INANE ‘US 20200123979AT ca») United States c2) Patent Application Publication co) Pub. No.: US 2020/0123979 Al Kusnierek et al. () Pub. Date: Apr. 23, 2020 (54) COAXIAL STARTER J GE} ATOR AND Publication Classification AIR TURBINE STARTER. 1) mec (71) Aptian: ROLLS-ROVCE NORTH Faic mars gone AMERICAN TECHNOLOGIES Fain 19a 00601) INC., Indianapolis, IN (US) 5: 5 Cl © y (2) use. (72) Inventors: John Kusnierek, Springfield, OH (US): FOC 7275 (2013.01); FOID 19/00 lee ean ik Fosb 20083 ls esd i ful Gorn Fos Sea (ano) at 122 0130 (7) Assigns: ROLLS ROYCE NORTH » sirac AMERICAN TEaoLocies anstract INE: lntnapl 1 (0S) A aye Sr stig 0 ttine cgi is pov, Te Sum is comprises nora itt anda eon C2) Apt Nos te01t ‘tree Te erhr yhve a perbox np du The Geox na sh ny Be analy cold «spel Ce on Stet egine. The fe outer ay hatea esa taf Tie son snr nay hve a seondtrer at 5 Appl The sentra nay be ona wi he insta Related U.S. Application Data shaft. The frst starter and the second starter may each be (4 Psvsl ppleion No, 274712, fledon Oe, Suna othe ge np cl npc ne 18, 2018, another.Patent Application Publication Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 1 of 18 100~ 104 106 110 102 \ US 2020/0123979 Al 112 108 114 FIG.1Patent Application Publication Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 3 of 18 — US 2020/0123979 AIUS 2020/0123979 Al Patent Application Publication Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 4 of 18Patent Application Publication Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 5 of 18 400~. 328 US 2020/0123979 Al 14-7 FIG. 5US 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 6 of 18 Patent Application Publication vo ‘Old 9€9 Buyjdno> 89 yeys, \ : ve9 _ Weys < oee 8ze vit suv 984 ry) gov 099 Jaquay) Bunun; — ; To ~Buisey \ voosUS 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 7 of 18 Patent Application Publication a9 °9ld 9s3 Bze C Ov9 Jaquiay Bununo; —~—-}> Ofe Slv * go09US 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 8 of 18 Patent Application Publication 29 ‘Did 89 yeus an ueys | . \ veo |_-weus Sf = oe ovo vt SW ao gov Ov9 Jaquay Sununoy —~ ™ Bulse) * 3009US 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 9 of 18 Patent Application Publication a9 ‘Sid BE9 weus veo __ageus 8tE 9s3 O09 Jaquay BununoW ———}> Oee SIN ™ Bulse) *aoosUS 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 10 of 18 Patent Application Publication 8E9 yeus 99 Buyjdno a9 Old 8ze 9S3 3009US 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 11 of 18 Patent Application Publication 0r9 sequian aununow t Bze 9s3 VOOLUS 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 12 of 18 Patent Application Publication O09 Jaquiay| sununoy) ——— seo yeus aL ‘Old veo 9E9 yeus Suydnoy 8E9 i yeys col BzE 9v9 vIt 9S] 8977) gov C ft 1 << v9 ~Buisea \ g00LUS 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 13 of 18 Patent Application Publication v8 Old 969 Buyjdno> 8e9 8Eo t seus vES yeys | syeus : a) OcEe gze siv 9s3 Ob9 vaquiaw Bununoyy ——|> ~Buisey voosUS 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 14 of 18 Patent Application Publication ovo 933 Jaquiaw a8 Did geo ues Bununow tl L_ OfE siV guise “008US 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 15 of 18 Patent Application Publication ve ‘914 v6 89 yey See veo sav _ueys ge 953 L gov org saquan Bununow FT guise “yousUS 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 16 of 18 Patent Application Publication a6 ‘514 ve a9 1086, si cer It yeys Boe pS see 9s3 0v9 sequal BuguNoW ——> ~a006US 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 17 of 18 Patent Application Publication KOqea) Stor puoras 32304 daue. vIOT a puosas ajdnozeq VOT ‘Did [ pug joods auiBuq auiqiny a3e30y races OTOT xoqueag Aueyxny aej0y 800T YEYS JOUEIS IS.1ly BILIOY 900T ¥ sass ysuly 9z/919Ug ¥ [ues | zoor vOot ~ vOooTUS 2020/0123979 Al Apr. 23, 2020 Sheet 18 of 18 Patent Application Publication SEOT vEoT g0T ‘Old xoqueay Auel|xny a1e104 KOI pUuoras a1e}0y eee = 4aYeIS JSUIy O1eIOY xOgIeaD Puy aIeIOY yeus Ja1se3s puosas areioy | O€OT 8zOT 9cOT vzZor * g000TUS 2020/0123979 AI COAXIAL STARTER / GENERATOR AND AIR TURBINE STARTER ‘CROSS.REFERENCE TO RELATED "APPLICATIONS. {0001} This pplication claims priority to U.S. Provisional Patent Application No, 6247-42, tiled “DUAL MODE STARTER GENERATOR” filed Oct. 18, 2018, fist named inventor: Jon Kusnierek. The entity ofthis rie apali- cation i herby incorporated by reference. This application is also related to concurrently filed US. patent application See. No tiled “DUAL MODE STARTER GEN- ERATOR,” Docket Number 2640-00269, filed Nov. 27, 2018, inventors: John Kusnieek and Matthew 1 Stare, US patent application Ser. No titled “PARALLEL SIARTERIGENERATOR AND AIR TURBINE, STARTER," Docket Number 62640-00301, filed Now. 27, 2018, inventors: John Kusnerek and Mathew J Stare and US. patoat application See, No. __, lod “ACCES. SORY GEARBOX. WITH OPPOSITELY DISPOSED STARTERIGENERATOR AND AIR TURBINE. STARTER.” Docket Number 62640-00302, file Nov. 27, 2018, inventors: ohn Kusniere and Mathew J. Stare The eatiety ofeach ofthese applications is bereby incorporated by reference. BACKGROUND [0002] Turbine engines extract energy to perform work by ‘compressing a working fuid, mixing a fuel into the com- pressed working fvid, igniting the fvel/luid mixture, and ‘expanding the combusted fuclifuid mixture through a tur- bine. When a turbine is operating a portion ofthe extracted ‘energy is provided as the work input t the engine's com- pressor thereby making turbine operation seli-ustaning. Prior to reaching this sol-sustaining point, the work input to drive the compressor must be supplied by some system other than the turbines ofthe engine. These other systems often incorporate a starter—such as an electric starter of an ait turbine stater—that provides the motive foree to turn the engine compressor, thereby providing an airflow to the turbine that can, eventualy, provide enough work output fo drive the compressor. Such starters are often connected to the spool housing the compressor through gearboxes and shafing. SUMMARY [0003] According to some aspects of the present disclo~ sure, system for starting a turbine engine is provided. The system may comprise a gearbox, a frst starter, anda second starter. The gearbox may have a gearbox input shaft. The ‘gearbox may’ be coupled to the mine engine. The gearbox input shaft may be rotatively coupled to a spook of the turbine engine, The fist starter may be coupled to the ‘gearbox input shall. The second starter may have a sevond- Starter output shafl The second:-sarter output shaft may be ‘coaxial with the gearbox input shaft. The second starter may ‘be coupled to the gearbox input shat through the irs starter [0004] According to some aspects of the present disclo- sure, @ gas turbine stating system is provided. The gas Turbine staring system may comprise a fist gearbox, a second gearbox, a first starter, and a second starter. The fist ‘gearbox may have a gearbox input shaft The gearbox input shaft may be rotationally coupled t a spool of a gas tubine Apr. 23, 2020 “The second gearbox may be coupled tothe gearbox input shall. The fist starter may be mounted on a first-starter shaft. “The fist starter may be coupled to the second gearbox. The second starter may be mounted on a second-stater shaft. “The second starter may be coupled to the fist starter. The first starter and second starter may be located on the same side of the gearbox. 10005] According to some aspects of the present disclo- sure, a method of starting a turbine engine is provided. The turbine engine may have a gearbox, a first starter, and a second starter. The gearbox may have a gearbox shai. The first stater may be coupled 10 the gearbox. The second starter may be coupled tothe gearbox. The first starter may have a fist-stater shafl, The second starter may have a second-starter shat. The second starter may be coupled to the gearbox through the first starter. The method may comprise a first mode and a second mode. The first mode ‘may comprise energizing the first starter, rotting the first, starer, aid rotating the geatbox via the first-tarter shaft ‘The rotation ofthe gearbox may rotate a spool of the turbine engine. The second mode may comprise energizing the second starter, rotating the second-starte shaft, rotating the fist-startr shaft via the sevond-starter shal, and rotating the gearbox va the frst-startr shaft. The rotation ofthe gearbox shaft rates a spool of the turbine engine [0006] Acconting to some aspects of the present disclo- sure, system for starting a turbine engine is provided. The system may comprise a gearbox, a first starter, anda second sane. The gearbox may have an gearbox input shat. The gearbox input shaft may be rotationally coupled to a spool ofthe turbine engine. The fist tater may havea fststarter shafl. The second starter may have a second-starter shaft. ‘The second-stater shaft may be coaxial wit the fist-starter shafl. The frst starter and the second starter may each be coupled to the gearbox input shaft independently of one nether. [007] According to some aspects of the present disclo- sre, system for starting a turbine engine is provided. The system may comprise a gearbox, a firs starter, anda second starer. The gearbox may have a gearbox input shaft, The gearbox input shaft may be rotationally coupled to a spool ofthe turbine. The first starter may have a firststarter shaft ‘The second starter may have a second-starter shaft. One of the firs-starer shaft and the second-starter shaft may be rally outward of the other shat. {0008} According to some aspects of the present disclo- sre, a method of starting a turbine engine is provided. The turbine engine may comprise a gearbox, a fist starter, and a second starter. The gearbox may be coupled to the turbine engine. The gearbox may have a gearbox input shaft. The first starter may have a fistsarter shall, The fiststarter shaft may be coupled to the gearbox input shaft. The second starter may have a seoond-stater shaft, The second-starter shaft may be coupled to the gearbox input shat. The firestarter shaft may radially suround the second-starter shaft along at least a portion of the axial length of the second-sarter shaft. The method may comprise a first mode area second mode, The fist mode may comprise energizing the fist starter, rotating the first starter-shaf, rotating the gearbox via shaft te first-startr shat, and rotating a spool Of the turbine engine via the rotation of the earbox. The second mode may comprise energizing the second starter and rotating the second-starter shafl. The rotation of the second starter causes the ation of the gearbox input shaltUS 2020/0123979 AI ‘and the rotation of the first starter. The rotation of the second starter shaft is independent ofthe rotation ofthe first starter shaft during operation of the turbine engine [0009] According to some aspects of the present diselo- sure, a system for starting a turbine engine is provided. The system may comprise an gearbox, and eleesie starter, and an ‘ir turbine starter. The gearbox may have @ gearbox input shaft, The gearbox iaput shaft may’be coupled to a turbine ‘engine, The gearbox input shaft may be rotationally coupled to. spool ofthe turbine engine. The elecre starter may be ‘coupled to the gearbox input shat, The air turbine starter ‘may be coupled to the gearbox input shaft. The electric starter and the air turbine starter may be separated by the gearbox. The electric starter may be a slartergenerstor ‘connected alternatively between an auxiliary power source and an auxiliary load, [0010] According to some aspects of the present disclo~ sure, system of starting a turbine engine is provided. The system may comprise a gearbox, an electric starter, and an air turbine starter. The gearbox may have a gearbox input shaft, The geatbox may be coupled to the turbine engine. ‘The gearbox input shaft may be rotationally coupled to a spool of the turbine engine, The eleteic starter may be mounted on the gearbox input shaft. The air turbine starter may be mounted on the gearbox input shafl. The electric starter may be located on one sce ofthe gearbox andthe air turbine starter may be located on another side ofthe gear- box. The electri starter may bea sarter-generator that may bbe comected altematively between an auxiliary power source an auxiliary load, [0011] According to some aspects of the present diselo- Sue, @ method of operating a turbine engine starting system is provided. The system may comprise a gearbox, an electric starter, and an air turbine starter. The gearbox may have a ‘gearbox input shaft. The gearbox may be coupled to the turbine engine, The gearbox input shaft may be roatively ‘coupled to «spool ofthe turbine engine. The electric starter ‘may have an electric starter shaft. The electric starter shalt may’ be coupled to the gearbox input sha. The ae turbine starter may have an air turbine starter shaft. The air turbine starter shaft may be eoupled to the gearbox input shal. The ‘lecric starter andthe ar turbine starter may be separated by the gearbox. The method may comprise energizing one of the electric starter or air turbine starter, and rotating the ‘gearbox input shaft via the respective shaft ofthe one of the cleceie starter othe air turbine starter, 10012] According to some aspects of the present dislo- Sore, sysem for staring turbine engine is proved. The system may comprise a gearbox, an electric starter, and an ac turbine starter The gearbox may have a gearbox input shaft. The gearbox may be coupled tothe turbine engin. ‘The gearbox input shall may be coupled to a spool of the turbine engine. The electric starter may have an electrc- starter shaft, The elecri-starter shaft may be coupled othe sgarbox input shaft, The ar turbine starter may have an ‘ait-turbine-starter shaft. The air-turbine-starter shaft may be coupled to the gearbox iat shat. The eleti-tarer shaft and the siesurbinestrter shaft may be radially displaced, citcumferenially displaced, o bath rally and ereuner- éeially displace, with respective oan axis ofthe turbine eigine, fiom one another, The eleticstater may be a starter gonertor connect altematvely batween 39 8 inry power source and an auilary lad Apr. 23, 2020 [0013] According to some aspects of the present disclo- sure, system for starting a turbine engine is provided. The system may comprise a gearbox, an electric starter, and an air turbine starter. The gearbox may have a gearbox input shafl. The gearbox may be eoupled to the turbine engine. ‘he electric starter may have an electrc-stater shaft. The electric starter may be coupled to the gearbox input shaft. ‘The electric stater may be a starter-generator conaected altematively between an auxiliary power source and an tuxiliary load. The air turbine starter may have an ait- ‘urbine-starter shat. The air turbine starter may be coupled to said gearbox input shaft. Oaly one of the electc-starter shaft or airurbine-startr shall is coaxial withthe gearbox input shat, [0014] According to some aspects of the present disclo- sre, « method of operating a turbine starting system is provided. The system may comprise a gearbox, an electric Sarr, and an ait turbine starter. The gearbox may bave a gearbox input shat. The gearbox may be coupled t0 the turbine engine, The electric starter may have an electric- starer shait, The electric starter may be coupled 10 the gearbox input sha. The air turbine starter may have an firturbine-staree shafl. The air trbine stating may be coupled tothe gearbox input shaft. Only one ofthe electric- sarer shaft of air-turbine-starer shat is coaxial with the gearbox input shaft. The method may comprise rotating the gearbox input shaft, wherein the rotation of the gearbox ‘input shaft rotates the turbine engine, and rotating the lectrc starter. BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF THE DRAWINGS {0015} The following wil be apparent from elements of the figures, which are provided for illustrative purposes {0016} FIG. 1s perspective view ofa turbine engine and sn auiliary gearbox. {W017} “FIG. 2 is a perspective view of the amiliary gearbox of FIG. 1. {0018} FIG. 3s perspective view ofa dual mode starter generator in acordanee with some embodiments [0019] FIG. 4 is a perspective view of the dul mode Starter generator of FIG. 3 installed on an auilar gearbox. {0020} FIG. 8 isan axial profile view ofthe installed del mode starter generator of FIG. 4 {0021} FIGS. 68-6E are block dggrams of various del rode starr generators in accordance with some embodi- ments {0022} FIGS. 7A-71 are block diagrams of various dual rode starr generators in accordance with some emboi- ment {0023} FIGS. 84-81 are block diagrams af various dul rode starr generators in accordance with some embodi- ment. {0024} FIGS. 9.98 are block diagrams of various dual mode starr generators in aeeordance with some embosl- ments. {0025} FIGS. 104-108 are block diagrams of various methods of starting a turbine engine having a dual mode starter generator in accordance with some embodiments [0026] The present aplication discloses illustrative (ie, example) embodiments. The claimed inventions are not limited w the straive embodiments. Therefore, many splemeatatons of the claims will be dillrent than the illustrative embodiments. Various. modifications can. he rade to the eluied iaventons without departing fom theUS 2020/0123979 AI spirit and scope ofthe disclosure. The claims are intended to cover implementations with such modifications. DETAILED DESCRIPTION [0027] For the purposes of promoting an understanding of the principles ofthe disclosure, reference will now be made to number of illustrative embodiments in the drawings and specific language will be used to describe the same. 10028] Iustrited in FIG. 1 is @ perspective view of a turbine engine 100, The turbine engine 100 may be 2 gas turbine engine, and may comprise a fan 102, compressor sections 104 and 106, combustor 108, turbine sections 110, and 112, and an auxiliary gearbox 114, Compressor section 106 anxi turbine section 110 may each be coupled to a common spool, often known as the high pressure spool Similarly, compressor section 104 and turbine section 112, ‘may each be coupled to a different common spool, often known as the low pressure spool. Fan 102 is also coupled to the low pressure spool either directly such that fan 102 rotates atthe same speed as compressor section 104 and turbine section 112 or through a gear system, [0029] During operation of turbine engine 100, incoming air is pressurized by compressor section 104 anc then ‘compressor section 106, The compressed ar is then mixed With fel and ignited in combustor 108. The combusted aitlfve! mixture is then expanded through turbine section 110 sand turbine section 112. Work is extracted ftom the ‘combusted sifuel mixture during its expansion through the turbine sections. The work extracted by turbine section 110, ‘may be used to power compressor section 106 and various auxiliay loads, These auxiliary loads may be coupled tothe auxiliary gearbox Id (See FIG. 2) that i, in turn, coupled to the high pressure spool though gearing andlor shaft work. 10030] "As explained cartier, the above operation is self sustaining, meaning that the work output of the turbine sections, and in particular turbine section 110, is alone suticient to drive the compressor sections, and in particular compressor section 106, such that the incoming air is pressurized so that the airfvel mixture can be combusted and provide the required energy to drive the turbine. Until the opeeation of the turbine engine 100 is sel-sustaiing, ‘work must be provided from some component other than turbines to rotate the compressors. These other components are referred to as starters [0031] Two types of starters ae electric starters and air Turbine starters (ATS). Both types of starters may be con- figueed to bring turbine engine 100 from rest to point of self-sustaining operation. The eletric starter convers elec- ‘wical energy into rotational motion that dives one or moee spools ofthe turbine engine. This electrical power could be supplied by systems onboard an aircraft (ex. batteries or other eletsical power storage devices, or electrical power generators (€g., an auniliary power unit (APU). another main turbine engine, ec.) or systems extemal othe airerat, (ea stating car, ete). An ATS expands a working Muid through a tucbine to convert the working uid energy into rotational motion that drives one or more spools of the turbine engine, The working fluid for an ATS may be supplied by aircraft components (e.g, APU, another main turbine engine), or systems external tothe aireralt (eg, staring cafe). [0032] Electric starters and ATS's maybe coupled too ‘or more spools ofthe turbine engine 100 through an sux iary gearbox, FIG. 2 illustrates an auxiliary geurbox 114 Apr. 23, 2020 Connected to auiliay gearbox 114 are 2 mumber of com- ponents, including a ATS 116, generator 118 (ean inte= trated de generator, fel pump 120, ydeanic pump 122, oil pump 124, and permanent magne altemator 126 {0033} The location a which each of these components is coupled tothe auxiliary gearbox 114 is known as a pd. Auniiary gearbox pas and ther associated internal auxi- iry gearbox components ae ofen designed fo accommo date the spciti loads ofthe component that couples tothe pad. For example, the pad (and internal auxiliary gearbox Components) 10 Which ATS 116 is coupled is designed to support the hgh org Toa from ATS 116 required to start the turbine engine 100, as well the static and dynamic lads fiom the siusture of ATS 16 (eg., bending momen). Adlon components, x, hte, may be used between the ATS 116 and some components ofthe suxlary gearbox 114 such that ATS 116 is not driven by the turbine engine 100 once itreachesaselfsuszining condition. Likewise the pad to which generator 118 is connected is configured for high speed operation such that generator 118 can supply electrical power to area loads during light However, this pad may not be capable of supporting the large, starting torque load from ATS 116 {0034} As such, the panieular components that ean be coupled toa given auxary gearbox pad may be finitd Aitonally, a turbine engine soften paired with a partieu- lar auxiliary gearbox. While a turbine eagine may provide the thrust that is sufieient for an application, the electric capacity for auxiliary loads (fom, eg, generstor 118) aay be insilicient fr that application, oF a consumer may fad it desimble to prove more thn one mode of starting the engine Such demands maybe addressed by redesign ofthe tuliary gearbox to suppor diferent or aiional compo nens, changing the auiary gearbox tht is mated t0 a particular urine or selection ofa different turbine engine Towever, these options come ata large eos. {0035} As disclosed herein, the desribed embodiments overcome these imitations ofthe auxiliary gearboxes and components mounted thereto by uilizng dil mode electric starter generator (DMSG) 300. An example of DMSG 300, isillsated in FIG. 3. The DMG 300 may comprise fist starter 328 and a second staxter 330, which may be an electric starter or an air turbine starter, respectively. In accordance With some embodiments, the elecic starter 328 may bean electric starter generator (ESG) in which the ESG can provide letrical energy to auxiliary loads ofthe sigcatt ‘when the ESG is powered by the gas turbine. {0036} As can be seen in FIG. 3. The fist and second starr, 328 and 380, maybe coaxial with axis AT fist and second states, 328 and 330, may be coupled to one ‘nother uh that one starter is ally forward, with espe tive tothe tubine engine in which they are mounted, ofthe over For example, second ster 330 may be axially foward of ist steer 328 [0037] The placement of DMSG 300 is father ilstate in FIGS. 4 and 5. FIG. 4 illustrates a perspective view of MSG 300 mouated on auxiliary gearbox (AGB) 114 in relation to fan 102 of turbine 400: Further illustrated is pa 332 of AGH 114, to which a component may be coupled {0038} DMG 300 may be mounted ono a pad, soc the po 10 which ATS 116 is coupled, that is capable of sup porting the torque required to start turbine 400. By supplying tho outputs of starters 328 and 330 to a single pad, 160 dillreat modes of stating turbine 400, cletic and paUS 2020/0123979 AI matic, may be achieved without redesigning or changing AGB 114. Additionally, the electri staner $28 may also fimetion a a generator, thereby allowing for mor elect ‘power generation without changing generator 118 or oer wise changing AGH 114 to support an addtional generator 10039] FIG. § illustrates an axial eross section view ofthe turbine 400 of FIG. 4. AS can be seen, DMSG 300 is ‘mounted axially forward of AGB 114, ATS 330 may be located aially forward of and coupled to electc starter 328 10040] In accordance wit some embodiment, block dia- gains of dual mode starter generator systems 6OAE ae ilustated in FIGS. 68-6E. Wit reference to FIG. 68, the system 600A may comprise an AGE 114, ESG 328 and ATS, 330, AGB 114 may have an input shaft 634. SG 328 may bbe permancaly coupled to the input shal 634. As used herein, “pemanently coupled” s used to indicate coanec- tion that isnot provided for a selectively coupling means, such as elutch. I other words, each ofthe two components permanently coupled to one ancer will always rotate when ‘one of those components i rotating [0041] ATS 330 may be selectively coupled to ESG 328 (and therefore input shaft 634) viaa coupling 636. Coopling 636 may be clutch (eg, an overruming clutch, ahydrai- lc elu or feton clutch, et). An overnning clutch allows starting torque tobe wausierred out of ATS 330, but prevents the ATS 330 from being driven throogh the eu- pling 636 by the turbine or ESG 328. Various 1pes of ‘verrunning clutches are known, e sprang, rller ramp, wrap, and Wedge syle clutches. ATS 330 may’ having an ‘output shaft 638 that is coupled tothe coupling 636, Output shaf 638 may be coaxial wi input shaft 634. 0042] In accordance with some embodiments, ATS 330 Imay be mounted onto and supported by ESG 328. By movating one of the starters (eg, ATS 330) ont the other (2. ESG 328) the DMSG may be coupled to a single pad and input shaft 634 of AGB 114. However, tis panievlar ‘method of coupling the DMSG to AGB 114 may require reinforement of AGB 114 or other components o suppor the additional weight of DMSG compared toa loe ATS or SG. For example, DMSG system 6004 may further com ‘rise « mounting member 640 that is configured to support the weight of the DBMSG of system 600A. In acardance th some embodiments, mounting member 649 may eo ‘rise an component configueed to dampea the dynam moment load places on the AGB during aireraft maneuvers. For example, mounting member 640 nay comprise springs, shocks, or both In accordance with some embodiments, the sboeks may bean active damper tht dyoanically changes the damping rate of mounting member 640. 10043] "Movnting member 640 may couple the DMSG to ‘esing 642 o ther srt clement ofthe turbine engine Mounting member 640 may be coupled 19 ESG 828, ATS. 330, or both [0048] Turning w FIG. 6B, another DMSG system 6008, isllustated. The DMSG system 6008 of FIG, 6B is similar to that shown in FIG. 64 with some differences. Here, ATS ‘330s permanently coupled to oF mounted on input shaft 634, Additionally, AIS 330 and FSG 328 have switched positions such that ESG 328 is now more distance fom AGB 14 than is ATS 330 {0048} In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 600 is ilistated ia FIG. 6C. System 600C is Similar to system 600A with the addition of gearbox 646. Gearbox 646 may be coupled to input shaft 634 snd output Apr. 23, 2020 shafl 638 of ESG 328. Gearbox 646 may be necessary to increase or decrease the torque output rom ESG 328, ATS, 1330, or both, As further showa below, additional gearboxes ‘may’be placed between the ESG 328 and ATS 330 o account for the difereat tonyue profiles and operating speeds between these two components, [0046] In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 600D is illustrated in FIG. 6D. System 600D is Similar to system 6008 with the addition of gearbox 646, [0047] In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 600E is illustrated in FIG. 6E. System 600E is similar to system 600C withthe addition of another gearbox. 648. In this embodiment, gearbox 646 is configured to smutiply the torque outputted from ESG 328 and provide it ‘o the AGB 114 via input shaft 634 a a design torque Toad, ATS 330 is configured to provide its starting tongue at a iflerent speod than ESG 328. As such, gearbox 648 is provided sch that the output of ATS 330 is matched tothe esigned input of gearbox 646. ATS 330 may be selectively coupled to gearbox 648, or, as shown, gearbox 648 may be selectively coupleable to shafi 638 af ESG 328. In acor- dance with some embodiments, gearbox 688 has an. input- ‘o-output ratio of less than one, {0048} In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 700A is illustrated in FIG. 7A. System 700A may comprise the same components performing the same func tions as described above with respect 10 system 600. However, dhe ATS 330 of system 7004 is mounted on aside of the AGB 114 opposite of the side to which ESG 328 is, ‘mounted such thatthe AGB 114 is located between the two. ‘This embodiment may resulta smaller axial extension of the DMSG away from AGB 114 when compared to the DMSGs illustrated in systems 600A-E. Additionally, the bending ‘moment placed the AGB 114 may be reduced because the ‘Weight of the ESG 328 is, atleast partially, countered by the Weight of ATS 330. [0049] In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 700B is illustrated in FIG. 7B. System 7008 may comprise the same components performing the same fune~ tions as described above with respect 10 system 700A, however, system 700B has an additional gearbox 646, Gearbox’ 646 may be coupled to input shaft 634 and the ‘output shalt 638 of ESG 328, ESG 328 may be coupled to AGB 114 through gearbox 646. In accordance with some embodiments, gearbox 646 may have an input-o-output ratio of les than one [0050] In accordance with some embodiments, ATS 330 of system 700B may be coupled to AGB 114 through gearbox 6646. For example, a lay shaft (aot shown) may couple the ATS 330 and gearbox 646, The lay shaft may be located radially inward (oward casing 642) or outward (away from, casing 642) of a portion of the AGB 114 suck that it may extonding axially between the ATS 330 and gearbox 646. In this embodiment, ATS 380 and FSG 328 may be connected to AGB 114 via the same pad on the same side ofthe AGB. Aespite the AGB 14 separating the two starters. This embodiment may require additional support elements to suppor the ATS 330. These additional support elements may couple the ATS 330 and the casing 642, may couple the ATS, 330 and ESG 328, or both [0081] In accordance with some embodiments, ESG 328 nay be coupled to the input shat 634 of AGB 114 via a ay shaft (not shown). In such an embodiment, ESG 328 may be located on a side ofthe AGB 14 that i opposite to the padUS 2020/0123979 AI associate with the input shaft 634. Gearbox 646 may be located on either side ofthe AGB 114, such that he lay sha (not shown) is coupled either between the gearbox 686 and input shaft 634 or between ESG 328 and gearbox 646. The lay shaft may he located radially inward (toward casing 642) ‘or outward (away from casing 642) ofa portion of the AGB M4 soc that it may extend axially between the ESG 328 andlor gearbox 646 and the input shaft 634. 0052] In accordance with some embodiments, a balanc~ ing member (not shown) may be aided to ATS 330, ESG. 328, or both, The balancing member funetions primarily to ‘add weight to one (or both) of the starters such that the bending moment of one of the starters is more closely countered by the bending moment caused by the combined Weight ofthe other starter and the balancing member. 10053] In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 800A is ilustrated in FIG. 8. System 800A may ‘comprise the same components performing the same fu lions as described above with respect to systems 600A-E and TOOA-B, however, the ATS 330 and FSG 328 of system ‘800 are cach connected othe input shaft 634 of AGB 114 separately from one another. Lik systems 6008-E, ATS 330. ‘and ESG 28 may be mounted oa shafts that are coaxial with ‘one another. Specifically, ATS 330 has an output shaft 638 ‘coupling ATS 380 to coupling 636. Coupling 636 has an ‘output shaft 638 coupling the coupling 636 to the input shaft 63, ESG 328 is located radially outwanl trom and may surround the ouipt shat 638 of coupling 636. FSG 328 has its own output shaft 638 that also is located radially outward from and may surround the output shaft 638 of coupling 636 ESG 328 output shaft s coupled to input shaft 634 In some ‘embodiments, input shaft 634 may be replaced with a gear Cr other structure capable of receiving a rotational input fiom the output shafts 638. 0054] In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 800B is illustrated in FIG. 8B. System 8008 may ‘comprise the same components performing the same func- tions as described above with respect 10 system 800A, however, in this embodiment ESG 328 may be separated fom the AGB 114 by ATS 330, 10055] In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 9004 is illustrated in FIG. 9A. System 900A may ‘comprise the same components performing the same func- tions as described above with respect to systems 600: ‘T00A-B, and 800A-B, However, ESG 328 and ATS 330 may be oflset from one another such that neither is coaxial with the other. To aevommodate this alse, a gearbox 944 may be coupled to the input shaft 634 of AGB 114 and to the respective output shalls 638 of ESG 328 and 638 of ATS 330, Gearbox 944 may contain various gears that couple the ESG 328 and ATS 330 othe geurbox 944, These gears may provide for differen gear reduction ratios to account forthe different operating speeds and torque output of FSG 328 and ATS 3390, 10056] In accordance with some embodiments, one ofthe SG 328 or ATS 330 may be coaxial with input shalt 634. In some embodiments, one ofthe ATS 330 of ESG 328 may be located radially outward (ie., with respect the turbine ‘engine—here, away from casing 642) ofthe other. la some cenibodiments, ATS 330 may be located at different cit- ccumfereatial position about the turbine engine than ESG 328. 10057] In accordance with some embodiments, a DMSG system 9008 is illustrated in FIG, 9B, System 9003 may Apr. 23, 2020 comprise the same components performing the same func- tions as described above with respect to systems 900A. The primary difference betwoen system 900A and 9008 is that, gearbox 944 is now separated fom the AGB 114 by ESG. 328 and ATS 330. ESG 328 outputs via shaft 638 1 gearbox 944, Gearbox 944 outputs to ATS 330 via shalt 638, ATS 30, is coupled to the input shaft 634 of the AGB 114. [0058] In secordance with some embodiments, a fist ‘mode 1000 of starting 2 turbine engine is provided for in FIG. 10A. The method may be applied to turbine engine having a dual mode starter generator as described above in ‘one oF more of FIGS, 310 983. The method may start at block 1002, At block 1004, a first starter may be energized. The first starter may be either an ESG or an ATS. Accordingly, energized” should be understood to mean supplying. the energy required to operate the stater—electricity for an cleetrc starter anda uid for an ATS, Energizing the first Starer causes the shaft of the first starter to rotate at block 1006, Being coupled tothe fist state sha, the auxiliary aearbox will also rotate due tothe rotation of the auxiliary earbox input shaft at block 1008. The auxiliary gearbox is rotationally coupled to a spool ofthe turbine engine. There- foe, the turbine spool will begin to rotateat block 1010. The method may end at block 1012. [0059] In accordance with some embodiments, the fist ‘mode 1000 may further comprise decoupling the second starter fom the auxiliary gearbox at block 1014. ‘This decoupling may occur prior to energizing the fist stare ‘The second starter may be either the ATS or the ESG. The first mode 1000A may further comprise rotating a second gearbox at lock 1016, The second gearbox may be couples to both the fist starter and the auxiliary gear box. In some embodiments, the second gearbox may be coupled to and in between the fist and second starters [0060] Ia accordance with some embodiments, a second ‘mode 10008 of starting a turbine engines illustrated in FIG. 10B. Like the frst mode 10004, the second mode may be applied to a turbine engine having a dual mode starter enerator as described above in one or more of FIGS. 3 to 9B. The method may start at block 1020. At block 1022, the second slater may be energized. The sevond starter may be either an ESG or an ATS, Energizing the second starter cause the second starter shaft to rotate at block 1024. The first, starter may be rotated at 1026 because the frst starter and second starter may be coupled to one another via their respective shafls. In tum, the ausiliary gearbox is rotated (block 1028), as is a spool of the turbine engine (block 1032), The method may end at block 1032. [0061] In accordance with some embodiments, a third gearbox may be rotated in Block 1034. The third gearbox. may be couple the second starter and the first starter. The third hear box may have an input-o-output rato of ess than ‘one, In accordance with some embodiments, a second gear- box may be rotated in block 1036. The second gearbox may couple the fist starter and the auxiliary gearbox. Ine second gearbox may have at inpu-to-ourput rato of greater than [0062] In accordance with some embodiments, the ro tion ofthe second starters ixlependent ofthe rotation ofthe first starter shaft during the operation of the turbine. For ‘example, the ATS may’ be configured to be devoupled from the auxiliary gearbox such that only the ESC is rotated while the turbine is operating.US 2020/0123979 AI 10063] In accordance with some embodiments, either the first mode 1900A or second mode 10008. may further ‘comprise disconnecting an electric state from an auxiliary power source and connecting the electric starter to an auxiliary load alter the turbine engine has been started [0064] "Although examples are illustrated and described herein, embodiments are nevertheless not limited to the details shown, since various modifications and structural changes may be made therein by those of ordinary skill ‘within the scope and range of equivalents of the claims. For ‘example, while various gearboxes and coupling members hhave been described ercin, one of ordinary skill will understand that these components may be moslfed, moved, ‘or deleted to achieve a particular purpose, ‘What is claimed is 1A system for stating a turbine engine, comprising: ‘a gearbox having a gearbox input shat; the geatbox input shaft rationally coupled to a spool of the turbine, a fist starter having a first-starer shaft; and asooond starter having a socond-starer sha, said second starter shaft being coaxial with the fist-starter shaft, wherein the first starter and second starter are each cgoupled to said gearbox input shaft independently of ‘ne another, 2, The system of claim 1, wherein the first starter is an ‘leceic starter and suid second starter is an sie trbine startet. 3, The system of claim 1, wherein the first starter sepa tates the gearbox and the second startet. 4, The system of claim 1, wherein the second-starter sha is located radially inward of the firststarter shaft 5, The system of claim 1, wherein the second starter is selectively coupleabe to said gearbox input shat 6. The system of claim 1, further comprising a second ‘gearbox coupling said gearbox input shall and one of said first and second starters. 17. The system of claim 1, wherein both of sid first and second starters are selectively coupleable to said gearbox. inpot shaft. 8, The system of clsim 1, further comprising 2 mounting ‘member connected to one of ssid frst and second starters and toa casing of said turbine engine 9, The system of claim 8, wherein sid mounting member ‘comprises an damping member. 10. A system for starting a turbine engine, comprising: ‘a gearbox having a gearbox input sha; the geatbox input shaft rationally coupled to a spool of the turbine; a fist starter baving a first-starter shaft and ‘8 second starter having a second-starter shaft, wherein one of the fiststrter shaft and second-stater shaft is radially outward of the other shal Apr. 23, 2020 11. The system of claim 10, wherein said first starter is coupe to said gearbox input shaft vi a fist coupling. 12, The system of claim 11, wherein said seoond starter is coupled to said gearbox input shaft via @ second coupling, said second coupling being separate from said frst coupling. 13. The system of claim 10, furthering comprising a second gearbox coupling both of said first and second starers to said gearbox input shaft 14, The system of claim 13, wherein one of seid fist and second starters is selectively coupleable to said second gearbox. 18. The system of claim 13, wherein both of sad first and second starters are selectively coupleable to said second gearbox. 16. The system of claim 10, wherein said first starters an electric stater-generator and the electric stater-generator being connected altematively between an auxiliary power source and an auxiliary load 17. The system of claim 16, wherein said fist starter is Permanently coupled to said gearbox input shaft 18. A method of starting a turbine engine, sid turbine engine comprising a gearbox coupled to said turbine engine and having a gearbox input shai, a first starter having a first-startr shat couplet said gearbox input shaft, and a second starter having a second-startr shalt coupled to said gearbox input shall sid first-starter shaft radially surround ing said second-starter shaft along at least a portion of an axial length of suid second-starter shat, said method com- prising: ina fist mode: ‘energizing the frst starter and rotating the fist-starter shaft and ‘lating the gearbox via the first-startershafl, wherein ‘the rotation of the gearbox shaft rotates a spool ofthe turbine engine. 19. The method of claim 18, Further comprising: in. second mode: ‘energizing the second starter and rotating sad second starter shaft, wherein the rotation of the second starter cause the rotation of suid gearbox input shaft and said first starter, wherein the rotation of the second starter shaft is independent of the rotation of the first starter shal during operation of he turbine 20, The method of claim 18, futher comprising: ‘decoupling said second starter from said geachox input shaft, wherein the rotation of said gearbox input shaft is accomplished by applying a motive fore to si first starter tat cause the rotation of said fst starter.