OP atl the garde filma
that have appeared in the
Jast two years, Mani Kaul's
“Uski Roti” is perhaps the only
one which could claim to be
really experimental. Whatever
the fate of the film, it has earn
Jn our cinema today
Rarely has a flm or a director
been talked about eo mich, The
ticiged, one feele,
enthusiasm. But “Uski Rot” is
the kind of lm that ean liberate
‘cinema that has been wallow-
Alot cliches” for ages
‘Recognition has not been lack-
ing for “Uski Roti" or Kaul. The
Filmfare Crities Award, the
Venice Film Festival, « place on
the jury for Kaul at the Berlin
Festival and the National Award
{or its phenomenal cameraman
XK. K. Mahajan. “Ashad Ka Ek
Din,” Mani Kaus second Alm,
bagged the Critics Award within
& month of ite completion. Yet
‘Uskl Hot!” ig sill to see public
‘eshibition in India, thanks to the
highly commercialied distribu
tion set-up which considers past
‘taste as the only sure thing in
taste
Tn the following intervie
‘Mani Kaul talke about his lm
his methods and his future pr
este
Does the fact that the publ
‘has not been able to see “Ushi
Rott” bother you?
Tt bothers me. The factors that
have acted against me are? the
economics of making « feature
one; the
et that there are people in the
commercial flm industry — who
‘would like to repress it; and an
audience conditioned to receiving
extravagenzas,
People come to watch the kind
ot film they have been used. to
don't fit into any of these cate-
sores. T believe that ~ certain
septs worked out on the
St communieation are the begin-
ing of a flm maker's failure
His incapacity to give up the
medium and Inability to follow
ma thinking, If 1 started
simplifying for the audience, it
neans 1 am falsifying the pro-
1 the
innot be fought with
it should be fought with
les
THE An Interview
vith
SUT
By J. S, RAOF
F
Teme citer medium or by life of distinct notes or beats rather dubbed the main actor volce Anite duration and pre-recorded
Pieeit Tconsder te'a medium. than a regular musical composi. wth your own.” What is the the track. ‘With the real ahem
Should not cinema be more — tion reason? T played tt back an the location,
PBrmanic thon the slow deliberate Although your films are differ- "Your question is very inter- the images were functioning um
Nezture of your filma? ent in content despite the wait- esting and very dificult for me der the discipline of sounds,
What 1am saying is not a rule. ing woman theme, your method 9 answer. Ifeel if Tapeak, my What re your future plans?
However, a higher experience in of treatment seems to be more contact will be more direct. Itis Are you planning @ third film?
lle, asin cinema, is achieved by or les the same, Are you deve- not the inability of the actor to am working on = script and
PPesiming to work against the oping a personal atyle tm cine- speak, Still, I feel it will make the story is by a man called
atural tendencies. “The high ma? the text more commentative and Vijaydan Detha of Borunda, a
uns of any civilisation have No. Maybe it appears tat way. leat of a dialogue I don't know. village in Rajasthan. Ageinat all
[een reached, by opposing the But Iam certainly not engaged Maybe the reason will become odds, he has collected 9000 folk
P satural tendencies to discover in developing my own. style, clearer in my third fm, lore tales of Rajasthan from
[iecorrect relation between what mainly because I feel that the What is your answer to those farmers and old women. ‘This
‘natural and what is right problem of having a personal who have called your filme ob- particular story is « step ahead
conduct. style is more of 2 renaissance scure and cbstroct? of my own themes.
InbothUski Rots" and “Ashad problem. It might even be That they are obscure and Speaking formally, it further
you seem to favour the use thought decadent to have a style! abstract. However, I have found articulates my theory of directly
f rlatic exmera positions and Where I have repeated myself, that women respond very well to narrating a film rather than em
hudied definite movements. Is nnd which Ithink is not a ques” my films acting it out. Tt is amazing that
this-a sort of self imposed dis- tion of style, ig in “neutralising”. Would you take stars in your objections. to “Ahad. "ane
dipline? T make every effort to combine films if you found them sujfici- mostly strong trom theatre peo
My answer in fact precedes the sound and image — moving or ently self effacing? Like Bel- ple, whereas in that Alm, 1 have
Pteetion. Both films were tho- static — in such a manner as to mondo, Soumitra Chatterii or abstracted the purer’ form’ of
oughly planned and organised reach the static. “And this, per Waheeda Rehman? theatre,
4m detail to counteract all that haps Twill repeat in almost I don't know. I want every Would you name some of the
foes under the name of spon- every film. I will combine the one with me to bea worker, film makers around you of whom
Mtsncty. Because, the discipline two to make them silent. In fact, Most Ukely, in tay third sim I gow have high hopes?
nd is rigorous “implementation very much unlike when T paint’ will be taking a girl who can" Kumer Shahan, SN. Dhir,
f@ much farther than the spuci- then T combine the two to dis- be termed a star. ‘Vishnu Mathur, Vinay Shukla,
ug naturalness or spontaneity turb, What is your concept of time Vikas Desai and K. M. Shankar
Wo are ured to, it can achieve a In both your films you have in cinema? appa,
profound simplicity. Above: “Whatever happens in her ‘Time in cinema for me must These are all from the Film
There is hardly ony back- mind is not memory..." Gariena necessarily correspond to time in Inatitute, Any others?
(gvend music in “Ushi Hot” ands Balo in "Usk Rov” life. In its Juxtaponition of seg- "Girish Karnad — even though
tad” although in the lt ‘ments however, cinema has-a 1 have only seen him act. May-
ter you have wsed sound effects. Tight to shatter our normal per- be some others escape my mind.
[Be you think music would de- Above right: Mani Kaul briefs ception of time, Which is why This is not final Ist.
from the seriousness of Ratha Sabnis for "Ashad Ke Ei I claim that in “Uski Rot” there What do you think of the
fms? Din fare no flashbacks or flashfor- future of Indian cinema?
is very close to me and wards. would like to be-wery hope-
independently of cinema. @ T was concerned with the 2c- ful and T am sure'that ifthe gor
tne therefore even to call tuality of this woman “Balo’ and ernment-doed not abandon its re
background score” How- what we may call her mind life. cantly found low budget policy,
tthe simple arrangement of ‘Whatever happens in her mind is "there is no dearth of talent i |
in “Uski Roti" were put at ‘not memory, nor is it aaticipa- this country to make — this
where conventionally tion. Tels also sn. actsality memorable period in the history
bis not required. The pur- In’ “Unis Roti” the whole of Indian cinema.
‘to simplify my own ‘stylisation emerged trom basic- Lastly, don't you have a wish
ally, the arrangement of space in to make a film that «ill be om
‘hymns T have used in images. Whereas in “Ashad..." immediate hit with the masses?
ware part of the sound the space was further controlicd "T have a desire, but no urge-
but percussion has boen by time cycles of sounds. Thad Twill be happy if it “happens
{smu In both cases T divided the text of “Ahad...” But nothing will foree me to 40
ireced by” the use Into recurrent time circles of de- it,
8