Professional Documents
Culture Documents
Tribuslingua Reduced PDF
Tribuslingua Reduced PDF
www.engineersaustralia.org.au
This booklet takes you through the whole process. Read it from cover to
cover before you think about writing anything.
Is it necessary that each career episode should be more than 5-6 pages or it
can just be 1-2 pages. I am writing CER and got confused in this matter.
Introduction: 50 words
Each career episode report (CER) should be 3 – 4 pages. Much less and you
will struggle to convince the assessors you have all the competencies. A lot
more and the assessors will not bother trying to read it.
hey ian, i’m a mech engineer and i have two career episodes selected. for the
third one, is it alright if i described my role in an assembly plant?
unfortunately there was no creativity or design involved, only managerial
tasks involving managing the work crews and meeting deadlines. i wonder
how i’d be able to present that. also, i see a lot of reports where applicants
have gone into considerable mathematical detail, even where there is no
apparent reason to do so. none of my career episodes have that level of math,
but only because it wasn’t required, as we used software to do the number
crunching.
So the answer is ‘yes’ You can write about the general things you have done
or you may be able to write about a specific problem. You write aboout
things you have done and include details of the how and why to demonstrate
professional engineering competencies. I suggest you prepare a brief outline
for each of your CERs. About ten one line sentences. Assess which
competencies from the definition in the Migration Skills Assessment
Handbook each of these will demonstrate. Then assess what is missing and
what may be repeated more than once. Look for additional points to cover
competencies you have missed and to strengthen your reports. Do not start
writing in detail until you are satisfied that your outlines cover all the
competencies as best you can. Do not panic if you do not cover every
competency fully. No one gets 100% in an exam (almost no one anyhow).
Kinjal – see the answer I gave to m yesterday on this topic. look at different
parts of your work experience. Look for mini projects.
Hi
Regards
you also need the definition for a professional engineer’s competencies from
the Migration Skills Assessment booklet.
Your voluntary work as a web designer does not help you as it is notrelevant
work experience for an electronics engineer.
Your technical support work seems like it could be more like the tasks of an
engineering technologist. You should be able to get one CER from your final
year project. for the other two, look for mini projects or problems soled
which used engineering skills as givem the competency definition: analysing,
adapting etc..
Hi to All,
Ian, will you please advise if I can write my CDR in this field.
Ian,
Atan – They look like professional engineering tasks and valid topics for
career episodes. Remember it is not about the job you have done, it is the
competencies, your skills and actions you can demonstrate from doing the
jobs.
Dear Ianlittle,
I am professional engineer from Malaysia under Institute of Engineers
Malaysia and currently working in Perth, WA. Just passed my IELTS, now
applying skill assessment from EA. What does provisional status by
Washington Accord means, is that means I am accredited or not? I’m a bit
confused here.
3 Select three episodes from your work experience and engineering course
that you think will enable you to display the engineering conpetencies you
have.
4 Write ten one line sentences, each starting with I (I analysed, I calculated, I
designed, I planned, etc.) for each of the episodes.
5 Check the competencies you are able to demonstrate from the episode
outlines.
Ian,
Dear Sir,
I have written 3 career episodes, two of about 18 pages each with lots of
pictures in it. The third one is of about 45 pages and includes actual design
work carried out by me in my studies. I wanted to show Engineers australia
all the work performed by me. Please guide me are these CERs acceptable
upto the level of engineers australia?????
Saghir – Not close. You have wasted a lot of time and energy.
Read and follow the instructions in the Migration Skills Assessment booklet.
Part of the assessment is to be able to write in a clear and concise manner.
Remove all pictures and any direct examples of your work. Then critically
review each CER, sentence by sentence. Delete every sentece which does not
show how you demonstrate a competency.
Do not write what you want to write. Write what Engineers Australia want to
see – evidence of how you meet each and every competency. Many
sentences should start with I !
Dear Ianlittle,
Thankx a lot for your reply. yeah i have wasted time and energy as it is very
difficult to write career episodes during your job anyways i will correct my
CERs for sure, thnkx again for support. Ian, i have some more questions to ask
and hope you will answer them by giving your precious time to these
questions……..here are the questions:
BR
Saghir Hussain
Saghir – As a former Australian prime minister said “Life was not meant to be
easy.”
2 As you have read in the Migration Skills Assessment booklet, DO NOT SEND
THE CERTIFICATE WITH YOUR APPLICATION. You send the test centre details
and tell the test centre to send the results to Engineers Australia.
3 Yes – For any work experience used as a basis for a CER you must have the
work experience validated by the company. I suggest that your draft a letter
for the company to provide to you. keep it simple. Key words are that “Saghir
was employed by XYZ Co for the period from A to B as a professional
engineer.” Anything else you can have added is a bonus, such as “He was
engaged in the engineering operations department an the ABC project doing
all sorts of good work (use appropriate professional engineering competency
words such as – designing, assessing, managing).” An alternative is to send
the company a copy of your CV with a draft letter and get them to simply say”
Saghir was employed by XYZ for the preiod A to B and get the appropriate
manager to validate your experience by signing your CV. Read the details of
authorising and validating documentation in the Migration Skills Assessment
booklet to be sure you get this bit correct.
4 A 4 page CV is a bit on the long side for your length of experience. If you
have not already bought Project Australia, get it and read it. It tells you all
about Australian CV preparation. You will need this once you have a visa, so
get it now.
You need to make a huge shift in your thought processes. You questions
indicate you understand what is written but you are having trouble believing
that these Australians want something that seems strange to you. Australians
are different. The two legged animals and the kangaroos. Work hard to
understand and accept the differences. Read Australian engineering and
news sites. If you cannot, or are not willing to, make the effort to understand
and accept the differences you will not migrate successfully to Australia. You
will feel misunderstood and discriminated against.
Dear Ian,
Again thank you so much for giving your valuable time for the questions i
asked. yes, Ian the prime minister was rite and if life is meant to be easy then
there will be no charm left in it. Struggle makes life harder and enjoyable in
my opinion. Anyways, i regularly search the site http://www.immi.gov.au and
http://www.engineersaustralia.com but i couldn’t find any major changes in
the fiscal year ended. Yes my previous employer gave an experience
certificate mentioning the time period i spent there in the particular
department and the idea to get a sign from a manager is a better one i will do
it as my previous boss lived just nearby my house :) but your idea was superb
and can help many others thnkx for tht again. Well you are rite Ian
australians are very differnt, on one side they said your CV should be very
brief and it should countain your experience and responsibilities in detail, :)
how one can show such things in a format of a 3 pages CV. Anyways as u said
i have to accept the changes and i will have to short down my CV to a 3 pages
one.
Well Ian you have mention the booklet project australia, could you please
mention from where i can get it. if you can tell us the website from where we
can order it, it will be very beneficial for us.
Ian, I must appreciate the efforst you are making in the development of the
future of so many people. Your valuable input is priceless, God bless to you
and your company who are doing such a great job for the human race.
Now i can understand that australians are really different and we have to
accept the changes they want to look in our presentations.
Thank you so much again Ian to guide me and assist me as those were the
final points in which i was stucked and you have just clear the
misunderstandings.
BR
Saghir
Saghir – Thank you. I can see why you have writen so many words. Whenever
you write or speak stop and think, “What does the recipient of my message
want to know?” Give them just that, not one bit more. You must work hard
to give them only the relevant iinformation. That is your challenge.
Good Luck.
Dear Ian,
I am civil engineer in telecommunication field, all the past three years i have
been with orascom telecom as a construction engineer, but last 1.5 years i
am doing the management job, main responsibilities of my job are to follow
up the project, preparing reports for upper mgt… take initiative to solve the
problem management problem in the field, liasion with consultants and
clients etc (In a word coordination)…… i have done nothing with designing,
we have just implemented…so in order to complete the demonstration
report i am thinking to face some problems
1. how can i divide my tasks into three reports as i am following almost the
same format
best rigards//
Sadik.
Sadik – I suggest you look at one CER from your university project where you
should hsve done analysis and design, the second look for a problem you
have analysed and solved or improvements you have initiated or a mistake
you had to correct, then look at your overall job so you can bring together a
number of different aspects to display your engineering skills.
Have a good look at your CV and update it to include the engineering skills
you have demonstrated.
Start writing the summary report first so you are thinking about the
competencies.
Thanks a lot for your precious suggestion. Ian can i select my under grad
thesis for episode 1?..it was about establishing a effluent treatment plant for
industrial discharge to river..though i work in telecom sector now. I decided
to prepare the CER’s as follows:
Best Regards//
Sadik.
Sadik – You can use an undergraduate project. These are good for
demonstrating design competencies. You do not talk about responsibilities,
you need to talk about competencies. Your next step is to write about ten
one line ideas on what your CER will cover – for each CER. Then put the
competency number each linewill demonstrate. Next complete the Summary,
check out what is missing and find new evidence to filll in the gaps. Do not
start writing the detail until you have done this.
Bright – All that seems too much. Remeber this – each part must
demonstrate how you can demonstrate an engineering competency. This
need action words, not pictures. It’s not a primary school project. a CDR is a
serious engineering report.
Hello ianlitle
Can you give the link to the Handbook Download (for those writing CERs)of
the Engineers Australia website ?
Thanks.
Dear Ian,
Best regards,
Miq
Miq – Correct. They will not recognise you as a professional engineer, but
they could recognise you as an enginering technologist. I have no idea why
they did not do that. You need to check whether you are accredited as an
engineering technologist under the Sydney Accord. You do this from the
Wasshington Accord web site. It is possible to migrate as a technologist and
apply for recognition as a professional engineer after you have migrated. I
think many people fail to e accredited as professional negineers because they
do not directly address the engineering competencies when they write their
CDRs. Learn more:strong>
Many thanks for your reply Ian, I really appreciate your effort.
I have just been on the phone to the Engineering Council UK and I have been
told that my degree is only eligible for an Engineering Technologist
assessment under the Sydney accord. They also explained me the
requirement for a Professional Engineer, which is an MEng (Master of
Engineering – Undergraduate, not Post graduate) and not a BEng (Hons).
Are there are any specials requirements for a CDR in this case (where you
only expect a different outcome)? Would a print out of modules comparing
the two courses be enough in my case? If I do end up writing a CDR, why not
then just submit it for a Professional Engineer Status instead and for an
outcome as a Mechanical Engineer?
Miq
Miq – Are you looking for work? I would apply under mechanical engineering
technologist under the Sydney Accord – no CDR required. The occupation
classifications are broad with few specialist areas. the specialities areas are
covered under the major disciplines. I agree if you write a CDR certainly go
for professional engineer.
Miq
I have read the Migration Skills booklet and writing a CDR should not be a
problem. Looks straight forward!
Regards
Miq
Miq – That is the first time I have aeen that written or heard said. Having
good English makes CDR writing easier. The most important thing to keep in
mind is that the stage 1 competencies are those expected at a graduate level.
Most people don’t realise the engineering skills they use doing simple tasks.
G’day,Sir!
I’ve been working in Australia for 17 months under 457 visa and my visa
occupation is Civil Engineer. I’m currently working for a project of building
houses in cyclonic area in WA as a project engineer. I plan to write a CDR
based on this project.
Jason – Yes you can write two, or even all three career episode related to the
same job or project provided they cover different aspects of the job or
project. For example, jou may write one CER about the job in general
covering project management competencies and write a second CER covering
a particular problem or technical issue you had to deal with. The way to test
if it will all work out is to write one line outlines for each CER episode. Write
about ten one liners to cover the story for each CER. Then you assess which
competencies you will cover for each of these one line items when they are
expanded into a full narrative. Next complete the summary report referring
back to the competencies in the one liners for each CER. You will need to
revise your outlines to cover all the professional engineering competencies.
You will find that you have repeated some competencies several times and
missed others. After you have revised your outlines you should be able to see
how it will all work out. Good Luck.
1. you wrote in “writing a CDR- Secrets of success” “To claim the element you
need to give evidence of actions which tell of things you have done to meet
every sub-element”. Let’s take PE2.3 as an example, there are 8 sub-
elements contained, I can only figure out writing selection of pile
construction method(percussion pile and bored pile) in karst area to
demonstrate the 5th to the 8th sub-elements, I have no idea where I can dig
out to demonstrate the first 4 sub-elements. Obviously, that’s not follow your
stands. (1)Can you advise me the sequence of importance of these sub-
elements, in another word, which sub-elements are more important than the
rest? (2)what can I do if I could not cover them all, or even half?
2.How to extract the competency from what I did? For example, during the
bridge project, once our site was raided by hurricane which showed no signs
and warning, I immediately checked the site and took the pictures of the
damage(materials were drown, power equipment damaged) and extracted
yesterday’s weather forecast, I then sent all the documents to the
Employer(Client) to help them to claim the insurance because it belong to
Force Majeure. I also referred to related clause from FIDIC contract
conditions and applied for 2 days extension of working time. the problem is I
can’t see which competency I can demonstrate from this action!! Can you
advise?
3.Do you have any other essay talking about the detailed competencies? I
believe writing appropriate materials to demonstrate all the competencies is
now my biggest challenge!
Jason – How many exams have you got 100% in? It is unrealistic to expect to
be able to get every part of every element. Obviously the more you can
demonstrate the better your chance of accreditation. You have to try and
show your strengths are greater than your weaknesses. You probably won’t
cover all the elements in one episiode. Look to other episodes to cover other
elements. Writing one CER about one of your jobs provides a good path to
pick up bits and piecs of elements missed out elsewhere.
I can see by your questions that you are only thinking about your actions in a
superficial way. You must try and recognise the engineering thoughts and
actions. This is not taking pictures and sending off reports for insurance
claims. How did you know what to take pictures of? You assessed the damage.
You estimated repair and recovery times. You probably made assessments of
whether some things could be repaired or had to be rebuilt or replaced. You
analysed the damage and made engineering decisions. You recognised the
contractual situation was force majeure – that’s a bit of project management.
Read the competecies again and again – think engineering thoughts behind
your actions. Ask yourself “What was the engineering reason for me doing
that?”
Ian,
Ian, thank you for coming back to me. I went and had a look and my
qualification is accredited with Washington Accord . The course, the
institution and the years that I have studied is listed – so I take that this is a
yes for the Washingon Accord?
Chris – Just think how useful it will be to have the whole Migrate Australia
Course. The blog is only a teaser sample. It certainly looks like you were
heading for the wrong queue. Your migration path appears very straight
forward. You can apply under the Washington Accord as a professional
engineer. Follow the links to Engineers Australia site from our FAQ page
Dear Ian,
The more I look at this the more confusing it gets. I am sure that I actually do
not qualify under the Washington Accord because they ask for degrees and I
only have a National Diiploma (studied 1991 – finished 1992) and National
Higher Diploma( 1992 to end 1992). In the list that I am looking at they
mention a Nasional Diploma 3 years and in the same section a BTech 1 year.
The B Tech degrees only came in after I have finished my National Higher
Diploma. They brought this in for the engineers that did their 3 year diploma
and then the 1 year BTech in order for them to register as proffesional
engineers in South Africa.
The thing is I can still not find any list that states the accredited courses and
institutions for the Sydney Accord regarding South African qualifications.
My next issue is that I do not want to register as an engineer – this is not why
my qualifications needs to be assest. I am in the process of applying for PR
and therefore needs my qualifications assest according to the ASCO code
3125-11. According to the code skills requirement it is as follows: an AQF
Diploma or higher qualification or at least 3 years relevant work experience.
Therefore I am looking at your first reply and would like to ask you if we
should do this assestment with the Sydney Accord.
Kind Regards,
Chris
Chris – I think we have both been misleading each other. I am now totally
unclear on what you really meant to tell me last time around. so I think it
goes like this. Starting from the Washington Accord site you saw your
qualification mentioned down to course institute and year. So by mutual
recognition your course will be recognised by Engineers Australia as it is
recognised in South Africa at some level under the Accords. If I was you I
would fill out the paperwork , pay my $200 hard earned and see what
happens.. To take some of the risk out of it, why not go along to the
Engineers Australia office in Adelaid and talk to an assessor there? Stick with
it mate.
Hello Ian,
I am an electronics engineer from India being working for more than 1.5 yrs. I
want to apply for Australian Immigration. I have cleared IELTS test. Can you
please guide me regarding the basic procedure to proceed further in order to
get through australian immigration successfully.
Thank you,
Regards,
Arvinder Singh
Arvinder – Go to our FAQ page and follow the many links there. You will need
to talk with a migration agent. We can only advise on qualifications
recognition and general migration matters. Buy Project Australia. It’s all in
there.
Dear Ian,
2) Since my 2 previous employers are from other countries and it’s hard for
me to obtain a new Employment Certificate, is it ok to use the old ones which
I got years back?
Many thanks
Donato
You may need to make statutory declarations and have your documents
witnessed by an approved person if your are using career episodes as part of
your CDR. The process is given in the Engineers Australia Migration Skills
Assessment booklet. Follow the links to this from our FAQ page.
Sir I have already written career episodes now I am getting confused how to
prepare summary report as it says “how you have applied the element” can I
get some words from professional engineer guide e.g.
Kind Regards,
Rehmat
Rehmat – Your summary should talk of specific events, not general as you
have done. Something like “For the XXX project, I improved the preformance
of the whatsist by analysing the plant preformance.” It is better to mention
one or two by name than put in a general statement. two or three dot point
pointing to the refence will do.
Regards,
Faizan
Faizan – It looks like you could fit into the electronics engineer ASCO
classification. You could probably pitch a case either as an IT professional or
an electronics engineer. You need to look closely at the ASCO definition to
ensure you can write CERs which display the engineering and occupation
competencies.
Dear Sir
Could you plz give me a hint for PE 1.4 regarding General Knowledge, what
can I mention in this point keeping EPC experience in Petrochemical sector.
Kind Regards,
Rehmat
Hi Ian,
With reference to the below mentioned statement from the Migration Skills
Assessment Booklet, could you please elaborate that amongst hundreds of
different applications, how does the IEAust relate the candidate’s IELTS score
with his CDR application as both these document sets will reach them from
two separate sources and at different timelines.
“Original English language test (IELTS) result [if necessary]. You must
arrange for this to be forwarded directly to Engineers Australia from the Test
Centre.”
Should I send them the reference IDs for my IELTS test report or the copy of
my test report itself?
Regards,
Hammad.
Hammad – I don’t know how they do it but they do. Do not send the test
report, send the reference IDs with your application and CDR and give the
test centre the Emgineers Australia adress you are sending your application
to. Make sure the name you use all all your applications and documents is the
same. It should be the name on your passport to avoid any confusion.
Lasitha – Good question. It really depends on the types of subjects you did in
your course (not the title), your project work and the specific engineering
work you are doing now. It helps a lot if they are all consistent. The line
between electronics and electrical engineering can be blurred, particularly in
the areas of power electronics. So it depends on your specific training and
how you demonstrate the competencies for an electronics engineer. It is
certainly possible.
Hi ian,
e.g.
Hi,
global123 – If you write your CER reports well and your experience
demonstrates engineering competencies you should have no trouble. You do
not need to send your secondary educationcertificates. With IELTS you need
7.0 or more in all categories to get extra points in the points test.
Hi Ian,
can you help me to know about the GSM Mobile Commuincation scope in
Australia.
BR
Arshad Masih
Arshad – Type Australian broadband network into youir web browser. This
will get you to a range of sites to tell you what is planned and wher it is at. It
is early days for jobs yet, but it takes a lot of people to spend $42 billion
Hi ianlittle,
AA – This depends on the University course you did and how well you can
demonstrrate the professional competencies in a CDR. You certainly should
apply for assessment as a professional engineer. IKL
Hi ianlittle,
Thank you for your great advises. I have one more question. Sticking to word
limits a CER would come to about 1500 words if I’m correct? What would the
typical word count for the summary statement be? Thanks again!!!
Keeki – Can’t you read? It’s all in the Migration Skills Asssessment Booklet. It
is also in a blog on this site.
Hi Ianlittle,
Thanks for your advises. But I couldn’t find any word count indication for the
field ” a brief summary of how you have applied the element”. I figured it
would be a sentence around 20 words, but was it for each competency
element or each applicable sub-element? I have heard people submitting
summary statements of about 10 pages long, but it sounded weird as it is
supposed to be a ‘summary statement’!!!
Keeki – You have figured it correcly. A short sentence is all you need for each
competency. Do not try to address every sub-element. The summary really
provides a cross reference so the assessors can find the competencies easily
in the 3 CERs from the references in the Summary Report. IKL
Ian,
Eeman – I am amazed
but my biggest dillema is how to make a CDR of being and industrial engineer
when i am doing a completely different job – and not the skill which i want to
be assesed.
Andre – You are assessed on your skills and not on your current job. Even if
your are supervising your are probably making engineering decisions using
engineering skills. Apply for assessment as an engineer and let Engineers
Australia make the decision. Look in your Career episodes to use the words of
engineering competencies. IKL
Hi ,
There is only one Summary Statement for the three CERs. This summarises
the competencies demonstrated and provides references to the paragraphs
in the three CERs.
For engineering assessment the CER topics must relate the nominated
occupation. It all depends on the specific competencies you can demonstrate
from each CER.
Have a test run first. Select your three topics and do an outline (ten single
line points) for each and assess the competencies each CER will demonstrate.
Complete the Summary Statement before you start writing the detail CERs.
This will help you make sure you are not demonstrating one competency
several times and missing out on others. Remember to look at both the
Engineers Australia competencies and the occupation requirements as listed
in the Australian Burea of Statistics (ABS) definition for the occupation. The
Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) website provides detailed descriptions of
typical tasks for your chosen occupation.
Hello Sir/Ma’am. I submitted my CDR in August and I got a reply from the
officer who is assigned to assess my CDR stating that ‘two of my CDRs lack
sufficient detail of engineering work personally undertaken by me in my
nominated occupation- Mechanical field (Bachelors degree)’.
Look at your CERs again, Do fhey talk IN DETAIL about things mechanical
engineers do? Such as designing mechanical elements, pipe stressing, writing
specifications for mechanical equipment, using engineering skills to solve
mechanical problems. Using software tools can be a trap. It is the mechanical
engineering aspects that are important, not the software.
Hi Ian,
I can apply with my Australian Masters via ACS and I already have 8 in
academic IELTS. So I guess I won’t have to spend again on professional year.
But the problem is the processing time. It is around 2 years and as I don’t
have any work experience it is highly difficult for me to get a job here. Also
wondering whether to apply as a professional engineer as my bachelors is a
four year program or technologist or associate. Thanks for your valuable
suggestions.
Rav – I think the time for either path will be similar. Unless you can be
sponsored you are in for a long wait. Certainly apply as a professional
engineer if you take that path. Let the assessment process work through –
you will not have to re-apply if the assessment is a lower grade. If your
computing skills are on the Critical Skills List that looks the best path to me.
The professional year could provide a path to a job.
thanks in advance.
Nidhi
The challenge in doing a CER involving softwaer is that the CER is about the
biomedical application and the software is a tool to solve a biomedical
problem. Concentrate on the application and biommedical issues, not on the
tool to develop the solution to a problem.
Do a test run. Do an outline (ten single line points) and assess the
competencies the CER will demonstrate. Complete the Summary
Statementfor all three CERs before you start writing the detailed reports. This
will help you make sure you are not demonstrating one competency several
times and missing out on others. Remember to look at both the Engineers
Australia competencies and the occupation requirements as listed in the
Australian Burea of Statistics (ABS) definition for the occupation.
Dear Ian,
I’m about to prepare my CDR. I have done my bachelor back home in
“fuel and energy engineering†, and I have done my master in chemical
engineering here in Australia. My question is I don’t have too many stuff to
write about 3 episodes except those projects that I have done it during my
Master. I already had three projects on design and research. Can I use them
as my Episodes? how about my undergraduate certificate, in Australian
university they accepted my undergraduate certificate as equal to chemical
engineering certificate as most of my units where the same as chemical
engineering’s unites.
Ala
Ala – Being accepted by a university for study to a htgher degree does not
mean Engineers Australia will accept your qualifications. With your studies
you should be able to write three career episode reports from your course
project work and be accepted as a chemical engineer..
hello ian,
i have Bsc civil engineering degree & have 6 yrs working experiance in Civil
eng feild which catagary can i apply for Aus Eng Assesment? washington
accord or non recognize qualification?
Nishan – I think you will need to work on your English to be able to write a
CDR. Your spelling is poor and you are obviously having trouble
understanding the Migration Skills Assessment booklet. Summary statements
are on pages 18 to 21 of Section C Washington Accord signatories are listed
on page 10. You need to go to the Washington Accord website to find your
country, univereity, course and year.
With your standard of English you would not get a job as a professional
engineer in Australia.
dear ian,
is it need IELTS results to attached with CDR Or result sent to drectly from
test center?
Nishan – Do not send the test results with your CDR. Provide test details and
test centre.
Mike – Skip the formulae, but use engineering words.To choose an hydraulic
system you must develop a specification for the system requirements. You
need to write about the things you thought about (that is engineering) the
what, why and how. Look at the words used in the detailed description of
competency elements in the Appendix of the Migration Skills Assessment
booklet. These sorts of words should be in you career episode reports.
Hi Ian,
I was so lucky that I found your website. Happy new year! Wish you and your
family happiness and success.
TuCa
Jabra
Jabra – What the examiners want to see is that you are able to get
information about how a plant has been started up and is running and learn
from that how to do a better job next time. Evidence could be that you have
designed a piece of machinery or a plant system more than once and have
used information from an existing plant to improve the starting up and
operation of the new plant you have designed. You need to provide an
example of a job you have done where you have used the experience from an
existing design, by talking with the people who started the system and are
operating and maintaining it to make your design better.
I have worked different places and my jobtitles there have been Product
Manager and Technical Manager. However – my duties undertaken were that
of a mechanical engineer, such as the design of ventilation systems, writing
of tecnical information for Air handling units and solving ventilation problems
using the mechanical and technical engineering skills obtained at Uni.
5. Does the fact that my title is “Msc of Civil engineering” present a problem
regarding assessment as a Mechanical Engineer?
In Denmark the Engineering Msc is 5 years long and during those years you
specialize into different fields of cengineering, one of those specialities being
“Natural ventilation”, the one I chose, and the one I believe fit the
description of Mech. Engineering.
Mattias Simonsen
Mattias – Your PhD does not disqualify you, but your qualifications will be
assessed on your undergraduate degree. You need to provide a transcript
which lists the subjects you studied. This will show the assessors you have
studied subjects which would come under an Australian mechanical
engineering degree.
Get the reference letter to include the information the appointment letter
had, such as date of appointment and job title and duties.
Yes. You will be eligible for more visa points with recent relevant experience.
Again the description of your duties will sort this out. The assessors are
experienced in interpreting the qualifications from different countries.
Hello Ian,
Thanks
Ian
Ian – Unless the migration agency can give you some examples of success I
would not try this route.
I am noy optimistic it will work. If you can get enough points as a technologist
why bother trying a harder route? In the end it will not affect the jobs you
will be able to get once you land in Australia. If there are a lot of jobs, why
not not try to get a job and be sponsored for a temporary visa and sort things
out after 12 months in Australia.
Hi Ian,
Giuseppe – This is a very fluffy concept. One part of this, the general
education background, is showing your engineering course provided subjects
such as management ,economic, and non-engineering components. We are
not just technical boffins who respond to request to do thinks. We are
expected to have a knowledge of our society and be pro-active in using our
skills to improve society. A clear example is in the area of pollution reduction.
Engineers play an essential role in designing solutions. In designing
infrastructure engineers have a direct affect on society. They must consider
the impact of the areas in which they are building facilities. Another example
is being able to apply technology in different areas – I know of a company
which developed a lightweight walking frame for old people using the disgn
tools for designing offshore gas platform structures.
OK, back to your narrative. Look for an example where your have used your
broader general knowledge to influence a design, solve a problem or
iinfluence your engineering decision making. A very simple example would be
to consider local weather conditions, or influnce of pests such as native
animals or insects.
Dear Ian
I have completed my bachelor degree in Environmental Science in India and
Master of Environment + Master of Environmental Engineering from
Aaustralia.
I did several trainings and project works in different industries when I was in
India (Amul Dairy, Kadam Environmental Consultancy, General Motors,
Alembic Pharmaceuticals – Pollution management, ETP operator,
Environmental Technician respectively).
Maulik -CER1 your bachelor degree project, CER2 your nasters project, CER3
your training period.
Thank you Ian for your precious guidance. I have started writing my CDR. This
website is helping me a lot in CDR preparation. Thank you again for your
efforts.
Dear Ian,
Good day, I have few question writing a CDR, I have already written 2 career
episode. The only problem I have now is my 3rd career episode.
My first two is I am able to stay in the company for more than 3 years unlike
this current job that I have. I am only 2 year and 2 months, as a Field Service
Engineer for 2 different companies.
I will need your expert advise. How will I write my CDR for my 3rd career
episode.
Regards
Randy Panaligan
Randy – In all that experience you must have some special project or problem
you can write about. It is not about length of time in a job, it is about
demonstrating you understand and apply the tskills and knoeledge of a
professional engineer.
Dear Ian,
Many thanks for the effort you guys are imparting. I have successfully
received the Assessment letter referring Professional Engineer/Electronics
Engineer. Sir, credit goes to you and Project Australia.
One more thing do i need membership for the job hunt in Australia market?
Best wishes
ianlittle said on February 10, 2010 at 10:25 pm
Usman – oCngratulations. You will be able to apply for jobs and work as a
professional engineer without being a member of Engineers Australia. Your
qualifications have been accredited for stage 1, graduate level. To become a
full member, stage 2 or chartered engineer (CPEng) you need to produce an
Engineering Practice Report (EPR). This is a major task. Go to the Engineers
Australia website and follow the links to get chartered status. In theory you
can achieve chartered status in 3 years. In practice it will take four or five
years. In Australian terms, your are a currently a graduate or trainee engineer.
Hopefully your employer is a professional development plan partner and will
assist you in achieving the experience necessary to complete your EPR.
According to new MODL change (February 8th 2010) How it affects CDR? Do
we need to write CDR anymore? Any comments?
Rathan – Yes you will still have to have your qualifications assessed as the
first step towards any skilled migrant visa. You need to prepare a CDR if your
engineering qualification is not recognised by Engineers Australia.
Hi , Ian i hope you are doing well. I have a query with me.
Hi Ian,
I was messed around by the agency i had employed to look after my ENS case.
I have since taken my files back i’m looking after it myself now.
I notice they have posted my typed up CRD and not the hand written part
(which they have binned)
I since called to make sure this was the correct thing to do – they assured me
that Engineers Australia would not accept hand written CDRs.
I’ve read the CDR outline and I think that i’m right on this one.
thanks
John
John – They are correct. Would you expect a professional to send you a
handwritten document? Of course not.
kr
john
Hello,
Thanks in advance.
Dear Ian,
Thanks in advance.
Regards,
GTJ
Guntur – Yes
Hi Ian,
After my engineering (ECE), I did MS ( both in India) and now have nearly 2.5
years industrial experience. In CDR application form it is stated a requirement
of 3 year industrial experience. Does my masters degree add any additional
weight. Do they follow strict rule for experience duration or can I apply now??
Thanks in advance.
Regards,
Rajesh J.
Dear Ian,
Nash – Don’t mess about. Do both. This is far too important to get wrong.
Regards,
Ammara Khalid
Ammara – Read through all the comments and answers associated with this
topic on this site. I have addressed this many times for other people.
Dear Ian,
Martin
Dear Ian,
I’d read one query of a Civil Engineer with Quantity Surveying experience.Can
you please advise me for the following queries since I’m preparing a CDR with
my Quantity Surveying experience though I’m not graduate in Quantity
Surveyor, but in Civil Engineering.
Thanks in advance
JMT
Hi there
Dear Ian,
Martin – It is only necessary to attest the experience used for your career
episode reports.
rex said on April 30, 2010 at 6:14 pm
Dear Ian,
Regards
Rex
Rex – Yes the skilled occupation list (SOL) and the points test are being
reviewed. No one knows what the outcome will be. The dates fo
implementation are being delayed (Governments find it hard to make
decisions)
Dear Ian,
Thanks
I’m working with my narrative report for the Stage 1 Competency for
Engineers Australia. I’ve done two reports, all about my engineering
employment in the Philippines as a Civil Engineer. The last report I’m working
on is about the educational program I recently attended which is MSc in
Structural Engineering (part time) in UK. I hold a PR visa in Australia and
already residing for 3 months. Is it ok to make this part time course I
attended for the last report?
Dear Ian,
2. Are the below events enough for Reports that need to be submitted?
2.1 Currently working as sales engineer & looking into 2 big projects at the
same time.
Adil
hi there i have done my computer science engineering from India. I have ielts
all 6. i have completed 3 projects based on c++,,java, visual basic. I would like
to get assessed as a computer engineer. would i be eligible to get assessed as
a computer engineer
Rajesh – I doubt it. You seem like a computer programmer who would be
assessed by the Australian Computer Society (ACS). Computer engineers fit
under electronics engineers. Have a look at the ASCO definition for an
electronics engineer. Follow the links from our FAQ blog page.
do suggest
You must arrange for an original IELTS Test Report Form (TRF) to be sent to
Engineers Australia directly from the Test Centre. The test certificate must be
less than 2 yers old on the date your application form ARRIVES at Engineers
Australia.
Dear Ian, I have gone through your website and it looks really great. Indeed
you are helping needy people and aspirants like me. I wanted your suggestion
on following matter :
I am working in Oil & Gas Industry since year 1997 and placed as Senior
Planning Engineer in an Operating Company.
I did Higher National diploma in Mechanical Engineering (after 12th exams) 3
years fulltime course from India (year 1997) and got selected in Campus
Interview conducted by EPC Major in India itself.
Having worked for various departments initially, I was assigned with Project
Controls work primarily Planning, scheduling, Cost, Engineering & materials
coordination etc. In the process and having spent few years in Project
Controls, I felt necessity to undertake Engineering Graduation course due to
multidiscipline environment of Oil & Gas Projects. Hope you can understand
well because you worked for Worley Parsons !!!
I completed BS in year 2006. In the meantime I left India and worked for
couple of companies in SE Asia including one Engineering & Project
Management Consultancy before moving and joining Present Organization.
My total experience is now exceeding 13 years in this field.
Rgds..Sau
ianlittle said on June 7, 2010 at 12:40 pm
Naga – It does not matter what people in different countries call you. Look at
the ASCO occupation definition. This is what Engineers Australia will use to
assess you. You are clearly an electronics engineer.
In Short,
However, my role is to design and develop Software and Firmware for Digital
boards (Ex. Board Support Package, Device Drivers, and Interrupt
handling…..)
Hi its shyam. I have just simple question. Do i need to subbmit IELTS score to
get access if i have studied 1- 2 years of course in Australia.
Yes
Hi Ian ,
hi Ian.
Joe – You will need to do a CDR as you have not studied in a university in a
Washington Accord signatory country. Accreditation by Engineers Australia is
the only accreditation that is recognised.
hi ian,
one of the projects i want to include in the cdr is some research work i did in
the food industry,.. the problem is that it is related to agricultural science and
not agricultural engineering . Can i still use it and try to explain the
engineering concepts related to the equipment i used?
Elaine – The CDR has to demonstrate how you have employed engineering
competencies in the episode. It is not enough to just write about agricultural
engineering done by others. Write down about ten one line points of things
you are thinking of writing about. Then mark which competencies you can
demonstrate. If there are not enough. Lokk for another topic.
Dear Ian,
You are doing a humanitarian work, God bless you. Ian, please inform me
what sort of books are available that can help engineers getting job easily in
australia.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------
€
â ¢ how you have applied your engineering knowledge and skills;
• that such application meets the competency standards of the relevant
occupational category in Australia.
APPENDIX D
Professional Engineer
The project consisted of upgrading the main switchboard for the Acme
Widget Company. It was my responsibility to determine the total power
requirements for the new plant, calculate the power consumption of the
existing plant and determine the maximum available power supplied through
an existing board and the 11kV/415V transformer.After analysing the
available information, I deduced that at least three alternatives for powering
the new plant existed. A separate 11kV feeder could be brought onto the site
to energise a new transformer and main board, the existing main board could
be replaced with a new board or the existing main board could be upgraded.
The last two options required the feeder cables to the main board to be
upgraded.
Technically, all three options were acceptable, although the first two allowed
for a greater flexibility for expansion in future years.I prepared estimates for
each of the options. The client engineer indicated that minimising the capital
cost of the plant was of a higher priority than enhanced flexibility for
expansion. On this basis, I issued a written recommendation indicating that,
although other technical solutions existed, the upgrading of the main board
involved the lowest capital cost and still provided the new plant with
sufficient power requirements. The client accepted this option.I selected and
sized power cables using Powerpack software. I simulated the limits in
current-carrying capacity and length of runs on the basis of voltage drop
using this tool. I also performed simulation of the maximum number of cables
that could be installed on a single cable ladder and in underground
conduits.For the PLC system I applied a functional specification already in use
by our Company. A subsection of this specification listed requirements of a
Factory Acceptable Test (FAT) to be conducted at the configuration
supplier’s premises. I designed this test, the aim of which was to provide
the consulting engineer with a reasonable confidence in the PLC software
before it was installed and commissioned on-site. In a controlled
environment and using the same PLC system hardware configuration to be
installed on-site, various input signals were generated through a test rig to
simulate field instruments. PLC outputs were recorded to verify the intended
operation of the PLC program, as specified in the functional specification.
During the test, a number of problems surfaced with the configuration. The
client engineer was present at the test and, after consultation with him, I
gave recommendations and directions to the PLC programmer to overcome
perceived problems and improve operation of the plant. E3.1 – Determines
engineering requirementsC2.3 – Implements planning and design
processC2.4 -
Signature of Candidate:
I verify that the above narrative is a true account of the candidates own work
Signature:
The elements claimed in the above example are for a chartered status
application. The competency elements for qualifications assessment for
migration are given in the Migration Skills Assessment Handbook.
Hi,
Rehan Idrees
The Australian Department of Immigration and Citizenship web site has the
Australian Skills Recognition Information (ASRI) page. This page tells you the
eligibility requirements for each occupation category.
Once you have selected your occupation code you need to go to the
Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) website to obtain a fuller description of
typical tasks for your chosen occupation.
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/0/5C244FD9D252CFC8CA25697E
00184D35?opendocument
Hai,
I am a civil engineer with a relevant experience of 3.5 years. i am in the initial
process of applying for skilled migrant visa. I have cleared my IELTS in
Academic module with 7.5, 6, 6.5, 6.5 in the respective facets.
Please clarify it to me
a) if i can use this (academic module) for the visa process or i have to write
the IELTS again in the General Training Module.
b) Is it for sure that IELTS general training module with 7 in each facet shall
only be useful to get a job there in australia.
Srini – The academic IELTS test is a higher level than the general test. You will
not have to repeat the test. It is not essential to have an IELTS of 7 in all
facets. There are some areas where it may be required. Experience shows
that the better your English is, the easier it will be for you to get a job.
Work hard on your English as you prepare to migrate . Project Australi: Land
that Engineering Job in Australia provides many useful tips on how you can
do this and learn the Australian engineering language..
Hai,
Thanks……
Introduction: 50 words
Dear Madam,
I came up with this thought because I want to secure a PR visa before they
change the rules again. Moreover a PR visa will allow me to be regarded as a
local student in the University hence giving me less fee benefits.
Aakash – Check with a migration agent, but as I see it – whatever you are
studying will not help you towards visa points for two years. Also, you do not
qualify for work experience points. (see DIAC Booklet 6.)
I agree with your thinking. It will be easier for you to do your CDRs now while
all is fresh in your mind and you can get the work experience episodes
validated easily.
The Australian Department of Immigration and Citizenship web site has the
Australian Skills Recognition Information (ASRI) page. This page tells you the
eligibility requirements for each occupation category.
Once you have selected your occupation code you need to go to the
Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) website to obtain a fuller description of
typical tasks for your chosen occupation.
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/0/5C244FD9D252CFC8CA25697E
00184D35?opendocument
Kindly help ..
Hi,
I have done Diploma in Tool & Die making and had applied for Skilled worker
visa and had my my medical almost, due to address changes, I missed the due
date. Subsequently I enhanced my qualification to BSc in Information
Systems. Though I continued my profession in Mechanical Engineering and
am currently working in USA for Caterpillar as Senior Engineer in Mechanical
field. I have around 13 years of experience and one my mechanical design has
been applied for patent. Can I get my competency evaluated for Professional
engineer with a Bachelor’s degree in other field. My diploma is considered as
equivalent to Diploma in Mech. Eng.
Govind
€
â ¢ how you have applied your engineering knowledge and skills
• that such application meets the competency standards of the relevant
occupational category in Australia.
Regds..
Tauseef – I really have no idea how the government will react. t may depend
on your engineering discipline. i think your Englisj level is a bigger concern.
Hi
Another thing, I tend to talk and obviously write alot, during my CDR i am
surprised that instead of the 1000 recommended word per episode, i wrote
maybe 5000. Is that an up or a down ?
Raed – Yes you do write a lot ! A 5,000 word episode report is a problem. An
important writing skill is to be concise. Your episode reports must be within
the limits stated by Engineers Australia; the body of a CER is 500 -1000 words.
You have to have taken your IELTS test within 2 years of making your
application for assessment to Engineers Australia.
The general test should be easier and enable you to get hiogher scores.
You will not need a licence to practice in Australia. In Queensland you will
need to be registered if you are to take responsibility and approving designs.
It will greatly help your chances of getting a job if you have your
qualifications assessed by Engineers Australia. Australian employers are
worried about the quality of qualifications from some overseas countries. If
you can show Engineers Australia accreditation, it removes that concern.
Ali
Once you have selected your occupation code you need to go to the
Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) website to obtain a fuller description of
typical tasks for your chosen occupation.
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/0/5C244FD9D252CFC8CA25697E
00184D35?opendocument
http://www.tribuslingua.com.au/blog/category/qualifications-assessment
Dear sir
Narendra – University lecturers are not on the MODL or any other of the lists.
As you have no engineering experience you will struggle to convince
assessors you are an engineer. Even if you did manage to get a visa, how
would youget a job in the current climate? Effectively you are an old
graduate competing against Australians with good English.
The Australian Department of Immigration and Citizenship web site has the
Australian Skills Recognition Information (ASRI) page. This page tells you the
eligibility requirements for each occupation category.
Have a look at the occupations you think you can demonstrate you have the
qualifications and work experience. Note that Engineers Australia assesses
you on your undergraduate qualification.
Once you have selected your occupation code you need to go to the
Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) website to obtain a fuller description of
typical tasks for your chosen occupation.
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/0/5C244FD9D252CFC8CA25697E
00184D35?opendocument
http://www.tribuslingua.com.au/blog/category/qualifications-assessment
Only your work experience after you have completed your degree will be
relevant for demonstrating the competencies as a professional engineer
Dear sir,
Hi,
Once after immigration, is there a hard and fast rule that i need to work as a
techie (since that has been the basis of all my scores) or can i opt for Sales
and Marketing (since thats the immediate career goal that i have)?
Dears ;
i am a Computer And Systems Engineers , i got my Bsc in engineersing from
Egypt , also i passed Ielts exam with scores L=9 ,R= 7.5 ,S=7 , W=7 , i have 3
years and 9 months of work experience in the Telecommunications field as a
Network Operation Center Engineer , my career episodes could indicate that
clearly in addition to some very specific Electronics work , so i would like to
know if i can apply for Engineers Australia as an Electronic Engineer to get the
opportunity for priority processing ? is it any possibility that they will assess
my job as Electronic engineer based on my work experience rather than a
computer and systems engineer based on my qualifications ?
Daniel – This depends on the particular subjects you took in your course. For
Engineers Australia to assess you as an engineer you will have to write a CDR
to show competencies that demonstrate you meet the ASCO definition of an
electronics engineer. It looks to me that your telecommuniccations work may
look more in the ICT area. You need to look closely at the complete
occupation definitions.
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/0/5C244FD9D252CFC8CA25697E
00184D35?opendocument
thanks
Daniel
mohamed – I do not know. We did have some problems with the blog site
last week. Please try again.
Happy – Sorry I have no CDR examples. There are four sources of experience
for your career episodes:
€
â ¢ your undergraduate experience, in particular your project work
Greetings,
and currently I am working for an OIL and GAS goverment company for the
past 1 and half year,but again my job title is INSTRUMENT TECHNICIAN
although i am doing all the job that is required from an engineer.
I have take IELTS test in last december and i got L:6.5 R:7 S:7.7 W:6.5 but its
not directed to the AUSTRALIA ENGINEERS.
so my enquiry is will my career description is enough to pass skills
assessment of AUSTRALIA ENGINEERS
Mohamed – For the IELTS test, all you need is the general test. There is no
special IELTS test for Engineers Australia. AEI-NOOSR will asses your
qualification at a cost of $450. If you are living in Australia the state Overseas
Qualifications Units (OQUs) will assess qualifications as a free service.
However the only assessment that matters is the assessment by Engineers
Australia. Don’t waste your time or money trying anywhere else for
assessment. You have two issues you need to think about : (1) getting your
qualifications assessed as a professional engineer, and (2) getting an
engineering job in Australia. With your work experience the jobs you are
likel;y to get are as an engineering technologist. In the instrument and
controls engineering field their is not a great difference between the
technologists and engineering occupations.
For assessment you need to prepare a CDR with three career episode reports
that show you have the skills and abilities of a professional electrical engineer.
What you job title has been is not helpful but not necessarily fatal. You need
to write about the tasks you nave done which show you have engineering
understanding attitudes and skills.
The Australian Department of Immigration and Citizenship web site has the
Australian Skills Recognition Information (ASRI) page. This page tells you the
eligibility requirements for each occupation category.
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/0/5C244FD9D252CFC8CA25697E
00184D35?opendocument
ianlittle
thanks alot dear and sorry for the multi post….i will go through the websites
u gave and certainly come back in case i got an enquiry,one more ,how to
check if my academic qualifications are recognised in australia will the AE also
assess it along with my CDR?
regards
i have taken academic test in ielts and score 7. IS it necessary to take general
test again to demostrate CDR. or academic test will be enough.
Amrit- Well done. The academic test is a higher level than the general test. It
will be more than enough.
Dear Ian,
“(Tick box) A police good conduct/character certificate for each person aged
16 years or over included in the application, for each country, including
Australia, lived in for more than 12 months over the past 10 years”. However,
on the page Character and penal clearance requirements
http://www.immi.gov.au/allforms/character-requirements/ it said
If you are applying in Australia, you should provide this information with your
application”.
Also, one of the requirements for qualifications and experience stated in the
Visa Application Checklist is
Q3: I am not too sure about how one’s age is determined. As it is said on the
website, the age is determined by “the day of making your applcation”. Is
that the day when you lodge your application or the day when your
application is processed?
Thanks,
Misa
Amrit – Use the number of words as the guide. Less is better than more. You
do not have a lot of words to play with so you must not waste them with
irrelevant detail. With every sentence you write, ask this question – “Do
these words tell about something I have done personally; actions which show
I have applied a competency unit and demonstrated a role of my chosen
occupation?”
http://www.immi.gov.au/asri/
Your qualifications and work experience do not seem to match. I do not like
your chances of success for a couple of years at least. You may also need to
do some IT training as well.
Hi, was wandering if you can clarify some things for me. I am an electronic
engineer and recently completed my MBA in Tech. I work at a security
camera installation company as an electronic engineer. HOwever i have only
worked at this place for two years. HOw many years of experience does one
require to be eligible for PR and can my designation be an electronics
engineer since i only work in a installation company and not a manufacturing
company.
All the IT courses should help you get recognition for prior learning (RPL)
from ACS. You need to read all the information and make your own decision
on which occupation suits your situation best. It is a mix of work experience,
qualifications and what type of visa you are eligible for. At this point in time
you need an occupation on the critical skills list to have any chance.
Out of 3 career episode, is it possible to write two of them about the projects
that i have done during my 7th and 8th semester. Since i have only one year
experience on my related field( electronics engineer) i am being unable to
write 2 career episode from my company. In the seventh semester i had done
a project on optical fiber and this project does not come under the course
syllabus(i.e. there is no marking of this project, this is just an extra project i
have done).
hi,
Thanks for your Replies in this blog. I have completed my Under graduation in
Computer and Communication Engineering (4 Yr) . Before that I completed
Diploma In Electronics (3 Year). I have done some Projects on Electronics
related field when I was perusing this diploma and done some project works
in under graduate course also. Can I write those project works in Career
Episode both done in Diploma and B.Sc Engg. Pls help me in this regard.
Thanks
Deepak – If you are so out of touch with what is happening in the worls at the
moments, I would say your chances are nil. You wouuld be competing against
graduates and would need to be applying now.
Vishnu – You either have not read the requirements or do not understand
them. The requirements are clear. Read and follow the instructions. The
Migration Skills Assessment Handbook provides specific details on
assessment requirements, competency demonstration reports (CDRs), and
the format and length of the career episode reports (CERs). Read this from
cover to cover before you start writing. Download the handbook from the
Engineers Australia website : http://www.engineersaustralia.org.au/
Midhum – You have a non recognised qualification and will need to do a CDR
as India is only in the process of becoming a Wasshington Accord signatory.
I need to know do i have to send the HSSC certificate & transcripts along with
my bachelors degree & transcripts to Engineer Australia for the CDR
assesment ? or only bachelors degree & transcripts will be enough ?
ianlittle said on April 15, 2009 at 12:03 pm
Raheel – Only send your bachelor degree transcript. Engineers Australia will
know the requirements to get into the course.
Hi. Ianlittle,
Its nice to know that some1 out of nowhere is helping people with their
aussie immigration concerns..Thanks for the effort..
Also I dont see any mention of Engineering for telecom personel hence I am
assumin I should apply under Engineering:Electronics engg.
Rahul – I agree with you on all points. As your undergraduate degre is from
India you will need to do a CDR.
Hi,
Please help me
Sairam – You should be able to get a career episode out of tour final year
project. You need to look at any electronic & communications engineering
tasks you have done and deal with them as mini projects. If you are doing
general QA tasks you probably will struggle to obtain a positive assessment.
You are not in a good position to get a job in Australia with your lack of
engineering experience. if you are looking at migration as a way to change
career path you could be very disappointed.
Hi,
4) When writing the CDR do I have to put the sub section of each career
episode in the same order
Or can I put the relevant index numbers at places where I have supporting
information in the sub section (meaning that sometimes the order ET 1.1 ET
1.2 … will not be preserved)
5) Note that when writing career episode most of the subsection overlaps
and If I write a small text to support each and every sub section my CDR will
reach over 5000 words. The booklet is bit miss leading, when it comes to
word count. Please Let me know how many words there should be for
“each†career episode?
Aravinda
A final year project is a good source for a career episode and is acceptable.
You write each career episoe as a story I think it is best to number the
paragraphs in each career episode and put the references to competencies
wherever they come up. The Summary Staement provide the cross
referencing to pull the whole CDR together.
STICK TO THE WORD COUNT.You will find that easier by wirting a story of
what you have done.
Do not expect to cover every point in detail. After all you do not expect to get
100% in every examination. The CDR is to demonstrate through your actions
you have engineering competencies at the level you are applying for.
Hello Ian
Would like to apply for PR Am already work visa (457) and working in
Australia for 13 months. What is the process to apply for a PR?
Some of my friends told me that I need to apply for an assessment with IEA
and others told me that I don’t require. I am confused and want your opinion.
I hold a PhD and have published in Intl Journals will that be ok if can
substitute the CDR episodes with these pubs.?
Is there any reliable website where I can assess myself whether to write a
CDR or not.
Giri – Go to the FAQ page and read the answer to question 1 – that gives you
the links you need to assess your situation.
http://www.tribuslingua.com.au/blog/faqs-for-engineering-migrants-to-
australia#comments
Hi,
Srinath
Hello!
I didn’t know back then that the projects I give as example have any influence
on my ASCO code outcome.
I applied for visa when I got my ASCO code from Engineers Australia but
failed because of lack of experience.
Now I want to apply again for visa, I got my IELTS with more then 7 at each.
But in the background of world crisis and Critical Skills List I was thinking of
reapplying and giving example of projects in my CDR that would fit a job
description on the Critical Skills List.(because according to my recent
experience I do fit one of those demanded jobs)
Thank you!
Marius
Engineers Australia would not have failed you because of lack of experience.
Assessment is competency based. You would have failed because you did not
demonstrate you have the competencies for the occupation level you were
applying for. Your CDR must demonstrate you have the competencies of a
professional engineer as they are defined in the Skills Assessment Handbook
and the technical skills for the occupation as defined for ASCO code by the
Australian Bureau of Statistics.
This does not appear on the Skilled Occupation List (SOL) and Employer
Nomination Scheme Occupation List (ENSOL). This is form 1121i from the
Australian Department of Immigration and Citizenship web site. This page
tells you the eligibility requirements for each occupation category –
http://www.immi.gov.au
http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/0/5C244FD9D252CFC8CA25697E
00184D35?opendocument
Maryam – Sorry I gave some false information last time with a wrong ASCO
code. Agricultural engineer occupation ASCO code is 2129-13
Factors to consider are: the subjects you did in your university course, the
nature of your work, and the points you get for the occupation you nominate
towards a skilled migrant visa for the occupation and work experience
components. I suggest you talk this over with a migration agent.
Ham – No. We will not do this. Part of the process is demonstrating report
writing skills. If you have UK qualifications you should be able to get
qualifications through the Washington Accord.
i want to apply for pr visa. i am preparing CDR also. How long it will take to
get skills assessment from engineers australia and how long lit will take to get
pr visa
Hi,
I checked the ABET web site and they say that Engineering programs outside
USA are accredited as substantially equivalent to the programs in the USA.
I have been told that I still need to do CDR for my engineering degree, even
though, ABET is a member of Washington ACCORD. Can you please confirm if
I still need to do the CDR. ?
It does not matter what you are supposed to do in your job or you job title.
Every salesman is called a manager so they can try and get into customers at
manager level. It is what you have done to be able to demonstrate the
competencies of a professional engineer or manager. Compare the
competencies of both and assess how well you can demonstrate the
competencies of either.
Thanks for the response. Please note that the Accreditation Board for
Engineering and Technology (ABET) is representing in Washington Accord.
See this link:
http://www.washingtonaccord.org/Washington-Accord/signatories.cfm
I agree with you that I can not pass as an Engineering Manager, as I can not
show the required experince in my current role and experince…
Rami – The real test is – is your course , including institute and year listed on
the Washington Accord site ? The Engineers Australia rules are (which you
can in read the Migration Skills Assessment booklet) that to be eligible under
the Washington Accord you must have a degree from an Washington Accord
accredited course completed in the country of a Washington Accord
signatory. The UAE is not a signatory. ABET is about accreditation for the USA,
not for Australia.
Farhan
Farhan – You will need an IELTS test if English is not the language of the
country on your passport.
hi,
Regards,
Nisarg
ianlittle,
IELTS certificate to them; in this case how do they going to track it as I’m
VBR,
Phanta
I know that the assessment fee of CDR is Aus$ 450. Can you please tell me
what is the visa application fee?
Phanta
Hi ianlittle,
I think my one of my questions need some corrections with its wordings, so
let me repeat it.
IELTS certificate to Engineers Australia through the test centre; in this case
how do they going to track my IELTS certificate as the certificate & CDR are
sending seperately. What should I do in order to let them know that I have
send my IELTS certificate to them?
Please advice.
Thanks.
Phanta
Phanta – Do not send your IELTS test certificate anywhere. Read the
instructions in the Migration Skills Assessment booklet and follow them word
for word. Have some one who has completed the application process check
everything for you. The main reason for delays in processing is because
applications are incomplete.
See section D1 – Original English language test (IELTS) result You must
arrange for this to be forwarded directly to Engineers Australia from the Test
Centre
You need to provide the IELTS test centre with details so the IELTS test centre
can send the IELTS test result to Engineers Australia.
Go to the Department of Immigration and Citizenship website to find out the
cost of a visa application.
Hi ianlittle
Hi ianlittle,
Thank you very much for the support, I really appreciate your kind co-
operation.
Thanks again.
Phanta
Hi Ian Little, I found most of your answers informative and useful. Thanks a
lot
3. If at all I seek jobs on CAD domain what kind of emphasis should be given
for while preparing the career episodes??
Gautam – Quite frankly all areas are down at the moment, particularly the
motor industry and manufacturing. But it is expected that the shortages of
the past will re-emerge when things pick up. Australia has failed to train
enough engineers for years. I think your design experience is the thing to
highlight. CAD is just a tool. The real skill si the ability to design machines.
Hi Ian little,
Also is it necessary that all points mentioned on the ABS website for
electronics engg. should be covered in CDR?
Amit – You really mean the occupation you nominate for your visa
application. Obviously you want to try and fit within an occupation which is
on the CSL (these must be on the MODL) to obtain priority for visa
assessment.
I suggest that you go to the Engineers Australia website and submit your
question directly to them.
Hi I am Sam,
Sam – You can choose any occupation you believe you meet the
qualifications, experience and can demonstrate the competencies for. Got to
our MODL, CSL, SOL and ENSOL – Australian Migration Lists blog and follow
the link to the skills recognition site. This will show you the requirements for
the different occupations.
Dear Ian:
This blog is providing great help and guidance to the people who want to get
thier skills assessed from EA.
1. What will be your advise if i write one of my career episode based on re-
building activities of a gas turbine. Do you think will it make it ?
There are a number of LNG plants being planned for construction in the next
two or three years. These facilities and the plants feeding gas to them will
provide great opportunities for rotating machinery engineers.
I’m from Sri Lanka & I sent my application & CDR together with all other
documents to Engineers Australia (I have a BSc Engineer degree)on 23rd June
2009. Here are my questions:.
Thank you.
VBR,
Mahesh
You should have sent your application by courier or registered post. These
applications are too important to just put in a letterbox and hope
Hi ianlittle,
Thank you!
Phanta – In some countries, such as Canada and the USA, and also in
Queensland Australia, you need to be registered to practice as a professional
engineer. If you have a similar licence or registration in any state or country
you have worked, Engineers Australia would like you to send a certified copy
of the registration certificate. A certied copy is one signed by an approved
person. The people who can do this are listed in the Migration Skills
Assessment booklet.
My Career episodes have exceeded the words limits of 2000 words. Will i be
asked to condense it ?
Mike – I reckon you are more likely to have you CDR downgraded or rejected
rather than being asked to condense it. How silly are you not to follow the
instructions? Engineers Australia have that many applications they are not
going to mess around with one from some one who does not understand the
guidelines. Response time to applications are slowing judging by comments i
have seen. Last week I saw a comment that an application for an occupation
on the CSL list took more than 12 months. Don’t pack your suitcase.
Hello,
I was given the responsibility for managing another project where there was
hardly any Mechanical Engineering related tasks involved, but it was more to
do with managing of the total project. Specifically it was a project for the
design and implementation of a floodlighting system for a outdoor sports
field.
Hello,
Do I have to nominate the occupation (and hence produce a CDR for skills
assessment) that I have been involved in for at least 12 of the last 24 months
or can it also be an occupation done before my current occupation (covering
a period of less than 12 months of the last 24) and a CDR produced for skills
assessed for that occupation.
My current occupation (for 14 months of the last 24) matches the skills levels
of “Industrial Engineer” whereas my experiences from the earlier occupation
would fit the skills required for a Mechanical Engineer.
Lamcha – Select your occupation after assessing how well you can
demonstrate competencies to get your qualifications accredited, and the
most points you get in the points test. You should have enough work
experience in either occupation to write a credible CDR. It is likely to be
easier to get accreditation based on your undergraduate degree. If your
degree is mechanical apply as a mechanical, if it is industrial, apply as an
industrial.
Hi ianlittle,
I have a BSc. Eng degree & I prepare my CDR (I followed the guide lines
provided at their website) & sent to Engineers Australia on June 22nd. So far I
did not receive a letter or receipt from them so I still do not know whether
they receive my CDR or not. But I received a receipt which says that the
National Bank of Australia received the fee I paid to Engineers Australia. (Aus
$ 450)
Thanks.
VBR,
Mahesh
Phanta – Just wait – You know they have your application. It will probably
take 2 -3 months.
Thanks
Puneet Bali
Ahsan – Have a look at the detail in the ASCO occupation definition on the
Australian Bureau of Statistics site. 2126-13 is production engineer. there are
only a limited number of job definitions in the ASCO definitions. You have to
pick an occupation which is closest to yours. By closest means contains a
range of similar engineering skills. For example plant engineer is similar to
mechanical engineer in many respects. You have to pick what you can from
the definitions to demonstrate competencies. It is not what you have been
called or what your job title is – it is the competencies you can demonstrate.
Hi Ian,
I am in a phase of writing Cdr, for this I thought to ask you that can i include
my final year Bsc Electrical Engineering project as my career episode. For this
what I suppose to write in summary paragraph and the title of position
occupied, please suggest.
Hi Ian,
Would in my academic like I mentioned earlier in final year Bsc Electrical
Engineering project, the organization chat is necessary?
Usman – It is asked for, so give it. All simple. It may only show your
department head, supervisor and any other members in your group if it was a
group project. At all times follow the instructions to the letter. Do not give
the assessors any reason to knock you back by not having an incomplete CDR.
hi ian.. thank you .. your answers are really helpful.. i also need to ask a small
thing.. in the above example of a CER it shows a candidates verifier’s name
and his signature.. who would that be??? coz i don’t have any work
experience, i just finished my masters studies in biomedical engineering. and
there is no gap between my bachelors and masters..
Zeeshan – The verifier is the person who is managing you. If you are a
student, it is the Head of the faculty or the supervisor or your project..
Hi Ian,
Many thanks for your advice. It really helped me a lot in writing complete
CDR. I have a question regarding compiling of CDR. Do I need to arrange the
printed CDR in a booklet form or just arrange the CDR by the separated titles?
Usman – Just keep the CERs as three separate documents. Label them Clearly
CER1, CER2 and CER3. Make sure you have all pages named and numbered in
a footer. Try the drop test. If you dropped all the pagesf your complete CDR
and they scattered all over the floor, can someone else easily pick them all up
and put them back in order. The instructions specifcally tell you not to bind
the CER. Engineers Australia like to pull the CDR apart !!.
Dear Ianlittle, I’m very surprised for the job you do on this blog. I want to say
thanks like many others and I hope you can give me a hand:
I’m a Chilean guy, 32 years old, married and dad of a little girl. I’m an
Engineer with a 5 years career at the Pontifical Catholic University, but I think
my degree only exist here in Chile, and is literaly translate as Constructor
Engineer, maybe could be Builder Engineer?. Also during 2008, I completed a
one year Diploma (Operational Management). I have 7+ years experience but
my best job until now, has been the Plant Engineer in an industrial
manufactur plant, during almost 2 years. To obtain that work, I worked as
part of the construction team for the construction of this new plant, and
finally the Plant Manager did offers me the possition to continue working
with them.
So, my question is, due to my recent experience could be aplying for a
“Production or Plant Engineer” 2126-13 and complete my 3 CDRs based on
that experience and different projects that I managed.
– “ –
JP Have you considered Engineer Building and Engineering
″
Professionals not elsewhere classified 2129-79 I think you could write CERs
around this. It is also consistent with your qualifications. I doubt if you can
succeed as a production engineer becuase that is not you base training
qualification. You will only succedd if you can demonstrate that parts of the
competencies in your building qualification are relevant to production
engineering.
Hi ianlittle,
I sent my CDR to Engineers Australia on 23rd of June 2009. But I still didn’t
get the result. What should I do now? Please advice!
Thanks.
VBR,
Mahesh
Phanta – Be patient and wait. Engineers Australia have a long backlog at the
moment.
JP said on September 23, 2009 at 5:29 am
Now, taking account your comment, when you suggest 2129-79 I read about
it on the ASCO, and at the end, the descrption mention 3 occupations… I feel
my degree doesn’t match with it. These three occupations are like a guide o
my qualification should be one off the 3??
Thank you.
Hi ianlittle,
Thanks.
I really appreciate what you are doing to help & guide the people like us
regarding this subject.
Thanks.
VBR,
Mahesh
Hi Ian,
1. How important it is to stick to the given word limit for each of the 4
sections of the CER? Do the assessors actually count the words? The problem
I am facing is that there is a huge number of competency elements to be
proven and the given word limit is too small for all the elements to fit in.
Regards,
Hammad.
Hammad –
1 It is very important to stay within the word limits. Engineers Australia will
not count the words but they can see the number of pages. Part of the
challenge is to be able to assess what is important and what is not. Look at
each sentence and ask yourself- “What element of a competency does this
demonstrate?” if you cannot answer this, delete the sentence. Do not try and
address every element individually, address the overall competency. The
elements should be considered as typical of the sorts of activities within a
competency. Remember no one is expected to get 100% in an exam. Cover
what is important.
3 If you have a formal written job description for any job you have had,
include it. If you have not had a formal job description list,in dot form, the
tasks you were expected to do. Such as:
Regards,
Its over 3.5 months since i sent my application to Engineers Australia under
CDR category but still no acknowlegement or response has been given from
EA. Pleae advise if i have to send them an email to update my status ?
Hi,
Thanks,
Orion.
Orion – No probelm. It does not help for qualifications assessemnt or for visa
application as it is not relevant because it is before you have gained your
qualification. It will help you get a job in Australia though.
Dear Ian:
Thanks again,
Orion.
Orion – Your final year project is a good topic. You have to display the
competencies of a professional engineer. You do not have to have
engineering experience. Hopefully you have done some jobs (projects) which
you used the engineering competencies. something that went wrong where
you had to analyse the cuase and evelop a solution are very good for CERs.
Orion.
1.The CER attached contains about 500 words. The Migration Skill
Assessment Booklet says spesifically that each nerrative should contain a
minimum of 1000 words. Is the attached CER a good reference? if not, where
is it possible to get a good example of a nerrative?
Thanks (again)
Orion
Orion – Sorry for causing confusion. This example is for application for
chartered status. It is only an example of the style of writing you must use in
a CER. Notice that it is a simple narrative style written in the first person
using the terminology of engineering competencies. It is not an example of a
CER.
The letters relate to the competency elements which are listed in the
Summary. For this example you would need to cross check against the
Engineers Australia handbook for chatered engineer. The competencies from
the CER Summary would be:
My apologies for the confusion. I did not want to change the Enginerrs
Australia example.
Thank Ian.
The Migration Skills Assessment Booklet says that I have to rpovide employer
reference letters. But does not state what should be included in such a letter.
thanks,
Orion
Orion – The employer reference letter must say you have been employed as a
professional engineer and when you started and finished the employment as
a professional engineer. Legally that is all an Australian employer can provide.
Any work that requires validation for a CER must be separately validated on
your CV.
Hi!
I am a Mechanical Engineer and an MBA from India with over 6 years of work
experience in our family business of manufacturing engineering components.
I have worked both in the capacities of Professional Engineer and Sales &
Marketing Manager for our business. I am planning to get my engineering
assessed by EA. Kindly advise me if for writing my CDR I should concentrate
only on my technical projects undertaken in our manufacturing business or
can I also write about various product developments, Sales & Marketing
initiatives that I have carried out to win new business for our company? I am
planning to get my credentials assessed as an Engineering Manager.
Hi,
Can you please tell me what is the maximum time I can wait without applying
for a visa? (I don’t want my CDR result to be expired!)
Thanks.
Phanta – You will have to ask an immigration agent about visa issues. On
second thoughts, have a look at the FAQ page on Engineers Australia site. The
assessment result does not expire , but IEAust charge a fee to update it after
a couple of years I think.
Hi Ian, Thanks a lot for your reply. I’m having expertise in heavy engineering
& semi conductor domains. Through out my 5 years of experience I am
involved in the generation of mechanical design concepts, modelling &
creating manufacturing drawings. I provide design support for the client.
Some times I need to handle small teams to meet the deliveries to the client.
So, as per your clarification, I hopefully come under mechanical engineer.
Here I have one more question. Will there be any change in visa process for
professional engineer and engineering technologist (with respect to
immigration points).
help me please
Sameh – I think the first thing you need to do is to improve your English. A
high level of English makes it easier for you to understand the engineering
competencies in the Migration Skills Asssessment Handbook, it will also mean
you can write your CERs better, write a better CV and perform better in a Job
interview. Go to our FAQ page and get the links to the appropriate web site
to provide the information you need.
hi Ian,
I am a mechanical engineer and have more than six years of experience in the
following
Can i claim points under the category of mechanical engineer? and can u give
me some advice on writing my CDR
Regards
Thanks for the response,i saw the task description for a mechanical engineer
and i think you are right, it will be Little difficult to write 3 career episodes(as
a mechanical engineer) with the current experience. Now I also saw the task
description of Production or Plant Engineer and Industrial Engineer and i
think it will be much easier to write the career episodes with one of these
nominated occupation, Now the questions are
2) Industrial is not in the current critical skill list that means the process will
be delayed and can you give an idea by how many months?
3) If you are not successful in the assessment process can you relauch your
application if yes then how many times?
Regards
Hi ian
Dear brothers,
I am writing my career episodes for CDR these days. I have a query regarding
the “Personal Workplace Activity” section.
The professional projects I am presenting in my CDR requires more amount
of data to be included than mentioned in the MSA booklet. As per the
booklet we can only include 1000 words in “personal workplace activity”
section whereas 02 of my career episodes contains around 2000 words (5 A4
size pages) in the “personal workplace activity” sections. Is there as strist
restriction regarding the word count for a CDR episode? Please guide.
Adeel – Yes there is. Part of the test is to be able to write concise English.
Look at every sentence and ask yourself which competency that sentence
demonstrates. If you cannot link a sentence to a competency, delete it. Most
sentences should start with I – I calculated, I assessed, I designed, I
planned….take out all the things about the companies and how everyone
appreciated your efforts. Stick with the facts. Each CER should be around ten
paragraphs of about ten lines. About six or so sentences in each paragraph.
Thanks Ian,
wanted to get it more clear from you before I proceed into it, the two project
from my bachelors will present my electronics skill but the project option
that I have from my masters is one of the electronics project but that is a very
small n simple project compared to my bachelors, so will that do?
Or else, I have done a project in “network design for a school and clinic” but
it would be totally computing field, so will this project be outside the
boundaries of electronics professional??
would need your help further when I get into writing this..
cheers
Hi Ian,
i would like to know the font & font size for writing the CDR.Any
recommendations regarding the Header,Footer and Paragraph settings?
Regards,
Waqas
Waqas – Use font styles you would normally use in a technical report.
Something like Arial 10 point. Put the page numbering your name and the cer
number in the footer, such as:
Bfeor you send off youur CDR apply the drop test. You should be able to drop
your CDR on the floor and have a stranger pick it up and put all the pages
back in order. This needs every page of ebery documenet to be numbered
and include the document title.
Kindly support
Adeel – You need a specific reference letter for any period you have used for
a career episode report. For other experience a reference letter will do.
hi lan,
tintin78
Hi there,
First of all I really want to appreciate the work that you are doing for so many
people. I read quite a few entries above and was amazed by your responses.
Hope I can also get some good feedback from you.
Second option is Engineers Australia which I am not really sure about if they
will recognize my Electronics degree despite me having all my experience in
IT and not pursuing my electronics skills by any means. I can still write my
CDR with 3 career episodes related to electronics and communication work I
did during my engineering. Would that help?
Will Engineers Australia object on me working in IT but getting myself
accessed as an Electronics Engineer.
Beck
As you note – the problem you will have is you will have no occupation work
experience as an engineer to get those points towards a visa.
Go to the ACS site (links from our FAQ page) and look in detail at their
requirements for qualifications. This takes into consideration the subjects you
have done during your electronics and communications degree. You may
have sufficient computer type subjects to be assessed as equivalent to a
computer engineer.
hi Lan,
thank you very much for your kind support.I am an indian and preparing my
CDR which I am going to send from berlin,Germany.If I get my documents
certified from India(by a doctor) and send them along with CDR,will it be
allright?If not, please let me know where I should go in Berlin for it.
Tintin
See clause 5 of section A of the Engineers Australia Migration Skills
Assessment booklet for a list of the classes of persons authorised to certify
documents. Doctors are not on the list! – so that will not work. So find a
person, such as a lawyer, on this list. Look for an Australian Embassy or Trade
mission in Berlin if you cannot find one of the other classess of people. It is
very important to get the certification correct. Follow the rules to the word.
Do not make any assumptions. IKL
Hi Ian!
I just want to ask if there was a specified format to be used in writing my CPD?
Thank you!
Emmanuel
Juanito – This is not unusual. The additional information required for areas of
experience used in CERs will have to be included in your CV.
Adeel – You can do whatever enables you to demonstrate all the engineering
competencies. To work out which is best, do outlines of about 10 single lines
(each about an engineering action) for each career episode report topic. Then
assess the competencies each report will demonstrate. Next complete the
summary report. If you do this before you start writing the details, it will help
you work out where you are repeating competencies and where there are
competencies missing.
Hi,
I have done engineering in Mechanical from India. But the experience which i
have is in Information technology in retail domain of 4 years. I have applied
my soft skills which i learnt during college and operations knowledge also. I
know my engineering subjects and work dont match but i need help from you
in terms of how to show in CDR my co relation between subjects and
experience. In IELTS i have scored above 7 in all fields. Also i have 2 years of
marketing experience where i managed around 2000 people under me in
parallel with my work.
Regards,
Abhishek
Your work experience does not need to match qualification – you need to be
able to show in your CERs thst you have the engineering competencies in
your nominated occupation. Do a test run. Select three topics and do outlines
(ten single line points) for each and assess the competencies each CER will
demonstrate. Complete the Summary Statement before you start writing the
detail CERs. This will help you make sure you are not demonstrating one
competency several times and missing out on others. Remember to look at
both the Engineers Australia competencies and the occupation requirements
as listed in the Australian Burea of Statistics (ABS) definition for the
occupation.
ian,
i really appreciate your sincere efforts for bringing solutions . i wish to ask
you that , do i need to submitt my original documnets or photocopy along
with the CDR ? i am applying outside the australia , what would be the fee
package for assessment of my skills .
Hi all,
Juan
thanks in advance
hi,
I am a chemical engineer. I got my degree back in early 2006 and after that I
worked in a fertilizer industry for exact three year. First of those three years
was spent in training while the remaining two I spent as a regular employee
of the company. Now I wana ask if I can include that one year training as an
experince in my CDR? Because in order to apply for professional engineer you
need to have 3 yrs of experience.
Then I came to norway in August 2009 to do masters from Norwegian
university of science and technology, which will be completed in 2011. Does
this give me any edge if I apply for immigration? Should I include it my career
episode when I write my CDR?
Regards
Fahad Saleem
hi,
Just one more thing. Can I use my training period as a career episode? I am
thinking about the three episodes as being 1) my B.Sc final year design
project 2) my first year of professional training 3) 2 yrs of further work…will
that work?
Regards
Fahad Saleem
Fahd- You do not need 3 years experience for skills recognition, all you need
is the equivalent of an Australian 4 year degree and be able to write a CDR
that demonstrates the professional engineering ciompetencies. All the
epeisodes are post graduation so they should be OK, if they demonstrate the
required competencies. The masters does not really help, but can be a source
for a CER. With such good English you should have no problems.
thanx ian…i’ll start working on CDR and would ask if i have any problems
Joynal said on December 25, 2009 at 4:13 pm
Hi Ian thanks for your effort. I am a civil engineer currently working in Dubai
(2+ Exp). I would like to know that in CDR booklet EA asked for employer
reference letter. In case of academic certificate they have written certified
copy however, for employer reference letter they didn’t mentioned
certified. My question is that, do I need to send original one or attested copy?
Please give me solution. I m stuck for this confusion.
Thanks i anticipation.
Joynal – I am not sure. I would think an attested copy would be fine. Any
copies must be current, not validated at some time in the past. i would send
an email to Engineers Australia to confirm. They have an email address on
their website.
Dear Ian,
I have read samples of CER’s in the internet in which they claimed they were
positively assessed in which diagrams, graphs were included in order for
them to expain well their competencies. So, is it also possible to include the
same format in my CER since I think the topic I’ve made also need to include
those kind of things to explain it well.
Emmanuel – You can, but I would not recommend including diagrams and
graphs. Engineers Australia are interested in the engineering competencies
and processes you have used not in the actual results. Your CERs are about
what you have thought about and done, not so much how the details of the
results. For example you could write: ” I plotted the machine performance
test results and observed unexpected variations. I analysed possible causes
and concluded there was an error in one of the inputs. This was corrected
and the test repeated. This time the performance was within specification.”
This demonstrates a number of engineering competencies which you may
miss if you included a graph of the results.
Thanks
Mark.
Hello Ian,
I read all of the forums above but it seems none of of those got the same
scenario that i faced right now. basically Im a BSElectronics and
communication Engineer Grad and i’m been working already for almost 10
yrs but unfortunately non of these work experience fits my Educational
attainment except one though, but on this one i just got 1.5 years experience
as a Product Engineer in a Semiconductor Manufacturing company. now my
questions is:
1. Can I use my 1.5 yr experience since this one fits my BSECE qualification?
3. is there any way I can write down my past and present work experiences
even though is not relevant to my Electronic Engineer qualifications? or is
there by any chance that this experiences might be acredited?
Regards.
If yoiiu have no recent relvant work experience this will affect the points for a
general skilled migration visa.
Hi ianlittle,
I am really glad to see someone helping out people with their PR problems – I
have got one as well. I found 2 or 3 posts slightly related to my problem, but
to confirm it further I am posting here. I would really appreciate if you can
help out.
Regards
Haris
Hello Ian,
I have sent a complete CDR to Engineers Australia via registered post at the
begining of December. Until now I haven’t recieved a receipt from them, nor
was I charged by my credit card. Should I worry that my CDR isn’t attended at
all?
Thanks,
Orion.
Hello Ian,
I’m on the process of making my CV. Based on the migration skills assessment
book, CV should not be more than 3 A4 pages but I’ve already exceeded the
limit pages and if I’m going to follow the allowed number of page, I’m afraid
that some of the important items and contents of my personal details will not
be included. Is it ok if I exceeded more than 3 pages? Thanks.
Regards,
Emmanuel
Emmanuel – Sorry for missing your query – 4 pages maximum if you have
more than 10 years work experience. You must be able to pick out what is
really important for the job you are applying for. It is an important skill to be
able to express yourself concisely. Throw out the less important parts and
emphasize your important attributes. Keep it to 3 pages. Anything longer will
be thrown out without being read.
Dear Ianlittle,
When you said that no recent relevant work experience will affect the points
for a general skill migration visa, are you saying that although i get a positive
result as Mechanical Engineer from Australia Engineers, i could not claim the
60 points because i do not a relevant expereince as a mechanical engineer?
Or you are referring to the additional 10 points toward recent relevant work
expereince.
Franciscus – Sorry for the late responnse. Somehow your comment got lost.
I meant the 10 additional points for recent relevant work experiemce. Your
60 points are fine.
Hi
Thanks
Hi,
I have done BE(Electronics) and also applied for Migration skills assessment
for Australia. I am asked to send CPD to Engineers Australia. But I do not have
any idea about Continuing Professional Development(CPD), can you please
provide me a sample document, so that I can write my own details to prepare
a well-mannered CPD to be send to EA. I have also scored 6.5 Bands in IELTS
Exams.
Thank you.
Hi Ianne. I’m currently on the process of doing my CER. Is it possible that the
sub elements of a competency element were not just included on a single
paragraph? For example, the competency element PE 1.1 have 4 sub
elements. It is possible that 1st sub element was found on the first paragraph,
2nd sub element can be found on the 3rd paragraph, 3rd sub element was
written on the 5th paragraph while the 4th sub elements was included on the
2nd paragraph. Thank you!
Emmanuel – It is highly likely that the elements will be distributed across mor
than one paragraph. You are not required to address all sub-elements. In
writing you should try and gather the parts together. This a communications
skill the assessors will be looking for.
Hi ianlittle.
Shaheen – It will depend on your qualifications, but you will fit under
electronics engineer, but you could also fit under electrical if you qualification
is electrical engineer.
Hi,
I would be 40 in June 2010. If I apply for the immigration before June 2010,
would I be awarded 20 points or 15 points.
Thanks
Salman
Salman – If you apply before June 2010, you will be 39, therefore eligible for
the points of a 39 year old.
Hi Ian,
The booklet mentions the need to have all competency elements assessed
within the 3 episodes.
Does that mean I need to assess all the “bullet points” or is it enough to
identify each one of the 8 “elements of competency”?
Julián
Julian – The instructions state specifically that you should not try and address
every sub-element (bullet point). But you need to address each element in
enough detail to be able to reasonably claim it. The number of sub elements
you need to cover will depend on how well you cover the particular individual
sub elements. I suggest you will need to cover at least half in reasonable
detail. It is really a normal exam approach. Look for better than an average
50% coverage.
Dear Ian
I would like to thank you for your help during my cdr preparation previously
though my comments are not available on this blog now.
Kind Regards,
Rehmat
Rehmat – Read and accept the rules. There is no point in fighting them.
Instrument and mechatronics engineers are covered within the definition of
electronics engineers. Go to the Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) site and
read the ASCO definitions (follow the links from aur FAQ blog page).
Electronics engineers are on the MODL, so as an instrument engineer you are
included. Study and follow the Australian rules. If you are not prepared to
adapt to Australian ways do not bother proceeding with a visa application as
you will spend all your energy fighting “ridiculous” rules. What your are
showing is intolerance. Engineers Australia are trying to help you and you are
ridiculing them. Read the definitions and try to understand them.
Hello,
I ‘ve written much just to make it clear and to deliver a view of the exact
situation.
After facing the practical life in our countries, I mean in Egypt; my country
and currently working and living in Turkey, I found that there is no Design
opportunities in these countries and what have been available to me since I
graduated were maintenance and service jobs.
For example, I worked for BMW and other Multinational companies, in Egypt
the BMW’s factory doesn’t design cars it only assembles, but the R & D
department is in Germany. (I worked as a Workshop Team Leader in the
service center)
Thanks in advance.
And special thanks for your efforts to help people achieve thier aims.
Best Regards
Ahmed
ianlittle said on March 4, 2010 at 11:12 am
I’m a mechanical engineer with MSc degree from Iran and have near to 10
years work experiences as a designer and project manager. I have prepared
three carrier episodes for assessment. They are nearly long each of them has
2000 words and my summary is in six pages. My experiences are so technical
and I have to explain them in detail to describe my main duties. Is 6-page
summary statement true or false?
Regards
Hamid – You must keep within the word limits. The summary statement
should be 2 pages maximum. Preparing CERs is not a technical test. Do not
provide technical detail. Look at each sentence. If it does not show how you
have used an engineering competency cross it out. The CERs must read…I did
this, I did that, I analysed, I designed, I used an engineering competency.
I’m happy considering information you stated for IELTS expire date.
Hamid – A 2000 word report will be throwm out. STICK TO THE WORD LIMIT.
Check through your three CER report and do a brief summary. Delete as
many repeats of competencies as yoiu can. Try to cover each competemcy.
But 2000 words is in accodance to word limit. But I agree with you I have to
write briefly. Each carrer episide is relevant to 3 to 4 years projects and
accept that wirting my duties as a project manager and designer briefly is so
hard . I have explained my detailed tasks as a designer an project manajer
and have omitted lots of daily tasks.
Hamid – A CER is not about writng about the tasks you do. You mast write
about you demomstrate the engineering competencies. You will do many
things on a job which are not relevant to the professional engineering
competencies.
tnx
Samih – No. As you are not working in the field you have qualified as you will
have great difficulty in getting a positive qualifications assessment. You will
also struggle to get a job in the aerospace field as you will not meet security
requirements.
Ianlitte,
I am reading almost all your post relating to your advice for migrant. And
really we all migrants are thankful for your kind efforts.
2.Ian, I am working as Planner in KSA since last 1 year and having a total 5
years experience in Well reputed Petrochemicals Company. Can you please
suggest me ways for minimizing my transition time for getting a job in
Australia?
Thanks,Pratik
Pratik – It is not easy to get a job before you arrive in Austaralia. In Project
Australia I provide a ragnge of avenues for doing this. use yoour industry
contacts. As you work in a global industry you should know people and
companies with Australian links.
Hello Ianlittle,
Here I have one more question; Is it possible that I write the Career Episodes
in the form of narratives (story), instead of writing ‘I did I did’ just to have a
more interesting form?
Thanks in advance
Ahmed
According to some of the answers you’ve written above, I feel that if I wrote
about my job too and my responsiblilites which were mainly in
troubleshooting and maintenance, I would be accredited as an Engineering
Technologist not a professional engineer.
Because the description of an electronics engineer’s occupation is dedicated
in design which I haven’t find a job in, as I explained to your before, so what
do you see?
Ahmed
You have a correct understanding. In your maintenance you may have used
your engineering competencies. You do not have to be a design engineer to
use a professional engineer’s occupation technical skills
hi ian,
regards
fahd saleem
Fahd – Act like a professional engineer and do not use text language in
dealing in professional matters. Your understanding seems correct. You have
fallen into a common trap where by doing study you have lowered your
chances of being eligible for immigration. Look for employer sponsorship.
i would like to ask if there is a standard form for this and what should
comprise the page. because i already drafted a cover page and i am quite
unsure if it will be enough.
Thank you,
gene
Hi Ian,
Is there a certain website for that, actually I don’t know the way.
Please advise.
Ahmed
Ahmed – Find some one to employ you. Buy Project Australia and you will
obtain many possibilities.
hi again,
Fahad Saleem
Hi Ian,
I’m afraid I’ve been asking many questions, but you know that the documents,
are really confusing and most of the people ask about common things, where
it wasn’t realy well explained in the booklets.
Do I need to submit any document for this item? it is stated that [if
necessary], so what do you see?
episode(s)]
Ahmed
ianlittle said on March 23, 2010 at 2:42 pm
Ahmed – If you have a license to practice in the country you are working in at
the moment (as in countries like the USA and Canada) you must provide a
copy of that license. If you do not need one, just put a note saying there is no
license required in the country you are working in.
I have sound expereince but I can not find my skill under mechanical
engineers’ assessment scheme.
Another question is; I have 3-year expereince, am I allowed to use my
graduation project as one of the CDR’s essays?
Samih – You have managed to put yourself into a very difficult situation.
Ideally your qualifications, work experience and chosen occupation should
align for the best chance of success. I think you would be better looking at a
management occupation. Go to our FAQ page and follow the links to
Australian Skills Recognition Information (ASRI) and the Australian Bureau of
Statistics (ABS) websites. For some occupations the ABS site provides more
information. You may be in the Bill Gates category – great experience, but
unable to fit into an Australian occupation definition.
Hi ian,
Thanks a lot
Ahmed
This is only to Thank Thank you very much for taking the time, reading,
thinking to give an answer to every body.
Your answers were very useful for me while writing my CDR, I hope it will
succeed.
You will receive the price of that support in your life in the form of easiness,
progress, and success.
Thanks alot
Ahmed
Hi ian,
Thanks a lot
Andro
Andro – A certificate of employment will only say that you have been
employed by a company between specified dates for the occupation they
nominated. This may come from the human resources department. A
reference letter will have more detail and include comment on the type of
work you have doing. This will come from (or be prepared by) an engineering
manager.
Hi,
I m a Civil Engineer graduate (10+ yrs experience) and I’ve scored overall
band of 6 in IELTS (L-6, R-6, W-5 & S-6). I would like to know, whether I am
eligible to apply for migration? please let me know..
Hi,
but i am having difficulty in writing the 3 cdrs i was searching on internet and
found a website
http://www.cdrsample.com
they are offering a complete sample of all the 3 cdrs and summary writing in
70 UK Pounds.
Umair – The fist page of your CDR includes a declaration that the CDR is all
your own work. Engineers Australia assessors are trained to spot applications
which are copied. There are many people to choose from so why risk your
chances.
Hi guys,
Muhammad – All you need to do is write a list of the various CPD activities
you have undertaken over the last three years. Put them in chronological
order with a brief description. You could do this in a table. If you go to the
Engineers Australia website, you can see an example for applicants for
chartered engineer. This is a bit more complicated, but shows a way of
setting CPD out. You can just do this:
Dear sir,
Dear Sir,
thank you very much for your reply.
But sir my concern is to get positive assesment from Engineers Australia. Now
can I prepare whole 3 CDR of acedemic. will they accept it ?
Hence such experience can consider, if i get positive assessment and logged a
file ?
Best Regards,
madhav
Hi,
Thanks
ianlittle said on May 17, 2010 at 8:04 am
Ahsan – This is a waste of time. There is no law requiring you to work in the
occupation which you have applied for a visa application. Many people
cannot get jobs in their nominated occupation. There is not a significant
difference between electrical and telecomms engineer anyway. The only
reason to apply again would be if the telecomms engineer occupation is not
in the new SOl. It looks like all engineering occupations will be retained in the
new SOL. Wait untill you see the new rules.
If I will add 1 CDR, from my current job profile, then will they cross-check
with my employer ?
Hi
And one more clarification. Somewhere above you mentioned that all the
CDR should consists of 10 paragraphs or just the main body?
Hi,
I wonder if you could help. I have been wishiting to apply for Australia for
such a long time now, I think I have disappeared up my own back side! I have
been waiting for my ocupation to come in, but even now with the new list I’m
still not sure what to do. Any help will be grately appreciated.
I have BSc (Hons.) Computing Systems Analysis & Design in 1999. I worked as
a Systems Analyst for 3 years. Had a break then started with a manufatuer of
DWDM and Ethernet Telecoms equipment in the UK. I worked as a Service
desk Engineer supporting EMEA for 1.5 years. I was then promoted to
Technical Services Engineer – which includes creating and giving training,
field installs, tech support, customer trials etc. I have been doing this now for
2.5 years. My questions are…
Many thanks Ox
Ox – Come off it, you are not really an engineer even if that is your job title.
You are an IT professional. Your occupation will be assessed by the Australian
Computer Society. I do not like your chances as you do not seem to meet the
relevant .work experience requirement. You only have 3 years in the IT
profession.
And as regards the reference letter of the employer verifying a certain job
experience, should it be certified by an authority?
Kostas – As the new SOL is based on ANZSCO I would think that applications
in future will be to ANZSCO. We must wait and see what is announced when
general skilled migrations applications are re-opened. Talk to a migration
agent. The Migration Skills Assessment booklet does not say the reference
letter must be certified, but 12 months or more periods of relevant
experience in your CV must be certified. All copies of original documents
must be certified.
Dear Ian,
DIAC already announced the new SOL. My question is whether they are
planning to review the point test?
ianlittle said on May 21, 2010 at 5:45 am
Rex – Yes, and other things as well. What this will be is unknown. The
changes are expected to be announced in July.
Kostas – Yes “certified” You do not need to get reference letters certified.
You do need to get parts of you CV certified where you have more than 12
months relevat experience to your nominated occupation. I do not
understand your other question.
Kostas – Yes even though you are working as a contractor, your client is
effectively employing you.
Dear Maddam,
I want to know that how can we calculate our points from the Immigration
website, also is it compulsory for evey one to get and IELTS of 7 bands if
applying for immigration. As i have done Masters of Engineering
( Mechancial ) from Australia and presently for last 4 years i have been
working in my home country Pakistan. Is there any type of relaxation in the
IELTS for people like me.
Regards,
Dear ianlittle,
Thanks for the Informatioan. actually i want to know if i get over all 6.5 IELTS
score. then will this be enough for launching the immigration.
Regards,
Hey. I am Electrical engineer and I’ve got my M.S. degree in power system.
But I worked for Nestle Water Company for 5 years as technical manager,
then my career is electronic machinery especially bottle manufacturing
machines. Also I worked with filling line in mineral water factory. In last 2
years I changed my job and I am working in a contractor company as project
manager. Our projects are foundation, tower building and wiring of power
transmission lines. I have experience in a complete 400 kV line structure. My
question is: for writing CDR which field is better? As I mentioned my
university degree is about high voltage electrical systems. But I prefer to work
in a factory as I was for 5 years that need to know electronic, pneumatic and
hydraulic systems. Could you please give me some Information about the
cities of Australia in job opportunity aspect? And about 3 episodes? Thank
you in advance. Yashar from Iran: Sadeghshahamati@gmail.com
Ianlittle,
I’d like to ask you how a certified copy of identity card should be done.
Kostas – Email Engineers Australia with a copy of you identity card and ask
them. There is an email address on their website. It sound like it would be OK
to me as the essential details will be in English. If not a dual language card
would be a waste of time.
Thanks.
Harinder – You should be able to write three CERs from you current
experience. Read through all the comments on this web site and you will
receive a large amount of useful information.
Hello,
I have a few questions to ask regarding the summary statement for engineers
australia.
i have written 3 episodes and i have letters of reference only for two
episodes. i hope this is okay
Valen -talk to a licensed migration agent. There are some interim provisions
which may cover your case during this period. You can get more information
form the DIAC website.
Apoorva said on June 16, 2010 at 5:27 pm
Hello Ian,
This is a question regarding the employer reference letter for each of the
career episodes.
Currently i have based my first two career episodes based on the work done
at my first job. i have a combined reference letter for the entire work stint
completed at the first job.le
For career episode 3 . since i wouldnt want to get a employer reference letter.
as suggested by you. i require a public notary to do the same.
2)In case a notary certifies my work. should i write a summary of work done
by me and this will be certified by the notary.
also iam a finite element analysis engineer and as per engineers australia’s
documentation. my area of work matches the profile of an engineering
technologist. could you also give me a lead regardiing the opportunities for
finite element simulation engineers specialising in product design
Apoorva – Your plan is good. Do both parts. Although you nay be classified as
an engineering technologist you should be able to get an engineering job in
this specialist area.
Hi
I am an instrumentation eng from India- mumbai. Since instrumentation is
not on the SOL i need to get my degree assessed as an Elctronic eng (thts the
closest related I could find). Is it possible to apply for assesment sisce I have
qualified as Instrumentation eng My progects are also mostly automation
related which i im going to try and relate to Electronics. Would knowledge in
PLC help in the electronic assesment?
Hello Ian,
Iam a finite element analyst who has specialised in the area of occupant
safety/seating system finite element simulations. Normally, We are called
CAE engineers ( computer aided engineers) in India, Europe and the USA.
Could you please guide me on what code i should be writing when i submit
my covering letter to EA and also in case no such code exists. how should i go
about the next step?
Apoorva – You need to relate your ANZSCO occupation to your degree title, if
that is possible. You may find a closer occupation in the ANZSCO classification,
The next step is to think about what you are analysing. If it is mechanical
design, determining stresses, I think you are nearest to a mechanical
engineer. Apply as whatever you think is closest. Engineers Australia will
decide what you are closest to
Dear Ian,
How are you?. I have a question that is in fact not related to the title. I am
willing to apply for membership, for that I have contacted Engineers Australia.
They told me to send a photo copy of assessment letter along with the
approved CV. The later is confusing for me as I am not getting the exact
format required by the institute. Secondly I don’t find any one in my area
who is member from Engineers Australia. The only option is court, for that
how I can attain declaration statement in which statement, either along with
the CV statement or not. Can you please guide me with the format required
by Engineers australia as you are also her member.
Stay blessed.
Usman