8/30/2017 CR4Thread:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?

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Anonymous WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
Poster 01/05/20083:11PM

Weareaweldedstructurefabricationcompanyandweareaskedtobuildasmall2000barpressurevessel
(tobeusedasastatic,pressurizedairstoragevesselinambientcondition)asperdesignprovidedbyour
customerwhodesigneditasperASMEBPV,SectionVIII,Div.2codeof2005.Howeverthecustomerisnow
askingthathydrostaticpressuretestbecarriedoutatatestpressureof143%oftheMAWP(2000bar)once
thepressurevesselfabricationiscompleted.TheASMEcodeof2005requiresthishydrostaticpressuretest
bedoneat125%overpressureonly.Butthecustomerisaskingwhyweshouldnotfollowthe2007BPVcode
ofhydrostatictestingat143%?WedontwanttodothatandIstronglyfeelthatthereisnoneedtogo
beyond133%,esp.whenthesamecodein2005didspecifyonly125%overpressure.Iwonderwhether
anyonewithexperienceinthislinecanthrowsomelightonthisproblem?And,whyatallASMEcodehas
comeupwiththis143%overpressure,andwhetherreallythecodeintendedthistobeappliedtothislevel
ofpressurei.e.2000barpressurevessel.

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#16"Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?"bypipewelderon01/25/20089:53PM(score1)

#1
TexasCharley Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel
Guru 01/05/20088:37PM

Iamnotfamiliarenoughwithyourappstoaddresssomeofyourfinerpoints.However,whenitcomesto
code.Youaretobuildtocurrentcoderevisions.Itisyourresponsibilitytodoso.Ifyouhaveagreedto,and
Iquote,"testpercode"thenyouareobligatedtodoso.

Itsoundstomethattheclienthaspresentedatestingspecthattheoriginalbiddidnotquoteto.Thisisnot
JoinDate:Jul2007 goodforthemanufacturer.
Location:3030'N,
9745'W,Elv:597ft. Soifadrawingsays
Posts:2432
GoodAnswers:10 1.buildtoASMEBoilerandPressurevesselcode.

2.Testpercode.

andnocodeisgivenyouaretobuildtocurrent.

Ifdrawingsays:
1.BuildtoPBVcodeJJJJJJJ(apriorrelease)

2.TesttocodeJJJJJJJ(apriorrelease)

thenyoubuildandtesttoJJJJJJ

Suspectthathelpslittleifany,butmoreknowledgeableandcurrentlypracticinghandsaresuretojoinsoon.

regards,

Charles

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#4
Anonymous Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel Inreplyto#1
Poster 01/06/20081:34PM

Mr.Charles,Thanks,yourcommentsarerightontothepointatissue.Youechoedmyownviewonthe
problem.ThemoregeneralpointIwishtoaskallinthisfield,whyatallASMEBPVcodeguyshavecomeup
withthis143%overpressurein2007whileallalongitwas125%only?Idonotseeanylogicaljustification

http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/15967/WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel 1/5
8/30/2017 CR4Thread:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
for143%ofcourse,forsmallerpressureslike10baror50bar,1.5timesisspecifiedandacceptable.Itsa
vastlydifferentwhenitcomestoahighpressureslike2000bar!And125%isasensibleandpracticallimit
forthehydrotest.ASMEpeoplehaveundulycomplicatedthiswithoutprovidingaridersuchas"applicableto
pressurelevelsupto500bar"orsomesuchthing.

Thanks

#2
Anonymous Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
Poster 01/06/20089:47AM

2000baris30,000PSI,isthereanerror?

Usuallystatictestsaredonewithwaterandthetankisfilledwithcaresothatthereiszeroresidualair.

Thenatestpressureof143%oftheratedpressureisplacedandwatchedfordecreseovertime.Ifthetank
issealeditmustholdfirm.

Iamsureyoucanfindapropertestprocedurefromthenationalpressurevesseltestingfacilityofyour
country.Ifyoudonotknow,askyourinsurancecompany,theyknowthesethings

#6
MUKULMAHANT Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel? Inreplyto#2
Guru 01/06/20084:13PM

2000Bars!!!!Wow.

Areyousure?

Andyourcompanylandedthiscontract

Fromsomebodytryingtosynthesizediamonds?

JoinDate:Dec2006
Location:
Long.92E,Lat.26N
Posts:1343
GoodAnswers:14

#8
Anonymous Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel? Inreplyto#6
Poster 01/06/20084:44PM

Itis2000bar,not2000psi.Andsynthesisofdiamondsrequiresevenmuchhigherpressuresoftheorderof
6000barIthink.

#3
mrhippo2 Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel
ActiveContributor 01/06/200810:36AM

ASMEtestingistypicallyto125%ofratedcapacity.Thisisthestandardtowhichthewallsweredesigned.
Togoto143%withoutdamagemayrequirearedesignandrefabrication,neitherofwhichwereinthe
originalspecification(Iamguessing).WhilethecustomermayWANT143%,whatdoesthecontractsay?
Typically,thedefaultstandardisASMEunlesssomeotherstandardisexplicitlystatedinthecontract.
Unlessthecustomercanshowyouwheretheysaid(onsomepartofthecontractordesignnotes)youhad
JoinDate:Aug2006
Location:OutsidePhilly
totestto143%youareundernoobligationtodoso.Too,theASMEcodesarewrittensuchthattestingover
Posts:24 125%isnotrecommendedandmaydamagethevessel.Ifthecustomerwillsignofftheirapprovalto
acceptavesseldamagedbyexceedingtherecommendedteststandards,thenanyguaranteeswillbenull
andvoid.Thevesselwaslikelynotdesignedforthe143%load.Too,therearecomponentdesignstandards
thathavelimitsonindividualcomponentstresses.Dependingontheapplicationthesenumbersmaybeas
lowas20%ofyield.Therequestedoverpressuremayviolatethedesignstandardsandyoucouldrefuseto
testonthatbasis.

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#7
Anonymous Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel Inreplyto#3
Poster 01/06/20084:41PM

To:mrhippo2:Thanks.Ifindyourcommentsusefulandrelevant.Pleasenotehoweverthatthedesignofthe
vesselcantakeoverpressureof143%too,sincethereisabuiltinsafetyfactorof2(onYS).Butthe
questionis,whentheASMEcodeasrecentas2005hasspecifiedonly125%max.overpressure,whydidthe
Codecomeupwith143%inthe2007revision.Thisisnotclear.Thecodeshouldprovidesomesensiblelimit
whenitistobeappliedtopressurevesselsratedfor2000bar.Andstrictlyspeaking,sincethedesignwas
basedon2005revisionofthecode,thesamerevisionshouldbeapplicableforallaspectsincludingthe
hydrostatictest.

#5
AbdelHalim Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
Galala 01/06/20082:44PM

Guru
AccordingtoASMEcode,SectionVIII,Division2:

http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/15967/WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel 2/5
8/30/2017 CR4Thread:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
AT301HydrostaticTestsBasedonCalculatedPressure

Ahydrostatictestbasedonacalculatedpressuremaybeusedbyagreementbetweentheuserandthe
Manufacturer.Thehydrostatictestpressureatthetopofthevesselshallbetheminimumofthe
testpressurecalculatedbymultiplyingthebasisforcalculatedtestpressureforeachpressure
elementby1.14andreducingthisvaluebythehydrostaticheadonthatelement.Thebasisfor
thiscalculatedtestpressureisthehighestpermissibleinternalpressure,asdeterminedbythedesign
JoinDate:Feb2007 formulas,foreachelementofthevesselusingnominalthicknesses,includingcorrosionallowance,andthe
Location:Cairo,Egypt allowablestressintensityvaluesgiveninSubpart1ofSectionII,PartDforthetemperatureofthetest.
Posts:1746
GoodAnswers:243 Whenthispressureisused,itshallbeassetforthintheDesignReport.

Ithinkthedesignpressureis2000psinot2000bar,otherwiseyouhavetouseASMEcode,SectionVIII,
Division3.

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#9
Peter Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
ActiveContributor 01/06/20086:15PM

JoinDate:Oct2006
Location:WestBrabant
Perhapsthereasonyourcustomeraskingfora143%hydrotestisthattheywillsellorusethispressue
Netherlands vesselinsidethebordersoftheEuropeanCommunityasthePressureEquipmentDirective97/23/EG(PED),
Posts:21 whichrequiresa143%hydrotestfromtheMAWPisapplicableoneachcodeusedfordesigncalculations.
IfthisisthereasontakecarethattheNoBorequiresalsoaPMAofthematerialsuse
forconstructionofthisvessel.

Peter

#10
TexasCharley Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel Inreplyto#9
Guru 01/06/20086:40PM

Ahh!Veryinterestingpoint.

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Location:3030'N,
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GoodAnswers:10

#11
KeithEBowers Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel
PowerUser 01/07/20086:12AM

WereIthereceivingparty,foravesselatthishighpressure,Iwouldhaveinsistedonfullcertificationson
allmaterials,weldprocedures,welderqualifications,etc.Anairreceiveratthispressurelevelisavery
dangerouspotentialexplosion.WereIthefabricator,Iwouldinsistoncheckingthedesign(withpay)to
ensureitisvalid.Ifthevesselfails,everysurvivororfamilyofvictimswillsueallparties,andfabrication
ofadefectivedesign(furnishedbyothers)isnodefense.

JoinDate:Jan2007 __________________
Location:Houston,Texas KeithEBowers,PMP
Posts:378
GoodAnswers:24

#12
TexasCharley Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel Inreplyto#11
Guru 01/07/20086:45AM

YeahIagree.Allthesubseacouplingsanddriveunitswemadereqdallcertsthroughoutandtherewas
notruesafetyissue,onlycostoffailure.

SoagainIwouldthinkfullcertsfromfillertoflanges.

JoinDate:Jul2007 __________________
Location:3030'N, Ineverapologize.I'msorrythat'sjustthewayIam.
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GoodAnswers:10

#13
mrhippo2 Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
ActiveContributor 01/07/20087:01AM

OK,Iwillechotheneedformaterialcertsforallcomponentsaswellasweldingandweldercerts.Iwas
respondingtothetestingissues,andhadmadethathorrendousassumptionthatthequestionwasonlyon
testing,andnotongettingtheproductoutthedoorwithfullacceptance.Meaculpa.

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#14
AbdulWasay Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
Commentator 01/07/20081:02PM

PleaserefertotheContractAgreementthatyoumadewithyourClienttofabricatethevessel.Gotothe

http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/15967/WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel 3/5
8/30/2017 CR4Thread:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
ElementwherereferenceofInternationalCodeandSpecificationismade.IfthatelementreferstoBPV
code,2005Editionthencontractuallyyoudotesting@125%ofMAWPandwouldnotbreachthecontractif
youdoso.IfthatelementsreferstoBPVCode,latestEdition,unfortunatelyyouwouldhavetofollow2007
Edition@143%ofMaximumAllowableWorkingPressure.IfyoudonothaveanyWrittenAgreement,then
verbalinstructionofClientwouldprevail.IfyoucomparetheOldEditionandNewwouldrevealthereason
forenhancingtestpressure.Iamsureitisbecuaseofimprovementinmaterialgrade.

JoinDate:Aug2007
Posts:98 #15
AbdelHalim
GoodAnswers:3 Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
Galala 01/08/20081:45AM

Guru
ThisvesselmustbedesignedbyprofessionalandregisteredengineerandfabricatedbyanASMEstamp
holder,andthevesselmustbecertified"U2".

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Location:Cairo,Egypt
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GoodAnswers:243

#16
pipewelder Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?
Guru 01/25/20089:53PM

MyAuthorizedinspector(Rstampforrepairsandalterations)wouldnotallowmetouseanymaterial
includingweldingelectrodesthatdidn'thavematerialtestreportsoratleastsomesortofstampinganda
papertrialbacktothemanuf.andtheMTR'softhematerial.Onnewvesselswealwaysgoto1.5mawp.On
repairsthoughitisleftuptotheA.I.butwegenerallygo80%ofmawporoperatingpressurewhicheveris
greatest.AnyA.I.thatdoesnotrequireatleastanoperatingpressurehydroonarepairisnotthinkingvery
wellinmyopinion.Mostofourvesselsareinthe1501000psirangethoughnothinglikethesehigh
JoinDate:Apr2007
Location:NorthGeorgia, pressures.
USA
Posts:672 pipewelder
GoodAnswers:33

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#16"Re:WhatHydrostatictestpressuremaybeusedtotesta2000barpressurevessel?"bypipewelderon01/25/20089:53PM(score1)

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