ead Samuel D. Hunter Greater Clements TONY KUSHNER: I want to start by talkin ‘work seems to involve a very strong sense of place. [have sort about Idaho. Your of an adjacent question, which is whether or not your playsare interconnected. Are they in some waysa cycle SAM HUNTERET think so? But in many ways I'm stil out because I'm sill buildingt. When [frst a playwright, Iwasa high school studentin Idaho. Tonly applied to two colleges—the University of dao and NYU—because some- bodytld me thatyou tughe there, which I wasnt even sure was tue iguring that ded I wanted tobe I did for like three years. When Ig about New York was from rea 1 to New York, I was so overwhelmed. I mean, all [knew Allen Ginsberg, who Iwas obsessed with when I was a teenager, and Angels in America, which I saw at the University of Maho in 1999. started writing play setin Fdaho asa kind of write what you know” sort of thing. Thave fairly deep ‘great great grandfather was the fist postmaster in my hometown, having moved there right after he fought in the Civil War. So I eel deeply connected to that partof the country. In roots there—1 school, [also wrote plays set elsewhere, but the Idaho ones always kind of hit firmer ground for me emotionally. ‘Then, ata certain point, around 2012, 2013, when I was first starting to get produced, I was like —Oh, ths isn’t about any one play; this is about a body of work. And within that body of work, I want the plays to respond to and dovetail off each other. I have no idea what this project is going to look like going forward, but Thaven't grown tired of it yet. And ie not like I start every play saying, “Gotta write about Idaho!” Ie ju people I want to write about naturaly fit maybe also because I don't see a lot of people like that populating that the storiesand the to that landscape. And our stages and our screens. Samuel D. Hunter _ The High Tragedy Place An interview with the playwright BY TONY KUSHNER In Samuel D, Hunter's Greater Clements, Magg a mother and son who run an and Jo Idaho mining museum, fice its imminent closure as their small town goes through the process of unineorporating. When an old fame of Maggie's turns up, her chance fora new startrans head on into punishing compromises and existential questions. Tony Kushner spoke to Hunter about the play last month, You've found a way to investigate everything that's central to what we're going through now asa country the terribly powerful presence of economic disparity and economic despair—the things everybody talks about every election cycle, people who are liv In these small owns in Idaho, ther yin towns that have lost their economic reason for being. Was that true atthe time that you we: growing up there? Actually, no. I grew up in Moscow, a college town in Northern Idaho, which is honestly the reason Iwas able to imagine becoming something so esoteric asa playwright. I grew up with access to the University of Maho Library, the largest library in the state, where 1 was introduced to writers like Allen Ginsberg. IF1 had lived in 2 town like where my mom grew up—Weiser, daho—I probably ‘wouldn't have had the same kind af acess, Even though Moscow is a small town in Northern Idaho that takes 15 hours to gett from New York City, there still a window tothe larger culture. Which is probably why I don’toften set plays in my hometown, because it doesnt feel ike the majority of Idaho to me. Iewasa surprise in Greater Clements ta learn—T didn't know this, 1 home and Googled it—that chere were internment camps in Idaho, and there had. ‘embarrassed to say,and I been a Japanese American community in the state,and racial tensions both before the war and when vers from the Pacific theatre were returning hom I should credit my mother with that. Iwas looking through one of | her old yearbooks few years ago, and I was struck by the fat that there were a ton of Japanese American kids in her high school in rural Idaho, Tarns out, there had been an internment camp nearby, something my mother was only vaguely aware of when she was young. She went on to tell me that she had dated a Japanese Amer- [ABOUT THE PLAYWRIGHT Samuel D. Hunter's plays include The Whale (Drama Desk Award, Lucille Lortel Award for Outstanding Play, GLAAD Media Award, Drama League and Outer Critis Circle nominations for Best Play), Lewiston/Clarkston (Drama Desk nomination for Outstanding Play), A Bright New Boise (Obie Award, Drama Desk nomination fr Outstanding Ply), The Few, A Great Wilderness, Rest, Pocaell, The Healing, The Harvest, and most ‘recently, Greater Clements. Hes the ecipient of a MacArthur Fellowship. Whiting Writers Award, and an honorary doctorate from the University of dane. His plays have been produced at such theaters a Lincoln Center Theater, Playwrights Horizons, \CT3, Seattle Rep, Theatre Royal Bath, Denver Center, South Coast Rep, Wiliamstown, Victory Gardens, Dalas Theater Center the Old Globe, and elsewhere. He is currently a Resident Playwright at Signature ‘Theater in New York. Anative of northern idaho, Sam lives in NYC. He holes degrees in playwriting from NYU, The lowa Playwrights Workshop, and Julia ABOUT THE PLAY Greater Clements had its world premiere at Lincoln Center Theater (André Bishop, producing artiste directo; Adam Siegel, managing ‘rector in New York, on December 9, 2018 It was directed by Davis McCallum. The sat design was by Dane Laffey the costume design was by Kaye Voyce, the lighting design wes by Vi Zhao, the sound design and original music were by itz Patton, the dramaturgs were John M. Baker and Anne Cattaneo, and the stage manager was Roxana Khan, The cast was: Jucith vey (Maggie), Edmund Donovan (Joe), Ken Narasak (Bly, Haley Sakamato (Ke) Nina Hellman, as AMERICANTHCATRE MAVIJUNE?©ican elasmate shad her sister. My grandfather was a World War IL vet, and, ata certain point he told them that he didn't approve ofit. ething that you grew up knowing abou No, Ididn’t know until very recently. Which itself reveals so much about who weare as a country and what we choose to remember. I had wanted to work thati know how. But when the 2016 election happened, that piece of his- tory took on a new dimension. I think Greater Clements is maybe into a play for years, but I didn’t really the frst time I've ever set out to write a play that's a state-of-the nation kind of play. What do you mean by that? Well, even though I think my plays kind of intersect with political ideas, I don't really think of them as overtly politcal plays. But I wrote the frst drat of Greater Clements about a month after the election ina writers’ group at the Lark. I was feeling so much anxiety, and I had so many questions; think the play was, toa degree, my way of dealing my own stress and dread, Bur the element that locked it into place, that really made it an allegorical state-of-the-nation tragedy, was the idea ofa own voting to unincorporate. And this an actual phenomenon. The real-life own I sort of modeled Clem- entson wascalled Seneca, Neb. that voted to unineorporate because of sues within and between the commu ty—arguments over land ‘us, things like that. Unincorporating opened up a fisure in the 1 was interested in the idea that these ial ie eracks sive way to these larger confers and deeper wells of resentment. Something I've seen ina number of your plays is that you have a great trust in the dramatic form itself to tell truths that you don't have to speak-—you know, the characters don’t have to stand up and deliver an essay. Yeah, that’s right. I don't have alot of rules for myselfas a write, but itis important to me that the characters aren't mouthpieces for ideas. That doesn't mean that there aren't big monologues in Greater Clements. But I think the plays are trying to engage with ‘on-the-ground human outcomes of these ideas and these realities. So the language they trafic in should be more quotidian andl hon- cst, you know what I mean? Yeah. I mean, they do and they don't, because the deeper you _getinto one of your plays when you' you're reading it, you train yourself to listen. The language feels to me, sa New Yorker who I think was once in Idaho ike al dialect, uc kind ofa rhythm of speech wat or when not exactly are that's true to thatarea. es funny, I've thought about thisa fot. Ido think that there's a par- ticular Idaho sensibility, which isa bit held back and alittle terse. “That being sad, a this point I might have just developed a kind of dialogue that’s more specific to the plays I've been writing rather than the real Idaho. Ie kind ofa constant dance for me, given that Twrite about real place: How much do I try to make sure that I'm place versusallowing myself to freely ere- ate these fictional characters and situation “accurate” about the! Irscems tome, more than Lewiston and Clarkston, more than The Harvest, that this sa tragedy. and that itcame out ofthis ys the election of Trump. If there's hope in Greater Clements it seems to me it’s p in theabsolute blasting away of everything thats. Yeah, Around when I was first conceiving the play, I remember walk~ ing downtown and having the idea for the lst three scenes. And I was like —Whoa, thats not usually the place where Igo in my plays. But a full-blown tragedy. And ultimately that’ why the play hasa structure thats itself sort ofa callback. The play isso much about the toxicity of nostalgia, and how we desper= catastrophic momentin rece! ily then I thought: maybe this ately try to relive things without admitting whae they really we ‘Yousee that, for instance, when Billy character opens up about what it was like to bea Japanese American person in the “60s in a small town in Idaho. Maggie follows up with something like, “Well, but itwas still a great place to grow up, right?” She’ trying to move the ‘ruth to the side, not in an act of malevolence, but just sort of ike, “Lean’t believe that about my lovey town.” ‘When thisis played out ona larger cal, we geta culture where people keep saying that the America of yesteryear was idyllic and wonderful. So I thought, okay, let me employ this dramatic struc- ‘ture from the frst half ofthe 20th century, sort ofa nostalgic struc ture in and of itself. But then toward the end, that structure itself intentionally starts co fall apart. ‘The great sin, the great crime, in the play isa completely human level of ambivalence. It's world so stretched toward extremes, where there’s so little comfort or luxury or Forgiveness, that even ordinary, inescapable human quali become possible sources of unspeakable tragedy. It's cruel, but tragedy is cruel because life iseruel. Yeah. With this ply [ust really allowed myself to go to that—this {s going to sound so pretentious—almost Greek place. The high tragedy place. But will say thatthe new play Tm working on now fees ikea spiritual response to Greate Clemens looking toward the future, looking past the tragedy; wondering what comes after that great flood. (Olivia), Andrew Garman (Wayne), and Kate MacCluggage (Mona). Greater Clements was developed atthe Ojal Playwrights Conference (Robert Egan, artiste ‘iector/oroducer and at the Lark Play Development Center, New York Cty. es regarding rights should be adresse to Derek Zasky c/o Wiliam Morris Endeavor Entertainment, 1 Madison Ave, 18th Floor, New York, NY 10010, (212) 903-1996, dzashy@wmeentertainment.com, warned that performances of Greater Clements are subject to a royalty. Its fully protected under the copyrig Greater Clements is copyright © 2020 by Samue! D, Hunter. ling fessional and amateurs are hereby of the United States of Amerie ‘and of all countries covered by the international Copyright union (Including the Dominion of Canada and theres of the British Commonwealth), and ofall ‘Countries covered bythe PanvAmerican Copyright Convention and the Universal Copyright Convention, and of al countries with which the United States has Feciprocal copyright relations. Alrights, including professional, amateur, motion picture, recitation, lecturing, public readin, radio broadcasting, television, video or sound taping al other forms of mechanical or electronic reproductions. such as information storage andretrieval systems and photocopying, and the rights of translation int foreign languages are strictly reserved, Particular emphasis aid upon the question of readings, permission for which must be secured from the author's agent in writing MavIsUNE20 AMERICAMTHEATRE os