Welcome to EDAboard.com Welcome to our site! EDAboard.com is an international Electronics Discussion Forum focused on EDA software, circuits, schematics, books, theory, papers, asic, pld, 8051, DSP, Network, RF, Analog Design, PCB, Service Manuals... and a whole lot more! To participate you need to register. Registration is free. Click Tecmo el -1M NTO ce aT Forums > Anclog Design > Pewer Electronics '230V" 120W DC Carbon Brush motor speed control? ‘open for further repl CO are ee By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to cur use of cookies.Coper Member lovel2 Hello, I have scroll saw with 120W DC motor, speed is controlled by triac regulation in the range of 500 - 2000 any as see pic in my version for 230v) The original electronics are destroyed, So I'm thinking about how to do speed control again? Should | stick with this simple triac regulation or recommend something better? \\8V a0 "inputehmitt tigger In my opinion, the simpler the better. The circuit that you show is very simple and almost foolproof. But itis open loop, meaning that the speed will change with both load and line changes. If that is ok with you, keep the simple circuit I you require a tighter speed regulation via back-EMF feedback, while maintaining an all-discrete circuit, the following circuit courtesy of GE SCR Manual Sth edition, may be used. If your motor is a permanent magnet type and has no shunt field connection, you can eliminate D3 and D4From there, the sky is the limit with respect to complexity and features [ 5 034 FIELD 33K lzovac | 15k LT NOTE: FOR D\-Dq, SCR), SCRp, SEE TEXT. FIGURE 10.7 SCR SHUNT OR PM MOTOR SPEED CONTROL eeeEWE Coper Member level 2 2N4987 Silicon Unilateral Switch (SUS) to this day, !had no idea of the existence of such a component. ee 10-7011 ie MEEK Ene) —.. schmitt trigger SUS are not very common but still can be found on the web. Or you can roll your own as shown in the datasheet's equivalent circuitCoper Member level 2 Welll see, said the blind So far, | have redrawn the schematics according to another piece of the same saw. Speed is controlled by a 500k potentiometer, control range 500 to 1700, which corresponds to the voltage at no motor load 45 -130V. The engine is 120W with carbons, | did not find out anything more about it, From the logic of things (voltage control) it delivers 120W power only at high speeds Maybe I drew it well | miss the meaning of WR1(+R2+C4+R1) a bit 2 say a Bloc mide 50Hz ow | REE 120W Slaw | Fe a Be motor MC Fite—.. schmitt trigger The ceutnith vo capa ithe wel kno dsb tie conn toi hs Also explained on the same GE book WR1 and WR2 are te minimum and maximum speed set points Dy ee Junior Member lavel 2 Thank you for pointing out the book GE SCR Manual Sth edition, interesting book, although | just did not find a connection with two C in it, but itis discussed her, have a question about this I have a grinder that has a similar speed control and I would like to add a foot switch My first idea Parallel to PT1 and WR2 add optotriac for example MOC3052. if LED in MCO3052 is On current over R3 ids ground and voltage on diac is below its switching voltage and the big triac is open If LED is off the triac in MOC30S2 is turned off and the device is operating normally Any reason not to do it like this or a better idea? This. Cee eee oe ee ere ae aa By continuing to use this site, you are consenting ta our use of cookies Sa neebEaaenmittwigger am not following your description Why don't you draw a schematic with your ideas? SD) rior Mornborievel2 Seen es TT First optionDede Base Saansv es 120W a Dc motor Device is blocked if LED in MOC3052 is ON because the triac in the MOC3052 short current from R3 and the Diac D7 never switch and open BTAI2 triac. Itis perhaps simple and functional Second optionaes any Dre Bo 50H2 Sav 120W Yar ie _ motor FSencone DBs Her is triac MOC3052 insert between Diac D7 and Triac BTA2.. If LED is OFF is not Gate of BTA12 powered from diac and do not switch, If LED is on is Gate powerd and device , the question is how? (On small triac in MOC3052 there will be some losses that will affect the operation of the equipment. Perhaps this should be compensated by adjusting the resistance of WR1 and WR2 or am | wrong? a) schmitt trigger Use a small relay instead,‘Aug 14, 2020 Javert J) ror verb ovel2 Big, expensive, impractical. for amateurs but seriously, MOC30xx is actually small Solid State Relay ‘Aug 15, 2020 Cary Qs... ii A Triac behaves lke a relay if it actually latches, | will allow you to determine whether the short trigger pulse generated by the Diac can achieve that, erro eo Doren wlll | tied a simple simulation in Multisim the question of course is how accurate is the SPICE model MOC30S1, but in the simulation it works and the voltage drop across the triacthe upper inserted oscilogram isthe signal before and after thetic in MOC30S1 ‘According to the simulation it should work @ How it wll be in reality will be revealed, as soon as | find an optotriac, | wil try it Eten Len) Pay Thi. Cee ee ae Eien ee teeters 1 your experience and to keep you logged in if you re Sean peerende Super wear Hi You need to add a load for a more realistic simulation .. especialy voltage drop and timing Kaus eee Javert J unr temberovel2 ‘Are you right of course, multisim can simulate a DC motor, but | have no idea what R and L has a typical 120W motor with PM, Fen Ey) ae BradtheRad super Modorctor EEE | guess your DC motor is brush-type? Then it has numerous coils of wire wound on an armature, Each coil's impedance is some portion ‘ohmic resistance and some portion inductance (Henry value). You can read ohmic resistance with an ohmmeter. Inductance is measured This. ee ee ee tie ae aa By continuing to use this site, you are consenting ta our use of cookies. Sa neebEaTeceives voltage for 1/200 second, In that time the coll draws 120 Watts average, Calculate the RL time constant which yields that response, to get an idea of Henry value. ‘There's the observation that a motor draws greater current at slower speeds. At first it seems unexpected, although it makes sense when ‘we realize more current flows in an inductor the longer voltage is applied @ Kajunbee Helpful Answer Positive Rating | rot open torturer pies STRUCT speed control of brushed dc electric motor @ speed contro! Motor Dc 220vD¢ ? @ Merocontrotier based speed contro! de motor speed estimation and control of de motor© srasniess 0 motor contr | # |) &| 9] t | > PART AND INVENTORY SEARCH Cor » WELCOME TO EDABOARD.COM. > SPONSOR Forums > Analog Design > Pewer Electronics > a ee aa ee r ep By continuing to use this site, you are consenting ta our use of cookies Recep fearOnline statistics Pee Cree Senne ee Threads: Drs Pees feet Prd PNew posts Deron Pees tree ce re cee ee eet ee By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies. Sd Po Eo lashengStyle chooser Cee ce your experience and to keep you logged in if you regis Sen eran pene v Accept |