India The Modi Question S01E01.srt

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This programme contains scenes
which some viewers may find upsetting
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My name is Alishan Jafri.
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I am a journalist reporting
on hate crimes
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and the rise of extreme politics.
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India is a state where calls
for genocide against Muslims
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are on the rise.
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There is a very direct call
to violence
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to make India a Hindu nation.
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The Prime Minister of this country
should have spoken against it,
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but he does not speak up.
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CROWD CHANTS
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The man of the moment...
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..Prime Minister of India.
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He is the leader of the world's
biggest democracy.
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Narendra Damodardas Modi.
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He came to power promising
a new age of prosperity...
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..but his rule has been marred
by religious turmoil.
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ARCHIVE: There have been
violent protests in opposition
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to a new citizenship law
which many see as discriminating
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against the nation's
Muslim minority.
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Many in India see this law
as anti-Muslim.
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Massive pelting, massive pelting
as of now is going on.
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This series tells the story
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of Narendra Modi's troubled
relationship with India's Muslims.
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As a young child, Mr Modi
joined an organisation
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which believes that this is
a country of the Hindus.
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Could he have done more
to prevent violence
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that killed hundreds of Muslims?
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We were hearing that those orders
to let all this happen
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were coming from the top.
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It is obviously a stain
on his reputation.
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There's no way out of that.
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I'm not agreeing with your analysis.
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I'm not agreeing with
your information.
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From where you have picked up
this type of garbage, I do not know.
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He was cleared of
criminal conspiracy -
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a finding upheld by
India's highest court...
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Agenda was to destroy
Narendra Modi politically.
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The agenda was explicitly political.
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..but concerns will not go away.
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Questions remained over
Mr Modi's head for a long time,
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and they remain over him now.
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Narendra Modi has promised
to build a new India,
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but what does that mean for
the millions of people
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who belong to its largest minority?
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This regime wants to disenfranchise
the Muslims
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and make India a "Hindu nation".
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My name is Imran Dawood.
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I live in Yorkshire.
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My grandparents are from India.
So is my father.
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It was very exciting hearing
the stories from family members
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of what India was about,
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so it was a great opportunity
to do a trip at the age of 18.
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With me was my two uncles,
Shakil and Saeed Dawood,
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and my next-door neighbour,
Mohammed Aswat.
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We were on our way back
from the Taj Mahal.
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It was a long journey.
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When we actually entered the state,
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I remember the driver
saying, literally,
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"We're home now, boys. We're home."
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And then we get to a roadblock.
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There was cars being stopped
by people chanting Hindu chants.
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They were, like, vetting them.
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It was very common for people
to decorate their cars' windscreens
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with Arabic literature,
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so straight away they'd see
the owner is a Muslim.
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The car in front gets through
and then it's our turn.
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The mob surrounded us,
waving their weapons.
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Suddenly, we have an attack.
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We're just literally getting out of
the car and running for our lives.
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The first person that the mob
attacked and tortured
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was the driver.
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Then I see Mohammed Aswat
getting blows to his head.
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One of the people in the mob -
having a knife in his hand -
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is saying to us,
"Pull your pants down.
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"We want to see if
you've been circumcised,"
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and literally feeling...
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..feeling...
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..feeling, "Am I going to live?"
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I got stabbed, and then
a police vehicle pulls up.
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And then as I get in,
I remember Mohammed...unconscious.
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And this was before me blacking out.
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This is...
That's the last thing I see.
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I do not know what happened
to my uncles.
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It's...fresh in my mind,
like it happened yesterday.
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But, sadly, 20 years on
and nothing's happened.
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There's evidence out there
of what has happened
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and, clearly, these people
are walking free.
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It feels like there's
no justice there.
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ARCHIVE: 57 people have died
after
a train carrying Hindu activists
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was set alight by a group
of Muslims.
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The train was carrying thousands
of Hindus who had visited...
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The wreckage is horrific,
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all the worse for being man-made
and deliberate -
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one of the worst acts of
religious hatred India's ever seen.
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In some areas,
the grief and anger here
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have already erupted into violence.
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That's alarming news in a state
where racial hatred
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is deeply ingrained.
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Jill McGivering, BBC News,
Godhra, Gujarat.
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People were saying there had been
a group of people inside -
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they were Hindu pilgrims,
including women and children.
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Somebody had either locked them in
or kept them inside,
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poured petrol in
and set fire to them,
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and a lot of people had died.
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It was horrific.
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People were outraged.
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The perception all over Gujarat -
and, in fact, all over India -
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was that these Hindu pilgrims
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had been targeted by
the Muslim community.
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The final death toll was 59.
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The cause of the fire was disputed,
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but at the time,
Muslims were blamed.
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This is in a state which has
a particular history of tensions
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between the Hindu majority
and the Muslim minority community.
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There have been a history
of communal riots
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and of very nasty violence
between the communities.
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And the concern was,
something like this happens,
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members of the Hindu community
feel angered
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that their people
have been targeted,
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there might be a big reaction
to that.
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The Chief Minister of Gujarat
was Narendra Modi.
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He was seen as a rising star,
quite visionary -
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a man who got things done,
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somebody who was very pro-Hindu,
a very powerful, influential figure.
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I got a call from
a foreign diplomat.
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She was a diplomat of one of
the foreign Western nations.
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So she asked me, "Have you heard
what had happened in Godhra?
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"Do you think that this is
going to escalate?"
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I just used one word.
I said, "Hugely."
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My producer started
to get information
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that something was happening
nearby in Ahmedabad.
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It was clear from our arrival
that something was very, very wrong.
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As we were driving in, we were
seeing plumes of thick black smoke
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ahead of us in the centre of town.
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There were no emergency services
there. There were no police.
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My memories, then, are going into
the centre of Ahmedabad.
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There's a quite well-known square -
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there's a big area,
there's an arch - and it was...
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It was mostly on fire.
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I remember a man who was a Hindu
with his hands to his face,
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watching his business -
it was a travel agent's - burning.
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There were also other people
informing me sometimes
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that the areas that were
being targeted belonged to Muslims.
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JILL, ARCHIVE: This is
exactly
what the authorities hoped
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would never happen - the streets
have become a battleground.
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The grief and anger
at yesterday's murders
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has boiled over into violence,
looting and religious hatred.
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JILL: There was this sense
of
absolute lawlessness.
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It was a free-for-all.
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I remember seeing the police here
and there, very, very disengaged.
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I didn't see anybody,
from what I remember,
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trying to stop the setting fire
to things and the looting.
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JILL, ARCHIVE: On the worst
day
of the violence,
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when murder and looting were
taking place all across the city,
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we saw policemen just standing by,
watching what was happening
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but doing nothing to try to stop it.
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JILL: One of my
colleagues
in the team
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was having quite regular phone calls
with a contact of his.
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It was someone, I understand,
who was high up in the police force,
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and they were giving
information to my colleague
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that they'd been told,
"Let it happen.
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"There will be a reaction to what
happened in Godhra. Let it happen."
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And we were hearing that
those orders to let all this happen
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were coming from the top.
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Did Mr Modi do enough to stop
the violence?
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I think that that's something
he has to answer for.
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Depending on how you look at it,
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he oversaw mass violence
or was not able to stop it.
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Questions remained over
Mr Modi's head for a long time,
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and they remain over him now.
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REPORTER: Did the police under
your
command do enough to stop the riots?
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Not only enough, but excellent work
they have done.
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Excellent work? Excellent
work
they have done.
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Within 72 hours, we were able
to control such violence.
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More than 500 people dead,
most of them innocent civilians,
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and you're calling this
"excellent work"?
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I'm not happy at what happened.
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But what we have done, I'm happy.
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Everyone we've spoken to
have said that the police
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did absolutely nothing.
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This is absolutely false propaganda.
This is not the truth.
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As questions grew around
Mr Modi's actions,
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attention turned to his past.
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DRUMS PLAY
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RSS stands for
Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh -
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"the Association
of Indian Volunteers".
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The RSS is a political organisation.
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It believes that this is a country
of the Hindus.
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ARCHIVE: The RSS was formed in
1925
to unite Hindu society
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and spread Hindu culture.
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But the Boy Scout image
is deceptive.
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Based on principles
of discipline, patriotism
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and unquestioning obedience,
the RSS seeks to establish
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the superiority of Hindus
over all other races in India.
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RSS took shape in the 1920s,
when, in Europe, we saw a movement
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that will result in fascism
in Italy, Nazism in Germany.
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They liked the idea of the
supremacy of the race theory,
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which was created by
the European fascists,
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and also the idea of creating
a common enemy.
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For the RSS, the enemy
were the Muslims.
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Today, RSS is not anti-Muslim,
but definitely pro-Hindu.
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And they believe in the glorious
past of this country
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and they believe in the idea
of national reconstruction.
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The very core cultural values
of this country,
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now they are being called
Hindu value system.
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People can have any way of worship,
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but if they believe in
that value system,
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they are very much part of India.
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RSS always recruits children,
very young boys,
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because they want to tell them
who they are
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when they are still malleable.
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To reshape the psyche of the youth
is very important.
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So Narendra Modi joined
when he was very young.
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After school, he would participate
in the activities
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of the young wing of the RSS.
That is how he got attracted.
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Gradually, he has climbed
all the ladder of all the posts
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of responsibility -
and at a very young age.
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Modi is a product of the RSS.
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He has learned its politics,
its lifestyle.
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He made a mark for himself,
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and so he was deputed to
the Bharatiya Janata Party -
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or the BJP - which is a political
affiliated organisation of the RSS.
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As the violence subsided,
stories began to emerge
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about what had happened
to some of the victims.
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In this largely Muslim
neighbourhood, more than 100 people
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had sought shelter in a house
to escape a Hindu mob.
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Imtiyaz Pathan and his family
were among them.
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The house belonged to a Muslim
former Congress Party MP -
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Ehsan Jafri.
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A judge later ruled that Mr Jafri
had provoked the mob
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by firing his gun at it.
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Imtiyaz survived by hiding upstairs.
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The violence only stopped
when the police eventually arrived.
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When a senior police officer
arrived at the house that evening,
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the victims' corpses
were still smouldering.
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REPORTER: There are
allegations
that police could have done more
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in Ahmedabad today.
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There's always scope
for improvement, I concede.
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There's always scope
for improvement.
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I'm sure...
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00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:24,280
..we could have done better.
243
00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:28,880
I think I would take it as my
inadequacy, if that is to be said.
244
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:34,360
The killings would trigger
a long legal battle
245
00:22:34,360 --> 00:22:38,160
that made serious allegations
about the police response
246
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:40,600
and Mr Modi's role in the violence.
247
00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:46,960
In 2009, Imtiyaz gave evidence
in court
248
00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:51,400
about the alleged phone call
between Mr Modi and Mr Jafri.
249
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,240
Mr Modi denied receiving the call
250
00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:59,160
and an inquiry said there was
no evidence it was made.
251
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:05,040
Imtiyaz later stood for election
against Mr Modi's political party.
252
00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:17,240
In Britain, the government
was alarmed
253
00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:19,560
by what had happened in Gujarat.
254
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:22,240
I was very worried about it.
255
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:25,040
I was taking a great deal
of personal interest
256
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:28,840
because India is a really important
country with whom we have relations.
257
00:23:28,840 --> 00:23:30,600
We had to handle it very carefully.
258
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,080
What we did was to
establish an inquiry
259
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,200
and have a team go to the Gujarat
260
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,200
and find out for themselves
what had happened.
261
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:43,600
And they produced
a very thorough report.
262
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:48,560
The report, sent as a diplomatic
cable and marked "restricted",
263
00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:51,800
has never been published before.
264
00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:56,080
FEMALE VOICE: "Extent of
violence
much greater than reported."
265
00:23:56,080 --> 00:24:00,960
"Widespread and systematic rape
of Muslim women."
266
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:04,640
"Violence", "politically motivated."
267
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:09,120
"Aim was to purge Muslims
from Hindu areas."
268
00:24:09,120 --> 00:24:12,120
"Their systematic campaign
of violence
269
00:24:12,120 --> 00:24:15,200
"has all the hallmarks
of ethnic cleansing."
270
00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:21,840
This former senior diplomat
was one of the investigators.
271
00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,880
He's speaking publicly
for the first time
272
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:27,480
about what the British
inquiry found.
273
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:30,880
He's asked to remain anonymous.
274
00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:34,520
At least 2,000 people were
murdered during the violence.
275
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:36,720
The vast majority were Muslim.
276
00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:39,000
We described it as a pogrom,
277
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:41,400
a deliberate and
politically driven effort
278
00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:43,800
targeted at the Muslim community.
279
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,680
The violence was widely reported
to have been organised
280
00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:50,920
by an extremist Hindu
nationalist group - the VHP -
281
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,400
who have a relationship
with the RSS.
282
00:24:55,280 --> 00:25:00,480
"The VHP and its allies could not
have inflicted so much damage
283
00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:05,360
"without the climate of impunity
created by the state Government."
284
00:25:05,360 --> 00:25:09,280
"Narendra Modi is
directly responsible."
285
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:13,040
The report contained
an extraordinary claim.
286
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:15,880
"Reliable contacts have told us
287
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:20,520
"Narendra Modi met senior police
officers on the 27th of February
288
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:24,160
"and ordered them not to intervene
in the rioting.
289
00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:27,240
"Police contacts deny
this meeting happened."
290
00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:30,400
There were pretty credible reports
291
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:33,920
he had specifically instructed
the police not to intervene.
292
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:37,720
The police contact who we talked
to consistently denied that,
293
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:42,240
so we did have conflicting reports
on what his direct role had been,
294
00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:45,680
but we did feel it was clear
there was a culture of impunity
295
00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:49,440
that created the environment
for the violence to take place.
296
00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,480
That undoubtedly came from Modi.
297
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:58,680
"While Modi remains in power,
reconciliation will be impossible."
298
00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:04,880
It was very shocking.
299
00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:08,240
These were very serious claims
that Chief Minister Modi
300
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:14,080
had played a pretty active part
in pulling back the police
301
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:19,040
and in tacitly encouraging
the Hindu extremists.
302
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:25,520
That was a particularly egregious
example of political involvement,
303
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:29,600
really, to prevent the police
from doing their job,
304
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:31,720
which was to protect
both communities -
305
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:33,840
the Hindu and the Muslims.
306
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:39,360
The options open to us
were fairly limited.
307
00:26:39,360 --> 00:26:44,000
We were never going to break
diplomatic relations with India,
308
00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:46,080
but it is obviously a stain
on his reputation.
309
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:47,680
There's no way out of that.
310
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:49,680
CHANTING
311
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:57,560
The European Union carried out
an investigation
312
00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:59,280
at around the same time.
313
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:06,480
It reportedly found that ministers
took active part in the violence
314
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,400
and senior police officers
were instructed
315
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,600
not to intervene in the rioting.
316
00:27:14,360 --> 00:27:17,560
They looked upon this in terms
of the...the suffering,
317
00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:20,760
which had happened
to the Muslim community,
318
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,960
and if you look at it in that way,
you're certainly bound to come
319
00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:27,760
to this conclusion that there was...
It was completely one-sided,
320
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:31,120
and that there was nothing done
on the part of the administration
321
00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:35,360
to seriously check this,
that it was a deliberate,
322
00:27:35,360 --> 00:27:41,320
pre-planned, motivated assault
on Muslims by mobs who were not
323
00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:45,720
restrained is, to my mind,
an exaggeration.
324
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:48,840
It was unstoppable for anyone.
325
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:50,880
And as a chief minister,
326
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:53,040
Modi did all the effort.
327
00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:58,400
And after three days, he was able
to stop with the help of police.
328
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:00,240
Modi definitely shows contrition.
329
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:03,080
He even puts in
his resignation to the BJP,
330
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:05,080
but the BJP reject it.
331
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:10,040
It was quite a smart thing to do
because, politically, if you offer
332
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,640
the resignation at that particular
juncture and it is turned down,
333
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:16,600
that's the end of
your resignation drama.
334
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:33,280
My name is Cedric Prakash.
335
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:35,840
I'm a Jesuit priest.
336
00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:41,280
My background has been on
human rights, justice and peace.
337
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:48,240
In Gujarat, human rights workers
set up a citizens' tribunal,
338
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:52,640
headed by three retired judges,
to investigate the violence.
339
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:55,880
Father Cedric helped them.
340
00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:01,200
We wanted people from
the government, officials,
341
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:05,000
to come and depose before
the citizens' tribunal.
342
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:07,160
It was not easy.
They were frightened.
343
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,200
Their careers were at stake.
344
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:15,520
On a flight to Delhi,
345
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,720
I happened to be seated
next to a minister
346
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:20,280
of the Gujarat government.
347
00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:22,760
He belonged to the BJP.
348
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:26,440
Haren Pandya was responsible
for the home affairs
349
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:28,720
of the state for several years.
350
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:32,880
He just very recently relinquished
office when Modi took
351
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:35,840
over as Chief Minister of the state.
352
00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:39,960
He was telling me, "I know
everything what was happening."
353
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,560
Then I said, "We have the citizens'
tribunal - would you...?"
354
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:45,560
He said,
"Of course I'll be willing."
355
00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:47,600
He swore us to secrecy.
356
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:52,960
We tried to do everything possible
in order to protect his identity
357
00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:55,080
because he was big catch.
358
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,640
The tribunal was examining
Mr Modi's role -
359
00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:06,320
including the directions he had
given to the police.
360
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:12,040
I think Haren Pandya wanted to
explain what had transpired
361
00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:13,840
on the 27th of February,
362
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:15,600
so he came to my office.
363
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:21,080
Mr Pandya told the tribunal
he had attended a late night
364
00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:26,280
meeting with Mr Modi and senior
officials, and he claimed Mr Modi
365
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:30,720
said the police should not interfere
with the Hindu reaction
366
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:32,920
to what happened at Godhra.
367
00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:37,160
Mr Pandya was very clearly
blaming Modi for the violence.
368
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:40,360
He felt he was responsible
and he should be brought to book.
369
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:41,480
That was clear.
370
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:48,440
This was the real first indication
from within the government
371
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,600
that there was actually
a decision taken.
372
00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:56,960
He is indicating that the chief
minister of the state was party to
373
00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:01,840
a decision where the law and
agencies do not do their work,
374
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:04,200
let Muslims be attacked.
375
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:10,280
Mr Pandya wanted to remain
anonymous, but news about his
376
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:15,320
evidence leaked out, and he resigned
from Mr Modi's government.
377
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:19,080
Narendra Modi has said he gave
categorical and clear-cut
378
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:23,920
instructions to maintain peace
and communal harmony at any cost.
379
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:27,960
So was Haren Pandya lying?
380
00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:30,160
Frankly, I don't know.
I wasn't at the meeting,
381
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:31,760
so I don't know exactly what it is.
382
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:36,560
But a chief minister of a state
cannot give a blank cheque
383
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:38,240
to people to run riot.
384
00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:45,960
Last year, India's Supreme Court
said Mr Pandya's claim was false.
385
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,960
Its findings were based
on an official inquiry
386
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:52,800
which found Mr Pandya was not
at the meeting.
387
00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:57,240
The inquiry heard that others
who were there disputed his presence
388
00:31:57,240 --> 00:32:01,120
and records showed his government
mobile was several miles away
389
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:02,960
at the time.
390
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:07,480
But some questioned the inquiry's
credibility and thoroughness.
391
00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:18,440
For most politicians, allegations
like this would be devastating.
392
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:23,880
But in the midst of all
the criticism,
393
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:27,640
Narendra Modi did something
unexpected -
394
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,040
he called an election in Gujarat.
395
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:38,280
NEWS CORRESPONDENT: This
election is
all about one man - Narendra Modi.
396
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:42,600
To his supporters, he preaches an
extreme form of Hindu nationalism,
397
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:46,240
offering hope and security
against Muslim extremists.
398
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:51,040
We're just after the events of 9/11,
which, in many ways,
399
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:54,480
has legitimised actions against
Muslims across the globe.
400
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:59,440
This, at the very least, emboldens
what the BJP are doing in Gujarat.
401
00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:05,600
Mr Modi realised that there was
a very strong sentiment of Hindu
402
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:09,480
victimhood, and he decided
to harness that electorally.
403
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:06,800
The violence against Muslims
became part of the messaging
404
00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:11,000
that Narendra Modi used
in the election campaign.
405
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:15,240
It is the violence and how he
reacted to it that has constructed
406
00:34:15,240 --> 00:34:17,360
the persona of Narendra Modi.
407
00:34:24,440 --> 00:34:27,800
UNTRANSLATED
408
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:30,680
Narendra Modi doesn't tend
to be very media friendly.
409
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:32,520
You follow what I say?
A little bit, yes.
410
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:35,200
So for him to agree to do
a sit-down interview with us
411
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:36,800
felt like a bit of a scoop.
412
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:38,400
HE CHUCKLES
413
00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:42,240
He struck me as a very charismatic,
414
00:34:42,240 --> 00:34:44,000
very powerful,
415
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,520
quite menacing figure.
416
00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:48,480
So you're now coming up
to elections.
417
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:50,600
This seems to me to be
a state in turmoil.
418
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:52,520
We're seeing repeated violence.
419
00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:54,200
We're seeing people living in fear.
420
00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:58,320
What has gone wrong with this
breakdown in law and order here?
421
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:01,240
I think you have to correct
your information first.
422
00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:05,120
The state is very, very peaceful.
423
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:08,400
So, the Muslims who would say
that they are still terrified,
424
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:11,040
they are still frightened to go back
to their homes... I am
not...
425
00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:13,680
..they still fear that the people
who murdered their relatives
426
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,160
have not been brought to justice.
What would you say to them?
427
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:18,200
I'm not agreeing with your analysis.
428
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,040
I'm not agreeing with your
information.
429
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:24,360
This absolutely misguided
information to you.
430
00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:27,600
From where you have picked up this
type of garbage, I do not know.
431
00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:31,400
Some people have been accusing
your government of not doing enough
432
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:35,840
to stop this, of not
protecting Muslims even now.
433
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:40,560
These are also false propaganda
made by our opponents.
434
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:44,280
And you are also a captive
of this false propaganda.
435
00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:54,240
Can you explain more? Who is
perpetuating this false propaganda?
436
00:35:54,240 --> 00:35:56,800
The information I am reporting
is taken from what I have seen
437
00:35:56,800 --> 00:35:59,040
with my own eyes, both at
the times of the riot and now.
438
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:00,520
Those who are our opponents.
439
00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:02,760
And the independent reports
that have already
440
00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:04,920
been published
into what has happened?
441
00:36:04,920 --> 00:36:07,680
They have no right to talk
about the internal matter
442
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:09,120
of any government.
443
00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:10,600
I'm very, very clear in my mind.
444
00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:12,560
If they have done,
they have done wrong.
445
00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:13,960
Some would say it is a human right.
446
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:15,840
There is a general
international interest.
447
00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:17,760
Please don't try to preach us
the human rights.
448
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:20,000
We know what the human rights are.
449
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:22,600
You British should not
preach us human rights.
450
00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:25,760
When you look back over the last
month, you've been the leader
451
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:28,000
of this state through
a very difficult period.
452
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:31,160
Do you think there's anything that
you should have done differently?
453
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:32,560
Yes.
454
00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:36,520
One area where I was very, very big.
455
00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:39,080
And that was how
to handle the media.
456
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:42,120
SHOUTING AND CHANTING
457
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:48,040
NEWSREEL: Ecstatic crowds of
BJP
supporters started to celebrate
458
00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:50,960
the election win
before it was official.
459
00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:53,880
The architect of victory,
Narendra Modi,
460
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:56,960
the controversial
Chief Minister of Gujarat.
461
00:36:59,240 --> 00:37:04,160
The more Mr Modi was attacked,
the stronger he became by simply
462
00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:07,680
saying that he was being targeted
only because he was standing
463
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:09,720
up for the rights of Hindus.
464
00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:14,440
A new repertoire had taken shape.
465
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:19,760
You polarise your vote, and you get
the majority supporting you.
466
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:37,800
I just entered a taxi
and suddenly I got a call
467
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:40,360
from a journalist friend of mine
468
00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:44,920
and she said, "Do you know what
has happened to Haren Pandya?"
469
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:51,320
She told me that he was...
he was killed.
470
00:37:55,480 --> 00:38:00,000
He's found dead in a car under
very suspicious circumstances.
471
00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:04,080
The entry point of the bullet
wound is at the groin.
472
00:38:04,080 --> 00:38:08,640
There is no blood lying there
where there should have been blood.
473
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:12,000
There is no way from the position
he was in that he could
474
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:14,080
have been killed sitting in the car.
475
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:16,440
Evidence suggests he was killed
elsewhere,
476
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:18,680
his body put in the car
and placed there.
477
00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:26,160
The death of Haren Pandya
is a mystery -
478
00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:28,000
a well-kept mystery, probably.
479
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:31,400
There is, to my knowledge,
no serious investigation.
480
00:38:32,760 --> 00:38:35,240
The murder of Haren Pandya
remains one of the big
481
00:38:35,240 --> 00:38:37,560
mysteries, even today.
482
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:40,840
Mr Pandya was killed in a murder
which has really not
483
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:42,160
been answered yet.
484
00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:46,520
12 men were jailed in connection
with his murder,
485
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,400
but this verdict was overturned -
486
00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:51,360
the court blaming
a botched investigation.
487
00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:53,720
NEWSREEL: All accused in the
Haren
Pandya murder case
488
00:38:53,720 --> 00:38:54,880
have been acquitted.
489
00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:57,520
Haren Pandya was the former home
minister, you might remember,
490
00:38:57,520 --> 00:38:58,960
of Gujarat...
491
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:04,640
In 2019, India's Supreme Court
upheld the original verdict,
492
00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:08,280
but even some in Mr Modi's
own party have doubts
493
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:11,720
about the investigation
into Mr Pandya's death.
494
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:14,960
I knew him personally.
495
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:21,680
I think the killing of Mr Pandya
was tragic and suspicious,
496
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:24,800
and the
circumstances explained to me
497
00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:26,120
don't make me believe in it.
498
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:29,680
I'd like to know
who organised it so well.
499
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:37,280
It is not some, just a stray, say,
killer or somebody taking revenge...
500
00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:40,640
..but it is well-organised.
501
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:44,120
I don't think it has
been properly investigated.
502
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:49,120
He was killed by terrorists
who wanted to kill him
503
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:52,760
so that the blame could be
apportioned to Narendra Modi.
504
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:54,560
The investigation was thorough.
505
00:39:54,560 --> 00:39:58,640
It went into every stage
of the Indian judicial process
506
00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:00,920
and culminated in
a Supreme Court judgment.
507
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:03,640
I think we should leave it at that.
508
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:18,760
In Yorkshire, the Dawood family
were losing faith that the police
509
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:21,280
in Gujarat would catch the men
who killed
510
00:40:21,280 --> 00:40:23,400
Saeed, Shakil and Mohammed.
511
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:29,440
There were some serious doubts
arising in terms of what the Indian
512
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:32,720
police were doing, because on
the one hand they were saying
513
00:40:32,720 --> 00:40:34,240
that they were doing everything.
514
00:40:34,240 --> 00:40:37,360
On the other hand, we were seeing
no results whatsoever.
515
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:43,160
In respect to the investigation,
516
00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:46,000
we had no confidence in the Indian
police.
517
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:51,600
It turned out that the police hadn't
even done basic investigations.
518
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:54,800
They hadn't gone to the scene
of the crime.
519
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:58,640
Family members went to the
crime scene themselves and made
520
00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:00,640
a terrible discovery.
521
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:07,000
They found burnt remains, including
bone fragments, bits of teeth.
522
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:11,560
It seemed from what everybody
was indicating that those remains
523
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:15,160
were Saeed and Shakil's.
524
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:21,640
The police seemed to be putting
up a wall and were completely
525
00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:24,880
disinterested in helping
us get to the truth.
526
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:30,720
Then there was an unexpected
development.
527
00:41:30,720 --> 00:41:33,840
NEWSREEL: The controversial
chief
minister of Gujarat, Narendra Modi,
528
00:41:33,840 --> 00:41:35,960
has arrived in London
on a short visit.
529
00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:39,000
He presides over the state
where as many as 2,000 people
530
00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:40,560
were killed in communal rioting...
531
00:41:40,560 --> 00:41:43,200
I thought this was a great
opportunity for the family
532
00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:47,640
and for the victims for him
to be arrested here in the UK.
533
00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:51,800
The idea was that the family
would go to court and seek
534
00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:54,200
to prosecute Narendra Modi.
535
00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:58,680
We had pages - hundreds
of pages - of reports.
536
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:04,520
All of them were clear
that this was a massacre.
537
00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:09,280
Most importantly,
that there was state collusion.
538
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:15,000
And so the chain of command went
all the way to the Chief Minister.
539
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:19,680
Although the offence took place
in India, it could be prosecuted
540
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:20,880
in this country.
541
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:30,160
An Indian diplomat said when news of
the plan leaked, there was panic.
542
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:35,560
Mr Modi was reportedly urged to
leave Britain on the next plane.
543
00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:40,000
I argued in front of the judge
for Narendra Modi's arrest.
544
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:42,760
The judge said, "I can see
all the things that you've put
545
00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:44,640
"before me, Mr Kahn, but really
546
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:47,040
"what I need is the witness
statements."
547
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:49,960
The evidence that we would
need to prosecute it
548
00:42:49,960 --> 00:42:53,120
would have been somebody
somewhere along the chain of command
549
00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:55,800
saying, "Yes, there was an order
550
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:59,800
"not to take any action,
allowing this to happen."
551
00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:03,800
Mr Khan says that the evidence
that has emerged since then -
552
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:07,280
even though it is fiercely
contested - has made him
553
00:43:07,280 --> 00:43:11,080
more convinced of the merits
of his case.
554
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:14,600
Knowing what we now know, and the
information that we now have,
555
00:43:14,600 --> 00:43:18,640
if we had had that at that time,
I'm pretty sure that a summons
556
00:43:18,640 --> 00:43:21,600
would have been issued
for Modi's arrest.
557
00:43:23,240 --> 00:43:26,000
We were bitterly disappointed
the judge didn't issue the warrant,
558
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:31,720
but we understood this was going
to be a quite a long campaign
559
00:43:31,720 --> 00:43:35,240
in terms of getting answers
and getting justice and holding
560
00:43:35,240 --> 00:43:36,560
people to account.
561
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:51,360
Western governments began to take
action against Narendra Modi
562
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:53,840
over the Gujarat violence.
563
00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:58,160
The UK imposed a diplomatic boycott
and de facto travel ban.
564
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:03,440
There was essentially a travel
ban imposed on Modi.
565
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:06,720
I would like to have seen much
stronger action, but I think
566
00:44:06,720 --> 00:44:09,840
we probably did end up doing
as much as we could.
567
00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:15,280
In 2005, the US government formally
revoked a visa for Mr Modi
568
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:19,960
under a law that targets government
officials responsible for severe
569
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,280
violations of religious freedom.
570
00:44:23,280 --> 00:44:25,680
The US are saying this is not
acceptable.
571
00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:29,280
Mr Modi? Would you like
to speak to the BBC, Mr Modi?
572
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:32,040
Barred from entering
the United States,
573
00:44:32,040 --> 00:44:34,320
barred from entering
the United Kingdom.
574
00:44:34,320 --> 00:44:37,640
On the international stage,
it makes him somewhat of a pariah.
575
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:13,000
In 2007, a reporter went undercover
in Gujarat to investigate
576
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:16,080
what had happened during
the violence.
577
00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:18,160
Posing as a Hindu extremist,
578
00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:22,080
he secretly filmed one of
the killers boasting about the role
579
00:45:22,080 --> 00:45:23,160
he had played.
580
00:45:24,200 --> 00:45:29,560
Babu Bajrangi was accused of leading
a mob that killed around 100 people.
581
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:54,000
Mr Bajrangi made an extraordinary
claim about Narendra Modi.
582
00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:57,400
He said that when he was arrested
for murder, several months
583
00:45:57,400 --> 00:46:02,320
after the massacre, Mr Modi helped
him get bail by changing the judge.
584
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:18,520
Mr Bajrangi later claimed
he was reading from a script given
585
00:46:18,520 --> 00:46:20,480
to him by the reporter.
586
00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:26,120
Though a judge ruled the veracity
of the sting was not in dispute.
587
00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:29,320
In 2012, Mr Bajrangi was jailed
for murder.
588
00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:35,600
And he wasn't the only one who made
damaging claims about Mr Modi.
589
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:38,520
Haresh Bhatt,
a local BJP politician,
590
00:46:38,520 --> 00:46:42,480
said he was at a political meeting
addressed by Mr Modi
591
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:44,880
shortly after the train burning.
592
00:47:16,880 --> 00:47:21,200
Mr Bhatt later said he told
the reporter an imaginary story.
593
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:26,440
Mr Modi has said allegations
against him in the recordings
594
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:28,200
are false and incorrect.
595
00:47:30,920 --> 00:47:35,280
You often find that activists
at the lower level...
596
00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:37,960
..make claims...
597
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:43,240
..which are, in hindsight,
quite preposterous.
598
00:47:43,240 --> 00:47:45,920
They exaggerate their own
importance.
599
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:51,280
But pressure was now building
for a new investigation
600
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:52,600
into the violence.
601
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:05,120
By the beginning of 2011,
Narendra Modi had run Gujarat
602
00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:06,600
for nearly a decade.
603
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:12,960
Despite the controversies,
some were now tipping him
604
00:48:12,960 --> 00:48:15,280
for an even bigger job -
605
00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:18,120
India's next Prime Minister.
606
00:48:18,120 --> 00:48:21,880
Modi started to think
about national politics
607
00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:26,320
very early on, projecting
himself as a national leader
608
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:35,760
It was already clear
that he was headed
609
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:39,920
on a course which would lead him
to the national state.
610
00:48:39,920 --> 00:48:42,520
But Mr Modi had a problem.
611
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:46,080
SHOUTING
612
00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:52,120
India's Supreme Court had ordered
a wide-ranging investigation
613
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:54,960
into the Gujarat violence.
614
00:48:54,960 --> 00:49:00,080
A special investigation team -
or SIT - was examining the Dawood
615
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:04,000
family murders and allegations
made by Ehsan Jafri's
616
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:09,480
widow that Mr Modi was part
of a criminal conspiracy that led
617
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:12,800
to the disorder and killings
across the state.
618
00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:17,160
NEWSREEL: Modi seems to
be
unstoppable.
619
00:49:17,160 --> 00:49:20,160
But the ghosts of the past don't
leave him alone.
620
00:49:20,160 --> 00:49:23,840
Grilled for nine hours
on the case in 2010, the stain
621
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:25,360
on his image remains.
622
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:29,400
The mandate was to look
into the possibility
623
00:49:29,400 --> 00:49:32,200
that there was a criminal
conspiracy by the government
624
00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:33,480
led by Narendra Modi.
625
00:49:33,480 --> 00:49:36,920
But the criminal conspiracy
is a particular term in law
626
00:49:36,920 --> 00:49:39,960
which requires a very strong
standard of evidence.
627
00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:42,800
For the first time in the history
of independent India, a sitting
628
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:46,200
chief minister, Narendra Modi,
has been questioned on the role
629
00:49:46,200 --> 00:49:49,880
of his government in mass murders
in connection with the post-Godhra
630
00:49:49,880 --> 00:49:51,120
riots in Gujarat.
631
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:54,200
I think Mr Modi definitely
was very worried.
632
00:49:54,200 --> 00:49:57,480
The special investigation team
was definitely a very serious
633
00:49:57,480 --> 00:50:00,840
threat to Mr Modi's
political career.
634
00:50:00,840 --> 00:50:04,440
An important witness was the former
head of police intelligence
635
00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:10,200
in Gujarat, RB Sreekumar, who'd made
a string of claims about police
636
00:50:10,200 --> 00:50:12,720
and government failures.
637
00:50:12,720 --> 00:50:16,240
He claimed that, on the night
of the Gujarat train burning,
638
00:50:16,240 --> 00:50:19,720
Mr Modi instructed officials
to allow Hindus
639
00:50:19,720 --> 00:50:21,720
to give vent to their anger.
640
00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:26,440
He claimed Gujarat's police chief
had told him this -
641
00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:28,560
though the chief denied it.
642
00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:32,040
Without Sreekumar, the case
against the Narendra Modi
643
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:34,160
government would be much weaker
644
00:50:34,160 --> 00:50:36,640
simply because there would
have been no information
645
00:50:36,640 --> 00:50:39,560
from inside the government which
would tell you what was happening.
646
00:50:39,560 --> 00:50:44,240
In that sense, he was a central
figure in this investigation.
647
00:50:44,240 --> 00:50:48,400
Another senior police officer,
Sanjiv Bhatt, gave evidence.
648
00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:52,960
NEWSREEL: The ghost of the
Godhra
riots back to haunt Narendra Modi.
649
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:56,320
This time it's senior police officer
Sanjiv Bhatt who alleges
650
00:50:56,320 --> 00:50:58,640
that Modi was complicit
in the Godhra riots.
651
00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:02,240
In an affidavit filed in the Supreme
Court, Bhatt says that he was
652
00:51:02,240 --> 00:51:04,880
present at the crucial law and order
meeting chaired by Modi.
653
00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:05,960
I know my truth.
654
00:51:05,960 --> 00:51:10,000
I've stated my truth and I have sent
there a note in an affidavit
655
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:12,520
submitted to the highest court
of the land.
656
00:51:12,520 --> 00:51:15,360
When he started reporting
before the SIT inquiry,
657
00:51:15,360 --> 00:51:18,960
my father stated that
the control room contacted him,
658
00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:21,600
saying that an unofficial
meeting has been called
659
00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:25,600
at the Chief Minister's residence
and that his presence was required.
660
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:31,360
He said that Narendra Modi ended
up saying that the emotions
661
00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:34,680
were running very high in the Hindus
and it was imperative
662
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:38,080
that the Hindus be allowed
to vent their anger.
663
00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:43,120
He said that Narendra Modi
had directed the police force
664
00:51:43,120 --> 00:51:46,040
to step down, look the other way.
665
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:50,480
Mr Modi and other officials at
the meeting said Mr Bhatt did not
666
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:55,040
attend, but an independent adviser
to the Supreme Court said
667
00:51:55,040 --> 00:51:59,720
there was enough evidence
to consider prosecuting Mr Modi.
668
00:51:59,720 --> 00:52:03,800
This is a prominent legal person
who has reached his own conclusions
669
00:52:03,800 --> 00:52:06,760
about what is there and I think some
of those conclusions needed
670
00:52:06,760 --> 00:52:08,200
to be taken note of.
671
00:52:11,360 --> 00:52:13,120
In major relief for Narendra Modi,
672
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:16,200
the Supreme Court-appointed rights
panel has found no evidence
673
00:52:16,200 --> 00:52:17,840
against the Gujarat Chief Minister.
674
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:20,920
The complainant, Zakia Jafri,
had accused Modi of ordering
675
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:23,360
officials to give rioters
a free hand -
676
00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:26,640
the only complaint that named him.
677
00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:32,120
After three years, the SIT ruled
that Mr Modi would face no charges.
678
00:52:33,560 --> 00:52:38,000
It said RB Sreekumar's account
was hearsay, and Sanjiv Bhatt's
679
00:52:38,000 --> 00:52:41,160
account could not be relied on.
680
00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:43,800
It said claims about
the instructions Mr Modi
681
00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:46,040
had given were not established.
682
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:51,360
NEWSREEL: So, what next for
Modi?
683
00:52:51,360 --> 00:52:56,000
Legal experts say he has not got
a clean chit in the rights -
684
00:52:56,000 --> 00:52:58,320
just that there is no evidence.
685
00:52:58,320 --> 00:53:00,000
But it could...
686
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:03,320
The ruling did not stop the debate
over what had happened.
687
00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:08,880
The special investigation team
could not succeed, for many,
688
00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:10,440
many different reasons.
689
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:14,320
The investigation team had to rely
somewhat on the Gujarat police.
690
00:53:15,360 --> 00:53:20,480
Much of the investigation on the
ground is done by police officers,
691
00:53:20,480 --> 00:53:23,600
and among the people
who stand indicted
692
00:53:23,600 --> 00:53:26,600
are the Gujarat police force itself.
693
00:53:26,600 --> 00:53:31,040
The SIT report is really
very superficial.
694
00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:36,920
It doesn't explain how
this pogrom could take place.
695
00:53:36,920 --> 00:53:41,800
So, of course, it underestimates -
I mean, it minimises the roles
696
00:53:41,800 --> 00:53:44,440
of the top leaders,
the chain of command.
697
00:53:44,440 --> 00:53:48,800
To establish criminal conspiracy
in law is often very difficult.
698
00:53:48,800 --> 00:53:52,160
Just because they have arrived
at the conclusion there was no
699
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:56,000
criminal conspiracy is not
the same as saying the conduct
700
00:53:56,000 --> 00:53:59,280
is above question, that
there were not serious lapses.
701
00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:03,560
That in no way takes away
all the important questions
702
00:54:03,560 --> 00:54:06,880
that still stand
on the 2002 violence.
703
00:54:06,880 --> 00:54:10,160
Yes, there were some people who said
they were at a particular meeting
704
00:54:10,160 --> 00:54:11,680
when others said they were not.
705
00:54:11,680 --> 00:54:15,720
Agenda was to destroy
Narendra Modi politically.
706
00:54:15,720 --> 00:54:17,880
The agenda was explicitly political.
707
00:54:17,880 --> 00:54:20,840
I don't think they were
concerned about Muslim victims,
708
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:23,960
and these included a section
of the media, these included
709
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:25,960
journalists, these included NGOs.
710
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:29,600
I think ultimately at the end
of the day, the SIT findings
711
00:54:29,600 --> 00:54:31,520
didn't implicate Mr Modi.
712
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:36,640
The SIT gave a clean chit
to Narendra Modi.
713
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:40,360
We have to have faith on our
institution and we have to put
714
00:54:40,360 --> 00:54:43,840
a full stop on something
and we have to move forward.
715
00:54:43,840 --> 00:54:46,360
CROWD CHEERING
716
00:54:46,360 --> 00:54:49,720
The verdict cleared the way
for Mr Modi to run
717
00:54:49,720 --> 00:54:51,600
for prime minister.
718
00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:53,640
The travel bans were lifted.
719
00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:58,360
Diplomatic relations with the West
were restored.
720
00:54:59,920 --> 00:55:02,440
I don't think that I had any doubt
that Mr Modi
721
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:05,280
is going to be the next
prime minister.
722
00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:10,120
NEWSREEL: Narendra Modi,
India's next Prime Minister,
723
00:55:10,120 --> 00:55:12,560
riding into Delhi in triumph,
724
00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:16,560
after he won an election landslide
with his promise that good days
725
00:55:16,560 --> 00:55:18,120
are coming for India.
726
00:55:32,280 --> 00:55:35,400
Sanjiv Bhatt was jailed
for life in 2019
727
00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:39,760
over a death-in-custody case
dating back 30 years.
728
00:55:40,840 --> 00:55:46,040
His family insists he's innocent,
and many say his trial was unfair.
729
00:55:47,720 --> 00:55:51,120
The government will try to do
whatever they can to ensure
730
00:55:51,120 --> 00:55:53,720
that my father's voice is not heard.
731
00:55:55,440 --> 00:55:59,480
He is the sole surviving
witness who can tie Narendra Modi
732
00:55:59,480 --> 00:56:01,560
to the carnage of 2002.
733
00:56:04,760 --> 00:56:09,000
No-one has ever been convicted
for the Dawood family murders.
734
00:56:11,920 --> 00:56:15,600
Still feeling very angry,
very frustrated.
735
00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:20,000
It feels like
there's no justice there.
736
00:56:23,560 --> 00:56:29,200
Ehsan Jafri's widow challenged
the findings of the SIT in court.
737
00:56:29,200 --> 00:56:34,840
In June 2022, India's Supreme Court
upheld the findings,
738
00:56:34,840 --> 00:56:38,160
saying there was no larger
conspiracy.
739
00:56:38,160 --> 00:56:41,880
It ruled the testimonies
of Sanjiv Bhatt and RB Sreekumar
740
00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:47,080
were replete with falsehood and said
those involved in abuse of process
741
00:56:47,080 --> 00:56:49,320
need to be in the dock.
742
00:56:49,320 --> 00:56:53,600
Shortly after, Mr Modi's
closest political ally
743
00:56:53,600 --> 00:56:55,160
spoke out about the case.
744
00:57:26,360 --> 00:57:31,240
The police arrested Mr Sreekumar and
a high-profile human-rights worker
745
00:57:31,240 --> 00:57:34,560
who helped Mrs Jafri bring the case.
746
00:57:34,560 --> 00:57:39,520
Sanjiv Bhatt, already in prison, was
named in the police complaint, too.
747
00:57:40,720 --> 00:57:44,960
All three are accused
of fabricating evidence.
748
00:57:44,960 --> 00:57:49,280
20 years on, the Gujarat
violence remains controversial.
749
00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:56,360
None of the people arrested
were sources for our report
750
00:57:56,360 --> 00:58:00,200
and the findings of our
investigation still stand.
751
00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:04,280
2,000 people were murdered
in Gujarat in 2002
752
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:08,880
in a campaign of violence that
was clearly well organised.
753
00:58:09,960 --> 00:58:12,080
That remains a fact.
754
00:58:12,080 --> 00:58:14,600
Now Mr Modi is in power,
755
00:58:14,600 --> 00:58:17,960
it seems to me that history
is being rewritten.
756
00:58:22,160 --> 00:58:25,680
The Supreme Court gave a judgment
which actually brought the whole
757
00:58:25,680 --> 00:58:27,200
matter to a closure.
758
00:58:27,200 --> 00:58:29,080
The closure was necessary.

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