Bill OHanlon

Mental Health Expert

Part 1: Mental
Robert Pagliarini
Best-Selling Author, Entrepreneur, Wealth Creator, TV Commentator, and founder of Richer Life Insights. hosted by

Join Robert for more compelling conversations with experts that drive more money, motivation, and meaning into your life, at www.RicherLife.com.

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Getting Back to Normal

Bill OHanlon, Mental Health Expert

Copyright 2011 by Richer Life Media, LLC. All rights reserved. No part of this book be used or reproduced in any manner whatsoever without written permission except in the case of brief quotations embodied in critical articles or reviews. For information, address Richer Life Media, LLC, 26041 Acero, Mission Viejo, CA 92691. www.richerlife.com

The goal of this book is to help you live a better, fuller, richer life. It is designed to help you focus on goals and actions that are important to helping you achieve more at work and in life. The book is intended to provide general guidelines that are for informational purposes only and is provided with the understanding that the publisher and author(s) is not engaged in rendering professional services or in providing specific financial, health, or other advice. You should not regard this book as a substitute for consulting with a competent expert, medical professional, lawyer, accountant, or other professional, as appropriate to the nature of your particular situation. The book presents various strategies, tips, and products that may or may not be appropriate for your specific situation. If you have any questions regarding the applicability of any strategy or idea discussed in this book to your particular situation, you should consult with a professional. References in the book to products, service providers, and potential sources of additional information do not mean that the publisher or author(s) can vouch for such products or services or the information or recommendations in those sources. Neither the publisher nor author(s) are responsible for any third-party product or service or content over which they do not have control.

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Preface
"Getting Back to Normal: The Great Depression Recovery Toolkit" is a 4-part series, aimed at helping the millions of Americans who have been laid-off and are struggling to keep their heads above water both financially and emotionally. The goal of this toolkit is to help you get back to normal quickly as possible.

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Getting Back to Normal

Bill OHanlon, Mental Health Expert

Robert Pagliarini Getting back to normal, the great depression recovery toolkit is a four part series aimed at helping the millions of Americans who have been laid off and are struggling to get their heads above the water both financially and emotionally. The goal of this toolkit is to help you get back to normal as quickly as possible. In order to get back to normal we will tackle areas mental, physical, financial and career. So, this part one: mental. Everything starts here. I want to make sure youve got your head on straight. Prolong unemployment can mess your sense of self and your confidence. I want to make sure you have a healthy mindset and the confidence that you need. So, I brought in one of the leading mental health experts and therapist in the country to work with us. His name is Bill OHanlon. Hes written 33 books and youve probably seen him on Oprah, The Todays Show and many others. Hes a certified professional counselor and one of the developers of solution oriented therapy. Bill thank you so much for taking the time to come on here, to share your wisdom with us. Bill OHanlon Thank you, Robert. Its really important subject people are hurting and emotionally hurting as well as financially hurting so we can say something today that will make a little bit of a difference or maybe a great difference with people. Robert Thats a great goal. You know, I get emails every single week from people who are truly, truly struggling not just financially, not just because they dont have a job but because of this prolong unemployment for many of the people its almost as if they dont know what step to take next. Theyve lost their sense of confidence maybe theyve had a really great job and they felt on top of the world and now all of the sudden theyve been unemployed for six months or a year or two years and all of the
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sudden that umph that they had is gone. And so, Im wondering how we can help them get back to normal. Bill Well, you know, I wrote this book, Do One Thing Different which is one that got me on Oprah and my latest book is coming out next year, its called Baby Steps after that movie What About Bob and thats the thing I think we should start with. When youre unemployed, when youre having any kind of major difficulty its easy to get overwhelmed. You know, its just the nature of human psychology we get a little overwhelmed, we want to do a hundred things or everything seems overwhelming or nobody can get a job, you watched the news and say theres no jobs out there, well, there are jobs out there and there are things that you can do. The first and best thing that I recommend as a mental health expert is do one small thing. You know, I was unemployed when I was younger and I certainly just the way you described it you get discourage, you start to think nothings going to work, Im never going to get a job, that mindset is not conducive to getting a job and its conducive to being depressed and discouraged. So, I sat down and I wrote, you know, what have I aint done yet? Well, I didnt call this person that might have a lead on a job and I didnt update my resume in the last month. You know, I updated it a month ago but probably I can work on that. There were about when I got through with that list there were 12 small things, they werent going to get me a job directly but 12 small things I could do to get myself out of that rut, to get myself out of the discouragement to give myself something to do rather than sit around and worry about money and not having a job and be depress all day. So, small things rather than big things and you do one a day or one a morning or you get out and walk around the block if you havent gotten out of the house. Something small and youso, thats the doing thing and then theres not doing. Maybe you want to stop watching the news. News might not be too encouraging, so, either find some small thing to do or some small thing to stop doing that you know isnt helpful for you even though youre compelled to do it. Thats the first recommendation I have. Robert Now, so, what can happen when someone sense of self confidence sort of evaporates? When someones been unemployed for a year and theyve been out there, maybe the first six months they were out there every day

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Bill Yes. Robert they were networking, they were confident, and emails and now its almost this, you know, learn helplessness nothing they do seems to work. So, what can that do to their sense of self and their confidence? Bill Well, I think, therere two things and I think one is we become so identified with our jobs or our careers or the ability to make money and I remind people keep your perspective. You had self esteem and self worth and you were an okay person before you ever had a job. Remember you had a few years living your early life before you had a job, most people, remember that. Keep things in perspective. You know, I used to specialize in working with eating disorders. And I would get these women that would come in, mostly women, and they would say I was really good this week or I was really bad this week and I would say, ooh, you know, Im a therapist and Im kind of sensitive to this stuff. Can you just change your language a little and say, I did some things I was proud of this week. Or I did some things that I wasnt proud of or I was unhappy about. Separate what you do from who you are. I think thats one of the things to start to get yourself out of that rut if youre judging yourself I dont have a job so Im a loser and Im worthless thats pretty generalization but also equates all your worth with what you do rather than who you are. Robert I think that is absolutely what happens. This program is for both men and women I tend actually to get more emails from men, I think its probably because for guys their sort of self worth is tied to their net worth, its tied to what they do because as guys, you and I, we kind of feel this sense of responsibility like were supposed to provide for our family and maybe weve done that for years or decades and all of the sudden that job is gone. That sense of financial security has evaporated and now, were left with what am I going to do now? Bill Yeah. I think, well, you know, I think with women, you know, if youre a man think about a woman staying home as a homemaker and all of the sudden starting to feel
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worse and worse about herself like shes not worthless, shes not being valued very much because we do in this culture we value people who make money, success and especially in America, its a very success oriented, very money oriented culture but I think thats been the big, if you will, opportunity at this terrible financial crisis we had that people, you know, and Ive heard people say it and Im sure you have too, say, you know, after I hurricane happens, you know, Ive still got my family. Ive still got the people that Ive love. And theres some research in positive psychology that says, if you have relationships good positive social relationship, friends, family, you know, keep up your social networks because I think thats one of the things that happens when people get off work they lose of their social networks or they withdraw from people. So, keep up those positive social interactions and that can be other thing that can increase yourself worth, or keep yourself worth steady, I think, or at least not dropping so much. Keep up those social positive social relationships not the negative ones. Robert Thats a fantastic recommendation because I think youre absolutely right, if you have a job for a long time sure thats where you make your money but its also where you have your friendships and some discussions. And so all of the sudden, Monday morning rolls around and you dont have an office to go into, all of the sudden who are you talking to at that point, and then you feel a little bit badly. So, when your buddy calls maybe you dont want to hang out because youre feeling so badly about things. Bill You dont meet people after work for a drink or, you know, just go out for a walk during lunch with, you know, one of your colleagues you have to really work at keeping those positive social relationships. Robert And so, what you might recommend then is every week getting together with one or two of your close friends not necessarily for networking purposes but simply to establish or maybe re-establish that connection that you had.

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Bill Absolutely. And keep it up with your family because again if youre feeling, oh, Im not contributing everything or Im not worthwhile, Im such a loser, maybe you would even withdraw from your partner, your kids, you know, maybe youre sleeping a lot because youre feeling more depress so, make an effort and, you know, I know youre covering the physical on this but what weve discovered in recent times is that obviously the mind and the body and the emotions in the body are connected so, get out and walk. Move and get your brain moving you know as Robin Williams said when he was Mrs. Doubtfire, pump your cranium. You know, its not just pump your muscles its pumping your cranium to move it helps your brain stay alive and it helps your emotions stay a little more positive. So, keep that physical going as well as social. Robert And sometimes when someone loses their job especially for a prolong period its almost, you almost go to the grief process of its justits such a huge loss for somebody. Bill Yeah. Robert And I think maybe, sometimes, people can be so fixated on what was lost that they lose sight of what they still have. And so, Im wondering, what are some ways that people can think less about the past and what they once had and more toward what they currently have and maybe eventhe next step is what they would like differently in the future. Bill Well, you make two really good points. The first one is, theres a great book by Reynolds Price (who is no longer with us, I dont think), but it was an English professor who got severe cancer, became paralyzed, really his whole life change. And he wrote a wonderful book, he was a great writer, called A Whole New Life and he said, I struggled for years to get back to the old person I was, the previous person I was and I wish somebody had taken me by the shoulder and just look me in

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the eye and shaken me when I first got this terrible thing that happened to me and say, the old Reynolds Price is dead you have to find a new version of you. You have to find a whole new life. So, thats the first thing is, that old identity is no longer there that was wrapped up in your work, in your career, in what you did before its gone. Youve got to create a new identity and youve done it before you were a son and then you became a father, you know, you were a teenager then you became an adult. Youve gone through identity changes before its time for another one. Shed that old skin go to something new but what you say is really, really important. The second point you made is if you orient to the past and whats not there its easy to get discouraged and depressed and stuck. Orienting to the future which is something that human beings can do even in the darkest moments, Viktor Frankl who wrote a book called, Mans Search for Meaning has said, The freedom youve had nobody can take away the freedom is to choose to point of you. And if you focus on what you prefer in the future rather than whats missing in the past, eat your pride, lift your spirits a little and give you something to move tomorrow. Now, its not psychotic optimism where you say, everythings going to be great you already tried that at the beginning where you got laid off or when you lost your job. I mean to have something to look forward to. So, I love that you emphasize both getting a different perspective in the present and orienting to a more hopeful future. Robert And by the way, Man Search for Meaning, what an incredible book that [overlapping conversation] one of my favorite books of all time. Bill Absolutely. Robert Just fantastic and so, actually, thats a great recommendation for anyone whos feeling a little badly about themselves or their situation. You read that book and all of the sudden youre going to have a whole new appreciation for whatever it is youre going through. Bill I think thats right. And you know, and to a certain extent, you know, watching this terrible news that we watch or, you know, reading the news or hearing the news we

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can get kind of a distorted perspective but one of the things that positive psychology, again, this research on what works and what makes people better in life has been happening in the last 15 years or 20 years, they say that appreciating what you do have rather than focusing on what you dont have tends to increase your well being and your sense of satisfaction and your sense of happiness. So, take a few minutes, I had a guy that told me that he has a practice when he lost his job he noticed 25 things before breakfast that he could be grateful for. And I said, that sounds like it takes hours and he said, no. You know, when I go to the light switch and I turn it on the lights come on. You know, I have a glass of water. Im not thirsty. Im not living homeless, you know. I still have a house even though Im in foreclosure. You know, I go to the shower and Ive hot water. You know, these small things that we can be appreciative for. I have a friend who talks to me every day. Those small things if you can think of, you dont have to think of 25, but even three or four in the morning it sets the whole tone for the day as a tone of appreciation rather than resentment or frustration or depression. Robert Yeah. Now, thats a great tip as well is just being grateful for what you have can be small things like you flipping on the light switch like you mentioned or really big things like, wow, you know, Ive got my beautiful spouse, you know, laying next to me today and were in good health. Everything else kind of sucks but Bill Thats right. Robert Ive got my kids, Ive got my spouse. Bill Right. Robert Things arent quite as bad. And so, looking at the future can be very, very difficult for a lot of people when theyre in that ditch. And so, lets say I was your client. And I come to you and Ive been laid off maybe its been a year and half and Ive tried everything and I tell you, Bill, you know what Ive tried everything, Im at sort of the
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end. Im pretty hopeless. I dont think that my future is going to be better than my past. And Im really, really depress about that insight that what I once had was great and I just dont see myself having this better future. How can you help me Bill? Bill Well, you know, you and I have this shared interest an approach to therapy called solution oriented therapy and its approach focuses on peoples strengths and abilities but it also have a future orientation as we were talking earlier and one of the simple things that I would is say, lets imagine youve got a job. I know it seems unrealistic now and it may never happen but lets imagine youve got a job what else would change in your life? And theyd say, well, Id be probably, you know, feeling happier. Id be looking people in the eyes. Id be going out to exercising and running again because Ive been too depressed to run. And theyd give me a list of all the things that would happen once they got a job. You know, and not just financial things but emotional things that mostly and relational things thats mostly where were focusing on, Id say, is there any part of that you can start to do voluntarily right away? So, just getting them out of that rut of right now they dont have a job plus they have all these emotional, psychological relational things that arent going well that are part of being discouraged about not having a job, we want to get you, keep you in that mode so youre not dipping so deeply into that rut of depression or discouragement you dont take care of yourself and other ways because you stopped dressing, you know, everyday, look for a job because its ridiculous, you know. What youd be doing? Well, Id be getting dressed every day. Id be getting out of bed by eight oclock in the morning or seven oclock in the morning or whatever I got out of bed. I just want to bring some of that positive future into the present in a realistic way, not in again a psychotically optimistic way. Robert And so, that is a fantastic exercise sort of a miracle question asked. Bill Yes. Robert And so, if someones not working with you which I wish everyone could because

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Bill Well, thats nice. Robert But if they dont have that luxury, how can they do this by themselves? What would be the technique there? Bill You know, number one do some of the things we talked about. You can be your own, you know, one of the things that solution oriented therapy is you look at your strengths. What are you good at? Some people artistically creative, some people have great ability to connect with other people. Go with your strengths as theres been some research on that, the more you recognize and use your strengths. So, you can do a little on your own if you go beyond the pill or you can use your friends, again, your social connections to help you get a perspective or get moving or get out of your rut or feel a little better or little more hope. But if you get so discourage its a good idea to go get some professional help. You know, there are clinics that will do it for reduced fees or sliding scales. There some clinics that are associated with universities or sometimes do it for $5 or $10 per sessions. You can go to self help groups. You can go to, you know, job supports or groups. Get yourself out of that rut. Go get some professional help or some self help and read a book. Go to the library and get out some books and start to fill your mind with things that Viktor Frankls Man Search for Meaning which is a little different and you know, again, the reason research is called Brain Plasticity, that is, you can change your brain at any time, thats the good news. The bad news is if you get into the groove of thinking in a certain way, behaving in a certain way and interacting in a certain way, its easy to stay stuck in that groove. It takes a little effort to jump out of the groove and shift your gears to get into more positive frame of mind or more forward moving kind of actions. Robert Yeah, actually, just listened to a book called, The Biology of Belief by Bill Yeah, Bruce Lipton.

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Robert Bruce Lipton. Exactly. And what a fascinating book that was. And one of the quotes that I remembered in there is that we used to think, all these experts, we use to think that our genes determined our life. Bill Right. Robert But it turns out that our life determines our genes and its the exact same concept that were talking about that once we start thinking in certain way and almost develop that rut, like you said, in the brain we develop these pathways and we re-enforce them over and over and over. And so, we got to, as your book points out, do one thing different to sort of break, jump the tracks. Jumps [overlapping conversation] Bill And thats what this whole series is about. People, you know, I think people, who are listening to this or reading this, sure watching this, should give themselves a little credit. You did one thing different. You didnt just sit on the couch and think its hopeless; I cant get a job nothings going to change. You took a little action and said, let me give this thing a chance and see if theres anything here that and hopefully something that you say that one of your guest say or one of the experts say well make a little bit of difference. So youre doing something, give yourself some credit the way you kind of get lost is if you stop doing anything that can possibly make a difference. Not everything youll do will work but youve got to start doing something. Thinking differently, doing something differently, relating differently, physically doing something different, you know, getting up and moving any of that stuff might make a difference so try what you can and wait for something to work. Robert And so, your book, one of your 33 books, really, really great. What I think is applicable here is its called, Do One Thing Different: Ten Simple Ways to Change Your Life. And really, the take away from that is if youre stuck, if youre not really happy with whatever the situation is, whether its relationship, your job or in life, that you can continue doing exactly the same that youve been doing but you probably

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get the same results. So, your concept is do one thing different and whats great is that the name of the book is not doing one right thing different or Bill No. Robert or do one exceptional thing different its just do something anything different. Bill Right. Life is an experiment and the experiments youve been doing recently if its not working try a different experiment. I think thats right, Ive heard a Native American saying a while ago from the Dakota tribe that said, when you discover youre riding a dead horse the best strategy is to dismount. So, do something different, stop doing what youve been doing that hasnt been working and try something new because thats sort of a trap that everything falls into partly because of this brain grooving that will happens but partly because we get a little righteous. We decide or what we think is the right way to think the way were seeing it is true and we realize as you go through life, well, that was my point of view at that point but maybe there was another point of view that was equally valid or better and so, what were suggesting in this whole program I think what youre up to in this whole program is giving people a new perspective and some new options. So, just get into life as an experiment rather than life as already settled, life as an ongoing experiment till youre off the planet. Robert And I really like how you complimented the listeners and the audience here because youre right, the mere fact that they are participating with us means that they are doing something different. Something they did today was different in order for them to get to this point. And so they should be complimented for that. The other thing that we talked about was the importance of maintaining relationships whether its with friends, family and Im wondering though if there could be a dark side to that because lets say I got laid off and a few of my buddies got laid off and at first we were working together optimistic, helping each other and I dont know, maybe the last few months we kind of get together we drink a couple of beers and

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we just kind of lament about how everything sucks and how this justthe economys terrible and, you know, the politician theyre looking to get us and we kind of start feeding this negativity, can you see that happening? Bill Yes, definitely. Thats why I mentioned earlier the positive social relationships. It doesnt mean that every moment has to be wonderful but heres my quick, you know, read on this or quick meter that I have within myself and I suggest to my clients and that is if you spent time with a person on a regular basis and you leave drain or feeling worse, feeling angrier feeling worse, and thats your typical experience and I reduce the amount of time spent with that person and you know there are other people you just have a conversation with them, they get you to laugh, they can get you new perspective, they can give you some validation or support, they can give you some sense of hope or energy. When you leave them or the conversation so the interactions you have with them or do you feel a little more positive, a little more energy, a little more hope; spend a little more time with those people during this difficult time for you. Youve got to be really careful its like eating the right foods or not drinking too much alcohol. You have to be really careful of your inputs at this point because youre vulnerable because you could have a tendency to get too discourage or depressed or drink too much or develop some of those not helpful habits same things socially. There can be relationships that arent so great for you. Not in the long run but when youre stronger, when youre doing better you can go back to those relationships but maybe distance them a little for now if theyre negative social relationships. Robert Great, great point. About a year ago I wrote a column called something about when you should break up with your mother? And its this concept therere really two types of people in the world, I think, that there are those that are assets to you that when youre around them theyre optimistic, theyre supportive, they care about you, you feel good, they give you energy. And then of course there is everyone else when youre around them you feel just less then, theyre pessimistic, theyre negative, you just feel badly. And especially as, like you identified, when youre struggling in a period like this its even more critical to sort of ditch the liabilities in your life maybe temporarily and maybe forever and really just focus on those

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handful of key relationships where you feel good and where they support you because thats just so important right now. Bill Well, yeah, and I think theres an old country song that says lifes too long for that, you know, its not only too short but its too long for that. youre going to be hanging out with these people for a long time and obviously were talking about in balance there maybe a day thats off or its not so great in a relationship but if its an ongoing negative relationship probably yes, either get some distance for now or maybe for good. Robert Yeah. And you mentioned earlier that if you get to the point where, I dont know, maybe youre sort of you feel like youre at the end of the rope that you should seek some more professional assistance. Bill Yes. Robert You start with books and your friends but at what point would you say, you know what, pick up that phone maybe schedule a meeting with somebody. Bill Right. Or have somebody else pick up the phone. Sometimes when youre so depressed picking up the phone seems daunting, talking to somebody new seems daunting so, use that social network and get somebody else to call for you. Make an appointment get your buns off that couch or out of the bed and get there and thats really typically the time when youre just not getting out of bed, youre not getting out the couch, youre not doing and youre feeling its not just a temporary discouragement blues, you really have soaked into, you know, more of a clinical depression. Your appetite changed. Your eating is changed radically. Youre just not doing well and youre not getting out of that rut its a good idea to seek something. Again, you can callI used to work as suicide crisis line and people would call up not just with suicidal crisis but with depressed crises and wed steered them to the right resources and those things are free, they have them in almost every
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community. You can call for help; you can call the emergency hotline and say Im in desperate shape I need some help. And just making that one step may again start to pull you out of that deep, deep, deep rut that youre getting into and get some help if you need to. If you cant do it on your own or with your friends or social network, go get some professional help its out there, itll make the difference. The longer you spent in it, the worse it gets so, get yourself out of it as soon as you can and if you know youre really seriously depressed. Robert And as you mentioned earlier, a lot of these resources are very, very low cost if not free. Theres a local community health center in my area that I actually volunteer at and for most people its free, its a sliding scale sometimes its $5 a session. And, you know, well, well, worth it. This is an investment in really your life so, well, well worth checking out. And, you know, I guess I would be remissed if I didnt say, if someones listening to this program and its in their feeling a sense of desperation or are hurting themselves, what should they do at that point? Call the suicide hotline? Bill Yeah, absolutely. Well, talk to somebody new. You know, again, its that withdrawal thing thats a dangerous sign. Talk to somebody near you, let them know whats really going on with you in the most honest way you can, you know, theres no shame in that. Thats, you know, I think what change us. When I was a younger person I used to be such a stigma, oh no, youre depress or oh no you went to, you know, if youre going to see a psychiatrist you should just have your head examined that was sort of the attitude now theres so much more acceptance. Its in the movies, on TV; your friends have gone so go get help. Theres nothing to be ashamed about. Its just support while youre going through this difficult period, so, yes, reach out suicide hotline, call a mental health center, call a local health center, talk to your friends, talk to people that you know that know somebody who have been to therapy, get a recommendation and go get some help. Robert And really the only reason that we are speaking today is because I got an email from a gentlemen who was suicidal and not when he emailed me he said it had been about a month but he was at the point where he was suicidal. He had been unemployed for about a year and a half and he got some help, thankfully. But he

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shared with me with this very long email his story and just how bad it got for him. And after reading that I thought he is not alone out there. Maybe its not to the same level that he experienced for everyone but there is this general sense of hopelessness for a lot of people. Bill Well, I agree. When I used to work on suicide crisis line, people would call and they would only see one option or two options. Be miserable like I am or have it be worse or die. And we made a breakthrough on the telephone because we usually would when they see at least a third option. I joke with them at a certain point when I had a little bit of a relationship with them and say well you can always have a banana boat to Brazil I mean, you know, give up this life here and they would laugh, and I say, no, Im not talking about hopping a banana boat to Brazil lets come up with a third option thats different from stay miserable or kill yourself. Theres almost always a third option for almost everybody. Go get some help but realize youre stuck in a kind of a narrow perspective and dont end your life over this. Its not worth ending your life over this stuff. Robert Thats third option. That is quite profound Ive never really thought of that before when someones at that level where its either be miserable or end it all. And wow, theres always a third option. Bill Yeah. Thats a start choice. And, you know, I think thats a perspective that they get into when they get so discouraged. And 24 hours later theyll probably remember something else or think of something else or if they have a conversation with somebody else theyll realize theres a slightly different perspective you could just so narrowed down it seems like those arent your only two choices. So, yeah, thats probably a distorted point of view, please dont go with that, usually thats suicidal stuff will pass in a short time if you get some help, if you talk to somebody if you get through those desperate moments. Robert One of the ideas that Ive actually interviewed Professor Jeffrey Pfeffer about is this idea of faking it until you make it. And this concept if you dont feel confident if you

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dont feel like you have this real strong sense of self esteem are there things that you can do to kind of pretend that you have confidence. Bill Oh, yeah, the old psychology said you have to go inside and work on your inside and you feelings and your childhood and all that stuff. Robert Yeah, right. Bill You can go out and do it but new style psychology said do it and then the feeling will follow. Robert Yes. Bill So you do a more positive thing and you might feel more positive feeling. So, I think they go together. Obviously, the insides affect the outside and the outside affect the insides but because youre not feeling so good right now its extra important to go do something that might help you feel better. Robert Yeah, and one of the things you talked about is a recent study in that, you know, two groups of people randomly selected. One group they were told to sort of move their bodies in a depress way and the other group they were told to stand straight and put their shoulders back and to look people in the eye and to put their head up and as you suggested, people who were pretending to be confident felt more confident. The other piece that Ive add and it goes back to this whole biology of belief that we talked about is that they tested the blood of both sort of groups. And the group that simply pretended that they were more confident in their blood work shows that they have much less cortisol which is the stress hormone, and that it actually just by moving differently change their biology.

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Bill I think thats great. That, you know, and again, thats something we sort of new intuitively but its great to have that scientific support for it thats what Robert and I have been talking about this whole conversation is, get, you know, shift your mind, shift your actions, shift you interactions and I call it, you know, change the doing, change the viewing and change the context. If youre thinking about doesnt work, shift the viewing, shift the point of view, and shift your perspective. If what you doing isnt working to get you the results, shift the doing, change the doing, change the interactions, change your actions. And if youre in a context thats not so good youre sitting around in the couch all the time get out the house, do something different. Go some place. Be around different people. Take a different route, you know, when you go to the unemployment office or whatever it may be. Do something different. Change your context or change the doing, change the viewing, change the context. If you change any of those things in the small way were talking about, baby steps bob or Robert, baby steps Robert and, you know, then you might get out of that negative groove and that discourage you. Robert And so, lets say optimistically, someone listens to this whole program and feeling a little bit better, maybe not great but theyre feeling a little bit better and they get a call back on an interview. And what are some things that they can do to project this sense of confidence or to feel better when they go in? Bill Right. I think what Professor Pfeffer said was great and that was act as if, what would you do if you were in the prime of your career and doing really well? How would you dress? How would you do your hair? How would you walk? How would you stand? What time would you get there? What would you do to prepare? You know, put yourself in that as if mind frame. I think thats great because right now youre not in that mind frame thinking, oh, theyre not going to hire me or maybe they wont hire me or Im not good enough. Put yourself in other frame of mind and physically see if you can get yourself there. Dress that way and think that way and put your body in that position if you can. It might make a difference. We dont mean, you know, pretend fake, you know, that you dontyoure not really that. I mean put yourself in that as if I were framework. I think thats a great phrase.

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Robert Yeah, and I mean, one of the things that I just love about solution oriented therapy is that it doesnt really focus so much on what the problem is. It sort of jumps the wall so youve got problem, youve got the wall and youve got the solution on the other side and it jumps over the wall. Now, youre living in sort of solutionville. And its like Bill I think thats right. Robert Yeah. Its like whatif you were in solution land what would be different? And exactly what youre talking about, you know Bill Because I think we get hypnotized by problems. Problems tell us certain things about ourselves and they get us to focus on certain things. What isnt working? Whats wrong with this? How thing will never work? And I agree, if you can jump over that wall even for a brief time, all of the sudden you see things you never saw. You see resources, abilities, strengths, all that stuff, if you can make that small shift in perspective that as if, a lot of other things can follow thats great. Robert Okay. So, tough question here, lets say someone skip everything else and now they just come on the line here. And so, I want to provide them some kind of actionable summary that they can say okay, I can do this. Ive heard a lot and Ive learned a lot but like you say, what is that baby step? What is that one next thing that I should do? Bill Here it is, very simply. If what youre doing isnt working, do something different and that means think something different, view something differently, get yourself out of the different context or take some different actions or interactively. Take small steps, dont try to overwhelm yourself. Dont try to do everything you want. You know, just one small thing you can do today, this morning, this hour, and this minute. Whats one small thing and if youre lying in bed depressed and youre focused on

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youll never going to get a job shift your perspective and think of something else. Thing of what youre grateful for, the small things youre grateful for, think of what you could do rather than what you cant do. Think of who youre going to be rather than who used to be that you cant get back to. Thats as simple [overlapping conversation] Robert Love that. Love that. And so, let me play devils advocate just for a moment because I know, I know people are thinking this. And that is, Im kind of hopeless right now I dont think my futures going to be any better. Tell me why is that wrong? Why can my future be better than it is right this moment? Bill Oh, yes, thats right. Only God knows whats the future is. Youre playing god in your own like you say; I know its never going to be any better. The best thing, Robert that I can tell you right now is you dont know what your futures going to be. But you might have it a chance to influence that future but if you keep thinking its going to be terrible and nothings going to happen you wont do anything to make that better future. So, no guarantee if you get out of bed and try something and do something different your future would be better but we can almost guarantee if you stand bad, you know, loss in that self pity and lost in that negative rut, probably the future is going to be much like today. So, get out of there and do something, get of off the couch and do something, keep your social relationships going and shift in any small way you can. Dont put too much pressure on yourself. Dont try and take too big a leap but take a small baby step baby step. Robert Fantastic advice. Hang out with friends, be grateful for what you have, think of a few things every day that you really, really would desperately missed if they werent in your life. And some great book we have talked about certainly Viktor Frankls Man Search for Meaning, your own book which I would highly recommend its called, Do One Thing Different: Ten Simple Ways to Change Your Life. And you also have a really cool website with a lot of information. And Im going to tell people what that is: its www.billohanlon.com. So its Bill, B~I~L~L O~H~A~N~L~O~N.com and you also do quite a few webinars and teleseminars and you are, from what I gather, I havent had the privileged to hear you but supposed to be one amazing public speaker.

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Bill Thank you. I was a shy person; this is why Im such an optimist for the future. I was a shy person who didnt like to speak in front of people and I got so passionate about these stuff that weve been talking about today that I overcame my fears and became a public speaker and I love it, I love it, I love it, I love it. And so, yes, I got a little better over the years and less gastrointestinal symptoms when I stand in the live crowd. Its great. Its great. Robert I like how you said less and not none. Thats, yeah, thats so true. So people go to your website, they can see, you know, what youre going to be doing. Maybe some [overlapping conversation] Bill Yeah, I travelled around and, you know, I write books probably one or two a year these days so they can find out what Im up to. Occasionally, I do free teleseminars and things like that. Robert This has been absolutely fantastic, Bill. I really, really appreciate your time, your insight, I mean; you are a master at this whole solution oriented sort of paradigm. Its a whole new way of looking at life and more importantly at how to change. Bill Yeah, were the mirror image of Freud. We dont go back to your childhood, we figure out whats happening right now, where you want to go and find the strengths and the abilities to get there. So, I hope some people explore that if theyre stuck. I mean theres value to that Freudian kind of stuff and therere value to this stuff. Robert Right. Well, thank you again Bill. Again, your website is www.billohanlon.com one of

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the 33 books is Do One Thing Different absolutely check it out. Thank you again Bill. Bill Thanks.

Join Robert Pagliarini, Best-Selling Author, Entrepreneur, Wealth Creator, and TV Commentator as he has compelling conversations with experts that drive more money, motivation, and meaning into your life, at www.RicherLife.com.

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About Bill OHanlon

Bill OHanlon is a psychotherapist who was a developer of Solution-Oriented Therapy and a founder of Possibility and Inclusive Therapies. His clinical work is recognized for its collaborative respectful approach to clients. He is known for his storytelling, irreverent humor, clear and accessible presentation style and his psychotic enthusiasm for whatever he is doing. Bill began his professional career in 1975 as a hippie transpersonal counselor at the A.R.E. (Edgar Cayce) Clinic in Phoenix, Arizona. Earlier he ran growth groups and taught seminars at the Phoenix growth center Sentheon. Deciding he really ought to know something more about what he was doing, he studied Neuro-Linguistic Programming (before they even had a name for it) and ultimately went back to school and became a marriage and family therapist. During graduate school he studied with the eccentric and creative psychiatrist Milton Erickson and became Erickson's gardener (he was Dr. Erickson's only work/study student). He was so confused and impressed by Dr. Erickson's work, he felt compelled to spend the next several years of his career writing and teaching in an effort to make Erickson's approach more understandable and accessible. Bill then moved on to develop his own method, the SolutionOriented Approach, a brief approach to change focused on identifying and using strengths to reach goals and overcome challenges. It has been applied with individuals, couples, families and organizations. Bill has now authored or co-authored 30 books. Always looking for a challenge, Bill now brings his ideas to a wider audience. In 1999, he appeared on Oprah with his

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book, Do One Thing Different: Ten Simple Ways to Change Your Life. He has also appeared on The Today Show, Canada AM, and Body By Jake. His work has been featured in O Oprah's magazine, Ladies Home Journal, New Woman, Newsweek, Bottom Line, Self, Women's Health and The Psychotherapy Networker.

Bill OHanlon on Facebook

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About Richer Life Insights

Richer Life Insights is a community of passionate people who want to learn and achieve more in life and at work. Members of Richer Life Insights include entrepreneurs, business owners, and others who are focused on creating and living a better life. Its an online destination members can easily plug into that provides them with easy to implement advice that can radically change their life. You can participate in conversations I have with an experts, celebrities, authors, and thought leaders that is laser-focused on practical ways to drive more money, motivation, and meaning into your life. We are acutely aware of information overload. While there is certainly no shortage of informationeven good informationthere doesnt exist a system (until now!) that you can easily plug into that provides you with easy to implement advice that can radically change your life. If you want to take your life and finances to the next level and want to have some fun in the process, become a member now.

About Robert Pagliarini

Best-Selling Author | Entrepreneur | Wealth Creator | TV Commentator Robert Pagliarini is a man on a mission. He is obsessed with improvement, making the most of his time and energy, and creating. Hes also obsessed with inspiring others to create and empowering them to live life to the fullest by radically changing the way they invest their time and energy. Robert Pagliarini is the founder of Richer Life Media, LLC and runs Richer Life Insights. In addition to being the author of the national bestseller The Six Day Financial

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Makeover, Plan Z: How to Survive the 2009 Financial Crisis (and even live a little better), and The Other 8 Hours: Maximize Your Free Time to Create New Wealth & Purpose, he writes a personal development column for CBS that is syndicated to newspapers (e.g., Chicago Tribune, LA Times, Orange County Register) and popular online websites including the Huffington Post and many others. Robert has also had multiple appearances on Good Morning America as well as Dr. Phil, 20/20, ABC News and others. For future appearances, Robert will be identified as the founder of Richer Life Insights. Robert is the president of Pacifica Wealth Advisors, Inc., a boutique wealth management firm specializing in sudden money recipients. He is a Certified Financial Planner, has a masters degree in financial services, and is currently completing a master's degree in counseling psychology. When not working, Robert enjoys going to Disneyland with his wife and young daughter, attending Saddleback Church, and running a non-profit he co-founded called the Band of Brothers Foundation that helps impoverished kids around the world.

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For More Information

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Getting Back to Normal

a conversation with Bill OHanlon