Imagine that you are conducting an interview of Ibn Khaldun.

Prepare a transcript of this

imaginary interview.

Interviewee: Abdur-Rahman bin Muhammad bin Ibn Khaldun

Interviewer: Muhammed Hasham Khan

Date of interview: 2 January 1405

Location of interview: Egypt

Hasham: what develop your interest in history and society?

Ibn Khaldun: Well I am from a learned and politically active family background. I received
early education which is traditionally given to us. My father was a scholarly person and I
received my initial education from him. He motivated me to acquire an education. I memorized
the Quran, learned Arabic grammar, Islamic jurisprudence, hadith, philology, and rhetoric. The
study of hadith and the way in which they were kept and pass on to us is itself writing of history
which made me critical of the rest of human history. The major changes in our time in all spheres
i.e. political, social, and cultural compelled me to trace out the history of these things. In this
way, I took interest in history, and to understand history you have to understand human society
so I worked on both.

Hasham: What do you mean by turning points in history and what is the importance of these in a
historical process?

Ibn Khaldun: The turning points in history are very important. It decides the rise and fall of the
civilizations. These are two points in history that divert the whole process of history. The Black
plague and the Mongol invasions are the turning points of history in our times. Those states who
tackle it smartly will lead the world.

Hasham: What is the role of religion in strengthening the state?

Ibn Khaldun: Well, religion plays a very important role in the strengthening of the asabiyya. It
multiplied the strength of the asabiyya because religion has the capacity to build a larger social
group irrespective of race and ethnicity. Religion has the power to glue different nomadic
societies which makes it more powerful.

Hasham: You discuss in the introduction of your book that there are two major ways in which
we understand history, the outer meaning of history and the inner meaning of history. So what do
you mean by the inner meaning of History?
Ibn Khaldun: History is a subject that is interested and easily accessible for almost all people
either they are learned or ignorant. History is also understood by an ignorant because the general
look of history is the collection of information about political events, dynasties of the past. But
history is not just the information about the events of the past, but it also has a deep meaning. At
the inner level history writing involves explanations of the causes, it deals with the questions of
how and why of the events, it also explains the origins of the things and these are the reasons
which are why history ought to be as a field of philosophy.

Hasham: Briefly tell us about the characteristics of nomadic and sedentary societies and also
discuss that how their interaction affects the rise and the decline of states?

Ibn Khaldun: By nomadic society, I mean a pure bedouin society while sedentary society I
mean cities and township life. In nomadic societies people generally live a common natural life,
they live a very tough life which the people of a sedentary society live a luxurious and easy life.
One thing I want to clear is that nomadic society is prior to the existence of sedentary society
because it was actually the nomadic society that later converts into sedentary society by
acquiring more wealth thus adopting a luxury lifestyle.
One interesting point I want to add is that the people of  nomadic society are more moral than
sedentary society people it is because the bedouin soul is generally affected first by good and
later it was very difficult to affect from evil while the sedentic soul is affected by evil due to
greater exposure to worldly and luxurious things which corrupt their soul. Nomadic people are
more brave than sedentary people because sedentary people are lazy and they want comfort and
they depend on authority for their protection, they themselves do not carry weapons and also,
they do not depend on hunting for their food as compare to nomadic. One of the most important
characteristics of nomadic society is that they have much strong social connections called
asabiyya then sedentary society.
Those nomadic societies having strong social cohesion could dominate and establish a rule over
weak social cohesion. So, the cycle moves in a way that a strong asabiyya attacks weak asabiyya
and establishes a rule. when they establish a state and make an urban society, they become weak
and vulnerable to tribe attack. From this point the decline of the state starts and the rise of other
strong asabiyya societies.

Hasham: What are the major flaws in existing historical writing?

Ibn Khaldun: The majority of Muslim historian's work is just a recording of historical events
based on false reports and was repeated by the rest of the coming historians. There are general
flaws that I found in the historical writings which put serious questions on the authenticity of the
history.
1) There is a mixture of invented reports and the use of Gossip with true reports which make it
questionable.
2) Most of the historical events are reported on the basis of errors and made opinions on
incomplete information.
3) Less competent persons are entered into scholarly discipline like history which corrupt the
discipline.
4) Without any inquiry there is a total blind imitation of the facts in history which was passed
down from generation to generation.

There is a strong need of understanding the inner meaning of history which enquires every detail
about history.  There are only a few words that are recognized as authorities and the remaining
historian just copied them. One other is which I am telling you is that historian did not restrict
their writing to their own regions, cities, and period, they should broaden their scope of history.

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