DTH: There was a kvetch in the Daily Tar Heel last month that

said, Ill give Carol Folt this: she sends one hell of an email,
but thats about it. Now, I think thats unfair, but that is what
people write in the Daily Tar Heel, and I think that its
reflective of a kind of perception of you as a person who
would, you know, invest a whole lot into PR. But just talking to
people at the Daily Tar Heel, I get the sense that you do a lot
of things behind the scenes, that you dont exactly say to
students. So, if you do have any opinions to it, what would you
say to that sort of perception?
Folt: I think Id answer in a very different way. What I can say is that when
I came in . . . what my philosophy was, first of all, that I need to hire a
new team. And I dont know if students dont keep track of that, but . . .
of the 18 top administrators that were here when Holden Thorp began,
there are only three still here. So a large part of what Ive been doing was
hiring and developing a leadership team . . . But what Im very excited
about is what people dont talk about all the time, because I think were
doing it well: were bringing people in, and were keeping it going, yet
were also completely transforming the leadership team. And,
interestingly Im very proud of the people we hire but almost all of
them are nontraditional. Many came from very different backgrounds.
They werent necessarily working in higher ed or working in the more
traditional areas, but instead bringing a whole set of expertise that I think
is really valuable . . . So, as a Chancellor, these are very important for me.
I do a lot of that work, which doesnt necessarily develop in a
conversation with students . . .
I see why it wouldnt necessarily be so observable . . . The (issue)
thats the most obvious to students would be the relationship with the
state. And I thought, coming in here, youll have a new chancellor, a
completely new team. We have also a new Board of Governors, and most
of them either started when I started, or maybe a year before, but almost
all of the new Board of Governors and half the Board of Trustees were
new. So the Trustees and I both developed a real strategy where we
thought, We need to spend at least a year when were going around and
try to meet everyone. So . . . we have good relations with the
legislature, and in particular, good relationships with the governor. So
when the governor, who Ive talked to many times, was talking about
entrepreneurship, we discussed, in quite a lot of detail, all of the people
here that work in on it. So he set up a task force. He brings in the Carolina
people. So I think a lot of what I do has really been involved in developing
those relationships with the senior leadership, and making sure that
Carolina, our university, has a big and important voice in it.
DTH: I think that you are definitely are doing those things, but
I had to speak to a senior editor at the Daily Tar Heel to come

to conclusive evidence that you were advocating for UNCs

centers before the Board of Governors. So my question is, if
you asked the average UNC student what the Chancellors
doing does she stand up to the Board of Governors? What
would you say?
Folt: Well let me ask you another question I actually think that youre
casting it in a pretty funny light. I keep pretty good track of my schedule
I think Im probably out at student events more than any other
Chancellor. Im there all the time. And actually, I made a real pact when I
started I said I was going to make sure students were speaking at
every Board of Trustees meeting. Weve had students active in every
Board of Trustees meeting. Theyre serving broadly on committees. Ive
been extremely deeply actively involved in developing Carolina
Conversations, speaking out at the sexual assault panels I mean, I think
the problem isnt so much that Im not doing those things, I think we
arent as effective at absolutely at letting people know, because I dont
think its the DTHs job, or even maybe their idea, that they need to tell
what Im doing. So if I wait for them to tell it, maybe thats the problem
that itll never be told. I think that were out there all the time, yet I
think that its that vehicle for keeping every student involved is very hard,
because they dont know. So students have suggested to me to open a
Twitter feed I did that. Students suggested do a number of open
houses I did that. Students said, lets try to get more conversations
we set it up. So Ive been working across constituencies, to try and
say, how do we get students to be involved when weve got 29,000
students, and emails are such a shallow way to communicate. I think
thats the bigger issue is not what Im doing, which I know has been really
extensive over all these years its communicating it.
DTH: Going back to role of the Chancellor in relation to the
Board of Governors: Obviously, were in a time right now where
a lot of students are protesting what the Board of Governors is
doing, especially the closing down of the Center for Poverty.
Now do you see the role of Chancellor as being someone who
ought to be a representative of the community, or do you see
yourself as a person who needs to make everything work,
between the students and the upper administration?
Folt: Thats actually a really great question I love that question. I dont
think Im there just as the representative of the voice of everybody, and,
truthfully, there is not one voice. So if you ever thought that I had the
power to go and say that I represented everyone, it wouldnt be true.
That doesnt happen . . . in every one of these discussions, I can tell you,
as many statements as I get on one side, I get on the other. I think my
goal is to try to make this institution be as strong and powerful and

excellent as possible . . . In some ways, I think what Im actually supposed

to do is step above all that clamor. I mean, it would be a real mistake if
the Chancellor felt that if every time someone was agitated about
something, they had to microfilm that agitation. That is a recipe for
disastrous leadership. I need to be aware of it. I need to know what
people really think about it. But my job is to have the long view. Im the
person thats supposed to be helping us get through this time, and people
are upset on both sides. I need to be finding out how do we stay to our
mission and our moral compass? There are very bright lines that you
would never cross. I would absolutely be out there in a very public way
speaking for (those lines), but there are also times where what I really
need to be doing is getting (the BOGs) permission and helping us move
forward.
DTH: So, considering that were in an environment right now
where Tom Ross was basically just asked to step down and a
lot of students would use the word fired do you think that
if you were to publicly take a stand against the Board of
Governors and I think you just gave very good reasons why,
in many situations, that maybe wouldnt be the best idea
but do you think that, one, if you did that that, you would be
at risk of losing your job or being asked to step down, and,
two, do you think taking a public stance against them would
even be the best idea?
Folt: Well, Im not making decisions to the extent of which Im worried
about my job. Thats isnt what I think about. That isnt why I took the
job. I took it because I thought I was coming to the greatest public
research university in America. That I was coming in at a time where
everyones having real scrutiny, and I wanted to be part of an institution
that looked at every one of those issues straight in the eye and wasnt
afraid of them. That embraced them, and thought, How can we be part
of a solution? So thats really what motivates me. And with respect to
my relationship with the Board of Governors, Im very active working with
them on all sorts of things that are in our best interest. You know, I
worked with them on centers and institutes, and I did speak quite
forcefully there, and everyone that worked at the Board of Governors
would tell you that. And Im very proud of it, because I think it was
important, but what Im even more proud of is the way that we were able
to help the centers and institutes make their own case. And in fact, I
believe that we went from a likely 15 million dollar cut to zero cut of any
finances, and, in fact, one center that they think that they might want to
see increased came out of that conversation. And thats because I think
that we were very respectful. I think we worked with the Board and we
said, Okay, weve got questions. Im not going to say that we cant
have questions. In fact, Im going to try to get (the Board) so much

information that (theyre) going to understand what value (the centers)

bring.
DTH: Was that the Womens Center?
Folt: That was the Womens Center, but they looked at many of our
centers and were very complimentary to them, and they had legitimate
questions. We hadnt reviewed all the centers as we had promised to
five years ago, apparently, before I was here. So if you are part of a
system that is allowed to ask things, you have to allow them to ask them.
Then, if youre productive, and people trust you, and they think youre
going to give them an honest answer, you give them the full and honest
answer, which is exactly what I think we did. And centers and institutes
they came out pretty strong for it, and I disagreed with them publicly on
their decision about the Poverty Center. I think that went about as . . .
well, I always want more. I would have liked all of them to I want more
resources, I want everything to be positive. But I felt that lots of positive
learning came out of that.
DTH: What forum did you publicly disagree with them on?
Folt: I spoke at the Board of Governors . . . you have to realize, none of
the other schools were offering about any kind of criticism, but we were,
and I was . . . it was difficult at that moment. Of course, I wrote two
letters to the public saying I disagree with them. But I think the most
important part for us in having a relationship with the Board of Governors
is that we have to have a relationship with the Board of Governors. I think
theres a lot of polarized rhetoric everywhere. I think theres polarized
rhetoric about the Board of Governors, too. And so one of my most
important goals isnt simply helping the Board of Governors understand
Carolina. Im really trying to help Carolina help the system and the state.
And I also want, where I can, to help the university understand more
about what the Board of Governors is trying to do. So at the same time,
they did the first summit Ive ever seen, and they tried to look at K-12
education, and they did a fantastic summit. Never been done before.
They brought all the deans of all the educations schools, all the arts and
sciences. They ran an amazing summit that said, We are the great
universities in North Carolina what are we going to do to start helping
the K-12 problem? So theres stuff happening at the Board of Governors
that is not covered, just like theres stuff I do.
DTH: I mean there are things happening at the Board of
Governors, and
Folt: Thats a pretty big one.

DTH: But I think that what people are most concerned about is
the most negative things that are coming out of that,
especially the Center for Poverty closing.
Folt: Yes, people talk about the negative, but they talk about the negative
in many areas. So one area thats been very important to me, talking to
the Board of Governors, and also the legislature, was that at a time when
we might have such tough budget. There have been many years where we
were also being restricted as to what we could even do with the budget
we did have. So I spent much of my time last year talking with the
legislature and the Board of Governors about the need for flexibility, and
as a result we did get flexibility, and we did get raises into our faculty,
and they havent had them for quite a while. I mean, thats another
aspect of the things were all working with the need to develop the
relationships to talk through those complicated issues, why thats so
important.
DTH: Whats your opinion on the recently proposed bill that will
require UNC faculty to teach four classes per semester?
Folt: Im against it. Im completely against that. And I think that, if that
really looks like it has legs, well spend a lot of time really doing much
more effective job in explaining what faculty do, but I think there are
many people that understand that it wouldnt make sense in keeping this
to be a great institution, and I think many people have been speaking out
against it . . . My first thought is, I need to go talk to people and explain
to them what faculty do. My job has to be an educator. Lets get down
there, lets talk about it, and sometimes bills do come up in the legislature
that are actually pulled back by the very person that put them forward
I have no idea about that one but because they find out more
information. I always love it. I always feel that Ive succeeded if I have my
cell phone number out there to a bunch of legislatures, and they get a bill,
and theyre trying out something that seems kind of weird, that theyd
call me and ask me that. And I am getting more of those calls, too. So,
thats where Id start looking on that one.
DTH: Would you consider yourself a Democrat or a Republican
or neither?
Folt: Im an independent.
DTH: Independent? Kind of
Folt: Been registered independent three years.

DTH: Do you sort of lean more towards liberal-ish or

conservative?
Folt: Im Independent.
DTH: Just neither one?
Folt: You know, I dont feel like Id ever want to tell you what my politics
are because, quite frankly, thats my right. And I would hope none of my
students ever knew what my politics are because I really like to teach
from that position that you look at both sides of the issue, that you really
understand have some empathy try to understand that, and thats
really how Id rather live my life and also my professional life.
DTH: Understandable. Alright, cool, well, its been a pleasure.
Folt: And if you have ideas on how we can get more of the words out, the
better, because you know, I thought about sending emails, but students
always say No, I dont read your emails. But we debate this all the time.
DTH: I think, personally, just speaking as a student when
Thorp was here, when students were just kind of talking to
him, they would get the impression that he was just saying
whatever was on his mind. I think that got him into a little bit
of trouble after a while, with the whole athletic scandal, and
maybe he should have been a little bit more careful in those
regards. And so a lot of it just took place interpersonally. But
its definitely a challenge.
Folt: I think you might be a little bit remiss if you think students
impressions are captured by the editorial board of the DTH.
DTH: No, I dont think that at all.
Folt: Because I think that if youre actually talking to most of the students
I talk to, their impression would not be what youre of me not talking
to them pretty straightforwardly. And trying not to really answer them.
So, again, I think thats another part of it, having your own opinion of
what students think. You wont get that unless you have those
relationships and talk to people. But what I think is most important is
what are we really trying to do to capture student voice are we trying
to add to students ability to have input into decisions? Are we trying to
get them a better public forum? Are we really trying to be most
responsive to the issues that are most important to them at this
moment? How we teach classes? Thats what we really, in a way, have to
be judged on. What do we actually produce? How are we doing it? And

thats whats really the most important thing in the end, is are we
advancing the issues that are most important to students? And thats
harder to assess, but its what were really trying to do, is trying to figure
out the best way to do that.
DTH: Well, yeah. And, sometimes, students are just impossible
to please.
Folt: Well, thats okay. It wouldnt really be a university if everyone
agrees.