theSun | THURSDAY MAY 14 2009
INTERVIEWS VIEWS
Which means only about 30%
of the members are active?
Actually much less. We have 36
committees involved in human
rights issues, practice areas
(bread and butter issues), and
public interest areas. Of this, 80-
90% cover practice areas.
The participation in human
rights and public interest issues
is small, but because of the
public positions we have taken
and the exposure in the media,
many people only see that aspect
of the Bar. If we were to issue
statements on the practice areas
or the judiciary, this will rarely
be carried. But the idea, at the
end of the day, is not to build our
profile but to continue the work
we have already started.
At the end of the day, we deal
with bread and butter issues of
the profession, we run the most
comprehensive professional
indemnity insurance in the
Asia-Pacific, we have a strong
continuing legal education pro-
gramme, compensation fund,
legal aid, practice… 80% of the
work we do is in practice areas
for the members.
M than 60 years old. Organisation
Lawyers have often com-
plained about problems with
the tracking system imple-
mented at the courts in Kuala
Lumpur. Is the Bar working
towards a solution?
To be fair to the judiciary, Chief
Justice, Tan Sri Zaki Azmi, has
many consultations with us. The
main reason why the tracking
system was brought in was
that there were complaints that
Kuala Lumpur which had 20
judges did not have a tracking
system for managing a case.
Case management varied be-
tween the 20 judges. There was
a huge difference in perform-
ance. If you’re lucky and get
into a court with a hardworking
judge, your matter gets cleared.
If you’re unlucky you get a hear-
ing date in 2015.
So the main reason why this
tracking system was brought in
was to make it uniform for eve-
rybody, but that does not mean
that the system does not have its
own problems.
But these are issues that can
be resolved by tweaking the
system. Because it’s a “new”
system, it needs a settling down
period and the courts have
given it six months to one year
to see whether it works. The
cases are now managed and
monitored centrally so we hope
to see more effective disposal of
cases and hope the issues will
be resolved soon.
At the AGM on March 14,
there was a lot of talk for us to
take on this matter, so we organ-
ised a forum but only 18 people
turned up. Lawyers have to be
a little bit more pro-active and
inform the Bar and state Bars.
Zaki has been responsive
to the issues we have brought
up. The only problem we have
is when they ask – where is the
problem? Which issue? Can you
give me a file number?
And that’s when you need the
input from members.
Yes, tell us what the file number
is, tell us which registrar is giv-
ing you problems, tell us which
court, then it can be taken up
to the relevant authorities. But
if you don’t give us particulars
how do we respond?
With the tracking system, the
common experience is that the
decision is fast but the court’s
clerical staff cannot cope; so at
the end of the day, the imple-
mentation of the decision takes
just as long or even longer.
The biggest problem is a change
13
in mindset of the staff of the working relationship with the like reducing bumiputra equity, The court order for people to stay
judiciary. You must understand Najib administration? especially in this climate where away from the state secretariat
that this is the first time they are We have met Nazri (minister we have to be more competi- seems to be an attempt again
being pushed to work hard. So in the Prime Minister’s Depart- tive. to stop people from exercising
there are also many who are ment, in charge of law) but their right to assemble. We view
rebelling against these changes not the prime minister himself The arrest of journalism lec- this as unnecessary and counter
and are entrenched in their yet. From what the PM is turer Wong Chin Huat under productive. The government
ways. So that is why it is impor- saying, it seems he understands But I the ISA for sedition for what must accept dissent as a legiti-
tant to identify who these people and articulates the problems he said on the 1BlackMalay- mate form of expression and ac-
are so we can take it up with the well. But I don’t know if he will think the sia campaign. What is the ceptable as democratic norms.
authorities.
The CJ has asked us for de-
be able to solve problems which
are entrenched values within
position of significance of this? (Wong
has since been released)
As much as it is unpalatable, it
must not be silenced but coun-
tails, so that he can investigate. the old structure. the Bar on This arrest is an act of intimida- tered with reforms and concrete
But if we say everything in It was so entrenched that Ab- tion and seems to follow through changes.
general terms, then when he dullah couldn’t break through the Perak from the charging of Karpal
goes down they will tell him
“everything is fine” but if you
the walls that were being put
up. Najib has to be much more
controversy Singh for sedition as well. We
view these as attempts to cow
On the arrest of five lawyers
sent by the Kuala Lumpur
can give particulars, then he can persistent and stronger to push is clear; and intimidate the public to Legal Aid Centre to assist 14
act on it. forward his values. He has refrain from expressing their people arrested for taking
The problem is also that to break down the walls and that there views. part in a vigil, how do you
when you bring about changes,
not everybody will be happy.
breaking down the walls means
understanding. He uses the word
should The police obtained a court
handle this? (The lawyers
have since been released)
Which means you will have to ‘respect’ rather than ‘tolerance’ be re- order to prevent gatherings The arrests of the lawyers were
work harder. So there will be which is a huge difference from within a 500m radius of the unacceptable and an affront to
people who break down and the past, which is great. election.” state assembly in Ipoh on the rule of law and go against
try to create problems for the He has to engage civil society May 7. What does this mean all norms of the criminal justice
system. So this is what is hap- and various groups to resolve the for the right to assemble system. We have called for an
pening to certain parts of the crisis and make tough choices peacefully? EGM to discuss this matter.
judiciary.
You must also understand
that the system we have is an
archaic system which is more
is not there, the structure, the fil-
ing system, the court documents
… there must be a comprehen-
sive reform and review of all
these changes.
Wasn’t there a directive from
the former CJ to dispose all
cases within a certain period?
Those were old cases, but judges
are human beings and they have
to be monitored too. You can’t
just say I’m king of the court and I
decide on everything. They must
be fair to the litigants. In Kuala
Lumpur, dates have been given
in 2015. Now with the tracking
system, cases are being heard in
three months. This shows that
it can be done, and it means the
judges have to work harder.
But it does not make sense
for a judge (to adopt the attitude)
“I can sit and delay my case and
still get the same salary and don’t
get punished”; so now there has
to be some element of perform-
ance and accountability.
I think for the first time in
many years, the CJ is pushing
judges hard. It’s not perfect;
there are times when justice
may suffer. Issues can be
overcome but there will be no
overnight changes.
Do you blame your predeces-
sors?
No, I think the problem began
in 1988, during the Mahathir
era. We paid a heavy price for
neglecting the judiciary, heavy
price in terms of foreign invest-
ment, public confidence, inves-
tor confidence and only in the
last three to four years has the
government come out openly to
admit that we need to reform the
judiciary, that we have suffered,
that the judiciary is not work-
ing.
For 20 years, we ignored
this problem, the government
ignored this problem. The con-
dition, the morale, the invest-
ments were very low in terms
of the judiciary, appointments
were bad, and there was no re-
gard for individuals of standing
in society to be appointed.
What has happened (is that),
as lawyers when we deal with
foreign investors, the first thing
they say is “I don’t want the dis-
pute to be resolved in Malaysia,
I don’t trust your judges.”
This is the price you pay for
20 years of neglect and now we
have to re-work, reform and
recharge. Much more needs to
be done.
How do you see the Bar’s