d----Original Message--

From : Gavm Hewl :t

Sent: 27 3une 2003 06 :29
to ; Richard Sarnbrook-Inb2nnal
subject: RE : re : dossiers debate

Richard .
Yes piease use anything from that first conversation in your reply to Campbell, The man was my main source for the
Ten piece and the person who told me 'No 10 spin did come into play'. Privately I am, of course, happy to tell you
precisely who he was. He was consulted on the dossier and had intimate knowledge of how it came together He is
senior and is recognised as one of the principal experts in the field of blologicaUchemrcal weapons He has a role in
government at a senior level but not at M16. I hope that is not too cryptic but I am trying to proteCt him being
identified. However- as I said - v willing to tell-you who he is.

Thanks
gavrn

-ari,r " nzl Message-

From : Richard Samb-ook-internal
Sent : Friday, JJne 27, 2003 10 "57 AM
To : Ga-din Hewitf
Subject : RE re aossiers deoate
" importance : Hign

Gavin

Thanks that is extremely useful. Do you mind d I use some of that in the Campbell reply?
Can you give me at least a broad sense of the seniority of your source for the Ten?

Tnanks
R

---Cnginal Message--
From: Gavin Hewlt:
Sent: 27 3unE 2003 08 :34
To : Richard Sambroek-Internal
Subject: re : dossiers debate

Richard,
Thought it might be heipful to mention my conversations re the 'sexed uc' dossiers O.^, the day that Andrew
v broke the story on the Today programme r'Jlark Popescu asked me whether we could add anything for the
10 00 news, Without talking to Andrew I spoke to a very respected individual who had been consulted on
and involved n the preoaration of the september dossier . He said that dossier had been based almost
entirely on UK sources He said it had been prepared over a six month period but that in the fir-.al weak it haa
become freneticw{th material being '-aken out and maternal being added. In his view'No 10 spin did come
into play' . The vew was tr,at ma:enal was being presented in a vary'black and white way'. However he still
supported the basic conclusions that Iraq had a weapons of mass destrucaon programme . On the news that
night 1 stated cleany - on the basts of this conversation - tnat'No 10 spin did come into play' .

a conversation was had on my behalf at M1e They

were mnre concemed with the intelligence unit that nad been set up 5y Rumsfeld at :nn Pentagon ' !t had
done very serious damage' . They st;li supported the basic assertions in the september dossier but there was
'unease' over the way the material had been presented

Later that day i spoke to Dame Pauiine Neville Jones Although I did not use this clip sh,e said on came-a
`.ha; at the time of the september dossier she had ",eard mutterings within the intelligence co:rminrty Again
it was not that people disagreed with the thrust of what was being published, it was just the some of the
t
caution about what the intelligence meant had been lost

Thanks

Gavi n
 ---Or4rnal Message-----
From : Gavin Hewitt
Sent ; _9 3uly 2003 05 :4 :
To ., RicOard Sambrook-Internal
Subject Re : mtgs Dr Kelly

Richard, -
Here are the details about my conversation with Dr Kelly

On May 29 I was asked by the 10 00 news whether I could take further the story on the Today programme about how
the governmen:s september dossier had been 'sexed up', i agreed but only on the basis I couid speak to my own
sources Early afternoon I managed to reach Dr Kelly in New York. We spoke on the phone for beatween ten and
"Ifteen minutes . He told me he had been involved in preparing tne september dossier He said to rne the UK dess :er
~s based 'predominantly on Uk sources,' It had been written' in a very black and white way' ancl that had caused
'unease of some substance .' In writing the dossier ' No 10 spin had come into play,' he sala. However he thought the
'foundation of the evidence was reasonable : He still thought Iraq had a weapons of mass destruction programme but
:hat'it did not constitue a major threat '-Re doubted whether Iraq had a'massive arsenal'a no questioned whether
122 mm rockets could be loaded up in 45 minutes, He did not supqort the wew tnat t~e 45 minute claim had been
inserted against the advice of the intelligence services What he did say was that the dossier had been put together
over a six montn period and that in the week before publication material had been coming in anc out of the
aculrent
W
Oq the 'casis of that converetlon I oec~ded to report what this so.:rce was telling me Later tna', afternoon I spoke
both on camera and off camera to Dame Pauline Nev :lle Jones She told me that at the time of the September
dossier she had heard 'rruttenngs' in the intelligence community about the way the JtC report had been written up;--
She clearly backed up che tn:ast of wha; Dr Kelly had told me and an that basis I toid the 10 00 ti-hey snould run with ;
my story

Du,ing that cay I never spoke watn Anarew Gllligen and 1 never spoke to Dr Kelly again . What I can say is that during
rry conversation with Dr Kelly I found him, flrm-voiced, certain in his views and very measured . He seemed a credible
source

Tnanks
avin