UFO Video #13 Art Bell Interviews Bob Lazar About

Advanced UFO Technology At Area S4 F

https://youtu.be/7oPmLsmuZhw
Transcript
0:00
all right here we go Bob Lazar is the ex government scientist who in 1989 came
0:07
forward with the fact that he had been part of a team of scientists who back
0:14
engineered extraterrestrial discs flying saucers in other words at a base known
0:20
as s4 some 15 miles south of the infamous area 51 agrammatic Bob story is
0:29
the main reason behind the state of Nevada changing the name of Nevada state
0:34
highway 375 the highway to area 51 or s4
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to its new name the extra-terrestrial highway deed Bob currently runs a
0:49
company that manufactures and repairs alpha radiation detectors he also
0:55
creates CGI computer-generated graphics and simulations for technical and legal
1:03
demonstration videos for which he uses his mainframe supercomputer which by
the
1:08
way is the second fastest computer in the state of Nevada second only to the
1:14
one at Nellis Air Force Base Bob also has a small photo processing lab in his
1:20
home in his spare time Bob does pyrotechnical and rocket research and
1:26
throws desert blast his annual fireworks blowout at the Nevada desert and if
1:35
memory serves he also fools around with alternative fuels for cars he comes this
1:44
morning with gene Huff Bob's longtime friend and business partner who is the
writer and co-producer of the Lazar tape
1:51
gene is a real estate appraiser and screenwriter his screenplays for the Bob
1:58
Lazar story has recently been optioned and was chosen over three other
2:03
screenplays on the Lazar story written by writers Jim Cresson I guess that's
2:09
right Chris on or Cresson who wrote the morning-after with Jeff Bridges and
2:14
Jane Fonda Roy Carlson who wrote China moon within Harris and madeleine stowe
2:21
and David rabe a I guess it would be Rob a Rob a the wrote casualties of war with
2:30
Sean Penn and Michael J Fox and co-wrote the firm with Tom Cruise and Gene
2:35
Hackman so this is quite a coup obviously for an entry-level screen
2:40
writer but then again gene has had the inside track good morning Bob are you
2:48
there I'm here and gene are you there yes there are welcome to you both thank
2:54
you Bob is it really true uh it had to have been for oh maybe five years ago
3:01
that I interviewed you in concert with John Lear you know I honestly don't
3:07
remember that haha my friends tell me I have about the worst memory that can be
3:13
had but from what I recall years ago I remember John Lear apparently booking me
3:20
on your show and never telling me about it oh yeah I remember that but I don't and
then I really don't remember ever
3:27
doing the show know there was a time maybe even a couple of years before that
when we had you on for a short while
3:34
alright I think he called in uh that was it does it all then when Lear was on the
3:39
shore that's what it was yes yes well I don't even remember that but I'll take
everyone's word for it all right well in
3:45
fact we now have such a gigantic audience out there that hardly anybody
3:50
knows who you are Bob except for of course you know you follow just and so forth
who would be
3:57
very familiar with your story so the great majority of the audience ninety-nine
percent have no idea who Bob
4:05
Lazar is now I guess that means we have
4:10
to begin at the beginning uh with regard to how you well first of
4:18
all Bob you're a physicist correct uh-huh or was that the time was it the time you
4:25
know um how did you become involved with or begin to get involved with whatever
it
4:31
is out there at area 51 or is specifically s4 well let me try and give
4:39
you the Reader's Digest version some years ago I was working at Los Alamos
4:45
National Labs in New Mexico one
4:52
particular day I was going down to the
4:57
lecture hall to hear Edward Teller speak who as most people know as the father of
5:02
the hydrogen bomb yes I got down there a little early because I wanted to get in
assuming there was going to be a crowd
5:08
of people and actually to my surprise there's hardly anyone there coincidentally
that day the local
5:16
newspaper in town the monitor had printed a front-page article on me and
5:23
right outside the lecture hall was dr. teller reading the front page of the
5:29
paper so I thought it was a perfect opportunity to introduce myself and just say hi
absolutely it was just a casual
5:36
meeting and the only reason I bring it up is years later I had moved out of Los
5:44
Alamos after I quit working for the lab I opened up my own business that did some
contract work for the lab and also
5:53
started a one-hour photo shop for my wife that she ran there we later moved
5:59
out of Los Alamos to Las Vegas and again some time later I decided you know I
had
6:05
missed working in the scientific community so I decided to get back in and send
out resumes I said I'm out
6:11
really all over the place to the places where I'd essentially like to live
6:19
Livermore I really don't remember where else but one of the other resumes I said
6:25
was to dr. tellers attention and I had referenced our meeting back then a short
6:34
time later I got a call from him and he did remember me to my surprise and said we
might have a
6:41
position you're interested in I said great I went down and was interviewed at
6:47
that time there were a couple Ichi ng buildings by McCarran Airport out here
6:55
I recall NAS Vegas yeah I really don't know what's there now someone tells me
there's still one building but there
7:00
used to be two before they expand at the airport one of the special projects and I
don't know what the other one was but in either case I was told to go down
7:08
there for an interview any route was relatively short and I really don't
7:13
remember specifically what the job entailed but they told me I was
7:19
basically overqualified and would become bored with it in a short time I said fine
but they said we might have
7:24
something else in the future for you I said fine okay and basically went back
7:30
home figuring they had blown you off right I really don't remember what the
7:36
job was but it didn't really even sound too exciting to me so it really didn't really
didn't bring my balance I recall
7:43
anything about a technician level or something that would have been boring I really
don't remember this uh when I
7:52
when I go through most of the stuff people are amazed you know boy how come
you can't remember these facts you know this is a you know fantastic point in
7:59
your life and yeah but you know it's also a decade old now and it sure to remember
specifics here and there however as it turned out they did call
8:08
back and had another position the
8:13
position was stated to be something that was involving a field propulsion system
8:21
which to me in my mind sounded something along the lines of some
electromagnetic
8:28
propulsion something that might be used in space maybe I don't know an ion drive
8:34
system using mercury vapor or something like that or you vote out you've always
been fascinated by propulsion so
8:39
anything anything with you know it tremendous amount of energy from you no
explosives - you know high-energy
8:48
weapons anything along those lines propulsion and they in coincidence eller
8:56
was reading was about a car that I had converted to run on a jet engine now you
9:02
see I remembered that and then you converted another one I believe to run on
hydrogen didn't you yeah actually I'm
9:09
really surprised that you remember that I don't remember I have a baletta is one of
the number one things I get asked
9:15
about I know I have a good memory but for some obviously after that but in
9:22
either case a I after a more or less lengthy interview I accept the job and
9:32
of course I had to go back a second time can you remember any of the details of
this rather lengthy interview I mean was
9:40
a lot of it secure or security-oriented drawl there were certainly a lot of security or
security oriented questions
9:48
and so forth later on however keep in mind that I had just come from Los
9:53
Alamos just a few a couple years before that's where I had two clearance civilian
you know top-secret clearance
10:01
so yeah a lady really didn't have to go and dig deep back into my past to see if
10:07
I was you know a Russian defendant or anything along those lines so you
10:14
basically the a job just seemed like a you know typical research and
10:20
development job I was anxious to get started on it and things well they all they told
me is that it was in a remote
10:25
area out in the desert and then I was initially I would fly out there maybe
10:32
once possibly twice a week just to kind of get caught up on stuff and they had
10:38
to reinstate my clearance which would take you know perhaps a couple weeks
10:45
maybe a month at the latest sure and so in the meantime I was given busy
10:51
essentially busy work to do or at least that's how it rang in my and this is typical to
it los alamos you
10:58
know if you're initially hired there before your clearance goes through sometimes
you know painting to clearance
11:05
can take up to 13 months so they don't just have you sit at home you'll you know
before you go to work for the lab
11:10
sit around and work on alarm systems or something like that doesn't work you
know something usually below your
11:17
potential but nobody keep you busy that rings true I was in the Air Force they did
that to us all the time yeah it's
11:23
pretty it's pretty common so I thought well this you know very typical I had no
11:29
idea what this would actually Intel until I got into it and obviously they
11:35
looking through their eyes I guess it it made sense that they couldn't they
11:40
couldn't of course divulge what this job would actually Intel before they had you
11:46
know gone through all the security and whatnot but you know that's essentially
11:53
how the job came about all right one thing that I would think you would remember
is your impressions of mr.
12:00
tiller I do as far as what well what
12:05
kind of guy was he you know just simple questions what kind of guy was he he was
12:11
um he seems to have two phases you know
12:18
which is strange and in talking to him one-on-one he's a very polite Pleasant
12:25
intelligent man however virtually any interview you'll
12:32
see of this guy he comes across as the most pompous mean person you have ever
12:41
run into in your life bump isn't me I don't know how else to describe him but
12:47
he was not nearly as short not physically speaking but I mean you know
12:54
if you see him in interviews you'll see him answer questions specifically to the
point short and on to the next question
13:00
and not be very talkative not offer any information you know other than what
13:07
you're immediately talking about and in person he was certainly not that way so
he's you know the exact opposite
13:13
very pleasant and willing to talk about anything let's talk about it indirectly or
weapons or anything well that's what I
13:19
was going to ask about last night I interviewed professor Michio Kaku a very
13:25
a preeminent physicist back at New York University and he too
13:32
has worked with Professor teller and I asked professor Kaku why he had not
13:39
participated in the hydrogen bomb development and he said he simply chose
13:45
not to he wanted to go into a different direction with physics and had quite a
13:51
bit to say about Edward Teller and apparently he was consumed during the
13:57
Cold War years with national security you know with the being concerned about
national security and this is dr. teller
14:05
yes uh-huh and the developing bombs and in fact even today the programs go on I
14:13
guess with the third generation of hydrogen bombs sort of designer bombs
14:19
professor Popa said anyway that's why I asked you about - Edward Teller all
14:25
right Bob so you give not the job you landed the job and they had you doing busy
work and
14:33
then well not that busy work hasn't started oh that's what I thought was
14:38
going to happen instead where did we
14:45
leave off um well actually with busy
14:50
work they were kind of well it you know he had anticipated busy work but now you
14:55
had to go to work the first day yeah essentially I guess essentially it was to get
caught up with what was going on
15:03
and really to my surprise the security was a little more than oppressive you
15:10
know generally you're just assigned a badge and shown the general procedures
and things of that sort
15:15
[Music] this was a little different are you still talking about the facility
15:21
near Las Vegas or are you talking about being flown up there no this is when finally
I was
15:26
flown so they go to McCarran Airport right by the EG&G building and I be
15:33
flown to groom Lake as I landed there
15:39
the first time right across from where the plane parked there's a security
15:45
officer was a security office and that's I believe I spent quite a while there
15:53
but you know reviewing you know how secure things are so on and so forth but
you know this is not where I worked
16:01
where I did work was about for my estimates about 10 or 15 miles south of
16:06
there we were taken there in a converted
16:11
school bus you know those big Bluebird jobs it was painted kind of a dark navy
16:16
blue there's a lot of people bomb who don't even believe that area 51 exists by the
way much less s4 I live out here
16:24
in Pahrump but I think I mean people I can tell you will not believe area 51
16:29
exists well there are a lot of people don't but I can tell you Bob when you drive up
by the VFW here in prompt at
16:35
about 4:30 or 5:00 in the morning there's a whole bunch of buses out there and
they've got signs right on the side
16:41
of the buses I saw it about a month ago and it just says area 51 oh really
16:46
yeah yeah not bothering anywhere to keep that thicker I guess anyway so then
they take you in
16:55
some front from groom lake the main facility and incidentally bob up on my
website i've got a picture a pretty good
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one the best one i've ever seen of the groom lake facility and it shows what
17:07
appeared to be three large hangars with the one in the center perhaps being the
17:13
largest is that your recollection three
17:19
large hangars you know three big hangars there are a lot of other attendant
17:24
buildings but three rather large hangars i don't recall there being three you
17:32
know obviously large hangar is on the on the approach in from Las Vegas that
stood out that much above
17:39
everything else okay I recall a huge satellite dish but for the most part
17:44
most of the time I was going there at night and certainly didn't have a run of the
place all I did was get to go in one
17:51
time I got to go to the cafeteria but other than that
17:57
it was merely a stop toward us for yeah third s for but you know I don't recall
18:04
recall there being three large hangars really that stood out didn't anything
18:10
else did you ever see anything unusual at all at Groom Lake the thing I did see
18:18
that was unusual was some sort of advanced rocket or jet plane people have
18:26
called it Aurora I don't know I don't know if it was Aurora or or if even or
18:31
if it even exists but John Andrews from the tester Corporation and a few other
18:38
aviation buffs kind of interviewed me more or less about that it was something
18:44
along the lines of an x-15 shaped type of craft now we were driving away from
18:49
this as it was taxing but it was a horrendously loud tearing sound that the
19:01
engines made and I think my original description was that it made a sound
19:06
like the air was tearing and that's the best description I could give to it I certainly
have heard about the new
19:14
generation of scramjet engines that have supersonic air flow inside that burned
19:20
liquid methane and so on and so forth whether that was these I don't know but I
did get a look up the exhaust as we
19:27
were returning and it was they were rectangular exhaust with some sort of vanes
inside that's all the information
19:34
I can give and what it was I don't know but that was a strangest thing I ever saw do
you recall the general shape of the aircraft was it close to what we
19:41
would call lifting body no okay well even though the x-15 was a lifting body
19:47
it was not a lifting body like you'd see on sixteen or something where there'd be a
19:52
you know a lot more a lot more wing incorporated into the body it was more
19:57
along the lines of a long slender body maybe the cross between an f-104 and an
20:04
x-15 for those people that are familiar with those planes very short stubby wings
which translates to me in high
20:13
speed of rotation high flight speed and sure things like that but you know again
20:19
I didn't get a very good look at it I don't know it could have been any
20:26
scientific research vehicle or anything I'm certainly not claiming that was Aurora
but some time later some of those
20:35
people were down and raychel and they heard and recorded a sound that they
20:41
interpreted as the sky tearing and played it back to me and it was in fact
20:47
the identical sound so a couple years later it was still operational whatever that
thing was but that was the only
20:52
unusual thing I ever saw there all right so you landed and they generally then you
get off on the tarmac there and get
20:59
right on a bus yeah well straight across from where the plane parked headin
21:05
straight across from there and kind of a large parking area was the security
building and that's where we picked up
21:11
the bus and went south the first time we I did go in and it was an extensive
21:16
little get-together with the security people there and signed all kinds of
21:22
strange forums that were there are a lot of people on the bus no not going down
21:28
to ask for generally the person that accompanied me all the time was Dennis
Mariani who was my supervisor at that
21:34
time okay and so then they had you sign all kinds of forms what kind of forms
21:39
well everything from signing a virtually signing away my constitutional right so
should anything go wrong as far as me
21:48
pulling my guts ruin your don't show they would you know essentially be judge
21:55
jury and executioner as far as the
22:02
authorization to attain the clearance there that was
22:07
an order that was signed by President Reagan which I saw on the desk I'm
22:13
trying to remember some of the other paperwork beforehand I gave permission to
have my phone lines monitored boy and
22:22
can you remember any of the wording I mean sunt you said you signed something
that would allow them if you blab to be
22:29
judge jury well I had signed something like that I mean that may be a slight
22:34
exaggeration how the wording was but certainly I signed I'm trying to member
22:40
what it was like a 10-10 agreement if you've heard that before I don't remember
the exact title of the document
22:45
but you know it says if you violate the
22:51
international security secrets you're it's ten years in jails and a ten thousand dollar
fine does that sound
22:56
familiar to you that before I've signed something like that before but this is
certainly far above and beyond that
23:02
which was kind of shocking actually but at the time you know you pretty much
23:07
just blow it off and say all this means is that I'm going to be involved in something
you know extremely interesting
23:13
and you know it's it's great so what you know I'm not I have no intention of
violating any rules or you know causing
23:21
any problem so this no flat I understand I mean by that time you're being
23:26
probably tantalized thinking no really I always think you know what this is a
pumped-up
23:31
gonna be real fun exactly all right so you sign all the forms including one 2d
23:38
to tap your phone huh right they did I thought that was again before I went down
there that was down to D G ng and I
23:45
gave him permission to do that but that was only for a limited amount of time I
don't recall how long that was for um
23:53
Bobby that's kind of a silly thing to do in the first place because if you cannot
monitor my phone white tell me and it
24:01
defeats the purpose maybe because otherwise they have to go through some sort
of legal procedure and
24:06
get some sort of court something or another so maybe you would think in the
interest of national security they could
24:12
circumvent all that but well they probably do I know I had actually
24:18
doubted that they were actually doing that you know once in a while everyone
24:25
here is a little clicks and pops and buzzes on their phone and um you know I
24:31
really didn't think that was it my view is a good tap is one you never hear well this
is my point exactly
24:37
sometime later I guess we'll get into that but when things turned sour
24:42
actually before they did they had come to my house 30 minutes after I got off
24:47
the phone with gene one day and we were joking around on the phone they came
to my front door 30 minutes later with a
24:56
transcript of our conversation and outlined were the questionable phrases
25:01
that I had spoken now this is amazing to me considering the closest FBI building
25:06
down here is on Charleston and where our
25:11
Charleston and Maryland Parkway but I mean that's you know that's that's an
25:17
amazing feat it almost makes me think they had a little mobile setup somewhere
well it is you're you're a computer guy
25:24
and I've heard maybe you could confirm this for me that the NSC has the ability
25:29
to have super computers which virtually are monitoring perhaps even millions of
25:35
conversations looking not at the entire conversation but listening exactly
25:40
keywords I well that's how they caught that drug kingpin down and uh where is
25:46
it Panama or Mexico that's right and they always show you and every single phone
line right and just picked out
25:53
certain words and grab them so I encourage my audience to constantly in the
middle of a conversation just simply
25:59
say qo q hard actually we say a fascination president like that oh all
26:10
right well anyway so so onward to to
26:16
area s for I guess is it a paved road or a bumpy little ride that's a quite a bumping
little ride
26:22
it's a dirt road down there follows along the base of the mountain and
26:28
coming up to the facility it's right off of that booster I like that mm-hmm and
26:36
there's a small mountain range on the side and built right into the side of the
mountain is the installation itself
26:44
yes for installation and it's composed of hangar doors around one side and then
26:50
I guess I believe on the east now on the
26:57
south facing side there's a is the main entrance into the facility were the
27:03
windows on the bus darkened or could you see out as you know you could the only
27:09
place you could see out was the front on the bus most of the times I had gone
down there was the driver a security
27:17
guard and Dennis Mariani the security guard almost always stood right up front
27:24
not sitting down by holding that bar you know which is right by the door on those
27:29
buses sure uh in I don't know if it was in an effort to block my view out there or
just to intimidate me and stare at me
27:36
but that's how he rode the entire trip down there so it was always difficult to see
exactly where we were and and what
27:44
was in between right well there's really nothing in between I pretty much desert
Dennis Mariani who was he
27:53
he was my supervisor what his exact position was was was pretty much unclear
27:58
to me he's a stocky guy smokes a cigar kind of
28:04
looked very military looking short blond hair um was about the best I could
28:11
describe him maybe you know late 30s early 40s um not gregarious more security
like yes
28:20
so I really don't know what his exact function was in the world I didn't wear a
military uniform though Teddy Bob you
28:26
know now hidden clothes brand civilian but you can kind of tell military guys
28:32
yeah just by the way they look and the way they comport themselves and so forth
and so on but you know again
28:38
it's this is my guesstimation of what sure what this guy was about we'll see
28:44
your cumson shadow was he with you all the time for the most part for the most
part until I learned how things operate it
28:52
there my I guess I shouldn't jump ahead that far yet well I might as well for
29:02
the most part you know for science to progress anywhere if you're doing any sort
of research whatsoever one of the
29:10
things that is that is vital this free discussion open and free discussion amongst
the people that are working on
29:16
the project okay right what obviously you know it's how ideas or bounced off
29:22
other people and now the only way things can progress wasn't that one of the
main contentious points during the
29:28
development of the atomic bomb in the Manhattan Project everything was
compartmentalized and le military just
29:36
loved to do that and the scientists just hate it because they want to bounce ideas
off each other
29:41
exact same really in 1989 that was still going on well probably well how would I
29:50
know how bad it was during the Atomic Age but it was very oppressive so much
29:58
so that our job was very compartmentalized every aspect was split
30:05
into groups of people groups of people are quite literally two people you work
30:10
on the buddy system in other words the only person I can talk to the only person I
can discuss anything with the
30:16
only person I can relate to is the one person who I work with any other aspect
30:21
of the project any other questions are simply not to be asked so immediately
30:27
you're interfering with your progress in that if whatever you're doing interacts
30:33
with anything else anywhere you know you've run into a black wall you don't even
really know if you're the first
30:40
person to come down and be assigned this task do you exactly there's another
role
30:46
that I was a real yeah but yeah you really have no idea
30:52
what's going on and I'm sure if you found that in while part a connects to
30:59
Part B which were not allowed to see you know I'm you know I'm sure there would
be some way to gain some of that
31:05
information but Bob not only were you not the first person assigned that task but
this might be an interesting point
31:12
to tell them why you were told you were hired no that's true I was actually one
31:20
of the questions I've always had is why did they hire me hmm certainly for this
31:26
project I would not be the most intelligent the most resourceful person
31:38
that they could possibly hire out of all the people at Los Alamos or anywhere else
in the world for that matter so
31:44
I've always wondered exactly why they would have picked me and so why then did
31:49
they I still don't know I have always wondered this I've ran a lot of things
31:56
through my mind you know at different possible scenarios and they really none of
them make any
32:02
sense was it because Edward Teller just thought I was a nice guy and essentially
32:07
juiced me into the position it's that makes yeah it sounds that way yeah but you
know in a project like this why
32:15
would something like that happen where every person counts you're talking in a
project where they're only actually 22
32:20
active people working on it no but when tiller speaks the military listens
32:26
yeah that's true but I mean I didn't know him well enough as far as my
32:32
scientific background it was actually fairly limited the most I mean I was
32:38
working at Los Alamos on the working
32:43
with the accelerator at that point so it really wasn't a propulsion based job
32:49
anything to do with uh what I was about to have my hands on
32:55
maybe they assumed you did have the right background maybe they didn't really
know what they had on
33:01
their hands here we are at area s4 south of groom Lake and I guess by now you're
33:09
in great anticipation Bob wondering what you're going to be doing I was actually
33:15
I was just about to make a point before we broke and I can't remember it
33:21
well that's why you have Gina Gina 13 doesn't remember either I just remember
33:26
is why I think my short-term and we were talking right before we broke about he
had the idea why they chose him of all
33:32
the people in the world but that's well actually gene you had said why don't you
tell him Bob why they chose you said if
33:40
I have no idea and we were told about the work he did it right almost right yeah he
was what I was implying
33:48
something else and in other words I was I was telling him reminding him of why
33:54
there were vacancies why they needed to hire someone was why someone wasn't
in his slaughter and we were talking about
33:59
the fact that he was not the first one that's right early and that makes sense
34:06
in other words if they had something they didn't understand I can imagine they
would bring in a writ an array of
34:12
people of different disciplines to take a look see well might that might have been
the case but you know I to this day
34:20
I can't figure out why you know if certainly you look at my record and the
34:25
way I approach things and the work I had done before was a little more renegade
and maybe that's what they were doing
34:30
was looking for someone that would approach the project from a different
34:35
Road and are you able to talk about what you did at Los Alamos I did several
34:41
things initially I was working on the
34:48
polarized proton target on the accelerator the accelerator there at Los
34:54
Alamos is a linear accelerator it stretches about I remember about a half mile and
it's one of the more unique
35:03
setups in that instead of running a single experiment on the output of the
35:08
accelerator the beam is split into different areas and all these different areas
35:13
our I don't know really if they're leased or rented to other countries or
35:19
other scientists but several other people and other groups from all over
35:26
the world essentially can conduct experiments simultaneously at different
35:32
times they'll fire different particles down the target for different lengths of time
and you know everyone can run their
35:39
own experiments and you know see what's going on there was also some Star
Wars development done there okay I'm sitting
35:48
here listening trying to imagine any application for what you were about to do and
you don't edit for but ya know
35:57
there is there's none there was no there was no direct connection at all this is you
know one of the things that has
36:04
perplexed me forever but how could there be but yeah maybe this was the point
36:10
that I was going to make in fact it is it just popped back in my mind what was
strange about the interviews I had had
36:18
was you know certainly there was some technical questions here and there they
36:25
essentially knew my background already but what they were most concerned was
36:31
what was what I had done in my spare time which I found to be very unusual
36:39
now your what had you done in your spare time you have worked with propulsion
36:45
systems in your spare time right I mean they were essentially concerned with more
of my you know for lack of a better
36:51
word play time than they were was what I was or what I had currently done all
36:57
right well let's take this back to Edward Teller when you had a conversation with
Edward Teller did you
37:03
talk about your play time did you talk about well I was talking about at that time the
static ramjet engine that that
37:11
was in fact that was in the front of the paper uh-huh so we were talking about in
37:16
fact at that time I had filed patents on it of how the device operated without
37:24
the need for fuel pumps and things of that sort the type of fuel that used what is a
37:29
static ramjet engine it was an offshoot of a pressure jet engine which is which
37:36
was invented by Eugene glue harf who was also coincidentally the inventor of the
37:41
rocket ejection seat seat that's used on all fighter aircraft indeed he developed
37:48
that I believe in the 50s and in the 70s I had run into him and really as a kid
37:57
back then started working in my spare time as I went to Pierce College at that time
working to improve on the design I
38:06
came off with an offshoot of the design which was a little more complicated but
38:14
produced a lot more thrust the basic design of the engine is it has no moving parts
at all one property of propane is
38:25
that it sticks to hot metal this eliminates all the needs for flame
38:30
holders and things of that sort inside the engine which makes it more complicated
I'm trying to think of a
38:39
couple other points about it but there were it was a pretty different design as
38:44
far as jet engines go and with the changes I made it was essentially a
38:49
different type of engine and after I had gone past the development of it on a
38:56
test and I felt a slightly larger one and installed it in the back of a car and it was a
convenient mobile test
39:04
setup as opposed well and additionally it was something kind of interesting to
39:09
play around with in the desert sure which is where the whole article came from in
the newspaper but all right well
39:16
then I think you've answered your own question but still and playing around with
jet engines really doesn't qualify
39:23
qualify him or her to work on something of extraterrestrial origin no
39:28
but but then again uh who does have qualifications to go work on some well
they're here the point
39:35
so I can understand and if here's how I would based on what you said I'll bet
39:41
here's what happened the article in the paper the conversation with Edward
39:46
Teller and probably his suggestion with probably amounts to more of an order
39:53
that you'd be a good good person kind of a rebel to go take a look at this stuff
40:00
they had that area as forum oh that's that would be mildly that's yes that's a pretty
good guess
40:06
what what do you think Jeanne I agree I think that Edward tellers word carried
40:12
all the weight in the world and and and I also agree with you that who would
40:18
have a background who would be qualified to work on you know a gravity
propulsion
40:23
system and an antimatter reactor and the things Bob later ran into and about the
comprehensive problem solver as a
40:30
background in physics and electronics and propulsion and and I can understand
40:36
why they'd hire well yeah if you're going to go if you really have extraterrestrial
craft and you're trying
40:42
to figure out what makes them go then you're going to go find somebody who
works out of the box in other words is a
40:49
bit of a rebel and kind of works out of the normal box and experiments and tinker's
and is interested in propulsion
40:57
that's the kind of person you're going to go for because there's nobody out there
with specific qualifications for
41:02
that job obviously in addition to probably other considerations of a psychological
profile and you know yeah
41:09
that they were also very concerned with your psychological profile yeah they
41:15
were concerned with how I handle stress like I remember one of the one of the
41:21
questions was it you know have you ever thrown tools around in the lab or to that
effect and that these are very
41:27
strange questions for what you know what we were talking about but well in either
41:33
case I mean I got the job and and wound up there but haven't you ever thrown
41:38
tools no actually I haven't why I've kicked radios to one all the way
41:45
across the room put my foot through it anyway so so then you seem qualified most
every
41:50
way as much as one could be qualified for that so here you come to ask for and
were you immediately led into this area
41:59
where these crafts were no absolutely not in fact the first day there I went
42:04
in and I think my first stop was to go through the metal medical office there I
42:11
believe there was a nurse in there I'm pretty sure that was my first stop and I
42:18
had to go through a series of what I was told were allergen tests allergen does
42:24
yeah they took my arm and drew a little graph on it and pricked each little area
42:33
in my arm with different little needles nope and in fact I was not permitted
42:40
back to work and I think for two weeks until there was a reaction or if there
42:46
was debris reaction with any of the substances they put on my skin and they said
you know we're working with some
42:52
extremely exotic materials here that were not all that familiar with and we
42:58
want to know if there's going to be any problem with it again odd but acceptable
43:04
and I was also given an injection there too which was a yeah which was a wide
43:12
spectrum what did they call it antibiotics no it wasn't a wide-spectrum
43:18
antibiotic a wide spectrum something rather it's always good to know what
43:24
they're shooting you with yeah eyes up now I mean there have been so many I'm
43:31
sure which we'll get into later you know so many ridiculous stories offshoots of
what actually had happened to me you
43:39
know people said oh well they injected you with Thorazine or so on or this was the
memory drug that wiped out your
43:44
memory so you could only remember back and forth and you know so on and so
forth but I'm pretty sure that wasn't
43:50
the case this was they were mainly concerned about the you know here you're
dealing
43:56
with actual extraterrestrial materials and if we're going to be crawling around
44:02
on I'm taking things apart and having contact with them you know they imagine
they want to make sure that the people
44:09
working on her fairly safe well of that in one hand weight against the fact that
44:14
you know don't forget the United States government said fall out the people from
time to time you don't and you know did
44:21
other strange things to them but the island and mine were originally when you
44:26
originally told your story Bob years ago that wasn't known hazel all right the
44:32
A's Aloha that Leary was not around yet and and everybody regarded your story is
absolutely incredible beyond belief but
44:40
then when hazel O'Leary stepped out and said the following occurred everybody
went into into kind of a stupor as if my
44:46
time we did that so your story isn't so Auto I hadn't actually changed in the
44:53
past ten years if you remember you know ten years ago to the predominant theory
about how gravity propagates in any
45:02
physics test textbook you know related to gravitons and now the predominant
theory is
45:07
gravitational waves which is exactly how some of and in some scientists and
45:13
physicists at that time you know pointed out one of the many reasons they say the
45:19
reason this story can't be true was that this was actually ridiculous so on and so
forth and now it's spoken of as a
45:26
matter of fact this is how gravity propagates through space and it's just interesting
to see how things slowly
45:32
over the span of a decade quietly changed mm-hmm that's one thing I do
45:38
keep an eye on past but I take it your arm didn't break out inappropriately so
45:44
you passed now I think I think it did develop a small eruption somewhere but it was
nothing nothing to be concerned
45:51
about or so I was told so we just proceeded from there as you know there
45:57
is a group of people suing the government over illnesses they have
46:03
suffered from work they did at area 51 and that is proceeding quietly in court
46:11
it's not going to be so quiet when it goes to trial but that's underway now so
indeed there are some pretty exotic
46:17
materials up there actually you just reminded me of something when was that
46:22
gene when was it right after that where
46:28
I collapsed from the kidney Oh remember that it right yeah was that there or
46:34
after I had left the project no you were still in the project that was right after that
after they did these tests
46:40
and give your shot you know it's kind of surprising I forget that during a strange
substance and all i remembers
46:46
that you were at a toyota dealer or something like that and he was in he was in
such pain as kidneys hurt so bad he
46:54
thought he was going to die and to that point bob had never had any health
46:59
problems or had never had any sedatives or painkillers and the doctor gave Bob a
shot of Demerol and I called an Irishman
47:08
voting on cloud 9 and wasn't coherent and I came to his house is what was wrong
and then he was literally
47:14
literally high from from a painkiller they gave him just so he could stand the
47:19
pain in his kidney so whatever went through his system certainly stuck there yeah
so there was an adverse reaction to
47:26
something do you think that was well crush you have Nord knowing whether it was
the allergy test they put you
47:32
through or the shot they gave or wasn't it you know an amazing coincidence that
you know but he handled the prior kiddo
47:40
neuropathy yeah I mean it is you know well I take it you went to the doctor I did
yeah what do you say I don't
47:48
remember I think he said he gave me a shot of painkiller Demerol I believe it
47:56
was and he took a urine sample a blood
48:01
test and he asked if I had any previous problems anything strange and obviously
48:08
I said no no no certain they didn't mention anything about getting an injection right
a strange place in the middle of desert right um didn't they do
48:16
x-rays or a cat scan or something and time the cat scan they did yeah they did a
just an
48:21
tray to see if there was any blockage but there was my day later or I think
48:28
even the next morning everything was fine the x-rays came back negative
48:34
and I believe the blood work came back negative too as did the urine sample so I
in fact I think his conclusion was
48:41
that perhaps I had passed a small stone you know wound up in my bladder and
then it would probably hurt coming out again
48:48
but you know that never occurred and you know whether or not that scenario is
correct you know again it's just
48:54
speculation but I don't know that you just stirred that up in my memory I
48:59
don't you know I don't think I can tell didn't fit that's right that's how little bits and
pieces come back um
49:05
how's your health now by the way and and since then okay fine no problem all
49:11
right um so anyway uh you pass all their little tests that's all that the next
49:18
thing to happen was that I was led into a room with quite a number of little
49:26
briefing packages briefing papers or
49:31
these range from two pages to about five pages little folders with different
49:39
aspects of the project that I was working on this was I believe the part
49:49
of the first day and the second day that I was working there so they just sent
49:58
you down at a table and had you begin to read about yeah what these were just
basic overviews of what each group was
50:06
doing just essentially to give you knowledge of what the other facets of
50:11
the project were about a general overall right had no specifics whatsoever if in
50:17
parentheses a group of metallurgy and so on and so forth all right what I also
50:24
contains some of the names of the projects oh it did yeah all right um so
50:30
here we are you're in a little room with a bunch of briefing papers giving you more
or less an outline but not
50:37
specifics of what of the work being done on actually at that point they did they
50:43
state what it was that was being worked on well at this point yeah this is the
50:48
first time I really knew exactly what I would be doing and this is where it was
50:56
stated that the the project excuse me
51:02
the project was essentially that of bank engineering and extraterrestrial craft
51:07
that must be quite aligned to read well it wasn't it was also hard to believe but
certainly going into the project I
51:14
was basically a nuts and bolts guy and certainly didn't believe in UFOs and
51:20
thought everyone was crazy that even considered the topic I certainly believe
51:26
that there was life elsewhere certainly life can exist on other planets other
51:33
galaxies others other solar systems but I just found it very hard to believe that
there is any intelligent life
51:39
visiting earth and you had never had any close encounter of the third kind no no
51:45
and I thought people were basically crackpots the thought watch out but also art
he was into science and technology
51:51
and he certainly wasn't well-read I mean he had never heard of the you know Betty
and Barney Hill case or he didn't know
51:57
anything about the Roswell crash or anything along those lines I mean he
52:03
wasn't interested he didn't pursue it and if you all remember really a decade ago I
mean some of that information was
52:10
available that certainly wasn't prevalent to the point that it is today with websites
and movies and television
52:16
shows Oh indeed as a matter of fact before we proceed Bob I'd be very very
interested to hear your reaction
52:22
I am interviewed now twice very rare interviews by the way hours long
52:27
interviews with Colonel Philip Corso and I'm kind of interested to get your
52:34
reaction to Colonel Corsos revelations about the back-engineering
52:40
and insertion into American industry he did of artifacts from the Roswell crash
52:46
were you surprised to hear about this is the first I'm hearing about this
52:53
ah is that right what right there didn't alright Philip J Corso Colonel I rip
53:00
believe it or not I really am completely uninterested in the topic UFOs and never
follow it at all all right well this in
53:07
the darkest felon this is a man who was given the job he's
53:13
now 82 years of age by the way he was given the job of it was actually handed
53:18
a filing cabinet by a general and he was given a job of figuring out what some of
53:24
these things were and introducing them into American industry specifically Bell
53:31
Labs and some others at the time and these were artifacts from Roswell and he
53:36
is very very credible he wrote a book called the day after Roswell what
53:43
specifically left of Anathoth armed devices that led to and I'm gonna it's
53:50
going to be hard to night-vision scopes for example fiber optics for example the
53:56
transistor for example a lot of leaps that by the way particularly the
54:02
transistor there's not much of a paper trail for if you if you look back at the
54:08
development in Bell Labs of the transistor there's not a big paper trail yes it arrived
but there's not a big
54:15
paper trail about how it arrived well
54:20
I'm so skeptical of something like that the reason being well let me tell you
certainly you've seen pictures of the
54:26
first transistor we know it was developed at Bell Labs you know there are a couple
of guys working on it but
54:32
you know what the first transistor was it was essentially just anyway it was more
along lines of a diode it's just a
54:38
right a P a PN and a P Junction it's a big slab of silicon it really couldn't
54:44
do anything certainly if we had been given that advanced technology at that
54:51
time wouldn't it have been something a little more down the road
55:01
a lot of it was a lot of it they had no idea and well is he saying that he
55:07
worked with some of these guys or it knows them or was this all a big
55:13
conspiracy and everyone was no he was a it was just a middleman and his
assignment was to take something that
55:20
looked interesting and take it to American industry and trying to determine the
function and whether it
55:27
could be duplicated or not it's a long story not a while I mean with it but although
Bobby he's highly qualified I
55:33
mean this guy is I'm not I'm not immediately thinking about you know this
55:38
is my natural reaction to jump on that part he was an officer in the military and
held some very lofty positions right
55:44
oh absolutely I'd actually be interested to look I actually gave him UFO magazine
so he
55:51
could read about it but he doesn't read about UFOs understand really is true
people don't believe this about you Bob
55:57
they think you are the Guru of ethology and all guys why have you got the wrong
56:03
again it just isn't true oh wait you see I remember the interview I did
56:09
with you before remembered very well anyway so here you are reading about all of
56:15
this and you get sort of an overview of it all and probably buy it what are you
thinking by then I mean is your mouth
56:21
hanging open extra truck it is it is to some extent and another part of me is
56:29
beginning to wonder whether or not this is true at all or if this is some some
56:35
sort of psychological test you know everything else was so way out
56:41
essentially maybe this is you know another game that we're playing maybe they're
just trying
56:47
to determine what reactions of people in science would be to extraterrestrial
56:53
craft or the fact of extraterrestrial presence of any kind at all right and and
certainly all these thoughts had
56:59
gone through my mind from there the days
57:06
have kind of blended together in my mind I don't it's hard to separate what
happened on each day after that but I
57:13
believe that the next time I went there was the
57:23
time that I was actually let in through one of the hangar doors now normally we
57:30
drove alongside of the installation and came in the main entrance this one time
57:37
we drove up and one of the hangar doors was open in the hangar doors as plain as
57:45
day or in the hangar door as plain as day was the craft that I had later
57:52
labelled the sport model a very sleek looking very stereotypical flying saucer
58:00
my immediate reaction was this is the new generation fighter that we're
58:06
working on for whatever reason it's saucer-shaped but immediately in my mind
58:13
I said this explains all the UFO sightings throughout history has just
58:19
been the development of this thing here it is here it is it makes you know perfect
sense I've done a model five
58:26
feet away from me here a tester model which I believe the tester corporation built
based on your description right it
58:33
looked exactly like that is that what we're talking about the exact work model you
call the sport model yeah a very
58:39
sleek sporty looking yeah that's it exactly
58:45
I'll be damned alright um so you drove by this thing we actually stopped in
58:51
front and I was led out of the bus the security guard first then Dennis
58:58
then myself Dennis walked on ahead of me and the security guard told me to keep
59:05
my eyes forward and just follow Dennis into the back and at the back of the
59:11
hangar there was a door that led in to a hallway in the office areas I walked
59:17
right by the craft the door was off the craft or hatch whatever you want to call
59:24
it right alongside of it was an American flag
59:29
adhere to it a little sticker not really qualified now the all they did was
59:34
cemented in my mind thinking well this is obviously this is there I slipped my
59:40
hand along the side of the craft which the guard didn't appreciate and I was
59:46
told again keep my hands at my side where to feeling awkward it's I I say it
59:52
felt like metal and the reason I say that is because it was cool to the touch
59:58
yes it could an advanced ceramics or something absolutely but to me sure
1:00:04
itself and it appeared like metal we
1:00:10
continued in and this is where I first met the person that I'd be working with
1:00:16
very castelia are Casteel however you pronounce that and this is when I first
1:00:24
saw the initial components of the craft that had been taken out so they had
1:00:31
begun to gut this thing that not this particular one there was more than one there
how many there were actually nine
1:00:38
craft not all like this but from what
1:00:44
they told me from what I saw there were nine craft and don't ask me where they
came from or how we got them or anything
1:00:51
I have no idea but the craft were in different really different states some
1:01:00
were completely dismantled some looked as if they would be operational but they
1:01:07
hadn't been touched at all but apparently from what I understand all
1:01:13
the crafts had the exact same reactor and propulsion system in him did any of
1:01:20
the craft look looks as though they had been in a collision or crash uh no the
1:01:28
only one that had damage to it looked intentional it was a craft that had a
1:01:41
it's kind of hard to describe but the area around the craft the lip if you
1:01:47
will was very broad and flat and thin and it looked as if it had been stood up
1:01:53
in a projectile fired through the hole from the distance that I saw look around
1:02:00
for inches but it could have been at any sizes it looked as if the metal was bent
1:02:06
outward and so wow that could have been dropped from the sky
1:02:12
someone could have fired a projectile through it who knows again was very
1:02:17
interesting in other words we're not dealing with Superman's cape here holes
could be blown through it right of
1:02:24
course on the other hand it's an extremely unscientific test you take something as
prized as that you don't
1:02:30
stand it up and fire a cannon at the thing or a howitzer you certainly you
1:02:35
know take a small quantity off and you know do your analysis of that that piece but
for whatever reason that was the
1:02:42
only one that looked like it sustained any damage some of the other craft were
1:02:48
dismantled to some point but certainly not wrecked the only craft that I was
1:02:54
permitted to work on to touch to have anything to do with was the craft that I term
the sport model that's the one that
1:03:01
you have a model up there well as you turn around as you walk in on all of
1:03:06
this so Bob you know I did not see this all at one time this is I saw this one craft
and the hangar doors are all the
1:03:13
hangars are all next to each other and only at one time you know way down the
1:03:18
road where all the bay doors open at one time and I got a glance to see in what
was the other and the other hangar doors
1:03:24
but for the most part all I at this point all I knew was that there was this one craft
and now in my mind I am
1:03:31
convinced that this is just a US manufactured extremely secret
1:03:36
crimefighter reconnaissance craft who knows what but indeed the little American
flag did that for you Oh
1:03:42
without without question that was it it's a done deal so then you say you look at it
and say
1:03:49
turn around to your companion will go in and say wow or my
1:03:55
god or where these come from nothing all I just had a smile on my face if I
remember walked into the back door and
1:04:01
then I you know the introductions began the only other person I really interfaced
with was Rene I don't
1:04:08
remember his last name but and I
1:04:16
actually can't remember what in the world Rene did but for the most part Barry
and I worked closely together now
1:04:23
this was also the first time that my supervisor left me alone with Barry and
1:04:31
you know this is where the learning process essentially began this date is
1:04:38
where my view of everything changed did they tell you at that point what your
specific job was in other words there it
1:04:46
is and it's sort of like okay what am I supposed to do well that's what this you
1:04:51
know that's where we begin now this is exactly what this meeting with Barry
1:04:57
entails is the description of precisely what I'm supposed to be working on what my
function and life is now at this
1:05:04
place hmm and this is where I find out that we are essentially well number one
1:05:11
that the briefings I was reading are correct in other words they are extraterrestrial
right these crafts are
1:05:17
no extraterrestrial the the scope aim of our project is now to back engineer
1:05:24
these craft or this one particular craft with the intention of duplicating it or
1:05:31
duplicating the substance of the subsystems within it using earthly
1:05:36
materials so that's that was the project now this hit me quite hard at that time
1:05:45
and needless to say now this night I didn't get any sleep it was fairly
1:05:51
exciting before that but and certainly
1:05:56
Barry just telling me this wasn't enough this is when we also had some
demonstrations on what we had found out
1:06:03
or what information had be had been gleaned so far from the technology that we
seen you know I was all very
1:06:12
fantastic and I was absolutely mind-boggling well I know you don't
1:06:18
follow all this but I have to ask and have you seen Independence Day oh absolutely
1:06:23
oh okay good at least you've done that um you remember when they brought
everybody into area 51 and they opened
1:06:31
the big door and you want to say well they Azazel invited me to the premiere of
that well they did yeah in fact I
1:06:38
made me stand up for some reason they make oh yeah I did they introduce me I
1:06:43
see but in fact someone called I don't
1:06:49
remember the people involved there but when they were talking about the movie
1:06:55
the making of the movie so on and so forth the lab technician there I don't
1:07:03
remember his name in the movie but who wore the white lab coat they called the
Bob Lazar guy young Dean Devlin was the
1:07:10
writer okay I don't remember the other people that were there but I thought that
was pretty funny but as they said
1:07:18
they had taken the for the movie they had taken much of the UFO lore stories
1:07:25
and everything that had been circulating around for years and you know threw
together the script in a short time and
1:07:31
produced it so that wasn't great it looked nothing like that by the way but
1:07:37
you know the idea was the thing same right same idea um all right well we're
1:07:43
at an interesting juncture here and the real fun is about to begin uh were you told
that you were going to
1:07:51
be working on one specific area of back-engineering or were you gone like
1:07:57
oh really i only power in propulsion system and everything else is essentially off-
limits meaning you
1:08:03
couldn't even touch it now couldn't touch it however I did get I did get to go on the
craft one time and this was
1:08:12
for the express purpose of only seeing the placement of the the actor and how the
gravity amplifiers
1:08:19
worked how the emitters moved freely underneath on the the primary level and
1:08:25
just how all the sub components you know fit together our Bob you were in effect
1:08:31
recruited I think by Edward Teller I have a friend who's listening to the
1:08:38
show this morning as we speak believe it or not all the way down in Perth Australia
his name is Stan Dale and he
1:08:46
was also recruited by Edward Teller and he's got a question or two for you I
1:08:52
want to see if we can bring him up all the way from Perth Australia there's a slight
delay in the phone line
1:08:59
transmission of Stan are you there hi yeah okay very good
1:09:04
bob lazar is on the line and i know you followed the Lazzara story and you might
briefly just very briefly recap yours
1:09:12
and ask a question all right very briefly I was working in the computer
1:09:18
business in Dallas in 1908 it was 70 71 and I among other things I was also
1:09:26
doing some investigation for the FBI at the corporation's where I was working it's
time to cover a plan during this
1:09:35
time at this company where I was working as a large corporation called belt X
optical the time had 100 sub corporation
1:09:43
and a lot of mop rated in the bottom and during the time I was there I was
1:09:48
approached by one of the senior executives of this company to go meet with a
doctor change our max field at
1:09:54
the radiation research clinic over a couple miles from where we had the office in
Dallas and I I didn't go for
1:10:02
about a month and then I met this same executive at a morning coffee in the
1:10:08
executive room and he said to me I hadn't been to see his friend max field
1:10:13
and the reason he asked me to go is because I had talked him about some work
that I've been doing in my time off my private time at home in my own
1:10:19
laboratory working with two things one was a thermionic electrical converter
1:10:25
and the other was a rather novel method I thought of propel a flying aircraft which
was
1:10:33
circular-shaped and you know Flying Saucer you'd call it today anyway in the
1:10:38
course of having homeless guy just over coffee well he kind of got reason being
interested in didn't tell me out I go talk to further his and didn't do it so
1:10:45
thirty days passed and he said to me look you haven't been to see Jim axle yet
please go this afternoon I've booked you an appointment three so I go over
1:10:52
this place and it's not like a place that sees people very often it was some it was
open the door was kind of a jar
1:10:58
but there was no cars in front of it and daylight and then I walked in the lights were
off down the hallway and I walked
1:11:04
down the hallway and it was kind of dark and this suddenly this nurse well I guess
we set aside lady appears out of
1:11:10
nowhere from the side and you just can I help you I thought gee I didn't anybody
was here look I think I'm deaf right I
1:11:16
think I'm looking for this dr. James or Maxfield and she's all yes yeah dr.
1:11:22
Michael is here you'll be out in just a second we stay on the lab and so sure
enough within a minute or so this big tall dude comes out and a white medical
1:11:30
coat smoking cigar wearing cowboy boots ah yes yes I've been expecting you
come on into my office and at this time is
1:11:36
when I first got introduced to this clandestine organization in the United
1:11:42
States that was headed by dr. Edward Teller and who max will worked with and
with this teller and this organization
1:11:50
[Music] had been working since the mid 50's on something like 50 some hot
project all
1:11:56
relate directly to flying saucer technology if you wish to put it down to that level I
was just a delight comer on
1:12:04
the scene they showed me about their base down to South Pole and the ice cap I
had access to by submarine or
1:12:10
something similar and explained to me they knew what I was doing they even
1:12:15
knew what I was thinking were see because they asked me about my physics and I
said well look thinking I was talking to some of the greatest
1:12:21
physicists in the world which I wish I was I didn't have my degree in that area and
you know I said well look guys I'm
1:12:28
here sir you know I am been working on a way to unify gravitation electromagnetic
1:12:34
and magnetic effects and she's all look spare me all that he said you're working on
anti-gravity and let's get to the
1:12:40
maybe no matter how are you doing and that's when they started when he started
tell me that I need to
1:12:45
finish my research with him down in Australia instead of America that's why I'm
here today because those guys packed
1:12:52
me up and sent me down here we partied way and nineteen seventy two or three I
1:12:59
think it was I was only with him for about a year and I got rather
1:13:05
disenchanted with all the technology they were holding back from the people I'm
still was young enough to think that
1:13:10
we could them that we could save the world by giving technology to you know
1:13:16
countries needed food and grain and water stuff shipped back and forth rather
rapidly but anyway because of that we parted
1:13:23
ways in a in a real HUF and I kind of hid in the bush for a while because they really
kind of I'll be better if I was
1:13:30
buried and then after coming out of that I wrote the book to cause conspiracy to
1:13:35
kind of be insurance and told a lot of what I had gone through in there and left the
rest for I'll tell the rest if
1:13:40
you get short with me so now that's my side Bob story do you ever run into Jim
1:13:49
Maxwell at on your side of it no I haven't actually now you I've got a thousand
questions now but one of the
1:13:57
prominent one on my mind here is what what function what was tellers function
1:14:02
well they seem to be in charge or overseer of all the projects at the
1:14:08
highest level that's all that I was told this is something I've always wondered about
the project down down where I
1:14:14
worked and you know no one really ever spoke of them but I got just a gut
1:14:21
feeling that he was silently in charge of everything
1:14:26
and it's well what you're saying is also
1:14:31
very interesting because a lot of what you're talking about seems to mimic some
1:14:37
of the things we were working on and I Bob when if I remember I went
1:14:44
teller called you when you originally got the call from him to contact a gentleman
of EG&G teller said that he
1:14:50
was no longer active but worked in a Chia Trenton capacity that's right haha
1:14:56
something happened after I left because in fact I'll tell you I had minders
1:15:01
appointed down here who really run this country and run the Prime Minister's my
minders operate out of a group called
1:15:07
the Melbourne Club and they're you know the old kind of British Raj you know
cigars and port white haired guys anyway
1:15:15
they brought me into their halls of power and I had lunch a few times with the
kingpins there and my my mentor was
1:15:22
mmm Sir John Williams and Henry Somerset Sir Henry Somerset anyway we were
1:15:29
sitting there one day at lunch and they were talking amongst themselves about
someone moving in on them or they were
1:15:35
like like it's an undeclared war status and that they were losing and they never
1:15:40
mentioned aliens and a lot kind of stuff so don't jump the gun but I you know I
heard him say well yeah Henry it looks
1:15:46
like we're going to lose this you know they're just moving in and I waited and
1:15:51
nothing else was said and I still excuse me gentleman said by day you know think
I'd be clever I said you mean the
1:15:57
european economic community because we've been talking you know large
corporate or money deals in life in the country and they both look at me like a
1:16:04
you know done a rout at the table or something and said oh mmm mabel distant
fishing up the farm this weekend henry
1:16:10
yes john and you know immediately I knew that I asked the question that I should
have known the answer to already didn't
1:16:17
anyway they they indicated at that point that they were being taken over
1:16:22
well I got a with the organization and wrote a book no less years passed and about
seven years ago I have a friend in
1:16:29
Scottsdale Arizona and in Conrad Murphy and Conrad goes to a lot of places and
1:16:34
he's a racist of boats and cars and he's you know fairly active fellow in business
anyway
1:16:40
Connor is invited to give the morning devotional and it's some big business
breakfast like for the you know Arizona
1:16:47
500 club or something like that and and so he rang me says look guess who I'm
going to give the
1:16:53
the you know the breakfast benediction right next to who's sitting right next to me
next week is you know Edward
1:16:59
Teller I said wow I said can you get to mr. Tucker tell her and say you know take a
message I want to talk to him he
1:17:06
said not a problem so I waited why you two week passed and so Conrad bring me
1:17:11
back in he says one out he says well I sat next to him and he said you know it was
all kind of a normal conversation
1:17:18
give the benediction eat a bit and he says after he had a couple bites I said to him
look come what do you know about
1:17:24
them this fellow named Stan do you know down in Australia working on anti-
gravity and you know flying saucers
1:17:31
and he said cover looked at him very blankly and said don't know the fellow he
says oh that's hot and he reaches in
1:17:38
his coat and pulls out a copy of my book with my photo on it and turns it up in
front of edy teller II said the blood
1:17:43
drained out of his face and he looked away and a general over on the side who was
in uniform came over and took teller
1:17:50
said dr. Tiller's have another meeting and took him away so I wondered at that
point where the teller was in charge of
1:17:56
anything anymore you sure I'm saying hmm I do that's very interesting
1:18:01
I've never been able to get back to the team it's a you know I think they did lose
whatever whatever was trying to
1:18:06
take him over did and so anyway after all of that Stan had to sort of lay low
1:18:13
for a while and he just sort of ended up staying in Australia will art I had to
1:18:20
give up my US citizenship to keep from being extradited the time that they were
trying to to get to the bottom of this
1:18:25
okay I'd love to be back in this were they trying to prosecute you for for anything
and what was will I wasn't
1:18:32
like there's out doing a lot of the covering living sorry sorry taken see that's a
delay we have oh I already
1:18:37
Michael no just go on it just what was the reason what were you were they trying
to were
1:18:44
not too cute you four there were a number of things Bob one of them was that oh
there were a number of things ah
1:18:52
jeez I just put the dog on she wants to say something here just like you I don't
1:18:58
know the as I said to you I was doing some undercover where are the FBI and they
deny of course that there were
1:19:04
seven oh sorry is everywhere dog from
1:19:10
Australia believe me it's coming - very good leave the most popular dogs on the
plant they've seen a bird out here and
1:19:15
they're trying to eat it alright well I got that question is a stand were they trying to
prosecute you or with their
1:19:22
threats on your life how serious well both when when I went underground they
1:19:27
had really determined they were going to put me around permanently in
Melbourne well well I ran and for a little over a
1:19:36
year I travelled in the Australian bush with you know what let the hair grow out and
wore the sunglasses and probably
1:19:42
hippies and whatever just disappeared fine I got hungry had to come back in and
when I did I came in under an
1:19:49
assumed name and worked for a while and but eventually they caught up with me
because I applied for work in companies
1:19:54
and had to show my passport uh what was it can I interrupt you for a second well
1:20:01
what was the threat that you presented to them well were they afraid of the
information that you had or yeah okay so
1:20:08
that that was their main concern that you're running around with information that
you could possibly divulge to someone else and well first of all I
1:20:15
would be able to identify them I mean I could identify you know like by name that
people were head of it in the the
1:20:23
aeronautical research centre at Fishman has been in Melbourne and in the
Australian Club who of course controlled
1:20:30
the prime ministers of this country and there was a number of things that I was
privy to that would be rather
1:20:35
embarrassing but in their defense let me say this now that I've had time to think
1:20:40
about it if I'd have been in their position and yeah they were holding the secrets
they were and wearing the
1:20:47
pressures they were I would probably have ordered my execution as well it
1:20:52
it's bigger than one person's life it's a really I'm sure you would appreciate this
Bob what we're talking about is a
1:20:58
cover-up of incredible proportions were you able to continue your research or did
they have all the requisite hardware
1:21:05
ah of course they did I did do something I did play around a bit what I could do
1:21:10
but um you know I couldn't I didn't have access to high temperature coding I
couldn't put my barium titanate or
1:21:16
anything else on the to services but your little that video
1:21:21
you did with the little ship that had the thermionic converter on it I don't want you
had to have an element whatever
1:21:28
was one 115 because we were quite aware that you could convert thermal energy
1:21:33
that had around 37 gigahertz on the on the sampling frequency you could you
1:21:39
could take random heat and convert it into flowing electric energy well that makes
the thermionic generator I mean
1:21:45
yes that's it that's it oh yeah but all that does that yeah that's just that's
1:21:51
just providing electrical power that's correct that's correct this as I say we didn't
need one one farm to do that though well yeah no one does I mean
1:21:57
that's how ya means space space thermionic generated issues you know
1:22:02
plutonium to warm essentially a thermocouple using the Seebeck effect or
1:22:09
whatever to produce you know electrical energy however the basis of the craft
1:22:14
that I worked on the electrical energy was merely a byproduct that was not how
the entire craft operated that's where
1:22:20
the 115 came in now the other thing I notice there is you're using gravity wave a
and gravity wave B focus field in
1:22:29
the stuff we were working on it it's the field we would generate was in a toroidal
field that would curl well that
1:22:37
that's exactly how this is general is essentially a tour it around the craft okay
1:22:43
in fact there's I just have some some of the animators gave me some fantastic
1:22:52
graphics that I haven't really been able
1:22:57
to post anywhere but I did want to put them up on the web somewhere because
there are a lot of people that are interested in the actual propagation of
1:23:03
the gravity field and I was just about to give those to the guys that handle
1:23:10
our web page and you'd be it might be worth having a look at that
1:23:15
what's the website uh it look like yeah just go to my site and you'll be able to
1:23:22
jump right over a span we're out of time in the South hour but working from what
I've heard I think that you too should
1:23:29
be communicating I know well I never had in every spa he kind of did like I did went
to ground I think yeah well what
1:23:36
I'll do is I'll provide Bob with your number in person okay if with your
1:23:42
permission is that Alright fine excellent all right I thought mommy L might work
well do i yes it does work
1:23:48
well and we can make those arrangements as well so well that would be fine yet I'd
like to come all right Stan um thank
1:23:57
you very much and uh we'll put you two in contact all right good night all right
good night from America and we'll
1:24:05
be right back with Bob Lazar and Jeanne huff this is kind of interesting when you
listen to people like Stan and you
1:24:11
listen to people like Bob as far as we've gone with the story it's all laid out in such
a calm matter-of-fact way
1:24:18
that I think a lot of the public has a tendency to lose sight of the implications of
what they're hearing but
1:24:25
you've told the story so many times Bob that I guess it comes out that way sort of
in a matter-of-fact way huh yeah it
1:24:32
pretty much does um all right let us
1:24:37
return your story now you're in you've got to just get in the craft and what
1:24:43
are you doing what are you working on what are you seeing well if I remember
1:24:49
this is I have just met with Barry and we're now going over Thanks let's see
1:25:00
well this is as I said when I first realized exactly what was going on what
1:25:06
the implications were and precisely what
1:25:11
I'd be doing in the room this is a lab
1:25:16
off the main hallway and in the room is
1:25:21
one of the reactors from one of the crafts and one of the amplifiers from
1:25:30
one of the crafts also how big are these the reactor I would imagine is about Oh
1:25:38
two feet somewhere but eighteen inches 2 feet somewhere in that
1:25:44
general area not really big been no nothing not large at all yeah odd-looking thing
has a bottom plate and
1:25:52
half of a sphere on top of it the
1:25:58
amplifier itself is about in about two
1:26:05
feet in diameter probably four feet long cylindrical shaped with something that
1:26:11
would look like plates on the outside of it black in color you know these are
1:26:19
very unusual and essentially how very very unusual looking devices this isn't
1:26:26
actually the amplifier that I always catch myself calling it that it's the emitter it's
the device that is moved on
1:26:35
a pivot and it's where the gravity wave actually is or emanates from quite
1:26:43
similar to a horn on a microwave system
1:26:49
[Music] as it turns out gravity waves behave a
1:26:55
lot more like microwave at least the gravity waves that are being produced by
1:27:01
this system do so you have wave guides and things of that sort that you'd see
1:27:08
in a microwave system those are the main
1:27:13
components of the craft that were in the lab at that time what does that suggest or
tell us about the nature of gravity
1:27:21
well actually you have to look and see what we really know about gravity and
1:27:27
you know we really as it turns out don't know anything about gravity as people
1:27:36
have said we can certainly measure its forces or measure its effect on things
1:27:41
ROM but really to to this date there is
1:27:47
no and a lot of people don't know this that there is there's truly no
1:27:52
conclusive evidence at the present time that gravitational ants have ever been
1:27:57
detected in a laboratory now there have been several gravitational wave detectors
built and you can assume that
1:28:08
they protecting gravitational waves but they can also be detecting many other
1:28:15
energies of or fluxes of energies from from who knows where so it's a it's
1:28:22
something we can hardly measure something we certainly know the existence of
but we know very very
1:28:29
little about it it's essentially a big hole a black hole if you will in physics
1:28:35
as we know it actually the physicists that I've talked to are not altogether certain
whether it's a push or a pull
1:28:42
and the one I think they're pretty sure it it's a pull but in physics today if
1:28:50
physics itself is so fluid yet so many people either true physicists or
1:28:57
armchair physicists or you know scientists whoever you run into really
1:29:02
stand their ground on theories and yet most people tend to forget that these
1:29:10
are just theories you know they are not you know these are not facts this is a
1:29:16
topic we know very very little about and as I said some time ago we or the
1:29:22
prominent theory was that there were graviton alleged subatomic particles
1:29:28
that actually you know accounted for the force of gravity however people that do
1:29:36
bring that up really don't know much about that theory either because there was
never an actual particle called a
1:29:43
graviton the whole concept behind a graviton was that because
1:29:51
[Music] I'm trying to think of how to put this in layman's terms they basically
wanted
1:29:59
to to quantify gravity maybe I shouldn't
1:30:05
get into this all right you're looking at this thing when you see it do you know what
it is what are we talking
1:30:11
about well the V or D laws went okay we're looking at the the amplifier that's right
that's right well it will
1:30:18
civil technical discussion for later that no basically I have know what I'm
1:30:24
looking at okay I had to be led through everything the first demonstration that was
1:30:31
presented to me was the actual operation of the reactor now this in itself is
1:30:37
nothing short of a miracle we're dealing with something extremely small maybe
two foot square maybe six
1:30:46
inches high just on outside dimensions and the power output of something like
1:30:52
this is equivalent to a little nuclear power plant I mean it's very impressive
1:30:58
also the fact that it's not producing any waste heat which is a violation of
1:31:05
well little laws of thermodynamics you bet Bob have to interrupt too much but
1:31:10
didn't you say that that reactor put out as much power as Hoover Dam I really I
1:31:16
remember I recorded all the data I had about it but off the top of my head and I
don't remember that they all reactors
1:31:22
laid people like me in the audience so they can imagine the type of power we're
talking what is a huge amount of power coming out of essentially a very small
1:31:29
small place what do the demonstration actually entail and I mean we will purchase
with was certainly not the
1:31:39
electrical output of it but it was showing me the gravitational field around the
device now the only reason I
1:31:46
started going off on a tangent about gravity is because I I guess my whole point
was that we don't have a machine
1:31:52
there is nothing in existence that can make gravity I've seen a lot of people
1:32:00
just lay people telling me stories about
1:32:05
Hell there watch a film on NASA and the astronauts are training and they're in a
little chamber and they're floating
1:32:10
around and they're you know in a weightless environment they don't realize that
the airplane doing a crash dive that they're there is no machine
1:32:18
that makes gravity I mean at all nobody has that on earth on earth right and
1:32:24
here was a device that in operation was doing this to do that the Barry told me
1:32:32
well he started the reactor when it was operating after a short time he told me
1:32:38
to put my hand or attempt to touch the sphere on the top of the reactor and as
1:32:45
my hand got close to it you can feel a force exactly like putting two light
1:32:52
poles of a magnet together why does that soft push yeah soft push but you know I
1:32:59
know what what you're experiencing now is more of an antigravity field which is
1:33:04
something you know something entirely different oh that's extremely interesting
Bob because as you may have
1:33:10
seen they've done experiments now in Sweden with incredible magnetic fields
1:33:17
generated in a fairly conventional manner and they have actually levitated frogs
and plants and all kinds of
1:33:25
strange little things they've levitated when is this documented oh absolutely I
haven't heard anything about with a
1:33:32
magnetic field oh absolutely yeah well certainly magic not magnetic I wonder
1:33:37
what is this just a raw medic zero magnetic an electromagnetic field raw
1:33:45
and gigantic and they had a little chamber it's superconducting yes set up there
yeah and they and they're
1:33:50
levitating our frog you got it and there's wrong written up anywhere oh absolutely
1:33:56
I wonder how this managed to pass on advice I'm glad to be delivering so much
1:34:02
news to another time but but obviously where can with it do you have any put on
1:34:09
your weather runoff on a on another tangent here but is there a name of any
1:34:14
of the people or anything you can reference me to where I could look oh I'm sorry
this second I can't
1:34:20
it was finished scientists it was carried on NBC ABC CBS all the networks had it
they had the photographs of
1:34:26
others living there boy that's a tremendous discovery there well it is it
1:34:32
just when you mentioned to me the tremendous gravitational field and the effect
on your biological hand it
1:34:40
immediately flashed to that experiment in Finland so there you are anyway so you
can say
1:34:46
let's do one more question if they levitate in anything none conductive something
with no water in it like this
1:34:51
uh well I don't know what uh well maybe they love Atlantic or something like no
1:34:57
I don't think so I think that it was plants nuts frog spiders it was all
1:35:04
biological material yes yes but but you said yourself you felt you felt the
1:35:12
gravity with your hand now the rather than biological effect right anyway I
1:35:17
don't want to stunt your story I just couldn't resist telling you that oh I'm glad you
brought it up that's actually
1:35:23
very very interesting to me as time went on we tossed a little golf ball at it
1:35:30
too and never did hit the sphere it merely ricocheted off the field which
1:35:36
again was an impressive display indeed a golf ball is not in any way conductive
1:35:44
it has no moisture it has no well or minimal amount very so midnight from the
1:35:51
fluid sure enter pal fall oh that's right they are fluid centers anything but in either
case this was a quite a
1:36:02
impressive demonstration just in the fact that this is producing a
1:36:08
gravitation on the directional gravitational field around the unit it was later
connected up to the emitter
1:36:15
and the amplifier and where the gravitational beam out of the emitter
1:36:23
can be focused this again was extremely impressive the gravitational wave or way
1:36:34
coming out of the emitter were focused into a small point and produced a little
1:36:40
black dot in the air hovering in the air really um now this is not to say what's
1:36:46
a black hole but what it was showing me was that it could bend light now the
1:36:53
only thing that can bend light is gravity you know it's that's right
1:36:59
you know a lot of people say well light can be bent so on and so forth user that's
diffracted or refracted but where
1:37:06
you can only bend light is with gravitational ways so to me again this is another
impressive demonstration but
1:37:14
it really was a kind of a black hole well in the sense that it was absorbing
1:37:20
at least in the labaik hole you know by definition itself would be empty source
1:37:25
of the gravitational distortion as opposed to you know this the botto
1:37:31
kissing on it and you know you're also a black hole quantum singularity and blah
1:37:36
blah blah but the theory is the same isn't it in other words you saw the blackness
because of the intense focus
1:37:42
of right where light was an escape yeah yeah true still extremely impressive
1:37:51
demonstration to me oh yeah um so basically those were the well they were
1:37:59
we did get to essentially fool around with it a little more but he was updating me
with basically what had been
1:38:08
learned in the time that they had the craft there he wasn't really specific on
1:38:14
how long the craft was there I was very elusive on many of the questions that I
1:38:21
heard anything you yeah that's something I want to touch on you must have had a
million questions by then I did I did
1:38:27
and they he would answer them
1:38:33
peripherally he wouldn't really get down to the meat of the question at that
1:38:39
point very had a higher security clearance than you did did me uh yeah that's
probably true that may have been
1:38:46
there yeah who knows if he was told to do that or that was his own decision or or
what
1:38:53
but again he was just basically filling me in with what they knew and what my
1:39:02
job was going to be in this was it this was finding out how this subsystem of
1:39:07
the craft operated it operated in the craft operated outside of the craft could this
eventually be duplicated
1:39:15
using another power source could this power source be duplicated itself without
using exotic materials and so on
1:39:24
and so forth sometime later I got my only view inside the craft which again
1:39:31
was extremely exciting yeah no kidding now can you describe what you saw in
1:39:37
that craft yeah I was led in again by
1:39:45
what's-his-name not very Dennis and we
1:39:52
walked up a small rollaway stairway that led into the craft it was very cramped
1:39:59
getting in the doorway the hatch was removed I really didn't pay attention to
1:40:06
see how it was fashioned to it or if there were hinges or anything a lot of people
have asked me that but it was you
1:40:13
know you don't spend time looking at our door was connected somewhere when
there's a flying saucer in front in
1:40:20
either case I went inside initially you must bend over to get in there is very
1:40:26
little Headroom so whoever originally flew in this was small right whatever
1:40:32
flew in I was and if you notice art if you're looking at the v-model of a sport
1:40:37
model they're out near the equator of the disc I mean it literally comes to a
1:40:42
to a point and it graduates as you go towards the center so obviously that's
1:40:48
very low here there and for the benefit of the audience with internet access I've
got a photograph of the sport model
1:40:55
on my live studio cam right now okay go ahead Bob sorry I didn't mean to
1:41:02
as you walk into the craft first of all
1:41:07
it's I should address a few questions that people constantly ask all right
1:41:12
wait one of them is certainly well how did you feel going to the craft wasn't
1:41:17
it the most exciting thing in your life and I know I've said this a thousand times
before to too many other people
1:41:23
but it was not the feeling at that time was not of excitement it was a very
1:41:29
ominous feeling um very much so it was more a feeling like it's actually I
1:41:39
can't I can't really can't describe it's difficult to put into words but it was a very
ominous feeling more like are you
1:41:45
sure we should be here but of course after the fact you know it was certainly
1:41:51
exciting but it was a very very hard feeling because and it was no pun intended it
was a very unearthly setting
1:41:58
inside all right there aren't bail now turns it back to Bob Lazar and Bob you're right
I'm sure you know all the
1:42:05
questions that people would ask if I started picking up phone lines now so what
about being inside that craft what
1:42:12
do people generally ask and how do you respond well first of all the overall
description inside entering the craft is
1:42:24
like I said certainly uncomfortable for an adult human being it's you realize
1:42:34
that you're not in a place that was designed for humans exactly and it
1:42:40
certainly is different from anything that you're familiar with and what I
1:42:47
mean to say about that is everything is basically one color normally any area
1:42:56
you're surrounded in as always different textures different colors so on and so
1:43:01
forth the inside of the craft is essentially all a dull pewter aluminum
1:43:10
color very metallic looking there are no sharp right angles anywhere in the
description I've given before is it
1:43:17
basically the Krabs looks like it was just injection molded essentially like the model
was there are no seams
1:43:25
anywhere everything inside the craft looks like it was fashioned out of wax
1:43:36
heated for a short time and then cooled to where everything basically melted
1:43:41
into what was next to it what it was sitting on that's that's about the best
1:43:48
description I can give as to how the inside look seamless seamless and and
1:43:55
very unusual again no right angles anywhere the structure of the craft the
1:44:04
skin from the outside was smooth inside this is very difficult to describe but
1:44:12
if you can picture yourself inside a disc of a flying saucer shape and you're
1:44:18
inside looking at the wall surrounding you there was an additional structure
1:44:27
kind of a secondary wall was kind of repetitive archways that looks like it
1:44:36
was either for structural integrity or as we later found out something to do
1:44:45
with the waveguide and the gravity amplifiers themselves but if you have the box
there you're looking at you
1:44:52
notice who what I'm saying is kind of difficult there's a little booklet that came in
there it has a nice cutaway view
1:44:58
of the craft but it's um it's very difficult to describe without drawing a
1:45:06
picture or seeing something visual well the lucky people on the Internet can see
what I'm holding up uh the
1:45:13
others are going to have to make do with your word pictures or go out and get the
1:45:19
copy in the tester model or how else might people see is is there something
1:45:25
on your again it would be your website so it's just people with computers so we've
got to formulate word pictures for people
1:45:31
with yeah I'm not really good at that but that's basically what the there are three
levels to the craft when you enter
1:45:38
you enter into the main level and that's basically what you see as far as what's on
the main level well first of all the
1:45:45
dimension that graph is about 52 feet diameter about 16 feet I'm that's just
1:45:50
the overall measurement now back on the inside of the craft what you'll see in the
center of the craft is the reactor
1:45:58
itself extending from the reactor up to the top of the craft is the waveguide it
1:46:06
kind of looks like a little chimney more or less surrounding the reactor in the
1:46:12
center of the craft are three seats these seats all face one direction also
1:46:19
near these three seats are the three gravity amplifiers themselves they look
1:46:24
like consoles just solid rectangular
1:46:30
objects there's when I say consoles I don't mean there's any buttons lights or
1:46:35
anything of that sort and in fact there were no buttons light switches or wiring in
the entire craft really really that's
1:46:45
also quite an impressive feat no levers
1:46:51
no buttons no lights no switches however I did not get to go in one part of the
1:46:57
craft so I really can't say what was there but I do have a good idea as to
1:47:02
what it was now this was all on the center level immediately underneath there's a
small breakaway part of the
1:47:10
floor as you walk in to the craft over to the left to collapse a collapsible
1:47:18
hexagonal very unique doorway if people
1:47:25
have asked me have you ever seen anything in any of these crafts any of
1:47:31
the technology that could be used today something simple and that's certainly
1:47:39
one of them aside from the you know high-tech gravitational propulsion
1:47:45
system solar so for something very very simple to understand and easy and
anyone that's taken a six-pack of beer or
1:47:55
bottles or anything like that you'll notice that if you push on the sides of you take
all the bottles out
1:48:01
you push on the sides of the box it all collapses flat yes and the floor itself
1:48:10
was hexagonal in shape and made of little square hexagons like that of thin
1:48:17
metal the little notch cut out so basically to operate it you just stuck your hand in
the knotch
1:48:23
and pushed and the entire thing collapsed flat and left a hole open
1:48:28
however since your when it's I'm getting
1:48:34
tangled with my words here trying to because there's so many other things going
through my mind when it's extended
1:48:42
and it the opening is closed off it's it's a very strong structure because
1:48:51
you're standing on the top of hexagons the metal is relatively thick even though
it's it's an I might you kind of
1:48:57
have an idea of what I'm trying to present Here I am as you of course I
1:49:02
understand how it drives the strength yes so yes it's very easy to collapse
1:49:07
one way but that's one simple thing I thought would find uses somewhere
somehow something that could be made
1:49:14
right now in fact I've fashioned one of thin metal I've actually no use for it but it it's
1:49:22
just one of those strange things I've never seen anything like it and it's certainly
something that could be used
1:49:31
in some sort of architecture somewhere now the craft you were in had all of its
1:49:36
the generator the amplifier right that was all on the first level everything
1:49:43
was intact absolutely alright well let me take that back one of the amplifiers
1:49:48
was removed alright on this when you do collapse this little
1:49:54
porthole you can fit your body through at least the upper part of it and look
1:50:01
underneath this is the lower level of the craft this is where the emitters that would I
sometimes call the gravity
1:50:09
amplifiers hang down these are three of
1:50:15
the cylindrical shaped black objects two foot diameter four feet long that
1:50:21
actually admit gravitational waves from them like a microwave horn right they
1:50:26
are positioned directly underneath the larger rectangular gravity amplifiers on
1:50:31
the first level and are in fact connected to them the actual physical
1:50:37
connection between the emitters and the
1:50:43
subflooring above it again is something very interesting it's our short piece of
1:50:49
pipe I'd say oh maybe a 12 inches longer
1:50:54
maybe slightly 12 inches long maybe a little longer than that but this
1:51:01
mounting flexes in any direction but it's a solid piece of pipe it's
1:51:08
something very very unusual and we see the same thing being used on the
waveguide to the reactor from what we
1:51:15
could well from what we could see by applying an electric charge to different
1:51:22
parts of this of the structure would Bend quite easily really yeah it's uh
1:51:32
again something very difficult to describe without drawing it exactly how
1:51:38
this operated but it's it was not made of tell us in a telescopic forum where
1:51:47
you'd see something like a car antenna where it would collapse down on each
1:51:52
section would collapse down on to one another it was a solid piece if you can
imagine just a solid piece of pipe and
1:51:58
applying an electric charge to it and having the pipe bend but remain rigid after it
had done
1:52:04
so anyway this compromise the orc opposed the focusing system for these
1:52:10
three amplifiers they receive signals from other parts of the craft the
1:52:17
amplifiers would focus in on a certain point and you know this is basically how
1:52:23
the amplifiers were aimed Mary and the craft had again it's kind of a lengthy
1:52:31
explanation but there were two different modes the craft we found would operate
in one is called Omicron and one is
1:52:39
called Delta the Omicron configuration was the standard operating mode of the
1:52:44
craft and it's where it used one single amplifier to maintain its elevation in
1:52:52
the sky one of the other amplifiers was rotated 90 degrees and essentially
1:52:58
pointed straight out ahead of the craft so with one amplifier working it
1:53:04
essentially produced an anti-gravitational pillar to stand on with the amplifier that
was rotated 90
1:53:12
degrees instead of what we would normally think along the lines of
1:53:19
propulsion where a jet would essentially
1:53:25
exhaust material hot gasses out the back right where we would normally think
1:53:32
along the lines of our propulsive a propulsive force what the craft did was
1:53:38
essentially create a distortion in front of it a distortion no a gravitational
1:53:46
distortion is that like sort of creating a well in effect exactly
1:53:51
it would create a little distortion a divot in time-space if you want to call
1:53:57
it that now well is a good a good analogy to to where the craft would
1:54:04
actually this is kind of the low performance mode if you want to give it a name but
where the craft would
1:54:09
actually continuously slide downhill yes a very awkward strange mode of
1:54:15
propulsion I mean we have nothing that would even really relate to something like
that but it's
1:54:23
kind of backwards if you see what I'm saying I do the other motor propulsion and
you before we go to that you would
1:54:30
imagine this mode of propulsion to be used in in what configuration in other
1:54:36
words in an atmosphere for example atmosphere just maneuvering around small
1:54:44
objects so gravity probably our planet or moon would you say I would imagine so
1:54:50
yeah I don't think it would be used in space the risky's are by definition of
1:54:55
this motor it requires some force some large amount of gravity to be acting on
1:55:01
the craft so you would have to be near some sort of gravitational body or I'd
1:55:06
imagine as it was hovering around the ground this is what would it all right make
sense and then there was another mode the other mode is the Delta
1:55:13
configuration and this is how it normally travels through space and makes large
jumps the craft flies with the
1:55:20
belly facing the direction you want to go not as you would normally see the craft in
a science fiction movie
1:55:27
oh the gravity of Latoya's are all brought up your power and they're focused on a
single point this point now
1:55:38
becomes an area of intense gravitational Distortion many many times more than
1:55:45
what we were talking about before and this is where the true warp drive comes
1:55:51
into effect this is where you actually then you begin to distort space and time
1:55:56
and instead of the craft actually flying you're basically distorting the fabric
1:56:03
of space around the craft and move without actually traveling you're not
1:56:11
you're not moving and if I'm visualizing this correctly it's kind of like the
1:56:17
other mode except far more intense and you're constantly moving toward this
warp or with this warp I don't know
1:56:23
which way you actually become part of the other space it's a pretty wild
1:56:30
concept but something that it really isn't unknown to us as I've stated before to
1:56:39
most people that sounds like wild science fiction however we know most of these
things are possible we know for
1:56:46
example as I stated in in that tape that we can see stars that are behind the Sun
1:56:53
and the reason for that is the intense gravitational field of the Sun then not
1:57:00
just light but it bends space around the Sun and we can see some things behind it
1:57:06
we know that not just we know space gravity and time are all interrelated we
1:57:13
know this for a fact we know that around areas of intense gravitational field
1:57:19
time essentially slows down and it's certainly been theorized that if one was
1:57:24
to orbit a black hole an area of tremendous gravitational distortion of
1:57:30
gravity will for instance that time would virtually stop right so with all these things
interacting
1:57:36
this is how you can travel a great distance with essentially no time
1:57:42
elapsing first of all you're bending space towards you by doing that you're
1:57:50
actually slowing time not to say that this is a time machine it's just a byproduct
whenever you whenever you
1:57:56
produce a gravitational field whenever you're around an intense gravitational field
time slows that's just Bobby Bob
1:58:04
did you discern all of this yourself out of all the examining oh no this was written
okay they gave you this then
1:58:11
right all right and so you've dug it up
1:58:17
so then you're in the craft then your job I guess is to go back to the gravity
1:58:24
amplifier and the rest of the dead they've already got dissembled and trying back
engineer the thing or try to make it work with materials that we have
1:58:31
here on earth is that correct basically so well basically it is to start at the very
beginning and look at
1:58:37
the reactor and try and and try and see how from from ground level the device
1:58:43
operates and this is where apparently I came in to the project gene basically the
silent
1:58:51
one right now sort of helping out as he can uh let's see
1:58:56
Bob within the interest of time because you know we could spend ten hours with
1:59:01
this perhaps not before you fell asleep but well we did make them coffee here I
1:59:06
was I detected I started rambling on that thing anything so hopefully this will help
we are about three hours past
1:59:13
my bit back I see I appreciate it the nation appreciates it this really is an incredible
story
1:59:19
now briefly you went to work obviously trying to back engineer this right how
1:59:25
far did you get would you learn well not very and I need to digress for a moment
1:59:31
here and this is where I learned one of the reasons why I was hired initially
1:59:36
our work started on the reactor we forget that's the center point of everything and
this is where we should
1:59:42
really concentrate our efforts and apparently that's what the people before me did
to apparently there was an
1:59:50
attempt to analyze the operation of one of these reactors and I got to read the
1:59:56
notes that the gentleman before me had left there was a fatality or actually
2:00:04
three fatalities if I remember when they attempted to do this for some reason
2:00:11
they attempted to get into the reactor while it was in operation under load and
2:00:16
it was never very clear in their notes as to why anyone decided to do that
2:00:23
however again of the interest of time I'll cut this short but they did attempt
2:00:29
to do that the reactor did explode and the gentlemen were killed I was to
2:00:34
replace one of these people really this did anybody at any point suggest that
2:00:40
you go in oh no no I think this is something I think they reached a point of
frustration couldn't get anywhere in
2:00:48
you know went on from there again this didn't sound very sensible to me but
2:00:53
this is a story that was relayed to me and just something I thought I passed
2:00:59
along another also let me add one other point too that has really nothing to do
2:01:04
with this but we were also talking about static on the phone yes--you minutes ago
um coincidentally earlier today now I
2:01:13
have no cordless phones in the house I was on the phone with Jean and my
2:01:18
neighbor comes to the door and tells me that she can hear my conversation on the
2:01:23
phone on her cordless phone oh-ho-ho-ho-ho I found that kind of hard
2:01:28
to believe so I picked up her cordless phone and listened and could hear
everything fine I mean I mean that's
2:01:33
very unusual to say believe in art he called me and I could literally hear his
2:01:40
neighbor talking on a cordless phone in her house from my house what you need
then is a sweep of your house absolutely
2:01:48
well I call tell and they should be here tomorrow too but uh you know what an odd
coincidence for a long time
2:02:00
but it is pretty unusual anyway back to what we were talking sure uh three who
2:02:07
went down before you three who died so there you are what do you do well
basically followed
2:02:14
in their footsteps up to that point what we did find was that the reactor
2:02:20
operated at least the lower part of the reactors of baseplate operated like a
2:02:25
little cyclotron and in fact the first cyclotrons were almost exactly that size
2:02:33
they accelerated particles to a high speed in a circular fashion along the
2:02:39
space plate the particles are then diverted by a electrical and magnetic field up
into a target area which is
2:02:47
what was inside the domed part of the reactor these and this is now where we
2:02:56
get into some exotic material one of the elements we identified in the reactor
2:03:03
essentially the fuel or it at least seemed to be
2:03:08
was um there's an awful lot of static here yeah there is a lot of static it's
2:03:13
coming from the phone that gene is on gene maybe what you ought to do is hang
2:03:18
that phone up and they hike it up on the app a comet Wow
2:03:30
[Music] all right all right there we go
2:03:36
oh there we go okay and now we're in business right all right go right ahead
2:03:43
we then found well again we had
2:03:50
identified an element an element of super-heavy element one that doesn't
2:03:55
naturally occur on earth and certainly one that we haven't synthesized this
2:04:00
element was identified as 115 now normally the higher level elements ones
2:04:09
that we have produced in accelerators decay in a fairly short time in this
2:04:18
case what we're seeing was a stable element one that was not undergoing any
radioactive decay which is very unusual
2:04:26
however again this is something that science and chemists have already
2:04:33
theorized that there should be an island essentially an island of stability for
2:04:40
elements around the 114 115 116 area
2:04:46
over we certainly haven't been able to produce anything that that high up on
2:04:53
the periodic chart but apparently you know this is what we were observing how
much of this element 115 was available
2:05:00
200 well if there were 223 grams in the craft in the reactor 223 grams I heard a
2:05:09
story I think it may have been from John Lear that and this jumps us way ahead
2:05:15
but that you somehow got some of element
2:05:20
115 out of that area is that true our and I really don't want to comment on that
2:05:26
ethic all right I didn't big though John didn't want to say much about it either but
that was that was rumor well let it
2:05:34
stand as a rumor um all right so element 115 something that we don't have yet I
2:05:41
think we have progressed a little bit up the scale but we're certainly not at 115
2:05:46
where are we now what is it I believe the laugh isolated was 112 110 most of
2:05:55
the more recent where recent work has been done in Darmstadt Germany all right
2:06:04
[Music] in fact I believe there's um their plan
2:06:12
to produce element 116 is coming up next
2:06:20
I think they plan on I don't I don't really I think was californium and no
2:06:26
calcium or something I do remember that gene yes I think they were going to fuse
the curium with calcium and and they
2:06:34
were going to end up with element 116 which they then thought would decayed
and chain of unknown nuclides and see
2:06:41
where the island of stability actually settled but they are they are very close to uh
attempting to you know Pierce that
2:06:50
island of stability and seeing what's going to happen however producing one or
2:06:56
two atoms of it really isn't going to let them determine you know how the
2:07:02
substance is going to react but at least they're there they're almost to the point
now where they can begin to look
2:07:08
at some of these exotic substances right there are a lot of people waiting to to see
if they can perform any experiments
2:07:14
or find this you know gravity a that Bob alludes to but really when you read and I'm
2:07:20
certainly a layperson when you read on these for instance the website for the lab
for heavy ion resort research in
2:07:28
Darmstadt Germany you can see that they actually detect these atoms when they
make them and in getting an atom
2:07:34
- it doesn't put them anywhere near having a quantity of it that you could hold in
your hand and actually a study
2:07:41
for any macro scale type effect event Bob how long were you then at s for
2:07:47
doing your work it was from December of
2:07:52
88 to April of 89 December of 88 to
2:07:58
April of 89 okay uh what went wrong when
2:08:05
did the whole thing begin to go to sour oh and why boy then there's a long story
2:08:14
[Music] okay the readers died this this story
2:08:21
readers not just for Reader's Digest version of this which is typically longer than
the entire story itself
2:08:30
do you want me to tell it if you got a shorter version than I do well go ahead how
about this at what stage of work
2:08:38
were you when it began to go bad well very actually very early we'll go ahead
2:08:46
gene give it a try well you know Bob had been on an all on call basis and right
when he got to the point where he's told
2:08:53
you about up to this point they stopped calling him in to work and and this was
2:08:59
very frustrating he wasn't a fun guy to be around and what had happened is when
he as he told you before he had to sign
2:09:06
documents allowing them to monitor his phone and fax and computer and anything
that came into his house over a phone
2:09:12
line and to make a long story short Bob's wife was having an affair and they
2:09:18
found out and when they gave him security clearance they deemed him to be
2:09:23
financially stable emotionally stable and just generally stable and so now they
knew that he was going to be having
2:09:30
some emotional problems when they stopped calling him ultimately they heard his
wife admit that she had had an
2:09:36
affair to her mother over the phone and that and she ran she ultimately told Bob
2:09:42
and they called him in and yanked his security clearance saying that he would be
beamed in to be a sure candidate
2:09:48
for emotional instability and that he could reapply again in six to nine months so I
have never heard any of this
2:09:54
before you never heard this no yeah that's the reason that he lost his Clarence that
had nothing to do with him
2:10:00
all right well you would sign all these papers Bob what motivated you to go public I
mean
2:10:09
that that's weird in itself and why did you go public you surely you have to
2:10:14
worry about your life you had to worry about your career and I I don't know
whether it's everybody knows but you
2:10:21
were virtually the modern term is erased your educational records were erased a
2:10:29
lot of the work you did in New Mexico was erased saved for one little mistake I
think your name was innocent still is
2:10:39
recorded in a phone book isn't it right for the most part uh yeah for the most
2:10:45
part everything was they what was they missed oh where was that a phone book
where that was uh well as an old phone
2:10:53
book in Los Alamos Los Alamos is certainly they they couldn't erase the
2:11:00
as I mentioned at the beginning of our conversation the newspaper article at
2:11:05
that time clearly clearly stated on the front page of the local Los Alamos
2:11:10
newspaper that I was a physicist working yeah almost laughs yes so you know
2:11:15
they're they certainly couldn't go back and make that disappear but they made a
2:11:21
lot disappeared isn't it yeah however our you know they they did lie to begin with
as you know George Knapp for your
2:11:28
listeners as the at that point in time was a news anchor for the CBS affiliate
2:11:34
here in Las Vegas only yes and he had extensive correspondence with Los Alamos
2:11:40
as well as Kirk Meier which was one of the subcontractors that Bob worked for and
they all denied Kirk Meyer did say
2:11:48
he was issued a Z number which was a number required to be an employee and to
get a paycheck but none of them had said
2:11:56
that they retained records that far back and at this point in time it was only you
know
2:12:01
five or six years earlier it wasn't you know ten years like it is now and that
2:12:07
they didn't retain any records at all and George gave them numerous chances are
is said are you sure you have no
2:12:13
record of Bob Lazar he has Turk my are you sure you have no record of Bob Lazar
eighteen I've denied denied and then
2:12:19
that's when Bob came up with the Los Alamos phone book with his name and
station number in there and then also he
2:12:27
had a copy of the Los Alamos newspaper from 1982 how did they react to that
2:12:32
well whether we're also talking about two people when I was initially hired on I was
hired on via a headhunter
2:12:39
essentially for Los Alamos sure and I worked like I said the initial time you
2:12:45
work for anyone in a secure job you have that time before your clearance goes
2:12:52
through and that's when I worked for Kirk Meier and then later the game hired on
directly at Los Alamos however both
2:13:01
people you know either quote-unquote lost their records or just flatly denied
2:13:10
the existence of me even working there but what pushed you to go public what
2:13:18
pushed me to go public essentially was fear fear what fear of death fear of
2:13:26
prosecution fear of well just we're in general I imagine you can add them all
2:13:31
together and that was essentially what I was feeling at the time you know at that
2:13:38
time I had nothing other than what I had said to anybody for the most part if I
2:13:45
suddenly disappeared off the face of the earth nobody would have noticed well
not
2:13:50
only would nobody would have noticed I certainly have friends and family that
would be but no one would have known exactly what happened and people
2:13:57
disappear all the time right well it's been especially in Las Vegas so I at least
wanted to get what was going on
2:14:06
out in the open and I believe it worked very well it was essentially a push back
2:14:13
against all the force that was leaning on me we're a fight I
2:14:18
thought if I just went on in a subdued fashion on television and maybe just
2:14:24
said a little bit I just can't kind of gave a little shove back they would lay off and it
was
2:14:32
perhaps it was a big gamble but it worked exactly the way I wanted it to although
art at this point when he was
2:14:39
trying to show those around him what was going on is when he took people like me
2:14:45
and his wife and John Lear out to the BLM land outside of area 51 and we
2:14:51
actually saw one of the disks tested in the sky now Bob did this after he told
2:14:57
us the story after he was in trouble and in fear for his life he told those around him
the story and obviously we
2:15:03
were a little apprehensive when her friend said you know we thought he was just
working in in you know some project
2:15:09
for the government none of us really cared what he was doing and you know so he
wanted to prove that not that we
2:15:16
thought he was lying but it's still an an outrageous story to tell your wife and
friends and say oh by the way I'm
2:15:22
working on flying saucers sure and John has told me the story of a trip up Perry 51
and there is video to support your
2:15:29
claim as well right right plenty of video now they didn't let you go though because
in 1990 and a lot of people use
2:15:37
this Bob to try to discredit you uh you have to plead guilty to a pandering
2:15:43
charge related to the apparent operation of an illegal brothel in Las Vegas now
2:15:48
ah pandering charts that's very serious actually I got to pick the charge oh you
2:15:53
got to pick it up get the ad the charge on three of them uh now my understanding
2:15:59
is a little big but I think all you did was some computer work isn't it well I
2:16:05
literally did we have again we have to you know backtrack two years ago after I left
Los Alamos and opened up opened up
2:16:15
one our photo business for my wife in Los Alamos we had decided to move and we
2:16:24
began because of our contract with Los Alamos began to I'm asked quite a bit of
money we were
2:16:31
looking for a business to buy into uh one of the things we invested in was one of
the legal brothels in Northern Nevada
2:16:38
a very oily Northern Nevada no cheating right well this was years ago yeah
2:16:44
people need to know here in my County of nie we have legal brothels and near
Reno
2:16:49
they have legal brothels as well I which is up where this was okay and I was just
another business business it's just an
2:16:56
investment opportunity and you know we hit made money off of it and and later
2:17:05
got rid of it however you know an amazing coincidence after all this had
2:17:13
not after all this had happened after I left the lab and we decided to move to
Nevada which is where essentially what
2:17:19
brought me to Las Vegas here I had businesses in Southern California in Northern
Nevada and in New Mexico and I
2:17:26
needed a central hub and that's the only reason I moved out to Las Vegas sure we
2:17:33
essentially you you do the brothel business at that point well yes in some extent
and even though we were out of it
2:17:40
after after I had left s4 and began to
2:17:47
look for some other source of income I ran into one of the old managers of the
2:17:54
place up north run she said she had a place running down here that wasn't running
illegally but she'd wondered if
2:18:00
I could install a computer system like we had up there to make her business run
smoother and I said there's no problem
2:18:06
it'll take me a while to write the program and I can set the computers up for you
and so and so on and so forth
2:18:11
they also wanted a security camera outside to make sure a guy wasn't coming to
the door with a gun or a knife sure I
2:18:17
essentially installed all that stuff and and left and that was you know that was the
end of it however it wasn't the end
2:18:25
of it no I wasn't the end of it then certainly it was pretty it's actually
2:18:32
hard what happens after that is as you well know living here in Southern Nevada
that with George Knapp that is special
2:18:39
UFOs the best evidence in November 89 if George won won an Emmy for it and
2:18:46
it was one of the highest-rated shows mysteries always add up so when it came
for sweeps week the next spring George
2:18:53
said it would be a great idea to have Bob Lazar on so the you know it's Bob that a
giant following and say what is
2:19:00
Bob Lazar went up I've been up to so Bob goes on television not knowing that
2:19:05
installing all this equipment for a brothel was illegal and on television George says
what have you been up to Bob
2:19:12
and Bob says oh I installed some security systems and computers and things for a
local brothel and then
2:19:18
leave Elizabeth things on the lane for leavening that baby apparently so all right
gentlemen hold
2:19:23
on we've only got one more hour to go and it sounds like the coffee's working this
is close to coast back to Bob Lazar
2:19:30
and Gina Habba here's a really good question for you I guess we ought to finish up
so you anyway you got arrested
2:19:37
after tell them after being on television with George Knapp well not
2:19:43
really arrested they said come down and talk to us but yeah essentially that was
2:19:53
the impetus of everything was talking on the TV art there's a big long drawn-out
2:19:59
story behind it which we probably don't have time to go into it essentially the
madam of the brothel wasn't informed for
2:20:04
the FBI DEA and anyway she got off she was a prostitute who ran the whole
2:20:11
brothel and she got off with a misdemeanor from an old early 1900s Nevada's
Nevada statute called keeping a
2:20:18
disorderly house and they had the mail somebody and Bob just went down and
2:20:23
turned himself in and they gave him probation and that was it I see well a
2:20:28
lot of people and even the judge thought it was very strange that the FBI was at
2:20:33
the trial and I think he made some very unusual comment to knowing that there
2:20:40
were some other influence yeah he the judge said on camera in court that he
2:20:46
didn't understand why the madam of this brothel got off with a misdemeanor and
considering that Bob Lazar was certainly
2:20:52
not a pander and the classic sense of the term and had no prior criminal record
why in the world
2:20:57
he would have pled guilty to pandering yet it was some bad legal advice and
2:21:03
well we can all turn our imaginations loose on that one yes no rule actually the if
they gave him probation and the
2:21:09
people of the probation department used to fight to try and get to come to the
checks on Bob so they could speak to Bob Lazar they all right I want to run you
2:21:18
through a few past questions I've got a million tax is one is a good one how could
some of the UFOs or parts be
2:21:24
disassembled if they in essence have no seems they were they were absolutely
2:21:30
torn out of the craft when I had corrected myself and said that one of
2:21:37
the gravity amplifiers was removed from the sport model itself it wasn't removed
surgically like you
2:21:45
would imagine it looked like it was almost cut off with an oxy-acetylene torch
though there were no burn marks on
2:21:52
the on the deck but it was absolutely ripped out and I never did see where the
2:21:59
other amplifier to that craft went or you know heard any stories about it but
2:22:05
maybe it was the one on the workbench all right ripped out his answer all right
good answer um by the way for your
2:22:12
reference of Bob the Frog was levitated in the high field magnetic laboratory in
2:22:20
Amsterdam at 16 Tesla if Bob would like to take a look at the photographs and
2:22:25
read about it I've got to let a web address here the most complete account is given
in quote of flying frogs and
2:22:32
Levitt Ron's by M V berry and a keg I'm European Journal of physics a version of
2:22:39
version 18 page 307 to 313 ah that's
2:22:45
just for your rats I am really interested in that um have you ever Bob
2:22:53
subjected yourself to regressive hypnosis in hopes of recalling details
2:23:00
because obviously I've in his program they're still coming back yeah I did in
2:23:06
fact it was one of the first things we did and it was - you know again so many so
many offbeat
2:23:12
stories get started on this information sure uh you know people said I you know
2:23:19
was either drugged or hypnotized they're at work and couldn't remember anything
or you know however the stories go but
2:23:26
there are plenty of them in there more than more than a fair share on the Internet
but I actually went to a hypnotist here
2:23:35
in town by the name of Lane tech specifically one that had heard nothing
2:23:40
about flying saucers alien abductions or any of the other silly things associated
with this and went specifically to
2:23:49
remember intimate details of what I was working with specifically layouts
2:23:56
schematics so on and so forth so I could sit there and you know to the absolute
best of my ability draw and record
2:24:02
everything that I had seen and done and that did that did help out quite a bit
2:24:09
it seemed to all right and for the record art you know Bob had a very good
2:24:14
memory of all the major things that happen he's talking about frequencies and
thing you know quantum behavior and
2:24:22
think things that he wanted to get into relaxation and try and reread those reports
and but you know it was nothing
2:24:29
like he he didn't know he had worked on flying discs and suddenly remember that I
Roger it knows that's not what
2:24:34
happened all right well these are random questions Bob of somebody asked if the
anti-gravity field has to extend all the
2:24:42
way to the ground in order for a saucer to fly or if it has to simply surround
2:24:48
the disc itself or the bottom of the disc no I really just have to surround the disc
itself in fact that that's how
2:24:58
the what I was talking to that other gentleman in Australia yeah that is
2:25:04
essentially what what we were talking about that the field produced around the
craft is like a torrid are big doughnut
2:25:11
essentially however with the bottom extended is you know the pedestal the
2:25:17
the effect of the emitters pointing in that direction but the the field
2:25:22
completely surround the craft alright here's another one please ask Bob if the
2:25:28
principles that you've been describing tonight have any relevance in what you've
heard of stories uh with regard
2:25:37
to the infamous Philadelphia Experiment you know that Philadelphia Experiment a
2:25:46
long time ago when I was at last I'd heard of the Philadelphia Experiment
2:25:51
some time ago and when I was in Los Alamos they have a classified library there in
the library and I was able to
2:26:00
find some general information on the Philadelphia Experiment and I you know
2:26:06
in my personal opinion here that this is the story that has gotten so completely
2:26:11
blown out of proportion [Music] the certainly there were people injured
2:26:19
and people killed in the operator or this test the the aim of the project
2:26:25
apparently now maybe I was reading false material but from what I understand the
aim of the project was to make this this
2:26:32
was the apparent first test of any stealth technology was to make an entire
2:26:38
ship invisible to radar not optically invisible are correct and to do this
2:26:45
they were essentially using huge microwave generators which is
2:26:51
essentially what radar is and I think the the accident that occurred was more
2:26:59
along the lines of radiation injuries and things along those lines not the
2:27:06
more sensationalized maybe time to another dimension continual and people
coming up in the middle of the metal and
2:27:13
all yeah I think there was a much more prosaic explanation for what happened and
you know in my opinion and from the
2:27:20
small amount of information that I was able to get my hands on because that had
always fascinated me too as to what
2:27:26
happened with that but I think that's you know we're looking at it's just a an
accident along those lines and the
2:27:31
reason for the cover-up I think is the same thing same reason for the car perhaps
we see around area 51 is a more
2:27:39
of a legal reason because of the injuries involved just like the toxic
2:27:45
waste problem you've got there then then there being something unbelievably
top-secret alright al Bielek won't like
2:27:51
that in I know but that's alright aren't I'm a computer tech my training includes
understanding electronics of course
2:27:57
please ask Bob if he would give us some figures on the toroid that he worked with
2:28:03
perhaps voltages and current I like to Tigger that Tauride toroid Oh Oh at all
2:28:10
right is that shape well you were just yeah that's just the shape of the field they
didn't you didn't even work with
2:28:15
Atari did you no I mean what you know that yeah that's that's just the shape I don't
I don't understand the question
2:28:21
all right I don't either so I give up have you been approached or have you
2:28:28
agreed to be part of the C SETI program to get a congressional investigation
2:28:33
going on all of this have you been approached by them no not that I know
2:28:39
over remember all right um please ask Bob there is a gravity theory out there
2:28:46
that says that gravity is RF waves from one Hertz to pass light basically energy
2:28:52
doesn't get destroyed so it must all be out there billions of ways the earth is an RF
absorber so on one side you are
2:28:58
pushed to the earth by the pressure of these RF waves do you think the engine
2:29:04
you were working with was simply a wideband RF amp then taking the signal 180
degrees out
2:29:10
of phase canceling anyways coming in thus making anti-gravity no I I don't
2:29:16
think so I mean I I kind of see what he's leaning to he is relating the
2:29:21
gravitational waves to RF waves and in fact and some in some respects there are
2:29:27
some similarities here and there but it isn't just plain RF okay a cavity
2:29:34
resonator normally bounded by conducting services in which electromagnetic
energy may be stored or transmitted as
2:29:40
oscillations whose frequency is determined by the size shape makeup of
2:29:46
the cavity do these propulsion system use this technology in scalar form
2:29:51
Waveline okay continue wave that form or modulated FM form against or with
2:29:58
gravity I in waveguide form with gravity
2:30:03
essentially is gravity this is along the lines of what I was saying that this behaves
very similar to a microwave
2:30:11
system and you know we're seeing really a lot of similarities in the
2:30:18
construction of the two the comparison between the reactor waveguides and
2:30:24
emitters and microwave systems themselves all right what does mr. Lazar I think of
dr. Michael wolf he hasn't
2:30:31
passed supported mr. Lazarus claims about s4 and the sports model um you
2:30:38
remember it remember three freshmen he's the gentleman from back east I think it
2:30:44
Connecticut or somewhere like that who says in fact I think I read that he said
2:30:49
that he was actually a medical doctor working out of this for it isn't that
2:30:54
right art I vaguely recall that something like that and and essentially
2:31:00
concurs with a lot of the things you have to say but yeah I don't think bob has ever
spoken to him or talk to him ER
2:31:05
I hate I really don't couldn't really don't remember his entire story so I
2:31:11
can't I can't really really wrote a book but we didn't get it all right Lee and Grand
Junction Colorado asked Bob was
2:31:18
being interviewed on a program several years ago where he described seeing a
black and white photograph of an alien
2:31:24
which had an autopsy performed on it he said at the time all you could see was
2:31:29
one large organ in the chest cavity uh if he has seen the video alien autopsy
2:31:36
please ask him if that's what he saw or how the two compare no that that isn't
what I thought I
2:31:43
don't believe that that video is is authentic I believe that completely fabricated the
in one of the briefings I
2:31:52
had mentioned there was there were two autopsy photographs of the apparent
2:31:59
occupants of the crash they were both cut when one was cut in a
2:32:07
T fashion it was a bust shot essentially from the middle of the chest upward the
2:32:14
chest was cut in a T fashion the skin was pulled back and apparently what was
2:32:20
removed from the body was a single large organ and I said that it looks it most
2:32:27
closely resembles a liver now we're dealing with a black-and-white photograph so
I don't know sure what
2:32:33
color it would be but it it has that almost semi fluid appearance there is a
2:32:39
the other portions of the other photograph had that organ cut itself and
2:32:47
appeared to have many other chambers and just from the small amount of
2:32:53
information they provided it it seemed to have the function of several organs
2:33:00
that we would be familiar with but essentially evolved or grown together however
you want to look at it but
2:33:07
essentially just one large organ performing the functions of many organs
2:33:13
that we're familiar with so all you saw to be clear were those photographs you
never saw any sort of alien being alive
2:33:21
or dead in person know you know this
2:33:28
again this story always gets bent out of shape - well Bob this is why I did
2:33:33
mention dr. Michael Wolfe dr. Michael Wolfe says well you tell us a story about
walking down the hall Boyzone says
2:33:40
he's one of the guys that was standing in that room that's what he's are okay I will
tell the sorry do I think I ever
2:33:47
eyes are alive alien no I am I even sure that those photographs were of an actual
2:33:53
alien no how could I be who what we're referring to here art is at one time I
2:34:00
was I believe I was walking away from the hangar portion of the installation
2:34:06
and down this hallway that connected all the other rooms on a door to my left
2:34:14
there are these nine or ten inch square windows on them that have the wires
2:34:20
running through home-security windows if you know what I'm talking about sure
as
2:34:26
I was walking down there I glanced quickly into the room and what I saw in
2:34:34
a quick glance was to two other
2:34:39
gentlemen in white lab coats is facing my way and then there was a smaller
2:34:46
thing sitting okay with its back towards the door looking to them and this is at
2:34:54
a quick glance and walked by and immediately you know everyone has jumped on
it saying well use there is a live
2:35:00
alien air so on and so forth now I find it much more plausible to believe that
2:35:06
this was a dummy or something them trying to ascertain the size of whatever
2:35:13
creature flew in these crafts perhaps they're going to sit it in the seat see where
its arm placements like placements
2:35:19
would be so on and so forth but I have you know there's certainly no reason for me
to believe that that was a an actual
2:35:26
alien living or that it wasn't well or that it wasn't however you would think
2:35:32
that you know quite possibly Barry would have said something about that or I
2:35:37
would have been notified you're having the alien room well.alright something
2:35:44
along those lines I don't think that would have been left out and you know quite
frankly if there were living
2:35:50
aliens there would we be doing a back engineering program like we were
2:35:56
wouldn't we be receiving some instruction as to how these devices operated so
it's unless they weren't the
2:36:03
aliens to do that anyway I just no I don't believe that was I believe they
2:36:08
had a little dummy there because they were sitting there looking at it like they
were trying to size it up as to is this thing the right size or so on and
2:36:15
so anyway dr. Michael Wolff alleges that he was one of the men in the white lab
coats all right that's where he fits in
2:36:21
this all right we're going to break here at the bottom of they are only one segment
to go we're trying to fit in as much as we can
2:36:26
when we come back I want to ask Bob whether he ever actually saw one of these
craft close-up lifts off the
2:36:32
ground I eat defy gravity - bob lazar mg and
2:36:37
off Bob I'm curious I'm told that you're not going to do many interviews or perhaps
not any after this one what's
2:36:44
going on well what happened is is uh actually believe it or not that try to
2:36:53
call yeah gene actually knows more about this than I do well you know when they
when they auction by screenplay aren't
2:36:59
they you know Bob's story has been owned by two separate movie studios who for
2:37:05
whatever unknown reason have not allowed the movie to make it to the screen well
that was basically because of me because
2:37:12
they kept turning down their screenplay you know Bob gives them freedom in a
straitjacket I mean he won't allow them
2:37:18
to do all the outrageous things they need to do and so there was long bargaining
this this studio wants to get
2:37:24
the movie on the screen and they want Bob to give him give them his attention
2:37:30
and they want him to be actually actively involved as it is a technical consultant on
the movie and and Bob
2:37:38
never does any interviews anyway so it wasn't much of an a man Kristi never goes
anywhere so he agreed to it to give
2:37:44
them the the impact if they're going to spend tens of millions of dollars to get a
realistic portrayal of his moving on
2:37:50
the screen they'd like him to wait and and I guess through the rounds when the
2:37:55
movie comes out well so it's a rare opportunity I want to thank you both all right
some very fast technical questions
2:38:01
if you don't know the answer is Bob just say no our gravity waves a broad band or
2:38:06
narrow band phenomena well they're actually a narrow band phenomena but
2:38:12
they're not just a simple electromagnetic wave it's a it seems to
2:38:18
be a complex emission and that that's about all I can say in a short time
2:38:24
about them all right what is their frequency or wavelength or Israel wave
2:38:29
was there a way of measuring that well there was there's it's not really as set
2:38:36
as I said frequency or wavelength but there was an effect I wish this
2:38:42
person was snapped right yeah indeed there was a an apparent carrier wave and
that was I believe the extremely low
2:38:49
frequency not to say that this is the gravitational wave but it was in the
2:38:54
area of seven point four six or seven points if you remember what the exact
number was Jean yeah seven point four
2:39:01
six Hertz at a 1 micron bandwidth or something like that yeah and almost 3 o'clock
in the morning
2:39:06
my my IQ drops about 50 more to gather we could get one answer out is gravity
2:39:12
radiation coherent yes it is can you draw a schematic or block diagram of the
2:39:18
propulsion system the answer to that has to be yes you've done that's uh uh what
level of power is produced during travel
2:39:26
kilowatts megawatts gigawatts or measurements of we don't have to it is
2:39:32
gigawatt Giga one is a huge and it's the the way the craft runs is the reactor
2:39:38
actually operates it its full potential always the the way they if you want to
2:39:45
use the term throttle the power is they just they change the phase of the
2:39:52
amplifiers themselves but the the reactor is always outputting its maximum
2:39:58
alright so that answers my next one which was what is the duty cycle peak
2:40:03
average power and duration of output so it's always at full output right uh is there
a lever however I I do have to say
2:40:10
that when the ample all three amplifiers are being used for the Delta motor
2:40:18
travel there is they do not operate continuously in other words if the craft
2:40:23
was sitting here locally in our our local system you can't make a jump or
2:40:31
you can't distort space from here to 30 light-years out this has to be done in
2:40:38
several consecutive jumps and there is apparently a recycle time you know on
2:40:46
the system that and they're put their pulse right yeah they're they're pulsed
2:40:52
and now again we're working against the three o'clock yes IQ drop here but I'm
2:40:58
trying to remember we even calculated the recycle time on him because we
2:41:06
wanted to find out what the actual travel time would be and adding oh god I
2:41:12
can't remember it's microseconds or milliseconds but you know what we'll do in
the future is uh should we ever get
2:41:19
the guys to update our webpages post some of this information more some more
the technical stuff you have everybody
2:41:25
people that are interested in it alright is there a relatively simple antenna detector
that one might use with a
2:41:31
receiver or spectrum analyzer to capture gravity waves no absolutely not what
eeehm effects are
2:41:37
produced near and operating saucer all dramatic one anything you'd see around a
2:41:45
you know any any sort of electromagnetic pulse but you see a tremendous
2:41:51
electromagnetic disturbance actually you have an optical disturbance to well one
that is quite fascinating if you are
2:41:59
directly under the craft you will only see the sky above it and and here again
2:42:06
is what I was describing as the bending of light you know this is also a
2:42:12
potential fantastic camouflage should we
2:42:17
be able to duplicate a system like this for military vehicles and what-have-you
because the way the gravitational field
2:42:25
is formed around the craft the light is bent around it too so looking up
2:42:30
directly at the craft you will see this guy to actually see it you need to step back
out of the field well you're not
2:42:36
really in the field yeah as you kind of see what I mean there there are certain from
certain viewpoints the craft is
2:42:45
completely invisible all right do gravity waves inter modulate radio or light waves in
any way do they enter
2:42:52
modulate radio light light laser anyway how would you know I guess you wouldn't
2:42:58
well I'm trying to guess here how that might happen
2:43:04
well I I imagine I would because you're what you're dealing what you're doing is
you're distorting well is that true I I
2:43:16
don't know for sure so I guess I don't want to get alright amantha here's one then I
don't understand you might
2:43:22
referring to the candle experiment does the flame continue to radiate heat as
2:43:27
well as light when it's frozen why or why not this is something that still to
2:43:33
this day makes absolutely no sense to me and and I thought so this is aggravated
2:43:40
me and probably will forever one of the experiments they showed me if you
remember I mentioned the producing a
2:43:48
localized distortion producing a black dot yes what the other experiment Barry
2:43:55
performed from he was putting a candle in that space and what he did was I
2:44:04
really don't recall if he posts the emitter at a lower power a higher power
2:44:11
or it was probably a lower distortion but the candle flame continued to emit
2:44:16
light but the flame stopped flickering as if it was frozen in time whew that's
2:44:22
weird no I didn't I would believe me this is quite beyond weird were you close
enough to feel heat no and I you
2:44:28
know I don't think anyone who's brave enough to stick their hands I had general
area Jesus Rose what it would be
2:44:33
like but this if the fact is if there was a localized gravity distortion
2:44:41
obviously there was and if there was a localized distortion in time why is
2:44:48
there light being emitted I mean it is there's nothing here that doesn't make any
sense at all and this is really
2:44:54
driven me crazy and I can't so it is there heat a minute boy I would really
2:45:00
love to know myself that indicate that well like we don't know as much about
photons as we thought we did well really
2:45:06
we don't know when it comes right down to it but obviously if we're seeing uh
2:45:11
you know photons photons emitted in our normal optical bandwidth there's
2:45:19
nothing to tell me that they wouldn't be in the infrared bandwidth which is he also
so my guess is that there there
2:45:25
would be he's but I would certainly love to have that demonstrated to me again
2:45:31
and really observe that you observed only one propulsion system correct one
2:45:37
propulsion says in other words one type right well from what I from what I
understood there was only one type all
2:45:43
right do the saucers have a communication or did they seem to have any sort of
communication system that
2:45:49
you could perceive no again however this brings up another point when I did see
2:45:56
one of the craft tests flown there one
2:46:02
point I was permitted to be inside the hangar the craft was taken outside and
2:46:07
it was a very unimpressive test the the craft just lifted off the ground and moved
around slightly however would have
2:46:14
impressed me well as I said that Dunham as unimpressive as a flying saucer death
2:46:20
could be but I mean as far as its zooming around and doing all kinds of exotic
maneuvers it didn't do that in
2:46:26
your opinion what humans survived in zooming around mode in these crafts lately
but my point was was that the
2:46:36
person was apparently in communication with someone in the craft now from what
2:46:43
I was able to see and I believe I even asked the guy that he was communicating
2:46:50
with him on a normal VHF transmitter around the 200 megahertz bandwidth and
what a gravitational distortion around
2:46:56
it in fact this even relates to another question someone else had asked I would
imagine and with the EMP effects of the
2:47:04
craft I I can't understand how they can receive that in the craft ooh so there's
there's an awful lot of questions that I
2:47:12
would really like to know the answers to and obviously people ask these questions
sure the 200 megahertz area would be
2:47:18
military frequencies generally um let's try a couple of questions from the audience
so little time first time
2:47:25
caller line you're on the air with Bob Lazar Angie and Hoffa lo hello hi where are
you I am
2:47:30
I'm coming from Bellingham Washington yes sir and respects you mr. Bell your
program is excellent thank you I have a
2:47:36
question for mr. Lazar ask and two times were volatile I seen huh before my
2:47:42
father said leave it in any of this did you ever see any sort of strange blue
2:47:48
light yes around the well strange blue light wasn't that strange when the craft
2:47:54
began to lift off the ground because of the high voltage present and the very
bottom of the craft there was a corona
2:48:00
discharge kind of a brush like fuzzy blue glow around the bottom which dissipated
when the craft got up to
2:48:07
about 30 feet or so but that was the only you know unique blue light color
2:48:14
arcticus all right is for the Rockies you're on the air with Bob Lowe's orangey and
huh follow where are you I'm
2:48:19
in Oklahoma City all right sir and I listened to the program and then he you
2:48:27
told that that model yes and on it on that booklet said that though when he was in
fact a craft and he powered it up
2:48:35
one of the panel's become you know invisible like forever it's not a weird
2:48:42
riding on it all right transparent is that correct yeah why that was a I was
2:48:50
going to touch on that when I had mentioned that all the seats were facing in one
direction between each archway in
2:48:57
the craft there's obviously the skin of the craft that one archway that the
2:49:05
seats face is apparently unique now I say apparently because the other
2:49:11
archways may in fact do this but I saw no evidence of that but the one time when I
went into the craft there was
2:49:19
another team working in there and they energized that portion that archway in
2:49:27
the craft where the skin of the craft became transparent now that's not the most
amazing thing I mean we have liquid
2:49:33
crystals that do that too true in fact I think the new Buick Sun roofs do that
2:49:39
however this is more metallic than crystalline so this was certainly another you
know
2:49:46
unique material that can be used as you know obviously a transparent translucent
2:49:53
viewport or some sort of video or whatever their output is displayed pal
2:50:01
all right also Bob on the what this gentleman was referring to you said on the right
side
2:50:06
of the archway was a solid panel and and and some sort of unknown writing Scrolls
2:50:11
down that right well I related it to writing there it's just the closest thing I said it
looked like was a Korean
2:50:19
Korean Korean right I mean I'm not very familiar with a you know writing is that
2:50:28
you know Korean life writing looks like it's mostly luncheons and little well it's like
Chinese do too well no not
2:50:34
really Chinese kind of looks Chinese uh
2:50:40
alright I'll take a look at Korean writing but that's my closest analogy to it I'm not
saying that it was
2:50:46
represented it in any way I understand well so the Rockies you're on the air with
Bob Lazar and Jean house hello good
2:50:52
morning this is Alexander in central California yes sir I was just curious where able
to identify the material that
2:50:58
the emitters were hanging off of as far as elemental sort of thing no we never got
to that that was a certainly further
2:51:06
down the line but if it was identical at
2:51:12
least apparently to me to be what the waveguide was also made of that
2:51:18
connected to the reactor and in fact removing reactor if you grab the
2:51:24
waveguide and lift it up it just collapses in on itself I mean there's no
2:51:30
visible seams or any it just gets smaller but it you know there's really
2:51:40
no way to describe it we weren't able to perform any tests on it other than just
standing there and looking at it in
2:51:46
amazement all right listen I want to give you guys have been so good I want to give
you an opportunity to plug something or another you've got a tape I
2:51:52
know uh Jean how do people get can you still got that tape or not yeah you can
2:51:58
the reason that tape as an existence was so I didn't have to do any interview and
2:52:06
I used to just give that out to people because I absolutely loathe doing interviews
but then we found people were
2:52:12
selling it instead yeah but I they can they can get to your website to our website
and everything's on there and
2:52:18
then in fact we never advertise it or anything will I'll cook up something will give us
some sort of discount knock
2:52:25
it down for art bell listeners if people are interested in buying it we'll go ahead
discount the tape and the poster
2:52:31
on that webpage if they mention art bell alright but not everybody has a computer
so well if you're interested you could
2:52:38
you could write to tri-dot productions trid ot productions 24 13 South Eastern
2:52:48
Avenue Suite 225 Las Vegas Nevada 8 9
2:52:54
104 and we'll have the girls send you a postcard and give you prices and
addresses and places to spend money for
2:53:00
a paper poster if you buy do it do it again please give us southeastern itself ok it's
tri-dot production PRI do t
2:53:10
productions right 24:13 F period Eastern
2:53:15
Avenue South Eastern Avenue is suite 225 Las Vegas Nevada 8 9 104 and they
write
2:53:23
and if they're interested we'll send out a postcard alright um when the
2:53:29
screenplay that you are now developing that is going to tell this whole story gene
when will this be manifested into
2:53:37
something that we can go out and watch it the movies well you know I don't think
Steven Spielberg could tell you
2:53:43
that that the fact is the first movie deal literally the president of the studio came to
meet Bob and said I'm
2:53:48
going to make this movie do you want to help or not yes and five years later that
movie still not on the screen so I
2:53:55
would I would not be so bold as to give a date that these people do seem serious
and if they could wave a magic wand
2:54:01
they'd like to have it on the screen in the in the summer or fall of 1998 but I
2:54:06
mean who knows well the atmosphere for it now after the way the
2:54:12
genre has been going has got to be just right well they say that if a mediocre
movie like men and black and and we all
2:54:19
had hoped men in black would be great but it was kind of mediocre it did 230
million just in the United States so I
2:54:28
would say that's more than encouraging Bob are you going to you're going to act
at all in the movie you but
2:54:34
actually I don't want them to make the movie you don't know really why not he's
2:54:41
all like you really haven't been he's afraid they'll make it outrageous and won't
stick to the storyline mr. Bovard
2:54:48
he's probably right by the way they will you know well you have to when you sign a
contract for a movie deal you have to
2:54:54
sign you know you have to sign away every right I mean they could turn it into
anything they want and so Bob is
2:55:02
state gets it close to the vest man and restricts what they can portray they can't
portray any live aliens and oh I
2:55:10
don't know but um it's over you'll have little guys going to sit down we'll be
2:55:16
fighting them with a machine gun brother well it sure has been a pleasure doing
2:55:22
this and we sure did get a lot of good information out and I want to thank you both
and I'm sure you both want to go to
2:55:28
bed we do thank you good night to both of you okay
2:55:34
all right that's Bob Lazar and Jean hop and that's one rare interview one rare
2:55:39
interview