PLATO GORGIAS and ARISTOTLE RHETORIC ‘Translation, Glossary, ind Introdu ay‘The Foes Philosophical Library 7 cokers Sevres gan str Vet A anna Conga ams Att and Ror ar ror ne Kh ‘ns eters Stn anette Spas Bm Klee Thin Spo Sar esac atraan aad Hong Fst “Soe aa Aline ou Tots» Di Joan ‘Same Tsetse Copyright 0200 y fous Covering by Wendy Biase ‘sp eas by For Ping / Rules Cony, AO Boe Recipe Li mar ra sn iy ents baton, peed ag dyn nan ce an, ci a fiepotake PAGSnphe Buon Canpy ne ete ule a yt ‘cl ae a oy amg aps of Pts Pablo Plo Company [ter medin cas eta epee me ours CONTENTS Introduction a 1 ‘The Gorgts of Plato nn = Fa Introductory conversation (7A SARC) 0 Socrates and Gorgias (48D 4618). ey Socrates and Poss 4618-805). os Callies interruption and speech (SIB-486D) on 68 Socrates and Callicles 486-34), 7 Socrates concluding speech (6254-5778), is ‘The Rheorc of Arstode. m1 (Chapter Summaries m1 Book. 38 (Rhetorical spect nature its kinds and the opinions tis based on) ook I. 189 (Design of speeches pasions and peedispenitions of audiences ond techniques of angen’) Book I. 287 CPrsetaton napkin wording el arg) Glossary. 285 Index - etINTRODUCTION Therein a wideyprend bl that he teachings of Pato and Aitotc on ‘mostifnotallsubjetsare opps. Aamoustnageal Oe cee ofa anes ‘aintng dpi te two phieophers ncngejes th stem expression The one points ups he ober peeade Ne Rind kava gta over the ‘ath The supposition hs ansthing writen bona hes ators ile ‘Spuing for an pinion atthe oppostis expe fran whatever the ter bes ‘Sidon the same subject an become principle of inerpretatin, ivarably ‘Snktnng the dgmeat epee nade avance athe Ietween Patric and Artotalan echngs. This approsch to lnteprtauen ty, of couse onthe farther presuppestion that ene comes oer stor Imedy endeanding the other Allin al isan ntspratve srtegy hat ‘never arrives anger except the spot on eich fo nterpetereleady ‘ing tag Raphael's highly pespectval png of cof Aes from th apex of an sels tae Just far enough aay ose Is sts ‘calle without being able to put tit ay ger ame Ths ook as been Bought int ing inthe constant nore can be eared from Pito an Arse when one wander of hat conventional senspont te es ut her poof iw “he wring ofthe two phosophers on Hhetori oe a seul eagle the way the tinking of Are lated fo tha of Pst. Th Cogs {Ea tama ack on mhetre, andthe Rito contains a eel define ot 2 The station smart tat vols psy, and re poet) pe tear, which Sorte tacks in Pat's Repu ad Astle defends tbe acts But the Raya is ne and compl, acd one must ome 1 ent withthe way the tes cf poctey ft inos whale eign. The Goes, hough. focused on sot us as much asf the work of Aol at Tra that name, athe pare works is cea a covert The uth ‘word ofthe Ron falwing hoe tha mean "Rhetoric "stake fom ‘he Gag and the mntenee ens with irc dena oF the corspandng Slaimmedethereby Socrates Asthe Gargusbegisby seting upaconortat 12. PLATO: GORGIAS 20 ARISTOTLE RFTORIC on of Cogacy Sxnes th Rr eins by sting up acorns Fike pp arette Bu some contortion equim and some a2 sar Wend tole ens i trcs fhe tewing tere ean “hvcrtard cay ot heen stachingan tthe deen When ‘fe [aug wl nd more cotiy then contention bet he Swoon The dco nb Go of wha s wrong wh ne ‘aye owing te quo of what mes righ an a se he ton Arse io up hr wy nt play, seo a itt woth of eros pio sop asin a ce athe omy kerterl Pat a Ares ‘eaybing eg an revert woul occrdejand tat en beyond ‘Becentyancounsy notch they woreda wo end the art ‘Berreede ands fat thee wok of wn etre te pcr ‘tatwarofen nd ohave eased Gre, Homer's though ent sou four coset the tine fat, an et og Seto ta Tron wait contaie sang cabo pesetan cf the pargpan whos toc ll oer the owe wed oh tal war Sate crac inthe oem ae not nodal tl fee bave os {ten the Grek sue rata hat econ predoanyo ‘onan Rid Homer tpi noducny “stg fp he ‘nde of Bok anne oan oro ies at cee cnt ie ocean cen spate one when sae eset an ‘pei sm in soe oup other A prot aa va en he {SeshadGreskemys hey Sotto ew corms re down. & Prominent snd power ware el an sent ht ade os ang “Svs wun fe srmy.One he ose ees on Olympus nals ‘ppealdt versa sinlardvison among tego. A coun hens «ale the Grek commander incl ted by ster se of thewha aay at ice tory and gh Int ce ta ere te esotreloer ere re Y Fuad ctor the oar ‘Snnundeso hold he en ge ten BY ese e e men, souinthinseenth atleingeneed spars stent Seed anh eranvat insoles who hacno erat sb atacking ie chraer tdmothescinecommande Thee doce tthe a where “Std of pots uot he fab hing ut ee ae than ont pan eve anno pep Homer Kgs en the seumentof hoe who nee mae ons urganeton pol "Theda prt uronic ts Grek ers forcntaee cone. a carver nthe Gangs gu tet (S80) {hat hving to ae ete the poem ris ute a wel os ‘Seimautmany ecelanssduplaped npabe ie whee st atpeaing isidsperatie Ant Aschyr + One th ony cps agi gy Shr ta ome down tou fom tse Gere apes te vrei ft ‘ney cya otpriate mrdesby the eaabtent oaccatolaw where {he opeeme power wil reve be Fessson preniod the gs Feith Eamets 85,97) Thay Hy oft epoca Ma, INTROOLCTION 3 ‘he recanted speeches play lage rein ating he reer dracon ‘ns about what happanod than do the ecnstuctone of events, Whether fled monarehically ligands demoxtaticly on some mised Som, very ty involved in the confltscbomntakingnd renee deen by Tieng to specie Tho eighth bool of Tyce work wan never ‘Sompetd nd reader whose expats he een fore byte pre ‘ous seven books may ind it unsatisfactory as sory, alo cvete But entainsno speeches, The common ie a the Grok, a wt sete ein thee prominent works of oy an pros tes octal paeto aking, thats organized, persue, and pbc ‘ul sthis predictor ging bearing spaces area pecans of partir plac sp me? The empha some wre lace on the at that dmocracy emorged in ancient Greece may tacure something deep, ‘more universal and more eralng Inthe writings Wepossss from arent {Gest i poset rth erergnce of pote ett The most Important distinction among human conwnunlues is nt ow nary thin tha ile but ove they rule" One pac tose something his sin he st work f what wecal history the sry onus Herat of Hala asus, Herodotus taveed neous enstor Gree, an ingue, anon ter tings ito the Persian warm. Twain thane wore that Grek began {o discower wat thy had in common inl hel inependent Si, when those ces were under common tit rm aust” Kern, the Pesan ‘emperor wholeads the langestinvasion of Grace, canta eave ay amok ‘pon accustomed to feedom coll and up toe ted feo hile, fghtngunder he compulsion he ash. (VT 109) Heccheesthorntmart tthe fet Pern ener Cyr eho sid hehad noes a ny men oho fawn inthe canes thi ite to el es (153), an ewe refering Eats tore market commerce and the commerce cf pital spec Bat eres opiniones to change when mv se nt force anon shine ofSparans inane passat Theropylo, are reais at ne has many entrar bu few anes (VT 20), oe David Gree tastes many men but few en. Wem dunk of edition ng ste human ster and humans whos cpacies have buen fered an et (work. And fhe capac tbecome aly nama semaine sles ong Shivesofa despot pecapsitstheavicinsiubans place anon Greeks Uhat mae rom fori to emerge. When Athena calishes he awe kt ‘he Ort her explicit purposes to veld Be despotic rslec mater ovet slaves (mendes 696) and replace wh the oot Perssion. Herds inqures ino how ana why the Creek schooled isthe ter sion elo tna drove gut amasively spor feof fighters who were not Te el know that i a Polley, Arno sid tet 9 aman being | 1 pital animal by nature (1253323), but whats lven by nate ean Be Ingle or Uivarte and may sotemerge itis not cuenta Thssoctl Hives ftes and herding nals are present by mere nature ist goes ‘inthe same osoge beste they commonicte abot ht ipsa ana ‘Painful But her communication not speech anaeisupen speech tht he4__ PLATO. GORGIAS 040 ARISTOTLE: RHETORIC lime politica fe depends The power of spec he sys, what eval thatsomethngsthatar pean ut mans some a tana eae ety prema oe aang ovay notre ‘sims tht i shaved perception of the oo the evant oe Int constant «cy that sata mere hive a edu oes ‘poi ie, The is rpesetn inthe al ee King they feces by Arto et cn ese the sbycte el by ose rising to specs ht ert hc oh common ie ‘seams The vading hordes led y the Great Ringe Feb apo y ‘ontast to have bon fred it sabhuman ives, ‘he making and earn of pct eo nly prominent ae tates place an tinea whch Put at Ase we Wt seein warty of tenon ss coniun fetes of mee nature, Sue ohh People ayorere at ty time cultivate one the highest pes ies oa ‘tice, Bat we muy se thsve award the wrong qeaston, We eed ‘shy plop atenion was mest hy rhc. With te necesien of 1s withrtramatal gods any Kin thes wey prong etsy bea division of abu. Afar, epee weave nay reine bot recs with beter eceney by conctnng al hs ine a eon ene {8 things pope anepar thers hom pyiganyaenton at ll. But Sow goods that ait in att cant be fared eu Yo otbecme iby paying somenne todo your unig or walking A what Should wemmakeof te tllsng acs? vhave knows wo peopl we bay hep doing someone i's eading one who preps Tea board for 4 gee wth summa of etic al epost ne wh wet Sue aries an evans ors profesor of plorophyo boks fet tune ‘he was then wring Tou the former fac suprsing bot andes a the late merely depressing now peopl hn ad more satel 2 ‘eigen do be wd er want any tem ode reading fr oe Iie ring them speak about hn hey hve es iy when have red them oo The sass esi pope wie er than the et fat ple speckng ba itt aig te as = psily or even a prfesion, ay we net be netomat at ‘ight toe prtsionaized? Andwhatcnety lca sah opeclee rots toe sled dong? Shu we rep strat soncbang al ‘Snlsbtes to poltc eo ens fo undereane i? “Asm analogy any shed sight on what may be wong with mle ‘ue profenraom, Weal kw datas tahoe eter what ey so than otersore. But what aes th tr? Do hey haves hangs Some thik they dandy may evencain ave coesparice Npelagegy engage in tah sn decades and opinions weremand Sooo ee allorbadyididati.butt wasalwoys mde unesy when ether can ave any special podapopel inning, Temhng as date fron teeay croc havalvays seemed tone ote anattal output torin Tate cue fo ta ter, nd the non fe yt ane undermine very sources Leg depend ders eletaa iee INTRODUCTION § ‘sho kom earning fom the ine, an have kept italiv in hemseves ean ‘recognize its begining in oer nll the ulead shapes a {0 nite encourage, and asst thom. Pedagogies slay sey ‘tanipulitive tome os though the are were sone etal materi foc teacher to ald, but avons who has espeience it knoe ot nto se ‘efolow tsowncourseand cannot bemtanipulted. Leamingeante essed, ‘rst or inspizd, ut suc ators ore size ds ot tal Soe ‘ery word “pdagogy” puts mean alert for meting thot urtbiy toe ‘ha tcl tobe. Nw ft happens tht tis analogy sn onlpacteone -mesbutlaken oma mae complex ealony Socrates takes inthe Cagin,F ancient Grete, thos who datmed ne specials ot n soe eae at btn teaching sel weve alle soph andthe gave even wisdom bad name. Socrates sysin48C tat speslaton i toc se rh ie Sophistry tha the who paced them co make no ler dino of ‘hemelie from each oer. Hut thee eptatons were adler could ‘be sopiss were loka down on by popu apinion, out theorist ed a ersin ghimou “Thissiustio in which anes raw stong public ceacons,buthe kings ‘named are not ly understood, doef worthy finest, Ae ‘en oe f those vaguely neertood asi ins fo be ie mina ower publi lif,» thoughalserany of whit ti and dows gh be ‘ery maxed, Pat designs the Gorgas dips here sack that cannot he undeestood par fam an ng it the nan god end ‘5 en cet of choice that canbe no less han mato Lies eat hn the dlalogue Seats cones, ome afer another, hive men whos tv fr sored in shor putty and demands tha they atc at {hey do and why. Goris am old sha an ntenatlonl eb completers teach people howto dinate cites with teers Pus isa younger follower of Cori chesloder for etre df ‘rannial approach oie. Calc x younge sil on the verge making ie choies, and sald onthe pst that eto les eis he pce, {nc of Calicles tat ngs out tno ultimate seriousness the comer, “This is ply because he doesnot shy away rex bg Ne epi Into the open, Dut evermore the ce Bese o wha fe New the fips in ao’ slogucs re people who were Lagwntohave ved ‘rvs Athens during the of oct Ina hana o ag ete fare invented chatacters sch asthe unnamed plospr from Bes > lakes the ea! inthe discussions in the Span Sts. But Cle resend inthe Garis with weath of Gta about sends ad he poe ‘tte elves inane yethesantely unknown fo ay othe cou Te list exploration farts anomaly seems tome tote thet ewes someone sown to Pat who emared pia! ie in Athen with eect those bra Aims he announces in the diniogu and Du he ino ve king eng > ‘complch anya thy "ts inerpretation of ales! foe coset, then Pls contemporary| reer would have been are of background othe loge that would6_ PLATO: CORGIAS i= ARISTOTLE: RHETORIC ange ite one of sciousness. The fet would be comparable othe a Shae Famingofthe Tasers ae conversation eure wile Tees sas dying. Bat he fc of Calis’ eal and hopes denth would rebect Tn nis conencein he power of rhetone tout providing conan fon ofanythingforvich Socrates cities it Pot an Calils do msn ‘mend motor as an at of slr resration (47, SUA SAC} out Sorat ‘deen gre with hat nse what he args that te ey 9 Sived matters more ta how tong it lasts The expt cto Seas ‘makes of hone tat andor to the eon and pearappones a the {nga thet eater moat in Wee the god the cowl approves of and cn provide. Buying info shtoicacoringa Socrates ulitely res Py {ntoaconepion oa tyrannical ear the highest whic amar begat ‘Spire. Gorgas and Plus ze content to stand on he iene of pall 0 ‘Soh and spp thee who adopt ann pols, boas ely ‘Sets shou purauingsuch Me Aa i Caliles ia figure brought belre ‘sto dplay the potently fatal consequences ofa comitinen to certain Sind oft his steeme havo paired witha Sacratn, howe manne of dying was, ard swell own to very reader of thoclslogue, arent aa ‘modem. Pai shows Socrates to in the Aly, retin o play he (wd theta fr hs inh Ci retin eeape om prison whe his fiends ha ital arranged, ain the Paso aceping his death witoat ‘plat afr spendinghes lst day in piknapaccaneration. The Grp ‘rings together two men who aprarenly ded the way they cose ove Bt thecal confronts and pring heck wf Socrates with Conga and ths astapontion hal Bring fo sight a deper evel of Socrter position f9 rete, The neal sins of he dag my Bo Sudtorevave around the singular and plural forms oasingle Word. Corgas rmounces that what he has «krewodge of anda power over ae spe, [igs (U9), na soe therentier (530) erate begin to pound vy = the sngulr ofthat word ashe sas oer and over gain Bat what he wants {oidoand they need tn he ao wher tea. nis tal Hon ot words warsated spec even whan “arguinet” cr some one choice might ithecontest more smoothly Insconvesaton wih Corgis, ‘Socrates doce everything he can ole rcogae fat we have # Se between inking ofspeeeh sa instrument ofenercon that weconto ora powerofthe revelation meaning Wat we can flow. The cr plied Dy tus lerative may appear undated to the charge of pandering but he ‘okavemachin commen, The speaks who ply tothe ced aces tait ‘opinions and prceence se governing Ne neracton with them, and ha 0 ‘tilt himself ths audience by ving atest the appearance of sharing, them. The speaker wo bekeves moe! be superior decowd, ad ‘bomaniulating them by manipubting words has made the sssumption ha he wn opiions need fn explorations evs, In ether aide the ‘eto open to dlcovernganjthing abou the things e peaks about Inneithe way of using sponte speech regarded 3s he medium through iwTRopuCTON 7 vehich understanding coment bing, Sora’ deepest cram feta Feta tis perversion oa eatin tothe power of specs But we noted earth argument in Art's als nthe estat te burn power of spech is what takes our ces move dan hes ot Ives At lett polontaly, our pla! fee an oppor for 3 cannon tncerstanding othe good the advantageous, and te ist w be shiva ‘What Anstote says th politcal feof erry n fc resto Sa common perepton lens) ofthe gs Dotould ctor play aren allowing community toadvanceinits common uncestarng ofthe percelved goals tltscanmom ie? Aga Sost nas ashtinthemeaitgora word tat ‘ays mote chou the posable wsesf heturicthan do Ns expla ergumens. spicy indica ei Pols ads teconetosion hat Ser ile ternowwe or strc among decent people who are notte glam ith $Snything dishonest (1B) bute waphe go aboutcecareng howe ‘te, Fem the very beginning ofthe dialog the word everytne acs ‘what Gorgas dos pena Remakes spay, But when Socrates is ron taking foe whe with Pla eho temp toric im ae el Mi {hata ane agrcs wii, Socrates aks himtostop doing thos ings art Instat inlay tim that he wrong BIC). Pr unable bg, sd the word drops out ofthe dag, ever to be use agai. But witha thre ofthe mene argues with, Socrates contin displaying viene {Roe het own wands at mages heya wrong Iie common remsck, ‘fears hatin the Gorgon SoratesNimelf Domes a orca, Bocas Ieewetlly rope isu questonand-anewersyi and make lng ard ‘xnatinesenpeaoned specs, Bathe never dopa ie characte way ‘fparsing the implications ofthe poope'sttomnts. Ones flloe he igo noon forthe sake of one's wh undersianding bata dspay conte tn ofhought that antes person igh bec to recog, an one ‘om put thee cn display oe any audience ht might be present. TE vould seem wo be sel fo cal Socrates exploration ofthe implce- tions of te words of others torial, bat thee em noth sy [nl ovetiap Bees de two uses of speech to allow a reader to messi ‘eto practices by compison with Scrat ons. But Soca: Rima ‘aw the ponsbliy a shotore that would be he eterno oppo ofthe Drsvalent oe, and that formfthecertanly does practice The word buses fer panderng tlt, serile Hater wey spre ln as et ‘cotati advantageous thine out feds who have what he Waals Ieopponte wold be authotatee uke, en by xeeneane whe wants prove somthing advantagmns fo anor peso. Ties tthe sot {hing Socrates usualy does othe dese Pav andCalicles The wor ‘Srdicplns, lorconectve rtrainter punsiunent sus an oom ait ‘read egoenily when Sogates speaks tan aboot those women. And Sith thst, Socrates at ses anon heal protstation tht be ows noting and makes emphatic pronouncements that he knews Deter {han they do what ood for them He adopts a frm of tore wear all {aula wih ned by parents and judges whan teyingo persuade chien_PLATO:GORGIAS i ARISTOTLE RHETORIC x criminals tat ie punshnent efor her nr good. It ight be called oli helo Ue prevalent, pandering or koa rhetoric meant 0 [ecoductive or wiooding te Kolitc arty sisted cea splash of cold teeerinth ace I would ser atts Uys ited but Socrates ert {hthe standard for jucging pola lnders. Ina passage hepnsing WSC, ‘Shcrniesangus ta thc hasbeen no empl, not ven Penile ofan Ate ‘Ran pelican who ued actor to make the cian beter. Calis takes ‘his amoet a fighting word SIS). and sce soerates early intends to provoke such areatton, this el an tance of olastic hen "Now Sous facing the ba for poicaltelovi vry high. He is domancing not only hat aot nat pander tothe crows Duthat he gO!0 Ueoppesitetermetadiciplinee Ande judges tnepolisciansat the past rot by any worth pots the ny have purse, mat sll by whether they kth ft cons beter hamaebengs than the fourths. ven tthe standard eis would nathave ben ges acopee falar ‘Clery. Thacpes aim apaealeadesvho desta the male ‘Songs be wasalie and cou peak to ther in ways tha did no please ‘hem Lut nade tem angey Uvoypoesan Wer I 8) Bat Thucyid ao ‘resents fanerl ration wich Pees eas whatoconsidered good [tzeruiptooe, Het the Athenians hat then no share a Being Foor ‘Sblong acne sing to gee. ond urges thet exp the eyeson tele Gip'spower and develop aust frit (40,48) He encourages the to ake {Unt rgh the impera supremacy tat lle est ey the goo thing tha owe itn ther ty fom allover he woe (38) Thucydides ‘doesnot content secon the asumptns undetying Peis’ these, tthe placental following the Funeral opeech an account of lagoe that Athens sufered fo month lesan pide hat ws deadly toFast, shuntersand devastating welt thechaaces fhe people who strived Sn Thucydides pins oot that he plague Nowed north frm upper Egypt dno Athens thru pe (8) Scr syst Perle oped the temperance and jsie of he tne ane fled thei ap with arbors Ielshpyants ond walle and tut and maneense ike th” GI9A) Vis ‘Sreanetr woud have given the peopl ter defense against misfortune ‘hanalthenoney and power inthe wot andi soli dat Thcydides ‘mould have ngseed with Sozte abo tat. Sut Thuyeies compares Porcles tthe eho cme eR, and gives Aim cet fora odeating Unflaence they lace ht Sure ais hat he hima the only man of hs ime to have ‘crt len poll 3211). So Row well docs a aby is wen STaidards? Heike Prices, clorly willing at des to tell an Athenian diene things t doesnot want to heb, and in Rs cae ne cn pont 2 people whoblieehehacade oe lvesbeter_Atthebeginnng of Plt's fost foreample certain Apolldors gives Sones ret orang ‘tantormed hii forthe ste, hough tthe nf the same dialogue faves glanpu ofthe undicpine ela by Albades, whose diststous thfst om Athers wax late by many om Sota ature transform hi. INTRODUCTION 9 tat amore intresting instance ght be Psa who ted a alent for writ Ing toward pimps en are of hear Soaes peak oer. Sterne spoken pubic bu is specch was diesied slon shay ard tne person sts tine. tishard enough ol wat stings he don | Snyons we ee encountering hit ina dalogae and impose tokraw what ‘Newordsmighthave inne sof any alent steer Butwe do have ‘sucsesion of people to when he spi abt rhetoric a he Gog, na ‘mtn nasnposibe not nkofis words a having hetora ‘Sect and wecan see omehingef what he isdoingty comparinate ways ‘peat totem, Tere sno esion tot Socrates hand tee men ‘ey ferent ands clea that ve re awe ha hey aen pubic [Int that he toner wl Be cing thm by he way hey and po ‘Fatlonge Hah the retest a pbc advocate of some Kin Cre {pis alan course of acon as advantageous Pos pring ah act {the most Geta ot hunan prety, ad Calc ering Sates of ‘prendngopincen that pervert jnice anda heeenduphuvingodeend Totmetts Wechallse when we dco Arid’ Mitr hate Corgis fre splay ofthe Ue main objets Metre eke t0 De pesiave out hose tare uray considered n pbc verbs, on ceremonial tecason andincourtecrs nthe dlog ee oro suchormalerasien thateall for speskere to defen or atck any opti. Wherever Socrates foes, convertion breaks ot sme se wah inking bout brug Eofocn andthe who arelnersot gather sen. “To conversaton Serotes engage se slray aera in thesnse {hatha flo op tho preneppotans and consent oe pean ted opis rd sways phosphate expo te eed For pions tobe grounded in lite convictions an for sto tbe ged leat cos about ich al hua beings need Yo nguie,ane i ‘Soveratons inthe Cogsare no exceptions And a hore component ‘enever stent rom Sncses conversations, at satin he sense tht he sus {heleveoldheducusson te alts of tether peor in the Tact, ferinstance Thee taken ugh nite rents wie Theodora Jnengage ons snare chat stvetimes even gosipy, ve. The way Sorat titsnthe Conus dsncve ontyn hat tesa conversations take pice ‘Ste by sige wile questions about thet are ety in fat of verve tehospesks and tine. And Socrates often ngage ni tery hog. Iotofascrvckindsndsoteranyadvatagetohinselfout time other sof vanity fo sein pesuacing him fo psi an argument he dos {isa Cons n 9D, wih Pols ina73A and wih Calle 5878.8 1s good wc frets ison cpa in the Corps ts roti ter han ‘Suter usualmodeof convention andit ies betwen dhetwo extemesve avec klaicand kot Iether wheels or bots. Sorates ‘andra soscone rward witout pandering hey and pl creane back srt rebakang Mh power ofboth action an compulsion, st Sneak tps inthis soc nthe go "10 _TLATO.GORGIAS 1» ARISTOTLE: RHETORIC ‘Wena earth ho door sen Scarabs ofthe retro ongas lout pevetstureaton oie powero ech tis erst femisenac tha we wouter paca Sats tSowagien otto, Cagis ke of pees sec cote Solo rote by whi he sabe ta popicisclve 2) iNedoratheve trey ont arc of Pats poral ok as We paste spas of Cong neo racy Een a, Spel ney abut curt ns preps aad inthe dog 3 songs say tt perce pela mols pecs io Sepone of trininsedpevesnrsolthosulebir se Srey wesw som ‘Fpetely geste seats long telomere trovetorvardinanay tut woulimake wistererabeig ten ofeient Iusssmuho pomle” (9) Eres Congas ens he of the ot seat hd PolucerCalleiconis wants oscewher thespeech at hasemerged ‘od e304 407 Sag). Tete hts peer re ene Tidus uan langage veer pe ough tne gel {Sans Mice conse he neg may of gs that or {Sr whic on becnne man cde hy are lc eaten sd Tothen Sorter sss stimstch ae" eo” he song fords but hiner ona word onan emo fs ‘Neng ste thng sumed hte mae fone. Any axon tithe dass lorie a ofr the prance “trsaton more tanh sae why nae The foal dtronse ‘eat Soares ain nape ats pero eign ‘PNiulatn ofa pert of plies a ountpr fr solo cong ty Teo soon anne wanting pmsca tat aves beyond em Sinskesneting eniey dies ves tari whet Sees il warmly to ke a opinion sed by onather pessoa om and ny evden for whtoonetig nan {Shel would level inchuman tron ato wach began Uehara rom toe hsconparrs at Sac ees trod hts van eras ng’ went four hour a tine 30, 2H Dyand we awe abt pimpin the Pte (9240) of Sots {shears tough asvetenope pondieaoropily at oung man ‘tern mathatccornt ow his. bl become nove trencheinPacsdloguesshows Sccststsainays ang sore Inpbriclrandalvays tying oleae prsndchin. Serene {eibelngedcerened tale ngorit tne wo may be aed ot “Sling to gu abn The cameo tht estace are varanand they cn ‘veut weg theta fect tricia and overeat {het etre wt ws ae ys ‘ete pre ny sow beakapesdo te quetlnot wheter mae Syne beg tne abou anyng Be does nat we which ayn tarnreqe making im eth ere omen porn he oat Knows nthe ne eb), Sarat Scares cervion he woul gt ‘eeu anyon to mokes ny sp ante disney yt ery IvTRODUCTION 11 facta beter person. The sim of Scrat in the agus it never to teach “Smetngiy ming verter for bling bts some rica porn td ding tari Sorte abt ste ing {Po the llnge Sorte makes lo Pols 67C) yet ot pul Shee ne ht Fn rong” ‘Now the arguments Socrates make ate lays eres in ways that tanacond th mma oesons pay Beebe we = cing Sulves tn wee argues with or af east ela reson fet Oh stat he seayng, an pany bce we want orto nd do Tatknow how todo so A mixtre of contaditory motvstn hese mates TPnot cero And at tines neo re arguments ay beset try deca rom tear Some he sensi the Cre {heed that nether poser sor pleasure spond inl haves unveil se rigor tat canot be dnd. But the presappoton of ouch agumens ‘tealwaysopento challenge, snd Soerater inne way or aotheralayesecs te provaue te challge Teer vay an empl tas des ae Fivasuppetingargumert witha blows premise er 8 contain stein tren or ver tag foe, The ect of he Corgis bulk on ‘Ste fi oormpe bg i Corgan tan Ps, toy tsa wha ‘ero wih argent senshi Ally ucoed npr hal ‘reponse from Calce, Scrat gol abe his arguments corse Sreven perunsve bl tombe es inponeoignoe end tees way {Sosa stoma than hit coe hone. “The arte spe tr: ht Cong cemphaieris he matey itgivestin over pe aove ppl, What Sots dos within at hi. gent but iy ie «poston i whch he ean al os is Sentencing wc htc erin wy he at ‘otencouneed fr many eas qbstion ich Re ad os handled before (Gtoh), Gongs eemenctr to hve acre he babi pling favs nan gent andcutracinga counteragument. Atay ae nthesech of late fom 4609 $618, Corgan’ contributions become hear, et, ‘itn and fay uns” Fob sep dnend Corp ut ht ‘specter eas exphaszs rom th ft ax been hati he os tstiulothoman series 45) a thoes Sse agumera ats ‘ith thischangeof pater dics Soca’ elaborate preston ‘fe aay oars an couterfrthatinsero anlar tebe Spd hau sin alee Ramet same sing ay. ‘hone who pol theres eth a ney dit am nc nese ‘igus coon a tpay he son of bent eyo sot poses (485, andshetonc defined ys place in an aralagy betwen Body ae Sout. espnte thatthe reputation of revo matches alo {pra}, an Scrat eget with um en foc on get a. {S'cknonedge tha the acts of tyra are uly thingy. Po aaa nt the ogo pure of whatcan happen osenene whoa fn an fas 0730, an spt seme to ay with um ee Forershbreperme herb unhenaingl rep al dong jie, wie12_ PLATO. GORGIAS 50 ARISTOTLE: RHETORIC ‘eter than fering an ur hing (47C)- One of Sorat ag ‘nents tothe eft lhe sme seus must eng oth fenton fn the sutermgot ny action (768-0) may nothave versal validity, But Folurs own gape description of tories tat area oslo sums to taint his ear pe of rhetorciane for ving the eral power ol [donb whomever they please The sve stake ent a mater of gia inconssteney oto whether Poison eeton rally wants he ngs Hat Iaveso far semis! foo tes (4600-F). He has wanted to have the power fa tyrant ina sensed and vied for, an Sora gives him a chance {ose hat move deal itis Callies wn akesthe strongest and mot stand counteratack ‘on behalf eto and the ape of tat he sighs out et fal it ‘manliness. He spesia the ist words of the inoue and they are playful ‘ccuation that orton cowarc. By the nee makes Rs long space inthe mica of ie dag hehas stopped paying and his cceaton tak Socrates unmanly exp (45D) Netural usc he argues, deans That the manlestmenshou rae (18) forthe sake of othing hot thelr ow Uncestuned erupt of peste (9LE 492A) Hes content that hea lfeall gd ast but hie tone ops to change When Sorte’ argues average an lock he question of whstheries the maa othe coward) ten an blll eho are more deve fo pleasures replys made ‘ntemptuoealy 998) but hat cnt deg he at tht ho as en ip {pound he het of his defenses Onoe Socrates has eomspaed toc smming or piloting ship, menial kl for avg ves without earl {he words or wortessess of those ves, he confess ina vonerng sone tobeing partly persiaded (13C), The crac moment for Callies tms"0 Ino fore when Secs sks him once again if he iss ecommending {hecenle pandering thatthe rhetoric eadvoctingrequls Inabustot angry honesty, Calc ony nec, [don eared youeaD ty the unmae Test of nam Il ee no ofher mane fo survive in a urbulet pla ‘twionment (DIB). In the retrcl contest over theo he sas Rave Hpped stat moment snd the dispute ou as dravn even. By acepting Aan Mista the name of rae conde tot the east manly the ‘wor Calls snot nly abandoned the ai of manliness on which all, ‘isargoments were se, hehar alo sid the mate's oo portant 0 be trested hetoricly_Alg heway. Calis has been shown tat pesres [Mealinays meusued by se standard ther than please an tend ‘the line he inserting that etre bejaged by speach that ak ‘tora. Callatby any name you plese, he says, colo ts 3 appeal todisiproval but tell me how ese ven Aes [Now at sucha moment ane might expect Socrates to deliver a knockout ‘punch of some sort but ha would be appropriate ony he werecompein ‘hat hisownlife by nomeanssecarein Athens by atic and ten ela mye about analterie. An experince reader (OF Pato might conclude tht everything cats hae ets om 9 th INTRODUCTION 19 saperatual evant, A mone 0 reader wil atc that Sots feller such mys, and Bat they all fern wha hey describe Ia the Pde (616) he sas he 0 eller of ts (magia, kat he elisa ‘daborate one of his owe sevention ltr in the dale, before condading, That one with ny sense woul is hinge sere really ht way (14D) Inthe Phatnathestyaetelove al ecomaonly cepted sys eat {tis ot woth his tne to quarrel eh them, since he ony thing he ely ‘rant tundentand what Kind of being he Mw s 2396-2308 ter ‘Ratdslogwe Phacdrs tel im he makes upmythical stores a the drop of stand protnathey ae things ho sear (2758). Sorter my eloges ‘th he pest tour magia making toltiate desta ofthe uman Soulthesubjectofanassortmonto dispose and epacablerarratves. We {take them oleae them orld dani the ragunaton thing Hat re other tue nor alse. Tein amayth eanbea way of making inves ‘be hat isenssonadan eflercontnnation of someningene haa “een inthe understand rican note anf tuna asa way of geting the pent And paradoxical, even whe sot taken a teal {Guth amhcen npr ation Forth esa Jacob Kin Comncary bm P's Mens (Unversty of Noe Carolina Pres 195,17, Raster ‘hat "Mheng Send the paradigm of al sete “Them Scrtstelin the Gopi elie ayo is ober pictures of naff an almost certainly une sty myth any ohar human beng hae ‘ter enceved provers the place of the lst judge of oul as a RYDE Sum, Twas he custom of le Greeks to exercise naked, and the slog 0 ‘convertion at hast une nthe Gurr orden eno Is ‘rphusized thoughout th dscsion with Callies hat opinions resin ‘Sn with al. the conventional ieee shame an plitenes pot ‘ay (7H, 4920) and that he poopie wo arestating em ae themselves boigoxpecd ojudgnent GID S120), Tothelisteersuouing Socrates hd Casey and the racers of the dsloge,ehomy this ike am epg that unversalizes what the preceding conversation ht put cis, aed {eso not tepnting for as bt by ose up ina strc age Buriwehaye alll benlooking at Socatetore as smelhing desired for and adosed to, te one pion Socrates speaking oan or hat ‘pespetveitappese tobe the wort het taceanyone would ever nk [Sf ctosing forCalles In 4934-494, Socata asalrdy toed out aie ‘mytveingon Calis dat met wits nlhngbut dod, and Sosate sys {Ube hs longa nyt that he expt alist dismiss te Sort hing od women say (027A). Ita hor decared at tesco the highest pase he knows how to give manliness, why would somecne ‘holly hesomernetoral aos ads fim he way and woman ‘wold? The aner tema to me fo Be found nario sgeson mae by late colegue of mine, Hugh McGrath. The ral cispay that Socrates leners Calico the pene of Sorts hums ab aman eave cough {ost in publicand endorse the sorte things hat ol women ell Shon Callies handy boo tang by the arnt tt is naa oeM_ PLATO. GONGIAS sp ARISTOTLE: RHFTORIC savinghisowa skin avealleseis unmanly. He nov: asthe opportunity 0 {Sevan nage ofa manliness he novr apied Theses cannot ao ‘elect omtsmage of himall and a cou ao some racial ring {ths fst options Ther con never be an assurance that anyone ed to ‘hebrinkof such questioning wil urdrabe and te cave f Callies we haveseen earns ta suspect hthonever di butfaiueat atsageconnot tetlamed on anyone ut himelt Soot Petorc has done eveyihing that ‘tbe dane oth eed i that ection "the Conga, he, cuainsanatackenonesertof hor nocd ion of another sot anda ply of yt ic atacke te prostitution of speech opander oacrow or lerioe motives of he speak recomend the cure se of epee tv impose dlpline ona person oe 2, and {Boplaye the use of spe alone othe predation ofa singl hear fo ive and prove tha ers f allow the ogo om aso What We Ihave nt yet dened ere the gus of wea common tothe thee tvs at makes or ogee them all as varetesof one specs that we fave uneremonusy ban caingrhetori The dialogue sears to met Sis wth sens sees th uson nb ental ation een Speeches sn specch all. Teta seem at att seppoet Sora clams ‘Bataleon enero ae suggest hat Ws because isnot { disinerented purl of understanding, Tis might in rm sogget tht ‘Reto the stakang of spesches devo fal atonal content Te uly Sok that way when one Gras’ ality to offer even he shes ftgumes!nfvor he cams e acer And Pokus ges us no grounds {Dbundan tht yew ashe attempts to upport hs las by invoking the ‘weight of popstar opinion canning up the lage of pin sed Gesth and ‘ibpingriitleon anyone who agro ith um tir tat Socrates pants [Su at 47IE 79D, and A73E. Gorgias and Plus Rave thee conelusions and Seem to expect abe able to persuade people of them by mens der han [rgumen orgs in fst aks this view ef chetri tobe a compliment to FRE sul ites es lot eae fone can period people By means of immnics witout having take the bleto lear or understand anny (Ebsch Now the elation of alana content fom a spec would be Epon Cangas speaks tlie sertene, and ewes the patie {he way a is comerporaie do to assert ha oe sanance a use ive rato fr what sid inthe preceding one. But his easing hore apparent than rel on il persuasive, Hs own power must supe {Hat eich the cramon hua lot (456A). Gorgias ony wing but pro open that extreme 3! wach pecs are comply divarcod {rom te extra power of spe et Calli ang spon st HOC 480, witht sina between anguments {oom nate sd angueents fen conventin, presets an underiaaing of things thal sso go beyond anything ound isthe speeches Gorge and Ptemak, boo diterencemay again be more apparent thn eal Tosap~ ‘orthisovnclans abot natural ate, Calls des o% use argues i bathetrcal examples U0D-E} evading ond quotations om Pindar INTRODUCTION _15, and urpides (48482). Ness and Dari and Herc ook whatever they ‘waned nd hat made righ or thom to have esaye. But the xsrplos ‘Stbave no eft ules the udicns fair with fea an hone PO ‘aus for even a memento aclt ther wl nt fst Xernes and Dara, ‘edn sscoedin geting what they wanted in th intanees Calis ca, land Tleaces did not waht what e gt But ha t et fo someone ese Zeta achaacer a ply by Easpies wha che the may Ue acon INebrotherArmphion feted ended sp ncedinghistrother’elp old ok tothe things hey came aootin comma. Tissier sof eal tact show someting eel dren som what hes amy ms mes thal Callies snot conser worth is wl ohn hough ay saan feehisconclaions Between his historical and poetic examples he pte a Image of yong lon that rs al eta lw and one, to ‘ake his conception of tra pice" rth ith nied that feeds no argument to justly But again is ttre may show aething hed notin Any of his contemporaries presented wih an nage of ‘varauing on, woul belly to Bank of a femur sme of a hat {appears tice th ig (XL, 547-356; XVIL 57-460). Homer's an power feline au sn dese but 9 math fre weer doe and ‘county fk who cannot ll but can protec thecal es all ih Egos away at dann having accomplished! no sng thing at idole, witha hear id wits nothing but reget. The sew on thoes Snderstand wy itn mot fora engl any fe deste may [he ead be pil sage of Cael’ om ie The roa of hi hetose i ferctas, bana one wil ever use Rm as anes of man who a" What he wanted and poi “Tere sees tobe no denying that nthe Goris i Sacrat ehetose alone tat is pote, or hati ass ffecoenes fam combining rather Chan separating the tonal and manson lement im speech Scrtos ‘himeto want tnpersiae tosh whom hespeaksthatsbetec tose lejusie tan 9 do ha happiness pase ony in an ore ie and ever in hee of ant and Ut pla fe oot Mori ees [rounded in philsonhy. o doce not persuade any of them of ano these things bute dos show he tat they ont kno ho show tat heme “opinons are wrong (504, 527A}, Ive get absorbed the datogue, Pte tay be abi to show un the same thing The purpose ofthe dio inet to drivehome any ofthe pots Soca asses but shaw Socrates to ws ithe shows things tocthe, The arent ae te nto Eh toric of ot Socrates and Plat, and tose arguments Willsucced at Ut sherk tenk ony if they arent od enough o demonstrate ter conclusions But ‘oo gond be darian Tei complete eure aco would mea hat ‘cmene tured othe peut of posh, bt they are etl sscssfal llth dois mae people « idemore moderate and tog a ie ss ‘ure of what they thought they knew anda te ore inclined 4 eet on Uheends they areseking. Thucydides bu tol Peis was ale a exert 2 moderating influence onthe Atbnian people as lang ashe was ale, Bat16 _PLATO-GORGIAS 20 ARISTOTLE: RHETORIC Att he had no ating ict om hem. Soca rhetoric ata dering Invent ts one that akesrootin the peope around him a grows ony in Hisabence And sine Pato pacts theme storia rein he sae ‘fal toate ngs for anne eat Sate uencohae mana Some fits pow hog th centres ter i me ado "The Sorte rete oe wits nthe Cag io a very speci kind and alms ae forte lng term. Pato practice i and some teachers may oo but docs its xp gt us anywhere in tinkng about Ue ordinary tesefthaone that happenalthetine? Wenoted earl hat rst den fsthe kinds of ples where reson is pally esa ses eto, public assembles and ceremonial gathering Kathe fst, deons need {Obemade an he spot andi the Bed, must audiences want he speaker © {othe workand fishiton the rpot Having ven ec large or small, fn the mies othe audience nat the pina an, which simp 16 ‘ermaepoopetoadoptone opninsnpreeencey ashe rong {beaneude te buses ot han nthe ay dhe speaker thinks es Ha he ‘way Sneaticrhetonedoce te by mating agement primary, ad wing ther to sow someting o others, an ties possble tall the customary places Metorc Is used. And acorn Arse the is caper of ‘het thiis he oe at oly thing hat nine tote taal art ‘he Sat words of Wat work, Aristo cars tat Feo sa connepart ‘of date thi isa pointed replacement of Sorrtesuertion tht there ‘the counterpart of the seta cookng tat pancers io cls bil tastes. Bt that i= one hat Scr Reel hes nly made inthe Cog by ‘Sowing urachatoricwthan anit dneee Aristo beptshis tone notby rejecting the Gorgias Buty kup where eaves [Anse does ake anadversaty postion the fit ape fhe tori, ‘bu hisopponent snot Plato or Scrat bathe whale ary of eae books ‘nto tan the Gorge. There wer apparnty many michBook for ‘which Artoteune the genre Af Ses ech eo). Soa Uses the sare race in Pat's Phd ad mabes fn of hee hooks ane Uh suthore (24D, 2613, 262478}, eho incade Gorgas, Plus ant the Tvnaymachua who appears inthe Republi, Scttessayein the Paes thata speech neste haves oy, kes ving hing and Aedes inthe es chapters Retr tat the body of persuasion nde up of ‘guinens, His cmplant aout the ear treatises tht they provide no pot of the at orc bt oly i eco, Ho sandy mates of rousing prsudice scl pasion Areal discs sch mates ines [Eng te Rss as fats tate be way ape an speaker ‘erecato,butallas means tothe end which goversel persuasive peak {ng the hong of something facta orc tata work elie ((Sbia apa 1860, Like Soca nthe Corgis, Ast conser the ‘heton orgie and Pos pacts tel each ob nna stall Like Sorates {nehe Gora, arto says haa Petron crm acueve is ed sll ty manipalting elings, Dut needs to show eidence ora concise, IwTRopUCTION _17 ‘The word Arise chaes forthe showing that she one ental tas of shoo ido rma ota range ta is between fo eaters fe ‘piers charac of Gorpat a shovines that makes an npty dep ay, hd the gms duraters of mathematics, rasa ht demons Something rigorously and conclusively. Reon hs ational content ut famnot Rave prof, and this according to Aristo hat die ty ‘Snalogy to an contrat eth siete The non of dates pei {ibe Gorgas when Soca cortranstetrewth having 9 conerston (iaegeta toi oat what something (88). In the Pac, Socrates esc netersiono! that canvematonlprosessnto ato finding the "natural estinetons among thing, the way 2 goa butcher carves «body at ‘Remus joins and Ressys that a Snel prepsaton oat sot wots Ie needed lo make rhetori an at (ED-2560) Artal devotes the ork «ale he Tyson, which takes toe set andl genous rasan ‘hatin demonstration bea os ot proceed om afew tr Ingppoins. Itrewors from opinions tat are accept by many people orb ‘rine thinker der tes them, anit maken sere poe tat owed ltr byroecting tse pinion aigha procs of cman, orby exsblising hem onsen frm and lar asi Arsaes own oe ‘al works sha tbe Mets the Pgs, an Ont Sa, ae work a ‘alec, ascending in stages fom commonly hed popular and phlceop hc ‘pinion iosscure an endertanding ofthe way ting ore. Ditties explored in the Toi the stu of the kinds of argues tat ean show {he way fom pinion oar the ating point of knows Incting choc countess (tapi) of lei Astle ears thatthe tr ate analogous actries, Inthe performance of topes, ce Sanz of eb ode te hate by her ane coe ‘hestage andi sowed by ananistophe astanza witht sine number ‘lin inthe same metic patter, sung asthe chorsdanets the sme steps ‘ean th ther way arom the sage. Inte Corgan Socrates lays eat ‘wo byt aay oa that ministre fy and sol to promote oF ‘estore 2 hall cone, wh corsponding cay of Spe of pane Ingy he ase the words ops fore othe aps win secon Say. Wht Arto matcher up ar the too sn diet rssoning witha whole ara of tetra counters caecte ws slogans and {action sed on necesay o eontngen premises, whe hore ses fmuhymanies and cusp, fused on Hbelboods at sigs (3388 10-1, 1557a 3038), What makes them diferent is hat while dalace reasons fom opin #retone with sit nasty aout ation ak adm ‘owiedge, Put rhetoric reasors about rigs tha must remain mats of opinion ways boca they ere admit ong illeren ys (157 243535, "Tas ioin pat boeause te pos and fre ter of tet tyre and plies somite cannoverte aly known (3586 323) fh pat bec he general anne shut the vantage, tes, ante Frisia by the communities af hamon beng who sk thos ends re varus They connol be determine by experts and must be ager18_ PLATO: GONGIAS sow ARISTOTLE: RHETORIC ‘uponty people who dont have teeta to develo the kl fling, Tang or omplex argument (1373 14) Rhetoncsetorcing 0 Arse, smroutgowth of ali ito polis (3862827). The dale pursit ‘ofthe things that ae knoatle about pits sacha the advantages ad the aeons whe any have soe spesten ad wilh Ce [solely alt acon and exertion of mastery ae by means of ‘Juches You seam to me fo besuying that sti isone the ootthi kind orgs What ou say steve. Sues Bat ot spose you want call any of i thetic en though you nid fat wy in your wording thes {atheitnatonel matey by af speech eran {Foomeore vote to want hep but ur speches he Ingitcae ack with "Terr Gergis youre saying art tr Srna Bat or supose you mean ether ata or oometry chet, [coments eee SS Seeger nce eee Seema set peer omen EE gaa cesmiacnengicnoe See ees rete encemgt capers ie hoe ames reeamemeeios ‘eno Rte ea a Ft Cg ee eerie pt eeerbemaea ag in wn y t ings sboot corcias 35 Ces epithets a yori Swf Comean now, yo too finish ofthe anawrero wha ‘Since htoichappcas tbe one mong those ash wees forthe most pare whe offer aso happen obo tha etry total harks abot which tori has exertion fmasey ik veods? Ks we snme aifsomeone were task me abo ay oe Ute arts whstever hat we were fist now speaking o “What ‘heart of aries, Socata” Tt him, the way you did insnowthatfeons of hears that have cr exertion osery Dyan afspech And fhe were to goon andaskme,"Theone ‘twongther ta sab aa” e hi thatthe onc among theothate about even al thee ad exacy how micheach Ie-Anditheweretoask intr “Whatartdo you cll estoy of rasmeril its” Tati ha hiss oe hoe ater all ‘hetrmastr tcughopeech Andifhe weretogpon andaskime “Theone about ha Talkin ke people dein motion n the surly hat whereas in cter respec the std of nme Calratoscorespondsto te artot ametc—sine ey eae ‘he sume thing the eer an he odd they fers exent ‘tthe sty emer ats stade the way the oda! he rer ae lated thoratvs and none sien malt ‘nnd fsomeone were sk about atone when ad that to eet mastery nal spect y pec, Be were to fy "What arte spvche atone abou Soc? Tl ‘i that theyre boat the wy the tins the ars hes, ‘nd the moo are elated oo another np ras Ad yu be tights sng i Socrates. Stites 0 Zoro o then too Cargian ore rcely oof Thess that corp everything aa exert all ha mastery by speech orga: Tati ‘Sart So tel me the ne asng them thas about wl? What ‘among the thing threat thew peehen tat Hee Sapopetetoet meenty Calta By te gods Charen Tou Rave bon preset a many pesos be ow and dont now wen Fre eer eyed ‘Braso mach serigtnow So frien yo wet 08 tether all day ng, you ding me a Sts WE Cale hing oye pve so ong a8 jan ili Coa two be shaef hing indeed er ht Sete or trees ty be wii whet el promise at arjone ek + Gkuhaesere wane Sifters good ox pooper oni becom and sk whatever ou wan sce Lik ay Corn tot im spied nthe gy saitby yu Bocuse nay welt yasapeainggy od Tato ge phy Youchyoveabe make mcone = ‘estan he wanton om ou? Gere Fp nae on ico wats “ait ahve {ep et nh me sey hs gy ae corcus 0 “Set So a o be persasve in crowd about ll sje nt Teaching but pesunding? Gorges Qt ‘Sars: You were suey saying astra tat he eto wile ‘hore persis aot whats heathy than he doce. orgs was sang he would eins eo a ‘Sires And hein owe?” noun hs amg he gor? ‘Since presumably he wert be mse perasave than the doctor among those who have hreledge Gorges Yetre pening the rath, Scot: Sf el be more peruse than the doce, e bcos ‘more persuasive han the ane who ove? org Oae ‘Sts Even though hes nat doc right? Gongs Yes. ‘Stool: Bat prvurnhly somone whys not a doctor sacking in cl ef the hing the doctor knowles shat orgs Cie. Swot Therefor, every ne the shetorcian is move persuasive than the dace, th ane itt Knowledge willbe more pers ‘Sve among poople witout knowledge thal what Flows ‘cmethingele?| oy ease anyway that dows allow: ‘Shoat: Bat the shear nthe samo conton with respect © all the other rs oe and sas sete Theres no nee at all ot ito know a tings stand wit the subjects emt st ‘Needs to have discover scene contrivance persunsonto make ESppene tothe who dont Know that it knows more han those sno knoe ‘Garg Well cst that mae alot easter Soca for someone no st ened heres of th ast ost thi oe fo Ben Trova than the isan? sox Water the sora ie worse of or at worse of than ‘he thes fer being in tha raion we ok a shay, hasany basen ourspecch, bur ow letseaminethis rst ‘sth hetrcian neatly he sare conditon eis reper to the fst and the unjust the shamseel andthe batiul e good at ‘he ba she eth respect theese and the ther matters Sekning wth thera athe dest ha, What 00 ‘ewhat'sba what's best or whashamefal orator nat, Set contier persion about tham ao shat without Erin ‘heseems amang these wh dent Know to knoe moe hat the ‘ne wo dove know? Or st neces 20 koe Wa ad does the pers ws pong to leat thetric fom you have Waive [kntsng thee hing steady? Ant the one se rive doce then, are yuo the ache of eto going etch in|H_PLATO.GORGIAS a» ARISTOTLE: RHETORIC nothing bos tow thing—beause snot yourpb—andareyou ‘Bangali wean he maw to ew such ng Shethe does tno then and seem to be good when heist? Oeil you be tly unabi to teachm ctor ihe dow STrndy knw the rath these hig? ow dest go with thing Hee at Gorgas! Ant rt of Zen mae he revel tn you werent ying You would adel us hal he rer the power of deo corps Well npposs, ocrates the does happentokrow these ‘hinge el ism then rom me sores Hal st ght there, Bosse Yoste pti it bei. stat make someone» etonia, sa newt forhim Kom {hethigs trent enor ber breand, orafewand bya then rr you congas Quite sa. ‘Sts: What about hs Someone wheres materfcarpenty Teacup ihe oe? orgs Yes Sct: And someone who srned matters of msi fs msl ori Yes, ‘Shins nd soedone who ler matters of doctringisa dete, St ao. forthe rex? Acording fo ou same pec ache St leaned exchange tear pero sree tars Gorgias Queso Sree Soaccordingtn ou same spec “nw arn mattress ee? congas Ttly 0 presume ‘Ses And prsunaly te ot person dost things Corgis Yes ‘Sco: Then ls a nce that the seta s st and hat Fast peso wants 0 ot ings? Corgi So apps ‘Shire Therefore te js person will never Want do insti Gorge: Necesar. ‘Slee Ad fen our speach a necessity dat the tori ‘ia Sree Therefore the hein wll never want od injustice Gorges Happears ok anyway. ‘Scotce Welloycuemembersayngalitie while gp tht one ought tol the blame on the anes or throw them ouch cies Ifa bor use hs bovng sil and comms gsc, and 90 {hesae way fs costa testo sll una one {nh oto ay th ec se ese wt taught him or exe th case that some concas 35 thi fom the ty. but the person whos dang theistic ane tng has tor righy? Wire thowe tgs adorn orga They wor sid ‘Sila: But now ts shen that thie same person, th storia never doe inst that Sc? org Sot appears ‘Shots: Ad inthe Bist speccs that weremade Gorgas wat sid that heroic wou be abot speeches oon theevenand Re odd Dotan the pst and he anja ea ge orga Ye, ‘SiS ine that when you altho things then assumed That etn whch always makes speeches bot juste, could ever be an uns thing Bt since you ere sayin itl ater Uhattherbetclon might abo wclusebeicunjsy tse su Pris thinking he things that adbeen ai weretin zion, thas made tose tatenent othe ten tat if you would count itagaintoberefte, the way [woul it would Rewortwhueto haveaconversitio but fet to ellit goodbye. Art now farther along when veveextmined i yousee for yoursel that we aes ‘one again that he retorican ls incase of wing hs Peto {nj o of Being wiling todo jute, What the word i going on with thee things, Gorgas “by the dg—issomething, i take no snl conan ook nto sdaguatey fh alas. Pus Wha gies Socrates? Doyo ra think bout rhetorthe ny Youre no taking about? Ordo yousnugine—tecause Gorgias teas schaed not to gant you thatthe Metorcly sil nan rows the hing tht eat an Def an god oiferseane ‘ame pot knowing them an is own ed tack him Rims, nd then from hs cones maybe sme contraction ered up in ‘sspeeches us what youlove when you ours were leading, him wth such questions vol ho 9 yo magne wou deny ether hat he kre whats or athe eset ten? Buti’ trably uncouth eo daw the talkin such mater Sue Pola, you mont beasilyannered getimay url Te with god resent we get urseles companions and Sons fo vehen we curetes have gti to ld an gel the eight tnd narrows you youngsters standing by can stagiten ou lives ‘utagain nour dedsand in our speeches as wel Ard nw ifn ry mapect Gorgas ond have gon outofbounds inoue speeches You tand by and do ot us ragh-i'sthe ast hing er yout Tee ete ety ae ns dg ee [cera nsrayandeonet te Byncemag uetonagee Teil ecrdettc ga Tetons sen waar cee445 _ PLATO, CORGIAS ie ARISTOTLE: RUBTORIC dard on your eyo fm wiling tke bck whlever you want ftom umung the things that have ben agreed any of thar seem ‘Syounrbesuielthiyeiohaweageede soknges youll guid Sinan one tins me ola Wh do ys nan by tat Sx Tot you ae nt Poison that ey speaking that you tad west ne ha? Wont hae height to ay a2 macho ant? Shore Yutcrany be eringsrething crest ment ce Tet ft when youve came to Ans where there’ the pretest fight ta spankin Grew you sone were then oat ge that ile. Dat pot pu ists wage yo pong a eth eae wing oanower nha ae ake, woud Be a ‘Elngsometing dena en ay eo going the right go syd alsin oyu? But anything sd our peech tbls yo and you want aighton Hout then spook ‘Goveay td sso, poting tafe way hat seems good {og and by aking and answering gosto in your tr he 10a; Canis and estab ted cae penalty ot cat to know the sume things Gorgas does tat ri? nite Soe And do you aso urge people on each oxason task you rhatever anne want caitang soknow how answer? es Very ocho ‘Seo Now thn do whichever of thse things you want ask ie ost Anan Socrates hat doa cael since Goria ses to yet tare no cv snk Some As yoabingine whats ofan sim ue am Ste None tall Seems to me Postel yo the tah Tie wat das strc o you be? Sts hing you lt he bow reading ce ‘es Whats that out aking sou? Snowe A certain ind of experience, TaarSo core coms to you tobe experience? Se icows tame sla you ay something es. Fou tapanance steht ‘SrtA binging about certain gaan and pls Fr So heer wen fo you to bea bs thing, the since iS hie to gry peopl? sere Waa Pos Have ovale ered ram e wat Tea ly so yx can as the goon tat lows ha coat Dieiteitdonavtusin ome Tobe bse? consis. Pa: Wel ve oot hat yu claim stn kine of ‘experience Seo Then since you have high ear for gratifying woul you The to ratty nein lay? Pee Two ‘Sto Ask ane now about he coking of tay fod eh sort of “ar that seems to me tobe, is: Ls you then what sor of rt scooking tasty fod? ‘Swot None sl Ps Sey “Bat at ‘Stora A cetin Kind of experince Sy “At wha” Fats Tsay Seo: Ateinging about roifcstion and pease Plus Pate So cooking tasty food the sae ings cre ‘Stotes Nott ost» parte these psi ‘an: What that youre speaking of Stes Teling the uth might be foo uncouty fo Garg sake, Tim deta to say ene he imagine im msn fn os pursuit at dont realy know whether ths s theres Corgi pursues—fom a speech fe nove nothing ese le os bout wat inthe work he thinks iio bul wat eal tori partofacorsin mater thats not one ofthe Peal ings ‘Gos: Par of what Socrates? Spesk dont be ashamed'on my Sut: Walt sernsto me Gorgas that tan arf pari at all ut belongs to asoul thats gel at gssing have and lever by atte t dealing with people. The eux fel pondering seems toma tat tare ae mun other pars of ss pari ‘well and ta one of them s ooking a) fod, wh seems ‘ean art but the way ny spench ha i ent bt» ator of ‘xperens and repeion ell rhetoric 3 prt af thio, ex well {scouetlogy and sophistry, these fo pars to deal wth ov ‘matters Now HPs wants kat something, ht an lene [necro hema anode Kind of part of pandering Lan hebecie but without otcing that Thavertansiered Bat yet he goes ont sak whether Iconee i» Rent thing But Yk ‘ol ging to answer hther cuir stor toes beat ‘fal thing ora harfltone befor Ist nawer what is, That ‘wot be an thing Pokus I you do war to ar ho, ask what kind of par of panceving [lam rhetores dsm ashing: arewer what Kid of pts on hve" ong ode on at