A K Ramanujan Interview – Ramachandra Sharma

A K Ramanujan. Whenever you think about him, what comes to mind is an image of a migratory bird
that travels to India from Chicago once a year or two. Once he is here, he spends an ample amount
of time with people like us.

When he comes here, he looks at what has been done in Kannada literature with astonishment and
enthusiasm. He holds Kannada very dearly, fills his heart with its contents and then flies back to
Chicago to use Kannada like a man who uses money in the bank.
It’s a little difficult for me to introduce Ramanujan because he has been an important part of my life
for almost 35 years… When I introduce him I feel like I’m repeating myself.

He has been living in Chicago for the past 30 years. He is a Professor at a University there in the
Dept. of South Asian Languages and Civilisations.
He has written three anthologies of poems in Kannada and four/five in English. Above all, he has also
translated a lot of works from Kannada and old Tamil making him a notable translator of his times.
It brings us great happiness that you have come to Bengaluru now. I hope you will be happy to have
a ten-minute conversation with me.

Today I intend to talk about four important parts of your work -

1. Your Kannada Poem compositions

2. Your English Poem compositions
3. About the one thing we both have in common – I have lived outside of the country for 24
years and you still continue to live outside the country for 33 years now.
4. I am also curious to know your thoughts on translations.

RS​ - When you compose Kannada poems in Chicago, what kind of problems do you face?

AKR ​- I have known three languages from my childhood - Kannada, Tamil and English. That’s
probably why transitioning from one language to another didn’t seem too difficult. My father had a
three-storeyed home. On the ground floor, we spoke Tamil, in his library, it was English and outside
of our house it was Kannada. As children, we would run up and down the house. This is probably
why Kannada cannot be separated from me.
Even when I am away, I continue to read in Kannada and think about the language as well. When an
idea strikes me I hold onto the thread and keep moving forward. Normally, if I keep reading in
Kannada for a month or two or when one of you people visit me, we converse in Kannada and then
as we say, ‘Kannada poems are coming out of my ears’.
One year when I was writing my first book, ​Hokkulalli Huvilla, ​Chandrashekar Kambar had come visiting.
When he was there, we would speak day and night in Kannada and recite Kannada poems. He became a
point of reference for Kannada and I think I can say this book is written for him. He even helped me make
a copy of several poems I wrote then and also the story ‘Annayana Manavashastra’. That’s why
transitioning from one language to another has become a habit and it is the same with translation.

RS​ – I think here I have to share one of my experiences when I used to live in England. I used to talk
to myself in Kannada, that means I used to write in Kannada and I would only read that. At home no
one spoke Kannada, even my kids spoke in English. I was trying to escape paraphrasing of ideas by
completely depending on my thoughts and believing in what I wrote.

AKR ​– It is interesting how a language we have learnt in our childhood has been with us for 60 long
years. I visit Mysore and Karnataka in general sometimes only to listen to the language. I am curious
to understand the language and how it is spoken in various dialects, for instance in the market, also
how it sounds. Therefore, I feel Kannada has become a part of me. They say, “you can take the boy
out of the country, but you cannot take the country out of the boy”. The same way even if I was
away from Kannada, Kannada was never away from me.
RS​ – This reminds me of the poem I wrote, ‘Gypsy’ - somewhere on the banks of river Thames, even
though you are listening to English all around you, for love, desire and dream you need Kannada
spoken under the Banyan tree. It feels like you have conveyed the same idea in different words.
AKR ​– You must have seen individuals when they are counting or calculating they revert back to the
language that they learnt as children.

RS​ – What about you?

AKR ​– Even till date if I am doing bigger calculations I do it in Kannada.

RS​ – Same here. That’s why I asked you.

AKR ​– Even though I do most of my conversations in English, as soon as I am given a math problem I
use Kannada.
RS​ – Now I have noticed something intriguing when I look at your writings in both English and
Kannada. If you keep them side by side and compare, it feels as if they have not been written by the
same person. Being a psychologist I would like to use the term schizophrenic division, how are you
able to divide and write like that?
AKR ​– I don’t think that's possible. Both these languages are quite different from one another, they
have different cultures. Firstly, let it be me, you or anybody else here, if we are familiar with two or
three languages, we familiarise ourselves with the respective cultures as well. We are not just
becoming multilingual but multicultural. This does not make us different people. We stay as a single
being, inculcating this compound culture or complex culture.

Secondly, when we use one language to its fullest potential the subject of choice in that language
will also vary. Wallace Stevens says, “a change of style is a change of subject.” We cannot possibly
write about the same subject in two different languages. The subject will not present itself before us
asking to be written in a certain language. The subject embodies itself in a language. When you say
Schizophrenic, it feels like a pathological condition, it’s not like that, it is a resource. We start using
the language well if we want to know about two cultures.
Also, like how the left and right brain works there will always be some support and connections. For
me knowing these languages is like playing the sitar, when I play one string the other strings
respond. Likewise, when I am writing in English, Kannada and Tamil reside within me or when I write
in Kannada, Tamil and English reside within me. There will be certain responsiveness for sure.
RS​ – You have explained it well. I intended on asking this because without your knowledge I have
been trying to translate some of your English works to Kannada and have failed miserably. The
essence of your writing in English is lost in my Kannada. I think it's my problem because my thinking
in Kannada is quite different from yours and that’s why the translation didn’t work.
AKR ​– No, even I have tried to translate some of my works from Kannada to English. I have gone
through the same struggles. I might start off with the first sentence from Kannada, but as it goes on
that subject changes and it becomes new writing. Translating from Kannada to English has become
difficult for me. But it's also probably because I feel like I have some rights over my own writing and
hence I can translate however I want to.

RS​ – Absolutely, looks like that’s the main reason. For a poet when they are translating from one
language to the other, they don’t have to refer to anyone else. Their work is like their child so when
translating he takes the liberty to move things around sometimes.
AKR ​– I agree, and I do not think I would have taken that liberty with other’s works. It is like what
Johnson said, “A translator is an artist on oath”. While working on others' work we have promised
them to take care of their work and try to ensure it is captured in its truest form. We do not make
such promises with our pieces. We understand that the possibilities are different when we travel
from one language to another.
RS​ – In this situation since we are talking about translations, I shall ask you a question on translation.
From my personal experience, I believe that when we are too loyal towards the original poet/poem
our translation seems inadequate. What do you think?
AKR ​– Here we would have to make a distinction between literal translation and faithful translation.
A lot of times literal translations have not been faithful. By literal I mean word-by-word, and
sentence-by-sentence translation and most times that does not seem honest. We have to translate a
poem through another poem. By keeping the original verse in our minds we have to create a
reflection of it in the translation, such liberties during the process of translation help convey the
essence of the text better.

RS​ – So you’re saying it is almost like an act of recreation.

AKR ​– Recreation is a big word, it is translation. The word translation is like a metaphor which means
to carry across. Taking it from one language to another faithfully.
RS​ – There is time for one more question. A few years back you wrote an essay called ‘Is there an
Indian way of thinking’. So I want to ask you the same thing, is there an Indian way of thinking,
Ramanujan?

AKR ​– The reason for asking that question is to tell you there is no answer to it.

IS​ there an Indian way of thinking? Some might say there​ WAS​.

Is there ​AN​ Indian way of thinking? Some might say there is ​NOT ONE​ but multiple ways of thinking.

Is there an ​INDIAN​ way of thinking? Some might say there is no difference between any third world
nation and India.
Is there an Indian way of ​THINKING​? Some might say there are differences in feelings but thinking is
the same.
The reason I asked that question is because there are at least six or seven questions within that one
question. However, it is difficult for anyone to give a single, right answer. I wrote the essay thinking
this question could be a start for a lot of explorations.

RS​ – Is there an Indian way of writing?

AKR ​– Well there is no one India, right? India contains many Indias. It contains many languages,
many kinds of people, many religions. Therefore the concept of India to me is abstract.

RS​ – Absolutely. These days people are trying hard to unify everything as ‘Indian Literature’. Trying
to tie us all down to one pulse.

AKR ​– I am not saying much about that.

RS​ – You have not given it too much importance either.

AKR ​– No, I am not breaking my head over this because I have worked with different languages and
translated from one language to another as well, and I have realised how they are all different.
Sahitya Academy mentions, ‘Indian Literature is one but written in many languages’, which I don’t
agree with. As I told earlier, when one travels from one language to another, the subjects change.
RS​ – Lovely, I request you to recite a few lines from your latest book ​Kuntebille ​we would be
delighted.

AKR ​– *recites few poems*

RS ​– Ramanujan, I hope you return to India and stay with us. Thank you.