Style Archive

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.
txt
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fastseduction.com query dump, author: Style (1)
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"Ricked N Style" <godly_presence@bigfoot.com>
Wed, 27 May 1998 04:00:00 GMT
newsgroup: alt.seduction.fast
subject: Re: Bald
ajc@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca wrote in message <6k70hj$dbi$2@news.sas.ab.ca>...

>
> Are you blind? Everywhere you look these days you see
> short, shorn, shaved, and bald - regardless of whether
> it's genetically induced or hairclipper induced. Bald
> is "in".
I've got to agree here. Shaved heads do rule. Balding looks shit. Bald
looks good.
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"styler" <styler@my-dejanews.com>
Sun, 06 Sep 1998 04:00:00 GMT
subject: Mystery: Meet The SSers and RDS
Dear Mystery: Your posts are interesting, provocative and fantastic. I, for
one, believe you. Your positive attitude is refreshing. Let me fill you in
a bit about alt.seduction.fast. It is populated by the Speed Seducers and
their arch enemies the Stealies. R. Don Steele has been carrying on a flame
war in this group in a sorry attempt to sell his books. He is failing. Ross
Jeffries tries to convince losers to part with 3,000 so they can get laid. -
You sound like the antithesis of these types. As a matter of fact you sound
like a leader, not a follower. Can you learn something useful here? You can
learn a lot of what NOT to do. You can learn that those who don't get laid
talk about it a lot. You can learn that flaming is a poor substitute for
getting laid. - Now, don't get me wrong. Both Don AND Ross have some good
ideas. Cherry pick the best of what they preach and continue your quest.
You will find no one in this group who would be a worthy teacher. I started
reading this group hoping to improve my skills. What I have learned would
fit in a thimble! BTW: Save your money. Spend it on those 10s! Much better
investment! - alt.seduction.fast is a group of LOSERS, GEEKS and NERDS. -
Anyway, thanks for the posts. Your information is welcome. Your ideas are
new and fresh. This group needed a breath of fresh air. It was getting old
and moldy!
file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (1 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
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Sun, 06 Sep 1998 04:00:00 GMT
subject: Mystery Yes!
I enjoy Mystery's posts very much. There is a lot of jealousy and negativity
in this NG. Let's have more positive input and ideas. We could all learn
something from this person.
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Tue, 08 Sep 1998 04:00:00 GMT
subject: Keep On Posting Mystery
I had just about given up on alt.seduction fast. The rantings of R. Don

Steele...The idiocy of Ross Jeffries. The ultra-boring flame wars between
these two old men. Keep on posting, Mystery. You sure got my attention.
And my VOTE, too! Damn good ideas. You SHOULD write a book. If you can't
write, find a ghost-writer. You will clean up. I have read most of what is
out there and most of it sucks. R. Don Steele had some good ideas ten years
ago. That's about it. Anyway, Mystery, thanks for posting. You are always
welcome in my book. Always.
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Thu, 01 Oct 1998 04:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: Penthouse Article On Speed Seduction

In article <sandworm-2909982230480001@la-ip15.via.net>,
sandworm@via.net (Ross Jeffries) wrote:
> Attention Fans and Foes,
>
> Once again, Speed Seduction is the focus of a favorable article in a major
> magazine....this time PENTHOUSE!
>
> Eat your heart out foes and critics!
>
> Too bad R. Dung died before he could read it and eat his withered heart out!
>
> --
> Get Laid NOW!
> Ask me how!
> http://www.seduction.com
Please speak kindly of the dead. RDS/RIP!

> Free Newsletters and Real Audio files!
>
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------

http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
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Thu, 01 Oct 1998 04:00:00 GMT
subject: R.I.P./R.D.S.
R. Don Steele (John White) 1941-1998 May he rest in peace.

May he find many sweet young things wherever he is now.
We will miss his Alzheimer rantings! His Flames at Ross and SSers.
But you have to admit alt.seduction.fast is a little quieter place since his
untimely demise.

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Fri, 02 Oct 1998 04:00:00 GMT

subject: Re: Consequences for Ross and company
Deja-News tracer : routing #456-38-112-23-BC-3747/far2many@:!!8565-56

Austin Hub///Okla City///Denver///Los Angeles.........searching......
searching.........deja-news...notfound....searching////384...New Route..
545-4848//Auston Hub///////Chicago////58495...384...Local ISP...backbone hub
8474444CCCBBBA//////FOUND//FOUND//FOUND///reporting location, address, id
number. End tracker...
In article <6v1adl$ggo$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
far2many@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> Your techniques may work wonders, but you should be aware of the consequences.
>
> If you seduce my wife, any of my family's wives, any of my friend's wives, or
> any one's wife I care about, I will kill you. I am not kidding. I am not a
> violent man, but when someone threatens those I love, I respond with
> appropriate, in this case deadly, force. And your NLP patterns don't compare
> to my Ruger's.
>
> Don't fuck another man's wife
>
> -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
> http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
>

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Fri, 02 Oct 1998 04:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: Consequences for Ross and company
In article <6v1k65$q5s@drn.newsguy.com>,
Crash Street Kidd <CrashStreetKidd@hotmail.com> wrote:
> In article <6v1adl$ggo$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, far2many@my-dejanews.com says...
>>
> >Your techniques may work wonders, but you should be aware of the
consequences.

>>
> >If you seduce my wife, any of my family's wives, any of my friend's wives, or
> >any one's wife I care about, I will kill you.
>
> They've got that one covered with speed hitting if you
> go to the 3000 buck seminar. First they teach you how
> to seduce housewives and then they teach you how to kick
> the crap out of their husbands.
Most of these eunuchs haven't been able to get it up for years. If you saw
them on the streets you would laugh your head off. The computer keyboard is
all you have left. Their pseudo-cock! If this guy were not so pitiful, he
would be dangerous. I hope your wife runs away with a real man. On second
thought, I doubt if you have ever been able to talk ANY woman into giving you
a tumble. Keep posting Troll. You are good for a laugh. If by some chance
you are for real and an actual sociopath, just be aware that we are a LOT
smarter than thee. We are ready for stupid moves by stupid people.
Stoooopid!! Now back to the keyboard, huh?
>
> >I am not kidding. I am not a
> >violent man, but when someone threatens those I love, I respond with
> >appropriate, in this case deadly, force. And your NLP patterns don't compare
> >to my Ruger's.
>
> Stand twelve feet away. Or the speed hitting will get you.
>
> >Don't fuck another man's wife
>
> Crash Street Kidd
>

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Sat, 03 Oct 1998 04:00:00 GMT

subject: Re: Angry-Bitter Women
In article <6v3epd$d1e$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
rdeesteele@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> From a recent newsletter Men Of Steel Balls.
> Free subscription? send empty email to subscribe@steelballs.com
>
> ARE BITTER WOMEN HOPELESS? You say that by the time women reach their
> 30's many have become bitter and hardened. Is the damage irreversible? If
> not, how can you spot the ones that can bloom again? Gene O’Roark, Nashville.
> STEELE SEZ: Bitterness is what long term resentment turns into.
> Resentment is what unexpressed anger turns into. Anger is what one feels when
> one is hurt or indignant. Anger is a survival emotion, as normal and natural
> as crying or joy. When you step on your female cat’s tail by accident, she
> does not, grit her teeth and maintain an image of feminine decorum, now does
> she. She gets angry, hisses, bares her teeth ready to fight and kill, sticks
> out her claws and whacks you on the leg. She expresses her anger from the
> hurt you caused her. Her anger enabled her to stop you from hurting her.
> Survival! By expressing her anger, you stop hurting her (move your foot).
> So, in only a matter of minutes, the relationship you have with you cat goes
> right back to healthy and normal. QUESTION 1: Is the damage irreversible?
> ANSWER 1: First you have to know what caused the damage to see if it can
> be reversed. Here’s how women become bitter and hard. In our culture, women
> are indoctrinated against expressing anger when they are hurt or feel
> indignant. Instead, when they are hurt they are taught to cry. To compound
> the neurosis our culture induces, men are indoctrinated to never cry when
> they feel sadness, helplessness or pain. In fact, to never cry under any
> circumstances, even death. Instead they are taught that the only emotion
> permitted to a Real Man is anger. So, a typical young couple marries. The
> man never cries. The woman never gets angry. Rather, the woman sits on her
> anger for three or four years, then in one defining moment she loses her
> temper and goes on a wild rampage of destruction, both physical and verbal.
> A few weeks after it’s over, she is shocked by her behavior and vows to
> never get angry again because she hurt her children, her husband and her
> parents as well as embarrassing herself completely. Her humiliation is caused
> by what she sincerely believes a female is supposed to be like and behave
> like. The man in this situation is stunned by the ferocity of her anger. He
> had no idea she was angry. He had no idea he was irritating her every day by
> leaving the wet towel on the floor, forgetting to shop, ridiculing her mother
> and on and on because she did not express her anger, thus he kept hurting
> her. She begins to resent him about the second year and deeply after
> their first child. I could go on with the dynamics of how a marriage dies,
> but you only need to know that this is the fate of couples who do not know
> how to express what their feelings are, especially negative emotions. Which
> couples are those? All of them, save a very few. So, they divorce. She
> is 28 with custody of two kids, has no job skills and has to work at an entry

> level job. She’s tired every night. Her parents lay guilt trips on her. Her
> ex-husband hassles her. Her children become burdens, not joys. Every
time
> she meets a guy, she has to chase around for baby sitters so he soon
> disappears. The only guys who will date her are divorced men who also have
> children. That’s not much fun. She wants to go back and be young again, to
> live, to enjoy life and sex and men. Every attempt at getting her needs
> met ends in hurt at the hands of a man who does not want to “get too
> involved,” so he uses her and drops her. She is frustrated at every turn. She
> is disappointed in life and love. She is hurt and disillusioned. She is
> lonely and horny. This is the state she lives in for years on end, with no
> relief in sight. Now you know how she feels and you know why. Can she
> stop being this way and become a new, different, happy human being? As
> a Biocentric Humanistic Psychologist, I say, of course she can. I have worked
> with many women in this predicament and seen them stick with it until they
> recover their joy for life go on to live happily ever after. I have also seen
> women in this plight come into therapy and quit after only six weeks. Why
> some stick with it and why some don’t is explained by the somewhat circular
> argument, “To change, the client has to really want to change.” In
> Biocentric Therapy, the client goes through a process of self-awareness,
> self-acceptance, self-assertiveness and accepting personal responsibility for
> her life. That is the pathway back to being an integrated, whole human being.
> To travel this road, the woman must be brave (must want to change)
> above all else. She must go back in her life and relive the pain and sorrow
> and fear, and even terror, as well as moments of horrible trauma. She must be
> aware of how she avoids these feelings today. She must accept that these
> things happened to her and that she alone is responsible for accepting what
> it means to her and her future. She must assert herself and change how she
> behaves and reacts toward her parents, children, ex-husband, boss, female
> friends and even service people. She must accept full, complete and total
> responsibility for her life from this moment forward. IMPLIED QUESTION:
> Are there very many women who can overcome their bitterness. ANSWER: No, not
> many. Most women fester there until after menopause. About seven years later,
> many women are able to accept that the world is the way it is and that they
> were operating on a faulty set of principles. These women are also able to
> see that their parents and society are, and were, wrong to teach them that
> they would only be a success if they became a "good wife and mother." The
> rest are grumpy, angry, bitter old ladies. QUESTION 2: If not, how can you
> spot the ones that can bloom again? ANSWER 2: To spot one who has
> potential, look for a woman who has already decided what the post menopausal
> women above decide. WARNING: Don't try to change anybody! She is what she
> chooses to be, just as you are what you choose to be. We are what we do, or
> do not do. Doing or not doing is a choice.
>
> Aloha, R. Don Steele
>

> http://steelballs.com FREE compare R. Don Steele with WUSS J'OVARYBERG, click
> on How To Talk With Young Women at http://steelballs.com
>
> -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Shit! I really thot R. Dung had croaked. Drat... He's baaaaaccckk!

Now we have to put up with more of his fucking flames.
It was so peaceful and quiet around here without this asshole.
>

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Fri, 16 Oct 1998 04:00:00 GMT
subject: Join The Baby Doll Community
If you are into young girls (and who isn't?) you will want to join the Excite
Baby Doll Community. Lots of pix, new ideas, strategies, comeraderie. It's
easy, it's fun and it's fast. Free membership in the Baby Dolls Community.
http://www.excite.com/comm/new/
Scotty
You will thank me!

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Fri, 16 Oct 1998 04:00:00 GMT
subject: You Gotta See This!
ZAP! All the free sex sites have censored the pix. Government regulations
or something. But my site is different. 100s of free pix, totally
uncensored, young, ripe, beautiful. We just love young girls. You can join
our discussion group if you want. No registration required. Pass it on.

Http://www.excite.com/comm/new/
You'll thank me.
Scotty Tyler

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Thu, 24 Dec 1998 05:00:00 GMT
subject: Where's the book?
I placed an order for "Outfoxing The Foxes" almost three weeks ago and have
yet to receive an acknowledgement or the book. An E-Mail to Snodgrass
Publishing Co. has gone unanswered for 5 days. I sent another today
(Thursday). It is too early to say that this is a fraud, but I am beginning
to wonder. I will keep the group advised. In the meantime, you might want
to hold onto your check and just read the free material at Ray's web site. I
can understand the mails being slow this time of year, but E-mail? p.s. I
really want the book! Answer Ray? If there is a logical explanation, I
apologize.
BTW: This is not my real name, but Ray knows who I am.

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"HHH-DX-STYLE@webtv.net" <HHH-DX-STYLE@webtv.net>
Fri, 03 Dec 1999 06:26:42 GMT
subject: Help
Hi
I'm 28 Single. I have a friend of mine she's 20.
Goes to college about an hour away from my house. I recently got back
in touch w/ her after about a year. We made plans to go out the 11th.
about a week an a half away. Is there any patterns I can use that will

help me put her in the mood and thinking of me until then. any help you
can give would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance
Jason
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"mystyle10@my-deja.com" <mystyle10@my-deja.com>
Wed, 12 Apr 2000 14:53:56 GMT
subject: you're fucked in the head
that such a Talent-less moron like yourself still walks this earth
surprises me, where to start! to break into someone's apartment just
to
go to bed with her, shows you have two chances of getting laid in "the
real world" slim and none ! To stoop to that level to get laid shows a
complete lack of respect for anyone else, not to mention a lack of
personaility if you really have to use ss crap in the first place, then
no one you ever slept with ever gave a fuck about you as a person NO
ONE and, you can never relax around these women always afraid your
going to slip up and ruin it(be real for a moment!) and tell me yu see
the irony here please!!!-------->"Once inside, microcassette
recorder and digital or micro-camera in hand. start an intensive search.
Do NOT ransack the place for God's sake. You're a professional with
a lofty and precise goal in mind. Not a fucking low-life crook"<-----
you have GOT to be taking the piss here please??!?!?! you see yourself
as a cut above a low life? laughable..hmm so lts take a look at your
like.. no personalty, no one could possibly like you as there isn't
anything real about you, your a lonely balding fuckwit, with a very
badly put together website! gorgeous!!mmmmmmmmmm and you want people to
pay YOU for advice!!!
pull your head out of your ass
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

Before you buy.
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"mystyle10@my-deja.com" <mystyle10@my-deja.com>
Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:23:50 GMT

subject: Re: you're fucked in the head
Aaaah ... good old straightforward jealousy and envy.

It's the very grease that makes the world go round,
(besides money), VINCE
word to the moron, I'm a WOMAN, therefore why would i be jealous of

you? and please don't tell me it's the woman who's apartment your
breaking into i'm jealous of???? Delusional pillow biter
In article <8d22lt$l4k$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,
mystyle10@my-deja.com wrote:
> that such a Talent-less moron like yourself still walks this earth
> surprises me, where to start! to break into someone's apartment just
> to
> go to bed with her, shows you have two chances of getting laid in "the
> real world" slim and none ! To stoop to that level to get laid shows a
> complete lack of respect for anyone else, not to mention a lack of
> personaility if you really have to use ss crap in the first place,
then
> no one you ever slept with ever gave a fuck about you as a person NO
> ONE and, you can never relax around these women always afraid your
> going to slip up and ruin it(be real for a moment!) and tell me yu see
> the irony here please!!!-------->"Once inside, microcassette
> recorder and digital or micro-camera in hand. start an intensive
search.
> Do NOT ransack the place for God's sake. You're a professional with
> a lofty and precise goal in mind. Not a fucking low-life crook"<-----
> you have GOT to be taking the piss here please??!?!?! you see yourself
> as a cut above a low life? laughable..hmm so lts take a look at your
> like.. no personalty, no one could possibly like you as there isn't
> anything real about you, your a lonely balding fuckwit, with a very
> badly put together website! gorgeous!!mmmmmmmmmm and you want people
to
> pay YOU for advice!!!
>
> pull your head out of your ass

>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
>
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

Before you buy.
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"christopher powles" <cpowles100@hotmail.com>
Wed, 27 Jun 2001 22:02:21 GMT
subject: Language Barrier PUs
I had a question, and haven't seen this topic addressed here:

I'm going to be traveling in an Eastern European country where very
few women speak English. And I’m going to be hanging out there
with someone who is pretty hooked into the scene, so hopefully I'll be
meeting a lot of HBs. The question is: how can I PU in a foreign
country without communicating verbally? I’m an average-looking
guy who has always used SS, intelligence, patterns, etc. for PU's;
I've never been forced to rely just on gesture, body language,
physicality, etc. Any suggestions for an American trying to PU
non-English-speakers in Eastern Europe? Meeting HBs should be really
easy, but I can’t figure out what to do afterwards to close the
deal!
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Thu, 28 Jun 2001 18:02:39 GMT
subject: The Art of War
Hey, I thought Id make a recommendation for one of the most ancient PU

guides: anyone ever read the Art of War by Sun Tzu in respect to SS?
If you think about it, it totally works as a big analogy for
strategizing a seduction.
For Example, he advises, before going to war, asess <<moral influence

(eg, values), weather (is the environment favorable to sarging?),
terrain (what kind of HB are you dealing with), command, and then

doctrine.>>
THEN he goes on to say: <<Victory is the main object in war. If this

is long delayed, weapons are blunted and morale depressed.>>
AND: <<What is of supreme importance in war is to attack the enemys

strategy; next best is to disrupt his alliances...Thus, those skilled
in war subdue the enemy without battle. They capture his cities
without assaulting them, and overthrow his state without protracted
operations.>>
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Fri, 29 Jun 2001 21:50:53 GMT
subject: Re: The Art of War
kumadek@yahoo.com (Alessandro) wrote in message news:<da26ae5f.0106281652.6a9c27@posting.google.

com>...
>
> IMHO, if you read this book for chicks, you are out of the
> game. women supposed to be fun ;)
>
For Alessandro and others who object to thinking of the art of war
with seduction in mind, read it as an analogy: obviously, women are in
no way enemies and seduction is not a war. But the Art of War is not
really a war guide: it's a guide to strategy, which is exactly what
this newsgroup is!
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Fri, 29 Jun 2001 22:12:07 GMT
subject: Expert Help Needed
Is there discussion anywhere or advice on how to sarge when traveling

in a foreign country where English isn't normally spoken. Its so easy
to meet HBs abroad, but when they don't have a grasp of the language,
NLP and patterns definitely don't work and any initial spark of
excitement and possibility fades away when communication becomes too

difficult. Any advice, especially since sometimes the hottest, most

unjaded, most ready-for-adventure HBs don't speak much English?
Also, stupid questions for further thought:
What does it mean when a HB you're with eats garlic/onion type food
when shes with you--that shes not expecting to go back to your place
that night and that youre going to have to work harder to get her
there?
Applying lipstick/lipliner--is there any significance in how/where its

done. When its done very blatantly in front of you, is it a signal or
symbol for anything, positive or negative?
Work nights: So many perfect nights have been foiled by the fact that,
even though shes ready and kino-ing like crazy, its 2 or 3 a.m. and
she has to be up for work at 7 a.m. the next day. Any strategy/pattern
here for trying to convince a HB to not worry about the fact that it's
a work/school night and just come back to your place?
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Mon, 02 Jul 2001 06:17:59 GMT
subject: Re: Getting out of LJBF.
"local_d" <local_d@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<TUP%6.12673$p41.2084095@news1.rdc1.md.

home.com>...
> I don't think it would. But if you start the kino, you have to build it up
> gradually since you never did it before. Might seem unnatural.
>
> --
What you have to do is bring in a HB9 or 10 who doesn't usually hang
out in the club (someone you've picked up elsewhere), and let everyone
see that they are attracted to you. Do this two or three times, and
you're golden. But--important--do not show or try to show your HBs
off! It must seem perfectly natural for these beautiful HBs to be
attracted to you, and you must seem perfectly comfortable in that
situation, like it's normal for you.
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Mon, 02 Jul 2001 06:49:53 GMT

subject: Re: Expert Help Needed
candor88@my-deja.com (Candor) wrote in message news:<e6f23903.0106292045.bb9ab7e@posting.google.

com>...
> I don't know how much of an expert I am, but I am willing and able to
> help, so here goes...
>
Candor, you are clearly an expert. That's good stuff, esp the
kino/dictionary routine. And Gunwitch, yeah, the blunt approach in a
foreign accent can be charming.
>
> Generally not a problem for me, because I always cut off weeknight
> meetings at 10 while things are still going well. But in theory, if
> she's with you at 2 or 3 and has to get up at 7, she has already made
> the decision (or thinks it was made for her) that interacting with you
> is more important than being alert at work the next day. You have to
> be doing well to get to this point. So the deal is pretty much in the
> bag. All you have to do is take her to bed. Tell her she's not going
> to be able to fall asleep at her place, because she's going to be
> fantasizing about what might have been. Tell her you'll give her a
> massage and calm her down so she can get to sleep. If she argues,
> tell her she's wasting time that would be better spent getting relaxed
> and ready for bed. Be dismissive of her arguments and tell her she's
> being "silly" and has nothing to be afraid of.
>
> Of course, the massage you give her will lead to kisses on her back,
> followed by kisses on her neck, and eventually flipping her over and
> letting her feel the weight of your body on her crotch. At that
> point, you're just about home free.
>
But this work thing is where I keep having the problem. I think you
have the right answer here but I need a little more help. I just got
home, it's a sunday night, and i'm coming from what would have been a
perfect PU. Visited a store a friend owns, saw a young HB7.5 in a
tight little red dress making eye contact the whole time. Suggested we
get some food so we could talk (she paid--for sushi even--while I was
in the bathroom), got some drinks, and she was perfect--giving me all
her trance words right away and, after I bounced them back at her, she
started dropping sex talk into the conversation, setting me up
perfectly to improvise some patterns. We leave the bar and she walks
me back to her house. She says she's tired. But then she opens the

door and walks upstairs, and I follow. Then she runs into roomates,
and we talk to them. She says she's tired again and has to sleep for
work. What I should have done was either cut the night short much
earlier so I wouldn't be in this situation or brought her back to my
place. But instead, I *closed and left.
So, does this demote me back to an AFCdom (or worse)? Candor or

Gunwitch or etc., what would you have done?
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Mon, 02 Jul 2001 07:10:57 GMT
subject: AI and SS
Anyone see the movie AI: Artifical Intelligence and have any thoughts
on Joe (the gigolo robot)? Anyone think he was programmed with SS?
Anyone think he was Mystery? I saw it yesterday with a HB I met that
day (but wasn't interested in--just practicing), and she was
definitely digging Joe (the confident, mysterious, and somewhat cheesy
robot who knows what women want)...
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Mon, 02 Jul 2001 07:22:00 GMT
subject: Re: STD's and ASF
Just a question:
Which is a bigger risk? Having protected sex with multiple women, or

sleeping for years unprotected with the same wife/gf and assuming that
they've been faithful to you the whole time?
Also, as for the initial comment that started this whole thread, you
could see SS as a way of fucking and leaving as many women as
possible. But for some people I've talked to here, if they find the
right woman, they're going to keep her. SS is just increasing their
chances of finding the right woman, and not just settling. (And maybe
it'll even increase their ability to stay faithful to her cause
they've already sown their oats)...

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================================================================================
Tue, 03 Jul 2001 01:06:10 GMT
subject: Re: *Closing and FClosing....what's your mindset?
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Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast
Subject: Re: How to order drinks?
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Tue, 03 Jul 2001 19:14:54 GMT
subject: Party Girls
This is where SS fails for me: the party girl, the fucked-up HB who
just wants to have a good time and will end up in bed with the guy who
shows her one. She doesn't want to sneak off in some corner with a PUA
who will talk the sweet words that will open her legs. She wants to be
grabbed and taken on an adventure that escalates the fun and mayhem. I
often get approached by these girls, because I'm seen with other HBs,
so they want in on the action. But if I open my mouth and start
dropping patterns or anything, she's gone in a hearbeat because that
shit's boring to her.
Anyone have any good advice on landing party girls? There have to be

good routines--they'd have to be physical ones--that can be simply

done to show that you can give them the adventure they crave that
night. Does anyone else have problems in this area, with the "wild and
crazy" HBs? An extra problem for me is: I've always seduced with my
words and mind, never with my body.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Thu, 05 Jul 2001 06:59:38 GMT
subject: Re: Party Girls
final@identity.com (Final D) wrote in message news:

<Xns90D498C4ED7CDFinalDFinalDFinalD@207.217.77.22>...
> drsquare <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in
> <bof6ktghs9bobett6itkopltdikgqh9sja@4ax.com>:
>
>
> And to the rest of the newsgroup, for those of you who do bag party-girls
> easily, what's the best way to get into a state where you can appear to her
> to be the emotionally charged up life-of-the-party type that she's seeking?
> I suspect it's not as simple as that
Thanks Final D. That's exactly the problem: the answer is obvious but
how to execute it is the dilemma, especially for guys like us who
can't go into fake "Whoo-hoo! Party!" mode at the drop of a hat.
Formhandle's girl is a HB at a party, but a party girl would have
gotten bored with the "what song is this" game. Could party girls be
God's gift to the AFC? Someone must end up with them at the end of the
night. But it's not most of us it seems. And, I'm not willing to give
up and say, 'Oh, I just can't work with that type.'
So there are two ways to get an answer to this: maybe mirroring their
behavior is a good start, and then coming up with a really quick, kino
heavy routine--something to make her see you as her collaborator in
having a crazy unforgettable time. She needs to feel like she's being
offered an adventure that she can tell her friends about the next day
so that they can say, "You did that?! You're wild!" Maybe you do this
with some sort of "dare" game: saying something like, "You are out of
your mind! I love that! But I bet you would never 'bite that girl's
ass/get that guy to buy you a drink/whatever'" And then maybe slowly
shift the dares to things she can do to you in public.
That's just an idea: I'm thinking out loud. If someone has a good

idea, I'd be up for trying it and reporting back.
Also, one other line of thinking: What does a party girl really want?
What is her ENDS VALUE? She is insecure, and badly needs social
validation. How can we become that source of social validation for
her?
Any thoughts?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Thu, 05 Jul 2001 07:44:20 GMT
subject: Re: DeepBlue's Anti-Flaking Formula
This brings up some good issues:
1. The logic of ending a good time early to keep her wanting more can
sometimes backfires when the HB was actually caught up in the moment.
It's hard to know sometimes whether to close early, or to push it. Any
suggestions?
2. Besides the option of making a second plan on the spot (which can
sound desperate if you keep mentioning it to her on the phone to get
her to hang out with you again), I would suggest doing a takeaway if
you're worried a HB will lose interest after the spell of the night is
broken. I'm not a fan of the nickname-tease, but you could do that. I
prefer leaving a story or pattern dangling. For example, as you #close
or *close, tell her you have some great advice that would help her
realize whatever dream she's confided to you that night, and you'll
tell her next time you get together.
3. Honestly, I'm less worried about women flaking than about myself
flaking. I feel like the problem with SS for me has been that
three-quarters of the #closes and *closes I do, I don't follow up on
(even when they call me) because either I'm too busy juggling others
or I don't have the patience to hang in there if it takes longer than
three times hanging-out to f-close. So I find myself not finishing
what I started too often, and then going out sarging for more. Is this
a common problem? Should I join sargers anonymous?
DeepBlue <DeepBlue@NoSpam.com> wrote in message news:<MPG.15ac581184aae58d989853@news.

earthlink.net>...
> (This is a re-post, because I just noticed the thread I posted

> it to is very old so no one will ever see it there.)

>
>
> I noticed that I myself have occasionally "flaked" with women
> (flaked from her point of view) by not calling her after I went
> to the trouble of asking her for her number. I've talked to
> women about this, and they definitely DO feel rejected when they
> have given a guy their number and he never bothers to call.
>
> By looking at why I was "flaking" with them, I gained some
> insight into the reasons why women flake as well.
--snip---
> > I'm convinced that it's the same for women. They give out their
> numbers because they genuinely are interested--right at that
> moment, but their interest is heavily supported by surrounding
> factors--by all the extras, including you being with her
> physically, face-to-face.
>
> When the "supporting factors" for her desire are suddenly
> absent, and you call her, that triggers her asking herself a
> question that becomes an obstacle--namely asking herself whether
> she is "interested enough."
>
> One solution for chicks flaking is to do what Rock Harders has
> suggested, which is to take things as far as possible with her
> right then, in the heat of the moment, by going somewhere else
> with her, and somewhere else again, till you end up someplace
> where you are kissing and having sex.
>
> Another solution is to get her number, but arrange the next get
> together in such a way that it saves her from having to ask
> herself "am I interested enough in him".
>
> You can do this by temporarily dropping back to having some
> "other reason" for getting together (something that doesn't
> revolve around you being interested in each other) and you can
> count on the fact that once you are together, your presence,
> face-to-face, will reawaken her interest so the "obstacle
> question" about her interest level never comes up.
>
> Another approach is to not only get her number, but also find
> out in advance if she'll be at some club or pub or wherever and
> then manage to run into her there. That way, you'll not only
> have your live presence working for you, but also the "extras"
> provided by the setting.
>

> DeepBlue
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sat, 07 Jul 2001 01:54:14 GMT
subject: Re: DeepBlue's Anti-Flaking Formula
Wayne and Deep Blue, good advice and answers! 'You gotta know when to
hold em, know when to fold em.'
Especially liked the comment about being pickier about who you take
numbers from: I've been getting two #s a day here, and am making plans
seven days a week. So, besides flaking often, I'm perpetually
exhausted.
Wayne, you mentioned you were in LA. Do you think it's worth starting
a new thread on sarging starf*cker HBs? Is it worthwhile trying?
DeepBlue <DeepBlue@NoSpam.com> wrote in message news:<MPG.15aeeeefdd2faf2989854@news.

earthlink.net>...
> In article <6fbd06c3.0107042344.15ff731a@posting.google.com>,
> cpowles100@hotmail.com says...
> > This brings up some good issues:
>>
> > 1. The logic of ending a good time early to keep her wanting more can
> > sometimes backfires when the HB was actually caught up in the moment.
> > It's hard to know sometimes whether to close early, or to push it. Any
> > suggestions?
>
> It depends on your definition of a good time. Lots of things
> feel good, but only some of them are anchors. Meaning, only some
> of the experiences you share with an HB will have "holding
> power". If you're a good kisser then giving her a long kiss is
> usually a powerful, memorable experience, and most chicks are
> going to want to get together with you again after that. But,
> it's not just a matter of giving her pleasure, it's a matter of
> getting her thinking about you, fantasizing about you, wanting
> and desiring you.
>
> To answer your question, I think you need to have some sense of
> where continuing things will lead. If the vibe you get from her
> makes you confident that you can take things to a more intimate
> level with her right then, you probably should. But if it looks

> like you're just going to drag things out without

> significantly escalating the excitement and intimacy, then that
> is kind of anti-climactic and will simply dampen her impulse to
> be fantasizing about you--in that case you'd be better off
> keeping things short and sweet (brief but powerful and
> memorable).
>
>
> > 2. Besides the option of making a second plan on the spot (which can
> > sound desperate if you keep mentioning it to her on the phone to get
> > her to hang out with you again)
>
> Yikes! Not on the phone dude. This isn't about having "backup"
> activities to suggest. The emphasis is on smoothly transitioning
> from one activity to another, starting from as soon as you first
> meet her if possible. For instance, you pick up a chick in a
> bookstore and you both go have a cup of coffee together, right
> then. You sit down and talk and you get closer and build
> rapport, and so she enthusiastically goes along with your
> suggestion to go somewhere else together. And so on.
>
>
> > I would suggest doing a takeaway if
> > you're worried a HB will lose interest after the spell of the night is
> > broken. I'm not a fan of the nickname-tease, but you could do that. I
> > prefer leaving a story or pattern dangling. For example, as you #close
> > or *close, tell her you have some great advice that would help her
> > realize whatever dream she's confided to you that night, and you'll
> > tell her next time you get together.
>
> That might be a bit much--telling her that I hold the secret to
> her dreams and that I'll reveal it all the next time we get
> together.
>
> However, the basic idea is on target: to come up with a
> practical reason that will serve as the basis for you two
> getting together so that when you call her later on, she doesn't
> have to agonize over whether she is "interested enough" in you
> socially. If her desire has (temporarily) subsided then then
> your phone call won't trigger her worrying over whether she
> likes you "enough." She'll have this OTHER reason for getting
> together with you, so she can relax about it. Then, when you get
> together she will naturally start to re-discover the same desire
> she felt for you before. That's it in a nutshell.
>
>

> > 3. Honestly, I'm less worried about women flaking than about myself
> > flaking. I feel like the problem with SS for me has been that
> > three-quarters of the #closes and *closes I do, I don't follow up on
> > (even when they call me) because either I'm too busy juggling others
> > or I don't have the patience to hang in there if it takes longer than
> > three times hanging-out to f-close. So I find myself not finishing
> > what I started too often, and then going out sarging for more. Is this
> > a common problem? Should I join sargers anonymous?
>
> It's true that the "anti-flaking formula" does nothing to
> address the issue of ME flaking. I think the answer to that is
> that I have to be more discriminating about who I bother to get
> numbers from.
>
> The women fall into two categories--the ones I'm interested in
> just because she's the only decent looking chick in the place
> (at a party for instance) and those that I find hot enough that
> I am sure to stay interested in her if I meet up with her again
> another time and place. The second type is the only one I should
> bother getting numbers from. But sometimes it's tough to know
> the difference in the heat of the moment. Practice makes
> perfect.
>
> DeepBlue
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sat, 07 Jul 2001 02:43:23 GMT
subject: RedBull vs. Alcohol: A field report
Okay, came up with two great things last night. The first was re:
energy drinks. The second: a good boyfriend killer. But, in the end, I
fucked up. Heres the report:
I met HB9 in a bookstore. She has a boyfriend she's very, very serious
about. But suddenly they started having major problems, and she called
and said she was upset. We went out to talk about it. In a previous
thread, someone had suggested a good pattern about people needing
multiple partners to really experience what more than one person can
give. But I had the feeling that she was too traditional to change her
whole belief system because of a single pattern. So, after other
BF-supporting (then destroying) tactics, I came up with this:

She: Everyone tells me that we should break up. I dont know, though.
He says that he thinks that everyone has several people who are right
for them, but I dont believe that. I believe that there is just one
person youre fated to be with. And what if its him?
Me: But fate works in strange ways. Think about it. Maybe you need to
make it through this relationship and out the other side in order to
find the real person youre supposed to be with. ME, I know that fate
never works how you expect it to. You may think youre fated to be with
this guy, but from what youre telling me you dont sound very happy.
Maybe you just need to learn a lesson from this relationship, so that
you can then use it to find the person who fate really wants you to be
with. ETC, ETC (of course, anchoring this to myself with gestures the
whole time)
So we hang out for a while, then head back to my house. She calls her
BF and tells him shell be over in 15 minutes. Thats bad, but I wanted
to try an experiment anyway. And I would really be curious to hear
further thoughts on this. Instead of mixing a drink (because alcohol
is a downer), I thought we would drink an energy drink (something
called Hansens NRG, which is like Red Bull). The idea is: if you drink
an energy drink (or a lot of caffeine), then your heart starts racing
and you feel excited. And if I could anchor those feelings she was
having to myself, then she would feel that I was making her excited.
It worked: because as were sitting there fluff-talking (after a good
describe-your-first-amazing-kiss pattern), she just spontaneously
leans over and hugs me, burying her face in my chest.
Now, all good. Right? But this is where I fuck up. Instead of pressing
further or lifting her face up to mine to kiss, I fear rejection and
don’t move in. (The fact that I've met her boyfriend before
didn't help either.) This is what I was thinking: Shes been stressed
out about being late to her BFs and having him mad at her, but shes
already said 100 times how im so much more fun and exciting to be
with. I figure shes going to go there, fight with him the whole time,
and think about how much more fun I am to be with. So I can try to get
her to spend the night next time, when shes not stressed out about
having to go to her boyfriends. All that would have happened last
night was that, at best, we would have *closed, then she would have
gotten neurotic afterwards and I never would get to f-close.
So the question is: Was that AFC thinking? Was I just fooling myself
because I was afraid of rejection? (Probably, huh? What should I have
done?)
(Follow up: she called me first thing the next morning saying she

wouldd like to hang out before she has to go to her boyfriends

tonight. Should I pursue or eject?)
And, more importantly, any thoughts on Red Bull vs. Alcohol???? Anyone
else want to try this and report back?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 08 Jul 2001 09:33:59 GMT
subject: Re: "the hungry dont get fed"
Right, so how about making it: "those who LOOK hungry don't get fed."
I've been thinking about this too. I've suffered a few times this week
from trying too hard, giving her too much attention, etc. So I am
thinking of trying to shift the method a little to make the HB
inititate the *close more.
So instead of thinking "the hungry don't get fed," what do you think
of laying on all the EV, patterns, and kino, but at the same time,
letting her know that I'm completely unavailable and she is completely
not my type physically. Is this in keeping with ASF philosophy, or is
it going too far?
I've been thinking this because, whenever I really want to get away
from a UG, it seems that the more I resist, the more aggressive she
becomes.
As for "desperate energy," I'm still undecided on whether this is an

advantage or disadvantage in sarging (the Scruffy thread a few days
ago makes the opposite of the argument you make: that PUA gets more EC
when not looking for it).
blscorpz@aol.com (BLscorpZ) wrote in message news:<20010707154606.10567.00003286@ng-fg1.aol.

com>...
> I'm going to throw a wrench into the belief that "the hungry dont get fed."
> because I think its only half true.
>
> I got a PUA friend (dont I have many PUA friends hehe) who recently told me, "I
> am soooo desperate! I need a woman to love!" and another PUA friend told me a
> couple weeks ago "god, I need pussy". I thought those things would come from
> AFCs, but they came from PUAs who have laid over 20 girls in the last couple
> years. They said that when they were on a dry spell. they ADMIT they are

> desperate, YET they still get fed with pussy sooner or later. so I would never
> say that the "hungry never gets fed". I mean, I was soo desperate myself after
> a three month dry spell, and the frustration put me over the top and I went out
> that night and got laid. If the statement "the hungry never gets fed" was
> true, then me and my PUA friends would still be virgins.
>
> so I think it is OK to admit to yourself and other guys that you're desperate,
> but its not OK to show your targets that you're desperate. just show her that
> you like sex. you can even use the "desperate energy" as motivation to go out,
> play the high numbers game, and work harder.
>
> this is like hunting. an hungry man will work harder to search for food and
> hone his hunting skills to maximize the amount of food he can get from his
> niche. if another man is satisfied and keeps having his food brought over by
> his mommy, how will he learn to hunt, and hone his hunting skills? suppose his
> mother dies, and he doesnt have anyone to bring food to him. who do you think
> will get the most food, the hunter with learned skills, or the spoiled mama's
> boy with no hunting skills? the hungry man DOES get fed in the end. so, I
> know this is a much better and healthier frame of mind for newbies and AFCs to
> follow than that frame of "the hungry never gets fed." granted, you still need
> a clear mind to do negs, takeaways, and teasing to APPEAR to the target that
> you're not desperate, even if you are.
>
> fake it till you make it!
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 08 Jul 2001 17:11:51 GMT
subject: Re: She's with her family...
This happened to me the other day. I was eating in a restaurant, and

this HB8.5 came in with her mother and aunt. I figure you approach
this like you would a HB hanging out with two UGs. Approach the
parents/UGs first. Talk to everyone EXCEPT the HB you want at first,
but you try to make the HB intrigued in what you're saying. Then, once
the friends/parents are comfortable with you, you try to isolate the
HB while still being friendly to their parents/friends.
So when the mother walked in and passed by table to order food, I

heard that they were speaking with an English accent. So I told the
mom that she had come to the right place, and talked about the
restaurant for a litte while. When the mom and aunt went to order
food, I talked with the daughter, who was 20. In addition to eliciting

values, I tried to elicit events (things she wanted to experience in

NY)--and, as soon as I heard my opportunity to invite her to a party
at a cool lounge I was going to the next night, I said that I was
going there and maybe she would enjoy accompanying me.
I think this worked because I made it seem to the mom and aunt like I
was doing a favor for the daughter(and of course I invited mom and
aunt, knowing they'd decline but appreciate the compliment to their
"youth"). The secret may be to earn the parent's trust and show them
your kindness, stability, and completely platonic interest in their
daughter, but not to kiss up too much to them, because if you get
along too well with a girl's parents, then you risk neutralizing the
HBs attraction to you. You still want to allow the HB to be just a
teeny bit rebellious under their parents noses, and not make her feel
like you're just another lame friend of her parents.
"Nate" <bigstud55555@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<iRR17.14765$E93.2762599@news1.telusplanet.

net>...
> Yeah, I know I posted already. Sue me. No, don't.
>
> Anyways, I was at the local pool tonight, there were TWO fine ones but both
> were with their families (parents etc.) This is bound to happen elsewhere
> too. Is there any way to make an approach without her family
> interfering/getting suspicious? How do I manage to pull her away? I know
> most parents can get kinda suspicious that their daughter's being "PU'd."
> Comments all!
>
> Nate
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 08 Jul 2001 17:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: Introducing a Great Fluff Technique
Will T. Power <sdfsadgghw34@asdf.cdas> wrote in message news:

<j1pgktgvo6b3p9mokoeph24ri3rnrn9312@4ax.com>...
>
> USW. If you were using this with a girl (which I was not) you could
> easily lead it into sexual territory while maintaining the idea that
> it was a game. And again this is an example of one of my favourite
> techniques, which is sharing an inside joke with a girl to which you
> can later refer. It's like an anchor to your own private laugh, and no
> one else gets why it's funny. It always seems to work to create an

> in-group that includes you and the chick and excludes everyone else.
> Anyway, have fun. It's addictive.
>
> -Will T. Power
With an HB, you could always, when the ideas for fights start to run
out, suggest switching it to sexual combinations.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 09 Jul 2001 08:59:09 GMT
subject: Re: Inspirational Quotes
Those who restrain desire do so because theirs is weak enough to be restrained.
--William Blake, The Marriage of Heaven and Hell
================================================================================
================================================================================
Thu, 12 Jul 2001 00:11:56 GMT
subject: Re: Asian Girls in Asia vs. Asian American Girls in USA
> But it's a whole different ballgame here in the USofA. Since I got back
> from my stint in Asia the feelings I have of being an Alpha Male have been
> transformed to an AFC'hu Male so to speak.
>
This brings up another question I've had. I'm not an Asian fetishist
type guy, but I have spent a lot of time in Asia and can speak a few
Asian languages. A few years ago, it used to be cool if you knew
something about an Asian girl in America's language and culture. Now,
I worry that when I speak their language to them or mention good
directors/writers/celebrities from their country, they get scared
because I SEEM like an Asian fetishist who's learned this stuff just
to seduce Asian women (not true!). So the question is: With Asian
girls in America or Asian American girls, is it better to show off
your wide-ranging knowledge of their culture in the early stages of a
PU or to pretend total ignorance? My worry is that, right now, Asian
girls are ultra-sensitive to guys who they think might be into them
just because they're Asian and not because of who they are as

individuals...
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 19 Aug 2001 03:22:14 GMT
subject: Dying here. Need all possible advice
I need some advice. I'm willing to try every tactic suggested,and post
a field report. The situation is this: At home in America, I'm a
RAFC+. But now I'm in the Balkans and I'm an AFC at best. The problem
is this: I have never ever seen more beautiful HB9s, 10s, and 10+s
(and total AFC guys)anywhere before. But the problem is that most of
them don't speak English. So my sarging technique basically consists
of asking, "Do you speak English?" When the answer is yes, I can have
a conversation and kino and it's amazing (but this RARELY happens).
When the answer is "no" or "a little," I'm just left in the dark and
don't know what to do.
Adding futher complication is the fact that I'm visiting a friend here
who is totally fluent. But he is such an AFC that A) When I ask him
what to do, he just says to say "Me buy drink"--and there's no way I'm
doing that and B) When I ask him to translate, he chickens out and
either won't say what I tell him to or gets scared and runs away. On
top of that, he leers at most HBs in any room, which makes matters
worse. I've been a great wingmen, sending HBs to him whenever they say
they don't speak English, and he is just unable to follow up.
So, clearly, at clubs and cafes, I need to sarge solo. But anyone have
any suggestions on what to do? I'm totally at a loss, and going out of
my mind...
(One thing I'm thinking is that through SS I've learned to sarge with
words; how can I do it with few or no words here, esp in a country
where the girls KNOW they're hot and are mostly trolling for
husbands?)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"switz" <pete@pimpstyle.com>
Tue, 21 Aug 2001 05:26:56 GMT
subject: Canadian PUAs?

anyone live in the greater vancouver/victoria area?
~switz
================================================================================
================================================================================
"pimpstylez" <pimpstylez@hotmail.com>
Fri, 24 Aug 2001 22:50:27 GMT
subject: club approaching but can't get away from fluff
Hi Guys!
After reading this group for about 3 month this is my first post.
I'm a 21 year old student, not bad looking and a total AFC till I
discovered SS for me.
I realised that I was always a nice guy and that my problems with
women
were resulting from this.I was always shy and quiet and approached
women
not often.In the last month I went out often and tried to speak with
every
girl I met.At the moment I'm becoming more secure with this, but my
problem
is when I meet a girl at a club I don't know how to get her in the
right state.
Yesterday for example I went to a big dance club.There are always many
HBs in
this club and most guys are wallflowers and total AFCs.I'm always
walking around
and speak with girls standing around or sitting at the bar.
In the beginning I was only approaching single girls, but yesterday I
approached
also some girls standing in groups of 2 or 3.
The first HB I approached was HBdance.She was there with another girl
and
both were dancing at the edge of the dancefloor.When they stopped
dancing I said
to HBdance that the club is a little bit empty today and that I it was
always
packed when I went here before.She agreed and we talked about clubs
and where she likes to go clubbing.I got good fluff talk but didn't
know what to say to get her in the right state.This is where I
stucked.I also talked to her friend,

but couldn't get away from fluff.So finally I ejected and said see you
later.
I continued walking got a drink and chatted with the female barkeeper.
Then I met 2 HBs I know from study.The came over both hugged me and we
talked a bit.I didn't talked much with them so far and it we had some
fun walking around
and talking.Then they went dancing and I went dancing with them.
It was nice but I stucked again and danced with them for an hour and
didn't approach another HB.Finally they went to the bar and I decided
to walk and continue PUing.I watched 3 HBs, 2 standing and one sitting
on a chair and after a time they changed so that always one of them
could sit down.
I walked next to them and said to the HB next to me: "You are all
waiting to sit on the chair and here is the end of the line and if I
stay here I'm the next to sit.Am I right?"
She started laughing and I got good rapport with her.We talked about
dance clubs and I tried eclecting values by asking her about her job
and what she liked about it.She liked it and was really talkactive.I
tried to talk with all of them, but didn't get much out of it.When I
meet a girl in daily life I always try to use patterns and it's
working good but they don't work in clubs.
Again I got a a lot of fluff but didn't know how to continue.
It's too loud to use patterns and I get stucked into fluff.
One funny thing was while I was talking with them an AFC was
approaching HBnext
and introduced himself to me cause he was thinking I belonged to them.
He got rejected really fast and ejected.It was fun to watch.
The HBs started to talk with each other a lot and I couln't get a good
conversation again.So I decided to eject and said see you around.
I was happy with my approaches so far cause I got over my fear of
approaching
and I started to feel more confident.But I also didn't know how to get
away from fluff talk in this club situation.
Later I approachen 2 more HBs with the "It's really empty today,This
club was always packed when I was here before."
Again I got good rapport but the same problem as before.
Suddenly I ran into the 2 HBs from study and some male friends of
them.
I introduced myself and we get sitting on a table.I acted real alpha
and started to talk with them all.This was more social proof but I
liked to impress them buy talking a lot and making jokes.Now i also
talked a lot of fluff but the situation was different then before.If I
know a HB already I can really get into this alpha state quick and
people always think I'm a real cool guy.In the end I got a lot of
social proof, some new buddys and the HBs were really cool with me.I
don't closed them cause I see them again anyway and want to use them

as pivots cause they got many HB girlfriends.

Even if I didn't get a close it was a real sucessfull evenig for
me.One month ago I was happy approaching one HB an evenig and now I'm
getting more and more secure with approaching.I also get in a good PU
state and overcome my shyness.
Maybe that was not a good example for a field report cause I couldn't
get one #close this evenig.I did much better before at partys or in
other situations but I want to get good at clubs cause there are
always a lot of HBs and I don't want to lose all my opportunities I
got there.
All HBs I approached were from 7 - 8.5.There are not many Hb9s or
HB10s
at the club and they are always surrounded by many cockblockers and
male friends.So I concentrate on the Hbs7-8.5 cause they are more
easier to approach.
I like to know if some of you guys got similar experiences and know
what is a good routine to get away from fluff talk quick and what to
say to get the girls interested in you in this danceclub situations?
pimpstylez
(newbie on a mission)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Tigerstyle" <blacktigerstyle@hotmail.com>
Sun, 26 Aug 2001 23:02:56 GMT
subject: Re: Elvis script working 4 anyone?
"Memetrace" <memetrace@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<HT6i7.162585$GN.22536328@typhoon.kc.

rr.com>...
> slam drunk <slam_drunk@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:4ec0a601.0108260509.a503dab@posting.google.com...
> > alec1976nyc@hot-spamfilter-mail.com (NYC RAFC) wrote in message
> news:<slrn9ohcd1.b34.alec1976nyc@ciao.cc.columbia.edu>...
> > > Elvis script working for anyone as an opener? I only tried it a couple
> of
> > > times. Here's one:
>>>
> > > In a museum (also hosting a party), I point my finger at a big Fidel
> > > Castro portrait (my idea was to follow up with "if Elvis was alive today
> > > he probably would look like this guy"). I say to HB8.5 standing nearby:
>>>
> > > ME: Did you know that Elvis died his hair?

> > > HB is silent, but looks at me

> > > ME: Elvis *Presley*?
> > > HB ??? (really?)
> > > ME: A friend saw it on TV and that's what (he/she) told me.
> > > He was really a dirty blond.
> > > HB stares at me.
> > > ME: I think it's just bizarre!
> > > HB (in a half-serious tone): Thanks for sharing this information with me
> > > (walks off)
>>
>>
> > Welcome to real life.
>>
>>
> > Slam Drunk
>
> Isn't that the truth..
>
> Sometimes you approach and even with a great opener they won't open up right
> away. Usually with persistance most girls will open up and talk to you. Even
> with the most innocent openers some of them will assume you are hitting on
> them. Teasing or negs are great for getting some of these hot chicks to
> lighten up and not take themselves so seriously. Were you dealing with a
> really HB like a 10?
Yeah, I agree it's all a numbers game, sometimes even a good opening
won't work and you have to just accept that- for whatever reason. But
that's fine, plenty of fish in the sea, and a good line will have to
work on some of them right? What I'm wondering is why Didn't he start
with the "if Elvis was alive today, he'd probably look like that guy"
line, and then work Mystery's Elvis routine in from there. That would
have been more humorous, given her a chance to laugh, and probably
would have been less likely to scare her off.
-Tigerstyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 26 Aug 2001 23:25:44 GMT
subject: Re: Cell phone strategy
Omp <no.one@no.com> wrote in message > No responce. She has my number and caller-ID. Of course, I don't
> expect her to call back. So, do you have any suggestions on what to do

> ? I thought that should I wait 2 days, call back and if there is still
> no responce SMS her. What to write in SMS ?
>
> a)something like I'll call you tomorrow at 7 pm
> b)structure an opportunity for meeting offering time
> c)simple 'Call me'
>
> P.S. When is the best time to call ? I usually call chicks early in
> evening (6-7pm).
Yes, give her one, maybe two more chances- leave a message (the "a"
above is probably best- it's less passive than the other two), after
that if she doesn't answer/call back, then toss her number. You don't
need a chick who disrespects you or won't make herself availble to
you. Especially if she's only a 7. Whatever you do, don't look
desperate in front of a 7. Luck.
-TigerStyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 28 Aug 2001 00:18:19 GMT
subject: field report with #closes
This is a newbie field report.Not so long but maybe also helpfull

for all the newbies out there.I'm also thankfull for any advises
from anybody what to do better for the next time.
I was going to the city today to get some things done
and do a little bit of shopping.I didn`t go there only for
PU but was in a real confident mood and wanted to collect some
field experience.First HB crossed my ways when I was using the train.
HBtrain(HB 8) was sitting when I entered the train.I sat opposite to
her and thought about an opener.I needed 10 seconds(broke the 3 second
rule but
anyway) and asked her then with a smile and friendly tone:
"I got to go to the bank.Do you know how long it's open today?"
(Maybe a little bit lame for an opener but better than nothing)
Her: "I don't know exactly but I think till 6."
Me: "Thank you!You know, It's important that I get to the bank today
and it would be a pity if it is closed already.By the way what are you
going
to do in the city?"
Her: "I got to go to shopX.Cause I test shops as a part time job.But I

don't
know exactly where the shop is."
Me: "Oh.Your lucky, I know the shop.I can show you the way then!"
Her:"Thank you.That's great!"
Me: "So what you do when you don't test shops?"
Her: "Study X"
Me: "Oh cool.That's interesting.What are your reasons for study X?"
Her: blah,blah...
From this moment on I did a lot of electing values.Asking about her
interests.What she likes, where she lives and where she likes to go
out.
Found out she lives in my town and likes to go to bars and small
clubs.
Then the train stopped and we walked to the shop she needed to go to.
She was happy that I helped her and I thought about closing.
Me:"That was really nice to talk to you.So you said you like to go to
bars.
What you think about when we go to a bar and get something to drink
someday?"
Her: "That would be cool"
Me"So just gimme your number and I call you!"
Her:"Ok.I got a pan and paper."
She writes down her number and I give her mine after she asked.
Me"Ok, I got to go.See you!"
She"See you"
Maybe not the perfect #close cause I was always thinking to much what
to do next and how to close but finally got the number and thats ok.
Next HB was HBshoe(HB 8.5).I met her in a store I went in to buy new
shoes.
She jobbed in the store and she showed me the shoe department.
She asked what kind of shoes I liked and started showing me different
ones.
She was very sweet funny and friendly.So I started to asked her about
her day
how she likes her work and what she does for living.
We talked about 15 minutes.I tried different shoes and finally found
some good ones.
I also asked her what shoes she likes and she tried some and we were
joking
around a little bit.When I bought the shoes we talked about clubs and
going
out and I was going for the number:
Me:"What clubs you go to by the way?"
Her:"I like to go to club X!They play real cool music there."

Me:"Me to.That's a great club.I go there often with my friends and we

always have a lot of fun.So maybe we can go there together someday."
Her:"Yeah.That would be cool"
Me:"So, gimme your number and I call you next time I go there"
Her:"Ok.Here is my number!"
With both #closes got no resistance from the HB to gimme their #.

Sometimes it seems to be so easy!
That was it!2 #closes and it was not as difficult as I thought first.
I really start to like this shit.I didn't use much NLP or SS but just
with confidence and straight talk got the girls interested and I got
the #s.A good day for me and I hope you guys like my field report.
I'm trying to improve my style everyday and the results are getting
better and
better.I think I wait one/two weeks and call them then for a real
"nice" evening!
Anyway I keep on sargin and look forward to my first FC.
pimpstylez
(newbie on a mission)
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 28 Aug 2001 01:07:36 GMT
subject: Re: I've reached a dead-end! (Long)
"blfcd" <blfcd@soon.com> wrote in message news:<3B8A96D8.MD-1.4.4.blfcd@soon.com>...
> No-one seems to undersand my problem (not even my closest friends), an in all
> honnesty nor do I anymore. Something that should be so simple, is proving to
> be the hardest part of my life. I have tried, tried and tried again, and to no
> avail.
Well, you're definitely suffering from a lack of confidence. I bet

it's probably showing too.
It's been said before, and I'm going say it again: It's not only what
you do, it's also HOW you do it. Confidence is the magic key in my
opinion. It's not any one kind of guy that women go for. Artists,
musicians, doctors, laywers, business men, and military all get women
because they ooze confidence. It really doesn't matter all that much
if you try and try and try, but come off every time as desperate or
needy. Women won't go for that. They want a guy with a take charge

sort of attitude. You gave an example of saying "Hi" to a girl who

ignored you, so you tried to say "Hi" again. In a small way even that
might have been supplication, as she may have percieved that you NEED
acknowledgement from her. It would have been better to say "Well,
someONE's not in a good mood today!" and then YOU ignore HER. Anyway,
take this advice for what it' worth, and luck, bro.
-TigerStyle
"Life's too short to dance with ugly women".
================================================================================
================================================================================
Fri, 28 Sep 2001 18:58:39 GMT
subject: Re: performance anxiety
This is an interesting thread. I've found that, while asf tactics have
worked amazing wonders for me, they've hurt a little too. For some
reason, every now and then, just after I meet a chick (especially a
quieter one who's waiting for me to set the pace of the convo), I'll
be shuffling so many scripts and routines through my head, trying to
find the right one to say to get her hooked, that I'll just end up
silent, not saying a thing, whereas in my afc days i would have at
least kept the conversation going. Does anyone else have the problem
of trying to think of the right ASF thing to do--instead of just
doing?
Also, Capitol, here's something to think about: You are only as good
as your self-esteem. You need to find a way to raise your self-esteem
when you're talking with other people. It seems to me that you're
afraid of rejection or losing, that you're too hard on yourself. I
know it won't do any good to tell you the old and very true cliches
that he who doesn't try never wins, that one success is worth twenty
failures. Instead, try to do two things: next time you're very
comfortable being yourself and being assertive and in control around
someone (a younger sibling, an ex-girlfriend, an underclassman or
coworker), try to remember what that feels like, and when you go out
sarging, treat that HB like that person you're comfortable with, where
you have the attitude that: you don't need their respect, but they
want yours. Also, start small: try the Svengali challenge (going out,
smiling, and just saying hi to 10 HBs). You'll find that rejection
doesn't come near as often as you think it will.
Finally, people are very responsive to your signals and expectations.

So don't expect rejection, because then you're going to act

tentatively and get what you expect. Expect success, and you'll be
amazed how often it comes.
> capitol <capitol101@hotmail.com> wrote in article

> <69ced46f.0109271303.39d2313c@posting.google.com>...
> > I have recently found out that I do badly with chicks b/c I have
> > severe performance anxiety (not just chicks, about everything for
> > which I have to "perform" - tests, computer games, sports, etc). Does
> > anyone have any experience with this or now how to cope with it? I
> > read the online help, but the problem is that I don't really seem to
> > have all the 'inner talk' they speak of on which the cure system is
> > built.. and neither does changing beliefs or EFT seem to work.
>>
> > Capitol
>>
================================================================================
================================================================================
Fri, 28 Sep 2001 19:35:50 GMT
subject: Tactics That Worked
Just back to sarging after a LTR and long trip, and decided to get
back into ASF gear at a party last night. I tried some tactics that
worked amazingly, and had a few refinements of other tactics. The
party was at a roller skating rink, full of trendy HBs in skimpy
little roller outfits. And it was amazing, because it was so easy to
initiate convo when you're in a situation like this: a friendly neg
hit about an HBs coordination on wheels, or just bumping into someone
on the dance floor. Anyways, here are stories of three #closes and one
observation:
1. # close 1: HB8Plastic I'd seen in a bar before, but never talked to

her. She was memorable because she was hot, but something really
looked plastic surgery about her face. So the opening was easy
("weren't you in the XXXX bar the other night"). Anyway, after fluff
talk and patterns, I suggested we spend some time together since we
seem to always end up at the same places anyway. So she said, "Sure,
give me your number." Instead of using one of the lines I've learned
here to get her number, I tried something else and it worked
AMAZINGLY. I just said, "Okay." She grabbed a club flyer and gave it

to me. I tore it in half, and gave her one half. Then I borrowed a pen
from a girl standing nearby, wrote my number on my half of the flyer
and then handed her the pen. She of course wrote down her number and
email. The point here is, instead of trying to talk her into giving me
her number, I just put her in the position of being OBLIGATED to give
me her number. If she has the paper and pen in her hand, what else is
she going to do (unless she's a total bitch).
2. # close 2: This one is where ASF really paid off. I got a ride home
with HB8.5Energy, a totally thin cute party girl. A mutual friend had
introduced us, so we felt pretty comfortable together and had a lot of
kino on the skating rink. When she dropped me off, I asked for her
number. She said, "Give me your number. I never give guys my number."
THen I did something I never would have done before ASF. I said,
"That's funny, I never give girls my number either," and walked off.
The next day I wondered if I'd been totally rude. But rudeness worked.
I got this message on my answering machine: "Hey Chris, guess who?
It's the girl who's not going to give you her phone number. I was
thinking about it, and I perhaps didn't come across as very good
yesterday because it's just a natural reaction when guys in the past
have asked me for my number. But thinking about it, it was rude, and
you're good and I know you're not being creepy and have some ulterior
motive...If I came off bitchy, that's not what I wanted to do. I had a
lot of fun and I'm calling to give you my number, if you still want
it. I had such a long day, but I kept thinking, 'I gotta call Chris,
gotta call Chris.' It's been on my mind all day." And then she gave me
her home phone AND cell phone. (She must have gotten my number from
our mutual friend.) So, chalk one up for ASF, because I know that if I
had just given her my number like an AFC, she NEVER would have called.
3. Close #3: I collided (accidentally, really) into a totally cute

HB8Scrawny on the rink. In that moment, though, I made sure our eyes
met and I smiled, and she returned the gaze and smile. Later, when I
saw her off the rink, I apologized, and we talked, and I ran a sort of
meant-to-be pattern on the spot, saying that maybe this wasn't an
accident, that maybe we were thrown together in this unusual way by
fate, didn't she sort of feel a tingle of energy run through her body
when our eyes met (and then I offset the cheesiness with a joke that
maybe that tingle of energy was just pain from the head-on collision),
and finally suggested we get together some time and see if it was
meant to be. This was my corniest #close, and I only think it worked
because she was actually interested in me already (after we crashed, I
noticed that she kept looking over at me).
4. Mirroring: Maybe I haven't read the entire archive, but it seems

that whenever we talk about mirroring, it's about physical mirroring

and imitating movements and gestures. I noticed too that vocal

mirroring works amazing, and lets you create a world with an HB. If
she talked fast and excited, I'd talk fast and excited; if she talked
slow and mysterious, I'd talk slow and mysterious. And I noticed that
this created instant rapport, that she'd automatically assume we had a
lot in common because our energy level and speech patterns were the
same. Maybe this is an old ASF thought, but thought I'd share it
anyway.
Anyways, that's my report. It's the 'when it rains it pours'

phenomenon. I'm sure I could have more #closes that night. And it's
not because I was 'on,' it's probably because a lot of HBs saw me
kinoing with HBEnergy on the roller rink.
Comments/suggestions/refinements appreciated and welcome.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sat, 29 Sep 2001 03:51:04 GMT
subject: Re: Asian Babes
"sterobin" <sterobin@onetel.net.uk> wrote in message news:<3bb4d4ae@news-uk.onetel.net.uk>...

>
> I've tried to contact her since I've been back and got only negs from her.
> Very puzzling.
>
Yeah, this has happened before. It can mean one of two things:
1. She has a boyfriend, and just wanted a quick fling with no follow
up.
2. She was hot for you in the moment. But once it was over, she felt
guilty or ashamed or just simply forgot those feelings she had for you
at the time. I've noticed one problem with ASF tactics sometimes is
that they assume that you're just going to keep getting a girl hotter
and hotter and hotter until she's going crazy. But sometimes there's
just a moment (or a certain night) when she lets go of her taboos and
is ready, and if you let that moment or night pass without seizing the
opportunity, you're lost. (In other words, you should have taken her
to the lavatory and joined the mile high club.)
================================================================================

================================================================================
Sun, 30 Sep 2001 18:47:25 GMT
subject: Re: Tactics That Worked
A FOLLOW UP AND A GREAT QUOTE FOR THE ARCHIVES
exoticoption@hotmail.com (exoticoption) wrote in message news:<4d0ba53e.0109291127.20cb451c@posting.

google.com>...
> Great fuckin report Chris. Some things, let us know if your technique
> with HB plastic worked. I have a feeling the whole conversational "no,
> but you can give me yours" works because it shows the chick YOU are in
> control. while when you were writing down yours, by accepting her
> request, she could have been thinking (oh there goes another chump.)
Seeing HBPlastic tomorrow. I'll let you know what happens. In the
meantime, here's a follow-up for the disaster file.
I went out with HBScrawny last night, and we had an amazing time.
Everything went perfect. We started out the night talking and drinking
at my house, and I did a lot of listening to what was wrong with her
last boyfriend and what she wanted, and then reflected what she wanted
back to her. Then, we went out to a local bar and I proved myself to
be a fun alpha guy (which I usually am not). At the jukebox, there was
a crazy hippie girl there. We talked her into putting our favorite
songs on the jukebox, and then danced with her. The hippie girl was
super physical, and kept giving me the doggie dinner bowl look and
holding my hands. And because I was getting all this attention (and
I'm really only average looking), I noticed another girl in a corner
giving me the look. I motioned for her to join us, and she did. Now, I
don't know if this was right, but I kept my attention on HBScrawny all
night and didn't go for closes with any of the other girls (even
though hippie girl tried to tongue me later), because I didn't want to
seem like a scumbag--just a guy who likes to have a good time. Was
this right?
Anyway, the bar closes and I bring HBScrawny back to my house for
another drink. Now, as I said at the top of this post, I just got out
of a relationship with an insanely jealous girl and am still trying to
get my RAFC sea legs back. So, we walk into my bedroom, and who should
be there but MY EX (an HB9.9 who is so perfect-looking that I dated
her much longer than I should have). Now, the only reason my ex showed
up was because she must have known I was out with a girl and wanted to
fuck up my game. So the Ex yells at poor HBScrawny, and HBScrawny runs
out of the house. The rest of this tragic night I will keep to myself,
but suffice it to say that I followed this advice, which I read

recently in a 19th century book (it's a little misogynist, so ignore

that part and check out the advice). One of the main characters is
telling another how he keeps his tempermental wife obedient:
"Human ingenuity, my friend, has hitherto only discovered two ways in

which a man can manage a woman. One way is to knock her down--a method
largely adopted by the brutal lower orders of the people, but utterly
abhorrent to the refined and educated classes above them. The other
way (much longer, much more difficult, but in the end no less certain)
is never to accept provocation at a woman's hands. It holds with
animals, it holds with chilren, and it holdw with women, who are
nothing but children grown up. Quiet resolution is the one quality the
animals,t he children, and the women all fail in. If they can once
shake this superior quality in their master, they get the better of
him. If they can never succeed in disturbing it, he gets the better of
them."
So, in other words, I refused to be provoked, no matter how hard she

tried (and I have the bruises on my body to prove it). So now I'm
faced with two problems:
1. What do I tell HBScrawny, or should I just give it up with her?

2. How do you go back to sarging with an ex-LTR who is so jealous that
even after the relationship, she still can't stand you sleeping with
other people?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 30 Sep 2001 19:37:31 GMT
subject: Re: Tactics That Worked
A note on my previous post:
Just so you know, this isn't a case of me trying to start dating one
day after breaking up or not being clear with my ex. We've been broken
up for a few months, and she has in fact already started dating, so it
really is a case of extreme, irrational post-breakup jealousy. Anyone
else ever had a nightmare cockblock or sarging obstacle like this?
(I've already taken one precaution since the last email and changed my
locks.)
BTW, ASF helped me invaluably before the relatinship and now it's been
really key to building up my self-esteem to go sarging again after a

destructive relationship like this one. So thanks!
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 01 Oct 2001 05:02:18 GMT
subject: Re: exoticoptions field report
exoticoption@hotmail.com (exoticoption) wrote in message news:<4d0ba53e.0109301005.639f12d6@posting.

google.com>...
>
> I do so without problem and while talking to her I also engage nearby
> standing wing, describing him the approach with the two chicks a
> second ago (to get her to see how I DON’T need her and I’m
> in control of my shit.) Then I began just talking to HB7, kinoing (as
> I was used to). I do a first neg by squeezing her belly and commenting
> on how I thought she had taken a passion for eating (in reality
> she’s hot, just thought advantageous to use negs in case of a
> shield were to form up.) Just a little while after I re-neg by
> flashing some gum in front of her (without saying a word) while she
> was babbling about God knows what.
>
> [OBSERVATION:Guys this is something that I’ve realized. I
> remembered Mystery mentioning this, but he suggested not to neg girls
> that don’t have the super-attitude. I found the negs to be
> really breaking down on girls confidence,..i’ve negged a whole
> bunch of girls that I engaged convos with.]
> While she was playful about it, she complained on how I was
> “such an asshole,” first with the beingfat-joke and now
> implying that she had bad breath ecc.. So guys, beware, negs are
> powerful weapons that should be used only with the appropriate ladies
> (8 and aboves), see the scale above for detail.
>
Good post and good observations. One thing, though. Neg hits shouldn't
be straight-out insults (and, of course, they should only be for HB9s
and 10s who can handle them). If she calls you an asshole, you're
laying it on too hard: AFCs who can't pick up hot chicks usually end
up calling them a bitch or ugly, so they're used to that. What you
want to do is be more subtle. So instead of pinching her belly and
saying she eats too much, say something like, "Is that the new
fashion, for shirts to be so tight around here?" and then touch her
belly. All you want to do is throw her off guard a little, off her HB
high horse, and prove that you have high standards, not like the other
AFC animals in the bar. The gum bit is good. But here's your problem

with that: don't do it while she's talking. This may indicate that
you're not listening or paying attention, and that's bad. Instead,
after you've responded, pull out a pack of gum, offer her a piece, and
then take one for yourself. Don't say that she has bad breath: let her
get paranoid about it (after all, if she's been drinking, she's
probably worried about that). Actually, the gum bit is a really great
neg hit: it'll get her a little embarrassed, which is great, and may
even discourage her from talking to other guys. I will have to try
this one, if you don't mind. (Of course, the only problem is that if
she thinks she has bad breath, it'll be hard getting a *close that
night.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 01 Oct 2001 05:21:29 GMT
subject: New Thoughts on Supplication
I was talking to a psychologist today, and he gave me a different idea

of why not supplicating works, especially when YOU get the girl to buy
you a drink or do something for you.
I may not be remembering this right, but he said: when you do

something for a HB, she will think that you're a sucker or at best a
nice guy. But if you can get her to do something for you, it makes her
more attached to you and bonded to you. Also, it plants the seed in
her mind that it is easy to do a small favor or kindness for you, so
that when you ask her to do something else for you (like going some
place quiet) she will be less likely to offer resistance. So the
message is: not only should we not supplicate, but we should try to
make the girl supplicate to us (even if it's just in a small way it
establishes some power over her).
BUT, on the other hand, I often talk to girls who've been out on a
date, and the guy has paid for everything that she feels obligated to
fool around with him. The psychologist said that this kind of
supplication works because there are expectations involved: the girl
knows that if she lets you take her out and pay for the meal, she's
expected to do something in return. Now, I do not date and do not pay
(unless I'm already in a relationship), but is this something to be
considered here? When an AFC buys an HB a drink, she's obligated to
talk to him a little (before blowing him off for a real PUA). So does
it stand to reason that excessive dating/supplication is how AFCs get
laid (by making the girl feel obligated and guilty if they don't)?

================================================================================
================================================================================
"christopher powles" <CPowles100@hotmail.com>
Mon, 01 Oct 2001 17:23:03 GMT
subject: Re: How do I change my appearance ?
>
> Case in point, me and my two friends Ed and Steve, We go to the local
> topless bar to hand out money. There is this chick, a customer, prolly bi,
> She is sitting at the table in front of us with two guys, well the guys
> leave (restroom break, whatever) , she turns to me and asks me if I will
> watch her purse while she goes to the bathroom. Now I have not said word
> one to this girl, but just by looking at me, the way I am dressed, and my
> dimeanor, she can tell that I am harmless. WTF ????
>
Dude,
Try looking at this way. She waited until her guy friends left, and
then turned to talk to you. Sure, maybe she thought you were a nice
guy, but she clearly wanted to meet you and talk to you. Otherwise, it
would have been very easy for her to take her purse to the bathroom by
herself. This is a total PUA tactic: I always ask a hot girl to watch
my stuff while I go to the bathroom or into the pool or whereever, to
set it up so that I can talk to them when I come back.
Think about it Grim Reaper: you're sitting there worrying about how
YOU look and appear when, if you paused for a moment and got outside
of your worries, you would have realized that a girl in a strip club
was hitting you--and a bi one who's probably a lot of fun, too. Even
if by some small miracle she WASN'T really hitting on you, assume that
she was and proceed accordingly. Sure, work out: but not to attract
chicks, just to feel better about yourself. The fact is that looking
like a nice guy can work too, because it makes chicks lower their
defenses.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 01 Oct 2001 17:45:26 GMT
subject: Re: New Thoughts on Supplication

Making a
> direct SOI too early on can kill things off - especially if you haven't
> negged first. Best use an indirect SOI, or 101 routine to do the job early
> on.
>
> Any time a chick sees us making an attempt to "get her", she's immediately
> controlling us already - therefore, she loses interest quick.
This is a really good point, Rio!
> The trick to doing this requires some damn good acting! I mean... making the
> negs sound accidental, like they weren't supposed to come out the way they
> did... and then looking confused as to why she acts the way she does when
> you've negged her. Also, acting like you are confused and shy yourself when
> she negs/teases you!
> When a 10s sexual control mechanism ISN'T working on you - you are the guy
> she can't control!
And, Rio, this is EXACTLY how Tony Curtis (or whoever) gets Marilyn
Monroe in "Some Like It Hot." As I remember it, he pretends like he
has no feeling anymore, and can't even feel any sensation on his lips
when someone kisses him. So Marilyn Monroe tries. And when she asks
him if he felt anything, he says, "Nothing." So she keeps trying
harder and harder. Of course, it's just a movie, but it does reinforce
your point: present their sexual control mechanism with a challenge.
Thus, they feel like they must seduce you in order to prove their
sexual powers TO THEMSELVES. This is another good point, Rio, and I'll
have to think of it this way next time I'm out sarging (which will be
tonight!).
>>
> The reciprocation thing will quite easily work on chicks who would be OK
> about prostituting themselves. Unless you want a chick like that, stay away
> from paying for shit.
> The guy with NO DESIRE for her cannot be controlled.

> That's why it's essential to not tell a 10 that you love her. That's why the
> sex has to seem "accidental" or "just happen". That's why 10s have to be
> kicked out of your house in the morning.
>
This is true. But it's easier said than done sometimes. I'm finding,
now that I'm back out sarging, that with the total HB10s, sometimes
I'm so amazed that I'm talking to them and it's working that I start
to get nervous and blow it. Just being nervous or not comfortable
around a HB10, no matter what you're saying, shows them they have
power over you. I sometimes try to look for small ugly features and

obsess on then in order to keep the upper hand mentally, but

sometimes, when a girl's just my type, I get nervous and blow it. Any
suggestions, Rio, for keeping your cool when SSing a super-hot HB, for
not letting the fact that inside you're dying of lust (and surprise
that she's beginning to get hot for you) show on the outside?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 02 Oct 2001 17:27:26 GMT
subject: Re: exoticoptions field report
Exoticoption, thanks, and definitely post a field report after your

next night out. Until then, here's a good neg hit/bitch shield
deflector for the road (which I cut and pasted from an old thread,
courtesy of Michael S I think). Let us know how it goes!
TO TURN OFF BITCH SHIELD (AFTER SHE CATCHES YOU MAKING EC AND TURNS
HER NOSE UP):
Keep a couple of lint balls or little pieces of string in your pocket.
Then, when you receive one of those "Fuck You" looks... Palm one of
the dust bunnies and walk right up to her and say "Excuse me", then
act like you are removing it from her face, hair, or clothes. Then
show her the lint ball. This has a way of frying her brain and
bringing the sheild ALL THE WAY DOWN. Just before that happened, she
saw herself as THE PRIZE and YOU as some sort of STALKER or something.
Faced with the realization that she was actually looking like some
sort of ASSHOLE walking around with a lint ball stuck to her face, NOW
she is not sure what to make of you. You have just saved her from
looking like an asshole. In all probability she will FEEL like an
asshole for misjudging you. Usually, right after you "Remove" the lint
ball and show it to her, she will laugh and bring the shield down.
NOW, you can have a conversation with her as one human to another.
Michael S.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 03 Oct 2001 17:42:14 GMT
subject: Re: I need replies
I think that you are too nervous, that you're too intimidated around

such a beautiful woman (even your writing style is nervous). And I

think that when you're nervous and uncomfortable, the person that
you're with becomes nervous and uncomfortable. And that discourages
her from wanting to be with you.
So, all you need to do is to find a way to be comfortable around

beautiful women. But that's easier said than done. There's Svengali's
Challenge (which Fatass turned me on to--thanks!), but I think you
need some more basic psychological reprogramming. Anyone have any
ideas?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Thu, 04 Oct 2001 21:44:46 GMT
subject: Mystery's Basic Training
Has anyone here taken Mystery's Basic Training course? Can anyone
recommend it? Did anyone get results or learn techniques that helped
them sarge on their own afterwards?
For me, I'd just love some experience in the clubs with a PUA I
respect; to get over any lingering shyness I still have; and to have
someone give me some feedback on my style and sticking points. So,
that said, is this worth an RAFC paying for?
[Also, when you respond, please keep in mind that I do not care
whether Ross, Mystery, or Ray's methods are better; I do not care who
gets laid more; I don't care which one of them is for real and which
is a poser; I don't want to start one of these ugly flaming wars we
get bogged down in in this otherwise great newsgroup. They've all got
good ideas and they all get laid (I hope). Thanks.]
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 09 Oct 2001 10:50:41 GMT
subject: Double Field Report: Double Suggestions Needed
Okay, two HBs, two good times, but...a couple mistakes...:
Three days ago, my friend saw three super-hot HBs at a restaurant late

at night but was too shy to talk to them and get them to come to this
party he was having. I noticed that every guy in the room kept coming
up to them, and getting shot down. I went up and said something like,
"I know this is going to sound like a cliché, especially after
watching what you guys have been going through tonight, but my friend
over there is a little shy and wants to invite you to a party he is
having at xxxxxx." Then I paused, "God, Im so embarrassed. This
probably sounds cheesy. But he really means it." Honestly, it was a
terrible approach, and I was just doing my friend a favor. But, for
some reason, one of the girls asked me to sit down at the empty fourth
spot at the table, which was awesome, because now I was sitting there
watching guys come up and crash and burn. Their bitch shields were up
super-high, and they were being very sarcastic, but I negged a little
and just didnt care and sort of became one of them, making fun of the
AFCs. My friend, in the meantime, ran away like a wuss. I #closed with
the hottest girl there, HBFFrosted (HB9.5), a model with just an
amazingly cool look: frosted hair, skinny, leggy, and super-aloof. I
left the restaurant, and believe it or not the girls actually showed
up at the party.
At the party, I had another girl, an ex-stripper (HB8), who was thin,
arty looking, and with a really well-defined facial structure with
makeup that almost made her face look like a beautiful statue. She
attached herself to me, and we just didnt stop talking. If I went away
to talk to other people, she would just wait for me and shoo away
other guys. So when the three HBs came to the party, I just said hi,
introduced them to some of my friends, and then proceeded to ignore
them and focus on HBExstripper, who said she was trying to start a
modeling agency (whatever, but it means she has a lot of great friends
to meet). She is giving me TONS of kino, holding my hand and putting
her hand on my chest. Then, HBExstripper says she has to go to the
bathroom and asks me to walk her there. We walk there, and I go in
with her. She drops her pants and pees with me in the room. Then we
stand and talk in the bathroom for a little while. I probably should
have made my move here, but it just seemed strange after she had just
urinated. Any thoughts on how to start making out in the
girl-takes-you-to-the-bathroom-and-pees-in-front-of-you situation
(which I seem to get into a lot)?
Anyway, it feels like it is on anyway, especially since her friend is

already making out with one of my friends. We step outside and the
three girls say bye to me. I just wave to them and dont really pay
much attention because HBExstripper and I are in deep kino and
conversation. Then the boyfriend of HBExstripper calls. She ignores
it, but I see her posture grow distant and her arms fold across her
chest. Then he calls again, and she answers it. After they talk, when

I talk to her, the vibe and kino is gone. She and her friend (whose
boyfriend is also calling on HBExstrippers phone) say they have to
leave. I #close with a quick, totally inadequate *close. Now, clearly
both she and her friend were ready for an f-close, but the boyfriends
kept calling and scared them off. Boyfriend destroyers, I felt, would
have been useless, because they were ready to cheat, so what should I
have done here? Any suggestions? Also, now that I have the cell
number, how should I handle calling her and making plans when her
boyfriend might be with her?
Okay, onto HBFrosted. We went out tonight. I brought some friends, and
she brought along a friend who was a bit of a bore and kept wanting to
go home. I disarmed the friend pretty good, and spent a lot of time
talking to her, but she kept trying to get HBFrosted to go home. Also,
all night, HBFrosted was super aloof, and shooting down guys left and
right who came up to her, but I refused to let it intimidate me. I
kind of had her figured out. At some point, when we were alone, I
commented on how probably a lot of guys think she is a bitch, but I
can tell she is just a quiet type who likes to be an observer, to
watch people and listen to them and sort of mentally process the
information and learn from it. This starts a really good conversation
that ends up with her telling me that my star sign is the one that is
supposed to educate her star sign (a good place for me to improvise
and incredible connection type of pattern). Finally, we have bonded.
She also says she got out of a long relationship a year ago, and is
not looking to get trapped in a relationship again, which is
encouraging for me because I have a really great response for this.
Then the friend says she really wants to go home. HBFrosted says she
is going to drop her friend off, and then call me to see where Im at.
So Im with my friends at a bar, its dead because its Monday, and she
meets me there. We sit and talk for a little while. As we are exiting,
I ask if she can give me a ride home because my friends want to stay
out. I live half an hour away and she says she is going in the other
direction and really has a lot of work to do the next day (which is
actually true, but its also a cop out). So then (and this is where I
need help) I get stuck and cant figure out a way to get us alone. The
signs are good, and there is kino and rapport, but I could not
escalate it to a *close or more. She still drifts into being aloof
when Im not heavy rapport-building and intensely patterning. When we
part and it comes time to say goodbye, she offers me her cheek. I can
tell that a *close is out of the question, though definitely enough
rapport is built to hang out again. My question here is this: I feel
like she gave me a good opportunity, coming back without her friend.
At the same time, I can tell she gets hit on and used for her looks a
lot, so making any sort of direct move on her would have been a

problem. Any suggestions for how I should have handled this situation
and, especially, how I could have escalated it beyond kino and rapport
to a more romantic close? How I could have stood out more from all the
OTHER guys as someone she wants to get physical with? I will probably
see her again when she is back or Im in her town, but I definitely
wanted to seal the night better and bond her closer to me, because
shes definite MLTR material.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Thu, 11 Oct 2001 10:56:02 GMT
subject: Re: Double Field Report: Double Suggestions Needed
Aarin, your observations are perfect. You nailed exactly what worked
and what went wrong and, in the bigger picture, nailed my strengths
and weaknesses. I especially appreciate the advice about HBFrosted,
in turning an obstacle to an advantage when something doesn't work.
Also, I totally failed in not getting something started in the
bathroom--why else would she bring me in there? I wish I had you
whispering these things in my ear, then maybe I'd have a lay report
instead. I'll update on HBFrosted, who I'm supposed to see on
Saturday.
And, Fatass, good stuff too. And it is odd how often the bathroom
thing happens: one time, I went in a bathroom with a girl I had just
met on Halloween, and she says, "want to see my piercing," while she's
sitting on the toilet. Then she spread her legs to show me a clitoral
ring (or whatever you call it). There are some CRAZY HBs out there.
You've got to spend some time sarging here or in New York!
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sat, 13 Oct 2001 12:07:39 GMT
alan@sci-log.apana.org.au (Alan Palmer) wrote in message news:<ac5aed8d.0110111930.1c87a801@posting.

google.com>...
> Until last night, this situation - chick peeing while I watch -
> would've dumbfounded me.

>
> Last night, I hooked up with a 30 yo bi-chick (6 face, 8 body, 9
> attitude) who is into watching hard-core porn and pissing games,
> among other things.
I'd assume this is a case where you made the approach, but she took
over from there. Or did you lay on any good ASF routines or SOIs?
>
> In the cubicle of the male toilets at a bar, at her request, I
> let her hold my cock while I peed. Then she deep-throated me
> while she got herself off, then she took my fingers amd jammed
> them in her pussy while she got herself off again. All while guys
> are going in and out of neighboring cubicles.
>
> Sex in toilets isn't my scene, but I like her so I thought: as long
> as we don't get caught, and observe some basic hygiene-related
> precautions, why not?
>
> I've never met a chick this raunchy or kinky before. For example,
> she was amazed when I said I'd never done a scene with two other
> chicks. She told me she has strong visual turn-ons. I know she
> loves it when I talk about fucking other chicks and when I
> describe all the slippery details (ie when I help her visualise
> the scene). I got her sopping wet doing this (and by applying
> lots of kino as well).
>
> She's mostly into chicks, but she sometimes likes the right
> kind of guy (arty, intelligent, strong hints of sexual aggression
> as well as vulnerability). She's also fascinated by male porn
> stars.
You can be so set up if you work this right. A friend of mine is in
this situation: he's dating a girl like yours (6 face, 8 body, 10
attitude). And all he does is take her to a club or party, and she
just picks up women left and right for them. I've seen her in action:
she's like a sexual predator. And all the women she picks up are 9s
and 10s (as I'm sure your girl does). Then she takes them back to his
house, and the three of them have a good time. This could obviously
be a great situation for you. Be that kind of guy she likes, and let
her know that with you, her sexual horizons are going to be wider as a
team with you than they would be if she was just on her own.
>
> Getting back to your case. Chicks don't do anything like this
> by accident. If a chick pees in front of you, she's giving you
> a strong message IMHO.
>

> Maybe she's letting you know she's into kinky stuff like pissing
> games, or maybe she's letting you know she's ready to fuck. It's
> up to you to find out.
>
> What I'd do, in your situation, is make a comment on the
> situation and ask her how much she likes pissing in front of guys.
> I'd get her talking about what she likes sexually, and I'd tell
> her how much I get turned on by a chick who is confident enough
> to *show* me what she likes, especially all her kinks.
Yes, good stuff. I will definitely turn the talk to reinforcing her
confidence and discussing sexual preferences, instead of trying to
hang out in the bathroom and just play it cool. I'm guessing from your
post (wild chicks in bathroom stalls, acting scenes, etc.) that you're
in LA.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 14 Oct 2001 22:50:07 GMT
> The thing about bi chicks, I'm discovering, is that they operate
> outside the rules. So much is possible with them. Gays think they
> are cowards, afraid to come out completely. Straights think they
> are really queer. Bi girls get attacked from both sides.
>
> I would love to work up a game for bi chicks. But how to meet them?
> Flirt with "gay" chicks and see which ones respond well?
I think you may be on to something here. There has to be a better way.

What we need is a script to EV. It's tricky territory. I've dated bi
girls who never did three-somes. They just dated either boys or girls,
one at a time (though if I had better game when I dated them, I might
have been able to change that). So being bi doesn't necessarily mean
she's a party girl like yours. At the same time, however, a lot of
guys don't sarge on girls with girlfriends, not realizing that those
girls may actually be bi and a girlfriend destroyer might work just as
good as a boyfriend destroyer. We should start a new thread on this:
because wouldn't that be the ideal situation, to sarge for threesomes
with a girl like your bathroom HB? Let's try to figure out ways to EV,
and then scripts/patterns to show that we are a guy who can help them
live the lifestyle they want to an even greater degree.

================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 15 Oct 2001 20:57:39 GMT
subject: Re: Field Report - Success after Mystery's advice
Marquis <greg_t@connect.net.au> wrote in message news:<3BCA61DC.94E36718@connect.net.au>...
That sounds like a good day's work. Out of curiosity, what's your
opener. I'm getting bored of mine...
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 22 Oct 2001 04:38:13 GMT
subject: Insane field report with four *closes
I have been meaning to post here for awhile, but I´ve been out of the
country. What I want to write is a report on Mystery´s basic training,
which was really amazing. When I return home next week, I will post a
long report on the experience. One particular night, I probably
witnessed the most sensational, artistic PUA #close of my life, which
I will share when I get back.
In the meantime, here´s a wild field report from the European city I´m
visiting.
THE TEXTBOOK *CLOSE

On Friday night, I went to a dance club and ran into a friend. She was
with two British women. And one was just a total bitch. She had her
arms folded across her chest, had a shitty attitude, and basically
told me to go to hell when I was introduced. Since hanging out with
Mystery, I´ve learned that if you treat this all like a game, it´s so
very easy because instead of just trying to make people like you
(which is seen as pathetic, you´re toying with them (which intrigues
them).
So I decided that, just for the sport of it, I´d try to break down
HBBitch. I isolated HBBitch (an 8 who I´ll rate a 6 because she really
enjoys being mean and self hating), and did a little mind reading
trick on her that I learned. At first, I said I´d read her mind and
come up with the name of the first boy she ever loved. She said she´d

never loved anyone before (no surprise there). So instead I went with
her mother´s name, and got it well enough to impress her. Then we sat
down and I ran a couple live-for-the-moment patterns past her. Then I
tried the Cube game on her--her horse was a unicorn and her storm was
over the unicorn. So I told her that´s why she´d never loved
anyone--she´s holding out for a man who doesn´t exist, and then she´s
got this storm cloud over him. So we talk a little more about deep
relationship stuff, and then I just stop talking to test her because
I´m getting the DDB look. She says, 'So, what do you do for work?´ As
we all know, that´s a sure IOI, so I use the Mystery *close and say,
'So, do you want to kiss me?´ She hesitates, and I don´t give her time
to reply. So we start making out for a while.
A little later, we decide to go to another club. She goes to the

bathroom, and she´s gone forever, so my friend and I decide to just
leave without her.
THE DISASTER *CLOSE

We go to another dance club. As soon as we walk in, I see this totally
drunk HB9(very, very hot, young, slender, funky black haired girl with
a red scarf and red lipstick and tight red top) who I had seen at a
party the night before. I say hi, and she just throws herself on me,
drunk, and we´re all over each other. We sit down, and then I make the
mistake of actually using asf tactics. She is too wasted to really
understand a word of it, and it creates this awkwardness between us
(anyone ever have the problem of patterns and SS turning off drunk
girls?). She says she wants drugs, and I don´t do drugs, but I tell
her I can maybe take her to another club to get some. She says okay.
We get up, and as she passes the bathroom, she pulls me in. She sits
down on the toilet and takes a long pee (remember my last field
report--THIS HAPPENS ALL THE F-ING TIME TO ME). As she finishes,
someone starts pounding on the door. I tell him someone´s in the
bathroom, and then he bursts in the door. It´s some guy, maybe the
girl´s boyfriend. They start yelling at each other, and finally she
grabs my arm and we leave.
We go to the other club, and as soon as we walk in, I see HBBitch

sitting at a table alone with her arms folded. She gives me the look
of death for ditching her, and I joke and play with her a little
(because her responses fall into such a predictable stereotype, it´s
easy to be one step ahead of her). Anyways, I´m in hell for the next
half hour, because I have HBBitch upset that I´m with this hot drunk
party girl, and I´ve got this hot drunk party girl upset because there
are no drugs for her.
A MARRIAGE CLOSE? HELP!

Outside, HBBitch disappears and I #close the party girl, who is very
upset with me because she is tired and wants drugs to stay awake. I
run into a group of about 20 people (I know one guy in the group), who
are trying to figure out where to go. I start talking to HBRussian (a
teeny 7), and suggest that while they are standing around indecisive,
we can go to a fun after-hours club, have an unforgettable time, grab
a sandwich (because she´s hungry), and then call her friends and meet
up with them. She says she likes that I´m decisive, and we sneak away.
There is a line outside the club, and a guy behind us starts talking
to us. I tell him that HB Russian and I got engaged tonight and are
celebrating (I´ve never actually used this before, but I think it´s a
good tactic with someone you´ve just met because it seals you to the
HB romantically--it´s a joke that plants a seed of possibility in an
HB´s mind. At the very least, you´re both sharing a private joke
together, creating a fantasy world for the two of you to live in for
the night. Any thoughts on this?)
Anyway, the guy in line was just amazing. He said he was a priest, and
then he took a ring (sort of like a keyring) off his cell phone and
performed this beautiful marriage ceremony, full of undying pledges of
love. It really was quite beautiful. I put the ring on HBRussian´s
thumb, and of course kissed the bride very well for a couple minutes.
We went inside, kissed more, and paid our priest a beer for his
services. He took our names and addresses, and said he´d send us our
paperwork because he swears that he´s really a priest.
After a litle while, we leave the club and her friends are STILL on
the corner. We hang out and talk with them, then I suggest we slip
away again. We go back to my hotel room. She says the night is too
perfect, that this can´t be real, and gets a little shy about getting
too physical. She says something somewhat sarcastic, like, 'I knew you
were going to try to do this.´ And then I tell her a story. It´s an
amazingly sad but effective story about a girl and a boy who each meet
their soulmate, and then a sliver of doubt crosses their minds. They
decide to test it just to make sure, but in the process they lose each
other forever. I can write it in more detail if anyone´s interested.
Anyway, she spends the night and we fool around more (but we don´t
actually have sex, despite my amazingly told story). She´s very sweet,
and leaves in the morning, and I like her and think she could be a
MLTR possibility. Until...
THE *CLOSE FROM HELL

On Saturday night, I go to a dance club, and as I get a drink, there
is a UG standing next to me. She is sort of dressed trashy, so i

wonder if I should talk to her for fun. While I´m deciding, she says
something boring to me, like, 'Are you an American?´So, just for
practice, I decide to go for a *close in five minutes (thanks again to
Mystery for the confidence). I tell some stories, and we start talking
about wild nights out. She talks about an orgy sshe went to and I get
her worked up on that, asking about her feelings and experiences
there. I tell her how it´s so great to be in those situations where
you´re totally comfortable and you can just let yourself go, knowing
that you´re safe to do whatever you want and it´s all okay. There´s
lots of kino and she´s giving me the DDB, so I do the Mystery *close.
It´s terrible, because we´re in plain view and surely people I know
are watching me make out with this UG.
As soon as we stop, HBRussian appears out of nowhere and tells UG that

she is leaving the club now. It turns out that they´re friends! I am
frozen and speechless, and HBRussian leaves without a word to me. I
stand there in shock for several more minutes, then introduce UG to a
friend of mine and go to find HBRussian. Sadly, she´s already gone.
And, worst of all, I never got her number the previous night. So the
story I told her about the soulmates who lose each other forever comes
true.
All in all, an amazing weekend full of romance, tragedy, and more

*closes than I´ve ever had in a weekend clubbing. Any thoughts,
advice, and funny jokes are welcome.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 23 Oct 2001 18:15:42 GMT
subject: Re: Mystery's seminar in LA
Yes, it went great. I have so much to say, and Í´m out of the country
right now. I will work on a full report and post it next time I´m at a
computer. I have a few quick thoughts to share in the meantime
if you are READY for it, it is invaluable. In other words, if you have
absolutely no game and cannot carry on a conversation with a woman, it
may not be worth it. If, however, you have some game and want to
improve it or get to the next level, the class will really blow you
away. I learned so much in just a few days that it will take me months
before I can implement it. But I know that the field report I just
posted the other day with four kisscloses would not have been possible
without what I learned. It makes such a huge difference to be watching

and doing it, instead of just reading about it. I got three number
closes and one kind of weak kiss close my first night out, which is
alright, considering I was in a group of five guys.
And, honestly, what I loved most in the class is that it was like
being out with the asf newsgroup whispering in your ear. Many people
here go out sarging, come back without a good close, and then post
asking for advice on what they should have done. Well, here, you´re
sitting on a couch with a girl, and Mystery is coming over or sending
someone over to whisper just what to do in your ear, like MORE KINO or
TIME CONSTRAINT, CLOSE NOW or TURN AWAY FROM HER FOR A SECOND WHEN SHE
DOES THAT AGAIN or PHASE SHIFT or TELL HER SHE HAS NICE SKIN AND RUB
HER SHOULDER or whatever.
Speaking of time constraints, I´m on one now. I will prepare a day by

day report and post it here, with experiences, praise, and criticisms,
ok.
Please, no flames from competition. I really haven´t taken other

classes, but to me, they seem like two completely different things,
like comparing steak and ice cream. Sure, you eat them both, but they
taste nothing alike. Some like one, some like the other, and most like
them both.
"Manny" <sinfonia@mindspring.com> wrote in message news:<9r2q5p$bc4$1@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net>...

> Yeah people, whats up!! I want to here what happened!!!
>
> Manny
>
> "ErosLA77" <erosla77@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20011022095846.17412.00000795@mb-ch.aol.com...
> > Any reports from anyone who actually attended?
>>
>>
> > ENQUIRING MINDS WANT TO KNOW!
>>
> > Ross "Buster Simcus" Jeffries
================================================================================
================================================================================
"christopher powles" <CPOWLES100@HOTMAIL.COM>
Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:40:13 GMT
subject: Question about Mystery kiss close

Okay, after I ask, ´do you want to kiss me,´Í know what to do if she
says yes, or no, or maybe, or if she just hesitates. But, last night,
someone said ´´maybe later.´ What is the right response hereþ
It kind of threw me for a loop, especially since I knew I was in and

getting tons of kino from her. What I did was sort of tease her, and
say something like ´óh, really´ and then I turned away to face the
bar, and pretended to ignore her. She, of course, came up to me, and
tried to get my attention again, and I slowly began to pay attention
to her like before. It was sort of punishment. Anyone have any better
ideas. (I ended up introducing her to a friend while I went elsewhere
in the bar, mainly because I wasn´t that interested in her and just
really wanted to practice the kiss close.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 30 Oct 2001 04:18:41 GMT
subject: Re: Question about Mystery kiss close
> PS: Bro, can you do me a favor and type out your workshop outing report? Im
> getting so many emails asking for the goods.
>
> QUESTIONS
>
> 1) is Mystery what he says he is? Does he have game? what did you see him
> do? is he anything like he is online?
>
> 2) what specifically did he teach? was it fun?
>
> 3) how has it changed your game? did you get laid?
>
> 4) was the information and the way it was internalized worth the price?
>
> 5) overall, is the workshop a cool thing?
Okay. Will do. I´m traveling, so it´s been hard to get to a computer
and write long emails. I will write a full report and post it when I
return tomorrow (Tuesday) night. It´s going to be long, honest, and
interesting. There´s so much to say!
Sorry I haven´t had time to do this yet, ASFers. Think of it as a

takeaway!

================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 31 Oct 2001 04:05:43 GMT
subject: Mystery class field report (Days 1 and 2)
Okay, here it is, the long-awaited report. I'm going to try to stick
to what's essential to keep this from getting way too long. But if you
have any questions about anything, I'm glad to elaborate. Again, let's
try to keep the flames and character assassinations out of this
thread: Mystery's class is the only one I've ever taken, though I'm
sure what the other teachers and experts here have to offer is amazing
and rewarding too.
A SUMMARY FOR THE LAZY
1. Yes, Mystery is an amazing PUA. There are VERY FEW women (whether
alone, in groups, or with men) who he can not approach and at the very
least #close within 15 minutes.
2. I recommend this class very, very highly for those who have some
game but need to improve it or work on sticking points. If you have
absolutely no self-confidence or are so painfully inhibited that you
cant carry on a conversation, Id try to work on those issues first.
However, the class may still be worthwhile if only to watch an
accomplished PUA at work.
3. Like we've said a hundred times in ASF, there is no magic pill, and
this class isn't one. But, at the same time, this weekend of classes
is much more valuable and helpful than a full year of just reading ASF
postings and SS materials. The reading is just about education, but
the class is all about application.
4. Finally, as for me, the class was different than I expected, but at
the same time I got more out of it than I expected. I have a MUCH
better understanding of how to use the tactics I read about here. And,
more importantly, Mystery brought my game to the next level, as you
shall see in the following...
NIGHT ONE
I meet Mystery and his WING in a hotel lobby. There are two other
students, a fairly inexperienced guy in his early 20s and a
distinguished looking older man who is somewhat shy. Both good guys.
Mystery lectures on approaches and openers. Then he analyzes each of
us: he has good instincts, and in a way the class is worth it just to
get honest feedback on your social problems and what you can do to

increase your allure in clubs. For example, he tells the young guy to
go for a rocker look: to ditch his preppy outfit, get cool clothes,
get a (fake or real) piercing and tattoo, and to shave his goatee a
certain way. Unfortunately for the guy, he doesnt go clothes shopping
at all during the class, which is a real shame, because Mystery was
dead on and the guy could have easily gone from wallflower to chick
magnet. Hopefully hes taken the advice by now.
Mystery tells me that I'll probably have a lot of success this
weekend (heh heh) and then suggests an approach for me. It's one I
never thought of, and in fact its quite embarrassing, but it works.
We get in a limo and head to the first club, which is pretty
dead. The second we walk in, Mystery walks up to a group of HBs and
instantly launches into his routine. Within moments, all the girls are
staring at him slack-jawed as we lowly students watch and learn.
Mystery suggests warming up on any easy-to-approach girl, just
to get in a talkative, confident mood. So, with the Wing, I approach
an okay-looking party girl. Once I make contact, WING comes in and
helps me out with the conversation, always trying to escalate it into
more sexual talk. Eventually, SHE offers to buy me a drink. She gets
the drinks, and I isolate her on a couch. I do some great EVing, and
then we start talking about adventures, and she tells me about a
threesome she had; I tell her about one I had. I'm getting the DDB,
but Im really not that into this girl. So, we all leave the club, and
Mystery and Wing decide to bring Party Girl along in the limo so that
the other guys in the class can practice some convo. So she completely
ditches her friends and joins us.
The next club we go to is a super-trendy LA spot, full of models
and HB9s. This one is a really good time. Ive been there before, and
usually just settle for seeing and being seen. But this time, our
group hits the club like a bomb. We fan out and just start talking to
all these HBs (ignoring poor Party Girl). What is amazing is that no
one is really rebuked, and once the social proof is coming in, were
talking to really hot HBs left and right.
It's great, because as I'm sitting talking with one HB9, WING
is sitting on the couch next to me. Hell whisper, say, xxxx, and Ill
say it. Or hell say, grab her hair and smell it or whatever. These are
things Id never do or say, but I do or say them and they work. We try
Mystery's "Do you believe in spells" approach on one totally hot
stripper-like blonde, and it turns out shes a white witch (or at least
she thinks she is). WING makes her get cherries from the bar and feed
them to us, just for fun.
Once I know she's a white witch, I have a great opener for other
women, and just tell them, "That girl just told us shes a white witch.
What do you think that means?" And girls here love dissing other
girls, so I start talking to a hot Asian HB9 and her friend, whos a
HB7. I dont want to go on too long, but I a lot of lines and patterns

I saw Mystery use and end up #closing them and getting a weak *close
from HB7.
As we're standing up to leave, a totally perfect new-wave girl
walks by us. And by now its just become instinct not to let a HB pass
by. I say something stupid about her haircut, and we talk, #close, and
make plans for later that week--all within five minutes. Another good
thing about the class is that if Im spending too much time with a HB,
Wing or Mystery will come over and say, in my ear, Time constraint, so
Ill pretend like I have to go and #close.
Now its 2 a.m., so we pile in the limo and go back to our
meeting place to dissect the night. Mystery tells each of us what to
work on. I wish I could have him and WING whispering in my ear every
night.
Oh, and what about Party Girl? She drinks herself into oblivion,
evidently, and is last seen stumbling out of the club alone. Poor
thing.
NIGHT TWO
This night we go to a sort of cheesy bar. There are, however, a lot of
girls there. Most of them arent too bright, so I just have fun. I
actually spend the night learning how to wing. And it is so much fun
and so easy to just disable the guys whenever Mystery or WING walk up
to a group. This is one really important thing I learned in Mystery's
class: how important and how easy it is to befriend and disarm the men
in a group, whether sarging solo or with a wing. I was never able to
approach groups before. Anyway, that night ends with WING and I
setting up a double date for the next week for ourselves with two
super-cute girls.
Its great because every question I have about sarging, Mystery
has an answer and plan for. So, what I really learn this night are
four important things that Id read but never really applied before.
They are:
HAVE A PLAN. Watching Mystery, I realize that its important to know

WHAT to say and WHEN to say it. Its insane to watch him just use
nearly the exact same opener, the exact same gimmicks, and the exact
same lines, and just reduce HBs to mush.
HAVE A GIMMICK (or at the very least a prop). This way, you can just
bypass the small talk, demonstrate value to her with a short
performance (a story or trick or demonstration or whatever), and start
an in-depth conversation about whatever deeply personal subject arises
from the use of the gimmick (that, I guess, is part of sex magic).
HAVE STORIES. Most people go out to be entertained. Be the
entertainer. But entertain in a way that suggests or opens up the
possibility of a connection between you and the target.
TREAT IT ALL AS A GAME. Because it is one!

So, based on this night, I go home and work on my own script, stories,
and plans. I think that for Mystery, magic and mysticism work because
thats what he excels at. Magic doesnt have to be for everybody: youre
going to be a good PUA if you find something that youre passionate
about that intrigues others, and then amplify that thing. Anyway, I
come up with my own plan and sequence, a personal variation on
Mysterys Find, Meet, Attract, Close. It is:
1. Establish yourself as an interesting person (and fun too)

2. Establish yourself as someone she can make an emotional connection
with
3. Establish yourself as someone she can make a physical connection
with
4. Make that connection
...continued in next post...
================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 31 Oct 2001 04:22:58 GMT
subject: Mystery class field report (days 3 and 4)
NIGHT THREE
Tonight is a strange one. We go to a Latin dance club. We are all out
of our element: it's full of well-dressed salsa-dancing HBs and suave
salsa-dancing dudes. But, we learn that it doesnt matter. We just
approach, approach, approach. Every time I make a mistake, Mystery
catches it and calls me on it. Every time there is a two- or three-set
alone, Mystery or Wing push me in their direction. I #close once there
(getting heavy IOIs from the girl), and, then a totally hot waitress
that WING #closes with asks for MY phone number too. Wing, of course,
is very distraught by this. (We're going out with her this week, so
we'll see whats up.)
After this, we head to another bar. This one is amazing. Full of
HB7-8s who are really open to approaches. Wing, Mystery, and I end up
in the corner entertaining a steady stream of HBs. At one point,
someone in our group is making out with one while I'm massaging
another and Wing is #closing another. I get two more numbers there.
The last one is with this really cute Italian girl. I think I'm hot
sht for #closing her, but then, in the limo, Mystery blows my close
apart. He watched the whole thing, and tells me that I let her play
games with me when instead I should have been punishing and rewarding.

And he's right. I can explain this in more detail later, but his
advice on this was worth the price of the class alone. It really
taught me how to flirt, not be manipulated, and be in total control.
NIGHT FOUR
Okay, this is where we see a true PUA in action. This is just
beautiful, textbook stuff. As a demonstration of his powers, Mystery
approaches a certain well-known actor, who's sitting with his HB10
girlfriend and another couple. Mystery, of course, engages the guys,
completely ignoring the HB10 (who is Playmate material). Eventually,
she clamors for attention, asking if Mystery can show her some
illusions. Mystery complies and sits down--taking the celebrity's seat
(beautiful move!). As he shows her this stuff, he completely brings
her into his world. They're holding hands, and he's completely BF
destroying. Since the actor is older, Mystery plays up his youth and
enthusiasm for the good life that the actor now seems to have
outgrown. When he tells the HB10 his own age, she responds, "Perfect!"
The actor, watching all this, tells his friend something like, "Tell
me this is all an illusion, and he's not actually stealing my
girlfriend" Anyway, this perfect set ends with the girl whispering her
phone number to Mystery so that he will remember it. Seriously, this
is unbelievable. I wish I could have recorded it!
Next, we go to a club full of the LA jet set. It's very
intimidating and, to be honest, we dont do that well. Were all tired.
Mystery, however, actually manages to make two different HBs CRY
during his routine. One of these HBs is with her meathead alpha BF,
and you can tell that she so bad wants to leave him and just run away
with Mystery.
Afterwards, we have a late-night meal and wrap-up discussion at a
restaurant, where I somehow get two #closes from some girls at a
nearby table. I go out with one of them on Sunday.
AFTERTHOUGHTS
I only have one critique with the class, and I'll say this as much for
ASFers benefit as for Mystery's. The man is amazing. He knows that he
can PU anyone. Sometimes we'll just be walking out of a bar, and he'll
stop two HBs walking in and just #close for sport. I wish, however,
that he spent a little less time demonstrating and a little more time
coaching and working with us one-on-one. Fortunately, he had a great,
great WING who also helped out. And this is a problem that can easily
be fixed. I'd also like to have an afternoon sarging in malls or cafes
as part of the class, though Mystery says this stuff is too easy
compared to sarging in clubs and bars, which is true.
Now, for my main praise: the great advantages have come afterwards for
me. I now feel like I can approach any girl and know exactly what to

do and say to get her intrigued and close. I was never very good at
*closing someone I'd only met minutes ago, and now I can. I just went
on vacation for a couple weeks and had all sorts of adventures. I must
have #closed 20 girls; *closed ten; slept with two; and, in a very
strange night, f-closed two crazy sisters. And one of the girls I
#closed was one of the city's most stuck-up HBs; I ran into her sister
yesterday, who told me she was talking about me all day. I probably
wouldn't have done one-tenth this good without Mystery's class. In
addition, I found myself becoming more charismatic and more of a
leader in regular everyday situations that didn't involve sarging.
And, most important, whether succeeding or failing, I had tons of fun.
I can't wait to put this stuff to work at home. Anyone in LA want to
wing? Email me: just make sure you're somewhat confident, intelligent,
and socially comfortable.
AND, FINALLY
What I need now is Advanced Training. I need a class to take me
through the next steps: calling an HB I #close with and taking her for
a perfect, passionate adventure. I have to bring my follow-up game up
to the level of my approaching-and-closing game. Mystery, you ready?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Thu, 01 Nov 2001 01:36:32 GMT
subject: Re: Mystery class field report (days 3 and 4)
"Fatass" wrote:
> Okay, so much for the testimonial. Now tell me this: Was your
> success on vacation due to anything NEW that you learned from the
> seminar, or was it due more to application of the information that is
> already available in The Fucking Manual?
The truth is that the manual gave me the knowledge and the class gave
me the skill. Without ASF and TFM, I wouldn't have been able to
appreciate the class. But without the class, I wouldn't have had the
confidence and know-how to make all the approaches and closes I did.
So, yes, I credit a lot (but not all) of the vacation success to the
class. But, then again, that's me. I'm a quick learner, but I think
anyone is going to learn more from watching and doing than just
reading or listening.
Seriously, Fatass, from reading your posts, I think you're the same: a
really smart, funny, quick guy who has a good grasp of this stuff. The

class is perfect for someone like you to take you to the next level
and help you get past some of your sticking points. However, it's
probably not perfect for the type of guy posting here saying 'I'm too
scared to talk to the girl who sits next to me in class--help!'
"Mystery" <magic26man@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<qmVD7.10188$Fy2.2108551@news20.

bellglobal.com>...
> NYC my man, NYC! :)

Okay, I'm there!
> you still hangin' with WING?

I'm seeing him tonight: a Halloween party actually being thrown by two
HBs we met on our first night of class. (The one whose hair WING told
me to sniff; I still think it's corny, but I guess it worked.)
great post. it's great to

> be able to read what I actually had been through. like seeing it through
> someone else's eyes. sweet.
cool. remind me if i missed anything good.
about sex magic ... I will be changing my

> workshop in several fundamental ways and your suggestions will be
> implemented.
Great. Considering it was the first class ever and a totally new type
of class at that, I thought it went really smooth.
as soon as I can find a website space for my pages, Ill post

> the URL. To sum up though ...
>
> "Mystery is conducting his SEX MAGIC Workshop in cities worldwide (teaches
> all aspects of The Mystery Method). He is writing a book (ebook too) called
> SEX MAGIC: How to Put Women Under Your Spell".
I like the new angle and name: tasteful, intriguing, and something a
woman would be less likely to freak out about if she found it on your
shelf.
> Mystery
================================================================================
================================================================================


Thu, 01 Nov 2001 02:32:31 GMT
subject: Re: Mystery class field report (Days 1 and 2)
"Jonathan Ashton" wrote in message news:<z_UD7.10178$Fy2.2098742@news20.bellglobal.com>...

> Hey Chris,
>I have a few specific questions--and they're all about the Words
Spoken.
>(I wish you'd included some examples.)
>What routines/stories did you have the most success with?
For openers, there are three I used:

1. "Omigod, did you see that fight outside. These two girls were
totally going at it...etc., etc."
2. This is the embarrassing one Mystery suggested for me. I've only
had the guts to use it a couple times, but it has actually worked. "It
looks like the party/fun/whatever is over here." Then I turn to the
girl I'm interested in and say, "If I wasn't gay, you would be SO
mine." It instantly turns off her defenses (and those of others in the
group), and I can then hit her with heavy stuff. When it actually led
to a *close once, it wasn't until afterwards that she said, 'aren't
you gay?' I said, 'I was' (with a joking smile) and then kissed her
again, a little more passionately. (Anyone know any better replies?)
3. My favorite was a variation of the "do spells work" line of

Mystery's. I said that and then launched into a story I made up. I
pointed to my friend and said something like, "The reason I'm asking
is because my friend over there is new to LA. And he met a girl at a
club. He wasn't interested in her sexually, because she wasn't really
his type [At this point, the girl always says, 'sure,' which is great
because I can say, 'no, really,' and begin light kino and
teasing--plus it shows us as nice guys who women are attracted to].
Anyway, she came over to his house and after she left, he found a
corroded metal ring and some feathers wrapped around a scroll under
his sofa cushion. Well, he took it to a magick store and they said it
was an attraction spell. And, now, the strange thing is, he's suddenly
finding himself attracted to her. Do you think that it's the spell or
just psychological?'
This this isn't genius or anything, but it never failed to get a good
convo going and open up doors for patterns. However, since the class,
I've been using some other openers that involve props/gimmicks.

As for other routines/patterns, I liked:

One about how there are so few days in our active lifetime, and we
should enjoy each moment to its maximum.
There's also one about how our emotional circuitry has evolved to
perfection while the intellectual part of our brains is new and
imperfect. It ends with me pulling the back of her hair, but I can't
seem to get this one quite right anymore. Mystery or someone, can you
post it here?
A few good BF destroyers too long to explain right now.
Various negs--fake nails, something in her ear, etc.
Question games
A kino story called Dino Island
Etc, etc, etc.
> You said it was easy to disarm the guys. What did you say to them on
> approaching?
This is easy. You just say to the guys what you'd never say to a girl.
In other words, you make small talk. While your friend is sarging, you
just ask her male friends anything: "How'd you guys end up here
tonight?" "Are you guys from around here?" "What did you all do before
this?" Whatever. They just want to be paid attention to so that their
egos aren't bruised as they stand around watching some other guy
entertain the chick they're supposed to be entertaining.
> I'm also curious about the conversation with the Italian woman where
> Mystery told you she'd gotten the better of you. What was the
> conversation/power dynamics? What hoops did she put up? How did
> Mystery say you should have handled them?
Yes, this is really interesting. What happened was we made a joke

about something, and she sort of backed away. Then later, while I was
kino'ing her, she wasn't responding positively enough. And even later,
she introduced me to some AFC who came up to her. And what ended up
happening, from his perspective, is that I got the #close because I
forced myself on her. (As this was happening, AFCs kept patting me on
the back, going, 'She's hot' 'You lucky bastard'--what's a cool way to
respond to this stupidity?) Anyway, Mystery said afterwards I should
have punished when she moved away or didn't respond to kino. I should
have just turned away for a moment and talked to a friend or another
girl. When she paid attention to the dorky AFC, I should have said
something like, "I’m going to leave you two alone" (implying in
some sarcastic way that I'm leaving them alone romantically, though I
know she'd really rather be with me.)
His advice, and I've followed it since, is to think of a cat playing

with a piece of string. As long as the string is dangling just out of

reach, the cat is going to keep trying to grasp it. As soon as the
string drops in its lap, the cat loses insterest. So, to quote the
man, BE THE STRING.
> Thanks,
> Ash
Hope this helps. Let me know if you want me to elaborate more (or
less) on anything.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Thu, 01 Nov 2001 15:21:33 GMT
subject: Re: Odius and Mystery
Okay, I think I should weigh in on this issue (ha ha, I kill myself).
Seriously, this is the word on weight: It is not how much you weigh,
it is how you carry yourself. If you have good posture (try a course
like Alexander Technique), move gracefully (take dance or movement
classes), dress well (just a clean, pressed black tshirt or black
button down shirt and black pants will do), and have confidence (do
what you need to do to get this--be outgoing and speak to other people
about their favorite topic, themselves), people will be less likely to
think of you as "fat" and more likely to see you as "big." I know this
because a good friend of mine is IMMENSE. He's well over 300
pounds--just huge. But he's a clean, gregarious, positive, outgoing
guy who always knows where the party is. And he gets laid--by cute
girls. In fact, I briefly dated a really cute, very thin, very tiny
socialite girl. And, just recently, she started dating my BIG friend.
I can't even imagine how they fit together, but I guess she can...
So, Grim Reaper Dude, it may take more work for you, but you can do
it. If you really set your mind to it and made some changes, you could
completely reinvent yourself in a year and be THE MAN.
> "Grim Reaper Dude" <spleencrusha@oohay.com> wrote in message

> news:trlfls4r9kst22@corp.supernews.com...
> > Why are you always making comments that "fat people cannot get laid" ?
>>
> > I think both of you would find that your tried and true methods of PU
> would
> > be seriously hampered if you woke up one morning overwieght and not having

> > the looks you have.

>>
> > If you are true masters of PU, why do you riducule us who do not have
> looks,
> > and instead work on developing methods for helping us who do not have
> looks
> > to succeed as you have ?
>>
> > -me
================================================================================
================================================================================
Fri, 02 Nov 2001 01:13:23 GMT
subject: Quick Advice Needed on HBExStripper
You may remember HBExstripper, from a field report from a couple weeks
ago. She was the one who brought me into the bathroom and was giving
tons of IOIs, and then her boyfriend kept calling on the cell. I had
asked whether I should call her or not, considering that she lives
with her BF. Well, it turns out she called me while I was on vacation.
I called her back today, and she was giving good IOIs on the phone
(talking about how she was looking for someone to kiss last night but
couldn't find any good guys). But, at the same time, she also just
broke up with her boyfriend, so I was also the shoulder to cry on. I
gave her some advice, but got off the phone a little quickly. Then she
invited me to go to Las Vegas with her this weekend. Now, here are the
questions:
1. How do I keep myself from being the shoulder to cry on and instead
turn the conversation towards eliciting positive states. She may
already have me in mind as the rebound, but I don't want to turn into
the shoulder.
2. Her BF lives in Vegas. She said she's going down there this weekend
"with a really hot friend" and wants me to join them. She said she's
going just to have fun and forget about things. So, should I:
A. Go along and hope that we'll have a fun, crazy lost weekend with
her and her BB friends.
B. Make plans for when she returns from Vegas. I fear that going with
her there or meeting her there may be supplication--I'll be depending
on HER to show me a good time in HER city, and there's always the risk
her BF will call and she'll go running back.

Thanks!
================================================================================
================================================================================
Fri, 02 Nov 2001 18:49:02 GMT
subject: Re: LAID REPORT!!!!!!
Nice, honest lay report. Made me think of two things:
1. Success is a matter of talent and timing. The fact that you

approached a HB who had just been stood up is what made this all work.
The lesson here for newbies is approach, approach, approach until you
find the right person at the right time.
2. Now, the second thing your post raises is a good lesson in a

woman's self-esteem. Of course, a girl who goes back to a hotel with a
guy she's just met is not going to feel good about herself. When she
started acting like a "bitch," as you say, and getting all freaked
out, all she wanted was some reassurance that she had done the right
thing, that you don't do this all the time, and that you were a nice
guy. When you say "well the least you can do is give me a bj before
you leave," that's total Neanderthal/AFC behavior.
My guess is that you felt insecure afterwards, and were freaked out by
her reaction. If you had understood how she was feeling and been
sympathetic to her (in other words, eased her doubts and taken care of
her), you probably could have continued to see her--and gotten your
practice in! Instead, she left feeling tricked and feeling taken
advantage of, and I'd guess that this sort of ruined the experience on
some level for you too.
Next time, understand how she's feeling. And, if you're really feeling
bad about your ability, work on a pattern telling someone how the
first time, you're just so excited to be with her that you can't help
yourself because she turns you on so much. But, this is a good thing,
because you know that over time, the sex will get better and better,
until you both know just how to pleasure each other for hours and
hours, over and over, etc. Tell her how it's great to have gotten sex
out of the way, and now you can drop the sexual tension and the games,
and just be completely comfortable together as you get to know each
other emotionally and physically.

Other than that, it sounds like you did a nice job. In the future,
instead of coming on so strong and persistent, consider playing hot
and cold, rewarding and punishing (something I only recently learned
from Mystery to great effect), to make HER want you more.
I hope this helps!
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================================================================================
Sat, 03 Nov 2001 18:14:04 GMT
subject: Dealing with "difficult" girls
One in every 20 or so women I approach is a "difficult" girl, and I

get thrown for a loop. What I mean by difficult is that they're
purposely contrarian. It's okay to approach and start talking. But,
then, they don't want to be figured out. So anytime that you say
anything to use the values you've elicited or gain rapport or show
that you understand them, they'll respond by either saying the
opposite or by just answering vaguely and mysteriously and
non-commitally Basically, these are women who are giving you shit
tests and battles of wits all the time, half as a method of flirting
and half as a protective shield to keep emotional distance. They're
smiling and enjoying the conversation, but you are getting absolutely
nowhere. They're the easiest girls to figure out, but the last ones to
ever admit that they've been figured out because their self-image is
so tied up in the idea of being "complicated" and "too intelligent to
be out getting picked up" (though they're generally not that
intelligent compared to a lot of other women). I'm probably not
explaining this as well as I could, but do you know the type of woman
I'm talking about?
Anyway, I usually get frustrated and eject or move on to her friend

(because I get annoyed, though I'll always smile and never show it).
But, does anyone have a bridge or pattern or idea that works on these
women, to get past the BS and stupid cryptic comments to the more
simple, interesting, and vulnerable woman hiding underneath? Or maybe
there's a way to completely change her state--by, perhaps, instead of
trying to build rapport, taking her outside of herself in some
way--very strongly taking her on some sort of adventure (with words or
actions) that makes her forget about and let go of herself and the
self-image she so tightly clings to for a moment. Maybe more negs? I
don't know. Any suggestions? (And I'm not accepting "eject" as an
answer--there must be a way.)

================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 04 Nov 2001 17:03:05 GMT
subject: Re: Dealing with "difficult" girls
"Tzeen" <donotreplybyemail@tz.net> wrote in message news:<XW6F7.131720$P8.45201917@news1.elmhst1.

il.home.com>...
> Shit man....I hear what you're saying. I found one like that about 2 weeks
> ago. Her fucking mind games and stupid comments kept making me really
> uncomfortable and throwing me off my game. I planned on seeing her mainly
> so I could practice some SS techniques but I spent the whole damn time
> dancing around her god damn pointless questions. She answered my questions
> with questions, and I got nowhere.
Yes, this is exactly the type of girl I'm talking about. So annoying!
In the end, she just turned out to be a

> horny little slut, because I fucked her, left, then blew her off for good
> three days later (i disliked her enough to pass on sex with her a second
> time...because it would have meant seeing her again.) I think the problem
> is, patterns don't seem to work on these girls, because they turn them
> around and return fire with mind games of their own. Someone on this board
> (im sorry, i can't remember who...but it wasn't ray) pointed out that the
> sluts play alot of mind games so they can seem more complicated than a girl
> who just likes to fuck.
Interesting. I never thought of it that way.
>
> In my opinion...the mind games might come down a notch if you can get her
> comfortable enough to let you fuck her. If she's using it as a defense
> mechanism...perhaps sex will lower her defenses for good. I guess if i had
> met my weirdo chick a second time, i would have found out.. but i disliked
> her way too much.
>
Okay, makes sense. But HOW do you get her to let drop her annoying
games/defenses enough to go home with you? What did you talk about?
How do you get her in the mood?
================================================================================

================================================================================
Sun, 04 Nov 2001 17:13:32 GMT
subject: Introducing...the bathroom takeaway?
I learned something new (at least I think it's new) by accident last
night.
The bathroom takeaway.
Strike up a conversation with an HB who's in the bathroom line (you

can either be in line, walking past, or walking out of the bathroom).
Have a gimmick in mind (palm-reading, handwriting analysis, sex magic,
runes, digicam, whatever). Turn the conversation to whatever gimmick
you want to perform on her. Then do a takeaway. Tell her that your
gimmick would really blow her mind, and it would be fun to try it on
her and see if you can tell her anything about herself. But,
obviously, the bathroom line isn't the place to do it, and there isn't
enough time anyway. Then say, "Listen, I have to go find my friends.
But find me when you're done, and we'll try this together."
It worked great for me last night, because I'd be talking with one HB,
and then all of a sudden another HB (returning from the bathroom)
would find me, pull me aside, and beg me to perform for her. This
worked out great, because not only was it great social proof, but I
was in a situation where I had my choice of women. I could either stay
with the bathroom HB after we sat down, or go find the other HB I was
talking to and apologize for being too popular.
Maybe this is obvious, but I'd never thought of it before. Last night
I tried it twice, and both times the HB came looking for me. (It helps
to be a good, enthusiastic conversationalist, so that the HB is really
intrigued by the gimmick.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Nov 2001 19:24:00 GMT
subject: The Ex-Girlfriend Routine
Out of curiousity, how often did this work for you. In other words, once you
got an HB to walk down the street with you, how many of them actually french
kissed you? And of those, how many were willing to make out with you somewhere

more secluded?
In other words, how many good *closes did you get at the fiesta with this
technique. I really like the idea, but I'm trying to decide if it's better than
other tactics.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Nov 2001 00:25:00 GMT
subject: Re: Anti-Flaking Techniques?
I've noticed that the best way to keep an HB from flaking is to set up
DEFINITE plans before you leave. In other words, don't just plan on
meeting for coffee sometime or seeing each other later in the week.
When you're eliciting values, elicit EVENTS too. Then, when you
#close, you can say, 'I'll call you to go to that..." (whatever, but
the more memorable the better--concert, amusement park, cool bar).
This probably seems like obvious advice, but the flake factor is much
less when you close with a definite plan rather than just an agreement
to "hang out."
Also, on the same thread, when you #close with a girl and don't call
her (which happens all the time), what do you say to her when you see
her again, especially if you decide you want to pick up where you left
off and go for a *close or more? Has not calling her (and having to
apologize for it) ruined rapport?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Nov 2001 03:17:00 GMT
subject: Re: Palm reading
Okay, you all are going to thank me for this addition to your
palm-reading arsenal:
Novices may wonder whether to read the left hand or the right hand.
The right hand is connected to your left brain, the analytic side
(which deals with numbers, language, logic, etc.), so it generally
tells you about who someone is on the outside. The left hand is
controlled by the right brain, which is someone's intuitive side

(creative, artistic, instinctual, erotic). Now, and here's where the

good patterning comes in, tell her, and this is true, that the left
hand almost always has clearer and cleaner lines than the right, and
this reflects the degree of repression in our society of our natural
intuitive and erotic selves. You can use this to launch into the
Natural Woman pattern.
Oh, and sometimes, because I live in California, I worry that

palm-reading has become cliche for PUs. But it's just not true: HBs
love it. At a bar on Saturday, I was talking about psychic-type stuff
with an HB and all of a sudden she just thrust her hand into mine and
said, "Can you read palms?" No one ever gets tired of hearing about
themselves: people could get their palms read every day and still want
more.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Nov 2001 05:04:00 GMT
subject: Voice Class
Alam Palmer wrote:

>I'm now taking a voice class. I'm the only guy in a class of eight. The class
>only has one doable target, a 7.
>But I'm there mainly to learn how to control my voice, so I can make >it more
>seductive.
Yes, I have been trying to find a place to take vocal coaching or

elocution lessons. I don't want to learn "speech." I want to learn how
to enunciate, to speak louder, to speak clearer (all important for
walk ups on group sets), and to, of course, sound more seductive. I've
searched on the internet, but can't figure out how to find classes or
one-on-one tuturs for this. Any suggestions? Alan, how did you find
yours?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Nov 2001 08:24:00 GMT
subject: Re: Anti-Flaking Techniques?

On Mon, 05 Nov 2001 19:41:00 -0500, finalD wrote:
>So, I'd reframe the whole discussion. For me, the best way to prevent her
>from not seeing you again, is to cause her to WANT to see you again. Build
>some mystery, some anticipation, a definite sense inside of HER that YOU
>are a limited and worthwhile opportunity. "I might bring my Tarot deck. We
>have such a great bond, there's no way you could find out these things
>about yourself without me telling you. In private. Over coffee. Of course,
>I promised Gisele the 36DD super-model that I wouldn't do anyone else's
>Tarot reading until I'd done hers, and she and I have a standing agreement
>to see one another most Tuesday evenings. Plus, work takes me off to
>Bangkok and Milan often at short notice, what with all the professional
>female beach-volleyball players I have to interview and book for private
>... engagements ..."
>
>Setting up the time and place is only one piece of the puzzle. Setting up
>her DESIRE to be there, is a much larger piece. Logistics is simple. Just
>do it and get it done with. The rest, is rapport, showing value, etc. etc.
>etc.
>
Yes, this is it. I was listening to a radio show today on carnival

barkers. When they're trying to get people in the tent, they have six
steps they go through (which sound a lot like PU stuff). The third or
so is called the jam, and that's when they say, "For the next five
minutes only, admission is only one dollar. Step inside now, and see
the flea circus while you can." Of course, the admission is always a
dollar!
And that is exactly what you are saying above, FinalD, telling her to
act now, otherwise you're going to be unavailable, out of town, and
with a supermodel!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Nov 2001 08:30:00 GMT
subject: Casual Openers vs Routines
Which do you think is more effective: a casual opener (a short,

situational question) or a routine (a made-up story or gimmick).
Also, is one better for a club and the other better for street PUs.

For example, you walk up to the bus stop and an HB8.5 is standing
there. What is going to lead ultimately to greater rapport or a
greater close:
A. Saying something like, "Have you been waiting long?" or "Those
boots are amazing. Where did you get them?"
B. Launching into a routine, like telling her you need to practice

handwriting analysis for a class and then doing it on her. Or telling
her you were having an argument with a friend about (spells,
relationships, whatever), giving her the whole exciting story, and
then eliciting her values.
Now, say you see an HB8.5 at a bar in a club. What do you go with, A
(which is essentially leading with small talk) or B (which is throwing
her into the excitement, but also runs the risk of making you seem
"weird")?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Nov 2001 08:42:00 GMT
subject: Characteristics of Wing
Is it better to sarge with a Wing who is better looking or worse

looking than yourself?
The dilemma is that the better looking wing attracts more female
attention to your group but the worse-looking wing makes you the
prize catch of the group.
(I'm asking this question cause I sometimes wing with a guy who is
model material, and we talk to tons of HBs, but I tend not to do as
well because they mainly have eyes for him--even though he has almost
no PU style.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 07 Nov 2001 16:22:00 GMT
subject: Re: Unusual Niches for Practicing Approaches
On Wed, 07 Nov 2001 01:48:00 -0500, The Fox wrote:

>
>> I've got some that I haven't figured out yet, but there are lots of hot
>women
>> at all three.
>>
>> The grocery store
>
><snip>
>
>This one was obvious, but I didn't say it. I think the key here is look for
>WOMEN giving you eye contact / smiling at you / sidelong glances / you get
>the idea. Let them make that move, then go for it. You can't make it look
>like you're trolling the Jewel for action. You have to actually BE shopping
>for food you eat.
>
Even better than a grocery store is a health-food-type store, or a
natural food grocery store or an organic market or whatever. They are
almost exclusively filled with women from 18-40. And not only are
there tons of HBs and very few guys, but its so easy to strike up a
conversation. This is weak, but it's worked for me to just see some
weird food product in an HB's cart and say, "Are those any good?"
Then, from there, start talking about diet, and then health, and then
lifestyle, and within there find a connection for a #close.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Nov 2001 00:22:00 GMT
subject: The Best Friend Approach?
I saw a girl from the back last week, and thought it was a good friend
of mine. I grabbed her super-affectionately from behind, but when she
turned around I realized it was a different girl. I said, "I'm so
sorry, but you look just like my best friend XXX. And you can take
that as a compliment, because she's a very cool girl." Then I walked
away because she was in a group of friends, and didn't think anything
of it.
Later, I was by the bar and she just came up, a little drunk, put her
hand on my chest and looked at me with the DDB. We fluffed for about 5
seconds, and then I realized that she was just up for it. I said,
whispering in her ear with my cheek brushing hers, "You know, it just
doesn't seem right o kiss my best friend," and then we made out for a

while. I probably could have taken her home, but for some reason,
because it was TOO easy, I started to get a little nervous and blew it
(I HAVE to work on this).
Anyway, the question is this: do you think that mistaking someone for
a close friend, greeting them very affectionally, and then suddenly
doing a takeaway when you realize that it's not them would work as a
general approach?
(I thought that maybe this worked because she saw the intimacy and
affection she COULD have if she was a friend of mine, or maybe she was
just feeling randy and in the mood.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Nov 2001 00:25:00 GMT
subject: Re: Voice Class
That's a great idea: telling the voice coach your exact PUA goals. (Or
you could tell them you need to play Don Juan in a play.)
But, Alan, how do I go about finding an actor's voice coach? Where

should I look, a magazine or web site? I searched the internet and
just can't find anything.
On Wed, 07 Nov 2001 06:08:00 -0500, alan_palmer wrote:
>On 11/6/01 12:04:51 PM, ActionMan wrote:

>...
>>
>>Yes, I have been trying to find a place to
>>take vocal coaching or elocution lessons. I
>>don't want to learn "speech." I want
>>to learn how to enunciate, to speak louder,
>>to speak clearer (all important for walk ups
>>on group sets), and to, of course, sound
>>more seductive. I've searched on the
>>internet, but can't figure out how to find
>>classes or one-on-one tuturs for this.
>>Any suggestions? Alan, how did you find
>>yours?
>

>If your primary aim is to increase the seductive qualities of your voice, then
>may I suggest you avoid "Public Speaking" and "Sales Presentation" classes
>(unless they are rich in HBs :-)
>
>Instead, I recommend you take voice classes that are aimed at actors or
>would-be actors, mainly because the instructor is likely to be an actor and
>voice/accent coach.
>
>I'm taking a night class that teaches the voice aspect of acting to
non-actors.
>The instructor is brilliant at acting and foreign accents. I've half a mind to
>tell her exactly why I'm there and ask her for private tuition to help me with
>my goals (straight-up, I've no intention of sarging her).
>
>I want to be able to make my voice more resonant, and a little deeper in
pitch.
>Already I can sense that that is possible and what I need to practice to get
>that.
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Nov 2001 00:29:00 GMT
subject: Re: Characteristics of Wing
Good answers, Anton and DJ. And, yes, the problem with model man I
think is that he makes himself competition. So, the problem I realize
now isn't the attractiveness of the wing, its the willingness of the
wing to work as part of a team!
On Tue, 06 Nov 2001 14:48:00 -0500, DJ wrote:
>ActionMan wrote in news:340.104@discussion.fastseduction.com:

>
>>
>>
>>
>Never mind about the looks. If you are worried, then you IMO you maybe
>shouldn't even have a wing. Wings are not COMPETITION. They are your
>brothers in sarging.
>
>

>Dude, a wing is someone that is looking out for you - not always into what
>'he' wants, but rather a goal what you can both work towards. Sometimes
>wings have to do the charity work, but in return you do it for him
>sometimes and take the less attractive girl. I found with after a while
>working with my wing, we ended up on the same wavelength.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Nov 2001 06:17:00 GMT
subject: Re: Blowjobs
It's actually really easy: role play.
Suggest role playing some fun night. Whatever you do (groupie/rock

star, maid/boss, escort/client) puts you in a position of authority so
that you can tell her what to do, and puts her in the position of
being someone other than herself, so that it's okay to do things she
normally wouldn't. It's especially good if you create a role-play
relationship (like rock star/groupie) where BJs are part of the
routine.
Let me know how this works for you! It should open up other aspects of
her sexuality too.
On Thu, 08 Nov 2001 12:59:00 -0500, anton wrote:
>Teach her by example. Suck on her finger the way she should be doing to you.
>If you've established yourself as the boss, simply grab her head with both
>hands, say "No, like this..." and demonstrate the proper technique. But this
>will depend on the girl and whether or not she thinks that she is doing YOU
>a favor, or vice versa.
>
>-Anton
>
><finalD> wrote in message news:431.120@discussion.fastseduction.com...
>> yaritai wrote in news:425.120@discussion.fastseduction.com:
>>
>> > The words, "ooohh yeaaaaaaah, just like THAT! Dooooon't
>> > sttttooooooopp! Don't stop!" didn't seem to mean anything to her.
>>
>> I've had the opposite experience. "Ok, you need to vary your technique
>> more" didn't seem to mean anything to her. I think women like to think of

>> themselves as "going with the flow" so much, that when thinking of
>> themselves as doing something effective actually comes up, it's sometimes
>> an impossibility for them. I don't mind anyone being inexperienced ... I
>do
>> mind when they can't learn, because they're so busy being all wrapped up
>in
>> the experience. Call it selfishness, call it arrogance ...
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Nov 2001 06:24:00 GMT
On Thu, 08 Nov 2001 12:40:00 -0500, atwater88 wrote:
>My projection is very powerful, (years of debate, door to door sales, and
>a bit of theatre) and I found that it is quite counterproductive to
>seduction. I have found that you want much less definition and projection
>in your voice when you're trying to seduce. Once I started speaking to
>girls in my "sexxy voice" I found that the reactions were drastically
>different. Listen to Ross, he doesn't project worth a shit. That is how I
>try to sound, and the results are amazing.
It's funny, because Ross to me sounds like a wimp when he says his
pattterns. It doesn't sound sexy at all to me. Obviously, it works,
but I think there are sexier voices. To tell the truth, I've never met
Ross, but I'm a little intrigued. I like his ideas and methods, but
when you hear him on tape, his jokes are nerdy and corny, his voice is
wimpy, and he comes across like a wet fish. Am I wrong?
Maybe for you, the problem isn't just too much definition and
projection, it's adding sensitivity and heartfelt emotion to your
voice. And how about Barry White? He projects!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Nov 2001 20:48:00 GMT
subject: Re: Another LJBF block

This is great. I think with a little work on some of the language, it

could be a classic! Anyone want to give it a try...
On Thu, 08 Nov 2001 07:11:00 -0500, Nicholas wrote:
>I had this work like a charm last night, and haven't seen it elsewhere.
>Although I don't use patterns and NLP per se, it appears that reading up on
>it has rubbed off on me. Perhaps one of the NLP'ers can work with this and
>clean up any rough edges.
>
>Had dinner last night with a chick who works at the coffeeshop near work.
>We've had lunch a few times, she's even initiated lunch "dates", so I knew
>there was interest on some level. Dinner went well, seems as though we get
>along decently. Sitting at the bar afterwards, I started with kino and
>various other attraction methods, and seemed to get no resistance, but not
>much of a positive response, either. I used Mystery's *close, "Do you want
>me to kiss you?", and got the dreaded LJBF.
>
>Her: "I like you, but I just don't see you in that way"
>
>Me: "That's because you've never tried. I want you to close your eyes (got
>a funny look, like wtf), Come on, close your eyes. (she did). You imagine
>me as a person you like, you enjoy spending time with me, and enjoy my
>company. You like being with me, I make you feel good on an emotional
>level. Now, imagine someone you see as a lover, (at this point, I put my
>arms around her waist, slowly pulling her to me) someone who makes you feel
>good on a physical level, who knows your personality and would be able to
>guess what you like, and aniticipate what you want. Someone who when you
>think about his touch, it sends shivers down your spine, and you want him
>to touch you more. Now, wouldn't you enjoy having both types of guy with
>you at the same time? (by this time I was holding her close to me, easily
>within kissing distance). Open your eyes..."
>
>As soon as she opened them, I kissed her full on the lips. SHE initated
>tongue action. So much for that LJBF shit.
>
>--
>Nick
>
>"That man that hath a tongue, I say, is no man,
>"If with his tongue he cannot win a woman."
>--William Shakespeare, "The Two Gentlemen of Verona", Act 3 scene 1
>
>"Losers always whine about their best...
>"Winners go home and fuck the prom queen."

>--John Mason (Sean Connery) "The Rock"
================================================================================
================================================================================
Fri, 09 Nov 2001 09:06:17 GMT
subject: Re: Mystery LA workshop report
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 12 Nov 2001 08:20:00 GMT
Where did you find the tutors? What were the websites (or search
terms).
Thanks.
On Sun, 11 Nov 2001 19:40:00 -0500, DrToddCallingback wrote:
>I've been searching the Web for information on this subject over the last
>few days. I find a lot of tutors, but no general information or exercises.
>
>I'm wondering if searching for information regarding acting might also help?
>
>Todd
>
>
><ActionMan> wrote in message news:350.106@discussion.fastseduction.com...
>> Alam Palmer wrote:
>> >I'm now taking a voice class. I'm the only guy in a class of eight. The
>class
>> >only has one doable target, a 7.
>>
>> >But I'm there mainly to learn how to control my voice, so I can make >it
>more
>> >seductive.
>>
>> Yes, I have been trying to find a place to take vocal coaching or

>> elocution lessons. I don't want to learn "speech." I want to learn how
>> to enunciate, to speak louder, to speak clearer (all important for
>> walk ups on group sets), and to, of course, sound more seductive. I've
>> searched on the internet, but can't figure out how to find classes or
>> one-on-one tuturs for this. Any suggestions? Alan, how did you find
>> yours?
>>
>>
>
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 13 Nov 2001 22:16:28 GMT
subject: Sunday Sarging Report with Questions
I wanted to deal with a couple issues, but in the form of a field

report. I had a really interesting Sunday of sarging with Swinggcat.
We met Ross J at a museum to test the waters there for future sarging.
It was the first time I had met Ross, and I was impressed: the man is
a master manipulator, in the best sense of the word. Anchors and
patterns were just oozing out of him. My favorite was when we went out
on a balcony to look at a city and, standing near some women, he
commented on how amazing it was to look out at the expanse and see how
all the pieces fit so smoothly into the whole/hole!
Anyway, I #closed there with a pretty cute Asian girl. While waiting
for Ross, I asked her if she had seen my professor anywhere ("a tall
grey-haired gentleman"), started a conversation, and then, making sure
I waited until we were in the middle of a subject, asked if I could
take a seat to wait. I suppose some here might say I should have told
instead of asked, but I knew she'd say yes. I Ev'ed for a while, found
out her trance words (creativity, expression), dropped some deep
thoughts on her, and then looked through her cds. One of the bands she
was into was playing in town next week, so we decided to go together.
Now, interestingly, she seems to be on break from a relationship, and
is reading a Japanese book on the differences between men and women.
So, it seems like she's not looking for a relationship, but not for a
one-night stand either. At the same time, she is intelligent, but a
slow-processor who easily falls into trances and, at movies, often
finds herself focussing on a small object and spacing out. So, with
this info in mind, any suggestions for patterns and framing when I see
her next? What is it that I want to hint that she needs physically

from a man, when it's neither the ideal BF nor the ONS?
Anyway, the museum was a pretty good place to sarge, but I didn't make
as many approaches as I should have: I think I got nervous with Ross
around (it's like trying to play the violin in front of Yo Yo Ma).
Next time, though, I'll play more violin, because I passed up a couple
good opportunities!
Afterwards , Swinggcat and I cruised around a student neighborhood and

had a lot of fun. I haven't really done a lot of street sarging (more
bars and clubs), but it was amazingly easy. We'd just stop someone and
ask for directions; in the process, they'd give us some scrap of info
about themselves. We'd ask a question about it; and then we'd
transition into doing something fun like the Cube with them. Now,
Swinggcat is a genius SS'er, and would get them into amazing trances
for *closes. The best was in a store. I was cubing one super-cute
Asian-Latina girl while he was doing the same with the other girl who
worked there, a hippie chick. They were ignoring the phone and
customers and everything, and, if we were in a club or bar or house,
the hippie girl was so turned on that she would have been all over
Swinggcat. I must learn more NLP! And this leads me to Question Two:
Raised Expectations.
Before ASF and SS and everything else, I was excited just to get one
phone number a week. Now, I know that I can #close with just about any
girl 8 or below, and some girls 9 or 10. And most of the time, I don't
even care to get a number, because I want to *close or fclose that
day. So, now I'm coming home with a pocketful of numbers (one or two
of which I'll actually call), and feeling frustrated or like I failed.
I'm more impatient now if I don't get instant physical results with
these new methods. Does anyone else have this problem of needing to
manage their expectations?
Anyway, we met two bisexual girls in the street who were just
wandering around killing time. To be honest, they weren't that hot,
but they were definitely ready to go and had good sexual energy. They
both lived in the area (we didn't). We did some SS'ing, and that got
them aroused, and had a bit of sex talk. But, when we left, I felt
like we had failed, because a true PUA would have brought them
somewhere private for a little fun once he saw all the IOIs. So, the
question is, if you meet a couple girls in the street during the day,
and you can tell they are up for a little adventure, what is your
strategy for getting them back to their homes (or a hotel or
somewhere)? Obviously, you can't be too blatant: it must be done
smoothly and naturally, so that the mood doesn't break and they don't
feel either scared or slutty or manipulated or whatever. Any

suggestions?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 18 Nov 2001 18:34:27 GMT
subject: How to handle this chick?
Last week I met this chick at a party at the university.

She is a HB 8 and I got good reactions from her from the
beginning.We had a lot of EC and she was really into me at
this evening.We talked the whole time and I always displayed
alpha and social status.She seemed to like that and when she had to go
we exchanged
numbers and kissed on the cheek.
Three days later I met her again at the university and she invited me
to a party in the
evening.So a buddy of me and I went to the party and sat with her and
a female friend
at a table.This evening I sat very close to her and made a lot of
kino.
I started with kinoing her leg and arm when she laughted.Later my legs
touched hers
the whole time.We had a lot of EC and because it was so loud I had to
talk close to her ear
and touched her face with mine.I also tried to mirror a lot and tried
some eleciting values.
We had a lot of fun that evening and in the end I went for the KC.
We had to go and so I looked her deep in the eyes and kissed her.We
started to tonguekiss
heavy for about 10 minutes.My buddy was driving so I had to go and I
kissed her goodby and
we arranged a meeting for the next evening.
The next day we met at a bar in the city.We talked for a while and she
behaved a little bit shy
(no kissing so far and I didn't want to force her).
After we had spent some time at the bar we went to a near pub.It was
cold and so I got my arms
around her while we walked and she seemed to like that.In the pub it
was a better atmosphere.
Candlelight and nice music.After a while we kissed again and this time
very heavy.
From now on I kinoed her a lot and hold her close.Sometimes she
behaved shy again and

I thought she was maybe a little bit unexperienced.We haven't talked

much about sex and relationship,
so I don't know how much experience she has (she's 20 years old).
Maybe that was the problem.Finally we both left the pub to get our
busses.We hugged and toungekissed
the whole evening and she seemed always very comfortable with that.
Now to my problem: The next day we wanted to meet again, but she
didn`t call.Finally I called her and asked if she would come with me
to a club in the evening where I wanted to go with some buddies of
mine.
She apologised for not calling me and sad she was to tired to go
out.She is visiting her parents over the
weekend, so we couldn`t meet again till next week.She promised to call
me and so I spent the night with
my buddies(was fun anyway).Now it`s sunday and she didn`t call so far.
I don`t know why she behaves so strange after she was so into me all
the time.I'm sure I meet her again next
week.So what you think is the best to do?I don't want to appear needy
and there are also other chicks I'm working on at the moment(but no KC
so far).
Should I drop her or how can I work on this chick to get her close to
me again(and get her into my bed as fast as possible).What's the best
thing to say when I talk to her next time?
pimpstylez
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 18 Nov 2001 22:06:00 GMT
subject: Re: Field Report: Kirk's reply: Symbol Fractionations?
On Sat, 17 Nov 2001 20:03:00 -0500, Sandstorm wrote:
><Kirk> wrote in message news:685.151@discussion.fastseduction.com...

>> My methods not only work powerfully, but as I'm finding out by all of the
>> private emails that I've been getting, have been Banned and Forbidden from
>> being used or taught. "Symbol Fractionations" is what it was called I'm
>told.
>
>Banned or forbidden from being used or taught? I doubt that. Free exchange
>of information is a blessing that the constitution grants us. If someone
>chooses to use the same techniques for a less good cause, then that's their

>choice. Don't let it stop you from teaching those of us who simply want to
>learn and absorb information.
>
>... Chris
>
I have an intuition about Kirk. I am not so sure that Kirk really

exists. Right, old man?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 19 Nov 2001 23:41:00 GMT
subject: Re: Study/Learning Tips
On Mon, 19 Nov 2001 04:18:00 -0500, Sandstorm wrote:
>Here is some of the stuff I've done over the past four years:
>
>(1) Read
>(2) Take notes
>(3) Practice speaking into a small recorder
>(4) I often wrote dialogues between myself and random women as short
>stories. (I was an english major) Allowed me the opportunity to refine and
>recreate scenes using newer and better NLP.
>(5) Read more.
>(6) Practice in front of a mirror.
>(7) Practice IRL.
I'd add to this that a great way to practice, besides Svengali's

challenge for approaches, is to find a girl who is already in your
life (a friend or gf or coworker) and choose her to practice with. You
don't necessarily have to try to f-close her. Just, every time before
you hang out with her, memorize a couple patterns or techniques or
games or whatever, then try them on her. See what her reaction is, and
then refine and modify your techniques accordingly. If Svengali's
challenge is the way to learn approaches, I think this is the way to
perfect getting to the next level of building rapport and attraction.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 20 Nov 2001 01:13:00 GMT

subject: New Stripper #close: field test
I've never been a strip club guy, because I know that with a
seduction, I have a better chance of getting laid than at a strip
club, where I'll get played. But, since I was in Las Vegas this
weekend and knew I'd end up in strip clubs, I read Mystery's strip
club stuff in the archives and decided to try my own plan.
I walked in with my friends, and took a seat at the table facing
away from the stage. I didn't look once. When a stripper approached, I
said, "Of all the people at the table, you picked the wrong guy. I'm
completely gay."
Then she said, "A lot of my best customers are gay" and offered
me a massage, and went into the stripper routine of how she was just
doing this for a little while, and really needed the money for the ad
company she wanted to start. Midway through the speech, I cut her off
and said, "Why don't you take my seat and talk to my friend. I'm
keeping you from making money."
(What I should have said also, I realize now, is "Why would I want
to pay you for a massage. I'm trained in Swedish massage, and you
should pay me for a massage.")
I went to the bathroom, then returned and took a seat behind the
table. Another stripper came up and, again, I told her I was gay. Then
I said, "And, do you know what? Even if I was straight, I wouldn't buy
a dance from you.
"Why?" she asked.
"Because my boyfriend is a dancer," I said. "And I know that as
soon as he dances for someone, or starts telling them the same stories
he's told a hundred people that night, he doesn't see them as human
beings. And you actually seem like an interesting person, someone who
I could actually be friends with and do a lot of amazingly fun things
with, and I wouldn't want you to ruin that opportunity." (I didn't
quite deliver this as well as I just wrote it-it was my first
attempt-but it seemed effective.)
Then I told her that she should go make some money, so she sat
on one of my friend's laps but kept talking to me. She touched me a
lot, but I didn't return the kino once. I gave her a variation of the
Natural Woman pattern, saying how most men may think that strippers
are 'sluts' and businesswomen are 'uptight,' but in fact every woman
has two women inside. It worked okay, but then she went into stripper
mode and said, "I love sex." So I just cut her down and said that she
was paid to say that, and we talked for a while. But it was hard to
keep her from delivering her usual routine.
In the meantime, the original stripper who approached went off
with my other friend. She gave me the thumbs up behind his back as she
left, which was great because it meant that we were colleagues-I was

on her side helping her get suckers/customers.

She comes back later with my friend, and thanks me. I tell her
that if she's bored between dances, to come back and I'll keep her
entertained. She returns at various points, and I tell her about my
boyfriend, and pretty much repeat the things I said to the previous
girl. Every now and then I send her away to go make money, and she
makes a lap and then just comes back. She says I'm really interesting,
and I tell her I'm coming to town next week for a concert and don't
know anyone (hint, hint). She says she's into the band, and that if I
can't find anyone to go, I should call her.
I'm really not that into her: this was just practice. I think
it's a good routine though, because I established myself as completely
uninterested in her physically, helped her get business (so that I was
more pimp than customer to her), and then proved my worth as the most
interesting guy in the club. And, if I do actually call her, I'm not
that worried about the gay lie, because if I can get her attracted
enough to me, it won't matter. It may even be more of a fun challenge
for her. Any thoughts on this approach? I'm excited to work on it and
refine it. (And I'm kind of proud of myself for pulling off the whole
gay-guy-dating-male-stripper charade.)
Now, one more thing: one of my friends, who is older and not
that attractive, but is pretty cool and has a kick-ass job, went off
for a lapdance with a stripper, who totally suckered him into one.
Back there, he said, "Go gentle. I have a wife at home, and am not
really looking for wet pants or anything." Anyway, they talked a lot,
and she asked him where he was staying and if it was okay if she came
over tonight or tomorrow. They stayed back there for two songs
talking, even though he only paid for one. He also said that her palms
were sweaty after the talk and light dance, as if she was excited. And
then, when we left the club, her stripper friend asked my friend, "Did
you get Rachel's number?"
Now, the question is this: was this just a stripper tactic to
give my friend his money's worth (or get him to return), or was she
actually interested? And if she was actually interested in him after
he paid for a dance, does this mean that stripper rules don't always
have to be followed? Or does it mean that if you have a cool job with
a little power, it doesn't really matter what you do in the club?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 20 Nov 2001 18:57:00 GMT
subject: Re: trying for too much too fast

Fatass,
Nice to see you posting a field report. I'm used to seeing you giving
advice rather than seeking it, so I'm glad to offer my two cents.
On Tue, 20 Nov 2001 08:49:00 -0500, Fatass wrote:
>I do this so often....

>
>Met a cute shop girl this morning. Started right out with stroking her
>hair, touching her arm, then grabbed her hand and faked a palm-reading
>routine. She was into it, lots of smiles and that excited look whenever I
>leaned in real close and put my face close to hers and lowered my voice to
>a whisper, blah blah blah.
>
>When I didn't see anywhere more to go at the moment (she was working,
>right?) and did not want to dick around with a # close, I told her I would
>see her again sometime (why didn't I make that a *definite* sometime?
>Aha!)
Know your ABCs. Always Be Closing (though I guess you did try the
close below). I say this because I let someone I should have closed
get away this weeking, figuring I'd run into her later that night.
And, of course, I didn't, and she was the cutest HB I met all week.
and leaned in to give her a kiss on the lips (Mystery sez if she
>won't kiss you, she won't fuck you). She turned her cheek to me, but I
>pointed to my lips (Fatass sez if you'll kiss her cheek you'll kiss her
>ass) and tried again, but she just wasn't there yet. I smiled and said a
>pleasant goodbye and was gone.
Yeah, there's nothing worse than the turned face, to our male ego. You
should have done the cheek point at this stage to say bye. I like this
one, because no girl will refuse a cheek peck, and you're
demonstrating physical control to her. You point, and she responds
physically.
>
>Normally, this would be the cutoff point for me. I fucked up; I tried to
>kiss her before demonstrating value sufficiently. NEXT! I do this a lot
>because I want to get to point B or get the fuck out of the place.
>
>It occurs to me that I might go back and try over, but now I've tipped my
>hand. I figure that because I tried to kiss her and failed, it was not a
>pickup; what I did was HIT on her, and now she knows my intentions. In a
>way that's good, but it also means that I can expect the ol' bitch shield

>to be up. If you were me, would you bother or just keep movin' on?
Fatass, a funny thing about girls is that it doesn't matter. All you
did was act charming, and then (very cooly) point to your lips. She
doesn't see it as rejecting you, the way you may see it. She just sees
it as "I don't know him well enough yet." Generally, if I move too
early and something like this happens, I'll pursue. If I've
demonstrated enough value, made an emotional connection, done all the
work, and everything seems right for a real *close, and I get cheeked,
I will eject. (The funny thing in these cases is that the girl always
calls and emails after I go silent.)
>
>As I sit here writing, I see what I did wrong. I should have said "I can
>see you're busy working now, so why don't you meet me tomorrow etc."
>Geezus. You know what my real problem is? I get fucking LOST in the
>moment. Can't think. The most obvious shit escapes me. I stand there
>playing with her hand and looking at her eyes, and I just can't fucking do
>the most obvious, simple things.
I know, Fatass. That's why just about all of us here need to be doing
this more in real life and reading NGs a little less, so that we can
internalize this stuff and it becomes instinct.
>
>You know what I'm going to do? I'm going to write some of this shit down
>on an index card (encoded, of course) and carry it around and just whip it
>out and look at it when I need to.
>
>A. Ask her to meet you later.
>B. THEN kiss her.
>C. etc.
It still might not have worked with this girl, because of the
environment. Even in this case, I still would have set up the next
meeting, future-paced, cheek-pointed, and left her flushed and
wondering.
>
>I mean it. My mind just goes blank. And you know what rushes in to fill
>the empty space? "God, she has beautiful eyes. I'd love to lick those
>lips. I wonder if she's wearing underpants."
Yeah, I've trained myself to stop thinking that. And think, "She is
melting when she looks into my eyes. She is thinking about kissing my
lips when I speak. I wonder if she knows how hung I am."

I don't know if this is the right attitude, but instead of lusting

after her I'm trying to make her desire me. This mindset seems to give
me the control I need to execute the PU.
>
>I also met a girl this morning who didn't know who Elvis was. I was
>stunned. :-))
You didn't use the Elvis opener, did you? I've never really gotten
into that one. (Anyway, I savor it when a girl doesn't know who Elvis
or someone obvious is, because it's a good opening for light negging,
teasing and flirting)
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 20 Nov 2001 19:47:00 GMT
subject: Getting into her house
I went out with the Asian (Japanese) girl I met sarging with Swingcatt
and Ross (see previous field report). She was a lot of fun, and really
responded well to patterns, so I got to make up a lot. I turned all
the cord-of-light stuff (and energy building inside needing release)
from the instant connection pattern, for example, into a pattern on
the way a certain singer connects with his audience, but of course
gesturing between us and firing anchors as if I'm the singer and she's
the audience.
Anyway, we make out in the club, and she's fairly responsive. Then we
pull up outside her house, and are still going at it. She's into it,
but also moves my hand a little if it goes anywhere too, um, private.
I know that if I could get upstairs, it would all be okay. But, I know
that saying, "Let's take this somewhere more comfortable" or "why
don't we go upstairs" will be too direct for her. So, when you can't
get to your house, what are your tactics for coming up with an excuse
to go to a HB's house? Obviously, if it's your house, it's easy to
come up with something to show her, play for her, whatever, and you
both know what the subtext is, but what do you do for HER house? (Are
there any props you could bring--something you want to show her but
need to do it in the privacy of a house as opposed to a car or a bar?)
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Wed, 21 Nov 2001 11:50:00 GMT
subject: Re: Discussion of SOIs
On Wed, 21 Nov 2001 02:01:00 -0500, To mas wrote:
>
>Often I think us males forget that the other (female) half of the human race
>are born without penises. They simply do not feel pleasure in life the way
>in which we do. Yes they can have orgasms, but I would be willing to bet
>that if they experienced a man's orgasm for just a split second it would
>literally BLOW THEIR FUCKING MINDS.
Nice post, but have to disagree with you here. I've been with women
who have super-intense, body-quaking orgasms that blow male orgasms
away, to the point where they just collapse in hysterics, crying and
laughing at the same time. So, one would think, why wouldn't these
women want to have these orgasms all the time. And the answer is that
they can usually only have them with someone they feel completely
comfortable with in bed (and usually have an emotional connection with
as well). So one could see that need to make an emotional connection
and feel comfortable with someone before jumping in bed with them as,
perhaps, a need that's motivated by a desire ultimately for physical
pleasure...
================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:04:44 GMT
subject: Re: Seduction and Improv
Actually, improv can help your game. But not enough to make it worth
taking the class for that reason alone. Here's how improv helps--and
ONLY if you have a good teacher (email me if you want
recommendations):
1. Learning to do good improv is not about "being funny," it's

actually about learning to create a relationship with someone on the
spot. So, several of these tactics apply to PU'ing. In addition, the
things you learn about creating relationships in improv are very easy
to spin into good patterns in conversations with a HB.

2. It's also good for learning to be in the moment more, to walk into
a scene without a script (which sometimes we rely on too heavily here)
and completely create a relationship out of nothing by simply
responding affirmatively to what the other person says and then
escalating it (and often making a game of it). But, though it's a lot
of fun and pretty cool (and there always a couple HBs in a class), I
find that improv hasn't necessarily made me any quicker or cleverer
when sarging.
Wayne Rasmussen <wjrasmussen@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<3BFB49D1.A14A152D@earthlink.

net>...
> No. For good improv you need to think quickly on your feet. The class
> can't teach that. You might learn to be funnier. If you want to get
> better you have to go out and seduce.
>
> If you want to be a comedian then take a improv class.
> If you want to be a mechanic, take an autoshop class.
> If you want to be a chef, take a cooking class.
>
> if you want to be a pickup artist...
>
> Logan wrote:
>
> > Has anyone taken comedy improv classes? if so, do you think it has
> > helped with seduction/PU?
>>
> > Approaching/PU depends IME on being able to stay "in the moment" with
> > a girl. Improve depends on the same thing, so it would probably help.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:19:12 GMT
subject: Re: Getting into her house
Chris,
Not that I condone such behavior, but it does create an atmosphere of

transgression and of breaking society taboos.
Yaritai,
I'd love to post this on fastseduction, but, for some reason, after my

first posts there, CPowles100 became a "deleted user" and I can't log
back on. It's strange. Formhandle, can you email me and let me know
what I need to do to reactivate the name. I'd like to use it there,
since it's the name I use here on ASF.
[Also, I believe Chris had me post a field report on fastseduction,

promising to share some answers and thoughts. Chris, I love your
posts, man, but I hope when you're sarging you deliver what you
promise! How about a little congruence! Just teasing -- but still
waiting :) ]
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 22 Nov 2001 01:53:00 GMT
subject: Wordless PUs
The first PUA I met was a friend who was able to just make eye contact
with a HB. He'd walk away, she'd follow him, they'd make out or
whatever in the corner, and then, sometimes, they'd just part without
a word exchanged.
Anyone ever done this? I figure it's just a few easy steps. And all it
takes is choosing the right person and, most important, going in with
total and complete confidence, without hesitating for even a
millisecond.
I've always relied on talk first, though there's been that rare time
when I've just felt the vibe and gone for it with someone I was
sitting next to without even having talked to her.
I'd like to play around with wordless making out and *closes (I guess
they'd technically be *opens) more often. Any thoughts or suggestions
from people who do this?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 22 Nov 2001 10:18:00 GMT
subject: Re: Kirk gives the little brat a spanking
I must say that I'm impressed. Theory in action. And you do make it

sound as easy as promised. (Plus, very nice transition into the

synesthesia routine.)
Out of curiosity, what's the point of the age regression? Is it just

to tease and neg her, or is it necessary before beginning the
synesthesia thing?
On Thu, 22 Nov 2001 12:31:00 -0500, Kirk wrote:
>Kirk gives the little brat a spanking

>
>After a long day at work, I decided to go to the local bar for a
>scotch. My energy wasn’t entirely up to par and I felt a bit agitated.
>
>As I was sitting down drinking my scotch, an attractive but seemingly
>Inept young lass reached close to me to get a drink, inadvertently elbowing
>me in the process. I looked over at her and said sarcastically,
>
>Kirk: “Excuse me, but I don’t like to be touched by people I don’t
>know.”
>
>She seemed taken aback by my comment although she recognized the
>sarcasm and bumped me again saying
>
>Michelle: “Oh, excuse me”.
>I smiled and thought to myself, “She wants to play.”
>I looked at her and I noticed the size of her high heels. Then I said
>To her,
>Kirk: ”How tall are those shoes?”
>Michelle: “Not that tall”, she responded.
>Kirk: “How tall are you without the shoes?” I said.
>Michelle: “5’6”.
>As I continued to look her over, I said smiling,
>Kirk: “Little girl, how old are you?”
>Michelle: testing me “How old do I look?”
>Kirk: “14, 13?”
>Michelle: “26”
>Kirk: “Oh, wow, you look a lot younger.”
>Michelle: “I know, I’ve been told I look 17.”
>Kirk: “Well you are a little girl right?” “Little girl. You don’t think
>26year old, you think 13, 14 year old little girl.”
>Michelle: “Yeah,”
>Kirk: “Aren’t you a little old to be a little girl?”
>Michelle: With hesitation she says, “What?”
>Kirk: “Aren’t you a little old to be a little girl?”
>Michelle: “No, I’m not old. I’m am a little girl.”

>Kirk: “26? That is like 45 in girl years.”

>Michelle: “45 in girl years?”
>Kirk: “Yes, you didn’t know that?”
>Michelle: Defensive: “I’m not old at all, I don’t look it, so
>whatever.”
>
>Kirk: “Well if you think about models, most of them peak at 19, and
>After that it’s all downhill. So being 26 years old, you’re like 45 in girl
> years.”
>
>Notice how I didn’t go to the bar to “pick up women”. I just chat
>Everyone up to find the ones that want to play.
>At this point, I calibrated her discomfort and wanted to focus on
>Building more rapport.
>
>We small chatted and got acquainted as I focused most of the
>conversation on her and her responses, building Rapport and continuing to
evoke
>good
>states, values, anchoring, and making her feel good.
>
>At one point I noticed her rubbing her arm so I asked her:
>
>Kirk: “Why do you keep rubbing your arm?”
>Michelle: “Because I like to.”
>Kirk: “You’re a kinesthetic aren’t you?”
>Michelle: “What does that mean?”
>Kirk: “You’re the sort of person that can probably remember the feel of a
>smooth texture. Or what it feels like to feel the wind blowing on your skin,
>and the sunlight shining on your face. Or being at the beach with the feel of
>the warm sand between your toes, or how wonderful it feels when
>Someone you feel connected deeply to caresses your smooth skin in all of those
>sensitive and wonderful places.”
>
>At this point, I noticed that distant look in her eyes. I said,
>Kirk: “You can remember when that’s happened, right?”
>Michelle: “Oh, my God. I LOVE when a guy touches me and have that feeling of
>closeness.”
>Kirk: “As you can remember that, and you can feel it now, where do you feel it
>most in your body?”
>Michelle: “Right here” pointing to her upper chest.
>Kirk: “Here is something that will blow your mind. Have you ever tried
>synesthesia?
>Michelle: “What’s that?”
>Kirk: “As you focus in on this feeling right here, (Touching her upper
>chest) notice that the more you begin to focus in on this feeling, the

>more you can begin now to see a color flowing from this feeling, what color
>would that be?”
>Michelle: “Red, with bright sparkles inside”
>Kirk: “Now what was that like? How good did that feel?”
>Michelle: “Wow, that was Crazy?”
>Kirk: “Now, I’m curious. Whenever you’ve been able to feel this close
>With someone special, how were you able to get there?”
>Michelle: “I’ve had to feel secure”
>Kirk: “Now if you were to feel this secure feeling now (Anchoring left
>palm) and turn all of this feeling into a form, what would this be?”
>Michelle: “It would be like a cloud?”
>Kirk: “Now remember the red sparkles right here?” (Touching chest)
>Michelle: “Yeah” smiling, eyes glazing
>Kirk: “Good, now what would it be like if you were to allow all of
>Those feelings, all of those red sparkles flowing now from here (Touching
>chest) to here (moving finger down to lower abdomen) and now as you really
>focus in on all of those feelings and close your eyes, because the interesting
>thing is, is with each breath that you take, all of those feelings and all of
>those sparkles begin to grow bigger and brighter, and the bigger and
>brighter that they grow, the more intense you can feel those feelings.”
>“Now notice how you can take those feelings and move them up to your
>chest and feel them flowing through your body, across your chest, to your
>shoulder now, and down your arm, down your forearm, all the way here to the
>palm
>of your hand. And the interesting thing is, that you can open your eyes
>now and see those red sparkles right here in the palm of your hand.” “Now do
>you remember the cloud?”
>Michelle: “Yes”
>Kirk: “Now what would it be like if you were to see this cloud in this
>Other hand clearly now, and as you bring your hands together, and the cloud
>Begins to mix with the red sparkles, now what is that like?” Her hands were
>together now and my hands we around hers.
>Michelle: “That is so crazy” Staring glazed and bleary eyed.
>Kirk: “Now notice as you send this from your hands into mine, that I
>can put it right here into your chest.”
>Kirk: “And how I can take it out again, and now put it back in, as you
>Feel it even more intensely.” “Now how good does that feel?”
>Michelle: “Mmmm…”
>Kirk: “Now as I take this out again, and brush it along the surface of
>Your skin, where you can feel this energy beginning to soak through your
>skin. Notice how wherever I touch you, this leaves a trail of energy flowing,
>and moving through you. And wherever you can feel this energy spreading,
>the deeper you want to allow yourself to feel these feelings becoming even
>more intense.”
>
>I began to move my hand from her shoulders to her chest and down to her

>lower stomach.
>
>At this point she was entirely in state and looked at me with eyes half
>closed. I congruently looked at her eyes deeply and began to kiss her
>fully and passionately. As she began to really get into it, I pulled away and
>said,
>
>Kirk: “Let’s take this somewhere else more private.”
>
>It was late evening now as she took my hand, walked with me out the
>door and lets just say that I spanked her hard that night.
>
>K.
>
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 22 Nov 2001 10:26:00 GMT
subject: Re: about kiss-closing
On Wed, 21 Nov 2001 16:43:00 -0500, Kriminal wrote:
>
>
>Thats true in never asking a chick what or what she doesnt want to do. I
>think a lot like mystery but the kiss close is just too AFC. As always the
>rule, what works for one man may not work for another. This also goes for
>touch. I do NOT touch excessively. Only on rare occasions when I make her
>laugh i'll touch her elbow.
>
>Its funny though, but another indication of interest is to not touch her and
>see how she reacts. You can see that she is gonna start touching you. So in
>effect the more you back off the more she'll go outta her way. Women are
>finicky about touch and touch can only be done once you have rapport, and
>even then, it must be kept to an absolute minimum. Once again, what works
>for one man, may not work for another.
Hmm, I'm sort of confused on the kino thing. Before SS and ASF, I
never touched. Now, I'm pretty touchy--putting my hands on their
shoulders first, then on their waist. I'm not sure which method is
better--touching or not touching. I do think there's a danger of being
seen as a "groper." And, now that I read your post Kriminal, I wonder

if a good thing to do is "selective touch." In other words, don't just

touch her at every opportunity you get. Choose your touches carefully,
and do them with confidence. In other words, suddenly hold her waist
and turn her towards you. Or, while you're talking, just hold her arm
(level with the breast) firmly and look her deep in the eye to say
something. And then, after these things, back off again.
What do others here think of, instead of having constant kino, making
just a few kino moves that are very sexy and confident, and get her
imagination going?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Thu, 22 Nov 2001 11:16:28 GMT
subject: When Girls Approach
I went out tonight and got five numbers (four with 8s and 9s--and all
with SOLID plans). In my AFC days, I'd think I was a stud for all
this. But now, all I can think about is how I could have done better,
approached more, flirted and SS'ed better, and gone for more * and
fcloses.
So, before I get to the successes, I need some serious help with this
one failure. I went to a great club in LA that was just packed with
HBs--and hardly one was under a 7. Hell, even Hugh Hefner was there,
surrounded by like seven HBs dancing around him and on his table.
Anyway, as soon as I get there, the pivots I'm with go to the

bathroom. I'm alone, and I sit on a couch. As I'm sitting there
thinking how this is all wrong for generating social proof, three
girls just come up and surround me on the couch. They're like 7s (sort
of not-too-bright party girls) and put their arms around me and tell
me what a lucky guy I am. And I smiled and joked a little and told a
good story, but, one by one, they drifted away. I could tell I wasn't
holding their interest. They were like ready for action, and I froze.
This is because the openers I know don't work (because the girls want
to get past that), building rapport and NLP is useless here (because
it takes too much time), and phase-shifting into making a physical
move won't work on a group of three. What would you have done here?
Please tell me, because for some reason I always seem to get stuck
when a gift like this falls into my lap without any work.
Anyway, luckily, two really cute brunettes sit next to me. And I tell

them that I was discussing something with the other girls, and would
be curious to hear their opinion. I then tell the same story (about
spirituality)that failed with the three girls, but this time it works.
And we get in a deep discussion, and they give me their numbers (one
lives with a BF so she gives me her cell #--a good IOI) and make me
promise to call them.
Later, I'm talking with my pivots and a 9.5 (exotic, amazingly stacked
Latin-Asian) walks by. I turn around and ask her how old she is. She
says "23." I tell my friends, "See, that's 29 in dog years for girls."
(Thanks to Kirk at fastseduction discussion for that one.) She sits
down nearby, but keeps looking over. I walk up to her later and
explain the comment politely. I do some EV'ing, some palmreading, and
lots and lots of kino. We #close, though I should have *closed but she
had too many friends in the area.
I hear a really hot blonde saying it's her birthday tomorrow. I

memorize her face so that I can come up to her later and "guess" her
birthday (which I do, and it freaks her out). In the meantime, a pivot
wants a cigarette. I tell a small, cute blonde (8), "If I can guess
your name, will you give me a cigarette." She says that the comment is
original, and then gives me one. I ask to see her palms, and take her
to a seat to read them. We #close and promise to go dancing together.
But she has been in love with the same guy for three years and they
decided to take a break a week ago. He's there, and later she brings
him by to introduce him. I can tell she feels guilty for giving me her
number in front of his friends, and he is sizing me up. I'm so cool in
these situations that, while he's trying to prove how alpha he is
around me to her, I make friends with him and even get his number,
totally disarming him. I don't really thing the blonde 8 is worth
pursuing under this circumstance, though.
Later, at another bar, a 5 is all over me, her hands on my chest,

talking about how badly she wanted to "do" some guy who left and about
how she owns her boyfriend's penis. I have some fun suggesting that we
pick up a girl for a threeway (she hugs me when I suggest the idea)
and then try to eject, but she forces her number on me when I'm
leaving. And says "just as friends, okay?" Sure...not that i'll call
anyway.
Anyway, some closing thoughts. One of my pivots had some good comments
on this stuff. On the neg about age, she said: "Girls think all night
about comments like that. When you come up to them later, they
remember you."
And on the importance of having stories, routines, gimmicks, etc.

prepared: "At these places, I always see guys I think are cute. And I
wait all night for them to come and talk to me. Then, when they
finally do come up, they're so boring that I wonder why I was wasting
my time."
Anyway, this post may be a little long, but let me know what you would
have done with those first three party girls to demonstrate value
instantly.
Practice
Makes
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 22 Nov 2001 18:10:00 GMT
subject: Re: Wordless PUs
Doc, My friend wasn't really a good-looking guy. And it won't

necessarily be easy if you're a good-looking guy. What you need is the
right presence: comfortable, relaxed, a deep sensitive gaze, slightly
moist lips that seem almost irresistable. When I've done it, I've
noticed that it was a certain friendly, open, seductive vibe I was
putting out. I just can't figure out how to call it up at will!
And, Proto, I agree that it's mainly a thing to do in clubs and bars.
So, tell us, how'd you pull this off in a bank line?! I'm dying to
hear this one...
On Thu, 22 Nov 2001 10:20:00 -0500, Proto wrote:
>You can do it if you not particular handsome, but it will depend a lot on the
>environment.
>
>My experience is that it is much more appropriate for clubs etc then
>street/shop pick ups, although it seems that when you get to know how to do it
>it actually works elsewhere too. I just surprised myself with a silent
>seduction when I was waiting at the local bank.
>
>Love,
>
>Proto

>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 23 Nov 2001 08:24:00 GMT
subject: Re: Unorthodox PU style
On Fri, 23 Nov 2001 12:53:00 -0500, SuperBobo wrote:
>Once I had a friend who was a natural and asked him straight up what he did,
>and he said he didn't know. Then I started asking him more specific questions
>about how he related to girls and how he looked at them and what he did with
>his eyes and body and stuff and he poured out a bunch of really helpful
stuff..
Want to share it here?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 23 Nov 2001 08:31:00 GMT
subject: Re: Great place to pick up
Nice one. And you know what may even be better: Penn Station at 4
a.m., when the bars are closed and maybe there's an HB there who's
missed her last train and isn't looking forward to crashing out in a
train station.
Next time I'm in NY, and have a bad night in the bars, I just might
have to hit this up on the way home. In fact, now that I think about
it, a good harmless opener would be to ask if she's seen "a girl with
blonde hair in a powder blue cowboy hat" (or whatever). Say she just
called and wanted to crash at your place because she missed her train,
but now you can't find her. Then, after building some rapport with the
target, invite her over, so that the sofabed you prepared for your
friend doesn't go to waste.
Let us know when you field test any of this Penn Station stuff...

On Fri, 23 Nov 2001 02:49:00 -0500, violet_lotus wrote:
>You know what looks like a great place to pickup?

>
>Penn Station on a weekend night.
>
>(I don't know if other cities have a similar situation with their train
>station.)
>
>Basically, every HB on Long Island going clubbing in NYC has to pass
>through the LIRR waiting room. Do you know how many hot girls there are in
>LI? (I suppose you could wait in Amtrak to pick up New Jersey chicks, but
>who wants a girl from NJ?? Seriously, though, this terminal has many fewer
>HBs.) The train seems to be the preferred method of transport for people
>that live at least half an hour outside the city, even for wealthy people
>with cars.
>
>I believe it is better to get there BEFORE clubbing time, as people are
>more sober, more excited, less tired, and there at a more consistent time
>(people arrive mostly between 9pm and midnight, but people leave from
>midnight to 4am). I am not yet sure when is the optimal time.
>
>* Many many HBs! Like the equivalent of six mega-clubs! And the stock is
>replaced every half-hour!
>* The gamut of HB club-chicks.
>* HBs are not yet in the club so they are psyched but have not put up
>their bitch shield yet.
>* No cover!!!
>* Quiet enough to talk.
>
>The cons are somewhat important to consider, though: * If you catch girls
>arriving (and they WILL arrive as a group), they are already GOING once
>they get off the train. So extracting one of them is somewhat tricky. *
>And to a lesser extent: Any girl you PU will have to take the train to see
>you. (But this does remove prospective buyers from mere browsers ;)
>
>I have had little experience with this scenario, as I usually am in a rush
>to catch a train when I'm in Penn Station. BUT, I am considering making a
>detour here at least once a week to see what I can do.
>
>--
>O-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-O
> violet lotus
> poison carrying assassin
>

> "To hold a pen is to be at war." --- Voltaire

>O-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-O
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sat, 24 Nov 2001 12:20:38 GMT
subject: Re: Trashy Chicks
letsfacethetruth@hotmail.com (Enlightened One) wrote in message news:

<d3591106.0111231916.1e3b6e@posting.google.com>...
> Where are these trashy chicks.
Las Vegas, where else? Just got back from a night out. Tons of
#closes, two *closes, and would have had a fclose if I could have
seperated one HB (tall, black hair, huge breasts) from her best
friend. But she gave me tons of IOIs and kept saying "if my friend
wasn't here...," so I figure it's on for tomorrow if I can remove the
obstacle (or, even better, include the obstacle).
Anyway, what worked for me tonight was:
1. Tons of social proof. I had three sets of HBs, and I'd just move
from one to the other, and I noticed that the more I was getting
attention from HB9s (all three of which had bfs--and all three of
which I #closed), the more blatant the HB8s would be in coming on to
me. By the end of the night, women were just coming up to me saying,
"Don't I know you from somewhere?"
2. Knowing where the party was. I made myself the leader of the group,
I got them into the clubs. Anyone who wanted to know what was going on
had to come to me. I put myself in the position of host, "the guy
taking care of everything to make sure everyone has a good time." It
really worked for me tonight.
But, I still would like some advice for cold approaches with trashy
chicks! After all, despite all the attention and kino and making out,
I'm still back in my hotel room alone tonight on ASF!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>

Sat, 24 Nov 2001 12:40:00 GMT

subject: Re: Great place to pick up
On Fri, 23 Nov 2001 13:54:00 -0500, alexknyc wrote:
>Just a quick note-- Penn Station trains operate 24/7.
Not to all destination! I've known many a girl who's been stranded.
Same with Grand Central, come to think of it.
And VioletLotus, I'll be in NY next week. What's the best way to get
in touch with you for some sarging?
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 26 Nov 2001 18:40:13 GMT
subject: Re: When Girls Approach
Delirium <maddox1@home.com> wrote in message news:<6t4svtcepj2ogf5uca6felu0grn7jt6bma@4ax.com>...

>
> I'm curious how you explain this one to her?
MF'ing deja made me lose my whole response to you. So I will type it

again now, the condensed version.
This is easy. I just came up and said, "I didn't mean to come across
as rude before. My friends and I were just talking about how women age
differently from men. As men get older and mature, a lot of women
think they become more attractive. But for women, once you hit 20,
you're like already too old to be a model. So 19 in girl years is like
27 in regular years. So we were saying that it was unfair of our
society to age women so quickly. If you think about it in evolutionary
terms, a woman doesn't reach her sexual prime until much later in
life."
This would have made a good transition into the natural woman pattern,
but instead I sort of threw in another mini neg. "So when you walked
by, I thought you'd make a perfect example."
She said, "You keep insulting me" (laughing)
I said, laughing too and starting kino, "accidentally" And then I
gestured to this bench nearby and said, "Let's sit down. I'll

explain." And then went straight into my routine without ever really
explaining... This was all improvised on the fly (based on a Kirk post
on Formhandle's site, but I was basically trying to explain the
comment to her without apologizing (and with negs combined with slight
sex talk, animated conversation, and smiling).
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 26 Nov 2001 18:55:24 GMT
subject: Re: When Girls Approach
bromo@ou.edu (Kontol) wrote in message news:<54f698cd.0111240927.3586c8ce@posting.google.com>...

> Chris,
>
> How did you "disarm" her boyfriend by being cool and even got his #?
> Details on the conversation/situation you had would be great.
Guys here always seem to ask this. It was super-easy. In fact, it was
kind of funny. I just asked him usual fluff talk questions. She had
already told me that he played Lacrosse professionally (he was about
20x more goodlooking than me), so we talked about that and how he had
just moved to XXX. So I just said I go to XXX all the time, and
thought it was really cool and the people there are really friendly.
And then I said next time I was there, I could introduce him to some
cool people. It was funny, because after he gave me his number, he
suddenly went up to his girlfriend and started jumping around, trying
to sort of do a dance move and show that he was a fun, party guy. I
sort of saw it as him almost subconsciously realizing what had just
happened and suddenly returning to his original mission (showing his
primate mastery over his girl). His girl didn't respond really, and
looked over at me and smiled (as if to say, "Do you see what I have to
deal with?") She told me not to forget to call her on the way out, but
again I just get the feeling that, even though she's very cute in a
"upper middle class daddy's girl" way, it's not worth the time because
she is still really emotionally attached to this guy she went out with
for so long and sees him as the love of her life (even though they're
temporarily broken up).
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 26 Nov 2001 21:48:04 GMT

subject: Sexualizing Your Game
I'm so close that I can almost taste it, but I have one major sticking
point and need some serious advice from you all. (If you're in a rush,
just skip to the last paragraph of this post):
I just got back from an amazing weekend, but not amazing enough. I got
12 #closes. Two were with girls who work at Hooters and one with a
stripper (all were off duty at the time). Another one was a total 9.9
(tall pale black haired model type, with a serious bf, but so smart
and cool I'd settle for friends if the bf destroyers don't work). Then
there was this sick Latin 9.5 (thin, baby face, and huge soft natural
breasts), and a girl I consider a 9.5 (a thin blackhaired girl with a
perfect slender body and two liprings--how do you kiss a girl with
liprings? Anyone?). Probably one of my best weekends sarging, in terms
of attractiveness of HBs. (It helped that I had lots of social proof
all weekend, and knew tons of people.)
Now, here's where I need help. Despite all this success (at one point
I was on a couch with like six hbs begging to be next for handwriting
analysis--it was ridiculous), I only *closed once. And I had a failed
*close with one of the Hooters girls. I knew she liked me (tons of
hair playing and manipulating her friends so she could stand next to
me and even calling my cell phone to find me whenever we separated),
but I lost confidence for a moment when I went in for the *close, so I
got rebuked.
The way I see it, my sticking point right now is sexualizing my game.
This is especially true with 8s and above, where it's more of a
challenge I'd like to come across, after the initial opener and
rapport building, as someone they want to sleep with THEN. What are
ways that others here use to accomplish this. Of course, I use kino,
patterns, self-points, story-telling, etc. But something is still
missing. What are ways others here use to get a girl to see them and
think of them sexually, both overt and subtle (body language,
tonality, eyes, types of kino)? A lot of HBs said I was one of the
most interesting guys they had ever met, but I still felt like I was a
small step away from making them want me in "that special way deep
inside." I'll probably get there with at least two of or three them
over the coming weeks, but I'd like to put off more of a vibe for a
faster physical close with 8s and above. I'm also looking for "making
the move" confidence builders, because, although I have no fear with
approaches, I sometimes start thinking too much before kissing("How
should I go for the close? what if I get rejected?") and blow it.

================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 27 Nov 2001 08:43:19 GMT
subject: Re: Sexualizing Your Game
alan@sci-log.apana.org.au (Alan Palmer) wrote in message news:<ac5aed8d.0111261825.5790831f@posting.

google.com>...
> Kino is the key. My guess is your sticking point is there.

>
> Describe what kino you are doing in detail: what, how, when.
Yes, maybe you and SuperBobo are right. The key is in the kino. I
think maybe I've interpreted kino to mean simply making body contact
when we speak--just touching shoulder and, then later, waist when we
laugh or or make strong points of agreement. (At least for initial
kino, as opposed to the heavy kino or hand-holding test if things go
well.)But, maybe, kino should be less about quantity and more about
quality. A few well placed stimulating touches instead of a lot of
contact? Maybe my problem is that I reserve more firm, arousing
touching for the bedroom, and don't do anything suggestive enough
beforehand.
So, Alan, SuperBobo, and anyone else here, can you tell me how you use
kino (or how I should)? Not just where and how, but also when etc. The
sooner the better, because tomorrow (Tuesday) I'm seeing one of the
HBs I #closed with a couple days ago in the "When Girls Approach"
post. Thank you so much for the replies, and for reminding me why ASF
is such a godsend. Your advice will be implemented immediately!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 28 Nov 2001 07:46:00 GMT
subject: Re: An anti-trouble # close, passive force
Yes, this is a good one. I do it all the time. And, of the #closes
that I've called, I haven't gotten one fake number. Even once, when an
Italian HB said "just give me your number and I'll call you," I didn't
respond and just did the paper-ripping trick. And she gave me her

number. Like you said, it's very hard for her to refuse with a paper
and pencil in her hands without being very obnoxious.
On Wed, 28 Nov 2001 02:32:00 -0500, Treeland_AZ wrote:
>Used this earlier tonight and thought I'd post it since it's so simple. I was
>working a girl (eh, only a 7, barely made fuckable), and was doing a mild job
>at it. Anyway, finally got around to asking for her number and I got the "give
>me your number" response. I said ok and took a bit of junk paper out of my
>pocket, ripped it in half and handed her half. Wrote my number on my half and
>let her use the pencil stub for her own piece. She threw down her number, we
>swapped paper, and that was that.
>
>I call it passive force and use in alot of things. It's pushing her into a
>corner so to speak. She's expected to put her number down, she can't just hand
>it back to you without looking bad. You bypass having to finess her into
giving
>up the number, and you didn't have to speak a word to do it. At worst you'll
>get a fake number if you didn't spellbind them enough. At best it turns an
>annoying situation around alot easier then playing the "I dont give out my
>number, you'll just show it off and throw it on the pile etc etc etc" game.
>
>Anyway, hope that helps someone out there in the future, if anyones using some
>similar passive force techniques, lets hear them :).
>Nova (Treeland_AZ)
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 28 Nov 2001 07:52:00 GMT
subject: Getting the *close straight
When I read here about people getting a *close, sometimes I wonder

just what they mean.
When I say *close, I'm talking about some serious kissing, with
tongue. When others say *close, it sounds like they just got a peck on
the lips. Which is the right definition? I'd assume the former, but
maybe I'm wrong.
I couldn't find a specific enough definition in the FAQ, but maybe I

wasn't looking hard enough.

================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 28 Nov 2001 08:20:30 GMT
subject: Re: First SS outing: the symphony
I hate deja! I wrote a long ass response to this post and f-ing lost
it again.
Anyway, Mike, it sounds to me like you're taking a baby step in the
right direction. You're getting out there, finding a target, and
working up the nerve to speak to her.
But, I can tell just from the way you write, that you're too nervous.
You think too much. There comes a time to stop thinking and just do.
See comments below.
"Mike W" <mwen@houston.rr.com> wrote in message news:<z2ZM7.29641$sq2.1030707@typhoon.austin.rr.

com>...
> The music was some Haydn shit, so my mind wandered all over the place and I
> saw one HB6 who is sitting by herself at the end of the lower floor. Since
> she's not very pretty and seemed kind of shy sitting all by herself I
> thought she's perfect for practice. It's not like there are loads of women
> my age to pick from. I made a resolution to talk to her and used all the
> NLP anchoring confidence builder to work up to it.
> At intermission, I went and looked for her but she was just GONE. Looked
> downstairs, upstairs, even checked the line outside the ladies' room. So, I
> decided to hang around the auditorium door that she would be using. Saw her
> come back and made EC. I think I have my EC down to a pat because I had
> practiced with a mirror. She looked for two seconds, squeezed out a shy
> smile, and looked away. Did I unwisely took that as an encouraging sign?
Okay, you little stalker, but you violated the 3 sec rule. You should
have approached her right after she returned your ec. You could have
used a regular ASF/SS opner, or somethng as simple as "Hey, you're
just about the only person my age here. You must be a musician too."
(Even if you're not one.)
>
> After the concert ended and as I walked across the lobby and to the exit my
> peripheral vision picked up on that HB6 again.
> She was walking toward another exit slowly. Since she was walking I
> couldn't EC so I used a lame mistaken identity PU line to talk to her. I
> fluffed for about five minutes, and found out she's actually a music
> student. I made some comments about the performance tonight that I thought

> was insightful and funny, and she laughed, although not in an out loud,
> ebullient way.
>
> (AT this point I was a little confused about what I've read. I have read
> that you should project only friendliness for the first fifteen minutes, but
> there were also posts stressing the importance of early SOI. WHICH ONE
> SHOULD I FOLLOW?)
Good. You approached a girl and made her laugh. Now, at the peak of
the converssation, suggest adjourning to a cafe where it's more
comfortable to continue.
And, don't forget: being friendly doesn't mean NOT using Ss and ASF
stuff. It just has to be subtle, in the background of your game. It
sounds to me like you used a really weak opener (get the guts to use
something more original or even direct) and then just fluffed here.
> I sensed she had to go and I wanted to go home too, so I just

> straightforwardly asked for her number. She said no, giving me the "Thanks,
> but I would rather not" line. After that, I just said "good night, then"
> and left. Is there anything more to be done at that point?
Okay, this was an experience and you learned from it. Why didn't she
want your number? You didn't demonstrate enough value, it sounds like.
You're just a guy who talked to her. What makes you special? Show her!
(Or at least make up something!)
Hope this helps...
================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 28 Nov 2001 08:26:09 GMT
Nice post, and kino descriptions. See my post below.
This is great stuff, and nice to see it in detail. Out of curiosity,

some girls "baulk" as you say; others give a "speech." I liked how you
dealt with the baulking. You were persistent, hoping that at one point
her state would be different and she wouldn't "baulk." But what would
you have done, out of curiosity, if instead of baulking, she had given
you the dreaded "speech." You know, the one that goes "I just got out
of a serious relationship, and you're really nice and all, but I'm

just not ready for anything right now. I hope you understand and we
can still be friends."
> I'll describe what is working for me at the moment. My current #1

> target, who is definite LTR material, tells me I'm "very sexual".
> And I can tell that, among other things, this attracts her to me.
> My intuition tells me she wants a sexual guy so that she can feel
> free to be sexual too, and enjoy that side of her. So here is how
> I came on to her.
>
> First meeting: cafe that I know, with movable swivel chairs. I move
> my chair close to hers. We talk about things in common (writing,
> music). Good rapport. As soon as I sense it's time to start touching
> her I do: hand touches on leg, arm.
>
> Touches get longer. Touches to her hand. Take her hand, hold it.
> Take both hands, hold them. Caress her fingertips with mine. Hold one
> hand, run fingertips of my other hand along the inside of her arm.
>
> Talking all throughout this, so that the touching just becomes part
> of the experience of being with me. We're enjoying talking to each other,
> constant touching adds to it for both of us.
>
> Holding both hands, give them an occasional squeeze. Hold one hand in
> both of mine. Hold one hand and caress her arm. Repeat with variations.
>
> Brush her hair away from her face. Good reaction.
>
> Pull her towards me for a kiss. She baulks. Gently persist. She
> keeps baulking. I keep touching her.
>
> We go to counter to pay. I'm standing next to her. Her hip
> "accidently" moves against mine. I take this as a clear IOI. I put my
> arm around her waist and squeeze.
>
> Outside the cafe, I put my arm around her waist again. Her arm goes
> around my shoulder. We're about to go our seperate ways.
>
> Face each other. Arms around her. Go for the kiss again. She baulks.
> Gently persist. She keeps baulking. I move in anyway. She gives me
> her cheek. Move in again. She gives me the other cheek. Move in again.
> She gives me the first cheek again, laughs. Move in again. She gives me
> a quick kiss.
>
> We go our separate ways. I'm prepared to chaulk it up to experience
> and move onto next target.

>
> Next time I see her, she says "Hi", and looks at my lips. I move in
> and kiss her. Lots of kissing (which she loves) and touching after that.
> I can tell that she has been thinking about me and has reached some kind
> of decision.
>
> Now I touch her constantly while I'm with her. She loves this. Touches
> to her hair, back of neck, back, hands, arm, leg, smooth her eyebrows,
> kiss her eyelids, squeeze her waist, touch her legs, butt, nipples and
> breasts, pussy.
>
> What I think I did:
>
> -showed that I love touching her and want to do this and will persist;
>
> -showed that this is a natural part of me;
>
> -showed her that she will enjoy this, that I'm sensual and I know what
> I'm doing;
>
> -though body language, offered her a sexual adventure with me.
>
> Other things I did, in subsequent meetings:
>
> -made constant sexual innuendos (I get very blantant in messages
> to her cell phone too - she likes this "bad boy" behaviour);
>
> -kept talking as if it was a forgone conclusion we will fuck;
>
> -told her (at her prompting) about the most outrageous sexual
> experiences (good and bad) I have had;
>
> -in a calm good-natured manner, challenged her shit tests;
>
> -showed a deeper artistic side as well as a frankly sexual side,
> ie I'm sexual but there's a lot more to me than that.
>
> We haven't fucked yet, because we have some medical issues to sort out
> (no, it's not what you think, and I'm not going to explain here). And
> she likes the way I make it easy for her to talk about difficult
> personal issues. Fucking is a forgone conclusion.
>
> I've persisted because she has a definite "wild side" which she keeps
> buttoned down, and she's showed me enough for me to sense just how
> raunchy she can be. She's still coming to terms with this side of her.
>

> Kino is something I like to do all the time with the right chick,
> in and out of bed. HTH.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 28 Nov 2001 08:45:06 GMT
"Red Conda" <unsent@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<nEIM7.6$2k.427@psinet-eu-nl>...

> Your post mirrors almost exactly my experience. I can get numbers, kino,
> tell stories, EV, make them laugh and come accross as an extremely
> interesting guy but when it comes to the * close I get burned. I would be
> very interested in the follow ups to this post because seduction is an art
> which requires so much work that to get burnt at the close time is very very
> infuriating.
>
> Just out of curiousity, are you very sexual in your jokes, and innuendos?
>
> Maybe our only problem is "thinking too much before kissing" after all up to
> that point everything seems to have been done right.
Man, Red Conda, I think we have the EXACT same problem. We should talk
via email and get to the bottom of this. For fun, let me tell you
about my last two nights. One I did right, the other I did so wrong.
MONDAY
I went to grab a bite to eat, saw an average-looking girl with
huge-ass breasts, and did handwriting analysis. We talked, she said
she was going to her hotel, I drove her there and told her to call me
in an hour if she wanted to get a drink. My genius move was that
before she left the car, I pointed to my cheek and had her kiss me
there.
Then, I said, "I haven't shaved in a while. I hope it's not too
hairy."
She: Well it is a little hairy.
ME: Out of curiousity, do girls actually like kissing hair and
stubble, because as a guy I cant' even imagine it. To me [speaking
very slow and seductive now], the lips are so much softer and smoother
and moister and better for kissing.
She: Yes, I like that better.
Anyway, she calls me an hour later, we go out. We talk a lot about sex
and ex'es, and I do some massage-type things with her. Then I drop her

off at her hotel. I say "kiss goodbye" again, but this time I point to
my mouth. And from there, it was on, and I went up to her room with
her.
I think this worked because, to be honest, I just didn't care whether

I slept with this girl or not, because she wasn't as hot as the hbs
i've been #closing lately.
TONIGHT
I went out with one of those HBs, a beautiful part Brazilian girl who
just has the biggest warmest eyes. And, dude, check out how stupid I
am: after dinner, she invites me up to her house. She sits next to me
on the couch. And do I make a move? No. I keep thinking about it and
then imagining her rebuking me while saying "I just got out of a bad
relationship" (which she did). I'm sure it's on for next time, but
still...how could I choke like this at the last minute. My
Find-Meet-Attract game is getting so good (every single girl I #closed
with last weekend called me back!) I also made the mistake tonight of
not talking about sex or sexually with her before. The best I did was
describe things--the ocean, art, whatever--in very erotic terms.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 28 Nov 2001 23:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: about kiss-closing
On Mon, 26 Nov 2001 15:39:00 -0500, Anonymous wrote:
>I'm going to field test this ( i.e kissing the girl without asking or anything
>).
>I was thinking of something I could say just after doing so and something fun
>came to my mind...
>Just before she says anything, saying :
>"Hey ! Why did you just do that ??"..
>Most probably she was intending to say this to you.. she wont and instead of
>being mad or anything she will try to answer on a different level arguing that
>"You just did..." etc. then .. "No, I would have done much better" and go for
a
>* again.
>But this is talking I'm trying it as soon as I can and tell you the result.
>Any opinion ?
This is kind of funny. Could even be good, and could work as a sort of

pattern interrupt if you feel like she was a little taken by surprise
or resistant. Field test this and report back!!
================================================================================
================================================================================
Fri, 30 Nov 2001 18:09:12 GMT
subject: Re: First SS outing: the symphony
Come on. Mike here posts his first report. He tries his best and pours
his heart out, and all we can do is respond with a pretty dumb flame
war that has nothing to do with his post. Let's ignore the stupid
comments, and give Mike some advice and encouragement to help that PUA
locked up inside him, waiting to come out. It is unbelievable how a
few of us are more likely to respond to a flame or a troll than to an
actual post about seduction.
NOTE: Please do not respond to this comment. If you want to add to

this thread, help Mike.
the_squire_of_gothos@my-deja.com (The Squire) wrote in message news:

<b62d31e8.0111291734.419952fa@posting.google.com>...
> exoticoption@hotmail.com (exoticoption) wrote in message news:
<4d0ba53e.0111290833.7082e0c4@posting.google.com>...
> > qfu9@yahoo.com (Queen of the Universe) wrote in message news:
<2a62528c.0111280220.6355b914@posting.google.com>...
> > > "Mike W" <mwen@houston.rr.com> wrote in message news:<z2ZM7.29641$sq2.1030707@typhoon.
austin.rr.com>...
>>>
> > > Is there anything more to be done at that point?
>>>>
> > > > Comments and advices are appreciated.
>>>>
> > > > MW
>>>
>>>
> > > No, just go home and wank off like you do every other night.
>>
> > Queen of Turds, your advice sounds like something YOU should do (hey,
> > release that tension)... you fucking troll.
>
> She's number 1,004 in a long list of feminist trolls in the soc.men
> group. Real loser this one is.

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 03 Dec 2001 11:33:00 GMT
subject: Ever come across this block?
So all is going well. I am building intense rapport, there's lots of

kino, and we're back at my house. Two of her friends are in the other
room. We kiss, but she keeps stopping. Her line (and I've heard it
before): "I've always been easy and just jumped into bed with anyone,
but I want to take it slow because I really like you."
Questions:
1. How do you respond?
2. Does this mean I used the wrong approach: tried to be the perfect
guy instead of the ONS?
3. Why am I always the guy who brings out the good girl in them
instead of the bad girl? This is probably my biggest stumbling block.
The other line she used (which I also hear all the time) when she
stopped me from making further progress was: "Every time I see you,
you're surrounded by a dozen girls. You must have a girl in every
city."
What's your response for this one?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 04 Dec 2001 03:29:00 GMT
subject: Phone Manner: Bad ASF advice
I've noticed that in doing this stuff, everyone has to find their own
style. And some tenets of SS/ASF/FastSed work, and some don't. One
thing that I started doing when I read ASF is keeping to the "make
plans and get off the phone fast" routine. But, I noticed that it
always freaked the HBs out a little when the conversations were so
abrupt and almost business-like. This week (it's a no sarging
week--and all following up on closes week) I've been trying to build
better connections with the people I closed, and I've been trying

instead to talk for like 15 minutes. This way, I think they feel more
connected to you (because they're investing their time, thoughts, and
stories in you). Now, I'm not just a stranger they met, had fun with,
and can ignore; I'm more woven into their life, and it's harder to
flake. Also, it gives me a chance to write down their trance and EV
words next to their names in my phone book--for future reference.
So, I don't know if I got the wrong impression or idea from previous
seduction posts, but doing a short chatty phone thing (with a little
bit of patterning and SS slipped in) is definitely reducing the
blurring and flaking factor for me. Am I missing something here?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 04 Dec 2001 03:30:00 GMT
subject: Re: Strawberry Fields!
On Mon, 03 Dec 2001 20:53:00 -0500, RomanianRefugee wrote:
>
>I never tell them the meaning before I finish. The best reply I got was from
a
>HB (9.0). When I asked her, "What do you say to the farmer after you've eaten
>his strawberries?" She said, "I would just give him a BJ!"
>
What was your response to that?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 04 Dec 2001 04:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: Ever come across this block?
Once again, lots of good advice. I am really loving this board.

Good post, Allesandro. DMZ, brutal but true--I have to work on this
stuff.
And Wizzard, let's either communicate via email or start a new thread
here to discuss our problem. I think that maybe some HBs want a
"perfect guy" frame and other's want a "hot ONS" frame. And you can't

always find this out with normal EV'ing, because HBs are not always
going to be totally honest with you (or themselves) about which they
"really want deep down inside." From your posts, I wonder if you try
to hard to "say the right thing" to women now. That may be a form of
supplication: even if we don't pay for things, by always trying to
please someone with words we're still supplicating.
Slick Eddiez, I'm using that pattern next time I hang out with her.
That's probably all she wanted to hear. And maybe I should have
responded to the "you're always surrounded by girls" line with a cocky
pacing line like, "Yes, and wouldn't they be jealous when they knew
that, out of all of them, you're the one I'm making out with right
now."
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 04 Dec 2001 05:06:00 GMT
subject: Re: Phone Manner: Bad ASF advice
On Mon, 03 Dec 2001 23:46:00 -0500, Logan wrote:
>I agree with the phone thing. I've found the same....you need to keep up the
>warmth and connection over the phone so they feel like you're actually
>interested, and not just another game-player hunting for trophies.
Exactly.
>Another thing about ASF....way too much emphasis on nonsupplication and being
>aloof, for my situation and personality. As a goodlooking guy (so I've been
>repeatedly told by female friends), I probably need to be warm, down-to-earth:
>a lot of girls lose their self-confidence around a goodlooking guy who is too
>aloof. Comments?
I agree with this. A mediocre looking guy dripping with attitude may
be intriguing and alluring, while a stuck-up goodlooking guy may just
seem like an asshole. On the other hand, you don't want to come across
as a doormat. The best approach for you, I'd say, is to "warm up." In
other words, let a girl think at first that you're aloof or arrogant,
but slowly open up to them and show your warm, down-to-earth side.
This accomplishes two things: she thinks she's making progress that
other HBs don't and it's exciting for her, because she knows you're

not like this with everyone. Secondly, you have a very good way of
"punishing" her if you don't like her responses (if she doesn't return
kino) by reverting to your aloofness for a little while. Experiment
with letting her earn your warm down-to-earth side and see what
happens. I think if you can play this right (not be too aloof on the
opener, but not be too super-nice immediately), you'll get amazing
results.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 06 Dec 2001 21:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: Lay report: Night club HB7
On Thu, 06 Dec 2001 13:03:00 -0500, zloverboy wrote:
>I agree that it's not true in all cases. Yes, it does _depend_ on how you
>talk about it. If you talk about it like you're a desperate horny guy,
>etc.... then you're screwed up.
Exactly. I used to never talk about sex. But now I talk about it from
her point of view, and tell stories that show me not as someone who is
desperate, but as someone who is able to get and, more importantly,
deliver satisfaction. I just read a lot about tantra, so lately I've
been working that into conversation, talking about the ideas and stuff
behind it.
>Also, my mistakes in the past was harvesting phone numbers when I could've
>taken her home. Don't lust for phone# ... when a woman gives you her phone#
>it doesn't always mean that she's gonna fuck you....
Not only that, but you can get the phone #, get a return call, hang
out, and create an amazing connection. And she STILL might blur and
disappear on you. This just happened to me with someone who I knew was
really into me, and I still can't figure out what went wrong. My best
guesses are: fear of starting to like someone intensely (it's a loss
of control issue) or the fact that I didn't get physical with her and
she just wanted to get it on [my bad!] or another man/old BF appeared
in the meantime...
I think the lesson that you (and I) are learning here is: seize the
moment, because the state an HB is in when you're with her may
disappear as soon as she leaves you. Of course, there are SS tactics

for helping to make her think and dream about you when you're gone,
but I have yet to see these really conclusively work better than other
methods like a good takeaway or expressing necessary value. Anyone
else?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 07 Dec 2001 11:29:00 GMT
subject: She Got Scared and Ran Away
A few days ago I posted that I was going to see a really cute Asian
HB I had sarged. A strange thing happened, and I wanted to get advice.
She's from a very strict family, and only a year ago moved out of her
mother's house. She was 20 then, and had never kissed a guy or
anything. Now, of course, she's lost her virginity, but is still
pretty innocent and inexperienced.
So we went out, and I patterned all night, making myself the key to
all this adventure she was missing out on. The sarge was along the
lines of a famous quote I read somewhere--"The tragedy of life is not
that it ends so soon, but that we wait so long to begin it."
She said that any guy she had ever been with she had been friends
with, but nonetheless we connected well and talked a lot about sex.
She said that her favorite part of getting physical was kissing. She
loved to kiss. When she came back to my hotel room, I looked her
straight in the eyes, and came in very slowly and confidently for a
kiss. She responded, and I went to lower her backwards so that she'd
be lying on the bed. But all of a sudden, she climbed on top of me,
and just went wild. While we were making out, I paused and said
something like, "You're a great kisser."
All of a sudden, she just went tense, rolled off me, and said, "I have
to go." I tried to make her stay, and feel relaxed, and talk to her.
She said something about her ex-boyfriend, and how she wasn't being
fair to him or to me by starting a new relationship because he was
going through a rough time and needed him. I agreed then tried to
pattern her out of it. But she was set on leaving, and grabbed her
purse and walked out of the room very briskly. I figure that either
she was scared of me because things were moving too fast on our first
time hanging out, or she was scared of herself because her "natural
woman" came out for a brief moment.

Has anyone had an experience like this? More important, I need to call
her today or tomorrow, and am trying to figure out: What is it that
she needs to hear to be less fearful, to see me again, and to start
this new relationship?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 07 Dec 2001 11:54:00 GMT
subject: Re: When It Rains, It Pours
On Thu, 06 Dec 2001 00:52:00 -0500, finalD wrote:
>You are my hero.

>
>:)
>
>First off, the power of social proof.
Also, I realize that what I described as rapport and mirroring with

HBPersian when she came down to my room was also seting a frame. The
second I saw her, I created physical excitement, which set the tone
for the night.
But, yes, the rest of the night was social proof. When I saw HBPersian
again today, I let her tease out of me the fact that I had made out
with two girls after her that night. And though she pretended to be
offended, and though she said she'd never heard of anything like it
before and that's why she could never be with me, minutes later she
was unbuttoning my shirt.
>
>Second off, what kind of conversation things did you do, when you were at
>the celebrity party (or the bar previous) with two women? I know what you
>mean, one HB will NOT involve another in the convo, period. No matter how
>polite a person, no matter how mature, it will just be a catty "oh, well,
>and what would someone like YOU think of it? Hrrumph." But there you are
>stuck between them. How does THIS work?
In the bar, HBPersian was across from me, and HBAniston was standing.
HBAniston was looking bored first because HBPersian wasn't including
her, so I let HBAniston share my seat with me. Now she was stuck, and
when I was talking to HBPersian I could kino her. I don't really
remember what I said. I just remember that whenever one looked bored,

I'd turn to her to get an opinion on the subject I was talking about
with the other HB. Then I'd talk to her about her answer, and I'd
notice that her face would literally light up when she had the
attention. Once it was lit, I could turn to the other HB to talk. It
was kind of like trying to keep two candles lit on a windy day: I had
to keep lighting one then the other, over and over, until I could hint
to HBPersian that she should be getting ready for her flight. Overall,
as their interest was building, so was their frustration and jealousy,
and it could have gone bad if it went on for too long.
At the celebrity party, I tried a different tactic. After a while, I

said to HBAniston, "Why don't you talk to HBGirlinblack. We're leaving
her out of the conversation." And HBAniston did it, maybe because I
said it in a way that made her feel like the dominant female,
including the other out of pity.
However, I must note that Mystery's advice for such situation with two
girls who don't know each other is:
Say to HB1: "Hey, have you ever kissed a girl before?"

HB1: Yes
Say to HB2: "Hey, have you ever kissed a girl before?"

HB2: Yes.
Say to Both: Well, I don’t want you two kissing in front of me.
Because it only makes me jealous...unless I’m included.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 08 Dec 2001 10:50:00 GMT
subject: Re: Socially Inept
Listen to everyone here. And read what Specialist says. But, most
important, reading will only get you so far. You must act. That is the
only way to learn. Start out slow, and take it one step at a time.
Here's what I suggest. In addition to what's already mentioned (the

newbie challenge and just making small talk with everyone you pass
especially], start with a plan. Make a list of stories you can tell,
phrases you can say to people, whatever works. Then practice saying
them out loud. Grow to like the sound of your own voice and trust in
the fact that what you have to say is interesting to other people.

They are bored, and looking for some sort of stimulation to break out
of their boring daily routine.
I'm also willing to bet that you don't look people in the eye when you
speak to them. Hold your head up and meet their gaze. Then, for
starters, walk around where you live and practice asking directions or
for the time or whatever. These are AFC tactics, but you have to start
somewhere. Then practice creating follow up conversation.
I'd recommend reading "Introducing NLP." Not just because of the

seduction tactics, but because of its ideas about relearning certain
behaviors. You must retrain yourself: it may seem contrived at fist,
but soon you'll internalize it. Learn to make small talk. Some of the
best PUAs I know don't use SS: they're just casual and friendly and
open.
On Fri, 07 Dec 2001 23:04:00 -0500, SeductioNLP wrote:
>Hello all.
>
>First off I'd like to say 'Great Job' to Formhandle on this site and thanks
>a lot. I really appreciate the effort you've put in to help out AFC's like
>me.
>
>
>
>I'm a long time lurker to ASF and now to this site. I've never employed any
>seduction techniques because I'm still trying to jump the first hurdle. My
>problem is that I'm incredibly shy. Not just with HB's (which I think most
>guys started off that way) but with anybody. Even guys. Even with people I
>know. Conversations that I engage in are usually very one-sided, or filled
>with long pauses. I'm the guy that says the least in a group setting. I
>think that I wouldn't be so shy if I "knew what to say". And I'm not
>talking about patterns here. I'm talking about basic conversation skills,
>that I seem to lack. My question is, Are there any PUA's that post here
>that had to overcome shyness or social ineptness, and if so what steps did
>you take in order overcome it?
>
> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for
>reading my post.
>
>
>

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 08 Dec 2001 20:24:00 GMT
subject: Hyper Emperia?
What is Hyper empiria?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 08 Dec 2001 23:03:00 GMT
subject: My New Frame
I've noticed that my most successful sarges lately have been when I
have the mindset that...
"I am not trying to get anything from you. I am trying to give YOU
what you want."
Last night, I went to meet an HB I had sarged who I'm really into. She
was drinking with another friend, who was turning 30. To make a long
story short, I made myself the birthday girl's birthday present. The
funny things is that, with this attitude, even her friends (including
the HB who I know likes me and who I really like) were encouraging us
to leave together, telling me "Please go home with her. Make her
happy." So it became ME doing her a favor for her and her friends, and
the obstacles became collaborators.
On a different topic, if I had better skills I could have pulled a

Rick H. All three girls were ready. All three had fooled around with
other girls before. I flirted with and kissed them all and made some
joking suggestions (like proposing a faithful four-way relationship),
but I just couldn't figure out how to include everyone. Any
suggestions for tactics I could have used here?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 09 Dec 2001 20:31:00 GMT

subject: Re: She Got Scared and Ran Away
On Fri, 07 Dec 2001 08:51:00 -0500, Vinnie wrote:
>>>While we were making out, I paused and said

>something like, "You're a great kisser." <<
>
>I read somewhere that once you get to kissing on the bed, you don't say
>anything. especially not a compliment!
Hmm. I get contradictory advice on this. I talked to Ross J about it,

and he said that girls need to be fractionated. From what I
understand, it's the theory that you move forward, then back off for a
little while, then move forward further, then back off for a little
while, etc., until you've gone all the way.
Any one else have ideas on conversation after the kiss. Yes or no? (In
the past, I've liked to say something to let her know that she's doing
the right thing, but maybe it's not necessary and breaks state.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 09 Dec 2001 21:05:00 GMT
subject: Re: She Got Scared and Ran Away
Twitch, I've heard that TWICE in the last couple weeks.
>
>Double-check how sexually experienced she is. If she is a virgin with a
>lurking fear that her "one special time" will be "wasted" on a "player,"
>then you need to play the candlelight and romance card just once. Or leave
>the deflowering up to someone else.
Final D, she's had it once, and from what I can tell didn't really
enjoy it and doesn't like certain male body parts. It felt to me like
she needed to be patterned not for romance but for adventure and
experience, which were lacking in her life.
>Double-check how MASOCHISTIC she is. Bet that didn't occur to you, did it?
>Hmm? Maybe she is so wrapped up in her fantasy of "being taken," that some
>strong words and stronger arms would do the trick. Many many -- like, 75% -
>- chicks really get wet as hell, and NEED that to get them going in some

>manner. Careful here, of course, because you must skirt the fine line
>between non-consent and consent. If she LIKES making you uncomfortable
>BECAUSE you're on that edge, then she's just fucked up and a harassment (or
>rape) suit waiting to happen, so NEXT.
Yes, I think this is it. I've been in this situation a couple times,
where I was getting a lot of resistance. But, at the same time, I knew
she wanted to just be grabbed and taken, so that she could feel like
she didn't have a choice. However, each time I didn't "take" her,
because that line is so fine and I'd rather not get laid than take
that chance. But I think you're right here.
>You might alleviate concerns about ex-boyfriend by pointing out that HE AND
>SHE BROKE UP. Period. If she can't handle that, NEXT. But I'm willing to
>bet, that was just an excuse at the time, and there might be other ones at
>other times. It's last-minute anti-slut-defense wrapped up in last-minute
>fear, and it doesn't make any sense. She doesn't worry about that, it got
>her out of the room didn't it? So maybe the ex-boyfriend is really not an
>issue.
Exactly right. It was just an excuse to bail because her mental

programming couldn't handle the physical sensation she was
receiving/about to receive from someone she'd just met. I should have
been more conscous of this, and built up ideas of a "long friendship"
between us.
>I am guessing the following, from my own experience. The sex will be
>bizarre. She'll be on her own planet, which is fine, but that means she
>will be utterly unaware of your presence, your needs, anything. Example: it
>might feel really good to her to cram her legs together at the knees; in
>which case, she would want you to move so that she could do that, right in
>the middle of fucking; which is, obviously, an impossibility, but that's
>beside the point to her. She might even view your presence as an annoyance.
>She needs to be SO FAR off on her own planet, that it's essentially a solo
>masturbation act that is very embarrassing for her to do in front of
>someone. Get the metaphor?
You definitely have this girl down. She said she did this with her old
BF. Exactly as you said--she said she would push him off and
masturbate to get off.
>Here's another suggestion: I'm willing to bet that social proof won't work
>too well on this one. If she sees you with a couple of other women, she'll
>just think, "I guess I fucked that one up," and she probably doesn't have
>the social skills or the outgoing self-confident nature necessary to chase
>you down. If she does, see above, "maybe it's an act," and handle

>accordingly.
True again. This stuff will definitely help, if she's even worth still
pursuing. Thanks, man.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 10 Dec 2001 12:03:00 GMT
subject: I Got a Tip!
I had to post this because it was so funny. Though I still have a lot
to work on, I've really been on an unusually good roll lately. I just
got tons of phone numbers over the last few weekends, and have slowly
been harvesting them.
Last night, I went out with one HB, a 19 year old Hawaiian hiphop
chick. All night, she kept saying how she "doesn't just give it out"
and is looking for friends. I know that this just means that she gives
it out, but eventually I got bored and didn't feel like pursuing, so I
said I was tired and took her home. I knew that an older woman I had
met (37 to be honest, but a great slender body) was out, so I called
her and met her at a bar around the time of last call.
In keeping with my last post, I took on the attitude that I am doing

her a favor by deciding to give her the pleasure and adventure that
she wants. So I instantly came in with a boy-toy frame, and positioned
myself as her boytoy for the night in a joking way. We went back to my
house. She said she just wanted to talk, and said that nowadays she
needs to have a long friendship before getting physical. However, she
said that in her younger days she slept around a bit. So, inspired by
some of the posts here, I kept trying to bring out that younger girl,
to make her answer questions from the point of view of that younger
girl, and I kept doing the "naughty girl" jokes.
Anyway, a strange thing happened. As soon as we started to make out on

the bed, she suddenly started role playing: she was a young naughty
schoolgirl and I was a teacher seducing her. The naughty girl fully
emerged. I'll spare you the details, but it was one of the most
amazing first night experiences I've had. This is partly because of
the role-playing frame, because we're both collaborating on this story
of the corruption of a schoolgirl and there's only one place that this
story can end. Thus, we didn't have to stop to talk or deal with any
guilt or blocks, because it wasn't really us doing these naughty

things.
The best part was the next morning. She said she'd get breakfast, but
she had no money. I paid the $25. Then she went to a cash machine, got
out $40, and gave it to me. I asked her if she wanted change, and she
said, "No, keep the rest as a tip for last night."
If a guy had said that to a girl, it would have been an insult. But
for me to hear that as an ASFer, it's the best compliment ever.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 10 Dec 2001 21:41:00 GMT
subject: Re: Girl Asking for Favors
On Mon, 10 Dec 2001 16:06:00 -0500, Vinnie wrote:
>As I understand it, if you're already fucking a girl, it's "ok" to date and do
>favors.
>
>However, if she is holding out, one should withhold such favors but I want to
>know what is the best way to decline?
>
>for example, Girl calls in the middle of the night stranded, needing a ride or
>a jumpstart. helps no one if I were to say, "Since we're not in an intimate
>relationship, you should call triple A ...unless you want to take care of my
>jumper cable first"
>
In my mind, the point of not supplicating is to not let yourself be

manipulated. So, when you have to make a decision, ask yourself, "Am I
being manipulated, used, or taken advantage of?" If the answer is no,
then proceed. If yes, then decline and tease.
In this particular case, it's not a favor--it's an emergency. Some

PUAs say to stay away from girls when they're having negative
emotions, because you don't want them to associate that with you.
However, if I was in the situation you mention (which I assume is
hypothetical), I'd help the girl. Why not be her knight in shining
armor? Heroes may not buy dinner for damsels, but they do swoop in and
save them from certain danger.
================================================================================


================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 14 Dec 2001 00:58:00 GMT
subject: Re: Good days & bad Days
On Thu, 13 Dec 2001 04:52:00 -0500, tallafc wrote:
>I'm a little above AFC and trying to improve my skill, but lately I have
>noticed that on some days I work it like a PUA, and on other days i'm bombing
>all over the place and just can't give it all my effort. I wonder if anyone
>else out there has had same problem ? thoughts, comments ?.thanx
>
Yes, something like this happens to me. I call it AFC Reversion

Syndrome. There are just those nights when I'm not on. The symptoms
are:
1. Don't make approaches

2. When HB talks to you, can't think of anything to say
3. Awkward fluff phone conversations with HBS.
Usually it's when I'm tired or have something else on my mind. It's
very frustrating now that I'm used to getting good results any night
of the week.
And, what I've noticed about AFC Reversion Syndrome is that I become
WORSE than an AFC. Because now I am conscious of the fact that I suck,
and it throws me further off my game.
The only way I can think to get over it is to practice all the time,
so that it is internalized and becomes instinct. The only problem is
that when I practice all the time, I end up with too many HBs calling.
(It's weird, lately the HBs I sarge are calling me before I get a
chance to call them--I'm trying to figure out what I'm doing right.)
Anyone have any other suggestions for getting rid of AFC flashbacks?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 17 Dec 2001 05:36:00 GMT
subject: Entertaining Groups and Waiting to Isolate

I've been experimenting with something new lately, especially on

nights when I feel on. And this is entertaining groups and waiting to
isolate. In other words, I'll approach one or two HBs in a group, tell
a story that I need their opinion on, and if their other friends are
listening I'll include them in the story or repeat it to them. Then
I'll tell them I want to show them something cool that relates to the
topic, and bring two or three with me somewhere quiet. Then I cube,
magic, whatever. Eventually, the other girls follow too. And soon I
find myself against the wall surrounded by say four girls. I'm getting
really good at flirting with everyone. I do this by observing, and
commenting on things about them bad body language (especially for the
CB of the group). I'll also put my arms around the group of girls,
smile, and say something like, "May I suggest beginning a faithful 4
(or whatever number) way relationship tonight."
I've found for some reason that the group will usually accept me. And,
after flirting, teasing, and performing for about ten or more minutes,
I can figure out which I have the best chance of going home with that
night. Or, when I'm good enough, I can try for a threeway or
something.
Also, instead of making a decision and isolating right away, I wait

and see who is the most responsive. The additional plus to this is
that I can #close with everyone in the group, because we'll all hang
out cause we're all best friends now. And this means not only more
options, but blurring is impossible because at least one of them will
be calling me to hang out with them all again.
(Not to mention the amazing social proof--girls I've already sarged

will come up to me in the group and say, "Wow, you are quite the
ladies man." And I just smile and pretend like I don't know what it
is: it's just some crazy magnetic power I exude. And of course, when
you're entertaining a group of girls and another girl comes up to you,
it's good social proof for them as well.)
Last weekend, one group I was with suggested coming back to their
house for an after-after-party and getting stoned. It was so on.
Unfortunately, I had a plane to catch in a couple hours and couldn't
do it. In my AFC days, I'd kick myself for missing the opportunity.
Now, I don't care cause Ihave their numbers and know there are plenty
of more groups to be found.
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Mon, 17 Dec 2001 18:41:00 GMT
subject: My Main Sticking Point
Okay, I've had a great nine days, with three new f-closes. (I'll post
one of the reports later.) That's worthy of celebration for me.
However, it could have been five. And my problem is that I didn't
phase shift on two of the girls I could have. With one of them, she
was even really tipsy and a guy in the bar was saying "she's the
hottest girl here and I can tell she likes you by the way she looks at
you." Right now, I am in a hotel room and she is lying in the bed next
to me. That is not the bed she should be in!
My problem is that with a girl I really respect and have really deep
rapport with, I have problems phase-shifting into the physical because
I'm worried I'll break that rapport and trust we have. It's such a
stupid AFC idea. But both of these girls were into me, and both times
I stopped the PU just shy of getting physical. I think it's either an
old fear ("could a HB really be attracted to ME") acting up, or it's a
worry that an HB is too smart to fall for the patterns and routines
that would lead to a physical close. I think there may even be a voice
in my head that's already imagining a scene in which I get rejected on
the close. I think the key here is a worry that I'm going to get
rejected and/or break the trust that we have. The truth is, who cares?
(And I rarely get rejected when I go for it with confidence.) But
there's still a nice guy still lurking in my head that I have to get
rid of. Any suggestions???
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 17 Dec 2001 18:42:00 GMT
subject: Re: Social Proof ??
On Mon, 17 Dec 2001 10:44:00 -0500, Rio wrote:
>Thanks to those who replied to my earlier post. i would also like feed back on
>my Social Proof issue.
>
>1. About social proof -- I assume that social proof is the concept of being
>seen in
>public with a chick to make yourself more desirable looking in front of other
>babes.

>
>My question is: If one is interested in using social proof on exceptionally
hot
>chicks that are Playboy / Penthouse Pet material (beauty of a 9 or 10), is it
>better than to be seen by them while accompanied with a chick who is also a 9
>or 10?? or will the exceptionally hot chicks be just as impressed if they see
>you
>with an average looking chick ( 7 or 8) ??
Yes, you're right on social proof. And, yes, the more attractive the
girl you're with, the more social proof you have. But, if you are
after a 9/10 and you're with a 7/8, you can compensate. It's not just
simply BEING with an HB that gets you the social proof. It's how she
is behaving towards you. If you're both in a corner bored, it won't
get you anywhere. But if you're with one or two 7/8s and they're
hanging on your ever word, laughing all the time, having a lot of fun,
and maybe even dirty-dancing with you, THAT is going to make a 9/10
want to meet you.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:59:00 GMT
subject: Lay Report: Manufacturing Chemistry
Man, I have been having so much fun lately. And the advice in this NG
has been great. When I think about how much more exciting going out
has become since my AFC days, I'm in shock. So thanks to you all. That
is, with the exception of Violet Lotus. (Dude, you should have
returned my email and sarged with me in NY--you missed out on many
good times and two amazing HB-loaded parties, like the one below.)
LESSONS LEARNED IN THIS FIELD REPORT: The importance of warming up,

sometimes rules must be broken, messed up patterns/lines can still
work, fractionating attention, making her uncomfortable in a good way,
and the benefit of creating competition.
The night I got to NY, I met some friends at a bar party. It was
still early, but there were lots of bored looking groups of HBs so I
just dove in. I find that I always start with a rehearsed approach,
but after a while I'm on a roll and not even aware of what I'm saying
to open.
I #closed the only two girls I was interested in, but didn't plan on

calling them because I had a lot of friends to see in NY. But the next
day BOTH called ME. One was HBSmiles, a blonde in a low cut shirt. I
don't even remember my opener with her, because it was very natural. I
just turned around while I was flirting with two drunk chicks and
started talking to her.
When I met HBSmiles the next night, there was just no vibe whatsoever.
I had to try to keep from yawning. I was just going to eject and call
someone else, but then I realized that I have the power to create that
chemistry. I wanted to see a short hour-long theater thing, so I took
her to that and just figured I could eject after if I wanted. As we
sat, I matched my breathing, posture, laughter, everything to hers.
Afterwards, we went to get some food. It was a struggle to EV, but

once I did and realized that she wanted a teacher to show her new
things, I became that guy and everything lit up. I did Strawberry
Fields, and totally failed because she didn't really understand that
the field was supposed to be forbidden and off limits. But it worked
anyway, because we started talking about sex. She said how she didn't
sleep around, didn't have a lot of partners, needed a long time to get
to know a guy, and all that. My instinct said "reject," but the new
PUA inside said "we'll see about that." Then I hit her up with natural
woman type patterns.
Then a funny thing happened. She said, "This is sort of a date, isn't
it?"
I heard all the voices of this NG yelling "No!!!" So I tried to turn

this into my advantage by making her think she'd just given me a SOI.
So I said, "Well, I had thought we were going to just hang out, but
it's interesting that you think it's turning into a date. I wonder
what that means about us."
When the check came, I heard the voices in the NG yelling "No!" But
sometimes rules have to be broken, because in certain cases you're
just going to look cheap and stingy. I took care of it, and said,
"This means that you're buying the drinks tonight (pause). And I'm
very thirsty."
Now, I called a friend of mine--another blonde--to meet us at the bar.

I'm really into introducing other HBs into the picture on a "date"
lately, and it's been effective. (This way, the girl I'm sarging is
confused about my interest in her, and I am now a challenge for her to
compete for.) The blonde arrived with her sister, who was this hot
Lisa Loeb looking girl, and her sister's husband. I sat between the
blonde and HBSmiles. This was perfect: I could talk to HBSmiles, and

then if she said something I didn't like or didn't respond right to

kino, I could punish and talk to the blonde, leaving her cut off. And
all night, HBSmiles kept buying me and her drinks. I joked that she
was trying to get me drunk.
While I was alone with the blonde, she told me her sister and her
husband had a joke that they can only cheat with mermaids and mermen.
When the husband left the table, I leaned in and told the sister, "You
know, I only have legs for the day (pause, laughter). Would you like
to take advantage of this brief opportunity to make out?"
She said, "I guess this means that I'm allowed to make out." I gave
eye contact, moved in real close, and then at the last minute backed
out teasingly.
When HBSmiles came back, I decided to try a line I had learned from
Ross J, I think. I said, "How good of a kisser do you think you are,
on a scale of one to ten?" She answered "ten." And then, I froze. I
couldn't remember the next part of the line (DOES ANYONE HERE KNOW
THIS ONE?]. So I just started talking about how it's really the
connection and chemistry between two people that makes for the perfect
kiss, that some people can be a bad kisser with one person (looking
away) but an amazing kisser with the right person (sp), and then I
talked about how I'd approach a mouth like hers (which was a little
large). She suddenly changed the subject because she was getting
uncomfortable, but I knew that it was a good kind of uncomfortable and
meant that she was getting turned on.
A little later, I put my hand in hers, and she just started rubbing
me all over with both her hands. She rubbed my hands, then traveled up
my arm. So I went in for the kiss (with all my friends still at the
table). And, yes, she was a ten. She said, "We should stop and
continue this later." She actually future-paced me! From then on, I
knew I didn't have anything to worry about. We made out again and I
suggested leaving, but she said, "Let's get another drink first." I
knew this was a good sign, because she knew she wanted to sleep with
me but wanted to drink up the courage to do it.
I think my friends took this as their cue to leave. The husband walked
outside and the two sisters were there. I was just tingling and giving
off this sexual energy from the make out (and tipsy), so I kissed the
blonde very well on the lips and then just tongued down the sister. I
don't know what I was thinking, but when I was done she had this great
expression on her face--surprised, but very pleasantly so. Normally, I
wouldn't have done this, but when I'm in an altered state lately I
have this amazing intuition about who in the room WANTS and NEEDS to

be kissed.
So I drank up with HBSmiles, went back to the place I was staying, and
had a really great night. And the whole time she kept future-pacing me
about all the things we're going to do in bed on future hook-ups.
So thank you all again. Let me know if you want any elaboration. All
comments are welcome and, though this went well, please read my post
in the "general" section and see if you can help with my major
sticking point.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 19 Dec 2001 05:04:00 GMT
subject: Re: Lesbian Routine
Out of curiousity, have you field tested this?
I did in a mall yesterday, after Adonis mentioned reading your post.

It was a fun approach, though it didn't really lead to anything. It
may be better in a bar or club. The best was when two Asian girls said
they were actually lesbians. I then suggested a faithful three-way
relationship.
On Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:10:00 -0500, juggler wrote:
>Approach a set of two straight looking girls and tell them you will use your
>psychic sense to tell them about themselves.
>
>Then tell them you see their auras are very closely intertwined. Say they are
>either lesbian lovers or just strongly attracted to each other.
>
>If you are right, they will be amazed. If you are wrong she will say, "I'm not
>a lesbian."
>
>Insist that you are rarely wrong. There must be something deep down inside her
>that even she does not know is there.
>
>She will again insist she is not a lesbian. You then smile wickedly and tell
>her to prove it.
>
>-Juggler

>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 19 Dec 2001 16:57:00 GMT
subject: Re: good NEG
On Tue, 18 Dec 2001 19:42:00 -0500, CJ wrote:
>"wow, you wear a lot of makeup"

>or " you wear more makeup then most girls ive met"
>
>-CJ
>
I prefer something more ambiguous, like:
"Wow, you look like you spent a lot of time putting yourself
together."
(Most HBS are always looking for the hidden insult in everything you
say about their appearance anyway...)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 19 Dec 2001 20:47:00 GMT
subject: Re: Newbie Mission Complete. What Next?
On Wed, 19 Dec 2001 15:04:00 -0500, christianbones wrote:
>Thanks Juggler and lovedrop.

>
>One other question. What is the easiest approach? I've already gotten past
the
>"hi" part.
>
>Do I compliment her on something she's wearing? or ask "How was your day
>today?"
>
>I have the F/M part down. The problem I have is attracting and carrying on

the
>conversation after the initial "hi."
>Yes I'm still learning and getting better every day.
>
RTFM for this question. I can suggest some later if you want. In the
meantime, try this.
Start a computer file. Make the following headings:
OPENERS
DEMONSTRATE VALUE
ESTABLISH CONNECTION/RAPPORT
PHASE SHIFT
*CLOSE
#CLOSE
(You can also make subheadings of NEGS and PATTERNS/SS.)
Now read the manual and browse the Newsgroups. Grab your favorite
stuff, test out some of your own tactics, figure out your most
interesting stories, and put whatever can work for you under each
heading. Now you know exactly what to do, and how to escalate. Work on
proceeding one step at a time, and come back here and seek advice for
each sticking point. The secret, as you see, is sometimes simply
knowing WHAT TO SAY/DO and WHEN TO SAY/DO IT.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 19 Dec 2001 20:55:00 GMT
subject: Re: My Main Sticking Point
>Although my problems aren't identical to yours, I think they come from a

>similar sense of respect for HBs. I tend to assume somehow that I need to
>find a soul-mate, and that sometimes troubles my pick-up. My method of fix,
>was to always remember that there is NO such thing as love at first sight.
>And to extend the metaphor, I kept in mind that ALL rapport and trust is a
>perpetual building process. If you and the chick have level-x rapport, it's

>silly of you to rely on it such that rapport either sinks to x-minus-1, or

>remains at x. Instead, you MUST continually push it to x-plus-1, and then
>on and on forever. In the absence of pushing, she recognizes one thing only
>-- that you aren't continually pushing forward. Now, of course, this act of
>pushing can't come across as demanding or ... dare I say it ... pushy, but
>in order to "convince yourself" that moving toward the lay is a great plan,
>not a nasty plan or a risky plan, try thinking of it that way.
>
>Try thinking that all interactions with women are always moving forward.
>It's never over. If you get the first lay, that's no guarantee that you'll
>get the second lay. You have to fuck her well the first time, and then, in
>between, you have to re-seduce her. Therefore, all interactions are
>perpetual forward movement. (LOL ... chick-logic, the perpetual motion
>machine!) It's like walking backwards on an escalator. You get on at the
>wrong end, but if you want to, and know how, you can just outrun it. But,
>if you stop running, it will eventually place you right back where you
>started.
This is just a perfect metaphor!
>
>So, there is no stasis, it's never over, no woman is fully and permanently
>seduced, no interaction has a stable point of rest. Therefore, if there's
>someone presenting herself to you, you can either (a) push it forward or
>(b) LET it fall backwards by not pushing. Period.
>
>So, when I remember that concept, the idea of "risking" losing rapport by
>being too pushy and not enough of a gentleman, entirely goes by the
>wayside.
Yes, this is what happens with the HBs I somehow end up respecting too
much. I respect myself out of the game, and end up back at the foot of
the escalator. At the same time, I worry that I'll run up too fast,
trip, fall on my face, and plummet to the bottom. I must figure out a
way to get rid of that self-limiting belief--it's still the main
problem in my game. Maybe I need to go for crash-and-burn *closes!
I do forget this concept of the escalator sometimes -- especially

>with people I'm re-meeting at reunions and the like. I'm 35, and there's a
>whole crop of old high-school and college friends coming back around after
>their divorces. With these people, I have such a natural rapport in the
>first place, plus some very old habits of behavior and patterns of
>interacting, that I tend not to sarge as much as just go with the flow. And
>then when one of the women is showing signs of interest -- the ratio of
>available single men is quite low, naturally, so I should be a pig in shit,

>shouldn't I? -- I forget that it's OK to be the "new" me.
Yes, a lot of who you are is dependent on your environment, and you
can find yourself reverting to past behavoir. However, I think that if
you show the new you to your old friends a few times, you'll be
comfortable in that skin. This happens to me too. And it frustrates me
when I turn the PUA pilot-voice off.
>
>Then I remind myself of the escalator metaphor, and lots of other things
>fall into place. First thing, is that rapport can't be relied upon to
>remain there for ya -- the act of not making a pass at her, can be as
>insulting as the act of making a pass at her (and don't "make a pass," of
>course ... SEDUCE). Next thing, is that I know all windows of opportunity
>are limited opportunities. I guess that's the same as the first thing.
>Other things are, that she appreciates people making moves on her -- other
>things are, that she wants the positive reinforcement even if she is
>tending toward rejecting you -- other thing is, that if you do let her
>treat you like a girlfriend you'll SOON be resenting her "manipulations"
>when she LJBF's you -- and all those other things kind of come to mind in a
>more concrete, meaningful way, if I remember the escalator.
>
>I guess that's what I have to say about how to egg yourself on.
>
>For me, I end up in these situations with people who are lukewarm or warm
>toward me -- definitely testing the waters, they are. But then I believe
>that I don't want to fuck her if she's too dumb for me, and not well
>educated enough -- naturally, later on I kick myself for that stupid
>tendency, and realize that it's just the old AFC me making excuses not to
>take risks. So, meeting high-school pals has been a difficult test, because
>lots of them are uneducated relative to my "ideal" -- I went to a high-
>falutin' private college, most of them either went straight to military
>(the guys) or at best to the State school. So I end up with this, "Nah, not
>good enough, couldn't build a lifetime soul-bond with someone whose
>horizons are so narrow" thing in my head.
yeah, I do that too. But when I decided to just go ahead with the PU
anyway, it resulted in the lay report I posted a few days ago. Turned
out great! And NOW you can believe there's rapport...
But then I remember the

>escalator, and I realize, I'm not trying to build a lifetime soul-bond. I'm
>trying to insert my penis into her vagina. Furthermore, I realize that the
>only REAL soul-bonds (unlike those imagined to be "true love" by AFCs and
>Disney princesses the world over) only happen AFTER the sex has taken
>place. Which is an obvious point, and one nobody here would generally
>quibble with, but a point that I "forget" just like you're forgetting other

>lessons. So, I kick myself with the escalator thing, and it all seems to
>fall back into a better PU mindset.
>
>Hope that helps. At least the discussion itself leads to some self-
>awarenesses. As you say, you're realizing that it's a mistake, you're just
>wondering how to learn how not to make that mistake.
Thanks. Good metaphor. It will help. I still need another piece though
to get over it. And I guess that piece is practice and experience!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 19 Dec 2001 21:12:00 GMT
On Mon, 17 Dec 2001 20:23:00 -0500, specialist wrote:
>This is precisely why the various "kiss readiness" tests exists.
That's true. I just have to trust in the tests. The test I tend to
fall back on is the Mystery one: look for three IOIs, then move in.
What are the ones you use?
>If I had KNOWN the kiss readiness symptoms and tests a few years ago, I
>would NOT have wasted a whole bunch of years waiting for an indication from
>the HB that was ALREADY basically sending me every kiss-ready signal in the
>frigging BOOK. Needless to say, LJBF.
>
>If you really have the rapport and trust and respect that you claim, she
>isn't going to hold one attempt to kiss against you.
True, true. And I know this. The funny thing is that a lot of
guys--even RAFCs--eject when they get rebuked on one kiss. And I don't
know a single girl who holds it against a guy. If it doesn't work, you
just have to do what you do when she won't let you go down her pants
in bed. You back up and try again with a modified approach. Or, if
it's just impossible at the moment, build more rapport and try again
next time you're together. The video game model has always been a good
one for me.
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Wed, 19 Dec 2001 21:12:00 GMT
>Pour on the kino from moment one. Then, no "phase shift" is required.
>
>Become a touchy-feely person. When you meet people, men or women,
>attractive or unattractive, *USE KINO ON THEM TO BUILD RAPPORT*.
>
>Be excessive in your frequency. Be mild in your placement. Touch
>shoulders, hands, &tc. (unobstrusive places) very often.
>
>As soon as you can do this, you will associate touching other people with
>BEING FRIENDLY and not necessarily seducing them.
I can see this. And I do use kino. Maybe I need to plan out a kino
map. In other words, good kino moves to accompany each stage of the
PU. From the encounter (shoulder touching, hand slapping, whatever) to
rapport building (rubbing arm, hand on back) to hair stroking, hand
holding, and so on. Also, some here advocate lots of light kino.
Others say a few well-placed very firm suggestive touches are good.
Where do you fall?
Also, my last gf (a 9.9) went out, and would just go CRAZY from being
touched by guys trying to PU her. She was always being touched and
grabbed by guys who had just started talking to her. It literally made
her sick. This makes me wonder if there's a way to get kino values,
and modify kino technique according to the girl.
I think you may be right that getting kino theory down may be key. But
I've never seen it really discussed in depth anywhere, other than the
advice to just use lots of kino.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 20 Dec 2001 00:49:00 GMT
subject: Openers for mixed groups
Can anyone suggest good openers for approaching groups of girls and
guys. Preferably it's an opener to use with the guys. It's gotta be
one that doesn't make you seem gay, but at the same time demonstrates
some value and leads into meeting the girls in the group.

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 20 Dec 2001 03:59:00 GMT
subject: Re: What to answer when she asks:'Where are you from?'
OPTION ONE (DEFLECT AND REFRAME)

HB: So where are you from?
YOU: People always ask me that. But you know what I think, where
you're from isn't who you are. Why don't we try to have a more
fulfilling conversation than I do with everybody else and talk about
more important things. If I was interested in who you were, I would
ask a question like, So what is there in life that you are very
passionate about, that really motivates you?
OPTION TWO (FLIRTATIOUS)

HB: So where are you from?
YOU: Somewhere dark and mysterious.
HB: No, seriously.
YOU: Seriously, it's somewhere that you would love to go one day. And
it's somewhere I could even take you to. But you're going to have to
earn it.
HB: So you're not going to tell me?
YOU: No, of course I'll tell you. When you earn it.
OPTION THREE (HONESTY)

Tell us here where you're from, and we'll come up with some good
answers for you. I doubt that any HB is truly turned off by any answer
you give. It's not WHAT you are telling them, I'd guess, it's HOW you
are telling them.
On Wed, 19 Dec 2001 22:19:00 -0500, Anonymous wrote:
>As common as can be, this question I am been asked by basically all of the
>people I enter in contact in North America.
>
>I consider that this question is a very disarming tactic used by chicks, in
>special, a very efficient way for them to find out if you have a good social
>position at all.
>
>I can actually tell how a chick is seeing me from a relationship point of
view,
>by just how soon she would ask me this above question.It's very similar to "I

>have a boyfriend" tactic, really.

>
>Does any of you have any tips, suggestions to overcome this barrier.
>I used to think that if I would say:" I am not telling where I am from", it
>would solve the problem.Instead, the chicks will keep on asking me on and on
>and on till they will finally find out where I am from and that would be most
>of the time the end.
>
>P.S.Just a reminder, 95-100% of the chicks have asked me this question.I don't
>know what is so wrong with the east European country where I am from, but it
is
>my nightmare when is about talking to chicks.
>
>
>
>
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 20 Dec 2001 05:35:00 GMT
subject: Re: OK, my turn to ask a stupid question
>Having read you this long saga, my question is this: Should I take the cheek
>kiss as an IOI or just a greeting?
>
My thought is that it doesn't really matter whether the cheek kiss is

an IOI or not. It's up to you to make her interested (YOU are the male
of the species), and the door is open. From everything you've told me
(she gave you her number twice, she was happy to see you), it seems
that she likes you enough, though maybe as LJBF. But, again, it
doesn't matter. You need to just call her. You need to have a good
reason to call her (something that makes her smile). You need to
demonstrate some charm and personality on the phone. Then you need to
take her out, and don't let her sleep in the room next door this time.
As for your wing, just tell him what you're doing first. I'm sure he
won't mind: he has a HB now, and he's had plenty of time to work on
this girl.
DON'T WAIT THIS TIME!

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 20 Dec 2001 19:12:00 GMT
subject: Re: Lay Report: Manufacturing Chemistry
On Tue, 18 Dec 2001 14:49:00 -0500, exoticoption wrote:
>Hey Chris, did you stay in NYC?
No, I left now. But are you based there? If so, let's get together and
sarge next time.
>One thing that i find really interesting is how i feel you have your own
method
>which sounds like a mix between Ross and Mystery's methods?
Totally true. My attitude is: I try everything, and I keep what works
for me. Right now, I use Mystery for approaches, entertainment, and
group sets in clubs. However, part of that entertainment also involves
using Ross-style NLP. Then I use Ross stuff when I'm alone with the
HB. And, here again, I might throw in a Mystery line or two. I don't
think they're mutually exclusive, and I think both are excellent and
have some overlap. I'm also still learning, because they both have so
much more to offer. I also add my own stuff: throwing in my own
stories and using whatever else I have within my own personality that
I know will be attractive and compelling.
Strangely, I was talking with a friend the other day, and the one
thing I don't do is approaches that show immediate interest. In other
words, I begin with a neutral, environmental, or funny story opener.
Never with something that says flat out that I find her attractive and
that we should meet for coffee to see if she has more to offer than
just that. I like the idea of making our sudden attraction seem like
an accident or coincidence of fate. What's your thoughts on this:
openers that show you're trying to PU someone vs ones where you're
just a cool interesting entertaining guy? I'm willing to try more
direct openers...
>I'm curious also on your group tactics..this is what i'm guessing you do, let
>me know if i guessed right: you use "unknown" openers/routines to start and
>keep conversation before moving into ss/pattern style seduction when one-on
>one?

That is exactly it! At some point later, I'll post the exact routine
that's been working for me if you want.
Hope you did good on those finals!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 23 Dec 2001 01:12:00 GMT
subject: Re: Hooks and Pauses
Genius post, Juggler. This will be put into action tonight!
By the way, outside of being from Ann Arbor, where did you come from?
How'd you get to this forum? Did you have good game before discovering
this community, did you discover all this through asf/fastsed, or are
you an older poster using a new name? Either way, digging your posts
and ideas...
On Sat, 22 Dec 2001 14:53:00 -0500, juggler wrote:
>Puzzles...
>
>You must be big enough to control the situation while at the same time look
>like you are not trying. You must approach while not seeming like you need to
>approach. You must entertain a group while not 'working' at it.
>
>Pick-up artistry is full of these riddles. But there are solutions.
>
>One such answer can be found by re-working your routines to include hooks and
>pauses.
>
>Get a girl to chase you by getting her to ask you questions. Make her want
>something. This is the beginning of her quest to experience your mysterious
>self. Encourage this by structuring your rap to include hooks and pauses.
>
>A hook is a statement which brings to mind one or more questions. A pause is a
>momentary stop to let her use her imagination.
>
>Example:
>
>You: I have an intuition about you.
>
>Her: What?

>
>You: Sometimes I get these hunches. My friends are amazed that many of them
>turn out to be correct. I don't know if I have some sort of phycic power or
>what. But with you I can see a specific aura around your body.
>
>Her: What is it? What do you see?
>
>You: I see a deeply adventurous spirit which is to often not let free because
>of societies expectations. (Pause) I knew a girl once, an artist, who had a
>similar feeling. She came up with a beautiful and exciting idea to free
herself
>of all the bonds that are put upon us.
>
>Her: What did she do?
>
>It's easy from here. Take a look at your routines. Give some thought into how
>you can re-write them to include these concepts. Try interacting with a girl
>without asking her anything. Try getting a feel for her by how she pursues
you.
>
>Of course, you also need to deliver with powerful material. As she digs deeper
>and discovers jewels it will encourage her. Maximize the chick interestingness
>of your routines.
>
>Questions are opportunities. Just plot to have her pursue the conversation
>threads you wish. But also, think up some pre-planned, great answers to common
>questions girls ask you all the time. And if you do some cool trick, make her
>beg it out of you.
>
>There are many smart guys who make the mistake of saying the perfect
statements
>- thoughtful, chick appealing and nicely ended. You can sabotage yourself this
>way. Do not be too thorough. Practice leaving holes and making contradictory
>statements. Make space for her imagination to fill in the details and her
sense
>of wonder to lead her to want to consume you. Try to spend less of your time
>solving problems and more of your time finding mysteries.
>
>Avoid conclusions. Never hand over the 'microphone' after a conclusion. If you
>find yourself at a conclusion bring up a new conversation thread which has a
>hook before handing over the microphone.
>
>If a girl does not take a hook it does not necessarily mean it is a bad hook.
>Even a hook which doesn't catch will usually contribute a half point to your
>interestingness factor. Just don't look like you were expecting anything. Be
>self-contained - not needing anything. Keep your rap streaming.

>
>This post is really about pulling an indicator of interest out of girls at the
>approach. Of course there are ways of pulling all the other IOIs out early as
>well but I'll save those for later.
>
>-Juggler
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 23 Dec 2001 22:07:00 GMT
subject: Went for the easiest instead of the hottest
Learned a lesson today. And that lesson is: always go for the hottest
girl, not the easiest.
A few weeks ago, I met two HBs. One was a 9 (I've posted about her
before here), and the other was a 7. I knew the 7 was into me, but I
wanted the 9 more, of course. I took the 9 (who had a BF) out, and
*closed (even though from everything she's said I'm 100 percent not
her type--though she is exactly my type!). But the 7 called the 9's
cell phone while we were out, and said something like, "Hands off, I
want him." So I let the 9 go and fclosed the 7 a few days later.
So I still see the 7 sometimes, and today I was talking to her and she
said that she was talking to some of the 9's friends. The 9's friends
were mad at her because they said that she stole me from the 9.
Now, I am upset at myself: I went with the easiest girl instead of the
hottest, and I could have had the hottest. So the question is: now
that I'm f-ing the 7, is there any way to get back with the 9? (I
haven't talked to her since we hung out, but I know she wouldn't mind
hearing from me.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 24 Dec 2001 15:45:00 GMT
subject: Re: Hooks and Pauses
On Mon, 24 Dec 2001 12:28:00 -0500, juggler wrote:

>
>Hey CPowles,
>
>I have enjoyed reading many of your posts as well.
Thanks, man.
>
>Here is a little background:
>
>I am in entertainment. When I began my career I couldn’t get anywhere near a
>stage so I took many of these strolling jobs. Newbie challenges, chatting up
>sales girls… forget about it. I had to talk to hundreds of people a night
under
>pressure of being funny and astonishing. That is where I discovered many
>interesting truths.
>And it is a short step to applying that knowledge to the art of meeting and
>seducing girls. The two overlap a lot in my life.
Interesting. I sort of did the reverse. To get over a certain shyness

in everyday life, I pursued stage entertainment for that SOLE reason.
Once I was able to entertain in life, I stopped entertaining from the
stage. Also, you sound somewhat like Mystery: he's a stage magician,
and everytime he sarges, he's still practicing magic, entertainment,
and winning people over to hone his stagecraft. The two also are bound
tightly together for him.
>Although I have been working on adding some NLP, my game was pretty much
>installed when I discovered ASF a short time ago.
>During my sarging I can sometimes be seen accompanied by a seven foot tall

>German giant who likes to say, “I’lllll crushhh eir eads.” Besides that I
can’t
>understand a word he says. Anyway, I strongly recommend employing a goon. He
is
>such a conversation piece.
There are unfortunately no goons around where I live. Does your goon
travel? I offer attractive rates to goons, with bonuses for height
(per inch over 6'6"), nonsequitor catchphrases (the louder spoken the
better), and general idiocy (which can be calculated by dividing the
amount of words in their vocabulary by the number of words they
mispronounce).
================================================================================


================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 25 Dec 2001 01:39:00 GMT
subject: Re: Sandwich Opener
Darko, welcome to the board, man. I'm glad you'll be posting here. I
like your style, and your enthusiasm, and your willingness to try
anything. AND I know how hot the girls are in your region of the world
(and how little game most guys there have), so I am very jealous.
This is a good opener. I read your post on it elsewhere, and tried it

out the other day. When everyone can be maneuvered into the right
position (or when chance sets it up), it's a lot of fun! Very good,
playful way to start a sarge. I just tried it out with one wing (no
photographer).
However, I would like to start thinking of more scripted openers:

drawing an HB into a plot that involves you and one or two wings.
(Sort of like Mystery's opener where he asks an HB to deliver a
satchel full of money to a wing across the room.) Or even better, a
pivot/female-wing who can simultaneously start laying out this story
with an HB AND give you social proof. Maybe I'll start a new thread on
this.
On Mon, 24 Dec 2001 16:35:00 -0500, Darko wrote:
>Sandwich opener:
>
>While moving trough the crowded clubs, there are some routes formed, where
>people pass from one part of the club to another. Wing enters the route, I let
>a girl get between me and him, and follow her. I reach with my hand past her
>head and tap my wing in front of her on the shoulder. He turns to the girl
>"yes?". She tries to explain that it was me who taped him, I of course say
that
>it was her and I saw it (with a smile). By then we are already in a
>conversation. You don't have to be moving to use it, just position yourself so
>that the hottie is between you and when you reach to tap the wing she can see
>that it was you.
>
>You have to be playful and wear a smile.
>
>
>Example:
>Last night's "sandwich" in action:

>BadBoy goes first, I let a hottie enter the route between us, I tap him and
>hide behind her.
>BadBoy: yes?
>HBhacker: oh, it wasn't me, it was (turns around to see that I'm hiding.)..
>Me: (I smile to her so we both know I'm playing, but put on a serious face to
>explain to BadBoy) It was her man, I saw it
>BadBoy: (something like) oh, you like to play, don't you? (with a smile)
>Me: (Atila comes in with a digicam) sorry, but we have to take a picture for
>evidence
>(the mood goes up, we all laugh, BadBoy is aplying heavy kino, they hug, Atila
>takes pictures) You're going on the internet baby
>HBhacker: Oh my god, please send me this pic to my email (BadBoy email closes)
>
>
>Darko
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 25 Dec 2001 02:07:00 GMT
subject: Making Girls Cry (In a Good Way)
Last weekend, something new started happening on my sarges. Two

different girls I was talking to started tearing up. I've seen this
happen with PUGs, but never with myself before. I'd like to figure out
what button I'm hitting. So here's the story.
HB1: A very cerebral, somewhat sarcastic, very beautiful and

sophisticated mullato. I used the best friend approach on here ("Hi
(friendly squeeze, big smile). I'm sorry, you look exactly like my
best friend Ann. But take that as a compliment, because she's a cool
girl.")
Later, we started talking about mystery and the unknown. I

demonstrated some psychic stuff on her, and we talked a little about
the powerful emotional connection she had with a recent ex (this
probably triggered it). Then, when asking about the psychic stuff, I
talked about how I turned off my analytical brain and just got in
touch with my emotions, my feelings, because they are always right and
I can always trust them. As we talked, tears just started dripping out
of her eyes as she smiled this teary smile. And she had a bitch shield
when we originally talked. All her friends wanted to leave, but she
stayed and talked with me and of course #closed.

HB2: At a small party, there was a busty blonde with an okay face. I
wasn't even sarging her (already #closed an amazing HB9, and slept
with the host, an old MLTR). But she was talking about how travel was
the most important experience to her, and I told her about some of my
amazing travels and insights and people I'd met. Her hands were so
soft as we talked, that I told her I should hold them. As I talked, at
about five or six different stories or ideas I shared, her face would
just well up and tear up. I anchored all this with certain touches on
her hand, of course. Later, I asked my old MLTR if she often cried
like that, and she said no.
Both times when this happened, I felt I could just slowly brush her
hair back from her face, make eye contact, and move in very slowly for
a gentle kiss. Does anyone else here have experience with this, and
does anyone know exactly what is being triggered here? (My present
theory is that it may be some sort of unfulfilled frustration with
their own life finding release because I have the piece that's missing
in my own life, maybe.)
PS My old MLTR at the party asked when I had become such a ladies man.
I pretended, teasingly, that she had created this monster. Thanks
again for everything, brothers!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 25 Dec 2001 02:38:00 GMT
subject: Dealing with Best Friend: Fast Help Needed
Okay, as I was posting (in "tactics") about making girls cry, one of
the girls I sarged (but didn't make cry) in that post called me. The
HB9 who I met at an ex-MLTR's party phoned and, since we're both away
from our familes, she wants to spend xmas eve together. This is good,
because she's definitely MLTR or GF material. She said, "Do you think
we should hang out? Ex-MLTR probably wouldn't like it. I haven't told
her."
I could not think of the right answer at all here. She wants a reason
to hang out with me and not feel guilty about fucking over her friend.
I think I said the wrong thing, because by answering "i'm sure it's
okay," I may be showing myself to be a weasel.
So, no doubt, when we're making out tonight (if all goes well), this

is going to come up again. What should be my response (esp since I

slept with ex-mltr last night, though HB9 doesn't know it)?
Ah, the tangled web we weave...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 25 Dec 2001 03:35:00 GMT
subject: Re: Dealing with Best Friend: Fast Help Needed
Two Lessons:
1. What I did wrong.
2. The importance of having backup plans.
So, HB9 called and fucking flaked. She said that a friend of hers was
in town and had just broken up with her boyfriend, and she needed to
console her. Like an AFC, because I was so surprised (i had the
PERFECT sarge planned), I told her to call me afterwards to get a
drink. In other words, I LET her flake on me. I have half a mind to
call her back and tell her what I think of people who make plans and
then cancel them. Should I do this? What would YOU say?
Fortunately, while we were talking, another HB I recently met (but

haven't closed) called on the other line, so now I'm going to see her
in an hour for a little xmas eve celebration. Unfortunately, this HB
is not MLTR or GF material.
Obviously, I didn't say the right thing on the phone to HB9 (dude the
unspoken sexual tension on the phone between us was so high), and she
either chickened out or talked to my ex-MLTR. I still need to know:
What SHOULD I have said.
Man, no matter how good you get at this stuff, there's always so much
more to learn...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 25 Dec 2001 10:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: This was odd...

Dude, you didn't fuck up. You stopped too soon! See below. (Thanks to
Adonis for all of this!)
On Tue, 25 Dec 2001 01:45:00 -0500, jhunt2001 wrote:
>I was talking on the phone to a friend of 2 yrs. I started trying to change my
>thinking patterns and image to her. She says she has noticed my new
"attitude".
>
>Anyway, when Eliciting values, I tried...
>
>Me:Why do you date who you date, I mean, What is your Idea of the perfect guy?
>Her:I dunno, EX's name.
>M:How did he make you feel?
>H:Um, normal.
>Me:You didnt feel excited when around him?
>H:Only while we were having sex.
>Me:Blah Blah
You: What excited you the most about the sex?
Her: X
You: How do you know, when you have X, that it's really good? What
does this guy do that gives you X?
Her: Y.
You: So when you have X sex and a guy is doing Y, how does it make you
feel?
Her: Z
You: So if you have X sex and someone is doing Y, and you're feeling
this amazing sense of Z, wouldn't that be a great thing to have. With
me, I know that...
Just keep going, find out everything that turns her on, anchor it to
yourself, and push those buttons...
>
>I had fucked up by this point, but I did go on to tell her vaugly of how I cam
>make a girl with a great imagination feel wonderful emotional states and such,
>as we are friends, and it is somewhat odd that she shows up from florida and I
>am different.
>
>My question is, what the hell should I do now? Try to make her feel NORMAL?
>WTF.
>
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Tue, 25 Dec 2001 21:23:00 GMT
subject: Re: Pulling 1 Girl away from a Group of Girls
I have a different tactic than the above advice, which I credit to

Mystery. I try to entertain the whole group at first. I want everyone
to like me and include me in the group. If I try to shut everyone lese
out and focus on the HB, the group (or an obstacle in the group) can
get upset and try to drag the HB away.
So my steps are:
1. Entertain the group.
2. But, as you are doing so, talk more in depth with the HB you want.
3. Come up with your excuse for isolating the HB. ("to talk more
comfortably," "to show her a cool trick/game/thing/exercise").
4. If necessary, flatter the obstacle in the group. "Wow, let me see
your sweater. You have such a cool sense of style."
5. Then ask her friends, "Do you mind if I borrow your friend for a
second?"
Asking permission is great, because unless you're totally creepy, the

friends always say yes. And now you have ratification, so after you
isolate the HB, she's not going to be worried about gettiing back to
her friends because they've already said that they approve.
When I first heard the idea of asking the friends for permission, it
sounded silly. But I've never had anyone say no. In fact, when I ask,
I win extra points with her friends.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 02:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: Invent a mission
I'd like to try the kiss close mission. It's a more advanced one.
This involves going bar or club sarging. The mission is to sarge at

least 10 HBs in that night and to try for a *close with every one of
those HBs. This means that if you feel the PU is failing after a
couple minutes, you still have to try for a *close. And if you meet a
HB10 who is perfect GF material and all you want to do is exchange
phone numbers, too bad. Try to get her to kiss you.

The goal here is to improve your *closing technique by forcing

yourself to go for it more, by modifying your technique to see what
moves work best, and by seeing if you can increase the number of
successful *closes you will have in a night. We could even develop
rating system. It would be something like:
0: AFC
1-2: RAFC
3-5: aspiring PUA
6-7: PUA
8-9: PU Guru
10: PU God
I will try this soon and report back. Anyone else want to go for it
and report back too?
On Wed, 26 Dec 2001 20:18:00 -0500, Logan wrote:
>
>There are a number of newbie missions out there. There's Svengali's "just say
>hi" mission; there's Mystery's "Elvis opener" mission; and some others which I
>can't remember.
>
>I like these missions: they get my "juices" flowing. They're like the punching
>bag drills of PU.
>
>What I'd like you guys to do in this thread is to write down in your replies a
>mission that you think would be helpful in developing or refining particular
PU
>skills.
>
>In the thread OT: Spy Games
>one mission I liked was
>
>"Go out. Approach 20 women. Find out something interesting about each woman
>without giving away your name or occupation."
>
>(I can't remember who to give credit to for this one.)
>
>Another one, from Odious' site:
>
>"Go out with a small camera. Spend the afternoon approaching women and
building
>rapport with them. See how many you can get to pose with you for pictures."
>

>I think Violet-Lotus had something as well, but I can't remember it right now.
>
>OK...fire away!
>
>
>
>
>
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"CPowles100" <CPowles100@hotmail.com>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 03:21:51 GMT
subject: SPECIAL REPORT: Mystery teaches Sex Magic in Europe!
SPECIAL REPORT: Mystery teaches Sex Magic in Europe!
Beginning January 5, Mystery will conduct his 3 night Sex Magic

workshop in Belgrade, Serbia for 6 lucky students.
The dates for the Belgrade workshop are Thurs Jan 4, Fri 5 and Sat 6.
For workshop details go to www.mysterymethod.com right now.
Due to short notice (and a festive holiday spirit - it's boxing day
after all), Mystery has reduced the $600 registration fee to a special
Eastern European rate with significant savings. Sign-up now

by emailing Chris Powles at CPowles100@hotmail.com. Note that there is
high interest in this rare European class, so students will be
accepted on a first come, first served basis. (However, a SECOND
workshop is possible the following week in Greece, Romania, or
elsewhere in Europe if demand warrants.)
Happy Holidays,
Chris Powles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"CPowles100" <CPowles100@hotmail.com>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 03:57:01 GMT

subject: Re: SPECIAL REPORT: Mystery teaches Sex Magic in Europe!
To clarify, the workshop begins Friday, January 3 and ends Sunday,

January 5. My bad. Also, Mystery is having computer trouble, so email
me if you're interested.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 03:59:00 GMT
subject: BREAKING NEWS: Mystery teaches Sex Magic in Europe!
SPECIAL REPORT: Mystery teaches Sex Magic in Europe!
Beginning January 3, Mystery will conduct his 3 night Sex Magic

workshop in Belgrade, Serbia for 6 lucky students.
The dates for the Belgrade workshop are Thurs Jan 3, Fri 4 and Sat 5.
For workshop details go to www.mysterymethod.com right now.
Due to short notice (and a festive holiday spirit - it's boxing day
after all), Mystery has reduced the $600 registration fee to a special
Eastern European rate with significant savings. Sign up now

by emailing Chris Powles at CPowles100@hotmail.com. Note that there is
high interest in this rare European class, so students will be
accepted on a first come, first served basis. (However, a SECOND
workshop in Greece, Romania, or elsewhere in Europe is planned the
following week if time permits and demand warrants.)
Happy Holidays!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 04:09:00 GMT
subject: Re: It can change JUST THAT FAST
1. As Tzeen says, you should have #closed her the first time.
2. And you REALLY should have #closed her the SECOND time.
3. It's good that you forgot her and she remembered you. It means that

you made an impression. She got distant all of a sudden because she
was embarrassed to have been so enthusiastically waving when it seemed
like you had completely forgotten about her.
4. You didn't blow it by not recognizing her. You blew it by WORRYING
about having not recognized her. It's a nice neg that you didn't
recognize her. Then, when you finally talked, you shouldn't have been
all awkward. You should have ignored her state and warmed her up again
by being enthusiastic to see her. You should have told her that it was
a great conversation you had before, that it seems like you both have
a good connection, and, then half-jokingly, you could have said that
you would make up for the fact that you didn't recognize her by
letting her continue the conversation with you at a cafe sometime.
Then you should have #closed.
5. Did I mention that you should have #closed?
6. It CAN change just that fast, but you have the power to change it
BACK.
7. Know your ABCs: Always Be Closing.
On Wed, 26 Dec 2001 22:22:00 -0500, iclimb513 wrote:
>Damn I am bummin'
>
>About 3 weeks ago I was at my local climbing gym. I was hanging out and a HOT
>little girl I'd seen in there a few times and spoken to briefly once b4 came
>right over and sat down next to me and said "hey what's up" like we knew each
>other real well.
>
>So, I took that opportunity to run the usual techniques, getting her to talk
>about herself, eliciting values, etc and I applied good Kino.
>
>I wanted to leave on a good note, so at the first break in the convo I got my
>shit, gave her a firm squeeze on the shoulder and said "hey great talking to
>you, I'll see you again soon!". She responded with enthusiasm.
>
>fast forward 3 weeks to today. I hadn't been in there much since then and
>didn't see her the few times I was in there.
>
>So, I was in there climbing and there's a huge glass window at the far end
>that seperates the gym from this tv room and I see like this little dude in a
>hat waving at me and I'm like "who is this waving at me?"
>so I kind of give a nod and go back to what I was doing.
>
> Then later I see the same little dude in the gym at the other end and he's
>staring at me. So I kind of look at him with a "why are you staring at me?"
>look then go back to climbing and a bout 3 minutes later he takes hist shirt
>and hat off and now I realize it's her!

>
>I did not recognize her with this hat on and last time I saw her she had
>glasses on. FUCK!!!!
>
> So i walk up and tell her "hey didn't recognize you until just now... sorry"
>and she's like "uh yeah I was waving at you before but you didn't wave back"
>and she seemed much less enthused to talk to me after that, so I just made
>small talk for a minute and bailed.
>
>I'd love some analysis of what happened in her mind and how I can fix it.
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 04:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: BREAKING NEWS: Mystery teaches Sex Magic in Europe!
Mystery is having computer problems, so make sure you email me about

this. My email address is in the previous post.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 04:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: It can change JUST THAT FAST
><iclimb513> wrote in message news:3614.627@discussion.fastseduction.com...

>> Does it matter? I'm not that interested in any "I told ya so" and "You
>should
>> have done X and Y to begin with" type posts. Those aren't that helpful,
>dude.
>
You're looking at this the wrong way. Nobody is trying to criticize

you. They're trying to help you. To quote NLP language: "There is no
such think as failure, only results. These can be used as feedback,
helpful corrections. Failure is just a way of describing a result you
did not want. You can use the results you get to redirect your
efforts."
In other words, when this happens again, now you know what to do. Your

post tells me that you respond to a lot of things with insecurity: if

you can wipe away that counter-productive trait, you'll be well on
your way to becoming a PUA.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 17:25:00 GMT
On Wed, 26 Dec 2001 23:11:00 -0500, Logan wrote:
>
>What about English language issues? I mean, how likely are we to find chicks
>who speak English out there anyway? (Maybe it doesn't matter but I'd like to
>know what you think.)
>
Actually, I asked him about this. His response is that what he does
works very well across language barriers. He's had experience in other
countries. The concern, he said, is that the people he teaches MUST
speak English well.
However, I think you're speaking about people who are thinking of

coming out but worried about the language barrier. IMHO, I've sarged
in that part of the world before. First, the women are BEAUTIFUL.
Really, more 9s and 10s per capita than most places I've been. Darko
will vouch for me on that.
But, yes, PU'ing can be harder because not everyone will speak perfect
English. But PU'ing can also be easier because you can get away with
SO much more as a foreigner. Plus you have other things going as a
foreigner: maybe you seem more exotic, richer, better looking, more
mysterious, whatever, than you do at home.
Also, sometimes I'll use a wing as a translator and come up with fun
routines that way. Now that you've got me thinking, doing Mr. Smooth
there could be fun with a wing who speaks the language and an HB who
knows no English. But, overall, if you can do it there, you'll be able
to do it at home.
BTW, let me know if you need a website for cheap last minute tix
there. I never considered the possibility that people from further
away might actually want to come. Cool!

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 27 Dec 2001 21:03:00 GMT
subject: Re: Invent a mission
I define a *close as a kiss with passionate intent. In other words,

just stealing a peck on the lips when you say goodbye I don't consider
a *close. It doesn't HAVE to have tongue (though it usually does), but
it HAS to be a kiss that you couldn't give your mother or sister (I
hope!).
IMHO
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 28 Dec 2001 12:06:00 GMT
subject: Boy Toy Lay Report
Okay, I'm exhausted, so I'm going to have to make this quick. Went
with a friend to a pretty fancy hotel bar. There were two women
sitting at the bar, both looking amazing from the back. We approached,
and they were actually in their 40s!
The blonde was just amazingly hot anyway: thin, great body, soft skin,
thin WASPy aristocratic face, And she was very, very sensual. The
approach was the "do spells work," combined with a story about an
attraction spell. The blonde said: "You should just go for it" when I
asked her about this girl in the story. So I patterned off going for
it and being in the moment, then she started patterning me on how she
lives day to day, second to second, for herself only. Her friend
teased her about a one night stand, and she told the story. I used a
new Ross technique to elicit values and states, and she answered very,
very erotically. Then she said she was trying to teach her friend how
to be in the moment more and get in touch with her inner slut.
I told a story I've been telling lately about how my uncle's a sex
therapist. In it, I incorporate some Tantra stuff (about women's
orgasms and how women are the only sex with an organ made solely for
feeling sexual pleasure), and end with the conclusion that "it would
make sense, logically then, that since women get more satisfaction out

of really good sex, they should be out acting like predators." They
hung on every word.
Anyway, the sex talk continued for a little while. Then, there was
last call, and I suggested adjourning to my place for more drinks. My
"wing" almost blew this one, but it worked out and they came up. I
extracted the blonde by saying I wanted to do the Cube on her, but her
friend couldn't hear because then it would give it away. This way I
can do the Cube on her friend later, I said.
Anyway, a weird thing happened. We went out on the balcony, and I

started patterning a little. I talked about how it is when you're with
someone and you begin to focus in on one certain feature that you like
in their face. And the more you focus in on it, the more you become
aware of your breathing, in and out." She starts to get the DDB. Then
she says, "Are you trying to hypnotize me?" It freaked me out a bit,
because I don't really know the first thing about hypnosis. I was just
talking trance-y. But it felt like I was busted.
I recovered okay, and then kissed her without any kind of routine
(we'd been rubbing hands and arms for a while by then). Then I took
her into the bedroom. There was no resistance at any point: Ah, older
women. And, the best part is that the packaging was not deceptive. She
had a great body, and still looked good with makeup rubbed off in the
light later.
Anyway, there's something else I learned from this. Later, all four of
us were in the same room. The OTHER woman kept looking at me now. I
took her hand and we started rubbing each other's hands. Then I
realized that I couldn't ignore the woman I'd just slept with in front
of her. So I started to be very erotic and rewarding with the blonde
I'd just slept with. Everything I did to the blonde, I did to turn on
the other woman (a brunette). The amazing thing is that the blonde
just went wild, saying how amazingly sexy I was and that she was just
getting turned on like crazy. I suddenly realized a new way to think
about sex: do it, and imagine that you're doing it to turn on someone
else who is watching, an even hotter girl that you want to sleep with.
For me at least, it made my movements and touches incredibly
smoldering.
Anyway, my friend, who didn't even have sex with the brunette (even
though he easily could have), didn't have much game. I teased them a
little bit about bixexuality. But overall I couldn't figure out a way
to switch partners or to just get something crazy going on, so we
eventually bid them goodbye. I may try to see the blonde again because
she really was one of the classiest, most sensual, and, well, oldest

woman I've ever been with before.
I realize I'm writing this quickly, so let me know if you need more on
any of this. After all, the point of these reports (which I'd like to
see MORE of) is to learn about the PROCESS of seduction in detail,
even word for word when possible, and see what works. Well, this did
work, though there were a few sticking points when I felt that we
could have lost them. I think what saved us was the simple fact that
these older HBs were in the bar already looking for adventure.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 28 Dec 2001 18:54:00 GMT
subject: Re: This was odd... Also a Meeting of Masters
On Tue, 25 Dec 2001 13:58:00 -0500, Adonis wrote:
>Hey, just ask Chris Powles how powerful this is as I demonstrated it and
>anchored his values to sugar packets over lunch this last Sunday.
And not only did he anchor everything that I cared about to the sugar
packets, but then he poured it all into his ice tea and drank it. I
was forced to call him a vampire on the spot.
BTW, we had
>an awesome roundtable discussion and lots of fun with Ross Jeffries, Sin (Did
I
>spell that right), CP, Swinggcat and myself.)
>
>The waitress and manager did not know what they had gotten themselves into...
>Ross was an absolute MASTER, Sin combined Natural Skill and Intelligence,
Chris
>was ever coming up with new and even better ways of approaches as he broke
down
>underlying processes of how we do what we do, Swinggcat of course was smooth
>and hypnotic, and myself... I can't really comment on but for some reason that
>I'm not entirely sure of, Sin believes I am his counterpart but on the Dark
>Side... Hey, if he's not Dark then what am I? (Puzzling, since I am the nicest
>guy you could meet... although at the end of the night I asked Chris if he
>still thought I was evil... he said, "More than EVER!" :)
>

>We had all kinds of FUN. Which brings me to another point... above all, HAVE
>FUN with it.
True, we had a lot of fun, saw an amazing demo of Ross's skills (he
had a waitress and hostess competing for him within just 5-10 minutes
of convo for each), and watched helplessly as Adonis sucked up our
values and hijacked anchors on everyone's sarges. Yes, he is nice and
lovable and all, but he's dangerous. It's like Mike Myers: he's both
Austin Powers and Dr. Evil rolled up in one.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 28 Dec 2001 21:57:00 GMT
On Fri, 28 Dec 2001 16:05:00 -0500, hackingforgirls wrote:
>On Wed, 26 Dec 2001 22:59:00 -0500, CPowles10 wrote:

>
>>The dates for the Belgrade workshop are Thurs Jan 3, Fri 4 and Sat 5.
>
>Bars will be empty , the chicks are still tired after the first day
>2002.
They've had three nights to sleep. And, fine, if the bars are less
crowded, it just means there'll be less competiton and more bored HBs
looking for excitement.
>
>> (However, a SECOND
>>workshop in Greece, Romania, or elsewhere in Europe is planned the
>>following week if time permits and demand warrants.)
>
>Seminar in Romania ? U are kiddin right ?
>I want to see the first Romanian who will pay for that seminar.
>Do a check in PAIR to see how many PUA u will find in Romania .
Well, there would be more PUAs there if we left. And, think about it:
imagine how valuable PUA skills would be in a place where there is NO
competition. Someone could clean up. Anyway I already know a couple
Romanian aspiring-PUAs I've emailed before. Anyway, it looks like just
Belgrade for now for the workshop, though we'll probably be sarging in
Romania for a night.

>P.S. I still think that foreign languages will be a problem .

>A little tip for Mystery : Don't try the Elvis script in Romania .
>People in this country don't know anythin about Elvis , and even they
>know they still don't care . :)))) But maybe you will find a good
>subject of disscution trying to explain who is Elvis :))))
I think there just may be a couple of other openers that will work.
Thanks for the tip though: I'll have to change it to the Gheorghe
Hagi or Nadia Comaneci opener. The foreign language thing is both an
obstacle and an advantage: sure, some HBs won't speak English, but at
the same time you can get away with more if you're a foreigner. Also,
look at your somewhat cynical post in alt.seduction.fast.advanced: you
told the guy that if he's rich he'll automatically get laid, so
wouldn't it stand to reason that in Belgrade Americans/Canadians would
automatically be rich. Hmm.
I think you've got a negative way of looking at things, and maybe that
works for you and helps your sarges. But, have you ever read
Introducing NLP at all? It's a good book, and shows you different
frames to look at life through.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 28 Dec 2001 22:08:00 GMT
subject: Re: Boy Toy Lay Report
On Fri, 28 Dec 2001 10:45:00 -0500, Proto wrote:
>Haha this is a good FR. Makes me jealous.

>
>If have a few remarks and questions;
>
>1) It is caled Boy Toy Lay Report but I dont see any reference to Boy Toy in
>your story. Was this your frame of mind you were in? I have been experimenting
>with the Boy Toy image lately and gotten excellent results, but there seems a
>mist of homosexuality/bisexuality over it that I try to avoid. If it applies
>can you elaborate on this?
Yes, it's just the frame I was in. And it's been a great one. In
another report I posted here, I used it more explicitly and it got me
laid. I like to tell people as a joke, especially if I'm talking to a

slightly older woman and she asks what I do, "professional boy toy." I
think if you say it in the right context, it's clear that you're
talking about WOMEN.
>
>2) Can you elaborate on the 'do spells work' approach. Maybe I just need to
>RTFM again, and i can prolly guess what it is, but i wouldnt mind seeing it
>written out completely.
I ask "Do spells work?" THen I say, "The reason I'm asking
is because my friend over there is new to LA. And he met a girl at a
club. He wasn't interested in her sexually, because she wasn't really
his type [At this point, the girl always says, 'sure,' which is great
because I can say, 'no, really,' and begin light kino and
teasing--plus it shows us as nice guys who women are attracted to].
Anyway, she came over to his house and after she left, he found a
corroded metal ring and some feathers wrapped around a scroll under
his sofa cushion. Well, he took it to a magick store and they said it
was an attraction spell. And, now, the strange thing is, he's suddenly
finding himself attracted to her. Do you think that it's the spell or
just psychological?'
This this isn't genius or anything, but it never failed to get a good
convo going and open up doors for patterns. In this particular case,
instead of saying "my friend," I said that I was the one who the spell
was cast on (because I knew my "wing" wasn't good enough to play
along.)
>3) New way of Ross to EV. Is this covered in public? Maybe I need to RTFM
>again, but from memory Ross was less into EV and more into Patterning. Has he
>changed a bit? As I am currently studying real hard the latest developments in
>NLP I am very interested to see in Ross applying this new stuff already. Or if
>not what differences there are. Again if you dont mind I love to see it
written
>out completely.
It's cool shit, but you'll have to get that from Ross once he's
perfected it and starts teaching it. It's SIMPLE and DEADLY!
>4) Again I am also experimenting with Sex Magic theme. Now I am quite sure
>thats not in the manual so I am not gonna RTFM again. Mind writing it out in
>detail?
I'm not sure exactly what you're thinking about when you say sex
magic, because it's such a broad term. Let me know how you've been
experimenting. And you should check out Mystery's posts on these,

either on ASF or at his www.mysterymethod.com site.

>
>5) Dont be scared about the Hypnosis part. NLP, trance work, etc. is hypnosis.
>Just not the old hypnosis of the stage theater, but advanced healthy hypnosis.
>Much of the latest developments in NLP move it more and more towards hypnosis.
>A lot of old ideas about hypnosis are changed atm. Maybe the most important
one
>being that you cant be conscious while being hypnotised. Well you can, as you
>saw with this woman. One model to look at it is that we are all hypnotised in
>some way anyway.
True. Good way to look at it. It's just such a loaded word, I think.
>6) In order to get the other woman, or get something crazy going on you just
>start all over seducing those involved. SOI them. For the brunette it might be
>enuf if you seduce the blonde if the brunette is being led by the blonde.
I know...I could have escalated everything with a good SOI!
>7) Make good arrangements up front with your wing. He either should get the
>action going/ make things hotter or if he doesnt want to get the hell out and
>leave them to you.
I know. He came out as a friend, and knows nothing about this stuff.
And some people just don't GET IT enough to wing. They are attached to
their AFC ways.
>Proto
>
>
Great advice and comments, Proto. Thanks!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 28 Dec 2001 22:14:00 GMT
On Fri, 28 Dec 2001 13:26:00 -0500, modernlegends wrote:
>All four of you were in the room?! The sexual overtones must been crazy!!
They were!

>From what I could tell, the mood was already set, and you wanted to get the
>brunette and pawn the blond to your friend....You had the answer, you
>mentioned it in your post....Or maybe you can elaborate why you didn't do
>it. IMO You should have extracted the brunette to play the "cube" (in your
>room of course). I would have talked up your wing as much as possible
>before the extraction, still keeping up the "living in the moment" and the
>sexual overtones vibe...Then do the extraction....
You're right. Or even better, extracted them both. My wing, BTW, was
useless: everything that happened that night was because I instigated
it. He was too busy THINKING that he's cool by not doing anything at
all and talking in a really bored negative voice. I think I backed off
because we were sitting there making out afterwards as two isolated
couples, and, even when the brunette was playing with my hand, I
couldn't figure out how to mix it up. In hindsight, it would have been
really easy if I'd just been more direct. Next time!
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 07 Jan 2002 11:53:00 GMT
Yaritai,
You nailed it here. I had a great time, yes, but could have had a better one.
And what I needed was less patterns, and just clear SOIs. I should have simply
been the director, and given them the real adventure they were looking for.
Isn't it funny how high our standards are now: I can go out and get pocketfuls
of numbers or get laid, and still feel like a "failure."
Anyway, a general note: I've been traveling and haven't posted here lately, but
have a lot of field reports to come. However, what you point out here Yaritai,
screwed me up last night when I was so IN with a porn star looking blonde. You
are so right: I need to trust that I've conveyed enough personality, have
enough IOIs, and should have the fucking balls to SOI hardcore (the above
sentence was just dictated to me by Mystery, but is very true).
Anyway, we're having an amazing time in Yugoslavia--so many HB9s and 10s here
it's sick--and have tons of stories to get out of our brains and into
cyberspace, when we have time. Sleep is needed now...(cause we need to meet

girls in the afternoon. Look for the field report on one of them: a whole
entire club "pawned" for one HB in a seven-set with four guys in the corner.)
<<I envy the shit out of you man. Two sexy older women... Mmmmm mmmm!!!
Anyway, just wanted to point out that, at least from your post, you let
slide a MAJOR opportunity to have yourself a threesome (or foursome since
your buddy was there too) with two hot hot chicks. Maybe at the time you
were too busy thinking that you might be insulting the blonde or that it
would have made her angry, but you shoulda jumped ALL OVA that brunette man.
AND kept the blonde in the game too. Your bud would have been going out of
his mind watching you have your own private little threesome. I know how it
is to not see things clearly when you're in the middle of it all, but
believe me, THEY WERE BOTH UP FOR IT. It was SO obvious from your post. If
there's ever a next time, DO NOT HESITATE.
> could have lost them. I think what saved us was the simple fact that
> these older HBs were in the bar already looking for adventure.
Yup. I think you're right on target here. All your patterns and shit were
utterly worthless here, and in fact, I think you're lucky that they didn't
actually fuck up the PU. These chicks knew they wanted action from you the
moment you spoke to them. Kudos on having the balls to approach and
progress, but you made your PU much more complicated than it needed to be.
That whole balcony scene was pointless. Doing more than you need to do can
make you look like your trying too hard and desperate. Always remember to
keep things as simple as possible. Complicate things ONLY when you see and
identify a NEED for it, not just because you 'think' that patterns are the
only way into her panties.>>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"pimpstylez" <0>
Sat, 19 Jan 2002 12:07:00 GMT
subject: Need help with strange chick chancel logic...
Another example of strange chick logic and I'm not

sure how to handle it right.
I met this chick online and we exchanged some mails.
I wrote her that I'm not interested in e-mail contact and
if she doesn't want to have a real relationship she shouldn't
write back.She wrote back and gave me her number.
I called her some days later and we had a nice conversation.
Mostly fluff, but quite funny.Finally we made an appointment

for today in the evening.

So yesterday she wrote me a mail if I'm still ok with the date
and I wrote back sure I'm.
I also had send her a pic from me after she begged me for it.
Maybe that was to needy but in the end it's just a pic and also
a good one ;-).
So today in the morning I get a mail from her:
"It doesn't work for today.Let's meet another time."
I thought "What the fuck???".I'm really confused.At the phone it was
ok, yesterday it was ok and today she writes this shit.
I had some more experiences like this before and it's always the same.
Chicks like to meet, we make an appointment and she is happy with it and
just before the date she writes one of this fucked up messages.
I'm always working on more than one chick, so it's not a big loss, but
I would like to know what is the best to do in a situation like this.
Should I write her back and suggest another meeting(I think phone her would
be to afc) or should I just forget this chick.Suggestions appreciated!
pimpstylez
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 21 Jan 2002 13:08:47 GMT
subject: Mystery conducts Sex Magic Workshops in your city
Hey,
This is from Mys. We're out of the country, sarging in Eastern Europe,
but return tomorrow. The workshop here was wild, and he's planned tons
more for you guys:
------------------------------------------------
Isn't it time you finally "GOT IT?"
Mystery is conducting Sex Magic Workshops in Toronto, New York City,

Los Angeles, and San Francisco.
Toronto workshop Jan 24, 25 & 26.

NYC workshop one Feb 1, 2 & 3
NYC workshop two Feb 5, 6 & 7
Los Angeles workshop Feb 28, Mar 1 & 2
San Francisco workshop Mar 7, 8 & 9

Reserve your spot now (only 6 positions available per workshop) by

emailing magic@erikvonmarkovik.com. For more info, visit
http://www.mysterymethod.com/
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 23 Jan 2002 07:51:00 GMT
subject: Responses to Stevie M Posts
Hey all, been gone a few weeks. Back now. Missed these forums!
Anyway, Stevie B, your posts kick ass. It sounds like it's time for
you to raise the bar for yourself a little. You need to be getting
other closes. Make your goal next time you go out to TAKE HOME the
hottest girl you make out with. I mean, she is kissing you. Why is
she doing that? Perhaps she wants adventure? Then give her more
adventure! Start planning out the next stages of your PU: from kiss to
extract to lay.
Also, from your four-kiss close report, you said you were having
trouble getting phone numbers. Here are two super basic techniques I
sometimes use or combine with the other classic #closes:
1. In convo, I always seed the close. In other words, I know already

what I want to do with them when we meet again: take them somewhere,
show them something, whatever (a show, a special place, an exhibit, a
hike, etc.). I mention it casually in the convo as a cool thing to do.
When I leave, she usually asks for my number so that we can do this
thing.
2. Instead of asking for her number, I "give" her mine. But not
really. I take a piece of a paper or something, and rip it in half. I
write my name and number. But I don't give it to her. I hand her the
pen and the other half of the piece of paper. She has to be a real
warpig not to write hers down. Then we exchange pieces of paper.
A NOTE: In this forum, we've always stressed getting the girl's

number. I've realized now that it's important to give the HB your
number too. I call so few of the numbers that I get (because I'm
already juggling so much), and sometimes a HB I don't call will
actually call me. Then I KNOW she's VERY interested, and the game is
on.

Alright, Stevie B. Looking forward to your lay reports in the future.

And, by the way, you'll notice that in situations like that footballer
party you went to, the social proof not only makes approaches and
closes easy. It HUGELY reduces flaking...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 23 Jan 2002 09:15:00 GMT
subject: Re: 4 # closes(incl: 1 TongueDown + Heavy Petting).
Yeah, like everyone says. Nice job. But once you started making out,
you turned off the PUA and became that AFC/supplicant just trying to
get some and rub her crotch as much as you can. She was really
controlling you here, and you should have flipped the tables and
controlled her a little bit. Played hard to get. Don't be easy: be the
prize. If a friend is forcibly pulling a HB away after a *close like
that now, I'll usually say something like, "Hey, where are you going?
You owe me $60 for that. This shit ain't for free."
Now, she said that she and her sister both liked to party. As soon as
the sis came over, you should have totally focused on her. This would
have done one of three things: won over sister 2, made sister 1
jealous, or perhaps initiated a threesome. I have a friend who was
just seduced by two sisters into a menage a trois (and a foursome,
with another girl). Some sisters do that...
You could have used the Mystery line:

You (To Sis 2): Have you ever kissed a girl before?
Sis 2: Yes.
You (To Sis 1): Have YOU ever kissed a girl before?
Sis 1: Yes.
You: Now don't start kissing each other right here. I might get
jealous.
Then, you could have transitioned into just being playful with the two
of them, until they invited you to come with them and meet their
friends.
That said, sounds like you had an amazing night anyway.
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Thu, 24 Jan 2002 02:28:00 GMT
subject: Re: Stairwell opener
When you do get her to your house, rent "In the Mood for Love," if you
don't mind subtitles. It's a slow beautiful movie about two neighhbors
who always pass each other on the stairway, and eventually fall in
love.
On Wed, 23 Jan 2002 14:17:00 -0500, sillywilly wrote:
>There's this HB I've noticed in the building I live in. I've seen her
>about 3 times, just going up and down the stairs. She recognizes me,
>I recognize her, and we exchange "hi" (which elicited a smile from her
>last time).
>
>Next time I see her I'm going to try the following opener:
>
>"I've got a question for you. Do you like to meet new people?"
>
>That should take her by surprise. I've never used this opener myself,
>so I am curious what will happen.
>
>Planned strategy:
>
>She says "yes": "Well let me introduce you to a great guy. My name is..."
>
>She says "no": "No? Well then, how do you plan to meet the man of your
dreams?"
>If she is really taken, she'll say so now.
>
>Anything else: handle as "yes", or eject.
>
>I also think this opener is good because it sublty presents her a
>challenge right up front, if she is receptive to meeting new people.
>On top of that, I can gauge her reaction to see if I want to get to
>know her, or if it's not worth it.
>
>Whaddya think?
>
>
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Thu, 24 Jan 2002 19:54:00 GMT
subject: Re: Responses to Stevie M Posts
On Wed, 23 Jan 2002 00:31:00 -0500, ZgBadboy wrote:
>Man, we are waiting to hear your reports from your trip(Belgrade)...

>and how did workshop went...
>Romania??
>
>badboy..
>
Dude, I have SO much to report, I need to get around to it. Better

yet, I'd like to post pictures. Where can I do this?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 24 Jan 2002 19:54:00 GMT
subject: New Phone Number Rule
This should have been obvious, but I've only just realized this:
ALWAYS, when #closing, give your number to the HB as well. This way,
if you never bother to call her or just don't have time, she has the
option of calling you. And if you made a good enough impression for
her to call you, then you know that you're in.
I never really did this before. I was so focused on just getting the
HB's number, that most of the time I never bothered to give her mine.
(And I think an HB always assumes you're going to call, because
they're not used to being blown off by guys.) But, when you're
#closing many times every night, there's no way you're going to call
every HB back. Today, I just got a call from an Asian HB I #closed
with three weeks ago and never called. And this has been happening a
bunch lately. So from now on, I'm switching my frame from making the
HB want to give me her number to EXCHANGING numbers.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>

Thu, 24 Jan 2002 21:10:00 GMT

subject: Re: New Phone Number Rule
On Thu, 24 Jan 2002 15:43:00 -0500, Alessandro wrote:
>Give her your number and:

>1) you are well known.
>2) she can call you whenever she pleases.
>3) you supplicated by giving her your #
>4) you are always at an arm's reach.
>
5) you will get laid if she calls
If you want to remain mysterious and unavailable, just get an

answering service and give her that number. Problem solved.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"pimpstylez" <0>
Fri, 25 Jan 2002 02:10:00 GMT
subject: Fieldreport--My first HB 10 PU!
Just 2 hours ago and I talked with this amazing chick and
I still can't believe it.But I like to share the whole story with you guys.
2 weeks ago I was in a cocktail-bar with some buddys.It's a also a good place
to PU,
cause there're always a lot of HBs.This evening HB cat was sitting at the bar
with a
(lame ass AFC) guy.My buddy told me he saw her before at the University and
that she's
the goddess of all chicks.We all agreed, cause she's a real 10.Long dark hair,
brown
eyes and an incredible body.So my buddy told me that every guy admires her, but
nobody
has the nuts to approach her.So I decided at this moment, that I wanted to have
this chick.
A year ago I would never dreamed of even say "Hi" to her(Thanks to ASF!!!).
So I saw her one time on campus, but she was to far away and to quick.
This week I heard of a party at the campus, where she definitely would be,
cause its
a party of her subject.So this evening I prepared for everything.Look good,

push myself
up with some NLP and made a goal(Talk to her and even if its just one time).
I met with a friend at the party(We were early there so could see who would
come) and
we were looking for chicks.My friend is a real AFC, but good looking, so we
always have
chicks looking after us...I also don't look that bad myself ;-).
This evening we first started walking around talk to chicks we know and watched
for good HBs
(especially HB cat).Finally she arrived with a girlfriend(HB 9).My friend
started to discuss
with me about approaching this chick and for him it seemed almost impossible.
I said that I would definitely talk to her today and we should wait for a good
moment.
Broke the 3 second rule but anyway.We chatted with some other guys and I
watched HB cat
from a distance.Two AFCs talked to them and made every single mistake I now
know.Standing with
their beers, talking some dumb fluff and don't realize the body language of the
chicks which was
more then clear(Both had their arms crossed and tried to watch away).
Finally both HBs started to talk with each other and tried to ignore the AFCs.
10 minutes later the HBs were alone again(Poor failing AFCs!).
So me and my friend moved in!We leaned next to the chicks at the wall and
chatted while I
thought about a good opener(bad cause i started to get nervous!).Then this guy
walked by,
who looked like a famous TV- Moderator.I just looked at her and said: "Don`t
you think this guy
looks exactly like (moderator)?That's really strange, isn't it?"
She looked at me a little bit strange, but friendly and answered:" Yes.You
right.A little bit maybe."
So I also asked her gf but then started just talked to her(some minutes later
the gf was approached
by some other AFCs--they bought her a drink--just for info--;-))
So I started convo by asking some fluff questions, but immediately mirrored her
posture and
gestures(In the beginning crossed arms--later on more and more open).
I also tried active listening and let her talk most of the time.So we talked
about different
themes and found more and more similarities(I also got her into realize that
"It's amazing we have
so much things in common, like everything I say is also a part of your life").
So I tried ev and got her into talking about her interests and even about a car
accident she had
some years ago that deeply moved her(Not a fun story but really personal and

emotional).
I talked with her about 1 hour and she opened up more and more(in words and
posture!!!).
So she was really into me and finally her friend talked to her about leaving.
She is still happy talking to me so I worked forward a close.
She lives near me(good for me!) and so it was easier.
Me: "So I also have to go soon.How about us meeting for a drink some day?"
(nothing creative but it worked...)
She:"Oh that would be nice"
(I also have to mention she had very low bitch shields and in the end none at
all.)
Me:"Ok.The best I think is you give me your number and I call you when I have
time"
She:"Ok.I give you the number"(got my handy and she gave the digits and name)
We talked just for some minutes after that and then I ejected with a kiss on
her cheeks!
With a great ego boost I walked to my buddy and we left.He was amazed and
couldn`t believe
what I did(We often talked about getting this chick cause she's definitely a
hot 10).
At home I realized what I just did and was surprised by my own skills(Still
RAFC...).
So I got the number of the hottest HB on campus and she even lives near
me(couldn't get better, i guess...).
I'm now thinking about when to call her and what to say on the phone to get her
into a meeting.
I would be happy about suggestions, cause I never dated a HB 10 in my life
before.
My strategy would be to get her to a bar and drink something and then work with
patterns, kino and
sexual language.Maybe you guys can give me some hints?
ASF changed my life, thank you guys.
pimpstylez
(RAFC in progress!)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 25 Jan 2002 06:25:00 GMT
subject: What to Say While Making Out
Today, a girl who LJBF'ed me a few years ago stopped by. We hadn't
seen each other in a over a year, and she looked good. But I was

really exhausted and hadn't showered or changed clothes, so I didn't

pull any seduction-type tactics or even talk much at all. In fact, I
specifically remember thinking to myself, "Why aren't you using any
SS/ASF tactics or patterns?" But it didn't matter because for some
reason she started giving me the DDB look. When she went to leave, she
hugged me, and then I looked her in the eyes and started kissing her.
So, everything was fine, it was very passionate. But I wanted to ask
people here, When you're making out, and you take a little break for a
second, what do you say? There's a school of thought that you don't
talk till you're done with the deed, but I don't know if I buy that. I
often feel that the HB WANTS to hear something that lets her know she
did the right thing and that it's okay to proceed. What are your
thoughts on this? What do YOU usually say?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"pimpstylez" <0>
Fri, 25 Jan 2002 20:14:00 GMT
subject: Fieldreport--My first HB 10 PU!
First of all.THANK YOU FORMHANDLE for this great answer to my post.

It was more than I expected and definitely opened up my eyes.
It's quite a new situation for me but I learned a lot by
reading your post over and over again!
So I decided to do what you said and tried to see her more as a normal
chick than as a HB 10.Not easy for me but after fighting this old AFC-feelings
it worked out better and better.
I decided to call HB cat today and to talk on the phone like you suggested.
So here's the call:
Me:Hi it's pimpstylez from the party last night

She:Hi
Me:How you doin?Everythings ok?
She:I just finished class.It was a hard day today.
Me:So you were on campus the whole day?
She:Yeah.Almost the whole day.
Me:You have to know I really enjoyed talking to you yesterday.
I think it would be fun when we could meet next week.
She:Yeah I think that would be nice.
Me:Ok how about going to X and do Y or we can just hang out at Z and do W
(like you suggested formhandle)
She:Oh I don't know X but Z would be cool I think.

Me:Ok we wanna meet there at Tuesday or Wednesday?

She:Wednesday!No lets say Tuesday that works better for me.
Me:That's cool.Let's say half past six?
She:Oh I have training that day.Would eight be ok for you?
Me:Yeah that's ok.So Tuesday at eight at Z?!
She:Alright.See you there.
Me:See you.Bye
She:Bye
I was a little bit nervous before the call and tried to do everything close to
your advices and I have to say I'm really satisfied with everything.
She wasn't flaky at all(even very friendly and happy) but I was prepared for
everything.
I going to refresh my patterns for this date and definitely will do everything
to
get her back into the good state she was with me before.
Haven't heard of a bf so far so I think there will be no problem.But I also go
out sarging
with some buddys on the weekend so I go on with my normal life cause I
definitely don't
want to get caught in one-itis.
I'll post my progress next week(a layreport would be nice I think ;-) ).
One step closer to PUA and I'm loving this feeling!
pimpstylez
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 26 Jan 2002 06:56:00 GMT
subject: Re: New Phone Number Rule
On Fri, 25 Jan 2002 01:56:00 -0500, Candor wrote:
>If I never bother to call her, it means I don't want to talk to her.
For me, sometimes it's that, and sometimes I just forgot or didn't
bother or didn't feel like we had enough rapport.
>I know I'm in anyway, because she volunteered her phone number without my
>asking for it.
Come on. How many times has that happened, and then there's been

blurring or flaking afterwards?
>
>I get charged for incoming calls on my mobile, so it would end up being
>expensive to be called by 20 different chicks a day with whom I'm not
>interested in having a conversation (remember, they're calling because I
DIDN'T
>call them, and I didn't call them because I didn't want to talk to them). In
>addition, it's a waste of precious time that I COULD spend talking to HBs that
>*I* want to talk to. I sure as hell don't want anyone calling me at work, so
>that leaves my home number, which is always busy during those rare times when
>I'm home, either because I'm connected to the Internet or talking to somebody.
I guess this is your frame, and I do respect it. But then just get an
answering service, so that you can CHOOSE who you call back. Or leave
your home number and screen on caller ID. If you're on the internet,
who cares: they can leave a message.
Anyway, it's not really worth debating. For me, I'm going to start
exchanging numbers; for others, maybe it's fine to just get the
number. Whether you do the former (so that more HBs call you and you
have more to choose from) or the latter (so that who you call is at
your discretion) just depends on what your goals are.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 28 Jan 2002 05:51:00 GMT
subject: Re: Emergency!!!: CHICK tells me she has HEPATITIS B, and to GET TESTED!!! WTF DO I
DO!!!??? PLZ HELP
Come on, let's be understanding here. This does suck.
So, here's what I know about Hep B:

1. You can't contract it through kissing unless you have cuts. It's
mainly through sexual contact.
2. Get a dose of HBIG NOW! If you get the shot within two weeks after
sexual exposure, you have a good chance of eliminating it. I hope
you've called a doctor by now! If not, check the yellow pages under
immunizations or something like that, or find a "travel doctor" who
specializes in immunizations.
3. Your shots would only give you lifelong immunity IF you had a three

shot series within a year. Hey, maybe you got this as a kid. Ask your
parents.
4. Let this be a lesson to all here: NEVER have unprotected sex with
anyone--no matter how clean cut and innocent they look--unless you've
both been tested for everything. I always assume with anyone I bring
home that their last bf was a junkie, and protect myself accordingly.
5. Stop reading this, drop everything you're doing, and go see a

doctor IMMEDIATELY and get your HBIG shot (not a gamma globulin shot).
It's $40-$100 for the visit.
6. Are you still here? GO!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 29 Jan 2002 00:06:00 GMT
subject: Re: 1st # and kiss close
On Mon, 28 Jan 2002 00:14:00 -0500, lovedrop wrote:
>Kiss on cheek != kiss close

>
>A kiss close is a kiss on the lips. Preferably a tonguedown.
>
>o===3
>
I define a *close as a "kiss with passionate intent." Otherwise it's

just nothing but a handshake with lips...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 29 Jan 2002 09:53:00 GMT
subject: Re: Emergency!!!: what to do about HEPATITIS chick, opinions, thoughts, rants?
Dude, GET a HBIG immunity shot NOW, like I advised you in the last
post. You NEED a three-shot series for lifelong immunity. Don't accept
a doctor's advise that you're PROBABLY okay. It can't hurt to get that
extra shot, especially since 90 percent of sexual contact with Hep B

results in infection. So if you get that shot within two weeks (the
sooner the better), there's a good chance you'll be okay.
After you immunize yourself, THEN you can worry about what to do about
that shitty girl. Okay? Report back here when you do, otherwise I have
ZERO respect for you!
Better safe than sorry...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 29 Jan 2002 19:02:00 GMT
subject: Re: Dealing with teenies
On Tue, 29 Jan 2002 00:40:00 -0500, NewToTheGame wrote:
>Chris,
>
>I am not sure if this response is sarcastic or not but I will let you all know
>tomorrow.
>
I think this is the funniest thread I've ever read!
Seriously, dude, open like you would anywhere else: use less patterns,
more cocky/funny (though I am a little concerned about your sense of
humor). And a gimmick is always good...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 29 Jan 2002 22:04:00 GMT
On Tue, 29 Jan 2002 15:24:00 -0500, NewToTheGame wrote:
>Ok. Since you are not newbies I simply wanted to see if there was anything
>different in the SS knowledge when working on younger women.That's all.
>
>Thanks anyway.
>

Here's a more detailed reponse on mature vs younger, which was posted

a while back on ASF, I think. It's not by me. I forget the author's
name (apologies all around).
------------
One thing I keep in mind while sarging: Say you see a sexy girl, and
you use that line of "Hey, do you have theatrical
training......because you have great posture", and she goes "Ah...ok".
That's a great line, but when will it NOT work? When the girl is
immature. I'm sure that some of you here sarge chicks who just
finished high school a year or two ago. You can't expect to charm them
with a line like that. They're just not mature/intelligent enough yet
to appreciate that. This is when you have to use that bratty sister
frame. Maybe the numerous methods of seduction are scrambled in your
head, because so many people here focus on teasing, and playing with
the girl, and yet so many others here focus on how to be a charming,
charismatic sweetheart. I'd like to untangle the wires in your head
for those of you whose picture is blurry. For the more mature girls,
you don't really need to tease them. Usually you don't need to go
beyond a little bit of play fighting, and if you tease them too much,
they might start taking you seriously, and actually take offence. So
for those girls (the mature ones), use everything that Ross has to
offer them + some good intelligent conversation. Note how Ross treats
his girls like adults, I never once heard him go into the bratty
sister frame. This is mostly because he's screwing around with mature
girls. Do you think that a 17-18 year old chick will understand half
the shit he's spewing? She'll usually go "huh", because 1) she doesn't
care so much to experience the 'wonderful connections' as she'd rather
just have fun and 2) she hasn't been on this Earth long enough to
appreciate what's truly rare, so she cannot appreciate you ; ). On
Saturday I was in the car with 3 girls, and 3 guys. They were all in
the age range of 18-19, but at the end of the night I had the hottest
girls there (definitely a nine) on my lap, with her arms around my
neck without ever meeting her before, and I didn't use a single
pattern, an embedded command, or a time distortion. It was all just
because I kept making jokes. One thing I keep in mind, as soon as she
began laughing at my humor in general, I began making fun of her. She
said "Let's go buy some alcohol, so that I'll be in a more party-like
mood", and I said "and then you'll talk less too, right?" She showed
us her boots (they were those really long boots), and when she
accidently hit me I said "Damn it, why do you have to bring your work
boots into the car?" (implying that she was a hoe). You could never
get away with something like that with a mature girl, but this was
exactly what this girl needed to hear.
Once I saw a cocky young girl sitting on the train, and I come up and

say "Hey, do you mind if I ask something of you?" She said "Sure", and
I say "Can I have your seat?" She was like "Wh..at?" So I say, "Well
it's already warm, and I'm kinda cold...would you really want to have
me freezing on your conscience?" This was just a cocky, humorous
opener, that I'd prefer not to use with the more mature ladies. With
the older ladies I do things like "Hi, I just noticed you from over
there, and wanted to come over to find out what you were like." Get
it?
--------------------
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 29 Jan 2002 22:09:00 GMT
If none of this works, however, you can always just tag, release, and
attack the queen! We call it the Sandstorm Method. I believe he's now
teaching classes on it, and selling the technology.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 29 Jan 2002 22:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Green Girl
On Mon, 28 Jan 2002 23:09:00 -0500, InnerCalm wrote:
> I've been talking to a woman. I've tried several approaches and got her
>interested. I recently played the colors game with her. I asked her what
>color best discribes her personality. She said Green.(Those who prefer Green
>are gentle and innocent in their approch to sex, they are gentle, but not
>passionate). She is exactly like that!
>She does not respond well to poetry and romance like most women do. Responds
>better to just talking in general, and responds to casual flirting, with light
>direct sex talk, but not too direct. She has expressed her disire to fuck me,
>but doesn't get heated up when I get romantic with poetry and NLP. I think
she
>might be bi-sexual, but I'm not sure.
>
>I'm confused. I know I can fuck her. I just don't know what really pushes

her
>buttons. Does anyone have expirience with this kind of woman?
I'll tell you what pushes her buttons: fucking.
Seriously, I recently had experience with a girl like this. She didn't
get excited by anything. In this case, it pays to just be direct. Have
her over to your house, and just tell her what you want. I don't know
enough about this girl, but mine was simply ready to be led. She
needed direction and didn't give any resistance. Just tell her, when
the mood seems right, "come here" (in a soft, casual tone). Then kiss
her. Take her hand, bring her back to the bedroom. Say "take off your
shirt" (again soft, casual, and as if it were the most natural thing
in the world) or just go for it.
There comes a time (and I think I may start a thread on this) to stop
the sneaky stuff and just be direct, be confident, and be a man. After
all, she already told you she wants you. What are you waiting for?
Looking forward to the lay report!

CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 29 Jan 2002 23:46:00 GMT
subject: Introducing NaturalPUA...
I've been thinking a lot about naturalPUA, who is the first Pick Up
artist I ever met. Of all the PUAs I've seen since, no one operated
like him. Unfortunately, he's now renounced his PUA ways and is
celibate, and I am not able to model him. However, he's the best I've
seen, and maybe we could discuss here WHAT made it work.
He was about 6'7", long curly hair, Semetic looking, average build,
and pretty average looking. Definitely not the kind of guy who turns
heads. His long hair was maybe the only thing that made him stand out.
The day I met him, we went to a club, and, within two minutes, he had
made eye contact with a HB standing nearby. They walked off, made out
in the corner, and then parted. Not a word was spoken between them at
any point. Every time we went out, he'd just slink off with different
girls, and make out or get BJs and hand jobs in the club. A total AFC

friend of mine hung out with him for three days clubbing, and within
that time they walked back to their car with 12 different pairs of
girls (that's 24 HBs) to make out. In other words, NaturalPUA was so
effective that he could PU a girl for himself and one for his AFC
friend.
He had no real PU lines. He was very casual, totally fearless, and

very soft-spoken. When I was with him, he'd do a street pickup by
making eye contact and just saying, very casual, "Hi, we're going to a
party. Want to join us?" At restaurants, if he caught a HB looking ,
he'd say, "We're having a very interesting conversation, if you'd like
to join us." At parties, he'd say, "Do you know CPowles?" And from
there the adventure would begin...
From what I asked at the time, his frame was that he was the adventure
that women craved, the dark mysterious anonymous guy who'd sweep them
off their feet for a brief unforgettable rendez-vous. Compared to the
tactics I've learned from the gurus online, NaturalPUA worked so much
quicker and with almost no talk. He'd sometimes talk a little before
and after, and find out a bit about them in a very caring way. He
loved women, from semi-UGs to total 10s!
This is what else I know: he lost his virginity at like age 11. At 13,
he says he used to walk around with the mind of a 19-year-old and just
pick up girls his age right and left. So I suppose after so many years
of this, he just honed this animal-like instinct for sniffing out who
was ready for it, and just moved in with slow confidence.
My questions are: Is what NaturalPUA did part of the tactics we learn

here? And, more important, how can WE do what he did?
(I can maybe email him questions if we have some...)
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 30 Jan 2002 00:33:00 GMT
subject: Re: OT Email Fun
I got it too. Didn't open it, though I was tempted. Thanks for the
warning! So does this mean that someone, or some virus, or some evil
UGsupervillain, is targeting us innocents here on ASF?

When will they understand: we don't do this for ourselves, we do it

for them...
On Tue, 29 Jan 2002 19:18:00 -0500, juggler wrote:
>I received an email today with an exe which I not very smartly opened. Of
>course it was a virus. %$^#&*@!
>
>The thing that makes it relevant to this group is the subject line contaied
the
>name of Mystery, Rio, AlphaHot and a few others.
>
>I opened it because I was expecting something from Mystery. Just saw his name
>in the heading so I double clicked it. Anyway, it went through my hard drive
in
>a flash and copied all my jpgs and emails and tried to upload them somewhere.
>This is the first time I have been thankful I have a slow dial-up connection.
>
>Anyway, I don't know if I was targeted personally or others on this group were
>as well. I know most guys on this group know better than to open an unusual
exe
>but i just wanted to send a warning. The file was called sample.exe.
>
>-Juggler
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 30 Jan 2002 02:32:00 GMT
subject: Re: Introducing NaturalPUA...
On Tue, 29 Jan 2002 18:46:00 -0500, CPowles10 wrote:
>He was about 6'7", long curly hair,

Oops, that's 5'7"
================================================================================
================================================================================
"pimpstylez" <0>
Wed, 30 Jan 2002 05:35:00 GMT

subject: HB cat story.Fucked up a possible lay...
This is the follow up to my PU HB 10 report last week.

Our date was Tuesday evening and sadly this is not
a layreport(more kind of a fuck up report).
Tuesday evening at eight I was at the place we wanted to meet.

A small pizza restaurant around the corner.
10 Minutes after eight HB cat arrived.I had set my limit of
waiting for her to 15 minutes, but I expected her to be late(enough
experience with that).She arrived by car and she was wearing
a jeans and a sweater, quite casual I would say.
We exchanged cheek kisses and went into the restaurant.
We got a small table and sat opposite to each other.
I can't tell exactly what we talked about, but i will describe
how the conversation was developing.
First some fluff about her day and what we did the last days.
She is really good at small talk and the conversation was flowing.
After some fluff I started with patterns.I opened with IC and got
good reactions.I got her into talking about her most wonderful
vacations experience, her dreams and romantic experiences( Quite harmless
by the way).She told me about a guy she was dating for three nights but
never kissed... = her most romantic vacation experience.
I asked a lot of open end questions and in the beginning she seemed
uncomfortable to talk about her feelings, but it gets better after a while.
So we talked almost 2 hours just about feelings and she was really into me.
Found out she loves dancing, likes art and
France is her favorite place in the world.I told her that I also took
some dance lessons some time ago and she suggested to go dancing
together next week(more on that later).
During our conversation I also kinoed her like a friend when she said something
funny and then kinoed her hands by
asking her about the story behind her rings(Found out both were gifts from
ex-friends).
After 3 hours she suggested to go cause she was tired.I agreed and we paid.She
waited to get out her money but I didn't offer her to pay everything.She seems
to be used to get everything paid (waited very
long to get out her money).
I don't think she is a gold digger, more like she is used to guys who pay for
her.
To this point everything worked out great.I mirrored her the whole evening
and we got a lot of eye contact so she was into me a lot by then.
We walked to her car and I stopped there.She asked if I walked and after
I agreed she offered to drive me home(that was what I worked toward anyway).So
we drove to my home and sat in the car in front of the house.

I asked for her homephone number to call her before we want to

go dancing(Only got cellynr.).She had no pencil and I invited her to come in
cause I
got a pencil there to write down the number(A very good reason I think ;-)).
So we finally were in my living room on the couch(everything worked out perfect
so far).Got some smooth music, a drink and some pictures from my last vacation
to watch them together.I explained the pictures to her and started kino
her arms and legs.She was ok with that.We finished with the pictures and I
thought that was a good moment for a kc.We sat beside each other and I started
kino her face and played with her hair.She was also ok with that.
When I started to move in for the kiss she turned her face and said:
Let's dance now!
I said ok and we started to make some dance moves.That was very nice cause
she is a good dancer.But I still got the kiss in my mind that didn't work out
and wanted to repeat that as soon as possible.During dancing our faces where
close again but she seemed to avoid now to get her mouth close to mine.
I wondered cause she was really into me and reacted good to kino before.
Finally she said she was tired and wanted to go.I saw everything I worked
for this evening go down the drain and still got the kc as a goal in my
mind.But it was to late now.She had already decided to go and I didn't want
to scare her or appear needy by trying to get her to stay longer.
She left and I did a last attempt to kiss her on the mouth for goodby but
she moved her face so it was just a cheek kiss in the end.
That was it.I was so close to a kc or even fc with this HB cat but
everything turned in a strange way.I'm still not sure what went wrong
cause I got a good feeling with her the whole evening and I know she
was into me.My impression was that she is a very social girl who
likes to party, but she always reacted shy when we talked about
personal things.She's very passive, I almost did all the work.
My ideas are that i didn't kino enough and was to concentrated on the
kiss that I made some mistakes that turned her of or she was scared
by her own rate of attraction to me(seduced her to fast)...just thoughts.
So after I fucked up this great opportunity chances seem to lower
now.I meet her next week for dancing(will call her before).
But I don't want to get LJBF by her( I think she does that with a lot
of guys).So what is the best thing to do now with this chick?
Did I fucked everything up at this evening or is there another way into
her pants?
When a chick is into me that much that is normally a sure lay in my experience.
I don't want to waist my time with her but if there's still a chance
to lay her I want to use it.
pimpstylez
RAFC on a mission

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 30 Jan 2002 18:56:00 GMT
Responses to Proto and Neo-Rio
Neo-Rio wrote:
> Maybe it has something to do with the fact that men don't get emotional with
>women until after sex (documented fact) - and such a guy constantly remains
>a mystery until after sex - so women fuck him simply to get him emotional
>and to find out who he really is....... only to find that the guy is such a
>pro that he is emotionless after sex too!
Maybe. But also I think it's more that if you're a blank screen, a
woman can project her own fantasy on you. You're an empty vessel for
her to fill with her fantasy.
On Wed, 30 Jan 2002 06:21:00 -0500, Proto wrote:
>Haha, I am trying to get to get the wordless PU done.

Same. That's my goal these days. Hard to get in the frame of mind with
the total confidence to do it. That's why I'm trying to model
NaturalPUA.
>Point 1 is that if you establish enough rapport in a club by social proof etc,
>you can pull off amazing things without speaking. You dont need to speak just
>look at her and you can indicate that the two of you are gonna do X (kiss,
make
>out leave and fuck whatever)
Yes, but for what it's worth, NaturalPUA didn't need social proof.
He'd just go with me, alone, or one other person. He didn't need to
work the room, or have HBs see him with other HBs. He just sort of
appeared out of nowhere.
>
>Point 2 is that it is your total congruent behaviour that sets the limits. So
>if you are deeply convinced that you can walk up to her and get a BJ within 10
>seconds, you can pull that off.
Yes. To quote the ancients, "Hesitate and all is lost."

>
>Now comes the interesting part. I know from experience that the deep rapport
>can be established within a few seconds of EC. So in theory it is possible to
>make EC to a girl, walk to her, tonque her down, take her hand and lead her to
>a place to fuck all within a seconds.
Definitely. EC was very important to him. We'd be walking around and

he'd make EC or get a glance from a HB all the way across the street.
And he'd say something like "Contact," as if he knew he was already
in.
>Now the bad part. It doesnt work all the time. Off course many times when it
>fails, its me who fucks up. But there are times when I know everything is
going
>well (for instance with other chicks), and I still get burned badly.
I guess calibration and experience is key here, to know whether you

can do it wordless or need negs/rapport/EV and all the other talking.
>DOes NaturalPUA gets burned now and then? Can you tell us more about his
>failures aswell? Most of the times more can be learned from failing then from
>the successes.
Well, his failures never seemed like failures because he didn't care.
(Very important!) Sometimes he'd approach very casually to talk, and
if the HB wasn't interested, he just walked away--no bruise to his
ego. He also seemed to have a slightly harder time PU'ing more jaded
types of city HBs, whose guard was up, and in places where the HBs
knew his player reputation.
>And what the fuck is this celibacy thing? That makes me sick haha.
I know! He suddenly became very religious, and is extreme in his faith

as he used to be in his hunger for one-night (and one-hour) stands and
MLTRs.
Here's a dialog we had.

Me: So do you have sex anymore?
Natural: No.
Me: Do you masturbate?
Natural: No.
Me: Really?
Natural: Well, sometimes, when I sleep, I have wet dreams.
Me: Isn't God trying to tell you something? It HAS to come out.

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 30 Jan 2002 19:05:00 GMT
On Wed, 30 Jan 2002 08:09:00 -0500, Logan wrote:
>
>Chris:
>
>What quality of women did this guy get?
>
>How did they compare to the kind of women you saw Mystery PU in LA?
In general, when he was in a club, he wasn't picky about looks. He

just loved women--sometimes they happened to be super-hot, sometimes
they were just mediocre; sometimes they were married and older,
sometimes younger and innocent, etc. For MLTRs, he usually chose hot
ones or ones who appealed to this sense of the
"adventurer-artist-aesthete" that he sometimes considered himself.
Mystery, on the other hand, generally just goes for the hottest woman
in the club.
And, Rubirosa, I haven't read that book. If you think it would be

helpful to the group's PU techniques, it would be great if you could
summarize "Mike's story" here.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 31 Jan 2002 10:43:00 GMT
subject: Re: Not In Control
On Thu, 31 Jan 2002 01:21:00 -0500, Next Level wrote:
>What I'm wondering is when do other guys feel the least in control during a
PU?
>I think the best way to explain this is by example:
>

>But when I call the chick and set up a meeting, if I get fucked around by her
>answering machine or she flakes and doesnt want to meet me, then I get annoyed
>about it.
This is happening less and less for me, but when it happens, I don't
mind. It's just one less HB to work...and one more night to go out
sarging.
>Likewise if I get stood up on the date it also pisses me off because I have
>wasted my time.
That's why I always, now, make TWO "dates" for the same night. This
way:
A. If one blows it off, I have a back up.
B. If the first HB is lame, I can eject and meet the second HB.
C. I can go out with both of them, and make them compete for my
attention. Usually, I'll focus on the HB I want the most, and then,
when I want to punish or fractionate, I'll focus on the other HB.
>
>Anyone else have a similar (or different) view on this?
>
For me, when I'm the least in control is when I'm about to go for a
*close or another physical close. Here is the one moment when the HB
has the power. Before this, she's in my control, playing my game. But
when I go for the *close, it's the one moment where she has control,
and can say yes or no.
Now, this may just be my own self-limiting belief. If it is, please

tell me so and how to get past it!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 01 Feb 2002 18:32:00 GMT
subject: Re: Communicating that you're qualifying them - Ideas needed
I like this, Juggler. Lately, I've been working on adding challenges

and qualifications all the time when I talk, and your questions here
are a good way to do it. It keeps you in the driver's seat, and your
questions also involves a lot of presuppositions, which is great.
Also, before I hang out with an HB, I've been working on trying to
make THEM nervous by giving them MY expectations, and making it seem
like THEY are too eager. I've been into mixing this all with humor

too, like in the following exchange setting up a lunch hang-out after

an HB I sarged IM'ed me today. There's no genius stuff here, but it
just shows the attitude, which is a newer frame for me:
CPowles: So XXXXXX
CPowles: Saturday
CPowles: 2 p.m.
HB: i'd love to go, by the way... thank you
CPowles: Wait, I didn't actually invite you yet.
HB: fine
<snip>
CPowles: I will call you before I leave for your place on Saturday. I
do expect you to bring your sharp wit and adventurous spirit with you.
CPowles: Oh, and some towels too.

HB: I'll be sure they're intact.
HB: yeah... that's a tough one... I don't know... clean towels are
quite simply a precious commodity.
CPowles: Okay, forget I mentioned it. The wit and adventure should be
enough to start with.
On Thu, 31 Jan 2002 17:38:00 -0500, juggler wrote:
>Most guys work this backwards.

>
>In general, with women you just met, you want to make statements. Avoid asking
>many questions.
>
>The exception are questions which you ask for screening purposes. These are
>tests which you make up for her to try to pass.
>This accomplishes a few things. It shows you have distinguishing taste. It
>tells her that she will have to have more than just a great body to get with
>you and it puts her in the proper dynamic of working to garner your
affections.
>
>You can be direct or subtle. But either way they should be difficult even to
>the point where she can not answer. That is right - have her fail some test
>questions.
>
>The questions should require work on her part either because they require
>imagination, a sense of humor or just plain stretching her values to meet
>yours.
>

>Here are a few examples and follow ups:

>
>1."If you could spend your life doing one thing, what would it be?"
>
>She will probably say something lame. You follow up by telling her about your
>passion in life. You give her an example to try to live up to and demonstrate
>how well spoken and thoughtful, passionate about your own life you are.
>
>
>2."I like a woman who can cook well. What is your best dish?"
>
>Wether she comes up with something or not you tell her your favorite is
>'whatever'. Mine happens to be lasagna. So I tell girls how much I like all
the
>gooey cheese and noodles, etc.. If she doesn't enjoy and like to talk about
>food I usually walk away. I love eating.
>
>3. "If we were a couple and I wanted to hang out with my friends to 2 am. How
>would you feel about that?"
>
>Here you are point blank telling her the treatment you expect and holding a
>hoop for her to jump through. If you end up having a LTR with her, she will
>remember that she agreed not to complain when you stay out late.
>
>Of course, make up your own questions based on what you like from a girl. But
>just make sure they are not too easy and that they are interestingly creative
>questions.
>
>-Juggler
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 03 Feb 2002 19:49:00 GMT
subject: Solution for the dreaded *close blocker speech
One HB I met at a lounge this weekend, after a short soft kiss, really
pulled back and said that she "was tired of sexual energy." And then
gave the dreaded SPEECH. This is how I reframed, and it worked very
well. First I told her that I understood what she was saying, "but
you're not talking to me. This is something that happened between you
and someone else, and hopefully one day you'll get the chance to say
this to him. In the meantime, this is a new experience to be open to."

She agreed, and then I added something about how what she experienced
before is not about all guys, it's about immature guys.
Then I improvised this bit, which I may incorporate into my game (some
of its, to give credit where its due, uses Ross J. and Mystery lines):
"I feel that nervousness and fear also. It's part of that whole boy
meets girl thing. But do you know what? Fear comes from the exact same
place as excitement. They both give you the same physical sensation
inside, and when we’re nervous and excited, we sometimes interpret
that as fear. So I’ll tell you what? Let’s try something: let’s get it
out of the way. It’s very easy. Pretend like we’ve already slept
together. Maybe we met last night, and you felt those butterflies, and
you just trusted them, and we went back to your house. It’s a very
cute place, and I like your sense of style, though your bedroom was a
little messy. You probably didn't expect company. Anyway, it didn't
matter. We spent a wonderful night in each other’s arms, very
passionate but also very safe and comfortable, and it was just
wonderful. It didn't even feel like the first time because we just
seemed to know already what each other liked and wanted. And we both
just glowed and tingled from it afterwards, when we were apart. So I
called you this morning and said, 'I had a wonderful time last night.
Meet me at XXXX.' And here we are."
Comments?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 03 Feb 2002 19:58:00 GMT
subject: Kinaesthetics Do It Better
I've been noticing lately that the HBs that put off the most sexual
vibe are usually process information kinaesthetically first. The
visuals tend to talk fast, and put out more of a fun, party vibe. As a
visual, I come in with a good, fast, fun energy. But lately I've been
trying to phase-shift by thinking kinaesthetically. In other words,
trying to feel (through body sensations) instead of see the
environment. And I noticed that it slows my speech down and I put out
a much more sexual vibe. (This may be why, after sex, you're glowing

and just radiating sexual energy, because you're so in touch with and
feeling your body sensations, which have just been stimulated.)
Does this make sense at all?

Has anyone else noticed this?
And does anyone have any suggestions for modeling kinaesthetics during
a PU?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 04 Feb 2002 08:27:00 GMT
subject: Re: Saturday (or should it be Twat-urday) night
On Sun, 03 Feb 2002 13:49:00 -0500, wizzard wrote:
>
>Had a wicked night out last night, and thought I would share. No closes, as
>I'm still really not sure what I think of all this shit. I am getting good
>at approaching and not just standing gaping at pretty HB's like my AFC
>friends do though.
Yes, this can be fun. There's no feeling like the feeling of getting
better!
>
>'k, we're out in Bristol for my mate's girlfriends birthday. About 8 of us,
>including 2 of her single friends from work. I quickly realise they are
>boring, but decide to try and get them interested anyway, if I can, and
>maybe pivot on them if I can't.
>
>They did help me realise one thing though, which is that it really does make
>a difference to appear interesting from the start. Now I work in computers,
>for an up and coming internet company, with lots of high profile customers,
>it's an interesting job but because 99% of it is sitting behind a desk doing
>very little, I find it difficult to talk about with any excitement, and this
>is reflected in people's reactions. Now, I'm also writing a novel, and
>devoting much of my spare time to it, I'm passionate about it and can't stop
>thinking about it. I just spent a week away with my laptop to just write.
>So, when people ask me what I do, "I'm a novelist". Eyes light up and they
>ask "Really?" or "What's your book about?". Then I tell them and quite
>often discuss in detail various bits of the book, which because I'm writing
>about it is going to be a subject I'm into and know lots about. Eventually
>the smart ones ask what I'm living on, at which point there's no problem
>with a dismissive "oh, well during the week I work in computers, it pays the

>rent and doesn't really define me as a person". MUCH better than "What do
>you do?" "I work in computers." "Oh."
There are lots of good opportunities to pattern here, and not just
about the subject matter you're writing about and your passion for it
and the way you make such an intense connection with the laptop so
that the rest of the world just fades away and you can just do it
anywhere. Also, if you ever make a gaffe in conversation, now, you can
say, with some intensity that this is why you write, because the
connection between your head and your hands is so strong.
I can write this out in more detail if you want, but it's all good
stuff and field tested.
>
>Now, as we enter a fairly trendy bar, packed with assholes but with
>generally high quality totty, we pass a group of 3 fairly hot girls. They
>are standing next to us for a bit and I'm thinking of an approach when I see
>that one of them is wearing this t-shirt with a velcro patch on the front,
>where you can put your own message in fuzzy felt letters. This girl is
>easily the hottest of the three, but written across the front of her very
>pink top is "WITH MY MATES". So I'm like, suit yourself, and don't bother
>to approach :(
To quote Mystery, the PUA is the exception to the rule. This is what
AFC's think. A PUA would approach the other two, and then completely
ignore the one in the With My Mates top. When she tried to be included
in the convo, he'd then use her tshirt against her and just exaggerate
the fact that she only wants to be with her mates, agreeing with the
point until it seems almost ridiculous. This way, you try to back her
into the corner of either saying "that's not what I meant" or
including you as one of her mates if you've demonstrated some value.
>
>My (fairly AFC) mates remark on how hot one of the waitresses is, and fuck
>me, I think I know her. So when she comes over I'm like "wait, don't I know
>you?" and my mates fairly blatently duck and cover, can't believe that I
>said that to her. "Aren't you HBThai's friend?" I say, and she is, and we
>fluff a bit, although she's obviously bored 'cos she quickly interrupts with
>"would you like a drink?" Now, I'm not particularly short, but most of my
>mates are a good couple inches taller than me, and this girl is VERY tall,
>like model tall. I think I was quite intimidated by this, and when she
>asked if I wanted drinks I turned to ask my friends what they wanted, and
>found myself confronted with a row of tall backs :( There was then an
>awkward pause while I got their attention and took an order. I also didn't
>know how much cash I had and had to check before asking people what they
>wanted.

This is where pattern interrupts work, to get people off their

autopilot responses. Also, if you find yourself in this situation of
looking un-alpha in your group (trying to get their attention with
their backs turned), there's always a way out. In your case, you could
tease the waitress and try to turn the tables with something
humorously delivered like, "Why don't you ask them. That IS your job,
isn't it, or are you going to just stand around and hit on me me all
day?" or whatever.
>
>Now, we actually ended up sharing a table with HBwithmymates, and her two
>hot mates. I remembered a piece of Mystery's advice (I think), which was
>"Don't sit down", and so instead of fighting for one of the few stools was
>happy to stand up. I think it makes a difference. Was far too put off by
>what it said across HBwithmymate's chest, so didn't approach, but did make
>occasional eye contact with all three, totally breaking the three-second
>rule.
The rule is: don't sit when you're looking for HBs, but when you meet
or are talking with HBs, then you want to sit and be included in the
group. In this case, sit if you want to sarge them; stand if you
don't. I still say you should have sarged them, but that little AFC
who is slowly dying in your head interfered.
>This almost put me off approaching at all, but here's the thing; Girls
>_don't_ know about the 3-second rule. It IS good to approach spontaneously
>but if you can't, or just don't, it doesn't always matter. If you're just
>talking to your mates, that's a good enough reason to have not approached.
Yes, the 3 sec rule, for me, is a general principle, not a hard and
fast rule. If you miss three seconds, it never hurts to go in anyway.
One point of it is to make you ACT before that little AFC voice starts
talking you out of it.
>
>So, when one of my AFC mates points out how hot the girl in the pink top is,
>I say "yeah, you're right, I think I'll go talk to her", and did. Now you
>might *think* that a girl with "With my mates" written across her t-shirt is
>going to have bitch shield on full, but actually these girls had no
>discernable bitch shield at all, and were very friendly. I approached with
>a "hey, how you're doing, I expect you're wondering why I've come over to
>talk to you, I'll tell you", and told them that I'd noticed them when we'd
>come in, and said that I was the sort of person who enjoyed talking to
>random people in clubs, BUT I deliberately hadn't because of HBwithmymate's
>t-shirt, and then asked her was it her intention to use it to put guys off?
>I guess I was really relieved when she burst out laughing, genuinely, and in

>a friendly way, and it was a hell of a boost to my confidence.
See! The PUA is the exception to the rule. I hope you've learned from
this. Don't prejudge: just move in and find out.
>
>So had a fairly interesting conversation (round the world trips, blind date,
>pop idols) with all three of them, trying to play the group dynamics and
>being in charge of which one spoke at which time. Maintained good eye
>contact and anchored with the one nearest me. One good point was when I
>asked them all which university they'd been to, and nearest one had been to
>the same one as me, so I was all "Really?" and pretty much ignored the other
>two for a minute, which made them work noticeably harder. Towards the end
>of the conversation the bouncer kept trying to chuck us out, and we all sort
>of dispersed. Maybe I should have tried a #-close and I'd probably have got
>it, but didn't.
You definitely should have. Especially when an outside time constraint

is imposed like this, it's a perfect opportunity to #close so that you
can continue the conversation at some future date. Even if you're not
going to use the #, you should at least do it for practice!
>
>Oh, HBwithmymate's had just been round the world, and made me guess what
>she'd brought her mates back from India. Before I could guess, they'd told
>me - Viagra! Damn, the more I think about it, the more I think it would
>have been fun to #-close and see them again. I was thinking about training
>one of my mates to clap me on the shoulder and say "we're going _now_, just
>get her number" loud enough for the target to hear, then it would be pretty
>easy to grin and ask for the number.
No! I'm willing to bet that you talked yourself out of asking for her
number when you were with her. Your AFC friend should just say "we're
going now." Then you should use a tried and tested number close from
the archives here. In fact, train them to always time constraint you
after 10-15 minutes with an HB. This way you have the option of
#closing, escaping, or staying with her, and she knows your time is
valuable.
>Went on to a club, and was more interested in dancing with the group I was
>with, but did approach HBbabyspice-lookalike who was sitting on her own
>right next to us. Pretend to trip over my mates and grab her shoulder to
>steady myself, then sat down facing away from her, but kind of turning to
>apologising,
Never apologize.
>and then started talking to her, worked pretty well, but I

>think with this girl in particular I couldn't have gone wrong. However, I
>didn't work this out until too late.
Do you see a pattern here?
> I was like, why are you sitting on

>your own, where are your friends. She said they were over there, but she
>wasn't in the mood to dance. Like a true AFC, I probed her for why, and she
>eventually told me that her boyfriend had just moved in with another girl.
>At this point I should have twigged that she was really up for a random
>pull, but I didn't. I was fairly drunk by this time, dammit dammit arse
>fuck.
No PUA I knows drinks. Well, actually one does. But you shouldn't
anyway.
>Conversation was stilted, and really difficult, but she was really
>really touchy-feely, touching my arm and my knee. Conversation was so bad
>that I got bored and turned back to my mates, leaving her on her own - I
>misinterpreted her general one-word answers as a no-thanks, when actually
>they were a "look, I'm in a bad mood, but really want a snog". She walked
>off soon after, and I remarked to my mates how touchy-feely she was, but
>still *did* not get it. I suppose this is easy to say with hindsight, but
>at the time I had no clue what her agenda was.
Sometimes you can ignore all the preliminaries and just move to kino
and *close. Calibrate...
>Then she fucking came back and sat right by me, didn't she. A returning
>fox, if ever there was one. I *really* wish I'd tried Joey's Story - see
>another thread I'm about to start - because it would probably have worked.
Fuck Joey's story or any story. She wouldn't have been interested.
Just phase shift and move in, because obviously she's interested!
>So I talked to her again, and without thinking tried a neg (I think this is
>a fairly good one), told her I wasn't sure if she was the same girl when she
>sat down the second time, and had had to ask my mate if she was. She looked
>horrified, and I just shrugged my shoulders without apology, to which she
>half hugged my arm. And I still didn't fucking get it.
Oh, man, you were so in. This hurts to read... I've never tried this,
but in this situation, as she half-hugged your arm, II might have
said, "You know what?" hard eye contact. "I...talk...too...much." And
then *closed.

>Then this FAT FUCKING GAY TWAT, suddenly appeared from nowhere and started
>asking us about Pop Idols, and who did we think would win, and who did we
>want to win. He pushed and pulled us so we were sitting facing him, to
>which HBbabyspice just ran off. I was like "you fucking idiot", and he said
>I should watch my language, because we were being filmed for Pop Idol, with
>hidden cameras. I walked off in disgust, and he started the same routine on
>my mate, couldn't work out why. Later we realised he'd probably nicked my
>mate's mobile phone. Fucker. What is wrong with some people?
To escape, and credit to Mys again: "NAME, shall we see what adventure
awaits us in another room?"
>
>HBbabyspice came back AGAIN! This time I was sitting at the opposite end of
>our group, and I was going over, when this other guy sat with her and fairly
>soon after started snogging her. Oh well.
>
>I will reciprocate unprovoked kino.
I'm glad he did that. Because you deserved to see it. And how long did
it take him? No time at all. Now, next time you're in this situation,
be that OTHER guy! And don't hesitate!
You're learning, though, you're learning. It comes piece by piece.

Nice job, though, in approaching and in recognizing the weaknesses.
Your mission this week is to KILL your internal dialogue!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 06 Feb 2002 02:51:00 GMT
subject: Phone Sarging Advice
A couple months ago, I met an HB8.5 in Vegas (21, Brazilian, 9.5 body,
with just a massive REAL chest but her nose is a little big). Anyway,
I went for a *close and failed solely because I just didn't go in with
enough confidence at the moment. But I had tons of rapport, and now
she calls and we talk all the time. She's going to come to visit me in
two months, because I told her I'm busy until then.

Now, I can tell on the phone that when we talk I'm on the line between
good friend and destiny dream man. She says she doesn't often open up
like this to people, and feels so comfortable, and is passionate about
the same things, and wishes her friend wasn't in Las Vegas getting in
our way. She's has an intense attitude but is delicate inside, and her
attitude towards relationships (and friendships) seems to be all or
nothing.
In the old days, I would just maintain friendly phone contact, and
then wait until she comes to visit to try and make her an MLTR. Now,
however, I'd like to escalate this relationship on the phone, so that
when she comes she feels like we're already dating and all that needs
to be done is to consummate the relationship. Anyone done this before
or have any advice on doing this or lines/patterns/routines to try to
create an MLTR over the phone with an HB you haven't *closed yet?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 06 Feb 2002 21:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: Phone Sarging Advice
On Wed, 06 Feb 2002 11:39:00 -0500, juggler wrote:
>Have you talked about having sex yet?

>
>-Juggler
>
No, this is my problem. I've had social proof, demonstrated value, and
made an emotional connection. But, I am at a loss regarding how to
initiate a physical connection on the phone. Come to think of it, this
advice could definitely help my off-phone game too.
So, before we discuss having sex, I have to get her to agree that
being together intimately with me is something she wants to do and is
thinking about. And it probably has to be done in a way that doesn't
scare her away or make her think that I ONLY want sex...
There's probably a simple bridge into this stuff...
================================================================================
================================================================================

"pimpstylez" <0>
Thu, 07 Feb 2002 22:45:00 GMT
subject: HB Cat - Chick logic experience
My last report was about my date with HB cat

and the failed KC.I'm still working on this chick an I
just want to tell you guys how everything developed so far.
This week I met HB cat again.We wanted to dance and I
wanted to close the deal this time.
We met at the dance place, kiss on the cheek and we went dancing.
That was not as bad as I thought, cause I could use a lot of kino
(you have to when you dance anyway ;-) ).
This time I used less patterns and more fun and kino to get her ready
for more and it worked out quite good.
After dancing I suggested to get something to eat, cause she mentioned
to be hungry before.So we got in her car and drove to a near diner.
We sat beside each other on the table(better kino opportunity) and
the talk was mostly fluff.It was a lot of kino I worked with this evening.
The convo was funny and relaxed and I used the opportunity to
kino her hands, arms and her hair and got a lot of ec.
We stayed at the place for one hour and she offered to drive me home again.
Sounded good and we ended in the car in front of the house.
I used the opportunity and started to kino her hair and face.She reacted shy
but seemed to be ok.So I finally leaned in for the kiss.
Kissed her on the lips.She didn't turn away this time.After the kiss, chick
logic
came to her mind and she started to tell me that we should wait and everything
was too fast.So I said: "Ok, let's wait 5 minutes!" in a humorous
way.She laughed but continued to tell me that she need to know sb longer to
kiss
him and that a kiss is a very personal thing for her.
I got her into admitting that our "relationship" is something special cause
we got so much in common and that she enjoyed the time with me.
She told me the usual chick bs like she needs to know me better...needs time
...and she always knew her past bfs longer before they came together.
To me this sounded like she has not much sexual experience(21 years) but maybe
she is
just too shy.I'm not sure.I know that she liked the kiss so that couldn't be
the
problem.I realized that a FC wouldn't work after this so I asked her what she
suggested
to get to know each other better.She said spend more time, so I offered her to
spend
a day together(Give her a last chance).She was ok and we'll meet again on
Sunday.

I said I'll surprise her, but got no idea what to do so far.Something to get
her more
sexual would be the best I think.When she left she hugged me very intensive and
cheek kiss again.
I think she liked the kino and the kiss but there is too much chick logic bs in
her brain.
Maybe could have get over it with more kino but I was not prepared for all this
strange
shit she came up with.Ok, now I know what to do and will try to get her horny
by making
more sex talk and kino next time.I don't want to date her longer without the
right results,
so next time I'll definitely be prepared...just my thoughts.
Anybody got another idea how to get over this chick logic resistance as fast as
possible?
Got not much experience with this so far, but I'm willing to learn.
pimpstylez
RAFC on a mission
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 07 Feb 2002 23:41:00 GMT
subject: Re: Put a price on yourself
Juggler, when all your PU manifestos are collected, there is going to

be an amazing collection of original knowledge and technique there.
I've been into this lately too. As posted in the Mystery Lounge,
another similar tactic I like to use is if a woman lingeringly touches
me in a bar when she's walking past, or if I just meet someone and
they're being very physical, I'll say, "That'll be $30. This shit
ain't for free." (You can always throw in a "hands off the
merchandise" line before saying this.)
I modeled this from my ex-girlfriend, a sassy 9.9 who used to get hit
on ALL the time. In fact, for the benefit of FastSeduction, here's a
quote from her describing her attitude. I think WE should have it
instead.
"I went out and all these guys were drooling over me. I go home in
tears sometimes because all these guys are all over me and all I want
to do is have fun. A guy came up to me and kissed my hand. I slapped

him and said, "I ain't no merchanidse to try out.' I said to this
other guy, a hot lawyer, 'You do not touch me when you go out. Why
don't you go touch one of those trashy whores over there. I'm sure
they'd like it. I AM a lady' Then I said to another boy, 'You gotta
think a lot faster than that if you want to talk to me.' His friend
was sitting nearby and said, 'Hey Miss Extrovert, come here.’ I said,
‘You don’t tell me to come here. I ain’t no extrovert. I’m very, very
shy."
Good, simple, cocky, flirtatious stuff that makes you the hard-to-win
prize...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 07 Feb 2002 23:51:00 GMT
subject: Re: Change in game plan
I haven't followed this whole thread, but, in general, for the most
part I liked your firmness here. But your frame of trying to pass HER
test was a little supplicating. And, besides, you don't want to give
yourself over to a girl who's going to play these games.
Tell this girl when you see her that you don't play games and don't
have time for games. Then go into the 36,000 days in a lifetime
pattern (do you know this one?). Tell her you are a mature human
being, and if she wants to be one, she has to learn to trust her
feelings and not her friends. As I said before, I haven't kept up on
this thread, so if you haven't laid her yet there are some perfect
intellect vs feelings patterns you can spin off of from here that end
with a little strong kino.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 08 Feb 2002 06:01:00 GMT
subject: Re: Phone Sarging Advice
This is good stuff. And what I like most is how when you escalate into
kino and get physical, it's very congruent with your personality. It
seems like less of a phase shift (which others here do) and more of a
smooth and easy transition. You joke and tease and challenge them into

being physically comfortable with you. I like it. And your frame and
mindset are good: This was a lot of help, as far as my sticking points
are concerned. Thx!
>One of the things I like to say to a girl on the phone almost immediately is,
>(dropping my tone) "What are you wearing?"
That's funny. I always like to say, in that same tone, "Are you naked
right now?" immediately after a girl picks up. That's my version of hi
(if I know the girl has a sense of humor and is comfortable with me).
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 08 Feb 2002 12:35:00 GMT
subject: Re: FR: HBCheerleader9.5 + more success
Nice FR. You have the POTENTIAL to be a great PUA. But right now, you
are letting the HBs come to you. See comments below...
On Thu, 07 Feb 2002 23:53:00 -0500, Blue Seas wrote:
>START OF THE NIGHT: Drank some beers at a buddys house,

Too much beer drinking throughout this report. It dulls your skills.
If you're sarging, don't drink.
>went to the Redrock

>Hotel (A pub/club) to start the night off. The redrock was OK but I didn't
>think there were enough females, spent the first part of out time there
>drinking and getting some good EC with HB's, didn't bother approaching... I
>work at the Cott Hotel, saw some chicks that hit on me last week at work,
Here are the first of many chicks that hit on YOU... Yes, we all wish
we were this lucky, but you should in general take the initiative so
you can CHOOSE the HB yourself.
>blatant EC at me etc... Ignored them, concentrated on checking out other

chicks
>then my mates head of to the dance floor... I was still on my beer and stayed,
>gave the Cott chicks EC for the first real time: One comes up to me "My friend
>thinks your really hot"
>I laugh "really then why isn't she approaching me like you?"
>"she's shy, go talk to her"

>"Dude are we in primary school of something? No she can come here"
Nice!
>She comes
>over, BCott7.5... We fulff for a bit, I pay a lot of attention to her friend
>which wasn't as attractive as target, look at mates on dance floor.
>Her "You going to CLub Bayview after this?"
>"Yeah... Actually were gonna go now so I'll see you there OK?" I new she was
>interested, Flashed the carrot before her eyes with some flirting and fluff,
>then yanked it out of her eyesight and left with buddies... She was my backup
>if I couldn't do better at the club.
Just for practice for yourself, you should always #close. Especially
if you can get the cell #, ithen you REALLY have a backup plan for the
night.
>
>THE CLUB:
>Go in, drink some and hit the dance floor... It was weird, 1/2 of the floor
>were dudes but they all seemed to be dancing together on one side, all the
>chicks on the other WTF?! AFC's... Me and my mates moved in to dance on the
>female side :) Noticed HB 9.5CHeerleader on the way, noted she was fine and
>got EC but went and danced away from her (Neg?)...
Maybe, maybe not. It depends on whether you're avoiding because you're

nervous to approach or avoiding her because you really don't care
about just another pretty girl in a club.
>Then I see some Buddies at the edge of the dance floor and push through
>CHeerleaders groups (Her friends were also cheerleaders and damn fine too) to
>get to them. HBCheerleader was now facing me and only a meter or two away from
>me... Told my mates I thought she was pretty hot let her see me do this and
>keep EC...
You are breaking the 3 sec rule here, but obviously it didn't matter
in this case.
>Friends thought they were definately the hottest group in the club.
>Then leave these mates for some others who are buying a jug, go and drink some
>more...
Try going out and not drinking. Not even holding a beer in your hand.
It's all just a crutch.
>See a HB8 from Uni who I had seen around but never spoken to before,
>she introduced,were doing the same course next year ;) Then we hit the dance

>floor again...
>I spot HB 7.5-8Brunette, get blatant EC, she likes what she sees and
approaches
>"Me and my friend think your really sexy"
Man, where do you live? I'm moving here!
>"It's a standard compliment but i'll accept it" I say kidding around...
> Her jaw
>drops and i laugh and say "just kidding"...
Excellent!
>Leave their group and move more

>into the center of the dance floor. We get hot, go drink more beer and then
hit
>the dancefloor again.. I spot HB 7.5-8 Brunette, motion her over with my
>finger, she grins and comes... Now I know I have her, I motion with my finger
>on my lips and she kisses me on my cheeck... I motion again and she kisses on
>the other cheeck... I shake my head and firmly motion to my lips --> Tongue
>down for a bit and build some social proof...
Nice confidence and persistence: this worked because the whole time
you KNEW she wanted to kiss you. (or maybe you were just drunk, LOL)
>Not sure if HBcheerleader saw

>this or not. HBBrunnete tells me she loves me, I laugh and go and dance w/
>friends... Then HB Cheerleader hits the dance floor near me. I honestly do not
>remember how I approached but started with some holding hand/arm kino on the
>dance floor then I deliberately pulled away from her and moved further into
the
>dancefloor mtioning her to follow, If she did i knew i had her... She followed
>;) Used same kiss routine as HBBrunnette and get a kiss... Damn I hear all
>these dude cheering me and I wanted to like do a backflip and high five them
>all because this is the best chick I have ever got but I forced myself to stay
>calm and tongue down ;) Rest of the night we made out on the dance floor...
Nice dude. With this social proof you could now have ANYONE in the
club.
>Here are some negs I softened her up with until she was totally receptive and
>let me do whatever I wanted with her:
>She was tall, I am 6ft3 she was definately over 6ft so I say "Damn how tall
are
>you?"
>She says "I'm not that tall it's my shoes!" She takes off shoes I look down

>"Holy shit are those size 10's?" (classic mystery line) and she cracks up and
>gives kino
Good.
>She kept on playing and ruffling her hair so I imitate her then later I gave
>her a noogie, she cracked up again.
Good, too.
>I genuinely compliment her on a shell necklace she was wearing because I
>thought it was cool, she said it was from margaret river (an awesome surfing
>spot) and I say I love that place. SHe asks if I surf but I say no I bodyboard
>which is true, find out she surfs a bit... Get the rivalry going between the
>two sports and say that most surfers can only cut n slash on a wave,
>bodyboarders can spin, flip and do insanse shit surfers could only dream of.
>She says I am a busdriver and just ride the wave into shore I laugh and
imitate
>her surfing with arms pinwheeling etc... Get good laughs.
Good too, to get rapport and then express a differing opinion and
playfully debate it.
>Teased the shit out of her. I would constantly back away and make her follow
>me, I would turn my back on her (she would reciprocate w/ butt kino), go in
for
>a kiss then pull away at last minute, give her gum but i did this all in a
>joking manner and she loved every second of it.
Nice again. Punishment/reward, and she's chasing you.

>
>Later after a couple of hours of this (honestly not sure how long but seemed a
>long time) her friends come over and wanna go cause it's 3am. She tries to get
>them to stay longer but they refuse, so she asks if I have a mobile. I don't,
>nor did I come with a pen or pad (FUCK!) so I end up putting my number down on
>her mobile...
Yes, EVERY PUA I know has a pen and notepad on them at ALL times. You
must do the same, because you never know when you're going to meet
that special cheerleader. Also, when talking, find out the details:
who she came with, where she lives, etc., so that you can devise a
plan to extract her. In fact, if this was going on for hours, you
probably could have easily taken her to the car or somewhere.
>Then I fuck up again I think because she asks when to call and I
>instantly and firmly say tomorrow, then think about it and say saturday then

>thought about it again and said whenever(WtF?!)... Should have been firm with
>tomorrow, so I am not sure if I will see her again will report if do.
Yes, always good to make a plan on the spot. "Call me tomorrow and
we'll make plans to go to that ???? I told you about."
>Some random stuff I missed when I just proof read my post:

>She was called HB cheerleader because her and her groups of friends use to
>cheerlead, she also works as a bartender in an awesome club.
Now you know where to find her. Show up around closing time so that
you're not hanging out too long just waiting for her like a
supplicant.
>
>Stupid mistakes at the end, I just think I lost my concentration and was
pretty
>tired.
(or no longer drunk)
>
>By the end of the night she had her hand down my pants and was trying to get
me
>to strip on the dancle floor.
>
>KINO!!! Non stop and blatant, her resiprocating with at least as much as well.
>I'm not in the game for sex really,
This is a good frame. It actually achieves the opposite and gets you
more sex, whether you want it or not.
>If she calls I will probably start a

>relationship with her.
>
>Don't fuck up the close like I did.
>
>
Overall, these criticisms are minor. You are the man! Your kino and
cocky/funny/ teasing skills are great. If you can improve your game
and approaches, you will be a master at this.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"pimpstylez" <0>

Fri, 08 Feb 2002 16:04:00 GMT

subject: HB Cat - Chick logic experience
formhandle wrote:
Thanks formhandle!Missed to use the

negation technique, I was too surprised
by her chick logic I think.
But dinner is a good idea.
I just bumped into Hb cat today on my way
to the campus.Some short fluff and said:
"Ok, i have to go.See you on sunday!"
She:"Ok...but...can we change to Saturday?"
-some kind of shit test I think-
Me:"No, sorry, I got plans for Saturday already.
Would be difficult to cancel."
She gave me some bs about what important was happening
on Sunday, but then confirmed the meeting on Sunday.
I didn't tell her about the dinner so far.
I'll call her tomorrow anyway to tell her what
time we're going to meet.Maybe will surprise her,
just mentioning something like:"Be hungry on Sunday".
This time I'll use the negation routine to get over
her chick BS.
Results will be posted!
pimpstylez
RAFC on a mission
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 08 Feb 2002 21:11:00 GMT
subject: Re: Learning tonality
Actually, I asked about this a while ago, and someone emailed and
mentioned a guy named Jonathan Altfeld. He is an NLP trainer who has a
website and sells CDs on tonality. They look pretty powerful. I am
very tempted, but haven't ordered them myself. Has anyone here tried
them out?

On Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:20:00 -0500, martin_eriksson wrote:
>Hello,
>
>Patterns, as we all know are great. But, what about tonality when delivering
>patterns ? So far I haven't been able to find one single audio clip (wav/mp3)
>to help me with my tonality. I'm guessing there out there, I just can't find
>them.
>
>The best I've gotten so far is a transcript from Ross, which is good, but just
>not enough.
>
>This leads me to two questions:
>1. Where can I find (hopefully free) audio/video clips demonstrating tonality
>or in any way helping me with my voice ?
>
>2. Where can I find more information about creating a good tonality ?
>
>Thank you very much for you help !
>
> Martin
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 09 Feb 2002 13:46:00 GMT
subject: Lay Report: Internalization
Tonight started with a phone call from Sin, a PUA who uses a combo of
Mystery style and his own highly sexual sarging (not in a GM way, but
in a suggestive alpha body language way). We discussed how lately,
when we're not even trying or thinking about seduction, we're getting
a lot more attention from HBs. We decided that maybe, from having
learned and internalized a lot of this, we're just exuding something
sexual and more confident. For example, two nights ago, I got together
with a friend of an ex and her cousin. I ended up making out with both
of them (not together though, unfortunately) without even really
thinking about this stuff. So, with this all in mind, I went to meet
HBSlinky.
HBSlinky I hadn't seen at years. We had a summer job at the same place
way back when. And she was the hot HB that everyone who worked there

constantly hit on and tried to date. Back then, I was just a

supplicating LJBF to her.
When we got together tonight, I didn't have any expectations. But my

frame was this: I wasn't going to do routines and gimmicks and bits. I
was just going to exude sexuality. So when I picked her up, I went
into her bedroom and just hung out. I talked very quiet and slow, was
very laid back but at the same time mysterious, and just showed that I
was comfortable there. It's hard to explain, but I knew that I was in
already because I'd made a good first impression.
From here, we went to dinner with friends and then to a bar/lounge.

Here's what worked for me:
1. Social Proof: I called HBBreasts, who is very flirtatious with me,

to meet us at the lounge. THis way, HBSlinky could see me getting
attention and kino from someone else. Instantly, HBSlinky told me that
HBBreasts seemed to like me and kept asking if I liked her. THis
worked perfect, because HBSlinky now had to compete for me. Also,
HBSlinky thought the waitress liked me (a HB9.5), so I let her believe
it.
2. Fractionating: Instead of hanging on to HBSlinky all night as the

kino escalated (from brushing against each other to hands on each
other's knees to hand-holding to kissing), I would sometimes leave to
talk to another HB or a friend or just wander around the room. I think
this was important so that I didn't seem desperate or clinging, and
didn't bore her. When I left, she was excited to have me return.
3. This DIDN'T work, but as long as I had HBBreasts and HBSlinky

there, I thought I'd try to get them together. I told them how they
could be friends, had HBBreasts sit on HBSlinky's lap, and, after
HBBreasts pecked me on the cheek, I told her that HBSlinky probably
felt left out and she should kiss her too. She did. And then they
said, "Guys love it when girls kiss." I replied with the wrong answer,
I think, "Oh no, not me. I'd rather have you kissing me," I said.
Anyway, my skills weren't good enough to make a threesome happen.
Maybe next time with them, though.
When I left with HBSlinky, we had been making out a little. I tried to
tell her how nice it would be to wake up at my place, but it was too
far away and she said she wanted to do some stuff in the morning. In
the old days, I would have just taken this at face value. Instead,
here's what I did:
1. She was staying at a friend's father's house. I told her I was too

tipsy to drive and needed to sober up for a little while so that I

didn't get pulled over on the long drive home.
2. I put a time constraint on myself, which was important in making
her comfortable with me coming over. I asked her to tell me when 15
minutes had passed so that I could drive home, because I needed to be
up at 9 a.m. I told her to make sure I left then.
3. So we started making out, etc. I played a lot with the idea that
her friend's father was in the next room, and how we were like
naughtly little kids. I asked her about the time she lost her
virginity as a kid to link her to that state. When she said I should
probably head home, I asked her to lie against me for a little while.
Then I did a sexual value elicitation (courtesy of Adonis), which did
a lot to get her turned on.
4. We started again, and I felt LMR (last minute resistance) coming
on. I now try to anticipate these objections. I told her that this
felt really nice, but we should save something for next time, so that
we leave with anticipation and excitement. (This also obviously does
two other things: future pacing by assuming that we'll do it next
time, and letting her know that I'll see her again.)
5. I really thought I was going to leave without the f-close, because
I couldn't figure out a way to get to my condom, which was in my
jacket on the other side of the room, without completely ruining the
moment. So I discussed her sexual value elicitation and how nice it
would be to feel those feelings of complete togetherness and warmth.
Then I went into a variant of Riker's three rules. This was my first
time using them. "But, if we're going to do this, we have to promise
ourselves. three things. No, make that four things. The first is that
we have to be safe, and use a condom. That's very important to me. The
second is that has to be something that we both really want to do. The
third is that you have to be able to wake up in the morning and be
happy you did this, and feel good about yourself everytime you get
that tingly feeling during the day and think back on this night." Then
I added something like, "And the fourth is that, since your friend's
dad is in the other room, let's take this easy and slow, and just feel
what it's like to be inside each other. That's all. This way we'll
know what we have to look forward to next time, and some of that
awkward pressure will be removed."
5. And may Riker be blessed, because she very easily agreed to these
rules and we had a wonderful night that I would describe here if the
newsgroup was alt.sexstories.com. But it's not, so you'll have to use
your imagination.
Anyway, this is the lesson I learned: I used to believe that sarging

was knowing what patterns/routines/gimmicks to say/use and when. Now,
I realized that it's conveying an attitude. Learning and practicing
these ASF tactics verbatim helps you get comfortable enough with

yourself and with HBs so that you can adopt this attitude. And then,
the gimmicks and routines are just secondary, almost something to use
to keep the conversation lively and stimulating whenever it goes flat.
At least, that's what I believe tonight...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 09 Feb 2002 22:36:00 GMT
subject: Re: My first report.
On Sat, 09 Feb 2002 14:14:00 -0500, Jayzar77 wrote:
>My first post here guys. I've decided to start taking my first steps to
>becoming a PUA. I am a major AFC with a huge shyness problem, but i'm
starting
>to learn. I read a few articles from here and here is my first night out
since
>then. The report:
You're on your way. Congrats on starting. Read the manual, and see the
comments below...
>
>It was a pub crawl sponsored by some guys i never met. The ONLY person I knew
>was my 1 buddy, and like 3 bus loads of strangers. perfect cause it gave me
>motivation to meet people. At the first 2 pubs, I did not bad, gaining social
>proof with a few guys and we had a great time. I didn't talk to a single
>chick, I just wanted guy proof. Couple fuckups. While talking to one guy,
>this HB comes over, taps me on the shoulder, but it wasn't so she could talk
>with me. She instead looks over at her friends and says "This one??" I froze
>and couldn't think of a dam thing to say. And she walked off. No idea why
she
>did that, but I should have had some opener. any ideas?
What you need is not so much lines as the right attitude. Once you're
in the right attitude, you'll think of the right thing every time. So
get into that cocky, funny, interesting guy frame. When a girl comes
up and touches you and says "this one." Hey, don't be flattered.
That's rude. Tell her, but in a totally teasing voice, "Hey, I'm not a
piece of merchandise. You can't just pick me out like some puppy in
the window. I'm a man. Here, want to see?" (Okay, well maybe not those
last two sentences.) Anyway, the point is to always make the girl feel

like she's hiitting on YOU.
>Another was the HBs

>who came to talk with the other guys and I couldn't think of a way to break
>into the conversation. Specially since one said "stick out your tongue". (i
>just got a tongue ring) I did and she said "oooh, I find tongue rings very
>attractive" me being afc didn't try any kind of line, just afc supplicate.
>(thank you, glad you like it, shoot me now!) :(
I learned this one from Mystery. This is going to become your new
STANDARD line:
"I like other people who have things like this too, because they’re my
type. I like people who are a little wild. And you’re too tame for
me."
Then see if she qualifies herself. If she does, you're in. You can
add, if you want, "Do you have any tattooes or piercings?" And again,
see if she says she has them. If she doesn't and says she WANTS some,
you're in.
>The next place we went to was a dance hall, where I did my first and only
>approach of the night. My friend approached and I came up right after. They
>introduced themselves and my friend started talking to HBnosering (6.5) beside
>me. I couldn't break in since my girl was across the table from me. So I
>watched for a bit, my bud was C&B. Her friend HBstreaks (7.5, she's a
>hairdresser with NICE hair) was chuckling at this, so I walked over to her
side
>and said "Watching him is rather amusing isn't it?" She laughed, we started
>fluff talk. I was getting good kino from her, and the conversation was light
>and fun. I asked her if she was looking forward to valentines day, she goes
>nooo, worst holiday of the year. (perfect, she's single) ;) Here's where I
>go afc and say "oh you must be single then" ack. But we keep talking, I find
>out she broke up with her BF of 7 years about 5 months ago. So I try to
>pattern her and get some anchors. Do you miss having a BF, you must miss that
>feeling of being together, etc. I couldn't think of anything really trancing
>since it was first time I used something like that, but with more practice
>watch out.
>Buddy had C&Bed walked off by now, so I started talking to the other girl. we
>had a great chat cause she grew up like an hour away from where i did. it was
>also good cause I was getting rid of any possible interfearance from her later
>on, plus my first girl now had someone else viing for my attention. I then
>walked away saying I'm going to go "talk with more people, but I hope you will
>come find me later".
A little supplicating. You should have #closed. Always try to #close,

just for practice. Also, train your buddys to give you a time

constraint after you're talking for 10-15 minutes. This way, they can
come over and say, "we should go." And then you can either choose to
stay talking or use any of a variety of number closes, like, "Listen,
I have to spend some time with my friends right now. But I've really
enjoyed talking with you. What steps should we take to continue this
conversation at some future time?"
>At the last bar it was crazy, HB's everywhere. But by this time I was drunk
>and in an AFC state and scared to do any approaches.
Drink when you're hanging out with the boys. Don't drink when you're
sarging. Now you know...
>(gawd I gotta fix that!)

>However, HBstreaks found me and grabbed my hand and dragged me to the dance
>floor. Total kino and smiles, and we were grinding together. She was flaky
>though. She gave me lots of attention, and would then just give a BS excuse
>and dissapear. then 10min later, she would come back again and repeat. I'm
>sure she was shit-testing me, but in my drunken state I couldn't really think
>of any good ways to counter em. But I did alright, I didn't supplicate. One
>time after she came back, I was like "so you think you can walk away with an
>excuse like that do you, I think you better give me a kiss before i'll talk
>with you again." She smiled, kissed me on the cheek, then took off before I
>could say another word! ARGH!
That's good. The right mindset. Tease her harder, punish her more for
leaving, let her feel like she really might lose you. Sounds like a
flirt though, who just enjoys the attention and doesn't totally
deliver. Anyone here know of any good techniques to turn the tables on
a girl like this, and just take control physically?
>10min later I found her. I just walked up and said hi, looked her in the eye,
>took her drink and set it down, grabbed her hand and led her to the dance
>floor! Not a single bit of resistance. She did respond better to actions
than
>words with me, mostly since I always did have trouble saying the correct
stuff.
Nice. Good calibration, good confidence.
>At the end of the night we were dancing to slow songs and really kino each
>other. hands rubbing up and down, pressed right against each other, etc. I
>was waiting for her to give that "kiss me look" but never saw it. so no kiss
>close. I was thinking of doing mysetery's "do you want to kiss me" bit, but
>after the previous kiss I was worried she might fuck off on me again... She
>seemed physical, but I couldn't really get her sexual.. >(inexperience and not

>able to properly use words) but I said, "I want to call you, what's your phone
>number" She gave it to me. :) and I went home. Later on, I learned she
said
>she liked me from when a friend was talking to her, so this might be
promising.
Yes, she was playing her games. You need to get her to be playing
yours, and you actually did a good job a few times of flipping it
around. If you worry less about what she's thinking and worry less
about losing her, you'll do even better. I think you're starting to
get this stuff, to realize what you should and could be doing. Keep
posting field reports and letting us see your progress! And don't
forget to post your lay report after you call Flirtbabe here.
>
>To work on:
>-went into afc shy mode and didn't do near the approaches I wanted to. I'm
>going to try the go to mall and talk to every girl thing.
>-need to practice talking!!! been afc for so long my communication skills are
>pathetic.
>-MUST learn some basic patterns, lines, etc. many oportunities where I could
>have said something, but had nothing ready.
>-any others?
Not drinking
Playful confident attitude
Not being in the frame of "begging" girls to come find you later or
give you their number, and "hoping" they will.
More approaches
>
>Did right:
>-Established social proof very early on with the guys. So I always was able
to
>walk around and talk someone up.
>-with HBstreaks I talked to her friend and made competition for her.
>-with her again I was alpha for some things I did and it paid off with a
>#close.
Yes, confidence and telling her what to do worked nicely in this last
case. I bet you could have even pushed it more, like the cheerleader
FR here (where he didn't let her get away with a cheek kiss and kept
pointing to his lips until, the third time, she did it). You're
getting there...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>

Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:23:00 GMT

subject: Re: Lay Report: Internalization
On Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:23:00 -0500, NewToTheGame wrote:
>Man,
>
>I am amazed at:
>
>1. How much knowledge you have.
>
>2. Not only that but you are able to jungle w/ the different styles.
>3. That PU had an A+ preparation ( very good planning skills/not 'going

>adrift'-AFC style).
>
>4. Your attitude is of a dominant,hard to get male.
>
>5. You knew how to close. A lot of guys , including me(RAFC)
>a lot of times get some positive results at a good level but are unable to
>properly close and fail.
>
>I think you are very close to 'the other side of the bridge'- being a PUA(if
>you do not consider yourself one.).
>
>And also I would like some practical advice from you on how you got on the
>other side of the bridge posted so guys like me (AFC&RAFC) can benefit from
it.
>
>Also: How long (how much practice) did it take you to leave the AFC
>brotherhood?(I know it's a typical AFC question but I am just curious:O).
>
Thanks, man. These are all huge compliments. I still have a lot to
learn, but I can feel my game falling into place piece by piece. I
think the challenge is not just in having that knowledge, but in
learning how to implement it. It's also in not taking anything said
here as solid fact: use what works, discard what doesn't, and know
that just because something works in one situation, it might not be
effective in another. For example, I tried to use Riker's three rules
again yesterday with a different HB, and they almost backfired on me.
Almost :)
I guess the things that helped me to learn this were:

A. Getting in the field and practicing.

B. Sarging with people like RJ, Mystery, Sin, Adonis, Swinggcat, etc.
I could watch their game and learn and model; and we could watch each
other work and give each other detailed feedback.
The truth is that I read this stuff for a few months and tried to
implement it without fully understanding the attitude and context
behind it. Mystery's workshop was the experience that kicked me into
high gear, simply because seeing these techniques is a lot more useful
than reading about them. In two months after that (and with constant
exchanges of ideas with Swinggcat and Adonis), I felt pretty good in
the field. Then I hit another sticking point, and was stuck there for
a month. Now, I just sat in on a couple days of Ross's seminar, and
that seems to have gotten me past that sticking point.
I hung out with an ASF'er recently. And he knows every line and is
fearless about walkups. But this stuff isn't working for him because
he is a virgin and doesn't truly believe that he can get laid. So the
key, I think now, is working on your own internal state so that you
come across as confident and aren't afraid to be interesting. (Mystery
says this can be accomplished through experience, Ross says this can
be helped with NLP and hypnotism.) ***It's going out there not with
the frame of "trying to get an HB to sleep with you," but KNOWING that
she wants to sleep with you.*** And, from there, it is like a video
game. There will be certain challenges and obstacles on your path, and
you have to know how to navigate around them.
So, my advice, for what it's worth, is this. If you haven't already
done so, write out a list of the phases in your PU (openers, gimmicks,
challenges, creating rapport and chemistry, #closing, *closing, etc.).
Make sure you have some sort of plan for each stage, and write out
your differenet options. Then go out in the field and work on one
piece at a time. Try not to go out with your same old friends (who
anchor you to your AFC state and who you aren't comfortable
experimenting around); try to find a wing online. Once you have
openers down, work on continuing the conversation and demonstrating
value. Once you have that down, work on creating an emotional
connection and #closing. And know that once you get this down, you'll
find that you won't need notes or steps, because you'll have
internalized it all.
I'm still working on my game, though, because it's fun getting better
at this. It's helped in the non-sarging world too. My current
challenge: learning to be DIRECT and GUTSY (in the right situations).
Out of curiosity, what are your sticking points right now?

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 11 Feb 2002 19:27:00 GMT
>>5. You knew how to close. A lot of guys , including me(RAFC)

>>a lot of times get some positive results at a good level but are unable to
>>properly close and fail.
P.S. If you're having trouble here, it usually means that you're doing
something wrong or missing something BEFORE the close. Let's discuss
it here...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Feb 2002 09:43:00 GMT
On Tue, 12 Feb 2002 12:06:00 -0500, Jayzar77 wrote:
>Just gave her a call today. It was light and friendly. Mostly total fluff.
I
>tried to get some values and stuff, but was outta my league. We talked about
>work and she said that she works mon tues thur fri. I said great, we can do
>something tomorrow since we both don't have to be up on wed. (I’m a cook and
>work nights) she gave me a shit test here saying that she still had to be
>awake to see family and stuff on Wednesday, but could we go out this weekend.
>I said sorry, tomorrow is the only time i can spare out of my schedule, so i
>hope you can make it. pause... so she says ok
Nice! See, you set the rules! Well done...
>then, but as long as it's light

>like a movie or something. :) boom, we have a date!!!
Don't take her to a movie, and don't take her on a "date." You should
be just "hanging out" to see if she meets your standards for someone
you'd even consider taking on a date. And, of course, you only date
girls you're already sleeping with, who deserve the rewards and
privileges of dating you. But you know that already...

>I did well on the phone for filling in the voids and talking, kept it short
>with not too much fluff. but couldn't really establish a good bond. it felt
>more like talking to a friend than building this amazing potential with her.
>but hey, the phone was mostly to make the date, so it's all good. I’ll study
>up tonight on date stuff posted by you guys and give you guys the report of
how
>it went tomorrow.
Listen, don't forget that SHE pursued you in the club. And SHE
rearranged her plans to be with you. You are already IN. Now, plan
before you go. Let's say that you're already committed to a movie.
Here's what you do. Meet her somewhere near where you live for coffee
or a snack or whatever. There, work on rapport, humor, interesting
gimmick (graphology, cube, whatever). Maybe even stop mid-gimmick and
suddenly realize that you left your wallet or the movie times or
whatever at your house. Have her pay for coffee or snack. Stop home to
get them. Sit down with her, continue gimmick. As you continue with
handwriting analysis or whatever, hold your hands out (palms up). Say
"give me your hands." You should, by now, be slowing down your
speaking and phase-shifting.
If she asks "why" when you take her hands say, "This is subtext,
we're not supposed to talk about it." (Mystery line.) Notice: Does she
give you her hands easily? Does she squeeze you back? If there's
resistance, punish (by withdrawing your attention) and try again in a
little while. If the IOIs are positive, go into the "Would you like to
kiss me" close. Make sure you do all this with complete confidence.
Another fun thing to do is to get her amped up and wanting to get

kissed, and then fractionating by going to the bathroom or something.
Get her aroused, and then back off. Until she's going crazy for you.
(After all, this is what she did to you in the club, if I remember
correctly.)
I'm exhausted tonight, so I hope some of this helps. Let us know what
happens.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Feb 2002 09:48:00 GMT
Also, dude, don't forget to give her the tongue ring challenge: You

got that tongue ring because it's a shit test. It weeds out the lame
people, the one's who aren't open to adventure and excitement and
trying new things. And, you know what, maybe SHE is a little too tame
and unadventerous for you. You like wild girls.
Don't let her toy with you this time: Make her prove herself to YOU.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Feb 2002 10:09:00 GMT
On Mon, 11 Feb 2002 23:17:00 -0500, NewToTheGame wrote:
>Before I move to my stuff, I just wanted to ask you how you were able to get
so
>close to those PUA-s and actually watch them in the field?(just out of
>curiosity)
Because I'm cool and fun to hang out with.
And also, because I asked questions and really wanted to improve, like
you do. (Oh, and paying my hard-earned $$ for a Mystery class didn't
hurt either.)
>I went to that bar. There were 2 HB8-s. My mates were getting drunk and were
>looking at them saying to me:"C'mon, man, look at those chicks.They are
>alone.". I approach them but do not use the 3s. Instead I first chatted w/ my
>friends for a few minutes letting the chicks notice my presence and then
>strike(while one of them was out):
>
>"Are you having a good time?"
>-"yeah,.."blah,blah....
>Did some fluff.
Weak opener. You have to come in strong with a good opener that
captures their attention. Look through the manual and the forums. Use
your newly created PU file to write down some original stories and
openers to capture their attention, and not be just another guy
working up the courage to talk to a girl.
>When the other came she just smiled wittily. I asserted:

>

>"Hi, I was having a little nice talk w/ your friend."

>
>Now, she was eager to talk w/ me (jealous?).I use kino, even neghits and
>everything was going fine. But I remembered that if I was to talk only to one
>of them the other would CB. When I started talking to the other girl, the left
>one said:
>
>"I think I got drunk and I need to go..."
>Me:"I did not scare you, did I?"
>"Oh. No,no,no....we'll be back'(bullshit).
Yes, you failed to interest them enough and get enough rapport. That
seems to be your first sticking point to work on. Goal number one for
New to the Game: Demonstrate value!
>On this past Sat I went out on my own cos my friend were out of town. I went
to
>this bar full of AFC that were being desperate and were trying to pick up
every
>chick(of course unsuccessfully).
>I decided to take a different approach. I was playing bored and hard to get
not
>talking to any girl for like 11/2 hours. I even sat next to 2 HB9 and did not
>say a word leaving them wondering and becoming self-conscious.
From here above is all in your imagination. You play hard to get not
by ignoring girls altogether. You play hard to get by ignoring your
target, but making other girls around her laugh and express
fascination in you.
>Then in half
>hour I decided it was time. I first started off very friendly and smiling with
>a HB9 :
>[at the bar]
>
>(she was fighting to reach the bar tender)
>Me;What do you want to order?
>Her:Jim Beam and coke.
>
>complimented her on the nice earrings and ring(hoping to get into the necklace
>pattern) but even she seemed very nice and sweet to me she blurted out of the
>blue:
Yes, again, you're fluffing. Not coming on strong with interesting

stuff. This is stuff any guy could say, not a SPECIAL guy. Read
romance novels: the hero sweeps her off her feet and doesn't give her

time to think. He doesn't say "what do you want to order? Nice

earrings. Nice ring, too."
>
>"I went on a honeymoon to Tahiti..."(I think straight-up bullshit for she did
>not have a marriage ring..")
>
>Then I tried to start up a convo w/ about 2-3 HB but did not get any positive
>response until a HB9 came to me and asked me for a cigarette.I said I got mine
>from another chick but she almost 'begged' to go and get one for her so I went
>to the other chick and told her something like:
This is a great IOI from her. But your response is a little

supplicating. If she asks for a cigarette, say "Convince me." Then,
after she's convinced you, tell her that you don't smoke. She laughs,
you laugh. Then point to the girl who's smoking and say, "Ask her. And
get one for me while you're at it." When she brings you a cig, just
look at it and say, "Didn't I tell you I don't smoke? Wow, you sure
have a bad memory. I bet you don't even remember meeting me that one
night, on the Charles Bridge in Prague. I looked in your eyes and you
looked in mine, and we felt that attraction flare up inside like a
forest fire...etc...etc...Wait? What? You've never been to Prague?
Isn't your name Stelinka?"
>"This time I really need to know what you are drinking so I can buy you
>one(just bullshitting her) because my friend need a cigarette."So, this si how
>I got her a cigarette but I noticed she was in a big company of men but when I
>handed her the cig she seem charmed and I smiled widely to her. Then I felt
she
>was instantly drawn to me and we started a convo(I lied I was from Greece and
>started shifting into patterns but there were 2 male CB that just could not
>leave her alone...). I later heard her telling her friend(pointing at me):
>
>"He is very good...".
>
>But could not close w/ that girl because of her big group of CB friends and of
>course bc of my own lack of inventiveness.///Oh, how bad it is to feel you can
>have a HB and not to be able to.
Yes, you must always befriend the guys! Talk to them about any old
shit. They don't care. As long as they feel included, then their pride
won't be hurt when the girl gives you her phone number.
>
>Another thing:I think my fear to approach a minute. I can not gain good
rapport
>though.
>

>That's it-I hope I was in detail enough. I will wait for your response.
>
So, you're doing better than alot of people. You're approaching. Now:
1. More original openers.
2. Less fluff. Avoid this by transitioning quickly into deeper
questions.
3. Demonstrate value: maybe find a gimmick of some sort.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"pimpstylez" <0>
Wed, 13 Feb 2002 20:49:00 GMT
subject: HB Cat third date and layreport!
Last Sunday it was my third date with HB cat and

this time it's a layreport!
Here's what happened:

I called Hb cat Saturday to tell her I'll
pick her up with my car on Sunday afternoon.
I first wanted to cook her dinner at my place,
but then decided to take everything a little
bit further to make it a sure lay.
I wanted to take her to the botanic garden in the
afternoon cause she mentioned to love exotic plants.
After that I prepared some asia food at my place we would
cook together.
Sunday afternoon I picked her up and kept my plans
secret.She was very curious but I didn't tell her anything.
Finally we reached the botanic garden and it all turned out
great.
She has never been there before and when I mentioned I had the idea because she
told me about her love for exotic plants she hugged me and said that this was
so cute.
We spend two hours in the park and I got a lot of kino by her all the time.
When we reached my home in the evening we were both in a funny and relaxed
mood.We cooked the asia food I bought together and she loved that too.
After dinner was finished we sat on my couch with a glass of wine.
Got some smooth music and soft lights and started to kino her body.
No signs of chick bs this time.Kinoed her face and hair and went for the
kiss.This time she reacted positive and there was no resistance at all.A lot of
tongue kissing followed and we started to make out on
my couch.We moved to my bed and the rest is history.

Maybe I put more effort in this chick then necessary but I wanted to make
it turn out right this time.And it worked!
I drove her home after fucking and she told me again how great this day was
for her.She's really hot and I want to get some more lays out of this.
I think that's no problem now but I still got something on my mind and
maybe somebody can give me some advice with this.
She's a very passive chick and it took some time to get her horny enough
to fuck.So what can I do to get her acting more sexual next time and get her
horny faster?
--thought about giving her more alcohol to drink next time ;-)--
That was a fucking great feeling to lay this HB and all because of ASF(thanks
again to formhandle for the help).
Next time I know what to do to move things faster but it's a layreport and
that's all that counts in the end.
pimpstylez
RAFC on a mission
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 18 Feb 2002 22:07:00 GMT
subject: Re: interesting close failure
You did this well. Nice teasing, and she called you back. I hate to do
a takeaway, but I will. There's a great story that I use that you
could have told here. I'll post it when I have more time. It's golden:
to be added to the permanent seduction files. It not only works in
this situation, but last week I sat on the floor of my living room and
told the story to an HB on our FIRST time hanging out. That night,
after we slept together, I asked her when she first wanted to kiss me,
and she said it was when I was telling the story. I adapted it from a
short story by the Japanese writer Haruki Murakami. I PROMISE to post
it here soon, unless you all already know it.
Also, I want to dispute a certain ASF tenet. And that is, whenever she
won't give you her number, the advice here is to say something along
the lines of, "I don't give out my number to girls, because to you
it's just another number and you won't use it" or whatever. And, here,
you said that you don't give out your number to girls who won't give
you theirs. These responses (especially the standard ASF response)
both sound a little supplicating to me. The problem is that the ASF

response ASSUMES that she won't call you and your response, while
funny, is also babyish (though I still like it). My response is to
steal their frame: "That's funny, I don't give out my numbers to girls
either. My phone rings enough as it is." (Sometimes I'll make up a
story about a girl who called me or drove me crazy or whatever her
fear seems to be, to show that I understand.) Then, because I've
already seeded the conversation with a SOLID PLAN, I'll say, "This is
going to make it awfully hard to go to the XXX." Then we'll both agree
to break our rules just this once, and I'll have totally stolen her
frame by this time and say when I hand it to her, "Don't go crazy with
this now and force me to block your number."
While I say this, I'm humorous, conveying the things she liked about
me. I'm not being angry or upset or argumentative or persistent. This
only didn't work twice. However, one of those times, the HB actually
GOT my number from a mutual friend, called me the next day, apologized
for not giving me her number, and then left it on the machine. :)
CPowles
On Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:28:00 -0500, strange_attractor wrote:
>Last night I definitely wasn't in my best frame (too tired to properly work
>a convo, in spite of my attempts to caffeinate myself)--but I figured I
>might as well try things for the heck of it. (I was at a singles-only
>party, I couldn't pass up the opportunity to practice.) Anyway, when I went
>to close one of the women that I had been talking to, I ran into trouble.
>
>Me: "Let's get together sometime."
>Her: (smiles) "OK"
>Me: (starting to write down her name)
>Her: "Why don't you give my your information instead."
>Me: "OK, why don't we trade?"
>Her: "Actually, I have a new policy this week, I've decided not to give my
>information out anymore."
>Me: "OK then, I guess I'll see you around..." (starts to walk away)
>Her: (grabbing my arm, pulling me back) "You shouldn't be so pessimistic,
>trust me..."
>Me: "Why, are you going to let me break your new policy?" (I know, bad
>frame)
>Her: "No, but just give me your information."
>Me: "Sorry, I've had a policy for a long time that I don't give out my
>information to someone who won't tell me theirs. Maybe I'll run into you
>again sometime." (which isn't completely unrealistic given our social
>circles)
>Her: (smiling) "OK, I like serendipity."

>
>I figure things ended OK, and if I do run into her again, I'll be in a
>better position because of this, but it was amusing nonetheless. Any ideas
>on what I should've said when she pulled me back?
>
>Damn, I need to start getting more sleep...
>
>--SA
>
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 18 Feb 2002 22:28:00 GMT
subject: Re: From LJBF to LJBFB (Lets Just Be Fuck Buddies)
On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 13:40:00 -0500, Wintermute wrote:
>My advice is not to.

>
>It's way easier to pick up a new chick than it is to convert an LJBF.
>The reason there is no documentation on it is because no one ever
>bothers because it's just not worth the effort. I know that's not what
>you want to hear but the success ratios are much more in your favor to
>sarge a new chick.
I agree with this. But a funny thing has been happening lately. In my
AFC days, I befriended a lot of girls but never closed them. Now,
however, in my new state and with all this knowledge, I've been
finally closing some of them. And what's worked is simply this: NOT
seeing them for a while. Just losing contact for a few months. And
then, either THEY will call or I will call them. Then, as soon as we
meet up again, I almost treat it like a first "date" with someone I
just #closed. Also, when I see them, I put off a very sexual vibe (not
aggressive, but more alluring and slightly suggestive). Or I may bring
along a second HB, who DOES see me sexually, so that they can see what
they're missing.
I don't know if this makes sense, but TAKE A BREAK from them. When
they see you again, show them the NEW YOU. Make them think about you
in ways they never thought of you before.
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 22 Feb 2002 10:53:00 GMT
subject: The Window
Mystery says that when you're sarging a girl, a window opens up. It
lasts, say, 5-20 minutes. And if you don't make your move inside that
window, it's over. You're done. Game over.
I say that, yes, the window can close. But it's just a state, and at
some future point you can get her back in that state.
Anyway, with that debate in mind, here's my question:
At dinner, I met a great HB9 (a super-thin exotic beauty, a mix of

Latin and Jewish). Sitting next to her during the meal, I totally
opened the window. What opened it for me was a new spin on EV'ing that
I'm doing, which is to find her core value and then point out how,
right then and there, she's feeling that core value with me.
Anyway, the window opened, and I knew right there that I could have
her. BUT, we were at a table with a bunch of people. I fractionated
and talked with the HB on my other side for a while. Then I returned
my attention to her. However, the meal was so long that after a while
I felt that incredible connection we made start to fade. (Or maybe I
just got tired.)
So, what do you do when the window opens and you're not in a place
where you can go for a *close?
Once it closes, I often feel like things sometimes get awkward. What
do you do AFTER the window closes to maintain and affirm the
connection and excitement you had, so that it doesn't feel like a
letdown--like it was just a moment that passed?
If this makes sense, please comment!
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 22 Feb 2002 18:10:00 GMT
subject: Re: unstimluating sex.... (raverDJ + HBpetiteHottie)

RaverDJ,
I haven't read this whole thread, but two things come to mind:
1. You can't MAKE a woman orgasm or feel good. She has to ALLOW
herself to orgasm or feel good. (This isn't an NLP turn of
phrase--it's repeated in Tantra, sexual psychology, everything.) So
the more pressure you apply on her to enjoy sex, the more she's going
to get tense and enjoy it less.
And, this is MOST IMPORTANT:
2. Role play! She seems like the kind that likes to please. Tell her
you want to role play. Spin up a good fantasy scenario (I'm sure
you're creative here), and have her play a role that would be
associated with a female who voraciously enjoys sex. This way you
can't lose: either she lets go of herself and gets so into the role
that she actually enjoys it, or she is just more involved, responsive,
and loud, and it's more fun for you!
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:28:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Window
> You need to learn how to ANCHOR the responses. That way, you can "open the
>window" any time you want to and slide on through.
Okay, I understand anchoring. But maybe I don't use it to its full

potential. As I understand it, when she's "in state," I'd do something
like slide my hand down her bicep or whatever. Then, sometime later, I
repeat that touch/gesture and, bam, she's right back in state. But,
even if this is effective, she's back in state for a second at most,
no? How would you then use this to your advantage in this scenario?
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:38:00 GMT

>Share with us CPowles...explain how you're doing this

>new EV'ing......sounds like a great technique...
>
Sure, it's a little long, so I started a new thread for it below.
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:45:00 GMT
subject: The Way I EV
In response to five683, here's the new way I'm EV'ing these days. I'm
not sure if it's the way it's supposed to be done or even if it's new
at all, but it REALLY works.
Here's a script from last night. And there's a question at the end, so
please read on:
HB: I want to produce.

Me: But that's not what you really want to do. That's just one of many
things that will give you the end goal you're looking for.
HB: What do you mean?
Me: Well, what is it about producing, as opposed to directing or
acting that appeals to you.
HB: I like getting things done.
Me: Yes, you like to get things done. But you don't want it to get
done in the business world. There's something about film that attracts
you more.
HB: Yes, because it's creative.
Me: Ah, now we're getting somewhere. Because it's creative. Now, let
me ask you something. If you produced this amazing film, and got it
all done completely by yourself. And it took a lot of work, but you
did it and now you were standing on a stage at Sundance accepting an
award for it, how would you feel?
HB: Accomplished.
Me: So that's it. That's what you're really after: a sense of
accomplishment.[She lights up here and gets almost red.] Now, let me
ask you something else: you can be totally honest. Is this a sense of
accomplishment that comes from yourself and having done it yourself.
Or is it a sense of accomplishment in the sense of having others see
what you've done and approve of it.

HB: I guess it's from others.

Me: That's fine. That kind of accomplishment is really what you're
after. Isn't this great: in just a couple minutes, we already got
something done together.
HB: Yeah (now big grin and red).
Me: And don't you feel a sense of accomplishment now.
HB: Yeah, I do. (totally red and big smile now.)
And, by the way, I don't say this in a sneaky way. I'm flirting and
teasing, and we're both in on the joke and what I'm doing. (And what's
awesome is, when you're done, you can have her ask you these things.
Pretend like you've never thought about it for yourself. And as she
asks you these questions to find you're core value, they're a perfect
opportunity to go into connection patterns and mirror what she would
want in a guy.)
I also tried this a few nights ago, with someone whose core value was
fun. I just said, "Yes, and we're having fun right now. Look at you:
your face is flushed and you're laughing. Isn't THIS what life is all
about?"
It's awesome, because it works amazingly well. Now, here's my

question: once you've done this and shared this amazing moment
together and she's laughing/flushed, what do you do NEXT. How can I
transition this into a *close?
Ideas?
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Feb 2002 16:58:00 GMT
subject: Re: Older woman and group problem...
On Sat, 23 Feb 2002 10:27:00 -0500, :GREG: wrote:
>Tonight I'm going to a diner with the girl I want to fuck....

>She's doing the diner and there's about 15 people I don't know who'll come.
>
>I'm 19 she's 28.
>
>My question is, how can I take her apart (hard because she's the one who
>invite everyone at her house). What can I do not to feel like a dumb in so
>much strangers I really don't know ? Some social integration tips ?

Warning: Don't TRY to be smart or TRY not to be dumb or TRY to prove

yourself. That will always fuck someone up. You have to let go of
these worries altogether. If you want, you can even ACCENTUATE being
young and dumb. Play it up! Pretend like you're her professional boy
toy. You're her young stud. Every woman, esp at 28, loves the idea of
having a cute, doe-eyed boy toy. You don't NEED to be smart to get
laid here; you just need to be CONFIDENT and SEDUCTIVE in this
situation. So, remember, they're ALL jealous of YOUR youth. They WISH
they could still be 19.; Tell them how much fun it is to be 19 and
young and frisky and free of responsibilities and free of the
complications that society drags people down with. If you're not
connecting with someone, it's not because you're not old enough, it's
because THEY forgot what it was like to be young or lost touch with
the younger generation. Our culture has a Peter Pan complex, so YOU
are the prize at this party.
School's out. Go get em!
(A bonus idea: Maybe stay after to help her clean. Then, when everyone
leaves, tell her that you want to tell her a secret. "I don't clean."
Then kiss her. And file a field report here, bro!)
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Feb 2002 06:01:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Way I EV
On Sat, 23 Feb 2002 10:55:00 -0500, finalD wrote:
>So, presumably, the concept of accmplishment, in this portion of the

>script, could be modified for ANY ends-value she reveals. So, if the whole
>thing had led to her deciding she liked "excitement," for example, then you
>would have said, "Isn't this great: in just a couple minutes, we already
>have done something exciting together." Right? I mean, or am I missing the
>point here?
Yes, exactly.
>Anyway, to give a brief stab at using that for a close -- the LOGISTICS of
>the situ. (my personal pet difficulty). Move the language on to how great

>YOU are in context with her. "See, we are really clicking together" "Isn't
>that a wonderful feeling, to know that someone understands you and your
>quest for accomplishment" "I don't usually get this close to women, but
>we've been able to" pump up your own status. I dunno. Sounds too much like
>you're TELLING her how great you are. Maybe you need to do something else.
Yeah, this all makes sense, but it doesn't ESCALATE it towards the
*close. I think that you, myself, Sandworm, and Forix are all zero-ing
on the same thing here. It's to take this to the NEXT level. It's the
idea of: "Wow, we both feel this way with each other right now. What
are we going to do about it?"
Specialist, I see what you're saying. But, maybe it's just my own
self-limiting belief, but just going for it here or using Mystery's
"would you like to kiss me" might be too much too soon here. I'm
willing to field test just moving in--saying "come here" and making
out. But I still think there's a small step, a small line of dialog
missing. And it may just be as much as saying, "So how do you feel
right now...Great?...I know a way to make you feel even better and
more [VALUE]...come here..." Or maybe going into a pattern that
combines what some of Forix's SS stuff here with Mystery's "don't
think, just feel" pattern?
Any further thoughts or a solution? I've got a big week coming up and
will be in the field a lot, so I'm ready to test anything...
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Feb 2002 06:19:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Way I EV
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002 23:44:00 -0500, Forix wrote:
>Your EV method is great! You don't mind if I start using it, do you? =)
>
Of course it's cool if you use it. That's why I share it here. But,
just post a field report. Let us know how it works for you, and if you
figure out ways to improve it by using it in the field.
See the post below for response to the rest of your message...
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Feb 2002 06:21:00 GMT
subject: Juggler ?'s
Juggler,
The ideas you post here are great and original, and I've incorporated
a lot of it into my game (from the ancient-indian-burial-ground opener
to the girlfriend test). It's really great to have you in this NG. But
two things:
1. What are your sticking points? You offer a lot of great advice, but
from what I can tell ask for little. I'm assuming that you must have
sticking points or parts of your game that can be improved.
2. I'd love to see a field report from you. I'd like to read how your
posts, ideas, lines, favor-swapping, etc. work on a night out for you.
Thanks, man...
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 25 Feb 2002 21:57:00 GMT
subject: Re: Juggler ?'s
On Mon, 25 Feb 2002 10:37:00 -0500, juggler wrote:

>
>On a personal level I would really like to get together and go sarging. Are
you
>in California? I am going to be in the San Francisco area March 14-17.
Dude, by some crazy twist of fate, I'm going to be in San Fran from
March 7 on. I'm going to be in a situation that makes sarging hard,
but I'll figure it out. Email me at: CPowles100@hotmail.com.
>If I have any sticking points it is maybe with managing girlfriends,

organizing
>my time and so on. I am a pretty busy guy. I perform two separate shows and am
>hosting a new weekly variety show starting soon.

Yes, this IS the problem. Juggling to me is not just the performing

art, it's trying to manage your time, your MLTRs, all your phone #
closes, and still have time for yourself and reading and learning and
exercising and getting better at your OTHER crafts etc. etc. I'm
losing a bunch of HBs I've sarged lately just because I don't have
time to call back or hang out. (Of course, this sometimes works in our
favor because then we automatically become prizes they have to work
for, we clearly have ambition and work ethic, and avoid the trap of
being too desperate.)
>Posting to fast-seduction is like my hobby. A time to relax. You might say

>another sticking point is dealing with people who keep asking me how I can
>relate to my 18 year old girlfriend. I'm 33. Or how does it feel to be
sleeping
>with a married chick. Or a girl who is a witch. I get tired of answering the
>same questions.
Not a bad sticking point.
>
>But having said that, I am posting a field report on my Friday night out. for
>the heck of it. Check out the Field Reports section.
>
The FR is amazing: adds a lot of context to your posts. I like those

nights, where you go home dizzy from a circus of female attention. And
it's always up to YOU to get it started. You can stand around like an
AFC (we all have those nights), or you can initiate and escalate the
action, like you did, and pretty soon you're on automatic PU pilot.
Definitely looking forward to more, in the lounge or here!
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 26 Feb 2002 18:35:00 GMT
subject: Re: Favorite Bitch Shield
On Tue, 26 Feb 2002 10:42:00 -0500, Minotaurus007 wrote:
>A girl friend of mine told me what she preferred to say when some AFC
>was annoying her.
>
> - "You're playing in the wrong league, baby!"
>

Guys,
EMULATE this behavoir. Put up your own joke bitch-shield. Next time
you're in a sparring match, use THIS line. I'm going to use it
tonight. It rocks.
As a zen master once said, "BE the HB10."
P.S. With lines like this, I usually call them on their bluff. Rather
than a witty comeback, just laugh and break her state. Say, "I like
that. Insecure women bore me." Then either demonstrate value fast, or
neg or give her the "lonely being beautiful/talented" speech. I don't
use the exact wording that follows, but it combines a few things:.
"You remind me of my sister. She looked a lot like you and had that
same attitude when she went out because guys were always coming on to
her. But inside she was so insecure, and I came to realize that
excessive confidence is just like shyness. They're just different
responses to that same gnawing voice deep inside that's always telling
you you're inadequate. I mean, not you specifically; we all have that
voice inside." Then you can go into cube, handwriting, EV,
eye-accessing cues, whatever. As Ross J says, this is an opportunity
to demonstrate authority over her world.
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 26 Feb 2002 18:41:00 GMT
On Mon, 25 Feb 2002 17:54:00 -0500, lovedrop wrote:

>I thought you were studying SS lately...? Doesn't the course material cover
>anchoring?
Yes, but reading about anchoring is different than learning it. And
learning it is different than understanding it. And understanding it
is different than being able to apply it. And, Lovedrop, I TOTALLY
agree with what you're saying. It's almost a WASTE to get these states
going on if you CAN'T anchor them and use them. So, obviously it's
really something I want to figure out and add to the PU arsenal. I
know what it is and can do it, but not, in my opinion, effectively
yet. As far as anchoring skills go, I'm like the guy who thinks a HB's
end value is belly-dancing. There's a vital step I'm missing as far as
learning how to plant and trigger it effectively.

But this advice is great. Thanks...
>
>The state induced by an anchor isn't a magic spell that "wears
>off"...rather, it lasts until her state shifts again...perhaps from another
>anchor or from her thinking about something that reminds her of a
>feeling...or from something else you say, etc. However long it DOES last
>will probably be much longer than a second. Furthermore, you can continue
>to fire it over and over again...especially if it is not a kinesthetic
>anchor. Also, with good anchoring skills you should be able to ramp it up
>higher and higher...
>
>If you have anchored different states on her, you can use them at different
>times or combine them.
>
>States such as that feeling of connection, attraction, lust, intrigue, that
>feeling of certainty (eliminate hesitation), that feeling of "this is so
>right"...anchor certain internal dialogue A.K.A. her "woman's intiution"...
>
>If you spend a lot of time and effort installing states, using routines and
>patterns, etc, why not set anchors and reduce the amount of work you do in
>the future to get her back in state?
>
>o===3
>
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 01 Mar 2002 03:25:00 GMT
subject: Dictated success --> failure FR
Okay, this FR is going to be dictated to me, because it totally shows

my sticking point:
Tonight, I was with a solid HB9 that I'm really into. She's got long
black hair, about three inches taller than me, and a beautiful body.
Honestly, she looks so much like a model that I almost feel out of my
league (and herein may be the problem) and I'm so thankful that she's
into me that I almost get afraid to blow it.
Anyway, she has a boyfriend who she's been seeing for a while. But,
he's away for six weeks, and she KNOWS that, though she loves him,

he's not the guy she wants to marry. She also says that she could
never be unfaithful and would have to be broken up before she did
anything with someone else, but Mystery says this is just anti-slut
defense. Anyway, on to the dictation, from Mystery. I'm glad someone
else was here to watch it:
"You pick her up the very next day, go to lunch (split the tab), and
then she goes over to your place immediately, dude. [IOI #1] (Oh, and
before you go to look at an apartment-for-rent and pretend like
you're a couple -- IOI #2.) Dude, she's playing with your shoe and
leaning over to touch your knee (IOI #4 and 5). When I came out of the
shower, and noticed her sitting in the corner, I noticed: there's that
window of opportunity and it opens, and you've got to go for it there,
because otherwise you'll stale the entire relationship. She's going to
come back over and have those feelings that nothing happened. She
wanted that to happen, there were those expectations for something to
happen.
But what did you do wrong? You didn't shut up, you didn't do a kiss
close (say "come here."). Dude, you were in complete control: she's in
your house, laughing, playing with the bottom of your shoe, leaning in
to touch your knee with her hand. She sat with you on the couch and
listened to your music and shared time with you. I winged you, I
think, wonderfully, bringing up the subject of sex and
boyfriend-blasting, and then leaving and taking a really long shower.
How did you keep it going when the sexual energy--I could smell the
pheremones, man.
There was nothing wrong with this set: you went all the way to the end
right there. Her bf is gone for six weeks; she doesn't know how she's
going to survive for six weeks; she's talking sexual. Dude, it was SO
money. You should slap yourself: you were there. She came over.
Do you know what I would have done? I have a loofa sponge. When I was
in the shower, I would have said: 'come into the bathroom with me.
Take your shirt off. I want you to feel something, this is really
great. I'm going to rub you down with my loofa sponge.' Would she have
turned you down? No, because you're a cool guy. You could have said,
'it doesn't have to be sexual if you don't want it to. It's a great
feeling.'
But you were afraid of her saying no and having that awkward feeling.
The whole point of getting to that point of yes/no is to find out. If
it's a no, let it be a no, but at least you know. It's not a bad
thing. It's not a failure. Dude, she's here. The only reason why she'd
say no is that she didn't want to appear a slut, not that she didn't

want to fuck you. All it takes is for you to invite her into the
shower. You have the guts to approach, to make the moves, to go see
them, to get them over to your house. Dude, take your reward!" [end of
dictation]
So, I'm posting this here to A) Internalize this and change. B) Have
you all tell me what an AFC I am. C) Get advice on how to stop that
little voice in my head that says 'what if she rejects me when I try
to kiss her.'
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 01 Mar 2002 20:11:00 GMT
subject: Re: Dictated success --> failure FR
>I started a new job doing direct sales and my boss was telling us that
>when rookies do the 2 hour demonstration, 60% of them are too afraid
>to pull out the order form at the end.
Yes, dude, that is exactly it. A great analogy! Both good posts that
nail the problem.
It's so stupid that I didn't go for it, because later that same night,
I went to a party and met an HB8 I had hung out with twice before.
Went in more fearless. Left the party, returned, found her, did a
camera *close. I have this cool camera that takes mini-movies, so I
took a movie of us. She said, "What should we do?" I said, "come
here." And kissed. I knew it was already on, so ended up with the
f-close after all that night. Oh, and one interesting thing: I did a
new variation of Riker's three rules: the three rules takeaway. I told
her the first two rules, and then she discussed not wanting to
actually go all the way. So I said, okay. We fooled around some more,
then she asked, "What was the third rule?" It was beautiful, because
it let me know she was ready. I told her, and she said, "Those are
good rules." :)
But when I left this morning, I realized: That HB9 was just waiting
for ME to make a move the day before. I could have had TWO HBs
yesterday...
Not Afraid to Get Stabbed,

CPowles

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"Style" <0>
Sun, 03 Mar 2002 19:47:00 GMT
subject: Re: FUN! #close on a stripper
>> Suddenly, she asks me for a pen, grabs a napkin, and writes down
>> her cell#.
>
>Without knowing precisely what you did with her before, this is
>completely incongruent and unpredictable. You might as well have said
>"I got lucky." You said yourself that you were even thinking "I really
>should try for a #close" but didn't actually go for it. So, without
>knowing the specifics of what you did, the only explanation for it is
>"blind luck".
You have to be careful about #closes with strippers. The SMART ones
have a phone number just for clients, so that they can call and tell
them when they're in town or to visit them at the club. So on one
hand, this could just be what she does with guys in the club; on the
other hand, you didn't give her a penny so maybe not. In my mind, a
stripper #close isn't truly a number close until you see her at some
future time outside of the club. (Others say that the only/best way to
really close a stripper is to date her right there: to tell her you're
going to get some food, she should join you, and take her out of the
club.)
CPowles-
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 03 Mar 2002 19:55:00 GMT
subject: Re: Left brain - Right brain. Very long. Good read.
On Sun, 03 Mar 2002 12:26:00 -0500, InnerCalm wrote:
>It doesn't apply as far as tactics and techniques are concerned, however, it
>does offer an inside view of the inner workings of the human mind.
No, it totally applies. Here's how I use it. When we're talking about

creativity or something like that, I say, "Let me see your hands." I

pick them up, turn them over, and look at her palms. I tell her how
the left hand is controlled by the right brain, and how the right
brain is the artistic side, the anima, where intuitive, erotic,
creative, and spiritual thinking come from. The right hand is
controlled by the left brain, and that's where logic, reason, and
language look. And when I look closely at her hands (light kino on
palms here), she, like most people, has deeper and more complex lines
on her right hand, and this reflects how strongly our society has
repressed our natural, intuitive, erotic self--the part that truly
allows us to develop personally and spiritually.
And then you can spin whatever pattern/routine ("Natural Woman,"

usually) you want from this...
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 03 Mar 2002 20:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: Color Psychology Site
On Sat, 02 Mar 2002 19:46:00 -0500, Next Level wrote:
>My first colour profile seemed very accurate, but after doing it a few more
>times I noticed that most of the profiles seem to have themes of common human
>feelings such as being in control of your life, wanting to feel needed,
>conforming to social norms, and dreaming of better possibilities in life.
>Interesting site though, worth checking out and forming your own opinion.
>
And FInal D wrote:

>Yes, the first time I read my results, I DID indeed think, "Wow, these
>people really got me to a total tee." So, there's something to be learned
>from the persuasive language that they use on their response pages -- it's
>language that somehow induces a semi-trance of persuadability and
>compliance in the reader. PUAs would do well to mimic that type of
>language. But the actual psych results? Hooey.
And I Say:
Who cares about whether it's true or not, BS or not, a front for

scientology or not. Will HBs like it? Is it good enough for us to find
the rules of the color game so that we can use it in sarging like we
use the Cube?
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 03 Mar 2002 20:02:00 GMT
subject: Re: attract attention:food colour
On Sun, 03 Mar 2002 13:27:00 -0500, climbon wrote:
> Last night I had some food colouring and put

>it in our beer. It got lots of attention and we had
>DOZENS of women come over to our table.
Ha. I like this. I'm adding food coloring to my prop bag!
>
>Also, as an aside, I've noticed with myself that "lines"
>don't work probably because they come off as staged
>and non-spontaneous and less creative. Instead I just
>say whatever pops in my head and that seems to work.
Not true. I don't use "lines" per se, but I do use "canned openers."
And a good canned opener is not a pick-up line (for me at least), but
a story to keep her insterested, get her involved, and demonstrate
your desirability. Read the manual, or look through the archives, and
you'll find some of these.
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 03 Mar 2002 20:14:00 GMT
subject: Re: Impersonating a priest to get laid
On Sat, 02 Mar 2002 20:59:00 -0500, exps16 wrote:
>
>I'll assume that you are serious... TheOnion.com is a joke site. The chances
>of this actually being field-tested are next to none.
>

>exps16
True or not (and it's probably not). I love the idea. It's fun to play
dress up when you go out, like the guys (Darren or something-- I can't
remember their online names) who dressed up like pimps and had a
couple pivots dress up like ho's, and just blew up the scene at the
clubs. The priest disguise (in the street, but maybe even in the clubs
too--hell, alone at a bar with a shot of whiskey would work too) could
be so much fucking fun. Where does one go to get a priest outfit? I am
seriously considering this right now, just for fun.
Or how about having a FB dress up like a nun, and going out and just
making out in public (and, in the process, maybe picking up a HB for a
three-way make-out session. Take pictures for her with digicam. I
don't know: the possibilities are endless). The point would be: NEVER
drop the act. Even if people think it's fake, stay in character.
Either make it very real so that you are a priest who is tempted, or
create a role-playing fantasy for them and take it to its conclusion
(which, without a costume, is what happened in the boy toy lay report
I posted here months ago).
What other costumes would be good?
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 03 Mar 2002 20:50:00 GMT
subject: Two Funny Stories
Just finished winging Mystery in LA this weekend, and a lot of funny

shit happened. Here are two stories that crack me up:
1. For fun, sometimes I like to play with my appearance: just go out

looking like someone else. This night, I put on a really cool wig and
a fake lipring.
An Aside: (Oddly, I noticed that it doesn't change my response from

women at all, really, which leads me to believe that personality is
more impt than looks and style. Similarly, Mys, instead of wearing
suit and cool magic man outfit, dressed up like an overgrown boy in
overalls, bandana, hair in ponytail. And it didn't really effect his
game either. Hmm. Maybe "game" transcends "looks.")
Anyway, met a redhead HB and #closed. (If anyone wants the details,

just ask, but no new or great technique here.) Anyway, I left and felt
like I had failed, because I knew I could have kissed her. Later, I
saw her coming up stairs. She spread her hands out and smiled. I took
her hands, pulled her gently into me, and just started kissing her.
(Note: Her friend was there, and I had already disarmed the friend so
no CB.) And THEN, I realized the fake lipring was in. Fuck. I don't
know how to kiss with one of these on.
I took her hand, and led her into a corner. We started to make out
more, and, man, I couldn't figure out how to really french kiss with
this thing on. I told her to stick out her tongue, and played with her
tongue. Then I went down to bite her neck, but all I could do was sort
of lip it because I kept getting worried my lipring would fall off. In
fact, I started SHAKING while we were kissing because I got worried
the wig or lipring would be exposed as total fakes. I asked her what
part of her body was most sensitive, she said everywhere. I said
"right here on the back of my neck," and she started rubbing it--and
then I realized it was like right below where the netting at the
bottom of my wig was. I was DYING laughing. (And it is going to be
funny when she sees me next time with a totally different haircut,
color, and style, and no lip ring.)
2. So later this night in some club, I see Mystery do his usual: he

isolates a HB, sits her in a chair, runs his routines, holds her
hands, and #closes. Later, I'm downstairs leaving the club, and I see
the girl she was sarging. She walks up to me, stops, looks at me, and
yells, "Chris!"
I go into shock: this girl is an HB I sarged like a month ago at a

completely different club in a completely different context. We even
went out a few days later and made out. And this is a large city, so
the chances of Mys SARGING the same girl I already sarged are slim.
Not only that, but when he #closed her, he gave her MY cell phone
number. So she already has the SAME number.
LMAO,
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 05 Mar 2002 04:32:00 GMT
subject: The Priest idea

First, a word on this forum: More than ever, people are talking less
about seduction, and just jumping down someone's throat when they post
something: it's too long, too irrelevant, not true, not advanced
enough, whatever. Let 1000 postings bloom, because something will turn
into an amazing seduction idea.
So, for me, the posting about the priest article in the Onion has been
golden. I don't care if it's true or not, because it's about to turn
into one of my best night's out ever. Here's why: I turned it into a
great idea.
I talked to a girl I #closed today.

Me: "You know what, I have a crazy idea. I just saw a priest outfit in
the window of a uniform shop. Why don't I dress like a priest and you
dress like a nun, and we'll go out in public and make out."
Her: Where in public?
Me: A bench on the beach, or anywhere that it would be the strangest.
Her: Hey, I have an idea: how about in church?
Me: You rock. I knew you were cool enough to be into this. I could
just put my hand on your thigh, really high, so people would notice
and we'd just sit there.
Her: Yes!
Me: Or how about we go to a bar, and we just sit there and drink a
couple shots of whiskey. We don't talk to each other. Not a word. And
then, after half an hour or something, we just molest each other.
Her: I love it. See if they have a nun uniform at that store, or I'll
look for a nun uniform online tonight!
So we set a date for Wednesday. This is going to be hilarious. And all

because of a posting here that was criticized as stupid, naive, or/and
OT.
F--k coffee dates. I'm all about meeting to dress up as a nun and
priest, and go at it in public now. (Maybe this is even a funny
variation of the "our world" routine--a routine, btw, I've never used
but MUST learn.)
Seduction can be fun,

CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 05 Mar 2002 19:13:00 GMT

subject: Re: Riker's Three Rules Takeaway?
On Tue, 05 Mar 2002 11:27:00 -0500, NewToTheGame wrote:
>
>There is an Austrian author (whose name I have forgotten-sorry, formhandle)
who
>has a simple solution on the problem:
>
>"Whenever you get these negative vibes, ask yourself: 'What is the worst that
>may happen to me if I fail?'."
>Most of the time we realize it's something trivial like: 'She won't ever talk
>to me' or 'I will not see her again.' or 'She may tell her friends about it'.
>Big Deal!
Yes, that's a good way to think: I'm working on that, on placing NO

value on "failure," because the truth is that it doesn't really
matter. Rejection isn't an ending, just a message telling you try a
different sort of approach--to back up and change direction in the PU,
or to put her in a better state and go for it. Another thing I'm
noticing that helps is NOT TO expect or think about failure at all. In
other words, to expect SUCCESS and then, in the PU, act congruently
with that belief/intent/future-scenario.
Adonis, here, gave me the idea of stepping outside of yourself, and

just knowing your intent and watching the seducer (you) work naturally
towards that intent from an outside perspective. He said it shuts off
the internal doubting and AFC voices. He added that he is outside
watching himself operate during a whole PU. "The only time I step back
in my body is when I'm actually fucking the girl..."
It's funny, because the pieces are slowly coming together. Last night,
I met a BEAUTIFUL Asian HB. I went hardcore in terms of being
interesting, fascinating, blowing her mind. Then I went very kino,
with lots of hand holding, back stroking, leg touching, etc. Then I
decided to 'fuck it,' and go for the *close at this bar. She turned
away. I actually REALLY didn't care, and just backed off a little and
continued with the PU.
Later, dude, I actually #closed the 9.5 waitress (has a boyfriend of

four months) without even really trying, right in front of her.
Anyway, I thought I was out with the Asian HB, but she called twice
this morning to say what an amazing time she had.
And, do you know what I did wrong last night? I was TOO on, too
consistently entertaining. Not enough takeaways, disappearances,

challenges, 101s (which I HAVE to incorporate into my game), etc. I

made her LIKE me, but I didn't make her WANT me. (Also, I think I have
to learn more about working with Asians, in terms of bypassing their
shy/repressive programming. Any suggestions?) So at least I'm starting
to get past one sticking point and going for it BEFORE I'm 100 percent
sure, and now I'm seeing what my next one will be.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 11 Mar 2002 20:18:00 GMT
subject: Re: Read right or left palm?
On Mon, 11 Mar 2002 04:36:00 -0500, Commander Zap wrote:
>Tell us, oh learned ones, for we are confused...

>
>Do you read the left or the right? Materials seem to indicate right (without
>actually saying it as far as I can see), but subjects seem surprised...
>
Hey, check out the right hand/left hand palm-reading pattern I posted
somewhere inthese forums. It's a version of the natural woman pattern,
but for palm-reading (right is analytical/thinking/language, and left
is intuitive/erotic/feeling). I like to use this instead of
palm-reading...
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 11 Mar 2002 21:02:00 GMT
subject: Need to Figure Out Why this Worked
Had an amazing week, not much time to post. But I did want to share a
story, because it would definitely advance the game if we can figure
out how to work this in an efficient way.
Before I start, you've always said here that I fuse Ross J and Mystery
technique: now I've made that literal. I brought them together in LA
last week, and we all had a great discussion. Ross shared some REALLY

interesting stuff I'd never heard before. More on this later...
Anyway, just finished up an amazing weekend in SF. Got past some

sticking points, had some great closes. And here's one of the stranger
stories I wanted to share:
I'm just bouncing around in a bar, sarging like usual. I'm having a
real ON night; HB9's who are there with their fiancees are slipping
their arms into mine. Mystery is working an HB7 (cute but a little
chubby, to be honest) and I notice her eyes keep twinkling in my
direction. I cruise in and talk to her. Can't remember exactly what I
said (fuck, this stuff is getting so internalized that it doesn't seem
like technique/routine anymore). After just two minutes, I notice that
she's giving me the DDB, so I say, "Would you like to kiss me?"
She says, "Well, I wasn't thinking about it before."
I give her the reject line, "Hey now, that wasn't an invitation. It
just looked like you had something on your mind."
And then, I kiss her anyway. I pull back and use what has now become
my between-kiss line (how good of a kisser would you say you are, on a
scale of 1 to 10). Then we start making out again. Mys comes in with
camera, and we make out for the record.
When we're done, she says, "I don't have any of your albums, but my
friends tell me that your music is really good."
I say, "umm, okay..."
Then she smiles and licks my face.
Anyway, it turns out that the hostess of this trendy bar thinks that
I'm a certain pop musican (not a superstar, but a semi-known star),
and has told everyone in the bar that I'm this person.
I know I can HAVE this HB7, not just from this info but from the
constant DDB. All I have to do is take her to the bathroom or out to
the limo (rented for the SF workshop). I decide to wait to decide if I
want to go through with the charade. I tell her that I don't have a
hotel room, but I'd like to meet up with her later tonight. She gives
me her #'s, and tells me to make sure I call her later.
Anyway, the point is this: Why would this woman be willing to just
totally have a ONS on MY terms after a few minutes?

The immediate answer: because she thinks I'm a musician she doesn't
really know but is somewhat famous.
The REAL answer: because it's an adventure, because she can brag about
it to her friends afterwards.
So, how can WE go out and be ALL THAT without being a CELEB? I think
it's possible. No, I know it's possible. How can we frame ourselves as
an ADVENTURE to BRAG ABOUT LATER, an EXPERIENCE that makes them
SUSPEND THEIR USUAL RULES and brings out their inner sexual being who
wants to satisfy US. And how can we establish this right away, from
the onset?
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Mar 2002 00:31:00 GMT
subject: Re: Need to Figure Out Why this Worked
On Mon, 11 Mar 2002 17:19:00 -0500, Forix wrote:
>LOL just to show that I am a good student of the Player Guide:

>
>http://www.fastseduction.com/guide/09_Field_Reports/richfamous.shtml [The rich
>and famous setup - but even more accurately the "tired of female attention"
>setup:)]
>
>Forix, rAFC [Actually, a repressed PUA =) ]
>
>"Eat shit! A hundred billion flies can't be wrong!"
>
Yes, I think the rich and famous setup is good. I like to do this when
winging. I brag/bs for my friend, or he brags/bs's for me. It's an
important part of winging I sometimes forget! In fact, I got a very
sexy *close in front of the whole workshop (and a busload of people)
this weekend after Mys winged me with a story like this.
But, what I'm really after, is not how to PRETEND to be famous to

attract money-grubbers and star-fuckers. What I really want is to
figure out HOW to tap into the ENDS VALUE of someone who would lay
aside their normal MORAL PROGRAMMING to just run off and have a crazy,
sexual ONS with a CELEB. How can WE offer that same ends value (an
adventure, a notch in their belt, a new crazy experience) without

actually being a celeb? Does this make sense?
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Mar 2002 00:37:00 GMT
subject: Anyone use a motorcycle?
Just got a motorcycle hand-me-down. Thinking of learning to ride. Out

of curiousity, does anyone use a motorcycle in their PUs.
Thinking about it, it's much cooler to say "Why don't I pick you up on
Sunday on my motorcycle, and we'll ride down the XXX to the YYY."
Hell, it's a lot sexier than going for coffee or whatever. Man, you
could even do a bs value-demonstrating routine where you pretend to
break down, then borrow a hairpin to fix the exhaust release valve (or
whatever) in 30 seconds.
So, does anyone go on "first meetings" on a motorcycle. Does it help

or work? I also think it would be pretty cool to be at a bar carrying
a motorcycle helmet. I like what it represents.
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Mar 2002 00:48:00 GMT
subject: The answer to sarging with too many GUYS
This weekend, I was on a bus with a bunch of bachlorette parties. And

they all had lists of things to do in each bar:
"Get a guy to buy a blow job shot for you
Get the cutest guy in the room to kiss Melissa
Get a guy's boxer shorts."
This made me realize the answer to a perennial problem. There is

nothing I hate more than sarging with a big group of guys. It just
cramps everyone's style, and doesn't look cool. So, from now on,
whenever I sarge with a bunch of guys, I'm going to write up a FAKE
bachelor-party scavenger-hunt list for everyone. That way, as soon as
we hit the bar, we can just approach, approach, approach looking for
things on our list.

The KEY here is to make sure of two things:

1. So that we just don't seem like a pack of horny guys who should be
at a strip club, I'm going to pretend like the groom is gay and is
marrying a guy. It just makes this more unusual, less typical.
2. Put a lot of silly things on the list. I don't want to make it all
"get a girl to kiss you" or "get a girl's panties." This is because
I'm not using the LIST to get a kiss. I'm using the list as an OPENER
only, and then I can work on getting a # and * with my OWN skills. So
they should be fun, non-sexual, playful things on the list. And they
should be fun for the girl too. Like "get a girl to belch" or "take a
picture of someone's underarm hair" or ""talk someone into licking the
bar."
Now, suddenly, going sarging with a bunch of guys will be fun and
multiple approaches will be a piece of cake. Yes? No?
So, does anyone here want to write up and post a master fake bachelor
party list to use? Anyone want to work on one with me?
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Mar 2002 01:06:00 GMT
subject: Re: Getting chicks comfortable in clubs - UPDATE
Nice post. You've had a few good responses and did a good job making
this happen. But there are a couple small things you should work on
and add to your game that I point out below.
On Sun, 10 Mar 2002 18:25:00 -0500, Dreem wrote:
>I was standing by a crowded bar in a club waiting to be served when a HB8.5
>with long blonde hair comes and stands next to me waiting to order a drink
>as well. She looks about 22 yrs old max I would say (I didn't ask). I got
>served and I turned round but stayed leaned against the bar. She gets
>served as well and does the same as me leaning against the bar standing
>close to me. At this point I was beginning to get internal dialogue, I
>noticed with the corners of my eyes that she would glance at me and look
>away. I knew I had to make the move quick or stale things out.
>

>I leaned in (not turning to face her) and asked if she's had enough of the
>dance floor as well. She said the yes that she's has been dancing and her
>legs hurts.
You need an all-purpose opener. This was a weak environmental opener.

It worked: good for you. But with an all-purpose opener, you don't
have to think or wait before going in. As soon as you see her, you
just recite your opener and it's much more interesting than the
environmental fluff small-talk bs openers that girls hear all the
time.
I then blasted into a story of a club out of town I went to last

>month and all the weird and strange things that happened that night (all
>exaggerated of course!). I then transition into talking about music, I
>asked her no personal questions. All this time I had to raise my voice to
>talk over the music and after a while she kept complaining that she couldn't
>hear me. I was thinking, fuck... is she looking for an excuse to eject or
>what?
>
>I then suggested that we go to a quiet corner with comfortable seats and
>talk some more. She said OK. [This is a breakthrough for me! I could
>never get them to do this before.]
Yes, talking quiet is always good. To extract, or just to move closer

and start kino.
>
>We got seated and carried on talking. Heavy kino going on. 3 times her 4
>female friends came round and tried to cockblock by trying to get her away
>from me but each time she refused to go with them.
THIS was your KEY mistake. You could have gotten laid IF, as soon as
the friends came by, you hopped up and introduced yourself and
entertained them all. IF you won them over, they might even ENCOURAGE
their friend to go home with you. (I don't know exactly what you did
here, but most guys sit there and look guilty and wait for the friends
to leave. That's wrong.)
>I found out she was Swedish, and we talked a bit about the difference in
>attitude towards sex on TV in Sweden and England. I noticed her body
>language and decided to skip the sex talk and move forward. When she speaks
>to me she would lean in and her lips would touch my ear. I did David
>DeAngelo's kiss test by making a comment and touching her hair and running
>my hand through it with no resistance on her part. So I said "kiss me" and
>went for the kiss. We kissed a bit and I disengaged and carried on talking
>[to create sexual tension].
>

>I teased her a bit and after a while she turned towards me trying to kiss me
>again, this time it was a tongue down. We carried on like this for a while
>and I disengaged again and said "Take is easy, don't get greedy now...".
>She didn't take this very well and I almost blew it here! She said she
>wasn't gonna kiss me again so I had to tell her I was just kidding.
Don't worry. You did NOT almost blow it here. You just started a game,
and she was playing along. So instead of taking it back (and risking
appearing incongruent), when she says she won't kiss you anymore (and
you know she wants to), say, "Okay, stick out your tongue." Then play
with her tongue with yours and start kissing again.
>
>After a while we resumed our tongue down again and carried on snogging for
>about 40 min. I knew with the 4 friends around there was no possibility of
>making an extraction
because you hadn't won them over (and found out her
tranportation/living arrangement)!
>so I @ and # closed her and promised to call her soon.

>Obviously I've got to try this a couple more times before I can concretely
>say it's a wining formula but what happened yesterday was definitely
>progress for me in the club environment. 'Baby steps' as the saying goes.
I think you got a LITTLE lucky here. Your skills helped for sure, but
it also helped that the girl was clearly into you, looking for a
little adventure, isolated from her friends when you found her, and
possibly tipsy. Nice job though (dude, you can't argue with making out
in a club within minutes). This may not be a "winning formula," but
you've DEFINITELY worked a few more piece in the PU puzzle into your
game now!
Keep posting such well-detailed FRs!
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Mar 2002 09:22:00 GMT
subject: Re: The answer to sarging with too many GUYS
On Mon, 11 Mar 2002 23:55:00 -0500, juggler wrote:

>This could be great fun CP. We will have to try this Saturday night.
>
>-Juggler
>
>
That's exactly what I was thinking! And I know your mind could come up
with some pretty original items for the list. If you can think of 'em
before Saturday, post them here and I'll print out/xerox a fake
bachelor party list for Saturday that we can use if we want.
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Mar 2002 09:39:00 GMT
subject: Re: Sarging in S. FLA with 'The List'...
On Mon, 11 Mar 2002 23:56:00 -0500, Forix wrote:

>
>Great idea. I just have to say that CPowles is the man!!!
>
>This is a great playful opener / game. I guess the things that go on the list
>should be fairly light to start with (kisses, etc.) and then once you opened a
>chick you can move further down the list into more kinky stuff...
Thanks, man. My advice: keep the WHOLE list light and playful. Have
the HB do fun/silly stuff. The list is just your OPENER, not your
whole PU. If there's too much kinky or sexual stuff on the list,
you'll just look like a bunch of pervs. (I do like the idea of
bringing a camera to document it, however.)
So, this way, if you have on the list, "get a girl to put eye makeup
on you," you can quickly get into a playful/flirtatious situation with
her, demonstrate your personality while this is happening, and then
it's up to YOU and your game to get the kinky/sexual stuff going
afterwards!
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Mar 2002 21:18:00 GMT

On Tue, 12 Mar 2002 15:07:00 -0500, sandworm wrote:

>
> Note how we stole the anchor Mystery spent all that time laying on that dumb
>chick, and Mys had no clue what was going on!
I wish I had a picture of all three of you doing the anchor move over
your chins. I was dying.
(What happened, for those just reading, was that Mys demonstrated a
routine on the HB. Then he ended it. He didn't realize that he had set
a strong anchor, so, all of a sudden, Ross and two of his top students
kept anchoring her whenever they talked with her, and retriggering the
state. Later, after Ross left, we all went up to my place and the
students did some SICK NLP slight-of-tongue on her that somehow had
her convinced that she was a naughty girl pretending to be good!)
>Hey! You told me you were with your family! Are you fibbing to your Guru?
I ain't fibbing. Still here. Call and you can talk to my mom. She's a
very funny lady: great sense of humor. But, man, it is hard being with
family: regresses me back to AFC in 24 hours. It makes me realize that
most PUAs (though I don't know about you personally, Sandworm) are,
at least in some small way, out trying to win the acceptance/approval
they never got from their mother or father...
> Well, how do you think Brittany, the girl with the totally rocking body
views
>ME? And how did I do that? Do you think I am what she would NORMALLY be
>attracted to? How did I get her to say that opening to my voice is better than
>sex?
I see. And you did this in FIVE minutes on the phone. Pretty efficient
too! As I started this thread, I thought that SS is designed to bypass
those socially programmed circuits and link her deepest desires to us.
But, at the same time, I remembered the first PUA I ever met years
ago, a natural. He was an average-looking guy who went to clubs and
would just make eye contact with a girl and be off in a corner making
out with her seconds later. He also tapped into something primal, some
adventerous side--but without words, without social proof. The
persuasive message of SS came not from his mouth, but emanated from
his body language, his demeanor, his gentle fearlessness and subtle

confidence. So the piece I'm trying to figure out is this: how can I
have an HB open to being responsive BEFORE I even open my mouth. Half
of this, as discussed in SS LA seminar, is selecting the appropriate
person. And the other half is conveyed in "how she views you, or what
she sees you as, as you are moving towards each other." This HB saw me
as SEMI-CELEB, so she was ready to be responsive. Now, I want an HB to
see me as SEMI-ADVENTURE, and ready to be responsive. How can this be
conveyed in the first seconds, and then acted on congruently?
Is this asking too much?
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 13 Mar 2002 09:56:00 GMT
subject: Jumping from One Friend to the Other
Okay, anyone have experiencing f-closing one girl, then her best
friend. I'm stalled. Here's the story:
I #closed HB7 and HB9.5, in Vegas a couple months ago.They're both

friends, they both work together, and they both live 40 minutes away
from me. I went out with both, but ended up f-closing HB7. She really
liked me, and we became f-buddies for a couple weeks. However, HB7
bored the shit out of me and basically I ejected her when she reneged
on plans because she was too lazy to drive to my house and see me.
So the question is this: HB9.5 has a bf, but she's really my type and
would be open to hanging out again.. I WANT to call her and work on
her. BUT, how can I have her meet me without making her feel like
she's betraying her friend etc. Especially since I totally blew off
her friend after she flaked...
Should I:
A. Call HB9.5 and invite her to hang out like nothing ever happened.
(Saying you had a dream about an HB is always a good excuse to call
after a gap of weeks.)
B. Call HB9.5 and tell her the truth: why I ejected HB7, and why I
think that SHE is a more interesting, adventurous type than her
friend?
C. Call and frame a meeting as her revenge on HB7 for stealing me from
her. (She actually told HB9: "hands off, he's mine.")

D. Give it up 'cuz it's too complicated.
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 13 Mar 2002 20:09:00 GMT
subject: Re: Asking for a ciggarette, suplication?
On Wed, 13 Mar 2002 14:35:00 -0500, lojloj77 wrote:
>Is asking for a cigarette as a opening line supplication?

>
No, but it is a WEAK opening line. If you want to use it as your
opener, be prepared to IMMEDIATELY follow with a real opener to
continue the convo (do not follow with fluff).
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 13 Mar 2002 20:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: My thoughts on Mystery's Workshop
On Tue, 12 Mar 2002 15:29:00 -0500, davo wrote:
> Chris comes over and tells me we have a time

>constraint and we have to go. I stay and don’t get his hint. He comes over a
>couple seconds later, calls me an idiot(whispering of course) and tells me to
>do a takeaway and make her give me her number so that we can continue the
>conversation some other time.
LOL! Didn't mean to be harsh, but hated to see a perfect opportunity

pass you by. And it did work...
>I give her a piece of paper and a pencil and she

>knows exactly what to do. Then she asks me if I’m gonna remember what we were
>talking about. I take the number, but I don’t think I’ll call her. I gave
her
>a 7, but another guy there gave her a 9. Oh well, I chalk it up to
experience.

Hey man, I had a feeling you weren't going to call her. I'd suggest
asking yourself why. Is it because it may be awkward and you're not
used to this? Or does she truly repulse you so much that you would
never ever want to sleep with her no matter what?
My suggestion: call her, man. And this is why: Even if she's not
totally your type, it can't hurt to practice the next steps in your
game. This way, when you #close a HB you're REALLY hot for, you'll
know just what to do. Besides, she seemed attractive and intelligent.
And her friends who came up later, were also. So this could lead to
other options and pivots for you.
[If it seems like too much time has passed, either A) tell her you
were talking to Chris who said he had just spoken to her redhead
friend and it made you think of her. or B) tell her you had a dream
about her.]
Nice report, man. It was fun hanging out with you, and it was amazing
to see how much you improved over just three days. Keep making those
approaches
CPowles!
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 15 Mar 2002 22:30:00 GMT
subject: Re: Asking for a light
On Fri, 15 Mar 2002 17:20:00 -0500, uberguy wrote:
>HB: "Hi. Do you have a light?"

>
>PUA: "<Smile>.
Convince me...
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 16 Mar 2002 10:01:00 GMT

Thanks. Good stuff, and fun stuff to play with. But, the challenge is
not being interesting, in this situation. The challenge is how to be
an adventure for her--right there, right then, in the moment.
I'll expand on this later, but the more I think about it, the more I
realize that PUA styles may value, but they all offer one thing: an
adventure that sweeps an HB off her feet...
On Sat, 16 Mar 2002 04:19:00 -0500, Minotaurus007 wrote:
>On Mon, 11 Mar 2002 19:31:00 -0500, CPowles10 wrote:

>
>>
>> How can WE offer that same ends value (an
>> adventure, a notch in their belt, a new crazy experience) without
>> actually being a celeb? Does this make sense?
>>
>
>It's not that difficult! See:
>
>- You are going to do some training, the New York Marathon is coming
>soon.
>
>- You would love to leave for some photo-session with a beautiful
>chick on a tropical island. You have had exhibitions in earlier times,
>haven't you?
>
>- You are working on a neural network system to develop a financial
>forecasting system.
>
>- You have to go to write on your book about mechanical investing.
>
>... etc. ...
>
>All this stuff makes you interesting for the chick without having to
>be a celeb at all. And it works even with intelligent babes, because
>it works up their unconscious mind.
>
>Mino
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"Style" <0>

Mon, 18 Mar 2002 21:18:00 GMT

subject: Re: Schemas: Rich & Famous Setup, Pop Star PU
FOrix,
This is a great post and a nice way of thinking. I like the "schema"
model. I know some PUAs who like to use the "confusion" approach.
Swinggcat was telling me the other day that he likes to do things
like: shake with the left hand, say "yes" but nod no, etc. I guess the
SS'ers call this "confusion induction." So maybe it fits your model as
a schema breaker.
So, I sense two different threads coming out of your post: one is just
to interrupt and confuse her normal schema, just so that she can't put
you in a category. I don't know if I'm using the word "schema"
correctly in this post, but I'm sure, everyone has a schema for
hooking up/ONS/instant make-out/etc. And rock stars trigger this
schema, because it's what books and movies say that women do when they
meet a celeb. I don't remember if I posted here about a friend of
mine. Well, she was in Hawaii, a guy came by on a bike, stopped, and
said he was from Brazil. She said, I'm from the Hilton (or whatever
hotel it was). He said, What room? She said, room 812. He said, I'll
be there at 7:30 p.m.
As he biked away, she thought, "You know, I've always wanted to have
an anonymous fuck." She said that as soon as he walked in the door,
his dick was in his hand. They had sex (terrible, she said), and then
he talked and proved himself to be a total bore.
So, by being direct, confident, and giving her no other info (like you
post) besides her fantasy, he triggered her "anonymous fuck" schema?
And everyone has this: I don't work the internet, but clearly there
are housewives there who, when their husbands are away, troll for a
guy to come over for a quickie. So clearly there are other ways to do
this besides being just rich and famous. How, as a PUA, can we bring
up that schema within the first 15-second impression? (That is, for
HBs who fit OUR schema for ONS or bathroom encounter, vs our other
schemas--relationship, love, eject, etc.)
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 18 Mar 2002 21:23:00 GMT

subject: Re: Schemas: Rich & Famous Setup, Pop Star PU
I realize, as I re-read this post, something I'd never realized

before: an anonymous fuck has to be anonymous. The PUA has to come and
go, with nothing attached or lingering other than the beautiful
memory. My Natural PUA friend who I posted about before didn't need
social proof and all that. He just appeared out of nowhere, made eye
contact, and disappeared with the HB. It was a beautiful anonymous
fantasy. So, in all out other models, by the time we've talked or
built rapport or asked about the unknown or used almost any opener,
we've already destroyed anonymity.
Anyone here ever work the ANONYMOUS thing?
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 19 Mar 2002 06:36:00 GMT
subject: Re: the 3-week call?
On Mon, 18 Mar 2002 21:25:00 -0500, Maddash wrote:
>I hooked up with a HB 9.5 about 3 weeks ago, f-closed, went out on a date
>and we lost interest in each other. Are there any recommended techniques
>for calling and resurrecting this one? I'm interested in another f-close.
>
Call her and tell her you just had a dream about her...
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Mar 2002 10:06:00 GMT
subject: The Ultimate Never Fail Foolproof Opener
Ladies and Gentleman....
Well, gentlemen, at least...
Because you asked for it...
Here it is...

The tested, tried, and true...
ULTIMATE NEVER FAIL FOOLPROOF OPENER.
Amaze your friends...
Thrill the ladyfolk...
With your newfound prowess...
When you use the UNFF (Ultimate Never Fail Foolproof) Opener.
Prepare yourselves...
For the UNFF Opener...
As seen field-tested by Juggler and CPowles in San Francisco...
Much to the delight of the fairer sex...
"STICK 'EM UP"*
*For a free brochure on how to properly use this opener--including

tips on how to properly leap in front of a group set, how to position
your thumb and fingers in the shape of a pistol, and what the fuck to
say next--send a SASE to PO Box 6996.
Act now, and you will receive absolutely FREE an extra opener: "Do you
speak English?" (opener valid in English-speaking countries only).
Offer good while supplies last.
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Mar 2002 19:26:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Ultimate Never Fail Foolproof Opener
On Thu, 21 Mar 2002 06:36:00 -0500, spirit wrote:

>If she sticks èm up...

>
>"now turn around, put your hands on the bar and spread èm (while I frisk
>you)..."
>
>I think I`ll try this on Friday =o)
>
>Spirit
I wouldn't make it too cheesy and sexual right away. But if this is
your style, and you say it with a good sense of humor, go for it.
My follow up (deadpan): "I'm serious. I don't know why you're smiling.

Hand over your money and valuables. Or I'll shoot you: These are VERY
dangerous weapons."
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 22 Mar 2002 06:57:00 GMT
subject: Email Sarging Tips
Lately, I've been sarging in other cities, so there are a few HBs I'm
staying in touch with via email. This may seem like a newbie question,
but I'm trying to figure out how to escalate our
connection/relationship via email. In other words, I feel that the
emails are getting bogged down in small talk and fluff. I'm trying to
think of a way to TRANSITION into getting deeper, heavier, sending
poetry, etc. The problem is that I don't want to get too intense too
fast, but to gradually ease them out of this "holding pattern" and
into expecting the possibility of something more exciting when i see
them again..
Is this making sense? Anyone sarge via email with someone they've
ALREADY met (and #closed but not *closed)?
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Mar 2002 07:51:00 GMT
subject: Re: Email Sarging Tips

On Fri, 22 Mar 2002 20:46:00 -0500, mohap wrote:
>dude why are you wasting time online... try to move the sarge to the ground
>ASAP. Online you are in no man's land.. offline, you have all your weapons..
>kino,EC,smiling,voice tonality. the list goes on.
>
>it just seems like you're wasting your time to me... if these cities are
>hundreds of miles away then you dont get to see (i.e. fuck) these chicks..
>so you NEXT them.
Good advice guys--five, spirit, berry--for email sarging acceleration.

And I agree that Email sarging may be futile. But I travel a lot, so
it would be nice to be set up in a city when I get there and not to be
wasting the numbers I've already collected. Maybe the way to do it is
not to expect to get anything out of email. Just to manage their
expectations and tell them to expect a call from me some time when I'm
in town--next week, next month, next year. Otherwise, maybe you're
right, maybe it just fizzles out eventually.
On the other hand, you can get it exciting enough for the HB to come
visit you. That's happening with one huge-chested Texas Hooters girl I
met in Vegas a few months ago. She's coming out next week, and she's
staying with me, so it's going to be ON. But, we stayed in touch via
phone, not email...
Anyway, thanks guys...
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 26 Mar 2002 20:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: Foolproofing the Cube
Yes, I agree with Dr. Honker. Whenever a chick is playing games with
you, just PLAY the game, but PLAY it better. If she says her horse is
pissing in the sky, that shows she has a funny wicked sense of humor.
Come up with a funnier, more wicked interpretation. "This means that
as a baby, when your mother was changing your diaper, you pissed on
her and got in trouble. Now you are looking for a man who will piss on
you, as a sort of self-punishment. The fact that your horse is pissing
into the sky means that you want to eat at McDonald's, because it is
making a golden arc. If you'd like, we can step into the bathroom,
I'll quickly piss on your hand and then let's get out of here. I'm
hungry too; maybe I'll let you watch me eat a Big Mac." Or whatever.

You get the point.
THE BIGGER IDEA:

Guys here and in the field, in general, seem to just BAIL every time a
chick doesn't respond like they SHOULD on paper. But EVERYTHING an HB
says is an opening. YOU just have to know how to take advantage of it.
If a chick is FUCKING with you--say she says she is a phone-sex
hooker, which happened to one student in Mys's san fran workshop--then
just fuck with her right back. In the san fran case, tell her you're a
pimp and she's wasting time on the phones when she can be making much
better money in the street.
I LOVE it when chicks do this stuff. It makes it a challenge for me, I

have to be creative, and, best of all, now we have a private joke
together and something we can role-play all night, maybe right into
bed...
Get it?
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 26 Mar 2002 23:23:00 GMT
subject: Re: Need a debrief on this one
On Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:17:00 -0500, Sabel wrote:
>I need a debrief on this one.
My quick thoughts:
1. You did a nice job of being alpha. Calling her on her BS, telling
her to see you, and refusing to settle for LJBF.
2. In my opinion, where you went wrong (and where I used to go wrong

with these kinds of HBs before I discovered ASF) is that you kept
asking her what was wrong. And then you tried to use logic to talk her
out of it. The problem there is that you just recreate and reinforce
all the WRONG feelings. Instead, don't PRESUME that something is wrong
(even if it is). Have her relive the times when something was right.
Ask her about going into the bathroom with that guy, what inside her
told her that it was okay, what about him triggered that response in

her, how delicious it was to be naughty, etc. This is pure RJ stuff:

then you have a road map to follow into her bed.
Also, in my experience (but not universally true), girls like this

like it a bit rougher in bed. They can only reward themselves with sex
if it feels like a punishment: biting, scratching, animalistic. I
maybe also would have spun a sort of "natural woman" crossed with a
"don't think, feel" pattern, then said, "you know what, you talk to
much. Just be quiet for a second. And feel this." Then I would have
just bitten her neck and said (a bit of a Mys line here), "You can
thank your ancestors for that. That is real. We can talk for hours
about all this stuff, but THIS will be the most real and memorable
thing you'll take home with you tonight and think about."
Then I would have continued with the sarge...
Think this would have worked with her--if you sent her down the RIGHT
paths in her mind and body instead of the WRONG ones...
CPowles
>I call her on her BS and

>tell her that we got to see each other today anyway.
This was good. Very alpha.
>Well then, we meet this evening, and as I kinda expected she was cold. Upon
>meeting she tries to kiss me on the cheek. I turn my face away. Then I ask
what
>is wrong with her and she starts telling me these stories about her past
>boyfriend who used to hurt her a lot (aha, seems she likes to that kind of
>guy), how she lost her father at 10 and how she is kinda unexperienced with
>guys (note that she is 23 and only had one boyfriend -- or so she says --).
>
>Then she proceeds to tell me she doesnt like sex , but still she got banged
>once in a night club before. Also she tells me she doesn't get easily
attached,
>and she won't give in before getting attached (-- or so she says, even if she
>told me one minute before she got shagged with a total stranger --). And she
>tells me again she doesn't like sex. So I explain to her that sex is something
>natural, and that I agree that it comes after two people get attached to each
>other. Then I proceed with a bit of an IC pattern.
>
>So I put her around my arms and tell her to kiss me. And I kiss her, but she
>does it so coldly on the tip of the lips... I ask her what is wrong with her.
>And she tells me that she doesn't feel anything for me, or not at least what

>she used to feel with her past experiences. I didn't knew how to proceed for
>there, so I choose to turn cold, and eject. She begs me for LJBF but I refuse,
>saying that I got lots of friends, and that's not what I am after.
>
>Can you guys with more experience point out the mistakes I did. I got a get
>together with an HB10 in 2 days, and I'd like to fare better than what I did
>here.
>
>Thanks
>
>Sabel
>-------------------------------
>"Testing the bounds of reality."
>
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 27 Mar 2002 10:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: Need a debrief on this one
On Wed, 27 Mar 2002 02:46:00 -0500, Veroxii wrote:
>Anyways, I had a (inexperienced) chick pull this on me once too. We kissed

>and then she said "I didn't feel anything... no magic... bla bla bla". Big
>shit test. So I told her that you only get out of life what you invest...
>and if she didn't feel anything it's because *she* didn't put any feeling
>into the kiss. (shit test her right back!)
>
Nice reframe here! I'm using this one, Veroxii. Thanks!
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 27 Mar 2002 18:37:00 GMT
subject: Re: WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS SHIT!
On Wed, 27 Mar 2002 11:32:00 -0500, Sandstorm wrote:
>YOU ARE GETTING TOO TECHNICAL.

>
>There is a fine line, and I think many, many people are crossing it.
>Asmodai pointed it out flawlessly: all you need is "ALPHA+EC". I mean,
>this is a gross simplification, but it rings pretty true in my ears.
>
>The cube, the gimmicks, palm reading, etc - these are not meant to be "the
>sarge"! These are not the end all and be all of sarging. With these
>gimmicks and such, an AFC MAY have some success, just because it gets him
>talking to the girl.
Exactly. I had a breakthrough of sorts when hanging out with Juggler

in San Fran. He took my game BACKWARDS two steps. And that's a good
thing. We didn't use canned openers or routines. (In fact, sometimes
we tried to make it HARDER for ourselves--I tried to get HBs to come
up to Juggler while he was sarging and tell him that his boyfriend
wanted to have a word with him). We were just fearless, fun,
interesting, different, and had an outcome in mind when dealing with
HBs.
Anyway the point is this: ZEN AND THE ART OF THE PU. I realized that
the purpose of learning all these routines and gimmicks is so that one
day you can COMPLETELY THROW THEM OUT because you've internalized all
this stuff, learned how to talk to women, instinctually figured out
what it takes to get each one into bed, and become a true seducer
================================================================================
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 28 Mar 2002 21:10:00 GMT
subject: Re: Being Led Instead of Leading
On Thu, 28 Mar 2002 14:46:00 -0500, five683 wrote:
>I think I may have danced around this subject before, but I can't remember, so
>here I go:
>
>A major problem I seem to have is that I get led
>into someone else's state rather than being able to
>lead them into the state I want them to be in.
>
>I'm fine if the other person is in a good/happy mood, because then I'M also in
>a good/happy mood and my game is just SO on.....
>But...if the person is in a bad/bitchy mood, then I always seem to get drawn
>into that mood instead of turning them around to a more positive mood....

>
>Any advice on how correct this?
You're not doing anything wrong; it's just that you're halfway there.
Mirror, and then lead. Reflect their state--happy, bitchy,
whatever--as usual. Then shift your state into whatever you want the
two of you to feel. If you do this right, she will follow.
Experiment...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: Fucking her...
Thank God this board is here. It's amazing to me that there's no one
someone can talk about this stuff with, but it's true. So, if you
listen to any advice, listen to this (and Commander Zap's above):
If you don't have condoms already, go to a drugstore. Buy a big-ass

pack of latex condoms (for starters, lubricated and if you wanna be
extra safe, with nonoxynol-9. Trojan or Lifestyles are good enough.).
Don't be embarrassed to buy them, cause everyone will think you're
cool in reality for getting them.
Then USE THEM. I ALWAYS assume that any HB I'm with dated a junkie
before me so, until we get tested together, I ALWAYS have sex with a
condom on EVERY TIME. I'm not here learning all this stuff for
nothing: I'm in the game for the long haul, and I'm going to protect
myself accordingly. She's smart: she's asking "What will happen if I
get pregnant." (Your answer: "You won't be pregnant if nothing gets
inside you.") You should be smart too and asking "What will happen if
she has a disease or warts or some shit."
Next, put them EVERYWHERE where you might be getting laid (from your
wallet to the cracks in your bed between the mattress and the frame),
so that you always have easy access to them.
And, when you're in the heat of the moment and you're thinking that
maybe you just won't use a condom, remember this: you're excited, it's
your first time, and if you use a condom you're going to last longer.
Alright, let us know what happens and any questions!

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"Style" <0>
Sat, 30 Mar 2002 02:30:00 GMT
subject: Re: Values: power play
On Fri, 29 Mar 2002 19:57:00 -0500, V wrote:
>
>OK guys ... here's a tricky one.
>
>Say you ellicit a target's values and one of them is to feel powerful.
>
>Now, how do you massage that 'feeling powerful' thing but at the same time
>not give up the prize (retain independence from their power).
>
It's okay to let her THINK she's powerful, as long as you REMAIN in
control. See the chapter "Disarm through Strategic Weakness and
Vulnerability" in the book Art of Seduction.
"The best way not to raise suspicions is to make the other person
feeel superior and stronger. If you seem to be weak, vulnerable,
enthralled by the other person, and unable to control yourself, you
will make your actions look more natural, less calculated. Physical
weakness--ters, bashfulness, paleness--will help create the effect.
Play the victim, then transform your target's sympathy into love."
Not exactly what you had in mind, but may give you some ideas...
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 30 Mar 2002 22:33:00 GMT
subject: Re: RJ Lines
On Sat, 30 Mar 2002 04:56:00 -0500, sfpd wrote:
>I was wondering what everyone means when they refer to "RJ Lines" or "Ross
>Jeffries Lines".
When I say "RJ line," I'm trying to give credit where credit is due.

So, if I use a line of his (or anyone else's) in a PU and I post a

field report about it, I don't want to take credit for someone else's
good moves so I'll give them a shout-out. Because, well, they fucking
deserve it! So when I say " RJ line," it isn't shorthand for a certain
tactic or technique, but more like a footnote reference in a research
paper...
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 31 Mar 2002 19:33:00 GMT
subject: Re: need help quick
And, also, go to the alt.seduction.fast archives (or through deja) and

look up Mystery's strip club rules...
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 31 Mar 2002 19:43:00 GMT
subject: Re: Bad rumours
On Sun, 31 Mar 2002 13:24:00 -0500, marcc wrote:
>Does someone have suggestions about how I could cope with this problem? It
>really bothers me, and with some very social parents/aunts/uncles, shit might
>even happen that they hear about the story... and that would be NOT NOT good
>:'(
I've never been in this situation, thank God, but I do know someone
who was. A bs rumor was spread about him and a girl he'd slept with.
What he did was he called the girl and suggested they meet for coffee;
he then said that he had heard these rumors and he was very sincerely
upset, because the person in those rumors, as she knows, is not him.
He went on to go over the events of the night and say that it was a
very unusual but special evening, and discussed how considerate he is
during sex and attentive to her wishes and having consent (you could
refer to the attitude expressed in Riker's three rules here, and also
reinforce the point by saying that this was why you didn't have sex
with her or force anything). Anyway, what you want to do is to
befriend her and make sure that she sees that evening the way you

recall it. This way, if you ever hear something, you say, "That is
totally not true. You know how rumors are. You can even ask HB. In
fact, we're still friends. I don't think she'd still be friends with
me if something like that had really happened." If it's an HB, you can
add, "In fact, it was a really funny story, but, well, I don't kiss
and tell." Then let her force it out of you, and tell a version of the
story that shows a little humor and a little sensitivity and other
admirable traits that will actually turn the story around and actually
sell yourself.
PS I hope you used a CONDOM when you were trying to have sex with her
when she was on the rag!
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 31 Mar 2002 19:57:00 GMT
subject: Tips from a Natural GM
Last night, I spent time with a guy who is a natural GM and wanted to
mention some of his techniques here. He was an amazing PU, not to
mention a total asshole, but in a good way. We talked for a long time.
1. His attitude: I just bench-pressed the world.

2. His confidence: I deserve the best of everything.
3. His philosophy of women: They do NOT want freedom of choice, so
don't give it to them.
4. His approach: total negs. He is super-harsh, and doesn't apologize
for it. It's like he's always giving them a shit test, and if they can
put up with him just picking relentlessly at their weak spot and if
they have a sense of humor about it, he relents.
5. He also uses a LOT of sexual talk. Is very direct, then he says
"just kidding." And he's very firm and tactile when he talks, with men
and women: he touches them a lot to make sure he has their full
attention.
6. THE FLIP: Pay attention here closely, kids, because this is his
secret weapon. He either mentions the flip or just does it. And what
it is, basically, is him putting one arm along the person's stomach,
another along their back, and then just flipping them 360 degrees
around in the air, so that they land back on their feet. It's amazing:
gets a woman's blood pumping, surprises her, exciting, etc. He loves
doing it out of the blue when he's dancing with a woman, and then gets
the insta-DDB.
7. MORE PHYSICAL TRICKS: He loves just picking up (physically picking

up, that is) people and carrying them. Very obnoxious. But ONE great
move of his is he'll pick up someone out of the blue and then just
weigh them with his hands. Then he'll put them down and say "160?" or
whatever. Can work great as a kino-neg.
8. He has already taught himself so many of the tactics here. While
hitting on a woman, he's always accusing her of hitting on him. And it
just seems like it's his natural personality, so they never know if he
is REALLY hitting on them or not. When greeting women, sometimes he'll
just look at them, pause, and say, "you look good
today....congratulate yourself" (not sure if I like it, but it worked
for him).
9. He does not give a shit about what people think about him or
whether people hate him or not.
That's all. I'll post more about him if I remember and when I hang out
with him again.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 01 Apr 2002 19:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: Tips from a Natural GM
Okay, all you alphas. Scoff at the flip, but the shit works. He is
maybe 5'11" and medium-build, but not like what you'd consider a tough
guy or bouncer material or anything. And he can fight, and has punched
out guys before. His MO is basically that he is obnoxious and he
dances on the line of making you want to kick his ass. Everything he
does balances humor and aggression in just the right combination. It
DOES work for him. I saw him just mercilessly pick on this one blonde
actress wanna-be. He did not say one nice word to her and flipped her
and negged her. And ALL night she was hanging on his arm, trying to
win his approval, trying to go home with him. And HE completely blew
her off and didn't take her home..
(Side note: I have noticed that on nights when an HB's self-esteem is

shattered, she sometimes tries to win approval with a backup plan, her
body. Once I went out with an HB9 who got so drunk that when she was
dancing on a table, she fell off in the middle of a somewhat trendy
party. I scooped her up, didn't say a word to her, took her back to my
house, told her to sleep on the couch, and got into bed. She crawled
in with me minutes later.)

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"Style" <0>
Mon, 01 Apr 2002 19:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Return of HB Lipstick
Nice job. One suggestion. Do not try to talk an HB into kissing you,
making her promise, getting her consent, speaking in terms of logic
and bargains. Just take her and kiss her. It's what they call the art
of the bold move in some places; it's what my Natural GM calls taking
away free choice from HBs, because they don't want it. If you know
you're in, just * her. Or play with the tension for a while, hold out
on her. In my opinion, HBLipstick did want to kiss you the WHOLE time.
You just had to make the move in the right time, the right place, and
with the right confidence. Of course, you got the f-close anyway, it
seems, so it didn't matter in this case.
But, what you did do right (though you probably could have gotten away
with more) is to punish when she didn't. Just give her negative body
language and stop talking--not in a spoiled brat way, but either in a
teasing way (my style) or in a subtle nonchalant way (more Mystery's
style).
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 02 Apr 2002 21:06:00 GMT
subject: How to tell if a HB wants out of LJBF-land
God, this is a stupid question, but here goes:
Lately, in my new seducer state, I notice that HBs who I had been
"friends" with previously now seem much more interested in me. The
question is this: What IOIs should you look for to tell if an HB you
are friends with is interested in having MORE with you?
Obviously, they are not going to jump on top of me or do anything

obvious. So I'm curious how I can test the waters, and make sure that
they are interested, before moving forward with a full-on PU. IOIs to
look for? Kino tests to give them? Subtle SOIs to see how they respond
to? What?

I'm seeing one today and another on Friday. And I feel like it's time
to start closing them...
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 02 Apr 2002 21:11:00 GMT
subject: Re: Tips from a Natural GM
>CP!
>
>You found your edge! Although, you may have to pick up very small women.
Hey. Beneath this slender frame lie the muscles of a circus strongman.
>But in all seriousness, even though you are naturally a good guy I could
>actually see you getting away with this attitude.
I know. What you said in your other post was RIGHT ON! I'm going to
try to work more of this in. (Did you see the funny SF pictures of
Leftcoast's in the lounge?)
>I'll just loan you my goon in case anyone wants to kick your ass.
Yes, please. In fact, maybe I can ask the HBs to close their eyes
while I flip them, and then the goon can do the work for me.
>BTW: You were right CP, a certain someone called me out of the blue this
>weekend.
Aha! I knew it! That's awesome!!
>Oh and also I've been thinking. When we sarge the old-folks home, does
pinching
>their oxygen tubes count as a neg?
LMFAO!
Yes, but ONLY if they USED TO BE 9's or 10's in the 1950's. Beauty may
be fleeting, but bitch shields last a lifetime.
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 03 Apr 2002 20:31:00 GMT
subject: Re: Alpha transformation
On Wed, 03 Apr 2002 10:16:00 -0500, Sandstorm wrote:
><straif> wrote in message news:14256.2226@discussion.fastseduction.com...

><snip>
>
>You are confusing "alpha" with "the jerk." Alpha does not mean beating up
>anyone who opposes you, it simply means being a "man's man" and making
>everyone that you come in contact with feel good about themselves, unless
>they try your patience, in which case it is time to step up and make them
>look stupid.
>
>... Chris
Lots of nice advice in these posts. Let me add one more distinction
that may help. And, from the tone of your post, I think this is an
important point for you to internalize:
Being alpha means not being afraid that others might not like you,
but, at the same time, knowing that you are in essence a very likable
person who people want to be around and listen to.
... The Other Chris
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 03 Apr 2002 20:44:00 GMT
subject: Re: Juggling + More
On Wed, 03 Apr 2002 11:34:00 -0500, downy wrote:
> Hey, I've been lurking here for a month, and this is my first post.
>I have three things to discuss:
>
> 1 - Since reading the ASF materials, I've improved my game a lot.
>Before ASF, I had a lot of good traits (cocky, funny, outgoing), but
>always held back from getting sexual, I never took my sarges past the EV
>point, and rarely did kino. For this reason, I have a healthy supply of
>what I'll call "stale prospects", girls who were interested in me, but

>probably figure I'm gay or something now. Do I have better prospects

>with these girls, because of my early charm, or worse, because of my
>unmanly hesitation? What can I do to wring some ass out of this
>situation?
The general advice on this board is to eject and find new prospects.
Plus, it's easier to be the NEW you around other people. However, I'd
suggest two things: Use these "stale prospects" to practice your
techniques and patterns on, since it doesn't matter. And, two, try
withdrawing yourself suddenly from a stale prospect who you're very
close to. See if she chases after you, then go into PU mode.
>2 - I'm a university student, in Toronto, and I've found that a lot of
>the girls who are in my social circle are what I would call "nice
>girls". Probably the female equivalent of an AFC. These girls are
>intelligent, interesting, and very self confident. I'm attracted to this
>type, but there's a problem. They're pretty feminist, and that, coupled
>with their confidence, means that if I appear to be a "player", they'll
>have none of it. They seem to place an irrational emphasis on monogamy,
>and have a negative/twisted view of male sexuality (one I shared in my
>AFC days). Can I break them down? These girls aren't fluffballs, they
>don't seem the type to necessarily accept the kinds of rationalizations
>given in this news group, if they've already made up their minds. Should
>I take my time and do it slowly, or is time wasting my enemy.
Smart, nice, interesting, confident girls make the best targets. Who
wants to sarge the opposite: dumb, mean, boring, and insecure. At the
same time, I think you're putting these girls ona pedestal. "These
girls" are the same as most of the rest of the girls we sarge. I've
sarged feminists who PRETEND to be man-haters and gotten the
lay--using the same techniques I always use BUT not supplicating to
their bs image of men.
And, listen, don't worry about getting a bad rep as long as you follow
RJ's advice: Leave them BETTER than you found them. Make sure you
follow up with the girls you lay, make them feel like they did the
right thing, give them more if you want to, and they'll be sayin ggood
things to their friends instead. But, dude, ERASE this worry from your
head. It will hold you back: Learn your GAME first, then deal with
this.
>3 - I have a date this evening with one such "nice girl" (east indian,
>this may matter), and though I have "kept my value" through our previous
>encounters, I can tell she's scoping me for BF material. I have a date
>tomorrow with another girl, who is just a FB. HBNicegirl doesn't know
>about my FB, and I don't think I've set her up properly to accept an

>"open" relationship. I'm leaving town in a month, and could probably

>talk her into "seizing the moment" and having a casual relationship, but
>I just don't think she'd accept another girl in the picture. I
>....could... lie.... but...
Dude, I can see where you are going wrong here. I used to think this
too. Not all girls are "nice girls." Girls who are socially programmed
to be nice ESPECIALLY have hidden fantasies. Read My Secret Garden by
Nancy Friday (thanks, Swinggcat, for recommending this): It's all
about women's hidden sexual fantasies. Use it to start a convo.
I think you need to internalize this more--mrsex4unyc's attitude

(download his posts) and Ross J's mechanisms for bypassing social
programming and triggering desire.
>Here's the kicker...

>I have this nosy-ass housemate, who knows about both girls. I'm just
>***ing sure that if I bring both of them home, she's going to
>"accidentally" let it slip. And we can't go to their places... they have
>roommates.
Again, cross this bridge WHEN and IF you come to it. And, if you do
HAPPEN to bring both girls home and your housemate lets it slip,
that's great PR for you. It makes you seem desired and like a limited
opportunity. Just either answer vaguely or have a reframing response
ready.
>So, what's the call, o wise ASF?
The call is this: get out and sarge, and get rid of these irrational
thoughts, because you are mentally going to eliminate your desire to
succeed because it'll seem easier and less trouble to fail.
>Evil is also my middle name....
I have a feeling it really isn't, but you're working on it :)
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 03 Apr 2002 20:56:00 GMT
subject: Dealing Out Compliments
I haven't seen this dealt with anywhere, but after reading the Art of

Seduction and just being in situations with HB's where I know that
flattery will get me everywhere, I am beginning to believe that there
is a TIME and a PLACE for COMPLIMENTS during the PU. (I am writing
this post because a lot of ASF material strongly advises against this,
and I wiped it out of my game, but now I am starting to see its
strategic uses.)
These don't have to be supplicating compliments, but sincere ones that

drive you towards your intended outcome. They must come AFTER an HB is
interested or intrigued by you--during a phase shift in a PU, before
or after your first kiss, on your first meeting, or at any point
later. And, just a thought, maybe they can be more than just a simple
one-line, but even more flattering. Last night, I did this and I saw
the HB just glow more and more as I talked. This was because an HB
wants to know that you DESIRE her because of WHO SHE IS. This is why
PUA's always get the LMR line of "I bet you do this all the time" or
"why are you kissing me?" She wants to know that SHE is special.
In addition, when you compliment, then you can do a takeaway right

there or later on, and increase her desire to attract you because
she'll want to lure you back now.
So, to discuss: When to use compliments? How to use compliments? What

(sincere) compliments to use?
Does anyone here use strategic compliments in their game?
Note: I am talking here about compliments during the PU, not in

openers and approaches.
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 03 Apr 2002 22:58:00 GMT
subject: Re: How to approach in drive thrus?
On Wed, 03 Apr 2002 08:48:00 -0500, yaritai wrote:
>Could it be that it was the way you walked up? I mean, did you sprint or
>something? ;-) Did you kinda look menacing? Perhaps you could have honked
>your horn lightly first or something to get her attention before going. The
>way your post reads, you surprised her?
>

I think this had a lot to to with it. Very important: Were you
smiling?
Imagine, if a guy walks up to your car and isn't smiling: scary.

Guy walks up and is smiling naturally and easily: reassuring,
harmless.
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 04 Apr 2002 04:52:00 GMT
subject: Re: Dealing Out Compliments
On Wed, 03 Apr 2002 18:29:00 -0500, AllWeatherGal wrote:
>
>Use comments that make her feel "closer" to you rather than "observed."
(Course
>I can't think of a better way to phrase that since I'm female, but I hope it's
>understandable.)
This is a GREAT insight! Should go in the FAQ almost. It's changed my

thinking just by reading it. Any good examples?
Also, on a different note, I noticed that on the more "shallow" and

"surface" compliments side (which isn't really what we're talking
about in this thread), it's better to compliment on something a woman
notices than on what a guy notices. Listen to the way women compliment
each other (when they're NOT being competetive with each other), they
are on things that a guy COMPLETELY doesn't notice. Start noticing
these things and you'll stand out.
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 05 Apr 2002 01:21:00 GMT
Good stuff here. If anyone else here has examples of compliments

they've used just PRIOR to or just AFTER the *Close, I'd love to hear
them!

See more notes below...
>Soooooooo many excellent comments here.

>
>I've also found that "surface" compliments don't work.
>ANYbody can walk up to someone and say, "Wow, you have pretty eyes." or "Gosh
>you have beautiful hair."
>(not that any of the men here would actually say "Gosh"..lol)
While this is true, I find that there are two different compliment
phases. There is, if she's NOT a 9.5 or 10, the approach or opener
compliment, which is usually more surface. Then there's the compliment
you make during seduction, which, as noted above, should be something
that shows a real appreciation of who she is.
However, I have found that SINCERE surface compliments are important

to my game in some cases. For example, at a party a few nights ago, I
just improvised an on-the-spot opener for a two-set. It was kind of
weak, to tell the truth. But one of the girls said, "You're cute." I
said, "You're cute too." She replied, "You're just saying that."
So I said, "You're right. Let me give you a very sincere compliment."

Then I paused and looked at her for a while and said, "You seem like
you have a very good heart." And she replied, "You're right, but it
gets me into trouble sometimes." And BAM--there's my opening for
convo, and we're off. (I #closed, and could have *closed if her
friends weren't around. My fault for not isolating.)
And last night, too, I told an HB, after the opener, "Most people
can't pull off those kinds of shirts, where just one shoulder is
exposed. It's something about the assymetry. But it actually works on
you." Then, the HB I was with said to her: "I was just about to say
the same thing." So, as noted in my previous post, if you are going to
make a surface compliment, notice something a woman would notice. IOW,
if she's wearing a glittering gold, low-cut top, comment on her SHOES
or her NAILS--not the loud top.
CPowles
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Fri, 05 Apr 2002 15:29:30 GMT
subject: Re: Hey--anybody get laid so far this year?

"trickynick" <trickynick_pdx@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<U5Tq8.165923$ZR2.83623@rwcrnsc52.

ops.asp.att.net>...
> > If so, for this group, its a miracle!!!!!! If not, stop horsing around on
> > USENET, and get out there!
>
> Can't speak for anyone but myself and I have plenty, however I bet Ray gets
> more pussy than any of us! LOL!!!!
Yeah, from his mom!
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 06 Apr 2002 03:27:00 GMT
On Fri, 05 Apr 2002 03:59:00 -0500, David Shade wrote:
>Chris,
>This reminds me of the conversation that you and I had at the Colonial
>restaurant in San Francisco three weeks ago with Wolf and Uberguy and a few
>others, when I described to you my feelings on seduction as influenced by
Major
>Mark.
Yes, this is what got me thinking along these lines.
>
>You may remember me telling you that giving a woman a compliment is the best
>way to weed out the low self esteem women. They cannot handle a compliment
>because it is incongruent with their identity, and it breaks rapport, as it
>should. Giving a woman a compliment is the best way to reveal the high self
>esteem women. They take a compliment well because it is congruent with their
>good identity, and it makes them feel better about you, and it increases
>rapport, as it should.
I agree with this--of course, if it's a sincere compliment delivered

without lust. And if I had known this, I probably could have avoided a
certain self-destructive relationship with a very beautiful but very
insecure woman who couldn't take a compliment.
>You may also remember me saying that seduction is all about rewarding her
>proper behavior. When she responds to you, or indicates increased interest in

>you, you reward her proper behavior. One way to do that is with a genuine
>compliment. When a compliment is delivered as a response to her behavior, it
>is taken with respect, it makes her feel better about what she did, and it
>demonstrates to her what expected proper behavior is.
Yes, I REALLY like this frame.
>I also said that seduction is all ABOUT HER. By responding to HER it IS about
>her, as it should be. It is not about you, or your 'material.' The really
>worthy ones will provide all the material you will ever need. They just have
>to be shown that they will be rewarded for their investment.
>
>And as I posted to asf a long time ago, when she pays you a compliment, do not
>respond back with the same compliment. That cheapens her compliment. To
truly
>reward her, give her what she really wants by replying with "Wow, I really
>appreciate that. That makes me feel really good." A woman wants to be
>appreciated and she wants to make you feel good. Let it be known that you are
>the man she can enjoy that with.
Yes, I remember discussing just this. Funny that I blew it in the

moment and did exactly the opposite. It's now internalized...
>And finally, I also described to you that a compliment is a good opener, even
>in a night club, even on a 10, IF it is delivered with ABSOLUTE SINCERITY.
>Women respond to sincerity, and the really good ones respond to a sincere
>compliment. Such sincerity will instantly open up a high self esteem woman
>because she wants to let in, and respond to, and have in her life, absolute
>sincerity.
I can see this. I don't make the compliment/observation approaches

that you do, but I do use them after the opener. I'll try starting
witht his foot forward, as long as, like you say, it's sincere and
original.
I think that a lot of ASF reading has put out a certain mindset that
compliment = supplication. This doesn't have to be true, and maybe
what some of us need to do more often is, like you say, to sincerely
compliment at the right time to reward behavior that will help sustain
and deepen our relationship. The right compliment, I've noticed, can
give a woman physiological reaction--a glow, trance, a DDB, and all
those other things we love here on the boards.
Finally, Yaritai, I think to sincerely appreciate a woman's ass or

legs in a non-lustful, non-threatening way is okay. My natural GM
friend delivers compliments like these, then pauses, and says,

deadpan, "Congratulate yourself."
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 06 Apr 2002 03:40:00 GMT
subject: Deep fundamental change
After having met a lot of people in the seduction community in the few
months I've been doing this stuff, I find that it's easy to learn and
know all the material. What is hard is to make the deep changes, on an
identity level, that turn one into a true PUA.
These include: developing and displaying a full personality (which

includes humor, creativity, romance, intelligence, mystery, and so
on), developing a sense of total confidence, eliminating fear and
insecurities, letting go of worries about outcomes and how others see
you, walking through the world as a man who is not afraid to take up
space, being a naturally outgoing or humorous person, truly listening
and understanding others when they speak, standing in a way that
reflects a man of stature, exuding the aura of an active desirable
male, being an interesting conversationalist, speaking in a clear
intense fashion that commands attention, believing that you can have
and deserve the best the world has to offer, looking in the mirror and
seeing a man who woman can and do love, etc., etc.
So, I want to ask those here an IMPORTANT QUESTION: how many of you,
as a result of your seduction studies, have been able to made DEEP
changes at the CORE of who you are? How many of you have truly changed
as a person? And, if you have made a deep fundamental change in who
you are and how you present yourself to the world, HOW have you
brought this change about in yourself?
P.S. It is interesting to note that these identity-level changes not

only make one a better seducer, they make one a better person. Agree?
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 06 Apr 2002 19:43:00 GMT
subject: Re: Deep fundamental change

Bastian,
This is a GREAT post. It's clear, it's well-written, and, most

important, it's VERY true. The techniques will only get you so far.
Looking in the mirror and seeing a confident seducer who woman desire
and guys respect and everyone wants to listen to will take you the
rest of the way. The techniques are only to help you get there, the
successes will help you get there, the positive visualizations will
help you get there. All good points, Bastian! And I truly believe
that, for most people here, unless they can make these changes at a
deep level, they are NOT going to ever become a PUA.
For myself, a lot of people around me are noticing that I'm different
now. First, I went to a party, and a FB asked: "What are you saying to
my friends when you sit and talk to them? They're so fascinated in
whatever it is you're saying." Then it was friends saying, "Wow, you
look good. So much better than when I say you last." (Even though the
only difference was my confidence and attitude.) More recently, an old
girl who LJBF-ed me said, "I don't like you anymore. You're like a
real asshole now. You used to be so sweet. I'm sure it attracts a lot
of women, but I don't like it." The funny thing is that NOW she is
attracted to me: by being what she perceives as an asshole then being
the sweet guy again after that (push-pull), I now have her wanting
me--so I got to LJBF her. LOL!
Anyway, the reason I've been thinking about this is because I

sometimes still have AFC reversion syndrome, especially when I'm
around people I knew pre-ASF. The seducer is still something I turn on
and off--sometimes the switch is in my control, sometimes it isn't.
I'd like that switch to be ON all the time.
Anyway, perfect post, Bastian. Sorry you had to write it twice...
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 06 Apr 2002 19:51:00 GMT
subject: Re: Sex defences
Dude, this HURTS to read. Of course, I've been there sometimes. In

fact, to tell the truth, I was there last night. Total AFC reversion
syndrome, but ended up with the *close anyway. I just executed it
poorly. I don't have much time now, but a couple quick thoughts:

Yes, logic doesn't work. Don't try to talk a chick into something.
She wanted to kiss you the whole time. So there comes a time when you
have to just shut up and kiss her. To do that, you have to make her
feel relaxed, then make her feel a charged silence/slowing down, then
kiss her.
Also, I feel that you are envisioning failure in your head. This makes
it hard to get what you want. You are envisioning failure so much that
you're trying to talk her out of it. Come from a position of ASSUMING
that she wants to kiss you.
She was giving off "undecisive" vibes because you were "undecisive"
about whether you thought you could kiss her or not. She was mirroring
you, you were mirroring her. Bad loop. You should learn some Ross
stuff, and reframe her energy and put it in a good direction that will
make her feel relaxed and excited.
FInally, I am very jealous of you: knowing how to play Leonard Cohen

and Jeff Buckley on guitar! That is a dangerous weapon. How well does
it work for you?
On Sat, 06 Apr 2002 14:06:00 -0500, Chris Evil wrote:
>Can someone help me with a weird failure?

>
>
> Chatting with HBindia in a coffee shop, over apple cider, and I get to
>"Love and Relationships". Turns out, she just broke up with a long term
>boyfriend, and doesn't want a relationship. In my AFC days, that would
>have been it, but I challenge her mindset. First, I find out wither "no
>relationship" means LJBF, or LJFuck... it means LJBF. So, I tell her
>that, "I too consider myself a free spirit", and I like the single life
>too, life is short, I don't date friends, yada yada yada. I'm winging
>it, and doing an all right job, but I don't have much practice, and it
>doesn't come out too smooth.
>
> We leave the coffee shop, and I ask her to come back to my place for
>tea. She looks hesitant, and I tell her something to the effect that
>"I'm not going to take any physical stuff for granted, but if you're
>afraid I'll seduce you, you shouldn't come(insert charming smile" . She
>comes...
>Chatting, drinking tea, and I'm doing kino and so forth, but she's
>rigid, and I feel my advances are a bit unwelcome. Should I continue to
>kino in this situation? Or give the girl her space.
>I play her some songs on the guitar (Leonard Cohen+Jeff Buckley =
>industrial strength panty remover), and chat and trying to break down

>her sexual standoffishness. These are the main mistakes I can think of -
>
> 1- I'm a very logical guy... I think I was arguing with her left
>brain, not her right (left being the math/logic one, I think). How do
>you break down a woman's sex-defences, when they're irrational? Can
>someone give me an example of a pattern/argument that will do this
>reliably?
>
> 2- She asked me why I picked her up in the club... I told her it was
>because she didn't look like the other hoochie types in the bar. Should
>I have run the Incredible Connection pattern? For the sake of honesty, I
>prefer to give girls the "life is short, have fun" line for why they
>should sleep with me. "Sleep with me because you'll enjoy it, and I'm
>the kind of guy who will treat you with respect, while treating you like
>a woman". Saying that I feel like there's some "incredible connection"
>between myself and a woman feels a bit manipulative, and is a bit
>incongruent with the "I'm a free spirit" mentality. I'm wary of creating
>irrational expectations of monogamy in a woman.
>
>Shortly before she left, she told me "If you'd just made it easier on
>me, we'd be making out now".... what does that mean!?! I was being
>forward and direct, but the resistance I got was flaky and inconsistent.
>She was giving off indecisive vibes, and I was (unapologetic ally)
>trying to lead her to my favored decision. Too upfront and logical?
>
>Finally, she had to leave, and I asked her for a kiss good bye. We
>kissed for at least 2 minutes, before she pulled away and said "I have
>to go now". She was totally hot and bothered, which was a total contrast
>from the standoffishness of just 10 minutes earlier.
>
>So? Any comments? When she left, the idea was that she'd call me when
>"she was ready" for a relationship. I know that was a cop out, but I
>wasn't getting anywhere and had decided to next her. Then she gave me
>that kiss. Should I call her? When? And say what? Have I messed it up,
>or do I just need to go into another date with a different attack plan?
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 06 Apr 2002 22:30:00 GMT
subject: Re: Sex defences
Let me just add the advice from my Natural GM friend: A woman does not

want freedom of choice; do not give it to her. Do not let her choose.
Once you know she's interested, choose for her. (But obviously keep in
the bonds of consenual lovin'.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 07 Apr 2002 20:15:00 GMT
subject: Re: How NOT to cross the
On Sat, 06 Apr 2002 23:46:00 -0400, Signore wrote:
>Ricki Lake Opener:

>
>Have your wingman go up to the target group and say "My friend needs some
>advice...he got a call from the producers of the ricki lake show and they
>invited him on. The thing is he thinks this girl is his secret admirer and
>they are going to have her confess his feelings for him!" Then the wingman
>chats with them for a little and soon calls you over. Play along and voila.
>
Credit for this opener, to the best of my knowledge, goes to Hollywood

(or Vinigar), who shared it with myself and Mys in New York.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 07 Apr 2002 20:23:00 GMT
subject: Re: Field Report - SUCCESS!!!
A quick note on the Pez opener: When you do it, make sure you take a
Pez yourself first and eat it. This is because, of course, people are
paranoid about taking candy from strangers in society today, so this
subtly lets them know that the Pez is really just Pez.
Nice job getting the #close. But do you know what? When she asked:
>Her: Really? And what types of documentaries do you like?
That was a huge IOI. She was interested in you from the get-go. Now
that you've got openers down and a conversational thread down, learn
to get out of fluff talk and into more seductive topics. I'm willing
to bet that with a few more seduction tools and months of practice &
study at your disposal, you could have had a nice *close from her

too.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 08 Apr 2002 01:22:00 GMT
subject: Re: How NOT to cross the
On Sun, 07 Apr 2002 16:44:00 -0400, Alessandro wrote:
>LOL Chris, don't tell me you don't invent thousands of little oppeners
>like that on the fly.
>
>I heard the "Riki Lake" thing way before I even found ASF, man, back
>in high school, when Jerry Springer used to come on 11 pm.
>
Alessandro, you are a strange cat. Seriously, dude, I enjoy reading

your posts, because there's something a little different about you and
the way you see the world--and I bet that sometimes this helps your
game and sometimes it hinders it. Anyway, while I do believe that you
had heard of the Rikki Lake SHOW back in the days of Jerry Springer
being at 11 p.m., I find it hard to believe that you heard the Rikki
Lake OPENER. My first clue to this comes in your post, where you say
the opener was taught and demonstrated to you. My second clue comes in
the fact that it's not in the archives at all.
Oh, and I do invent thousands of little openers on the fly. Oh shit, I

feel another one coming on. "Excuse me, but is there any shaving cream
still on my face?" I'll field test it for you tonight, unless you
already heard it in high school, back in the day when Edge was 99
cents a can.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 08 Apr 2002 02:17:20 GMT
subject: Re: ROSS JEFFRIES, YOUR PERSONAL JESUS
Odious <Odious@cox.net> wrote in message news:<3CB0B197.F64C6456@cox.net>...

> Mark poulson wrote:
>>

> > to odius for that post - "I WILL BUGGER YOU AND STUFF YOUR GOB".
Oh great, we've got a Latin nerd on our hands. That quote is lifted
right from Catullus. Hey, Markie baby let me give you a hint, if you
want to emulate any dead poets go for Ovid not Catullus. Ovid was a
mack who complained how he couldn't settle down because he loved all
women. Catullus was a whining sissy-boy who wrote annoying poems
about how he couldn't get a married woman to love him back. And then
when his critics called him an annoying sissy-boy (which he was) he
threatened them by saying in another poem "I'll bugger you and stuff
your gob". Like you. And that loser Ray. So instead of threats and
crap like that let's keep to constructive posts that are on topic,
capeesh?
TigerStyle
-"Life's too short to dance with ugly women."
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 08 Apr 2002 18:55:00 GMT
subject: Re: Angles for HBSpock type chicks
A few thoughts and tips here:
1. I probably would NOT have gone to visit her at work. First, you've
got the obstacle of not being able to go kino on a kinaesthetic HB.
Second, since she works at a strip club, now you have to fight off the
fact that she may now see you as just another customer hitting on her
(even though i'm sure you didn't buy anything there--I would have done
my waitress neg by NOT buying a drink from her, then actually buying
one from the bar or another waitress and saying, "sorry, i got thirsty
and couldn't find you.") Finally, I do not like to visit HB's at work
OR even call them there, because when I'm operating, I want their FULL
attention. In this case, if you're going to visit her at work, you
have two choices: A. Do it after you're fucking. Or B. Give up on her,
and use her as a pivot and social proof to meet other strippers.
So, I'm not so sure it was the right thing to meet her at the strip
club, but it's done and I think you can get over it. My MO here would
be to invite her and her friends to something special: bar, club, or
party, but something a little cool and out-of-the-ordinary that an HB
will for sure say YES to. Try and make her even ditch work, so that

she feels she has to make the night "worth it." Then, I'd bring along
a pivot for many reasons: A. To surprise and confuse her (a 101 in
itself, with other 101 opportunities) B. Social proof and C. To
fractionate from her group. and D. To wing the group when you isolate,
esp if she decides to bring only ONE friend.
2. Here, for your benefit and everyone else's, is my favorite bf

destroyer:
"I'm going to ask you some questions. But instead of answering with
words, I want you to answer with your hand. If what I ask you about is
very very close to your heart, put your hand right here. (I hold my
hand up to my nose.) If what I ask you about is very far away from
you or your heart, hold your hand out here (I stretch my arm out
straight in front of me and hold my hand up, parallel to my nose.) If
it's inbetween, hold it somewhere inbetween. Okay?
"How close is your work to you?" (Usually she'll hold her hand out
pretty far from her nose.)
"How close is your boyfriend to you?" (Usually she'll hold her hand
out three or four inches in front of her nose. I've only had THREE HBs
put their hands on their noses here: one was lying and didn't even
have a BF--I was winging a friend who wasn't doing so well--and two
WERE really into their bfs.)
"How close is your family to you?" (Usually she'll put her hand right
on her nose. If not, or if I feel like the HB will understand the
question, I'll ask, "How important is being creative and the things
you are really passionate about to you?")
Now, here's where the genius part comes in: "What if someone were to
offer you a job that was RIGHT HERE. (You hold your hand up in front
of her, midway between her nose and the place where she put her job).
Would you leave your job and take it instead?... (hb: yes.) Of course
you would."
"Now...what if you were to meet a guy..who was...RIGHT HERE. (Put YOUR

hand right ON her nose. If you want, feel free to slip in any extra SS
language to the question. Then DON'T wait for her answer, because it's
already obvious because she's already ratified it with her previous
answer. Just wait for a millisecond to watch the EFFECT sink in.
Sometimes you can see a BF being destroyed in her complexion as it
pales. THEN, just start talking about something else altogether. Your
work is done.)

TROUBLESHOOTING: If she happens to say that her boyfriend is as close

to her as her nose, then say, at the end, "But it is not possible at
all for you to ever have a better bf. Because he is right here (touch
nose). That's a rare thing..." Then, if you think she really has a BF,
go into your favorite BF destroyer: what I'll do in this case is just
tell a story about a friend with the perfect bf, and about how great
and trouble free their relationship is, and all the considerate things
he does for her, and how they can fill in each other's sentences (To
hb: Can you guys do that?) until it makes her bf pale in comparison.
FINAL NOTE: If you think she's bs'ing about the bf, just don't bring
it up again. But, somewhere during the night, tell her about a friend
of yours who is a stripper and says she is engaged to all the
customers. Tell it like you approve of and understand the idea,
because it weeds out the losers from the really worthwhile guys. Then
don't say ANYTHING about her and her "bf": just drop it, because
she'll sort of know you're on to her but still not be totally sure.
Plus, now you're the "worthwhile guy."
A NOTE AFTER THE FINAL NOTE: Maybe this is just something I like to
harp on, but have you demonstrated any VALUE to her? Shown her that
you're different from all the other guys, given her an ADDED reason to
call you besides just your interesting personality and turn of speech?
This seems important to hook her here, because I sense flake
potential...
I could go on forever, but hope this helps. Good luck, and keep us
updated!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
Fri, 12 Apr 2002 19:35:04 GMT
subject: Re: Women make me sick
"EG Smooth" <egsmooth2002@yahoo.cum> wrote in message news:<iAvt8.11240$Gl6.5930@sccrnsc01>...

> They don't want nice guys, and it's so pathetic. Least they could do is
> tell the truth.
The way I think about it is like this:

Women may be opportunistic, underhanded, and liars...but that's no
reason to hate them.

Men that go around and say they hate women because they lie are no
better than women who go around saying they hate men because all they
think about is sex.
The problem with both viewpoints is that they show a lack of

willingness to FUCKING GET OVER IT and work around the problem.
So what if women lie and don't want nice guys? Maybe you shouldn't be
such a supplicating pansy. Women do want nice guys, but only if they
show backbone every now and then. The reason women are attracted to
bad-boys is because of confidence. If you can be confidence and nice,
great. If you lack confidence then you're out of luck.
I've seen people on this board say all sorts of things like "women are
cunts, whores, and bitches" and I think people who say these things
are sad, pathetic losers, who can't accept things for what they are.
They are being frustrated by circumstance because they can't control
their own situation.
Once you accept that women lie, you're in a position to do something

about it. When they lie, call them out. If they deny it tell them:
"now you're lying again- I don't speak to liars", and cut them off.
Force them in a position where they owe you an apology. If a women
sees that you are going to buy every fucking lie she tells you, then
she'll walk all over you...even if she are a "guy-friend" of hers and
someone she "has feelings for but not romantically". I tell you one
thing- you're not going to change the world by bitch about it.
-TigerStyle
"life's too short to dance with ugly women."
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sat, 13 Apr 2002 23:28:09 GMT
subject: Re: best advice ever:don't masterbate-get laid!
Peter Kerner <vze2dkbn@verizon.net> wrote in message news:<3CB84BBA.FBF2F04F@verizon.net>...

> YOSSI IS RIGHT
>
> yossi wrote:
>
> > Hi all

> > The formula goes:

> > don't mesterbate=get laid.
> > masterbate=don't get laid,masterbate more,masterbate more=don't get
> > laid,masterbate more and on and on..
Heh, check out this website for a more in-depth coverage on the same
topic. There's also a link to it on Maniac's page:
http://www.geocities.com/how2getlaid2002/
-TigerStyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 15 Apr 2002 00:30:44 GMT
subject: Re: Eddie Z: Will your woman LET you answer?
Ray, do all of us a favor and shut your fucking cum-hole for a change.
Reading your posts is tiresome and it's distracting the entire board
from any productive conversation.
You've got nobody fooled, we all know you're a loser who lives with
his mommy. Most people with any decency would be embarassed Ray, but
you have no sense of shame. You contribute nothing meaningful to the
board. But you're addicted to being an obnoxious asshole, you're
addicted to your own ranting. Do us all a favor and go away, for a
while at least. Stop the threats, the rants, and the promises you
never back up. We will all be happier.
-Tigerstyle
"Life's too short to dance with ugly women."
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 15 Apr 2002 00:53:00 GMT
subject: Re: Crazy Idea: 100 approaches in 1 day(?)
On Sun, 14 Apr 2002 14:06:00 -0400, Ice_Smooth223 wrote:
>On 4/14/02 2:42:00 AM, RAFC_London wrote:

>>Hey Rick,
>>
>>I remember your post entitled
>>"Crazy Idea: 100 approaches in
>>1 day"? Did you ever do this?
>>What were the results... I'm
>>sure that I'm not the only one
>>to be wondering!
>>
>>---
>>RAFC_London
Thought for the day: was talking with some PUAs. We all used to say
that this was a numbers game. Once you get good, though, it's a
"target selection" game. In other words, it's only a numbers game
until you get to the level where you can choose and PU the HB in the
area that YOU want. Then it's quality, not quantity.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 15 Apr 2002 01:52:00 GMT
subject: From eject to LMR
Here's an interesting one. The lesson learned from this is: do not
eject, even when a PU is going bad, if you think that just for a
moment you can open the window into intimacy later in the "date."
Other similar experiences when terrible "dates" have turned into lays
later that night have taught me this. Maybe it's the whole push-pull
thing.
Anyway...
I met HBRedhead in a club. I posted it under "two funny stories,"

because I was goofing off in a wig and fake lip piercings and didn't
expect to be making out. Anyway, we tried for weeks to get together
and our schedules were too busy. In fact, our phone rapport was
terrible and I was starting to feel like an AFC for trying too hard to
make a plan with her. So, last weekend, we made a plan for Sunday. She
called at the last minute to say that a bunch of things had come up. I
told her that her excuse was pretty weak, and just went cold on the
phone, so that she knew her behavior was unacceptable. In my tone and
in my mind, she was ejected.

So, I leave town for a few days, and she emails me saying she feels
terrible and, to make it up to me, she'll pick me up at the airport. I
tell her that it's a step in the right direction. She tries to make me
go with her on some long-distance errands when we talk to arrange a
meeting time and place at the airport. I tell her that I don't want to
be multi-tasked. If we spend time together, I want all of her
attention.
So she picks me up. The convo in the car is terrible. I've never dealt
with this type of girl before, but it is impossible to get any
rapport.
Example:
Redhead: I like that calm, peaceful feeling.
Me: Yeah, feeling peaceful is important.
Redhead: No, it's not important, I just like it.
Me: Okay, so you like that peaceful feeling.
Redhead: No, I like more of a feeling when you're just totally calm
and relaxed.
Me (in my head): [that's what I just fucking said!]
In other words, whenever I tried to agree with her, restate something,

feeback a value to her, tell her something about herself, or establish
authority over her world, she would totally respond with "no, you're
wrong" and then restate exactly what I had said. I've never dealt with
this before, because it was even worse than a polarity responder. Is
there a name for this type of person? (I can hear Sandstorm's joke
coming already.)
I was thinking in my head: "get rid of her" on the whole ride back to
my place. However, I have learned that the PU isn't over until the PUA
decides it is. So we drop our stuff at my house, I show her around,
and we sit on the couch. We talk, I mirror her, we slowly move closer,
and I tell her a tale by a short-story writer that has become a good
part of my game (I'll post it later, too tired now). I notice that she
doesn't want to get up from the couch. IOW, the window has opened.
So I go in and kiss. We make out for a while. Then I say that I'm
tired, and she seems tired too. I suggest we take a nap, set the alarm
for an hour from now and then maybe get some food. "Do you think
you'll be able to sleep with me there?" she asks. I tell her that I
think so (ha).
We get into bed. She is super-responsive. Whenever I touch her

breasts, she just goes into convulsions. She says that she can cum
just from me touching them. She keeps stopping and asking questions

("what does your dad do for work?" "do you have any brothers?") I'm
sure most of you know this already: but this is just a sign that an HB
is interested, but needs the illusion that she knows you first.
So here's where I begin to lose control of the situation: she says she
is so turned on and feels so good. It seems on, so I give her Riker's
three rules. She says that she doesn't want to go too far today, that
we should leave something good for next time. I reframe, but she says:
"when things go too far, I walk." Walk? "I leave. So we shouldn't go
further. Unless you want me to run away and never want to see me
again."
*****As she says this, I think: What a great line! How can we use this
OURSELVES in bed to counter LMR! Any ideas???? (It's a great way to
reframe the fear that we'll sleep with her and not see her again by
saying that if she doesn't, we won't see her again.)*****
So I do the video-game tactic: Back up and try another path. This

time, I'm saying "we shouldn't be doing this" as I progress. She is
getting very turned on, and I tell her that I want her so bad. She
responds by saying that she's thinking about how I'd feel when I came,
and what my cum would taste like, and how she'd let me cum on her tits
and her ass.
BUT she STILL won't let me unbutton her pants. We talk more, she
leaves to do the errands, and that, sadly, is the frustrating end of
this one for NOW.
I have a couple thoughts: I should have tried Mystery's LMR killer

(where you just "shut off" whenever she says no). Never tried it
before, but it works for him. Any one had success with this?
Also, I wonder if this was her own female reverse-PU technique. She
may have held out for next time, and promised the world, to get me to
see her again. Maybe this is her style: give a little more each time,
but promise even more for the next time.
Any thoughts on this one, and what else I could have done?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 16 Apr 2002 10:24:00 GMT
subject: Re: Riker's Three Rules Takeaway?

On Mon, 15 Apr 2002 16:33:00 -0400, Maddash wrote:
>Chris,
>
>This post came from awhile ago, but I just had to respond to it. Remember
>the girl we team-sarged this weekend? (for everybody else: Chris and I
>accidentally sarged the same girl at the same time due to a
>miscommunication, very funny stuff). Anyway, at the end of the evening, I
>tried the kiss-bet on her ... she pulled away, but started holding on to me
>more and more. She emailed me this morning.
>
>I'm starting to become a believer in this *-close stuff.
Maddash: This is turning into a fun contest. You're making me want to

fly to NY just to close her. There was something really sexy about
her. Hey, make sure you email me the photos from the weekend.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 16 Apr 2002 10:37:00 GMT
subject: Re: Mystery's Workshop Results Part I: The Airplane PU (HB Hollywood)
Dude, great weekend. Sorry you couldn't make the third night. Went
over some good gimmicks and tricks. Then we went to W6, where the
Matadore of Love was on fire! Then we went to Crobar, which was way
too loud, but got a *close anyway from an HB I nicknamed superstar.
(Lately, I'm into never finding out their name and just giving them a
nickname on the spot in club pus).
Your plane sarge rocks. That definitely took some guts to take her
empty seat. When weird coincidences start to happen (like with her
book), I usually ask "Have you ever read the Celestine Prophecy?" They
almost always have, and it basically says that there's no such thing
as coincidences.
I have no doubt that within a couple months, you're going to be GIVING

more advice on this list than SEEKING advice. You're so close to
superstar-dom: you're smooth and mostly fearless on walk-ups, your
attitude is cool and cocky, and your appetite for sarging is
incredible. Now, if only you can stop anchoring the HB's I'm sarging,
LOL!

>Powles: I have a new Mad Dash-patented IOI which I have to share with you).
I'm waiting!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 16 Apr 2002 11:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: Booklist Suggestion: Re: Values: power play
On Mon, 15 Apr 2002 15:59:00 -0400, Maddash wrote:
>Hey Chris,
>
>Just bought the book based on your recommendation. Any others that you
>recommend???
>
>MD
There are a lot of threads on this, and I have a seduction bookshelf

FULL of books I've never read. Here's what's on the shelf, and, to
tell the truth, most of it I haven't even opened.
I like reading Jung, listening to Joseph Campbell lectures, quoting

Pablo Neruda love sonnets, skimming Nancy Friday's Secret Garden,
reading Libertine novels, and flipping through books like Sexual
Secrets to spin patterns off of. Anyway...
The two classics are:

Introducing NLP
and Influence: Science and Practice
For more hardcore NLP:

Tranceformations
Ericksonian Approaches
I've also been into books on body language (your new favorite topic!)
like Reading People and cold-reading. I realize now that a significant
part of my game after the approach is basically cold-reading.
And I just picked up Arousal by Michael J. Bader. Not sure if it's

good yet. Sleight of Mouth also comes highly recommended: thinking of
picking it up too.

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 16 Apr 2002 11:04:00 GMT
subject: Re: To ALL south Florida ASFers
Note to RaverDJ and Forix: I wasn't online in Miami. I would have

really liked to have met you two. Next time I'm there let's definitely
sarge together. I have a great field report from a Crobar VIP room
sarge that I'll post here when I get some more time, 'cause it
explains a lot of this stuff. (An HB I met during jury duty just left,
and I'm exhausted.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 16 Apr 2002 17:51:09 GMT
subject: Re: Eddie Z: Will your woman LET you answer?
winatbetting@aol.com (Win At Betting) wrote in message news:<20020414204727.04312.00003457@mb-bh.

aol.com>...
> >Most people with any decency would be embarassed Ray, but
> >you have no sense of shame.
>
> Not when others try to artificially attach it to me.
>
> How's life at the University of Georgia, by the way?
>
Going fine, hot chicks and nice weather. You ought to come down and
visit if your mommy will sign the permission slip that is!
Damn Ray, yer such a loser!
-Tigerstyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 17 Apr 2002 03:55:00 GMT

subject: Re: Need phone technique refinement..
Dude, these don't sound like "fake numbers" to me. The fact is: if a
girl wants to get rid of you, she MAKES UP a number. She doesn't just
give you the number of a friend. It just may be that these HBs happen
to be between homes at the moment. SO maybe that one is really staying
with her sister, but her name is not on the answering machine. Think
about it: if you don't want to give your phone # to someone, you don't
give them your brother's or best friend's # instead. You don't give
them any info they can use to track you down. IMHO, I think you're
okay here, and overthinking it. Leave messages with the sis and best
friend, and I'll bet that at least one of these calls you back.
>In the other instance (last night) the girl gave me a number, and then said
>"My sister Michelle might pick up the phone..." so I figured the two lived
>together. However when I tried to call today to set up a meet, I got a
>voicemail that only mentioned the girl Michelle, not her sister - so it
>seems as if she just plain gave me her sister's number! The problem with
>this is I can't leave a message ("Hey, this is someone you don't know, and
>I'm trying to reach your sister..."), so what is the move?
>
>My initial thought was that I needed to close quicker and in person, instead
>of going straight for the number, but in both cases it seemed that I
>couldn't push for a f-close and instead had to wait until I could call them.
>Aside from "NEXT", what can I do to resolve these situations?
>
>... Chris
>
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 17 Apr 2002 04:08:05 GMT
subject: Re: OT: Other usages...
"VaKo" <VaKoATminley2DOTdemonDOTcoDOTuk> wrote in message news:<1018996212.16756.0.nnrp-12.

d4e5a8fd@news.demon.co.uk>...
> I've been lurking here for a few days now and a thought crossed my mind,
> would *some* of the stuff talked about work in interviews? The whole "knows
> what he wants and how to get it" confidence type stuff? Making them (the
> interview panel) see me as an opportunity rather than a potential, making
> them feel like your enjoying the experience etc. Anyone got any thoughts on
> this?

>
> I think that my work is good enough [to get into university] but I want to
> come across really well in the interview.
The short answer is yes. The foundation of Ross's sysyem is NLP

(Neuro-Linguistic Programming), and really what he did was tweak NLP
for use in a seduction environment. There are many books written
about using NLP for business (and interview) settings. Go to a B&N,
Books-a-Million or Borders and look in the Business or Selp Help
sections. But yes even without worring about NLP, confidence leads to
success in many areas of life. I might add as an additional note that
I don't buy into NLP completely. I think being confident, upbeat, and
adaptible is enough most of the time.
-TigerStyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 17 Apr 2002 18:06:00 GMT
subject: Re: Questions Research - LONG
Another question, courtesy of Rick H:
PUA: What's your stripper name?

HB: I'm not a stripper.
PUA: Well, if you were a stripper, what would your stripper name be?
HB: (whatever)
The best questions in your list, maddash, are the ones that cause her
to step into a sexual persona. Here, for example, she must imagine
being a stripper (and the fantasy that it entails) in order to come up
with a name. Now, you can teasingly call her by this nickname...
Also, I can't seem to find your #/email (I can't find half of my Miami
numbers, including that blonde Brazilian chipmunk girl who I told I'd
hire and pay to follow me around like a little pet). So email me at
CPowles100@hotmail.com.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 18 Apr 2002 09:40:00 GMT

subject: Seducer On/Off
Right now, I feel like the seducer is something I can turn on and off.
It's in my control, and when I go out I decide whether I want to work
it or not.
Then, once the seducer is on, the choices are to go with a scripted
routine or to just be natural. This decision is less in my control.
Often, I find that I need the script for the first few sarges, and
then once I'm in state I can let go and just flow naturally.
Now, the goal, for me, is to have the seducer ON all the time--to have
that be my identity. And, ideally, I'd like the PU to eventually flow
naturally all the time, so that I can throw out the canned script. My
tried and true routine starts to bore me after a while, and I can't
deliver it congruently.
So, here's a question: does anyone here feel that the seducer is ON
all the time, that it is now their natural identity? If not, how can
this be done?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 18 Apr 2002 09:51:00 GMT
subject: Perfect PU: CP & the 10+'s
By popular demand, here's a report from a recent sarge I did. Here,

every cylinder was firing. It was one of those PUs that was pure ART.
Some of the lines that I made up on the spot I am now going to
incorporate into my routine. Make sure you read it through to the end:
there's a lot of GOLD in here.
The place: The VIP lounge of the Crobar in Miami.
The Scenario: There are two hot platinum blondes in matching

outfits--tight white tank tops, tight white pants, and big fake
breasts. They're totally peacocking, and every guy in the room is
drooling over them. Mystery rates one a 10 and the other 11. I'm
watching guys come up and just crash and burn. So I go up and just
bust balls. Negs totally opened up the set for me.
I say, "That girl over there is biting your style. Look at her."

HB10, "She's just got the same hair."

"No, look at her outfit. It's almost the exact same."
Now, here's a make-or-break moment. They look over, and I'm about
to lose their interest if I don't come up with something good. So I
continue the negging. "You know what, you both look like strange
little snowflakes."
Now, I have them. It's a strange, cryptic comment. Then I
continue. "I have to ask you something. Is your hair real?"
She says, "Yes. Feel it."
I pull it gently and say, "Hey, it moved. It's not real."
She says pull it harder, and I fucking yank it. "Okay, I believe
you."
Then I ask the same to HB11. Now, HB11 gets in my face and says,
"That is really rude. What if I'm bald underneath here. That could
really hurt someone's feelings. It's disrespectful. How would you feel
if someone said that to you?"
She's pretty angry here. And these next few paragraphs are what
MADE the sarge. It's basically a full reversal. "Well," I tell her. "I
actually am wearing a wig and I am bald under here. I shaved my head,
and thought I'd play dress up tonight. It's fun." (It was one of those
nights when I was just goofing off wearing a wig and fake piercings
for no reason: it doesn't help or hurt my game. But I NEVER tell
anyone it's a wig: I just knew it would help save this particular
sarge.)
Then I continue: "And I'll tell you what. Whether I go out totally
bald, in this wig, or in some crazy long-haired wig, it doesn't make a
difference in how I'm treated by other people. It's all your attitude.
Don't you agree?"
They ratify this. Then I continue, with a variation of a Ross J
pattern (maybe with Riker bits too). "I live in Los Angeles. It's
where all the most beautiful women in the country come to try and make
it. You look around, and everyone's beautiful. Beauty is common. Big
deal. So you got lucky in the gene pool. What counts is a great
outlook and a great personality. What counts is what you make of
yourself."
Now I'm in: I've broken into their world. To ensure it, I say to
the HB11. "And you know what? You have a great smile. I can tell that
underneath all that, you're probably a good person."
The HB10 comes up to me, and tells me that they're sisters.
"Bullshit," I say, smiling. "I bet a lot of guys believe you, but I'm
a very intuitive person. When I look at you both, I can tell that
you're both very different. Too different."
She tells me I'm right, puts her arm around me, and says she likes
me. We fluff from here, trade small talk stories, and exchange
numbers. They ask if they can stay with me at my house in LA some
weekend because they live in San Diego.

But, you know what dudes, I'm not satisfied. I want to push this
further. I want to isolate the HB11. And I notice that the more
attention I give to the HB11, the more the HB10 just comes up to me
and smashes her tits against me. I then come up with something fucking
genius. (This is why I LOVE this game.) I tell the HB10: "Somewhere
along the way, I bet you learned to manipulate men a lot with your
body, by touching and hugging them. You probably get them eating out
of your hand this way. But I'll tell you something: I grew up with a
lot of sisters, and I've always been immune to this." (note: I have NO
sisters.)
She says, "I don't try to manipulate men this way. It's just how I
am."
I know what's she's saying is bs, and of course I don't want her
to stop touching me. So I say: "But I'll tell you another thing. I'm
like a pet. Dogs and cats like to be petted. It doesn't have to be
sexual or non-sexual. It just feels good. It's important."
She says "good" and gives me another killer hug.
[NOTE: Can you all think of a good way to rewrite the above into some
permanent pattern to use in these situations?]
I then turn to the HB11, and just fucking step hardcore into her
world: "You know what, when I look at you, sometimes I'm not looking
at you as you are now. It's funny. I can see exactly what you looked
like in middle school. And you know what: I bet you weren't so
outgoing or popular then."
She's flabbergasted and says it's true. "I know," I say. Then I
go into my last beauty destroyer routine, a mix of my own real-life
experience, a convo with Mystery, and Ross J classics. "My
ex-girlfriend was one of the most beautiful women I've ever seen. And
you know what? Her life is so hard. She has to work twice as hard for
everything. I bet a lot of people think you're a bitch. But you're
not. I can see that. You're actually shy in a lot of ways."
HB11 agrees and talks about her experiences with this, especially
with the competition from other women who thinks she's a bitch.. Then
I continue: "People never give her a break. They're always really
tough on her, because they think everything just comes easy to her.
She had a doctor who was really great, and gave her appointments for
very cheap because he liked her. One night she saw him drunk at a bar,
he hit on her, and she rejected him. Now her own doctor doesn't even
return her phone calls."
(At this point, Mys comes in and tries to take over with some
magic. I am prepared for this little CB, and put my arm around the
girls and "ooh" and "aah" with them as they watch. Thank God, Mys is
tired and talked-out, so he backs off my set. The bastard!)
The HB11 asks me my sign. I tell her to guess. She actually gets it

right the first time (though I would have said that she was right no
matter what she said--because it's her projection of who she wants me
to be). She thinks I'm bs'ing and wants to see my driver's license. I
pull out my wallet and come up with another awesome bit: "I can pull
out my driver's license and show you, but if I did, it would mean that
you didn't trust me. So do you trust me, or do you want to see my
driver's license?"
She says she trusts me. I say, "Good, because I am telling the
truth." Now, I get her cell phone number so that we can hang out in
Miami too.
At this point, a guy they're with buys three shots. I hold out my
empty hand, and look around, pretending to be hurt. "Don't mind him,"
the HB11 says. "He's just rude." Then she calls the bartender over and
orders me a shot.
The HB10 shoots her friend a dirty look. "Remember our rule?" she
tells the HB11.
I can already tell what their rule is. So I guess. "Yeah," says
the HB10. "We said we're not going to buy any drinks for ourselves on
this trip." (In other words, they're going to let sucker AFCs buy
'em.)
So I say: "But you're not buying a drink for yourself. You're
buying one for me. And I'm different than all the other guys."
They are loving them some Chris Powles. Mystery (seeing the
error of his ways, LOL) says to try to isolate the HB11. I tell her
I'll cube her, but she says it's too loud in the club to concentrate.
I wait a few minutes, then say, "Come here. Sit down with me. I want
to show you something, but I can't in front of your friend."
(By the way, I'm giving her tons of kino now: arm around her, hand
on her shoulder, rocking her waist in my hand, taking her hand in mine
for a few seconds.)
We sit down, and I do a little psychic mind-reading. It actually
freaks her out a little bit (perhaps because I was IN before the
gimmick and now her perception of me has changed--added value?). I
pattern with Mys's "don't think, feel" speech and, as we're hugging, I
see Mystery giving me the *close signal behind her back. I start to
phase shift, and slow down, and have her kiss me on my cheeks and then
bite my neck. My fake lipring is preventing me from going for the
*close, because I'm worried it may fall off. (By the way, in MY head,
I'm seeing her as the pudgy HB7 middle school student she used to be.
If I was looking at her like an 11, this never would have worked.) We
fluff about cute Japanese toys, so I give her a little pencil (which
looks exactly like a cigarette) from my prop bag. I'm into giving
. She says, "No lips." And here's another thing I still can't believe
I did. I hold my finger up to her lip and say "Shhhh.." And then I
kiss her--on the lips. The lipring even stays on!
Now, check this out: The HB10 comes up to me, grabs me, and kisses

me on the lips. I say, "Have you ever kissed a guy with a lipring
before." She says "no," and then I kiss her a little more. I realize
right away that I shouldn't have done this, because I really need to
stick to the HB11 and not fuck up my game with her. So I tell HB10,
smiling: "I'm a big flirt, but I don't put out. I'm very picky."
I can sense that my work is done here. I don't want to stale out
or linger too long, so I tell them that I have to rejoin my friends.
We confirm our plans to spend a weekend together, and I leave just
feeling ON FIRE. I exit the VIP room and walk through the club, and
HBs can smell it. Whenever I catch one staring at me, I stop to talk
and ask her what she's looking at (in a friendly, smiling, playful
way). I get two nice solid number closes in the next 15 minutes. My
man Maddash and I go into a three set (two Brazilian girls and a guy)
and, I swear to you, the girls were ready to go home with us after 15
minutes--despite the fact that Maddash is as dumb as a brick (just
kidding--revenge, dude). We made their night.
Anyway, to me, I'm prouder of this than a lay report, because
it's the game artfully done. I wish we could post photos here, because
I'd love to show you what they looked like.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 18 Apr 2002 18:08:00 GMT
subject: Re: Seducer On/Off
>There is nothing wrong with using scripts, routines, and related. One can
still
>be a PUA and use them.
>
>They are only bad if you become *solely* depended on them for PU. Still, it's
>safe to put them to use if it'll help boost the PU in more difficult
>situations--or, in your case, perhaps to get you in the right state so you
flow
>naturally. The only danger is if a guy comes to believe that the gimmicks are
>the end all and be all of PU. If that happens, he is handicapped because he
has
>trained himself to be too depended on them, hence he would have great
>difficulty if he were to try and attract chicks relying only on himself. But
>Chris, I really doubt this applies to you.
Yes, this is a good answer. Thanks. The reason I posted this question
is because of this: of course, the attitudes and beliefs I have are
permanently changed. And, of course, I'm tons more interesting and

confident than I used to be. (Dude, if I could tell you the celebrity
who I @closed yesterday, even though she has a bf, it would blow your
mind. Ross J., in a hilarious mood, was with me and witnessed it! His
comment: "Her tits look much smaller in real life.")
NOTE: Does anyone else here notice that this material is designed to
work BETTER on hot and smart girls than on dumb or plain ones.
Anyway, to continue: at the same time, I have VERY high expectations

for myself. I know I have the skills to work any person in any
environment I'm in, but I usually only work in bars and clubs. This
may be unreasonable, but I'd like to be able to just walk outside,
anywhere, at any time, and, if not get laid, know that if I wanted I
could get laid. I also notice that sometimes I walk in a club and blow
it up; othertimes I lurk and do a few single hits. I'd like to, of
course, blow it up all the time. These, probably, are unreasonable
expectations, but they keep me going.
>I don't see how you shouldn't already have established this "seducer"
>self-image into your identity by now. Though I don't know you personally,
>nevertheless speaking from what I read of you and from your posts, it seems
you
>have more than enough experience to know that you are very capable of well
>executed PUs and I'm sure you've had many success in your endeavors. All this
>experience should add to ones growing self-assurance and attitude of "I am the
>prize."
True. But with six months of being the seducer vs many years of being
AFC, it's a self-image tug-of-war. I'm sure we all experience this.
The other difficulty is that you're constantly around old friends who
anchor you to your old self sometimes. I'm still in the metamorphosis
stage. I'm brutally honest in my posts, about successes and failures
(because I have nothing to prove), so I'll give you an example that
you'll want to shoot me for. Dude, Mys had sarged a Playboy lingerie
model: very nice. I asked for permission to sarge, he said yes. We
were lying on HER bed, we were holding hands, and you know what went
through my head: "No, this can't be real. How can this beautiful,
huge-breasted, sexually ravenous model who can have anyone she wants
be interested in ME, CP." Now where did THAT come from?
>Well, just for a moment, let us suppose that this "seducer switch" is turned
on
>at all times. How do you think this will affect other areas in your life?
>Positive? Think in larger terms and do not focus only on the PU aspect.
This is true. Nice NLP therapy: this paragraph has changed my thinking

already.
>I'm not sure I can say the switch is on all the time but it seems to be a much
>more dominant part of me than it's been before. I wouldn't call it a seducer
>switch but rather I simply have a different attitude and beliefs about chicks
>as well as myself. I know that I did a complete full-circle turn from my AFC
>beginnings. I mean, knowing what I know now to be true regarding PU,
seduction,
>ASF, chicks,
There's a difference between this, which is easy:

>how can anyone with half a brain slip back into AFC beliefs?
(And don't forget that beliefs are different than behaviors!)
And this:
>How can the seducer not be your natural identity?
>Suppose, for example, I'm put in a certain situation where I can potentially
>fuck up by supplicating. Before I would have to consciously worry about
>avoiding supplication. Now, I KNOW for certain that I cannot supplicate
because
>it is totally against my beliefs regarding what I am. I know that supplication
>will only work against me (while the AFCs don't have a clue they even do this)
>so why do it? If you're running in a marathon would you purposely stab
yourself
>in the leg?
Of course this is true. But you only encounter this AFTER you put
yourself in the game.
>Perhaps my experience combined with understanding of the reality regarding

>attraction between male and female really helped change my character
>(identity). I can say that frequently as I go about with the various routines
>in my daily life, I often attract interest in chicks who see me regularly. I
>don't try to PU, often I don't even bother talking to them. I just be who I
am.
This is true for me here too.
>You may think this is good but it isn't as rosy as it sounds. You see, in
>general chicks warm up easily to me BUT the problem is with the AFC guys. The
>thing is that back as a AFC I shared with them the same world view, the same
>beliefs and same basic problems--especially in areas where sex was concerned.I
>was one of them so naturally I fit in well in their social circle. However,
now
>it has become increasingly frustrating to stand their company. Because of the
>change in myself, over half those things I could connect with in the past has

>been wiped out. I know I could keep low-profile and play pretend but really
>what the use? Which reminds me that recently I've been "banned" by my former
>AFC "buddies" from joining them in their usual stimulating discussions which
>includes what movie star they want to fuck, and which chick is hot, etc. Oh,
>what a loss! LOL I should add that they have no idea of my PU lifestyle yet I
>think what drove us apart was that it was apparent that I wasn't one of them
>anymore.
True here too. Isn't it funny. But I like being one of the guys with
the PUA's much better than with the old AFCs. Way more fun!
>Chris, I'm not sure how much of this made sense. Just adding my experience to
>this discussion.
Thanks for the post, B. Very helpful. Where are you based? Does this
explain what I'm wrestling with at all?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 18 Apr 2002 18:14:00 GMT
subject: Re: Pregnant woman sarge
On Thu, 18 Apr 2002 00:24:00 -0400, Maddash wrote:
>This is just too funny. Sorry, Chris, I had to post this due to popular
>demand.
LMAO.
You should have seen how fast they ran!
[But, to tell the truth, they were probably ready to get out of the
pool. This little GM comment probably just gave them a funny excuse to
leave. We were actually still in: cause they still kept looking over
afterwards. Not that we cared, of course. On the other hand, your
sarge with the blonde hottie at that afternoon bar: that was true fear
when I somehow scared her friend away. Good times...]
PS I'll respond to your email soon, or call you if I can find your #.
================================================================================

================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 18 Apr 2002 18:18:00 GMT
On Thu, 18 Apr 2002 00:42:00 -0400, juggler wrote:
>Think about what the nature of ON is.

>
>I think of ON as when you are in the frame of being very open. Your guard is
>lowered and you can think aloud in front of people. Your opinions, emotions
and
>humor flow freely. There is no stage fright. You are just expressing.
>
>Now, in some people's mind, there is a problem with being this open all the
>time. They believe that you need to 'protect' yourself and pull within or else
>you can't deal with con-men, girls you don't want pursuing you, etc..
>
>But this is mistaken. You also need to be open with those you do not want to
>seduce or not want in your life.
Yes! This is exactly what I'm talking about!!! (And this is exactly
what I've seen YOU do!)
>It is just that you may be hesitant to develop the dark side of yourself. You
>have mastered your seductive 'good' side. But now you have to pay more
>attention to the other side.
>
>I know you have used this side to bitch girls out and to lay down the law but
>you need to become even better and willing to express anger and power as you
>have your passion.
>
>Those moments when someone wrongs you and you would normally just forget it,
>instead tell them how they have F-uped.
>
>I'm not saying you actually have to get red in the face and be an A-hole. (A
>little acting doesn't hurt though) I am saying, you need to become effective
at
>putting people in their place and using negative emotions to influence others.
You know me, man. Good advice!
>Try this experiment. Visit a used car lot and approach the first salesman you
>see. Sarge him. Make him like you. This should be very easy. Now, when he
>begins to try to sell you a car cut him off. "I have no interest in buying a

>car." Do not let him go down that road. Be ruthless but keep your guard down
>and go right back to being friendly.
>
>Heck, you can try this with the bums too. make them like you without giving
>them any money or hemming and hawing about giving them money.
>
>Be tough as nails but then be able to turn on a dime and be nice and smooth as
>silk. Girls need that from you. People need that from you. Think of yourself
as
>everyone's dad. You love them but sometimes you ahev to set the law down.
>
>When you can freely and effectively express both sides then you will feel very
>free to be open (ON) all the time.
This is GOLDEN advice. Very original, very perceptive, very true. Will
implement it ASAP. How much do I owe you?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 19 Apr 2002 18:19:00 GMT
subject: Re: Outbreak and RaverDJ
On Fri, 19 Apr 2002 04:13:00 -0400, RaverDJ wrote:
>Then he negs her. He folds a napkin in 4, hands it to her, and kinda rubs the
>side of his mouth. She does nbot get it. He repeats the motions. She still
does
>not get it. He TELLS her she has some shit on her lip and she should wipe it
>off... Well, she asks her friend if she has anything on her face, the friend
>says NO. BUSTED!!!!!!!!!! OMG this was the funniest crash and burn ever. He
>just got this guilty look on his face, said nice to meet ya, and walked away.
>
>I follow him out, then tell him wait, watch me try to bust a turn around. He
>was like dude, the situation is killed, as in unfixable. I was like watch
this.
>I went back to the 2 girls, and said "Hi laides, You'll have to apoligize for
>my friend. I took him to this club to kina show him how to pick up women, but
>folding up a napkin and telling you to wipe your face is NOT the way to do it.
>You don't wanna be the guy who just says something dumb, like Hey baby, whats
>shakin, and you do not wanna be the chump following them around all night,
>buying them drinks. (she interrupts to tell me she likes guys who buy them
>drinks). Then I Tell the one that rolled her eyes "You didn't even look bored,
>you looked iritated, and I was gonna say something to cheer you up, but he

>really made a mess of things, so I waited a minute before coming back to

>introduce myself." I found out basic info, the cute one is from out of town,
>the other one lives far from me. The nice one blows me off by saying "nice
>meeting you". I could have negged back with "Oh, is that your way of saying
you
>are bored of talking to me?" but I did not think of that till just now, 3
horus
>later.
RaverDJ, I like you and I like your posts. But I must point out that,
in my mind, you broke a cardinal rule here: You sold our your friend!
If there is a PU code of ethics, it should include not trying to make
yourself look good at the expense of someone else. Not only is it not
cool to anyone you wing with, BUT think about exactly what value and
personality trait you're demonstrating to the girls!
Outbreak, never BAIL on a PU because something doesn't go according to

YOUR plan. Every move is an opening. So, when she asks her friend and
her friend says nothing is there, say, "No, right there...can't you
see it...oh wait, that's her lip...never mind..." Then it seems like
you were joking in the first place, and you get your neg in.
Oh, and rule #2: The best way to PU is to ALWAYS look like you have
something better to do than PU! I'm willing to bet that you guys
looked like you were there to sarge. This is one of the hardest rules
to keep when I go out sarging in a small group.
Anyways, nice report. And I know Outbreak's shirt well--makes me think

"yabba dabba doo" :).
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 19 Apr 2002 19:00:00 GMT
NOTE FOR LURKERS: Special One-Time-Only Bonus-------Free Pattern Below
>Major Mark preaches "Seduction by temptation. Live the life of her fantasy,
and
>she will seduce you." No work required. Simple BE, and let her do all the
>work.
Yes, I like this, and the other Major Mark points, a lot. True, and

good frame. Must check out one of his seminars!
>And now to comment on Juggler's comments:

>
>Juggler accepts everyone. He can walk up to and talk with and establish
>rapport with anyone. Within just a few moments they are his friend. The
>beauty in this is the following: Because he does not judge anyone, he himself
>is immune from judgment. Think about it. Most guys pre-judge people and rate
>them on a scale of worthiness. It is no wonder that they are constantly
>concerned what others think of them. They become the victim of their own
>judgmental-ism. No wonder they are constantly rejected.
This is very true. Applies to some people here. In fact, it ties in

with something I read, which I've modified now into something I say. I
think this quote/pattern/comment below is actually pretty congruent
with your style anyway, David:
"All the things that help us become better, more complete human
beings, like yoga, or meditation, or sports, or any spiritual interest
you may have, all have one thing in common. They are all focused on
quieting the mind, quieting thought, quieting the whole imperfect
intellectual computer-like process. This is because we have become
over-conditioned and reliant on thought: taught and rewarded to have
very active, busy, comparing, competitive minds. But to really enjoy
and experience life, we have to undo all this and learn to listen--to
others, to ourselves--without judgment. When we speak to someone,
we're always judging: do we agree or don't we agree. But if we are
either agreeing or disagreeing, then we're not listening, for to
listen there must be an openness, an innocence, a putting away of the
old ideas so that the fresh ones can come in. We wonder why we learned
so well and so quickly as children: that is why. So when you listen,
all you need is an openness, and an innocence, and a passionate mind."
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 19 Apr 2002 19:42:00 GMT
subject: Re: Booklist Suggestion: Re: Values: power play
>Chris-
>
>Is the "Secret Garden" book you recommended a good read for many
>different patterns/ideas, or is it more useful for the overall
>pattern you mentioned the other night about different fantasies?

Great for a discussion starter. You can just skim it in a bookstore.

PERFECT for people who have trouble starting sex talk. I have gotten
into so may great convos about this lately!
>
>Don't forget the old faithful "Dangerous Men and Adventurous
>Women" book recommended by the SS folks. Excellent mind-fuck
>in looking at the seduction process from a women's point-of-view.
Ah, don't know this. WIll get it!
>I looked into some body language books in the past and couldn't
>find much useful. (I recognize this as a HUGE weakness of mine)
>Let me know if you find something useful.
Learn about reading body language and about cold-reading. That's a

huge part of my game now, I realize.
>BTW: I'm the younger uptight/conservative guy MadDash LOL...

>I wish I would've known I was going to South Beach when I left
>for the office in the morning...
Of course I remember you, dude. And you'll be pleased to know that

you don't come off as uptight or even that conservative. (Some sort of
EDGE would be nice if you could figure out how to add it!) I wanted to
ask: What happened to you after we left you. Did you go back to W6?
Did you go back into that set? We should have stayed there!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 20 Apr 2002 07:04:00 GMT
subject: Re: Lucid Dreaming
Chris,
Give me with your email address at CPowles100@hotmail.com. I can point

you in the direction of what you need to lucid dream. Amazing stuff...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>

Sun, 21 Apr 2002 18:18:00 GMT

subject: Re: Tzeen + Mad Dash + AFC = a little success (long)
On Sun, 21 Apr 2002 04:02:00 -0400, thelovematador wrote:
>BTW, Chris Powels, please send me the photo of my "New GF" Liz from Miami
which
>is in your digital camera. Thanks in advance.
Hey,
Email me at CPowles100@hotmail.com, and let me know your email
address. I'll send the photos of your new gf. Nice photos, too.
Are you making progress? Out sarging much? Found any good wings--from
class or the board? How about that HB from work you were talking about
who was mad into the Love Matador? Dude, I know you are going to be da
man soon...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 21 Apr 2002 18:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: howdy folks / OLD GUYS TAKE HEED
On Sun, 21 Apr 2002 02:08:00 -0400, Fatass wrote:
>Hi to all, Fatass here.... Spent the winter snuggling with my LTR, as I'm
>only a fair-weather hunter. Now that spring has come to the Balkans, I'm
>back in the game.
Yes, good to see you not only back on the board, but back in the game.
You were my first buddy here, and it's good to see you back! Keep
posting and, more important, keep using this stuff and posting these
success stories.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 21 Apr 2002 18:25:00 GMT
subject: Re: Belt loop opener

Yes, great minds think alike. I have a whole new genre of these
openers I've been experimenting with. I call them "grooming openers."
They include: Is there shaving cream on my face?
Is there any chalk dust on the back of my shirt?
Are my eyelashes long? A girl last night said that, and I wasn't sure
if it was an insult or a compliment. What makes for a good eyelash?
And, of course, now your "tag sticking out" and "belt loop" openers.
These, of course, are also good ways to have HBs look at your good
features--if they're your face or ass.
Any other grooming openers to add to this thread?
On Sun, 21 Apr 2002 11:26:00 -0400, juggler wrote:
>Whatever you wear, just make sure you miss one of your belt loops in the back.
>Then use Juggler's belt loop opener:
>
>"Hey did I miss a loop?" Pull up shirt and show back of pants.
>
>"Well, putting on my clothes I was very rushed. Mmmffff, jealous husbands have
>no sense of humor!"
>
>-Juggler
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
Sun, 21 Apr 2002 23:50:36 GMT
subject: Any photo's of Ray out there?
Hey does anyone know if there's a photo of Ray anywhere online?

I'm curious to see what a true babe-magnet looks like. You know, so I
can imitate his style of dress, not to ridicule him or anything.
-Tigerstyle
================================================================================


================================================================================
Mon, 22 Apr 2002 02:57:35 GMT
subject: Re: Article "How To Deal With A Player" from WOMEN
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================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 22 Apr 2002 02:59:00 GMT
subject: Re: Perfect PU: CP & the 10+'s
Thanks for the comments. I'll try to post more of these. The message:
raise your standards, trust your game, and at the same time be
realistic.
>This is awesome. However, I am kind of skeptical about you calling a girl an

>11. If Mystery calls a girl an 11 that's got to mean something. Send me a
>pic, let's see what an "11" looks like.
>
>Lonerman777@aol.com
Lonerman, that was a great analysis of the PU. Broke it down nicely,
so that even I could see how it worked. That structure will really

help me continue to do this. I'll send you the photos.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 22 Apr 2002 06:47:00 GMT
subject: Re: Belt loop opener
On Sun, 21 Apr 2002 14:43:00 -0400, Zan wrote:
>And CPowles, for women long eyelashes on a guy are very good. The longer the
>better. I know this because mine are relatively long (I guess), and a lot of
>women comment on it and say they love long lashes.
That was actually an opener, not a question. But clearly it's a good
one, because it opened you. LOL! Since you have nice long lashes, you
should use it as an opener yourself...
>
>And subsequently, talking to other women and mentioning this, they looked at
me
>like I was stupid. "What do you mean you never combed your eyebrows before?
>That is very important to us."
True, Zan. And I'm such a slave to fashion that I actually bought an
eyelash comb.
Beauty is in the details.
================================================================================
================================================================================
Tue, 23 Apr 2002 04:16:43 GMT
subject: Re: A different taste of the same story (Welcome to Greece) !!!
> >Generally I have humor and I use it all the time so last summer only from
> >one club I go there often I got 20 phone numbers. 19 of them were
> >correct. None of them ended to a date.
>>
> >I have problems ONLY with Greek girls and never from girls outside Greece
> >(Balkans, Europe, US). The same happens with my friends. > >
>>

>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
Damn, that's too bad because those 'yinekes' from 'Ellatha' are 'poli'
hot!
-Alright sorry, for that my Greek really sucks. Plus I can't get the
damn Greek 'alpha-beta' on my keyboard.
You know I think maybe you should stick with foreign chicks if the
locals aren't playing along. Maybe you can earn some social proof
that way and then transfer that over to a Greek chick. Other than
that I'd say just keep trying and be optimistic. Perseverence pays
off.
-Tigerstyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 23 Apr 2002 17:34:00 GMT
subject: Re: Outbreak and RaverDJ
This thread really pisses me off. The point isn't how RaverDJ effected
Outbreak's state. The fact is this: You don't sell a buddy out, even
to PU a girl. Even if it's just a joke or a line. It shows bad
class--to the girl and to your buddy. Never apologize for your
friends: if you need to apologize for them, why are you hanging out
with them? On top of all this, it's a SUPPLICATING approach. There
were a million other made-up stories that you could have told about
Outbreak to break open the set--some that would have elicited positive
emotions and sympathy from the girls, and demonstrated some of your
better values. On top of everything, it's a negative opener, and
negative openers suck. When I'm winging Mystery, say, and he totally
freaks out a set because they think he's a Satanist or something, I go
in and stick up for him, point out his values, say that he was on TV,
whatever. THEN, instead of justifying the fact that they snubbed him
(as with Outbreak), the HBs now realize that THEY were in the wrong
and too hasty. Make sense?.
Like I said before, I like RaverDJ and his posts a lot. I just think

this approach reeks, as proven by the fact that it bombed anyway. Do

we AGREE on this?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 24 Apr 2002 05:18:00 GMT
subject: Re: James Randi and Cold Reading
On Wed, 24 Apr 2002 07:13:00 -0400, Neo-Rio wrote:
>I kinda got swept up in this whole Cold Reading fad I'm going through
Hey, Rio, KEEP posting this cold-reading stuff. I came to the

realization after my Miami HB10 + 11 sarge that a LARGE part of my
game comes from cold-reading. The way I transition out of an opener is
by doing cold-reading, by saying something I observed about the HB
that is true for her (I'm rarely wrong or unable to reframe to make it
fit here). This is how I begin to get deeper rapport. Essential stuff.
I just picked up a CD on Cold-Reading, by Richard Webster. There's
some good stuff in there.
I was out with Ross J recently, and he sarged a waitress. Unlike, say,
James Randi, Ross does believe in psychic ability. Anyway, he either
psychic-read or cold-read the waitress, going into amazing detail that
was incredibly accurate and had her completely DDB.
Of course, as our friend Alessandro learned (in his recent fuckup

field report), don't attempt cold-reading unless you are very
intuitive, observant and good at reading people, and can make those
safe general statements that will always be accurate (even when
they're not).
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 24 Apr 2002 05:23:00 GMT
subject: Re: Call Now or Later
On Wed, 24 Apr 2002 09:42:00 -0400, hardman wrote:
>I met this girl and we have been out once, we have talked a lot though and I

>never sensed a problem. Since we went out she hasn't called or answered my
>calls. I am giving her one more chance. I want to go out tonight, should I
>call her cell during the day and leave a message telling her I am going to
call
>her later or just call her home later.
>
I'm guessing one of two things happened:

A. Whatever she was expecting didn't happen when you guys went out.
Or, more likely:
B. She either has a bf, or a bf reappeared, and it is out of your
control.
Anyway, if she hasn't answered your other calls, you need to use
something more sophisticated. You need to trigger an emotion. The best
is her guilt--to make her feel guilty somehow. Or maybe there's
another emotion she's susceptible that you realized when you met her.
When you do this, you must sound strong and resolute, not weak,
whining or pleading. Not angry, but stern, like an authority figure.
Make it so that to live up to her self-image of herself as a good
person, she must return your call and see you again.
I'll try to think of the right way to put this advice into a practical
answering machine message...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 25 Apr 2002 23:25:00 GMT
subject: Re: Ross On Walkups, Part II
>Chris..jump in here...
I like this. It's like tag-team posting.
Okay, here are my thoughts on all this:
1. We are in a room full of alphas. When you are known as the top guy
in your field--and the one who gets all the press and the Tom Cruise
character based on you etc. etc., everyone's going to want to knock
the big cat off the fence. That's the way it is. Some of this thread
is simple differences of opinion--and that's cool, and good fodder for
discussion--and other parts are potshots. These mystify me.

2. That said, there are ways we can all learn from each other.
Everyone I've met has developed a style that really works for them,
and for who they are. Adonis, who posts here, is pure SS: his closing
game, he says, is 100 percent accurate. 100 percent! I want that! At
the same time, I agree, the approach technology could be perfected.
Personally, there's an approach category that hasn't been mentioned
here: the story opener. This is my favorite: "Hey, I'd like to get
your opinion on something..." That's what I like to use if I'm going
to use canned stuff. However:
3. When I went out with Juggler in San Fran, I learned one important
thing: openers don't really matter, so long as you open. I recall that
we sat around and thought of the STUPIDEST openers we could imagine,
then went out and used them. And they worked. The point is this: a
good opener is one that is meant to be forgotten, so that once you
start talking with the HB, you both forget HOW you started talking.
So, whether you compliment someone or neg them, hump their leg or be
intellectual, make a joke or an SOI, it doesn't matter--so long as it
gets you in. Everyone here who's good has fine-tuned an approach that
works for their personality and their method.
4. That said, Ross's openers work. Dude, I died laughing when we were
at this trendy club, and I turned around and he was humping some
girl's leg. Both HBs were in hysterics. I came up to wing and said,
"Sorry, I meant to have him neutered today." It was funny. And then
Ross does a 180, gets serious, and steps hardcore into their world.
You just want to get their focus and attention. And Ross, Mystery, and
most others all agree on this following rule: don't be James Bond, be
Bugs Bunny. Afterwards, I leave, and he is sarging a VERY HOT
(Hawaiian?) HB outside. He doesn't even #close her because he doesn't
want to, although he's in. I'm at a loss to explain this, because she
was so soft bodied and fine. Ross, why?
This same night, he blows the mind of our waitress by telling her
everything about herself, and then closing with a SICK business-card
anchoring routine. So, the point is: he has game. But no one doubts
that, right?
5. I really don't know what my point is. Late night last night. I'll
continue when I'm more clear-headed....
Let he who has not crash-and-burned cast the first stone...
Increase the peace...

Chris Powles
================================================================================


================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 25 Apr 2002 23:31:00 GMT
subject: Re: A good PU story bedding a flake (LONG)
Nice field report. Sometimes your game was ON--firing on all

cylinders--and sometimes it was off. Either way, you hung in there and
got the close. My two concerns, though, are this:
1. Do you think that she was in control MOST of the time, that you
were playing a game by her unpredictable rules? (she was doing the
push-pull thing very well!)
2. It doesn't really matter, but I'm curious: do you think you were a
revenge fuck?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 26 Apr 2002 00:07:00 GMT
subject: No Topic
P.S. One other thought: There are not enough PUAs on this board. So
when one does post here, and shares some of his insights, let's not
just jump down his throat and run him off.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 27 Apr 2002 17:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: Celebrity Pickups
On Fri, 26 Apr 2002 10:11:00 -0400, Willie D wrote:
>Anyone ever had an opportunity to attempt a celebrity PU?
Trust your material. It works even better on celebs...
================================================================================

================================================================================
Tue, 30 Apr 2002 00:29:53 GMT
subject: Re: Women get ANGRY when they learn they've been played
winatbetting@aol.com (Win At Betting) wrote in message news:<20020429070604.22662.00004176@mb-de.

aol.com>...
> >> And they have VIOLENT MALE FRIENDS who can get justice for them very
> easily.
> >>
> >> This is one of the downsides of ASF methods that the men who seduce other
> men
> >> out here won't warn you about.
>>
>>
> >WHereas using ray's methods, no woman will regret sleeping with you,
> >because no women will be sleeping with you in the first place.
>
> You could only wish. That you devote so much time to attacking me only PROVES
> how powerful my methods are.
>
> You bully people who agree with me in an attempt to prop up support for your
> own beliefs, and then act as if you've changed something when you haven't.
>
> I should post the link to the guy who had the three-year relationship with one
> hottie from one key move he made.
>
Ray, let me be frank- anti-player is, and mean this, by far the GAYEST
philosophy towards women I've every heard of in my life.
You know nothing. You embarass yourself with your own stupidity and
you can't even see it.
You are a disgusting loser who is trying to pretend to be something

you're not. GO AWAY. Your whole anti-player concept is so
unbelievably weak!
When was the last time you got laid Ray? Have you ever had a woman?
You're a worthless, mentally-stunted, piece of trash, mommy-boy loser.

Move out from your mommy's place, make some money, get some
long-overdue therapy, and stop preaching your drivel to people who are
mentally far past your ability to reason.

Oh, and clean yourself up. You look like a goddamn pig.
-Tigerstyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 30 Apr 2002 22:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: OT: Candor a 9?
Candor, to quote a very smart HB I know: "If you act like a 10, you
will be treated like a 10." So, to other posters, no matter what you
look like, act and speak and think and move as if you are handsome and
sexy, and you will be treated as such.
Also, Candor, when I first started posting stupid AFC questions on

ASF when I first got into this stuff, you were always the man with
some of the best advice. It would be great to see you participating
more in this forum!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 01 May 2002 21:49:00 GMT
subject: "Bite My Neck," Alpha Kino, and more
Okay, learned a few things and confirmed a few ideas this weekend. I
wanted to write them down, for my benefit as much as yours. Every time
I sarge my games gets better, but at the same time I have certain
performance expectations for myself--and they're VERY high, so I don't
always meet them. Anyway, some newer principles and older ones I've
been thinking about this week:
1. BRING HER ONTO YOUR TRIP: I find that I sometimes sit there
with an HB and try to think up routines and games to do with her. And
what happens then is that it stales out. You must: A. Be natural and
have a lack of self-consciousness--this is very charming. And B: Bring
her into your world--your adventure and your frame. So if you're at a
concert, grab her hand and plunge into the crowd towards the front.
Lead her, then have her hold on to you for safety. She is yours now.
You are in control. Don't follow women around trying to think of
clever things to say--that's supplication, even if your routines are

good. Bring her into your world, where she is along for the ride and
you are the driver.
2. YOU'RE NOT A HORNY GUY, BUT YOU ARE A SEXUAL GUY. This is an
IMPORTANT distinction. I should write a separate post on this. But I
watched people crash and burn with the HBs I was sarging because they
were just too touchy-feely and persistent. On the other hand, I told
stories, demonstrated value, gave massages, and made them bite my
neck. I conveyed sexuality without desperation. Here's another way to
think about it for strip club sarging. If a guy is in a strip club
alone,he's horny. If a guy is in a strip club with a girlfriend, he's
not horny because he's getting some, so he must be sexual.
3. ALWAYS LOOK LIKE YOU HAVE SOMETHING BETTER TO DO THAN TO PU. I

can't say this enough.
4. SELECT YOUR TARGET, BUT SEDUCE HER FRIENDS.Nancy Friday writes

that the most motivating things to a woman are approval--and, even
bigger, avoiding disapproval. I've noticed that HBs who REALLY fall
for me are ones who I have social proof with: they see me with other
HBs or, better, their friends are talking me up when I'm not there.
Even if she's not into you, if her friends keep saying you're perfect
for her, she'll find a way to identify those qualities in you.
5. PUNISH: This is so effective, and relates to the above post.

Whenever I don't get what I don't want, I stop paying attention. This
worked for me twice. A girl I met in a bar, after giving her the
Juggler GF test, I said "bite my neck" (my new favorite line). She
said "I just met you." I turned and talked to Yum, then turned back.
"Bite my neck." She did it, and very well. The second time, I got
rebuked on a *close. She gave me the cheek (my pet peeve). I told her,
humorously, you're going to be punished for that. Then I stopped
paying her attention. Later, she said her neck was sore. So what did I
do? I started massaging the neck of her FRIEND who was sitting next to
me. Then I had the friend lick the back of my neck. So, later, when it
was time to leave, I went to kiss the target goodbye and now, all of a
sudden, SHE tried to slip me the tongue.
6. ALPHA KINO: This is a new thing I'm trying to work in. I thought it
up after observing my Natural GM friend and talking to Maddash. It's
beyond kino and it's non-sexual. It's picking up a girl, putting her
on your lap, showing your physical mastery over her. Very effective, I
think. Would be curious to hear about others using it.
================================================================================

================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 03 May 2002 18:04:00 GMT
subject: Re: AoS Part III: Sending mixed signals
NOTE TO SKIMMERS: FREE PATTERN AT BOTTOM OF POST.
On Fri, 03 May 2002 04:31:00 -0400, Commander Zap wrote:
>So here you are, you are attractive you tell us, you seem reasonably fulfilled
>by your work, and you make good money. And again, that's *plenty* to get a
>guy laid. I'm almost scared to ask if you're tall, too. Plus you fucking
>teach *yoga*?
>
>Next you'll tell us that BTW you're a rock star, too. It's a bit like, How I
>Learned to Attract Women, by Brad Pitt.
Okay, I'm going to go on a little bit of a short rant here, and it's
nothing personal, Commander Zap, because you are fast proving to be
one of the board's great posters. But (you knew the next word was
"but") there is a TERRIBLE mindset here. And that mindset is to ALWAYS
disqualify someone else's successes: HE just got laid because he's
good-looking, or because he's rich, or because he teaches yoga (wtf?).
These are all advantages, but none of these things gets you laid. So
when you read someone's posts you can do two things: ONE, just ignore
them since they're clearly better looking, richer, and more spiritual
than you, so they're ideas and insights don't count. Or TWO, model
what works for them so that you can have these successes too.
Having met Maddash, I'll say this: The best thing he has going for him
is his personality, his attitude, and his state. These can all be
imitated. Like I told the HB10 & 11 I PU'ed--"I like to change my
appearance all the time. Wear wigs and piercings etc. But none of them
changes the way I get treated because it's all your ATTITUDE." And,
what you're posting right here Cmd Zap, is a BAD attitude. It's
defeatist.
>I think that you have inadvertently shown us that this AoS Part III has less
>general application than were trying to suggest. What you are is a great
>catch, at least based on what you say.
Yes, now make YOURELF a great catch.
>For us, it's a little bit like going to a recruitment counselor who says to
>you, "Okay, let's say you graduated first in your class at Harvard Business

>School! GO AHEAD AND PUT THAT DOWN ON YOUR RESUME! That will help potential
>employers better evaluate your prospects, and believe me, it will look good!
>Understand?! Glad I could help!"
Come on. Look at the evolution of Maddash's posts. He's largely

self-taught, but it's what he's learned in the last month alone that
enabled him to PU HB11. And he's sharing it here. So he went from 8's
to 11's. What if you could raise your median level of HB by three
points. Wouldn't that be amazing?
>Some of us here make good money, Maddash, some of us are even in the
>professions, some are more attractive than others, and some make shitty money
>or no money, but we all strive together. None of us, though, none except you,
>(1) is attractive, (2) is professionally fulfilled, (3) brings down very good
>money, and (4) teaches yoga. As far as I know.
So what do you have Cmd. Zap? What is there in you that YOU can bring
out?
>There is something for us all to consider in this AoS Part III that you lay
>down (I re-read it, and there is a lot of good stuff in there actually), but
>there is another obvious point here, too: the guys who are attractive on
every
>level may well do better than most of us.
They MAY do better. It IS an advantage. But there are plenty of rich

good looking successful guys I know who don't get laid because they
are total AFCs. For a guy, fortunately, this surface stuff is NOT
enough.
>Not content to wave all of this in our faces, I see that you leave us
>struggling with a riddle: "A big thanks goes out to SiN for suggesting the
>yoga routine. I owe him big time." Yes, and just what the fuck does *that*
>mean, Maddash? You do or you don't teach Yoga, and if you don't, do they
never
>notice your deception? What a tangled web we weave, eh, Maddash?
You're a bit off here. I was there. The fact is this: Maddash never
even considered using his knowledge of yoga in a PU. (He used to be a
yoga teacher.) Now it's one of his GOLD routines. So this leads to a
question for you: Give yourself a personal inventory, and think: Is
there something about you, a story of your past, a special skill you
have, an area of knowledge or spirituality that you enjoy, a family or
traditional rite that you've been ignoring. What is there WITHIN
YOURSELF that so far you've failed to notice and to bring forward

during the PU.
I will end this now with one of my favorite quotes, which you can BET
I use all the time during PUs, but it applies here. From Joseph
Cambell (with a few of my own imbedded commands added):
"We keep hearing around us all the time: 'the revolution, the
revolution, the revolution.' The revolution doesn't have to do with
attacking something; it has to do with bringing forth something. If
you spend all your time thinking about that which you are attacking,
then you are simply bowing to that in a negative sense. You have to
TURN IN to find what the zeal is in yourself and bring that out.
You have one life to live. Marx teaches us to blame society for
our frailties, Freud teaches us to blame our parents, and astrology
teaches us to blame the universe. And the only place to look for blame
is if you didn't have the guts to bring out your full self, if you
didn't act on your DESIRES, if you didn't take advantage of what was
in front of you and life the life that was your potential."
Heh heh, nice one, huh? And Cmd Zap, I'm patterning you here! Again, I
hope the tone of this post is friendly, because it's meant to be, but
I just think it's not a good mindset to be trying to disqualify the
successes of others because of X or Y or Z.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 04 May 2002 02:01:00 GMT
subject: Re: AoS Part III: Sending mixed signals
On Fri, 03 May 2002 13:44:00 -0400, Commander Zap wrote:
>Hey Chris Powles! I wasn't beating up or belittling Maddash, my goodness me!

>Maddash is great, and so are you!
Hey Zap, I know that you weren't being up on Maddash. You were beating
up on YOURSELF. (Even if you were half-kidding, there was another half
of you that was half-serious.) THAT is what got me so upset. If you
were beating up on Maddash, I wouldn't have interceded. He deserves
it--calling people "twit" and all.
================================================================================


================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 04 May 2002 21:49:00 GMT
subject: Staling
So, for some reason, I don't have a problem with flaking. Most HB's
give me good numbers and return calls. Some even call me first.
But, I sometimes have a different problem. I'll call it STALING. This

is when both of our schedules are so busy (or we're traveling or
whatever) that it takes too long and too many phone calls to set up a
meeting. Eventually, after a few phone weeks of trying this, that
connection and attraction we originally had begins to fade out--for
her as well as me. Of course, part of the reason this happens, is I'll
only give them ONE night each week when I'm free. If they're not free
that night, too bad and we try again the next week. Another problem is
that I'm a bit of a flake, I'll admit. This can work to my advantages
(mixed messages) but also some HBs get tired of me taking too long to
return phone calls, being late, etc.
So, does anyone else have a problem with the connection and meeting
going stale?
As I write this, one way around this would be to set up a continuing

story/drama/puzzle/game that would be continued with each phone call.
This way they'll really look forward to the phone call to continue the
game or find out what happened or hear the rest of the story or
whatever. IA plot or suspense is a great way to keep anyone's
attention.)
Any ideas?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 04 May 2002 21:59:00 GMT
subject: Chick Logic: Explain It
Three examples of chick logic:
1. HB-A I'm out with is totally cold. I make out with another girl in
the bar just because I'm pissed off, then all of a sudden HB-A is all

over me?
2. HB-B rejects a kiss. I tell her she will be punished. Then I

massage her friend, and let her friend lick my neck and hardcore flirt
with me. Later, HB-B tries to stick her tongue down my throat.
3. HB-C meets me with her CB friend. We go to a party, and I #close a

very beatiful blonde. HB-C says, "She was nice. You guys make a good
couple." (Translation: "You're supposed to be with me. Fuck you.") So
she and her CB friend leave in a huff. BUT, ten minutes later, HB-C
calls my cell phone and says: "Hey, you didn't say goodbye. Call me
tomorrow." (Translation: she wants me.)
Okay, now, if an HB I'm with makes out with or flirts with or # closes
another guy while I'm out with her, I usually eject her in my mind on
the spot. This, as we all know, doesn't seem to be how HBs work. So,
ladies as well as gentlemen, someone explain it to me! WTF is going on
in their minds? Why would they still want a guy after he's just been
playing tonsil hockey with some bar skank?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 04 May 2002 22:02:00 GMT
subject: Re: Staling
Let me add another question to this:
What is your GOAL in a phone conversation?
Mine is to INCREASE RAPPORT and SET UP A MEETING. I'm thinking maybe

my goals and style of phone-sarging should change. How can more
push-pull be worked into the phone game? What is a way to increase the
relationship, even sexcalate, over the phone?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"TigerStyle" <0>
Sat, 04 May 2002 23:47:00 GMT
subject: First post, field report HB-Deutschland, part 1
Hello all, this is my first post here on mASF. And I want to start by saying

what I great idea this is. I’ve been active on the Web Board for a while but
this is loads better. Mucho thanks to Jay. Anyhow, this’ll be a long post…
So here’s the field report, last night I went to go hang out with a friend and
drink loads of beer. Exams have ended and I’m heading back home early next
week. So after I get there, my buddy’s GF shows up and says that some friends
of hers will be coming over. Now one of these chicks, HB-Deutschland, I met
before, about an 8, maybe an 8.5 if she were a little bustier, nice face
though. She’s from Germany and she’s got a major attitude, very contrary to
anything you say. So we start the night at my friend’s apt, then we head out
to the bars. Now I never was too interested in HB-Deutschland, I met her at a
party a while back and I’ve spoken to her at a local café before, but she
always came on with this major attitude, she does it to everyone- like lots of
foreign chicks do. But last night was the first time I ever actually got to
hang out with her and I decided to make a play.
Basically I just went into cocky mode all night, threw in some kino here and
there, but didn’t run any patterns. As we were walking to the bars I found out
that she’s going back to Germany at the end of the summer and is upset about
this. So I asked her why she has to go back. It turns out that she’s an
exchange student and her program is up. So I said “oh, so you’re being
deported!” She was shocked by this and acted mock-offended. So of course I
kept digging.
Once we got in the bars we started fluffing, HB-Deutschland asked where I was
from and I told her where but she didn’t know where that was, so took out my
pen (always carry a pen) and drew a map of the east coast on a napkin (I go to
school in a different state that where I’m from). I’m a decent artist, and she
seemed interested that I could draw a state map freehand. So after this she
told me where she was from (I didn’t know where that was- some small town in
Germany on the north coast). So she grabbed another napkin and drew a map of
Germany. The map was very crude, so I started kidding with her about that
saying: “is that supposed to be Europe?” (it was a really bad map). Again she
acted mock-offended and she even punched me in arm a few times playfully, but
she was smiling and laughing at the same time. This was good, any time a girl
starts doing that she’s interested.
More fluff followed, then I went to go talk to my friend and his GF went over
to talk to HB-Deutschland. Some more friends showed up and there were too many
of up to sit at the bar, so we went outside to the patio area. My friend then
told me that HB-Deutschland has a boyfriend back in Germany. She hasn’t
mentioned this to me, and she doesn’t want to go back to Germany, so I’m
thinking this is not something I’ll worry about. If the BF comes up later
hopefully I can link him to the fact that she’s going back to Germany(something
she doesn’t want to do), and work past that. Anyway- it hasn’t come up yet, so
I’ll cross that bridge when I reach it.
Anyway, we eventually left when the bars closed and went to IHOP to eat some
greasy breakfast food. We ditched most of the friends we met at the bar, and
only 5 of us went to eat. We sat at a booth and HB-Deutschland sat next to me,

excellent opportunity for kino. My friend’s GF told HB-DL that she seemed to
be in a better mood that normal. And she was, she had completely warmed up to
me after I acted cocky all night.
Anyway, somehow the conversation turned to politics. The issue came up about
how the whole world is obsessed with American politics but America doesn’t care
about foreign politics unless we’re at war. She bet that none of us knew who
was Germany’s leader (of course we didn’t know that!) but I told her that I
didn’t know his name, but I knew what her looked like, cause I’ve seen him on
TV. She said oh, yeah, what does he look like? So I took out by pen, grabbed
a napkin, and drew a quick caricature of Hilter!
Everyone at the table burst out laughing, she called me an asshole and again
punched me but, she started laughing too. Then she asked if I could draw
George W. Bush, so I told her yes and drew a picture of a monkey in a suit and
tie. She laughed at this and kept the napkin! Good sign, I think.
Later after we got our food she said that I was the first person ever to joke
about Hilter with her, and how she thinks Americans are uncomfortable talking
about Nazism with Germany. More kino, fluff, etc. Then we called it a night,
we dropped her off first (we had all taken, my friend’s van) and then they
dropped me off at my car and I went home. It was very late, after 4am.
Anyhow, I think I did well, I could have been more aggressive. Although there
was a lot of kino it was mostly arm touches, leaning in to whisper in her ear,
that sort of thing. I never really had an opportunity to isolate her, though I
didn’t try to make one either.
But here’s the deal, I’m leaving town in three days. Plus, she's leaving for
good to go back to Germany soon. So I’m going to try to close her by Sunday
night. There’s a Cinco de Maio party that night we’ll both be at, and plus
I’ll probably see her again tonight. I’ll post the results of that when I get
the chance. Basically I’m working under the assumption that she wants to ride
the hog, and I just need to find time to let her. So that’s it, comments,
suggestions, etc are welcome.
-TigerStyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 05 May 2002 00:18:00 GMT
subject: Re: Staling
On further reflection, I think I've refined my issue with the phone,

and it's this:
In the last two months, my approach style has changed. Now, I

ball-bust, tease, social proof, and do take-aways more. I'm more

dominant, I put them more in my world, I confuse them more. When I
leave after 10-20 minutes, it's like they just got out of a whirlwind
(or, better yet, a jacuzzi).
BUT, on the phone, I'm not congruent with this. I'm a nice guy telling
stories and building rapport. The challenge now is to figure out how
to do the above on the phone. To keep them spinning...
On Sat, 04 May 2002 17:25:00 -0400, Tzeen wrote:
>You surprised me a little with your idea for a running plot thing that gets
>continued at each phone call. I've been doing that for years...even when I
>was an afc. Either I present some harmless crisis in my own life, and
>present her with a series of outcomes "oh, I bet I'll do this, and it will
>turn out like this"
Yes, this is okay. But it presumes she's THAT interested in you and
your life already.
>Or I will try and predict her solution to something in

>her life. For example, one of my "busy girl" prospects was talking to me on
>the phone when she saw a mouse in her bedroom. She had to get off the phone
>to do something about it, but I presented her with an outcome. "I bet you'll
>end up staying up all night if you don't catch that mouse. In fact, I'll
>make you a bet, If you stay up all night over a little mouse, you gotta buy
>me a beer." I called her back 4 days later, and she owed me one beer :)
This, however, I really like. Yes, making bets. I will start doing
this: I like the frame of getting into conspiracies and private jokes
with an HB.
>The one I've been using lately is "I'm supposed to be an extra in a movie
>next month, but I'll just be standing in the background. Maybe I'll dye my
>hair blue so I'm more visible. I'll tell ya all about it after my scene
>films." This, in fact is true, I will be an extra in a movie next weekend. I
>plan on sarging the lead actress if she's cute. She's nobody famous (its a
>low-budget indie thing.)
Why don't you have her come over to dye your hair, because you don't
know how. Every time I have a chore that needs to be done (paint a
bookshelf, whatever), I use it as an excuse to invite an HB over to do
it with me. Why not, right? And plus she's supplicating to you on top
of being at your house...
================================================================================


================================================================================
Sun, 05 May 2002 00:29:00 GMT
subject: Re: please read all of you
"Nebuchadnezzar" <trickynick_pdx@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<3iVA8.228384

$CH1.149861@sccrnsc02>...
> Ray, I can't speak for the group but I am willing to forgive you provided
> your behavior actually changes. Remember, actions speak louder than words.
>
> "Win At Betting" <winatbetting@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:8a2b42e7.0205040417.224ca63@posting.google.com...
> > I am sorry about any offensive comment I have EVER made in my entire
> > life. Please accept my apology and leave me alone. I will no longer
> > make any threats of any kid to any of you. Let's just be friends. I
> > was wrong, and I am simply one big penis. I hope all is forgiven.
Hmm, no signature.
And he mispelled "kind" in line 3. Ray may be many things, but he
usually doesn't make spelling errors. It this really Ray?
-Tigerstyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 05 May 2002 11:10:00 GMT
subject: Re: Interesting research
On Fri, 03 May 2002 14:17:00 -0400, throughfare wrote:
>
>Don't know if there's some useful info in here for those ASFers who like to
>satisfy the extracurricular needs of married girls & those with borefriends,
>but it just confirms the fact that women are programmed to seek gratification
>from more than one guy:
>
>http://www.economist.com/science/displayStory.cfm?story_id=1109532
Great article, thoroughfare. Not only is there a great pattern here,

but there's also a great neg. It's a little GM though. If you see a
scantily dressed woman, during the convo, ask, "I have to ask you

something: Are you ovulating?" Then explain: (FROM ARTICLE): "Previous

work has shown that women are more sexually aware around the time of
ovulation (for example, dressing in ways that reveal more skin)."
I'll combine this with a story about [insert female pop star], and
discuss how she has four different boyfriends, each a different type
of guy (and i'll list the types) to satisfy each of her different
needs. Isn't that smart?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 05 May 2002 11:43:00 GMT
subject: #closing some models (with bfs)
Thought I'd recap some nice #closes tonight, partly just to write down
some new lines I made up on the spot. And also because the second HB I
sarge here TELLS ME one of the best lines ever: she basically destroys
HER OWN BF for me!
I met a pivot at a bar/restaurant. She was at a table full of male and

female models. I sat down next to a blonde female model (honestly, I
give her an 8, because she has this fat baby face that I don't like),
and launched into a true story that happened to me today. It may be a
new pattern (this is sort of a field report within a field report):
"Hey, let me get your opinion on something. A month ago, I got a card
at work from a girl I had met at an airport. In the card, she gave me
her email address. I emailed her just to say thanks and that it was a
miracle I even found her card in the stacks of mail I usually get. And
we started a nice online correspondence. Over time, I really grew to
like her: we had a lot of things in common, and really a great
connection, so that after awhile I began to really anticipate these
emails. Soon, we were talking on the phone and really enjoying each
other's company. Today, she told me that she wanted to visit me in LA.
Now, here's where I'm concerned: I have absolutely no idea what she
looks like."
HB: You don't remember meeting her at all?
"Well, I sort of remember meeting someone. But all I can see when I
look back on it is like a white silhouette. (I outline HB's body with
my hand.) What would you do? Should I have her come?
HB: (I don't know. Maybe have her come, but put her up at a hotel just
in case.)
ME: But don't get me wrong. I'm not concerned with whether she's hot

or not, I just want to make sure there's that physical connection and
excitement when we see each other. Like, you know, when you meet
somebody and (instant connection pattern).
As we're talking, HB's friend asks, "Do you two already know each
other?"
Us: No.
HB friend: "That's funny. You two seem like you're already friends."
This is nice social proof. And later I learn that the HB had been an
ice queen all night, and only came to life with me. She says she's
going outside for a cigarette, and asks if I smoke. I tell her no, and
then pause (so that she thinks she'll have to go out alone) then say,
"but I'll keep you company out there."
I start to go into routines outside, but leave them as open loops as

we start talking. Anyway, we #close pretty easily, though I'm really
not into her. She doesn' thave that much personality.
The next sarge, however, I'm into:

I sit down, and notice a really fine thin dark-haired model (9.5, with
a bit of a Jennifer Aniston look) talking to a guy. The guy is saying
he is going to school to do talk radio. I butt in and assume instant
conspiracy/rapport with the girl. "Cool. Let's pretend that you're
doing a talk radio show. Her and I will be callers, and we'll ask you
about something and you have to give us your opinion on it."
"Sure, how about asking about Israel." The guy says.
"No," I say (taking control--alpha). "That's too easy. Everyone has an
opinion on that. It has to be something harder."
"Mayonaisse or Miracle Whip?" HB9.5 asks.
I smile at her: "Good one."
Anyway, she's really bright and much quicker than him. I hold both of
them, and pull them close to each other. "You guys are a good team.
You should have a radio show together." (Note: I notice that when I
try to play Mr. Smooth and hook a guy & a girl up, she usually ends up
liking me instead.)
HB9.5 asks him another question, and he goes on. I can tell she's
showing off her smarts for me, but I actually grow bored of just
listening to them talk, so I walk away without a word. TOTAL TAKEAWAY.
I sit next to my pivot, and just as HB9.5 turns around, Pivot is
hugging me. Perfect.
Five minutes later, HB9.5 is talking to another guy and I re-approach
her. I tell her that I like sharp girls (say what you want, but a
sincere compliment that displays your high standards is a good thing).
She tells me she likes guys for their mind. I tell her the "internet
girl" story above, but with more connection stuff embellished.

We fluff about books, and as we do, she takes off her sweater and
displays a low-cut shirt and an amazing natural chest--perfect size
breasts. This is clearly all for my benefit, because the bar closes in
15 minutes.
I tell her about my ex-girlfriend (a 9.9). "She's amazing, and could
just light up the room when she walked in."
HB9.5: Why'd you break up with her?
"She was very, very, very jealous. She didn't want me to talk to or
even be friends with another woman."
Then I went into my jealousy pattern, still a work in progress: "I'm
not a jealous guy. This is the way I look at it: God gave man the
choice between good and evil. I give the person I'm dating that same
choice. It's up to them. If you choose good, great, then you can stay
with me and get all the rewards and great experiences that come with
that. If you choose evil, then, fine, you suffer the consequences;
you've made your choice, so long."
{...oh shit, dudes, she just called and asked me to come over as I'm
writing this....}
Let me get to the good part of the story: I do a really great #close
that affirms our great connection. Then her boyfriend comes over, and
I learn that they live together. BUT, she says to me, "Did you ever
see the movie Serendipity?"
"No," I tell her.
"Well, it's about two people who meet, but they are both dating
someone else..."
WHAT A GREAT I.O.I.!!! She's basically telling me that I'm the perfect
guy for her already, but coming too late.
Anyway, dudes, I'm outta here. Don't know how this is going to work,
because she lives with her borefriend. She says there are a couple
other people over too. If I don't return to this NG, it means I got
caught...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 06 May 2002 19:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: here you go, the 'spiderman pattern'
On Mon, 06 May 2002 13:39:00 -0400, ybatman wrote:

>Yes, Saw the movie this weekend. MJ was tranced out. BUT if you use that
>pattern in a few weeks when Millions of people see that movie you will look a
>bit weird. Its a good pattern though
>
Exactly, dude! You don't use it as if you just made it up. You QUOTE
the movie. You talk about Spider-man, and say, "You know what cracks
me up. It's that scene where Spidey looks at MJ and just says to her,
totally seriously (now repeat pattern in seductive voice and trance
her out). Then when you're done say, "Now, come on, that wouldn't
REALLY WORK, would it?" (Then see if you get the IOI!)
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 06 May 2002 19:31:00 GMT
subject: Re: Trip Report
On Mon, 06 May 2002 12:33:00 -0400, finalD wrote:
>The first thing is, that I was at the Jazz Fest in New Orleans, which is
>just now over. Basically, here's my opinion on Jazz Fest -- if you haven't
>been, then you haven't lived. If you're into listening, walking, eating,
>drinking, being, breathing, existing, then you will learn something about
>being a better human at Jazz Fest. <snip>
It's a great festival. Maybe we should have a PU meeting there next

year: great music, great food, great HBs, great times.
>So, I'm kind of happy to just BE there and suck up what I feel is "normal"
>life rather than "fucked up typical city dwelling" or "fucked up typical
>North American puritanical anti-sex shit" or "fucked up girly-girl chick-
>logic shit" or "fucked up gold-digging" or "fucked up social mores" or
>"fucked up poor people" or "fucked up rich people" or whatever else "fucked
>up" is the status quo here in our universe. Instead, the shackles drop off
>and you just can go ahead and BE yourself, and the whole "just be yourself"
>crap advice actually takes a life of its own and becomes something
>marginally useful. Also, all the people around you are contributing to your
>heightened sense of social positivity, because they're feeling it too, and
>spreading it around. Approaches aren't something you have to think about,
>they just happen of their own accord ... at least for me.

I SMELL a pattern here: the New Orleans pattern. And you're right,
they enjoy life and the senses..
>But then there are the down-sides. First is, it only happens once a year
>and it's just now over. (Last weekend in April, firs weekend in May, book
>now!) Obviously there's a positive vibe at this place that I want to take
>advantage of, and I'm having a hard time transferring the OTHER people's
>states into something as mundane as a suburban Tampa shopping mall. The
>second down-side is that you're only meeting people who are a long way away
>from a car or a hotel room, and who (since they want to make the most of
>their $20-a-day ticket) aren't into being dragged off to some secluded
>locale.
BUT, they want to do something AFTER jazzfest, to find out where the
party or cool bar or night concert is.
<snip>
>
>But being dissociated from ASF had other drawbacks. I found that when I
>returned home and got to my computer (which crashed immediately, goddamnit,
>but that's a different issue) and got back to involving myself in the ASF
>threads and discussions, I was suddenly transported to the whopping big-PUA
>stud-muffin that I always knew I was. I was right back into the right mind-
>set, and the AFC stuff evaporated. I was instantly confident and somehow
>more "aware" of small social dynamics, and the "tricks of the trade." I was
>reminded of them; I was interested in them; I was frustrated that I hadn't
>found more opportunity to use them on my travels. And part of that was,
>that while travelling, I didn't really have any kind of re-instalment
>device. Like this newsgroup.
You should make being the seducer your identity, and reinforce it with
your own behavoir. Everyone should, instead of just feeling like a
seducer by reading about and being part of a community where people
TALK about it.
>Which really freaks me out. I didn't realize how newsgroup-dependent my

>internal state had become. I suppose it's an obvious outgrowth of reading
>all these posts and posting as often as I do; but there's another thing to
>what's going on, which is that the WHOLE EXTERNAL WORLD is pushing on ya,
>sometimes all of it in concert, to create an AFC out of you. All the
>stimuli are very non-PUA, and only in rare instances in which you "force"
>the universe to conform to your own PUA-ness, does the universe then start
>to reinforce that PUA-ness and help you out on your sarging.
I do agree. BUT, when you go out, and watch EVERYONE ELSE talk to

women, you realize that you're already light years ahead of them just
by what is now your natural instinct. Of course, when you're around
old friends and environments, you can get anchored to your old AFC
self.
>So I'm kind of wondering what the next step is, for me. I am uncomfortable
>with my performance on my vacation. I really enjoyed the company of my LTR
>(who is, essentially, my "primary" when I'm in that town) but I don't feel
>that I managed to create an MLTR situation with her, mostly because I
>didn't actually find for myself any successfully landed targets. There were
>no other options. I did sarge, but only just barely. She kept me under
>wraps. And then there's this whole issue of not having my state-control
>very much in hand at all. It was a surprise, so naturally I wasn't very
>prepared for it.
You have three choices:

A. Accept the fact that when you are with her, she is the only woman
in your life at that moment. At the same time, stay alert to any
opportunities that present themselves by chance.
B.Tell her you like to be friendly and outgoing. Suggest going up and
talking to people, and just practicing being outgoing. Tell her that
it's good for your job (or some other such excuse). Then, with her, go
sarge GROUPS, just for practice. Of course, just approach and be
interesting, don't hardcore hit on anyone at first. Just see if she
enjoys it. Plus, your approaches will be awesome because no one would
suspect you're sarging.
C. Read through stuff like Major Mark's Building a Better GF and all
the MLTR threads. See if you can ease her, by very small steps, into a
bisexual experience or a MLTR. Start opening up her mind sexually:
maybe buy her the Nancy Friday book about women's fantasies, so that
she knows that it is common and together you can live out her fantasy
FOR HER.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 07 May 2002 21:01:00 GMT
subject: Re: Detecting AI's
Always assume she's interested, and proceed accordingly.
Make the above sentence your matra, dude, repeat it over and over.

Because even if she's not interested at first, thinking this way will
get her interested.
If you want an actual test, there are tons. One is to just suddenly
stop talking. See if she continues the convo. If she does, she's
interested.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 08 May 2002 10:25:00 GMT
subject: Ross on Walk-Ups II (Slight Return)
Hey, this is CPowles. I was GIVEN a nickname today, and thought it was
about time I had one. (For one thing, no one even spells my last name
right.) Anyway, regarding the Ross on walk-ups thread, I have some
thoughts on the TACTICS themselves.
For me, the gold advice, which Ross has always given, is the
Observation/Question/Intuition. This is my total fallback opener. I
have my own model for this:
A. You open with, "I have an intuition about you" or "I noticed
something about you" Then you make your truthful comment.
B. You continue and escalate with: "I'm curious about something." Then
you go into cold-reading, cube, handwriting analysis, demonstrating an
understanding of her world, whatever, and you're off and running.
It's so easy.
As for everything else in that thread, the best way I've learned to PU
is by watching other people use these techniques and the way they work
for them. Just because you don't agree with the put-on approach
doesn't mean the whole model doesn't work. In every model, there will
be some aspects that aren't congruent with your personality: fine,
don't use them. Besides, in my interpretation, the new SS is not about
repeating patterns word for word, it's about understanding and using
the principles behind them. (This applies to approaches too.) It's
about using the information that she gives you to trigger the states
that you want in her.
Ross's sense of humor may work for some guys, and not for others, but
I will guarantee you one thing: it works for him. This is a guy who is

out IN THE FIELD sarging every free moment he has. That's hardly even
true of most students, let alone teachers. He is not an armchair PUA.
So, anyway, unless you've seen Ross, Adonis, or Swinggcat really work
it, I wouldn't discredit the whole model. As I posted a few months
ago, I saw a waitress and a hostess (at the same restaurant)
practically fall in love with him after he spoke a maximum of ten
lines of dialogue!
Anyway, this whole thread is somewhat ridiculous, because we wouldn't

even be here without him.
Guess it's an Oedipal thing...
--The Artist Formerly Known as CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 08 May 2002 10:37:00 GMT
subject: Re: My great ass opener
I like it overall, but it sounds a little too much like a horny

grope-fest. Remember, a PUA is never horny or trying to cop a feel. A
PUA is sexual, but he doesn't give it away--it's a prize, a reward to
be earned. This is how I'd do it (credit to swinggcat for a couple
lines here):
>Me: Well check it out properly then, its not going to bite you!
>[Both move closer and point butt out to her]
>[They either give it a squeeze or laugh or decline to. If they laugh then
say,
>'well its not going to feel itself is it!', if decline then tease them.]
If they squeeze, go 180 on them and say, "Oh my god, I can't believe
you just squeezed my butt. You are so forward. Do you always do this
with guys you just met?" Then dust off your butt, "Geez. If you're
going to touch, touch a little higher."
(If you want, you can even PAWN here for a different set by saying:
"You see those girls over there. I bet they wouldn't just grab a
stranger's ass." Then ask them, "Can you believe what this girl right
here just did to me? I mean, can't a couple of guys talk amongst
themselves for a little while without being attacked and sexually
assaulted like pieces of meat.")

>ME: WHAT? ? [turn her round, then both you and wing give her ass a little
>squeeze]
Then DON'T squeeze their ass. It's too easy. Keep flip-flopping
frames. Play hard to get: tell her, "You know what, I don't know you
well enough yet. I mean, we just met, and you're already trying to get
me to feel you up. Just because you're easy doesn't mean I'm going to
go home with you."
Push-pull, push-pull, push-pull, push-pull-*close. Get it?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 09 May 2002 02:47:00 GMT
subject: Re: Cold Walkups for Party Invites
>I'll be having a few parties over the next couple months while class is out.
>I was wondering if anyone has done cold walkups to invite groups of girls. I
>think I could get the interaction going fairly well but it seems like even
>if they agree to come most will end up flaking primarily cause they don't
>know me and they will think about it too long/too much time will pass.
>
>I have no doubt this would be a low turnout tactic but this way I could
>practice my sarges at the same time with a decent excuse to approach. I'll
>be approaching college girls on campus, downtown, etc.. Only if they're 7's
>or up. The semester is over and the girls that are still in town should be
>primed for parties.
>
>What's the best way to play this? Should I act like the idea just came to me
>and I decided to tell these girls in the spur of the moment? Or should I act
>like I'm actively recruiting people for this party with fliers and such?
Do a standard approach, start to talk and demonstrate value. Then TIME

CONSTRAINT. Mid-routine, say, "Oh no, I have to go meet XXXXX or do
XXXX" (whatever gives you extra social proof but isn't bragging). Then
say, "But, listen, it was a pleasure talking to you and, if you want
to continue this, I'm having a party on Saturday."
NOW, you have two options here: If you only have a little rapport,
write down the address, phone, and info. Then give her a little extra

encouragement to come (there are sneaky NLP ways of doing this).

If you have good rapport, exchange numbers and tell her you'll call
her with the info.
If you do it as an afterthought, and invite them because they're

special, you'll have a better turnout than if you seem like you're
just actively recruiting any old woman for your party.
--TAFKACPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 09 May 2002 02:51:00 GMT
subject: Re: Opener...works 100% of the time!!!
I like the push-pull idea: an insult, then a compliment. But I think

the compliment is too strong and supplicating. That said, if it works
for you, then who needs my advice.
But why not begin more playful and not supplicating? My favorite new
opener:
"What kind of mischief are you guys up to now?"

If you don't get a good response, select the most playful person in
group and continue with, "She looks like a troublemaker. Look at the
way her (insert observation)."
I like this frame, of coming on like the authority figure of their

youth. A little imbedded age regression to soften up the bitch shield?
--CPowles
On Wed, 08 May 2002 20:10:00 -0400, mojo702 wrote:
>Now many of you may not agree with this opener because it's one in which you
do
>the ..."you are attractive...blah blah",(AFC??) but I tell you, this works
100%
>of the time to get you IN!!! It has been field tested!!! I have used it at
>least 50 times and it works! Try it.
>
>This works to get you to become instant friends (rapport) with any woman you

>want. You can use it ANYWHERE-- parties, clubs, work, supermarket, bookstore,
>airplane...wherever. It gets you immediate attention, since the woman runs
the
>gamut of FEELINGS in a split second, from irritation to confusion, chagrin,
>perplexity, pathos, relief, thankfulness, friendship, appreciation...and who
>knows, maybe even love. (ha ha)
>
>OK...you guys ready???
>
>You approach the girl and say, with a STRAIGHT face:
>
>"Pardon me, but aren't you embarrassed being here?"
>
>She will immediately become confused. Her thought process: "Is this a bad
>place to be?" "Is something wrong with my clothes/looks?" Do I have toilet
>paper stuck to the bottom of my shoe?" "Why should I be embarrassed? What's
>wrong?"
>
>So she'll ask rather indignantly...even angrily:
>
>"Why should I be embarrased?"
>
>Nearly all respond the same way. (There are variations). Answer her with the
>same STRAIGHT face and serious tone:
>
>"Oh! I thought it might be embarrassing being the prettiest girl at this
>party! Doesn't it embarrass you just a little bit?"
>
>Any walls of resistance she might have built up immediately come crashing
down.
>She'll smile/laugh, KINO YOU, and sometimes compliment the novel approach.
>Usually she's so relieved at not having something to be embarrased about that
>she actually begins to appreciate you at once. From here on out, YOU keep the
>convo going.
>
>Like I said in previous posts, I can approach and open with ANYONE (usually
>with this opener) but I then tend to stall out after a few minutes :(
>
>Anyways...Try it guys...it DOES work!!
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 09 May 2002 04:33:00 GMT

subject: The Window
I have to post this quickly. Late to meet a goddess HB (statuesque

belly-dancing Goth with a black Betty Page haircut and killer body),
who I haven't seen since my pre-ASF days. Anyway, I've been thinking
about:
The Window
With every HB you sarge, a window opens at some point. It may open for
a minute, a day, a week, or a year. And you MUST wait for the window
to open and make your move before it closes. Agree/disagree?
As soon as a woman meets you, she puts you in the "potential partner"
category if you make a good impression. It is then your job to
physically close her before she files you away somewhere else, and
moves on to another potential partner.
For others, you may be entertainment or interesting, and then it is

your job at some point on the first meeting to open the window into
greater possibilities.
The difficulty is determining how long the window will stay open: is
it just for that minute when you've got her really aroused, just for
that night when you're talking so intensely, or will she be into you
for weeks and months?
I think this may account for the flake factor: when you have great
rapport, but the HB doesn't call you back. You had an open window, but
it closed
.
Another example: I often find, if I'm sarging a married woman or a
woman with a bf, the window may be open for just that night only. In
other words, I can lay her that night, but if I don't and #close
instead, the follow-up phone calls are useless.
This, as expressed here, is an idea. I'd like to turn it into a

tactic, and a way to determine when the window will be open and for
how long. The lesson, of course, is that once the window opens, you
MUST enter it then, and push as far as you can without being so pushy
that she shuts it out of fear, distrust, or discomfort.
I'm not sure exactly where I'm going with this, but I'm hovering
around an idea or principle. Maybe I'll see God tonight on the subway,
or a vision of Rio.

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 09 May 2002 19:15:00 GMT
subject: Re: Opener...works 100% of the time!!!
On Thu, 09 May 2002 07:48:00 -0400, mojo702 wrote:
>Now if I can only get passed the fluff and my 1 routine and quit stalling...
>
Advice: Get a second routine. Start a new thread on it, and I'll help
you.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 09 May 2002 19:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: what to say?
On Thu, 09 May 2002 10:27:00 -0400, battousai wrote:
>Greetings PUA's
>
>What's a good counter for the "maybe next time" BS? I've been getting a lot
of
>that lately when I try to close (#-close, meeting, whatever).
>
>battousai
You must be doing something wrong BEFORE the #close. I usually don't
get that, but then I never #close unless I've built enough rapport to
get the #. Depending on the HB, this can take from 5-15 minutes.
Discuss your routine here, and maybe we can help you.
However, Sin, a PUA who doesn't post here, once encountered this. Just
say, "There might not be a later"--with a smile (important). Then

point to your cheek and say, "Kiss goodbye." Then walk away.
Now, just reapproach this same girl later, and then build the rapport
you need for the number. When Sin did this, the chick gave him the
number finally, and they started dating. I later asked the girl what
made her want to date Sin, and she said it was the gutsiness he had to
approach a second time. Because most guys wouldn't.
To quote Mys, The PUA is the exception to the rule.
--CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 10 May 2002 08:39:00 GMT
On Fri, 10 May 2002 03:26:00 -0400, BizGuy wrote:
>Not wait for it...create it...remember you are the prize so show value by
>showing your values and what you want from life and if she's into it give her
>an opportunity...remember every HB wants a challenge...if I'm thinking that I
>have to jump on a wondow she creates there is no challenge because she defines
>the rules...she will get bored with me fast this way (I'd be just like every
>other guy she meets)
I do agree with you and Maddash: as a PUA, you CAN create and open the
window. BUT, that is only when you're WITH her. If the window opens,
and because of some circumstance you don't move in then and there, you
may not get the chance to see her again to re-open that window.
(Mystery, for what it's worth, is more extreme than me: he sees the
window as a one-shot deal: it opens, and if you don't phase shift and
go for it, it's over--pass her on to someone else.)
>Maybe..or it might tell me that during my phone convo with her I did something
>to decrease her interest in me or maybe something is going on in her life that
>made our rapport less than important.
>
>
>Yes..but there's a lot of things completely out of your knowledge and you just
>can't compensate for...she may be on her period, she may have had a death in
>the family last week...who knows...it may have nothing to do with you.

>
>
All you examples above here mean that the window closed on you
(external things can close them as much as internal thoughts).
From reading the other posts above, it is the strangest thing when
you're IN with an HB one day, but the next you don't get calls
returned. The window opens and shuts, whether due to her own
fickleness or to other events in her life. I guess the message is
this: When you feel that the window is open (or that you've opened the
window), get in as far as you can, so that when it shuts again, you're
already inside.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 10 May 2002 08:47:00 GMT
subject: Re: what to say?
On Thu, 09 May 2002 23:35:00 -0400, battousai wrote:
>me: I like your workout routine - just watch other ppl get tired, and maybe
>you'll get tired as well
>HBgym: Laughs
>Me: You CAN join them you know?
>HBgym: No I work here
>Me: Oh, your new blah blah (I ask her abt work, its challenges,is it fun)
>HBgym: blah blah blah (all smiles)
>Me: You look younger than the other instructors...
>HBgym: I just graduated
>Me: (ask her abt school, differences in the "fun" of school vs work etc)
>HBgym: blah blah blah (all smiles)
>Me: I got to go now. But hey, give me your number
>HBgym: umm, Maybe next time
Ahh, I see. This is fluff, really. What have YOU done to either:
A. Demonstrate value--show that you're different from the other guys.
OR
B. Demonstrate an understanding of her world.
You must make her WANT your number. You have to make it so that if you
walked away and DIDN'T exchange numbers, she'd be upset and thinking
about it all day. How do you do this, you ask? RTFM. You made a joke,

and a cute opener. Then what? Any guy can do that. Learn the Cube or
handwriting analysis for starters. Read Rio's Cold Reading posts. This
is all good newbie stuff, before you internalize it all. Then you can
INSTANTLY get out of fluff and say, "You know what, there's something
very different and original about the way you think.... I'm curious
about something.... " Then go into HW, EV, Cube, whatever...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 12 May 2002 13:25:00 GMT
On Sat, 11 May 2002 14:55:00 -0400, sandworm wrote:
> I don't think you have to passively wait for "the window". I think you can
>create it..and here is the kicker:using anchoring, a tool you have yet to
>really explore(no offense intended) you can open the window pretty much
ANYTIME
>you can re-establish contact.
Yes, I still must master this. I'm just starting to use it now. But so
far, the only anchoring that's been working for me is SUPER-OVERT
anchoring. In other words, if she's complaining about her bf, I'll
have her do a little puppet show with our cell phones. And her cell
phone will be the bf she's upset with. This way, all her bad feelings
about her bf are anchored to the cell phone that she takes home with
her and uses all the time. This worked out perfect the other night,
because the bf called and bitched her out on her cell phone--and that
really reinforced the anchor.
But, yes, I must really learn to do this right, in the way you say.
Cause at present, I'm not good enough to anchor the window and re=open
it by triggering the anchor.
>
> That last part is the key: some chicks are so enturmoiled, busy, distracted,
>that establishing the second contact becomes nearly impossible...or, in the
>meantime, someone else has come along and closed the deal.
yes, especially the hotter HBs.

> And there are different kinds of windows; the most prominent being, she is
>back at your place, or you are both alone together SOMEWHERE, and she is ready
>to be closed, physically, and for whatever reason, it doesn't happen. THAT is
a
>very difficult window to re-open, if ever.
Fuck yeah. Been there!.
> However, if the window is she is very turned on, attracted to you, but you
>haven't yet been alone, that can be re-triggered with a modicum of anchoring
>skill.
>
> Go to: www.essential-skills.com They don't teach seduction...they DO teach
>distinctions, tools and skills that make seduction MUCH easier.
Will read, watch, and learn!
> I think you also have to factor in other things, like her physical
proximity,
>other intereferences in her life, emotional upsets that turn her off of all
>men, etc. etc. Also, there is something to the momentum of sweeping someone
>away and for them, being swept away. A seduction that drags on becomes a drag.
Yes, exactly! And so does trying to make plans for weeks...
> Or they have very enturmoiled, troubled lives. Don't discount that,
>especially with the younger, very hot ones. They look hot, but often their
>lives are miserable, melodramatic, fucked-up and painful. Nice flesh puppets,
>to be sure, but look at their LIVES. Many of them, mentally and emotionally,
>are still in High School...who is the coolest, who is in, who is out, but
>emotionally they don't know their asses from their elbows, or who their daddy
>is, or what it all means.
Very true, especially here.
> Chris, if you are using THEIR structures, processes and signals, it shouldn't
>be such a problem to create the window, naturally and then step through, IF
you
>so choose. So what mechanism in you might be preventing you from leaping on
>these opportunities?
>
> Could it be that creating these windows is still so new and unexpected, it
>throws you off balance and makes YOU feel out of control, more than them?
Ross, you NAILED it here. I can create the window, no problem now, but

you're 100 percent right about what SOMETIMES happens. Especially when
I'm unprepared because it happens so fast, or feel unworthy of such a
HOT HB.
> How about if you could create a symbol that represented "unexpected
>opportunity, boldly and rapidly seized"? And make sure it is energized and
>flashes in your body and mind whenever you feel that signal that used to say,
>"Wow...I think she's ready...what do I do now?"
Yes, let's talk more about this. i need to figure out how to create
this symbol! If it worked, I'd be in f-ing heaven.
> This isn't so much about windows, as it is about your willingness to cross
>over the bridge you have created, even if it appears to be a suspension bridge
>that is a bit rickety, bouncy, with some gaps in it, swaying in the
>breeze......but now you yell YEEEEHAHHHH! FUNNN! And scurry across......just
>stop looking down at the abyss...got it?
Exactly! I'm often waiting for the Golden Gate Bridge, when I should
just suck it up and across that rickety rope bridge.
You totally nailed the heart of my sticking point here. Seriously, I

could be getting laid like a movie star if I can incorporate this
advice. (That said, there's an hb in my bed right now who keeps trying
to get me off the computer: i'll post a FR later, mASF'ers..)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 12 May 2002 23:54:00 GMT
subject: Re: FAILURE : Cube didn't work...
This whole convo sound a little too supplicating to me. See comments
below:
>I met up with someone who works in my company. (I know the rules... but I
>thought it would be good practice!)
Good attitude, though.
>"HORSE"
>The horse is ON THE CUBE (!) and galloping.. (she laughs and then says that

>it'll fall off!)

>
>Now I ran though some of the basic interpretation that I found on
>www.pickupguide.com but I had NO IDEA about what the horse galloping ON the
>cube means! Anyone have ideas?
Dude, it doesn't matter what's RIGHT. Read Rio's posts on cold-reading

here. Just say: A. What seems right FOR HER. And B. What leads her to
the desired state you want.
If the horse is galloping on top of the cube and looks like it is
going to fall off, to me you could say that it means she has
passionate relationships, and lets men get very close to her quickly,
but then it gets hard to balance her own life with the intensity of
this new man." Watch her as you say this; see if she's nodding in
agreement, elicit feedback from her, then pattern. "Wouldn't it be
great if you could have this instensity of a new relationship that you
crave, but without completely losing yourself or your identity or your
balance in the process. What do you think you would you have to do or
change to get this?"
>After lunch we go to a coffee bar and I ask her about her dreams and where she
>wants to be in a year's time. She starts giving very flaky answers... e.g. "I
>have many goals". I ask her about specifics...
Tease her more, instead of trying to press for these deep convos she's
not so into.
>ME : "[Since you have many goals] what is your main one?"
>
>HB-Nutter : "To save the world!"
Now, spin a funny story. Imagine HB-nutter as a superhero. Joke around

about that, get some kino going. Fuck the EV, or just return to it
later.
>ME : "That's interesting... what appeals to you about that?"

>
>HB-Nutter "I don't know... maybe it's because I want to do good things"
Now, get playful again. Convince her that she's just a bad girl
pretending to be good, that's why she has these fantasies. There are
posts somewhere here on reframing that will tell you how to do this.
It's the specialty of Swinggcat and Adonis.
>HB-Nutter : "Dunno... I'll have to think about this!"

See, EV didn't work. Playful, fun, teasing would have.
>I don't get that far using this either... I fluff for a while to re-think my
>strategy.
Ah, this is your problem: too much thinking and rethinking. Don't be
afraid to be YOURSELF sometimes.
>We chat for a while about her holiday to Thailand. I try asking her
>about what she's looking forward to... she looks at me a bit blankly...
>
>ME : "Is it spending time with your friends or visiting the country that
you're
>looking forward to?"
>
>HB-Nutter : "Well... I don't think I would be going if I wasn't gonna meet my
>friends there"
Tease, tease, tease. Bust balls. She's asking for it. She'd love it.
And, take a tip from Juggler, forget getting material from her: You
lead. You tell stories. You dominate!
>Anyway... kino works well and we're linking arms walking down the street. She
>even turns it into a bit of a game where she walks in "anti-step" to me so we
>carry on like this and we degenerate into a game of "tug-of=war".
Nice, fun. Explain a little more "anti-step." I may try this myself
with HBs!!!
>A few hours after I'm getting really frustrated with the lack of feedback.
Forget about it. That's not her. She's not going to give it to you.
Trust your material, and just go full-steam.
>She
>asks me whether I would like to go to an art exhibition with one of her
friends
>in about an hour's time. I say "no" and that I need to catch up with someone
in
>the area. (I'm trying to TA)
>
>When I try to leave I get a kiss on both cheeks (she grew up in France for a
>while and this is standard for them).
You're coming on too forward, too easy, this whole time. Whenever

someone tries to kiss me on both cheeks (EVEN if it's their custom), I

always say, "Don't be greedy now" after the first cheek and don't let
her kiss the second cheek. (Thanks to Mystery for that one. It
infuriates the HBs, but they love it)
>I give her some directions and prepare to

>go in the opposite direction. But she decides that she will take a different
>route to walk with me to Shaftsbury Avenue. (So how do you interpret this?)
>
>I try to *close again, get a kiss on both checks again... I said "let's try
>that again". And I get the same double check kiss. I pull away and say "you're
>a bit boring aren't you... that's not a proper kiss". She laughs and says
"what
>do you mean?". Then she steps right back nervously and says bye.
>
>Now, what the f&*k have I done wrong...
Nice persistence, and nice criticizing/punishing her for not

responding.
Obviously, you're a good, likable guy, and she clearly liked spending
time with you. But it doesn't seem like you seduced her. NO SOIs from
you,but maybe you don't want to risk it with a girl you work with.
Also, I find that getting the tongue down as the goodbye kiss works
less with HBs; why start something you can't finish? I don't go for
the "special goodbye kiss" anymore; i try to get that kiss MUCH
earlier.
Nice practice and nicely detailed report, though.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 13 May 2002 00:04:00 GMT
subject: Talking with Passion
I recently added something to my PU arsenal. It's an old pre-ASF

tactic I had that I completely forgot about as I embraced this new
stuff. And it's so simple:
Talk about ANYTHING with passion. The less interested she may be in
it, the better. I've noticed that once you start to get in with a
girl, if you just talk for five minutes about ANYTHING you care about,
she trances out. She'll stop listening, and just look at you, thinking

about kissing you.
One reason this works is because she likes and respects that you have
a passion for something (and she'd like to be the recipient of that
passion). Another is because you're not trying to PU her--you have
something better to do. And maybe she's even bored of the story and
doesn't want to interrupt, so her mind wanders and she starts thinking
those...naughty thoughts. If you catch her doing this, you can just
stop mid-sentence and make total hardcore eye contact, then briefly
glance at her lips and back to her eyes. Watch her reaction, and use
the Mys *close: "Would you like to kiss me?" I recently tried this,
and she hesitated (they rarely say yes), so I went in for the kiss.
Honestly, man, it can be about whatever: the new bed you bought for
your house (Juggler's routine); that computer code you were trying to
write today; a family memory; how to tame lions (a funny routine from
an old mediocre pickup movie, The Knack and How To Get It); whatever.
Just:
A. Don't worry about whether she's interested or not.
B. Talk about it with passion--this is something you REALLY care
about. Girls respect that. It shows a lot of alpha qualities; you're
the center of attention, you have ambition and drive, you have a life,
you are a commanding and interesting presence, you are kissable.
This seems obvious, but I never see anyone discussing it here

(especially those who are so focused on gimmicks and EV'ing etc.).
Thoughts? Comments? Differences of opinion?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 14 May 2002 12:11:00 GMT
subject: A Risky Experiment: Being My Self
I've been trying an experiment lately. The experiment is to practice

being myself. Or, more accurately, to test out my "new self." I
haven't been using routines, gimmicks, or canned openers. No "spells,"
no rikki lake, no cube, no HW analysis, no conscious NLP, nothing.
The result: the new me, without all these tricks, attracts 7s and
below easy. Every night I go out, one will latch on to me, whether i'm
at a club or at dinner, like a puppy dog. Closing 8's takes more work,

and 9's and 10's are nearly impossible without my usual routines. Of
course, before ASF, it was rare to get a pet girl following me around
at all, so this is a big improvement. After tonight, I'll return to
the usual routines and game, and after a few more months I'll try to
temporarily drop them and see if I can get the 8's and 9's naturally
without having to think consciously about it.
Here are the things the "new me" does naturally that work for him:
1. Tease, bust balls, be direct, and always do the opposite of what's

expected. Examples:
A. An HB tonight says, "I wish we got to talk more. You seem very
nice." Me: "No, I'm very, very mean."
B. I'm talking with a guy friend, and an Asian HB he knows starts

listening. I tell her, "This is a PRIVATE conversation." (She sulks
off, and of course I approach her at a later point.)
C. HB asks, "So what's your story?" Me: "That's a boring question. Ask
a better one."
D. My new FAVORITE comeback that popped in my head tonight (though I'm

sure it's not a new line). When she called me a player, I said,
teasingly, "Hey, don't hate the players, hate the game."
E. When an HB tonight asked if I wanted to go to a movie premiere with

her, I said, "Is this a date? Because if it is, I expect you to pick
me up and buy me dinner too."
F. If an HB says she really values truth, before I tell her another

story, I'll preface it with or interrupt it with, "By the way, this is
a total lie."
2. Do takeaways but don't let the HB do takeaways. Also, punish and

reward behavoir.
In other words, I'll walk away and pay attention to other HBs if I
want, but if she doesn't give me her FULL attention ALL the time I
will neg and tell her I'm not going to waste my time talking to her.
The Asian HB started looking over my shoulder when I was telling a
story and I just said, "Pay attention to me when I'm talking." She
said that she liked the way I said it, that it turned her on. It's
very alpha: she MUST listen to whatever you're saying (even if it's
the most trivial detail) as if it's the most important thing in her
life right then. You won't stand for anything else. (You're Daddy!)

3. Social proof.
This is so important. You must be seen with other girls--not seen
hitting on them, but seen with THEM hitting on you. If not, it must be
discussed in a natural, non-bragging way. When tonight's obligatory 7
was following me around, suddenly her friend pulled her away to talk.
Do you know what she said? "Are you madly in love with him? You know,
he dates the most beautiful women." (I don't even know her friend, so
I'm not sure how that news got out but I LOVE it.)
4. Radiate confidence
A guy even asked me tonight if I was a celebrity. LOL.
5. Not care about the outcome.

But when she's in the state where she's ready for a # or a *,
recognize it and go for it.
6. Talk with passion, with intensity, with eye contact, with slower
words and gestures
Discussed in a previous post in tactics, but basically tonight I
didn't use any PU patterns or stories, even the true-to-life ones I
like to tell. I talked for like 15 minutes about a seal that kept
following me around when I was surfing yesterday, and the HBs gathered
around and loved it. I had no goal here, wasn't trying to demonstrate
any quality, wasn't trying to imbed commands or turn her on. I was
just excited to see a seal, though I was worried that he was following
me because he thought my feet were fish.
7. Make the HB feel like SHE is special.

This may sound like AFC shit, but it's PUA shit. If you're negging,
teasing, doing takeways, and admitting to be a player, to really get
an HB, at some point I will let her know that she is NOT just another
HB, that I recognize a quality in her that I respect her for. (IOW,
she is earning MY rare and valuable respect.) And I try to pick a
quality that AFCs don't notice right away. So it will be intelligence,
sense of humor, sense of style, no-nonsense go-getter attitude,
adventurous spirit, whatever.
I think there are a few more things, but the key combo seems to be
cocky/funny/unpredictable + takeways + social proof + a perceptive
compliment = attraction.
CPowles
================================================================================

================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 14 May 2002 12:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: A Risky Experiment: Being My Self
>C. HB asks, "So what's your story?" Me: "That's a boring question. Ask
>a better one."
Actually, I said, "That's a terrible question." No big difference, but

thought I'd correct it in case this post goes in anyone's seduction
files (because it is, after all, so chock full of valuable
information, LOL).
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 14 May 2002 12:27:00 GMT
subject: Need a New *Close Technique
Do you ever feel, when you PU, that there's just a blank spot. You
reach a certain stage in the sarge, and suddenly everything goes white
because you realize that for this specific situation, you know of no
effective tactic.
Well, what I'm looking for is a small speech, a paragraph long, to amp
up the heat for a *close. Mys likes the "Would you like to kiss me?"
line. That is a pattern interrupt, and good in some situations. Just
going for it is good in other situations. But there are some
borderline situations, where the HB likes you, and all you have to do
is pull her into some private space, say something special and
meaningful, and then *. Well, what is that SOMETHING? Anyone want to
write something out or share something they use?
In exchange, I will share an insta-*close technique that worked for me

tonight.
About 30 seconds after approach, I said, "Let's talk about something

more interesting. Let's talk about men and women and relationships."
Then I basically recited what was in my "chick logic: explain it"
post, about how when chicks saw me making out with other HBs, they

grew more attracted to me; but when I ssee a chick I'm with hitting on
another guy, I eject her.
She had just seen me with another HB, so she said, "So are you into
some girl here? Do you want me to kiss you?"
That wasn't my intention. But as she said it, I bet she could see the
lightbulb go on in my head. DING: NEW PU PATTERN. Of course, I said,
"Yes." And had an okay, tongue-waggling *close. Time elapsed: two
minutes. Of course, afterwards, I had to be a smart ass. "Thanks.
Normally I charge $20 for that."
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 14 May 2002 13:05:00 GMT
subject: Re: Need a New *Close Technique
To quote Toecutter:
"There are three steps to closing a sale:

A. Recognizing the time to close
B. Deciding on your closing technique
C. Making the closing statement."
We are looking, in this thread, for C, the *closing statement....
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 14 May 2002 20:42:00 GMT
>I am curious as to whether you have any dating handicaps that you have
overcome
>with the techniques (ie. short, balding, overweight, etc.)
>I am "blessed" with all 3 of those things and my experience is that the
>techniques help a lot w/self esteem and with dealing with women once I get
>something rolling, but for the most part, I don't even get 5-7's "following me

>around".
EVERY time someone has success, there's always a poster looking for
ANOTHER reason why it worked. What is the POINT of doing that? Does it
HELP your game?
LIke Juggler, I laughed when I read your post. I have two of the three
problems you list below--actually three of the four complaints you
list in your post. But I NEVER think about them. A lot is in your
control: shave your head, get a tan, work out, and, hell, try some
platform boots for fun one night. Some of them are very subtle. I was
with an HB who was 6'2" in heels yesterday, just towering over me. You
know what? You see little pot-bellied guido dudes with tall blondes
all the time. And do you know why they can get them? Because they are
POWERFUL and CONFIDENT enough to handle them.
Actually, I talked to an HB I've known for a long time. She said she
found some pictures of me from three years ago, and was talking about
how much better I looked know. "You're aging well," she joked.
"It's not genetics," I told her. "It's attitude!"
However, because of Juggler's negging post, I am no longer confident

and cannot sarge anymore. Thanks, Juggler. Why don't you find a more
dashingly handsome PUA to stay with when you're in LA!
>It's good to know I'm not doomed and Styles does have an edge.
What's my edge? A sense of style? Buy one cool outfit to sarge in, and
we're even.
Stop making excuses. What is their purpose? How do they help your
game?
Practice, practice, practice. Sarge everybody, everywhere, every time.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 15 May 2002 07:07:00 GMT

Bad Form and Dreem, really great posts. (Maddash, yours sucked.) As I
read this, I realize that there's one PUA element I haven't
internalized yet and it's a key ingredient:
Be a Sexual Being; convey from the get-go the notion that you are a
sexual man, and that you expect sex and will not waste your time even
talking with an HB if this is not part of the bargain.
I suppose it's what MrSex4UNYC was so good at. Any suggestions for
internalizing this attitude? Does anyone here REALLY have this
attitude, and have it work for them consistently?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 15 May 2002 19:10:00 GMT
>Dude, I have tried this "Being myself" thing out once, and I got some mixed
>reactions with it. Like I purposefully stripped myself of any fun
>conversation and tried to act "adult". Then I went to a party.
Rio, you weren't really trying to BE YOURSELF here. Is the REAL Rio
completely stripped of fun? Is the real RIO totally an adult all the
time. No, you were playing a character, who contains a PART of
yourself. You weren't being your FULL self.
>What happened... Ok, I approached a lot, and fluffed with all the chicks. I
>gave them all the unemotional look. I didn't act like some kind of
>happy-puppy dog around them. I ran no fancy entertainment routines. I
>displayed very little personality.
Does your REAL SELF have no personality to display? If you're going to

be yourself, wouldn't it make sense that you'd display more than a
little personality? Sounds not like you're being yourself in this
experiment, but that you're holding your self back.
>Conversation didn't get very far at all - I guess my content was boring
>(deliberately)
Again, you're neutering yourself, not being yourself.

>The other guys have amassed social proof from the HBs, whilst I have amassed
>social proof from the UGs (who I could fuck at least - but.... why?)
>
>I do overhear that there are chick interested in me, but in my current state
>of mind, I haven't got a clue how to close it (again, not trying)
At least, the HBs sense that the heart of a PUA beats somewhere
beneath the no-fun, no-personality charade.
ny suggestions for
>I am a big fan of Svengali's work, because he embodies this whole "I'm going
>to give you a chance to get me, but if you don't I don't care" attitude. He
>just casually drops a single, powerful line and effortlessly moves to the
>next chick.
I'll read his archived posts. I've never read them before.
>Also, I have one question that I would like discussed:

>
>There are chicks who hang around affeminate guys a lot, and yet completely
>avoid giving any positive attention to obvious alpha-males in a given social
>situation. Now, this kind of social proof you would think would help
>affeminate guys get laid, but they don't. Instead they are blindly led into
>supplicating to these women.
>HOW then, does social proof help the PUA? What if the other women watching
>this affeminate guys' swarm of chicks KNOW that these women are using him
>blind, and that he is not, in fact, a good fuck but rather an emotional
>blanket?
>
>I think the answer lies in the KINDS of interest women show in a guy, that
>determines social proof. It's one thing for a chick to tell another chick
>that "This guy is so sweet and caring, I like him" and a different thing for
>a chick to tell another chick that "This guy is clowing around and having
>fun, I like him."
>
>What we WANT a chick to say about us is "This guy is a REALLY GREAT fuck, I
>LOVE him.". THAT is the kind of social proof we must build.
>
Yes. Good point. The wussy "friend" guy is a "safe" guy. The PUA is
not safe. He's exciting. And the difference, in my mind is this:
The wussy sweet friend is on the girl's trip. He is following her--her

moods, her thoughts, where she goes, what she says.

The PUA has the girl on HIS trip. She is supplicating to him, trying
to please him, following his conversational lead, looking lost and
confused when he leaves.
The difference between the two is WHO is in control: the guy or the
girl! And this is something that other HBs can see and sense easily...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 15 May 2002 19:17:00 GMT
subject: Re: Talking with Passion
On Wed, 15 May 2002 06:03:00 -0400, Dreamer wrote:
>His close? "I just wanna do SOMETHIN right now" in a latino lover
>accent said extremely passionately then major kiss close. I like
>telling this story and doing the impression then going for the close.
>It's such a powerful thing for women that latino lover thing.
>Be passionate about passion. I have a routine where I talk about how
>it's great to have a passion in your life. I've lately been working
>on challenging chicks to match my passion and so far I've been getting
>lots of improvements in their reactions.
When talking about passion specifically, you might want to try this:
"Do you know what passion is? It's root is from the Latin word for
abandonment. Passion is giving up oneself, abandonment. It's losing
yourself in something, whether it's this guy, a sport, art, or just a
moment. And only then, when you really trust yourself to let go of
yourself, can you find the things that truly fulfill you---love,
learning, and most importantly yourself."
You can amp up by having her take a deep breath and then try letting
go, right now, and just being completely in the moment together. Then
go for the *close.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Wed, 15 May 2002 19:19:00 GMT
On Tue, 14 May 2002 07:27:00 -0400, Style wrote:
>Well, what I'm looking for is a small speech, a paragraph long, to amp
>up the heat for a *close. Mys likes the "Would you like to kiss me?"
>line. That is a pattern interrupt, and good in some situations. Just
>going for it is good in other situations. But there are some
>borderline situations, where the HB likes you, and all you have to do
>is pull her into some private space, say something special and
>meaningful, and then *. Well, what is that SOMETHING? Anyone want to
>write something out or share something they use?
Is Alessandro the only guy here who kisses girls?
Come on, let's hear some *close patterns!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 17 May 2002 18:09:00 GMT
subject: Re: Comments, advice, info? For a Newbie PUA -to-be...
Nice, you're already further along than most people. You also really
naturally used some of the basic principles of ASF: pawning, negging,
etc. And you can BET that the 9+ is thinking a lot about you, because
guys usually DON'T say that to her. They stare at her tits, and maybe
say something stupid, when she fixes her bra like that.
So, the trick is, once you push them away (with the ignoring and
negging), you have to reel them back in. You have to break into her
world hardcore, and surprise her with how well you understand what SHE
goes through. Here's what I would have said, and this is straight-up
adapted from Ross J stuff:
" You know what, a lot of people here are so immature. All they focus
on is how something looks. But I learned, from an early age (it's a
long story, I'll tell you some other time), that beauty is common.
Sure, it's work to maintain, but so what if you're beautiful? There
are so many beautiful people in the world. Look around. Big deal!
Beauty is an accident--so you got lucky in the gene pool--but what

have YOU made of yourself. That's what I'm interested in. So for me
when I meet someone that is attractive, it does nothing for me. And in
fact I often wonder if they've gotten lazy cultivaitng the other
parts of their personality, the ones that don't fade. What I usually
like to ask them is: what are three things about you that a man would
find attractive, and none of them can be about your looks."
Then wait for her to answer the question. It should blow her away. And
if she starts to qualify herself to you, you're in.
I think you want to demonstrate to her that you're not like other
guys. Once you've done this, you can begin to let her know that you're
a sexual guy, but not a horny guy. And if she's deserving you might
consider sharing what you've learned over the last couple
years--because you are much wiser and more experienced than the other
dumb guys in your high school. They say that girls mature before boys,
but that was never true for YOU, because YOU... (insert story here:
maybe you grew up around a lot of women, maybe you were corrupted at
an early age, whatever).
Keep us updated on your progress, young pua-to-be.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 17 May 2002 18:15:00 GMT
On Thu, 16 May 2002 16:04:00 -0400, throughfare wrote:
>I've never asked a girl, of any age, about kissing. I always 'just do it'.
>
>You have to do it when the girl is ready.
A girl may want to kiss you, but the kiss needs to come in at the
right time, otherwise it won't work. Conversely, a girl may not be
thinking about kissing you at all, but if you create the right state
for a moment, you can do it. In my mind, a girl only needs to think
about what it would be like to kiss you for ONE SECOND (and of course
you can lead her there), and as long as you SENSE and MOVE IN within
that one second, you're in.

Here, for example, is a line from Dreamweaver that helps amp up that
state when you get it, spoken of course slowly etc: "You know that
moment before two people kiss for the first time? Don't you wish that
moment could last forever?"
>I wasn't aware of this Mystery technique. Does it work very often?
Yes, it's a state break. It works nicely, especially 7-20 minutes

after an approach. You should be able to find it easily in the
archives.
>I can finally see how this patterning stuff works. Had great success last
>night with on-the-fly patterning about Fantasy.
Wanna share it?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 17 May 2002 18:22:00 GMT
>"Do you wanna kiss me" is the best neg out there, gets a laugh all the
>time.
Hmm. Alessandro, you are an unusual cat. You have turned a *close into
your own cocky funny neg. When I say "Would you like to kiss me," it
is not a neg or a joke--it is to get a kiss. And, if you say it after
three IOIs, most of the time it will work. (She probably won't say
yes, but she will usually say maybe or stop to think: then you put a
finger under her chin, say come here, and kiss.)
>I adapted it differently though. I point at my lips and ask them "do
>you wanna kiss me here :-)" if she says yes, I go for it, if she says
>no, I put my finger on my butt and ask her "do you wanna kiss me
>here?".
I like this, but then again I don't. I like it as a joke. It's

actually pretty awesome and teasing. But the problem is that it
ASSUMES that you WON'T make the sale; its subconscious intent is to
get rejected, so that you can make the rest of the joke.
================================================================================


================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 17 May 2002 20:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: I NEED SUGGESTIONS!
On Fri, 17 May 2002 13:18:00 -0400, HotRod6969 wrote:
>I Have a GF, we've been going for 2 months now, and she hasn't givin it up.
She
>is a virgin. She says I will be her first, and that she wants to fuck me. now
>here is the confusing part, she says she wants to but, she isn't ready, I
>really don't understand. This is so AFC, but i want any suggestions on what i
>should do.
>
>HotRod
Here's the obvious answer: the girl will always tell you what SHE
needs. IOW, DO NOT PRESSURE HER. Instead, at some point when you're in
deep rapport with her, ask her what it would take for her to BE ready?
How will she know when she's ready? In an ideal situation, how has she
always imagined losing her virginity? In what context? How? (If she
seems ready right then, continue by asking "with gentle touches like
this," or "with a sense of authority and inevitability like this" and
just walk her towards it in this consenting, small-chunk way.)
Gather all the information you need, and then, later (or perhaps even
at the moment depending on her answer), create that scenario. If you
REALLY think about it, you'll be doing her an AMAZING favor. Because,
after all, how many women get to lose their virginity in just the
ideal scenario that they've always imagined?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 18 May 2002 21:07:00 GMT
Dreem and Kooper, nice stuff. That pattern about eyes open/eyes shut
goes in my permanent seduction file.

You get her imagining kissing, then you kiss her. I totally agree
Kooper. I think the setting IS important.
Another version of some of the stuff you posted that I use is

something like:
PUA: How good of a kisser would you say you are on a scale of one to
ten?"
HB: a 9. What about you?
PUA [This is a rough version]: Well, actually, I don't think there is
any such thing as a good kisser or a good lover. It's all about the
connection you have with your partner. Someone can be a good kisser
with one person (sp) and a bad kisser with another [gesture away].
It's all in the chemistry that two people have together. (If she's not
DDB by now, I go into a story about how I learned from a young age how
to discriminate btwn the kinds of people you just have okay sex with
once, and the kinds you just make love all night with, over and over.]
From here, we usually kiss. Then I pull back and say, "Yeah, you are a
9," then make out more.
Alessandro, I think you need to watch Mystery or I work. Then you'll

understand the "would you like to kiss me" *close. There is a time to
ball-bust, and a time to shut up and get some!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 18 May 2002 21:17:00 GMT
subject: Re: eliciting values & my obstinant ineptness
On Sat, 18 May 2002 00:25:00 -0400, Potsked wrote:
>hello players and lesbians, i seem to have a problem with eliciting values, i
>can transition from fluff into EV pretty quickly and smoothly but i can't seem
>to find the woman's ends values fast enough and feed them back to her through
>nlp fast enough and i get busted, like in this convo i had, it's pretty
>indicative of every attempt i've made so far with EV., (this is from an aim
>conversation)(and in media res (after some fluff))
>
>me:im guessing you get that alot, that stalker/hanger-on

>
>her:yep
>
>me:but you like the buff guys, right
>
>her:lol yes, i like them a little bit older than high school age too
>
>me:well, then bobby should be just your type, but oddly he's not
>
>me:why not?
>
>her:hes immature
>her:a pain in the ass
>her:conceited
>her:other girls may think hes hot but, i dont really think hes all that
>
>me:so what is it about those strapping college boys that makes you swoon?
>
>her:lol
>her:do you want physical characteristics?
>
>me:well, i hardly think that that's what a woman truly desires
>
>her:lol
>her:i donno, they are a little older
>
>me:well, a little older is quite superficial, how do these mature guys mkae
you
>feel?
>
>her:look! i dont know why, they are better!
>her:all around
>
>me:well, do you feel more protected around them, like you do around buff guys?
>
>her:they are a little older, a little wiser about things and how to treat a
>girl and stuff
You: So when you're around a guy who's totally buff, and is older than
you, and a little wiser about things. A guy who is mature enough to
know how to treat you in just the way that you like to be treated, how
does that make you feel...inside?
Her: Well, I don't know. I guess it makes me feel warm, and secure,
and protected.

You: Aha! So what you're really after is that warm, secure, and
protected feeling! It's not about buff guys really or older guys. The
fact is that if you could find another way to feel that warm, secure,
protected feeling, you'd enjoy that just as much, maybe even more.
Like right now, we're talking on the phone, and you're warm under your
covers and have that safe, protected feeling as you hear my voice,
like you know you're going to have a safe, beautiful, peaceful sleep.
MMM...isn't that nice...(said a little teasingly) we just fulfilled
your whole life goal right here on the phone You can go to sleep now.
Don't dream about me too much! Goodnight.
NOTE: In this last paragraph, you reframe, to show her how guys LIKE
YOU can help her experience her ends values. Later in the sarge, you
can tell her stories that reflect your values, like about how you are
much more mature for your age because you had a lot of sisters who
told you everything about how woman like to be treated. Etc. Etc.
Finally, BE THE FIRST TO END THE CONVERSATION! And LEAVE HER ON A
HIGH....
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 19 May 2002 11:55:00 GMT
subject: Re: IOI's
>2. Actively solicited IOIs: here you do a little test to see if she's
>interested. From what I remember Mystery would sometimes just stop talking
>and turn a little bit away from the HB. If she then first re-initiates the
>convo, that's a good IOI.
Other type 2 IOIs:
1. Lean back, away from her as you're talking. See if she leans in
closer.
2. Take her hands in yours. See if she squeezes back.
3. Say various phrases, and see if she ratifies them. For example, if
you're doing the Mys camera close, and you look at a picture of the
two of you together, and you say, "We make a great couple, don't we?"
If she agrees, that's a huge IOI.

4. Stand up, turn around, and fart in her face. If she doesn't turn
away or hold her nose, you're in.
I'll post more later.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 23 May 2002 09:31:00 GMT
subject: Re: Opinions on email closing?
In general, I like David DeAngelo's stuff: his cocky funny stuff has
been gold for me and many of us here. But there are a few principles
that I think sell his readers too short. One in particular is this
one-minute email close. You need:
A. A phone number. Because this way you can call, make a plan, and
you're on. With email ,now it's still another step to proceed to
phone. And then another step to "date." And this is assuming the HB
even really checks or responds to email. She may be too busy.
B. More time to make an impression on her. In 10 to 15 minutes, you

can build enough rapport to both get the number and have her excited
for you to call her: the mysterious exciting stranger who just may
sweep her off her feet.
A one-minute email close is not only "wood" (to quote Boiler Room) but
it's wimpy. If you're posting and reading here, you should have enough
game to talk to a girl you meet for 10-15 minutes and get her phone
number. Anything beneath that is selling yourself short (except in
extreme time constraint situations).
Finally, there is NO WAY this would work on most 10s! Think about it..
CPowles
'
In Mon, 20 May 2002 18:54:00 -0400, xx396 wrote:
>I've always been one for a #close and a specific ask out everytime, with ok
>success. But I like David's stuff so gave it a shot. I think he's right in

that
>it is dead easy to get an email but on reflection am not sure it was ideal.
She
>started with no and when i said, oh well make it your phone number then, she
>suddenly had an email address. Can't be a good sign :)
>
>Anyway, maybe I'm overanalysing but this close is discussed in DYD as being
>done pretty quick, like an afterthought to a quick conversation and takes down
>the womans defensives. But if you had such little rapport, why should they
>respond positively when you go for the (ahem) date? I also don't think it has
>the impact of a #, people obviously don't mind giving out email so them
>remembering giving it out and making the connection of who it is actually from
>is a worry. As you can see I didn't really think about my own opinion of this
>beforehand, and just did it! I guess I'll shut up if it works :)
>
>I think its a little worse because this particular close was someone i've seen
>4-5 times and spoke to but never really thought of asking out. That does seem
a
>bit of a cop out when you don't do it in person. Its amazing how some chicks
>can become more and more attractive each time you see them, she's gone from
>that ignore 6 to a 9, don't know how that happened, thats how decisive I am ;)
>
>Anyway basically all I'm saying is DeAngelo swears by this, does anyone else
>and how does it field test for you? Now to read up again on whats best to go
in
>the email, any ideas from people who have used it to good effect are welcome
:)
>
>Chris
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 25 May 2002 02:59:00 GMT
subject: Re: Sucky ass field report
On Sun, 19 May 2002 06:16:00 -0400, Maddash wrote:

> Nevertheless, I went out and tried a few new things:
>Style: I did the "nice eyes, can I touch them?" opener. Totally bombed
>twice, they were like "what?" and basically walked away. You have to coach
>me on this one, man.
Oh shit, Maddash. It's not an opener. You do it after you have

rapport. Then, to build state before the kiss, you do the "eyes" joke,
then the soul-gazing pattern, then kiss.
Cool that you used it, though! Gutsy...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 27 May 2002 08:33:00 GMT
subject: Re: Acquiring Social Proof
On Sun, 26 May 2002 15:15:00 -0400, marcc wrote:
>Right, my problem is the exact opposite, I have TONS AND TONS of social proof;
>chicks feeling me up, me feeling them up, they give me drinks, buy me small
>things, generally supplicate (not all the time but just that much that I can
>enjoy it nicely ;)).... yet I haven't *(erotic tonguedown, cuz lipkisses and
>stuff are regular here)/f closed a single girl in 2 months :/
Marcc,
Select a target! I know this problem: the HBs are all over you.
They're flirting with you a lot. You go for one, then get distracted
by another. Then one seems like she's easier, so you switch to her,
but then decide another is cuter. Then you go home, high from all the
attention but ALONE.
Try this: Walk in the room, look at the hottest HB there, and think
(to quote someone from the DYD seminar): "That is my future
ex-girlfriend." Work her the whole night. And working her doesn't mean
pay attention to her all night or follow her around like a puppy dog.
It means: KNOW that she is your target, that she will not escape the
club without you. All the other girls are for social proof and
fractionating. Don't lose sight of your target and your objective. Get
her competing for you, wanting for you, then isolate and make the bold
move.
I'm guessing you can't decide on WHICH HB you want and, even when you
do decide, you don't STICK to that decision.
CPowles
================================================================================


================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 29 May 2002 07:10:00 GMT
subject: Re: Public Speaking Class
On Tue, 28 May 2002 18:15:00 -0400, sombies00 wrote:
>I just started a Public Speaking class today, and there are a couple of HB in
>it. Tomorrow I have to do a 1 minute speech reading from anything I want
>(literally anything, the prof said people have used food wrappers, playboy
>jokes etc in the past). I was wondering if anyone had any good suggestions to
>help attract some of these HBs. Also alot of the future speeches in this class
>will be free form where we will be allowed to pick our own topic, so any other
>suggestions for those would also be appreciated.
>
Yes, buy Pablo Neruda "100 Love Sonnets." Choose your favorite. Say it
has sentimental value, then introduce it with a story about its
sentimental value with you and an ex-gf. Make it a tragic, bittersweet
story.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 29 May 2002 11:09:00 GMT
subject: Online Personals Photo Idea/Question
Never experimented with online sarging and personals, really, and

trying it now. Here's the question:
1. Send HB a picture of myself alone.

2. Send HB a picture of me with other HBs, and say it's the only photo
I have scanned.
Has anyone tried option 2? Logically, it seems like a good idea

because:
A. It's social proof and
B. It shows you're not the typical online loser who can't handle
himself around women.
For what it's worth, in my letters, I'm mixing the standard SS letter
with my own version of cocky/funny challenging ("You sound like you

may be more than just another pretty face. I need someone sharp-witted
too, who likes a little verbal sparring, because I'm a total
smart-ass. Grew up with too many girls in the house.")
CPowles
Any thoughts appreciated. This is a new world to me.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 30 May 2002 02:30:00 GMT
subject: Re: 3 somes
On Wed, 29 May 2002 17:20:00 -0400, Dee wrote:
>Hi all,
>
>My FB and I are going to go to a club on Saturday in London with the
>intention of picking up a girl to come back with us for a threesome.
>
>I've got her to agree to go and try and pick up anyone I point out to bring
>back with us.
>
>Has anyone got any pointers for how to make this work?
>
>My thoughts were to get my FB to flirt a bit to get her over, then we can
>both be flirtatious. Then I can massage the new girl while my FB maybe
>strokes her leg or something. Get her turned on, and then invite her back.
>But I'm not PUA yet, so I'd appreciate any advice on what to do and what to
>tell my FB to do.
>
>Thanks,
>Dee
>
HEre's some advice: courtesy of Rick H. His advice is: Go to a lesbian

bar. Seriously, do this by yourself if you need to. Watch how lesbian
chicks do it. The really successful bi chicks I know are like sexual
predators. They can afford to be MUCH more direct than guys, because
they are not threatening and do not trigger pre-programmed cultural
responses and dating frames. They just walk through the club. When
they spot a girl they want, they make HARDCORE sexual eye contact.
THey walk up to the girl and compliment her. They KINO a lot, and make
the girl feel sexy. It's like a tigress trapping a young chicken.

Eventually, they'll be making out in the club, so that when she takes
the girl home with her boyfriend, it's already a done deal.
There are other ways to do this: you can look up some of David Shade's
posts, or Rick H's posts in the archives of Cliff's list.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 31 May 2002 09:40:00 GMT
subject: Phase Shift: Step-by-Step
I've been discussing a lot with PUAs developing a routine for

phase-shifting. This is when you have all the IOIs from an HB, and are
done with rapport-building/teasing and ready to just go for it. Last
night,I met up with a platinum blonde South African HB. Short,
cute-body type. Anyway, I think I developed my phase-shift routine on
the fly (a combo of Mys Method, and a couple ideas from DYD seminar).
Feel free to use it, or comment on it:
1. We start talking about attraction, and I say that evolution has

wired us to get aroused at certain things. Then I say, for example,
feel this, and I run my hand up the back of her neck and grab a
fistfull of hair and pull it, downwards. She says "mmmm..." And I say
"see."
2. Then I say come closer. And I talk about how animals begin the
mating ritual by sniffing each other. Then I smell her hair, and under
her hair, and go into the whole "mmm, you smell good" thing.
3. She's into it, so I point to my neck and say, "Now, bite me here."
When she does, I say "mmmm, I love that."
4. I fractionate for a little while, and point to someone else in the

bar. Then I talk about how the most sensitive places on the body are
places that are usually hidden from contact with the air, like the
back of her neck. Then I take her arm, and I erotically bite the area
on the opposite side of the elbow (that crease where it bends). She
loves it, and falls into my arms. I brush her hair aside, and bite her
neck.
5. From here, I would normally go for the standard kiss. But my intent

was just to amp it up as much as I could without kissing, to really

get her hot. (I made out with her later back at my house, but no
f-close because she was buying us drinks all night and fucking passed
out cold on my floor. Ah, this is the life, huh?)
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 31 May 2002 09:54:00 GMT
subject: Re: Online Personals Photo Idea/Question
All great advice: Thanks!
For the record, I ended up combining a bunch of ideas here. I took a

photo of myself in a group. I cropped the rest of the group, so you
can see mostly just me, but you can tell that there are other HBs in
the image. This way, it looks like a fun, party shot--not like I just
cropped out an ex-girlfriend and am looking for a replacement. It
gives me social proof, without raising questions about "who's that in
the picture with you?"
Then, I took Tzeen's advice and turned it b-and-w and added some
shadows. It looks very cool. So far, it's worked on both of the HBs
who've emailed me. (One seems quite hot in a Lisa Loeb way; the other
may be a fattie, not sure.) Curious to see how this whole online
personals thing pans out. I'll post FRs. BTW, for my profile, instead
of doing the usual SS stuff, I just posted a bunch of funny stories
that I like to tell when sarging. It's gotten a great response.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 31 May 2002 22:33:00 GMT
subject: Create the NEW you
To rAFCs:
Try this.

As you are reading this material and growing more confident in

yourself and beginning to take on the identity of a seducer, reinforce
it by making a change in your APPEARANCE. This change will prevent you
from being anchored to your previous AFC self, from looking in the
mirror and remembering your old self-limiting beliefs. It will signify
the coming out of the new you. So, if your hair is thinning, shave it
all off. Every time you feel the wind blow against your bare head, or
an HB asks to touch it, or you see yourself in the mirror, you will
remember that this is the new, clean, confident you who isn't afraid
to walk through this world and take up space. The new you who women
notice and are attracted to. If you wear glasses, get LASIK. If you
have greasy black hair, consider cutting it, dying the tips blonde,
and spiking it up. If you have a generic look, give yourself an edge
with a tattoo or piercing. If you look like Maddash, consider
liposuction and a penis enlargement. Work out, get a tan, shape some
facial hair. Celebrate, show, and believe in the new you. Let the new
you be very present in every moment: eyes gleaming with life, energy
pushing outwards, healthy and tan.
When your old friends see you and say "You look different," you can
now respond: "That's because I am different."
Get it?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 03 Jun 2002 20:19:00 GMT
subject: Re: Would like 2 discuss 'I wanna bring frieds' test
I often wonder if it's a shit test, or just a case of the girl

piggybacking plans. I'd like to hear other's opinions.
Anyway, my two responses:
1. I only have tickets/room/etc for two, but I would love to meet your
friends sometimes. They sound cool/interesting.
2. Sure, but make sure there's more than one other person joining us.
This way, if we want to go off and talk alone, your friend won't be
sitting there all alone and bored. (This is a shit test for her, and

if she fails--and i've never had that happen--cancel.)
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 04 Jun 2002 05:51:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Last Word on Compliments (Was: Openers...)
On Tue, 04 Jun 2002 05:36:00 -0400, yaritai wrote:
>
>"You are so hot! In fact, if you can show me that you've got a great
>personality to match, I just may give you a shot at meeting me again."
>
>yaritai
Exactly. Superiority. You're keeping the upper hand. (I knew there was
an "acceptable" version of "you're so hot")
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 04 Jun 2002 10:12:00 GMT
subject: The Last Word on Compliments (Was: Openers...)
It is OKAY to compliment an HB as long as:
1. It is either original or sincere
2. It is from a position of superiority
A great PUA I know compliments even super-hot HBs, but in a

condescending way, as if he is their father or an authority figure. It
works great: "You look good today... Congratulate yourself."
In my game, I usually ballbust, and then reel them back in with a

sincere compliment-observation. It's also okay to open up with an
observation-compliment, so long as rules one and two are followed.

The compliments that don't work are when they come from an inferior
place ("you are so hot"). All of a sudden you've disqualified
yourself, because you're saying she's out of your league. So, to me,
rule #2 here is key: if you come from a position of superiority and
expertise (and are not really "impressed" or "intimidated" by whatever
trait it is you're complimenting), it can be part of your game. You
must have an opinion that she respects...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 05 Jun 2002 02:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Last Last word on Compliments
On Tue, 04 Jun 2002 16:12:00 -0400, juggler wrote:
>In general a compliment is too about her. You need her EVing you, asking about
>you, closing you. Don't start off the interaction by making it all about her.
>She has to earn your interest. She has to earn you being into her.
>
>But if you want to open with a compliment type statement here is how to do it:
>
>Make it, not about her, but about you and your standards.
>For example, take her hand and say, "I like rings like this. Some people
>believe they have magical properties."
>
>"I like the type of dancing you do."
>
>"I love hands like yours cause they are great for giving back rubs." Etc...
>
>See, it is NOT about HER, it is about YOUR standards.
Juggler, you should take my workshop, and I'll try to show you how
it's done. LOL. It's hard to express the tonality that I and my GM
friend use with these. They're a large part of his game, and he's been
with 350+ women. Anyway, we're coming from the same place: these
examples you give are all "compliments" that come from a place of
superiority. The way he does it is almost condescending at first. Very
funny.
BTW, I don't necessarily recommend compliments as on-the-spot openers:

observations or mixed-message "compliments" are better if they must be

used. Then she can earn a true, sincere, non-condescending compliment.
>That is the right timing for compliments. But if you START off the sarge with
a
>compliment then you can't do that in the end - you can't act as if you just
>noticed how great she is. You can't make her think that she is doing the
>chasing and that she has finally won.
BUT, you can start with a surface compliment (sense of style,

fingernails, dancing) and then she can earn a true deep insightful
compliment about her inner self. I don't see anyway how you'd
invalidate the effectiveness of saying something later, like, "don't
look at me like that. You're killing me...You're making it so hard to
talk to you....If only you knew the things I was thinking of doing to
you right now..."
On the other hand, a true sincere compliment delivered from a position

of authority has helped me open up obstacles and targets. I also use
them after I've ball-busted and pushed them away, to get them to
return.
There are different stages in a Pu when a well-timed compliment will

come in handy. But I guess the message is: It's a powerful weapon, so
wait to use it till you need it. Like a Get Out of Jail Free card.
But, in my mind, when you use a compliment from a position of
authority and almost condescension ("congratulate yourself"), it's
practically a neg anyway.
Whatever works...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 06 Jun 2002 18:43:00 GMT
subject: Re: As per request: Remembering phone numbers
Zan,
I used to use this to, in the right environment, to entertain an HB. I

tell her I have a photographic memory, and tell her to write down as

many numbers as she wants: like 20. Then I follow this system, and
recite it back to her--a minute later, 10 minutes later, 1 hour later,
in bed (if all goes well, lol). It usually freaks her out, especially
since for some reason they write down some combination of their
birthday, social security number, and phone number. You can also do a
#close, and tell them you'll meet at a cafe and teach them how to have
a photographic memory. I don't really do this anymore, but it can be
fun and does work.
Just another tool using another tool,

CPowles
On Thu, 06 Jun 2002 02:53:00 -0400, Zan wrote:
>Sort of off-topic, but...

>
>Someone asked me to post the technique I use to remember telephone numbers. I
>mentioned that I have been using a mnenomic device for years. And I still
>remember phone numbers from way back - like 10 or more years.
>
>In fact, with this system (which takes a fair bit of work to learn), I used to
>win bets. I would have someone write down a random number that was 100 digits
>long. Then I would have him read it off to me (sort of slowly). I wouldn't
even
>look at it. When he was finished, I could recite the 100 digit number forwards
>or backwards or start in the middle and go any direction. In fact, I can still
>remember some of those 100 digit numbers to this day.
>
>It was cool and I would win bets all the time. If you take the time to learn
>this, you will remember phone numbers with ease. There are other systems out
>there; this is just the one that I learned.
>
>Here is the gist of it:
>
>Pictures are far more easy to remember than numbers. So basically you
>transcribe the numbers into nouns. Every numeral has a corresponding consonant
>sound. You just have to remember the small chart below. For instance, 3 always
>has a 'm' sound and 1 always has a 'd' or 't' sound. See below.
>
>0 - s, z, soft-c
>1 - d, t, th
>2 - n
>3 - m
>4 - r
>5 - L
>6 - j, sh, soft-ch, soft-g

>7 - k, hard-c, hard-g, ng

>8 - f, v
>9 - p, b
>
>So once you remember this chart, and someone gives you a phone number, you use
>the letters above to try to make nouns from the numerals. Just add whatever
>vowels are necessary to make your words.
>
>For instance, girl gives you 379-2436. Hard to remember this phone number. But
>if we transcribe the digits to the consonant sounds from our chart, we get:
>
>3 - m
>7 - k
>9 - p
>4 - r
>2 - n
>4 - r
>1 - t
>
>Remember it is the *sounds* of these consonants that is important. For
instance
>the 8 could be either a 'v' or a 'f' sound and the 9 could be either a 'p' or
a
>'b' sound. Whatever works better for your word.
>
>So in the above example, chick says '3794241'. In my mind I am thinking
>'m-k-p-r-n-r-t'. Then I just make up words around this until something clicks.
>Like:
>
>"make brown rat" (hmmm)
>or
>"my cab ran red" (picture a cab running a red light)
>or
>"make porn art" (Bingo!)
>
>Picture this vivdly in your mind. Now when I think about this girl, I will
>remember 'make porn art' - I think of her and I making porn art together. And
>now I will never forget her number. Just transcribe it back.
>
>Ha ha, just describing it makes me think, "Ah, just go grab a fucking pen".
Too
>much work. But believe me, you will use it in other areas of your life as
well.
>
>It sounds far more difficult than it really is. Doesn't take long to get
>proficient and very fast at it. If you practice this for awhile - just do it

at
>your desk or the subway or whatever. Glance at something until you see a
number
>(like on a box or sign) and then practice making words out of it. You can
>practice anywhere all day long.
>
>Don't know how you other guys do it, but this is what I do. Maybe there is an
>easier way? I would be very interested in learning an easier method.
>
>More info at :
>
>http://www.mindtools.com/pages/article/newTIM_07.htm
>
>
>Zan
>
>*******************************************************
>Don Juan: So much fire is in you.
>Tisbea: How well you talk!
>Don Juan: How well you understand!
>Tisbea: I hope to God you're not lying.
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 06 Jun 2002 18:47:00 GMT
subject: Re: Huge confidence builder!
On Thu, 06 Jun 2002 03:31:00 -0400, apollo_nz wrote:
>Now I have short light brown hair, but this wig is long, fluffy and dark! So
I
>hit the town in my new costume, and a new identity. I acted all night as
>Arthur an exchange student from Brazil! I went wild, introducing myself to
>girls left and right. Confessing my undying love for girls that looked just
>like Maria from back home and generally having a great time all the time
>looking absolutely ridiculous!
Nice. This is a fucking hilarious routine too. And you learn that it's
all just a GAME and FUN--whether you're in a wig or not. And if you
look ridiculous in a wig, that must mean you look better without a
wig, which means that you should do BETTER with the HBs! Now try to
give yourself a permanent change--looks, hair, fashion--so that you

can peacock and showboat a bit more.
BTW, next time you do this, you should work in the routine from the
Don Juan move, where he kisses her hand, delivers that awesome
monologue in an accent, and gets the HB all worked up. I sometimes use
it. (I preface it by saying I'm quoting the movie, but then I deliver
it very sensually in a fake accent.) If you don't know it, someone can
probably post it here.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"CPowles" <0>
Sun, 09 Jun 2002 20:42:00 GMT
subject: Style and Maddash on the Loose
Maddash visited Style for four days of intensive sarging. Lots of

hotties, lots of new tactics. Here's a somewhat long report of one
busy night:
MD: Started by opening a 2-set at some cheesy sports bar. I walk up

with the cologne opener: From here, I work into "where are you from?"
(weak, I admit, but a warm-up) and then they talk a little about what
they do, etc. I tell them that I have to go back to Style and eat,
and I do a takeaway. I get HUGE IOI's at this point. We eat, and
head back to their table a little later. We corner the one with the
huge IOI's from earlier and #-close in about five minutes. I worked
into the convo the "Albino-Gary Coleman Opener" (style) AKA the
"short-guy opener" (MD) (credit also due to Swinggcat for this one):
Style: "Hey, we need to get a woman's opinion on something. We're

meeting a friend here, and he just broke up with his girlfriend. We're
supposed to give him some advice on meeting women. So what do you
think that women look for in guys at a bar?" After they answer, we
say, "Okay, there's just one thing you should know. He's 5'1"
and...did you ever watch Different Strokes? Do you remember Gary
Coleman? Well, he's like a white albino Gary Coleman." Then, when they
start to laugh, we neg them for being so shallow. From here, we elicit
a "value hierarchy," and ask what qualities he would have to have for
them to go out with them. Example: she says "funny," we say, "well,
what if he has no sense of humor?" Then she gives us her next highest
criteria. So, in general, after you say, "So, he's a white albino 5'1"
Gary Coleman who's not funny, rich, or really intelligent." And as she

laughs, you tease with, "Well, you know, you're not really his type
anyway. Sorry."
Also, he #closes her and promises to call so she can join us tonight,
Maddash holds out his hands. She puts hers on top, and he slaps them
(like the childhood game) and says, "Oh well, I can't call you
tonight. You're too slow."
MD: We end up at a half-trendy, half-cheesy club where Style knows the

doorman. I open up a bartender with cologne opener and we are very
nice to her. This is important, because when I'm sarging her at the
end of the night, she says, DDB, "You two are the only people who
introduced themselves to me all night."
We walk in and Style pulls a psychic-bitch opener (it would be known

as a "psychic" opener, but he's a bitch for not telling me how it's
done). I will spare you the details. Bitch. Anyway, he has a bunch
of latino 6's dripping for him within 45 seconds. Quite impressive.
I walk away and open a 3-set with the cologne opener, and then I
freeze and run out of shit to say, so I move (flawlessly) into the
accomplishment intro about Style (note from style: this is a new
tactic where you basically brag about your wing with a story, and it
social proofs both of you. Agree on a story beforehand.), telling them
how they just have to meet him later. They light up and I do a
takeaway. I come back to Style and hang around for a bit. I open up
another 2-set without success (and without detail, because I can't
remember much about it).
Style opens up with the Prom Date opener. I converse with B

Tall-Blonde (7.5). She resists but eventually breaks down. For some
reason, I am totally genuine with BTB, even though I am lying through
my teeth and telling her I own a club in Chicago. I work into
Mercenary routine ("I went to Mercenary school" ...etc etc etc ... too
long to post here) she is getting wet. At one point, these two
mention something about how they are having a good time. I tell them
"that's because you are talking to the two most interesting guys in
this entire place". They agree. Go, me. I forget the rest of the
set. We eventually do a takeaway.
Style: My target is very cute, great rapport, though I can't remember

now the routines I used. After, we spot two nice-bodied girls,
shimmying on the outskirts of the dancefloor. They look like they
think they're hot, so we come in with a neg and ask if they know that
they have matching dimples on their back. They say they're sisters.
Then we say that maybe the forceps dented them on the way out. Anyway,
MD takes one HB and I take the other. I neg mine about probably being

a tomboy as a child (my new favorite neg--WHEN it seems true) and

she's upset, though her sister agrees. I give her the Albino Gary
Coleman, but she says, 'whatever he does, make sure he doesn't
approach girls like you approached me.' I tell her, 'awww, that's
cute. you think I'm hitting on you.' I'm REALLY losing her (and this
is the fun of the game), I reel her back in with a value elicitation
that tells her a lot about herself.
MD: I launch into a palm-reading routine with the gypsy-Indian sister

HB. I go into how her mound of venus is low, and ask if she's a
virgin. She says "almost", and the humor is lost. However, the
impact is heightened. I keep going for awhile, and then notice that
she has man hands. I remark on this and she flips out. Uh, can you
say neg-gone-bad? She tells me that I can go talk to someone else
with that attitude, I can go ask other females if they are really men,
etc. I apologize, and ask her if she has a good sense of humor or
not, I tell her how I am really genuine and I just say what's on my
mind and I assume everyone has a good sense of humor, but she's not
biting. I decide to give up, and end with "Are you a bitch to
everyone, or just people cooler than you?". To my surprise, she
apologizes to me. HFS. I wasn't expecting that, I was expecting a
kick in the nuts. Takeaway.
Back to the VIP room. Mighty fucking fine blonde with big-ass C-D
cups, fish-net top, no bra, fucking A awesome, Mad dash style bizatch.
Style and I work in with the cologne opener, and for some reason I
really get into Stacy and the convo flows smoothly. We talk about her
home town, New Orleans, and I launch into a story that I forgot I had,
the New Orleans "I can't believe I didn't end up getting mugged but
ended up in the coolest ever party 2 blocks west of the French
quarter" story. Good one, me. She loves me. Takeaway.
Style: In the meantime, I work her friend. Honestly, they're both the
STARS of the room. Maybe not the HOTTEST, but the most PLATINUM
BLONDE. Anyway, the point is: it turns out that MD's target is just a
new-girl-in-town from New Orleans and mine is just a shy homebody,
though they look like total club whores. So we treat them like the
sad, lonely little girls they are. Takeaway.
Now, we're in total state. Our goal is to work the club: to open as
many sets as possible, then go back through the club with all the
social proof and reap the rewards. On the patio, I see a short Cuban
girl with just the most beautiful face. She's in a four-set with a
guy. I'm not even thinking of sarging, but I just tell her she has
the most amazing facial structure. I ask if anyone's told her before,
and she and her friends say no. Anyway--bam--MD and I are in, and we

each end up number-closing our targets there.
MD: Notable here, I am in state. My target is a psychologist, but she

won't admit it. She keeps making me guess what she does. She tells
me it's the opposite of "business". So I say "you are in the pleasure
business". She laughs, I keep guessing stupid occupations until she
admits she's a shrink. Then I launch into discussions of Campbell and
Jung, and how Jung's followers are total pricks. She likes me,
because I know what the "red book" is. I #-close her, tell her she is
coming to Chicago soon.
Style: So, now it's time to round up our targets. On the way up to the
roof, see another set, open it up, and have another girl to round up
later. I run into her five minutes later, and show her my new belt (it
has a lighter attached--I also use this as an opener. I ask if anyone
has a cigarette, and then say "no, I don't want it; i just want to
give someone a light," and then I show my new belt.) Anyway, she wants
to know where I got it. I say I'm never telling, you'll have to
torture me. And she starts pinching me everywhere, then I have her
massage it out of me. Of course, I neg her on how bad the massage is.
So, we run into the B Tall Blonde and her cute little friend again.
They're talking to two guys, and we just run up and pretend like
they're old friends, and then steal them away. We tell them, "You
looked like you needed rescuing." Lots of kino now; the little one
keeps grabbing my ass. My mistake here was not to phase-shift and make
out, because she was READY. Also, Maddash does a dollar-bill trick
that they eat up. We learn a lesson here: one takeaway is good,
because you're IN when you return. After two or three takeaways, the
novelty starts to wear off.
MD: The little HB grabbed my ass multiple times as well. I threatened

to charge her for the privilege. Anyway, we start to walk off (Style
holding the little HB's hand) but I excuse myself to go to the
bathroom and that's the last I see of them.
From there, I run into the platinum-blonde fish-net booby girl again,
and she rubs my arm, tells me she will be back, and that's the last I
see of her. Ummm hmmm. Wish I had this field report about 4 hours
ago.
I open up a set of spanish girls with the cologne opener. Good job,
me.
I meet a brown-haired little midwestern looking girl and talk for not
15 seconds before I grow a true appreciation of her down-home looks

and tell her "God, you are really fucking pretty." She blushes, and
she's mine. We talk for a little while, I invite her back to Chicago,
and tell her she's fucking pretty again (remember you fucking
AFC-whores, this was in-the-moment kind of shit, and it was genuine,
so it wasn't AFC. It was PUA. It was from a position of
superiority.) I #-close her in short-order, and get several kisses on
the cheek. This is one of my true failures of the night, I could've
*-closed her easily had I been thinking properly. I just had too many
sets on my mind.
Style: Oh, and before this, we run into the Forceps Sisters. And the
funny thing is, they're happy to see us. We work on our respective
sisters, and the fact is that, again, we could have been making out,
but too many sets and didn't just go caveman and take charge. Anyway,
I work on another Spanish girl. Really tall and sexy. And I just break
her down. I do psychic bitch routine, find some good commonalities,
and really break into her world. Anyway, without me mentioning it,
she says, "I'm going to give you my number, and I'll leave it up to
you whether you call me or not." And, then, funny guy that I am, I use
my new SELF-PORTRAIT #CLOSE. I tell her, "Why don't you draw a picture
of yourself, so that I can remember what you look like." I'm doing
this all the time now.
Also, I must mention one of MD's great new things. He asks where
they're from. Maddash then challenges them to a thumb-wrestling war.
After he wins (he's not above cheating), he says he's working on the
50 states, and so far he's the world-champion of four of them.
MD: A few more sarges, Style stepped on some girls purses and I made
them love him for it, then I threatened to crush her purse and
lipstick with my heel if she wasn't good. Anyway, the club closes too
early for us, and we learn:
2 takeaways. 3 not as good. 4 fatal.
Style: I think he means 1 takeaway (2 visits) is ideal. Other moral:

When you're done opening up the room, find your targets and strike
while the iron is hot. Don't forget that, once you're in, you can
unleash your desire and speak to their desire. We could have been
*closing a lot of HBs if we hadn't gone so sarge-mad. Also, the club
was far from my house, so extracting wasn't easy. It was awesome,
though, because it felt like we owned the club. We went from knowing
everyone to knowing everybody, HBs were always coming up to us and say
hi, but we let too many slip through our fingers by not closing before
the club closed!.

Oh, and another point: During a sarge, I continue to sarge others in

the room. There are two aspects to this: If an HB tries to walk past,
I may block her path for fun or point out something about her to the
HBs I'm sarging. This way, when I'm done, she's warmed up for me to
approach her. Second, I TALK TO GUYS during a sarge. If a guy
approaches the HBs, I'm not threatened. I turn my back to them, talk
to him, earn his respect easily, and then turn back to the HBs. It
shows they're not THAT important to me--and it disarms the guy and
gives me alpha points. (The exception here is if the guy is a major
jerk or trying to out-alpha, in which case I shut him out with body
language and holding the HB's attention.) Other times, if I see a
couple on a date, I'll help the guy get in with his girl. (Unless, of
course, I'm VERY attracted to the girl, in which case that's another
story and I'll do the above, but then have my wing distract the guy
while I #close the HB.)
Sarge and Learn,
--CPowles/Maddash
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 09 Jun 2002 20:57:00 GMT
subject: Re: Backfiring takeaways
On Sun, 09 Jun 2002 15:36:00 -0400, Tzeen wrote:
>Second approach, a tiny, really cute asian girl who stood at 4'11". I would
>give her a 9. Crash and Burn. Never ever neg ("I think you're really 4'10"
>but those boots give you an inch") a 4'11" girl about her height, no matter
>how hot she is. She still approached me a few times over the course of the
>night, but it was just to bust my balls about shit. I couldn't keep a convo
>going with her.
I know what you're thinking here. But I've learned this: You STARTED a
game. And she's playing YOUR game. You neg and tease. Maybe you really
do ACCIDENTALLY touch a sore point and hurt her feelings. Either way,
this is unusual and new for her. She will react by teasing and
ball-busting you back. This, to me, means that I am in. Now, I reel
her back in. I have three options:
1. Make it seem like she passed MY test and met MY criteria: Smile,
tell her I like a girl that can take it and dish it out, and explain

how teasing in my family was how we expressed our affection.
2. Say, I'll tell you what, I will give you a genuine, sincere
compliment. Then I say something profoundly insightful about her that
blows her away (esp after her expectations are so lowered from the
neg).
3. I forget what the third tactic I use is. I'll post it when I
remember. But, after a long verbal swordfight with a girl, when she
gets a good zinger in, I might say, "Are you single?" It freaks her
out. Or, another option, is after she zings you, be proud of it and
talk about how looks don't matter. It's all attitude. This speech
works good for me too.
Anyway, the point is: If you can dish out the negs, expect to receive
them back. If you shit-test them, you will get shit-tested back. This
is flirting. Be prepared to have a taste of your own game, because
women are much more used to playing it.
>Approach #7....a short hippie chick who gets an 8 because she had a great
>face, but a mediocre body. If she had been in better shape, she would have
>been a 9. This chick was the goddess of kino..she was touching every guy at
>the party. I chatted with her for awhile, allowed her to grind ass up
>against my crotch, at which time her borefriend escorted her to the couch.
If this is her tactic, call her on it. Don't let her touch you. She'll
be frustrated, and love you for it. (See my old Sarging 10s and 11s in
Miami report for a line I use to bust girls who like to manipulate men
with their kino.)
>It was getting late, I did some other quick approaches which didn't get far.
>I need to work on my skills at parties, because girls get distracted EVERY
>time someone they know comes into the room, and at a crowded house party,
>this shit was happening all night long.
>My takeaways allowed these girls time to get so drunk that they were
>unclosable...no closes this night, but a ton of experience, and alot of fun.
>I know I'll run into a few of these girls again, so I'll get another shot.
Ha, sounds like what happened with MD and I. Lots of experience, too
many takeaways.
One: What you did right was WARM UP every HB. This way, when they're
tipsy (and not totally shit-faced) and want to fool around with
someone, you are now SAFE and can qualify because you approached

earlier.
Two: What you (and me too) do wrong is not SELECT A TARGET. Work the
whole party, cool, but know which HB you're working it for. Then
reapproach, isolate, and go for it. It's too easy to be distracted by
the attention of other females, or to keep switching targets because
another HB seems easier or hotter. But learn to select your target,
and then take it AS FAR AS YOU CAN with her (this can still include a
takeaway) before selecting a new target.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 10 Jun 2002 04:22:00 GMT
subject: Re: Field Report From Chicago!
Nice job reeling her back with the teddy bar line, and good gutsy move
with the kissing. Congrats.
This same thing probably would have happened to me, and in RETROSPECT,
I would have realized that what I NEEDED to do was to STEAL HER FRAME.
In other words, after making out, sit down, make out, and act is if
I'm trying to control myself. Then say, "I can't believe that just
happened: look what you're doing to me... I am not normally like
this...whatever you're doing, cut it out." This is also fractionation,
and doesn't give her a chance to think or get freaked out. And then
I'd pattern into more rapport, talking about incredible connection and
how the best things in life start passionately etc. Then I'd try to
take her home...
That said, NICE JOB!
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 10 Jun 2002 09:52:00 GMT
subject: Re: Why we don't talk about sex?
Two quick thoughts on this:

1. DO NOT LISTEN TO WHAT A CHICK SAYS! I've made this mistake too many
times; still do sometimes. This has NO BEARING on whether they will
sleep with you or not. Watch for other signs, other reactions, other
IOIs. I think of PU as "clearing roadblocks." HBs throw them up, and
you have to get past them. This is simply another roadblock, an
auto-response, AND...
2. IT'S BULLSHIT. Come on: A couple of months. If an HB told me that,

first I'd say, "Aww, that's cute. You want a serious relationship with
me. I'm flattered, but I hardly know you yet." Then, think about it,
you're not moving for MONTHS! The first few months are the best part
of a relationship: she gets to enjoy the great part--being in love,
lots of sex--and then you're gone before it starts to implode and
self-destruct and turn into change-of-heart territory. Hasn't she ever
had a wonderful relationship that's just lasted a few months?
Here's my pattern for this:

You can't look for or find or hold or keep love. It comes and goes;
either it's here (sp) or not. SO what do you do if you want love, and
yet the more you seek it, the harder it is to find. What you can do is
to leave open a window so that the breeze of love, the freshness and
newness of it, may come in. If a window is open, the breeze may still
not blow in; there is no guarantee. And if it does blow in, there's no
telling whether it will linger for a minute, a day, a month, or a
lifetime. Either way, it's a beautiful thing to experience. There is,
however, one thing that is absolutely guaranteed: if the window is not
open, the breeze will not blow in.
THEN, IF SHE'S IN STATE, YOU CAN CONTINUE AND GO FOR THE *CLOSE WITH
THIS. IT'S A LITTLE HARDCORE, AND I'VE ONLY USED IT ONCE, SO CALIBRATE
BEFORE USING:
And that's a shame, because when we do feel it, it is a great thing to
feel, to enjoy, and to savor. And a lot of times we let it pass by,
because we are conditioned by society to fear love, because it makes
us vulnerable. Right now, in this minute, I do truly love you. I might
not a minute from now, but right now I do and I am not scared. Because
I know that love is an energy between two people that bypasses
completely all logical thought. [*CLOSE AT SOME POINT AROUND HERE AND
SAY. Wasn't that a beautiful thing?]
THE REST OF THE PATTERN, WHICH I'VE NEVER USED (TOO OVER THE TOP) GOES
LIKE THIS: This is because love is timeless. It does not live in time.
It does not either live in memories of the past or anticipation of the
future, but only in the living moment, which is the eternal. Love
lives when time dies.

>I just had a date with a fairly self-aware chick and she gave me some food
>for thought that I'd like to regurgitate here.
>
>Some in the seduction community advise against talking about sex before the
>sex is had. I think I may have just unwittingly discovered one good reason
>for that.
>
>This HB was responding to me pretty well with plenty of kino directed at me
>and compliments on my cute butt (I might have hooked this IOI a little, but
>hey ;) and I got her to open up well since she said repeatedly "I can't
>believe I'm talking about this on a first date." Etc, things are going
>nicely.
>
>Then I mention that I'm moving to another state in a couple of months and
>soon enough I'm hearing about how that means she won't have sex with me, in
>more words than that, because she won't have 'uncommited meaningless sex.'
>We go back and forth for a while. I sorta try a Natural Women bit on her,
>but she deftly blows that one down by explaining that women who do put out
>easily, often when drunk, are usually trying desperately to use sex to
>create the emotionally connected pair bond that females are programmed to
>seek.
>
>So, my point: Be careful when talking about sex in situations like this
>because once she has verbalized and committed herself to her non-slutty
>beliefs, she will try to be consistent with them and your job of getting
>into her panties will be harder. I think...
>
>On a more general level though, are there really, actually, honestly girls
>out there that want ONS or casual sex without the committment? That's what
>I hear, but I don't think I've seen it yet. I mean evolutionarily speaking,
>there's no reason they should.
>
>Thoughts or opinions?
>
>-manoreason
>--
>
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 10 Jun 2002 19:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: Question: outplaying the players

On Mon, 10 Jun 2002 03:55:00 -0400, Gina wrote:
>Have any of the playettes here ever gotten a player to fall in love and
>broken his heart?
>
1. I've noticed that almost all girls dating a guy THINK that guy is a
player, even when he isn't.
2. There is a rule (stated by Ross J) amongst PUAs: "Leave them better

than you found them." If anyone, for example, posted a message like
this on his SS newsgroup, they would be banned. Here, I would not even
THINK of giving ANY GUY (or woman) seduction advice whose intention
was to do harm to someone. In fact, I believe that he would be soundly
flamed by other posters. This way of thinking, in the end, is going to
be more detrimental to yourself than others, ultimately.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 11 Jun 2002 00:26:00 GMT
subject: Re: Why we don't talk about sex?
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002 14:11:00 -0400, Zan wrote:
>Style, that sounds like my game.

>
>I always play the cocky / funny routine to start. I am comfortable around
girls
>and bust on them like they were my sister or whatever. But as I continue the
>seduction and she is getting interested, I gradually transition to the wounded
>romantic - the one who is smitten with her but she can never truly possess.
>
>I lay it on thick - adoration, smooth talk, fall into you, drama, etc. But I
>always couch it in temporary terms - much like your pattern. I can't stay, but
>my stay will be memorable.
>
>Just my way.
>
>
>Zan

It also works on another level, because it's managing expectations.

Nice!
Where are you based?
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"stylechild" <0>
Tue, 18 Jun 2002 05:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: Help Patterning
Well if a girl says, what do you want from me? Just turn to your buddy and say
out loud so all can hear(assuming you have a buddy there)"Hey steve, this girl
thinks i want something from her. What is it with women?" get up and walk away
or just sit there and keep trying to get rapport. What this does is it kind of
throws her off and its a neg/challenge in a way because it makes her think that
you dont want anything, and that might make her feel like there is nothing
about her that you want, so she may try to win your liking. What do you think
guys?
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================================================================================
"stylechild" <0>
Tue, 18 Jun 2002 16:37:00 GMT
subject: Re: Newbies, read this.
Geeze with the original post i thought i was reading a long version of "the
psalm of life" by Longfellow. But he is right i agree. Great post guys, keep up
the great thinking.
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 19 Jun 2002 06:06:00 GMT
subject: Re: AOS IX: Keep them in Suspense (new)
>You: HB11, you have completely mesmerized me these last few weeks. You are
like
>a butterfly that landed on my hand one day... and I hardly dared to breathe...
>afraid that this exquisite butterfly would fly away. But I know that life

>happens... circumstances happen... I know it is now time for you to go..
This is great! Especially for spur of the moment. I'm really starting
to like your style...
================================================================================
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"stylechild" <0>
Thu, 20 Jun 2002 05:10:00 GMT
subject: Re: A Logical Idea?
Hey their defenses are down.
================================================================================
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 21 Jun 2002 10:54:00 GMT
subject: New *close report
I went on a first meeting with a musician girl who I closed a couple

days ago. She's a cute little blonde girl: the prize of the room that
night. I was *closing a blonde at a table next to her, then we left
the club. I pretended like I'd left something at the table, then
returned to the table and pretended to be looking for something. Then
I asked the HBs if I'd left my lucky pen there, and that was an easy
opener to start sarging from. So I #closed her, and she emailed me to
invite me to her show tonight. I was very clear in my response to set
the frame: that I was going not to be a fan or paying customer, but to
see if she was the kind of person I would like to get to know. So I
show up at her show, and then go to a bar with her and her friends.
Anyway, I end up *closing her and, while her back was turned, *closing
her friend and #closing another one. Yes, I am a dog.
Anyway, I improvised two new moves:
1. I was standing with one of her friends, who gave me IOIs when I
was introduced to the group (I came in very funny and entertaining). I
did NOTHING here. Just fluffed. But every time i wanted to leave to
find my musician HB, she'd keep talking to keep me there (IOI). So
whenever I told her something, I'd lean in VERY close. She didn't move
at all, so that's IOI #2. In the middle of the fluff, I decide to
experiment with what a PUA named Sin always does: to pretend like I'm

TRYING to control myself. I say: "You don't know how hard it is to

keep from kissing you right now?" She just blushes and hides her
head. Then she says, "Well, when can we get together again?" It is SO
on. I give her the incredible connection pattern. Then I fractionate
for two seconds, and we look around and notice that our other friends
have left. So I say, "It looks like they've left us alone." She
agrees, and then we make out. (To start making out took no more than
10 minutes.) She does a GREAT move to me here (which I'm going to
steal and use): she just got back from Hawaii, so when she goes to get
a pen to give me her #, she gives me her room key. Of course, it's
from Hawaii, but it's a very cute endearing move. (I'm going to keep
it and give it to the next HB I sarge.) Anyway, I could have probably
had her that night, maybe even in the bar with some skill, but instead
we make plans to meet at my house at 1:30 p.m. the next day. So,
unless some serious chick logic shit kicks in, this should be an easy
fclose.
So I'm going to experiment with "You don't know how hard it is to keep
from kissing you right now" and various alternatives ("I'm trying so
hard to resist the impulse to kiss you right now") as my new *close.
This may not be an original line. In fact, it's very Zan-style.
2. NEW RESPONSE TO "YOU SEEM SO FAMILIAR"

I return to my target and start sarging her. All the usual stuff. I
improvise, however, a new good line that I'm going to add to my
routine. She says that when we met, I looked so familiar. I say (and
this is congruent with the psychic stuff I sometimes do): "You know,
even physicists say that there is no such thing as time in the
universe. Time is just something humans use. And I believe that all
people have a tiny psychic sense, like when they have deja vu. So
sometimes, when someone looks really familiar to you or it seems like
you've met them before, maybe it's not because they're from your past,
but because they are familiar from your future, because they are going
to be important or fulfill a role in some way." (Please, feel free to
improve the languanging and repost this: it's good future-pacing, but
I think it can be made more powerful.)
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 21 Jun 2002 10:59:00 GMT
subject: Re: Pretty basic but I still had to ask

On Fri, 21 Jun 2002 02:56:00 -0400, PFAL wrote:
>I don't know... Recently I have just been saying "Bitch I wasn't trying to
>talk to you any damn way.", and then keep on rolling. Just NEXT and move on.
>No matter how experienced you are, no matter how many girls you have picked
>up before, some chicks won't understand that you aren't a person to be
>fucked with.
Let's not do this. It's a bad attitude, and plus there still could be
a chance and you're blowing it out. To me, everything a chick says is
an opening, even if it's something bitchy like this. (I hardly EVER
get this, so look at your own game too). If you want to exit, do it
gracefully. Just say, "It was nice meeting you." Then walk away: if
you get a lot of social proof in the room, she'll start giving you
IOIs and beg for you to talk again.
Also, there's the GREAT Rick H response to bitch shields. Say in a

calm, firm/gentle tone: "I don't know how you were raised, but I was
taught that basic courtesy and etiquette are NOT OPTIONAL...And just
because your mother...failed to instruct you...in the precepts...of
the Emily Post Book of Etiquette...doesn't mean...that I should have
to suffer...due to YOUR ignorance."
Then walk away. She'll usually come after you and apologize.
Let me know how it goes...
CPowles
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"stylechild" <0>
Fri, 21 Jun 2002 15:56:00 GMT
subject: Re: Pretty basic but I still had to ask
If she opens up with, "I dont want to talk to you" or :Why should i talk to
you?", respond with,"Well i dont want to talk to someone who is rude to total
strangers, or isnt proper enough to hear someone out so goodbye." Then you wait
to see if she runs up and says shes sorry. If not then just find another chick.
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Sun, 23 Jun 2002 13:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: Note to PFAL (was: Pretty basic but I still had to ask)
Thanks 4Running. Saved me from posting again. But I can't resist

adding this to PFAL:
Dude, this is a shit test. And you know what, you just failed. Not
only that, but you made her GLAD she didn't talk to you. So while she
tells all the other HBs in the bar about what an asshole you are, I'll
be #closing and making sangria with her the next night in my
apartment.
My good friend Sin is dating a beautiful girl who he sarged. She

rejected him on the first approach, and he played it cool and just
came back in a little later. And you know what: she gave him her phone
number and saw him again because she admired his BALLS--most average
guys just sulk off and call her a bitch.
Finally, I don't post anything I haven't FIELD TESTED and found to be

EFFECTIVE.
>> Shit, man, you sound like a pussy. Is it really worth trying to convince
>> some hoe that you are a SUPER GREAT GUY? Nah. Fuck that. See, for every
>> bitch like that, there are ten that are game.
>>
>> "Do it gracefully." Shit, what are you, a woman? Be a man.
>>
>> That whole paragraph about "Emily's etiquette" is so lame. If she doesn't
>> want to talk to you in the first place, do you really think that she is
>> going to stand there and listen to that crap? Hell nah.
>>
>> PFAL
>>
>> "Pimpin' bitches and hittin' switches..."
>>
>> <Style> wrote in message news:26118.3907@discussion.fastseduction.com...
>> > Let's not do this. It's a bad attitude, and plus there still could be
>> > a chance and you're blowing it out. To me, everything a chick says is
>> > an opening, even if it's something bitchy like this. (I hardly EVER
>> > get this, so look at your own game too). If you want to exit, do it
>> > gracefully. Just say, "It was nice meeting you." Then walk away: if
>> > you get a lot of social proof in the room, she'll start giving you
>> > IOIs and beg for you to talk again.
>> >

>> > Also, there's the GREAT Rick H response to bitch shields. Say in a
>> > calm, firm/gentle tone: "I don't know how you were raised, but I was
>> > taught that basic courtesy and etiquette are NOT OPTIONAL...And just
>> > because your mother...failed to instruct you...in the precepts...of
>> > the Emily Post Book of Etiquette...doesn't mean...that I should have
>> > to suffer...due to YOUR ignorance."
>> >
>> > Then walk away. She'll usually come after you and apologize.
>> >
>> > Let me know how it goes...
>> >
>> > CPowles
>> >
>>
>>
>
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 24 Jun 2002 08:12:00 GMT
subject: Who You Are and What You Have to Offer
I was in the bookstore today, looking through all kinds of shit--on

tantra, palm reading, persuasion, chakra-reading, etc. And I realized
that there's a temptation to just learn it all. But the most
successful seducers I've seen aren't generalists. They have a
specialty: in terms of what they do and the women they're after.
Right now, in my game, I have a lot of routines, know the principles,

and have good success. But I'm not where I want to be yet, so I'm
trying to fine tune my persona. I'm also trying to figure out how to
frame and present myself, and how to frame and present what I TELL
them (or hint to them) within the first 10 minutes about what I want
our relationship to be (eg, do I come on with strong seductive SOIs,
or make them work for me by telling her I'm putting her in my friends
compartment).
So, my question is this. How important is it to figure out:
1. Who You Are: By this, I mean more than a charming, adventerous,

funny guy. I mean: an expert in women's sexuality, an illusionist who
can bend metal, a yoga expert, a masseuse, a hypnotist, a good dancer?

2. Who You Want: The targets you are after. Are they college girls?
super models? strippers? bored housewives?
3. What You Have To Offer: In other words, they will see you again
because they can go to great parties, learn how to female ejaculate,
learn about chakras, show you off to their friends, hypno demos that
give them greater awareness and focus, whatever.
I'm not sure about this frame. I'm "thinking about thinking about"
this stuff. Any thoughts here? For those of you who are successful,
have you found that SPECIALIZING in this way is important?
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"stylechild" <0>
Thu, 27 Jun 2002 23:19:00 GMT
subject: IMPLIED SOCIAL PROOF THEORY
Here is my theory on social proof.

If a guy sees a fat and ugly girl surrounded by guys that isnt going to make
him think she is attractive to be atracted to her, and we all know why, becuase
men look at looks first. Now a mistake that men make often is thinking that
woman think the same way we do all the time.But if a woman sees a guy who is
just ok looking or maybe even unatractive surrounded by beautiful women then
she will think that he posseses some great qualities that she will be courious
about and that she may want to "experience" for herself. And much of that is
because looks are not her first priority. Therefore "implied social proof" is
effective aka to imply that you are dating or that you are friends with many
beautiful women. I have noticed that if a girl does this to a guy too often
then some times the guy will loose intrest in her( although girls pull this all
the time so us guys will catch onitis. But a woman loves a challange, so she
will throw herself at you more(alot of the time).
There is a saying that i have read many times that says, "give a woman the
chance to sacrifice herself and she will it is her most favorite form of
self-indulgence."
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"stylechild" <0>
Fri, 28 Jun 2002 16:28:00 GMT
subject: Re: stop reading/watching/listening, start doing

Here are a couple quotes on the topic that i thought some of you might like,
"do the thing that you fear and the death of fear is certain" R W Emerson
"i have gone ahead despite the pounding in my heart that says, 'Turn Back'."
Erica Jong
"the diffrence between the possible and the impossible lies in a persons
determination."
"freedom lies in being bold." Robert Frost
some of my favorites
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"stylechild" <0>
Sat, 29 Jun 2002 08:08:00 GMT
subject: Re: Who's Doc Love?
Go to ask men .com and youll fine him all over there in the love and dating
section, most of his stuff is right on but alot of it it geard toward a
relationship and not seduction.
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"stylechild" <0>
Sat, 29 Jun 2002 21:01:00 GMT
subject: My method fails me.
yea that was a dumb thing to say, your suposed to be a seducer and all war is
based on deception, you threw the game plan out to earlie, if you think she
thinks like you do then 9 out of ten times your going to be wrong.
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"stylechild" <0>
Mon, 01 Jul 2002 18:12:00 GMT
subject: ever feel stuck?

The most important thing is that you get a "meeting" set in stone. When you
call try as hard as you can to be very interesting, tell funny stories, lead
her along and then apeal to her vanity aka.talk about her and ask her questions
about herself, once you find out what shes into set something up based on what
she enjoys.When she bits on something, dont play around or say, "hey well maybe
sometime we could go to ____. What do you think?"--wrong.Say,"Ok well on
saturday we should go to______, Ill pick you up at 7.ok?" Strong lead.And if
she flakes out then forget her...you cant view her as some sort of prize, you
are the prize and noone else, if she doesnt fall for the prize then that means
she just wasnt good enough to get it. However if you are consistantly doing
something that never seems to work, dont keep doing or saying it, cause
obviously its not working.
Stylechild
"The diffrence between the possible and the impossible lies in a persons
determination."
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"stylechild" <0>
Tue, 02 Jul 2002 05:43:00 GMT
subject: donjuan, romeo, whatever....CONAN OBRIAN
Its not JUST him im talking about any so caled funny talk show host, their just
very calm and collected and if you notice they bring the humor out of their
guest, ive watched plenty of talk shows with guest i couldnt stand, but i was
still entertained because the host knew where to take it. Im not saying go up
to a girl and say, "hi i really like your shoes, there really nice...FOR ME TO
POOP ON." I just think that being easy going is a great non-threatening way to
come across at first. I always try to come across as an easy going, confident
guy with a sense of humor that seems genuinely interested in the target, and i
tell you it gets great results.
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"stylechild" <0>
Tue, 02 Jul 2002 16:01:00 GMT
subject: donjuan, romeo, whatever....CONAN OBRIAN
I was watching the conan obrian show the other night and something dawned on
me, oh he is a dork but i think that we approached women like he talks to his

guest we would be very sucessful...Confident, eyecontact, sense of humor, just

being at ease with the subject. I mean alot of the stuff i would shy away from,
when it comes down to alot of the silly things he does, but my challenge for
all of you is to watch that show tonight and thing about it.
Stylechild
"The diffrence betwen the impossible and the possible lies in a persons
determination."
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"stylechild" <0>
Wed, 03 Jul 2002 01:02:00 GMT
subject: Re: Let's NEVER get married
Yea sometimes out of the blue i will tell a chick, "hey you know your a fun
person to hang out with but i bet you would make a terrible gf." it really
pisses them off but it also makes tham want to prove to you that they would
make a good girlfriend.
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"stylechild" <0>
Wed, 03 Jul 2002 01:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: On confidence
Like mystery says,"If you want to get rid of the fear of rollor coasters then
decide to ride 500 of them. 48 aproaches a week for six months will do it." If
you think that sounds crazy then you may be right, but unless you can get your
ass out there and repeat, repeat, repeat then your sunk. I was so scared at
first and I would go back and read but it didnt help me so I just started going
out and talking to girls for no reason and I didnt even try for # closes untill
I was comfortable just going up to any girl and saying anything I wanted to
say, and thats where im at now, I can go up to anyone and just BS with them for
an hour all because I, for instance "wonderd what she was drinking" or " Liked
her nails" or "wonderd what book she was reading." and thats all there is too
it. I once thought i could never talk to chicks. I used to go to the mall just
to pick up girls and I would be there for 3 hours and talk to noone and I would
go home and be all depressed. But I got sick of it and I got my ass out there
and just started talking, now I have no problem asking for a #. Do the thing
that you fear and the death of fear is certain. Go forward despite the pounding

in your heart that says turn back. You are the 10 you are the comodity, not
them, not her, no matter how good she looks. If you really want to know about
this then get on cliffs list on this site and look up the "48 approaches a week
for 6 months" post or "section" a ways down on the list. PS and expect to get
shot down.
StyleChild
"do the thing that you fear and the death of fear is certain."
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"stylechild" <0>
Wed, 03 Jul 2002 06:46:00 GMT
subject: Re: Well? Are you a man, or a pussy?
Wow, a good post brings out the best and the absoult worst of people I swear.
To the original poster, that was good stuff, I could barely put it better
myself, its all about feeling the fear and doing it anyway. If there is one
thing in this world that has held people back from their full potential the
most, it is FEAR. Fuck the fear, and fuck the women. Rock on.
STYLECHILD
"Do the thing that you fear AND THE DEATH OF FEAR IS CERTIAN."
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"stylechild" <0>
Wed, 03 Jul 2002 15:16:00 GMT
subject: One-itis strikes; C&B
I like your method, but yes you did mess up with this one. Whats more important
is that you see your mistake. Now next time you will be sure not to just give
your # but get hers or exchange. I dont think your sunk though, wait a bit see
if she calls, if not go back like your just having another drink and MAKE SURE
you get it then. Although you messed up, i dont think you crashed and burned.
But remember, if it doersnt work out then NEXT her. No one-itis man.
STYLECHILD

"DO the thing that you fear and the death of fear is certain."
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"stylechild" <0>
Thu, 04 Jul 2002 00:27:00 GMT
subject: No Topic
What was that, how is that going to help you to get a girl, i hope you dont say
thoes kinds of things to a girl when you first meet her.
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"stylechild" <0>
Thu, 04 Jul 2002 00:29:00 GMT
subject: No Topic
But i can see how it might pump you up i guess.
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"stylechild" <0>
Thu, 04 Jul 2002 00:51:00 GMT
subject: THE ROLE WILL BE REVERSED what do you guys think?
Ok im having trouble with this queen bee, she dating a few guys, me being one
of them and she knows that i am talking to a couple other girls. We have gone
alot of places and we have hooked up 2X but i have not f-closed her yet (long
story), although we do stuff like hold hands and kiss in public. So the other
day she tells me she wants a relationship but cant decide between me and the
two others. Well first off i dont really care if she "picks me" and i told her
that, but if she picks me and i get the f-close that i want then cool. Now she
is just one of my projects so im not stressing about it. Earlie on i was being
too afc and too nice to her and i started to like her(big mistake) since then i
have cooled off and ive been macking mad girls. (ive known her for about 5
months, started out as"friends")Well any way this is what im going to say this
weekend when we go to the rodeo in the car on the way there. "I was thinking
the other day and i thought what a great friend you are and how much fun i have
when im with you, but then i thought about how you would make a horrible gf. I
mean i still want to hang out and all because its a good time. But your not my

girlfriend so the boyfriend benifits stop here. Im not going to give freebies
out because i dont have to, i dont hang all over my friends." at this point she
will probably try to get close to me or kiss me and i will put my finger on her
lips and gently push her away and say,"Wait that is a boyfriend benifit and you
are not entitled to it." with a smile.
What do you think, a form of role reversal? a challenge?
STYLECHILD
"Do the thing that you fear and the death of fear is certain."
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"stylechild" <0>
Thu, 04 Jul 2002 20:35:00 GMT
subject: THE ROLE WILL BE REVERSED what do you guys think?
The whole point lies in the challange, If she thinks that i think she cant be a
good girlfriend shes going to try to prove me wrong...do you see how this
works? This girl is begging for a challenge, and im not going to supplicate and
try to compete for her like all these other guys, i dont drool all over girls
to get my way, maybe you do zap, and if so thats too bad.
================================================================================
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 08 Jul 2002 08:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: better than a # close?
On Thu, 27 Jun 2002 17:13:00 -0400, Fatass wrote:
>I met TWO 17-y.o. girls at the library today. This is getting so
>easy. As we were chatting, I thought, "Why bother with a # close?",
>and I just set up a meeting w/ them for tomorrow -- both of them. Why
>not?
>
>One of them was outgoing and talkative, a real attention hog, and the
>other was more shy and reticent. I figure I'll give the shy one more
>attention just to see how the other one reacts.
>
>I'm also going to put myself more in the spotlight than I usually do;
>talk more about ME than about them, just as an experiment.

>
>This is nice. I'm starting to feel that I can afford to play w/ the
>dynamics a bit and focus on the game. I'm happy to be past the point
>where I feel like this is MY BIG CHANCE..... I feel more free to work
>on making them feel that it's THEIR big chance. :-))
Yes, Fatass. This is what Mystery and myself are thinking now: numbers
and email are wood. Fuck that. Why not "instant date"--either
immediately (ideally) or the next day. Insinuate yourself into their
life, become their reality, and avoid flaking altogether. I'm going to
post a FR on this new MO later tonight.
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 08 Jul 2002 09:34:00 GMT
subject: Re: PUAs who don't need to approach
This can happen in two ways:
1. Proximity Warning System: Watch when an HB is standing near you, or

a group of HBs, for no reason. Open them: they are waiting for it.
2. I just got back from MTL with Mystery. He is into a radical new
form of peacocking: boots that make him 7 feet tall, big red cowboy
hat, tight black pvc pants. EVERY set of HB eyes turned as he walked
down the street. He could open them all, because they all wanted to be
opened and find out who he was. UGs would come up to him and grab his
ass and stalk him and hit on him. One older chick even BIT his crotch.
I will post longer on this: it blew my mind. When he wears regular
clothes, this doesn not happen at all. It was amazing: like walking
down the street with a famous actor or something. The easy lesson here
is that chicks will open you if you WEAR your opener. More than that,
if you dress like a star, people will treat you like one.
================================================================================
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 08 Jul 2002 10:39:00 GMT
subject: LR: Mystery and Style get new MLTRs (long)
INTRODUCTION:

STYLE: Just got back from an amazing trip. Lots of all kinds of
closes. Below is a field report from just a fun, perfect sarge in
which Mystery and I are nearing a new MO. It was from our first night
out of town: the first of many adventures. The old MO is the 20 minute
* and #close. The new MO is the instant date. Go around the club, get
your *'s and #s, then spend time with and extract whoever is worthy.
#'s blur, but if you can right away take an HB to a diner or cafe (and
then her or your house), you're in. No worries. It begins with tight
game, but it ends with just being fun and making the HBs feel
comfortable, at ease, and laughing. Laughter will get you laid, boys.
Joining us on this night were Cliff of Cliff's List, MTL PUA, and
Katan Omed.
BEFORE THE SARGE:
MYSTERY: We went out on Monday in the street in a group figuring out

where to go, when MTL PUA points out a two-set walking towards us and
says, "How would you pick up that?" It looked like a hard set: moving
targets, and one was a 9. They walked past us, and I explained how I
would do it. I said I wouldn't' pick them up on the street while
they're moving, I'd follow them on the street to see where they're
going. We turned around and noticed they were gone, so we figured they
went into a nearby cafe. So I took the challenge.
They sat down and ordered. I walked in with my crazy red cowboy hat. I
decided to get social proof first from the waitress, and make it look
like I knew her. I took my hat off, put it on the waitress's head, and
said, "I want to see what you look like with this on." She ran to the
mirror, looked at it and came back. We talked--black nails, spells,
poltergeist--while I watched the two-set, waiting for them to settle
in. Then I walked over, opened with black nails, and did the same
material I did on the waitress with the two set. I then said: "Scooch
over. I can only stay for a couple minutes. My friends are outside. I
talked with them for about eight minutes, did a time constraint (said
my friends are outside but we have so much to talk about), and
#closed.
STYLE: It was a nice set. When I walked in to time constraint, they

screamed at first because they were startled. The Mystery man had
spooked them out. Also, I noticed that Mystery had placed his
targets' hand on his knee, and it stayed there. Anyway, they were
loving him and genuinely sorry to see him go.
From there, we went to a nearby bar. It was quiet at first, and not
many targets. But Mystery went to work on warm-up sets, and eventually

so did I and MTL_PUA. We all did #closes. Mystery did one, and I ended
up doing three. First I #closed a Russian girl, with the usual
routines. Then I approached a set, and they only spoke French and
Spanish. So I fucking sarged in my amateurish French for the first
time ever: try translating the cologne opener and Rikki Lake into
French on the fly! Also, I did a great opener on a three-set with a
guy. I had the guy take MTL_PUA, Katan_Omed, and I's photo. Then he
asked for me to take a photo of him and his girls--basically inviting
me right in. I #closed my target, though he was getting perturbed. Was
complaining to the bouncer that MTL_PUA and I were stealing his girls.
LOL.
MYSTERY: I must add here that my taking my hat off and putting it on
other people's heads was amazing. It set a format to the pick-up, and
became a great tool. It was playful, and it allowed me to interact.
THE SARGE
MYSTERY: So in the bar was a two-set. A blonde (9.2) and a brunette

(8.4 looks, 10 personality). They were standing by a small table,
across from each other. I came in with black nails. My hat went onto
the brunette, and I selected her as my obstacle at first. I started
talking with the blonde, but after three minutes discovered that the
brunette was actually my target because she had a much more expressive
personality, and I found that more attractive.
When I switched in my head to wanting to play with the brunette, I sat

on a chair and pulled her close to me to my hips, between my legs. I
engaged in chat with her for 20 minutes. I was really enjoying myself:
I was in no hurry to get out of there. MTL_PUA at some time wanted to
go to another club, but Style and I decided to stay because we were
having a good time. I found her attractive because she was
conversationally engaging.
STYLE: I came in at some point, and Mystery introduced me to her

target. He said that I was an amazing illusionist in my own right. And
I entertained her with a couple of my fake tricks--elementary school
gags, really. It's sort of a parody of what Mystery does.
Anyway, I'm just trying to be a good "wing," and make her have fun and
be relaxed, and show her how cool Mystery's friends are. At this
point, the blonde comes into the conversation. I know that she will be
my target, so I exchange a couple words and then say, with a smile,
"Now go away. I'm talking to your friend." (I think that was a good
move: it showed that I wasn't desperate to talk to this thin blonde,
like most guys would be.)

After a little while, I leave Mystery alone with his target and
approach the blonde. I can't remember my first story, but I neg (tell
her she has an 80's hairdo), and elicit values and find out a little
bit about her. She starts to warm up to me, but then the brunette
turns to talk to me. While I'm talking to the brunette, Mystery takes
the blonde into the corner for a runecast. So, I figure Mystery has
switched targets (it's his set), and I now make the brunette my
target. (Also, I notice that Mystery tried the Tic Tac *close on the
brunette, but it backfired because instead of letting him feed her the
Tic Tac, she took it out of his hand and ate it. Note: This is okay;
he's testing for IOIS. And, interesting enough, at a meal later she
DOES eat out of his hand.)
Anyway, she's a writer, and she discusses liking concise short

stories. I tell her I just read a great one, and we go off to where
it's quiet so that I can recite a romantic short story I like to tell
HBs. She loves it. I then make a plan with her. And she says she'll
give me her #, but only as long as I have no expectations. I give her
a big speech. (copped from Joseph Campbell) about how it's unfair to
any relationship--whether it's going to be a friendship, a minute-long
conversation, or a lifetime of love--to walk into it with
expectations. Then it's not a shared experience, it's you trying to
make someone conform to what you want your experience to be. So I tell
her I let any relationship set its own neither course. I don't try to
force it in one direction, but I don't try to fight it either if it
goes in that direction. She gives me the # of her new house, and says
her phone gets hooked up Friday. I tell that I'll call her ONCE on
Friday. If her phone is hooked up, then we'll hang out. If it isn't,
then it's fate and that'll be the only time I call. She jokes about
how we shouldn't test fate, like the couple in the story (which is
what I want her to do). And of course, I give her my # anyway-who
trusts fate? Then I go over to Mystery, who's with the blonde, and try
to get him to leave the bar, because I'm exhausted from traveling.
MYSTERY: The runecasting rocked. She was floored. She got pensive for
ten minutes, and I'd already established enough rapport with the
brunette that I thought she was mine. I thought that I was already in
with the brunette, and Style was occupying her. So I set up the blonde
for him, and the brunette for me. I told the blonde: "You're a
beautiful girl, it's too bad I'm smitten with your friend." In brief,
she wasn't sure if she was going to go back to a guy or not. I bent
the runecast interpretation in favor of finding a new man. And I said
that she already knew this person, she may have just met him in fact.
I suggested that maybe Style was the man--or maybe someone else in the
past (I made it subtle, so that it didn't seem like I was pushing

her).
The bar was closing, and Style was tired and was going to say goodbye.
I said that we were going to grab a bite to eat. Why don't you come
join us?" Then they mentioned a place with the best "poutine" (fries
with cheese curds and gravy), and Style and everyone chimed in and
said they were hungry and wanted to try this new food. So we left the
club and went to the restaurant.
STYLE AND MYSTERY: Basically, as we walk with them and eat with them,
we're just having fun and enjoying their company. We're not hitting on
them. It's so important.
Afterwards, I ask them if they can give us a ride home. We start

walking towards their car, but their car happens to be parked near
their new apartment, so we drop by to see it. There's no furniture, so
we just sit on the floor.
We're all spread out, sitting very far apart. We take our shoes off,
to show that we're staying, and just get comfortable. Now, we're
playing it cool, like we're not hitting on them. But Mystery (bless
his heart) has an MO. And this is going to be known as: The Massage
Oil MO.
MYSTERY: I'm going to be marketing very shortly some bottles of the

best-selling massage oil on earth. (A large refill bottle, with a
small portable plastic bottle that can fit in your pocket or prop
bag.) I pulled it out of my pocket, and put it on the window sill.
They asked what it was. I said, "It's massage oil, you have to smell
it." They asked why I had it. I told them I was going to start
marketing it, on the side for fun.
I had Style come over, and I poured it in his hands. Then I poured it
in the brunette's hands and started giving her a hand massage. We gave
each sexy slippery other hand massages for about 15 minutes. In the
meantime, Style has gone ahead and pushed the boundaries.
STYLE: I tell mine that I learned Swedish massage (which is true) and
Mys says that I'm licensed. I tell her to take her top off, and lie
down, and tell that I'm going to gie her a professional massage. She
resists at first, but I really let it be known that it's all I want to
do (which is true-at this moment). She pulls her top up
three-quarters, and I start rubbing her.
MYSTERY: We're lying on the floor. There's no furniture. We start

caressing each other. Style and the blonde start kissing, so we take

the blanket and go to another room. I get frozen out: she doesn't want
to kiss, but I kiss her neck and her face all over and nibble on her
ears. But ever now and then she says, "Don't do that." So I would
stop. It was quite frustrating. It was 7 a.m., and both of us were
unable to sleep. Over-tired.
STYLE: What's interesting is that we're lying there, and both thinking
that Mysery and the brunette are going to hook up. We're not looking,
but we can hear kissing sounds. (It turns out that Mys was just
kissing her forehead and shoulders.) But what I believe happened is
that A PRECEDENT was being set (in the blonde's mind), making it okay
for her to break her own boundaries. She goes and gets a couple
blankets: one on the floor, and then one to throw over us. I ask her
what her favorite position is to sleep in with someone is, and she
lies on my shoulder. As she does, I stroke her hair and neck. I
actually don't know if it's on or not, because I hadn't really
expressed any interest in her in that way--or received any explicit
IOIs. I decide, before I go to sleep, to try to kiss her. I turn my
face slowly to hers, and when my lips meet hers, she responds. It's
on. She puts her hands around my head, and it's all over. She gets
turned on quickly. I eat her out, and I know she wants to have sex.
But I get an objection I seem to get a lot as I get good at this: "But
I just met you." (Any ideas on how to reframe this. Another one I get
is, "But we don't know each other yet." Mys and I usually respond
with: "Yeah, you're right. I don't even know you from a hole in the
wall," smiling. But it's just funny, it doesn't eliminate the
objection.)
Anyway, we cuddle and talk and get to know each other (she's 19!), and
just get really comfortable when Mystery starts yelling "Style" from
the other room (he actually does yell "Style"). We don't want to move,
so he and the brunette join us in the front room.
MYSTERY: We woke up at 1, and for a moment we were almost over-staying

our welcome, but we won them back when we all left for breakfast. And
we did this just by being normal and fun, sometimes ignoring them and
joking around with each other.
After, they drive us home. Style gets a kiss goodbye, but I get
another no-kiss goodbye. However, she was kissing my fingers in the
back seat. Curious mixed messages. (We should make these mixed
messages too.)
DAY TWO
STYLE: We go home, and shower and talk. We've filmed a lot of the

sarge, for fun, so we make it into a short movie. While we're doing
this, I get a phone call from the blonde. They were both planning to
visit the suburb where the blonde lives, but they end up spending too
much time furniture shopping, so they're staying in town that night.
The blonde requests a get-together. I accept that request (smile) and
tell her to pick us up at 9:30 p.m.
Mys and I sit down and formulate a plan: we want them to pick us up at
our house. We're going to pretend like we're not ready and bring them
upstairs. We will keep them there for no longer than a minute: we just
want them to see the apartment and be comfortable there, but save the
tour for later. (This is an important psychological move that DOES
work: as long as you DO NOTHING and DON'T HIT ON HER when she's up
there the first time.) We also discuss what Mystery should do about
his target, and he decides on a FREEZE-OUT.
Anyway, just the blonde comes and picks us up. We take her upstairs,
then she drives us to the brunette's house. We sit around on the
floor, and just hang out. Mystery works his freeze out plan: he
doesn't sit near her, and hardly talks. Any question she asks, he
replies to tersely. It's a hard game: because I need my blonde to feel
comfortable (so that she can feel like she made the right decision the
night before) and Mys needs his brunette to feel uncomfortable (so
that she can feel like she made the wrong decision the night before).
We go out to eat. I do a Ross attraction pattern thing, and the blonde

just blushes and gets shy and doesn't answer. (Note: I notice that
when I do something like this, and they blush and turn their heads
away, it's better than an answer because she ALREADY feels those
things.) When the blonde goes to the bathroom, I tell the brunette
that I'm really smitten with her friend, and that she has such a good
heart. Then I ask about what the blonde's mother is like. (The goal
here is to show her that I'm sincere, that I'm not just after the
booty--especially after switching targets NOTE: Mystery here didn't
switch; he was congruent.) Then we go back to the brunette's house
because I've left my bag there. (This was an accident, but leaving
something at their house is a good thing--just make sure it's
something that you don't need back.)
The brunette wants to go to a bar where there's an 80's night. I scoop

the blonde around the corner and start making out, and she says,
"Forget the bar."
We rejoin the brunette, and I suggest going back to our house. They
waffle back and forth, then Mystery says, " Here's the plan. We're
heading back to my place, and I'm going to show you the video I made."

He shows a nine-minute movie he made of No. 9 getting his tongue. Then

the movie of our first day with the girls. They love it, and we all
get to relive the night and and all the jokes all over again: it made
our meeting meaningful, a real sweet memory. (For you NLP losers, it
brought them back into state.) Also, in the cab and at the house I
purposely sit as far away from the blonde as possible: I want her to
feel what it's like without me, to yearn for my presence and touch
again.
Finally, I call the blonde into my room to see something on the

internet. I really had NO IDEA what I was going to show her. I just
wanted to separate her. I showed her the mASF (just kidding). I found
some boring shit to distract her left brain with, then pulled her into
me for a kiss. She's a little resistant. I notice that the door is
open. I then ask Mystery and the brunette if it's okay if we close the
door for five minutes, and Mystery (with his usual tact), asks, "Is
that all you need?"
MYSTERY: I had been freezing out the girl for about three hours now.
Examples: we're walking down the street, and I'm looking at trees. My
arm that's closest to her is in my pocket, and I always walk behind or
in front of her. Every time I do this, she runs to catch up to me, or
bumps her arm against mine.
So when we're on the couch together, I show her video clips of my

magic, my childhood, and even my ex. I think this helped to establish
that I was sexually viable. (Note to all: develop a computer film-clip
routine for when you bring a girl home. It's so much more powerful
than a mere photo routine.) I also showed her a home movie I made of
my nieces and my puppy, and that turned her around. It made it look
like I wasn't a player, like I'm the type of person who's not just
loved by beautiful people but also committed. Earlier, when she took
her shoes off, I said, "Are those YOUR stinky feet? Whew!" So later, I
said, "Come with me." I grabbed her by the hand and pulled her into
the bathroom and turned the water on. She said, "It's not my feet.
It's my socks. It's my socks." She was so embarrassed that she ran
into my bedroom and jumped on my bed. The lights were off in the room,
and a candle was lit. (The stage was pre-set.) I yanked her socks off,
and I carried her into the bathroom and sat her down on the side and
started washing her feet. Her self-esteem was so lowered, but she was
also giggling and laughing the whole time. I said, "I feel like I'm
washing my dog." She then gets out, and I dry her feet. As I'm drying
her feet, "that's a good girl. You stay still now. All clean. Now
shake, shake."

I tell her that I'll find a garbage bag to put her socks in, haaa I
love this! *evil grin* She says she wants to wear a pair of mine. I
take her into the bedroom, throw her on the bed, and put them on her.
My socks go up really high, so I pull them all the way up to her
knees, and she's still laughing. I grab her, pull her towards me, and
set her down on the bed. Then we had that pause, where we look into
each other's eyes and take a deep breath to relax. I move in REAL
CLOSE to her lips. She doesn't say anything, so I kiss and we make
out. We start kissing passionately, continuing the same energy as the
tickling. A minute later, I was sucking on her breasts. I get her top
off, pour my world-famous massage oil on her chest, massage her
breasts, and start rubbing my chest against hers. (Style: Note that
Mystery didn't talk her into kissing him intellectually; he appealed
to her emotionally--he froze her out, negged her, and then made her
laugh and have fun.)
She then has to go to the washroom. She puts one of my t-shirts on.
She comes back, and straddles me. I take her shirt off. A little pants
resistance, but solved with telling her that it's nobody's business
what we do. Anyway, pants off and, to make a long story short, we
f-close. (I spank her bottom, but, cripes, she doesn't like it.) By
the way, she tells me afterwards that she has a boyfriend.
Sidenote: Message oil will rub off your fake tatoos! I looked for the
smear on HER but could find the remnants anywhere ... another MYSTERY
STYLE: Anyway, we f-close. (I spank her bottom, but, cripes, she

doesn't like it.) Afterwards, she is really distant, and I can sense
she feels like she shouldn't have done that. I never really pressured
her, I just got her so turned on that she wanted it. I ask her why she
thinks I shouldn't have. She says "I gave it up too fast. Now I'm
never going to see you again."
It's the sweetest thing ever, because I really like her and do want to
see her again. It's been a while since I've been moved emotionally by
a girl, but for some reason I feel for her. I tell her first of all
that sex is not something you give up or someone takes; it's something
you share. Secondly, I tell her that every passionate relationship
I've ever had began passionately (Mys's line). Thirdly, I tell her
that maybe she shouldn't have, but she wanted to and needed to (which
is true). Fourthly, I tell her that I'm more mature than a lot of the
people she's been with before, so don't judge me by your past
experiences. I'm a new person and a new experience, and as she can
tell already I'm different from the other guys. Finally, I tell her
that I'd really be sad if I didn't see her again. (Note: Mys says, as
soon as you fuck, the pickup is over, so I won't bother you with

anything more, because it's off-topic. I don't want to turn into

Maddash here and think it's a new seduction every time I screw my
girlfriend. {just kidding, MD})
MYSTERY: When it was time for them to go, they knocked on my door. And
it was just as I was having an orgasm, and my HB yelled "Coming." And
I yelled "That's right."
STYLE: Anyway, we watch an episode of the Osbournes together on Mys's

computer, and all laugh together once more before sending them on
their merry way. (Also, Mys takes his girl to the shower, and they
both wash the massage oil off each other.) A nice night, and we see
them again. New lovely MLTRs for both of us (and the brunette even
dumps her bf for Mys).
AFTERTHOUGHT, FROM PROF. B.T. SPANKENBOTTOM: Mystery and Style may

very well have spanked the bottoms of their girls at the exact same
times, setting off a clap of thunder heard everywhere from Juggler's
Hotel Room in Montreal to Rio in Japan to Maddash in the Chicago
airport, missing his flight..
SUMMARY: This worked due to four critical moments, when the sarge
could have been lost but was saved by the meeting of preparation with
opportunity:
1. The Instant Date

2. Getting back to her place.
3. The massage oil gambit.
4. The freeze-out
FINAL THOUGHT FROM STYLE: What is interesting to me is that earlier,

in email before traveling, I said that my goal in for the trip was not
to sarge like crazy, but to find a girlfriend for the two weeks. And
that happened on the first night here. It shows the power of intent
(it also shows that fate has a funny sense of humor, because she lives
five hours away).
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 09 Jul 2002 10:02:00 GMT
subject: Re: LR: Mystery and Style get new MLTRs (long)
On Mon, 08 Jul 2002 22:52:00 -0400, PurePerfection wrote:

>Great fr, you have to keep posting these Styte..

>i like the way both you and mystery wrote what happened to the each of
>yourselves..
Thanks, man. But I'm a little disappointed in posting FRs lately. I

post them to get feedback, constructive criticism, commentary on
things done right and wrong. But for some reason, they get no response
lately. (That said, maybe this FR was a little long.) And also when I
post good advice about field-tested stuff that works, I get flamed by
some misogynist who clearly knows nothing about this stuff. I'm here
to share: that is a two-way street. And I'm here to get better and
help others get better. For some reason (whether it's my less frequent
posting or an influx of inexperienced "experts" here or just a high
turnover of people in the community), those needs aren't being met. Is
this just my experience, or others as well?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 09 Jul 2002 22:39:00 GMT
On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:28:00 -0400, DBCooper wrote:

>
>My question is what is your frame from start to finish? What you do is
>playful, but do you just go with the flow, or do you have some loose linear
>process? I think the main abilities of PUas is the ability to think fast and
>intelligently, which you guys do...that instict you have is great..
>
In this case, we enjoyed talking to these girls. So the frame was to
know where we're going, and at every necessary juncture escalate it to
get there (whether by steering towards an instant date, or making a
bold move like the massage oil). But it was also about letting go of
the outcome, and enjoying each step along the way. There's not a loose
linear process, there's a tight one. But we're also going with the
flow, knowing that once we're on course the current will guide it
there. My best PUs lately have been where I've really enjoyed spending
time with the HB, but at that same time steered the time towards a PU
outcome. And these may add hours to the PU (never days), but they also
make flaking near-impossible because of the rapport and laughter and
because they miss my (or our) presence when we're not there. When an
HB you've only known for a few hours can get comfortable enough to get
stupid and silly with you, chances are she's also comfortable enough

to sleep with you. You just have to be the one controlling the flow...
I think now that I'm getting to a new stage. I know the routines I do
so well that I can let go of them, and work on the attitude and the
comfort with myself and the ability to read what a woman wants and
know what/how she wants to be seduced and other aspects of the PU.
Hope this makes sense.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 09 Jul 2002 23:21:00 GMT
Thx blzcorps and ginko and softcontrol and etc. and etc. This post is
awesome, and just what I need. I have great success and can rock a set
when I walk in, but I am still nowhere near where I want to be yet. So
I really do want to keep learning, keep teaching, and keep exchanging.
Every time I leave a set, I think: "how can I have taken this one step
further?"
Anyway, I'm going to be away from the board for a little while for
other reasons, but when I'm back I have an idea to really help people
here in a focused way. I'll try it out.
On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 14:39:00 -0400, softcontrol wrote:
>
>Have you considered that the number of people who feel QUALIFIED
>to respond to a FR like yours is probably pretty small? You say that
>this group is full of "inexperienced experts," but you also complain
>that none of them are responding to your posts! I don't get that.
Ha. I'm busted. It is true, though, that there are two kinds of
advice:
1. Advice aimed at making the person who posts it seem cool.
2. Advice aimed at helping the person who posted the info do better
the next time.
So I guess I'm criticizing the first, condoning the second.
>Face it, there is only a handful of guys on here that are REAL
>experts. Do you think they have the time or inclinations to answer ALL
>of the posts on this group? I doubt it. How much time do you

>PERSONALLY want to spend doing that?
true. But when I do have time, I do want to spend time helping anyone
who I think A. Posted in enough detail taht I can give good advice B.
Is willing to incorporate and use the info to better the game.
>What *I* see is that some people with LESS experience than YOU are
>helping EACH OTHER out. And while these people are willing to help
>people at or near their OWN level, they are normally hesitant to
>respond with advice to people who TEACH this stuff for money.
I don't teach this stuff for money. Don't make a penny. I guess Mys
does. But even he is still learning and trying to improve his game.
Also, I do see people trying to help each other out, but I also see a
lot of CONTRADICTORY advice given here. It used to be like we were all
trying to figure it out together, and moving towards an MO that
worked...
>I agree with this completly and I am glad you guys have come around to
>this way of thinking. I had been noticing a disturbing trend on this
>group towards # closes which gunwitch and formhandle, among others,
>have tried to counteract. Then I did some researcha and found that
>Sven was advocating NOT doing # closes at all YEARS ago. IMO, # closes
>are shit. I see the goal of PUA as immediately I&Fing your target, if
>possible. If something unavoidable gets in the way, you do your best
>to work around it, but take a number ONLY if you have to. If you can't
>immediately extract then try to make EXPLICIT plans for your next
>get-together. But certainly don't put unneccesary obstacles in your
>OWN way by giving her UNNECESSARY time away from you to think it over,
>meet someone else, make other plans, etc. Close the deal ASAP. Then,
>after you have fucked her, get her #.
Yes: become her reality then and there. Thx. Crudely put, but true.
>Personally, I wouldn't even bother opening a set that I had no

>interest in f-closing right there. Sure, it is practice, but why
>waste the time? Why not spend your time doing approaching someone who
>you really want to fuck or else do something else more productive. But
>that's just my opinion...
Well, not true. First, you never know what a set is like until you
open it. I've gone into practice sets, and ended up leaving with an
MLTR. Or not had time for an instant date, but gotten a great # that
worked and was worthwhile. I see logically what you're saying, but I
also think a lot of people use this as an excuse. On further thought,

I don't agree with this. I'm trying to let go of my outcome, enjoy

each set, and approach al the time so that it becomes internalized
instinct. I do see logically wha tyou're saying, but no PUA I know has
this attitude. They all enjoy playing the game, and it's not always
about winning the game.
>I don't think you need to reframe this as much as have ALREADY made
>her FEEL like she "knows" you.
>See this post by lovedrop:
>
>http://groups.google.com/groups?q=g:thl717975343d&dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF
>-8&oe=UTF-8&selm=91oj3m%24htd%241%40nnrp1.deja.com
>
>What he says here is becoming a fundamental part of my philosophy on
>seduction.
Thx. Nice point.
>> upstairs. We will keep them there for no longer than a minute: we
>just
>> want them to see the apartment and be comfortable there, but save
>the
>> tour for later. (This is an important psychological move that DOES
>> work: as long as you DO NOTHING and DON'T HIT ON HER when she's up
>> there the first time.) We also discuss what Mystery should do about
>
>This is a very interesting point. I like the principle behind this.
Don't know why, but it really does work psychologically. I do this

every time I can now. And it's much easier to lead an HB back after
this. Maddash does this too, I think.
>> MYSTERY: I had been freezing out the girl for about three hours now.
>
>At first thought that seems like way too much work in the wrong
>direction at this stage of the game, but OTOH, you may be working with
>a different dynamic in a dual seduction that makes it harder in some
>ways than in a one-on-one situation. So maybe this is normal. What do
>you think?
Right, obviously this wouldn't work one-on-one. But it works when

you're in a group, and don't have to pay her 100 percent attention.
Then, when he's left alone with her at end of night, he thaws and
seduces.
>

>Again with the objection. She's operating from the frame of the more
>time you make him wait, the longer he will stick around. I like the
>way you handled it after the fact, though.
Thx. Figured out a way since then to handle it before the fact. Is
anyone familiar with David, Cliff's PUA friend. He sets conversational
traps--has her agree to her "attitude" on things, and then springs
them back on her to avoid LMR: "I thought you said you were
spontaneous and adventerous, and not one of those boring people who
etc. etc."
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:02:00 GMT
subject: Re: Hijacking Sets
On Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:37:00 -0400, 4Running wrote:
>I have lately been sarging in some meat market bars. It's great training
>for a few reasons: high bitch shields (get your negs down), rude girls (get
>your shit-test responses down), and the girls are very hot. However, it
>being full of AMOG's, there is hardly ever a set of girls that aren't either
>1)with a group of guys or 2) being sarged by guys. The guys here are very
>direct and usually good-looking, they hit on the girls and the chicks
>respond. So I need to get my balls together and not only start breaking
>into groups with guys (a current weakness), but hijack sets from other guys
>in order to get real results (this is even harder for me). IOW, I need to
>become the AMOG.
Dude, you have game. More game than these guys. I love this shit. You
know what inspires me the most in a bar? When I see a couple guys
approach a girl. I just love to jump in, and open the whole set. The
guys love it because by doing this, they THINK you're bonding them to
the girls and treating them as a group. You can just use Rikki Lake or
some other story here. You make the guys your friend, and as you do,
you blow them out of the water in terms of personality. Then you have
your wing talk to the guys, while you PU the girl.
Secondly, man, the PUA is the EXCEPTION to the rule. It is EASIER to

approach girls who are with a group of guys than a group of girls
that's getting hit on left and right. MTL PUA just f-closed a girl who
was in a group of six guys. To quote Mystery: Own the men and you own
the women.

On my trip last week, I approached a table full of girls and guys. I

first paid attention to the guys, I negged and teased the girls.
Whenever I was talking to the girls and a guy interrupted, I turned my
back to the girls and had a conversation with the guy. The result?
After a while, I said I wanted to go look for my friends. I took my
target with me for company. She and I made out all over the bar. (Hey,
I finally got past my consistent *close sticking point: the secret was
escalating kino, but escalating not to get her aroused and touch her
but to test for IOIs.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:04:00 GMT
subject: Re: Overcoming BF Objection and Pattern
Look up the "Sin Boyfriend Destroyer." It involves her answering

questions by moving her hand around. I love this one...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:25:00 GMT
subject: Re: Mystery and Style get new MLTRs (long)
On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:22:00 -0400, vaitology wrote:

>
>There are some questions I have though:
>
>1. How do you guys loosen up? I really take a lot of time getting that
'google'
>as mystery puts it.
Before the sarge, by entering other sets and talking to other HBs.
During the sarge, by letting go of our outcome, enjoying the HB's
company, teasing them, and sometimes just ignoring them and joking
around with each other.
>2. How much time do you guys spend actually rehearsing the plan/structure? Do
>you guys look at the troubleshooting aspects??

We just discuss the plan/structure beforehand. But are flexible enough

to change it if the circumstances/situation change. It just takes a
few minutes to come up with a plan.
>3. Did you mold techniques into your style, or did you guys develop
techniques
>to mold into your style?? For eg: Black nails..Mystery. Did you come up with
>this after you had black nails, or did you come up with the opener and then
use
>black nails. Same with the HAT opener in this report.
Hat opener and others just HAPPEN in the field. When they work, they
become part of our game. Hat was bought for peacocking. Now it's used
all the time to open a set, or lay claim to a set. A lot of what I
use, I just developed in the field and then came home and wrote it
down to remember.
>4. Have you guys ever tried using MM for 3somes or even foursomes??
Not yet. Have to extend MM to cover that.
>These are some questions I really need answers for. I am gonna try a lot of
the
>stuff I've read for abt a month, and keep on posting any interesting stuff I
>come across. Lemme also tell you that your posts are really inspiring, I would
>really love to read more stuff from you. This group needs a lot of stuff from
>experienced PUAs. Especially when you sarge at such a rate, I bet there will
be
>a lot of stuff that you can actually write up on this list.
Thx. There's another LR I should post from the trip that would be
helpful, especially since it involves a failure with an HB10 and then
a rebound into the lay. Have to find the time. Grr...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 13 Jul 2002 00:25:00 GMT
subject: Any PUAs in Italy
Email me at CPowles100 at hotmail.com if you are in Italy...
================================================================================

================================================================================
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 03 Aug 2002 12:01:00 GMT
subject: Re: This sentence seems to work well every time
On Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:11:00 -0400, Ludus wrote:
>A cool sentence I remember from my earlier days is "Whoa, I was just about to
>say that" whenever you're having a semi serious conversation. It makes it
seem
>like you and the chick are on the same wavelength and there's no way she can
>prove you're lying.
>
>Ludus
>
That's great, Ludus! So obvious, but I have never used it as an

INTENTIONAL technique. And the best is that after, you can both giggle
about it, mirror, kino more strongly, and maybe go into Juggler's
girlfriend test or something similar from there. Love it!!
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 03 Aug 2002 15:52:00 GMT
subject: SP: A Proposal--Let's Make Some Progress Here
Okay, I'm going to try something for the next week or so. I see a lot
of people here moving forward in their games, and a lot just treading
water, asking the same question over and over. Or, even worse, just
gathering material and not getting into the field.
SO:
Take a look at your game. WHERE do you stall? What is your STICKING
POINT? Post it under a NEW THREAD on the Tactics/Techniques board.

Preface it with the letters SP: (Just as you preface field reports
with FR:). And then myself and others on the board will post EXACTLY
what you need to get past it. I will spend a LOT of time doing this in
the next week (even sharing new tactics/techniques) on ONE condition.
When you receive the advice, you MUST go out, use it, and write up a
post saying how it went. If you can NOT do that, you shouldn't be
here.
Now, do NOT post about specific HBs or sarges. Look at the BIG
picture.
For those of you who STILL do not have a format to your approach, this
is how I break it down. There are two variables during a sarge: What
YOU are doing and how SHE is responding.
Beyond that, there are FOUR critical moments during a sarge (where
most sticking points take place):
1. OPENER: Approaching an HB or a group.

2. RAPPORT/VALUE: Being interesting/entertaining/charming/unusual
enough for them to want to keep talking to you after the opener
3. ATTRACTION/CHEMISTRY: Getting her to find you attractive (and
consider you as a bf, ONS, lover, whatever)
4. CLOSING: Once you have the interest, successfully getting the #,
the *, the f, etc.
So, look at your recent experiences with women, determine the one tool
or thing you need to take the next step, and post your STICKING POINT.
Keep your post SHORT and SIMPLE. Look at the big picture of where you
are at right now, not one specific sarge where something went wrong.
Let's get focused and get better!
Ability + Confidence + Energy = PUA
(Note that I am still FAR from the PUA I want to be. My journey has
only just begun. I will be posting my sticking points in this thread
too.)
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 03 Aug 2002 18:48:00 GMT

subject: Re: SP: Demonstrating Value
On Sat, 03 Aug 2002 13:03:00 -0400, BLscorpZ wrote:
>I've encountered a sticking point lately since I've been approaching more
>and more groupsets than ever. This never happens during one-on-one sarging
>or two-sets, but more in bigger groups, 3-4+.
>
>After the opening, I do a follow up routine to demonstrate value and neg the
>target. But in the middle of my routine, one person (could be the target
>herself or a non-target) keeps interrupting and shifting the conversation
>back to themselves. So my routine ends up sounding like a broken record or
>something.
>
>I do NEG the target if she is the one interrupting by saying "You talk too
>much, <hand puppet> yak yak yak, wait your turn." Sometimes it did work,
>sometimes not. HOWEVER, if it is the guy or CB interrupting, I stall at
>this point. One should always be pleasant and friendly to the CBs while
>still in the process of disarming them, so I am not sure how to proceed.
>Right now, I just smile and nod, going "right... oh yeah... uh-huh..." and
>after waiting out the interruption, finish the routine. Still, I feel that
>the power of the routine is diminished if there have been a lot of
>interruptions.
>
>So any suggestions on how to deal with routine interruptions by people who
>talk too much?
>
>Thanks in advance.
There are two kinds of interruptions:
1. Where the CB/Obstacle/Target is talking to you. This is good. The

POINT of the routine is to get INTO the set. So this is an invitation.
Just drop the routine, or include the CB in it. I LOVE sets with a
really alpha guy, because he'll invite me right in and we can joke
around. Then I'll try to do something that will blow his mind (a magic
trick if necessary), and if you win his respect or fascination, you
have the group. This is NOT bad. Let them talk and invite you in. You
have so much MATERIAL that you can always out-alpha them anyway. So,
in this case, forget the routine, join the group, win their
acceptance, and sarge your target.
2. Where the CB/Obstacle is NOT talking to you. This is bad. It means

that either your routine was not powerful enough to keep the group
attention, or that you didn't disarm properly and give the CD/Obstacle
enough attention. Flattery will get you everywhere here if it's an

obstacle or alpha male.
I do a lot of group sets, and THIS is never a problem for me. This is
because I am not focused on having to STICK to my routines. If I'm in,
I'm in and who cares. I'll save my routines for isolation with the
target. If it's someone who wants to talk about themselves, that's
cool too. I'll get the whole group in on it, and play around with the
idea, pit them against each other, joke around like I'm their best
friend too.
This is my metaphor for a group set: I think of everyone there as

having a fire in their bellies. It is my goal to keep all those fires
stoked. So if anyone's fire starts to burn out, I throw more wood on
it by paying attention to them. When the fire is going again, I turn
to someone else and stoke theirs. When they are all going, I am in
total control and they love me.
So look at:
A. Your performance
B. Your flexibility
Hope this helps....
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 03 Aug 2002 23:37:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: the long last step
Hey Fatass,
Enjoying your posts now that you are more IN the game than before--as
a participant and not just an expert. Has something changed in your
life? In your area, I know it is a little more of a numbers game than
elsewhere as far as finding women willing to f close quickly. I know
some people who have tactics of always getting the f close fast, but
for ME I want to do it in a way that the HB does NOT have buyer's
remorse and wants to do it again.
Out of curiosity, are you using any of the actual ASF techniques to
battle LMR? The way I see it, there are five ways to battle LMR, and
you can use them all in order (I do and Mystery has)

1. Steal her frame: If you think she's getting worried, stop

BEFORE HER, and say things like, "You know, I'm getting the feeling
that we should pause for a moment and talk" or comment on how it's all
going so fast for you.
2. The classic, that is in all the recent lay reports: Keep agreeing,
but moving forward and pacing. "You're right, I shouldn't be
unbuttoning your pants right now" "Its so bad I'm making you feel so
good"
3. Riker's Three Rules (do you use these? do you have a good script
for them?)
4. Mystery turn-off: In bed, if she won't let you do something twice,

respond casually-without anger. Turn on light, turn off music, watch a
cartoon. If she asks what's up, say, "Ever since I was a kid, the idea
of 'no' has been the biggest turn-off. I just lose everthing. It's
really no problem-we can just be friends. I don't want to." If you
want, you can tell a story here about how in sixth grade a friend
taught you a trick, and you went to a girl in class and said, "I bet I
can make your breats move without touching them." Then you bobbled
them, and said "I lose." You got into such big trouble, the principle
even hit you and then suspeneded you and called your parents. So you
really respect boundaries now, and when a girl says no, you assume
that she means no, and just shut down. It's no big deal. That's just
the way you are.
Now, after this, either she will come to you and reinitiate or you can
come to her. Try even being direct: if, for example, she won't take
off her shirt, say, "Get onyour knees...lift your arms" and just take
off her shirt
If you get rejection a second time, say, "I'm an adult--either we're
going to be happy, maybe even have sex, or we can play chess."
It is scary to do this, but at least in America, I've never found it
not to work. Try experimenting by just turning off and rolling over
when you get resistance, you'll see that she will return to you.
5. I HAVE NOT USED THIS ONE YET. IT IS NEW. FROM CLIFF'S FRIEND DAVID.
BUT IT IS ALSO GENIUS. Early in the relationship,he asks the HB about
what her rules are, he gets her to ratify that she is spontaneous,
that she follows her feelings, etc. He is laying traps so that if she
resists later, she is then in the position of contradicting what she
has already told you. Then, when facing LMR, he will say, "Excuse me,
I didn't get a copy." HB: What? PUA: A copy of your rules. Fax them
to me and I'll decide if I want to see you again." Then you trigger
the traps you have set: "I thought you were spontaneous. I thought you

did what you wanted. Were you lying to me?" Other traps involve
getting her to ratify that she's her own indpendent person, and not
dependent on family and friends for decisions, and that you won't
judge each other by past experiences with anyone else.
Finally, Fatass, from reading your email, this is my personal thought:

Once you've put ALL THE WORK into a seduction, you are afraid to blow
it at this late stage. So, what you need to do maybe, is advance work
before LMR to let her know what type of guy you are, so that it will
be congruent when you push (in the right way!) for the close. For
example, I always say (partly from Mystery, and also it is true), that
"all the passionate relationships I have ever had all had one thing in
common: they began passionately. My last girlfriend, who I dated for
three years, and I slept together on the second date. etc etc." Also,
Milton Erickson discussed a great technique for seduction. Maybe you
can read about it somewhere, but basically he was a perfect gentleman,
but said, "On the eighth date, I am not responsible for what I do. I
am not going to be able to control myself. That's just who I am etc
etc." So he wouldn't hit on the hb at all, he'd even do a small
takeaway for the seventh date, then the HB knew that when she was
going to see him for the eighth date, she had already ratified that
something was going to happen.
And, if you REALLY want it to happen fast, make yourself an expert in

female sexuality and the female body, and let them know that!
This is long, and there's a lot of stuff here, most of which you may
already be aware of. If I haven't addressed the problem directly, let
me know and I'll continue. But, obviously, logic NEVER works. You
already know that, so discard it. Appeal to emotions, desires, core
personal values, and the reward/punishment instinct.
>Another sticking point for me is that I have a lot of trouble

>penetrating the NLP seductive-o-babble that is in common use on these
>boards. Fractionate! Calibrate! Reverse thrusters! WTF? I'm sure
>this is meaningful after you've done it a thousand times, but for me
>it's a dense thicket.
LOL! Of course, they are just words with definitions, nothing to do

with sticking points. And I bet you already do know the meanings,
you're just frustrated with seeing them all the f-ing time. Seriously,
if you really do want a definition of any of these words, ask again
and I'll give you the definitions as I understand them.
Talk soon,

CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 04 Aug 2002 00:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: opening/closing
On Sat, 03 Aug 2002 17:58:00 -0400, danilo wrote:
>
>Thank you, Style. It's a very generous offer that you extended. Reflecting on
>your post, I realized that there are a lot of quirks in my game which I
haven't
>corrected because I usually stumble through them. I'll go through them as
>briefly as possible, and I appreciate you helping me perfect my game.
Danilo, I think these are not sticking points, just confusion points.
Over all, if you add this all up, you seem to have ONE sticking point:
dealing with situations that you cannot control or are not prepared
for, especially ones that involve groups. As anyone gets good at this,
they learn to let go of the rules (which are just suggestions anyways)
and be flexible and understand each situation. The more you do this,
the more naturally it will come to you. Anyway, answers below. Hope
they help:
>
>OPENING
>
>Black Nails is one of my favorite openers. I enjoy it because I can open
>virtually any situation involving groups of girls.
>
>But whenever there's one or more guys in the group, I stumble.
Yeah, either find a different opener for groups with guys OR just pace
the guy's reaction and then go on (agree, but then proceed as to why
you changed your mind) OR get out of the opener quickly after the
story, and go into the next bit of your routine.
If they say it's gay, you can also say, "they're black, not pink."
Mirror their attitude, then best it.
Out of curiousity, do you follow up with the elevator story?

> * What is the best way to open a set walking your way? Other than following
>them.
Personally, I don't do this. But here are things others use:
Mystery follows discreetly, and then approaches when they arrive at a

cafe.
Nightlight 9 walks in front of them, holds his hand up, and says,
light-heartedly, "Stop it...stop...stop it..." until they slow down,
and then uses a light opener.
You can jump in front and say "stick 'em up," joke around, and then go
into other opener. I've done this before, but again, don't like street
approaches.
The author of the Sexual Key just gets in front, does an interrupt
("stop"), and then compliments them and goes straight into pure
NLP-type patterning.
Finally, the easiest, lamest thing to do is to just stop them and ask
for directions to a place that you KNOW is in the direction that they
are walking. Then walk with them, and open as usual.
> * When you approach a table at a restaurant or coffee shop, do you recommend
>immediately sitting down and talking or stand there talking for a few minutes
>before sitting down?
Some people do, I don't. I wait until I am mid-story (at a

cliffhanger), and then ask to sit down. I ALWAYS say (and this is
crucial) that I can only stay for a minute, because my friends are
over there and I need to return to them. This helps lessen a lot of
anxieties.
> * How do you approach and entertain a full table with no empty seats? Stand
>there talking for 15-20 minutes?
After five minutes, you should do the above, and then pull up an empty
seat. You need to JOIN the group.
>Unique canned openers: I love them but I work a nearby college campus
regularly
>(there's 3 where I live) and it's a bit weird (hilarious in retrospect) when I
>open the same people twice with the exact same opener I used on them a week or
>two ago. ;)
Yes, two options here:

1. Come in with fluff. You can do the "wave" opener. Wave sort of
meekly, jokingly, until they wave back. Then join them, fluff, and

then go into routine. (If you have opened so many people on campus,
you can always insert early in your routine a question like, "I feel
like we've met before, and had a really interesting conversation." If
no, just say maybe it's deja vu, and now you have a bridge into an ESP
routine.
2. All openers, even canned ones, fall into a certain class. There's
the "opinion" opener, the "intuition" opener, etc. Make up a new one
every day.
>Casual openers: They are usually not as interesting as prepared ones. Say you
>spot a casual way to open a set. Would you go for it or stick to your reliably
>interesting ones?
The canned opener is ALWAYS a fallback, a way to go into a set without

thinking. If you can do a casual one, ALWAYS do it. And if it doesn't
get you into the set, you still have your canned one to fall back on.
>CLOSING
>
>How do you elegantly #-close a target in the midst of her friends? Often I
make
>plans, tell her to come along, some of her friends pop in with "are we invited
>too?" or "sounds like a cool plan! we are in."
First, you should be DISARMING the friends, so that they like you too.
It sounds like you are if they want to come too. Cool, then.
Number-close the group, so you can all meet up later, but do it by
getting HER number. It is important to have their approval, so they
can say good things about you when you're gone. If you don't invite
them or concentrate too much on her, they will work AGAINST you
instead.
This is not a problem. Let the friends come along, sarge them, make
them like you more than they even like her, and then they will only be
too glad to let you two slip off together. This is not a problem to
me.
>I isolate and close whenever possible, but sometimes it's not (people eating
at
>a restaurant, a 2-set waiting for a bus, 2-3 people studying in a library).
You can't isolate one girl out of a two-set without a wing, as far as
I know. Anyone here been successfully able to do this. Other than
that, with three sets or larger, just tell the group that you are
borrowing their friend to (whatever) and you'll be right back.
They'll either say "ok" or "if it's alright with her," and, bam, you
are in.

================================================================================
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 04 Aug 2002 00:27:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: The Target's Intelligence
This is easy, Unchaste. I find myself here sometimes. With targets

that are just lame are passive thinkers and just don't respond to
patterns, or can't imagine the cube, etc., YOU must change YOUR
tactics if you want them. They are going to respond not to patterns or
EV, but to kino, laughter, and being LED by a CONFIDENT MAN (even an
asshole). Fuck ASF tactics, but remember Alpha tactics: make her your
pet. Do two things instead, in addition to the C&F that you mention:
1. Be a storyteller. Tell funny, entertaining stories. Just be totally

comfortable with her, and don't care what she thinks. Put her under
your wing, tease her, lead her, and don't wait for or care about her
responses. Talk, talk, talk, and soon she will get comfortable, and
when she is talking and laughing too, take her hand and you are on
your way.
2. Also have some fun interactive routines that aren't deep. Games,
tricks, kino things--thumb wrestling, play wrestling, tickling, and
any game you may have played in second grade.
Finally, you don't need to screen these chicks. Sounds like you can
recognize them pretty quickly. If you don't want to lay them, there's
nothing wrong with befriending them as a pivot and working their
friends.
Hope this helps...though I don't feel that this is your sticking

point...just a type of girl that throws you off your game, so you
eject even though she's so visually appealing...
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 04 Aug 2002 00:53:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Kino and kissing

Wzd,
I feel your pain, man. I was there. In fact, that was one of my major
sticking points. It isn't anymore. I will tell you how I got over it,
and I will share a bunch of my new routines here too.
A few things:
I modelled my alpha friends. Whenever they are talking to someone, I

notice that they are very physical. They hit the back of their hand
(lightly) against someone's chest to get their attention. They make
points by a slight karate-chop (lightly!) on their arms. They are
always touching in a natural, non-groping way.
Thus, to get over this, you must make for yourself a KINO routine.
In my mind, the point of kino is just to pave the way for a kiss. So
to me, kino isn't just to turn her on, it's to test her responses to
my touch. My new routine is something like this, as far as going from
kino to kiss.
Step one: touching arm and shoulders to talk. (Don't linger.) Just
being a physical guy.
Step two, touching waist. Holding her waist to guide her around
corners, rocking it back and forth to make a point. When you kino, it
is important not to let your hand just linger somewhere like a dead
fish. Make your touches authoratative and seductive. Here, I may also
let my leg brush hers etc., and see if she moves away or not.
Step three, if all signs are go, as I introduce my next routine, I'll
hold both my hands out. Either she will give me her hands or I'll ask
for them. I will hold her hands and see if she squeezes back or not.
If she squeezes back, then I am in. I will just hold hands for a
little while, and if she says anything, use the Mystery line, "This is
subtext. We're not supposed to talk about."
From here, I will use one of two *closes I am using now:
1. The Style *Close (if this is someone else's, let me know). This
usually happens 15-25 minutes into the sarge: As we are talking, and
I'm getting DDB, I just say, "I am trying so hard NOT to kiss you
right now," as if I'm trying to control myself. (Note: This is
foolproof, Wzd. You can't lose, because you are not TRYING for
anything.) I watch her reaction, and then go on with whatever I am
talking about. If her signs were good, then I kiss her about a minute

later.
2. My Evolution Phase-Shift Routine. Wzd, you will love this one. It

is what you need to do--to LILY-PAD (slowly, through yesses, escalate
to where you want to go).
A. We start talking about attraction, and I say that evolution has

wired us to get aroused at certain things. Then I say, for example,
feel this, and I pull the back of her hair. She says "mmmm..." And I
say "see."
B. Then I say come closer. And I talk about how animals begin the
mating ritual by sniffing each other. Then I smell her hair, and under
her hair, and go into the whole "mmm, you smell good" thing.
C. Then I talk about how the most sensitive places on the body are
places that are usually hidden from contact with the air, like the
back of her neck. Then I take her arm, and I erotically bite the area
on the opposite side of the elbow (that crease where it bends). [Last
week, an HB told me this was also true of the back of her knee, so I
erotically bit her there in the middle of the club.]
D. From here, if she falls into me, I may bite her neck. If not, I
point to my neck and say, "Now, bite me here." When she does, I say
"mmmm, I love that." If not, I punish, turn away and talk to someone
else for a moment, then return and say, "Bite my neck." After two
times, this almost always works (for some reason)
E. Here, if she doesn't bite neck well, I show her how I like it by
biting her neck, then have her do it to me again. Or, at this point,
you can just brush her hair aside and go for the kiss.
Also, on a second meeting with an HB, if I've set the frame right, I
will just ASSUME that she is my gf and take her hand. Presume that
it's okay to do the things a BF or FB does with her.
Wzd, you are going to hit a breaking point, and once you see how easy
kino and kissing are (I was fucking worried about it for so long), you
will never have this SP again.
Talk soon. Post results, man!
CPowles
================================================================================

================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 04 Aug 2002 02:10:00 GMT
subject: SP: When to Hold, When to Fold
As I get good at this, my goal is no longer to go out and do a lot of

approaches. My goal is to go out and get laid or get a MLTR.
In the past, my format was to do 20 minute sets, get the number or the
*, and then eject.
But, by staying in a set, by instant dating (even going on two instant

dates), and hanging in, there is often a chance of getting the
f-close. A lot of women I got a # close with, and then moved on to the
next set, probably would have come home with me if I'd stayed in and
taken it to the next level. Then again, a lot would NOT have.
So, the question is this:
When I go out, is there any way to tell whether I should stay in the
set, instant date, and try to bring the girl home OR whether I should
move on and work another target. Are there any tests/questions for
this. My concern is that I will stay in the wrong set, and find myself
CB'ed at the end of the night.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 04 Aug 2002 02:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: using some of the more eccentric stuff
Again, this is NOT a sticking point. It is a question you have about

methods and seduction. It will not make your game better to know WHOSE
methods to use. What will improve your game is figuring out WHERE you
get stuck during the PROGRESS of a sarge, and ironing out that
wrinkle. (Bad metaphor alert.)
Anyway, the easy answer to your question is this:

A. Only use what you are congruent with and can perform confidently.
B. The best way to be congruent and confident with material is to see
it work for you.

So, for me, I don't use the Elvis script. I don't like it, though I
have seen it work for others. That's fine for them, not for me. I do
use other Mystery scripts, though, and love them. See what you are
comfortable and congruent saying.
That said, the fact that he looks a certain way has NOTHING to do with
the effectiveness of his scripts. The fact that he uses magic
sometimes does. But I do not do magic (generally), and still use the
scripts.
So, for you, scrap the Elvis script. Unlike others here, at least you
TRIED it. And it didn't work for you. Cool. Do you have another opener
that works? Use that one instead. If not, I can suggest one.
Yes, it does help to see others use them effectively. That's how I've
learned most of my SS and Mys and other scripts. What are the other
scripts that are troubling you? I'll try to help. And what is your
TRUE sticking point?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 04 Aug 2002 12:32:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: the long last step
>I have successfuly used Steal Her Frame, Agree With Her and Then Do
>What You Want, and something very close to Mystery's takeaway. I
>can't find Riker's Rules on the web site. What are they?
Not sure that he wants them posted. Email me at

cpowles100@hotmail.com, and I will see if I can send them or not.
>Actually, for me, the later it gets the more sure it gets. My pre-ASF
>style consisted mostly of just hanging in and waiting while taking
>advantages of opportunities to spell-bind them. That still works, but
>I want to move faster. You referred to Erickson's "eighth date". For
>me, an eighth meeting will be a sure-thing lay, but I want to make it
>more like the second or third.
That was an example. Just modify it to fit your desires. It obviously

doesn't have to be the eighth date. That is not the point. It can be
the third date, or going camping, or starting to kiss, or whatever.

Just as long as she knows that by doing something, she is also

agreeing to sex. It is like an implicit contract.
>I start pushing right away, sometimes way too soon for these girls.
PUSHING is not good, right? When you push, people automatically will
resist because that is in their nature. Never push. Make her want you
and have to push you.
>They STILL seem *surprised* that I want to fuck them, even after I've
>been talking about sex and rubbing their thighs for an hour. Maybe
>this is where the age difference kicks in; they don't expect this old
>guy to want their pussies. Maybe they think I'm a compulsive massage
>therapist. :-)
Hmmm. I NEVER blame anything on the girl. If this is happening

consistently, it must be something that you are doing. Everyone CAN be
seduced, somehow, right?
Are you making a clear SOI at some point?
Are you telling stories that demonstrate your sexuality?
Are you doing age destroyer-type pattterns? I have one where I say
that every age counts up to say 18 or 19. After that, everyone is at
the same level of maturity until they get married. Then they are a
couple, and have to see the world in this way. The next age comes when
they have a child,and for the first time have to stop living for
themselves because someone more impt has come into their lives.
That's the short version. I don't know if this would work for you or
not, because I don't know if you have any children.
Most important, learn Riker's Three Rules. I think they will be a

MAJOR step towards getting the lay faster. They are for me.
Finally, and this may be prying, but if you get a girl turned on
enough, she WILL want to have sex. We can discuss simple techniques if
you want for doing this. You can also maybe read Mantak Chia and
Tantric Sex type books (though I know people are a little less open to
experimenting there).
In my mind, here is the flaw that often leads to this sticking point:
You are making sex YOUR experience, and not HERS. (Could this be true
for you too?)
>So what the fuck does "calibrate" mean?

Calibrating, in my mind, is just observing your target's personality,

reaction, and values, and then adjusting your own game so that you are
in tune with those things. Think of it as TUNING. Fractionating, in
hypnosis, is when you bring a subject out of trance, then put the
subject back in. And when they go in again, they go in deeper. So, for
general PU purposes. Think of it as doing a TAKEAWAY (though it
doesn't have to be a physical takeaway; it can also be, for example,
pausing the sexual talk for fluff etc.) If anyone here has better
definitions, feel free to improve mine above.
>Thanks again!
Hope we're getting closer!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 04 Aug 2002 12:50:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Extraction, isolation, and the */Fclose
>This SP thread is a great idea.
Thanks. I hope it's helping. Others here, feel free to chip in and
contribute with advice for these SPs. I don't want to be the ONLY one
answering!
>I've gotten to the point now where in a given night I get good IOI's from my
>sets. However, I usually flub up the extraction of my target ("mind if I
>talk to your friend for a while" in large groups), and I puss out and go for
>a number close.
Yeah, that SUCKS. Try having a BETTER reason to extract. Then you have
a better pretext. I have a feeling you are not congruent with what you
say, like you don't believe it is going to work. The easiest
extraction reasons can be:
1. To take a lap in the club and look for your friends.
2. To show her the cube, because if her friends hear it won't work on
them. This way, she can then teach it to her friends.
But the proper way to do it is to be negging the target the whole

time. Then you say, "Ive been alienating your friend, is it alright if
I speak to her for a couple minutes? good," (This is pure MM.) Then

you pull her aside, and give her runes/photos/whatever, and ask her to
bring them over to you by the couches. What is working here is: A.
Peer Approval and B. Object Obligation.
Then read her runes or show her your photos or whatever on the couch.
Look for IOIs. Do the photo kissing routine (do you know it?) and
*close.
>I need to work on my middle/end game a lot. I tend to do better with girls
>looking for a ONS/purely physical relationship, but I don't push it enough
>due to fear of messing up what I have accomplished thus far in the sarge,
>and I don't push things enough.
Follow the new rule being espoused on this board. I hate the wording
(make the ho say no), but I like the idea of pushing it farther.
>With quieter, more reserved girls I don't do as well because my

>connection-building skills are not so sharp.
See the post above that I made on "stupid" girls. Do the same thing:
tell stories, take charge, lead. We met a few months back, and this is
something I think you can work on. You are a nice, cool, regular guy.
I can see you being very good at connections, and at observing people
for their reactions. Now practice taking charge, not caring what they
think, and being congruent with your desires. Have the confidence to
expect the best outcome for yourself.
>Aside from these points, I have some more specific questions: what are your
>guys' criteria for deciding which girls to extract? Do you always do it at
>the end of the night? (sometimes your first set is your best set).
When you say extraction, I am assuming you mean extraction from the
club. Guys have two diff criteria:
1. The most responsive (or the easiest)
2. Their favorite HB in the club: their target, the one they enjoy
talking to the most.
A true PUA would do 2, right? But 1 is cool too if that's what you
want.
As far as waiting for the end of the night, you can always instant
date as soon as you find a worthy HB. I like to go to a lamer bar at
the beginning of the night, so that I can then talk a worthy HB or set
into accompanying me to a better bar. Now you are PART of the group,
they are in your territory, and you are in control.
>When you have extracted them, and say you are walking to someone's place or
>an instant date, what conversational threads do you start and why? Do you

>work on building more comfort/rapport? Increase kino, etc?
4Running, did you see the movie that Mystery and I made of our Toronto
sarge. It shows the extraction, and us talking on the way. Our thing
is, yes, to make them feel comfortable. Make them LAUGH. Do you do
this? Joke around and tease and be silly sometimes. But, at the same
time, to do a little bit of a gf presumption. Sit on the same side of
the booth, hold hands, whatever. Yes, exactly, though, we are working
on building comfort and rapport, and LETTING GO OF OUR OUTCOME. It's
like time distortion in a way. The secret to this is to be comfortable
yourself, and not think "oh boy, i'm going to get some. i hope she
doesn't change her mind."
>So to recap:
>
>OPENER: no problem here
>RAPPORT/VALUE: I'm good at demonstrating value, but rapport is a bit
>trickier. I want to establish that 'known each other forever' connection
>with my targets
Yeah, did you see my post on eliciting values. I find this helps. The
Cube also does this. I find that HBs often tell me that I know them
better afte 10 minutes than any of their friends. Also KEY is finding
commonalities--things you both have in common--and amplifying them.
There's also mirroring, cocking your head and nodding, and, as someone
here posted, saying things like "I was just about to say the SAME
thing!" Rapport should be easy for you. Sarge with a good wing too,
helps. I really like sarging best friends and sisters with a good wing
like Nightlight9 or Mystery or Maddash.
>ATTRACTION: Good at this, I usually move into relationship/intimate talk

>and the girl starts showing the IOI's
>CLOSING: getting better, but the weakest part of my game by far. I still
>get MPB.
Yeah, if this isn't working, either you have a fear of closing

correctly or, more likely, there's an earlier piece of your game that
you are not doing right. Take a look at a past sarge in detail: maybe
it IS the rapport thing, maybe it's something else going on internally
that she is picking up on. Think about it, and post again if you want.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 04 Aug 2002 18:03:00 GMT

subject: Re: whether or not to 'wig' out...
On Sun, 04 Aug 2002 10:47:00 -0400, poet wrote:
>
>Yes he deffinitelly would. I don't know if it's he or other PUA but I remember
>lay report where he chats up 2 HB10 then shows he's wearing a wig and use it
in
>his pickup to demonstrate personality.
>
Yeah, that was me. Here is my take on this stuff:
Exaggerate what you have. If you are going bald, shave it ALL off. And
love it. If you want to wear a wig, do it for FUN. NOT to compensate.
The truth is this, as I told the HB10 and 11 I pu'ed in a wig: I go
out bald, in a cool black haired wig, and in a heavy metal wig. And it
doesn't make ANY difference as far as how people treat me. Because, it
is ALL ATTITUDE. Don't worry about your hair: worry about your
attitude. Love yourself, and others will too.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 01:58:00 GMT
subject: Re: something I tried with a HOHHT bartender - comments welcome
On Sun, 04 Aug 2002 19:31:00 -0400, YAKUZA wrote:
>Hmm....That's actually pretty good right there with the paper/marker trick.
>But, you have to get the number especially if you are giving her your number.
>That's like one of the big rules here because she will never call. If by some
>snowball's chance in hell she does, then you do own her.
>
IMHO, different rules apply for wait staff. There was no way to really
get the number after this visit, judging by your report. If this is a
bar you go to a lot, you can build up value over time. Just keep
coming in, making her almost anticipate your arrival so you guys can
talk, and then start doing takeaways. Also, do NOT order drinks from
her or tip her. Get them from another bartender if possible. I did a

seduction like this recently with a girl who worked at a crepe stand.
To tell the truth it didn't work out (she was too young and I
overqualified myself), but it was fun. To punish her once, I showed up
at her crepe stand eating a crepe from A RIVAL stand. These kinds of
seductions can be fun.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 02:09:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: using some of the more eccentric stuff
>IMO, I have two obvious sticking points.

>
>1) 50% of the time I run out of stuff to talk about, because I am not
>adaptive/versatile enough to deal with HBs responding poorly (ie neutral,
never
>bad since I'm good w/ rapport) to my routines. I have to develop a better
>secondary thought process, to adapt FAST. I hate leaving and realizing a
>minute later what I COULD have said.. I'm not sure if you can offer advice on
>this though other than to keep sarging.
A couple suggestions here:

1. It is okay to leave and see what you SHOULD HAVE said. But then
write it down. Do you keep either a journal, or a file with your
routines/patterns/openers on it. If not, you should.
2. Do you do much cold reading. This is how I get past quiet parts and
transitions. It's key for me. When I do a routine, it's just to keep
my mouth busy while my mind is scanning the situation and figuring out
how to best adapt.
3. It sounds like you need to get out of your own head. Don't watch
yourself; watch the group and their responses. Who is the leader? What
is their relationship? What stands out? Who has good and bad body
language? Don't worry about getting stuck. You may be your own worst
enemy if you WORRY about what to say next. When that happens, interact
with the group, even fluff, then go back into material when it comes
naturally.
4. It sounds like you are on the right track anyway. As long as you
leave, then realize what you should have said, and THEN apply that
knowledge to the next set, you're going to be WELL on your way.

>2) I wish I could come up with a more neutral closer, for the specific purpose
>of sarging girls in closed environments (ie my gym and university classes).
>This is because I get scared (to be honest) to try to run my regular no fear
>type game on girls that I will have to see everyday. ie - I wish I had
>something that I could bail out of, to avoid awkwardness, in the case that I
>misjudge the likely success of my close (not often, but it happens). I hate to
>admit that I think about these things, but it is the case right now.
I'm not sure exactly what you mean here. You sort of want a closer
that is indirect, so that if you don't get the close it won't be
embarrassing. I'm assuming you are talking about #closes here. Again,
you should be IN THE MOMENT enough to know whether the close is
possible or not, whether the HB is going to respond or not. I do
understand not wanting to stale out or get rejected with girls you
have to run into every day, but if you're fun, interesting, and you
bait them with a plan, they'll want to close you. For me, the
foolproof safe close is to seed the conversation with a plan. First,
bring it up at some point. Then later realize it's something she would
enjoy too. Then later realize that you should both do it together. And
then when you leave, she'll be like, "wait, how are we going to get in
touch?"
>I am personally using "you look like you're thinking about something"
>(variation of M) if I see a girl sitting there alone.. they always think that
>they must have appeared overly introspective or something and start telling me
>what they were thinking and bam.. my other opener when I get strong returned
EC
>is "you must be really confident.. I thought that girls were supposed to look
>away when guys look at them." cause it fuels their ego and gets them thinking
>that they can be even more confident (ie get with a new guy). This has worked
>GREAT so far. My current #close that IMO I think all sarges should close with
>is, "yeah I gotta go.. I'd talk to you more though.. is there a way that I
>could REACH you." (presupposition since the answer is obviously 'yes', and
less
>overt than can I CALL you.
See, "talking to you more" is boring IMHO. At the very least, leave
her on a cliffhanger. Don't finish the Cube or something; that way,
there's something specific you have to do when you talk again. Also,
these sound like 1-on1 openers, which are cool on campus. Do you have
group openers too?
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 02:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Demonstrating Value - RESULTS
On Sun, 04 Aug 2002 10:41:00 -0400, BLscorpZ wrote:
>Thank you, Style for clearing this up... I followed your advice and got
>immediate results.
Awesome, BlscorpZ. THIS is what makes it worth doing this, man.

Immediate application. ANYONE I've seen get really really good shares
this trait with you. Hope we can meet sometime!
>This situation has occurred to me twice during the night. Whenever I got
>interruptions from other people talking to ME, I layed off the routine and
>let them talk... and I would respond to them based on what they said. I
>don't really know any magic tricks or whatsoever (I should learn a few
>because visual openers and routines are good for me). I just did the usual
>cocky/funny, kept them laughing and having a good time. Then I managed to
>isolate one girl who was giving me the most IOIs by asking the CB "I really
>like her, is that okay with you?" She gave me a thumbs up, and I proceeded
>to kiss close the target. Had I TRIED to stick with my routine, it would
>have became awkward (at least for me) and I would have ejected too early.
>It pays to be FLEXIBLE.
Yes, awesome. Flexiblility rocks! After a while, routines just become

a way to fill dead air...
>I've got this a few times as well, and just did the "pleasure to meet you"
>eject.
You don't HAVE to eject here. To me, either you need stronger routines
for sets like this. OR, you have to make sure that the CB/Alpha is
really included in your patter, like pointing out how he's the group
leader, and directing your stuff at him/her. If you win over an
attention hungry group leader like this, they will invite you right
into the set and then you can steal the HB of your choice.
>
>That's a VERY good metaphor, it really worked to think of it like that.
>Keep everyone satisfied with the attention they are getting and you'll
>always win.
Exactly! Awesome. Nice job on the *close!!!!
CPowles

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 02:22:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: transitioning/'running out of material'
On Sun, 04 Aug 2002 15:45:00 -0400, Chameleon wrote:
>Here is my sticking point.

>
>I've only been doing this for about a month. Most of this has been
>deshying/newbie missions. I am now at the point where I can open a
>conversation with anybody, groups or single girls.
Excellent. Good for you. I've met people who have been in this
community for TWO YEARS and still can't open a group. That's why I
started this SP thread. Sick of seeing people who have been in this
community far longer than I (just nine months for me) with NO
MATERIAL. Mind-boggling.
>The problem I keep running into is transitioning from the opener into my next
>routine. I don't have good segways, I guess. Here is what usually happens.
I
>will go up to, say, a two-set, and use the Elvis Opener. This usually
>generates good conversation about bad boys, but it only goes so far. When I
>get the sense that the conversation is about to trail off, I usually go back
>into what I used to do before I found ASF (I know this isn't the best idea).
I
>will ask AFC-style questions like "where you from" etc and listen to her
>answers. I look for the opportunities in the conversation to move into
another
>routine, and if they come, great. But often what happens is they don't, and I
>end up stalling out.
Okay. Cool. A lot of people have this problem. It's easy:
1. You don't need transitions. Just go into your next routine or

pattern. Watch stand up comedians. A lot don't use transitions and it
still flows. As many here say, to start you have to talk 80 percent of
the time for the first few minutes.
2. Write out a structure for yourself. This is what I did. A list of:
Openers

Ways to Demonstrate Value

Ways to Gain Rapport
Ways to transition into getting Physical
Ways to Physically Close
This way, you'll know where you're going after your opener. You just
have to SMALL CHUNK this stuff into your game, piece by piece.
3. Like I said in an above post, get books on cold-reading. Watch the

person or the group as you are delivering your opener. Comment on
their reaction, their body language, etc. Make statements that are
TRUE about them. That is how I transition, or fill the space, after an
opener. In fact, I often interrupt my opener to do this. Leaving open
loops is nice. It makes it seem like you have a lot to talk about.
>
>So I need to address this "running out of material" problem. What I do,
>sometimes, is to use a gimmick like photos on my digicam or palmreading as
>backup against stalling. This is ok, but I don't want to become too dependent
>on gimmicks. What I really need to learn is how to become a better
>conversationalist.
That's okay. Use those gimmicks for now. Like I said above, they can
keep your mouth busy while your mind figures out other non-fluff
things to say. Just have a DIRECTION with what you do. Don't just keep
them talking. Escalate!
>So my question for you guys is how you transition for an opener to, for
>example, a personality-demonstrating story about how you got mugged in San
>Fran. How do you link together your routines? How do you prevent against
>stalling?
All answered above, I think. Let me know if you want more.
Also, make sure that you are not just talking and talking and reciting
and reciting. Pull them into your world. Leave spaces for them to
comment, ask questions as you talk to have them fill in gaps or words,
etc. Suck them into your world as you do your opener and your next
routine. All you REALLY need is ONE routine to go into after Elvis,
and you're cool. It's okay to fluff briefly, and then go back into the
routines. Make that list I mentioned above!
Let me know what happens...
CPowles

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 02:36:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Attraction
>Hi Styles,
>
>Awesome idea this, and the replies and help so far has been awesome. Very
>specific and to the point.
Thanks man. I'm just going to do this for the rest of the week. Too
time-consuming!
>Onwards:
>I don't have any problems with approaching and opening groups. I can usually
>get the attention pretty fast and make them laugh right off the bat.
>However, after that I usually just end up fluffing, being funny, and
>fluffing, being cocky, and fluffing etc. Along with this I'll do a LOT of
>kino and heavy eye contact. Pretty much going full-on sensual and sexual ala
>Gunwitch.
Sounds great!
>Now this seems to work *really* well with the 6s and 7s, (the average
>looking but fuckable chicks), and I don't have any problems closing them.
>But naturally as you get better at this, your standards go up! lol! And I
>find that my same technique simply isn't working on the 8s and up.
Yes! I know people with your game. I understand this. They have
fine-tuned their game to get those 6s and 7s. And they often end up
dating a VERY pretty girl who DOESN'T KNOW she's so pretty. This is
you, no?
>After repeatedly (and stubbornly!!) running into this, I pretty much

>realised my attraction phase needs a lot of work. (I'm VERY average looking
>btw). What I'm doing about it so far: I'm experimenting with getting some
>good routines. At the moment, I'm testing out doing Strawberry Fields and
>the Cube. The preliminary results are looking good, although I haven't had a
>lay out of it yet. At least the last two 9s (who were the first ones I tried
>this on last week) didn't flake or blur on the first meet, which is already
>an immediate improvement.
Okay. You are starting to understand this, because you are applying

something here which is necessary for those 9s. I'll comment on that
below. Anyways, easy. In my mind, the game is MADE for 8s to 10s.
Often, I find it doesn't work on the average girls. It works even
better on the girls who are always approached by guys, because we are
so different and interesting.
>In conclusion:
>OPENER: easy, no prob.
>RAPPORT: usually no problems here. I seem to get the girls quite comfortable
>in my presence.
>ATTRACTION: The SP. I'm looking for more good ideas on how to build the
>ATTRACTION.
>CLOSING: No problem with 6s and 7s. Should be the same if I can get the
>proper attraction generated.
Okay, it's not attraction that you need. It is something BEFORE

attraction.
1. You need to HOOK them. To stand out from all the other guys who
are cocky and funny and good talkers. I always mention DEMONSTRATING
VALUE. With a 6 or 7, your personality and sense of humor are enough
value. You don't need this. With a really hot girl, then you have to,
after the opener, blow her mind WITH:
The Cube (like you are doing)
Palm-Reading, Runes, HW Analysis, something similar
Some kind of cool Hyper Empric demo if it's not too heavy
(OT: I came to realize the other day that it's not just about
demonstrating value, it's also about setting yourself up as an
authority on something.)
2. Are you negging here? Are you introducing challenges into your
game? These things are designed for SHBs.
3. Are you using beauty destroyer patterns? ("Beauty is common, but

what's rare is..."). These are KEY too!
4. What about your dress? If you look regular, you will attract
regular girls. Do not be afraid to stand out. If you want the SHBs,
you will have to dress for SHBs. Peacock, but with taste and style.
Wear jewerly and accouterments etc.
5. BE THE 10! IOW, you must have the attitude of a 10. Be hard to get.
And at the same time, understand how hard it is for her to be so
desired, because you can relate. It's not easy. It's lonely. I get

away with saying these things, and I do not consider myself in any way
to be a good looking dude.
6. I am going to write a post later entitled YOUR WING CAN GET YOU
LAID. These are a lot of new ideas myself and others have been working
on, and they definitely apply to SHBs and will help you immeasurably
if you have a good wing.
To me, there are the key elements to add to step up your game. It will
take you a while to internalize them, but once you do, you are going
to be dangerous.
Let me know what happens!!!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 02:48:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: approaching SHB's / attracting HB's
On Sun, 04 Aug 2002 20:04:00 -0400, psychobabble wrote:
>Damn, I was wondering what the hell this SP shit was hahaha.
>
>I have a fear of approaching SHB's and groups of SHB's. I have managed to get
>one to approach me through pea cocking and ignoring her (she's the gf of a
>band's lead singer I know) but I have not gotten past the fear of approaching
>those 1 in 1000 chicks as of yet.
See the response to Veroxii's post above. Also, when you look at a
SHB, try to imaginer her either as:
A. A chubby homely middle school girl OR
B. Her mother, which she knows she will turn into
Beauty is a shit test, and if you let it intimidate you or make you
uncomfortable or insecure, then you've already failed it.
>I have a problem with the attraction phase. I could most likely have easily #
>closed more than a few but believe my attraction game is weak. I would like
>to/am working on improving my 'attraction' phase because I don't want a weak #
>close. I can easily #close many chicks just with some fluff but that's no
>value to me. I loose track of my plan during the attraction phase and with

>some of the tougher chicks I trip up. I'm still practicing but don't have a
>solid game plan, or loose my game plan (and control) at times during convo's
>with chicks. I need to get them very interested in me in convos but due to my
>job (psychology) O am soooo conditioned to listening to others describe their
>problems and helping them solve them that it is a major challenge for me to
>attract, pace and lead. I'm out in the field regularly. I had been studying
>some materials up until a few weeks ago but found that I'm making more
progress
>by just sarging and then reviewing my sarges and mistakes. Any advice, input
>would be appreciated.
Cool. I understand this. Look at the post I made above this regarding
transitioning out of openers. You need to KNOW your direction and stay
IN CONTROL. In other words, WRITE out your routine. I will be clearer
this time. Here is the structure of my PUs:
OPENER
DEMONSTRATE VALUE
CREATE AN EMOTIONAL CONNECTION
CREATE THE POSSIBILITY OF A PHYSICAL CONNECTION
MAKE THAT PHYSICAL CONNECTION
Have 2-4 routines for EACH of these stages. (For amping things up, see
the Evolution Phase Shift Routine I posted above.) That will be your
solid game plan. I used to be super shy and passive. Now, my problem
is STOPPING from talking and letting her speak.
If you're in psychology, cool, then set yourself up as an authority on

the human mind. Do the Cube and all that other stuff. HBs LOVE hearing
about themselves. What you are learning in psychology is KEY for
attraction, and for being an authority and keeping the spotlight on
you in your PUs.
If you think of a PU as a tight wire that you are pulling, it sounds

to me as if after the opener, you are letting it go slack. Yes?
Anything she says can be a transition into ANY of your material if you
can learn to relax and improvise in the moment.
And once you have this loose game structure in place, then throw in
lines to use for the subtleties:
Negs
Challenges
Cocky/Funny
Stories to get into desired state
>I was reading the headlines SP/SPS and was thinking it was someone selling
some

>new type of system hahaaha so I just read your post and got it now. This was
>very generous for you to do. Like I said, I'm in the field on a regular now,
>and making progress, but some tips would be appreciated.
Cool, PB. Let me know if you need SPECIFIC routines to get you back in
control at any moment in the PU. I think you'll get past this if you
can get the CONFIDENCE to know that what YOU have to say is VERY
INTERESTING to her. And if you KNOW and are CONFIDENT in the direction
you are leading her.
Post results!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 07:37:00 GMT
On Sun, 04 Aug 2002 23:24:00 -0400, Eddy wrote:
>Something important that I realized is the DISTINCTION between SUPER HBs and
>usual HBs.
>Sometimes you see a major HB, and you think that if you neg her it'll help but
>it fucks up..
The rule for deciding whether to neg or not is: don't base your
decision on how hot YOU think she is; base it on how hot SHE thinks
she is.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 09:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: ATTRACTING a chick by telling stories
On Sun, 04 Aug 2002 21:54:00 -0400, Manifestis3 wrote:
>I don't have much problems going up to a chick and talking to her. But the
>main problem is i go in and sarge without a plan...i just go and say hi to

them
>and start fluffing forever...i have now realized that i need more substance in
>my sarges...
It's interesting. There are two different types of responses to the SP

thread:
Those with absolutely no plan
Those with too fixed of a plan
Anyway, yes you do. Good for you. You can talk to a chick. You're
better than half the lurkers here. But, yes, have a plan. Have
substance, for chrisssake. What are you here for if you don't? And,
yes, it may suck and seem corny to LEARN things to say and say
pre-planned things. But think of them as just training wheels, and
when you get good at riding, you CAN remove them.
>i need to improve my story telling because most of the time in order to
>lengthen the converstation, i just keep asking questions and i want to stop
>this habit and start making more statements/story telling...
Yes, stop this. Know where you are going. Lead! Most of the BEST PUAs
I know love to HOLD COURT and just talk forever.
>can you give me some tips and stories you tell that work in many situations
>that will demonstrate value and establish rapport? what is your personal
>routines that work well?
My thought here is that storytelling is NOT your sticking point. Your

sticking point is where to go and what to do after the opener to avoid
just fluffing forever. That said, here's a quick tip on storytelling:
NOTICE what stories you tell that get great responses from your
friends. When you find yourself telling a story and everyone is
hanging on every word, make a note of it so that you have a file of
great stories to tell HBs. And what Eddy said is true: none of them
should be negative. In fact, NEVER express anything negative INITIALLY
in a sarge. If you just got back from the worst vacation ever, DO NOT
say that you hated it.
I'd recommend the e-book the Sexual Key. It's really great, especially
a part where he suggests having good seductive responses for every
question about your life that you may be asked.
Also, for starters, start adding to your skill set one chunk at a
time:
1. The Cube
2. Eliciting Values (see the old thread I wrote on it in "Advanced")

3. Incredible Connection Pattern

4. Ring Finger Pattern (this may not be posted; if it isn't, then it's
private stuff, sorry)
Also, in my sarges, I use two types of stories...

1. Opener stories: these are just funny and entertaining, like about
the time a seal was chasing me when I was surfing or about a car crash
I was in with another PUA or whatever.
2. Stories Meant to Lead Her Into Desired State: These are stories
about friends' sexual experiences, or seemingly irrelevant stories
that actually have a deep pertinent moral (like Mystery's ant farm
story].
Too tired to post much more right now. Let me know if you need more...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 20:27:00 GMT
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 14:32:00 -0400, Manifestis3 wrote:
>hey style,
>
>can you post specific examples of
>
>OPENERS
>DEMONSTRATE VALUE
>GAIN RAPPORT
>CREAT EMOTIONAL CONNECTION
>CREATE POSSIBLITY OF PHYSICAL CONNECTION
>MAKE THAT PHYSICAL CONNECTION
>
>can you give examples of 2 or more stories/things you say in each of those
>groups?
>
>i understand the concept but don't know what kind of stories would work for
the
>groups listed above.

C'mon now. You have to do a little work yourself.Spend some time RTFM
and reading Maniac's site and FastSeduction etc. You'll find routines
for ALL these stages. So do a LITTLE thinking for yourself. And, when
you're done, post your routine here and I'll comment on/critique it on
ONE condition. That you USE IT!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 20:31:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: i aint go no shag pad
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 02:38:00 -0400, wavehoundau wrote:
>Hey crew im sure some of u have a similar problem. I live with my oldies
>(moving away in like 3 months) and bringing chicks home aint an option for me,
>which can be a pain in the ass.. wondering if anyone here can shed some light
>on anyways they have overcame this and good ways to get chicks more responsive
>alternative venues..
Hate to say it, but some of the BEST PUAs I know still live with their
folks. So, as Fatass says, be creative. Do you have a car? Do you have
a relative with a house with a pool or jacuzzi? Is there a beach or
park or isolated area where you live? Check out Fatass's reports: he
takes 'em to the f-ing forest.
Or ever thought about going to THEIR house...
I have a feeling Wavehounau that this is NOT your sticking point.

Unless you mean to tell me that you have dozens of chicks just waiting
to fuck you if they can find a suitable venue. My guess is that this
is your INNER AFC talking, saying what's the point in bothering with
the game since you have no shag pad. Get out there, meet some new HBs,
and get them hot for you. I'm willing to bet that your lack of a pad
will not be a sticking point--just an inconvenience.
Now, post your REAL sticking point, dude.
CPowles
================================================================================


================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 20:34:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP- internet cafe
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 06:38:00 -0400, poet wrote:
>I have problem in internet cafes. I can open quite easily. But chicks paid
>their time on computers, have something to do, read e-mails from friend, so it
>dies out quickly. And start it again up later - at least I have problem with
>that, the momentum is lost.
>
>We have different times so we leave different time. Wait for her in small
>internet cafe feels like supplication.
>
Poet,
I am trying to hold back my instinct to flame you here, but WTF are
you doing sarging in an internet cafe? Since when did hot girls hang
out in an internet cafe? Dude, the answer to your sticking points is
SARGE SOMEWHERE ELSE. Got off the internet and into the real cafes,
the bars, the clubs. And, yeah, you're right. Who wants to talk to a
stranger when they are paying by the minute to be on the internet?
Again, like I've said above, THIS is not your sticking point, dude.
Look at your game again. I have a feeling your current problems are:
A. Approaching outside of totally familiar contexts
B. Your self-image, that you don't feel comfortable in certain
environments.
C. Approaching groups
Just a guess...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 05 Aug 2002 20:46:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Getting panties off sooner

On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 07:37:00 -0400, Commander Zap wrote:
>
>One problem is literally finding time to fuck them all, no kidding.
Yes, because you're taking too long to fuck them.
Seriously, though, Zap, it's been great to watch your progress here.
Dude, you should have seen my first posts just nine months ago.
Ouch...
>But another is getting them in the sack within 2-3 meetings. I am by nature
>such a nice guy that I can enjoy sitting around doing sex talk with the chick,
>patterns, making out, telling her how good sex will be, and I'm not always
>focusing enough on getting her panties off right then and there.
I like the fact that you have no sense of urgency, that you let go of
your outcome, etc. This can help you get the !close faster...
> I've never

>had a problem in the end, but there is an LJBF risk implicit in this, and
>anyway I am sort of relaxing/procrastinating I think, and not making best use
>of her/my time. I enjoy getting them DDB too much without seeing the return.
>They are given to skittishness about giving up the sex, and they need to be
led
>in that direction a bit more than I have been doing. Best is to take them
home
>that very night, of course, lots of them want that too, but are skittish and
>need to be pulled in.
Before I can offer advice, I have a question for YOU Zap. What is YOUR
intent? What do you REALLY want? I have a feeling that there is
something inside YOU that is causing this and being perceived by the
chicks. For example, I met a guy from this group. He runs around like
a machine, opening sets, and then he NEXTs and opens the next set.
Even when the HB is willing to lay him on the spot, he still just
#closes and nexts. Inside, he isn't ready, for some reason, for the
success. He may even have self-limiting beliefs about his own
techniques ane experience sexually, after all he's promised the HBs.
Or maybe getting laid just isn't his goal and intent yet. Zap, I'm not
comparing you to this guy at all. BUT, really ask yourself, WHAT is
your intent? What is that LITTLE AFC VOICE still squawking away in the
back of your head saying, and are you listening to it?
A SIDE NOTE: Sex is NOT something chicks GIVE UP, as you write. That
is their frame. Good sex is not a matter of chick giving up something

and a guy taking it. It's something that's shared. I don't want to
sleep with any girl who thinks she is GIVING IT UP. I reframe girls
I'm with on this all the time, because it's a fucked up (socially
programmed) way of thinking.
>I have one now that I have to make clear next time we fuck or it's NEXT.
>She'll gladly do it, too, she just needs to be led more by me to that result.
>I've had to be a bit tough once before, and I may with her, just a bit and
>she'll gladly copulate. She's probably wondering why we haven't yet, and
>that's not so good.
Sounds like you're pressuring her. Make the sex HER experience, not
yours, and she'll be more likely to jump YOUR bones. Also, Zap, for
ACTUAL TECHNIQUES, ead the response to Fatass's SP post re: LMR.
Talk Soon,
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 03:32:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP:Salvaging a sargeshould have been a done deal
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 18:39:00 -0400, DBCooper wrote:
>Look I have a question on salvaging something. I have a situation where there

>is this gal comes by my volleyball games she is in a FB with one of the guys
on
>this team. A couple of weeks ago she was flirting with me. There was little I
>could do to extract because she was with a fb. Anyway a week later I had a
>chance to go up to her after the fb left but didn't . From then on she was
cold
>to me. So I suspect because I didn't go for her number she was cold. Anyway,
is
>there a way to salvage this you think?
>
>I just know this one should have worked better, but I never really lead enough
>
>
This is NOT a sticking point. It's just a shitty situation. Advice:

Try again, and be a man, because now you have NOTHING to lose. Even
better if you can get her FB to look UP to you and ADMIRE you.

NOTE (not necessarily intended for you, DB): EVERYONE here, if they
are in the field, should KNOW their sticking point. If you don't know
your sticking point, then you are NOT in the field practicing this
stuff. A sticking point is where you currently get stalled out in your
PUs. In other words, some people can't open. Others can't transition
out of opener. Others can talk to anyone, but can't get a #close.
Others can get a #close, but not a *close. Others can get a *close,
but can't extract the HB from the club. Others can get a ONS, but not
a GF. Others can get a GF, but can't get her to go bi. Others can get
her to go bi, but can't get her to stick a carrot in her ass and
whinny like a donkey. Where are YOU stalling out?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 03:33:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP Any ritual to get into state?
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 18:41:00 -0400, DBCooper wrote:
>I know there used to be some "Rocky Bullwinkle" ritual for getting into state
>before approach. Anybody have any other excercises that may work?
>
Again, not a sticking point. Ask yourself: what do you need this
ritual for? What CAN'T you do normally that you THINK this ritual will
allow you to do? THAT is your SP, I'll bet.
NOTE (not necessarily intended for you, DB): EVERYONE here, if they
are in the field, should KNOW their sticking point. If you don't know
your sticking point, then you are NOT in the field practicing this
stuff. A sticking point is where you currently get stalled out in your
PUs. In other words, some people can't open. Others can't transition
out of opener. Others can talk to anyone, but can't get a #close.
Others can get a #close, but not a *close. Others can get a *close,
but can't extract the HB from the club. Others can get a ONS, but not
a GF. Others can get a GF, but can't get her to go bi. Others can get
her to go bi, but can't get her to stick a carrot in her ass and
whinny like a donkey. Where are YOU stalling out?

CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 06:40:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Reaching to the lay
NOTE: FREE SEX TALK PATTERN INCLUDED IN RESPONSE. ENJOY!
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 20:34:00 -0400, Tiks wrote:
>Ok I'll try to make sense of my problem based on an example:

>
>Last night I went to my Cream chick's place. I went there with the
>purpose to lay her. I got light kino and fluff and eventually hard kino
>and sex talk going, then kissing and tongue down but from the start she
>had the mindset to resist me.
Hmm. Why did she have THAT mindset? Must be...
>As she cleared afterwards she had decided not to have sex with me that
>night because she said the only purpose I came was to get the lay.
....yes, something you conveyed wrong.
>I pushed on and went 3 steps back and even played with my phone a while
>waiting her to melt up but noting. She had decided not to have sex and
>that was it 9
>
>She said I'll get the lay next time I come.
Good, next time you come, YOU hold out. Don't give HER the lay. Get
her REALLY turned on, then stop. Tell her next time you come, she'll
get to come. Don't do it as revenge. Just do it because you're not
ready yet. A lay is not something of hers to dispense, like a present
for good boys. It has to be something SHARED!
Do you know (and I'm giving away a great "routine" here) that it is
FEMALES, and not males, who are the only ones who have an organ in
their body made SOLELY for sexual pleasure. And that organ has twice
as many nerve endings as a man's entire penis. And that organ has more
nerve endings packed into a single small space than anywhere else on
the body. With all that being EVOLUTIONARILY true, wouldn't you think

that it would be FEMALES who are the sexual predators?
>NOW my problem is that I get into situations like this a lot. I get the
>girl onto a place where to lay her and get kino and kissing going so the
>next reasonable thing to do for both of us seems to have sex but then
>they start giving heavy resistance or lose the state completely.
>
>It's like they have decided not to have sex and I can't break them.
>
>Don't know maybe I give out some sort of a vibe that I'm only out for
>sex or maybe they think I'm playing with them or maybe they fear I'll
>leave them after a lay.
>
>Help me please.
Okay, two things you should be doing:

1. Read the response to Fatass's post for LMR busters. You NEED to be
using Riker's three rules, early on. Especially YOU. Email me if you
don't know them.
2. Early on in your sarges, you need to reaffirm these fears BEFORE
they come up. Your protests are USELESS afterwards. So, for yourself,
list the worries you think they have. And come up with a PREEMPTIVE
response for each one. If you think they're worried that you'll leave
them after the f-close, tell them that every passionate relationship
you've ever experienced all had ONE thing in common: that it started
passionately. And that your last gf, who you dated for two years, you
slept with on the second date, and that's been true of all your gfs.
Obviously, these girls WANT to sleep with you. You're better off than
a lot of others here. But they don't seem to TRUST you enough yet. So
tone down your lust --your gotta-get-some vibe--and play the GAME.
Post again if you need more detail.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 07:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Overcoming Girl's Sex Drive
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 22:51:00 -0400, justdoitalways wrote:

>
>My Sticking Point is overcoming a chick's natural sex drive. Specifically, her
>sex drive not matching mine.
>
>Basically, I'm an LTR kind of guy. I'm not really happy in casual
relationships
>and ONS's because I want that regular chick who I can have every day,
sometimes
>twice a day.
Good for you. A lot of people on this NG feel like they have to set
their goals by the newsgroup's. And the truth is a lot of people are
happy with a quality LTR, and don't need constant ONSs. So you are
already in my good books for knowing what YOU want out of this.
> I have two fuck buddies who don't really meet my standards for an
>LTR and I'm getting lots of quick sex pick-ups so I'm getting it regular
>enough. But I'm really looking for that high quality chick who meets all my
>standards for an LTR including a sex drive that matches mine.
>I've had more than 10 LTRs lasting more than 3 months and I've noticed that
>women's sex drives can vary widely. From the once-a-week kind of girls to
>whenever-I-want-it kind of girls. The problem is I've noticed no matter how
>good the sex is, the girl's sex drive just doesn't seem to change. My sexual
>techniques are not the problem, believe me.
>
>Does anyone have a tried and true method for increasing a girl's natural sex
>drive to the at least once-a-day variety.
Hmm. This is strange to me. I have never had an LTR who doesn't want
it AT LEAST once a day. I think the problem is somewhere within you.
It may be one of many things, but I hesitate to post the obvious
(taking care of her needs,making her come, or just generally EXPECTING
it but giving nothing in return), because you sound like a smart guy
who women like. Another option is that the girls are with you for
another reason (besides an emotional/physical connection): your job,
money, or something of that sort.
I'm not sure what the problem is here, because usually with any LTR I
have, the girl wants it every day. Especially for the first period of
the relationship, multiple times a day.
That said, there ARE ways to make a woman want and enjoy sex more in
your terms. They involve CONDITIONING, I guess is the best word. Some
of them could be seen as manipulative, however, and I'm loathe to

suggest them in a public forum because they could be misused.
First, give me a little more detail on the above questions and why
these women don't want sex daily.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: whether or not to 'wig' out...
On Tue, 06 Aug 2002 07:26:00 -0400, poet wrote:
>On 8/6/02 6:28:00 AM, Commander Zap wrote:

>>Instinctively I am sure that
>>shave-it-all-off is the right
>>advice.
>
>
>
>Even better - You shave it all except small strip on the back side of head,
>above the neck.
>
>You can do stripes as barre code, 2 or 3 horizontal stripes, or some sort of
>logo.
>
Can you explain this better, or link to a photo...
>
>And facial hair around mouth, mustache and goatee with vertical stripes,
lining
>them together. (I don't know how to describe it better)
This too. This one sounds interesting...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:22:00 GMT

subject: Re: SP: The Opening/Rapport
Hey Kassanova,
Thanks for coming out of lurker-dom. You actually posted this on the
wrong board, so see the Tactics/Techniques board for your answer...
CPowles
On Tue, 06 Aug 2002 10:12:00 -0400, Kassanova wrote:
>'lo all...been a reader for a couple weeks now, first post for me. 22 years
>old, and do most of my approaches in bars or just everyday life. Still
working
>on dance club approaches.
>
>Been experimenting with some of the ideas posted here, and it blew my mind as
>to how effective the stuff was in the field. Hell...even did a turn around on
>a girl that had LJBF'd me, and had HER friend DDB. I will try to post about
>that sometime.
>
>Anyways...my sticking point is the opening.
>
>Whenever I get introduced to an HB or a group, I'm fine. Hell...even if the
>intro is just in passing and the person who intro'd me takes off.
Conversation
>just starts to flow, I do my material, stories, etc... I seem to develop
>rapport quicker/better.
>
>So maybe I should rephrase that...say the sticking point is opening
>solo/developing rapport
>
>I doubt it is my looks, either...I'm well dressed when I go out and would say
>I'm between a 7.5 and an 8 in the looks department.
>
>I know its kind of hard to pinpoint without actually seeing me approach and
>talk, because for all I know it could be *how* I do the approach and talking,
>but any advice is appreciated.
>
>If you need any more info/details/specifics, let me know...didn't want to make
>the post an epic.
>
================================================================================

================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:25:00 GMT
subject: Re: is mystery still around
On Tue, 06 Aug 2002 03:53:00 -0400, LeftCoast wrote:
>That is definately not accurate. I think Mys setup a FAQ at

>www.mysterymethod.com on how to join the lounge
>
>Anyhow, here's a few ways to get in...
>
>1) Post a lot of useful stuff here and someone will notice and invite you
>2) Sarge with a few of the current members and if they like you...they'll
>bring your name up for everyone to vote on.
>3) Go to the workshop and show that you can positively contribute to the
>lounge. Doing the workshop is not a guarantee in and of itself.
>
>For those of you in college or have gone to college...it's a lot like a
>fraternity....
Yes, you have to swallow a goldfish and receive a bare-bottom paddling

from Leftcoast to get in. There are keg parties, too, after which many
of us wake up with a strange unidentifiable pain in our rectums.
Probably from just sitting on something funny while drunk, I guess.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:30:00 GMT
subject: Useful Question for Devilhimself
I've sarged with a lot of guys here, and there are THREE in particular
whose learning process I greatly admire:
OntheProwl
GetSomeUK
Devilhimself
These guys all have something in common. They are MACHINES. They
approach EVERYTHING THAT MOVES. They don't think--they just go in.
They can stale out a bar, or even a whole small town, in like two
hours because they've approached everything that moves. And, as soon
as they hear a new tactic or technique from someone, they test it out

IMMEDIATELY. And, because of this, they are ALL getting quite good at
this, doing amazing things. They've all gone from staling out or
getting rejected after an opener to getting *closes from hotties in
bars. Amazing stuff.
So, my question for Devilhimself: WHAT IS YOUR PROCESS?
When you see a group of women, what is it that you think that enables
you to go in so quickly without thinking. Why do you have NO FEAR? Is
it that you think of it as a video game and not real, or what?
And, when you go in, do you always have the SAME opener, do you figure
out which opener to use as you walk in, or do you just throw yourself
in and figure out something on the spot?
More on your thought process would be interesting.
And congrats. I hear you've been rocking at this lately. Really

impressive....
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:39:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: opening/closing
>>Out of curiousity, do you follow up with the elevator story?

>
>I don't. :) I usually follow with a real life story or go on to voodoo and
>spells.
Nice, honest responses. Thanks, man. Check the archives (or maybe
colorfulbull, or whatever his name is--can't remember right now has
this) for the ELEVATOR STORY. This is told after getting the opinion
on the black nails. It will make this a much more effective opener for
you:
"What's your first impression of these...no, not the big hands, the
black nails...now now, they're black, not pink...oh, that's funny,
because, get this I was in an elevator today, coming down from XXXX,
and there were these old ladies on it, and...." GET THE REST OF THIS
STORY, YOU'LL LOVE IT!
>>2. All openers, even canned ones, fall into a certain

>>class. There's the "opinion" opener, the "intuition"

>>opener, etc. Make up a new one every day.
>
>Will do. I tend to reuse and reuse openers which I had success with before.
>Yeah, my success rate is much better for it but it also means my openers are
>fairly limited/similar.
>
>Can you elaborate on the 'classes' of openers, please? All I've used so far
can
>only be loosely classified as 'opinion' or 'story' openers.
Opinion openers: non-sexual, getting an opinion on a story or

something you are wearing (black nails)
Intuition openers: "I have an intuition about you....yeah, you seem

like the kind of person who.....Now, I'm curious about something, do
you...."
Compliment opener (credit to RJ, and apologies for writing this wrong
because I usually use opinion openers): "I just had to stop and tell
you that you are the most amazing specimen of genetic
perfection....I'm glad you laughed, because it's clear that you're
attractive, ut a sense of humor is an inner quality that I look for in
someone I'll share my time with. My name is Danilo..."
Improvised Opener: comment on what they're doing/wearing/thinking at

the time or on the environment.....
Etc, etc..
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:44:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP- internet cafe
On Tue, 06 Aug 2002 06:22:00 -0400, poet wrote:
>>
>>I am trying to hold back my instinct to
>>flame you here, but WTF are

>>you doing sarging in an internet cafe?

>
>:-) Here internet cafes are full of expatriates HB. I like them more than
local
>BTW. We have cafe with hundreds computers here, so it's full of people.
>
>And when I'm here anyway, it happens that sometimes I start to speak
>immediately when I see her. So I continue as far as I can. :-)
And, fine, here's what you do:
Start something, stop at a cliffhanger (esp if it's an analysis about

HER, like cube or palm-reading), ANTICIPATE her reaction and say "you
know, I'm enjoying this conversation, but I have to finish reading my
email and get off this computer" as if it is SHE that is holding you
up. Then say, as if you just thought of it, "But if you want,
afterwards, I'm going to meet my friend TK, who I told you about, at a
cafe and I can continue this story/your cube/your hw-analysis. I can
call you in about 10 or 15 minutes and let you know where we are..."
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:51:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP:short-timer
On Tue, 06 Aug 2002 09:33:00 -0400, Cazador wrote:
>
> This isn't an immediate SP, but it's going to be within a few months, and I
>might start having problems with it sooner than I thought. Here it is: I'm
>entering my last year of school, and when I get out, I'm joining the military
>for some experience. Don't know where they're sending me, but the bases in
>this state suck ass, so I hope it's somewhere far away. Anyhow, I don't lie
>about my life plans (maybe I should start?) and before too long, girls I'm
>sarging are going to realize that anything they start with me is strictly
>short-term. One of my friends who just moved had that problem the last three
>months or so he was here. He;d be talking to some girl and as soon as it was
>out of his mouth he was moving 6 hours away, the target went cold on him.
> I don't think this is going to be a problem with girls in bars/at parties

>who are looking for a quick hookup. But as to girls I meet randomly on campus
>during the day, at the store, at the mall, etc, it seems that if they have
half
>a brain they'll realize what I'm throwing down on the table. "He's leaving in
>two months for another country, but he still wants to have coffee with me.
>He's hunting beaver!"
>Even sluts don't like the idea of being used...up goes the ASD.
> I guess the short form of the question is this: how do you deal with your
>targets characterizing you as a mere poon hound once they find out you're a
>short-timer in town? Maybe you're moving, maybe you're there on a business
>trip. Maybe THEY'RE there on a business trip. How would you propose managing
>such a situation? Thanks.
Oh, man, that's rough. A great PUA who taught me a lot went into the
military. And, yes, it was bad to tell HBs this for two reasons: 1.
You're leaving soon and 2. There is sometimes a stigma against the
military by some people, even if, for him, it was a very good career
move.
Also, when he went into training camp, he couldn't sarge the HBs
there, even though they liked him, until AFTER IT WAS OVER. And those
short weekend passes to go into a nearby town were pretty much useless
as far as sarging because the nearby HBs all knew what was up.
Yeah, dude, it's going to be rough. And good for you for not lying.
But, for now, try not telling. Just avoid it, or have some answers
that are clearly jokes prepared (like MTL PUA's line "disposable
lighter repairman" or MY OWN personal favorite "professional boy
toy").
There's a line that I tell the HBs I'm dating, which I learned from
David (from Cliff's list): "You can ask me anything. I will always
tell the truth, or I will choose not to answer the question. I will
never lie to you, and I expect the same from you."
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:52:00 GMT
subject: SP: The Opening/Rapport (Kasanova)
REPOSTED HERE FROM "FIELD REPORTS":
'lo all...been a reader for a couple weeks now, first post for me. 22
years

old, and do most of my approaches in bars or just everyday life.

Still working
on dance club approaches.
Been experimenting with some of the ideas posted here, and it blew my
mind as
to how effective the stuff was in the field. Hell...even did a turn
around on
a girl that had LJBF'd me, and had HER friend DDB. I will try to post
about
that sometime.
Anyways...my sticking point is the opening.
Whenever I get introduced to an HB or a group, I'm fine. Hell...even

if the
intro is just in passing and the person who intro'd me takes off.
Conversation
just starts to flow, I do my material, stories, etc... I seem to
develop
rapport quicker/better.
So maybe I should rephrase that...say the sticking point is opening

solo/developing rapport
I doubt it is my looks, either...I'm well dressed when I go out and

would say
I'm between a 7.5 and an 8 in the looks department.
I know its kind of hard to pinpoint without actually seeing me

approach and
talk, because for all I know it could be *how* I do the approach and
talking,
but any advice is appreciated.
If you need any more info/details/specifics, let me know...didn't want

to make
the post an epic.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 15:59:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: The Opening/Rapport (Kasanova)

>'lo all...been a reader for a couple weeks now, first post for me. 22
>years
>old, and do most of my approaches in bars or just everyday life.
>Still working
>on dance club approaches.
Yeah, unless you dance or there is a quiet area where the music isn't
so loud, dance club approaches are difficult.
>Anyways...my sticking point is the opening.

>
>Whenever I get introduced to an HB or a group, I'm fine. Hell...even
>if the
>intro is just in passing and the person who intro'd me takes off.
>Conversation
>just starts to flow, I do my material, stories, etc... I seem to
>develop
>rapport quicker/better.
>
>So maybe I should rephrase that...say the sticking point is opening
>solo/developing rapport
First, out of curiousity, HOW OFTEN are you opening. Are trying
openers a lot, or do you just do one or two a night and then give up
on it?
>I know its kind of hard to pinpoint without actually seeing me

>approach and
>talk, because for all I know it could be *how* I do the approach and
>talking,
>but any advice is appreciated.
>
>If you need any more info/details/specifics, let me know...didn't want
>to make
>the post an epic.
>
Yeah, I would love to help you here, but it is impossible to know

without more details. For me, I almost never get rejected on an
opener. I come in non-sexual and non-aggressive, I am interesting, I
draw them into my story, I draw myself into their world, and, most
important, I put a time-constraint on myself (artificial) so that they
don't think I will be there forever.
So, what is happening when you approach that is causing you to flame

out. At what POINT does it happen, and who is it that ejects--do you
politely leave, or do they shoot you down?
Also, what is your state: are you ultra self-conscious and

uncomfortable because you think it's WRONG, or are you very casual and
cool, like it's an everyday thing?
Let me know, and I can definitely let you know what to do here.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 17:19:00 GMT
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 16:17:00 -0400, Manifestis3 wrote:
>hey style,
>
>what do you think of these routines? please give feedback on how i can
improve
>it...i made up some of these routines and i wanted your feedback on it so i
can
>make it better...
>
>
>OPENER
>1. Hi…what’s the story behind that?
>2. Hey…you look exactly like this girl I was dating…everything she used to
talk
>about was her psychic powers. Do you believe in ESP? Let’s play a game.
They look okay for now. I notice people prefer three kinds of openers
in general:
1. Canned opinion openers
2. Spontaneous openers
3. RJ-style compliment/test openers
You seem to prefer what are pretty much spontaneous openers. Unless
you feel like you can use "girl I was dating" EVERY time, get ONE MORE
canned opener and you are good. I like the girl I was dating thing, AS
LONG AS you draw it out a LITTLE MORE than you have here.

>DEMONSTRATE VALUE
>1. That would be scary to have someone know what you’re thinking about. That
>would be a different scary from some other scary things. One time, I was
>hiking in the mountains with my friends and we came upon this pile of shit.
My
>friends started laughing hard saying that some idiot took a dump in the
>mountains. I didn’t even laugh. I pointed to it and said that shit was still
>warm and gigantic. I knew it wasn’t human shit. It was bear shit. So we got
>the hell out of there.
>2. Yesterday, I was snorkeling at the beach and I saw this shark following me.
>It was looking at me right in the eye and I tried to stay calm as possible but
>my heart was beating a million miles a minute. Luckily, the shark swam away
>and I was able to get out of there safely.
>3. I like doing adventurous stuff with people. Like with my ex-girlfriend, we
>used to go rock climbing together at Joshua Park. And one time while I was
>climbing one of the rocks, my rope snapped. I was freaking out but luckily I
>had a good hold of one of the boulders and my friend Jake came down and helped
>me get down.
Okay, even though Mys is my buddy, the bear shit in the wood story is
NO gold bullet. It's just something that happened to him. Find cool
things from your own life that your friends enjoy hearing. For the
shark story, I'll assume again that this is the short version.
Exaggerate it and draw it out. I will give you an example of how I
create a story below. Same for the rock climbing story. I like it:
shows a good side of you, and I'm assuming you draw this out for
greater suspense and comic effect too.
Now, these stories are good ways to get going, to talk. But if you are
sarging a girl who is hot or approached a lot (and doesn't feel lucky
to JUST have some guy talking to them), you need more. Yes, ESP will
work. The Cube will work. HW analysis will work. Palm Reading may
work. Yes, these are all gimmicky. But learn them, and eventually
you'll be able to LET THEM GO once you have more experience with SHBs.
>GAIN RAPPORT
>1. I feel like we’re similar in some ways. How would your friends describe
>you?
>2. I think it’s so interesting how we’re just two people on this planet earth
>looking for a sense of happiness and so much of that comes from spending time
>with other people and as strange as it may sound, I feel very comfortable just
>talking to you. Do you feel comfortable too?
Again, I like the idea of these. I'll assume they are the SHORT
versions. But what you need here are not just stories or lines, but

conversational threads--EV (see the old thread on this in the advanced

section), a lot of RJ's questions (challenges, attraction signals,
etc.), and RJ/NLP stuff like mirroring etc. Also, very important in my
game, is COMMONALITIES: finding out what she likes, showing that you
like it too, and then amping up that connection. They did a study that
says that pheremones are released by commonalities (and of course I
always tell the HBs this after we find our commonalities).
>CREATE AN EMOTIONAL CONNECTION

>1. I was reading this article about how women and men fall in love
>differently. Men first feel an attraction but women by contrast feel a
>connection first. I mean, have you ever experienced an instantaneous
>connection with someone? IC Pattern
>2. That type of connection doesn’t happen often but when it does, it’s like
>you want to cherish it forever. I remember, back in high school when it first
>happened and it was so new and exciting. So vulnerable and tender to
>experience a connection with another human being. So I’d be curious to know,
>what was it like for you to realize that you had a big crush on someone?
Good, perfect RJ stuff. Nicely transitions out of rapport and into

emotional connection. This stuff here is perfect.
>CREATE THE POSSIBILITY OF A PHYSICAL CONNECTION

>1. I learned this cool massage technique. Let me try it on you.
Yes, this is also known as phase shifting. The seduction in Don Juan
is a perfect example of this. You can also do the evolution lily-pad
thing I posted in an above SP. More sexual story-telling here is good,
esp if it is about a "friend." Often, you can even skip this step if
the stuff you did above for creating an emotional connection did the
trick. Do you know about IOIs and how to look for them?
>MAKE THAT PHYSICAL CONNECTION

>1. Kino (hands, arm, waist, hair)
Do you have a *close routine. If not, look up the Mystery *close and
the Style *close I posted above.
Now, you must make the MOST important step. Write out your ROUTINE (it
will change as you experience more in the field), put it in your back
pocket, and go out and sarge. Don't post anymore questions in this
thread UNTIL you've gone out and done it. NOW that you know your
structure, you'll know just where it is along the way that you get
stuck. Cool?
CPowles

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 17:45:00 GMT
subject: Storytelling (for Manifestis)
Hey, here's a quick example of how I turn something mundane into a

story for the field. Like I said, I have two types of stories:
1. Stories just to amuse the group on opener AND
2. Stories to get the HB into a desired state
THis is an example of an amusing story. A PUA on this board (I'll keep

his identity anonymous, since this gives away personal details) was in
a car crash recently. So, Nightlight 9 and I constructed this, trying
to just IMAGINE how it might have happened. Notice that we did a few
things to make the story worthwhile in a sarge:
1. We exaggerated for comic effect.
2. We left spaces where we interact with the HB
3. We made it seem like it JUST happened, and that's why we're telling
it.
4. We tell her something about herself that she may not know in the
story
ETC.
Also, note that is important HOW you tell the story. Lots of big
gestures, mime things, and as you tell it, make sure she is following
along and understands and is enjoying it. DRAW HER IN...
"We have to go soon and meet our friend Blane. We were in an accident
with him yesterday, and he's picking up the car. We were driving along
the coast, and they told us that like 95 percent of car crashes on
this road are fatal to all the passengers. I can't believe we survived
without a scratch. In fact, I can't believe we even let Blane drive.
You see, Blane was shot by snipers when he used to be in the army in
XXX. He walks with a limp now, and can only use one of his arms. You
may have seen him: He always wears a pink cowboy hat. Anyway, when
he's driving, he uses one hand. When he goes to flip on the turn
signal--no hands! It's a very scary experience.
And, do you know how most people can only hold seven pieces of
information in their conscious mind at one time. Yes, it's true:
that's why they made phone numbers seven digits. Anyway, Blane was

also shot in the head. The bullet went in one side, and they took it
out the other. So now he can only hold like THREE pieces of
information in his conscious mind at one time.
So he was driving along the coast. That's one thing in his mind. And
all of a sudden, Eminem comes on the radio, and he loves Eminem. So he
starts singing along. That's now TWO things. And we're on our way to
Vodice, so he starts looking around the seat for the address of the
place we're staying there. That's now THREE things.
And that's all fine, but all of a sudden there is a truck in front
blocking our path, so he decided to flip on the turn signal and go
around it. So now that's NO HANDS on the wheel and FOUR THINGS on his
mind. So since he can only hold three things, ONE THING has to go, so
he forgets to drive the car and goes right off the road into a bush.
Yeah, it was terrible.The car was literally teetering on the edge of a

cliff over the sea. I guess after his experiences in the war he
doesn't like bushes very much.
Anyway, we can only stay and talk for a couple more minutes. Yeah, we
need to go get Blane before he tries to drive his own car again."
Anyway, it's just a regular old story. Nothing special, and nothing
I'll probably use in my sarges for more than another week or two. But
that's generally the process through which I turn something mundane
into something fun and engaging. Hope this is helpful.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 07 Aug 2002 03:39:00 GMT
Hey, PB: Where are you based?
>OK, upon re-evaluation I do have some more stories/routines I use. Comments

>appreciated.
>
>I use:
> Strawberry Fields

Fun.
> Colors Game, should I tell her what my color that best describes my
>personality at this point to create a connection?
Don't know or use this, but generally I don't have HBs talk about me
other than to reaffirm how great and unique I am ("I will personally
introduce you to ANY guy in this club, and I dare you to find one as
fun as my friends and I."). Anything else may seem needy.
>My niece wont kiss me because I have a beard
>(it's trimmed real close, I have a good solid square jaw line, and tall and
>broad shouldered), which phase should I use this in, creating a physical
>connection, ie going for the toungedown?
Don't know this one. Not so sure: you don't want HER to have a fear of
kissing you and being rubbed raw and red by your beard either. Unless,
of course, this story transitions into how great a kisser you are and
makes HER want to kiss you.
I have a better story to make her think about kissing me, about how a
girl once made out with me in a club because she thought I was a
certain celeb. And I really amp up the way she looked into my eyes
with that DDB look and all she could thing about
was...that....first...brush of the...lips (I posted this in a field
report when it happened.)
>
>They call me psychobabble the humanitarian
>
>I use this when chicks comment on my smoking a cigar. I start talking about
>how I'm supporting poor cuban and dominican children in third world
>countries....I initially considered this just cocky funny, do you think this
is
>more of a routine, I've been getting good responses thus far
Just a cocky/funny joke to me. I'm sure some NLP guys could help you
out here. I once read a manners book that said that men with beard
should never smoke cigars because, well, it looks like sexual
penetration....wait...come in Houston, we may have a routine here...
>psychobabble the good boy/bad boy.

>
> A 10 approached me the other night. I did the above. She asked do you think
>I'm stupid? I negged her. She commented that the cigar I was smoking wasn't

>cuban. I told her this is my everyday cigar, they won't let ppl smoke fat
>stogies in places like this, this is my Clint Eastwood cigar, I'm such a goood
>boy... I smoke these to cover up the fact that I'm a good boy, smoking Clint
>Eastwood cigars so chicks won't think I'm wimpy
I'm assuming that cigars are a big part of your persona. Never thought
of them as a way to attract HBs. II like how you convey two sides:
good boy/bad boy. Anyway, you shouldn't have responded to the chick's
criteria anyway. Should have negged her on the fact that she wouldn't
appreciate a good cuban cigar if Castro gave it to her himself. Then,
if she responded by saying she actually smokes cigars, you can act
surprised and give her the Juggler girlfriend test or something
similar, and it's on.
To me, smoking cigars can transition into the idea of wanting to live
the good life, of not giving a fuck what other people think, and you
can use that to go into the natural woman pattern and tons more.
>(I was bumping and grinding on the dance floor all night with 2 chicks and in
>no way look like a good boy, in fact I was introduced to her that night by my
>wbafc friend "This is psychobabble, he's a stud"
Nice. Even though afc, you always want your friends to brag about you
for you. Somehow, it works: social proof.
She commented that "I've seen

>him around, but never met him" I pretended not to hear what was going on and
>moved on to talking to some other chicks.
>
>GF left me after falling in love with me, I didn't feel the same way so told
>her I wanted to be just friends, now I like to go out and meet lots of ppl and
>have fun
Okay, don't know about this one either. You want to find out her
values first. Not sure what this demonstrates, unless it's part of a
longer story. If they ask what my ex gf was like, I usually say
(credit to David D'), "She's not your type, you wouldn't be interested
in her."
>ESP numbers guessing game

>
>(haven't used the getting the chick to write down phone number and name, a la
>mystery yet though, but it's in my game plan.
No, don't do that. You NEVER want to TRICK anything out of an HB--not
a number, not a kiss. SO, if you GET the number this way, afterwards

GIVE IT BACK. Then say that you didn't want to get it by deceit, you
want her to WANT TO give it to you. That cocky move alone will make
her want to give it to you for the most part...
>My vacation in Miami with photos
Cool: make sure it includes photos of you with hot girls who seem to
like you and you doing something athletic and you doing something with
a child or pet. That's the photo routine....meant to flip all the
switches in just a minute...
>ONE'S I HAVEN'T USED YET:

>
>My pets (cute exotic animals with photo's)
Add this to photo routine.
>Cube
Learn it: it WORKS on many levels, and transitions into everything.

Better than strawberry field and whatever the colors game is.
>Handwriting, need to research it

>
>Palm reading, need to research it
Choose ONE and make it your specialty.
>Was on Martha's Vinyard during the making of jaws, met the Director, Stephen
>Speilberg, pics of me in directors chair next to the shark, sitting on the
>shark, on the beach in the film when the shark attacked in the cove...
Cool. Add this to photo routine. Just have one SUPER collection.
Small, but each photo telling a story.
>Time a woman emailed me with a song attached and told me she was going to send
>me pics of her kids....I was thinking it was some fat stalker chick in her
>40'sfrom the midwest.....emailed her back telling her I didn't have any time
>for more internet friends...was afraid of being stalked...turned out to be MY
>SISTER
AWESOME STORY! Love it!

Make it seem like this has happened before to YOU too with an actual
stalker.
>Guy in a program I was running met some chick off the net from Cali. she

showed
>up 3 days later (in boston) and he moved back with her 2 days later (she's in
>her 40's with 5 kids) This one seems weak to me though fiends have got a kick
>out of it
I'm sure it can be good if it's TOLD well. I'm sure you can find a way
to make it get the HB in the state/mood you want.
>Client who was hypersexual, coming on to female staff constantly ( I can do

>some wild moves he used to do) and how I taught him to be smooth with chicks
>through 2hr counseling twice weekly.
Again, I LOVE this one. Could be a lot of fun. Could start off kino.
Could even be your KEY routine. I'd love to see this typed out in
full, or in a field report. I'm sure you could find a way to even tell
this so that it transitions into a phase shift and kiss.
>Chick I had to fire b/c she was caught watching a client masturbate peeking
>into his room (I actually fucked this chick, didn't work with her hahhaah)
Can be good too, because it can go into natural woman and other
patterns about women just not being able to express their true
sexuality in our repressive society. But, on the other hand, when you
meet this right person (sp)... Awesome stuff man.
>Lifting weights/wrestling to get in better shape, chick I'm dating is trying

to
>convince me that fucking 3x/day is better way to go (true story)
Awesome, and of course you know all these stories are for after you
have rapport and are trying to get her into desired state.
>Chicks coming on to me at work/wanting to date, I like to meet ppl, and have

>fun...too young to settle down...now 2 of them are already married with
>children (is this weak or could you suggest modifications?)
Use it to transition into YOUR rules, that you don't date women from
work (especially patients, ha ha). Then say you're choosy about who
you spend your time with, that they must have certain attributes and
qualities that are impt to you. MAKE CHALLENGES HERE. When she asks
what, you can either go into Juggler Girlfriend test OR tell her that
she's passed three of your tests so far but failed one. She'll go
crazy trying to figure out what test it was.
>Mystery boobs shaking story (my bedroom game is tight, I'm thinking of using
>this in creating the possibility of a physical connections stage)

Right, for LMR. Cool. Share your bedroom game then, if it's tight.
Curious...
>Taking a chick out of a club. "Don't think your getting into my pants
>tonight...." I've used variations of this but just considered it being
>cocky/funny, maybe I could expand it?
Yes, it's the attitude conveyed in that line that's cool, not the line
itself. Any number of variations will work.
>Time I almost got caught having sex at work with a female co-worker, I former
>client I still see occasionally on the street refers to me as "Tom Jones" with
>a smirk on his face (like our private joke as he knew what was going on) (true
>story)
Make sure you're congruent if you say you don't date clients/coworkers
earlier.
>Chick I was dancing with last week. Stole her beer from her and started
moving
>into/ dancing with groups of other women while teasing this chick with her
>beer, holding it out of her reach as she followed me (true story)
Yes, do you know about cat string theory? WHen you go to PU, in your
mind, BE THAT BEER--always hovering away, teasing, just out of reach.
Make her chase you that way...
>Comments on the above appreciated. I guess I do have a loose game plan, just
>need to tighten it. I also don't like to go for #'s, I like to leave with the
>chick(s) from the club.
Agreed.
>Leaving with 6's and 7's is usually not a prob for me,
>but I want better. I have done it at least a few times over the past couple
>months since I broke up with my fb.
Yes, like I said in earlier posts, this game really works for 6s, 7s,
and 8s/9s who think they're 6s/7s.
>Should I:
>
>1. continue with this goal, shooting for leaving with 8's and above
>or try for #1 and go for kiss close if I can't do #1

>or just go for number close (damn I cringe at the thought of that)
Nice stuff, man. My thought:

Go AS FAR AS YOU CAN with every HB. But accept the fact that as you
tighten and expand your game for the 9s and 10s, you are going to have
to settle for #s at first. In reading your posts, I see you as a
likable, interesting, probably reasonably good-looking guy who women
like to be around. Having a gf or lay is no problem for you. Let's
STEP IT UP now. Because I also see you as a REGULAR guy. Yes, a
regular guy with game and really interesting stories and some unusual
experiences. But still, a REGULAR guy. Work on being an extraordinary
guy, a leader of men, someone who a 9/10 will look UP to. It will take
work, there will be setbacks, it will be difficult, but I think you
can do it.
And when you get that 10 ONS, I'll treat you both to breakfast the
next morning....
Alright, good stuff. Talk soon,

CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 07 Aug 2002 03:53:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Getting panties off sooner
On Mon, 05 Aug 2002 21:48:00 -0400, Commander Zap wrote:
>Well, thanks to all.

>
>Style, you're right that the no-sense-of-urgency is a help as well as a
>hindrance. I think that I'm sometimes mentally focusing on getting them DDB
>and to make-out land when the goal should be more the bedroom.
I don't get this, Zap. If they're making out with you, they're willing
to fuck you. As I read your posts, I see confused thinking on this
subject (usually you're very clear). There's something else going on
here... maybe your old afc self is stronger than you think.
>When they're DDB

>I tend to relax and enjoy it, rather than taking it to the next step right
>away. The chicks *do* want to fuck, but on a somewhat slower schedule (though

>usually not too bad). If it works out that way, I may need to say something
to
>avoid a stupid situation, like, "Why don't you come to my place tonight", not
>even offering dinner, and they definitely do, but I feel I have first
>procrastinated and then sort of put my foot down, not too smooth.
Yes, you've gotten to a CERTAIN point in your game. Now you must get
past this hurdle. Send me an empty email, and I will give you an
example of a great home seduction routine (the Aquarium Seduction).
It's not mine, otherwise I would post it here. You can look at it and
make one up for yourself that'll work.
>I think I need to have more of an F-plan in my mind some evenings. First we
do
>this, then we go see that, then we come to a place (still reasonably early)
>where we can be comfortable.
Yes, like the Aquarium Home Seduction Routine
>And I should try to stick to that plan if the
Yes, but also be flexible and willing to improvise. My last new lay (i
should post a fr, because it was done completely non-verbally) I had a
plan, and then just threw it out when the course of the night changed.
HAVE a plan, but be willing to discard it.
>vibes are right, since it seems so easy to get them DDB, and once they are,
>what am I waiting for? I think I need to make less of a big deal of coming to
>my place, we're just going to go check out some music and have a drink, the
>fact that it's at my place shouldn't be a big deal.
See above. Here's your confused thinking. You still feel like you are
TRICKING them, like they wouldn't want sex with you otherwise. Yes,
they want sex with you. But, you have to first take care of that
internal anti-slut defense voice they have. So you develop a pretext
that they can use to convince that anti-slut voice that it's okay.
Make a list of your PRETEXTS. Then seed them into the conversation
early, before she's DDB. That way, it seems only natural to go back to
your place to HEAR THAT CD or BORROW THAT BOOK or GET THAT TAROT
READING or PLAY WITH YOUR KITTENS or SMOKE THAT PCP or whatever you've
got going on.
>But as Maniac says, you've

>got to sex them up before they come in or they may freak,
I haven't read the new plan. In my mind, you don't have to necessarily

be sexing them up already. BUT, you have to KNOW that you're IN or can
be IN once you build the mood at your place. But, yes, of course it
helps to already have your tongue down their throat and her hand under
your shirt.
>so I'll need to play

>doctor a bit to build desire. And I actually do hesitate there, I feel funny
>about putting my hand in some woman's blouse, need to get over that to fuck em
>even faster.
I'm confused here, zap. You mean, you hesitate to be going that far IN
PUBLIC, right? That said, if you are going that far in public, you
probably can close on the spot--in bathroom or car--and don't need any
pretext except continuing this somewhere private.
Okay, my analysis: YOU still feel UNDESERVING of this (of sex, of

girls wanting YOU, Zap). Don't you? Here are two new rules to tell
yourself 100 times today:
1. Act as if what you WANT to happen is going to happen

2. What you get is what you think you deserve.
What are your thoughts on all this>
Did I mention that I really enjoy your posts and your progress?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 07 Aug 2002 05:19:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: living with other PUA.
On Wed, 07 Aug 2002 10:45:00 -0400, Hedge Killa wrote:
>In about 3 wks I will be moving in with a natural PUA.His main game is his
>looks and his car as a gimmick. He can also be considerably more alpha than me
>and my other roommates. It's like in the back of my head that any chick I
bring
>home he can take off of me just by looks alone. He has some AFC tendencies as
>well but it doesn't seem to matter,He always has HOT chicks approaching him.
>I'm fucking jealous and pissed. What should I do? I'm planning
>for a large harem of girls this year in college but how to protect my

>investments from this lady-killer?
Again, this isn't a sticking point. It's a pain and an inconvenience.

Ask yourself instead: WHAT is it that you are LACKING in YOUR game
that makes this guy a threat to you?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 07 Aug 2002 05:24:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: The Opening/Rapport (Kasanova)
Hey Alessandro,
The post that head this section isn't from me. It's from a guy named
Kasanova. I just reposted it for him because it was in the wrong
section. That said, LOOK at the response again. The time-constraint
thing is KEY. It puts a lot of chick fears to rest. When you sit down
at an HB's table, you say, "I can only stay for two minutes. I have to
rejoin my friends over there." This way, she doesn't get worried when
you sit and think you'll be there forever, because that'll distract
from your game. Then, when you prove how fucking cool you are, she
will now be worried that you WILL leave and it's her job to be
interesting enough to keep you there.
Even when I'm going to a chick's house, I sometimes still say (just
like a chick would to a guy sometimes), "I can only stay until 2:30. I
have a lot of work to do tomorrow. So let me know when it's 2:30,
because I definitely have to leave then." It does the same thing:
neutralizes her anti-slut defense (he's coming over just to sleep with
me), makes her have to EARN extra time, and, best of all, allows you
to leave after the lay if you so desire.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 07 Aug 2002 05:29:00 GMT
On Wed, 07 Aug 2002 01:46:00 -0400, psychobabble wrote:

>Hey Styles, thanks for the critique.

>
>So, I saved and printed my previous post out (including your structured PU and
>stages). I also saved some of the other SP posts and jotted down a few notes
>for myself.
>
>I reviewed them a few times and went out alone tonight.
>
>I go to this bar. It's a bit early and I'm sipping a cranberry juice. Some
>chicks start to roll in. I'm checking them out but break the 3sec rule #'s of
>times.
>
>I then go outside to light up a cigar. I also have to make a phone call.
>There's this HB8 with a smokin body out there. She asks me "who you callin',
>your wife?" I say no as I dial. She sais "your girlfriend?"
Major, major, major IOIs!!!
>
>She introduces herself to me. We chat. She asks if I'm going to dance with
>her. I say "well, I'm gonna leave early so you gotta catch me soon" as she is
>heading inside.
I like this attitude, but she is already SO into you, you could have
just *closed her on the spot.
>I then grab HB8smokin body and say "lets dance"

>
>We're on the floor and she's lookin all sexy at me, we are moving good
together
>on the floor. I'm teasing her as she's trying to rub up against my cock by
>bumping my knees and thighs against her legs and inner thighs. she sais "your
>pretty good for a white boy, were the best one's out here" We dance a few
>songs and she's tired and needs to take a break. I put my arm around her (had
>other good kino going on the dance floor) and say, "when are we going to do
>this again, I gotta leave now"
Why didn't you just take her home. Great story, btw, but you waited
too long and staled her out, IMHO.
>We grab a drink. She's sitting down and I'm standing next to her kinoing her.
>She stands and I say "you don't want to sit anymore?" She doesn't answer so I
>sit down and slap my thigh indicating she should sit there. She hops up on my
>thigh, stratteling it. I'm kinoing her and start to tell her some adventurous
>stories of some chicks I was with over the past couple weeks (taking a couple

>chicks into the woods looking for a swimming spot, taking a chick to the beach
>(actually 2 different chicks over the past week). She starts to get wet and I
>can feel her wetness on my thigh.
Nice, but you should have been making her wet by playing tonsil hockey
by now!
>She jumps off. I suggest we dance again. She asks for a piece of gum so I
>stick half of the gum I'm chewing out of my mouth and she bites it off.
See...
> I say
>"hey you took too much, I want some back." she doesn't go for it.
That's because you tried to TRICK her. Be a MAN and fucking go for it.
(Of course, it's easy to say this to a 6'2" guy online, LOL.)
Do you know any of the foolproof *closes (foolproof meaning that there
is no REJECTION involved if she doesn't go for it).
>I give her a ride home. She kisses me good bye, and sais "so your gonna call
>me right?" I say "If you give me another kiss I will" She does.
A trick again. Oh, psychobabble, she WANTED you... nice though,

because she IS yours now...if you want...but you could have had that
smoking body pressed up against you THAT night. But you know that,
right?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 07 Aug 2002 05:31:00 GMT
LMR is last minute resistance.
And what you do naturally is exactly what you're supposed to do: Take
it away and don't really care...
I love these bedroom-game stories. THAT is being a PUA.

Being a PUA is not necessarily shagging her the first night. It's
keeping the control, like you did, having her dreaming about you every
night and knocking your door down begging for it. It's exercising
self-control, putting the WOMAN in the GUY's frame like that. Nice,
man. I have an MLTR moving to Boston for school, so hopefully we'll
meet some day...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 07 Aug 2002 19:33:00 GMT
subject: Re: Useful Question for Devilhimself
On Wed, 07 Aug 2002 12:45:00 -0400, Devilhimself wrote:
>I've found it crucial to try something new as often as possible because:

>1. New techniques can improve your game dramatically (GM style has just caused
>my games to improve by leaps and bounds, and it is quite lethal especially
when
>bitch sheilds need to be lowered.)
>2. New techniques force you to push your boundaries and harden your balls.
I'd be curious to see how YOU use GM style, Devilhimself. I assume

that it doesn't come natural for you. Care to elaborate a little?
I also really respect how you've made your own routines, openers, and
stories that work for YOU.
>Here is what I have done at a conscious level:

>1. I constantly repeat good memories from sarging adventures, I replay images
>and voices from good sarges in my head so many times every single day. This
>helps to make sarging something I look forward to.
>I have anchored very positive and pleasurable feelings with sarging (though I
>have crash and burned over a thousand times now, I choose to simply not focus
>on them)hence sarging is in itself a joy for me.
>2. I make it a point to approach people even in my regular life (old people,
>tourists, bums, whatever.) So building rapport with complete strangers is a
>part of my daily life...now some of these complete strangers happen to be HBs
>:-)
>3. Because I have done so many approaches, its something that is becoming
>second nature to me. When I see an HB I ask myself WHAT approach to use, not
>IF I should approach (unless of course the situation is dangerous or

something)
>Over the last few months I have changed my belief system dramatically (at the
>very least, at the conscious level)
>I hold these key beliefs in regard to approaching
>1. There is ZERO cost to an approach. A no-go or a crash and burn only has a
>cost associated with it, if you choose to give it a cost. Rude words from an
>HB or some laughing AFCs or anyone only matter if you let them. Approaching
is
>free in terms of both monetary and emotional cost; so why not do it? Since
>there are hundreds of millions of eligible attractive women, you can keep on
>trying and practicing.
>2. With every approach I get better. Regardless of how a particular approach
>turns out, I learn something from it. At the very least I practice my skills.
>3. I view every approach as simply practice. Hence NO pressure.
>4. I treat every sarge attempt independently. If one sarge attempt didn't
>work, I simply learn from it and go on to the next one; I try my best not to
>let any particular sarge attempt affect my state in a negative way.
>A simple metaphor, I use is in regards to basketball. Just practice as much
as
>you can, learn from other players, constantly improve your game and don't give
>a damn if one particular basket goes in or not.
The above SEVEN points should be printed out by every newbie and
nailed on to their refrigerator. Nice! You've answered 1000 newbie
questions and soothed 1000 newbie fears with this post.
>
>Thanks, I am loving every moment of this adventure.
Again, good attitude. Looking forward to seeing you sarge sometime

soon. Send me an email with your email address if you can...
CPowles
CPowles100@hotmail.com
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Aug 2002 01:05:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Opening/Rapport (Kasanova)
On Wed, 07 Aug 2002 00:01:00 -0400, PiQL wrote:

lems opening on anyone. If any HB is in my path when im doing this, I

>do very well.
>
>If im 'acting' curious, or trying very hard to find something with which to
>comment - it comes off fake and I ask some stupid, blatantly transparent
>question.
>
>Also, I cannot rely on HBs being in my path during this - its too
>chance-oriented. When I see a HB or group that I want to approach w/o any
>situation, im not legitimately curious about something around me, or I have
>to 'hunt' them for a block - I either C&B or dont even approach because I'm
>speechless (which leads to anxiety, blehh).
Cool, man. Good comments. Good self-analysis. And an easy answer. HAVE
a canned opener on reserve. Something to use when you're not curious
etc. Just an easy story that you need an opinion on, like the Rikki
Lake opener. This way, when you see that girl, you can just walk in
without thinking and you don't have to FORCE yourself to look for
something you're curious about.
NOTE: For you and others, if you don't like the Rikki Lake opener--and
I'm getting a bit tired of it myself already--just LISTEN to talk
shows (Leykis was mentioned) and SEE what issue/discussion is
super-interesting and gets a big response. THEN make that YOUR story
about a friend of yours, and, bam, insta-new opener. Just share it
with everyone here after it's field tested...
But, otherwise, good for you, it's a good skill to have to be able to
manufacture genuine curiousity and use it to open sets. Now, just have
a favorite canned opener on reserve as backup, and you're set.
On to the NEXT sticking point...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Aug 2002 01:11:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Approaching women at casual places
On Wed, 07 Aug 2002 00:16:00 -0400, ColorfulBull wrote:
>Hi Style. Thanks for your offer. I have a SP where there is a serious problem
>in my game.
>

>I know how to approach chicks in a bar, club or caffee, I can for example open
>with the Elvis script. However, I'm having problem with short-time pickups.
>
>See, when you meet a woman on the street, in a big shopping center, or in the
>underground. I have 2 problems exactly: opening and attracting. I can't use
the
>Elvis script or the ESP opener because it would be lame in such a casual
>environment. The other problem is that at these places, your time is very
>limited. And you can't begin a story when the woman is in a hurry. What do you
>think?
I generally don't do street PUs. I like the environments you work in

(clubs, bars, cafes). That said, you DO realize that this SP is all in
YOUR head--it isn't REALLY objectively true. That said, you do a few
things:
1. Pace: Show that you are aware they're trying to get somewhere. Best
done if you STEAL their frame and say that you are also trying to get
somewhere. Do this with your words, and with your body language, until
you attract them enough.
2. Be energetic, confident, curious. Genuine curiosity is a good

opener in these situations.
3. Trust the material (as I know you do): It works. It works

everywhere. I'm in LA, I use the SAME material on celebs, and it still
works. It works everywhere. Just be aware of the surroundings and
incorporate them into the game.
4. Fine, if they REALLY have to be somewhere, then #close on a

cliffhanger and continue later. Do the attract at the first meeting.
5. There ARE specific street openers that WILL work, even on HBs going
in the opposite direction. It's all about YOUR delivery. All those
things you mention (elvis, esp), they DO work in a casual environment
if you EXPECT them to work. Maybe you just have to come in initially
more casual, under the radar. Pace, and then lead.
Don't have much time right now, but I hope this helps a little. Let me
know if you need more, or openers for specific situations. There are a
few that I love...
CPowles
================================================================================

================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Aug 2002 01:45:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Getting them into desired state
NOTE: FREE STORY AT END OF POST!!!!
On Wed, 07 Aug 2002 13:04:00 -0400, ColorfulBull wrote:
>OK. Thanks to these posts about storytelling and stuff, I now know how to
raise
>the curiousity of chicks with stories like the bear shit.
>
>But what kind of stories should I tell to get them into the desired state?
>Style, if you could post a story on getting them into the desired state just
>like you did with the car accident one, it would be really nice.
>
>Thanks.
Okay, ColorfulBull. I've been thinking about you. And here are my
thoughts:
You have a hunger for knowledge, and you are putting in the work. I
like that. There is, however, something I am worried about. I think
that YOU feel that you need to put all the material together in your
head before you go out and do this. You need to know all the good
routines and stories, all the moves to make at the right time, etc
etc. But, trust me here, I've met a lot of people from this board. And
a lot of them are GREAT SEDUCTIONISTS IN THEIR OWN HEADS. However,
they can't do shit in the real world. They just KNOW what to do, but
they don't JUST DO. See what I'm getting at?
So, if you really want to learn, learn ONE PIECE AT A TIME. Tell
yourself that today you will go out and test an opener. Do it dozens
of times until you have it down. The next day, tell yourself that
you'll learn a game or a pattern or a story. Then, go out and use your
opener and add the game/gimmick/story. As you do these things, you'll
find that YOUR OWN NATURAL GAME will come out. You'll find your own
routines, your own stories, your own quirks that make you attractive.
And soon you'll develop YOUR OWN GAME, and you won't need any one
else's routines or stories.
Now, on to your question. There are four kinds of stories that I tell
to get them into desired state...

1. Stories that encourage and bring out the attributes that I want
them to have. In other words, stories about living in the moment,
about living for your bliss, about not being controleld by others
expectations, about doing things for the now, about how we are only
alive for such a short time and any time you are thinking about the
future or the past, you are wasting the present.
2. Also, stories about something that I was doing, told very

passionately. Listen, if you are a computer programmer, you CAN talk
about CODE and get laid. You just MUST speak about it with excitement
and passion and enthusiasm and confidence. Try it: talk about
repairing a doorknob, and just hold court. Just talk and talk and
talk, with total energy, excitement, seriousness, and passion, and
KNOW that she is listening and enjoying it. You'll see her just trance
out and go DDB, because she'll just start watching your lips move and
think about wanting to kiss you.
3. Sexual stories, about something I did or a friend did. Like the

time I was with a gf in Paris, and we went to a sex show for fun. And
the two people on stage were just so boring and not into it. We were
thinking how WE were so much sexier. So we had an idea. My gf asked
the manager if it was okay if WE went up on stage. We gave someone our
camera, and went up on stage, and totally gave this live sex show in
front of all these people. I still can't believe we did it, but I have
the photos. I like being with people like that, where together you
bring out each other's adventurous side and even surprise yourself
with what you're capable of. (This is the short version of the story,
but as I tell it, I make sure she can really imagine it, and I leave
the RIGHT parts vague so that she can fill it in with her own
imagination and experience.)
4. These are my favorites lately: metaphorical stories that make a

point at the end. Mystery's Ant Farm story is like that. Usually,
there will be a specific reason why I tell one of these, at a specific
time. Like this one, from Milan Kundera:
"One day, a man and a woman meet -- two melancholy, lonely people.
They like one another and secretly hope to join their lives together.
All they need is the chance to be alone for a moment and say so.
Finally one day they find themselves unobserved in a wood where they
have come to gather mushrooms. Ill at ease, they are silent, knowing
that the moment is upon them and they must not let it slip by. The
silence has already lasted rather a long while when the woman
suddenly, "involuntarily, reflexively," starts to talk about
mushrooms. Then silence again, and the man casts about for a way to

declare himself, but instead of speaking of love, "on some unexpected

impulse" he too talks about mushrooms. On the way home they go on
discussing mushrooms, powerless and desperate, for never, they know
it, never will they speak of love.
Back at the house, the man tells himself that he did not declare his
love because of the memory of his dead mistress, which he cannot
betray. But we know perfectly well: It is a false excuse he invokes
only to console himself. Console himself? Yes. Because we can resign
ourselves to losing a love for a reason. We would never forgive
ourselves for losing it for no reason at all."
Does this help?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Aug 2002 01:51:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Can't get her to stick a carrot in her ass...
On Wed, 07 Aug 2002 17:25:00 -0400, ozwald1 wrote:
>I can't believe you mentioned my SP! I just can't get a chick to stick a
carrot
>in her ass and whinny like a donkey. I have no problem, opening,
transitioning,
>connecting, #close, *close, fclose, or getting them to go bi, its this final
>step that's so integral to becoming a PUA that i just can't get past. style,
>any suggestions?
I did literally laugh out loud reading this. My advice: rent a Winnie
the Pooh video, and bring her to orgasm every time Eeyore comes on the
screen. This way, you will condition her to associate her sexual
pleasure with the image and sound of a donkey.
Eeyore is a donkey, right?
>thought i'd lighten the mood, thanks for all the hard work this week, you've
>been really patient even though half the posts aren't really SPs. To be honest
>my SP is keeping my confidence. If i'm feeling really good about myself then i
>have no problems, but if i don't think i look my best(like if i'm just out in
>public and happen to see someone i want to PU) or i've gotten turned down a

few
>times that night, is when i begin to have trouble. usually bringing a wing
>solves the last problem, but not always. other then that, i feel i'm doing
>pretty well. thanks again.
Yeah, I know what you mean. There is a rule that is generally true,
for me and most others:
YOU ARE ONLY AS GOOD AS YOUR LAST SARGE
That's why you have to keep pushing yourself to get a good one before
you go home, put yourself in a good mood and have the confidence. QUIT
ON A HIGH!
I also know what you mean about only wanting to sarge when you look
your best. But if you push yourself and approach, as soon as she
starts responding positively to you, you'll forget all about it.
Because it's only in YOUR mind.
A book that might help: Mastering Your Hidden Self: A Guide to the
Huna Way by Serge Kahili King. At the very least, you'll find some
good material for patterns in here.
He's the one who says that mastery = ability plus confidence plus
energy. Also, "You get what you concentrate on."
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 08 Aug 2002 02:11:00 GMT
subject: Ending SP Threads Now
I'm going to stop answering SP questions in about an hour. It's been a

lot of fun though. I'm taking off to visit a favorite MLTR for a
couple days. After that, I'm going back in the field to improve myself
and work on my own sticking points. I'm still far from where I want to
be.
Has this been helpful? Has the information been specific enough? It's
hard to tell for me. So much of this has become SO internalized, that
often when I look at what I wrote, it seems so OBVIOUS, like truisms.
So I hope this has been useful to some. If it has, let me know here,

and I'll come back and do this every now and then. It will be fun to
see how people have gotten past their OLD sticking point and reached a
new one (like that whole carrot in the ass dilemma).
As for me, I'm still far from where I want to be. Most of the
PUAs--the greats--are still not happy a lot. They're often lonely and
unfulfilled. And this is because PU'ing is still NOT natural to them:
it's something they do. It's not who they are. It's still putting on a
game face and getting to work. And every time that girl leaves their
house, there they are, right back at square one again. I want to make
this natural for me. I want it to be part of who I am. That is what
I'm working on for myself now. The better I get, the more loathe I am
sometimes to go out and do it, because it is a long journey from
opener to bedroom and I have to be in the mood. I want that MOOD to be
what I am.
So, before I leave:
HERE ARE SOME NOTES I'VE MADE FOR MYSELF AFTER THE PAST FEW
MONTHS--SELF-CRITICISMS AND POINTS TO WORK ON. THEY MAY BE HELPFUL FOR
OTHERS. (You'll see that some SPs that I've gotten past are similar to
those above):
Select a definite target, and stick to that decision. Don't just keep
bouncing around between HBs indecisively because they seem easier or
more into me.
Find a way to be incongruent: in other words, show an OPPOSITE side of

myself to create depth.
When I get insecure, respond by slowing down (instead of speeding up)
Put out more sexual energy. Don’t hold it back. Intensify it! Slow
down speech and movements to phase shift.
Understand that a woman WANTS sex
Set the frame clearly in the first five minutes, with strong SOI.
Know that a woman does not want freedom of choice; don’t give her that
power, especially after getting the IOIs.
KINO, KINO, KINO. AND KINO WITH AUTHORITY
Work fast: do not give her a lot of time to think or find another BF

Work more on push-pull and challenges
When you start to get physical attention, don’t give in: still play
hard to get.
Know that women want to be dominated. Do it. Suck her into your world
and your reality, and make it be natural for her to be there--so long
as she follows your rules.
More intense eye contact and, when ready, glances at her lips etc.
Do not be surprised or falter when you realize that the game has
worked, that an HB 10 wants YOU!
Trust the game and routine to work, in all situations
Calibrate your game to the target more
Do not feel obligated to USE game when it's not necessary
Be congruent with whatever I say, and to only say what I'm congruent
with. This also means being congruent with my incongruencies.
Do not go quiet when thinking of the next piece of a routine. But, at

the same time, do not be afraid to let things go quiet to build up
tension.
Let your mantra be: I Deserve the Best of Everything
Over and Out,

CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 12 Aug 2002 21:39:16 GMT
subject: Re: Ray goes wacko again.
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subject: Re: Ray goes wacko again.
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Subject: Re: DOn't no what to do
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 14 Aug 2002 04:48:00 GMT
subject: Re: showing anger to women?
On Tue, 13 Aug 2002 21:49:00 -0400, Deepmann wrote:

>

>Now I dont give a shit about the girl so that doesnt matter but I was
wondering
>like with other chicks your meeting, is it better to show your displeasure
>without getting angry/cursing/etc or is it better to just let it loose and rip
>into her when she does something to deserve it? Is it just a lose-lose
>situation if you get angry at a woman because it shows that your loosing your
>cool and letting her get under your skin? Or is it a healthy thing that shows
>your in control?
>
Human ingenuity, my friend, has hitherto only discovered two ways in

which a man can manage a woman. One way is to knock her down--a method
largely adopted by the brutal lower orders of the people, but utterly
abhorrent to the refined and educated classes above them. The other
way (much longer, much more difficult, but in the end not less
certain) is never to accept provocation at a woman's hands. It holds
with animals, it holds with children, and it holds with women, who are
nothing but children grown up. Quiet resolution is the one quality the
animals, the children, and the women all fail in. If they can once
shake this superior quality in their master, they get the better of
him. If they can never succeed in disturbing it, he gets the better of
them.
--Count Fosco, 1860
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 14 Aug 2002 17:00:00 GMT
subject: Question for Treswww
Catching up on old posts. Read one of yours and had questions. Don't
know if they were answered in the old thread:
1. I LOVE the stars pattern. Could you write it out in full? It sounds
like a classic, and I think it would segue nicely into another stars
routine I heard. I'll post it too after yours!
2. Okay, I give up. How do you escape from the sharks? Something to do
with switching around the letters?
3. Okay, I give up on the shovel and the dirty thing too.

I may not use these in my sarges, but they are fun. Here are some
more:
http://sanantonio.us.mensa.org/puzzle.shtml
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 15 Aug 2002 06:01:00 GMT
Just read the rest of the messages in this thread. Ignore the previous
advice. Seems like she might not have really cared what your job was.
And, instead, you proved yourself to be a psycho.
Done the same thing myself before...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 15 Aug 2002 11:27:00 GMT
subject: AST: Photos
Hey David,
Did you ever make it to LA?
Anyway, first an observation. Then a question. An on-and-off

older-woman ex-stripper FB of mine just left. And it was funny,
because we went out tonight, then she drove me back to my place. I
knew she wanted to come up, so I just asked. She said she had to work
early in the morning. I just said, "Aw, come on" (not very pua, I
know), and she goes, "Well, I do have to go to the bathroom." I found
it interesting that she still needed an EXCUSE to come up, and had to
MANUFACTURE one herself.
Anyway, a question I was thinking of tonight (because she has a

marvelous body). I sadly do not have your manual (I MUST order it),
and I think this topic is covered. But anyway:
Taking nude, partially nude, and sexual photographs: With a MLTR, this

can come up naturally. But during a ONS or with a new FB, how do you
broach this subject and accomplish this?
Thanks, David. Hope to see you soon. Always enjoy talking with you!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 15 Aug 2002 17:13:00 GMT
subject: Juggler's advice on matching her bf situation
This was posted in the review (excellent, btw, and well written) of
Juggler's workshop. I've been thinking about it. Not sure how I feel
about it. What's the consensus here. Agree or disagree? Thoughts?
"Try to match her relationship situation, so that if she has a bf,

then you have a gf; if she's single, then you've just broken up with
your gf [despite how great the sex was]; if she's in a long-distance
relationship, then you are too). "
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 15 Aug 2002 17:27:00 GMT
On Wed, 14 Aug 2002 01:26:00 -0400, DBCooper wrote:
>Styles,
>
>I have been sarging much more lately. I have gotten numbers from all the
women
>except one (I over sarged her and got myself eliminated when game was not
>necessary). The last one was the most gorgeous I have ever seen.
>Surprisingly, when I mentioned off hand that she was pretty, she actually
>blushed and was taken a back, so she may have some self esteem issues.
Shouldn't make appearances compliments to gorgeous women anyway.

Besides, the way they are wired is (and I always tell them this if
they won't accept a compliment later): 1000 people can say something

complimentary about them, and one person can insult them. They'll not
believe the 1000 compliments, and stress out about the one insult.
(Thus, that's why negs work.)
>Anyway, I called her (she wasnt't to bright, she never heard of john
malkovich)
>and tried to tell her some stories like Juggler had reccommended but it did't
>phase her too much. I was talking and then she asked me what I do "I said it
>isn't what I do but what I enjoy doing" but she insisted (not trying to be
>evasive) and I told her.Then I asked her what she did and she told me. At
that
>point, the phone muffled and I got disconnected. I called back, left my name
>and number.
>
> Now I am angry at myself because I realized she basically
>hung up on me. I thought of leaving another message along the rick h "I
>shouldn't suffer do to your ignorance" and tell her off, or wait a few weeks,
>use *67 and try to hook her again,. In the meantime, I will be talking up
>other women of course.....
Now, are you SURE she really hung up on you and won't return your call
because of what you do. If so, I'd eject. But here's a cool way to do
it. FIND OUT the COOLEST, TRENDIEST, MOST PRESTIGIOUS thing going on
in town (make it up if you have to). Call back and leave a message:
tell her you are going there because you need to put in an appearance
for work; then let it drop that you tend not to tell people what you
do, or to make up something mundane, because you're tired of being
used for what you do. When she calls back, be evasive about it if she
asks ("you're not one of those, are you?"). Tell her to dress well
when you pick her up, because you don't want to be embarrassed and,
you're sure, neither does she. Especially if there are papparazi
there. Then pick her up (it would be hilarious to rent a limo or
chauffered car), and tell her you need to do a few things first. Then
take her with you to do ALL your errands: to Rite Aid, to the grocery
store, to pick up something from a friend. Then drop her off at home.
If she asks why the hell you aren't taking her to "THE COOL
PARTY/PREMIERE," tell her you're going alone. She has to earn the
privilege to go with you, and so far she's demonstrated nothing but
being as shallow as the people you've made an effort to cut out of
your life. But you see something more in her, some potential to be
someone special to you, and THAT is the HB you want to see next time
you call/see her.
Then post a field report, LOL
================================================================================


================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 16 Aug 2002 02:03:00 GMT
subject: Re: FR: *closed a 10 ! (long but good infos)
Nice FR, dude. I MUST learn your dancefloor skills.
Anyway, I may be getting to this too late. But, to follow up, you must
ACT FAST. See her SOON. (Should have done it the next day.) She IS a
player. She KNEW what she wanted the whole time. She just threw up a
bunch of roadblocks and tests, which you passed thanks to your ASF
skills. So, what you SHOULD DO (or hopefully have done already) is
seen her again RIGHT AWAY. And when you see her again, you must just
PRESUME and ACT AS IF she IS your girlfriend. IOW, as soon as you see
her, put your arm around her, hold her hand, whatever. I may get
flamed for this, but I only discovered this when an HB recently did it
for me: But, you can even GIVE her a little something (in a
non-supplicating way--I'll post a LR that this got for me recently).
BUT, at the same time, with this girl, you must be prepared to PUNISH.
This means: to TAKE AWAY your attention whenever she misbehaves or
won't do something. To just go cold and turn away. Trust me, she will
ALWAYS work to get your attention back. Do it two or three times, and
she'll let you put your hand down her ass. (Check out also the post to
Fatass in techniques on SP--sticking points--for LMR techniques, which
you'll definitely need with this girl.)
You must, here, strike while the iron is hot, otherwise you're going
to have to work this all over again from scratch.
Post an update!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 16 Aug 2002 02:44:00 GMT
subject: Training Pivots
I've been thinking lately. Sure, it's fun sarging with a group of ten
ASF'ers. But why not UP the game a little. And instead train a woman
to be my PIVOT. After all, when you are WITH an HB, there is ZERO

resistance to opening sets and LOTS of social proof. Plus, she can
talk you up to other women. I don't know why I wasn't doing this
before. Or why anybody else here isn't with their female friends.
So, on Friday night, I am going to a party with LOTS of super-fine

HBs. There will be tons of 9s and 10s. I am taking a girl I sarged in
Vegas who is gorgeous in a cheesy way: big fake breasts wanna-be
actress. A 9+.. She's just not too bright and lots of drama, so I told
her today that we would be each other's pivots. Then I explained that
all of my gfs were in other cities, and I needed an la gf. So she'd
help me find an LA gf, and I'd help her find a BF. We agreed.. Now, I
need to TRAIN her. What do I do? What do I tell her? What are good
NON-LYING (but also NON-SEXUAL) openers to use in these cases? What
other ASF techniques can she use to help me here?
I mean, yes, I can just go sarge normally with her. However, this is
an art. There are RULES for winging, and ways you can use your wing to
get yourself laid.. And I'm sure there is a VERY efficient way to work
with a pivot. Ways SHE can open sets for me (and me for her).
Need ideas fast.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 16 Aug 2002 10:29:00 GMT
subject: Re: Training Pivots
On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 01:00:00 -0400, spirit wrote:
>I kinda thought this was pretty normal stuff to do whoever you`re with! lol
>
>When you go sarging with ASFers don`t you get them to talk you up to other
>women?! ...and vice versa?
>Thats one of the ground `rules` when hanging out with my AFC mate neither
>of us talks ourselves up initially with a HB(s) the other person always does
>it... especially if one of us is off somewhere else at the time.
>
>*3rd party perception installation*
Of course. Always. We call it the accomplishment intro. But a woman

responds better to another woman than one of your buddies.
>People everywhere are pivots whether they know it or not! lol
True. But read on...
>Assuming she`s fine with the whole idea of being an ASF style pivot then
>keep it simple - get her to talk you up when she`s opened a set with things
>like "you simply gotta meet my friend he`s sooo funny and interesting, I`m
>sure you`ll love him..." If you`re cool with the various games get her to
>say you played X or Y before you came out and "it was really fun and sooo
>revealing" if she can find a HB who`s interested in that - bingo....
>
>Just get her to talk about you positively and make sure she doesn`t reveal
>things about you or your expectations or previous relationships etc Anything
>even slightly negative should come from you ( and then framed positively )
Spirit, I really like your posts. And this seems cool. But I want to
take this FURTHER. To make it more sophisticated. For example, to have
her tell the group when I leave (credit to Nightlight 9), "We're just
friends, I really wanted to get with him but he always has a
girlfriend..." if they ask if I have one now, then she'd say "No, but
there's this actress who wants to get with him." Or to have her offer
to get ME a drink while I'm in the group.
I believe that there is a SPECIFIC routine you can work out with a
pivot to get the target COMPETING FOR YOU. I'm also trying to think of
new good fun openers to use with pivots.More ideas here????
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 16 Aug 2002 12:06:00 GMT
On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 06:40:00 -0400, spirit wrote:
>Just another thought...

>
>How about training a pivot to aid your àlpha` status i.e. interrupt in some
>way when an OG begins to say something and staying quiet when you`re talking
>and other similarish `spoiler` tactics, like telling off OG`s who interrupt
>you...
>

>Spirit
Yeah, Spirit. I like these ideas. And also having her be

physical--touchy-feely--with me. Now we ARE getting somewhere. I just
thought of a great opener too. This will be GOLD in mixed sets.
I can even do the BABYSITTING INTRO:

Walk in with pivot, ask group if they can take care of her while I go
to the bathroom. Tell them I don't want to leave her alone here, and
they looked like trustworthy people. She just moved to town, and I
promised her mother that I wouldn't let her get into any trouble. So
don't get her into any trouble while I'm gone.
Then, I go to bathroom; she at some point talks me up to the set; then

I re-enter, joke around asking about what trouble they've gotten her
into. Then she distracts the guys, while I work on the HBs in the
set...
Okay...let's keep thinking...maybe we can end up developing, out of

this, a FAQ on training pivots.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 16 Aug 2002 20:11:00 GMT
subject: Re: LA Girls are confusing the shit outta me!
In addition to FinalD's excellent advice, here is my thought. And this

advice is specific to cities like LA. The problem, IMHO, is this: You
are using the NEW GUY IN TOWN approach. Now, hot girls in LA are very
busy: they are obsessed with their career and their phone rings off
the hook. People are offering to take them to great parties every
night. Plus, they are working hard trying to make money for ridiculous
rent and food costs and head shots and whatever else.
So, the point is this, the "I'm the new guy in town, please show me
around" approach will NOT work. YOU need to come from a position of
SUPERIORITY. You must, more than ever here, "be excellent." This means
that you need to VARY your whole routine, your whole game. You need to
give her a REASON to WANT to call you. And if you are sarging 9s and
10s (good for you), you will NEED to add beauty-destroyer routines to
your game. These are gold in places like LA.

You must also STEAL THEIR FRAME. You MUST "BE THE 10." In high demand.
You just moved to LA, you already know so many amazing people here,
you are having the best time. Maybe, since she has qualified herself
to you, you will have time for her.
And, on a side note, you are TOO EASY to diss. A chick should not be
able to get away with not calling back or giving you the wrong phone
number. You must ALWAYS call a chick on her bullshit. Never in an
angry way (at least that's not my style). And MAYBE give her a second
chance. But NEVER EVER give her a third chance. Have rules, tell them
to her, and stick to them.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 17 Aug 2002 19:52:00 GMT
Great advice, Cantactus. I know you're experienced in this sort of

thing...
Here's the upshot of the night: I got two *closes, but they both could
have been !closes. However, my own pivot CB'ed me.
She was good for social proof when we went out. I just opened all the
sets myself: very easy. And I knew I had an IOI when an HB asked if
Pivot was my GF or if Pivot would mind if she sat with us etc. By the
way, the babysitting opener rocked--for both mixed groups, and even
directly after the opener with a group of HBs. But, sadly, when I
returned, Pivot would just be sitting there looking hot and stupid
when I returned, not really opening up the group.
Anyway, the problems were:

1. Pivot was NOT bright. She couldn't hold her own very well in a
conversation.
2. When I isolated, Pivot would fucking follow. Useless. I need to
train a NEW Pivot on EVERY aspect of the game.
3. This is where it REALLY fucked up: logistics. I was Pivot's ride.
So Kiss close #1 left the club with us, but she had to drive me to my
car because I had to take Pivot home first. It was too complicated. I
was IN, but couldn't work the logistics--getting my car, taking pivot
home first, etc. So, as I'm sitting in the car with Pivot, and Kiss

close #1 is making a fucking booty call. She wouldn't have had to make
that if Pivot was NOT there. In retrospect, maybe I could have
finessed this situation. But in the moment, once she realized Pivot
was coming with too, it was over in her mind.
4. Kiss close #2 met us at a small after-hours party. She was drunk
and with a guy she'd been flirting with all night. However, she said
she didn't like him and wanted me to drive her home in her car. Dude,
this was SO on. She was talking about how much she liked to fuck (hot
older fake-breasted thin blonde). She also did a super-sexy thing: we
were biting each other's necks. I still have a bruise this morning.
Then she goes, "Do you know what else I love to do?" And she takes two
fingers, spread-eagled, and rotates them 180 degrees in my mouth. My
mistake was that I should have just isolated her at the party and
closed her there. I tried to work the logistics of the cars, because I
was still with Pivot and had to drop her home (in opp direction
first), but it was just too complicated and kiss close #2 ended up
having other guy drive her. I hated losing to an AFC who just got
lucky; in retrospect, I should have blown him out.
In retrospect, the Pivot was a fucking CB. Next time, we have to

travel INDEPENDENTLY of each other. Also, needs to be a brighter HB
for sure. That said, opening was a piece of cake with her, but after
that she couldn't hold her own
CPowles
On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 20:31:00 -0400, cantactus wrote:
>
>I like your Style, Style.
>
>Make sure that your pivot knows that the only way she
>could ever be with you is if you both pick up another
>woman. A woman pivot is going to CB if she really
>wants to be with you. When you are sarging, you'll be
>demonstrating value, and she'll notice and be interested.
>Be careful about setting up a frame for her to compete
>with other women.
>
>This works out well though as she is more sincere when
>talking you up. I did this one about a month ago with a
>pivot:
>"Here's a wild idea... , I know you're not into
>women, but if you could let yourself do it for just one
>night, what qualities would that woman have to have?"
>She'll eventually point one out... You can reenforce

>it with, "hey what about that one" and "do you think
>we should bring her home?" I think you see where that is
>going... This is a routine that a GF and I would use -
>(I think I told you those stories in Miami) I was more
>of her wing in those days...
>
>Your 'babysitter' routine seems interesting... I'm sure
>we're all curious how that will work out for you. You'd
>be walking into a conversation that you might not know
>anything about... Opening the set would be completely on
>her shoulders, it is completely dependant on your pivot's
>skills and willingness to learn.
>
>For openers: how about relationship material
>(The standard) Do women lie more than men? We were just talking about
>blah...
>Who is more insensitive to each others needs... We were just talking
>about her boyfriend who did this.. (work in somehow that she's trying
>to get with you...)
>Are you guys a couple (for a pair of super HBs...) (not tested, but
>seems good)
>
>
>
>
>In article <34090.5119@discussion.fastseduction.com>, Style says...
>> I've been thinking lately. Sure, it's fun sarging with a group of ten
>> ASF'ers. But why not UP the game a little. And instead train a woman
>> to be my PIVOT. After all, when you are WITH an HB, there is ZERO
>> resistance to opening sets and LOTS of social proof. Plus, she can
>> talk you up to other women. I don't know why I wasn't doing this
>> before. Or why anybody else here isn't with their female friends.
>>
>> So, on Friday night, I am going to a party with LOTS of super-fine
>> HBs. There will be tons of 9s and 10s. I am taking a girl I sarged in
>> Vegas who is gorgeous in a cheesy way: big fake breasts wanna-be
>> actress. A 9+.. She's just not too bright and lots of drama, so I told
>> her today that we would be each other's pivots. Then I explained that
>> all of my gfs were in other cities, and I needed an la gf. So she'd
>> help me find an LA gf, and I'd help her find a BF. We agreed.. Now, I
>> need to TRAIN her. What do I do? What do I tell her? What are good
>> NON-LYING (but also NON-SEXUAL) openers to use in these cases? What
>> other ASF techniques can she use to help me here?
>>
>> I mean, yes, I can just go sarge normally with her. However, this is
>> an art. There are RULES for winging, and ways you can use your wing to

>> get yourself laid.. And I'm sure there is a VERY efficient way to work
>> with a pivot. Ways SHE can open sets for me (and me for her).
>>
>> Need ideas fast.
>>
>> CPowles
>>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 20 Aug 2002 22:52:00 GMT
subject: HBs who won't * in public
Was with a girl yesterday in a bar, getting all the IOIs, and went in
for the kiss. She wouldn't do it. But NOT because she wasn't
attracted. She said she didn't kiss in public. But she said she would
come over tomorrow to my house, bring a picnic, bring a movie
("requiem for a dream" I think, though it's pretty bleak), etc. So it
is ON, BUT it made me think about the whole MO.
In other words, my club MO is to go for *close, then try to instant

date or, if not, get the #. There is the whole 20-minute from
meet-to-kiss routine. That's what I'm working. BUT, some HBs will NOT
kiss in public, even in a dark corner or sofa.
So, it's making me think that maybe some HBs I ejected were actually
UP for it. Just NOT in public. And it would have been a matter of
getting to a car or a house.
So, first, I'm wonding: Is the whole "go for the kiss" MO not feasible
with some girls. And, at some point in the sarge, should a question be
asked about their views of public displays of affection. IOW, she may
not be willing to * you in the club, but she might be willing to ! you
that night somewhere else. This should be screened.
Curious to hear others' thoughts and experiences...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>

Wed, 21 Aug 2002 04:01:00 GMT

subject: Re: Tips From the World of Sales/Marketing
>HANDLING OBJECTIONS
>Sometimes, the best strategy isn’t to confront an objection. Instead,
>acknowledge it. Then ask the customers to put the objection on hold. Don’t
>expect them to abandon their concerns – assure them you’ll return to the issue
>in just a moment.
> Example: Sales trainer Bob Schultz shelves objections when he feels they
>arise too early in the presentation. He draws an example from real estate:
>"Suppose they step into the very first bedroom and say, ‘This is too small.’"
> "Sure," Schultz acknowledges, "you could hear the objection out and answer
>it with a preplanned response."
> But he suggests saying, "Mrs. Jones, I can appreciate that. What I’d like
to
>do is show you the rest of this home and some of the community. Then, if you’d
>like, we can come back with a tape measure to see if your furniture will fit."
> Schultz reports that, when he uses this "shelving technique, nearly 100% of
>his customers go along with it. More importantly, at least 75% of the "shelved
>objections" are answered during the normal course of his presentation – or
have
>been completely forgotten by the time it’s through.
This is gold. Here's why. Whenever I suggest some type of close--#,

extraction, *, whatever--and the response is only lukewarm or not
immediate, what I do NOW is just NOT PRESS the issue. I move on to
something else. And then, after just a few minutes, I return to it and
ask again. It is VERY strange, and maybe even a different principle at
work, but then I always get the close. This may be because the first
request plants the seed; then you don't press or be pushy or be
desperate; then you fluff or joke or do routine, and it gets her
comfortable, so that when you return to the request, she is ready to
assent. I'm not sure exactly how it works: but it works. Try it!
>CLOSING
>To improve your closing technique, go to a busy restaurant for lunch or
dinner.
>Notice how your waiter acts. He or she fearlessly asks for your order:
> • "What would you like?"
> • "Would you care for a drink?"
> • "Are you ready to order?"
> In a straightforward manner, busy waiters ask for and receive your
business.
>But what would happen if they hesitated, explaining every item in detail but
>never asking you to decide? It would needlessly drag out the transaction – and

>possibly drive you away.

> Remember: Prospects want to be led by your requests and suggestions – just
>like restaurant patrons expect the waiter to take the lead.
Also, note that the next question a waiter asks is: "would you like a
salad with that?" He tries to sell you something ADDITIONAL
afterwards. This works because:
A. He treats it as if it's something that everyone else has, and you
should be having to fit in.
B. It's a yes-chain. Use yes-chains in your pus. Ask questions that
always get yesses to lead up to what you want.
>Professional closers wait until their customers are "hot." Then, when the
>timing’s right, they strike, and the customer willingly agrees to buy.
>Suggestion: It’s time to close when the customer:
> • Nibbles or bites at his lip.
> • Stares away with a thoughtful – not a blank – expression.
> • Looks continuously from the sales material to the salesperson.
> • Asks "What if..." questions.
> • Repeats a question he asked before.
Yes, as Gunwitch (I think) says: strike while the iron is hot. Learn
to recognize when the window is open and seize the moment.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 21 Aug 2002 04:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: HBs who won't * in public
Good responses Tyler, 4R, Psychobabble, Cobi, Skyrazer, Tyler Durden.

It is that auto-antislut defense at work, I think. So, obviously, the
thing to do is to DROP the point, fluff/routine, then suggest an
extraction (under a pretext, which you both know is bs). And if the
IOIs are being read correctly, it should be no problem.
>whoa.. You actually eject chicks for not kissing you within minutes/hours of
>meeting you? I realize that *close is an ideal (lowers flakiness, etc.), but
>I've never used it as a rule.
True. Not a rule. But I try to push it as far as I can each time. When
I say eject, I don't mean just totally rebuke her. I'll take her # and
follow up later. Then I'll find a new HB in the club/bar/room willing
to *. But, what I realized, is that I don't have to settle for the #

in some of these cases; I can just try a solid extraction.
>Think of all the girls that are thinking that

>you're like their soulmate or some shit like that. They might have been
burned
>by a player before, and don't want to appear easy because they think you'll
>NEXT them post-sex. So they hold out, but really would do it within 1-3
>meetings (which, to be honest, is fine by me as long as the intention is
there,
>and they excite me [ducks for cover])
Though I didn't like a lot of Leykis's rules, I do follow one: If I'm

not sleeping with her by the third date, I will usually eject. I'm
just like that. All my passionate relationships start passionately.
And, I don't even know if I can truly connect with a girl until I
sleep with her and see if we have that chemistry. That's just the way
I am. And every girl I've had a multi-year relationship with I've had
sex with within the first three dates. Honestly, if there's not even a
kiss after the first meeting, it's not going to be ON in my exp. Every
girl when she meets you is at least CONSIDERING you as a
ONS/lover/soulmate/whatever, but if you don't act while the window is
open, you're going to get LJBFed. Of course, I love your posts, so I'd
be curious to hear your opinion on this.
Besides, I do agree with that Leykis post where he discusses a guy

nexting a girl post-sex. Good to read to reframe HBs.
>My HB9 LTR from high school that I still talk to has still never kissed a guy
>that quick (I talked to her about it last week, and she looked at me like I
was
>out to lunch).. but its possible she's never met a guy who could manage it.
True, but I bet it's a fantasy of hers that she's never gotten to live
out. (Read Nancy Friday, Secret Garden, about anonymous sex fantasy).
>I think its also important to remember that club *closes are far more likely
>than anywhere else. Not that you can't elsewhere, but the
>alcohol/daytonasetting increase your chances dramatically.
True. I primarily work in clubs/bars where that's possible. Don't do

much street sarging. I should, though, and then instant date to
clubs/bars.
>On the discovery channel, psychologists suggested that in environments where

>sex is acceptable, they are for more likely to engage in it (eg. in Daytona,

>girls who would be surveyed as saying they'd never ONS, willingly will there).
Yes, also note this principle when you meet a girl, and all her
friends are hooking up with guys. It tacitly gives HER permission to
suspend her barriers also and hook up with you.
>I would never NEXT a girl who won't *close though gives IOIs, unless you have
>many other options (which I bet you do) and the chick is no more enticing than
>others.
Yeah, when I say NEXT, I mean, get the #close, and then save for later
so I can move elsewhere in the club. (But now I'm changing my MO to
calibrate afterwards and then try tor fluff and then try to take
somewhere totally private before moving on to someone else in the
room.)
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 22 Aug 2002 00:22:00 GMT
subject: Re: HBs who won't * in public
>Makes perfect sense. You know, maybe this is a reflection of my need to

>improve, but I've always thought there are just some girls who take 1-3
>meetings to crack (some). Not that I think that you should change your game
in
>ANY way, or that you should not PUSH them. Just that if they don't crack, but
>are still agreeing to keep seeing you regardless of your ever-increasing kino,
>then it seems to me they are likely to crack eventually.. I also kind of think
>it makes it a bit more fun, since honestly I don't think that sex with condoms
>is that great, and I enjoy messing with girls more than actually laying them
>(if I have to use a condom that is, which if I just met this girl then i DO).
LIked your post and responses. Had some other thoughts, but want to
share one first:
Dude, ALWAYS use a condom. We are in this game for the LONG haul. If
you know a girl for a month (in an extreme case) before you fuck, that
doesn't make her ANY MORE SAFE than a girl you fuck the night you meet
her.
I ALWAYS ASSUME THAT THE LAST BF OF ANY GIRL I'M WITH, NO MATTER HOW

PURE AND INNOCENT, WAS A JUNKIE. AND I PROTECT MYSELF ACCORDINGLY.
The truth is, you never know. Even if she's been with one guy, who
says that guy wasn't a total disease-ridden slimeball. So I NEVER do
it without a condom unless either we get tested, or there's some sort
of proof that she's okay.
We are in this game FOR THE LONG HAUL. We are learning these skills
FOR LIFE.
Don't mean to go off, and maybe I even misunderstood what you wrote,
but doesn't hurt to repeat this advice anyway.
Maybe you'll be in Toronto next time I'm there, and we'll do the
clubs/bars. I don't drink or dance either.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 22 Aug 2002 20:16:00 GMT
On Wed, 21 Aug 2002 20:35:00 -0400, Supastar wrote:
>Style, would you mind describing how you GOT this girl to want / acquiesce
>to be your wing? Somewhere in the thread someone asked a really good
>question - what's in it for the woman? How do you frame the situation for
>her? How did you approach the subject with her?
>
>I have trouble turning women into Pivots; my sister, ex-GF, and other HB's
>in my life don't like the idea of me picking up women, so they are more
>likely to CB than to help.
Yes, I said: "Let's help each other find girlfriend/boyfriends." I

didn't say help me get laid or a ONS. I just said that I needed a
local girlfriend. A lot of HBs I know are cool with that idea: they're
looking for a good guy too. They're shy to approach themselves
sometimes. So when I told her what to do as far as an accomplishment
and desirability intro to the group, I told her what I'd do. My pivot
happened to be a busty bimbo. So I told her I'd tell guys, "PIVOT is
an awesome girl. You'd never guess it, but she's really a pretty

innocent good girl. So if you're interested, that's great, but just

now that I've never known her to sleep with a guy in less than three
months."
I wouldn't say this to EVERY pivot. But in her case, it filtered out
what SHE was worried about in guys: that they just want to have sex
with her. So, for someone else, find out what they're looking for and
what they're afraid of, and work your proposal along those lines.
Maybe your sister etc would be more helpful if she thought you really
wanted a nice girlfriend: that you were lonely and your life was so
empty without a real relationship like that etc etc.
>I guess the BEST pivot would be a bisexual MLTR who is helping you because
>she is looking for a girl for HERSELF and you to share. I will start
>looking for one of these.
Yeah, let's discuss this. I have a friend who has one, and she is a
predator. Amazing to watch her work!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 28 Aug 2002 18:46:00 GMT
subject: Re: Language Barriers: How to communicate?
>This is the e-mail I got back:

>
>"Hi!
>
>you re funny too!
>it s a short letter because it s hard in english for
>me. but i like you, so email me..."
>____________________________________________________________
>
>I think i'll pursue this but it'll only work in person. I know she likes me
but
>how to proceed from here?
>
>
>Advice appreciated.
>
>

Just give her the time and the place inyour next email. Keep it
simple. When you see her, play the GIRLFRIEND ASSUMPTION game. In
other words, ASSUME that she is your girlfriend. Take her hand. Even
bring her a little fun present, like the Lonely Planet English to
French language guide. (This is not supplication when it gets you to
where you want.) That actually rocks, because there are a lot of fun
expressions you can play with in there (about sex, police, the
pick-up, etc). Have everything planned: walk around hand in hand, get
ice cream, make out, go to club, dance, make out, take her home. Be
confident, know where you're going, and don't worry about
communicating when you don't have to. Clearly, you're in already.
I actually just did my first !close with a girl who did not speak ANY
English. I will post it in a FR if you want.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 28 Aug 2002 20:30:00 GMT
subject: Lay w/o Words (by Request)
This was written by Nightlight9 and myself.
We were in Europe at the time, on the seaside, wandering the strip

with the rest of the 10 pm tourists. We stopped for popcorn, and
Nightlight9 bought a big bag. Nearby, we saw two HBs sitting on a
curb, looking dejected. Nighlight9 loves approaching sad girls; I like
approaching fun girls. However, he was correct here.
Nightlight9 plops down next to them with his popcorn and asks, "How
are you doing?" Turns out they don't speak English at all. We try the
language of the country we are in, and they don't know that either.
Then we try a few other languages. Nothing. To tell the truth, I
consider ejecting here. But they aren't giving negative responses, so
Nightlight9 continues.
He offers popcorn, and one girl (blonde) takes it. The other
(brunette) doesn't. (Nightlight9 here notes that when women take food
from him in a situation like this, they usually end up hooking up with
him: his style is very interesting. It's very low-key, under the
radar, rapport-matching. He comes in VERY harmless and average-guy.)

I come in here and, facing them, I do a couple of little visual

tricks. I do an arm-twisting magic trick for fun, and then I make one
of their cigarettes disappear. I usually don't do magic, but I wanted
to do something fun and non-verbal. Then I sit next to the brunette.
We figure out through pictures and gestures that they are Czech, 18
and 19, and here with their parents. I also do a magic trick where I
guess their birthday. Nightlight9 offers popcorn again, and this time
the brunette takes some too.
Anyway, what HAS worked here is that they were depressed before. Now
they're happy and enjoying themselves. I think that THIS was all it
took. We were already IN before the magic, just for brightening their
day. Anyway, we break into two couples and start wandering around,
kinoing. They're very cute. The brunette is tan and leggy and thin and
small-breasted, with a model's body and face (though she's an 8.5,
because "model look" does not necessarily mean a 10).
Anyway, around 10:30, they get sad and gesture that they have to go
meet their parents. I take out my notepad, and we make plans to meet
the next night at 8:30 p.m. Then Nightlight9 and I each give/get
closed-mouth kisses goodbye.
After the girls go, we agree that they are hot and fun. We decide the
key move is to just treat them AS IF they are our girlfriends on the
next meeting. For the next date we come up with a great plan to take
them to top of a tower, then for ice cream, then for a walk, all the
time going from full GF treatment to friendly distance and back. The
idea being to try to make it seem like multiple dates.
Also, a few days ago, Nightlight9 and I had picked up two sisters. On
the first meeting, we did the GIRLFRIEND PRESUMPTION thing. They also
happened to bring us each a little present--a souvenir glass ball
diorama with plastic fish inside--and when they gave us the present,
it really felt nice. So nice that we *closed them on the spot. So,
with the two Czechs, we took a cue from the sisters and brought the
Czechs tiny cheap necklaces. In the past I would have thought it was
supplication, but here it was a VERY effective PU tactic-it's an SOI.
So we meet up with the girls and start to take them to tower. They
start to get upset and "explain" that their parents are at the tower
(this takes much translation). We take their hands and start walking
arm in arm: the blonde runs off and buys ice cream herself. So much
for our plan. We sit down with them, give them their presents (which
we put around their necks), and then *close and make out. And, by the
way, the Czech girls also gave us presents--Czech candy and music. How
cute.

Anyway, it seems as if they have their OWN plan. (Note: Always HAVE a
plan, but ALWAYS be prepared to abandon it if circumstances change.)
They make a windmill movement with their arms, and we realize that
they want to go swimming. We say "OK" and they lead us on. We come
to a dark beach. They take off their dresses and their bras.
Everything but their thongs and shoes. It was so fucking sexy.
Nightlight9 and I are looking at each other like, "This is on!" So we
run after our girls into the water, and make out and do all sorts of
awesome sensual things. We didn't !close in the water, but it was one
of the sexier experiences of my life. And all because we APPROACHED
and DIDN'T EJECT and WENT WITH THE FLOW.. By the way, through this
all, the Czech girls keep talking to each other nonstop. I wish I
recorded it: I'm dying to know what they were saying about us.
The water gets cold, so we get out, change, and sneak onto a boat and
start going at it a little more hardcore. But then some captain climbs
onto the boat, and we freak out and sneak off the boat before we get
caught. And the girls have to go meet their parents again. We make
plans to meet two nights later.
This time, Nightlight9 and I rent a hotel room right next to the
beach. It's pretty cheap ($40 or $50). Then we get candles,
chocolates, and fruit for the room. When we meet up with the girls, we
just take them by the hand, walk down the boardwalk, and take them to
the hotel. A little confusion, but no real resistance. Every time we
try to talk and say like "what did you do today," they just make
gestures like they don't understand us. So we give up trying to
communicate with words. Nightlight9 takes his girl out to the balcony;
I stay in the bedroom with mine.
When I was trying to remove my girl's underwear, she kept resisting

and saying one of the 10 English words she knew, "days." I realized:
ah, period. I ran out to the balcony, where NL9 was with his girl, and
asked what to do. "Just fuck her," was his advice. Good advice.
Afterwards, since the girls kept talking to each other in Czech while
they were making out, we figured we'd try to get them to make out with
each other. So we all got into bed together. I took my girl's hand,
and had her slap the sunburn of the other girl. And we all started
play-wrestling in bed. Didn't work, however, but it was a good idea
and in another circumstance might have worked. I think at the very
least when/if we see them again, it is possible.Anyway, they had to go
meet up with their parents soon.
A couple interesting points: most of Nightlight9 and my best

experiences on this trip came from girls trying to ESCAPE their

parents for a few hours. Also, from the idea of it being two girls, so
if ONE is doing something with a guy, then it's OKAY for the other.
And if the OTHER is going VERY FAR with one guy, then it's okay for
the OTHER to go very far too. They start to lead each other like this
in a feedback loop. Is there a term for this?
Anyway, a grear memory, especially since, as anyone who's seen my

earliest posts knows, I've always wanted to do the PU w/o words.
Thanks to Nightlight9 for not bailing when we discovered they couldn't
speak English. (BTW, since then, I developed and field tested a *close
without words routine that will work for traveling. It's playful and
fun. I will write it out and post it in tactics/techniques.)
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 29 Aug 2002 12:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: Lay w/o Words (by Request)
On Wed, 28 Aug 2002 16:14:00 -0400, psychobabble wrote:
>Nice post style. Just wondering about your question regarding the positive
>feedback loop between the two chicks going father, making it acceptable for
the
>other one to go farther, etc...
>
>I haven't been in many experiences such as this as I am by nature a lone wolf.
>
>But it raises a few questions in my mind.
>
>Do you feel that it was possibly more skill/natural progression with the
chicks
>conveyed by both you and nightlight9 that made it 'OK' for the chicks to get
>into this loop by making it seem natural?
Don't totally understand this question. But I think it was the

perception of one THINKING the other was going further than she was
that made it okay for HER. And this became a feedback loop. But, yes,
the fact that we made it seem natural and seduced our respective girls
made it okay. If ONE of us blew it, it would blow it for both of us.

I am REALLY into sarging two-sets with a good wing now. I am going to

make this my game for now. Went out with Swinggcat and we HAD a
two-set. We PU'ed, instant dated, etc., It was very frustrating: we
were very close, one was totally ready, and the second one ended up
cockblocking. However, with more practice, we will master the two-set
sarge. More fun than lone wolf sarging, I think. Plus, as noted in
Lovedrop's post, you can work it GM style.
>Do you feel as though they were already kinda determined to have
>fun/excitement/whatever on vacation/behind their parents backs?
Absolutely. In some ways, after we entered their world, they PU'ed us

and did most of the work. I wish I spoke the language, but if it
wasn't their plan from the start, it was their plan after they met us.
>The way you described it makes it sound to me as if the chicks were naturally
>removing each others anti-slut defenses, and like I said, I have rarely been
in
>a similar situation, but I'm wondering what your thoughts are with regards to
>my questions above.
Swinggcat and I are going to be working the next few months on

mastering this. I will post the progress. The same principle worked
with the lay report that I wrote up a month or so back with Mystery.
The girl I was with THOUGHT her friend and Mystery were hooking up
(though they weren't), so it gave her permission to do the same with
me.
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 29 Aug 2002 12:21:00 GMT
subject: Re: Lay w/o Words (by Request)
This is GOLD! Thanks for posting this. Now that I see it here, I
realize that this principle worked for me in my AFC days. I'd try to
leave a friend alone with a girl, but end up going FURTHER with the
girl I accidentally isolated. Thx for this!
>
>I remember Nathan and GM used to do this type of thing. First they'd bring
>two chicks back to the apartment ("It's my friend's birthday and we're going
>back to celebrate with some champagne.")

>
>Then they'd be hanging out for a bit, then GM would take his girl in the
>back room. He did this by telling her something like, "Uh, look at
>them...can't you see they want to be alone? C'mon, let's go in the other
>room for a minute."
>
>So now each chick believes that the other wants to be alone with her guy so
>she can be sexual with him. This provides social proof for HER to get
>sexual as well. Haa!
>
>o===3
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 31 Aug 2002 18:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: LR: Rent a movie turns groovy ! (long)
Quick comments (a mltr is over):

This isn't long. Detail is good.
On Sat, 31 Aug 2002 00:21:00 -0400, superslicka wrote:
>so we go to rent 'the end of an affair' with ralph fiennes suggested by Eddy
>from here and she wants to watch serendipity - take it as a shit test so I
>agree and then say 'I'll pay for the movie and you pay for the popcorn k ?'
she
>agrees we pay and we go back to my place. put the popcorn in etc. all the
while
>EV'ing and keeping her laughing then finally start up the movie. watch the
>movie for like 20 minutes still joking around about the movie now and then
>(she's got closed bl - crossed arms and legs) to gain rapport and she slowly
>relaxes. When she's relaxed, ask her about going to a certain bar (where I
>picked her up) and if that's her favourite bar, and she says ya, so I give her
>a hi5 and hold on to her hand - eventually she pulls away to scratch her head
>or something so I continue to relax her by EV'ing and making her laugh. Then I
>ask her about her bracelet and take her arm and ask some questions about it
>then put her hand in mine and squeeze it now and then telling her 'I'm playing
>with your hand'...after a while I say 'now I'm going to play with your arm :)'
>and then start tracing a finger slowly up and down her arm very lightly. she
>leans her head on my shoulder then I smile and ask her if she likes it and she
>says ya it's ticklish and then she starts doing it to me..after a few minutes
>of doing this, I can tell she's getting excited, so I say 'u know what else

>feels good ?' and smile, she asks what then I move my head in to make out with
>her.
Nice. Clearly she was into you from the beginning. But nice move. You
did a good job of NOT BLOWING IT. Most guys do: the girl is into them,
and all they have to do is NOTHING WRONG. And they fuck that up.
>Make out for a while then lie down on the couch and I start kino'ing
>everywhere - we do this for a few minutes then I pull off her top etc. and
then
>I tell her I have a romantic cd in my room and if she'd want to hear it - she
>says but what would your parents think if they say me going into your room ?
(I
>still live at home btw but not for long)..then she suggests showing me the cd
>in her car so I say sure..so we finish the movie then I get the cd and we go
>drive to a park where we can 'listen to the music' but then she wants to show
>me some of her music and I say fine.
Look at all the chick logic here: the shitty pretext she needs, and
the fact that she cares about what your parents will think if she
fools around with you. That's why forums like this exist, right, to
deal witha ll that stuff?
During the drive and all this I'm joking

>around with her and trying to keep the state by kino'ing her now and then. We
>finally get there and I suggest we move to the back seat, I take her top off,
>pants, bra but she doesn't want to remove her panties and says "uh uh uh!" so
I
>don't remove them - yet :) make out have fun etc. I take off shirt and pants
>and tell her to hold on a sec, fish out the rubber and she asks 'what are you
>going to do with that ? you're not getting THAT lucky..' and I smile and put
it
>away then make out with her more and turn her on even more until she's moaning
>and shit, reach back for the rubber, this time no resistance, and the rest is
>history !
This is where I really want to give you props. Remember that post on
sales tactics a while back? When you get initial resistance, you
acknowledge it, but then DON'T argue it or press the point. You move
on to something else (you show them the rest of the house you're
trying to sell them), and THEN you return to it. This is an important
principle to always use: if there's minor resistance (on a #, *, !),
move on, maker her more comfortable/turned on, then return and see
waht happens. Then, you pull out your other LMR-blocking tactics
(Riker's three rules, Mystery's take-away, "we shouldn't be doing
this" patter, etc.)

>one thing I think I fucked up tho was during the movie I got a bit buzzed so
>after we were done in the car she was asking me why I always ignored her at
the
>club and danced with her friends cuz she was by far the hottest one there (she
>was a 9 btw) - she said it pissed her off and made me different from all the
>other guys who would come up and hump her from behind or whatever; she was
>intrigued as to why I wasn't dancing with her or paying any attention to her.
>Anyway I told her it was all part of my technique then explained to her neg
>theory ! as soon as the words came out of my mouth I fucking regretted it
>tho....was this bad or does it matter after I've laid her ?
Doesn't matter at this point. But, yes, now you know: bad move. Never
do this. The frame you must have, always, is that you didn't like her
at first--she made a bad first impression--but then she EARNED your
approval and attention by something she did. For next time.
Nice,
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 31 Aug 2002 18:28:00 GMT
subject: Re: My First Kiss close! But didn't # close...dammit!
Nice shit, man. You are COMING ALONG. This is textbook. UNTIL...you
get the HB7 all hot for you and DON'T close the deal. But this is all
good. Part of the learning process. You should have ISOLATED and
really *closed her. For next time. Also, find out her car and living
situation so you can see if a ONS was possible. She wanted you, man.
You did your work and it WORKED. Now reap the rewards fully next time!
As for the MTV chick, cocky/funny doesn't work on her. SO, you try
another tactic. Instead, you be MORE INTERESTING than her. You tell
her ABOUT HERSELF instead of joking around about YOURSELF.
Cold-reading type stuff would have worked well here.
>another time, i explained to her that she was into me

>and that she wasn't touching me ALL OVER like other girls would...and i
>explained to her that words are only 7% of communication and 93% is body
>language...i said "u should communicate to me fully now." she then >started
>touching my arm all over and my chest...it was fun...

I love this!
Nice, M3,
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Sep 2002 07:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: OT: porn for ladies
Videotapes by Candida Royale: they're made for couples, with women in

mind. http://db.phenet.com/catalog/femme/home.html
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Sep 2002 07:24:00 GMT
subject: Re: New style/tactic: 'Me, too!'
On Sat, 31 Aug 2002 18:10:00 -0400, jlaix wrote:

>From what I've seen, he just goes up, starts talking. Basically, his style
>consists of letting them talk and then saying, "Oh yeah? That's so amazing! ME
>TOO!!" to everything they say. Do they like rock climbing? Guess what? GREG
>TOO! Roller skating naked? Guess what! GREG TOTALLY LOVES ROLLER SKATING NAKED
>TOO!! And so on and so on...
>
>This extremely simple technique seems to work for him. But I think it would be
>best applied as a PART of a larger overall style. I guess it could be
>classified as Mirrorring.
Yes, this is part of my game. I call it: finding COMMONALITIES. It's a

big part of rapport: getting excited, emphasizing, exaggerating the
things you have in common (or claim to in Greg's case). Once this is
done, I discuss an article I read (true) that says that pheremones are
fired between two people in response to things they have in common.
That is how attraction is created. Etc etc.
CPowles
================================================================================

================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Sep 2002 07:27:00 GMT
subject: Re: Negging HBs by giving them nicknames
On Sun, 01 Sep 2002 18:00:00 -0400, Euphorio wrote:
>Anybody ever tried calling an HB you've never seen before by a nickname? I do

>this all the time. I even call guys by little nicknames I give them. For
>example, if I see some clueless lookin AFC standing all by himself, I'd go up
>to him and call him Rufus or something condescending. If I see an HB with a
>ponytail, I'd approach her and say some shit like, "hey, pony, did you
know..."
>And it'd start like that. She would be like, "why are you calling me pony?"
>then I'd point out her hair. Makes for good openers.
>
Recently I went out, I met two HBs named Kelly. So I named one Kelly 1
and the target Kelly 2. She said she knew another Kelly 2 and didn't
like her, so I made her Kelly 3 instead. Since then, when I meet an
HB, and she gives me her name, say, Sara. I tell her I already know
two Saras, so she is Sara 3. (Naturally she's jokingly upset about
being a lowly Sara 3.) Then I call her that all night. And if she's
good I promote her to Sara 2 and then Sara 1. If bad, I demote her to
Sara 4. Fun and effective reward/punishment game.
I like your "Pony" game too. Nicknames rock for PU purposes. Creates
private jokes: a good thing!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Sep 2002 07:29:00 GMT
subject: Re: Improvising Neg Hits - Finding an Angle
On Sun, 01 Sep 2002 23:59:00 -0400, SexPDX wrote:
There are all purpose negs: act as if she has something in her nose or
ear. Or ask her to get you a napkin. When she hands it to you, either
rub something off her face or hand it back to her and gesture to her
face.

You could also carry lint around with you. Do you know the lint
opener?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Sep 2002 07:33:00 GMT
subject: Re: Style, we need your help man!
On Sat, 31 Aug 2002 22:02:00 -0400, ColorfulBull wrote:
>Style, I see that you are still around here occasionally. I wonder whether you
>are planning to make another SP thing in the near future or not.
>
>I think this board is somewhat suffering from the lack of real PUAs around
>here, and your threads were a really great cotribution to it.
>
>Personally, after getting your advice I went out and started field testing
only
>to come into new obstacles - which is good.
>
>What is not good is that most of the guys on this board are not familiar with
>MM or give false advice. I trust your advice and I feel like you are the only
>person who can help. Please reply if you can.
Thanks man. I'll start a new SP thread when I have the time to do it.
It's a bitch to answer all the questions and threads. Time-consuming!
I do enjoy it though. I'll take a look at your recent field report
right now and see if I have any observations. I like that you are not
JUST researching: it seems like you're getting out and practicing this
stuff a lot, and finding out what works for YOU. Where are you based?
By the way, David Shade, if you are reading this: You're a great guy,
and one of the people with the most integrity I've ever met. But
answer the questions in the damn thread you started! It was a good
idea, I thought. I could have used your answers this weekend...
CPowles
================================================================================

================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Sep 2002 07:55:00 GMT
subject: Re: FR #4: a # close and important self realisations
On Sat, 31 Aug 2002 21:53:00 -0400, ColorfulBull wrote:
>So I went to the other place.

>I did Elvis on two girls, but they were UGs so I ejected. I tried the spells
>opener but the chicks laughed at me after I said "Do u believe in spells?" and
>didn't pay any attention at all.
Sometimes you have to muscle through the beginning. It's a rocky road
and you have to keep pushing forwards until you get clear terrain.
I've had some bumpy beginnings that I've been able to power through.
This, btw, doesn't mean sticking with the opener no matter what and
just telling the story: it means finding out what it takes to open up
the set.
That said, I've never had anyone laugh at me with the spells opener. I
do it like this: "Hey guys, I want to get your opinion on something:
Do you think spells work." Here, if they seem skeptical or anything, I
say, "There's a reason I'm asking this, but I want to get your opinion
first. A funny thing happened when my friend over there and I were at
this club last week..."
>Then 2 guys came to talk to the girls and I

>started befriending them. (I though they were friends or such) Turns out the
>guys were trying to pickup these chicks as well but they didn't succeed.
Wanted
>to do some sarging together with one of the guys, but he wasn't really
>receptive. At least we had a good talk anyway.
You should be alpha/interesting enough that you're blowing other guys

who come to PU chicks you're talking to out of the water. My favorite
move is watching guys go up to chicks, and then walking in, opening
the set, making them love me, and then taking the chicks from under
their nose.
>I then Elvised another 2set and went into my stories. After my first story
>(car-chasing one) one of the girls asked: you practised this a lot, right? I
>couldn't come up with a decent answer to that. I went into to another story,
>but the girls wanted to go dancing.
Maybe for clubs you need less stories, more playful. I'd like to watch

you work. I have a feeling that something isn't clicking: your energy,
the way you feel about yourself, your attitude, your ability to enter
their world, your ability to calibrate their mood...
>What do u do in a situation like this? 2 girls standing, you are talking to

>them, they suddenly hear a music they like and they go dancing. This means you
>weren't interesting enough, right?
Yep.
>Another problem I had: I went for the UG first, but the B was more responsive.
>The UG didn't care about me, I mainly talked with the B, then the UG somewhat
>started to cockblock me. How do u fix this?
Yeah, the easiest thing to do with this game is to THROW IT OUT THE
WINDOW as soon as a hottie starts paying attention to you. Remember,
that is HER game. Don't let it make you lose your game. Stick to the
rules. You still have to disarm the obstacle, maybe even neg the
target. I was with a MLTR this weekend. What made her like me was I
approached, talked to her, and then talked to her friend. When she
reapproached to talk, I said, "Not right now, I'm talking to your
friend," and waved her away. What made her interested in me was that I
WAS NOT INTERESTED IN HER.
>I then continued to wander around, and saw a girl who gave me heavy EC and a
>smile. She was with a boy, who seemed to be her BF. I went up to her to call
>her on her shit and tease, turned out she gave me heavy EC because she knew me
>(she didn't remember me correctly as well, but still more than I did). We had
>some fluff about our friend we knew each other through, I teased her a bit ala
>cocky/funny and somewhat GM style.
>BTW: Do u have a decent GM-style comeback when girls say that you are
>overconfident and stuff like that?
"And what is it about an overconfident man that turns you on?" (said
smiling, teasing, not totally serious) Can be used for anything: "And
what is it about a funny/cocky/etc man that you like so much?"
>Anyway, what I learnt here: this girl was with a guy. When I first took a look
>I'd have sworn that he was her BF. Turned out they were just friends and they
>were there with a group, nothing more. This is important guys!!! Don't let
>things like this discourage you from approaching chix with boys.
Exactly. EVERYONE approaches the two girls in the bar. No one

approaches the girl with the two guys. Always ASSUME they are single
until you find out otherwise. Do the opener, then ask, "So how does
everyone here know each other?"

>So, after some fluff the girl left and went back to her friends. The time we
>talked wasn't enough to get her IOI level high, and I didn't want to go into
>stories because we had this mutual friend who told her things about me, and I
>didn't want to risk my stories turning out fake in front of her.
Fuck it. How would the mutual friend know they were fake? And if so,
just say later, "I thought you knew I was teasing/joking/kidding."
Sometimes we talk ourselves out of the PU. Maybe your reason was
vaild; maybe it's just a rationalization not to continue and
risk...whatever...
>So I continued sarging and saw a group: 6 girls and a guy. So I went up to the
>guy with my all time favourite opener: "Dude what's your secret? You want to
>ashame other men, right?" Then I usually tell a story about meeting a guy who
>had 3 gfs and they were making out in front of me - stuff like that.
>While I was talking to this guy and telling him my story, the girls went away.
>I ended up talking to the guy only. Turned out he was not really a PUA, but he
>occasionally had lays and gave me some good info about places to go to and
ways
>to meet new chicks. In the end he told me to feel free to mess with the girls
>:)
Yes, good job sticking with him. The girls will return after all. All
good (so long as you make it clear early on that you're not gay by
mentioning an ex-girlfriend or something).
>Guys, this is the second most important thing I've learnt today: the
importance
>of making male friends as well. They might turn out to be PUAs or not, they
>might have some valuable insights and infos for you or not, but at least you
>get to know new people who might lead you to getting more girls. Nice.
>
>So after I finished talking to this guy, I went back to the 5-set. I decided
>that I wouldn't go for stories this time and I wouldn't fucking care. I was
>really tired and wanted to get some sleep.
>So I went back and started talking to the girls. One of the girls enjoyed my
>company and ISOLATED me :) Well not really, let's just say she was somewhat
>receptive to my shit.
>Like I said, I didn't feel like doing stories so I just fluffed with the girl.
I see you mention stories a lot. Stories are good. But you need more
than stories. You need a direction. Do you have one. And things to do
to get you to each step there. They don't need to be stories. I
definitely don't always use stories.

>Yes I inserted some stories but not as much as I was supposed to.
You're never supposed to. You do what the situation requires.

I
>concentrated on KINO and discovered that I had difficulties doing it. I only
>felt comfortable with doing KINO on her ARM and SHOULDER. Damn, I HAVE NOW
>REALISED THAT I HAVE TO WORK ON THIS. My kino sux. I usually talk to 2 sets,
>and don't get to the point of isolating and doing KINO.
I think in one of the SP threads I posted some kino routines, like the
evolution phase shift routine. Just be a guy who TOUCHES people when
they talk to them. Naturally. You touch them to get their attention,
to make an emphatic point, to compare one thing to another, etc. at
FIRST. KINO is key!
>BTW: I wanted to go into sexual state, but I was SOOOO TIRED, I couldn't even
>think of sex. DAMN.
>
>SELF REALISATION #3: NEVER GO SARGIN WHEN YOU ARE TIRED. It's on your face.
You
>feel it. Girls feel it. It sux. It was fucking late and I didn't have any
>energy. I had a hard time approaching and telling stories. I was not
>enthusiastic. Always look and feel your best, RIGHT?
True. But if you're in the moment and that's how you are feeling,
either:
A. Get some energy or
B. Use being tired as part of your game. Feel her shoulder; is it
soft? ask her if you can nap on it for 30 seconds to recharge. (I'm
just making this up now, but you see what I mean...She wasn't bothered
by the fact that you were tired, YOU were.)
>OK, so I wanted to get some sleep and said to the girl that I was leaving. I
>didn't want to do a num close. She said she enjoyed talking, so I asked if she
>wanted to continue. She said yes, so I had her write the number down.
>Seems I did the attract phase well. Why? Because even in my "TIRED STATE" I
had
>the attitude of "who cares, I don't give a fuck". BTW: The girl is between UG
>and B and I usually close girls like this at this place. Gotta find a better
>one since I'm fed up with UGs and Bs.
This game is MADE for HBs. You'll find that it works BETTER on HBs
than UGs.
Hope this helps, CB,

CPowles

================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Sep 2002 22:15:00 GMT
subject: Re: Warning: post contains ICQ Imaginary sarge :)
DISCLAIMER: I do NOT sarge online. Maybe I should , but I have no

actual experience here. However...
Okay, the way I see it, you made two key mistakes here:
1. You played HER model game. Come one. She calls herself "Hot Mod."
And she says she works at "Ford," like the most obvious agency in the
world.
>Hot Mod 07/08/20 2:39 PM Yes I model.

>
>TylerDurde 07/08/20 2:40 PM like hand modelling or something?
>
>Hot Mod 07/08/20 2:40 PM No, like fashion modeling or something.
Okay, you are off to a good start here.
>TylerDurde 07/08/20 2:41 PM hmm.. I'm very impressed. My stepdad was

> going to get me a job modelling, but I
wanted
> to play football for queen's this year, and
I
> couldn't see my bottom 2 abs clearly enough
> after I did the necessary bulking.. so what
> agency u working with?
>
>Hot Mod 07/08/20 2:43 PM Ford
>
>TylerDurde 07/08/20 2:46 PM u work at the one on Adelaide?
And here you fuck it up!! You are playing her game now. You are trying
SO HARD to gain rapport with her. THIS is where I would have said that
she is probably a guy or a grandma or something. Then I would have
said, "Never mind that. While we're talking, let me ask you something
quickly..." And NOW is your chance to CAPTURE HER ATTENTION. IOW,
you've "defused" the model thing; you don't care who she is anymore.

You're not a horny guy looking for models online. Now, she can begin
to demonstrate her personality to you.
So the second thing is this: WHY should she want to talk to you? You
haven't REALLY demonsted anything special enough about yourself yet.
So with the story or opinion or whatever you go for here, I would try
to NOT MAKE SMALL TALK, but work your way into her world. Be funny,
cocky, testing HER (or Him, ha ha), and making comments about her
personality. (Hell, then do the cube with her over ICQ and she's yours
if she's playing with you for that long--esp if you do a takeaway and
continue interpretation later.)
So, for this: 1. Defuse and let go of the model thing--and then talk
to her anyway, whoever she is. Make her prove herself to you.
2. Don't appear to be trying too hard to have things in common.
3, Show her that you are DIFFERENT than all the other guys out there.
My good friend Leftcoast just hooked up with a GORGEOUS blonde natural

looking 6 foot model he met online. I must consider looking into this.
Do post or email me your successful ICQ routine!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 03 Sep 2002 04:02:00 GMT
subject: Re: OT:help draft this email b4 sending 2 important HB
Man, my quick impression before I run out:
She already likes you, dude. The shit your sister did has INCREASED
her interest in you. Remember, this PUA stuff is COUNTER-INTUITIVE.
>Hey Ty,
>
>What's up in Kingston? I just got in the door was out shopping with my
brother,
>I think I may be turning into a shopaholic like your sister , which would be a
>very bad thing seeing as my books for one course this year are $180. Sorry you
>missed watching the movie with us the other night but it sucked anyways.
She wanted you there, wants to let you know you didn't miss anything,
it sucked w/o you, etc.

>Where
>are the pictures of your house that you said you would send me?
She doesn't care about the house: she cares about keeping her
connection with YOU
>What have you

>been up to lately?(I am referring to the things which you can discuss with me
Jealousy rears its head, in a joking matter. She thinks you are a
player. This makes her MORE interested. But it will also be a
roadblock that she will erect when you try to re-sarge her: a shit
test. So be prepared to reframe it for her in the right way for her.
>). Liz, Denise and I went to Grace O'Malley's last night it was one of those
>exciting Grocery store events!!! Your sweet sister basically made fun of all
>these losers without them even beening aware of it. Ask Liz to tell you about
>Claude, this really sexy new man she met who is sure to help her forget all
>about that jerk Ryan.
Dude, all good: she's sexual, she's throwing another man in your face
(even if it's not hers), and she has a great sarcastic sense of humor
Invite her out to go make fun of people at some cheesy place, so you
can both feel superior and bond that way.
As for your email, too long to comment on specifically:
Like Zap says, shorten it!

What's up with all the hiphop speak. Funny at first; annoying later.
>
>My buddies were watching Sopranoes w/ pizza over at Wildo's when I went over,
>and I kinda wanted to go back.. hoping that maybe if I took off when liz
>started getting uppety, she might be a little sweeter next time you're over -
>killing two birds with one stone (she only acts like that when you're over
>cause she thinks like..... me and you are hot for eachother.. or something
like
>that). Incidently, she's been quite sweet ever since :)
I don't know about this. First, don't explain yourself. Fuck it.
Secondly, remember how important the approval of other women is to
other women: this may be detrimental if she thinks your sister is
against it. Consider it...

>Will send/attach asap-zo. I also got some progress pics of my working out,
>that you can post on your wall to give the borefriend some perspective after
>the Grace O'Malley's escapade. See if I can dig that stuff up pour vous..
Don't acknowledge the borefriend. I'd delete the above too.
>"What have you been up to lately?(I am referring to the things which you can
>discuss with me )."
>
>ooops.. I guess the one with me, two bar chicks, the cow, and ex-Spice Girl
pop
>sensation Geri Haliwell is off limits then..
Don';t acknowledge this either.Even with a joke. Let her own feverish
imagination wonder why you didn't respond.
>Claude... mmm.. very sexy... sounds Parisian..

>Claude: "bon soirs mademoiselle.. tu est tres belle.. voulez vous chouchez
>avec moi ce soir? "
>Liz: "I'm saving myself for Tristan from The Legends of the Fall you faggot..
>go home and jerk off little man!"
What's up with the languaging. How about ending after Legends of the
Fall. Otherwise it's trying too hard to be funny.
>
>
>omg, the funniest thing just happened at A&P like just yesterday.
Save the story for the phone: too long for email, and not sure again
if it's going to demonstrate the values you want to demonstrate. Fun
story, though. But, dude, why does your EMAIL TO YOUR ONE=ITIIS GIRL
not have the INTELLIGENCE and FLAIR and LIKABILITY of your postings
HERE. Trying too hard???
>OK, so now we're gonna play the questions game, since we're in different
cities
>and we got nothing better that we can do from here.. So I'm gonna ask you some
>questions, and you gotta gimme back some cool replies for each question that
>don't put me to sleep .. zzzzzzzzzz
>
>hmm.. lemme think of some good ones..
>
>Questions game (give direct answer, and then why):
This is TOO much to respond too. Who has time, esp with school

starting. And it's clear that you are trying to SNEAK in sexual ones.
Better idea: Start the questions game via email. You each get to ask
each other ONE question. The rules are: 1. THey have to be something
that lets a skeleton out of the closet. Good, provocative, revealing
questions. 2. You can't ask a question the other person has asked (or
a slightly altered version of the exact same question) 3. She goes
first. Usually,this is done face to face in isolation with the HB.
But maybe it can work via email.
Anyway, man, my feeling is this: you've already been with her, right?
And known her for so long. You don't NEED to get to know her anymore.
You need to be SEDUCING her. You need to SEE her. Find a way to SEE
her. In the meantime, read:
The Art of Seduction

The Sexual Key
Check out the LANGUAGING in the sexual key. Speak to chicks in their
language, the world of feelings. From this and your ICQ post, I think
you still have GUILT and it doesn't feel RIGHT when you talk in the
language of feelings and deep inner needs. Try doing it without
apology. FInd the post Kooper (I think it was Kooper) did (maybe in
field reports) on talking to his MLTR after reading the Sexual Key;
they were discussing magazines, I think.
Hope this is in time. Feel free to use any advice you like; and
disregard what you don't agree with.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 05 Sep 2002 23:34:00 GMT
subject: When HBs go GM
Every now and then, as soon as you approach an HB, she gets sexual
right away with talk. Not trying to turn you on or go kino, but simply
being very open and frank and joking about sex. I don't know if I need
to give examples, but we've all met them: right away, they start
talking dirty or showing off their ass or being super frank about sex.
And, this does NOT mean that they're easy; it's just that it's what
they do, sometimes even as a cover up for their own prudishness.

Anyway, the question is this: How do YOU respond when the HB starts
sexual talking right away. Because, with THESE types of women, it does
NOT mean you're in AT ALL. Because right now they'll talk the talk,
but not walk the walk. The two responses are:
1. You continue the sexual talk. But this means that you are playing
HER game, and it seems like you are getting EXCITED by it, so
immediately you're ejected in her mind as another horny AFC loser.
2. You shut it down or ignore it. But this is bad too, because then
you are showing a total lack of sexuality. You are dry, boring, stale,
and not sexual. You've killed the dynamic and rapport.
Other options are:

1. Cold-reading: In other words, you point out to her how she does
this, and say that a lot of people who say this are usually the least
sexual, while the girls who seem totally prudish and shy are the most.
Then maybe challenge her on talking the talk but not walking the walk.
[OH SHIT, I JUST REALIZED THE ANSWER TO THIS POST AS I WROTE IT..IT'S
#2 HERE. I USUALLY DO #1, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHY I DIDN'T THINK OF DOING
THE BELOW BEFORE]
2. Cocky/funny: the David D' thing. Pretend like she's trying to turn
you on, but you won't fall for that because you're not easy and a
piece of meat.
What are the observations of others here on women who go GM on YOU

right away? What type of women do you think they are? And how do you
usually handle it?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 07 Sep 2002 10:23:00 GMT
subject: Re: When HBs go GM
Smithy, Kooper, and Psychobabble, good responses. You guys defintely

know the type, which is
not this, but I like these types of girls:

>I have come across two basic types of immediate sexual talk from chicks.
There
>are some chicks that seem to be just 'open' about sex. These chicks, however,
>don't feel the need to 'prove anything' to guys or PUSH sex talk. I treat
>these chicks like anyone else. I might try to find out where there 'line' is
>by asking them a few questions or throwing out a couple of comments,
>particularly if I'm not sure if they just happen to be comfortable talking
>about sex and the like or if they are the other type of chick I have met.
Yes, THESE, but it's probably not as malicious as you portray it here:
>The other type I have come across is the type of chick that wants to turn the
>tables on men, using sex talk as a weapon to embarrass us. In my experience,
>these chicks usually pull this shit when they have an audience. They want to
>see you fall on your ass so to speak, and they want their friends to watch
them
>make it happen to you. They throw out sex talk trying to get you to turn red,
>stutter, fumble, change the subject, or whatever. These chicks have caught me
>off guard in the past and had quite a bit of fun doing so. It must be quite
>empowering for a chick to do this. However, if she can't stand the heat......
Haven't come across this:

>There are also undercover dykes, or whatever who will do this shit attempting
>to emasculate you. Maybe it's some chicks out on the town for the night and
>they want to humiliate guys, or some chick that just doesn't like you for
>whatever reason, and has chosen this tactic rather than ignoring you to try to
>make you get lost. THIS type of chick I would advocate that you turn up the
>fucking heat. If you started off with the coy type talk, and the chicks
seemed
>to be not behaving as 'women' but as mean people who happen to be chicks, I
say
>they are out to turn you on and turn you down, or have some fun at your
>expense. I say turn up the heat on chicks like this, or just walk if you
>prefer, as soon as you are reasonably certain that you are not going to get in
>with the chicks.
>For me it's not much of a problem, because I just recently started actually
>TALKING to chicks during PU. For a long time my 'game' consisted of running
my
>"Ug, ug" pattern on chics, doing a dick point, and fucking. I still don't
>really 'work' at getting in with a chick or group of chicks, unless I'm not in
>PU mode and am having fun fucking around and not really trying to close
anyone.
LOL!!!
>Style, you seem to be the type of guy with a good verbal game. I don't know
>you, and since I just recently started speaking the english language to

chicks,
>instead of caveman speak that I was comfortable with, I don't have a natural
>modulator built in from that perspective. The modulator I'm speaking of is
the
>one that I use to determine when I switch from either testing out the waters
to
>see where the chicks limits are, or from playing coy and innocent to turning
>the tables on the chick and deciding that I want to put her in check mate,
>stump her, or make her embarrassed in front of her friends.
Yes, language IS my game. But, now, since my language is pretty tight,

as I speak, I'm watching and monitoring and adjusting my body
language, so that I can be MORE caveman.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 07 Sep 2002 10:24:00 GMT
On Fri, 06 Sep 2002 09:27:00 -0400, Sabel wrote:
>If you feel that she's playing a little shit game, then laugh at her :
>
>"Haaaa if you think I'am that easy!!!..."
>
>After that, set a light at the end of the tunnel :
>
>"... well may be later... if I find you nice enough...".
>
>To be delivered with proper tonality and face.
Yes, I like THIS response the best. What I NORMALLY do is what C. Zap
recommends. But I like doing this: flipping the script on her.
Good....
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>

Sat, 07 Sep 2002 10:26:00 GMT

On Fri, 06 Sep 2002 10:09:00 -0400, Eddy wrote:
>I have met a few chick that goes all sexual within 10 minutes into the
>conversation. one girl even go as far as, " I love having sex with strangers,
>it totally turns me on. You can find most of these type of girls at bars and
>sometimes at single's coffee place. To the best of my recollection ( I haven't
>sarge at bars for a long long time now) most of these girls are loud and very
>touchy touchy. I wasn't reading ASF at the time but I think it would be pretty
>easy to get a fclose from this type of girls as they are probably very
>receptive to kinos and negs, and enjoy physical contacts.
>
Yes, this is a DIFFERENT type of chick. These are the types you HOPE
to meet: a few months ago, I met a girl who told me straight up that
she once pulled a guy into the bathroom at the bar and had sex with
him. I * and #closed her (though not hot enough to really follow up
with), but I realized that it WAS an invitation to do the same with
her. So you have to be able to tell: which one is sexually adventuous
and giving you an opportunity, and which just likes to tease sexually
to see if she can make you uncomfortable or turned on or both.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 07 Sep 2002 10:30:00 GMT
On Fri, 06 Sep 2002 21:56:00 -0400, Vegeta wrote:
>
>*She is talking ANYTHING sexual...and u notice she is trying to turn u on....
>
>You:Ok,*laugh*, lets not talk about this anymore
>(She will of course be puzzled as to why you don't want to talk about that)
>Her:Why not?
>You:Because I've had more than enough experience w/ this and I know how
FUCKING
>IMPOSSIBLE it is to get a horny chick off of me.....

I think I understand this. Is this script right:
PUA: Let's change the subject.

HB: Why?
PUA: Because I've had a lot of experience with this, and if you keep
talking like that around me, you're actually going to end up turning
YOURSELF on, and I've been fighting off enough horny chicks tonight.
Seriously. A girl just asked me if I would take her sister home with
me. I was like, "What am I going to do with another sister?."
>Say this light heartedly...If anyone thinks it sounds better reworded...be my

>guest, but please post ur variation...
PS The sister joke isn't mine. I forget what PUA the credit should go
to.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 10 Sep 2002 00:29:00 GMT
subject: When She Brings a Friend
Okay, curious as to how others handle this. I BLEW UP (in the good
way) a set a couple weeks ago, and met a really cute Asian HB. Since
then, she's been out of town, but emailed me to make a plan because
she arrives in town today. So we were going out tonight, and it seemed
like a sure thing. MLTR material. Now she emails and says she's
bringing a friend. I'm sure this is because her own anxieties are
kicking in--she doesn't know me and hasn't seen me for two weeks. (Is
this FIM? What does FIM stand for--Female -something- Mechanism?) But,
two questions:
1. How do you handle it when this is brought up. I think if there

hasn't been a clear SOI (just a presumed one), you can't really shut
it down.
2. Obviously, it's easy to go along, win the friend's approval, etc.

But, because she is busy and I am busy, I want there to be some type
of physical closing tonight. How do you deal with the friend's
presence here? I would just bring another PUA, but can't think of the
right person who can do this at the last minute right now.

CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 10 Sep 2002 10:22:00 GMT
subject: Re: When She Brings a Friend
Great responses, and so varied. Anyway, a few things of clarification

first: Since the "date" was her suggestion and her idea (she did all
the follow up after meeting), I did not have the option of being
indignant about the friend. It's her frame, and maybe I shouldn't have
let her have it, but on the other hand it's nice for her to have the
perception that she is chasing me and asking me out. She's Asian, but
pretty much western-minded. Very outgoing and flirtatious. But maybe,
as advised here, email was too IMPERSONAL to be making plans on. Good
point for future reference, because sometimes I use it when it's
easier. Thx.
Psychobabble, you write: "This has personally never happened to me,

then again I mostly go on 'dates' over chicks houses." How do you
work this for the first meeting?
I also wish I read the posts on sarging others while I'm with them.
Would have been fun, and made them value the company more. Plus it
would have been so easy.
Like Alessandro says, the friend was to check me out. It meant I was
in, but it was also for safety, I think. My mistake here maybe was
STOPPING the sarge once she was trying to close me on a date, so that
I didn't SOI or build more comfort/rapport etc. On the other hand, I
discovered that she just got divorced (older than she looks-30) and
has a boyfriend in another city. Her friend was married. And, of
course the friend is a shit test, and you HAVE TO allow it if it's
unavoidable and work within that constraint.
All went well. The friend clicked with me, of course. And it worked
nicely, because I could reward and punish by paying attention to the
friend. And after going out, we all went back to my house. Here's
where I wasn't prepared. Lots of kino, some drinking, but every time
I'd try to get us all together on the couch, someone would get up to
do something or go smoke a cig. I felt like a threesome was possible,
but I didn'[t know how to swing it. I didn't know how to TRANSITION
into it. I felt like this was their night out (on a work night even),

and something COULD HAVE happened if I knew how to work it. I was in
control, I upped the romance vibe, I kino'ed the hell out of both of
them (with no negative response), but just couldn't figure out the
transition steps into threesome. It also sucks because, if the friend
hadn't been there, it would have been a full close for sure.
But all is good: they want to have a slumber party here later. They
say they have another married friend who will love me. I'm at a
dangerous tipping point here: between experienced mysterious sexual
fantasy man and fun neutered friend. So I NEED to figure this out for
next time. Suggestions?
When will this game EVER be mastered? So many little pieces!
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 24 Sep 2002 16:42:00 GMT
subject: Re: sarged beach, coffeehouses, bar (long day FR)
Manifestis,
Some quick thoughts:
Your sarges got better as you went. Nice job on the approaches and the
fearlessness.
My thought from reading this is that it is time for you to CHANGE your
learning process. Cool. You have a lot of material, you have a lot of
lines, you have games and stories. Now, stop memorizing, and start
working on some big chunks. From the sound of this, you are not
CALIBRATING the women right. IOW, if you asked for the number THAT
many times, you should have gotten it at least a FEW times. When you
went for the *close, she shouldn't have been SO surprised. So, before
the *close, were you kino'ing and escalating kino? More important, in
general, are you looking for IOIs?
For example, when I'm in a set, I KNOW when a woman is going to give
me her number. And, if I'm pulled out of a set, I know where I am: if
it's time for a #close, a *close, or even if I need TWO more minutes
to buld the comfort and rapport that it would take for a #. Speaking
of this, hwo are your RAPPORT skills. Are you getting rapport with

these girls?
Right now, it sounds to me, that they enjoy your company, like some
random unusual funny guy you meet at a bar. And you might enjoy seeing
him again whenever you go to the bar, because he makes it fun and
gives it personality. But you wouldn't leave him in your house alone.
BTW, that lesbian girl sounds like a missed opportunity. For what
exactly, I'm not sure--haven't sarged lesbians. There is a subtext
there that I can't pick up on because I wasn't there, but they were
kissing for YOUR benefit.
What can you do to:

A. Better read their signals and level of interest, and modify your
game accordingly.
B. Be a guy who they would trust alone in their house when they are
not there.
C. Turn them on. IOW, kino better, so that it leads naturally to the
kiss.
On Tue, 24 Sep 2002 06:04:00 -0400, Manifestis3 wrote:
> I went sarging all day basically. Started off hitting chicks at the beach.
>The first one I approached was a 2 set (HB8 and HB7)…went in asking for a
pizza
>they had…they gave me a slice and I started fluffing…turned out HB8 was
engaged
>so I started paying more attention to the HB7…I got the number but I called
>immediately…turned out it was fucking a number for home depot…fuckers!
> The next chick I approached was this chick from North Carolina and turns out
>she was leaving tommorow…I got a pretty good conversation with her…I was
>thinking of fucking her while talking to her in a deep tonality…we fluffed and
>I teased her a lot for being from North Carolina and being a redneck in a
>playful way…I then went into favorite actors and her favorite was Nicholas
>Cage…I asked her how she would try to seduce him if he was right in front of
>her…she said she would be speechless…then she said she liked bad boys…we were
>talking far from the beach…but we checked out the sunset and we walked
together
>to sit down in front of the sunset…she started videotaping the sunset and I
>told her my tattoo story…she laughed and said that was the best story…I then
>played the questions game with her…found out about how many boyfriends she
>had…she said she had 4 serious boyfriends…she asked me if I had a girlfriend
>and I lied that I was dating a few…then I said some patterning language about
>how you can be friends with someone for a long time but suddenly for whatever

>mysterious reason, they start to look different…the more you talk to this
>person, the more attracted you get…I told it may be the color of his eyes or
>descriptive feature of his face…she was giving me great eye contact and giving
>the DDB look…I then asked her how she rated herself as a kisser…she said she
>didn’t know because she never kissed herself and I replied “let’s find out”
and
>moved in for the kiss…she resisted and said she wouldn’t kiss me…she fucking
>left after that…
> I then later saw this HB8.5 walking pretty fast barefoot while holding cool
>Nike Shoes…I went up to her and while walking with her (follow the chick), I
>asked her about her shoes…if it was basketball shoes or not…she said she was a
>runner…I asked her why she wasn’t running in this great foggy weather…she said
>she just came from the airport and wanted to walk…I went playful by saying
“you
>know what…let’s race…let’s find out who’s faster…I’ll give you a 2 second
>start…” She said she didn’t want to race so I commented “That’s probably
>because you know I will beat you…” and she agreed with me…I saw her holding a
>bottle of water so I commented “wo…you have water…I am so thirsty…can I have a
>sip? You know I don’t want to drink ocean water…it’s too salty…” She then
>gave me the waterbottle and said I could keep it…I told her “you can take it
>back…I’m human just like you…” She said she didn’t know me…so I went playful
>again by saying “So you ever drink ocean water? How do you like it?” She
said
>she did in a playful way…and we were walking for like 2 minutes together so
>far…I had to go somewhere else so I closed by saying “Well…it was nice meeting
>you…is there a way we can talk again?” Got the # close…that was the quickest
>close I got…I also hugged her and kissed her on the cheek…
> I then went to Starbucks and got some coffee…I saw this two set sitting down
>about to study with big books…the HB7 had a shirt with her college name on it
>“Grossmont”…I went up to her and said “Let me guess which college you go
>to…Grossmot?” She played back by saying “Yeah…wow…how’d u get it right?” I
>said “I know a lot of stuff…I’m psychic…” The HB6 said it was probably the
>piercings I had that gave me the psychic energy…we fluff talk and I am being
>energetic and random…turns out the HB7 is an avid runner and I do some
>patterning language about having a runner’s high…when they asked me what I
>wanted to be, I said “I want to be a magician.” The HB7 laughed and said that
>I was so random and brave to just go up and talk to people…unfortunately,
these
>chicks turn out to be super Christian girls…they start talking about religion
>and we start getting in a debate…I tell them that I believe in New
Age…anyways,
>they invite me to come over their church…they give the directions and shit but
>I’m not gonna pursue these religious chicks…
> I go to another coffee shop…I find a 2 set sitting at a table (HB8 and
>UG5)…there’s an empty chair and I asked them if anyone was sitting there…the
>HB8 lies to me that she’s waiting for another friend…there was a bag on her

>chair so I asked “Is your bag rested?” in a joking way…she laughs…this whole
>time, I kept the TENSION in order to develop the ATTRACTION…turns out UG5 is a
>lawyer and friend of HB8 because she’s going through some shit with her
>job…anyways, she asks me what I do…I say I major in psychology and I wanted to
>learn the art of persuasion and teach it to people…I joke that the reason why
>people join psychology is because they have personal problems and want to
>figure themselves out in a weird way…and I comment “Obviously, I’m the
>exception…I mean, I’m normal…you know what I mean?” All the while, I see
these
>two guys smiling and looking at me because they know I am sarging these
>chicks…I tell my tattoo story and the HB8 starts laughing and having a fun
>time…I also tell them about what I’m planning on to get over it…a monkey
>meditating with a number three in it…I said that number 3 was my religion back
>in the days and I had to touch a person three times to complete my number 3
>religion…they start laughing and looking at me kind of funny…I forgot her name
>so I say “So you’re name is Sandy right?…you look like a Sandy…” She laughs
>and I comment that she must be from Arkansas, probably a redneck…she laughs
and
>I say “well…white people look all the same to me…” So then I tried closing
HB8
>by saying “Well…is there a way we can talk again?” She says she comes to that
>coffee shop a lot but I then try to close again by saying “Is there a way I
can
>get your number, Sandy?” She laughs and said she had a boyfriend…I commented
>“You’re probably like other girls just settling for less.” The UG5 says he’s
>not “less.” So I eject by saying “I love the feeling of rejection!” They
>laugh…
> I see two beggars on the street so I sit down next to them and start
talking…I
>give them some cigarettes and we talk for like 20 minutes…I then see HB8 and
>UG5 passing by and UG5 says hi to me…the HB8 says “Bye BJ” and waves at me…it
>looked like she liked me because she was smiling a lot when she said
that…maybe
>the fact that I was talking to beggars made her feel like I was a cool guy who
>talked to everybody…
> I then see this HB8 standing waiting for people at a bar…I go up to her and
>ask her about her tattoo…I tell her about my tattoo and go in the number 3
>routine…I say give me five and take away my hand every time so she misses it…I
>then say “We got to do it 2 more times to finish my routine…” Everytime she
>misses I said “Rejection…hahaha” in a playful way and she is smiliung. She’s
a
>computer programmer so I tease her that she must be a nerd who never goes out
>So we do it two more times playfully…her friends show up and they start
>talking…I start talking to one of the guys about his shirt…they’re about to go
>into the bar so I try to close by saying “Well…Elaine (whatever her name is),
>is there a way we can talk again?” She was in front of her friends so I think

>she kind of got self-consicous…she said she’ll see my again around this bar…I
>say “well…okay…nice meeting you…” and when I leave, I yell “Rejection!” She
>laughs and turns around to smile back at me…
> Now it’s time to go the bar…I sarge two girls sitting down and turns out they
>have a guy friend with them…I sit with them anyways…fluff for a while…they are
>surprised that I am here by myself and I comment that I like going out by
>myself because I kind do my own thing…they ask me what I do…I play the cube
and
>strawberry game…the HB8 has a boyfriend…fuck! I need to check out the
>boyfriend destroyer…
> I talk to a 3 set (HB8.5 HB7 HB7.5) One of the guys said he was going to
>approach them but he didn’t so I said “Okay…I will then…” I approach with
“How
>you girls doing? What’s your name…well let me guess…Susan, Campbell, Erin”
>They start laughing and asking me why I named them Campbell and I say “cuz you
>look like a girl who likes to eat Campbell soup all the time” I was being
>energetic/enthusiastic all the time and the guys around me are surprised about
>how I’m doing well…well, I touch HB8.5’s necklace and the HB7.5 says “No!
>Don’t touch!” in a playful way…I comment “wo okay…is my hand going to burn if
I
>do it again?” and I like my hand is burning in a fire…they laugh and one of
the
>guys who was with them was like “Is there a mute button to you?” I say
>“Actually there is, but it just broke…I’m sorry man…you’ll just have to deal
>with that…” and I start playing games with them as having weird names…I say my
>name is BJ and she should hold her hormones on check because I knew she was
>getting excited by the way she was smiling that evil smile…they laugh but then
>the HB7.5 says “Wait…aren’t your friends over there?” indirectly telling me to
>eject…So I say “yeah…but you guys are my new friends” They don’t really give
>me an attitude but I decided to eject…all the guys there then wanted to shake
>my hand for having game…I didn’t even close…wtf?
> All the while I was doing the sarging with the 3 set this HB6 was checking me
>out…I sit down in another 3 set group and she was part of it…anyways, she
>wanted a lighter and asked me so I said “Well…not for you…” She gave me this
>intimidating look on purpose…then she said she was going to play that soccer
>game where you play with hands (don’t know what it’s called)…I commented that
I
>was best at it and could kick her ass…she said she could beat me…so we
>went…turns out two other guys were there…so I said “I want to compete against
>HER!” She gave me this look like she wanted to play with me so I said
>“Alright…we should be teammates…now we all love each other” and we hugged and
I
>kissed her cheek…we lost! After playing the game, I started talking to her
>again…she was talking about her nursing job and how she thought it was
>important for everyone to defend themselves…I commented “you must be pretty
>AGGRESSIVE” with a tiger look with using my hands as claws…she plays the game

>back…she is kinoing back and I’m kinoing her while we are talking…then she
asks
>me what I do and I say I’m an ass model…she fucking believes me and says to
>turn around…I turn around and she grabs my ass saying it’s really nice…I ask
>her to turn around too and she says she doesn’t have a nice ass…she turns
>around and I grab her ass…felt nice…anyways, I go cocky/funny by saying “You
>love my ass, don’t you?” She says I’m funny and we start hugging…I kiss her
on
>the cheek and I say “I like your lips…let’s do a real kiss” Turns out this
>chick is a lesbian! She says she’s a lesbian and is with her girlfriend
>(HB7)…I then say “but I know a lot of lesbians who turn bi after meeting me”
>She laughs and goes to talk to her girlfriend…they start kissing each other in
>the mouth and she ejects.
> I then talk to this 42 year old chick…she looked like she was in her 30s…I do
>gunwitch style by thinking of fucking her…I start doing the spells routine…and
>talking about the energies of this universe (New Age metaphysics shit)…she
>totally believes it but she said “I know you’re fucking around but it’s true
>what you’re saying…” I then talk about that I can’t stand girls who don’t
>follow the natural way and just flow with the universe and go into the Natural
>Woman pattern…she doesn’t give me much IOIs…but basically, the whole time I am
>very serious and doing RJ type of patterning language…she doesn’t seem to
>become AROUSED by it…she talked about liking melons and I should have gone to
>the BJ pattern but I thought it was way too early in the sarge…she ends up
>going home with her friends…I even thought of whispering to her “So…let’s go
to
>my place and talk” but I was too chicken…next time, I will…I’m getting
rejected
>anyways…so what?
> I didn’t do much successful sarges today so I don’t think this field report
>may help others but that’s the point…this is just a field report that I had
>today…any suggestions would be appreciated…I feel like I can keep interesting
>conversations by keeping the TENSION (by being eccentric or energetic)…but
it’s
>not enough to get a close…guys, I would like your comments…thanks
>
>
>manifestis3
>
>"I live my reality and you are my guests..."
>
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 25 Sep 2002 11:03:00 GMT

subject: Re: sarged beach, coffeehouses, bar (long day FR)
On Tue, 24 Sep 2002 17:23:00 -0400, psychobabble wrote:
>HAHAHAHAHAHA no offence Style, I think your advice rocks but my SISTER'S wont
>even leave me alone in their houses HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAA j/k
Point taken. Exaggerated the idea for Manifestis, but something is

coming off wrong here and they are not comfortable with him. Not sure
why. But, Manifestis, I will be at the LA things, so we'll meet then
and figure it out.
Come to think of it, one beautiful older woman I sarged was like
super-paranoid. She just wanted sex, and was looking for concealed
video cameras and things. Strange. Yeah, she wouldn't have trusted me
alone at her house, true, but at the same time she wouldn't have been
over and doing all that if there wasn't some degree of COMFORT and
RAPPORT (even if just physical) going on).
>Would you let ME stay in your house alone?
No, but for different reasons: it would reek of cigar smoke after you
left.
> BTW is that chick of yours in

>Boston yet? hehehe
She'd eat you alive.
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 28 Sep 2002 01:01:00 GMT
subject: Comments on Maniac's bi sarge
1. I'm wondering what Bibabe said to HBexciteme when you went to the
bathroom. It seems like some type of SOI or statement or agreement
must have been made. Because when you returned, and the whole leg
over yours thing ensued, it was just ON.
2. What I like most, and learned best, from this report was how you
conducted them. Held both their hands, put their hands on top of each
other, etc. I wonder how PLAYING Mr. Smooth with two girls would work

in the future. In other words, Mr. Smooth'ing Bibabe in with another

target, esp since Mr Smooth always gets the girl into the
SPEAKER/INSTIGATOR as well. Anyway, will definitely start physically
placing HB's hands on each other etc when I do this. Nice.
3. The only mistake you made her is this: Let it be BIBABE'S

EXPERIENCE, not yours. Seem to be doing this all for her, not you. As
Rick H says, let her be the lead sled dog. Then you won't have these
feelings. Continue, in bed, to orchestrate for the two of them to get
together, don't get lost to your animal desires if possible. If you
are always conscious to make it her experience, she will ALWAYS want
to do this with you! IOW, at first at least, act as if you are the
intermediary--the conscious rationalization--for them to have this
lesbian experience. This is what has worked for me in my little
experience with this. So the rule to take away: Make it THEIR
experience.
Nice job, though, turning an unplanned obstacle into an unplanned

opportunity! A lesson for all here!!
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 04 Oct 2002 03:10:00 GMT
subject: Re: Gunwitch method kinda embarrassing, FUNNY
On Mon, 30 Sep 2002 17:21:00 -0400, Eddy wrote:
>So I'm about to go into her car, cause I'm fucking going INSANE to nail this
>old chick, but I'm just trying to look REALLY close at her face, just to see
if
>it looks nice still because of makeup or if its cause she's actually nice
>looking. You can see this chick dresses all easy-breasy-young-style and tries
>really hard to take amazing care of her body (tanned, good hair, clothes etc)
>so I gotta be sure what's up.
Dude, are YOU seeing THIS theme yet? You are LOOKING for a reason not
to fuck her. You are TALKING YOURSELF out of it every time for some
reason. I know I've written this to you before, but each example gets
more blatant.
I'm sure this is true of others here besides me who have slept with

10s, but there is going to be a point somewhere before you've laid

them when they don't look attractive at all to you. I'm not saying you
should sleep with everyone you can, but there's something going on
here with you. You may know; if you don't , I'll figure it out when we
meet.
>It looked like she's nice looking, but it was still WAY fucked for me to fuck
a
>chick that should be my mom. So I say "listen HBareyoumymom?, I have
something
>really pressing, and I just wanted to go home with you, but we'll start doing
>the whole chill thing after classes maybe, cause I'm too busy right now."
>She's like "ok" and I hop out.
>
>Sorry guys, just TOO FUCKED UP for me to fuck a chick that's 15 years older
>than me. I need more time to think about what I want from her.
>
>FUNNY SHIT though, getting all hard like that. I had to reach down and adjust
>myself before I could even go back into public.
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"Style" <0>
Sun, 06 Oct 2002 02:03:00 GMT
subject: Re: Korean double LR/Tutorial (Part 2: TokyoPUA)
On Tue, 01 Oct 2002 02:50:00 -0400, Tokyopua wrote:
>She asked me what I do for a living and I replied, she asked if I make good
>money, I said “good enough”.
Out of curiousity, this sends up big gold-digger warning signs in my

mind. Out of curiousity, since you spent a few nights with her, how
much was this true? And if it was, was it enough for her just to know
that you HAD money (comparatively) or was she after spending it? Or am
I off about this, but why else would she hang out in ritzy hotel
lounge? That's what the golddiggers do here.
>I touched her hands and told her how I liked her soft skin. This also let me
>do my standard hand size comparison routine, getting more kino and of course
>hinting to her (at least on a subconscious level) that I am “larger” than the
>average Asian guy. I ran my hand up her bare arm and she smiled and asked if
I

>wanted her to come closer.
IMHO, you were IN already here. The rest of this PU, to me, is just
avoiding the roadblocks. I always think that once an HB is ready for
sex, most guys can't get there. There are often about 20 roadblocks
and barriers between the moment she's interested (which may be even
BEFORE she walked in the bar, saw you, or met you) and the moment you
close the deal. A lot of PUA is just handling those roadblocks and
objections and crisis moments, all of which you did nicely here.
>She mentions at some point about having had a sort of bad day so here I do
some
>of Ross’s SS stuff (we had just attended the Montreal Seminar the week before,
>see our separate reviews on the site), just patterning on the fly, with some
>submodality and visualization. “So where in your body do you feel that bad
>feeling?“ She felt it in her upper chest. “And as you notice what color it is,
>can you tell me what color that is? “Grey” I asked what shape. “Like needles”.
>(I had just learned from Ross that its important to get the HB giving input
and
>“ratifying” the process, in order to make it more real for them, so that is
why
>I keep asking her for these descriptions.)
>So I said “OK, here is what we are going to do. I am going to take my hand,
>and put it right here up against your chest” (this was a nice intimate kino op
>as well), “and I am going to just pull those needles out of you, OK?” She
>smiled and said yes, appearing very enthusiastic about the idea. “Ok, now I am
>going to pull my hand away. Wait, I think there are more in there, so let me
>get them all.” Then I take my hand away and say “ And now you can notice that
>as I pull my hand farther away, that the feeling goes away. But if I move it
>closer it comes back just a little.” (This stuff was a direct adaptation of
>something Ross was doing in the Montreal seminar.)
Dude, do you see what you are doing here? This CRACKS me up. You are
anchoring her BAD FEELINGS to your HAND. When your hand is close, she
feels those needles. When it's away, she doesn't.
So that tells me that some of these demos and fancy psychological

things aren't sneaky ways to get her addicted to you or want you, but
just ways to make you interesting and different than anyone else.
Because, obviously, if this was powerful, she'd feel bad-day tension
whenever your hand was near her chest!!
>She nodded her head and I

>continued, “So now I am going to ensure that the feeling never comes back, so
I

>am going to take these needles and put them far away in the dirt here. And now
>I think I can see a glowing feeling here in your chest where those needles
>were.” She was definitely intrigued by all this, and said she felt much
>better. She had that relaxed look on her face that Ross likes to call DDB
(the
>Doggy Dinner Bowl look).
>who can say no to a super hot aerobics instructor

>who wants to do a striptease for you in the Seoul moonlight? J I have to add
>here that she gets an extra rating point for being able to stand on one leg
>while holding the other leg over her head while I banged her (a new experience
>even for me), so to me she is like a 10.5! Also, I elicited on later nights
>that she may have bi-tendencies, so basically this chick is just off my
>scale!!!
Dude, I am very JEALOUS of this one. It's moments like this that make
the whole game worth it. Nice FR, great detail.
On a last note, my game lately has been what I call TWO FOR TWO. In
other words, with my wings (mystery, swinggcat, nightlight9, whoever),
we've been going for two-sets and then BOTH ending up with the girls.
One HB's behavior ratifies the others behavior and allows them to go
further. IOW, at first, since your girl was into you, it gave
Formhandle's girl permission to be into him. Then, since Formhandle's
girl was going up to his room, it gave your girl permission to go up
to yours. Don't know if this was definitely a factor in your PUs, but
I'm finding it to be true.
Plus, it's fun to share with your friend and both have great girls,
and date them together, etc. I may do a big post on TWO FOR TWO method
some point soon.
Nice work, TPUA! See you again soon...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
Wed, 09 Oct 2002 21:59:46 GMT
subject: Re: Formal Challenge to Ray from Mystery
amoderncaveman@aol.com (A Modern Caveman, aka: Raytardo) wrote in message news:

<20021009105309.05800.00000323@mb-mm.aol.com>...
>>
> I think I'll stay here and keep showing everyone what a pathetic little asshole
> you are.
>
i.e. you won't accept his challage Ray, because you know Mystery is
the man and he'd swat you down like the bug you are.
Too bad, I would have love to see the squishing!
-Tigerstyle
"life's too short to dance with ugly women."
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 22 Oct 2002 06:17:00 GMT
subject: Re: Any PUA's in Austin, TX?
Met Firefly in Austin. Great guy, been around a while, fearless on

approaches, strong game. I've been disappointed with a lot of guys
I've met in the community, not Firefly. Interesting as a person too.
If you're in Austin, definitely email him!
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 22 Oct 2002 06:28:00 GMT
subject: To Get To Her House
Made up on the spot this weekend (a variation on a line I read

somewhere in the archives). Worked well, so adding it to my game.
Anyway, in bar, on a good night, and one girl is giving me all the
IOIs and watching when I'm with other HBs. She's the best in the
place: dark skinned, thin, white dress, white go-go boots. Says she's
getting a drink, I come with, and just for the hell of it, say:
"If I let you take me home tonight, will you feed me?"

She just backs off and gives me a funny look. But my confidence is
high. I say, "What do you have to eat?"
She says, "Really?"
I say, "Really."
She says, "Chicken, spinach, cheerios, rice krispies..."
Now I know I am IN. This works MUCH better than other lines ("will you
keep me" I think is in the archives), because now you're talking about
FOOD. Disarms chick logic, because she's just feeding you, after all.
Then when you ask what she has to eat, you're waiting for the
IOI/response. (You also have a c/f out: if she says she just met you,
you can say, " So it's too soon to eat with me; what were YOU thinking
of?")
Anyway, it was awesome. A half hour later, I suggested leaving. She

waited upstairs while I said my goodbyes (rounding up three #s) then
went to her house. She fed me (chicken and spinach) and just WATCHED
me eat. After, she goes, "Are you done?"
I say, "Yes."
Then she says, "Let's go." And we get into her bed. It was SO nice
just knowing the !close is in the bag and being able to take MY time.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 22 Oct 2002 06:33:00 GMT
subject: Sarging Celebs (response to FRs)
Been off the board for a while. Noticed the new trend towards
aggressiveness. Interesting. Anyway, also saw a few FRs (gunwitch,
pfal) in trying to sarge celebs. Listen, there are a lot of methods
here, and I'm realizing how to work them ALL into my game. I use a
combo of mys, ss, cocky/funny, and now trying to work in
gunwitch-style.
Anyway, with a CELEB, you need to START OUT with group method. It is
ESSENTIAL not to approach her directly. You MUST win her friends over,
and ignore her. NOBODY does that. You must be the exception, and have
her friends/entourage talk YOU up to her. THEN, when SHE is opening
you or begging to talk to you, you can proceed with your preferred
method of seduction. But you must just shut her out and win her
group/entourage over first, so that she's intrigued and is like, "Who

is this guy?"
Otherwise, why should she bother? Because YOU think you're special or
different? You need to PROVE it first. Demonstrate value, group
alphaness, status, and/or social proof before going for it
I can elaborate on this if you want.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 22 Oct 2002 17:48:00 GMT
subject: Re: SS and GM Adventures in a strip club
Wow. I suggest that everybody read your posting history. I read some
guys here and they NEVER improve. I read yours, and you sound like a
NEW person. Like I've said, you are doing something right, and you
posted so well on it a few months ago. I suggest those who feel like
they are TREADING WATER look up the thread.
Congratulations, man. The Devilhimself I met months ago could not tear
up a strip club like that. Nice!
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 23 Oct 2002 00:29:00 GMT
subject: Re: PU'ed sexy store clerk
On Sat, 19 Oct 2002 01:24:00 -0400, TylerDurden wrote:
>
>Anyway, I need to regroup. What I'm doing isn't working well enough.
>
>So I tell her that I need to go back to my car to get some cash before buying
>these jeans, and that I'll be right back.
>
>I go out to my car, and think... "think Tyler think.. what's she given you to

>work with?.. what could work here?"
Dude, I ALWAYS do this when I'm stuck. This is what separates the
people who really learn this stuff from the hopeless. How many times
have I stood in restaurant/club/bar bathrooms, thinking, "What's my
next move?" "How do I get her home?" "What can I do to swing the
threesome?"
>Here's how I do it:

>So I walk out of the store, MINUS MY KEYS.
>
>I wave to her, so that she can CLEARLY see what direction I'm going in, and
>walk slowly once I'm out of there so she can catch up.
>
>Sure enough, she darts out to catch me, and returns the keys.
>
>I act OH SO RELIEVED, and stop her and start patterning on about what great
>character she has to chase me like that (she was actually panting).
>
>Then, I use a TYPICAL principle that I almost ALWAYS try to use when #closing
>or isolating.
>
>I tell her that she EARNED me to take her out, and show her around and have a
>great time etc..
>
This is GOLD, man. This key gambit/earning-# goes RIGHT into my game,
for when it's necessary. Nice thinking, man. Now, you DESERVE to
seduce this girl. Make it a PERSONAL project. Go ALL the way. Don't
let it slide: hopefully you called within 24 hours to reduce flaking.
Let us know what happens.
Seriously, TD, after you go out with Mys, you will be unstoppable. All
you are missing is DEMONSTRATING VALUE to get the 9s and 10s. If you
add that piece in, and can wait for the IOIs BEFORE going caveman or
showing sexual interest, you will be getting laid like a rock star.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 23 Oct 2002 00:29:00 GMT

subject: Re: To Get To Her House
Thx zap, eddy, ozwald, jimbo.
As for the other Qs,
To get her to your place, there are a MILLION techniques. Any pretext
will do. You should know these. Lately, I just suggest switching bars,
then stopping back at my place to get something on the way, then I
give her a tour. This works BEST when she meets you at your place
first, and you whisk her out in a minute without showing her around.
(This way, she has SAFETY associated with your place and CURIOSITY.)
All this has been posted on before.
As for getting the other #s. In this case, the girl was upstairs. But,
to tell the truth, I don't let it bother me anymore. As an AFC, I did.
But now, I just do what I have to do and don't worry about what she
thinks. As long as I'm not being sneaky or a dog it's okay, because
I'm just being popular. And she WON: she gets to take me home.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 23 Oct 2002 08:29:00 GMT
subject: Hooking an IOI Online?
I don't do much email sarging, but I travel a lot, and always end up
with lingering HBs who I never got to close.
Anyway, a friend's hot sister has started emailing me. Big IOI. She
emails me almost obsessively. Wants me to come visit for some event.
Lives with her parents, too, so may be tricky. Anyway, I am willing
to visit (though usually I'd have her come to me), but I want to make
sure she's thinking romance and not friendship. How do you HOOK an IOI
of that sort during email (without being too blatant or aggressive or
direct, due to knowing her sis). I know this is easy, but,...can't
seem to figure out..how to escalate the relationship and
get-agreement-on-mutual-sexual/romantic-interest via email.
Hating email, loving real life,
CPowles

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"Style" <0>
Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:49:00 GMT
subject: Re: NOT all girls can be Gunwitched...
Yes, it's a general rule: never talk about serial killers (or stalkers
etc.) with a HB you just met. Especially if you are a stranger who
wants to get her phone number or take her home...
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:54:00 GMT
subject: Re: Hooking an IOI Online?
On Wed, 23 Oct 2002 18:58:00 -0400, TylerDurden wrote:
>The point is that Chris doesn't want to travel to meet a girl for anything
>short of !close.
Yes! You get it...
>Makes sense.
>
>I guess that when it comes to chicks, there is no way to know for sure. But,
>*yeah*, having an IOI first would be alot more motivating.
>
>Just out of curiousity, why haven't you spoken to her on the phone? You'd
think
>that you could get a much better sense for it that way.
Yeah, I could do that. Good idea...
>As far as a blanket technique for securing an IOI over the internet (that has
>to be subtle given that she's a friend's sister), there's none that I can
think
>of.
>
>It has to be relative to the context (like an inside joke, that she can choose
>to respond to in a certain way if she wants to deliver an IOI).

You're right. I could either: A. Trust my gut or B. Fuck it, and just
have her come here to my turf.
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:03:00 GMT
subject: Re: Sarging Famous Pussy -
On Wed, 23 Oct 2002 18:40:00 -0400, PFAL wrote:
>
>I try to sarge female celebrities whenever I get the chance.
>
>Style is right about winning over the "hanger-ons" first.
>
>Sometimes the underlings will introduce you immediately to the celebrity as
>if you did not see her or did not recognize her, at which point you would
>probably have to "apologize" for never having seen any of their movies or
>work, though that may just make them feel like shit more than anything else.
No, do NOT refer to their celebrity at all. If (and this sometimes

happens) they bring it up, just cut her off and talk about something
else. (Sort of like stripper rules.) Only when she is BEGGING for you
to acknowledge it are you allowed.
Also, it's good after rapport to insinuate that you've dated other
celebs but are totally discrete: "If only you knew some of the people
I've dated. It would blow your mind."
Anyway, I can post a whole MO for this, but do people here want to
know as an INTELLECTUAL exercise, or are they really going to do it.
The fact is, with OUR game, once you are ALLOWED into a celeb's world
and have her focused attention, she will EAT IS UP. She's never
experienced anything like this before, because she is stuck in a
boring closed sycophantic world. You must understand her world, be
able to move through it, be unimpressed by it, and be able to take her
out of it.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 24 Oct 2002 22:11:00 GMT
subject: The Logic of Sarging
This is something I've been thinking about for a while. Then, after
reading SteviePUA's post about Poland, I decided to try to formulate
it. In his field report, on his first day there, he meets a couple
sets that are totally into him. But both times, he #closes or
cheek-kiss closes, declines their invitation to hang out more (or just
doesn't invite them to hang out more) and moves on to sarge some more.
In the end, he ends up at a dance club where it's not a good
environment for sarging, and they go back to the hotel alone. What is
our goal here? It is to get laid, to be able to travel to Poland and
find a girlfriend your first day there. Which he could have done. That
is what we are building these skills for.
So, it leads me to the question: to sarge or not to sarge. The model

here seems to be to make as many approaches as possible. But, IMHO,
that model was created for those who wanted to LEARN: to use openers,
to get comfortable with approaching women, etc. But the fact is, once
you have some skills (or maybe even if you don't), you can get laid
from your first approach.
When I go out with some sargers, we just stale out a bar or club in an
hour from approacheing everyone. There's also the vibe of walking into
a bar and just looking like desperate hunters who will only feel
validated if they talk to women. (I do LIKE and RECOMMEND what Stevie
PUA does: when talking to his wing, he doesn't look around, is very
animated, is very alpha, having a good time, intense, not needy, not
eyeballing every passing HB---VERY IMPORTANT because you are being
watched at all times).
Last night, I went out with a new PUA (not online, but I'm learning
some very important stuff from him that i will post on). We went out
with the express purpose of NOT talking to anyone but TOTALLY
observing group/couple behavoir. Try it some time: see what is working
and what isn't, and see who is succesful and who isn't, and see where
you fall in this. We watched two AFC losers get laid simply by
cornering two girls at the bar, getting them drunk, and talking their
ears off for hours. (I went into the set for fun to CB and see if our
intuitions were right.) By the end of the night, what was going to
happen was just inevitable. And even though one couple was hitting it
off and the other wasn't, they're both going to get laid because

that's just the way it works.
So I guess the point of this long rambling post is to question the

logic of sarging, of making so many approaches. The next level, IMHO,
is to be comfortable, enjoy yourself whenever you go out, talk to
people, and then select the girls you want to be with that night. Talk
to them and, over time, by reading IOIs, figure out what the best you
can do is. If you're enjoying the set, you don't even have to press it
so that if she won't go out to your car in 20 minutes, you eject. You
take your time, because you are getting lots of action as it is and
don' t have any desperation, and let the course of the night (directed
by you, of course) lead her or the group to want to continue the
adventure at your house.
You don't #close and eject in 20 minutes, you don't just decide to
push it as far as you can take it before ejecting--what you do is you
let it unfold at its own pace (using the skills you have to accelerate
it and create the attraction necessary) because you are enjoying
yourself and you KNOW you are going to get laid tonight with her. And
chances are that your chances will be good as long as you have the
skills to get past the few roadblocks that come up, esp on the
transition from bar/club/whereever to your house/hotel/whereever.
I think I'm rambling here and I'm not exactly sure what my point is.
But, basically, I just don't really like the frame of SARGING anymore.
I like to be more strategic, less desperate. It's part of my process
of becoming a TRUE PUA (and I only feel like I'm halfway there still).
Sure, it's still a numbers game, but some of those numbers are on a
clock.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 25 Oct 2002 03:12:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Logic of Sarging
To clarify, a couple more examples:
1. Out with a bunch of ASF'ers. I explode in a bar (an on night) and

meet every HB. They want to leave and go to another bar because they
are out of targets. I've approached tons of HBs to, but now it is time
to STAY and REAP the rewards. So they go, I stay and go home with
someone.

2. Meet a girl I sarged and her friends, a couple ASF'ers meet us.
There aren't any targets, so they want to go elsewhere. We leave the
girls and go to other clubs, then go home alone. And I know I could
have gone home with one of the original girls at the first place. So
why bother looking for MORE targets?
I think if you really want to make this an art and a lifestyle (and
this answers your question, Ozwald), what you want to do is CHOOSE a
bar (or, better, a lounge). Take your time and befriend bouncers and
bartenders and managers etc. Have your friends meet you there. Always
have a good time there. Always know and meet and tease all the girls
there. Be THE MAN there. Own it. And every time a new girl walks in,
she sees you and wants to be in your group, because you have the
STATUS. Then you take someone home every night. This is not "sarging,"
but it is being successful.
Direct responses:
Spirit: looking forward to hearing your thoughts. I enjoy your posts.
Ozwald: The answer is not going out with more guys (BAD--max is
three), but enjoying yourself when you're out and not scanning for
HBs. I've always said here: the best way to PU is to look as if you
have something better to do than PU.
Tunnces: Agreed. It's about making it part of your life, your
identity, who you are always. My issue is just with the idea of going
out and bum-rushing three clubs and making 12 approaches each with a
bunch of guys when you're past the learn-to-approach stage.
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"Style" <0>
Fri, 25 Oct 2002 11:52:00 GMT
On Thu, 24 Oct 2002 19:00:00 -0400, Twitch wrote:
> Let me suggest that you become a romance novelist. Paint a picture in her
mind
>of beautiful scenery (with your handsome self in it). Create some majestic
>mystery about yourself, a mystery in which she so desperately needs to
>understand that she will pay any price (mad sex) to solve and understand your
>mystery. So when your paths cross by fate (a girl that does not believe in
>faith is a girl that has a penis), she will be trembling with anticipation.
> So go out and get a romance novel ( Porn for woman), as nauseating as it

>is to read those, it does work. Use the vocabulary and the way they create
>mystery for your own email seduction. It is easy to lose interest over the
>Internet, so you have to use her imagination to keep her interest. This has
>been field tested, and it does keep them emailing back wanting more until you
>can be there in person. Also, In person, do not talk like a romance novel, you
>lose your manliness. In person, revert back to ASF. But email, you are in
>romance novel.
>
>And for fuck sake DO NOT let anybody see you buy a romance novel. :P
>
Great response. Yes, this is it. And I will do it. And for other HBs
in the future.
In the meantime, I think I've hooked the IOI. She seems to be writing
to me like a bf now. So thanks guys. With the very FEW girls I've
sarged via long-distance email (after meeting and #closing in person),
I've tried to build it up enough online so that when I meet her in the
airport, I hug, look in eyes/lips/eyes, and then just *close
(passionately) right away. Anyway, she writes: "YOU write the best
e-mails. I have enjoyed our correspondence so much. And with that
statement, I will say what joy feels like in action. It makes me
breathless -- it suspends life into this timeless moment that I know I
will savor forever. Even the small things, like getting a lick on the
nose from a dog, or bigger things, like getting a message from you...I
just cannot wait to see you!"
So I think I got my IOI...
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:50:00 GMT
subject: Re: Success, Had sex with the blonde
On Mon, 28 Oct 2002 13:49:00 -0500, Fizzy Pants wrote:

>
>So anyway my problem now is she wants a relationship from me and I don't! I
>wouldn't mind her as a FB but nothing more. I told her at the outset to keep
>her feet on the ground. Then today I', getting all these messages about this
>shit from her. So I said "I am not in a position to be anything more than this

>to you or anyone. I'm in a place in my life where I cannot be anyone's

>boyfriend" She says "OK I'll make it easy for you and walk away then..."
>
>WTF do I do??? Do I take the opportunity and run!? hurt her feelings and be
>free or try to get her for more sex? But if I say "listen lets keep things as
>they are if you can handle that then we don't have a problem" She will think
>"hmm ok I'll say yes and then I can persuade him to be whatever..." And then
>I'll have to get pissed and say "no we agreed to keep it was it was I'm going
>to have to not see you again".
No time to post. But quickly, NOW you must learn about MANAGING
EXPECTATIONS. I always tell a girl this. NOTE: DONT DO THIS WORD FOR
WORD, ITS JUST THE GENERAL IDEA OF IT: The best way to have a
successful relationship, and two people talking is a relationship, is
to have no expectations for it. To let it go where it goes naturally.
People always have to put things in a box: is this a friendship, are
we dating, are we going to get married. But that's society's rules.
The truth is that human interactions are fluid, from one extreme to
the other. And the course of any relatinship is set from the moment
you meet someone, and it unfolds naturally to where it is supposed to
go. As soon as you try to define it, then you are creating
expectations that of course won't be met because that is not reality.
For instance, if a girl meets a guy and she's looking for marriage, in
the first week, she's going to be looking at everyhing he's doing and
saying, "Can I live for the rest of my life like that?" Let's take the
time to get to know each other, let's spend more time together, and
enjoy each other's company like we are, and let this go where it is
naturally supposed to go.
Anyway, you get the idea. And I truly do believe this.
Finally, it was good of you to be clear IF you didn't lead her on to

expect something, and that seems to be the case. That said, she
shouldn't be giving you ultimatuums either. If you do want to see her
again, send her something like the above (better yet, TALK IT--email
sux and there's no pressure on her to AGREE) and then say, "I had a
nice time with you on Friday. I'd like to see you again. What are you
doing on TKTK?" If she tries to make a BF ultimatuum again, then just
shoot it down with something like, "Stop being silly and get a drink
with me. This isn't something that's decided with words, like a
business contract. Let's enjoy each other's company again." (Again,
not word for word, but mix in humor and teasing.)
It's your world, it's your frame, and I can tell that she actually
WILL accept it if you do it right, because that is WHY she is giving

you ultimatuums--to try to take her power back....
Hope this makes sense, dude. Report back.

CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:54:00 GMT
subject: Re: To Get To Her House
On Mon, 28 Oct 2002 11:48:00 -0500, Vegeta wrote:
>W/o a doubt, this is a good line....But I just dont see

>how you could use it outside of the club...ie:U meet a
>chick up for coffee, then u use that and basically say ur
>hungry??? Even though there are multiple restaurants
>around?? Or u and a chick meet for lunch?....U could
>still go to her house under another pretense but I only
>see limited applications for this line....Correct me if Im
>wrong...
You are right. Indeed, the line only works when you are somewhere at
night where there is no food. You are a genius...
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:58:00 GMT
subject: Re: LR: Eddy lays HB9 Kooper style
Nice report, man. And awesome to see you working a group instead of
the lone wolf thing. The reward is more sweet, no? And notice how you
did cocky/funny, and got rapport etc, before going Gunwitch. That to
me is the winning formula for now: get IN under the radar, and THEN go
caveman.
Finally, can't remember if I posted this at the time, but the reason
IMHO why this all worked for you is not just because of the alphaness
you displayed, it's because you got into a CONSPIRACY with the girl

and her friends. It bonds you together, makes you all seem superior
and more fun to everyone. You become partners in crime. I like trying
to find ways to do this: you and me, HB, against the world...
BTW, what's the rose pattern? Is that the one where you have her
imagine all her hopes and dreams on a rose, and then she imagines you
carrying it down to "the place where she keeps everything she knows to
be most true" and locking it in there?
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 29 Oct 2002 10:16:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Getting chicks into desired state
Dude,
First of all, I'm impressed. You have made it THIS far. Remember when
you were still trying to figure out openers and shit? And that wasn't
even THAT long ago. This is the home stretch, CB. You've really come a
long way, man, from your first posts. As I say to the HBs when I'm
being a smart-ass, "Congratulate yourself."
Okay, there are three ways to get an HB turned on that come to mind:
1. With words
2. With touch
3. With your body language (that includes EC)
First step for you is to become more sexual. Now that you know your
routines so well, next time you are delivering them on auto-pilot,
EXAMINE YOURSELF. How is your EC, how is your body language, how is
your tonality, how is your state? Try to adjust yourself to become
more sexual and seductive. (This is something I'm still working on
myself...)
Next is to make sure you are doing and escalating kino. I wrote a post
on this in the SP thread, I believe. (Do you have my evolution phase
shift routine--it rocks.)
Finally, are you TESTING for IOIs? You should look for three, and then
phase shift.

Examples of looking for IOIs:

1. Lean back when you are talking, and see if she leans towards you.
2. When you do the Cube or something, take her hand in yours. Squeeze
her hand. Does she squeeze back or let her hand hang there limply?
3. See if she holds direct EC for longer than three seconds.
4. (learned from Badboy) At some point, slap the HB a high-five when
you agree with something. Keep your hands together, and bring them
down. As they reach your waist, interlock your fingers with hers. If
she doesn't withdraw and locks her fingers too, you are IN.
If you are NOT getting any of these IOIs regularly, after 20 minutes
of talking to a girl, then you have missed something or not
demonstrated something, and you have to look at your opening and
attitude.
And it IS possible to talk to much and lose the girl by NOT taking
action, especially if you are entertaining with one gimmick after
another. Study things now like Rio's SOI and 101 theories.
Something I did to get past this point was that, after I got the IOIs,
I took on the frame that I was trying so hard to resist her charms.
It's something I learned and modified from a good friend and PUA named
Sin. Telling her things like, "I'm trying SO hard NOT to kiss you
right now." Or "don't look at me like that. What are you doing to me?
I'm talking about something important here." Or suddenly say, "I have
to get out of here."{HB: why?} PUA: You're driving me crazy." .[Hb:
what do you mean?] PUA: If you only knew the things I was thinking
about doing to you right now."
But, CB, only do these AFTER you have rapport, interest, emotional
connection, etc. And be sincere and intense and serious and confident
when you deliver them. If you are NOT getting positive IOIs, go back
and look at your game and the way you dress, act, believe...
Finally, I do not know you well enough, but I have a feeling that you,
like most of us, probably have a FUNDAMENTAL part of your self that
you NEED to change to become more successful with women. I don't know
what this is. My guess would be that you are not always great at
calibrating other people, that you don't trust your own observations
of the world enough, that you lack (on first impression) a certain
sense of depth and mystery (and can come off as too average
sometimes), and that you come off as needy in certain social
interactions instead of confident. Am I getting warm?
Out of curiosity, who was the stronger person in your household

growing up: your mother or father?

CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 01 Nov 2002 19:44:00 GMT
subject: Re: Brief threesome update
I had what should have been a complicated experience like this once.
With an ex-gf and a current FB--and BOTH were my neighbors, LOL.
However, once we hooked up, it was easy to repeat and maintain. No
stress, no worries, no awkwardness. The reason: I made it THEIR
experience. So, HBLipstick will NOT be jealous if you make this HER
experience, not YOUR fantasy. Get it?
There's a second way to do this that I learned from Steve Piccus,

which is to set down rules in which EVERYONE is equal and loved in the
relationship. This, however, assumes that they want a three way
relationship, and not just a little Zap on the side for spice every
now and then.
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 01 Nov 2002 22:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: Brief threesome update
On Fri, 01 Nov 2002 05:33:00 -0500, Commander Zap wrote:

>Afterward, I worked to reassure HB Lipstick (as I have been all along) that I
>wanted her, not the bi-GF, and pleasse remember that. She needed to hear
that,
>too; she wasn't as super-confident about it all as she has been making it out.
Been thinking more about this:
PROBLEM: HBLipstick may be jealous of other girl getting attention and

being less attractive/appealing to you.
SOLUTION: Make HBLipstick see that being with her and bi-gf makes her

MORE attractive to you.
So , follow the above advice and make it her experience, but REWARD
her for it. Use some Zan-style sweet-talk stuff about how you see her
and her sexuality in a whole new better light, and you get so much
pleasure out of seeing her take pleasure with both of you. REWARD her
afterwards with whatever talk/gestures/maybe even a present that she
likes. Dude, you can make this WORK, and make it so that HBLipstick
has INCENTIVE to make it work.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 02 Nov 2002 23:21:00 GMT
On Tue, 29 Oct 2002 06:16:00 -0500, Commander Zap wrote:
>Style, you're a natural AFC and I don't think you'll ever lay any chicks, some
>of us just don't have what it takes. Sorry.
>
>Anyway, what brought about the transition do you think, or was she sarging you
>all along (as I suspect)?
>
>I was going to suggest a question I use all the time to move things onto the
>boy-girl track: What do you like in men; what are the qualities that matter
to
>you in a man? It never fails to transition the convo in my experience.
>
>Are you going to make this eager beaver come to visit you?
>
>Zap
Zap,
I'm starting to get into an email routine, with long-distance girls

I've met briefly, and #/email closed. All I do is my value elicitation
(see in Advanced: "The Way I EV"), but ask each question in a separate
email. As I get each response, I feed her first response back to her.
I just started doing this by accident. But I figure it works because:
1. It's a fun game, something she anticipates and looks forward to
when she gets online. Usually I make her wait a little for each

response.
2. By the end, I know all her trance words, what motivates her, what
excites her, and when I'm feeding them back, it creates a connection.
In fact, in her latest email, she confesses that she "may have a
slight crush on me." So what I'm doing now is backing off, so that she
doesn't get too nervous and it doesn't build up her expectations too
high or become an online fantasy, and then at the same time, have her
so excited to just see each other at the airport that I can hug her,
look in her eyes-mouth-eyes, and just start making out. Then she
drives me to the hotel I'm staying at, and...
BTW, I'm not going just to see her. Have to take care of some other
stuff there anyway, and see one of my favorite wings in the world,
Sin.
Oh, and Walber, Zap was just kidding. But thanks, man, for getting my
back. If I ever end up in jail, you just may be my one phone call....
Out,
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
Mon, 04 Nov 2002 18:31:53 GMT
subject: Re: Why is it?
Odious <Odious@cox.net> wrote in message news:<3DC64036.92A8992D@cox.net>...

>
> Tell me newbaum, does ross go to groups about david's book to bash david,
> or does ross insult david in ASF when guys like you come here to attack
> ross as a means for generating publicity for this book?
Hey, Odious, calm down, man.

I know that ASF was started to promote Ross's material, but it's long
outgrown that purpose. I even remember Ross himself saying something
to that effect a while back. A friendly debate about what seduction
tools work should NOT involve this much smack-talk.
I'll say that I've read DYD and I think it definitely has it's merits.
Sure, I also believe that it could have been condense to 10 pages and
still said all it needs to say, but I don't see that as a problem. I
also think Ross's material has it's strengths and even "How to Suceced
with Women" is good stuff. And there's no reason to even have to

mention Mystery, we all know he has game.

But everyone here is coming off sounding like children screaming "my
daddy can beat up your daddy!" and for once it's not over Ray-ray.
You're normally a voice of reason, man, so don't lose you're cool over
someone sending smack-talk in Ross's direction. Ross has been doing
his share of trash talking too and he's a grown boy, he can handle
himself I'm sure.
-Tigerstyle
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 07 Nov 2002 18:35:00 GMT
subject: LR X 3
THREE LAYS (LONG AS A MF)
I've really been switching up my style lately as I'm getting to the

next "phase." I'm coming to this IMPORTANT realization. Patterns,
routines, and gimmicks are just things to say and do to kill time.
They are time-fillers. Sure, they make you interesting and demonstrate
value, but eventually you can just BE. So, while I've been doing the
Cube and ESP routines and all, that's just to keep my MOUTH busy while
my MIND is assessing the situation: working on body language, watching
her signals, etc. I noticed, for example, in a recent LR from a
newbie, he did Strawberry Fields on everyone and eventually took an HB
home from the bar. Now, Strawberry Fields didn't get him laid, but it
was a way to be interesting and bring up sexuality when it didn't
happen naturally.
I got into this community about a year ago, and then I started
remaking myself. Now, I've been REINTEGRATING parts of my OLD self
BACK into my NEW self. I've also been deviating from the tried and
true game, taking more chances, and trying things that almost seem AFC
at times, and they are working. Here are three recent lays, all
different yet similar, even the mistakes along the way.
1. HBRed
I had an on night at a trendy lounge, and was getting lots of
attention from the ladies. I saw a redhead surrounded by guys and went
into the set. No real opener, because I was just on and being a social
butterfly. One of the guys pointed to one of his friends and said,
"He's a player. He used to date her." So, considering myself a player

too, I decided to go for her. I started talking to her with the Albino
Gary Coleman Opener. It's something Swinggcat and I made up. I've
posted it before, but if you NEED it, I can repost. Anyway, I used
this to elicit her criteria for men: funny and confident. So I just
poured on cocky/funny. We threw jokes back and forth.
While we were talking, an FB came up behind me and wanted to
leave. I used her for social proof with some Alpha Kino. She was
behind me, so I wrapped my arms behind my back and around her, and
bent over, lifting her into the air on my back. I knew I hadn't gotten
enough rapport with HBRed to exchange phone numbers yet, but decided
to go for it anyway. So I just said, "I enjoyed talking to you. We
should continue this." She was into exchanging numbers, so I did my
favorite #close: I pulled out my business card, ripped it in half,
wrote my number, handed her the other half, and then, after she wrote
it, handed her my number. Then, to make up for the AFC way I asked,
said, "Do you live in XXXX (my neighborhood)?" No, she said. "Oh, too
bad, I'm looking for people to hang out in XXXX because I just moved
there." She kind of looked dumbfounded, then joked about taking her
number back. I did the old "Kiss goodbye" cheek-point, and exited.
Anyway, here's where the art comes in: I actually WASN'T going to
call her during the week because there wasn't enough rapport, but
decided that this was an opportunity for an actual challenging
SEDUCTION. I called and made a plan for Friday.
Now, check this out: On Friday, I made plans with two hot pivots.
Then I called HBRed and told her that I'd be with two friends, who
were driving. Before we arrived at the house, I told the pivots that,
at the end of the night, when dropping HBRed off, to say, "We need to
stop by XXXXX on the way home. It may take a couple hours. I don't
know if you want to wait around or not." Then, if I was interested in
HBRed, I'd say, "Well, I have to work tomorrow. I'll just take a cab
home from HBRed's house." Very important: advance planning.
Anyway, we pick her up, go to dinner, and then go to a party at
a café. I split off with HBRed, sit down on adjacent chairs, and then
begin my PU. We talk, gather commonalities, and I elicit values. While
we're talking, I feel the attraction building and the window opening.
She does too, and says we should go to meet my friends. (HBs tend to
fractionate themselves when tension gets too high.) I need to think
quick and, as we're walking down a corridor, I wheel her around,
facing me, as I say something like, "Before we find them, we should…"
Then I trail off and kiss her. She's super-responsive: her hands are
all over my head, back, and ass. We make out like crazy, so I figure
it's on. This is my mistake, as you'll see.
The pivots drive us home, and deliver the line I told them. It
works smoothly, and we go up to HBRed's apartment. I figure it's on
but, fuck, she wants to go to a party. I start making out with her,
and she says, "No, I can't, because I'm worried I won't stop."

Anyway, long story short is that I DON'T get the lay because I
dropped my game, and stopped playing hard to get,once I got the
hardcore make out session. I was IN, but I EXPECTED it, and her chick
logic kicked in and she decided that she didn't it's want to give it
up so easily.
No problem. I've never done a cook-a-meal thing for an HB, so I
decide to do this for our second meeting. So I invite her over, tell
her I'll cook her my special dinner (rosemary chicken and Caesar
salad), and then we'll check out a new bar.
So she comes over but, because I'm so lazy, I don't make it to
the grocery store and my refrigerator is bare. So we get some take out
food (LOL), bring it over, eat it, and then I give her a tour of my
house and concentrate on showing her stuff that fits the hobbies she's
into. I'm very c/f with her, arrogant, dissing, playing hard to
get-everything I didn't do the night before. On the balcony, without
words, I turn to her and slowly move in and make out. I wheel her
inside the house, and against the wall, and our hands are all over
each other. Then I take her to the bed, and there's no resistance all
the way to the lay.
Afterwards (and I hope you all do this), I interview her. I ask
when she first wanted to kiss me, and she says when we sat down at
that café party and started clicking mentally. She also said she was
surprised and intimidated by the hot girls I brought. (Of course!) She
also said that she didn't plan on sleeping with me at my house, but
was so surprised by my "size" (because I'm not that tall) that she
went all the way. So, now I'm trying to figure out ways to allude to
my size in a PU without appearing like I'm bragging or showing off,
since it's something HBs think about in advance. Any suggestions?
2. HBNewwave
I'll keep this one short. I met her in a group of friends, and then
instantly isolated her. They were talking for 20 minutes about what
bar to go to next, and I just said to her, "This is annoying. Let's go
find an adventure." We go to a club and there's a line outside. We
meet a guy behind us and I tell him we're engaged. I tell the guy I
will ordain him as a preacher so that she can marry us. (I've used
this marriage thing once before-GOLD.) When he says "You may now kiss
the bride," we make out (after having met just five minutes ago). We
hang out, make lots of husband and wife jokes, and then I take her
back to my hotel room. She sleeps over, but, again, I DON'T get the
lay because it's what I EXPECT. Same problem as above-again.
Anyway, I went to visit a town near hers last week, called her
up, and invited her to a party. I was also joined by two other girls I
had sarged. We hung out pretty late, I isolated one of the OTHER HBs
and made out with her, and then took HBNewwave back to the house I was
staying at. She said she was exhausted and wanted to go to sleep,

which was fine with me because I was tired too. I also suspected from
her behavior (because she wasn't all over me, LOL) that she had a bf.
Anyway, during the night, I wake up and for some reason just find
myself stroking her leg, then her inner thigh. She starts moaning, and
then I stroke her through her pants and she's going crazy. I remove
the pants, and she's super turned on. So the close is no problem.
After, I ask, "What will your imaginary boyfriend say?" (a new line,
borrowed from Triumph the Insult Comic Dog). She says, "Actually, I
have a boyfriend." Ah, my intuition WAS correct. And the funny thing
is, the next night, she leaves her bf at a concert, meets me at a bar,
and calls to tell him, "I'll talk to you tomorrow." Gotta love the
game.
NOTE: IS THIS POST OF ANY USE AT ALL? FOR SOME REASON, IT'S HARD TO
WRITE. I THINK I HAVE INTERNALIZED SO MUCH STUFF THAT I DON'T REALIZE
EXACTLY WHAT I'M DOING ANYMORE. ALSO, THIS IS LONG SO MAYBE I'M
GETTING LAZY ABOUT THE WRITING. LET ME KNOW IF YOU WANT ELABORATION
ANYWHERE.
3. HBHotsister
This is my favorite one, a new MLTR. A couple friends stopped by my
place a couple days ago, and one was dropped off by his sister. His
sister was a bright, motivated, hot little redhead (dyed metallic red
hair and cute body). She was also a total smart-ass no-bullshit chick,
the kind I would have failed with before ASF and C/F stuff. I showed
her around the house, and we even had a little moment (that building
tension of connecting) on the famous balcony. I think what sealed the
deal was when I couldn't think of a response to one of her jokes. She
was talking with another girl about straightening their hair.
Me: You two are going to have to leave my house if you're going to
talk about that.
HB: Just like a man. You complain that we talk too much about
straightening our hair, and then want to grab it when we're in bed
with you.
Me: (look at her in eye, nod head slowly, smile creeps across face)
Respect...
Anyway, as she's about to leave, I need to think of something quick. I

can't just #close her in front of her brother. So I suggest that we
all go to a party I'm going to that night. Perfect. The brother stays
over longer, and is tired, so he gives me her number on the way out. I
am tired too, and call her. We talk, build lots of rapport
(commonalities, fluff); I tell her I'm too tired to go out tonight;
and she invites me to a dinner party the next night.
What did it for me at dinner was using group-entertaining

routines on her friends. I made her friends like me and made the
conversation interesting with a little bit of non-cheesy magic, body
language discussion, and challenging questions that were fun.
Questions like:
(for vegetarians): "If someone said to you, eat this McChicken

sandwich or else I'm going to kill a chicken, what would you do?"
(for women, because all guys all have the same answer): "If someone
said, you either have to have sex with the ugliest guy in the world or
die, which would you choose?" (You'll be surprised: one in four women
would rather die! BTW, this is a GREAT sex-screening question so you
can know what you're dealing with.)
Anyway, after, I suggested stopping by my house to listen to some

music. On the way, she said she wanted to stop by her house to get
some money. So we stopped there, she gave me a tour, and I sat down on
a couch with her to do the Cube. Once we were doing the Cube, I felt
the WINDOW open. So, as I interpreted her cube, I kept pausing and
losing track of what I was saying. Then I said, "You don't know how
hard it is NOT to kiss you right now."
She got a little shy, and turned her head away and said, "Is
this easier?" I took a blanket and put it over her head and said,
"That's better." I did the Incredible Connection pattern. Then, after
a little more cube, I just leaned in and we started making out. She
was very responsive, which I love.
Anyway, there was a lay report here where the guy (I can't
remember who, but some self-professed seduction expert) took three
hours to get from kiss to lay. And he was heavily criticized here for
that. Dudes, this took three hours-kiss, talk, shirt off, talk, move
to bed, talk, hands down pants, talk, best bj in the world, talk,
!close, talk, etc, etc-and it was fucking amazing. Sure, it's fun to
attack each other with lust and have sex within 15 minutes, but to
spend 3 hours in that intimate, passionate bubble is like ecstasy. So,
whoever was criticized in that LR, I hope you're reading this.
Respect...
A couple interesting things: After the lay, she said, "I have
mastered the art of visualization." What do you mean? I asked. "Men
are visual," she said. "So I make sure everything I do looks good.
Like when I was on top of you, I bent back like this, so you could see
my whole body and face, and twisted my torso like this so you could
see all my muscles tensed."She was amazingly sexy!
In the bath the next day, she asked, "Are you a womanizer?"
I said, "A womanizer is someone who uses women for something. I
don't use women."
So she asked, "Then are you a stud?"

I said, "A stud is a horse who is hired out to get female

horses pregnant...So, yes, I am." (She liked that, though Deep Blue
says for future use, it would be funnier to say it's a bull who gets
female cows pregnant.)
Anyway, she's really an awesome girl. I gave her the usual
interview after. She said she felt electricity on my balcony, then in
the restaurant, and then was impressed I had the courage to lean in
and kiss her because most guys wouldn't. (Fuck, I wouldn't have had it
six months ago.) She also said I was the only guy she met who
interesting her in a long time. She was sick of having to entertain
everybody, and liked being with someone who was entertaining. Turns
out she's mostly been dating women lately. Respect...
Afterwards, a girl who likes me tried to fuck it up: she told the
sister that I taught guys how to PU women, and told me all kinds of bs
about her. Evil. But, thanks to ASF, I now know that all this does is
create drama, and drama increases attraction. So all is good.
That's it for now. Next time, I am going to try to keep better

track of what I'm saying so I can give you one of those finely
detailed LRs like Formhandle, Maniac High, and TokyoPUA do. I know I
had a lot of good c/f stuff and connecting patterns, but I'm making so
much up on the fly it's hard to remember afterwards. The funny thing
is, since letting go of routines for this experiment, I'm making far
LESS approaches and scoring #s and *s with far less consistency, but
getting MORE HBs.
The moral: Don't be your self, be your best self...

What most of you who aren't having success here need to learn is: How
to get comfortable expressing your own natural sexuality...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 08 Nov 2002 09:29:00 GMT
subject: My New Frame: Oversexed
After the first two lays in my LR in the FR section, I decided to add

something new to my game, to deal with the LMR I got in those
situations. (Isn't it funny how, even after a successful !close, I
still look back over it to see what I could have improved and done
better and pushed further?) Anyway, the point is: MY NEW FRAME IS
THAT I AM OVERSEXED.First off, it's been true lately. Second, it just

works for me: if I am oversexed, and act from that perspective (even
talk about it when necessary), it entirely eliminates most girls'
"he's just trying to get in my pants/use me for sex" objection. It's
something new I've been experimenting with And it's also a good way
to get rid of that desperation aura when talking to girls.
As part of this frame, I'm spending less time sarging, and more
time on "dates" and following up with girls I've #closed just from
daily life. As I said in the LRs, I feel like I'm hitting a nice new
level, where the stuff is really being internalized into who I am
every day. The goal here is to find and nurture your OWN sexuality and
seductive energy, and bring that out in a way that works socially. So
as you do the patterns/gimmicks/routines, you should be focusing on
those SEDUCTIVE QUALITIES you already possess and bringing them out,
so that they become you.
Anyway, a quick example of the new frame. I was with a super-chaste
Christian girl, who said she is guilty about kissing and has never had
sex in less than six months with a bf. We went back to her house, and
I said: ""I'm oversexed, so I never put pressure on anyone. I have no
problem at all with waiting six months make love to you. I'm just
going to be sleeping with other girls on the side, of course." It
didn't get me the !close, but I enjoyed having the balls to say it.
After all, it was true.
Any thoughts on the effectiveness of the OVERSEXED frame?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 08 Nov 2002 20:11:00 GMT
subject: Re: LR X 3
>
>lol, one time the funniest thing happened to me. i was just buying a big
>package (like 20) and put 10 of them in my jacket as i was on the way to my
>primary and wanted to store some there. i decided to go shopping beforehand.
so
>i´m in the clothing store, big store, crowded, lots of girls and a few guys.
my
>mobile was in the same pocket as the 10 condoms. so my mobile rings and i
>didn´t hear it at first. i grab into my pocket in a hurry and pull the mobile
>out....... and like 8 of the condoms that fly across the floor. LMAO, in a
>second like 5 girls that were standing around me looked... at the condoms...

at
>me... at the condoms... at me staring at the floor with that "oooooohhhhh
>nooooooo hahahahaha" look and we all start laughing and they start helping me
>picking up the L size condoms from the store floor ;). haha i got a lot of
>"seems like someone got plans tonight ;)" and joking "wow, can i be your
>girlfriend? ;) hahaha" comments :)!
>
>fuck i should use that as an opener. lol.
kooper, you got it, accidentally even. I'll put this story in my
routine now. It's a funny way to get it across, and even fits with my
new "oversexed" frame. And I like that they're "large condoms," not
Magnums (which are almost seen as cheesy posturing).
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 08 Nov 2002 20:13:00 GMT
subject: When talking to a married woman...
...always at some point early on, use the phrase "one of my

girlfriends." They usually ask about it, and then you can get into
patterns, natural woman, how healthy this is, and Major Mark's
statistic. (Ask what percentage of married women said they'd have a
passionate one night affair if there were no consequences and no one
knew about it. Answer: 100 percent.)
Anyway, did this accidentally a few times, and made for a great
lead-in into PU material. "One of my girlfriends...." I"m sure others
here do this already...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 08 Nov 2002 20:14:00 GMT
subject: Re: When talking to a married woman...
PS It also makes them LONG for their wild days, for the things they

miss, for the things they can't do any more, for...freedom.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 08 Nov 2002 20:35:00 GMT
subject: Re: FR: PU of HB10Shakira in a club - Vrax needs to improve isolation skills (long)
>I went with my friends to club. I didn't plan sarging. However, I saw a
>gorgeous HB10Shakira. She was in group surrounded by guys. The group was in
>playful state. One guy (AFCjealous) was trying to pick her up. He put his
>arm on a HB10's chair (it was clear - he wanted to put his hand on girl's
>shoulder). I thought she was
>into him. That was a bad thought as I discovered later. I heard that he
>asked her "May I put my arm on your shoulder?" hehehe what a wimp :)
>
>I left my drunk friends for a while and I approached a group with HB10. I
>didn't plan to PU her. I only wanted a lighter. So I asked afc2 for a light.
>He lent me a lighter. Then he said "you know...that girl (pointing
>to other HB8) is lonely...but you are not her type, hehe". I replied "Maybe
>she broke up recently with the guy of her type? And now...it's time to try
>something new? :) "
>HB10: Don't listen to him. I think you ARE in her type
>
>Opportunity to join a group? Was she encouraging me? Teasing me?
>
>AFC2: And she is very lonely
>
>[GM Orgy Group Line :) ]
>
>Vrax: if so..I know how to solve this problem...i 'm organising an orgy
>tomorrow. wanna come?...."
>Vrax: Just kidding :)
>AFC2: Hahahaha!!! cool!
>AFC2: Where are you from?
Nice: Way to get in with guys: talk about sex/girls.
>Vrax: I live here but I study in University of XXXXX in

>Cracow
>HB10: I study in YYYYYY University
>Vrax: You are kidding :) I don't believe you . Which year?

Oppportunity for neg here. "Only nerds go there" or something like

that. Make her feel uncool. But no worries, all is good so far here.
>HB10: 3rd year and you?

>Vrax: 4th year. I'm on electronics faculty but I am analytical only when I'm
>in laboratory. Outside laboratory I'm creative human being :)
Draw it out, tease her, make jokes before giving her actual info. "I'm
in my eighth year. I'm scared of the real world." OR "Actually, I
don't go there. I just live on campus for the cheap rent." OR
whatever...
>I noticed, that HB10 is pissed off because of AFCJealous picking her up
>(with
>caveman style - aggresive thigh kino...but she was rejecting it...it was
>clear that she wants to get rid of him). I ignored HB10 and started chatting
>other guys. Some BS about college, guitar playing, drinking
>blablabla.....AFC2 thinks that I am cool and encourages me to talk with
>HB10! "She is very lonely, blablabla"
Nice. If you had just hit on HB10 straight off, this NEVER would have
happened. In a group set, ALWAYS (for first ten minutes AT LEAST) give
convo with the guys PRIORITY over the girls. Well done!
>Vrax: (to HB10) "uuu....it's just because nobody wants you...just kidding
>"(grin) (is it a good neg?)
Pretty good. I might do, on isolation with her, beauty is common

routine too.
>AFC's are shocked and impressed. AFC2 laughed and gave me a five. AFCjealous
>didn't know
>what to say.HB10 tried to recover her ego with "No, I have a boyfriend"
>line.
>Vrax "So...When will you marry him?"
>HB10: "in two months...."
Yeah, I would look at her and AFCJealous, and say, "Congratulations.

You two make a really great couple." LOL. Again, this is just what I
would do. OBvioiusly, what you did here was fine.
>Vrax "Congratulations...but tell me....where is he now?"

>HB10: "Not as far as you think" (playfully)
>Vrax: "I bet he is cheating you, exactly in THIS moment, hihi"
>HB10: "No, i think he isn't. I see him once a month. He lives in Spain"
>(notice that spain is about 3000km from poland)

>Vrax: "That's nice...but it's far from Poland. Don't you miss him?"
>HB10: "We see each other once a month"
>
>ok, I think she either is BS-ing me or she wants to have some fun....
>
>HB10: "But you know.. all women are..." I interrupted her with "La donna
>mobile"
>HB10: Exactly. And you know..."Carpe diem" :)
Big IOI here. Nice.
>Vrax: Words of Quintius Horatius Flaccus :) "Catch a day" (not sure if it

>is good
>translation to english)
>HB10: Exactly!
>
>I tried to ignore HB10 in order to receive some IOI's.
>I asked AFC2: "So...how long have you known each other?"
>
>AFC's were trying to give me a BS - they said that she is a friend of them
>and AFCJealous said that he has been in love with het for 3 years. AFC2 went
>to the john. I sat on his place and started talking with HB10. She said that
>she knows AFC's for only few hours (she whispered
>to me "They are a chumps and I feel discomfort when they touch me").
>I said
>"maybe he (AFCjealous)is attracted to you? hmm......no, I don't
>think so...it is impossible...to be attracted to you...:) " (playful neghit,
>with smile). HB10: "But I am NOT attracted to him"
>Vrax: "So...What kind of men attract you? Badboys? Gentlemen?"
>HB10:"You know, I want a man who will make a first move by
>himself..blablabla."
>
>I launched "beauty is common" routine and started to EV -
Ah, nice, We DO think alike. Perfect way to jump in her world.
>she valued
>comfort, culture. Now it's obvious that AFCJealous couldn't
>seduce her - he was very aggresive and confident but he touched her like a
>pervert :) (discomfort) and his language was very vulgar and he was drunk.
>
>Based on those values I started to demonstrate my value. I told her a story
>in order to convey culture and tried to run pattern on
>the fly - "feeling comfort, connection when you are with someone, you can
>talk with him about anything, feel natural, relaxed blablabla". We was
>sitting very close (a few inches between our heads), EC was good. I mirrored

>her sitting posture and motion of her hands. The rapport was good. She
>totally forgot about the other guy, but...now....AFCJealous in action...he
>said to the other girl that he will beat me b/c I picked up his chick! He
>was pissed like a hell...once she told him "get your hands off from me".
>When she went to the john, the other girl said "You know...this guy
>(afcjealous) wants to pick her up...and you fuck up his game...". I tried to
>recover: "Why do you think so? I just wanted to meet new people". I said to
>AFCJealous: "Go ahead, man...she's yours" (is it good to disarm competitor?
>tell me).
Yeah, nice again. Well done. In fact, you can even piss off HB10 and
freak her out, by trying to set them up and saying they make a great
couple. Again, everything you did is perfect here, so no worries.
>But when HB10 returned, I moved toward AFCJealous. She sat next to
>me (but on the right - so I was sitting between AFCJealous and her). Talk
>about travel, languages. She told me she knew five languages (trying to
>impress me?). We spoke English for a while (just for fun). Light kino on her
>leg ( I gently rubbed her thigh with my hand and I was in very close
>distance). But I noticed that AFCJelous raised his elbow and said "I will
>kick his ass!!! Who the fuck he is???"...oops...I decided to #close. I told
>HB10: "Let's go outside for a while, I want to talk to you before I go".
>We left her group - semi isolation. Now... I tried to full isolation - I
>wanted to have her leave the group with me.
>Vrax "You know, I have to go now... If you want to go with me, I will wait
>for you outside the club - but only five minutes."
>HB10: "I can't. I have to wait for a train to my town."
Shit, man. I think you could have done this. She may have wanted to
come with you, BUT you didn't disarm her chick logic. Fuck. IMHO, you
had an opp here. But present it as more harmless. This is the only
wussy part of your PU. It's like, "I'm going home now, but you can
come if you want to." Unless you're 100 percent in, most girls will
just make up an excuse. Instead, your goal is to make her MISS her
last train home. So, you say, "My friends and I are going to XXX. You
should join us: you'd really like them." Then do accomplishment intro
on your friends, and mention how she wanted to get away from chumps.
INSTANT DATE, right? This was the CRITICAL moment here. At least you
got this far, though, nice.
>Vrax: "Ok...I understand....but it's too bad that we can't continue our
>conversation" (Was it good move or could I isolate her?)
>HB10: "Have you got a phone?"
>Vrax: "No, I haven't. But you can give me yours. Say slowly all the digits
>and I will remember"
>HB10: I don't know if you remember

>Vrax: It's only way to arrange a meeting

>HB10: xxxx-xx-xx-xx
>Vrax: let me repeat....xxx...xxx.xxx
>HB10: you won't remember....wait here....I'll be back
>
>
>She went to the bar, she borrowed from bartender a pen and a piece of paper
>and she wrote her # with her name. When she was writing her # I went to my
>friend near the bar. When she had written her number she looked around. I
>was behind her - I touched her arm and I said "Here I am :) We will meet
>soon". I took her to her table and I left the
>bar with my friends. That was my first close with HB10!
Nice. Now make sure you call her. Don't wuss out. Be the MAN. And be
HARD TO GET!!
>I know that this PU wasn't flawless. I failed to isolate her and I was
>afraid to apply heavier kino. What do you think about kinoing a girl when
>she is being touched by all those horny guys? What kind of kino should I
>apply when I want to be different from the other competitors?
Kino, IMHO, is to get her turned on. If there's not an opp for you to
*close or anything, no need to kino in this situation.
>How to handle jealous, threatening competitors (not only obstacles)? Notice

>that AFCJealous NEVER told ME that he will beat ME. He told this to the
>other guy - not to me.
Nothing you could do here. When someone wants someone like that, ANY
guy, no matter what they do, is competition. If you can't win him, win
the rest of the group and ignore him. OR, introduce him to a girl, say
it will make HB10 jealous or something.
>I have a problem with structure of my game. I can tell a story, pattern or
>routine quite fluently (and improvise), but to me it's difficult to create a
>proper state in the girl's mind. I can maintain a convo but I can't create
>DDB.
You're almost there, dude. No worries. I am confident it won't be long

before you can do this. DDB also comes from the WAY you talk and LOOK
at her.
>One more question. I practise martial arts. Is it good to tell her stories
>about my fights and my training? - in order to discourage other guys to pick
>a fight with me?

If they're good stories, it's good: demonstrates alpha, protector

qualities.
>I was friendly even with AFCJealous. But he wasn't. How to deal with such a
>jealous threating fucker?
>
>What do you do, when a chick has a BF but she is not seeing him often? Does
>make sense BF-smashing attempt or is it better to ignore BF bullshit and
>focus on connection, kino, etc. ?
In this case, you did perfect. Quick BF destroyer, raise doubts, then
IGNORE it until she brings it up again. It may be true, but also I'm
sure it's her STANDARD AUTO-RESPONSE so she doesn't have to deal with
guys hitting on her all the tijme.
>Give me a feedback, please - I know there are many mistakes in this PU - I

>want to correct it.
>
>Vrax - Polish RAFC
Nice job, man.
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 09 Nov 2002 05:52:00 GMT
subject: Re: My New Frame: Oversexed
On Fri, 08 Nov 2002 10:18:00 -0500, Commander Zap wrote:
>I think there's something to this.

>
>As for me, if *I* said I was oversexed I would work into it my standard rap
>about how imp't pleasing the woman is for me. I am oversexed and I just
really
>get off on seeing a woman get pleasure that I know she doesn't usually get
from
>men, I need to really please women, really satisfy them, regularly. Don't
know
>what's wrong w/me that I love to fully, deeply satisfy women so much, but also
>it's a shame so few men understand how important it is, blah-blah-blah.
>
>Zap

Yeah, Zap, I just realized what you're getting at here. I need to add
a NEW piece after saying that to make it a PLUS. This way, first, it
counters the objection. And then if you add something like what you
say here, it makes you MORE attractive. Nice...
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Sat, 09 Nov 2002 18:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: LR X 3
On Fri, 08 Nov 2002 16:12:00 -0500, afcpua wrote:
>
>what in the LR were called 'fuckups" were more like slips that are easy to
>recover from. this new gamestyle doesnt allow you to get in a position where
>you are in an unrecoverable situation.
>
Yeah, didn't think about that. You're right.
>why isnt Style in TFM? he's better than a lot of the other shitty people in
the
>manual.
>
>i want to learn this new gamestyle. it's very consistent.
You know, this CONSISTENCE is new for me. But, man, what a great
feeling. I said above that I dropped routines/gimmicks/openers to do
all this. Last night, I put them all back in and, holy shit, they were
10x as powerful. I'm in a totally new city I've never been to before
(with my pua buddy Sin) and got three phone #s and two *closes from
hot girls. The girls all #closed me, actually. I wish I could show you
guys the photos.
When i first started this, I met Ross J and Mystery. And they all
said, "If you leave me alone in the room with a girl for 15 minutes, I
can kiss her." I marveled at that. Now I feel like I'm finally almost
there. I notice now that when i JUST talk, HBs are responding to me
differently.
Oh, and in case you are wondering, I do NOT have the kind of looks

that EVER turn heads. (But if you WERE one of the people who has been
wondering this at all, stop making EXCUSES and get in the field. You
know who you are.)
The learning continues...
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 09 Nov 2002 18:09:00 GMT
subject: Re: LR X 3
On Sat, 09 Nov 2002 13:00:00 -0500, Style wrote:
>On Fri, 08 Nov 2002 16:12:00 -0500, afcpua wrote:

>
>>
>You know, this CONSISTENCE is new for me.
That's "consistency." Duh...
>CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Nov 2002 19:23:00 GMT
subject: Re: LR X 3
On Sat, 09 Nov 2002 13:00:00 -0500, Style wrote:
>On Fri, 08 Nov 2002 16:12:00 -0500, afcpua wrote:

>
>>
>You know, this CONSISTENCE is new for me.
That's "consistency." Duh...
>CPowles

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"Style" <0>
Tue, 12 Nov 2002 20:19:00 GMT
subject: Re: She asks, 'What size is your cock'
Finally found a good line for this, made up and field-tested last
night:
"I can always tell that a girl has slept around a lot when she doesn't
comment on how big I am..." Also fun to say loudly to your friends
AROUND the HB you are sarging.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 20 Nov 2002 05:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: The Dental Floss Opener
Thanks for the responses. The fact is, it doesn't matter what opener
you use. It's how you come in. Example: last weekend, I was hanging
with an AFC (Rafc-wannabe) who was too scared to use any of the
openers: rikki lake, spells, etc. He said, "They don't work." I said,
"No, the problem is not the opener, they've been field tested hundreds
of times. The problem is how you're doing it." I told him to give me
any line, the stupidest line in the world, and I'd use it. He said,
then use, "Nice weather we're having, isn't it?" We were in a city
where it happened to be snowing. I walked up to a four set and said,
"Nice weather we're having, isn't it? I can't believe it's snowing.
Back home, I just got a message from my friends and they were all
surfing today. But I like the snow here. It's beautiful when it's not
too cold. Where are you all from?"
Fluff? Yes. Stupid? Probably. But did it open? Yes. The fact is: once
you have the CONFIDENCE, anything will work. Same, CB, with groups.
You must talk to all of them, be interesting, tease all of them, be
loud enough for everyone to hear, and make eye contact with all of
them.
BTW, Danilo, I hope it wasn't a WET dream, LOL!

CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 20 Nov 2002 07:59:00 GMT
subject: The Dental Floss Opener
Basically, the way I do openers now, is I just ask HBs about whatever
is on my mind. This one is so ridiculous that it's been working:
Hey guys, I need to get your opinon on something. It's very important,
and we need a woman's perspective. It's a matter of life and death.
ETC (big build up)...
Flossing! Are you supposed to floss before or after you brush your
teeth? (They usually act surprised; and, in a big set, there will
usually be a difference of opinion. When there is, say, "See. It's a
controversial issue.") Then you can neg a little: have them smile, and
check out their teeth to see whose opinion you should take. Then say,
"My friends and I talk about very interesting things." And then go
into your normal PU routine.
Silly, yes, but field-tested, and it never fails (so long as you have
somewhere to go afterwards).
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:24:00 GMT
subject: OT: Any mASF'ers around Jacksonville, FL
If so, email me:
CPowles100@hotmail.com
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"Style" <0>

Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:57:00 GMT

subject: Re: Solo Club Night: Part II...I'm a Magician
Breakbeat gave you some good advice.
In reading your FR, I have two thoughts:
1. Learn to calibrate. IOW, it sounds like you are staling out sets.
You are just delivering hollow material that means nothing to you,
expecting it to just work automatically because it is magical. Say
things that mean something to you, be sincere, and ESCALATE. Move
forwards. It sounds to me like you're talking JUST to KEEP them there.
If you're doing this right, they should WANT to stay there and
continue the convo. You have the Find and Meet part down, NOW work on
ATTRACT.
2. If you have to ask what the purpose of something is (pull my finger

neg), then you are not doing it right. Rather than memorize the lines
and gimmicks and patterns, you should memorize the INTENT behind them.
With no intent, you have no PU.
I can elaborate on this. But I think you get it. Work on being
interesting, and on believing in what you're doing, and in getting out
of YOUR head and into THEIRS. When I read this, i can SEE you doing
this stuff in the club and I can ZERO IN on what's working and what's
not. so let me know if you want elaboration.
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:11:00 GMT
subject: Re: First Field Report, Double tounge down/fuckup
>Get back and I decide to pull one last attempt before giving up for the night.
>I pick up HBia and carry her upstairs, lay her down and start kissing her
>again. She recproicates but askes for her friend/roomate. Her roomate comes
>up and interupts me.
>
>Here's where I attempt to salvage some self respect, b/c franky I'm PISSED
>about being manipulated. The two HBs go and flop on my bed. I walk in and
>tell them to get off. Then announce that they're not getting a ride back.

I wasn't there, but did it ever occur to you that they wanted to ditch
your afc friend and get with YOU for a threesome?
In this situation, if it got to this point, I would have said I'd give
them a ride home in the morning. Then, ALL crash in your bed. And then
just patiently WAIT for the MOOD to strike. It almost always does.
Finally, WHY be a DICK about it at the end? Because you didn't get
YOUR way? Be a good sport, man. Tease them, but drive them home. Let
them wear your sweats. The fact is:
A. You want them to give you a GOOD rep.
B. You may seem them out again, and have a chance with them or their
friends. But now you've blown this.
C. You're ruining them for another PUA who wants to take them home.
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: Stevie's Experiment
Stevie,
You're an alcoholic. Congratulations.
Seriously, it's a crutch. What happens if you see a hot set and don't
have alcohol? Is it blown? I know you're better than this.
So, my theory: getting INTO and ACCEPTED by a couple sets gave you the
STATE and CONFIDENCE. No the beer.
Try this experiment again. Make your goal to get INTO and LOVED by a
set. After that, the sarging is easy, beer or no beer...
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:15:00 GMT

subject: Re: Stevie's Experiment
>Back in the original bar we talked to 3 different sets of HBs, entertaining

>them. I noticed something here - a pair of HBs who were only maybe 6s/7s were
>not especially open or friendly, while a group of 3 HBs which I opened and
were
>7,8, and 9.5 were much easier to talk with and open to meeting.
One more thought: Reading this made me think. How about telling a set
that responds like the 6/7s that, in general, you've found, in your
line of work, that attractive girls tend to be friendlier, more
accepting, and more outgoing than less attractive ones. This give them
an IMAGE to live up to in order to BE attractive. Make sense?
I will test this out....
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:19:00 GMT
subject: Re: Solo Club Night: Part II...I'm a Magician
One more thought:
WHO CARES WHAT THEY THINK
Dude, if you're worrying about what the BARTENDER is going to think of

you for ordering 7up, you are LOST. Who gives a fuck? All he cares is
that you give him a tip or two over the course of the night. He wasn't
pressuring you to order drinks, man. That's YOUR imagination, and you
need to curb it. Stop worrying about what to say or do. Just do it.
NOTHING comes after the pull my finger neg--it's an aside. Stop
worrying about being seen alone. You are only bad if you're seen being
UNCOMFORTABLE. If you're seen being COMFORTABLE (alone or in a group),
you're golden.
So work on being comfortable with yourself, on not worrying that

everyone is looking at you or judging you. They're not. You are.
CPowles

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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:28:00 GMT
subject: Re: (FR) Toecutter-ized Email seduction. (pt3)
This is not an email sarge, it's an email stale. IMHO. An email sarge
escalates, this one degenerates. Have you read Zan's recent email
seduction. He also didn't close her, but he definitely got her
thinking. Good stuff.
Anyway, she sounds like a smart girl. I like her, and the way she
responds to your stuff. She's fun, she's a challenge, and she likes
you. But now you've had a whole relationship via email: you've even
fought like lovers picking little things apart.
My thought is that what didn't work here is the INCONGRUENCE. In the

emails, you are a confident, take charge kind of guy. She likes that.
But when your dinner ruse doesn't work, you back off. And you prove
yourself to be the OPPOSITE by not taking the initiative for the
meeting which SHE so desperately wants. She WANTS to get together with
you, dude. Take the bait. She wants it to be safe, like breakfast,
because she's afraid of HERSELF being alone with you at NIGHT, as she
mentions.
My thought is that you've actually BLOWN this by making it so

COMPLICATED. There's an old sales maxim tha Maddash likes to use that
says: the less they have to commit to, the more likely they are to
buy. Use that for what it's worth.
The fact is: SEE her and SEDUCE her. You're trying too hard to
MAINTAIN the upper hand, and that is causing you to LOSE it. Because,
dude, you HAD it.
I did like the 100 bill thing, and her response. After that, I would
have sent her Bishop's Warm Fuzzy.
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:35:00 GMT

subject: Re: The Dental Floss Opener
On Wed, 20 Nov 2002 16:09:00 -0500, ColorfulBull wrote:
>The problem is "be interesting". It's damn hard... It's something you can't
>learn if you are tapped in your own introvert world unless you are willing to
>learn routines/you are helped by other people.
Answer #1: Get out of your own introvert world.
>I'm normally interesting in my

>social circles but it's really hard to be interesting when talking to alien
>groups from other social circles... That's why I need universal routines. (if
>one of my interests are martial arts, it's no use talking to people who don't
>know martial arts...)
Answer #2: Take notes on what you say that is interesting in YOUR
social circle, and then use it in other social circles. The marital
arts thing is an excuse: I know NOTHING about martial arts, but if I
met someone who was an expert and could explain concepts to me in an
interesting way, I'd be very excited. Maddash, for example, was a yoga
expert, but never used it in his routines. Big mistake then. Now he
does. In fact, he wears his yoga beads out and HBs open him. Then he
goes inot his golden "yoga pattern." Find your "martial arts" pattern
and post it here.
Anything you can talk about with genuine PASSION will work...
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Thu, 21 Nov 2002 07:47:00 GMT
subject: Re: fast #close
Beautiful, man. Textbook. And the answer to the oft-asked question

about elevator sarging.
Now, call her man. And tell us what happens.
Your SP: follow through...

CPowles
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================================================================================
Sat, 23 Nov 2002 17:24:29 GMT
subject: Ray's newest persona is funniest yet!
Hey Ray, I just checked out the profile for "mensleepforme".

So are you going to have a sex change operation to match your new
persona?
I'd sooner believe pigs fly than believe this "Hellen" is anything
other than a pathetic attempt by you to get us to think you have a
hypnotist girlfriend with whom you share an email address.
You are such a loser.
-Tigerstyle
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================================================================================
"stylechild" <0>
Sat, 23 Nov 2002 18:57:00 GMT
subject: Mystery?
Does anyone know why Mystery called it quits, and if he plans on getting back
into the game, or if its quits for good?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Nov 2002 20:42:00 GMT
subject: Re: FR: Madison, Wisconsin PU
Dude,
nice fr. But: LEARN ABOUT NEGGING. You are just INSULTING the girls.
Not cool, and will get you blown out. Don't say, "We call those fuck
me boots." You're just going to force her to put up her defenses.

Better, say, "I like those boots. I some people wearing them
yesterday, and was wondering where they got them." This is subtle: on
the surface it's a compliment, but beneath you're saying that it's
unoriginal and everyone has them. Until you've mastered the game and
calibrating, don't go so far with your negs. I like that you have the
balls; now learn about women and what they will respond to and when.
You seem like you're ASKING to get blown out sometimes. But that's
cool. You're new. Take it piece by piece: find an opener that works
for you and just practice it till it works. Then come back to me and
i'll tell you what to do next.
Style
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Nov 2002 20:49:00 GMT
subject: What is a playette? Need an answer
I was out last night, and someone was asking me what the FEMALE
equivalent of a player and the female equivalent of the game was.
So, if the end goal of a male player is sex (be it in a ONS or a LTR),
what is the end goal of a playette?
Also, what are the obstacles that prevent her from reaching that goal?
The difficulties that must be overcome? The game that must be used?
Does this make sense? I am very interested in seeing answers, because

I don't REALLY know...
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Nov 2002 21:08:00 GMT
subject: SP-Inner: A New Type of SP Thread
Okay, for fun, I'm going to try out a NEW type of SP thread. Internal
sticking points. In the past, I asked people where they were getting
stuck in their game and gave them tactics to get past it. Openers,

ways to deal with LMR, ways to demonstrate value, etc. Let's try
something different.
I've met SO many people from ASF. It boggles the mind. And, as soon as
I meet them, I can ALWAYS tell how well they are going to do with
women. As soon as the first words come out of their mouths.
And my theory is this: We are all doing something wrong. We all have
one fundamental aspect of our core personality that we need to change.
Let me give you an example, if you don't mind. Paps is a great guy.
Very bright. He has SO many techniques and gimmicks. He's fearless
about approaching and stays in sets a while. He's studied and learned
it all. And what is going to help his game the most is NOT a new
routine, but a deep fundamental change. And this is his belief that
peple are not interested in HIM, in who he is, and as a result, he
sometimes comes across as hollow. He WILL be getting laid like a rock
star, but once he INTEGRATES himself back into his game. (Is this
correct, Pap?)
Another example: Zap used to have an internal SP of deservedness. I

think he's got that licked now.
So what I want you all to do is to take a hard look at yourself, like

from a third person POV. See what is NOT working. Why are you not
engaging HBs (if you're not) or why are you not attracting them (if
you're not). Do you have a fear of expressing your own internal
sexuality, do you think you are boring, are you so stuck in your mind
that you're not paing attention to her, do you really wonder what a 10
would ever see in you, do you get nervous, do you always feel like you
are being watched and judged? What is it?
Do yourself a favor: ask your friends. What could you change about
your PERSONALITY that would attract more women?
I don't know if this makes sense, or if many of you are even capable
of seeing yourself in a detached manner like that. But if you can,
post a message. Begin it with the words SP-Inner, and we'll work on
it. This could be the biggest favor you EVER do yourself.
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 23 Nov 2002 21:21:00 GMT

subject: Re: SP-Inner: A New Type of SP Thread
Also, if I HAVE met you, just ask me for an evaluation, and I'll share
what I THINK your SP-Inner is here, and we can discuss...
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 01:37:00 GMT
subject: Re: the essence of my game - c&f frames (kooper)
Just wanted to post here to draw more attention to Kooper's post. It

is GOLD. Those of you looking for the magic pill, the shortest cut,
this is it: cocky/funny frames! Read it and read it again!!
One more (obvious) frame I've used for !closes is to walk around with
the HB I just met and tell other people in the club that she is my
fiance. Then, I'll either ask them, "Don't you think we make a great
couple?" (When they say yes and explain, it's SOCIAL PROOF on the spot
for you!) Or, if someone is real fun, I'll ask them to marry us on the
spot. Of course, when he says, "You may now kiss the bride"....you
know what to do... Play the game all the way back to your house, and
carry her over the threshold. (All field tested!)
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 12:13:00 GMT
subject: Re: great get together, bring her home, but no FUCK!!!
Nice job. Don't beat yourself up. This is how you learn. Now you know
how to get any girl over for coffee and then back to your place. And,
here, I'm going to give you the next step. When you feel that the
energy is right, just say:
"I'm trying so hard NOT to kiss you right now."

You can't lose this way. Just see how she reacts, fluff (or do IC
pattern), and then, if sign was good, go for the kiss. I think this
works not just as a test, but also because it's an SOI. It lets her
know what's on your mind and prepares her. And the frame that you're
trying SO hard to CONTROL YOURSELF is sexy. Sometimes I'll tell her:
"Whatever you are doing, STOP it! I'm talking about something
important here."
Even after I kiss, I keep up the frame: "What are you doing to me? I'm
NEVER like this."
They LOVE it.
Enjoy, and report back.
CPowles
On Sun, 24 Nov 2002 01:09:00 -0500, Manifestis3 wrote:
>Oh my fucking god! I am a loser! Please flame me for this!!!

>
>Yesterday, I went out with this Latin chick i picked up 3 days ago...i told
her
>to come to my place...so when she came, i wasn't even dressed...i was like
>"ok...ill be there in a second..." i came in like i didn't give a shit and
said
>"hey!!! what is up?" and gave her a nice kiss on the cheek.
>
>i opened the door for her to my car and we drove to the coffee place...and we
>walked for awhile while talking about our similarities such as New Age ideas
>and books...so that was a GREAT PLUS...we had something in common..
>
>when we got there in the coffee shop, she was in front of me asking what i was
>getting...i pretended to know all the coffees and confidently said "oh...i'll
>get the strawberry coffee" and she was like "is that good?" i was like "oh
>yeah..." she got something else and then the cashier was like "are u guys
>together?" at that time, i smiled at him and "yep...and she's paying for me
>tonight" while smiling at the HB8 about it...when she was like "what?!??" i
>said "don't worry, i'll pay next time..."
>
>so i got her to pay which was awesome...and then we got to a sofa and i led to
>her sit down...we were immediately talking about new age shit...i love the
>ideas honestly and it's very curious thing women love to imagine about...the
>mystery and the metaphysics of life...anyhow, i was facing her while she was
>pretty close to me...everytime there was something funny, i would touch her on
>the arm or shoulders...

>
>i also did the palm reading routine and i got to really see her breathing
>deeper and deeper one time...i thought she was getting into that
>nervous/excited state...while i held her gently and pointed throughout her
>lines with my other hand...she totally believed teh bullshit i was talkign
>about...
>
>then, i tried to get her to do the BLAMMO PATTERN but she said she didnt' want
>to get hypnotized...i quickly changed the subjcet to get out of here...she
said
>great and we started walking toward my car (about 1 block)...while walking, i
>should have held her hand but i didn't cuz she mentioned she had a boyfriend
>and i figured since she's brining him up a lot, that must mean she doesn't
want
>to fuck me....i know, dumb thinking
>
>anyways, while walking past some workers in front, i made jokes with them and
>she was having fun...also when a beggar asked us to spare change, i remember
>her taking changes from the coffee shop cashier...so i told him that she had
>change and she kept denying...and i kept saying to the beggar "no dude...this
>girl really has change...stop denying!" anyways, after we passed the beggar,
>she was saying that i can be very rude sometimes in a positive way...
>
>as we got to my house, i suggested her to come on in so we can see my books
>taht we were discussing about...she said yeah and that it would only be for
>awhile cuz she has to go...yeah right...she spent an hour there...anyways, we
>got in and i immediatelly showed my book collection of interesting books such
>as new age, self-help, business, spirituality, and more...she was totally
>fascinated by the books i had saying "wow...u have so many books!" she also
>noticed many books had to do with power, influence, persuasion adn joked
"there
>seems to be a pattern here...haha" and she questioned if i was in a way
>manipulating her...i said "haha...of course not..."
>
>then when she sat next to my bed....my room is small so i sat next to her on
>the bed...and i analyzed her personality by using handwriting analysis...then
>she asked to check out the handwriting analysis book and then we were sitting
>there checking out the book together...it was for like 15 minutes and i was
>thinking "oh shit...do i make a move here or what..." i was very unsure of
>what to do because i have never went up to THIS PHASE...i was simply not
>experienced in this stage of the seduction...so i felt very unsure...not very
>nervous but unsure of what to do ESPECIALLY SINCE she had mentioned she had a
>boyfriend and saying it was an incredible realtionship...
>
>i ended up not doing anything and called my friend to come over...when he came
>over, i just said "hey...u gotta go now..." she laughed about what i said and

>said ok...i walked out to the gate with her...and said i hope i can do this
>again sometime...and kissed her on the cheek with a hug...
>
>after i came home, i started slowly realizing that chick may have really
wanted
>to fuck me...i mean she came in my fucking room sat next to me on MY BED...and
>i realized all this negative afc talk making stupid lame ass excuses like
>"oh...she says she has a boyfriend and she's talkinga bout him a lot...she
must
>not want to fuck me..." this idea and the fear of failing was taking me over
so
>i was doing nothing much in house to extend and increase the sarging and
>seduction...
>
>i just talked to ozwald on the phone and he was yelling at me that she
>obviously wanted to fuck since she came home...i want you guys to team up on
me
>to fuckin make me realize taht in these kinds of situations, i just have to
>fucking do it!!! just fuckin flame me! make fun of me to make me KNOW that i
>will never do this again in the future...
>
>sigh....
>
>ps...this get together was teh best i have ever had by the way in my six
months
>of training...still i didn't go to the next level...my fuckin fault!!!
>
>manifestis3
>
>"I live my reality and you are my guests..."
>"ANYTHING & EVERYTHING a chick does is an IOI to me..."
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 12:27:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: SP awareness
Okay, man. I've read your FRs, and know a little bit about you, so
this is easy. My thoughts: Pap says that you are a cool, good looking
guy. Good for you. Now, you must build the confidence that this cool,
good-looking guy must have.

When I read your FR, I see a guy USING the techniques he has learned,
but NOT knowing why they work and in what context. For example, the
three mouse race (which I used tonight on a good #close--also broke up
with an MLTR tonight, but I digress). You don't just come out and use
it, and expect an HB to like you because of it. First you build value
or do something cool. Then they think that the 3 mouse race will be
another cool thing. Instead you draw all over their arm. It's a neg,
and they feel stupid falling for a second grade trick.
The point is this: When you go out, I think you are VERY
self-conscious. You feel like you are being observed: not just by
everyone in the room, BUT by all the PUAs here. You feel like there
are all these things you are supposed to say and do, and then just get
flustered and confused. Am I right here?
So, step one, is slow down. Take the learning ONE piece at a time.
Like I said in the email above, just get openers down (you seem almost
there). Then get openers and building interest afterwards. Etc.
Now, to address the specifics:
>I'm pretty sure I know what my sticking point is. It's an inability to get
>into a really CONVERSATIONAL state... I have a hard time getting really
psyched
>up.
There is only ONE way to get psyched up for me. And that's to do a
couple sets to warm up. Once I have the love of the HBs (how shallow
of me), I am ON FIRE and in TOTAL CONVERSATIONAL STATE. So, you MUST
warm up. Before you're even at the bar, call someone you're
comfortable with and joke around with them. Talk with the security
guard on campus, the bouncer at the door, the man in the street. Get
into a talkative state before you even WALK in the door. Then, as soon
as you walk in--BAM--talk to the first person you see.
At the same time, in your regular life, notice when you are
comfortable and talking and the center of attention. What does it feel
like? What are you talking about? What are the stories that get a good
response? Write all this down and make it part of your sarging
routine.
>At the same time, if I become even more detached and look even more critically
>at myself, I realize that the fact that I REALIZE what my sticking-point is,
in
>itself, is a major sticking point for me. I am almost TOO aware of what my
>problems are, and that sometimes gets in my way.

It's great to be aware of your problems now, on your computer. But in

the field, you have to COMPLETELY let go of that aware state. Sort it
out OFF the field. But when you're on the field, PLAY THE GAME.
> If ever there could be

>someone who was too aware of themselves, it would be me.
Yes, do not think. Thinking is your enemy. The way to avoid thinking
is to act. Don't think before approaching, don't think before saying
something. Trust your subconscious to internalize this stuff.
You need to TRUST yourself. I'm willing to bet that you're someone who
doesn't like to get out of control, because you worry that if people
see the REAL you they won't like it.
Love thyself...
>Sometimes I wish I
>could just turn my brain off and act like an animal (al a Eddy the Caveman).
>Also, this hyper-awareness of my lacking qualities can sometimes become an
>EXCUSE for me to do nothing... I figure, hell I'm just a pussy, simple as
that,
>and feel that realizing that is in itself an excuse to remain inert.
Don't think about what you lack. Think about what you have. Eddy lacks
a lot, but do you EVER see him stewing on it?
>Of course, I realize all of this and am actively trying to change it, but it's
>not easy. ARGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!
That ARGGGGHHHHHHH is the sound of self-hate and frustration. I am

REALLY glad you had the honesty to post this. There is a SOLUTION to
this. It comes in two parts:
1. The seduction part: Keep getting out in the field. Find the best
way for you to learn this stuff. Batter away until HBs are loving you.
There's something about the attention and adoration of a woman that
will send a man's self-esteem sky-rocketing.
2. Get GOOD at something: do you have something you're great at and

confident at? Find that thing and practice it, become respected for
it. Make it non-seduction related. Then transfer that feeling to the
rest of your life. It will happen naturally.
Finally, get the book MASTERING YOUR HUNA SELF. Read it. It will put

you on the road....
Hope this helps!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 12:37:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: Being vs. Doing; and others...
Hey, man, I am still looking forward to sarging with you one day. I
can be an email flake, so apologies.
>If this SP-Inner thread had been posted a year or so ago, I would have listed
>dozens of inner-SPs in regards to my attitudes and beliefs about women and my
>ability to succeed with them. I can gladly say that over the past year most
of
>these inner-SPs have disappeared and I am a very different type of person
>now...Sure I have done thousands of walkups in the past year but even more
>dramatic and powerful has been the change brought by challenging some of my
>previously held beliefs about seduction.
Let me ask you a question? Did these SPs disappear through

self-hypnosis and concentrated effort in reading and learning and
mental exercises. Or did all the EXPERIENCE and walk-ups and sets just
get rid of them automatically?
As you know, I admire the way you've learned this, stuck with this,
and succeeded. So fucking impressive to see real progress here. Wow!
>Anyways, on to my two of my main

>current inner SPs and your inputs on how to correct them:
>
>SP-Inner #1: After observing my successful sarges and my not-so successful
>ones, I have noticed a crucial difference between the two. In relatively more
>successful sarging sessions I don't give too much thought to the very
specifics
>of the game...I just open, proceed with powerful routines and patterns, and
>take the approach as far as possible. Its almost as if the process happens
>subconsciously. In my less successful sarges, I find myself specifically
>thinking about what do, what to say etc. After a good deal of introspection,

I
>noticed that before successful sarging sessions I got my mind to enter into a
>certain type of 'state' where I just become a 'PUA.' I dont DO
>routines...instead I BE a man with fascinating passionate things to talk about
>and women just seem to fall in love with this man... I begin to act as if I
am
>the prize and I adopt an extremely empowered inner frame...whereas in less
>successful sarging sessions I end up asking myself the wrong questions and
>sabotaging my game. So my question to my fellow ASFers is: How do you keep
>yourself in an empowered state where you just BECOME that PUA instead of just
>someone who is DOING various techniques?
>One component to my future success as a PUA lies in consistently precieving
>myself as a PUA and entering that role instead of just doing neat gimmicks.
So
>HOW DO YOU ENTER THAT ROLE CONSISTENTLY? I enter it quite frequently but not
>as consistently as I would like to.
In my mind, this is not a sticking point. This is the turbulence you

are hitting as you reach the next level of mastery in this game. In
other words, doing all these routines and gimmicks and walk-ups has
taught you a lot and made you a more interesting person. You are now
on the borderline between becoming a seduction COMPUTER and a NATURAL.
And sometimes you are ON, and just tear it up. And other times you
have to revert back to the patterns and routines. My advice is to NOT
worry about it. Try doing NO canned/routine/gimmick stuff for a little
while. Then do a week of ALL scripts, routines, gimmicks. Each will
power the other.
You'll also find that as you let go of the tried and true routine that
less women will be into you, BUT the ones who ARE into you will be TEN
TIMES more into you than before.
>SP-Inner#2: This a relatively minor SP. I am quite committed to becoming a

>excellent seducer, but I find that sometimes my commitment to success can work
>against me. There is a danger in taking the game too seriously and not having
>fun and enjoying and learning from every bit of the process.
Again, this is the turbulence. It's the guilt factor for when a week
goes by and you are not studying and working out. It's the frustration
of knowing that with ALL this game you should be getting laid like a
rock star, but some weeks you're just alone. Again, it comes with the
territoriy and is part of the path to the lifestyle you want. BUT, as
long as in the FIELD you seem playful, that is good. AND, as long as
you are working on something ELSE in your life at the same time. Like
I say in the SP-Inner post below, BE EXCELLENT (Tao of Steve) at

something that is completely UNRELATED to seduction.
>On a more positive note (I didn't have an chance to post a FR on this due to
>schoolwork) a hottie on campus and I made out like rabbits on a bench earlier
>this week. I had run into her earlier, and after doing Cocky and Funny stuff,
>some routines, GMing, and patterning...got her to continually ask me out and
>chase me. Well this week, she ran into me and instant dated me...till we went
>to a bench and made out.
>
That rocks, esp to do it in public on campus. Post a FR one of these
days. It'll be useful to everyone here.
So, in summary, I see no sticking points here. Just frustration

sometimes that the learning process is longer than it feels like it
should be. Below, I recommend reading the book Mastering Your Huna
Self. You might enjoy it too if you haven't already read it.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 12:39:00 GMT
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002 17:57:00 -0500, cloudninevirtual wrote:
>Style wrote:
>
>>
>> Do yourself a favor: ask your friends. What could you change about
>> your PERSONALITY that would attract more women?
>You mean GUY friends right? That's an inner-SP in itself for me, I
>cannot relate to other guys since I started reading up on the ASF gospel.
>
>All I see now is fucking cockblocks not friends.
>
Let me rephrase: ask a trusted WING (not a friend). Basically, on the

grand SP-Inner level, whatever is holding you back in LIFE (with
friends, with authority figures, with work) is going to be the SAME
thing that's holding you back with women.

Tyler, thanks for the kind words, man! Wish we'd gotten to sarge
together in TO.
And, ColorfulBull, I am WAITING for your SP-Inner post. I already have

some thoughts for you...
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 12:50:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: SP awareness
One more thing:
A lot of my success comes simply from the fact that I'm a great
conversationalist. And I'm a great conversationalist because I really
listen to people and think about what they say, and respond in an
intelligent way. (Sounds afc, doesn't it? But mix it with good game, a
quick wit, and push-pull, and you ARE the prize.)
So my point is too that you need to hone your conversation skills, to

be intersted in what peole have to say, to be able to even make small
talk.
So practice TALKING every where you go: start conversations with

EVERYONE: in the elevator, at a restaurant, in the check-out line, in
the brothel you frequent. (j/k)
And do some internet chatting too. Personally, I'm too impatient to

internet chat. But, for you, do some IM'ing. Practice being
quick-witted.
And, remember David X's cardinal rule: WHO CARES WHAT SHE THINKS!!!
CPowles
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================================================================================
"stylechild" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 20:55:00 GMT

subject: The Red Pill
Maybe this could help some of you newbies out there. Ive always been someone
who has struggles with confidence and i dont know why, im an attractive guy and
ive slept with at least 20 women in my life, but for some reason i just couldnt
get the approach down, most the time i would get so scared i would just walk
away, even from a girl who was obviously checking me out or interested, but
recently ive really taken the bull by the horns, i dont know what it is but
something has just clicked with me. Ive been reading alot of stuff on pick up
guide .com and on here and i think i finally realized that its all about "just
doing it". I was watching the Matrix the other day and thought about the part
where he says. "you can take the blue pill and you will wake up in your bed and
believe whatever you want to believe....but if you take the red pill you stay
in wonderland and i show you how deep the rabbit hole goes..." Well most of my
life ive been taking the blue pill and being a pussy, only getting girls
through the internet and through friends, and then waking up the next day
beleiving i did the right thing...but recently i have been very hard on myself
about that, and i find the more i try, the more sucessful i become. I went out
the other night and talked to six diffrent girls, danced with 4 of them, kiss
closed one of them, and got a date set up with another, and it was so easy.
There was even one point when i saw these two hot girls in short plaid skirts
dancing with obvious poorly dressed afc's who were constantly feeding them
drinks and holding the girls bottled water as they danced with them. So i went
up to them and asked them, do you think the guys your dancing with are
attractive? and they said "hell no", at wich point i began dancing with the
hottest one while she was drinking the drinks the afc's bought her, then i look
over and i see one of the afc's sitting all depressed in the corner, broke
after he spent his money on them, drinking one of the girls bottled waters. I
had to laugh.
It makes me think of the end of the Matrix when they opend fire on him and
he stoped all the bullets in mid air because he realized that he could do
anything as long as he truely beleived he could. Now i believe i can have
anything i want, and i can't imagine how i was ever scared to try. So if any
newbie out there is scared to try, get your ass out there and do it, you wont
believe the diffrence you will see in yourself in just a couple months, even a
couple weeks. The only way to beat fear is to face it.
"Do the thing that you fear and the death of fear is certain."- Emerson
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 21:27:00 GMT

subject: Re: SP-Inner: Be yourself
CB,
This post was very interesting. It sort of reframed some thoughts i

had about you. I notice the way you post in this newsgroup. In my
mind, you are a TAKER. Every thread, you are ASKING for something. You
want some pattern, some help with your game, some way to fill in
Mystery's missing routines. But you GIVE very little here. Before I
even click on one of your posts, I can always guess that it's going to
be a short thing asking for something. You're like the guy who quits
smoking by not buying any more cigarettes, and instead just bums them
off other people and ends up smoking just as much.
Okay, not the best metaphor: But what is interesting is this. You WANT
to give. You just don' t have the CONFIDENCE IN YOURSELF to do this.
It makes me see you in a whole new light and want to respond to your
threads more. It's not greediness and selfishness, it's insecurity.
(By the way, that's a reframe: I suggest for everyone here, buying the
Robert Dilts (spelling?) Sleight of Mouth book and practicing the
techniques with a wing; it's fun.)
Somehow, I don't picture you as a cool guy. (No offense, CB, because I
do like you.) But I picture you as a guy in the shadows, withdrawn
into himself. A guy who I would have to go out of my way to talk to,
but once I did, I would find him very interesting. This brings us to
what, in my mind, is the goal of a lot of the stuff here: TO PUT YOUR
BEST FOOT FORWARD ALL THE TIME. Don't make other people wait to find
out.
Anyway, on to your email, point by point...
>Okay, my first SP is something which is found in mostly everyone. Except for

TD
>and Eddy :) Haaa! It's to get out your ass constantly to sarge. It's really
>hard to go to those noisy, smokey etc. clubs on Saturdays/Fridays etc. instead
>of just sitting home or sleeping. Anyway, I can get around that most of the
>time.
Yes, I have this too. But, every time, once I make myself go out it's
great. I have this problem with everything: work, sports, gym, dates,
etc. It's called inertia. BUT: Once you get off your ass and out the
door, you're there. You know how to solve this: As soon as you
QUESTION whether you should go out or not, then make the decision
right then and there to GO OUT. It's not laziness or the smokiness or
tiredness that's preventing you: it's your own fear of success.

>The bigger problem is when I enter these places: I have to get into state. I
>have to get into a talkative state and into an enthusiastic state. The first
>one is no problem, the second is harder. Usually if I have successes I get
>excited. That's cool. It gives me lots of energy. Only the first few steps are
>hard.
Okay, normal stuff again. We all need some warm up sets. Read my
responses above: warm up on the way out with anyone you run into. And
KEEP SARGING until you get a good set. After that, you'll be on fire.
>Okay, now here come the fun part. My biggest inner SP is the phrase "be
>yourself".
It should be the phrase "be the best parts of yourself, and share
those parts always"
>I'm naturally an outgoing guy. I like to make new friends, meet new and
>interesting people, I'm into new adventures and things etc. But I constantly
>feel like there is nothing special in me for others to value, that I'm not
>enough fun on my own.
Even as you write this, you KNOW it's not true. You just worry that
others won't RECOGNIZE the special things in you. You know you are
special and interesting, dude. It's part of being human and having an
ego. You just worry that others won't GET IT right away. You have to
find a way to help them GET IT right away. And not to take it
personally when the rare HB doesn't.
>I know lots of people at my uni - I make new friends easily. My problem is I
>feel like I only know them because I'm talking to them and I have an interest
>in people. I enter groups through individuals bringing me in, and I don't feel
>like I have anything to offer to these groups other than maybe my canned
>routines/gimmicks/material. There are people, who have a lot of experience
>about life, who can talk about fun things, places they've been to - I'm not
>like that. I feel like I'm lacking something interesting in me - maybe just
the
>way to sell myself well. I could never be the center of attention on my own -
>while I always wanted to be that... I can join convos, say cool things, but I
>dunno how to lead an entire group... And now I'm talking about groups of
people
>I know.
Dude, this is ALL good. You have an interest in people, you like to
learn what they have to say about life. You don't need to be juggling
fire while riding a unicycle while playing the kazoo to get attention.

Just relax, and be interested in other people. And when the

opportunity for a routine or gimmick you know comes up, share it and
enjoy the attention and admiration. If you're SO worried about HAVING
to be the CENTER OF ATTENTION and ENTERTAIN all the time, you're going
to come off as a flawed person if it doesn't come naturally. All you
have to do is: BE INTERESTED AND INTERESTING.
Like I said in a post above, NOTICE what stories you tell and lines
you use that get a good response. Write them down and make them part
of your routine. And learn from those others that you think have more
experience: write down their good lines and routines. Model them.
Dude, if you are TRULY interested in other people, you will have NO
problem being in groups as long as you can BRING THEM OUT. Make sense?
Don't take everything in this NG as gospel. Find out what's working
for you and who you are. Just because someone has found THEIR way to
PUA-dom doesn't mean it's THE way.
>I have no problem when I'm 1 on 1 with somebody, we can have a great talk,
>share mutual topics etc. But in a group, I feel lonely and separated. These
are
>my biggest inner fears that I'm now talking about. Do you know what I mean?
You realize that's YOU, not THEM. It's in YOUR mind. Just relax and go
with the flow of the group. You are PRESSURING yourself to HAVE to do
something FANTASTIC. I may have posted this before, but this is how I
think of group sets. I imagine that everybody has a wood-burning fire
in their belly. And my job is to keep it all stoked. So whomever's
fire is dying, I give them attention to get it blazing again. In a
group set, I just divide my attention and commentary amongst everyone.
I wish you could see me work on.
>Like I see these people around me, and I know that they probably like me, but
>sometimes when I think about it, I cannot show up anything they should like me
>for...
Answer: Don' tthink about it. They like you, don't ask why. It should
give you CONFIDENCE not INSECURITY. You have self-esteem issues, CB.
It sucks. One of your parents didn't do thier job correctly. Same
here, to tell the truth. You MUST defeat them to get good at this
game. That is your BIGGEST goal. As I said in another post, love
thyself. If you don't, no one else will. I want to see you start
contributing here, sharing what's special about you. You NEED to do
homework: self-improvement books (maybe The Artists Way? I'll think of
the right book for you). Writing out the good qualities about
yourself, and focussing on them. Then you'll be surprised when someone
DOESN'T LIKE you instead of being suprised when they DO.

>Well, I'm sure most of the people are like this in groups as well, except that
>they are not worrying about it...
>
>You know, I'm not the one who is called by people, but the one who has to call
>people...
That's because you're seen as a taker, not a giver.
>Okay, this topic leads straight to another topic. My attitude with woman.
After
>reading ASF I can feel that I'm the shit and alpha and woman should love me
>just for this... For being a MAN which is rare these days...
>But apart from this attitude I feel like there is nothing I can give to this
>woman... Especially compared to some of you guys... I'm special I know, but
not
>in a way that most people would define someone special.
No two people are special in the same way. That's the definition of
special, CB. You are a hard case, man. I WANT to see you improve. But
you're going to get nowhere if you don't get over these insecurities.
You must make that a priority and do what it takes. You don' tknow how
hard i've worked on myself in the last year: I've taken posture
classes (Alexander Technique), improv comedy classes, speech classes,
dance classes, and started lifting weights. It's not easy. It's a
commitment: not just to the game, but to making yourself a better
person.
>I have passions: I'm into inner-martial arts, meditation, self-development,

>NLP, tennis, wall-climbing and computers (even music-making and 3dgraphics).
>But I feel like this is something which is not interesting enough for other
>people... Compared to guys who draw attention to themselves just by their own
>presence...
Oh my god, dude! This is ALL interesting shit! Inner martial arts,

meditation, self-development are ALL big chick topics. Dude, you are
sitting on a gold mine, but for some reason you are too lazy to sift
away the dirt to see it all!
>My most current problem is that I feel like I don't have anything to say to
>these woman on our get-togethers. Like I'm meeting this woman next week and I
>don't know where to start.
Treat her like someone you ARE comfortable with: a relative, one of
your guy friends from high school. You never worry about what to say
with them. That's because you're not in the AWARE STATE with them.

>We can fluff, but will it be interesting? Apart from this, I can tell stories,
>routines etc. but note, that that's NOT THE REAL ME! That's just a mask I'm
>wearing. And if I can't lay that woman the same night, and I have to meet her
>more the mask will eventually fall off and my pure nude personality will be
>exposed... As it is...
Bullshit. That WILL BE the real you. You can't change overnight. It
feels awkward at first, then you internalize it and it starts to
BECOME you. I can't even do field reports anymore because I'm not even
AWARE of all the techniques I do. I SAY I don't do NLP, then
Nightlight 9 watches me and says i use tons of it. It just has BECOME
me. And, dude, there is NOTHING that's a bigger turn on for a chick
than to catch a glimpse of the REAL you, the PURE NUDE (as you say)
personality. Don' ttry to hide it, man.
>Tell me Style, what do you say to these woman on dates? Again, I tried the
>maniac plan and shit like that, but that's just not me... How can you be
>interesting and create connection/value/trust/sexual attraction at the same
>time?
Okay, try this. Before you go on a date, make a big list of all the
routines and questions and things you want to say, in order. Study it
, then fold it up and put it in your back pocket. Don't look at it
again. Just know it's there in case the convo stales.
>Are patterns the answer? Is value elicitation the answer? Or what?
The answer is to have a large arsenal of techniques at your disposal,

and to use them when nothing else is working or a transition is
necessary.
>I know that I must have value in me, but how do I show it to these ladies? And
>what if they don't find it good enough? (I mean I know it's good... yes, for
>me! But many people consider things I care about simply bullshit and are not
>interested in them...)
No one considers the things you care about BS. But if you express them
poorfly, they're going to lose interest. If you express them with
passion and a confidence that the other person wants to hear it,
they'll be DDB in no time.
>Sorry for the long post, but it feels much better now after writting down my
>insecurities. These are things you can surpress to the outside world, but they
>eventually reappear more dramatically somewhere else... Thanks.

Thanks for sharing this here. You are at the beginning of a long road
that you MUST take. Here is your first homework assignment:
1. Write out a complete sentence (or two) that describes the way you
think that other people see you right now.
2. Write out a complete sentence (or two) that describes the way you
would like other people to see you.
3. Draw a picture of the first person.
4. Draw a picture of the second person that you would like to be.
Then, if you want, share it here and I'll tell you what to do next....
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 21:28:00 GMT
subject: SP-Inner: Final D
FINAL D: I'm starting a separate thread for your SP here.
FINAL D WRITES:
Personal SP problem (recorded here for posterity ... :-P )
not thinking other people are "good enough" for me
I don't mean to defend that attitude, it obviously sucks for a lot of

reasons, not the least of which that it doesn't really rationally make
sense. This isn't an "ego thing," although obviously ego is related to

it
somehow, thinking I'm SO GREAT that other people don't "measure up" to
my
standards. But that isn't exactly what I'm getting at.
It's more like, I'm bored by the level of intellect of most people. I
would
rather be posting on the internet, where the ideas are full-fledged
and get

to be investigated "for real," rather than having a shallow lame-ass

convo
with a HB-IQ75 about which fountain pen is really worth writing with.
Really, no matter how hot-looking she is, I just am NOT fascinated by
slow,
undereducated, etc. etc. Sure, I still want to fuck her, but not her
BRAIN,
just her BODY. And in the end, I usually sabotage myself because of
this. I
reject, next, or just get low-energy because the other person isn't
"inspiring" me, and I excuse myself for that type of reactive
emotional
lack of control.
Which is stupid, of course, because most of the time when I sabotage

myself, it's a really early knee-jerk response. I don't actually KNOW
if
the chick has a brain or not, all I know about her is her first seven
sentences of socially prescribed brain-dead twaddle. I've been
speaking
just as much brain-dead twaddle too, or maybe not (depending ...), but
either way it's not reasonable to think that you can know how
fascinating a
person is in the early stages of an encounter. I fool myself that one
can
"just tell" by the sparkle in someone's eye, whether or not they're
"worth
my time" or not, but I know that's bullshit as well.
Most of my successful sarges have come from a geunine interest in the

other
person, and what she's been talking about. If she comes up with
something
that stops me short and gives me an intellectual / interpersonal hook
upon
which to hang the conversation, then I am very good at establishing
rapport
and getting the close. But if she does nails for a living, I'm likely
to
fail at the sarge entirely, due to my own judgmental nature.
Consequently, I'm seeing that my sarging isn't really based on

TECHNIQUE or
MY OWN CHOICE of whom to land and whom not to, as much as on whether
or not

the chick and I actually share a world view that involves, people in
"this
percentile" might dismissively put it, "getting the concept." If she
DOES
"get the concept" and is hot, I'm probably going to fuck her, but only
IF
she happens to do something early in the meeting that convinces me
(and my
psychological resistances, etc.) that she's "getting the concept". If
she
happens to be acting "socially appropriate" instead, then I'm gonna
sabotage myself.
I'm glad I had a chance to write this down. I've already begun to see
the
flaws in the sabotage, and the mistaken assumptions behind it, and so
forth; and to begin to notice the time-frame in which the sabotage
occurs,
and the typical process that an interaction undertakes when I do go
about
sabotaging myself, so that I know what the critical moments are, and
how to
start to intervene in my own mind.
Cool. Suggestions?
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 21:48:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: #1 Being Watched
On Sun, 24 Nov 2002 11:10:00 -0500, Energy wrote:
>The SP-Inner threads are a great idea, thanks Style - I remember some
>of your SP-threads back in summer, when I first began to read here on
>mASF, after I had read TFM. I found them outstanding immediately. Now
>that my thoughts have become a LITTLE organized, I think my main
>problems can be expressed in 3 SP-Inner posts.
>
>First, something about me:
>I'm 23, 5'9, from Munich, Germany.
>My father is a natural PUA, and sometimes I feel so, too. (Well, this
>feeling's VERY rare, but when it happens to occur, nothing can hold me

>back :-)
>I even started out in my life as a natural PUA - but some things went
>badly wrong... before I found fastseduction.com.
>
>SP-Inner #1:
>>do you always feel like you are being watched and judged?
>
>YES. I feel I can go nowhere without the chance that I could meet
>someone I know.
First of all, get rid of this. This will STOP you from acting. There
is NOTHING you are doing, EVER, that they will EVER judge you for. Get
that through your head. So what if they see you succeed with a girl.
So what if they see you not succeed with a girl. They will still envy
you for having the chance to fail. Dude, I used to feel like this: I
live in a bit city, and I know A LOT of people. Ask anyone who's
sarged with me. And you can not get ANYWHERE in this game until you
STOP caring about what they think! In fact, whatever you do, if you do
it consistently, it just becomes part of your character. Most people
envy ME now because I'm always having a lot of fun when I go out. So
ABOLISH this thought NOW! It's that old AFC voice in the back of your
head trying to hold you down. It is NON-PRODUCTIVE thought, and your
goal is to ELIMINATE non-productive thoughts and emotions.
> I wanted to start a survey this summer, where I ask

>the girls how they find my looks (pretending this would be for
>scientific purpose,) I also made an AWESOME questionary for that
>purpose. But I can't use it here in my city (the feeling that I don't
>want to shit where I eat, as Tyler puts it) So I used my holiday,
>where I traveled through Germany, to do this survey. And I STILL had
>the feeling that I MIGHT meet someone I know, which caused a constant
>fear inside of me.
Wow, that took a LOT of balls. Good for you!
>I WANT TO BE FREE. How to??

>
>(BTW, the survey was great, my former fear that I might be ugly is
>gone for the bigger part, because the (hot) girls reacted so
>positively - and I found out, that the prettier the girls, the higher
>they rate me! The only negative reactions I got were from UGs.)
You haven't really elaborated on your SP here. And I'd suggest you
read some of my other responses. But really quickly, HERE is your
ANSWER. When you go out, you don't really see what is going on. You
LOOK at YOURSELF through the eyes of OTHERS. You imagine what they are

thinking and how they are seeing you. STOP IT! DON'T LOOK THROUGH
THEIR EYES. Look through your own eyes. It's that easy. Plus, you're
mind-reading; you don't REALLY know what they're thinking anyway. See
the world through your own eyes. It will give you not just the freedom
but the attractive/alpha qualities that you seek. I always think of a
line I heard from Steve Piccus (a master hypnotist): This is YOUR
reality; everyone else is just GUESTS in it. Get a strong sense of
your OWN reality, and stay in it. Get it?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 21:49:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: #2 Self-Image
>SP-Inner #2: Self-image -> facial expression:

>Still, often when I go out, I carry a goofy picture of myself in my
>head. This puts me into a state, where I can't control my facial
>expression like I want to - I see this on photos: as soon as I see a
>camera pointing at me, I immediately go into this 'goofy state', thus
>I always look goofy on photos. This is WORSE than ugly - chicks can
>love ugly guys, but they hate goofy looking ones. And I even know why,
>I hate myself for that...
>As soon as I look in a mirror, I can control my facial expression
>NATURALLY and look COMPLETELY different. But the moment I look away
>from the mirror, my self-image changes ABRUPTLY. I can't see my real
>picture with my inner eye, there is always a different one.
>I honestly don't know what to do about this, sometimes I spend days in
>this 'goofy state' and can't get out of it.
>
You realize this is the same SP as above. You put on this goofy
expression because you feel that you are being watched. It's like the
facial expression version of a shrug. I know it: I've seen chicks do
it when they're insecure.
Have you tried Ross Jefferies Unstoppable Confidence tapes? They give
you a good image of yourself to hold in your head.
The other thing they do is they'll help you get over whatever negative

experience it was that made you lose the NATURAL PUA vibe you used to
have.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 24 Nov 2002 21:56:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: #3 Losing interest
>SP-Inner #3: Losing interest (maybe my most fundamental SP?):

>I like to have girls around me, I like to talk to them, I like to hug
>them, to kiss them, I like them giving me blow jobs and I like to fuck
>them. So far so good. But I usually lose interest as soon as I go out
>to find girls.
That's the AFC voice in the back of your head. It is your own internal
self-sabotage. You must turn it off. It is NOT a loss of interest; it
is a FEAR of rejection (or, even worse, a fear of success).
>The reason for that problem COULD be this:

>Two years ago in spring, when the girls' skirts were getting shorter
>again, and their jackets gave way to sexy tops with deep showing neck
>lines, I often had the problem that I suddenly couldn't walk anymore,
>cause my (fortunately not too small :) d**k got so rock hard in my
>trousers, making every move almost impossible for me. This wasn't the
>first year I had this problem, but it had never been that intense
>before. So I decided to do something against it: I tried to think of
>nude men whenever it happened, and it WORKED, I lost the arousal very
>fast every time.
>
>But maybe it worked too good, as I can't get sexually aroused anymore
>when I see a HB. So this is maybe why I can't get motivated enough
>when I go out.
Wow. Interesting self-analysis. And look at this amazing self-control

you have. You hypnotized yourself and you succeeded. You can do
anything now. And, here's a funny thing: chicks love a bulge in a
guy's pants. Ask Treswww. In Chicago, he wore these ultra-tight pants
and a couple chicks just came up to him and grabbed his package. LOL!

>Only if she's a HB10 in every respect, I still can get aroused

>immediately, but in these 1 out of 5000 cases, I'm caught so much off
>guard, I always miss out on the moment.
>
>As soon as I've talked to a chick for a while, and I'm beginning to
>like her, the problem disappears, even if she's only a 6 or so. (When
>I don't like her all too much, which is often the case with average
>HBs, the problem persists)
>
>There was a time when I could become naturally aroused whenever a girl
>was hot. I'd so much like to get it back!!
Okay, two ways to do this. One is what Breakbeat says. The other is to
take it all the way and sleep with those girls and then remember how
sexy it was. Okay, in my mind anyway, you DO NOT have a problem. This
is an IDEAL state. Think about it: You see a girl, you do not get
excited, you approach and talk and don't really care. BUT, as you say,
once you start to talk to her, you get attracted. Then, once you get
attracted and she begins to notice it and the chemistry is flying, you
phase shift. She knows that you didn't come up to her all horny, but
that you really are attracted to HER because she has WON you over. So
before you know it, you are tongue wrestling in the middle of the
club.
This isn't SP, dude; this is an ideal state to be in.
Now, to get over the LITTLE hurdle that remains, just go in and sarge
anyway even when you're not attracted. Think of it as PRACTICE so
you'll know what to do with the 10s.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 25 Nov 2002 23:03:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: TShandy
On Sun, 24 Nov 2002 16:02:00 -0500, TShandy wrote:
TShandy,
Very funny. While reading your post, it seemed like something I would
have written about myself. Not WHAT you said, but the way you said it:

the total perceptiveness, sensitivity, and honesty with which you look
at yourself. This can be a great asset but also a great disability.
I will begin my response by assuming that your screen handle comes

from the Laurence Sterne novel, Tristram Shandy. Do you remember the
ending? After struggling through all those pages, you are told:
Said my mother, "What is all this story about?"

"A Cock and Bull," said Yorick.
That is what PU is: a cock and bull story. Let that be your motto.
Don't take it so seriously. You are placing TOO much value on it. You
are hinging TOO MUCH self-esteem on it. You, I would bet, are very
scared of rejection and what other people think. As I said in another
SP post, to paraphrase David X a little differently, Who cares what
THEY think? And, for you, who cares what YOU think. You must find a
way to silence that AFC voice in the back of your head that says you
are not interesting or good enough.
Anyway, on to specifics.
>Hey Style, thank you for this.

>
>I feel TREMENDOUSLY frustrated, and angry at myself.
>
>I absorb everything intellectually. I have a marvellous
>capacity to get enthusiastic about each new thing and
>say yeah, THIS IS IT!! Yet as I head out into the real
>world, it's the same real world I've been operating in for
>49 years and the same OLD shit kicks in for me. Even
>so, my enthusiasm eventually returns.
Like I told others, you must acquire the new learning one step at a
time. The biggest frustration of this NG is you just LEARN IT ALL. But
you can't APPLY it all. Thus, you always feel like a failure. So just
small-chunk it into your game. That's how I did it: Master one thing
at a time. When it works for you, move on to the next step. Make it
like an algorithm. And when you're good enough, you can just throw it
all out and be a natural.
>Ironically too, as I look over my "second life" in the

>"field"--the almost five years since getting divorced--I
>see a series of opposite trends. When I hit the street I
>WAS the prize. I'd absorbed the popular myth that
>women have it hard, guys have it easy. Plus
>now--unlike before my marriage 20 years ago--I was

>the shit in a profession with definite glamor (at least my

>way of doing it has glamor), I'm vigorous, in good
>shape, and ready to rock and roll. I run a
>free-newspaper personals ad and get lots of
>responses. But I'm a total AFC.
Email me. Now I'm curious about what you did/do for work. Sounds cool.
>Still, I have a great year-long relationship but it

>eventually crumbles; I'm devastated. I hit the personals
>again but they've gone south; and the net personals
>that took up the slack are unproductive. So I hit the
>clubs, but I feel shy and out of place. I figure hey I'll
>learn salsa, then I'll be good; but it doesn't help.
It helps. Every cool thing you learn is a way to make plans and have
commonalities and demonstrate value for people.
>I fall
>into every wbAFC trap in the book. I get NOWHERE. I
>start getting sadder and sadder, especially after having
>had such a nice gf.
See, and my FB CAN NOT understand why men want to LEARN this. Women do
NOT understand what guys go through, man...
>And I'm getting pickier and

>pickier--I'm just not into the 40-somethings my own
>age. At one point I NEARLY hook a 22-y.o. HB9.999 but
>don't act boldly enough on her strong IOIs and...poof!
It's gone. Forget it. If it really bothers you, try the Ross J
technique of turning bad pictures into success pictures. (It's on his
Unstoppable Confidence tapes.)
>ASF comes along and it revolutionizes my life. I

>instantly "get it," theoretically at least. I suddenly
>UNDERSTAND my many AFC misadventures--back to
>the age of 14! YET, I can't quite seem to put ASF into
>practice. Meanwhile, three very interesting things
>happen:
>
>(1) I become more and more shy about going to the
>local salsa club where I'd hung out pretty happily (if
>fucklessly) as an AFC; or any night spot for that matter.

This is ALL you. It's your EXPECTATIONS. Or maybe you're anchored to

your old self there. Whatever. Take a HOT girl there one day, and
you'll be over it soon. Or find a new salsa club and be the NEW you
from the start.
>(2) I get over my old GF (but keep her as a friend);
Good!
>(3) I stop feeling pain: I understand that my AFC failures

>are generic and typical, not a sign of my inherent
>unworthiness; and I stop pining for storybook true love
>because I *KNOW* that being a PUA is much MORE
>what I want. In short, ASF is my ideological Prozac.
Perfect!
>But with time, some anxiety returns. I'm just not making
>progress. In the field, I am just not APPROACHING, or,
>when APPROACHING, I'm just not moving it along. So I
>say clubs are too tough, let's try coffee places; but I can't
>approach, and when I do I have nothing really to say. I
>go though mood phases where I approach everyone
>and chit-chat, but the phases fade after maybe a month
>and then I have no real desire to communicate.
Okay, start all over. You can't just READ it, UNDERSTAND it, and then
DO it. YOu must work at it. Take out a piece of paper:
Write down FOUR OPENERS that work for you. (Even if you like "natural
approaches," you NEED these as back up.)
Write down FOUR WAYS to transition out of opener into something that
demonstrates value.
Write down FOUR WAYS to build rapport and an emotional connection.
Write down FOUR WAYS to phase shift into making a physical connection.
Write down FOUR *close lines.
Write down FOUR #close lines.
And, for fun, collect a short list of cocky/funny-type lines and negs
to sprinkle in her.
Problem solved. Now you have NO fear of approaching because you know
what to say. Now you know how to communicate it. Practice this ONE
STEP at a time. Master an opener, then master the next piece. ETC.
>I feel a
>strange disconnect between my sarging scene and my

>work scene, where I feel totally adored by young and

>old, and can lead effortlessly. >Because when I sarge, I
>feel like hiding behind my own face as if it were a mask;
>I feel physically rejectable (though I'm not exceptional in
>any way, plus or minus, except somewhat delicately
>built), and mentally dull.
Attractiveness to me is a mental quality. Dude, I have NO idea why

girls want to sleep with me. I am NOT that good-looking. But, when I
speak, my eyes catch fire, my face animates, and I have a certain
seductive empathy and sensitivity that works. Cultivate your inner
seductiveness, passion, and life spark. You CAN NOT allow yourself to
be SELF-MONITORING or SELF-CRITICAL when you sarge.
>Above all I feel

>DISCONNECTED, unable to read people, distrustful of
>positive reactions and fearful of negative ones. At times
>I worried that it was fear of sarging people associated
>with my workplace (a serious tabu in my line), who in
>this town are ubiquitous; but I still have the same
>problems when out of town and out of the country.
Have you read Introducing NLP (not for the techniques, but for the
reframing of failures as learning lessons). And, since I've told
everyone else, read Mastering Your Huna Self too. Get rid of ALL these
irrational worries. It's just your FEAR OF REJECTION masquerading in
all sorts of disguises. You must struggle against this voice, ignore
it, and go in anyway. I'm guessing that you come across as a good guy,
and, as long as you are not overly nervous, will not experience a lot
of rejection.
>So last summer I took Juggler's Denver workshop. I

>needed to see it IRL. It was a great experience (I did a
>FR on it). Still, when I was doing it, I felt sometimes
>literally like hiding behind Juggler when we made our
>approaches, and, once thrust in a situation face to face,
>like saying 'well er, it was HIM...not me...'; especially
>when confronted with any sort of negativity. When
>confronted with receptivity, it was hard not to go
>bland-nice-guy, the opposite of sexual.
Yes. You must just TEST new things that are the opposite of your
instinct. Once you're seeing they work, you'll drop the bland nice guy
thing in no time. It's going to be hard work, but SO rewarding. Do you
get David D'Angelo's newsletter: I'd recommend subscribing (free) to

this to get rid of the nice-guy/wuss syndrome.
>I want to be VERY self-analytic here. When I approach I

>feel:
>
>* Like who am *I* to be approaching? I feel that my
>whole AURA is somehow instantly unappealing to
>women;
You are a manifestation of your feelings. Women are out to meet

people. If you come in non-sexual, NO ONE will mind. They will enjoy
the interaction. And if they seem bored or whatever, just say
"pleasure meeting you" and exit. Done.
>* Like even if I get on board, I can't keep riding;
Dealt with above.
>* Like I'm a fake or fraud, especially if I run anything

>"canned" (openers, games);
You MUST do this for a while. THIS will help your game. Think of it as
training wheels. Once you're comfortable with these interactions, you
can remove them.
>* Like I'm disconnected--I have no ability to read the

>signs or "sense" people (this is odd because in my
>work environment I get treated like I have a
> permanent sixth sense);
That's because you are watching yourself instead of them. Buy a book
on body language and start not just watching theirs, but commenting to
them on it. Fun, and they enjoy it.
>* Like I don't care about people (again odd, because as

>a raconteur, making other people sound interesting is
>one of my strongest suites);
That's just your Fear of Failure manifesting itself as indifference

and misanthropy. YOu WILL care when those people just LOVE you and the
things you are saying.
>* Like I am selfish;
We all are.

>* Like I can't attract and sustain people's attention;
You WILL be able to.
>* Like who the fuck are these people anyway (a bit of
>what FinalD describes);
FoF (fear of failure again)
>* Like I can't take the lead or lay down SOI's (it's fair to
>say that my seductions in the past have been very
>significantly chick-initiated or chick-sustained;
>interestingly, I've been taking improv and find
> certain leading situations and "alpha" situations
>difficult there too);
If you follow the structure above, your PU will PROGRESS to the

physical on its own. Just learn to test for and read IOIs.
>* Like I am AFRAID--afraid of being humiliated, of being

>put down, of being treated of appearing
>UN-social-proofed, of fighting (I've always felt that
>feeling physically weak, averse to playing sports, and
>averse to fighting, has put me at a distance from
>random other guys and indirectly also affects my
>"AURA" around women);
THIS is your biggest problem. BTW, EFFETE (and that is what we're
talking about here) is a quality a lot of great seducers have. Read
The Art of Seduction, and find the seducer that is best for you: the
Dandy or whatever. The fear you must just fight back. It is OVER once
the material starts working for you. It's a constant struggle: I feel
it all the time too. The worst that can happen, however, is NOT much.
>* Like I'm afraid of APPEARING afraid (thru body

>posture/reactions, etc.), ... (This is odd because all in
>all my life has been pretty adventurous.)
You WILL get over this. Numbers will work for you. Read the posts by
DevilHimself. Very inspiring: turned himself from zero to almost-pua
with SHEER quantity. Now he uses ALL his own original routines and
patterns--which work for who HE is. YOu will develop these too.
>By going on at such length, it's not my intention to throw

>you a million little things to respond to. Rather, I'm

>hoping to send you a bit of my aura to react to--just your
>very off the cuff, unanalyzed gut feelings would be great.
>Ha, and one kind of funny note about my aura--soon
>after meeting Juggler, he said I reminded him very
>strongly of... YOU! Both in looks and personality--he
>described you as deeply sympathetic, engaging, and
>very tuned in to other people. Honestly, that gave me a
>lot of encouragement because I felt your own chronicle
>of your emergence as a PUA--especially your posts of
>about a year ago and a little less--were really thrilling. I
>do, in the end, have a ton of optimism that I can
>eventually get past these things that have been psychic
>but very real blocks to my progress.
>
>Many many thanks,
>TShandy
Whew. Long post. Good luck. Interested to hear your thoughts. In my

mind, you are a likable guy. Like I told everyone else here
(interesting, huh): LOVE THYSELF. Let's make that the first
commandment of PUA-dom. Nothing can proceed without that. Do you know
how mirroring works? Well, if you love or hate yourself, HBs will
mirror that automatically.
Hope to meet one day.
I would suggest taking Mystery's Workshop to you, but I don't know

whether you'd feel comfortable in clubs, bars, and lounges. Your
call...
Anyway, you are on the way. As they say in the NLP book, you've gone
from unconscious incompetence to conscious incompetence. Now you're
working towards conscious competence. And one day here you'll tell us
about reaching the final stage: unconscious competence.
CPowles
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================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 25 Nov 2002 23:14:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: #2 Self-Image
>I listened to the first few minutes of those tapes once - sorry, I

>can't follow his instructions, as for example I don't like to imagine

>a "40 foot tall guy", I find such a guy couldn't integrate himself
>into society very well.
>
Fine. Make it literal. Find the best picture EVER taken of yourself,
where you look your best. Carry it around with you always. Whenever
that goofy image comes into your head, look at the GOOD picture
until...it's...internalized...
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:31:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: Final D
FD: Nice to see you posting, man. Hope to meet you sometime. Where do
you live, anyway?
I think you answer your own question in this post. So I'm going to
snip the top. Here you basically say that you get bored intellectually
by girls you meet. But then you admit that you never really give them
a chance. And, even more so, you might not even come off as so bright
in the first 30 seconds. So, really, you already know this way of
thinking is BS. It's, in my mind, really a way to TALK YOURSELF OUT OF
DOING PUs AND POSSIBLY FAILING, because then it's their fault for not
being up to your standards. Of course, in the meantime, you haven't
even given them a chance.
So, yes, you know and I know this is a BS rationalization.
So onwards... I SWEAR to you that I can find something interesting

about anybody. I can find something to LEARN from anybody. I think
this is what may make a lot of my sarges successful on some level. I
am genuinely interested in most people. Most aren't my intellectual
equal, sure. But most are CAPABLE of adding to my intellectual acumen.
More so, when I am in bed, having sex with a girl I met, all I can
think is: "Wow, this is the greatest thing in the world. This is what
life is all about." It's NOT an intellectual connection (though it
helps if it is, sure); it's an emotional and physical connection.
You can reframe yourself thusly: You spend too much time in the

intellectual sphere as it is. You NEED women to bring you back into
the emotional, which is where real true art and creativity (not to
mention seductive power) spring from anyway.
>Most of my successful sarges have come from a geunine interest in the

>other
>person, and what she's been talking about. If she comes up with
>something
>that stops me short and gives me an intellectual / interpersonal hook
>upon
>which to hang the conversation, then I am very good at establishing
>rapport
>and getting the close. But if she does nails for a living, I'm likely
>to
>fail at the sarge entirely, due to my own judgmental nature.
So there are NO smart girls who do nails for a living. Wow! Why don't
you just make it your FRAME whenever you find a girl who is not your
intellectual equal to EXPLORE and find something interesting and
stimulating about her. It can be a fun game for you, and a way to stay
in the set when you want to eject.
Now, I've never met you, BUT the PUAs I see who leave sets and say,
"She wasn't good enough for me" tend to be rationalizing some failure
of their own here or the fact that THEY weren't accepted by the girl.
I'm not saying this is true of you, but examine the situations when
you say this.
>Consequently, I'm seeing that my sarging isn't really based on

>TECHNIQUE or
>MY OWN CHOICE of whom to land and whom not to, as much as on whether
>or not
>the chick and I actually share a world view that involves, people in
>"this
>percentile" might dismissively put it, "getting the concept." If she
>DOES
>"get the concept" and is hot, I'm probably going to fuck her, but only
>IF
>she happens to do something early in the meeting that convinces me
>(and my
>psychological resistances, etc.) that she's "getting the concept". If
>she
>happens to be acting "socially appropriate" instead, then I'm gonna
>sabotage myself.

Yes, stop it. I;ve found, in my experiences, if you TEST someone,

they're bound to fail. Back off and enjoy the interaction. THe fact
is, I LIKE HBs who are very different than me, who offer pieces that I
am missing.
>I'm glad I had a chance to write this down. I've already begun to see
>the
>flaws in the sabotage, and the mistaken assumptions behind it, and so
>forth; and to begin to notice the time-frame in which the sabotage
>occurs,
>and the typical process that an interaction undertakes when I do go
>about
>sabotaging myself, so that I know what the critical moments are, and
>how to
>start to intervene in my own mind.
See,. you're so smart that you know this is bs and self-sabotage. So,
make it a new rule: Next time you go out and meet a girl and THINK
that she's not your intellectual equal or doesn't get the concept, to
stay in the set and find something interesting about her. One of two
things will happen:
A. You will stay in the set and get a #, *, or !
B. You won't be able to stay in the set, and you'll find that this
"she's not good enough" thing is the way you rationalize it when
someone isn't IN to you right away.
Hope this helps!
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 26 Nov 2002 06:34:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: Final D
On Mon, 25 Nov 2002 19:04:00 -0500, manoreason wrote:
>Damn. I was excited about sitting down to write out my own little Inner SP,
>but then I read FinalD's and realized that he had just written it for me. I
>mean, it's EXACTLY what I was going to say.
>
>I usually regard my success or failure as almost entirely dependent on my

>target's intelligence level. What went wrong? She's not very bright. No
>fun. Dull.
See above post. Yes, it's HER fault for not being bright enough, never
YOURS. That's not what I think when I leave a sarge. I always think:
what could I have said/done to take it one step further.
>In fact, my proudest PU moments are when I was able to overcome this hurdle
>and actually have success with dumb chicks! And the smart ones are simply
>too few and far between for me to realistically tell myself "yeah! this
>could be a smart one this time! go get her!" when I approach, so my
>motivation to approach is lower than it ought to be.
Yes, love it or not, it's a great feeling when you're getting physical
with them. Who knows what OTHER sides come out as you get intimate and
afterwards, when you're totally comfortable together. God, I love
women...
>On top of all this, I made the mistake of moving to Texas A &M University
>for grad school. Let me do all of you the favor that no one did for me: I
>will tell you that redneck inbred yokels in overalls come to TAMU, and
>everybody else goes to UT or somewhere the fuck else. Just FYI.
>
>Yeah though, FinalD's sentiments are my own on this SP topic. (FinalD, I
>wish I'd driven out to Tampa to meet you when I lived in G'ville. Doh!)
>
>
>-manoreason
Anyway, see FinalD's post. Yeah, and if you wanna go to grad school in
texas, go to Austin next time! That said, there is a PATH to every HB.
You just must find the path to these... Read The Art of Seduction:
make them want to dump the Hicks for your Byron...
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Tue, 26 Nov 2002 08:05:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Inner - Setting up Roadblocks
On Mon, 25 Nov 2002 17:22:00 -0500, scoob wrote:

>Appreciate the new series of SP posts Style. Your insight and firsthand
>experience is a real benefit here.
Thanks. I hope this is helping. It's not like the last SP threads I
did: I can't give people a sentence or a routine to conquer them. It's
a long-term commitment to get rid of these inner SPs, but it will
ulitmately serve everyone better--in the field and in life.
>Quick background: I'm 34, 6'0, have looks and intelligence in my favor but I
am
>still struggle to show my true personality with new contacts..most often I am
>described by them as mysterious (which can be good) or aloof (which usually
>isn't).
This, IMHO, lets me know that you are a good looking dude who comes
across as MORE confident than you actually are. This can be good: you
LOWER their expectations, and then it's THAT MUCH MORE AMAZING when
they see how interesting and interested you are.
>Now..aside from that issue, I have found that in any area of my life...work,
>hobbies, social relations...when things become too "easy" or "unchallenging"
at
>a subconscious level I seem to become bored with it. Because of this I tend to
>create some drama or to make things more difficult than they should be. With
>sarging/seduction I find easy pickups to be dull and usually eject or NEXT
>instead of going for the sure thing. I've rationalized this as selectiveness
>but I don't really believe it is. There must be more to it because it crosses
>to other areas of my life.
I don't know if this is wrong or a SP. You like a challenge. Just like
a woman does. This all depends on your GOALS. If you wants lots of sex
and ONS, yes, this logic is counter productive. If you want a gf who
constantly interests and challenges you, this is just normal
screening. Only you know.
Me, I tend to be the same way. Once I master something, I tend to stop
because it's no longer a challenge. I've accomplished my goal. So if
you are ejecting because you KNOW you could have her and CHOOSE not
to, fine, you seduced her and succeeded then.
>I am very selective and generally good at screening, but I have had some
>experiences with LSE LTR's that made life a living hell and it makes me wary
of
>any chick that is just too easy to seduce..which sort of defeats the whole
>purpose of fast-seduction.

Easy to seduce has NOTHING to do with LSE, IMO. LSE manifests itself
in so many different ways...
>If it moves to an FB or LTR situation and things are

>going too well, I'll deliberately do something to piss them off...I seem to
>have a need for drama and avoid complacency like the plague. Does any of this
>make sense?
Yes, this part is bad. Drama is a waste of time. So many better things
to do with your life. It probably makes hbs get addicted to you and
the drama, but a total waste of time. Avoid complacency--yes, a good
thing--but not with drama. With excitement! Okay, you too should read
Mastering Your Huna Self. It talks about getting rid of old behavior
patterns that are not good any more and don't serve the purpose they
were supposed to originally.
>Ultimately, I cannot seem to accept success if it comes too easily. In all

>areas of my life I am very competitive and I am constantly challening myself.
>Its fun to ultimately lay an HB that was originally very difficult or hard to
>read but it is silly to be investing more time when I do not have any to
spare.
>Thoughts? Ideas? Thanks in advance...
>
Man, I read this and get it. I'm just not sure it's an SP. It's what
drives you, IMHO. You probably had one strong parent who was either
hard to please or often critical of you (a wild guess). So, IMO, you
just have to re-examine your behavoirs and ELIMINATE the ones that are
not productive and waste your time and KEEP the ones that are
effective. Get rid of the things that just complicate your life: the
self-sabotaging, masochistic behavoirs. Keep the ones that keep you
interesting and successful. Only you know which is which.
Reading this, though, I wonder: What ARE your goals with seduction and
ASF?
CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 27 Nov 2002 02:36:00 GMT
subject: Re: How to answer the 'Are you a player?'

Hey, don't hate the player, hate the game...
(Learned that from my ex, a 9.9 and a true player who taught me
cocky/funny...)
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 27 Nov 2002 03:23:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: Vicomte
Zarathrusta answered you pretty well here. You know your problem. And
you know the BS excuses you make. And you even know that this is a
fear or ejection. But, you say that you KNOW what to do after
approaching. You know how to carry on a conversation. People like you.
So, yes, the answer here is to SHUT UP THAT LITTLE SELF-SABOTAGING AFC
VOICE in the back of your head. Just ignore it. Say, "Fuck it" in your
head and GO APPROACH. It's a hard thing to do. Your heart will pound
with fear, your mouth will go dry. But once you find your openers
working, the fear will dissipate. Even the best of us feel it
sometimes. But what separates the best from the rest is that the best
don't give in to that fear and doubt. They overcome it.
On a practical level, do you have a CANNED OPENER that you like. If

not, find one, then you can bypass logic. In fact, a lot of times I
just GO IN before I even know what opener I'm using. Then I'm commited
and have to think of something on the spot.
And obey the THREE SECOND rule. The more time you give yourself to
think, the more you will talk yourself out of it. Do yourself a favor
and REDO the newbie mission or something. JUST do openers, then say
"pleasure meeting you" and eject yourself. Practice, practice,
practice, and see that there is NOTHING to be afraid of. Who are YOU
to give away YOUR POWER to some random HB (by being afraid that she'll
reject you and that will make you question your whole concept of
yourself--c'mon).
So, with your excuses: anything you have to say is more important and
more interesting than what she's doing. If she's REALLY doing
something MORE important, she'll tell you and you can thank her. It
could happen. But it's not your fault or failure: she may even
reapproach you later and apologize. So now what are you going to do

for an excuse?
Approach groups, with guys and girls in them. People think that's the
hardest thing in the world, but it's the easiest. Because who would
think you're actually hitting on a girl in a group! Just befriend the
whole group.
As for getting into proper state, you NEVER will if you sit around too
scared to approach. You will if you approach and get some warm up sets
under your belt (as in almost every FR here).
Here is how you get rid of the problem. It's how I did: EVERY TIME you
see a HB who you are interested in but don't approach, it is a
FAILURE. You know what I'm talking about, because you feel that sense
of failure every time you stale out and don't approach. So DON'T feel
like a failure. Don't fail. You DO NOT fail when you go in and open
and take a chance. THEN, you have nothing to regret later. It's a
learning experience and will make your game better. It's the only way
you will learn.
Have you ever had a trainer in the gym? Do you know how when you're
completely exhausted, they say "just one more" and you can do it.
Then, when the trainer is gone and you're working out alone, you
INTERNALIZE that voice and hear the trainer saying "one more" and you
do that last rep. So internalize the voice of us here, on ASF, saying
"FUCK IT! THREE SECOND RULE! GO!!!!!"
FUCK IT! THREE SECOND RULE! GO!!!!!

Style
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 27 Nov 2002 03:26:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: Vicomte
Typos:
>Zarathrusta
ZARATHUSTRA (though I kind of like the pun Zarathrusta
>fear or ejection. But, you say that you KNOW what to do after
fear of rejection (though I kind of like fear of erection--like Energy
used to have)

CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 27 Nov 2002 09:23:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP: Inner - Exuding Confidence/Sexuality
On Tue, 26 Nov 2002 12:28:00 -0500, BLscorpZ wrote:
>Style,
>
>I met you at that hotel in DC and going to bar afterwards. I think my problem
>is my comfortableness with my own sexuality. You might agree? no?
I might agree. Come to think of it, I do agree. For example, you were
talking to that one girl at our table. She was enjoying your company.
You staled out because you didn't progress to get real physical, But
she liked you: you were interesting and different and made her feel
comfortable. Later, some weird Spanish guy who was visiting town came
up to the table. When I left, it seemed like she was going home with
him. That could have been you.
>I think it comes from the way I was raised. As I have been told by different
>wings, I come off very warm and friendly in my sarges, but often not sexual
>enough. Funny part is, when I'm around strangers or bare aquaintances, I'm
>MORE comfortable with my sexuality, therefore I exude it MORE. But when I'm
>around people I know more than a bare aquaintance, I sometimes bottle up my
own
>sexuality. And I think that's hurting my chances of getting laid MUCH more.
>Even sometimes during a sarge, I put a hamper on my sexuality... for example,
>I'm keeping my hands to myself or just touching her shoulder/arm... when they
>should be on her ass or thigh. Just an example here, there are many ways to
be
>more sexual. I KNOW I can do that, but sometimes I forget to take that LEAP,
>unless her IOIs are REALLY strong.
Yes, I had this problem at first. But suddenly, it just got solved.
Before, it was such a LEAP to go from talking to touching, from
touching to kissing. Even you here refer to it as a leap. Now, for me,
it's no longer a leap: it's just part of the natural flow. You and I
are both non-threatening initially, which helps us get in and get
little resistance. And then we must turn up the sexuality as the sarge

progresses and the IOIs increase.
So how do you turn it from LEAP to FLOW? Well, you have to do ROUTINES
first to practice. After successes, it will become flow. So, be a
machine: wait for three IOIs, then phase shift. Do you have a
phase-shifting pattern or routine? If not, write some down and use
them once you get IOIs. Give yourself kino moves to use too. Write
them out if you have them. Soon they'll become natural for you.
>Maybe if I take a lick at that SP, I won't forget to put my hand on her ass
and
>stear the conversation towards sex! Your thoughts?
Yes, but these aren't being sexual. They are ways to force sexuality
into a sarge. But they work. SO, in addition to the above, find ways
to transition the convo into the sexual. For example, a good one is
Juggler's "If your life was a book and that book was made into a
movie,what would it be rated?" discussion thread.
Here's something I tell HBs, but it applies to you too. I do believe

it...
THE SIR ISAAC NEWTON PATTERN

"Listen, we're adults. I won't lie to you. Sexuality does potentially
create conflicts (though less so if you're both mature people), but
what's also true is that any attempt to stop the conflict by
eliminating or controlling sexuality only creates more and often
greater conflicts. If you try to turn off your sexuality or go
celibate for whatever spiritual or religious or personal reason, all
you're doing is creating more pressures, more conflict, more tension.
A lot of great historical figures--Sir Isaac Newton, John Ruskin, and
Immanuel Kant--were virgins who went mad from sexual repression. If
you negate sexuality, you are negating yourself. To be an animal is to
be sexual, and we are animals. We like to break ourselves off into
separate parts-intellectual, emotional, sexual. But that is just the
way we think and organize; in truth we are not fragmented. So that any
time there's a total response in any situation, the whole being is
there and because the being is sexual, sexuality is always there in
any total response. To have a free flow of energy, there must be
sexuality in addition to everything else. It can display itself in a
look, a touch, in a quality of attention. People cut off others or try
to ignore them or resist or fight feelings because they are afraid of
being turned on, afraid of seeing someone as they are, afraid of love
because they think they don't know how to handle it. But you know
what? It takes more energy to turn yourself off than it does to let
yourself be turned on."

>After writing this SP about sexuality, I'm still not convinced that I covered
>everything yet. There's something else. It may be related to the first SP,
>but it is more general. More about life. hard to explain, so I'll use a
>football analogy here.
>I'm just running the ball and making short passes. Not going for the classic
>long Favre bomb across the field for a touchdown. I'm a bit too conservative.
>But I AM becoming less and less conservative over time. If you met me two
>years ago instead of this year, you would have NEVER believed that I could
talk
>to strangers at all. But I dont really GRAB THE BULL BY ITS HORNS - >in LIFE.
>I haven't yet developed the balls for that.
Yes. You have made great progress. Now you must master the NEXT stage.
Do this by writing out and practicing the phase-shifting stuff above.
And then get some *close patterns/routines/lines under your belt.
>Something about my own authority. My authority over myself and >others.

>Sometimes I'm afraid to take over a groupset, or veer a chick off her >daily
>schedule to get her back to my place in daytime PU. For example, when >a girl
>says "I have plans tonight", I don't yet have the balls to say >something like
>"so change your plans, call your friends and tell em you'll be a >little
late."
>Just another example, but you get the general idea. I want to move >through
the
>world with AUTHORITY. I may have SOME authority in SOME situations, >and I do
>know that I have solid confidence in my abilities and competence. But >I
still
>feel that I haven't reached my potential YET.
Dude, you ARE incredible. Considering the hurdle that YOU have to deal
with because of your particular situation, it is AMAZING what you can
do and what you're capable of. Not only that, but I think that BECAUSE
of your uniqueness in this respect, it makes you MORE attractive to
HBs than you might be otherwise. It brings out something in them that
you can capitalize on. Anyway, to get the guts to be ballsy, it's
easy. This is a journey that I am going through too. What you have to
do is TRY ON this new behavoir, and see if it works. Do it in a
cocky/funny way: read Zan's posts and get David D's emails to get a
feel for it. That way, y ou're not being a jerk, you're being arrogant
and funny and in control of your world. I think, knowing you, that you
could have this particular problem licked in one month.
>At the moment, I'm not 100% self-assured yet. Hell I don't even know >if I'm

>making any sense... its all in my head I think.
No one is ever 100 percent assured...but I know what you mean... There
are times when ALL of us here feel a little powerless or like we
should be more of a MAN. We read the FRs here and know what's possible
and then when we DON'T do it in a situation, we're very hard on
ourselves. You've come a long way, man. This is just a tiny roadblock
you'll get past.
See you soon,

CPowles
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"Style" <0>
Wed, 27 Nov 2002 09:34:00 GMT
subject: Re: OP-Inner-im lazy and rely on my appearance
You got some good responses here--from jasmine, zyxzxyz, spirit etc.
Plus, Psychobabble, I don't TOTALLY buy what you say here: I mean,
otherwise, why have you been in this community for so long if not to
learn and improve your skills?
On Tue, 26 Nov 2002 15:43:00 -0500, psychobabble wrote:
>I'm a fucking lazy bastard. I am very reluctant to change. I like chicks

>coming to me for cock. This was no problem in my teens/twenties. I am now
35.
>I never developed social skills in seducing women. I used to just show up and
>wind up with some pussy regardless of the shit that I babbled out of my mouth.
>
>I'm now 35 and have recently put on 40lbs (lost 10 over the past couple
weeks).
>
>This isn't really an inner sticking point because I don't think I really want
>to put much work into my inner confidence (i.e. feeling confident even if I
>don't look studly).
Okay, that's sad...
>I'm not really expecting any feedback on this one because I very likely may
not
>put any effort into changing this. I like being a CAVEMAN. I like grabbing
>chicks and making them want to fuck me.

So why HAVE you been here since the ASF (no-m) days then?
>My plan is to loose about 20 more

>pounds and then start taking legal steroid precursors and build up my physique
>so that I can pull chicks by grunting, moaning, and pointing at my cock, and
>pulling them on the dance floor and then out the door.
You're funny...
>The professional and personal stress that lead to the weight gain has
>significantly decreased and I expect it to stay this way for a while.
But your body is still changing....
>Is it possible for a leopard to change it's spots? Given the choice, would he
>want to? I like the feeling of being a powerful sexual entity when I walk
into
>a bar.
This has nothing to do with weight or looks. David X is one of the

ugliest guys I've ever seen in my life. Makes Ross Jefferies look like
David D'Angelo (just joking--sort of).
>All this entertaining chicks, etc. I don't know, I don't think I'm cut out
>for it.
>
>I like to demonstrate my value by leaning over then while they sit at a table,
>or by doing my thing on the dance floor, or in the bedroom ;)
>
>What are people's thoughts on this?
>
My thought is: What's your REAL sticking point. I don't buy this
somehow. I've seen you post your stories and game. They weren't all
just grunting and pointing to your dick and dragging an HB off the
dancefloor by her hair.
But to take this post literally, you don't NEED to palm read or do
magic tricks or have a gimmick if you don't NEED it.
So, let me ask you, are you getting the RESULTS you want? If you are,
you have no SP. If you are not, then what could you do differently to
get those results?
CPowles

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"Style" <0>
Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:05:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-Inner: I'm Rude and Have No Manners
Nice responses here. Don't know what else I can say... But see below
anyway...
On Wed, 27 Nov 2002 01:57:00 -0500, jlaix wrote:
>haha just kidding. While it may seem otherwise due to the often inconsiderate
>tone of my posts here, while sarging I am always polite and well-mannered. I
>have to be able to do this, I work at a hotel. My fake response is at this
>point indistinguishable from a genuine one. But someone suggested I take the
>"SP-Inner Challenge," so here goes.
>
>In reality, my SP-Inner would be that I am emotionally dead. Somebody once
used
>the phrase "emotionally cauterized" to describe me, I just don't feel many
>things. I have a real nightmarish Hollywood-plot background and as a result, I
>really don't care about anything anymore.
The fact is, some would say this is an ideal state for PU. Ross says
that he imagines covering his heart with a metal plate. That's not how
i work, but good for some. It is, however, a personal SP. It is nice
to be emotionally engaged in life...
>For example, tonight I asked my Primary of 2 years if she would still love me
>if I all of a sudden ripped off an elaborate costume to reveal that I was
>actually a bald Latino she-male with fully functioning cock. She said "Yes,
>would you still love me?" I was just silent. she looked and said, "haha...
>still? You never did love me, huh?" I said, "You know I can't feel that." And
>she actually started getting tears in her eye. I "felt" bad, but shit, I don't
>want to lie to her...
Hey, who here could really say yes here? Fact is, you set yourself up
for the return question. So your SP here is stupidity. Thinking about
anyone I dated, I don't think I could still love them if they were a
she-male with a cock. I do hope one day to feel a love that strong for
someone, but doubt it. This doesn't make you an emotionally shut down
bastard; it makes you a normal man.

>Anyway, I feel that this is somehow holding me back in my quest for PUA
>mastery. I can't exactly articulate HOW it actually hinders my game, but I
just
>suspect that it is, and probably seriously. I don't know... but I guess that's
>the purpose of posting an SP, so maybe someone else could provide insights or
>advice.
Hey man, what I SHOULD do is reread your posts. You have an

interesting, rare attitude in them that both helps and hurts your
game. So I will readdress your SP later. There's not enough here to go
on. Despite what I say above, you're a complicated guy and I'm sure it
both attracts and scares away the HBs...
Anyway, you go on to say:

>Overall i think you guys have given me some good advice here. I know I need to
>cut down on the alcohol (I am definitely a drunk), but it seems difficult when
>1my main sarge venues are BARS. I'm gonna cut it down to one drink a day,
>tops... eliminating it completely does not seem feasible to me at this point.
I am so sick of reading FRs where guys feel GUILTY for not drinking.
For me, I tell people that I choose when I get drunk and when I don't
. If I felt obligated to drink every time I went out, I'd be drunk
every night. It's MY decision. Just because I'm out and in a bar
doesn't mean I NEED to drink. That's weakness. I have NO apologies for
drinking juice/soda'/water in a bar. I drink what I WANT to drink WHEN
I want to. Easy...
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:15:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-inner: deadlock
This is NOT a SP. This is just your general meditation on this

newsgroup. You're not very specific here, so it's hard to interpret.
But I think I've figured out your SP anyway. Read on, oh conflicted
one...
On Wed, 27 Nov 2002 22:21:00 -0500, cloudninevirtual wrote:
>I am reluctantly posting this...on some perverse level you guys have
>become a support network..of sorts.

Weird, ain't it?
>I don't want to become a PUA. There you go, I said it. I am resisting it
>and not putting in the work required to take me there. If that was all
>there was to it, I would simply unsubscribe from the NG and go back to
>the emotional highs of AFCdoom.
Good: Set your OWN goals. Don't let the trends of this newsgroup
influence you. I'm sure everyone here has slightly different goals.
>But the ideology of this forum is most insidious; I don't think there is
> a real going back. I consider myself reasonably rational and mature,
>and I feel compelled to give credit to the content vehiculated here,
>after the noise is averaged out. Perhaps the hardest truth to accept
>(and most rewarding) was that my end values are no better than anyone
>else's here.
Yes, you're the guy who's caught in traffic behind a car accident and
complains about everyone rubber-necking and holding up traffic. Then
you drive past, slow down, and rubber-neck yourself.
>If tomorrow I had the magic choice between becoming a certified PUA or
>the caring father of two, with a loving wife, white picket fence and dog
>house, I would choose the latter in a heartbeat; yes that was a
>mononuclear family and a monogamous relationship. The reality is that I
>am not any closer to either, but instead I am internally deadlocked.
Fine. I agree. Me too. And I know that the experiences I have as a

result of what I've learned here will make me a more confident and
secure husband and father, because I'll have no regrets and I'll know
that I didn't settle
.
>Going in ANY direction is better than sitting in the middle of the road.
> The pure unspoiled AFC is actually a lot happier with his state than I
>am; knowledge of the game disturbs me, and instead of getting me
>enthused TD style, it only jades me more.
>
>How do I get out of this rut? My end values are largely delusional, at
>least in this day and age.
All our end values are delusional. Welcome to reality...
>Cloud9
>
Good for you. Here is what I gather from your post:

1. Ignorance is bliss
2. Hypocrisy is misery
3. You think too much.
4. You have internal conflicts that, in the big picture, are total BS.
My advice:
Let go and embrace your self. Embrace your nature. And decide: are you
on the bus or off the bus. You're only going to hurt yourself if you
stand in the doorway with one leg on the staircase and the other
dangling in the street.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:25:00 GMT
subject: Ending SP-Inner Thread: Additional Thoughts
So, that was fun. And productive I hope. Time for me to get back to
real life. I will post my SP-Inner when I can formulate them better. I
know they have something to do with deservedness and fear of breaking
rapport and trying to please everyone and passive-aggresiveness. But
it's more specific than that. Will try to figure it out.
I also note that some of the people who DIDN'T post Inner SPs here are
people who have a high (often inflated) opinion of themselves. That's
a good thing, for the most part, but there are other fatal personality
flaw that are harder to see. We could ALL be doing better. Who here is
REALLY living their IDEAL in terms of the opposite sex. I know I'm
not.
That said, it's interesting how everyone's REAL SP-INNERs are all
pretty similar. I think it ALL has to do with a quote from the Huna
book: THE WORLD IS WHAT YOU THINK IT IS. You live in the reality you
believe in and create. And I think we could all stand to create a
better one.
I'll leave you with a little more general SP-Inner advice: I think
the vitality of your life force, whatever that means, is something
that is crucial. When I meet guys who are receded back into their own
heads, they don't do well in the fields. When I meet guys who project
their energy outwards, they do well. So if you imagine your body and

your soul, for lack of a better metaphor, where does your soul reside?
If it's a tiny little shadow in the middle of your body, you must work
on it. When it's a halo penetrating through your body and surrounding
it with a glow that is sometimes called charisma or magnetism, then
you're on fire.
This sounds new-agey, but I can't think of any better way to explain
it.
Anyway, it's been a pleasure. Thanks for your honesty. We'll return to
our regular SP thread sometime in the near future, because I have tons
of new tactics to share.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:30:00 GMT
>Hey Styles,
Your SP is that you spell my name wrong...
>
>We met at the MM workshop at Chicago. What your evaluation for me would be?
>
>Kontol
>PS. thanks for recommending the goatie and more peacock on the clothing (ie.
>fake earrings etc.). I've gotten more stares this weekend than 3 months
>with no peacocking combined.
Cool, man. Read the End of Thread post and the comment on projecting
your energy.
Watching you in the field, you have two sides:
The wuss who walks through the world afraid that someone is going to
hit him in the face.
The cool, fun,mellow, humorous guy who people love to be around.
I saw the first guy at the beginning of the workshop and the last guy
at the end. KILL the first guy. BE the last guy. As I said elsewhere,
THE WORLD IS WHAT YOU THINK IT IS. So, somewhere along the line either

your parents or your early friends didn't instill in you the belief in
yourself that you need. (neither did mine.) You must do this yourself
through: SUCCESS in the field and SUCCESS in school, work, and
whatever else you apply yourself to. With that success will come the
confidence in yourself that you need. Take the risks, choose the
adventures, do the things that are not in your "nature," and learn
who KONTOL really is and could be.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 29 Nov 2002 09:14:00 GMT
subject: Re: Ending SP-Inner Thread: Additional Thoughts
On Thu, 28 Nov 2002 17:51:00 -0500, spirit wrote:

>
>> I also note that some of the people who DIDN'T post Inner SPs here are
>> people who have a high (often inflated) opinion of themselves.
>
>Hmm... Is this the passive aggressiveness coming out? Quite a `rude`
>comment without naming names and giving reasons for why you think that...
>
>Am I one of the people on your list of inflated egos? A simple `yes` or
>`no` and I`ll tell you why I haven`t posted any SPs
No, if you have to ask--you're not. Said "some," not most or all.
Really not meant as passive aggressive. It's just encouragement for
everybody (on their own time--not in the mirror) to see themselves for
a moment as strangers see them. Hell, videotape yourself.
>> That said, it's interesting how everyone's REAL SP-INNERs are all
>> pretty similar. I think it ALL has to do with a quote from the Huna
>> book: THE WORLD IS WHAT YOU THINK IT IS. You live in the reality you
>> believe in and create. And I think we could all stand to create a
>> better one.
>
>My only problem with this is that whilst we can and often do create worlds
>for ourselves, we still have to interact with people with different
>worldviews, different `reality tunnels`... Finding people who you can share
>that with, step into and alter *each others* reality in a positive way is
>unfortunately rarer than I`d like it to be!

Agreed. Don't think these contradict. Flexibility is also key as a

pua. Point is: if you think people don't like you, you'll project that
and they won't. If you think SHBs are all hitting on you, you'll
project that and they will.
>>
>> This sounds new-agey, but I can't think of any better way to explain
>> it.
>
>It was cool as it was bro =o)
Thanks for the thoughtful post, Spirit!
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 29 Nov 2002 09:29:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP Inner: striving for perfection
Hey man,
Though I ended the thread, had to respond to you. After all, you saved
my ASS when I saw you in Italy. Got me to the train on time! Even got
my ticket stamp so that I didn't get fined on the train. Have I ever
thanked you for everything, man? I wish we'd gotten to actually sarge
together instead of running around!!
Anyway, onwards:
>Hi Style,
>
>I have been reading the materials(but never fully). I have so many different
>kinds of seduction stuffs. Really, I am just piling them up.
>
>I have never cold approached and closed although I have know about seduction
>for 2 years now(too long).
>
>The thing is I am trying to learn this stuff so that I can make the perfect
>pickup.
Cools gave you good advice here. Fuck the perfect pickup. Just back up
and take it one step at a time. The guys I've seen who improve the

FASTEST don't put this pressure on themselves. They treat the

bar/club/;cafe as a virtual world, like a video game. And they keep
working on each board until they get the skills and find the patterns
to progress to the next level. If I recall correctly, one problem is
that you live in a small town and it's hard to find new targets. Well,
stale out your town. Then stay with friends in other nearby towns. Or
go to the closest big city to you. Spend a weekend just approaching.
IMHO, you must change your image of yourself in your head. You need to
find some good people to model. Change your fashion, get a tan, and
get a confident expression on your face. Move through the world with
confidence, authority, and love for yourself and what's around you.
What I said in the "ending SP post" about pushing your energy
outwards: that applies to you. Figure out how to do that.
At the same time, do what I've told everyone else: SMALL CHUNK it into
your game. Don't do the perfect PU for now. Find the perfect opener
that works every time FOR YOU. Then find the perfect thing to do NEXT
to carry on the convo or demonstrate value. STOP amassing stuff. STOP
reading. Choose the skill you want to master: hw analysis, palm
reading, cube, whatever. As you're doing this stuff in the field, work
on your Inner-SPs mentally.
>Probably this leads to the obvious conclusion that I am afraid, yes I

am...fear
>of the unknown.
What can I say here? The only way you learn is by entering the
unknown, by taking chances. Show me one great person who didn't!
>I lack organizational skills, thats why I don't have a plan either.
I don't believe this. I think you just need to take the time and sit
down and come up with your routine. Make that list of sequential
tactics I've been telling everyone else about. I showed you mine, yes?
>I would love to hear anyone who can tell me how they plan to succeed in the
>quest for becoming a PUA.
Five words: through experience in the field.
>This would give me a good idea how to go about my own plan, also PUA's here
can
>tell u if there is any improvement in your plan to be made.
Your plan is this: take it one piece at a time. Master everything

sequentially. At the same time, do something physical with your life:

work out, swim, whatever. Get in sharp mental and physical shape. At
the same time, PRACTICE constantly. You will NOT get this
intellectually anymore than you will learn how to sail a boat by
reading the manual. You must get in the boat, grab the mast and
rudder, and go for it. It won't be easy to handle at first, but soon
you'll be sailing like a pro.
>ciao
>
>Thanks Style for this.
See you soon!
CPowles
>Giovanni
>"Convictions are more dangerous foes of truth than lies."- Nietzsche
>
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 29 Nov 2002 09:40:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-inner: I'm stuck
On Thu, 28 Nov 2002 19:25:00 -0500, zeev1 wrote:
>Hi Style & everyone.

>
>I'm stuck. What should my next move be?
I'm an addict: okay, last one then I take a break from NG for a while.
Had a rough night tonight: happened to be at party with total
supermodel (in photos she's a 10, but in person honesty a 8..5). She
was with her bf. I #closed, but it was a soft one. No romantic
possibilities, IMHO. And I wasn't in good form.
Anyway, on to your stuff...
>
>My target is lay. As soon as possible. For that matter I'm currently not
>interested in say learning and practicing group tactics. Because it doesn't
>directly serve my target. Neither I'm interested in learning too much
>stories to make my game "perfect". All I need is a quickest way to lay, I'm

>interested only in learning the most neccessary parts of The Art as

>possible, to get a lay. I don't care that not knowing so much nice routines
>will get me into embarrassing situation or two. That - I can eat up & live
>with, if I still can get laid after that.
You will LOSE with this attitude. This is the attitude of the novice.
I recently had an experience I should post about (an instructive
failure report). I was IN. She was HOT, and LOVED me. She kept saying
how sexy my voice was and how she played my answering message for her
mom (my voice sux, btw) and how I'd better be a good kisser because
that's important. Anyway, I LOST a SURE MLTR because I tried to RUSH
it and PUSH it and GET the lay as soon as possible.
I want to get the lay ASAP too, because that for me is the best way to
get and keep a quality woman. And because after, it takes the tension
out. Now you can have a normal relationship with each other.
BUT, as Mystery pointed out after I lost the sure-thing lay: A novice
tries to win a chess game in seven moves. But, he does this by simply
hoping his opponent will make a mistake. He seizes that opportunity
and wins. But when his opponent DOESN'T make a mistake, he loses. Now,
a chess master waits 12 to 15 moves to win. It takes LONGER, but he
ALWAYS wins because his plan is perfect. So don't be a horny beginner,
be an oversexed master. (Suddenly Mickey Rourke in Wild Orchid comes
to mind.)
>What's the next obligatory&most

>neccessarry parts of the game that I must learn or practice if only what i
>want is a lay, don't care if it's from HB6. Say learning kiss close on the
>first approach is absolutely extra in my case I think.
BTW, this isn't an inner-SP. This is just a regular old SP in your

game. Maybe impatience is your inner SP.
>I'm at the point where I am comfortable approaching, today I approached 3 at

>the university, 3 in club (during 1 hour I was able to), no number closes in
>none - some didn't go past the opener, one said I'm waiting for my
>boyfriend, one just simply seemed uninterested in me&my stories. I can
>handle MM's openers & stories: know einstein (i.e. elvis), floss, esp,
>mannequin story, ant farm story, strawberry fields game, IC pattern
>(learning rose pattern). I can cause, through using minimal c&f and opener
>and one & two stories, the girl to drop her shield and start talking to me
>like a friend (one actually said today, when I parted her when she met her
>bf, "It was nice talking to you" - with intonation that she really liked
>it..) I believe that I can be good with patterns: I can use that tone it's
>so natural to me to talk deep etc..

Okay good. You have OPENING down. You have demonstrating value down.
And you can create a little bit of an emotional connection. But how
are you REALLY at creating rapport? Is that easy? If so, then the next
step is...
....making it physical.
>I'm bad with kino.. I don't do kino at

>my sarges mostly at all. I remember sometimes during sarge: Ahh I must do
>kino and touch her on hand and then pull my hand back..but this stuff is
>happenning once-a-sarge most time during a sarge I'm forgetting about it
>(can't remember after every story especially I'm trying to be entusiastic
>with stories and this keeps only this in my head, while forgetting about
>kino). I can close I think...did this like 15 times in last year: let's
>exchange numbers so we can talk again... got only One date so far, of course
>no kino during it, and some bad fate has caused me not to see her again (and
>it's final).
Okay, kino is easy. Should be natural. You do it unnaturally. Watch

people who touch others in a non-octopus way when they speak. Touch
her to get attention. make your touches firm or masculine, not soft or
wussy. Anyway, learn my EVOLUTION PHASE SHIFT routine. See the post
from the earlier SP thread about phase shifting/kino for techniques.
>So on what should I concentrate next, can you help me out?
1. Build an emotional connection tactics/rapport tactics/find

commonalities
THEN...
2. Phase shift routines
THEN....
3. Kiss close routines
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 29 Nov 2002 10:00:00 GMT
subject: Re: Ending SP-Inner Thread: Additional Thoughts

On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 04:55:00 -0500, spirit wrote:
>Yeah, have to agree with you there bro... it wasn`t so much a contradictory
>point as something that popped into my mind whilst listening to a song ( the
>lyrics being "two worlds collide, two together" ) My point was that, at some
>point your world WILL collide with someone elses and although it`s perfectly
>reasonable for you to assume that the world is still as you see it, and
>still what you think it is, if you don`t take their world into account it
>all falls apart pretty quickly... (IMHO)
>
>I guess that whilst I agree on many levels with your point about the world
>being what you think it is I just want to add my own two pence and say to
>people take the blinkers off, look at yourself for a while and look at other
>people a little longer than you may have done in the past....
>
>Perhaps a better way of saying what I`m thinking would be that when with a
>HB - The world is what (the TWO of ) you think it is. If you retreat back
>into your own mind without putting any energy into that `you become we` for
>a given moment then both your worlds will stagnate... or something like
>that! lol
>
Agreed. I LOVE creating that NEW world between two people, because it
is ALWAYS different. I think we see eye to eye here. We're
anti-solipsism....
And don't tell me you're talking about the Iron Maiden song...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 29 Nov 2002 10:04:00 GMT
subject: Re: SP-inner: I'm stuck
On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 04:40:00 -0500, Style wrote:
>On Thu, 28 Nov 2002 19:25:00 -0500, zeev1 wrote:

>
>>Hi Style & everyone.
>>
>>I'm stuck. What should my next move be?

Fuck, I gotta go to sleep. But I think about these things. ..
In the BIG picture, I have a feeling that you are not comfortable
around girls, esp girls you are attracted to.
So the next thing to do is to get FRIENDS who are girls. And to get a
GIRLFRIEND. She doesn't have to be a knockout. Just get a girlfriend,
get comfortable interacting with and relating to women, so that you
are in control....
Apologies if I've misinterpreted you here, but it's a feeling I get

from reading your email.... just allow yourself to be around women as
much as possible WITHOUT an agenda.... that's your next move if my
analysis is correct.... if not, well, just do what I said in the
previous post still goes...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Dec 2002 04:12:00 GMT
subject: Re: What is a playette? Need an answer
On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 05:03:00 -0500, softcontrol wrote:
So I think a playette is
>a woman that knows how to play the game so that she can get what she wants,
>whatever that may be. Certainly, it's going to at least be getting the best
>available mate, and I'm not speaking in terms of money here. A golddigger
>can be a playette if she has a boyfriend (or boyfriends) on the side that
>fulfill her other needs. Remember the rocks for gold metaphor? Well, if a
>PUA is adept at getting the gold, then a playette is adept at getting the
>rocks. So think of it that way.
Nice. You nailed it. Answered. Thanks, man!
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Dec 2002 04:20:00 GMT
subject: Re: Some cool stuff for you guys and esp Tyler

>Here is my FORTUNE COOKIE ROUTINE.

>
>Print out 3 small pieces of paper and make them worn-out and dirty. On the 3
>pieces of paper there should be some general wisdom.
>
Wouldn't it be easier to just take three fortune cookies and remove

the fortunes next time you're at a chinese restaurant??? Otherwise,
nice story.
>
>Here is my CRAZED BOYFRIEND STORY.
>
>"You won't guess what happened to me today. I have this friend Robin. (Robin
is
>a rare name here) Imagine a guy with a name like that. He is one of my best
>friends, we usually hang out together and we usually get into the funniest
>situations when together. We have this friendgirl we have known for like 10
>years. We were hanging out together when we were little children. The girl
>moved to the country but a few weeks ago she came back to the capital and
>rented a flat. She invited us to visit her sometime and since we were hanging
>out together in the city with Robin we decided to visit her. Robin had been to
>the place once before and he knew the address. So I park the car in front of
>the house and we go upstairs. Robin rings the bell. 1 ringing nothing happens.
>2 ringing nothing happens. We are about to ring a 3rd time when the door opens
>and this HUUUUGE guy is standing there. He was 2 meter tall, 1,5 meter broad
>and his head was shaved bald. You can guess it, we were a little scared. So, I
>ask: "Hi. Where is Katie?". Nothing happens and we think that everything is
>allright when suddenly this guy blurts out and starts screaming "What the fuck
>do you want from my Katie?". He grabs Robin and starts to bump his head into
>the door. I was standing there while this guy much stronger than me is beating
>up my friend and I didn't know what to do. So, suddenly I make a quick
>decision, and step on the foot of the huge guy. He drops my friend and I pick
>Robin up and we run. We are running down the stairs and the guy is behind us.
>We jump into my car and I start the engine. I hear a knock and I see from the
>mirror that guy is hanging on the car. I could hardly start off without going
>through his feet.
>
>So we are heading away and suddenly my phone rings. I pick it up and it's
>Katie. Meanwhile Robin is sitting next to me, the size of his face is double
of
>the original, and he is screaming to Katie like a wounded lion. Katie doesn't
>understand it at first than we finally "solve" the mystery: it turns out that
>there are semi-detached houses in the area and Robin missed the address and
>went to the wrong house. Poor Robin..."

Don't buy this one. Is it actually true? Don't know if it works, so I

would have to hear you tell it....
>CONJURING GHOSTS STORY:

>
>"3 years ago my ex-gf was holding a party. The party was crazy and there was
>this guy dressed very gothic. At around 3 o'clock in the morning people
>started to leave and we were getting more and more sober. You know that when
>you are getting sober you always start talking about shit and you open up. So
>there was this cool convo between a few ppl and this guy and it turns out that
>this gothic guy conjures ghosts. So we decide to try the stuff out. We set up
>everything, we darken the room, bring in candles and incense and we sit in a
>circle. The guy tells us to clear our minds, hold each other's hand and
>concentrate. 5 mins go by, 10 mins go by, 25 mins go by and nothing happens.
>Suddenly we hair a loud noise coming from the kitchen. Much like the falling
of
>an object. So everyone rushes out to the kitchen, only to see that there is
>this trophy on the ground. Everyone is scared to hell when it turns out that
>some funny guy atteched a very thin string to the trophy in the kitchen, and
>pulled it when we were conjuring ghosts. Before the joke turned out the most
>surprised was the gothic guy, who thought that he finally succeeded in
>conjuring a ghost ;)
Cute story. But just fills space, that's all. At best, it gets her
taking about the unknown. But it would be better to have a story
that's NOT a trick and is REALLY the unknown, to make her comfortable
talking about her spirituality etc.
>
>BOYFRIEND DESTROYER ROUTINE
>
>"I'm gonna ask you some questions, and I don't want you to answer with words.
>I want you to answer with your hand. I'm gonna ask you about some things like
>your job. If something is close to your heart, hold your hand close to your
>heart. If it's far away, hold your hand far away. If it's in between, hold
>your hand there.
>
>"Now, how close is your job to your heart?
>
>"Think about something you're really passionate about, like a hobby. Do you
>have it? How close is that to your heart?
>
>"How close is your boyfriend to your heart?
>

>"How close is your family to your heart?

>
>"Now, if I was to offer you another job that was right there [he moves her
>hand near her face, closer than her original job], would you take it?"
>
>She answers yes.
>
>"And if a some guy came along [Chris is waving his hands toward me] who was
>right there [he moves her hand so it's touching her nose], would you take
>him?"
You mean HEART above here, not nose. I originally posted the routine,I
believe, and I use her NOSE not heart. But I'm sure the heart works
just as well. It's a GREAT one. And, half the time, if she puts her
hand to her nose when she's talking about her bf WITHOUT hesitating,
then either A. She's recently engaged OR B. She's totally lying.
>
>
>STYLE'S FEMALES AS SEXUAL PREDATORS ROUTINE
>
>Do you know (and I'm giving away a great "routine" here) that it is
>FEMALES, and not males, who are the only ones who have an organ in
>their body made SOLELY for sexual pleasure. And that organ has twice
>as many nerve endings as a man's entire penis. And that organ has more
>nerve endings packed into a single small space than anywhere else on
>the body. With all that being EVOLUTIONARILY true, wouldn't you think
>that it would be FEMALES who are the sexual predators?
And let's add too that she's capable of having ALL kinds of
orgasms--clitoral, vaginal, blended, etc--and we can only have one.
PLUS, she's capable of having orgasm after orgasm, whereas most guys
just have one and then are done, which means she's DESIGNED to be
having sex with multiple men in a community....
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Dec 2002 04:28:00 GMT
subject: Re: The RULES of the CUBE

>Rules of the cube:

>1.Asking questions during the game will fuck it up (Don't elaborate on how it
>will fuck it up. Just leave it at that). So you can not interrupt and ask
>questions b/c I will not answer.
NO! If she wants to talk, let her talk. It's INFORMATION THAT YOU CAN
USE. Remember, the goal is SEDUCTION/ATTRACTION/RAPPORT. It's not to
"Do the cube!"
>2.Close your eyes
Allow her to jmake up her own mind. Just tell her to either close her
eyes or keep them open; whichever way she visualizes best. This way,
she's more comfortable.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 02 Dec 2002 04:30:00 GMT
On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 22:15:00 -0500, Mannix wrote:
>On 9/5/02 6:34:24 PM, Style wrote:

>>Every now and then, as soon as
>>you approach an HB, she gets
>>sexual
>>right away with talk. Not
>>trying to turn you on or go
>>kino, but simply
>>being very open and frank and
>>joking about sex. I don't know
>>if I need
>>to give examples, but we've
>>all met them: right away, they
>>start
>>talking dirty or showing off
>>their ass or being super frank
>>about sex.
>>
>>And, this does NOT mean that
>>they're easy; it's just that

>>it's what
>>they do, sometimes even as a
>>cover up for their own
>>prudishness.
>>
>>Anyway, the question is this:
>>How do YOU respond when the HB
>>starts
>>sexual talking right away.
>>Because, with THESE types of
>>women, it does
>>NOT mean you're in AT ALL.
>>Because right now they'll talk
>>the talk,
>>but not walk the walk. The
>>two responses are:
>>
I found the answer to this, finally. When she says something like this
to intimidate you or whatever (and it's BEFORE you have enough RAPPORT
to really have her want you), just look at her with EC, shake your
head up and down and say, with a slight smile creeping across your
lips, "Respect." Say it in a c/f way. It works EVERY time.
For the Brits here, I got the line from Ali G...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 05 Dec 2002 02:28:00 GMT
subject: Inner and Outer Game Tips
Just a couple quick thoughts:
INNER:
After reading all the SP-Inner posts, and hearing some roundtable
discussions with women that an LA seduction teacher I know made, I
realized what DOES NOT work. It doesn't work if you come off as
socially awkward, and it doesn't work if you try to be a cool player
either. What BOTH of these have in common is that they are
SELF-CONSCIOUS. So, the goal in the field, is to move through your PU
with a TOTAL lack of self-consciousness. That is what it means to be a

natural.
OUTER:
I realized that there is a KEY element of attraction that is NEVER
discussed in this NG (to my knowledge). And that is having AMBITION.
To women, car, job, money, status, etc.--all that does matter to some
degree. But what is MORE important is having ambition, a goals,
direction. So what I'd advise everyone to do is to come up with a
paragraph-long mission statement. And, at some point during your PU,
when a natural opportunity arises, tell it to the girl with excitement
and a gleam in your eyes. If you are a musician, tell her your dreams
and ambitions and hopes. And if you're a computer programmer, tell her
you are working on a code to play all media files (or whatever--I know
nothing about computers). It is going to be called the Yourname Code,
and, if all goes well, you will actually become a household name
because your name will be on everyone's computers.
That may not be the best example, but all of us here have a non-PUA
dream. Figure out what it is, and share it. HBs are like talent scouts
sometimes; they want to hitch themselves to the rising star before
anyone has discovered him.
There are certain switches that must be flipped to create attraction.

Things like being desired, having confidence, having value, being a
protector, etc. This is one of them...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Thu, 05 Dec 2002 06:05:00 GMT
subject: Isolating Out of Group Sets With Instant Attraction
Phew. What a header. But this has been happening to me a lot. And I
read Stevie PUA's first Australia FR, about when they're with the
girls on the bridge and one is instantly into them, but they can't get
her alone the whole night.
So, what do you do when: You sit down to join a group set. And, right
away, within three or four minutes, you are getting ALL the IOIs from
one of the girls there? How do you extract her from the set to start
making out before you've won over and disarmed everybody?

Often, if you just wait it out, and try to disarm the group, the
window can close...
Thoughts? Suggestions?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 06 Dec 2002 14:58:00 GMT
subject: Re: LONG: Toronto - Mystery, No9, TylerDurden, Eddy, TwentySix and PiQL!
On Thu, 05 Dec 2002 15:24:00 -0500, twentysix wrote:
>There was a cool scenario where No9 told me to approach a three set, so I did.
>Now, the interesting thing was that he didn’t directly approach with me.
>I’d approach first, run my opener, then he’d saunter in a little after.
>I realized what was going on here. It was a lot easier for the HBs to take one
>guy going in with the opener, rather than two guys walking in at once (that
>just looks lame).
>
Yes. This is how it IS done. Never mentioned it, because we do it

instinctually now. It works SO much better when just ONE guy
approaches. Then, when it LOOKS like it is either staling out or time
to isolate, your wing comes in. He says, "Was he telling you about
the..." And the PUA who approached says, "Yeah, the Rikki
Lake/Spells/Dental Floss/Whatever thing." And the Wing goes, "And so
what did you guys think?" And, bam, he's in the convo, and can wing
everyone else while the PUA slips away with the HB of his choice.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 06 Dec 2002 15:01:00 GMT
subject: Re: Tap Water Opener
This made me laugh. Love it. Because, correct me if I'm wrong, it

wasn't long ago that your wing was buying girls champagne and wine.

Isn't this a much better way to do it? Love it. Will try it...
BTW, what ever happened with that female PLAYER who was driving you
crazy by blowing off plans. I agree with what others said: you gave
HER the power. Basically, say, "I am going to ???? on ????. I will
pick you up/meet you at ???." The problem is that you already let her
get away with flaking. NEVER let a chick say that she'll call you
before to confirm or anything like that. It's a shit test. You did
everything so well but failed that shit test. Did you ever get
together with her?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 06 Dec 2002 15:03:00 GMT
subject: Re: Tap Water Opener
PS I don't know why I never thought of this before. Next time an HB

asks me for a drink, I'm going to say "sure" and get her some cool
refreshing water! Awesome...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Fri, 06 Dec 2002 15:04:00 GMT
subject: Re: HB's going for skinny guys?
I'm a twig.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sat, 07 Dec 2002 18:11:00 GMT
subject: Re: Starfucks Coffee

On Sat, 07 Dec 2002 03:02:00 -0500, jlaix wrote:
>
>Tomorrow, I'll be ready. I'm gonna meet this little Starbucks Bitch for lunch
>on an insta-date when I see her next. How many fucking IOIs does a nigga need?
You've been thinking about this too much, and you may blow it because
you may NERVOUSLY RUSH OUT with the idea. So when you go back next,
take your time. A couple C/F statements. If there's a big line behind
you, say some c/f stuff, then sit down. When it's quiet, walk back up.
Do it like a teasing kiss. Have her be DYING to have YOU ask her to to
something with you after work. And DON'T say, 'let's go do something
after work." LAME! Say, instead, "I'm going to XXXXX then. You should
join us." or something like that. As if you ALREADY have plans and she
is welcome to JOIN you for them, but you're going to be doing them
anyway, with or without her.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 08 Dec 2002 18:56:00 GMT
subject: Re: MATRIX Opener.
Here's an interesting Matrix pattern. I got it off the Mindlist NLP

group (it's not mine). So apologies to the original poster because I
don't have his name. Try combining this with your opener to really
blow her mind....
ORIGINAL POST:
MATRIX PATTERN
Basically, this seduction is another "what-if" type of pattern, but

this
one is much cooler because it causes a meta-cognition of a woman's
existence...as well as your own. For a brief moment in time, it
re-frames the definition of the liason you're having (of course you're
talking to a woman as you speak dis).
----

Me : Hey Debbie...have you seen the Matrix ?
Her: Yeah...
Me : What do you think about it ?
Her : yadda yadda yadda...
Me : Interesting...interesting concept...just think...what if...
Everything around you here...isn't really...real ? Like what if...all

these things around you are just computer constructs ? This
table...this
food...all just a set of computer code that tells your brain that it
should feel this way...it should smell this way...but in fact...it's
not
really there...it's just in your mine...and everything we see
here...this is just the reality as we know it...and that there is a
more
real truth out there, we just can't perceive it...wow...cool
concept...
Then...it gets better. What if...say you...were living out in this

world
of constructs...where even the people around you...are all constructs
?
Remember the Woman in Red ? She was just a construct...then everyone
around you all had a "purpose" in your life...some were just
decorations
so you could look at something...other constructs were supposed to be
your friends...others...hmmm...what if...and this is just for
fun...what
if...
I am just a computer construct...and it was my programming that you

and
I were to meet...and talk like we are talking now...and be
friends...and
it is programmed destiny that...we be really close friends
initially,...feeling comfortable...and warm...and safe with each
other...
Then what if...and this is just a "what-if" of course...what if...it

was
my mission in this matrix...to be your lover ? (allow for some

giggling
between yourselves)...Hahaha...yeah...of course this is just...you
know......
I mean...what if I was created to meet you...a special

program...designed to hold your hand...(hold her hand) look you in the
eye and tell you "I love you"...of course, you won't FALL IN LOVE
IMMEDIATELY...because that's not fate...yet...
And then (giggle) in time...in a few months...or maybe a few days...

or
maybe as soon as in a few minutes....you notice how you feel warm
about
me...and safe...and loved...and you suddenly realize how you feel the
feelings of what it's like to fall in love...because what if the truth
was...I was created to love you...and be your lover ?
What if, in this matrix...where you are the central figure...I am to

be
your companion...and show you what it's like...to cuddle up by the
fire...holding each other...feeling warm together and for each
other...what if I was the construct that was created...to make you
fall
passionately in love...would you spend a thought to explore that
possibility ?
Hmmm...it would be easy to not take advantage of the opportunity to

spend some real time with this construct...and along with him...all
the
wonderful adventures...and all the beautiful moments that come with
him...
How more could you feel safe ? He's just a program designed for my
pleasure...hahaha...better as well take advantage of him while I'm in
this matrix...
Interesting thoughts...don't you think so Debbie ??
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>

Sun, 08 Dec 2002 19:03:00 GMT

subject: Re: Survivor Opener
Where is the next season of Survivor being filmed?
You'll have to know this, because you WILL be asked...
Nice. I like it. Fun.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Sun, 08 Dec 2002 19:19:00 GMT
subject: FR: Intentional AFC Night
I went with Swinggcat to a house Christmas party last night. We

decided on the way there that we WOULD NOT SARGE. No, no matter how
many hotties were there, we wouldn't select targets or do routines or
anything. We'd just relax and enjoy ourselves and purposely not hit on
anyone.
It was a hard thing to do because the party was ALL 7.5-9.5s. Very
attractive, classy, smart women. Just my type. And since I knew some
people already, it was easy to just relax and talk. It was very funny
to walk outside and see Swinggcat sitting at a table of all guys, just
talking. The important thing he learned is that: Most guys are lame.
They are too scared to talk to women, so they cluster into small
groups and make boring convo. And when they talk to a woman, it's
boring too. But this is okay, as you will see.
Anyway, there actually WAS a girl there I liked. Just my type: sweet
feminine blonde with a light purple top through which you can see her
nipples. Swinggcat, asks, "What are you going to do about it?"
"Nothing," I say. "Hopefully we'll just end up talking somehow."
Well, it gets time to exchange presents, and she is on the couch. And
there's a seat next to her. I ask if she minds if I sit down (total
AFC) and just sit down and say hi to her and her friends. Then I
totally do fluff. We talk about how they know the host of the party,
where they are from, where they went to school, how they know each

other, what they do for work, how long they've been in town. In other
words, all the BORING stuff. I REFRAIN from demonstrating any value or
doing any kino. It's very funny, and very difficult.
In fact when, they wanted a drink, and I TOTALLY SUPPLICATED and

brought them each a drink, LOL.
Anyway, later, as I'm leaving, her friend says, "You should say
goodbye to HB." (So obviously HB is interested in me or her friend
thinks she should be.)
So I go to say goodbye and do a total AFC #close. I just say, "We

should exchange phone numbers and get together some time" or whatever.
We exchange #s. Afterwards, I want to do my usual player move and
point to my cheek and say "kiss goodbye." Instead, I just awkwardly
wave and say I'll call her later.
I can't wait until we go out, because when she is going to be blown

away when she ends up going out with the amazing STYLE instead of the
average Chris.
What is SO interesting to me is that since I've been in the community,

I've wondered how AFCs get laid. The fact is, you can be totally
boring and awkward and nice and STILL get the #close. I mean, if I DID
game I still would have had the SAME result: I #closed my target. I
really tried to do this like I would have pre-ASF. It was SO
interesting. Is there a lesson to be learned here?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 09 Dec 2002 08:53:00 GMT
subject: Re: wore her out
Tunnces,
I've noticed in your LRs--not just this one--that you do something

that I NEVER do. And this is almost your MO. You just take off your
clothes and get into their bed, sometimes before you've even kissed.
Or, when they are in bed, you just get into the bed with them and go
for it. How do you KNOW you have enough IOIs for this. How do you
know she won't scream bloody murder. And how often is it because she

REALLY wants you, or because she just decides 'why not' and gives in?
Elaborate more on what is going through YOUR mind when you make the
decision to make these ballsy moves...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 09 Dec 2002 17:57:00 GMT
subject: Re: superstar
On Sun, 08 Dec 2002 23:36:00 -0500, Tunnces wrote:
>
> Finally, she agreed. :)
How exactly did that happen?

>
> In the morning I awoke to find an HB in my bed! :) I pulled the blankets
>off of her and got naked. My movement in the bed woke her up, then I
>pulled the sheets off of her and removed her panties --> SEX!
This has happened to me a lot lately. You go to sleep with her after
having gotten no more than a *close, but at some point during the
night or morning, you both awake at the same time and it just happens.
Another good ad for not rushing it and feeling like you've got no game
if you go to sleep with an HB who you haven't fooled around with, but
letting it happen at the right time.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Mon, 09 Dec 2002 21:28:00 GMT
subject: Re: FR: Intentional AFC Night
Great responses here: tunnces, superslicka, unchaste, etc. A couple

thoughts:

Whoever said it was looks, it sure ain't. I've NEVER had a girl say
that I'm good-looking or handsome BEFORE sleeping with me. So let's
get rid of that rationalization. However, this was a SAFE way to do it
because i knew people at the party (thus some social proof) as opposed
to doing a cold approach at a bar.
It MAY be that I've internalized the attitudes and beliefs. But, more
than that, I think I went back to the way I used to #close before I
had game. I just talked and tried to make a plan. And it DID work
before, and it does work now. Maybe, though, since HBs are very
perceptive, she could sense the PUA beneath the sheep's clothing. I'd
have to ask Swinggcat who was there with me.
After the party, we went to another party and I turned it on. And the
response was much different. I was being a total smart ass. Example:
Me (with ice tongs in my hand): If I squeezed your neck with these and
made a mark, what would your husband think? Would he think some guy
gave you a hickey?
HB: I'd just tell him it was a dog.
Me: Okay, good come here then. (Start chasing her around with ice
tongs.)
HB: Ha ha stop etc.
Me: You know, why use ice tongs? Come here (trying to bite her neck).
And within minutes, this girl WANTED me. Totally could have had her,
but there's some PUA disease that made Swinggcat and I leave the party
and go to a bar to start all over from scratch. If I was still an AFC,
maybe I would have been sleeping with that girl (though she wasn't
that hot) instead of out trying to chase more.
Finally, regarding rehearsed material: Yes, the ideal is to have ZERO

prepared. But the way to get there is to have EVERYTHING prepared, and
then slowly phase it out once you internalize everything else you
need. I am beginning to see that the ideal here is to just live
REGULAR life (not sarging subculture life) and carry these attitudes
and beliefs around with you EVERYWHERE as who you are. And all of a
sudden, everything will start to JUST HAPPEN as the NEW YOU is
interacting at work, with friends, and in the world.
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================

"Style" <0>
Tue, 10 Dec 2002 04:08:00 GMT
subject: Re: LayReport - Stevie Lays HB Writer
Hey SPua,
What's this "pig in a bar" thing you keep mentioning?
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 11 Dec 2002 03:57:00 GMT
subject: Re: LR - Fuck me 26
This is the FUNNIEST thing I've EVER read on ASF. Thanks for such a
great FR. It was hilarious to know what you were thinking the whole
time.
My favorite is when you think she says "Change your condom." LOL. What
do you think she was saying?
Dude, this was HIGH comedy. Keep 'em coming (I mean that
figuratively). And congratulations. Now you know: nothing to be so
anxious and worried about...
CPowles
================================================================================
================================================================================
"Style" <0>
Wed, 11 Dec 2002 04:01:00 GMT
subject: Re: Breakbeat's Breakthrough: How to be HSE, part 1
>About at the same time, I watched an online video workshop by a Dr.

>Seiwert (www.seiwert-institut.de, it's in german) on self-leadership
>and time management. My studying abilities and overall productivity
>leaped to a level unknown to me before.
Great post, man. Tell me, if you can, what are the general principles

ant tips of this workshop. This is MY SP!
CPowles

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file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.

ajc@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca wrote in message <6k70hj$dbi$2@news.sas.ab.ca>...

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (1 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

I had just about given up on alt.seduction fast. The rantings of R. Don

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (2 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

Please speak kindly of the dead. RDS/RIP!

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------

R. Don Steele (John White) 1941-1998 May he rest in peace.

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------

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Deja-News tracer : routing #456-38-112-23-BC-3747/far2many@:!!8565-56

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------

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-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (5 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

subject: Re: Angry-Bitter Women

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (6 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (7 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

Shit! I really thot R. Dung had croaked. Drat... He's baaaaaccckk!

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-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (8 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

You'll thank me.

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (9 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

pull your head out of your ass

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (10 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

subject: Re: you're fucked in the head

Aaaah ... good old straightforward jealousy and envy.

word to the moron, I'm a WOMAN, therefore why would i be jealous of

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (11 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

I had a question, and haven't seen this topic addressed here:

Hey, I thought Id make a recommendation for one of the most ancient PU

For Example, he advises, before going to war, asess <<moral influence

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (12 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

THEN he goes on to say: <<Victory is the main object in war. If this

AND: <<What is of supreme importance in war is to attack the enemys

kumadek@yahoo.com (Alessandro) wrote in message news:<da26ae5f.0106281652.6a9c27@posting.google.

Is there discussion anywhere or advice on how to sarge when traveling

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (13 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

difficult. Any advice, especially since sometimes the hottest, most

Also, stupid questions for further thought:

Applying lipstick/lipliner--is there any significance in how/where its

"local_d" <local_d@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<TUP%6.12673$p41.2084095@news1.rdc1.md.

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (14 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

Mon, 02 Jul 2001 06:49:53 GMT

candor88@my-deja.com (Candor) wrote in message news:<e6f23903.0106292045.bb9ab7e@posting.google.

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (15 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

So, does this demote me back to an AFCdom (or worse)? Candor or

Which is a bigger risk? Having protected sex with multiple women, or

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (16 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (17 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

good routines--they'd have to be physical ones--that can be simply

final@identity.com (Final D) wrote in message news:

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (18 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

idea, I'd be up for trying it and reporting back.

This brings up some good issues:

DeepBlue <DeepBlue@NoSpam.com> wrote in message news:<MPG.15ac581184aae58d989853@news.

file:///D|/pics/My%20Documents/ASF/Archives/archive_style.txt (19 of 686)2005.01.27 01:55:50

> it to is very old so no one will ever see it there.)

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