #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:12:38 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@welsh_gas_doc I'm not sure that we have many comments from introducers apart from @Neil_Mehta in UK... maybe @drsuparnadas ? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:13:08 PDT 2011
mdTalk
competence education only usefull to my opinion during clerkship and than still somewhat premature #meded... http://bit.ly/lstJj8
Thu Jun 30 13:13:11 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@Neil_Mehta does conflation with competency in UK undermine this aim? #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:13:43 PDT 2011
topknife1
@DrShock #meded surgical portfolios aim to pick up poor performers. Poor performance easily hidden in portfolio with careful assessor choice
Thu Jun 30 13:13:48 PDT 2011
silv24
The idea of a portfolio is a good one but I have my reservations about the current foundation programme portfolio that I use #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:13:59 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@Neil_Mehta interesting that u, as end-user, were involved in th design of ePage 3 of 29
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drsuparnadas
portfolio. Were any end-users involved in design in UK? #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:14:01 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
Am not familiar with UK system enough to understand negative feelings/resistance #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:14:46 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@amcunningham @welsh_gas_doc @neil_mehta @drsuparnadas does it depend how they are incorporated into the curriculum? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:14:59 PDT 2011
DrDLittle
RT @silv24: The idea of a portfolio is a good one but I have my reservations about the current foundation programme portfolio that I use #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:14:59 PDT 2011
amcunningham
I want to flag-up that the Foundation programme should be aware of problems with assessment given MEE evaluation last October #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:15:05 PDT 2011
nlafferty
What e-portfolios system is used in England - is the NHS Education Scotland one? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:15:14 PDT 2011
MykelO
I am disturbed to see some I have signed off as competent later being poor and having no way of commenting or revisting my opinion. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:15:22 PDT 2011
PatParslow
Some people tell me blog posts do not create meaningful dialogue. Read @amcunningham's post http://bit.ly/j2gzhC #meded and tell me that!
Thu Jun 30 13:15:30 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@nlafferty yes, NHS Scotland seems to be used in England and Wales... #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:15:35 PDT 2011
amcunningham
RT @PatParslow: Some people tell me blog posts do not create meaningful dialogue. Read @amcunningham's post http://bit.ly/j2gzhC #meded and tell me that!
Thu Jun 30 13:16:09 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
http://pages.citebite.com/l8l2r6m9jegv this is comment from one of our students #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:16:15 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@patlockley Yes have thought about Wordpress as an e-portfolio thingy - infact 1 of our sutdents @pendy41 thinking of using it #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:16:28 PDT 2011
CHAHEC
RT @LindaP_MD: "[I] am rarely commended for choosing primary care" http://t.co/gHaH4IH via @PhysiciansPract #meded #primarycare
Thu Jun 30 13:16:31 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
The portfolio as a private development tool is a good thing; using it as a stick to beat trainees with at ARCP causes resent for it #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:16:33 PDT 2011
DrShock
@topknife1 meded is about knowledge, skills don't need portfolio, competencies is

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DrShock
more for residency training or adult education #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:16:34 PDT 2011
chebbes
@welsh_gas_doc #meded A reflective learning cycle should be valuable,people do it without thinking but become resistant when it is explicit
Thu Jun 30 13:16:41 PDT 2011
amcunningham
RT @welsh_gas_doc: The portfolio as a private development tool is a good thing; using it as a stick to beat trainees with at ARCP causes resent for it #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:16:47 PDT 2011
DrDLittle
I agree with @topknife1 my experience of foundation e-portfolio was of a tick box exercise resented by trainees #MedEd
Thu Jun 30 13:16:48 PDT 2011
thefourthcraw
@amcunningham #meded Willing to bet that a lot of portfolio writing gets done in week before RITA/ARCP.
Thu Jun 30 13:17:15 PDT 2011
nlafferty
Is the consensus that the NES e-portfolio is too clunky for both students and assessors #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:17:37 PDT 2011
amcunningham
How can portfolios work best as development tools? What needs to happen? Who needs to be involved? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:17:37 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
@drsuparnadas not sure what you mean by end-user? I don't review the portfolios. That is done by advisors in formative manner #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:17:38 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
I fear competences and portfolios are just another sign of fall in intellectual rigour in #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:17:47 PDT 2011
chebbes
@welsh_gas_doc #meded So...how to retain the benefits and perform some kind of assessment without interfering with the process
Thu Jun 30 13:17:59 PDT 2011
silv24
The foundation programme portfolio is difficult to navigate and use & has far too much on it. Often left feeling frustrated using it #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:18:01 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@drsuparnadas @neil_mehta users were heavily (and still are) with design and implementation of ePET portfolio at Newcastle, UK #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:18:02 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
@chebbes I do reflect, I reflect often. I don't feel comfortable writing it down on paper to show to strangers though. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:18:15 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@amcunningham @welsh_gas_doc @Neil_Mehta No wasn't introducer in UK. But can understand frustrn of end-user if not involved in design #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:18:15 PDT 2011
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amcunningham
@nlafferty several have mentioned the clunkiness- but I don't think it would be fair to say that is the main issue... #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:18:19 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
@amcunningham Expect change? My med school Principal was on that board, WBPAs here have increased! #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:18:20 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
forget #statistics, forget #biochemistry -just tick boxes #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:18:55 PDT 2011
DrShock
@david_colquhoun agree, experience in holland has shown this with higher vocational education #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:19:14 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
We first did a pilot portfolio on paper - used it for a year and got feedback for all stakeholders before making it ePortfolio #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:19:23 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
RT @david_colquhoun: forget #statistics, forget #biochemistry -just tick boxes #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:19:35 PDT 2011
silv24
Also does feel like you are ticking boxes rather than actually progressing through your training #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:19:40 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
Thu Jun 30 13:19:50 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@amcunningham Appreciate clunkiness not main issue - but usability is important none the less and too often overlooked #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:19:56 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
#meded would eportfolio integration with other educational platforms help? Ie not having to 'go somewhere else'?
Thu Jun 30 13:20:02 PDT 2011
silv24
RT @welsh_gas_doc: @chebbes I do reflect, I reflect often. I don't feel comfortable writing it down on paper to show to strangers though. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:20:10 PDT 2011
distmeded
I've been using a #mahara installation for #meded portfolio implementation. Need to change faculty culture. #mahara is very good.
Thu Jun 30 13:20:11 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
The Portfolio is the med professions equivalent of Mao's Cultural revolution detainees given diaries to write down their faults! #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:20:20 PDT 2011
stuboo
APB: Hard working 4th year medical student seeks ObGyn rotation (08/02 - 08/26). #seriously #obgyn #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:20:23 PDT 2011
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amcunningham
Here's an account of someone who kept a 'portfolio' purely for private use... http://bit.ly/l9HKrE - would you? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:20:32 PDT 2011
topknife1
#meded portfolios have replaced traditional methods of assessment partic at arcpso instead of conc on good care/performance we tick boxes
Thu Jun 30 13:20:35 PDT 2011
silv24
@welsh_gas_doc I am the same, never reflect on the most important events on the eportfolio because it is far too personal #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:20:37 PDT 2011
DrShock
@amcunningham the main issue being is it worth our while #meded does it improve meded? Is meded about competency or knowledge and skills
Thu Jun 30 13:20:39 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@distmeded interesting you think mahara good, as one med school dropped after 6 months because students found too complicated #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:21:02 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
That is not how to test interventions RT @Neil_Mehta: - used it for a year and got feedback for all stakeholders #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:21:07 PDT 2011
DrDLittle
What is the point of having an e-portfolio if at ST interviews for example, you are expected to have paper copy? Need to consolidate #MedEd
Thu Jun 30 13:21:11 PDT 2011
chebbes
@welsh_gas_doc #meded I agree.And arguably we should look at endpoints clinical performance rather than enforced reflection.
Thu Jun 30 13:21:32 PDT 2011
ambulancemandan
#meded Dan, Paramedic and Mentor, mostly viewing as on shift, but do have portfolio views...
Thu Jun 30 13:21:38 PDT 2011
distmeded
Reflection is more than just writing faults @welsh_gas_doc, writing is a way to clarify thoughts. #meded #portfolio
Thu Jun 30 13:21:49 PDT 2011
amcunningham
Meant to write in my summary post that integration between undergrad and postgrad is essential to stop waste of time #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:22:03 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@DrShock @topknife1 what about 'attitudes' in addition to 'knowledge' and 'skills'? Surely reflective practice helps attitudes? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:22:15 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@silv24 @welsh_gas_doc #meded don't you have the facility to keep reflections private? Should not always be public.
Thu Jun 30 13:22:16 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
And breaches DC#s rule #1 "never trust anyone who used the word stakeholder" RT @Neil_Mehta: got feedback for all stakeholders #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:22:18 PDT 2011
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alijmbacon
#meded - eportfolios fail for me because they actually make it very difficult to capture poor performance...
Thu Jun 30 13:22:27 PDT 2011
keirshiels
The portfolio system necessitates reactive not proactive experience. F1s wait around in EAU in April to do an NG Tube instead of work #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:22:42 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@welsh_gas_doc yes quite agree that portfolios should not be used in a punitive way #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:22:45 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
@distmeded It doesn't have to be written down though, does it? #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:22:47 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
@david_colquhoun can you please explain? Why should we not do a pilot? what is wrong with stakeholders? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:23:19 PDT 2011
amcunningham
Does writing add to the quality of reflection? Some feel that not everything can be codified? Gaming may result. #meded @distmeded
Thu Jun 30 13:23:37 PDT 2011
silv24
@glittrgirl @welsh_gas_doc we do but I prefer not to have to write my thoughts down in such a structured way, I reflect differently #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:23:44 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Reflection = fruitless naval gazing (loved by homeopaths) RT @drsuparnadas: @DrShock @topknife1 reflective practice helps attitudes? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:24:17 PDT 2011
silv24
@DrDLittle @glittrgirl @welsh_gas_doc yes but you do get scored on your reflective diary!! #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:24:40 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@silv24 @welsh_gas_doc I agree different learning styles should be accommodated #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:24:48 PDT 2011
distmeded
@welsh_gas_doc - I believe that writing clarifies thoughts more than just "thinking". Words provide structure. Writing to think. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:25:02 PDT 2011
iamdoctord
RT @DrDLittle: I agree with @topknife1 my experience of foundation e-portfolio was of a tick box exercise resented by trainees #MedEd
Thu Jun 30 13:25:05 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@silv24 scored? how so? do you get a numeric grade at end? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:25:06 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
"Quick, I need to think of something to reflect on" I heard said in the Mess last week. Defeats the object of the whole thing! #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:25:47 PDT 2011
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glittrgirl
@silv24 @drdlittle @welsh_gas_doc how would you prefer to reflect if not via a portfolio? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:25:57 PDT 2011
silv24
@amcunningham scored on the quality of your reflective diary, can't remember the exact way it is worded but it is there #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:26:00 PDT 2011
amcunningham
I can see that philosophical differences underlie much of discussion around portfolios... what is nature of knowledge? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:26:03 PDT 2011
dr_dyb
If fy portfolio had 30-40 clear targets would be much more useful. Combined clin/ed supervisors too busy to r/v 3 ppl 4x block. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:26:19 PDT 2011
thefourthcraw
@glittrgirl #meded The opposite extreme is what (some of?) the psychiatrists do weekly, hour-long sessions with their Ed. Supervisors
Thu Jun 30 13:26:47 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@glittrgirl how do you reflect? #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:26:48 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@DrShock Competencies are typically categorised as knowledge, skills and attitudes as per Bloom's taxonomy of learning #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:26:48 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Read Ben Goldacre and learn some statistics http://bit.ly/l9byAA RT @Neil_Mehta: Why should we not do a pilot #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:27:18 PDT 2011
huw_penylan
#meded nes eportfolio very clunky. Made worse by slow hospital IT systems. Makes whole process v frustrating
Thu Jun 30 13:27:31 PDT 2011
dr_dyb
@welsh_gas_doc also reflecting needs a certain knowledge and experience base thus slightly useless at fy level except for practice #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:27:41 PDT 2011
tobyhillman
RT @welsh_gas_doc: The portfolio as a private development tool is a good thing; using it as a stick to beat trainees with at ARCP causes resent for it #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:27:43 PDT 2011
nlafferty
#meded heard 1 of our tutors say they'd read more meaningful reflection on elective expereince by 1 of our st (cont) http://deck.ly/~JGu2d
Thu Jun 30 13:27:44 PDT 2011
distmeded
While thinking about reflective writing in #portfolio learning, I really liked Coyler's thoughts http://bit.ly/ix1Vba #meded @welsh_gas_doc
Thu Jun 30 13:27:50 PDT 2011
DrShock
@topknife1 agree that's why some become pathologists, surgeosn or intenists, competencies and eportfolio is something for residency #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:28:06 PDT 2011
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markhawker
@amcunningham Here's a post on epistemology and types of knowledge. http://bit.ly/l64EB9 #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:28:09 PDT 2011
DrDLittle
#MedEd @amcunningham and competence... Are we talking a minimum acceptable standard and if so, is that really what we should be aiming for?
Thu Jun 30 13:28:19 PDT 2011
silv24
@topknife1 @amcunningham part of how we are scored along with clinical supervisors report etc, had an impact on my F2 application #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:28:41 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Is it a coincidence that most alt med nonsense in med courses comes from directors of #meded?
Thu Jun 30 13:28:46 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@amcunningham two blogs :) one for work, one personal, and on twitter :) you? Best reflection via dialogue imho #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:28:49 PDT 2011
distmeded
@nlatterty - what medical school dropped mahara after six months? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:28:59 PDT 2011
ElinSilveous
MT @OHSUNews: OHSU is one of 27 leaders in #LGBT healthcare equality according to @HRC report http://ow.ly/5u9sY @hrc #equality #MedEd
Thu Jun 30 13:29:03 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@distmeded hmm interesting Colyar is writing about becoming a scholar/researcher not a practitioner. agree? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:29:23 PDT 2011
silv24
@glittrgirl @DrDLittle @welsh_gas_doc I reflect everyday, I don't need to write it down. Even talking through things is reflecting #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:29:43 PDT 2011
ambulancemandan
@welsh_gas_doc: "Quick, I need to think of something to reflect on" Yep, have had experience of similar! #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:30:16 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
@david_colquhoun thanks for the response. The linked page does not apply to the discussion. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:30:27 PDT 2011
BenCosway
Is there any evidence that suggests that that reflective writing in portfolios improves undergraduate or post-graduate performance? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:30:27 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@glittrgirl indeed- and I am picking up that it is rarely felt that text-based reflections in UK portfolios produce dialogue #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:30:47 PDT 2011
distmeded
@amcunningham yes, Colyar writing about scholar/researcher, but it's her thoughts about the "process of writing" I find compelling. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:30:50 PDT 2011
http://hashtags.foxepractice.com/healthcare-hashtag-transcript58&tdate=06%2F30%2F2011&thour=15&tmin=0&ssec=00&tsec=00&img=1
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welsh_gas_doc
#Meded epitomises The Emperor's New Clothes. Things that one educationalist says is held up as gospel, because he said it.
Thu Jun 30 13:30:51 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@david_colquhoun why wouldn't u trust anyone who says 'stakeholder'? It's a perfectly polite & reasonable English word #meded @Neil_Mehta
Thu Jun 30 13:31:01 PDT 2011
DrShock
@drsuparnadas yes I know the competencies but just finished med students will have to learn to integrate them during further trainig #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:31:18 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@glittrgirl on the other hand I will spend several hours discussing my text-based reflections with an appraiser next week- learning++ #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:31:26 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@distmeded One of the Scottish schools, they ended up developing their own much simpler system #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:31:26 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
RT @amcunningham: I wasn't suprised either ... hoping this discussion can generate some light along with the heat:) #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:31:39 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
@Neil_Mehta "Pilots" are just badly designed experiments with uninterpretable outcomes #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:31:49 PDT 2011
topknife1
RT @DrDLittle: #MedEd @amcunningham and competence... Are we talking a minimum acceptable standard and if so, is that really what we sho ...
Thu Jun 30 13:31:50 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
@drsuparnadas @david_colquhoun @Neil_Mehta "Stakeholders" are the sort of people who subscribe to "blue sky thinking". ;) #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:31:52 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
RT @BenCosway: Is there any evidence that suggests that that reflective writing in portfolios improves undergraduate or post-graduate performance? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:32:21 PDT 2011
unpermanent
RT @silv24: Also does feel like you are ticking boxes rather than actually progressing through your training #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:32:22 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@welsh_gas_doc you're saying that about the WHOLE of medical education! I'm insulted! #meded I'm being taught to think critically!
Thu Jun 30 13:32:24 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
RT @amcunningham: @nlafferty yes, NHS Scotland seems to be used in England and Wales... #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:32:25 PDT 2011
distmeded
@nlatterty thanks. I'm really impressed with the #mahara community. Lots of good work. New versions regularly, education focus. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:32:45 PDT 2011
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nlafferty
@distmeded We were looking at Mahara but put off by others experiences, is it working well at Dalhousie? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:32:50 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
RT @david_colquhoun Pilots" are just badly designed experiments with uninterpretable outcomes - I guess depends on who designs them. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:32:55 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Until social science takes experimental design seriously, it will continue to mislead See http://bit.ly/l9byAA #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:33:18 PDT 2011
iamdoctord
@amcunningham @nlafferty and Northern Ireland #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:33:58 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@david_colquhoun I think you'll find that the concept of a checklist of competencies does not emerge from social sciences #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:34:13 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
NO it is statistical Q RT @Neil_Mehta: Pilots" are just badly designed experiments.. I guess depends on who designs them. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:34:31 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
Re stakeholder - defined as a person, group, organization, or system who affects or can be affected by an organization's actions #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:34:48 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
Would it be inappropriate to share with the group that all but one of the reflective parts of my portfolio are made up lies? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:34:49 PDT 2011
distmeded
@nlatterty, portfolios not implemented widely yet, will take time. I'm hosting a Canadian #meded #portfolio group, at www.MEportfolio.ca
Thu Jun 30 13:35:19 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@welsh_gas_doc inappropriate??? what do you think? #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:35:24 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Worse -it comes from HR RT @amcunningham: of a checklist of competencies does not emerge from social sciences #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:35:28 PDT 2011
topknife1
@welsh_gas_doc #meded you're anon!

Thu Jun 30 13:35:50 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
Are these portfolios tied into health records or are they all stand alone requirements? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:36:05 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
@amcunningham I didn't say it was true. In fact, I don't keep a reflective thing cos I don't have to. It COULD be true though. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:36:17 PDT 2011
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distmeded
@welsh_gas_doc was that a professionalism #meded #portfolio project ? :)

Thu Jun 30 13:36:28 PDT 2011
cringlem
#meded Joining late. Biggest problem is the sad mix of formative and summative assessments such that Trainee and er cannot accept <average
Thu Jun 30 13:36:29 PDT 2011
amcunningham
Checklists of competencies are not part of portfolio model in @Neil_Mehta 's institution #meded @david_colquhoun
Thu Jun 30 13:36:47 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@welsh_gas_doc you are such an attention seeker! #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:37:30 PDT 2011
huw_penylan
#meded definite gaming if reflection happening all the time. Used to fill in gaps in competencies rather than truly reflecting
Thu Jun 30 13:37:48 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Excellent! Only way to deal with box-tickers RT @welsh_gas_doc: ll but one of the reflective parts of my portfolio are made up lies? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:38:03 PDT 2011
MykelO
Are others missing posts on #meded ? I am seeing from some but missing others. Twitter problem? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:38:28 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@cmeadvocate stand alone as far as I know.... #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:38:58 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@david_colquhoun < not everything in life can be broken down to stochastic processes/statistics/quantitative @Neil_Mehta #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:39:06 PDT 2011
distmeded
"Problems and Conditions" plugin for #meded #mahara #portfolio not working with current version, but an easil (cont) http://deck.ly/~p6z4g
Thu Jun 30 13:39:24 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
Seems suggesting that people make up their reflections has caused upset. There is NOTHING to stop this happening though. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:39:39 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@distmeded Do you make use of the social aspects of mahara so that students gain benefits of social learning? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:39:44 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
One year at one medical school in London will produce 22,000 pieces of paper. Does all education have to be documented? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:40:06 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@amcunningham exactly #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:40:15 PDT 2011
catherineleng
Clearly many people not happy with current sit. - how can #meded change for the
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catherineleng
better? Not really a user yet but interested to hear ideas..

Thu Jun 30 13:40:15 PDT 2011
silv24
#meded I would love to be involved in improving the eportfolio - have had alot of conversations about it with other trainees
Thu Jun 30 13:40:17 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
RT @drsuparnadas: @david_colquhoun < not everything in life can be broken down to stochastic processes/statistics/quantitative LOL #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:40:26 PDT 2011
mtvpaul
@welsh_gas_doc @amcunningham My portfolio has VAST amounts of reflection based on VERY LITTLE clinical experience... elaborated?? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:41:02 PDT 2011
amcunningham
How could we contribute to improving the way portfolios are implemented.delivered? #meded Who do we need to talk to?
Thu Jun 30 13:41:07 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
RT @amcunningham: @david_colquhoun I think you'll find that the concept of a checklist of competencies does not emerge from social sciences #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:41:15 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
at our institution, portfolios are primarily used to help develop lifelong learning skills and reflection rather than a checklist #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:41:26 PDT 2011
distmeded
@nlatterly Mahara social tools were not used widely, yet. But are good forum to "discuss" social media in #meded, and privacy concerns.
Thu Jun 30 13:41:29 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
#meded I haven't heard very much about the evidence base for use/not use of eportfolios tonight. Anyone care to comment?
Thu Jun 30 13:41:43 PDT 2011
tobypeterdavies
RT @david_colquhoun: And breaches DC#s rule #1 "never trust anyone who used the word stakeholder" RT @Neil_Mehta: got feedback for all stakeholders #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:42:14 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@glittrgirl Good point - is there a BEME guide on e-portfolios #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:42:57 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
@amcunningham #meded In HR speak, "service users"

Thu Jun 30 13:43:01 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@welsh_gas_doc @david_colquhoun @Neil_Mehta And what's wrong with strategic 'blue sky thinking'? Unfortunately not taught in medicine #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:43:07 PDT 2011
catherineleng
@amcunningham Who/what body brought in/made portfolios so ubiquitous in the first place? #genuineQuestion #Meded
Thu Jun 30 13:43:12 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
This is edu theory -no evidence needed RT @glittrgirl: #meded I haven't heard very
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david_colquhoun
much about the evidence ... eportfolios tonight.

Thu Jun 30 13:43:24 PDT 2011
distmeded
Dalhousie's enviro scan and review of #meded #portfolio from 2009 at http://bit.ly/lb9bvR has citations for references.
Thu Jun 30 13:43:33 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
Forcing someone to reflect serves no purpose. It feels to us medical students like we're having an organized religion forced upon us #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:43:47 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@welsh_gas_doc to my mind lying about 'professional' activity is big no-no. have guts to argue your case if you think it's rubbish. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:43:51 PDT 2011
cringlem
@amcunningham #meded Need dedicated postgraduate teachers and not every man and their dog claimed S code for their training.
Thu Jun 30 13:44:06 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
@Neil_Mehta Doesn't sound like the model employed in the UK at all #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:44:08 PDT 2011
docurel
Thu Jun 30 13:44:09 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@catherineleng @amcunningham GMC! #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:44:25 PDT 2011
BenCosway
RT @david_colquhoun: This is edu theory -no evidence needed RT @glittrgirl: #meded I haven't heard very much about the evidence ... eportfolios tonight.
Thu Jun 30 13:44:37 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Again student's have more sense than teachers! RT @RaccoonFran: Forcing someone to reflect serves no purpose. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:44:44 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@catherineleng good question... people decided we needed more emphasis on competency.... then how to assess-> enter portfolios #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:44:52 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
RT @RaccoonFran: Forcing someone to reflect serves no purpose. It feels to us medical students like we're having an organized religion forced upon us #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:44:52 PDT 2011
DrShock
@amcunningham important not to use it as exams or keep scores #meded use of portfolio
Thu Jun 30 13:45:00 PDT 2011
shanemuk
The wee white angel on my right shoulder whispers portfolios are wonderful; the red devil to the left screams "THEY DON'T WORK!" #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:45:00 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
@Rohit_Silhi It is also not representative of US med schools either. But getting more
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Neil_Mehta
adoption slowly. #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:45:06 PDT 2011
distmeded
gotta go, thanks for the #portfolio thoughts #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:45:14 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
@amcunningham I was merely highlighting how easy it is that people's eportfolios are made up (not mine, because I don't do it) #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:45:34 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
And how are we supposed to interpret comments on our reflective exercises lol "needs to be more reflective"? Wear fluorescent yellow?#meded
Thu Jun 30 13:45:41 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@david_colquhoun ouch! So medical education not based on evidence? #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:45:41 PDT 2011
catherineleng
@Rohit_Silhi @amcunningham I agree, the end users should have input, from FY1 to most senior #Meded
Thu Jun 30 13:45:43 PDT 2011
silv24
@RaccoonFran I agree, I reflect in my own way everyday but hate having to write structured reflections as evidence of it #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:45:48 PDT 2011
DrShock
@amcunningham it's often better to judge the way studnts deal with the portfolio than the score keeping #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:45:49 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
@Neil_Mehta Unfortunately, the ease of deployment of a tick list model probably led to its ubiquity #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:46:03 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
@glittrgirl: You must realise that educationalists mostly don't understand how to get good evidence #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:46:08 PDT 2011
shanemuk
So is the angel right or is it the devil? Is there evidence that e-portfolios make better doctors? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:46:21 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
RT @catherineleng: @Rohit_Silhi @amcunningham I agree, the end users should have input, from FY1 to most senior #Meded
Thu Jun 30 13:46:51 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
@amcunningham @catherineleng Makes you wonder what the point of finals or postgrad exams are #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:47:08 PDT 2011
cringlem
@amcunningham Need balanced triangulated evidence in portfolio (sounds like a GA) Reflection is part of it. True reflection that is.#meded
Thu Jun 30 13:47:28 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@david_colquhoun #meded Eraut has done empirical work in order to develop

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amcunningham
theory on professional learning- he; (cont) http://deck.ly/~9ontM

Thu Jun 30 13:47:33 PDT 2011
andycoverdale
RT @PatParslow Some people tell me blog posts do not create meaningful dialogue. Read @amcunningham's post... http://t.co/S7uxZ0Q #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:47:50 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded Sorry for late arrival :-(

Thu Jun 30 13:47:51 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
RT @shanemuk: Is there evidence that e-portfolios make better doctors? How does one define a better doctor? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:47:51 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded Sorry for late arrival :-( http://tumblr.com/xph39b4zbb

Thu Jun 30 13:47:53 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
And they needed to fill in time with something when science was removed @Rohit_Silhi: @Neil_Mehta #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:48:00 PDT 2011
silv24
#meded I have been signed off as F1 competent this week but still not sure you can assess that just looking at the eportfolio
Thu Jun 30 13:48:04 PDT 2011
catherineleng
@DrShock @amcunningham Interesting thought - anychance the content doesn't matter, it's just there to show you've made the effort?:p #Meded
Thu Jun 30 13:48:34 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@silv24 what would be the best way of assessing your competence? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:48:35 PDT 2011
shanemuk
It would help if we could define what we want in a good Dr (I agree with @david_colquhoun that they NEED scientific knowledge). #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:48:39 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
At the risk of sounding Buddhist, reflection comes from within, not by imposing a rigid thought structure #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:49:02 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@david_colquhoun that wasn't a patronising comment at all, was it? Would you like to reflect on that? :P #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:49:09 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@shanemuk what's the best way to assess scientific knowledge? #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:49:17 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded Good conversation - will take some time to read through.

Thu Jun 30 13:49:33 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@david_colquhoun < do u think qualitative research as practised in social sciences has any value at all? @glittrgirl #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:49:39 PDT 2011
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silv24
@amcunningham think the assessments in eportfolio should be improved - to actually show what you learnt rather than you just did one #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:49:47 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@cringlem or sensitive to good doctors? what happens when good doctor produces bad portfolio? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:10 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
Would it be incredibly old fashioned and luddite of me to say that exams are the best way to assess scientific knowledge? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:18 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
@david_colquhoun The justification given to my year was "you'll have to do it when you graduate, so start now" #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:27 PDT 2011
AJCDeliciousNet
[from wishfulthinker] AnneMarie Cunningham: "@david_colquhoun #meded Er" Deck.ly http://goo.gl/fb/OmssU

Thu Jun 30 13:50:32 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
RT @amcunningham: @shanemuk whats the best way to assess scientific knowledge? Or assess that they can learn sci knowledge? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:39 PDT 2011
silv24
@amcunningham think here supervisors have a huge role, they work with us everyday and they need more input #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:42 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@silv24 that does sound as if you are talking about more reflections... are you? how else to record this? can it be? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:43 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Not much I suspect RT @drsuparnadas: do u think qual research as practised in social sciences has any value at all? @glittrgirl #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:48 PDT 2011
cringlem
#meded A good doctor. We know it when we see it.

Thu Jun 30 13:50:49 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
RT @silv24: @amcunningham think the assessments in eportfolio should be improved - to actually show what you learnt rather than you just did one #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:52 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded My 2p: ePortfolios were never meant to encourage excellence; political pressure --> minimum competence and De-professionalise medics
Thu Jun 30 13:50:55 PDT 2011
thefourthcraw
@Rohit_Silhi #meded And once revalidation kicks in, we'll all be doing them for ever more
Thu Jun 30 13:50:55 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
@amcunningham @cringlem When a good doctor produces a bad portfolio, they become a "bad doctor" and fail ARCP. Bad hoop-jumper. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:50:58 PDT 2011
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glittrgirl
@amcunningham @shanemuk what's the best way to assess competent social application of scientific knowledge? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:51:15 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded Meded folks intended for portfolios to celebrate excellence; now they impede personal devt IMHO
Thu Jun 30 13:51:43 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Qual research loved by homeopaths though RT @drsuparnadas: do u think qual research ... @glittrgirl #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:51:57 PDT 2011
silv24
@amcunningham not more reflections but an improvement on recording CBDs & mini CEXs - show what actually happened in the assessment #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:52:00 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@amcunningham #meded Not just scientific knowledge - a scientific *approach*. Science is not just facts. How we assess? Not by tickboxes :-)
Thu Jun 30 13:52:04 PDT 2011
silv24
RT @welsh_gas_doc: @amcunningham @cringlem When a good doctor produces a bad portfolio, they become a "bad doctor" and fail ARCP. Bad hoop-jumper. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:52:23 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
YES RT @DrPlumEU: #meded Meded folks intended for portfolios to celebrate excellence; now they impede personal devt IMHO
Thu Jun 30 13:52:26 PDT 2011
cringlem
@amcunningham #meded This process still unnatural to many so lots of poor portf from otherwise good Dr. A good Trainer is the key WITH TIME
Thu Jun 30 13:52:31 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded Unintended consequences of ePortfolio - more administration getting in the way of clinical experience
Thu Jun 30 13:52:36 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
RT @drsuparnadas: RT @silv24: @amcunningham to actually show what you learnt rather than you just did one - #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:52:40 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@david_colquhoun I'm sure you know that rejecting qualitative research because it is beloved of homeopaths is very poor logic indeed #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:53:01 PDT 2011
silv24
RT @david_colquhoun: YES RT @DrPlumEU: #meded Meded folks intended for portfolios to celebrate excellence; now they impede personal devt ...
Thu Jun 30 13:53:02 PDT 2011
silv24
Agree with this! RT @DrPlumEU: #meded Unintended consequences of ePortfolio more administration getting in the way of clinical experience
Thu Jun 30 13:53:12 PDT 2011
huw_penylan
#meded @amcunningham supervisor reports, MSF in each job, other professionals need to have ways of flagging up worrying docs. Tht shd be enf
Page 19 of 29

Thu Jun 30 13:53:21 PDT 2011
01/07/2011 21:20
DrPlumEU
#meded What happened to trusting high achievers to achieve highly?

Thu Jun 30 13:53:25 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@glittrgirl @amcunningham There is perhaps an assumption that portfolios *do* assess useful things; is that assumption warranted? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:53:27 PDT 2011
DrShock
RT @silv24: Agree with this! RT @DrPlumEU: #meded Unintended consequences of ePortfolio - more administration getting in the way of cli ...
Thu Jun 30 13:53:34 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
Why is there such reticence to acknowledge forced reflective writing is not the way to make someone reflect? Balint groups? Thoughts #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:53:56 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@shanemuk not be MCQs either then? lots of peopple love progress tests... expect to see more soon #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:54:04 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@RaccoonFran I have no problem in acknowledging that #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:54:29 PDT 2011
trixiebelle121
RT @welsh_gas_doc: Would it be inappropriate to share with the group that all but one of the reflective parts of my portfolio are made up lies? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:54:42 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
They like it cos you get results you want RT @amcunningham: rejecting qualitative research ... #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:54:44 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@shanemuk have you read my post? http://bit.ly/lVTGsJ #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:55:00 PDT 2011
tea_driven_doc
@welsh_gas_doc all but one?! I don't believe one is real #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:55:08 PDT 2011
huw_penylan
#meded @amcunningham @silv24 agreed supervisors need input and responsibility for signing us off as ok
Thu Jun 30 13:55:19 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded The wonder of medical practice is its variety; ePortfolio as I saw it was a chance to celebrate this. In practice=a straightjacket
Thu Jun 30 13:55:31 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@welsh_gas_doc exams may test knowledge. What about skills and attitudes? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:55:43 PDT 2011
silv24
RT @RaccoonFran: Why is there such reticence to acknowledge forced reflective writing is not the way to make someone reflect? Balint groups? Thoughts #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:55:43 PDT 2011
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JoBrodie
RT @amcunningham: @david_colquhoun I'm sure you know that rejecting qualitative research because it is beloved of homeopaths is very poor logic indeed #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:55:51 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
RT @DrShock: @amcunningham the main issue being is it worth our while #meded does it improve meded? Is meded about competency or knowled ...
Thu Jun 30 13:55:59 PDT 2011
EuroDocstar
RT @silv24: Agree with this! RT @DrPlumEU: #meded Unintended consequences of ePortfolio - more administration getting in the way of cli ...
Thu Jun 30 13:56:04 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
@Kryptonknight83 Join in the #meded discussion, would be good to hear your view as an administrator of it.
Thu Jun 30 13:56:05 PDT 2011
EuroDocstar
RT @david_colquhoun: YES RT @DrPlumEU: #meded Meded folks intended for portfolios to celebrate excellence; now they impede personal devt ...
Thu Jun 30 13:56:08 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
From what I've gathered from my experience and from speaking with colleagues is: 'group' reflection brings more insight than alone #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:56:17 PDT 2011
samanthallen
@amcunningham Can you speak to/feedback to Prof Gallen or Dr Stuart Carney at Foundation Programme?? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:56:18 PDT 2011
EuroDocstar
Thu Jun 30 13:56:20 PDT 2011
catherineleng
@huw_penylan @amcunningham @silv24 Perhaps training supervisors to assess officially, in conjunction with something portfolio-esque? #Meded
Thu Jun 30 13:56:31 PDT 2011
MykelO
@shanemuk @amcunningham Portfolios record but rarely give qualitative comments. @DrPlumbEu is nearest with lowest level of competance #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:56:43 PDT 2011
huw_penylan
#meded @amcunningham @welsh_gas_doc they get told to go away for 2 wks and rewrite in areas they're weak in.
Thu Jun 30 13:56:45 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
Allows you to consider points of view other than your own and trigger actual reflection #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:56:57 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded What counts is often what cannot be counted. Try telling that to health service managers and keeping on their good side!
Thu Jun 30 13:57:09 PDT 2011
shanemuk
MCQs are an easy option; the unpalatable truth may be that assessing competence requires deep ongoing commitment to *working* w them? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:57:12 PDT 2011
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huw_penylan
RT @DrPlumEU: #meded Unintended consequences of ePortfolio - more administration getting in the way of clinical experience
Thu Jun 30 13:57:29 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
Eureka! RT @amcunningham: philosophical differences underlie much of discussion around portfolios... what is nature of knowledge? #meded"
Thu Jun 30 13:58:05 PDT 2011
drpetra
RT @amcunningham: @david_colquhoun I'm sure you know that rejecting qualitative research because it is beloved of homeopaths is very poor logic indeed #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:58:05 PDT 2011
amcunningham
Has recording something in your portfolio ever lead to dialogue which has increased your understanding/insight/knowledge? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:58:06 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@amcunningham Not fully yet - just dipping in opportunistically! Will do so now :-) #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:58:08 PDT 2011
huw_penylan
YES! #meded #meded Unintended consequences of ePortfolio - more administration getting in the way of clinical experience
Thu Jun 30 13:58:10 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
@huw_penylan @amcunningham @welsh_gas_doc that sounds like prro implementation rather than problem with tool to me #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:58:15 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@david_colquhoun < I'm sure you can get the results you want in quantitative research/stochastic processes as well! @amcunningham #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:58:23 PDT 2011
EuroDocstar
RT @BenCosway: Is there any evidence that suggests that that reflective writing in portfolios improves undergraduate or post-graduate performance? #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:58:33 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded Personally, the portfolio was valuable when used as a vehicle for reflection with mentor/trainer. Unhelpful if just exercise for GMC
Thu Jun 30 13:58:34 PDT 2011
AuntiePumpkin
Thu Jun 30 13:59:12 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@DrPlumEU when you kept your own record for several years did you share with anyone? I asked you that in reply to blog comment to. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:59:17 PDT 2011
EuroDocstar
RT @chebbes: @welsh_gas_doc #meded A reflective learning cycle should be valuable,people do it without thinking but become resistant whe ...
Thu Jun 30 13:59:27 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
RT @Neil_Mehta: at our institution, portfolios are primarily used to help develop lifelong learning skills and reflection rather than a checklist #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:59:32 PDT 2011
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EuroDocstar
RT @welsh_gas_doc: @chebbes I do reflect, I reflect often. I don't feel comfortable writing it down on paper to show to strangers though. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:59:42 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded @amcunningham portfolio data rarely led to helpful conversation since left VTS
Thu Jun 30 13:59:44 PDT 2011
MykelO
@amcunningham It has but only when I have discussed it with peers. The process itself was not useful. #meded
Thu Jun 30 13:59:44 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
@amc@chebbes hence defeating teh purpose of the exercise #meded

Thu Jun 30 13:59:57 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
RT @amcunningham: Has recording something in your portfolio ever lead to dialogue which has increased your understanding/insight/knowledge? #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:00:03 PDT 2011
EuroDocstar
RT @welsh_gas_doc: "Quick, I need to think of something to reflect on" I heard said in the Mess last week. Defeats the object of the whole thing! #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:00:10 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
http://pages.citebite.com/l8f2m7d1gbjh another comment by students in our program. Balanced view point of our system. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:00:11 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@Neil_Mehta your student comments are great- I'll link to them here later http://bit.ly/lVTGsJ #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:01:00 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
RT @shanemuk: Is there evidence that e-portfolios make better doctors? How does one define a better doctor? #meded"
Thu Jun 30 14:01:12 PDT 2011
dr_kika
#meded ironic that reflections may be kept "private" online, but need printed evidence at arcp.. Well at mine at least!
Thu Jun 30 14:01:15 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
#meded @amcunningham My portfolio was shared with my Trainer and Course Organiser. Never published as eg of 'life in 3 yrs of GP Reg'
Thu Jun 30 14:01:15 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@amcunningham Ah - it's the follow-up :-) I think portfolios suffer the same defects as exams. They do not [?] predict performance #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:01:26 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
#meded I wonder hoe much poor implementation of eportfolios in the curriculum is responsible for such distaste for them? #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:02:26 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@shanemuk what do you think about my suggestion about why we might have lost confidence in global assessment of competency? #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:02:26 PDT 2011
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DrShock
The big mistake is using a portfolio for feedback while feedback alone will do #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:02:50 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@DavidWaldock MCQs need to be very well designed if they are to test *reasoning*. Usu they don't. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:02:52 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
RT @glittrgirl: #meded I wonder hoe much poor implementation of eportfolios in the curriculum is responsible for such distaste for them? ...
Thu Jun 30 14:03:24 PDT 2011
mathena123
#meded just found the feed. I think that portfolios identify people that have a global weakness not necessarily excellence.
Thu Jun 30 14:03:40 PDT 2011
silv24
#meded I had some fantastic CBDs with my SpR in A&E, learnt a huge amount but couldn't really show this when recording it in the portfolio
Thu Jun 30 14:04:13 PDT 2011
amcunningham
By lack of responses I'm assuming that most people do not find that their portfolio has lead to meaningful dialogue - pity :( #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:04:16 PDT 2011
Neil_Mehta
@amcunningham @Nlafferty @drsuparnadas thanks for great (somewhat heated at times) conversation. Have to sign off. G'nite! #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:04:21 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@amcunningham Yes, I think there is much of that. However, the senior bastard problem is an issue. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:04:39 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@Neil_Mehta thank you! thank you! :) #meded

Thu Jun 30 14:04:40 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@DrShock yes agree. Portfolios and feedback could be kept separate #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:04:50 PDT 2011
mathena123
@silv24 #meded did you use the reflective area?

Thu Jun 30 14:04:59 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
@silv24 @DrPlumEU - it is why it all has to be integrated into normal workflow....can't be separate obligation. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:04:59 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
Perhaps the portfolio 'safety net' function has been extended to all ability and excellence? #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:05:00 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
The portfolio is a nice idea on paper; in practice it has been implemented badly, executed appallingly and badly received. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:05:18 PDT 2011
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01/07/2011 21:20
huw_penylan
@mathena123 not necessarily. Picks out people who are weak at filling in portfolio. Very different things #Meded
Thu Jun 30 14:05:25 PDT 2011
DrShock
@amcunningham dialogue and porfolio needs time, often not sufficient enough between med students and staff #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:05:29 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@shanemuk that's the other side of the coin... once you accept you need multiple assessments then you are back to 'tickboxes' #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:05:31 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@amcunningham Well, I wouldn't say that - I have had some useful exchanges with juniors over pts they were documenting. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:05:48 PDT 2011
DrShock
take care #meded

Thu Jun 30 14:06:11 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
But, we must accept the portfolio is here to stay. Gravy train is moving too fast, and too many snouts in the trough for alternative. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:06:26 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@amcunningham Not necessarily - there may be other ways of standardising assessment. Portfolios are not the only fruit (are they?). #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:07:25 PDT 2011
mathena123
#meded portfolio now has training on giving feedback for some locations. An attempt to make the exercise more useful.
Thu Jun 30 14:07:25 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
RT @welsh_gas_doc: The portfolio is a nice idea on paper; in practice it has been implemented badly, executed appallingly and badly received. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:07:36 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
I try #meded very hard to complete one CBD/CEX form for each student on each contact with them. With contructive feedback too.
Thu Jun 30 14:07:38 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@shanemuk I'm not talking about portfolios.... #meded

Thu Jun 30 14:07:46 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
@welsh_gas_doc yes I too feel poor implementation of what seemed like a good idea is what has happened #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:07:47 PDT 2011
mathena123
@huw_penylan but if you are struggling with that it is often a sign to investigate why... Often flags up other problems #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:08:28 PDT 2011
RaccoonFran
@DrPlumEU If only all clinicians were of the same opinion... #meded

Thu Jun 30 14:08:44 PDT 2011
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01/07/2011 21:20
nlafferty
@Neil_Mehta Thanks for contributing - I need to take a look at your system #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:09:08 PDT 2011
shanemuk
@amcunningham OK - finding it hard to maintain threads - need to get more streamlined twitterbrain :-) #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:09:12 PDT 2011
dirtydrcasbah
@welsh_gas_doc too many "educationalists" sat in their offices with too much time on their hands and "reflecting" an awful lot #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:09:15 PDT 2011
twiturdoc
@DrShock avoid VVD #meded

Thu Jun 30 14:09:20 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
Got to duck out. Thanks for a gr8 discussion everyone and special thanks to @amcunningham #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:09:30 PDT 2011
DrPlumEU
Reflective diary/portfolio to be part of Wrkflo #meded adds at least 5 min to EVERY consultation. x30/d = +150min to day. Who pays for that?
Thu Jun 30 14:09:31 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@Neil_Mehta Thank you for your contributions! #meded I need to take a closer look at what you've developed #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:09:50 PDT 2011
MykelO
@drsuparnadas @welsh_gas_doc "seemed like a good idea" We are back to the point of properly conducted trials #meded. We are scientists?
Thu Jun 30 14:10:08 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
YES RT @dirtydrcasbah: @welsh_gas_doc 2 many "educationalists" sat in their offices w/ 2 much time on their hands & "reflecting" #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:10:12 PDT 2011
amcunningham
Thanks to everyone for taking part in #meded chat... perhaps you can post longer 'reflections' here:) http://bit.ly/lVTGsJ
Thu Jun 30 14:10:43 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
RT @dirtydrcasbah: @welsh_gas_doc too many "educationalists" sat in their offices with too much time on their hands and "reflecting" an awful lot #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:10:58 PDT 2011
drsuparnadas
thanks for your contribution tonite @Neil_Mehta #meded

Thu Jun 30 14:11:11 PDT 2011
huw_penylan
@mathena123 #meded often means that you're busy doing some work! MSFs regularly and a good clinical supervisor would pick up same issues
Thu Jun 30 14:11:14 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Main lesson from this discussion is: #meded folks should reflect less & learn about design of expts and inference -put some science back
Thu Jun 30 14:12:17 PDT 2011
Page 26 of 29
01/07/2011 21:20
shanemuk
OK folks; interesting #meded chat! May leave a comment on @amcunningham's blog :-)
Thu Jun 30 14:12:20 PDT 2011
silv24
@mathena123 I did but I still don't think it is the best way of recording it #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:12:30 PDT 2011
Rohit_Silhi
RT @dirtydrcasbah: @welsh_gas_doc too many "educationalists" sat in their offices with too much time on their hands and "reflecting" an awful lot #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:12:30 PDT 2011
akroundtree
RT @david_colquhoun: Main lesson from this discussion is: #meded folks should reflect less & learn about design of expts and inference ...
Thu Jun 30 14:12:45 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
For the record; nothing that I have ever presented to my ARCP has been fictional. I was merely making a point that it COULD happen. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:12:46 PDT 2011
silv24
Thu Jun 30 14:13:27 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@shanemuk #meded my point was that if we don't trust single global assessment of competency.... and multipl (cont) http://deck.ly/~RUpRg
Thu Jun 30 14:13:46 PDT 2011
MykelO
@amcunningham Thanks. Has shown huge differences between practioners and educators. Plus a change. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:14:08 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
RT @david_colquhoun: Main lesson from this discussion is: #meded folks should reflect less & learn about design of expts and inference ...
Thu Jun 30 14:14:26 PDT 2011
tea_driven_doc
Thu Jun 30 14:14:52 PDT 2011
Kryptonknight83
Eportfolio is here to stay :( but surely it it can be restructured/re designed to make it more engaging than a list of tick boxes #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:16:10 PDT 2011
mathena123
@huw_penylan That forms part of the portfolio though. Its not perfect and has little evidence but it is evolving. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:16:27 PDT 2011
scottishphil83
@amcunningham constantly.My learning log has become a two way dialogue. Shame its now all signed off now. now to revalid portfolio! #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:17:32 PDT 2011
cmeadvocate
RT @huw_penylan: @mathena123 not necessarily. Picks out people who are weak at filling in portfolio. Very different things #Meded
Thu Jun 30 14:17:32 PDT 2011
Page 27 of 29
01/07/2011 21:20
amcunningham
@MykelO do you think so? which house do you think I am in? #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:17:35 PDT 2011
dirtydrcasbah
Baby boom sounds like job security for a wannabe paediatrician, on reflection #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:18:42 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@scottishphil83 @akashkarki seems that GPs have better experiences of portfolios.... I'd say mine is positive:) #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:19:27 PDT 2011
markhawker
@amcunningham If you did four that touch each base of the link I sent: Logical, semantic, systemic and empirical. #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:20:00 PDT 2011
glittrgirl
#meded @amcunningham thanks for interesting discussion - see you next week.
Thu Jun 30 14:20:04 PDT 2011
MykelO
@amcunningham I think that your house has two front doors and you choose which one to use. I'm not certain which one I'm in #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:20:04 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@MykelO I'm a student educationalist:) I can ask questions ALL the time.... but I don't ever intend to stop:) #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:22:23 PDT 2011
nlafferty
@aymorrison There's been a heated #meded twitter chat on portfolios tonight - here are some of the comments be (cont) http://deck.ly/~ZlUTH
Thu Jun 30 14:29:58 PDT 2011
david_colquhoun
Exactly, nevr properly evaluated -sheer dogma RT @cmeadvocate: RT @shanemuk: Is thr evidence that e-portfolios make better doctors? #meded"
Thu Jun 30 14:30:22 PDT 2011
welsh_gas_doc
After the Twitter bunfight on #meded, it's time for an even less constructive discussion with #BBCQT
Thu Jun 30 14:31:13 PDT 2011
gingermarauder
@BenCosway we are the experiment to answer that question, I don't remember signing the consent form for that. #meded #eportfolios
Thu Jun 30 14:32:27 PDT 2011
ambulancemandan
#meded sorry left half way thru, just read thru.Good discussion. Thks
Thu Jun 30 14:35:15 PDT 2011
westr
4 Physicians using Social Media in Medicine: Gr8 6'vid: http://t.co/YUzWGcX Not 2 B missed! #pm101 #hcsm #MCCSM #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:35:18 PDT 2011
KentBottles
RT @westr: 4 Physicians using Social Media in Medicine: Gr8 6'vid: http://t.co/YUzWGcX Not 2 B missed! #pm101 #hcsm #MCCSM #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:36:35 PDT 2011
Page 28 of 29
01/07/2011 21:20
HealthCulture
RT @UMFamilyMed: From Slate: "We Need More Doctors, Stat! Why is it taking so long to address the physician shortage?" http://ow.ly/5s4d7 #meded #primarycare
Thu Jun 30 14:37:05 PDT 2011
amcunningham
@dr_dyb thank you for joining in tonight- very helpful comment:) #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:46:58 PDT 2011
dermotor
@amcunningham For majority v able trainees, not sure ePortfolio adds much. As med director tho it does allow to deal with strugglers #meded
Thu Jun 30 14:52:18 PDT 2011
Page 29 of 29

#Meded Twitter Chat 30 June 2011 UK/EU

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#Meded Twitter Chat 30 June 2011 UK/EU

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#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

Learn more about #meded at The Healthcare Hashtag Project

@glittrgirl you going to join us for #meded chat?

@amcunningham I'm here watching. #meded ;)

#meded @topknife1 Scott surgical reg northern ireland

DJ, Anaesthetics Reg, Wales. #meded

#meded Pharmacist Lancashire.

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

head of residency training and medical education for psychiatry #meded

@DrShock Hello - good to have you on tonight's #meded chat

RS, Fourth year med student, SW London #meded

@amcunningham #meded Mike, Paeds SpR, East Midlands

PB, GP in the midlands. #meded

Catherine, 3rd yr medic, London #meded

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

@topknife1 main issue feedback versus competence #meded?

helped design and implement ePorfolio at our medical school #meded

@Neil_Mehta does conflation with competency in UK undermine this aim? #meded

@Neil_Mehta interesting that u, as end-user, were involved in th design of ePage 3 of 29

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

portfolio. Were any end-users involved in design in UK? #meded

Am not familiar with UK system enough to understand negative feelings/resistance #meded

http://pages.citebite.com/l8l2r6m9jegv this is comment from one of our students #meded

@topknife1 meded is about knowledge, skills don't need portfolio, competencies is

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

more for residency training or adult education #meded

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

forget #statistics, forget #biochemistry -just tick boxes #meded

RT @david_colquhoun: forget #statistics, forget #biochemistry -just tick boxes #meded

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

@distmeded It doesn't have to be written down though, does it? #meded

@silv24 @welsh_gas_doc I agree different learning styles should be accommodated #meded

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

@glittrgirl how do you reflect? #meded

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

@amcunningham Here's a post on epistemology and types of knowledge. http://bit.ly/l64EB9 #meded

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

@amcunningham @nlafferty and Northern Ireland #meded

@welsh_gas_doc inappropriate??? what do you think? #meded

@welsh_gas_doc #meded you're anon!

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

@welsh_gas_doc was that a professionalism #meded #portfolio project ? :)

@welsh_gas_doc you are such an attention seeker! #meded

@cmeadvocate stand alone as far as I know.... #meded

@amcunningham exactly #meded

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

better? Not really a user yet but interested to hear ideas..

@glittrgirl Good point - is there a BEME guide on e-portfolios #meded

@amcunningham #meded In HR speak, "service users"

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

much about the evidence ... eportfolios tonight.

@catherineleng @amcunningham GMC! #meded

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

adoption slowly. #meded

gotta go, thanks for the #portfolio thoughts #meded

@david_colquhoun ouch! So medical education not based on evidence? #meded

@david_colquhoun #meded Eraut has done empirical work in order to develop

#meded - Healthcare Twitter Transcript

theory on professional learning- he; (cont) http://deck.ly/~9ontM

#meded Sorry for late arrival :-(

#meded Sorry for late arrival :-( http://tumblr.com/xph39b4zbb

@shanemuk what's the best way to assess scientific knowledge? #meded