[D&D 3.5] Alternative Epic Rules?

Hey Playgrounders,

So, I'm running a PbP game and I quickly decided that I want to take my players to the Epic
levels. I'll be accelerating level advancement a lot to make up for the slow-moving nature of
PbP, so, even though they're start at Level 4, This is simply because I'd like to see them
able to challenge the "big 'uns" (for example, a CR 59+ [if I'm calculating it right] Great
Wyrm) of my setting before our gracious alien overlords (my masters, obviously) come
down and give my soul ultimate cosmic power and divine transcendence. I mean, once that
happens, I might not have time to run a PbP game.

Please don't harass me about "ruining the purity of the game" or something by making
levels go by fast. At least half of the party have the souls of Gods in them... They're
destined to have some pretty bloody epic adventures.

My point of this post is that, well, I kinda find the D&D Epic rules... bland. And kinda
broken. But mostly it's just the blandness - half the excitement in gaining a level for me is
new class abilities! But... um. Whee. Epic feat. Which are basically either broken or
completely flavourless crap.

Now, I'm not trying to raise an argument about Epic rules. Or edition - I'm sticking with 3.5,
because I'm comfortable with it, I like it, there's a lot of things I want to use from it, I love
some of the homebrew out there, and it's just fun for me, if a little challenging sometimes.
But what I do want to know is if anyone out there has devised an alternate way of
advancing beyond level 20. Any suggestions are welcome at this point - if I have to, I'll go
with the "usual" epic rules, but I'm not immensely pleased with them.

The key should be fun, not "balance".

The simplest idea I had was to just have everything advance past level 20 just like it used
to. Y'know, modify the base classes to have more than 20 "normal" levels (didn't Diablo D20
do this?), with BAB, Saves, and all that jazz advancing normally. Homebrew up some fun
ability advancement in conjunction with my players. Again, I don't give one whit for what
people call balance - I've already abused RAW in a manner which a character from the
Book of Erotic Fantasy would adore. I just care about fun...

So, yes, suggestions? What have you Playgrounders done with non-standard Epic
advancement?

Oh, and if you interpret this post as having lots of attitude? Well, yes, it does! But it's meant
to be fun, playful attitude, so please don't get offended! If you disagree with me, that's
fine - I'm just stating my feelings in a way that amuses me! It's all tongue-in-cheek, I
promise - good, clean, sassy fun.

Thanks in advance.

(P.S. My players/potential players are totally welcome to post in this thread, but don't think
that you can pump me for too much information. )

(P.P.S. If anyone is interested in the game and wants to navigate the UTTER CHAOS OMG of
the thread, click here. BEWARE INSANITY AHEAD. ALSO BLATANT RAW ABUSE SEE MY
EARLIER COMMENT ABOUT THE BOEF)

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Flickerdart
Yeah, the Epic Level Handbook is broken as hell, especially considering it's 3.0 (I think).

For lack of something better to do, you could simply let players take more class levels. "I'm
a 20th level Druid, I've maxed my casting, time to get some of that sweet Master of Many
Forms" is a reasonable thing to do.

So is stopping caster level advancement altogether, since Epic magic is what makes Epic
broken. Since casters are overpowered anyways, it's a good chance for them to round off
their abilities, especially since normally it can turn into a game of "what about THIS one,
does this kill you?" If they take, say, Rogue levels on top of Wizard, they'll make an
excellent skill monkey and if they get uppity and you slam down the in-game nerf bat,
they're not useless, but you get your point across.
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Cheesegear
Simply put, just allow more Class Levels. Don't worry about 'Epic' so much. Since once your
players hit Level 20, they're almost assuredly to be almost-broken as it is.

Just let your players keep advancing.

Or, just cross out anything you think is broken (like Magic), or don't like. Or, since you're
DM, just fiat them some homebrew abilities.

Like once a Desert Wanderer with various caster classes hits level 20/1, you should think
about giving him Sandform as an SLA, maybe?
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Salvonus
Thanks for the suggestions, mates. I'll probably just go with the whole "stacking on more
class/PrC levels" thing, since it's the simplest solution. I thought that maybe someone who
disliked the blandness of the ELH would have made up some super special awesome
homebrew Epic system that I could never even DREAM of, but it appears not.

Now... I have to figure out how to handle epic spellcasting. I'm almost tempted to have real
10th+ level spells, powers, and manoeuvres (not just virtual slots for metamagic), but that
is a lot of work. Still... Cool new spells is hardly a "bland" thing, amirite? Makes CL
progression still worthwhile, and gives the ToBers some cool stuff too. Homebrewing up an
awesome continuation to Dervish might be in the cards too, Dreamshifter.

Ahh, thanks lads (and lasses, if any of you rare breed be out there). I did not learn as much
as I might have wished for, but I appreciate your help regardless.

'course, if anyone feels crazzzzzy and goes on an "Alternative Epic" homebrewing binge,
FOR <deity>'S SAKE SEND ME A PM.
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Prometheus
The link to the epic spellcasting rules actually seems pretty good. The only other thing I
could recommend is to make spells stop being any deeper, but make them wider. For
example, Time Stop that works for allies, Temporal Stasis over a large area, Gate which
functions for multiple dimensions simultaneously, etc.

Personally, I think homebrewing beyond 20 progression is the best option for general
classes suggested. Perhaps it should be mentioned that the power level of said expansions
should still have continuity non-epic classes, so while it might not make sense to stop
progressing spellcasting a lot of builds can still find it fun to multiclass.
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Belial_the_Leveler
As a fan of god games and very epic games I have a suggestion:

Every 2-3 epic levels, you get a divine rank, with all the mechanical benefits this gives. Cool
new divine powers and you don't even have to make them up? Yes, please!
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