No. 82456-F Smith Sammons Depo 090716

1
1 CAUSE NO. 82456-F

2 IN THE INTEREST OF ) IN THE DISTRICT COURT
)
3 RYAN SMITH, JR., ) 300TH JUDICIAL DISTRICT
)
4 A CHILD ) BRAZORIA COUNTY, TEXAS
5
6
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7
ORAL DEPOSITION
8 OF
STEPHANIE SAMMONS
9 September 7, 2016
Volume 1
10
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11
12
13 ORAL DEPOSITION OF STEPHANIE SAMMONS, produced as a

14 witness at the instance of the Respondent, Ryan Smith,
15 Sr., and duly sworn, was taken in the above-styled
16 and numbered cause on the 7th of September, 2016, from
17 1:05 p.m. to 2:43 p.m. before Minnie Cadena, CSR, RPR,
18 RMR, in and for the State of Texas, reported by
19 stenographic method, at the offices of the Brazoria
20 County District Attorney's Office, 111 E. Locust, 5th
21 Floor, Angleton, Texas 77515, pursuant to the Texas Rules
22 of Civil Procedure and the provisions stated on the
23 record or attached hereto.
24
25
MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

(979) 864-1605
2
1 A P P E A R A N C E S:
2
3 FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF FAMILY AND PROTECTIVE SERVICES:

Mr. Trung Tran
4 and
Ms. Lauren Menia
5 Brazoria County District Attorney's Office
111 E. Locust, 5th Floor
6 Angleton, Texas 77515
979-864-1233
7
FOR RESPONDENT RYAN SMITH, SR.:
8 Mr. Shane Kersh
Alston Kersh
9 3355 W. Alabama, Suite 950
Houston, Texas 77098
10 713-980-5291
Shane@alstonkershlaw.com
11
FOR RESPONDENT ASHLEY ERICKSON-SMITH:
12 Ms. Christian Landry
Landry Law Office
13 1110 Nasa Parkway, Suite 315
Houston, Texas 77586
14 281-935-6941
Christian@clandrylaw.com
15
ALSO PRESENT:
16 Ryan Smith, Sr.
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18
19
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23
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25

(979) 864-1605
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1 INDEX
2 Page
3 Appearances 2
Stipulations 4
4 Testimony of STEPHANIE SAMMONS
By Mr. Kersh 4
5 By Mr. Landry 36
FURTHER EXAMINATION
6 By Mr. Kersh 49
Witness' Signature Page 51-52
7 Reporter's Certificate Pages 53-55
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(979) 864-1605
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1 THE COURT REPORTER: This is pursuant to
2 the Rules, and will the witness read and sign her
3 deposition?
4 MR. KERSH: We need her to read and sign.
5 STEPHANIE SAMMONS, 01:05
6 having been first duly sworn, testified as follows:

7 DIRECT EXAMINATION
8 BY MR. KERSH:
9 Q. Would you state your name for the record,
10 please? 01:05
11 A. Stephanie Sammons.
12 Q. And Ms. Sammons, where are you employed?
13 A. With the Texas Department of Family and
14 Protective Services.
15 Q. And are you familiar with the case causing this 01:05
16 deposition today?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. Now, has anything happened today that would
19 cause you to have any difficulty remembering the facts of
20 this case? 01:06
21 A. No.
22 Q. And as I ask you questions, if there is
23 something that you don't understand or that I need to
24 repeat, will you make sure that you ask me to repeat that
25 question so that you fully understand it? 01:06

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1 A. Yes, sir.
2 Q. And if you don't ask me to repeat it, then it
3 will be understood that you fully understood my question
4 and answered it truthfully to the best of your knowledge,
5 correct? 01:06
6 A. Yes, sir.
7 Q. Has anyone instructed you to not answer my
8 questions truthfully or honestly, to the best of your
9 ability?
10 A. No. 01:06
11 Q. And is there any reason why you would not

12 answer my questions truthfully and honestly, to the best
13 of your ability today?
14 A. No, sir.
15 Q. What's your position with the department? 01:06
16 A. I'm a supervisor over workers who are

17 responsible for children and conservatorship.
18 Q. And in particular with this case and
19 particularly with my client, Ryan Smith, have you pretty
20 much been the lead on this case with regard to the 01:06
21 department?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Have there been caseworkers under you that have
24 worked on this case?
25 A. Yes. 01:07

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1 Q. And who are those?
2 A. Initially, the first caseworker was Gracie
3 Pequeno. She had it for a few months and then she left
4 the agency and then now it's Tammy Goodall.
5 Q. Have you been on this case since the start? 01:07
6 A. I was on medical leave June, July and probably

7 half of August. So, the case, when it came into effect
8 here, had already started. So, I became familiar with it
9 in the middle of August.
10 Q. Now, with regard to handling this case, would 01:07
11 you say that you are the person with the most knowledge
12 and experience with the on goings of this case?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. From the department's perspective?
15 A. I've had the most contact with the parents. 01:08
16 Q. Specifically, when did you come in contact with

17 the parents?
18 A. Probably in September of 2015. Probably
19 towards the end of September.
20 Q. Okay. What caused you to come in contact with 01:08
21 the parents?
22 A. Ms. Pequeno was out on leave for a few weeks.
23 So, I was handling setting up the visits, things for her;
24 and then when she returned, she gave her notice. So, in
25 the meantime of it transitioning, I just kind of handled 01:08

(979) 864-1605
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1 the cases, was setting up visits for her cases. So, this
2 one just fell into that category.
3 Q. Okay. And when was the first case with regard
4 to Ryan Smith? When did that happen?
5 A. That would be in December of 2014. I'm sorry. 01:09
6 Are you talking about Ryan Smith, the baby?

7 Q. Yes.
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. And what happened with that?
10 A. There was an investigation for physical 01:09
11 neglect, and they opened it up for family-based services.

12 Q. Do you know the cause number of that?
13 A. No, sir.
14 Q. Now, there has been two -- there has been
15 essentially two lawsuits with regard to Ryan Smith, Jr.; 01:09
16 is that correct?
17 A. That's what I understand, yes.
18 Q. And this first one that you're speaking of was
19 actually nonsuited by the department?
20 A. The first time they sought custody, yes. 01:10
21 Q. Okay. And do you know when that nonsuit took

22 place?
23 A. Not without looking at it, no, sir. I believe
24 I was out on leave at that time.
25 Q. Okay. 01:10

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1 A. I wouldn't have had knowledge.
2 Q. When was the second -- when was the second
3 lawsuit brought by the department?
4 A. Again, that would have been when I was on
5 leave; and I don't -- I don't believe I have that date. 01:10
6 Q. Do you have an approximate time frame?

7 A. July, 2015.
8 Q. And what led to that -- what led to that
9 lawsuit being filed by the department?
10 A. I believe that the parents were noncompliant 01:10
11 with their services; and if I'm not mistaken, it was at

12 that time that Ashley, the mother, had asked Jaimie, the
13 family-base worker, to bring Ryan into foster care.
14 Q. And then what happened?
15 A. At the second hearing? 01:11
16 Q. Yes.
17 A. It's my understanding that the judge ordered
18 that we would have TMC, but the baby was placed with the
19 parents at the grandfather's house.
20 Q. When you say "grandfather's house," whose 01:11
21 grandfather is that?
22 A. It's Ashley's grandfather.
23 Q. Ashley Smith?
24 A. Yes, Mr. Stephen Erickson is his name.
25 Q. And were there problems with that placement? 01:12

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1 A. Yes.
2 Q. So, this lawsuit that was reopened in 2015,
3 let's talk about that a little bit.
4 So, you said that it's your belief that the
5 reason that was brought is because the parents were 01:12
6 noncompliant and Mom made a self-request that the child

7 be placed into foster care?
8 A. I believe so, yes.
9 Q. What services were they noncompliant with in
10 July of 2015? 01:12
11 A. To be exactly sure, I would have to go back and

12 look at the notes of that family-based case. Again, I
13 was not present for that hearing. I wasn't even working
14 at that time.
15 Q. So, you wouldn't know the circumstances 01:12
16 surrounding why the child was actually removed?

17 A. The specific services, not without looking at
18 the notes right this second.
19 Q. Were they your notes?
20 A. No, sir. 01:13
21 Q. Whose notes were they?

22 A. They would have been Jaimie Taylor's. She was
23 the family-based worker at that time.
24 Q. Where is Jaimie at today?
25 A. She is still employed with us. 01:13

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1 Q. Here in Angleton?
2 A. No, she is in Pearland.
3 Q. Pearland. Okay.
4 So, at the time of the removal in
5 July, 2015, specifically, what issues did this child have 01:13
6 or was having medically?

7 And I say "child," I mean Ryan Smith, Jr.
8 A. At the time, I remember that he was diagnosed
9 "failure to thrive"; and he was being seen by several
10 doctors in regards to some eye issues as well as a hernia 01:14
11 that needed to be repaired.

12 Q. Now, there is an issue -- or there is a gap
13 between December, 2014, and July, 2015. Part of that gap
14 is that the child and the parents were living with the
15 maternal grandfather. 01:15
16 Where was the child the rest of the time

17 between December, 2014, and July, 2015?
18 A. He was in a voluntarily placement with Audra
19 Parsons. Let me see if I have that date. I believe it
20 was around the very first of January of 2015. 01:16
21 Q. To July --
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. -- with Ms. Parsons?
24 A. I don't know if it was all the way to July
25 because I believe -- I don't remember if he was still 01:16

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1 with her in July.
2 Q. Okay.
3 A. I know at some point, she asked for him to be
4 removed.
5 Q. So, just so I'm clear, so, the child, from 01:17
6 December of 2014 until some point in the summer of 2015,

7 Ryan Smith, Jr., was either in the care of Ms. Parsons or
8 with the parents, but with the maternal grandfather.
9 Would that be correct?
10 A. From December until July? 01:17
11 Q. Yes.
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. So, you filed this lawsuit in July of 2015; is
14 that correct?
15 A. Yes. Well, I didn't; but the -- yes, the 01:17
16 agency did.
17 Q. So, can you tell me from that December to that
18 July -- you're saying that these parents placed this
19 child in an environment that was dangerous to his mental
20 and physical well-being. 01:18
21 What specifically could they have done

22 between December, 2014, and July of 2015?
23 A. And I don't know that I can answer that without
24 looking back over those family-based notes because I was
25 not involved, and I don't have those notes here with me. 01:18

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1 So, I don't want to misspeak or say something that I have
2 no immediate knowledge of.
3 Q. But to your recollection, there was a removal
4 in July of 2015, correct?
5 A. Yes. 01:18
6 Q. And where did little Ryan go?

7 A. He was allowed to be in the custody of the
8 parents as long as they remained at Mr. Erickson's.
9 Q. And we said that placement had difficulties.
10 A. Yes. 01:19
11 Q. And then what happened?

12 A. From there?
13 Q. Yes.
14 A. He came into foster care.
15 Q. And it was about July, 2015? 01:19
16 A. No, it was shortly after August. I believe

17 that he was placed there with the grandparents, give or
18 take July 24th, like the first -- one of the last two
19 Thursdays of the month. And before the middle of August,
20 that placement had disrupted, I want to say August 11th. 01:19
21 Q. But in your lawsuit, you're alleging that my

22 client, Ryan Smith, Sr., knowingly and willingly placed
23 this child in an environment which posed potential danger
24 to his well-being. You've also alleged that he allowed
25 others to be in concert with him to do that. And what 01:20

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1 I'm asking you specifically is, can you tell me what
2 those acts were?
3 MR. TRAN: We're going to object to form.
4 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) You can answer.
5 A. I'm sorry. Without looking -- I don't want to 01:20
6 speak without looking at those notes. I did not -- I

7 wasn't part of that actual removal and without looking at
8 that again --
9 Q. And who would know that?
10 A. That would be Jaimie Taylor. 01:20
11 Q. And so, are you able to answer when,

12 specifically, those acts happened or occurred?
13 A. Not without reviewing those notes, no.
14 Q. So, essentially, you don't have any -- you
15 weren't on the case and you don't have -- it's not 01:21
16 your -- it was not your position to be able to know what

17 those acts were?
18 A. I mean, I have read that; but I was not part of
19 that. I didn't make that decision. I wasn't even at
20 work during that time frame. I was on leave. 01:21
21 Q. Got you.
22 So, let's talk a little bit about where
23 Ryan Smith, Jr., is today. This little boy has got a lot
24 of medical issues, does he not?
25 A. Yes. 01:21

(979) 864-1605
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1 Q. And do you know what those medical issues are?
2 A. He is diagnosed "failure to thrive." He takes
3 a supplement, Pediasure. That's what he drinks because
4 it has more calories than normal milk or formula. He
5 sees a gastroenterologist for those issues. 01:22
6 He also has delayed swallowing. They have

7 done several swallow studies to determine, you know --
8 figure out why he is having difficulty because he is not
9 up to speed on eating certain things that he should be
10 eating at this age. 01:22
11 He is also being followed by a neurologist

12 because of his developmental delays that he has been
13 exhibiting.
14 He is also being followed by a urologist.
15 He was born with hypospadias, and that's a deformity of 01:23
16 his genital area where the urethra did not form. They
17 have done one of the surgeries. They are preparing to do
18 the second surgery.
19 He is being followed by an ophthalmologist.
20 He had persistent pupillary membrane of his eye that 01:23
21 was -- I believe it was his right eye -- that was fixed

22 in 2015. So, he still sees the ophthalmologist for that.
23 Because of an incident that happened in
24 April of 2016, he is being followed by a neurosurgeon due
25 to some malformation of his spine up here by his head 01:24

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1 (indicating). So, the neurosurgeon is following him in
2 regards to that.
3 He has BACH/ECI that does occupational
4 therapy, physical therapy and speech therapy with him.
5 MR. KERSH: Can we go off the record for a 01:24
6 little bit?
7 (Off the record.)
8 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Okay. So, you had ended with
9 the therapist, the occupational therapist?
10 A. The occupational, physical therapist and speech 01:25
11 therapist. And also BACH has him being followed by a

12 nutritionist.
13 Q. This baby has a lot of issues that he was born
14 with, would you agree?
15 A. Yes. 01:25
16 Q. Now, when you talk about the "failure to

17 thrive," that failure to thrive was based on the fact
18 that the baby had not gained the correct amount of weight
19 for his age. Was that your understanding?
20 A. That's my understanding, yes. 01:26
21 Q. And has anyone talked to you -- or I guess I

22 should say, how far after the failure to thrive was it
23 determined that this baby had some problems with
24 digestion and being able to swallow food?
25 A. I don't remember the specific date, but it 01:26

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1 would have been around the time that he started to drink
2 something other than -- eat something other than formula
3 as his main, you know, source of food.
4 Q. And isn't it true that the baby is -- as we
5 speak today, is still underweight for his age? 01:27
6 A. He is.
7 Q. And how much weight has the baby gained since
8 he came into the department's care?
9 A. The last weight that I have down on here was
10 the middle of June, and he weighed 9 pounds 3 ounces. 01:28
11 Q. And is that June, 2016?

12 A. Yes, sir -- no, 2015. 2015.
13 Q. And as far as the neurosurgeon is concerned,
14 those issues with the spine were just recently discovered
15 in April of this year, correct? 01:29
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Did the baby have an incident at daycare while
18 in the department's care?
19 A. What do you mean "an incident"?
20 Q. Was there a need to rush the baby to the 01:29
21 hospital at any point?

22 A. Yes.
23 Q. And when was that?
24 A. On April 26th of 2016.
25 Q. Was that the event that necessitated the 01:30

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1 neurosurgeon following?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. And if you know, do you know essentially what
4 happened?
5 A. Initially, I was -- I received a phone call 01:30
6 that he had stopped breathing at daycare. Upon getting

7 more information, the daycare attendant had put him down
8 to sleep, turned around and within a minute, turned
9 around to check on him because she said normally he would
10 kind of root around and get comfortable and she didn't 01:30
11 hear him rooting around. So, when she turned around, he

12 was blue and had bubbles in his nose and mouth; and so
13 she immediately picked him up. It appeared he was having
14 trouble breathing.
15 Q. And he was taken to which hospital? 01:31
16 A. To Clear Lake.
17 Q. And how long was he there?
18 A. A couple of days.
19 Q. And by this time, he was already placed in
20 foster care, correct? 01:31
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. Was there anything that you're aware of that
23 would have given you warning about this baby not being
24 able to breathe?
25 A. Any, like, preexisting conditions? No. 01:31

(979) 864-1605
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1 Q. Was there anything -- did you know or did
2 the -- I'll ask you this way: Did you know or have
3 knowledge of this spinal defect until April, 2016?
4 A. No, not until he had that MRI that was done.
5 Q. Do you know when the ophthalmologist came on 01:32
6 the scene with the eye issues?

7 A. No, I don't.
8 Q. And what about the urologist, when did the
9 urologist get involved?
10 A. I do not have a date. Sorry. 01:32
11 Q. That's okay.
12 And what about the neurologist for the
13 developmental issues, when did he or she become involved?
14 A. I don't know if that's who he had been referred
15 to after the December, 2014, incident when they had taken 01:33
16 him to the hospital, or if it was a couple of months

17 after that.
18 Q. Okay. And with regard to the specialists --
19 the occupational, the speech and those therapists and
20 nutritionist, do you know when they became involved with 01:33
21 Ryan, little Ryan?

22 A. It may have been in May of 2015.
23 Q. So, is it fair to say that the medical issues
24 with this baby have continued to grow?
25 A. I would say it's just been the one issue that's 01:34

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1 come up with his neck. The other stuff, I think, has
2 been -- he has consistently had doctor's appointments
3 with them from at least our standpoint of when the case
4 started back, that's when I became aware of those
5 appointments. 01:34
6 Q. So, is it your opinion from talking with these

7 people that all of these are predicated on the spinal
8 issue?
9 A. No.
10 Q. So, you found out about the spinal issue in 01:34
11 April of 2016. You didn't know about the spinal issue in

12 December of 2014?
13 A. Not that anybody had told us, no.
14 Q. So, you're continuing to learn of other medical
15 conditions through -- while being in your care that this 01:35
16 little baby has suffered through?

17 A. Sure, yes.
18 Q. Do you believe that given all of these issues
19 that this baby has had from -- or at least that we know
20 of from 2014 that he was with a therapist in May of 2015, 01:35
21 that either the department and the foster parents should

22 have known that this baby was at serious risk for other
23 incidences like the one he suffered at daycare?
24 A. Prior to this incident in April, there was no
25 other -- like, that had not happened while he was in the 01:36

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1 care of the foster parents.
2 Q. But what I'm asking you is, given the medical
3 issues and the medical history with this child, should
4 not either the department and/or the adoptive parents,
5 should they have not known that this was possible? 01:36
6 MR. TRAN: I'm going to object to form.

7 A. I guess anything is possible. I mean --
8 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Well, you're saying that my
9 client knowingly placed this child in such an environment
10 that it substantially harmed -- or was a risk to his 01:36
11 physical and mental well-being; but all of these factors

12 that were predictive that this baby would have other
13 issues, you weren't aware -- you weren't aware of that,
14 were you?
15 A. Aware that he was going to stop breathing -- 01:37
16 Q. Yes.
17 A. -- or have difficulty breathing? No.
18 Q. And neither the department nor the adoptive
19 parents -- strike that.
20 Is it your position that neither the 01:37
21 department or the adoptive parents placed this child in

22 such an environment that was a danger to him?
23 Do you believe that they did that? Do you
24 believe that either one of you did that?
25 A. No, because we had no idea that that would 01:37

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1 happen.
2 Q. So, how is it that in your lawsuit you claim
3 that my client could have known it would happen when all
4 of these medical issues haven't even been determined yet?
5 MR. TRAN: I'm going to object to form. 01:38
6 A. Can you -- I don't think I understand that.

7 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Well, you're claiming in your
8 lawsuit that my client knowingly and willingly placed
9 this child in an environment that endangered his
10 well-being. I mean, you've testified that you weren't on 01:38
11 the case there; but I'm specifically asking if this child

12 is born with all of these birth defects and the
13 department nor the adoptive parents can predict when this
14 child is going to have a life-threatening episode, how is
15 it that my client was supposed to do that and we didn't 01:38
16 even know of all the birth defects yet?

17 MR. TRAN: I'm going to object to form.
18 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Does that seem reasonable to
19 you?
20 A. I don't know how to answer that question 01:38
21 because I think there were a lot of other circumstances

22 besides them not knowing what could happen with him
23 medically of why he came into care.
24 Q. Well, let's talk about when he came into care.
25 You said that he came into care -- originally, there was 01:39

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1 a failure to thrive. The baby wasn't gaining weight,
2 correct?
3 A. Well, I don't remember saying that that was a
4 reason why he came into care. I think that was one of
5 the medical issues that he was having. 01:39
6 Q. Okay. Tell me why he came into care for this

7 last lawsuit.
8 A. Is there any way I can look at the notes from
9 that?
10 Q. Are they your notes or are they -- 01:40
11 A. I mean, they are the department's notes. I

12 wasn't part of that removal.
13 MS. LANDRY: Where are those notes? Are
14 they here? If we took 10 minutes, is that enough time
15 for you to look at them or would you need hours, like 01:40
16 what?
17 THE WITNESS: I mean, I would have to
18 review the whole removal to figure out specifically what
19 he is asking for because I don't want to misstate
20 something that I read before but didn't have firsthand 01:40
21 knowledge of. So, I don't want to misspeak and say

22 something that's not right.
23 (Off the record.)
24 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) So, without taking time to look
25 at the record, what is your general understanding of why 01:41

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1 little Ryan came into care under this last lawsuit filed
2 in July?
3 MR. TRAN: Objection, form.
4 A. Due to noncompliance of services there were --
5 I believe the second time was when Ms. Smith asked for 01:41
6 him to come into foster care, that she wanted him to be

7 out of the home and in foster care.
8 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Is it fair to say -- let me ask
9 you like this:
10 How much of this lawsuit is predicated on 01:42
11 the fact that you just don't like my client very much?
13 A. I would say none of that.
14 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) So, after the baby came into
15 care with the department and the foster parents, which 01:42
16 was around that July time frame of 2015, there has been
17 communication between Ryan Smith, Sr., and yourself?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. And sometimes he has not been very polite?
20 A. Sometimes but at the same time, we've also had 01:43
21 pretty good conversations.

22 MR. TRAN: Objection, nonresponsive.
23 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) So, with regard to the removal
24 of the child in approximately the July time frame, July,
25 2015, until we sit here today, there is nothing -- there 01:43

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1 is nothing from July, 2015, until today that my client
2 could have done to place this child in a dangerous
3 environment because he hadn't had the kid, right?
5 A. I think there has been issues in the home that 01:44
6 would have and have caused us not to reunify up to this

7 point.
8 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) So, let me ask again:
9 Specifically, from the time that baby came into your care
10 until we sit here today, there is nothing that my client 01:44
11 could have done to place the baby in any harm because he

12 hasn't had the baby. You've had the baby.
14 A. Correct.
15 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) So, if we're going to narrow 01:44
16 down the issues of when these allegations in your

17 petition happened, when specifically were -- when
18 specifically was that time frame?
20 A. If I understand your question, that would be 01:44
21 prior to removal.
22 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) But there has been several
23 attempts at removal on the first lawsuit that was
24 nonsuited; and then we have a second lawsuit, correct?
25 A. Yes. 01:45

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1 Q. So, when did these events occur where my client
2 allegedly placed the baby in an environment that
3 endangered his well-being? When did those -- when did
4 those acts specifically occur?
5 MR. TRAN: Objection, form. 01:46
6 A. I guess my answer would still be the same,

7 before removal.
8 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Two follow-up questions to
9 that. Can you tell me today what -- because you also
10 pled an old ground. 01:46
11 Can you tell me what services Ryan -- I'm

12 going to ask for her, too.
13 Can you specifically tell me what services
14 Ryan Smith, Sr., has yet to complete and then what
15 services Ashley Smith has yet to complete? 01:47
16 A. Okay. On Ryan's psychological, the

17 recommendations were for him to have a med consultation
18 and follow those recommendations, individual counseling,
19 couples counseling, attend the child's appointments,
20 one-on-one parenting during therapy and family 01:48
21 reunification prior to therapy.

22 So, of those recommendations from that
23 service, he did not follow through with the
24 recommendations from his med consultation; and he has
25 only attended two of the doctor's appointments. 01:48

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1 Q. And what were the -- from the med consultation,
2 what were those?
3 A. He was prescribed medication, and he was to
4 take it.
5 Q. So, it's the State's position that one of the 01:48
6 things that my client would have to do in order to get

7 his son back would be to ingest the medication that the
8 doctor prescribes, correct?
10 A. Yes. 01:49
11 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Now, what -- okay. So, what

12 other -- are there any other services that he has not
13 completed? The med consultation because he didn't take
14 medication that you said he should take. What else?
15 A. Well, not that I feel he should take; but it 01:49
16 was recommended by the psychiatrist based on an

17 evaluation that he did.
18 Ryan initially did a substance abuse
19 assessment and didn't follow through with those
20 recommendations; and I believe that we agreed in court 01:50
21 that if he was to go for two hair follicles prior to

22 court and they were negative that we would waive that
23 substance abuse assessment.
24 Q. And how many has he taken?
25 A. We talked about that at the end of January; and 01:50

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1 he went for one in July, I believe.
2 Q. So, he has went for one. And what were the
3 results of that hair follicle?
4 A. It was negative.
5 Q. Has Ryan Smith ever failed a drug test that 01:50
6 you've requested from him?

7 A. I believe that's the only one he has gone for
8 us.
9 Q. So, if he goes for another one --
10 A. I'm sorry. I believe he went in court, also. 01:50
11 Q. Just not too long ago. He didn't fail that one

12 either, did he?
13 A. No.
14 Q. And so, if he goes for another hair follicle,
15 then that would cover the two hair follicles that we 01:50
16 agreed to, right?

17 He went for one. One more makes two,
18 right?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. What else as far as services? 01:51
21 A. Throughout the life of this case, we have not

22 been able to verify that they have a safe and stable home
23 environment.
24 Q. I think we agreed, did we not, that you guys
25 would be able to go out and make a home visit in -- I 01:51

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1 think that was over a month ago.
2 A. Yes, sir. And you said that you would get with
3 me to set that up.
4 Q. So, if we do that between now and October 17th,
5 will that satisfy the department's position on whether or 01:51
6 not that's been satisfied?

7 A. I would like to see it more than once between
8 now and trial; but, yes.
9 Q. Okay.
10 A. But that's not all that entails a safe and 01:52
11 stable home though.

12 Q. Thanks for throwing me under the bus. I
13 appreciate that.
14 What else is he missing?
15 A. That's it for Ryan, the substance abuse, the 01:52
16 med consultation and the child's appointments.

17 Q. Just so we're clear on Ryan and the home visit,
18 just so we're clear, he needs to take another hair
19 follicle which needs to be negative and that will satisfy
20 the drug and alcohol assessment, correct? 01:53
21 A. I have --
22 Q. It's your deal. I'm just asking, he's taken
23 one. If he takes another one, that is two.
24 So, you said he took one in July. If he
25 takes one in September or even the first part of October 01:53

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1 to give him more time, they are hair follicles, that
2 would suffice for the two, correct?
3 A. Yes, but the hair follicle is not going to test
4 for alcohol.
5 Q. Okay. But you just said that the agreement was 01:53
6 that we would forgo the recommendations of the drug

7 assessment if he took two hair follicles that both came
8 back negative?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. Okay. That was what we had agreed to. So, he 01:54
11 has already taken one?

12 A. Yes.
13 Q. If he takes another one, does that not satisfy
14 the terms of that agreement, assuming that it's negative?
15 A. It satisfies those terms, yes. 01:54
16 Q. Okay. The other thing was that you had not

17 been able to go out and visit the home; and if we set
18 that up between now and next week, that would satisfy
19 that component. I understand you want more than one; but
20 at least that satisfies that component, correct? 01:54
21 A. Part of that component, yes.

22 Q. What's the part that it does not cover?
23 A. I still am concerned about the stability of
24 their relationship and possible drinking that's going on
25 in the home. 01:55

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1 Q. But those are possibilities, correct?
2 A. Well, there have been things that have been
3 brought to our attention.
5 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) But those are supposition and 01:55
6 possibilities, correct?
7 A. Well --
8 Q. Do you have personal knowledge of it? Have you
9 seen it with your own eyes?
10 A. Not what I've seen but what one of the parties 01:55
11 has indicated to me, yes.

12 Q. And so, is it the department's position that
13 you keep kids in temporary managing conservatorship with
14 the department or you terminate parental rights because
15 they have a bad relationship? 01:55
16 A. I think when there is conflict and instability

17 in the home that could affect that child's well-being,
18 then, yes, we have concerns about that.
19 Q. But you don't have any reports or any tangible
20 evidence or anything that are within your personal 01:56
21 knowledge that there has been anything in this home other

22 than maybe a bad marriage; isn't that right?
23 A. Correct.
24 Q. Is it the department's position that when
25 people are going through marital problems, their kids are 01:56

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1 taken?
2 A. No.
3 Q. Is there any evidence that you have that you
4 want to show me today that any of the issues with their
5 relationship has significantly or even at all harmed this 01:57
6 child's emotional or physical well-being?

8 A. It's not harmed him because he wasn't in their
9 possession.
10 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) So, anything that your concerns 01:57
11 are with regard to that would simply be concern about

12 potential future events?
13 A. Correct.
14 Q. Now, with regard to Ashley Smith, the mother,
15 can you give me a rundown of what services she has yet to 01:57
16 complete?
17 A. From her psychological evaluation, she was to
18 attend doctor's appointments. She has attended two of
19 the doctor's appointments. And then from her drug and
20 alcohol assessment, she was recommended substance abuse 01:58
21 education and anger management; and the same, safe and

22 stable --
23 Q. Home environment?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. Now, can you tell me specifically on the anger 01:58

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1 management, it's your position she has not completed
2 that?
3 A. I remember discussing it at a PC meeting --
5 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) You can answer. 01:59
6 A. -- that I never exhibited -- I've never seen

7 Ashley exhibit anger issues. And so, I believe that we
8 were going to "X" that service out and work specifically
9 on the individual therapy that her attorney asked that
10 she be able to participate in again; and we could 01:59
11 incorporate the substance abuse education into that

12 individual therapy, specifically so that we could have
13 someone come to Ms. Smith.
14 Q. Now, was that conducted with Bill Herrin?
15 A. Which part? 02:00
16 Q. The individual therapy?

17 A. She did have individual therapy with
18 Mr. Herrin; but after she was discharged from him, there
19 were some things that happened that I felt that she
20 needed to engage in individual therapy again so that 02:00
21 those issues could be addressed.

22 Q. But you're not tacking those services on to
23 what she has not completed, are you?
24 A. No.
25 Q. So, she was discharged from Dr. Herrin; and 02:00

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33
1 then it was the department's position that she needed
2 more services, correct?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. But, again, just to be clear for the record,
5 you're not saying that that's a noncompliant -- she is 02:01
6 not -- that's not a noncompliance for services?

7 A. No, I was just saying that we were going to
8 incorporate the noncompliance for the substance abuse
9 education --
10 MR. TRAN: Objection, nonresponsive. 02:01
11 A. -- into that.
12 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Okay. So, specifically, what
13 services, as we sit here today, has she not completed?
14 A. The anger management recommendation -- right,
15 but you asked me what has she not completed. 02:01
16 Q. But we can take anger management off the table,

17 right? You said you're "Xing" that out.
18 A. Correct.
19 Q. So, that's not an issue.
20 So, what has she specifically not 02:01
21 completed?
22 A. The substance abuse recommendations which were
23 substance abuse education and she did not -- she has not
24 been attending the doctor's appointments.
25 Q. Okay. Did you offer her an opportunity on the 02:02

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1 substance abuse to take the same two hair follicles as
2 Ryan Smith, Sr.?
3 A. No, that was never discussed.
4 Q. Has she ever failed a drug test?
5 A. For the ones that she has gone for, no. 02:02
6 Q. So, would it not be, in all fairness, that she

7 would also be able to submit to the hair follicle; and if
8 they are clean, that we would do away with the substance
9 abuse assessment?
11 A. Can I look at something real quick? I'm sorry.

12 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) It's okay.
13 A. If I remember correctly, the substance abuse
14 education for her was not because she actually uses
15 substances. It was because she had said that both of her 02:03
16 parents were extreme alcoholics and that her husband and

17 his mother abused alcohol. And so, it was more of trying
18 to get her to understand what substance abuse was. It
19 wasn't because she was testing positive. It wasn't
20 because she had a substance abuse issue. It was more an 02:03
21 education piece for her dealing with people and having

22 that -- those issues around her.
23 Q. So, it's the department's position that a
24 person who has no known history with drugs or alcohol,
25 who has never failed a drug test, but because has people 02:04

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1 in her past that have been alcoholics, that's okay to
2 remove your child?
4 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) Because you didn't complete
5 that service? 02:04
6 A. That's not the only reason.

7 Q. But it's the only service you said she hadn't
8 completed?
9 A. In the safe and stable home and the doctor
10 visits. 02:04
11 Q. Okay. So, we're going to -- the same home --

12 safe and stable home would apply to mom as it would with
13 dad. If you go out there, we can "X" that out, right?
15 A. The physical condition of the home, yes. 02:04
16 Q. (By Mr. Kersh) And so, under "Section O" of

17 her services that she hasn't completed, the education
18 course wasn't because she has a problem with drugs and/or
19 alcohol and because she hasn't shown up to doctor visits.
20 Assuming that the home checks out, that's the only two 02:05
21 things under "O" that you have for Ashley?

23 A. If you're looking specifically at just
24 services, yes.
25 MR. KERSH: I'm going to pass the witness 02:05

(979) 864-1605
36
1 at this time.
2 Do you need a break?
3 (Off the record.)
4 DIRECT EXAMINATION
5 BY MS. LANDRY: 02:16
6 Q. Are there any of Ryan's medical problems that

7 you are aware of that were caused by something the
8 parents did or failed to do?
10 A. Of the ones that I listed, of the medical 02:16
11 conditions?
12 Q. (By Ms. Landry) Of what you know as far as
13 you're aware of.
14 A. As far as I'm aware, no.
15 Q. Is there anything that you're aware of prior to 02:17
16 the removal -- and just what you're aware of. I

17 understand you haven't reviewed the notes or anything
18 like that. I'm not going to hold your feet to the fire,
19 but what you can recall having spoken to the doctors and
20 looking at the notes in the past, is there anything that 02:17
21 Mr. or Mrs. Smith should have done that they didn't do?
23 A. I remember reading when they took him to the
24 hospital in December of 2014 --
25 MR. KERSH: Objection, form. 02:18

(979) 864-1605
37
1 A. -- that they indicated to the hospital staff
2 that it had been more than -- I believe more than
3 10 hours that they had not fed Ryan. And when he
4 presented at the hospital, he was -- I believe he was
5 hypoglycemic. 02:18
6 Q. (By Ms. Landry) Is there anything else?

8 A. Medically?
9 Q. (By Ms. Landry) Correct.
10 A. I remember looking through the medical records 02:19
11 and there was a doctor's note in there that they said

12 that they --
13 MR. KERSH: Objection, form.
14 A. -- missed an appointment or two, but I don't
15 remember which doctor. 02:19
16 Q. (By Ms. Landry) Anything else?

18 A. No.
19 Q. (By Ms. Landry) Who was the child's
20 pediatrician at the time of the removal? 02:20
21 A. I know it starts with an "M." Malato

22 (phonetic) or --
23 Q. Where is that pediatrician?
24 A. It would have been down in the Freeport/Lake
25 Jackson area. 02:20

(979) 864-1605
38
1 Q. Was that a pediatrician that the parents chose?
2 A. I assume so, yes.
3 Q. Did you get those medical records?
4 A. I believe so, yes.
5 Q. Did you review them? 02:20
6 A. Probably. I've looked at a lot of records.

7 Q. How many Foster homes has this child been in?
8 A. Just this one.
9 Q. Do both parents work in that Foster home?
10 A. Yes. 02:21
11 Q. Mr. Kersh asked you a lot of questions in

12 between December and July, and you were not able to
13 answer those questions, correct?
14 A. Specifically, no.
15 Q. All right. And so, when the trial date comes, 02:21
16 you're still not going to be able to specifically answer

17 those questions, are you?
18 A. Well, hopefully, I'll review them before trial.
19 Q. So, your answers to those questions are going
20 to be based on a review you did of the file of someone 02:22
21 else's work?
22 A. Correct.
23 Q. Not anything you have any personal knowledge
24 of?
25 A. Correct, because I was not involved in the case 02:22

(979) 864-1605
39
1 at that time.
2 Q. And you believe that the rights of these
3 parents should be terminated; is that correct?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Why? 02:22
6 A. I don't believe that they have had the desire

7 to or made an effort to understand Ryan's medical
8 conditions, to attend his medical appointments and figure
9 out exactly what his issues are so that they can care for
10 him, know how to feed him. I think that there is a lot 02:22
11 of instability, still, in their relationship that was

12 reported. It had been worked out, but there are
13 incidences still happening.
14 Q. Anything else?
15 A. Honestly, I don't believe that Ashley is very 02:23
16 bonded to Ryan at all.

17 Q. And that was based upon your observations of
18 Ryan and Ashley together, correct?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. The reason why they were removed in July -- or 02:23
21 one of the reasons why you said they were removed in July
22 was because of noncompliance of services. Were those
23 family-based services, or were they services that they
24 were ordered to do?

(979) 864-1605
40
1 A. No, I believe it was on orders to participate
2 case.
3 Q. (By Ms. Landry) And do you know which services
4 they weren't compliant with?
5 A. Not without looking at those notes from the 02:24
6 family-based case.
7 Q. What was the original goal in this case?
8 A. Family reunification.
9 Q. And when did that goal change?
10 A. In December of 2015. 02:25
11 Q. Why?
12 A. For a couple of reasons. The parents were slow
13 in getting in their services. They were not consistently
14 visiting Ryan, and they were not attending his doctor's
15 appointments. 02:25
16 Q. And so, after that goal changed to -- what did

17 that -- I'm sorry.
18 What did that goal change to in December of
19 2015?
20 A. The concurrent -- the primary and the 02:26
21 concurrent goal flipped. So, the primary goal became

22 adoption; and the concurrent goal was still family
23 reunification.
24 Q. And what efforts did you make towards the
25 reunification? 02:26

(979) 864-1605
41
1 A. We continued to ensure that their services were
2 set up, provided 2054s to those service providers, tried
3 to encourage the parents to participate in doctors'
4 appointments, in visits, in their services.
5 Q. What is their current visitation? 02:27
6 A. Weekly.
7 Q. For how long?
8 A. For an hour.
9 Q. Where?
10 A. It just depends. If they want it during the 02:27
11 weekday, we can have it at the office or wherever they

12 would like.
13 We switched the visits to where they were
14 available back in January on the weekends. So, they have
15 had visits outside of the office. 02:27
16 Q. And why weren't those visits ever increased?

17 A. Because they don't make every visit weekly.
18 Q. And that's a requirement to increase
19 visitation?
20 A. Not necessarily a requirement; but if they are 02:28
21 not making the regularly scheduled visits, why would we

22 increase them to more time?
23 Q. What medication was Ryan, Sr., supposed to take
24 that you're saying he didn't take?
25 A. When he went in June of 2015, he prescribed him 02:29

(979) 864-1605
42
1 Singulair, which is a like an allergy, Zyrtec, and then
2 Depakote.
3 Q. What was the Depakote for?
4 A. Ryan reported that he was feeling more agitated
5 when he was not on his meds; and so, Dr. Pressa 02:29
6 (phonetic) prescribed him that.

7 Q. Was it as needed? Once daily?
8 A. I believe it was two tabs in the evening, two
9 tablets. It was 500 milligrams, two tablets at night.
10 Q. And it was for agitation? 02:30
11 A. That's what I have written down from the sheet,

12 yes.
13 Q. So, you're concerned on both parents that they
14 can't provide -- or have not shown you that they can
15 provide a safe and stable home. What specific factors 02:30
16 are you looking for in a safe and stable home?

17 A. Well, I mean, the physical aspect of the home
18 is that it -- you know there is no safety or physical
19 hazards that babies that they have of their age could get
20 into or be harmed by. So, you know, safety baby 02:31
21 proofing, things of that nature.

22 Safe and stable is also, you know, free of
23 drugs and alcohol, where there is stability, no domestic
24 violence.
25 Q. What else? 02:31

(979) 864-1605
43
1 A. I mean, obviously, food -- you know, a home
2 that has food, they have the ability to maintain their
3 utilities.
4 Q. Anything else?
5 A. Able, you know, to maintain the home. 02:31
6 Q. Anything else?
7 A. A home where the parents are meeting all of the
8 children's needs, basic and otherwise, you know, able to
9 take them to doctors' appointments as needed, being able
10 to understand the importance for that. 02:32
11 Q. Anything else?
12 A. No.
13 Q. Is it the department's position that a home
14 that has alcohol in it is not safe and stable?
15 A. Can you restate that, please, or say it again? 02:32
16 Q. Is it the department's position that a home

17 that has alcohol in it is not safe and stable?
18 A. No.
19 Q. Have there been issues of domestic violence in
20 Ashley and Ryan's home? 02:33
21 A. That's been reported to me? Yes.

22 Q. That you've investigated?
23 MR. KERSH: Objection, form.
24 A. I don't know what you mean by "investigate."
25 Q. (By Ms. Landry) Have you investigated any 02:33

(979) 864-1605
44
1 incidents of domestic violence in the home?
2 A. Not other than trying to follow up with
3 Mrs. Smith, no.
4 Q. Were either of them ordered to do domestic
5 violence classes? 02:33
6 A. Not in the CPS case, no.

7 Q. And you've been to Mr. Erickson's home?
8 A. No, I have not been there, no.
9 Q. You haven't been to the grandfather's home?
10 A. No. 02:35
11 Q. But at some point during this case -- well,

12 during the first case, that was considered a safe and
13 stable home?
14 A. Yes, my worker had been to that home.
15 Q. And the judge ordered, initially, in this case, 02:35
16 that the child be placed in that home?

17 A. Correct.
18 Q. And you said there was a breakdown?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. What was the breakdown? 02:35
21 A. The grandfather asked my worker to take Ryan,

22 Jr., into foster care because he was asking the parents
23 to leave the home. He was not going to allow them to
24 reside there anymore.
25 Q. Both parents? 02:35

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45
1 A. Yes. Well, it was reported to me that both
2 parents were leaving the home.
3 Q. But you don't know that he asked both parents
4 to leave the home?
5 A. I do not have personal knowledge of that, no. 02:36
6 Q. How long were they seeing Mr. Herrin?

7 A. They started seeing him in June of 2015.
8 Q. And who chose that person for them to see?
9 A. That was the provider with CPS.
10 Q. Do you know what a person has to do to become a 02:36
11 provider with CPS?

12 A. I don't know all the details, no. I know they
13 have to go through a procurement process and submit an
14 application to be a provider, but I don't know what the
15 criteria is. I don't know what the details are. 02:36
16 Q. What's his full name?

17 A. William Herrin.
18 Q. Can you spell the last name?
19 A. H-E-R-R-I-N.
20 Q. And have you spoken with him? 02:37
21 A. Not on the phone but we have communicated back

22 and forth on e-mail.
23 Q. Did you provide those e-mails in your
24 discovery?
25 A. I believe so, yes. 02:37

(979) 864-1605
46
1 Q. If not, will you update those?
2 A. Sure.
3 Q. And is he -- is he a doctor or is he a
4 certified counselor? Do you know what his --
5 A. He is not a doctor. I believe he is a licensed 02:37
6 therapist.
7 Q. And which one of the services for both of the
8 parties was he supposed to cover?
9 A. He was working on -- he initially started
10 working with them on anger management, relationship 02:38
11 issues, the individual counseling, parenting and then

12 couples or family counseling.
13 Q. And how long did he see them for?
14 A. He began to see them in June of 2015. He saw
15 them in July of 2015. He saw them in August and October. 02:38
16 He did not see them in November of 2015. He saw them in

17 December of 2015.
18 And after December -- we contacted him in
19 January to get notes for December and January because we
20 had not received them. That was when we were brought 02:39
21 aware that they had actually not seen him since December.
22 He said he was going to discharge them. I
23 asked him not to because we would have to set them up
24 with another therapist.
25 And he said that it could be that 02:40

(979) 864-1605
47
1 transportation was an issue for them. So, we were going
2 to set them up with --
3 MR. KERSH: Objection, nonresponsive.
4 A. -- a therapist that could come to the home or
5 meet them somewhere else. And through my conversations 02:40
6 with Mr. Smith, he did not want to start with a new

7 therapist. He wanted to continue with Mr. Herrin.
8 And so, they went back to see him in April
9 of 2016. And he saw them in April and May and then
10 discharged them. 02:40
11 Q. (By Ms. Landry) And that was a successful

12 discharge?
13 A. I don't remember it saying "successful," but it
14 was a discharge. It didn't say "unsuccessful."
15 Q. But that was enough for CPS to have checked 02:41
16 those things off their services then, correct?

17 A. Correct.
18 Q. And you didn't ask for them to do anymore
19 counseling?
20 A. Well, I thought that Ashley might need to go 02:41
21 back to counseling.
22 Q. But when we had our permanency hearing in
23 August, you didn't request the Court to order her to go
24 into anymore counseling?
25 A. I did not. 02:41

(979) 864-1605
48
1 Q. And Ryan wasn't ordered to do anymore
2 counseling?
3 A. Correct.
4 Q. In the e-mails that you had with Mr. Herrin,
5 were those after the -- did you have anymore e-mails with 02:41
6 him after he said that they were discharged?

7 A. I did not, no. I don't believe I did.
8 Q. So, as far as CPS is concerned, the anger
9 management, relationship, individual counseling,
10 parenting, all of that was taken care of through 02:42
11 Mr. Herrin. They didn't require anything else?

12 Well, you would have asked for more if they
13 had, right?
14 A. I didn't ask for it to be court ordered, but I
15 did discuss with you having Ashley participate in 02:42
16 counseling.
17 Q. And that's currently trying to be set up with
18 Ms. Lewis?
19 A. Yeah, she has been trying to reach Ashley for
20 several weeks. 02:43
21 MS. LANDRY: I'll pass the witness.

22 MR. TRAN: We reserve our questions for
23 trial.
24 * * * * *
25 02:43

(979) 864-1605
49
1 REDIRECT EXAMINATION
2 BY MR. KERSH:
3 Q. When you were asked about why you thought
4 termination was appropriate, you said that the parents
5 were not making appointments. That was one of your 02:43
6 issues, correct?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. And instability in the relationship?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. And that Ashley was not bonded with the baby? 02:43
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. Those were your three responses to the question
13 of why these parents' rights should be terminated.
14 Can you tell me the not making the
15 appointments, that was after the pickup of the child, 02:44
16 correct? That was after you filed the lawsuit.

17 A. All of his doctors' appointments that we have
18 had for him, yes.
19 Q. Ms. Sammons, in conclusion today, is it your
20 testimony that you've answered each and every question 02:44
21 that you were asked today truthfully and to the best of

22 your knowledge?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. Is there any answer that you gave that you were
25 unsure of at this point or would like to correct your 02:44

(979) 864-1605
50
1 answer?
2 A. No.
3 MR. KERSH: Pass the witness.
4 MS. LANDRY: Nothing further.
5 (Deposition concluded.) 02:45
6 (Read and sign.)

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1 CHANGE AND SIGNATURE
2 STEPHANIE SAMMONS SEPTEMBER 7, 2016
3 PAGE LINE CHANGE REASON
4 _______________________________________________________
5 _______________________________________________________
6 _______________________________________________________
7 _______________________________________________________
8 _______________________________________________________
9 _______________________________________________________
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(979) 864-1605
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1 I, STEPHANIE SAMMONS, have read the foregoing
2 deposition and hereby affix my signature that same is
3 true and correct, except as noted above.
4
5 ____________________________________
6 STEPHANIE SAMMONS
7
8 THE STATE OF TEXAS

9 COUNTY OF ___________
10
11 Before me, ______________________________, on

12 this day personally appeared STEPHANIE SAMMONS, known to
13 me (or provided to me under oath or through
14 _________________) (description of identity card or other
15 document) to be the person whose name is subscribed to
16 the foregoing instrument and acknowledged to me that they
17 executed the same for the purposes and consideration
18 therein expressed.
19
20 Given under my hand and seal of office this

21 _______________ day of __________________, 2016.
22
23 ________________________
24 NOTARY PUBLIC IN AND FOR
25 THE STATE OF ___________

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1 CAUSE NO. 82456-F
2 IN THE INTEREST OF ) IN THE DISTRICT COURT
)
3 RYAN SMITH, JR., ) 300TH JUDICIAL DISTRICT
)
4 A CHILD ) BRAZORIA COUNTY, TEXAS
5
REPORTER'S CERTIFICATION TO THE
6 DEPOSITION OF STEPHANIE SAMMONS
TAKEN ON SEPTEMBER 7, 2016
7
I, Minnie Cadena, Certified Shorthand Reporter in
8 and for the State of Texas, hereby certify to the
following:
9
That the witness, STEPHANIE SAMMONS, was duly sworn
10 by the officer and that the transcript of the oral
deposition is a true record of the testimony given by the
11 witness:
12 That the deposition transcript was submitted on
9/13/16 to the witness or to the attorney for STEPHANIE
13 SAMMONS for examination, signature, and return to me by
10/12/16.
14
That the amount of time used by each party at the
15 deposition is as follows:
16 Mr. Shane Kersh - 1 hour, 1 minute;
Ms. Christian Landry - 0 hours, 27 minutes;
17 Mr. Trung Tran - 0 hours, 0 minutes.
18 That pursuant to information given to the deposition
officer at the time said testimony was taken, the
19 following includes all parties of record:
20 Mr. Trung Tran, Attorney for Department of Family
and Protective Services;
21 Mr. Shane Kersh, Attorney for Respondent, Ryan
Smith, Sr.,
22 Ms. Christian Landry, Attorney for Respondent,
Ashley Smith.
23
I further certify that I am neither counsel for,
24 related to, nor employed by any of the parties in the
action in which this proceeding was taken, and further
25 that I am not financially or otherwise interested in the
outcome of the action.

(979) 864-1605
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1 Further certification requirements pursuant to Rules
205 and 206 of TRCP will be certified to after they have
2 occurred.
3 Certified to by me this 12th day of September, 2016.
4
7
_____________________________
8 Minnie Cadena, CSR, RMR
CSR No. 5849
9 Expiration Date: 12-31-16
111 E. Locust, Room 321A
(979) 864-1605
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(979) 864-1605
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1 FURTHER CERTIFICATION UNDER RULE 203 TRCP
DEPOSITION OF STEPHANIE SAMMONS
2 SEPTEMBER 7, 2016
3 The original deposition ___ was / ___ was not
returned to the deposition officer on _________________;
4
If returned, the attached Changes and Signatures
5 page contains any changes and the reasons therefor;
6 That $187.30 is the deposition officer's charges to
Mr. Shane Kersh/Brazoria County for preparing the
7 original deposition transcript and any copies of
exhibits;
8
That the deposition was delivered in accordance with
9 Rule 203.3, and that a copy of this certificate was
served on all parties shown herein and filed with the
10 Clerk.
11 Certified to by me this ______ day of
____________________, 2016.
12
13
14
_________________________________
18 Minnie Cadena, CSR, RPR, RMR
CSR No. 5849
19 Expiration Date: 12-31-16
111 E. Locust, Room 321A
(979) 864-1605
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(979) 864-1605

No. 82456-F Smith Sammons Depo 090716

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No. 82456-F Smith Sammons Depo 090716

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1

1 CAUSE NO. 82456-F

13 ORAL DEPOSITION OF STEPHANIE SAMMONS, produced as a

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

3 FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF FAMILY AND PROTECTIVE SERVICES:

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 having been first duly sworn, testified as follows:

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

11 Q. And is there any reason why you would not

16 A. I'm a supervisor over workers who are

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 A. I was on medical leave June, July and probably

16 Q. Specifically, when did you come in contact with

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 Are you talking about Ryan Smith, the baby?

11 neglect, and they opened it up for family-based services.

21 Q. Okay. And do you know when that nonsuit took

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 Q. Do you have an approximate time frame?

11 with their services; and if I'm not mistaken, it was at

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 noncompliant and Mom made a self-request that the child

11 A. To be exactly sure, I would have to go back and

16 surrounding why the child was actually removed?

21 Q. Whose notes were they?

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 or was having medically?

11 that needed to be repaired.

16 Where was the child the rest of the time

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 December of 2014 until some point in the summer of 2015,

21 What specifically could they have done

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 Q. And where did little Ryan go?

11 Q. And then what happened?

16 A. No, it was shortly after August. I believe

21 Q. But in your lawsuit, you're alleging that my

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 speak without looking at those notes. I did not -- I

11 Q. And so, are you able to answer when,

16 your -- it was not your position to be able to know what

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 He also has delayed swallowing. They have

11 He is also being followed by a neurologist

21 was -- I believe it was his right eye -- that was fixed

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

11 therapist. And also BACH has him being followed by a

16 Q. Now, when you talk about the "failure to

21 Q. And has anyone talked to you -- or I guess I

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

11 Q. And is that June, 2016?

21 hospital at any point?

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 that he had stopped breathing at daycare. Upon getting

11 hear him rooting around. So, when she turned around, he

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 the scene with the eye issues?

16 him to the hospital, or if it was a couple of months

21 Ryan, little Ryan?

MINNIE CADENA, CSR, RPR, RMR

6 Q. So, is it your opinion from talking with these

11 April of 2016. You didn't know about the spinal issue in

16 little baby has suffered through?