Build Your Audiences with Apps | Creative Production Design

Build Your Audiences with Apps | Creative Production Design

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winner,
WINTER’S
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BONE
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Alex Gibney’s
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AND THE UNITED STATES
AND THE UNITED STATES
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Spring 2010, Vol. 18, #3 HUMPERS
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Poitras’s
Poitras’s
THE
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1
CONTENTS FILMMAKER SPRING 2010 VOLUME 18 NUMBER 3

50

28 A DAUGHTER’S TALE Set in the Ozarks, Debra Granik’s gritty adaptation of Daniel Woodrell’s novel, Winter’s Bone, was
praised at Sundance earlier this year and walked away with the Grand Prize. With a powerful performance by lead Jennifer Lawrence,
Granik delves into the methamphetamine-dealing mountain countr y of Missouri to follow a young girl searching for her father.
By Scott Macaulay | Photographs by Henny Garfunkel PLUS: Jennifer Lawrence Q&A

34 HOUSE RULES Oscar-winning director Alex Gibney returns to white-collar corruption to examine the incredible rise and
sudden fall of mega-lobbyist Jack Abramoff in Casino Jack and the United States of Money. By Jason Guerrasio | Photograph by
Henny Garfunkel

38 THE MAN WHO WASN’T THERE In The Oath, her follow-up to the Oscar-nominated My Country, My Country, director
Laura Poitras refracts America’s post-9/11 years through the story of two estranged brothers-in-law. One is Osama bin Laden’s
bodyguard, free in Yemen, and the other is bin Laden’s driver, locked away at Guantanamo Bay. By Scott Macaulay

42 DON’T YOU WANT ME Taking their highly improvised storytelling to the mini-major level, the Duplass brothers team with
stars John C. Reilly, Marisa Tomei and Jonah Hill to create Cyrus, an unconventional love story between a man, a woman and her
grown son. By Alicia Van Couvering

44 AN ENTOMOLOGY OF LOVE With Beetle Queen Conquers Tokyo director Jessica Oreck creates a beautiful homage to
an unlikely creature: the insect. Journeying to Japan, Orek shows through a poetic experimental style the country’s unusual love for
bugs. By Michael Tully | Photograph by Richard Koek

50 ROCK IN OPPOSITION Bahman Ghobadi’s No One Knows About Persian Cats mixes documentary and fiction in telling a
musically exuberant, politically charged story set in Iran’s underground rock scene. By Livia Bloom | Translated by Sheida Dayani

54 CURBSIDE Harmony Korine follows up his Mister Lonely with a defiant Nashville-shot stealth feature, Trash Humpers, a
bizarre ode to vandalism, urban decay and VHS tape-trading culture. By Scott Macaulay

2 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010 VOLUME 18 NUMBER 3 ™

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58 STRAIGHT TALK Producer Mike Melissa Silvestri
S. Ryan challenges the current preoc- 24 LOAD & PLAY CONTRIBUTING EDITORS
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60 SET UP 26 THE SUPER 8 Ray Pride
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Alicia Van Couvering highlights the im- Eight thinks that will keep you in the know.
portant collaboration between a film’s CONTRIBUTING PHOTOGRAPHERS
Henny Garfunkel
production designer and cinematogra- REPORTS Richard Koek
Michael Lavine
pher.
8-15 Ciné Rebuilds Haiti, Creative Capital Tom Le Goff
Ilona Lieberman
66 DESIGNS FOR LIVING Is Ten, Hindi New Wave, The Lazarus Effect,
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apps. By Lance Weiler BONE

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All materials become the property of FILMMAKER and cannot be
The Duplass Brothers’ returned unless a stamped, self-addressed envelope is included. FILM-
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18 INDUSTRY BEAT CASINO
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AND THE UNITED STATES
lished four times a year. The title FILMMAKER and “The Magazine of
Independent Film” and logotype are registered trademarks and service
Youthquake: Where is the Under-30s
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Audience For Indie Film? By Anthony $5.95 U.S. / $7.95 Canada
Spring 2010, Vol. 18, #3 HUMPERS
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Laura
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or mechanical, including photocopying, recording or by any informa-
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Reports from Sundance, Berlin & Photo: Henny Garfunkel/Retna Ltd.
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4 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

EDITOR’S LETTER
This issue of Filmmaker is bookended by two pieces representing the twin poles of our
changing independent film world. In his “Culture Hacker” column, Lance Weiler looks at the
Independent Filmmaker Project
potential for apps — iPhone, Android and iPad — to both connect our films to new audiences 68 Jay Street, Suite 425
as well as extend the potential of their narratives. I believe he is right. At Sundance I sat down Brooklyn, NY 11201
Tel: 212-465-8200
with Lance over lunch and he showed me the Android game app he designed for his upcoming Fax: 212-465-8525
feature, HiM, and I can confirm that it is seriously cool. (Look for an upcoming discussion of Email: NewYorkMembership@ifp.org
Website: www.ifp.org
it on the Filmmaker blog.) A couple months later I attended SXSW both on the film and the
interactive side. The film events — the panels and discussions — were informative affairs featur-
ing many key figures participating in what now seems to be one giant rolling conversation about
the future of independent film and both its collapsing old and possible new business models.
BOARD OF DIRECTORS
However, like last year, when I sauntered over to the interactive side I was energized by the Jeffrey Levy-Hinte
Chairman
huge audiences and deep nature of the dialogue. While 200 or so people listened to a group of
industry experts ruminating on VOD as monetized indie film platform, 2,000 would be listening Jewell Jackson McCabe
President
to a speaker like Danah Boyd, whose discussion or publicity and privacy in the Internet age was
inspiring and deeply ethical. My point, though: The crowds, investment capital and even intel- John Schmidt
Treasurer
lectually provocative conversation were definitely over on that side of the convention hall, and if
we are to renew independent media we need some of what those other guys have. Jeanne R. Berney
In the back of the book our Line Items section kicks off with a passionate editorial by producer Mike Anthony Bregman
S. Ryan, who body checks many of the prevailing Indie 2.0 sentiments of the moment. Specifically, he Mark D’Arcy
reacts to the idea that artists should aggregate audiences before making their films, worrying that this Howard Graff
thinking is leading us toward the creation of marketing-driven work. He finds the current focus on Hunter C. Gray
Andrew Karpen
new business models and practices like app development distracting from the goal of discovering and Stephan Paternot
championing new auteurs. I won’t recite all of his positions here — go and read the piece! — but I am Carole Rifkind
sympathetic to his arguments. Like Mike, I look to independent film to supply what mainstream cul- Mark Urman
ture doesn’t. I still remember having my mind blown by Eraserhead during my first weekend in college. Lance Weiler
Would a young David Lynch have been able to construct a viral marketing plan for that film? (Come Adam Yauch
to think of it, if you head over to davidlynch.com you can see that he probably would.)
I don’t see my appreciation of both Lance’s quest to expand film practice beyond the screening Interim Executive Director
Joana Vicente
room and Mike’s mission to make sure our rush toward new business models doesn’t stifle the Web-
disconnected auteur as contradictory at all. I know both these men and can attest that their positions
come from passion, core belief and hard-fought experience — not calculation and received wisdom. After debuting with a program in the 1979 New
I will be attending the premiere of not only Lance’s film, when he makes it, but his app as soon as I York Film Festival, the nonprofit IFP has evolved
into the nation’s oldest and largest organization
can download it. And I can’t wait for the next Béla Tarr film that Mike has been involved with. The
of independent filmmakers, and also the premier
point is to allow film practice to bring us closer to our artistic desires, not farther away from them. advocate for them. Since its start, IFP has supported
the production of 7,000 films and provided resources
See you next issue. to more than 20,000 filmmakers — voices that
Best, otherwise might not have been heard. For additional
information: www.ifp.org.

Scott Macaulay
Editor
CONTRIBUTORS
LIVIA BLOOM (pg. 50) is a film curator. Her writing regularly appears in the film quarterly journal Cinema Scope; she is editor of the book Errol Morris: Interviews (Univer-
sity of Mississippi Press, 2009); and she is the Film Festival Programmer of the 2009 Nantucket Film Festival. HOWARD FEINSTEIN (pg. 21) is a film critic for American
and European publications living in New York. He is a programmer for the Sarajevo Film Festival. BRENT GREEN (pg. 68) is a self-taught animated filmmaker who lives
and works in a barn in rural Cressona, PA. His films have been shown at the Sundance Film Festival (2006-2009), the Rotterdam International Film Festival, the Getty
Museum (LA), Hammer Museum (LA), MoMA (NYC) and all kinds of other festivals, museums and galleries around the world. Green’s work is represented by the Andrew
Edlin Gallery, NYC. BRANDON HARRIS (pg. 24) is a Brooklyn-based writer and filmmaker. GABE KLINGER (pg. 77) is a teacher, writer and programmer who splits
his time between Chicago and Madrid. BEN REKHI (pg. 12) is an award-winning filmmaker and journalist who sees the future of the film industry between Hollywood
and Bollywood and is committed to developing strong ties to both. MIKE S. RYAN (pg. 58) is a NYC based producer, his latest film by Frank V. Ross, Audrey the Trainwreck,
premiered at 2010 SXSW. His upcoming releases include films by Bela Tarr, Todd Solondz and Kelly Reichardt. MICHAEL TULLY (pg. 44) directed the films Silver Jew
and Cocaine Angel and is currently the head writer-editor of HammerToNail.com. He lives in Ditmas Park, Brooklyn. ALICIA VAN COUVERING (pp. 42, 60, 66, 70) has
written about mumblecore, tax credits, union strikes, micro-financing, film festivals and many other things for this magazine. Her production credits include Junebug, Old Joy,
Tadpole and Precious. Recently, she produced Lena Dunham’s Tiny Furniture, the Jury Prize winner of the 2010 SXSW Film Festival.

6 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

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 REPORTS
CINEMATIC RESTORATION
In the Summer ’09 issue we highlighted the Ciné Institue, Haiti’s first free film school. Here filmmaker Annie Nocenti, a teacher at the school,
recounts with her students the horrific earthquake that happened in Haiti in January and how the school is helping in the rebuilding.
“Zaka (Chery Claudel) and I were watching
location footage we shot,” says Ciné Insti-
tute student Fréro Pierre, “and suddenly I
felt my chair shaking and heard a weird
sound like a helicopter and my computer
started to move across the table. I tried
to protect the computer then realized it
was an earthquake.”
On Tuesday, January 12, the Ciné In-
stitute students of Haiti’s first free film
school in Jacmel, Haiti, were in prepro-
duction for three films about water for The
University of Miami’s international water-
awareness project.
“The ground was moving under my feet,”
Frero continues. “The walls started to fall
down. My whole body was covered in dust. I
thought of a movie I saw once about the big
earthquake in Los Angeles, about a catastro-
phe that was supposed to happen in 2012. All
the movie’s images came out of my mind.”
The Ciné Institute was founded by film-
maker David Belle two years ago and is
run by Chief Administrator Paula Hyppolite
8 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
ANNIE NOCENTI (CENTER) AND STUDENTS FROM THE CINÉ INSTITUTE.
and School Director Andrew Bigosinski.
With filmmakers coming from around the
world to teach, the Ciné Institute students
have made short films and attracted the
eye of Francis Ford Coppola, who sent
funds for cameras. The students were
just beginning to get work on commercials
and films. Director Paul Haggis visited the
school and became a supporter.
“I saw Marie Lucie Dubreuse (fellow
student) running from place to place going
crazy,” Fréro says. “Then it stopped shak-
ing. Marie Lucie was paralyzed with fear so
she couldn’t walk. I dragged her into the
street. I could see all the houses falling.
A second quake hit and an artist, Marc Ar-
thur from Fosaj, lifted his hands and cried,
“Jesus, Jesus, Jesus.” Paula cried to Jah
Rasta, “What is happening, Rasta!?”
The roof of the Ciné Institute’s theater
space at the Condorde collapsed. The
school’s walls cracked. It is still not safe
to enter either building. The Ciné Institute
will have to rebuild.
“Paula, Donald Charles (fellow student),
Andrew and I went back into the school to
get cameras,” says Fréro. The studio was
cracked and covered in dust. It was scary
— we were watching the walls to see if they
shook again. We got the cameras safe then
heard people crying, ‘Tsunami, tsunami!’
We saw the ocean coming and started run-
ning. A third shaking hit and more walls
and houses started to fall down. The ocean
came up and hit the Yaquimo Bay Club. I
started to breathe again when I got a few
blocks away, next to the prison. People
were going crazy. Some people were acting
like zombies. Their eyes were rolling. I lost
PHOTO COURTESY OF THE CINÉ INSTITUTE
close friends and family but I couldn’t cry
because there is too much pain. But I have
a hole in my throat and it hurts.”
“When (Ciné student) Simeus Fritzner
called us to ask if we would go shoot, I said
yes. That was the true therapy. I started
to feel better. Then Zach Niles, Annie No-
centi and Bremen Donovan came all the
way from the United States to help teach
 us how to make good reports. When I saw
our footage on CNN I was so proud. I real-
ized I have an importance in the Haitian
community. I could imagine a better future
because of Ciné Institute.”
Despite the loss of both of the Ciné In-
stitute school buildings, the school was
transformed into a functioning newsroom.
Every day since the quake, the students
continue to shoot, making journalistic re-
portage and short documentaries.
“The first shot we took was of the de-
stroyed gas station; Fritzner shot it,” says
Bonga (student Hermane Desorne). “Then
we shot a possessed man’s house and
the little hole where they pulled him out.
He was possessed but that was how he
got the strength to dig out. It felt weird to
be shooting all the damage and dead peo-
ple. I was wondering: Is it true? I thought it
was a movie. I thought I was dreaming, be-
cause I’ve seen movies where weird things
happen, like in Chuck Norris, Jean-Claude
Van Damme and Arnold Schwarzenegger
movies, so I thought this was a movie.
The worst thing was you could see the big
houses stretching… about to fall and then
CINÉ INSTITUTE STUDENTS.
sway back. It was as if they were alive and
struggling to stay up so people could get
out. It was like the quake didn’t want to patiently waiting under boiling sun with noth- a music video with Ciné Institute. The
kill all the people so the buildings pushed ing but their few remaining belongings.” earthquake shifted their efforts from film-
people out before falling.” “David [Belle] and John [Edwards] making to relief. They helped arrange for
“We are still getting crazy-strong after- showed up with the flatbed,” wrote Paul a container full of supplies, including six
shocks,” wrote Bigosinski, a week after Haggis, “and, working with the St. Damien’s generators to power the tent camps, to
the quake, “at least once a day, and usu- staff and the Jenkins-Penn Haiti Relief Or- come to Jacmel on a steamship.
ally more often. These frighteningly quick ganization doctors, they started loading. The school continues to function from a
tremors send us running in all directions. And within hours, a convoy of six vehicles temporary shelter at Kros next to the air-
We work outdoors, sleep outdoors — every- — flatbeds and pickup trucks — drove port, below the roar of endless helicopters.
thing. We are all too tense and frightened slowly over the potholes of the destroyed Ciné Institute’s “Cinema Lumiére,” a proj-
to go inside.” streets of Port-au-Prince to get them to the ect partnered with FilmAid, brings films into
David Belle went to Port-au-Prince and airport, which is a scene out of hell right the tent camps three nights a week. The
began working with doctors in Miami, and now, and into the safe hands of Lt. Col. students have produced 15 short docu-
with the help of actor Sean Penn and Sen- Lee Harvis with the 1st Special Operations mentaries for CBC TV that can be seen on
ator John Edwards, were able to medevac Support Squadron, and their amazing doc- the Ciné Web and right now Bellegarde and
many Haitians with spinal cord injuries to tors, nurses and medical staff.” Rony are out filming the story of a Haitian
hospitals in Miami. Ten of the Ciné Institute students went band that decided to convert from Voodoo
“Not once have we witnessed a single to Los Angeles to work on the 25th anni- to Protestantism because of the quake.
act of aggression or violence,” David Belle versary “We Are the World” music shoot Roudeline Michel is editing a film she’s mak-
PHOTO COURTESY OF THE CINÉ INSTITUTE

wrote after the press was filled with stories
of violence in Port-au-Prince. “To the con-
trary, we have witnessed neighbors help-
ing neighbors and friends helping friends
and strangers. We’ve seen neighbors dig-
ging in rubble with their bare hands to find
survivors. We’ve seen traditional healers
treating the injured; we’ve seen dignified
ceremonies for mass burials and residents
with Lionel Richie, Quincy Jones and Paul
Haggis directing. Other students went to
Port-au-Prince to film children singing “We
Are the World” with director Doug Liman.
They then worked for three weeks at The
Post Factory with Belle and Haggis editing
a film about the earthquake.
Director Jonathan Demme and cinema-
tographer Charles Libin were set to shoot
ing about an 89-year-old woman who lived
through Papa Doc Duvalier and Baby Doc,
and now she’s survived an earthquake. The
old woman does an “earthquake reenact-
ment” for us. “Bom bom bom bom bom!”
she cries, her arms rattling like the quake
that rolled under her feet.
Visit our Web site to see the films: cin-
einstitute.com.

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

 REPORTS
SOMETHING VENTURED
There’s a wonderful irony at the core of
Creative Capital, the arts-funding organi-
zation celebrating its 10th anniversary
with events including a film retrospec-
tive at the Museum of Modern Art in New
York City this spring. An organization that
funds boundary-breaking work by some of
today’s most innovative and often uncon-
ventional artists, Creative Capital is also
an organization that preaches the most
quotidian of skill sets — fiscal manage-
ment, career planning and the necessi-
ties of marketing and promotion.
“I had so many friends who thought this
was a crazy idea,” laughs Creative Capital
executive director and president Ruby Lern-
er over lunch near the organization’s NoHo
office. “The idea of giving artists money but
then providing this whole other set of ser-
vices — they thought it was way too inter-
ventionist and that artists would hate it.”
Quite the contrary, as the 10-year mile-
stone testifies. Creative Capital has sup-
ported more than 400 artists, providing
$20 million in support including not just
traditional grants of up to $50,000 but
also advisory services designed to assist
artists in professionalizing their business
practices. And while Creative Capital’s vi-
sual artists, filmmakers, writers, theater
and dance artists certainly appreciate the
grant monies, if you talk to them they also
10 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
DECASIA.
By Scott Macaulay
wax positively about all that other “inter-
ventionist” stuff. Says Lerner, “I think the
non-money parts of the grant have turned
out to be as important or sometimes
more important than the money itself.”
Still, she admits, “the [Creative Capital
program] is like being in a relationship
with a high-maintenance spouse — it isn’t
right for everybody!”
Creative Capital was born in 1999 at a
very specific political moment. During the
“culture wars” of the mid-’90s, the Nation-
al Endowment for the Arts had gotten rid
of its grants to individual artists, killing an
entire subsidy category as a response to
the political pressure created by a handful
of controversial grants. Lerner left her po-
sition as executive director of Association
of Independent Film and Videomakers to
head up Creative Capital, which was prin-
cipally backed at the outset by the Andy
Warhol Foundation. Its president, Arch
THE ZO.
Gillies, was what Lerner calls a “driving
force” in Creative Capital’s formation. She
says, “I think initially the idea was that this
would be kind of a fellowship program, just
to replace the lost fellowships. But I think
because of that dot-com moment, when
venture capital sort of made its way into
the public consciousness, people who had
made money in new-economy businesses
were turning philanthropic. They looked
at traditional philanthropy and thought,
‘Who would do business this way? Maybe
there is another way to think about phi-
lanthropy?’ So the whole kind of venture
philanthropy movement was born. There
were no manifestations of those ideas in
the cultural arena, and so it was decided
that Creative Capital would be just that: an
experiment to see if you could take those
ideas and translate them into something
that would work in support of individual
artists. It was like, ‘Individual artists, ven-
ture capital, go!’”
What developed was a four-part pro-
gram. Explains Lerner, “The first part is
supporting the [artist’s] project, which is
mostly about money and meetings. Next is
supporting the person beyond the project,
which is the skills-building part of what we
do. Then there is helping artists build re-
lationships with people in the field, and
then the last is engaging the public, which
we do by being an information broker.”
Of the skills-building part, Lerner stress-
es that Creative Capital isn’t an organiza-
tion that writes a check and waits for the
final report. She employs a comparison
from the for-profit world: “Just because
somebody has a fantastic business idea,
they don’t necessarily have all the skills
and tools to realize that idea. How many
businesses have faltered because the per-
son had a great idea but didn’t know how
to balance a checkbook or their idea? The
idea is that you surround somebody who
has a good idea with external resources
that help the idea succeed.”
The third step, the relationship-building
part, has as its focus Creative Capital’s
yearly retreat. Artists and arts profes-
sionals are invited to a college campus
for a summer weekend, and the panels
and seminars are mixed in with marathon
presentations in which grantees present
their works in progress. The retreats are
stimulating and inspirational affairs where
see page 72
Stop Wasting Time. Sure, pulling three straight all-nighters
to get your Alliance past the Horde and
safely into the distant lands of Mulat may

Start Making Movies.

have been heroic, but was it productive?
When it’s all you, making a movie can be
a time consuming business. Don’t waste
time with second-rate talent. Go with the
pros and use one of SAG’s Low Budget
Agreements.

The AbMaster wouldn’t battle a three-

headed dog before getting armed with
a grenade launcher or magic sword. You
shouldn’t take on your next production

sagindie.org before getting armed with professional

actors at affordable rates.
 REPORTS
THE HINDI NEW WAVE
Namaste! Welcome to Indian cinema. The
world’s largest film industry, India produc-
es more than 1,100 films per year, roughly
a third of which are Hindi-speaking or “Bol-
lywood” films. A word play on “Bombay”
plus “Hollywood,” Bollywood is known the
world over for stories of true love, its signa-
ture bright colors, and its non-stop singing
and dancing. But there is a new movement
currently underway in the Indian film indus-
try, and it may just be what the subconti-
nent and the world needs. Similar to what
happened in Hollywood in the ’60s and
’70s, Bollywood is undergoing a massive
cultural shift in content and conscious-
ness. There are new voices and new audi-
ences that are reinventing Indian cinema
as a major player on the global stage. This
is the Hindi New Wave.
“This new generation is making films
because they want to make films, not be-
cause they want to make money,” says
Anurag Kashyap, the undeclared pioneer
of the Hindi New Wave. At 37, Kashyap
has directed seven motion pictures across
all genres — think Steven Soderbergh in
the ’90s. Kashyap plays by his own rules.
And now, both Hollywood and Bollywood
are chasing after him wanting a piece of
the action. Danny Boyle hired Kashyap as
a consultant on Slumdog Millionaire after
seeing the slum sequences of his terrorist-
12 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
By Ben Rekh
themed film Black Friday. Kashyap recently
signed an unprecedented nine-picture
deal with UTV Motion Pictures, the most
progressive film studio in India. With more
than 30 credits to his name as writer, direc-
tor and producer, Kashyap leads an army
of creative rebels behind him. “These are
the new voices of the new people.”
In 2009 Kashyap’s Dev. D broke into
Bollywood and created mayhem with its
revolutionary style and controversial con-
tent. A clever reinvention of the classic
Bengali tale Devdas, the film explores
themes and storylines previously taboo
in India. An alcoholic spinster trolls for
drugs and prostitutes on the dark streets
of Delhi. A young schoolgirl is ostracized
by her friends and family after her sex vid-
eo circulates around the country. The film
was a forceful punch to the face of Bolly-
wood bubblegum. Kashyap describes the
origins with his collaborator and leading
actor, Abhay Deol: “Abhay told me a story
he wanted to do about a man who falls
in love with a stripper, and this guy was
self-destructive like Devdas.” Adds Deol,
“No one had ever imagined this modern
spin on the classic tale. At its core, the
film is about addiction, a theme as rel-
evant today as ever.” Made for under a
million dollars, Dev. D gave voice to the
angst of the country’s youth and became
LSD: LOVE, SEX AUR DHOKHA.
an instant cult classic.
 “We went from having only one TV sta-
tion that would play for only two hours a
day to the 24-hour programming of MTV,”
explains Deol, citing the opening up of the
Indian economy in 1991 as a major influ-
ence on the new filmmakers’ credo. “Our
generation saw the transition happen in
our lifetimes.” In addition to Dev. D, ac-
tor-producer-youth icon Abhay Deol stars
in several groundbreaking films includ-
ing the international co-production Road
Movie and the darkly comedic Oye Lucky!
Lucky Oye! The latter is co-written and di-
rected by the third axis of the New Wave,
visionary filmmaker Dibakar Banerjee.
Born and raised in Delhi, Banerjee
wowed audiences with his first two films.
Khosla Ka Ghosla! (Khosla’s Nest) por-
trays a suburban family terrorized by an un-
derworld landowner who lays claim to their
abode. Oye Lucky! charts the incredible
rise and fall of one of Delhi’s most notori-
ous thieves. But nothing could prepare au-
diences for his latest venture: LSD: Love,
Sex Aur Dhokha (“and Lies”), a shocking
portrait of India’s modern youth. The first
digital feature produced in India, LSD fol-
lows three desperate and disparate tales,
all told via the protagonists’ cameras. In
the first, an aspiring filmmaker directs a
see page 72
From the film Structurally Sound. Photo by Amanda Bose.

Photo by Tom Nowak

announCing ColuMbia College ChiCago’s new
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colum.edu/mpc
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
 REPORTS
RESURRECTION By Jason Guerrasio
For more than a decade the news out
of Africa about its fight against the AIDS
pandemic has been grave. Much of the
continent is uneducated about the virus,
children are still born with HIV or become
orphans because of it, and the money
sent to help people in need is often si-
phoned by corrupt governments.
But recently there’s been a glimmer of
hope, as Lance Bangs chronicles in his
intimate documentary The Lazarus Effect.
Originated through Bono’s (RED), the U2
singer’s “not a charity” that directs private
sector funds to the purchase of antiretro-
viral drugs (ARVs) for AIDS sufferers in Af-
rica, the film chronicles Bangs’s journeys to
Zambia to show how these ARVs are greatly
improving the health of infected Africans.
Known for directing music videos for
Sonic Youth, R.E.M. and Green Day in the
’90s, and most recently his behind-the-
scenes documentaries for films like Be-
ing John Malkovich, Be Kind Rewind and
Where the Wild Things Are, Bangs was
working with Spike Jonze on their doc Tell
Them Anything You Want: A Portrait of Mau-
14 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
BEFORE AND AFTER PHOTOS OF A SUBJECT IN THE LAZARUS EFFECT.
rice Sendak when he learned of (RED)’s
project. “I had friends who died of AIDS
in the ’80s and ’90s,” Bangs says. “Then
I stopped hearing that much about AIDS,
and with the ARVs being so accessible in
the West, I didn’t understand all of the rea-
sons why there wasn’t the same access
in the rest of the world.” Bangs jumped on
a plane and spent two weeks in clinics in
Zambia last May filming people who were
just starting to take the ARVs. The trip also
gave Bangs ideas on how he wanted to tell
the story. “I didn’t want to make a film
where white people are commenting about
Africans,” he says, “I wanted to show peo-
ple in their daily lives.” Bangs also knew
the most striking visuals of the film would
be the transformations of his subjects.
He returned two more times to Zambia
to capture the drastic change in his sub-
jects’ health through ARVs, which are pro-
vided to Africans for free and have treated
more than three million people there. One
of the most amazing moments is when
Bangs interviews a young girl with HIV
— the virus making her unable to grow,
she sits next to her mother and looks like
the size of a large doll. When Bangs re-
turns three months later the girl’s health
improves to the point where she can play
with other kids. The Africans have dubbed
ARVs “The Lazarus Effect.”
Though Bangs admits he was caught up
in what he was seeing, the reality is there’s
a lot more work to be done as 3,800 peo-
ple in Africa still die every day due to HIV/
AIDS. “Dr. Phiri, who’s in the film, said to
me, ‘This is never going to get solved until
we as Africans learn about cutting trans-
mission and preventing the spread of [the
PHOTO BY: JONX PILLERMER/THE PERSUADERS, LLC.
virus]. It would be great to make the medi-
cation in our own country and not rely on
outside governments. We need to learn to
take care of ourselves.’”
Spike Jonze is executive producer and
HBO will air the film in May. Bangs hopes
audiences will see that we shouldn’t give
up on Africa. “The way that [Africans] have
dropped the rate of people dying is an
amazing thing,” he says, “so I hope people
get a sense that aid to Africa can work and
be effective. It is not a bottomless pit.”

FILM FORUM AT 40
Celebrating its 40th anniversary this
year, Film Forum has long been essential
to the New York City cinephile. Whether
rediscovering the classics or premiering
new works, the cinema’s longtime direc-
tor Karen Cooper has consistently priori-
tized quality over the bottom line. And, as
this celebratory time underscores, she
never looks back.
“As much as this moment is rooted in
our 40th anniversary,” Cooper says, “I
am a very forward-looking person and an
antisentimentalist.”
However there are certain moments
and films that Cooper looks back on
warmly: the move to the twin-screen
cinema on Watts Street, and finally to
its current triplex on West Houston St.;
Bruce Goldstein’s important repertor y
COOPER PHOTO BY: ROBIN HOLLAND; MARQUEE PHOTO BY: PETER AARON/ESTO
programming — arguably the most im-
portant in the U.S. — brought new au-
diences and new publicity; and a good
number of seminal independent docu-
mentaries have also passed memorably
through Film Forum’s doors, like Crumb,
Paris Is Burning and Atomic Café.
Documentaries have always been where
Cooper’s heart is, and in recognition of
the crucial role she has played in non-
fiction film premieres, MoMa sponsored
“Karen Cooper Carte Blanche: 40 Years
of Documentary Premieres at Film Fo-
rum” this past February. MoMa screened
Cooper’s personal selection of past Film
Forum documentary premieres, ranging
from Nathaniel Kahn’s My Architect to
Jennie Livingston’s Paris Is Burning.
By Jaimie Stettin
Cooper says the goal of Film Forum
has always been to create “a balance be-
tween more esoteric films and the ones
that had been financially and critically ac-
claimed,” and she does that with her co-
programmer Mike Maggiore by attending
the major festivals — Berlin, Amsterdam,
Cannes, Sundance and Toronto — and
also newer, emerging ones. A recent grant
from the Robert Sterling Clark Founda-
tion will send them to African, Asian and
Latin American Film Festivals in the next
few years. Cooper believes this diversity
has set Film Forum apart from other art-
house theaters in the country, and num-
bers confirm that opinion. According to
Cooper, 2009/2010 is panning out to be
a 300,000-person audience year. “They
can’t all be filmmakers and they can’t all
be SoHo artists,” she jokes.
In terms of upcoming premieres, Coo-
per is excited for the April screening of
Connie Field’s Have You Heard from Jo-
hannesburg?, which she considers “a
really epic, in-depth documentary of the
antiapartheid movement.” This fall, Film
Forum will show Kings of Pastry, a recent
documentary by D.A. Pennebaker and
Chris Hegedus, one of Cooper’s favorite
filmmaking teams. Pennebaker’s land-
mark Dylan documentary Don’t Look Back
is, according to Cooper, “one of the best
documentaries ever made.”
“I remember when Karen started her
theater uptown and thinking, ‘At last
there’s someone in the movie-showing
business who’s interested in something
(LEFT) FILM FORUM DIRECTOR KAREN COOPER.
besides selling popcorn,’” Pennebaker
says via e-mail. “It almost got us think-
ing about renting an old theater on Eighth
Avenue and trying it ourselves. Almost. I
think people should do what they know
how to do best, and she was clearly going
to be better at it than anyone else, includ-
ing us.” Pennebaker says with no takers
Stateside for Kings of Pastry they weren’t
sure what to do with the film. “It seemed
like a disaster. So we showed it to Karen,
and she said, ‘Sure.’ It makes me feel
like the frog that got kissed.”
Besides skillfully selecting films, Cooper
is keeping the physical theater itself up-to-
date. She’s redesigning Film Forum’s light-
ing with lower-impact fluorescents, and the
concession stand now carries healthier
snacks like dried fruits and nuts (though
Cooper’s favorite remains the orange cake
with chocolate frosting). And, “We twitter,”
Cooper proudly declares. “Well, I don’t
twitter, but someone here does.”
After 40 years, can Karen Cooper pick
out a favorite film she’s shown? “You
know, I think the pleasure of my position
has really not emanated from showing
one film or even a group of films but hav-
ing had the freedom to show all kinds of
films. The fact that we presented narra-
tives, documentaries and work like Mat-
thew Barney’s Cremaster series, and
animated films — there’s a tremendous
diversity. And I think there’s a cer tain
joy and fun to having that kind of free-
dom. That’s more impor tant to me than
any one title.”
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
 COLUMNS
CULTURE HACKER INDUSTRY BEAT | FEST CIRCUIT | GAME ENGINE | LOAD & PLAY | THE SUPER 8
WANT TO BUILD AN AUDIENCE?
START MAKING APPS
BY LANCE WEILER
It’s a known fact that the film industry has
no shortage of middlemen. The path between
filmmaker and audience is littered with them
— some good, some bad. But the promise of
a direct connection to an audience has become
the currency of the future. These days it seems
as if everyone is trying to find a way to capi-
talize on fostering stronger relationships with
audiences. Much of these efforts are focused
after the film is finished when it comes time to
promote and market the work. Although some
filmmakers are including audience development
in their initial business plans, many are still only
working to build awareness around traditional
elements such as theatrical, DVD and VOD.
Are we missing a window of opportunity
by limiting ourselves to formats, running
times and traditional markets?
Consider the following:
• To date, Apple has shipped more than 70
million iPhone and iPod Touch devices and it’s
projected that within the next two years they’ll
have more than 200 million in the market.
• More than 140,000 applications have
been created for the iPhone and iPod.
• Each day, 60,000 Android devices ship.
• The fledging Android Market has more
than 10,000 apps.
16 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
HiM.
These stats are just one part of a growing
mobile device market, which is currently ex-
panding due to a new generation of tablets.
Apple’s iPad and a slew of other computer and
handset manufacturers have tablets entering
the market over the next few months. Larger
screens, faster processors, wireless connectiv-
ity and the ability to run various browser and
mobile-based applications will all be here soon.
We don’t know yet if this generation of tablets
will resonate with consumers but, as we have
seen in the past, devices do have the ability to
influence user behavior and consumption. The
iPod revitalized the value of a music track and
now the publishing industry is hoping the iPad
can do the same for books and zines.
For the time being, these devices all offer
opportunities for filmmakers to reach audi-
ences directly, with little to no intervention
from middlemen. While the selling of a film on
iTunes requires a filmmaker to go through one
or maybe two aggregators, it is possible to go di-
rect to the App Store as long as the mobile app
receives approval from Apple. Android allows
you to rapidly prototype so that beta testing can
be done directly with users thus enabling access
to a diversity of handsets right out of the gate.
An area of growth within the mobile mar-
ket will come from embracing apps as a sto-
rytelling device. For instance, geolocational
services that enable users to connect and
share experiences have become popular in
recent months. Foursquare and Gowalla are
two companies that are leading the category.
Early adopters are not the only ones taking
note — Foursquare recently inked a deal with
Bravo that has viewers and fans of their pro-
grams “checking in” to various locations they
visit and along the way earning badges and
status within the community.
Joseph Stump, CTO of SimpleGeo, a com-
pany that provides ready-to-use infrastructure
for locational-based services and solutions,
believes that location is going to be a part of
everything we do. “The biggest shake-ups
are going to come in social networking and
gaming,” he says. “I see location now where
social features were a decade ago. Social fea-
tures made large corpuses of data interesting
and relevant based on a person’s social circle. I
think location provides another view into data
that makes it extremely relevant to the user.”
Where Data Meets Storytelling
Mobile apps offer not only a direct channel to
audiences but they carry your story to places
where the audience will consume it. As stories
travel they can harvest a variety of data such
as: GPS coordinates, viewer preferences and/
or contact info. This data can be filtered and
used in a variety of ways to enhance a story. For
instance, media (video, audio, photos) can be
released to viewers when they reach a certain
location, data can be used to connect audience
members who share similar interests around a
story, and characters can contact players direct-
ly via SMS, e-mail or even phone calls.
With my newest feature/transmedia proj-
ect HiM, my company Seize the Media,
which specializes in story architecture (design
and delivery of stories), is hard at work on a
series of mobile applications and Web brows-
er-based extensions. Our efforts are focused
on an area known as Contextual Storytelling
— the use of data to enhance and customize
the delivery of story elements and social en-
tertainment experiences to audiences.
Pandemic is a transmedia property that re-
sides within the storyworld of HiM. The game
enables players to step into the shoes of the
protagonist as they are forced to scavenge for
food and encouraged to search for other survi-
vors. One core feature of the game enables the
player to create a 360-degree panoramic view of
a space. By standing and snapping pictures in a
see page 73
 COLUMNS
CULTURE HACKER INDUSTRY BEAT FEST CIRCUIT | GAME ENGINE | LOAD & PLAY | THE SUPER 8
YOUTHQUAKE: WHERE IS THE
UNDER-30s AUDIENCE FOR INDIE FILM?
BY ANTHONY KAUFMAN
Question: “When was the last time you went to an arthouse?”
Answer: “Years ago. I watch everything online. I don’t have time to go to the cinema.”
While this reply from Alex Johnson, a 30-
year-old interactive strategist, filmmaker and
co-founder of WBP Labs, doesn’t speak for
an entire generation of new movie consum-
ers, it certainly begs the question: What is the
future of the indie movie-going audience?
As Ted Hope recently noted on his blog
trulyfreefilm.com, “It is really surprising how
few true indie films speak to a youth audi-
ence. In this country we’ve had Kevin Smith
and Napoleon Dynamite, but nothing that was
youth and also truly on the art spectrum like
Run Lola Run or the French New Wave.”
Distributors have the evidence to sup-
port such concerns. IFC Films’ marketing
head Ryan Werner says American indie films
with a younger bent, whether the work of Joe
Swanberg, Andrew Bujalski or Barry Jenkins,
are the hardest to connect to their audience,
and not just in theaters, but on VOD and
DVD, as well. “There isn’t a tougher breed of
film right now,” he says.
Many industry insiders had hoped Lynn
Shelton’s Humpday, distributed by Magno-
lia, would break out, but the film underper-
18 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
BREAKING UPWARDS.
formed. “The main thrust was about married
people getting older,” says Magnolia Pictures’
Eamonn Bowles, so younger audiences stayed
away.
What is the consequence of this disconnect
between millennials — those aged 18 to 29
— and today’s American indie cinema? As
New York Times critic Manohla Dargis wrote
in a piece that picked up on Hope’s blog, “Any
future alternative film culture will depend on
the cultivation of younger patrons,” she wrote.
Not only that, but this is a demographic, she
added, “who are used to receiving much if not
all of their entertainment at home and on
handheld devices.”
Indeed, WBP Labs’ Johnson says, “I’ll
stream movies on Netflix, rent from my Xbox,
use torrents, whatever is easiest. If I can watch
something on my cell phone, I will.” Because
in the new age of watching-whatever-you-
want-whenever-you-want, according to
Johnson, “it’s really about being able to watch
it immediately and talk to other people about
it and be a part of that conversation.”
For Johnson, the kind of buzz that once
drove young people to see cult movies doesn’t
happen around alternative theatrical releases
so much as popular torrents, pointing to the
success of freely pirated movies such as Jamin
Winans’s sci-fi indie Ink (downloaded by
more than 400,000 people on BitTorrent in a
few days after it was leaked).
Johnson also suggests that “event-izing” a
film can work for both big movies — like Twi-
light-watching parties — and small movies, if a
group of like-minded young folks can embrace
seeing a film as a social happening.
Tim League, the founder of the Alamo
Drafthouse and Fantastic Fest in Austin,
Tex., agrees. He says one of the best ways to
reach out to younger audiences is “to make
the moviegoing experience more than just
paying 10 bucks to see a movie” by adding
events such as preshow video entertainment,
food tie-ins or bringing in celebrity guests.
New York City’s IFC Center also frequently
hosts director Q&As in a hipster atmosphere,
while the Gen Art Film Festival has always
lured younger audiences with its “7 Premieres,
7 Parties” format.
Similarly, the Film Society of Lincoln
Center recently rebranded its Young Friends
of Film program as “The New Wave,” aimed
at cultivating arthouse audiences through a
social gathering-like atmosphere, with post-
screening conversations and parties, says New
Wave board member Michael Shulman, a
28-year-old actor (Party of Five) and indie
producer (Sherman’s Way). “My friends want
to see great independent films, but they don’t
know they exist,” says Schulman. “But people
come see these events if there’s a basis of un-
derstanding that the experience will be a fun
and enlightening one.”
In other words, it comes down to trust. “It
requires us to be part of that experience,” says
League. “Our niche audiences know us, and
we hang out with them and listen to what
they like and don’t like.”
Similarly, 26-year-old filmmaker-promot-
er Todd Sklar, whose Range Life Entertain-
ment takes “awesome movies” on tour across
the U.S., explains that their cross-country
grassroots campaign can do what most dis-
tributors can’t: “Being at the screenings, doing
events, panels and workshops and getting the
PHOTO BY: ALEX BERGMAN
audience excited to talk about the films af-
terwards.” Sklar notes that comedies do par-
ticularly well with the university crowd, such
as films like his own feature Box Elder and
Dan Eckman’s Mystery Team, which grossed
see page 73
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 COLUMNS
CULTURE HACKER | INDUSTRY BEAT FEST CIRCUIT GAME ENGINE | LOAD & PLAY | THE SUPER 8
REPORTS FROM SUNDANCE, BERLIN & ROTTERDAM
Sundance Film Festival
BY SCOTT MACAULAY
It is now almost three months after the Sun-
dance Film Festival. I will leave it to you to
decide whether or not the revolution prom-
ised by the festival’s marketing materials
(“This is the renewed rebellion,” proclaimed
the program book) materialized, but I think
it is safe that the 26th edition of the Park City
festival ( Jan. 21-31) will not be filed along-
side May ’68, the formation of the Dziga
Vertov group or the drafting of the Futur-
ist Manifesto in the history books. In fact, I
doubt that many of the folks who actually at-
tended Sundance noticed the guerilla intent.
Debra Granik’s excellent Winter’s Bone won
the Grand Jury Prize, and, indeed, it is the
kind of film the festival has traditionally cele-
brated. There was a large sale — The Kids Are
All Right to Focus Features — from veteran
Sundance filmmaker, Lisa Cholodenko, who
found success there with earlier features High
Art and Laurel Canyon. And, as always, the
festival was the launching pad for quite a few
important documentaries, including Laura
Poitras’s The Oath, Lucy Walker’s Wasteland,
and Tim Hetherington & Sebastian Junger’s
documentary Grand Jury Prize winner Re-
stropo. New discoveries included Detroit-
based Sultan Sharrief with his Bilal’s Stand
and Philadelphia’s Tanya Hamilton with her
Night Catches Us, both of which were subse-
quently picked up for New Directors/New
Films; actor Josh Radnor transitioning to
directing with his Audience Award-winning
happythankyoumoreplease; and Todd and Brad
20 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
EXIT THROUGH THE GIFT SHOP.
Barnes for their Homewrecker, which won a
prize as the “Best” of the festival’s new low-
budget NEXT section.
In the end, then, was Sundance’s revolu-
tionary rhetoric just a marketing come-on
and ready-made lede for sleep-deprived jour-
nalists looking for an easy angle? (As you’ll
note from my posts at the Filmmaker blog I
firmly place myself in that group.) Not neces-
sarily. Discounting the marketing hype a bit,
there were big changes at Sundance this year,
but some of them were felt not at Park City
but in theaters and living rooms far away from
the festival. Sundance USA brought premier-
ing films like Philip Seymour Hoffman’s Jack
Goes Boating to art houses around the country
concurrent with the main festival, and a part-
nership with YouTube saw other festival films
streaming to online viewers. For new fest
director John Cooper, taking over for long-
time head Geoff Gilmore, these small initia-
tives lay the groundwork for future editions
in which Sundance will more directly engage
the current problematics of the independent
industry it helped create.
Maybe these weren’t huge changes, but their
modesty was of a piece with the festival. Coo-
per and his director of programming Trevor
Groth were so buoyant in their debut outing
that their attitude was infectious. While the
marketing said one thing, the overall vibe
emanating from the festival’s programmers
was one of cheerful experimentation, a lack of
self-importance, and an encouraging willing-
ness to reconsider the role a festival plays in
the ecosystem of independent film.
My favorite film at the festival was a sur-
prise screening not listed in the program
guide. Banksy’s Exit Through the Gift Shop
is a brilliantly made and entertainingly con-
founding sort-of documentary that morphs
from a portrait of the reclusive British con-
ceptual artist to one of Thierry Guetta, an
amateur French documentarian who, in the
course of making a movie about street art-
ists, becomes a successful one himself. “You
know it’s a mock documentary,” a friend told
me beforehand. I didn’t, but with his thick ac-
cent and memorable mustache, Guetta would
seem to have come right out of Central Cast-
ing. Later I learned that my friend was wrong
and that Guetta is for real and something of
an art-world scourge. (Some believe that he
is a “creation” of Banksy’s.) I had to rethink
the film and Banksy’s reality manipulations
before deciding that I liked it just as much.
It’s an enormously witty, gently satirical film
laced with Banksy’s realization that his out-
sider ethos and conceptual art tool kit are eas-
ily appropriated by others to financially if not
artistically rewarding ends.
Another best-of-the-fest favorite — al-
though I saw it months ago right after Cannes
— was Josh and Benny Safdie’s Daddy Long-
legs. It’s the story of Lenny (Ronald Bron-
stein), a projectionist and divorced dad, and it’s
set two weeks during the summertime when
he has custody of his two young sons. Lenny’s
lifestyle is both perpetually frazzled and com-
pulsively bohemian, and his take on parent-
hood is somewhere between unaffected love
and a call to child services. Lenny is based on
the Safdies’ own dad, and their ability to weave
their complicated emotions about him into a
work that is alternately shocking, free-spirited
and joyful is a testament to their extraordinary
emotional intelligence as directors.
Other strong works included Derek Cian-
france’s Blue Valentine, moment for moment
one of the best shot and directed films of the
festival. Ryan Gosling and Michelle Williams
star as a young couple whose marriage is un-
raveling. A Bergsonian meditation on love
and identity, the film is painful yet honest in
its refusal to sentimentalize or demonize ei-
ther character.
Mark Ruffalo’s Sympathy for Delicious wasn’t
as altogether successful, but it was a bold and
idiosyncratic directorial debut that grew out of
the actor/director’s long relationship with the
film’s writer, Christopher Thornton, who stars
as a paraplegic turntablist who becomes an
unlikely faith healer. Stunningly shot by Chris
 Norr, the film has a refreshingly unpredictable
narrative that feels exactly like the outgrowth
of a complicated friendship. I also liked Esto-
nian filmmaker Veiko Õunpuu’s The Tempta-
tion of St. Tony. The film is an oddly delirious,
blackly comic reverie about an alienated mid-
level businessman who becomes more and
more untethered from reality.
Part of New Frontier was Sam Green and
Dave Cerf ’s Utopia in Four Movements. In
what was billed as a “live documentary,” film-
maker Green explores a precondition for rev-
olution: a shared vision of utopia. Green col-
laborated with Cerf, who composed the score,
which was played live by the Quavers, and
also did live commentary over film clips and
slides. Green’s piece had a charm to it, much
of it deriving from his sincerity as narrator
and the poetry of its quixotic goals. Perhaps
appropriately, the piece, which began by plac-
ing utopia within a historical frame, tracing it
from Sir Thomas More onward, had a hard
time finally answering its central question of
whether utopia can still be imagined; retreat-
ing from historical analysis, it found the seeds
of utopia’s renewal in such ahistorical values as
hope and faith. Still, the idea that one could
reintroduce the concept of utopia to a jaded
21st-century audience through the power of
the spoken work, three musicians, and a video
projector was perhaps its own utopian gesture
and thus the piece’s true ending point.
John Well’s The Company Men, purchased
by The Weinstein Company postfestival, is a
well acted (particularly by Ben Affleck, Rose-
marie DeWitt and Tommy Lee Jones) story
of recession and job loss as seen through the
lives of several employees of a Boston-based
ship-building conglomerate. For the first half
hour I was fascinated by its fantastic produc-
tion design and location work, which form
an almost alternative narrative in which plot
points are replaced by gradations of comfort.
By its end, The Company Men becomes a 2010
version of an ’80s yuppie-redemption film
like Regarding Henry. On a human level, The
Company Men is a good-hearted and well-ob-
served piece; as a political statement, however,
its narrative plays as a kind of neoliberal fan-
tasy that provides closure for the characters
but perhaps not audiences still pondering the
PHOTO BY: PHILIP OEGAARD
roots of the current recession and America’s
future industrial policy.
Flat-out disappointments included Mi-
chael Winterbottom and Mat Whitecross’s
uncharacteristically unimaginative adaptation
of Naomi Klein’s The Shock Doctrine; Hesher,
Spencer Susser’s tonally uncertain tale of fam-
ily grief; Four Lions, a comedy about jihad-
ists by iconoclastic British comedy director
Christopher Morris that runs out of satirical
juice long before the end; and Drake Dore-
mus’s Douchebag, a lazily imagined, no-budget
shaky-camera comedy about two brothers on
the weekend before one’s wedding. The lat-
ter played in Competition although it would
have seemed a more natural fit for the NEXT
section. Regardless, I would have preferred
the better written, better shot, Jack Black and
Luke Wilson version of this story.
Berlin International
Film Festival
BY HOWARD FEINSTEIN
I’m rethinking green. On account of the un-
usual cold wave that hit Europe recently, Ber-
lin was covered in snow and ice. Walking was
treacherous, even with the appropriate cleated
shoes, which I wore. It was inevitable: One
evening I slid on a sheet of ice and fell on my
knees, tearing open the skin on my right leg so
badly that blood was dripping everywhere. For
diabetics like me, an injury to a limb can be life-
threatening. I finally went to a nice pharmacist,
who disinfected it and sold me plasters.
There is a point to this self-indulgent story.
A nice woman in Berlin explained why it was
so icy in spite of a law, like the one in New
York, that snow and ice must be cleared in
front of any building by its tenant. It turns
out, they ran out of sand. As far as salt goes,
they are not allowed to use it because it is
considered an environmental hazard: It can
A SOMEWHAT GENTLE MAN.
kill the trees. The ERs were packed with folks
with broken bones, and foreigners attending
the festival, who walked everywhere, took
their lives in their hands and prayed to God
or Allah that they not succumb. The trees,
however, will be fine.
Some of the best films I saw at the Berlin
International Film Festival (Feb. 11-21) were
shot with relatively unconventional cameras.
The best film of all, Alexei Popogrebsky’s
How I Ended This Summer (which I wrote
about on the Filmmaker blog), was shot with
a RED camera. The film was later transferred
to 35mm. The RED is of course, near the size
of many 35mm cameras, but it still allows
the flexibility and ease of movement neces-
sary for a film about two men working on a
remote Arctic island in which the natural set-
tings convey the narrative flow. The film was
awarded Outstanding Artistic Achievement
(Best Cinematography) and a shared Best
Actor prize for the two leads.
The other most impressive cinematographic
feat was L.A.-based Rodrigo Garcia’s seg-
ment “La 7th Street y Alvarado,” one of ten
10-minute shorts in the portmanteau Revo-
lución, the collaboration of ten Mexican film-
makers to honor the centenary of the Mexican
revolution. In a contemporary barrio in Los
Angeles, scores of pedestrians, many with cell
phones in hand, walk past charmless discount
stores. Suddenly, rebels on horseback from
1910, wearing wide-brimmed sombreros, pass
through the crowd, with sad looks in their eyes.
For THIS we fought against a dictator? Every-
see page 77
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
21
 COLUMNS
CULTURE HACKER | INDUSTRY BEAT | FEST CIRCUIT GAME ENGINE LOAD & PLAY | THE SUPER 8
GAMES OF TRAGEDY
BY HEATHER CHAPLIN
In February 2008, Brenda Brathwaite’s
6-year-old daughter came home from school
talking about the Middle Passage. Brath-
waite, whose husband is half African-Amer-
ican, said she’d always known this conversa-
tion was coming, but she hadn’t expected it so
soon. And she hadn’t expected her daughter,
Maezza, to be so blasé by the facts of the slave
trade. She seemed emotionally unaffected —
which affected Brathwaite tremendously.
Brathwaite is a game designer. Her solution:
design a game on the spot for her daughter to
play. First she had Maezza color little wooden
figures of people and group then into families.
Then, when Maezza was finished, she grabbed
handfuls of the little people and stuck them
randomly on index cards she called ships.
Maezza was confused. She hadn’t taken whole
families! Mothers were separated from their
babies, fathers from their wives. “Sorry, honey,”
Brathwaite said, “they don’t get to choose.”
Then as the index cards set sail, they rolled
the dice to allocate food. “Mom, you’ve made a
mistake, there’s not enough food for everyone,”
Maezza cried. Brathwaite told her they could
put some people into the water or try to make
it to the end and hope people survived.
Brathwaite didn’t need to finish the game.
When her husband came home, they all ended
up talking together for hours, crying together.       her grandmother’s rosary.
“It was an amazing experience,” Brathwaite
says. “Maezza had spent some time inside the
system of slavery, as abstracted as it was, and
came away with this really deep understand-
ing. It was transformative.”
If there’s one thing games are good at it’s
teaching how to think systemically. Brath-
waite’s games are created from her realization
that so many of the great human tragedies,
22 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
TRAIN.
the mass sufferings of history, have taken
place within systems. Someone designed
those slave ships. Someone developed the
system of taking land from the Irish during
the Cromwellian invasion in the mid-1600s.
And, probably, most recognized, the Nazis
implemented a fantastically complex and
efficient way of exterminating Jews during
World War II. Perhaps games were the ideal
way of fostering a real sense of understanding
and empathy about these atrocities.
In her spare time, Brathwaite decided to
make a series of tragedy games. While Brath-
waite designs video games in her professional
career, these would all be non-digital board
games, each made painstakingly by hand. First
up was Siochan Leat, or “The Irish Game.” At
the beginning of each role of the dice, an or-
ange square representing English forces under
Cromwell take over a portion of the board.
As the game progresses, players are fighting
each other for space on the board. When space
runs out, the figures representing the Irish are
forced onto slave ships for Barbados. Brath-
waite made the game by hand, bundling little
hand-painted figurines together and burying
within the burlap ground of the board to rep-
resent the dead. She even buried some family
heirlooms (Brathwaite is of Irish descent), like
The game that has gotten the most atten-
tion is Train. In Train, players are presented
with a board that is a window frame with its
glass panes shattered. There’s a typewriter,
three train tracks with trains on them, a stack
of cards and handfuls of little yellow figures.
Instructions for the game are in the type-
writer. On one hand it’s a turn-based race-
to-the end game with cards instructing you
how much to move your train forward or pre-
senting setbacks like derailment. While play-
ing the game you’re stuffing the little yellow
figurines into the trains. Disconcertingly, the
figures are just a tad too big to fit easily into
the train entrance so you find yourself shov-
ing them in. Also, once your train car is full,
the “people” are not lined up but squeezed in
at all kind of angles. At the end of the game
you get your destination card — each one is
the name of a concentration camp.
“I want to make you feel complicit in a sys-
tem of human tragedy,” Brathwaite says.
Brathwaite named her game series “The
Mechanic Is the Message.” This may be con-
fusing for non-gamers, but the holy grail of
game design is to express oneself not through
the artwork in a game, or the music, or the
cut scenes, but rather through the actual game
mechanics itself, like requiring players to force
their little figures brutally into the train cars.
Brathwaite designed the rules of Train to be
intentionally vague. So if a card instructs that
a car has to be derailed, you don’t have to pass
it on to your opponent; you can choose to de-
rail your own train. Or if a card orders people
to be removed from your train, you can choose
to force them on another player, or put them
in your pocket. In other words, the mechan-
ics of the game design forces players to think
about the decisions they are making; and the
fact that they are making decisions.
Watching people play Train is in itself a fas-
cinating experience. Some people figure out
what’s going on right away and start derailing
their own trains and pulling people out when-
ever they can. Others only realize it’s a game
about the Holocaust at the end when they
get their destination card. Crying abounds.
And when people realize that the typewriter
is actually a Nazi artifact, complete with the
SS sign above the five buttons (Brathwaite
bought it from an Air Force veteran online
for $1,000), there is shock and horror.
The other games in the series are about
Mexican immigration to California, life in a
Haiti slum (this was before the earthquake),
and the Trail of Tears.
Brathwaite has no idea what will become
of her games. Each one has been made by
hand by her and is not easily reproduced.
PHOTO BY: JOHN MCKINNON
(Can you imagine trying to supply Nazi type-
writers to a mass market?) So far, she’s been
traveling around the country showing them
at game festivals and conferences. She doesn’t
want to turn them into video games because
see page 73
 Dezso Magyar/
ARTISTIC DIRECTOR
David Ward/ No Secrets,
WRITER/DIRECTOR Summer
Sleepless in Seattle,
The Sting

John Badham/
DIRECTOR
MFA IN FILM AND TELEVISION PRODUCING Saturday Night Fever,
WarGames
MFA IN SCREENWRITING
MFA IN PRODUCTION DESIGN
MFA IN FILM PRODUCTION: Cinematography • Directing • Editing • Sound Design
JD/MFA IN FILM AND TELEVISION PRODUCING
MBA/MFA IN FILM AND TELEVISION PRODUCING

Film has the power to make us laugh or cry, to

challenge dearly held beliefs or to put forth
Alexandra Rose/PRODUCER
new concepts.
Norma Rae,
Frankie and Johnny If you dream of telling your story, expressing
your passions or bringing life to your ideas through
film, the Graduate Conservatory of Motion Pictures
at Chapman University has the highly accomplished
Lawrence Paull/
faculty mentors, intensely hands-on curriculum and
PRODUCTION DESIGNER
Back to the Future, Blade Runner resources to help you reach your goals.
Learn more. Call us. Visit us online.

Paul Seydor/EDITOR
White Men Can’t Jump,
Barbershop II
One University Drive, Orange, CA 92866
The only limit is your imagination.

800-775-0065 • 714-997-6765
FTV.CHAPMAN.EDU
Bill Dill/CINEMATOGRAPHER
ROBERT BASSETT, DEAN
Dancing in September, The Five Heartbeats

Chapman University is accredited by and is a member of the Western Association of Schools and Colleges.
 COLUMNS
CULTURE HACKER | INDUSTRY BEAT | FEST CIRCUIT | GAME ENGINE LOAD & PLAY THE SUPER 8
QUEUE IT
FILMMAKER’S LOOK AT THE SEASON’S DVD RELEASES April 6: BAD LIEUTENANT: PORT OF CALL
NEW ORLEANS First Look Pictures
DIRT! THE MOVIE Docurama
HARLEM ARIA Magnolia Home Entertainment
CELESTIAL NAVIGATIONS: SHORT FILMS OF AL JARNOW Numero – IN STORES YES MEN FIX THE WORLD The New Video Group
You probably grew up on the shorts of Al Jarnow and never even knew it. From rocks finding April 13: DEFENDOR Sony Pictures Home Entertainment
different ways of crossing a river to watching a billion years elapse on a hillside in the span of THE MISSING PERSON Strand Releasing
one minute, Al Jarnow’s contribution to animation is unquantifiable. Making abstract works THE SLAMMIN’ SALMON Starz / Anchor Bay
for children’s shows like Sesame Street and 3-2-1 Contact in the ’70s, Jarnow’s heightened sense April 20: 35 SHOTS OF RUM Cinema Guild
of observation elevated the medium to more than just colorful figures doing funny things on 44 INCH CHEST Image Entertainment
paper. Now 45 of his shorts are showcased in this remastered anthology, which also includes a CRAZY HEART 20th Century Fox
documentary profiling Jarnow and a 60-page booklet written by some of his closest collabora- SUMMER HOURS The Criterion Collection
VIVRE SA VIE The Criterion Collection
tors and son Jesse, who was the inspiration for many of Jarnow’s works. A must-own for anima-
THE YOUNG VICTORIA Sony Pictures Home
tion enthusiasts or if you just want a keepsake from your childhood. ­— Jason Guerrasio Entertainment

April 27: HAL HARTLEY’S SURVIVING

EASIER WITH PRACTICE Breaking Glass Pictures – April 6 Winner of last year’s Grand Prize DESIRE: SPECIAL EDITION Microcinema
at CineVegas, Kyle Patrick Alvarez’s intimate debut feature looks at the yearning for companion- THE IMAGINARIUM OF DOCTOR
PARNASSUS Sony Pictures Home Entertainment
ship, even if it’s only over the phone. In Easier With Practice Davey is on a book-tour road trip
WILLIAM KUNSTLER: DISTURBING THE
with his brother when he gets a mysterious phone call in his motel room from a sultry female UNIVERSE Microcinema
interested in talking dirty. Instead of hanging up Davey goes along for the ride, which gradually May 4: PAPER COVERS ROCK MPI
forms into a bizarre relationship, and inevitably leads to the moment when the two meet. High- TETRO Lionsgate
lighting the talents of its lead Brian Geraghty (The Hurt Locker), who plays the lonely schlub to TOKYO SONATA Koch Vision
perfection, Alvarez’s unique love story got him major notice on the fest circuit and this year’s May 18: THE GIRL ON THE TRAIN Strand Releasing
Someone To Watch Award at the Independent Spirit Awards. — J.G. THE MESSENGER Oscilloscope Laboratories
OSHIMA’S OUTLAW SIXTIES The Criterion Collection
BURMA VJ Oscilloscope Laboratories – June 15 Defying the traditions of documentary form in May 25: MYSTERY TEAM Lionsgate
myriad ways, Anders Østergaard’s Burma VJ is not just a bold aesthetic achievement but an act THE ROAD Sony Pictures Home Entertainment
of solidarity and courage. Restitching footage shot by various brave souls, whom the film dubs STAGECOACH The Criterion Collection
“Burma VJs” and from whom the film gains its title, the Oscar-nominated doc portrays nearly June 15: MYSTERY TRAIN The Criterion Collection
suicidal protests, often carried out by imperiled Monks, within war and genocide-torn Burma.
June 22: CLOSE-UP The Criterion Collection
Using footage smuggled out of the country by anonymous shooters into neighboring Thailand,
Østergaard pulls the curtain back on this repressive place while offering glimpses of acts of June 29: EVERLASTING MOMENTS The Criterion
Collection
pure selflessness in the pursuit of freedom by a perpetually imperiled grassroots movement of
protesters and Handycam-bearing witnesses. — Brandon Harris

RIDE WITH THE DEVIL Criterion Collection

– April 27 At times fanciful and at others mournfully
taciturn, Ang Lee’s oft overlooked Ride With the
Devil, which quietly and all too briefly came and
went amidst a flurry of better-known Oscar con-
tenders in the winter of 1999, is getting the Crite-
rion treatment with a new remastered Director’s
Cut that Lee claims will finally bring his vision of
the American Civil War’s western entanglements
to glorious life. The story of a pair of Confederate
PHOTO COURTESY OF THE CRITERION COLLECTION

Bushwackers (Toby Maguire and Skeet Ulrich)

who sign up to ride with the notorious William
Quantrill during the conflict along the Kansas/
Missouri border with the Union Jayhawkers, is as
beautiful and well observed as anything Lee and
frequent collaborator James Schamus have ever
made. It contains an absolutely sublime perfor-
mance by Jeffrey Wright as a black man fighting
for the Confederacy, a plot point that probably
ruined its commercial prospects in theaters at the
RIDE WITH THE DEVIL.
time. — B.H.

24 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

NEW YORK
■ FILMMAKING
■ ACTING FOR FILM

FILM
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ACADEMY ■ 3D ANIMATION
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FILM
■ MUSICAL THEATRE
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SCHOOL ■ DIGITAL EDITING

■ MUSIC VIDEO
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1-800-611-FILM | WWW.NYFA.EDU/FM SOUND DESIGN
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MASTER OF FINE ARTS* HD • RED ONE™ Camera

IN THE FIRST YEAR, EACH FILMMAKING STUDENT WRITES, SHOOTS, DIRECTS,

AND EDITS 8 FILMS IN THE MOST INTENSIVE HANDS-ON PROGRAM
IN THE WORLD AND WORKS ON THE CREW OF 28 ADDITIONAL FILMS

NEW YORK CITY

UNIVERSAL STUDIOS
ABU DHABI FILM SCHOOL
MIAMI, FLORIDA
DISNEY STUDIOS, FLORIDA 
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100 EAST 17TH STREET 100 UNIVERSAL CITY PLAZA DRIVE, BUILDING 9128, SUITE 179 MUROUR ROAD, E22
NEW YORK, NY 10003 UNIVERSAL CITY, CA 91608 ABU DHABI, UAE
TEL: 212.674.4300 FAX: 212.477.1414 TEL: 818.733.2600 FAX: 818.733.4074 TEL: 971.2.446.6442 FAX: 971.2.443.1676
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All workshops are solely owned and operated by the New York Film Academy and such workshops are not affiliated with Universal Studios, Harvard University, Yale University, or Disney Studios.
 COLUMNS
CULTURE HACKER | INDUSTRY BEAT | FEST CIRCUIT | GAME ENGINE | LOAD & PLAY THE SUPER 8
EIGHT THINGS THAT WILL KEEP YOU IN THE KNOW
4 tive, more portable future for the projector.
1 YOU ARE NOT A GADGET Internet pio-
neer and virtual-reality visionary Jaron
Lanier’s first book, You Are Not a Gadget:
A Manifesto (Alfred A. Knopf, $24.95), is
an exhilarating provocation, a beautifully
written argument against many of Web
2.0’s sacred cows. Tackling free culture,
the copyleft movement, crowdsourcing
and, most particularly, the ascendancy of
“the cloud,” Lanier asks if our unthinking
engagement with Internet technology is
making us less human.
2 FIRST EVER TCM FILM FEST Meet the
first ever Turner Classic Movies Film Festi-
val, April 22-25 in Hollywood, Calif., where
international film icons will host screenings
of classics at historic Hollywood venues.
Jean-Paul Belmondo will be present to cel-
ebrate the 50th anniversary of Breathless at
the North American premiere of its restored
print, and Stanley Donen will introduce Sin-
gin’ in the Rain. Catch rare films like The Sto-
ry of Temple Drake (a precode production) and
archival prints of films like Casablanca. More
screenings, panel discussions and other events
are soon to be announced. Learn more at tcm.
com/festival.
26 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
3 SHEDDING LIGHT ON NOIR “This book
is likely to become the book on film noir,”
claims Robert Benton, director of one of the
genre’s classics, Still of the Night. Due for its
first rerelease since its original 1979 publica-
tion, Film Noir: The Encyclopedia (The Over-
look Press, $45) will now include entries for
more than 500 films, as well as a new selec-
tion of illustrations and photographs. What
do 550 femme fatales have in common? Find
out when Film Noir hits bookshelves in May.  lightindustry.org.
4 HOLLYWOOD TRIBUTE Witness to War-
hol’s Factory, Georges Monfils is a Nouveau
Pop painter whose current works “Paparazzi”
and “City of Angels” examine the satiric na-
ture of celebrity and the entertainment in-
dustry with a specific Hollywood focus. From
recreations of magazine covers to spinning
film reels, Monfils’s imaginative paintings
are confrontational and captivating. His show
opens April 24 and runs through the end of
July at the San Marino gallery in Pasadena,
Calif. Learn more at sanmarinogallery.com.
5 SLEEK PROJECTION For DIY filmmak-
ers wanting to screen their works anywhere,
the new OO Wireless HD Projector is just
for you. Capable of projecting hi-defini-
tion images through WiFi or its internal
SSD storage, the OO works wirelessly for
up to three hours. It is lightweight and
functional, promising a new, more attrac-
And with its sleek design, duplicating the
circular nature of the lens in the round-
ness of its slim machine (hence the name:
“OO”), you’ll be lookin’ good doing it.
Learn more at flylyf.com/oo-high-defini-
tion-wireless-projector/.
6 SPEAKEASY STYLE For those who can’t
get enough of their gangster fix on screen,
the Museum of the American Gangster
opens this spring in a former NYC speak-
easy. It is fitting that a past underground
watering hole will now pay homage to the
gangsters of yesteryear that inspired films
like The Godfather trilogy, Bugsy and The
Untouchables, to name a few. This speakeasy-
cum-museum also nicely complements the
recent accumulation of hidden Prohibition-
style bars around the city. For more informa-
tion visit moagnyc.org/.
7 SCREENINGS Recently moved from its
old space in Sunset Park to a new location in
downtown Brooklyn, Light Industry remains
a venue for film and electronic art. Inspired
by cinematheques and alternative art spaces
alike, Light Industry has a weekly screen-
ing program, with each event organized by
a different artist or curator. Past screenings
range from Echoes of Silence, introduced by
avant-garde pioneer Jonas Mekas, to Bijou,
introduced by writer and poet Eileen Myles.
Check for upcoming screenings and events at
8 MULTIMEDIA RESOURCE Since 1996
UbuWeb.com has been gifting poetry of
all sorts — audio, visual, multimedia — to
anyone and everyone who logs on. Accord-
ing to the site, UbuWeb is “a completely
independent resource dedicated to all
strains of the avant-garde, ethnopoetics,
PHOTO COURTESY OF SAN MARINO GALLERY
and outsider arts.” Relying on the generos-
ity of various media-hosting sites as well
as on the unlimited storage of cyberspace,
UbuWeb provides an incredible archive of
visual, concrete and sound poetry. Indepen-
dent of institutional constraints, UbuWeb
features everything that pleases its editors.
Explore the site (ubu.com) for an incredible
range of works.
DESIGN: ZOVECK.COM
 Set in the Ozarks, Debra Granik’s
gritty adaptation of Daniel Woodrell’s
novel, Winter’s Bone, was praised at
Sundance earlier this year and walked
away with the Grand Prize. With a powerful
performance by lead Jennifer Lawrence,
Granik delves into the methamphetamine-
dealing mountain country of Missouri to
follow a young girl searching for her lost,
possibly deceased father.
By Scott Macaulay |
Photographs by Henny Garfunkel

WINTER’S BONE DIRECTOR AND CO-WRITER DEBRA GRANIK.

28 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

 The Ozark mountain holler that is the setting for Debra Granik’s fierce and extraordinary if they weren’t doing that, they had other dev-
Winter’s Bone seems carved away from much of what signifies as “contemporary America” in astating illnesses or pathologies. I mean, at
cinema today. The movie, which won the Grand Jury Prize at Sundance this year, dwells in a the end, Anne and I felt like this big being
landscape that imbues it with the starkness of classic Western frontier drama. Seventeen-year- female Homo sapiens. And then along comes
old Ree Dolly is the single-minded heroine who has to venture into the wilderness to save her Ree Dolly, okay, and who couldn’t resist her?
family home — the dwelling of her younger brother and sister and infirm mother — from I mean, just even on the level of fantasy — a
repossession. To do so, she must find her wandering father, who, after a prison stint, is rumored female hero, a girl with moxie? An old-fash-
to have died in a meth-lab explosion. Relying on little more than information meted out by ioned kind of Western gal? She appealed to
her father’s estranged brother, Teardrop (superbly played by John Hawkes), and confronting us literally on the level of relief and fun. Even
a group of meth producers who do not want their secrets poked into, Dolly takes us into a though her life has superhard elements, we
world that is both of this country and defiantly sheltered away from it. Her journey, of course, had pleasure imagining her. We enjoyed her
is something of a coming-of-age tale, but Granik shies away from any of the genre’s more strength, her quick-witted responses. She’s
sentimental flourishes. Dolly’s efforts do lead to her father, but the film is as much about her got interesting relationships with the men
education in the ways of the criminal subculture she’s been brought up around and the family and women in her life. And [Daniel Wood-
ties that may keep her from ever entirely escaping it. rell] told such a damn good story. I read it
Winter’s Bone is Granik’s second feature, premiering in Park City six years after her de- three years ago in Washington Square Park in
but, Down to the Bone. In that similarly tough-minded film Vera Farmiga played a mother one sitting — on a hard bench! I hadn’t done
struggling to kick her drug addiction while holding down low-wage work and raising her that since I was a teenager.
children. With this new film, Granik and her producing and writing partner Anne Rosellini So your manager sent you the book. I pre-
enlarge their canvas considerably, venturing into an Ozark community that has rarely been sume it had been shopped to the studios
portrayed so realistically on screen. Shot on the RED One in chilly blues and grays by Michael too. Yeah, exactly. I mean, the book went out
McDonough, the film memorably captures the desolation and flashes of spare beauty in this widely. A lot of Daniel’s other material is out
landscape. But Granik also manages the harder job of depicting the people in this community in the world and some very prominent people
without condescension or judgment. have adapted his books. Daniel’s not our dis-
Eschewing any trace of Hollywood glamour, Kentucky native Jennifer Lawrence (The Burn- covery by any means.
ing Plain), 19, gives a star-making performance in Winter’s Bone; the supporting cast who in- Once you decided you wanted to do it, what
clude actors like Hawkes and Sheryl Lee, blend seamlessly with the local hires; and there’s a was that process like? Was it still a process to
scene on a boat that I think is the best scene I’ve seen in a film all year. The film will be released get Woodrell to agree to give you the book?
by Roadside Attractions in June. I spoke with Granik a few weeks after her Sundance win. He felt positively about Down to the Bone and
so was predisposed to us being the people who
might do the next interpretation of his work.
You’ve made two films about women and them in the conventional ways, through what Initially it was probably a blow to see that it
their relationships with drug culture. What I call “the general pipeline” — or, “the general would be a very humble production because
attracts you to those worlds, those stories? colon.” [laughs] he was used to something quite big with very
You know, it never starts with something so Were these from an agent? We had repre- prominent American stars being involved. He
overt. It’s almost like the drug aspect was the sentation at Anonymous Content; manager had to take a huge leap of faith.
burdensome reality I encountered in both of Shawn Simon was looking for stuff for us. And then what about the adaptation? Was
those stories. Down to the Bone started from Of course, the majority of stuff had female he involved? We would sometimes ask him
[the story of ] a family that I was interested in protagonists, but… I don’t know how to say to interpret for us or just to clarify things
and their central struggle was whether they as it but [reading all these scripts] stoked a kind that were ambiguous or had multiple mean-
adults in that family structure could become of disheartened misogyny within myself. ings. We’d ask him things like, “What were
sober. I [didn’t choose the story] because I rel- [laughs] Because if [all these female charac- you thinking here? Did you think Teardrop
ished taking on drugs or addiction but because ters I was reading] weren’t cutting themselves, was fronting? Was he being sincere?” And
their story was inherently suspenseful. And in they were collapsing psychiatrically; if they we asked certain questions about the sheriffs,
(OPPOSITE PAGE) PHOTO BY: HENNY GARFUNKEL/RETNA LTD.

Winter’s Bone, that’s the backdrop of Ree’s fam-
ily. That [aspect of the story] frightened me the
first time I read [the book] and contemplated
what it means for a kid to be growing up with
family members who are involved with meth.
So, I didn’t go seeking those [stories and mi-
lieus] — they were attached to the lives of the
two females that I was interested in.
How did you find the book? Had you been
reading lots of novels and spec scripts look-
ing for your next project after Down to the
Bone? Did you know Daniel Woodrell? My
producing partner, Anne Rosellini, and I had
been reading a lot of scripts. We’d been getting
weren’t collapsing psychiatrically, they were
having a bad time in a psychiatric institution;
HOW THEY DID IT
PRODUCTION FORMAT HD/4k.
CAMERA Red One. Generation 18.
EDITING SYSTEM Final Cut Pro.
COLOR CORRECTION Autodesk Lustre
incinerator by Tim Stipan at Tech-
nicolor’s New York DI Theater, which
includes NEC IS8 2K projector. Trans-
coded to 10bit log dpx files. Conform
and visual effects done on Autodesk
Smoke 2010.
how they work. He was very forthcoming
with the research that he had done.
One thing I was fascinated by in your film
was the milieu and how removed it is from
the usual signs of contemporary Ameri-
can life we see in films. It felt like it could
almost have been a period film while it’s
clearly very much a film of today. Well, there
were satellite dishes.
What? I’m trying to remember them. It’s
okay. They were there just because they really
are there, and we weren’t going to cover them
up or take them down. In the cattle-auction
scene, there was a man on his cell. But, you

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

29

know, for me it was unusual to meet a fam-
ily where wild game was being consumed
for dinner, and then that same family has a
grandmother who works as a greeter at Wal-
Mart. That grandmother is bringing stuff
home for her granddaughter, who actually
plays Ashley, the granddaughter in the film.
She does have pop icons on her T-shirts, and
there are figurines in that house that repre-
sent the contemporary things that are being
sold at Wal-Mart. So that stuff is there. It’s in
30 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
JOHN HAWKES IN WINTER’S BONE.
every nook and cranny.
I guess I just missed a lot of that. It felt like
this was a world that is resisting the homog-
enization that’s going on in American cul-
ture. Well, visually [those cultural signs] are
not heavily represented [in the film]. I like
that really contemporary stuff isn’t shown,
but it was also because of [clearance issues].
The way [modern culture] is actually being
absorbed the most [in this region] is with the
loss of some of the actual turns of speech, the
phrases that are unique. Linguistic homog-
enization happens very rapidly, I think.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that the
whole film rests on an understanding of “and.”
Ree’s family has good people and really diffi-
cult people. Her uncle has a serious chemical
dependency and he has a certain kind of no-
bility to him. And he does fucked-up things
[laughs]. And he’s surly and difficult. There is
meth in this story and Ree Dolly doesn’t want
to use meth. If “and” isn’t the umbrella under
which the film can be perceived, I always feel
like I’m cooked, because there’s some particu-
larly sensitive material in this film.
I was fascinated by how cut off the region
feels, but at the same time, I didn’t think
you exoticized it as a filmmaker. Was that a
worry, that you’d exoticize the Ozark peo-
ple? Yes, it was a big concern. And hillbillies
have already gotten an extra dose of that [in
film]. My husband showed me early films
from 1919, 1920 where they’d get a bunch
of so-called “mountain people” together on a
primitive film set and they’d be shooting at
each other. As a Northeastern, upper-middle-
class urban woman, I was such a foreigner.
But before [Anne and I] even really contem-
plated going further with the project we had
to go down there. We had to do the visual
anthropology and those trips helped hugely.
That’s when we started to get confidence.
When people gave us access [to their homes]
and allowed us to take the several hundred
photographs of almost every detail of their
existence, that’s when we could say, “I believe
Ree’s family could live in this holler. I believe
Ree could live in this house. I believe this is
the high school she would go to.” Someone
down the road would show us how squirrels
are caught and prepared for consumption. It
felt all-important to us to get the details right,
to actually be instructed, and we had some re-
ally indispensable guides who did that.
What was your relationship with your pro-
duction and costume designers like with
regard to these issues? Yours is a contempo-
rary film that almost had to be approached
as a period or historical film in terms of its
research. With wardrobe, [costume designer]
Rebecca [Hofherr] was really into it. She
PHOTO BY: SEBASTIAN MLYNARSKI
ended up being a very openhearted anthro-
pologist of wardrobe, of clothes, of class, of
circumstance, of winter. And she got access
to so many people’s wardrobes. Her questions
about them were very novel, and she was able
to perform an exchange in [many cases]. We
had new Carhartts and we’d exchange them
for old and tattered ones. We didn’t have to
 distress a lot of the wardrobe. That was her
major technique — swapping clothes.
What about with production design? Mark
White, the production designer, he took very
astute notes, and there were [locations] we
knew we didn’t really have to touch. Many
props utilized in the film came from houses
that we were filming in. Mark was very in-
vested in making sure that he wasn’t recreat-
ing something differently [than it was in real
life]. He wanted to just preserve — to keep
the continuity and precision of place. That’s
not to say that [the art department] didn’t
do anything. Everything still had to be in its
place, had to make sense. It’s all very much or-
ganized with great care, but there was a spirit
to how and what was chosen to be there.
I think to the film’s credit it didn’t seem to
have overly obvious references in terms of its
visuals. A lot of times you see movies about
rural America and certain influences, like
Walker Evans, or Days of Heaven are obvi-
ous. Maybe it’s because of the RED camera,
maybe it’s because of the wintery palette,
the grays and blues, but I didn’t feel those
things. Well, you know, it’s funny, but you put
three children on a porch in clothing that is
well used and you’ve got Walker Evans!
Was that shot a direct reference, then? It
wasn’t a direct reference, but we did look
at [Walker Evans]. Our tear book was rich,
though. I mean, we weren’t drawing just from
one [source]. But really, does any frame [in
a film] ever really look like [a director’s] tear
book? The tear book is to get yourself so
amped up [to make the film], and almost to
praise the people that you’ve loved.
What else was in yours? Oh God, you know,
in terms of actual camerawork, [d.p.] Michael
[McDonough] and I adore how the Dardenne
Brothers work with a moving camera, that kind
of balletic camerawork that is not gratuitous in
its movement but is designed to keep up with
the actors. Paul Greengrass and his unusual
framing. Barbara Kopple’s Harlan County,
USA for its palette of winter and smoke and
smokestacks and its long lens work. And there
were some photographers who shot in Appa-
lachia and other mountain settings, stuff that’s
both immediately accessible and stuff that’s ac-
PHOTO BY: SEBASTIAN MLYNARSKI
tually provocative and concerns us. Shelby Lee
Adams has been around the block with the
controversies that surround his image-making,
and we felt like some of that was really relevant
to what we were about to do.
Did meth as the subject matter affect any
of your relationships in the community as
you shot it? Absolutely. We had to make sure
(LEFT-RIGHT) ASHLEE THOMPSON, JENNIFER LAWRENCE AND ISAIAH STONE IN WINTER’S BONE.
“At the Sundance Lab, one mentor preached
something that stayed with me forever...
What is an actor bringing already?”
people read the book. We had to say, “This
has this content in it. You need to read this
before you even consent to say that you’ll
shoot with us.”
You mean the extras, the locations, the —
Yeah, especially the primary location, where
we were involving every member of a fam-
ily. We were asking their 7-year-old grand-
GO BACK & WATCH
FROZEN RIVER Melissa Leo received
an Oscar nomination for her perfor-
mance as a mother struggling to make
ends meet in upstate New York near the
Canadian border. With no other options,
she decides to smuggle illegal immi-
grants in the trunk of her car from Cana-
da to the U.S. to support her family.
DOWN TO THE BONE In Granik’s debut
feature, Vera Farmiga turns in a career-
defining performance as a mother bal-
ancing her troubled family life with her
addiction to cocaine.
NORTH COUNTRY Off her Oscar win for
Best Actress two years earlier, Charlize
Theron gets an Oscar nomination in ’05
for her portrayal of a Minnesota female
miner who endures abuse from her male
workers and wins the first major sexual
harassment case in U.S. history.
daughter to [play a character in the movie]. It
was imperative. They had already had life ex-
periences that made them feel very concerned
and saddened by meth. They had a real-life
understanding of the way it can insidiously
work its way through a community and the
lives it can touch. Meth is a fact of existence
in many communities, but it’s what a char-
acter chooses to do to get away from it or to
navigate around it that counts in the end.
Tell me about the actors. You mentioned
the Dardenne Brothers, who famously work
with non-actors. How did you take your
Hollywood actors and blend them so seam-
lessly into this other world? To a huge ex-
tent, that is about relying on what the actors
are willing to do. In the case of John Hawkes,
I think he feels challenged by research oppor-
tunities. Because he’s not so necessarily rec-
ognizable in certain circles he feels he’s totally
free to go into a bar, hang out, listen really
carefully to how people are talking, the hu-
mor that’s being used, the cadence, the sound.
He’s able to pick up on stuff. He’s able to ask
questions. He’s able to be in a place, to absorb
it and make his notes. I think he relished the
opportunity. Jen [ Jennifer Lawrence] really
tried to do the same, but she had a leg up be-
cause she comes from Kentucky. Again, not in
those circumstances — she would be the first
to say that. But she had relatives who prob-
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
31
ably spoke with quite a pronounced accent, so
she was open to the actual dialogue. Nothing
felt very foreign to her. Another thing: with
her on-camera [locally cast] siblings, she was
able to create a little world for them. She was
able to be a big sister and then to close down
their world so they weren’t so aware of the
whole production. She made a more hermetic
setting for them. That can be something too
that an actor brings.
What kind of director are you with your
actors? What’s your approach to directing
actors? At the Sundance Lab, one men-
tor preached something that stayed with me
forever. First and foremost: What is an actor
bringing already? What’s been their note-
taking, their imagination when they read the
script? First, see what they’re bringing, and
usually that becomes the foundation. Maybe
that’s why casting is so intense: it’s because
you’re already getting a vibe of what parts of
their life experience they are going to bring
[to a part]. I’m deeply, deeply interested [in
my actors]; it’s not like I am more knowledge-
able or more insightful [than them]. Next, I
want them to listen to the world around them.
I especially like it if an actor is open to work-
ing with either a non-experienced actor or a
real-life professional who is performing their
real-life job in the film. Like in [Down to the
32 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
Bone] the court-appointed attorney was just a
real guy from New Paltz court. [laughs] Ac-
tors like Vera [Farmiga] and Jen — they are
so willing to listen, to really respond and just
be present in that exact moment. They don’t
get unhinged that each take is different, that
a question might occur that they haven’t been
asked before. That [attitude] to me is just gold
because it allows for chance occurrences. But
obviously, I can’t be willy-nilly. I’ve learned,
painfully sometimes, that when every take is
unique there’s hell to pay in the editing room.
And yet, you know, the joy then is finding an
editor who can swing with that irregularity.
It sounds like once your actors are in that
space, they’re in their characters and there are
not a lot of adjustments or changes. Exactly. I
feel like my adjustments are really tiny. [laughs]
I go through huge phases in all parts of pro-
duction — this is not me being coy or falsely
humble — where I literally lose my way about
what the director’s role is. I just feel like I’m a
coordinator. I mean, Michael [McDonough’s]
off doing genius work, the actors are busting
their asses and I’m just vibing off them at the
monitor. I’m just sort of checking [laughs] that
things are going well. There are times when I
feel like the director thing has this very uncer-
tain quality to it, like my role just sometimes
feels very malleable, you know?
It’s interesting to hear you say that because
I’ve talked with a lot of directors who would
never say something like that. I’d love to
know what’s inside their minds sometimes,
you know? I think where this feeling comes
from is when filming gets rough — when it’s
a night shoot or a long day or it’s cold — you
can’t believe that [your crew] don’t just quit
on you. They stick with you. And then after
that feeling is “we.” “We” made this.
Was it a tough shoot? Was the environment
difficult? The winter was a lot less brutal
than we thought it would be. The shoot was
not arduous on the level of keeping our crew
biologically warm and okay, but arduousness
came from, I think, the speed.
How long was your shoot? Twenty four-and-
a-half days.
Were you moving around a lot? Seventy per-
cent of the film is shot in one holler. That was
like our soundstage, if you will, because our big
trucks parked at the entrance to the holler.
A holler is…? There are hills and hollers.
A holler is sort of a low-line piece of fam-
ily property, an enclave where several dwell-
ings from one family or close-knit people will
all be assembled. There might be a shared
animal pen and ATVs — all-terrain vehicles.
The numerous dogs that are in the film were
see page 75
 Jennifer Lawrence Q&A By Jason Guerrasio
It’s not often a striking young girl makes it
in Hollywood without accentuating her looks,
but Jennifer Lawrence is not your typical 19-
year-old actress. While many of her peers
go for lightweight parts in bubblegum teen
comedies, Lawrence has taken a more serious
route, filled with dark roles that deal with is-
sues well beyond her years.
The Kentucky native left home for L.A. at
14 and after getting bit parts on TV shows like
Monk, Cold Case and Medium, landed the role
of daughter Lauren on the TBS series The Bill
Engvall Show in 2007. A year later she was cast
in her first leading role in The Poker House, an in-
tense drama playing a young girl whose mother
is a prostitute. She followed that with Guillermo
Arriaga’s moody directorial debut The Burning
Plain, where Lawrence once again is a teen deal-
ing with mom issues. So when her agent handed
her the script to Debra Granik’s adaptation of
Daniel Woodrell’s gritty novel Winter’s Bone,
Lawrence had no doubts she had what it took to
play the demanding role of the book’s lead, 17-
year-old Ree Dolly. Covered in a bulky jacket,
winter cap and her face chapped from the cold, it
isn’t Lawrence’s physical traits but her tenacious
performance that grabs our attention and draws
us deeper inside Ree’s struggle to find her crystal
meth-making father in the Ozarks.
Gaining high praise at this past Sundance,
where the film won the Grand Prize, Law-
rence has continued her good fortune as she’s
recently wrapped her next film, The Beaver, a
dark comedy starring Mel Gibson and Jodie
Foster, who also directs.
Filmmaker talked to Lawrence over the
phone about her performance as Ree, which
has already started Oscar buzz.

I believe in an interview you did at Sundance

you said that your mother read Winter’s Bone
some time ago and told you Ree would be a
good part for you to play. Yeah, she said if
they ever make it into a movie I would be
perfect for it. Then five years or so later I got
PHOTO BY: HENNY GARFUNKEL/RETNA LTD.

the audition and ended up doing it. So it was

sweet because I got the movie but bitter be-
cause my mom was right. [laughs]
What was it that grabbed you about the role?
I can’t even remember a movie I’ve seen where
a woman is the strong one, a woman is at the
forefront of the story and she’s not a sidekick to
another man who is going on an incredibly dif-
ficult journey. And not even a grown woman, a
young 17-year-old woman. I just craved to be
able to do that character. Then after talking to
Debra and hearing her plans for the movie, I
couldn’t resist it. I became obsessed with it.
What was your audition like? I’m really bad at
auditions. I don’t really like them because I feel
JENNIFER LAWRENCE.
like you get six pages and you’re supposed to just
go in front of people you don’t know and “start
acting.” But I was able to read the script first and
develop what I thought would be my idea for
see page 76

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

33
 Oscar-winning director Alex Gibney returns to white-collar
corruption to examine the incredible rise and sudden fall of
mega-lobbyist Jack Abramoff in Casino Jack and the United
States of Money.
By Jason Guerrasio |
Photograph by Henny Garfunkel

CASINO JACK AND THE UNITED STATES OF MONEY DIRECTOR ALEX GIBNEY.

34 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

 On January 3, 2006, lobbyist Jack Abramoff solidified himself as the latest Washington should be closer to 90 minutes, but for this
villain when he exited a Federal Court in D.C. wearing a black trench coat and fedora. For particular film two hours and thirty minutes
someone known as a movie buff and producer of the low-budget action movie, Red Scorpion, in sounds like a better time for me,” and you start
the late ’80s, it looked like Abramoff had cast himself as the menacing bad guy in his own cloak- fooling yourself. But I think there’s a Rubicon
and-dagger thriller. But even before Abramoff had donned his black fedora, Alex Gibney had an crossed at two hours and we crossed it. The
eye on the man they call “Casino Jack.” Through Susan Schmidt’s reporting for the Washington Sundance cut showed at two hours and three
Post he learned of Abramoff ’s illegal practices — which included lavish trips and gifts in exchange minutes and a couple of screenings they were
for political favors, heading a scheme in the Mariana Islands that can be best described as 21st- great but we realized watching it again —
century slave labor, and defrauding American Indian gaming tribes of tens of millions of dollars. Your brain goes on overload. Your brain goes
Digging deeper, Gibney found a man driven to succeed by any means necessary, a hyperactive on overload and you have to give people rest.
personality who charmed the pants off everyone he met (including Gibney) and had skills en- We felt there was something kind of propulsive
abling him to manipulate Washington politics to a point where it may never be repaired. because this also is in Jack’s character; it’s full
Gibney is no stranger to white-collar corruption. Before making his 2007 Oscar-winning doc of enthusiasm and high energy — it’s part of
Taxi to the Dark Side, he received an Oscar-nomination for his 2005 film Enron: The Smartest Guys the con. So we developed a rhythm that seemed
in the Room, an in-depth look at how one of the world’s largest corporations became America’s consistent with his character. But in the recut we
largest corporate bankruptcy. Like Enron, Casino Jack and the United States of Money takes the greed, just needed to pull out stuff so you could pause
deceit and cons at the forefront of the story and strips them down to present a human drama. Gib- and get into the next [topic]. We let the music
ney walks us through Abramoff ’s rise as a College Republican alongside colleagues who would later play more, cut down the amount of facts and
have high-level roles in the Bush administration; joining the group Citizens for America in the mid figures. It’s tough to find that rhythm because
’80s, which helped support the Nicaraguan Contras; to becoming a lobbyist in the mid ’90s, doing you want to be accurate, but the audience can’t
everything from bribes to building fake companies to influence the political system; and ending be working too hard that they get exhausted.
finally with Abramoff sentenced to almost six years in prison for fraud, conspiracy and tax evasion. And you also have to examine why you’re
In his wake lay resignations (House Majority Leader Tom DeLay) and prison sentences (Congress- making a movie. You don’t want it to just be
man Bob Ney and Ney’s Chief of Staff Neil Volz) with countless others on Capitol Hill rumored to a parade of interviews that turn into a lecture;
have ties to Casino Jack, including then-President George W. Bush. you want there to be scenes that have other
With a wealth of archival footage at his fingertips, Gibney not only shows how Abramoff reasons to exist besides a kind of two dimen-
became one of the most influential people on K Street, but highlights what he calls “the kind of sional information giving. If you see how lus-
wheel-and-deal nature that the Republican Party had become.” What’s most frightening is that cious the Mariana Islands are you kind of get
even though Abramoff is behind bars it doesn’t mean his tactics have been locked up with him. it and why it works for the Congressmen.
Casino Jack premiered at Sundance and will open in early May through Magnolia Pictures. What did you and your longtime d.p. Maryse
Alberti talk about in regards to the film’s look?
Do you guys try for a signature style, or do you
Since you screened the film at Sundance the want to include but the film, kind of like a grem- change it up for each film? Every time we go
Supreme Court has ruled to remove limits lin, starts telling you to pay attention to the story, out we try to find a style, for the interviews in
on corporate campaign spending, which follow your story, and our story was Abramoff. So particular, and for this one there was a kind of a
was something that was in Abramoff ’s arse- by taking it out, which was very hard, it made the “lobbyist backroom vibe” that we tried to convey.
nal. Has that ruling in the Citizens United story better. And we’re going to experiment a bit When we went to the Marianas we shot everyone
case become a dark coda to your film? Yeah. more with this one with the Internet, so when we outside because we wanted you to know imme-
It’s devastating. I just put a card about it in release the film I’ll take that whole section and diately you were in the Marianas. With me and
the end. Jack lost but he also won. release it on YouTube. Maryse, it’s always about finding a kind of atmo-
Before this ruling had you hoped that there Was editing this difficult because you had sphere for a certain place, like when we shot in a
would be some uplifting feeling at the end? so much good material? The editing process casino in Louisiana, we actually had a Steadicam,
I did, and I still hope that for the film but is always the most fun and the most brutal, so it was a little bit like the vibe from Casino. You
it’s a much higher bar. I mean, I don’t think particularly brutal at the end because the feel like you’re in the action. It was fun and it was
(OPPOSITE PAGE) PHOTO BY: HENNY GARFUNKEL/RETNA LTD.

people can lose hope, even with that horrible
ruling. But man, as I was doing the movie I
realized we all thought after Abramoff we en-
acted all of these reforms, and things haven’t
gotten better — they’ve gotten worse.
You’ve also trimmed down the film since
Sundance? We had to take out the Medicare
section. That was very hard for me to do because
it’s a great section that is so relevant to what’s go-
ing on today, but it was a very dense section. It
had an Abramoff connection but it wasn’t that
central to him. A thing happens in the cutting
room — you get to a certain phase in the process
and there are all of these great sections that you
films are always too long. Particularly when
you have director’s disease. Director’s disease
is, “You know what, I agree that most films
HOW THEY DID IT
PRODUCTION FORMAT Digital HD.
CAMERA Panasonic: P2, Varicam,
HDX-900, EX-3.
TAPE STOCK DvcPro HD when applicable.
EDITING SYSTEM Avid Media Composer
3.5.1.
COLOR CORRECTION Pandora Pogle,
not the Quantel Pablo.
movie-like, which was the other thing — Jack is
a movie producer so we wanted it to have that
vibe. When you do those aerials in the Marianas
I wanted it to feel like Shangri-La.
With films like this one, Enron, and Taxi,
what is it that first gets your attention and
makes you think there’s a movie there? This
one was the story. Abramoff ’s story was so
outrageous that it just seemed compelling.
And it seemed compelling as a way of look-
ing about what had gone wrong with govern-
ment. I wouldn’t have pursued it if his story
hadn’t been so extraordinary. That was the
spark. Same with Enron. Taxi was differ-

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

35

“As I was doing the movie I realized... things
haven’t gotten better — they’ve gotten worse.”
ent but it ended up in the same place. Taxi
was one where I was given the assignment.
I didn’t know what I was going to do. But in
order to do a movie I had to find a story and
so in each case the story is the thing.
Did you want to get Abramoff on camera? It
was always my dream and we came very close
to doing it but the Department of Justice
thwarted us. I think Jack actually was willing.
You went to the prison? I went to the prison
and I met him.
How many times did you see him? Three or
four. I thought he was a very likable guy, very
funny, good storyteller, very charismatic.
Did you get a verbal agreement from him
that he’d be willing to be on camera? Yes.
Did the Justice Department give you a rea-
son why he couldn’t be in the film? The De-
partment of Justice used carrots and sticks to
persuade Jack not to be interviewed. We were
forcing the door open through legal efforts
and then the Department of Justice went to
Jack and persuaded him to write me a let-
ter saying that he did not want to be in the
movie. But I know he wanted to be in the
movie — he told me he wanted to. And I was
working with his lawyer in order to make that
interview happen. We shut down for a year
trying to get Jack. But at the end of the day
the Department of Justice intervened.
Why didn’t they want him to be in the film?
The legal argument is that you don’t want
your witness to be testifying to anybody else
because you want to control his version of the
acts and you don’t want his testimony, if he had
36 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
ever testified, to be impeached. And you don’t
want versions of his story floating out there
in the ether that could be attacked by defense
counsel. So that’s their rationale. But, the fact
is Jack had been sentenced and there was noth-
ing abridging his First Amendment rights, so
in my view what they did was improper.
When you realized you weren’t going to
get Abramoff on camera, were you unsure
if you had a movie? Trying to get him came
GO BACK & WATCH
ENRON: THE SMARTEST GUYS IN THE
ROOM Casino Jack isn’t the first time
Gibney’s turned his lens on corporate
greed. In this 2005 doc he examines the
major players responsible for the collapse
of one of the largest U.S. companies.
MR. SMITH GOES TO WASHINGTON
Nominated for 11 Academy Awards
when it was released in 1939, Frank
Capra’s look at Washington politics
through the eyes of a naïve U.S. Senator
(played by James Stewart) is considered
one of the first looks at the political
system run wild.
THE NATURAL Barry Levinson’s classic
look at corruption and the national pas-
time stars Robert Redford as Roy Hobbs,
a pitching phenom in his late teens whose
career is cut short after a freak incident.
He returns to the game in his mid 30s
and becomes one of the game’s greatest
sluggers with his bat. “Wonderboy.”
(LEFT-RIGHT) TOM DELAY AND BOB NEY.
very late. You can’t go into one of these things
thinking you don’t have a film if you don’t talk
to one person because then a witness can have
too much power over you. You go in thinking,
“I’m going to tell the story and I’m going to
tell it the best I can.” There’s always a way
to tell the story, and we started out telling
the story through the detectives: [executive
director of Citizens for Responsibility and
Ethics in Washington] Melanie Sloan, [lob-
byist] Tom Rogers and Sue Schmidt. [They
were] the people who dug out the story. And
the story changed because while waiting for
Jack we ended up getting [Congressman]
Bob Ney and [Abramoff business partner]
Adam Kidan, and they’re great. They weren’t
Jack, but they were pretty close. They both
have been in prison and were Jack’s partners
in crime. So you never know what you’re go-
ing to get; you just have to keep plugging and
hope you’re going to get something good.
From what you show in the film Tom DeLay
is perhaps a bigger villain than Abramoff
because he got away with it. I agree. It’s un-
believable that he’s gotten away with it. I’m
surprised that he was never indicted. It really
floored me. I mean, he had people like [De-
Lay Chief of Staff ] Ed Buckham and others
doing his bidding and you always have deni-
ability in that context. The way the system
works allows for an extraordinary amount of
PHOTOS COURTESY OF MAGNOLIA PICTURES
flexibility. In order to be found guilty of brib-
ery there has to have been an explicit quid pro
quo. But there’s never an explicit quid pro quo
— that’s never how it works. Where [DeLay]
and Abramoff saw eye to eye was once you
become a kind of hardcore ideologue then
anything that contradicts your beliefs is just
hidden in plain sight. Jack would always tell
me that “Willie Tan [who was involved in the
Marianas sweatshops] is such a good guy, and
 he told me there was no abuse going on so I
believed him.” Okay Jack. But did Jack ever
hire someone who spoke Mandarin to go out
to some of the factories to really talk to work-
ers when the foreman wasn’t there?
When did the idea come to intersperse clips
from Patton, Mr. Smith Goes to Washington
and The Manchurian Candidate? It comes
out of the character. Jack is a movie buff so he
kind of sees things cinematically. He loved to
quote movies, so it seemed to me that was fair
game. That was a way of finding a style for
the film that would mirror his character.
The way you used the last scene from The
Natural at the end of the movie is really jar-
ring: showing a memorable cinematic im-
age of America’s pastime during a voiceover
JACK ABRAMOFF.
explaining how America’s political system is
failing us. It’s a funny thing and we debated a
lot about it. It’s kind of a coda to the film but think that we’re going to be wealthy some that’s [Redford’s character] Roy Hobbs, the
The Natural, as written by Bernard Malamud, day. The sparks coming down on the ground American Dream — but in fact the American
is a story of corruption. There’s a happier end- are like pennies from heaven until you real- Dream at times can be a con because we don’t
ing in the Robert Redford version, but when ize that it’s all kind of a dupe; you see those want to ever say to the people in power, “You
[So Damn Much Money author] Bob Kaiser fans cheering in the stadium and it’s like we’re are abusing that power.” And that’s because
says, “The national pastime is not baseball, all being duped. So there’s something funda- we imagine we’re going to be in power some-
it’s making money,” that seemed like a grand mental about that spectacle we all believe in. day and we don’t want anyone to put checks
visual metaphor for this idea that all of us We all believe in the American Dream — and balances on us.t
PHOTO COURTESY OF MAGNOLIA PICTURES

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

37
In The Oath, her follow-up to the Oscar-nominated My Country, My Country, director Laura Poitras refracts America’s post-9/11 years through the story of two
estranged brothers-in-law. One is Osama bin Laden’s former bodyguard, free in Yemen, and the other is bin Laden’s driver, locked away at Guantanamo Bay.
By Scott Macaulay

Both intimate and epic, mysterious and clear-eyed, Laura Poitras’s The Oath examines So many documentaries start by establish-
the legacy of 9/11 through two unfortunately linked Yemeni men. Abu Jandal is the jihadist, ing the authority of their characters so that
a soldier who left Yemen to travel to Afghanistan where he became an al-Qaida member the audience believes them and trusts what
and one of Osama bin Laden’s personal bodyguards. He invites his brother-in-law, Salim they say. You have taken almost the opposite
Hamdan, to the country where he becomes bin Laden’s personal driver. So why at the movie’s approach, withholding key details about
start is Jandal driving a taxicab through Yemen and discussing jihad with young Yemenis them until later in the movie. How did you
while Hamdan, who was simply a low-level employee in al-Qaida, on trial in Guantanamo? come up with this structure? I was interested
That question tugs at us as we watch Poitras’s astonishing and essential documentary, in this approach because when I met [Abu
which opens in May from Zeitgeist Films. While telling a factual story about the political, Jandal], he was presented to me in one cer-
legal and intelligence issues informing our war against al-Qaida, Poitras also draws a complex, tain way, and then as I learned more and more
novelistic portrait of two men whose intertwined destinies tell us more about this conflict there was a certain kind of unfolding of his
than most newspaper articles ever could. Hamdan is never seen in the film; he is locked past. [Editor] Jonathan Oppenheim, who did
somewhere inside the anonymous Guantanamo prison buildings that are photographed Paris Is Burning and Children Underground,
with a disquieting beauty by d.p. Kristen Johnson. We hear through recited voiceover his and I felt that [Abu Jandal] was a character
sadly eloquent words, however — letters to his family waiting at home in Yemen. As Poitras with something to hide. We wanted to take
follows Hamdan’s Guantanamo trial as well as his Supreme Court case challenging the the audience on a journey where they think
authority of the Bush administration’s military commissions, Hamdan v. Rumsfeld, she cuts they know where he is coming from and then
back and forth to Jandal’s more inward journey as he grapples with the personal legacy of his backstory, as we slowly unravel it, makes
his fealty oath to al-Qaida and his knowledge that he is responsible for his brother-in-law’s them rethink what they know about him in
imprisonment. In emotionally involving, formally provocative filmmaking, Poitras argues the present, including his defense of the 9/11
for our human understanding of these two men, but in doing so she also refuses to simplify attacks. It makes them question, “What ac-
them; she turns Jandal and Haman into psychologically complex characters whose mysteries, tually is his motivation for defending them
if we could unlock them, might offer a way out of our post-9/11 policy cul-de-sac. now? Is it that he has something to hide? Is
The Oath is Poitras’s follow-up to her Academy Award-nominated My Country, My it that he believes [what he’s saying]?” We
Country, which told a story of the military occupation of Iraq by focusing on a Sunni doctor wanted the viewers to always be questioning.
and political candidate whose practice becomes engulfed by the victims of that conflict. The It’s a pretty classic trope of narrative storytell-
Oath premiered at the Sundance Film Festival, where Johnson and Poitras were awarded the ing to have these sorts of reversals or reveals
Excellence in Cinematography Award. It traveled to the Forum at the Berlin Film Festival, — it’s the “unreliable narrator” — but I think
the True/False festival (where it won the True Vision Award) and New Directors/New it isn’t used that often in documentaries.
Films. I spoke to Poitras by phone a few weeks before her film’s opening in theaters. How did you meet Abu Jandal? I went to

38 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010


Yemen with a lawyer, David Remes. At
that point I think he had 12 Yemeni clients
[in Guantanamo], and some of them have
since been released. I was looking for a story
about somebody returning home there from
Guantanamo, and I filmed his trip. We met
a bunch of families, and then he went home
and I continued working there for the next
couple years. On the second day in Yemen I
was asked if I wanted to meet Salim Ham-
dan’s family. Of course I said yes — it was
a year after the famous Supreme Court case.
Then I met Abu Jandal, and it kind of blew
my mind that this guy was driving a taxicab.
What did it mean that he was free and driv-
ing a taxicab while we’re imprisoning people
who probably had no direct contact with bin
Laden? I was immediately compelled. It was
rich story material, I could sort of piggyback
into the taxicab as a narrative or visual trope,
and there were all these psychological subtexts
I could play with. A guy driving a taxicab in
and of itself isn’t particularly interesting. A
guy who was bin Laden’s bodyguard, who’s
free in Yemen driving a taxicab? That’s really
interesting. Jonathan and I wound up work-
ing really hard in terms of calibrating what we
anticipated to be the audience’s relationship
to him and the questions [we knew the audi-
ence] would ask, like “Why is he free?” and
“Why does she have this access?”
Did you always restrict yourself to Yemen?
Did you explore other countries? I pretty
much felt like Yemen would be an interesting
place to set the story, and so many Guanta-
namo prisoners are from there. I figured that
when prisoners were released they’d be going
home there. That turned out not to be so true.
Most of the first prisoners released went back
to Saudi Arabia. But also, as it’s often report-
ed, Yemen is the ancestral homeland of bin
Laden, and it’s just a fascinating country.
How did your relationship with him evolve?
And over what period of time was your re-
lationship? Even though I met him on my
first trip, it took a long time to shoot the film.
Immediately I was like, “So, do you think I
HOW THEY DID IT
PRODUCTION FORMAT HDV and MiniDV 24p.
CAMERA Panasonic DVX100A (24p
Advanced), and Canon Vixia HV20
mounted inside the taxi.
EDITING SYSTEM Avid Express Pro.
Online conform to HDRS (23.98) on
Quantel IQ. HD titling generated on the
Avid Symphony Nitris.
COLOR CORRECTION Pandora Pogle
Evolution at PostWorks.
THE OATH.
could put a camera in your taxicab?” [laughs]
He was resistant for a long time. After the
first trip I just did some other filming and was
meeting lots of families. I was still searching
around for what story I would land on. And
then I made another trip back to Yemen and
said, “Hey, can I get in your taxicab?” It didn’t
happen that trip either. And then I went back
and rented a house in Yemen and spent two
years going back and forth. I had a lot of pa-
tience. I would go for a month and I would
come back with not a whole lot of footage
and go again.
How about on a personal level — how did
your relationship with Abu Jandal evolve
over time? As you can see, he talks to me-
dia, so he’s not shy. But I needed a different
kind of access, and that took a long time to
get. I made a film in Iraq about the war [My
Country, My Country] and he looked at that.
I think that film kind of gave me a level of
access that was different than what he gives
to typical media. But it was slow. Usually I
would contact him through a producer I had
there [in Yemen]. I mean, [Abu Jandal] is al-
Qaida, and I was already on a watch list when
I went to Yemen. I had to be careful in terms
of communication — like, I’m not in direct
contact with him now. We had to be cautious
and also stay under the radar.
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
39

Why do you think Abu Jandal agreed to
talk to you? I mean, obviously he’s attracted
to publicity. But was it deeper than that? I
think he wants to still have some relevance.
I think he’s somebody who wants to get his
position or word in. He’s a bit of a player. He
wants to say what he believes. I think he’s also
got something to hide, and I think he’s trying
to constantly set the story straight. But he’s
maybe, I think, creating more problems for
himself in a certain way. It’s pretty extraor-
dinary how open he is. Everybody is shocked
that he speaks so freely, and that he’s, you
know, walking [laughs] and that somebody
hasn’t taken him out — the Yemeni govern-
ment, the U.S., or the younger generation of
al-Qaida. It’s not just a mystery for us Ameri-
cans; it’s actually a mystery for people who re-
ally know this universe well. He’s clearly me-
dia-savvy and trying to control his image and
message. But across the board, everybody in
national security will tell you he’s a very im-
portant source for information about al-Qai-
da. Less so now — I mean, his information is
old, but when he was originally interrogated,
what he said was important stuff.
What’s happened to him since the movie?
I’m not in direct contact with him. I think
he’s got an office, and I think he’s been trying
40 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
ABU JANDAL IN THE OATH.
to set up this institute to retrain guys who’ve
gone to fight jihad and get them some prac-
tical skills so that they can transition back
into normal life. But nobody actually wants
to fund that. I think he has these ideas, you
know? I think he’s taking some business-
school classes, but I think he’s in a tough po-
sition because of his background to get a job.
Has he seen the film? He has seen the film.
GO BACK & WATCH
MY COUNTRY, MY COUNTRY For Poitras’s
2006 film, nominated for a Best Documen-
tary Oscar, she spends over eight months
in Iraq to chronicle a Sunni Arab doctor as
he runs in the ’05 elections.
THE ROAD TO GUANTANAMO Michael
Winterbottom and Mat Whitecross mix
drama and doc to examine the Tipton
Three, three British Muslims who were
held in Guantanamo Bay for two years
and released without charge.
RECYCLE In this ravishingly shot film,
director Mahmoud al Massad offers an
intimate look at a Jordanian father living
in Zarqa, a breeding ground for recruits to
the jihadist cause and birthplace of al-
Qaeda’s Abu Musab al Zarqawi.
Do you know what his reaction was? Well,
you know, again, I’m not calling him up and
saying, “Hey, how’s it going?” It was through
an intermediary. The first rumors I was get-
ting were negative, and that he was very up-
set. Then the second thing I heard was that
actually he was happy with the film. He said
the strength of the film is that it showed the
human dimension of this conflict, and that it
exposes that he’s against the policies of the
West and not the people. But I don’t know
— he might need to distance himself from
the film because of some of the content.
Did you go to Guantanamo? Kirsten John-
son, our cinematographer, and Jonathan, the
editor, did the Guantanamo shoot while I
stayed in Yemen.
Being on the U.S. travel watch list — that’s
a dimension I hadn’t even thought of. How
did that impact your practice of making this
movie? [laughs] Well, you know, I assume ev-
erything is listened to, including this interview.
That’s how it impacts how I did this work! If
you’re talking to any lawyer who’s representing
Guantanamo [prisoners], you basically assume
you are getting caught in the net of people
who are being monitored. And the question
is to what extent? Is it just electronic moni-
toring? Are they really paying attention? We
always kept multiple copies of footage in dif-
ferent places. I didn’t want to be subpoenaed
— that was certainly a concern. And when I
travel I experience difficulties. Returning back
to the States, I’m always met at the airplane by
Border Patrol folks who question me. So yeah,
it’s a particular way of working.
When were you added to the travel watch
list? I got flagged on the list in the summer
2006 after I finished My Country, My Country.
It was before I’d even begun work on some-
thing about Guantanamo and al-Qaida. So
[this film] certainly raised the stakes in terms
of subjects that touch on nerves, subjects that
are going to flag interest by the government.
Did you ever expect to get Salim Hamdan
on camera? When we started filming I cer-
tainly didn’t think he was getting home any
time soon. I thought, “Okay, well, he’s going
to get sentenced and I’ll finish the movie.” It
was always shot with the sense that he would
be a ghost in the film, and that we would have
one protagonist who was missing. That was
actually an important [emotional] element. I
spent a lot of time with families in Yemen,
and there were people missing. You could feel
their presence. We all know how many Iraqi
civilians are dead, or how long we’ve detained
people at Guantanamo, but we don’t really
 “The film is about loyalty and betrayal, and
that relates to me too. Loyalty and betrayal
between the filmmaker and the subjects.”
have a palpable relationship to those facts.
I feel it’s my job as a filmmaker to translate
those experiences on a more emotional level.
And so with Hamdan’s story, we’re using the
[voiceover recitation of his] letters to go be-
yond the image of guys in orange jumpsuits,
to [create] an emotional connection to this
[idea] of “being gone.”
Did you ever try to film Salim Hamdan? I
wanted to and he declined. The filmmaker in
me would have loved to have witnessed that
moment [of his release] and the reunion, but
I also have respect for his decision not to en-
gage the media. I think it’s probably the right
decision not to talk to folks. And it’s not just
me he hasn’t talked to. He hasn’t talked to Al
Jazeera. He just hasn’t done interviews.
I read your statement on indieWIRE where
you referenced Don DeLillo and the
Dardenne brothers as influences. At what
point in the filmmaking process do influ-
ences like these come into the movie? Don
DeLillo’s work I loved for years. I brought
both Underworld and Libra to Yemen and
read them there. The antihero and the themes
of terrorism are just so resonant in his work.
He has almost predicted certain things.
There’s just something very ominous in his
body of work pre-9/11. Underworld has just
such a fantastic nonlinear structure. I think
[his influence] allowed Jonathan and I as art-
ists to tell the story in a way that didn’t con-
form to something more generic, to really let
it unfold in complicated ways. And then in
terms of the Dardenne brothers, I just love
their open-endedness. They’re basically say-
ing, “We believe that the audience is smart,
and we want them to do some work here.”
I think that’s something we [as filmmakers]
THE OATH DIRECTOR LAURA POITRAS.
see page 78
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
41
 MARISA TOMEI AND JOHN C. REILLY IN CYRUS.

Taking their highly improvised storytelling to the mini-major level, the Duplass brothers team with stars
John C. Reilly, Marisa Tomei and Jonah Hill to create Cyrus, an unconventional love story between a man,
a woman and her grown son. By Alicia Van Couvering

Cyrus is the new film by the brothers Duplass (emphasis on the “Du,” as in, DU-plass, for
the record). It stars John C. Reilly as a man on the brink of giving up on love altogether, Marisa
Tomei as his long-awaited love interest and Jonah Hill as her man-child son, who tries his best
to wedge himself between them. Mark and Jay’s first feature, The Puffy Chair, premiered at
Sundance five years ago, one of the first of the DIY/Cast Your Girlfriend as Your Girlfriend
films that were soon grouped into the semi-unfortunate lump christened “mumblecore.”
In the intervening years, the Duplass Brothers have done good on their promise as bright lights
of a new film generation, exploring horror (Baghead) and getting deeply involved in the films
PHOTO BY: CHUCK ZLOTNICK

of their peers as producers (Lovers of Hate) and actors (Mark’s credits include Hannah Takes the
Stairs, Humpday, True Adolescents, Noah Baumbach’s Greenberg and Geoff Marslett’s Mars).
On the eve of the Sundance premiere of Cyrus, writers-directors-brothers Jay and Mark
Duplass spoke to Filmmaker about their film influences, studio politics, their on-set meth-
ods and snuggling.
Fox Searchlight opens the film July 9.

42 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010


Do you see your film as part of the pan-
theon of scary-kid movies, such as Clifford
or Problem Child? JAY: I haven’t seen any of
those movies.
MARK: I haven’t seen either of those films.
JAY: The Toy would be a good example…
Of a film that informed your screenwriting?
JAY: No, not at all.
MARK: No. We’ve just seen it, and there’s that
cool piranha scene, which I’ve always loved.
JAY: This is going to sound remarkably pre-
tentious —
MARK: …and ostentatious, and douchey —
JAY: But we really don’t reference other
movies, ever. Honestly our biggest influence
in film is documentaries. That’s what we’re
obsessed with, and we would probably make
them if they didn’t take four years and ruin
your bank account.
MARK: And your marriage, and also your
HOW THEY DID IT
PRODUCTION FORMAT HD/4k.
PHOTO BY: CHUCK ZLOTNICK
CAMERA Red.
EDITING SYSTEM Final Cut Pro.
COLOR CORRECTION Red log files col-
ored and conformed on a Quantel
Pablo Neo. We recorded onto 2242 Kodak
film stock using an Arri laser recorder.
(LEFT-RIGHT) CYRUS CO-WRITER-DIRECTORS JAY AND MARK DUPLASS.
friendships. [ Jay Duplass laughs]
Well, narrative films ruin all of those things
too. MARK: Not for us. We can do it. Like
when we made The Puffy Chair, it was nine
months from script to Sundance, and it was
relatively painless. Docs destroy. We like
having control of the narrative, and with
docs you have no control. So we just try to
basically approximate, as closely as we can,
the documentary feel inside of a well-struc-
tured narrative.
How do you run your sets? JAY: There’s a
lot of yelling and screaming.
MARK: We use a bullwhip.
JAY: We use flamethrowers. Basically we’re
the opposite of most directors in that —
MARK: It’s like a big therapy session. [both
laugh] There’s a lot of hugging going on.
There’s a lot of positive reinforcement hap-
pening. It’s really stressful in a lot of ways to
be an actor on our sets, because —
JAY: — we work in a state of confusion, ba-
sically.
MARK: [The actors] need to improvise.
They need to find the moments, and we
don’t let them lean on the script too much.
We want them to try to reinvent some of the
dialogue and make it fresh.
JAY: We don’t do any blocking. Our whole goal
is to just set up a room and basically foster an
interaction that we feel is interesting and real.
MARKS: And spontaneous.
JAY: And spontaneous. We’ll basically do
anything in order to get that. We’ll throw
the script out, we’ll insert different motiva-
tions. I mean, we’re always working within
see page 78
GO BACK & WATCH
PROBLEM CHILD Not since Dennis the
Menace has there been a dysfunctional
child like Junior. Foster parents Ben and
Flo (John Ritter and Amy Yasbeck) are
smitten by the child, but after taking him
in they quickly realize it was the worst deci-
sion they’ve ever made. But boy it’s fun to
watch.
ABOUT A BOY Sometimes it’s the
adult who’s the dysfunctional one as
the Weitz brothers show in their 2002
film starring Hugh Grant as a cynical
womanizer who grows up after building a
friendship with an unpopular schoolboy
(Nicholas Hoult).
THE TOY Richard Donner’s racially charged
comedy finds Richard Pryor as an out-of-
work newspaper reporter who is bought by
a wealthy businessman (Jackie Gleason) to
be the living toy of his bratty son.
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
43
 BEETLE QUEEN CONQUERS TOKYO WRITER-DIRECTOR JESSICA ORECK.

44 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

With Beetle Queen Conquers Tokyo director Jessica Oreck creates a beautiful homage to an unlikely
creature: the insect. Journeying to Japan, Orek shows through a poetic experimental style the country’s
unusual love for bugs. By Michael Tully | Photograph by Richard Koek

Jessica Oreck’s Beetle Queen Conquers Tokyo is one of those dazzlingly precocious
documentary feature debuts that make you wonder who on Earth could have possibly dreamed
up such a thing. A quick résumé inspection proves revealing: Oreck’s day job is working as
a live animal keeper, and sometimes docent, at the American Museum of Natural History
in New York City. With this bit of insight, Beetle Queen Conquers Tokyo begins to make
more sense, as it’s clear that Oreck is coming at filmmaking from a truly unique perspective.
This fresh, atypical approach has paid off, resulting in more acclaim and attention than
most borderline experimental documentaries ever get, culminating with Oreck winning the
Spotlight Award at the 2010 Cinema Eye Honors and being nominated for the Truer Than
Fiction Award at the 2010 Independent Spirit Awards.
In Beetle Queen Conquers Tokyo, which opens in theaters in May, Oreck travels to Japan
to explore that country’s ongoing fascination with insects. Interviews with experts are
interwoven with vérité footage of collectors and everyday citizens going about their daily
lives, which are in turn threaded throughout by a poetic voiceover that sheds more light on
the history surrounding this entrancing subject. Perhaps the best compliment one can pay to
Oreck’s film is that it’s so refreshingly hard to describe. Filmmaker sat down with Oreck to
discuss how this marvelous debut came to be.

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

45

Did you go school for your day job? No, I
went to school for filmmaking, and then I
minored in biology and ecology, and I have
a certificate in botany. “Certificate.” What a
stupid thing to get! [laughs] But I have that.
Does that imply you understood early on
that film was most likely going to be a hobby
as opposed to a breadwinner? Well, I always
knew I wanted to make movies about biolo-
gy, and now more ethnobiology, the way that
human cultures interact with the natural
world. But I never expected it to be a bread-
winner. [laughs] And I still don’t expect it to
be a breadwinner. So the day job is a really
great fit for me in terms of that. But I don’t
really want to work in science, like in a labo-
ratory, just because I feel like a lot of times,
in the science world and in academia as well,
the ideas become so focused that they be-
come totally obsolete. I didn’t want to pursue
a career in science — I really wanted to stay
sort of on the periphery, because I feel like
then you can interact a little bit more with
the masses, shall we say? [laughs]
46 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
BEETLE QUEEN CONQUERS TOKYO.
I love hearing people talk about the mo-
ment when they had the realization that
their idea was becoming an actual movie.
Do you remember when that happened?
Yes. It was almost the same moment that
the idea came. Bugs are my passion, more
than any other animal. I was teacher as-
sisting at AMNH, an in-between job be-
tween the video and the live exhibits, and
we had a guest speaker come in who talked
about how Japanese people love bugs. And I
thought, “This is awesome, I want to make
HOW THEY DID IT
PRODUCTION FORMAT MiniDV.
CAMERA Panasonic DVX 100A.
TAPE STOCK Panasonic miniDV tapes
(AY-DVM63PQ).
EDITING SYSTEM Final Cut Pro.
COLOR CORRECTION Apple Final Cut
Pro to conform entire movies, densitry
grade performed with a Da Vinci 2k plus
technology. Mastered to D5 1080i.
a movie about this.” I started doing research
that night, and there was nothing in Eng-
lish about it. So I sort of set that idea aside,
and I was like, “Well, I’m still in school,
I’ll wait. I’ll see how it goes.” Then literally
two days later, my sister randomly met this
Japanese-American entomologist in an air-
port in Baltimore. They started talking and
he said he was an entomologist and my sister
was like, “Oh, you should get in touch with
my sister, she wants to be an entomologist,”
blah blah blah. So she put us in touch, and
it turns out that he’s totally bicultural. He
grew up half in Tokyo, half in New York,
and so he knows both cultures really well.
And he goes around the U.S. talking about
how Japanese people love insects, because it’s
really surprising, obviously, to most people,
especially to entomologists here. So I said,
“Cool, I want to make a movie about this.”
And he said, “Great! We’ll stay at my par-
ents’ house and I’ll introduce you to my
entomologist friends.” That was it. It really
was that first phone conversation with Akito
[Kawahara] when I knew we were going to
make this movie.
I’ve recently been talking to a lot of people
who shoot docs in languages they don’t
speak. That’s a terrifying thought to me!
Did you have Akito or someone else with
you who translated at all times? Akito was
with us for the first two weeks, and then the
rest of the time we were with my friend Mai-
ko [Endo]. What we would do is we would
get to the place where we were going, and
we’d sort of do the preliminary introduc-
tions, and then as soon as Sean [Price Wil-
liams, the d.p.] turned on the camera, we
stopped knowing what was going on. They
just started communicating in Japanese. And
as much as possible, we would try and get
Akito not to talk to us. [laughs] Sometimes
he was explaining just because that was his
(THIS PAGE) PHOTOS COURTESY OF MYRIAPOD PRODUCTIONS, LLC.
habit, but for the most part we sort of lost
touch with whatever was going on, and when
he would say something and point, Sean
would follow his finger and just hope to God
(PREVIOUS SPREAD) PHOTO BY: RICHARD KOEK;
[laughs] that he was paying attention enough
to know what they were talking about. But,
yeah, that part was difficult, for sure.
The film has an unorthodox ebb and flow
to its storytelling. Was this more informed
by the fact that you hadn’t made a feature
before, or was it more directly linked to the
subject matter itself? Well, I knew going
into it that I wasn’t going to have a narrative
arc. Not because I think that narrative arcs
are bad, but because they just didn’t inter-
 est me. I think that sometimes they’re really
useful, and sometimes they feel really forced.
As I was doing research I realized that there
was just too much that I was interested in
talking about for me to force it into a nar-
rative arc. When I think about the film, I
think about it — this is going to be hard to
explain through audio — like this: When
you’re following a narrative arc you’re on one
plane; you’re going up and down on the x-
y-axis. But then if you add z, you can move
in a three-dimensional spiral. That’s sort of
the idea when I think about the film. So, if
you had a camera on a track, you’ve got this
cultural phenomenon in the very center, and
then the camera’s moving around it in all
these different planes. You know you’re trav-
eling through time, but you’re also traveling
through space in this direction. So when I
started the research I had come up with this
very vague idea of that structure, this crazy,
weird spiral that doesn’t make any sense
probably to anybody but me.
But that was calculated at least. That wasn’t
something you discovered after the fact.
Yeah. I mean, the list that I made of all the
shots that I wanted, Sean looked at it and
was like, “What type of movie are we mak-
ing? What the hell is this film about?” So it
was pretty clear early on that it wasn’t going
to be a particularly tight story. I mean, liter-
ally the way I did it was I wrote this 14-page
BEETLE QUEEN CONQUERS TOKYO.
paper about all the things that I wanted to
talk about, and then I printed it out and I cut
each idea out individually, and then arranged [Angell] and sometimes with myself, we just to Japanese pop music. And obviously
it in a way that I felt represented this spiral, could cut stuff just because it was awesome, some of those things still remain in there:
sort of this passage through time. And then the footage, and we’d be like, “We have no that opening credit sequence, the firefly se-
just kept cutting it down, because 14 pages, idea what we’re going to use this for, but quence, some of the really early stuff that I
I mean, that would’ve been like a 16-hour we’ll cut it,” like the cherry blossoms scene, cut. But then, of course, I was like, “Okay,
movie. [laughs] In the end, it ended up being where it’s just those stills of cherry blossoms. I can’t obviously cut all the time to Japanese
about three and a half pages. Theo cut that, and we had no idea what we pop music, I need some other stuff in there.”
As far as the merging of the voiceover and were going to use it for, and then when I So I started just cutting without music.
image, which is such a delicate process, how got the voiceover, you know, we both had a And then I had sort of a fiasco with a bunch
did that work? It was a bunch of different cut that we lined up with different things. I of different composers. None of it worked
things. Sometimes I would cut knowing that don’t remember who put the haiku with the very well, until the end, when finally J.C.
I wanted certain points to be made. Even cherry blossoms, but it just worked. So it was [Morrison] came up with the theme song
PHOTOS COURTESY OF MYRIAPOD PRODUCTIONS, LLC.

though the voiceover wasn’t written, I knew
I was going to write about, say, Zen garden-
ing, so when I cut the Zen gardening scene
I knew that it could be abstract to a certain
degree before it would lose its meaning. Be-
cause I was going to be talking about Zen
gardening, you didn’t necessarily need to see
full pieces of banzai, you could just get the
idea of it from the images. There were some
times when I’d say, “Okay, I’m going to cut
this knowing that I’m going to be talking
about it.” Then other times, like with Theo
a bunch of different things.
How about the music? That’s also very
important in enhancing the film’s poetic,
dreamlike quality. The music was a bunch
of different stuff. I mean, Sean and I both
love Japanese pop music from the ’80s:
YMO [Yellow Magic Orchestra], Saka-
moto, Takahashi, Hosono — all those guys
are some of our favorite artists ever. I had a
list of about 400 songs that I had to include
in the movie no matter what! They all had
to be in there. So originally I was cutting
that sort of plays a few times now. Nate
Shaw did most of the music throughout the
film, and a lot of the sound design and stuff.
It was really fun working together because
I would play pop music for him and I’d be
like, “I want this to be, you know, really…”
I’d describe it some way and he’d come back
to me with something totally different than
what I’d say and I’d be like, “Great! This is
exactly what I’m looking for!”
So if you knew before shooting that your
movie didn’t have an arc or a climax in a

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

47

“The film is so aligned with my belief
systems and my aesthetic ideas.”
traditional sense, when did you know you
were finished shooting? Was it as simple
as having a plane ticket home? It was the
plane ticket.
How long were you there? Six weeks. Sean
and I had a really hard time. We had one
twin bed for the both of us. And you know
Sean, he’s 6’4”, and that bed was about five
feet long. [laughs] So we were both ready
to come home, even though we both loved
Japan a lot. So there was no option that we
were going to stay any longer.
At what point did you know that you had
enough footage for a feature-length film?
Was that always an agenda? Feature-length
was always an agenda. Sean and I were re-
ally, really careful, because we really didn’t
want to come back with 300 hours of foot-
age, that just seemed overwhelming. So we
only brought 50 tapes with us. We ended
up buying a few more when we were there,
but in total, even with the voiceover — like
recording the voiceover onto tape — we
only had 68 hours. So we were really care-
ful to not go overboard on the shooting, but
I could’ve easily made it a four-hour docu-
mentary. I was like, “Ninety minutes is the
very longest it could be.”
This seems like a film you could’ve tin-
kered with forever. Did you call it a pic-
ture lock when you got a festival accep-
tance? Or did you give yourself your own
invisible deadline? In terms of when it was
done, I had a cut that I didn’t love, but it
was close, I thought. And originally the
48 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
BEETLE QUEEN CONQUERS TOKYO.
voiceover was in English — same woman
reading it with a Japanese accent in Eng-
lish. I showed it to a bunch of people, and
everyone was like, “Yeah, yeah, it’s cool.
We like it. We like it, you’re close.” Then
I showed it to my friend Robert Greene
[Owning the Weather, Kati With an I], and
he was like, “It has to be in Japanese.”
Which I had been fighting the whole time,
because my parents kept saying, “Oh, you
know, if it’s in Japanese then you can’t get
mass audiences.” Finally at that point I was
like, “Mass audiences? I’m not getting mass
audiences! I don’t care if it’s in Japanese!
It needs to be in Japanese.” The whole
time I’d been struggling with this idea,
GO BACK & WATCH
SANS SOLEIL Chris Marker’s groundbreaking
1983 documentary/essay examines
Japan as the repository of the “Other,” a
world whose strange customs are key to
comprehending the dominant culture.
MICROCOSMOS Claude Nuridsany and
Marie Pérennou’s 1996 documentary
uses a macro lens to focus on the huge
world of tiny insects that exists in a
French meadow.
MOTHRA Ishirô Honda’s 1961 horror
standard features a giant moth that
attacks Japan and spawns several
sequels, including the legendary 1964
showdown Mothra vs. Godzilla.
and finally I was like, “What the fuck am
I even waiting for?” By that time Haruko
Shinozaki, who’d done the voiceover, had
moved back to Japan. It was such a disas-
ter. I called Haruko and I was like, “We
have to do the voiceover in Japanese.” And
then as soon as I put the Japanese in, ev-
erything just felt so much better. I mean,
people complain about the subtitles, that
you can’t read the subtitles fast enough
because you want to pay attention to the
visuals and why didn’t I record it in Eng-
lish. Two of the main reasons were: it feels
right in Japanese; I think you would feel
like an intrusion if it was in English. And
the other reason is that I really like to
watch movies over and over again — that’s
something about my obsessive personality.
What I love about watching really good
movies more than once is that you notice
different things every time. I really hope
that someone will watch the movie and
only pay attention to the visuals and then
go back and see it again a second time and
get something totally different from it.
Once you had your footage, how did you
begin to approach the editing process?
Everyone has different methods for doing
things, but when I was in high school and
I had to do homework, I’d do math home-
work first, because even though I didn’t love
it very much, once it was done, it was done.
You know, your English paper you can al-
ways keep reediting. Math homework, you
either got the answer or you didn’t get the
answer, but you were done. So I felt sort of
the same way when I was making this. Like
the scenes that I knew how I wanted to cut,
I just cut. Even if I didn’t think they might
end up in there, I was like, “Okay, I’m just
going to cut everything that I know how
to cut.” Then the rest of it just sat around
for a long time, and I was like, “Ohhh! I
don’t know what to do!” A lot of that stuff
I left to [co-editor] Theo [Angell]. Then
once he had cut it, it was very clear to me PHOTO COURTESY OF MYRIAPOD PRODUCTIONS, LLC.
whether I needed to recut it or whether I
was okay with it the way it was. I get really
overwhelmed when there’s too much, when
there are too many options, so it was really
good to have Theo there, and I would defi-
nitely work that way again.
Did you ever worry about the question of
exploitation, being a foreigner and making
a movie about this subject? Or were you al-
ways just excited at the prospect of learning?
Initially, the prospect of learning was really
exciting, but as I delved more and more into
it, I realized — this is going to sound totally
hokey — but that I was Japanese in a past
life. [laughs] So much of what’s in the film
is so aligned with my belief systems and my
aesthetic ideas. So at first I was really excited
about just learning about it, and then I started
to feel like this was a really personal project.
In the end when I started showing it to Japa-
nese people, I had a little bit of fear — I was
like, “Oh, wait a second, I realize now I’m
an outsider.” The first person I showed it to

#82
was Maiko, because I feel like she was really
somebody I could trust to be like, “You’re an
asshole. Take that part out.” But she really
liked it, which was a good start. And so far
all the Japanese-Americans that I know that

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feel like it’s really nostalgic for them, that it
feels like it represents what they believe. I
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parents, but I don’t know what they could
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I know a lot of people come out of their first
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feature tired on the other end. But are you
rejuvenated to keep going, especially since
Beetle Queen has been received so well? It’s
interesting. I’m really excited to work on my
next project because I really like the way that
Beetle Queen came out, but the positive stuff
that’s happened with Beetle Queen has actu-
ally been harder to deal with than anything
else. Even though it’s been really positive, and
even though it’s doing really great, I’m hav-
ing to come to terms with the fact that I can’t
afford to make another movie and that there
are no solutions for me on the horizon at all.
Like, I can join Kickstarter and I can make
$20,000, and that won’t even cover a quarter
of my next project, because the next project
takes place in Eastern Europe, so we’re trav-
eling for three months. Filmmaking is so ex-
pensive. You can do all this stuff sort of in a
vacuum, but if you want to get it into a festi-
val, if you want it to look really good — espe-
cially if you’re shooting on film — there’s just
so much money that you have to sink into all
this postproduction stuff. I mean, the movie
itself wouldn’t cost that much, it’s the post-
production expenses. [laughs] And that part
of it feels really hopeless right now. But I’m
trying not to lose my excitement about the
next project. If I can just get it started, some-

FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

49
 Bahman Ghobadi’s No One Knows About Persian Cats mixes documentary and fiction in telling a musically exuberant,
politically charged story set in Iran’s underground rock scene. By Livia Bloom | Translated by Sheida Dayani

The soundtrack to Bahman Ghobadi’s film No One Knows About Persian Cats is like a mix- What first brought you to filmmaking? I
tape, each song meticulously selected and arranged in a perfect order. Its alternating highs and really liked sandwiches when I was a kid. I
lows and its shifts in language and tone place it in the company of compilations that have taken was born in a very small town called Baneh
on life independent of their films — from Pulp Fiction to Saturday Night Fever. Like these, in Kurdistan. There was a movie theater next
Ghobadi’s is a soundtrack that ought not be shuffled. to the sandwich shop. Whenever I told my
The film it accompanies is also a special one, not least of all because it allows each song father or my uncle that I wanted a sandwich,
to function as a strong-willed character in its own right. In this documentary-fiction hybrid, they would tell me to take it with me into the
shaped by a simple structure and a brilliant coda, we follow Ashkan and Negar, two hipster movie theater and eat it there. I always had my
musicians playing versions of themselves as they search for a bandmate with whom to go on sandwiches with Coke, and they wrapped the
tour. (In real life, their duo is called Take It Easy Hospital and Ashkar also performs as Ash sandwiches in paper. I never managed to eat it
Koosha.) Since they live in Iran, however, the complications of hitting the road take on not all before the lights went off, and as soon as the
only political subtext, but clear and present danger. Ashkan and Negar have already been to lights went off, I would watch my movie and
prison. Now they need passports—which means illegal ones—and the ready cash to pay for eat my sandwich in the dark. I never realized
them. If they get caught practicing their music, let alone performing it, severe consequences until the film was over that I had eaten not
await—particularly for Negar. In Iran, not only is much of Western-style music banned, but only the sandwich, but half the paper, too!
women are not allowed to sing. [Laughs] So my love for sandwiches took me
Yet despite the risks, the pair sets off on an odyssey of auditions, meeting a range of Iranian to the movies, and I became a moviegoer.
bands in search of the right musician to join them. Each group they meet has found a way to What kind of sandwiches tempted you so
remain out of earshot of neighbors and police; to remain “underground” even if that means tak- much? They only had three kinds: salami, hot
ing to the rooftops. The sounds in the film exhibit unusual cross-cultural pollination, or what dogs and hamburgers. I loved the bread: small,
the writer Sasha Frere-Jones has described in the New Yorker as “musical miscegenation. ” A white bread, sandwich bread shaped like hot
range of cultural musical influences are audible within single songs as well as on the soundtrack dog buns. When I think about it now, I can still
as a whole. Hip-hop by the talented rapper Hichkas (his name means “nobody” in Persian) is taste the bread and the paper that I ate with it.
matched with the metal of The Free Keys and the growl of Mirza, a crooner who belongs in I didn’t choose cinema; cinema chose me.
the company of Leonard Cohen or Tom Waits. In a director’s statement, Ghobadi writes, “In I gradually got drawn into watching films all
the eyes of Islam, music (ghéna) is impure, giving rise as it can to cheerfulness and joy. Hearing the time. There were no Kurdish filmmakers
a woman singing is considered a sin, because of the emotions it stirs.” In the case of chanteuse in the region when I was born. Cinema chose
Rana Farhan, critics might have a point: her voice smoulders like hot coals. to have a Kurdish filmmaker when I first made
The title of the film, No One Knows About Persian Cats (out in theaters through IFC Films in my movie A Time for Drunken Horses.
mid April), might be thought of as a reference to the American jazz appelation “hepcat.” But that  We did not have cinematic education,
was not what Ghobadi had in mind. “I compare [expensive, rare Persian cats] to the young pro- universities or higher education in my town
tagonists of my film, without liberty and forced into hiding in order to play their music,” he has or in Kurdistan. Even a hundred years after
explained. “What’s more, when I visited the musicians’ homes, I noticed that cats liked to stand in the invention of cinema, there is still nothing
front of the amps and listen!” For a film and a mixtape like this one, that’s not a bad idea. available. I went to two universities and I

50 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010


left them both because I could not learn
cinema there. I did not learn filmmaking in
the classroom; I learned it in life in Iran and
Kurdistan. The struggles that I went through
day after day, the wars that I witnessed in Iran
and Kurdistan — these are the things that
made me a filmmaker.
What brought you to the film No One Knows
About Persian Cats? Censorship, repression, and
pressure: these are the things that brought me to
the film. I had been trying to make another film
for three years, but the government gave me a
very hard time and would not release permission
for it. I was kept at home and I couldn’t do
anything; it was a struggle day after day. Often
I thought about committing suicide. Finally, I
packed everything, and wanted to leave Iran.
Then, however, a friend who was visiting
said, “This was exactly what the system wants.
PHOTO BY: MIJ FILM
They want you to leave and not to work. If
you really want to fight this, you have to stay
here and do something — move! If you cannot
make films, do something else; go study music.
ARASH FARAZMAND IN NO ONE KNOWS ABOUT PERSIAN CATS.
You love music; do something in that world.”  real names, and play their own music. Can
So I did: I went to study underground
music, and I got to know many underground
bands in Iran and Tehran. I realized that
these kids were very brave, and that they were
doing what they want to be doing. They were
making music in their basements without any
money, without any equipment, but with a
lot of courage. I decided to make a film in
their style; I learned this particular style of
filmmaking from them. With the music of
these kids, my whole view of the world has
changed. They have opened a new window in
my life, and I owe them very much.
 Your first film, Life in Fog, was a documen-
tary short. This film’s characters use their
HOW THEY DID IT
PRODUCTION FORMAT HD/2k.
CAMERA Silicon Imaging + P&S Munich
EDITING SYSTEM Adobe Premier CS3
you discuss the documentary elements of this
film, and the way that the documentary and
fiction modes intersect in your work? Many
of the films that I’ve made have their roots
in reality and truth. I don’t make films based
on fiction, I make them based on real life.
Many of the people in my films have actually
experienced the lives you see onscreen.
When I started making a film about the
underground music world in Iran, I realized that
although I was making a documentary, it was
very similar to a fiction film. These stories have
a lot of drama. The underground music world
in Iran is very different from the underground
music world in the U.S. or in other western
countries. It exists because of a lack of space
and lack of permission to make music. These
people are actually hiding. Their lives are so
traumatic that there is a lot of inherent drama
in even a documentary portrayal.
For instance, when I met Ashkan and
Negar, the film’s two main characters, I
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
51

NO ONE KNOWS ABOUT PERSIAN CATS CO-WRITER-DIRECTOR BAHMAN GHOBADI.
“The truth is that we are in a very bad
situation in Iran, and we need to talk about it.”
decided I wanted to make a documentary
about them. But when I followed them as
they tried to leave Iran, I realized that their
story in and of itself had a lot of fiction-like
drama. A lot of my films are this way. They
are documentaries that have a lot of fiction
in them.
Every time I want to make a film, I go and
I live with my characters in advance. Fifty
percent of my script comes from the people
who are living those lives, and the other 50
percent I make myself.
The half that I do, my 50 percent, has roots
in my memories of childhood and my own
experiences. For example, characters like Ayoub
in A Time for Drunken Horses, Satellite in Turtles
Can Fly and Nader in No One Knows About
Persian Cats all are based on real charcters from
my childhood and in my life. So to a certain
extent, I replicate my life in my films.
To what extent are your films written or
spontaneous? Most of the time I don’t even
have a script. I start filmmaking with just two
or three written pages. I go to the location and
prepare my dialogue about half an hour before
I start to film, and I usually complete the script
after I’m done directing. I do this in order to be
as natural and close to reality as possible.
  Before filmmaking, I go to live with my
characters. We stay together in a big house
52 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
and I don’t separate from them. I want to
monitor every little thing that they do and the
precise way they do it. I observe them very
closely, and then I ask them to repeat some
of those parts the next day in front of the
camera. I don’t give them unreal text; I want
them to use their own lives. I take from them,
and then I give back to them.
Usually when I ask writers to cooperate
with me, it’s because I want them to challenge
my ideas. So if we sit down and I say, “A
boy and a girl…” Then the person will say,
GO BACK & WATCH
PLATFORM Jia Zhang Ke’s 2000 saga
reflects the change in China from Maoism
to the new capitalism through the antics of
a musical troupe in the Shanxi province.
HEAVY METAL IN BAGHDAD In this
2007 documentary, filmmakers Eddy
Moretti and Suroosh Alvi travel into
2005 war-torn Baghdad to watch Acras-
sicauda, a homespun heavy metal band.
IRAN: VEILED APPEARANCES Thierry
Michel’s 2003 documentary was one of
the first works to reveal a surging youth
culture at odds with the established
theocracy in Iran.
“Why a boy and a girl? Why not two girls? ”
I want them to constantly question my ideas
and to complement areas where I might be
lacking. This is the second time that I’ve asked
a writer to sit down with me to complement
and complete my ideas.
 We can’t really touch the scenarios because
we want to make films exactly like the lives that
are happening. What we do is control the stories
a little bit and give them a cinematic shape. We
follow them, we record all the events that are
happening in their lives. Everything that you see
in No One Knows About Persian Cats is exactly
the same as what’s happening in real life —we
just give it an ending and a cinematic form.
Can you describe your technical procedure
for this film? How many people were on your
crew? Because our subjects were all musicians,
we had to have a lot of people with us to carry
equipment and other stuff. Minus them and our
drivers, however, it was only about five or six of
us going to locations: a very small crew made up
of me, two assistants, a cinematographer and a
sound person. We used a couple of motorcycles
and one SI2K digital camera.
We didn’t have permission to shoot this
film, however, and therefore we could not be
seen on the streets.
On that note, you were arrested while mak-
ing Persian Cats. Could you describe what
happened? I was arrested on June 2, 2009,
because I wanted to leave Iran through the
airport with a legal passport. My friends told
me not to leave legally because the authorities
would stop me and take my passport away. So
I went to Kurdistan, in order to leave illegally
at the border where I made A Time for Drunken
Horses. It was there that I was arrested by
plainclothes militia. They took me to Hamedan
for three days, and then to Tehran. It was two
days before the presidential elections in June
that they told me to leave Iran.
They had created this kind of fear in me
prior to this event, but this time it was a lot
more intense. Every time I traveled, they
would take me in at the airport, interview me,
and invite me to the Ministry of Information.
There, they would tell me very politely to take
my stuff and leave Iran. This had happened
seven or eight times. Each time I questioned
why I should leave my own country, they told
me, “If you don’t want to leave, don’t make
movies in the Kurdish language, or don’t
interview with foreign media outlets, or
PHOTO BY: MIJ FILM
don’t make movies about such matters.”
I could still go back to Iran. I’m not afraid
of anyone; of course I could go back. But if
I do go back, I’m sure that I would be taken
into prison, like my friend Jafar Panahi.
Then, if they ever let me out of jail, they
would take my passport away and not let me
travel anymore. When I think about it now, I
wonder if it’s better to go back, or if it’s better
to stay outside Iran, make films, do interviews
with people like you, and work in Iraq to help
other people make films.
I’m in the process of doing a number of
activities here, outside Iran, for the benefit of
people who are still inside. I’m making films,
finding budgets and working hard for the
benefit of filmmaking in Iran. I’m conducting
a workshop and building studios in Kurdistan
Iraq so that Iranian bands can come record
their music there.
During the production, did you run into
trouble with the police? Only once did they
question what we were doing, in Tajrish,
Tehran. But I talked to the police officers and
calmed them down. I explained what we were
up to and gave them DVDs of my films. One
of them told me that he had a daughter and
asked me to make her an actor. I gave him
my phone number and said, “Sure. Contact
me anytime you want.” So they calmed down
and left after two or three hours. We were not
arrested, and they didn’t take us anywhere.
Two or three times I was compelled to
borrow permits that my friends had for other
films. For example, a friend of mine had a
permit to make a film about drugs. The scene
with the police in my film is all real — but
they hadn’t come to be in my film, they were
under the impression that they were part of
a different film. I told them, “This kid we’re
filming is being arrested for drugs,” and they
acted along, thinking that it was all being done
for another film entirely.
Anything that’s being said by the government
about drugs — and any films that are being
made by them — are propaganda. They make
it appear that they’re actually fighting against
drugs, but that’s not the case. When you go to
many regions of Kurdistan, you see that people
are encouraged to use drugs.
Drugs are also another reason that it’s
difficult for these kids to make music in Iran.
They are accused of being into drugs and
alcohol; they are also accused of being devil
worshippers and fire worshippers. But when
you go and see them up close, you realize that
that’s not the case. In fact, I got to know God
better through these kids, their bands and
their music. Through them, I learned more
about God than I ever knew before.
Are you saying that there was a religious
element to this project for you? I’m not a
religious person, but I believe in an energy in
the world around us that you might call God.
When I told you at the beginning of this
interview that these kids changed my view of
the world, this is exactly what I meant. They
made me question myself, who I am, why I
am here, and what I’m doing in this world.
In Persian we say, “Religion makes trouble
for people.” I don’t think that there’s anything
inherent in religion itself that is a difficulty;
multiplicity of religions is the trouble. The fact
that there are all so many different religions
makes it difficult for human beings to coexist.  when I had no choice other than to leave.
Your recent conflict with Abbas Kiarostami
has been of great interest to the film com-
munity. Would you like to say a few words
about that? I’d like to set the record straight
for the last time here in this interview. First
of all, I have a lot of respect for Abbas
Kiarostami. He is my teacher and I have the
greatest respect for his films and his work. He
was like a father to me, and when I wrote to
him [publically], it was like writing to one’s
father. He knows, better than anyone else,
that in the Iranian filmmaking world I have
the highest regard for him.
Recently, Abbas Kiarostami did an
interview with an Arabic newspaper in which
he congratulated me, Bahman Ghobadi, on
leaving Iran. He said it in a sarcastic tone, ���
im-
plying that I had run away. It’s not right for
him to make me appear as a cowardly person
who would flee Iran. I did not run away; I was
made to leave my country.
He also said, “I’m living in my country, in my
NEGAR SHAGHI AND ASHKAN KOSHANEJAD.
homeland, and making films in my language,”
thereby implying that I, Bahman Ghobadi,
was not doing this. Yet at exactly the time that
he was making a film (Certified Copy) with
Juliette Binoche in a non-Persian language, I
was making Persian Cats in my own language
and in my own country. Of course there is
nothing wrong with making films in other
languages, but the fact is that he shouldn’t
have made me seem like a coward and himself
a hero in front of people. I did not appreciate
being put down in front of my own people
He’s in an international boom. He’s an
international figure who’s very safe in Iran.
But he makes it sound like everybody can sleep
peacefully in Iran. That is really not the case.
If you’re in a position of power, you should
not assume that everyone else is in that same
position. So what I am saying is, “Please do not
make it sound like all the people in Iran have
a peaceful and calm life like you do.” When I
open my mouth and say something, I want to
represent the reality of life in my country. The
truth is that we are in a very bad situation in
Iran, and we need to talk about it.
Mr. Kiarostami must remember that there’s
a big difference between his filmmaking and
my filmmaking; we’re not making the same
kind of films. My filmmaking, like that of
Jafar Panahi and Rakhshan Bani-Etemad, is
political; we take the camera out into society.
Naturally, we don’t get permission to film as
easily as Kiarostami does to make his art films.
see page 79
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
53
Harmony Korine follows up his Mister Lonely with a defiant Nashville-shot stealth feature, Trash Humpers,
a bizarre ode to vandalism, urban decay and VHS tape-trading culture. By Scott Macaulay

When Filmmaker last covered Harmony Korine it was the spring of 2008 when his film We covered you in 2008 with Mister Lonely,
Mister Lonely, a drama about a Michael Jackson impersonator, opened in the States. An emo- so I wanted to start by asking about this film
tional story of personal transformation, it was Korine’s first feature since 1999’s julien donkey- in relationship to that film — not only the
boy and saw him working on a larger scale in Europe with a cast including several name actors content but the mode of production. Why
(Diego Luna, Samantha Morton, Denis Lavant). At the film’s end, the Jackson impersonator did you follow up Mister Lonely with Trash
played by Luna learns to live without his mask — his stage makeup and King of Pop costume Humpers? I don’t know if it was a reaction
— transitioning into a new, uncertain and yet hopeful phase of his life. to Mister Lonely, but I guess that movie was
The release of Mister Lonely followed Korine’s move back to the States from Europe. He very frustrating to me — the amount of time
settled back to Nashville, his childhood home and the location of his first feature, Gummo, got I spent making that film and how compli-
married and now has a young daughter, Lefty. And he’s become an in-demand commercial direc- cated everything got… Sometimes I feel like
tor, helming original spots for companies ranging from Budweiser to Liberty Mutual. So one the lack of spontaneity, the lack of immediacy
might think that his next feature would be a more conventional film following up on Mister works against a director. I have always felt like
Lonely’s move towards straightforward narrative. it would be nice to work as quickly as I can
Such an assumption is ripped apart by Korine’s latest, Trash Humpers, opening in theaters think, you know? For Trash Humpers origi-
in May through the record label Drag City. In fact, the mask removed at the end of Mister nally there were just these photographs. I was
Lonely is placed right back on again here. Korine and his wife, Rachel star underneath a layer of dressing up my assistant, we’d go out late at
prosthetics as a delinquent elderly couple, trawling the back alleys of Nashville and engaging in night in the alleyways by my house, and he’d
ritualistic vandalism that is both oddly symbolic and disturbingly random. Assorted characters wear these kind of crude masks, like he was
enter and disappear, and the band of trash humpers — so named for their propensity to dry a burn victim. And he would go and forni-
hump garbage cans — communicate mostly in nonsensical bursts of cackled laughter. And al- cate with trash. I would use the worst cameras
though Trash Humpers, which looks like a montage of degraded VHS clips, is a feature-length possible, disposable cameras, and take these
film that will debut in theaters, crucial reference points ­— the Kipper Kids, Paul McCarthy, pictures, get them developed at the drugstore.
Cameron Jamie — all hail from the art world. Indeed, Trash Humpers has as much to do with It was more of like an art piece or something.
performance as it does with cinema. Nonetheless, for all of its seeming disinterest in conven- And then I looked at the pictures, and there
tional storytelling, Trash Humpers does have a surprising and unexpected narrative build as its was something kind of creepy and compelling
themes of discarded people in a disposable society are imbued with a subtly tender belief in about them. And so that’s kind of where the
family and personal connection. idea came from.

54 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010


It’s also a very different kind of production.
Gummo and julien donkey-boy were both
made in the midst of that ’90s American
indie movement when a company like New
Line would finance films like those. And
then Mister Lonely was another model. You
moved to Europe for a while and figured
out how to access different subsidy funds
and foreign sales advances. And now this
film — I don’t want to call it “DIY,” but it’s
a much more grassroots affair. Well, this
one, it’s its own thing. I mean, in some way
the idea of what movies are now is changing.
I don’t necessarily think that cinema means
the same thing as it did 10 years ago, or even
that I feel the same way about it as I used
to — especially narrative filmmaking. With
this movie I wanted to make something that
wasn’t even really a movie in the classical
sense. I wanted to make something that was
more like a found object, like a movie that
had been thrown in the trash somewhere, a
VHS tape that had been buried in a ditch.
I didn’t want it to remind anyone of a con-
ventional film in any way. I didn’t want to
make a film where there was even too much
thought going into the compositions, where
“I wanted to make something that was
more like a found object, like a movie that
had been thrown in the trash somewhere.”
there was no such thing as coverage, where
it was more just about a kind of documen-
tation. The thing that’s most exciting to me
is that I started shooting this movie just 11
months ago and now it’s about to come out in
the movie theaters. We did it with no studio,
very little money, a stealthy crew. It was more
of a concept, an idea away from the world. It
was an exciting way to function.
But there still seem to be aspects of the
traditional movie experience that are im-
portant to you. Because, you know, Trash
Humpers is a movie. It is in theaters. It could
have been something else, though, like a
video installation or, as you say, a collection
of photographs. Right. That’s true. I mean, I
guess having said that, I still always feel that
theatrical distribution is the ultimate. You
still always want it to be projected. Now what
happens after that almost doesn’t even matter
TRASH HUMPERS.
to me so much. But yeah, I do make these
things hoping, no matter how kind of unorth-
odox they are, that they’ll play in the movie
theaters. I’ve always dreamed that my mov-
ies would play in multiplexes, like on a Miley
Cyrus double bill or something. [laughs] And,
once they play in theaters, however else they
are seen almost doesn’t matter to me. VHS
releases, cell phones or someone projecting it
into a toilet bowl, I really don’t care any more,
you know what I mean?
After seeing Trash Humpers I began to think
of your films as having a real autobiographi-
cal thread. Gummo is a movie coming out of
your youth in Nashville. Yeah.
And julien donkey-boy deals with New York
and your family in Queens at the time. Mis-
ter Lonely was made after time spent living
in Europe, and now this film has been made
after a lot has changed in your life. You got
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
55

married, you have a house, you have a kid
and you’re back in Nashville. And because
you and your wife Rachel are both in Trash
Humpers and you’re wearing old people
masks, I guess I just thought of the idea of
going back to your hometown after being
away and imagining growing old there but
still wanting to have the kind of relationship
you had to the place when you were growing
up. The movie to me was almost about taking
an attitude one would have when they were
young and projecting it into the future, into
an older version of themselves, if that makes
any sense. Yeah. [laughs] It could be, I don’t
know. I haven’t even thought about that really.
You know, it’s like an emotion. It’s like a feel-
ing or a pull. I just remembered growing up
here, and I remembered seeing certain things
in the alleyways. There’s a kind of vernacular
here I understand that was speaking to me. I
didn’t question it so much. I almost wanted to
make a film in a way that I almost didn’t know
what was happening, where I was creating it
from the inside out. I wanted to make a film
that was primarily an ode to vandalism, or a
film that was almost about the glory of de-
56 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
TRASH HUMPERS DIRECTOR HARMONY KORINE.
struction. In some ways I admire these charac-
ters because what they do is live in terms of the
opposite. Like, for example, while you sleep
they’re awake. They’re artists and they find
some kind of beauty in destruction, in watch-
ing things burn, in messing with the laws of
reality to create their own kind of language. In
that way I identified [with them].
Physically, have those neighborhoods in
Nashville changed a lot since Gummo? They
have. Like in a lot of America people seem to
just knock down anything that’s too old. A
lot more white people have moved in, at least
into the city limits, and they pushed back a
lot of the minorities. You know, there’s still
traces of the way things used to look and feel,
and I tend to film in those areas, just because
it feels like they’re not going to be there much
longer. Eventually all the bowling alleys and
strip malls and abandoned car washes become
like, you know, check-cashing places and cof-
fee shops. That thing, that feeling is still pres-
ent, but you have to look for it.
Tell me about the masks. The masks were
interesting because we had had someone try
to make them and they turned out really bad.
And I almost pulled the movie. It was two
days before we were supposed to start shoot-
ing and the masks didn’t fit [the actors’] faces
— they couldn’t move and they couldn’t show
expression. I felt if the masks were bad, then
the film just wouldn’t work. And so Avi, my
brother, he did some research and found these
[mask makers] in Los Angeles. They did an
amazing job in like three days. We got a UPS
box full of masks.
So the masks were made specifically for you
and the other actors? Yes. At one point I con-
sidered having real old people, but I knew that
it would be pretty physical. We would be liv-
ing [the movie] and, you know, I didn’t want
anyone to die. I would have had to have found
old people willing to do that stuff. I decided
that there would be something more interest-
ing about them being partially young as well.
Young bodies, old faces — kind of shape-shift-
ers, characters that live in the shadows.
How many days did you shoot it? Approxi-
mately two weeks.
This is the first film you’ve done without a
high-profile d.p. involved. Yeah, yeah. I just
shot it myself. I mean, again, it fit the concept
because it really was made the way it looks.
We basically would live out in the woods.
We would just drive around or walk through
the alleyways. Some nights we would sleep in
these tractor tires that we would make, and we
would kind of just document things. I never
did things more than once or twice. We would
just walk around with a VHS camera. And
then after about two weeks I just figured that
this movie was all done. We had destroyed ev-
erything there was to destroy and gotten to a
point where there was nothing left to do. But
then in some ways the editing was like staying
in character. I would just sit there with my edi-
tor with a stack of VCRs. It was really hot, so
we would be in our underwear. He’s 75 percent
blind, and we would just take apart the ma-
chines and I would always catch him sticking
pencils in the VCR to give the footage these
glitches. We would tape over the same tape,
degrade the images over and over again. And it
almost felt like these characters were just mak-
ing the films on their own VCRs.
Did you ever think of distributing it on
VHS? Yeah. I mean, I’m still going to do a
VHS release. We’re going to tape over a lot
PHOTO BY: RACHEL KORINE
of old other movies, like we’ll put this over
Three Men and a Baby or some Jean-Claude
Van Damme film. Originally we had thought
about not even releasing it, just making this
film and then randomly dropping it off onto
different people’s doorsteps or police stations,
sending the footage to newspapers, throwing
the tapes in the trash and letting people pick
them up on their own and seeing what hap-
pened organically. But I didn’t have the pa-
tience for it. [laughs]
There’s a scene in this film in which Ra-
chel’s character instructs a little boy on how
to put a razor blade in an apple. I thought
back to Gummo, and how this scene in that
movie would have felt very different — like
it was deliberate provocation. In this film,
it almost seemed to me to be a meditation
on fragility and the dangers that can befall
kids. I guess for me it was informed by you
having a daughter. Yeah, I can see that.
And then of course Lefty comes into the
movie at the end. It was a strange time making
the movie because she had just been born. And
so her mom and my wife, Rachel, and I were
in it. At a certain point I started to feel like I
was losing myself into this movie. It started to
become kind of scary, actually, but it was also
exciting. We would mostly film at night and
we’d sleep during the day. When your objectiv-
ity goes, it’s wonderful and also frightening.
Tell me about some of the other people in
the movie. Well, there’s a little kid who was
a Pentecostal preacher, this kid that I’d heard
about who lived on the outskirts of Nashville
and who would spend a lot of time in front
of a Holiday Inn screaming at guys who were
fucking whores. He would also hang out in
front of 7-Elevens standing on egg crates. I’d
heard about this kid, this exceptional character
who was all into serpents and strychnine and
all that kind of fire and brimstone. But when
we met him all he really wanted to talk about
was his obsession with the African basketball
league. Another one is Chris Crofton, who’s a
comedian from here. He’s a really good come-
dian; he specializes in jokes with no punch lines
— more like insults. But he does them really
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wonderfully. And there’s Dave Cloud, the guy
with the humongous toenail who’s a master of
the one-string ukulele. One of the characters,
Chris Gantry, is a well-known songwriter who
wears a nursemaid’s outfit and says that poem.
And there’s Brian Kotzur, who’s a drummer for
that band the Silver Jews.
Tell me about the balance you’ve struck be-
tween making movies and doing commer-
cials. I’ve been interested that your most
narrative work is for commercials, like the
Liberty Mutual campaign you did. Yeah, I
love making commercials because in some
ways when I do them I get to pretend that I’m
a commercials director rather than really be-
ing one. It’s almost like I step into a character.
And they’re exciting for me because they’re
technical exercises. They are really not even
so much about me, and I get to work with
people I wouldn’t normally get to work with.
How do you work as a commercials director?
Do people bring you boards or do you come
up with the ideas? Yeah, usually people have
concepts, they come to you, and they want you
to develop them — you know, make them vi-
GO BACK & WATCH
THE IDIOTS Lars von Trier’s 1998 trib-
ute to chaos features a cadre of Co-
penhagen citizens who spend their free
time “spazzing,” i.e. acting idiotically.
EVEN DWARFS STARTED SMALL Werner
Herzog’s beautifully bizarre 1970 drama
recounts the adventures of a group of op-
pressed little people who take over the
mental institution that houses them.
PINK FLAMINGOS John Waters’s 1972
cult favorite, which featured Divine out
to show the world she really is “the
Filthiest Person Alive,” set a high bar for
low taste in films.
World Wide entertainment insurance specialists
Commercials • Errors & Omissions
Liability • Special Events
Personal Lines • Health • Life
Equipment • Production Office
sual, give them a story, character. I don’t really
do too many. I’ll do like two or three a year. I
try just to do the ones that are interesting.
Tell me a little about having your production
entity in Nashville. What’s it like trying to
have a production company there? Well, I’m
just trying to stay away from the big cities. I’m
trying to stay away from places where I feel like
people can suck my lifeblood. As far as the pro-
duction company goes, we have it set up here
because, again, it comes back to that dream of
being able to move as quickly as I think. I’m
starting to get close to this point where I can
actually act on all my impulses, you know, like
I don’t need too much to do it. I can just kind
of work on my own here and no one really pays
too much attention to me.
Are you still as voracious a movie watcher?
You know, it’s strange, I don’t really watch
as many movies as I used to. I still go to the
movies, but there hasn’t really been that much
I’ve been superexcited about, honestly.
How about music and art? Yeah. It’s not
even really music that much anymore, either.
I got to this point where all I could really
do was just listen to radio, like the local rap
station here. It’s more like artwork [l’m in-
terested in] — painters and some photogra-
phers. I don’t know what happened. It’s like
you can get so filled up with things that you
have to cut yourself off and then just work
them out. There’s so much information now,
so much noise in the world. At some point
you’re just like, “Man, there’s just so many
bands, they all sound the same.” You know
what I mean? There’s maybe just a fraction
of difference from this movie to that movie.
You’ve never been big on promoting yourself
through social media. Faceboook, Twitter,
any of that stuff. No. To me that just sounds
like hell on Earth. [laughs] This idea of
see page 79
Films •Documentaries
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
57
 LINE ITEMS
STRAIGHT TALK
PRODUCER MIKE S. RYAN CHALLENGES THE CURRENT PREOCCUPATIONS OF OUR INDEPENDENT FILM SCENE.
Call me crazy, but I don’t think distribution
is the greatest problem facing independent
cinema right now. Distribution is a problem,
but it has always been. Returning investment
is perennially difficult, but even when we had
a few exceptional profit leaders most films lost
money. The brief heyday of what seemed like a
profitable indie industry was just a bubble, like
dot-com and real estate. Bubbles typically self-
inflate with the hot air of the people inside,
spewing gas to mask secret truths. In the case
of independent film, it is this: uncompromis-
ing, quality work that exists outside the main-
stream has only ever been profitable for a few.
Today most of us in independent film are
looking for new ways to justify investment
in our movies. DIY output deals, VOD and
niche marketing seem like the new hot ideas.
And recent successes with new platforms are
a true sign of hope. Our expectations are ad-
justing to reality; innovative, passion-driven
films are finding their audience again. What
concerns me, though, is not the slow, vague
emergence of new business strategies but the
idea that filmmakers need to adjust their ideas
to conform to these so-called new models.
Post-screening, filmmakers are used to
hearing from potential distributors: “Great
film, but we’re not seeing the poster.” In other
words: “We’re passing because we don’t know
how to market this.” These distributors don’t
believe they can interest a mass audience in
original, unclassifiable films. Today that mar-
ketplace concern has not only become more
intense but is almost accepted as a justified
reaction to difficult movies. And it’s not just
distribution execs but also the press and even
other filmmakers who retreat to this mind-
set, dismissing innovative work that seems
alien to our commercial marketplace.
Roger Corman was famous for mocking
up one-sheets before his films rolled camera.
Today, filmmakers are told to have Constant
Contact lists of their target audiences on their
hard drives before their first days of filming.
The required strategy is to first launch a Face-
book page, make your fans your “audience” and
allow their swelling numbers to serve as your
green light. And, then, as you shoot, make sure
these fans don’t get away by marketing your
film through Twitter updates, blog posts, and
other forms of social-media messaging.
This is indeed a great strategy for certain
58 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
MIKE S. RYAN.
films — but not all films allow for such easy
niche preconceptions. While defining a film’s
possible marketing plan early can be helpful, a
promising marketing plan should not justify a
film’s existence. And, more importantly, the lack
of one should not designate a film as worthless.
Developing content and nurturing auteurs
should be our top concern, not figuring out dis-
tribution models or revenue schemes. The whole
purpose of independent film is to make films
that aren’t prefabricated to hit a target audience
of someone else’s devising. In fact, it’s that kind
of market-centric thinking that puffed up the
bubble with derivative films; it’s those goals that
made indie go flaccid in the first place.
Audience-driven content posing as truly in-
dependent film has numbed the audience that
is hungry for innovative work. Powerful state-
ments told in direct, aesthetically challenging
and possibly uncomfortable ways are what mark
visionary work. The outer margins are where
true visionaries live, and the fact that these art-
ists may not reach the mainstream is not sad;
it should be embraced. I’m not interested in
dragging everyone I know to the new Béla Tarr
film. Béla Tarr is not for everyone (his work
is actually for very few), but it is exceptional
work, and it deserves to exist, despite the fact
that Béla does not have Facebook or Twitter
accounts. I’ve heard it said that because film-
makers like Todd Solondz and Jim Jarmusch
don’t have readily-defined young audiences
reachable through all these various wired plat-
forms that their work is considered less relevant
today than the latest viral sensation. Frankly, I
find that a sad and scary opinion.
I worry that the traditional gatekeepers
— the festival programmers, the critics and
the producers — are starting to ignore the
cultivation of true visionaries by wholeheart-
edly drinking this niche transmedia Kool-
Aid. If gatekeepers start to agree that the
only way to make indie film relevant again is
through new forms of community outreach
then there is a chance that films that alien-
ate and aren’t crowd-sourced huggable will be
passed by. I fear that in the rush to embrace
new methods of promotion and distribution
that worthy yet seemingly unpromotable
films will be completely ignored. If festivals
get behind day-and-date VOD or free You-
Tube multiplatform releasing then isn’t there
a chance that these fests will pick films that
best lend themselves to these new screening
platforms? Films catering to easily distracted
Web surfers and not contemplative theater-
goers? Likewise, are there producers passing
on strong work because it can’t be broken into
Webisodes and streamed on YouTube?
Some films do not lend themselves to view-
ing on computers, phones or in loud crowded
rooms. The extreme margins is where the
true groundbreaking work is done; it’s always
been that way, and no amount of crafty virile
Twitter DIY distribution chatter is going to
change that fact. Films that make their mar-
keting campaigns their highest priorities are
audience-driven films and these are the films
that have historically alienated viewers hun-
gry for visionary work.
I am not into indie film because I like be-
ing part of an indie “community.” I don’t help
make bold, boundary-pushing work because
I want to connect to or be part of a group of
outsiders. Though this group can help spread
the word, it’s not the reason I work on these
films. I am into indie film because no other
medium can express my feelings about the
world. It’s because I don’t get what I need
from mass culture that I seek it in the mar-
gins. I don’t crave mass acceptance nor do
I dream of it. And I would hate to see the
young artists who would otherwise make the
boundary-pushing work of tomorrow not do
so because they haven’t impressed gatekeepers
with their viral marketing plans.
There is a problem with independent film
today, but it’s not that filmmakers don’t have
access to the marketing tools they need. If
PHOTO BY: RICHARD SYLVARNES
we create strong innovative work audiences
will come, and in turn, new forms of profit
will evolve. But if we start by encouraging
filmmakers to please as wide an audience as
possible then we will destroy what is alive
and essential about alternative cinema. New
see page 73
 TION
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 LINE ITEMS

SET UP
ALICIA VAN COUVERING HIGHLIGHTS THE IMPORTANT COLLABORATION BETWEEN A FILM’S PRODUCTION DESIGNER AND CINEMATOGRAPHER.

Without an environment to shoot, cinematographers have nothing; without directors of room, not red.” Because it was a location, not
photography to shoot their sets, production designers have no purpose. It takes a lot of people to a set, they were limited in their capacity to
build a world for the camera to film, and while the director may inspire and supervise its creation, destroy the room; everything had to be re-
it takes a production designer and a cinematographer to get it in front of the lens. The creative stored to its original condition afterward.
and practical collaboration between these two key crew members often gets personal. It is always This temporarily set back Weinberg’s plan to
co-dependent. We spoke to three such teams about their most recent projects together – Inbal paste a giant mural of a moon behind the bed,
Weinberg and Andrij Parekh of Blue Valentine; Andy Byers and Sam Levy of Isabella Rossellini’s until she found a solution: “We basically built
Green Porno and Seduce Me shorts; and Tom McCullagh and Sean Bobbitt from Steve McQueen’s a fake wall on top of the wall that was already
Hunger — about how they did their jobs on key sets and what made their relationships work. there, and then wallpapered this huge moon
mural to it.” In order to build inside the room
without harming it, they Velcroed and taped
BLUE VALENTINE sequences on digital, “we went for a much sheets of custom-cut Luan to the existing
Derek Cianfrance’s Blue Valentine was one of more monochromatic and emotionally cold walls, and then painted over them.
the most celebrated features at Sundance this feel. The RED helped create a sharper and To be faithful to the scripted elements in
year, lauded for intense lead performances by harsher environment.” the scene, the art department would also have
Michelle Williams and Ryan Gosling. The One of the most important sequences in Blue to add a dividing door to part of the room
script had been in development for years be- Valentine occurs about 20 minutes into the film. and a spinning bed. But the biggest challenge
fore Cianfrance got to make it, and when he Attempting to reconnect to the wife he fears he’s for everyone was the lighting. “Because Derek
finally did, he brought on cinematographer losing, Gosling spontaneously books a night in and I wanted to shoot 360 degrees at all times
Andrij Parekh (Half Nelson, Cold Souls) and a “romantic” themed motel a few hours from and run long master takes without turning
production designer Inbal Weinberg, who home. He picks “the Future Room.” When they around and relighting, we decided to design
had worked with Parekh on Half Nelson. walk into the silver-walled, midnight-blue hotel [the set] in a way where there was no chance
The film oscillates back and forth from the suite, replete with rotating bed and Day-Glo to stop and adjust lights,” says Parekh. “The
present and the past. As we watch a couple’s light fixtures, Gosling cries out, “this looks like location was incredibly small, maybe 15 feet
marriage reach its breaking point, we flash the inside of a robot’s vagina!” wide, 30 feet deep — like a big tunnel with 8-
back to long sequences of their meeting and “I was like, ‘Ryan, did you have to say that foot ceilings. You can’t hide lights anywhere.
falling in love. The seeds of their fundamental about my set?’” jokes production designer A d.p.’s nightmare, really.” And, remembers
problems are planted, scene by scene, in the Weinberg, who had spent the previous week Weinberg, “The room has no natural light,
story of their early relationship; simultaneously slaving away to get the space ready. To keep his no windows.” The only viable solution was to
we watch their love breaking apart, years later. actors’ reactions as genuine as possible, Cian- incorporate the lighting into the production
The filmmakers shot on two formats. The france had made sure that his actors would design. “Instead of hiding the lights, we built
RED camera was used for the present day and see the room for the first time on camera. His them right into the set.” Approximately 40
16mm for the romantic past. Says Parekh, shooting method also called for two cameras at Kino Flos were tucked behind opaque pan-
“The format choices were based on a shoot- all times, and, due to the nudity, a completely els in the walls. “I also asked Inbal to provide
ing style that would allow for extremely long closed set. He also wanted the ability to shoot some 25 to 40 watt globes that sat on the
takes — 45 minutes was our longest — and a in every direction for up to 40 minutes at a floor and contained low-wattage incandes-
theoretical approach to the past and the pres- time in order to give the actors the maximum cent bulbs. These three ‘lights’ were the only
ent.” Long lenses were used for the present amount of flexibility and space. lighting fixtures that were moved during the
and wide lenses were used for the past. “We “Production had initially intended to build entire week.” According to Weinberg, these
wanted to be ‘away’ from the actors in the the Future Room on a stage, but we couldn’t Ikea-bought fixtures “had a ‘spacey’ look that
present, physically, and just watch them from afford the build,” remembers Parekh. The blended seamlessly into the set.”
afar, whereas in the past the camera was al- producers found a theme motel with an ac- Parekh chose three theatrical gel colors to
ways close to them to give an immediacy and tual future-themed room, albeit several hours gel the lights: blue for the part of the room
presence to the camerawork.” away from where they had based the rest of where Gosling and Williams sit, drink and
“For the past sections,” says Weinberg, “our the shoot. The hotel’s version of the future mentally destroy one another; red for the bed,
color palette was slightly subdued but also room, says Weinberg, “was very crazy, pret- and purple along the shower wall, “where
rich, accommodating both pastels and darker ty far from what we were going for, which they have a brief, passing moment of inti-
earthy tones.” Weinberg felt that the 16mm was like a 1980s’ DIY version of sci-fi. The macy.” The effort was a joint one between the
helped to “romanticize” the interiors “almost original room had red Formica on the walls art and lighting departments; the leadman
like vintage photographs,” a contrast with the with giant triangle structures harshly lit by and the rigging gaffer working on the same
more realistic present. “Film also takes well two pending lighting fixtures. The walls re- fixtures at the same time. “All the lamps were
to patterns, which was great in the interiors ally bothered me. I didn’t know what to do fixed,” he continues, “so that we could only
where we used wallpaper.” For the present with them. I saw blue and white light for this shoot during the shoot and not tweak any

60 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010


lights, guaranteeing Derek only performance
time during our shooting days.”
The schedule allowed for a rigging gaffer
and art department to spend four days prep-
ping the space before the shooting crew ar-
rived. “Sometimes the crew is very divided
— you just dress the set and someone comes
to light it,” says Weinberg. “But this was a
real collaboration.” Every light had to be part
of the set, and everything was potentially
visible. “There was a lot of experimentation
while building, and a lot of figuring out how
to hide wires.” For instance, because most
of the technical crew (including the sound
recordist) had to operate from an adjoining
suite, cables had to somehow extend out of
the set. Explains Weinberg: “we couldn’t lay
them through the door, because it had to be
functional at all times. So we ended up drill-
ing a hole through the back of the closet, and
threading the cables into the adjacent room.”
The result of everyone’s hard work is an
insane and vivid blue and silver sex den, pho-
tographed in a way that is too strange and
constrained to be corny, accented by red lights
and mirrors that reflect the characters’ anxiet-
ies back at them. It feels airless; suction-sealed
from the outside world. Accessorized with
whiskey, cigarettes and a well of resentments
BLUE VALENTINE’S “FUTURE ROOM” SET; (INSERT) ROOM BEFORE DESIGN.
and frustration, it’s the perfect environment
to facilitate the rapid and violent breakdown
that the couple endures inside it.
Both Parekh and Weinberg are noticeably
proud of how far they went to get out of the
director’s way. It took a week of full-time
rigging by the lighting department and one
quarter of the art department’s entire budget
for the film. “It wasn’t just about making the
set, it was also about facilitating the special
nature of our shoot,” says Weinberg. Coun-
ters Parekh: “I realized early in my career that
nobody goes to a movie to see great lighting.
Once you understand that, that you need to
make space for the actors and the director to
work on the performances foremost, you ap-
proach things differently.”
What are the most important elements of a
d.p. / p.d. relationship? According to Parekh,
“flexibility and compromise. The thing with
any movie’s budget is, there’s one pie, and
everyone has to share that space and money.
The more you can help each other, the more
successful the movie can be. If you start get-
ting selfish and eat too much pie, someone
else’s department is going to suffer. For me,
the production design is as important, if not
more important, than the shooting format,
because 35mm makes no difference if you’re
stuck shooting on a set of four white walls. I’d
rather take the money for film processing and
put it into set dressing.”
For Weinberg, “the most important thing is
to have a clear line of communication, to be
communicating all the time, as much as pos-
sible. I love being around the camera, to look
into the eyepiece, to understand what the
framing is and what the shot is. I also try very
hard to go to the screening of the camera test
to see how the film stock is going to react to
different colors. The aspect ratio is also impor-
tant — that affects how I approach a set in a
major way. For Blue Valentine I knew they were
going to be doing a huge amount of very tight
coverage and close-ups, so I had to come to
terms with the fact that my sets wouldn’t be
seen very much. It was about the actors, not
my sets. A lot of what we did on that film was
so the actors would feel comfortable — or un-
comfortable, in the case of the Future Room.”
GREEN PORNO & SEDUCE ME
“When I first met Isabella, she said she
wanted [the sets] to feel pretty naïve, and I
said, ‘paper’s pretty naïve,’” states Andy Byers,
designer of the sets and costumes for Isabella
Rossellini’s Green Porno and Seduce Me series of
short films, available on the Sundance Channel.
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
61
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In the case of Green Porno, each vignette is the
story of one animal’s reproductive behavior.
Green Porno: Praying Mantis for instance,
begins with Rossellini’s elegant face, looking
quizzical. “If I were a firefly… I would light up
my ass at night. I would fly here, and there, and
there…” she intones. The camera zeroes in on
her regal rear end, lit with one bright bulb and
flitting from one side of the frame to another.
It cuts wide, to an ink blue-lit night scene, with
a carpet of tall grass and curling, silhouette
leaves in the foreground. It’s clear immediately
that the set is made of cut paper. The tone is
whimsical and deeply adorable, and it’s impos-
sible not to think of the exceptional skills it
took to craft it. Rossellini narrates the fireflies’
behavior as light bulbs of different colors begin
to appear on the set, moving and blinking. Her
face appears, lit up behind paper grass — “Dif-
ferent fireflies flash different lights… they are
imposters! Mimicking our species’ flashes!” she
cries, her face swathed in the dark blue unitard
of her firefly costume.
The pieces are only about a minute long
each, and all were shot on a soundstage, in
front of a colored backdrop. Virtually every-
thing — from the giant whale penises to the
translucent squid face to the shiny school of
three-foot anchovies — is made by Byers and
his team out of colored paper with the occa-
sional dash of fabric and bubble wrap thrown
in when necessary. “When we met, I showed
her a dragonfly made out of paper, and she
thought it was fantastic,” says Byers. “So first
it was like, ‘Okay, let’s just make everything
out of paper.’ And now it’s like, ‘Okay, we
have to make everything out of paper.’”
Rosselini begins with scripts and very
simple line drawings of the costumes and
62 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
SEDUCE ME SET.
sets, which she gives to Byers months be-
fore filming is set to start. D.P. Sam Levy,
whose feature credits include Wendy and Lucy
and the upcoming The Romantics, met Byers
when they were both hired for the first sea-
son. “Sam is the first d.p. I’ve ever worked
with who’s become my friend,” says Byers.
“It works when you see the same thing. The
most disappointing thing is when you read a
script and you’ve got something really specific
in your head — like, you’ve made the perfect
kitchen for the character you read — and
then the d.p. comes in, moves things around
and lights in a way that makes it clear that
you’re on completely different pages.”
One of the first things that the two agreed
upon was how to light Isabella. “Really early
on, we had this idea to do like 1970s porn-
star lighting: kind of glitzy, gold, glamorous,”
says Byers. “It makes me really happy when
Sam does that.” For the snail episode, in
which Rossellini, as a snail, defecates on her
own face, “there’s this soft focus glow, which
is actually super corny, but then she poops on
her face,” says Byers.
Levy has used a different camera for each
season. For Season One of Green Porno, work-
ing with a very small budget, he used a Sony
HRV-V1U: “Basically a mini-DV camera
that shoots 1080i. I wanted to use a primi-
tive camera that recorded to tapestock that I
could operate myself.” A black Pro-mist dif-
fusion has been used since Episode One to
soften the hard digital edges of HD. “Isabella
had mandated a very handmade, simple ap-
proach,” says Levy, which led him to the sim-
plest cameras he could find. “I always think
that if you’re good you can point any camera
at a subject and create a strong image, even if
you’re using a cell phone. The V1U very much
tested this theory.”
Originally designed only for small screens
— simple, graphic images employing just a
few colors each — the team got the chance to
watch the series projected on movie screens
when it became popular. After seeing them
big, Levy says, “I wanted to photograph Isa-
bella using 35mm depth of field.” For Season
Two, he used a Sony EX-3 card camera with
a Letus adapter and Zeiss 35mm superspeed
primes, employing the Pro-mist filters once
again. Before the first season of Seduce Me was
set to begin, Levy bought a Canon 5D Mark
II “like every other d.p. in the world,” know-
ing that the color space and shallow depth of
field would be great for the project. “I love
[the 5D] because it feels like a medium-for-
mat stills camera, which is the perfect way to
photograph Isabella Rossellini.”
Byers has a background in ceramics and
sculpture, not film. “Sam helps me with color
quite a bit because there’ll be certain ques-
tions like, ‘I think this looks right together
but what kind of colors are you thinking
about?’ He’ll also help me with scale: ‘that’s
not going to fit on camera’ or ‘that would look
better really big.’”
At first, Byers was building the pieces in his
apartment, a location that became untenable
for various reasons, notably his young daugh-
ter’s discovery of the joy of stomping on paper
animals. The operation was moved to Brook-
lyn, and then further out into Brooklyn as the
sets themselves got bigger. Byers uses mainly
Canson art paper, employing photo back-
ground “set paper” for the larger pieces. What
you might expect to go wrong with enormous
paper sets and costumes often does. “It’s gon-
na rip all the time,” admits Byers. “It’s gonna
mess up. Also I sometimes forget that Isabella
Rossellini is going to have to wear them and
move around in them.” One of the main dif-
ferences he has noticed between making art
for art and art for film is that the camera only
looks in one direction. “The back of these
things are covered in duct tape and wire and
glue; it took me a few film jobs to realize that
you don’t have to make something beautiful
all the way around.” The homemade touches
are part of the plan, though it’s often hard for
Byers to make things as homemade looking
as he could. “I keep trying to make things
look awful, like pieces of crazy garbage, but
then we make them like that and I’m like…
‘Guys, these should really look better.’” Nev-
ertheless, he loves the paper’s unslick, practi-

cal charm: “I hope people like looking at the
stupid gags we create, and seeing the stupid
tricks — I think it’s so much fun to see the
wire that makes the whale penis move, rather
than doing it with a computer — if we can’t
do it on camera, we don’t do it.”
For Levy, color is what he thinks about
most of all, beginning in preproduction
when he meets with Byers to see the sets and
animals in their early stages. “I look at what
Andy’s doing, and that really sets the palette,”
says Levy. Early plans were to paint the back-
drop for each piece; they decided quickly that
lighting the cyc with theatrical gels looked
much better. Levy meticulously tested hun-
dreds of colors of gels and built a reference
board with all of his favorites. “When we
shot the whale in Season 2, Andy had built
these beautiful blue whales, so I lit the back-
drop a muted blue — but then they had these
enormous pink penises, and Isabella thought
they were getting a little lost in all that blue.
So each penis had its own Leko pointed at
it, with a bit of pink gel, to make sure they
popped. No pun intended.”
“I think the best way to work is to first ask
the designer what their parameters are,” re-
flects Levy. “Especially on smaller budgets,
the art department usually only has so much
leeway with what they can do. These are the
colors, this is the mood, these are the spaces.
As a d.p., you just take those parameters and
run with them, start thinking about the color
temperature of the light, how it’s going to fit
into what the designer is doing, how it’s go-
ing to contrast and complement the environ-
ment. There’s really only so much you can do
with lighting and camera blocking to make
something look good.” One would think that
shooting two-dimensional sets out of flam-
mable materials might force a great deal of
photographic compromises, but Levy insists
the opposite. “Andy’s sets were really easy to
shoot. He used muted colors and matte paper,
which I loved.” Using powerful stage lights —
12k chimeras and nine Lite Maxi’s — helped
ensure that the paper was never close enough
to any units to catch fire.
“Things look the best when the director
can direct me and the designer to one goal,
but when they also give you room to work,”
continues Levy. He cites one specific exam-
ple from their recent Seduce Me shoot, about
duck mating. Byers had built a gorgeous pa-
per duck, essentially a giant hat that allowed
Isabella’s body to be under the paper “water
line.” Levy and Byers had agreed on an am-
ber-gold color for the sky, which Levy created
with light, and showed it to Isabella on set
(who happened to be trying on her bed bug
outfit at the time). Knowing that the next
part of the piece involved an immersive jour-
ney through a bright pink labyrinthine duck’s
vagina, Rossellini requested to change the ho-
rizon lighting to pink.
“Sometimes what’s best for one individual
ISABELLA ROSSELLINI AND PAPER DUCK.
image isn’t best for the transition, or the entire
project. Isabella was thinking about the viewer
in that case, and not just the one image, and we
all agreed that it was the best thing. At the end
of the day we’re all just trying to keep the view-
er engaged in what’s happening on the screen,
even if they don’t understand what’s happening
inside this huge pink duck vagina.”
HUNGER
Color was also on the minds of the creators of
visual artist Steve McQueen’s debut feature,
Hunger, a brutal and visceral film about one
of the most famous episodes of “the Troubles”
in Northern Ireland, a hunger strike endured
by Republican political prisoners in Belfast’s
HM Maze Prison that left Bobby Sands and
several other IRA fighters martyrs for their
cause. The film’s imagery is deeply beautiful
and equally unsettling: a snowflake melting
on the bloodied hand of a Protestant prison
guard, trying to collect himself after a beat-
ing; the slow steps of a man in a Hazmat suit
approaching a prison cell; the rings of con-
centric circles drawn in feces on the wall, fad-
ing as they’re sprayed off to reveal gleaming
white tile. We enter the prison at the height
of the “dirty protest,” when IRA captives,
denied the status of political prisoner they
felt they deserved, refused to wear clothes
or bathe. The death of Bobby Sands and the
plight of the hunger strikers attracted massive
international attention, drastically changing
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
63
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the nature of the conflict.
“When I met with Steve, I knew that his
take on the Troubles was going to be in a simi-
lar vein to the style of his own art,” says Mc-
Cullagh. “From the beginning it was to be all
about the reality of our environment, and the
detail within that reality.” McQueen’s art films,
several of which were shot by Hunger d.p. Sean
Bobbitt, could well be described as being pre-
occupied with the physicality of environment.
“When you’ve got nothing, the only thing
left you have [to protest with] is your body,”
says production designer Tom McCullagh, a
native of Northern Ireland who was a teen-
ager during the hunger strike and remembers
the riots that followed. He began his career
64 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
PRISON HALLWAY IN HUNGER.
working for the BBC in Belfast. McCullagh
was initially reluctant to take on the proj-
ect. “I wasn’t sure I wanted to do another
so-called ‘Troubles’ film,” he admits, though
McQueen’s approach as a visual artist and the
imagery of the script, combined with his goal
to make a film about the reality and detail of
this extraordinary environment, convinced
him that this project was going to be differ-
ent from the rest. McCullagh had done ex-
tensive research into the Maze Prison and
had been inside several times, a privilege that
was no longer granted by the time the Hun-
ger producers were ready to start. “It was all
budgeted based on shooting inside the actual
prison, which had been dormant since the
PRISON HALLWAY SET.
Good Friday agreement [in 1998]. When I
met the producers I told them that I didn’t
think there was a chance we could get in there
to shoot. It had become a very iconic building
for the Republicans. It was just too politically
sensitive.” McCullagh assured McQueen that
they could build it, on budget, and set about
recreating the prison exactly to spec. “I think
Steve felt nervous at the beginning about
what myself and the art department had to
achieve within a very limited budget,” admits
McCullagh. “If the prison set did not truly
represent the original, then the story and de-
tail that both Steve and I wanted to portray
would not ring true.”
The early stages of prep were devoted to
meetings between McQueen, his Heads of
Department [HOD’s, in the local parlance],
and a number of ex-prisoners and guards who
had lived and worked in the Maze prison. From
these meetings, says McCullagh, “we were able
to build up a microscopic picture of what it was
like to live and work there, from both sides.”
“Tom’s knowledge of the history, his knowl-
edge of H block specifically, was stunning,”
says cinematographer Bobbitt. “He created
the most amazingly accurate set, working
with almost nothing.” Explains McCullagh,
“The Maze was a purpose-built prison with
a very distinctive design, used specifically to
house paramilitary prisoners caught up in
that conflict.” The original prison was built in
an H formation, a cross bar lined with admin-
istration offices, with cells running up either
side. McCullagh built “a sort of L” inside a
huge abandoned warehouse.
The longest portion of this “L “ turned out
to be about 170 feet long and used up almost
all of the available floor space in the ware-
house. The surfaces of the actual prison are
concrete and block work with painted con-
crete floors, which McCullagh’s team tasked
themselves to copy. “The environment had to
be unforgiving. There was nothing that we
used as a finish which could give a comfort-
HUNGER PHOTO COURTESY OF IFC FILMS/PHOTOFEST
ing impression.” The surface of the walls was
rough plaster, painted over with a few coats
of paint. On top of that, inside the cells, was
layer upon layer of prop feces, created by “trial
and error,” says McCullagh. “I wanted it to
look like a surface that never really dried out
fully, therefore giving the impression of an
endless, living damp; an untouchable surface
— something hellish.”
McCullagh’s personal reckoning with the en-
vironment of the prisoners was also a reckoning
with his own country’s history. “A prison offi-
cer told a story about one of the guys who was
covering his walls in feces, but actually doing a
mural almost where he had outlined a fireplace
on one wall. On another wall he had done the
shape of curtains and flower pots and things like
that. I suppose if you’re going to live in that en-
vironment you might as well get some humor
out of it, though I can’t imagine it.”
McCullagh remembers the entire build
taking about six weeks to complete at a cost
of about £80,000. “When Steve first visited
the set during construction, I think he was
shocked by the scale of it,” says McCullagh.
“I think he was expecting a lot less for the
budget.” The metal bars used throughout
the set were real iron, and extremely heavy,
requiring four men to move each one into po-
sition. “I wanted to use actual metal for rea-
sons of movement and sound: the weight of
them when being opened and closed, and the
sound that heavy gates like that would make.”
They built the hospital set, which dominates
the last third of the film during the scenes of
Sands’s wrenching death by starvation, inside
an unused gymnasium.
Comments producer Laura Hastings-
Smith, “We had an eight-week lead-in for
Tom so that the H Block could be completed
— design, build, set, prop — for shooting.
Then, [the art department] continued to
build the hospital set while we were filming.
The H Block wing had to be lit from above
as well as from the floor to the side. Plus, the
corridors are very, very long — a perspective
painting that makes you believe the corridors
are twice as long as they are. It was crucial
that that was [done] right.”
For most d.p.’s and designers, sets offer
the obvious bonus of flexibility. Walls can
fly away, ceilings can rise up. But McQueen
wanted the cells built as accurately as possible.
“He wanted you to constantly feel surround-
ed,” says Bobbitt. “He didn’t want breakaway
walls. It was very important to Steve to strive
for reality, which we embraced.” For Bobbitt,
the cramped space “was the choice that in-
spired us to shoot in 2:35 aspect ratio, so that
you’d always feel the walls, so you could get
that feeling of confinement. There was dis-
cussion about making the cells larger to get
the camera in there but we all felt that the
reality should be the first priority.”
“A lot of films use the Troubles as a dra-
matic backdrop but this is a truly visual de-
piction of the story,” says McCullagh. “Steve
put a lot of trust in his HODs to create some-
thing that, while obviously visual, would have
a tactile essence to it. The audience had to
have a total physical experience while watch-
ing it. They had to be able to smell inside the
cells, they had to feel the cold and damp, they
had to flinch from the beatings — almost as
if when they left the cinema they would need
to go home and bathe in a warm bath. It was
about trying to stir up your other senses.”
With regards to color and texture, McCul-
lagh based his choices equally on what was
real, and what was emotionally true to the
story. “In 1981, when the film takes place,
was before anyone had done any research into
the emotional effect of colors in institutions,”
reminds McCullagh. “We were told that
the cell doors were red, the bars were black.
I don’t think Sean and I are too far off the
mark with the actual colors we used,” though
together they focused on cold hues of blue,
white and green.
Their dull, cold color palette “also lets the
red stand out,” continues McCullagh, “the
red of blood and of the visitors’ clothes. Red
can be warm, but in this story red is also asso-
ciated with pain. Red marks on their bodies,
red blood on the floor spilling off their face
after a beating.” In Bobby Sands’s hospital
room, one red chair sits, unoccupied. “There’s
nothing audible to know that [Sands] is suf-
fering; it’s almost all visual. That snippet of
red I think helps [that idea] along.”
“Their visual environment should reflect
the physical environment and what they’re
going through,” says McCullagh. “We based
our use of creams and neutral colors on the
fact that nothing was going to give [these
prisoners] comfort. If you look at a cream
wall, there’s nothing there to warm you or
inspire any memories. It’s a combination of
those kinds of thoughts — we stayed with
creams for the walls, gray for the walls, colors
that would reflect what the guys were suffer-
ing through. The hospital also is quite cold
and blue — blue is a standard hospital color,
but, for instance, we chose more warmed-up,
comforting blues for the guard office. The
hospital blues don’t give any comfort.”
The lighting, too, had to marry this extreme
realism and extreme emotionality as well.
“When we got into preproduction,” remembers
Bobbitt, “Steve gave me a book of Velázquez,
filled with his incredible chiaroscuro lighting.”
Characterized by intense contrast and strong,
often singular light sources — a candle, a win-
dow — the artist’s work became an important
visual reference. “We started out just wanting
to emulate Velázquez — in some shots espe-
cially we lit with just one light source, from a
window,” says Bobbitt. “Which was fine, be-
cause sometimes all we had was one window
or one skylight.” Indeed, light sources were few
and far between in 1980s jail cells: often there
was only one open window, one blaring televi-
sion, or one hallway skylight. But in the real
prison, says McCullagh, “any practical lighting
is from florescent tubes running the length of
the main corridor,” with a bit of sunlight com-
ing in from skylights or windows. Working
with Bobbitt, McCullagh worked precisely
these same lighting schemes into the set.
“Any job I take on I just feel like [my work]
is combined with the other departments, and
that’s what makes it so interesting,” says McCul-
lagh. “The final product should be a lot better as
a result of that awareness. When everybody’s
pulling their own weight, it can make you aware
of these other [elements] — the conditions of
light, the possibilities of sound.” Adds Bobbitt:
“You make a lot of films, and once in a while
you get one where everything works, when one
pure idea can actually become a reality. It’s a rare
joy to be part of that. The director has these
ideas, which you then try to puzzle out with the
designer and try, between the two of you, to turn
into a visual reality.”t
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 LINE ITEMS

DESIGNS FOR LIVING

JACK FISK LOOKS BACK ON HIS OVER 30 YEAR CAREER AS A PRODUCTION DESIGNER. AS TOLD TO ALICIA VAN COUVERING

From Days of Heaven to Mulholland Dr. to Badlands to The Thin Red Line to The Straight Story “What does an art director do?” but he had no
to Phantom of the Paradise to There Will Be Blood to several of your other favorite movies, Jack idea. I knew you had to get the sets ready, so I
Fisk has created the physical worlds for some of cinema’s most important films. He has tried knew how to start, but I didn’t know where the
directing (Raggedy Man, with Sissy Spacek, Eric Roberts and Sam Shepard), did well at it, but job ended. So I was doing props, and set dress-
decided that he liked designing better and went back to it when he heard that Terrence Malick ing, and costumes and graphics, just sort of do-
was returning to film after a 20-year break with The Thin Red Line. His touch is always simple ing everything I could think of to cover myself
and genuine, even when the look of the film is stylized or surreal; the product of a kid from the because I was so afraid that I wouldn’t be doing
South with the mind and training of an artist who likes most of all to hit nails into wood and what I was supposed to be doing. So I kind of
drive trucks around wheat fields. figured out in that film that I liked doing every-
Fisk’s work will next be seen onscreen in Terrence Malick’s The Tree of Life. Below, in his thing, as much as possible. You know, you kind
own words, Jack Fisk talks about how he likes to work, how he became a designer, and why it’s of fall into what you’re doing and then you real-
important to take care of sets. ize that everything in your life up to that point
has really helped you. I learned so much in art
school about color, composition and about get-
I was studying fine arts in Pennsylvania department on an AFI picture called In Pur- ting the courage to start something.
with a good friend of mine — actually my suit of Treasure, and he wanted to get off of it, I grew up outside the union, and really out-
best friend, David Lynch. They asked him to so I got on it. My hotel room was the editing side the industry, so I was continually reinventing
come out to go to the very first year of the room, and I spent my day casting gold bricks the wheel, trying to figure out new ways to do
American Film Institute in Beverly Hills. We out of plaster. Then I came back and I got a job it without any instruction. I remember my first
rented a U-Haul with his brother John and working on a film that Jonathan Demme was union picture was a film called Movie Movie. I
put all his stuff in it and headed west. producing at Roger Corman’s company; it was was on the lot, and the union kept filing griev-
When I got out here I had no idea what I called Vigilante, I believe. I was hired as the art ances against me because I was painting and
was gonna do. David was working in the art director. I called one of my friends up and said, hammering things — it was because I was used

PHOTO COURTESY OF THE CRITERION COLLECTION

DAYS OF HEAVEN.

66 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

 to doing it that way. To me the sets were just like
big sculptures. I just wanted to be involved with
them and I liked climbing around on them. De-
signing was the easy part and you were sitting
down; I like being more physical. I got a repu-
tation as being more of a hands-on production
designer. Even on There Will Be Blood, at the end
of the film Bill Holmquist, the construction co-
ordinator, gave me a hammer as a going-away
present. They found out that I was always happi-
est if they gave me something to build.
When I was starting out there was a produc-
tion designer named Leon Erickson, who did
McCabe & Mrs. Miller, and I heard that all the
carpenters were living on the McCabe sets. They
were building the houses and then living in
them and building more houses, and they built
that whole town, which was just magnificent.
To me, that was like the perfect way to build
a set. He used a lot of real props and real con-
struction waste instead of trying to create ev-
erything. It not only saved money but it looked
great. I didn’t know him personally but he had
a big effect on my life. The other art director I
loved was John Box — when I saw Lawrence of
Arabia, that’s when I seriously started thinking
about becoming an art director.
In 1972 I heard that Terry Malick, who
was at AFI, was going to make a film and
that it was a period film that took place in
the ’50s; it was about Charlie Starkweather.
I got so excited about doing a period film
that I started researching his project. He
heard from mutual friends that there was
this art director in town that was research-
ing his project on his own. [laughs] We met
and got along and a few months later I got
in a paneled truck with a bunch of tools and
headed out to Colorado. They showed up six
weeks later and we started making Badlands.
So I’ve been working with him ever since;
Terry’s become like my brother.
I met Sissy working on Badlands, and
it was like I was building the sets for her. I
got so carried away in the details — I would
be filling the drawers with stuff I wanted to
share with her about the story. I’ve tried to
continue that practice with all actors. I find
that actors are a great resource for finding out
about the characters because they spend so
much time thinking about them. The more
you learn about characters the more you can
PHOTO BY: BILL CAMPBELL
know about the environment they’re living in;
when stuff ’s in sync like that it makes for a
stronger presentation and story.
Terry and I have developed a relationship
where we just go and look at locations together,
for weeks, and that way we kind of get in sync on a
JACK FISK.
picture. And then he says, “Whatever you do will
be fine.” He’s so trusting, but I’ve worked so hard
to fall in line with what he’s after. I think also over
the years we’ve kind of developed similar tastes.
Some of it came about because we never had any
money, so we always had minimal set dressing
and props, and we found out that we really like
the way that looked. Even today, I spend most
of my time taking stuff away rather than putting
stuff onto a set. Just try to keep it simple, because
if people aren’t confused by the background, they
pay attention to what’s happening with the char-
acters, I think. I try to create backgrounds that are
easy to understand so they tell you in shorthand
what you need to know about the place or the
character and don’t distract you by giving you too
much to look at. [The balance between simplicity
and authenticity] is a hard one.
I’ve developed a real love of Edward Hop-
per. His paintings have a simplicity and an es-
sence of location, so he’s probably who I ref-
erence the most — I think of him almost like
an art director. You really feel the humans in
those environments because there’s not a lot
of distraction; he paints just what you need.
The other artist I like is completely different
and that’s Francis Bacon. The thing I really
like about Francis Bacon is his passion. I look
at his paintings and they’re like falling apart.
He’ll put water-base paint on oils — whatever
he does, he doesn’t worry about preserving it,
but he worries about the moment. If he needs
a dash of purple up there, he’ll put whatever
purple he has. I appreciate that passion.
[Twenty years after Days of Heaven], this
film critic came up to me and said, “Oh I heard
Terry’s making a new film.” And I thought,
“Oh my god he’s making a film? I don’t want
him to do it without me.” So I sent him a fax
saying, “I just recovered from Days of Heaven,
and I’d love to work with you again.”
Days of Heaven was, I guess, 1976, and when
Terry started telling me about the picture his idea
originally was to build a house that we could pack
up, put in the truck, and drive from wheat field
to wheat field and shoot. But we had no money.
The story took place in Texas, but Texans had
already harvested all their wheat. So we started
moving north because of the later harvests. By
the time the picture got its cash flow, we were up
scouting in Canada. They were going to harvest
the wheat in six weeks, which meant we had four
weeks to build everything if we wanted some
time to shoot. Now this was a nonunion film at
a time when Canada didn’t have much of a film
industry like they do now. So it was hard to find
set dressing, hard to find construction people. We
found these great old steam tractors, did the bar-
racks around the house, built the house, the barn,
all in four weeks. So now when everybody says,
“We only have four weeks of prep!” I say, “Oh
that’s plenty of time.” We broke so many rules to
get that done.
When I started directing, I probably thought
of Terry most of all. But you know, I think I’m
a better designer than director. I think I enjoy
it more. The thing I don’t like about directing
is dealing with studios and raising money. And
the thing I like about art direction is they call
you up when they usually have all the money
already. And when it starts, you know that in
six or nine months, you’ll be free again. I like
things that end. With directing, it never ends.
You could work on prepping something for
two or three years, and it could never get made.
So I’d rather work on my own projects on the
farm, be with my family and then go and do a
film and work really hard for a while.
Once you realize that you’re not only de-
signing a film but you’re designing the way it
can be shot, the collaboration with the cine-
matographer becomes more important. If you
give them something they can’t shoot, it’s like
you’re cutting off your own foot. On Terry’s
films, working with Chivo [Emmanuel Lu-
bezki] — that’s really fun — because we’re
trying to do it without lights. A lot of times
I’ll be cutting extra holes in buildings to cre-
ate more windows: holes in the ceiling and
stuff like that, so he can shoot.
I never wanted to plan the sets in the office
and accept whatever we got. I keep working
on a set until the crew leaves, until it’s shot. I
keep working until the actor pushes me out
off the set. Because it’s permanent. It’s alive.
Sets are alive. You have to take care of them
and love them and not ignore them — be
there every minute while they’re being built
and shot. Because that’s their whole life.t
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
67
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WITH THESE HANDS

FILMMAKER BRENT GREEN RECOUNTS THE MAD ACT OF SET BUILDING BEHIND HIS GRAVITY WAS EVERYWHERE BACK THEN.

Brent Green is a self-taught filmmaker and artist who lives and works in the Appalachian abandoned farmhouse I live next to. (It’s the
hills of Pennsylvania. His unique hand-drawn and stop-motion short films have played venues house where I grew up, but it’s empty now,
including the Sundance Film Festival, the L.A. Film Festival and the International Film Festival with a huge hole in the side I haven’t been
Rotterdam. He was also one of Filmmaker’s 25 New Faces in 2005. Recently he wrapped up film- able to fix, yet. This year… the film has to
ing his first feature-length film, Gravity Was Everywhere Back Then. Shot entirely in stop-motion do well, but this year….) So, most of the
using human beings, the film tells the true story of Leonard and Mary Wood, two people joyously film’s building supplies came from abandoned
brought together but separated through forces far beyond their control — a schism that results in farmhouses and barns in the area and Dewald
creation of something wonderful. The making of Green’s new film has been a process unlike any & Lengle, my local hardware store.
other. He crafted it by hand with little more than the help of his friends and his own ingenious Building the set outdoors had its upsides and
creativity. Here he talks of the daunting, obsessive production of his new film. downsides. The biggest upside was in making
Gravity Was Everywhere Back Then premieres at the IFC center in New York City May 7. the house look old and lived in. We built the
floors and interior and exterior walls first, no
roof, and finished the rooms beautifully. Some
Leonard Wood lived outside of Louisville, When I decided to rebuild Leonard’s of the rooms have old cloth wallpaper, others
Ky. He built his house into a kind of healing house — which I first saw when working on are painted, and we made really nice-looking
machine to try to save his wife’s life when she Christoph Green and Brendan Canty’s Burn hardwood floors out of planed-down two-by-
was diagnosed with cancer. Rural Pennsylva- To Shine series in Louisville — I started by fours. We built the floors, put up and decorated
nia, where I live, looks a lot like the area around making a small-scale model so I could decide the walls, and then waited. The rain and wind
Louisville. I have six acres of land and very little where to place the trusses, how much wood did amazing things to them. The house began
money, so the only way for me to tell Leonard’s building the whole thing would actually en- to look incredibly worn and lived in. The floors
story was to make it on my own property. I had tail, and how I would make it with what I had warped. Mice moved in. It had to look old. It
to reconstruct the house. I couldn’t make the or could access. Luckily, two of the things did. It was gorgeous.
film a hand-drawn animation or shoot it on I had were falling-down barns. I knocked To further control the lighting and try to
miniature sets because Leonard’s act of build- them flat, stripped the wood and the giant increase the amount of time we could shoot
ing the house wouldn’t seem so Herculean. old beams and got to work. I spent my ver- in a day, Donna K., who plays the character of
He built this thing himself, by hand, with no sion of a fortune at my local hardware store Mary Wood in the film, sewed 34’ tall black
money over the course of 20 years. I knew my on screws, L-brackets and electrical wire (the cloth curtains that we could use to cover the
movie about his life had to embrace a similar whole set was wired up proper — it’s a re- walls around the set. As the film goes on, the
kind of crazy ambition. ally pretty thing). I pulled the toilet out of the curtains are pulled back and you see more and

GRAVITY WAS EVERYWHERE BACK THEN.

68 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

more of the walls.
Everything I built for the film was built en-
tirely with my filming needs in mind. I wanted
to be able to circle a room at any point and
see entirely new and interesting details in ev-
erything from the furniture to the wall to the
set as a whole. Outside of the house we built
three 64’ long by 32’ tall walls — an open-
ended square. We strung wire across the top
of the walls with pulleys so we could hoist our
wooden stars up and down to accommodate
any kind of shot. Every light in the film is on a
dimmer, too, so we could use them in all kinds
of situations. All stars are on dimmers and the
moon too, which is 16’ tall, and made out of
wood that I routed paper-thin so all the light-
bulbs inside it would glow through it beauti-
fully. The front of the moon was faced in cloth
to disperse the light around each bulb and then
covered in strips of thin balsa wood, like the
kind hobbyists use for model airplanes. All of
the electricity for my little solar system above
the set ran into one of Leonard’s neighbor’s
houses (which we also built). I could stand in
the first floor of the house and twist dimmer
switches, watching the stars through their win-
dow, until I had the shot I wanted.
Building the set in my backyard in Penn-
sylvania rather than on a soundstage some-
where, in itself, I think, made the whole film
a lot more honest. I had to do the vast ma-
jority of the work myself. (I have an amazing
girlfriend and some awesome neighbors who
all helped a ton.) It felt like I was Leonard,
LEONARD WOOD’S HOUSE.
RECREATION OF WOOD’S HOUSE.
driven by an obsession to save something (his
story) by building something wonderful (this
movie), which seemed completely impossible
when I started out a couple years ago. And
the best part of making a film like this with
no budget is the fun! There were all kinds of
problem solving at every stage of the game.
How could I make Mary Wood 25 feet tall
without hurting anyone? Giant wooden legs!
With concrete shoes! When we had to crash
cars, we crashed our own cars. Donna made
her own dresses for a bunch of the scenes.
Everything in the film is either stuff we made
or found around the property, which led to
the film having a strange now quality, rather
than looking like any kind of particular pe-
riod. There was no extra money for any-
MARY WOOD 25 FEET TALL.
thing, which I really think helped in telling
Leonard’s story — the truth is a lot easier to
discern when everything in front of you is
stripped bare.
Even though there is a lot of starkness in
the film I built a lot of beautiful details around
the house. There are really pretty hand-carved
wooden lightbulbs in the door-frame corners. I
made a working piano where the sound comes
out of two phonograph horns on the top. The
keys are weighted with old fishing weights,
and all the hammers in the back of the piano
are oak — but they grow out of the keys in
a complicated tangled mess, like weird plants
at the bottom of a pond. There are all kinds
of beautiful little details like that throughout
the film, but I try hard never to call attention
to them. When you’re obsessed with some-
thing, or when I’m obsessed with something,
anyway, I’m not able to see the big picture. I
can only see the little details and imperfections
right in front of me and can only think about
how to change those little details. I tried to do
that with the whole film: a straight narrative
love story told relatively normally, but sort of
patched out of glimpses and occasional clarity.
Even the special effects in the film are in
camera and, I hope, truthful. We shot the
whole film frame by frame with a mix of
wooden characters, moving wooden set pieces
and real people. In order to make the spectac-
ularly strange special effects sequences flow
with the more standard scenes, the straight
see page 74
THE MOON.
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
69
 LINE ITEMS
PAY TO PLAY
YOUTUBE’S SARA POLLACK DISCUSSES THE SITE’S REVENUE-GENERATING NEW DISTRIBUTION MODEL. BY ALICIA VAN COUVERING
One of the most visible signs of change in
the distribution landscape at Sundance this
year were the YouTube movies: the three
2010 films that premiered on the site dur-
ing and after the fest, along with three films
from Sundance 2009. Did the experiment
work? Was Bass Ackwards’s number of views
on the first day good or bad? Did Children of
Invention’s availability there generate overall
buzz in the marketplace? Was it the pioneer-
ing shift in distribution strategy that some
claimed or, as others argued, a failure given
the low number of rentals (hundreds, not
thousands) most of the titles garnered?
These are the questions we posed to Sara
Pollack, the entertainment marketing manag-
er at YouTube, both during and three months
after the festival. Approaching her three-year
anniversary at YouTube (her “Google birth-
day,” as they call it internally), she began her
career at the production company Green-
Street. From there she moved to Miramax to
work for production head Meryl Poster, then
moved over to Big Beach where she became
a production exec overseeing Little Miss Sun-
shine and Everything Is Illuminated, and was
about to start on Sunshine Cleaning when she
was snatched up by Google to figure out how
to empower filmmakers on the Web.
“Sundance was an experiment,” she says
gamely. “There’s no question in my mind that
the initiative helped these films increase their
audiences, and that was the goal.”
“The idea that YouTube was ‘a place for
film’ has been in existence for some time,” she
70 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
PRINCESS OF NEBRASKA.
continues. Aaron Crumley and Susan Buice’s
film Four Eyed Monsters, one of the first fea-
tures to air on the site in 2007, was “the perfect
film to start testing the waters.” The Four Eyed
team had already built an enormous social net-
work, been playing clips about the making of
their film on YouTube, and were employing
a multiformat interactive Web-based way of
making and marketing their movie that had
deep appeal to a young, wired audience.
Since then, a lot of very different films have
begun to play in their entirety on the site, and
a number of different methods of monetiza-
tion have been set up by the company.
Says Pollack, “Luc Besson put his film Home
on site last June, Wayne Wang premiered The
Princess of Nebraska here on the YouTube
Screening Room with about 200,000 hits the
first weekend, which was equivalent to a very
high box-office ranking.” Several films have
chosen to go online for free, “usually docu-
mentaries dealing with political or activist is-
sues,” notes Pollack, such as the Oscar-nomi-
nated documentary No End in Sight.
Pollack says that her real goal is to empow-
er filmmakers by offering as many choices
BASS ACKWARDS.
and as much freedom as possible. “The ad-
supported model doesn’t work for everyone,”
she points out. (That model occurs when
Google decides that you have enough of the
right kind of content to partner with you, in
which case you are deemed “monetizable,”
and YouTube can begin selling ads to appear
in and around your videos.)
The Sundance films this year were oper-
ating on a rental model, but what’s different
about it for Pollack is that filmmakers “choose
the price that they want to set for their films.
You know your film best, you know your au-
dience best, you know how to reach them and
know what they think they should or want
to pay, so you make the decision about how
much you want to charge them.” The ma-
jority of the revenue goes to the filmmaker,
and the filmmaker can decide the term of the
rental as well — maybe $1.99 buys someone
three hours of your movie, maybe $10.99 buys
them 90 days. The agreement is non-exclu-
sive, and the revenues — as indicated by the
number of views — are transparent.
“It’s really about giving filmmakers and con-
tent creators choices as to how they want to
reach their audiences because we’re just trying
to get as much content on the site as possible
for our community,” she says. “The best way to
do that is by giving partners more choice about
how they monetize and distribute their work.”
What makes YouTube different from other
online viewing sites? Pollack thinks it’s the
viewers, not the platform: “[YouTube users]
not only watch content, they rate it, they share
it, they comment about it; it’s really about
creating a conversation around videos. These
films inspire a lot of debate over characters,
over storylines, over distribution models. The
site built around this diversity of content that’s
about what’s happening right now — whether
it’s censored video of protests in Iran that gets
spread around the world or the latest sports
thing that everyone is talking about — I think
that really carries over to movies. What’s new,
PRINCESS PHOTO BY: RICHARD WONG
what’s relevant, what’s fresh?”
Still, for all the excited press the YouTube
Sundance partnership generated, there were
many who dubbed it a failure. Indeed, on the
festival’s close the numbers were poor, with
The Cove, which went on to win the Best Doc-
umentary Academy Award, scoring the most
see page 74
SOMETHING VENTURED
from page 10
everyone watches all the funded work,
which means that all of us film folk have our
consciousnesses raised by seeing what’s
happening in all the other fields. (Full dis-
closure: I’ve been a panelist for Creative
Capital’s Film and Video program twice and
have attended the retreat several times.)
The final phase consists of Creative Capital
supporting the publicity and distribution of
a work when it is completed.
What type of artist is a good relation-
ship match for Creative Capital? Says Le-
rner, “They have to be willing to engage,
they have to be at a kind of self-defined
point of change in some way. This can be
a young artist, somebody mid-career, or
somebody who’s been at it for a long time
who believes that they need to make a
shift in their work, or who is thinking things
in a new way. I remember the year that we
funded [experimental composer] Mary Lu-
cier. She is obviously an icon in her field.
In her application she wrote, ‘People think
when you get to this point in your career
that you have everything figured out, but
you haven’t.’ And that was really appeal-
ing to the panel, somebody saying, ‘Yes,
I’m a mature artist, yes I’ve had a lot of
success, but, that doesn’t mean I have all
the pieces put together.’”
And for all the talk about business mod-
els and checkbook balancing, when you
dig deeper Creative Capital is hardly the
straitlaced taskmaster it might first ap-
pear. There’s a strong dose of compassion
alongside the interventionism and venture
capitalism. While Creative Capital encour-
ages artists to articulate a long-term view
of their practice — not one simply fenced
in by the project’s due date — that long-
term view can take many forms. Says Le-
rner, “Over the last few years we’ve been
trying to get artists to define what it is they
want to get out of the project so that we’re
working with them to assess whether the
project was successful using their metrics,
not external ones, like ‘This ended up at
the Sundance Film Festival, or this ended
up on Broadway.’ If those are somebody’s
metric for success, then, yes, we’re going
to measure the success by that. But we’ve
also had people whose metric is, ‘I want to
get pregnant, have a baby, and get tenure
in my job.’ And, you know, okay!”
In the last decade Creative Capital has
supported more than 80 film projects, in-
72 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
cluding feature-length work, short anima-
tion and experimental film. Often these
projects cross categories. Lerner remem-
bers Bill Morrison’s feature-length found-
footage symphony Decasia: “It started as
a commission from the Basel Sinfonietta
[as a collaboration with composer] Michael
Gordon from Bang on a Can, and then it
had this amazing life in the film world and
on television. And then Bill wasn’t satis-
fied with that; he really wanted it to be
seen as a live performance piece in this
country; it opened the 25th anniversary
season at St. Ann’s. And then he ended
up showing stills from the film in a gallery
in Chelsea. These trajectories are just not
predictable;, they unfold over time.”
As we finish our lunch, Lerner and I re-
flect on the irony of Creative Capital’s 10-
year anniversary happening at a moment
in which artists everywhere are suddenly
concerned with the issue of sustainability
that was at the center of the organiza-
tion’s creation. “You know, 11 years ago,
I could argue that it was a little bit ahead
of its time, but in the same moment I can
argue that it helped make the time right
for these ideas,” Lerner says.
For the next 10 years, Lerner lists a
few developments that need to happen
for the arts community to replenish it-
self. “We have to look for a process to
breed a new generation of producers with
a background in not just the media but
the visual arts,” she says. “And I think
more funders really need to open up.” Cit-
ing some of the now-deceased major arts
philanthropists, Lerner says, “If they were
alive today they’d be funding Internet art.
Or bio-art. What would Andy Warhol be do-
ing right now? He’d be on the front lines
of everything. So, with all the walls that
are cracking open, the question we are
asking ourselves is: Do we need to modify
the system of support we have built? And
how to we become an advocate in the
field for those other resources, like strong
producers, that need to develop?”
A project for the next 10 years. For now,
though, lovers of innovative film and video
practice can attend the MoMA retrospective
from April 30 – June 6. Organized by the
Department of Film’s Joshua Siegel and Ra-
jendra Roy, the series includes a number of
“the most original, impassioned, and rebel-
lious films and videos” supported by the or-
ganization. Appropriately, the forward-think-
ing nature of Creative Capital is echoed in
the curation; the series opens and closes
with new work in their premiere screenings.
On April 30 is Here [The Story Sleeps], “a
deconstruction of [Braden] King’s forthcom-
ing feature film Here, a landscape-obsessed
road movie romance starring Ben Foster
and Lubna Azabal” that will be presented in
a live-performance with composer Michael
Krassner and the Boxhead Ensemble. Clos-
ing on June 6 will be Eve Sussman’s whiteo-
nwhite:randomthriller, which is provoca-
tively described in MoMA’s press release
as “a film of indeterminate length whose
continuously evolving narrative is generated
by computer code.” Also in the series are
films by Ela Troyana (La Lupe: Queen of
Latin Soul), Kalup Linzy (Keys to Our Heart),
Caveh Zahedi (I Am a Sex Addict), Glenda
Wharton (The Zo), Christopher Munch (The
Sleepy Time Gal), and Sam Green (The
Weather Underground). (I was on the panel
awarding a grant to Wharton, whose beau-
tiful and disturbing hand-drawn animation
dealing with themes of abuse is under-rec-
ognized and highly recommended.) There’s
also essential work by two artists you can
read about in this issue: Laura Poitras (The
Oath) and Brent Green (Paulina Hollers).
THE HINDI NEW WAVE
from page 12
campy Bollywood remake, falls in love with
his lead actress, and finds his life in dan-
ger when they elope in the real world. The
second, shot entirely in a pharmacy from
the POV of security cameras, follows the
store supervisor as he manipulates his
female co-worker into unknowingly starring
with him in a sex tape to pay off his debts.
Peeking out from hidden cameras, the third
film follows a reality-show reporter collabo-
rating with an ex-model to catch a leading
pop star in a video sting operation. The ge-
nius of the film unfolds in how the stories
are woven together, the final disturbing pic-
ture becoming clearer at every step. It’s a
brilliant cinematic experience, a film whose
psychology is as rich as the best of today’s
international cinema.
The beauty of the New Wave filmmakers
is that though they are provocative in their
content, their sensibility is distinctly Indian.
There is song and dance in Dev. D; it is just
under a black light with pop-and-lockers
from London. There is romance in LSD, but
it is manipulative, desperate and complex.
And Abhay’s heroes are disillusioned and
angry. India is a young country, with nearly
70 percent of the population under 30. And
they are coming out in droves to support
the new cinema that reflects a reality closer
to their own.
“Slumdog kicked open the doors for In-
dian-themed stories around the world, but
it was still a British and American produc-
tion,” admits Kashyap. Deol adds, “The
true change will have to come within.”
Like Coppola, Scorsese and Spielberg of
the American ’70s, Kashyap, Banerjee,
and Deol boldly tackle contemporary is-
sues that resonate with their country’s
restless youth. And like the Easy Riders
and Raging Bulls that came before them,
theirs are not arthouse films. This is the
new mainstream cinema in India. While
Bollywood’s shimmering glitz fades across
the world, the Hindi New Wave is poised
to explode onto the global cinema stage.
If people around the world think Slumdog
Millionaire is the real India, they have no
idea what’s about to hit them.t
CULTURE HACKER
from page 16
circle, users can capture any space and place it
within the game world. In a sense the Pandemic
app creates a crowdsourced type MMO (mas-
sive multiplayer online game) that enables play-
ers to virtualize the real world around them.
Prior to attending the Sundance Screen-
writers Lab with HiM we released the “pan-
oramic feature” of Pandemic as a standalone
Android app. Without any promotion more
than 20,000 people have downloaded it. In the
process of downloading users are prompted to
“opt in” at which point they can decide whether
they wish to provide us with GPS coordinates,
e-mail addresses, phone numbers and the op-
erating system and model of their handset.
The collected data enables us to build a better
storytelling experience that can be designed
and targeted more specifically to individual us-
ers while at the same time giving us a sense of
the global activity within the game world.
Working within the mobile app space has
given me a new creative outlet that enables
the stories I tell to reach audiences directly
in an efficient and targeted way. I am finding
more effective methods to drive audiences to
theatrical, DVD and VOD releases. The pro-
cess of building audiences has shifted into a
realm that is a natural extension of the cre-
ative process, something that is developed as
a storytelling opportunity as opposed to just
marketing and promotion afterthought.t
INDUSTRY BEAT
from page 18
after visiting around 30 college towns.
Interestingly, Sklar says it’s also strategic to un-
dersell the movies “so audiences will go into them
with lower expectations, and then it’s part of that
discovery process tied to independent film.”
Like Sklar, Scott Beiben, of the Evil Twin
Booking Agency, also touts the efficacy of
the on-the-road model. “Filmmakers need to
start touring like bands,” says Beiber, who is
currently promoting a multimedia event called
Scientists Are the New Rockstars. “Then, they’re
going to hang out with the people who are
watching their films, go out to dinner with
them, and hop fences and swim in pools with
them. The only way to penetrate that culture is
to be a part of it,” he adds. “You can’t just make
a product and expect it to sell anymore.” doesn’t want to profit in any way from them.
All this may sound old hat to readers of
Filmmaker, Scott Kirsner’s Fans, Friends & Fol-
lowers and the writings of Lance Weiler. But to
reach younger audiences — who are plugged
into local groups via the Web more than any
other demographic — the most obvious strat-
egy is cultivating community and dialogue.
Daryl Wein, the 26-year-old director of
Breaking Upwards, a low-budget romantic
comedy that premiered at South by Southwest
in 2009, also believes Generation Next is best
seduced by Internet-based viral marketing. On
the eve of his film’s DIY release, he points to a
comic music video his team put on FunnyorDie.
com, featuring the film’s recognizable co-star
Olivia Thirlby (Juno), which has been viewed
more than 13,000 times. “The under-30 crowd
has a shorter attention span than older audi-
ences, so you have to find ways to excite them in
a short amount of time,” says Wein.
It’s also widely accepted that young audiences
base their movie-going decisions less on reviews
and more on two-minute video chunks. Sklar
says newspaper blurbs, pull quotes and festi-
val pedigree means little to younger audiences.
“They don’t care if it played at Sundance,” he
says. “They just want to know if they can watch
the trailer and do they like it?” consumer-entertainment machine. What was
Should Andrew Bujalski, then, have made
a short music video to promote his next film?
And what would the viral comedy clip for
Bradley Rust Gray’s The Exploding Girl look
like? These are questions the next generation
of art filmmakers might need to consider.
Or not. Magnolia’s Eamonn Bowles says
he’s never relied on young audiences. “Inde-
pendent films are more complex, more intel-
lectual, so it’s really always been the domain
of people that are older,” he says. “I can’t
speak for the ’60s when Antonioni was blow-
ing people’s minds, but since I’ve been doing
it, the younger audience has always been the
most overrated.”
Perhaps, then, no matter how much mil-
lennials are occupied with interactive, short-
attention-span experiences like videogames
and the Internet, all that will change when
they enter their 30s and even they will seek
more complicated and contemplative enter-
tainments. Will those entertainments be in-
dependent films? Stay tuned….t
GAME ENGINE
from page 22
the coding process would remove the infinite
possibilities of choice that exist now, which is
essential to the gaming experience. And she
But all of this is okay for Brathwaite. The
games are part of her own healing process.
She was violently attacked in 2006 and real-
ized when she started the series that it was
her way of working through her own unre-
solved pain. Why do people do such horrible
things to other people? What is the system of
tragedy? Of human suffering?
“I’ve been making games since I was a kid
and professionally since I was 15,” Brathwaite
says. “I didn’t know any other way to work
through my thoughts and feelings. It’s me
trying to understand all this stuff.”
So for now, just making the games is
enough.t
STRAIGHT TALK
from page 58
distribution strategies are inevitable, but we
should not allow our search for new platforms
to dilute the content or crush the dreams of
our next generation of auteurs.
There are some brilliant films out there
today that are having a hard time finding
an audience. This isn’t the filmmakers’ fault.
It’s the fault of the youth audience whose
minds have been melded by the corporate
potentially indie film’s next greatest audience
didn’t materialize because it never learned
about true rebellion, what counter culture
means and where it is often found. It’s often
conjured up and cultivated under smelly over-
passes by angry outsiders, not in corporate-
sponsored high-tech think tanks by salaried
media trend experts. Films like Happiness,
American Splendor, Safe, Gummo and, recently,
Ballast are films that were not made to imi-
tate a preexisting popular Hollywood model.
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
73
These are films that were made because they
resembled no other prior films. It used to be
that bold unconventional visions like those
were the raison d’etre of indie film culture. It
was those visions that made indie cinema es-
sential viewing for any self-respecting young
anti-establishment non-conformist free
thinker. Today those films would be consid-
ered “undistributable.”
Perhaps it’s not the youth audience’s fault,
though. Even if they are looking for it, young
people today actually aren’t able to associate
outsider perspectives with most current inde-
pendent cinema. Market forces are so shaping
independent content that we have castrated the
whole reason indie got started in the first place.
“Independent” alt culture helped kill itself by
distracting its audience with the petty bourgeois
aesthetics emboldened by a decade-long on-
slaught of overpriced Sundance-launched quirk.
We need to get back to the heart and soul of
what it means to be independent and stop chas-
ing the mainstream dragon; it was a pipe dream
to begin with. We need less sweating over what
we think the audience wants and to focus more
on the people who could care less and are busy
right now marching to their own fucked-up,
out-of-time drummers. The indie film industry
as it has been defined since sex, lies, and videotape
is dead. Hallelujah. Let the inmates run free.
By my definition, “indie” means not being
afraid of rejection. If you are a filmmaker who
has no idea who in the world would ever want
to see your movie then there is a pretty good
chance that you are on the right road to creat-
ing something truly groundbreaking. You are
our true future.t
WITH THESE HANDS
from page 69
dialogue scenes and the portraiture, the whole
film had to be shot stop-motion. So, for in-
stance, the dialogue was all prerecorded. After
I recorded it, I’d go into the audio file and
map out the syllables everyone was speaking
frame by thousands of frames. It was obses-
sive, but I didn’t want the wonderful scenes,
like someone flying through two windshields
in a car crash, to stand out. I didn’t want the
film to be going along and have a notice-
able shift to, “Okay, here comes something
strange.” I wanted the viewer’s eye to adjust
to the stop-motion so even the impossible
things seemed like normal life.
The film was shot entirely on a digital still
camera (a Nikon D70, until it died after five
years of impossibly hard and reliable work, and
then a Nikon D90). The filmmaker/narrator is a
74 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
major character in all of my films, and I wanted
his presence to be felt with the camera floating
around and following people. I had some furni-
ture dollies and I’d tape the tripod onto those and
wheel it around. There were also a few amaz-
ing days where I rented a crane from a friend
and flew around the set on that thing, camera
in tow. The sound… since this whole thing was
stop-motion we had to do all the sound in post,
which is really effective. All of it was done like
in old cartoons: huge sheets of metal, sandpaper,
throwing cinder blocks across our basement.
For the dialogue and the foley, we recorded on
a combination of relatively fancy mics a musi-
cian friend lent us (an Audio Technica AT3035)
and whatever mic was on the front of my Can-
on XH A1. We’d recorded everything through
those mics and a small Samson mixer and put it
together in Garageband.
The dialogue was fun. I had it all written,
but I wouldn’t let either of the main actors read
any of the script. We’d start on a scene and I’d
say, “This scene is where Leonard and Mary
first hang out. It’s their first date. We’re go-
ing to start around here and, Mike, you’ll say
something like….” Then Mike McGinley
(who portrays Leonard Wood) and Donna
would instantly dismiss my dialogue and go
into much better, much funnier bits, with the
same base feeling as what I’d written. The two
of them were a godsend in terms of making this
film accessible and, really, so damned funny.
I approach all my films from a very liter-
ary perspective. I’m much more interested in
literature, and stories in general, than I am in
films or pictures. So when I design the set,
title cards, narration and overall look of a
film, I’m only trying to accentuate the story. I
know some scenes have to be beautiful to look
at, and I certainly aim for that all the time,
but even a visually stunning scene should only
be there to push the narrative forward. When
I’m planning out a film, I’m thinking much
more about how to recreate a feeling of, for
instance, reading a Kurt Vonnegut scene, or
how I felt actually standing in Leonard’s real
house. I’m thinking much more about life and
literature than filmmaking.
One of the main points of the film is: “You
have to build your own world. Everyone does
it. From the richest Wall Street investor and
medical venture capitalist to the biggest nerd
dropping a McFish into a deep fryer. All of
us do it.” In my mind, the film’s design is a
physical representation of how much not just
Leonard but every single person I respect re-
ally builds his own world.
I love ideas that seem impossible. I love reach-
ing further than I can actually grasp. It makes
me focus on every little detail. There’s no com-
fort zone whatsoever in making a film for me
as long as I keep it impossible. A couple years
ago, the idea of building a town in my backyard
seemed absolutely ridiculous — and that’s the
kind of idea I want to start with when I make
a film. That’s what keeps me concentrated and
excited to get out of bed every morning.t
PAY TO PLAY
from page 70
views at 303. The possible reasons cited for the
low number of rentals was diverse. Brian New-
man, who at his Springboard Media blog called
the venture “a failure” and “a travesty,” pinned
the blame on poor marketing and search opti-
mization. Others pointed to a possibly greater
problem: YouTube’s brand as a “free content”
site and the difficulty of changing the behavior
of viewers who land on it.
Counters Pollack, “There is no doubt that
the Sundance experiment helped those films
find greater audiences than they would have
found otherwise. The numbers you see on
YouTube may speak to the number of people
who watched the film on the platform but
not the number of people who learned about
the film. [Children of Invention] producer
Mynette Louie, for example, said that sales of
her film’s DVD spiked on the Web site dur-
ing the screenings. Each filmmaker was able
to connect with additional fans.”
Regarding the marketing, Pollack acknowl-
edges that it was an issue but cites the fact that
the rental program was announced so close to
the festival as an impediment that won’t be en-
countered in the future. She also underscores
that filmmakers’ ability to market their own
films will be key to their success on the plat-
form. “Going forward, we are going to look for
marketing [ability],” she says. “We are a plat-
form — we provide the tech for people to dis-
tribute work in a simple, user-friendly manner.
We are excited to do our part to make this suc-
ceed, but you wouldn’t put a film in a theater
and leave it there and expect people to walk
by and see it. Over time studios spend billions
of dollars to create awareness around their
films. Filmmakers don’t need to spend those
billions, but they still need to create awareness
by investing time and energy.” Pollack cites the
example of Garry Beitel’s The Socalled Movie,
about Montreal rapper Socalled, which was
available for rental during SXSW. Some of So-
called’s videos on the site have clocked as many
as 2.5 million views. “In addition to us doing
our own outreach,” Pollack says, “Socalled
tapped into existing fans through Twitter and
Facebook, sent e-mails to his database of fans
and directly marketed the film that way.”
Of the final criticism — that viewers don’t
want to pay for content on YouTube when
there is so much free stuff on the site — Pol-
lack says, “No doubt a change in user behav-
ior has to take place on our platform. We have
to do some thinking on how best to facilitate
that change. But the more that people under-
stand what they are paying for, the more likely
they are to pay for it.” She references some of
the comments threads for the Sundance films
on the YouTube site. When the films went up
for rental there were negative comments from
people objecting to the idea of a rental price.
“What was great was when some of the film-
makers jumped into the comments,” she says.
“They spoke to the fans about why they were
doing this, talked about the struggles of being
an independent filmmaker — being in debt
and trying to recoup — and that changed the
tone of the comments. People recognized that
this was not just some ploy to take money out
of their hands and that the majority of rev-
enue was going to the filmmaker.”
Of course, it’s possible that other forms of
content, not independent features, will suc-
ceed at the YouTube monetization game first.
At SXSW, Pollack talked about the site’s in-
terest in Web series. In late March, YouTube
opened an official store (youtube.com/store)
containing some of the Sundance titles (Bass
Ackwards, One Too Many Mornings), other
movies old and new (Smithereens, Bunny),
and short-form content (the animation series
Sands of Destruction and a travel series called
Bikini Destination). “There are exciting things
happening in original content made for the
Web, whether it’s the next generation of new
media studios or user partners of ours becom-
ing more prolific, building the infrastructure
to create more work of a better quality and
with more energy. The Web will facilitate a
new era of content creation — it’s not just
about pulling content made for other medi-
ums but stimulating a new type of content.
And that is something that we will be aware
of as we find new partners.”
So, then, is there — or will there be — a
specific sort of YouTube movie? Pollack an-
swers, “When movies online were still a very
unique thing, it was about ‘what fits this [In-
ternet] audience.’ But as people become more
accustomed to watching films online, the idea
that there’s an online-type of film is going to
become moot.”
Filmmakers can apply to have their film on
YouTube via youtube.com/filmmakerswanted.t
A DAUGHTER’S TALE
from page 32
the dogs that belonged to that piece of prop-
erty, that holler.
Let’s talk about the film’s relationship to
genre storytelling, because it’s a lot more of
a defined narrative than Down to the Bone.
I mean, on one level, it’s the oldest story in
the book. It’s “they’re coming to take away
the farm.” It’s older than that. It goes back to
German fairy tales. Tales from the woods are
even older than losing the farm. And then, of
course, issues of trying to bury your father are
even older, right? Daniel, I felt, did a great job
of getting some throbbing essential storytell-
ing elements and making them cohere beau-
tifully in his setting. But, yes, the actual struc-
ture that was given to us — a mystery that has
to be solved, a time frame, an urgent deadline
— who doesn’t love that? I mean, especially
a gal like me who could make observational
films for the rest of her life.
You don’t hammer those points, though. It
never felt that it had any artificial dramatic
quickening or something heavy-handed to
amp up the drama. Yes, but at one point we
got severe with [the edit]. In a couple of the
edits, we took out even more of the quotid-
ian material to try to please this “mistress of
suspense.” And then it did feel a little unrec-
ognizable. I was like, “Oh God! What did
we originally like when we went down there?
What did we originally photograph?” [Edi-
tor] Affonso [Gonçalves], Fonzie — he was
my dream collaborator because he so wanted
to defend that stuff. He didn’t want to lose
that [material] either.
The “mistress of suspense,” was there some
outside force advocating for a different
rhythm? A faster pace? More melodrama?
Or was it just your own idea that it should be
— There was no outside entity telling us [to
cut more]. Maybe it was our own need to see
how far we could go. You can get in this really
brutal mind-set that’s actually kind of pain-
ful. Once you don’t need some things that you
love, once you’ve got rid of some of your favor-
ite scenes, you get on this roll where it’s like,
“Well, we did without that, so we can just do
without this.” But you can get too brutal. It
was almost like once it got sparse, it had to go
even sparser. And then I missed certain things,
and so did [Affonso]. And we knew that we
had to go back and make peace with our own
taste. In the end it felt good. The thing that
tormented me until the end, though, was how
to end the film, because there were two really
viable ways to end — I’m talking about the
very final notes of what happens to Teardrop.
There was a very concrete ending and there
was a much more open-ended situation. We
filmed it both ways. We went with the more
concrete, which is that Teardrop sort of does
indicate overtly to Ree at the end of the film
that he’s still very troubled. There was another
way in which he didn’t actually enunciate that
in lines, and you weren’t sure. But I had a real
split in the people near and dear to me, peo-
ple who really love the classicism of a tragic
destiny — Teardrop as a more conventional
tragic hero, where there is a destiny that he
feels compelled to play out. And maybe the
vanilla in me, the wuss in me, the female in
me, whatever, [felt otherwise]. [laughs]
But you did wind up going with the tragic.
I did.
One scene in your film is, I think, the best
scene I’ve seen in a movie all year. I’m speak-
ing of the scene on the boat. Character, plot
and theme all converge in a single scene. The
sound design is also innovative in the way
background noise drowns out Ree’s reaction,
which makes it even more powerful. That
scene was always a daunting, daunting aspect
of this project. The scene was written that we’d
be cutting through ice, and we came very close
to doing that. At times there were really heavy-
duty suggestions. When a larger production
company was involved in the movie early on,
they were contemplating doing that scene on a
soundstage with technology and special effects
and whatnot. All that was foreign to me; I said,
“I am open to that” even though it felt like I
was going farther and farther away from a zone
I knew how to operate in. I would have had to
rely heavily on the special effects person to be
the co-director of that scene with me. I can’t
storyboard with that kind of precision — that’s
just not how my brain functions. And luckily
once freed from the larger entity, [laughs] we
had to go poor man’s process and do it rolling
on a lake, on a pond. We did have one really sig-
nificant production concern, which was we had
to do it day for night, because we didn’t have
a budget for condors. We didn’t have any way
to light. So that was difficult. The actors had to
apply a lot more concentration. Dale Dickey,
who plays Merab, was so fabulous in this scene.
Her solemnity, her focus brought Jen [into the
scene]. And then there was the fact that [the ac-
tors] had real tools to actually operate. We had
to go through safety protocols to figure out how
to actually do that. The filming was topsy-turvy.
The operator was in waders. But people rose to
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
75
[the challenge]. We shot the rest of the scene
that evening, which really helped. Getting the
actual black sky behind her, that was done on
shore. So we did it half on a boat and half on
shore next to a pond.
How do you work with your produc-
er? Because your producer’s also your
screenwriting partner, right? Yes. That rela-
tionship is really healthy. We don’t always see
eye to eye, but it’s really healthy.
She was also a producer on your other film,
right? Yes.
What’s it like for you to have someone who
is dealing with the practical side of film-
making also be your artistic collaborator?
Well, she also brings order and semblance to
that process. She’s a taskmaster in a great way
— in a way that I so flourish under. In our
writing sessions, there’s no funny business. I
value how she brings the focus in. Also she
reads [material] copiously and quicker than
I do. She’s vetting and trying to find the in-
formation and the stories, the articles. She
also loves documentary, so we’re always try-
ing to sniff out, are there documentary ideas
that could lend themselves to some form of
growth or expansion through a narrative?
She’s just a hungry, interested, alive person
who’s constantly trying to read and look. But
she also wants [production] to be qualitatively
a rich, lived experience. Filmmaking has so
much pain in it, and she doesn’t want it to
drag us down to the point where we can’t
make more films.
How did you get this one financed? Private
equity? Yeah. You know, the first time it was
canceled two months out from production.
It took us a huge amount of time to actually
bounce back to where we were not feeling
extremely deflated. This was the year before
we made it. It was October, Halloween night
when we got the pink slip. And —
This was the bigger company? Yeah. It was
very hard to bounce back because it had gotten
so close. And then there was a whole period
[when people would say], “If Keanu Reeves is
Teardrop, maybe we can get you some money.”
Oh my God! What kind of film would’ve come
from that! That recipe of thinking — first of
all, it never really comes true, and second, most
of those films don’t work.
Let me ask you a final question about the
role of the director today in terms of pro-
moting a film. A lot of people are writing
and blogging that the director has to be an
active marketer of his or her film. The direc-
tor should be blogging and Twittering and
directly engaging with the audience. Is this
76 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
something you have thought about doing? I
think there’s a lot of credence to that. I wish
some of the cast and crew were involved with
Twitter. I would sanction them. I would say,
“Please Twitter!” But that’s not a talent that I
have. I think I hesitate too much in like — I
mean, if I could write it in broken sentences,
I’d be happy, but like actually, you know… my
list of who I even want to e-mail is so long
right now. I don’t know how to manage! And
actually look for a new project? I almost feel
like I need to like get a really rambunctious
young Twitterer and pay them a stipend.
That’s what celebrities do. Oh God, they do?
Not all of them, but many of them do not re-
ally write their tweets. That’s so disingenuous.
I think [the idea of the filmmaker as marketer]
has a lot of credence. But how to enact that
and perform it is a whole other question.t
JENNIFER LAWRENCE Q&A
from page 33
the character. I went in there and they liked it.
How long was the wait before you knew you
had the part? Gosh, it felt like 45 years. After the
audition I think I got called back right away and
that’s when I met Debra and [co-writer and pro-
ducer] Anne [Rosellini]. Then they went back to
New York [for more auditions]. They liked me
but they thought I was too pretty. I wasn’t very
happy when I found out why I wasn’t getting the
movie. So I flew to New York and read for them
again. I flew the red-eye over and was on no sleep,
so I guess then I wasn’t too pretty.
What conversations did you have with Deb-
ra about the part? Debra’s main concern was
she wanted everything to be authentic. She
pulled it off. There’s not one thing in that
movie that isn’t sincere and authentic. And
she just wanted to make sure that I understood
not only Ree but the life of the people there. I
spent enough time with the families and saw
the way that they lived life that I could play a
girl growing up in that place. Ree was up to
me, since I was the actor, but Debra wanted to
make sure I understood what it would be like
for a girl my age to grow up in a home and in
a family and in a place like the Ozarks.
So you hung out in Missouri and stayed with a
family? I did. I spent a lot of time with the fam-
ily of the house that we shot the movie in. And
the little girl Ashley, who played my little sister,
she lived there and we became really close, so
when we began filming it was like second nature
to me and I was so comfortable with her.
Having grown up in Kentucky, I would imag-
ine you’ve spent a lot of effort as an actress
trying to lose your accent, so was there an in-
security in trying to create one for this role? It
worried me at first because Debra had record-
ings and the people in it pronounced things a
little bit differently. Every time I would try to
speak my Kentucky accent would come out. I
just thought it was going to sound horrible. So
I wrote Debra an e-mail and said “I don’t know
if I can do this,” and she was like, “Just speak in
your Kentucky accent.” She loved the way that I
spoke. So that was a huge relief. All I had to do
was call my mom and talk to her for five min-
utes and I had the accent for the rest of the day.
You’ve played some serious roles before this
one. I read after shooting The Poker House you
had to go through therapy. Is it hard to leave
the characters you’ve played? With The Poker
House I was 16 and it was my first movie. Now
fortunately I know how to leave the character
when I leave work. In fact, it leaves me after [the
director calls] cut. But with that [film] I just felt
I had to take all of it on, and it did take a toll
on me. It’s just hard to come out of because you
spend two months being a person and going in
these dark places, and when you’re young you
don’t know how to get out of those dark places.
But it wasn’t that bad. My friend knows a thera-
pist and I just talked to her for a little while. I
just needed someone to talk to.
Has it always been a conscious decision to go
for the more serious roles as opposed to the
young glamour parts that most teens your age
take? Yes. I remember being 14 and I told an
executive at Disney that I didn’t think I was
very Disney and did not want a television show.
[laughs] There are people for that and they’re
extremely talented, but everybody has a differ-
ent avenue that they take and I didn’t fall in love
with those things. I fell in love with the dramas
and the grunge and the edgy and the dark —
whatever you want to call it. The things that I’ve
done are simply the things that I really wanted
and I cared about. If I don’t really care about
something I don’t have any interest in doing it. I
don’t know what that says about me. But I don’t
want to do sad movies my whole life. I’d love to
be the female Alec Baldwin. [laughs]
And it sounds like your next film, The Bea-
ver, is on the lighter side. Yeah, I do get to
be funny. I was able to be as normal a teenage
girl as I could be.
Your performance in Winter’s Bone has al-
ready started talk of it being Oscar worthy.
Have you thought about that possibility?
No. I can’t. My mom e-mailed me an ar-
ticle last night about that and I had to shut
my computer. I was like, “I can’t be thinking
about this at 19.” [laughs]t
FEST CIRCUIT
from page 21
thing is shot in slow motion — but such grace-
ful slo-mo that it was as if you were seeing the
technique for the first time.
How did Garcia do it? I naively asked him if
the revolutionaries were shot at the same time
as today’s residents. “A Phantom camera,” he
responds. “It can go up to 1,000 frames per
second, but I was not sure that it would work,
so I shot it at 450.” He then showed me on
his cell phone a photograph of Glenn Close
dressed as a man — believably so — for his
next project, based on the true story of a fe-
male butler who passed herself off as a man.
I realized that this filmmaker, whose features
(Things You Can Tell Just by Looking at Her,
Ten Tiny Love Stories) I never cared for, is
special, a whiz. And then it dawned on me:
He is the son of Gabriel García Márquez, not
that he would ever bring it up. His genes are
good: Maybe creative genius is inherited.
The only other remarkable film I have not
blogged about for Filmmaker is Michael Win-
terbottom’s Sundance entry, The Killer Inside
Me, which was in Berlin’s official competi-
tion. For me, a Texan and a Jim Thompson
fan, it is a faithful adaptation of the source
novel, even with troubling violence directed
toward women. The Killer Inside Me, as in
almost all of Winterbottom’s films, is intel-
ligently executed and perfect for the genre he
is working with. I can’t help but wonder why
most of the Sundance reviews and interviews
with the British director focused almost en-
tirely on the shocking on-screen acts and not
the merits of the film itself. Is it as p.c. in Park
City as many of my critic pals say? (I’ve never
attended Sundance.) If so, it’s just not right,
and does films and filmmakers an injustice.
Brief mention of some other Berlinale
films to look out for:
A Somewhat Gentle Man, by Hans Pet-
ter Moland, from Norway, starring Stellan
Skarsgård. If you like Kaurismaki’s sensibility,
you’ll love this well-integrated dark comedy.
Crab Trap, by Oscar Ruiz Navia, Colom-
bia. A no-budget feature shot in a beach area
populated by a community of black ex-slaves,
people who are never represented on film.
The storyline is very good — two white in-
terlopers crashing into their culture.
Self, a short by New Yorker Oleg Dubson.
This very controlled film addresses one’s ex-
istential dilemma, yet it is highly accessible.
Dubson himself plays the lead.
Most of the other segments of Revolución,
especially Fernando Eimbcke’s opener.
Best line of the festival: In the awful, campy
Austrian/German coproduction Jew Süss, the
wife of a Nazi soldier, while the non-Jewish man
who played the lead role in the infamous 1940
propaganda film Jew Süss is taking her from the
backside, screams out, “Do it to me, Jew!” Af-
ter the giggles, a British Jewish critic told me it
should have been, “So do it to me already!”
Rotterdam Film Festival
BY GABE KLINGER
Now and historically, the International
Film Festival Rotterdam ( Jan. 26 - Feb. 6)
is one of the most adventurous events of its
kind. Size wavers and leadership occasionally
changes, but the festival has been consistent
in its aim to question and expand our ideas
of cinema since its inception in 1972. Indeed
a sort of modus operandi can be found in the
festival’s continued use and reconfiguration
of André Bazin’s phrase “What Is Cinema?”
In recent times Rotterdam has answered this
question by inviting filmmakers to expand
their work outside of movie theaters and
into galleries and other alternative spaces
with painting and photography, installation
art, performances and virtual and online
projects. A few years ago, the festival even
had the idea of asking its guests to stop
watching movies and partake in an indoor
soccer tournament that lasted from morn-
ing to night in a converted theater space.
Such ideas are not merely irreverent; former
Rotterdam director Simon Field believed in
thinking outside of the prescribed norms as
a way to combat the market forces that inev-
itably impact film festivals. In Field’s words,
the festival “has a responsibility to discuss
rather than simply consume.”
A rethinking this year of Rotterdam’s con-
sumptive habits was the opening of the festi-
val’s first shop, The Break Even Store, where
one could sift through vintage issues of Ca-
hiers du Cinéma and other cinephile-friendly
goods. But the most significant aspect of the
store was its free-trade policy in which any
filmmaker or artist visiting the festival could
sell their work “A2C” (artist to consumer).
This generous incentive once again provokes
the question of whether sales companies and
distributors are still relevant in today’s rapidly
changing digital economy where filmmakers
visiting festivals are able to position and sell
their work with increasing facility. Another
notable experiment was Rotterdam’s imple-
mentation of an online server hosting nearly
all of the new films screening and which could
be accessed wirelessly from a personal laptop.
The concept of the video library is nothing
new, but the idea of online streaming in such
a personalized fashion runs dangerously close
to negating the entire concept of a film fes-
tival, where films are carefully curated and
projected on big screens. The initiative itself
isn’t bad, but it encourages lazy practices that
are already quite common in the DVD and
video-on-demand sectors.
This year Rotterdam took on the daunt-
ing task of demystifying an entire continent
of filmmaking. “African cinema has been ne-
glected,” writes programmer Gertjan Zuilhof
in the festival catalogue, “by us and by itself.”
In the aptly titled sidebar “Where Is Africa?”,
Rotterdam proposed multiple strategies. For
instance a dozen works were commissioned
from non-African filmmakers and shot in
different countries such as Angola, Congo-
Brazzaville and Zambia. Cameroon Love Let-
ter (2010), by the prolific Khavn De La Cruz,
uses as a loose framework the characters and
storylines of a Philippine soap opera that has
become popular in Cameroon to capture the
attention of the locals. Many of the works are
very much in the same discursive spirit. Other
components to “Where Is Africa?” included
musical accompaniment by African musi-
cians to projections of silent films either shot
in Africa or fictitiously set there. At least on
paper, these events have the possibility to un-
derline the power of cinema as an unpredict-
able global phenomenon.
One of the major highlights of the festi-
val and an important global cinema specimen
was John Gianvito’s four-hour documentary
essay Vapor Trail (Clark), a film that, due to
its length and unglamorous subject matter
(the disastrous environmental and human ef-
fects of the removal of two U.S. military bases
in the Philippines), was virtually ignored by
pleasure-seekers. Perhaps it’s indicative of
certain trends that industry and audience
members alike would prefer to watch Gianvi-
to’s magnum opus in small, easily consumable
morsels on disc or online. On the other end
of the spectrum, the Mexican Tiger-prize
winner Alamar, praised for its scenic im-
ages and easygoing story of a father on va-
cation with his son in a secluded Caribbean
paradise, was one of the festival’s biggest hits.
Clocking in at a brisk 73 minutes, it fits into
a certain worn-out notion of the festival film
in its exotic, faux-naive look at a community
detached from the bustle of modern life. It is
escapism of a highly amorphous kind and the
wildly overblown hype around it suggests that
market forces are still looming large around
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
77

SET PHOTOGRAPHER
www.unitstills.net
805.252.3696
Rotterdam’s artist-friendly core. For better
or worse, the question “What Is Cinema?”
encompasses both good and bad, under- and
overrated, commercial or non-commercial —
and it’s one of the virtues of the festival that
it presents us with this ample vision, even if it
means a few filmmakers ultimately get lost in
the shuffle.t
THE MAN WHO WASN’T THERE
from page 41
too often forget.
So this is the second film in a trilogy about
the aftermath of 9/11. Yeah.
78 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
What can you tell us about the third, and
how it will draw from or be influenced by
the two films you completed? In terms of
process the way it always works is: you say,
“Okay, I’m starting a film,” you have certain
ideas, you go out and start to make it and
then everything kind of gets turned on its head.
And so I assume that’s going to happen again
with this one. I’m interested in the 9/11 trials
if they actually happen in Federal court on U.S.
soil. Not really the trials themselves, but what
might happen around them. If they end up as
military commissions at Guantanamo I won’t
be so interested. I’m also interested in looking at
something on domestic surveillance in the U.S.
In either case I’m interested in doing something
in the U.S. as the final part to this [series].
What about formally as a film? You’ve spo-
ken here about how the first film differed
from the second. Is there a new approach you
are thinking about for the third? It’s prob-
ably too soon to say. I mean, I’ve also thought
about trying to do something as a narrative.
I’m not quite sure. But, I wouldn’t have been
able to make The Oath without having made
this film about this really saintly Muslim doc-
tor in Baghdad, you know? Having made that
film allowed me to make The Oath, which is
much darker and more politically incorrect.
It’s a more complicated film in terms of how
you leverage it — like, I’m against Guantana-
mo, okay? I want Guantanamo to be closed,
but this film could be leveraged against that
wish. You could say, “Oh, well, they’re all
crazy fanatics and we should throw them all
in jail.” I know I’m treading in much darker
territory, more complex territory, in terms of
filmmaking and storytelling in this one than I
did in the last one. So they’re related. In terms
of what I’ll do the next time, I’m not sure. I
mean, I’d like it to sort of develop in some
sort of a different direction that will build off
of these other two films.
Tell me a little bit about your relationship
with your editor, and how on a practical lev-
el that plays out. All the collaborators who
worked on the film are incredible. Jonathan,
who’s the editor, he started working on it
while I was still in the field. I was back and
forth to Yemen and psychologically it was just
a lot to carry. How was I going to make a film
about this guy? How was I going to tackle
somebody who is so complex? In a sense his
charisma is his personality so how were we
going to not let him run away with the film?
So [ Jonathan and I] were editing and then I
would go to Yemen and come back and we’d
keep working. There was a lot of back and
forth. One of the real contributions that he
brought to the film later in the process was
this [idea of ] exposing the filmmaking pro-
cess, which is typically something I don’t like
to do. I like my films to be stories, to take the
viewer on a journey. And we know that [in
early cuts of this film] the viewer was spending
a lot of energy wondering about the camera,
saying, “Why is there a camera in the room?”
Audiences were having a hard time connect-
ing to the story. So then we started bringing
in these [moments] where [Abu Jandal] lies
about the camera and about what’s it doing
in the taxicab. Those more self-reflexive ele-
ments to the film that break the narrative wall
came in later in the editing process.
One last thing. In one of your interviews
you commented on the multiple meanings
of “the oath,” and said one was whether or
not you as a filmmaker had broken your
oath to your subject. Could you elaborate
on that? Well, I mean, there’s a point in the
film that, you know, Abu Jandal asked me to
take something out, and not only do we not
take it out but we also show him asking us to
take it out. We also probably revealed things
about him that wouldn’t be his choice to re-
veal. I think that the film is basically a film
about loyalty and betrayal, and so that relates
to me too. Loyalty and betrayal between the
filmmaker and the subjects. [ Jandal’s] loyalty
towards bin Laden and also Hamdan. Our
government and [whether it’s a] betrayal of
our trust in terms of how it’s conducting it-
self. So those are just a few of the things we
wanted the audience to grapple with.t
DON’T YOU WANT ME?
from page 43
the framework of what that scene is trying to
accomplish and the scope of the whole narra-
tive, but honestly, if we’re not getting a genuine
and in-the-moment performance, we’ll throw
everything away just to get to that point where
the actors have released all these previously
conceived ideas about what a scene should be
and are just interacting with this other person.
MARK: Because I don’t care what every actor
says, most of them rehearse their lines in the
mirror. [Jay Duplass laughs] And you have to
get through that.
It sounds like a lot of the movie comes to-
gether in the edit. JAY: Yes.
MARK: It took us almost nine months to
edit Cyrus.
Were there other avenues that the film could
have gone down? What did you throw away?
JAY: We threw away tons of stuff.
MARK: There’s a couple of different movies
that could’ve been made out of the footage.
JAY: By “a couple,” he means like 50. [laughs]
How was your experience working with a
studio, Fox Searchlight, versus working on
your own? JAY: It was very, very different.
[laughs] I mean, Mark and I come from a
cave. We were not even working on 30-peo-
ple independent film sets, we were working
on five-person film sets.
MARK: We’ve never had someone else’s mon-
ey before. So that was a whole new item.
JAY: It’s not even about answering to some-
body else, it’s about discussing it with some-
body else.
MARK: Jay and I discovered that we were
particularly bad at communicating what we
needed done because we share a shorthand
between ourselves, and we share a shorthand
with our previous cast and crew, who are our
friends, parents and wives, essentially. So we
had to really get good at setting [the studio] at
ease and saying, “Yes, I know you just watched
four hours of improvised dailies, 10 percent
of which are out of focus, and you can’t re-
ally see the script in there, but there’s a scene.”
And [we found out that] that’s not really good
enough. We [had to] cut some scenes for them,
let them into our process. Once we kind of fig-
ured that out, everything went smoothly. But
it was a little rocky for a while, kind of all of us
finding our footing, you know.
I imagine that it was different working with
a professional, studio-sanctioned crew as
well. JAY: Definitely, hiring crew was a
more difficult learning process than working
with the studios. We probably had to inter-
view 15 people per position before we found
somebody who really got what we were do-
ing and wanted to do it. In particular with
the [designers]. I mean, our movies aren’t
like the best-looking movies in the world.
We’re going for vérité. What we feel like we
have to offer are real moments happening in
front of you that mean something to you and
add up to something important.
MARK: A lot of production designers will
come in with ideas like, “He should be blue
and she should be red!”
JAY: And we’re just like, “No! He should be
wearing a T-shirt. That’s it.”
MARK: “It should look like it looks like in
your neighbor’s house.” And finding that per-
son who not only respects that but wants to
be a part of it is hard.
JAY: Because we’re not looking for people who
can tolerate what we’re doing, we’re looking for
people who love what we’re doing. Because,
obviously, we’re making weird, kind of special
little movies in a very specific little zone, and
Mark and I are not tyrant directors — like if
we don’t have a lot of love around us, we’re go-
ing to crumble immediately.
MARK: We need crew members who are
also pillows [Jay Duplass laughs] essentially is
what it comes down to. “Snugglebug” really
should be on their résumé.
Snugglebugs only.
MARK: [laughs] Exactly.
JAY: That’s right. That’s actually our new
production company, Snugglebugs LLC.t
ROCK IN OPPOSITION
from page 53
resistance in my films, as I have always done
and as I will continue to do.
In my letter to him, I invited him for ����
fur-
ther dialogue. But I want to ask you to do
some research and find out whether or not I’m
telling the truth. I want you to find the truth
on your own.
Would you like to comment directly on the
situation with Jafar Panahi? The problem
is that in his letter, Kiarostami says that the
arrest of Jafar Panahi has to do with the
Cultural Ministry. But the truth is that the
Cultural Ministry is really nobody in Iran.
This didn’t come from them, it came from
higher up. These kind of arrests come from
the Presidency and leadership of Iran. We
have to realize that once Jafar Panahi has been
to jail, he’s not going to be the same person
after he gets out. He will be changed. Right
now, in jail, they’re killing his feelings and
his emotions. It’s not very easy in countries
like mine to have filmmakers. Once we have
them, we cannot afford to lose them.t
CURBSIDE
from page 57
wanting people to know where you are at ev-
ery second and what you’re doing — it’s like I
want whatever the opposite of Twitter is. I wish
I could make myself more invisible. I just don’t
know where that compulsion comes from where
you want everyone to know everything about
you all the time. I mean, it’s like a disease.
The various Web sites devoted to you — are
any of those official? No, I don’t have Web
sites, or MySpace; other people who I don’t
know just do them. I was always unsure about
it, like, whether that was something I should
try to stop, but now I kind of like it. I kind of
like the idea of people pretending to be me.
There’s something comforting about it. It just
allows me not to worry about it.
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Filmmaker Digital Issue .................................... 59
Five Towns College ............................................. 49
FUJI ..................................................... BACK COVER
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Glidecam Industries .......................................... 17
Hola Mexico Film Festival .................................. 27
IFC Films .................................. Front Inside Cover
IFP ........................................................................... 71
Kino Flo ................................................................ 37
KODAK .................................................................... 3
LA Shorts Fest ............................ Back Inside Cover
Montana Film Office ......................................... 49
New York Film Academy ...................................... 25
Reiff & Associates .............................................. 57
SAG Indie ............................................................... 11
Technicolor ............................................................ 1
The Writers’ Store ............................................... 41
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please contact Ian Gilmore at:
212-465-8200 x220 or
ian@flmmakermagazine.com
I agree with you that some artists are too
present in the social mediasphere. Some-
times maintaining a kind of mystery is best.
Yeah, I just try to live my life. It’s hard because
I have to promote the films, or else they don’t
exist, you know? But I try not to think about
myself too much, or why I do the things I do.
Like sometimes I’ll just make a film because
I feel like I should, but I don’t exactly know
what I’m trying to say. I’m doing it because I
feel like I have to do it. So I guess the only
time I really think about myself objectively is
during interviews.
By making the film you figure out why you
want to make it. Yes, exactly. That’s right. Ex-
actly. It’s the same thing with anything. It’s like
drawing a picture or something. Same thing.
You just kind of sketch and play and then start
to say, “Oh, maybe there’s something more
there.” Most of the time people make movies
it seems like they have like a point to prove
or like they’re trying to plot their life or have
some kind of message. I’ve just never felt like
that. I feel like films should just be more like
experiences. They should transcend words and
be more like feelings or emotions. They should
move you like the best things in the world that
you can’t necessarily articulate.t
FILMMAKER SPRING 2010
79
 PARTING SHOT

TILDA
SWINTON
Over the course of two
decades, Tilda Swinton
has quietly become one of
the most respected actresses
working today, unique in her
ability to move between Hol-
lywood, international arthouse
cinema, fashion and the art world.
Seemingly uninterested in fame but
only in how she can challenge her-
self through her craft, Swinton chooses
roles that are rarely similar and always
unique. Becoming the muse of Derek
Jarman after first appearing in his 1986
film Caravaggio and then starring in 1991’s
Edward II, the London-born Swinton spent
the ’80s and ’90s feeding her avant-garde senti-
ment, taking roles for filmmakers like Sally Pot-
ter, Susan Streitfeld and John Maybury. Then in
2001 she broke into America’s indie landscape with
her Golden Globe-nominated performance in the
Sundance hit The Deep End. Winning the Best Sup-
porting Actress Oscar for her brilliant portrayal of an un-
ethical corporate attorney in Tony Gilroy’s Michael Clayton
in 2007, she’s since done everything from trying her hand
at the Hollywood tent pole — playing White Witch Jadis in
The Chronicles of Narnia franchise — to working with the likes
PHOTO BY: HENNY GARFUNKEL/RETNA LTD.

of the Coen brothers, David Fincher and Jim Jarmusch.  

This spring, Swinton plays the lead in Luca Guadagnino’s family

drama I Am Love, released by Magnolia Pictures. Swinton (speaking
in either Italian or Russian the entire film!) is the mother of a wealthy
Milanese family who engages in a heated affair with her son’s business
partner. A decadent, elliptical melodrama, I Am Love offers Swinton the
canvas for yet another powerful performance in her dazzling filmography.
– Jason Guerrasio, Photography by Henny Garfunkel

80 FILMMAKER SPRING 2010

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