Introduction

Welcome everyone and before you is group two in this course, STB-SS401, under Johannine
Literature. Our discussion is based on two important articles found in the CBQ, an article by
Tomas B. Dozeman, “Sperma Abraam in John 8 and related Literature Cosmology and
Judgment.” CBQ 42 of 1980 and also an article by Jeffrey M. Tripp, “Claiming Ignorance
Intimidating Witnesses: Reading John 9 in Greco-Roman Forensic Context,” CBQ 80 of July
2018.

Before we continue, please allow me to welcome our panel, who will introduce themselves, I
will start with those on my extreme right…and I am Joseph Sabato your moderator. Thank you
all for joining and you are most welcome.

1. So David Odongo, would you please bring us to speed with the Guiding question?

Answer: SPERMA ABRAAM AS INTERGRAL RECIPIENTS OF THE FOURTH

GOSPEL

2. Patrick Musa, Please, for the sake of our audience, what is the meaning of Sperma Abraam?

Answer: Sperma Abraam from the Greek word sperma to mean “seed” simply means; the
descendants of Abraham.

3. Edward Nyandega, from the guiding question we have heard from David Odongo, and now
that we already know the concept of Sperma abraam to be the descendants of Abraham, what
should we expect from our discussion this morning? What does the question require us to know?
In brief please.

Answer: Our main aim is to discuss as to whether the descendants of Abraham are the intended
recipients of the fourth Gospel. Here, we will base ourselves with the two articles already
mentioned, looking into the fatherhood of Abraham in the mind of the Jews as presented by
Dozeman, what the fragments say about the fatherhood of Abraham, the views of Paul on the
real descendants of Abraham which is more or less the same with views of Justin the church
father and finally our discussion will rest on the difference between the tekna and the
descendants of Abraham as presented by Jesus in chapter 8 of John. Thank you
4. So are there any particular texts that are the basis of this discussion? Because John 8 is quite
in segments if am not wrong…Stephen Orina what is the main text of interest here?

Answer: According to Jerome Biblical commentary, John 8 is divided as follows;

I. Woman taken in adultery 7:53-8:11

II. The Father testifies to Jesus 8:12-20
III. Jesus returning to the Father 8:21-30
IV. The seed of Abraham hear the truth 8:31-47
V. Before Abraham was, I Am 8:48-59
So basically we will be more interested with the last two parts of this division according to the
Jerome Biblical commentary 8:31-59
5. David Odongo and Musa, in the article by Tomas Dozeman, the fatherhood of Abraham is
discussed identifying the Jews as the legitimate descendants of Abraham; what were some of the
reasons given as to why the Jews regarded themselves as the descendants of Abraham?

 For the Jews, Abraham was a great wanderer, moving from Ur to Haran, Shechem,
Bethel, Egypt and Hebron, the same way Israelites who were wanderers from their land
to the episodes in Babylon and therefore regarded Abraham as a symbol of the crucial
aspects of the diaspora Jewish experience
 They also based on the Abraham’s character. A victorious warrior, who sat with Kings
(Gen 14), a Mighty Prince (Gen 23), Hospitable to strangers (Gen 18), a Prophet who
interceded for others (Gen 18:20)
 Abraham was also regarded as a mediator of blessings in God’s saving plan for all the
families of the earth (Gen 12:1-3)
 Orina Stephen, According to the fragment found in Eusebius, Abraham surpasses all
men in nobility and wisdom and he was also pleasing God by his zeal for religion. This
could be another reason why the Jews identify themselves as truly the descendants of
Abraham.
 Edward Nyandega, Abraham’s origin also goes back to the beginning of time
 Abraham’s belief was monotheism which he inferred from the sun, moon, and all
heavenly phenomena.
For the Jews therefore, the above views were used as apologia for their claims as truly the
descendants of Abraham.

6. Dozeman also presents the views of Paul, Patrick Musa, What is Sperma Abraam according
to Paul?

Answer: In Pauline corpus, Paul addresses theological issues related to the Jewish law and the
inclusion of the Gentiles (non-Jews) into the Christian faith. Some Jewish Christians argued that
gentiles needed to become circumcised and follow Jewish law in order to be part of the covenant
people of God, the descendants of Abraham. Paul’s defense centered on the idea that faith rather
adherence to the Jewish law was the key to being a part of the “seed of the Abraham.” He argued
that the promise made to Abraham in the OT was fulfilled in Christ, and anyone who had faith in
Christ could be considered a part of the “seed of Abraham” circumcision and the law was no
longer necessary for Gentile believers.

7. Edward Nyandega, Let us now embark fully into Chapter 8 of John, there are two concepts
that are necessary for clarification, first are the believing Jews, then the children of Abraham?
John 8:31-38 – Who were these believing Jews?

Answer: John is calling people "believers" who were in fact deficient in their faith-
understanding of Jesus, at least according to the standards of the Johannine community's exalted
Christology. It appears more likely that these were Christians who were in danger of lapsing due
to pressure, fear, or danger and that they were probably unable to accept the radical rejection of
Israelite law and practice that John viewed as now superseded by Jesus.

8. Now, David Odongo and Stephen Orina, there is this distinction that Jesus brings up by
introducing the concept of Tekna against that of Sperma/Descendants/seed - Jn 8:39-47. Would
you please elaborate for us what he intended to mean?

Answer: To be able to differentiate these two terminologies, we have to apply some textual
criticism as to why Jesus prefers to call the Jews “Children” and not necessarily “descendants.”
The sitz en leben of these terms as used here, descendant is child of child of child and so on. A
child is only of that specific element.
  The Jews are therefore indeed the genetic descendants of Abraham, but according to
Jesus, they do not yet belong to the Abrahamic heritage because demonic paternity reveal
demonic identity while divine paternity reveal divine identity.
 A believer cannot be against another believer. They cannot receive “strangers” or
Messengers of God as Abraham did, they are not ready to embrace the word of God
spoken to them, they do not even obey as Abraham did (Jn 8:37), they do not honour God
as Abraham did (Jn 8:49).
 For Jesus, as Sperma Abraam, they would do what Abraham did, because being a child of
Abraham is equivalent to being a child of God, i.e a believer in Jesus which is a gift in
God alone. The relationship of Jews to Abraham is not only significant but also a
relationship of Jesus to Abraham. Jesus is the standard measure of genealogy of Abraham
and not the vice versa.
 Sperma abraam therefore represented the external and by part law observant followers of
Judaism while Tekna represents those who had truly internalized the truth that Jesus
taught and who followed his example.
 The opponents of Jesus are truly sperma Abraam but not truly Christians since they do
not do works of Abraham. They are not truly children of Abraham because they
destroyed freedom of Jesus. By rejecting Jesus, the Jews reject Abraham who is the one
who bears witness to Jesus.

9. Patrick Musa and Edward, Before Abraham was, I Am 8:48-59, When and where did
Abraham see Jesus? John 8:56-58

Answer: The point here is that Jesus is proving to the Jews that they are not the sons of Abraham
because they are not doing what Abraham did…Abraham rejoiced that he would see Jesus. He
saw it and was glad. This is very contrary with Jews who are seeking to kill Jesus. I want us to
pay attention to verse 40, but now you are trying to kill me, a man who has told you the truth
that I heard from God. This is not what Abraham did… (What is that that Abraham did not do?
definitely killing Jesus…is that possible if they didn’t meet?) We have two verses that we can
refer that show us when and where Jesus met with Abraham. First of all, Act 7:2 And Stephen
replied. Brothers and fathers listen to me, the God of glory appeared to our ancestor Abraham
when he was in Mesopotamia, before he lived in Haran and he said leave your country….
In Exodus 6:2-3, God spoke to Moses and said to him; I am the Lord, I appeared to Abraham,
Isaac, and Jacob as God Amighty, but by my name “The Lord”

10. that is really very informative. Before we look into the sixth sign and its connection with
sperma abraam, Edward Nyandega how would you say about the sperma Abraham? are they
the intended recepients?

John 9 The sixth sign Jesus heals the Man born blind

In this article by Jeffrey Tripp, Claiming ignorance and intimidating Witnesses, John 9 in Greco-
Roman Forensic Context, simply involves reading John in light of contemporary trial records and
literature to heighten our understanding of the nature of the scene that is, reading John 9 as a pre-
trial hearing to assess the potential testimony of the blind man.

The drama in John 9 points in some way to the complex nature of forensic process in Greco-
Roman courts. This shows that the fourth gospel may have been heard by a Greek audience as
less a trial than a pretrial examination of the evidence for and against Jesus that culminates in an
actual trial before Pilate, initiated by “the Jews”

Ordinarily the scene in John 9 is understood as a “trial” of the formerly blind man, although
admittedly a highly irregular one. It is possible we view the interrogation as a pretrial hearing
assessing whether the man would be a good witness for the persecution of Jesus.

The Jews had already laid down the three potential violations of the Sabbath, that is, kneading
(mud), healing when life is not threatened, and possibly anointing the eyes. The man gives no
hint of the first or third violations in his testimony, but does of the second.

It was during pretrial hearings that the testimony of potential witnesses was vetted, negotiated,
and even molded.

What a witness was eager to testify to was offered as something he KNEW to be true, and that
which a witness was not willing to testify was frequently presented as something HE DID NOT
KNOW so simply could not confirm. This is why there are a lot of cognitive assertions in John 9
about 11 times?