RT Interpretation

where expertise comes together
- since 1996 -
- Login
Exhibition Archive Forum Jobs More
MyNDT Email Login
All Boards Post A Topic Search

< Technical Discussions 20171 views
Veeramani
04:36 Aug-16-2013
https://www.ndt.net/forum/thread.php?msgID=49866#49866
RT Interpretation
Can anybody explain what is the composite viewing

of radiographs and also how much density accepted
within film.
Reply
+Translate
Compact NDT inspection-heads Sponsored

for measurements with active
thermography
Stand AT-Automation Technology

GmbH
2 Videos
jaimin
NDT Inspector, NDT LeveL-III @ UIC, KSA
Saudi Arabia, Joined Dec 2012,
102
12:28 Aug-16-2013
Re: RT Interpretation
In Reply to Veeramani at 04:36 Aug-16-2013
(Opening).
composite viewing is technique for shortening

exposure time by putting two films togather,
and as per asme sec.v for composite view density
1.3 to 4 is acceptable.
Reply
+Translate
veeramani
18:00 Aug-17-2013
In Reply to jaimin at 12:28 Aug-16-2013 .
Hi Jaimin,
can you explain further for me.
Reply
+Translate
jaimin
102
18:24 Aug-17-2013
In Reply to veeramani at 18:00 Aug-17-2013 .
composite viewing means seeing two radiogrpah at

one time.
Reply
+Translate
veeramani
18:48 Aug-17-2013
I have one film .

density exactly 2 at the centre and at the edge 1.8.
Gamma ray,
Is it acceptable?
Reply
+Translate
Jon Wallis
NDT Inspector, - Netherlands, Joined Feb
2010,
626
04:42 Aug-18-2013
In Reply to veeramani at 18:48 Aug-17-2013 .
If you only have one film from your examination

then this has nothing to do with composite viewing
which is when you expose two films at the same
time.
As for the density, look at the procedure or
standard you are using, this will explain the
minimum density for the job you are doing.
Reply
+Translate
Uli Mletzko
R & D, Retired Germany, Joined Nov 1998,
89
16:50 Aug-18-2013
Hello all,
I suppose that Veerami is not yet understandung

the expressions 'putting two films together' resp.
'seeing two radiographs at one time'.
If you have very thick material and/or low intensity

radiation source, you can save exposure time, if
you do the following:
Take two films according to your specification, each

with front and rear lead screen, and put them
together into the same envelope, one BEHIND the
other. Then make your exposure (rule of thumb for
exposure time: half the time you would need
according to your exposure charts for correct
density). Then develop the films.
Each film should have (as a rule of thumb) about

half the desired density. Take the two films, put
them as an overlay (one BEHIND the other) on the
screen of your evaluation illumination box, and look
at it.
This is 'composite viewing'. Of course in resulting

density in summary of both films during composite
viewing you have to fullfill the minimum/maximum
density standards according to your specification.
During evaluation take care that there is no
vibration which would shift the two films, leading to
unsharpness.
As said already above, the only reason of this

'composite viewing procedure' is to reduce
exposure time.
Regards
Uli Mletzko
Reply
+Translate
Jianjun Wu
Engineering, China, Joined Nov 2012,
21
04:36 Aug-21-2013
In Reply to Uli Mletzko at 16:50 Aug-18-2013 .
Composite exposure could also be applied upon the

component with great section change. For this
technique, the exposure speed of two films are
different, one is fast and the other is slow.
Reply
+Translate
Jon Wallis
2010,
626
15:08 Aug-21-2013
In Reply to Jianjun Wu at 04:36 Aug-21-2013 .
This is not composite viewing. The technique you

are offering is a double film technique and has
nothing to do with composite film technique which
is only used to shorten the exposure on thick
sections
Reply
+Translate
Tim
15:29 Aug-21-2013
In Reply to Jon Wallis at 15:08 Aug-21-2013 .
Hello Jon,
I do believe Jianjun is correct. ASTM E 1316-11a

defines composite viewing as "the viewing of two or
more superimposed radiographs from multiple film
exposure." Different film speeds might be used.
Reply
+Translate
Gerald R. Reams
Engineering, Industry, USA, Joined Aug 2012,
183
15:56 Aug-21-2013
In Reply to Tim at 15:29 Aug-21-2013 .
In my experience with different requirements in

different industries there are differences between
the 2 techniques.
Composite Technique is taking a radiographic

exposure with 2 or more film and combining them
to meet the density requirements (1.8 viewed
singularly 2.0 viewed multiple).
Multiple Film Technique is taking a radiographic

exposure with 2 or more film to give a single
exposure more latitude (greater range of part
thickness). Each film has to meet the minimum 2.0
requirement.
Regards,
Gerald
ASNT NDT Level III Radiographic
Reply
+Translate
Jon Wallis
2010,
626
16:59 Aug-21-2013
In Reply to Gerald R. Reams at 15:56 Aug-21-2013
.
I side with Gerald on this. I interpret composite to

mean making a single item from two or more
separates. With the double or multiple film
technique, you view the films separately not
together as one.
Reply
+Translate
Tim
15:13 Aug-22-2013
I agree with Gerald's response too, but there is no

reason that multiple films can't be viewed
(composite) together if needed. Even films of
different speed.
Reply
+Translate
Jon Wallis
2010,
626
08:49 Aug-23-2013
You wouldn't normally use the composite film

method on items with a difference in thickness, the
difference in thickness will produce one (slow film)
radiograph to examine the thin area of the object
and one (fast film) radiograph to examine the thick
area of the object.
The composite method is only used to compensate
for long exposures, not section thickness change, of
course you may use films of different speed
although how would you calculate your exposure
then?
Reply
+Translate
Tim
14:22 Aug-23-2013
Hello Jon,
I agree with the first part of your response as not

"normally used".
What would keep us from viewing two or more

films (exposed together) when geometry
necessitates?
For example an airfoil that transitions from thick

(leading edge) to thin (trailing edge). Say two films
cover all densities required. Now add a thick "boss"
or mounting pad to the airfoil. The two films top
together might be composite viewed for this area

only. "Normally" a triple load might be used, but
what if?
Reply
+Translate
Gerald R. Reams
183
15:10 Aug-23-2013
I have used up to 3 different speeds and

manufacturers routinely in the past for castings
having multiple section thicknesses with excellent
results. Appropriate penetrameters were placed as
necessary to meet density requirements.. This was
for recurring, quantity, work to save costs yet meet
the requirements.
Reply
+Translate
Jon Wallis
2010,
626
15:23 Aug-23-2013
.
My 'world' is mostly welds and I am defending my

corner from a weld configuration point of view
(where welding norms and standards apply) so I
accept that the aircraft and aerospace boffins have
different ways of doing things with different
acceptance criteria.
Welding standards (I'm thinking mainly of ASME)
explain what composite viewing is and that has
been the basis for my arguments.
I will bow out of this discussion having learnt yet
something else on my journey through the
wonderful world of NDT.
Reply
+Translate
jaimin
102
15:31 Aug-23-2013
.
as per my view
composite viewing=viewing two films at once
whatever the speed of film it has but density and
sensitivity should be achieved.
multi films technique & composite viewing =when

we are putting more than one film to reduce
exposure time & viewing them together.
multi films technique & single viewing= when we

are putting more than one film to reduce exposure
time & viewing single radio graph as our density &
sensitivity criteria are met.
Reply
+Translate
Gerald R. Reams
183
16:20 Aug-23-2013
Jon,
You have probably used multifilm techniques. Ever

shot a complete circumferential weld with more
than 1 film cassette attached? Same density
requirements but you only need a minimum of 3
penetrameters IAW ASME.
Remember I'm an old fart. I shot radiographs to

Mil-std-453 (walkibg 10 miles, bare-footed, in the
snow)
Reply
+Translate
S V Swamy
Engineering, - Material Testing Inspection &
Quality Control Retired from Nuclear Fuel
Complex , India, Joined Feb 2001,
787
17:50 Aug-23-2013
.
Dear Gerald,
As per my understanding that multiple exposure of

a circumferential weld is called panoramic
technique.
Best regards
Swamy
Reply
+Translate
gerald R. Reams
183
20:18 Aug-23-2013
In Reply to S V Swamy at 17:50 Aug-23-2013 .
Right.
You still have the same issue with density variation

for each radiuograph. However; in this case, the
density requirement usually only applies to 3
penetrameters but, each individual penetrameter
could apply to many radiographs within a 120
degree section of the exposure.
Reply
+Translate
Jon Wallis
2010,
626
00:12 Aug-24-2013
.
Most certainly have I used the technique you

described, I'm not sure what it has to do with the
composite film technique, whatever.
I suspect that I'm an even older fart than you (is
this now a male p****ing contest?), we used to
dream of walking 10 miles in the snow, when I was
a boy we walked 30 miles, with an x-ray set on the
shoulders, in -20C and shoot 40 welds in an
hour......
(you will need to have seen Monty Pythons Flying
Circus (fossil British comedy) to appreciate this).
Btw us old farts, who are 'grandfathering' the
younger ones are becoming increasingly rare,
which is why I can still earn a few groats in my
dotage.
Reply
+Translate
jaimin
102
18:26 Aug-24-2013
In Reply to S V Swamy at 17:50 Aug-23-2013 .
Mr. S V swamy what about my view is it correct or

need some clarification?
Reply
+Translate
Tim
01:29 Aug-25-2013
Hello Jaimin,
Your explanation above is "on the mark" in my

opinion.
Reply
+Translate
Eric
12:39 Jul-22-2014
Dear Tim
May I know for the exposure calculation for using

the difference types of films in one time exposing.
For the composite film technique, do you use one
set of lead screen and cassette or two films are in
separate film cassette and lead screen ?
Regards
Eric
NDE Technician
Reply
+Translate
Tim
14:17 Jul-22-2014
In Reply to Eric at 12:39 Jul-22-2014 .
Hello Eric,
You would still follow the film manufacturer's

comparative film speed.
Films would be within the same holder.
Reply
+Translate
sudhakar
19:00 Jul-13-2020
Hi sir,
superimpoes technic normaly used in three
segment a,b,c. suppose some time one film is
retake and double expose some mistake happend
to possible. so that time we accepted joint based
on only twoo films. it is possible. if any have code
or standard.
Reply
+Translate
Email Address Notify Me
Compact NDT inspection-heads for Sponsored

measurements with active thermography
Stand AT-Automation Technology GmbH
2 Videos
Product Spotlight
Extended Range Variable Wall® Piping

Calibration Blocks for Longseam
Inspection
Stand PH Tool Reference Standards

5 Showcases 5 Videos
GUL Subsea Solutions - Screeening &

Monitoring
Stand Guided Ultrasonics Ltd.

Ultrasonic Testing Immersion Tanks with

Unmatched Scanning Features
Stand TecScan Systems

USAVSJ-4-1500
Stand USA Borescopes

5 Showcases
more Showcases
Subscribe
Share...
Home Advertise
Exhibition Publish
Archive Privacy Policy
Forum Contact & Imprint
Jobs About
Members
Events
Directory
NDT A-Z
We use technical and analytics cookies to ensure that we will give you
the best experience of our website - More Info
© NDT.net - Where expertise comes together. The Largest Open
Access Portal of Nondestructive Testing (NDT)- since 1996
Accept

RT Interpretation

Uploaded by

Document Information

Copyright

Available Formats

Share this document

Share or Embed Document

Sharing Options

Did you find this document useful?

Is this content inappropriate?

Copyright:

Available Formats

RT Interpretation

Uploaded by

Copyright:

Available Formats

where expertise comes together

Exhibition Archive Forum Jobs More

MyNDT Email Login

All Boards Post A Topic Search

Can anybody explain what is the composite viewing

Compact NDT inspection-heads Sponsored

Stand AT-Automation Technology

composite viewing is technique for shortening

composite viewing means seeing two radiogrpah at

I have one film .

If you only have one film from your examination

I suppose that Veerami is not yet understandung

If you have very thick material and/or low intensity

Take two films according to your specification, each

Each film should have (as a rule of thumb) about

This is 'composite viewing'. Of course in resulting

As said already above, the only reason of this

Composite exposure could also be applied upon the

This is not composite viewing. The technique you

I do believe Jianjun is correct. ASTM E 1316-11a

In my experience with different requirements in

Composite Technique is taking a radiographic

Multiple Film Technique is taking a radiographic

I side with Gerald on this. I interpret composite to

I agree with Gerald's response too, but there is no

You wouldn't normally use the composite film

I agree with the first part of your response as not

What would keep us from viewing two or more

For example an airfoil that transitions from thick

together might be composite viewed for this area

I have used up to 3 different speeds and

My 'world' is mostly welds and I am defending my

multi films technique & composite viewing =when

multi films technique & single viewing= when we

You have probably used multifilm techniques. Ever

Remember I'm an old fart. I shot radiographs to

As per my understanding that multiple exposure of

You still have the same issue with density variation

Most certainly have I used the technique you

Mr. S V swamy what about my view is it correct or

Your explanation above is "on the mark" in my

May I know for the exposure calculation for using

You would still follow the film manufacturer's

Films would be within the same holder.

Email Address Notify Me

Compact NDT inspection-heads for Sponsored

Extended Range Variable Wall® Piping

Stand PH Tool Reference Standards

GUL Subsea Solutions - Screeening &

Stand Guided Ultrasonics Ltd.

Ultrasonic Testing Immersion Tanks with

Stand TecScan Systems

Stand USA Borescopes

You might also like