You are on page 1of 2286

Mic Eropq Do HjgurMic Eropq Do Hjgurjump to content

MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary

/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas

InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.

permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into

that, and the poll confirms ;)


permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent

[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago


y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.

In general though the level of English was pretty good.


permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D

permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i

s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago

I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).

permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago

Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent

[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago


Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent

[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago


I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan

tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.


In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source

permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent

[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago


fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago

Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o


pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.

permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.

permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago

10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits


That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia

l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink

[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago


A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent

[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago


As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn

ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent

[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago


Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago

I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in


ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin

g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent

[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p

oints 1 month ago


Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*

As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they

receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl

e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago

I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago

Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago

Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r


e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago

Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.


permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.

As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but

any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent

load more comments (13 replies)


[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago

I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.

He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink

[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago


Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig

rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "

we're in Europe, but not really in"


permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p

opulation and immigrants.


Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink

[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago


My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t

he other way round)...


permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English

this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014


2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta

/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago

The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent

[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago


We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago

Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D


permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)

[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago


You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago

I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s


ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.

permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.

permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago

To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is


a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas

ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.


Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic

ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago

After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway

).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago

[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m

y hometown and I love going there.


permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.

But I'm not sure that makes it better.


permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an

d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.


permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.

Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor


ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago

[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.

It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago

Oh, cool this again:


Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)

permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat

e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.

permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca

nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H

eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i

n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl

e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i

dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.

permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago

We won't talk about you as many Brits do.


I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink

[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago


No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago

Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.

I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is

no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.


Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would

suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien


t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t

heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900

1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o

verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink

[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago


British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam

a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer


was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in

their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,

followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink

[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago


They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For

travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope


50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia

/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.

permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"

permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,

permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent

[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago


In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent

[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago


Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even

if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe

r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm

permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago

A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago

I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent

[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago


or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago

Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.

Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent

[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago


Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.

permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some

sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent

[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago


I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink

[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago


TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m

igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent

load more comments (4 replies)


[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your

only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t


aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.

I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d

on't have dedicated terminals.


Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago


I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr

ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.


One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."

EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?

permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and

is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink

[ ][deleted] 1 month ago


[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the

UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent

[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago


Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago

Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t

heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.

Not really helpful, I know.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.

Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who


lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.

Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members

is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.


permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago

A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago

Yes, it's ridiculous.


But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe

reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who

le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago

This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho

w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over


populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink

[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago


crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you

raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters

permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki

FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra

/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics

In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p

permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.

permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent

[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago


Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago

Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!


permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago


While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a

nd then Greece and Latvia.


permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.

Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)

[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago


People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.

But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec

ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent

[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago


and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.

permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent

load more comments (3 replies)


load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago


Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody

cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil

a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i

ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)

[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago


Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi

nts 1 month ago


Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli

sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago


One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase

output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent

[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent

[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*


Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent

[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago


I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink

[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago

I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s

killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.

permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga

in browsing this sub makes me think twice.


That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago

That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago

As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou

nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en

ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most

Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe

.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen

t. The change in attitude I mean.


And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink

[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago


I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.

permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.

permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago

It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"

permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G

ermany (42,859) are much lower.


Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago

Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I

don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne

cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store

redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands

/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats

a community for 6 years


message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent

[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago


No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent

[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago


1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]

[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago


There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent

continue this thread


[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i

n most people's minds.


permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago


True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,

and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im

provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.


permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent

[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago


You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi

ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent

[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago


Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering

sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be

It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri

ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.

permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.

When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.

permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago

That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv

ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he

re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)

load more comments (27 replies)


[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)

[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago


My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent

[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago


That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago

I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals

feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.

permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.

permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a

ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?


permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.

But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago

This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.

permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to

p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent

[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago


Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an

d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!


permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago

I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell

ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe


rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction

ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is

taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f


ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen

d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it


's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago

It's like deja vu all over again.


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m

ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)

[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago


Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink

[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago


Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re

staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink

[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago


And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO

GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands

/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks

...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent

[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago


Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent

[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago


Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent

[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago


Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago

steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.

permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago


They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent

[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago


See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent

[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago


It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent

[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago


No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though

,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent

[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago


Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+

km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them

permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.

I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

load more comments (2 replies)


load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.

permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there

is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen

sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago

Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.


permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)

[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago


What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago

That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.


permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..

permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the

full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.


permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago

Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".


"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He

athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent

[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago


If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap

se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t

hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.

permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago

Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f

rom people like Farage and UKIP.


permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar

bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent

[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago


It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T

hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri

ct the subject to a British context.


That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri

es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic

.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago

British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants


They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago


No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent

load more comments (7 replies)


[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink

[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago


Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos

permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago

You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?


permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'

permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with

a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link

Submit a new text post


europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway

/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago

Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent

[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago


Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we

ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago

Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)


permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago

Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?


permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for

a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the

y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago

...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).

What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his Co-

Host Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into

a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink

[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago


Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac

kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago

Not even the most original joke about windturbines.


http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...

(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"

permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and

claim benefits there doesn't work


You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.

permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent

[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*


That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ

t to live and work in UK.


permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.

permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent

[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago


My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and

Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?

permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have

strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.

I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago

Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E

U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.

People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a

re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(


permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent

[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago


Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems

elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent

load more comments (3 replies)


load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q

ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo

uldn't necessarily share their view with.


Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo

uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.

permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago

I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)

has the very opposite effect of what you want.


Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.

That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I

think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people

standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is

the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent

[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago


A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)

load more comments (4 replies)


[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about

blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines

Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine

/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago

Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.


permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."

permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent

[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago


Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.

permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l

ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.


I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago


A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som

ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent

[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago


There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent

[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago


Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent

[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago


They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.

permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts

with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living

in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago

Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.

Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit


s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa

rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).

permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink

[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago


I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent

[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago


Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.

It is all for show all these security measures.


permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*

[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago

I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce

permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect

ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P

They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking

:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even

want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago

Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?


permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.

permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but

I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation

al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain


some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply

as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.


If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago

Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?


Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism

, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)


permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu

s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili

ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).

There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink

[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago


I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people

here - but I am not complaining.


Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago

64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.

permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki

ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools

mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium

/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)


/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop

List of European English-language news sources


Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago

Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden


loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago

99.99% of the time, we're perfect.


permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago

Hey that's other cook


permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago


I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-consider-

voting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi

n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.


permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.

When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago

It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]

[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago


A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort

gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent

[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago


Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h

ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.

shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago

lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago

There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.


permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago

I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent

[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago


That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh

en complaining about "welfare leeches".


permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu

ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).

That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.

They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent

[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago


They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)

[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago


If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.

permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return

travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.

I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.

permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see

m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink

[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago


I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago


I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to

learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent

[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago


The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.

As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago

With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.

But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent

[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago


That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati

on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago

I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent

load more comments (20 replies)


[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo

ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago


I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked

at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co

llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".

permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit

Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar

/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth

EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago

Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!

permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago

Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago


Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent

[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago


The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago

And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is

we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that

it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago

True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime

, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.


permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.

If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago

point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent

[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago


What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife

False. Already debunked.


Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago

Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.

It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.


permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago


Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory

permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri

ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?


permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on

ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)

Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent

[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago


No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent

[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*


I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago

Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi

ty again for a connecting flight in America.


permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.

permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.

I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object

ively it's just the same.


permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of

the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago

If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic

iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l

ike beeing at home.


permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that

cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...


permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago

That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.

That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago

It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt

her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.

He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink

[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago


Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak

ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.

permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.

We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E

ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink

[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago


INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)

[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago


Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans

wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE

europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)


want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania

/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare

top 500 comments


sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent

[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago


Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago

Like Father, like son.


permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v

e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co

nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen

ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.


Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que

stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.

I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f

rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m

ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]

permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago

That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha

t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?


Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.

permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my

backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself

permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.

permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.

Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.

Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit


s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?

permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t

hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent

[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago


At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you

come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T

urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.

permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago

Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.

permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so

many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going

to be significantly better than any other.


Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi

grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I

won't hesitate as well :)


permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)

[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago


I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E

astern Europeans among Scandinavians?


permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl

y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.


There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus

t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P

permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu

rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*

[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad

guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago

The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago


and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a

fucked up form of white guilt.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink

[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago


I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent

[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*


hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i

f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO

NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!


Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino

/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago

Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:

"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me

permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from

how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink

[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago


Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.

My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)

permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega

rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I

have zero knowledge on).


permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m

inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc

ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago

Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent

load more comments (18 replies)


load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu

tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out

of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.

The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en

ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...

So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo

ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to


come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.

Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago

So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra


ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua

ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in


English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU

Of course people would say yes.


All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...

permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago

I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent

[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago


Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb

ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.


"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago

Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago


Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa

s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie

s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.

permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.

But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago

we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!


permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu

rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.

I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that

it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi


ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)

[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago


Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count

ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.

permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.

Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago


I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop

ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.


permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei

ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to


leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to

the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than

in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi

gration from outside the EEA.


https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise

jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats

English language subreddits of European countries:


/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:

Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.

permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent

[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago


always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago

MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,


permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago

60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.

permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe

They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent

[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago


As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago

It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago

I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)

[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago


Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent

[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago


We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/

dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.

permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent

[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago


Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY

permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.

That, too, is the same almost everywhere.


permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma

I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.

permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le

eching it problem I've seen in a long time.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or

high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago

Even changing singular to plural would change the results.


A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago

That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent

[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago


that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b

ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.

I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.


permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent

[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*


25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus

permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.

permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"

permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.

permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne

therlands and it's culture, etc.


permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago

in the pitch black at 2pm :(


permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.

permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are

revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis

cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I

t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d


emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien

t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago

This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.

permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago

I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir


eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax

is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent

load more comments (5 replies)


[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago

You're right and make some good points.


You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.

I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration

depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.

permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget

<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech

/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index

"... of Europe" picture series


Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago

without being that ugly


Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago


You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent

load more comments (7 replies)


[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread

[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago


Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago

Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities

X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent

[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago


I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago

The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati

ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck

and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago

Danger to avian wildlife


No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th

e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice

LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.

I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent

[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago


It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent

[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago


Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.

I have a feeling it would be very similar.


permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]

[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago


That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits

In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is

this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago

What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you

come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.

permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago

Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o


r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago

When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?

permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger

many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.

permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago

Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas

t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago

Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago

Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i

ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se

nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even

are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged

areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec

ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.


Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago

Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour

Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago

Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.


permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha

tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.


permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago

What is the source of this data?


Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl

d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS

FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland

/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666

ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago

as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent

[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago


We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte

ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent

[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago


Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago

You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.


permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*

I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou

tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.

That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago

There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.

That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?

permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin

t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h

ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)

[ ][deleted] 1 month ago


[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr

eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the

re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago

Treated as superior by whom?


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago

Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)


But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo

ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski

ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he

had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".


permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P

(jk we're kind of in the same pot)


permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso

nally not been in a European airport that made me do this


permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!

permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.

permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y

ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago

Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.

Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would

be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the

hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to

go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?

You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s


permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?

permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago


Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?

Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.

From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago

Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe

n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu

shing their property prices up.


permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes

down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan

ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink

[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago


How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop

le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago

The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.


permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago


"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'

permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink

[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago


You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)

shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco

/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t

hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!


permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!

permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent

[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago


filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago


As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!

I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago

I think you mean all the time.


permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago

What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago

Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more

easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and

so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?

permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m

ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago

I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent

[ ][deleted] 1 month ago


[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent

[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago


Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink

[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago


I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.

permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago

I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.


benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole

; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,

46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago

Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh

oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago

Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent

[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago


The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan

d area so don't expect them to have much patience.


On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago


Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co

ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.

P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top

of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago

That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...

Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be

en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent

[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago


Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a

re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British

history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor

kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola

tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760

permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out

young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl

y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise


wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".

permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*

Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago

Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago


We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)

"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."


permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.

permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people

... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden

/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago

People, what a bunch o' bastards.


permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago

In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin


g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago

Shiny. Let's be bad guys.


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking

English and a second language. You guys should be proud.


Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even

permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent

[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago


I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le

ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini

umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that

it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago

The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing

Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein

g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th


e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.

Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.

permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago

May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."

permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.

I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s

permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou

ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago

No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m

uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...

Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.

Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.

I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b

efore she died. Arrogant cunt.


permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun

d out that I was specifically targeted for this.


permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago

I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala


is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

load more comments (15 replies)


[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent

[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago


But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]

[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago


France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se

en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo

r workers from other EU countries.


permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.

permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an

d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never

really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.

The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.


permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent

[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago


The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.

permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s

ure Denmark would at least.


People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of

the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh

it economies compared to the UK.


It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British

jobs for British people".


He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of

Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean

, especially since expansion.


permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay

off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago

Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette

rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan

/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture

Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago

Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.


permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago

Very occasionally, of course.


permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent

[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago


And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb

er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent

[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago


Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r

e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards

. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".


permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.

permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.

permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person

Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago

A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*


What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife

False. Already debunked.


No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x

262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.

permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at

other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants

Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent

load more comments (10 replies)


[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m

igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think

about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago

I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.


Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing

Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab


solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take

my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.


permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago

maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago

All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)

[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago


That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling

to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago

Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average

between stay and go without renegotiated terms.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.

permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent

[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago


Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent

[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago


Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward

, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without


saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br

itish sentiment in my opinion.


permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.

True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those

are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea

lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.


When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago

You can have him!


permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago

Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since

they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago

British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows


permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and

even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.

permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.

permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re

garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app

reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France

/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)


/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators

MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be

avoided. It will still run fairly straight.


permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!

permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other

people's cultures and the Dutch.


permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago

You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent

[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago


I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar

results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).

permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent

[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago


I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?

I'll take 2, please.


permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta

nt to spend any money.


On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic

ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice

Have a few reasons :)


permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.

Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.

permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago

No. It's called hypocrisy.


permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.

For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago

It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.

permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.

Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing

or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago

I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi

s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s

imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.


The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.

(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)


permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.

permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)

[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago


Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)

[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago


They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago

I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent

[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago


They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment

rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis

tent with no voters being hypocritical.


permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago

I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En

glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?

permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent

[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago


Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene

ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.

Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving

on our past successes.


permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.

It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'

permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago

I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.


It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research

permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.

The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat

ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi

fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.


Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un

less they're very wealthy or something.


permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme

permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS

OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo

/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729

How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)


submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma

terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago

Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you

are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!

permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.

permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago

Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.


Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag

ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I

don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c

alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.

permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.

permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar

ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago

Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago

It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par

t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)

[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago


Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago

Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.

One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben

efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent

load more comments (4 replies)


[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?

permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent

[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago


London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago

Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent

load more comments (6 replies)


[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"

Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.

I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.

Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?


permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea

l their money and collapse their social care.


People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you

point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.


At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*

My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?

permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent

[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago


I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens

ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.

permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the

slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't

be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr

uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent

[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago


The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent

[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago


They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.

permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin

ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s

ome more doctors


permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago

Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent

[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*


No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago

I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago

I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.

permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe

unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal

/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to

pay for that!


permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago


Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!

permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.

permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink

[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago


He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago

You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent

[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago


it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po

se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.

permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.

permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an

d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago

Not to mention all that wind...


permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w

ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.

. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool

permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,

very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php

"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)

The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago

This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren

t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked


for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago

Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.


permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o

f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains


t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink

[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*


I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago

Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security

guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.


permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.

I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*

Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi

nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b

oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent

load more comments (6 replies)


[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.

Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you


try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent

[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago


Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma

s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi

ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.


The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago


Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.

permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo

re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re

ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)

[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago


You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.

permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the

ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.

permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked

beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.

On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink

[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago


Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.

I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago

My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about

team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:

Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org


Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:

/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)


/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent

[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago


Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago

That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago

*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t

o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago

It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago


Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago

When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s

ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though

, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago

One is white noise, I suppose.


permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?

Edit- 'compensation' maybe


permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr

ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.

permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago


wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago

IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.

permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent

[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago


Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad

permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize

ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.


Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)

[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago


Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT

of people to suddenly come and invade you.


permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare

ly look at your id.


permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent

[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago


Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago

I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.

permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago

Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent

[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago


Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink

[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago


You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz

en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent

[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago


Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago

Except when its muddy snow goo.


permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha

t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.


Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts

and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri

ct the subject to a British context.


I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref

lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent

[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago


Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago

I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and

other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.


permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi

tably create tensions and one sided opinions.


As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H

e's studying in the Netherlands.


Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from

your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work

vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)

[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago


I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and

work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension

chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria

/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:

"What do you know about ... ?" index


"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.

permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent

[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago


100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent

[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago


Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their

country in the sky.


permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent

[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago


No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent

load more comments (3 replies)


load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre

b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans

to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw


here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?

permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage

. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago


Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi

ng them in their vicinity.


permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.

Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.

sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.

permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent

[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago


Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many

people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce

nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent

[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago


One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou

nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor

ing 'ordinary people'.


permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.

permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same

way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro

m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago

Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.


permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo

ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?


Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t

he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.


permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago

I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent

[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*


It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s

hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D

enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.


permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.

permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago

Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.


permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.

Was it the same for you guys?


permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau

se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar

ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re

tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher

s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.


permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago

EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question


up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what

the tabloids claim will happen


permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a

part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.

I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

load more comments (1 reply)


load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent

[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago


The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago

Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.

REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey

/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12

Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas

s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.


permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago

Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...

permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form

and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).

So why not stay? :D


permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones

emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i


s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent

[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago


I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying

this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent

[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago


Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.

permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?

permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o

I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk

Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.

permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent

[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago


Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen

s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.


permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago

If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.


permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink

[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago


10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).

If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia


l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.

permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.

permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.

Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(

permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent

[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago


I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago

Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?

permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent

[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)

[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*


As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi

cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.

In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent

[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago


I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent

[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago


Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent

[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago


Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago


Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the

re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou

t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.

permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent

[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago


I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan

tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.

permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st

udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago

Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra

nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.

permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other

EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English

this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014


2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia

/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best

[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago


The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!

permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent

[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago


Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago

Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent

load more comments (4 replies)


[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent

[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago


I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is

essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel

s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent

[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago


To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of

f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago

Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic


ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent

[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago


After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills

are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)

[ ][deleted] 1 month ago


[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"

I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago

Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago

Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.

EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize

ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.


Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)

[ ][deleted] 1 month ago


[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago

In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago


Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.

(guessing, could be bs)


permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t

heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th

an in other European countries.


permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.

It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago

I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,

foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago

I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s

ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before

moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU

law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent

[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago


We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry

permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent

[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago


Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall

y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.


I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)

I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*

Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can

stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago

Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900


1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*

British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.

permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev

ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam


a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts

are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!

i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.

permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!

Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia

/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.

Ugh, why are people so stupid.


permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus

e of, uh, reasons!"


permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago

Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.

permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.

permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me

anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago

They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased

questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent

[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago


A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent

[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago


I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?

permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago


Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit

h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.

permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so

suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b

ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.

permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".

permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.

One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?

permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.

In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the

UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago

so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.

I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your

right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire

s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?


permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."

Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.

But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.

permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago

Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)

permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent

[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago


Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can

stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are

superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again

because it's not fresh on my mind.


Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:

they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new

s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago


A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)

[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago


Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai

n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:

The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink

[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago


This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).

However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho


w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.

permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn

less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor

ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help

wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania

/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail

Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago

Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p


permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago

We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.


permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.

permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent

[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago


Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago

He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin

with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

load more comments (10 replies)


[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent

ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li

ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?

permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t

here's a lot of resistance.


permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago

Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards

https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago

I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent

load more comments (5 replies)


[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent

[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi


nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago

TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.

Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.

permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.

permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it

permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.

permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent

[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago


I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp

ace is something I would say was significant.


permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago

That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.


permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago

Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago

Show me a developed country where this isn't true.


permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago

You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent

[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago


That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent

[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago


As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago

Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the

German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not

want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br

itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.

Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!

permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago

As an spaniard, I find it so funny.


permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita

than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.


permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink

[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago


It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago

"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1

77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink

[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago


Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.

Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago

I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold

store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)

/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide

Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?

permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!

permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago

[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.

permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago

Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.

People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t

he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.

permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.

On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.

permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon

shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.

Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa

n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the

value of their property.


permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard

' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.


When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I

'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.


permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago


That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on

e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas

Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent

load more comments (7 replies)


load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.

permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago


I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago

I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than

trips to the US, or at most on par.


permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago

Birmingham's like that.


permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,

they didn't notice he had just walked through either.


permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago

I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh

ould have the right to do it.


But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago


This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul

ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate

d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.

permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th

e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent

[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago


I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r

ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc

h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.

I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing

his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.

permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).

Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.


http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink

[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago


It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*

Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.

permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago

I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..

permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS

-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy

/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK

??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU

permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.

permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!

permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent

[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago


steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition

to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.

permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e

permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P

permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago

A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.

permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.

This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]

load more comments (4 replies)


load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul

dn't need them


permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou

ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.


I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h

ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.


permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p

oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i

mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent

[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago


Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent

load more comments (6 replies)


[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent

[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago


That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago

They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..


permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago

Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent

[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago


Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't

come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.

permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea

k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about

it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.

That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.


permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent

[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago


Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit

ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago

Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.

permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British

media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.

If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part

of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers

on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent

[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago


British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.

permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe

permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info

edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink

[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago


You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"

permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago

Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les

s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin

Submit a new link


Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands

/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink

[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago


Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago

And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat

permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.

Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent

[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago


Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

load more comments (1 reply)


load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago


Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance

So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo

k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago


...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l

ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).


What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an

d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.


permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago

After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby

in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.

permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago

I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]

[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago


Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi

ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...


(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we

're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago

Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali

sed economy IMHO.


permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.

permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv

e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in

the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.

permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr

ain
I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.

Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who

shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come

in through airports anyways.


I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent

[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago


Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even

more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that

doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.


People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li

ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.

permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)

don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the

same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people

are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU

members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo


uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.

That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.


permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)

[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago


I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag

ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)


has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c

limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago

As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I


think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2

Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'

t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is


the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.

permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent

load more comments (8 replies)


load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)

about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.

Community Rules and Guidelines


Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey

/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent

[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago


Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power

grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."


permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent

load more comments (1 reply)


load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.

permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago

Time for a song of patriotic prejudice


permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and

the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig

ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.


permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago

I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.

permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e

ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?

permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".

permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.

permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago

Would she like it? :)


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close

to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago

Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts


with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t

he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po

ints 1 month ago


Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he

re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.

There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie

t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.

permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.

permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt

op while in the air.


It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent

[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*


[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent

[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago


I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra

nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago

Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and

is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France

perceived as English speaking


:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.

Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent

[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago


Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago

Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.


permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.

Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago

Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.

From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent

[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago


Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur

opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago

It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.

permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.

But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th

e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.

permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.

Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent

[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago


64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.

London is a different story.


permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance

of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki


ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us

tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus

/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics

Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop


List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent

[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago


Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent

[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago


99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)

[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago


Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing

http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.

Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles

s of what you may prefer.


When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink

[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago


It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago

[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago

I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.

At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.

permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o

In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon

Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)

[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago


lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent

[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago


There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)

[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago


I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.

permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago

Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh


en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.

Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a

t the bottom end, but not by much).


That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor

t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.

permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent

load more comments (3 replies)


[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There

's no way this could work out in your favor.


permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago

Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return


travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G

ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.


I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into

the Schengen area will have to go through the same.


permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une

mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.

permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago

I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h

as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.

permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b

it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent

[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago


With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the

Empire is what baffles me.


But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.

permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin

es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati


on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent

[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago


I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.

permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)

When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink

load more comments (1 reply)


[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe

r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago

Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago

A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne

ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit

Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany

/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort

EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent

[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago


Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago

Hey, we invited you!


permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink

[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago


Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...

permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent

[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago


And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago

I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity

(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent

[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago


True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see

their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and

so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent

[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago


point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.

permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago

Danger to avian wildlife


False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent

[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago


Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's

also happening in our backyard.


It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago

*Land of hope and glory


permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne

eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have

to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point

system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)


Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.

permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.

permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent

[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago


Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago

For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred

ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o

n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK

border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island

Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.


permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because

I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink

[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago


If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati

ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic


iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel

t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago

The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th

at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent

[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago


That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for

the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent

[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago


It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor

bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago

Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.


He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.

permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago

Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago

We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa

me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants

are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)

permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent

load more comments (4 replies)


[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago

Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE

MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein

/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527

1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.

permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent

[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago


Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.

permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago

I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago

Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of

a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.

Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i

s essentially a giant canvas.


I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov

e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago

Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago

[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)

[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago


That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).

Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env

ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r

uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.

EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself


permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.

But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody

wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.


Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio

n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu

ilding houses instead).


permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago

So you do want me but don't want a Pole?


permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.
It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago

Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:
British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU
Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli

ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i
was going to be there. And this was Canada...
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!

permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent
[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago
I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago

We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.

Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila
delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in

the graphic of this post.


permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago
Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent

[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago


Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.

EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago
It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not

only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago
I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in

Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less
, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago

That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo
to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t

o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent
[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago
we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent

load more comments (28 replies)


[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago

I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d
egrees depending on education and self-awareness.
I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to

the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess -

it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.

But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.
I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa

l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire
world, if asked in the right way.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago
It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.
permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)

[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*


[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti
nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders

Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent

[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago


The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and
if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k
m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad

watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'
you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.

permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat
s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.

permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.
Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago

Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code
advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200

FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO


NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here
IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia

/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia
Other European subreddits you might enjoy:
Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent

[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago


Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.
That's Dutch people for ya.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y

ears old) situation in my district:


"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago

You can't take the sky from me


permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago

Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent
[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago
MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.

permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago
60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd

see more egalitarian attitudes.


My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count
ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !

(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places
they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.

The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point
of the question. The question is all the other people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago

Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago

For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago
It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.

TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc


ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago
I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent

[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago


Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent
load more comments (14 replies)
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".

permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.

A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago

I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *
Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill

on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b

e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en


ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st

ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.

I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago
Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma
I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote

ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.


Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be
completely starved for money either.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent

[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago


So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago
A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Romaniacbr777 2 points 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Holy shit! Talk about an absurd fucking idea, so you want poor countries to actu
ally pay benefits to people that don't actually live in those countries anymore
and won't spend any of that money in those countries anyway? That's not even cou
nting the fact that those poor countries already payed for the emigrant's educat
ion and probably won't get anything in return.
Just how fucking stupid do you have to be to propose such a moronic idea? How is
this nothing more than a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich?
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 8 points 1 month ago
I've been chattin lately with my British friend who: 1. is UKIP supporter 2. wan
ts to migrate to Australia. Do I have to continue what was his view on the point
system to be introduced in UK, and having to meet it in Aus? :)
Disc: it is an anecdata and I'm aware of that. I'm not making any general realis
ation on that basis.
permalink
[ ]billtipp 14 points 1 month ago
A British man stopped at immigration in Sydney airport replied when asked if he
had any criminal convictions "Why, is it still mandatory?".
permalinkparent
[ ]ginger_beer_m 3 points 1 month ago
Ah ... The convict jokes, they never get old.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Nederlandjothamvw 2 points 1 month ago
So you do want me but don't want a Pole?
permalink
[ ]Scotlandggow 15 points 1 month ago
In theory, the point system that UKIP propose is nothing to do with nationality.
It'd likely focus on what skills gaps the UK had, English proficiency, and so o
n. In that sense, it's hard to say if the UKIP system would prefer you to a Pole
; I'd imagine there are tonnes of poles who'd get more points than you just beca
use of the nature of their skills vis-a-vis whatever yours are.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 2 points 1 month ago*
That's the same logic for when people in the US were proposing literacy as one o
f the conditions to be allowed to vote. In theory it doesn't discriminate agains
t African-Americans, but in reality - that's pretty much ALL it does.

It's the same way when you consider the skill gaps UK has, and especially langua
ge proficiency - an average Dutch person is almost certain to be more fluent in
English than an average Polish person.
In any case, the idea of free movement is to take the good with the bad. If your
only desire is to be a brain-drain on the rest of the continent, without also t
aking in contingents of less skilled workers to compensate, then that's pretty m
uch a deal breaker. That is not something that a friendly/co-operative state wou
ld do, it's something that a rival state does (ie US acquisition of German/Sovie
t intellectual elite).
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]xelah1 5 points 1 month ago
Imagine putting everyone in a list with the most desirable (educated, skilled, m
otivated) employees at the top. People higher up the list but in lower-income or
high-unemployment countries have been coming to the UK and competing for low-en
d jobs which people at the bottom end of the list here also want.
Of course, those people often do the jobs well, spend their incomes and increase
output and employment here. And it'd be silly to assume that this situation wil
l never happen the other way round in the future. But people mostly don't think
about that.
(From what I remember, it's been studied and found that it does reduce incomes a
t the bottom end, but not by much).
That's why people don't care so much about people from richer countries. It's al
so why its sometimes seen as an elite vs working-class issue - politicians ignor
ing 'ordinary people'.
permalinkparent
[ ]NetherlandsCespur 1 point 1 month ago
What's that?
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Norwayteaprincess 6 points 1 month ago
My job involves finding qualified people for jobs and I hate when people use thi
s argument. We have to look overseas for people with the right skills and experi
ence all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 3 points 1 month ago
No one respects Java programmers now a days.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 4 points 1 month ago
As a Python programmer, I'm not feeling sorry for them at all. :P
(jk we're kind of in the same pot)
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]akathefundraiser 1 point 1 month ago
What about C# and .NET programmers?
permalinkparent
[ ]weewolf 1 point 1 month ago
Not sure, I know a lot of Romanian Java programmers.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 14 points 1 month ago
Oh, cool this again:
Confused Britain: EU citizens should have right to live and work in UK: 36% Yes,
46% No. UK citizens should have right to live and work in EU: 52% Yes, 26% No.
Sunday Independent poll: 52% of UK adults believe Brits should have right to liv
e and work anywhere in the EU, but only 36% believe EU citizens should have righ
t to live and work in UK.
permalink
[ ]I-Will-Wait 24 points 1 month ago*
I really hate the semantics of this question:

British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the EU


Of course people would say yes.
All citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the
UK.
I have a contention with that 'All'. It really puts a negative spin on the quest
ion before it's even asked. Simply change it to...
Citizens of other EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK.
...and I think you would have different results.
permalink
[ ]Romaniacilica 5 points 1 month ago
I also found that "All" to be odd, to say the least. It makes you think of A LOT
of people to suddenly come and invade you.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americathecoffee 2 points 1 month ago
Even changing singular to plural would change the results.
A Person is a decent fellow, but People are assholes.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 209
points 1 month ago
I was surprised how similar traveling to the UK was to arriving at a US airport.
Sure you can go through the automated passport scanner if you have a EU passpor
t but still, it was unlike anything I've seen at other European airports.
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomJanloys 131 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here. Also, they aren't really checking up on anything, other then you are
who you claim to be, you can come in with EU id card if you wish.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 9 points 1 month ago
That's not true at all. As an American, flying into the mainland is incredibly s
imple. Passport control takes about 10 seconds.
The UK? So many questions. A form to fill in (like the US). Long lines.
permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumbudtske 77 points 1 month ago*
I'm treated differently comming back from the UK then going to it.
Also landing in heathrow its all US style shoes off metal scanner etc for a conn
ecting flight .
As long as you don't leave the airport and are on a connecting flight I've perso
nally not been in a European airport that made me do this
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 158 points 1 month ago
That's likely because the UK isn't a part of the Schengen Area.
permalinkparent
[ ]letmepostjune22 2 points 1 month ago
London is the largest airport hub in the world. Get loads of interconnecting fli
ghts so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as t
hey don't have dedicated terminals. I couldn't imagine the airports do stuff the
y'd rather not because, money.
(guessing, could be bs)
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing from North America in the UK is quite different than landing from North
America in Continental Europe. You get asked a lot more questions in the UK, in
the rest of the EU, you don't even have to open your mouth.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyaqswdefrgthzjukilo 4 points 1 month ago
Now you can imagine how we fell landing in NA. Last time i actually had to show
the border agent all my hotel reservations and flights for each and every day i

was going to be there. And this was Canada...


permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomChippiewall 2 points 1 month ago
so I'm guessing Schengen Area get the same treatment as all the others as they d
on't have dedicated terminals.
Schengen Area gets the same treatment because the UK isn't in the Schengen area.
Cost isn't the factor, from the UK's perspective there is nothing intrinsically
different about the schengen area.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionReilly616 2 points 1 month ago
Nah. Ireland isn't either, and flying into an Irish airport is lovely! They bare
ly look at your id.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalpasteleiro 2 points 1 month ago
That doesn't explain why going into the UK from Schengen would be different from
the reverse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Finlandorbat 4 points 1 month ago*
Ah, I was referring to the connecting flight bit; they might have been crossing
Schengen Area borders. Or it could also be that UK airport security is run by ab
solute cunts, which isn't exactly unlikely either.
permalinkparent
[ ]vooffle 1 point 1 month ago
They don't do security checks when you land, only passport control. In the same
way, they do check your passports when flying out of a Schengen country into the
UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 25 points 1 month ago
I've never been to a UK one that made me remove my shoes or whatever, out of Eas
t mids, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Gatwick or Luton. Perhaps Heathrow just sucks.
(or maybe I'm just phenomenally lucky I guess?)
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 36 points 1 month ago
Had to take off my shoes at Edinburgh airport and got laughed at for my odd sock
s :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 16 points 1 month ago
Your socks are fabulous!
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandWarfare_by_Words 13 points 1 month ago
They were. If I remember correctly one had robots on them..
permalinkparent
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 1 point 1 month ago
Robotic cavity searches used to be a dream of many. Now, they're the way forward
!
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 9 points 1 month ago
At least at Glasgow & Edinburgh, whether or not everbody or nobody has to take t
heir shoes off seems to depend on the preferences of the individual security gat
e staff.
At least, that's my observation. Two gates open, left one has everyone taking sh
oes off, right one has nobody. I'll take the right, thanks, but I'm sure a "shoe
bomber" would be able to make the same observation.
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 4 points 1 month ago
My 11 year old brother had to remove his shoes in Gatwick, although the security
guard wasn't a cunt about it, seemed nearly apologetic really.
permalinkparent

[ ]The EmpireSpeed_Junkie 4 points 1 month ago


I had to take my shoes off in Mlaga airport.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 2 points 1 month ago
I didn't have to remove my shoes.
I accidently seemed to have taken two opened 0,5l water bottles in the plane, an
d was reminded that I had a pocket knife in my laptop bag when I grabbed my lapt
op while in the air.
It is all for show all these security measures.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 2 points 1 month ago
Not brown enough
permalinkparent
[ ]Currently in Tyrolanders_ 1 point 1 month ago
that's probably it
permalinkparent
[ ]British/Welsh in StrasbourgJoe64x 1 point 1 month ago
I've never had to take my shoes off in a British airport. But I did have to take
my shoes off yesterday at Madrid Barajas airport for a flight to Paris.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]ScotlandYunikoYokai 1 point 1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, you need to do this for domestics as well. Flew fro
m Glasgow to Heathrow and back on the same day earlier this year; shoes off in s
ecurity (both at Glasgow and Heathrow), face cameras at Heathrow before boarding
the plane. I don't think Glasgow had the cameras though, could be wrong.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland!DeadeyeDuncan 1 point 1 month ago
I've had to do it in CDG. It just depends on the Airport design. If the arrivals
feeds into a common area before you can get to the transfer area, it makes sens
e that you need to get re scanned.
permalinkparent
[ ]cajones32 1 point 1 month ago
For what it's worth, I have never had to take my shoes off, or go through securi
ty again for a connecting flight in America.
permalinkparent
[ ]Ulsterossetepo 1 point 1 month ago
I had the same experience on a connection in Ecuador. Which is odd because on in
ternal flights they don't care about anything you bring into the airport.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedentheCroc 1 point 1 month ago
Manchester airport is the only one in europe so far that made me go through the
full body scanner. I was going home to Sweden.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]therationalparent 17 points 1 month ago
We get treated exactly the same when we go to mainland Europe as you do when you
come here.
That's not really true. Security at British airports tends to be much tighter th
an in other European countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Europese UnieFirePhantom 24 points 1 month ago
Wrong. As an American who lives in the UK and frequently travels to and from the
Netherlands and the rest of Europe
by boat, plane, and, once in a blue moon, tr
ain I can definitely say that the UK Boarder Agency is more like US Customs and
Border Protection than the equivalent agency of every other European country I'v
e been to.
I have been harassed again and again by UK Boarder Agency officers who are wholl
y ignorant of the law.

permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 10 points 1 month ago
Likewise.
I got harassed by UKBA for having a foreign-registered car. They could not compr
ehend that someone would ever leave their island paradise.
One of them in Calais genuinely tried to stop me getting to see my grandmother b
efore she died. Arrogant cunt.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Ivashkin 13 points 1 month ago
I agree and I live in the UK. Tel Aviv airport security are more chilled than LH
R security. There is one blond women in T5 who questions me every time I come ba
ck like I'm a terrorist (can't seem to fathom someone flying out in the AM and b
ack in the PM) and every time my portable charger is pulled for additional check
s. They once xrayed my passport on its own twice. Hate the place.
permalink
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
maybe the act of brushing my teeth in one of the bathrooms threw up some alarms.
I always make sure my stays on airport restrooms are as short as possible. There
's no way this could work out in your favor.
permalink
[ ]HallandUgion 1 point 1 month ago
Always want clean teeth before your suicide bombing.
permalink
[ ]Irelandcarlmango11 1 point 1 month ago
Totally agree. My experiences getting through Heathrow (even for a connection) o
r Stansted (to Dublin, supposedly a common travel area) have all been worse than
trips to the US, or at most on par.
permalink
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]mamoswined 5 points 1 month ago
Really? Because as an American flying to Sweden going through customs was incred
ibly easy and fast. In the UK it was similar to flying to the US.
permalinkparent
[ ]originalthoughts 3 points 1 month ago
Landing in the UK and going through customs is much more of a hastle than landin
g in mainland Europe. In UK, they ask me a bunch of questions each time, what am
I doing, where am I going, etc... Continental Europe, it is all, hello, thank y
ou, bye.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 10 points 1 month ago
Well at Birmingham airport, border security yelled at me that I had a "Bu'ule".
"A BU'ULE!!!!"
Only when I, after much confusion, held up my belt-buckle, they managed to commu
nicate that I had indeed forgotten a small water bottle in my backpack.
Then about 2 minutes later, a uniformed guy asked me if I had any money on me. T
urns out they were interested in larger sums than the 50 quid I carried in my wa
llet.
It really was like travelling to the US. The only thing missing was the iris-sca
nner.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 6 points 1 month ago
The only thing missing was the iris-scanner.
Is this a joke?
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionzombiepiratefrspace 5 points 1 month ago*
Uhm no?
When I entered the United States for the first (and probably last) time at Phila

delphia airport, I had to give an iris scan. If my memory isn't mistaken, everyb
ody coming out of my plane went through that procedure.
"Your passport please. Please look into the device with your left eye. Now your
right eye..."
EDIT: I'm usually quite vocal about these things, but having already landed, I h
ad not options, really. I'd be a bit additionally annoyed, though, if I now foun
d out that I was specifically targeted for this.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 9 points 1 month ago
I seriously couldn't tell, that is just dystopic for me and a good reason to avo
id the US until they have their stuff sorted out.
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americatemp_bigot 8 points 1 month ago
until they have their stuff sorted out.
I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on that one.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SverigeSvampnils 2 points 1 month ago
Same for me in LAX. Iris-scanner and fingerprints. A few questions on my return
travel plans, Q: "are you thinking of staying here illegaly after 90 days", and
are you planning to work while here. And ofc the usual what is the purpose of yo
ur visit, buisness or pleasure. I thought to my self, why so similar questions?
Are they unsure of me? Did I do this right!?
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]05banks 2 points 1 month ago
Birmingham's like that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 55 points 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island but want to roam freely o
n our mainland.
I'm failing to see the problem here. Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our i
sland?
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 35
points 1 month ago
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying you should let illegal immigrants onto your so
il. Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't
come in through airports anyways. All I was saying is that arriving at London He
athrow (coming from within the EU nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me
than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, Germany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I just think it says a lot about the mentality of a country when you see how the
y design the process of entering their frontiers and maybe that's what we see in
the graphic of this post.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 10 points 1 month ago
I fly frequently and never noticed any real difference but I don't fly through H
eathrow, which you must remember is the busiest airport in Europe and the 3rd bu
siest in the world while Frankfurt is 12th and is twice the size in terms of lan
d area so don't expect them to have much patience.
On top of that I would think UK airports feel more of a duty to keep people who
shouldn't be here out whilst in Europe what good is it if Germany airports have
strict control if one of the other schengen countries does not. Especially if yo
u look at the current situation in Calais I think you would find it difficult fi
nding people who would agree we should be more relaxed about it.
permalinkparent

[ ]Switzerlandargh523 3 points 1 month ago


Why the hell would you risk confrontation with the authorities just to go the th
e UK when you're already in the much larger schengen area that includes countire
s much more friendly to illegal immigrants?
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure, ask these guys http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/28/cala
is-migrants-willing-to-die-britain-french-mayor-natacha-bouchart-uk-benefits-fra
nce
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Heathrow has only 25% more flights/year than Frankfurt, so the difference is cle
arly due to other factors.
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 2 points 1 month ago*
25% more flights and over 20,000 more passengers a year in less than half the sp
ace is something I would say was significant.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomspookytrip 19 points 1 month ago
All I was saying is that arriving at London Heathrow (coming from within the EU
nonetheless) seemed a lot less inviting to me than i.e. arriving in Frankfurt, G
ermany coming home from across the Atlantic.
I noticed this when flying between the UK and Amsterdam actually. When I arrived
back home they were much more stringent with the passport checks, compared to t
he guy at Schiphol who barely even glanced at my passport.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomTheOnlyZyria 7 points 1 month ago
When i was in Greece the passport checking staff were all on their phones, my li
ttle brother didn't notice that he had to show his passport and walked through,
they didn't notice he had just walked through either.
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 10 points 1 month ago
I travel a lot between Germany and the UK (and also the USA). For me, the experi
ence is the same in the UK and Germany. Although it's always nice to see the UK
border agency - it feels like home. Germany feels less inviting, although object
ively it's just the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]That country that sounds similar to the one with the kangaroos.desentizised 5 p
oints 1 month ago
Curious that you would say that. For me it was pretty much the opposite so far.
Maybe you're sent through different terminals with friendlier people when you're
a UK citizen? Just kidding.
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 8 points 1 month ago
If anything they're unfriendlier.
Why would anyone dare leave this sacred isle?
permalinkparent
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 2 points 1 month ago
Heh heh. I think mostly it's simply that the UK feels comfortable to me. I mean,
Germans are nice enough but despite their best efforts they're still, you know,
foreign.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Delenda est monarchiaangry_spaniard 1 point 1 month ago
Of course it's different on the mainland where most illegals probably don't come
in through airports anyways.
I know that during bubble years most illegal immigrants came through airports wi
th tourist visa to Spain from Morocco and South America. The black ones in the b
oats and the fences of Ceuta and Melilla are a really hopeless and poor minority
.

permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Indeed, You might even say we have an "Island Mentality."
Chuckles at own wit, puts pipe back into one's mouth
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (15 replies)
[ ]mallewest 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah that is pretty shortsighted. It's not a problem from an egoistical perspect
ive.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandGavinZac 1 point 1 month ago
Why would we want 'sketchy' things on our island?
-- Cyprus
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 5 points 1 month ago
That has more to do with extensive anti-terror legislation in the UK.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]IcelandMrPuffin 2 points 1 month ago
That's because you were leaving the Schengen area. British tourists coming into
the Schengen area will have to go through the same.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 7 points 1 month ago
I was in Berlin the week before last, its exactly the same as any British airpor
t. Maybe you're mistaking the difference between major world wide airports and s
mall EU only airports?
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenWelcomeToOurWorld 1 point 1 month ago
I didn't even have to show ID when I went to Scotland 2 months ago, are you by a
ny chance uhh.. middle eastern?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionHrodrik 1 point 1 month ago
They make sure nothing sketchy comes onto their island
Yet they allow Muslim fundamentalists in.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 27 points 1 month ago*
As much as I like like to bash the Brits whenever I can, because fuck the guiris
(just joking) in this case I feel that in most (all?) countries the bars would
be similar.
I am an immigrant myself, as many other Spaniards, and when I hear somebody spea
k about how the immigrants coming from Africa want to steal our money and collap
se our social care, I can't but remember than that many people in Europe still t
hink that Africa begins in the Pyrenees and that Spaniards go to Germany to stea
l their money and collapse their social care.
People think that their group is the special one.
EDIT: Spelling.
permalink
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 15 points 1 month ago
I can't but remember than many people in Europe still think that Africa begins i
n the Pyrenees
Africa begins just south of where the speaker lives, obviously. It's a rubber co
ntinent.
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 17 points 1 month ago
Estonia is literally Zimbabwe.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 4 points 1 month ago

It was an old said in France, when Spain was completely ruined (like if there wa
s a time when Spain wasn't ruined), supposed to be insulting and denying Portugu
ese people and Spaniards the European condition.
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
permalinkparent
[ ]Limburgsilverionmox 3 points 1 month ago
But I guess you are right. Except in Germany, for Bayern is the richest part and
is in the south :P
They're still pretty comfortable with having Africa start south of the Alps :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Frysln/BilkertTheActualAWdeV 2 points 1 month ago
Yes. Africa does begin to the south of my province.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainiagovar 4 points 1 month ago
Well, but that's not a fair comparison. Most of the inmmigrants from Spain are s
killed people, with at least one bachelor degree, into economies that, more or l
ess, are demanding qualifyed workers, while Spain has a labour market struggling
to provide enough jobs for those same qualifyed workers, and not to mention tho
se without studies, which, as far as I remember, is the vast majority of the une
mployment here. So adding more non-qualifyed people to the ecuation does not see
m help.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 14 points 1 month ago*
It is the same.
And it is not like they sell it in the news. There are a lot of Spaniards in Ger
many or in UK who go there to serve coffees and meanwhile improve their English
skills. I can tell it to you because I see it everyday. And I think that they sh
ould have the right to do it.
But anyway, Africans are persons too. They move where they think they can have a
better life, just as we did, escaping from a country with a 25% of unemployment
rate. Whenever somebody says "Those immigrants are stealing our jobs" I can but
reply "and we are proud of it", because I am an immigrant too and, just because
I am a physicist who is working, is not any less true that I took my job out of
the market for other Germans and I could be blamed for that.
The saddest thing is when you see some immigrants with very little or no qualifi
cation at all, whining about how bad is their situation and how little help they
receive of the welfare system and that it is not fair because they are European
s too; but still they rant about how the Africans come to Spain to collapse the
hospitals. The argument of not being European is the same as the argument of not
being German/British/etc. I could see some high qualified elitist ranting about
it, but the fact that people in the lowest tier of qualification believe that t
hey are any better just because they haven European passport baffles me. Yes, bu
t XXXX is European, that is the difference is a worrying common answer when you
point that XXXXX has no qualifications and is an immigrant in some EU country.
At the end, it is just a way to say that the same happens in every country, not
only in UK. You say that the Spanish immigrants have high qualifications, and so
many British people thinks about the British immigrant. In Spain, the low tier
immigrants come from Africa and in UK, from East Europe, supposedly. It is the s
ame. My point is that the same chart would be true in any country, because peopl
e always think that their immigrants are good enough but the ones who come are m
ostly bad.
P.S: I have struggled with a certain amount of xenophobic treatment within Europ
e, so I feel completely emphatic with those poor souls who have to struggle even
more just because had even less luck than us and weren't even born within the E
U borders.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Germanydvandyk 9 points 1 month ago

I wonder about the outcome for questions with respect to individual nationalitie
s. What about "should German citizens be allowed to live and work in the UK" , a
nd so on for the French, etc.
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]FranceimrealIybored 2 points 1 month ago
France
perceived as English speaking
:D
permalink
[ ]EnglandEd__ 1 point 1 month ago
You are on to something, UKIP do oft say things like "when it was france and Ger
many, countries similar to us economically maybe it was a good idea"
permalinkparent
[ ]NotCricket_ 9 points 1 month ago
Show me a developed country where this isn't true.
permalink
[ ]sprntgd 10 points 1 month ago
Loaded as fuck.
Remove the word "All" from the second question and see what happens.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomHawkUK 18 points 1 month ago
I get the feeling that a lot of people are effectively saying "No, EU citizens s
hould not come and work in the UK, but since they are we should damn well be all
owed to work over there." I somehow doubt that many are asking for a one-way str
eet.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomJohn_Wilkes 10 points 1 month ago
This looks worse than it actually is, because of the don't knows. 52% supporting
the British right and what looks like about 45% opposing the EU right is consis
tent with no voters being hypocritical.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomerythro 5 points 1 month ago
If you are thinking "how can there be such a great cognitive dissonance there?"
then let me try to explain.
In answer to the first question some people will answer yes. Some of those peopl
e will be thinking "yes, because there should be freedom of movement in the EU".
Others will be thinking "If they get freedom to come here, we should get it to
go there" - even though they likely disapprove of the whole concept of free move
ment.
That said some people will genuinely be full of crap.
permalink
[ ]Sweden (-> Bulgaria)59Nadir 4 points 1 month ago*
My girlfriend's sister and her husband are planning to move to England (from Bul
garia) for [potential?] work. I think it's a massive mistake, but growing up in
Sweden I don't have this idea that the UK (or any other place, really) is going
to be significantly better than any other.
Unless you secure a good job with good security before you move (as I did before
moving to Bulgaria), moving to any other country is most likely kind of a bad i
dea. I would advise people not to move to Sweden, for example, as getting in on
the job market in a totally different country is just a really bad idea. On top
of that most people do fine with English, but that doesn't mean you will fit in
or do well with anyone. People are generally curious about foreigners, but that
doesn't mean anything for you work-wise.
People see average wages and everything as some kind of pot of gold, but don't f
actor in the extreme differences in living expenses.
Going to Sweden/Norway/The UK to potentially starve for several months while you
try to secure a mediocre job so that you can then most likely starve, only less

, while sending money back to your home country is not a good idea.
permalink
[ ]Count_Blackula1 4 points 1 month ago
Why am I even subscribed to this sub? It seems like the only posts regarding the
UK are wholly negative when voicing an opinion about our government and there s
eems to be constant mud slinging at the British people as well. I've actually se
en this exact same implication about five times over the past few months. As if
you wouldn't get similar results in any other country.
Enough with the spite and ill-will Europeans, a lot of British people don't even
want to leave the EU and even if every last man woman and child wanted to leave
it still wouldn't warrant persistent digs at our population. As a British citiz
en this sub certainly doesn't endear me to the EU in any way. All it seems to be
is a forum for mainland Europeans to blow their own trumpets and champion some
EU utopia where Britain is overtly absent.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomPoachTWC 5 points 1 month ago
You're not alone there. I intend to vote to stay in the EU but every now and aga
in browsing this sub makes me think twice.
That being said, if you look at the opinion polls there's a dead heat on average
between stay and go without renegotiated terms.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 34 points 1 month ago
I suggest East Europeans who want to work and live in another country, come to D
enmark. We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
permalink
[ ]SerbiaOmegaVesko 24 points 1 month ago
Problem is though, many people already know English and don't want to learn anot
her foreign language when they move. I imagine that's why the UK is such a popul
ar destination.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 16 points 1 month ago
I know. That is the only problem. But then its a good thing that Denmark has the
highest English Proficiency for any country that doens't have english as a nati
ve language, in the whole world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Profic
iency_Index#2014_Rankings
permalinkparent
[ ]Romaniacilica 3 points 1 month ago
I'm sorry to bother you kind sir, but do you happen to know if your country is g
iving some sweet benefits for us to take without doing nothing just like UK has?
You know...some nice, juicy, sweet benefits? /s
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
Does Denmark have a requirement that immigrants have to learn the local language
, like they do here in the Netherlands?
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 11 points 1 month ago
That language requirement doesn't apply to EU citizens. EU citizens are not immi
grants (technically speaking) and have the right so live anywhere within the EU.
Making them meet extra conditions just to exercise that right is against the EU
law.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 3 points 1 month ago
That is kinda fucked up though. I thought the whole point of the "inburgering" w
as to adjust to life in the Netherlands, especially language wise. It seems a li
ttle backwards to only have a certain group of immigrants to adjust when there a
re plenty of EU immigrants who could use it. :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Germoneydonvito 7 points 1 month ago
Yes, but they're not immigrants. They're more like citizens who move from Venlo

to Amsterdam.
But that gives you also the right to move to Germany and not speak German if you
wish :)
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
Nope. If you're an asylum seeker, i think you have to. But there is no demand fo
r workers from other EU countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 1 point 1 month ago
Do you have a legal requirement? Would you mind to explain?
permalinkparent
[ ]Dartillus 3 points 1 month ago
Not 100% sure but I think that everybody that gets a visa after the 1st of Janua
ry 2013 has to go through an "inburgeringscursus". You learn Dutch, about The Ne
therlands and it's culture, etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 2 points 1 month ago
That's not the case with EU citizens. That is if you fx come from Africa or Asia
.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsHeyCupcake85 2 points 1 month ago
I'm not sure how it works for EU citizens, but I know my American husband has to
learn Dutch and take an exam to prove that he knows the language at a certain l
evel. It's definitely a requirement and he has 3 years to do it.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 16 points 1 month ago
Actualy many are considering that. If the Brexit becomes the reality, or at leas
t UKIP and such gains a serious majority pushing through their policies, people
I've been talking to are willing to consider other directions. Those who migrate
d to Denmark are happy about their decision :). In a matter of fact UK is the to
p direction for a sole reason - language. People are afraid they won't be able t
o communicate with locals thus will put themselves into the "ghetto", and the En
glish is the most commonly taught foreign language. Despite what isolationists s
ay, Poles (I guess other EE are not different from us) are generaly eager to mel
t into the local communities with leaving just as much of home customs to feel l
ike beeing at home.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 3 points 1 month ago
Denmark is the country with the highest English Proficiency for a non-native spe
aking country, in the whole world. So that won't be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EF_English_Proficiency_Index#2014_Rankings
But i know that it is the language part that makes many people immigrate to Brit
ain. But there is alternatives to GB. No need to put up with all that nonsense f
rom people like Farage and UKIP.
permalinkparent
[ ]dobrymalo 3 points 1 month ago
I must admit I didn't know that. I'll spread the news then, many will be happy t
o hear that. And if I ever find a nice company in Denmark I'd like to move for I
won't hesitate as well :)
permalinkparent
[ ]IcelandD4rK_Bl4eZ 16 points 1 month ago
We won't talk about you as many Brits do.
I don't know about that...
Dansk Folkeparti, the Danish equivalent to UKIP, is the biggest Danish party in
the European Parliament.
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 5 points 1 month ago
Yep, but they don't speak badly about East Europeans (with the exception of Roma
s). As long as you're not muslim or Roma, the DPP will most likely be quiet.
permalinkparent

[ ]etwa77 5 points 1 month ago


we would, but it's so damn cold over there..!
permalinkparent
[ ]EU Federalist, DenmarkFredeFup 24 points 1 month ago
Actually, Denmark isn't that cold. Kind of rainy, but so is GB. Its Norway and S
weden that gets very cold.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenyxhuvud 7 points 1 month ago
Well, snow is preferable to half a year of mud each year though.
permalinkparent
[ ]topforce 8 points 1 month ago
Except when its muddy snow goo.
permalinkparent
[ ]Possiblyreef 2 points 1 month ago
in the pitch black at 2pm :(
permalinkparent
[ ]Denmark_Dreamslayer_ 2 points 1 month ago
As a dane i will agree with you, barely saw snow last year...
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 3 points 1 month ago
Of course depending on where in these countries you stay. Norwegian west coast h
as a climate like the U.K with no snow in the winter and lot's of rain.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 1 point 1 month ago
Sweden actually gets more sunlight than the UK.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Doesn't mean it's not colder. They have 24hr daylight in the north. Are they all
sunbathing? Nyet.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyfjisdif 3 points 1 month ago
Since when is Denmark cold?
permalinkparent
[ ]fl1ndt 2 points 21 days ago
The entire country is warmed up by the Gulf Stream so no it isn't actually that
cold it can get a bit windy though cus no mountains...
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Wasnt Denmark seriously considering abolishing the Schenden treaty or at least r
e-introducing border checks?
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyBrainlaag 1 point 1 month ago
Apart from the language being an incomprehensible mess and the weather being gar
bage (don't take it personally, I'm a sunshine hot-weather guy), the main gripe
with Denmark is the incredibly high cost of living. EVERYTHING is way too expens
ive and most people end up being poorer there, regardless where they came from.
permalinkparent
load more comments (28 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 66 points 1 month ago
I don't know what's wrong with us, I'm so sorry
permalink
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 118 points 1 month ago
No need to be sorry! That question keeps bothering me for some time now. I've be
en trying to disuss that matter with some Brits and got a few hints.
I was told that it is a fair statement to say that many Britons (rather English)
don't see themselves as equals compared to other Europeans. They think of thems
elves as more 'civilized' than the continentals. They don't want to share theirs
(money, lives, etc.) with the rest because they feel that they don't get anythi
ng 'decent' in return and just give away their 'superior' goods.
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa

l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
The superiority part is a product of Britains preeminent role during the 18th an
d 19th century. Being number on in terms of trade, finance, war and industrial p
ower for 200 years does have an impact on a national consciousness.
Some Brits are put off when I joke about My condolences for winning the war! but
I'm only half-joking because I feel that we Germans got a clear cut after the 1
914/45 apocalypse. Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning tha
t shaped our national consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny.
Whereas in Britain some of these forces still seem to have more actual power ove
r people's thoughts and lives.
permalinkparent
[ ]GINnFIN 28 points 1 month ago
Doesnt all of northern Europe (including the UK) look down on their southern cou
nterparts?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 6 points 1 month ago
Yea, but only recently. Germans used to admire Italians.
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 5 points 1 month ago
The thing I admire the most about Germany is the engineering. That and football.
Was it the same for you guys?
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 5 points 1 month ago
Dem Italian women (and men, my cousin just had a baby with an Italian who grew u
p in Germany), ancient Roman history and culture, Italian cuisine, the opera, th
e language which sounds so much more lively than ours, and, as you said, cars an
d football. Ah, and the Vespa of course!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanyescalat0r 2 points 1 month ago
Until 04.07.2006, yes. A friend of my parents threw away all his frozen pizza th
at day.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SwedenSnokus 21 points 1 month ago
Id say its more of a UK-France-Germany thing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomtittybangbang123 46 points 1 month ago
Looking down on us are you, you viking pillaging bastard.
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 20 points 1 month ago
It's pretty existent in Scandinavia too.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 5 points 1 month ago
I've always been curious, what are the differences in the views of Southern vs E
astern Europeans among Scandinavians?
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 18 points 1 month ago
Southern Europeans are lazy while Eastern Europeans are criminals basically.
permalinkparent
[ ]Spainjoavim 7 points 1 month ago
Haha fair enough. :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Of course people's biases are always at work. Everywhere, everytime to varying d

egrees depending on education and self-awareness.


I put forth the same argument as you and the response I got was: Yes, but ... ev
en educated Britons secretly think that they're right in thinking that they are
superior.
Not really helpful, I know.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 30 points 1 month ago
Every entity or concept of power, hierarchy and reasoning that shaped our nation
al consciousness in 1914 is dead or under constant scrutiny. Whereas in Britain
some of these forces still seem to have more actual power over people's thoughts
and lives.
Living in England, can confirm.
The way in which the Empire, the Monarchy and other oppressive institutions are
revered and bound tightly to the national psyche is slightly disturbing in a com
ical sort of way. The British Empire was just as, if not more barbaric than the
German Empire. At this stage I'm convinced that the average Brit doesn't know en
ough of their own history to come to any sort of objective view on the matter; m
ost people still think that the British Empire was some sort of slightly wayward
, slightly mismanaged, but well-intentioned civilising force... It goes without
saying that the heavy doses of nationalism in the press on a daily basis are a b
it sickening.
As you say, because they were on the winning side of both wars, they've never re
ally had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent. It's a pity, becau
se there's so much good stuff about British history that the national psyche nee
dn't revolve around all the reactionary shit that it does.
And, before any angsty Brit decides to get on my back; yes Ireland has its own i
ssues. No, they're not relevant to the discussion - so don't go down that path.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago
I'm British. I've lived in England for my entire life. I don't see any reverence
for the British Empire or longing for past glory either in the media or in gene
ral life. I honestly can't imagine from what basis your opinion would form.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
That's understandable. When I go home to Ireland after having been away for a wh
ile, I see aspects of the country that I didn't really notice when I grew up the
re. It's just "normal", you get a sort of bizarre form of culture-shock.
As some concrete examples, have you seen the film the King's Speech? Could you i
magine a film like that being made about the Kaiser?
Do you remember the centenary remembrance for the start of WWI a few weeks ago?
There was an almost complete absence of any discussion in the mainstream British
media about how it was a war between imperial powers over colonial interests. T
hey hyped up the 'senseless slaughter' and the 'great sacrifice' aspects, but th
ere was no real analysis or blame put on the classes in power who instigated the
slaughter. It was sort of a soggy mush of morality, where it was completely ign
ored that the better part of a million poor working-class Brits tottered off to
the trenches to die for the interests of British capital. I know, it's a slightl
y dramatic over-simplification, but point stands.
There is certainly reverence for the Monarchy, I don't think anybody would reall
y disagree on that. The fawning over the royals is hilarious.
I lumped the Monarchy and the Empire together - reverence isn't the right word t
o describe the latter. It's more a sort of passive sense of pride. The Germans a
re ashamed of the German Empire; I'm yet to meet anybody over here (in fairness,
I'm in London so it's obviously not representative of the North) who feels the
same way as the Jerries - they'll talk about the bad aspects, but it's usually q
ualified with all the great things the Empire also accomplished.
Just my personal experience.
permalinkparent
[ ]Count_Blackula1 5 points 1 month ago

I haven't seen The King's Speech in a while but I was under the impression that
it was merely a semi-biographical picture. I wasn't aware of any Empire-glorifyi
ng or overtly political symbols but then again I'd have to go and watch it again
because it's not fresh on my mind.
Remembrance Sunday is pretty self-explanatory; it's a day to remember those who
lost their lives in the First World War. Again, as a British citizen I've never
really picked up on any desire to analyse the politics of WWI amongst the genera
l population, it's simply a memorial for the dead.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past. If you've ever dis
cerned a feeling of pride or reverence for the past from British people then I'm
willing to bet it's a general pride that any other nation in history feels, not
want for starving the Irish or conquering natives. I have no idea whether most
Germans are ashamed of the German Empire actually. I've never really heard any s
trong opinions from Germans on the subject of WWI which is kind of similar to Br
itish sentiment in my opinion.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
With regards to the King's Speech, it's not the overt political message of the f
ilm - it's the film as a whole and the part it plays in the overall discourse ar
ound WWI. I hope at this stage I'm not sounding like a boring academic... The ge
neral point is that a dithering, affable King with a speech-impediment is thrust
unwillingly into a position of authority and manages to step up the plate to se
nd his brave troops off to a just war against the aggressive Hun. It's a candy-c
otton whitewash of history that fits a pretty sanitised narrative of Britain's r
ole as a world power in the early 20th Century. In my opinion it's pretty intell
ectually dishonest; we wouldn't accept a similarly sympathetic film about the pe
rsonal life of the Kaiser - the figurehead of a rival empire.
Again, as a British citizen I've never really picked up on any desire to analyse
the politics of WWI amongst the general population, it's simply a memorial for
the dead.
That's the point I guess. It's the lack of discussion that doesn't sit well with
me. Sure, remember the dead respectfully - but it's also necessary to talk abou
t why they died. There was a lot of discussion about how, where, when, who - but
any in-depth analysis of why was largely absent beyond the shallow Franz Ferdin
and --> Belgium --> War.
From my experience most Brits seem to view the Queen and the royal family simply
as celebrities. The 'fawning' is no different from any other celebrity worship.
If you want to talk about celebrity worship then I don't think we should restri
ct the subject to a British context.
That's true. I suppose if people fawn over idiots like Joey Essex, it shouldn't
be so odd that they fawn over the living symbols of a parasitical social class t
hat fucked their forefathers over for hundreds of years. Such is life I guess it just seems very odd when you've lived in a republic for a long time. It's jus
t a cultural oddity, a bit like the French and their continued insistence that C
orsica is part of France. ;)
I think you'll find pretty much any country finds pride in it's past. Ireland is
no different. Britain just happens to have an imperial past.
Yup. Not arguing with you on that. There's no reason not to be proud of British
history. I was just making the point that when British history is full of great
things like Magna Carta and the English Commonwealth, I find it odd that people
are conditioned to feel pride over things that their continental counterparts wo
uldn't necessarily share their view with.
Anyway, it's not like we really disagree on a whole lot. I guess this is just mo
re of a sharing of experiences.
permalinkparent

load more comments (5 replies)


[ ]burlyjez 3 points 1 month ago
Hmm, I'd agree with some of that but:
they've never really had to reflect on their own culture to any great extent.
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media? Actual
ly has subsided recently, but it was getting ridiculous a couple of years ago.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
permalinkparent
[ ]Marxist-Leninistredvolunteer 2 points 1 month ago
Do you not see the weekly "what is Britishness/Englishness" in the media?
Yeah, it gives me a good chuckle. I meant it more in the context of national ref
lection on a par with what the Germans did post-WWII, not the sort of daily medi
a squabbles over whether or not immigrants, or Scotland leaving the UK has taint
ed what it means to be 'British'. Sorry if there was any confusion about that. I
t is obviously a contentious issue at the moment, as this young man eloquently d
emonstrates; will "Britain be back British"? Will the "Muslamic infidel" ruin Br
itish national identiy? Only time will tell... I'm betting the UK is pretty safe
.
The left usually have a very critical view of Empire.
True. I'm a lefty myself, no surprise. The fact that there exists a large sectio
n of the population that is not only uncritical, but glorifies the memory of the
Empire is what baffles me.
But hey. Whatever. It's like the Orange Order - if that's what you get your kick
s out of, crack on I guess.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomflobberdoodle 3 points 1 month ago
That national psyche is what the UK is, without it I wouldn't know what we even
are, it's our culture. I really don't think you're right about people thinking w
e have never done anything wrong, people try to steer away from the issue so muc
h because we've heard enough really. Any sense of superiority is likely reaction
ary as we feel smaller, weaker, and less relevant by the day. We hold on to the
things that we do well, or have done well, as people don't see us ever improving
on our past successes.
permalinkparent
[ ]winkwinknudge_nudge 2 points 1 month ago
It's quite funny how many references I see to the British Empire in /r/europe vs
real life.
permalinkparent
load more comments (13 replies)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 6 points 1 month ago
Exemplified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We
can stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part
of their national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuri
es.
Which is funny, because they tried to invade Spain just one year after the destr
uction of the Spanish Armada, to take advantage of it, and they failed so misera
bly that the status quo that Spain had lost to England was recovered again.
But of course, nobody in England want to remember who was Maria Pita :P
permalinkparent
[ ]dongalingus 9 points 1 month ago*
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
I agree that many Britons would perceive Britain to be superior to the newest EU
members, in particular the Central and Eastern European countries. However I wo
uld question whether this is due to historical sentiments or from the anti-Europ
ean rhetoric that is so common in the media and current politics of today. In re
ality it's probably a mixture of the two, with the media playing on our perceive
d superiority to make their rhetoric more popular.

I would be interested to see this poll performed again, but broken down by count
ry. No doubt there would be high levels of dissapproval for free movement of the
newest EU members, but more approval for the founding EU members. In better new
s the percentage who agree with the right to freedom of movement for EU members
is up from 23% to 36% since last year, which is something.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 5 points 1 month ago
The sense of superiority towards Eastern Europe is shared among most Western Eur
opeans, it's obviously got to do with them being fucked by 44 years of Communism
, which left them poorer and repressed (goes the perception)
permalinkparent
[ ]RheinlandRhabarberbarbara 1 point 1 month ago
Perhaps, but I don't think this mentality applies equally across Europe. I would
suggest that we do indeed look up to other European nations, Germany's efficien
t industry, the Scandinavian social policies, the French unions representing wor
kers rights.
Agreed. Historically speaking, though, this is a very recent and slow developmen
t. The change in attitude I mean.
And, surely, history cannot provide a definite answer to the question but those
are the only 'professional' tools I have at my disposal and the matter of UK-Con
tinent relation is really interesting.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotland/UKFTWinston 4 points 1 month ago
That's ... really quite interesting. Thanks for sharing!
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomhowaboutwetryagain 3 points 1 month ago
I would say that that attitude is mainly focused in Northern, more right winged
areas of England. If you look at London for example, I would say a lot of Britis
h people there would be in favour of the EU, but up North not so much so.
I think a big part as well is the language. Am I right in saying that English is
taught in all european countries? Whereas in Britain you'd be hard pressed to f
ind a fluent speaker of another language, and that sucks.
It's a shitty attitude because we definitely can't survive on our own, and we ca
n add a lot to the EU! I feel as though it is going to have to be a somewhat mor
bid waiting game, until some of the older generations die out we won't want furt
her integration.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionfuchsiamatter 1 point 1 month ago
I came across a very interesting debate about Britain's place in the EU held in
London by intelligence squared a while back. What really struck me was that, whe
n all the debaters had had their say and it was time for questions, every single
young member of the audience was fiercely pro-EU, while every single older pers
on was die-hard anti. Beautiful illustration of the generation gap on this topic
.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDrunkRobot97 1 point 1 month ago
The historical roots are apparent. Starting with emergence of an english nationa
l consciousness during protestant revolution when they faced off with the Habsbu
rgs who represented a large portion of the european 'nations' at the time. Exemp
lified by the iconic defeat of the spanish armada the English turned the We can
stand for ourselves! We don't need anyone! attitude into a fundamental part of t
heir national consciousness, feeding that mentality over the coming centuries.
Now all I can imagine is Queen Elizabeth I signing Let It Go. A kingdom of isola
tion, shutting everybody else out and deciding to conquer as much of the world a
s it could, while still being cold and generally lonely.
That damn movie is getting to me, I swear.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ]EnglandTomazim 7 points 1 month ago
You would get the same "hypocritical" response on many surveys across the entire

world, if asked in the right way.


permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
A bloke walked into a wormhole in 1950 and came out in the 21st century where he
became a politician.
permalinkparent
[ ]MikoSquiz 1 point 1 month ago
It possibly bears pointing out that the "Brits should have the right" people plu
s the "foreigners shouldn't have the right" people don't add up to 100%, as far
as I can tell.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]MyWinkyIsDinky 20 points 1 month ago
This country has been ruined by the amount of immigrants that have been let in t
hat's why I'm fucking off to live in Spain next year. Viva La Espana!
permalink
[ ]dimprefx 4 points 1 month ago
I know you're joking...sadly there are so many people who think this way and rea
lly aren't and can't see the hypocrisy.
When I go home, a common argument between my step-father and I follows these lin
es exactly. He is your stereotype of a conservative, ukip voting, anti-immigrati
on nutjob who believes that we should kick any immigrants (and anyone of immigra
nt descent that was born here) out... yet, at the same time he is planning to re
tire to France with my Mum and their kids (who, undoubtedly would be state-schoo
led in France -aka using French tax-payers money- and find jobs there -aka steal
ing jobs from the French locals). But clearly, he won't be an ''immigrant'', bec
ause ''it's different''. And it's so sad.
Also, I was studying in Poland earlier this year and my little brother, echoing
his dad's views was saying something bad about immigrants and couldn't comprehen
d the fact that I was at that time an immigrant, in another country...because it
's a 'dirty word'
permalinkparent
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 2 points 1 month ago
Your stepfather sounds a lot like my father.
He is a UKIP-voting civil servant who regularly rants about how he would happily
have everyone of foreign birth rounded up and put onto a barge out in the Atlan
tic, whilst simultaneously talking about his plans to buy a villa in Spain.
He doesn't speak a word of Spanish and has no intention of learning, and is more
than happy to use everything that is paid for by the Spanish taxpayer whilst pu
shing their property prices up.
permalinkparent
[ ]ceresbrew 1 point 1 month ago
British people that move to other countries aren t dirty immigrants
They re expats!
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 1 point 1 month ago
They are expats as long as they don't want to integrate themselves.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Whai_Dat_Guy 1 point 1 month ago
Reminds me of this comment: https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/53183409303900
1601?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=johndoran1&utm_content=53213249593
7269760
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
[ ]Estoniavariksoo21 7 points 1 month ago
I really do not understand all the hate against the eastern and central european
countries. They really are wonderful places. Do not judge a book by it's cover.
permalink
[ ]CrimsonDinosaur 2 points 1 month ago

It's all because of them damn Lithuanians.


permalinkparent
load more comments (30 replies)
[ ]Denmarkzmsz 10 points 1 month ago
Yes, it's ridiculous.
But to be fair, I think a lot of countries would show similar discrepancy. I'm s
ure Denmark would at least.
People are, in general, idiots.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Kunlan1 8 points 1 month ago
I was talking to an english guy in my pub and he told me he was going to move ba
ck to spain because there were too many immigrants coming over from the EU. He d
id not understand why i found it so funny.
permalink
[ ]Spainiagovar 5 points 1 month ago
As an spaniard, I find it so funny.
permalinkparent
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 3 points 1 month ago
You can have him!
permalinkparent
[ ]Shizo211 3 points 1 month ago
I believe it would be the same for every EU country. People will give different
answers depending on what perspective they have to assume. That's why researcher
s / poll-takers have to ask a question with the very same phrasing.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomDirtySketel 3 points 1 month ago
Meh, it's a funny graphic, but there are plenty of charitable interpretations fo
r this data.
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]thecrius 3 points 1 month ago
I suppose this will be everywhere in the world.
It's the fear of the unknown.
permalink
[ ]Devonmagnad 16 points 1 month ago
Ah damn it, we are such hypocrites.
permalink
[ ]Citizen of the EUWillaemann 14 points 1 month ago
Dude you're in Devon, you can't honestly say you're surprised with the attitudes
down here.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomFreeAsInFreedoooooom 1 point 1 month ago
No we're not. The two charts were comparing different things.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago*
[deleted]
[ ]Romaniarasmod 43 points 1 month ago*
British people don't have a problem with Polish doctors going to work in their o
verstretched NHS, in fact they universally welcome them, people do have a proble
m with Polish builders going and only employing other Poles whilst freezing out
young British people and driving down the value of their work
Well, I can tell you that in Romania your media's current frenetical campaign ag
ainst Eastern European migrants in general (and against Romanians in particular)
has the very opposite effect of what you want.
Low-skilled workers heading your way aren't even aware of it as they're not the
ones reading your press or international message boards, meanwhile among univers
ity students the UK is starting to look like less and less of a hospitable desti

nation.
Italy and Spain have a massive amount of Romanian immigrants (1 mil each) and th
e huge majority are low-skilled workers, while the UK is by far our biggest brai
n drain. A blue collar worker can get by with just the basics of a language, whe
reas a doctor or a teacher has to be fluent. That's why the UK has been for year
s now the most attractive destination for the educated here, because it's one of
the only 2 European countries that wouldn't require them to have to perfect a 3
rd language to do these kinds of jobs.
But now more and more of these people aren't willing to put up with that hostili
ty and go to a place where their ethnicity is being witch hunted in the press on
a daily basis. You're basically driving the educated immigrants to Ireland and
other European countries while maintaining the low-skilled labourer influx.
permalink
[ ]Londonchezygo 2 points 1 month ago
I can't see anywhere near a significant amount of Romanians choosing to go to Ir
eland over the UK. I'd say the UK still has more Romanian immigrants per capita
than Ireland, and will continue to gain more at a greater rate.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugalyarr_be_my_password 5 points 1 month ago
Nope.
-someone who moved to Romania and actually knows people.
permalinkparent
load more comments (20 replies)
[ ]Englandpheasant-plucker 49 points 1 month ago
EU migrants, specifically Eastern Europeans (I think if you split this question
up between Western/Eastern European migrants you'd get a very different answer)
are, by and large, unskilled, low-skilled labour
Actually not. Few east European migrants (only 8%) have low educational achievem
ent, and much fewer as a proportion compared with the UK natives (53%).
Migrants in general are much better educated than the locals.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/uk-magnet-highly-educated-migrant
s-research
permalink
[ ]iregamberro 1 point 1 month ago
Thank you for pointing that out. The other point above about EU migrants "partak
ing in the British public service and welfare system" is rubbish. Despite what U
kip, Migration Watch and the Daily Mail come out with, every serious academic st
udy has shown the UK's public finances are strengthened by the numbers of EU mig
rants going to the UK to work. For example, it's been demonstrated that EU migra
nts are generally younger, come already educated, have fewer numbers of dependan
ts and are less likely to avail of public services (even when entitled to them)
that then rest of the UK population.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 5 poin
ts 1 month ago
people do have a problem with Polish builders
Oi! Poland is central yurop now. We're the eastern yuropeans now. We're the bad
guys.
Direct your bashing this way, please.
permalink
[ ]irishsultan 7 points 1 month ago
British people going to live in other EU nations are, by and large, either highl
y qualified, highly skilled workers going to fill needed positions, or otherwise
wealthy pensioners going to retire and spend their British pensions in warmer c
limates.
That may be the perception of British people living in other nations, but that w
asn't a part of the question.
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)

load more comments (2 replies)


[ ]brb6 3 points 1 month ago
I can understand why they feel this way... A few things to bare in mind:
The people who were surveyed were most likely born and raised in the UK (the who
le pride thing).
There are a decent number of countries within the EU that just have downright sh
it economies compared to the UK.
It's constantly in the news how the UK is subsidizing billions to stay within th
e EU (right or wrong).
There are without a doubt a significant number of people from poorer countries t
hat move to the UK. Not saying there's anything wrong in that, but it will inevi
tably create tensions and one sided opinions.
As a British guy who lives in another European country I really hope we continue
the freedom of movement thing. It's awesome. Also not having to pay import tax
is great :)
permalink
[ ]Cornwallvzzzbux 1 point 1 month ago
It probably also matters that when Britons think of moving "to the continent", t
hey're thinking sunny bits of France or Spain/Portugal for retirement, and since
they have money they won't be a drain on the state (while claiming UK benefits
like a heating allowance despite living in a hot country)
When Britons think of filthy continentals moving to the UK, they're thinking abo
ut eastern Europeans who they believe (wrongly or otherwise) will park up here a
nd claim thousands in benefits per year, or "take all the jobs", as this is what
the tabloids claim will happen
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomFrankeh 7 points 1 month ago
Hey, it's this thread again. Neat.
permalink
[ ]United KingdomGetKenny 1 point 1 month ago
It's like deja vu all over again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ][deleted] 2 points 1 month ago
We not them.
permalink
[ ]ThatRollingStone 2 points 1 month ago
Sounds like England's foreign/domestic policy since the Norman's invaded Kent, "
we're in Europe, but not really in"
permalink
[ ]jethromoonbeam 2 points 1 month ago
How each European country feels about freedom of movement in the rest of Europe
permalink
[ ]FinlandThamanizer 2 points 1 month ago
Probably not Romanians, they have a serious brain drain going on and could use s
ome more doctors
permalinkparent
[ ]billtipp 2 points 1 month ago
The Irish government regularly petition the U.S. government to regularise the st
atus of estimated 50,000 undocumented Irish in the states. When asked, the relev
ant government dept. in Ireland if a similar plan as suggested by President Obam
a would be forthcoming for estimated 35,000 undocumented in Ireland, the answer
was a simple "no".
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
As a Brit studying in Ireland and potentially working in other member states, I
think it's wonderful. I also think that there are some cool opportunities that I
encourage EU citizens to take advantage of. Some of the best people I've worked
beside EU Migrants back home and it really added to the skillset of the workpla
ce. It's always good having a different perspective. It's such a great idea, and

if you can't find work in the UK that's for you there is literally nothing stop
ping you from taking advantages elsewhere except yourself.
permalink
[ ]witandlearning 2 points 1 month ago
This is exactly the opinion of a guy in my German A-Level class. He was adamant
he was gonna move to Germany after Uni to work there, but was all about "British
jobs for British people".
He was a proper knob.
permalink
[ ]Lancashire, UKJoeverwhelming 2 points 1 month ago
I have a friend who's a member of UKIP and actively campaigns to leave the EU. H
e's studying in the Netherlands.
Irony is a bitch.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]Fig1024 5 points 1 month ago
"But I was born in a richer country! It is my BIRTH RIGHT to have more rights!"
permalink
[ ]Great Britaincouplingrhino 5 points 1 month ago
British public wrong about nearly everything, survey shows
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 4 points 1 month ago
I do wonder what will happen after we leave the EU. I expect the EU will break a
part .. all those economic migrants from southern and eastern Europe will go to
France, Germany, Scandinavia, widening the north-south divide even further.
permalink
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 4 points 1 month ago*
Yes this is hypocritical and while I don't agree that people should be free to m
ove around the EU at will, you have to realise the UK, for its size is quite ove
rpopulated, or at least, London is.
The UK has 242,900 km2 land mass and a population of around 63.5m whereas France
has 551,500 km2 and a population of 64.6m. Double the size and virtually the sa
me population.
We also have one of the highest populations of migrants every year. I'm far from
racist or a bigot but the UK is too small to be taking in the amount of immigra
nts we currently do. Spain for example has double our land mass and less total p
opulation and immigrants.
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
All statistics from: www.worldometers.info
edit: typos
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdemostravius 4 points 1 month ago
Take out the highlands which are mostly uninhabited and you get an even denser f
igure.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
and Wales. And Northern Ireland. And the south west, north east.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Germanyhansdieter44 2 points 1 month ago*
Our population density in 2014 was 261 people per km2 .... the USA's was 35 peop
le per km2
Comparing with the US is not really fair, because they are basically 3.5 people
standing in a massive field when compared to any European country. Because their
statistics include boring places like Montana, Idaho or Nebraska.
On the page you cited, it shows that the Netherlands(405p/km2) and Belgium(365p/
km2) have a much higher density and you don't hear them complain. Germany(232p/k

m2) is only a little short of the UK(261p/km2) and people are not complaining ei
ther. At least no one in these countries compares to the point of threatening to
leave the EU (115p/km2).
However: Yes, I agree that London(5354p/km2) is overpopulated, but thats just ho
w it is. I guess NY(10725p/km2), Tokio(6000p/km2) and Paris(21000p/km2) are over
populated as well. Thats a problem of the city. I took a look at large parts of
Scotland and the 5 sheep I saw didn't look like they had problems with overpopul
ation.
Source: German hanging out in London, paying tax here that feed and house people
here - but I am not complaining.
Numbers for cities & EU whole from the wiki articles, Numbers for Countries from
your source.
permalinkparent
[ ]ENGERLANDserenity10 5 points 1 month ago
You're right and make some good points.
You did however gloss over the migrant numbers on that website. The UK took in 1
77,549 in 2014 while the numbers for Netherlands (10218), Belgium (35,305) and G
ermany (42,859) are much lower.
Another issue, which you pointed out, is that the likes of Scotland, Ireland and
even Wales have perfectly fine or low population density. England is the main p
roblem, and I imagine a very high percentage of immigrants move to England rathe
r than the rest of the UK. I don't have a source but I'm sure if you just looked
at the statistics for England instead of the whole of the UK it would be much w
orse.
I'm by no means comparing whatever issues we might have with other countries lik
e India or China but to ignore it is moronic and to dismiss it as not an issue b
ecause other countries have it worse isn't fair. I'm not a supporter of UKIP wha
tsoever but I recognize there is a problem, especially in London.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 1 point 1 month ago
Remember this too: Many people account for the entire UK when looking at populat
ion density but it's wrong to do so. We have two big conurbations, London and th
e North West. These are the most densely populated parts of Europe. No migrants
are ending up in Wales, Scotland, or NI. It's far more accurate to account for E
ngland only. Frances population is far more spread out throughout the country. S
o is Germany.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago
The british 'im so sorry' crowd on /r/europe are pathetic.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdom & Subjugated IrelandDilanski 9 points 1 month ago
You're expecting British redditors to defend this poll?
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandBinnedcrumble 6 points 1 month ago*
No, i just wasnt expecting so many people to act like... god knows what. Its sad
watching people apologise because 100% of the country isnt 100% pro-eu. Like a
fucked up form of white guilt.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]England, SurreyBenni88 2 points 1 month ago
Living close to London, I've always found it quite cosmopolitan. Although I was
talking to my dad the other day and he was saying that a lot of the country isn'
t so familiar (and friendly I guess) with other cultures. Shame. Integration is
the key.
permalink
[ ]Dinkledonker 2 points 1 month ago
Not really representative though is it? When you're talking 'anywhere in the EU'

you're talking about a huge place full of huge countries. With people coming to
the UK you're talking about an extremely small island that has a significant am
ount of people already concerned with the immigration in the country.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 3 points 1 month ago
crucially though the average wage and quality of life is higher than the EU mean
, especially since expansion.
permalinkparent
[ ]blue_strat 0 points 1 month ago
64 million Brits should be allowed to go into the 4,100,000 km2 rest of the EU t
o work
vs
443 million other EU citizens should be allowed to go into the 243,000 km2 UK to
work.
I mean, what is the point of that comparison other than political grandstanding?
permalink
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 11 points 1 month ago
Is that how UKIP people think? The gates are open right now and guess what: Roma
nia and Bulgaria still have people in it.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 2 points 1 month ago
Also some seem to be building themselves homeless shelters in our parks.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 1 point 1 month ago
What is the source of this data?
Edit: Nevermind, I'm a dumbass.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomrspender 1 point 1 month ago
Look. We whipped Napoleans arse. We fucking thrashed Hitler and Mussolini. Rosbi
fs? Fuck the Vichy collaborators.
Of course we should have free rein over Europe! ;)
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
INGLIN
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Denmarkgrevemoeskr 4 points 1 month ago
"We want ALL the upsides and NONE of the downsides"
permalink
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Hungary_maxiking_ 1 point 1 month ago
I would be very curious to see them doing the low paying shitty jobs that immigr
ants do.
permalink
[ ]European ultra-nationalistredpossum 35 points 1 month ago
I mean, british people do, and poor conditions, low pay and zero hour contracts
are a huge political issue right now, but obviously the brits are all sitting in
their stately homes while Poles and Hungarians plough the fields.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomwill_holmes 14 points 1 month ago
We do. The resultant lack of social mobility is a big problem here.
permalinkparent
[ ]HungaryBlindMancs 7 points 1 month ago
A lot of them do, mostly on the countryside, and with a proper mindset.
I mean even if you are going around with the garbage truck, you have a pretty de
cent job here. You receive proper equipment, a nice modern truck with comfy seat

s, hygine wise they provide the highest possible standards. Less harassment than
in McDonalds. Heck, Firefighters earn ~18k / annual while they are under trainin
g. It's a lot easier to handle the "low paying shitty jobs" when you can't earn
less than 1000 a month. You can have a decent car, a nice tv, goverment helps you
raise the kids with atleast another extra ~ 5k / year, and once you have a decen
t credit rating, you can easily get a mortage on a small house, that you can pay
off easily. If you speak English at any reasonable level, you'll get promoted a
s they highly value people who actually speak their language properly.
London is a different story.
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
[ ]Scotlandggow 6 points 1 month ago
I think the argument tends to go that if there wasn't mass immigration, the pay
the bottom would creep up, making those jobs more attractive. Thus, immigration
depresses living standards at the bottom. I do believe there's actually some lim
ited evidence for that but I'm not sure.
Either way, given the unemployment rate and economic activity rate in the UK, I
don't think there are a whole lot of Brits turning their noses up at the 'low pa
ying shitty jobs', the Brits are already mostly in work.
permalinkparent
[ ]MegGriffin_ 10 points 1 month ago
A lot of British people have "shitty" jobs abroad, it's just not usually blue-co
llar work.
permalinkparent
[ ]EnglandTomazim 3 points 1 month ago
The idea is that without the infinite downward pressure of immigrants who are us
ed to lower pay, some of those jobs become more appealing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdommfizzled 3 points 1 month ago
I'm English born in England and I have spent many a night washing dishes in a re
staurant with a Hungarian and a Brazilian. People are people, pretty much no one
here has a sense of entitlement that they're too good for those kind of jobs un
less they're very wealthy or something.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ -3 points 1 month ago
Ah, silly islanders.
permalink
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 4 points 1 month ago
My uncle (who is also Dutch coincidentally) calls it 'island mentality'
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesSid_Harmless 2 points 1 month ago
Literally 'insularity.'
permalinkparent
[ ]NorwayTheEndgame 5 points 1 month ago
I can almost guarantee that the results would be similar in The Netherlands or a
ny other European country for that matter.
permalinkparent
[ ]you love it you slag!jesusandhisbeard 9 points 1 month ago*
hey, leave us alone you great cheese making bastard. we arent all like this!
i couldnt give a shit were you are from in the world if you came to my country,
followed the rules and generally wasnt a dick about our way of doing things then
your alright with me. :)
"come all you want. just dont be a cunt."
permalinkparent
load more comments (8 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Birous 1 point 1 month ago
My case isn't the same because I'm not from the EU, but I battle the ridiculous
migration policies in the UK everyday.

Here is a link to our case if anyone is interested in knowing the truth about mi
gration from outside the EEA.
https://www.change.org/p/rt-hon-david-cameron-mp-bell-duque-family-appeal#suppor
ters
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Depressingly I'm quite pleased because I thought It was worse in terms of the hu
ge hypocrisy. It concerns me that I think it might come from a sort of arrogance
of British economic migrants being continental intelligent wonderful hard worki
ng people, while people coming to the UK are all benefit scroungers or similar.
Out of curiosity how many figures are there on how many Brits actually live and
work abroad as opposed to retiring? I know we're around I see a few here in germ
any and definitely some are working all over but It would be nice to get these s
tats to stat-slap people with.
permalink
[ ]dd63584 1 point 1 month ago
I believe that's a fairly general feeling regardless of your location and not ne
cessarily restricted to the subject of free movement. I just left Germany after
living there for 10 years and believe the sentiment to be very similar. Also, re
garding wind turbines, fracking, power lines, asylum housing, and so on and so o
n. I believe the general opinion is, "yes, we need these things but not in my ne
ighborhood".
permalink
[ ]BigFuckinHammer 1 point 1 month ago
Well if think people from England moving somewhere are less likely to be a detri
ment to that country compared to the other way around so in that regard I can de
finitely sympathize with that graph. I think a lot of people all around the worl
d are getting sick of immigrants not assimilating and trying to make the country
they move to more like the shit hole they came from..
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
And the same graph for British politicians would be even more extreme
permalink
[ ][deleted] 1 point 1 month ago
Did they ask both questions to the same people? I mean, it's pretty weird to ans
wer "Do you think British people should be free to live and work anywhere in the
EU?" with "Yes" and the subsequent question "Do you think all citizens of other
EU countries should have the right to live and work in the UK?" with "No" (or t
he other way round)...
permalink
[ ]octopusinmyboycunt 2 points 1 month ago
You'd be surprised. It's more that people just want to keep out workers from les
s economically developed nations. UKIP (for example) would probably be down with
a selective common travel area, choosing from a select bunch of nations that th
ey have holiday homes in.
permalinkparent
[ ]autopron 1 point 1 month ago
Rich people don't want the poor flooding their country. I doubt the Brits care i
f Germans move in, but it's a different story if someone from a new EU member wa
nts to enter the UK.
permalink
[ ]graffiti81 1 point 1 month ago
They should have just said screw india and taken over Europe, I guess.
permalink
load more comments (104 replies)
about
blog
about
team
source code

advertise
jobs
help
wiki
FAQ
reddiquette
rules
contact us
tools
mobile
firefox extension
chrome extension
buttons
widget
<3
reddit gold
store
redditgifts
reddit AMA app
reddit.tv
radio reddit
Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy
. 2015 reddit inc. All rights reserved.
REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc.
p jump to content
MY SUBREDDITS
FRONT-ALL-RANDOM | ASKREDDIT-ASKSCIENCE-EARTHPORN-FUNNY-AWW-PERSONALFINANCE-TELE
VISION-NOSLEEP-UPLIFTINGNEWS-CREEPY-BOOKS-GIFS-LIFEPROTIPS-SHOWERTHOUGHTS-SPORTS
-PICS-GETMOTIVATED-INTERNETISBEAUTIFUL-NOTTHEONION-HISTORY-LISTENTOTHIS-FUTUROLO
GY-PHOTOSHOPBATTLES-MUSIC-EUROPE-WRITINGPROMPTS-ART-NEWS-GAMING-TWOXCHROMOSOMESVIDEOS-DOCUMENTARIES-WORLDNEWS-FITNESS-MOVIES-MILDLYINTERESTING-TIFU-IAMA-PHILOS
OPHY-OLDSCHOOLCOOL-SPACE-DATAISBEAUTIFUL-TODAYILEARNED-GADGETS-JOKES-DIY-FOOD-EX
PLAINLIKEIMFIVE-SCIENCE
MORE
europe europecommentsrelatedother discussions (3)
want to join? sign in or create an account in seconds|English
this post was submitted on 26 Nov 2014
2,729 points (93% upvoted)
shortlink:
remember mereset passwordlogin
Submit a new link
Submit a new text post
europe
unsubscribe205,348
200
FILTER RUSSIA, UKRAINE, NATO
NEW TO REDDIT? CLICK HERE!
Latest "News roundup": 28.12.2014 - Up-/Downvote for quality, not content! - For
travel advice, please visit /r/AskEurope
50 countries, 230 languages, 731M people
... 1 subreddit
A forum for discussion about Europe and its neighbourhood.
Community Rules and Guidelines
Reddiquette
IRC:
Join us on IRC: #europe on irc.snoonet.org
Snoonet link direct to IRC channel here

IRC stats
English language subreddits of European countries:
/r/Albania
/r/Andorra
/r/Armenia
/r/Azerbaijan
/r/Austria
/r/Belarus
/r/Belgium
/r/BiH (Bosnia and Herzegovina)
/r/Bulgaria
/r/Croatia
/r/Cyprus
/r/Czech
/r/Denmark
/r/Eesti (Estonia)
/r/Faroeislands
/r/Finland
/r/France
/r/Sakartvelo (Republic of Georgia)
/r/Germany
/r/Gibraltar
/r/Greece
/r/Guernsey
/r/Hungary
/r/Iceland
/r/Ireland
/r/IsleofMan
/r/Italy
/r/Channel_Islands
/r/Kazakhstan
/r/Kosovo
/r/Latvia
/r/Liechtenstein
/r/Lithuania
/r/Luxembourg
/r/Macedonia
/r/Malta
/r/Moldova
/r/PrincipalityofMonaco
/r/Montenegro
/r/TheNetherlands
/r/Norway
/r/Poland
/r/Portugal
/r/Romania
/r/Russia
/r/San_Marino
/r/Serbia
/r/Slovakia
/r/Slovenia
/r/Spain
/r/Sweden
/r/Switzerland
/r/Turkey
/r/Ukraine
/r/UnitedKingdom
Unrecognized:
/r/Artsakh (Nagorno-Karabakh Rep.)
/r/Abkhazia

Other European subreddits you might enjoy:


Q&A - /r/AskEurope
InterRail - /r/Interrail
Pictures - /r/europics
In-depth - /r/Europeans
Culture - /r/europeanculture
Federal EU - /r/EuropeanFederalists
Anti-EU/Euro - /r/eurosceptics
Yurop Stronk! - /r/yurop
List of European English-language news sources
Interesting threads from the past:
"What do you know about ... ?" index
"Which places should you visit in ... ?" index
"What happened in your country this week?" index
"... of Europe" picture series
Comment Formatting Guide
Traffic stats
a community for 6 years
message the moderators
MODERATORS
kitestramuort
EnglandRaerth
EnglandTheSkyNet
European UnionSpAn12
Greecegschizas
InternetistanBezbojnicul
Supreme Presidentdavidreiss666
ScotlandSkuld
JB_UK
??????metaleks
...and 4 more
2729
How Brits feel about freedom of movement in the EU (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 month ago by Belgiumpegasus_527
1104 commentsshare
top 500 comments
sorted by: best
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 369 points 1 month ago
The same thing in Germany (probably almost everywhere): Yes, we want the giant e
lectricity grid connecting South Germany to the North Sea! Wait, it should run t
hrough my village? Hell no, it looks disgusting!
permalink
[ ]Restrider 190 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Why don't you construct land lines that connect the North to the So
uth without being that ugly? Wait, it costs a lot more? Hell no, I don't want to
pay for that!
permalinkparent
[ ]Schaffe, Schaffe, Husle Bauehypercompact 166 points 1 month ago
Followed by: Those fucking politicians are obviously sitting on their asses all
day because nothing gets ever done where I live.
Ugh, why are people so stupid.
permalinkparent
[ ]Revoluzzer 36 points 1 month ago
People, what a bunch o' bastards.
permalinkparent
[ ]Restrider 8 points 1 month ago
Thank you... now I will have to watch that series again.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 11 points 1 month ago
Followed by: 'Zwarte Pieten Discussie'.

That's Dutch people for ya.


permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 2 points 1 month ago
Belg hier, we volgen jullie debat met argusogen :p
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 2 points 1 month ago
Minder een debat, meer een wellus niettus spelletje.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Zolang jullie frieten en bier blijven exporteren en politiek binnenshuis houden
loopt hier niets uit de hand.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 3 points 1 month ago
without being that ugly
Are there renderings of this?
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionLitterball 3 points 1 month ago
No. That is the point. It will have to run underground wherever a town cannot be
avoided. It will still run fairly straight.
permalinkparent
[ ]SchwabenNeutronizer 30 points 1 month ago
Bah, we could probably have sustainable energy in the south if we could turn See
hofer's changes in opinion into electricity. Attach a dynamo to his moral compas
s, and you'll get yourself alternating currency at about 50Hz.
permalinkparent
[ ]gmkeros 8 points 1 month ago
as a Bavarian citizen I always said we could solve all energy problems by making
a generator that runs on hypocrisy and connect it to the CSU
permalinkparent
[ ]ImJustPassinBy 2 points 1 month ago
Also, add a machine which collects the air he is exhaling and you have enough ma
terial for a biogas plant with all the shit he is spouting. Though this is true
for most politicians.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceVanadyel 17 points 1 month ago
Oh German behaviour looks so much like French!
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanybakuninsbart 5 points 1 month ago
We are all puny humans after all!
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandKeyrawn 2 points 1 month ago
And Irish.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]AustriaNanthax 3 points 1 month ago
Feels good to see this type of thing happening in other areas as well. The (10 y
ears old) situation in my district:
"Yeah, we totally need that bypass because traffic through the city sucks! What
do you mean you want to put it on my side of the suburbs? That won't work becaus
e of, uh, reasons!"
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandgavmcg92 2 points 1 month ago
In Ireland it's to do with a larger investment in wind turbines. "We're improvin
g the wind infrastructure? Nice! You want to put in pylons to improve the power
grid to allow for these new turbines to be connected? Hell no."
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 2 points 1 month ago
That's exactly what it's about in Germany too. There are lots of productive turb
ines off shore and on land in the North.

permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 1039 points 1 month ago
We are, very occasionaly, completely full of shit.
permalink
[ ]AustraliaJayKayAu 357 points 1 month ago
Very occasionally, of course.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 229 points 1 month ago
99.99% of the time, we're perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsGroteStruisvogel 143 points 1 month ago
100% of the time you're ego is too big as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 190 points 1 month ago
You only say that because you're jealous of our superiority!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 99 points 1 month ago
1688! Take it you Brits!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 89 points 1 month ago
Hey, we invited you!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsBosmanJ 106 points 1 month ago
Since when do you guys invite people to your islands? I thought you weren't into
that, and the poll confirms ;)
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomwOlfLisK 119 points 1 month ago
We learnt our lesson after that one. Never again.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]European UnionDhaecktia 1 point 1 month ago
Too soon
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americahalfar 14 points 1 month ago
Like Father, like son.
permalinkparent
[ ]FranceSeriousJack 2 points 1 month ago
Didn't saw this one before. It's awesome :-D
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandRiresurmort 3 points 1 month ago
filthy redcoat
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandAnExplosiveMonkey 16 points 1 month ago
Yah, browncoats all the way!
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 32 points 1 month ago
You can't take the sky from me
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionStipoBlogs 3 points 1 month ago
Take my love,
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBlackStar4 11 points 1 month ago
Shiny. Let's be bad guys.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlands (N-Brabant)Hmm_Peculiar 67 points 1 month ago
*your ego.
Dude, we're known for our knowledge of foreign languages, keep it that way.

permalinkparent
[ ]Belgiumkar86 2 points 1 month ago
always with terrible accents offcourse.
permalinkparent
[ ]Glorious GelderlandReLiFeD 13 points 1 month ago
Better than having a terrible accent in your own language.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsrodinj 2 points 1 month ago
Hey that's other cook
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Ehh biscuit.
permalinkparent
load more comments (7 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United KingdomPerfectHair 31 points 1 month ago
There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other
people's cultures and the Dutch.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 16 points 1 month ago
Just because our hair is more perfect than yours, isn't a real reason to hate us
...
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsblizzardspider 5 points 1 month ago
y'know, hair is a really weird thing to compare. I've literally never payed atte
ntion to the average quality of hair coming from a certain country. Also: it's a
n Austin powers quote.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 1 point 1 month ago
Then I apologize for my ignorance. But yeah, hair is weird to compare unless you
are looking at a certain ability, for example, how long can you live on eating
only hair from a certain country.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Sea GodManannin 2 points 1 month ago
Is that a stereotype? Really never heard of it.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 20 points 1 month ago
As a North American in The Netherlands... hahahahaha no.
Don't get me wrong! I'm impressed by how everyone here can speak English very we
ll. But the number of basic mistakes that are made by well-educated people reall
y drives home how difficult mastering a language can be.
permalink
[ ]The NetherlandsLUCTOR_ET_EMERGO 28 points 1 month ago
Come on man, we already feel so insignificant that all our pride is derived from
how well we speak foreign languages. Let us have our petty illusion of grandeur
. Its all we have.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 12 points 1 month ago
In my experience, on average, the Dutch are better than anyone else at speaking
English and a second language. You guys should be proud.
Also, water management. Absolutely top-notch.
permalinkparent
[ ]Nimollos 5 points 1 month ago
Hey, who cares about managing water when you can make beer with it. Move along t
o Belgium, we have everything the dutch have but better beer and fries!
permalinkparent

[ ]NYCshoryukenist 2 points 1 month ago


MUCH better beer. Had me an Orval last night. Yum,
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 8 points 1 month ago
Hey, don't be so hard on yourself. Y'all are excellent cyclists too!
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsDPSOnly 15 points 1 month ago
And we are the best at not making our country drown.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomshudders 12 points 1 month ago
I think Nepal or Bhutan is better at that. They had the foresight to build their
country in the sky.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]pilas2000 10 points 1 month ago
Only time will tell.
permalinkparent
continue this thread
[ ]United Kingdomrcfshaaw 1 point 1 month ago
You're better than the Scots pal, you have that.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]EyeSavant 2 points 1 month ago
Heh yeah got a nice letter from ABN-AMRO, "can you please sine the enclosed form
and sand it back to me". Guess there is a reason they got bought out.
In general though the level of English was pretty good.
permalinkparent
[ ]Carrots are the best vegetablesBeleidsregel 1 point 1 month ago
Your just jealous!
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaCDLTO 2 points 1 month ago
Its true!
permalinkparent
[ ]JimmyJimRyan 1 point 1 month ago
I've never met a dutch person who didn't have perfect english but them again I'v
e never been to the netherlands, I've only met them in the nonnetherlands.
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Swedenbenwap 1 point 1 month ago
You did so good with that comment!
I'm assuming you hear some variation of that often. I feel for you.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Unionrockstarsheep 2 points 1 month ago
Uhhhhh no. That's wrong. Very wrong. :)
permalink
[ ]Czech RepublicRemedan 2 points 1 month ago
He's probably an emacs user.
permalink
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 3 points 1 month ago
Before I was conceited, now I am perfect.
permalinkparent
[ ]CanadaTulipsMcPooNuts 2 points 1 month ago
Brilliant, even
permalinkparent
[ ]South African in BavariaWikiWantsYourPics 2 points 1 month ago
Time for a song of patriotic prejudice
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 2 points 1 month ago
It's... beautiful
permalinkparent

[ ]NorwegianGodOfLove 2 points 1 month ago


60% of the time we're perfect 100% of the time
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomUnalaq 35 points 1 month ago
While this data is a bit embarrassing for us, the source does show that the numb
er of people who think all EU citizens should be able to work in the UK is incre
asing
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2014/10/18/more-labour-voters-seriously-considervoting-ukip/
permalinkparent
[ ]ItalyMephisto94 22 points 1 month ago
No reason to be embarassed, I'm pretty sure the result of this survey would be t
he same in many countries.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomrtrs_bastiat 2 points 1 month ago
Yeah, chances are there's a real disconnect between the two sides of this coin i
n most people's minds.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francem00t_vdb 19 points 1 month ago
I could recall about one hundred years of that ...
permalinkparent
[ ]WalesG_Morgan 9 points 1 month ago
The Entente isn't what it once was.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of Americamr_glasses 66 points 1 month ago
You're not called perfidious Albion for nothing.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 35 points 1 month ago
steeples fingers
Ye olde excellent.
permalinkparent
[ ]liquidfootball_ 13 points 1 month ago
Perfidious Albion just haven't been the same since they were relegated to the Co
nference.
permalinkparent
[ ]merkinmafioso 2 points 1 month ago
I chortled uncontrollably, which for me is practically a roflcopter. Good work s
ir.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]immerc 33 points 1 month ago
You'd probably get the same with any of the other "rich" EU states: France, Germ
any, Netherlands, etc. Meanwhile if you asked citizens of Greece or Latvia you'd
see more egalitarian attitudes.
My guess is that it comes from the idea that the citizens of these richer states
picture an educated, trained person from their country going abroad to work, me
anwhile they picture essentially refugees coming from the poorer countries, even
if that's unfair.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 12 points 1 month ago
I agree, and I think it's on us to change our attitudes about Eastern Europe and
the high volume of skilled labourers and professionals that come to us.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]US of Eweltburger 3 points 1 month ago
Not necessarily, in poorer countries too there's the fear that even poorer count

ries will steal their jobs; for example Spanish or Italian with Romanians etc.
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 1 point 1 month ago
He didn't mention Spain or Italy though, just France, Germany, the Netherlands a
nd then Greece and Latvia.
permalinkparent
[ ]US of Eweltburger 4 points 1 month ago
Don't be pedantic, I took them as examples, not a definition set in stone.
Greece is getting quite xenophobic at the moment, now that Albania is set to joi
n the EU I'd like to see their attitudes.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United Kingdomxu85 2 points 1 month ago
Poor people: Do you want socialism? Yes! Rich people: Do you want socialism? No!
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Belgiumder_kaputmacher 22 points 1 month ago
True, but to be honest, most other Western European countries might have similar
results.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 22 points 1 month ago
And with that trait you are, unsurprisingly, just like the rest of the European
nations (or any nation, really).
So why not stay? :D
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomLethargyc 33 points 1 month ago*
I'm all in favour of staying actually, and I find the constant politicking about
a Brexit to be both tedious and embarassing, and the dearth of vocal opposition
to it doubly so.
permalinkparent
[ ]German, living in the NetherlandsOda_Krell 16 points 1 month ago
Yeah, wasn't really expecting you'd be overly UKIP on this.
Just that the thought crossed my mind that there's a corollary to being a bit of
a xenophobe hypocrite on the island: might as well stay with the rest of us xen
ophobe hypocrites on the mainland.
Bring on the downvotes, suckers :D
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United Kingdomnehkz 18 points 1 month ago
I think you mean all the time.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomlesser_panjandrum 14 points 1 month ago
Are you implying that their assertion is full of shit?
permalinkparent
[ ]GreecePyrelord 15 points 1 month ago
it's ok we all love you !
(the UK is secretly my favorite country in the world, but don't tell anyone)
permalinkparent
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 0 points 1 month ago
They are asking different questions here though. When they are asking about othe
r from EU countries living here people will think about Eastern Europeans. When
asked about living abroad they think about places they would want to live and le
ts face it for most that isn't eastern Europe. The surveyors know what they are
doing. I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the rig
ht to live in Britian you'd find a different answer.
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 38 points 1 month ago
When they are asking about other from EU countries living here people will think
about Eastern Europeans. When asked about living abroad they think about places

they would want to live and lets face it for most that isn't eastern Europe
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Eastern Europe is Europe, and is (for the most part) European Union.
When you're asked whether you're okay with immigrants from European Union, you'r
e asked whether you're fine with both a French doctor and a Bulgarian electricia
n - or the other way around, for that matter. One goes with the other, regardles
s of what you may prefer.
When you're asked whether you want to live and work in the European Union, that
question does not discriminate between working in Stockholm and working in Zagre
b. One goes with the other, regardless of what you may prefer.
No one is ever going to ask the British people if they're okay with people with
nationalities A, B and C living there, while excluding people with nationalities
X, Y and Z. There's no cherry picking allowed - that's kind of the whole point
of the Union to begin with.
People who respond to these poll have to realize that they're either in or out,
and that all the good things go with all the bad things (which are not necessari
ly that bad anyway).
permalinkparent
[ ]admiralbear 2 points 1 month ago
I agree, but that's the problem many Brits have with it. The perception here is
we don't have enough housing, public sector services are being stretched thin, a
nd jobs are scarcer than they were before. The rich and/or retirees are the ones
emigrating to warmer climates, whilst the majority of the immigration we have i
s poor and/or low skilled. It's understandable why some Brits want reduced migra
tion from Europe, the real question is whether the downsides of migration are ou
tweighed by all the other benefits the EU brings.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Lives in DenmarkGorau 4 points 1 month ago
They are not asking different questions, people who respond to the poll are imag
ining different questions due to their own bias - which is the problem to begin
with.
Well no, they are asking one question which provides benefits and a seperate que
stions that provides negatives. The result is fucking obvious. What they should
do is merge the question into one so people have to think about balance which is
essentially the issue but has been completely missed in the questions asked.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerlandargh523 4 points 1 month ago
What they should do is merge the question into one so people have to think about
balance
So you complain that the surveyors "know what they're doing" and are looking for
a specific result when they talk about "the EU" in one question, but about "the
EU" in another question, and your suggestion what they should be doing is to po
se the questions in a way that alerts the people to the possible conflicts of th
e answers to those questions.
The whole point of questions like this is the find out what people believe, rega
rdless of wheter those believes make sense or are hypocritical. You accuse perfe
ctly harmless questions of having a bias, and propose to fix it by asking biased
questions. /facepalm
permalinkparent
load more comments (6 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]SpainEonesDespero 2 points 1 month ago
I bet if you asked about Scandinavians, Germans and French having the right to l
ive in Britian you'd find a different answer.
I am not a racist. I would have no problem having Will Smith, Oprah Winfrey or s
ome rich black people in my neighborhood. But I don't want the poor ones!
Who would reject a highly educated German surgeon? I think that is not the point

of the question. The question is all the other people.


permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 522 points 1 month ago
People are in favor of fracking too until they start doing it in their backyards
. Typical "I am allowed but I don't want you to be".
permalink
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 326 points 1 month ago
It's called the 'Not in my backyard' mentality. Same with windmills. Everyone wa
nts windmills for green energy, but none wants them in their view. Result: Plans
to build windmills everywhere, and resistance against building windmills everyw
here.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 218 points 1 month ago
I don't oppose windmills in my backyard tbh. When they placed the windmills in t
he North Sea just off the coast of Kennemerland, I thought it actually was an im
provement to the drilling platforms we used to see.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 46 points 1 month ago
I think windmills look quite nice. I certainly wouldn't mind them in my vicinity
(provided of course that they aren't super loud or anything to the extent that
it's bothersome).
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 16 points 1 month ago
I think you're probably in the minority, but they're a necessary evil in my mind
. So I wouldn't mind either... Same as I don't mind electricity pylons.
That said. They can have a certain environmental impact and depending on who you
talk to they might not provide the best bang for buck.
permalinkparent
[ ]Croatianeohellpoet 21 points 1 month ago
See, I don't get the windmill hate. They're sleek, elegant, usually white, but I
don't see why you couldn't have them in any color. I find them quite charming a
nd I'm confused as to why more people aren't doing cool artsy things with what i
s essentially a giant canvas.
I've seen so many ugly as sin buildings, especially old factory chimneys packed
with cell towers, that are ugly as sin but no one cares, that this really baffel
s me.
permalinkparent
[ ]Switzerland (Dutch)shinnen 2 points 1 month ago
Mainly because they often spoil natural beauty of the country side they're in...
I agree that they're nicer looking than many buildings and they actually do loo
k cool in or on the outskirts of an urban landscape. But in the country side the
y kind of make me cringe, but even electricity pylons make me feel the same, tho
ugh.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsreeepicheeep 2 points 1 month ago
Sure, whether they are the best solution or not is an excellent question (that I
have zero knowledge on).
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 3 points 1 month ago
A well isolated home should have no problems with sound and the story about elec
tromagnetism is a load of horsedung. They can always coat their homes in alumini
umfoil.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Felix4200 72 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
, so it is rather significant, even if you don't care about the noise, the view
or the shadow flashing.

permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 60 points 1 month ago
As far as I know the noise is negligible. I've been to huge wind farms on decent
ly windy days and the noise is less than wind blowing through trees.
But please correct me if I'm wrong, because as far as I'm concerned that's the o
nly legit concern.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]KockenIKungsan 2 points 1 month ago
A true Scotsman eh?
permalink
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Io_-I 28 points 1 month ago
The blades block the sunlight, so if the mill rotates quickly, your living room
will turn into a disco.
permalinkparent
[ ]Thuglicious 33 points 1 month ago
You get a FREE disco room when you buy a windmill?
I'll take 2, please.
permalinkparent
[ ]IrelandThread_water 9 points 1 month ago
True and it is a legit concern, it's just very easy to test for this before inst
alling the turbines and plans can be changed to avoid such a thing. (Not saying
this always happens, just saying it's not a hard thing to do).
permalinkparent
[ ]Estados UnidosJackIsColors 13 points 1 month ago
There's also a negative psychological effect from the constant strobing, I beliv
e
permalinkparent
[ ]Quartinus 5 points 1 month ago
It's not constant unless the windmill is basically on top of your house. I saw c
alculations somewhere that based on solar angles, etc you'd get a strobing effec
t for 15 minutes or so a day for about a month every year assuming you live abov
e the 45th parallel and the windmill is greater than the height of itself away f
rom the window. It was on reddit, I'll try to find it when I'm back on desktop.
permalinkparent
[ ]alcathos 3 points 1 month ago
To be fair, there is a negative psychological effect just from thinking there is
a negative psychological effect.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]The Netherlandsconceptalbum 3 points 1 month ago
...How close do you think these windmills are? They don't put them literally in
your back yard.
permalinkparent
[ ]rwrcneoin 2 points 1 month ago
For how long during the day? Seems like that's a fairly easy thing to at least m
inimize.
permalinkparent
[ ]ClashOfTheAsh 4 points 1 month ago
I just did a project on it. It's called shadow-flicker and it's generally avoide
d but if not; county councils will have a limit of something like 30hrs/yr that
it's allowed to happen to somebody's house and then the turbine needs to be turn
ed off.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
One is white noise, I suppose.
permalinkparent

[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 75 points 1 month ago


It always striked me as something baffling. You buy a house, you use a house and
for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person. Li
ke buying a bicycle and selling it for more. Not to mention that the economy rec
ently collapsed under the idea that house prices go up forever. It seriously bog
gled my mind.
permalinkparent
[ ]Scotlandggow 42 points 1 month ago
I think you're being unfair. If you've bought a house, it'll most likely be mort
gaged. If the value of your property drops, you could just have entered into neg
ative equity: even selling your house wouldn't be enough to pay off the mortgage
. The banks aren't typically all that happy when that happens.
On a personal level, you're stuck in that house. If you need to move, you can ei
ther crystallise your loses or not move or a number of less than optimal situati
ons. If you have to go with the first one, you've probably just set yourself bac
k several years of saving for the mortgage deposit.
On an economy-wide level, it's bad for a lot of people to tip into negative equi
ty. banks get a bit shaky. Job mobility declines so unemployment is higher than
it otherwise would be. Consumer spending goes down as people become more relucta
nt to spend any money.
On a personal finance level again, is it baffling that people don't want to see
their property devalued? It's one of their largest assets. Bikes have a lifetime
, houses should last basically forever, if cared for properly.
permalinkparent
[ ]someguyfromtheuk 10 points 1 month ago
Bikes have a lifetime, houses should last basically forever, if cared for proper
ly.
That's a bit misleading, everything should last forever if cared for properly, b
ut then you run into the Bike of Theseus problem :P
permalinkparent
[ ]I_play_support 2 points 1 month ago
No they won't, half-lifes would make the "forever" part impossible.
permalinkparent
[ ]Noord-HollandKaashoed 16 points 1 month ago
Average prices in housing have increased rapidly since any period in time (but m
ostly since after the worldwar and at least for the Netherlands). I am talking a
bout sometimes worth 4x as much, after inflation correction. Assuming you pay of
f your mortgage, you are still sitting on money. The fact that the system is bas
ed on something that does not have to be makes the system broken.
Eventually oil prices will catch up and having a windmill near you makes it more
easy to get cheap energy. I had the pleasure of meeting this guy that runs a co
mpany by directly connecting the consumer to the guy that owns the windmills(a l
ot of windmills in my country are privately owned by farmers and such).
What I am trying to say is that both systems are based on a mindset. People tend
to cry wolf when it comes to windmills. Meanwhile a lot of people don't care an
d you will never know a thing about them. The media does not care about people w
ho have no problems, exaggerating the problem even more.
TL;DR: I really should be spending more time on my schoolwork instead of convinc
ing some online person that the system is broke and the media lies.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Slavazza 4 points 1 month ago
The reason for it is that land is a limited resource and then you have inflation
and economic growth. Money supply is growing in basically all economies at an e
ven higher rate than economic growth + inflation rate. The surplus has to go som
ewhere and it affects asset valuations - hence the long-term growth of the stock
exchanges and property values.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)

[ ]The NetherlandsSCREECH95 2 points 1 month ago


I think these modern windmills belong in the Dutch landscape just as much as the
old ones. I mean, doesn't this look extremely Dutch to you?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americawadcann 1 point 1 month ago
and for some magical reason, your house becomes more valuable to another person
Well, if population is increasing in an area, more people are competing for the
same slot of land.
At least in the United States, though, housing isn't a very good investment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Crowbarmagic 3 points 1 month ago
Source? I'm just wondering how close to the windmills these houses were when you
said neighbour. I can see how shadowflashing and the noise is annoying as fuck
and people don't want to live there, but it's hard to imagine that the prices dr
op 7-15% for just having windmills in your view.
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 5 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]European UnionUrnquei 1 point 1 month ago
Windmills make sound?
permalinkparent
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 3 points 1 month ago
A windmill as neighbor means a danish house will lose 7-15 % of its value though
,
But people recieve financial compensation for that.
permalinkparent
[ ]_Francis 1 point 1 month ago
[citation needed]
permalinkparent
[ ]DenmarkMrStrange15 2 points 1 month ago
Here is a study about it done by Copenhagen University. it's in danish, it basic
ally says that if there is a windmill within 2,5 km of the property then the pri
ce drops by 3 % and if it's 00 m closer then the price drops by 0,25 % extra and
so.
If the windmill produces between 20-29 dB then the price drops by another 3 % an
d if it's between 40-50 dB then the price drops by 7 %.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomthebeginningistheend 1 point 1 month ago
Not to mention all that wind...
permalinkparent
[ ]warpus 1 point 1 month ago
Why does it drop in value, just because less people want to buy it? Demand goes
down?
permalinkparent
[ ]United States of Americabuildthyme 1 point 1 month ago
or the shadow flashing
Considering the earth's movement, this couldn't be a problem for more than what,
1% of the year?
permalinkparent
[ ]iverie 1 point 1 month ago
There's no way to get some sort of 'refund' due to the property losing value?
Edit- 'compensation' maybe
permalinkparent

load more comments (14 replies)


[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 5 points 1 month ago
Then you're a minority. In nearly every village where we try to build new ones t
here's a lot of resistance.
permalinkparent
[ ]13104598210 1 point 1 month ago
A Dutchman doesn't oppose windmills. Next we'll hear a German say he doesn't min
d working overtime.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwedenDuapDuap 72 points 1 month ago
Windmills are cool, I don't know why people get so mad over the prospect of havi
ng them in their vicinity.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
shadow flickering
sound
danger from falling ice
Have a few reasons :)
permalinkparent
[ ]Irelandvjaf23 22 points 1 month ago
point of calmness
What's that?
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 5 points 1 month ago
I am sorry if that is translated haphazardly. It's the idea that you have a poin
t on the horizon you can look at that's not constantly moving. Permanent movemen
t wherever you look can be quite stressful.
permalinkparent
[ ]Rapesilly_Chilldick 20 points 1 month ago
Just look at the traffic.
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 7 points 1 month ago
That remembers me of the Tropico 4 radio announcement when you build a windmill.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 3 points 1 month ago
After I gave up on Tropico after the pirate thing (2? 3?), I don't get the refer
ence. Care to enlighten me?
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 12 points 1 month ago
After you build a windmill, Penultimo (Loyalist Faction Leader) talks to his CoHost Sunny Flowers (Enviromentalist FL) about the wind mill and says to her that
she loves this renewable energy. She then complains about all sorts of stuff, w
ith one being that the windmill "hat dem letzten Kokusnussadler den Kopf gespalt
en".
permalinkparent
load more comments (18 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 42 points 1 month ago
Trust me, as someone who just drove 750 miles yesterday through the American Mid
west (as in absolutely jack shit to look at) to get home for Thanksgiving, seein
g wind farms was a welcome distraction from 12 straight hours of "calmness on th
e horizon".
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, maybe for you, under these very specific circumstances. Once you live surr
ounded by them and at no point during the day can watch something that isn't mov
ing, you might think differently.

permalinkparent
[ ]United States of AmericaMshotts 6 points 1 month ago
We'll take your windmills if you don't want them :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]Hobbidance 3 points 1 month ago*
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
). Unless you're stood close to it I doubt this will affect anyone other than th
e engineers. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again e
volution, the stupid ones die.
Edit: Read further on and saw the explanation for 'point of calmness' to be
It's the idea that you have a point on the horizon you can look at that's not co
nstantly moving. Permanent movement wherever you look can be quite stressful.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyDocTomoe 1 point 1 month ago
What is considered a "point of calmness"... o_o
I explained it somewhere else ... it's a point at the horizon that's not constan
tly moving. Being in an enviroment without such "Ruhepunkte" is stressful.
In regards to 'danger to avian wildlife' if birds fly into it then that's just h
ow evolution goes... the stupid ones die. Most birds tend not to fly into things
though.
This isn't stupidity. This is being hit from the side by a windmill wing at 160+
km/h. Tell me again how "better" birds look sideways searching for objects on a
potential impact course... Your "evolution at work" will mean "extinction of lar
ge birds of prey like hawks, eagles and owls" (smaller birds tend to not operate
in that heights and/or open airspace).
Why do we not build an autobahn over an area having some sort of rare lizard tha
t only exists there, but this suddenly is a case of evolutionary disadvantage?
Also the danger from falling ice... the same could be said for pylons. Windmills
are not erected outside your front door or close to roads (not in the UK anyway
).
They can be very near commonly-inhabitated areas in Germany. However, and this m
ight come as a surprise to you, people like to live not only in their homes and
on roads, but also ramble the countryside. I've seen plans of a windpark nearby
in the woods - at 160m height, each windmill renders an area 2km around it into
a no-go area in the winter. Put 15-20 of them in a cluster, and entering the for
est can be very, very lethal.
. If people do stand under them and get hit by falling ice... again evolution, t
he stupid ones die.
A government that proposes electricity gathering that impedes basic and constitu
tionally-granted human rights (e.g. the right to roam) by willfully adding letha
l elements into the picture is a government of criminals and should be dealt wit
h.
Sorry, but, a horizon is 360o all you have to do it look in a different directio
n if you cared to.
Works as long as you are not surrounded by wind farms. This is no longer the cas
e in many parts of Germany.
permalinkparent
[ ]Germanywealllovered2 2 points 1 month ago
They will learn fast to not fly into windmills is his point.
permalinkparent
[ ]bytemage 2 points 1 month ago

Sounds like we should ban cars too. There are far more reasons cars are anoying/
dangerous.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]Jan_Brady 2 points 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
No more "point of calmness" on the horizon
Non argument.
shadow flickering
Doesn't happen in Germany.
sound
Outside residential areas in Germany.
danger from falling ice
LOL
I'm surprised to see all these fake arguments made up by the GOP used by a Germa
n especially since some of them don't apply to Germans because of your more stri
ct regulations. You should get off of the Internet. I hear your schools are pret
ty good, you should use them.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenzyphelion 1 point 1 month ago
Danger to avian wildlife
False. Already debunked.
Maybe not birds, but bats appears to be at risk
Second PopSci-source
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ]Tonnac 1 point 1 month ago
Because at the moment they're not a sustainable solution for the energy problem
and just a patchjob to make people feel like they're doing something for the env
ironment.
permalinkparent
load more comments (11 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Scotlandswindlz 9 points 1 month ago
I will always love hills covered in turbines more then a single dirty coal power
station.
permalink
[ ]Not SpainRikkushin 21 points 1 month ago
Why do people hate to see windmills? I think that they actually look cool
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 18 points 1 month ago
I kinda like the juxtaposition of those modern windmills that create energy out
of thin air (so to say) with agricultural farm land. In my opinion it doesn't lo
ok bad at all.
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 7 points 1 month ago
Putting them on a dike looks awesome.
permalinkparent
[ ]AGuyFromRio 2 points 1 month ago
Would she like it? :)
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
[ ]United KingdomSergeantJezza 44 points 1 month ago
wind *turbines *

Windmills are for grinding corn. Sorry, I had to.


permalinkparent
[ ]GermanyFauler_Lentz 5 points 1 month ago
Apparently everyone but English speakers happily call them windmills and nobody
cares :P
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]cokkish 7 points 1 month ago
lol, that's cute. Come to Italy and see the 'Not in my backyard' mentality broug
ht to the next level shit.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 11 points 1 month ago
Have windmills in my view. Actually relaxing to look at. Like a big flower.
I like it.
I don't think anyone really dislikes them. They're just worried it'll lower the
value of their property.
permalinkparent
[ ]Czech Republicpayik 9 points 1 month ago
No. It's called hypocrisy.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 7 points 1 month ago
Some windmills have been built in a mountain near my village, i like them and i
like the view, it's like a ray of hope of a better tomorrow.
permalinkparent
[ ]oceanembers 22 points 1 month ago
fucken NIMBYs everywhere around here. "What do you mean the north downs are a gr
eat place for windmills? I live here and I don't want windmills!!" Yeah well if
you'd stop using your 4x4 to drive 100 yards to the nearest shop, maybe you woul
dn't need them
permalinkparent
[ ]FinlandHrtzy 10 points 1 month ago
It's particularly funny when you get to the subject of wind farms from the subje
ct of nuclear energy. "What do you mean build a nuclear plant in Oulu? That'll r
uin the tourist image of Lapland! I'd much rather have a few wind turbines in my
backyard. What do you mean 'wind-farm the area of Helsinki'? That'll ruin the t
ourist image of Lapland! Why can't they just use less electricity for heating?"
I could go on.
permalinkparent
load more comments (1 reply)
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]SpainNerlian 3 points 1 month ago
I'd rather say, they don't want their in their view if they are not in their bac
kyards.
I had a friend whose family lived in a small village in the mountains in Avila,
very windy and all. They were approached to put windmills in their land and ever
yone was on board since, much of the population would have at least one windmill
on their land and they'd collect the sweet sweet rent money.
The neighbourhs on the other hand were pissed of they werent having any of these
sweet euros and now they'd see their neighbours windmills on the town over, so
suddenly it was a problem to have the windmills and they were eyesoreish.
permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
May I know the name of the village. My grandma is from a small village in Avila
(20km from Avila city) and the same happened there, maybe both village are close
to each other.
permalinkparent
[ ]SpainNerlian 1 point 1 month ago
IIRC the village was La Hergijela, no idea how close or far from Avila city since
I've never been there.

permalinkparent
[ ]Onlyreplytoidiots 1 point 1 month ago
Not very far away, give your friend my regards
https://www.google.es/maps/dir/Mu%C3%B1ana,+%C3%81vila/La+Herguijuela,+%C3%81vil
a/@40.4934593,-5.3048465,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0xd40817438792917
:0xae5f01a1a32ce87f!2m2!1d-5.0149955!2d40.5914001!1m5!1m1!1s0xd3f9b1db9ed9c9f:0x
262a6bf1e9d19659!2m2!1d-5.2544061!2d40.395184
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomBrewtifull 2 points 1 month ago
There was a huge resistance in my village, morons, the lot of them.
permalinkparent
[ ]skztr 1 point 1 month ago
Why wouldn't someone want a windmill in their backyard?
permalinkparent
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
It's a figure of speech. It means that people don't want it near them. 'Backyard
' is a metaphor for 'close to you'.
When we say 'It's happening in our backyard' we mean that it's happening close t
o us.
For example:
Human trafficking isn't something that happens only in 3rd world countries, it's
also happening in our backyard.
It means that human trafficking happens in our countries as well.
permalinkparent
[ ]The NetherlandsValkren 1 point 1 month ago
Yeah, the resistance against windmills in Friesland is pretty ridiculous in my o
pinion. What landscape is there to protect? There almost no real nature left the
re, it's all been heavily reformed by people to fit in rectangles of farmland. N
o mountains, no natural forests, no natural streams. If anything, windmills shou
ld be a symbol of wealth and good intentions for the future generations.
I bet that if windmills are built now, and in 50 years if a new technology threa
tens to replace them people will get all emotional over the windmills being 'par
t of our landscape' or 'they've been here since I was a kid, so they should stay
'.
EDIT: I'm from Friesland myself
permalinkparent
[ ]Sheltac 1 point 1 month ago
Am I the only one who thinks windmills are awesome? There's a lot of them near m
y hometown and I love going there.
permalinkparent
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Frysln (Living in Overijssel)TheByzantineDragon 1 point 1 month ago
Not even the most original joke about windturbines.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_09/020014.php
"Wind is God's way of balancing heat. Wind is the way you shift heat from areas
where it's hotter to areas where it's cooler. That's what wind is. Wouldn't it b
e ironic if in the interest of global warming we mandated massive switches to en
ergy, which is a finite resource, which slows the winds down, which causes the t
emperature to go up? Now, I'm not saying that's going to happen, Mr. Chairman, b
ut that is definitely something on the massive scale. I mean, it does make some
sense. You stop something, you can't transfer that heat, and the heat goes up. I
t's just something to think about."
permalink
[ ]PortugalDanielShaww 1 point 1 month ago
Recently there has been a "not in my neighbours' farmland" mentality. It starts
with someone opposing a wind farm in his land and then finding out his neighbour
took the offer and is now racking $3000/month for leasing the land.
permalinkparent
[ ]linuxjava 1 point 1 month ago

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NIMBY
permalinkparent
[ ]ScotlandJamie_Maclauchlan 1 point 1 month ago
I don't want wind turbines for green energy.There is a lot of ignorance on the i
ssue I have to admit but a lot of people live in cities and never have to see th
em if they don't want to.
permalinkparent
load more comments (19 replies)
[ ]United KingdomProfessional_Bob 10 points 1 month ago
I think we can also look at the phrasing. It says "citizens of all other EU coun
tries" I'm not saying they're right or that I agree with them but I reckon many
people would have issues with Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles being granted free
access and wouldn't bat an eye to a Swede, Dane or German.
permalinkparent
[ ]SwitzerlandDuvidl 3 points 1 month ago
Absolutely true. I don't question WHY the results are as they are. I get that. I
'm just saying it's obviously a hypocritical view.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
It's only hypocritical if you don't believe that Englishmen are superior to slav
s.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomalmdudler26 2 points 1 month ago
Not to disagree with your point, but the way things are at the moment EU citizen
s are treated as 'superior' to non-EU ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Swedenchagad 2 points 1 month ago
Treated as superior by whom?
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (27 replies)
[ ]Swedenpawnstomper 175 points 1 month ago
Hypocrisy, sure.
But I bet similar charts for all countries would look more or less the same.
permalink
[ ]Bahamabanana 8 points 1 month ago
Definitely.
But I'm not sure that makes it better.
permalinkparent
[ ]Portugaljm7x 28 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi
ne. Even risk to say you'll feel rich and wealthy...
(Winter sports resorts are rather limited, though. Some other hindrances, but no
t very serious)
The opposite case I don't feel it needs explaining: there are more Portuguese li
ving abroad than in country. To be fair, many (most?) are outside Europe, but st
ill...
So, I'm pretty sure in our case the green bars would rise quite high compared to
the red ones.
permalinkparent
[ ]Unio Europaea | Vive l'Europe fdrale!dr_turkleberry 16 points 1 month ago
I can clearly confirm this statement. It's a very welcoming country and people.
I really like their notion of being a gate to the world, maybe because of their
magnificent history...idk. Traveled from Viana do Castelo to Sagres and on the t
he southern interior. I was around my Portuguese friends all the time and living
in their houses. What a lovely and welcoming people, will come back asap.
permalinkparent
[ ]somesuredditsareshit 2 points 1 month ago
Not here. You can come in any time -- just bring your own money and you'll be fi

ne.
That, too, is the same almost everywhere.
permalinkparent
load more comments (5 replies)
[ ]ItalyMordorsFinest 4 points 1 month ago
Not sure, anti immigrant sentiments in most of Europe aren't usually directed at
other non-Balkan Europeans. It's mostly against Africans and West and South Asi
ans.
permalinkparent
[ ]mkvgtired 2 points 1 month ago
That is why it is annoying that this keeps getting posted. Look at a similar sce
nario with VISAs. Ask almost anyone if they think they should need a VISA to tra
vel to XYZ country. Now as them if people in XYZ country should have the ability
to freely travel to their country.
I have a feeling it would be very similar.
permalinkparent
[ ]United Kingdomdraw_it_now 56 points 1 month ago
That's pretty much how we've always felt about anything: We can go there, but yo
u can't come here. This is holy land.
permalink
[ ]EnglandHoney-Badger 28 points 1 month ago
*Land of hope and glory
permalinkparent
[ ]sterreichRedKrypton 6 points 1 month ago
If you go after soil and weather, god has left you.
permalinkparent
[ ]The Netherlandsthunderpriest 2 points 1 month ago
Oi, you stay on y'er bloody island you filthy lot! :)
But yeah, it's probably like that in most Western European countries that have h
ad significant immigration from the Middle East/Eastern Europe/North Africa.
permalinkparent
[ ]redduck259 15 points 1 month ago
Well to be fair they didn't ask what the fair option would be, only what they pr
efer. I doubt the outcome would be much different in any other country - nobody
wants to be restricted in terms of movement, and nobody wants more competition.
Implementing it like that would be pretty egoistic, but the question wasn't abou
t what would be the best for all of mankind.
EDIT: I'm actually surprised that 26% don't think they should be free to live an
d work anywhere. Would have expected much lower.
permalink
[ ]European UnioncHaOZ_ZoNE 3 points 1 month ago
I'd assume those 26% actually have the spine say "all or nothing" instead of "we
're better"
permalinkparent
[ ]European Federationjtalin 98 points 1 month ago
This has popped up several times so far, and the responses from the local UKIP c
rowd have been even more comical than the image itself.
I think the argument comes down to "That image makes sense because we do want yo
ur super-qualified people to immigrate, we just don't want all the Romanians to
come with them".
permalink
[ ]Irelandshanemitchell 48 points 1 month ago
TIL Romania doesn't have super-qualified people /s
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 104 po
ints 1 month ago
Deport all Romanians back to Africa where they came from!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Chad
permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomThe_last_in_line 62 points 1 month ago

Romanians confirmed for both African and Roma


I don't think my heart can handle this, call in the underpants brigade!
permalinkparent
[ ]Romanian, pissing in your tea with a precalculated arch.acidburnzdeleted 15 poi
nts 1 month ago
Phase 1: collect underpants
Phase 2: ??
Phase 3: Profit!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tO5sxLapAts
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]Francefauxgosse 59 points 1 month ago
That would drastically affect all the young Britons in other EU countries. In on
e recent episode of Question Time Ken Clarke said that 10% of British people liv
ing in Berlin receive German welfare benefits. My experience reflects that state
ment.
Not only would welfare benefits fall away, young/non-rich people couldn't move t
o Europe unless they have high-level university education or some desperately ne
eded skill. Do you know how jealous Americans in Berlin are of their British fri
ends only because EU citizenship opens so many doors?
permalink
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 36 points 1 month ago
10% of British people living in Berlin receive German welfare benefits
That's the big problem. Having s system where people have the right to freely mo
ve between countries and claim benefits there doesn't work unless the levels of
benefits and cost of living is fairly consistent between countries. With more, p
oorer nations joining the EU and gaining this right, it's inevitable that there
is a migration from the poorer nations to the richer ones, which is harmful to b
oth.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits (at the same level that they would receive in their home natio
n) until they've been employed and paying tax for a certain amount of time.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Unfortunately, a pragmatic debate is impossible in the current climate of rhetor
ic and "hard-line" groups.
permalinkparent
[ ]Francefauxgosse 42 points 1 month ago
Having s system where people have the right to freely move between countries and
claim benefits there doesn't work
You can't just claim unemployment benefits (around 390 euros + whatever your ren
t is a month) on arrival in Germany. You need to have worked or seriously looked
for a job. It's not that easy, they are stricter on foreigners (because of pote
ntial abuse) and I think it is a good system the way it is.
Germany did win that court case against the Romanian woman. Member states alread
y have the required mechanisms to prevent welfare tourism.
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
Another option would be to have an EU-wide agreement on a basic level of benefit
s, with nations having the option to pay additional benefits to their own citize
ns without the requirement that they pay this to recently-arrived immigrants.
Very good proposal in my opinion. That way newly arrived immigrants wouldn't be

completely starved for money either.


permalinkparent
[ ]United KingdomDeathflid 8 points 1 month ago
TIL I would be better off on German benefits than > minimum wage full time Engli
sh work
permalinkparent
load more comments (10 replies)
[ ]finlayofdublin 11 points 1 month ago
Habitual Residence Conditions often go overlooked by the Eurosceptic movement wh
en complaining about "welfare leeches".
permalinkparent
[ ]xelah1 1 point 1 month ago
One solution would be to make the source nation responsible for paying for the m
igrant's benefits
In the German system that is impossible because it means Spanish authorities wou
ld need to make sure the unemployed German is properly looking for work whereas
Germany would pay. Money and the pressure to look for work are closely linked he
re.
It actually already happens a little bit. I'm not sure if it's an EU-wide thing
or not (I think it is), but the UK government will keep paying jobseekers' allow
ance for three months to people who have left for another EEA country. They have
to register with the local employment people and follow their rules. It also on
ly applies to the contributions-based version (which isn't any higher than the o
ther version).
If governments really can't be trusted to do the right checks without a financia
l incentive then it could be combined with the EU-basic benefits idea (make the
host government pay it), or the paying government could after a while start aski
ng for evidence that the claimant is also looking for work in that country, too.
Of course, in the UK it's assistance with housing that's much more financially i
mportant. Jobseekers' allowance is a few percent of the total benefits bill. Pen
sions are the biggest, and housing benefit (which immigrants can get, even whils
t in low-paid work) is something like 15%. If the UK really wants to use the ben
efits system to keep out low-paid EU immigrants then this is the one it'd have t
o look at. (However, if cutting the bill were more important then I'd suggest bu
ilding houses instead).
permalinkparent
load more comments (3 replies)
[ ][deleted] 1 month ago
[deleted]
[ ]United Kingdommallardtheduck 5 points 1 month ago
I'm more in favour of an EU-wide basic provision of unemployment/disability/etc.
benefits. Basic Income needs more evidence of practicality in a modern, globali
sed economy IMHO.
permalink
[ ]EnglandClutchHunter 6 points 1 month ago
Using this opportunity to plug /r/basicincome.
permalinkparent
[ ]Earth- From Sussexjimthewanderer 1 point 1 month ago
So if there was a universal system of benefits people wouldn't be drawn to migra
ting to lenient benefit nations like Sweden and the UK?
permalinkparent
load more comments (4 replies)
[ ]Fryske KeninkrykMagnaFrisia 1 point 1 month ago
No thanks. What people get in welfare here, is enough to live the good life in o
ther parts.
There should just be a rule that "internal migrants" need to meet certain standa
rds before being allowed basic provisions. Like at least work for x years.
permalinkparent
load more comments (2 replies)
[ ]dobrymalo 6 points 1 month ago

A fine point. It's actualy a first sensible stance on the benefits system and le
eching it problem I've seen in a long time.
permalinkparent
load more comme

You might also like