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ie tree nds tha lacrowsbiog sn seen inet Recs pir geal ign era Oh ter cafes ae eee et ‘The Southern Journal of Piloiphy 2008) Vo XLAIE ‘Virtue and beyond in Plato and Aristotle Sarah Broadie University of St. Andrews 14 ie woll known that at the end of the Nicomachean Bthioe (ak) 'Aristato, unexpectadiy and perhaps withost hanes sllicienty prepared his renders eich ts propoaleg oe famous theorstia! eal of mn happiness udeinoniey Tike apparently lastunipute developmen: eoneludes’« levgshe Invent closely frmod oo i ay wll have seem te ‘assumptions: first, that the major ingredient in happiness Is Vieuous activity and second tht te Frat in quent oe Be ‘understood ‘ar a sot-af dispositions for roupendiog ¥ 'Spproprate feelings and condct to the concrete stastions fa Which human beings ar situated Roughly speaking in ocher Words, the virtue in question, the oneslee of whicteboe ne Beeson ws wo crucial fr homuan bappinesy, tat ses chee fal excellence. But nox, is the pouliimats chaprs of ty Way we are suiidenly given to anleretand that the hnppinges Sseocated with this sor of virtue blonge at bac tf seeegd "nk wheceas happiness in Is highest iri ipnd only ty sodlive activity ofan ustory different sort af vitae Tato Durely theorocea wisdom (nop) Hove T'shall be discussing a different last-minute ethleal turn by Avsttlo Tt ooeare near the ond athe Bacon Eek (BE), Loss scandalous beenune lets wall kagwn thee is Wag ‘ached counterpart, the Wademian late twist simon ay srprising. Inthe EE too Ariatale hea bsen oveewheieataty foneerned with practical vine in it forest Linde Mere, his Budomian aecount of happiness, the highest hunnaa eet thas heen couched in torus of practical ria" Everything Jaatbetbre the end eeggerte that in the BE Arist eee oul regards the person of virtue ne the very host at Ihuman being, But in tho last chapter we find him demeticy irtuy We are sudly shown a tort af character superior {he virwaous or morely good (agethot), Beyond these eee {old are parsons of noble x rina goaineca te keabcgede Literally Bne-andgeod)* Sipe of mere yondnena ea keer Sgaty condition for veined goodias nats ast slices Ieee Aristotle speaks of the refined grade ae comaplee ar perfect Sar Bean (telsian) vistao? and imlion in hia premblo to the divgussion ha ie a sort of whole tae eontios the sdiaury tirtuers ‘Bat isnt jus tho entirely of tho ondinary virtues, nor I's whole that sopervenanon thom, Fortis elealy part of his View hat peono cen have more goninaa oo virus Wihout aang the refined grate, The later, Shon, doce ot mvvomaticlly ene in te prevence ofthe former "abon beeanes lor that the difference between virtue and ‘refinement of virtue ie uot of dagree. Not that Aristotle's unt es ot diferencia dere of wrt: on te en ‘rary he recognizes the posailty of x hervie of superhuman, agrade that stands up to cireumsiencee wp testing that oven tne {raly good person givas way in them” at (os we shal dlifreacebetwoon tare nd refined vizio je ns ofthis a 1 fact, Aristotle here gives the Impression ot holding that -efinemant of godnecs is a prateabe ideal fr al cizens, bat ‘ot (in his remarks elsewhere aboot soparhtunan vue) teat all should Ideally be superhuman virtunaa- Nor does Ariattle ‘think that having reftaed virtae js or involves haying just ‘another good quay a ation to the arian one of erage ‘moeraton, gentleness, juste, and practical windom Tor ‘lew is that thar later gun itiesthe ordinary vienuo, ‘nay cal them that for the omental ave te bang cet We'don't have any ono af thom strictly speaking fms lack practical wistom (phvondets), and we don't have practice! Witdom withoat having all ef them "Thue having any one af ‘hom entalls having gach ofthe othora, This doctrine of oneatenation (athe than sit way) of he vitae i no ey to-understand or defend But fat nod at nob as he, Who Iatlers now is that, given the dretive wt nfined goodness ‘adds to mere gownose ao be just ater ordinary Teton ainsing portion of mere gaodnass. All te portions of me soodnese must oetat together, whereas Aveta fo eleae tae ‘ello goodness nod not exlat when the rato rue exit Welk wht is refed goodaeas or refinement of gotdnct, sccording to Artstie? Is nae: eooeder the Spervane They or cther poop of that kind? thi of virtue ee something sae ‘lua ave And they are virtuous good men, 12401)" Dut thay ae nat nobl-and-good, fer they value itt in tae oon ras They value forthe neo the various desirable thing Brings in its train: Aristotle calle these "ihe natural pots. Gxamples are hoon would, health au srength of buy power br noc positon. By vntrast persons of ined goodies Vale ‘sie nnd the practise of virtue fr eheit ow sage eid bes ‘ire and the!practic of ure in themselves fine Obviously ‘Allott this this she right way to value virtue, nd T shal not dapate tae view ‘So we havo edictinction between virtuous people with the ‘wrong view about th value of ite aud virtucus people wit # ‘ira nd eyed in Pann Aide {he ight view on this Ariat does not tll us what he thinks about viraous people with no view ane way or weather on ake Fouson why virtue i valuable, even though euch people sere ai ea of i aly ron i partan type, they have nothing a a ery wit tho oe aoe itr is concerned, ven ob clean T tink, thet Acne ‘ould not inludo therm among the kalePagathot, Rotten goodness neeesarilyinvalvea tha ght rlleciveevshaaton sTepodaes “Aristotle's deprecation of the Spartan type may tempt one 40 infor that we are not mean to iow this type es genuinely Wituowa"1 think we wat oesat this tomptations Ae ‘eitngdalberaely here Had ho wished he sould ual Bid thatthe Spartan type seems toby virtuous but realy ‘ot, That is haw Aristotle deala with «number vf ayuda {bal mimic she onda od dapaitin ofthe wpe es urage they ar illeary freon, not the rol Tage Bok Is tee resent gastage le say rather emphatically Wek thone ofthe Spartan typo are good or virtanoe nen" According Yohei poten thtak one out car aes have viton, but trey bees, And be says something else very signin proving seat 1h means i eciousiy wien ie calls them food Aron hae ‘ue dolecd'in general terme thatthe must wht goo even Maat also refinedly good, is the sousce of goodness foreee ‘natural goods he has, such ex wealthy peesge and pone Hs, Aviatotle tales up's tradition we find prsigurel or Pees, ascording fo which many ofthe things Chat human teins ort ae guod and dovieable are realy good and desta oly fa the bande ofthe good perso, Ony auch 4 uno a gensiaaly dvantagnd by hoving them, Kan sya something sata te tegen errr: the nd i eo nc ional yod that ie tne conition of other gots bong so ‘The good will, or in Aniatatie the good pervons iy ike Gee Fetes florm edd ty pricing i, at boing elated in some way tu him, by belonging fo hea, ibe onmoral goods, which in themasives are ee it were ants ‘petontially food, take on actual value: Thus tho god person the arché and aita ton ogathon ” Now whatever we tie ot {his dactrine~nadT shall not go inky ft herent ‘nd of though one does what wo find. Sristette unterning the Spartan typo who me ped by wich pereongoodaear, r ne might say ne asi Uf their goodness, tho nonmoral or natural pode ore coed eth seemed to to be very strong evidenos that Arise eon erelly and seriounly when, in this peannge, he calls the Sean gd ous con ote moment he Eve of plain that these pervs lack reverent hoe wrongly valuing virtue on acount ofthe naturel goode soe 99 Srsh ed ‘han ths on esount of. And if, an think, he means it ‘when he ells the Spartan tye tin then ho ugk ae Shia Type et manfeting virtues parscaar response of the Hat AL hwit canna he te ono hat thn Sparen type ss ony ‘witha view to ebtaiaing the ataral good since being toe el'srono tie Board fe not somaintent with bein & ‘alls virtuous per, "Ts Arsotliar gen oust at lout eo quetions for ‘iru spel, the iow th owls Fists what mont virtue eseataly bo, f gach am agent Le oveiie? (Mach of at Tsholl say on this is equally appl table tote ageat who has virtue but i without any teary at lon iby vistue la valuable) Secondly” why or in what way {oes tear whothor we have tho right vlew abnut the value sia? Why by refinement of geodaese, as Avistatlo dep toater than mers goodnces? T shall some to there questions presentg But Gest must say something about Plato, i only Etchume {wae rari enough to neode hein mg tie Plato alsin a passage not greatly requentod by contmporacy ‘Phlocopton” nuggets that one can be genuinely virtuous but Ina way ar trom ideal, This passage too oncur et he end ofa Arent work on ethicn Ie in the myth of Be Here we are ‘Rtown'how the sols of the dead fare besond this fe sn how {hay come tobe sencarnatd. Tyg fist eng places in the other word or to acon af punishment, depending on bow they have lived ther nataral ives. "There they remain for thovsand year. Then, by tages hey arrvn atthe Spindle ot Naconty (or Bate), where each oul given to cho Dont word Se shee ae errata ar eceotaviyimpemented, Te power ef vie ontiee dows what Telasure sho every soa understand wh abo 2 ot the woul itanit {hen choore in an teder determined by lot There aro many {hore ptena ives ofl Kinde on offer than re ane soul, 60 ira comes. Anywe process on one ecnsion, tho tal who hed drawn fame fried and withont more ado ealeced the Io of the treater despot Thon and only then did this epul discover lng th fold fhe i ad egg witha harough Inspection vepisodes af paradigmatic horror such ag’ the ‘loving of Hs own children Ad when Usa seul ev proptely ‘rin it had chosen, {twas aghat and bevailed ite misfortune, “Micugh thie was none fat ut ie own a0 itu and beyond in Pato ands For our purpote tho central point ia that this very oul ia described a8 having been ireunuin ite previous if. Cleace t fed gone toa bang place whon it diode could nt be seat to {he place of paiahmant, for ie had done png wrong’) This oul lata anys, nd lived sn a welberdered ely ded rs ‘Spatod in vista out of eutoon or habs, bat without pilose (ethet aneu phitonophias areitemetelephotay And ia lb ataey thie eal wae not an anomaly: mony othere ike it we aro ta ‘sos the samo kind of dsastroas hole, The moral sof our {hat mound philosophy sn His world offers tho he ‘last ruck fright Bal enouernenta nthe other oe ‘But In order ta geasp how that moral actually fellows, we dhave to understand why ta sus previous vise waa act act snough to Keep it frem making the ghastly choice otherwise Plato sound here as it bei eliply bullying ut ato upporing philosophy by throats about reincarnation. The myth of Be Speaks of the fos the erangement which oul wequlos only {nthe cours f living ‘ons forming in atforent soul ae ea [one or snather kind of chosen lie i Ube comre of lig it Trther think theta oxcerab gen ice aerangementa fare what Anette his Ether Ihnee of the 20: that i they are moral dlapostions doveloped and activated in Atiy living, Ant the previous viréuo of the boul at she canter af ‘hie pact of fs stnry was the peyehle fore it bad acquired in its previous life, Wo can imagine thot this possession would atrophy in th otter world on tho Aristatlian ground that it Inns tobe exercned in order to bo maintained Th asarpion is tua eangot be exereeed there; put why not Te might in fct be mare satisfactory to imagine fling bo sureve nto the ether watld for the atina reason almioat every ether thi ‘worldly possesion fall ta survive namly heauoe it would be Sno use—in fac, would be meaningless pearly sald “under the atherswordlycreumstancesThe pati hat there are no cieumatances There. Tam supposing that Plato employs here ‘whnt i faiar to oe tho Aruotlian ides of avnvue a2 ‘ispasition to respond appropriately to one's patieuar ecu ‘stances that i, from within a pro-osating context made up of Tmany factory containing one respons, snd many that dirt tnd shape i Such dlapasttons do not necessary carey with them the habit of ertial reflection about o's whole way of oing on: the eandstions of it, the stuadards and valuen $t Snubodies, tho changes that might imperl or strengthen 5k People ven whole communitig, aay i things renal oder ‘and peaceful, continuo i tho daly practic af virtue without ‘Hepping back from thoi lives, Thoir souls rospond always 1a Usfrocaasion or Uset within am unsemerked framework: Bat tem pen gaing te tke otter wold the word of eontext-lesk ‘hoica buch souls asive where thi od ways af choning have Sere Broaio nothing at alto atch onto, and whero the one choice oa ill So upor them fie them ast ‘But this fant quite tre. Some ground must have bean lid. genre hat cou tah ioe with on (ould precizoay vituoun 20] 90 prespitataly choos, Ives the fo ofthe grontost denpat? Its not to be ena latory to thin, ie, But what wor of ras in being a dng ould it have entertained than? Nota Preccal ar aven © would-be-pracia interest Any tol which Shin world took pracicl aim on tyrannical power would ot We wetuoun, Grins acts mort Be plosied with rem fo teising power, and petpotraded ifthe bid ita be atonanl once'the desire for dexpolina harbored by the soul the ‘ory most have been iapeactial to nature: ie must have Consist inthe play of fantnsy-fascinetion whose abject the Soul et te ine new 19 be moray and pracicaliy ot of etch “nd ow ofthe queen, and Goreore sey and fanacetly 90 Pica lve lhl obo charmed by. What hop tie ‘antaay abject ou ofthe fed of practical option mere the aos {hisweridy creaming and the natural apaciaes of in Intuing human beings, Only because of these to there Aitfrens bobwoen practi! deste and fantsy Gee, wit tae oul an oner to get someting inthis world enw haa a do Iore thon be entranced by fe But in the next worl, where io [npodiments sur wt what had been a fantasy becomes 3 ‘olmatealy see ulin thoi ‘fowever, the soul in the other world must have retained rouse of normal, prephilocphica, Auman deoney (On the ‘asi of thee, prsuspeip easton an practi ins orev Iie butte pepe asi of patient) Fo erally phileophy was nt need to make the tut in the other word [Bate menstronely foul action: ne ta some of dhe pen ‘Hon ef er Seapic ese, broke into spontancous lamen tation: It eniled againel’ chance. and extornal fate not ‘endoretanding how it ow fantasy bad st thoteep. ie in thin ward enabled i to indulge en admiration for despaticm. feom's state of ethlal sveueity, and so engaged in th non: ‘copoableimagtning tht deopens such wpa. foecfod oe thelatincive things about despot without reading te nal Print, precleely ecco the whole packege wan, in this world, ‘Sur of one He blindly aarumed thet the contest daner and Suter, that made tare safe o fant, would nessa sSwaye be there. Afeanwhie, th couree and content of the {ntaining wan uncesponsive tothe sous actual partiula “atin the {e-containonses i I am supposing eanety the property the Vir been ats and Aisle fantasy needed to enable itt cling on in the soul, ermining there te an active influence erent te other world whare me ‘Chrsmtance" were proses old em eoak™ "How would philosophy have helped protests from such a “ieastvounbetwennfivesseioe? But first we sould sak: whose ‘Dhiloeosing? Perhaps did os have tobe tis sous Oe Enaogh, perhaps if it had been reared through a rflecively dlvigod education like that of ae masa guaran wht are tought up not merely to value justice forts own take, but Boniiely to ono tnd opand any devin frm net moaly ‘onatrousones-van ely and in short to Took upon fuse ae the eateace of eudatmone; and to be oo deeply dyed with thls ‘attitude that ‘even such extremely effective detergents 83 ure, pai, fear and devtre woutart wah Houten any mology allows that con have Phlowophia witheut ‘ersonaly phlsophisingy if there are thove who do and Tove od roped thelr autho. ‘However «certain enount of personal philgeophiring would come an ¢ anlural bloom on the suniiery's upbringing if Dllbvepbiring fn allowed to ietudethowghfe bet nosed fal general reflection on common experience, sielding conc as suchas that ie eg or iponsble fr a despot tt fo Commit diogrcetl crimes? that ie of moderate enous ‘oct favorable to practi of virtue that making god colo Aepends on mare than meaning well, (For of sours the soul {he story did mean well when botwoon ive chose despotism ‘And oven within this lf Plat audience would have boon are of plenty of cases where oe thing had 0 lo to another ‘at individuals who started out remvkebly wall ended traitors and murderers) What is sore, even without an idea Salary education, ithe sel inthe mary ad penctind ae xamination tn thi fe might have realized before to inte hat being innocent of wickedness matiored foi amuch mer {han it was are one thouphtowaess thus the soul igh have bac i thi ie moe elt boat scare and Dathape fone indulgent infantry. Commontonoe philasoph ful lo hove edit wees Se ten wh non of he mill virtue and good canduce, including ts on, dopend on & nrapaco af habits aad inatittions: sed to Sealey that the ‘enditions for these can be swept sway. Pisally, Platonte ‘sthatology would have tag that none of ta exeapes fet Soak alton sate ow al wear cho lest for death simpy tsp cho tol of those worldly support ‘ten awh ondidon the ho foe to moss meres {ots coicecneavabe ‘hut hee Iota of philosophy coud st elpin that hoi leas they wer ail poeent a working i the aoa ant Why ‘should we mappore thie tobe trae of theta when even the Vr- abus pouch tats ull and oid in the ole worl To oaks 08 Sarah oan conse ofthis, we havo to thiak of philosophy as, ina wi fstr activity fo fantasy. fm this life philbsophizing tao dopand, for th stot of tho activity, ona given oot of ereumstance wll i ts deliberate universality it takor ne nic f thor ot {ny edhe particular irummtance, Like fastany, fellows sn Inser dynamic, bing similarly foe from the cnatvalnia of tle I Henes ifthe frats of one thereby survive in the soul ‘er death, so do the rite of the other But ean we finda moral in the myth of Be if wo are no es in the Plane eschatology? Ye Te proctams “terse foun scratch tke conditions of their lives, nn even if each aoa ‘atarallydiepoces ital inte a taue electing is conditions, tall she some wo aro.not Inevitably Ibmitod to aequleeclg in those concitions so that ail fa inmereed inthe Dustness of Leng along therm, exept far corner or to af reirerhing ‘oatane Once the sol Toners, (hy ding m)thnt already inthe mid of tis word ean gets chnabeve Use edge, pore ‘reed to question and work towards changing even funda ‘tte life, For nothing cam hoop it back but ts ov roa tha thas thin power, Tall rctsen vary briefly to the myth of Hr after a farther look at Asetote. Hore, then, whet we have teen so fr Plnto tnd Aristotle, ae tho end of the Republic and the Rademtan ‘Bios renpnetivly, seo een arse a poslly coexisting with Store ofeical fut n each eam tix a fale that stands at tome remove from daily practcalitien and on this loval may hardly show up, or hava show up ae elt. With Arotte the place ef las" nove came back to Aristotle view although, aa was indicated © now is wot farther exegesiy but las oT want to fond off a iow which, if tue, would mann fe Impossible to be gonulgaly virtuous without having Uae ight valuntve attitude to virsu, My argument wil follow fanilae packs et the msnteke I shall angst wil has life once It hoa up wut olan in Ancasions of Aristotle een. "Tho fiat oolat tg be mae, however, i thi: the nataes sanewer to the gue ‘what oue a0 ‘Yet and beyond in Pata od Aisle priate rosponses in footing and aetion,qver a wide range of brdinary situations” By “right ax aporopeata mest “ight or "ppeopriate all things considered," aad T shall werume that ‘what we Would call moral requirements outweigh or trump Uither considerations." Moreover the vistvous parson comes Up ‘wlth che right or appropriate reaction a4 much. That i say, ‘Yeriations sm or hia seastions exacly reflect varietione te hal counts as the rit or appecprinterexponso in varying ‘tuations C make th sampling aasuugtion that they oak ‘one appropriate response in each situation) The victuoue Braon not only haz the sthical know-how at tracks right ‘espouso, bt immediately enact th now how on he given eeasion, “Immediately” means not temporal immediacy bat ausal shure knowing how to respond tv wufficiot fo" the rowponse.” Tescems obvious that if this ie whet virtue i, then one ean be virtuous and reliably come up with the right practea! and smotional responses to situations just bieause one ix geared 0 Alo precisely shat, sven though when aaked the redlective ‘anestion "What ls the point of virtue? What should we yest 9 for ane lesuas 8 wrong annwer That this ie jonsble ly connectod with the fact that one may have Gevsloped ‘racicod virtuo oor along time belore over conaldeving at fll what exactly tho point oft Is Probably thie dovelopaneat fnd practice could not have occured if one had not imbibed from others the belo that bog & good or virtuous person ‘ory important and mut be taken very seriously Ths it may ‘elle it he cul ot pores Bea ne eld it a, “ietuo without having any svaluative attitude twand vst a a, Tam claiming, however, that any such neveararyeufectie "tttude neod agi include a apecifention of what tee thst ‘ales virtwe ao mportant, Such specication may oF may not ome later, and a take creet (a0 assume for now) fa fis when we end ap holding thas virtue ls tobe valved for {2 ‘en eake'and just gence ists in, oa inoreet fora 4s when we end up holding at virtue is for the sake ofthe eeol— a the reap t whith we bon. "ff realy are vrtwouswe shal ind such forging ‘ultenatural we shal fet at home wilt suah behavior When ‘We are rather austere about the natucal goodx on éracil (ecaslons, Wo are toon n'a sonae behaving asi we onsidared thom lee important than doing the night thing That ime re bhving inthe suse way as people would wit eld xd ved Ite lator secni-order view Botts dows not mua that we share or even wavor toward Ghat view Afr all wo do nal in 105 Sarah Bea ‘owe azaions, have th option of pursing the natural gods, ‘Wren in not wpractial option if me really ate vitaseec at ‘memaly have dot steadydiopention secs a bi odd to thoee Spartan-tyl vstuous agents tat thay find themselves alhoring to correct behavior cree then sary paths cutting moral eortra plainly stots Secon hom ad some natural good vwel, hit eensien can be leek 'n different ways. They might ead up rejecting afer lf eae ry of why virtue matters, and of Luraing ta brace the alternative on, which tity How might nea te aslvos as having implicitly hold all long. "As I disconsred ate in the day. kad al along been courting her for lege ene {hough Tas doing i or hor money" Or they might hang on foi rofloctive theory but Iasi aguinet fhe svidenes that ‘ting tho moral comers alwave has damaging nataral oc OF they might fad it compoling to nlieve that empha ‘pourance al far hort at roality and thet you ean never Ly aning wrong morally beenuaedving so bridge son hanenath, ‘i wort evil sent hy god as puninhmens hee or rotorved ioe Feuater ath hehe ble cht re mei sccused of doing what is right simply ro ua to avoid thy suis of Aivine punishaent. at the explanation may be the okey aie ‘und. in some aman beings the very Dobe in pols conmeanae sand divine justioe maybe bolstered, even generated, by ote ‘snlecodent attachment to cight-doing combined wih « eee about he value of it that sigaally clashor with wre of the pial fat, ‘The question was wbat must victuo essentially be, i it ean be genuinely possesed by thore who value it for the wisag ‘reso and the simple answer we have hoon sonalderng We Sek ‘csounte of virtue virtuous Spartan type. However, the simple acon is; as Thos sald the ed fone Ife correct, then anyon ie wrong who holds, wr soe Bhllosophers are said by same interpreters tore that ah, fuoue agent alps acts fem ths thnught This Shak Re itaoas person ay placed would dae fron the though args this ation ist at fromm vitae This destroys tha Lnmediacy that in characteristic othe vstcous eget meee to the asteral account. Om that account, one Sent eee Iuslegs the mero recngnition of tho right thing to dai aullioent forthe action. In recognizing the rght thing one i aeeaiee te fhe particular external situation, Thoughts that one ages ‘matches, or ls, @ virtuous one, are addtcoaed, aod ior con sally distract fom the nituation in fase, cosstec ake second thought ao that its tantamount to"l Se ease hs 108 ‘Vir nd ayn in Pato a Avilla ttuolirtuoosy” then, on the natural account of what virtue 4s, th thought is domed tobe fig by bing see 1am, not aro how many philosophers realy believe that the morally admirabe agent acts Gore ta thas superiaoas thoughts But for senge renson we Bee ance ‘bers reading this view inte ether philacophers, sok wath However, i Arstatle avepts the natural angactat Yirluo-an account which males neut sonse of hs Sporto, {pe chen’ (to that extent) the superfs honght ora ‘urs of Ariattiy piturw af the vistas agent fn sete [have aot yet rouched the precise misinke hiled bite anowering tho first question, But here iu oe ig es istuous agent acts from the fllowkig conjunctive thosgbes to hh hiss is acting vireuouly, nad) acting virtuous ee realest goat sry ey coma i lpi and elegy oe nv earost response. Tho underlying Piosepical Geshe Gre the vrtnun agen ie netented ot er ee by good, and, consequently, only her own grate! go cathe earanteed in u rational agent) to motivate ae tac Foliably produce the appropriste behavior This tester ney, ike the ona above, mae tan gots astribed te philocepoors By ‘heeelvon Ie tends toe tcibed to antongsetran Ba een reel Bi on nla pets ad

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