Perhaps a more general discussion of psychological approaches and viewpoints is warranted.

Sticking just to Mark Douglas for the time being...

I initially found MD very illuminating - I've read TITZ and Disciplined Trader many times each, literally
8-10 times for TITZ.

I think MD does an excellent job of presenting most of the viewpoint a consistent trader needs to
have. However, I think MD is limited in that his psychological approach best serves those who view
trading as a statistical/probabilistic math problem.

I don't want to voice an opinion whether this is right/wrong because opinions differ and aspects of
both are correct.

But I think that in discussing psychological coaches it is fruitful to make distinctions between
coaches that help you adjust your psychology to a given approach vs. psychologists who help you
work on yourself regardless of the philosophical approach you are using.

I would classify MD as a psych coach who will help you adjust your viewpoint/mindset towards using
a statistical/probabilistic approach.

I would classify Brett Steenbarger as a more "all-around" psych coach. He believes strongly in the
statistical/probabilistic approach but he offers a lot of practical knowledge in the "achievement" and
"performance" categories.

One psych coach not mentioned is Ari Kiev. I don't want to derail the thread, but Ari is very good and
focuses on the personal aspect in most of his books (Trading to Win is the exception). However, I
would caution that Ari's coaching is most useful for those that approach trading as a performance
discipline which involves building conviction in trade ideas based on skill/experience/focus.

thanks for the thread!

I agree they are both very good for different reasons.

"The day I became a winning trader was the day it became boring. Daily losses no longer bother me
and daily wins no longer excited me. Took years of pain and busting a few accounts before finally got
my mind right. I survived the darkness within and now just chillax and let my black box do the work."
Quotes that I enjoyed

I just finished reading Trading in the Zone. I need to take the book back to the library, and I wanted
to get a few ideas down for reference. I figure here is as good a place as any.

CH1

Ninety-five percent of the trading errors you are likely to make—causing the money to just
evaporate

before your eyes—will stem from your attitudes about being wrong, losing money, missing out, and

leaving money on the table. What I call the four primary trading fears.

CH3

Taking responsibility means believing that all of your outcomes are self-generated; that your results
are based on your interpretations of market information, the decisions you make and the actions
you take as a result. Taking anything less than complete responsibility sets up two major
psychological obstacles that will block your success. First, you will establish an adversarial
relationship with the market that takes you out of the constant flow of opportunities. Second, you
will mislead yourself into believing that your trading problems and lack of success can be rectified
through market analysis.

CH4

If your goal is to trade like a professional and be a consistent winner, then you must start from the
premise that the solutions are in your mind and not in the market.

CH7

A probabilistic mind-set pertaining to trading consists of five fundamental truths.

1. Anything can happen.

2. You don't need to know what is going to happen next in order to make money.

3. There is a random distribution between wins and losses for any given set of variables that define
an edge.

4. An edge is nothing more than an indication of a higher probability of one thing happening over
another.
5. Every moment in the market is unique.

If you really believe in an uncertain outcome, then you also have to expect that virtually anything
can happen. Otherwise, the moment you let your mind hold onto the notion that you know, you
stop taking all of the unknown variables into consideration. Your mind won't let you have it both
ways. If you believe you know something, the moment is no longer unique. If the moment isn't
unique, then everything is known or knowable; that is, there's nothing not to know. However, the
moment you stop factoring in what you don't or can't know about the situation instead of being
available to perceive what the market is offering, you make yourself susceptible to all of the typical
trading errors.

CH8

On the other hand, if you believe that all you need to know is:

1. the odds are in your favor before you put on a trade;

2. how much it's going to cost to find out if the trade is going to work;

3. you don't need to know what's going to happen next to make money on that trade; and

4. anything can happen;

Then how can the market make you wrong?

CH11

I AM A CONSISTENT WINNER BECAUSE:

1. I objectively identify my edges.

2. I predefine the risk of every trade.

3. I completely accept risk or I am willing to let go of the trade.

4. I act on my edges without reservation or hesitation.

5. I pay myself as the market makes money available to me.

6. I continually monitor my susceptibility for making errors.

7. I understand the absolute necessity of these principles of consistent success and, therefore, I

never violate them.